Podcast appearances and mentions of lulu ramadan

Across vast stretches of rural Washington, large boxy warehouses have popped up between fields of potatoes. They contain the humming infrastructure that the tech industry and users rely on to store documents in the cloud, access streaming videos, or perform internet searches.  It's easy to see why companies put data centers in this part of the state: cheap hydro electricity, available land, and a friendly legislature in Olympia that provides tax breaks. But now, all those data centers are gobbling up electricity, which will only intensify with the growth of AI technology.  And the growing demand is stretching the grid in rural counties, moving them farther away from green energy mandates from the state.  Lulu Ramadan and Sydney Brownstone are reporters at the Seattle Times who looked into the effects of data centers on the electrical grid and rural communities in a two part series. Guests: Lulu Ramadan, investigative reporter at The Seattle Times and a distinguished fellow with ProPublica's Local Reporting Network Sydney Brownstone, investigative reporter at The Seattle Times Relevant Links: Seattle Times: Data centers guzzle power, threatening WA's clean energy push Seattle Times: Data centers got a huge tax break to create WA jobs. Is it paying off? See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Years ago, Washington passed a law requiring electric utilities to go carbon-neutral in a decade. Yet lawmakers continued to give generous tax incentives to data centers, which use a huge amount of electricity. In fact, in the last few years Washington has gotten a smaller share of its electricity from renewable sources than it did two decades ago, despite producing a quarter of the nation’s hydropower. Lulu Ramadan, investigative reporter at the Seattle Times, joins us to talk about her reporting.

On this midweek show, Seattle Times reporter Dahlia Bazzaz returns with a run-down of education issues across Washington state. Dahlia and Crystal review the Legislature's considerations of special education funding, restraint and isolation in Washington schools, and free school lunch provision. They then cover the lawsuit brought by the Wahkiakum School District against the state, arguing that capital construction costs shouldn't be entirely borne by local taxpayers through school bonds. Finally, Dahlia and Crystal discuss the shift in enrollment patterns whereby students of color are now the majority in Washington public schools, the rise of direct student advocacy with lawmakers, and a call to action to get involved and educated about school boards and school district budgets. As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Follow us on Twitter at @HacksWonks. Find the host, Crystal Fincher, on Twitter at @finchfrii and find our guest Dahlia Bazzaz at @dahliabazzaz.   Resources “Special education spending, oversight top priorities for WA lawmakers” by Dahlia Bazzaz and Jeanie Lindsay from The Seattle Times   “WA schools still restrain, isolate students often despite state laws, report says” by Lulu Ramadan and Claire Withycombe from The Seattle Times   “Restraint and isolation in Washington schools: What these practices are, how they are being used and what needs to change” | ACLU of Washington   “The next McCleary? Tiny district with decaying school buildings sues WA state” by Dahlia Bazzaz from The Seattle Times   “No clear answers as WA Supreme Court hears case on school construction” by Dahlia Bazzaz from The Seattle Times   “WA legislators scrap plan for free school lunch for all students” by David Gutman from The Seattle Times    “Students of color are now the majority in WA public schools” by Dahlia Bazzaz from The Seattle Times   “WA kids deserve 45 minutes of recess time, new bill proposes” by Dahlia Bazzaz from The Seattle Times    “After fatal shooting in school, Seattle searches for answers to gun violence” by Dahlia Bazzaz & Jeanie Lindsay from The Seattle Times   “In Session: Drug possession bill passes, students make opinions clear on multiple bills” by Drew Mikkelsen from King 5 News   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher, and I'm a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington State through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast to get the full versions of our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, the most helpful thing you can do is leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. Full transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. Today, I am thrilled to be welcoming back to the show: Seattle Times education reporter, Dahlia Bazzaz. Welcome. [00:01:02] Dahlia Bazzaz: Thanks for having me again. [00:01:04] Crystal Fincher: Excited to have you back. We talk about education basically weekly on the show. There are so many things happening in the realm of education - in our schools, with our kids and students. It's so impactful in so many ways. Right now, we're in the middle of a legislative session where they're taking up a lot of issues that will be impacting education. And I thought we would start off by talking about what is currently in play, what is happening legislatively when it comes to education in our schools. So what is top of your mind with what the Legislature is working on? [00:01:43] Dahlia Bazzaz: Yeah, I think to set a little bit of context - this was one of the first sessions post-school closure and we didn't have any sort of form of remote schooling happen this year. So we're coming out of a lot of federal money that was offered to schools - a historic amount of federal money - as well as a lot of enrollment challenges affecting school districts and their budgets. So we came into the session hearing - lots of school districts facing financial challenges, and there's also been some topics that have crept up that have been on legislators' minds since before the pandemic. The most recent session before the pandemic started in 2019, the Legislature really took up special education and that was a huge topic. And it appears that has resurfaced again because that's been probably the biggest thing that's come up in terms of education legislation. One thing to note here is that this particular focus on special education is mostly related to funding. And one of the things that lawmakers are working through - today was the cutoff for bills to make it out of the house of origin, so out of the House or the Senate. And some of the bills that have survived include one bill in the House and one bill in the Senate that seek to address the same problem, which is that the state funding that goes to school districts to support disabled students is capped at a certain enrollment rate. So if you have more than 13.5% of your students receiving special education services, the state will not fund beyond that in its formula. You can seek to apply for a set of funds called safety net funding, but that's an additional barrier and paperwork, and it's basically an as-needed type of pot of funds. So the bill in the House proposes gradually decreasing that funding cap until 2027, when it's eventually removed. And it also proposes increasing the - what they call a multiplier - it's basically a per student rate. So for every student, let's say if you have - for every general education student, the state will give you $2,000. If you have a disabled student, they might give you an extra $900 on top of that. So this bill would also seek to increase that multiplier. It's not the exact amount, but let's say like instead of $2,900, they're giving you $3,500 per student receiving special ed. [00:04:23] Crystal Fincher: This is really an important thing because we already have districts who are above and beyond that cap right now. We're hearing from teachers across the state that more students are in need of more services. Certainly it takes more resources, it costs more money to educate students who have disabilities. And it's a responsibility of the state. It's a responsibility of each of these school districts to do so - we've had so many school districts talk about, They just don't have enough money to do it. They don't have enough educators, para-educators to do this. So does this look - it's continuing to move on - does it look like this is going to meaningfully help a lot of these districts who are in this situation right now? [00:05:09] Dahlia Bazzaz: Districts do, by and large, support this legislation. I think - I've watched enough legislative sessions to know that when things come down to the final budget writing, that what makes it in can be very different from what was going through the different chambers. So as it is, I think I've heard most people who are really in the education world support getting rid of that cap completely. There have been other proposals, including the one from the Senate, that just propose increasing that cap to 15% instead of 13.5%. So it does seek to put a lot of additional funds - we're looking at for the House bill, about $410 million over the next four years. The Senate bill would add about $771 million extra dollars over the next four years. So it's a significant amount of money, but time will tell about what actually makes it in in terms of concrete policy and funding changes. [00:06:09] Crystal Fincher: Got it. What else is being looked at? [00:06:11] Dahlia Bazzaz: So within special education and things that are affecting disabled students, there's also a bill out that would ban isolation and isolation rooms for students. It's a pretty big problem across the state. It was documented in a recent Seattle Times investigation as well. Essentially, this bill would seek to ban isolation rooms, which is a space that educators or school staff would put a student with a behavioral problem. It has a lock in which the student cannot unlock themselves, so basically it's just locking a student in a room. There are really not many provisions about what these isolation rooms look like, and a lot of research has shown that it's very harmful for students and kids and it can actually worsen behavior and worsen school avoidance. So this legislation would seek to ban these isolation rooms by 2025. It also would prohibit mechanical and chemical forms of restraint, so think of things like different medications used to sedate students or things like handcuffs that are used outside of a criminal justice type of environment - so these are all sort of ways to regulate the response to students with any behavioral problems at school. [00:07:32] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, absolutely. This is really important. I actually - just yesterday, I believe it was Kendrick Washington from the ACLU, who I know is involved with advocating for that bill actually posted a picture on social media about some of these isolation rooms. And it looks like a prison inside of the school. And this flies in the face of evidence about what actually does work to improve behavior and integration within schools. These types of tactics are used disproportionately against BIPOC students. It just - this doesn't seem appropriate for school settings at all, and for kids at all. This is not productive discipline, it's not effective. And so I really hope this is something that does make it through. [00:08:23] Dahlia Bazzaz: Yeah, and I'm remembering a case out of Spokane - I believe a few news outlets covered it in Spokane - where a student who is nonverbal was locked in a room that didn't have any sort of padding or whatsoever. And the student ended up hitting herself against a few walls and really injuring herself to the point of needing medical care and attention. So it's a pretty huge issue and it can cause physical harm to students. [00:08:47] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, absolutely. So we'll be keeping our eye on that one. Is there anything else that you've been tracking in the Legislature? [00:08:54] Dahlia Bazzaz: One other big issue is capital construction costs, which is something that I think we don't talk about enough within the K-12 sphere. But right now, the State Supreme Court is hearing a case that could be the next McCleary, except on the school construction side. So McCleary was the big school funding case that changed the way that teacher salaries and all these operational parts of a school are funded - really increased how much the state was spending versus how much local taxes we're collecting from voters. And so this case came up because a tiny school district in southwest Washington called the Wahkiakum School District sued the state. It hasn't been able to pass a bond in 22 years. And when you are a district that cannot pass a bond in Washington state, you don't have a ton of options to get funding for school construction. You can't apply for the biggest state program that offers assistance, which is called the SCAP [School Construction Assistance Program] program. This program only allows you to apply for funding if you pass a bond. So you're locked out of a lot of options. And so the same attorney that won the McCleary case for the plaintiffs has taken on this case for Wahkiakum, and they're coming at it from the same angle, which is that the State Constitution says that it is the state's paramount duty to amply fund education. And they are arguing that school construction that is essential to the safety of students is - falls under that umbrella term. So there are a couple of bills floating out there that try to address this problem. One of them is from State Representative Joel McEntire, who is an alumnus of Wahkiakum, I should say. And it is very specifically tailored to these very small school districts that struggle to raise money through bonds. It would provide about half of the construction costs for school districts that are 1,000 students or fewer. As of right now - 1:25PM - it has not passed out of its chamber of origin. But i have seen things come up in the budget out of the dead before in the final weeks of the session, so can't say for sure whether or not that's going to come through. There's also some proposals to redirect revenue from timber harvests over to school districts - also not sure where that's going to end up. But I think a fair amount of legislators see this issue as a problem - they think the state should provide more funding for school construction. But there are many who also believe that local taxpayers should be fronting most of that cost. And they don't really agree with a model like school operations where you would get, let's say, a certain amount of funds per student for school construction every year. So that's been a big topic. The hearing for that case, the first and only, is going to be next week on Tuesday. And I have a story publishing about the Wahkiakum School District this weekend, and it just takes a look at their school facilities. I went down there. The buildings are in some dire need of some improvements. The floors of the high school are lined with asbestos that are sealed in by a layer of wax. Their fire alarm system is from the 1960s and if it's activated, you have to use a leather welding glove to disable it - it gets really hot. There are lots of broken sinks in their science classrooms - they can't do experiments inside, they have to go outside, sometimes sitting in the rain to do any sort of chemistry labs. And yeah, they haven't been able to pass a bond in 22 years. So as you can imagine, there's a lot of outstanding maintenance and leaky ceilings and just crumbling infrastructure around the buildings. So look for that story coming up this weekend. [00:12:43] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. And we record before people hear this aired, so they may not hear this for a couple of weeks - but we are recording this at the moment on March 8th. So by the time people hear this, we'll be well past this - we'll know what definitely made it out of the chambers of origin. And we will absolutely share the upcoming article that you have in our resources in the show notes so people can have all of that context. And this is such an interesting conversation. The McCleary decision was such a big decision - messy process throughout that decision in even getting the Legislature to comply with that decision after it was made - was just its whole dramatic tooth pulling endeavor. But this is really a necessary continued part of this conversation. So many school districts across the state are reliant upon bond and levy revenue - they're reliant upon local voters opting in to fund these things throughout the district. And there was just a Marysville school levy election last month that if they wouldn't have passed that, they would have had to take immediate major steps to cut to fit within their limited budget. And so if it truly is the paramount duty of our state to fund education - whether it's special education, whether it's school funding in these capital costs - it really seems like there's a long way that we still have to go. And regardless of how this court case turns out, it seems like there is a responsibility for the Legislature to reckon with and fund this in a better and more sustainable way. [00:14:29] Dahlia Bazzaz: Yeah, that's certainly what Wahkiakum would like to see. And there have been other proposals to - let's adjust the bond approval rates - right now it's 60% with a certain percentage of voter outcome. And for Wahkiakum, the last bond they attempted - they only got 30% approval. So it's very challenging even without making those really substantive adjustments to the law. And there's also the issue of how much the districts can tax - when you have a really small school district and you have a really poor property valuation, you're not going to raise as much money as districts that are really well-to-do. So it would take - you would tax at a way higher rate to make a third of what Mercer Island or Bellevue would make if you were Wahkiakum. So it's also another sort of issue that lawmakers, Supreme Court justices will have to contend with. [00:15:21] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. And we have to ask ourselves - what are we setting ourselves up for and what kinds of patterns are we allowing this to fall into? If people coming from districts that already don't have the financial resources that others do, then aren't able to fund new building construction costs and are not able to provide a quality education or even a quality environment for people to learn in. If they aren't able to pass levies that provide some of what lots of people would consider to be educational basics and necessities - providing things like nurses and libraries and things like that, that we expect to be part of a traditional school experience. If we are setting ourselves up to make sure that people in lower income districts just cannot enjoy, just cannot have these types of things - seems like we're just further setting in stone cycles of poverty, because we're not enabling people from these areas to have a good education - who are more reliant on that education for mobility socially, economically, and otherwise. So I hope that this gets the attention that it deserves. [00:16:34] Dahlia Bazzaz: I hope so too. [00:16:35] Crystal Fincher: Is there anything else in the legislature that we should be looking at? [00:16:38] Dahlia Bazzaz: Just a couple of other things. There's a school lunch bill that would essentially extend, in a modified way, extend a Biden administration policy that expired last school year - which would offer free school lunch to all students. This state substitution would lower the threshold for when schools are required to offer free lunch to all students, regardless of income eligibility. So currently it's at about 40% or more students that would get, if they qualify, for free and reduced lunch at the elementary school level, then the entire school has to provide it for all students. And this would bump it down to 30% qualifying. So it would help a lot of schools that kind of straddle that 30-40% line, but it's not free lunch for everybody. And there's also a different graduation pathway option being proposed. So basically a different way for students to graduate high school. [00:17:37] Crystal Fincher: Well, yeah. And certainly if you follow me online, if you have listened to prior conversations - the bill, the original bill that would have just provided free school lunch to all students in Washington, sponsored by Senator T'wina Nobles, was something that I was very excited about, that lots of people were very excited about. To me, it seems - hey, if we're mandating kids be in this space, we can provide meals. Especially with what we learned throughout the pandemic in providing this additional school meals, with the addition of SNAP funds - that actually also just expired - we made such improvements, such dramatic improvements in childhood poverty reduction and in hunger reduction. And these are such basic things. If we cannot feed our kids, if we cannot keep our kids from being hungry, what are we even doing - just as a society - is basically where I'm at. And so especially the SNAP benefit boost ending and people essentially receiving a $95/month cut after we've seen so much food inflation in the first place. We know this cut is going to be made by making choices between food, medication, and rent, and clothes. And they're going to be more kids who are hungry - who just may not have as much food as they had before to eat. And we know that that impacts students' ability to learn. I can't sit through a meeting and pay attention well if I'm sitting there hungry and then I get hangry. And to think of kids going through this in school, it just seems like we can do better. But we have a number of people who said - Hey, there just isn't the money in the budget to do that. So as I said in other settings, I will say again - if that is the case, if that is the truth, then I sincerely hope that we see these legislators who said that we couldn't afford it fighting for the revenue to be able to afford that as soon as possible. Because it just doesn't seem like we're doing our job as a society if we're enabling kids to go hungry when we have the option to do better. [00:19:45] Dahlia Bazzaz: Yeah, I'm just sitting here and thinking about those first few months of school closures when school districts just turned into these food banks - and they were passing out food to anyone who came by - didn't have to be a student in a lot of these places. I remember talking to a lot of school districts in central Washington and South King County, and I was there when they were distributing a lot of food and goodies. And it was just a line constantly from 8AM to 5PM, so it's crazy to see the difference between now and then, and the transformation of what schools are doing. [00:20:22] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. So we've talked about what's happening within the Legislature, but what else is happening, or what else is making news in the state of education here in Washington? [00:20:34] Dahlia Bazzaz: A little bit at the top, but there's the enrollment patterns that emerged after the pandemic. Some of it is undefined, but we've lost a lot of students in Washington state - we've lost more than other states have on average. And a lot of districts are feeling the crunch because, of course, funds are tied to that student enrollment. And there is a bit of hand-wringing going on right now among school districts about school closures, about possible layoffs - Seattle Schools has warned about that. There could be school closures happening around the Seattle area and other parts of Washington state. And so I think that state officials, state education officials have been pushing for funding to help cushion that blow. And a lot of this is related to the pandemic federal aid running out, or the deadline coming out. They still have a couple of years to spend all those funds, but a lot of districts invested that money in salaries, and short-term positions, and then to fill budget gaps. So this is the result of all of that pandemic-era spending, and also a realization that students need more resources for mental health and counseling and social services. And so there's been a lot of addition of staff to school districts even as enrollment has been declining. And so this is kind of a crunch point right now for school districts. I wrote recently about a landmark that we just hit - we hit it last year technically, but it's also on the books this year - but students of color are now the majority in Washington state. And this is not unique across the country - we're actually a little bit behind the rest of the nation when it comes to this, but officially now make up the majority of the state. And it's been interesting digging into the enrollment patterns within those changes because not all student groups that are nonwhite have increased. In fact, we've seen some decrease over the years. And so I wrote a story about that recently as well. And it's been interesting seeing how districts are adapting to that new reality. [00:22:35] Crystal Fincher: And did I see that Black students were one of the groups that were decreasing? [00:22:39] Dahlia Bazzaz: Yes, Black students and Native students are among those that have decreased - and white students. [00:22:44] Crystal Fincher: Gotcha. Another issue that is important - just in terms of childhood development - is how much unstructured play time kids have and that's something that I think you wrote about, too. And paying close attention to the Legislature - this is the time of year that just hurts my feelings the most, because even the good things - they just get hacked to pieces and - [00:23:06] Dahlia Bazzaz: I know. [00:23:07] Crystal Fincher: - that hurts my feelings. And so I try to just not pay attention to - I'm not working on any legislation at the moment. So it's just like - I just want to not look, just let me know what survives and what doesn't, and I'll try and - So we've also seen a lot of advocacy directly from students talking about what they need, whether it is mental health, special education services, or even feeling safe on campus and what they need to do that. What have you seen from students and heard directly from them about what they say they need? [00:23:40] Dahlia Bazzaz: A lot of students have taken their advocacy directly to the state and to lawmakers. They recognize that violence on school campuses is a direct consequence of whatever laws there are in the state around who can own a weapon. And I think a lot of students are cognizant that the violence that happens on school campuses is just a microcosm of what happens outside of school campuses. So mostly they have been advocating for gun control law changes. They've also been advocating - as they have been for several years and for many different reasons - more mental health counseling, more social and emotional support and help, violence, de-escalation education in their classes. So a few different things. And even going back to 2018, 2017, we had those March for our. Lives movements that brought a lot of Seattle area students out - walking out of their schools and classes. So it's been something they've been thinking about a lot, and especially in light of the recent fatal shooting at Ingraham High School. [00:24:42] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. Now you have a perspective that is unique in the state - as someone who's covered education for a while thoroughly, who has seen things with her own eyes in a variety of different environments and circumstances, districts across the state - for people who really care about public education and who want to improve conditions but don't quite know where to start or what types of things would make the biggest difference, what would you say to someone who says, I want to help, but I'm not sure how. What would make the biggest difference? [00:25:18] Dahlia Bazzaz: Pay attention to your school board meetings. I think every year there's a city council election, there's a school board election. And when I see the turnout differences in Seattle - and in any other city, honestly - when I see the turnout differences between a city council race or a mayor race and then the school board elections, it always makes my heart fall a little bit because these folks are in charge of a lot of money and a lot of decisions that affect students. And there just isn't the same type of advocacy and accountability for these bodies. And journalists do the best they can, but there are 300 school districts in the state and not that many news organizations covering all of them. I know reporters that double up and they cover like 20 different school districts out in central Washington. There's no way you can watchdog all of those school districts at the level that is required to really catch everything. So I would say - get really involved in the school board politics, show up to meetings, testify to school board members - they have a lot more power than you think they do. And it is a, I think, a largely ignored body of policymakers as well, because they don't get paid very much - I think the law caps it at $4,000 in compensation. And people have been trying to change that because it can be an equity issue where only people that can sustain themselves and don't have to work a full-time job can take those positions. Do have the rare school board member that is a teacher at the same time, or can make the time or set it aside for school board activities. But it is - it is a full-time job for many people. And so I would say make sure to vote in those elections - I know that a lot of the time people ask for solutions and we just shout "Vote" at them, and it can be an incomplete answer. But I think in these cases, it's especially important to vote - because they can be separated by just like 20, 30, 40 votes - your vote really does matter in those elections. And just read through all of the documents that they're working through. They're required to record those meetings in minutes, so definitely pay attention to what is happening on the policy level. And if you can get a school board member to partner with you, they can introduce different policies and pass them at the school board level. I think more people are becoming cognizant of that - unfortunately, because of how much chaos has erupted in school board meetings over the past several years. But it's important that even outside of these huge controversies with masking, with CRT, that we're paying attention even when it's not dominating the headlines. [00:27:58] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. I think that is such wise advice, and I just second everything that you said. Especially because hardly anyone engages with school board races, school board meetings - so few people vote in those elections, are aware of who the candidates even are or what they stand for, that it really - because they can operate under the radar and without notice. People may be shocked to see the egregious things that are happening in school districts that they think are fine and safe and "normal" - and to see, whether it's conversations about book bans, about allowing all members of our community, including people in the LGBTQ community, all different cultures, ethnicities - it is just so important to engage in these races. And I have personally seen some shocking and alarming things happen at school board candidate forums and school board meetings. And I tell you, it just takes - three people showing up to a school board meeting can completely change the trajectory of things. It can make them reverse votes. I've been involved in movements to do that successfully, and it just doesn't take much. It just takes paying attention and engaging and getting involved. So whatever your local school district is, I think you are absolutely right in encouraging people to stay engaged, pay attention, make sure to vote in those elections. But also stay engaged throughout the rest of the year to make sure that you see what's going on - to make sure if some elements are trying to come in and usurp power or take over the district, that there are people who see that and who organize against it. Because right now a lot of it's flying under the radar and people may not notice until it's too late. [00:29:50] Dahlia Bazzaz: Absolutely. And I would also add to that - trying to gain a knowledge of how school districts budget and just the essentials of education finance, because - and I hear this a lot and I love this phrase, but - a budget is a moral document. And if you want to know where a school district puts its values, then you just have to look at what they're spending, and where they're spending it, and on which students they're spending it on. So if you show up for those days where they're going through the budget, going through their fiscal strategy - all those things can really pay off and give you a better understanding. Don't just show up for the policy days, show up for when they're actually putting the money behind those policies. [00:30:33] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. Thank you so much for taking this time again with us today to help educate us on what is happening in education across Washington state. Thank you so much, Dahlia. [00:30:44] Dahlia Bazzaz: Thank you for having me, Crystal - it's fun. [00:30:46] Crystal Fincher: Thank you for listening to Hacks & Wonks, which is co-produced by Shannon Cheng and Bryce Cannatelli. You can follow Hacks & Wonks on Twitter @HacksWonks. You can catch Hacks & Wonks on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts - just type "Hacks and Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast to get the full versions of our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the episode notes. Thanks for tuning in - talk to you next time.

For this Hacks & Wonks week-in-review, political consultant and host Crystal Fincher is joined by metro news columnist and opinion editor for The News Tribune in Tacoma, Matt Driscoll!  They start the show reviewing the criminal trial of elected Pierce County Sheriff Ed Troyer. Troyer is charged with false reporting and one count of making a false or misleading statement to a public servant in relation to his alleged harassment of Black newspaper carrier Sedrick Altheimer. This week, the trial revealed discrepancies in Troyer's account of the incident compared to the police report. This case hinges on whether the state can prove Troyer's actions were criminal, and it's anticipated that the trial will be sent to the jury next week.  Next, Crystal and Matt recap a new investigative report from ProPublica and The Seattle Times that reveals how deeply the state's schools are failing students with complex disabilities, sending many of them to for-profit entities with little oversight, leading to instances of mistreatment and abuse. In housing news, the Pierce County Council will vote next Tuesday on an affordable housing sales tax. The county needs more funding for affordable housing, and even though a sales tax is a regressive tax, it's the best available option the council has to generate additional revenue for affordable housing projects. The tax will require five votes to pass from the Council that includes four Democrats and three Republicans. In other Pierce County Council news, Crystal and Matt discuss the retirement of Council Chair Derek Young. They explore his political career, talk about his impact, and share their appreciation for how he handled the responsibility of being an elected leader. The trend of dangerous, sometimes violent protests against drag shows and drag story time events came to Renton this week, which saw a local brewery get shot at before their Drag Queen Story Hour event on Thursday. It's part of an increase of anti-LGBT and antisemitic hatred and violence happening across the country. The incident in Renton comes alongside  concerning reporting from KUOW revealing that the electrical grid in Oregon and Western Washington has been attacked six times since mid-November, with at least two of the attacks resembling the incident in North Carolina last Saturday. It's a foreboding sign of the rise of domestic terrorism in this country fueled by right-wing hate. As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Follow us on Twitter at @HacksWonks. Find the host, Crystal Fincher, on Twitter at @finchfrii and find today's co-host, Matt Driscoll, at @mattsdriscoll. More info is available at officialhacksandwonks.com.   Resources “TPD officer testifies that Troyer reported no death threat to him. Next, defense's turn.” by Jared Brown from The News Tribune   “WA's schools are failing students with complex disabilities. It's happening in Tacoma too.” by Matt Driscoll from The News Tribune   “‘Kids Seem to Be a Paycheck': How a Billion-Dollar Corporation Exploits Washington's Special Education System” by Lulu Ramadan, Mike Reicher and Taylor Blatchford from ProPublica    “At Washington special education schools, years of abuse complaints and lack of academics” by Mike Reicher & Lulu Ramadan from The Seattle Times   “Pierce County needs an affordable housing sales tax. Will it get one next week?” by Matt Driscoll from The News Tribune   “Pierce County Council Member Derek Young Retires from Politics for Unknown Future” by Sara Thompson from Key Peninsula News   “Renton Brewery Shot Up before Drag Queen Story Hour” by Will Casey from The Stranger    “String of electrical grid attacks in Pacific Northwest are unsolved” by Conrad Wilson & John Ryan from KUOW   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher and I'm a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington state through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Full text transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. Today, we are continuing our Friday almost-live shows where we review the news of the week with a co-host. Welcome back to the program, friend of the show and today's cohost: metro news columnist and opinion editor for The News Tribune in Tacoma, Matt Driscoll. [00:00:56] Matt Driscoll: Hello, thanks for having me - it's good to be back. [00:00:59] Crystal Fincher: It's great to have you back - enjoyed your commentary and insight last time, excited for it today. Well, there's a lot of news that we need to get to this week. I think the first thing that we will start off with a recap of is the trial of Pierce County Sheriff Ed Troyer. What is he on trial for and what has happened so far? [00:01:23] Matt Driscoll: Yeah. Well, first just a shout out to my colleague, Jared Brown, who's been in court covering this thing, following it on Twitter, and writing daily recaps - they've just been doing an incredible job in the courthouse. But yeah, our sheriff down here in Pierce County, Ed Troyer, he's on trial for two misdemeanor counts - one of false reporting and another of making a false or misleading statement. The reality of this - in general terms, if this was anyone else is - if convicted, he's facing maybe a little bit of community service and maybe a fine of some sort. It's not a big deal, in the sense of he was just an average person. But of course, it is a very big deal because he's our sheriff down here in Pierce County and there are a lot of complicated aspects of this case. Just to - if folks aren't following the case or haven't heard, which I kind of doubt at this point, but basically this all stems from an interaction he had with a newspaper delivery carrier. It's been so long now - I don't even remember exactly when that was, but I guess it was January - looking it up now - of 2021. A Black newspaper carrier in his neighborhood - Troyer basically saw him, thought he looked suspicious, started following him around. Confrontation ensued, Troyer ended up summoning a police response saying he had been threatened. It sparked a massive response, which was quickly kind of downgraded to a smaller response. But still, the bottom line was you had a huge police response, guns-drawn situation with a Black newspaper carrier who felt in danger for his life. And so that story, thanks to the reporting of folks at The Seattle Times and then at The News Tribune, got a lot of attention and led to the governor calling for an investigation into it. And eventually it led from charges from the state AG's office. So there's no charges down here locally, but Bob Ferguson jumped in and filed these misdemeanor charges. And that was a long time ago, and we're finally at the trial now. So we've been following it here for a couple of weeks - jury selection took a while, and now we're into actual testimony. And actually, Ed Troyer was on the trial, or on the stand, yesterday. So that was the latest interesting event in an interesting case, that's probably the most high-profile misdemeanor trial I can recall. [00:04:01] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. So Ed Troyer is an elected sheriff, not an appointed sheriff, like currently exists in King County - also makes just the issue of accountability more challenging. It's not a situation where - in the midst of this, there were inconsistencies that were revealed between Ed Troyer's initial account and what actually seems to have taken place, or what ended up in the police report about this. And in those situations, often - I won't say oftentimes - but in other situations, sometimes that could lead to accountability or discipline locally. That's a whole different issue when you have an elected public official and not someone who is subject to interdepartmental discipline or anything like that. So this trial is basically the accountability lever and - to the point of independent oversight - had to be initiated externally, because it wasn't happening just from the agencies in the jurisdiction. The prosecution presented their case and rested. The defense is now presenting their case. There were questions about whether Ed Troyer would take the stand in his defense. He has done so. And up until this point, where we're recording on Friday morning, the defense questioned him and now he is getting ready to face questioning from the prosecution. So we will see how this turns out, we will continue to follow this along. I don't think the trial is expected to last more than a few more days before it goes to the jury. Is that correct? [00:05:45] Matt Driscoll: It's been slow going - I think that's the expectation. They don't - there are no trials on Friday, no trial on Friday - so the next action will be Monday. You'll have the state cross-examining Troyer. And I should mention - that was a shoddy recap, I guess - because I've been living it down here in Pierce County for so long, it just feels like coming up. But the crux of this case basically is - when Troyer summoned police response, he said that his life had been threatened. And then when cops arrived, he told them that wasn't the case. So that's the crux of it - is whether he made a false statement, a false report that summoned this huge police response. It's almost like a swatting, mini-swatting situation. So it kind of hinges on that. At the end of the day, I think, there's going to be a big burden on the state to prove that this was more than - and I guess I'm a columnist, I can share these sorts of opinions - whether this was more than Ed Troyer being stupid, right? Like I think it's established that - what he, at least in my mind - his actions on that morning were not the smartest thing to do and were not what he should have done. But is that criminal or not? I think that's going to be that's kind of the crux of it. And I think it's going to be interesting to see what the jury decides there. My gut tells me it's going to be difficult, just given the nature of things to get all jurors to agree one way or the other, but we'll see. And that's why we follow it. [00:07:20] Crystal Fincher: It is why we follow it. Certainly I'm sitting here as a Black woman, who has seen these situations unfold, and feels that this newsletter, newspaper carrier was fortunate to escape this situation with his life. The kind of call and the kind of accusation made initially in the call is the kind of pretext to death and shootings - shootings called justified because they felt that they were threatened, particularly from Black men. So this call was - if this indeed happened the way it's alleged to or appear to have happened, was a risk to this Black man's life. And by just doing his job - to have someone who felt uncomfortable with this Black person in their neighborhood - followed them, basically stalked them down the street, and then initiated a confrontation - is just beyond the pale. And one, for anyone in that situation - he could have been any other resident on the street calling and saying their life was threatened by this person, and it would invite a massive police response - certainly for the sheriff of the entire jurisdiction. And is this behavior that we want to see, that we are comfortable with from the head of all law enforcement in that jurisdiction - even in the most charitable interpretation of this possible, which you kind of recap, where he's just being ignorant and ridiculous. Do we want this ignorance leading this agency? Is this the head that we want? Regardless of the outcome of this trial, I think those are important questions to examine and ask - for us to ask ourself - where is the bar that we hold elected officials and public safety officials to? And I personally feel that Pierce County deserves better, but we'll see how this trial turns out and we'll continue to follow it throughout. Also want to talk about a story that you talked about - that came from ProPublica, The Seattle Times also wrote about it - but about Washington schools failing students with complex disabilities. What's happening here and what have you seen in Tacoma? [00:09:52] Matt Driscoll: Yeah. I mean, this is just an incredible story. And first and foremost - I guess I did this last time too - but credit where credit's due - the reporting team there on Seattle Times and ProPublica on this story. It's just a jaw-dropping story. This is one of those stories where my wife and I were sitting - because they'd hit on Saturdays - and we're sitting around in the living room and she's actually reading the excerpts from the story because we're in such disbelief of what's transpiring. But the long and short of it is basically the state is obligated to provide basic education to students with complex disabilities. They're required to require basic education to all students, but including those with disabilities. And in certain cases, you've got children, students with disabilities that make it really difficult, if not impossible, to do that in a standard classroom or a standard school building. Districts across the state have done a lot of work to try to integrate students with disabilities as much as possible into regular classrooms. As a parent of a child with disabilities, I know the system well. But in some cases, when you're talking about - sometimes severe behavior stuff, sometimes it's medical, feeding tubes - any number of things that can require a situation where - what the state needs to provide can't be done in a classroom. So, long story short, districts don't have a lot of money. We don't fund education anywhere near as much as we should, and they have this obligation to serve these students. So what has transpired basically is a system that we've created in the state where these students are often - that work is outsourced to other schools. Many times they're for-profit schools - they're publicly-funded private schools, so private entities that then receive state funding to do this work. Districts send their challenging students there, the students that need this there. But with the story, the ProPublica-Seattle Times piece really revealed is just the incredible lack of oversight that happens there. It's basically on the districts to monitor each of their students, and the oversight from the state as a whole is really lax. Maybe districts know what's going on with their individual kids. Maybe they've got a couple in these situations, but the full picture is really hard to see. And that's what this investigation revealed. And what it revealed, shockingly enough, is that when you welcome in for-profit entities to serve our most vulnerable children, bad stuff happens sometimes. And there's some really bad stuff in this story. Some allegations of abuse and mistreatment, just some anecdotes that I won't - you should read the story, but some of the situations painted specifically in one of these schools, the Northwest, the acronym is SOIL - I'm going to of course forget what it stands for at the moment - but it's the largest one of these in the states. It's got three campuses, including one in Tacoma. Long story short, Tacoma has relied heavily on this school in particular over the years, going back to 2015. It has sent basically more funding to this Northwest SOIL school than any district in the state by a wide margin. And the unsatisfying answer here is - when talking to district officials, it's essentially - this is the system we have. It's not great. We would like to see it better, but we don't have the means to serve these students and we're reliant upon it. And so that's a really unsatisfying answer. It's an unsatisfying answer to parents, I'm sure, but I think the bigger picture is until we reimagine them and blow up this system we've created in this state, where we're essentially outsourcing this work to for-profit corporations and publicly-funded private schools where - we basically welcome situations like this, in my opinion. So that was a lot of rambling, but this story, it pissed me off. It makes me really, really mad. [00:14:10] Crystal Fincher: It's a shame. And the state unquestionably has a responsibility to provide an appropriate education, in the least restrictive means possible, to all students - including those with disabilities and complex disabilities. Funding has been a continual conversation in this. And the fact is these programs don't currently exist in public schools to the degree they need to serve all the entire population of students, including those with complex disabilities, because they don't have the funding to implement and support those. And as we see too often in these situations, if you ask me, for-profit companies then are there to fill that gap, they say. But what we see is that when profit is a main driver and not an outcome from a student is the main driver - predictably, obviously - we're going to see profit prioritized ahead of these students. And we're seeing them in these situations with shocking and abhorrent and abusive and harmful consequences. And are we comfortable? In the column that you wrote, you asked a very appropriate question. Are we comfortable abdicating our responsibility as the state to for-profit entities who already have a record that is troubling? Are we comfortable with this? Because this is the system that we have and there are reasons, multiple reasons, to be uncomfortable. Are we prepared to confront the questions about funding that are related to this? Are we prepared to meet the responsibility as the state ourselves, or continue to check a box saying - oh, we handed the student over to the Northwest SOIL School, which seems like an appropriate acronym at this point in time. [00:16:12] Matt Driscoll: School of Innovative Learning, that's what it is. [00:16:16] Crystal Fincher: Yes, and so it's just really troubling. Right now, there are no other options - so families are faced with the prospect of their kids not getting their constitutionally mandated education, or sending them someplace where they're at risk - that's the plain truth - where they're at risk. They're certainly at greater risk than in the school setting and other settings for abuse. But if they're in another setting, they're at risk of not getting an appropriate education. That is a choice that no family should have or should face, and we have a responsibility to do better. We have to talk about revenue. We have to talk about funding as part of that. And I hope the Legislature takes this seriously and meaningfully addresses this deficit and these challenges, because it's going to take action there to help solve this. But man, this is troubling. I'm happy you wrote about it. I'm happy that ProPublica and The Seattle Times did this piece, with so much investigation and legwork that it took - just really troubling. We owe our kids, all of our kids, a better education than this. We can do better. [00:17:34] Matt Driscoll: No, you're exactly right. And I think your prescription for what needs to happen is exactly right too - that's one of the frustrating things - talking to the local district. I felt obligated to call Tacoma and basically be like - you read this story, WTF. But you do that, right? And it's not a problem that they can solve by themselves - they can't, given the current structure, provide the services that they need to because they don't have the money and they don't have the staffing and they don't have the resources to do it. So Tacoma can't solve it alone. The Seattle schools can't solve it alone. It really does require a state response and really a complete rethinking of the way we serve these students - and most of all, bags and bags of money. And you would hope that reading something like this would inspire us to have those difficult conversations and would inspire that change. But the political realities of it make me fear that we're going to take half measures, we're going to increase our oversight of these - when what I really think we need to do is blow it up and work on the thing. Because the only option is not just for-profit. There are schools that do this work that are not for-profit. There are other ways to do this. So there's a school in Puyallup - I think it's the Olympic Academy or Olympic something or other, and this is really wonky stuff - but basically there are education regions and they can band together and they can create these schools - and it's not a for-profit thing, there's more oversight, there's more involvement, there's more district involvement. So it's not an unsolvable problem - what it takes is political will and a lot of money. [00:19:25] Crystal Fincher: That is true. And once again to reinforce, they're constitutionally mandated to provide this. If our constitution means anything, then that should motivate working to fix this problem. Also want to cover an issue that you also wrote about - Pierce County needs an affordable housing tax. It is going to be up for a vote in front of the Pierce County Council next week. What will this do? And is it going to pass? [00:19:57] Matt Driscoll: No, I don't think so. But first I want to just get your - as a King County person, are you shocked by the fact Pierce County does not have this tax? Because most people, many counties do. This is not like some rare thing. Is it mind-boggling to you to hear that we're still fighting in Pierce County about whether or not we should build affordable housing? [00:20:20] Crystal Fincher: Well, I may be a bit more familiar with Pierce County than a lot of people, so I find it not surprising at all in any kind of way. I think Pierce County is moving closer to there. Are they at the point where they're ready to pass this now? Questionable. But this problem is just getting so much worse for everybody that it's getting undeniable. And we are seeing, more and more, that voters are voting for people who are saying that they're going to take action. And seeing pressure even from entities who traditionally rail against any kind of taxes - no matter what kind of benefits they have, especially if people with money need to pay more taxes - that they're feeling pressure to at least come up with rhetoric saying that they want to address this problem. Because before, several years ago, I think people were comfortable not addressing this at all, or maybe not characterizing this as a problem for everyone. That's not possible anymore. This is a problem for everyone. And so now it's just the question, what are they going to do about it? And is this something that they feel moved to do? But just backing up a little bit - [00:21:34] Matt Driscoll: Let me answer your original question - I apologize. But yeah, so basically, it's a one-tenth of 1% sales tax in Pierce County, which would raise about $20 million a year - estimated - cost the average Pierce County resident about $16 a year, that then that money could be used for affordable housing or related services. Tacoma already has this tax, so we already do it here in Tacoma. A number of cities and counties across the state already do it - conservative and liberal - I don't know the exact numbers off the top of my head, but I know Wenatchee has it. Ellensburg has it. Spokane has it. Snohomish has it. Thurston has it. As you pointed out, I think we've passed the point of this being a problem that elected leaders feel comfortable ignoring. I think they know they can't ignore it. So in Pierce County, to pass this tax, what it's going to take is a supermajority on the Pierce County Council. So current makeup on the council is four Democrats, three Republicans. In my opinion, as a columnist, the reason that you've seen Pierce County move closer, as you alluded to, is because we do have a Democratic majority on the Pierce County Council now. So I think that's sped up some of these talks, some of this action. We do have a Republican Executive in Bruce Dammeier. But regardless, it's going to take five votes, by our charter, to get a tax passed - so they're going to need a Republican to side with the Democrats to pass this tax. It was passed out of committee last Tuesday. It'll be voted on on the 13th if it all goes as scheduled. And I anticipate a split vote - I think this is going to be a 4-3 vote. I think this is going to be very similar, for those who follow it - in Pierce County, our long trod towards enacting a behavioral health sales tax, which is very similar. It was a very similar situation. Counties, cities across the state already had it. It's money that goes to behavioral health services, mental health and addiction services. Pierce County drug our feet for years. We literally debated it for years and years and years. And we finally were able to get that fifth vote on the council to make it happen in 2021. So it took a very long time. I anticipate this is going to be a very similar thing. I think what's going to happen is, Democrats are going to make the case next week. It's going to be a rock solid case because anyone who looks around, I think, can see where home prices are, where housing prices are, our lack of affordable housing. I think the estimate by the county's own plan to address housing is they need something like 50,000 units affordable to those at 50% of area median income or below by 2044 just to meet the need, which doesn't even consider the housing that's needed to meet those above 50% of area median income, which is very low. I don't know Pierce County area median income off the top of my head, but it's it's usually around $50,000-60,000 depending on whether you're looking at individuals or families. This is not a wealthy county. This is hitting us hard. This is hitting us in Tacoma. This is hitting us in rural places. It's clear we need some sort of answer from the county - both to build the housing itself, and to help get federal money to address the problem. But no, I don't think it's going to pass yet. I think it's going to take a long time. I think the Republicans are going to express the things they're uneasy about, and they're going to go through the process of trying to answer those questions. I also anticipate it becoming more of a political football. If you follow Pierce County - listeners - clearly, you're very familiar with Pierce County, so I don't mean to suggest you're not - but for listeners, I know sometimes it seems like a weird, far off place. There's a micro home village for the chronically homeless that Republican County Executive Bruce Dammeier and his team very much wants to build. There are some questions about what the funding would look like for that. The current plan, as it's been described as basically a one-time investment of ARPA funds and then hands it over to private folks and donations. I think one thing that's going to - that you might see - is Democrats saying, if you want to build this, we need the tax. I wouldn't be surprised to see that. I also think it's just going to be one of those long bureaucratic processes where the Republicans need to prove to their base that they're not gung ho for a new tax, and they need to be won over, and they need all these guardrails that we talk about to ensure that the money is spent wisely and yada, yada, yada. I think eventually we'll get there, but I don't anticipate it Tuesday. So it was a long answer, but I think that's where things stand. [00:26:21] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I think that's a decent read of the situation. What I would say - [00:26:25] Matt Driscoll: Decent, decent! [00:26:26] Crystal Fincher: I think it's a great, accurate read of the situation. I was about to say - I think you nailed it with its parallel to the behavioral health tax issue and debate, and how lengthy that was. And I think that's also instructive - for those who do want to see this implemented - on how to get that passed. As you talked about in your column, the pressure from the public was instrumental in getting that tax passed. And I think it will be instrumental in addressing this issue. And so for those who are listening, for the public out there - it is really important to contact your County councilmembers, to contact your elected leaders - even if you feel they're not inclined to vote for this, or if they are, to let them know what your situation and circumstance are, to let them hear your story. Anecdotes actually go a far way, a long way in addressing issues like this. A lot of times people don't understand the specific pain that is being felt by people put in these situations - how it impacts seniors on fixed incomes, veterans, those who are dealing with families with complex needs, the disabled community. People who are among the most vulnerable and in need of protection, who are some of the people who are least likely to be able to just meet an increase with a raise at work - if they're not working, if they're retired, if they're in different industries that are not keeping up with this kind of thing. A sales tax, I think across the board, you will find it's no one's favorite tax to implement. To be clear, it is a regressive tax. It is also the only lever that the county is afforded in this situation to be able to solve this. And until there are different avenues opened up at the state level, this is what the county is left with to be able to address this problem. And I think my read of the situation - a lot of people's read - is that this is the time to do everything possible at all levels to address this crisis, because it is a crisis. So it'll be interesting to see how this unfolds. It'll be interesting to hear, particularly what the Republican members of the council do say, as they deliberate this and discuss this in their meeting and in the public - and how they answer the concerns that their residents have. So we'll continue to follow this story also. [00:29:02] Matt Driscoll: Yeah, I agree. And just one quick point on that process - this is Hacks & Wonks. I was talking to some folks about the - why now, why we're doing it. And I think there is an importance, even if the tax isn't - even if it's not going to pass this time, I think it's helpful from a political standpoint to get the folks on that council on the record to say what their position is and why they're either supporting it or in some cases not supporting it, because that's exactly what we saw with the behavioral health sales tax is - once you publicly have that conversation and say what you would need to - because again, no one can deny the problem. Say what you would need to get there to support something like this - that kind of gets the ball rolling and you can start answering some of those questions. So I think it's, even if it doesn't pass next week, I think it's a starting point and it's a good first step. [00:29:56] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely agree. Another item I want to talk about today is with someone who the listeners of Hacks & Wonks are probably familiar with, because he has been a prior guest - is Pierce County Council Chair Derek Young is about to complete his final term on the Pierce County Council. He is being term-limited out and is stepping down and away from public life. And so I just wanted to just take a moment and see what your reflections on Derek and his term have been. How did you find his time in office to be? [00:30:37] Matt Driscoll: Yeah, it's an interesting discussion for me, in comparison for me, because he's been on the council for eight years now. So basically he arrived at his position about the same time that I arrived as a metro news columnist at The News Tribune. I'd been working at The Seattle Weekly previous to that, still lived down here - but so basically our tenure overlaps. So I basically covered him the whole eight years of his time on the council. And for Derek, for those who don't know - maybe it's been mentioned on the show - but he was essentially like the Parks and Rec's boy mayor of Gig Harbor on the council. I forget how young he was when he was first elected to the Gig Harbor City Council, but he was quite young. He did that and then later he ran for Pierce County Council and he's been there for eight years. So listen, from a journalism perspective, from a news perspective, I think we like to keep sources at an arm's length. We need to maintain skepticism, right? We can't become best friends with the people we cover. And certainly, Derek and I are not best friends by any means - but I will say - you interact with a lot of people in this job and you talk to a lot of people and you talk to a lot of politicians. And a lot of times they are, you can tell they're just feeding you soundbites, feeding you hot air, feeding you what the research says they should say. And Derek, I have just always found to be - one, he's really sharp on the policy stuff. He's one of those people that - I think it takes a special kind of person to get really into the mechanics of governments and just be really into it - excited about the procedures and the policy, but he's one of those people. He's really smart at that stuff and I just think he's really reasonable and really sensible, and those are things I appreciate in a leader. One thing about Derek is - there was a time when he was a Republican. And then he has since become a Democrat - now he's been a Democrat for many years now - but Pierce County is an interesting place, right? We've got Tacoma, which is this urban, progressive hub, and then you've got the rest of the county. And the bottom line with the rest of the county is it is either very moderate or red. And Derek is one of these people that can walk the line, that can get progressive things done in a county like Pierce County. And I think there's something to be said for that. I think we talked about the behavioral health tax already. I think Derek's a key reason that we got that. I think we're bringing up the affordable housing tax now, in part, because Derek's ending his term and they want to get a vote with him, even though his predecessor will likely - or the person who, I don't know, I always get those words mixed up - but the person who's filling his seat will likely vote the same way. I think it's as an honor to him - just the work he's done - they want to get a vote in before he leaves. So I think he's accomplished a lot. I think a lot of what he's accomplished has been behind closed doors in that kind of wonky way, that government work. I don't know how long we have to talk about this, but I was talking to Derek just last week about - I had an issue with a vote he took back in 2015 that would have allowed big box retailers up in Fredrickson. And I was all ready to rip him up on it because I was writing about Canyon Road and the way that has sprawl that's created. And I called him up and he was like - well, actually two years later we reversed that. It didn't get a lot of promotion because I didn't want to spike the football, but we were able to reverse that through just basic government maneuvering, the kind of stuff that most people don't see. And he's really good at that kind of stuff. So I think it's been a successful tenure and it'll be interesting to see what he does from here. [00:34:50] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. And from my perspective, especially looking at the politics of things, I think Derek is one of the forces most responsible for the Democratic representation and the increase in Democratic representation that we've seen in Pierce County, certainly on the Pierce County Council. He has always prioritized developing leaders, recruiting leaders, and supporting other leaders. Like you said, a lot of his work has been done behind the scenes, which is absolutely true. And I don't think people really understand how much work he has done, both to build Democratic leadership in Pierce County and just on the nuts and bolts of building better communities. One of the cities doing the best job in the state, actually, in meeting their comprehensive plan goals to accept density is Gig Harbor. It's not an accident that that comes in the wake of the work that Derek Young did in Gig Harbor. And just understanding the nuts and bolts of building community, of understanding how you have to adequately plan for growth - or else there are lots of consequences - how regional planning is important to local outcomes and results in feeling that responsibility. Absolutely, I don't think the behavioral health tax would have passed without him. And doing meaningful stuff - he has taken his responsibility as a steward of public health for the county seriously. And has had to fight against a lot of opposition and weird forces, including through the pandemic, to maintain the capacity and ability to deliver on that responsibility. So I just appreciate his thoughtfulness. We don't agree on everything, but the one thing that I always find is that he's coming with a great understanding after a lot of conversations with folks in and throughout the community, that he is not making decisions simply based on emotion or rhetoric or what's popular, that he's really thoughtful and processes information and community needs in a really serious way, and really focused on outcomes and accountability - and I think that has shown. And so as I see him leaving, it certainly leaves a legacy that I think he can be proud of and that others are building upon. I think Gig Harbor and Pierce County are better off for Derek Young having served. So I just wanted to take a moment to talk about that and say I personally appreciate what he has done, and see him as an example for others to follow as they look at being an elected official in public leadership. [00:38:02] Matt Driscoll: Well said. I'm not going to gush about the guy on record - I just think that I'd lose street cred as a journalist if I just, if I just gushed. But yeah, he's very thoughtful and I've enjoyed covering it. It's been - it's funny to see - eight years of the overlap that we've had, but I've enjoyed talking to him. He's been a good source. You can always call him and he'll explain something to you, which I always appreciate because I do the Columbo thing, right - where it's - oh, walk me through this. And he'll always walk you through it. And those land use things, he's really sharp on those sorts of things. So yeah, I agree 100%. [00:38:36] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. And he's younger than a lot of people who wind up long political careers, because he did start at 21 in Gig Harbor. So excited to see what is next for him. Now, a troubling story this week. One of a few troubling stories, frankly, but there was a Renton brewery that was shot up before a drag queen story hour. This is a story that we're seeing unfold across the country, and we're not immune from it here in Washington state. There are a number of drag queen story hours. This one in Renton was one that caught people's attention, that actually had a lot of chatter online about it from right-wing sources railing against this. There's been a lot of unfortunate, inaccurate characterization of people who are just existing as trans people in the drag community - and characterizing them and people who patronize, support, associate with them - as "groomers" or "pedophiles," or somehow degenerate, morally unfit - blah, blah, blah, blah. This being used as a political tool by many people - attracting a lot of hate speech, threats of violence, dehumanizing speech - which we all know incites violence. And predictably, this has incited violence. Now there's no absolute clear tie. We don't know who did fire this shot into this brewery, but we are seeing a familiar pattern of hateful rhetoric, violent rhetoric - followed by violent action. We've seen it at hospitals that treat the trans community and trans children. We've seen it at other drag story, drag queen story hours, and now we're seeing it here. To be clear, these stories - it is literally a story hour - it's just a drag queen reading some stories. There is this assertion by right-wing forces that basically just existing as a drag queen - and they also say for the trans community and it's extending to the entire gay community really - that just existing in drag is inherently sexual and immoral, which is not the case. That's like saying just existing in a heterosexual existence and in particular type of clothing is inherently sexual. It is not, but that is the assertion here and it's being used to pass laws in different states to basically keep people from being able to fully participate in society and to ostracize them. This is part of a coordinated effort and goal that we are seeing, and it looks like violence and really this is terrorism. This is politically motivated violence, is part of the overall strategies and tactics that are being used by right-wing forces to fight against this. This happened in Renton. This attracted a lot of sympathy and support obviously from the community coming together to say this is unacceptable. We support you. There's a talk about a rally to support that in the community. There's no question that the broader community finds this unacceptable and abhorrent. The question is - how diligent are we going to be as a society and are investigative and law enforcement entities going to be in combating this? I think that's the question before us right now as a community - how intense are we going to be in standing against this? But it's unacceptable. I am not shocked certainly, but dismayed to see this happen locally in Renton, as it's happening across the country. And I'm dismayed at the acceptance of blatant hate and dehumanization of certain groups, whether it's the drag community, folks within the LGBTQ community - principally the trans community at this point in time. I think this is absolutely related to the rise in anti-Semitic talk that we see openly, and accepted, and that's being platformed around this country. Openly racist talk - we are seeing a renaissance of hate, and it is really dismaying. And it's going to take people not tolerating this in all of the spaces that they are in. If someone's making a joke as you're at the gym, if you're talking with your friends, if you're at work - wherever you're at, we can't tolerate jokes. We can't tolerate casual statements of hate. We can't tolerate dehumanization and othering and we have to make it absolutely clear that it's unacceptable to say that in our presence. People who espouse hate should be more uncomfortable doing that than they currently are, and we all have a role to play in that happening. Wondering what your take is on this, Matt? [00:44:18] Matt Driscoll: Well, just a hard pro sign I guess on everything you just said. I think you summed it up really well. I guess I feel obligated to note that I've read the story about this. I don't know everything about this specific instance, but I think broadly speaking - the picture you paint is 100% accurate. You see hate, I think you see it fomenting online. I think you see the way that that turns into real action and real harm and real danger and real terrorism. I do think that this constitutes as terrorism when things like this happen. And going back to a conversation we had before we started recording - obviously, you alluded to other places across the country where you've seen laws passed and those sorts of things and certainly those things are happening, but I think a big part of this is - you called it a renaissance of hate and I think these are desperate actions by people who are losing. I mean I think they're losing, and I think they know it and they feel it - and I think that this leads to - and this doesn't excuse any of it, just in case that's not incredibly clear - but I think they're desperate and it generates hate speech. And when you add in the internet where people are able to silo themselves off and the stuff just grows and grows and grows and grows, it eventually - and none of us should be shocked by this - it eventually jumps off the screen and moves into real life. And people get hurt, and people get killed, and lives are altered, and lives are taken. So yeah, I agree with you. I think the general level of acceptance of this sort of stuff in our society, and the way we talk about it, and the way we report on it, and the way we discuss it, and the way we think about it - needs to be more clear just how unacceptable it is. [00:46:27] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely agree. And to the point you were just discussing and we discussed earlier - they are losing. They are absolutely losing. I think one thing that we do need to recognize is that when it comes to marginalized populations gaining rights in this country - and there are another number of countries where this precedent has been set, but we don't need to look any further than this country - terrorism has been employed as a response to that. Okay, we can't do it at the ballot box, we're losing - so we're just going to enact violence to attempt to fulfill our needs. I mean there was a statement made in North Carolina that these acts of violence and terrorism will continue to happen as long as drag queen story hours exist - it's a pretty clear statement of motivation and intent. And we need to not be surprised by this, but be prepared for it. And to effectively fight against it at all levels - to hold our elected officials accountable for fighting against it, to hold our institutions accountable for fighting against it, and to hold ourselves accountable for fighting against it - in all of the spaces that we inhabit, all the places that we are, and the people who we associate with in any way. That this is unacceptable in all of its forms because we're not done with this. It's predictable that it was going to happen. We know that rhetoric like this results in violence and it's escalating. And either we're gonna take steps to counteract it or we're in for a lot more. We have to address this. And related to that - seemingly, are stories about attacks on our electrical grid here in the Pacific Northwest as we saw back East. We have had attacks on our electrical grid here in the Pacific Northwest. What has happened with these attacks? [00:48:35] Matt Driscoll: Yeah. Certainly I've just been - I think this is one of the - I know as a news person you get this weird kind of callous nature where you're like - oh man, this is a really interesting story - when it's actually a terrifying story, a really alarming story. But yeah, this story is all of those things, and I've just followed it like anyone - but basically, what we're seeing is what appear to be at least somewhat coordinated attacks on power grids across the country. I forget - where was the, was it Carolinas that - yeah. So and then we've had some up in this area as well - I think it was - KUOW did a really good kind of look into what's happening. And again - similar - going back to your point, I've just read the stories everyone else read, but certainly what seems to be happening - at least to some extent - is extremist online groups being involved with encouraging and instructing folks how to do this. And the people who follow online extremist groups then going out and doing it. And I want to be careful - because I, again, I've just read this item - we don't have an exact answer to what's going on yet, so I don't want to jump to conclusions. But I do think we can say that you know there does seem to be some online extremist group involvement with this to - helping to perpetuate it - and people are doing it across the country. And it's terrifying, not just because of the prospect of losing power and what that could do - and when we talk about losing power, we're talking about a whole lot more than just your lights going off. There's a lot of fairly obvious reasons why electricity is very - it's crucial to a lot of folks, including in medical situations and what have you, but it's again - it's just terrifying for the way you see just belligerent hate, the kind of hate that if you encountered it in-person, it would be like one person ranting lunacy on a corner. But online, the way people can self-select and can group, it becomes incredibly, incredibly dangerous. So yeah, I think there are similarities between this story and the one we just talked about in the way that online extremism seems to be playing a role in it. [00:51:08] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, absolutely. And it was in North Carolina - after gunfire attacks on two electrical substations - resulted in tens of thousands of people being out of power for days. This was not a brief interruption - schools were closed, traffic lights were dark, people who relied on refrigerated medication had it spoil. It is a horribly disruptive situation - our society runs on power at this point in time, and this was an attack on that. Here locally, there were six separate attacks in Washington and Oregon - the Bonneville Power Administration, Puget Sound Energy, Cowlitz County Public Utility have reported different attacks involving cutting through fences into these facilities, attacking infrastructure with gunfire, setting fires - really seems to be employing a number of the same tactics that we saw in North Carolina. And across these six different attacks here in Washington and Oregon - employing similar tactics across those attacks - so this seems to be a coordinated effort that we're seeing. Some of these resulted in more disruptive power losses than others. This doesn't seem to be some super sophisticated entity doing sophisticated things to disrupt this - these are people crudely breaking in, shooting up these facilities. It does invite questions about what can be done to harden the security of these facilities, where else may we be vulnerable - there are lots of conversations about just our infrastructure in our community for basic services and what can be done to better protect those, because evidently there are groups that are seeing those as principal and primary targets, no matter how many people it impacts. And it does seem like this tactic has now shifted to - we're targeting specific communities, but we're willing to make sure everyone feels pain in order to try and help achieve our goals. And it's causing pain, and we're - this is the tip of the iceberg, it seems. And either we do something to intervene right now, or we see this get a lot worse. The FBI has declined to comment on whether or not they're investigating these, but it's an issue and we've had several attacks here locally and it's just troubling. [00:54:08] Matt Driscoll: It's, yeah - troubling is the word for it, I would say. It's just, it's so fascinating on a lot of levels because as you mentioned, sometimes you see terrorism and it has a really specific target - and kind of the purpose of it can - you see it. With this, it's almost just chaos. It's almost just like the unraveling of society around us. I think you're right - the sole purpose of it is to inflict just damage, just widespread damage and it's almost - it's not specific, it's just trying to disrupt and harm people and create havoc and chaos for - from a small, small minority of people - assuming what we have is accurate with the ties that - again, feel desperate and are led to do desperate things. So yeah, the year 2022 - the year we had to start guarding our electric grids. [00:55:17] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. [00:55:18] Matt Driscoll: If you had that on your bingo card, I guess, you win. [00:55:22] Crystal Fincher: I hope we don't have it on the 2023 bingo card - I will tell you that much - I would love to nip this in the bud and get real clear that this is unacceptable everywhere. And with that, we thank you for listening to Hacks & Wonks on this Friday, December 9th, 2022. Hacks & Wonks is co-produced by Shannon Cheng and Bryce Cannatelli. Our insightful co-host today is metro news columnist and opinion editor for The News Tribune in Tacoma, Matt Driscoll. You can find Matt on Twitter at @mattsdriscoll - that's two L's at the end. You can follow Hacks & Wonks on Twitter at @HacksWonks, and you can find me at @finchfrii, with two I's at the end. You can catch Hacks & Wonks on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever else you get your podcasts - just type "Hacks and Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to get the full versions of our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the episode notes. Thanks for tuning in - talk to you next time.

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