Podcast appearances and mentions of steve larsen now

Steve Larsen: What's going on everyone, this is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to Secret MLM Hacks radio and I've got a very special interview and a very special guest to bring on today for the show. So go ahead and stay tuned. We'll cue the intro, grab a pen and paper and sit tight. So here's the real mystery. How do real MLMers like us read and cheat and only bug family members and friends. If you wanna grow a profitable home business, how do we recruit A players into our down lines and create extra incomes, yet still have plenty of time for the rest of our lives. That's the blaring question, and this podcast will give you the answer. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Secret MLM Hacks radio. Hi, what's going on everyone. Hey, I'm really excited for today. You guys have a very special treat. I have just been so incredibly impressed with this person. I have actually been watching closely, from am distance. Seeing everything that's been going on. You guys know my take, in the MLM space. I truly believe that MLM nowadays is broken for the way we get it. We get it, and it's not set up correctly. Or there's so many things we got to do in order to actually still be successful with it. And it's not an aspect that's really taught by uplines. And that's not something that ... I'm not anti up line, I'm not anti the man. I'm not anti those things. But it's just the reality. And from a distance, I started watching who the who was. Of all the other people who believe the same thing. And there's more ways to do it. And hey, the Internet's here, and why do we use that. Various things. And we ran across this amazing woman. Gloria MacDonald. MacDonald. Gloria MacDonald, and I'm so excited to have her on today. She is an expert, a pro in the MLM space, using LinkedIn, using various tools and things across the internet. Very honored to have her here today. And thank you so much for being here. GloriaMacDonald: Oh Steven, absolutely my pleasure. I'm thrilled and delighted to be here. Steve Larsen: This is awesome. Very, very excited. Could you ... You have a lot of success now, right. And you're doing all these great things. And I know you've done things with huge players. Was it always that way? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. I came out of my mother's womb at the age of two. I was three level diamond in Amway. No. Steve Larsen: You saying you've always been successful, wow. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, always. And I've never had any struggles at all, you know. Yeah, right. Let me tell you another story. Let me tell you the true story. Steve Larsen: Sounds good. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. So I started in Amway, in 1979. So right off the top, Steve, and I hate to do this to you, but I have to correct you on something that I've heard you say. With great respect for what you've done. But I heard you say that [inaudible 00:02:43] hasn't changed since the 1990s. And I'm sorry, but it hasn't changed since the 1970s. Steve Larsen: I will take your correction. GloriaMacDonald: I don't fault you for not knowing that, because you wouldn't have been around in the 1970s. I was. Steve Larsen: That's funny. GloriaMacDonald: So it's mind boggling to me. Because people are still doing today, and network marketing companies today are still teaching and training exactly what I was taught in 1979 before the internet existed. Before personal computers existed. You know, there was no such thing as a personal computer. Cell phones didn't exist. I hate to think about what a dinosaur I am. But none of this stuff existed that exist today, that is so powerful that enables us to build our networking businesses in a much more effective and efficient way. And still, network marketing companies are still teaching, and uplines are still teaching, make your list of a hundred people. [inaudible 00:03:57] market. It's like, good god really? You know? Really. So, I went through all the struggles. I've done everything everyone else has done. Done my list of a hundred people too many times. I was an overachiever. So I did, you know, a hundred and fifty people, or two hundred people. Steve Larsen: Sure, yeah. GloriaMacDonald: You know, I- Steve Larsen: What happened from that? Was there a moment where you're like, wait a second. GloriaMacDonald: Well, yeah. What happened from that, was just like everybody else. I got so much rejection. And I burned through my one market. And then, especially back when I started, then what on earth what do you do? You couldn't hop on Facebook or LinkedIn, or whatever. Because those things didn't exist. So you had to be out and about, strike up conversations with total strangers in the grocery store. You know. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: And really networking meetings like we know them today didn't exist in 1979 either. So it was tough. It was grueling. Anyway, and the interesting thing, what I know now that I didn't know then, was all of that old school technique ... And don't get me wrong. Obviously there have been people who have built huge businesses using all those old school techniques. And that's great, and that's wonderful. But why would we still be using that today? Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: When there are far more efficient and effective ways. And the biggest thing about those old school ways, is that they work completely against the way our brains work. They go completely against our human physiology, biology, chemistry, psychology, and you know, our brains job is to keep us safe and protect us. So every time we start to feel any kind of rejection, our brain is literally saying, "Don't go there, don't do that. It's not safe. Rejection's not good. No, no, no, no, no." So why would you put yourself in a position where you're working against your biology, when there are all kinds of ways today where you can work with your biology, and you don't have to ... I mean, literally, you can do rejection-free recruiting. You know that, you're doing it. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Now, the first time I heard you say that, I was like, dancing up and down, screaming. Because I was like, yes, yes, someone else! Okay, absolutely. You talk about, it's literally against a lot of the way our chemical make up is put together. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: Which is true. Could you talk a little bit more about that, and what you mean about that? Because that's fascinating. I'm pretty confident most people have no idea about this. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I mean seriously, the way our brain works, the job our brain is to keep us safe, and conserve energy. That's the primary job of our brain. And it goes back to millions and millions of years of evolutionary psychology, where literally we had to conserve energy in case a tiger or lion jumped out of the jungle at us, and attacked us. We had to be ready to just fight, or flee. Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: And so we had to conserve energy, and we had to be very very very aware of what was going on around us to protect us. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: And so, even though we're not facing lions and tigers today, in that same way, our brain's job is still to protect us and to conserve energy to keep us safe. And so literally anything that feels uncomfortable to us, the brain recognizes that and says, "No, danger zone, danger zone." It literally tries to shut us down. So rejection's not comfortable for anybody, unless you work really, really, really hard against your brain. But the problem is, the vast, vast, vast majority of people just can't do it. They physically can not do it. They physically cannot re-wire their brain to go against human biology. And they can't re-wire their brain to say, "Nope, doesn't matter. I don't care about being safe." Because we need to be safe. So yeah, it goes against- Steve Larsen: I mean, you're literally saying that MLM is going against the way our bodies are built. What do you doing different? When did you realize that, and the new thing you learn. Like, oh my gosh, there's this whole other way. I don't need to be doing it this way. How do I become more in harmony with my body, and the way my body is made up to be successful in MLM? GloriaMacDonald: Great question. It was just within the last four or five years, that I had this huge uh huh, as I studied the brain more and more. And I studied the brain a lot, because it's fascinating, I believe. It's really important to understand how the human brain and the human body work to be successful, and to understand what's going on in your prospects brain. Because it's not just you, it's your prospect, right. Steve Larsen: Right. GloriaMacDonald: Your prospect brain is going through the same thing, and it's saying, "No, no, no, no. This doesn't sound like I'm going to be good at this. This doesn't sound like I'm going to succeed at this." So their brain is taking that too, because their brain's job is to make sure they don't fail. So yeah, it's just over the past four or five years I've really started understanding a whole lot more about how the brain worked. It's like, oh my gosh. Wow, all this prospecting and recruiting stuff the way I've been taught over the last 35 years really doesn't work with the brain. I mean, I knew it was tough. I knew it was tough for the vast majority of people. And I knew that somehow or other, I just trudged forward and did it. But I knew most people couldn't. But I didn't understand exactly why. I thought, well people just don't have enough stick to it ness. They just don't, all the stuff we heard. Their Why isn't big enough. Oh, you know. They just don't have enough guts, whatever it is. But it's much, much, much more scientific than that. Steve Larsen: It's not just that. GloriaMacDonald: Pardon? Steve Larsen: It's usually not just, hey I'm lazy. I don't really want success. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: [inaudible 00:10:41]. GloriaMacDonald: Exactly, exactly. And then it was really just in the last two years, that I figured out the technology piece of okay. So, you know, it was two years ago I heard about this attraction marketing thing. But okay, what's that. That sounds kind of interesting. And realized, my gosh, traction marketing, the beauty of traction marketing is that it's not working perfectly with the brand. That's why it works. Because it takes out the whole rejection thing. And then you know, I started mucking around on Facebook, and had some initial success. But then Facebook algorithms changed and started going crazy and stuff like that. So my ads weren't working, and all that kind of stuff. Steve Larsen: Thank you, Zuckerberg. GloriaMacDonald: Pardon? Steve Larsen: Thank you, Zuckerberg. GloriaMacDonald: Yes, exactly, yeah. And again, not to say that there aren't people out there that aren't having success with Facebook ads. But I think it's extremely. So Steven, if any of your listeners are listening today, and who are listening today are actually just trying to start off with Facebook ads, I think the message people need to hear, are look. If you're just starting off today, it's going to cost you a wack load of money if you don't already have a huge following. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: So the people who are making Facebook ads work, are the people that started four, five years ago, and already had followings of 50 thousand, 60 thousand, whatever. Before all the algorithms started changing like crazy. And even they are experiencing an increase in advertising cost. But it still is worth it to them. But I think it's really tough for the person that's starting out today. So I just thought, this is not a recipe for success. So I started fooling around on LinkedIn. And it was like, oh my gosh. Steve Larsen: Now, what made you choose LinkedIn? If I could just interrupt you. Sorry about that. I mean, LinkedIn is usually not the place people think of, you know. What made you go there? GloriaMacDonald: Well, I'd had a presence on LinkedIn from a previous business. Not much. I had, oh I don't know, a thousand, 12 hundred connections on LinkedIn. I fooled around with Linkedin a little bit, but not in the same way at all. And I don't know, Twitter, I thought, really? How much can you do with a hundred and twenty four characters, or whatever it was at that point. Because it was [inaudible 00:13:16] than it is now. Steve Larsen: I think we're grounded at 180 now. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. And Twitter's just not my thing. And again, there are people making money on Twitter. They are. Not me. And I fooled around a little bit with Instagram, but I couldn't figure out how Instagram was going to work for me. And again, people are making money on Instagram, but that's not the platform I cracked. So I just, I don't know. LinkedIn just made sense to me, it felt comfortable to me. And when I thought about it, I thought, wait a second. LinkedIn is where a whole bunch of professionals are. And in fact, the average LinkedIn user has twice the buying power that the average online user. So it's a more professional ... I say LinkedIn really isn't a social media platform. It's really a business platform. So the beauty of LinkedIn is that you can get right down to business. Steve Larsen: You don't expect that. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, you don't have to be what I call fake social. You know. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: So yeah. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. So you went, oh man, something's messed up there. Eventually, you left the tactics. And just so everyone's clear, we're not bashing on any MLM, just the actual tactics. They're so weird. And you go, you're like, what about this LinkedIn thing. What made LinkedIn work so well? I tell you what, if I see someone else posting on social media of them, a selfie in a gym. You know, saying, "I'm working from home today." And you're like, you just started this. You know, it can get a little frustrating. How is your approach so different so that we're not offending those parts of the brain. We're actually attracting people the right way. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, great question. So first of all, it starts with really targeting people you know who are already open and interested in what you have to offer. It's not just the old three foot rule, anybody who comes within three feet. Or anybody who calls, or anybody who breathes. You know ... Steve Larsen: [inaudible 00:15:34]. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. It's not that. It's really understanding who your target market is, and figuring out how to exactly find them. This is true for any platform. It doesn't matter whether it's LinkedIn, or Facebook, whatever. The whole basis of being able to work with the brain, is knowing who's already open to and interested in what you have to offer. And then being able to have highly targeted messages to those people. So that when you actually end up on the phone with them, or in a zoom call with them or whatever, you're not going to get any rejection. So I say to people, look, my day is filled with conversations like you and I have right now. When I'm talking to people who are already totally sold on network marketing, they already believe in that. They struggled. The vast majority of them struggled. And they feel like, oh they can just figure out the secret. If I could just get the one thing to work, then I'd be a millionaire. As you and I both know, it's not that easy. Nothing is that easy, it's a business, and you have to treat it like a business. It doesn't mean 100 percent of people are going to buy from you, or join your team. But there's no rejection. There's no beating your head against the wall trying to talk someone into the idea that network marketing isn't a scam or a pyramid scheme or whatever. So it works with the brain. And you know, there are millions and millions and millions, and millions and millions and millions of network marketers on LinkedIn, but they're not using it. Steve Larsen: So they're sold on the concept of network marketing, they just don't know how to apply it anymore. Especially in today's internet saturated world. Everyone's far more shut off a little bit, and ... So how do you ... When do you know that you're ... Because here's how I imagine it, right. Someone comes in, and you kind of start sizing them up. Not to say you skip the relationship, which you don't obviously. But you're sizing them up, and trying to see, hey, is this person someone I can attract to me, in starting up a conversation. What are the signs that you know you're taking to somebody who's already in an MLM, who's already ... Without being, feeling like you're being pushy? GloriaMacDonald: Well for me, it's really simple. They have it on their LinkedIn profile. Steve Larsen: Got you. GloriaMacDonald: So I target them because they said on their LinkedIn profile, that they're with ABC company. Or they've got the words Network Marketing in the profile, whatever. So it is very easy to find network marketers on LinkedIn. It's a piece of cake to find network marketers on LinkedIn. And the beauty of what I teach, Steven, is it's free. Now, people say, oh you can't scale when it's free. And there is a certain amount of truth to that. But only a certain amount. And you know, my whole goal is to help people make money. Because as you and I know, there's so many people that, they've got a dream. They want to be able to send their kids to college. They want to be able to take vacations. They want to be able to pay off their debt. They want to be able to take care of their aging parents, whatever their dream is. And they can see that it's worked for other people in network marketing. But it hasn't worked for them yet. So I want to help people make money. So I am all about ... Sure, you can go spend a hundred thousand dollars a month on Facebook ads, if you've got the deep pockets. But how many people do, you know. So I'm all about starting right where the person's at, and helping them right where they're at. So if you don't have deep pockets, if you're struggling to make ends meet, and you really want to build your network marketing business, then you can start off absolutely for free on LinkedIn. You don't even have to pay for a LinkedIn subscription. And you know, I'm into this now ... Well, it'll be 11 months that I launched my first LinkedIn thing. So I started one thing that I launched in August last year. So right now, I'm going to do it right around, say the 20th or so, of August. So I'm 11 months into this, and I have not paid a dime for LinkedIn advertising. Not a dime. And I've made multiple six figures in the last 11 months. Steve Larsen: That's amazing. GloriaMacDonald: All on Linkedin. Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. Now, is there things that you got to be aware of? I know on Facebook you got to be aware of a few things with [inaudible 00:20:28] marketing, and MLM on Facebook. Is LinkedIn the same? GloriaMacDonald: No, LinkedIn is open to you just using the words network marketing, MLM. They're absolutely open to it, it's a business platform, and people are there to talk about business. And network marketing is a business. So, you know. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. And, I will say, Steven, that one of the things I see all the time, and it drives me bonkers, is ... And I even see this with people who are trainers. Network marketing trainers. And they've got training programs on LinkedIn. And what they're doing, is they're teaching people how to do Facebook on Linkedin. It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Steve Larsen: Different platform. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, it's a different platform. It's a business platform. In fact, just yesterday, I was having a conversation with somebody, and she was sending messages to connections on LinkedIn. She said, "But nobody's messaging me back." And I said, "They don't." They don't. This is not Facebook, it's not about being fake social. It's not about being, oh how's your day going today? Oh, you know, here's the color of my new toenail polish. Oh, this is what I had for lunch. No, this is business. This is not about having, you know, just mindless dribble conversations on messenger. Steve Larsen: Oh, thank you. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Stop it, guys. Stop it. And it drives me bananas when I see people putting all the motivational inspirational quotes up on LinkedIn. Now, I am all about motivation and inspiration. I'm all about it. So here's the analogy I use. If you were an accountant, and you're going in to meet a prospective client, would you go in with a binder full of motivational, inspirational quotes to show your new perspective client? No! Steve Larsen: If they were a poster store, maybe. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, but no, you're an accountant. Steve Larsen: Yeah, no. GloriaMacDonald: You're going to go in with a photo album of your family and what they did last weekend, or the picnic you had. It's like, no, guys. This is business. This is not Facebook. And I see network marketers doing it all the time. It's like, stop it. Steve Larsen: Yeah, it comes off kind of weird. I heard somebody say, you got to match the content with the context of the platform. So it's like- GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: Totally, totally different feel on LinkedIn. That's not what that's for. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, absolutely. Steve Larsen: So let's say you identify somebody. How do you approach that person on LinkedIn, without coming across like that? You said, they're not going to message you back. But how do you get their attention? GloriaMacDonald: Well, I always lead with value. It's all about leading with value, it's literally about attracting people to you, because they're really interested in what you have to offer. So I send people an invitation to connect. Very simply, you don't have many characters anyway, you're limited to 300, and you can't put links in the initial message. So I send invitations saying, "Hey, I see you're with ABC company, I'd love to connect with you. Looking forward to it, thanks, Gloria." Super simple, right. Steve Larsen: Yeah. GloriaMacDonald: Right. And then when they connect with me, I send them a message saying, "Hey, thanks for connecting," I don't remember the exact wording, but it's something like, "I've found LinkedIn to be a super powerful place to build network marketing business. And here's a link to my free guide for four steps to power prospecting on LinkedIn." Steve Larsen: Cool. So you give them some value, and you know you're talking to an MLMer, a network- GloriaMacDonald: Exactly. Steve Larsen: Wow. GloriaMacDonald: Yep. So it's all about [inaudible 00:24:26], just like you're doing, Steven. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Now so, you go, you leave them with value. And what are two steps you tell anybody. The first two things you need to go do in order to get started? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, the first thing is to set up your LinkedIn profile very, very differently than what you ever thought. So most people think of LinkedIn as really an online listing. Get rid of all that crap. Use LinkedIn ... Use your profile page as a sales and marketing machine. So I literally have sales coming in, seven days a week, while I'm sleeping. While I'm doing other things, you know. Because it's all automated. Now at the end of the day, you have to talk to people. Sure, you can do things to get people really, really qualified, which is what I highly recommend, that you keep qualifying, qualifying, qualifying. So that you're only speaking to people who have raised their hand multiple times, saying, "Yes, I'm interested, yes I'm interested, Yes I'm interested." And then, at that point, you get on the phone or zoom with them, or whatever, and talk to them about your opportunity. But it's all about using automation to pre-qualify people, so you're not wasting time talking to people who aren't open to, and interested in what you have to offer. So you really are only doing rejection-free prospecting and recruiting. So take everything off your profile page that has anything to do with where you worked, what year you worked there, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And just because the LinkedIn field might say company name, you don't have to put company name in there. I put the title of one of my [inaudible 00:26:24] in there. Steve Larsen: Oh, I love it. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I put four steps to power prospecting. Free gift. You know, that's the company name. Location, we don't care about location. We're- Steve Larsen: Internet. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, internet. It's the internet. Steve Larsen: Everywhere. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. You know? So, just because it says location, doesn't mean you have to put location in there. Put a link, put a link to where they can get the [inaudible 00:26:51] or put a link to your online calendar, or whatever it is. But give people a way to connect with you. Now, links on your profile page on Linkedin, are not live. You have to copy and paste them. You know, LinkedIn, like everything else, is trying to keep people on the platform. But that's okay. I still put, "Copy and paste this link." And yeah, so use your profile page as a sales and marketing tool. And I would also say, don't put anything on your profile page about your network marketing company. Steve Larsen: Amen, oh my gosh, amen. GloriaMacDonald: Yup, take all that stuff off there, and lead with value. So, what is it that you have to offer your target audience, free information that will help your target audience with whatever their paying points are. Steve Larsen: Wow. Okay, okay. So step one, drastically treat that profile page completely different from most likely pretty much all of us are. Not totally different though. GloriaMacDonald: [inaudible 00:28:05]. Steve Larsen: And two, what would be the second thing you'd have people go do? GloriaMacDonald: Then, be very targeted in terms of who you are inviting to connect with you. And who's invitations, when people send you an invitation to connect with them. I only accept invitations from people who are in my specific target market. I do not accept invitations from people who are not in my target market. Steve Larsen: I accept everybody. Uh-oh. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, I wouldn't do that. Steve Larsen: I don't even get on it that much. I'm totally going to get on this thing now. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, well you better, Steven. Steve Larsen: Yeah, that's awesome. GloriaMacDonald: I mean, seriously. Linkedin is an absolutely untapped gold mine for network marketers. It's an untapped gold mine. Steve Larsen: Wow. Okay, okay, profile. Step two, get real targeted on who you allow, and don't allow. And who you're going for, and don't go for. GloriaMacDonald: Yeah. Steve Larsen: And then step three, is probably go buy your course, yeah? GloriaMacDonald: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you could do that. Steve Larsen: I appreciate you being on here and sharing everything. Everyone, you said it's GloriaMacDonald.com? Go to? GloriaMacDonald: Yes. Yeah, so M-A-C for MacDonald. Gloria MacDonald dot com. Or you can find me on LinkedIn. Gloria MacDonald. And I'm in Toronto, Canada. But Gloria MacDonald. Or on Facebook, Gloria MacDonald. Steve Larsen: Oh my gosh. Well, we appreciate you taking the time. This has been absolutely amazing. And frankly, this is the kind of stuff I just feel like, no one really ... You know, this is disruptive information, everybody. I hope that you take time to sit down and actually re-listen to this, and write down the steps she just said. Because that's very powerful, and come back. You owe Gloria a huge testimonial when you made your millions, as well. GloriaMacDonald: Thanks, Steven. It was great to be here with you today. Steve Larsen: Absolutely. Thank you so much. Oh, isn't Gloria awesome? You can't learn that stuff anywhere else. Hey, kick a thank you over to Gloria, and check out Secret MLM hacks, by going to Gloria is awesome dot com. Again, that's Gloria is awesome dot com.

  For 6 months I've developed a friendship with Noah, and had deep "funnel-doctrine" conversations with him, only find out (3 weeks ago) that he's 12 years old! Very impressive individual...      Hey, what's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen and you're listening to a very special episode of Sales Funnel Radio... I've spent the last four years learning from the most brilliant marketers today. And now I've left my 9:00 to 5:00 to take the plunge and build my million dollar business. The real question is how will I do it without VC funding or debt completely from scratch? This podcast is here to give you the answer. Join me and follow along as I learn, apply, and share marketing strategies to grow my online business using only today's best internet sales funnels. My name is Steve Larsen and welcome to Sales Funnel Radio... Hey what's up, guys? I am very, very excited for today. This is ... You guys got a treat ready for you today. This is going to be a lot of fun. There's been a lot of times when I've been holding my little ones or I'm the oldest of six kids, actually, and it's pretty fascinating to see the wisdom that comes from anywhere around us... Wisdom has no age limits. Wisdom has no bounds. And I do a lot of live funnel builds and I don't know if you guys have had the chance to join me on that and actually build a sales funnel live with me. Well, there was this one occasion ... and this will help set the stage for this very special individual who's coming on with me in just a moment. But I was building this sales funnel one time and then there was one guy on there who was just really interactive with me. And was pretty much over typing, finishing my sentences.   I remember one instance went and looked up the URL of the funnel that I was building live in front of everybody ... went to that and logged in and actually opted in to that funnel as I was building it live in front of everybody. It was hilarious. It made me laugh really, really hard. I had no idea that it was a 12 year old. And until literally we met at Funnel Hacking Live. And it astounded me. When I was 12 years old, I think I was eating gummy bears and playing Halo. That's it. So it's amazing to me to see the actual wisdom, the incredible ... so advanced compared to what I was doing when I was 12 years old. So anyways, I have incredible respect for this individual. Very, very ... And we've honestly become great friends the past little bit here and it's been really fun to see his journey. But I want to, guys, welcome to the show Noah Lenz. Noah, how are you doing buddy?   Noah Lenz: I'm doing great. Awesome to be here today on Sales Funnel Radio. Steve Larsen: It's good to have you. It's very good to have you. That time when you were dancing circles around me while I was building these funnels live. I was like man, who is this guy? This is awesome. I was like whoa. That's incredible. Noah Lenz: Yeah, I listen to the show all the time. I'm at school and it's like new Sales Funnel Radio episode. I'm going to listen to this at lunch. Okay, good, good, good. I don't need to wait until I get home. And it's so awesome to actually be on the show right now. I always listen to it but to be on the show, it's just amazing. Steve Larsen: You're an inspiration. And I know that every person is going to be ... will kill me if I don't ask the question, how on earth did you get started doing this? This is not a normal thing for a 12 year old to do? It's amazing. Noah Lenz: That is literally the most common question I get asked. Steve Larsen: I'm sure. Noah Lenz: In terms of the whole entrepreneurship game, I'm not really sure what drew me to it entirely. But when I was about eight-ish, I really got into the business of making websites using WordPress and all that. ...And I eventually, my dad's like you need to start making some money off this, start doing it for some other people. My first one was actually for a political candidate in the local area. And I made a website for him and all that. And then, about a year ago I saw video from who is now my good friend and mentor, and I actually build funnels for him, Caleb Maddix. And everybody needs to read the book Dot Com Secrets. And like okay, I'll go do it. And it turns out we already had the book on our bookshelf so that night I literally ... I could not put the thing down... It's like oh my gosh. You can have a one click upsell. You don't even need to type in their credit card. Oh my gosh. And I just got so, so into it. And eventually, I'm like how can I do this? Hmm. And I had ideas going in my mind about what different funnels I could build. But I was never crazy about it for a while. And then, eventually I remembered that a while back I had done a website for this political candidate. And I'm like I really liked doing websites for political candidates. It's things that were kind of easy to deal with. It's the same type thing. I need to get serious about this... So I was thinking how could I do this? I could send out stuff in the mail. I could maybe hire somebody to code comp. And then, I remembered Dot Com Secrets. And I'm like, whoa, I can make a funnel for this. So that's how I basically got started with the funnel game and ever since I've just been obsessed with it. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. That's incredible. So you go through and you read Dot Com Secrets. That is so interesting to me that you did that. As you've been going through and building this stuff and putting all these things together, first of all, you said something that I thought was really, really interesting. You said that your dad eventually said hey, it's time to go try and make money with this. ...That's very wise for a parent to do that. What was your reaction when he said that? Noah Lenz: Well, it wasn't like full intensity but just one day I remember this vividly. My brother and my mom were at some sort of play or something. And I was at my dad's office. And he was like so you make these websites for other people. ...Are you doing it for fun? How about you think maybe you could get something going here. And I'm like oh wow. And I just was like you know, rather than sitting around all day and playing video games, I just got it going. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's awesome. And did he ... Was he able to help you on certain things? You seem like you're just full steam ahead on your own and don't really need ... No one's pushing you along to do this. Noah Lenz: Well, he gave me the resources. Steve Larsen: Sure. Noah Lenz: We always joke around about he taught me how to use cPanel wrong or something. But he gave me the resources. He gave me all the resources that I needed. And then, he taught me a little about what to do here, here, and there. But after he gave me the resources, honestly I just watched YouTube videos, read books, listened to podcasts. I just mostly learned it on my own but if it weren't for him introducing me to the resources, I wouldn't be where I am to. Steve Larsen: What's your favorite part of the entire funnel building process itself? What do you like to actually do with it? Noah Lenz: Oh, in terms of my favorite type of funnel. Steve Larsen: Yeah, type of funnel or is it the building or do you like writing the copy, the sales message? Noah Lenz: Honestly, it's the offer creation. The page building's cool. But I like the offer creation figuring out okay, we have this, what else can I give? What else can I give? What else can I give? ...To make it as awesome as possible but really all around I like just doing webinar slides. I love doing webinars. And then, I also it turns out I'm really good at high ticket funnels so I need to do some more of those. But I like the high ticket funnels but then I also like webinars and offer creation. Steve Larsen: That's amazing. So high ticket funnels and webinars. And I saw recently, you've been really active on Instagram. You've been publishing like crazy... You're probably one of my best students ever from the podcast. You're actually doing all of it which is awesome. Now when you're doing webinars, you just barely did one. What is it that you're selling now? What are you doing now? Noah Lenz: Okay, so right now I need to get more focused and one of Russell's ... Actually, the very first one he did at Funnel Hacking Live has helped a lot with that. But on the most recent webinar I did, I think I mentioned Caleb Maddix earlier, but he used to have a program called Summa Success. And he also did it with somebody called Emily Shay. And it went great. I think you actually built the funnel for that originally, the webinar, didn't you, Steve? Steve Larsen: I think so. It might not be the same one but definitely did a while ago. Noah Lenz: Yeah, on like Funnel Hacker TV or something. Steve Larsen: It was a long time ago. I don't remember honestly. Noah Lenz: Yeah, no problem. But you built so many funnels that it's just crazy. So he had all this content for Maddix book clubs, Summa Success, YouTube channel. And he was spending crazy amounts of time on it when it was really just a trip wire kind of like Funnel-U or just like a middle offer. ...And he was spending a ton of time on it. And he also had a publishing company at the time which he was spending just as much time on. And the publishing company was just far exceeding his expectations. And there were a whole bunch of problems going on with Summa. So he had to shut it down. But it was driving me nuts because I was like he has all this good content but we're just not doing anything with it. So I talked him in kind of like what you did with Secrets Mastery class to taking all his content and putting it together in chronological order and getting that all like first, in order to do this, you need to do this and this. So I got it all together in one huge membership site. Got it all mapped out on a spreadsheet, plugged it in and all that. And there's hundreds of lessons in there. But the goal is to help kids become successful and all that. And so, that's what the webinar is for right now. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. So you built ... Oh my gosh, I'm just blown away right now. You're probably the smartest kid I've ever met in my entire life, Noah. That is so, so incredible. Oh my gosh... So you went through ... You put his content in an order that's more easy to consume and actually apply and do stuff with. And then, you built a webinar to sell it. Noah Lenz: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Steve Larsen: Congratulations man. It takes the rest of us adults a while just to do that alone. That's really, really ... You should be very proud. I hope that you are, man. That's incredible. Noah Lenz: And the goal with that was we actually code named it Project Passive Income. So the goal of this, we just wanted to take all the content that he already had and then basically just put me in charge or actually selling it. So that's what we've been doing. Steve Larsen: Now what kind of roadblocks have you hit along the way as you've been doing this? Noah Lenz: I've hit a lot of them. Not huge things but one of them is at first, to be honest, I was very hesitant to actually want to use ClickFunnels. Steve Larsen: Sure. Noah Lenz: I was like that's $97 a month. Blah, blah, blah. False, belief, false belief. So I'm like ugh. But eventually, it's like you know what, I need to get this out there but I don't want to use ClickFunnels. I don't want to use WordPress. I know, I'm going to use Leadpages which I now call Loki Pages. So I sign up for Leadpages, $25 a month, four times cheaper. So I signed up Leadpages and I get in there and it was not good. I get in there to Loki Pages and I'm starting building out my thing. And I say, perfect. Now it's time to go do the checkout page. Perfect. Great. So I go in there to the checkout page and it says checkout page is not available unless you upgrade to the whatever a month plan. And it was more than ClickFunnels. And I'm like ah! But I don't want ClickFunnels. SamCart, what about SamCart? So I go run over to SamCart. $25, perfect. As much as Leadpages. Go over there. What do you mean my landing page can only have 100 characters? Come on now. Well, 100 character landing pages sell better. Okay, sure thing. I just got so tired of it and I ran over to ClickFunnels and it was the best decision of my life. And I wish I would have just saved myself that time and all that and just originally went with ClickFunnels. So that was the main one. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Noah, that's amazing. What other kind of things do you run into? You like the offer creation piece. The actual building of it obviously I'm sure. What are you doing to get traffic to your stuff right now? Noah Lenz: Traffic. That's been a major roadblock for me in terms of initial question. But I have been studying traffic like crazy lately. So I am doing a lot of Facebook ads. And what I found out is I'm not very good with the actual conversion type, traffic type. We need a 2.5 frequency with a $17 ad cap or whatever. I don't understand all that. But I'm fairly good with the copy and just the actual ad type. So right now I'm figuring out how we can take Facebook ads to the next level and all of that. But I've just been running my own but I'm looking to hire an ads manager where I deal with the creative piece. They deal with all that. And then, I've also been for Summa Success, I've been working on Dream 100 strategy for other big players in this spot, in this space. And that's what I've been doing a lot of. Getting cool gift packages together. And then, also you can never underestimate the power of events. You can get a ton of traffic into your funnels just from going to events. So that's what I've been doing a lot of too. And I've also ... I used to do a lot more Google Ads. I'm not a huge fan of Google Ads but that's mainly where I've been getting my traffic. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. I'm going ads. Facebook, I'm not honestly ... I don't want to learn how to do that stuff. I can write the copy, the hook part, all that stuff. I love that part. Noah Lenz: Same here. Steve Larsen: But the mechanics of it, it's like oh. I'd rather do Dream 100 stuff, things like that. Noah Lenz: Exactly. Steve Larsen: Now what are you doing for traffic as far as going to events? That was kind of interesting. Noah Lenz: So whenever I went to Funnel Hacking Live, I had this funnel built out. And it was a funnel and it was basically like a home page funnel if you guys have ever heard of that. But it was only for Epic Shell attendees. And so I had something on there and it's like, do you want this exact funnel for yourself? You can get it for only $47 or whatever. And so, it was also just a great list grower. And a lot of it too is just networking and then you can get connections there and then later on, you can go back to those people you know keep providing value, helping them with everything. And then later on, you can say hey, I have this real special offer I think would be great for you. And then, also I went to one of Caleb's entrepreneurial retreats a while back and there's a couple people there that are on a waiting list right now wanting me to build their funnels around. So that's what a lot of it has been. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Thanks for sharing that. You know I wanted to ... I mean, it's no doubt that you're going to be successful in this. I'm sure you already are which is awesome. As far as looking back to again what got you where you are, what are the books or the courses of the educational things that really helped you get where you are? You know what I mean? If you were to sit down, this is something I'm thinking of right now. Wow, I wish ... My little girl is four years old and I hope so much that in four more years I can get her going on these kinds of things too. You know what I mean? What kinds of things do you think I should indoctrinate her with, I mean, teach her, that would help? You know what I mean? As a parent, what are the things you look back and like thanks dad, that helped me a lot. Noah Lenz: Really, it would really rather than waiting, just actually doing something and just going forward with it. And then, Expert Secrets, obviously. I've read that book I don't know how many times now. Dot Com Secrets. And then, also the Funnel-U Gift Package. That's an amazing, just an awesome package that has a lot of stuff. And then, of course, we also have the Funnel Hacks membership. And just that alone has so much content in there that you can easily be successful with it. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's awesome. And where do you go to keep learning the information as well without getting overwhelmed? How do you choose what to learn and what not to learn? Noah Lenz: Okay, so more or less, I listen basically ... I listen to you, Dave Woodward, and Uncle Russell, as I like to call him. Steve Larsen: Uncle Russell, nice. Noah Lenz: Caleb calls him Uncle Russell all the time. And somebody the other day was like no wonder you're so successful, your uncle is Russell Brunson. Anyways, so I basically I study a few other players in the business game but I mainly just study you three. And I just study everything you have out there. Russell, some days I constantly reload my Instagram like every five minutes just to see if he's posted a new story. I have a zap set up so that whenever he posts a new YouTube video I get a text. So I like crazy study his stuff. And Funnel-U obviously, whenever the new edition comes in the mail I rip the package open, read it right away. And then, I'm also just always go back and study his old stuff. I got the little marketing in your car MP3 drive and I'm listening to all 257 episodes like crazy. Just going through trying to take away little nuggets. Rather than getting overwhelmed with a whole bunch of gurus, I just study deeply with a couple of them. Steve Larsen: I think that's really key. I think that's really smart. And I'm noticing more and more, just drinking really deeply from the two or three you love and broadly from the rest. I absolutely love that. What do you think is driving you to do this? You know what I mean? Noah Lenz: I think it's more or less the impact because especially with Summa Success, that's what helped me. And I know that if other kids can get that, it's just amazing. But just also at the end of the day, I just love marketing too. Marketing is my favorite thing on planet earth other than my family and God and all that. But marketing, I love it. Steve Larsen: That's so cool. Noah Lenz: I'm so obsessed with it. So that's a lot of it. Steve Larsen: That's so cool. I will never bash public education or anything like that but more and more and more, it's no longer enough to actually make a real difference in the long run for how to actually make money. So I think it's really amazing that you've dove into it this early. And honestly, with Summa Success and you basically are bringing in your own students. Other kids, students that you're teaching. You're helping them be successful as well. That's awesome. I'm sure that's fast tracking what you're doing as well. Now what advice would you give for somebody who just, I don't know, they just feel kind of stuck. They see what could happen but they're like oh, I don't even know where to start on this. Noah Lenz: Well, what I would do is I wouldn't try and be perfect at first. I would just get your ClickFunnels account. Don't try Leadpages. Don't try SamCart. Get your ClickFunnels account and go sign up and literally make a webinar funnel. Or just read Expert Secrets, Read Dot Com Secrets, and Brenda and Calen, what they did was they would watch a video for like 30 seconds. Stop it. Go do it. And you should do the same thing. Read Expert Secrets. Do a webinar. Okay, let me ... I'll sign up for Funnel Scripts here. Enter my stuff in. Oh perfect, got a webinar. Let's run some traffic to it. Boom. So I think other than just being obsessed with it, of course, I'm a huge Russell fan. I study him like crazy. But don't wait six months to study and then execute. Just execute and then keep studying along the way. Steve Larsen: That's incredible. That's incredible. Well hey, what's coming up for you next? What's the next thing that you want to go do? Noah Lenz: A few months actually ago, my teacher has this thing called self-paced math, my math teacher. And I'm like that's cool, whatever. And I really liked it actually. I liked it better than the normal math. But she was using this Google site and all that and so I was like this needs to be a ClickFunnels membership site. So I went in and I spent like a week building it out in ClickFunnels and then, I came in and I showed it to her. And I showed her that and it's funny because she was like ... There was another teacher there and she was saying wow, that's awesome. And then, she somehow, I don't know. I messed up. Got caught off guard. She asked me about my ClickFunnels stuff and whatnot so I must have said something about that, I don't know. But anyways, so then she's like ... What's funny though is there was this science teacher there also in the room and he's like awesome soft skills. And then, we had a science presentation and he didn't want me to use the perfect webinar. Steve Larsen: Are you serious? Noah Lenz: Well, that's how I convinced her to use this math program. Steve Larsen: You're putting your school presentations into perfect webinar format? Noah Lenz: More or less. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Do you trial close all the way to get an A? Noah Lenz: Exactly what I was going to say. Does that make sense? Steve Larsen: Does that make sense? It does, yeah. Oh man. Noah Lenz: I'm glad you think that. Do you do that in your webinar? Steve Larsen: Noah, that's incredible. So somehow your teachers are finding out about what you're doing behind the scenes. Noah Lenz: Yeah, exactly. But what I'm excited about is that ... he's like I need to do this. And I'm like you know what? You can do this as long as we can partner on selling this to other schools and then I'll just give you a certain percent of the sales. And she's like okay. Sounds good. So what I'm excited about is this summer, she's going to be refilming all the videos and all that, making it even better. And then we're going to do it kind of like Summa Success where we make it entertaining for the kids and throw in funny memes and stuff. But anyways, so we're going to do that this summer and then, I think we're going to do a webinar to sell it. So that's what I'm excited about too just getting that out there and making math more interesting, at least it was for me. Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. So you're literally partnering with teachers and showing them. That's incredible. You know that, Noah. I mean, that's amazing. I've just got to stop and acknowledge that real quick. Noah Lenz: Thank you. Steve Larsen: That's amazing. I mean, I was doing that in college. I had never thought of doing it ... I was that kid that was trying to not get in trouble in high school for selling just random knick knacks. Noah Lenz: Oh yeah, like the pen. Steve Larsen: Yeah. That's right. I forget you know all my stuff as well. Yeah, yeah. That is so cool to me that you're doing that. Just congrats to you for moving forward on those things. What is it that you ... How should I ask this? What is it that you, I guess, as far as this impact. You're developing this talent. You're developing this skill. You're developing the ability to sell face to face, sell ideas. So right now you're going to go off and partner with the teachers and stuff. What about 10 years from now? You know what I mean? It's that question that I always got tired of all the adults asking me. What do you want to be when you grow up? But I'm going to go ahead and ask you. What do you want to be when you grow up? Noah Lenz: Really, at the end of the day, I just want to be doing this same thing that I'm doing right now. I mean, I'm working on writing my first book right now. So I'm hoping that I can have multiple ... I just want to keep marketing, just helping as many people as possible. Maybe having some kind of funnel building agency or other business owners. But really, more than anything just keep marketing, keep doing what I'm more or less doing now, just trying to help as many people as possible. Steve Larsen: Now I just want to ask one final question here because it seems to be something that you've mastered which is just fantastic. When you have something that is... Okay, let's say that you're like oh man, I don't know what a funnel is? Or I don't know what this is? I don't know what that is? When you encounter something that is new that you need to learn, what is your process for learning something quickly so that you can actually use it? Because you seem to be very good at that? Noah Lenz: Really, I don't know. I've just gotten so used to it. I guess I go to youtube.com and I search into the search box how to do it. It's not that simple but more or less, actually it is... Steve Larsen: Yeah, isn't that interesting. Noah Lenz: But I will look it up and sometimes I might get a book on it. I might subscribe to a podcast and listen to a few episodes on it. And then, if it's something that I'm really interested in, I'll immerse myself in it. But if it's just more or less a simple skill, I'll learn it quickly and then implement on it. What's funny is the other day, I had a webinar and I realized that there was no chat box because we weren't doing it for GoToWebinar or anything. We were just doing it through YouTube Live with an iFrame on the ClickFunnel page. Steve Larsen: Sure. Noah Lenz: So I realized that there was no chat box and it was like 20 minutes before the webinar. And what's funny is in school they probably would have spent two hours saying you know, here's how to configure the chat box and make it look all pretty. Make sure the welcome message says welcome to this webinar. Make the title is blah, blah, blah. But really, I just wanted to get it going because the webinar was so soon. So I more or less just googled chat box or something. Or I think I might have logged into a membership site or something wherever there was a chat box resource. And I real quick just signed up for it and did it. So I think more than anything it's just taking action and then, the one thing you should immerse yourself in, if it's anything, is offer creation and then just file building. All the other things that supplement that. Those I like to spend time on but not as much as that. So when I need to learn those more than anything, I just hop on over to YouTube or Google and look up how to do it... Steve Larsen: That's incredible. Noah, thank you so much for taking the time to do this and teach the rest of us and share your journey. I mean, it's really, really fascinating to see everything that you're doing here. And the speed, I think that's something that's really just blown me away. Very, very fascinating. Where can people learn more about you and connect with you? Noah Lenz: So right before this call, I made a real cool link that you guys can actually go to and get this special marketing guide that I normally sell for anywhere from $7-$97. And it just has some checklists and things like that that you need to make sure you have in place before you launch your funnel. Because I remember when I was learning my very first funnel and then I realized that half the things were wrong, out of order, didn't have everything that you needed on the checklist. And I don't want you guys to have to go through that. So I decided that since you guys are listening to this really awesome podcast, I will give you guys this entirely free. All you need to do is go to noahlenz ... That's noahlenz.com/steve. And you will be able to get this marketing guide 100% free. No trip wire, no nothing. 100% free. Just because I want to give value to everybody here on the podcast. Steve Larsen: That's very nice of you, Noah. So it's noahlenz ... L-E-N-Z as in zebra ... .com/steve. Awesome man. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Thanks for taking the time. This has meant quite a lot. Noah Lenz: Yeah, thank you for having me on today. Steve Larsen: Hey, thanks for listening. The most common question I get is Steve, will you look at my funnel? Of course. Whether you want me to coach you, give some hand holding and guidance during your funnel build, or simply review the one you have, head over to coachmesteve.com and book your session now.

Ever wonder how the top guys actually make fortunes in MLM? Join us now to hear secrets of the "big guys"... Steve Larsen: What's going on everyone? This is Steve Larsen and you're listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Now this is part six of six. This is the last segment of this whole series. We're gonna talk about MLM funnels. MLM funnels, this is gonna be a little bit of a different sub interview than the other five so far, and the reason being is because in the other five, I have always been interviewing an actual funnel builder, right? Somebody who put the funnel together for their business, their industry, whatever it was. This is a little bit of a different scenario, I have an opportunity to interview an amazing gentleman who has built MLM the traditional way, but without bothering the family members and friends... You guys know that's my whole thing and so, we're gonna learn how he did that without using heavy tech like I use. Does that make sense? So it's kind of a rare look at this. He's done both seven figures personally, both in his MLM, but also in traditional business. Anyway, he's a very, very rare take on MLM and what it takes to be successful with it. Then what I'm gonna do is I'm actually gonna show you guys, or rather talk about and teach, why I have an MLM funnel myself and what it does and what it's done for me, and the whole psychology behind it because it's amazing. I've never seen anybody else do it. There's one other guy who kind of came close, but even then, it actually won't do the full thing that this does. Anyway, I'm excited for this interview. Even if you're not an MLM, I think you'll enjoy the tactics that he uses and how he manages his own business, 'cause I think if we were all to manage his MLM business the way we manage our personal ones, our actual lives would get mentally quieter. There wouldn't be so much noise in our head. Anyway, let's get into the interview... Announcer: Welcome to Sales Funnel Radio where you'll learn marketing strategies to grow your online business using today's best internet sales funnels. And now, here's your host, Steve Larsen. Steve Larsen: Alright you guys, I am super excited that you're here listening with me today. We have a very unique opportunity to hear from, honestly, one of the most brilliant people I've ever met. I actually only met him only a month or two ago, but right off the bat I could tell something was different. I have on the call with me Mr. Jon Penkert, who alone inside of the MLM industry, he's one of the top income earners. He's one of those rare guys that has done both seven figures in regular business, but also seven figures in the network marketing business. One of the things he's taught me is that most people only recruit two and half, two to three people into their MLM business ever. And to say that he's done, which is true, over $500 million in his own downline is absolutely amazing. Anyway, I'm excited to have Mr. Jon Penkert here with me. How are you doing man? Jon Penkert: Hey! Good morning Steve and thanks for having me on the call. It's a privilege to be speaking with you. Steve Larsen: I'm really excited that you're here. This is a very unique take. Most of the time when you hear the word MLM, I'm sure you were the exact same, you tend to run the other way. Most people do anyway, and I know that you've figured out though the way that this whole thing works. But before we jump into that, I actually wanted to ask, how did you get into MLM? Jon Penkert: Well, I was an entrepreneur out of college and moved to southern California. I wanted to take advantage of the business opportunities there and leverage my skills and my degree. When I arrived in California, you know it's kind of the mecca for network marketing, I never really heard of MLM. So, a friend of mine invited me to a meeting and I was very skeptical... It just seemed too good to be true. I couldn't believe all the money they were making. I was like, "Man, I gotta check this out." And it's funny, you say that people run from MLM. What happened is, I started getting involved in network marketing and then people started running from me. Steve Larsen: Exactly! Jon Penkert: I learned very quickly that this MLM business, it's rife with problems. You end up losing a lot of your friends in the beginning 'cause you don't understand what's required to be successful, you don't understand that the key ingredients to network marketing that makes successful champions are no different than any other facet of life. Whether it's business or music or sports, there's a formula to success. Once you figure that out, and you embrace the formula, then guess what? You begin to have this success that you long for... Steve Larsen: Now, did you know what that formula was when you first started? Jon Penkert: No. As a matter of fact, I have about 10 years of pain, which means failure. I learned that success is built on the back of failure. I used to tell people, "I'm the biggest loser in network marketing," because I tried everything and did it wrong. So, I got about 10 years of pain before I figured out, "You know what? There's gotta be a smarter way to do this." Steve Larsen: That's amazing. So, when you first joined though, what happened? What was all that failure? Most people don't talk about the failure parts, but I think we can all relate to it. Jon Penkert: Well, I don't fail small. I failed big. Back in the 80's people in California were making $30,000 a month in network marketing and there was a company called FundAmerica. You can research it... It actually is the case that all the case law studies. It changed the industry, because back then, you paid a lot of money for your membership fees. It was high membership fee to get involved in these clubs, these MLM clubs. The federal government shut them down for illegal Ponzi scheme, and so the big boys like Herbalife and Amway, they all went to school on that and they changed how they come to market. So all the case law for network marketing was really centered around that FundAmerica. You can do the research on the lawsuit. They came out on the other side nine months later innocent and not being convicted of a Ponzi scheme 'cause it wasn't, but it ruined the business opportunity and all the downline had dissipated. All of us that got involved and began to build saw the rug literally pulled out from under us in what we thought was the biggest opportunity of our life and we were all gonna become millionaires. The truth is, you realize if you don't have experienced leaders that have set a foundation to do it right, you're gonna get taken out and there's a lot of examples of that today but the case law began with that FundAmerica opportunity that I was knee deep in and got the rug pulled out from under me. Steve Larsen: So you came in while that was all going on then? Jon Penkert: Yeah, actually I had the misfortune of coming in at the end. I got all my guys in and we started running right as they closed the doors. Steve Larsen: Oh man! Oh my gosh. Jon Penkert: Yeah. Steve Larsen: Did you pick up and go obviously to somewhere else then I'm sure? Jon Penkert: Yeah. Then I got into a couple other companies. I tried the travel industry, it's big in network marketing, and I tried supplements. That's also big in network marketing. The number one product in network marketing is weight loss. We live in a culture that suffers from obesity and everybody wants the quick fix. There's a formula to losing weight, but everybody wants to take a pill so often times in network marketing, companies begin with weight loss. It's very common. The problem with weight loss, for those of you that are in weight loss know that 90 to 120 days into the journey people do one of two things. They lose the weight and get off your product, or they don't lose the weight and they blame your product. You lose your residual income often times in weight loss 'cause people don't stay loyal to the product. Weight loss is a tough way to create residual income. Steve Larsen: Interesting. That is fascinating. So did you deliberately steer away from that? You're asking questions that most people who are brand new in MLM never ask. You know? An awareness of the economy and the market and what's selling and what isn't, it's through the roof. It probably wasn't like that at the beginning though I'm sure, was it? Jon Penkert: Well, it's not. When you look at an opportunity, most people get involved in an opportunity because it's based on hype, right? My really good friend found this product they love and now I love it. We're gonna get rich together, and we're gonna do network marketing. Those are not good reasons to join a network marketing company. Unfortunately, that's how most people get involved in network marketing and then when they don't make the money, then they're like, "Oh, what happened?" There's five pillars of things that are important in network marketing. For those of your listeners that want to do the ... I was like, "Where do I find out about how to be successful?" Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: Harvard Business Review actually has a study on MLMs and what it takes to be successful. Go read it. Google it and find out here's the key ingredients that you need to be successful in network marketing. It's out there. It's not a secret. Steve Larsen: That's fascinating. So you go into, was it FundAmerica? And they kind of go under and go through all that big stuff, and then you transfer to another MLM. Now, were you successful you'd say in that one, or were you still learning what it took to be successful with it? Jon Penkert: Yeah. Well, I'm a type A driver and I'm very success oriented. I'm a guy that I'm gonna just try to make it work. I've done a lot of network marketing opportunities, but where I had the light bulb moment, the aha moment, was when one of my friends said ... I said, "Hey, get involved in this one and we're making a lot of money and we're driving the new cars and we're doing all this stuff." And he looked at me and he said, "Jon, you always get the car but none of the rest of us do." That was where I went, "Wait a minute." Steve Larsen: Powerful. Jon Penkert: It's not about how much money I can make or what I can do, I want to find an opportunity where I can mentor people and help them drive the new car. So that was a paradigm shift in my thought process. I said, "You know what? I have to look for something ..." There's a word that is abused in network marketing it's called duplication. I got news for you guys, everything duplicates. Success duplicates and so does failure. If you're using your influence to build your network marketing business, it's not duplicatable and ultimately will fail because your people don't have your influence. But, if you have a system that people can follow to make money, the system will duplicate and then you have an opportunity in network marketing to create a sustainable residual income. The system has to duplicate, you can't just use your influence and that's when the light bulb went off for me. I said, "You know what? It's not good enough for me to be able to do it, I have to enroll people on the journey and will help them actually accomplish their goals." Steve Larsen: That's huge. So from that point on, you went forward and just noticed that it's got to be a system that's duplicatable, rather than you being duplicatable. System wise, what did you go create? What was it that you knew that you had to go do? Jon Penkert: Well, the first thing that I do when I look at a network marketing company, is I say, "Look, I need 90 days to see if the system duplicates." Because once you begin ... most people make the mistake of measuring their success on their signup bonuses, right? "Hey, I went out and got a few people to sign up and they got some people to sign up, and in the first 30 days I made $3,000." That's not a duplicatable system, that's a sales job. The money you make on the front end isn't as important as if I sign you up Steve, and how much money do I make on you four months from now when you're on auto ship? That's the key. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: Because if I want a residual income, it's not your sign up bonuses, but it's your monthly auto ship that creates an income for me. Now, if I have a product that doesn't have a monthly auto ship component, you can't create residual income. It's gotta be something that you need or want every month, right? Most people will buy something for a couple of months, but is it sustainable? What does that mean? Well, is it something that, as a consumer, six months from now you're still gonna buy? Because if you're not gonna buy it then I don't have a residual income stream, so I always measure the opportunity not how much money do I make up front, but what kind of residual incomes am I making on an auto ship function three, four, five months out? Then I look at the percentages of growth. If my growth percentage is there, then I've got something. Not the paycheck. If you look at your paycheck in the first two or three months of any opportunity, and measure the long term viability, you're making a mistake. Steve Larsen: Fascinating. Okay, so 90 to prove the system, gotta have the monthly auto ship as a component to the MLM you choose, what other components should people look for when they are choosing one? Jon Penkert: There's a saying in business, remember I'm a ... one of the things that made me successful in network marketing is realizing that my entrepreneurship business skills, in traditional business, they don't translate well to network marketing. When you try to bring your skill set from a traditional business model into network marketing, it doesn't work. It doesn't translate. Steve Larsen: Like what? What do you mean? Jon Penkert: Well, entrepreneurship requires a skill set where you have an ability to take risks and make very quick decisions and cut your losers fast and leverage a skill set more than a system. You try to bring your skills into network marketing it doesn't work because why? [caption id="attachment_1194" align="alignleft" width="430"] Business Colleagues Together Teamwork Working Office[/caption] You're managing a volunteer army, nobody works for you. It's like a sports team, right? Everyone's part of the team and we want to win together, but since no one works for me, I can't hold them accountable. I have to motivate them, which is why network marketing often times leverages self help. Become a better version of yourself, work on yourself. Steve Larsen: Fascinating. Jon Penkert: Because the stronger self you have, the more people you're gonna lead. Steve Larsen: Fascinating. It is all about the motivation then for that. I didn't realize ... I mean, I knew that MLMs kind of like bus op wrapped around ... with the personal development wrapped around it, but that's a fascinating way to describe that though. I've never thought of it that way. Jon Penkert: You said what's important? What do I look for? Sports parallels business that parallels network marketing, and what am I talking about? Leadership is the number one thing that has the biggest impact on your success. Why is that? Because the rate of the pack is determined by the speed of the leader and it doesn't matter if you look at successful sports teams or businesses or network marketing, you gotta have good leadership. That's one of the things that I leverage going into an opportunity is are the leaders experienced? Are they just a bunch of guys that found a product and have never run a network marketing company? Or are their leaders proficient at the global business model? Because, listen you guys, today network marketing is the business model of the 21st century. There is no greater. What you are going to get paid to do is monetize networks that you build globally, not networks locally in a local market, but your ability to sell products and services globally in a global market place. Which means what? Language conversion, currency conversion. You monetize global networks, you want to be with a leader who's done that before. Somebody who's opened up other countries. Someone who understands logistically how to deliver products into those countries because you can have the greatest product in the world but if you don't have a leadership team that can deliver, you're gonna end up with a lot of unhappy customers. Steve Larsen: What are you doing to train people below you to become leaders? Like you said, that really does seem where all that duplication is even possible. Jon Penkert: I have my own philosophy on leadership. In the leadership circles, I've studied leadership and there's a great argument in leadership, and it's are leaders created or are they born? Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: They go back and forth on that question. The truth is it's neither. Leaders aren't born. You're not a born leader and you can't just choose someone and create a leader. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: I like to look at leadership one of two ways. You're either a cheerleader, which sits at the back of the room and encourages everybody to be the best they can be and go out there and charge and go do it. Then there's the servant leader that says, "You know what? I'm going first. I'm gonna go and go across the river and swim across and make sure it's not dangerous and make sure it's attainable. And then I'm gonna encourage my people to follow me." Leaders are neither born nor created, leaders are chosen... The masses will choose to follow you if you're cutting the path and doing the right things and having the success. Success attracts success. So as a leader moves forward quickly, there creates a vacuum that people will follow. So my definition of a leader, first and foremost, is the visionary who's following the path and setting the right example and the people will follow. Steve Larsen: That is definitely the best definition of leadership I've ever heard. Okay, a cheerleader or a servant leader and you're chosen by others based on you cutting the path and being an example. Wow, that's amazing! So you go out and you're teaching others to do that obviously, because you've chosen an MLM with the monthly auto ship and you have to develop new skills, you now have the potential for actual residual income. What are you doing to actually find people? It was fascinating, you told me when I first met you ... what do you say? The average person recruits only like 2.3 people in their life ever? Jon Penkert: Well the industry standard, and look, these are standards. Jim Rohn is a great leader and champion of network marketing. You can't beat the system and the system says the average person is gonna recruit 2.5 people in their career. So what network marketing companies try to do is they try to attract the superstar recruiters that are gonna recruit 200 people, but just do the math. Eventually, if you have a system that requires the average person to recruit more than 2.5 people for instance, well you're gonna set them up to fail. You can't beat, basically, the laws in network marketing. Steve Larsen: Interesting. Okay, so one of the other pieces you've taught just floored me. I mean, I just was blown away by this strategy. Before I did any marketing, I actually was going into CIT. I was gonna be a programmer, and I was learning about these things called binaries but you dropped that word and it meant something totally different for MLM world. Do you mind describing what it is that you were sharing with me? Jon Penkert: Well let's take a step back. The one thing that's consistent in life is change. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: Change is always gonna happen. If you'd have come to me 10 years ago and said, "Jon, I got an MLM and it's a binary. Will you join?" I don't want to join that because an old school definition of a binary, the way they set them up really hurt people. The fairest comp plan was the uni-level. There's matrix and there's different comp plan styles and different hybrids, but all of the legacy companies ran a uni-level platform. The truth is, in a uni-level, you've gotta bring your 20 friends into a room, get them signed up, push them out, say, "Go get your own 20 friends. That's how I make residual income, but you gotta go to work and get a job." Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: That really catered to the type A drivers who could recruit, but it doesn't help the average person. Why? Because the average person is only gonna bring in a couple of people and now you need a front line of 20. So it begins to unravel. Now I say that, I made a lot of money in uni-levels, but today, the hybrid binary's serve the masses the very best. Now why do I say that? Because if you have a system where the average person is gonna get 2.5 people recruited and you have a three-legged system, four-legged system, five-legged system to be successful, you're setting yourself up to fail. But if you have a binary system, which is a two-legged system, and you're building a team and 100% of the people as the recruiter that you bring in, either go onto your left team or your right team, that means each person benefits from not only your ability to recruit, but I've set them up to succeed because their 2.5 people does what? It qualifies them. One left, one right and now they have at least a half a person overflow into their downline, so now every person's adding to this success of the system and the system supports the 2.5 people they're gonna get. If that makes sense. I know sometimes when you talk about numbers, people get a little foggy but that's the reason the binaries today are the best leverage point to create residual income. Steve Larsen: So for example then, just so everyone understands on who's listening as well, my first month of MLM was a classic example of ultimate failure. I did a great job of recruiting people. I literally went down Main Street and I recruited 13 people in that first month, but I spread them so wide. You know? They were out all over the place, and you're saying that's not what I should do, right? Jon Penkert: Yeah, let's look at it. I like analogies in life. If you take a very large room and you have all of these light bulbs that are lighting the room, the light source defuses the light and it lights the room. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: But that's not maximizing the energy. Laser beams maximize the energy. If you took all the light and you focus it into a small beam you can cut steel with it. When I'm running a team, as a leader, I want to maximize their efficiency. I don't want them focused on 10 legs on their front line, I want them to run this business with maximum leverage. Two-legged systems does what? It focuses their time and energy in basically two streams, so you're not defusing your energy. You're focusing energy and your teams can run faster. Steve Larsen: Just in case people don't understand also the lingo or jargon, you're saying only two-legged meaning I'm only gonna put two people directly below me, right? And then try and do that for the people below them also, right? Jon Penkert: Yeah. In a binary system, I sign you up Steven and you go get two people. One left, one right. They get two people. One left, one right. Now, when you get the third person in the business, it has to go under Team A or Team B. Now, what's happened is those people that have joined you in the business opportunity, they take advantage of their upline, your ability to recruit, to help them build their residual income. That's powerful... That's what J. Paul Getty said when he said, "Look, I'd rather have 1% of a hundred people's energy, than a 100% of my own." Right! I want to join a team of leaders that are recruiting because I'm gonna bring my two people, and my people are gonna bring their two people. Then, the overflow, you have an opportunity now to gain the advantage of your upline's recruiting ability. If that makes sense. Steve Larsen: Yeah, it really does actually. That's fascinating. Now, when you were saying that all binaries are not created equally as well, I guess compared to what you just said right there, could you show what a bad binary would look like? Jon Penkert: Well, I hesitate to step into that because there's a lot of people that make extraordinary incomes in uni-levels, and extraordinary incomes at what I would consider a bad binary. There's good binaries and there's, let's say, better binaries. Right? I look for best in class and there's a series of things that are qualifiers that will tell me, "Is this a good deal or isn't it." Honestly, I'm gonna step aside for a second you guys. Look, you don't do this business by yourself. When I lead people, I tell them, "Look, you're a sum total of the five people that most influence you. Who are the five people that surround you?" My life is no different. I've got very good leaders around me that I consult with. When we look at a comp plan, I don't look at it by myself. I get my business partners to pick it apart as well 'cause I'll only see a certain deficiency, but I've got guys that break it down. They go, "Look, here's why it'll succeed and here's why it won't." I don't just rely on my own ability to analyze. I've got strong partners around me and each of you should do that. Your upline, your upline's leadership, and the downline, the people that you're attracting into your business. You have to surround yourself with strong people. That's a business acumen issue, that's not just MLM. It's good business. Steve Larsen: You've completely opened my eyes to more of these. The way you run the business is fascinating. Even the fact that you said, that I have a business card. Why don't you have your own business card to hand out to everyone? You don't run it really cool man. It's so awesome. Jon Penkert: I don't have a business card because I want my people to trust me. As a leader, if you lose trust, you lose everything. So when I go in and speak, I'll speak in front of rooms of 20 people and 2,000 people, but what happens is people come up to me and they say, "Hey, Jon. I want to join your team. I want to be apart of your deal. Or do you have a business card so I can contact you?" I'm not there to recruit my people's people. The only way you get ahold of me is really through one of my leaders. So I don't have a business card because I'm not looking to recruit anybody. The other thing is what I've learned in the business as well is, even if I come across a cold prospect on an airplane if I give them my business card, I have a 100% chance of them never calling me. They just don't follow up. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Jon Penkert: But if i say, "You know what? I don't have a card but let me get your number and I'll follow up with you." Now I've taken control of the relationship. It's amazing how I always have a chance to follow up with them if I don't give them a business card. It's part of a business progress, but it's also part of my leadership where I don't want people thinking I'm gonna cross-recruit their people. I work for them, and when I'm in one of their business meetings, then you can always contact me through them. If they want to give out my phone number, they can. That brings up another subject that you ... I'm gonna keep rambling here. Steve Larsen: Nah, I love it. Jon Penkert: What happens is, as you build these teams ... I've only recruited, best effort, between 30 and 40 people in any network marketing company I've ever been in because once you start building a team, I start working for my downline. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: So when I go into your home, I meet your 20 people, guess what? There's two or three of them that want me to help them build their business and I meet their 20 people. The masses that I've created, I've done one person at a time partnering with them and building their business. So I don't have to recruit a lot of people personally. All I have to do is be a leader and work with my downline and the masses will come if you do that. Steve Larsen: Yeah, it's great. It's absolutely great. And so, if you go out and you have that servant leader attitude, obviously that we've been talking about, and ... Anyway, I'm taking huge notes right now, just so you know. I'm drawing circles around all the key pieces and putting it together because this is really awesome. I hope all you guys listening are doing that too. I do that for every one of the people I interview. This is really, really interesting. So, if I'm brand new in MLM, brand spanking new or say I just joined a new one or whatever, what are the first key pieces you'd have me do as a new person into an MLM? Let's say it's in the chosen one you like where there's a binary with it, there's auto ship, all the pieces are play. What would my roles be? Jon Penkert: Well, I would seek, as fast as I can, who's in my upline and who the leaders are because the upline leaders are waiting for their phone to ring with their downline because they want to work with them and they want to help build the business. You might as well leverage their experience because I guarantee you're two friends that you bring in, they don't know anything more about the company than you do. Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: The closer you can get to your upline leadership, the better that it is. I tell you what, here's what I wish I would have done and for all you guys that are new to the business, I wish when I was out of college I would have gone and looked in ... You know, the DSA today, there's about 20 to 22 legacy companies that do over a billion dollars. We're in an industry that does $130 billion globally. There's about 20 companies that actually do over a billion. I wish that I would have found a product that I really liked and believed in, and then joined the legacy company for a couple reasons. Because then I would have learned the successful tactics and strategies of a network marketing company and I would've got connected to leaders in the industry because if you think that five years from now, somebody's not gonna come out with the latest and greatest something and turn it into a network marketing company, you're wrong. The relationships that you build will sustain you throughout your career. So, I wish I would have just gotten involved in really good companies and learned some principles and met amazing leaders because that's what network marketing's about. It's about connecting great leaders. Any of your listeners, go find a good company and get involved with them, not because you're ... I hope that you spend the next 20 years with them, but you probably won't because the truth is, when you're looking for a good network marketing opportunity, the one thing that I cannot teach or coach you is something called timing. Well, the time to get in those companies, honestly, was 20 years ago when they started. Right? Now you're not gonna create ... it would be a rare person, somebody probably will to prove me wrong but, the average person isn't probably gonna get in there and create an extraordinary six figure income because they've had their run. I want to look for a company that's been around for a couple years, they've got their ground work underneath them, they're doing 40 to 50 million a year, and they haven't hit momentum. The key is pre-momentum, and you'll get that in the Harvard Business Study Review, when you read it. You want a company pre-momentum, so that you're the one that is building the legacy and the income. When they do a billion dollars, you've helped them grow from 50 million to a billion. That's what you look for, is timing. That's the one thing that you can't teach or coach, is to be in the right place at the right time. Steve Larsen: That's interesting. Do you have any tips for how you find a company that's pre-momentum? Jon Penkert: Very difficult. You gotta keep your ears open and be connected to a lot of people, which is why I said ... you know, if I was ... a great opportunity for even college kids. I think every college kid, the skills that you learn in network marketing will carry you through the rest of your life. Go out and find a good company that you believe in the product and get involved and learn how to create these residual incomes because it's those people that you need that are gonna introduce you to the next big run. Steve Larsen: Yeah, and I appreciate that that's what the advice you said, if I was brand new. First, know the leaders, know your upline. I never took the time to do that my first round at it. I joined one, seriously, just 'cause my buddy was in it. I mean it was the exact opposite of what you just said I should do when I did that four years ago. Pretty much every entrepreneur I know is out there, whether or not they'll admit it, has been part of an MLM. It's such an awesome career. It's a great place to go to. The reason, obviously, why a lot of people have a bad taste in their mouth is because some over eager upline person turned around and badgered their family and badgered their friends and, honestly, hurt some relationships. How do actually recruit? How do you get to getting leads in this industry without actually hurting those relationships? You know what I'm trying to ask? That was poorly worded. Jon Penkert: What happens often times, people get in these network marketing opportunities, they look at it as a "get rich quick" scheme. Right? Like, how can I make money off of you and your friends? Steve Larsen: Right. Jon Penkert: Then they get disappointed because that mindset fails them. It's really not the servant leader model, and so, when I talk to people who have been hurt been network marketing and we've all been in a network marketing company that didn't work out for lots of reasons. Steve Larsen: Sure. Jon Penkert: But I always tell them ... Zig Ziglar I think said it best. He said, "Create enough opportunity for people and give them what they want, you'll end up getting what you want." And so, what I've learned in network marketing, especially if I've dealt with similar experience, I'll say, "What are the things that your upline didn't do for you?" I teach them to be the upline that they wish they had. People resonate with that. They realize, "If I do the things for my downline that I wish my upline had done for me, I'll create extraordinary success." And again, that's that leadership model of leading by example and not being a cheerleader. I'm gonna get in there and do the hard work with them because together we can do great things. That's really what I try to get people to focus on. When they have bad experiences in network marketing is, "Hey, let's you and I be the leadership team for your downline, that you wish you had." And so, "Be the upline that you wish had," is my best practice. Steve Larsen: I appreciate that answer. I very strongly do believe in an element of business karma, if you go around and you start trying to help people and you put out legitimate value out there. It may not happen all at once, there's got to be this mentality of dropping your anger and not moving forward for a while, it's not a "get rich quick" thing, but eventually you do get what you'd like. It'll come, and almost be surprising, over night. Just kind of show up. That's great... Jon Penkert: What people don't realize is that you attract what you put out there, so if you don't like what you're getting, take a step back and look at what you're putting out. Steve Larsen: Do you have any last pieces of advice for someone who, let's say they're in one, they like the product, there's not really a whole lot moving along ... what should someone be involved in daily, those tasks, those rituals that keep them engaged in the process? Jon Penkert: The biggest thing that I can do for each one of your listeners is ... You guys, take a deep breath and look in the mirror, because the number one quality that drives my business overall, is a belief in your self. You have to believe in yourself. Find a company with integrity, with a great product, and a good comp plan but then, look in the mirror and go, "You know what? You are at the right place at the right time. You were chosen for this opportunity and go get it." Because I can't stop a person that 100%, rock solid believes. They will go out and break every barrier out there if they just believe. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Jon Penkert: As a leader, most often, all I do is get people to see that they have everything that they need to succeed. They just have to believe and go do it. Steve Larsen: Very enlightening, very fascinating. I appreciate that a lot. Now, you've obviously mentioned you don't have a business card and you work with the people directly under you, if people wanted to reach out or learn more about what it is you're doing or some kind of an action follow-up after this podcast, where should people go? What should people do? Jon Penkert: Well, Steven I totally appreciate and respect you and I'm glad that you invited me to be on your broadcast. This, for me, was really a favor to you. It wasn't an opportunity for me to recruit. I don't think I'm that great anyway, but I think that you find out who I am and what I'm in and you want to get involved, I would say embrace a local leader in your local market that's on my team that's great. I'm not here to recruit people, I'm just here to support. If they want to reach out to you, you know how to get ahold of me. Let's work it that way. Steve Larsen: Sounds good. We'll do it that way. Awesome. Jon, thank you so much. I appreciate that. This has been fantastic. Jon Penkert: Well, it's my absolute pleasure and I look forward to working with you in the future. I'll tell you something. In life, when you get two people ... I love the mastermind principle. You get two people, it creates a third more powerful mind. You can change the world getting two people committed and believing in themselves and moving in the right direction. So, I thank you Steven for what you bring to the table and your commitment to success. Steve Larsen: Alright you guys. Now at this time, what I want to do is to show you guys a little bit more about the actual funnel that I've been using to recruit for downlines. It's amazing. I came up with the concept about four years ago. I never thought that it would actually come to fruition as quickly, or as powerfully, as it has. What happened, basically, is I joined this MLM and it was terrible because I literally went down Main Street. We just found out that my wife was pregnant with our first kid and I was excited, but really honestly, I was scared out of my mind because I had no money. I had nothing... I know a lot of people listening to this are still trying to figure out what there thing is and they're still trying to create with their product or what ever it is, their first successful funnel or whatever. Just know that I know the feeling, right? What happened was, basically, my buddy came in and he recruited me. He said, "Hey, come join this," and I was like, "No. That's a stupid multi-level marketing thing. I'm not gonna do that." I ended up joining his after he was begging. But I did it with the reason in mind like, "You know what? This could pay for the birth of my child." I was like, "Hey, the clock's ticking. I got nine months. Let's go do this." What I did is I started studying and reading and I was literally going door to door. I was like, "If I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do it 100%." And so, I literally did, I went down Main Street and I recruited 13 people my first month. First off, I just want to say, I'm never ever gonna tell you the name of the MLM. That's not the purpose of this. I'm telling you this, "You can use what I'm telling you right now in any MLM." Okay? I'm just gonna get that big elephant out of the room real quick. I was studying one night, and I realized that after I recruited those first 13 people, I was like, "Yes, this is awesome. This is totally duplicatable. I got all these people now." The problem was that literally none of them did anything at all. I literally had to take a cattle prod. I remember driving once three or four hours, something like that ... Yeah, it was three hours, three hours in a single day. I think so. Anyway, it was a long way ... just to meet with somebody just to see if they had actually done anything because they wouldn't answer the phone calls. I couldn't motivate them. I was like, "This is not sustainable. This is not duplicatable. Whoever told me this was passive income was lying."That was my attitude, and there was an element of truth to that. I was like, "There's got to be a better way to do this." What happened was, one night, it was like 3 a.m. in the morning or it was 2 a.m., 2 a.m. in the morning, I had class in a few hours. I was still in college, obviously. I was reading and all of sudden this guy ... I can see his face, I don't remember the eBook, I don't remember what company, I don't remember anything. I just remember hearing the concept "paid prospecting". I was like, "What? Is this real? Is this true?" Now, this is the dark ages. This is pre-ClickFunnels days or about the time they were launching actually. I was like, "This is fascinating, and you mean, you get paid regardless if somebody joins you? Fascinating. What?" I had this idea, what if I gave ridiculous value upfront, for free, for something and then something small paid, kind of like mid-tier, and then something more high ticket in the backend, and those people are the people that I go approach. Not family and friends. I can honestly say, and still say, that to this day there have been people, four years, me approaching them about MLM it hurt the relationship. I was like, "This is garbage. I'm not gonna do this. If this is what this industry is about, I don't want to do it." I know a lot of you guys are the exact same way. I was like, "What's this funnel thing?" I had been building, basically the equivalent of funnels, in WordPress prior, before ClickFunnels days. I had a whole bunch of my own clients. It was a lot of fun. We had successes. We had failures. This is the story, you know? Basically, what I realized is like, "What if I created this thing? I'll go film it." What I did is I basically funnel hacked. Again, I didn't know that was the term or whatever, but I went and I started looking at all the top MLMers who are out there. I started asking like, "What are they actually doing?" And you know what's funny is that after a couple of months of just deep diving into each of these guys, I realized that none of them were doing home meetings, none of them were doing hotel meetings, they're not going getting on the phone, none of them were going to their family and friends. They had created for themselves something unique. But what they did all have, every single one of them, had the equivalent of a funnel. They had their own website. They had the equivalent of a Webinar. It was interesting. It was so stark when I started looking at it. I was like, "This is the way to do that. Why have I been doing it the other way?" So what I did is I literally was taking some of these top guys courses... I was transcribing them. I was turning into my own. I was adding whole courses and elements to it. I went and I re-shot stuff. I put things together. It was one of the coolest things ever. It took me eight months, 'cause I was in the middle of college, I was in the army, we had our first kid. It took me a while to get it out, but when I did, nobody bought it at first. I had done a terrible job going around and sharing it with people. Honestly, what was really happening is I was graduating. There was a lot stuff happening. There just was. I was trying to become an officer. There was a whole bunch of stuff that was happening in my life and so I moved on. But some dude stumbled upon it and was like, "Oh my gosh! This is absolutely insane. Why are you not selling this more?" And I was like, "You know what? That was pretty cool." I went and I launched it and it was like massive, waterfall response. So many people just started coming out of the wood work, people I'd never heard of. I was like, "Holy crap! This is working." Pretty soon, I had a waiting list of like 12 people begging to join my MLM. I was like, "What the heck? This totally worked! Oh my gosh!" Anyway, fascinating. Well, it was my first attempt at making something that was bigger and there was a lot of things that were wrong with it. I had been redoing the entire thing and putting it all together. Basically, this is what happens, right? Just like Jon was saying. One of the problems is that people have not learned how to become attractive. I'm not saying good looking or whatever. I'm sure your all drop dead gorgeous. But you're not attractive yet. In MLM, you have the same product. You have the same service. You have the exact same scripts, the exact same websites. There's literally nothing different about you. Why would I join you over somebody else? There's no reason. There's no reason to. The one currency that you really have is you. You must be different. There's really two currencies, but that's the first one. The first currency, you must be different. You have to be sellable. You must know you. You've gotta find your voice. You've gotta know your message. That's what this new course that I've been talking about is gonna come out and talk about. Anyways, it's been a lot of fun. I've had a lot of fun putting it together. So, first of all, that's model number one. It talks about becoming attractive and how you actually attract people to you, how you create things and products that are free, that just deliver a crap ton of value because if you can do that, it will pull people to you in a really fascinating way. Right? You'll be giving before you ever ... you'll be leading with value before you ever even mention the fact that you have an MLM, right? I never even tell anyone about it ever. They have to find it through my funnel, and when they do, then I'll talk to them about it. Otherwise, it becomes this awkward thing and you have side agendas with every conversation. I hate that. I'm so against that. That's the reason I put this stuff together. Anyway. Second thing that it talks about is validating. So now if you've got people in through free stuff and you've attracted people in, the second part is a validation thing meaning I need to validate how serious this person is. If someone spends a little bit of money on marketing education for their MLM, I know they're serious. And so that's what I created. It was like a free plus shipping thing. And when someone bought it, I was like, "Hmm. This is not your standard MLMer." There's well over 10 million MLMers in America alone. Like, "Okay, this person already is separating themselves from the remainder of the people." And that's what I wanted. The third part then was now that I've pulled them in, I've qualified them, now it's all about the duplication and actually selling them. Right? That's what I use Webinars for and no one really has ever seen that before, which is awesome. Very few people have which is so freaking cool, anyway. But the Webinar goes in and auto closes and recruits and gets them signed up. It's amazing. Then after that, then it talks about some of this downline management stuff where I'll show you how to rob your downline. Meaning, there's a really good way to do this and a really bad way to do it and Jon touched on that, which is all about binaries, but, the right way to do them. Yes, the principles amazing, but there's a right way to do it just like he was talking about. You know, leadership training. I'm gonna have a lot of cool stuff. I'm gonna talk about when to rinse and when to repeat. How do you tell? It's weird to think of it like this, but it is a business and if someone's not doing their thing, might be time to rinse. If someone's run along with you and they can run with you, time to repeat. You do that through a very specific thing, and I'm not gonna give the golden nugget away, alright? There's a golden nugget to it. I'm totally gonna bait you guys. It's been ridiculous. Just the paid prospecting aspect of what I built up alone, without any ad spending, I made 50 grand last year. It was nuts. No ad spend, nothing else, it's just up, just talkable word to word, mouth to mouth. I didn't talk to anyone about it. There's very specific strategies I used and the people that are coming to me are asking to join. I don't even tell them I'm in one. Have I even told you what I'm in? No, and that's the reason why. That's why this is so powerful and why I've been so passionate about it... People are like, "Steven, MLM? Seriously?" Well, yeah actually. If you know how to work the system in a good way, if you know how to create a new opportunity, if you know how to create an offer, if you know how to do marketing, if you know how to do everything that Russell teaches, then yeah. Why the heck would you not, if you can do that? Then, the last part that it teaches you how to do, what it is shows you is I call it "pick your megaphone", "choose your megaphone", meaning, just choose one traffic source. Anyway, there's way more to it. There's a lot more that's been going on that you guys have no idea about that I totally kept from you for the last six months. It's been so sweet, all the pieces coming into play. Software pieces ... it's been great. It's been really great. I can honestly say very proudly that there's no one else on the planet that's been doing what I'm doing and it's ... Ah, it's so cool. I wish I could tell you more, but I can't. Anyway. That's what I want to talk about funnel-wise though, alright? Funnel-wise, and please understand, again, I'm not here to pitch. I'm just here to tell you what I've been doing because this is the sixth segment of this series, which is all about MLM funnels. So, what I've been doing, is I've been pumping ridiculous value into the MLM space. I know it's so good that people should be paying for it, and they know that. That's the feeling that I want them to have. Then I go through and I qualify them through something that's free and ... I'm sorry, something that's free plus shipping or whatever it is. Low ticket, 47 bucks. Honestly, I don't really think it matters that month. All your doing is your vetting out the good people. What's funny is that little vet move that I've been doing, I've talked to more owners of MLMs from that one thing than any other thing. You get the kind of fish that you put the bait out for, right? You know what I mean? Put better bait out, you get better fish. And so, I created a vetting system... Funnels are not just ways to increase our average cart value. They're also ways to vet people. That's exactly what an application style funnel is. You're trying to have them apply. You want to sift out the dirties, the people who are just never gonna do anything with you or who are just the kind of people who you help like crazy but they'll always complain or the people who just won't go take action. You know what I mean? I don't want those kinds of people and I know you don't want it either. So, first I attract through a lot of different ways, really amazing things actually. Then the second part is all about some kind of qualifier, money-wise. Paid prospecting, gotta charge. Right? Then after that, then I go close them through some more automated processes, specifically through Webinar funnels. That's what's been working for me and that's why I've been doing it. Anyway, I'm not the focus of this interview. I just wanted to be able to toss in more of what I've been doing funnel-wise to you, so that you have an idea that there is actually a really awesome way to do it without ever talking to family, every talking to friends, and if you want to, that's fine. I'm not trying to dissuade you from doing it. I'm just telling you that I am really against that and I don't do it for a lot of reasons. I specifically target the kind of individual that I want. I want someone who's a rockstar, someone who loves marketing. You know what I mean? Those are the kinds of people. Then what I do is I ... My team is very, very, as far as my own personal downline management strategies or whatever, I feel almost weird saying this to you guys, 'cause this is not the typical audience that I say this kind of stuff to, but what I do is I say, "Hey, look. I'll give you my entire marketing system if you come join." You know what I mean? Those are the things that you create yourself that make you attractive, otherwise, you're the same thing. Now, as far as a product standpoint, and fulfillment standpoint, and having to worry about customer service, MLM is fantastic because you don't have to worry about any of that. They take care of all of it... There's really ridiculous advantages to being a part of it. It truly can be passive if you set it up the right way. The problem is that most multi-level marketers, network marketers, have no idea how to market. And you're like, "What on earth is so..." Anyway, that's what I've been doing and it's been kicking butt. Anyway, it's been great. Not trying to be cocky, I'm just excited. Anyway, if you are interested though, go check out secretmlmhacks.com just to see what I'm doing. Again, not pitching you, not trying to be weird or whatever. Just so you guys can see how I've been doing it. If you love your MLM, stay in it, which is awesome. So anyway, go to secretmlmhacks.com to watch real time what it is that's been going on there in the MLM world. Alright. Hey, guys, that's been the last part of this series. I've loved doing this with you guys. I've loved going through this six part series. I have more interviews that I've already lined up. Might be the next one, might not be. But anyway, we're gonna get back into ... Usually I try and publish two times a week, but these have been an hour long, almost every single one of them. Now, if you really want to watch behind the scenes, as far as my hands, watch the magician hands, the real purpose behind these, yes it was to provide amazing value but there is something else that I did these interviews for that will help you. Anyway. Keep watching everything that's going on. I think you guys will enjoy it and please, these speakers have done amazing things, they have dropped insane value. I want you to know that the listenership has well more than doubled because of these. It's not because I know that I'm great or anything like that. I has nothing to do with that. It's because I understand the value these guys have been pumping out there... Anyway, I've got a great follow-up episode already that I'm gonna be doing. I think you guys will like the next one. I'll talk to you guys later. Hope you enjoyed it. Reach out to the speakers, tell them thank you so much. And go take some serious action, and you will enjoy successes. Alright guys, talk to you later. Bye! Announcer: Thanks for listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Want to get one of today's best internet sales funnel for free? Go to salesfunnelbroker.com/freefunnels to download your pre-built sales funnel today.

Click above to listen in iTunes... Dan went from not being able to pay his power bill, to WELL past $200k in a few short months. But it wasn't overnight. Here's how he did it. I'll personally be buy his product. Click on the link in the blog post to check out his offer… ATTEND DAN's WEBINAR HERE:  and get my WP Theme Free... (email me) Steve Larsen: Hey, everyone. This is Steve Larsen, and you're listening to a very special Sales Funnel Radio. Speaker 2: Welcome to Sales Funnel Radio where you'll learn marketing strategies to grow your online business using today's best internet sales funnels. Now, here's your host, Steve Larsen. Steve Larsen: All right, everyone here, I've got a really unique episode here. This is fascinating stuff. Now, I've interviewed a lot of people in this podcast, and I've gone through, and we've thought we've got some great advice from great people in the past. Today's no different though, but I've really cool spin... I want to introduce you to a guy I've just come to know just in the last couple days, actually, named Dan Henry who is crushing it in the Facebook ad area. He's going to tell you a little more about it, but just killing it. The thing that grabbed my attention right off the bat is I was going through Facebook. I see this thing that says, "From pizza boy to $200,000 in a couple of months." I was like, "What the heck?" You know what I mean? That's always going to grab your attention. There was a striped screenshot, and I was like, "Crap, this is real." I was like, "Who is this kid?" I started going through, and a really fascinating story. With that, I just want to introduce everyone to Dan Henry. Dan, how are you doing, man? Dan Henry: Hey, how's it going? It's super early, but how's it going, Steve? Steve Larsen: It's going good, yes. Just so we know, Dan was like, "I became an entrepreneur so I don't have to get up early in the morning." Dan Henry: Yes, you're darn right. I became an entrepreneur, especially an online entrepreneur, so I can sleep in. That's my whole thing... Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Dan Henry: How are you doing this morning? Steve Larsen: I'm doing awesome. Like you took, Dan, a whole bunch of caffeine, and I am loving it. It's just starting to hit. Hey, I really want to know, and so does everyone else. I asked a few questions to people on the Sales Funnel Broker secret unknown hacks, all different pages. I'm like, "Hey, I'm about to interview this awesome guy. What do you guys want to know?" I got a huge list of questions from people, actually. Dan Henry: Wow. Steve Larsen: I mean number one, people want to know, literally, I think some are like, "How does a pizza boy" ... Tell us about your story. How does a pizza boy go to 200 grand? We'd love to know how it happened. Dan Henry: Well, I'll go through it. 200 grand, it's getting crazy at this point. I did 32 yesterday. I'm at 9,045 so far today. Steve Larsen: Wow, you're passed 200, obviously. Dan Henry: Oh, way passed 200. I've been doing over a hundred thousand a month for the past three months. It's getting wild now. I'll probably do close to 200 just this month. Excuse me. It's getting nuts. Let me see if I can run through this from beginning to end as cleanly and quickly as possible. Basically, back in 2009, I was a pizza boy. I was just your standard douche bag. Steve Larsen: That does not reflect all pizza boys, by the way. Just want to put that disclaimer in there. Dan Henry: It reflects me. I saw these articles and these Business Insider things and all of these stuff about these guys that were making stupid money, you know? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: Just 18-year old kids making a million dollars. I was just like, "What is this?" It was this online marketing thing, and I was like, "I got to learn this." I spent two years just going nuts. Going nuts and trying to learn it... Steve Larsen: How were you trying to learn it? Dan Henry: The normal ways: podcast, buying crappy digital marketing products. That whole thing. Steve Larsen: Yes, yes. It's like the gauntlet we all run through, you know what I mean? Dan Henry: Yes. A lot of the early days with the Digital Point Forums and the Warrior Forums and all that. That whole thing. I didn't really try anything until 2011, and when I did, it was a blog. I was doing the whole SEO affiliate marketing blog thing. It was not how to make money. I know everybody starts with how to make money even though they haven't made a dime, which I don't freaking understand. Mine was electronic cigarettes, okay? Steve Larsen: Okay. Dan Henry: I went from $145 my first month in commissions to $30,000 a month my 14th month, so just over a year. I was making 30 grand a month in a year. I was doing really, really well. Life was great. I thought I was on top of the world, and then, the whole SEO crash happened. All that income just went poof, gone. It was just gone... Excuse me... Everything I worked for was just gone in a flash. I had a bunch of money in the bank because I had made that for that long of a time, and so I went, and I bought a night club. I took my skills offline because I was bitter, a little bit, about it. I was like, "Well, I want to start a real business." I started this night club, and I remodeled it. That's when I first started to learn Facebook ads because I had to bring business into my night club. It, in just over a year, I flipped the night club for a $300,000 profit. Now, you would think that that's all grand and well, but unfortunately, due to some really bad investments, me, investing in some software products I was trying to do, not paying taxes for three years like an idiot. I wound up literally broke at the end of it, okay? This was actually last year that I was still broke. Last year, I could not keep my lights on, almost. I had just gotten married to my wife who is a lawyer in Turkey, but does not have her ... she's working on it now to get her law degree here. She had to get a job, and this woman is a lawyer... She had to get a job at a Turkish restaurant to help me pay the electric. It was embarrassing for her, and it was embarrassing for me because I felt responsible that I made her do that. I'm sitting here, trying to keep afloat. I started another blog, and I was making about six grand a month doing that, but it wasn't consistent. I was barely keeping afloat. That was bad. Then, I started. People wanted to know how I made money back then and all these. People had always asked me, "How did you make this money to buy this night club, to do this, to do that?" I thought about coaching, but I didn't really get into it. I started doing Facebook ads more. I started taking on clients, okay? This is when it turned around... I started taking on local clients, real estate, all that stuff. In about a month, I scaled to $10,000 a month in clients, okay? First month. Steve Larsen: You were running ads for them, for their business? Dan Henry: Yes, just running ads for them, okay, and getting them great results. What really launched me was I had this real estate agent. Not real estate agent... Condo development in Texas. I spent $441 in ads. They ended up selling $900,000 worth of condos in a week. Then, I ended up getting interviewed on TV about it... Steve Larsen: I saw your picture all over the place. I was like, "Cool, this guy's been on TV, too." Dan Henry: Yes, yes. I've been on TV a lot. I've been on Business Insider twice. I'm hopefully working on getting on the Steve Harvey Show. We've been going back and forth with the producer for a while. Hopefully, I can get on there. In case Steve is listening, hey. I'm on the list. Steve Larsen: We'll send it straight to him. It says, "Re: Steve, you better ... From one Steve to another." Dan Henry: Yes, so anyway, so things started looking better. I had clients. Then, I started doing a little bit of coaching for Facebook ads, for online marketing. I did try to put out a blogging course, but unfortunately, most bloggers are freaking lazy. They don't take it seriously... They think it's some sort of hobby, not a real business. I got out of that real quick because it weren't the people I wanted to be dealing with. This went on for a few months, and I got back on my feet, and I was making crazy money with clients. Then, people obviously started asking me, "Well, how did you do this? How did you quickly make money with these clients," and all these. They were asking me these stuff. I decided to put out a little group coaching program. It was only seven people. This was where my course started happening... I don't understand this whole, "Let's build a course and sell it." You got to know that your course works. You might know how to do something, but you got to know that you can teach it to somebody. Steve Larsen: Right. It's totally a different skill, for sure. Dan Henry: Right, so I took seven people, and I worked with them personally, more of a group coaching than a course. I tweaked things. I figured out what was helping them and whatnot and what they really got in-tuned with and where their roadblocks were. I changed the material. I launched again to about 15 people. Then, I revised it. I did all these little launches until I had it down. I got three guys right now who were doing nothing, zero dollars. Now, they're making over $10,000 a month. One of them is a doofy 19-yearold kid. The other is a slightly less doofy 22-year old kid. The other one is in his 30's. He's got a family. Steve Larsen: No doof? Dan Henry: No, he's still a doof. Steve Larsen: No, can you just point out, re-quote what you just said. Okay, for the audience, what Dan just said is amazing because we tell people to do this all the time. Someone, the other day, just asked me like, "How do I get started? How do I do this?" I keep saying how to do it, and we keep saying how to do it. Go get results first. It's so much about that. Oh, man. You can't just go jump out, and just start if you like. Dan Henry: Listen, Steve, if nobody's going to listen, they're not... They're just going to be like, "Yes, okay." They're going to nod their head, and they're going to go, and they're drinking their drink, their overpriced latte. They're not going to do what you're telling them to do, okay? That's what's going to happen. 99% of the people listening to this right now are going to not do it. Steve Larsen: Startup Stock Photo Yes. I worked for free for 10 months for one company, just to get them sweet results. When they were making 60 grand every e-mail drop, then, I was like, "Okay, now you guys can start paying me." I took that story, and I went, and I sold it. That's how I got going in this industry... Same thing as you, anyways. Totally awesome, yes. Results first, everybody, before you get paid. Dan Henry: Yes, absolutely. Steve Larsen: All right. Continue, sorry. Dan Henry: Yes, so basically, now I had results. I decided to do an actual launch. I did an actual launch with an e-mail sequence. No webinar, just an e-mail sequence. I made $15,000 that month. That was fine. I was like, "Okay, that's cool," but I was a little disappointed. Then, I started implementing more of Russell's stuff from DotCom Secrets. I digest everybody's stuff... My favorite mixture right now is if you took Russell Brunson and put him in a bath tub with Ryan Lavesque, maybe sprinkled a little Derek Harper on. Not too much, but too much is way too strong, and just grinding them all up. Steve Larsen: All right. That's a great picture. Dan Henry: I got that whole little mixture going on. I started really getting into webinars. I took a webinar that I was working on, and I used the perfect webinar script. Steve Larsen: Okay. It's amazing. Dan Henry: Really, it was the same content. I just used Russell's format which really helps... I put that all together, and I launched. I used all the same strategies I taught with Facebook ads for my launch, obviously because duh, that's ... That month, I ended up doing $104,000. Steve Larsen: Holy cow. Was that just three months ago, you were talking about? Dan Henry: Yes, that was three months ago. Steve Larsen: That's amazing, okay. Dan Henry: Yes. Here's the funny part. I didn't pay for any ads. Steve Larsen: Really? Dan Henry: No. You know why? Because as soon as you opted in for my webinar, I didn't take you to a thank you page. I didn't take you to a, "Hey, here, you registered for the webinar." I took you to an up sell. It's a 37-dollar product... The way I framed it was, "Hey." We'll all just tell you what it was. It was called Pixel Hero. Basically, you sign up for my webinar. What I did was the webinar was just ... It is a super long name. It was called, "How I made $10,000 my first month running Facebook ads for clients, and how you can too, even if you don't have results to show first," okay? Steve Larsen: Sure. Dan Henry: I taught a method. It's funny because it's all revolving around the "Get results first" method, even though it says, "Even if you don't have results first." It's a very interesting method. I do that webinar, and then, on the thank you page, it was called Pixel Hero. I was like, "Hey, does the Facebook Pixel confuse you? If it does, you might want to check this product out because it really enhanced." This is the key. "It will really enhance what you learn on the webinar." I noticed that when I said, "This thing that's only $37 will enhance what you're going to learn on the free webinar," it could have earned at 40%. Steve Larsen: Dude, holy crap. Dan Henry: It can earn at 40%. Steve Larsen: Now, was it even your product? Is it just an affiliate thing that you put in? Dan Henry: No, I don't do that crap. No, it was my product. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Dan Henry: Yes, I put it together in a night. It was slides and all. It's like Russell's stuff. You get slides and all that stuff that I screen share. One of the bonuses was how to get webinar registrations for under a dollar. That really helped. I hit it from all different ways. I did $9,000 in Pixel Hero sales before I even got on my webinar... Steve Larsen: That's amazing. I mean you literally created a self-liquidating offer for webinars, which is oh, man, that's cool. Dan Henry: Yes, yes. You know what I stole from Russell a little bit? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: I saw him do this video once where he had a whiteboard, and he had the price, but he had paper taped up to the wall. Steve Larsen: Dude, go ahead, yes. Dan Henry: Yes, he did the whole thing, and the paper's there. I'm thinking, "Dude, just shut up, and rip off the paper, for crying out loud." I'm thinking, "Wait a minute." Steve Larsen: That's why he does it. Dan Henry: Yes, exactly. I was like, "Well, if I was that emotionally invested to that darn paper getting ripped off ... By the way, the only reason I'm saying darn is because I'm on your podcast. I would be saying all kinds of different things normally... Steve Larsen: I appreciate it. Dan Henry: I did it, and it works well. I ripped it off, and boom. It worked really, really well. Then, I re-targeted people, and I was like, "Hey, this is your last chance, or the price is going up." I would spend $3, and make a $37 sale. I've done probably $40,000 in that offer. Steve Larsen: Just for that front-end offer? Dan Henry: Yes. Steve Larsen: I mean if you can get someone to go through, and they buy a 37-dollar product, the likelihood that someone actually shows up is huge, watches the thing, goes through. Their engagement's high... Dan Henry: Oh, yes. Steve Larsen: Awesome. Dan Henry: It's a tripwire. Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: Let me just tell you, man. I've seen these things where Russell or anybody, you guys, you're talking about, "Oh, this funnel makes us $100,000 a day. Oh, this funnel makes us $30,000 a day." Steve Larsen: Which is true. Dan Henry: Yes, I know. Oh, I know it's true... When you're watching that, you're like, "Oh, man." Some people probably are like, "That's not even possible." Then, some people are like me. I know it's possible. I know it. I just got to do it. Now that I'm doing it, honestly, it's been a crazy ride for me. I remember looking at ... I don't know if it's still big now, but you know the income reports? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: Who is the guy? It was Pat Flynn. Steve Larsen: Pat Flynn, yes. Dan Henry: Yes, and the EOI on Fire, so I started looking at those. I remember, I saw one with Pat Flynn, and it said, "Oh, I made 120 in an income report. 120 grand." I'm thinking to my self, "If I could only make 120 grand in a month, that would be amazing." Now, I'm making it. This week- Steve Larsen: You're matching that. Dan Henry: This week, I have done almost $80,000 this week. Steve Larsen: Yes. You woke up, and there was already almost 10 grand in your bank. Dan Henry: Yes, yes. Steve Larsen: That's amazing, man. Dan Henry: This week. That's on very little ads spent... Now, it's a little bit higher this week because of the whole Black Friday thing, but when I went evergreen, which I'll get into in a minute, now, I'm up to at least five to $7,000 a day solid. Now, it's getting crazy... I've now have had 10, 12,000-dollar days. Yesterday, it was 32,000, but that was cyber Monday. Friday was 16,000. Anyway, I did my live webinar, and then, I did it again a month later. I made about the same amount a month later. Then, when I turned into evergreen, and I used your On The Hour webinar. There's that because I saw the ... What was it? Was it the Certified Partner one that you guys did? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: I was like, "That's awesome. I want to do that." I studied it, and I funnel-hacked you, basically. I recreated it, and then, I spent all this time trying to figure out how to do it. Then, you guys end up releasing the code for it the next day. I was so, so angry. I was like, "Ahh." I just deleted everything I did and used your code. I did the On The Hour thing. I've just been hit, hit, man. Now, I've just opened my affiliate program because my webinar converts like great. Like great. Oh, I don't have any coffee or anything. My webinar converts great. I just opened my affiliate program. One of my students made $800 yesterday on it. Everything's coming together, man. It's just amazing that last year, I could barely keep my electric on. Now, this is all happening. Not only that, but I've got student results out of the Yin Yang. I think that's what really sells my stuff. I don't even go into big long copy. I just constantly push. Every e-mail I send out has a new case study from a student. I don't push, really, my results so much. I mean I do, but mostly, my student results. I always do headlines for what these student results are. They're all across the board. I'll push out, like for instance, a web designer spent $100. She landed her first 6,000-dollar client within $100. I got guys running it as an agency where they got chiropractors. They're making 10 grand a month... I got a bunch of those guys, real estate guys doing well. I know you know Jesse Coft. She is killing it. Within two weeks of taking the course, she had a killer webinar going. She made thousands to $10,000 for a masseuse place. There was somebody else. I don't remember, but I just got all these variety of case studies, and I just push them out. What I do is every single time somebody gets a result, I have my assistant, Stephanie, get them on Skype or get them on Hangouts for a five-minute success call. I record it, and I immediately push it out or put it in my sequence. I just put it on my sales page, and I just push, push, push, push, push the results because that is honestly what I think matters. I think if you have results, you don't have to be awesome at sales copy, awesome at e-mail sequences or any of that because at the end of the day, you have the results. You have the results, so all that other crap is just secondary, I think... Steve Larsen: No, it's so true because I did door-to-door sales for two summers, right? How many of those tactics I actually use what I do now? None. What actually sells the stuff that I do and actually sells when I build funnels is I say, "Hey, I'm just built for the next president of Alberta, Canada." You know what I mean? It's helping him in his campaign. "Hey." You can point back to all these different things. It's so much more powerful because now, you sell without actually selling. You know what I mean? You're actually pushing things without actually cramming down their throat. It becomes very much a story-based automatically. It's just so much more powerful than a pitch that's more generic. Hey, I wanted to ask, so I'm actually drawing while you talk your funnel and all the different pieces. Now, so you go from a registration page ... Dan Henry: Do you want me to go through it? You want me to just go through the whole thing real quick? Steve Larsen: That would be awesome. Then, you said some crazy stuff. You've got little, little tiny ism's that you're doing, as far as capturing stories, getting them on Skype. Stuff like that. Those are things that are huge impacts, like you said. Those are not normal for people to be pulling off. I'd love to hear those kinds of things as well. Dan Henry: All right. Hey, I'll go through the whole thing. All right, so on my website, danhenry.org, I have a cheat sheet. It's called Seven Proven Steps to Creating, running and Profiting from Facebook Ads. It's a PDF cheat sheet. Once you go on there, and you opt in, whether it be from a cold ad or Google or whatever, you opt in. You get this cheat sheet... Now, this is where it gets interesting. Once you get the cheat sheet, you get forwarded to a thank you page where I invite you to my free Facebook group called Superhero Entrepreneurs. Now, this is important because I used to try to be super professional. It wasn't working for me. I just blended in with everybody else. When I started being myself, that's when it blew up. I'm basically the Kevin Smith of all my marketing on my extremely juvenile humor. It costs a lot. When I bring them to the thank you page for my group, I'm wearing a bunny hat ears, and I say, "Thanks for joining." I tell them about my group. I say, "Let me invite you into the group," and I say my spam policy. This is how I pre-frame people right away to get used to how I am. I say, "Listen, if you spam in my group, we have a policy. If you spam in my group, I will send you goat balls. My admins will send you pictures of goat balls." Everybody in the group has my permission to PM you with pictures of goat balls. They get used to my crazy incorrect way. Now, listen, seriously, if you go join Superhero Entrepreneurs right now, and you spam, you self-promote, you will get sent tons of goat balls. What happens is we don't even have to ban people. They leave because they get just bombarded with pictures of goat balls, okay? Steve Larsen: What the heck? That's awesome, man. Dan Henry: Yes. Now, people, and here's the funny thing. People enjoy this because I'm making stupid money, but I'm being a total jackass. I'm letting them know that it's possible. You can be your self. I'm the type of guy that would send you a picture of goat balls if you spam my group. That's me. You know what? That's what I'm going to do. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. Dan Henry: I take them to that page. I warm them up to my personality. I get them in my Facebook group, which is key. Then, after that, they get sent a five-day e-mail sequence which is your soap opera sequence, basically. That sequence tells them my story, indoctrinates them and pushes to my On The Hour webinar. It plays every hour. They register for the webinar. They get forwarded to the webinar room when it's time. Now, they get an e-mail that offers Pixel Hero, and they also get re-targeted for Pixel Hero. That helps my ad cost and all that. Steve Larsen: They go right after registration though. There's a interstitial page though where they go to Pixel Hero, right, before confirmation page? Dan Henry: Yes. No, the Pixel Hero only gets offered in the funnel steps when I did it live... When I switched it to evergreen, I just send an e-mail because I didn't want to. What happens if they opt in five minutes before it plays? What are they going to do? Watch the sales video? Then, I mean I guess I could split test it, but it's working, obviously, great right now. Basically, they get forwarded to a page. On this thank you page is just a five-minute video where I teach them how to get easy ROI clients. This warms them up as well. Steve Larsen: This is before the webinar even starts? Dan Henry: Yes. I send them an e-mail with pre-free videos as well. They can just watch it at their leisure. Basically, the e-mail they get right away is, "Hey, here's your" ... I basically funnel-hacked your certification thing. I looked at the e-mail Russell sent, and he was like, "No matter what time you opt in," he says, "It's starting now." I was like, "Oh, that's interesting." I did that. I also said, "By the way, here's three free videos you could watch anytime. I will help supplement the webinar." I do that... Steve Larsen: Those are your indoctrination videos, prior to coming on. Okay. Dan Henry: Yes, I did those videos when I did the live webinar. I might change these stuff a little bit, tweak it. I'm trying to fit what I did live into this evergreen thing because it's a little different. They opt in, and it plays every hour. The webinar plays every hour, so it's a little bit different. Steve Larsen: If you don't mind, how many e-mails are they actually getting then, when they opt in? I mean that could be a concern for some people. They're like, "Oh," but it probably doesn't matter. Dan Henry: Oh, they're fine. They'll live. Steve Larsen: Right, okay. Dan Henry: They get two e-mails as soon as they opt in. The fist e-mail is the whole, "Here's your link to the webinar." Then, the second e-mail is, "Do you have trouble with the Facebook Pixel?" That is a very short e-mail. It's two sentences, and it basically says, "If you have trouble with the Facebook Pixel, just click here." That's it, and it takes them to my OTO page. They also get re-targeted as well for that. It's no big deal if they don't read the e-mail. I do tons of sales with re-targeting... Then, they watch the webinar. They get offered the product, and they have seven days to sign up. They get e-mails, and the e-mail sequence at that point is literally just results, results, results, results, results, results, results. I just go nuts. Then, I re-target people... Oh, this is another interesting thing I should include. When people opt into the cheat sheet, for five days, they get targeted with all my TV interviews, podcasts I've been on. They see. Basically, they opt in- Steve Larsen: Social proof like crazy. Dan Henry: Yes, social proof. Yes. It's like my credibility... I call it my credibility campaign. Then, when they opt into the webinar, now, they're getting re-targeted with just one of nine case studies from my students, okay? I just keep funneling them back to that. If they haven't bought already, by the time day seven hits, they've only got that much time to buy. They've already been hit with the cheat sheet, soap opera sequence, the TV interviews I did, the speeches I've done, all of that. Then, they got hit with the webinar. Then, they got hit with the follow-ups and the case studies. They're getting hit. I'm following them around Facebook with re-targeting on the student results and all of these. Steve Larsen: Wow. Dan Henry: At this point, then, if they don't buy, they get forwarded to a waiting list. I actually find I do a ton of sales from the waiting list. Even though you basically have all this time to sign up, like I just opened for Black Friday and Cyber Monday to everybody on the waiting list, just to people on the waiting list and people on my group. Like I said, I did $16,000 on Friday, and I did $32,000 yesterday... Steve Larsen: It's from a waiting ... I've heard a lot of strategies with that waiting list. They'll go at them. If someone didn't buy on the webinar, you just toss them. I mean do you have them tucked in for waiting list? Dan Henry: You toss them on over to the waiting list. Yes, they have to opt in for it. Steve Larsen: How do you get them to do that? Dan Henry: Once the timer runs out, and the offer expires ... Oh, I use Deadline Funnel, by the way. Steve Larsen: Okay, cool. Dan Henry: Once that times out, no matter where they are, whether it's a sales pitch or whatever, they get forwarded to the, "Hey, sorry. You missed it. Jump on the waiting list," okay? Steve Larsen: Wow. Dan Henry: When every once in a while, I'll find a reason to open it up like Black Friday and Cyber Monday. I sent an e-mail out to that waiting list, and they just buy like crazy. One time, I sent an e-mail, and I was just like, "Listen, I know you missed the course. You know you want to get it. Just freaking do it, okay? Click here." I'd be paid 10 grand. I mean I swear to God. I don't know what it is. People don't read their e-mail or something. I get e-mails all the time... "Please let me in. Please let me in. Please let me in." I'm thinking, "You had seven days, dude. What is taking so" ... It revolves around a key thing here. It's that there's two very important points here. Number one, I could do this funnel completely different. See, everybody gets so ... "Oh, give me your funnel. Give me your funnel. Give me your funnel. Can I have a copy of your funnel?" None of that means anything if what you put in the funnel sucks, okay? Steve Larsen: Yes. It literally is the copy. It's the way you do it that matters, yes. Dan Henry: Right, so when you say you funnel hack someone, yes, you can funnel hack the process, but it's only going to work if whatever you're offering is good. If it sucks, and you don't have results, people aren't going to buy just because they went through a certain amount of funnel steps. I mean that's just ridiculous, because everybody's sick of people being full of crap these days. Everybody's full of crap. 99.9, they make $5 online. Now, they want to go create a course, you know? Steve Larsen: Right, mm-hmm (affirmative). Dan Henry: When I created my course, I did it in stages. I refined it. I redid it. I redid it. I made sure that it worked for people without me, holding their hand. You're going to still have people, like every once in a while, I'll get somebody who's like, "The course is not working for me." I'll be like, "Well, run me through what's going on." They'll run me through it... Steve Larsen: Yes, what are you doing? Dan Henry: Obviously, they're doing it completely different. I'm like, "Why are you doing this? This is not what I said to do." "Well, I just thought." I'm like, "Oh, you thought? You thought nothing. You're not doing it the right way. Do it the right way, and you'll get results." Then, they do it the right way. Then, they get results... Then, they're like, "Oh, it worked." I'm like, "Yes, no crap." Listen, I have refined this. I have taken ... Put it this way. I'm really close with one of ... I'm going to call him out right now. This is funny. One of my students, his name is Tanner, okay? This kid is 19 years old. Now, have you ever seen those videos on YouTube where they go and ask people who the Vice President is? They don't know. Steve Larsen: Yes, yes. Dan Henry: This is one of those dudes, okay? Steve Larsen: Okay, sounds cool. Dan Henry: He would totally be one of those guys. The kid is making $10,000 a month running a Facebook ad agency. I didn't give him any private coaching except the course. Steve Larsen: It's just from your course. Dan Henry: Right. Steve Larsen: From your content, yes. Dan Henry: Right. He took the basic version. It's like I refined it so that literally, somebody like, and I love him. He knows I love him, but one of those dudes can make that much money, that's what I was going for. Forget funnels. Forget webinars. Let me get this down first, okay? Steve Larsen: Right. Dan Henry: Let me get this to where people are going to get results. I did it in two things because my course goes over, "How to run ads for your self or for clients," and actually didn't even start for clients at first. I just noticed everybody wanted to do it for clients, so I added that aspect. It works for both, and I got it to where, for instance, this girl, Gretchen, she is a high-end web designer. She didn't know nothing about Facebook ads. She spent her first hundred dollars and landed a 6,000-dollar client. Boom. Got her. Tanner, who's making 10 grand a month... All these people, and once I had that, I knew I had something. When I launched big, I started getting, literally, every other day, I get a message from Stephanie. She's like, "We got another success call. We got another success call." I don't even know who these people are. They sign up. They take the course. They get results. They make money. That was the whole plan: get results first. I know everybody's listening right there. "Oh, let me get his funnel. Let me funnel hack him." It's like, "No, dude. You could screw the whole funnel." Actually, on that launch that I made, my second launch to where I did another hundred grand, 500 people didn't get the webinar registration link because of the API. Something happened with "Get Response," and the API wasn't talking to quick funnels. It was their issue. I know people have had issues with that. Here's a little tip. Don't use the API for anything... Use HTML parsing. It will work every time. If you use API, you could risk losing e-mails. Steve Larsen: Just so the audience know, you're talking about the ... If you're using a third party auto-responder, and you're inside ClickFunnels, open that top right spot, It says, "e-mail." If you click right there, and you drop in HTML and click pars, it grabs straight from the code, right from your third party auto-responder, or you can do it through an API. Sometimes, there's issues with that... Dan Henry: Exactly, and I didn't know that. 500 people didn't get my registration e-mail, so I had to re-target the crap out of people and be like, "Hey, here's the replay." I probably could have done more that second month, but whatever. I think we talked about that. I think I messaged you about that... Steve Larsen: I think you did, yes. Dan Henry: Yes, because I made 40 grand the week I launched it, and the first time I launched it, I made 45 grand the first day. When I first did my first webinar, it was literally my first, where I did the perfect webinar script, that first day, I did $45,000. Steve Larsen: Now, could you walk us through what the offer actually is, or do you want to say that for the webinar? Totally fine. Dan Henry: No, no. I don't care. If people are interested, they're going to watch the webinar. They'll find it. Basically, here was the secret that I did on the webinar. I know people are going to start copying me, and they're going to try to copy me, but whatever. I'm not worried. You're not going to do this good... Steve Larsen: That's a challenge to you. Now, you got to do better. It's like your pride's on the line. Dan Henry: I compete with my students all the time. It's funny. Actually, real quick side note. I had a student launch her course, and she did $53,000 in a week. That week, I had done 20,000. I got all pissed over that cost. Damn it. I got all peed off, cheated on, darn it. Steve Larsen: Hey, pissed isn't a swear word, is it? I hope not. Dan Henry: Isn't it? Well, good. Then, I got pissed off. I'm like, "I can't let her beat me." Then, I went out and made a hundred grand. Anyway, basically, I do the three secrets. Now, here's the key. There is a way to get Facebook ad clients. People don't realize how easy Facebook ads are if you ignore the noise. There's just so much noise out there. Oh my God, the split testing and the buttons and the objectives and the acronyms. It's maddening. Dude, it has nothing to do with any of that. It has to do with psychology. My ads, they're not all crazy. They're so simple. If you run ads for local businesses, doctors, lawyers, gyms, chiropractors, dentists, these are very easy. I could teach you in an afternoon, how to kill it for these type of businesses, all right? It's not hard. Now, for coaches and courses, that's different. I cover all that in my course, but for the webinar, I show you how to get results for those type of clients. Then, I show you how to get those type of clients right away. My first secret, and this is key, this is going to be huge. This is a huge value bomb right here. Secret number one, I show you how to get clients, literally, within an hour. Sometimes, 20 minutes, five minutes. I've had several people do it, and they got clients before the webinar was over. It's like really one of my best things, and I throw it out there on the webinar. What happens is people start doing this technique, and I'll save the technique for the webinar, but people start doing this technique. I say, "Go ahead and do it." Then, I start going through the rest of the webinar... By the time I get to the pitch, people's inboxes are blowing up with people wanting them to run ads for them, okay? Now, they got to buy the course because now, they're getting clients, right? They got to know how to run Facebook ads, or they got to know how to run better. They got to know how to improve their agency or whatever. They got to know how to get more clients. They got to know how to run whatever. I show them that on there. The secret, too. I show them how to get results for those clients. I give them everything they need. I've had several people. Several people, not buy my course and get results from that webinar. I'm okay with that. They're making money. They get clients... For the people that want to take it to the next level, I offer them the course... The course covers everything. It covers no only running for clients, running for yourself, whether you're a coach, a consultant, an online course. You want to run ads for restaurants. You want to ad runs for night clubs, chiropractors, doctors, lawyers, real estate, it's all in there. It's called, "Facebook Ads for Entrepreneurs." It's a very comprehensive course. It's huge, tons of bonuses. I mean it's a very big course. It's huge... Steve Larsen: Dude, that's awesome. By the way, Dan just is Zeigarnik effect of the crap, out of all of us, by the way. If you don't know what that is, it's when you start saying something, but then not finish it. It sounds like you all need to go watch that webinar. You said there's a technique that makes ... So you make people do things on the webinar to follow on with you, and they're getting results in the middle of the webinar. By the time the pitch happens, you are the obvious answer to them continuing... Dan Henry: Yes, yes, yes. Steve Larsen: Genius, my friend. That is amazing. Dan Henry: Thank you, thank you. Now, I don't tell people. I don't say, "Hey, go get a real estate client. Go get an online coach." Some people try it, and I even tell them not to do it. I show them how to get clients that are, what I call, "Easy ROI clients." These clients are super. You cannot possibly screw up a Facebook ad for these clients. I give them a funnel, too. I give them a free funnel. I give them everything. I give them the funnel. I give them everything they need. You cannot screw it up. Where people screw up is they watch the webinar... Then, they go, and they try to take on clients outside of that scope. Then, they have a little bit of trouble, but then, they buy the course, and they learn how to do it for those clients as well. Because it's a free webinar, I say, "Listen, I'm going to teach you how to get easy clients, how to get results for easy clients. If you want your hand held or you want to learn how to get results for different industries, for your self or for your coach or harder industries, or you just want to learn how to excel quicker, here's the course." That really, really works. I know some people out there are like, "Well, you shouldn't run Facebook ads if you don't know what you're doing." Yes, I totally agree, but like I said, for a select few types of clients ... Steve Larsen: Certain area, right. Dan Henry: Yes, it's stupid easy. It is because I have had people take the course, get a client and get stupid results. For instance, I've had several instances. Okay, I'll give you an example. I'll give you a perfect example. Cory Ellerbroek, this guy, and this almost makes me cry, this story. Cory Ellerbroek, he's a chiropractor in Texas. Cory was about to shut down his practice. He had very little business. He was literally about to close his doors. He had been following me for awhile. He bought my course on his last credit card. It was like his last Hail, Mary. Within the first day of him, running an ad, he got five or six new patients on nothing, like $40 ad spend. I have a case study. I don't remember. Let me see if I can find the numbers. Yes, I'll find the numbers. I'll go to my quick funnels. I'll tell you exact numbers. Yes, let me tell you the exact because I want to be accurate here. Steve Larsen: I know everyone listening now is going to be just frothing at the mouth to go to danhenry.org. Dan Henry: Okay. Yes, well, do that. Steve Larsen: Get your credit card out, and get it ready. Dan Henry: All right, so here's the numbers, okay? Steve Larsen: Sounds good, yes. Dan Henry: I'll give you the numbers right now. He spent $90, and he got 12 new patients. Steve Larsen: 12? Oh, man. Dan Henry: Okay, paying clients. This is somebody who is brand new, all right? Don't tell me ... See, all these people. I'm going to be honest right now. I'm going to piss off a lot of people. Honestly, I see them post in the groups and all of these. "Oh, well listen, to be good at Facebook ads, you got to test, test, test. You got to split test. You got to do this. You got to do that." I don't even split test my ads. No, I don't split test my ads, okay? Steve Larsen: That's huge. Dan Henry: Yes. I don't. I don't need to because now, I do split test ... I split test audiences. I don't split test ads, all right, because here's my thing. I want to create a perfect sequence for my perfect customer. Instead of trying to force and split test that ad and that copy to convince people, I want to create something that if somebody would opt into that, they'd be an easy sell. Instead of split testing the ad, I split test people. I find the people that engage with that ad the best. That's why I get such crazy ROI. I do not split test ads. I never have. Now, even still to this day, I don't split test ads. Steve Larsen: You want the ad to only let people in. You're not trying to convince clicks. Dan Henry: Yes. Let that sink in. Let that sink in for a second. I've got flamed even on the ClickFunnels go, "You don't split test ads? Oh, but I got them all up at arms." It's like, "Well, guess what? I'm spending two grand a month in ads, and I'm making over 100, so obviously" ... Steve Larsen: Right, something's working. Dan Henry: Something's working. I mean I've got these crazy ROIs. It's because of that, I don't split test ads. See, to me, I'm going to throw all this crap against the wall and see what sticks because I didn't take the time to know my customer. I go crazy into customer research, crazy. My first step like sometimes, when I get into a new ad or industry, I got take people out to lunch. I survey them. I ask very specific questions, which I cover in my course. I figure out exactly the pain points, the struggles, the roadblocks. I interject that into a script that I have for Facebook ads, okay? It's a formula. Steve Larsen: Fascinating. Dan Henry: It's Russell's. It's like Russell's scripts, but it requires the answers from the survey to plug in. All my ads convert immediately because of this. I do not split test. I just don't because I don't want to split test. I want to find the right customer. I don't want to convince people to buy my stuff. I want to find people already ready to buy my stuff, okay? Then, sales become easy. Cory, he spent $90. He has 12 new patients. Now, he's actually thinking of expanding his practice. He is too busy to even talk to me. This guy was going to shut down his chiropractic practice. Now, he's thinking about opening up a second location. He's starting to consult with other chiropractors and do ads for them. He's killing it, all right? Killing it. I actually got to send you the screen shot. It's a screen shot. Maybe you could put it on your ... Steve Larsen: Yes, yes, yes. I'll put it in the blog. Dan Henry: Yes. It's literally me, talking to him, and I said something like, "Hey, Cory. Can you help out with this thread in the student group about chiropractors." He's like, "I don't have time. I'm so slammed." Then, he told me the story of the credit card and how he was about to close practice. I was like, "What?" The thing is, for certain clients, I can teach you how to get crazy results for them in a couple hours. Yes, now, if you want to watch it on my course, you want to do something like that. I can teach you that, too. That's in the course, but it's going to be more in two hours, okay? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: If you follow a strategy where you focus on psychology, instead of all this crazy button-clicking inside the dashboard, you can get crazy results. I don't look at cost per click. I don't look at click-through rate. All those analytics are turned off in my dashboard. They're all turned off, okay? I swear. I know everybody's right now, freaking out. Steve Larsen: Yes, that's huge. Dan Henry: Some people hate me. Listen, I don't split test. I don't look at cost per click. Don't give a crap what my cost per click is, what my click-through rate is because the way that I do it, I focus solely on conversion in sales. Also, here's something. I'll give you teaser. Do you know how everybody freaks out about targeting? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: Did you know that in some cases, you don't even need to target? Steve Larsen: No, I actually had no idea that you could do that. Dan Henry: Yes, you could actually let Facebook do the work for you, and nobody knows that. Nobody actually realizes that... There are some campaigns I run for local businesses. I don't do any targeting. I got no interest targeting. Steve Larsen: That's pretty big. That's a huge deal. Dan Henry: Yes, listen, listen. If it's popular, it's wrong. Have you ever heard of that? Steve Larsen: Yes. Dan Henry: Okay. I've got at least 50 students that have taken every Facebook ads course under the sun. Hey always tell me, "Holy crap, this is so different, and it works so much better," because I take a psychological approach to Facebook ads. I don't take a button-clicking techie approach... I take a psychological real down-to-earth approach. These people are in their kitchen. They're driving. They're walking down the aisle in the mall, and they see your ad. You're pulling them out of their life. You got to do something. You got to hit them in their brain in order to pull them out of their life and into your world. Steve Larsen: Goat balls. Dan Henry: Yes, goat balls, exactly, pattern interrupt. Yes, hopefully, I've covered a good amount of- Steve Larsen: Man, I can't even believe it. This is fantastic. You're right. This is a complete different approach. It just goes to show. Funnel hacking is awesome, and it sits in this certain realm, you know what I mean? You're given this whole other avenue where you can go and actually be ... You're a pioneer, I feel like, in the Facebook ads. Not a lot of people do this. I don't know anyone else who does this type of strategy. This is awesome. Dan Henry: Well, it's something I learned over time, working with clients because I did the same thing, man. I looked at all the other trainings out there, what everybody says. I just hate this mentality. "Oh, let's tweak, tweak, tweak, test, test, test, test." Yes, there could be a little bit of testing, but here's the thing. You will take all the 99% of all that tweaking and testing out of the equation if you do the damn customer research and what your customer is thinking. You can skip all that because when you split test, that's all you're really doing. You're split testing things, and you're split tests are literally telling you what's connecting with your customer more and more and more. If you just figure that out from the beginning, like I'm on the big Ask Ryan Levesque. My method of customer research is actually similar to the method from Ryan Levesque in Ask. Steve Larsen: It's in the book, yes. Dan Henry: Right, but it's on steroids. Think like Arnold Schwarzenegger, 1960's like, "This is my customer research." Yes, this is totally different, but it's based on the same principles, but it's very specific questions. What I do in my course is when you ask the questions, you just take the popular answers, and you plug them into the script. You plug them into the Facebook ad script, and it just converts. Steve Larsen: Okay, that's amazing. I mean you've certainly taken us through. Dan Henry: I'm really trying to hit. I'm really trying to make sure I get to speak at the next Funnel Hacking Live. Steve Larsen: I will put in a plug. We just sold out yesterday, actually, on that. Yes, yes. Dan Henry: Yes, I had a bunch of people tell me, "I want to go." I have this horrible fear of flying, so I don't really go to the conferences a lot, but if I'm going to get on stage, I'll take a train or something. I do have a horrible fear of flying... Steve Larsen: Man, well, speaking of that, let's go 30,000-foot view then. Yes, I mean you've certainly taken us through the trenches on how you're doing this. Now, just conceptually, just the overall arching strategy that you're using for the people who are, let's say they don't want to go to Facebook ads. What would you tell people to do who are still the pizza boys? You know what I mean? Who don't want to go Facebook route, but they want to do something else, some other product. What's the thing they should go do? Dan Henry: Well, at any point, you're going to probably need to use Facebook ads regardless. You don't have to take on clients. You can sell your own product, but the quickest way to do it is with Facebook ads. I think that would be involved at some point. Steve Larsen: Oh, yes, for sure. I mean as far as their own business creation. Dan Henry: Oh, creating a product creation? Steve Larsen: Yes, how should they get started? Dan Henry: All right. You want my formula? Steve Larsen: Sure. Dan Henry: Okay. Everybody says, "Oh, find a problem and create a solution," or "Find a product and sell as solution." That is so vague, okay? Steve Larsen: It's very vague. Dan Henry: It's so vague. Here's my formula. Ready for it? Steve Larsen: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Dan Henry: Here it is. Find a specific problem for a specific person and create a specific solution while avoiding the common roadblock that that specific person usually runs into with that specific problem. Steve Larsen: You're going to find something specific, but do something different? Dan Henry: Yes, so basically, you want to find a problem that is a problem only for a specific type of person, and you want to create a solution. Here's the, yes, the most important part is your solution has to avoid the common roadblock, okay? I'll give you an example. My course revolves around how to run Facebook ads for clients or your self. The client aspect, what I did with this was I figured out a way to get ... Everybody's big pain point is, "Well, I don't have results yet. I'm learning Facebook ads. I haven't started yet... ...How do I get clients if I don't have any results to show? How do I ever get clients?" Steve Larsen: You do that before the webinar? I mean during it, basically. Dan Henry: Right, so what I do is I show them A: how to get easy clients that you can't possibly screw up, and B; how to get those clients on board before you have any results to show, okay? It's how you pitch them and how you sell them and how you attract them without saying, "Oh, look what I've done," okay? Here's the great part. It's no risk to you or the client. I know that sounds crazy like that's impossible. How do you get a client and make it to where you can get that client without showing a result, but at the same time, you're doing it at very little risk to their bank account or your reputation. Well, I figured out a way to hit all those points. I thought about it for awhile, and I figured it out, okay? That's what I give away on the webinar. Steve Larsen: Yes, I mean that's amazing. You went in, and you found the exact issue. That's not the fluffy issue. Those are the real "What keeps me up at night." I don't want to have more customers. I want less customers with more money, kind of thing. What's that real- Dan Henry: Right, well, you also got to remember that listen, a lot of people, they create an online course... They're like, "This is what I want to do." No. You need to find out what to do, okay? You need to find out. For instance, my first month, when I made $10,000, and I tell you this. The method that I teach on the webinar is like an upgraded version of that because I tweaked it. What I did was when I found out that was what the pain points were, I made sure to create a solution that would actually work for that. What I did was I went into my existing small group of students. I said, "hey, guys." I said, "Do me a favor real quick. Do this thing, and tell me if it works." Everybody is like, "Oh, no. That ain't going to work. That's not going to work. Oh, please." I'm like, "Just shut up and do it." I talked to people by myself literally like, is there anybody that ... You know the goat balls, they get used to it. Literally, that's how I get so much success as well. I'm very abrasive. I will take a wash cloth, put it over your mouth and pour success down your throat if I have to because I need your results so I can sell more courses. I need your results, so I can be the next Tony Robbins. I need your results, so I'm going to freaking drag you kicking and screaming through the mud to success, so don't buy my course if you want to be pampered. I don't pamper, okay? I'm like a freaking drill sergeant... Steve Larsen: Love it. Dan Henry: Basically, what I did was I posted this in my student group. I said, "Do this thing." Everybody did it, and it worked. People started getting clients like crazy. Remember, at this point, this was before I got big, before I launched. This was the small group. I posted it with that. It was about 20 people, and everybody started getting results. Then, that's when I knew it worked. That's when I put it in my webinar, and then I launched, and boom, it went crazy. It works. I had this one guy. He's like 65 years old. He did it, and he got 10 clients or 10 client leads. I think he closed probably half of them within two days of attending the webinar. Dude didn't even buy my course, but whatever. Steve Larsen: That's hilarious, man. Hey, I want to thank you for all the stuff you shared. I mean my gosh, you guys. There's going to be this little button on your phone or computer or whatever that looks like a little half circle with an arrow. It's the repeat button, and I want you to go back and hit it and listen to this again because the value is just insane, absolutely amazing and certainly a prolific leader. Dan, I really appreciate it. I know everyone else does also. Any final words, I guess, as we wrap it up? Dan Henry: Yes, I mean if you want to know about that, here's what I suggest. Get yourself a copy of DotCom Secrets. Get yourself a copy of Ask by Ryan Levesque. Get yourself a copy of the 4-hour Work Week, Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Get all those books. If you want to learn more about what I do and how I do Facebook ads, you can go to danhenry.org and download my cheat sheet: 7 steps to creating, running and profiting from Facebook ads. That cheat sheet is on the website: 7 simple steps to creating, running and profiting from Facebook ads. Don't even remember the name of my own freaking... Steve Larsen: That's okay. You've been going for a while, just drop it at the value, so I appreciate it. The Facebook group also. Dan Henry: Yes, you'll get an invite to superhero entrepreneurs as soon as you opt in. Steve Larsen: Awesome. Dan Henry: You'll get in that way, so danhenry.org. Get the cheat sheet. You'll then get an invite to my group. I'm in my group all the time. I'm going to tell you my whole story in a lot more detail than I went in on here because there's a lot into it. I'm going to tell you my whole story on how I went from broke to this in a 5-day sequence. In that sequence, I'll offer you a chance to watch the webinar. Then, you'll see the webinar. Then, you'll get a bunch of case studies and all of these. If you want to buy the course, go for it. If not, I don't know. Send me chocolates. Steve Larsen: Yes, no, and honestly, you guys should go buy. Dan Henry is the cutting-edge on this stuff, and he's going to stay that way. That's just how who he is and why he teaches what he does. There's been people that built funnels for him like, "Okay, I'm going to build the funnel. You send the traffic." They're like, "Oh, okay. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes." They're just really excited about the funnel. Funnels are great, but they are dead without traffic. You have to have people in them. This is the other part of the pie. It's not even a full thing until you have both sides. You got to have some kind of funnel, somewhere to send people, some sequence, some automation, but if you have not traffic, I mean you're already dead in the water. You might as well not even build a funnel. Go buy his course. Dan Henry: Right. Steve Larsen: Go get his course. Dan Henry: Thank you, Stephen, for the going endorsement. Steve Larsen: Yes, this is not a planned endorsement. It's just this is good. Dan Henry: Yes. Steve Larsen: I appreciate it. Dan Henry: I mean I appreciate you having me on. This is great. I love it. A little early, but I'm sitting here barely awake, but it was absolutely fantastic coming on. This was my favorite podcast to do where I couldn't fly off at the mouth with profanities. There are some podcasts, if you look up, that I just go nuts on because it's just me. That's how I am. Steve Larsen: Yes, yes. That's awesome. Well, hey, thanks so much, Dan. I'd love to meet up again some time in the future and do a follow up. Thanks for listening to Sales Funnel Radio. Please remember to subscribe and leave feedback. Want to get one of today's best internet sales funnel for free? Go to salesfunnelbroker.com/freefunnels to download your free built sales funnel today.

Click above to see in ITunes... If you've never met Liz then there's a little spark missing in your life. She's one of the most inspirational and hard-charging people I've met. Here her wisdom now.. Steve Larsen: Hey how's it going everyone? I am super excited today because I have a special guest on and it's not too often that I get to go interview someone as amazing as Liz Tennyson. How are you doing?  Liz Tennyson: I'm amazing, hi everybody.  Steve Larsen: Good, good, good. I'm laughing still because a lot of people that I interview, it's kind of early in the morning, and their either kind of half dead still or just not very lively and you're already making me laugh. T his is good. Liz, I was wondering just right off the bat. The first time I saw you online, I think it was in the ClickFunnels certified page and you were like just dropping these huge value bombs and I was like, "Oh my gosh, who is this lady? She's killing it." I was wondering, could you tell us a little bit about how you got involved with funnels in general. Liz Tennyson: I was going to say I'm glad you didn't mention, but then I'm going to mention it. My first post in there was me with my silly, I guess it was one of the physical products, the book, that Russell sends out with one of his products. I can't even remember which one, but I never get mail and so it was so fun to get something like in the mail and so then I posted it in the certified partner group and people were laughing at me. The way I got started with the certification program really just started this Spring, I was struggling with- I had my funnel set up but I was using so many different systems and so frustrated because it was taking me forever. I'm one of those people that I like to figure it out on my own. Especially even before I'm hiring somebody to do it, so I was still trying to figure out how to get everything up and I found ClickFunnels. I can't even remember who said, "Liz, you need to get your head on straight and simplify."   That month I moved all my funnels over and we had a really fantastic month and so then I started kind of going, "This is pretty incredible how fast I can create things." I'm an action taker and so then from there-  Steve Larsen: I noticed that... Liz Tennyson: From there it just kind of progressed into I was telling people about it. I was telling people really they should be using ClickFunnels and then the opportunity for the certified partner came up and it just seemed natural. Steve Larsen: Yeah. Liz Tennyson: It wasn't the best time. I have so many things going on with my book and my actual business, but it really, it's on of those things that I just had to do.  Steve Larson: Now what is your actual business? What is it that takes your time? Liz Tennyson: I am a holistic health coach and a personal trainer. I run an organization called I'm A Fit Mormon and so my niche is obviously Mormon woman. Mom's that I help stay healthy and fit. Steve Larsen: Cool. That's awesome. Now obviously ClickFunnel has played into that a lot. Russel and I have been talking a lot about this. It's so hard to define what a funnel is to someone who has no idea what the are you know? Liz Tennyson: Yeah.  Steve Larsen: It's a challenge to do this. Was it for you easy to make the transition over? Liz Tennyson: For me it was. I think I've been doing business for so many years. Even when I owned a FedEx franchise in my 20's.  Steve Larsen: Geez.  Liz Tennyson: It was the same thing in real life... You have to know how to transition a client throughout your process so once I understood how that worked, it just was kind of putting it into the online forum. Even when I help my clients, you know, I know exactly step 1, step 2, step 3. I think that if somebody can get that concept, kind of step back from ClickFunnels for 10 minutes and say, "What do I actually want to do for somebody? What am I actually doing for somebody?" Then you can build a funnel that can do that process. It kind of seemed natural to me... I take about, I don't know, I think last week I took maybe 2 to 3 hours and kind of wrote out you know the process I really wanted... Where I could really serve somebody better, if I was to create this type of funnel. If I was to create a really good sales page. It has to be good because then I want them to use my product that can actually change their life. I think if you step back for just a little bit and do that process. Then the funnel building is a lot easier. Steve Larsen: That's so interesting you say that because I- "What am I doing for someone else and how can I serve them?" That's such a good question to start with cause so many of us, I mean, we all want to make money, but when somebody makes that the pure focus, it's really really hard to actually make the money on there. I almost feel like it's a dog smelling fear. Everyone can tell when you're just there to pull their credit card out of their wallet...  Liz Tennyson: Yeah and you end up with a sales page that's like "buy from me" and nobody knows like where did I find this guy that's just selling- you know? Like just selling me his stuff and that works if maybe you have- I could do that with my community because they love me and they know I put out good stuff, so could build a page that says like, "hey buy my next thing." But it's taken me 2 years to be able to do that and I don't do that because I want them to understand what the products actually going to do for them and the... it's going to take them from. Even though I could pitch a product and make money, it still doesn't serve my community the best and at some point that's going to start diminish if I'm not actually serving them in some way. Steve Larsen: It seems like every entrepreneur goes through that though. Cause obviously you get in to make the money but you're say that it sounded like there was a point where you bridged the gap between you know, "buy buy buy buy buy" and then over to help.  Liz Tennyson: I go through a lot of different scenarios, when I started, I thought it was going to be like a non profit right? Cause I'm like, I felt like "oh I'm such an amazing person and I'm just going to give" and I know that doesn't really work if you don't actually go to be a non-profit and there's no money coming in from like anybody that wants advertised. You have to figure out a new way that I could serve people and that was like writing programs and being able to coach people through the process. At some point, even if it works on the front end, it at some point, you have to cultivate. That's what I love about ClickFunnels too is the culture. It's really, I'm pretty loyal of a person. I've been married 19 years, I have my 4 kids and I've been a member of my church my whole life. I feel like I'm pretty loyal but its hard to get me in. A lot of people pitch me, I have great energy, I really love people so a lot of people pitch me all the time. It's hard to get me in a community. It's hard for me to commit to a community.  I was on the phone with somebody that was actually pitching me this weekend and saying, "Oh, Liz, you would do so much for our community and we really want you." And I said, "you know what? I was just at this incredible event for ClickFunnels and I'm in and I can't really commit to something else because this is where my heart is right now and this is where I want to be and this community is growing really fast. I feel like that I have so much that I could give to the community and people that are coming on to learn how to use ClickFunnels and build their own businesses and that kind of stuff." I just feel like the culture that you build around your product, even if the culture is we build great products, right, so you can keep putting out great stuff that functions well and serves people well. I think is the main bottom line that actually pays so much more on the tail end if you just look at it that way. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. That's really awesome. What about the ClickFunnels community made you that loyal? Most people are in the community but you usually don't go vet communities you know what I mean? That's not something that most people go do. Liz Tennyson: Like I said at the very first, I wasn't really looking for anything, it's not a really if I were to look at it logically, even my husband's like. "Liz, you have your own book coming out." Like in book stores in January. We have a book tour, I am upper level management of my MLM company. I'm traveling around teaching and so it's not like a great time for me to even do this or commit or anything like that but I don't know what it was. It was way before the event this weekend, there was that feeling like this is kind of my, a lot of these people are going to be my family is kind of how I felt. I think maybe in the certified partner program, Nora's done a great job of creating that community with those people and then when I got there this last weekend, I felt so home. I don't know what it is and I'm not saying it's that way for everybody.  I normally don't do that but I felt like I got meet Randall who was the second person after Derek that I was on the phone with for the certified partner program and he has the coolest job to sell to collect. From that conversation, I sent him a card and all this kind of stuff. I'm sure he thinks I'm a total psycho because I keep telling him thank you but to meet him in person was, it meant so much to me. I don't know what it is.  Steve Larsen: Yeah what is that? Why would that- Liz Tennyson: I think, well, so I've worked really hard, I guess I'll tell you my back story. I've worked really hard... I got married at 19. Obviously I've been married 19 years so we can do the math. We immediately started having babies. When you're 19 and you start having babies, you can choose two paths. You can choose college and take in a whole bunch of student loans to practically live. Or you can become and entrepreneur. Those are the two choices. I guess there's a third choice, to like live with family and-  Steve Larsen: Die a slow death.  Liz Tennyson: Totally. My choice was to become an entrepreneur. Miraculously I was hired as a manager at a bank. I don't even- really looking back, I was 20 years old with a baby and they hire me. I worked graveyards while my husband worked days doing construction and we were trying to figure out like what type of business we were going to start. From that process we bought a franchise, we've done a whole bunch of different things. I love the process of MLM. If it's done correctly and I've been building businesses for a long time... Really ... after 19 years ... gosh you got me all excited. Having Randall on the phone I don't know what it was but it was like the universe is just confirmed your hard work matters, you know? You built up to some really incredible things and that phone call was like one of those pivotal things that he told me on the phone he says, "I don't tell people all this all the time" and he just said, "I can tell Liz that your life is going to completely change." And my life was already changing... I'm already a hustler. I'm already doing amazing things... I already create that balance between a mom. I'm there for my kids all the time and I create incredible businesses. I'm able to keep that balance and do some pretty awesome things. Then when he said that and I don't normally, it's so funny, cause I don't normally care about if somebody gives me a compliment you know. My ego isn't really connected to a lot of things and so for him to say that, normally, I'm used to people pitching me so normally I'm like, "yeah yeah". Whatever, yes, like I know I have charisma and I know you want me on your team. You know?  Steve Larsen: This is the only time I've been able to do this. Liz Tennyson: Exactly. There was something, I don't know if it was really ... him or if it was just like everything was cultivated up until that point and I was just completely vulnerable and my heart was open to change. At that moment it was like, "okay here we go, I shouldn't make this commitment but I feel like it's right so I'm going to and I'm going to let everything else ride after this."  I'm pretty good at making business decisions, I don't chase the shiny object... You know, I'm pretty solid and loyal and to the commitments that I make. It was like it was, "yeah lets just do this" I wasn't all in. I just I don't know what it was. It was good, solid people. I guess. Russell's built an amazing team and this weekend begin able to meet so many of those people, really, I don't know if you can call it, changed my heart, I don't know. Steve Larsen: Yeah yeah.  Liz Tennyson: It just felt so solid. Steve Larsen: That's awesome because most people do not want to meet their salesman. You know what I mean?  Liz Tennyson: I know and it was so funny because my husband was like, "maybe he's just really good at his job Liz, like maybe he's just a really good salesman." And I said, "Well he is a really good salesman and I respect that about him." But he also like- Steve Larsen: But he's a real person too, he's not being fake with you. Liz Tennyson: The connection we have, like he listened, which is really important to me if somebody listens. He listened to every single thing. He even asked me, "Liz, you're a really exciting person... ...Are you a shiny object type?" You know?  Steve Larsen: Yeah. Liz Tennyson: He really wanted to build with the certified partner program people that are committed. People that were a good fit for ClickFunnels and so he was vetting me to make sure that I wasn't flighty and gonna take off after I got really excited. Cause I want people that are gonna finish and actually become certified. I was glad that he did that. Steve Larsen: You know I remember ... I have two thought here. Trying to figure out which one to go for. I remember when I went to that last event. That last funnel hacker event. I was actually in college and it was my last week of college and I didn't have a way to get there and so I traded someone a funnel. I built a funnel for them and they paid for my plain ticket, a ticket to get in and two nights of a hotel and so I kind of just fended for myself for the others and stayed up all night in the basement of the Sheraton the last night there. What was funny was I remember getting on the plane just going there and for some reason having that feeling like, I feel like my life is going to change. You know?  Liz Tennyson: Yeah. Steve Larsen: I didn't work for ClickFunnels at the time. Russel had no idea who I was, anything like that. That's not even how it changed it was just something inside though for sure that I don't know what it was. I came back and that was actually the first time my wife looked at me and she goes, "You seem happy." I was like, "Was I not seeming that way before?" I didn't know that I wasn't appearing as happy beforehand but I guess she was like "it was a physical difference."  At the time I was going to go work for another guy. I won't say the name or anything in case he listens to this but she goes- As soon as I came back there was some other issue with this other guy I was going to go work for and she was like, "It was like this switch that flipped and you immediately went back to this other person and I realized that unless we go try and get you, find a way for you to work for Clickfunnels, I want the version of my husband that came home from that event." I don't want the other one.  Anyways, not to digress on that, I'm just completely agreeing with you. It was a life-changing thing for me. It's a very special thing for sure. I wanted to point out and say congrats by the way. At the last event, you won the best funnel right? Liz Tennyson: Thank you thank you, I'm raising my hands right now. Steve Larsen: I can see you actually. Woo. Liz Tennyson: Taking my virtual reward. Steve Larsen: Tell us about it. That's awesome. That's a big deal. Liz Tennyson: That was really fun. I knew that we would have some type of funnel hacking. The people from June's event kind of told me about it but until you get there you don't know what it really is. You don't know who the business owner's are... When you get there, you know, you go through the day and then business owner's tell you a little bit about their business. Then Nora says, "Okay, you have until tomorrow morning to build them a functioning funnel."  Steve Larsen: Woo. Liz Tennyson: Right?  Steve Larsen: That's exciting. Liz Tennyson: Then tomorrow you will present it to the owners and they'll pick a winner and hopefully we'll get some really great stuff that they can actually use. Then there was two owners and she put names in a hat and pulled out names who had which owner and so we were lucky enough to get ... he owns a flooring company in Idaho and he was incredible. His name was Matt and we got to pick a partner so somebody had come over and Michelle said, "Hey do you want to be my partner?" And we were super excited. Then that night you get the opportunity to just sit and talk to the owner. What was really cool is because I love to listen, right, to what the needs are, I had to ask him- He's incredible person and he's a genius and kind of he already knows about ClickFunnels. He had five ideas. Five funnels that he wanted built, but we had to create one. The night pretty much consisted of, "okay what funnel is most important? Let's get very clear on what funnel is most important to you." It turns out the funnel that was most important to him was to get people from the area, from Boise, Eagle and Meridian into his store. He said that numerous times that that was the most important. I love, I know how to do Facebook ads and I know how to do targeting and research for that.  With those skills, we created a funnel that was for him that was getting people into the store and it was only for those three areas and we him do a video for the front page and a coupon that they could bring in to the store that after they opted in, they could download the coupon. Then we showed him a little bit of how to target those homeowners. We showed him how to target different home values with people so he could run some new ads to get people into his store.  It was really fun... We had a tough competition though. There were so many talented people there and when they would go up, I was pretty com- I don't like to think I'm competitive, like I'm okay if I lose, if somebody does an amazing job to beat me. Steve Larsen: You're okay losing, but not really.  Liz Tennyson: I'm like a good loser. My husband is a terrible loser. I often just lose on purpose so we can just stay married. Steve Larsen: I've totally done that before. Liz Tennyson: We almost got divorced like after year one from playing Monopoly. We can not have this game in this house.  Steve Larsen: It's chess with us. I purposefully have lost many times to that game cause otherwise- Anyways, anyways.  Liz Tennyson: Anyways, besides that. There were some really talented people and as they were going up I thought, "Oh I want to be able to do this in the next funnel" because they had some really great ideas and really great converting processes. Then the owners chose the winners. That was really fun... Steve Larsen: Do you mind taking us through the funnel that you built and why you did that? Usually focus so much on the funnel side and you're like funnel funnel funnel you know its hearing more about the Facebook ad and how that moved through the funnel. That might be kind of cool if you don't mind? Liz Tennyson: For me, I have a lot of people, especially in the last couple months, I have highly converting funnels for myself and so people will say, "Okay can you do that for me?" The first thing I say is, "Do you know who you're selling to? Do you know who you're going to target? Because if I build you a funnel and you don't know who's going to see it, you're not going to make any money."  Steve Larsen: That's true.  Liz Tennyson: Right? If you can't direct traffic to it, Russel even talked about this in the first session of the certified partner. If you can't drive traffic and actually have people see your funnel, it's going to be really hard for it to convert because there's not going to be anybody to convert.  For that process the first thing we did is find out in the Facebook ads insights there's a way that, obviously this is like a whole class of itself. You can search home owners, you can search people even that want to do home renovation. Those types of things, we searched house values so we did, I think it was 150 to 275 and then 275-500 are the two different groups that we had we targeted women cause they're usually the ones making the choice of changing the flooring in the house. We did create because this business owner, we're going to figure out him how to target and speak it correctly without it hurting anybodies feelings but a lot of moms that are nesting that are having their first baby, he finds that they come in and want new flooring, they want to change their house.  Being able to help build him a list of pregnant moms in the area, own homes I think is a pretty targeted group that if you can get the message clear then it would be a really highly converting funnel for him. Going through that the most important thing for him was that he is amazing. That he gives out spot cleaner. You can go in for the life of your carpet you can refill the spot cleaner from him. That is an amazing bonus.  Steve Larsen: Is that a front end or something?  Liz Tennyson: It's a back end to get people to know that's the service- that's like a bonus that's like unannounced that you just get from him. Steve Larsen: Awesome.  Liz Tennyson: The biggest point of the funnel from him was social proof. He is big in his community. His mom started the company so they've been around for years. Right now all of the traffic that they get is from referrals, they have amazing reviews. He has done, before he came to the event, he had some great SEO done so he ranks #1 on Google and he just has a ton of reviews on there that are all amazing.  Social proof is a big deal... We needed him on the page. Him because he represents the company and he really wants to be known in the area as the expert. To make a video just about flooring would not have met his needs. So putting him on the video to introduce himself to start to cultivate that relationship, to start to cultivate that trust, was really important. Then at the top of the page, it said, "Do you live in" I'll have to look at the funnel again. I think it says, "Do you live" or "Are you from Boise, Meridian, or Eagle?"  Steve Larsen: Mm-hmm (affirmative) cleaver. Liz Tennyson: Because he doesn't want any leads from anywhere else.  Steve Larsen: That's awesome.  Liz Tennyson: If they get to that page and they're not from that then they'll go away right?  Steve Larsen: Yeah. Liz Tennyson: He's not going to get leads that are not targeted, he's not going to get leads that are going to waste is time and waste their time. Right? If they're not from that area, they're not going to need his flooring. He doesn't want to expand because he knows that they area that he lives in is big enough that he doesn't have to expand to different areas, besides those three.  Then below that was just an opt in that was "Hey get your free coupon, come in to meet Matt for the flooring needs." The things it had on the opt in though that were required was name, email and it had a drop down that they could tell him, "I am from Eagle, I am from Meridian, I am from Boise." He would have that info so then he could create a segmented list for just Boise people. That kind of stuff. That was really really really important to him.  We didn't get the chance to do it but in our presentation we talked to him about, "you know obviously we would be doing Facebook pixels and stuff like that to do retargeting just to those people" and then the coupon. Then at the very very bottom was-  Steve Larsen: Was this like an opt in page then or? Liz Tennyson: Yeah its just like a video opt in page and then at the very bottom was a really cool thing for people that are creating social proof. It was connected to his Facebook page so when people even go to that page, it will start to collect to those comments and just create more social proof for him which is really important. Steve Larsen: It was kind of like... now would he go and follow up after? Cause this sounds like a really simple, but powerful funnel. Was it two pages?  Liz Tennyson: It was just two pages and then the download that they could click to get the download for the coupon.  It was just an opt in and a thank you.  Steve Larsen: The reason I bring that in is because some people think like these funnels have to be huge just so many things you've got to put in it and you've got to have three up sells and a down sell and often, no, you don't. I've been building for real estate and they're just 2 pages but they're so powerful. It's the way you use them. The messages. I love that that's what you focus on. The messaging. Liz Tennyson: Yeah well and the most important thing for him, once we figured out, this is what I want it to do. This is the most important thing. Of course you can build other funnels for different functions right? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Liz Tennyson: You could say like, we could've made like a sales page or send them to sales page like "hey and we have a carpet sale" right? Steve Larsen: Yeah. Liz Tennyson: He didn't want to do that. That was cheesy to him. He wasn't interested in putting anything on sale because his stuff is highly valuable and he doesn't have to put stuff on sale. To drive traffic a lot of time ... even for me and this is a really good thing that people should be writing this down right now. For me I built a Facebook page for my community because I am a social, like I am building a community. I started building this Facebook page and I was just on my Facebook and was like "hey we have a free support group" and people were going there and then I realized I don't have anybodies information. Everybody in the Facebook group, yeah it's cool if they see my post in my Facebook group but I'm never going to be able to get in contact with them. At all, besides that Facebook group. Then I created literally one page, right? That is for me, that says, you know they go there and they put in their information and then they get to click the button and it takes them right to Facebook page where they can ask to gain access. Then I have the information and I have a list that's like my Facebook group people that opted in for the free support group and I can build a list on that.  Having that functionality I think a lot of people discount the value that that can actually bring you in your business. It works great for social proof...  It works great for anybody building in a community or a lifestyle business. A lot of times people just go to "it's really important to sell." Just do like an opt in, take them straight to a sales page and for me it's been so much more profitable to do this lead page, add value, then more people buy. When they actually see my up sell and my down sell. That's like a totally different funnel and a totally different product that serves a different purpose. Steve Larsen: How are you breaking even on ad costs usually? Cause that's something usually that as far as funnel methodology goes is usually pounded into us upfront. I guess it sounds like you're putting them in a normal Facebook group itself.  Liz Tennyson: Yeah so I put them into the Facebook group itself but I also sell. Steve Larsen: Mm-hmm (affirmative)  Liz Tennyson: Right from my page I do have a running ad, for me, for my lifestyle company- Steve Larsen: Oh cool. Liz Tennyson: That is you know a recipe book, I have my- I even run ads to get people to know my page exist. I spend money on that every single day that doesn't make me any money except that it gets them to my Facebook page which then they can have a social group and....  Steve Larsen: I'm sorry we've got someone right out the window. Liz Tennyson: I'm looking around my room like, I don't think that's me.  Steve Larsen: Nope so I'm using, maybe I'll pause it in actual recording right here cause. It's the same lady, anyways yesterday, Russel was on a call with someone and he ... this lady always comes at the exact same time that we're always doing anything that has to do with recording at all, ever. She's always like trimming the hedges. It's never like she's mowing the lawn or something like that. She's trimming hedges- Liz Tennyson: On the other side of the window.  Steve Larsen: Literally- and she gives us the dirtiest looks on the other side of the window.  Liz Tennyson: Yeah, it is funny. You know if people don't know this is the way business works, they haven't been in business long enough. Like to have just like ... really? Like this is happening right now? That's just the way it works. Steve Larsen: She just stepped back into the parking and she like put her hands on her hips and she's like tilting her head making sure that it's all level. She doesn't know I'm in here right now looking at her.  Liz Tennyson: I'm pretty sure that she sees that you're in there. Let me see, is he still on that call? Let me go back and try it again.  Steve Larsen: I don't know she's wearing sunglasses and it's like dark out still. We're almost done, we're not done.  Liz Tennyson: That's just amazing. I feel like you need to go get a picture. Steve Larsen: And ... woo okay we're done.  Liz Tennyson: Okay she's done awesome. Steve Larsen: So for a 1:38, for a while. Anyways ... so- Liz Tennyson: I'm going to just really finish and say that I think that a lot of people, so they try to make things complex for two reasons. One they really don't, they just want to make money. Right? They're thinking of all the different ways. How are all these different ways that I can break even and make money right? Or two, they don't really have that idea of like, what is this function going to do for me? Like what is, if I build this funnel, what is it going to do for the person observing and what is it going to do for me? Where am I going to lead them? I think that that, being able to target correctly, saves me tons of money. Being able to do that research, spending time doing the research, if you don't want to spend the time yourself, pay somebody to do it. Right? Because you will save so much money on ad spent. Because I target the exact person that wants what I have.  Steve Larsen: Yeah.  Liz Tennyson: If you're not targeting that and you're just like "ah I don't know, like women would probably want this." You're going to waste so much money. Being able to target more specifically will save so much more money on the back end. Steve Larsen: That's awesome. I know we've been going a little while today and I just want to thank you so much for this. I actually wanted to ask, where can people find your book? That's not a small thing to go through and write a book. Liz Tennyson: So awesome. I want to tell you, although it was ClickFunnels that wrote the book. It was because I built an incredible funnel. It was before I even knew, like I didn't even know about free plus shipping. I just did a JV with somebody that wrote an original book and nobody had read his book and so he pitched me on it and I was like, "yeah that's exactly what I teach, that's what my books going to be about."   I built a funnel and I built it into a really easy group coaching program, that they got the book and they got the program and that first month, that first two weeks, I didn't even know how to like- we had it on Amazon. I didn't even know how to get it to people. When they were buying it, I literally using a gift card to in my Amazon account that was like shipping to someone else, so I have like 500 names in my Amazon account with their name addresses. Cause I didn't know. I didn't know how awesome the funnel was going to be... We sold over 580 books in two weeks and the only reason we didn't continue it is because I literally, I had two teenagers on different laptops, placing orders. I wasn't set up to be able to have 500 people buy. Because of that, the publisher was like, "Okay, we need to publish your book." They contacted me, which was awesome because two years ago they didn't care what I had to say. It was fun to actually prove like, "Hey I do know what I'm saying." I can help a lot of people and my book needs to be on bookshelves. That will be in mostly the Utah, Idaho area. Barnes and Noble does our book, Sams Club, Costco in the end December and in January. Of course it will be online, so I'm A Fit Mormon is the community and then of course I have my own personal Facebook page which is Liz Tennyson and yeah that's how they can find me.  Steve Larsen: Now what's the name of the book? Is it I'm A Fit Mormon.  Liz Tennyson: No so it's called Fit For Good. It's not even specifically for Mormons I just obviously have that niche that I speak to and help but it's Christian based, it's really with the premise to take anybody, not just women. Anybody from the idea of like weight loss and eating low calories right? Cause that's what the world tells us is part of like heath... To actually what's the intention behind wanting to get fit, what's the intention for me, I want to serve as many people as I can and I need a ton of energy. I need to feel good, I need to think clearly and so for me, that's my intention. That's the reason I stay healthy, that's the reason I stay fit. Taking people from the way the world tells people to be healthy, like the world tells you- Steve Larsen: A weird way to do it. Liz Tennyson: And to sabotage your body and beat yourself up and then don't eat anything, to okay, eat with intention with consciousness, pay attention to what you're doing functionality wise to be having your blood pump in your body and letting all your organs be able to do their own job. It's not like a boring holistic book, but it is a Christian based book... I talk a lot about being able to serve more people and being able to really feel and get inspiration from God that we can really go out and do a lot of good things and be healthy. It's called Fit For Good and it will be ready at the end of the year. Steve Larsen: Why is she back? She's looking at the same bush. Liz Tennyson: I just can't. Steve Larsen: This is crazy. Anyways, I want to thank you very much for jumping on this... I always take notes, I literally have a full page of notes. All the stuff that you said, "you focus on what is the actual funnel going to be doing for people", "build a culture around the product is really important", "do you know who you're selling to specifically and how it saves lots of money", you mentioned, which is awesome, "don't chase the shiny object", "stop, don't be so complex, be simple". Russell actually sat me down and had to talk about that a while ago cause I was all over the place. As soon as I did though and focused stuff started happening. It's fantastic.  Liz Tennyson: Yeah.  Steve Larsen: Anyways, thank you so much for all you've done. Fit For Good is the name of the book, they can go to I'm A Fit Mormon dot com  Liz Tennyson: Dot org Steve Larsen: Dot org. I'm a Fit Mormon dot org. Cool is there anywhere else people should go to follow you?  Liz Tennyson: Just on Facebook. I do all my stuff on Facebook or Instagram. Under Liz Tennyson and then I'm a Fit Mormon. Steve Larsen: Thanks so much Liz I appreciate you taking your time.  Liz Tennyson: Thank you. Steve Larsen: This was super fun.  Liz Tennyson: Thank you have a great. Steve Larsen: You too. Liz Tennyson: Bye bye.