Thank You For Your Service

Last week, President-elect Joe Biden made an historic announcement to name Lloyd Austin as his nominee for the position of Secretary of Defense. This nomination is unique for two reasons: First, because Austin would be only the third retired general to serve as Secretary of Defense since the passing of the National Security Act of 1947. Second: Austin would be the first Black American to serve as Secretary of Defense. Jim explores the civil-military implications of this nomination with Ambassador Eric Edelman, Dr. Kori Schake, and Mr. Bishop Garrison.

The relationship between the military and the media is not always an easy one. But, without the news media, the American public would have a far narrower understanding of what our military is doing in our name. As difficult as it sometimes may be for both parties involved, getting the relationship between the Defense Department and journalists right is essential for our democracy. In this episode, Alice and Jim speak with scholar Dr. Amanda Cronkhite, Washington Post National Security journalist Greg Jaffe, and Army Public Affairs Officer Colonel Myles Caggins to get their perspectives on what journalists and members of the military should do to get this relationship right more often.

On this Veterans' Day/ post-election episode of Thank You For Your Service, we talk to Loren DeJonge Schulman about the draft and the civilian national security workforce. Then Alice and Jim discuss the personnel churn at DoD and what the change in presidential administration might mean for civ-mil relations. And we leave you with a little something to get inspired.

Whether we like it or not, the military's role in the election has become a topic of conversation this year. But military involvement in the election could mean a lot of things -- absentee voting by service members, veterans running for office, retired officer endorsements, or even the use of National Guard or active troops in the aftermath of a contested election. Alice and Jim talk with experts Don Inbody, Kori Schake, and Risa Brooks about some of the ways the military will, and hopefully won't, be involved in the 2020 Presidential election.

The U.S. military has struggled with racism throughout its history. This week, Alice and Jim talk to active duty military personnel, veterans, and a civilian expert about race, bias, and discrimination in the armed forces. Guests Bishop Garrison, Radha Iyengar-Plumb, Jada Johnson, James Johnson, Dana Pittard, and Daniel White talk about their personal experiences as well as recruiting, retention, promotion, and representation in the military.  

The war stories we tell both reflect and shape the relationship between American society and its military. In the second of two episodes, Alice and Jim explore how the stories Vietnam veterans told about their war have shaped America's experience of the war in Afghanistan. They interview author and Army veteran Matt Gallagher, about his most recent novel, Empire City, and consider how blogs and social media have influenced the ways we tell war stories, drawing on insights from counterinsurgency expert, Dr. Erin Simpson, and Marine Corps veteran and creator of the Duffel Blog, Paul Szoldra. Features "Born to Drive Me Crazy" by Lance Conrad via Artlist.

On an early October morning in 2009, an overwhelming force of Taliban fighters attacked a small unit of U.S. soldiers located at Combat Outpost Keating in a remote valley in Afghanistan's Nuristan province. Drawing on source material from Jake Tapper's book, The Outpost, director Rod Lurie has brought the story of the Battle of Kamdesh -- one of the bloodiest and most heroic American engagements of the 19-year war in Afghanistan -- to the screen in a film of the same name. In this special episode of Thank You For Your Service, Jim and Alice speak with Tapper and Lurie as well as with Ty Carter (Medal of Honor recipient and film advisor), veteran Daniel Rodriguez (who fought in the battle and played himself in the movie), Stoney Portis (the last commander of Combat Outpost Keating), and Katie Kopp (the brigade psychologist who helped soldiers process and debrief the 14-hour firefight) about the battle, the movie, and mental health. For the video of this interview, please visit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHISA70-CAo

Almost immediately after the American invasion of Afghanistan in October 2001, people started to wonder if we were getting ourselves into another Vietnam. Eighteen years later, victory in Afghanistan remains elusive and questions about the limits of American power remain. In the first of two episodes, Alice and Jim talk with historian Greg Daddis, counterinsurgency expert Erin Simpson, and retired General Barry McCaffrey about the similarities and differences between the wars in Vietnam and Afghanistan and consider how these conflicts have shaped the U.S. military and American society. Features "Taoudella" by Azalai via Blue Dot Sessions.

As America's volunteer force continues to grow smaller, fewer civilians have contact with the military in their daily lives. But many civilians are interacting with service members in the one place they both are: online. Alice and Jim talk with guests Heidi Urben, Nate Finney, Paul Szoldra, and Kristofer Goldsmith about the various ways the military's online activity can be inappropriate, thoughtful, funny, and sometimes even damaging to America's civil-military relationship.

Alice and Jim promised to give you their thoughts on the Space Force TV series, and here they are in a special bonus episode. Spoilers everywhere! But really, if you listen to this podcast and you haven't seen Space Force yet, it's time you caught up anyway. 

This episode tackles a big, important, and sensitive topic: the military and politics. How should we think about the military's role in domestic politics? What does partisan polarization mean for the U.S. military? Can military families get involved in politics without politicizing the armed forces? We talk with Mac Owens, David Burbach, Deborah Avant, and Sarah Streyder to answer these and other questions.

What does it mean for the military to be under civilian control? Jim and Alice talk about obedience, loyalty, and subordination with ethicist Dr. Pauline Shanks Kaurin, author of "On Obedience." Then they catch up with former Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral (ret) Michael Mullen to talk about how presidents and senior military officers build, and sometimes lose, trust.

You may not think of civil-military relations when you think about the hit musical, but civ-mil themes are all over Hamilton. In this special bonus episode, Alice and Jim talk to Hamilton superfans and national security practitioners Shannon Culbertson and Simone Williams. The crew discusses Hamilton's military service and social mobility, how types of national service blend into the same life, and the time George Washington says, "Thank You For Your Service."

How have the post-9/11 wars affected America's relationship with the military, and the military's relationship with America? In our War Storytellers segment, we talk to novelist Elliot Ackerman and poet Olivia Garard. Then we hear from Dr. Mara Karlin about her research on the impact the wars have had on the military and the civil-military relationship.

What is service? Is military service more valuable or more noble than other kinds of national and community service? Who serves, and why? Jim and Alice explore these questions and more with guests Janine Davidson, Shawn Skelly, and Amy Schafer.

In our first episode with new co-hosts Alice Friend and Jim Golby, we provide an overview of the podcast and give you a sneak preview of future guests. We also debate the state of civil-military relations, including the implications of the use of the military at home in the context of the recent protests against racial injustice. 

This is the last episode of Thank You For Your Service co-hosted by Thomas and Nick, who are leaving UChicago and moving on with their Navy careers. After this, TYFYS will join the podcast network at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, where it will be hosted by Dr. Alice Hunt Friend and Dr. Jim Golby. In this final episode, Thomas and Nick look back on the experience of creating TYFYS and interview Alice and Jim, who explain their backgrounds, assess the current state of American civil-military relations, and preview the future of the show. To our listeners: Thank you for joining us on this amazing journey. We hope you’ll keep listening and learning with Alice and Jim – we know the podcast is in good hands. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tom Lattanzio, producer Special thanks to Dr. Alice Hunt Friend, Dr. Jim Golby, and the Center for Strategic and International Studies.

Ever since Samuel Huntington wrote The Soldier and the State in 1957, his theory on objective civilian control of the military has had a profound influence on American civil-military relations. Over the course of this podcast series, we’ve explored that theory’s substance and applications to real-world events. But does Huntington’s theory need an overhaul? Dr. Risa Brooks is a professor of political science at Marquette University. She is one of the leading experts in academic civil-military relations, having written extensively about both American and international issues. Dr. Brooks joins the podcast to discuss her article in the Spring 2020 issue of International Security titled “Paradoxes of Professionalism: Rethinking Civil-Military Relations in the United States.” In that article and in this interview, Dr. Brooks argues that Huntington’s theory of objective control contains several paradoxes and deficiencies that are becoming increasingly important in today’s political and military landscape. We also talked about why students and citizens, civilian and military alike, should learn and think about civil-military relations. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tom Lattanzio, producer Aishwarya Kumar, production manager Yi Ning Wong, publisher Special thanks to Dr. Risa Brooks.

How have the roles of women in the military changed over time? What progress has been made towards more inclusive and diverse environments in the armed forces? Lyla Kohistany joins this episode to give her take. Lyla is a U.S. Navy veteran, having served first as a Surface Warfare Officer before transferring to the Intelligence Community, where she served as an Intelligence Officer for Special Operations missions. Upon leaving the Navy, Lyla founded a nonprofit called Promote, which is dedicated to helping Special Operations units foster more inclusive work environments. We talked with Lyla about women in the military, portrayals of women service members in the media and their ramifications on the civil-military divide, and how men can be better allies for women who serve. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. Further reading: Nicole Alexander and Lyla Kohistany, “Dispelling the Myth of Women in Special Operations,” Center for a New American Security. https://www.cnas.org/publications/commentary/dispelling-the-myth-of-women-in-special-operations Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tom Lattanzio, producer Aishwarya Kumar, production manager Special thanks to Brianna Keilar and Tracie Logan.

Despite popular stereotypes, the best predictor of whether someone will join the armed forces is not race or economic class. According to New York Times national correspondent Dave Philipps, it’s familiarity with the military – knowing someone who has served, usually a friend or family member. The result is that since the advent of the All-Volunteer Force, new recruits have been coming largely from the same places and the same families. Dave covers the military and veterans from a ground-level perspective, hearing and sharing the stories of everyday troops, as opposed to policymakers in Washington. He has been with the Times since 2014, and he has won a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting. In this episode, Dave discusses insights from his January 2020 article, “Who Signs Up to Fight? Makeup of U.S. Recruits Shows Glaring Disparity.” Comparing past and present demographics of the military, Dave explains why the makeup of the armed forces has changed, and where the trend is likely to go. He also talks about military efforts designed toward recruiting a more representative force, and why it’s important for the military to truly reflect the population of the entire country. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. References: Dave Philipps and Tim Arango, “Who Signs Up to Fight? Makeup of U.S. Recruits Shows Glaring Disparity”. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/10/us/military-enlistment.html Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Aishwarya Kumar, production manager Morgan Wade, production support Michelle Tran, production support Special thanks to Dave Philipps, Emma Moore, Mike Robinson, and Tom Lattanzio.

What does it mean to be an American? Phil Klay, a former Marine and critically acclaimed writer, returns to the podcast to discuss the connection between military service, citizenship, and “Americanness.” Elaborating on his November 2019 New York Times essay “The Soldiers We Leave Behind,” Phil recounts the story of the World War I “Melting Pot” division, and one of their leaders, Charles Whittlesey. He also describes the harrowing experiences of Black veterans after both world wars, and he connects these narratives to the stories of two Iraqi nationals – Ali and Ted – who, in recognition for serving alongside the US military in Iraq as interpreters, were promised visas to come to the United States. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. References: Phil Klay, “The Soldiers We Leave Behind”. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/11/09/opinion/veterans-war-immigration.html Equal Justice Initiative, “Lynching in America.” https://eji.org/reports/targeting-black-veterans/ Congressional Research Service report on the Special Immigrant Visa Program. https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/R/R43725/10 Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tom Lattanzio, producer Bobby Maxwell, producer Aishwarya Kumar, production manager Special thanks to Phil Klay.

Why does the military have a justice system distinct from the civilian justice system? And what are the implications of having separate forms of accountability? Former Republican Congressman Tom Rooney joins TYFYS to give his take. Congressman Rooney represented Florida’s 16th and then 17th congressional districts from 2009 to 2019. During his time in government, he served on the Armed Services Committee, the Intelligence Committee, and the Committee on Agriculture. Before his political career, Rooney served in the US Army as a Judge Advocate, a military lawyer. He worked as a prosecutor at Fort Hood, Texas, and he later taught law at the United States Military Academy at West Point. In this episode Congressman Rooney discusses his time in the Army and in Congress. In light of his background with military justice and his political experience, Rep. Rooney also gives his perspective on the President’s decision to pardon convicted or alleged war criminals. This episode was recorded on the morning of November 20, 2019. The situation concerning Navy SEAL Eddie Gallagher has developed since then. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tom Lattanzio, producer Bobby Maxwell, producer Special thanks to Congressman Tom Rooney, Ashley Jorn, and the Institute of Politics.

“Thank You For Your Service” is back. In Season 2, we’ll be taking a hard look at how the military institution interacts with American social issues and social change: race, gender, LGBT issues. We’ll address questions like: Who joins the military and why? What can be done to address sexual assault in the military or mental health issues among service members and veterans? What does the veteran transition to civilian life look like? We’re hoping to provide more context and information to these ongoing conversations, so they get the focused, rigorous, analytic examination they deserve. In this Season 2 premiere, Thomas and Nick look at reasons for joining the military. First, they speak to students on campus to get an informal look at why civilians think people enlist. Many of these stereotypes do not stack up to reality, and researcher Emma Moore joins to explain what the evidence shows. Finally, Thomas and Nick speak with Kaedy Puckett, a Navy veteran and first-year student at UChicago, to get a personal look at her reasons for joining the military. “Thank You For Your Service” is a production of the University of Chicago Public Policy Podcasts and does not necessarily represent the official positions of the Department of Defense or the U.S. government. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Tommy Lattanzio, producer Bobby Maxwell, editor Michelle Tran, producer Special thanks to Emma Moore, Kaedy Puckett, and Morgan Wade

Recently retired Navy commander Guy “Bus” Snodgrass served as chief speechwriter to Secretary James Mattis for most of his tenure as Secretary of Defense. Snodgrass has recently published a book, Holding the Line: Inside Trump’s Pentagon with Secretary Mattis. In it, the former speechwriter gives a behind-the-scenes look at national security decision-making at the highest levels of government. Snodgrass’s decision to reveal private conversations in his memoir has been met with criticism. Some have accused him of being self-serving or selling out. Others argue it is inappropriate for a military official to go public with the sensitive information he was privy to. Guy Snodgrass joins Thomas and Nick for this special episode of TYFYS to address those criticisms and to provide context on his decision to write this book. They also evaluate criticisms of Secretary Mattis’s time in office, and talk through leadership lessons that can be gleaned from Snodgrass’s time at the Pentagon. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Aishwarya Kumar, production manager

Dr. Paul Staniland and Dr. Austin Carson, political science professors at the University of Chicago, join the podcast to discuss how studying international civil-military relations can shed light on American civ-mil – and how the challenges of maintaining civilian control of militaries play out in countries around the world. Why do some countries experience coups, and others don’t? What happens when a country’s military becomes truly politicized? In addition, we discuss Dr. Carson’s new book Secret Wars: Covert Conflict in International Politics, which was recently named the winner of the 2018 Lepgold Book Prize – one of the most prestigious awards in the international affairs field, which Dr. Staniland also won three years ago. Note: This episode was recorded in late August 2019, prior to the breakdown of the United States' negotiations with the Taliban. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Aishwarya Kumar, producer

Maggie Feldman-Piltch is the founder of #NatSecGirlSquad, a professional development community committed to promoting competent diversity in national security and defense. She joins the podcast to discuss her experiences as an organizer and strategist, what motivates her to work towards putting more women at the table for national security discussions, and to share her vision for the future of #NatSecGirlSquad. We also discussed her perspective on the brand-new Leadership Council for Women in National Security (LC-WINS), where she sits on the Steering Committee, as well as our favorite West Wing characters and Maggie’s future presidential cabinet. Notes: You can find #NatSecGirlSquad at www.natsecgirlsquad.com and LC-WINS at www.lcwins.org. If you were unfamiliar with the names of some of the experts Maggie named in this episode, you can find most of their bios on the LC-WINS Steering Committee page. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Aishwarya Kumar, producer

Few scholars have had a greater influence on the academic study of American civil-military relations than Dr. Peter Feaver. But Dr. Feaver’s career has reached far beyond the campus of Duke University, where he is a professor at the Sanford School of Public Policy and director of the American Grand Strategy Program. The author and editor of several books and innumerable papers on national security, he has also served twice on the National Security Council staff and as an intelligence officer in the U.S. Navy Reserves. In this episode, we explore what Dr. Feaver has learned during his career as a scholar-practitioner. We also discuss the “civil-military gap” – Dr. Feaver’s groundbreaking research project with Dr. Richard Kohn at the Triangle Institute nearly twenty years ago, trends in American civ-mil since then, and his ongoing work with Lieutenant Colonel Jim Golby. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Aishwarya Kumar, producer Haz Yano, publisher Special thanks to Don Hoover.

From his hard-hitting interviews with prominent politicians to his work reporting from the Middle East, Jake Tapper has been a forceful presence in political journalism for the last 20 years. He is currently CNN’s Chief Washington Correspondent and the anchor of The Lead with Jake Tapper, as well as the host of CNN’s Sunday political show, State of the Union. In 2012, Mr. Tapper published a book, The Outpost, which covers the history of Combat Outpost Keating in Nuristan Province, Afghanistan leading up to a deadly battle that claimed the lives of eight American service members. The book has been widely praised for its realism, detail, and accuracy. It is now in development as a major motion picture. Jake Tapper joins Thomas and Nick for the final episode of TYFYS’s first season to discuss The Outpost, the relationship between journalism and the military, and how to bridge the civil-military divide. Notes: -FOIA = Freedom of Information Act request -“3-61 CAV” and “3-71 CAV” refer to U.S. Army regiments that were stationed at Combat Outpost Keating This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, producer & publisher Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Special thanks to Brianna Keilar.

David Axelrod, the longtime political consultant and commentator now serving as director of the UChicago Institute of Politics, has a unique perspective on civil-military relations. In 2004, Mr. Axelrod joined the U.S. Senate campaign of a young Illinois state senator named Barack Obama. Just four years later, he and his team of strategists orchestrated Mr. Obama’s historic campaign for the presidency. Then during the first two years of the administration, Mr. Axelrod served as a White House Senior Adviser, coordinating policy and communications -- where, among many other things, he observed the U.S. military and its role in a complex government. Mr. Axelrod joined Thomas and Nick for a special live episode before an audience of professors and graduate students at the Harris School of Public Policy. They discussed the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, political considerations in the national security process, the sometimes-tense relationship between the Pentagon and the White House, and Mr. Axelrod’s role as a political adviser. Also discussed: the USS JOHN McCAIN controversy, President Obama’s Nobel Prize, and the repeal of Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Podcast Production Credit: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, producer Julian Lake, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Special thanks to ret. Admiral Mike Mullen, Lieutenant Colonel Jim Golby, Captain Mike Robinson, Samantha Neal, the University of Chicago Institute of Politics, and to everyone at Harris who came out and supported this live taping!

The Honorable Michèle Flournoy, one of the most accomplished national security professionals working in the United States today, served as Under Secretary of Defense for Policy from 2009 to 2012 and co-founded the Center for a New American Security (CNAS). She is now the CEO of WestExec Advisors, where she helps make connections between the U.S. national security establishment and important industry partners. In this episode, Ms. Flournoy joins the podcast for a wide-ranging discussion of her career, the challenges of civilian leadership at the Pentagon, the military-industrial complex, and military politicization. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, producer Alec MacMillen, engineer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Special thanks to Lieutenant Alberto Ramos. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity.

After serving as a Marine Corps public affairs officer in Iraq, Phil Klay won the 2014 National Book Award for Redeployment, his collection of short stories about the war. Widely recognized as one of the best writers of his generation, Phil has also published essays on the military and society in The Atlantic, The New Yorker, TIME, and many other outlets. In this episode, Phil joins the podcast for a discussion of his previous writing, the moral contract between America and its soldiers, and his upcoming novel. In the opening clip, Phil reads from his Brookings Essay “The citizen-soldier: Moral risk and the modern military,” available online at http://csweb.brookings.edu/content/research/essays/2016/the-citizen-soldier.html. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer David Raban, publisher Special thanks to Lieutenant Colonel Jim Golby.

Admiral (ret.) James Stavridis, PhD, former Supreme Allied Commander of NATO and former Dean of the Fletcher School at Tufts University, was vetted as Hillary Clinton’s VP nominee and then interviewed by President-elect Donald Trump for a potential cabinet level position. He joins the podcast to discuss the importance of NATO, the role of retired military officers in politics, relations between the U.S. military and the media, and how policymakers and voters should evaluate the success of their civilian-controlled military. Also in this episode: the unique civil-military relations dynamics of international alliances, that Army PAO article about journalists, and why military officers should read and write. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer David Raban, publisher Special thanks to Tracie Logan and Sarah Claudy

The Authorization for the Use of Military Force (AUMF) allows the US military to be deployed against Al-Qaeda and any “associated forces.” Because of its broad nature, it has been used as a justification for military force across the globe, from Afghanistan and Iraq to Yemen and Niger. It was passed in 2001. Congress hasn’t renegotiated it since then. How does Congress’s responsibility of oversight apply to the military? And how has the relationship between Congress and the military evolved since the AUMF was passed over 17 years ago? Our guest, Dr. Charles A. Stevenson, is a former US Senate staffer with more than 20 years of experience in foreign affairs and defense policy. He is now a foreign policy professor at Johns Hopkins University. Dr. Stevenson joins the podcast to discuss the importance of congressional oversight, the dynamics of the congressional-military relationship, and possibly the Space Force, with Thomas and Nick. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer David Raban, engineer and publisher Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Special thanks to the University of Chicago Institute of Politics.

Many Americans, especially those who don’t personally know a service member, learn much of what they know about the U.S. military through portrayals in film and television. While military movies often make for high-quality and high-revenue entertainment, they can also tend to traffic in stereotypes – stereotypes that can perpetuate the already-growing civil-military divide by hindering realistic and rich conversation between veterans and civilians. This lack of informed interaction can have serious policy implications. In this episode, Nick Paraiso and Sarah Claudy, our creative consultant, discuss these issues with Chris Marvin, a former Army helicopter pilot and prominent communications strategist who works on veterans’ narratives in film and television. Chris is the founder of Got Your Six, a veterans’ non-profit working in the entertainment industry, and the principal of Marvin Strategies, an independent strategic communications firm. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Credits: Nick Paraiso, host Sarah Claudy, host Thomas Krasnican, editor and producer Haz Yano, engineer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer David Raban, publisher Special thanks to Emma Moore and Yana Seo.

Claire McCaskill, the former U.S. Senator from Missouri, joins the podcast for a wide-ranging discussion of her twelve years as a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee. We talked about oversight of defense contracting, the military-industrial complex, sexual assault reform, military justice, and congressional debate over the Authorization for Use of Military Force (AUMF). Haliburton, the F-35, New Balance shoes, Kirsten Gillibrand, Saudi Arabia, ice cream flavors, and Boeing may or may not have been mentioned as well. This episode was taped at the Harris School of Public Policy while Senator McCaskill was serving as a visiting fellow at the University of Chicago Institute of Politics. Warning: The following episode contains explicit language. And as always, this podcast is absolutely not in any way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Note: Four active-duty military officers & Harris students were in the room when we recorded this episode, including Thomas & Nick. Senator McCaskill’s frequent “you’s” and “you all’s” during this interview were directed towards them. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Julian Lake, engineer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant David Raban, publisher Special thanks to Ellie Price, Cindy Hall, and the University of Chicago Institute of Politics.

General (ret.) Stanley McChrystal, former JSOC commander and commander of the U.S./NATO troops in Afghanistan, joins the podcast for a discussion of his career. General McChrystal reflects on his role serving at the Pentagon while the U.S. invasion of Iraq was planned, his often-tense relationship with the Obama administration, and his decision to speak out on the current president. Also in this episode: what future military leaders should learn from his firing, the military’s relationship with the press, and what civilian policy students should know about the military. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the future of civil-military cooperation in America. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Further reading/listening: Obama’s Wars, Bob Woodward Duty: Memoirs of a Secretary at War, Robert Gates My Share of the Task, Stanley McChrystal Episode 302, The Axe Files with David Axelrod Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Alec MacMillen, engineer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant David Raban, publisher Special thanks to Jess Blankshain, Jim Golby, Morgan Wade, and David Axelrod.

The phrase “politicization of the military” is used often by the scholars and guests we’ve talked to on this podcast – but what exactly does it mean? If it’s a bad thing, then why? What kinds of actions qualify as “politicized,” and how can civilian officials and military leaders avoid inappropriately politicizing the armed forces? In this episode, we take a deep dive into the topic of military politicization and why it’s such an important element of our national security policymaking. Articles referenced: https://twitter.com/krasnican_/status/1088545635878473728 https://www.csis.org/analysis/military-politicization https://www.defenseone.com/ideas/2019/01/admiral-slammed-shutdown-can-he-do/154389/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2018/12/21/even-with-mattis-resigning-trump-is-still-damaging-the-militarys-credibility-as-nonpartisan/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/01/trumps-attacks-mcchrystal-and-mattis-will-do-lasting-damage/579256/ https://www.nationalreview.com/2019/01/trump-civil-military-relations-tensions/ Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant David Raban, publisher

At the end of 2018, the dramatic resignation of James Mattis from his post as U.S. Secretary of Defense sparked new concerns about the Trump administration’s conduct of foreign policy and its relationship with the military. Kevin Weng, a PhD candidate and lecturer at the University of Chicago’s Committee on International Relations, joins the podcast to discuss the civil-military implications of the Mattis resignation and the ongoing debate over policy towards Syria. Apologies for the poor recording quality in this episode -- we experienced some technical difficulties. Won't happen again! This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Articles referenced: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/19/us/politics/trump-syria-withdrawal-obama.html http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/12/andrew-sullivan-establishment-will-never-say-no-to-a-war.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2019/01/06/trump-actually-followed-one-civil-military-norm-with-his-announcement-on-syria/ https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/12/legacy-james-mattis/578815/ https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/24/opinion/mattis-trump-civil-military-relations.html Credits: Podcast Production Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, producer Mary Martha Maclay, producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant David Raban, publisher

In these episodes, Thomas Krasnican and Sarah Claudy (from the Pearson Institute) interview Dr. Ron Krebs, a professor at the University of Minnesota, and Robert Ralston, a graduate student at the University of Minnesota, about their research recently published in Foreign Policy Magazine. Part Two addresses the potential implications of the American ‘ritualistic hero worship’ of the military, and how the rhetoric and narratives associated with this practice shape national security policy through their impact on people in governmental positions. Is civilian oversight even a ‘good’ thing? By what standards? Part Two further addresses what civilians can do to stay informed in order to uphold the American democracy. Link to their original article: https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/12/03/americans-blind-faith-in-the-military-is-dangerous-civilian-oversight-deference-mcraven-trump/ Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Sarah Claudy, host Haz Yano, producer Nick Paraiso, producer Alec MacMillen, engineer and producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant Aishwarya Kumar, production support Mary Martha Maclay, production support Note: This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity.

In these episodes, Thomas Krasnican and Sarah Claudy (from the Pearson Institute) interview Dr. Ron Krebs, a professor at the University of Minnesota, and Robert Ralston, a graduate student at the University of Minnesota, about their research recently published in Foreign Policy Magazine. Part One covers different theories of that seek to answer the fundamental question of civil-military relations in a democracy: “who guards the guardians?” Part One also covers Dr. Krebs and Mr. Ralston’s research regarding public perceptions of the military—to what extent the general populace thinks that the civilian-controlled government should defer to military leadership with regard to national security issues—and some of the surprising insights their data revealed. Link to their original article: https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/12/03/americans-blind-faith-in-the-military-is-dangerous-civilian-oversight-deference-mcraven-trump/ Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Sarah Claudy, host Haz Yano, producer Nick Paraiso, producer Alec MacMillen, engineer and producer Aishwarya Kumar, production support Mary Martha Maclay, production support Note: This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity.

Admiral (ret.) Mike Mullen, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff under Presidents Bush and Obama, joins the podcast for a discussion of his experiences serving at the highest levels of civilian and military leadership. Admiral Mullen reflects on his role in repealing “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell” (the military’s controversial ban on openly gay and lesbian service-members), his public outreach as Chairman, and his opinions of the men and women with whom he served. This podcast is in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Alec MacMillen, engineer and producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant Aishwarya Kumar, production support Mary Martha Maclay, production support Notes: - The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff is the principal military advisor to the President, and the highest ranking officer in the U.S. armed forces. However, he/she doesn’t have operational command of troops. - A “flag officer” is any general or admiral in the armed forces. There are four levels of flag officer, each corresponding with a star that is worn on the officer’s rank insignia. - The “CNO” is the Chief of Naval Operations. The CNO is the administrative head of the U.S. Navy, but like the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, does not have operational command authority.

Dr. Kori Schake, Deputy Director-General of the International Institute for Strategic Studies and co-editor of a book with current Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis, joins the podcast for a discussion of current issues in civil-military relations. Dr. Schake shares the story of her own career path as a policymaker and analyst, and delves into topics like American views of the armed forces, politicization of the military, and defense budgeting. Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Alec MacMillen, engineer and producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant and cover art designer Aishwarya Kumar, production support Anita Joshi, production support David Raban, production support Special thanks: To those who serve. Happy Veteran's Day. Note: This podcast in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity.

Welcome to "Thank You For Your Service," a new UC3P Original Series. Our hosts Thomas Krasnican and Nick Paraiso, first-year MPPs at the Harris School of Public Policy and active-duty naval officers, preview the show. In this introduction, Thomas and Nick give an overview of the "civil-military gap" and what it might mean for society. They also discuss ways citizens can support military members and veterans beyond a simple "thank you for your service." Credits: Thomas Krasnican, host Nick Paraiso, host Haz Yano, engineer and producer Alec MacMillen, engineer and producer Sarah Claudy, creative consultant and cover art designer Michelle Tran, production support Anita Joshi, production support David Raban, production support Special thanks: To those who serve. Happy Veteran's Day. Note: This podcast in no way intended to reflect the official positions of the Department of Defense or any other military entity.