Beautiful Tension

David Clark-Sally (he/him) is a white, cisgender, gay man, stepdad of two girls and soon-to-be dad of another, husband, and entrepreneur. He is navigating what it means to be gay in a post-faith deconstruction world and what it means to be a parent. In this episode, he shares about coming out as a catalyst for spiritual growth, holding multiple truths, and the complexity of words as identities. You can find David on all major social media platforms at @davidclarksally.

Jack Bates (he/they) is a bisexual, trans and non-binary Episcopalian, father, fiancé, drag queen, stand-up comedian, and theologian. He has a B.A. in Bible and Masters degrees in Philosophy and Religion as well as Historical Theology. They share about doing drag in faith spaces, the intersection of faith and disability, and the importance of a queer-affirming theology. You can find Jack on Twitter at @jackmb and listen to their queer Christian podcast, "Lavender Mafia," wherever you find podcasts.

Jon Kwok (he/him) is Chinese-American, gay, and a reconstructing Christian. He's also a graduate student at Teachers College, Columbia University studying International Educational Development. Jon shares about his time in the Peace Corps, deconstructing his faith, and the dichotomy of harm and good being done in aid work. You can find Jon on Instagram at @jonpkwok or on LinkedIn as Jonathan Kwok.

In part 2 of my conversation with Donovan, we talk about freedom and loss after coming out, healing each other's wounds, and diversity in queer community. You can find Donovan on Facebook and LinkedIn as Donovan Ackley III, Instagram at @donovanackley3, and their profile on the Yoga Alliance website here. You can find his book, “Sex As Sacrament,” on Amazon and Kindle. If you or someone you know is trans, Trans Lifeline is a community support resource created by and for trans individuals. They also offer support for parents of trans folx. You can find out more at translifeline.org.

Donovan Ackley III (he/they) is a yoga instructor for trauma recovery, professor and program coordinator for the LGBTQ+ Leadership Certificate at the University of Redlands, and consultant on gender and sexual minorities. In part 1 of our conversation, he shares about growing up as an intersex person, coming out in Christian community, and the liberation and losses that followed. You can find out more about the LGBTQ+ Leadership Certificate program here. If you identify as trans and need support, or would like to support or volunteer with Trans Lifeline, you can do so here. Donovan's book, "Sex and Sacrament: A Queer Liberation Theology of Prayer and Worship" is available on Amazon. You can find the audio version of the book as well as their guided spiritual practices on YouTube.

Abby Coppock (she/her) is a White, female, wife, sister, aunt, and independent consultant. From working in a drug and rehab center in Chicago to receiving her degree in social work, she's since moved to Portland and worked as an organizational consultant focusing on diversity, equity, and inclusion. In a conversation centered around race and allyship, we talk about hard conversations, dealing with perfectionism, and knowing your shortcomings. You can find Abby on LinkedIn as Abby Coppock and her upcoming website at abbycoppockconsulting.com.

Brian Terada (he/him) is a creative who makes everything from videos and music to events and experiences. He's the founder of Be Free and Be Free Stories, social meet-ups where people come together to listen to and share stories of how they've found freedom. By doing the work personally and professionally, he's set out to be himself so that others can be free too. You can find Brian on most platforms at @brianterada. You can also find him on TikTok at @brianteradaa and Twitch at @brianteradababy.

Mindy Durias (she/her) is a lesbian, mystic, mother of five and Pastor of Families at Pearl Church in Portland, Oregon. From growing up in the Jesus Movement to attending Bible college, she was taught spirituality is about rules, certainty, and behavior. When her life took a different path, she discovered contemplative practices, which saved her spirituality. You can reach Mindy via Pearl Church at pearlchurch.com/pastoral-team and Coach Training World at coachtrainingworld.com/find-a-coach-directory/mindy-durias-wpcc.

Emmy Martinez (she/her) is the fierce, fabulous, and femme Mentoring Coordinator at the Los Angeles LGBT Center. She tells her story of growing up, facing heteronormativity and exploring gender. Additionally, she shares about the amazing work she does at the Center and the resilience of the many mentees she's worked with. For more information or to get involved in the Center's Mentorship Program, you can contact Emmy at emartinez@lalgbtcenter.org. You can also follow her on Instagram at @scenesofyoli.

A glimpse into my story, the "why" behind the podcast, and what Beautiful Tension is about.

Mike Roth is the lead pastor and co-founder of Pearl Church, a faith community based in Portland, Oregon. Over the span of his time in ministry, he’s earned several degrees, including his recent PhD specializing in the effectiveness of biblical literary figures to hold attention and make meaning. Among the many shifts Pearl Church has seen over the last 20 years, one of the most controversial was the move to broaden their marriage practice to include the LGBTQ community. In part 2 of my interview with Mike and this finale episode of the podcast, we talk about that decision and everything that followed. You can find Pearl Church at pearlchurch.com, on Facebook at Pearl Church, on Instagram at @pearlchurchpdx, and Twitter at @pearlchurch. You can find Mike's writings at mikeroth.org under the tab "Theopoetic." You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Mike Roth is the lead pastor and co-founder of Pearl Church, a faith community based in Portland, Oregon. Over the span of his time in ministry, he’s earned several degrees, including his recent PhD specializing in the effectiveness of biblical literary figures to hold attention and make meaning. Among the many shifts Pearl Church has seen over the last 20 years, one of the most controversial was the move to broaden their marriage practice to include the LGBTQ community. In this penultimate episode of season 1, we talk about the transitions that led up to that decision, including a move from dogma and doctrine to values, embracing women in leadership, and practicing infant baptism. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Matthias Roberts was forever changed when he discovered there were others who had integrated their faith and sexuality. Years later, he found there weren't many resources for queer people of faith, which led him to starting a podcast to address just that. Even more, he saw the need for work around healing in our bodies, which led him to becoming a therapist. We talk about coming out, relationships, sex, and more. Matthias can be found across social media at @matthiasroberts. His website is matthiasroberts.com and his podcast, Queerology, can be found wherever you listen to podcasts. You can also find his new book, "Beyond Shame," at your local bookstore or bookshop.org. Other books mentioned in this episode were "God & The Gay Christian" by Matthew Vines and "On Being Liked" by James Alison. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Angela Pacheco is a Latinx woman, ally, and social worker. She works for the Los Angeles LGBT Center's Host Homes program, which seeks to empower queer youth experiencing homelessness by matching them with host homes to help them get on their feet. We talk about the causes of homelessness, intersectionality, and so much more. You can find Angela on Facebook at Angela Pacheco and Instagram at @loveang93. You can find out more about the L.A. LGBT Center at lalgbtcenter.org and the Host Homes program at lalgbtcenter.org/hosthomes. You can also send them an email at hosthomes@lalgbtcenter.org. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Dave Khalaf grew up Christian, which led to a war between his faith and sexuality. After six years of reparative therapy, he finally accepted that he wasn't changing, and it was better to lean into the mystery and risk being wrong than to live a life based on fear. Dave and I talk about growing up Christian, what to do with the Bible when it's hurt you, and much more. Dave and his husband Tino are co-authors of "Modern Kinship: A Queer Guide to Christian Marriage," which you can purchase on Amazon, from their publisher Westminster John Knox Press, or wherever you find books. You can also find Dave's historical fiction novels wherever you find books. You can find Dave on Facebook and Instagram at Modern Kinship and his blog at daveandtino.com. You can also find a tweet or two at @modernkinship on Twitter. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Tino Khalaf didn't grow up religious. Yet when he came out and spent much of his adult life in New York City, most of the churches around him were affirming. He tells how witnessing this love grounded him, led him to faith, and eventually, marriage to his husband. Tino and his husband David are co-authors of "Modern Kinship: A Queer Guide to Christian Marriage." The book was birthed out of their blog by the same name. You can find Tino on Facebook and Instagram at Modern Kinship and the aforementioned blog at daveandtino.com. You can also find a tweet or two at @modernkinship on Twitter. I’d love to feature the queer community on next week’s resilience room. I want to know, how has Pride, coming out, and being queer made you more resilient? You can send a brief audio clip, no more than 30 seconds, to beautifultensionblog@gmail.com. I can’t wait to hear what you have to share! You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Kari Gale is an artist, but she didn't always feel like one. After following the script society had given her, then watching her life fall apart, she decided to pick up the pieces and chose a new adventure - eventually, she found a life she now loves. We talk about creativity, comparison, and so much more. The books mentioned in this episode are "Daring Greatly" by Brené Brown and "The Gift of Therapy" by Irvin Yalom. You can find Kari at karigale.com, pilgrimlost.com, and on Instagram at @karimgale, where you can find information on the 100-day project and more. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

In light of recent events and continual injustices against the black community, this week's episode is a repost of the May 14th episode with Robin Brown. Robin is a black, binary trans woman who has dedicated her life to studying social structures that oppress marginalized communities. Out of her own oppression was born a fierce passion for social advocacy, social change, and equity. Her two cultures have helped her flourish in both discovering her true identity and developing a voice this world so desperately needs. You can find Robin on Facebook at Robin Brown or Instagram at @robinjay25. To learn more from black voices, check out the work of Bernice A. King, Clint Smith, Ibram X. Kendi, Rachel Elizabeth Cargle, and Austin Channing Brown. The podcasts recommended at the end of this episode are 1619, Code Switch, and Pod Save the People. To the black community, we stand with you.

Juliana Ford was taken by surprise when she discovered her calling to be a pastor. With friends and family behind her, she pursued a Master of Divinity degree and recently graduated from Azusa Pacific University. Today, with joy and sincere passion, she shares about calling, God's will, and the importance of thoughtful biblical interpretation. This one's for Bible nerds, and anyone wrestling with Church, the Bible, and the tensions therein. The book mentioned in this episode is "Sacred Word, Broken Word" by Kenton Sparks. You can find Juliana on Instagram at @juliana.ford.27. You can also find Azusa Pacific's Center for Vocational Ministry on Instagram at @cvmapu or their website at apu.edu/vocational-ministry. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Traci Grabner is a fierce mom and loving ally. She grew up Christian and her faith is still important to her. Yet when her son came out to her, it challenged everything she'd ever known. Join us as we talk about when I came out, what it's looked like to be a mom and an ally, and engaging family members who aren't affirming. The book referenced in today's episode was "It's Not Supposed to Be This Way" by Lysa TerKeurst. The book referenced in today's resilience segment was "Space at the Table" by Brad Harper and Drew Harper. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Robin Brown is a black, binary trans woman who has dedicated her life to studying social structures that oppress marginalized communities. Out of her own oppression was born a fierce passion for social advocacy, social change, and equity. Her two cultures have helped her flourish in both discovering her true identity and developing a voice this world so desperately needs. You can find Robin on Facebook at Robin Brown or Instagram at @robinjay25. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

Darin McKenna is an out, queer pastor and Enneagram coach living in L.A. Yet once upon a time, he was a closeted pastor in Atlanta, Georgia, wrestling with faith, sexuality, and his place in the church. Though he wouldn't do it over again, beauty came out of those tensions and he wouldn't trade them for anything. You can find Darin at darinmckenna.com, Darin McKenna on Facebook, and @DarinMcKenna on Instagram and Twitter. His church, New Abbey North Hollywood, can be found at @newabbeynoho and newabbey.org/noho. You can support the podcast financially at anchor.fm/beautifultension, by leaving a rating or review, and sharing it with anyone you think might enjoy it. Make sure to subscribe to stay up-to-date on new episodes. Thanks for your support! --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

The "why" behind the podcast, where "Beautiful Tension" comes from, and the part of my story that started it all.