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Steve Larsen: What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Secret MLM Hacks radio and I've got a very special interview and a very special guest to bring on today for the show. So go ahead and stay tuned. We'll cue the intro, grab a pen and paper and sit tight. So here's the real mystery. How do real MLMers like us read and cheat and only bug family members and friends. If you wanna grow a profitable home business, how do we recruit A players into our down lines and create extra incomes, yet still have plenty of time for the rest of our lives. That's the blaring question, and this podcast will give you the answer. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Secret MLM Hacks radio. Hi, what's going on everyone. Hey, I'm really excited for today. You guys have a very special treat. I have just been so incredibly impressed with this person. I have actually been watching closely, from am distance. Seeing everything that's been going on. You guys know my take, in the MLM space. I truly believe that MLM nowadays is broken for the way we get it. We get it, and it's not set up correctly. Or there's so many things we got to do in order to actually still be successful with it. And it's not an aspect that's really taught by uplines. And that's not something that ... I'm not anti up line, I'm not anti the man. I'm not anti those things. But it's just the reality. And from a distance, I started watching who the who was. Of all the other people who believe the same thing. And there's more ways to do it. And hey, the Internet's here, and why do we use that. Various things. And we ran across this amazing woman. Gloria MacDonald. MacDonald. Gloria MacDonald, and I'm so excited to have her on today. She is an expert, a pro in the MLM space, using LinkedIn, using various tools and things across the internet. Very honored to have her here today. And thank you so much for being here. GloriaMacDonald: Oh Steven, absolutely my pleasure. I'm thrilled and delighted to be here. Steve Larsen: This is awesome. Very, very excited. Could you ... You have a lot of success now, right. And you're doing all these great things. And I know you've done things with huge players. Was it always that way? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. I came out of my mother's womb at the age of two. I was three level diamond in Amway. No. Steve Larsen: You saying you've always been successful, wow. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, always. And I've never had any struggles at all, you know. Yeah, right. Let me tell you another story. Let me tell you the true story. Steve Larsen: Sounds good. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. So I started in Amway, in 1979. So right off the top, Steve, and I hate to do this to you, but I have to correct you on something that I've heard you say. With great respect for what you've done. But I heard you say that [inaudible 00:02:43] hasn't changed since the 1990s. And I'm sorry, but it hasn't changed since the 1970s. Steve Larsen: I will take your correction. GloriaMacDonald: I don't fault you for not knowing that, because you wouldn't have been around in the 1970s. I was. Steve Larsen: That's funny. GloriaMacDonald: So it's mind boggling to me. Because people are still doing today, and network marketing companies today are still teaching and training exactly what I was taught in 1979 before the internet existed. Before personal computers existed. You know, there was no such thing as a personal computer. Cell phones didn't exist. I hate to think about what a dinosaur I am. But none of this stuff existed that exist today, that is so powerful that enables us to build our networking businesses in a much more effective and efficient way. And still, network marketing companies are still teaching, and uplines are still teaching, make your list of a hundred people. [inaudible 00:03:57] market. It's like, good god really? You know? Really. So, I went through all the struggles. I've done everything everyone else has done. Done my list of a hundred people too many times. I was an overachiever. So I did, you know, a hundred and fifty people, or two hundred people. Steve Larsen: Sure, yeah. GloriaMacDonald: You know, I- Steve Larsen: What happened from that? Was there a moment where you're like, wait a second. GloriaMacDonald: Well, yeah. What happened from that, was just like everybody else. I got so much rejection. And I burned through my one market. And then, especially back when I started, then what on earth what do you do? You couldn't hop on Facebook or LinkedIn, or whatever. Because those things didn't exist. So you had to be out and about, strike up conversations with total strangers in the grocery store. You know. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: And really networking meetings like we know them today didn't exist in 1979 either. So it was tough. It was grueling. Anyway, and the interesting thing, what I know now that I didn't know then, was all of that old school technique ... And don't get me wrong. Obviously there have been people who have built huge businesses using all those old school techniques. And that's great, and that's wonderful. But why would we still be using that today? Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: When there are far more efficient and effective ways. And the biggest thing about those old school ways, is that they work completely against the way our brains work. They go completely against our human physiology, biology, chemistry, psychology, and you know, our brains job is to keep us safe and protect us. So every time we start to feel any kind of rejection, our brain is literally saying, "Don't go there, don't do that. It's not safe. Rejection's not good. No, no, no, no, no." So why would you put yourself in a position where you're working against your biology, when there are all kinds of ways today where you can work with your biology, and you don't have to ... I mean, literally, you can do rejection-free recruiting. You know that, you're doing it. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Now, the first time I heard you say that, I was like, dancing up and down, screaming. Because I was like, yes, yes, someone else! Okay, absolutely. You talk about, it's literally against a lot of the way our chemical make up is put together. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: Which is true. Could you talk a little bit more about that, and what you mean about that? Because that's fascinating. I'm pretty confident most people have no idea about this. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I mean seriously, the way our brain works, the job our brain is to keep us safe, and conserve energy. That's the primary job of our brain. And it goes back to millions and millions of years of evolutionary psychology, where literally we had to conserve energy in case a tiger or lion jumped out of the jungle at us, and attacked us. We had to be ready to just fight, or flee. Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: And so we had to conserve energy, and we had to be very very very aware of what was going on around us to protect us. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: And so, even though we're not facing lions and tigers today, in that same way, our brain's job is still to protect us and to conserve energy to keep us safe. And so literally anything that feels uncomfortable to us, the brain recognizes that and says, "No, danger zone, danger zone." It literally tries to shut us down. So rejection's not comfortable for anybody, unless you work really, really, really hard against your brain. But the problem is, the vast, vast, vast majority of people just can't do it. They physically can not do it. They physically cannot re-wire their brain to go against human biology. And they can't re-wire their brain to say, "Nope, doesn't matter. I don't care about being safe." Because we need to be safe. So yeah, it goes against- Steve Larsen: I mean, you're literally saying that MLM is going against the way our bodies are built. What do you doing different? When did you realize that, and the new thing you learn. Like, oh my gosh, there's this whole other way. I don't need to be doing it this way. How do I become more in harmony with my body, and the way my body is made up to be successful in MLM? GloriaMacDonald: Great question. It was just within the last four or five years, that I had this huge uh huh, as I studied the brain more and more. And I studied the brain a lot, because it's fascinating, I believe. It's really important to understand how the human brain and the human body work to be successful, and to understand what's going on in your prospects brain. Because it's not just you, it's your prospect, right. Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: Your prospect brain is going through the same thing, and it's saying, "No, no, no, no. This doesn't sound like I'm going to be good at this. This doesn't sound like I'm going to succeed at this." So their brain is taking that too, because their brain's job is to make sure they don't fail. So yeah, it's just over the past four or five years I've really started understanding a whole lot more about how the brain worked. It's like, oh my gosh. Wow, all this prospecting and recruiting stuff the way I've been taught over the last 35 years really doesn't work with the brain. I mean, I knew it was tough. I knew it was tough for the vast majority of people. And I knew that somehow or other, I just trudged forward and did it. But I knew most people couldn't. But I didn't understand exactly why. I thought, well people just don't have enough stick to it ness. They just don't, all the stuff we heard. Their Why isn't big enough. Oh, you know. They just don't have enough guts, whatever it is. But it's much, much, much more scientific than that. Steve Larsen: It's not just that. GloriaMacDonald: Pardon? Steve Larsen: It's usually not just, hey I'm lazy. I don't really want success. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: [inaudible 00:10:41]. GloriaMacDonald: Exactly, exactly. And then it was really just in the last two years, that I figured out the technology piece of okay. So, you know, it was two years ago I heard about this attraction marketing thing. But okay, what's that. That sounds kind of interesting. And realized, my gosh, traction marketing, the beauty of traction marketing is that it's not working perfectly with the brand. That's why it works. Because it takes out the whole rejection thing. And then you know, I started mucking around on Facebook, and had some initial success. But then Facebook algorithms changed and started going crazy and stuff like that. So my ads weren't working, and all that kind of stuff. Steve Larsen: Thank you, Zuckerberg. GloriaMacDonald: Pardon? Steve Larsen: Thank you, Zuckerberg. GloriaMacDonald: Yes, exactly, yeah. And again, not to say that there aren't people out there that aren't having success with Facebook ads. But I think it's extremely. So Steven, if any of your listeners are listening today, and who are listening today are actually just trying to start off with Facebook ads, I think the message people need to hear, are look. If you're just starting off today, it's going to cost you a wack load of money if you don't already have a huge following. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: So the people who are making Facebook ads work, are the people that started four, five years ago, and already had followings of 50 thousand, 60 thousand, whatever. Before all the algorithms started changing like crazy. And even they are experiencing an increase in advertising cost. But it still is worth it to them. But I think it's really tough for the person that's starting out today. So I just thought, this is not a recipe for success. So I started fooling around on LinkedIn. And it was like, oh my gosh. Steve Larsen: Now, what made you choose LinkedIn? If I could just interrupt you. Sorry about that. I mean, LinkedIn is usually not the place people think of, you know. What made you go there? GloriaMacDonald: Well, I'd had a presence on LinkedIn from a previous business. Not much. I had, oh I don't know, a thousand, 12 hundred connections on LinkedIn. I fooled around with Linkedin a little bit, but not in the same way at all. And I don't know, Twitter, I thought, really? How much can you do with a hundred and twenty four characters, or whatever it was at that point. Because it was [inaudible 00:13:16] than it is now. Steve Larsen: I think we're grounded at 180 now. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. And Twitter's just not my thing. And again, there are people making money on Twitter. They are. Not me. And I fooled around a little bit with Instagram, but I couldn't figure out how Instagram was going to work for me. And again, people are making money on Instagram, but that's not the platform I cracked. So I just, I don't know. LinkedIn just made sense to me, it felt comfortable to me. And when I thought about it, I thought, wait a second. LinkedIn is where a whole bunch of professionals are. And in fact, the average LinkedIn user has twice the buying power that the average online user. So it's a more professional ... I say LinkedIn really isn't a social media platform. It's really a business platform. So the beauty of LinkedIn is that you can get right down to business. Steve Larsen: You don't expect that. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, you don't have to be what I call fake social. You know. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: So yeah. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. So you went, oh man, something's messed up there. Eventually, you left the tactics. And just so everyone's clear, we're not bashing on any MLM, just the actual tactics. They're so weird. And you go, you're like, what about this LinkedIn thing. What made LinkedIn work so well? I tell you what, if I see someone else posting on social media of them, a selfie in a gym. You know, saying, "I'm working from home today." And you're like, you just started this. You know, it can get a little frustrating. How is your approach so different so that we're not offending those parts of the brain. We're actually attracting people the right way. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, great question. So first of all, it starts with really targeting people you know who are already open and interested in what you have to offer. It's not just the old three foot rule, anybody who comes within three feet. Or anybody who calls, or anybody who breathes. You know ... Steve Larsen: [inaudible 00:15:34]. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. It's not that. It's really understanding who your target market is, and figuring out how to exactly find them. This is true for any platform. It doesn't matter whether it's LinkedIn, or Facebook, whatever. The whole basis of being able to work with the brain, is knowing who's already open to and interested in what you have to offer. And then being able to have highly targeted messages to those people. So that when you actually end up on the phone with them, or in a zoom call with them or whatever, you're not going to get any rejection. So I say to people, look, my day is filled with conversations like you and I have right now. When I'm talking to people who are already totally sold on network marketing, they already believe in that. They struggled. The vast majority of them struggled. And they feel like, oh they can just figure out the secret. If I could just get the one thing to work, then I'd be a millionaire. As you and I both know, it's not that easy. Nothing is that easy, it's a business, and you have to treat it like a business. It doesn't mean 100 percent of people are going to buy from you, or join your team. But there's no rejection. There's no beating your head against the wall trying to talk someone into the idea that network marketing isn't a scam or a pyramid scheme or whatever. So it works with the brain. And you know, there are millions and millions and millions, and millions and millions and millions of network marketers on LinkedIn, but they're not using it. Steve Larsen: So they're sold on the concept of network marketing, they just don't know how to apply it anymore. Especially in today's internet saturated world. Everyone's far more shut off a little bit, and ... So how do you ... When do you know that you're ... Because here's how I imagine it, right. Someone comes in, and you kind of start sizing them up. Not to say you skip the relationship, which you don't obviously. But you're sizing them up, and trying to see, hey, is this person someone I can attract to me, in starting up a conversation. What are the signs that you know you're taking to somebody who's already in an MLM, who's already ... Without being, feeling like you're being pushy? GloriaMacDonald: Well for me, it's really simple. They have it on their LinkedIn profile. Steve Larsen: Got you. GloriaMacDonald: So I target them because they said on their LinkedIn profile, that they're with ABC company. Or they've got the words Network Marketing in the profile, whatever. So it is very easy to find network marketers on LinkedIn. It's a piece of cake to find network marketers on LinkedIn. And the beauty of what I teach, Steven, is it's free. Now, people say, oh you can't scale when it's free. And there is a certain amount of truth to that. But only a certain amount. And you know, my whole goal is to help people make money. Because as you and I know, there's so many people that, they've got a dream. They want to be able to send their kids to college. They want to be able to take vacations. They want to be able to pay off their debt. They want to be able to take care of their aging parents, whatever their dream is. And they can see that it's worked for other people in network marketing. But it hasn't worked for them yet. So I want to help people make money. So I am all about ... Sure, you can go spend a hundred thousand dollars a month on Facebook ads, if you've got the deep pockets. But how many people do, you know. So I'm all about starting right where the person's at, and helping them right where they're at. So if you don't have deep pockets, if you're struggling to make ends meet, and you really want to build your network marketing business, then you can start off absolutely for free on LinkedIn. You don't even have to pay for a LinkedIn subscription. And you know, I'm into this now ... Well, it'll be 11 months that I launched my first LinkedIn thing. So I started one thing that I launched in August last year. So right now, I'm going to do it right around, say the 20th or so, of August. So I'm 11 months into this, and I have not paid a dime for LinkedIn advertising. Not a dime. And I've made multiple six figures in the last 11 months. Steve Larsen: That's amazing. GloriaMacDonald: All on Linkedin. Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Now, is there things that you got to be aware of? I know on Facebook you got to be aware of a few things with [inaudible 00:20:28] marketing, and MLM on Facebook. Is LinkedIn the same? GloriaMacDonald: No, LinkedIn is open to you just using the words network marketing, MLM. They're absolutely open to it, it's a business platform, and people are there to talk about business. And network marketing is a business. So, you know. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. And, I will say, Steven, that one of the things I see all the time, and it drives me bonkers, is ... And I even see this with people who are trainers. Network marketing trainers. And they've got training programs on LinkedIn. And what they're doing, is they're teaching people how to do Facebook on Linkedin. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Steve Larsen: Different platform. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, it's a different platform. It's a business platform. In fact, just yesterday, I was having a conversation with somebody, and she was sending messages to connections on LinkedIn. She said, "But nobody's messaging me back." And I said, "They don't." They don't. This is not Facebook, it's not about being fake social. It's not about being, oh how's your day going today? Oh, you know, here's the color of my new toenail polish. Oh, this is what I had for lunch. No, this is business. This is not about having, you know, just mindless dribble conversations on messenger. Steve Larsen: Oh, thank you. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Stop it, guys. Stop it. And it drives me bananas when I see people putting all the motivational inspirational quotes up on LinkedIn. Now, I am all about motivation and inspiration. I'm all about it. So here's the analogy I use. If you were an accountant, and you're going in to meet a prospective client, would you go in with a binder full of motivational, inspirational quotes to show your new perspective client? No! Steve Larsen: If they were a poster store, maybe. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, but no, you're an accountant. Steve Larsen: Yeah, no. GloriaMacDonald: You're going to go in with a photo album of your family and what they did last weekend, or the picnic you had. It's like, no, guys. This is business. This is not Facebook. And I see network marketers doing it all the time. It's like, stop it. Steve Larsen: Yeah, it comes off kind of weird. I heard somebody say, you got to match the content with the context of the platform. So it's like- GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: Totally, totally different feel on LinkedIn. That's not what that's for. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, absolutely. Steve Larsen: So let's say you identify somebody. How do you approach that person on LinkedIn, without coming across like that? You said, they're not going to message you back. But how do you get their attention? GloriaMacDonald: Well, I always lead with value. It's all about leading with value, it's literally about attracting people to you, because they're really interested in what you have to offer. So I send people an invitation to connect. Very simply, you don't have many characters anyway, you're limited to 300, and you can't put links in the initial message. So I send invitations saying, "Hey, I see you're with ABC company, I'd love to connect with you. Looking forward to it, thanks, Gloria." Super simple, right. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: Right. And then when they connect with me, I send them a message saying, "Hey, thanks for connecting," I don't remember the exact wording, but it's something like, "I've found LinkedIn to be a super powerful place to build network marketing business. And here's a link to my free guide for four steps to power prospecting on LinkedIn." Steve Larsen: Cool. So you give them some value, and you know you're talking to an MLMer, a network- GloriaMacDonald: Exactly. Steve Larsen: Wow. GloriaMacDonald: Yep. So it's all about [inaudible 00:24:26], just like you're doing, Steven. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Now so, you go, you leave them with value. And what are two steps you tell anybody. The first two things you need to go do in order to get started? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, the first thing is to set up your LinkedIn profile very, very differently than what you ever thought. So most people think of LinkedIn as really an online listing. Get rid of all that crap. Use LinkedIn ... Use your profile page as a sales and marketing machine. So I literally have sales coming in, seven days a week, while I'm sleeping. While I'm doing other things, you know. Because it's all automated. Now at the end of the day, you have to talk to people. Sure, you can do things to get people really, really qualified, which is what I highly recommend, that you keep qualifying, qualifying, qualifying. So that you're only speaking to people who have raised their hand multiple times, saying, "Yes, I'm interested, yes I'm interested, Yes I'm interested." And then, at that point, you get on the phone or zoom with them, or whatever, and talk to them about your opportunity. But it's all about using automation to pre-qualify people, so you're not wasting time talking to people who aren't open to, and interested in what you have to offer. So you really are only doing rejection-free prospecting and recruiting. So take everything off your profile page that has anything to do with where you worked, what year you worked there, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And just because the LinkedIn field might say company name, you don't have to put company name in there. I put the title of one of my [inaudible 00:26:24] in there. Steve Larsen: Oh, I love it. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I put four steps to power prospecting. Free gift. You know, that's the company name. Location, we don't care about location. We're- Steve Larsen: Internet. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, internet. It's the internet. Steve Larsen: Everywhere. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. You know? So, just because it says location, doesn't mean you have to put location in there. Put a link, put a link to where they can get the [inaudible 00:26:51] or put a link to your online calendar, or whatever it is. But give people a way to connect with you. Now, links on your profile page on Linkedin, are not live. You have to copy and paste them. You know, LinkedIn, like everything else, is trying to keep people on the platform. But that's okay. I still put, "Copy and paste this link." And yeah, so use your profile page as a sales and marketing tool. And I would also say, don't put anything on your profile page about your network marketing company. Steve Larsen: Amen, oh my gosh, amen. GloriaMacDonald: Yup, take all that stuff off there, and lead with value. So, what is it that you have to offer your target audience, free information that will help your target audience with whatever their paying points are. Steve Larsen: Wow. Okay, okay. So step one, drastically treat that profile page completely different from most likely pretty much all of us are. Not totally different though. GloriaMacDonald: [inaudible 00:28:05]. Steve Larsen: And two, what would be the second thing you'd have people go do? GloriaMacDonald: Then, be very targeted in terms of who you are inviting to connect with you. And who's invitations, when people send you an invitation to connect with them. I only accept invitations from people who are in my specific target market. I do not accept invitations from people who are not in my target market. Steve Larsen: I accept everybody. Uh-oh. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I wouldn't do that. Steve Larsen: I don't even get on it that much. I'm totally going to get on this thing now. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, well you better, Steven. Steve Larsen: Yeah, that's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: I mean, seriously. Linkedin is an absolutely untapped gold mine for network marketers. It's an untapped gold mine. Steve Larsen: Wow. Okay, okay, profile. Step two, get real targeted on who you allow, and don't allow. And who you're going for, and don't go for. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: And then step three, is probably go buy your course, yeah? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you could do that. Steve Larsen: I appreciate you being on here and sharing everything. Everyone, you said it's GloriaMacDonald.com? Go to? GloriaMacDonald: Yes. Yeah, so M-A-C for MacDonald. Gloria MacDonald dot com. Or you can find me on LinkedIn. Gloria MacDonald. And I'm in Toronto, Canada. But Gloria MacDonald. Or on Facebook, Gloria MacDonald. Steve Larsen: Oh my gosh. Well, we appreciate you taking the time. This has been absolutely amazing. And frankly, this is the kind of stuff I just feel like, no one really ... You know, this is disruptive information, everybody. I hope that you take time to sit down and actually re-listen to this, and write down the steps she just said. Because that's very powerful, and come back. You owe Gloria a huge testimonial when you made your millions, as well. GloriaMacDonald: Thanks, Steven. It was great to be here with you today. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Thank you so much. Oh, isn't Gloria awesome? You can't learn that stuff anywhere else. Hey, kick a thank you over to Gloria, and check out Secret MLM hacks, by going to Gloria is awesome dot com. Again, that's Gloria is awesome dot com.

I have the most incredible respect for Myron. Come learn some of the laws of wealth from his gift of clarity...  What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larson and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. I have a very special episode for you today. I'm going to be interviewing and going and through and chatting with one of my favorite people in this planet. His name is Myron Golden. There's a lot of voices out there, there's a lot of people out there that tell you to do this or tell you to do that. I'm not calling them out but every once in a while some not done this, they're not walking with their talking. They haven't actually been down the path. Myron is one of those people that I have come to not just know and like and become friends with but I trust him, I trust what he says, I trust what he's saying because I know that he's been down that path. I learn so much from him every time he speaks, very excited to have him on the show here. I would take notes during this episode. I would do during all my episodes but specifically this one. You're going to learn a lot about different, not just formulas but the personal attributes and formulas and steps of the process somebody goes through as they start to learn this whole game. As I've mentioned before, a lot of it has to do with personal development that's tailored directly to you. That's what you're going to find out as you listen to this episode. He's going to go through and dive in and do also a bit of a recap of what he spoke about at this last Funnel Hacking Live. Very honored to have him on the show to be honest. He is a published author... He's spoken for years. He's helped a lot of people gain their goals. He started out as a trash man. He has made millions of dollars now, very fascinating to watch the process and watch what he's done and his attitude towards that kind of learning, towards that kind of process. Very fascinating, please take notes, you guys are in for a special treat. Just stick around if you want to, decided to toss in some of the conversation that he and I had before we were actually officially making the episode together, a fun conversation will be afterwards, after the very last little outro piece... I spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today... Now, I've left my 9 to 5 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it with VC funding or debt, completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio. How's it going everyone? I am very excited. You have a very special treat today. Whatever you're doing, stop. If you're driving somewhere, pull over, take out a pen and paper, everything that you're about to hear it can be life-changing to you, certainly has been as I've learned from them. We have a very special guest on today who has blessed my life immensely. In fact, he just barely spoke at Funnel Hacking Live. I went home immediately and I started teaching my wife and my friends and family all the things that I heard from this man. I have learned incredible things from him. I have immense respect for everything that he does. Every time he speaks I feel like there's just gold that just falls on the floor and I run to pick it up. Anyway, I am very, very excited for the guest today. I want to welcome Myron Golden. How are you doing Myron? Myron Golden: I am excellent as always, Steve, and better now that I'm talking to you. Thank you for all those kind words by the way. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I remember the first time that we chatted really face to face. I've seen you in Russell's inner circle around the ClickFunnels office, places like that. It was after a Funnel Hackathon event, one of those 3-day Death Marches. Myron Golden: Intense, intense. Steve Larsen: Yeah, intense, right? You walked up to me and you said something to me that I actually wrote on my wall and I'm looking at it right now. Myron Golden: Can't imagine. Hope it was something good. Steve Larsen: Yeah, it was really good. It totally helped. Anyway, I have a wall full of quotes and you're on my quote wall. You said, "What makes you you is the ability to see things others can't." ...You said that and I wrote it on my wall, and I look at that a lot. It has made me look for more connections, it's made me look for more things. I really believe that it's brought me in places that I may not otherwise have been in. I just want to, anyway, thank you for that. Myron Golden: Wow! Absolutely my pleasure, bro. I call it like I see it. I just say it. Steve Larsen: I love it, I love it. You have a lot of ... you have a book, "From the Trash Man to the Cash Man", in ways that anyone can become profitable. Really, you obsess this expertise about how the laws of how money work. Could you tell us a little bit of your backstory and how you got into that? It's an area, it's not something you learn that from school. It's not like you ... you know what I mean? ...You obviously have this obsession about this topic and it's impressive. Myron Golden: You know what I learned from school? I learned to hate school. Anyway, that's all another conversation. I was a trash man, I wrote the book long time after that, but I was a trash man. I was making $6.25 an hour. It's the first job that I got after I got married. ...I can remember saying to my young wife, who I love more than life itself, and I can remember saying to her, if we can just make $300 a week, if I can just make $300 a week with overtime from this job, we're going to be okay. That was my vision. When I think about that now, $300 a week, that's where my head was. I drove a trash truck during the day but I had a business at night. I had a part time business at night where I sold insurance and investments. I say, I shouldn't say I sold insurance and investments, I should say I sold that insurance and investments. ...When I got started Steven, I was probably the worst salesman in world history. If there was a Guinness Book of World Records for a salesperson who could be in sales the longest without making a sale, I probably would have gotten that award and it would probably last until this day. That's how ... it took me literally that long to make my first sale. Steve Larsen: Looking at you now, that's hard to believe. Myron Golden: I know. Even when I think about it, and the beauty of that is ... let me just tell you. I got started in the insurance business, the financial services business in October of 1985. You pro weren't even born yet, October 1985. Steve Larsen: I was not. Myron Golden: Right. This is way before that. October of 1985, I did not make my first sale until April of 1987. I was working, I was doing presentation, I was talking to people, I was talking to friends, I was doing presentation to the family, I was doing presentation with strangers, I'd knock on people's doors, I'd talk to people I meet, and it literally took me 18 months to make my first sale and my first check was $125.66. If you take ... you have to note that if you take $125.66 and you divide it by 18, that's not very much a month. Quite less than [inaudible 00:07:39] a month. I was horrible. ...You say, "Well", you look at me now and not know that. Here's the beauty of that whole thing. I'm really good at sales now. I've made millions of dollars in sales. I've done millions of dollars in sales from the stage in less than an hour. I'm good at selling but I wasn't always good, and that should give everybody hope. ...This is Sales Funnel Radio. You don't have to be good to get started in sales but you have to get started to get good. I got started but getting started is not enough. The second thing you got to do to get good in sales, you got to lash through the learning curve. For me, the learning curve was 18 months. Most people think that selling is a talent... People who can sell are people who have a gift of gab and they're good at talking. I've discovered that people who are good at sales are people who have the gift of listening and people who are good at shutting up. ...Anyway, if you're not good at sales and you're listening to this right now, don't think that it's hopeless for you. That just means that when you get there, you'll understand what you're doing better than the average person who had just came easy for. Steve Larsen: Yeah, that's true. Absolutely. What did you do to lash through that learning curve like you said? That's an interesting way to put that. Myron Golden: How did I lash through the learning curve? I was basically optionless. I think one of the reason people fail is because they have too many choices. I didn't have any other choice. ...Steven, you know me so you know I walk with a limp, I've got a brace on my leg. I had polio as an infant. I'm a very athletic individual, I'm a black belter in martial Arts, I'm a single-digit handicapped golfer, but there were no sports teams trying to recruit me in my 20s. It wasn't like I was going to go and get recruited by a professional football team or a professional basketball, or a professional baseball team. That wasn't going to happen. I didn't have a college degree so as far as jobs were concerned, manual labor was basically was left. I couldn't lift things and carry them a long way so that was out. It was ... if I desire to be wealthy, I desire to build a life worth living for my family but I've got to make this work. I don't have any other choice. ...The only people that I knew in the world that were making, this is back at the 80s now, that we're making $10,000 a month where people who are in that business. In my mind, the only hope I ever had to get to $10,000 a month or $100,000 a year was to last and get good at this thing that other people had gotten good at. The fact that other people had gotten good at it, let me know that I could get good at it as well. Steve Larsen: That's amazing. It's optionless. I think the back against the wall mentality, got to get plata o plomo just like girls was talking about, looking at other model, you're modeling other people, you talked a lot about ... there was something that you said right at the beginning of Funnel Hacking Live. Your speech is just amazing. You said, I wrote it down as fast I can, looking at your page of notes that I took from your speech right now. You said, "Some of you are not willing to be bad at something long enough to get good at it. I stayed in the game long enough to learn the game." It just exploded my head when you said that. Myron Golden: Yup. I really didn't have a choice. I am a very determined person. That's not the word my parents used or my brothers. They called me stubborn. I like the word determined better. I can remember going to work with my dad when I was a kid. We might be working on a car or something maybe and a bolt that stuck and it won't come out. I said, "Wow dad, it won't come out." He said, "Oh it's going to come out, it didn't have a choice. It didn't have a brain, we have a brain, it has to come out." I was like, "Wow! It doesn't have a choice. Okay." When I look at learning how to sell I look at, get it, becoming good at business. ...Business is not going to be one of those things that's going to evade me. It doesn't have a choice. I have a brain, it doesn't have a brain, this is something I can learn, I'm going to learn. Steve Larsen: Where did you turn to? I think one of the things that people run into ... I've got this desire. I get a lot of people reach out to me asking thing actually. Steven, I want to go get this done. I really want to learn this funnel game. I really want to be wealthy. ...I really want to learn these pieces. There is so much noise. There's places all over. We could get distracted with the next book, the next CD, whatever, the next guru, the next thing. How did you figure out what to learn? Myron Golden: I didn't figure out what to learn. That's the reality of it. I literally learned everything I could from everywhere I could. We're talking about the 80s, there was no Internet. There was an Internet for the government but there was no Internet for the rest of us. There was no Internet, there was no YouTube, there was no Facebook, there were no webinars, there was none of that stuff. On the weekends, I would go to seminars, at least one seminar a month, I would go to one seminar a month. ...Every week they had trainings at our office. I went to all the trainings. I was bad at selling so guess what I did. Watch this. I was broke and I was bad at selling so guess what I did. I went to the library. Remember those things they used to have, the buildings with all the books in them? Steve Larsen: Yeah, I've heard of them. Myron Golden: I went to the library and I said, "okay, I'm going to find a book on selling." Guess what book I found. Tom Hopkins, "How To Master The Art Of Selling Anything". Steve Larsen: That sounds like the exact answer. Myron Golden: Exactly. I started reading that book. There are three things that I got from Tom Hopkins book in the forefront of my mind even to this very day. They were something that I put a lot of conscious effort into and now they've become subconscious parts of me. One, he had this thing called STP20. This is old school now. He said, "The key to success in sales see 20 people, STP, see 20 people belly to belly every day and you will be successful in sales. See 20 people. I said, "Okay. Well, I can see 20 people." Guess what. It all starts with seeing that first one. That's the first thing I got from Tom Hopkins, see 20 people. ...What would that translate into in Internet jargon? How about this? Generate 20 leads a day. Generate 20 leads a day that's 600 leads a month. 600 leads a month x 12 months, that's 7,200 lead a year. In two years, you've got 14,400 leads. Every lead on your list is worth at low end a dollar a month for you. You want to make $15,000 a month or $14,000 a month, generate 20 leads a day. It translates, it's just a little different. The second thing that I got from him was there's pain in change until the benefits of that change appear. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Myron Golden: There's pain in change. In other words, if I'm going to change from being who I am to being some ... from being the Myron who can't sell to being the Myron who can sell, it's going to be painful. Steve Larsen: What happens after you got- Myron Golden: It's always going to be painful until I get good at it. There's pain in change until the benefits of that change appear. Steve Larsen: I imagine that. Myron Golden: You're going to say what? Steve Larsen: I'm sorry, I was going to say what happened after you got that first $125.66 check. Myron Golden: It was like a floodgate opened. It was like, "Oh! I got this." Then I became the top salesperson in our office like month after month after month after month because I got one. ...A lot of people don't realize there are things that you can only learn about doing the thing by doing the thing. People want to learn how to do a webinar by watching Russell's perfect webinar. There are things you can learn from Russell's Perfect Webinar, no doubt, we all have, but there are things that you will only learn about doing a webinar by doing a webinar, which is why people ignore it. ...He says, Russell says, "Do your webinar 100 times before you turn it into an automated webinar." We want easy streak. Here's the problem, Steven, how I perceive the problem to be. People want to have wealth. People want to have things without doing the things that give them the right to have them. People are frustrated because they can't do a thing but they haven't become the person who can do them. Here's how God set it up in the beginning. Some people may not believe the Bible, that's okay, I'm going to say this anyway because I believe it since you're all listening to me. Steve Larsen: We're good. They know, me too. Myron Golden: Here's how God set it up. The very first thing that God ever said to a human being, to Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden, the first thing he ever said to them, I call it the first command which came a thousand years before the Ten Commandments. Here's what he said, "Be, do, have." ...I'm going to give you the whole thing he said but I just want you to get the essence of it. Be, do have, here's what that means. That means, "Don't be can't do, don't do can't have." Some people say, "Where did God say Be, do, have?" I forgot "made man". Here's what he said, "Be fruitful and multiply." Fruitfulness is something that you've become. Be fruitful. He said, "Multiply". Multiply is not a be, it's a do. Be fruitful and do multiply. He didn't say "do multiply", just the multiple but the do is... Be fruitful, multiply, that's a do. Replenish the Earth, that's a do. Subdue the Earth, that's a do... Then, have dominion over the works of my hands. If you don't become fruitful, if you won't be fruitful, you can't do multiply, do subdue or do replenish. If you don't do subdue and multiply and replenish, you can't have dominion. Be, do, have, that's the formula. Stop trying to have success without doing things successful people do. Stop attempting to do things successful people do without becoming a successful person. If you will focus more on becoming the person you should be, everything else will fall into place. Anyway, that's my rant... Steve Larsen: I love the rant. I don't want to stop you. This is awesome. I think that's a ... there's a little phrase I've been saying. It's interesting people want to ... they want to enjoy progression but have a hard time enjoying the process of progression... There's this process that you have to go through. I remember when it clicked for me as well. It's fascinating that you said that. I was like, "Wait a second. The first taste of success suddenly all these ceilings got a lot higher and breaking. I was like, "Whoa! Look at everything we go do and create. Pretty amazing." One of the things that I ran home and taught my wife from your ... from Funnel Hacking Live, from what you taught was this whole concept of these four levels of money, oh my goodness. I went nuts when I saw that... I wrote down everything I could, I was writing as fast as you were talking and getting all these pieces together. Do you mind teaching that here? I've put it on the spot but that was life-changing. Myron Golden: I'm here already so whatever you want me to do, I'm all in. I talk about the fours levels of value. Here's what it boils down to. A lot of people would go through life whining about the fact that life isn't fair. Here's what I'm going to ... I've got a good word for all of you who are whining about the fact that life isn't fair. Get over it... Steve Larsen: Woohoo! Thanks for saying it, yes. Myron Golden: If life was fair, a chicken would have you sitting on its dining room table tonight for supper. Get over it. Life isn't fair. My dad taught me that one, I was in elementary school. Steve Larsen: Amen. Myron Golden: Hey Steven, how about this? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Myron Golden: I was born, this is so hard for you to wrap your mind around. I was born in a segregated hospital that was started by a civil war nurse because the black soldiers couldn't be treated by the white soldiers. Granted, I wasn't born during the Civil War. I was born almost a hundred years later. Here's what people say. "That's not fair." Get over it. The conditions of that hospital were so poor that I contracted polio. My parents moved all the way from Tampa, Florida to somewhere in Pennsylvania before I even got diagnosed to be treated. My left leg doesn't ... basically there's a placeholder. That's pretty funny, placeholder. Somebody will say, "Well, that's not fair." Get over it. Life is not supposed to be fair. Everybody has a different assignment... A lot of people will talk about, they'll scream from their ... but it's not fair, income inequality. We have to understand something. We have to understand that income inequality does not exist in a vacuum. Income inequality is the result of something. What produces income? The only thing that produces income is value. If there's income inequality, there has to be value creation inequality. Okay? If you desire to make more money, you don't make more money by whining about how unfair it is. ...Here's what you do. You go create so much value that the marketplace has no choice but to pay you because they want what you have so desperately. That's the foundation of the four levels of value. There are four levels of value. If you offer value at the lowest level, you will always make the least amount of money. If you offer value at the highest level, you'll always make the most amount of money. You don't make more money by working harder on a lower level of value. That's something that people really have a hard ... but I'm working really hard. I know but you're working really hard at something the marketplace doesn't value. Now they have the framework, here we go. Here are the four levels of value. By the way, the three lowest levels have one resource that we use on those levels. The top level has two resources that we use. Here are the four levels of value. Here we go. Steve Larsen: Please go take notes everybody. Oh my gosh, go get a piece a paper. Myron Golden: The lowest level of value is called implementation. Those are the people who do the thing. They mow the grass, they hammer the nail, they dig the hole, they drive the truck, they type the paper, they clean the room. These are the people who do that thing. They are implementers. That is not to imply, it's not to say nor is it to imply, that the work that the implementers do is not valuable. It's just to say that ... it's not to say that those people aren't valuable. Obviously, one person is not more valuable than another person. What it does say is the value that they deliver in the marketplace is not something that the marketplace values as highly as things they pay more money for. For instance, I travel a lot, Steven. I stay in a lot of hotel rooms. I think only maybe once in the thousands of times I've stayed in hotels, if I ever checked into the room and the room was dirty, I won't back down to the front desk and say, "This room is dirty. Clean the room." None of us are willing to stay in a dirty hotel room that the beds were all messed, there's not clean towels. None of us are going to do that. We would have to all agree that the housekeeping staff in the hotel are some of the most important staff in the hotel. You can't even run up the rooms if you don't have a housekeeping staff. The housekeeping staff makes the least amount of money of everybody who works at a hotel. Some may say it's not fair. It may or may not be fair, I don't know if it's fair or not, I just know that that's the way it is. The key to making more money is not to whine about the fact that you're a housekeeping staff and you're not making as much money. The key is stop being housekeeping staff and go do something else. That's the key... Implementation, if you offer value in the implementation level, the resource that you use to make money is your muscles. You make use of your muscles to make money. Because, I'm going to have to do this part quickly, because the essence of money is spiritual, in order to earn more money you have to operate on a higher spiritual plane. Physicality is the opposite of spirituality. If you're using your muscles, a physical resource to make something to create, to earn something that's essence is spiritual, then no wonder you're having a hard time making money. I'm going to go to the next level. The next to the lowest level is called unification. These are not the people who do the things, these are the people who manage the people who do the things. You keep the housekeeping staff or you keep the work crew from killing each other, from stealing from the company, and from messing up the company's reputation. You manage people... The unification level, you use your management skills to make money. You will make more money than people who operate on the implementation level. On the implementation level, you're going to make on the low end. You're going to make about minimum wage on the low end. On the high end, you might make $80,000 if you work on Bentleys or Rolls Royce. When I take my Bentley to the shop, they charge me $215 an hour. They have to apy that mechanic probably I would guess $100 an hour. If you're a mechanic working on Rolls Royces, or Bentleys or even Mercedes probably, you might make $60,000 to $80,000 a year as an implement. Why? Because those people value getting their car fixed at a higher level. The next level is unification. Unification you use your management skills to make money. On the low end, you might make $40,000 a year, if you're a manager at Taco Bell. On the high end, you might $250,000 a year if you're middle manager of Lockheed Martin. ...It all depends on where you're using your unification skills. That's the second from the bottom level of value. We're talking about the potential to make a high five figures or low six figures on the unification level. But the next level- Steve Larsen: Sorry, I love also that you said in Funnel Hacking Live, you said, "Unification, the lie those people believe." Myron Golden: People believe, okay. Steve Larsen: Yeah, so good. When you said that my brain went nuts, sorry man. Myron Golden: I don't have yet the PowerPoint in front so I'm glad you reminded me that day. The lie that keep a people stuck on the implementation level, the lie they believe is that the key to success is hard work. They work harder at something that's a lower level of value. They don't get ahead and they think life has dealt them a bad hand. ...The reality is they just signed up for the wrong program. The next level is unification and on the unification level, the lie they believe that keeps them stuck is the key to success is more education so people going back to school and get another degree. A degree on top of the degree. They get to master the Greek. They get the Master's Degree, they get Doctor's degree and they can't even earn as much per year as they pay for their education. Mindblowing... Steve Larsen: It is mindblowing. I went nuts when you said that. Myron Golden: I don't have a college degree. I don't have a college degree. Steven, as far as income is concerned, on multiple occasions I've made multiple six figures in an hour. It almost doesn't even sound real. I'm not ... it doesn't make me wonderful. I figured out which level of value to work on and I just work in those levels. I do a little bit of implementation on my business but very little. I do a little unification in my business but very little. I operate predominantly on the top two levels. The second to the highest level of value, by the way, is a higher spiritual plane. You're saying that managing people is a higher spiritual, on a higher spiritual plane, but just going out and digging a hole. It requires a higher, that's why it earns more money. The next to the highest level of value. This is the third level from the top, I mean the second level from the top is called communication. This is the second highest level of value. The reason communication earns more money is because language is spiritual. Everything about language is spiritual. The only creatures that have language are spiritual creatures. I don't mean like parrots. Parrots can say words but they don't have language. A parent can say the word concept but has no concept of the word, what the word concept means. When I talk about having language, I'm talking about as a means of communicating a message. Language is ... communication is the second highest level of value. We see all throughout our society people who operate on this level. You're going to earn on the low end $100,000 a year, on a higher level, you might earn a hundred million dollars a year as a communicator. I'm talking about singers, I'm talking about politicians, I'm talking about talk show hosts. I'm talking about talk show hosts, I'm talking about authors, speakers, coached, seminar speaker, salespeople. All of these people operate on the level of called communication. When I say communication, I'm not talking about words that come from your mouth into somebody else's ears. I'm not talking about a conversation for the head. I'm talking about a message that moves the masses. I'm talking about having conversations that create cash flow. People are really horrible at conversation to create cash flow... It's really interesting, Steven...When I think about why people struggle in their presenting like people who are in sales. They've got something for sale, they want to sell it on the internet or they create an add and the ad doesn't convert. ...I can almost guarantee you the number one reason ads don't convert and offers don't convert above all over things, the number one reason, sales, messages don't convert is because they were selfish. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Myron Golden: What I mean selfish is, you're talking to your potential customer about you. If they don't care about you, you either talk to them about your product, you're talking to him about your opportunity. You're talking to them about your website, you're talking to him about your invention. You're talking to about your stuff and they don't care about your stuff at all, they only care about them. Until you have like the greatest quality of a very high performing salesperson, the most important quality, in my opinion or a high performing sales person is a high level of empathy. You have to be able to feel what other people were feeling while they're feeling. Anyway, communication, messages that move the masses, conversations that create cash flow. ...Then the highest level of value. By the way, the use your management skills in the implementation level, use your muscles on the implementation level. You use your management skills on therapy unification level. On a communication level, you use your mouth. Then we get to the highest level of value which is, drum roll please, Imagination. ...Imagination is the highest level of value that exists in the world. These were the people who came up with the ideas. We were just at Funnel Hacking Live a few weeks ago. My drove on to that Disney property and I thought to myself, "My goodness! This man had an imagination like nobody's- just that one Disney property that we are all. Just that one hotel, that one conversation center that we were on. It was like a small town. Steve Larsen: Awesome. Myron Golden: Only somebody would say, "Really, really powerful imagination could come up with something that's great. Steven, I did this at Funnel Hacking Live. I don't know if you remember that part or not. I said, "I'm going to name a company and I want you to tell me the first person that comes to mind. Do you remember me doing this? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Myron Golden: Then I said, "I'm going to name a company. I'm going to name the company, if you're listening to the podcast right now, will you say the first person's name that comes to mind. Apple, and everybody said- Steve Larsen: Steve Jobs. Myron Golden: Steve Jobs. I say that's fascinating. Why does everybody say Steve Jobs? Steve Jobs didn't invent the first Apple computer, Steve Wozniak did. When people think of the Apple computer, they don't think of Steve Wozniak, they think of Steve Jobs. Why? Because Steve Wozniak was an implementer and Steve Jobs was an imagineer. Steve Wozniak knew how to make it, Steve Jobs knew what Steve Wozniak had made... I'm going to tell you something. When you learn to use your imagination, when I say use your imagination, the resource that you use at this level is your mind. When you learn to use your mind at a higher level, it's going to create for you opportunities the like of which nothing else can touch. ...Now, the other resource that you use the highest level of value is your money. You use your mind and your money on the imagination level. When I talk about using your mind, I'm going to do this really quickly. There are a couple of things that you have to ... there are a couple of mind skills that you must master if you're going to create wealth. ...The first one you have to master is you master learning. In order for you to master learning, you have to first learn what learning is, what learning is not, and then learn how to learn. Steve Larsen: This is so good. Again, it's so good. I wrote all this down too. I'm a big Myron Golden fanboy. Myron Golden: I'm a big Steven Larsen fan too. We already have that conversation so you know. Here's the reality. Most people don't know the purpose of learning, like the stuff .. like school. The purpose of school is not learning. The educational system is not designed for people who are ... In fact, I believe that the educational, really, is one of the biggest hindrance in learning because they teach you that the purpose of learning is knowing. The purpose of learning is not knowing. In fact, knowing is the enemy of learning. In fact, if somebody attempts to teach you something that you think already know, you'll stop listening because you all say to yourself, "I know that already." Knowing is the enemy of learning... The purpose of learning, first you got to learn what the purpose of learning is. I'm going to tell you the purpose of learning and then I'm going to tell you how to learn. Okay? The purpose of learning is not knowing but the purpose of learning is mastery. I'm not going to say, the purpose of learning is mastery... Then, we're done. Two many teachers use words without defining those world and leave people hanging. I'm not going to do that. I'm going to define Mastery. Mastery is the ability to execute effortlessly without the use of conscious resources. Let me say that again. Steve Larsen: Wow! Myron Golden: Mastery is the ability to execute effortlessly without the use of conscious resources. What do I mean by that? I mean you've mastered, I know there's at least one thing in your life you've mastered. You Amy have mastered several but I know there's one thing you've completely mastered, requires no conscious resources. It's called tying your shoe. You can tie your shoe, have a conversation, and be holding something under your arm all at the same time. Why? Because you're not using any of your random access memory to tie your shoes. Why? Tying your shoes is in the cache. For computer people, you understand exactly. Cache, CACHE. ...When you get to the point where doing a webinar is in your cache, it doesn't require conscious resources. When you get to the point that the one thing, the three secrets on the stack is in your cache, then you've mastered it. Most people are far too content with subpar, unmastered skill sets. That's why like people think, "I'm overwhelmed because this is too much for me." No, the reason you're overwhelmed is because you never learned how to learn. What you do is you learn about something and you think that's the same as learning. You take this things that you've learned about and you attempt to implement it while you attempt to learn about something else and then you stack one unlearn thing on top of another unlearn thing on top of another unlearn thing, so you're stacking lack of clarity, on top of lack of clarity, on top of lack of clarity, until finally you feel like you can't breathe. I'm overwhelmed. ...The reason you're overwhelmed is because you have mastered any of those steps. Here's what I know. When you master one component of the thing that you are doing, and you don't add anything else to that until you've mastered that thing, now you'd learn another thing and you master that, now you got two, components master's on top of each other. You can do a webinar without using a conscious resources. I have been selling, I don't want to sound like I'm patting myself on the back but I've been selling for so long, for me, selling doesn't require any conscious effort at all. I can totally sell unconsciously. I can stand on stage, I can do a presentation, I can close, I can sell without any conscious resources. I can do a webinar, I'd close without any- I can do a strategy session, close somebody on a $50,000 or $100,000 high ticket offer without any conscious resources. Why? Because I've done it so many times that I've mastered the skills. Most people are so impatient they won't become a person of mastery. They can't do things masterfully so they don't get to have what only masters have. Steve Larsen: Interesting. You should pat yourself on the back, that's quite a talent. You married the process, you didn't sidestep or look for a short cut or look for an easy way out. You do it. Myron Golden: I used to look for shortcuts. You know what I found out about shortcuts? They take too long. Steve Larsen: They're actually longer. Myron Golden: They're a huge waste of time. I'm going to tell you something. People who get out of their car, they ate a candy bar, they get out of the car. They said, we'll I'd get that candy wrapper later. Right? Steve Larsen: Right. Myron Golden: It takes more time to get it later than it does to take it now. People who leave messes everywhere they go, they think, well, I'll get to it later. Later they get to it and guess what? It's a big mess that they have to take all this time to cleanup. They could have really done it as a ... I'm a little Geeky and a little work but I already know that so I've accepted that. Steve Larsen: Join the club, I'm right with you, right at home. Myron Golden: If I'm making food, if I'm making ... I like fried eggs and I eat fried eggs maybe three or four times a month. If I make fried eggs and turkey bacon and toast and breakfast potatoes from some leftover potatoes or something, if I make that breakfast, I will not eat one morsel until I put away every condiment that I used to make those eggs. I put away the cooking oil, the salt, the pepper, the garlic powder, I quashed the pants that I cooked it in. I dried the pants, put them away ... you say, "Don't let your food get cold." It doesn't get cold because I'm putting stuff away as I'm using it. When I'm done, that's given the ability to save so much time. Wheat happens, the reason I'm talking about cooking it's because it's just what? How you do anything is how you do everything? If you are going to always get to it later, that's exactly how you live your business life and you think, "I'll master it later, I'll master it later I'll masters it later. What happens if, you have never network mastered. You end up being just a person who's average and ordinary and you wonder why you never get great . you never get the great results because you've never become the great person who does the great things. Master one thing at a time... The other resource you use at the highest level is your money. Let me talk about, can I talk about the other learning thing? I know I've been going ranting forever and ever. Steve Larsen: I'm loving it. This is great. I'm afraid I'll say something it'll take you out of your flow. I'm not saying anything. Myron Golden: The other thing that we have to learn to use our mind for after we learned to use our mind for learning, we have to learn to use our mind to harness our superpower. Every human being like whose of normal mental capacity has a superpower that if you don't learn to harness and use it for your own good and for the good of others, the machine, a cultural hypnotic societal mechanism also know as the matrix, the machine, the powers that be, whatever you want to call it. That thing is going to use your superpower against you. I'm going to tell, I believe that the biggest things holding people back in their lives is the very thing that could catapult them for, and that is their superpower. They've been programmed all their life to use their own superpower against themselves. I'm going to tell, now that I've talked the superpower, I'm going to tell you what it is. Are you ready? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Writing it down. Myron Golden: It's called expectations. Expectation is your greatest superpower. Here's the challenge though. Expectation manifests itself into mental manifestations and two, emotional manifestations. Mental manifestation number one is called faith. Mental manifestation number two is called doubt. The mental manifestation of faith and doubt are a big deal because ... but those are concepts. One of the things that I've learned and am learning is that people don't do the things they know how to do, people do therapy things they feel like doing. Most people don't know how to make themselves do you thing, feel like doing the things that are in their own best interest. What I just said right there, that's a gold mine. If you can learn to make yourself feel like doing the things that are in your own best interest, it will change your life for the rest of your life. For instance, people will say, "Steven, I've got a procrastination problem." I'm going to argue. People will say, "Steven, I've got a procrastination problem. I'm going to argue but I don't like to argue but I'm going to argue right now. There's not a single solitary human being on planet Earth that has a procrastination problem. That's a bold statement, right? Steve Larsen: Yeah it is. Myron Golden: The reason I say that is because I recognize procrastination for what it is. It is not a problem, it is a symptom of a problem. It's a symptom of the emotional effect of your superpower, expectation being used against you. I'm going to tell you what that is. It's called anxiety. Procrastination is always the result of anxiety. Notice I didn't say it sometimes a result of anxiety. I know I'm speaking in absolute and that's because I'm absolutely certain of... Steve Larsen: It's on purpose everyone. Myron Golden: Yes, I know. Oh no, but you don't understand. The reason I put off working out is because I don't have now. The reason you put off working out is because you have more anxiety about working out than you do about having a heart attack. Period. ...The expectation, the feeling that it manifest self in and our lives, that steals all of our dreams is anxiety. Anxiety is the thief of all your dreams. When expectation manifests itself as a positive feeling, that positive feeling is called Anticipation. One of the things that I teach people to do when I'm coaching them, and I'm helping them break through the thing that's holding them back. I teach them how to replace the anxious apprehension of the outcome the don't desire with a joyful anticipation of the outcome they do desire. That will always, without exception, like there are no exceptions where I'm talking about, that we'll always help a person to take the action they desire to take. We've been programmed to believe or doubt and doubt our beliefs. We have to reprogram ourselves to believe our beliefs and doubt our doubts. Steve Larsen: I love that because it seems like one of this was a thought that gets tossed around which I have a hard time with is, well, if you're not doing something in life it just means you haven't felt enough pain around it. ...I was like, "whoa! Instead if we flip that around and say, let's find the things that we are in ... and switch that, foot that into anticipation, that's so much more positive than let's go to a place of pain all the time to get something done. Myron Golden: Pain can sometimes cause people to move but that's because that now they finally have anxiety about the negative result about not taking action. That's all that is... One of the things that I am learning to do, notice I didn't say I've learned to do, I do it pretty well most of the time but I don't do it all the way, but it's something that I do remind when I catch myself not doing, I remind myself too. That is to never give any energy at all to outcomes that are undesirable to me. Most people give most of their energy to undesirable outcomes and then they wonder why they have all this junk in their life that they don't desire. Steve Larsen: Gave it attention. Myron Golden: That's right. Where attention goes, intention follows. Anyway, that's my rant on the highest level of value. If you learn to use your superpower of expectation, like you can make yourself believe anything is possible. The biggest sale that I ever made like one sell to one person Steven, the biggest sale I ever made was a $400,000 sale. Steve Larsen: Wow, Myron Golden: I made that sale to a guy I met that day I had never seen him before in my life. I met him that day. We talked, had lunch, we connected, we thought, "Okay, we'll do some business in the future." Then I thought to myself, "Why wait till the future? Why don't I just make him an offer now? I made him an offer for $400,000. In a big company, and they needed some help with their marketing, and I came up with an idea that could help a little marketing. This offer that I made them was an offer for $400,000 and it was $200,000 profit for me in my pocket. Steve Larsen: Wow. Myron Golden: I made the offer and I say, it's only $200,000 down and $200,000 in delivery. You know what he said to me when I made the offer? He said, "You'd do that for us?" As I thought to myself, "Just as sure as you write that check." Steve Larsen: Thought I was, should've gone higher. Myron Golden: Exactly. He picks up his phone he calls his accounting department. He says, "Bring me a check for $200,000". He says, "Do you want it made out to you? Do you want to make it out to your company?" Make it out to my company. Then i called my assistant, had her fax me a purchase order and we closed that deal on the spot. Steve Larsen: Wow, that's incredible. Myron Golden: That was because I didn't allow myself to talk myself out of making an offer just because I just met this guy today. I only gave him like a 15-minute presentation with no flip chart, no brochures, no nothing just told him what I could do for him. He's like, "I'll take that deal." My expectation was ... let me talk about that for a hot second. My expectation is that when I create an offer people will buy it. If I'm talking to you Steven, even though I expect you to buy it I am not attached to you buying it. I will do nothing whatsoever, I will not use any of my powers to convince you to buy it. But I will use all of my powers to persuade you to buy it. Just thought I threw that out there. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I'm just writing it. I'm just writing everything. Myron Golden: To clarify, for those of you who were saying, "Didn't he just say he's not going to use any of his powers?" And then he say he's going, I said, "I'm not going to use any of my powers to convince people to buy it. ...I'm going to use all of my powers to persuade them to buy it. Most people don't understand that there's a ... not only is there a difference between convincing and persuading. Convincing and persuading are exact opposites of each other. Steve Larsen: Interesting. I never thought of that before, that they're opposites. Myron Golden: When you convince somebody to do something you're attempting to get them to do something you desire them to do for your reasons. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Myron Golden: But when you persuade somebody you are helping them come to a conclusion that you've already come to for their own reasons. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Myron Golden: I don't use any of my power whatsoever to convince anybody. I'll never try to talk to somebody into buying something from me. In fact, if somebody gives me a little resistance, like does anybody ever ask you like if you're closing, why should I buy this from you? People say that in sales, right Steven? Steve Larsen: Totally. Myron Golden: Ask me that question. Steve Larsen: I don't know if I should get this from you, Myron. Myron Golden: Then you probably shouldn't. Steve Larsen: I love it. I do something similar now, it's so nice. Myron Golden: If you don't instantly recognize that what I have can help you, you should not get it from me. In fact, you should go buy something from somebody else and see if it works and I hope it does. If you've got any doubt at all, I'm not your dude. Steve Larsen: Right. Myron Golden: By the way, that's not a ploy. I am so not ... I already know if somebody's going to buy it. I also know that it don't have to be you. I know that it would be a blessing in your life, in your family's life to have the privilege of working with me. I don't mean that in an arrogant way, I just mean I know what I'm doing. Steve Larsen: Right. Myron Golden: If you can't see that, then congratulations, you get to stay on the search a little while. What that does is that frees me from needing them to need me. I am a leader of people, I am not a needer of people. I will lead someone to buy but I will never need someone to buy. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Those are like side ... what's the word? It's like a by product of staying in the game long enough to gain the confidence to have that expectation. Myron Golden: Absolutely. I know that somebody's going to buy this that's why I don't need it to be you. Maybe you've got somebody who's going to come along and change your life for the better and teach you how to create wealth and maybe you don't. I don't know. You are not my best chance. I don't say this to people but this is what I'm thinking when I'm a one on one selling situation. You are not my best chance at making a sale but I am your best chance of creating wealth. What are you going to do about it? Steve Larsen: That's great. It gives them a chance to flex their own agency. Myron Golden: Exactly. Now, they can't say, "because you talked me into", I didn't talk to you in anything, not me, I don't do that. That is not a game I participate in. Steve Larsen: I want to thank you for this. Before we jump out here, what would you say to people, I don't know, who are in the thick of it, they're still in the, they're still lashing through the learning curve. I've often learned that especially from listening to guys like you and my own experience, this little game is really a relationship with yourself, kind of a side story. It's just some kind of piece of advice as well you could give to someone who's in the thick of it. They're still learning to have that vision, that grand vision. Myron Golden: Yes. Here's what I would say. The struggle is not real, it's imagined. Steve Larsen: That just made the quote wall. Myron Golden: What do I mean by that? People say the struggle is real. The struggle is not real, the struggle is imagined. You could take the very thing that you're struggling with and turn it into a game and make it fun. To me, selling is like a game. It's like the whole business is like a game. If you're in the thick of it, learn the rules of the game, master the moves of the game, and become a winner of the game, and stop convincing yourself that it's hard. The things that's hard about business is becoming the person who can do the thing. Steve Larsen: Whether or not you are that person yet, that's fascinating. Whether or not you're the person yet. Myron Golden: If you're not that person, become that person and be cool with becoming. Be cool with all. The other thing that I didn't tell you that I learned from Tom Hopkins, the third thing I never told so it just brought me back to that. He said, "You got to learn to love no." Steve Larsen: I'm writing it down. Myron Golden: Learn to love no. Steve Larsen: That's true, learn to love no. Myron Golden: One of the things that I created in my training back in the days when I used to do a lot of one on one selling was a fast no is better than a slow yes and a hundred percent better than a forever maybe. Steve Larsen: That's so true. Myron Golden: Get people to get off the fence. The reason you're struggling is because you want to get off the fence on the yes side. You got to get over your need of needing them. You got to stop needing people to need you. You just got to go ahead with people and say, "Look, do it or don't do it, I don't care. This is where the train's going. ...Get on the train or miss the train. Be sure not to get run over by the train. Stay off the track." I don't want people to think I'm mean though because I'm a really nice guy. Business is like, you got to have a level of conviction if you're going to be a business owner. Pretend to believe the stuff, you got to believe it. Steve Larsen: My product's good, I guess. That's not true. That's not how it works. Myron Golden: Exactly. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Myron, I appreciate it. This has been huge. You call your business Skillionnaire and clearly you are. Where can people go to follow you, to get your stuff, buy everything you have, which everybody should by the way. Myron Golden: You know what, can I start by giving people something free and the only place I have, the only place I have it is on a website that I put up for Funnel hacking Live. I've got a video on procrastination, on how to overcome procrastination and three videos on how the law of attraction really works, they're going to blow your mind. They're mindblowing. ...If you think you know something about it, it's nothing you've heard. If they will go myrongoldenconsulting.com/fhl2018. If they go there, they put their name and email just send, they'll get the three videos for free. Then, they'll get emails from me now and then. If they want to follow me on Facebook, I'm TheMyronGolden. I think I'm TheMyronGolden on Instagram too. I think it's the same time. Steve Larsen: I think you are, yeah. Myron Golden: It might be Myron Golden. If you want to follow me there, those are good places to go. If you want to get a free of my book just pay shipping, go to trashmantocashman.com. Those are a couple of places you can go. Start with the free stuff to see if you like me. You might just think you like because Steven like alley-oop me with all these fun questions. Go get the free stuff before you buy something. Make sure you really like me, you just don't think you like me. Steve Larsen: I'm a huge fan. Also it's myrongoldenconsulting.com/fhl2018. Awesome. Thank you so much Myron, appreciate it, this has been very, very helpful. Thanks for going a little longer than I think we talked right even to. Myron Golden: No worries. Steve Larsen: Fun to have you in flow. Myron Golden: It was fun, it was fun. Wow, we went for a long time did we? Steve Larsen: We did. I didn't even realize that actually. Myron Golden: I didn't either I was looking at my clock and I was, "Woo!" We got some videos to shoot today so that's good. All good, man. Steve Larsen: We appreciate it, thank you so much. Hey, thanks for listening. The most common question I get is Steve, will you look at my funnel? Of course. Whether you want me to coach you, give some handholding and guidance during your funnel build, or simply review the one you have, head over to coachmesteve.com and book your session now. Myron Golden: I got some pretty cool millionaire formulas that are pretty epic. Steve Larsen: Yeah. I'm actually very excited to hear more about them. I'm trying not to dive into what I want to say in the actual show because what you taught at Funnel Hacking Live was so good. Myron Golden: Really? Thank you. Steve Larsen: I ran home and taught my wife immediately. Myron Golden: Wow, that's awesome, that's awesome. I'm glad it was helpful for you, bro. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Myron Golden: That's why we do what we do. Steve Larsen: Thank you, thank you. Myron Golden: I love your podcast too, by the way. Steve Larsen: Oh yeah, you listen? Myron Golden: Yeah, I do. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Myron Golden: In fact, I need to leave you a review. You'll know it's me because it's going to start with Esteban. Yeah, I'm going to tell you, when I came to the Funnel Hackathon, you changed my life seriously. I'm not just saying that. I'm not a workaholic like a lot of people in the inner circle, at least I haven't been. I guess I am now that I signed up for this too comical act. I'm more chillionaire. I'm 57, I'll be 57 next month so I've worked hard for a very long time and I don't really need to make more money. You get to a certain point and more money is like it's totally nebulous. I like living my life. The reason I decided to become rich is so that I could have my time freedom so I could have two things, more time and then choose what I do with that time. I wasn't really a workaholic. When you talked about the funnels ... I was using ClickFunnels but I wasn't like Russ talks about, "All you want to do in your spare time is build funnels?" I could think of a lot of stuff I want to do in my spare time. Building a funnel ain't even on the list. When you taught about, you need three things. ...You need the big domino, the one thing, the three secrets and the stack. I'm like, "See, I like that. That's like boiled down." I like boiled down. I didn't get lost to the details when you did that. I said, "You know what? I can do that." I took Russell's Perfect Webinar script and I turned it into an outline and that's how I build all my stuff now. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Myron Golden: Based on one thing, three secrets, stack. Bro, I can do that. Steve Larsen: Right. Myron Golden: Shoot. Man, you must got me confused with the other Myron Golden, I can do that. ...Anyway, that helped me tremendously because a lot of the details like are just ... they're just grueling for me because some because somewhat I already know and do intuitively because I've been doing this for a long time, and some of this just because, if I don't see where it's going, the details to me, if I can't see the big picture, the details to me don't matter. I can't process them. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I get lost. Myron Golden: You too? Steve Larsen: I get lost in them 100%. Myron Golden: If I feel like I'm teaching somebody something ... my gift is pastor teacher. I like to teach people like they're make and do better if they knew better. People could do better if they knew better. Steve Larsen: That's a good t-shirt right there. That's the next ClickFunnels t-shirt. I think that's one reason I've been so drawn to following is I'm learning that about myself. I feel alive, I feel aflow, I feel like I can help people most. For some reason, teaching on stage, it's my. Myron Golden: You already know I'm not a workaholic, I'm a chillionaire so I'm not a workaholic, but I love teaching. I breathe it. When I learn something I'm like, "This is so cool. Anybody should know this." Anyway, I don't mean to get all Myronesque on you. I didn't mean to go all soapbox [inaudible 01:04:29]. It is my nature. Steve Larsen: I love it. Myron Golden: The name of my company is Skillionnaire Enterprises, Inc. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I wrote that down when you said it at Funnel Hacking Live, I was like, "That's awesome." Myron Golden: Got to have the skills if you want to be a millionaire. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I'm taking notes like crazy as you say stuff. Myron Golden: That's hilarious. Steve Larsen: I always do. I got a full, I got a lot on you from Funnel Hacking Live. Myron Golden: That's funny. I'm glad it was helpful, bro. You helped me. Teamwork makes the dream work. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. I'm all for that. Myron Golden: Me too. Steve Larsen: Awesome, I'll do my little intro here and we'll go ahead and we'll get started.

Steve Larsen: All right. Hey, welcome everyone. Today I am super excited; I have a very special guest who's very near and dear to me actually. I have been looking forward to this actually for several weeks; ever since we set it up. Everyone, this is Becky. Becky, say hi. Becky: Hi, everyone. Steve Larsen: Really though, Becky has been very influential to me, and I don't know that I've told you this which makes me feel even worse, but I actually feel like you were very influential on me being in the position that I'm in right now. Becky: Oh, wow. Thank you. Steve Larsen: Yeah, absolutely. If it's all right, I'd like to tell that story because it was a moment of high drama for me, you know what I mean? We always talking to people when they're in a life transition period, and that's kind of what I was in when you and I met. I was in college, obviously. I was about to graduate, literally the week before we met at Russel's last event, the Funnel Hacker event. I was about to go over and work for this guy in Florida. I knew it would be good, but I wasn't totally stoked. I remember at the event Russel had just pitched the whole certification event and I had a little prayer in my heart. I was like, "God, I feel like I should do this," and then ... I can't even remember what I stopped by and asked you. Do you remember that? Becky: I think you just asked me about the certification and kind of what I had talked about. A few of the certification partners had talked a little bit about what I meant to me and I had mentioned that it really meant a lot to me to be able to be home with my kids and work with people who I believed in and who I [crosstalk 00:02:20] make a different. Steve Larsen: Yeah, absolutely. I must've had a freaked out look on my face or something like that because I remember the first thing you said to me is, "Do you just need to go talk?" I was like, "Sure, I guess I do." I didn't realize that I ... I don't know. Anyways, so we stepped out of the whole meeting and you started just answering questions for me and it was awesome and that led me to apply not just for certification, but to work at ClickFunnels, and that's literally why I'm sitting in Russel's office right now I think. It really ... Everyone listening, Becky is amazing. Becky: Thank you. I appreciate that. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I've just been very excited for this. It's fun to interview everyone, but I was like, "Oh, I've got to interview Becky. Becky's been awesome." Throughout the rest of the event you were texting me and you were like, "Hey, just following up with you. Have you been doing all your stuff?" I was like, "Man! Normal people don't do this, that's awesome." Anyways, you've been working on a lot of funnels, obviously. You've been doing this as a certified partner especially for how long? A year and a half? Becky: Yes. I signed up for the certification at the first Funnel Hacking Live in May of 2015, and I've been working with ClickFunnels since it was in beta, so 2 and a half years. Steve Larsen: Oh, awesome. How'd you get into it overall? How'd you get into funnels? Becky: I really just kind of fell into it. Some of my clients had been using different things and we were piecing it together. The whole story about piecing all these different things together. I'd been actually doing funnels without the name "funnels" for years and years just trying to get people in and build that relationship. Then a client of mine went to one of Russel's events or seminars and he said, "Hey, I really wanna try this. Let's check it out." From there we just kind of jumped on. Even after I stopped working with him, when he went to travel, I was hooked; completely jumped on board. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Obviously ClickFunnels' beta version versus what it is now is very different. Becky: Yes, very very different. It was much clunkier, you didn't have a lot of the drag and drop capabilities, you didn't have a lot of the editing capabilities. It was still better than anything out there, but a far cry from what it is now with the amazing capabilities that it has to drag and drop and edit and customize. I'm really excited with the changes that are coming this summer, too. That's going to be even more cool. Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah. It's going to be cool. For sure. Was it because you'd already been kind of doing it that led you to be a certified partner and go through that whole gate also? Becky: Absolutely. Because I already had that experience, I already had the knowledge, I was already using ClickFunnels about 60% with my clients at the time, if not more. Just a few of the benefits of becoming certified were enough to tell me that it was really a great thing to do, and in the process i developed this whole new family of partners and colleagues and friends who've supported and helped and it's just been really amazing to have that group of people to support me in growing my business and helping people. Steve Larsen: I remember that's one of the things you had mentioned to me when I was asking questions about it, is just how big the network is when you jump into that boat. I've actually really felt that. It's amazing. I know a lot of people and they're all amazing. I went through 9 business partners in the last year and a half and they were awesome, but I moved on for certain reasons. Everyone I've been meeting is just ... They're all A-players. Becky: Absolutely. Absolutely. They say that you draw the people toward you that you need, and I really believe that, particular with this group of people because obviously there's people in this realm who are not the caliber that you and I have met, but somehow we've drawn to us the type of people who we need and who are amazing to work with and supportive and ethical and just not any of the negativities that maybe you've experienced before or I have or that you've seen out there. It's just been a great group of people who are willing to make referrals and help out and answer questions. Steve Larsen: Yeah, absolutely. It's not to say that everyone that everyone that I ever worked with in the past has not been good, because especially a few of them, they knock the socks off of what they do, but it's the ... I don't know what it is. It's fantastic, though. It's a cool community that I've never experienced. Becky: It really is. Steve Larsen: It's kind of funny because whenever you see ads or we all see sales video [headers 00:07:38] or we all see whatever it is. We all like to kind of puff our chest out and say, "This is what I've done and it's amazing and I'm making this much money," but beneath it all there's usually this lifetime of struggle and this lifetime worth of just going against odds that no one else would; a lot of courage and stuff like that. No doubt I'm sure you're the same with that. I was wondering, what are some of the issues you've had with some of the funnels that are now successful that may not have been in the past? Becky: It's funny that you ask that because I've been working recently on one that I feel like it's just a poster child. It's so cool when everything meshes and it just clicks. I didn't really start to feel success with this until I kind of was willing to have my own voice to say who I was and use my personality as opposed to try to be a cookie cutter with other people. That's particular what has made this particular funnel with Alex [Sharfon 00:08:52], and he said that I could definitely use him as an example. Steve Larsen: Do a little name drop. That's awesome. Becky: Yes. It's really cool because he has had so many successes in the past and these particular funnels were successful, but they weren't having the type of reach and success that he had hoped for and that he really wanted. You and I met him in San Diego and he just speaks so well to entrepreneurs especially. When he reached out to me and I went up to his office to work with their [inaudible 00:09:27] for an entire day, the first thing that I noticed was that what was in his funnels didn't resonate with him. It didn't have the same language and personality that he has in all of the things that he does through his podcast and his Facebook lives and even just his posts and everything that I've seen from him as well as the presentation you gave. Steve Larsen: That's interesting. You're saying match the personality with the funnel? Becky: Exactly. What we did was we went in and we basically stripped out a lot of the industry speak types of things where you might have these specific phrases or you might have these things that other people have used with great success with different markets, but it didn't fit him and his market. We really made the wording match what his message was and the people that he wanted to reach and the fact that he wanted to build a long-term client relationship with the people that he was reaching out to. He wasn't looking for a sale, he was looking for that relationship. Steve Larsen: How did you create that? You just basically got the whole funnel, or just changed verbiage? How do you match someone's personality and funnel? I've never thought about that. That makes sense, though. Becky: Yeah, it really does make a big difference. For him, the very first things we did were take out some of the language and the headlines. We focused on the headlines first because obviously that grabs your attention, and we changed the wording where it was going to reach people. We're always saying to touch people's pain points, and so that's really what tried to do, but in a way that matched his message. Then we went through and we looked at: Are we really showing people how much value they're going to get from listening to one of Alex's webinars or one of his products, and we focused on all the ways that this was going to really change their lives. I don't use that phrase loosely when I come to his particular work, but you and I know it really did. Steve Larsen: Oh, yeah. Becky: I do this with all of my clients. How is it going to change their lives? I have an iron man client, and what we focused on was: How is this training going to make these people's lives better? Focus on that messaging in a way that sounded just like she speaks. We looked at the headlines, we looked at what we were offering, and we took out a lot of the things that are purely sales-driven. Like I said, a lot of my clients are trying to build a relationship, so anything that felt too pushy ... Maybe some of the phrases and graphics that were really about sales ... For these type of people we took out so that they could start to build that relationship and let their audience know that they're trying to build a relationship and not just sell them a product. Steve Larsen: That's counter-intuitive to what most people do when they're selling. Does that mean you switch a lot of the things to a lot of soft closes instead of a hard- ... Becky: Yup. Steve Larsen: Okay, interesting. Becky: Absolutely. We did a lot of soft sell. Any time that you're not just about a product, but you're about a relationship, that's so important to look at. Are you pushing too hard to build that relationship and turning people off? This is something that the feedback that I actually got was they had had a lot of unsubscribes in the past 6 weeks, 2 months. Once they had started this particular method of marketing because it didn't resonate with what they were trying to do. Steve Larsen: Did you conduct a lot of interviews and things like that to understand his market better, or was he able to pick out, "Hey, that's not how I would say that." How did you identify what that is since it's matching him? Becky: Before I went in there, I had looked at a lot of his unscripted work: The things he was doing on Facebook, what he was doing on Facebook live, I watched 2 of his presentations, the live one at San Diego and then the video one, and I do that type of background with my clients in trying to get inside their head exactly the same way they're trying to get inside their audiences to really understand them better and really understand what they're trying to do for their audience and how they can do it better. Steve Larsen: Interesting. You watch your clients' social profiles. I never thought about that. That's clever, though. Becky: [crosstalk 00:14:15]. When their business is reaching out to people on social, then yes I do. It sounds very stalker-ish, and I don't mean it that way at all. Steve Larsen: We'll call it research. Becky: Yeah, it really is. For instance, my iron man client, she had been on several interviews, she had done things outside of social media, so watching her there was very helpful. If I have the opportunity, then I will talk to some of her clients or my client's clients as well to get that better feedback for how we can better serve them. In a nutshell, it really all boils down to being authentic and finding out what the real message is. Sometimes that takes a little bit of background, sometimes it takes a little bit of research, or really getting to know the person who is trying to reach out to their audience, but it's so worth it because in the end you are promoting a community and not just a bunch of sales. Like I said before, when I was at Funnel Hacking Live, that's part of the way that you help people change the world is helping them reach their audience. Steve Larsen: Interesting. You're basically going through and you're scraping out all the techno babble and stuff that doesn't make you human; the things that you and I would not normally say in a conversation with each other, and that's awesome. Becky: Exactly. The things that just sound too [canned 00:15:46] that maybe have been said too often or don't fit. You can't fit your particular personality inside someone else's funnel, just like you can't fit inside someone else's shoes or clothing. You just have to make it your own. Steve Larsen: I remember on SalesFunnelBroker.com, the site I built and put up, it was kind of funny because the moment I watched it someone was making fun of it. One my buddies, he was like, "You have yourself in a shirt and tie on the front." I said, "Yeah." He said, "No one looks at you like a shirt and a tie guy." I was like, "You know what? That's good, because I don't either." He's like, "Yeah, if you scroll down you've got a big picture of you being all goofy pointing at your shirt in a black and white. That's more what everyone looks at you as." I said, "Yeah, I know, I just thought I should toss that in there." It makes sense, though. It's not my personality, I probably shouldn't have that on my front page. Becky: Exactly. Especially people who know you, they understand what you're really like and we just can't fit inside someone else's funnel or someone else's marketing because we need to reach out to our audiences in our own voice and be authentic and sometimes share a little bit of our vulnerability and our background so that they know that we're real and we've been through the same types of growth problems that they have. Steve Larsen: Yeah, I am a brass tax really intense guy, everyone. You've just got to watch out for me. I will rip your head off. Becky: I totally get that about you. I totally get it. Steve Larsen: Yeah, most people do. They tremble in fear. Becky: Absolutely. Steve Larsen: Do you mind kind of walking us through the funnel that you've built or fixed with Alex? Is that okay? Just from your perspective I thought it'd be kind of cool to hear, "Hey, on the first page he was getting this percent kind of conversion, but after the tweaks ..." Are you allowed to share that kind of stuff? Becky: Yes, I actually asked him and he gave me the permission to do so. [crosstalk 00:17:48] Steve Larsen: Awesome. Becky: His funnel starts with a free book download, and it's a really impressive book. The people who were going to it were actually warm traffic, so his numbers should have been really high, but they were in the teens and nobody could quite figure out why he was getting 15, 16, 17%. He actually had several funnels for different reasons, but all that were identical and were all for the free book download, but none of them were converting it higher than 30%. Most of his traffic was warm and these people really liked him, so the first thing we did was look at: How are they drawing people in? It was just very simple; there was the title and there was a very very long description. We shortened that up and we made it a little bit more true to his personality. The other thing that we did was they were asking for about I think 6 pieces of information and we stripped that down to 3. Those particular numbers more than doubled after we made those changes. Steve Larsen: You cleaned up the copy and then basically ... I call it funnel friction. He had too much funnel friction; he had to release it a little bit before ... Becky: Right, we just stripped it down a little bit and made it simpler so that people didn't have to read quite so much, but the impressive thing was going from the second page where they would get the "Thank you for downloading" onto looking at another video. This part that we completely gutted. We took out all the headlines, we took out the slide deck video, we took out the offer- ... Steve Larsen: On the thank you page? Becky: On the thank you page. There was an offer for an upsell and people were even clicking to find out more about it. Those numbers were I believe right around 10%, so really really bad, especially for him for [inaudible 00:20:03]. We changed it over to be just a video thanking them, telling them what the book was going to give for them, and offering the opportunity to move on with the training with an additional video and more training. Steve Larsen: Kind of just like a soft offer but not even an offer; you're just asking them to progress clicking. Becky: Exactly. The thing that I said to them before they shot the video was, "You are not selling to people. You are offering them the opportunity to continue on this journey with what they've started to learn, and you're going to help them even more." Steve Larsen: Interesting. Becky: Once he did that, the clip throughs to the third page went up 6 times. Steve Larsen: What?! 60%?! Holy smokes! Becky: Yes, it was pretty phenomenal. It was pretty phenomenal because that was the most heavily salesy page of [crosstalk 00:21:04] marketing. Steve Larsen: Wow. Becky: It was really cool to see that change, that by really dialing into his personality, stripping out everything else, and just giving them the opportunity to continue on, because we weren't going from sales page to sales page the first time and then taking out the sales the second time. The funnel was the same, it was just the messaging that was different. We had the same offer that they could go on to watch this video and get more training, took out all the salesiness. That was very cool to see that stripping that down, making it really about helping made that dramatic of a change. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Becky: Thank you. Yeah, that was really cool to see. Then on the next step of his funnel which was actually his funnel stack because they were presented this offer a little bit later; it wasn't immediate. What we did was we took the sales page and we stripped out a lot of the pushiness on that one as well and we told them all the ways that this was going to benefit them and all of the things that they could do in order to continue to improve their life, which is his theme as an entrepreneur. By really telling the audience about what they were going to get and the changes they were going to make before we promoted what the course was going to do, those sales doubled. Steve Larsen: Was that an e-course, then? A membership area it promotes? Becky: Yes. It was an e-course; a membership area, it had I think 2 payments. It's within a long-term continuity type of thing, but the offer was the same, the price was the same. The difference was that we added a little bit of graphics so that it wasn't real plain and boring ... The graphics of Alex and of the course ... We talked about the changes that it was going to make and then down next to the order form is where we labeled out the ABC of what it was going to offer. When we went in, I believe it was about 8 days after we made those changes, it was so exciting to see that those sales numbers had doubled. Steve Larsen: That's fantastic. I'm a big fan of Perry Belcher, and one of the things that he talks about is how when you start to do a sales letter, or anything really, everyone comes into these scenarios having different beliefs: "Hey, I can do this," or "Hey, I can't do this," or "I believe I won't be able to because of my past and it's very very hard to get someone to change their beliefs. What a sales person's job is is truly more about suspending people's beliefs long enough for them to purchase, which is the greatest chance of them changing their beliefs in the long run anyways. I think it's interesting that you said in the sales page you didn't put the ABC's of the offer out until way at the bottom and the whole way from the top down to that point, you're really just pre-framing them to suspend their belief with time. Time is the biggest way ever to suspend beliefs. If they're out going from the top of the page down to the bottom, there's more time involved there; more stuff to help them suspend beliefs so that at the end, "Okay, ABC, here's 2 payment plans," and you don't pitch until the end. That's amazing. Becky: Definitely. The top was really about the changes that it would make and it was bullet points. There were very few paragraphs; it was all bullet point to attract the attention and again, to figure out how to help these people realize that they're continuing on a journey and that this is going to help them improve their business, their life, whatever the case may be that you are working on. It's about that transformation. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. That doubled the sales right there. Becky: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Steve Larsen: Holy cow. People get stoked in the stock market when they have like a 10% gain, and you're like, "Nope, let's double it." Becky: It was very very cool to see. The really cool thing about this particular funnel was that the results were so immediate and changes were very obvious. It was very simply, "We are making this for your voice. What would you normally say?", and these are the results. I've only been working with him for I think about 6 weeks. Maybe a little bit more; maybe 2 months, and we've seen these types of changes. If you can get these types of changes quickly when you're really dialing in and he knows his audience, and that's what's really fun about working with clients who are established, is that they've done the background on their audience and they know their message, so you can really help them transform what they're saying just by being more authentic. When you're starting from scratch, it's so nice to know that these results are possible. Steve Larsen: My wife always calls that ... Instead of authentic, she just calls it "being real". We'll be talking to someone and she'll be like, "That guy was the most real guy I've ever heard." I used to tease her and be like, "He was real before that." I get what you're saying, though. Becky: Being authentic is very much a marketing term, but just be true to who you are and be real in your messaging and don't try to hide behind a lot of things. Steve Larsen: Are you allowed to tell a little bit about the membership area also and what he's done in there? Becky: His membership area is phenomenal. He took pieces from a 2 day workshop that he did a few months ago and separated it out and added tools that you can download. Some of it's very focused on yourself and growing into the entrepreneur, the person that you're really meant to be. Some of it is focused on growing your business and some of it is focused on growing your business even more with a team. The pieces that he has and the tools that he's put together just really show how you can take a massive amount of information and break it down via a continuity or a membership area or things like that and offer it to people in bite sized pieces in a way that they don't get overwhelmed so that they can get the most out of what you're doing. Steve Larsen: What I'm curious about is: How did you determine, besides in the the beginning of the funnel and watching the conversions as you kind of worked down, but how did you even figure out that it was overwhelm that people were feeling? Becky: Because I was overwhelmed when I looked at it. I really have to be honest. When I looked at it, I just felt super uncomfortable because it was that pushy. I really believe that we are connected with people for a reason, that God puts people in our path for a reason, and I felt like when I had met him originally that I had so much to learn. Then when I was reading his stuff, I was just very put off. That's part of the reason why the research does so well is kind of getting to know their personality; you can tell if it's congruent with what you're trying to do when you look at someone's funnel. Steve Larsen: Wow. Okay. I'm just thinking. I've been taking notes. I've got a full page of notes of things you've said. I've actually drawn out the whole funnel all the way from the back, all the lessons, I number them out. That's cool. Stu Mclaren, I'm sure you've heard the name. Becky: Yup. Steve Larsen: Stu's the man, and he loves membership sites; that's kind of his mojo there. I heard him say once that overwhelm is actually the number one reason someone cancels from a membership site. They get in and there's too much stuff. People will go in and they're like, "I don't even know where to start." That's interesting that that's what you said it was. Becky: Absolutely. It was the same thing when I looked at his funnels. They had already broken things down on the membership size and had it in bite size pieces, so now what we're working on is just making it more user friendly in that membership area because still we want to make the user experience flow. Again, that's why it's so important to get to know the person that you're working with and do a little bit of research on who's following them and the types of people that they're going to resonate with. If he were, let's say one of these people who was hard-hitting and really promoting hard to corporate men and that type of thing, I honestly would step back and say, "I am not the best person to do your marketing because I have no idea what your message is from a personal standpoint. That's like what I said before: I really try to work with people that I connect with and who I can help make a difference. If I am nowhere in the realm of your target market, then in order for me to really understand what you're trying to say, I'm going to have to do way more research with the people that you're trying to talk to. If you're in that space where you're working with someone who they are not targeting, then that's when the research is really important. Steve Larsen: You made all these changes to the funnel itself, I mean 2x, 6x, 2x ... I'm just looking down all the numbers: 16 to 32, 10 to- ... It's amazing looking at all of it. In that process, you said that he had been sending warm traffic. Did you guys change the traffic source at all? Becky: No change in the traffic source. In the process, we did change the messaging in the e-mails as well. Steve Larsen: Oh, really? Okay. Becky: We took out some of that hard-hitting sales. It was more his conversational personality, it was an invitation and not pushiness, but he didn't change his ads, he didn't change what he was doing on Facebook, and he didn't send out more e-mails. In fact, ,i think he sent out fewer. Everything that he had been doing on social media were really his voice already. It was really just e-mail and the funnel that we had to change. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Okay, so fewer e-mails actually went out. Becky: That's a thing that I do as soon as I start working with a client, is I go in and I subscribe to what they're already doing if they have something in place. I'll subscribe to their e-mail and I'll start looking at it trying to get a feel for their messaging, what they're saying, how they're saying it. That gave me that same off-putting feeling in the e-mails that I got when I looked at that sales page. Steve Larsen: One of the things that Russel I think does ... I've never really realized: Some of it's just for the ease of creation and making things, but it helps him ... What I've seen him do is he will just record himself teaching something and then go get it transcribed so it preserves everything in his voice and it's the way he would say it. Most people, the way we write and the way we speak are 2 different languages, but that's actually an error in sales copy usually. Becky: Right, because you're not going to reach your audience if you are putting on a template, putting on this box of what you're trying to say. If they're already following you, then they're following you for a reason. By following that same type of format that you are engaging them with, then you're just going to engage them more. Steve Larsen: That's fantastic. I know we've been going for a little bit here. I actually have 1 other question, and I'm sure people are going to just kill me if I don't ask this. How on earth did you get a client like Alex [Sharfon 00:34:34]? Becky: It's really cool how that happened, and it goes right back to my strong belief that you provide the value and the rest comes. He had a funnel that he had put out on social media, and I think a friend tagged me in it. I can't even remember how I found it, but I ended up coming across it and suddenly there were all these messages that said, "It's broken, it's broken, it's broken, it's broken." I messaged him and all the people I could tell kind of were working with him and I said, "Send me your information, I will fix it right now," and they did and I did. That's all it was, was just trying to help out. It really pains me to see something like that when there's something not working and they're pushing it out to all these people because literally dozens of people were commenting on it that it wasn't working. Who even knows how many more people didn't comment on it at all. That was all there was. I said, "Here you go, it's fixed," and I don't know, a month or 2 later, probably 6 weeks maybe, his team reached out to me and said, "Can we talk? We'd love for you to help us." Steve Larsen: That's so cool. Becky: Yeah, it was really neat. They just said, "We appreciate that you helped us before and we wanna see about working with you." When you are genuinely interested in helping people, good things come to you. It may not be that obvious and that immediate; that was just a really cool experience of it was a pretty tight turnaround and the same person. People are going to talk about you helping them and about the things that you've done to improve what they're doing, and then good things will come. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Yeah, I completely agree, and I've seen that definitely on my own. There was a guy I was doing work for once. I actually ... This is kind of how I broke into it, because I needed someone to be able to see what I could do, right? I actually went to him and I told him, "I'm going to build a funnel for you. I know you don't know what that is, so don't pay me for the first 6 months. All I need you to do is pay for the tools, I'll go put it together." I ended up helping him pull an extra $60,000 from just an e-mail campaign that I put out there with his own list through a sales phone. [inaudible 00:37:10] funnel I built. After that, though, then they offered to pay me, and it was a really easy way to go get a relationship going. Becky: Whether or not he had helped you or he had turned around and decided to create it or not, it was good experience for you and you were helping somebody to help other people and so it comes around. All these things kind of click together for good when we're trying to do something good. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Yeah, and it's such a counterintuitive thing too, because everyone says, "Oh, put your resume out there and go ..." I hate resumes. I don't have one. You don't really need one. Anyways, that's so cool. Thanks so much for sharing that stuff. Becky: You're welcome. It's a privilege to talk to you and I've really enjoyed seeing all the great things that you're doing, so I'm thrilled to be able to chat with you about it and share some f that experience. Steve Larsen: Thank you so much. For all the people who are listening or will listen to this, how can they reach you or follow you? Becky: You can find me on Facebook, and then if you want to reach out in a way that's more direct, I have a website. It's go.funnelpros.net, and you can see a little bit about me and my history and the story of how I came to be here and a few of the people that we've helped. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Go.funnelpros.net. Becky: Yes. Steve Larsen: Awesome. Thanks so much, and I am looking forward ... I'm going to go check out that site right now, actually. Becky: Thanks so much. I appreciate talking with you. It was a pleasure. Steve Larsen: All right, we'll talk to you later. Becky: Bu-bye. Recording: Thanks for listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Wanna get one of today's best internet sales funnels for free? Go to salesfunnelbroker.com/freefunnels to download your pre-built sales funnel today.  

Steve Larsen: All right everyone, hey. I'm super excited for this, this is going to be a treat and its very rare. There's a few people I go through and I interview, and they don't know much about ClickFunnels or the world that I live in, but that's not the case for this time. You guys have the special privilege of listening to Mr Danny Walsh, thank you so much for joining us. Danny Walsh: Thank you Stephen, thank you so much for having me on the show. Steve Larsen: I'm really pumped about this. Its funny, so I was interviewing Jenn Goodwin. I don't know when that was, it was a couple of weeks ago and after the show she kept messaging me. She's like, "You have got to interview this guy, Danny Walsh. He's the man, he's helped me with all my stuff," and so I've been really excited for this. She kept telling me, "I use him for building all this stuff." Do you mind telling us a little bit about what you're doing for Jenn? Danny Walsh: The work that I'm doing with Jenn and in general is about building a partnership between ourselves, so that we can better serve our audiences. This is a longer term arrangement I guess, so in the short term yes, I'm helping her with ClickFunnels, yes I'm helping her with some strategy stuff. That's not to say that she's not already well advanced in various parts of the internet, and she does have a lot of clients and she's working on some fantastic projects. I'm helping and advising on funnel type stuff, but in terms of the partnership what we've realized is that we have a lot of similarities. By working together and putting some systems in place, we will be able to better serve more people. That's the angle we're coming at from that piece of work, and its going well so far. Big thanks and shout to Jenn, I guess. Steve Larsen: She's also very impressed. You're a ClickFunnels expert, that's obviously what she said and that's what you go out and do, is help people with ClickFunnels itself. How did you get started doing that first of all? You had said just previously to this that you were doing this all on WordPress, and that's awful for everyone. Danny Walsh: I've been working online since I was eighteen and I'm thirty five now, so that's quite some time. One of the first things I ever did online was create a music business, and this was before YouTube and Facebook, and the things that we're accustomed to these days. There was myself and a group of friends and we was into music, and underground music in particular in the UK. Lots of bass driven stuff and we wanted to get into raves effectively, and go and perform and DJ and rap, and do all of this cool stuff that we were into when we were sixteen, seventeen and eighteen. At that point when you're eighteen, as you know, you have a choice don't you? Your mom or your family or whoever says get a job, and society says get a job so you tend to find yourself in college or wherever. I went to college for a week and I left, it wasn't for me. I'm eighteen, loving music, loving all these sorts of things. Recognizing that the internet was becoming very powerful and it was certainly catching my eye and my interest, and I'd done lots of computer stuff at school. Albeit these computers were ancient, the floppy disks and all this kind of stuff. From this music business, we've ended up having choice. You can either go on this course that the government has provided, or you can look to write a business plan, but they never expected anybody to write the business plan. I saw that as an opportunity when I was eighteen to actually not go on this course, and actually do the music. I was one of the only guys who came back after a few days with a big smile on my face, with a business plan. The lady in the job center, she couldn't believe it but they put me forward into this scheme, where we managed to get £3,000 so, about four and a half thousand dollars worth of funding. This is me at eighteen and we set off on this journey, of running this website and doing events, and we quite quickly became the number one urban music website. People couldn't believe it and that starting point, and that wasn't even WordPress. That was actually coding this stuff in html and everything was so primitive, it took ages to upload anything. There was no such thing as camera phones, we were pretty much on our own playing Vinyl, do you know what I mean? From there, and learning WordPress and the DJ-ing evolved into teaching children and young people, and that set me on my journey if you would. Steve Larsen: Sure. That's incredible. Danny Walsh: That's just the beginning. Steve Larsen: Yeah, you were eighteen. I can't believe that, that's amazing. I almost got kicked out of high school because I kept selling all these random knick knacks in school, whatever it was. Little pens, they don't really like that kind of stuff. Danny Walsh: No, and obviously not conforming or you're not parts of the masses and what they want them to be like. If you're doing something slightly different, they'll try and make you fall back in line. That's where entrepreneurs are different. Steve Larsen: Yeah, just a little bit. I talk about pre ClickFunnels days like its the dark ages a little bit. It makes it so much faster now, I can't believe it. You've got this business, what's the website again? Just so everyone knows. Danny Walsh: I'm on dannywalsh.co.uk Steve Larsen: That's right. The biggest thing you do is you go help people with ClickFunnels issues. What are the kinds of issues that people run into that you see? Danny Walsh: This is the interesting thing. Since I've been doing the music days and from teaching children and young people how to DJ, and then from there working for the Council Writing Policy. All of these things I've done in my background, the problems that people have brought up in terms of promotion, marketing. The need to get people to come to an event or the need to get people to buy a ticket, or the need to get people to actually take action. The problems have been similar all the way up until now, up until this morning when I was speaking to somebody on Skype. The similar problems just have new solutions and ClickFunnels is a new solution to age old problems, and literally does take hours and thousands of pounds or thousands of dollars out of the equation. Compared to what we was doing nearly twenty years ago, compared to what you can do now on ClickFunnels, its safe to say that the world has evolved for the better. Some of the problems that people encounter come in on different levels. If you think about technology, the technology is always a learning curve for people. I've been fortunate that I've done this from young and always done it, so if you're just coming in and trying to get into this thing, there's a big barrier in peoples minds where they're afraid to press things. Does that make sense? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Danny Walsh: People will for example get ClickFunnels or but a WordPress theme, or whatever it may be. Something practical that they've got to do, Photoshop, whatever it is. They'll get this thing open in front of them and they'll have the training, and there still seems to be this mental block that presents them from pressing things. They always say to me things like, "I was afraid to screw things up," or, "I was afraid that I might do something wrong." That is like well, there's nothing there to start with. Do something, and trying to get people over that mental barrier very, very broadly speaking. Yes we can talk about how to set up an email or how to set up a retargeting pixel, or how to set up Ationetics or whatever it may be. Specifically but on a very very broad level, you seem to get this theme that people are just afraid to get started. If I can help them to get started that's half of the battle won. Steve Larsen: I completely agree with that because I'll get a lot of people that'll just message me, and they'll say, "How do I do this?" You're right, it is this theme of people that are just. You might fail but its so much better to just fail taking action rather than, I don't know what it is. They can't put all the pieces together, they don't know, they super obsess over one piece and the next piece and the next piece. You're like just go ask someone to give you money and see if it works, and if that works go put it online. Danny Walsh: People have always said that I've been a bit cheeky. I'll be the guy that'll get pushed to the front, ask them ask them [inaudible 00:09:47] I guess there's a point here about experience. When you take a course or when you read a book, or you follow somebody or you absorb somebody else's lifestyle, you're looking at their experience. You might be reading somebodies experience, you might be watching somebodies experience, taking part of a course which shares somebodies experience. If you go through life continually looking at other peoples experiences and trying to model, so let's take ClickFunnels. Russel Brunson making all these ClickFunnels and its awesome, and I want to be like that so I'll watch the videos. They're looking at that and that's Russell's experience, and they're trying to model that which is great. Look at me and they'll say, "Danny Walsh is doing all these things, share with me your experience Danny." I'm sharing my experience and they're thinking how do I make this happen, how do I out that in place? That could be true of any guru, author, coach, anybody. They're all sharing their own experience. There's a time comes where the person who's continually listening and absorbing all of these experiences, needs to have their own experience. That's again this mental block, let's get over this first hurdle because you need to start telling people about your experience. Like you've just said, a failure or a mistake is part and crucial, part of the experience that you're going to be sharing in the future. If you're not prepared to have your own experiences and keep listening to everybody else's, then you're forever stuck. Steve Larsen: You're just going to keep hitting a wall. I actually just did a podcast about this, this is very interesting you're talking about it. I had this realization, it was a few weeks ago, which shows just how much we all learn constantly. I was listening to one of Dan Sullivan's courses called Pure Genius and he was talking about, "You can stop comparing yourself to an ideal. Its someone else's ideal you're always compared to." I've got to be more like that guy, I've got to be more like that guy and what it does, it makes you implode. You'll never be satisfied and instead start comparing yourself to where you just came from. I did this, and then you'll actually feel peace and satisfaction with where you're moving forward in that scenario. Danny Walsh: Without a doubt, and when you start to show more of your experience, and obviously this is driven by the experience and guidance of others. When you're showing more of your stuff you become more accustomed to likes and comments, and all of the things that the internet will give you which will boost your confidence, and enable you then to keep repeating the cycle. Before you know it, you're inbox is lighting up at two o'clock in the morning, with people asking you for advice as opposed to you messaging somebody at two o'clock in the morning asking them for advice. Does that make sense? Steve Larsen: 100% I definitely saw that switch happen for me. Danny Walsh: I guess it takes a while, doesn't it? Steve Larsen: Yeah, I've been doing it for about four years. Not as long as you but it definitely took a long time and finally when I realized that. There's a really good book called How The World Sees You, and in there he was saying, it was just right along with what you're saying. He said, "Stop focusing on your strengths. Its not so much about your strengths, its not so much about your weaknesses. 100% just highlight and focus on your differences. Whatever makes you different out there, you're not going to be, you'll stop focusing on the ideal. You'll start focusing on your insides and again have more." What I think is funny is we could talk about these kinds of issues rather than so much of the tech issues, because ClickFunnels makes it so much easier to do the tech stuff. You can actually focus on your own self. Danny Walsh: Without a doubt, and I have three core principles that underpin everything that I do and everything I would do with my clients, and I have them for year. The three principles are very simple. One of them is technology must work, that's the first principle. If technology doesn't work then it doesn't work and nothing can be solved, and no one can click through and there's complaints etc ClickFunnels makes the technology work, that's that bit sorted. Where we have to hire a bunch of guys and spend thousands and bang head on the wall for months, its handled. Principle one is underpinned by ClickFunnels now in my mind, and that's great. The second principle is get the right offer in front of the right people, and that's like Dream 100 stuff and all the rest of it. Taking the time to actually figure out who are these guys who I need to put this offer in front of, and one of the other things I do apart from music is fishing. I do lots and lots of fishing and we have funnels for fishing. The principles of putting the right bait to catch the right size of fish is very similar in marketing, so principle two you must have the right offer for the right people, Steve Larsen: Which is very easy to mess up. Danny Walsh: Very very easy to mess up but the power of funnels and the power of, the things that we can do now on the internet, especially with things like Facebook and Facebook live video. All of this cool stuff, is the third principle and this is simple as it gets. Technology must work, right offer for the right people. Third principle, build a solid relationship. That part again is where people, they will fall down or they will not put into context how important that part is, because if you can build a relationship it keeps people coming back. See what I mean? As well as being able to push yourself over the mental barrier of just getting started, you've got to make sure your tech works which we know ClickFunnels will help. Getting that right offer is only the first bit of it, you've got to build a relationship. When you get that package correct, that's when you can start to really advance and it doesn't have to be complicated. Steve Larsen: No, it really doesn't. I really like that third one, build a solid relationship. I think a lot of people get into the internet business because they figure, "I don't have to talk to anybody." You're about to go through some personal growth because you're really not going to make that much, unless you actually start building relationships with people. Danny Walsh: The relationships are key, do you know what I mean? Whether you have a fancy fifty five page extravagant system with all odds of emails or whatever, or you just send somebody a message on Facebook you're still building a relationship. You've got to do that in a way that gives value, as you know. You've also got to do that in a way that leaves people happy, and there's people out there who are expectant that they can just switch something on and make a lot of money. As we know that's not the case, its a great experience to have as long as you learn from that and you don't go back to buying the next thing that comes along. Just repeating that perpetual cycle, and having the relationship does mean having a conversation and getting people on the phone, and having Skype calls and all the rest of it. You've got to think longer term, whenever you're embarking on any sort of marketing project I guess. Steve Larsen: You just said something there that I thought was very interesting, because I had this realization a while ago that I needed to stop. I was getting stuck in this just go read books and learn and learn. After a while I realized these are great, I know all these principles. This is fantastic, but I don't even have a business to do it with. I realized this is going to sound totally ludicrous but I had to stop reading, because my learning needed to start coming from my own experiences. Rather than just be curios all the time, I had to switch gears and say okay. Stop reading so much, which is totally not normal. Just go execute and execute, and whatever barriers I run into I'll study about that barrier and how to get around it. Danny Walsh: Exactly. Steve Larsen: Much better way to do it. Danny Walsh: We talk about ready, aim, fire. You get ready and you spend ages there, you probably don't do anything. If we flip it round to ready, fire, aim we can fire a few things. People say, "I've not got the money, I've not got the investment. You can put up a Facebook page and you can set up a simple opt in page, and you can gauge interest with a dew dollars of Facebook ads. You don't need a big investment. If that all points in the right direction and makes you happy and smiley, and thinking this is feasible, I'm sure the investment will come. There's so many guys, and like I said I've done a lot of stuff in music and we did internet radio for years. For example, working with people who want to become artists, and there's guys out there they're older than me and they wanted to become artists all of their lives. Forever, since I've known them, since we were doing the music business. They've still not made it, and they produce music that's release quality will sell. I know it will sell, they know it will sell but for some reason in their mind, they're never quite happy with it. Its never quite perfect and they are ready aim fire. They've spent twenty five years aiming, and in all of those years they've got older, they've lost their rap appeal if that's the right way to describe it. You're becoming old and you're getting past this stuff, and you'll get to some point where you'll never do it. Whereas that piece of music you recorded when you was eighteen or that idea you had last night, is good enough now to take to market. One of the things I say to people a lot is if you don't have an idea, let's look at you. You are the brand, so if you can become the brand then you've got products in abundance. Like I said, we've got stuff in music, we've got stuff in fishing. I love music, I love fishing, I love all the things as well and we've got funnels and all of those. These are the things that we love, make them into businesses. The guys who are listening, what kind of things inspire you and motivate you? You don't need to worry about the next persons product, you are the brand but only if you think like that, and think what do I have to offer the world and how can I package that up in a simple way that adheres to some basic principles? Technology working, put it in front of the right people and build a relationship with these guys. Its something I've done since I was eighteen and I had a choice. Follow the crowd and go and go on me to put McDonald's five days a week, eight in the morning for an Egg McMuffin and you don't even get paid and you're going to do some learning stuff or start your own business. At that point I chose that journey, and you've got to take your choice and make your journey start. If you can do that and you can overcome the failures and you overcome the disasters that will undoubtedly get you along the way, and you just put things out there, then you will start to build experience and you will start to build momentum quite quickly. That espouses the formula to all of this, but some people will not take that first step and that's what I specialize in helping them to do. Steve Larsen: I want to just clap and shout. I just agree so much with what you're saying right now because its the journey we all go through with this. I think its we all want to be on the laptop on the beach making the millions, with no shoes on kind of thing. That's why a lot of people get into this, but its just like every other business. Russell and I were talking yesterday and I was telling him its amazing to me how many people think that just because, they think online business and offline business are two different categories. The fact that its online does not make it a business, the fact that its online doesn't make it. It was a business without that, just putting it offline or online is just a medium. Its just a channel for actually putting your products out there. Danny Walsh: Exactly, and you've got to liken it to a department store but every door leads to the same till as it were, to the same register. No matter which door you go through, it still leads you up to the same bank or the same register or wherever. People look at their offline business as the mainstay, people are coming through the door they're spending money and then they've got little tiny bit of stuff going on online. You're like if we put some simple things in place on the online side, you can double or significantly increase your income. Again, sometimes there's reluctance especially if somebody's used to working in that offline traditional thing. Its frustrating when people spend £5,000 on newspaper advertising and they can't even track who has read it. You have nowhere to track who has read that newspaper. Steve Larsen: Is it even working? Danny Walsh: Exactly. You can say to them, "How many visitors have you had from your last newspaper advertising campaign?" "One or two maybe, its hard to tell." Let's give away some cash as a lead. We'll give you £10 to spend in our offline business, or $10 to spend or $20 to spend. Complete this simple form. We've done this and the guy rings me up, he says, "Make it stop. It's only been two hours and I've got a hundred people with £10 in their hand, with address phone number every other thing that I could need as a business owner to market to these people. Stop it." He spent $35 or something on Facebook Ads. £5,000 on newspaper and people continue to pour their money into things that are not even proven to work. He doesn't know whether it's worked or not. Something like ClickFunnels and tracking it with proper analytics and Facebook retargeting and all the rest of it. You can see instantly how your offers are working and who's responding and such like, so dragging these people up from the dark ages and saying look guys. This is very possible for you if you stick to some basic principles. Don't make it overly complicated and just take some of your best stuff, or if you haven't got physical stuff you can give away, give away coupons or vouchers or cash. People will flock to your business, because you can get them through the door. Do the free plus shipping or some sample or some way to get them in, and you'll get a lot better return than you will of a newspaper or radio commercial, or whatever it is that's costing you a fortune. Steve Larsen: The market really is fatigued with the old way of doing marketing. I don't want to say old way because its not that it doesn't work, its just its own beast and most people have no idea what they're doing. You help people with ClickFunnels all the time, and I wanted to ask is there a way that you recommend or that you've seen, helps people shortcut the learning curve with ClickFunnels? It makes it just a billion times easier, but there is a little bit of a learning curve. Danny Walsh: Get started, that's the first biggest thing you can say. Is actually open the editor and attempt to do something. I've got videos, ClickFunnels have got videos. There's an abundance of videos that show you to the finest detail, then there's the group. Twenty two thousand ClickFunnels users in the group. If between those resources and the fact that you've got probably one of the most easy to use and powerful editors on the internet full stop, period. Steve Larsen: Sure. Danny Walsh: In front of you, then is it a need that you need to speak to somebody or is it a need that you need to reassess where you're at, or is it a need that you're so cluttered and you've got so many things going on, that you need to disable or remove some of these other things, so you can focus your time? Clearly, something is stopping you from getting started. Once you do get started clearly there's a learning curve, but like I said at the beginning press things, see what happens. Make a test funnel, do things step by step but with anything in ClickFunnels, from reading Dot Com Secrets to using it, to upgrading to Funnel Hacks, whatever it is that you do, the principles are the same and if you look at the funnel hacking principle of seeing a website that you want to model. Thinking there's a blue line across the top, how do I make a blue line across the top? There you go [inaudible 00:27:12] make it a blue background. Maybe adjust the padding a little bit, now they match. Next section underneath, and do it in a step by step process and it might take you a few hours. It might take you a few weeks, but by the end of that you will have learned everything you need to know. When it gets to the more technical stuff obviously you can reach out to people, there's people like myself and certified consultants, and all guys all over the place who will happily jump in and hep you. The biggest thing is just getting yourself started and getting stuck in, and like I said don't be afraid of pressing things and seeing how the editor responds. Then test your pages. As long as you've got a plan in mind, which underpins all of this, have a plan. Know what you want to o by the end of the process. What does it look like at the end of the deal, at the end of the process? If you can get that foundation in place, then just get stuck into it and you really will find that its not overly difficult to do. Steve Larsen: Its funny, I'm laughing. I always tell people to do the same thing, just go start. Someone was asking me a little bit ago, "How do I even get going on this thing?" I said, "This is how I got started. I just found a page that I liked and I decided I would just clone it, pixel by pixel. The whole way down." I was learning all this stuff and I got into ClickFunnels right after they left Beta. I'm sure you're a long time user also and I have hits. My wife and I are on a date and we were hanging out, and she wanted to watch a movie but my mind just kept going back to this ClickFunnels thing. I was having a hard time focusing on the fact that I was on a date. She's like, "Hey, let's watch a movie." There's no way she didn't notice but I pulled my computer up on the side and I was doing stuff, I ended up cloning the entire homepage of GetResponse, GetResponse the email auto responders. Just pixel by pixel the whole way through, and I was like holy cow. At the end of it I was like I could do this with anything. This is fantastic. Danny Walsh: That's the thing, whether you're on a date and its a bit boring or whatever it is, you're just funnel obsessed. There's a lot you'll get out of this and obviously with the community and the guys that are supporting. There's no reason why you should be stuck, and certainly if I think what I have to do all those years ago to put one website online and the costs. If you wanted custom designs doing, there was no such thing as Fiverr. There's all of the things that you take for granted now when it comes to ClickFunnels and whatnot, but it can't really e much easier and I'm sure it'll get easier and more cooler as time progresses At this point there's not really much in terms of an excuse, so you get something out there online. As long as you're ethical and you build a relationship with people, and you have some fundamental principles, there's no reason why the stuff won't take off. Again, don't limit yourself to one thing. You've got to look at multiple income streams and there's things like affiliate marketing and al the rest of it, what you can do to bring additional income into your business really. Steve Larsen: Its so true. I want to thank you for this, I've been taking notes like crazy. I just want to hit on those three things you said again, your three core principles. Technology mist work. Danny Walsh: Yeah, technology must work. Steve Larsen: Number two, you go to get the right offer in front of the right people, which is just the most basic. You have to do that, you'll waste so much money if you don't do that. Then number three, build a solid relationship. That's awesome, thanks for saying all you have on this. This has really been helpful. Where can people learn more about you again? Its dannywalsh.co.uk right? Danny Walsh: Yeah, that's my main site but I do have free videos that I do, and tutorials. I've got a members site as well again, all powered by ClickFunnels and people are obviously are welcome to join it. Do a weekly live call and working in partnership with quite a few guys who are also using ClickFunnels. I literally do support, I would imagine forty to fifty ClickFunnels users, plus the rest of the guys I support. There's a lot of people moving over from WordPress to ClickFunnels, and I coined the hashtag ClickFunnels pays the bills. Feel free to let that surface around, but it literally does pay the bills. A pleasure to be on the show, really. Steve Larsen: Thank you so much. I've been looking forward to this and I'm sorry we had to reschedule tons of times. Danny Walsh: It's been good and hopefully, like I said if anybody needs me, needs any help or support just feel free to reach out. It's been a pleasure. Steve Larsen: Awesome, thank you so much and definitely go check out Mr Danny Walsh. I appreciate that. Danny Walsh: Thanks Stephen. Steve Larsen: All right, bye bye. Danny Walsh: Bye bye, Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Want to get one of today's best internet sales funnel for free? Go to salesfunnelbroker.com/freefunnels to download your pre billed sales funnel today.