Podcasts about victor mair

A special interview with Dr. Ross Bender, who recently finished his translation of the Shoku Nihongi, including a capstone work on the court of the 8th century.  We cover his work, from his training with some of the greatest names in Japanese historical circles to his dissertation on the Hachiman cult and the Dokyo Incident, and then to his most recent work publishing translations of the various senmyo, the edicts, as well as the entirety of the Shoku Nihongi.  Throughout the discussion we touch on many different  topics, and for notes on everything, please check out our blogpost page:  https://sengokudaimyo.com/podcast/bender-interview   Rough Transcript: JOSHUA: Welcome to Sengoku Daimyō's Chronicles of Japan. My name is Joshua, and this is a special episode I'd like to share with you an interview I had with Doctor Ross Bender, translator of the shogunate. Now, some of you may know Doctor Bender from his work translating the Shoku Nihongi, the official history of the Japanese court compiled in 797 and covering from the end of the Nihon Shoki in 697 through the entirety of the Fujiwara capital and Nara periods ending at the 10th year of the reign of Kanmu Tennō in 791. Not only has he translated the historical chronicles, but he has a series of books on the senmyō, the edicts, as well as more about that period, including institutional life more generally. And we cannot forget the paper that started at all, the Hachiman cult and the Dōkyō incident. We'll have links to all of this and more over on the episode blog post page. Now, in this interview, we cover the Shoku Nihongi and Dr. Bender's academic journey. Throughout that journey, he has had the chance to converse and study with some of the big names in Japanese historical circles, such as Donald Keene, Alexander Vovin, G. Cameron "Cappy" Hurst, and more. It was absolutely a pleasure to be able to talk with him about his career, his work, and about the Shoku Nihongi and this period more generally, and I really hope you all enjoy it as much as I did. So without further ado, I give you Sengoku Daimyo's interview of Dr. Ross Bender.    Dr. Bender, thank you very much for joining me for this. Dr. Bender has done some absolutely wonderful work, in particular with translating the Shoku Nihongi, which is going to be very key to some of the stuff we're going to be looking at here in the coming years. I want to thank you, first of all, for all of your efforts and welcome you to Sengoku Daimyo's Podcast, here; our little Chronicles of Japan.    DR. ROSS BENDER: Thank you. Happy to be here.    J: So your translation of the Shoku Nihongi: how did you come about deciding to do that? What was it that pulled you into the translation?    R: Well, it's a long story, but it does go back to my time in graduate school at Columbia in the 70s. In 1974, I finished my Master's thesis, which was "The Hachiman Cult and the Dōkyō Incident". I started grad school in 1971, and after a lot of intensive language training, became interested in Hachiman because, as you know, the common definition was that Hachiman was the Shinto god of war. Of course, at the time, the Vietnam War was raging. And so I became interested in, you know, what was this theology of a war God. And so I became rather obsessed with Hachiman, and, two things: In 74, I was in a seminar with Donald Keene on the Noh theater, and I found a play--a Hachiman play--called "Yumi Yawata". And I translated that and became interested in the way that Hachiman was portrayed in this Noh play. And then at the same time, I became interested in the Dōkyō incident and the Hachiman Oracle. So that was really my first encounter with Shoku Nihongi.    Two things I suppose really struck me. The first was that although the text is in classical Chinese or literary Sinitic, the senmyō and a few of the- there are a few poems are in the old Japanese script inscribed in Shoku Nihongi.    J: And the "senmyō": They are specifically the edicts.    R: They are the imperial edicts that are recorded in old Japanese.   And Motoori Norinaga, in the 18th century did an intensive study and interpretation, really, of them. And he came up with a canonical number of 62. There are some quibbles with that number, but that's the number. And so at the same time, I was discovering that some of the pioneers in the field had done work on these. So, for example, George Sansom in the 1920s had started to translate the senmyō, and he had also done work on the ritsuryo. And then in the 30s, JB Snellen had begun translation of the Shoku Nihongi, and he completed the years 697 to 715. So the reigns of Monmu and Genmei and-    J: I remember actually going through that translation. I think at one point I found it and was so enamored of like, oh, we have some of this, but then it then it stops.   R: Then it stops. And so both Sansom and Snellen are published in the Transactions of the Asiatic Society of Japan. And as I say, these were real pioneers, you know, digging into this stuff. And it was amusing because Snellen prefaced his work by saying that Shoku Nihongi is "dry as dust". And he further said that translating it was like "intellectual coolie labor". But his translation, you know, is still very useful and extraordinarily well documented, footnoted. And of course, I was able to use that, although it needed updating.    J: You mentioned that you had language training before going into this.    R: Well, I started at Columbia in fall of 71 with no Japanese at all. I had visited Japan and as a teenager in 67, but no language training. So they gave me an intensive full year of language study. So you had first year, second year, and third year all in the first calendar year. And then in the second year of study you started Bungo and further modern Japanese. And I have to say that I was very fortunate to be at Columbia at a time when some of the giants and pioneers of the field were there. So Ivan Morris had the first class in classical Japanese, and we did bits of Hōjōki and Heike Monogatari. And he told us that when we eventually went to Japan, we might find ourselves at a cocktail party, and we could be sure to amaze the hosts. And so he had us memorize the opening lines of both of those.    J: That's fascinating. So, so all about the Gion bells, and-    R: Yes. "Gion shōja no kane no koe...", and "Yuku kawa no nagare wa..." So I actually- I think there was one time I was at a party with, oddly enough, bunch of pediatricians from Kobe Children's Hospital, and I tried them out and with Hōjōki, and they couldn't get it. They said, oh, is that Hyakunin Isshu?    J: [laughing] R: So I was kind of pleased about that. But then everybody knew the "Heike".    J: Right.    R: Yeah. So actually my first class in ancient Japanese history was with Morris. He tragically died in 1976, so he had the Bungo introduction in the fall. And then Donald Keene came back from Japan and did it in the spring. And so he introduced us to a Noh play and "Oku no Hosomichi" and Shinkokinshu, I think. So the language training was just excellent. And then in the third year, Doctor Hakeda did Shingon Buddhism and classical Chinese and so forth. So yes, there was a lot of front-loading and intensive language study, but it was very pleasurable.   J: As you're studying about Dōkyō and the Dōkyō Incident and Hachiman, that then allowed you to access these sources and the senmyō, and all of that, correct?   R: Right. That was my first introduction to them. Both the "Yumi Yawata" and the "Hachiman and the Dōkyō Incident" were published in the late 70s in Monumenta Nipponica, and then in 1980, I finished my dissertation, which was the political meaning of the Hachiman cult in ancient and early medieval Japan.    J: I came across that as I was going through Ōjin Tennō's period. R: Yes, it was sort of a simplistic construction, but what I did basically was to posit three stages of the Hachiman cult. The first at Usa, which was the oracular stage, the second at Iwashimizu, which was where the Ōjin Tennō connection developed, and also the Hachiman Daibosatsu connection. And then the third stage, you know, identified with Tsurugaoka in Kamakura, which was the Minamoto- Where the martial aspect--the god of war--really developed.    J: And that is fascinating because, you know, you go to Hachiman shrines today and that's probably where people's minds will first go. But it is such a fascinating religious exercise of like Shinto, but also kind of Buddhist and kind of continental.    R: Yes. And I don't know what the statistics are today, but at least I think 35 or 40% of Shinto shrines have some connection with Hachiman. So it's yeah, it's a fascinating study all by itself.   J: So as you were doing this, you come across the Shoku Nihongi. Can you talk a little bit about where the Shoku Nihongi falls in all of this?    R: Yes. Well, the notable thing about both Nihongi and Kojiki is that they begin with the Age of the Gods, so that the first sections, the Shinwa, are the mythologies. Nihongi probably becomes historically accurate sometime in the late, I don't know, it's late six hundreds, but for the seven hundreds it's probably pretty much historically accurate. And of course, you know that John Bentley just recently did the first English translation since I think 1898 was going to ask, so that was long overdue. And that's a very useful publication. J: It's interesting to see the differences in some of the things he updates and the different take he has on it in terms of how to do some of the translating.    R: Yes. And he is a historical linguist. And so he has a very valuable exegesis and commentary. And then, of course, Matthieu Felt just published the first volume of his translation. It was Oxford Press. That just came out a few months ago. That's also a useful document. He actually has the text of the Nihon Shoki along with the translation. And so that's very useful. And I'm not sure when he's going to be publishing the second half, but that's something to watch for.    So the first one started with The Age of the gods. Now, Shoku Nihongi is the second of the Rikkokushi, or 'Six National Histories', and it, unlike the first two, is judged to be a very accurate historical chronicle. And it, of course, was presented to the Court of Kanmu in two recensions, 794 and 797, and takes the story up to 791, which I think was the 10th year of Kanmu's reign. That's where it fits. And then, of course, you have the rest of the Rikkokushi. The next one is Nihon Kōki, which I'm just starting to get into now. Then Shoku Nihon Kōki, Nihon Montoku Tennō Jitsuroku, and then Nihon Sandai Jitsuroku. So they take the story up to 887, and they become increasingly detailed, and the language becomes more intricate as time goes on. But that's where Shoku Nihongi sits in terms of the six national histories, and they're all court chronicles, compiled by court scholars and ordered by the emperors. And of course, the point of view is that of the central court.    J: Right. You're not getting Kyūshū's take on things.    R: No. Although, you know, Kyūshū is a fascinating place. A lot happens there. So of course you have the Dazaifu, the Kyūshū government headquarters, which is an important outpost, almost a mini capital by itself. J: The first several dazai sōchi, I think, all become Daijin. Like Sadaijin, Udaijin. They kind of come back and do that if they don't pass away in the meantime.    R: Yeah, it's an important post. People take that position and come back. But also what's interesting is that the Hayato people of southern Kyūshū begin to appear in the chronicles, and in the early years, there are some major Hayato rebellions, and that's a story all by itself. Those rebellions are, for the most part, put down. And then there's some sort of accommodation because Hayato people show up at court almost as envoys from, you know, the barbarian realm, and then some of them become guards. So they are assimilated more or less early on. And then, of course, there's the whole question of the Hayato and the Emishi and where did they come from? There are some theories that when the Yayoi people came in they mixed with the Jōmon people and assimilated. But some theories that the Hayato in the far southwest and the Emishi in the northeast were remnants of the old Jōmon. So that's, you know, it's a possibility, but it's certainly interesting. And unlike the Hayato, the Emishi, as you know, were constant problem for the Nara court. And all through Shoku Nihongi, but particularly from about oh 780 on, there were more and more intense periods of warfare. And these are described in great detail in Shoku Nihongi. Karl Friday and Wayne Farris back in the 90s, both did books on. I think Farris was the "Heavenly Warriors: History of the Samurai". And then Karl Friday also did a book on the samurai, but they paid a lot of attention to these Emishi wars, so that's well documented in English. J: Getting back to the Shoku Nihongi, which includes all of this, really, what were some of the biggest challenges you found?    R: Well, part of the story is that after I finished my dissertation, I went off and did a variety of things, this and that, and finally wound up at University of Pennsylvania teaching in the English Language Programs, which was the program to teach English to foreign students. At that time the majority of the students when I started were from Japan. So I actually ran a program for the Monbushō, and they would send over Japanese high school teachers of English for a summer session, and we would give them language classes, but also pedagogical training, how to teach English. And so that was my connection with Japan during that period. And so I really was away from my original interest until the early 2000s. I took early retirement and I visited my old advisor, Paul Varley. He had, of course, taught at Columbia, but then he had retired and moved to University of Hawaii. I visited him, he introduced me to Wayne Farris, who was also there at the time, and they both encouraged me to get back, get back to work. So that was sort of the impetus. I have to give them credit for that. So I found myself in Kobe for several months in 2006, and that was when I decided I was interested in the senmyō. So my first thought, my first ambition was to translate the senmyō. As you know, in the late 80s and 90s, the immense five volume Iwanami collated and critical edition had come out, the one edited by Aoki Kazuo and his team. That was still a magnificent piece of work, you know, with I'm sure you've seen it with all of the head notes and footnotes, and on one page there's the kanbun and on on the facing page is the yomi-kudashi, and, you know, more than you could ever hope to know. But also at that time there were three modern Japanese translations, so that was very useful. It was a good time to be starting into this, so I went to a secondhand bookstore in Kobe and got myself the books, and that started, I guess, what's turned out to be a 20 year project.    J: 2006 to 2026.   R: Right.    J: And it looks like you're doing most of this through self-publishing. Is that correct?    R: Yes. I discovered early on that what's now called Kindle Direct--it used to be called Create Space--through Amazon was a very useful piece of software. In fact, I first published several volumes of poetry in 2012, and that was my introduction to using this platform. And I've been very pleased with it, because I don't have to wait years and years to try to find an academic publisher. And actually they pay royalties through Amazon, so... J: That's not bad.    R: Yeah, that's worked out well for me. So I never had a chance to have an academic position teaching Japanese studies. Although when I was at Penn, my friend Cappy Hurst--Cameron Hurst--was the chairman of the department and he had been a student also of Varley's at Columbia, although before my time. And he invited me to give some lectures in his class on Japanese history. So another thing was that my classical Chinese needed an upgrade. Fortunately, at Penn, Victor Mair was teaching a year long course in classical Chinese, and so I sat through that and he was extremely, extremely helpful. Then one other thing was that I also got to know Alexander Vovin, who at the time was at Hawaii, and he, of course, is *the*- was *the* authority on old Japanese. And, you know, his Man'yōshu translations and, and commentary are just really helpful. So he gave me some good advice. So I had good teachers all the way through. And, you know, I'm always very grateful for that.    J: You mentioned classical Chinese. I'm curious how much of it is a standard classical Chinese, or is it kind of their own thing in the archipelago? I'm curious what the language is like in the Shoku Nihongi.    R: Okay, so of course, at that time, the eighth century was sort of the apogee of the Tang dynasty, and at least from what Victor Mair told me. And he was very helpful in beginning this translation. And he would look at some of my stuff. And according to him, it was pretty much like the Tang dynasty Chinese. I think that's called Early- I forget- Early Middle Chinese. So at least for the eighth century, that seemed to be the case. And, you know, you have records in the Shoku Nihongi of teachers who come from the mainland and lecture and teach the correct pronunciation and how to read. And then, of course, with the Buddhist monks, they're using the Chinese translations of some of the Sanskrit, and they have their own techniques for reading. So, yeah, the eighth century is a really dynamic time because the Japanese, at least at the elite level, are and with the help of the Koreans and that should be emphasized after the fall of Paekche there were a large number of refugees and high ranking aristocrats who came to Japan and helped them to learn to read and write Chinese. And then, of course, the Japanese started sending students to China and, you know, staying there for ten, twenty years. So, yeah, it was a very dynamic time. And then, of course, they were learning how to use Chinese characters to express old Japanese. And that's another story in itself, using the characters as semantograms, but also as phonograms. That's one of the things I found really fascinating about old Japanese, about the senmyō. J: And how does that compare to- I think we usually just refer to "Man'yōgana" as any of that. Is it very similar to what's going on in the Man'yōshu, or is once again, is there something else going on with the senmyō?    R: The standard edition of the senmyō I think notes that there are about 250 some--if I've got the number right--of phonograms used in the senmyō. There is a huge number used in the Man'yōshu; much greater. In fact, I think Vovin once said that it's not really known that you can't count. Although Bentley has a very excellent book, I think it's called an ABC Dictionary of Phonograms, like that. He has really scoured the landscape. So- But you could say that the phonograms in the senmyō are Man'yōgana, but that the set of Man'yōgana is far, far greater. J: Only 250 phonograms to have to worry about, as opposed to going through the Man'yōshu and seeing every once in a while a character and going, which pronunciation or what are they trying to represent here?    R: Yeah, yeah. So I mean, Man'yō studies, you know, or a whole realm in themselves and some of the, the emperors--I'm thinking of Genmei especially, or is it Gensho? I think it's Gensho. She has three poems in the Shoku NIhongi and they may be included in Man'yōshu. So there's some crossover. I was going to say that, of course, once you start reading these phonograms, you begin to see where the kana systems developed from, from Man'yōgana.    J: Right. So I think I've read that in Old Japonic, we think that there were more or at least different sounds than maybe we have today. R: Yes.    J: And so you see it represented in different ways. You'll see the same--what we would think of as the same character--represented differently, because to them it was different.    R: Yes. So there's still, as far as I know, no absolute standard for representing old Japanese. You'll see different scholars have their own takes on it, and Vovin, in his Man'yōshu translations, has his own very intricate system. Another good place to look that's freely available. The Oxford, I think it's called the Oxford Ninjal Corpus of Old Japanese Texts, is an ongoing project. It's actually been ongoing for many years, but you can go there. They have laid out all of the Man'yōshu poems with their  romanization system. I suspect that, you know, that's very prestigious and will eventually become a standard. But that's where you find all these things. Like is it "Himiko" or "Pimiko"?    J: Do you say "Kapa", "Kaha", or "Kawa"?    R: Yes. There you go.   J: [Laughter]    R: Right. Yeah.    J: I'm constantly wondering that myself.    R: Yeah. So you'll see different scholars have different ways of approaching it. But my opinion is that the Oxford, which is a very long standing and slow running project, will probably produce the standard.   J: In doing this translation, were there any favorite moments or items of particular interest that you found? R: So yes, actually my first go at the senmyō were the edicts of the lady we call Koken/Shotoku. Actually, I think almost half of the senmyō were produced during her reign. And so that was where I started. I think the first article I got around to writing in 2009 was for the journal Oral Tradition, and it was called Performative Loci of the Shoku Nihoingi Edict 749 to 770. And also because of my interest in Dōkyō my interest in her went way back. So 2015 I did the edicts. I called it the Edicts of the Last Empress, and it was a translation of all of the edicts from her reign. That year and the next year I did the four volumes I called them, Nara Japan 749 to 757, 758 to 763. So that period was, yeah, my first period of interest. And of course it went back to the Hachiman cult and the Dōkyō incident. I mean, you know, the stories about this wild empress I saw I saw an article that's just come out. I think it's a compilation of Women in Japanese Buddhism. And the title of the article by Emily Simpson is "The Depraved Empress". So that was one of the things that, early on, I decided was not accurate. That's a whole rabbit hole by itself. But according to Shoku Nihongi, there's no evidence, you know, of any illicit goings on between the two. But in Nihon Ryoiki, which appears in the early Heian period, not much later, you find the first really scurrilous story that about Dōkyō and the Empress. And then, as if you look at, for example, Donald Keene's "Seeds in the Heart," he has a long excerpt from a medieval tale. I forget which one that, you know, really rings the changes. And what fascinated me was that in there was a Playboy fable- I forget they were called. Some sort of fabulous stories. This one was done anonymously, but it was a very scurrilous, licentious story about Dōkyō and the Empress, and done anonymously. But it was later found to have been Bill LaFleur--William LaFleur--who taught at Penn and passed away unfortunately, some years ago.    J: So then in the Shoku Nihongi, it's just straight up politics, right? Just about Dōkyō's rise. And then it's just the political conflict going on rather than anything else?   R: Right. And it's a very intense period of political- So of course, the story was that when she was at the Hora capital, which was up near Otsu, it was a brief capital, and she was there and she was ill, and Dōkyō apparently at that time attended her as a physician. And that was the beginning of their relationship. So this would have been 760 or so. But the only phrase is that Dōkyō received the favor of the Empress, but it doesn't have a sexual connotation. It's used in other political settings also.    J: Yeah, I have to wonder how much they weren't looking back at Wu in the Chinese, which of course she also gets excoriated for stuff that is questionable. How much worse was it than anything that any of the men did? But she was a woman doing it.   R: Yes. Well, that's what happens to female rulers. You know, you have Catherine the Great in Russia. So. Yes. So that was initially my what really excited me. It was that period. And then I finished the "Edicts" translation. This was 2012. Bryan Lowe, who's a good friend at Princeton, he was finishing his doctorate and he had a workshop on Shosoin documents, and he invited Dr. Sakaehara Towao to present at the workshop. And he had been Bryan's advisor in Japan. So I was able to meet him and then talk to him and said, you know, I think I'd like to translate Shoku Nihongi. And he basically said, go for it. But I met him later that fall in Nara. He was at the Todaiji Museum, and so he encouraged me. A lot of people gave encouragement along the way. Yeah. So 20 years later, actually, I finished the translation 2025. And then this year in the spring, I did what I- is sort of considered the capstone, the volume: "The Japanese Imperial Institution in the Eighth Century." That's available as an e-book and also paperback and hardcover. And so there I have about a 75 page overview of the eighth century and then the introductions, not the translations, but the introductions to each of the emperors throughout the period. I'm very happy with that. And that sort of puts a cap on it. I should mention that that was in memory of Herschel Webb, another one of my great teachers at Columbia. He had done a book way back in 68 called "The Japanese Imperial Institution in the Tokugawa Era". And so this is sort of an homage to his memory.   J: And we very much thank you for it.  I remember when that came out, and we definitely snapped it up as soon as we saw it.    R: Well, great.    J: [Laughter]   R: Yeah. And you know, it's all available on Amazon. So let me let me make my plug.    J: Absolutely. Absolutely. You mentioned something about the Nihon Kōki. Are you are you serious about taking this project on and moving forward, or is that just kind of something you're toying with? R: Well, no, I'm actually I've actually made a start. That's an immense document. And what I'm interested in is finishing the reign of Emperor Kanmu. He dies in 806. And so Nihon Kōki begins in 792, and I'm currently up to 799. But I'm not putting as much energy into it. I do maybe an hour a day if I feel like it, but it's slow going. But there's some really fascinating stuff. So Wake no Kiyomaro died in 799, and they've inserted this immensely long biography of his life at this point, although it was obviously produced later and it's set apart. But that has details of his miraculous trip to the Usa shrine. And, you know, it's not clear if somebody cut his tendons, but he was lame and so he was on his way to Kyūshū, and suddenly a pack of wild boars appeared and sort of escorted him down to the shrine. It is just a really wonderful story. Then he has a vision of Hachiman, which is not part of the Shoku Nihongi tale. Yeah, I'm trucking along. My ambition is at least to finish the reign of Emperor Kanmu, and then we'll see what time there is beyond that.    J: So do you have any recommendations for current students of Japanese history? Those coming up? R: Actually, there are some young scholars. I was at the Association for Asian Studies meeting in Columbus, Ohio, which was, I guess, yeah, 2025. And for some reason there were a good number of presentations on eighth and ninth century. So there's a scholar by the name of Nadia Kanagawa. She finished a dissertation at USC on immigrants in the eighth century. Then Abigail McBain finished up at Columbia, and her dissertation was on specifically Tang Buddhist monks and interchange with Japan. Yeah, so there are some young scholars who are digging in to this. You know, I was just looking the other day at Wikipedia, which is a good start for anyone. I would say, you know, take it with a grain of salt. But if you want to know the names of the, you know, the famous emperors and the rebels, you know, Tachibana no Naramaro, and Fujiwara no Nakamaro. And just, just the other day I found this amazing thing called 'Grokipedia', which apparently is a new. But it's one of those AI things. Yeah, but it had the best summary of the Shoku Nihongi that I've seen. So with the AI revolution, goodness knows what's going to happen. But yeah, I find that it's possible to dip in and a lot of things are available. For example, the Rikkokushi text is online, it's been online, and it was first published by Asahi Shimbun way back when. But I used that and then that the Oxford project that I mentioned is online -- more and more it's becoming possible to access, you know, original documents. J: Yeah, combination of making them available online, better online translations.    R: Machine translation is going great guns. Yeah-   J: Yeah. Although I have to admit, it can get you a sense of what the classical Chinese is kind of saying sometimes, but the translation for some of the old stuff just it still has some work to do. I think it's better if you can translate the at least the modern Japanese translation, rather than sometimes going back into this. It's still tricky.    R: Yeah, well, it's I admit I'm getting old, but this this stuff is getting kind of frightening. This machine translation...   J: It is, yeah.    R: I feel like I'd be out of the job if I had a job.    J: Well, I think there's still a lot of questions to be asked on that. I don't think we need to get into a whole thing on AI right now, but I think there's some great benefits, obviously. And then, you know, I definitely know there's some concerns too, because every once in a while it can just hallucinate an answer. And you might be going through things that seem absolutely wonderful and then find something that you're like, wait a minute, I never knew that. [laughter]     R: And then it turns out not to be true.    J: Yeah, I don't know if you heard there was one, and I mean, this was a year ago, which already seems, in AI terms, ages and ages, but apparently it hallucinated entire papers and authors.    R: Yes, that's there was I don't know if you follow the PMJS list.    J: Oh yeah.    R: But I think there was a discussion and an example of that. So it's-  J. But the world is going to be different. J: Things are changing. And I think we will figure out how to use the tools that are useful will hopefully win out. And there's always going to be certain things. For instance, I remember early days, Wikipedia and still, you know, looking at Wikipedia sometimes for certain things around more popular subjects got to be a little more wary, though I have found the Japanese Wikipedia has been great when you're just trying to look for something and go, let me at least get what a common sense of this is so that I know the other things to go research. R: Well, I was going to say, just to sort of sum up, yeah, we're in a very dynamic time, but the eighth century was very similar because the new technologies were pouring in from the continent and the peninsula, and people were learning these new methods of reading and writing and orality to literacy.    J: So any last thoughts? I do appreciate all your time. But any last thoughts as we finish up here?    R: Not really, but I noticed that yesterday you came up with a long spiel on the UNESCO World Heritage site, and that's exciting. The Asuka region you seem to have links to photographs that took me back to wandering around that area. The Ishibutai, I remember, was something. So party on and keep up the good work. J: Thank you very much and thank you again. Thank you for your time today, and thank you for all the work that you've put into this. You have made these sources so much more accessible for people in English, and I think that is going to be critical as we move forward. I know for me this is a huge help. I was looking at Shoku Nihongi going, okay, I know we've got like the first so many years so I can get through that and then I'm really going to have to up my game. Then I saw all the work that you'd been doing and it was like a big load felt lifted off of my back. Now I can, you know, take a look. But at least with the idea that someone more experience than I has already done some of the really hard labor. I really want to say thank you for all of that.    R: Yeah, you're very welcome.    J: And once again, I would like to say thank you to Doctor Bender and thank all of you for listening. If you think that this is something you would like to see more of, please let us know. We'll see what we can do. Perhaps we can make it the start of a new interview series. In the meantime, next episodes we get back to our regularly scheduled program. And as always, if you like what we are doing, please tell your friends and feel free to rate us wherever you listen to podcasts. If you feel the need to do more and want to help us keep this thing going, we do have information about how you can donate on Patreon, where we have early and add free episodes for you to listen to. You can also donate through our Ko-Fi or BuyMeACoffee Sites. Just look up SengokuDaimyo for all of that. You can also find the links over to our main website, SengokuDaimyo.com, where we will also have more discussion on topics from this episode. Finally, feel free to reach out to our Sengoku Daimyo Facebook page. You can also email us at the.Sengoku.Daimyo@gmail.com. Thank you also to Ellen for their work editing the podcast. And that's all for now. Thank you again and I'll see you next episode on Sengoku Daimyo's Chronicles of Japan

Episode 2 : « La Chine essaie de réécrire l'histoire » Par deux fois, les autorités chinoises ont empêché le Pr Victor Mair, sinologue, de sortir du pays des échantillons des momies du Xinjiang pour les étudier. Lorsqu'il y retourne, il se rend compte qu'elles ont été déplacées vers d'autres sites archéologiques, séparées, certaines décapitées... Les résultats de ses recherches font cependant le tour du monde : un peuple d'origine européenne a occupé le Xinjiang, avant les Ouïghours. A partir de 2014, Pékin met en place un programme d'assimilation forcée, ciblant les 11 millions de Ouïghours. Victor Mair n'y retournera pas. Il témoigne pour que l'histoire mondiale n'efface pas les origines du peuple ouïghour. Interview : Romain Franklin et François Reinhardt (pour Yuzu Productions) Traduction et doublage : Xavier Combes Réalisation : François-Charles Domergue Production : Isabelle Duriez Une production wave.audio pour la revue XXI Le film Chine : le drame ouïghour, produit par Yuzu Productions, est disponible sur Arte.tv La bande dessinée Des momies trop bavardes de Romain Franklin et Jörg Mailliet est à lire dans la revue XXI n°61.

Épisode 1 : « Cette momie ressemblait à mon frère » En 2022, les journalistes Romain Franklin et François Reinhardt préparent un documentaire intitulé Chine : le drame ouïghour. Ils ont entendu parler de momies blondes, découvertes dans le Xinjiang, la région où la Chine persécute 11 millions de Ouïghours. Ces momies, vieilles de 3000 à 4000 ans, indiquent que des populations ont occupé cette région, bien avant l'arrivée des Hans. Les deux journalistes rencontrent le sinologue américain Victor Mair qui a étudié ces momies. Pour la première fois, le chercheur raconte comment les momies ont été manipulées par le gouvernement central. Pour réécrire l'histoire. Interview : Romain Franklin et François Reinhardt (pour Yuzu Productions) Traduction et doublage : Xavier Combes Réalisation : François-Charles Domergue Production : Isabelle Duriez Une production wave.audio pour la revue XXI Le film Chine : le drame ouïghour, produit par Yuzu Productions, est disponible sur Arte.tv La bande dessinée Des momies trop bavardes est à lire dans la revue XXI n°61.

This week we dig into the first 7 chapters of the classic proto-Daoist text, the Zhuangzi, named for Master Zhuang, or Zhuang Zhou. We worked primarily from Brook Ziporyn's excellent translation. Some other texts mentioned, and also worth reading are listed below, linked to their publisher's sites. Buy them! But not from Amazon. Victor Mair's Wandering on the WayVictor Mair, ed, Experimental Essays on ZhuangziLivia Kohn's Zhuangzi Text and ContextGeling Shang's Liberation as Affirmation - the Religiosity of Zhuangzi and Nietzsche

Wherein we discuss how linguistics is everywhere but linguists are nowhere, and introduce the concept of the unsolicited etymology swear jar. Jump right to: 01:33 “Universal” word lists, bad puns, and university “field work” stories 07:25 What composes an accent? What counts as a dialect? What about “little kid speak”? 24:16 What are the most valuable ways linguistics can improve society? 45:45 Favorite ridiculous etymologies 54:31 The puzzler: What do the words JOB, POLISH, and HERB have in common? Covered in this episode: We love Car Talk Dialects and accents often overlap but are not the same thing Dialects and registers also often overlap but are not the same thing Obligatory “A language is just a dialect with an army and a navy.” Linguistics After Dark has no official positions on contentious geopolitical issues Understanding the value of descriptivism and the reality of language evolution Hot takes on regional identity in the UK vs North America vs California Why don't journalists know that linguists exist? A story that has nothing to do with financial advising, and everything to do with geese OK is the only acronym etymology that's all correct Links and other post-show thoughts: Swadesh's first name was Morris Mutual intelligibility on the Deutsch/Dutch border More mutual intelligibility, including Scandinavia, from an A++ YouTube channel Victor Mair, coiner of the word topolect All sorts of ways linguists and linguistics benefit society BBC and Received Pronunciation Here are some diagrams about the overlap between linguistics and other fields (this last one is the one Sarah had in mind) The Unsolicited Etymology Trivia Jar Etymologies of canary, easel, and lettuce The full story of what the fuck, geese (spoiler alert: 356≠390) And yes, ⟨mint⟩ (where money is printed) is also related to ⟨moneta⟩ Etymologies of island, isle, OK, and lox (which has a dialectical variation still spelled "lax"!) Ask us questions: Send your questions (text or voice memo) to questions@linguisticsafterdark.com, or find us as @lxadpodcast on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook. Credits: Linguistics After Dark is produced by Emfozzing Enterprises. Eli edits, Jenny transcribes, and Sarah does show notes. Our music is “Covert Affair” by Kevin MacLeod. Thanks for listening!

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania

This week on "A Way with Words":  What's so special about the phrase Sit on a pan, Otis!? It's an example of a palindrome -- a word or phrase that's spelled the same backwards as it is forwards. This year's contest known as the Oscars of the palindrome world inspires some clever, even poetic, surprises. Plus, tips for raising a child to be bilingual.  And what was the search engine Google called BEFORE it was called Google? Also, spelunking slang, hissy fits, language vs. dialect, persons vs. people, French folds, phthalates, and I don't care if it harelips the governor! FULL DETAILSA palindrome is a word or phrase that reads the same both backwards and forwards, like the title of the book Go Hang a Salami! I'm a Lasagna Hog! The SymmyS Awards, bestowed by The Palindromist Magazine are the Oscars of the palindrome world. Recent winners included one called "Espresso Rescue": Had a tonic? Cuppa cappuccino, ta-dah!Bilingual schools can be great for helping children become bilingual, but the best way to fully get there is through complete immersion over a long period of time.Hissy fits, or frivolous tantrums often associated with girls, particularly in the Southern United States, probably derive from the word hysterical. An Alabama caller started thinking about the origin of this word after learning of the opening of a nearby store called Hissy Fit Boutique.Word-unit palindromes are palindromes where all the words read the same back and forth, like this SymmyS winner, titled "Cold Feet at the Altar": Say I do? What do I do? What do I say?!Our Quiz Guy John Chaneski serenades us with a game of rewritten lyrics for Disney's Frozen.Before the search engine Google, there was the word googol. As mathematician Edward Kasner recounts in his book Mathematics and the Imagination, he asked his 9-year-old nephew Milton to coin a word for a huge number, specifically 10 to the 100th power, and that's what the youngster came up with. A googly, on the other hand, is a type of bowl in cricket.What's the difference between your boss and your therapist? Aili Jokela's word-unit palindrome has the answer.Which is correct: several persons or several people? The word persons tends to be used in corporate, legalese contexts, and people is the more natural term.A Hollywood entrance, in spelunker slang, is when a cave has a large, epic opening. Burkard Bilger's epic article in The New Yorker on the world of squeeze freaks and other extreme cavers contains lots of great caving slang.In an earlier episode, we talked about whether it's condescending to say you're proud of someone, and the majority of you who responded agreed that it's best to say something that doesn't make it about you.The difference between Mandarin and Cantonese points to a general difference between languages and dialects: languages tend to have a whole different nationalism or geopolitical power associated with them. For more about Mandarin and Cantonese in particular, check out the work of linguist Victor Mair on Language Log.Take a sheet of paper. Fold it in half. Then fold it in half again. That's called a French fold. Phthalate, a compound in chemistry, got us thinking about other words with ph and th right next to each other. Another winning palindrome from the SymmyS: You swallow pills for anxious days and nights. And days, anxious for pills, swallow you.I don't care if it harelips the queen means "come hell or high water," or "regardless of the consequences." The phrase is particularly popular in Texas, as are such variants as harelips the governor, harelips the president, harelips every cow in Texas, harelips the Pope, harelips the nation, and harelips all the cats in Grimes County, among many others. Harelip refers to the congenital deformity known as a cleft palate, which resembles the mouth of a rabbit, and is sometimes considered offensive. This episode was hosted by Martha Barnette and Grant Barrett.--A Way with Words is funded by its listeners: http://waywordradio.org/donateGet your language question answered on the air! Call or write with your questions at any time:Email: words@waywordradio.orgPhone: United States and Canada toll-free (877) WAY-WORD/(877) 929-9673London +44 20 7193 2113Mexico City +52 55 8421 9771Donate: http://waywordradio.org/donateSite: http://waywordradio.org/Podcast: http://waywordradio.org/podcast/Forums: http://waywordradio.org/discussion/Newsletter: http://waywordradio.org/newsletter/Twitter: http://twitter.com/wayword/Skype: skype://waywordradio Copyright 2015, Wayword LLC.

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that it was Buddhist theories about reality that allowed fiction to flourish in China, and ending with Stephen R. Bokenkamp’s study of celestial scripts that Daoists created in response to the appearance of Sanskrit script in China, the volume focuses primarily on the fourth to tenth centuries but addresses dynamics that were at play both before and after this six-century period. While many previous studies that address the impact of India on China do so by focusing on the Chinese transformation of Buddhism and on the degree to which Chinese Buddhism retained this or that Indian feature, this volume differs in that it looks at the influence of Indian thought (particularly religious thought and myths) beyond the confines of Buddhism proper. Meir Shahar and Bernard Faure’s respective contributions are good examples of this, as they demonstrate that some of the Indian deities and demons who came to China with Tantric Buddhism exchanged their Buddhist robes for Daoist ones, or escaped into the wider world of Chinese religious thought and practice.  Another central theme of the book is the way in which Chinese turned to Indian models for religious and political ends, or, in other cases, attempted to recreate India within China. In addition to the aforementioned scholars, the volume contains chapters by Yamabe Nobuyoshi, Ye Derong, the late John R. McRae, Robert H. Sharf, and Christine Mollier.  This book will be of particular interest to those wanting to learn more about Indian myth in East Asia, the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and symbols, the interaction between Daoism and Buddhism, the adapting of Buddhist monasticism to Chinese familial organization, Bodhidharma, the influence of Buddhism on Chinese literature, and the Chinese response to Buddhist doctrinal dilemmas. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that it was Buddhist theories about reality that allowed fiction to flourish in China, and ending with Stephen R. Bokenkamp’s study of celestial scripts that Daoists created in response to the appearance of Sanskrit script in China, the volume focuses primarily on the fourth to tenth centuries but addresses dynamics that were at play both before and after this six-century period. While many previous studies that address the impact of India on China do so by focusing on the Chinese transformation of Buddhism and on the degree to which Chinese Buddhism retained this or that Indian feature, this volume differs in that it looks at the influence of Indian thought (particularly religious thought and myths) beyond the confines of Buddhism proper. Meir Shahar and Bernard Faure’s respective contributions are good examples of this, as they demonstrate that some of the Indian deities and demons who came to China with Tantric Buddhism exchanged their Buddhist robes for Daoist ones, or escaped into the wider world of Chinese religious thought and practice.  Another central theme of the book is the way in which Chinese turned to Indian models for religious and political ends, or, in other cases, attempted to recreate India within China. In addition to the aforementioned scholars, the volume contains chapters by Yamabe Nobuyoshi, Ye Derong, the late John R. McRae, Robert H. Sharf, and Christine Mollier.  This book will be of particular interest to those wanting to learn more about Indian myth in East Asia, the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and symbols, the interaction between Daoism and Buddhism, the adapting of Buddhist monasticism to Chinese familial organization, Bodhidharma, the influence of Buddhism on Chinese literature, and the Chinese response to Buddhist doctrinal dilemmas. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that it was Buddhist theories about reality that allowed fiction to flourish in China, and ending with Stephen R. Bokenkamp’s study of celestial scripts that Daoists created in response to the appearance of Sanskrit script in China, the volume focuses primarily on the fourth to tenth centuries but addresses dynamics that were at play both before and after this six-century period. While many previous studies that address the impact of India on China do so by focusing on the Chinese transformation of Buddhism and on the degree to which Chinese Buddhism retained this or that Indian feature, this volume differs in that it looks at the influence of Indian thought (particularly religious thought and myths) beyond the confines of Buddhism proper. Meir Shahar and Bernard Faure’s respective contributions are good examples of this, as they demonstrate that some of the Indian deities and demons who came to China with Tantric Buddhism exchanged their Buddhist robes for Daoist ones, or escaped into the wider world of Chinese religious thought and practice.  Another central theme of the book is the way in which Chinese turned to Indian models for religious and political ends, or, in other cases, attempted to recreate India within China. In addition to the aforementioned scholars, the volume contains chapters by Yamabe Nobuyoshi, Ye Derong, the late John R. McRae, Robert H. Sharf, and Christine Mollier.  This book will be of particular interest to those wanting to learn more about Indian myth in East Asia, the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and symbols, the interaction between Daoism and Buddhism, the adapting of Buddhist monasticism to Chinese familial organization, Bodhidharma, the influence of Buddhism on Chinese literature, and the Chinese response to Buddhist doctrinal dilemmas. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that it was Buddhist theories about reality that allowed fiction to flourish in China, and ending with Stephen R. Bokenkamp’s study of celestial scripts that Daoists created in response to the appearance of Sanskrit script in China, the volume focuses primarily on the fourth to tenth centuries but addresses dynamics that were at play both before and after this six-century period. While many previous studies that address the impact of India on China do so by focusing on the Chinese transformation of Buddhism and on the degree to which Chinese Buddhism retained this or that Indian feature, this volume differs in that it looks at the influence of Indian thought (particularly religious thought and myths) beyond the confines of Buddhism proper. Meir Shahar and Bernard Faure’s respective contributions are good examples of this, as they demonstrate that some of the Indian deities and demons who came to China with Tantric Buddhism exchanged their Buddhist robes for Daoist ones, or escaped into the wider world of Chinese religious thought and practice.  Another central theme of the book is the way in which Chinese turned to Indian models for religious and political ends, or, in other cases, attempted to recreate India within China. In addition to the aforementioned scholars, the volume contains chapters by Yamabe Nobuyoshi, Ye Derong, the late John R. McRae, Robert H. Sharf, and Christine Mollier.  This book will be of particular interest to those wanting to learn more about Indian myth in East Asia, the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and symbols, the interaction between Daoism and Buddhism, the adapting of Buddhist monasticism to Chinese familial organization, Bodhidharma, the influence of Buddhism on Chinese literature, and the Chinese response to Buddhist doctrinal dilemmas. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In India in the Chinese Imagination: Myth, Religion, and Thought (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014), eleven scholars (including editors John Kieschnick and Meir Shahar) examine the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and myth, and address Chinese attempts to recreate India within the central kingdom. Beginning with Victor Mair’s argument that it was Buddhist theories about reality that allowed fiction to flourish in China, and ending with Stephen R. Bokenkamp’s study of celestial scripts that Daoists created in response to the appearance of Sanskrit script in China, the volume focuses primarily on the fourth to tenth centuries but addresses dynamics that were at play both before and after this six-century period. While many previous studies that address the impact of India on China do so by focusing on the Chinese transformation of Buddhism and on the degree to which Chinese Buddhism retained this or that Indian feature, this volume differs in that it looks at the influence of Indian thought (particularly religious thought and myths) beyond the confines of Buddhism proper. Meir Shahar and Bernard Faure’s respective contributions are good examples of this, as they demonstrate that some of the Indian deities and demons who came to China with Tantric Buddhism exchanged their Buddhist robes for Daoist ones, or escaped into the wider world of Chinese religious thought and practice.  Another central theme of the book is the way in which Chinese turned to Indian models for religious and political ends, or, in other cases, attempted to recreate India within China. In addition to the aforementioned scholars, the volume contains chapters by Yamabe Nobuyoshi, Ye Derong, the late John R. McRae, Robert H. Sharf, and Christine Mollier.  This book will be of particular interest to those wanting to learn more about Indian myth in East Asia, the Chinese reception of Indian ideas and symbols, the interaction between Daoism and Buddhism, the adapting of Buddhist monasticism to Chinese familial organization, Bodhidharma, the influence of Buddhism on Chinese literature, and the Chinese response to Buddhist doctrinal dilemmas. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week on "A Way with Words":  What's so special about the phrase Sit on a pan, Otis!? It's an example of a palindrome -- a word or phrase that's spelled the same backwards as it is forwards. This year's contest known as the Oscars of the palindrome world inspires some clever, even poetic, surprises. Plus, tips for raising a child to be bilingual.  And what was the search engine Google called BEFORE it was called Google? Also, spelunking slang, hissy fits, language vs. dialect, persons vs. people, French folds, phthalates, and I don't care if it harelips the governor! FULL DETAILSA palindrome is a word or phrase that reads the same both backwards and forwards, like the title of the book Go Hang a Salami! I'm a Lasagna Hog! The SymmyS Awards, bestowed by The Palindromist Magazine are the Oscars of the palindrome world. Recent winners included one called "Espresso Rescue": Had a tonic? Cuppa cappuccino, ta-dah!Bilingual schools can be great for helping children become bilingual, but the best way to fully get there is through complete immersion over a long period of time.Hissy fits, or frivolous tantrums often associated with girls, particularly in the Southern United States, probably derive from the word hysterical. An Alabama caller started thinking about the origin of this word after learning of the opening of a nearby store called Hissy Fit Boutique.Word-unit palindromes are palindromes where all the words read the same back and forth, like this SymmyS winner, titled "Cold Feet at the Altar": Say I do? What do I do? What do I say?!Our Quiz Guy John Chaneski serenades us with a game of rewritten lyrics for Disney's Frozen.Before the search engine Google, there was the word googol. As mathematician Edward Kasner recounts in his book Mathematics and the Imagination, he asked his 9-year-old nephew Milton to coin a word for a huge number, specifically 10 to the 100th power, and that's what the youngster came up with. A googly, on the other hand, is a type of bowl in cricket.What's the difference between your boss and your therapist? Aili Jokela's word-unit palindrome has the answer.Which is correct: several persons or several people? The word persons tends to be used in corporate, legalese contexts, and people is the more natural term.A Hollywood entrance, in spelunker slang, is when a cave has a large, epic opening. Burkard Bilger's epic article in The New Yorker on the world of squeeze freaks and other extreme cavers contains lots of great caving slang.In an earlier episode, we talked about whether it's condescending to say you're proud of someone, and the majority of you who responded agreed that it's best to say something that doesn't make it about you.The difference between Mandarin and Cantonese points to a general difference between languages and dialects: languages tend to have a whole different nationalism or geopolitical power associated with them. For more about Mandarin and Cantonese in particular, check out the work of linguist Victor Mair on Language Log.Take a sheet of paper. Fold it in half. Then fold it in half again. That's called a French fold. Phthalate, a compound in chemistry, got us thinking about other words with ph and th right next to each other. Another winning palindrome from the SymmyS: You swallow pills for anxious days and nights. And days, anxious for pills, swallow you.I don't care if it harelips the queen means "come hell or high water," or "regardless of the consequences." The phrase is particularly popular in Texas, as are such variants as harelips the governor, harelips the president, harelips every cow in Texas, harelips the Pope, harelips the nation, and harelips all the cats in Grimes County, among many others. Harelip refers to the congenital deformity known as a cleft palate, which resembles the mouth of a rabbit, and is sometimes considered offensive. This episode was hosted by Martha Barnette and Grant Barrett.....Support for A Way with Words comes from The Ken Blanchard Companies, celebrating 35 years of making a leadership difference with Situational Leadership II, the leadership model designed to boost effectiveness, impact, and employee engagement. More about how Blanchard can help your executives and organizational leaders at kenblanchard.com/leadership.--A Way with Words is funded by its listeners: http://waywordradio.org/donateGet your language question answered on the air! Call or write with your questions at any time:Email: words@waywordradio.orgPhone: United States and Canada toll-free (877) WAY-WORD/(877) 929-9673London +44 20 7193 2113Mexico City +52 55 8421 9771Donate: http://waywordradio.org/donateSite: http://waywordradio.org/Podcast: http://waywordradio.org/podcast/Forums: http://waywordradio.org/discussion/Newsletter: http://waywordradio.org/newsletter/Twitter: http://twitter.com/wayword/Skype: skype://waywordradio Copyright 2014, Wayword LLC.

Victor Mair is a Professor of Chinese Language and Literature at the University of Pennsylvania as well as the curatorial consultant and catalog editor for the "Secrets of the Silk Road" exhibit. The symposium "Reconfiguring the Silk Road: New Research on East-West Exchange in Antiquity" was held in March 2011 at the Penn Museum in conjunction with the major exhibit from China, "Secrets of the Silk Road." The symposium was the first major event in over 15 years to focus on the history of the Silk Road and the origins of the mysterious Tarim Basin mummies. Since the last milestone conference was held on the topic at the Penn Museum in 1996, new archaeological discoveries and scholarly advances had been made, creating the need to critically reshape the very idea of the "Silk Road."

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania

Victor Mair, University of Pennsylvania