There Has to Be a Better Way?

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A Ropes & Gray (RopesTalk) podcast series from the R&G Insights Lab that is a curiosity-driven hunt for good ideas and better ways to tackle organizational challenges.

Ropes & Gray | R&G Insights Lab


    • Apr 19, 2024 LATEST EPISODE
    • monthly NEW EPISODES
    • 36m AVG DURATION
    • 34 EPISODES


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    Latest episodes from There Has to Be a Better Way?

    Curiosity & Empathy: A Better Way to Approach Data?

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 19, 2024 38:02


    For some, the thought of analyzing data for compliance purposes can be overwhelming, or overly focused on monitoring employees. But what if we approached analytics with curiosity and empathy? On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen are joined by Tara Palesh, who leads compliance analytics at Pfizer. With a background in engineering and strategy consulting, Tara views her team's role as helping compliance colleagues to do their jobs in a better, more focused way. Specifically, she talks about how data analysts can scale up and score data to find and address organizational risk. For companies at the beginning of their data journey, Tara offers thoughts on where to start, as well as the potential of generative AI to transform the compliance space.

    Data-Powered Insights: Telling Your Risk, Culture, and Ethics Stories with Data

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 3, 2024 38:57


    In today's business world, we're increasingly being asked to make sense of data. But how do we turn numbers into meaningful insights about a company's risks, culture, and compliance? On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen are joined for a second time by R&G Insights Lab's very own David Yanofsky to go deeper into the world of data storytelling. With a background in data journalism, David talks about how data can be used to tell multiple stories and why context is key to making them meaningful. The three explore various data concepts, such as correlation, causation, magnitude, distribution and flow. Even if you're not a numbers person, you'll walk away with a more sophisticated understanding of how data can be useful to help understand and navigate your organization.

    Faith@Work: A Personal Conversation on Ethics and Compliance

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 20, 2024 41:38


    Conversations about personal faith can be uncomfortable, especially at work. But in the compliance space, could one's faith be a motivating factor in decision-making? On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen are joined by fellow compliance professional Zara Merchant for a candid conversation about the role of faith in their personal lives and how it shapes their professional conduct. They also explore the intersection of faith and business ethics, the balance between rules-based and values-based compliance, and the role of faith in shaping their moral compass.

    Transforming Compliance Education

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 6, 2024 39:30


    Despite the role lawyers play in compliance, only one law school clinic in the United States focuses exclusively on this area. On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen catch up with Ropes & Gray alum Danielle Pelfrey Duryea, founding director of the Compliance Policy Clinic at Boston University School of Law. Danielle discusses the clinic's unique client-centric and experiential approach, which includes real-life client projects and a simulated internal investigation. They also explore the future of compliance education, envisioning collaborations between law schools and other professional programs to collectively address ethical issues with professionals in various industries.

    Understanding the World of Environmental Crimes

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 21, 2024 36:01


    Corporations are increasingly focused on issues related to environmental, social, and governance (ESG) factors. On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia explore the world of environmental crimes with Joe Poux, deputy chief of the Environmental Crimes Section at the U.S. Department of Justice. You will be fascinated to hear that environmental crimes encompass much more than pollution cases: worker safety, wildlife and timber trafficking, and animal welfare are all parts of this world that involves organized crime. You will also hear about international law enforcement collaboration in this area from Joe's work with INTERPOL. It's an episode not to be missed!

    Reimagining Compliance Training

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 7, 2024 43:15


    Training is an important part of any compliance program. Rarely, however, do we stop to meaningfully assess the effectiveness of the training. What are people getting out of them? What are the goals of the training and have those goals been achieved? And how can social science research inform how we design and evaluate training? On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia, along with the Lab's behavioral scientist Nitish Upadhyaya, explore ways to reimagine training in order to achieve holistic outcomes for the organization. Along the way, they tackle the challenges of remote training, consider how emerging technology could revolutionize the training landscape, and reflect on how training offers organizations a unique opportunity to listen to employees.

    What's Wrong With Doing the Right Thing?

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 24, 2024 38:38


    It's a common phrase in the compliance world: “do the right thing.” But what is “the right thing?” Are there risks to moralizing organizational decision-making? And what happens when two seemingly “right” actions are—or may be—in conflict? On this episode of the Better Way? podcast, co-hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia, along with the Lab's Dr. Caitlin Handron, explore how culture, context, and individual perspectives impact our understanding of what it means to “do the right thing.”

    2024 Outlook: What the New Year Brings for Business, Ethics, and Compliance

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 10, 2024 34:29


    Better Way? co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen preview some trends for the New Year, from where artificial intelligence (AI) will take us to how data and story-telling may help humans and organizations be more effective. Start the year with some provocative thoughts on technology, data, and culture and the role we can play in using and shaping them. 

    A Year of “Better Ways?”

    Play Episode Listen Later Dec 13, 2023 40:56


    Wrapping up year one of the Better Way? podcast series, co-hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia share their top themes from the year and discuss how these Better Ways inform the work they do to address organizational challenges. From embracing complexity and expertise to exploring empirical evidence and measuring culture, this episode packs the highlights of 2023 that you won't want to miss! 

    What is the “Right Thing” to Do?

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 29, 2023 37:50


    As popular as the phrase “Do the Right Thing” may be, defining the “Right Thing” can be quite a complex and even controversial exercise. On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, NYU Professor Alison Taylor tackles the question of what it means for a business to do the right thing in today's world, with multiple—and often conflicting—stakeholder expectations. She challenges some common notions such as “bring your whole self to work” and “courage to speak up” with deeper questions that will get you thinking!

    Compliance Stories: Lessons Learned in the Field

    Play Episode Listen Later Nov 8, 2023 38:19


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia go it alone in a one-to-one talk designed specifically for ethics and compliance professionals. In past episodes, guests have hailed the power of storytelling, and this week, Hui and Zach share personal stories—and learnings—from their decades of experience in the world of corporate ethics and compliance. Topics include: earning a seat at the table through relationship-building and diplomacy; why complication and complexity isn't always bad, but a lack of clarity is; and why compliance is, and needs to be recognized as, an area of unique expertise. 

    An Outsider with an Inside View: Researcher Daniel Beunza “Taking the Floor” on Wall Street

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 25, 2023 38:18


    Business professor Daniel Beunza spent years as an observer on the trading floors of Wall Street, and documents his journey in his award-winning book Taking the Floor: Models, Morals, and Management in a Wall Street Trading Room. On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, Dr. Beunza shares his surprising findings about ethics, morality, and leadership in these highly intense and competitive settings, and how his ethnographic method of “living with the natives” and “going with surprises” can inform how we understand organizations and behaviors.

    Not All AI is Generative: AI Strategist and Best-Selling Author Shannon Kirk on the Power of Metrics and Words

    Play Episode Listen Later Oct 11, 2023 31:36


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, Shannon Kirk returns to the podcast to share “Better Ways” from multiple perspectives: As a thought leader on the application of machine learning and artificial intelligence in litigation and internal investigations, she highlights the importance of metrics as evidence of effectiveness; and as an award-winning author and lawyer, she explains why words and precision matter. 

    Playing in the Sandbox with Bots: Nitish Upadhyaya Discusses the Role of the Human in an Increasingly Artificial World

    Play Episode Listen Later Sep 27, 2023 39:44


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen interview Nitish Upadhyaya, director of behavioral insights at R&G Insights Lab. Nitish is a lawyer and behavioral scientist whose research has focused on how humans interact with bots. Based on Nitish's findings, the three discuss how technology might complement human strengths in the ethics and compliance world. They also touch on human-centered design and Nitish's revolutionary way of thinking about effective training programs.

    Is Transparency in Business the Key to Halting Human Trafficking? A Conversation with Actor and Activist Julia Ormond

    Play Episode Listen Later Sep 13, 2023 34:13


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen are joined by actor and activist Julia Ormond, founder and president of Asset Campaign, a nonprofit organization working to ensure human rights by driving supply chain transparency and empowering individuals to make informed purchasing, investment and employment decisions. Julia discusses the “aha” moment that inspired her work on human trafficking and outlines a broad strategy for how policies and businesses can begin to support global human rights efforts. She specifically points to measurement and transparency as powerful tools that can be used to change behavior and eradicate trafficking, slavery and forced labor.  

    Company Leaders First: Former Coach Kevin Espinoza on How to Better Integrate Compliance Within Businesses

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 23, 2023 35:32


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen speak with Kevin Espinoza, a former collegiate coach who moved into compliance from sales and marketing. He talks about how this unique perspective has informed his approach to build compliance programs that embed compliance within the business, with compliance professionals focused on the same business goals as their colleagues. 

    What Pop Culture Gets Wrong: Leading AI Ethicist Rumman Chowdhury Defines the Real Risks of Artificial Intelligence

    Play Episode Listen Later Aug 9, 2023 41:49


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen talk to Dr. Rumman Chowdhury, a pioneer in the field of responsible AI. Currently a Responsible AI Fellow at Harvard, with prior leadership roles at Twitter and Accenture, Rumman has first-hand insight into the real harms of AI, including algorithmic bias. She discusses how data scientists seek to understand these problems, and the importance of trustworthiness in the future of AI development. Having recently testified before Congress about AI governance, she shares her thoughts about building a governance ecosystem where human ingenuity can flourish.  

    Do Consumers Care About Corporate Compliance? New Research Says Yes

    Play Episode Listen Later Jul 26, 2023 42:49


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen speak with researchers at Indiana University's Kelley School of Business about the value of corporate compliance programs. Compliance can be (inaccurately) perceived as a “cost center” or an “enabling function,” supporting rather than contributing to product development and business strategy. But business law and ethics professors Todd Haugh and Suneal Bedi tested this idea by assessing the role of compliance in value creation. They discuss findings from their recent study, which explores how consumers value compliance—as a unique product feature—using a statistical technique called conjoint analysis.

    A Beautiful Association: Antoine Ferrère of Novartis Discusses the Link Between Psychological Safety and Compliance

    Play Episode Listen Later Jul 13, 2023 39:49


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen talk to Antoine Ferrère, global head of behavioral and data science in the ethics, risk and compliance department at Novartis. With master's degrees in both management and behavioral science, Antoine discusses how his multidisciplinary team at Novartis applies behavioral and data science at scale to drive ethical behaviors, reduce risks and ensure compliance across all areas of the company. He also discusses the multi-year studies his team has implemented to better understand the role of psychological safety in both speaking up and “listening up.”

    The Power of Pause: A Retrospective on the Last Six Months

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 28, 2023 28:02


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen reflect on the last six months of insights and “better ways” from the podcast. From looking outside of your normal environment for better ways, to leaning into the importance of precision, to thinking like a scientist and drawing on radical creativity, this episode adds new dimensions to key topics with additional perspective and curiosity. 

    Miracle on the Hill: How to Build Consensus and Achieve Results in Divided Organizations

    Play Episode Listen Later Jun 14, 2023 42:12


    During some of the most divisive times in U.S. history, a small group of Democrats and Republicans defied all odds and learned to work together to get things done. It's an inspiring story of success that you almost never hear about in Congress. On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen talk with Dr. Marian Currinder, a political scientist and former professional staffer to a bipartisan congressional committee during an extremely partisan time, to learn about how a committee that seemed set up to fail thwarted expectations to pass more than 200 recommendations in four years.

    GE's Global Investigations Chief Counsel Katy Choo Discusses the Art of Investigations

    Play Episode Listen Later May 31, 2023 34:08


    Co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen speak with Katy Choo, VP and chief counsel of global investigations at General Electric. Katy is one of the most highly respected figures in corporate internal investigations, and has led a multitude of investigations both as a prosecutor and in-house at GE. On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, Katy shares her “humanizing” approach to investigations and compliance, and the many questions she asks in her search for answers. 

    Compliance Leader and Ex-Marine Patrick McGowan Digs Into the Predictive Power of Data Analytics

    Play Episode Listen Later May 17, 2023 40:50


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen talk to Patrick McGowan, senior director for global compliance auditing and monitoring at industrial tech innovator Fortive. With a JD, MBA and background in forensic accounting, Patrick discusses how using quantitative methods to analyze seemingly small compliance issues can lead to big human insights.

    Part II: Award-Winning Author Benjamin van Rooij Offers a Practical Framework for How Organizations and Lawmakers Can Improve Human Conduct

    Play Episode Listen Later May 3, 2023 30:19


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, the second in a two-part series, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen return to their conversation with author and researcher Benjamin van Rooij about the six questions in the book he co-authored with Adam Fine, The Behavioral Code, which can guide organizations and lawmakers in creating a better compliance culture. They also discuss how an organization's toxic culture can be changed and interrogate the oft-cited argument that compliant companies cannot be innovative.

    Part I: Award-Winning Author Benjamin van Rooij Explains Why Understanding Human Behavior is Essential to Law and Compliance

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 19, 2023 35:25


    On this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, the first in a two-part series, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen talk to author and researcher Benjamin van Rooij about why it's dangerous for lawmakers and compliance professionals to rely on their “own intuitions about human misbehavior” when designing laws, rules and compliance programs. They also examine the challenges organizations face when trying to promote ethical behavior. Stay tuned for part two of our conversation, where Professor van Rooij dives into lessons from his award-winning popular book The Behavioral Code, co-authored with Adam Fine.

    Not All Messaging Apps Are Ephemeral

    Play Episode Listen Later Apr 5, 2023 39:43


    In this final part of a special podcast series unpacking recent DOJ policy updates, There Has to Be a Better Way? hosts Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia check in with Ropes & Gray's global head of e-discovery, Shannon Kirk, to better understand how companies should think about non-email electronic communications. Shannon explains why using more precise language when talking about different forms of communication is important in order to manage them appropriately, and offers some options for meeting DOJ's expectations for preserving data.

    Skin in the Game? Dr. Caitlin Handron Discusses How Compliance Incentives Might Work in Practice

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 29, 2023 36:21


    In this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, the second in a three-part podcast series on the DOJ's recent policy announcements, Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia speak with cultural psychologist Dr. Caitlin Handron about both personal experiences and academic research around behavioral incentives. They discuss the complexity in both human and organization behaviors, and advocate for companies to take a nuanced look at their cultures and gather data to find creative ways to incentivize compliance without unintended consequences.

    Assumptions v. Research: Unpacking Recent DOJ Policy Initiatives

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 22, 2023 38:14


    In this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, the first in a special series of three episodes, Hui Chen and Zach Coseglia discuss the recent policy changes announced by the Department of Justice related to compliance incentives, clawbacks and messaging apps. Hui recounts the origins of the Fraud Section's “Evaluation of Corporate Compliance Programs” and she and Zach question some of the assumptions baked into these policy updates.

    Award-Winning Data Journalist David Yanofsky Explains How to Tell Stories from Data and Why Precision Matters

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 15, 2023 30:20


    In this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen interview their colleague David Yanofsky, a former award-winning data journalist who joined R&G Insights Lab as manager of data visualization. David shares how he finds stories in data and uses them to help companies achieve their goals and live up to their ideals.

    Attorney-Turned-Journalist Megan Zwiebel Talks About the Power of Stories and the Art of Persuasion

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 1, 2023 28:40


    Co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen explore the power of storytelling with Megan Zwiebel, the “untangler of knots” and director of operations and delivery at R&G Insights Lab, who went from working as a litigation attorney to anti-corruption journalist, and now as the person who makes the trains run on time at the Insights Lab. Along the way, she shares insights about uncovering juicy fact patterns in corruption cases, the need for organizations to take narrative control of their identities, and the human beings who read legal briefs.

    Attorney-Turned-Journalist Megan Zwiebel Talks About the Power of Stories and the Art of Persuasion

    Play Episode Listen Later Mar 1, 2023 28:40


    Co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen explore the power of storytelling with Megan Zwiebel, the “untangler of knots” and director of operations and delivery at R&G Insights Lab, who went from working as a litigation attorney to anti-corruption journalist, and now as the person who makes the trains run on time at the Insights Lab. Along the way, she shares insights about uncovering juicy fact patterns in corruption cases, the need for organizations to take narrative control of their identities, and the human beings who read legal briefs.

    Dr. Caitlin Handron, Senior Consultant and Behavioral Scientist at R&G Insights Lab, Discusses the Role of Cultural Psychology in Solving Complex Organizational Challenges

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 15, 2023 36:27


    In this episode of There Has to Be a Better Way?, co-hosts Zach Coseglia and Hui Chen interview their colleague at R&G Insights Lab, Dr. Caitlin Handron, about cultural psychology, her field of study. She discusses how cultural factors influence human behavior and how integrating insights from the social sciences can help companies tackle organizational challenges—from compliance programs to diversity, equity and inclusion—in more effective ways.

    Hui Chen, R&G Insights Lab Senior Advisor, Describes Her Atypical Career Path and How It Enriches Her Compliance Insights

    Play Episode Listen Later Feb 1, 2023 30:55


    Welcome back to There Has to Be a Better Way?, a new podcast series from R&G Insights Lab. In part two of our inaugural episode, Insights Lab founder Zach Coseglia interviews co-host and senior advisor at the Insights Lab Hui Chen about her varied career and why she believes that having a data-driven measurement mindset is a better way to assess compliance programs. 

    Zach Coseglia, Inspiration Junkie and R&G Insights Lab Founder, Describes the Journey to Combine a Data-Driven and Human-Centered Approach to Solving Problems

    Play Episode Listen Later Jan 18, 2023 34:06


    Welcome to There Has to Be a Better Way?, a new podcast series from R&G Insights Lab. In this first episode, co-host Hui Chen interviews Lab founder Zach Coseglia about his lifelong hunt for better, smarter ways to solve problems and how this podcast will contribute to that search.

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