The Gist

Today on the Gist, The former President of Estonia on Russia's aggression and German obstruction. And news that SCOTUS's Breyer will retire inspires a Spiel about domestic obstructionism. Produced by Joel Patterson Email us at thegist@mikepesca.com To advertise on the show, visit: https://advertisecast.com/TheGist  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Dartmouth professor Brendan J. Nyhan looks at polls showing Americans endorse violence and says those findings are off. But there's still a lot to worry about. And in the Spiel, a troubling but little-remarked-upon argument made in the Derek Chauvin defense resurfaces in the Federal trial of former Minneapolis Police Officers. Podcast production by Joel Patterson Email us at thegist@mikepesca.com To advertise on the show, visit: https://advertisecast.com/TheGist  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, America may be poised for revolution. Or not. We're certainly obsessed with talking about it. In the interview, Mike speaks with Stephen Marche, author of The Next Civil War: Dispatches from the American Future. Marche sets the chances of a civil war at 67%. Mike challenges him by asking why this moment is so different from dozens of inflection points since the actual Civil War. In the Spiel, a commitment to keeping the Gist a place free of catastrophizing, while not minimizing the number of very real problems we face. Podcast production by Joel Patterson Email us at thegist@mikepesca.com To advertise on the show, visit: https://advertisecast.com/TheGist  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Gist Returns on Monday, January 24 for Season 2. Today, Mike recounts the guiding principles of Season 1 ( i.e. the first 1400 episodes), and delivers a promise of rigor and independence for Season 2.  To advertise on the show, visit: https://advertisecast.com/TheGist  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Mike is out this week, so we’re digging in the archives for some of our best interviews. In the interview, Mike is joined by author, comedian, podcast host, and actor Michael Ian Black to talk about his latest book, A Better Man: A (Mostly Serious) Letter to My Son. Black was persuaded to write the book after publishing a New York Times op-ed on school shootings and gun control in 2018. Part advice and part memoir, A Better Man poses the question: why is it always boys and young men who are pulling the trigger? Black challenges readers to expand their definition of masculinity while refraining from denigrating qualities traditionally seen as feminine. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, #TedFled. In the Interview, his new documentary has been called “jaw-dropping,” “incendiary,” “riveting,” and “engrossing.” Sam Pollard’s new film MLK/FBI is about the bureau’s surveillance and harassment of Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. The film delves into new and declassified documents as well as restored footage to reveal the government’s long past of targeting Black activists. Pollard tells Mike, “I was just trying to tell a good story. About two men on the same trajectory one with a goal to take his people to the Promised Land, and the other one with a goal to stop that man from doing that.” Sam Pollard is an award winning director, editor and producer. He was nominated for an Oscar for his 1997 documentary 4 Little Girls, and has won two Emmys for his documentary editing. In the Spiel, we’re worried about the cows in Texas. Hat tip, Moo Muffs! Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, we rush to Limbaugh’s judgment. In the Interview, political and media historian, Brian Rosenwald, joins Mike to talk about Rush Limbaugh’s rise to popularity in conservative media, his power as a voice and entertainer in talk radio, the influence he had on the Republican party, and who is primed to carry his torch over the AM dial or in podcasting. As a national broadcaster, Limbaugh developed a political perspective over his career that to the left perpetuated harmful ideas, and to the right, uplifted and championed their values. Limbaugh was awarded the presidential medal of freedom February 4, 2020, and died February 17, 2021 of complications from lung cancer at 70 years old. Rosenwald is editor of Washington Post’s Made By History blog, scholar in residence at the Partnership for Effective Public Administration and Leadership Ethics at the University of Pennsylvania, and author of Talk Radio’s America: How an Industry Took Over a Political Party That Took Over the United States. And we give up the spiel to keep talking to Rosenwald about the aftermath of Limbaugh. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Southern cold snap! In the Interview, Sonari Glinton is back! Which means we’re talking cars. Glinton and Pesca discuss GM's recent proclamation to go electric by 2025. Glinton says that it's not that car makers aren't making profits off of going electric, it's that General Motors' commitment is a sign that the state of things are grave. He projects that automotive companies will be entering into partnerships in an effort to solve environmental problems, and that the new Biden administration in conjunction with the depart of transportation will lead efforts to push the U.S. out of the recession. Glinton is a well-known host in the public radio and podcast realm, and is a former NPR business reporter covering the auto industry and economics. In the spiel, trying to predict the history books.  Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Mike lives for the arguments Trump’s lawyers are making because, well, they’re really bad. In the Interview, “She loves America. For her, she was there showing support for the American political process.” SUNY Geneseo political science professor and author Karleen West talks to Mike about her mother’s participation in the January 6th insurrection. West has spent years studying insurrections in Latin America, but on January 6th, her personal and professional collided. Mike and West talk about how West’s mother is a strong woman, but doesn’t consider herself a feminist, the radicalization of her mother, and how her mother is still proud of her...despite not really knowing what her career is.  In the spiel, assailing democrats, and two words: Swiss cheese. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, exploring the complexities of the personal stakes of the Senators in the Trump Impeachment trial. In the Interview, it’s the second half of our conversation with Jonah Blank, an anthropologist, writer, author, and former policy director for South and Southeast Asia on the staff of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Blank joins Mike to talk about the Myanmar coup, the default of cheering on populism, conflicts and communal violence, and the threat to democracy. Blank is author of Arrow of the Blue-Skinned God, and Mullahs on the Mainframe, and currently based in Singapore. He’ll be back on the show next week. In the spiel, picking apart Lindsey Graham.   Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the prosecution in Trump’s Impeachment is firing on all cylinders. In the Interview, we take a look inside the FBI’s fight against white supremacy and domestic terrorism. Frank Figliuzzi is a 25-year veteran of the FBI. He joins Mike to talk about why the country needs a domestic terrorism law, the January 6th insurrection at the Capitol, and how the FBI is battling the threat from within the United States. Figliuzzi is the author of The FBI Way: Inside the Bureau’s Code of Ethics. In the spiel, like Gaston and the guys who went after Frankenstein’s monster before him, no matter what his defense says, Trump did incite an angry, pole-bearing mob. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the Belknap case is clear precedent. In the Interview, it’s round two of vaccine talk. Mike and Dr. Abdul El-Sayed, a former Detroit health director and epidemiologist, talk about equity and the rollout of the COVID-19 vaccine. They also discuss why we shouldn’t heroicize the pharmaceutical industry, using the issue of the sixth dose as a compelling example. El-Sayed’s new book Medicare for All: A Citizen’s Guide is out now. He’s also the host of America Dissected from Crooked Media, among many other projects. In the spiel, Trump’s defense tested a few losing arguments. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, ads for “The Big Game” are given the Pesca treatment.  In the Interview, it’s vaccine talk. Mike sits down remotely with Dr. Abdul El-Sayed, a former Detroit health director and epidemiologist about the COVID-19 vaccine. They talk about how social media has spread both information and misinformation, how the response to the coronavirus is eerily similar to climate change, and how Canadians have managed to get things right. Plus, when politics and health collide: El-Sayed’s new book Medicare for All: A Citizen’s Guide is out now. He’s also the host of America Dissected from Crooked Media, among many other projects.   In the spiel, George Shultz’ legacy as a public servant.  Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, cost of living and minimum wage around the U.S. In the Interview, journalist David Gilbert from Vice News joins Mike to talk about QAnon, the cult of disinformation, it's propulsion into 2021, and how people from all walks of life are susceptible to believing. Plus, Gilbert translates Marjorie Taylor Greene's floor speech, and explains why it wasn't a disavowing of Q or the conspiracy theories she still believes in.  In the spiel, it’s the first lobstar of the antentwig of 2021! Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, stripping Majorie Taylor Greene of her committee membership, but Republicans still want to keep her around. In the Interview, it’s coup talk. It’s part one of an interview with Jonah Blank, an anthropologist, writer, author, and former policy director for South and Southeast Asia on the staff of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Blank joins Mike to talk about the Myanmar coup, the default of cheering on populism, conflicts and communal violence, and the threat to democracy. Blank is author of Arrow of the Blue-Skinned God, and Mullahs on the Mainframe, and currently based in Singapore. He’ll be back on the show next week. In the spiel, Representatives Nancy Mace and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez are fighting. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, importing walkie-talkies into Myanmar. In the Interview, we’re coming into a new constitutional cycle, and it means Democrats could take quite a bit of power. Well, if they don’t blow it. We’ve been in the same Republican-dominated cycle for decades, according to Jack Balkin, author of The Constitutional Cycles of Time. Balkin and Mike talk about the extreme political polarization not seen since the Civil War, constitutional rot, and, just for fun, delve into conservative complaints about de-platforming and free speech. Balkin is a Knight Professor of Constitutional Law and the First Amendment and Director for The Information Society Project at Yale Law School. In the spiel, delving into the Trump files ahead of the Impeachment trial. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Alexei Navalny’s sentence. In the Interview, it’s part two of a conversation with historian Jill Lepore about her latest book: If Then: How the Simulmatics Corporation Invented the Future. Jill discusses that with data mining and analysis there is greater potential for the demeaning of democratic processes, and why in 2021, accepting social media and twitter as a proxy for public opinion and polling could be risky. Lepore is an author, a New Yorker writer, and historian. She is also host of a podcast called The Last Archive from Pushkin. In the spiel, looking for relief? Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, once a Nobel Peace Prize winner, now a war criminal. In the Interview, writer Jill Lepore joins Mike for part one of their conversation on her latest book: If Then: How the Simulmatics Corporation Invented the Future, a precursor to data and polling companies. If Then is an account on the mid-century boom in the advertising industry and its overlap with political marketing. Lepore articulates the deep prejudice in polling at the time, the rise of awareness of computers, and how Simulmatics' people machine's duplicity was made legible. In the spiel, the GameStop/Wall Street debacle starring the usual suspects. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, an Arizona Representative has a plan to win - throw out votes. In the interview, it’s all about the voice; John Colapinto’s new book, This is the Voice, that is. From sexy baby voice to deep baritones, Colapinto talks about his linguistic journey in writing his new book about the importance of the sounds and the musicality of voice that come out of our mouths, and how a good bedside manner can save you from lawsuits. Colapinto is a staff writer at the New Yorker. In the spiel, crackpot as croackpots. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, what happens when a conservative pundit and a famous quarterback make a podcast: Bolling with Favre.  In the interview, it’s been a lonely year, and an especially difficult 10 months to try and find love. But Logan Ury’s new book, How to Not Die Alone just may hold the key. Putting psychology first, Ury seeks to give readers a guide to finding and keeping relationships. Spoiler alert: Stop focusing on the spark! Ury explains an approach to dating that is more psychology than yenta, the non-fluffiness of behavioral science, and what goes on in a “Love Lab.” Ury is the co-founder of the Irrational Lab at Google, and was the Director of Relationship Science for the dating app Hinge. In the spiel, three horrible truths and a half terrible truth about Republican Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, you can’t trouble us with your labels. In the interview, what is In & Of Itself? The new Hulu special by Frank Oz and Derek DelGaudio is so much more than just a made-for-TV version of DelGaudio’s live show. As creators, Oz and DelGaudio discuss the stigma of illusion, an art form which relies on sleight of hand and audience participation, and talk about how they were able to bring to life their special for people sitting at home. Both Oz and DelGaudio elucidate the assumptions around their respective careers, professions which have historically been viewed as sitting lower on the performing arts totem pole, and urge viewers to refrain from taking things simply on face value. In & Of Itself is available now on Hulu. In the spiel, understanding the difference between lies and delusions. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Impeachment logic games.  In the interview, it’s part two of a conversation with Oscar award winning documentarian and director Bryan Fogel about his latest film The Dissident. The film centers around Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s brutal murder, and its broader human rights implications. The Dissident is available in theaters, and now via premium video-on-demand. Today, Fogel and Mike focus on Fogel’s experiences putting the documentary together, and how he got unlikely sources to sit down for interviews. In the spiel, use code RUDY today! Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Larry King, ‘Hello!’ In the interview, it’s part one of a conversation with Oscar award winning documentarian and director Bryan Fogel about his latest film The Dissent. The film centers around Washington Post journalist Jamal Khashoggi’s brutal murder, and its broader human rights implications. Fogel discusses how he seeks to right wrongs through his investigative filmmaking, and details how he put his own life on the line to tell Khashoggi’s story. The Dissent is available in theaters, and now via premium video-on-demand. Part two of Fogel’s conversation is tomorrow. In the spiel, Rand Paul versus reality. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Trump is deserving of a trial, and a lot more. In the interview, what are the consequences of putting Trump through a Senate trial? Mike does some game theory with Joe Lockhart about the possible implications for Republicans and Democrats when it comes to voting for, and possibly convicting the former president. Lockhart is former press secretary for President Clinton, partner at strategic comms group Rational360, and a CNN political analyst.  In the spiel, mask on, mask off. But seriously keep your mask on. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, before he jetted off to the sunshine state, Trump had a last bit of business to attend to.  In the interview, Mike talks to Jeffrey Sonnenfeld, senior associate dean of leadership programs, and the Lester Crown Professor in the Practice of Management for the Yale School of Management. He is also founder and president of the Chief Executive Leadership Institute. Mike and Sonnenfeld discuss C.E.L.I., a nonprofit educational and research institute focused on CEO leadership and corporate governance, and Trump’s influence on their decision making. In the spiel, oh the people he pardoned. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, a decent man gives a speech. In the interview, Mike talks to Sarada Peri about now President Joe Biden’s inaugural speech. The former President Barack Obama speechwriter says Biden, “knocked it out of the park.” They talk about the most effective moments and the importance of speaking directly about racism and white supremacy. Peri also discusses why Biden addressing the American people as “folks” is not only a favorite colloquialism of his, but a necessary way to relate. In the spiel, Republicans will likely continue to republican.  Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Trump is getting traded.  In the interview, we bring in Chris Molanphy to discuss the music hits of 2020. They talk about how All I Want For Christmas is You keeps coming back to the top of the charts and the unexpected timeliness of Rockstar by DaBaby featuring Roddy Ricch. Molanphy is a pop-chart analyst, the writer of Slate’s “Why Is This Song No. 1?” series, and host of the podcast Hit Parade. Come for the deep dive on an unusual year in music, stay for Mike explaining what W.A.P. stands for.  In the spiel, we remember Trump for the last time. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the QAnon Shaman’s lawyer. In the interview, John Fetterman, also known as Lieutenant Governor Stone Cold, talks to Mike about his potential Senate run. The Pennsylvania native talks about his origin story from son of teenagers to Harvard graduate, his thoughts on gun control and incarceration, and the woes of being six-foot-nine. (Not enough suits.) In Remembrances of Things Trump: so many Seans, so little time. In the spiel, supposed contradictions of pro-free speech. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Republicans use their voices to complain about not having a voice. In the interview, Melissa Murray joins Mike to discuss what the articles of impeachment can teach us about constitutional law as we review the events of last week at the Capitol Building. Murray is a professor at NYU Law, co-host of Strict Scrutiny podcast, and a contributor on MSNBC. In Remembrances of Things Trump: Goofy, Sleepy, Crazy...no those aren’t Snow White’s friends. They are Trump’s favorite nicknames.  In the spiel, the Trump push for Lisa Montgomery’s execution in the final week of his tarnished presidency. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the gavel was quick and sure during the impeachment hearing. In the interview, what risks lie ahead for 2021? Mike sits down with political scientist Ian Bremmer. They talk about what went wrong in 2020 (hint COVID-19 managed to make a lot of Bremmer’s predictions come true). And for 2021 - China, oil and Biden, oh my! Bremmer is the president and founder of Eurasia Group, a firm that helps investors and businesses understand the impact of politics on their investments. In Remembrances of Things Trump, Trump attacks a dead man because Trump has a problem with women.  In the spiel, bearing the stain of being impeached twice. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, this is actually who we are because we wouldn’t have let it happen. In the interview, Katie Meyer, political reporter at WHYY in Philadelphia joins Mike to talk about the Pennsylvania state legislature, and today’s federal ruling on the contested state senate race.  In Remembrances of Things Trump, back to the days when Trump was able to tweet, and retweet.  In the spiel, defining incitement. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, several Republicans predicted years ago Trump’s actions would lead to violence, but they’re sticking with him anyway. One of them is Ted Cruz. In Remembrances of Things Trump, Trump denounces a Swedish terrorism attack that never happened. In the interview, Mike is joined by Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel. They talk about insurrection at the Capitol building in D.C., and in Michigan, and how rallies and big talk got them there. Nessel also explains her decision to seek sanctions against attorneys who filed lawsuits claiming debunked election fraud in the state.  In the spiel, Trump may be off Twitter, but his supporters don’t have to go far to get their message out. It’s called podcasting. Ever heard of it? Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, how do 39% of registered voters “approve” of Trump’s performance? 39%; really? In the interview, Mike is joined by Stan Barnes to talk all things Arizona. Arizona just gave its two Senate seats to Democrats in a shocking upset for the long-time red state. Barnes is a former Republican state senator turned party consultant for the Copper State. He talks to Mike about the impact of Wednesday’s Capitol chaos on the Republican party and how there’s no “putting Humpty Dumpty back together again.” And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump, the people who left the Trump administration before it became en vogue. In the spiel, a slew of resignations following the chaos. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the assault on the Capitol through extremist corners of the internet. In the interview, Mike is joined by U.S Rep. Dan Kildee of Michigan’s 5th Congressional District, and Chief Deputy Whip of the House Democratic Caucus. Rep. Kildee was on the House floor when violent pro-Trump extremists overtook the Capitol, causing a lockdown. Kildee shares his experience of what it was like inside the chambers before and after the electoral vote count had been certified, and what he’s hearing from his constituents in Michigan. In the spiel, we continue our walk through the insurrectionist rampage at the Capitol. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the Capitol is breached by pro-Trump extremists. In the interview, Mike is joined by Slate’s senior politics writer, Jim Newell, from Washington, D.C. While sequestered from inside the Capitol Building, Newell discussed the safety measures put in place to protect those remaining in the House chambers and its locked corridors, while police made desperate attempts at corralling the violence.     In the spiel, the Georgia runoff and what this means for American politics. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, we return to the infamous Bean Dad. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: All the president’s less than capable men. In the interview, it’s part two of a conversation with David Shor, a researcher and consultant for democratic politicians. Dubbed a political data analyst prodigy, Shor developed a voter registration system as a teenager, then at age 20 subsequently moved on to work for the Obama campaign where he oversaw forecasting. Shor shares more of his experiences collaborating with more seasoned colleagues and explains how humbling it was in the process. In the spiel, needling the needle truthers ahead of the Georgia runoff. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, President Trump made a phone call and blew apart the life of a private citizen.  And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: teleprompter stumble. In the interview, it’s part one of a conversation with David Shor, a researcher and consultant for democratic politicians. Shor discusses the value trade-offs parties have to make in order to win an election. From his analysis, he explains that when a political party’s values are out of sync with what a median voter believes, issues inevitably arise at the polls. He stresses that it’s not just the messaging, it’s about how it is disseminated and used to persuade. In the spiel, the answer is: This former Jeopardy! contestant is facing Twitter backlash.  Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Margaret Kelley, Cheyna Roth, and Jasmine Ellis. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Fauci guess-timates. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: dead ducks and poisoned undies.  In the interview, Harvard professor Michael McCormick is here to tell Mike about the worst year in recorded history. According to him, it’s 536 A.D., a year when a volcanic eruption blocked out the sun, a bubonic plague that recurred every few decades began, and Ireland was without bread for four years. He and Mike discuss how we’re able to pinpoint so precisely the date of these events, how it affected humanity, and that sometimes the history lesson is things can always get worse. McCormick is the Frances Goelet Professor of Medieval History at Harvard University. In the spiel, if our ancestors got through, so can we. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, sorting out how undemocratic of our democracy is. In the interview, the Atlantic’s James Fallows contends that while 2020 has been bad, 1968 was actually quite worse. The Vietnam War was raging, young men were being drafted, and in 1968 the North Vietnamese and Vietcong forces launched their Tet Offensive. Not to mention, Martin Luther King Jr. and Robert F. Kennedy were both assassinated. Fallows and Mike discuss how the assassinations compounded on the stress of the war, how shooting targets have shifted from politicians to schools, and compare the civil unrest of 1968 with 2020. Fallows’ piece in the Atlantic is “Is This the Worst Year in Modern American History?” In the spiel, we’re not getting those $2,000 checks...which leads to a Remembrances of Things Trump where the president likes a certain phrase about talking and action.  Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Editor’s note: This episode mistakenly identifies Martin Luther King Jr. as having been assassinated “when he was in his early 40s.” King died at the age of 39 on April 4, 1968, in Memphis, Tennessee. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, we’re experiencing some loner white terrorist burnout. In the interview, we’re talking rural Republicans. Ross Benes gives us insight to Nebraska’s Republican party, and how they can help to understand Republicans everywhere. He talks about where Democrats are going wrong outside the cities, the difference between an old fashioned Republican and a Trump Toadie, and what makes rural voters tick—sometimes despite their own best interests. Benes is a journalist and analyst at eMarketer, and the author of Rural Rebellion: How Nebraska Became a Republican Stronghold. In the spiel, remembering what Trump said he’d do for the Carrier plant. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Republican Grinches are scratching their heads while Santa Trump calls for more stimulus money.  And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: This president. He hasn’t talked so good.  In the interview, we have Georgia on our mind yet again with Georgia Public Broadcasting’s Bill Nigut. He talks about the upcoming Georgia runoff including the impact of Republicans crying foul after the 2020 election, the (slim) chance that Republicans could blow an election that’s theirs to lose, and a deep cut involving a political jingle. Nigut is the host and executive producer of the Georgia politics podcast, Political Rewind. He’s also a program host and producer at Georgia Public Broadcasting. In the spiel, that rare feeling of togetherness that now comes with waiting on line for a COVID-19 test. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, who wants the vaccine? And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Did Trump really want a moat with alligators and snakes? In the interview, it’s the second half of Mike’s conversation with author Michael Scott Alexander about his book, Making Peace with the Universe: Personal Crisis and Spiritual Healing. Alexander talks about his connection to finding a religious path and identity, the differences between religious institutions and personal enlightenment, and why the concept of spirituality desperately needs rebranding. Alexander is associate professor of religious studies and Maimonides Endowed Chair in Jewish Studies at the University of California, Riverside. In the spiel, cleansing America of Trump. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, medical innovation. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: charitable contributions. In the interview, it’s part one of Mike’s discussion with author, Michael Scott Alexander about his book, Making Peace with the Universe: Personal Crisis and Spiritual Healing. Alexander details how he searched for insight during an existential crisis, and retroactively explored how other great thinkers, philosophers, psychologists, and musicians found help in healing the mind. Alexander is associate professor of religious studies and Maimonides Endowed Chair in Jewish Studies at the University of California, Riverside. In the spiel, dubious arguments against dubious death sentences. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder, Margaret Kelley, and Cheyna Roth. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the shrinking list of Democrats in Congress. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Trump trying to surprise the parents of British teenager Harry Dunn with their son’s killer. In the interview, the Gist’s favorite guest, Maria Konnikova, is back for another round of “Is That Bullshit?” She and Mike talk about long shot political wins and describe what it meant for Donald Trump to draw an inside straight in 2016. It’s a great hand to bluff with, but oftentimes it can be a bad strategy in poker and in life. Maria’s book The Biggest Bluff: How I Learned to Pay Attention, Master Myself, and Win is a New York Times bestseller and listed as one of their 100 Notable Books for 2020. In the spiel, it’s the final lobster of the antentwig of 2020! Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, gale-force winds from winter storm Gail. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Jim Acosta was scolded and his credentials revoked. In the interview, Mike talks with Scottish sports broadcaster Andrew Cotter how his dogs Olive and Mabel became online celebrities. Earlier this year, Cotter began publishing short videos of his dogs featuring funny commentaries from his perspective. One is a sports-style chew toy play-by-play, and another is a work call with his pups over Zoom. These videos went majorly viral, and now he’s out with a memoir recounting the real stories of his life with his dogs. Cotter’s book is Olive, Mabel, & Me: Life and Adventures With Two Very Good Dogs. In the spiel, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez stresses that there is no plan in place for new leadership. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, GOP going after themselves. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Peter Navarro’s alter ego. In the interview, Mike talks with Jane McManus about the conclusions of her poll on why Americans have been spending less time watching sports in 2020. What she found has a lot to do with not just the pandemic and aging viewers, but identity politics, too. In their conversation, McManus underscores that the health of a community is oftentimes based on playing games, and that sports are the ultimate reflection of a healthy democracy. She also discusses why sports leagues choosing to avoid getting involved in disseminating a public health message was contrary to putting community and teamwork first. McManus is director of Marist College’s Center for Sports Communication, a columnist for Deadspin sports and an ESPN contributor. In the spiel, Joe Rogan doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, Pete Buttigieg named Biden’s secretary of transport. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Ryan Zinke, Trump’s first secretary of the interior. In the interview, it’s the final half of Mike’s discussion with writer Matthew Yglesias. After touching on Yglesias’ argument from his Vox piece, “Trump’s Gains With Hispanic Voters Should Prompt Some Progressive Rethinking,” he and Mike go deeper on the divide between white Democrats and Democrats of color, and why some social issues in the progressive mainstream don’t necessarily work for the larger Democratic base. Yglesias’ Substack newsletter is Slow Boring.  In the spiel, Biden-esque buddyism. And, a short tribute to the late Catie Lazurus, comedy writer, and former host of the Slate talk show Employee of the Month. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, deciphering the Zodiac Killer’s last message. And, today in Remembrances of Things Trump: Trump trying to make Andrew Puzder his Labor Secretary. In the interview, the first part of Mike’s discussion with writer Matthew Yglesias. They talk about how the world of online media has changed since Yglesias founded Vox, and begin to get into his argument about certain parts of the Democratic platform that alienated Hispanic voters and pushed them towards Trump. Tomorrow, they’ll go deeper on the complex analysis of voters of color, and why it seems harder to disagree with progressive thought than it used to be. Yglesias’ Substack newsletter is Slow Boring. In the spiel, competent judges kept the U.S. in check. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, don’t trust the polls. And, today’s installment of Remembrances of Things Trump: Trump loves the Great Lake. In the interview, Mike helps Slate celebrate a milestone. Fifteen years ago this week, Emily Bazelon, John Dickerson, and David Plotz recorded their first podcast together, and the Political Gabfest was born. Since 2005, the trio has roundtabled weekly about politicians, scandals, and countless court cases with millions of listeners joining them along the way. It’s a podcast series that Stephen Colbert says “everybody should listen to.” One of the first-published podcasts to date, Slate’s Political Gabfest set the stage for news, culture, and politics shows everywhere to come over the years. In the spiel, proof through accusation. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, unasked for resignation advice. And, today’s installment of Remembrances of Things Trump: toilets for well-endowed men. In the interview, it’s part two of Mike’s conversation with Jim Tankersley, author and New York Times economics reporter. Tankersley provides solutions to productivity gains, explains how access to education in America is not enough of a tool for progress and that extending opportunities, like V.C. to women and BIPOC, will create more opportunities leading to a virtuous cycle promoting a new thriving middle class. Tankersley’s book is The Riches of This Land: The Untold, True Story of America's Middle Class. In the spiel, Georgia senators buying stocks. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Slate Plus members get bonus segments and ad-free podcast feeds. Sign up now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On the Gist, the skeletons in Hunter Biden’s closet. And, today’s installment of Remembrances of Things Trump: A natural rust color on the border wall. In the interview, it’s part one of Mike’s conversation with author and economics reporter Jim Tankersley about his new book, The Riches of This Land: The Untold, True Story of America's Middle Class. Tankersley defines the middle class by economic security, and underscores how legislations and the Civil Rights act negatively impacted economic policy. Mike and Jim also discuss how the U.S. seemed to luck into having a middle class post-World War II, and why chasing jobs of the past could be an ineffective method of rebuilding future opportunities. Stay tuned for part two in tomorrow’s episode. In the spiel, the Black community and the coronavirus vaccine. Email us at thegist@slate.com Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices