Podcasts about Covering

Host Seth Swerczek is joined by Miles Neville and Preston Lentfer to answer a question, that frankly, we get a lot… "Can match bullets be used for hunting?" In this episode the guys dive deep into what really matters when choosing a hunting bullet. Breaking down the key differences between ELD Match bullets and ELD-X hunting bullets. Covering how each is designed, manufactured and tested, and what that ultimately means for terminal performance. Let's find out!

From a teenage boy in the fields alone with the sheep to a king in the palace, David's life knew trouble … trouble he made for himself, trouble from others, and a lot of trouble with his kids.Despite his issues, David constantly showed us how to turn to the Lord with anything and everything.Listen to Psalm 18:1-6 …I love you, Lord; you are my strength. The Lord is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.  I called on the Lord, who is worthy of praise, and he saved me from my enemies. The ropes of death entangled me; floods of destruction swept over me. The grave wrapped its ropes around me; death laid a trap in my path. But in my distress I cried out to the Lord; yes, I prayed to my God for help. He heard me from his sanctuary; my cry to him reached his ears. (NLT) If you were to composed a psalm of your own, what would you say to God? What would you say about God?You know what enemies, threats, floods, and distress feel like, don't you? Do you know the other side David speaks about? To allow God to rescue you? To cry out to Him for help?Listen to part of this passage again in The New Life Bible … I love You, O Lord, my strength. The Lord is my rock, and my safe place, and the One Who takes me out of trouble. My God is my rock, in Whom I am safe. He is my safe-covering, my saving strength, and my strong tower. I call to the Lord, Who has the right to be praised. And I am saved from those who hate me. The ropes of death were all around me. The floods of death make me afraid. The ropes of the grave were all around me. The traps of death were set for me. I called to the Lord in my trouble. I cried to God for help. He heard my voice from His holy house. My cry for help came into His ears.Let's take a few moments to list some of the major troubles you have experienced … maybe something you are walking through right now?Now list what God has done or what You want to see Him do?Listing, even writing out your prayers is a great exercise … one you might try doing with your kids too.Let's pray together: “Heavenly Father, You are my strength, my Rock, my Safe Place, my Covering, my Strong Tower. Thank You for hearing me when I cry out to You. Thank You for answering, not always on my time, but on Yours. As above, so below.”

Undaunted by near unanimous opposition from the legal profession, the Government last week published the Courts and Tribunals Bill which, if enacted, will mean that roughly half of cases currently tried by juries will be decided either by magistrates or a single Crown Court Judge. And to discuss the content and implications of the bill, Ken Macdonald KC and Tim Owen KC are joined by the Chief Executive of JUSTICE, Fiona Rutherford who, in a previous life, was the Director of Access to Justice Policy at the Ministry of Justice as well as holding other frontline policy roles in the criminal justice sector. Given David Lammy's denunciation of previous Conservative Government proposals to limit jury trial in a series of 2020 tweets – “the opportunity to be judged by 12 peers is vital to prevent bias and ensure justice”, “the right to trial by your fellow citizens is fundamental to our democracy. It would be wrong of the government to abandon this valuable tradition for short-term benefit” – how on earth is he the right person to advocate such radical measures to undermine our system of trial by jury in all triable either way cases where the sentence can be up to three years imprisonment? In light of Lammy's 2017 Independent Review into the treatment of BAME individuals in the criminal justice system, on what basis does he now believe that forcing more defendants to face trial by an unrepresentative body of lay Magistrates will be a fairer way of delivering justice? And what lies behind the Courts Minister's sudden awakening to the idea that abandoning trial by jury for a vast swathe of cases will actually be fairer for everyone as a matter of principle and that she would be advocating in favour of the reform proposals even if there was no Crown Court backlog? Finally, as the House of Commons begins its Second Reading of the Courts and Tribunals Bill, Ken, Tim and Fiona consider the prospects of another government U-turn in the face of reports of growing Labour backbench concern that the Lammy reform package will damage Labour's commitment to justice and fairness without actually tackling the endemic problems which are the cause of the backlog.  -- Covering the critical intersections of politics and law in the UK with expert commentary on high-profile legal cases, political controversies, prisons and sentencing, human rights law, current political events and the shifting landscape of justice and democracy. With in-depth discussions and influential guests, Double Jeopardy is the podcast that uncovers the forces shaping Britain's legal and political future.       What happens when politics and law collide? How do politics shape the law - and when does the law push back? What happens when judicial independence is tested, human rights come under attack, or freedom of expression is challenged? And who really holds power in Britain's legal and political system?  Get answers to questions like these weekly on Wednesdays.  Double Jeopardy is presented by Ken Macdonald KC, former Director of Public Prosecutions, and Tim Owen KC, as they break down the legal and political issues in Britain. From high-profile legal cases to the evolving state of British democracy, Double Jeopardy offers expert legal commentary on the most pressing topics in UK law, politics, and human rights.      Ken Macdonald KC served as Director of Public Prosecutions from 2003-2008, shaping modern prosecutorial policy and advocating for the rule of law. He is a former Warden of Wadham College, Oxford, a crossbench member of the House of Lords, and a leading writer, commentator and broadcaster on politics and the rule of law.  Tim Owen KC has been involved in many of the most significant public, criminal and human rights law cases over the past four decades.  Both bring unparalleled experience from the frontline of Britain's legal and political landscape.  If you like The Rest Is Politics, Talking Politics, Law Pod UK and Today in Focus, you'll love Double Jeopardy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

*the guys apologize in advance for less-than-ideal backup audio that only lasts until 41:57. But it's a fun discussion and worth listening until they swap to primary audio! Thanks for your understanding!* Covering ten OEMs for ‘Peak INFINITI - Lucid,' the guys utilize two different strategies of evaluating the most notable cars from each manufacturer. They generate ideas for Chris D. In West VA, who wants a long term car and needs to keep the parents happy. Then, David is a 100% car enthusiast who lives in NY, but loves country back roads too. He only wants to add quirky, unique and fun to the fleet - what should he buy next? Audio-only MP3 is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and 10 other platforms. Look for us on Tuesdays if you'd like to watch us debate, disagree and then go drive again! 00:00 - Intro 00:12 - Lotus For Me?!? What's That? 6:56 - Hyundai Ioniq 6 Sales Discontinued In U.S. 8:47 - Peak Car (INFINITI - Lucid) 1:14:17 - EDD + HOD Events And Adventures 2026 1:16:55 - Car Debate #1: Pleasing The Parents 1:30:02 - Car Debate #2: Only Add More! Rate and review us on Apple Podcasts, and subscribe to our two YouTube channels. Write to us your Topic Tuesdays, Car Conclusions and those great Car Debates at everydaydrivertv@gmail.com or everydaydriver.com Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Special Note: This episode is not new; it was deleted by the Spotify robots due to the usage of music, but we wanted it to stay in the library because the idea for the episode came from a listener, and we love that. So, here it is - back in the library - new episodes coming soon! ____What happens when you flip one of our favorite questions on its head?In this episode, Todd Rossnagel and co-host Tim Arnold respond to a listener challenge from fan of the show Dave Schwind: instead of picking songs they want Wilco to cover, they imagine which artists should be covering Wilco.From Beck tackling “Sunken Treasure” to Paul McCartney reimagining “Sonny Feeling,” from Dead & Company stretching out on “Kingpin” to Sturgill Simpson turning “Bull Black Nova” into a fuzz-drenched nightmare.We talk about what makes a cover transcendent, why some songs seem built to be reinterpreted, and how Wilco's catalog invites dialogue across genres and generations.As always, it's less about settling debates and more about loving the music, thinking out loud, and continuing the long tradition of shoving Wilco onto friends, family, and anyone willing to listen.Listener ideas welcome. Voice memos encouraged. Got an idea? Email us: shovingwilco@gmail.com

For a deeper study of God's Word, plus daily resources for your walk with Jesus, visit https://passionequip.com/. — With Passion City Online, you can join us every Sunday live at 9:30a and 11:45a, and our gatherings are available on-demand starting at 7p! Join us at https://passioncitychurch.com — Subscribe to our channel to see more messages from Passion City Church:  https://www.youtube.com/passioncitychurch — Looking for content for your Kids? Subscribe to our Passion Kids Channel: https://passion.link/passionkidsonline  — If you would like to give to our house, visit https://passioncitychurch.com/give/ — Check out Passion's books, music, and more at https://passionresources.com/ — At Passion City Church, we believe that because God has displayed the ultimate sacrifice in Jesus, our response to that in worship must be extravagant. It is our privilege and our created purpose to reflect God's Glory to Him through our praise, our sacrifice, and our song.  — Follow Passion City Church: https://www.instagram.com/passioncity/  Follow Louie Giglio: https://www.instagram.com/louiegiglio  Passion City Church is a Jesus church with locations in Atlanta and Washington D.C. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Larry Johnson : US Intel Covering Its BacksideSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Table of Contents: Israeli Jews & Christian Zionists Want To Build The Third Temple–Which They Believe Will Herald The End Times & Their Awaited Messiah (Who Will Turn Out To Be the Antichrist) See Scott Johnson's Teachings: ++The Gog and Magog War, The 1000 Year Millennial Reign of Jesus Christ, The Abomination of Desolation, The Rebuilt Temple, The Image of the Beast, The 7 Year Tribulation Bible Study September 18, 2011 ++The Pre-tribulation Rapture vs. The Post-tribulation Rapture–Parts 1-4–December 22, 2011 Catherine Austin Fitts Interview: ‘The goal is to depopulate and control the remnant' Wars are fought over shipping routes and resources, not to liberate any oppressed people group  Iran Raises The Red Flag Of Revenge Over The Jamkaran Mosque As Shiite Muslims All Over The Globe Start To Commit Acts Of Terror 3 Grand Ayatollahs Have Declared Global Jihad Against The United States And Israel, as their followers now have an obligation to conduct a holy war. From this point forward, millions of Shiite Muslims all over the world will go to war  IRGC – Americans Will No Longer Be Safe; Not Even in their own homes Iran has officially declared JIHAD against the United States and Israel.  We Went from “4 days” to ” 4 weeks” and now, “Maybe Boots on the ground” in Iran Update: The Iran War Could Last 8 Weeks, Not 4 Weeks As Previously Thought, Hegseth Says The U.S. Is LOSING The Iran War & Here’s Why! Russia Sharing Far More Military Tech With Iran Than Previously Known Russia says it will do everything possible to make US-Israel military operation against Iran impossible.  Iran Targeting Global Internet – Bombing Major Data Centers Mood Inside Pentagon: Intense. Paranoid. Turns out the ‘Experts’ were wrong–PODCASTERS WERE RIGHT ALL ALONG! Russia and China are helping Iran. Payback to the US for what the US has been doing to Russia by supplying Ukraine with weapons  S. Missile Supplies Armies of Disinformation, Propaganda, Outright lies; Covering the Iran War Almost Impossible Strait of Hormuz Closure Enforcement; But Iran Didn’t Close it, London Did, Through INSURANCE CANCELLATION Qatar Natural Gas Declares “Force Majeure” – All Gas output HALTED Iran Begins Targeting Oil Infrastructure in Middle East & What This Could Result If This Continues–China Orders Major Fuel Refiners to Halt Diesel and Gasoline Exports Immediately: BETWEEN VENEZUELA AND IRAN THE USA HAS A CHOKE HOLD ON CHINESE OIL—SO CHINA WILL HAVE TO DO SOMETHING AND WILL NOT SIT IDLY BY  Unable to Ship–Middle East Oil Nations Face SHUTDOWN of Oil Wells!! “Apocalyptic”: Massive Fireballs Over Tehran as Bombs Hit Iran, A ‘War of the Oil Refineries’ Opens Iran War Cost Tracker–Live Estimates of U.S. Taxpayer Spending–Based on the Pentagon’s preliminary estimate of $1 billion per day Nobody is discussing how utterly terrifying the food situation just got for the Middle East right now–Food Shipments to Persian Gulf Countries are now CUT-OFF! South Korea Chemical Plants Declare “Force Majeure” – Singapore “No Bunker Fuel” “This Will Bring Down The Global Economy”: Hormuz Chaos, ‘Mr. Gold’ Warns of ‘System Reset’ Delusional, Demon Possessed Trump Demands “Unconditional Surrender” of Iran or NO DEAL: There Will Be A SELECTION of New Leaders I Know Exactly Why Trump Turned on Me — Now I’m Naming Names PDF: Emergency Freedom Alerts 3-9-26 Click Here To Play The Part 2 Audio Source

Today on the show: complete coverage on the Mid East with Weijia Jiang from CBS News and Erick Erickson. Stephen Stapczynski from Bloomberg News monitors the oil markets. The latest on the Save Act. Covering the death of the Hall County teacher. Plus, actor Tim Matheson joins us live. 9am-noon on 95.5 WSB.

Today on the show: complete coverage on the Mid East with Weijia Jiang from CBS News and Erick Erickson. Stephen Stapczynski from Bloomberg News monitors the oil markets. The latest on the Save Act. Covering the death of the Hall County teacher. Plus, actor Tim Matheson joins us live. 9am-noon on 95.5 WSB.

Today on the show: complete coverage on the Mid East with Weijia Jiang from CBS News and Erick Erickson. Stephen Stapczynski from Bloomberg News monitors the oil markets. The latest on the Save Act. Covering the death of the Hall County teacher. Plus, actor Tim Matheson joins us live. 9am-noon on 95.5 WSB.

Shame convinces us that our mistakes define us, pushes us to hide behind busy lives or excuses, and makes us feel like we have to run from God instead of toward Him. But the good news is that God's response has always been the same: He comes looking for us. Just like He asked Adam and Eve, “Where are you?”, God still pursues us today with grace, not condemnation. Real freedom begins when we stop hiding and bring our shame to the cross where Jesus already carried it for us. (Talk by Josh Daubert)

“Affliction, Covering, and National Accountability”Teachers: Kerry & Karen BattleAhava ~ Love AssemblyLeviticus 16 is not ceremony.It is survival law.After the death of Aaron's sons in Leviticus 10, Yahuah establishes the structure that prevents further destruction. Chapters 11–15 defined impurity. Leviticus 16 answers the question: How does a nation remain alive near the Presence?This chapter legislates restricted access, priestly responsibility, blood application, removal of iniquity, commanded affliction, and a statute declared olam, without expiration clause.This is covenant government.WHAT WE COVER IN THIS MESSAGERestricted Access and SurvivalLeviticus 16:1–2Access to the Most Set-Apart Place is not casual. Even the High Priest is governed. Proximity without order results in death.Preparation and DesignationLeviticus 16:3–10Washing, linen garments, bull for the priest, two goats, lots cast before Yahuah. Authority operates under command, not preference.Blood Within the VeilLeviticus 16:11–19Cleansing of the sanctuary because of the uncleanness and transgressions of Israel. Private sin contributes to collective contamination. The altar is not immune from the people.Confession and RemovalLeviticus 16:20–22All iniquities are confessed and borne away. Cleansing is incomplete if iniquity remains in the camp.Reset and ResidueLeviticus 16:23–28Garments changed. Bodies washed. Contact leaves residue. Holiness requires reset.Affliction and PermanenceLeviticus 16:29–34“This shall be a statute forever.” Olam means no expiration clause. The people are commanded to afflict their souls. Cleansing is paired with humility. Structure preserves those who submit to it.WHY THIS MESSAGE MATTERSHoliness is not casual.Access is governed.Cleansing is structured.Iniquity must be removed.Humility is commanded.Neglect is not harmless.Leviticus 16 teaches that dwelling with Yahuah requires restraint before joy, affliction before celebration, cleansing before tabernacles.SCRIPTURE REFERENCES FOR STUDYLeviticus 10Leviticus 11–15Leviticus 23:27–32Numbers 29:7Exodus 30:10Isaiah 58Joel 2Every section is taught precept upon precept.ABOUT AHAVA ~ LOVE ASSEMBLYWe teach the Pure Word of Yahuah.No religion.No tradition.No compromise.Our teaching follows the Sovereign Blueprint:Law | Precept | Example | Wisdom | Understanding | Prudence | Conviction | Fruit of the Ruach | Final Heart CheckSUPPORT THE WORK — GIVE VIA ZELLEZelle at: ahavaloveministry.comZelle only.No CashApp.No PayPal.FINAL WORDAccess is restricted.Blood is applied.Iniquity is removed.The nation humbles itself.Presence dwells where order is honored.Final Heart Check:If cleansing is commanded and affliction is required, are you humbling yourself under covenant structure, or assuming access without restraint?

Hour 1

Northing better than supporting your country through sports Maxx Crosby to Ravens Eli Willits joined G&D today

If you've ever experienced betrayal in a relationship - you'll know first hand how painful it can be.And I'm dedicating today's episode to talk about it. Covering things like:Handling the shock of betrayalWhy the brain obsesses over needing to know every detailThe meaning we make about ourselves and the futureShould you stay or leave?How trust is rebuilt (and why self-trust matters most)Mentioned in the episode:Processing Emotions MeditationEnquire about 1:1 coaching - rebecca@rebeccaorecoaching.com

Another gauntlet of an episode with our good buddy Eric Kennedy from BigBlueInteractive. Covering everything from barking free agency rumors via BBI asshats through day 3 prospects you've never heard of for this draft class - we cover it all. Get tuned up and tune in for a wild ride. 

Glute Building Masterclass LIVE Glute Building Masterclass by Mind Pump top-trainer Corinne. Sign up today! (1:50) How we got here. (3:11) Breaking down the components of the barbell squat. (3:59) The importance of having the RIGHT coaching and training to queue properly. (7:32) Ways to improve mobility. (9:08) Learning the ability to keep your knees from collapsing in. (13:34) How to access a greater range of motion to improve the effectiveness of the hip thrust. (14:51) Covering the various rep ranges: What they are good for, why you want to do either one, and what the strengths of each of them are. (16:25) You can't talk about building without an effective diet strategy. (16:57) Related Links/Products Mentioned Live Glute Building Masterclass ** Saturday, March 7th at 10 AM PST - In studio and online. How to execute the Squat and hip thrust - activation, mobility, access the greatest range of motion, rep ranges, frequency, and a little bit of diet. ** Visit: www.mindpumpmasterclass.com  Visit Seed for an exclusive offer for Mind Pump listeners! ** Code 20MINDPUMP for 20% off your first month of Seed's DS-01® Daily Synbiotic. ** March Spring Sale: Symmetry ($187), Prime ($107), Advanced Training Techniques Guide ($47) all for $147! (Over 50% off!) Visit: www.mapsmarch.com  Mind Pump Store Mind Pump #2792: Squat & Hip Thrust Butt-Building Master Class The Breakdown Recovery Trap, Why You Aren't Progressing Mind Pump Podcast – YouTube Mind Pump Free Resources People Mentioned Corinne Schmiedhauser (@mindpumpcorinne) Instagram  

This week on Black on Black Cinema, the crew returns to review Soul Men (2008) which was released just two months after Bernie Mac's death, making it a bittersweet farewell to one of comedy's greatest talents. Directed by Malcolm D. Lee and starring Samuel L. Jackson alongside Mac, this road trip musical comedy follows two estranged backup singers reuniting for a tribute concert after their lead singer dies.Black on Black Cinema is a long-running podcast featuring in-depth Black movie reviews and frank conversations that matter to the Black community. We review Black films across every genre — from Black horror and Black sci-fi to indie dramas, comedies, and blockbuster action. Covering filmmakers like Spike Lee, Jordan Peele, Ryan Coogler, Ava DuVernay, and more. Hosted by Jay, Micah, Terrence, and T'ara. Featured on RogerEbert.com. A TNP Studios production. New episodes weekly on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, and all major platforms. For more TNP Studios content, check out The Nerdpocalypse (movie & TV news), Look Forward (progressive politics), and Dense Pixels (video game news).

The reception to our recent post on Code Reviews has been strong. Catch up!Amid a maelstrom of discussion on whether or not AI is killing SaaS, one of the top publicly listed SaaS companies in the world has just reported record revenues, clearing well over $1.1B in ARR for the first time with a 28% margin. As we comment on the pod, Aaron Levie is the rare public company CEO equally at home in both worlds of Silicon Valley and Wall Street/Main Street, by day helping 70% of the Fortune 500 with their Enterprise Advanced Suite, and yet by night is often found in the basements of early startups and tweeting viral insights about the future of agents.Now that both Cursor, Cloudflare, Perplexity, Anthropic and more have made Filesystems and Sandboxes and various forms of “Just Give the Agent a Box” cool (not just cool; it is now one of the single hottest areas in AI infrastructure growing 100% MoM), we find it a delightfully appropriate time to do the episode with the OG CEO who has been giving humans and computers Boxes since he was a college dropout pitching VCs at a Michael Arrington house party.Enjoy our special pod, with fan favorite returning guest/guest cohost Jeff Huber!Note: We didn't directly discuss the AI vs SaaS debate - Aaron has done many, many, many other podcasts on that, and you should read his definitive essay on it. Most commentators do not understand SaaS businesses because they have never scaled one themselves, and deeply reflected on what the true value proposition of SaaS is.We also discuss Your Company is a Filesystem:We also shoutout CTO Ben Kus' and the AI team, who talked about the technical architecture and will return for AIE WF 2026.Full Video EpisodeTimestamps* 00:00 Adapting Work for Agents* 01:29 Why Every Agent Needs a Box* 04:38 Agent Governance and Identity* 11:28 Why Coding Agents Took Off First* 21:42 Context Engineering and Search Limits* 31:29 Inside Agent Evals* 33:23 Industries and Datasets* 35:22 Building the Agent Team* 38:50 Read Write Agent Workflows* 41:54 Docs Graphs and Founder Mode* 55:38 Token FOMO Culture* 56:31 Production Function Secrets* 01:01:08 Film Roots to Box* 01:03:38 AI Future of Movies* 01:06:47 Media DevRel and EngineeringTranscriptAdapting Work for AgentsAaron Levie: Like you don't write code, you talk to an agent and it goes and does it for you, and you may be at best review it. That's even probably like, like largely not even what you're doing. What's happening is we are changing our work to make the agents effective. In that model, the agent didn't really adapt to how we work.We basically adapted to how the agent works. All of the economy has to go through that exact same evolution. Right now, it's a huge asset and an advantage for the teams that do it early and that are kinda wired into doing this ‘cause you'll see compounding returns. But that's just gonna take a while for most companies to actually go and get this deployed.swyx: Welcome to the Lane Space Pod. We're back in the chroma studio with uh, chroma, CEO, Jeff Hoover. Welcome returning guest now guest host.Aaron Levie: It's a pleasure. Wow. How'd you get upgraded to, uh, to that?swyx: Because he's like the perfect guy to be guest those for you.Aaron Levie: That makes sense actually, for We love context. We, we both really love context le we really do.We really do.swyx: Uh, and we're here with, uh, Aaron Levy. Welcome.Aaron Levie: Thank you. Good to, uh, good to be [00:01:00] here.swyx: Uh, yeah. So we've all met offline and like chatted a little bit, but like, it's always nice to get these things in person and conversation. Yeah. You just started off with so much energy. You're, you're super excited about agents.I loveAaron Levie: agents.swyx: Yeah. Open claw. Just got by, got bought by OpenAI. No, not bought, but you know, you know what I mean?Aaron Levie: Some, some, you know, acquihire. Executiveswyx: hire.Aaron Levie: Executive hire. Okay. Executive hire. Say,swyx: hey, that's my term. Okay. Um, what are you pounding the table on on agents? You have so many insightful tweets.Why Every Agent Needs a BoxAaron Levie: Well, the thing that, that we get super excited by that I think is probably, you know, should be relatively obvious is we've, we've built a platform to help enterprises manage their files and their, their corporate files and the permissions of who has access to those files and the sharing collaboration of those files.All of those files contain really, really important information for the enterprise. It might have your contracts, it might have your research materials, it might have marketing information, it might have your memos. All that data obviously has, you know, predominantly been used by humans. [00:02:00] But there's been one really interesting problem, which is that, you know, humans only really work with their files during an active engagement with them, and they kind of go away and you don't really see them for a long time.And all of a sudden, uh, with the power of AI and AI agents, all of that data becomes extremely relevant as this ongoing source of, of answers to new questions of data that will transform into, into something else that, that produces value in your organization. It, it contains the answer to the new employee that's onboarding, that needs to ramp up on a project.Um, it contains the answer to the right thing to sell a customer when you're having a conversation to them, with them contains the roadmap information that's gonna produce the next feature. So all that data. That previously we've been just sort of storing and, and you know, occasionally forgetting about, ‘cause we're only working on the new active stuff.All of that information becomes valuable to the enterprise and it's gonna become extremely valuable to end users because now they can have agents go find what they're looking for and produce new, new [00:03:00] value and new data on that information. And it's gonna become incredibly valuable to agents because agents can roam around and do a bunch of work and they're gonna need access to that data as well.And um, and you know, sometimes that will be an agent that is sort of working on behalf of, of, of you and, and effectively as you as and, and they are kind of accessing all of the same information that you have access to and, and operating as you in the system. And then sometimes there's gonna be agents that are just.Effectively autonomous and kind of run on their own and, and you're gonna collaborate and work with them kind of like you did another person. Open Claw being the most recent and maybe first real sort of, you know, kind of, you know, up updating everybody's, you know, views of this landscape version of, of what that could look like, which is, okay, I have an agent.It's on its own system, it's on its own computer, it has access to its own tools. I probably don't give it access to my entire life. I probably communicate with it like I would an assistant or a colleague and then it, it sort of has this sandbox environment. So all of that has massive implications for a platform that manage that [00:04:00] enterprise data.We think it's gonna just transform how we work with all of the enterprise content that we work with, and we just have to make sure we're building the right platform to support that.swyx: The sort of shorthand I put it is as people build agents, everybody's just realizing that every agent needs a box. Yes.And it's nice to be called box and just give everyone a box.Aaron Levie: Hey, I if I, you know, if we can make that go viral, uh, like I, I think that that terminology, I, that's theswyx: tagline. Every agentAaron Levie: needs a box. Every agent needs a box. If we can make that the headline of this, I'm fine with this. And that's the billboard I wanna like Yeah, exactly.Every agent needs a box. Um, I like it. Can we ship this? Like,swyx: okay, let's do it. Yeah.Aaron Levie: Uh, my work here is done and I got the value I needed outta this podcast Drinks.swyx: Yeah.Agent Governance and IdentityAaron Levie: But, but, um, but, but, you know, so the thing that we, we kind of think about is, um, is, you know, whether you think the number 10 x or a hundred x or whatever the number is, we're gonna have some order of magnitude more agents than people.That's inevitable. It has to happen. So then the question is, what is the infrastructure that's needed to make all those agents effective in the enterprise? Make sure that they are well governed. Make sure they're only doing [00:05:00] safe things on your information. Make sure that they're not getting exposed. The data that they shouldn't have access to.There's gonna be just incredibly spectacularly crazy security incidents that will happen with agents because you'll prompt, inject an agent and sort of find your way through the CRM system and pull out data that you shouldn't have access to. Oh, weJeff Huber: have God,Aaron Levie: right? I mean, that's just gonna happen all over the place, right?So, so then the thing is, is how do you make sure you have the right security, the permissions, the access controls, the data governance. Um, we actually don't yet exactly know in many cases how we're gonna regulate some of these agents, right? If you think about an agent in financial services, does it have the exact same financial sort of, uh, requirements that a human did?Or is it, is the risk fully on the human that was interacting or created the agent? All open questions, but no matter what, there's gonna need to be a layer that manages the, the data they have access to, the workflows that they're involved in, pulling up data from multiple systems. This is the new infrastructure opportunity in the era of agents.swyx: You have a piece on agent identities, [00:06:00] which I think was today, um, which I think a lot of breaking news, the security, security people are talking about, right? Like you basically, I, I always think of this as like, well you need the human you and then there you need the agent. YouAaron Levie: Yes.swyx: And uh, well, I don't know if it's that simple, but is box going to have an opinion on that or you're just gonna be like, well we're just the sort of the, the source layer.Yeah. Let's Okta of zero handle that.Aaron Levie: I think we're gonna have an opinion and we will work with generally wherever the contours of the market end up. Um, and the reason that we're gonna have an opinion more than other topics probably is because one of the biggest use cases for why your agent might need it, an identity is for file system access.So thus we have to kind of think about this pretty deeply. And I think, uh, unless you're like in our world thinking about this particular problem all day long, it might be, you know, like, why is this such a big deal? And the reason why it's a really big deal is because sometimes sort of say, well just give the agent an, an account on the system and it just treats, treat it like every other type of user on the system.The [00:07:00] problem is, is that I as Aaron don't really have any responsibility over anybody else's box account in our organization. I can't see the box account of any other employee that I work with. I am not liable for anything that they do. And they have, I have, I have, you know, strict privacy requirements on everything that they're able to, you know, that, that, that they work on.Agents don't have that, you know, don't have those properties. The person who creates the agent probably is gonna, for the foreseeable future, take on a lot of the liability of what that agent does. That agent doesn't deserve any privacy because, because it's, you know, it can't fully be autonomously operated and it doesn't have any legal, you know, kind of, you know, responsibility.So thus you can't just be like, oh, well I'll just create a bunch of accounts and then I'll, I'll kind of work with that agent and I'll talk to it occasionally. Like you need oversight of that. And so then the question is, how do you have a world where the agent, sometimes you have oversight of, but what if that agent goes and works with other people?That person over there is collaborating with the agent on something you shouldn't have [00:08:00] access to what they're doing. So we have all of these new boundaries that we're gonna have to figure out of, of, you know, it's really, really easy. So far we've been in, in easy mode. We've hit the easy button with ai, which is the agent just is you.And when you're in quad code and you're in cursor, and you're in Codex, you're just, the agent is you. You're offing into your services. It can do everything you can do. That's the easy mode. The hard mode is agents are kind of running on their own. People check in with them occasionally, they're doing things autonomously.How do you give them access to resources in the enterprise and not dramatically increased the security risk and the risk that you might expose the wrong thing to somebody. These are all the new problems that we have to get solved. I like the identity layer and, and identity vendors as being a solution to that, but we'll, we'll need some opinions as well because so many of the use cases are these collaborative file system use cases, which is how do I give it an agent, a subset of my data?Give it its own workspace as well. ‘cause it's gonna need to store off its own information that would be relevant for it. And how do I have the right oversight into that? [00:09:00]Jeff Huber: One thing, which, um, I think is kind interesting, think about is that you know, how humans work, right? Like I may not also just like give you access to the whole file.I might like sit next to you and like scroll to this like one part of the file and just show you that like one part and like, you know,swyx: partial file access.Jeff Huber: I'm just saying I think like our, like RA does seem to be dead, right? Like you wanna say something is dead uhhuh probably RA is dead. And uh, like the auth story to me seems like incredibly unsolved and unaddressed by like the existing state of like AI vendors.ButAaron Levie: yeah, I think, um, we're, I mean you're taking obviously really to level limit that we probably need to solve for. Yeah. And we built an access control system that was, was kind of like, you know, its own little world for, for a long time. And um, and the idea was this, it's a many to many collaboration system where I can give you any part of the file system.And it's a waterfall model. So if I give you higher up in the, in the, in the system, you get everything below. And that, that kind of created immense flexibility because I can kind of point you to any layer in the, in the tree, but then you're gonna get access to everything kind of below it. And that [00:10:00] mostly is, is working in this, in this world.But you do have to manage this issue, which is how do I create an agent that has access to some of my stuff and somebody else's stuff as well. Mm-hmm. And which parts do I get to look at as the creator of the agent? And, and these are just brand new problems? Yeah. Crazy. And humans, when there was a human there that was really easy to do.Like, like if the three of us were all sharing, there'd be a Venn diagram where we'd have an overlapping set of things we've shared, but then we'd have our own ways that we shared with each other. In an agent world, somebody needs to take responsibility for what that agent has access to and what they're working on.These are like the, some of the most probably, you know, boring problems for 98% of people on, on the internet, but they will be the problems that are the difference between can you actually have autonomous agents in an enterprise contextswyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: That are not leaking your data constantly.swyx: No. Like, I mean, you know, I run a very, very small company for my conference and like we already have data sensitivity issues.Yes. And some of my team members cannot see Yes. Uh, the others and like, I can't imagine what it's like to run a Fortune 500 and like, you have to [00:11:00] worry about this. I'm just kinda curious, like you, you talked to a lot like, like 70, 80% of your cus uh, of the Fortune 500, your customers.Aaron Levie: Yep. 67%. Just so we're being verySEswyx: precise.So Yeah. I'm notAaron Levie: Okay. Okay.swyx: Something I'm rounding up. Yes. Round up. I'm projecting to, forAaron Levie: the government.swyx: I'm projecting to the end of the year.Aaron Levie: Okay.swyx: There you go.Aaron Levie: You do make it sound like, like we, we, well we've gotta be on this. Like we're, we're taking way too long to get to 80%. Well,swyx: no, I mean, so like. How are they approaching it?Right? Because you're, you don't have a, you don't have a final answer yet.Why Coding Agents Took Off FirstAaron Levie: Well, okay, so, so this is actually, this is the stark reality that like, unfortunately is the kinda like pouring the water on the party a little bit.swyx: Yes.Aaron Levie: We all in Silicon Valley are like, have the absolute best conditions possible for AI ever.And I think we all saw the dke, you know, kind of Dario podcast and this idea of AI coding. Why is that taken off? And, and we're not yet fully seeing it everywhere else. Well, look, if you just like enumerated the list of properties that AI coding has and then compared it to other [00:12:00] knowledge work, let's just, let's just go through a few of them.Generally speaking, you bring on a new engineer, they have access to a large swath of the code base. Like, there's like very, like you, just, like new engineer comes on, they can just go and find the, the, the stuff that they, they need to work with. It's a fully text in text out. Medium. It's only, it's just gonna be text at the end of the day.So it's like really great from a, from just a, uh, you know, kinda what the agent can work with. Obviously the models are super trained on that dataset. The labs themselves have a really strong, kind of self-reinforcing positive flywheel of why they need to do, you know, agent coding deeply. So then you get just better tooling, better services.The actual developers of the AI are daily users of the, of the thing that they're we're working on versus like the, you know, probably there's only like seven Claude Cowork legal plugin users at Anthropic any given day, but there's like a couple thousand Claude code and you know, users every single day.So just like, think about which one are they getting more feedback on. All day long. So you just go through this list. You have a, you know, everybody who's a [00:13:00] developer by definition is technical so they can go install the latest thing. We're all generally online, or at least, you know, kinda the weird ones are, and we're all talking to each other, sharing best practices, like that's like already eight differences.Versus the rest of the economy. Every other part of the economy has like, like six to seven headwinds relative to that list. You go into a company, you're a banker in financial services, you have access to like a, a tiny little subset of the total data that's gonna be relevant to do your job. And you're have to start to go and talk to a bunch of people to get the right data to do your job because Sally didn't add you to that deal room, you know, folder.And that that, you know, the information is actually in a completely different organization that you now have to go in and, and sort of run into. And it's like you have this endless list of access controls and security. As, as you talked about, you have a medium, which is not, it's not just text, right? You have, you have a zoom call that, that you're getting all of the requirements from the customer.You have a lot of in-person conversations and you're doing in-person sales and like how do you ever [00:14:00] digitize all of that information? Um, you know, I think a lot of people got upset with this idea that the code base has all the context, um, that I don't know if you follow, you know, did you follow some of that conversation that that went viral?Is like, you know, it's not that simple that, that the code base doesn't have all the knowledge, but like it's a lot, you're a lot better off than you are with other areas of knowledge work. Like you, we like, we like have documentation practices, you write specifications. Those things don't exist for like 80% of work that happens in the enterprise.That's the divide that we have, which is, which is AI coding has, has just fully, you know, where we've reached escape velocity of how powerful this stuff is, and then we're gonna have to find a way to bring that same energy and momentum, but to all these other areas of knowledge work. Where the tools aren't there, the data's not set up to be there.The access controls don't make it that easy. The context engineering is an incredibly hard problem because again, you have access control challenges, you have different data formats. You have end users that are gonna need to kind of be kind of trained through this as opposed to their adopting [00:15:00] these tools in their free time.That's where the Fortune 500 is. And so we, I think, you know, have to be prepared as an industry where we are gonna be on a multi-year march to, to be able to bring agents to the enterprise for these workflows. And I think probably the, the thing that we've learned most in coding that, that the rest of the world is not yet, I think ready for, I mean, we're, they'll, they'll have to be ready for it because it's just gonna inevitably happen is I think in coding.What, what's interesting is if you think about the practice of coding today versus two years ago. It's probably the most changed workflow in maybe the history of time from the amount of time it's changed, right? Yeah. Like, like has any, has any workflow in the entire economy changed that quickly in terms of the amount of change?I just, you know, at least in any knowledge worker workflow, there's like very rarely been an event where one piece of technology and work practice has so fundamentally, you know, changed, changed what you do. Like you don't write code, you talk to an agent and it goes and [00:16:00] does it for you, and you may be at best review it.And even that's even probably like, like largely not even what you're doing. What's happening is we are changing our work to make the agents effective. In that model, the agent didn't really adapt to how we work. We basically adapted to how the agent works. Mm-hmm. All of the economy has to go through that exact same evolution.The rest of the economy is gonna have to update its workflows to make agents effective. And to give agents the context that they need and to actually figure out what kind of prompting works and to figure out how do you ensure that the agent has the right access to information to be able to execute on its work.I, you know, this is not the panacea that people were hoping for, of the agent drops in, just automates your life. Like you have to basically re-engineer your workflow to get the most out of agents and, uh, and that, that's just gonna take, you know, multiple years across the economy. Right now it's a huge asset and an advantage for the teams that do it early and that are kinda wired into doing this.‘cause [00:17:00] you'll see compounding returns, but that's just gonna take a while for most companies to actually go and get this deployed.swyx: I love, I love pushing back. I think that. That is what a lot of technology consultants love to hear this sort of thing, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. First to, to embrace the ai. Yes. To get to the promised land, you must pay me so much money to a hundred percent to adopt the prescribed way of, uh, conforming to the agents.Yes. And I worry that you will be eclipsed by someone else who says, no, come as you are.Aaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: And we'll meet you where you are.Aaron Levie: And, and, and and what was the thing that went viral a week ago? OpenAI probably, uh, is hiring F Dees. Yeah. Uh, to go into the enterprise. Yeah. Yeah. And then philanthropic is embedded at Goldman Sachs.Yeah. So if the labs are having to do this, if, if the labs have decided that they need to hire FDE and professional services, then I think that's a pretty clear indication that this, there's no easy mode of workflow transformation. Yeah. Yeah. So, so to your point, I think actually this is a market opportunity for, you know, new professional services and consulting [00:18:00] firms that are like Agent Build and they, and they kind of, you know, go into organizations and they figure out how to re-engineer your workflows to make them more agent ready and get your data into the right format and, you know, reconstruct your business process.So you're, you're not doing most of the work. You're telling agents how to do the work and then you're reviewing it. But I haven't seen the thing that can just drop in and, and kinda let you not go through those changes.swyx: I don't know how that kind of sales pitch goes over. Yeah. You know, you're, you're saying things like, well, in my sort of nice beautiful walled garden, here's, there's, uh, because here's this, here's this beautiful box account that has everything.Yes. And I'm like, well, most, most real life is extremely messy. Sure. And like, poorly named and there duplicate this outdated s**tAaron Levie: a hundred percent. And so No, no, a hundred percent. And so this is actually No. So, so this is, I mean, we agree that, that getting to the beautiful garden is gonna be tough.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: There's also the other end of the spectrum where I, I just like, it's a technical impossibility to solve. The agent is, is truly cannot get enough context to make the right decision in, in the, in the incredibly messy land. Like there's [00:19:00] no a GI that will solve that. So, so we're gonna have to kind of land in somewhere in between, which is like we all collectively get better at.Documentation practices and, and having authoritative relatively up-to-date information and putting it in the right place like agents will, will certainly cause us to be much better organized around how we work with our information, simply because the severity of the agent pulling the wrong data will be too high and the productivity gain of that you'll miss out on by not doing this will be too high as well, that you, that your competition will just do it and they'll just have higher velocity.So, uh, and, and we, we see this a lot firsthand. So we, we build a series of agents internally that they can kind of have access to your full box account and go off and you give it a task and it can go find whatever information you're looking for and work with. And, you know, thank God for the model progress, but like, if, if you gave that task to an agent.Nine months ago, you're just gonna get lots of bogus answers because it's gonna, it's gonna say, Hey, here's, here are fi [00:20:00] five, you know, documents that all kind of smell like the right thing. And I'm gonna, but I, but you're, you're putting me on the clock. ‘cause my assistant prompt says like, you know, be pretty smart, but also try and respond to the user and it's gonna respond.And it's like, ah, it got the wrong document. And then you do that once or twice as a knowledge worker and you're just neverswyx: again,Aaron Levie: never again. You're just like done with the system.swyx: Yeah. It doesn't work.Aaron Levie: It doesn't work. And so, you know, Opus four six and Gemini three one Pro and you know, whatever the latest five 3G BT will be, like, those things are getting better and better and it's using better judgment.And this sort of like the, all of these updates to the agentic tool and search systems are, are, we're seeing, we're seeing very real progress where the agent. Kind of can, can almost smell some things a little bit fishy when it's getting, you know, we, we have this process where we, we have it go fan out, do a bunch of searches, pull up a bunch of data, and then it has to sort of do its own ranking of, you know, what are the right documents that, that it should be working with.And again, like, you know, the intelligence level of a model six months ago, [00:21:00] it'd be just throwing a dart at like, I'm just, I'm gonna grab these seven files and I, I pray, I hope that that's the right answer. And something like an opus first four five, and now four six is like, oh, it's like, no, that one doesn't seem right relative to this question because I'm seeing some signal that is making that, you know, that's contradicting the document where it would normally be in the tree and who should have access.Like it's doing all of that kind of work for you. But like, it still doesn't work if you just have a total wasteland of data. Like, it's just not, it's just not possible. Partly ‘cause a human wouldn't even be able to do it. So basically if a, if a really, really smart human. Could not do that task in five or 10 minutes for a search retrieval type task.Look, you know, your agent's not gonna be able to do it any better. You see this all day long. SoContext Engineering and Search Limitsswyx: this touches on a thing that just passionate about it was just context engineering. I, I'm just gonna let you ramble or riff on, on context engineering. If, if, if there's anything like he, he did really good work on context fraud, which has really taken over as like the term that people use and the referenceAaron Levie: a hundred percent.We, we all we think about is, is the context rob problem. [00:22:00]Jeff Huber: Yeah, there's certainly a lot of like ranking considerations. Gentech surgery think is incredibly promising. Um, yeah, I was trying to generate a question though. I think I have a question right now. Swyx.Aaron Levie: Yeah, no, but like, like I think there was this moment, um, you know, like, I don't know, two years ago before, before we knew like where the, the gotchas were gonna be in ai and I think someone was like, was like, well, infinite context windows will just solve all of these problems and ‘cause you'll just, you'll just give the context window like all the data and.It's just like, okay, I mean, maybe in 2035, like this is a viable solution. First of all, it, it would just, it would just simply cost too much. Like we just can't give the model like the 5,000 documents that might be relevant and it's gonna read them all. And I've seen enough to, to start believing in crazy stuff.So like, I'm willing to just say, sure. Like in, in 10 years from now,swyx: never say, never, never.Aaron Levie: In, in 10 years from now, we'll have infinite context windows at, at a thousandth of the price of today. Like, let's just like believe that that's possible, but Right. We're in reality today. So today we have a context engineering [00:23:00] problem, which is, I got, I got, you know, 200,000 tokens that I can work with, or prob, I don't even know what the latest graph is before, like massive degradation.16. Okay. I have 60,000 tokens that I get to work with where I'm gonna get accurate information. That's not a lot of tokens for a corpus of 10 million documents that a knowledge worker might have across all of the teams and all the projects and all the people they work with. I have, I have 10 million documents.Which, you know, maybe is times five pages per document or something like that. I'm at 50 million pages of information and I have 60,000 tokens. Like, holy s**t. Yeah. This is like, how do I bridge the 50 million pages of information with, you know, the couple hundred that I get to work with in that, in that token window.Yeah. This is like, this is like such an interesting problem and that's why actually so much work is actually like, just like search systems and the databases and that layer has to just get so locked in, but models getting better and importantly [00:24:00] knowing when they've done a search, they found the wrong thing, they go back, they check their work, they, they find a way to balance sort of appeasing the user versus double checking.We have this one, we have this one test case where we ask the agent to go find. 10 pieces of information.swyx: Is this the complex work eval?Aaron Levie: Uh, this is actually not in the eval. This is, this is sort of just like we have a bunch of different, we have a bunch of internal benchmark kind of scenarios. Every time we, we update our agent, we have one, which is, I ask it to find all of our office addresses, and I give it the list of 10 offices that we have.And there's not one document that has this, maybe there should be, that would be a great example of the kind of thing that like maybe over time companies start to, you know, have these sort of like, what are the canonical, you know, kind of key areas of knowledge that we need to have. We don't seem to have this one document that says, here are all of our offices.We have a bunch of documents that have like, here's the New York office and whatever. So you task this agent and you, you get, you say, I need the addresses for these 10 offices. Okay. And by the way, if you do this on any, you know, [00:25:00] public chat model, the same outcome is gonna happen. But for a different kind of query, you give it, you say, I need these 10 addresses.How many times should the agent go and do its search before it decides whether or not, there's just no answer to this question. Often, and especially the, the, let's say lower tier models, it'll come back and it'll give you six of the 10 addresses. And it'll, and I'll just say I couldn't find the otherswyx: four.It, it doesn't know what It doesn't know. ItAaron Levie: doesn't know what It doesn't know. Yeah. So the model is just like, like when should it stop? When should it stop doing? Like should it, should it do that task for literally an hour and just keep cranking through? Maybe I actually made up an office location and it doesn't know that I made it up and I didn't even know that I made it up.Like, should it just keep, re should it read every single file in your entire box account until it, until it should exhaust every single piece of information.swyx: Expensive.Aaron Levie: These are the new problems that we have. So, you know, something like, let's say a new opus model is sort of like, okay, I'm gonna try these types of queries.I didn't get exactly what I wanted. I'm gonna try again. I'm gonna, at [00:26:00] some point I'm gonna stop searching. ‘cause I've determined that that no amount of searching is gonna solve this problem. I'm just not able to do it. And that judgment is like a really new thing that the model needs to be able to have.It's like, when should it give up on a task? ‘cause, ‘cause you just don't, it's a can't find the thing. That's the real world of knowledge, work problems. And this is the stuff that the coding agents don't have to deal with. Because they, it just doesn't like, like you're not usually asking it about, you're, you're always creating net new information coming right outta the model for the most part.Obviously it has to know about your code base and your specs and your documentation, but, but when you deploy an agent on all of your data that now you have all of these new problems that you're dealing withJeff Huber: our, uh, follow follow-up research to context ride is actually on a genetic search. Ah. Um, and we've like right, sort of stress tested like frontier models and their ability to search.Um, and they're not actually that good at searching. Right. Uh, so you're sort of highlighting this like explore, exploit.swyx: You're just say, Debbie, Donna say everything doesn't work. Like,Aaron Levie: well,Jeff Huber: somebody has to be,Aaron Levie: um, can I just throw out one more thing? Yeah. That is different from coding and, and the rest [00:27:00] of the knowledge work that I, I failed to mention.So one other kind of key point is, is that, you know, at the end of the day. Whether you believe we're in a slop apocalypse or, or whatever. At the end of the day, if you, if you build a working product at the end of, if you, if you've built a working solution that is ultimately what the customer is paying for, like whether I have a lot of slop, a little slop or whatever, I'm sure there's lots of code bases we could go into in enterprise software companies where it's like just crazy slop that humans did over a 20 year period, but the end customer just gets this little interface.They can, they can type into it, it does its thing. Knowledge work, uh, doesn't have that property. If I have an AI model, go generate a contract and I generate a contract 20 times and, you know, all 20 times it's just 3% different and like that I, that, that kind of lop introduces all new kinds of risk for my organization that the code version of that LOP didn't, didn't introduce.These are, and so like, so how do you constrain these models to just the part that you want [00:28:00] them to work on and just do the thing that you want them to do? And, and, you know, in engineering, we don't, you can't be disbarred as an engineer, but you could be disbarred as a lawyer. Like you can do the wrong medical thing In healthcare, you, there's no, there's no equivalent to that of engineering.Like, doswyx: you want there to be, because I've considered softwareJeff Huber: engineer. What's that? Civil engineering there is, right? NotAaron Levie: software civil engineer. Sure. Oh yeah, for sure. But like in any of our companies, you like, you know, you'll be forgiven if you took down the site and, and we, we will do a rollback and you'll, you'll be in a meeting, but you have not been disbarred as an engineer.We don't, we don't change your, you know, your computer science, uh, blameJeff Huber: degree, this postmortem.Aaron Levie: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So, so, uh, now maybe we collectively as an industry need to figure out like, what are you liable for? Not legally, but like in a, in a management sense, uh, of these agents. All sorts of interesting problems that, that, that, uh, that have to come out.But in knowledge work, that's the real hostile environments that we're operating in. Hmm.swyx: I do think like, uh, a lot of the last year's, 2025 story was the rise of coding agents and I think [00:29:00] 2026 story is definitely knowledge work agents. Yes. A hundredAaron Levie: percent.swyx: Right. Like that would, and I think open claw core work are just the beginning.Yes. Like it's, the next one's gonna just gonna be absolute craziness.Aaron Levie: It it is. And, and, uh, and it's gonna be, I mean, again, like this is gonna be this, this wave where we, we are gonna try and bring as many of the practices from coding because that, that will clearly be the forefront, which is tell an agent to go do something and has an access to a set of resources.You need to be responsible for reviewing it at the end of the process. That to me is the, is the kind of template that I just think goes across knowledge, work and odd. Cowork is a great example. Open Closet's a great example. You can kind of, sort of see what Codex could become over time. These are some, some really interesting kind of platforms that are emerging.swyx: Okay. Um, I wanted to, we touched on evals a little bit. You had, you had the report that you're gonna go bring up and then I was gonna go into like, uh, boxes, evals, but uh, go ahead. Talk about your genetic search thing.Jeff Huber: Yeah. Mostly I think kinda a few of the insights. It's like number one frontier model is not good at search.Humans have this [00:30:00] natural explore, exploit trade off where we kinda understand like when to stop doing something. Also, humans are pretty good at like forgetting actually, and like pruning their own context, whereas agents are not, and actually an agent in their kind of context history, if they knew something was bad and they even, you could see in the trace the reason you trace, Hey, that probably wasn't a good idea.If it's still in the trace, still in the context, they'll still do it again. Uhhuh. Uh, and so like, I think pruning is also gonna be like, really, it's already becoming a thing, right? But like, letting self prune the con windowsswyx: be a big deal. Yeah. So, so don't leave the mistake. Don't leave the mistake in there.Cut out the mistake but tell it that you made a mistake in the past and so it doesn't repeat it.Jeff Huber: Yeah. But like cut it out so it doesn't get like distracted by it again. ‘cause really, you know, what is so, so it will repeat its mistake just because it's been, it's inswyx: theJeff Huber: context. It'sAaron Levie: in the context so much.That's a few shot example. Even if it, yeah.Jeff Huber: It's like oh thisAaron Levie: is a great thing to go try even ifJeff Huber: it didn't work.Aaron Levie: Yeah,Jeff Huber: exactly.Aaron Levie: SoJeff Huber: there's like a bunch of stuff there. JustAaron Levie: Groundhogs Day inside these models. Yeah. I'm gonna go keep doing the same wrongJeff Huber: thing. Covering sense. I feel like, you know, some creator analogy you're trying like fit a manifold in latent space, which kind is doing break program synthesis, which is kinda one we think about we're doing right.Like, you know, certain [00:31:00] facts might be like sort of overly pitting it. There are certain, you know, sec sectors of latent space and so like plug clean space. Yeah. And, uh, andswyx: so we have a bell, our editor as a bell every time you say that. SoJeff Huber: you have, you have to like remove those, likeswyx: you shoulda a gong like TPN or something.IfJeff Huber: we gong, you either remove those links to like kinda give it the freedom, kind of do what you need to do. So, but yeah. We'll, we'll release more soon. That'sAaron Levie: awesome.Jeff Huber: That'll, that'll be cool.swyx: We're a cerebral podcast that people listen to us and, and sort of think really deep. So yeah, we try to keep it subtle.Okay. We try to keep it.Aaron Levie: Okay, fine.Inside Agent Evalsswyx: Um, you, you guys do, you guys do have EVs, you talked about your, your office thing, but, uh, you've been also promoting APEX agents and complex work. Uh, yeah, whatever you, wherever you wanna take this just Yeah. How youAaron Levie: Apex is, is obviously me, core's, uh, uh, kind of, um, agent eval.We, we supported that by sort of. Opening up some data for them around how we kind of see these, um, data workspaces in, in the, you know, kind of regular economy. So how do lawyers have a workspace? How do investment bankers have a workspace? What kind of data goes into those? And so we, [00:32:00] we partner with them on their, their apex eval.Our own, um, eval is, it's actually relatively straightforward. We have a, a set of, of documents in a, in a range of industries. We give the agent previously did this as a one shot test of just purely the model. And then we just realized we, we need to, based on where everything's going, it's just gotta be more agentic.So now it's a bit more of a test of both our harness and the model. And we have a rubric of a set of things that has to get right and we score it. Um, and you're just seeing, you know, these incredible jumps in almost every single model in its own family of, you know, opus four, um, you know, sonnet four six versus sonnet four five.swyx: Yeah. We have this up on screen.Aaron Levie: Okay, cool. So some, you're seeing it somewhere like. I, I forget the to, it was like 15 point jump, I think on the main, on the overall,swyx: yes.Aaron Levie: And it's just like, you know, these incredible leaps that, that are starting to happen. Um,swyx: and OP doesn't know any, like any, it's completely held out from op.Aaron Levie: This is not in any, there's no public data which has, you know, Ben benefits and this is just a private eval that we [00:33:00] do, and then we just happen to show it to, to the world. Hmm. So you can't, you can't train against it. And I think it's just as representative of. It's obviously reasoning capabilities, what it's doing at, at, you know, kind of test time, compute capabilities, thinking levels, all like the context rot issues.So many interesting, you know, kind of, uh, uh, capabilities that are, that are now improvingswyx: one sector that you have. That's interesting.Industries and Datasetsswyx: Uh, people are roughly familiar with healthcare and legal, but you have public sector in there.Aaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: Uh, what's that? Like, what, what, what is that?Aaron Levie: Yeah, and, and we actually test against, I dunno, maybe 10 industries.We, we end up usually just cutting a few that we think have interesting gains. All extras, won a lot of like government type documents. Um,swyx: what is that? What is it? Government type documents?Aaron Levie: Government filings. Like a taxswyx: return, likeAaron Levie: a probably not tax returns. It would be more of what would go the government be using, uh, as data.So, okay. Um, so think about research that, that type of, of, of data sets. And then we have financial services for things like data rooms and what would be in an investment prospectus. Uhhuh,swyx: that one you can dog food.Aaron Levie: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yes. Yes. [00:34:00] So, uh, so we, we run the models, um, in now, you know, more of an agent mode, but, but still with, with kinda limited capacity and just try and see like on a, like, for like basis, what are the improvements?And, and again, we just continue to be blown away by. How, how good these models are getting.swyx: Yeah, I mean, I think every serious AI company needs something like that where like, well, this is the work we do. Here's our company eval. Yeah. And if you don't have it, well, you're not a serious AI company.Aaron Levie: There's two dimensions, right?So there's, there's like, how are the models improving? And so which models should you either recommend a customer use, which one should you adopt? But then every single day, we're making changes to our agents. And you need to knowswyx: if you regressed,Aaron Levie: if you know. Yeah. You know, I've been fully convinced that the whole agent observability and eval space is gonna be a massive space.Um, super excited for what Braintrust is doing, excited for, you know, Lang Smith, all the things. And I think what you're going to, I mean, this is like every enter like literally every enterprise right now. It's like the AI companies are the customers of these tools. Every enterprise will have this. Yeah, you'll just [00:35:00] have to have an eval.Of all of your work and like, we'll, you'll have an eval of your RFP generation, you'll have an eval of your sales material creation. You'll have an eval of your, uh, invoice processing. And, and as you, you know, buy or use new agentic systems, you are gonna need to know like, what's the quality of your, of your pipeline.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: Um, so huge, huge market with agent evals.swyx: Yeah.Building the Agent Teamswyx: And, and you know, I'm gonna shout out your, your team a bit, uh, your CTO, Ben, uh, did a great talk with us last year. Awesome. And he's gonna come back again. Oh, cool. For World's Fair.Aaron Levie: Yep.swyx: Just talk about your team, like brag a little bit. I think I, I think people take these eval numbers in pretty charts for granted, but No, there, I mean, there's, there's lots of really smart people at work during all this.Aaron Levie: Biggest shout out, uh, is we have a, we have a couple folks at Dya, uh, Sidarth, uh, that, that kind of run this. They're like a, you know, kind of tag tag team duo on our evals, Ben, our CTO, heavily involved Yasha, head of ai, uh, you know, a bunch of folks. And, um, evals is one part of the story. And then just like the full, you know, kind of AI.An agent team [00:36:00] is, uh, is a, is a pretty, you know, is core to this whole effort. So there's probably, I don't know, like maybe a few dozen people that are like the epicenter. And then you just have like layers and layers of, of kind of concentric circles of okay, then there's a search team that supports them and an infrastructure team that supports them.And it's starting to ripple through the entire company. But there's that kind of core agent team, um, that's a pretty, pretty close, uh, close knit group.swyx: The search team is separate from the infra team.Aaron Levie: I mean, we have like every, every layer of the stack we have to kind of do, except for just pure public cloud.Um, but um, you know, we, we store, I don't even know what our public numbers are in, you know, but like, you can just think about it as like a lot of data is, is stored in box. And so we have, and you have every layer of the, of the stack of, you know, how do you manage the data, the file system, the metadata system, the search system, just all of those components.And then they all are having to understand that now you've got this new customer. Which is the agent, and they've been building for two types of customers in the past. They've been building for users and they've been building for like applications. [00:37:00] And now you've got this new agent user, and it comes in with a difference of it, of property sometimes, like, hey, maybe sometimes we should do embeddings, an embedding based, you know, kind of search versus, you know, your, your typical semantic search.Like, it's just like you have to build the, the capabilities to support all of this. And we're testing stuff, throwing things away, something doesn't work and, and not relevant. It's like just, you know, total chaos. But all of those teams are supporting the agent team that is kind of coming up with its requirements of what, what do we need?swyx: Yeah. No, uh, we just came from, uh, fireside chat where you did, and you, you talked about how you're doing this. It's, it's kind of like an internal startup. Yeah. Within the broader company. The broader company's like 3000 people. Yeah. But you know, there's, there's a, this is a core team of like, well, here's the innovation center.Aaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: And like that every company kind of is run this way.Aaron Levie: Yeah. I wanna be sensitive. I don't call it the innovation center. Yeah. Only because I think everybody has to do innovation. Um, there, there's a part of the, the, the company that is, is sort of do or die for the agent wave.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: And it only happens to be more of my focus simply because it's existential that [00:38:00] we get it right.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: All of the supporting systems are necessary. All of the surrounding adjacent capabilities are necessary. Like the only reason we get to be a platform where you'd run an agent is because we have a security feature or a compliance feature, or a governance feature that, that some team is working on.But that's not gonna be the make or break of, of whether we get agents right. Like that already exists and we need to keep innovating there. I don't know what the right, exact precise number is, but it's not a thousand people and it's not 10 people. There's a number of people that are like the, the kind of like, you know, startup within the company that are the make or break on everything related to AI agents, you know, leveraging our platform and letting you work with your data.And that's where I spend a lot of my time, and Ben and Yosh and Diego and Teri, you know, these are just, you know, people that, that, you know, kind of across the team. Are working.swyx: Yeah. Amazing.Read Write Agent WorkflowsJeff Huber: How do you, how do you think about, I mean, you talked a lot about like kinda read workflows over your box data. Yep.Right. You know, gen search questions, queries, et cetera. But like, what about like, write or like authoring workflows?Aaron Levie: Yes. I've [00:39:00] already probably revealed too much actually now that I think about it. So, um, I've talked about whatever,Jeff Huber: whatever you can.Aaron Levie: Okay. It's just us. It's just us. Yeah. Okay. Of course, of course.So I, I guess I would just, uh, I'll make it a little bit conceptual, uh, because again, I've already, I've already said things that are not even ga but, but we've, we've kinda like danced around it publicly, so I, yeah, yeah. Okay. Just like, hopefully nobody watches this, um, episode. No.swyx: It's tidbits for the Heidi engaged to go figure out like what exactly, um, you know, is, is your sort of line of thinking.Sure. They can connect the dots.Aaron Levie: Yeah. So, so I would say that, that, uh, we, you know, as a, as a place where you have your enterprise content, there's a use case where I want to, you know, have an agent read that data and answer questions for me. And then there's a use case where I want the agent to create something.And use the file system to create something or store off data that it's working on, or be able to have, you know, various files that it's writing to about the work it's doing. So we do see it as a total read write. The harder problem has so far been the read only because, because again, you have that kind of like 10 [00:40:00] million to one ratio problem, whereas rights are a lot of, that's just gonna come from the model and, and we just like, we'll just put it in the file system and kinda use it.So it's a little bit of a technically easier problem, but the only part that's like, not necessarily technically hard, it is just like it's not yet perfected in the state of the ecosystem is, you know, building a beautiful PowerPoint presentation. It's still a hard problem for these models. Like, like we still, you know, like, like these formats are just, we're not built for.They'reswyx: working on it.Aaron Levie: They're, they're working on it. Everybody's working on it.swyx: Every launch is like, well, we do PowerPoint now.Aaron Levie: We're getting, yeah, getting a lot, getting a lot of better each time. But then you'll do this thing where you'll ask the update one slide and all of a sudden, like the fonts will be just like a little bit different, you know, on two of the slides, or it moved, you know, some shape over to the left a little bit.And again, these are the kind of things that, like in code, obviously you could really care about if you really care about, you know, how beautiful is the code, but at the end, user doesn't notice all those problems and file creation, the end user instantly sees it. You're [00:41:00] like, ah, like paragraph three, like, you literally just changed the font on me.Like it's a totally different font and like midway through the document. Mm-hmm. Those are the kind of things that you run into a lot of in the, in the content creation side. So, mm-hmm. We are gonna have native agents. That do all of those things, they'll be powered by the leading kind of models and labs.But the thing that I think is, is probably gonna be a much bigger idea over time is any agent on any system, again, using Box as a file system for its work, and in that kind of scenario, we don't necessarily care what it's putting in the file system. It could put its memory files, it could put its, you know, specification, you know, documents.It could put, you know, whatever its markdown files are, or it could, you know, generate PDFs. It's just like, it's a workspace that is, is sort of sandboxed off for its work. People can collaborate into it, it can share with other people. And, and so we, we were thinking a lot about what's the right, you know, kind of way to, to deliver that at scale.Docs Graphs and Founder Modeswyx: I wanted to come into sort of the sort of AI transformation or AI sort of, uh, operations things. [00:42:00] Um, one of the tweets that you, that you wanted to talk about, this is just me going through your tweets, by the way. Oh, okay. I mean, like, this is, you readAaron Levie: one by one,swyx: you're the, you're the easiest guest to prep for because you, you already have like, this is the, this is what I'm interested in.I'm like, okay, well, areAaron Levie: we gonna get to like, like February, January or something? Where are we in the, in the timelines? How far back are we going?swyx: Can you, can you describe boxes? A set of skills? Right? Like that, that's like, that's like one of the extremes of like, well if you, you just turn everything into a markdown file.Yeah. Then your agent can run your company. Uh, like you just have to write, find the right sequence of words toAaron Levie: Yes.swyx: To do it.Aaron Levie: Sorry, isthatswyx: the question? So I think the question is like, what if we documented everything? Yes. The way that you exactly said like,Aaron Levie: yes.swyx: Um, let's get all the Fortune five hundreds, uh, prepared for agents.Yes. And like, you know, everything's in golden and, and nicely filed away and everything. Yes. What's missing? Like, what's left, right? LikeAaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: You've, you've run your company for a decade. LikeAaron Levie: Yeah. I think the challenge is that, that that information changes a week later. And because something happened in the market for that [00:43:00] customer, or us as a company that now has to go get updated, and so these systems are living and breathing and they have to experience reality and updates to reality, which right now is probably gonna be humans, you know, kinda giving those, giving them the updates.And, you know, there is this piece about context graphs as as, uh, that kinda went very viral. Yeah. And I, I, I was like a, i, I, I thought it was super provocative. I agreed with many parts of it. I disagree with a few parts around. You know, it's not gonna be as easy as as just if we just had the agent traces, then we can finally do that work because there's just like, there's so much more other stuff that that's happening that, that we haven't been able to capture and digitize.And I think they actually represented that in the piece to be clear. But like there's just a lot of work, you know, that that has to, you just can't have only skills files, you know, for your company because it's just gonna be like, there's gonna be a lot of other stuff that happens. Yeah. Change over time.Yeah. Most companies are practically apprenticeships.swyx: Most companies are practically apprenticeships. LikeJeff Huber: every new employee who joins the team, [00:44:00] like you span one to three months. Like ramping them up.Aaron Levie: Yes. AllJeff Huber: that tat knowledgeAaron Levie: isJeff Huber: not written down.Aaron Levie: Yes.Jeff Huber: But like, it would have to be if you wanted to like give it to an Asian.Right. And so like that seems to me like to beAaron Levie: one is I think you're gonna see again a premium on companies that can document this. Mm-hmm. Much. There'll be a huge premium on that because, because you know, can you shorten that three month ramp cycle to a two week ramp cycle? That's an instant productivity gain.Can you re dramatically reduce rework in the organization because you've documented where all the stuff is and where the answers are. Can you make your average employee as good as your 90th percentile employee because you've captured the knowledge that's sort of in the heads of, of those top employees and make that available.So like you can see some very clear productivity benefits. Mm-hmm. If you had a company culture of making sure you know your information was captured, digitized, put in a format that was agent ready and then made available to agents to work with, and then you just, again, have this reality of like add a 10,000 person [00:45:00] company.Mapping that to the, you know, access structure of the company is just a hard problem. Is like, is like, yeah, well, you just, not every piece of information that's digitized can be shared to everybody. And so now you have to organize that in a way that actually works. There was a pretty good piece, um, this, this, uh, this piece called your company as a file is a file system.I, did you see that one?swyx: Nope.Aaron Levie: Uh, yes. You saw it. Yeah. And, and, uh, I actually be curious your thoughts on it. Um, like, like an interesting kind of like, we, we agree with it because, because that's how we see the world and, uh,swyx: okay. We, we have it up on screen. Oh,Aaron Levie: okay. Yeah. But, but it's all about basically like, you know, we've already, we, we, we already organized in this kind of like, you know, permission structure way.Uh, and, and these are the kind of, you know, natural ways that, that agents can now work with data. So it's kind of like this, this, you know, kind of interesting metaphor, but I do think companies will have to start to think about how they start to digitize more, more of that data. What was your take?Jeff Huber: Yeah, I mean, like the company's probably like an acid compliant file system.Aaron Levie: Uh,Jeff Huber: yeah. Which I'm guessing boxes, right? So, yeah. Yes.swyx: Yeah. [00:46:00]Jeff Huber: Which you have a great piece on, but,swyx: uh, yeah. Well, uh, I, I, my, my, my direction is a little bit like, I wanna rewind a little bit to the graph word you said that there, that's a magic trigger word for us. I always ask what's your take on knowledge graphs?Yeah. Uh, ‘cause every, especially at every data database person, I just wanna see what they think. There's been knowledge graphs, hype cycles, and you've seen it all. So.Aaron Levie: Hmm. I actually am not the expert in knowledge graphs, so, so that you might need toswyx: research, you don't need to be an expert. Yeah. I think it's just like, well, how, how seriously do people take it?Yeah. Like, is is, is there a lot of potential in the, in the HOVI?Aaron Levie: Uh, well, can I, can I, uh, understand first if it's, um, is this a loaded question in the sense of are you super pro, super con, super anti medium? Iswyx: see pro, I see pros and cons. Okay. Uh, but I, I think your opinion should be independent of mine.Aaron Levie: Yeah. No, no, totally. Yeah. I just want to see what I'm stepping into.swyx: No, I know. It's a, and it's a huge trigger word for a lot of people out Yeah. In our audience. And they're, they're trying to figure out why is that? Because whyAaron Levie: is this such aswyx: hot item for them? Because a lot of people get graph religion.And they're like, everything's a graph. Of course you have to represent it as a graph. Well, [00:47:00] how do you solve your knowledge? Um, changing over time? Well, it's a graph.Aaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: And, and I think there, there's that line of work and then there's, there's a lot of people who are like, well, you don't need it. And both are right.Aaron Levie: Yeah. And what do the people who say you don't need it, what are theyswyx: arguing for Mark down files. Oh, sure, sure. Simplicity.Aaron Levie: Yeah.swyx: Versus it's, it's structure versus less structure. Right. That's, that's all what it is. I do.Aaron Levie: I think the tricky thing is, um, is, is again, when this gets met with real humans, they're just going to their computer.They're just working with some people on Slack or teams. They're just sharing some data through a collaborative file system and Google Docs or Box or whatever. I certainly like the vision of most, most knowledge graph, you know, kind of futuristic kind of ways of thinking about it. Uh, it's just like, you know, it's 2026.We haven't seen it yet. Kind of play out as as, I mean, I remember. Do you remember the, um, in like, actually I don't, I don't even know how old you guys are, but I'll for, for to show my age. I remember 17 years ago, everybody thought enterprises would just run on [00:48:00] Wikis. Yeah. And, uh, confluence and, and not even, I mean, confluence actually took off for engineering for sure.Like unquestionably. But like, this was like everything would be in the w. And I think based on our, uh, our, uh, general style of, of, of what we were building, like we were just like, I don't know, people just like wanna workspace. They're gonna collaborate with other people.swyx: Exactly. Yeah. So you were, you were anti-knowledge graph.Aaron Levie: Not anti, not anti. Soswyx: not nonAaron Levie: I'm not, I'm not anti. ‘cause I think, I think your search system, I just think these are two systems that probably, but like, I'm, I'm not in any religious war. I don't want to be in anybody's YouTube comments on this. There's not a fight for me.swyx: We, we love YouTube comments. We're, we're, we're get into comments.Aaron Levie: Okay. Uh, but like, but I, I, it's mostly just a virtue of what we built. Yeah. And we just continued down that path. Yeah.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: And, um, and that, that was what we pursued. But I'm not, this is not a, you know, kind of, this is not a, uh, it'sswyx: not existential for you. Great.Aaron Levie: We're happy to plug into somebody else's graph.We're happy to feed data into it. We're happy for [00:49:00] agents to, to talk to multiple systems. Not, not our fight.swyx: Yeah.Aaron Levie: But I need your answer. Yeah. Graphs or nerd Snipes is very effective nerd.swyx: See this is, this is one, one opinion and then I've,Jeff Huber: and I think that the actual graph structure is emergent in the mind of the agent.Ah, in the same way it is in the mind of the human. And that's a more powerful graph ‘cause it actually involved over time.swyx: So don't tell me how to graph. I'll, I'll figure it out myself. Exactly. Okay. All right. AndJeff Huber: what's yours?swyx: I like the, the Wiki approach. Uh, my, I'm actually

Aight folks -- we're doing this one a little differently.. but there's plenty of trade discourse to go over as we approach the deadline. Make sure you set your calendars for the live deadline stream with Ian and Andrew over on the Low Qual channel as well. But here you're here now! Predictions! Voicemails! GET IN!Cynically acclaimed. Incredibly online. Covering all things #NHLBruins | OFFICIAL CHIRP LINE: (860) 506-5444 presented by @SeatGeek, use promo code SHORTSHIFTPODCHECK OUT OFFICIAL SSP MERCHANDISE AVAILABLE NOW ON OUR SHOP @ https://short-shift-podcast.creator-spring.com/Send us a message

It's been a while since we heard from legendary NFL insider Peter King so we gave him a call and found out that he's been hard at work on a new book about the 40 years of his trail of covering the biggest stories in the sport. Let him tell you how his "retirement" from the Monday Morning Quarterback grind is going. And a few Art Modell tales you might not know... The post Longtime NFL insider Peter King tells Nestor his new book on 40 years of covering football and the best stories first appeared on Baltimore Positive WNST.

Bryan went to CNN headquarters in Washington, D.C., to talk to CNN's Wolf Blitzer! Bryan has Wolf take us through his media life through the lens of five big stories. Before that, they talk about Wolf's upbringing and playing football in the Buffalo, New York, area and what made him decide to become a journalist. Then, the first big story they discuss is covering the Pentagon for CNN during the first Gulf War (16:17). The second is the Bill Clinton-Monica Lewinsky controversy (29:48). Third is what he remembers about covering 9/11 (37:32). And the last two are the election of Barack Obama in 2008 (45:41), and the election of Donald Trump in 2016 (52:23). Host: Bryan CurtisGuest: Wolf BlitzerProducers: Bruce Baldwin and Isaiah BlakelyAdditional Production: Ted Tuel and Dylan Nathan Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Covering the Cardinals for SI, Donnie Druin joins the guys with the fallout from the break up of Kyler Murray and the Cards, and where each party will look to for their next gig.

For more than a decade, the Modern Law Library has been chatting with authors about their books. But there haven't been many opportunities to talk directly with our listeners, and we want that to change. We are so excited to announce that we are launching a monthly book club series, which will appear in your normal podcast feed.  This year, we are going to be diving into The Brethren: Inside the Supreme Court, by Bob Woodward and Scott Armstrong. This book made waves when it was released in 1979, giving readers an unprecedented look into the U.S. Supreme Court chambers. Covering the 1969 to 1975 terms, The Brethren exposed the internal debates over matters like the Pentagon Papers and Roe v. Wade.  Each month, we will be reading a section of the book and inviting on a guest to discuss the issues raised. To be ready for the first book club meeting at the end of March, read the introduction and prologue! We are hoping to hear from you, so if you have a comment about the book or want to share your experiences with it, email us a written message, video or audio recording to modernlawlibrary@legaltalknetwork.com.  You can purchase a copy here and join in the discussion in our Goodreads group athttps://www.goodreads.com/group/show/1285340-modern-law-library

This episode reflects on King David as a contrasting “icon of repentance.” Though chosen and blessed by God, David's desire led to sin with Bathsheba, the death of Uriah the Hittite, and a desperate attempt to cover up his guilt. Like David, we often hide our sins out of fear of human judgment, yet nothing remains hidden from God. In mercy, God sent Nathan to expose David's sin and call him to repentance, showing that confession—though painful—leads to forgiveness and life. The message points finally to Jesus Christ, the true Son of David, whose sacrifice covers our sins completely, freeing us from fear and inviting us to confess our sins and trust in His mercy.

Covering the Vikings for Purple Insider, Matthew Coller returns to the show with the latest on the Vikings dilemma at QB for next season and just how much more patience they have with JJ McCarthey?

The beef industry is a beautiful blend of long-standing traditions and forward-thinking innovation. How much technology to embrace, when to use it and for what purpose — those are questions that often challenge producers, no matter the size of their operation. Trey Patterson, Padlock Ranch, and Janette Barnard, Merck Animal Health, share how they think about the future of the business. Covering everything from artificial intelligence for decision-making and virtual fencing to genetic progress and new marketing ideas, the duo talks about how to focus on practical application of data and the need for more advancements vs. greater adoption of current tools.  HOSTS: Miranda Reiman and Mark McCully   GUESTS:  Janette Barnard is bullish on the future of animal protein, and passionate about the intersection of animal agriculture and innovation. Janette currently leads the Vence business within Merck Animal Health and is the creator of Prime Future, a weekly newsletter for innovators in livestock, meat and dairy that draws on her background across agribusiness (Elanco, Cargill, McDonald's Global Supply Chain) and the startup ecosystem (The Poultry Exchange, DecisionNext, Merck Animal Health Ventures). Trey Patterson, president and CEO of Padlock Ranch Company, received a bachelor's and master's in animal science from Colorado State University and a doctorate in ruminant nutrition from the University of Nebraska. He served as an Extension beef specialist for South Dakota State University for five years, where he led statewide extension and research programs in beef cattle nutrition and management. Since 2005, Trey has been with Padlock Ranch Company, a multigenerational and diversified family-owned agribusiness with operations in northern Wyoming and southern Montana. Trey now holds the position of president and CEO. In 2008, he was listed in the Top 10 Industry Leaders Under 40 by Cattle Business Weekly. Trey and his wife Amy have five children and reside near Ranchester, Wyo.   SPONSOR:  Angus Media:  Are you ready to level up your herd's genetics? With the Angus Bull Book: Spring 2026 Angus Sire Directory, you can find your next great sire. The spring issue went live in March, but you're able to view the book online all breeding season. Live EPDs will help you pair the right bull with your breeding objectives. Search the Angus Bull Book here: https://shorturl.at/p06OD Angus Media: A solid herd starts with the cows. Commercial cattlemen need to know that your foundation is built on maternal traits. Tell them in the Female Foundations special section published with the September Angus Beef Bulletin. Get an advertisement, feature and social post all in the same package. Contact your regional manager or our advertising team to learn more. Find them at www.angus.org/angus-media/about/contact-us. Don't miss news in the Angus breed. Visit www.AngusJournal.net and subscribe to the AJ Daily e-newsletter and our monthly magazine, the Angus Journal.

Covering the Hillary Clinton deposition, we went over her clash with Representative Nancy Mace, from there, we filled in the Ringmaster James T. about Nancy Mace's skills as she has been clashing with democrats on social media and she has been smoking them.

7News Reporter Xander McGuire joins the show ahead of Opening Round, kicking off his regular spot on Mick In The Morning this season. Covering the big storylines; Charlie Curnow up against his former side, how Blues youngster Jagga Smith will turn heads, and questions over fitness of Patrick Dangerfield as Cats travel to Gold Coast. Catch Mick in the Morning, with Roo, Titus & Rosie LIVE from 6-9am weekdays on 105.1 Triple M Melbourne or via the LiSTNR app. Mick In The Morning Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/molloy Triple M Melbourne Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/triplemmelb Triple M Melbourne TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@triplemmelbourne Triple M Melbourne Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/triplemmelbourneSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Show Notes: Liam T.A. Ford, also known as LTAF, shares his initial career plans after graduation. After writing for the Crimson at Harvard, he initially considered a career in academia, but pivoted to journalism. He discusses his first job at the Montgomery Advertiser, where he covered crime and interviewed notable figures including the man who headed the pulpit committee that hired Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. for his pastorship in Montgomery. Liam recounts his transition to Chicago, where he became a reporter for the Chicago Tribune, covering notable events like Barack Obama's election to the U.S. Senate. Working for a Non-profit Organization Liam talks about his work at the Chicago Tribune, including helping to start the paper's breaking news desk and maintaining a database of shootings and homicides. He mentions taking a buyout from the Tribune in 2021 and, while he  continued his work in journalism, covering public/private partnerships, he also worked on a non-profit project called the Ignatian Mission Center, which he now does full-time. The non-profit aims to maintain the former food pantry that had been run by a local parish and eventually provide other social services, including a shelter for Spanish-speaking women who have left domestic violence situations. He still writes and edits on a freelance basis.   Crime and the Criminal Justice System Liam reflects on his time as a crime reporter at the Montgomery Advertiser and the lessons he learned about crime and the criminal justice system. He emphasizes the importance of humanizing crime victims and making readers understand the impact of each death. Liam recounts a significant experience where he had to inform a victim's family about the details of their loved one's death, highlighting the challenges in the criminal justice system. He discusses the role of crime reporters in centering victims and the importance of transparency in reporting. Covering the 2004 Senate Race Liam shares his experiences as a political reporter, including covering the 2004 Senate race in Illinois where Barack Obama won the Democratic nomination. He recounts the story of Jack Ryan's divorce records being unsealed, which led to his withdrawal from the race. Liam discusses his interactions with Barack Obama during his coverage and other significant political stories he covered. He reflects on the importance of transparency in political reporting and the impact of his work on local government and community issues. The Importance of Local Government and News Reporting Liam talks about his early career at the Tribune covering local government bodies like the Chicago Housing Authority and the Chicago Park District. He shares a story about investigating teen programming in Chicago parks, which revealed disparities in resources between affluent and less affluent neighborhoods. Liam discusses the impact of his reporting on improving teen programming and the creation of programs like After School Matters. He reflects on the importance of local government reporting in bringing wrongdoing to light and improving community services. The Creation of the Ignatian Mission Center Liam explains the process of creating the Ignatian Mission Center and the challenges of maintaining the food pantry after the parish closed. He discusses the support from Loyola University and other organizations in providing social services and resources for the community. Liam shares the progress of the non-profit, including securing a planning grant and architectural plans for the former parish property. He reflects on the personal and professional challenges of working full-time on the non-profit project and the impact it has had on the community. Harvard Reflections Liam credits the course Government 1061 with Michael Sandel and Harvey Mansfield for teaching him the importance of examining biases and assumptions. He discusses how these lessons have influenced his approach to journalism and his commitment to finding and speaking the truth. Liam reflects on the impact of his Harvard education on his career and personal life, including his journey to sobriety. He shares how the skills and values he learned at Harvard continue to resonate with him in his current work. Timestamps: 04:19: Transition to the Chicago Tribune and Sobriety Journey  05:47: Impact of Sobriety and Community Involvement 16:04: Crime Reporting and Lessons Learned  24:58: Political Reporting and Significant Stories  30:08: Challenges and Successes in Local Government Reporting  36:12: Formation of the Ignatian Mission Center 43:05: Personal Reflections and Future Plans  Links: Website: www.ignatianmission.org Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/liam.ford/ LinkedIn:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/liamtaford/ Featured Non-profit: The featured non-profit of this week's is brought to you by Kristen Hunter  who reports: Hi. I'm Kristen Hunter, Class of 1992. The featured non-profit of this episode of The 92 report is Ivory Innovations. Ivory Innovations catalyzes innovative solutions in housing affordability through the Ivory prize Applied Research and Policy Leadership, advancing ideas that expand access to affordable and attainable housing. The organization also partners with the Harvard master in real estate program through our summer practicum, which gives students the opportunity to complete a two month placement with a cooperating for profit, not for profit or public organization in the United States or overseas, participating in real estate projects and initiatives that advance cutting edge practices, including those promoting social and environmental best practices. I'm delighted to champion Ivory Innovations, especially as one of our recent Harvard Master in Real Estate graduates, Amy Love Tommaso serves as their director of policy innovation. You can learn more and support their mission at ivory innovations.org That's ivory i, V, O, R, Y, innovations.org, and now here's Will Bachman with this week's episode.  To find out more about their work, visit: ivoryinnovations.org  This episode on The 92 Report: https://92report.com/podcast/episode-162-liam-t-a-ford-from-journalist-to-non-profit-startup-leader/ *AI generated show notes and transcript

Covering the Commonwealth ft. NASCAR and Virginia Tech Hokies by Ed Lane

Covering the Commonwealth ft. JMU, UVA and Washington Commanders by Ed Lane

This week Luke and Janine return to the show bringing along the most loved slash reviled bit - declaring new Watches. Meanwhile on the Simpsons, there's babies, lost loves, eating bugs and religious psychosis while on One Piece we're finally getting out of Fishman Island by forcibly conscripting a bunch of militants and declaring war on Big Mom. Covering episode 569-574 of One Piece. Cover art by Kris Dobbins. Edited by Andie. Links! Itunes – https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/dohmance-dawn/id1620557454… Spotify – https://open.spotify.com/show/0iOBMkRGKTz04wJB2kitx7… RSS – https://pinecast.com/feed/dohmance-dawn… Bluesky – https://bsky.app/profile/dohmancedawn.bsky.social Patreon – https://www.patreon.com/lukeherr

Covering various magical TV shows and more Academy talk too!

Covering some archery news and going over some of the finer details about the Outlaw season

Covering the movements, issues and people fighting for some of the most important social justice issues of our time. Hosted by Amy Gastelum, Salima Hamirani, Anita Jonhson, and Lucy Kang. Sign up for program alerts and sneak peeks from Making Contact at: http://ow.ly/1FkV30aq1z2 The post Making Contact – February 27, 2026 appeared first on KPFA.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This week on Black on Black Cinema, the crew returns to introduce the next film to the reviewed, "Soul Men." The 2008 film follows two estranged soul-singing legends who agree to participate in a reunion performance at the Apollo Theater to honor their recently deceased band leader. The movie stars Samuel L. Jackson and the late great Bernie Mac. Available to stream for free on Tubi.The random topic this week we tackle the complex and difficult incident that unfolded at the 2026 BAFTA Film Awards when John Davidson, a Tourette's syndrome activist and subject of the nominated film "I Swear," involuntarily shouted racial slurs—including the N-word—while Black actors Michael B. Jordan and Delroy Lindo presented an award.This isn't a simple story. It's a collision of disability rights, anti-Black racism, media responsibility, and institutional failure.What happened: Davidson, who has spent decades advocating for Tourette's awareness, experienced involuntary vocal tics throughout the ceremony. His condition causes coprolalia—the uncontrollable utterance of socially inappropriate words. When Jordan and Lindo took the stage, Davidson's tic produced the N-word, audible throughout the venue.The BBC's failure: Despite broadcasting on a two-hour delay (giving them time to edit), the BBC left the slur in the broadcast AND on iPlayer for 15+ hours. Yet they DID edit out other content, including a "Free Palestine" statement and political jokes. The selective editing reveals a catastrophic failure/purposeful behavior in judgment and priorities.The complications: This incident sits at the painful intersection of two marginalized communities. Davidson has no control over his tics—they represent the opposite of his actual beliefs. Yet Black attendees, including production designer Hannah Beachler, experienced real racial trauma. Lindo told Vanity Fair he wished BAFTA had spoken to them afterward. Host Alan Cumming's apology said "sorry if you were offended" was woefully inadequate.Why this matters for cinema: The film "I Swear" was nominated for multiple BAFTAs and won three awards, including Best Actor for Robert Aramayo's portrayal of Davidson. The movie exists to educate about Tourette's. Yet BAFTA and the BBC failed both the disability community AND the Black community in how they handled this moment.We discuss:- The impossible position both communities were put in due to the BBC's actions or lack thereof- Why institutional preparation and response failed catastrophically- The difference between individual accountability and systemic responsibility- How ableism and anti-Black racism played out in the aftermath (including the idea of "he meant that shit" comments)- What should have happened vs. what did happen- The broader conversation about representation, disability, and whose comfort gets prioritizedThis is a conversation about nuance, compassion, and holding institutions accountable when they fail vulnerable communities.Full Black on Black Cinema episodes coming soon. Subscribe so you don't miss our deep dives into Black cinema, representation, and the stories Hollywood tells—and doesn't tellBlack on Black Cinema is a long-running podcast featuring in-depth Black movie reviews and frank conversations that matter to the Black community. We review Black films across every genre — from Black horror and Black sci-fi to indie dramas, comedies, and blockbuster action. Covering filmmakers like Spike Lee, Jordan Peele, Ryan Coogler, Ava DuVernay, and more. Hosted by Jay, Micah, Terrence, and T'ara. Featured on RogerEbert.com. A TNP Studios production. New episodes weekly on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, and all major platforms. For more TNP Studios content, check out The Nerdpocalypse (movie & TV news), Look Forward (progressive politics), and Dense Pixels (video game news).

Note: Short show as I was informed of a serious matter involving Dad and had to bail.Note: "Act 2" will be a separate published audio podcast.*Check out EZ's morning radio show "The InZane Asylum Q100 Michigan with Eric Zane" Click here*Get a FREE 7 day trial to Patreon to "try it out."*Watch the show live, daily at 8AM EST on Twitch! Please click here to follow the page.Email the show on the Shoreliners Striping inbox: eric@ericzaneshow.comTopics:*EZ probably would have been better served not wearing the "Bring Back Bullying" hoodie to the YMCA.*EZ got served; will appear for a deposition in a case involving hillbilly plaintiff and hillbilly defendant.*EZ breaks down the State of the Union. *One job, Al Green: Hold sign without covering letters*The chat was heavily involved in the State of the Union chat.*EZ got some troubling news during the show that cuts things short.Sponsors:Impact Powersports, Kuiper Tree Care, Frank Fuss / My Policy Shop Insurance, Kings Room Barbershop, Shoreliners,  Ervines Auto Repair Grand Rapids Hybrid & EV, TC PaintballInterested in advertising? Email eric@ericzaneshow.com and let me design a marketing plan for you.Contact: Shoreliners Striping inbox eric@ericzaneshow.comDiscord LinkEZSP TikTokSubscribe to my YouTube channelHire me on Cameo!Tshirts available herePlease subscribe, rate & write a review on Apple Podcastspatreon.com/ericzaneInstagram: ericzaneshowTwitterSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-eric-zane-show-podcast/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Note: Short show as I was informed of a serious matter involving Dad and had to bail.Note: "Act 1" was a separate published audio podcast.Get an EZ "DEFECTOR" hoodie!*Check out EZ's morning radio show "The InZane Asylum Q100 Michigan with Eric Zane" Click here*Get a FREE 7 day trial to Patreon to "try it out."*Watch the show live, daily at 8AM EST on Twitch! Please click here to follow the page.Email the show on the Shoreliners Striping inbox: eric@ericzaneshow.comTopics*EZ probably would have been better served not wearing the "Bring Back Bullying" hoodie to the YMCA.*EZ got served; will appear for a deposition in a case involving hillbilly plaintiff and hillbilly defendant.*EZ breaks down the State of the Union. *One job, Al Green: Hold sign without covering letters*The chat was heavily involved in the State of the Union chat.*EZ got some troubling news during the show that cuts things short.Sponsors:Impact Powersports, Kuiper Tree Care, Frank Fuss / My Policy Shop Insurance, Kings Room Barbershop, Shoreliners,  Ervines Auto Repair Grand Rapids Hybrid & EV, TC PaintballInterested in advertising? Email eric@ericzaneshow.com and let me design a marketing plan for you.Contact: Shoreliners Striping inbox eric@ericzaneshow.comDiscord LinkEZSP TikTokSubscribe to my YouTube channelHire me on Cameo!Tshirts available herePlease subscribe, rate & write a review on Apple Podcastspatreon.com/ericzaneInstagram: ericzaneshowTwitterSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-eric-zane-show-podcast/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

College newspapers are often on shoestring budget, and at the same time they’re a vitally important source of information — especially for their student readers. At the University of Oregon’s The Daily Emerald and Portland State University’s The Vanguard, reporters have been tear-gassed while covering immigration protests. Though reporters at Oregon State University’s The Daily Barometer have not faced that challenge, the editor-in-chief says the paper would like to be prepared for that situation if it arises. All three papers also cover stories in the community that affect the campus. Managing these competing priorities with limited resources can be a major challenge. We get more details from the editors-in-chief at the University of Oregon, Oregon State University and Portland State University: Tarek Anthony, Jenna Benson and Noah Carandanis.

What if the reason you cannot lose weight, think clearly, or stop craving sugar after dinner has nothing to do with discipline and everything to do with your hormones, your gut, and what you are eating at breakfast? These are the questions your doctor might not be asking or answering, but Jenn is.On this episode of Salad With a Side of Fries, Jenn Trepeck pulls back the curtain on the powerful Happy Healthy Hub community by sharing this Q&A from inside the hub. Covering hormonal weight gain, natural cholesterol remedies, healing leaky gut, taming food noise, boosting morning energy, and why protein intake early in the day is the most underrated tool for controlling sugar cravings and stubborn weight loss, it's likely your questions are included too! If you have ever felt like your body is working against you, this episode will help you understand why and what to do about it. For more Q & A, and answers to your personal questions, become a member of the Happy Healthy Hub here: https://asaladwithasideoffries.com/membership/What You Will Learn in This Episode:✅ Why hormonal weight gain and metabolic health are always the root cause of stubborn weight struggles and how willpower is never to blame, plus what actually depletes and replenishes this finite resource throughout your day.✅ How to naturally support cholesterol management through omega-3 supplements, soluble fiber, and reducing sugar and refined grains, and why coenzyme Q10 is essential for anyone currently taking a statin.✅ The key markers of gut health recovery, including zonulin testing and secretory IgA, and how repeated insults like antibiotics and artificial sweeteners compromise intestinal permeability over time.✅ How increasing protein intake earlier in the day dramatically reduces food noise, nighttime eating, and sugar cravings, and why satiety hormones like leptin and ghrelin are the real drivers behind your appetite.The Salad With a Side of Fries podcast, hosted by Jenn Trepeck, explores real-life wellness and weight-loss topics, debunking myths, misinformation, and flawed science surrounding nutrition and the food industry. Let's dive into wellness and weight loss for real life, including drinking, eating out, and skipping the grocery store.TIMESTAMPS: 00:00 Intro: You don't lack willpower, you're just spending your finite resources elsewhere throughout the day03:26 Natural cholesterol remedies using omega-3 supplements, soluble fiber, and reducing sugar/grain/starch intake07:13 Why coenzyme Q10 is critical for anyone on a statin and the disconnect between statin use and heart health outcomes09:47 Healing leaky gut: how to recognize recovery, what causes gut lining breakdown, and whether gut health and intestinal permeability damage can fully reverse15:34 Understanding food noise: how restriction, undereating, and low protein intake amplify cravings throughout the day and why low protein intake early in the day leads to nighttime eating20:46 Hormonal weight gain vs. metabolism: the roles of insulin, leptin, ghrelin, and satiety hormones in body weight24:50 How to stop sugar cravings after dinner by switching habits, increasing protein intake, and creating new meal-end rituals27:19 Warm water with lemon as a bedtime ritual: supporting digestion, gallbladder health, and signaling the end of meals naturally30:17 What is the easiest area to change first: nutrition, exercise, or health, and discussion of habits34:04 Jenn's go-to-tips for meal prep, cooking and takeout, favorite fitness activity and wellness habit that made the biggest difference42:00 Looking at health and wellness on social media and how it is tied to economics and the top wellness trends for 2026KEY TAKEAWAYS:

Malcolm Hoenlein and Thaddius McCotter assess the US withdrawal from Syria, leaving minority groups vulnerable while ISIS resurges, while also covering Azerbaijan's regional influence and the stalemate over Hamas disarmament. 6.1830 PERSIA

We are seeing repercussions around the world as a result of the release of even just some of the Epstein files. There are criminal investigations underweight in multiple countries. In the United Kingdom a UK ambassador to the US has had multiple search warrants executed on his properties. A former prince has been placed under arrest. Yet here in the United States, from our Department of Justice we get crickets and coverups.Covering up the crimes of others constitutes a crime itself, accessory after the fact, as Glenn explains.Find Glenn on Substack: glennkirschner.substack.comSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

The Epstein Files chaos has exposed serious failures inside the DOJ. Is it time for AG Pam Bondi to step aside? This episode breaks down what the Epstein Files reveal, what they do not, and why accountability requires more than document dumps and political theater. The controversy surrounding the Epstein Files has spiraled into confusion, speculation, and institutional dysfunction. This analysis separates allegation from evidence, examines the Department of Justice's handling of the release, and asks whether meaningful reform is possible. Covering everything from due process and the presumption of innocence to congressional grandstanding and structural oversight failures, this episode delivers clarity in a moment dominated by noise. What You'll Learn Why the Epstein Files chaos reflects deeper DOJ leadership failures The difference between moral outrage and prosecutable evidence How Congress contributed to the dysfunction through performative oversight Why chaotic disclosure without context damages public trust What a serious, structured accountability commission should look like What Attorney General Pam Bondi and the DOJ can learn from the restructuring of the DNI under Tulsi Gabbard This is not about protecting the powerful. It is about restoring equal justice under law and demanding competence from institutions that hold immense power over American lives.

How can trauma become a catalyst for creative transformation? What lessons can indie authors learn from the music industry's turbulent journey through technological disruption? With Jack Williamson. In the intro, Why recipes for publishing success don't work and what to do instead [Self-Publishing with ALLi Podcast]; Why your book isn't selling: metadata [Novel Marketing Podcast]; Creating a successful author business [Fantasy Writers Toolshed Podcast]; Bones of the Deep – J.F. Penn. Today's show is sponsored by ProWritingAid, writing and editing software that goes way beyond just grammar and typo checking. With its detailed reports on how to improve your writing and integration with writing software, ProWritingAid will help you improve your book before you send it to an editor, agent or publisher. Check it out for free or get 15% off the premium edition at www.ProWritingAid.com/joanna This show is also supported by my Patrons. Join my Community at Patreon.com/thecreativepenn Jack Williamson is a psychotherapist, coach, and bestselling author who spent nearly two decades as a music industry executive. He's the founder of Music & You, his latest nonfiction book is Maybe You're The Problem, and he also writes romance under A.B. Jackson. You can listen above or on your favorite podcast app or read the notes and links below. Here are the highlights and the full transcript is below. Show Notes Finding post-traumatic growth and meaning after bereavement, and using tragedy as a catalyst for creative transformation Why your superpower can also be your Achilles heel, and how indie authors can overcome shiny object syndrome Three key lessons from the music industry: embracing change, thinking creatively about marketing, and managing pressure for better creativity The A, B, C technique for PR interviews and why marketing is storytelling through different mediums How to deal with judgment and shame around AI in the author community by understanding where people sit on the opinion-belief-conviction continuum Three AI developments coming from music to publishing: training clauses in contracts, one-click genre adaptation, and licensed AI-generated video adaptations You can find Jack at JackWilliamson.co.uk and his fiction work at ABJackson.com. Transcript of the interview with Jack Williamson Jo: Jack Williamson is a psychotherapist, coach, and bestselling author who spent nearly two decades as a music industry executive. He's the founder of Music & You, his latest nonfiction book is Maybe You're The Problem, and he also writes romance under A.B. Jackson. Welcome to the show. Jack: Thank you so much for having me, Jo. It's a real honour to be on your podcast after listening all of these years. Jo: I'm excited to talk to you. We have a lot to get into, but first up— Tell us a bit more about you and why get into writing books after years of working in music. Jack: I began my career at the turn of the millennium, basically, and I worked for George Michael and Mariah Carey's publicist, which I'm sure you can imagine was quite the introduction to the corporate world. From there I went on to do domestic and international marketing for a load of massive artists at Universal, so the equivalent of the top five publishers in the publishing world that we all work in. Then from there I had a bit of a challenge. In December 2015, I lost my brother, unfortunately to suicide. For any listener or any person that's gone through a traumatic event, it can really make you reassess everything, make you question life, make you question your purpose. When I went through that, I was thinking, well, what do I want to do? What do I want out of life? So I went on this journey for practically the next ten years. I retrained to be a psychotherapist. I created a bucket list—a list of all the things that I thought maybe my brother would've wanted to do but didn't do. One of the things was scatter his ashes at the Seven Wonders of the world. Then one of the items on my bucket list was to write a book. The pandemic hit. It was a challenge for all of us, as you've spoken about so much on this wonderful podcast. I thought, well, why not? Why not write this book that I've wanted to write? I didn't know when I was going to do it because I was always so busy, and then the pandemic happened and so I wrote a book. From there, listening to your wonderful podcast, I've learned so much and been to so many conferences and learned along the way. So now I've written five books and released three. Jo: That's fantastic. I mean, regular listeners to the show know that I talk about death and grief and all of this kind of thing, and it's interesting that you took your brother's ashes to the Seven Wonders of the world. Death can obviously be a very bad, negative thing for those left behind, but it seems like you were able to reframe your brother's experience and turn that into something more positive for your life rather than spiralling into something bad. So if people listening are feeling like something happens, whether it's that or other things— How can we reframe these seemingly life-ending situations in a more positive way? Jack: It is very hard and there's no one way to do it. I think as you always say, I never want to tell people what to do or what to think. I want to show them how to think and how they can approach things differently or from a different perspective. I can only speak from my journey, but we call it in therapeutic language, post-traumatic growth. It is, how do you define it so it doesn't define you? Because often when you have a bereavement of a loved one, a family member, it can be very traumatic, but how can you take meaning and find meaning in it? There's a beautiful book called Man's Search for Meaning, and the name of the author escapes me right now, but he says— Jo: Viktor Frankl. Jack: Yes. Everyone quotes it as one of their favourite books, and one of my favourite lines is, “Man can take everything away from you, apart from the ability to choose one thought over the other.” I think it's so true because we can make that choice to choose what to think. So in those moments when we are feeling bad, when we're feeling down, we want to honour our feelings, but we don't necessarily want to become them. We want to process that, work through, get the support system that we need. But again, try to find meaning, try to find purpose, try to understand what is going on, and then pay it forward. Irrespective of your belief system, we all yearn for purpose. We all yearn for being connected to something bigger than ourselves. If we can find that through bereavement maybe, or through a traumatic incident, then hopefully we can come through the other side and have that post-traumatic growth. Jo: I love that phrase, post-traumatic growth. That's so good. Obviously people think about post-traumatic anything as like PTSD—people immediately think a sort of stress disorder, like it's something that makes things even worse. I like that you reframed it in that way. Obviously I think the other thing is you took specific action. You didn't just think about it. You travelled, you retrained, you wrote books. So I think also it's not just thinking. In fact, thinking about things can sometimes make it worse if you think for too long, whereas taking an action I think can be very strong as well. Jack: Ultimately we are human beings as opposed to human doings, but actually being a human doing from time to time can be really helpful. Actually taking steps forward, doing things differently, using it as a platform to move forward and to do things that maybe you didn't before. When you are confronted with death, it can actually make you question your own mortality and actually question, am I just coasting along? Am I stuck in a rut? Could I be doing something differently? One of the things that bereavement, does is it holds a mirror up to ourselves and it makes us question, well, what do we want from our life? Are we here to procreate? Are we here to make a difference? Some of us can't procreate, or some of us choose not to procreate, but we can all make a difference. And it's, how do we do that? Where do we do that? When do we do that? Jo: That's interesting. I was thinking today about service and gratitude. I'm doing this Master's and I was reading some theology stuff today, and service and gratitude, I think if you are within a religious tradition, are a normal part of that kind of religious life. Whether it's service to God and gratitude to God, or service and gratitude to others. I was thinking that these two things, service and gratitude, can actually really help reframe things as well. Who can we serve? As authors, we're serving our readers and our community. What can we be grateful about? That's often our readers and our community as well. So I don't know, that helped me today—thinking about how we can reframe things, especially in the world we're in now where there's a lot of anger and grief and all kinds of things. Jack: That's what we've got to look at. We are here to serve. Again, that can take different shapes, different forms. Some of us work in the service industry. I provide a service as a psychotherapist, you serve your listeners with knowledge and information that you gather and dispense through the research you do or the guests you have on. We serve readers of the different genres that we write in. It's what ways can we serve, how can we serve? Again, I think we all, if we can and when we can, should pay it forward. Someone said this to me once in the music industry: be careful who you meet on the way up and how you treat them on the way up, because invariably you'll meet them on the way down. So if you can pay forward that kindness, if you can be kind, considerate, and treat people how you want to be treated, that is going to pay dividends in the long run. It may not come off straight away, but invariably it will come back to you in some way, shape, or form in a different way. Jo: I've often talked about social karma and karma in the Hindu sense—the things that you do come back to you in some other form. Possibly in another life, which I don't believe. In terms of, I guess, you didn't know what was going to happen to your brother, and so you make the most of the life that we have at the moment because things change and you just don't know how things are going to change. You talk about this in your book, Maybe You're The Problem, which is quite a confronting title. So just talk about your book, Maybe You're The Problem, and why you wrote that. Put it into context with the author community and why that might be useful. Jack: Thank you for flagging my book. I intentionally crossed out “maybe” on the merchandise I did as well, because in essence, we are our own problem. We can get in the way, and it's what happened to us when we grew up wasn't our fault, but what we do with it is our responsibility. We may have grown up in a certain period or a climate. We didn't necessarily choose to do that, but what we do with that as a result is up to us. So we can stay in our victimhood and we can blame our parents, or we can blame the generation we are in, or we can blame the city, the location—however, that is relinquishing your power. That is staying in a victim mindset rather than a survivor or a thriver mindset. So it's about how can we look at the different areas in our life. Whether that is conflict, whether that is imposter syndrome, whether that is the generation we're born into. We try to understand how that has shaped us and how we may be getting in our own way to stop us from growing, to stop us from expanding, and to see where our blind spots are, our limitations are, and how that may impact us. There's so much going on in the moment in the world, whether that is in the digital realm, whether that is in the geo-climate that we're in at the moment. Again, that's going to bring up a lot for us. How can we find solutions to those problems for us so that we continue to move forward rather than be restricted and hindered by them? Jo: Alright. Well let's get into some more specifics. You have been in the author community now for a while. You go to conferences and you are in the podcast community and all this kind of thing. What specific issues have you seen in the author community? Maybe around some of the things you've mentioned, or other things? How might we be able to deal with those? Jack: With authors, I think it is such a wonderful and unique industry that I have an honour and privilege of being a part of now. One of the main things I've learned is just how creative people are. Coming from a creative industry like the music industry, there is a lot of neurodivergence in the creative industries and in the author community. Whether that is autism, whether that is ADHD—that is a real asset to have as a superpower, but it can be an Achilles heel. So it's understanding—and I know that there is an overexposure of people labelling themselves as ADHD—but on the flip side to that, it's how can we look at what's going on for us? For ADHD, for example, there's a thing called shiny object syndrome. You've talked about this in the past, Joanna, where it's like a new thing comes along, be it TikTok, be it Substack, be it bespoke books, be it Shopify, et cetera. We can rush and quickly be like, “oh, let me do this, let me do that,” before we actually take the time to realise, is this right for me? Does this fit my author business? Does this fit where I'm at in my author journey? I think sometimes as authors, we need to not cave in to that shiny object syndrome and take a step back and think to ourselves, how does this serve me? How does this serve my career? How does this work for me if I'm looking at this as a career? If you're looking at it as a hobby, obviously it's a different lens to look through, but that's something that I would often make sure that we look at. One of the other things that really comes up is that in order for any of us to address our fears and anxieties, we need to make sure that we feel psychologically safe and to put ourselves in spaces and places where we feel seen, heard, and understood, which can help address some of the issues that I've just mentioned. Being in that emotionally regulated state when we are with someone we know and trust—so taking someone to a conference, taking someone to a space or a place where you feel that you can be seen, heard, and understood—can help us and allow us to embrace things that we perceive to be scary. That may be finding an author group, finding an online space where you can actually air and share your thoughts, your feelings, where you don't feel that you are being judged. Often it can be quite a judgmental space and place in the online world. So it's just finding your tribe and finding places where you can actually lean into that. So there'd be two things. Jo: I like the idea of the superpower and the Achilles heel because I also feel this when we are writing fiction. Our characters have strengths, but your fatal flaw is often related to your strength. Jack: Yes. Jo: For example, I know I am independent. One of the reasons I'm an independent author is because I'm super independent. But one of my greatest fears is being dependent. So I do lots of things to avoid being dependent on other people, which can lead me to almost damage myself by not asking for help or by trying to make sure that I control everything so I never have to ask anyone else to do something. I'm coming to terms with this as I get older. I feel like this is something we start to hit—I mean, as a woman after menopause—is this feeling of I might have to be dependent on people when I'm older. It's so interesting thinking about this and thinking— My independence is my strength. How can it also be my weakness? So what do you think about that? You're going to psychotherapist me now. Jack: I definitely won't, but it's interesting. Just talking about that, we all have wounds and we all have the shadow, as you've even written about in one of your books. And it's how that can come from a childhood wound where it's like we seek help and it's not given to us. So we create a belief system where I have to do everything myself because no one will help me. Or we may have rejection sensitivity, so we reject ourselves before others can reject us. So it's actually about trying, where we can, to honour our truths, honour that we may want to be independent, for example, but then realising that success leaves clues. I always say that if you are independent—and I definitely align a hundred percent with you, Joanna—I've had to work really hard myself in personal therapy and in business and life to realise that no human is an island and we can't all do this on our own. Yes, it's amazing with the AI agents now that can help us in a business capacity, but having those relationships that we can tap into—like you mentioned all of the people that you tap into—it's so important to have those. I always say that it's important to have three mentors: one person that's ahead of you (for me, that would be Katie Cross because she's someone that I find is an amazing author and we speak at least once a month); people that are at the same level as you that you can go on the journey together with (and I have an author group for that); and then someone that is perceived to be behind you or in a younger generation than you, because you can learn as much from them as they can learn from you. If you can actually tap into those people whilst honouring your independence, then it feels like you can still go on your own journey, but you can tap in and tap out as and when needed. Sacha Black will give you amazing insights, other people like Honor will give you amazing insights, but you can also provide that for them. So there's that safety of being able to do it on your own. But on the flip side, you still have those people that you can tap into as and when necessary as a sounding board, as information on how they were successful, and go from there. Jo: No, I like that. If you're new to the show, Sacha Black and Honor Raconteur have been on the show and they are indeed some of my best friends. So I appreciate that. I really like the idea of the three mentor idea. I just want to add to that because I do think people misunderstand the word mentor sometimes. You mentioned you speak to Katie Cross, but I've found that a lot of the mentors that I've had who are ahead of me have often been books. We mentioned the Viktor Frankl book, and if people don't know, he was Jewish and in the concentration camps and survived that. So it's a real survivor story. But to me, books have been mostly my mentors in terms of people who are ahead of me. We don't always need to speak to or be friends with our mentors. I think that's important too, right? Because I just get emails a lot that say, “Will you be my mentor?” And I don't think that's the point. Jack: Oh, I a hundred percent agree with you. If you don't have access to those mentors—like Oprah Winfrey is one of the people that I perceive as a mentor—I listen to podcasts, I read her books, I watch interviews. There is a way to absorb and acquire that information, and it doesn't have to be a direct relationship with them. It is someone that you can gain the knowledge and wisdom that they've imparted in whatever form you may consume it. Which is why I think it is important to have those three levels: that one that is above you that may be out of reach in terms of a human connection, but you can still access; then the people at the same level as you that you can have those relationships and grow with; and again, that one behind that you can help pave the way for them, but also learn from them as well. So a hundred percent agree that that mentor that you are looking for that may be ahead of you doesn't necessarily need to be someone that is in a real-world relationship. Jo: So let's just circle back to your music industry experience. You mentioned being on the sort of marketing team for some really big names in music, and I mean, it's kind of a sexy job really. It just sounds pretty cool, but of course the music industry has just as many challenges as publishing. What did you learn from working in the music industry that you think might be particularly useful for authors? Jack: The perception of reality was definitely a lot different. It does look sexy and glamorous, but the reality is similar to going to conferences. It's pretty much flight, hotel, and dark rooms with terrible air conditioning that you spend a lot of time in. So sorry to burst the illusion. But I mean, it does have its moments as well. There is so much I've learned over the years and there's probably three things that stand out the most. The first one was I entered the industry right at the height of the music industry. In 2000, 2001. That was when Napster really exploded and it decimated the music industry. It wiped half the value in the space of four years. Then the music industry was trying to shut it down, throwing legal, throwing everything at it, but it was like whack-a-mole. As soon as one went down such as Napster, ten others popped up like Kazaa. So you saw that the old guard wasn't willing to embrace change. They weren't willing to adapt. They assumed that people wanted the formats of CDs, vinyls, cassettes, and they were wrong. Yes, people wanted music, but they actually wanted the music. They didn't care about the format, they just wanted the access. So that was one of the really interesting things that I learned, because I was like, you have to embrace change. You can't ignore it. You can't push it away, push it aside, because it's coming whether you like it or not. I think thankfully the music industry has learned as AI's coming, because now you have to embrace it. There's a lot of legal issues that have been going on at the moment with rights, which you've covered about the Anthropic case and so on. It's such a challenge, and I just think that's the first one. The second one I learned was back in 2018. There was an artist I worked on called Freya Ridings. At that time I was working at an independent record label rather than one of the big three major record labels. She had great songs and we were up against one of the biggest periods of the year and trying to make noise. At the time, Love Island was the biggest TV show on, and everyone wanted to be on it in terms of getting their music synced in the scenes. We were just like, we are never going to compete. So we thought, we need to be clever here. We need to think differently. What we did is we found out what island the show was being recorded on, and we geo-targeted our ads just to that island because we knew the sync team were going to be on there. So we just went hard as nails, advertised relentlessly, and we knew that the sync people would then see the adverts. As a result of that, Freya got the sync. It became the biggest song that season on Love Island, back when it was popular. As a result of that, we built from there. We were like, right, we can't compete with the majors. We have to think differently. We need to do things differently. We need to be creative. It wasn't an easy pathway. That year there were only two other songs that were independent that reached the top 10. So we ended up becoming a third and the biggest song that year. The reason I'm saying that is we can't compete with the major publishers. But the beauty of the independent author community is because we have smaller budgets—most of us, not all of us, but most of us—we have to think differently. We have to make our bang for our buck go a lot further. So it's actually— How can we stay creative? How can we think differently? What can we do differently? So that would be the second thing. Then the third main lesson that I learned, and this is more on the creative side, is that pressure can often work against you, both in a business sense, but especially creativity. I've seen so many artists over the years have imposed deadlines on them to hand in their albums, and it's impacted the quality of their output. Once it's handed in, the stress and the pressure is off, and then you realise that actually those artists end up creating the best material that they have, and then they rush to put it on. Whether that's Mariah Carey's “We Belong Together,” Adele with her song “Hello,” Taylor Swift did the same with “Shake It Off”—they're just three examples. The reason is that pressure keeps us in our beta brainwave state, which is our rational, logical mind. For those of us that are authors that are writing fiction, or even if we are creating stories in our nonfiction work to deliver a point, we need to be in that creative mindset. So we need to be in the alpha and the gamma brain state. Because our body works on 90-minute cycles known as our ultradian rhythm, we need to make sure that we honour our cycle and work with that. If we go past that, our creativity and our productivity is going to go down between 60% and 40% respectively. So as authors, it's important—one, to apply the right amount of pressure; two, to work in breaks; and three, to know what kind of perspective we're looking at. Do we need to be rational and logical, or do we need to be creative? And then adjust the sails accordingly. Jo: That's all fantastic. I want to come back on the marketing thing first—around what you did with the strategic marketing there and the targeted ads to that island. That's just genius. I feel like a lot of us, myself included, we struggle to think creatively about marketing because it's not our natural state. Of course, you've done a lot of marketing, so maybe it comes more naturally to you. I think half the time we don't even use the word creative around marketing, when you're not a marketeer. What are some ways that we can break through our blocks around marketing and try to be more creative around that? Jack: I would challenge a lot of authors on that presumption, because as authors we're in essence storytellers, and to tell a story is creative. There's a great quote: “One death is a tragedy. A thousand deaths is a statistic.” If you can create a story, a compelling narrative about a death in the news, it's going to pull at the heartstrings of people. It's going to really resonate and get with them. Whereas if you are just quoting statistics, most people switch off because they become desensitised to it. So I think because we can tell stories, and that's the essence of what we do, it's how can we tell our story through the medium of social media? How can we tell a story through our creative ads that we then put out onto Facebook or TikTok or whatever platform that we're putting them out—BookBub, et cetera? How can we create a narrative that garners the attention? If we are looking at local media or traditional media, how can we do that? How can we get people to buy in to what we're selling? So it's about having different angles. For me with my new romance book, Stolen Moments, one of the stories I had that really has helped me get some coverage and PR is we recorded the songs next door to the Rolling Stones. Now that was very fortunate timing, very fortunate. But everyone's like, “Oh my God, you recorded next door to the Rolling Stones?” So it's like, well, how can you bring in these creative nuggets that help you to find a story? Again, marketing is in essence telling a story, albeit through different mediums and forms. So it's just how can you package that into a marketable product depending on the platform in which you're putting it out on. Jo: I think that's actually hilarious, by the way, because what you hit on there, as someone with a background in marketing, your story about “we recorded an album for the book next door to the Rolling Stones”—it's got nothing to do with the romance. Jack: Oh, the romance is that the pop star in the book writes and records songs. Jo: Yes, I realised that. But the fact is— For doing things like PR, it's the story behind the story. They don't care that you've written a romance. Jack: Yes. Jo: They're far more interested in you, the author, and other things. So I think what you just described there was a kind of PR hook that most of us don't even think about. Jack: I'm sure a lot of authors already know this, so it's a good reminder, and if you don't, it's great. It's called the A, B, C technique. When you get asked a question, you Answer the question. So that's A. You Build a bridge, and then you go to C, which is Covering one of your points. So whenever you get asked a question, have a list of things you want to get across in an interview. Then just make sure that you find that bridge between whatever the question is to cover off one of your points, and that's how you can do it. Because yes, you may be selling a story, like I said, about writing the songs, but then you can bridge it into actually covering and promoting whatever it is you're promoting. So I think that's always quite helpful to remember. Jo: Well, that's a good tip for things like coming on podcasts as well. I've had people on who don't do what you just mentioned and will just try and shoehorn things in in a more deliberate fashion, whereas other people, as you have just done with your romance there, bring it in while answering a question that actually helps other people. So I think that's the kind of thing we need to think about in marketing. Okay, so then let's come back to the embracing change, and as you mentioned, the AI stuff that's going on. I feel like there's so many “stories” around AI right now. There's a lot of stories being told on both sides—on the positive side, on the negative side—that people believe and buy into and may or may not be true. There's obviously a lot of anger. There's, I think, grief—a big thing that people might not even realise that they have. Can you talk about how authors might deal with what's coming up around the technological change around AI, and any of your personal thoughts as well? Jack: I was thinking about this a lot recently. I mean, I guess everyone is in their own ways and forms. One of the things that came up for me is we have genre expectations and we have generation expectations. When we look at genres, you will have different expectations from different genres. For romance, they want a happily ever after or a happy for now. For cosy mysteries, they expect the crime to be solved. So we as authors make sure we endeavour to meet those expectations. The challenge is that if we are looking at AI, we are all in our own generations. We might be in slightly different generations, but there are going to be different generation expectations from the Alpha generation that's coming up and the Beta generation that's just about to start this year or next year because they're going to come into the world where they don't know any different to AI. So they will have a different expectation than us. It will just be normal that there will be AI agents. It will just be normal that there are AI narrators. It will be normalised that AI will assist authors or assist everyone in doing their jobs. So again, it is a grieving period because we can long for what was, we can yearn for things that worked for us that no longer work for us—whether it's Facebook groups, whether it's the Kindle Rush. We can mourn the loss of that, but that's not coming back. I mean, sometimes there may be a resurgence, but essentially, we've got to embrace the change. We've got to understand that it's coming and it's going to bring up a lot of different emotions because you may have been beholden to one thing and you may be like, yes, I've now got my TikTok lives, and then all of a sudden TikTok goes away. I know Adam, when he was talking about it, he'll just find another platform. But there'll be a lot of people that are beholden to it and then they're like, what do I do now? So again, it's never survival of the fittest—it's survival of the most adaptable. I always use this metaphor where there are three people on three different boats. A storm comes. And the first, the optimist, is like, “Oh, it'll pass,” and does nothing. The pessimist complains about the storm and does nothing. But the realist will adjust the sails and use the storm to find its way to the other side, to get through. It's not going to be easy, but they're actually taking change and making change to get to where they need to go, rather than just expecting or complaining. I get it. We are not, and I hate the expression, “we're all in the same boat.” I call bleep on that. I'm not going to swear. We're not all in the same boat. We're all in the same storm, but different people are going through different things. For some, they can adjust and adapt really quickly like a speedboat. For others, they may be like Jack and Rose in the Titanic on that terrible prop where they're clinging to dear life and trying to get through the storm. So it's about how do I navigate this upcoming storm? What can I do within my control to get through the storm? For some it may be easier because they have the resources, or for some of us that love learning, it's easy to embrace change. For others that have a fear mindset and it's like, “Oh, something new, it's scary, I don't want to embrace it”—you are going to take longer. So you may not be the speedboat, but at some point we are going to have to embrace that change. Otherwise we're going to get left behind. So you need to look at that. Jo: The storm metaphor is interesting, and being in different boats. I feel I do struggle. I struggle with people who suddenly seem to be discovering the storm. I've been talking about AI now since 2016. That's a decade. Jack: Yes. Jo: Even ChatGPT has been around more than three years, and people come to me now and they're talking about stories that they've seen in the media that are just old now. Things have moved on so much. I feel like maybe I was on my boat and I looked through my telescope and I saw the storm. I've been talking about the storm and I've had my own moments of being in the middle of the storm. Now I definitely do struggle with people who just seem to have arrived without any knowledge of it before. I oscillate between being an optimist and a realist. I think I'm somewhere between the two, probably. But I think what is driving me a little crazy in the author community right now is judgment and shame. There are people who are judging other people, and there's shame felt by AI-curious or AI-positive people. So I want to help the people who feel shame in some way for trying new technology, but they still feel attacked. Then those people judge other authors for their choices to use technology. So how do you think we can deal with judgment and shame in the community? Which is a form of conflict, I guess. Jack: Of course. I think with that, there's another great PR quote: “If it bleeds, it leads.” Especially in this digital age, there's a lot of clickbait. So the more polarising, the more emotion-evoking the headline, the more likely you are to engage with that content—whether that is reading it or whether that's posting or retweeting, or whatever format you are consuming it on. So unfortunately, media has now become so much more polarising. It's dividing us rather than uniting us. So people are going to have stronger positions. There's so much even within this to look at. One is, you have to work out where people are on the continuum. Do they have an opinion on AI? Do they have a belief? Or do they have a conviction? Now you're not going to move someone that has a conviction about something, so it's not worth even engaging with them because they're immovable. Like they say, you shouldn't talk about sports, politics, and religion. There are certain subjects that may not be worth talking about, especially if they have a conviction. Because they may not even be able to agree to disagree. They may not be willing or able to hear you. So first and foremost, it's about understanding, well, where are those people sitting on the continuum of AI? Are they curious? Do they have an opinion, but they're open to hearing other opinions? Do they have a belief that could be changed or evolved if they find more information? That's where I think it is. It's not necessarily our jobs—even though you do an amazing job of it, Joanna—but a lot of people are undereducated on these issues or these new technologies. So in some cases it's just a case of a lack of education or them being undereducated. Hopefully in time they will become more and more educated. But again, it's how long is a piece of string? Will people catch up? Will they stay behind? Are they fearful? I guess because of social media, because of the media, as they say, if you can evoke fear in people, you can control them. You can control their perspectives. You can control their minds. So that's where we see it—a lot of people are operating from a fear mindset. So then that's when they project their vitriol in certain cases. If people want to believe a certain thing, that's their choice. I'm not here to tell people what to think. Like I said earlier, it's more about how to think. But I would just encourage people to find people that align with you. Do a sense test, like a litmus test, to find where they sit on the continuum and engage with those people that are open and have opinions or beliefs. But shy away or just avoid people that have convictions that maybe are the polar opposite of yours. Jo: It's funny, isn't it? We seem to be in a phase of history when I feel like you should be able to disagree with people and still be friends. Although, as you mentioned, there's certain members of my family where we just stay on topics of TV shows and movies or music, or what books are you reading? Like, we don't go anywhere near politics. So I do think that might be a rule also with the AI stuff. As you said, find a community, and there are plenty of AI-positive spaces now for people who do want to talk about this kind of stuff. I also think that, I don't know whether this is a tipping point this year, but certainly— I know people who are in bigger corporates where the message is now, “You need to embrace this stuff. It is now part of your job to learn how to use these AI tools.” So if that starts coming into people's day jobs, and also people who have, I don't know, kids at school or people at university who are embracing this more—I mean, maybe it is a generational thing. Jack: Yes. Look, there were so many people that were resistant to working from home, or corporations that were, and then the pandemic forced it. Now everyone's embraced it in some way, shape, or form. I mean, there are people that don't, but the majority of people—when something's forced on you, you have to adapt. So again, if those things are implemented in corporations, then you're going to see it. I'm seeing so many amazing new things in AI that have been implemented in the music industry that we'll see in the publishing industry coming down the road. That will scare a lot of people, but again, we have to embrace those things because they're coming and there's going to be an expectation—especially from the younger generations—that these things are available. So again, it's not first past the post, but if you can be ahead of the wave or at least on the wave, then you are going to reap the rewards. If you are behind the wave, you're going to get left behind. So that's my opinion. I'm not trying to encourage anyone to see from my lens, but at the same time, I do think that we need to be thinking differently. We need to always embrace change where we can, as we can, at the pace that we can. Jo: You mentioned there AI things coming down the road in the music industry. And now everyone's going, wait, what is coming? So tell us— What do you see ahead that you think might also shift into the author world? Jack: There are three things that I've seen. Two that have been implemented and one that's been talked about and worked on at the moment. The first, and this will be quite scary for people, is that major record labels—so think the major publishers on our side—they're all now putting clauses in their contracts that require the artists that sign with them to allow their works to be trained by their own AI models. So that is something that is now actually happening in record labels. I wouldn't be surprised, although I don't have insight into it, if Simon & Schuster, HarperCollins, et cetera, are potentially doing the same with authors that sign to them. So that's going to become more standardised. So that is on the major side. But then on the creative side, there are two things that really excite me. The music AI platforms that we're hearing about, the stories that we've seen in the press, and it's the fact that with a click of a button, you can recreate a song into a different genre. I find it so fascinating because if you think about that—turning a pop song into a country song or a rap song into a dance song—the possibilities that we have as authors with our books, if we wish to do so, are amazing. I just think, for example, with your ARKANE series, Joanna, imagine clicking a button and just with one click you can take Morgan Sierra and turn her into a romantic lead in a romance book. Jo: See, it's so funny because I personally just can't imagine that because it's not something I would write. But I guess one example in the romance genre itself is I know plenty of romance authors who write a clean and a spicy version of the same story, right? It is already happening in that way. It's just not a one-click. Jack: Well, I think you can also look at it another way. I think one of the most famous examples is Twilight. With Twilight and Stephenie Meyer, if she had the foresight—and I'm not saying she didn't, just to clarify—but fan fiction is such a massive sub-genre of works. And obviously from Twilight came 50 Shades of Gray. Imagine if she had the licensing rights like the NFTs, where she could have made money off of every sale. So that you could then, through works that you create and give licence, earn a percentage of every release, every sale, every consumption unit of your works. There are just so many possibilities where you can create, adapt, have spinoffs that can then build out your world. Obviously, there may need to be an approval process in there for continuity and quality control because you want to make sure you're doing that, but I think that has such massive potential in publishing if we wish to do so. Or like I said, change characters. Like Robert Langdon's character in Dan Brown's books—no longer being the kind of thriller, but maybe being a killer instead. There's so many possibilities. It's just, again, how to think, not what to think—how to think differently and how we can use that. So that's the second of three. Jo: Oh, before you move on, you did mention NFTs and I've actually been reading about this again. So I'm usually five years early. That's the general rule. I started talking about NFTs in mid-2021, and obviously there was a crypto crash, it goes up and down, blah, blah, blah. But forget the crypto side—on the blockchain side, digital originality, and exactly what you said about saying like, where did this originate? This is now coming back in the AI world. It could be that I really was five years early. So amusingly—and I'm going to link to it in the notes because I did a “Why NFTs Are Exciting for Authors” solo episode, I think in 2022—it may be that the resurgence will happen in the next year, and all those people who said I was completely wrong, that this may be coming back. Digital originality I think is what we're talking about there. But so, okay, so what was the other thing? Jack: So the third one is the one that I'm most excited about, but I think will be the most scary for people. Obviously consumption changes and formats change. Like I said, in music I've seen it all the time—whether it's vinyl to cassettes, to CDs, to downloads, to streaming. Again, there's different consumption of the same format, and we see that with books as well, obviously—hardbacks, paperbacks, eBooks, audiobooks. Now with the rise of AI, AI narration has made audiobooks so much more accessible for people. I know that there are issues with certain people not wanting to do it, or certain platforms not allowing AI narration to be uploaded unless it's their own. The next step is what I'm most excited about. What I'm seeing now in the music industry is people licensing their image to then recreate that as music videos because music videos are so expensive. One of my friends just shot a music video for two million pounds. I don't think many authors would ever wish to spend that. If you can license your image and use AI to create a three-minute music video that looks epic and just as real as humanly possible, imagine if those artists—or if we go a step further, those actors—license their image to then be used to adapt our books into a TV series or a film. So that then we are in a position where that is another format of consumption alongside an audiobook, a paperback, an eBook, hardcover, special edition, and so on and so forth. It potentially has the opportunity to open us up to a whole new world. Because yes, there are adaptations of books that we're seeing at the moment, but for those of us that are trying to get our content into different formats, this can be a new pathway. I'm going to make a prediction here myself, Joanna. Jo: Mm-hmm. Jack: I would say in the next five to ten years, there will be a platform akin to a Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney Plus, Apple Plus, where you can license the rights to an image of an actor or an actress. Then with the technology—and you may need people to help you adapt your book into a TV series or a film—that can then be consumed. I just think the possibilities are endless. I mean, again, I think of your character and I'm like, oh, what would it be if Angelina Jolie licensed her image and you could have her play the lead character in your ARKANE series? I mean, again, the possibilities potentially are endless here. Jo: Well, and on that, if people think this won't happen—1776, I don't know if you've seen this, it's just being teased at the moment. Darren Aronofsky has made an American revolutionary story all with AI. So this is being talked about at the moment. It's on YouTube at the moment. The AI video is just extraordinary already, so I totally agree with you. I think things are going to be quite weird for a while, and it will take a while to get used to. You mentioned coming into the music industry in 2000, 2001—I started my work before the internet, and then the internet came along and lots of things changed. I mean, anyone who's older than 40, 45-ish can remember what work was like without the internet. Now we are moving into a time where it'll be like, what was it like before AI? And I think we'll look back and go like, why the hell did we do that kind of thing? So it is a changing world, but yes, exciting times, right? I think the other thing that's happening right now, even to me, is that things are moving so fast. You can almost feel like a kind of whiplash with how much is changing. How do we deal with the fast pace of change while still trying to anchor ourselves in our writing practice and not going crazy? Jack: Again, it's that everything everywhere all at once—you can get lost and discombobulated. I always say be the tortoise, not the hare—because you don't want to fly and die. You want pace and grace. Everyone will have a different pace. For some marathon runners, they can run a five-minute mile, some can run an eight-minute mile, some can run a twelve-minute mile. It's about finding the pace that works for you. Every one of us have different commitments. Every one of us have different ways we view the industry—some as a hobby, some as a business. So it's about honouring your needs, your commitment. Some of us, as you've had people on the podcast, some people are carers. They have to care. Some people are parents. Some people don't have those commitments and so can devote more time and then actually learn more, change more as a result. So again, it's about finding your groove, finding your rhythm, honouring that, and again, showing up consistently. Because motivation may get you started, but it's habit and discipline that sees you through. Keep that discipline, keep that pace and grace. Be consistent in what you can do. And know where you're at. Don't compare and despair, because again, if you look at someone else, they may be ahead of you, but the race is only with yourself in the end. So you've got to just focus on where you are at and am I in a better place than I was yesterday? Am I working on my business as well as in my business? How am I doing that? When am I doing that? And what am I doing that for? If you can be asking yourself those questions and making sure you're staying true to yourself and not burning out, making sure that you are honouring your other commitments, then I think you are going at the pace that feels right for you. Jo: Brilliant. Jo: Where can people find you and your books and everything you do online? Jack: Thank you so much for having me on, Joanna, today. You can find me on JackWilliamson.co.uk for all my nonfiction books and therapy work. Then for my fiction work, it is ABJackson.com, or ABJacksonAuthor on Instagram and TikTok. Jo: Well, thanks so much for your time, Jack. That was great. Jack: Thank you so much. The post Post-Traumatic Growth, Creative Marketing, And Dealing With Change with Jack Williamson first appeared on The Creative Penn.

1. Minnesota AG Keith Ellison’s Senate Testimony Minnesota Attorney General Keith Ellison was questioned in the Senate regarding alleged failures to prevent and address large‑scale fraud in the state’s Feeding Our Future program. Senators—primarily Josh Hawley—accused Ellison of: Ignoring whistleblower warnings as early as 2018–2019. Meeting with individuals later indicted for fraud and allegedly offering to “look into” investigators who were scrutinizing them. Accepting approximately $10,000 in campaign donations from individuals tied to the fraud shortly after their meeting. Ellison strongly denied wrongdoing, describing the claims as false and politically motivated. The session was tense, marked by interruptions, raised voices, and confrontational exchanges. 2. Refusal to Condemn Louis Farrakhan During questioning, Ellison declined to explicitly condemn antisemitic statements attributed to Louis Farrakhan. He attempted to redirect discussion to immigration topics, expressing discomfort with the line of questioning. 3. Democrats Linked to Record Sewage Spill Democratic officials in Washington, D.C., Maryland, and Virginia oversaw infrastructure failures leading to the largest sewage spill in U.S. history. A burst 72‑inch sewer pipe released nearly one billion gallons of raw sewage into the Potomac River. Criticism is directed at: Lack of media coverage. Slow response times. Infrastructure mismanagement. Emergency pumps had to be transported from Texas and Florida to address the crisis. 4. Discussion of Government Competence Democratic‑run cities and states mismanage public systems (snow removal, wildfire mitigation, infrastructure maintenance, etc.). They argue such patterns reflect systemic governmental incompetence. 5. Save America Act & Voter ID Debate The Save America Act, passed in the House with near‑unanimous Republican support, requires: Proof of U.S. citizenship to register to vote. Photo ID to vote. Senator Ted Cruz advocates for aggressive procedural tactics in the Senate, including: Forcing a “talking filibuster.” Using the two‑speech rule to pressure Democratic senators. The argument made: voter ID laws are widely supported across political and demographic groups. Please Hit Subscribe to this podcast Right Now. Also Please Subscribe to the 47 Morning Update with Ben Ferguson and The Ben Ferguson Show Podcast Wherever You get You're Podcasts. And don't forget to follow the show on Social Media so you never miss a moment! Thanks for Listening YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@VerdictwithTedCruz/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/verdictwithtedcruz X: https://x.com/tedcruz X: https://x.com/benfergusonshow YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@VerdictwithTedCruzSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.