The Secret History of the Future

With so much online content, it can be hard for a meme to stay in the collective consciousness for more than a few days. But one meme this year managed to capture seemingly everyone's attention - and challenge the definition of a meme altogether.  Guest: Kate Lindsay, host of Slate's ICYMI podcast.  If you want to support more of this reporting, in 2026 and beyond, consider signing up for Slate Plus. You'll enjoy ad-free listening across the Slate network, early access to tickets for live events, and you'll never hit the paywall on the site. We're on a mission to get 100 people to join Slate Plus before the new year—and we're even offering a 50-percent-off deal to folks who join us right now. Visit Slate.com/whatnextplus and use the code TBD50 to get a year of Slate Plus for $59. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by internet culture writer Kat Tenbarge to break down the most important internet moments of 2025. But not just any internet moments—specifically, the moments that fall under the three key themes that emerged in online culture over the past twelve months: brain rot, surveillance, and big tech dystopia. These themes not only defined how we lived life online in 2025, but have set the stage for what to expect in 2026. Were we wrong about the Astronomer CEO debacle? Will TikTok ever get banned? Is 6-7 finally over? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay, with help from AC Valdez. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's encore episode, hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by Slate staff writer Aymann Ismail to discuss the controversial YouTube channel, Jubilee. A video of political commentator Mehdi Hasan debating 20 far-right republicans has gone viral, but as Ismail argues in his piece for Slate, it also crossed a line. When political disagreement becomes content and extremism is rewarded with clicks, everybody loses.  This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by comedian and writer Youngmi Mayer to talk about a controversy that's divided TikTok: How should Asian people feel about white people in Asian grocery stores? That's the question creator Madeline Qi didn't even mean to ask when she posted her now-viral video, which resulted in call-outs, doxxing, and, ultimately, a conversation too nuanced for TikTok. Youngmi's attempts to make sense of the discourse on her Substack ended up going viral on Instagram, so she came on the show to share what people misunderstand about the controversy, and how her own experience being mixed white and Asian contributes to her perspective. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay, with help from AC Valdez. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

While the A.I. boom has created a data center boom, rich guys are turning their computing dreams to the skies. With its impending IPO, SpaceX stands to lead the extraterrestrial data center boom. Will it work out for Elon and company?  Guest: Eric Berger, space reporter at Ars Technica Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by culture writer Angelina Mazza to discuss the online reaction to the new HBO series, Heated Rivalry. Before the Canadian show premiered, let alone was picked up in the U.S., a dedicated online fandom committed to helping it succeed. Why did this show become such a sensation, and what happens to a niche fandom when their subject suddenly goes mainstream? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay, with help from AC Valdez. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Whole Foods based its brand on a certain standard of quality—but there are some things that shoppers nevertheless want. Amazon believes it has found a way to keep the shelves looking like Whole Foods, while getting you the Tide PODS  and Cheez-Its you deeply desire. Guest: Peyton Bigora, staff reporter for Grocery Dive Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by Gen Z expert and After School writer Casey Lewis to talk about how Gen Z TikTok users are switching up on Millennials. After years of mocking the generation for being “cringe” online, now people are longing to return to the 2010s and the culture that came with it. But were Millennials really as “optimistic” as the fancams make it seem? And what does Gen Z have, if anything, to be nostalgic about?  This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The good news is voters are more persuaded by factual claims than emotional appeals or appeals to fear. But the bad news is that A.I. chatbots, trying to convince you, will keep making factual claims long after it runs out of actual facts. Guest: David Rand, professor of information science, marketing and psychology at Cornell University Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Today's TikTok influencers share every aspect of their lives: from their morning routines, to getting ready to go out, to their parents being detained and eventually deported by ICE. Guest:  Tony Vara, TikTok creator @itonyvara Want more What Next? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and across all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by senior reporter at Bloomberg Businessweek, Amanda Mull, to talk about how the enshittification of online shopping came for Etsy. The platform used to be a thoughtful reprieve from the cheap, mass-produced products on Amazon, but now it's plagued by a number of the same problems. With cheap junk and AI allegations abound, where can the Shein and Temu-haters go to actually find what they're shopping for? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Donald Trump—or at least the tech guys who have his ear—is ready to clear the regulatory runway for A.I. but other Republicans aren't too sure. Can he bring them around? Or will the bubble burst first? Guest: Gerrit De Vynck, tech reporter for the Washington Post. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by culture writer Mikala Jamison to talk about the rise in online concern about celebrities' bodies. Mikala writes the newsletter Body Type, and her forthcoming book The Forever Project details her recovery from an eating disorder. Following the premiere of movies like Wicked: For Good, fan concern and speculation about celebrity bodies has culminated in a larger discussion about the return of “this is in.” But did “thin” really ever go away? And what is the right way, if any, to talk about it? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A tech mogul who made bank from Paypal with his Stanford buddies and has endeared himself to right-wing politicians and enriched himself the same way? No not him; this one's South African..no, not him either. Guest: Ryan Mac, reporter for the New York Times.  Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by senior supervising producer Daisy Rosario to unpack the 25-part TikTok saga titled the “Danish Deception.” After a former Bachelor contestant came forward with a story about her scamming ex, TikTok turned on her instead. Why didn't Onyeka get the Reesa Teesa treatment? And who is the real villain of this story? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As the U.S. upgrades and updates its defense and military systems, the question isn't whether A.I. will be integrated, but where, how much, and how much decision-making are we ceding to the machine? Guest: Josh Keating, senior correspondent at Vox and a fellow at the Outrider Foundation where he's reporting on nuclear weapons and AI. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by creator and social media manager Carmen Vicente to chat about the rise of offline hobbies, and how crafts, DVDs, and something called an “analog bag” are being used as acts of rebellion against an overly plugged-in society. But does this really mean the beginning of the end of social media? Probably not. Instead, Carmen shares how apps as we know them are about to change.  This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Note: This episode was originally published on July 27, 2025.  There's an entire economy devoted to seeing what products are trending—clothing, skin care, even Greek Islands—and delivering you a cheaper knock-off to buy. Guest: Mia Sato, reporter for The Verge Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by I

Hosts Alex Kirshner, Lindsay Gibbs, and Ben Lindbergh speak with the Athletic's Paul Tenorio on why Apple TV and MLS revised their deal and removed the paywall for viewers. They're then joined by Massachusetts state senator John Keenan about his proposal to regulate online sports betting and why he's changed his views on the issue. Finally, they wrap with a discussion of Connor Bedard and Macklin Celebrini, the young hockey phenoms leading the NHL in scoring. Lindsay has an Afterball on the one New York team that is actually good: Gotham FC. On the bonus episode available exclusively for Slate Plus members, the panel discusses the abysmal football on display from both the New York Jets and Giants. Apple and MLS (6:00): Tear down the wall Regulating Big Gaming (25:41): Mass. state senator John Keenan wants to rein in sports betting Hockey's Young Guns (51:36): Shooting it out for the Art Ross trophy Afterballs (1:07:04): The Bats win it (Note: time codes are only accurate for Slate Plus members, who listen ad-free.) Get more Hang Up and Listen with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Hang Up and Listen and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Hang Up and Listen show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/hangupplus for access wherever you listen. You can email us at hangup@slate.com. Podcast production and editing by Kevin Bendis, with production assistance from Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Tracking a license plate across the country has never been easier, which is good news if your car has been stolen, but in an era of ICE and Border Patrol raids, these warrantless searches feel increasingly invasive—and unconstitutional. Guest: Joseph Cox, co-founder of 404 Media and host of the 404 Media podcast. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by porn historian Noelle Perdue, author of the Porn World newsletter. OpenAI announced that they'd allow adult users to have erotic conversations with ChatGPT, just one more way AI and porn are becoming intertwined. As sex becomes more online, not only does it become more solitary, but also more surveilled. Both of these things are intended to divide us, but Noelle is confident that AI's attempted sex-takeover will fail.  This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trump promised to stop the “persecution” of the cryptocurrency industry. He did call off the SEC investigations that began under Biden, and pardoned Binance cofounder and ex-CEO Changpeng Zhao. But is the crypto industry ultimately better off because of that?  Guest: David Yaffe-Bellany, tech reporter for the New York Times. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by New York Magazine feature writer, Rebecca Jennings, to discuss the two internet villains currently trying to get back in the internet's good graces. First, there's former Try Guy Ned Fulmer, who was ousted from the group after having an affair with an employee, and has now relaunched his YouTube channel as well as his own podcast. Then, Colleen Ballinger, also known as MirandaSings, appeared on Tea Time with Raven Symone and Miranda Maday to discuss allegations that she had interacted inappropriately with her fans. In both cases, fans have rejected their attempts to return. So why do they keep coming back? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The parent company of Facebook and Instagram, Meta, doesn't (just) have a scam problem—with 10 percent of its revenue coming from scam ads, and a third of all successful scams in America using a Meta platform at some point, it's more an interdependence with scammers. Guest: Jeff Horwitz, tech reporter for Reuters. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by writer and content creator Josh Lora, who also goes by TellTheBees. Josh's Substack essay, Boyfriendland, was cited in the viral Vogue article written by Chanté Joseph, “Is Having a Boyfriend Embarrassing Now?” Many women are hiding their boyfriends online, or losing followers if they hard-launch. Some go as far as to say having a boyfriend “feels republican.” Is this heterofatalism gone too far, or a long-overdue correction to the patriarchy? This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

They don't cut cleanly along party lines, but data centers, and where they get built, became an election issue in Virginia. With so many more data centers to build, are we looking at a new trend?  Guest: Margaret Barthel, reporter covering northern Virginia for WAMU.  Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Why would Elon Musk attempt to replace Wikipedia—which is already quite futuristic, utopian and accurate—with a faulty, hallucinatory A.I.-powered “Grokipedia”? Well, see, he called it “Wokepedia…” Guest: Stephen Harrison, writer, tech lawyer, author of “Why Editing Wikipedia Is Becoming More Dangerous” for Slate and The Editors, a novel about Wikipedia. Want more What Next? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and across all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by Yahoo News senior entertainment writer, Kelsey Weekman, to answer the question on everyone's lips: Who is Alex Warren and why is every store playing his music? The Hype House OG is nominated for Best New Artist at the Grammys, and is part of a growing wave of musicians making “secular praise music.” Where did Alex Warren come from, and how did he pull off a musical career pivot when so many other TikTokkers failed?  This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Tesla shareholders just approved a trillion dollar (with a t!) pay package for Elon Musk. Is it enough incentive to keep him around the company and away from verbal spats with government officials? Because the whole Musk empire is still reeling from that dalliance. Guest: Faiz Siddiqui, tech reporter at The Washington Post and author of Hubris Maximus: the Shattering of Elon Musk. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by Manny Fidel, culture writer and cohost of the No Such Thing podcast, to explain how gambling took over the internet. A recent betting scandal not only exposed the chokehold that gambling has on the sports industry, but opened up a larger conversation about how everything on the internet is influenced by gambling. People are betting political candidates and arbitrary fashion choices, all while putting themselves further and further into financial precarity. How did this happen and, most importantly, can anything be done to fix it? This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Benjamin Frisch, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Nick Fuentes—an openly antisemitic, openly racist, openly sexist type who once was persona non grata in all but the unseemliest of online spaces—sat down with former Fox News star Tucker Carlson this week, setting off a debate between the “whoa whoa whoa, we're not Nazis over here” branch of conservatives and the “well now, hold on a minute” wing. Guest: Ali Breland, staff writer for The Atlantic and author of “The Firewall Against Nick Fuentes Is Crumbling.”  Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by Slate contributing editor Angelina Mazza to explain why Christian creators are throwing away their Hatch alarm clocks. The company's Halloween commercial was so spooky that it was accused of having “demonic ties,” and now people are claiming they hear voices coming out of the device. The question is not, “Is the devil really hiding inside of a $200 alarm clock?” But rather, “Why do Christians keep thinking the devil is in their technology in the first place?” This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by producer Vic Whitley-Berry, whose favorite animated shows like Hazbin Hotel have been funded by the internet—not big studios. In fact, as major studios consolidate and cut resources for animation, platforms like Patreon and YouTube are keeping the genre afloat. If we don't continue to support independent artists, then crude animated musicals about religious trauma and pegging won't get the audience they deserve! Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

One legacy of the internet is the millions of subcultures that it helps flourish. Another is pornography—and lots of it. At a “gooner meet-up,” the two collide.  Guest: David Kolitz, author of “The Goon Squad” for Harper's Magazine. Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by Jonquilyn Hill, host of Vox's Explain It To Me podcast. The pair chat about how the internet used to celebrate Halloween, from spooky Twitter display names to Snapchat filters, and why no one wants to be earnest online anymore. However, today's internet is still filled with plenty of scary stuff, with r/nosleep still going strong, ghost sightings going viral on TikTok, and LinkedIn. That's it. Just LinkedIn.  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For years, conservatives claimed that the Biden administration was pressuring tech companies to censor conservative speech with no solid evidence.  In Trump 2.0, the administration is explicitly bragging about doing the very same thing they accused democrats of. What gives?  Guest: Renée DiResta, Associate Research Professor at the McCourt School of Public Policy at Georgetown and author of “Invisible Rulers: The People Who Turn Lies into Reality” Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by writer and streamer Laura Kate Dale to talk about what happened to Emiru at this year's TwitchCon. The streamer was assaulted during a meet-and-greet, after a number of female streamers had already dropped out of the convention in fear for their safety. What is it about TwitchCon that makes creators feel unsafe, and why are female streamers, in particular, still paying the price?  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week's AWS outage illustrates just how fragile and vulnerable our interconnected world really is—and how far we've fallen from the vision of a decentralized internet.  Guest: Samanth Subramanian, author of “The Web Beneath the Waves: The Fragile Cables That Connect Our World.” Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Evan Campbell, and Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by Slate staff writer Luke Winkie to talk about Twitch streamer Hasan Piker, who some viewers have accused of shocking his dog on his livestream. Winkie spent time with Piker and his dog, Kaya, for Slate earlier this year, and helps debunk the misinformation currently being spread by cloutchasers and right-wing media figures alike. He also answers the most important question of them all: Just how soft is Kaya's fur, exactly? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hosts Alex Kirshner, Lindsay Gibbs, and Ben Lindbergh are joined by Nate Silver, founder of FiveThirtyEight and Silver Bulletin, to discuss his new NFL prediction model “ELWAY” and what it reveals about an unpredictable football league. Later in the show, OG Hang Up host Stefan Fatsis returns to talk about his new book on the dictionary, “Unabridged: The Thrill of and Threat to the Modern Dictionary,” and to share some of his favorite sports word definitions. The panel also previews the upcoming NBA season. Stefan sticks around to give a throwback style introduction to Ben's Afterball on the goofy mule-kicker comedy “Gus”. On the bonus episode available exclusively for Slate Plus members, the panel has GOAT talk aboutShohei Ohtani. NFL (3:54): The tricky world of football forcasting NBA (26:33): Will Wemby be great? Fatsis is back! (45:18): The prodigal host is unabridged Afterballs (1:05:08: Hee-haw (Note: time codes are only accurate for Slate Plus members, who listen ad-free.) Get more Hang Up and Listen with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Hang Up and Listen and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Hang Up and Listen show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/hangupplus for access wherever you listen. You can email us at hangup@slate.com. Podcast production and editing by Kevin Bendis, with production assistance from Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hosts Alex Kirshner, Lindsay Gibbs, and Ben Lindbergh are joined by Nate Silver, founder of FiveThirtyEight and Silver Bulletin, to discuss his new NFL prediction model “ELWAY” and what it reveals about an unpredictable football league. Later in the show, OG Hang Up host Stefan Fatsis returns to talk about his new book on the dictionary, “Unabridged: The Thrill of and Threat to the Modern Dictionary,” and to share some of his favorite sports word definitions. The panel also previews the upcoming NBA season. Stefan sticks around to give a throwback style introduction to Ben's Afterball on the goofy mule-kicker comedy “Gus”. On the bonus episode available exclusively for Slate Plus members, the panel has GOAT talk aboutShohei Ohtani. NFL (3:54): The tricky world of football forcasting NBA (26:33): Will Wemby be great? Fatsis is back! (45:18): The prodigal host is unabridged Afterballs (1:05:08: Hee-haw (Note: time codes are only accurate for Slate Plus members, who listen ad-free.) Get more Hang Up and Listen with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Hang Up and Listen and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Hang Up and Listen show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/hangupplus for access wherever you listen. You can email us at hangup@slate.com. Podcast production and editing by Kevin Bendis, with production assistance from Patrick Fort. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices