Dirt to Development

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We’ve got a dirty secret. Quite a few actually, and you will only hear them on our new podcast called Dirt to Development. We give you a behind-the-scenes look at key development projects and the insane stories surrounding them. Stay tuned to listen to all the dirt on land use, development, and the inside politics of Arizona!

Withey Morris


    • May 20, 2025 LATEST EPISODE
    • monthly NEW EPISODES
    • 42m AVG DURATION
    • 64 EPISODES


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    Latest episodes from Dirt to Development

    Ep. 63 - What does a PHD from MIT have to do with Development?...with Alex Pollack

    Play Episode Listen Later May 20, 2025 35:32


    Alex Pollack created a data-driven analytical approach to contracting.  Could it be useful in land use entitlements?

    Ep. 62 - C.R.A.B.S and Referendums: Two Things Nobody Wants...with Grant Fisher, VAI Resorts

    Play Episode Listen Later May 6, 2025 45:57


    Referendum laws are designed to empower citizens by allowing them to challenge legislative decisions through a public vote. However, in recent years, these laws have been increasingly misused by out-of-state union groups as a tool to block zoning changes and halt new developments. This trend has raised concerns that referendum laws are being weaponized to obstruct economic development rather than serve as a check on government power. Listen in as this experience plays out in real time with VAI Resorts.

    Ep. 61 - Buildng a Winning Entitlement Strategy...with Tood Gosselink

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 29, 2025 52:39


    Anatomy of a zoning case Pt.2: Building a winning strategy during the entitlements phase

    Ep. 60 - Halo Vista: A City Within a City...with Craig Henig

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 25, 2025 40:08


    Turning the desert into a $7 billion development project is no easy task. Billed as a "city within a city", Halo Vista will feature 2,300 acres, 28 million square feet of mixed-use development capacity, and up to 8,960 residential units as well as industrial, retail, and office spaces.  This truly is a story of dirt to development.

    Ep. 59 - "A Finger on the Pulse"...with Scott Isham

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 4, 2025 37:06


    When the development process is fraught with uncertainty, relying on strategic relationships can help you avoid unforeseen pitfalls.  Listen as Scott Isham, Chief of Staff for Maricopa County District 4 Board of Supervisors, helps guide developemnt to a Yes...and shows us how to be a big time movie star.

    Ep. 58 - Engineer to Developer; Passion to PowHer

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 7, 2025 32:03


    The path from dirt to development is evolutionary.  Some doors close while new ones open.  Hear Shelby Duplessis's story from engineer to developer, to motivating female empowerment.

    Ep. 57 - Oh, What a Year! with Matt Mancini

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 17, 2025 43:56


    2024 was a riot.  No really...some of our cases caused a riot.  Recapping 2024 with our good friend Matt Mancini, Partner at 3 Engineering.

    Ep 56 -“I've seen a lot of tools…”

    Play Episode Listen Later Dec 27, 2024 48:43


    Anatomy of a Zoning Case Pt. 2: Building an effective neighborhood outreach campaign.

    Episode 55: Why every project needs alignment between their zoning attorney and civil engineer…with Darrell Wilson of Colliers Engineering and Design.

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 26, 2024 46:10


    Episode 55: Why every project needs alignment between their zoning attorney and civil engineer…with Darrell Wilson of Colliers Engineering and Design.

    Ep. 54 - “If you don't know where you are going, you might wind up someplace else"

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 30, 2024 43:04


    Anatomy of a zoning case Pt.1: Don't sleep on the pre-filing strategy.

    Ep 53 - “I'm not quite sure how to put this, but…I'm kind of a big deal” with Greg Barr, Editor, Phoenix Business Journal

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 27, 2024 48:22


    Making news is our jam, and the Phoenix Business Journal is your insider's guide to the world of development. Join us as we navigate the crossroads of land deals and breaking news —because in our world, even dirt has a story to tell.

    Ep. 52 - "You don't get to pick where you are born, but you get to pick where you die"

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 16, 2024 45:27


    From band camp to development guru...with Jason Larsen. How a random encounter at Disneyland led to an unexpected and successful career in land development.

    Ep. 50 - Titans of the Trade: John Graham

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 14, 2024 38:24


    Episode 50: “The ability to give the elected official a soft place to land”

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 2, 2024 43:40


    Insight and perspective from an excellent civil servant - former Mayor, business executive, and state leader Jenn Daniels.

    Episode 49: “Molass at the Legislature” with Tom Dorn

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 30, 2024 50:30


    2024 legislative update on housing bills, resignations, and Adam messes up another word…again!

    Ep. 48 - The Buzzkill of zoning and land development…with Dawn Cartier and Sarah Simpson.

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 23, 2024 48:01


    Why does it feel like every good development project is getting squashed by City traffic departments? If you want to get approvals, you need to hire the best traffic engineers early. Listen as we lament why City traffic departments are like Toby from the office… always killing the vibe.

    Ep. 47 - What do On Cloud Shoes, Spec Industrial, and Data Centers Have in Common?

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 26, 2024 37:18


    Digital streaming, online computing, and AI technology have dramatically changed the way we store data and design modern industrial buildings. Jackie Orcutt from CBRE shares how it has changed her land brokerage practice…and Adam reveals his mastery of the English langauge.

    Ep. 46 - The mindset of running our cities like businesses.

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 5, 2024 52:11


    Two of our favorite City Managers - Patrick Banger and Kevin Phelps - share why Glendale and Gilbert are some of our favorite places to develop.

    Ep. 45 - Entitled? Think twice.

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 5, 2024 22:36


    What should you do when your use is allowed and the municipality doesn't want it? A huge mistake is assuming the zoning clears the path to develop. Even when zoned, obstacles may still exist with city staff, local politicians, and the process. Here are our suggestions.

    Ep. 44 - 2023 Market Naughty and Nice List

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 2, 2024 49:51


    We found some surprising nuggets sitting down with Connor Deveraux of CoStar Group in recapping the 2023 year and development sector trends.

    Ep. 43 - Two Lumps of Coal and Other Laughs From 2023

    Play Episode Listen Later Dec 22, 2023 33:21


    Looking back on some of the highlights (and absurdities) from the World of Zoning in 2023, along with Santa's zoning wish list for 2024.

    Ep. 42 - Minimal Living Concepts with Maximum Potential

    Play Episode Listen Later Dec 5, 2023 40:35


    Could Accessory Dwelling Units (ADUs) be the key to solving Arizona's housing shortage?

    Ep. 41 - From Skymall to Zenni Homes with Bob Worsley

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 27, 2023 41:02


    How a serial entrepreneur is tackling housing scarcity in a different, sustainable way.

    Ep. 40 - Industrial State of the Union

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 17, 2023 48:45


    No market segment has performed better that industrial development in Phoenix in recent years. The market is shattering absorption records and attracting major manufacturing, tech, and semiconductor users. Changes in recent finance and interest markets have shown some influence on new construction, but the overall outlook remains optimistic. In this episode we cover the state of the industrial market with Tyson Breinholt at Commercial Properties Inc. and Kevin Miller from Kitchell Development.

    Ep. 39 - Let's Get Fiscal: The Intersection of Financing & Development

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 3, 2023 31:31


    What's the point of great land use entitlements if you can't secure the financing to make it all possible.  Having a finance concierge is key to the effort, and precisely what Adam Finkel at Tower Capital does.

    Ep. 38 - Water Scarcity: Fact or fiction?

    Play Episode Listen Later Sep 19, 2023 41:49


    With all the wild headlines about groundwater limiting new development, it's time to set the record straight. In Arizona, water and development go hand in hand. But it's not doom and gloom as so many national headlines erroneously claim  Get the facts with Jason, Adam, and Michelle Van Quathem, a water law attorney in Arizona.

    Ep. 37 - Will You Be My Banker?

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 27, 2023 38:55


    Securing project financing is just as important as securing the land use entitlements. Without it, you've got nothing.  George Weisz and Neill LeCorgne from Scottsdale Community Bank give us a peak on the creation of a community bank and how it serves underbanked communities.

    Ep. 36 - From Creating News to Covering News

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 18, 2023 64:20


    While our zoning case work creates headlines, reporting on it is better left to journalistic experts like Roland Murphy, AZBEX Digital Magazine. We hope you enjoy a different take on the Dirt to Development podcast with an expert in covering real estate news

    Ep. 35 – Falling off Rooftop Bars and Learning to Fly

    Play Episode Listen Later Jul 12, 2023 41:44


    Liquor laws are often an afterthought when it comes to rezoning new property but sophisticated developers know to tackle that issue early in their due diligence phase, precisely what Withey Morris Baugh can help solve. In this episdoe we share practical advice and great stories to help you navigate Arizona liquor laws before building new developments.

    Ep. 34 - Blow Pops, free enterprise, and housing for all!

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 22, 2023 47:09


    When Senator Steve Kaiser proposed legislation to dramatically change zoning laws in 2022, it created huge shockwaves across Arizona towns and cities.  A second attempt in 2023, created a similar reaction before the proposed legislation eventually lost steam at the state capital.  The motive were noble though, and driven by a cause to provide better access to housing and remove barriers that impede new development.  We were delighted to record this conversation with Senator Kaiser during the middle of that fiery debate among policymakers on a highly critical issue in Arizona.

    Ep. 33 - 12,000 jumps a day

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 8, 2023 46:29


    Development might seem repetitive, like jumping a rope, but there are plenty of areas where you can get tripped up.  Recessions, raising equity, obtaining entitlements, securing financing, etc. can all become huge hurdles, but the best developers always find a way to succeed.  Listen in as Larry Pobuda shares how he has created success in both the best, and worst, economic conditions.

    Ep. 32 - Bonus Episode – Crime Prevention Through Environmental Design (CEPTD)

    Play Episode Listen Later May 26, 2023 13:34


    Among the factors to consider in creating a site plan, one that is often overlooked is crime prevention and threat assessment.  Listen as Shawn Prinkey from Prinkey Consulting shares how developers should reconsider this aspect early in their site plan design process.

    Ep. 31 - When Sean Connery joins the podcast

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 25, 2023 50:38


    Not all sites are created equal and some require serious problem solving with local land use counsel.  Scott Whittington from Avalon Development share how he was once the office King of Albuquerque and how he pivoted towards retail sites across Arizona with the help of his favorite zoning attorneys.

    Ep. 30 - “Just add a little more Gingerbread…” w/Korey Wilkes and Scott Thomas

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 24, 2023 39:18


    The Design Review Board is a step in the entitlement process but it can be tricky to win over.  Depending on the quality of the design, it can either be a comedy roast for a poorly designed project, or a coronation for great development.  In this episode we debate the merits of the DRB with a current DRB board member Scott Thomas and local architect Korey Wilkes.  

    Ep. 29 - A Shot Across the Bow, SB1117

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 9, 2023 20:26


    As anti-multifamily housing opponents become louder and more effective, it was only a matter of time before the pendulum swung back harder.  SB 1117 is a senate bill pending in the Arizona Legislature which has the potential to stymie public engagement and severely limit local zoning control.  Is this a good thing? Listen as we debate SB1117 and its merits.

    Ep. 28 - Depressive Shade of Grey

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 15, 2023 48:13


    Experienced architects and engineers know better than to navigate zoning matters solo.  Hear why David Bohn and Nicole Posten-Thompson utilize local zoning counsel early in their design efforts.

    Ep. 27 - “Two attorneys walk into a bar…” with Mark Tarbell

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 3, 2023 55:45


    2022 was a banner year for Withey Morris and our favorite restaurant Tarbells. Who better to recap it with than an Emmy Award winner, James Beard nominated, Paris-trained, two-time inductee to the Arizona Hall of Culinary Fame, and award winning restaurant owner, Mark Tarbell!!

    Ep. 26 - Finding Your Coach

    Play Episode Listen Later Dec 29, 2022 12:12


    Quick Land Use Update with Ben Tate: Recapping new state law regarding Major General Plan Amendments and why you should talk to your land use Attorney immediately.

    Ep. 25 - The Man, the Myth, the Legend: Mike Withey

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 29, 2022 73:21


    From pinstripe suits and cowboy boots, to Auto malls and State Land, few people have had more of an impact on local development than Mike Withey, the original founder of Withey Morris, PLC and a beloved friend to Jason Morris and Adam Baugh. Enjoy the laughs with us as we take a trip down memory lane and learn why finding friends at the kegger on the first day of law school pays off in the long run.

    Ep. 24 - Greg Vogel, Part 2

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 22, 2022 57:27


    The state of the residential land market, future projections, and why Arizona is well positioned for long term success.  

    Ep. 23 - We're Basically Famous

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 19, 2022 74:46


    What does Elvis at Las Vegas, The Beatles on the Ed Sullivan Show and the Dirt to Development Podcast at the AZ American Planning Association have in common? History making, wild fans and great performances. Listen as we regale audiences at the APA conference with a little back to the future planning knowledge.

    Ep. 22 - Prosopagnosia and the Database Man

    Play Episode Listen Later Sep 22, 2022 42:58


    When Greg Vogel started with Coldwell Banker in the early 80's, little did he know about the value of land databases.  In the 40 years since, he created Land Advisors Organization, one of the premier land brokerage firms and leaders in PropTech. Listen as Greg shares how he went from Fraternity Brother to Land Guru while thrusting Arizona to new development frontiers.

    Ep. 21 - Haboobs and the evolution of experiential retail development…with Chris Hake and Andy Call

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 9, 2022 33:08


    Development has inherent risks which is why it is critical to be responsive to new trends and land use changes. Listen to our friends at Thompson Thrift talk about how they make commercial development an experience and destination to adapt to land use trends.

    Ep. 20 - How to destroy municipal zoning authority...and put zoning attorneys out of business, with Caleb Rhodes

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 1, 2022 28:49


    In early 2022, Arizona municipalities and cities were shocked to learn about a proposed bill in the Arizona State Legislature that would drastically handcuff municipal zoning authority in order to bring more affordable housing to market.  We call it the Zoning Attorney Job Killer legislation.  Thankfully, it didn't advance but the bill started a conversation about how Arizona might consider tackling the affordability issue facing housing today.  Caleb Rhodes, Majority Policy Advisor at Arizona House of Representatives, gives some background and insight on what might be on the horizon down at the State Capital.

    Ep. 19 - Perry Mason, Harvey Specter, Ally McBeal, and…Dan Dowd???

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 21, 2022 43:47


    If you can't play an attorney on TV, at least you can be a great one in real life. In this episode we discuss how land use litigation can affect the best deals and how important it is to assemble the world's best when involving high stakes transactions.

    Ep. 18 - A Baker's Man

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 8, 2022 41:54


    Finding the land deal can be tricky but negotiating the transaction can be more challenging given seller demands, title exceptions, and more. Dave Baker guides us through the real estate transaction, purchase agreement, title review, and closing.

    Ep. 17 - Sniffin' Butts and Other Common Pitfalls to Avoid in Site Selection w/ Brett Hopper and Steve Backman

    Play Episode Listen Later May 24, 2022 39:22


    Sometimes you have to kiss a few frogs before you find a prince. Land development and site selection is the same, except choosing a poor site can blow up your deal…and your job. In this episode we learn from the best as they guide us through what to avoid when evaluating potential sites. 

    Ep. 16 - Top 10 Zoning Landmines to Avoid

    Play Episode Listen Later May 10, 2022 37:44


    Rezoning land is like navigating a minefield. One bad step and your entitlement case is blown to pieces. Listen in to hear tips and tricks to help navigate your way to success with top zoning experts. 

    Ep. 15 - MRAD: Masters in Really Awesome Development…(sorta) w/ Mark Stapp and Andrea Alley

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 26, 2022 50:48


    When the Masters in Real Estate Development (MRED) program launched at ASU in 2006, few people could foresee the role it would play in development projects across Arizona.  In the 16 years since, its influence is seen in the graduates, relationships, and projects that have been created because of it (as well as other copycat programs that imitate its success). In this episode we learn the origins behind the MRED and how it is shaping developments across Arizona.

    Ep. 14 - Joe Johnston: The Mastermind Behind Agritopia, Epicenter, Joe's BBQ and More

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 13, 2022 42:34


    Agritopia is to planning what the Beatles Sgt. Peppers album is to music – a masterpiece. Joe Johnston's accomplishments as a developer and entrepreneur include other successes like Epicenter, Coffee Plantation, Joe's BBQ, Joe's Farmhouse Grill, Liberty Market, and more. Listen as we hear how Joe reinvented his family farm into a model for place-making and creative development and how William Johnston leads the family legacy onto the next frontier of development. We hope you enjoy this storytelling episode with one of the most eclectic developers around.

    Ep. 13 - Michael Rumpeltin, Creative Genius and Adaptive Reuse King

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 15, 2022 34:17


    Michael Rumpeltin is the design brains behind notable projects like The Yard, Joyride Taco, Stock and Stable, Postinos Highland and more. Hear how he makes unique spaces work with adaptive reuse and experiential retail.

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