Freelancers and Entrepreneurs

Paul talks with the energetic and passionate Diana Edelman about veganism and creating running a business that serves vegans around the world.

Paul talks with Juliette Stapleton about her building your personal brand. Great tips on creating and developing a personal brand that actually leads to sales - "visibility that sells" as Juliette calls it.

Paul talks with entrepreneur Fiyin Obayan about how she got started with small business clients, her focus on LinkedIn, niches, finding clients, creating great content and more!

Paul talks about the power of having a morning routine and shares some advice that he gleaned from Hal Elrod’s book “Miracle Morning”.

Paul talks about how actually being kind in business, and helping others out, can lead to happiness and success.

Paul shares some more tips for producing great video for your company or brand. Vertical or horizontal? Where to host your video? These and other questions answered! Also, here’s a great post on video dimensions from Sprout Social: https://sproutsocial.com/insights/social-media-video-specs-guide/

Paul shares some tips for getting started with creating video content. From choosing a video type, to a very simple hardware set-up, sound, lighting, plucking up the courage to get started, crafting your message and more!

Paul talks about the importance of generating guaranteed, recurring, monthly income for your business or freelancing operation. What can you do today to improve your monthly income? Tune in to find out!

Steve is an A1 storyteller and has an amazing talent for building relationships — details of which he is very happy to share. Listen in and find out how you too can become an expert networker and create an amazing circle of contacts and friends. To find out more about Steve, head on over to: www.stevedsims.com

Paul continues the “Design Your Business” series by exploring the advantages and disadvantages of scaling your business. Is scaling for you, what kind of growth do you want to achieve and how should you go about it? Tune in to find out!

Paul discusses the pros and cons of location independence. Find out if location independence is something that you should be thinking about (or not!), and how to set things up in your business so that you are able to work and attract clients from anywhere.

Paul talks with former NFL star Jed Collins about mindset,making an impact, and transitioning to his current activity of helping people to write their own financial story.

Paul talks with talent development expert Andy Storch about networking, authenticity, attitude, relationships and the cost of freedom. Essential listening for all freelancers and entrepreneurs! Andy is a consultant and podcast host, but what’s really interesting is how his career has developed. He is now a leading figure within the talent development industry in the US. He has only been focusing on this niche for a couple of years, and is now at the point where he’s launching his first conference. It really shows what can be achieved with some persistence and dedication! This episode really is for all freelancers and entrepreneurs. Andy shares some great tips and pieces of advice. As he himself admits, he hasn’t “made it” yet, but he certainly has some of the traits and habits that are going to set him up for success…have a listen and find out what they are! To find out more about Andy, check out the following links: The Talent Development Hot Seat Podcast: The Talent Development Hot Seat Podcast – sponsored by Advantage Performance Group The Talent Development Think Tank Conference: https://tdtt.us/ And Andy on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/andystorch/ All of the podcast episodes are also available on iTunes, just search for “freelancers and entrepreneurs” in your podcast player. Have a great day!

Paul talks with Carolyn Kiel about change management for freelancers and entrepreneurs, adult learning and specific challenges that female entrepreneurs face.

Lara Cattlin shares her entrepreneurial journey. She is now a successful freelance copywriter, but it hasn’t all been plain sailing, there have been some difficult issues which she has had to overcome. Great episode, packed with tips and advice for freelancers and entrepreneurs.

Paul talks with Emily Cleary about how she got started as a freelancer, design, content creation, networking, time management and more! Curious by nature and passionate by design, Emily Cleary is a Product Designer and Content Marketing specialist with years of experience working in technology. She is driven by the opportunity to create meaningful and memorable experiences for people through UX design and content creation as well as opportunities to mentor others who are finding a home in design or technology. She founded her LLC, Cleary Co earlier this year to provide UX and Content services to various types of clients. Prior to graduating from Ironhack’s intensive UX/UI program and winning the Hackshow with her final project ‘PARK’, Emily graduated from Florida Atlantic University (FAU) with a Master of Arts in Sociology, and a Bachelor of Arts in Sociology and Business Administration. She worked as a UX Designer and Content Marketing Manager for a SaaS tool, a Conceptual Designer for a video production company, and an Adjunct Sociology Instructor at FAU and Broward College, as well as a Writing Consultant at the University for Excellence in Writing at FAU.  When Emily isn’t being a techie, you can find her singing around town or at the studio, or eating an açai bowl somewhere in Miami. She’s releasing her debut album later this year!

Jordan Paris is a really amazing guy. He has achieved so much at such a young age. He is still only 21 and has already written the incredible book “Growth Mindset University” and hosts a hugely popular podcast of the same name. He is a an inspiration for people from all walks of life, helping them to take massive action and achieve their goals. I really, really enjoyed this interview and I think there are lessons in here for all of us. Have a listen, and let me know what you think! To find out more about Jordan, check out his website here: jordanparis.com And here is a link to his highly-rated book: Growth Mindset University Jordan shows us that, by learning from others and taking massive action, it really is possible to achieve incredible things in a relatively short period of time. I hope you enjoy it as much as I did. All the best! Paul

Marketing is “snazzy”. Growth hacking is cool. But what about getting some of the unsexy stuff right? Like the structure of your business. Setting up for long-term success. A business with a weak foundation is unlikely to go the distance. So what about establishing something that is scaleable? And scaleable? In this epsisode, Paul talks with Lauren A. Cohen about setting up your business with the right legal structure, international clients, limited liability, 7-point inspections, staying in your lane, and much more! To find out more about Lauren, please check out here business websites here: www.scaleupcheckup.com www.ecouncilinc.com And here are the links to the quizzes she discusses: www.showmethemoneyquiz.com www.globalbizquiz.com

In this episode, I talk with Deepak Shukla about SEO, lead generation, traffic, solving one problem at a time and much more! Deepak was a fantastic guest, there’s lots and lot of value in this one. Want to get more traffic to your site? Looking to generate more leads? If so, then this is the episode for you. Deepak is such a great speaker and packs a lot of information into a relatively short space of time. He’s very experienced at SEO and lead generation, and I was so pleased that he agreed to share some of his expertise with us! If you would like to find out more about Deepak, check out his website SEO Consultant London or his company site SEO Agency London In conclusion, this episode is well worth a listen for anyone trying to boost their online presence and conversions (which I think is most of us!) I hope you enjoy it! All the best, Paul

Paul talks about the idea of designing your own business – what type of business or freelancing operation do you want to have? Scaleable? Location-independent? With monthly recurring revenue? Paul shares some initial ideas on what may become a “Design Your Business” series.

Paul talks with Andrew Morris about freelancing, entrepreneurship and the new Freelancers and Entrepreneurs Facebook Group.

Paul discusses the SEO benefits of producing written content on a regular basis, and how to develop an efficient method of producing written content, blogposts or articles.

Paul talks about the unique position that freelancers and entrepreneurs are in, in that they can’t be fired! He explores what this means in terms of business growth, gratitude and challenges

The second part of the interview with voice over master Joshua Alexander. Amazing stuff for all freelancers and entrepreneurs. So, carrying on where we left off in part I, in this episode we cover his voice over set-up, agents, getting clients and family. Just as before, it’s great stuff for anyone working in voice over or looking to get started in the business. But, there is huge value here for ALL FREELANCERS AND ENTREPRENEURS. So, don’t miss out! Have a listen and let me know what you think! Here is Josh’s Instagram account that I mentioned on the show (go follow him, I mean it!): https://www.instagram.com/seattlevoiceoverartist/ And here is his website: I’m sure you’ll enjoy this episode and, as always, please let me know if you have any comments or questions. All the best! Paul

What an amazing interview! I had a blast interviewing Josh. He’s a great guy, an experienced voice actor and has an awesome attitude. He shared so much great stuff in this interview, that I had to divide it into 2 parts (Episode 14 is coming out next week!) We talk about mindset, getting clients through different channels, mentors and working from home. Josh also shares a few of his different accents, it’s entertaining as well as informative. Seriously, don’t miss it! Here is Josh’s Instagram account that I mentioned on the show (go follow him, I mean it!): https://www.instagram.com/seattlevoiceoverartist/ And here is his website: Home I’m sure you’ll enjoy this episode and, as always, please let me know if you have any comments or questions. All the best! Paul

Paul talks with Ana Peñuelas about balancing motherhood and freelancing, and making the transition from corporate to freelancing.

Paul talks with Jenae Spry from CrushConversions.com about growth strategies, automating the sales process, Facebook groups, communities, coaching, membership sites and more! Here is a little bit about Jenae: Jenae Spry successfully built a boutique translation company specializing in the life sciences, which led to the offering of coaching to other translators and translation company owners in the form of a membership program, Successbyrx.com to help them build successful businesses themselves. Jenaenow offers consulting services as a Growth Strategist to help SMEs optimize their growth strategies or build successful strategies from scratch. With knowledge ranging from social media advertising, bots, organic traffic, community building, lead magnets and funnels, in addition to having used these all herself to build success in multiple industries, she’s uniquely qualified to help SMEs reach the next level in automating and optimizing their growth strategy.   Overall, it was a fantastic interview and I am sure there is something in there that you can apply to your business or freelance operation. Please let me know what you think. All the best! Paul

Paul talks with former reporter Christine Lee about starting and running her own business, and the challenges she’s encountered along the way.

Paul discusses the competition: what is the competition up to and should you be worried or should you just focus on your own strategy?

Paul discusses what it means for a freelancer or entrepreneur to become successful, how long it takes and what’s really important along the way.

In this episode, I talk with John Moran, a translator, trainer and programmer with a background in computational linguistics about productivity, growing your business, networking and co-working events. What a great interview with John! I really enjoyed talking to him and he certainly shares lots and lots of valuable information. So, whether or not you are involved in the translation industry, this episode is well worth listening to. He shares his story, which includes how he built a translation agency from zero twice, as well as loads of great information on productivity, building your business, managing different projects at the same time and much more! Click here to find out more about John’s translation agency, Transpiral Ltd. John and I also talked about his latest project, a co-working week initiative for professional translators called “Translator Stays”, which he is organising with fellow translator Wolfgang Stenhauer. The next event is in Bologna and it’s coming up soon! Click here to find out more!

Outsourcing can really help you to grow your business. In this episode, Paul discusses some of the things you should do to make your outsourcing process run smoothly.

In this episode, Paul Urwin interviews Dale Dupree, The Copier Warrior, leader of The Sales Rebellion and all-round positive guy. Dale is an experienced salesperson, full of wonderful stories and actionable advice. Want to sell more? Listen to this! Topics we discussed include: How to get noticed in a crowded marketplace How relating to people and their needs will help you to sell How to have fun How to entertain How to make cold calls effectively Why understanding “you can’t lose what you don’t have” can help you to achieve more Whether or not you can learn to sell How to overcome fear – actionable ideas How improv / acting classes can help you to improve your sales skills Why cold calling is still relevant Why inbound can lead to scarcity If you would like to find out more about Dale, check out the following links: www.salesrebellion.com www.thecopierwarrior.com Here is the full transcript: Paul Urwin  0:00   How to sell more with Dale Dupree Paul Urwin  0:05   Hi there. I’m Paul Urwin and welcome to the freelancers and entrepreneurs podcast where freelancing meets entrepreneurship and business. We discussed clients, sales marketing, outsourcing, mindset, and much, much more. Find out more at freelancers and e ntrepreneurs.com I’m Paul Urwin and this is episode five of the freelancers and entrepreneurs podcast. I’ve got an amazing interview for you today. And we’re just going to jump straight into it. If you want to find out more about what we do check out freelancers and entrepreneurs calm. Here we go. Okay. Paul here and today. I am talking to none other than Dale debris. The copier warrior and a leader of this sales rebellion. Dale’s started out selling copiers and he has one was an absolute master at it. And now he’s become a master at sales. He’s helping other people to really improve at sales and marketing. And we’re going to learn a lot on this conversation today. So stick with it. Great to have you on the show. Dale, how you doing? Dale Dupree  1:15   Thanks, Paul. I appreciate you having me. Man. I’m having a great day and doing very well. Paul Urwin  1:20   Fantastic, fantastic. Well, let’s get straight to it. Why don’t you start start off by telling us a little bit about about your background and how you got to where you are today? Dale Dupree  1:29   Sure. Yeah. So my story starts with my dad back in 1984, he founded a little copier firm. He he basically packed his bags at his corporate job and said, I want to do things different than the way that the corporate world is telling me I have to as a copier salesman, the way that I treat my customers, my customer service overall, their needs over my needs. And, and, and did the thing right, he was one of those guys that stepped out of his comfort zone and, and went to go and fail, hopefully in order to succeed. And so in ’85 I was born and so people joke that toner runs in my blood, but it’s a real thing. Like, if I get cut open, you know, it’s dangerous for anybody around like, you can inhale this stuff, man. It’s bad. Very good. Very good. But so yeah, so I got started in the copier world, because of my father. And, and really to fully understand me, you have to also know that as a 17 year old, I got signed to a major record label. I toured around the United States and a few other countries. And I enjoyed a music career for about five years of my life full time. And then I took a job with my father full time and put the music on the back burner and just kind of played shows in the area and around the state and a couple other states, you know, here and there kind of thing, but it became more of a hobby. As I as I fell further in love with sales and decided that this is where I was going to put my focus was awesome. Awesome. Well, you’ve got lots of interesting stories. We certainly know that. So certainly look forward to delving into a couple of them today. Sure. Paul Urwin  2:55   So yeah, how did you how did you make selling copiers? Let’s be let’s be honest, let’s be blunt here. It doesn’t sound like the most interesting sector in the entire world. Okay, I’m not saying that I work in the most interesting sectors either. But you’ve made this into something. you’ve developed a personal brand, you’ve made it exciting. I’ve seen your videos, you make this you make people want to sort of get more of this stuff. How did you how did you manage that? Dale Dupree  3:22   Yeah, so I love your point. And that copy machines are boring. I tell people all the time, just that I tell my prospects, even just that I I am very blunt about the fact that our industry sucks, the one that I had been in, at least for the last 13 years, and it’s not good at engaging its buyer outside of your lease is up, can we get into a sale cycle with you. And then as a community as an as a vertical, the copier world is racing to the bottom every single day. So it’s all about how can I be the cheapest commodity that you ever bought from another human being that cold called you through the front door. So for me, I I took all those facts instead of lying to myself and saying that somehow they were not facts. And I and I, I made them my truth. And I and I decided that my mission was going to be to overcome those things. And so I wasn’t interested in being petty about my sales, I was interested in impacting people, changing lives, and being bigger than just the copier guy. I, you know, I was allowing people to use my network that I built over the years of knocking on doors and making phone calls. And, you know, I really brought my community together as I wondered my territory and became the copier warrior in general. But I’ll say that I do tell people all the time, I say, I never thought when I grew up, that I would be a copier salesman, but you also have to understand that there’s a lot of people that feel that way, right? Like a receptionist didn’t at 13 years old, when they asked her, What do you want to be when you grow up? say, Oh, I would love to answer personal emails to the secretary or the the owner of the company. And, you know, field sales calls from 50 random strangers every month, right? That’s Yeah, it’s not that we’re all in this room, dream job, that we want it right. But what we what we do with it and our attitude toward it that makes us successful. Paul Urwin  5:05   Well, that comes through in everything that you’ve sort of posted online and talking to you today, you have massively hugely positive and that that obviously is really, really important when you’re when you’re selling things. And when you’re selling a commodity, like you said, when it when it’s in a market where there is this race to the bottom? How do you how do you stand out in that market? I think you’ve sort of briefly mentioned relationships. But can we go into that a little bit more? How are you? How are you standing out in in that market? Dale Dupree  5:31   Yeah, so I stand out and every single instance that my prospect will allow me too. So I stand out in the first touch methodology that I’ve created. Through my reason theory, I stand out on the first cold call, even that comes in behind that first touch, I stand out all the way to finally meeting the decision maker, once the receptionist has warmed up to me, I stand out in the first meeting, and I, you know, I again, and again, I just I follow I knew wants the process. And I follow a very strict guideline for myself. And that if I’m going to be this local legend, that most people strive to be, at some point in their career, that I’ve got to practice what I preach. And so every, every single interaction I have has to be meaningful and impactful. So I think about the bigger picture, not just I want to sell you copiers. But I think about what does this person deal with when it comes to my vertical and people cold calling her or him. And so I interrupt those patterns inside of those, those cold calls, right. So that even in the simplest format, sometimes an interruption or something that causes the psychological stir inside of our brains and our soul, even as a matter of fact, you know, inside of that interaction, I think about those little details of if I cold, call this person and just act a little bit different, right? And not because it’s not who I am. But because it’s truly what I want to say it’s my authentic self, it’s the copier warrior that they’ll see this little glimpse of me and say, This is different to some capacity, and they’ll have fo Mo, which is the fear of missing out if they don’t take an appointment. So, so again, when you’re in a commodity based environment, people are expecting you to call and say these 10 things. Well, I call and say the opposite. And people go, okay, sir, how to respond to this. It’s kind of the concept, but at the same time, they know exactly what I do, and how, what it is that I’m trying to accomplish with them, I should say, because I also knew wants the product inside of those pitches as well. Paul Urwin  7:25   Okay. Okay. fascinating stuff now, so can you just give us an example of something that you’ve said to someone or something that you’ve done that is that is is completely different than this has helped you. Yeah, to stand out, Dale Dupree  7:38   I’ll kind of give you a hybrid. Like, for example, I had a campaign back in 2013, where I had an eight and a half by 11 full bleed sheet on some nice, you know, thick card stock paper for all you copier paper geeks out there. Dunder Mifflin shout out. This thing was beautiful. And it had a picture of me pulling a sword from a golden copy machine in the middle of the woods. I had a call to action on it that said, Every morning, he wakes up believing that this is his job. I had this really unique look into my life on the back side of it, which was laid out like a resume, except for the fact that it talked about things that were more personal, my hobbies, these are my customers that you can call today and ask about me things that that people don’t normally do from that perspective. But at the same time to that, that’s going to get anybody’s attention to some degree, right? But But when I get you on the phone, you’re expecting me to flop, right, you’re like, yeah, this guy seems really awesome. There’s no way that this is the truth. But when I get you on the phone, I do the exact same thing. And so a good example that I teach a lot of SD ours is when I first get someone on the phone, I start to tell them about all the accolades and achievements of my company. And I stopped myself and say, Look, that’s the stuff that you’re used to hearing, right? That when someone a salesperson gets you on the phone, they want to just barf all over you about all their cool achievements and everything that they’ve, you know, accomplished. But you, you could care less. And so, you know, the reason for my call today is to truly we learn more about you. But the only way to do that is to build credibility. And so you’ve got to hear my story. So do you have a couple minutes so that I can briefly describe, you know, who it is that I am my culture, the Alliance’s I have in our territory and community and see if whether or not at the very least we can develop a referral relationship. Paul Urwin  9:17   Well, I’m convinced already down and I don’t need a copier right now. But I want to have a meeting with you. So yeah, brilliant. Brilliant now, well, there’s so many so many things that that that you’ve sort of been writing about. And you’ve been talking about another one of your concepts that I like to touch on is is something that I believe you call a living pipeline, is that right? That’s correct. Could you could you explain that a little bit more, please? Dale Dupree  9:45   Yeah, the, the living pipeline, just the name of it, really, you know, there’s a couple different things I want people to think about. Right, like, spiritually, even when they hear the word, the living pipeline, the sentence Olivia pipeline, I want them to think deeper about the fact that they’re the prospects and the people that they put in this thing, are living humans, right, that have interactions on this earth for, you know, hopefully, up to 100 years before they leave it, right. So the, this concept of impact and cause and effect and the psychology behind why we have somebody in a pipeline in the first place, let’s, let’s breathe life into it, right is kind of the concept here. But I have, I have a pretty intricate pipeline, okay. And that’s how I came up with a concept because I didn’t believe in the funnel system, the 3060, 9120, and then, you know, having the, the future opportunity tab, right. I mean, there’s no definition behind that all that does for a sales rep, is it helps them to be either bummed out about the fact that they don’t have any immediate opportunities, or it focuses too much on the instant gratification piece that we in sales are preached, you know, to do constantly by bad leadership. So what I did is I said, Okay, in the copier industry, you can walk into a place that will tell you, we just signed a five year agreement two weeks ago. And so now I’ve got four years, 50 weeks to build a relationship with this person, and develop something bigger than the rep they just signed a copier deal with, so that I can take that business. And that’s exactly what the living pipeline is, it puts people in these branches that bear fruit eventually, and whether or not you pick that fruit and eat it, or you pick the fruit and pass it along to the other sales guy that wins the deal. You know, the idea is, is that you’re treating the prospect from a whole new perspective, causing these interruptions, these pattern interruptions throughout the process and graduating them from, you know, five years out to three years out to one year out to 30, 6090 is the process, right? And being cognizant of the fact that your buyer might buy in the moment when they’re ready as far as the timeframe is concerned. But how do you nurture them all the way to that decision. So the living pipeline was was truly born out of those ideas. Paul Urwin  11:50   Fantastic. So that’s quite, that’s quite a long term strategy, then really building relationships over over quite a long period of time in the sort of hope and expectation that you’re going to be able to convert some of them eventually. Is that right? Dale Dupree  12:01   Right. That’s correct.  Paul Urwin  12:02   Brilliant brilliant Dale right. Well, that’s it, this is just fantastic stuff is absolutely brilliant stuff. I’d like to I’d like to change tack a little bit on this on this chat. And I’d like to, I’d like to talk to you about the following. Now, you are obviously an expert on you’ve been doing this for for years and years and years, you have huge, huge successes in terms of awards and numbers and everything else and you you’ve obviously figured it out. Okay. And And not only that, not only that, but I can tell even though I haven’t asked you this question directly. I can tell that you absolutely love selling right. You absolutely love sales. You absolutely love doing what you do. Okay. Is that right? Is that fair? Dale Dupree  12:42   Yes, sir. Absolutely. Paul Urwin  12:44   Okay. So now I want you to try and sort of talk to our audience a little bit a little bit more directly. And a lot of people in our audience have a business or they are freelancers, and they need to sell. So they need to sell in order grow their businesses, but a lot of people have a fear of sales and a fear of selling a lot of common things along the lines of, well, you know, I don’t really want to push something on to someone, if that person wants it, they’re going to buy it, they’re going to call me and they’re going to buy it from me, I don’t really have to sell it to them. I don’t have to convince them those kind of attitudes. I don’t feel comfortable making cold calls that doesn’t work any way, etc, etc, etc. or so. So can we talk about some specific recommendations for people who are less experienced than then then you are really looking to get a kickstart in their own business or in their own sort of freelance operation? What advice would you would you give them Dale Dupree  13:46   yeah, I would say that I was that person. First of all, when I first even when I was started my music career, I was timid even though on stage you would think, look at this extroverted maniac. I mean, this guy, he, he’s so high he is, he is a social gorilla, right? You would say that, but, but at the end of the day, if I looked at all my interactions, and everything I did, I was like a school boy about each one, right? I was super excited. I was, I was super nervous. I mean, there was, there’s a lot of, there’s a lot of fear that comes with success, no matter what. And, and, and, and anxieties and all kinds of different emotions that we feel and so I want people to hear and I tell people this all the time that I was that person that I remember saying to my dad, wait a second, do you want me to go and an open the door and tell the person at the front desk that I would like to sell them something I mean, especially a copy machine of all things like, that is the most unsexy conversation you’ve ever had in your life. It is not something that people are like, looking forward to, by any means. This sucks, this doesn’t sound like any fun, you know, I’m putting people in a place that’s kind of awkward for them as well, too, because I’m just calling them randomly is no thought process behind this. So I’ve been there man 100%. But what I realized super, super early in my career is that everybody feels that way. Even the people that you’re calling on because yeah, the businesses that we’re trying to sell our product to are also selling a service everybody is in sales. I like to say that the teachers cell structure that a coach sells inspiration, right, a delivery driver sells convenience, if we can break it down to this more, I guess, just easy to understand, easy to comprehend outlook about what sales truly is, it will help us to not look at it as this big intimidating monster every time that we we start the day at 8am and have to make cold calls. The idea though, that we can relate to people as well to that suddenly, like, I can call somebody be like, Hey, I’m also trying to sell something, right. It’s kind of concept like, I know you are too, I’d like to learn more about your product, you know who it is that you’re targeting the area, maybe I can help you with that, to some degree, even outside of what my products and services could provide as far as conveniences, or efficiencies, maybe I know, some people that I can hook you up with as well, too. And that’s this attitude of, of giving before you get is kind of the idea of it. But also like true servant leadership, like we are in sales, we have the unique opportunity to be the real definition of a servant leader, which is to help others and and expect absolutely nothing in return. And that is the kind of leadership in the sales world needs. And that is the kind of attitude that which we should go into each and every single call with another thing that I would tell people is that when you have reluctance, or you’re, you’re worried about putting somebody off for the day, I mean, understand that again, they have the same emotions, like they’re no different than you. Even if they are like, super extreme extrovert, like myself, we still think about it sometimes. But being able to provide something for them in that moment. That’s fun, it’s entertaining, it’s causes curiosity that you’re, you are literally putting a light on their day. And so you’re doing them a disservice by not calling them in the first place. But the attitude of of looking at something as like putting someone off or I’m sorry, turning someone off or causing some kind of interruption that’s going to make them ticked off at you. Like, I’ll tell you this, what I learned at an early stage in my career is two things, nobody cares as much as you and you can’t lose what you don’t have. So why the hell would put your full efforts behind cold calling people Paul Urwin  17:35   Awesome, awesome stuff. So I think what you’re saying is that if you have the right kind of icebreaker, the right kind of you know, different approach then it should actually even become it can even become fun It can even become fun for for you as a salesperson on also for the person who’s you know, receiving this call that is just that little bit different to all of the others that they receive all the time. Dale Dupree  17:54   Amen to that bro. Paul Urwin  17:55   Okay, awesome. Awesome. Can you learn to sell Dale? Dale Dupree  18:00   Absolutely. I’ve taught so many people that you would think could didn’t have a sales bone in their body that could never get through on this stuff, how to sell and but what I will say is that not everybody is going to have a strength in every single department of a sales role. So some people are going to be better on the phone, some people are going to be better and appointments setting, some people are going to be better at running the appointment, then they are at setting the appointment, some are going to just have zero fear of walking to the front door somewhere. And others are going to literally tell you that they can’t do that. So play into people’s strengths and weaknesses as their authentic self is super important in sales. And sales isn’t all five of these things. Sometimes it’s just one or two of the most important, right and the most important is is that you have to be able to interact with another human treat them as, as you know, somebody that is relatable appear, you know, a colleague, a friend instead of an object or a thing or something that signs your commission check and say, secondly, just being to some degree audacious and and wanting to change the culture around you. Like change agents, we all have something in our in our life that we’re super passionate about. It doesn’t have to be sales, but you can use that to light that fire and throw gasoline on it on top of it in order to go out and be that change agent that you want to be for the community. Paul Urwin  19:23   Okay, so you could be passionate about what you do about your product or your service, and then turn that into an improved sales performance. Because the actual selling of of your product or services is is key to getting the message out there, Dale Dupree  19:37   right. Absolutely Paul Urwin  19:38   brilliant, brilliant, brilliant stuff. Okay, well, you’re obviously really, again, you really speak really well. really confident guy really experienced that all of this a lot of people have have do have quite a big degree of fear about this sort of sales activity, what what recommendation would you give for people in terms of overcoming their their fear, Dale Dupree  20:00   I’ve got a couple of things that I’ll throw out on the podcast real quick. And they’re actionable items to I’m not just going to talk about change your attitude. And I think the to too many times, people like to throw out a mindset instead of an actual action that somebody can perform. And I think that those the actions are the most important thing that we can take away and early in our career, or halfway through at a point where we’re stuck. What we need is action more than anything. And so what I tell people is that there’s a couple things I did to become this articulate as you as you stated, and I appreciate the compliment, by the way to I don’t find myself to be that smart at all. But I appreciate it when other people do. But I took acting classes and improv classes. Now, it wasn’t like something I did regularly. But it was something I would do to just throw myself out of my comfort zone and go somewhere where no one knew me. And I could, I could just kind of practice this conceptualize this, the sales pitch that I was going to do with other people. Matter of fact, I for one of them, you know, through a local group here that where I got to know a lot of my favorite people in the sales world. That’s why I like met people there that were in sales that said, like, we come here to sharpen the way that we interact with folks. So improv and an acting classes there, they’re helpful, because they’ll put you in very weird, uncomfortable situations. But they’ll help you to understand the psychology behind the conversation. And to help you to feel more comfortable with the way that your prospect is interacting with you, whether it’s negatively or positively. But another thing that I do as an exercise, and I still do it to date to some capacity is that before you start your calls, it’s super important to warm yourself up. And so there’s tons of reps, and I’ve worked with him. And I’ve been one, you know, in the beginning of my sales career, that you just have a hard time making that first style. So I dial three people before I ever call a prospect, you know, and in my heyday, it was my dad, it was a mentor. And then it would be somebody that I was developing a relationship with, it was a prospect or customer, but all three would be very passive calls, they would just be like, Hey, how’s it going, my, my mentor, when I would call him I would actually do, I would call him like a cold call every single morning for about four months of my life, I would call him and cold call him, you know, I’d get i’d shake everything off inside of my office, and he’d be my first dial. And I’d give him my elevator pitch. And he would role play with me. And so that I would, I would start to feel confident in my call, he would give me a couple, he would say, Hey, you know, don’t say this, when you start calling or focus more on on this part of your pitch. And then, you know, my dad would soften things up for me, he would just tell me, love me. You know, sometimes we just need those little pieces to re energize ourselves and our soul throughout the day and throughout the weeks and throughout the month, because sales can be something that truly does tear us down if our attitude is not in the right state of mind. Paul Urwin  22:46   Okay, so right attitude and lots of practice and prepare preparation. Dale Dupree  22:50   Yeah, we’re gonna have fun with the practice. Because you don’t necessarily have to just you don’t have to sit with your co workers and be boring and stale with your pitch, like, go and meet you audacious and creative people that will help you to think outside the box. Because the box we’ve created for sales and for our interactions is really not it’s not a thing. We have done this to ourselves. But really all we’re doing is having conversations with people. Yeah, that’s, that’s all we’re doing. And so helping ourselves to understand that better, but also to feel that we can be that difference provider. It’s important in doing the acting classes or improv classes that will absolutely equip you to be better at that, Paul Urwin  23:31   tha t sort of self belief to get, you along, okay. Brilliant, brilliant. one more question for you. I think I know how you’re going to react to this one. But I’m going to ask it anyway. So in today’s in today’s marketplace, with with everything that is going on, especially online, lots of online marketing, or digital marketing, all that kind of stuff. is cold calling. still relevant? Dale Dupree  23:54   Absolutely. I’ll tell you why. The like, because I think a lot of people have different opinions on this. But I think cold calling is still relevant. Because we we tend to look at the word cold calling and just get turned off by it. And I mean, I hate it just as much as the next guy, especially with the attitude that you hear me portraying. I live this thing, right? So yeah, for me, I don’t I don’t like it either. But it’s why I created things like my reason theory, which is to radically educate and share one’s narrative, I’ve created these things that are fun, and that are enticing for myself inside of a cold call to make it something that I look forward to. Because truly, what we’re really doing is we’re creating a relationship that we’re warming up over time in order to sell a product. And so using the internet to have inbound or you know, any any kind of ad words that you’re using, or you know, whether or not your marketing through LinkedIn on content, it’s great to have inbound. Don’t get me wrong, but every person listening right now that has gotten inbound, you know, that every once in a while that inbound is perfection, right? Then you go through the process, you go through the cycle, even get the quote out, right. But then they stopped talking to you. Yeah, yeah, right. It’s been 22 days since I sent that court to that guy that I had such a good conversation with, well, it’s because you treated him like inbound in the first place. If we treated everything as a last sale, as a cold call, we would be so much more authentic inside of the cycle that we create for them. And so I think it’s important to have because it keeps us grounded. It keeps us thinking in that direction. And it keeps us having to, to keep among a mindset of abundance over scarcity because scarcity is truly what you have. If all you are having this inbound leads come in. Because these are just things these are just people that have found something about you or clicked on your advertisement. They don’t know you. There’s no credibility there. And cold calling can absolutely define that trust for your prospect. Wow, wow. Paul Urwin  25:47   Yeah. Well, I this is just brilliant information, which is exactly what I expected before before this interview started. So yeah, thanks a lot. Thanks very much. My pleasure. Okay. Well, where are Where are you now where, you know, in terms of your copier sales? Where are you now in terms of your your sales training brand, your personal brand, let’s talk about where you are right now. And where you hope to go over the next, you know, year or so. Dale Dupree  26:12   Yeah, so just recently, I announced that I started a sales rebellion, which is the name of the company the sales rebellion back in January, actually, I resigned from my post at my old copier firm. I didn’t tell anybody and, and however, I was concocting for several weeks and over a month, the the the sales rebellion itself that that again, like I had defined over my years as a sales rep in the copier world. And so really, the copier warrior has, has stepped out of his comfort zone, and taken all of the things that he’s created for himself, and is given them to others. I’m passing the torch to the, to the sales world to be able to change the game for themselves inside of their respective industries. So what I’ve done inside of the sales are going to is that I’ve taken a unique approach and that, you know, you can have more come out to your company for a boot camp, or we can do sales training. All these things, though, that I am offering to people are different than the normal and traditional way that you get your training from other folks. Because, again, remember, I’ve been a salesperson for the last 13 years of my walk. And even as a VP of sales, I was still an active individual contributor on top of it. So I’ve always had a selling sales manager role, even when I was in leadership, right, so so I know exactly what it is that you guys and girls go through, when it comes to the training and people leaving a boot camp feeling fired up. And two weeks later, it’s all gone, right? So we have actionable items that were given to people were truly trying to create a movement here, not something that just fun and entertaining over the course of four or five hours that you talk about for 10 more years that you never act on right is the idea. But at the same time, we recognize that people, especially individual contributors, that they’re not making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year and commissions or even as a salary in some cases and and because of that, they don’t have a lot of money to spend. So we have a fun subscription based model that people can go and sign up on the sales rebellion calm and dive into the copier, warriors, lifelong dream of giving back to his sales community, all the things that he’s put together, whether it’s my internet marketing pieces, the challenges that I give you on a weekly and a monthly basis, I have a sales devotional that pops up as well that will help you to reaffirm your, your your existence inside of the sales world. Just a lot of fun stuff to to create a culture and a community for sales people that are looking to rebel against the status quo. Brilliant. Brilliant. Paul Urwin  28:37   Well, the way I see it is, I think a lot of people really would like to focus on their, their core activity, they love what they do, they might be a graphic designer, they might have a small company or something like that. But they know that that sales and selling is obviously a key component of what they do. And if they don’t sell enough, they’re not going to be able to sustain their freelancing business or their or their small company. So I think that’s where that’s where someone like you comes in and I really feel that you can help a lot of people to ramp up there to ramp up their sales and to get better results and then once you start to get better results you can even go back sometimes to setting up a process and focusing more on on on what you love doing so I don’t know if you agree with this but I actually think that that by selling more successfully it doesn’t need to take you away from what you love doing it can actually help you to stay to stick doing that Dale Dupree  29:32   absolutely I agree 100% with that statement Paul Urwin  29:35   brilliant brilliant well thank you so much Dale it’s been it’s been an action packed episode has been full of absolutely brilliant information I really really appreciate you agreeing to come on the call and finally well I think you mentioned the sales rebellion.com is that the best place for people to find you Dale Dupree  29:53   yeah you can do the or you can just do salesrebellion.com you can head to LinkedIn and search for Dale Dupree you’ll find me is the copier warrior and the leader of the sales rebellion. I’m on all my social platforms as either at copier warrior or at sales rebellion. So come follow me and come join into my culture. My community. I’d love to have you Paul Urwin  30:11   brilliant, brilliant. Well, I will put all of that information in the show notes, of course. And finally, Dale A big thank you. You’ve been awesome. And I wish you all the best for the year ahead. Dale Dupree  30:23   Thanks so much. I appreciate you greatly Paul Urwin  30:25   now, thanks to Cheers. Thank you. Cheers. Well, I hope you enjoyed that interview with Dale as much as I enjoyed doing it. I thought it was a really, really brilliant interview and lots and lots of information in there. So as Dale says himself, one of the most important things is to take action. If you want to take action, head over to our website, freelancersandentrepreneurs.com There you will find all of the show notes for this particular podcast episode. That’s freelancers and entrepreneurs.com slash five. The number five you’ll find all the show notes there. And you will also find on the website a completely free training session of video training session. So I really recommend that you download that and take a look at it. Thanks for listening. Great to have you here with us all the best and until next time. Transcribed by https://otter.ai    

As a freelancer, entrepreneur or small business owner or manager, should you be specializing or diversifying. It’s often a confusing situation, with conflicting advice out there. In this episode, Paul explores this important issue and provides some useful advice.

Are you working with the wrong clients? Finding the right clients for your business or freelance operation can really help your business to grow. But, how can you go about targeting those clients? In this episode, Paul shares some ideas on how to build your ideal client base.

In this episode, I discuss some strategies you can employ to make sure you get paid.

Welcome to Episode 1 of the Freelancers and Entrepreneurs podcast! Freelancer or entrepreneur Which one are you? Here is the full transcript: 0:07 Hi there. I’m Paul Urwin and welcome to the Freelancers and Entrepreneurs podcast where freelancing meets entrepreneurship and business. We discuss clients, sales marketing, outsourcing, mindset, and much, much more. Find out more at freelancers and entrepreneurs.com. 0:30 Hi there, Paul here and welcome to Episode One of the freelancers and entrepreneurs podcast. If you are a freelancer or entrepreneur, looking to take your business to the next level, well, you’ve come to the right place. This is the show for you. In this episode, I’m going to be talking about the differences and similarities between freelancing and entrepreneurship. And I thought I’d start with a couple of definitions from the dictionary. That’s right. A couple of boring but 1:00 Important definitions. So, according to Merriam Webster fantastic dictionary, a freelancer is a person who pursues a profession without being associated with an organization. While an entrepreneur is one who organizes managers and assumes the risks of a business or enterprise. So pretty straightforward, right? a freelancer is someone who works for themselves, essentially, essentially has different clients while an entrepreneur is someone who starts a company and takes the risks associated with that company. Well, from that definition, they sound quite different. But actually, I think in practice, there’s a whole range of people somewhere in between Freelancer and entrepreneur. And if that sounds like you, then I have a feeling that you’ve come to the right place. There’s also a term out there that’s more frequently used these days, and that term is solopreneur. A solopreneur 2:00 Is someone who is very similar to an entrepreneur, but someone who builds a business on their own without a team, so they are more likely to carry out more of the tasks themselves. So again, that’s another definition that perhaps is somewhere between freelancer and entrepreneur. So today, I just want to really explore those definitions a little bit more and talk about what it means to be a freelancer and what it means to be an entrepreneur. And I would start off by saying, There’s absolutely no right answer to this at all. It’s more about finding the right answer for you. Where do you feel comfortable and are you where you want to be right now? So what does a freelancer do? Well, a freelancer essentially exchanges dollars for hours. It’s someone who’s going to be working on a particular task in a particular profession. You might be a writer, you might be a designer, you might be a translator, something like that, but you aren’t going 3:00 To be exchanging your time for a payment, and normally a freelancer is going to have a number of different clients a portfolio of clients. Now the great thing about being a freelancer is that you don’t have to work nine to five in a job, you don’t have a boss, you are independent, all those kinds of things. So that’s absolutely fantastic. But in terms of income, that usually is a limit. So as time goes on, you can probably increase your hourly rate, you can get better and better clients, but at some point there is going to limit is going to arrive and it will be difficult for most freelancers to break through that limit and earn even more money. Some of the advantages of being a freelancer include the fact that if you really love what you do, if you love being a writer, or if you love being a designer, then as a freelancer, you are really able to 4:00 Focus on your profession, you don’t have to deal with some of the other things that that are involved in running a company like making payments or dealing with some of those problems that always come up as an entrepreneur. So you’re going to have fewer distractions and fewer management issues, but you will have that income limitation. Now, as an entrepreneur, you’re going to be building a team usually, and you’re going to be employing some kind of leverage. And what do I mean by that? Well, you might have a team of people working for you, who are you producing or carrying out a particular task and that is going to enable you to service or to provide solutions to more clients. So as a result of that leverage, and building a team and servicing more clients, you are going to be able to increase your income usually. Now that doesn’t mean it’s easy. 5:00 But normally entrepreneurs are not going to have any kind of income cap, because if they can build the team in the right way and provide solutions to more and more clients, well, then there really is no limit to how far you can grow your company. But of course, it comes with quite a few downsides for many people. Anyway, you’re going to have to learn how to manage other people, you’re going to have to take responsibility. For example, if you are a writer, and you hire other writers, and then you submit some of that writing to a client and the client doesn’t like it, well, then you’re going to have to take responsibility for that piece of writing, even though you didn’t do it yourself. You might have reviewed it, but at the end of the day, if you are the entrepreneur, if you are the boss, you are going to have to take responsibility for everything that goes on within your company. And some freelancers don’t like that. They don’t like that responsibility. They prefer to focus on themselves and they prefer 6:00 To focus on on their own business, but their own business is is them. So that can be a great approach as well. Definitely as an entrepreneur, you can lose the ability to focus on your core activity. So once again, if you are a designer, or if you are a writer, or if you’re a photographer, then as you become an entrepreneur, and as your business grows, then you are more likely to focus on other areas. You’re going to be focusing on hiring and firing, you’re going to be developing more clients, focusing more on sales and marketing. So a whole host of other activities which can actually take you away from your core activity. You can’t build a company without making some sacrifices. And for many, that is a significant sacrifice, and that is why many freelancers choose to stay as freelancers. I think that’s one of the one of the main reasons actually 7:00 As an entrepreneur, you can sometimes experience higher levels of stress as you are definitely taking more risk. But I think a lot of those stressful moments as well apply equally to freelancers moments when there’s nothing coming into your inbox or moments when you have lots of clients at once, or moments when you don’t have any clients at all. So I think lots of stress related issues are common between both freelancers and entrepreneurs. 7:33 One of the disadvantages of working as a freelancer is that when you stop working, you are simply not going to be making any money because you are the person who produces the money in your business. So if you go on holiday for a few weeks, or if you want to go away for a month, then it is unlikely that you’re going to be able to make much income during that time. There are other ways to make 8:00 income as a freelancer so it is possible to to make some additional income. But generally speaking, you’re not going to be able to make money while you are not working. Whereas as an entrepreneur, you can actually achieve that you can actually set up some processes, you can set up a team and you can actually produce money from a business that doesn’t rely entirely on you as an entrepreneur, you definitely have this significant growth potential you can triple your income or even more after some people status is important. So as an entrepreneur, as a business owner, people have a certain status that they associate with that sometimes and I’m not talking about that photo of an entrepreneur getting off a private jet I think that’s a bit far fetched for most people but certainly as a business owner one is able to talk to other business owners at the on the same level if you like, and that for some people 9:00 is important in terms of status for others, it’s simply important to be the very best freelancer, they can possibly be the very best photographer, their very best brighter, or whatever it may be. So. So I think status is more important to some people than for others. as a freelancer when you eventually stopped working, if you are the business, then then there’s not going to be much of a business left without you. And that’s fine. Again, for many people. If you if you move into retirement and you’ve had a great career, then you can simply hand over a few clients to one of your colleagues and, and retire peacefully or move on to something else quite happily. So it certainly works. But as an entrepreneur, you do have the opportunity to create a company or to build a business that can work without you and therefore at some point you could actually sell that business that entity that business has a value with 10:00 You because if you set it up correctly, it can actually make a profit without you. So that’s that’s an important difference as well, I think. So when we look at this whole freelancing and entrepreneurship spectrum, and it is a spectrum, there’s a whole range, I would say that there are people out there who are really pure freelancers who work on their own, who have their business, and yet really are freelancing, the most traditional interpretation of the word right through to right through to entrepreneurs who focus from day one on on on building a business and often on building a big business, on scaling on venture capital on all those kinds of things. But there’s this whole range in between so many freelancers who will outsource one or two bits of work and essentially create a business there or free 11:00 Answers who will make a progression or freelancers who will make a progression over time to becoming an entrepreneur to building a small or mid sized business? There really is no right answer in all of this, as I said at the beginning, but it is important to understand what you want to achieve. Do you want to be a freelancer? Do you want to be an entrepreneur? Do you want to? Do you want to move along that spectrum? Or are you completely happy with where you are now? And if you do want to move along that spectrum, do you understand some of the challenges that await as you start to hire people for your business? Do you understand how difficult it might be to remove yourself from certain aspects of the business? Because I think as an entrepreneur, sometimes you need to get out of your own way in order to allow your company or your entity to grow. How do you feel 12:00 about sales and marketing. I think that’s another key question in all of this because as a freelancer or as an entrepreneur, you definitely need to focus on sales and marketing on getting more clients into your business. And if you do remain as a freelancer and you’re perfectly happy as a freelancer, do you still see yourself as a business? Have you moved out of that employee mindset and deed still see yourself as a business even though it is a one man or one woman business? I think that is another important consideration. So all things to think about all things to think about as we move along this journey of discussing freelancing and entrepreneurship. Well, I hope you found those words useful and please let me know where you are on this spectrum. It’s really important for me that you let me know and that you can help me to develop this product. 13:00 cost in the right way. So how do you feel about freelancing? How do you feel about entrepreneurship? Are you a freelancer? Are you an entrepreneur? And where do you want to go from where you are right now? Where do you want to go in the future? please get in touch via the website that’s www dot, freelancers and entrepreneurs.com there is a contact form on their alternatively you can contact me via Twitter. My Twitter handle is at Paul em earlier. And that’s at pa you l m. You are w i n roll em. We let me have your questions. Let me have your observations. I can’t wait to hear from you. And I can’t wait to talk about even more issues related to both freelancing and entrepreneurship. So thank you very much for listening. Finally, if you enjoyed today’s episode, I invite you to check out the resources for freelancers and entrepreneurs on our 14:00 website WWW dot freelancers and entrepreneurs.com if you really want to take action, visit the homepage and sign up for the completely free training on how to get more clients. That’s it for me all the best and until next time.