Podcasts about mba

Dr. Shadé Zahrai is a behavioral researcher, award-winning peak performance educator, and leading authority on confidence and self-doubt. A former corporate lawyer with an MBA and background in psychology, she has designed and delivered transformative programs for Fortune 500 giants including Google, Microsoft, LVMH, JP Morgan, and McKinsey. Named one of LinkedIn's Top Voices for career development, Shadé has taught over 7 million learners on LinkedIn Learning. Her TEDx talks and viral videos have amassed more than 300 million views, and her work has been featured in The New York Times, Adweek, CNBC, and Yahoo Finance.  Today on the show we discuss why self-doubt doesn't disappear with success and often intensifies as responsibility and visibility increase, how distorted self-image rather than lack of confidence drives chronic self-doubt, the four psychological traits that quietly shape how confident or insecure someone feels day to day, why confidence is the wrong target and self-trust is what actually eliminates doubt long-term, how comparison and impostor syndrome escalate as people level up and why that's a sign of growth, and the practical tools that help stop internalizing doubt while rebuilding real self-trust through action and much more. Today's sponsor: ⁠The Predictive Mind⁠ Understand how your brain and mind actually work so you can change patterns that hold you back. Use code DOUG15 for 15% off at ⁠https://predictivemind.io/ ⚠ WELLNESS DISCLAIMER ⚠ Please be advised; the topics related to health and mental health in my content are for informational, discussion, and entertainment purposes only. The content is not intended to be a substitute for professional advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your health or mental health professional or other qualified health provider with any questions you may have regarding your current condition. Never disregard professional advice or delay in seeking it because of something you have heard from your favorite creator, on social media, or shared within content you've consumed. If you are in crisis or you think you may have an emergency, call your doctor or 911 immediately. If you do not have a health professional who is able to assist you, use these resources to find help: Emergency Medical Services—911 If the situation is potentially life-threatening, get immediate emergency assistance by calling 911, available 24 hours a day. National Suicide Prevention Lifeline, 1-800-273-TALK (8255) or https://suicidepreventionlifeline.org. SAMHSA addiction and mental health treatment Referral Helpline, 1-877-SAMHSA7 (1-877-726-4727) and https://www.samhsa.gov Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode of the Solar Maverick Podcast, host Benoy Thanjan sits down with Joel Santisteban, Co-Founder & CEO of Ecosuite, to explore how AI, edge computing, and interoperable infrastructure are transforming the way solar and storage assets are managed. Joel shares his journey from solar development to building one of the most advanced distributed energy resource (“DER”) platforms in the industry, and explains how Ecosuite is helping developers, IPPs, utilities, and corporates unlock better performance, reliability, and efficiency across the full asset lifecycle.   Biographies Benoy Thanjan Benoy Thanjan is the Founder and CEO of Reneu Energy, solar developer and consulting firm, and a strategic advisor to multiple cleantech startups. Over his career, Benoy has developed over 100 MWs of solar projects across the U.S., helped launch the first residential solar tax equity funds at Tesla, and brokered $45 million in Renewable Energy Credits (“REC”) transactions. Prior to founding Reneu Energy, Benoy was the Environmental Commodities Trader in Tesla's Project Finance Group, where he managed one of the largest environmental commodities portfolios. He originated REC trades and co-developed a monetization and hedging strategy with senior leadership to enter the East Coast market. As Vice President at Vanguard Energy Partners, Benoy crafted project finance solutions for commercial-scale solar portfolios. His role at Ridgewood Renewable Power, a private equity fund with 125 MWs of U.S. renewable assets, involved evaluating investment opportunities and maximizing returns. He also played a key role in the sale of the firm's renewable portfolio. Earlier in his career, Benoy worked in Energy Structured Finance at Deloitte & Touche and Financial Advisory Services at Ernst & Young, following an internship on the trading floor at D.E. Shaw & Co., a multi billion dollar hedge fund. Benoy holds an MBA in Finance from Rutgers University and a BS in Finance and Economics from NYU Stern, where he was an Alumni Scholar.   Joel Santisteban Joel Santisteban is the CEO and Co-Founder of Ecosuite, an AI-powered asset management platform for distributed energy resources. Joel is a seasoned entrepreneur and clean energy leader with deep experience in solar, storage, and energy software. At Ecosuite, he is focused on helping asset owners, operators, and developers optimize performance, reduce operational risk, and unlock more value from their energy assets through data and automation.   Stay Connected: Benoy Thanjan Email: info@reneuenergy.com  LinkedIn: Benoy Thanjan Website: https://www.reneuenergy.com Website: https://www.solarmaverickpodcast.com/       Joel Santisteban     Website: https://ecosuite.io/     Linkedin:  https://www.linkedin.com/in/joel-santisteban/   Please provide 5 star reviews      If you enjoyed this episode, please rate, review and share the Solar Maverick Podcast so more people can learn how to accelerate the clean energy transition.    Reneu Energy Reneu Energy provides expert consulting across solar and storage project development, financing, energy strategy, and environmental commodities. Our team helps clients originate, structure, and execute opportunities in community solar, C&I, utility-scale, and renewable energy credit markets. Email us at info@reneuenergy.com to learn more.   Solar Maverick Happy Hour During Intersolar San Diego on Feb 18th https://luma.com/7v50llsn            

 Are you a Saver, Spender, Giver, or Avoider? In this episode, Miguel Gonzalez breaks down 5 money personalities—and how understanding yours can help you build a stronger financial future. Cortburg Retirement Advisors is a boutique financial planning firm committed to helping you grow, protect, and preserve your assets from your first job to retirement. We specialize in wealth management, estate and tax planning, group retirement, employee benefits, insurance, and retirement planning to navigate any economic climate.Miguel Gonzalez, a Retirement Specialist with 20+ years of experience, offers expertise in retirement income planning, investment management, and retirement plan design. With an MBA from Columbia Business School, and professional experience with JP Morgan Chase, Merrill Lynch, and more, Miguel is a trusted advisor for his clients. #CortburgSpeaksRetirement #MoneyPersonality #BehavioralFinance #FinancialHabits #PersonalFinanceTips #MiguelXGonzalez #MoneyMindset #RetirementPlanning #Cortburg #FinancialWellness #MoneyTalk #SmartSpending #SavingTips #FinancialEducation #FinancePodcast #MoneyMatters #BudgetingHelp #FinancialFreedom #FinancialGrowth #WealthMindset Welcome to Cortburg Speaks Retirement Podcast with Miguel Gonzalez, MBA, AIF®, CPFA®, CRC® CLICK HERE TO LISTEN TO MIGUEL'S LATEST PODCAST FOLLOW US ON: YouTube->https://m.youtube.com/c/CORTBURGRETIREMENTADVISORS Facebook-> https://m.facebook.com/CortburgInc Twitter-> https://twitter.com/CortburgInc LinkedIn->https://www.linkedin.com/in/miguelxgonzalez/ Website: www.CortburgRetirement.com Email: Miguel@CortburgRetirement.com

We're back for more stories about the impact the David Eccles School of Business has on the lives and careers of our alumni, and today we are sharing another success story of connections made through the David Eccles Alumni Network with Ben Holley.Frances talks to Ben about how he went from earning a music degree at the University of Utah  and an MBA from Harvard Business School to now the VP of Finance for Disney Entertainment Television. Ben discusses his career journey, the importance of curiosity, and how it has consistently opened unexpected opportunities along the way. Ben shares insights from his varied roles throughout his tenure with Disney and emphasizes the value of building relationships and connections along the way. He also touches on his philanthropic efforts supporting Ukrainian families affected by war through the efforts of To Ukraine with Love. This episode offers valuable advice for anyone navigating career changes, fostering curiosity, and maintaining optimism.Eccles Business Buzz is a production of the David Eccles School of Business and is produced by University.fm.Eccles Business Buzz is proud to be selected by FeedSpot as one of the Top 70 Business School podcasts on the web. Learn more at https://podcast.feedspot.com/us_business_school_podcasts. Episode Quotes:Ben reveals how building relationships and connections shaped his career path[12:41] The other theme besides curiosity that might emerge in this conversation you'll hear me say again and again is the importance of building relationships and building connections. Whether that be, as we've been discussing, to help manage a business that you're part of, or whether it's building your career, connecting to those that are further on in their careers that may be able to provide advice or guidance. I remember an experience as a student when I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do. I didn't really know what I wanted to do, and so I sat down and interviewed, in effect, 10 or 12 local businesspeople and asked them all about their jobs. I'd say, What do you like about your job? What do you hate about your job? What does your family think of your job? Do you make a lot of money? Do you not make a lot of money? What education did you have? Should I be thinking about an MBA? All of those questions. And the lesson I learned from that, walking away from all those interactions, there's not one that stands out to me as, Oh, that was the one; that was the silver bullet; that person knew everything that needed to be known. In reality, what happened was it was me talking about my interests and hearing other people react to those interests, and hearing a little bit about that helped me in my own mind to crystallize what I thought was sort of the right path for me, and that process of discussing and exploring different opportunities in different fields was really what helped me shape my own direction.On why students shouldn't be afraid to approach mentors and industry leaders[15:43] At the outset you do have to have a little bit of self-confidence to pick up the phone or send an email or a text or whatever to reach out and make that connection. But what I found, and I think what most people will find, is that people are eager to share their own experience and eager to give advice. They feel flattered, right? When you reach out to them and say, “Hey, you're smarter than me; tell me what I should do.” And so, if I could dispel the fear that some people feel about reaching out, know that most people are eager to share their experience and talk to especially students.How being curious and making bold moves helped Ben get to where he is today[17:18] I thought to myself, I'm capable. I can certainly explore it, right? Figure it out and try and make that move, and through a series of interactions and connections and opportunities that I was able to find myself in the role I'm in now supporting the television side of the business, which is so funny. I came into this a little bit naive, right? Thinking, oh, finance is finance and Disney is Disney. But in reality, the television business is very different than the parks and resorts business, and it took a long time for me to learn the business, to get to know the people, but it's the same thing. It's the same thing I was doing at the call center, right? It's, you know, find the guy who's running the tech, who's asking you questions, figure out how the business works, how the business runs. Connect with the people, understand who's making decisions and guiding the business, and get to know them and let them get to know you, and that'll serve you well. It served me well, certainly.Show Links:Ben Holley | LinkedInTo Ukraine with LoveUtah Entrepreneur ChallengeDavid Eccles School of Business (@ubusiness) | InstagramUndergraduate Scholars ProgramsRising Business LeadersEccles Alumni Network (@ecclesalumni) | Instagram Eccles Experience Magazine

Send us a textIn this episode of the Remarkable People Podcast, Darius Ross breaks down the "Radical Accountability" mindset that took him from a strict Chicago household to the international stage. If you are struggling with adversity or looking to scale your leadership, this is your roadmap.The King's Mindset: Darius Ross on Radical Accountability and Global LeadershipWhat happens when an 18-year-old is suddenly forced to "become the King" of his household?. In this power-packed episode, Darius Ross, Managing Partner of D. Ross & Company, joins David Pasqualone to share a journey defined by tenacity, the samurai code, and a level of accountability that most people only dream of.From Chicago Adversity to Global InfrastructureDarius doesn't just talk about success; he lived the struggle. Growing up in a strict Chicago military household, he learned early that there are no "second chances" when you mess up—you own it and you clean it up. We explore his incredible 7-year journey of "stalling" a bankruptcy to save his family home and how those "street lessons" translated into billion-dollar infrastructure deals in Asia, Latin America, and Africa.The Bushido Code and Scaling Your InfluenceDarius reveals his secret weapon for self-motivation: the Code of Bushido. He breaks down how the principles of the Japanese samurai apply to modern real estate and capital consulting.The Choice Matrix: Why sinking or swimming is a daily decision.Street Smarts vs. Corporate Wisdom: How to negotiate with creditors and federal judges before you're even legal.Global Vision: Why the "Third World" is the next frontier for infrastructure and multi-family investment.Key Takeaways: ✅ How to "become the King" when life takes everything away. ✅ The 7-year legal battle that taught Darius more than any MBA. ✅ Applying the Samurai "Bushido Code" to modern business. ✅ Investing in the future: Infrastructure in Africa, Asia, and Latin America.FULL SHOW NOTES & GUEST LINKS: https://DavidPasqualone.com/DariusRossKey Timestamps & Moments of Gold00:00:54 – The Ultimate Guarantee: What you will gain from this masterclass.00:03:02 – From Chicago Streets to Global Infrastructure: The Darius Ross Story.00:06:45 – The 7-Year Battle: How an 18-year-old saved his family from federal bankruptcy.00:10:12 – The "King's Mindset": Why you must step up when leadership is vacant.00:14:35 – The Samurai Code (Bushido): Applying ancient discipline to modern billion-dollar deals.00:19:20 – Radical Accountability: Why blaming others is the fastest way to fail in 2026.00:23:55 – Investing in the "Third World": Why Africa and Asia are the next frontiers for infrastructure.00:28:10 – The Power of Tenacity: Negotiating with creditors and federal judges before age 21.00:32:45 – How to Solve Global Problems while glorifying God and helping your neighbor.00:35:40 – Final Words: Your Support the showTHE NOT-SO-FINE-PRINT DISCLAIMER: While we are very thankful for all of our guests, please understand that we do not necessarily share or endorse the same beliefs, worldviews, or positions that they may hold. We respectfully agree to disagree in some areas, and thank God for the blessing and privilege of free will. For more Remarkable Episodes, Inspiration, and Motivation, please visit https://davidpasqualone.com/remarkable-people-podcast/ now!

In this episode, Alex Liff interviews Andrew Walker, GMAC's Director of Research Analysis and Communication about the latest MBA application trends survey that he just completed. Andrew offers interesting insights into the latest trends both on the applicant and corporate recruiter sides and talks about what to expect going forward.

Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS takes us on deep dive into the world of digital marketing, with a strong focus on Search Engine Marketing (SEM) and Search Engine Optimization (SEO). The host breaks down the key differences and relationship between these two critical components of a successful online strategy. The discussion covers the entire customer journey, from the pre-click phase, where the user is first searching for information, to the post-click phase, where the goal is to convert the user into a customer.A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to practical, actionable advice for improving conversion rates. This includes a detailed look at crafting effective Calls to Action (CTAs), optimizing landing pages, and leveraging analytics to make data-driven decisions. The host also shares a valuable tip on using brackets in headlines to increase click-through rates. This episode features a friend / guest from Canada

Send us a textPeter Weiss is a leadership mentor, former CEO, and founder of MindKaizen. He works with senior leaders operating under high pressure and complexity, helping them strengthen their inner operating system so they can meet today's demands with clarity and stability. His work focuses on staying grounded under pressure, acting in line with personal values, and protecting the relationships that matter most.Originally from Germany, and with a background in bioengineering and an MBA, Peter spent decades leading and transforming organizations across Asia. He founded and led the Kaizen Institute Thailand and later turned around and successfully sold a manufacturing business.Peter is the creator of the ShinKaizen program, which blends ancient contemplative disciplines with applied neuroscience to develop the inner skills required for whole and effective leadership. He lives on a self-sufficient homestead in rural Thailand and works globally with executives, founders, and leadership teams.A Quote This Episode“Many leaders believe Kaizen is something you delegate. That belief is the problem. Tools never changed a culture. What changes culture is how leaders show up when things get tough."Resources Mentioned in This EpisodeBook: Well-Being and Personal Growth by Bruno A. Cayoun Book: The Happiness Hypothesis by Jonathan HaidtAbout The International Leadership Association (ILA)The ILA was created in 1999 to bring together professionals interested in studying, practicing, and teaching leadership. About  Scott J. AllenWebsiteWeekly Newsletter: Practical Wisdom for LeadersMy Approach to HostingThe views of my guests do not constitute "truth." Nor do they reflect my personal views in some instances. However, they are views to consider, and I hope they help you clarify your perspective. ♻️ Please share with others and follow/subscribe to the podcast!⭐️ Please leave a review on Apple, Spotify, or your platform of choice.➡️ Follow me on LinkedIn for more on leadership, communication, and tech.

In this episode with Rishi Dave, a partner in Bain's Commercial Excellence practice with deep expertise in B2B marketing and digital marketing, he explains the concept of a "Day 1 List" in B2B sales and marketing and the three things that will get a supplier or seller on the list. Rishi also discussed what a "sales play" is, how to build it, institutionalize the knowledge within the company, and get the sales team to adopt the sales play to fulfill their potential and increase their productivity and sales. Rishi Dave partners with CMOs and management teams to drive marketing transformations and build modern marketing capabilities. He serves as an expert on the implementation of Bain's B2B Marketing Diagnostic and Sales Play System. Rishi has held global CMO roles at public technology and cloud companies, including Dun & Bradstreet, Vonage, and MongoDB. Prior to these roles, he served as the global head of digital marketing for Dell's B2B businesses. Rishi started his career at Bain & Company. As a marketing executive, Rishi has built world-class marketing organizations and capabilities that have driven top-line growth leveraging the right marketing technology, data, analytics and content strategy. Rishi has driven major brand and messaging transformations, reimagined digital customer experiences, and built and scaled go-to market models. Rishi earned an MBA in Marketing from The Wharton School at the University of Pennsylvania as well as a BS in Chemical Engineering and an AB in Economics with Honors from Stanford University.    Claim your free gift: Free gift #1 McKinsey & BCG winning resume www.FIRMSconsulting.com/resumePDF Free gift #2 Breakthrough Decisions Guide with 25 AI Prompts www.FIRMSconsulting.com/decisions Free gift #3 Five Reasons Why People Ignore Somebody www.FIRMSconsulting.com/owntheroom Free gift #4 Access episode 1 from Build a Consulting Firm, Level 1 www.FIRMSconsulting.com/build Free gift #5 The Overall Approach used in well-managed strategy studies www.FIRMSconsulting.com/OverallApproach Free gift #6 Get a copy of Nine Leaders in Action, a book we co-authored with some of our clients: www.FIRMSconsulting.com/gift

Send us a textThis week, my guest is Tracy Hicks, a doctorally-prepared and dual-certified family and psychiatric mental health nurse practitioner. She also holds an MBA, which is particularly useful in her role as a CEO.Tracy is the founder of C-Trilogy Comprehensive Clinical Care and C-Trilogy Outreach, a certified community behavioral health clinic that provides mental health services, substance use support, primary care, and 24-hour crisis help.I was excited to talk with Tracy, who is an expert in the care and treatment of individuals with schizophrenia, because in my 36 years as a nurse, I have encountered only two patients with this diagnosis, both of whom were teenagers. I knew very little about the condition and was eager to learn from Tracy, and she did not disappoint.We discussed long-acting injectables as a successful treatment option, the challenges of compliance, and the management of a long-term chronic disease. We also emphasized the crucial importance of a strong support system to help patients lead meaningful lives.A recurring theme in our conversation was Tracy's passion when discussing these complex cases. This emotion stems from her lived experience, as two of her beloved family members—her father and her daughter—both have the disease. Growing up with the stigma of having a father with schizophrenia has shaped her perspective, and even though her daughter is now grown, Tracy's concerns for her never waver.Tracy's days are incredibly busy. Between practicing in the clinic, serving on multiple boards that advocate for marginalized populations, and shaping the next generation of nurses as an Associate Professor, people often ask her how she manages it all. Her answer? When you align with your purpose from God, He will guide your steps. She truly is a blessing to her community.In the five-minute snippet: Be prepared to jump! For Tracy's bio, visit my website (link below).Dr. Tracy Hicks Puts Her Mind to Improving Access to Mental Care, Frontier Nursing Empowering Care Partners Through Psychoeducation in Schizophrenia Care, Psychiatric TimesContact The Conversing Nurse podcastInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/theconversingnursepodcast/Website: https://theconversingnursepodcast.comYour review is so important to this Indie podcaster! You can leave one here! https://theconversingnursepodcast.com/leave-me-a-reviewWould you like to be a guest on my podcast? Pitch me! https://theconversingnursepodcast.com/intake-formCheck out my guests' book recommendations! https://bookshop.org/shop/theconversingnursepodcast I've partnered with RNegade.pro! You can earn CE's just by listening to my podcast episodes! Check out my CE library here: https://rnegade.thinkific.com/collections/conversing-nurse-podcast Thanks for listening!

In this episode of Sales Is King, host Dan Sixsmith kicks off the show's 10th year and the launch of a brand new studio with a powerhouse guest: Andrew Brown, Senior Vice President and Chief Revenue Officer at Red Hat. Andrew shares how Red Hat is driving double‑digit growth with its hybrid platforms, automation, and AI capabilities—while staying anchored in long‑standing values like freedom, courage, commitment, and accountability. He also breaks down how AI is really changing sales, what separates top sellers from the middle of the pack, and why “happy customers” is his simple, non‑negotiable definition of success.​Red Hat's growth engines in 2025Three core platforms: Enterprise Linux, OpenShift (containerization/virtualization), and automation.​Why true hybrid (on‑prem, private cloud, hyperscalers) is resonating with customers globally.​The acquisition of Neural Magic and how Red Hat is playing in AI inference.​Values that customers actually feelHow Red Hat's long‑standing values—freedom, courage, commitment, accountability—show up through products and people, not posters.​Stories from customer visits (including India) where clients proactively praise the team, not just the tech.​The call to become CRO and first 90 daysHow Andrew was tapped from IBM by Rob Thomas to run “anything that touches revenue” at Red Hat.​Why he changed almost nothing at first: two ears, two eyes, one mouth—used in that ratio.​Moving the organization from “growing” to truly unlocking the next growth curve, with alignment on one vision and one belief.​What really separates top sellers from the middleActive listening as a true differentiator—probing pain, impact, and outcomes versus just hearing words.​Never settling: aiming beyond the renewal, operating on the “front foot,” and treating success and failure the same way.​A sports mindset: being ready for the clutch moments, orchestrating stakeholders, and failing at least 50% of the time but getting back up.​How AI is reshaping sales at Red HatBuilding and buying: Red Hat's own AI assistant embedded in sellers' workflow (Slack → CRM opportunity creation) plus tools like People.ai to free managers from data validation and focus them on coaching.​The big challenge: not building AI models, but getting them into production at scale with governance, cost control, and the right deployment (cloud vs. on‑prem).​Why only a small percentage of AI projects show real value today—and what needs to change.​Channel and ecosystem as revenue multipliersWhy a significant share of Red Hat's revenue runs through partners and how they're enabled pre‑ and post‑sales.​Technical certifications, revamped partner programs, and advisory boards to keep value and alignment high.​Customer success and value realizationConsolidating scattered customer success pockets into a central, technical CS team that engages the day after the contract is signed.​Focus on hands‑on deployment, embedding Red Hat tech in customer architectures, and rescuing under‑utilized hybrid commitments.​The direct link Andrew sees between CS, value realization, and recurring revenue uplift.​Andrew's personal journey and leadership lessonsFrom aspiring soccer player to IBM intern to CRO at Red Hat.​Doing an MBA nights/weekends to bridge technology and business outcomes in C‑level conversations.​Early “bad” first management role and learning from white‑space, door‑to‑door style selling.​Influences from Lou Gerstner and other mentors: keep it simple, communicate clearly, don't define your life only by work.​Andrew Brown is Senior Vice President and Chief Revenue Officer at Red Hat, where he leads all revenue‑touching functions globally across sales, services, and ecosystem partners. Prior to Red Hat, Andrew spent nearly three decades at IBM in a variety of technical, sales, and leadership roles, combining a deep technology background with a strong commercial track record.​

Owen Campbell left the corporate world to build his PT practice from the trunk of his car. Now he's helping other clinicians turn business dreams into real growth.In this episode, we unpack:Why PTs actually make great business owners (but were never taught how)Why most burnout has nothing to do with patient loadHow to build a business mindset (without an MBA)What makes growth possible — and worth itGuest: Owen CampbellCo-founder of Physio Growth@thephysiogrowthguys | https://www.physio-growth.comResources Mentioned:Crucial Conversations (Book)Alex Hormozi (Follow)Sponsored By:Brooks IHL – Ready to level up clinically? World-class residencies and mentorship at https://www.brooksihl.orgEmpower EMR – Built by PTs, for PTs. Clean workflows, better notes, faster documentation at https://www.empoweremr.comU.S. Physical Therapy (USPh) – Grow your clinic or career without giving up your identity: https://usph.com

Gregg Lunceford, Managing Director at Mesirow Wealth Management and a retirement transition researcher, joins Lesley Logan to explore why retirement is about more than financial planning. He introduces the concept of the “third age”—a longer, undefined stage of life where identity, purpose, and structure matter just as much as money. Together, they discuss why work identity is so hard to release and how shaping your retirement identity early can make your next chapter feel intentional instead of uncertain. If you have any questions about this episode or want to get some of the resources we mentioned, head over to LesleyLogan.co/podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/. If you have any comments or questions about the Be It pod shoot us a message at beit@lesleylogan.co mailto:beit@lesleylogan.co. And as always, if you're enjoying the show please share it with someone who you think would enjoy it as well. It is your continued support that will help us continue to help others. Thank you so much! Never miss another show by subscribing at LesleyLogan.co/subscribe https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/#follow-subscribe-free.In this episode you will learn about:Why modern retirees now face a long “third age” requiring purpose beyond leisure.How work identity provides recognition, social connection, and daily structure.The difference between living as your “ought self” versus your “ideal self.”Why failing to plan identity often leads retirees to burn through money.Why creating a shared retirement vision helps guide future decisions together.Episode References/Links:Mesirow Wealth Management - https://www.mesirow.comGregg Lunceford on LinkedIn - https://beitpod.com/greggluncefordExit From Work by Gregg Lunceford - https://a.co/d/c84euxXThe Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel - https://a.co/d/feJq9lhGuest Bio:Gregg Lunceford has 32 years of experience in financial services. He is a Managing Director, Wealth Advisor in Mesirow Wealth Management and Vice Chair of the Mesirow DEI Council. He creates comprehensive financial planning strategies for individuals, families, organizations, athletes and business owners. He is the Investment Committee Chair for the American Heart Association, on the Board of Directors for the Juvenile Protective Association, an Advisory Board Member for the Nathan Manilow Sculpture Park at Governors State University and is an Advisory Board Member for the Quinlan School of Business at Loyola University. Gregg is also a frequent speaker on WGN radio's “Your Money Matters.” Gregg earned a B.A. from Loyola University, an MBA from Washington University, and a PhD from Case Western Reserve University where he conducted research on retirement. He is a CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER® professional and holds a Certificate in Financial Planning Studies from Northwestern University. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure and give us a five star rating and leave us a review on iTunes, Podcast Addict, Podchaser or Castbox. https://lovethepodcast.com/BITYSIDEALS! DEALS! DEALS! DEALS! https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentCheck out all our Preferred Vendors & Special Deals from Clair Sparrow, Sensate, Lyfefuel BeeKeeper's Naturals, Sauna Space, HigherDose, AG1 and ToeSox https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/memberships/perks/#equipmentBe in the know with all the workshops at OPC https://workshops.onlinepilatesclasses.com/lp-workshop-waitlistBe It Till You See It Podcast Survey https://pod.lesleylogan.co/be-it-podcasts-surveyBe a part of Lesley's Pilates Mentorship https://lesleylogan.co/elevate/FREE Ditching Busy Webinar https://ditchingbusy.com/Resources:Watch the Be It Till You See It podcast on YouTube! https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gLesley Logan website https://lesleylogan.co/Be It Till You See It Podcast https://lesleylogan.co/podcast/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan https://onlinepilatesclasses.com/Online Pilates Classes by Lesley Logan on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjogqXLnfyhS5VlU4rdzlnQProfitable Pilates https://profitablepilates.com/about/Follow Us on Social Media:Instagram https://www.instagram.com/lesley.logan/The Be It Till You See It Podcast YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq08HES7xLMvVa3Fy5DR8-gFacebook https://www.facebook.com/llogan.pilatesLinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/lesley-logan/The OPC YouTube Channel https://www.youtube.com/@OnlinePilatesClasses Episode Transcript:Gregg Lunceford 0:00  What we all need to start to focus on right now is just like we had that career guidance counselor helping us and coaching us and to that next thing, we need to start taking time to figure out that action plan for that next thing. And once you start to figure out, I need to form a retirement identity and understand my ideal self. You start to self motivate and become excited about it.Lesley Logan 0:27  Welcome to the Be It Till You See It podcast where we talk about taking messy action, knowing that perfect is boring. I'm Lesley Logan, Pilates instructor and fitness business coach. I've trained thousands of people around the world and the number one thing I see stopping people from achieving anything is self-doubt. My friends, action brings clarity and it's the antidote to fear. Each week, my guest will bring bold, executable, intrinsic and targeted steps that you can use to put yourself first and Be It Till You See It. It's a practice, not a perfect. Let's get started. Lesley Logan 1:10  Okay, Be It babe. This conversation is really cool. It's really, really cool. It might you I'm going to introduce it in just a second, I'm going to introduce the guest, and it might be somebody like when you think about this, you yes, you do. Yes, you do. And I actually am really excited once I hit in on this, because Brad and I have already talked about this topic with each other, but I we've actually not dove into what retirement looks like, right? Like? What does it look like? Who are we, you know. And I think especially if you're an elder like me, you're like, I'm still trying to figure that out for my work stuff, but, but there's, there's an even bigger reason for us to think about it now, and Gregg Lunceford is going to explain that to us, and it's going to give you so much inspiration and a joy and excitement and possibility. And I can't think of a better be it till you see it, thing that be working on than what Greg is going to offer us up today. So here he is. Lesley Logan 2:04  All right, Be It babe, I'm really excited, because when I met this guest, I was like, hold on, this is very different. This is a whole different attitude to have about. Fine, we're going to talk money. And I know some of you want to, like, put your head in the sand and ostrich out, but we're gonna talk retirement. We're gonna talk about some really cool things, also just thought processes to have. We have an amazing guest, the first person ever make me think of this in a different way. Gregg Lunceford from Mesirow, is here to rock our world today. So Greg, tell everyone who you are and what you do.Gregg Lunceford 2:34  Hello, Lesley, thank you so much for the opportunity to be on your show. My name is Gregg Lunceford. I am a career professional in financial services. I work for a firm called Mesirow Financial in Chicago. We have locations across the country and some overseas. I am a wealth advisor. In addition to that, I am also an academic researcher, and my field of study is retirement transition. And so what I work with clients on is getting them, not only do you understand the financial part of retirement, but also the social, emotional components of making the transition and how it is unique to them, because the 21st Century retiree retirement transition is much different and way more dynamic than most people think, having watched others do it in the 20th century.Lesley Logan 3:21  This is so cool, because you're not, like, our, you know, our grandfather or father is like, like, financial planner, you are actually thinking, like, deep about the person. And that I find, I don't think I've known anyone who does that. Like, usually it's like, here are the numbers, here's your sheet. Let's put this in. How much money do you want to have and like, that's it, but you you've brought more personality to it and also more emotions to it. How did you get started in that? Gregg Lunceford 3:47  So I'll give you a little bit of a backstory. So as I mentioned, I've been in financial services for 33 years, and when the real estate bust occurred in 2008 I was working for another organization, and we were having people come in and very successful people, and they were set for life. They were being offered an exit package from their from their employer. They were leaving a lot of C suite roles, or maybe a little role below the C suite. And we were having meetings with them to prepare for retirement, and we would go through all the financial numbers and something still wasn't right. And what I was noticing was they were hesitant to make the retirement decision, even though the company was saying, look, we, giving you this excellent opportunity to exit early create cost savings for us. It'll create great financial opportunity for you, especially because we were in this period of time like unemployment was going above 11%, and so here's the opportunity to take this nest egg and be good, which was counter to what we were taught in our industry when I came in the industry that, you know exiting out was an economic choice, that once you hit a certain number, then you would go look for activit ies of leisure, because work can be depressing and daunting and stressful and all those kinds of things. And even when I was watching, you know, commercial ads from people in the industry and competitors, you know, you'll see something that goes, and I won't call the company, but they had a very successful campaign that said what's your retirement number? Yes. And this number will follow you down the street. Is this? You know, you walk from the door, do you remember that? And you look at your balance, it's like, if today's the day you just tell your boss, I can't stand you, and it's over with, right? And so this was very counter to what I was experiencing. And so I started to talk to some of the senior level people in my organization. I said, there's something going on here and and they said, well, it's probably because they're talking to us, and they're also shopping with other people to see who they which which company they want to work with. So go offer them a great discount, because it's probably all things equal, and it's just they're being sensitive about numbers, once again, making this an economic choice, so we would do that. And what I recognize is the sales cycle got even longer. And so I would go back to them. But I said, have you been looking at the trends for our sales cycle? And you would think that these would be quick, easy, easy sales, you know, because people supposed to be running out of the door, and they took longer. And so I said, there's something we don't understand about someone who is at this stage, and the feedback I got was, if it's something social emotional, there's nothing we can do about it. You know, if someone's afraid about running out of money, you can create an annuity product to take care of them for life. Somebody's worried about interest rates going up, you can create a product that deals with interest rate sensitivity, but nothing can deal with how a person feels. And I didn't accept that as an answer. I thought that was wrong, because the way I view it is, clients hire us, and they trust us, and we can do a better job the more we understand the client beyond just their finances, right? And I felt like there was a big problem here. So I basically said, you know, I want to go back to school and study this. And I negotiated for time to be in class, and I got it. And so I went to Case Western Reserve University. I got into a PhD program there, and I did four years of PhD study and lots of studies trying to figure out what are the social, emotional factors, as well as the financial factors that a person considers when making the retirement decision. And there were just tons of things that I learned in that process that I used to help my clients. Were happy to talk to you about that journey.Lesley Logan 7:37  Yeah, I'm excited to get in with that, because it's really funny as you talk about this, I like, my my family, right? My mom is two years from retirement, and she's got two homes, you know, in California that it, honestly, I was trying to get her to sell few years back because it would have been a great idea. And like, get a condo, be set for life. And we're like, showing her the numbers. We're like, look at this. This is a you, you can set yourself up to just be chill, and she is like, not listening, and I think it's because of the emotional attachment to these properties versus, like, the numbers. And so I can I get that right? Like, I get my my in laws could have retired years ago. I don't think that they know what to do if they don't have work things. And I don't even know that they love their work. I think they like what the what the work represents that they do during their day. So I do want to dive into this, because in being it till you see it like I'm hoping that every listener here gets to live to the age that they desire, like and we all are, as you mentioned, like that, the time that we're in people are living a much longer time, like retired at 65 and dying at 90. It's a long time to not have a J-O-B, right? So it would be really cool to chat with you, because like being it till we see it means including what we want to be. How do we want to be when we're older and not doing the thing we're doing? How do we want to be in retirement? So let's dive into that a little bit.Gregg Lunceford 9:06  Sure, so a couple things I want to cover off on. It was like one, how did we get here? And I think you've already touched on that. The fact is, we're living longer. And so if you are looking at a retirement maybe 50 years ago, when people really started to expire in their late 60s and their 70s. What occurred was you got to 65 and the system told you 65 is the number. Why does this arbitrary number was picked one day when they were trying to figure out Social Security, they said it was 65 is the number, right? And so you come out at that period of time, and you only have just a few healthy years in front of you, or at least you anticipate you only have a few healthy years. So what came out was this concept of a bucket list. So I am going to use these healthy years to travel, play all the golf I can, and have all this leisure that I can before I am too physically unable to do this or mentally unable to do this. And so couple things were wrong there, as it relates to our retirement 21st century. One, we're living longer, so you're going to be physically and mentally able to do something for a long period of time. So if you don't sort of set goals for yourself and see what you can be in the futurem you're going to get bored really, really quickly, and you're going to start to decline very quickly, simply because you're absent of certain things, purpose and drive and and goals and accomplishment. You know, it's more than just a couple rounds of golf that are going to make you happy. And so what I think people don't understand is we are now living in a period of time where it used to be you went from your youth to middle age and to old age. And so this transition from middle age to old age was about that 60 mark, right? And so people just basically said, I have no more control. The system is going to do what it does to me. I'm going to be booted out of my job. I'm going to be sent off to do leisure. I guess that means I play with my grandchildren or volunteer, and I'll just follow suit. And what happened is a lot of people found themselves doing things that weren't rewarding to them. Now we're in a new era, because we live longer. And what is present now is what is called, in academic terms, the Third Age. So you now go from early age to middle age to this Third Age, which is this undefined period, and today's retirees are the first people to go on this, and then you go on the old age, and the Third Age is this 20 year life bonus, where you get to define who and what you want to be. And think about it, you're wiser than you ever been. For most people, you have more financial resources than you ever had. You don't have a commitment to other people, meaning you've raised your children so you don't have to worry about them. Hopefully you're in a position where you don't have to care for aging loved ones, right? So this is a period of time where you can do anything and everything you always wanted to do. And people go, well, what didn't I have the opportunity to do whatever I wanted to do? Not quite, because remember when we were growing up, and those before us were growing up, we were kind of encouraged to do things that were socially acceptable. Rght? Lesley Logan 11:02  I agree. Gregg Lunceford 9:07  It wasn't until recent decades where someone says, I'm going to start a computer company out of my garage. I'm going to drop out of college and do something that's undefined and pioneer so the current generations, entering into into retirement, have never developed this proactive protein behavior the way maybe millennials and Generation Z has.Lesley Logan 12:54  I completely agree. Because, like, I, I mean, I feel very lucky that even though I was raised very much by, like, almost a Boomer and and a hippie like, I do have a career where I am doing whatever I want. I'm an elder millennial, so I have that, but I have friends who are just a few years older than me, and I don't think that they have a they don't have hobbies. If they have a hobby, it's going to the gym. You know what I mean? Like, it's like they don't really have things so outside of their work, it's like, what do you do for fun? Are you kidding? Like there's no and so I feel like what you're getting at is, like, no one has actually spent time thinking like, but what do I actually want? How can I dream about that, right? How can I make that so exciting that that I want to take a retirement package or that I'm excited to I have this I'm not just like, oh, let me go play golf three times a week. Like, what else? I have no purpose. I think it's really fascinating that that there is a good chunk of, like, I would say, probably over 45 who don't really, they're exploring it, but don't know. And how do you figure that out?Gregg Lunceford 13:59  So let me ask you a question. Lesley, what is your earliest memory? Or how about how old do you think you were when someone first asked you what you wanted to be when you grow up?Lesley Logan 14:09  I remember being in elementary school, and I'm sure it was asked of me earlier, because people have told me that I said something different earlier. But I remember in fourth grade, I had to, like, write a poem about who I was and what like, what did it feel like, and what did it sound like, and what did it look like. And I said, a judge, you guys, that should shock everyone.Gregg Lunceford 14:36  My point is so since age 10, someone has been helping you develop your work identity. So people were asking you at home or in your neighborhood or a church or wherever you socialize, what you're going to be then you're going to go to a middle school and you're at the high school and they're going to assign a counselor, going to start telling you to think about college or trade school or whatever it is. Is then you got to get into career. And then whatever career you get in, maybe you're assigned a mentor that's helping you understand or think about how to advance in that career. And then you get to this point where maybe you're like late 40s or 50s. And does anybody help you figure out what your identity will be after work. Lesley Logan 15:22  No, as you're saying this. Gregg Lunceford 15:24  You're on your own. You're on your own. And the only thing that was different here is when they put you into that position where you were felt forced into retirement, right? And then there was also a safety net there in the form of a pension that doesn't exist the way it once did, and there were other government safety nets that may not exist the way they once did before, when they put you there, you just said, okay, I'll accept it, because I'm only going to be around five years anyway. So let me work on this bucket list, but you never really thought about and I think people don't really dig into thinking about what the value of work is, beyond the financial resources it provides. So they get to the tail end of their career, and some people may not even think about it anyway, either. So career, because you've spent all this time having these conversations, you start developing this identity because your work, you become what your work is, right? And so, so a lot of people look at the economic resources it provides, but work also provides for us ways to get psychological success. Who doesn't like completing a task and getting recognition, and if you're in a good working environment, right? Everyone says, Let's applaud Lesley because she did this for the team which created this opportunity for the company, which created this value that she should be recognized for, right? So that that's very important, that gives you a reason to get out of bed, that gives you a reason to thrive, and that has some value when you walk out of the work environment. How do you replace that when you go into this third age? The second thing is, work provides socialization. No matter what you think about your work colleagues, if you like them, that's great. They give you somebody that you want to see every day, that you become personal friends with, that you grow with, that you learn to care about. If you hate them, they give you something to laugh about at the end of the day. You know what that idiot Bob did today again, right? That gives that gives you more than you think, right? And so work provides socialization. And then the third thing that work provides that we often overlook is structure in your day. What to do with your time, right? And so for a lot of people, when they don't have somewhere to go, something to do that makes them feel accomplished, and people to be around that they enjoy or either get some form of comical satisfaction from, they're lost when you put them out there on their own. And so what I learned and through my research is this transition for a lot of people, is the first career transition that they've made independently, and it is scary. Lesley Logan 18:08  Yeah. I mean, when you put all that together and I'm just like, going, wow, you know, people aren't it, one of the questions we've got on the pod is like, how do you make friends as a note when you move to a new place? It's like, I mean, for us, we work for ourselves. So, like, we didn't have a place to go to make, you know, so I, my husband and I have a different experience in, like, how to find socialization and structure to our day. And, you know, like we've had to make it happen. But for so many you know, my dad, he quit his he quit his security job. Yes, guys, my 72 year old father was a security guard, but he quit it because he got frustrated. Anyways, he is back working as a crosswalk guard because he's like, I'm bored. I have nothing to do, and I'm like, but dad, we could get a hobby. We could play these game like, all this stuff. And it's because he never, ever, ever in his whole life, did anyone ever encourage developing the skills outside of work.Gregg Lunceford 19:06  Developing a retirement identity, right, developing a retirement identity. And what also makes it hard is, you know, when you are developing a retirement identity, like I said, this is your first shot at personal freedom in life. Okay, when you're growing up, you had to do what your parents told you to do. Then you became an adult, and then you had all these set of responsibilities. And so you were doing what people told you you ought to do. You were really working on your art self. So if you're going to have a family, you ought to find a job that produces enough income, you know. So you didn't really think about ideally what you wanted to do. And what is really amazing to me is I've interviewed some highly successful people that do amazing things, and when I start talking to them about forming their ideal self, the stuff they come up with is so counter to what what and who they are. It is. Is amazing to me. So I get cancer surgery or successful attorneys or engineers to say I want to learn how to write mystery novels, or I want to start a rock band. And so what it points to me, and what it what comes out to me is these are probably things that they wanted to do in the 10, in their teens, in their early 20s, all along, but they couldn't do that because society told them these are not the things a person ought to do. You know, if they want stability in terms of income, if they want respect in their community, if they want you know, the structure that around it allows them to have a family and not have to worry about things. And so now you get to this third age, and I saw all off the table. You're wiser than you've ever been. You have more financial resources than you've ever had. You know, you have more personal freedom. Now you get to, really, for the first time, work on who your ideal self, not your ought self, who you want to be. And if you get it right, you're the only person you have to hold accountable. If you get it wrong, you're the only person you have to hold accountable. And so some people go, well, Greg, what does it have to do with money? I think people who don't take time to find this identity burn through a lot of money trying to find themselves. Right? And so, when I first started this journey, I was trying to find a cohort of individuals that had finished their career, achieved financial success and had 30 years ahead of them. And what were their behaviors, and where you consistently see this is with professional athletes, right? You're out of the game early. Right? You're in your 30s, and you're Tom Brady, you're 40, but that's the long game. But you're really out in your late 20s, your early 30s, you don't have financial concerns, right? And what is the behavior? And sometimes we demonize athletes for dysfunctional behavior after Hey, but all they're showing us is who we are going to be if we don't develop a retirement identity.Lesley Logan 22:09  Yes, Greg, you are 100% correct there. I think most people, think most people will say they don't know how to manage their money and and to your research and what we've been talking about here, it's not about managing money it's about they don't know who they are without their sport because they spent, for those people, they spent, literally, since they were a child in that sport and getting so many accolades, and then all of a sudden, no one cares. No one pays attention to them. For the most part, they're not going to be on TV like, that's it. And so I think it, I think you're spot on. It's not about the money responsibility, although they might need to learn some. It's about who, who are they now that they're not playing.Gregg Lunceford 22:50  Right and so then you go, well, this athlete just went broke because they put all this money in his business. Well, they're trying to get the same accolades in business they got in sports, right? They're trying to replace that identity that made them feel good, made them feel accomplished and some people are very successful at it. Those aren't. But my point is, there has to be a road map to get that yes, and it doesn't always have to be in business. It could be in your civic activities. It could be you learning to act, or you become in sport, but you have to first of all imagine who your ideal self is. And just like you were coached and you read and you trained to build that ought self, hopefully, for some people, a lot of people, the ought self is their ideal self, and they're usually entrepreneurs like you, where you that you know what, I'm not going to go to normal path. I'm going to carve a path for myself, and entrepreneurship gives me that freedom. But for a lot of people, they have to figure out now that I've satisfied all these obligations to other people and other things, who do I ideally want to be and then work at how do I get there? Because if you go in there blindly, you're just the same as that person out of that was in sports or any other industry, you're just trying to find this quick hit to replace all of these accolades or psychological successes you got. And you can blow up a lot of money doing that. So the well being comes from getting all of these components right, not just as we were taught in the 20th century, just making sure you don't run out of money. Lesley Logan 24:26  Gregg, this is insane. So okay, so I love all of this. And it's, it's, it's like, so aligned, because I'm always like, can't be you're not gonna get right the first time. Like, we have to ditch perfection, which, of course, in workplace, it's very honed. Like, check the box. Do it right. Do it right. So you have to talk to the boss about how you did it wrong. Like, get it right. Like, so of course, when you, when you retire, if you haven't been working on these things, you're you're going to be hard on you're going to take your ought self into your retirement. So I guess, like, first of all, I don't think that most financial retirement planners do any of these questions. So when, if, when people come to you talk retirement, are you like pulling are you like asking them what their ideal, what they want their ideal self to be? Do they even know how to find it? What questions do they have to ask themselves? Gregg Lunceford 25:13  Well, we do have. We have. We have a lot of conversation about, you know, not only can you financially afford it, we can put some numbers of software and come up with that answer pretty quickly, right? But we also have a conversation about, what do you think your lifestyle will be, and why do you think this is right for you? And what do you want to accomplish? And you know, some folks will come in and say, hey, I think I want to start a small business, right? And so we might talk about them, and they don't want they don't want work again in the way they want it, but they want something to do that is work on their own terms. So a lot of this is you changing the terms of what you're doing and because when we go, especially if we go to work for a corporation or some that's usually a unilateral contract, right? The person the institution is telling you, I'll give you X amount of dollars if you do this. And you say, but what if I did a little different? No, you don't get a choice in that. This is what you got to do, right? And what we're recognizing is we do have some power in that. We do have some power. I've seen a lot of people be successful in going back to their places of work and negotiating consulting contracts. And they basically said, you know, I don't want to do nine to five, but if you have a special project that you bring on, let's say you bring you on new software, whatever, and this is going to be a nine-month project, or it's going to be something you need few hours, you know, out of the week and but I get the summers off. I'm your person for doing that. And that's how they're able to get from their ought self into their ideal self, because the time that they're not there, they now start to figure out what their personal freedom, what they really like to do. So I think of one person now, he was very successful at this, but he also was confident enough talking to his employer, because he was the head of HR, so he knew he was a little bit more comfortable. But basically what he did was he got to this point, and he was ready to make this transition now, but he didn't know what he wanted to do. So he went to and he said, look, I'm the head of HR, I got 70 people reporting to me. I'm willing to give all of my direct reports to my successor. If you help me, let me help you identify my successor, and help me groom your successor. So his role became more of coach, manager, mentor, in this last couple of years, and that was three days a week. He said the other day a week. These are institutions, nonprofit institutions, that we, as an organization, support. I want one day to volunteer with one of them, and so now they get a free executive for one day a week. That was great for the company. Worked out well. He said, then the fifth day of the week, I just want a day off. I want to see if I really enjoy leisure. Everyone tells me I'm supposed to play all these rounds of golf and lay back and relax. Let me make sure that that's the right thing for me. So he has three days a week that he is engaging in what he traditionally knows in terms of what his identity is. He has one day a week to see if he wants to change his identity in his community through his volunteerism, and he has one day a week to figure out if I just want to exit all together. And the answer is, you can do one of the three of those. You can continue doing all of the three of those. What we have now is, if you shape them correctly, is we have what are called boundary-less careers. And so this is where I think, you know, we give Millennials a bad rap. We give millennials a bad rap because we always say, well, they like to do a gig economy. They don't stay anywhere 30 years. But what they're really engaging in is today's boundary-less career, where they define success for themselves, versus going down the traditional path, which says you can only be successful by going up the pyramid. For them is, you know what? I can be equally financially successful. I can gig here, gig there, and add it all together, or I can and get this personal freedom and know how to negotiate so that I'm spending more time, just as much time developing my ideal self as I'm developing my ought self.Lesley Logan 29:21  Oh my gosh, Gregg, you just like, I think you're the first person to ever give the millennials a compliment. But thank you. Constantly find myself defending, like, I'm like, what are we talking about? Like, we're not bad, we're we're a group that's how to really fight, like, figure things out. Because when we came into the world where we got a job, like, everything was so uncertain. You know, between 911 and between, that's when I went to college, and then I got out of college, and it was like the recession, like, there's not, there's not been an opportunity to have a certainty of a 30-year career. But I think what you're, what I'm, what I love about what your saying is, like, we've actually been spending our careers figuring out who we are, and like, spending time doing that. And I am obsessed with what the example of the guy you gave, because I think so many people can start playing with that right now. So many companies are looking to go to a four day work week, you know, like, so many places are looking to have like, Okay, you're in office for some days and you're at home for other days. Like, we can look at those opportunities as ways to figure out our retirement identity. Gregg Lunceford 30:22  Right. And a lot of us get stuck in this, oh, well, I work for this large corporation. They aren't flexible. There are a lot of small, medium sized companies that are in growth mode that that model works very well. That's what they can afford. And they need the institutional knowledge and the wisdom you got to be able to and this is where we go back to talking about boundary list careers. You got to think about all of the universe and parts of it you don't even know exist. This is where your personal curiosity has to kick in to get what you want. Lesley Logan 30:53  Yeah. Yeah. Okay, Gregg, so I feel like you are a unicorn though. Like, I really do feel like, because, I mean, obviously, what a cool company, that they're like, yeah, go, take four years to figure out this idea you have, and then, like.Gregg Lunceford 31:09  Well no, they weren't that cool. That's why I'm here. Lesley Logan 31:14  Okay, that's cool. Gregg Lunceford 31:15  I kind of, I took a lot of flack as I was doing this, and because people were going, we don't understand why you're doing thi, right, and you know, we don't really understand your need to do it. And there were a few key executives that said, you know, they were really supportive of me, but overall, it was, you know, I was sort of like I was trailblazing, and people were going, you you have a very good set of responsibilities here, that you could be highly successful. Why do you want to tinker with the mouse trap? And I said, I think this would make me a better advisor to my clients, if I, if I came to understand this now, back then, and, you know, there was no one talking about psychology. I'm a certified financial planner now, the CFP exam as of I think, like two, three years ago, 11% of the exam is psychology now. But I was, I was in a very uncomfortable space, but I believed I was right. So when you start talking about, you know, be it till you see it, right, I'd be, I was in a very uncomfortable space. And this is my book, Exit From Work, I write about it in my book, but I am glad I had the journey, because I feel as though I'm a better professional, and my clients appreciate it.Lesley Logan 32:21  Yeah. I mean, like, you know, years ago, I read the book Psychology of Money, right? I think that's what it's called, or maybe it's called profit, but I think that's money. And, like, I said, like, the type of person you have to be to get money is very different than the type of person you'd be to keep the money. And I was like, like, that's, by the way, that's, like, the thing I remember from the whole book, it's, but at any rate, I remember that sticking going, hold on a second. Like, we as people have to evolve, like, one on the getting, two on the keeping, and that goes kind of along with what you're saying. Like, you know, you have to understand the emotion psychology behind all of this. Because, yes, spreadsheets are great, but with AI, like, we don't need a bunch of people do a spreadsheet anymore. So there's that we need someone to help guide us to like, well, who is it like, where is this money going? What do you want to do with it? What like was also, what if, instead of like, okay, here comes our retirement age, what if it's like, oh my gosh, like, I can't even wait, or, actually, I'm going part time now, and my retirement is part time, and I'm doing all these other things. Like, that's so cool that you, I mean, you do that, it's not easy to be a trailblazer. It's not easy to be the only person talking about it, though. Gregg Lunceford 33:27  Right. It's rewarding in the end, and so, and I think a lot of people find it liberating, because if you got 20 years, you just really want to do what people tell you you ought to do. I mean, especially when you spent the first 60 doing that. And so really, what this third age is supposed to be. It's supposed to be the most dynamic part of your life, right? It is a way to course correct or either enhance something that's already gone well for you, versus a lot of people going to retirement, because that's what retirement was when it first started off, it was really this negotiation between management and labor, where, especially, we were in an industrial society. So labor was more physical, right now we're in a service economy, so it was really more cerebral. But back then, you know, they wanted a management wanted employees who could swing a hammer so many times a minute, and that was usually somebody under age 40, and this is where we start getting age protection laws, right. And anyone over 40 they wanted out of the workforce. So, you know, retirement didn't start off as this, oh, this is this great thing, and they're going to write me checks for the rest of my life. It didn't start off as that. It really started off as you were really making someone feel devalued because you you didn't have any and so we've gone along with this model. It wasn't until maybe, like the 19 late 70s or 1980s when we went into this global recession where people started getting offered these early retirement packages to come out of companies because globally, a lot of people, a lot of companies, had financial issues to deal with. And what they weren't expecting when they let this 55 year old go is that life expectancy was starting to go up, and so now this 55 year old is now living to 80, and they got the best end of the deal. And what is happening financially right now is people are looking at their parents and grandparents who got that deal, and they're going, I can never afford to do what they did, and not realizing that that was an anomaly. And so a lot of people, socially, emotionally, feel like they're failing, and they don't want to talk about retirement because they feel as though I'll never be able to do what the person did before me and therefore there must be something wrong with what I'm doing or what me and the reality is the game is changing, and so you actually have more personal freedom than they have. And just like they walked into a unique situation, you have to craft a unique situation for you that works.Lesley Logan 36:04  Yes, that, Gregg, this is, you're a historian. You're like a life coach and like the person we all need to be thinking about when it comes to like, because it doesn't matter how I mean, obviously we're told, like, the earlier you can start thinking about retirement, the better. But people don't want to do that, like I said the beginning of this. They want to put their head in the sand, like, I can't be my grandparents, so I'm just going to keep doing what I ought to do, and just and like, we'll deal with that later. We'll figure out the number later. But I think if we can, like, start thinking about it now, it really does allow us to curate the experience we have with work, but then also set ourselves up for that third age where we can have a really good time getting to know ourselves even deeper, and not not losing money along the way.Gregg Lunceford 36:51  That's correct, because in that third age, you may convert a hobby. So I have a friend who was in banking with me. He would always go take a week or two off every year and just go to Europe and backpack. He would stay at, you know, two three star hotels. He was like, I'm not there every day. And he would just go take the most amazing pictures he bring them back to the office. And we would go, Jim, you know, you should have an art show. And he was like, Nah, they're just hobbies or whatever. And he had a hard shell, and people started buying his art. And so, you know, now in retirement, you know his joy also produces income. And so he has defined work on his own terms. It doesn't even feel like work to him. And so what a lot of people who are looking at their parents and grandparents and then going, you know, they got this pension for life, and they don't offer pensions anymore, and they didn't get sandwiched. So they didn't have the burden, financial burden of raising kids and having to take care of parents. I'm stuck. I'll never be able to do that. There's something wrong you don't understand. You now have this 20 year life bonus, where you can learn to gig, you can learn to I often point to the show The Golden Girls. I don't know if the creators of the show knew what they were doing or they intentionally did this, but look at that model. I think that's the model a lot of people are going to have to go to. And I think you touched on this a little bit earlier. You start talking about your father and your in laws. And you know, we don't have kinship the way we once did, once small, we have smaller families, right? Two, geographically we disperse, right? And so what in this planning process of your ideal self, what you also have to learn how to do is to replace kinships with friendships. So that's what was going on in that in that Golden Girls house, you had Dorothy and her mother, Sophia, that had a kinship, but where they didn't have kinship, they replaced it with their roommates with Blanche and Betty (inaudible). And so now that you have this replacement of family that you trust and you get along with, now you got four people to split your rent with, so that makes the money go longer, right? Yeah, then you start talking about what went on every day. Well, sometimes they were doing volunteer work, and then they had to spin off where they bought a hotel. So they basically were doing their own version of a gig economy, right? They were engaging as much as they wanted to or not. Then they had socialization from each other. There was always something going on in that house, right? Yes. And so, right? And then they had things to create psychological success. So I don't know if the creators of the show recognized at the time, but to me, I looked at it as sort of foreshadowing what people have to create for themselves on their own with this life bonus, and it will help them both financially, as well as their mental and their mental well being. Lesley Logan 40:00  Gregg, yes. I mean, I joke with my friends who have kids. I'm like, I just want you to know that your kid is gonna have to take care of me because I don't have kids. But really, actually, I just need to find my Golden Girls, my husband. I just need to find a co op, a little commune of all of our friend all of our friends who don't have kids, we actually like what we're being with. And we could have a great little retirement home, maybe make it a BnB. This what I what I just I'm obsessed with, and why I got excited to have you on is, you know, oftentimes the Be It Till You See It podcast really talks about, like, what we can do right now, like, for right now, what we can do to be it till we see it tomorrow, or for the thing we want next year. Or there might be some stuff I have never thought of it as like, what can we be doing right now to be it till we see it for retirement in a way that we can choose, like we get the life is literally what we want, and the research you've done, the education you've had, and how you've literally seen it implemented in unique ways, because of all this work, is so cool. It makes me excited to actually, like, look into that future. Because, like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm not gonna look past 50, because I got things to do with my job, with the job that I created for myself. It's like, oh, hold on a second. What, like, what can I be playing with right now so that I know what I'm gonna do past 50, so that I have something to look forward to. So I'm excited about it. So, Gregg, what are you most excited about right now?Gregg Lunceford 41:20  I'm excited about I'm writing and researching and learning about the person I'm becoming. So and so I often joke with my clients, but I'm really not joking. They'll come back and they'll tell me some amazing experience they had, and I always tell them, leave me a list of notes so I know where to start when it comes to my time, and I say that jokingly, but it's something it is serious. What we all need to start to focus on right now is just like we had that career guidance counselor helping us and coaching us. And to that next thing, we need to start taking time to figure out that action plan for that next thing. And once you start to figure out I need to form a retirement identity and understand my ideal self, you start to self motivate and become excited about it. So what I really enjoy about what I've done through my work, whether it be here as an advisor or through my research, is that I'm helping people understand that they have a lot to be encouraged by, right? You're going to get 20 years to do whatever it is you want to do. And what I also want people to be understanding of. You don't have to leave the workforce if you're doing something awesome already. Just keep doing it. And if you want to modify that in some kind of way, figure out a plan, or figure out your terms and how to negotiate those terms. Say you can do that. Lesley Logan 42:51  Oh, I just like each answer. I just get more excited for people. I'm excited for myself. Like, I'm like, wow, this is so fun. We're gonna take a brief break and then find out where people can find you, follow you, work with you and your Be It Action Items. Lesley Logan 43:00  Okay, Gregg, where can they connect with you? You have a book, Exit From Work, but where, where can they go to chat with you, work with you like, get more ideas about their retirement identity?Gregg Lunceford 43:14  Sure, so I can be reached at mesirow.com so our website, M-E-S-I-R-O-W dot com, on that, if you put in my name in our search engine, Gregg Lunceford, you'll come up with my team web page. We'll have my bio, my contact information, also a list of all my publications. Also, if you're interested in my book, Exit From Work. This can be found on amazon.com, and I'm always encouraged by people who take time to drop me a note, or we didn't even go into I talked about the Golden Girls situation. We didn't even go into their academically based retirement communities. Now, basically, instead of dormitory you lived in when you were in your late teens and 20s, now people are going back to retire near where they went to school. So they now have, because we don't have these kinships, they're now bracing building friendships based on the fact that they're alumni, or they love the school and and so it's sort of like this, you were living in the Golden Girls subdivision, maybe. Lesley Logan 44:15  Oh, my God. Gregg Lunceford 44:15  So there are all kinds of things that are going on right now, and I just, I write about it in my book too. I just want people to learn about that so they don't feel as though they're confined to what they saw their parents do. Lesley Logan 44:27  Yeah, yeah. Oh my gosh, Brad, when you listen to this, we'll choose your school, because he went to music school, so we'll choose that one.Gregg Lunceford 44:37  He could, he could probably teach all the people I know they want to start a rock band. Lesley Logan 44:41  Yeah, yeah, yeah, him and his buddies. That could be their whole little they would love it. Okay, you've given us a lot, but I do want to dive into the bold, executable, intrinsic or targeted steps people can take to be it till they see it. What do you have for us?Gregg Lunceford 44:56  Okay, so what you first have to do is you have to create a vision. And if you have a partner, it is very important that that be a shared vision. The last thing we want to do is get to the end of our career and then have conflict with our partner. And a lot of that happens because most couples do not talk about retirement. They don't even know if the other partners is saving for retirement. Like 40% couples don't even talk about this. Don't even do the calculation to get past them. So so if you haven't even done the basics on that end, talking about this thing you aspire to be is very difficult because And so last thing you want to do is you both jump in it, and then you you're stuck and you're unhappy. So create a vision. If you have a partner, make sure that's a shared vision. And then start talking about goals. Engage someone like myself, who's a financial planning professional, to help you see how you can align your financial wherewithal with those goals. And then think differently. Think about being your best self at this stage, not being someone who society just said it's time for you to leave, because that's not the case. You have more value to offer a lot of people than you think.Lesley Logan 46:07  I do, I love that. This is an episode I really hope my in-laws actually listen to. I really am. I'm actually just really excited for even our our listeners who who are like, you know, they might be in there. They might be, like, 15, 20 years away from retirement, but, or even 10, but, like, we have a bunch of them, and I hope this helps them rethink that, because I think sometimes there's a fear to, oh, my God, you know. And you just said it like being the system has told them that they're done, but you're not done. And so I just you've given, like, so much excitement around this topic, and joy and possibility. So Gregg, thank you for being you. You all, how are you going to use these tips in your life? We want to know. Make sure you tell Gregg Lunceford your takeaways. I'm sure it will make his day. Share this with friend who needs to hear it, that friend who's like, so worried all the time, like, absolutely needs this. And you know what to do until next time, Be It Till You See It. Lesley Logan 47:01  That's all I got for this episode of the Be It Till You See It Podcast. One thing that would help both myself and future listeners is for you to rate the show and leave a review and follow or subscribe for free wherever you listen to your podcast. Also, make sure to introduce yourself over at the Be It Pod on Instagram. I would love to know more about you. Share this episode with whoever you think needs to hear it. Help us and others Be It Till You See It. Have an awesome day. Be It Till You See It is a production of The Bloom Podcast Network. If you want to leave us a message or a question that we might read on another episode, you can text us at +1-310-905-5534 or send a DM on Instagram @BeItPod.Brad Crowell 47:44  It's written, filmed, and recorded by your host, Lesley Logan, and me, Brad Crowell.Lesley Logan 47:49  It is transcribed, produced and edited by the epic team at Disenyo.co.Brad Crowell 47:54  Our theme music is by Ali at Apex Production Music and our branding by designer and artist, Gianfranco Cioffi.Lesley Logan 48:01  Special thanks to Melissa Solomon for creating our visuals.Brad Crowell 48:04  Also to Angelina Herico for adding all of our content to our website. And finally to Meridith Root for keeping us all on point and on time.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/be-it-till-you-see-it/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Chasing unqualified leads is costing you time, money, and momentum. Want better clients—not just more of them?In this episode of The Business Ownership Podcast I interviewed Mark Osborne. Mark is the  Fractional Revenue Leader for Professional Services & B2B SaaS at Modern Revenue Strategies. Recognized by AdAge Magazine as one of the world's Top 25 “Marketing Technology Trailblazers” in 2017 and a #1 Best-Selling Selling Author on B2B Marketing and Sales, Mark Osborne brings decades of experience creating Revenue Growth Systems for B2B SaaS, Tech, and Boutique Professional Services Firms. Mark has delivered tens of millions of dollars in revenue for his clients, often doubling revenues in 90 days through his focus on building Systems that emphasize strategic approaches to growth. He is founder of Modern Revenue Strategies offering a "10X ROI B2B Growth Guarantee" and a Free Diagnostic Tool to identify your fastest path to growth.Stop marketing to everyone. Start winning the right customers. Learn how to find your most profitable customers.Check this out!Show Links:Modern Revenue Startegies: https://modernrevenuestrategies.com/diagnostic/Mark Osborne on LinkedIn:  Mark Osborne, MBA, CEPA® | LinkedInBook a call with Michelle: https://go.appointmentcore.com/book/IcFD4cGJoin our Facebook group for business owners to get help or help other business owners!The Business Ownership Group - Secrets to Scaling: https://www.facebook.com/groups/businessownershipsecretstoscalingLooking to scale your business? Get free gifts here to help you on your way: https://www.awarenessstrategies.com/

FranBridge is led by its Founder, Jon Ostenson, a top 1% Franchise Consultant in the US, and a frequent contributor on franchising across a variety of outlets and publications. Jon is a multi-brand franchisee himself, and along with his business partners, he has great operators leading these ventures. As a result, he is able to commit over 90% of his time to helping others achieve their own dreams of freedom and wealth generation through business ownership. Prior to FranBridge, Jon was the President of ShelfGenie, a national franchise system with 200 locations. Before he began his franchising career with ShelfGenie, Jon spent 15 years in the corporate world, most recently as the Vice President of Sales for Carter's Inc., responsible for over $350M in annual sales. Jon began his career as a Consultant with Accenture, often working internationally on behalf of clients. Jon serves on the Board of the Entrepreneurs Organization and is active in supporting charitable organizations, including Growing Leaders and Hope International. Jon has BBA and MBA degrees from the University of Georgia and lives in Atlanta, where he and his wife, Jenny, have 3 children and are very active in the community.

Amy Liu is Founder and CEO of best-selling sensitive skin-friendly beauty brand Tower 28. After graduating from the University of California San Diego, Amy got her MBA in marketing and entrepreneurship from the University of Southern California. She led a successful 20+ year career as a beauty executive, building some of the fastest-growing prestige brands including Smashbox, Kate Somerville, and Josie Maran Cosmetics. But as a longtime eczema sufferer, she couldn't enjoy the best part of working in beauty: trying out all the products! She saw this challenge as an opportunity, and so in 2019, Amy launched Tower 28: a beauty company designed to be a safe space for sensitive skin. Tower 28's award-winning SOS skincare line is the first to earn seals of approval from the National Psoriasis Foundation, National Rosacea Society, and National Eczema Association— a testament to its commitment to skin-safe, effective formulations. It's also the only beauty brand to 100% adhere to the National Eczema Association's Ingredient Guidelines across all skincare and color products, ensuring the entire line is free of every known skin irritant.Follow Amy Liu hereFollow Tower 28 Beauty hereShop Tower 28 Beauty here - Use code THEBIGMOVE20 for 20% off your purchase at https://www.tower28beauty.com/  Follow The Big Move Podcast hereFollow Host Em here  Listener Note: This episode touches on sensitive topics, including febrile seizure in children and the Los Angeles fires, which may be hard to hear for some listeners.

In this episode, Susan Moffatt-Bruce, MD, PhD, MBA, President of Lahey Hospital and Medical Center and Professor of Surgery at UMass Chan Lahey Regional Medical School Campus, Beth Israel Lahey Health, shares how her organization expanded access into new communities, advanced AI driven care, and prepared for workforce and innovation challenges ahead.

What does it really take to lead with courage in environments that were not built for you? Gretchen Gagel, PhD, a trailblazer with four decades of experience in the construction industry, shares what she has learned about unconscious bias, the importance of male allies, and what it takes to create truly safe and inclusive workplaces. We also explore Gretchen's concept of grounded self-leadership, rooted in courage, humility, and critical thinking, and her bold vision for the International Institute for Women in Construction, a Global Institute dedicated to accelerating the success of women in construction, mining, and energy. This conversation is practical, hopeful, and deeply encouraging for leaders in any industry. Gretchen has degrees in Mechanical Engineering, an MBA, and a PhD in Leadership, Organization Culture, and Change. She's the former Chair of Brinkman Construction and the author of a new book, Building Women Leaders: A Blueprint for Women Thriving in Construction.  You'll discover: The real barriers women still face in construction and similar industriesWhy male allies play a critical role in inclusive leadershipHow grounded self-leadership strengthens confidence and credibilityWhat zero-tolerance cultures look like in actionHow research, storytelling, and convening leaders can drive lasting changeCheck out all the episodesLeave a review on Apple PodcastsConnect with Meredith on LinkedInFollow Meredith on TwitterDownload the free ebook Listen Like a Pro

Join Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS for a masterclass on email marketing strategies that actually drive revenue. In this session, Favour breaks down the power of segmented email campaigns, explains the metrics that matter, and shares how to build a website-first content strategy that turns subscribers into customers. Learn how to leverage free tools, automate your email sequences, and create long-term relationships with your audience through strategic, data-driven email marketing ROI.Whether you're just starting with email marketing or looking to optimize your existing campaigns, this episode delivers actionable insights you can implement immediately to boost engagement and generate sustainable revenue.What You'll Learn✓ How to use segmented emails to increase revenue and engagement✓ The difference between click-through rate and click rate (and why it matters)✓ Why your website is the foundation of successful email marketing✓ Google's E-E-A-T framework for creating helpful content✓ How to repurpose one piece of content across multiple channels✓ Which free tools every email marketer should be using✓ The "website-first" content strategy that saves time and builds SEO✓ How to create automated email sequences that work 24/7Top 7 Email Marketing Best Practices1. Use Segmented Emails StrategicallyCreate segments based on subscriber behavior and preferences. Use polls and interactive elements to gather data, then tag links to track which subscribers are interested in which offerings.2. Build a Helpful, Responsive WebsiteYour website should be fast-loading, mobile-friendly, and provide genuine value. Focus on Google's E-E-A-T framework: Experience, Expertise, Authority, and Trust.3. Create Content on Your Website FirstPublish content on your website before sharing on social media. This builds your owned digital assets, improves SEO, and gives you more control over distribution.4. Leverage Email Metrics for Continuous ImprovementTrack who opens, clicks, and takes action. Identify your most engaged subscribers and create VIP segments for them. Use this data to refine your messaging over time.5. Implement Scheduled and Automated Email SequencesSet up automated sequences that trigger based on subscriber actions. Create welcome series, nurture campaigns, and re-engagement flows that work around the clock.6. Repurpose Content Across Multiple FormatsTake one long-form piece and break it into blog posts, social media updates, podcast episodes, videos, and email newsletters. Maximize your content creation efforts.7. Focus on Long-term Relationship BuildingNot everyone opens emails the day you send them. Be consistent with your schedule, provide ongoing value, and build trust over time rather than chasing quick sales.Key Metrics to TrackDeliverability Rate - Percentage of emails reaching subscriber inboxesOpen Rate - Percentage of delivered emails that get openedClick Rate - Percentage of delivered emails with link clicksClick-Through Rate (CTR) - Percentage of opened emails with link clicksConversion Rate - Percentage completing your desired actionPodcast Episode Timestamps[00:00] Episode introduction: Email marketing best practices that earn revenue[00:40] Why segmented emails are the #1 revenue driver[03:06] How to create segments triggered by scheduled emails[03:37] Example: Segmenting by in-person vs. virtual event preferences[06:00] Using polls to understand what your audience really wants[07:00] Revenue starts at the beginning: building systems for MRR[08:00] Click-through rate vs. click rate explained[09:00] Identifying and segmenting your most engaged subscribers[10:00] Tracking email opens and clicks consistently[10:30] Creating VIP segments for highly engaged subscribers[14:00] Re-engaging inactive subscribers through targeted campaigns[15:00] Email deliverability and its impact on revenue[17:00] Understanding spam filters and how to avoid them[18:00] Email authentication: SPF, DKIM, and DMARC[20:00] Real case study: Client ranking page one for competitive keywords[21:42] Technical SEO: indexing, blogs, location pages, schema markup[23:00] Email marketing as direct response marketing[24:00] Why not everyone opens emails immediately (and that's okay)[25:00] Best Practice #1: Have a helpful, responsive website[25:32] Google's E-E-A-T framework: Experience, Expertise, Authority, Trust[26:22] You have less than 10 seconds to make an impression[27:00] The "website-first" content strategy[27:22] Free analytics tools: Google Search Console, GA4, Bing, Microsoft Clarity[28:00] Repurposing one article into multiple content formats[30:00] Maximizing content value through strategic repurposing[32:00] Creating content pillars and topic clusters[33:00] Planning content calendars aligned with email campaigns[35:00] Balancing evergreen content with timely topics[37:00] Creating lead magnets that attract quality subscribers[39:00] A/B testing email subject lines and content[40:00] Overview of popular email marketing platforms[41:00] Mailchimp: features, pricing, and best use cases[42:00] Constant Contact for small businesses and nonprofits[43:00] Brevo (formerly Sendinblue): affordable with SMS capabilities[44:00] HubSpot: comprehensive CRM and marketing automation[45:00] Choosing the right platform for your business needs[46:00] Free tier options and when to upgrade[50:00] Advanced segmentation for e-commerce businesses[51:00] Using behavioral triggers to increase conversions[52:00] Email in omnichannel marketing strategies[53:00] Measuring ROI from email campaigns[54:00] Common email marketing mistakes to avoid[57:00] Recap of key best practices[59:00] Closing remarks and next session announcement[59:29] Tomorrow's topic: Search Engine Marketing & SEO Best Practices (11 AM Central)Tools & Resources MentionedEmail Marketing Platforms: Flodesk >> Sign up and Get 50% OffAnalytics Tools: Google Search Console, Google Analytics (GA4), Bing Webmaster Tools, Microsoft Clarity, Fathom Analytics, Matomo AnalyticsOther Tools: Eventbrite, PinterestSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this strategic follow-up, Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS unveils the powerful, interconnected Microsoft ecosystem and why it's a game-changer for SEO. Move beyond Google and discover how Bing, Perplexity AI, and LinkedIn work together to build your website's authority and visibility in the age of AI search.We delve into the crucial, often-missed strategy for new websites: using Bing Webmaster Tools as a "language bridge" to accelerate Google's recognition of your site. Learn why your website must become your proprietary first-party data asset and how structured content gets cited by platforms like Perplexity.This episode is your roadmap to LLM (Large Language Model) Visibility, providing actionable steps on building trust signals, implementing schema markup, and creating a unified content structure that works across all platforms—not against them.Need to Book An SEO Discovery Call for Advertising or Marketing Services?>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Book a Complimentary SEO Discovery Call with Favour Obasi-Ike⁠>> Visit Work and PLAY Entertainment website to learn about our digital marketing services>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our exclusive SEO Marketing community⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Read SEO Articles>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to the We Don't PLAY Podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Purchase Flaev Beatz Beats Online

The financials of your practice are kind of like a patient's labs – they tell you a lot about that practice's health. Knowing your practice's financials as well as a patient's labs makes a lot of sense. My guest today is an owner in a private practice and knows their financials that well. Additionally, she consults with practice owners to help them do the same. She'll help us get started on how you can, too.Katie Nunn, MBA, CMPE, provides training and coaching for healthcare leaders and their organizations on process improvement, financial optimization, and cultural transformation. Leveraging extensive experience with financial and operational turnarounds, she is a valuable advisor for an organization experiencing rapid expansion or change. With over 20 years' experience in healthcare leadership, her broad areas of expertise include practice assessments, process improvement, financial management, IT implementations, telemedicine, strategic planning, providers on-boarding, and cultural transformation.In this episode Carl White and Katie Nunn discuss:Why you don't need an MBA or an accounting degree to know your financials wellThe handful of key financials to know about your practice and what to know about themHow to set up financial reporting to make them as easy to read as lab resultsWant to be a guest on PracticeCare®?Have an experience with a business issue you think others will benefit from? Come on PracticeCare® and tell the world! Here's the link where you can get the process started.Connect with Katie Nunnhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/bright-ideas-medical-consulting/Connect with Carl WhiteWebsite: http://www.marketvisorygroup.comEmail:  whitec@marketvisorygroup.comFacebook:  https://www.facebook.com/marketvisorygroupYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD9BLCu_i2ezBj1ktUHVmigLinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/healthcaremktg

In this episode, David Millili and Steve Carran sit down with Kunal Shah, Managing Partner of Travel & Hospitality at ZS, to explore the future of the hotel industry in 2026, key revenue strategies, and how technology is reshaping guest experiences.Kunal shares insights from his global career—starting at United Airlines, earning an MBA at London Business School, and now leading ZS's travel and hospitality practice. He breaks down the biggest opportunities and challenges hotels face today, including RevPAR pressure, AI adoption, guest personalization, and new revenue streams beyond rooms.Whether you're a hotel operator, GM, revenue manager, or hospitality investor—this episode is packed with practical strategies and industry foresight.What You'll Learn in This Episode:2026 hospitality trends & industry outlookWhy RevPAR growth is plateauingHow hotels can improve guest engagement & incremental revenueThe most promising new revenue streams beyond roomsWhy relationships & intellectual curiosity matter in hospitality leadershipThis episode is sponsored by ZSWatch the FULL EPISODE on YouTube: https://youtu.be/7y2WcNmOwfoLinks:Contact ZSKunal on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ksshah/ZS: https://www.zs.com/For full show notes head to: https://themodernhotelier.com/episode/245Follow on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-...Join the conversation on today's episode on The Modern Hotelier LinkedIn pageConnect with Steve and David:Steve: https://www.linkedin.com/in/%F0%9F%8E...David: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-mil.

Protecting your ideas can be the difference between building momentum and watching someone else run with your work. In this episode of Unstoppable Mindset, I sit down with patent attorney and entrepreneur Devin Miller to explore what founders and business owners really need to know about patents, trademarks, and intellectual property. Devin shares how his background in engineering, startups, and law shaped his approach to innovation, and he breaks down the real differences between provisional and non-provisional patents in clear, practical terms. We talk about common mistakes entrepreneurs make, how legal protection supports growth instead of slowing it down, and why understanding intellectual property early can help you compete with confidence. I believe this conversation will give you clarity, direction, and a stronger foundation for protecting what you work so hard to create. Highlights: 00:01:18 – Hear how growing up in a small town shaped Devin's approach to problem-solving and business.00:12:53 – Learn why Devin combined engineering, business, and law instead of choosing a single career path.00:19:32 – Discover how a student competition turned into a real wearable technology startup.00:30:57 – Understand the clear difference between patents, trademarks, and copyrights.00:33:05 – Learn when a provisional patent makes sense and when it does not.00:53:52 – Discover what practical options exist when competitors copy or knock off your product. About the Guest: Devin Miller is the founder of Miller IP, a firm launched in 2018 that helps startups and small businesses protect their inventions and brands without breaking the bank. He's overseen over a thousand patent and trademark filings with a 95 percent success rate on patents and an 85 percent success rate on trademarks, making sure garage inventors and side hustlers get the same high-quality service as big tech. Before starting his firm, Devin spent years at large law firms working with clients like Intel and Amazon, but he found his true passion in helping scrappy entrepreneurs turn ideas into assets. He blends legal know how with an entrepreneur's mindset, offering flat fee packages, DIY legal tools, and hosting webinars and a podcast series to demystify IP. A lifelong runner who knocks out 10+ miles a day and 30-40 miles daily biking (except Sunday), Devin listens to audiobooks and podcasts while training for marathons. When he's not drafting office action responses or co-hosting Inventive Journey, you might catch him brainstorming the next Inventive Youth program or sipping coffee while sketching partnership agreements. Ways to connect with Devin**:** If you'd like to talk strategy or swap running playlist recs, feel free to schedule a chat at http://strategymeeting.com LinkedIn profile  https://www.linkedin.com/in/lawwithmiller/ Firm website [https://www.lawwithmiller.com](https://www.lawwithmiller.com "https://www.lawwithmiller.com") About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset . Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes: Michael Hingson  00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us. Well, hello to all of you, wherever you happen to be today, you are listening to or watching or both unstoppable mindset and I am your host. Mike hingson, our guest today is Devin Miller, who founded the company, Miller IP, and he'll tell us all about that and what that means and so on as we go through this. But I will tell you that he is a lawyer. He deals with patents and other things and a lot of stuff relating to startups. I think that's going to be a lot of fun to talk about. So without any further ado, as it were, Devin, welcome to unstoppable mindset. We're really glad you're here. Thanks for having me on. Excited to be here. Well, we're glad. We're glad you're here. Can you hear me? Okay, now I hear you. Devin Miller  02:06 Well, we're sorry for the delay, but I said I'm excited to be here and looking forward to chatting. Michael Hingson  02:11 Well, perfect. Well, let's start. I love to always do this. Let's start kind of at the beginning. Why don't you tell us about the early Devon, growing up and all that? Devin Miller  02:21 You know, I I'm happy to do. I don't know there's anything that probably stands out. I was probably fairly typical. So I was raised in a religious family, so we're attended church regularly every week. And I had a couple sisters, an older and a younger one, and was went through, went through schooling and or studied, probably the typical course. So I don't know there's anything stands out. I was in a small town, so grew up as, probably not as small as I'd like it to be anymore, but a small farming town, and it was, it was kind of always enjoyed the small town fill, and actually am back to being in that same hometown where I live now with my family. But yeah, so I did that, and I did probably the at the time, the typical thing with the it's growing up with kids and sports and doing things, and went through high school and and after that, jumped or went off to college. But I don't know if there's anything in particular that stands out in my mind, other than probably, at least in my mind, a pretty typical childhood and upbringing, but enjoyed it nonetheless. But happy to provide any details or I can jump into a bit about college. Michael Hingson  03:38 Well, where did you go to college? Devin Miller  03:40 Yeah, so I went to Brigham, young university, just or BYU, just out here in Utah. So I went off to so, or I graduated high school and I went off to a year of college. So I went off to BYU, kind of intending to go into electrical engineering, which is what I or one of the degrees I ended up studying with, and then I did that for a year, and after which I went off and did a served a religious mission for my church, so Church of Jesus Christ, or Latter Day Saints, otherwise nicknamed Mormon. So I went off and went to Taiwan for about two years. So didn't have any idea, even at that point where Taiwan was and certainly didn't know the language, but when studied that, or they have a training center where you get an opportunity to study it for about three months. So I studied it and then went off to Taiwan and served that religious mission for my church for a couple years before coming back to the high school, or good, not the high school to college to continue my studies. Michael Hingson  04:43 I several, several comments. One, I know what you mean about small hometowns. We moved from Chicago, where I was born, to California when I was five, we moved to a town called Palmdale, and it was a very small rural town about 60. Five miles north of Los Angeles. I don't know what the population was when we first moved there, but it couldn't have been more than 1000 or 1500 people spread out over a little bit of a distance. For me, it was great, because without there being a lot of traffic, I was able to do things I might not have done nearly as well in Chicago things like riding a bike, learning to ride a bike and walking to school and and not ever fearing about walking to school for any reasons, including being blind. But oftentimes I once I learned how to do it, I rode my own bike to school and locked it in the bike rack and then rode home and all that. But then Palmdale started to grow and I'm not quite sure what the population is today, but I live in a town about 55 miles east of Palmdale called Victorville, and as I described Victorville growing up, it was not even a speck on a radar scope compared to the small town of Palmdale, but we we moved down to Southern California from the Bay Area my wife and I to be closer to family and so on. In 2014 we wanted to build a house for Karen, because she was in a wheelchair her whole life. So we wanted to get a a house that would be accessible. And my gosh, the only place we could find any property was Victorville. And at that time, in 2014 it had 115,000 people in it. It has grown. Now it Devin Miller  06:31 has grown. And it tends to be that, you know, it feels like everybody's always kind of chasing the small town then, or people find out about it. Everybody moves in. It's no longer a small town, and then you're off to chasing the the next small town, wherever that might be. So it's kind of a perpetual cycle of of chasing that small or at least for the people to like it. Not everybody loves it, but I'm certainly a proponent of chasing that small town feel from from place to places, as you're trying to or trying to find or recreate what you probably grew up with. So it is a it is a cycle that everybody I think is chasing, Michael Hingson  07:09 yeah, well, for me now, my wife passed away in 2022 we were married 40 years. And so the thing about it is that there are probably advantages for me living alone, being in a place that has a few more people and a few more of the kind of amenities that at least somewhat larger towns have, like a Costco and some some restaurants. We actually live in a homeowner's development, a homeowner's association called Spring Valley Lake, and I live within walking distance of the Country Club, which has a nice restaurant, so I'm able to go to the to the restaurant whenever I choose, and that's kind of nice. So there's value for me and being here and people say, Well, do you ever want to move from Victorville now that your wife died? And why do I want to do that? Especially since I have a 3.95% mortgage? You know, I'm not going to do that, and I'm in a new house that. Well, relatively new. It was built in 2016 so it's pretty much built to code. And insulation is great. Solar is great on the house. Air conditioning works, so I can't complain. Devin Miller  08:20 No, sounds like a good setup, and it's kind of one where, why, if you enjoy where you're at, why would you move to go somewhere else that you wouldn't necessarily enjoy? So it just sounds like it works out. Michael Hingson  08:29 Well, it does, and I can always, as I need to being a keynote speaker and traveling, there's a shuttle that'll take me down to the nearest airports. So that works out. Well, that's awesome. So you went to, I'm a little bit familiar with the the whole LDS missionary program, Mission program, we we were not part of the church, but we lived, when my wife and I got married, we lived in Mission Viejo and we had neighbors right next door to us, who were members of the church, and they came over one day and they said, we have an issue. And I said, Okay. And my wife said, Okay, what's the issue? Well, we have a couple of missionaries coming in, and the only homes that are available to these two boys are homes that already have young female girls in them. So they really can't be in those homes. Would you be willing to rent your one of your rooms to missionaries? And so we said, and well, Karen said, because she was a member of the Methodist church, we said, as long as they don't try to mormonize us, we won't try to methodize them. And we would love to do it. And it worked out really well. We had a couple of missionaries for a while, and then they switched out. And eventually we had a gentleman from Tonga for a while, and we actually had a couple girls for for a while. So it worked out really well, and we we got to know them all, and it was a great relationship. And they did their work, and at Christmas time, they certainly were invited to our Christmas parties. We. Had every year a party. What we actually had was what we call a Christmas tree upping. We got the tree, we brought it into the house, and we invited all of our friends and neighbors to come and decorate the tree in the house. Because, needless to say, we weren't going to do that very well. Karen especially wasn't going to be able to stand up and decorate the tree. So we got them to do all the tree decorations and all that, and we fed them. So it worked out. Devin Miller  10:26 Well, it's awesome. Sounds like, great. And you hit on. I said, that's probably my, my favorite part of the Christmas is a Christmas tree. So growing up, we always had a real live tree, but it was always, you know, it was downstairs in the basement, and had lower ceilings. And so I was always kind of the opinion, hey, when I grow up, I want to have the a huge, you know, kind of like in the newbies at 20 plus or 20 or 20 plus foot tree, yeah. And lo and behold, we, or at least the couple houses that we build have always had, at least in the living space, have had the pretty high ceilings. And so that's always what we do. We'll go out and we'll cut down a live tree. So we'll go out to kind of in nature, to the forest, where they let you cut them down, and we'll, we'll cut down, usually it's around a 20 plus foot tree, and then have it strung up in the house. And I always tell my wife, I said, I'd rather that one could be my Christmas present. I'd be just as happy, because as long as I have my tree, it's a good Christmas for me. Michael Hingson  11:23 Yeah, oh, I hear you. Well, one of the boys who lived next door to us went off on a mission to, I think it was Argentina, and was gone for, I guess, two years. What was really funny is when he came back, it took him a while to re acclimatize his speaking English and getting back his American accent. He was he definitely had much more of a Spanish accent, and was much more used to speaking Spanish for a while. So the the three month exposure period certainly got him started at the at the center there in Utah. And then he went off and did his missionary work and then came home. But, you know, it's, it's got to be a wonderful and a very valuable experience. How do you think it affected you? Devin Miller  12:10 Yeah, I think I said, I think it would be, you said it probably well, is it like one where to say, Hey, this is the most fun time in your life, and you'll never have a more fun time. I don't know that. It's kind of like, you know, I liken it to I so I like to do a lot of running, so or in older years. I don't know that I was as much in younger years, but kind of discovered not that I love running, per se, but love to get out and decompress and otherwise, kind of have a time where I don't have a lot of intrusions or other things that are pressing in on life. And so with that, you know, I've done a number of marathons and marathons, you know, everybody again, says, Well, did you have fun? Or was it a good or was it good marathon? So I don't know that it's ever fun. I don't and do it, but it's a good accomplishment. You it's, you go out, you set your mind to something, and then otherwise, at the end of the day, you reach your goal. And, you know, kind of has the that sense of accomplishment and learning and become improving yourself. That's probably a lot of how I like in a mission is, you know, you have a lot of stresses of learning a new language, being in a different culture, doing something that you're unfamiliar with or not accustomed to, and at the end, you know, you learn a lot of things, you are gain a lot of skills. You hopefully impact a lot of people's lives for the better. And so it is definitely one of those where it's a great accomplishment, but it's not, you know, it's not one way to say, hey, this was a fun vacation where I got to go play for two years. So it it works out well, and I would absolutely do it again. Michael Hingson  13:31 Yeah, I'm sure you learned a lot, and you probably learned a whole lot more in a lot of ways, than most of the people that you you visited with because you treated it as an adventure and an adventure to learn. So that's pretty cool, absolutely. So you came back from that and you went back to college, and did you continue in electrical engineering? Or what Devin Miller  13:56 did you do? Yes and no. So I did continue in electrical engineering. Or so I came back and, you know, the intent was, and what I continue to do is to study electrical engineering. I did add on a second degree, which I was a Mandarin Chinese and so I can't remember, I mentioned I I served in Taiwan for those couple years and had an opportunity to kind of, you know, learn and study the language. So as I was doing that, I kind of came back and said, Well, if I've already put in the effort to learn the language and to study it, I might as well, you know, utilize it, or add it to the degree. And so I I really started, or I added that as a second degree to the first degree. So I came out with both the degree in Chinese or man or Chinese, as well as electrical engineering. So yes, continue to study that. And then from that, you know, kind of just as a part of that story. So I was coming out, kind of getting, you know, the senior year, kind of getting towards the end of that degree, and looked at and said, you know, what do I want to do when I grow up? And I still know if I know the full answer, but I did look at it and say, Hey, I, you know, I don't know exactly what I want to do when I grow up, but I don't, I like engineering. Engineering, but I don't want to be an engineer in the sense that, you know, not that I didn't like engineering, but it was one where a typical electrical engineers, you come out of graduate school, you go work for a big company. You're a very small cog and a very big Will you work for. You know, 1015, years, you gain enough experience to have any say your direction and what projects you work on or really have any impact. Not saying that's not really what I want to do when I grow up, or when I start into the working world. And so kind of with that, I, you know, I had a couple interests I enjoyed, you know, kind of the startup, small business, kind of that type of world. And I also found it interesting to on the legal aspect of intellectual property, so patents, trademarks, and really more. At the idea of, hey, you're going to work with a lot of cooling or cool inventions, cool people are working on a lot of unique things, and you get a lot more variety. And you get, you know, kind of be more impactful. And so that was kind of the the Crossroads I found myself at saying which, you know, kind of which direction I want to go. And, you know, kind of, rather than take one or the other, I kind of, I split the road and decided I was going to do both. So I went off to graduate school and did both an MBA or a master's in business administration as well as a law degree, kind of focused more on intellectual property. So went off and studied both of those kind of with the intent of, you know, I don't want to just be fit into one box or do just one thing, but I'd like to keep a foot in the business world, startup world, and have an opportunity to pursue my own business as well as doing the law degree. So I did that in a Case Western Reserve out in Cleveland, Ohio, studying both of those degrees Michael Hingson  16:34 when you were getting your degree in manner, in Chinese. Was that all about speaking the language, or was it also involved in history and civilization and understanding more about China? What was it like? Devin Miller  16:47 It was really more, certainly, there was a or, I guess, are you saying within college or within the mission itself? 16:54 In college? Okay, yeah. I mean, it was, Devin Miller  16:57 it was still primarily focused on the language. You know, the nice thing is, you can test out of a number of the, you know, entry level or their beginning classes, as long as you can show a proficiency. So there may have been some of that, and you still got, you know, some of the classes, would you still study a little bit of poetry, or, you know, within the language context, they've used poetry as a way to kind of learn different aspects of the language. You'd get a little bit of history, but pretty, or vast majority of focus was kind of both speaking as well as the the written and, you know, those are really as opposed to, like English speaking, where it's phonetics and you can or sound out and kind of understand what a you know, what something means by sounding it out, you don't have to know the word in order To, you know, to pronounce it. Chinese is not that way. So you have characters that are just every character you have to memorize. There is no phonetics. There's no way that you can look at a character and sound it out. And so there's a large amount of just memorizing, memorizing, you know, 20,000 characters to read a newspaper type of a thing. And then on the flip side is you have to learn the language, which is, you know, which are already focused on that, more on the mission, but you have to do pronunciation, so you can say the same word with different tones and it has entirely different meaning. So really, there was enough there on the language side, they tended to primarily focus on that, just because there was quite a bit there to Michael Hingson  18:19 dive into. It's a complicated language. Devin Miller  18:23 It it is certainly or uniquely different from English. I would say probably English to Chinese speakers is the hardest language because it's the most different from their language. And vice versa for English speaking Chinese is at least one of the this or harder languages because it is entirely different. So it is one that has a lot of intricacies that you get to learn. Michael Hingson  18:45 I took German in high school for three years, and then in college, I did a lot of shortwave listening and encountered radio Japan a bunch. So I actually took a year of Japanese, and I think from a written language, it's a lot more complicated than spoken language. I think it's a lot more straightforward than Chinese and a lot of ways easier to learn. But even so, it is different than than Latin languages by any standard. Devin Miller  19:16 But it is. It's an animal in and of itself, but it makes it fun. Michael Hingson  19:21 Yeah, that's right, it does make it fun. Incident. And then, as I said, it was an adventure. And all of that was, was an adventure. My master's is in physics. That was an adventure. And until you spend a lot of time dealing with physics and hopefully getting beyond just doing the math, you learn how much of a philosophical bent and how much about society and the way things work really is wrapped up in physics. So again, it's it's kind of fun, and unlike a lot of physicists or engineers. I've never thought that one is better or worse than the other. I think they both have purposes. And so as a physics person, I never pick on engineers. Devin Miller  20:11 I am, I wouldn't pick up. I wouldn't pick on any physics or physicists or physics majors, either, because that's equally, if not more difficult. And so there's a lot of learning that goes on and involved with all of them. But they're all of them are fun areas to Michael Hingson  20:26 study with. They are. So once you you got your master's degrees, and you you got your law degree, what did you go off and do? Devin Miller  20:36 Yeah, so I mean, I would probably back it up just a little bit. So kind of during that period where I was getting the degrees, couple things happened. Had a couple kids. So started out first kid while I was doing the, I guess the second year where I was in under or doing the law and MBA degree, doing it as a joint degree. And so had the had a kid. And then during that same period, the next year, about a year about a year and a half later, had another kid. And so that puts me as a it's a four year program, if you combine both of them together. And so I was in the kind of the third year, the four year program. And while I was doing those studies, you know, I had a I was doing a couple things. One is, I was doing the both, or studying both majors, raising the family. I was working about 20 hours as a law clerk or for a law firm, and then during that, I can't remember or if it was a flyer, or if it was, you know, an email or whatnot, but came across a business competition, or it's kind of a, it was kind of a, a multi disciplinary competition wherever, you know, people of different degrees and different fields of study would get together, you form a group of four or five, and you work on developing an idea, and then you would enter it into the competition and see how it goes. And so we did that the first year, and we did something, an idea to make Gym Bags less smelly, and then enter that in and took second place. And during that period, next year comes along, we're all in our final year of our degree. And as we're doing that, we are studying the degree and or entering the competition again. And we decided to do something different. It was for wearables. You know, this is before Apple Watch, or, you know, the Fitbit, or anything else. It was well before I knew that, but we just said, Hey, when I was there, thinking, hey, wouldn't it be cool I'd ran my or, I think, my second marathon that time. Wouldn't it be awesome if you could monitor your hydration level so that you can make sure you're staying well hydrated throughout and it helps with the air, not being a sore and being, you know, quicker recovery and performing better. And so out of that, took the genesis of that idea, entered it back into the business comp, or that is a new idea, into the business competition, and did that with the partners, and took second place again, still a little bitter, or bitter that about that, because the people that took first place has entered the same thing that they entered the previous year, but polished, or took the money they've earned previously and polished it made it look a little nicer, and won again because it looked the most polished. But that aside, was a great, or great competition. Enjoyed it. And from that, you know, said, Hey, I think this is a good idea. I think it can be a, you know, something that you could actually build a business around. And so said, Hey, or kind of told the the people that were in the the group with me, you know, we're all graduating. We're going different directions. Would be pretty hard to do a startup altogether. So why don't we do this? Or why don't you guys take all the money that I got, you know that we you're in some reward money, or, you know, prize money. If you take my portion, split it amongst yourselves, and I'll just take ownership of the idea, whatever it is, where, you know, wherever I take it, and simply own it outright, you know, basically buying them out. And so that's what I did. So coming out of, you know, getting the MBA in the law degree, that was kind of always the intent. So, or coming out of school, I went and joined a law firm here in Utah. Was a full time patent attorney, and then alongside, you know, had the side hustle, what I'd really say is kind of a second full time job to where I was, you know, pursuing that startup or small business alongside of doing the law firm. So that was kind of the the genesis for, as I graduated full time attorney working, you know, with a lot of our cool clients and other things, and then also incorporating the desire to do a startup or small business. And that's kind of been, really, the trajectory that I've taken throughout my career is really, you know, finding ways to combine or to pursue both interests together. Michael Hingson  24:26 What happened to the business? Devin Miller  24:28 Yeah, so it so it's still alive today. I've been, I exited. Now it's been a couple year and a half, two years somewhere in there. Have to think back. So it started out. So with the business I started out, it was actually one where, rewinding just a little bit when we when I got started, my dad was also an electrical engineer. He'd actually, you know, he's well or farther into his career, and he done a number of different things across their medical devices through his career. And so he kind of, or he joined on as kind of doing it with us. Hustle with me, and we took that, started to build it. We brought on some additional team members. We brought on an investor, and actually built out and grew the business. It also evolved. So we were starting to test or test out the technology have it with some colleges and some other, you know, athletes, which was a natural place to start it at and about that time, and we were getting kind of to that next hurdle where we either needed to get a further investment or cash infusion, you know, to kind of take it to a more of a marketable, you know, a except a Polish full or ready to go to market type of product. And at that time, as we're exploring that we had or came or got connected with somebody that was more in the diabetes monitoring, they were doing it more from a service base. But you know, the overlay as to kind of how the technologies are overlapped with what they're doing tended to work out pretty well. And so we ended up combining the business to be one, where it was redirected a lot of the technology we developed underlining to be more of a wearables for the diabetes monitor. So that was a number of years ago. I stayed on doing a lot of, some of the engineering and development, primarily more in the intellectual property realm, of doing a lot of patents and whatnot. And then about a year and a half, two years ago, got bought out, was exited from that company and and that continues on today. It's still alive and growing, and I kind of watch it from, you know, from a distance, so to speak, or kind of continue to maintain interest, but don't are not necessarily active within the business anymore. So that was kind of a long answer to a shorter question, but that's kind of where the business eventually evolved to. Michael Hingson  26:36 So now I'm sure that the company is doing things like developing or working with products like continuous glucose monitors and so on. Devin Miller  26:46 Yep, yeah, that's kind of the direction as to what they're headed you Michael Hingson  26:49 well, and what's what's been interesting about several of the CGM type devices is that for people who are blind, there's been a real push to try to get some of them to be accessible. And what finally occurred about a year ago, maybe two years ago, is that one of the devices that's out there was approved to actually incorporate an app on a smartphone, and when the app came out, then it was really easy, although it took an effort to convince people to pay attention to it and do it, but it became technically a lot easier to deal with access, because all you had to do was to make the app accessible. And so there now is a continuous glucose monitor that that is accessible, whereas you wherein you get all the information from the app through voiceover, for example, on the iPhone or through talkback on a android phone that you get when you're just looking at the screen, which is the way it really should be anyway, because If you're going to do it, you should be inclusive and make it work for everyone. Devin Miller  28:06 No, that's cool. Yeah, there's a number of I think, between, you know, being a prevalent, you know, issue that people are dealing with, to, you know, different trying to address things earlier on, and also to motivate people do healthier lifestyle. And kind of the direction I think, is headed where a lot of the the company that's continues on today, from our original technology, is on the non invasive side. So a lot of them have, you have to have a patch, or you have to have periodically prick, or put an arm, you know, arm, right? Something where has a needle in the arm. And this one is kind of trying hair working to take it to that next level, to where it's no longer having to be invasive, and it's really all without having air with sensors that don't require you to have any sort of pain or prick in order to be able to utilize it. So kind of fun to fun to see how the industry continues to evolve. Michael Hingson  28:55 Well, today, we're working on that, and tomorrow, of course, the tricorder. So you know, we'll, we'll get to Star Trek 29:03 absolutely one step at a time. Michael Hingson  29:05 Yeah, but I've kind of figured that people were certainly working on non invasive technology so that you didn't have to have the sensor stuck in your arm. And I'm not surprised that that that's coming, and we'll be around before too long, just because we're learning so much about other ways of making the measurements that it makes sense to be able to do that. Devin Miller  29:31 Yep, no, absolutely. You know, it is a hard nut to crack. The body is very complex. A lot of things going on, and to measure it, not invasively, is certainly a lot that goes into it, but I think there's a lot of good, good technologies coming out. A lot of progress is being made, and certainly fun to continue to see how the health devices continue to hit the market. So certainly a cool area. Michael Hingson  29:53 So why did you decide, or maybe it was a natural progression, but why did you decide to go into patent law? Yeah. Devin Miller  30:01 I mean, I think it was probably a natural progression, and in the sense that, you know, it is one where overall desire was, Hey, I like engineering from the sense I like to think or how things work and kind of break things down and to have a better understanding. So really, intellectual property law and patents and trademarks and others allowed me to work with a lot of startups and small businesses, see a lot of cool things that they're developing still play a hand in it, and yet, also not, you know, be mired down to a long project over multiple years where you, you know, you're a small cog in a big wheel. And so, yeah, that was kind of one where it fit well within kind of the overall business, you know, business desire and business aspect of what I wanted to accomplish, and also just overall, you know, enjoying it or enjoying it. So that's kind of where it might, you know, it married well with the the desire to do startups and small businesses, as well as to work with a lot of other startups and small businesses. Michael Hingson  30:55 That's a lot of fun, to be able to deal with startups and see a lot of new and innovative kinds of things. And being in patent law, you probably see more than a lot of people, which does get to be exciting in an adventure, especially when you see something that looks like it has so much potential. Yep. Devin Miller  31:14 No, it is. It is fun. I get to see everything from I've worked on everything from boat anchors to credit card thing or devices that help elderly people to remove them more easily, from their wallet to AI to drones to software other or software platforms to medical devices. So it gives a ability to have a pretty good wide exposure to a lot of cool, different, you know, very different types of innovations, and that makes her just, you know, a fun, fun time, and be able to work or work with the air businesses as they develop. Are all those different technologies? Michael Hingson  31:50 Well, on the the law side of things, what's the difference between a provisional patent and a non provisional filing? Devin Miller  31:57 Yeah, so, so I don't back it up, and I'll get to your question. But maybe I'd set the stages to when you're looking at what is the difference between a patent and trademark and copyright, because a lot of times when people look at that, that's probably a good question too. Provisional trademark, or I want a, you know, or a non provisional copyright, or whatever it might be, and kind of get the terminology mixed up. So if you're to take it one step back, a provisional patent app or a patent is something that goes towards protecting an invention. So something that has the functionality that does something, that accomplishes something, a trademark is going to be something that is protecting of a brand. So name of a company, name of a product, a cash, phrase, a logo, and those type of things all really fall under trademarks and copyrights are going to be something that's more creative in nature. So a painting, a sculpture, a picture, a book, you know, all those type of things are going to fall under copyrights. And so really, when you're looking at it, you know, kind of breaking it down initially, you look at it as you know, which one is it. And so now to your question, Michael Hingson  32:58 well, before you go there, before you go ahead, before you go there. So if I'm writing software, does that fall under patent or copyright? I would assume if the software is to do something, it would be a patent. Devin Miller  33:12 So software primarily is under a patent. So there's, technically, you can copyright software. Now there's, it's pretty limited in its scope of protection. So if you're to do or software and do it under a copyright, really, all it protects is the exact way that you wrote the code. So you know, got it using this exact coding language. If somebody come along, copy and paste my code, you'll be protected. But it doesn't protect the functionality of how this code works or what it does. It is purely just how you wrote the code. So most of the time, when you're looking at software, it's really going to be more under a patent, because you're not going to want to just simply protect the identical way that you wrote the code, but rather what it does and what it does, yeah. So yep. So yeah, you for if you're to do as as your example, software, primarily, you're going to it's going to fall under patents. Michael Hingson  34:01 Okay, so anyway, back to provisional and non provisional. Devin Miller  34:05 Yeah, so, and when you're looking at doing a patent, you can do there's a couple different types of patents. One is a design patent. It really just goes to something the esthetic nature, the look and feel of a of an invention. So if you're thinking of the iPhone, you know, used to have the curved edges. I had the circle or a button at the bottom. It had, you know, the speaker placement and all those things. And it was just that outward appearance, not the functionality, could go under a design patent, but what the primary patent, which is what most people pursue, is what's called the utility patent application. And the utility patent application is really going towards the functionality of how something works. So the utility, how it works, what it does, and then kind of the purpose of it. And so with that, when you're looking at pursuing a utility patent application, there are a couple different types of patents that you can or types of utility patent patent applications. So. As you mentioned, one is called a provisional patent application. The other one is called a non provisional patent application. So a provisional patent application is kind of set up primarily, a lot of times for startups or small businesses where they're going to have a some product or an innovation that they're working on. They're in earlier stages. They're wanting to kind of protect what they have while they continue to develop it, and kind of flush it out. So provisional patent application is set up to be a one year placeholder application. So it will get, you know, you file it, you'll get patent pending, you'll get a date of invention, and it'll give you a year to decide if you want to pursue a full patent application or not. So you can file that gives you that one year time frame as a placeholder. The non provisional patent application would be the full patent application. So that would be what has, all the functionality, all the features, all the air, formalities and air, and it will go through the examination process. We'll go look at it for patentability. So those are kind of the difference provisional, one year, placeholder, less expensive, get your patent pending, versus the non provisional, that's the full patent application and gives you kind of that, or we'll go through examination. Michael Hingson  36:12 Do most people go through the provisional process just because it not only is less expensive, but at least it puts a hold and gives you a place. Devin Miller  36:22 It really just depends on where people are at. So kind of, you know, a lot of times people ask, Hey, well, what would you recommend? And I'll usually say, hey, there are typically two reasons why I would do a provisional patent application. And if you don't fall into either of those camps, then I would probably do a non provisional patent. Got it. So generally, the two reasons I get one is certainly budgetary. Give you an example. So our flat fee, you know, we do our primarily everything, flat fee in my firm, and a provisional patent application to prepare and file it, our flat fee is 2500 versus a non provisional patent application is 6950 so one is, Hey, your startup, small business, to have a limited funds, you're wanting to get a level of protection in place while you continue to pursue or develop things, then you would oftentimes do that as a provisional patent application. And the other reason, a lot of times where I would recommend it is, if you're saying, Hey, we've got a initial innovation, we think it's going to be great. We're still figuring things out, so we'd like to get something in place while we continue to do that research and develop it and kind of further figure it out. So that would be kind of, if you fall into one of those camps where it's either budgetary overlay, or it's one where you're wanting to get something in place and then take the next year to further develop it, then a provisional patent application is oftentimes a good route. There are also a lot of clients say, Hey, I'm, you know, we are pretty well. Did the Research Development getting ready to release it in the marketplace. While we don't have unlimited funds, we still have the ability to just simply go or go straight to a non provisional so we can get the examination process started, and then they'll go that route. So both of them are viable route. It's not kind of necessarily. One is inherently better or worse than the other is kind of more where you're at along the process and what, what kind of fits your needs the best. Michael Hingson  38:09 But at least there is a process that gives you options, and that's always good. Absolutely, patent laws, I well, I won't say it's straightforward, but given you know, in in our country today, we've got so many different kinds of things going on in the courts and all that, and sometimes one can only shake one's head at some of the decisions that are made regarding politics and all that, but that just seems to be a whole lot more complicated and a lot less straightforward than what you do With patent law? Is that really true? Or are there lots of curves that people bend things to go all sorts of different ways that make life difficult for you? Devin Miller  38:50 Um, probably a little bit of both. I think that it so. The law, legal system in general, is a much more slower moving enemy, so it does have a bit more of a kind of a basis to anticipate where things are headed in general. Now, the exception is, there always is an exception to the rule. Is that anytime the Supreme Court gets involved with patent law cases, I'd say 95% of the time, they make it worse rather than better. So, you know, you get judges that none of them are really have an experience or background in patent law. They've never done it. They really don't have too much familiarity with it, and now they're getting posed questions that are fairly involved in intricate and most of the time when they make decisions, they make it worse. It's less clear. You know, it's not as great of understanding, and it otherwise complicates things more. And so when you get the Supreme Court involved, then they can kind of make it more difficult or kind of shake things up. But by and large, it is a not that there isn't a lot of or involved in going through the process to convince the patent and examiner the patent office of patentability and make sure it's well drafted and has the it's good of coverage and scope, but at least there is, to a degree, that ability to anticipate. Hate, you know what it what's going to be required, or what you may likely to be looking at. You know? The other exception is, is, you know, the, ironically, I think the patent office is the only budget or producing or budget positive entity within all of the government. So every other part of the government spends much more money than they ever make. The Patent Office is, I think the, I think the postal office at one point was the other one, and they have, now are always in the in the red, and never make any money. But, you know, they are the patent office. Now, the problem with that is, you think, great, well now they can reinvest. They can approve, they should have the best technology, they should be the most up to date. They should have, you know, all the resources because they're self funding, and yet, there's always a piggy bank that the government goes to raid and redirects all those funds to other pet projects. And so, or the patent office is always, perpetually underfunded, as ironic as that is, because they're getting, always getting the piggy bank rated, and so with that, you know, they are, if you're to go into a lot of the patent office, their interfaces, their websites or databases, their systems, it feels like you're the onset of the or late 90s, early 2000s as far as everything goes. And so that always is not necessarily your question, but it's always a bit aggravating that you know you can't, as an example, can't submit color drawings. People ask, can you submit videos? Nope, you can't submit any videos of your invention, you know, can you provide, you know, other types of information? Nope, it's really just a written document, and it is line drawings that are black and white, and you can't submit anything beyond that. So there's one where I think eventually it will sometime, maybe shift or change, but it's going to be not anytime soon. I don't think there's any time on the horizon, because they're kind of stuck it once they move, moved over to the lit or initially onto the computer system, that's about where that evolution stopped. Michael Hingson  41:51 Well, the other thing though, with with videos, especially when you get AI involved and so on, are you really seeing a video of the invention. Or are you seeing something that somebody created that looks great, but the invention may not really do it. So I can understand their arguments, but there have to be ways to deal with that stuff. Devin Miller  42:13 Yeah, and I think that even be prior to AI, even we just had, you know, videos been around for 20 or 30 years, even, you know, digital format or longer. That probably, and the problem is, I think it's more of the search ability. So if you have a drawing, you can more easily search drawings and compare them side by side, and they'll do it. If you have a video, you know what? What format is the video? And is it a, you know, dot movie, or dot MOV, or is it.mp for is it color? Is it black and white? How do you capture it? Is it zoomed in as a kind of show all the details? Or is it zoomed out? And I think that there's enough difficulty in comparing video side by side and having a rigid enough or standardized format, the patent office said, man, we're not going to worry about it. Yes, so we could probably figure something out, but that's more work than anybody, any administration or any of the directors of the patent office ever want to tackle so it's just always kind of kicked down the road. Michael Hingson  43:06 Do they ever actually want to see the invention itself? Devin Miller  43:12 Not really, I mean, you so the short answer is no. I mean, they want to see the invention as it's captured within the the patent application. So the problem Michael Hingson  43:21 is, the drawing, they don't want to see the actual device, or whatever it is, well, and a lot Devin Miller  43:24 of times, you know as a inventors, they you know as a patent applicants, as the inventors and the owners, you're saying, hey, but I want to show them the invention. Problem is, the invention doesn't always mirror exactly what's showing in the patent application. Because you're on generation three of your product patent application is still in generation one, yeah, and so it doesn't mirror, and so the examiners are supposed to, they don't always, or aren't always good, and sometimes pull things and they shouldn't, but they're supposed to just consider whatever is conveyed in the patent application. Yeah, it's a closed world. And so bringing those additional things in now you can, so technically, you can request a live in office interview with the examiner, where you sit down live. You can bring in your invention or other or details and information, and when you do it live, face to face with an interview, you can walk them through it. Most very few people attorneys ever do that because one clients aren't going to want to pay for you to one of the offices, put you up in a hotel, you know, sit there, spend a day or two to or with the examiner to walk them through it. It just adds a significant amount of expense. Examiners don't particularly like it, because they have to dedicate significantly more time to doing that. Yeah, they're allotted, so they lose they basically are doing a lot of free work, and then you're pulling in a lot of information that they really can't consider. So you technically can. But I would say that you know, the likelihood of the majority of attorneys, 99 point whatever, percent don't do that, including myself. I've never been to do a live or live one, just because it just doesn't, it doesn't have enough advantage to make it worthwhile. Michael Hingson  44:58 Well, in talking about. About the law and all the things that go on with it. One of the things that comes to mind is, let's say you have somebody in the United States who's patenting, or has made a patent. What happens when it all goes to it gets so popular, or whatever, that now it becomes an international type of thing. You've got, I'm sure, all sorts of laws regarding intellectual property and patents and so on internationally. And how do you get protection internationally for a product? Devin Miller  45:32 File it in each country separately. So, you know, there are people, and I understand the inclinations, hey, I want to get a worldwide or global patent that covers everything in every country. The short answer is, you can't. I mean, technically, you could, if you file a patent into every country separately, nobody, including when I used to work or do work for companies including Intel and Amazon and Red Hat and Ford. They don't have patents in every single country throughout the world because they just don't have enough marketplace. You know, you go to a very small, let's say, South African country that you know, where they just don't sell their product enough in it, it just doesn't make the sense, or the courts or the systems or the patent office isn't well enough to find, or it's not enforceable enough that it just doesn't capture that value. And so there isn't a ability to have a global, worldwide patent, and it really is one where you have to file into each country separately. They each have their own somewhat similar criteria, still a different, somewhat similar process, but they each have their own criteria in their process that has to go through examination. So when you're looking at you know when you want to go for whether it's in the US or any other country, when you're deciding where you want to file it, it's really a matter of what marketplaces you're going to be selling the product into. So if you look at it and you know, I have as an example, some clients that 95% of their marketplace is all in the US, that's where they anticipate, that's probably where they're going to sell it. Well, yes, you could go and find, if you have 2% of your marketplace in Japan, you could go file a patent and get it into Japan, but you have such a small amount of your marketplace that's probably there that it doesn't make sense. And vice versa will have as an example. And a lot of times in the medical devices, they'll a lot of times file both in the EU as well as in the US, because those are two of the predominant medical device and are places where a lot of innovation is going on, where there's a lot of focus on utilization, development, medical devices, and there's just a lot of that demand. And so you're really going to look at it is which, where's your marketplace. The other times are the people, a lot of times, they'll get tripped up on so they'll say, Well, I probably need to file into China, right? And I said, Well, maybe because the inclination is, well, everybody just goes to China. They'll knock off the product. And so I want to have a patent in China so that I can, you know, fight against the knockoffs. And that isn't while I again, understand why they would ask that question. It wouldn't be the right way to convey it. Because if you if all it is is they you have no real, you know, no desire, no plan, to go into China. You're not going to sell it. You're not going to build a business there. If they're knocking it off and just just doing it in China, so to speak, then they're not. There isn't going to be a need to file a patent in China, because you don't have any marketplace in there. There's nothing really to protect. And if somebody makes it in China as a just picking on China, making as an example, and imports it into the US, you can still enforce your patent or otherwise do or utilize it to stop people from importing knock off because it's in the US, because they're, yeah, exactly, they're selling it, importing it, or otherwise doing activities in the US. So it's really a matter of where your marketplace is, not where you think that somebody might knock it off. Or, Hey, I'm gonna get a try and get a global patent, even though my marketplace is really in one or two spots. Michael Hingson  48:38 What about products like, say, the iPhone, which are commonly used all over. Devin Miller  48:44 Yeah, they're going to do, they'll do a lot of countries. They still Michael Hingson  48:47 won't do. They'll still do kind of country by country. Devin Miller  48:50 Yeah, they'll now, they'll do a lot of countries. Don't get me wrong, a lot of right. Phones are sold throughout the world, but they'll still look at it as to where it is, and they still have, you know, issues with them. So one of the interesting tidbits as an example, so going back and rewinding your time, taking apple as an example. You know, they came out with, originally, the iPod, then they had iPhone, and then they had the iPad. Now the question is, when they originally came out with their watch, what did they call it? 49:17 Apple Watch? Apple Watch. Now, why Devin Miller  49:20 didn't they call the I wash, which is what it made sense. It goes right along with the iPhone, the iPad, the iPhone, you know, the all of those iPod on that. And it was because somebody had already got a trademark in China that was for a different company, unrelated to the apple that had it for the iWatch. And so when Apple tried to go into the country, they tried to negotiate. They tried to bully. They weren't able to successfully get the rights or to be able to use I wash within China. China was a big enough market, and so they had and rather than try and split it and call it the I wash everywhere but China and trying to have the Apple Watch in China, they opted to call it the Apple Watch. Now I think they might. Of eventually resolve that, and I think it's now can be referred to as the I watch, I'm not sure, but for, at least for a long period of time, they couldn't. They called it the Apple Watch when they released it, for that reason. So even if you have, you know, a big company and one of the biggest ones in the world, you still have to play by the same rules. And why, you can try and leverage your your size and your wealth and that to get your way, there's still those, there's still those hindrances. So that's kind of maybe a side, a side note, but it's kind of one that's interesting. Michael Hingson  50:30 So that's the trademark of how you name it. But how about the technology itself? When the Apple Watch was created, I'm assuming that they were able to patent that. Devin Miller  50:39 Yeah, they will have, I'm sure they probably have anywhere from 30 to 100 to 200 I mean, they'll have a significant amount of patents, even it's just within the Apple Watch, everything from the screen, the display, how it's waterproof, how it does communications, how does the battery management, how does the touch, how does the interface, all of those are going to be different aspects that they continue to, you know, did it originally in the original Apple Watch, and are always iterating and changing as they continue to improve the technology. So generally, you know that, I'm sure that you will start out with as a business of protecting you're getting a foundational patent where you kind of protect the initial invention, but if it's successful and you're building it out, you're going to continue to file a number of patents to capture those ongoing innovations, and then you're going to file it into all of the countries where you have a reasonable market size that makes it worthwhile to make the investment. Michael Hingson  51:32 So if you have a new company and they've got a name and all that, what should new businesses do in terms of looking and performing a comprehensive search for of trademarks and so on to make sure they are doing the right thing. Devin Miller  51:49 Yeah, a couple of things. I mean, it wanted, if you're it depends on the size of company, your budget, there's always the overlay of, you know, you can want to do everything in the world, and if you don't have the budget, then you have to figure out what goes in your budget. But if I'll take it from kind of a startup or a small business perspective, you know, you first thing you should do is just as stupid and as easy as it sounds, you should go do a Google search. Or, now that you have chat GPT, go do a chat BT search and a Google search. But, you know, because it's interesting as it sounds, or, you know, is you think that, oh, that's, you know, kind of give me or an automatic I'll have still even till today, people come into my office. They'll say, Hey, I've got this great idea, this great invention, and a Lacher getting a patent on it, and they'll start to walk me through it. I'm like, you know, I could have sworn I've seen that before. I've seen something very similar. We'll sit down at my desk, take two minutes, do a Google search, and say, so is this a product that you're thinking of? Oh, yeah, that's exactly it. Okay. Well, you can't really get a patent on something that's already been invented and out there, and so, you know, do a little bit of research yourself. Now there is a double edged sword, because you can do research and sometimes you'll have one or two things happen. You'll not having the experience and background, not entirely knowing what you're doing. You'll do research, and you'll either one say, Hey, I've done a whole bunch of research. I can't really find anything that's similar. When, in fact, there's a lot of similar things out there. There's a patent, and people will say, yeah, it's the same, it's the same invention, but my purpose is a little bit different. Well, you can't if it's the exact same or invention. Whether or not you say your purpose is different, doesn't get around their patent and same thing on a trademark. Yeah, their brand's pretty much 53:20 identical, but they're Devin Miller  53:21 doing legal services and I'm doing legal tools, and so it's different, and it's, again, it's one where there's there they have a false sense of security because they rationalize in their head why it's different, or vice versa. You also get people that will say, Hey, this is even though it's significantly different, it's the same purpose. And so while, while they really could go do the product, while they could get a patent or a trademark, because they think that it's just overall kind of the same concept, then they talk themselves out of it when they don't need to. So I would say, start out doing some of that initial research. I would do it if I was in their shoes, but temper it with, you know, do it as an initial review. If there's something that's identical or the same that's out there, then it gives you an idea. Probably, you know, you're not going to be able to add a minimum, get or patent their intellectual property protection, and you may infringe on someone else's but if you you know, if there's, there's some differences, or have to do that initial research, that's probably the time, if you're serious about, you know, investing or getting business up and going, you've probably engaged an attorney to do a more formal search, where they have the experience in the background and ability to better give a better understanding or determination as to whether or not something presents an issue. Michael Hingson  54:32 Yeah, well, that's understandable. If I've developed something and I have a patent for it, then I suddenly discovered that people are selling knockoffs or other similar devices on places like Amazon and so on. What do you do about that? Because I'm sure there must be a bunch of that that that does go on today. Devin Miller  54:53 Yeah, yes, it does. I mean, I wouldn't say it's not as probably as prevalent as some people think. In other words, not every single. Product, right, being knocked off. Not everything is copied. Sometimes it's because, you know, either I don't have the ability, I don't have the investment, I don't have the, you know, it's not as big enough marketplace, I don't have the manufacturing, I don't have the connections, or it is simply, am respectful, and I'm not going to go do a discord because I'm not going to try and rip off, you know, what I think is someone else's idea. So it doesn't happen that as frequently as I think sometimes people think it does, but it certainly does occur. You know, there's a competitive marketplace, there's a profit incentive, and if there's a good product that's out there that people think they can do something with, and there's a motivation to do it, either because people are unaware that it's an issue, or that they they're unaware that they can't copy it or is protected. And so if you get into that, you know, there's a few potentially different recourses. One is, you know, a lot of times you'll start out with the cease and desist.

We reveal the unexpected strengths of MBA programs that aren't well known

SD343 - Por que Atender Mais Pacientes pode estar Diminuindo seu Lucro. Neste episódio, Dr. Lorenzo Tomé conversa com a médica e sócia-fundadora da Rinoclínica, Dra. Bárbara Bianchi, sobre um dos temas mais negligenciados na carreira médica: finanças do consultório. A partir da própria vivência como médica empreendedora, gestora e mentora da SD Escola, Dra. Bárbara mostra como médicos podem (e devem) assumir uma postura mais intencional na gestão do próprio negócio. Ao longo do episódio, são discutidos conceitos fundamentais como tempo para pensar estrategicamente, ticket médio, LTV (Lifetime Value), margem de contribuição, ponto de equilíbrio, metas, bonificação de equipe e o papel estratégico da secretária como gerente comercial. Tudo isso ancorado em exemplos reais, decisões difíceis e aprendizados que surgem apenas quando o médico sai do modo automático. O podcast Saúde Digital lhe ajuda a abrir a mente? Agora imagine como 3 dias de imersão com a gente pode impactar no seu negócio médico. A próxima Imersão SD já tem data: 20, 21 e 22 de março/2026. Garanta sua vaga com 10% de desconto na Imersão da SD Escola de Negócios Médicos. FAÇA CONTATO O Background da Bárbara Bárbara formou-se em Medicina em Passo Fundo-RS, fez sua residência em Otorrinolaringologia em Campinas-SP e depois um fellowship em Cirurgia Cérvico-Facial pelo Instituto Penido Burnier de Campinas-SP. Ela se estabeleceu em Porto Alegre-RS onde abriu a Rinoclínica com uma sócia, além de assumir a gerência médica de uma outra clínica de multiespecialidades em Passo Fundo, a Medix, aberta com dois sócios. O dia a dia lhe trouxe os desafios e os aprendizados na gestão do negócio, o que a levou a fazer um MBA de Gestão em Saúde na FGV e outros cursos para oferecer a melhor experiência para o paciente e ter os serviços reconhecidos como uma referência na área. Assista este episódio também em vídeo no YouTube no nosso canal Saúde Digital Podcast! Acesse os Episódios Anteriores! SD342 - Carreira Corporativa em Saúde: O Caminho Que Muitos Médicos Ignoram SD341 - Conheça o mercado da Saúde na Classe C SD340 - IA Generativa na Medicina: Quem Usar 1º Vai Viver Melhor Music: Charmed | Declan DP "Music © Copyright Declan DP 2018 - Present. https://license.declandp.info | License ID: DDP1590665"  

Send us a textIn this episode, Dr. Matthew R. Hitchcock, MD, MBA, shares his journey as a direct primary care physician and healthcare entrepreneur. Frustrated by long waits and high costs in traditional imaging, he founded Hitchcock Direct Imaging, a cash-only, insurance-free imaging center in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Dr. Hitchcock discusses how direct care models can improve patient access, the regulatory hurdles he navigated, and the importance of transparency in healthcare pricing. Learn how collaboration, innovation, and patient-focused care are reshaping the healthcare experience. Connect with him:Website: Hitchcock Family MedicineHitchcock Direct Imaging Support the show*Next Coaching Cohort Starts Feb 25, 2026. Launch it in 8 weeks and apply here --> Record your question easily here --> Join the Direct Care Society private Facebook group here. --> Own a DSC practice and want to share your story? Apply here EMR I'm currently using in my Direct Care practice Simple Practice HIPAA Compliant Email with Paubox Get $250 Credit Here Find me on LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/teadpm More resources teadpm.com

Send us a textIn this episode, Dr. Matthew R. Hitchcock, MD, MBA, shares his journey as a direct primary care physician and healthcare entrepreneur. Frustrated by long waits and high costs in traditional imaging, he founded Hitchcock Direct Imaging, a cash-only, insurance-free imaging center in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Dr. Hitchcock discusses how direct care models can improve patient access, the regulatory hurdles he navigated, and the importance of transparency in healthcare pricing. Learn how collaboration, innovation, and patient-focused care are reshaping the healthcare experience. Connect with him:Website: Hitchcock Family MedicineHitchcock Direct Imaging Support the show*Next Coaching Cohort Starts Feb 25, 2026. Launch it in 8 weeks and apply here --> Record your question easily here --> Join the Direct Care Society private Facebook group here. --> Own a DSC practice and want to share your story? Apply here EMR I'm currently using in my Direct Care practice Simple Practice HIPAA Compliant Email with Paubox Get $250 Credit Here Find me on LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/teadpm More resources teadpm.com

We have a classic episode for you. Master male hypogonadism diagnosis and management. Discover when and how to test, how to tackle confounding conditions, and why lifestyle changes may be more effective than testosterone therapy in certain patients. We are joined by Dr. Brad Anawalt, an expert in endocrine care, to guide us through the essentials.Claim CME for this episode at curbsiders.vcuhealth.org!Patreon | Episodes | Subscribe | Spotify | YouTube | Newsletter | Contact | Swag! | CMEShow Segments Intro Case 1 History and Physical  Laboratory Testing  Effect of Lifestyle on Testosterone Case 2 Prostate and Cardiovascular risk Treatment Options and Considerations Secondary Causes of Hypogonadism Case 3 Testicular Size and Klinefelter Syndrome hCG and Clomiphene Monitoring and Follow-Up Take-Home Points Outro Credits Written and produced by Paul Wurtz MD. Show notes, cover art, and infographic also created by Paul Wurtz MD.  Hosts: Matthew Watto MD, FACP; Paul Williams MD, FACP    Reviewer: Sai S Achi MD, MBA, FACP Showrunners: Matthew Watto MD, FACP; Paul Williams MD, FACP Technical Production: PodPaste Guest: Bradley D. Anawalt MD Sponsor: GustoTry Gusto today at gusto.com/CURB, and get three months free when you run your first payroll.Sponsor: LocumstoryLocumstory.com is literally just a free, unbiased resource dedicated to educating physicians about locums.  Sponsor: MedStudy PodcastCurbsiders listeners get 15% off with code CURB15 at medstudy.comSponsor: The Sanford GuideCurbsiders listeners can get 20% off the already very moderately priced yearly subscriptions directly at sanfordguide.com. Go to sanfordguide.com and use the code, CURB at checkout.

Dysphagia in Parkinson's disease is not one-size-fits-all, and treatment decisions shouldn't be either.In this episode of Swallow Your Pride, Theresa is joined by PD Dr. Bendix Labeit, MBA, neurologist and clinician-scientist, and Jule Hofacker, MSc, speech-language pathologist and PhD student in neurogenic dysphagia, to explore how Parkinson's treatments impact swallowing. They discuss how dopaminergic medication […] The post 388 – Parkinson's, Swallowing, and Deep Brain Stimulation: What Clinicians Need to Know appeared first on Swallow Your Pride Podcast.

Slava shares how he retired early and his whole journey to get there. Enjoy.Want to be a guest? → https://vwo3759x8i7.typeform.com/to/gh00JmnZ–––––––––––––––––––––––––––––The statements provided are from individuals who are not clients of Root Financial Partners, LLC. These individuals were not compensated for their comments, and their views do not necessarily reflect those of Root Financial Partners, LLC. The information shared is for informational purposes only and should not be considered a recommendation or testimonial regarding advisory services.Advisory services are offered through Root Financial Partners, LLC, an SEC-registered investment adviser. This content is intended for informational and educational purposes only and should not be considered personalized investment, tax, or legal advice. Viewing this content does not create an advisory relationship. We do not provide tax preparation or legal services. Always consult an investment, tax or legal professional regarding your specific situation.The strategies, case studies, and examples discussed may not be suitable for everyone. They are hypothetical and for illustrative and educational purposes only. They do not reflect actual client results and are not guarantees of future performance. All investments involve risk, including the potential loss of principal.Comments reflect the views of individual users and do not necessarily represent the views of Root Financial. They are not verified, may not be accurate, and should not be considered testimonials or endorsementsParticipation in the Retirement Planning Academy or Early Retirement Academy does not create an advisory relationship with Root Financial. These programs are educational in nature and are not a substitute for personalized financial advice. Advisory services are offered only under a written agreement with Root Financial.Create Your Custom Early Retirement Strategy HereGet access to the same software I use for my clients and join the Early Retirement Academy hereAri Taublieb, CFP ®, MBA is the Chief Growth Officer of Root Financial Partners and a Fiduciary Financial Planner specializing in helping clients retire early with confidence.

In this powerful Graham Sessions sit-down, first-time attendee Alex Bendersky, PT, MBA, gets real about risk, readiness, and the trillion-dollar opportunity in MSK care. From surviving the Medicare cap crash of 2002 to forecasting the next existential threats to PT, Alex challenges the profession to evolve beyond survival.We dig into:What resilience actually looks like for private practiceWhy waiting for change is a losing strategyHow to capture untouched markets in MSKWhat you're doing wrong with risk-based careThe trillion-dollar pie that's still on the table????Live from APTA Private Practice Graham Sessions

Special Patreon Release: Better Together with Jon and Jolene Rocke   "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder." Mark 10:9 (KJV)   *Transcription Below*   Questions and Topics We Discuss: What are you so thankful you did in every season of marriage, from newlyweds to empty nesters that you see the pay off now in the present? How has grace and forgiveness benefited your relationship? What advice do you have for all of us married couples as we seek to grow as one, rather than grow parallel or even grow apart from one another?   Jon and Jolene Rocke are my local friends and my guests for today. They work side by side at Peoria Rescue ministries, and they have so many lovely gifts of leadership and hospitality and teaching, but the topic we are going to focus on today is marriage. From the first time we met, Mark and I adored them and appreciated their sweet bond with one another, and I'm so thrilled to introduce you to them today. Here's our chat:   Jon and Jolene both grew up in Christian homes and accepted Jesus as their Savior and Lord at the age of 15.  Jon is from Morton and Jolene from Elgin, IL. They met on a bus ride to a Youth Gathering in Minnesota.  They sat together and talked the whole way home about life, the Bible and God.  Jon played his guitar and sang John Denver songs and their match was made with “Sunshine on my Shoulders”.   They married at the age of 18 and had their first child, Janelle, at 19.  They left for Grace college in Winona Lake, Indiana with an 18 month old toddler in tow and had another baby girl born while in college named Jaime.  At graduation in 1984, they were accepted to Trinity Seminary to follow Jon's desire to be a Professor of Theology, but became pregnant with their son, Jordan, which changed every plan and sent them back home to build up their finances.   They came back to Morton and worked in the Family Business and felt called to stay.  They raised their 3 children in Morton working in the business until God loosened their tent pegs and called them to Peoria Rescue Ministries in 2017. Jon is the Executive Director and Jolene is the Ministry Ambassador.  They are thankful to be working side-by-side in this new season of their marriage.   Jon and Jolene will celebrate their 44th wedding anniversary and have 3 married children and have 10 grandchildren. Their son Jordan and his wife Jessica live in Sandpoint, Idaho with their 3 Kids.  Their daughter Janelle and husband Ryan live in Kennesaw, Georgia with their 3 children.  And their daughter Jaime and her husband Jonathan live here in Morton with their 4 children.   Related Episodes from The Savvy Sauce: 5 Love Languages with Dr. Gary Chapman Traveling with Your Family with Katie Mueller   At The Savvy Sauce, we will only recommend resources we believe in! We also want you to be aware: We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.   Five Love Languages The 5 Love Languages of Teenagers A Teen's Guide to the 5 Love Languages   Thank You to Our Sponsors: Chick-fil-A East Peoria and The Savvy Sauce Charities (and donate online here)   Connect with The Savvy Sauce on Facebook, Instagram or Our Website.   Please help us out by sharing this episode with a friend, leaving a 5-star rating and review, and subscribing to this podcast!   Gospel Scripture: (all NIV) Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,”   Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.”   Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.”   Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.”   Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”   Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.”   John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.”   Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”   Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.”   Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus”   Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession- to the praise of his glory.”   Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.”   Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“   Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“   Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.”   *Transcription*   Music: (0:00 – 0:09)   Laura Dugger: (0:10 - 2:05) Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host, Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here. I want to say a huge thank you to today's sponsors for this episode, Chick-fil-A East Peoria and Savvy Sauce Charities.   Are you interested in a free college education for you or someone you know? Stay tuned for details coming later in this episode from today's sponsor, Chick-fil-A East Peoria. You can also visit their website today at https://www.chick-fil-a.com/locations/il/east-peoria.   If you've been with us long, you know this podcast is only one piece of our nonprofit, which is the Savvy Sauce Charities. Don't miss out on our other resources. We have questions and content to inspire you to have your own practical chats for intentional living.   And I also hope you don't miss out on the opportunity to financially support us through your tax-deductible donations. All this information can be found on our recently updated website, thesavvysauce.com.   Jon and Jolene Rocke are my local friends and my guests for today. They work side by side at Peoria Rescue Ministries, and they have so many lovely gifts of leadership and hospitality and teaching. But the topic we're going to focus on today is marriage. From the first time we met, Mark and I adored them so much and really appreciated their sweet bond with one another. And I'm so thrilled to get to introduce you to them today.   Here's our chat. Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, Jon and Jolene.   Jon Rocke: (2:05 - 2:06) We're so happy to be here, Laura. Thanks so much for having us.   Laura Dugger: (2:07 - 2:43) Well, it's truly my pleasure. And will the two of you just start by giving us a little background on how you came to know Christ as your personal Lord and Savior?   Jolene Rocke: (2:07 - 2:43) Yeah, I grew up in the Chicago area in a suburb and in a Christian home. So, I was very thankful to know about God. And I came to know Him as my personal Savior at 15. And so, then I really had a complete change. And from then on, I have just followed Him as close as I can. So very thankful for Jesus.   Jon Rocke: (2:44 - 2:59) Yeah, and I was actually 15 as well. Became overwhelmed with my sin at 15 and knew that I did not know Christ. And so, since then, a very imperfect following, but glad to be part of the family.   Laura Dugger: (3:00 - 3:15) Well, and that's awesome that both of you were 15 and never knew that piece of your story. But I'm assuming you were living in different places. So then how did the two of you meet and fall in love?   Jolene Rocke: (3:15 - 4:40) That is such a funny story. Because I, along with a friend of mine from Elgin, jumped on a Morton bus going to Morris, Minnesota. And they picked us up in Rockford. And we got on the bus, went to the same youth gathering for our church denomination. And on the way home from that weekend, we sat on the bus the whole way home and talked.   And Jon had what was so interesting to me, a study Bible. And I had never seen a study Bible in my life. And so, he showed me what an open Bible was with notes at the bottom. And because I came to Christ at 15 and started Bible study on my own with just a spiral notebook, a pen, and my Bible, I was fascinated by this Bible.   And I heard from Morton girls that he carried his Bible everywhere. So, he was kind of different than the rest of the guys. And I told them that's the kind of guy I was looking for. And then to top it all off, he had a guitar. And he sang John Denver songs to me. So, Sunshine on My Shoulders, I think, really made me happy.   Laura Dugger: (4:40 - 4:45) Just knowing your family music is such a big part of worship. Yeah. That's part of what wooed you, too.   Jon Rocke: (4:40 - 5:35) Yeah. Part of the crazy story is that it's a long trip. It's like a 12-hour trip. And so, we left Morton at like 5 in the morning. And so, I'm sleeping on the floor. And we picked these girls up. And I wake up, and I'm like, “Oh, an angel just got on the bus.” That's what I thought. And she was like, she didn't really have anything to do with me the whole weekend till the way home.   But we have a lot of fun with that story. And so that was the beginning. I think I sent flowers the next day. And we began, actually, a very long-distance, over-the-phone relationship, getting to know each other. And we actually went through, I think, the Book of Romans together over the course of, I guess, a year. And then got married. And we were pretty young.   Jolene Rocke: (5:36 - 6:47) Yeah. We met when Jon was just 16. And then two weeks after his 18th birthday, we got married. And I'm a year older. So, it was very young. But we are so thankful because we're going to celebrate 44 years of marriage here.   So, God knit us together, I think, through the fact that we were both really pursuing the Lord individually. And then we were so happy to find somebody like that. I thought I was headed to be a missionary in Africa at the time I met him. And he was, like, searching, too. But both all out pursuit of Christ. And so, I think that's what knit our hearts together. And it didn't hurt that he sent flowers the next day.   Laura Dugger: (6:47 - 7:15) It was a wise move. But I love it because the two of you have really grown up together. Totally. You've been meeting as teens. When you reflect back, what are you so thankful that you did in every season of marriage, from newlyweds to now empty nesters, that you're getting to see the payoff now in the present?   Jon Rocke: (6:49 - 8:10) Yeah, I think sometimes you are intentional. And we've tried to be intentional. But I think sometimes God brings circumstances into your life that sort of force something. So not only were we young when we got married, but nine months after we got married, yeah, we had Janelle, our oldest daughter.   And so, we had to realize we still needed time together. And we had a little baby. It began, I think, an intentional course for us to carve out time. So, you know, we put our kids to bed early. It was a big deal for us as parents that we had our time after they went to bed because we didn't get a whole lot of time.   And other little silly things, the kids didn't get to sit in between us at church. That was the rule. You can sit on either side of mom and dad, but you can't sit in between us. And so that was just, you know, again, a little thing that we did. And some things we had to learn. I'm more of a night person. Jolene's more of a morning person. Part of that, we had to learn at one point, you know, let's make sure we prioritize going to bed together. Just so, again, we had that time. So, there's been all sorts of different steps along the way that we've tried to prioritize each other.   Jolene Rocke: (8:10 - 9:01) So the two words that come to my mind with regard to that are compromise. You're two different people, and you're suddenly thrust together into a home situation. Well, that took compromise on both of our parts. So that's kind of sacrifice, too. That means he doesn't get to stay up until midnight if we want to go to bed together, and I'm going to have to push myself to stay up later just so that we can make a common bedtime.   So, compromise, and then I think the other major thing to me would be communication, because we didn't have a relationship before marriage where we were in the same town and could see each other all the time or go on dates. We didn't have that. So, we had letter writing. This is 43 years ago. So, we had letter writing daily.   Jon Rocke: (9:02 - 9:04) Some of us were daily. He was daily.   Jolene Rocke: (9:05 - 9:11) I wasn't quite as good at letter writing every day, but I was in college by now.   Jon Rocke: (9:11 - 9:13) You were still in high school. Now we know.   Jolene Rocke: (9:14 - 10:15) But I think the communication factor, that actually helped us because, yes, I realize face-to-face dating is a great thing, but to not be able to do that and have nothing but be able to write your day out, what happened during your day, you're learning to tell the other person what happened in your day, how you felt about that, what your dreams, your goals are. So, it started, to me and us, I think a great foundation of communication.   Laura Dugger: (10:15 - 10:30) And is it Song of Songs, I believe, 5:16, where part of it says, “This is my lover, this is my friend,” and that's what I'm hearing, is that you were really deepening your friendship in those early years and that from witnessing your lives, it seems that has only continued.   Jolene Rocke: (10:30 - 10:35) Yeah, exactly. We are so thankful. It's a very different story than most people, but we're so thankful.   Jon Rocke: (10:16 - 10:39) I think also, for us, it was Genesis 2 in the sense that you need to leave everything else and cleave together. We were young. It's hard to believe. When we look back, we think about our kids and our grandkids and would we want that for them, and yet I don't think we'd trade it for the world.   Laura Dugger: (10:40 - 10:52) I love that. And what encouragement do you have for others then who are also wanting to build a foundation of remaining connected and intimate in all the aspects of their own marriage?   Jon Rocke: (10:53 - 12:07) That's one of those things about being intentional. Matthew 19:6, where Christ repeats that adage from Genesis 2, that God created them male and female, they need to leave mother and father and cleave together, but then he adds this, “and no one should tear that apart.” And we often think about that, I think, as other people tearing that apart, and that's true.   But the same goes, we can tear ourselves apart if we're not going to make sure everything else, all other distractions, because they're going to continually come, right? And again, we had kids so early that I think we knew we had to carve that time out, because if we wouldn't have, I'm not sure how that would have worked. We would have been so consumed early. But career, we've just known that we've had to say, if we don't make sure that we're the priority, it's so easy to get lost in all the other things of life that are not bad. Kids are not bad, they're great. And your careers and your work, that's all good. But it can be the enemy of great in a marriage.   Jolene Rocke: (12:07 - 12:32) Yeah, we talked about the fact that this is how we started all those years ago. But a pursuit of God individually actually enhances a pursuit of God together. I'm still in the Word individually. Jon's still in the Word individually. But we also then read and pray together every night. So just this pursuit of God.   Jon Rocke: (12:32 - 13:06) But that wasn't something we did from day one either. I mean, that was a learned scenario where one time we were just kind of convicted of the fact that together we're not taking time to pray and read together. And so, then we just made that part of routine at night. So then again, that made us say we're going to go to bed together. Because if we didn't, then we didn't have that time. That opportunity to pray together and read together has just become a connection point that we wouldn't want to trade.   Laura Dugger: (13:07 - 13:55) I think that's encouraging in so many ways because you've grown into this. And I think for anyone just starting out, it's so helpful to see you didn't let excuses get in the way. It reminds me of a supervisor in college who said, “If you want something done, give it to a busy person.” And I think in a unique way with you two being launched into parenthood nine months after you were married, you didn't have the luxury of being frivolous with your time. And you chose intentionality. And it seems like God really has blessed that and honored it.   Jolene Rocke: (13:55 - 14:05) Yeah and continued it to this day. You're very right. We continue to be busy. And that's still the struggle to combat that with intentional time together. So definitely.   Jon Rocke: (13:55 - 14:31) You talk about seasons in our lives. So, I had to have a hip replacement. So, from like 23 till I had that at 50, I couldn't take long walks. But now we get to walk together, which is a huge privilege. And so, I always think about it. I'm not into exercise to exercise, but I'm into being together. And exercise is a thing we can do together. The other thing we did in our, I guess it was on our 25th. We got a tandem bike. And we love doing our tandem bike.   Jolene Rocke: (14:31 - 16:21) But he wanted a tandem bike right when we got married. And I kept saying, no, I didn't really want to sit on the back and have no control. And not be able to see when I thought I should break or when I wanted to turn.   So, this is something that I often encourage women that are moving into the emptiness season of life. I was driving to church alone. And the Lord really impressed on me that the extreme lavish amount of love that as a homemaker I gave to my children who were now gone, I needed to transfer that to my husband.   I've always loved Jon first and best. But I needed to take even the time commitment. What could I do to show Jon I loved him lavishly the way I tried to my children? So that was a time thing for me. And it was like get a tandem bike. So, I was willing then to get the tandem and sit in the back. And you really do; you're called the stoker. You really do work in the back. You don't just sit there. You work. But I no longer had the control of that. And I am learning to see butterflies land on corn stalks. And I actually love our tandem bike. But God had to grow me. And that was part of my several gifts to him in emptiness period that has helped us keep a strong marriage, I think.   Laura Dugger: (16:21 - 16:30) And isn't that interesting how there's a gift in it for you? Like you offer this sacrifice and yet he's teaching you new things.   Jon Rocke: (16:21 - 16:22) I love it, yeah.   Laura Dugger: (16:23 - 16:45) What would you two say is the biggest personality difference that you've recognized in your own marriage?   Jolene Rocke: (16:45 - 17:22) We just had a personality test yesterday. We have an executive team leadership at Peoria Rescue Ministries, and we had to do personality tests again. And that always is quite glaring to see how different we are. So, we're on two ends of the spectrum. But we can encourage any marriage that that can work and actually maybe be in your favor as long as you work hard at it. So, it just takes work and communication to say, you're very logical thinking, I'm very emotional, so how do we come together then in situations where I'm flustered and he's calm because he at times looks as if you don't care.   Jon Rocke: (17:22 - 17:53) Right, yeah, it can be that. You're highly relational. I'm definitely more process. And I think you're going to learn quickly, especially if you have kids, that all your kids are going to have different personalities. That's the weirdest thing, right? They all grew up in the same home and they're all just completely different. And so being able to help them understand kind of a little bit who they are and how that works has been a good thing that we're not the same.   Jolene Rocke: (17:53 - 20:01) God didn't make one good and one bad. He made all of us different, all in His image, to His glory. We all bring value to the family, and we both bring value to one another as helpmates because I'm able to sharpen Jon in areas that are blind spots for him. He's able to totally sharpen me and calm me in blind spots that are mine. So, I think in a marriage, it's just actually, it's been helpful. Differences are good.   Laura Dugger: (20:01 - 20:25) Oh, I love that. Differences are good. It sounds like God sanctified even your views of that. And so, getting really practical, when was a time when your differences were working against each other or caused conflict? And then how, through maturing and more time together, how do you celebrate and even lean into and appreciate those differences?   Jolene Rocke: (20:25 - 21:00) Well, one thing for sure is we had what we call our valley, where we learned that Psalm 23 wasn't just a funeral psalm, but it's a life psalm, and it's a way of life psalm. So, at that time, I had three family members pass away, and Jon had his family business go down. So, we watched our personalities within that in handling loss and grief. So, here's the optimist really down, and here's realist trying to be cheerleader and be up.   And so actually God did it, and we know without a doubt that God can work beyond personalities and bring you to a point where you can actually support one another well. But there again, it's got to be intentional. It's got to be me saying, we need to sit down now and have a meeting, talk about how you're feeling, whether you want to talk about feelings or not, because I need to know where you're at so that I can help you best.   Jon Rocke: (20:01 - 21:20) Yeah, and on a practical level during that time, I found myself not communicating some of what I thought was either scary or just the long drag of it. And so that was a potential way for us to disconnect because all of this is swirling from at least our livelihood standpoint, swirling in my head, and I'm not going to want to share that. And yet we realized we had to, but then those are not always easy things because Jolene, like most ladies, likes security as an important thing, right? Of just knowing what's going to happen.   In the end, it did make us really, again, Joe mentioned Psalm 23, and if he is our shepherd, what else could we want? We both had to end up clinging to that because our security was gone. Part of our sense of who we were, and particularly me in a family business for three generations, was gone. And so, we certainly had to make sure that our tendencies, like in communication, those kinds of things, we had to work through those during that time.   Laura Dugger: (21:21 - 21:30) Thank you for sharing that. I think that's very relatable to hear about the ups and the downs. And so, do you have any specific stories of a time when you were both in your strengths, and even though they were very different, they worked well together?   Jolene Rocke: (21:30 - 23:12) Yeah, I think that it's the learning what your strengths are that you may not know that God gives you at the time, and that's his grace. So, at the time, for all those years previous to the valley, Jon was the one that pushed me to communicate, and shutting down was not an option, which is what I wanted to do. So, I'd rather just not talk about it and go to bed. And he would push, push, push me to keep communicating, and that we would work through everything before the sun went down, as the Bible says.   Well, in the valley, it was Jon that was shutting down. And suddenly, you know, I had to be the one to push communication. So, this is something I heard on a sermon. A personality is not an excuse for sin. So that just means that I can't say, well, I'm not comfortable in conflict, so I'm not going to communicate and I'm going to shut down. No, you need to push yourself, ask the Lord for help, and go as his helpmate and say, you have to talk about it, you have to tell me, how are you doing? How are you feeling? So, I feel like it's just, it was such a beautiful valley when we look back now.   Laura Dugger: (23:12 - 23:25) Another previous guest had said she noticed when she was in the valley, that's when you're closest to the living water.   Jon Rocke: (23:13 - 24:41) Oh, absolutely. For sure. That's how creeks run, through valleys. Yeah. And I think our parenting, it was helpful for us to have both sides of our personality in parenting because I think we could address situations with our kids from different viewpoints and different ways to think about things, and those were helpful things as well.   But we also, during all sorts of the periods of time in our marriage, we had some little things that just reminded us. We had little words. So one was, you know, “we need to swim back.” So, you can often find yourself, because of a season of time or a season with your kids or whatever on the different islands, and we would just say, we got to swim back. And so that was one of our things that we did. And then we also had a, if we went too long, we just realized we weren't intentional about our intimacy of any kind. It was just basically, “Hey, you didn't kiss me today.” And we used to make that, “No, you didn't kiss me today.” And it was just a thing we tried to do to make sure that we had these little things that just kept us reminded. And so, they were really, they were kind of practical, just little code words for us that made a difference and got our minds back to where it needed to be.   Jolene Rocke: (24:41 - 24:50) Yeah, and in the busyness, that's easy to remember those little swing thoughts.   Laura Dugger: (24:50 - 30:17) Swim back. And now a brief message from our sponsor.   Did you know you can go to college tuition free just by being a team member at Chick-fil-A East Peoria? Yes, you heard that right. Free college education. All Chick-fil-A East Peoria team members in good standing are immediately eligible for a free college education through Point University. Point University is a fully accredited private Christian college located in West Point, Georgia. 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We ask that you also will share by sharing financially, sharing the Savvy Sauce podcast episodes, and sharing a five-star rating and review. You can also share any of our social media posts on Instagram or Facebook. We are grateful for all of it and we just love partnering together with you.   Now, back to the show. What encouragement do you have for healthy communication and healthy conflict resolution in marriage?   Jon Rocke: (30:19 - 31:31) God's grace. It's going to have to take time. You have to find that time together. So, I think it's all about prioritizing that time. I don't necessarily like conflict, but I know in our marriage you can't avoid it. And so, we just had to work through it right away. And so, I would say don't let time simmer conflict because that usually never makes it better.   Certainly, there's a sense of if there's something that's really emotional and maybe you need some space. My problem is I often don't give Jolene that space and that's hard on her, it really is, and sometimes not fair. But in the same vein, for me it felt like I didn't care if I just said, “Well, go ahead and be angry or be whatever or be upset about this or just let's not deal with it.” And she was gracious in pressing in and doing that. But I think don't let time go, just deal with it.   Jolene Rocke: (31:32 - 33:26) And two, the encouragement I think of is that Jon and I tell each other everything, every little thing. And we are very aware of couples that don't. And when Jon was holding back for me in that valley time, I really noticed it and I felt pretty alone. So, if you're always telling each other everything, there should be no secrets. So that just means there might be conflict then. If you're going to tell each other everything, then there might be conflict and you need to be prepared for that.   But that's better than me not saying anything. I sometimes say it's like a teapot, you're simmering or you're spouting. What's the perfect in the middle balance? It's really important to not simmer because you will spout eventually and then that's a harder conflict than if you just kept talking, kept telling every little thing. And so, we do tell each other every little thing.   Laura Dugger: (33:26 - 33:40) Well, and to go with that metaphor, if you have a release valve where that hot air can escape, it sounds like your communication has been that where you can get the water temperature back to a healthy place in the relationship.   Jolene Rocke: (33:40 - 33:55) Yeah, yes. And that takes work. So, I mean, honestly, what encouragement? Don't give up. Just keep going because it's worth it.   Laura Dugger: (33:55 - 34:10) Well, and I'm thinking back. Okay, so you had three kids. They're somewhat close together and you were young. So those years when all of your children were in the home, even elementary school age, that timeframe, what did that look like for communication? How did you still make sure you connected every day?   Jon Rocke: (33:26 - 34:31) Well, then throw in, we went to college after we had kids, which was actually, again, just God's grace and gift to us that we were able to leave town, leave the family business for a while, didn't think we were going to be involved in family business, went out to Indiana, went to school, and we didn't have anybody else but ourselves. And so that, again, was just his gift to us as young. We went in 1980, so that was two years after we were married. So, we already had Janelle at that point, and then Jamie came along soon after. And so, I had school but had to work to support. Jolene had to work and she was mom to two little ones. And so, again, I think it was just those times of making sure that we said nothing else can get in the way of us. Again, another phrase that we just had was, you know, we can get through anything together and nothing apart.   Jolene Rocke: (34:32 - 35:21) And that's not a flippant statement for us. That means we're trying and we're going to find the intentional time, put them to bed early, and make sure on weekends we're connecting well. And that meant sometimes driving with our kids. We'd go on drives. But that's Jon and I being able to talk. And then if they're goofing off in the back seat, it's okay. It's just fine because we actually are having talk time. Drive time has always been great communication time for us.   Laura Dugger: (35:21 - 35:35) That's really helpful, I think, for parents in any season. And you're talking about God's grace. So how has grace, and even forgiveness, benefited your relationship?   Jolene Rocke: (35:35 - 35:40) It's everything to our relationship.   Jon Rocke: (35:22 - 37:12) It's the only thing in everything. The parable of the unjust steward in Matthew 18 and just this idea that if you catch the enormity of your sin, then you can forgive others. And so that has been, I think, an important part of what we do because I love that whole story. Peter is asking that question, “How many times do I have to forgive somebody?” And if you think about a marriage context, well, that's a great question because my guess is it's going to be thousands upon thousands of times for whatever little or big things they are. And he's kind of like loading up. I feel that he's getting ready to say, “I've already forgiven this person six times. So, is it seven? And then after that, there's no more?” And the whole point of that is, oh, you really want to keep numbers, Peter? Here's the numbers. You've been forgiven zillions. And so, what's the little trifle amount that you're not going to forgive? And so, I'm thankful that Jolene is gracious because she's had to forgive me and continues to. We're still learning in a new season of life where now we get to work together, which to me is a really great joy. But it's also a different reality where we have a lot of work talk. Well, that's great. And we love that. But that can't dominate everything either. And so that's another one of those things that we have to figure out how to carve out our time away from work. Even though we enjoy working together and it's really fun, it's a new thing. That can't get in the way of us either.   Jolene Rocke: (37:13 - 40:14) There's got to be grace on both parts that now as I look at him as a boss also. And my husband, you know, I need to give a lot of grace to realize he's working within a momentum around a team and a leadership. But then as he comes home, and I'm very fully aware now of what a hat change that means for a man. That means that he's taking off his hat now and becoming my husband at home. And so, it's grace on both sides as he sees me working even under him or with him as a team. But it's a lot of grace and forgiveness over the years because in the early years as you're raising children, there might be unmet expectations is something I wrote down because I feel like as I think back to this pursuer of God and who I married and I remember those early years thinking, well, wow, he's not leading in devotions in the family. And I'm kind of struggling to find, I need to, as the mom then, pick that up and make sure we're doing with the children some family devotions. Well, that can create controversy. It can be that I would be upset, but I needed to forgive him for the fact that he didn't mean to do that and abdicate that responsibility. He just didn't know. And so, there's so much about being graceful as a wife to say, okay, I understand. That wasn't maybe how you were raised, or you didn't see that modeled in the home. But this is what I would desire for our family. And so, you just keep working and you keep forgiving because we've been forgiven so much, as Jon said. So, we know that. And I think the other key thing then with forgiveness becomes no record keeping, just as love is in 1 Corinthians 13. It doesn't keep the record of wrongs. I don't need to sit around with my time and in my brain and think about how much I've forgiven Jon. I need to think about the fact that God's forgiven so much in me, and he has to forgive me all the time. So, you're on this equal footing with forgiveness rather than trying to harbor a record of wrongs.   Laura Dugger: (40:14 - 40:40) Well, and I think you bring up examples for how it works in our families as well with children. And so, it's clear you two have such a solid marriage and you also have a thriving relationship with your adult children and your grandchildren and all their families. So, I think you just have a lot that you could teach us about raising a family as well. What are you so thankful that you did when your kids were living at home that you're now getting to see the payoff as they're adults?   Jon Rocke: (40:16 - 41:43) We literally grew up with our kids. So sorry for our kids that they had to, you know, grow up with their mom and dad. But that's been a lot of fun too because we did a lot of play. Again, these are just little things for us, these little words. So, as the kids were young, we used to, something that bothered them is I would tell them pretty plainly that I love mom most. And so, kids will always try to drive a wedge between mom and dad. That's just part of the fallen nature of kids. And so, we really communicated early. Our kids will tell you that was a hard lesson for them to learn that they didn't quite understand at that age, right? But they've really come to appreciate that in their own marriages. And then the other thing that we said was we choose you second. So, they knew we choose each other first because you're going to be gone someday and mom's not. And so, but we will always choose you second. So, friends were not a higher priority or social or hobby or anything. You know, the kids were always knew they were second. And so our kids are scattered all across, although we have Jamie and Jonathan here, one family here in Morton that we love to live life with. The others are gone, but I think we're still close in a lot of ways from that.   Jolene Rocke: (41:45 - 45:27) Yeah, I think we're a close family because we have stuck together through not just the ups, but the downs, but we're fun loving. Jon and I like games. We like to do stuff, and we like to go places. We prioritized vacation when they were little so that we were all together in an intentional environment that was away from home. And so, we were together, they enjoyed going to Florida every year and it was always what we called just happenstances that were so adverse. It wasn't your ideal. And so, we did not have ideal things happen on any trip, actually, that we go on. So, what we decided to call them is adventures. So, we intentionally took adverse situations, whether that's a flat tire, going to Florida with all the kids and it's the middle of the night and we're all sitting at a gas station on the curb waiting for the next tire to get fixed. It's just, we just always called them adventures and I'm not sorry for that. That's something our kids are passing on to their kids when things happen. Our son in particular, Jordan, his family seems to have a lot of adventures, like Jon and I have had. And that's what they call them to their children. So, I'm not sorry for the word adventure. Jon taught me a saying that he used to say, you love your children, even if you don't like them or you will lose them. And that was really important in the teenage years. When one of our children was struggling in junior high, I knew even if I didn't like the way this one was acting, I needed to just keep loving them as scripture says, right? Not if they're perfect, but all the time. And so, we didn't lose her through that time, I think because there was so much intentional loving beyond the liking. The other thing that I would just mention with that to encourage any, any mom or dad, I picked up the book, The Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman and had this daughter read it with me so that we can learn, how do we love each other? Well, through this time when it feels like we don't really like each other that well. So, well, wow. I had no idea. It was physical touch for you. And I, I thought it was the acts of service. And you would notice that I picked up your room because I knew you had a hard day in a test at school. Well, there was never any knowledge or awareness that I did that for her. But whenever I put my arms around her and gave her a giant hug and wouldn't let her go until she melted in my arms, I realized, yes, that's what she, that's how I can love her best.   Laura Dugger: (45:27 - 45:50) That is awesome to hear that story. It is helpful to have actionable things that we can replicate. And so, I am going to link in the show notes to a few of our episodes that may be beneficial. If people want to take that concept a step further, Dr. Gary Chapman has been a previous guest. I'll link to those. And then also Katie Mueller talked about traveling with your family and the lessons that the Lord teaches his children about traveling in the Bible and how that applies to us. That's great. So, if you're willing, will you share anything more about the honeymoon? I'm so curious now.   Jon Rocke: (45:27 - 46:35) We will. I feel like we're taking too much time here.   Jolene Rocke: (46:35 - 46:36) I don't know, but well, we knew that this was setting the tone for marriage as far as adventures.   Jon Rocke: (46:36 - 46:37) But well, the very first off we, we got on a plane. So, we got married on a Sunday and we were flying out down to Florida on Sunday night. We got to Atlanta where we were supposed to connect to another plane. We were supposed to go to Fort Myers, Florida and there had been a storm and, and they were rushing to get us on the right flights or to get us to the next flight. And they put us on the wrong plane. You know, this was back in the day where that could happen. Couldn't happen today, but put us on the wrong plane. We ended up in Melbourne, Florida at midnight last flight of the night. You know, we're newlyweds. We're supposed to be, you know, on our honeymoon. They put us up at a Holiday Inn Express with the crew and said, you know, we'll get you out a flight. You have to be up at 4 a.m. And so, you know, I was, our first night was not necessarily what you would, you know, call the most romantic night that we could have. And then do you want to tell the second story of our honeymoon?   Jolene Rocke: (46:36 - 46:37) The canoe trip.   Jon Rocke: (46:37 - 46:37) Yeah.   Jolene Rocke: (46:37 - 47:28) The canoe trip is, I have such bad allergies to many things. And so, Jon knew that because we tried to go horseback riding and I thought I'd be okay because it was outdoors, but the dander on the horse made me just blow up into a big ball on my face. And so, he realized how much I have a problem with allergies, but we decided to go canoeing in a very narrow mangrove swamp. That was really depleted in, in its depth that day. And so, we were canoeing along, but we, we got into the side of the mangrove trees and out came a Hornets, Hornets out of this giant nest and stung me all over my back.   Jon Rocke: (47:28 - 47:50) And so Jon went into, I'm like thinking that my six day, you know, marriage is over. My wife, who's so allergic, we're half hour out on our journey and I'm, she's like going to die on the spot. Cause I figured if she's so allergic to animals, then this many, you know, bee stings or wasp stings, she's, you know, she's dead.   Jolene Rocke: (47:52 - 48:12) So he jumps, jumps out. Yeah. First, the truth is he took my top off and started taking mud from the bottom of the creek and, just plasters me with mud on my back. And then he jumps out of the canoe and starts running the, the canoe. Cause it was pretty shallow.   Jon Rocke: (48:12 - 48:31) I decided it was going to be quicker to get her back in time. I figured I had about 30 minutes, you know, to, to try to get her to some medical attention. And so, yeah, so I'm running the canoe back instead of paddling it. Cause I knew I could get faster. Well, then I cut my foot on a shoal and we're a mess.   Jolene Rocke: (48:31 - 48:37) I mean, he had it. What? Like six-inch stitches. So, we ended up in the ER here.   Jon Rocke: (48:37 - 48:38) Yeah.   Jolene Rocke: (48:38 - 48:52) Both of us with me, with stings, Jon, with a cut. And, and that was just the start of the honeymoon that we called a giant adventure adventure since it wasn't great.   Jon Rocke: (48:52 - 48:55) It's been a 44-year adventure.   Laura Dugger: (48:55 - 49:15) You did start with quite the adventure. I love that. And I think the husbands' listening will appreciate, of course you took their top off first.   Jon Rocke: (49:03 - 49:04) That's right.   Jolene Rocke: (49:05 - 49:07) It was a little embarrassing.   Jon Rocke: (49:08 - 49:10) It was a good thing. Nobody else.   Jolene Rocke: (49:10 - 49:15) Nobody else.   Laura Dugger: (49:15 - 49:25) Sorry. I had to tease on that part, but through various seasons, how did you prioritize one another above your kids, your career and your own families of origin?   Jon Rocke: (49:25 - 50:35) We just knew we had to have time. So, a couple of things. I mean, we had a fortunate built in mechanism too, to take trips together. So, within our family business, we had conferences and such that we had to attend. And so, we made that a priority that we were going to do those together. I wasn't going to just go by myself. And so, a couple of times a year, and now that we're working together, it can feel like life blurs between everything. So, while we're at home, we're still talking about work and we're still dealing with ministry. And the other thing is with our kids away, a lot of our trip time is spent with our kids. So, we have to make that, that's gotta be a priority, but we realized we still need just our time away. and when we got, we went down to Florida and we just said, okay, no work talk for these five days, you know, no work talk. And it was pretty fun because most of the time Jolene broke that rule. And I would say, wait a minute, no work talk.   Jolene Rocke: (50:36 - 50:36) It's true.   Jon Rocke: (50:37 - 51:09) It's very true. But those, so trips were a big thing for us, and they don't have to be a big deal trip, but a weekend away to break the routine. You know, the example of that was, that's why God created festivals and holidays were to break routine and to have a stop in our everyday lives. And so, he knew we needed that to reconnect with him. Well, we know we need that in our marriages is to break the routine.   Jolene Rocke: (51:10 - 52:17) Very intentionally. Jon was wise enough to know we needed that as even as young as he was. Can you imagine the volumes of love that that spoke to me, that he wanted me to go with him on the trips. So that meant so much to me. And it still does today because he always wants me to go with him. And then I, I just have over the years, like when the kids were at home, that was days of rest for me when he was in meetings. But as I started growing too, as a person and not needing as much rest, I also would go into all the meetings because I liked the learning. But even as we went through college, like I just was always a part of the learning. And, and I liked that, but Jon included me. That said a lot to me.   Laura Dugger: (52:18 - 52:25) And I love your companionship, how you prioritize that. What advice do you have for all of us married couples as we seek to grow as one rather than start to grow parallel or even worse, start to grow apart from one another?   Jon Rocke: (52:18 - 52:47) Yeah, I think find things to do together. That's part of how even the biking, the tandem thing came about. Cause if we went out on bikes on our individual bikes, then I'm like, I'm wanting to run ahead. Well, you know, and then, and she's like, you know, you're not getting very much exercise or whatever the case may be. But then on a tandem, we could accomplish everything together. And so, finding some of those things.   Jolene Rocke: (52:47 - 54:56) So there's seasons of time when you're raising your children, like that, Jon was biking by himself and with some other men in a fast pace for extreme exercise. And I was doing my thing. And so, I'm not saying that hobbies apart from one another are negative, but for us, they've been mostly together. And so that just means that even there was a period that yes, Jon would go out golfing, not in excess, but when our kids were around and little, I think I was communicating even in that, that you don't just go off golfing every Saturday and leave your wife with the kids on a Saturday because you now that's your day off work. No, it's, we never get a day off work. So, you need to kick in at home too. So, there was this balance, I think is a really good word for how do you, how do you do like even individual hobbies and exercise even, but then mostly we're always trying to figure out how we can do things together. So, taking a back seat, literally on a tandem bike and knowing that that was going to help our marriage to be together. I also said recently now in a decade ago, I will learn how to golf. And so that, that just meant, again, I have no, no interest that much in golfing. I thought I loved riding the car around and being outside, but now it's like, yes, I will learn to golf if that means that that's another hobby and a sport and an activity that we can do together. So, we started a Friday night golf time, just Jon and I, it's a date night of golf and Dairy Queen supper. We call it Dairy Queen supper because we just don't eat supper, but we eat Dairy Queen after we go. So there again, there's just like, what are, what can we do together? And we're still doing date nights because it's just, we actually are really good friends still.   Jon Rocke: (54:57 - 55:51) Well, I think like I say, every season has been different for us. There was a time where kids were intense and Joe was a phenomenal mom and, was totally engaged in that. And you're in your career phase too. And so, all those things are competing. Well, then we've come back in the last five years and now we work together. So that's a different whole different dynamic. And so that's why we needed, you know, yeah, we need a golf and Dairy Queen night because we just need to get away from the intensity of our work relationship, you know, and take that break on our tandems. We usually ride for breakfast. So, most things have to do with food. It's not about exercise. It's about how to eat. So that's kind of just part of what we do.   Laura Dugger: (55:51 - 56:19) I love it though. That's an interest for all people. It's something that we have to do multiple times a day. Well, what do you want to leave us with? Whether it's a challenge or scripture, it can be anything, but how would you like to wind down our time together today?   Jolene Rocke: (56:19 - 56:30) I'm going to just say to encourage everyone. Our marriage has taken compromise and it's taken communication and it pays off in the end.   Jon Rocke: (56:19 - 57:11) You know, Ephesians 5 is really an important understanding that it's submitting to each other. The idea of wives submit to your husband, you're not catching the whole picture of that. If that's what your focus is, because it's husband loves you, love your wives as Christ loved the church. And so, and it starts the whole section off with submit to one another. And so, we have to be just intentional and committed. One of my favorite sayings is from Augustine, who says, when he was in prayer one time says to God, “Command what you will, but give what you command.” And so, when I think about our marriage, that's what grace is all about. Yes, it takes intentionality and commitment, but that only comes by his grace.   Jolene Rocke: (57:11 - 57:55) And one other thing that I thought of is that we always taught our kids to remember whose they are. And that just means that if you do that within a marriage too, and you're remembering that you're the Lord's, you're made in his image, then you relate and you will love the other one better. Even as you know your identity in Christ first, you will love your mate better.   Laura Dugger: (57:55 - 58:05) Amen. And you too may know we're called The Savvy Sauce because savvy is synonymous with practical knowledge. And so, as my final question for both of you today, what is your savvy sauce?   Jon Rocke: (57:56 - 58:07) You know, I just say submission is a good thing. It's not associated that way, but in a marriage it's such a good thing.   Jolene Rocke: (58:08 - 59:13) So that's both submitting to each other, not just the wife being clamped down. But our savvy sauce would be that sacrifice and submission are good things. They're not bad words. So, in our experience, a savvy sauce for our 44-year-old marriage is that sacrifice and submission have been very good things on both of our parts.   Laura Dugger: (59:13 - 59:20) Well, you clearly live this out, and you've been great role models to Mark and to me and our family. You love one another with such an intensity, and you love your Lord that way, and you love your children that way in your community. And I just see the way that He's had this ripple out from being intentional in the most key important parts of life, and that He's really blessed you in that, but He's also blessed all of us around you. So, thank you for sharing your journey with us. Thank you so much for being my guest.   Jolene Rocke: (59:20 - 59:22) It's been so great to be here with you. Thanks for asking, Laura.   Jon Rocke: (59:13 - 59:27) Yeah, it's been a privilege for us just to take the time to reflect again and realize the challenges, but really just celebrate what God has done through His grace in us and our marriage. So, thanks.   Laura Dugger: (59:27 - 1:03:10) One more thing before you go, have you heard the term gospel before? It simply means good news. And I want to share the best news with you, but it starts with the bad news.   Every single one of us were born sinners, but Christ desires to rescue us from our sin, which is something we cannot do for ourselves. This means there's absolutely no chance we can make it to heaven on our own. So, for you and for me, it means we deserve death, and we can never pay back the sacrifice we owe to be saved.   We need a savior, but God loved us so much. He made a way for his only son to willingly die in our place as the perfect substitute. This gives us hope of life forever in right relationship with him.   That is good news. Jesus lived the perfect life. We could never live and died in our place for our sin.   This was God's plan to make a way to reconcile with us so that God can look at us and see Jesus. We can be covered and justified through the work Jesus finished. If we choose to receive what he has done for us, Romans 10:9 says, “that if you confess with your mouth, Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.”   So, you pray with me now. Heavenly father, thank you for sending Jesus to take our place. I pray someone today right now is touched and chooses to turn their life over to you.   Will you clearly guide them and help them take their next step in faith to declare you as Lord of their life? We trust you to work and change lives now for eternity. In Jesus name we pray.   Amen. If you prayed that prayer, you are declaring him for me. So, me for him, you get the opportunity to live your life for him.   And at this podcast, we're called The Savvy Sauce for a reason. We want to give you practical tools to implement the knowledge you have learned. So, you're ready to get started.   First, tell someone, say it out loud, get a Bible. The first day I made this decision, my parents took me to Barnes and Noble and let me choose my own Bible. I selected the Quest NIV Bible and I love it.   You can start by reading the book of John. Also get connected locally, which just means tell someone who's a part of a church in your community that you made a decision to follow Christ. I'm assuming they will be thrilled to talk with you about further steps such as going to church and getting connected to other believers to encourage you.   We want to celebrate with you too. So, feel free to leave a comment for us here. If you did make a decision to follow Christ, we also have show notes included where you can read scripture that describes this process.   And finally, be encouraged. Luke 15:10 says, “in the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.” The heavens are praising with you for your decision today.   And if you've already received this good news, I pray you have someone to share it with. You are loved and I look forward to meeting you here next time.

In this week's MBA Admissions podcast we began by discussing the current state of the MBA admissions season. We are seeing several top MBA programs releasing interview invites for Round 2, including Yale SOM, Berkeley / Haas, Northwestern / Kellogg, UNC / Kenan Flagler, Rice / Jones, UVA / Darden, CMU / Tepper, Cornell / Johnson, UCLA / Anderson, Indiana / Kelley and Georgetown / McDonough. This led to a discussion about our newest product launch, Clear Admit's MBA Interview simulator.  This simulator is designed to provide a realistic interview experience for twenty top MBA programs, and provide detailed feedback. It is trained on Clear Admit's extensive catalogue of interview resources including its interview archive and interview guides. Graham highlighted MBA webinar events that are on the horizon that Clear Admit is hosting. The first webinar looks at the enduring value of the MBA, scheduled for Wednesday. The second series of events is for deferred admissions candidates who are currently completing their first degrees. Signups are here: https://www.clearadmit.com/events Graham noted two MBA admissions tips. The first focuses on MBA interview invite timelines for Round 2. The second admissions tip examines Wharton's Team-based Interview approach. Graham then noted a Real Humans piece spotlighting students from Minnesota Carlson. For this week, for the candidate profile review portion of the show, Alex selected two ApplyWire entries and one DecisionWire entry: This week's first MBA admissions candidate has a deferred admissions spot at Darden. They are planning to apply to a few M7 programs next season. This week's second MBA applicant was admitted to Fuqua, among other programs, in Round 1. They are also looking at several M7 programs in Round 2. This week's final MBA candidate has several offers from leading MBA programs. They want to focus on media and entertainment, post MBA. They are deciding between Darden with a scholarship and Columbia. This episode was recorded in Paris, France and Cornwall, England. It was produced and engineered by the fabulous Dennis Crowley in Philadelphia, USA. Thanks to all of you who've been joining us and please remember to rate and review this show wherever you listen!

Show Notes for Fleet Maull Podcast Episode Episode Overview Join host David Hill in conversation with Dr. Fleet Maull as they explore stress management, mindfulness practices, and radical responsibility for entrepreneurs. Learn practical strategies to optimize your nervous system, improve decision-making, and build sustainable business success. Fleet Maull helps overwhelmed founders and scaling entrepreneurs step out of survival mode and into CEO-level leadership. Drawing on 25+ years as a business strategist and founder of multiple mission-driven ventures, including an Inc. 5000 company, Fleet developed a high-impact MBA program specifically for bootstrapped entrepreneurs looking to break through 6- to 7- or 7- to 8-figure bottlenecks. Action Steps Establish a morning routine (even 5-10 minutes) Practice the "Stop, Feel, Breathe, Be" micro-practice throughout your day Learn breath regulation techniques at HeartMind.co Identify your top 5 daily priorities through journaling Implement the Pomodoro technique (45-minute focused work blocks) Delegate tasks that others can do 80% as well as you Practice mindful exercise with full presence TIME STAMPS 00:00 - 00:30 Introduction & Welcome 00:30 - 02:33 Understanding the Negativity Bias & Why Your Mind Wanders to Stress 02:33 - 10:41 The Two Branches of Your Nervous System Explained 10:41 - 14:30 Why Entrepreneurs Don't Do What They Know They Should (KEY INSIGHT) 14:30 - 20:25 The Power of Mindful Exercise & Morning Routines 20:25 - 24:27 From Operator to CEO: Building Systems & Delegating  28:48 The RISE Morning Routine Framework 34:26 - Stop, Feel, Breathe, Be: The One Micro- Practice to Start Today His immersive program isn't just business coaching—it's a complete recalibration of how leaders approach growth, delegation, and sustainability. Fleet's work combines proven operational strategies with mindset mastery, helping founders replace burnout with vision, build aligned teams, and unlock years of progress in a fraction of the time.  https://www.linkedin.com/in/fleetmaull/ https://www.instagram.com/fleetmaull/ David Hill is a trailblazer in marketing, sales training and coaching, leveraging over 36 years of experience across multiple industries. He has worked with some of the top companies, including Success, Cardone 10X, and leading real estate brands. David founded Path to Sales Mastery, where he specializes in helping sales professionals and business owners overcome common sales challenges. Known for his ability to drive significant growth, he enables clients to boost their sales by up to 50% and more within 90 days or less. Through his proven strategies, personalized coaching, and practical solutions, David continues to inspire and empower teams to reach their full potential. David also hosts the Path to Sales Mastery podcast with over 400 episodes featuring guests Gary V, Mel Robbins, Grant Cardone, Brian Tracey, and many others.  www.davidihill.com/podcast www.davidihill.com/online www.davidhill.link

It has been said that we don't have “big data” in healthcare, but instead a large amount of “small data.”In this episode, Halle speaks with Kyle Armbrester, CEO of Datavant and former CEO of Signify Health (acquired for $8B), about why healthcare data still moves the way it did decades ago and what it will take to modernize it at scale. Kyle reflects on building and leading large health tech companies and explains how fixing data flow could reduce administrative waste, improve security, and make care easier for patients and providers alike.We cover:Why healthcare billing still happens after the fact and how that fuels administrative wasteHow missing data standards led to fax-based workflows and brittle systemsWhy healthcare data is such an attractive target for cyberattacksHow clinical data can be shared digitally without being owned or resoldLeadership lessons from scaling companies through IPOs and acquisitions—About our guest: Kyle Armbrester is Chief Executive Officer of Datavant, a healthcare data platform company with a mission to make the world's health data secure, accessible, and actionable. Datavant operates the largest and most diverse health data exchange in the U.S., connecting more than 70 percent of the 100 largest health systems, all U.S. payers, and 300 plus real world data partners.Previously, Kyle served as CEO of Signify Health, where he led more than 200 percent revenue growth, took the company public in 2021, and guided its acquisition by CVS Health in 2023 for approximately $8 billion. He later served on the CVS Health executive management team, overseeing healthcare delivery strategy and interoperability.Earlier in his career, Kyle was Chief Product Officer and Head of Corporate Development at athenahealth, where he helped scale revenue from $320 million to $1.2 billion and launched the company's partnership marketplace. Kyle has served on multiple healthcare boards and holds an MBA and AB from Harvard University.—Chapters:00:01:20 Introduction to Kyle Armbrester and his journey in healthcare00:03:58 The impact of Athena Health on healthcare innovation00:06:20 Datavant: Revolutionizing health data interoperability00:08:15 The role of Datavant in reducing administrative burden00:12:20 Understanding Datavant's value proposition across stakeholders00:14:00 Consumer products and data accessibility at Datavant00:18:25 The scale and impact of Datavant in healthcare00:19:35 Cybersecurity challenges in healthcare data management00:23:57 Bridging the gap in healthcare regulations00:26:13 Unlocking the value of untapped healthcare data00:29:25 Challenges of value-based care models00:33:23 The reality of being a CEO in healthcare00:37:00 Navigating IPOs vs. Acquisitions00:39:44 Innovating healthcare incentives for better outcomes—Pre-order Halle's new book, Massively Better Healthcare.—

Are you anxious about an abrupt transition to retirement? In this episode of Retirement Answers, I share the concept of phased retirement, where you can gradually reduce work hours or stress levels instead of stopping work entirely. I explain the financial and emotional benefits, offering practical advice for a smoother, more comfortable path to retirement.

"My best learning opportunities were the ones where I've ultimately failed or made huge mistakes. I basically got an MBA in acquisitions in that deal." - Cameron BishopWhat if you could see your business through the eyes of someone who's completed over 100 acquisitions? In this episode, Bradley sits down with investment banker Cameron Bishop to explore the mind of an acquirer and how thinking like an investor can transform your business—whether you're planning to sell tomorrow or a decade from now.Cameron shares hard-won lessons from his journey from advertising copywriter to CEO of a $400 million company, and now as a managing director helping business owners navigate successful exits. You'll discover why the strategies that make a business attractive to buyers also make it a better business to own and operate.Resources MentionedRain CatcherWebsite: raincatcher.com Email: cameron.bishop@raincatcher.com.Connect with Cameron on LinkedIn.Free consultations available (no cost, no obligation, no sales pitch).Visit BlueprintOS.com to learn about the 2026 Above The Business Workshops, our coaching programs, and resources designed specifically for small business owners who want to build systematic, scalable operations that don't require your constant presence. Thanks to our sponsors...Coach P found great success as an insurance agent and agency owner. He leads a large, stable team of professionals who are at the top of their game year after year. Now he shares the systems, processes, delegation, and specialization he developed along the way. Gain access to weekly training calls and mentoring at www.coachpconsulting.com. Be sure to mention the Above The Business Podcast when you get in touch. Autopilot Recruiting helps small business owners solve their staffing challenges by taking the stress out of hiring. Their dedicated recruiters work on your behalf every single business day - optimizing your applicant tracking system, posting job listings, and sourcing candidates through social media and local communities. With their continuous, hands-off recruiting approach, you can save time, reduce hiring costs, and receive pre-screened candidates, all without paying any hiring fees or commissions. More money & more freedom: that's what Autopilot Recruiting help business owners achieve. Visit https://www.autopilotrecruiting.com/ and don't forget to mention you heard about us on the Above The Business podcast. Direct Clicks is built is by business owners, for business owners. They specialize in custom marketing solutions that deliver real results. From paid search campaigns to SEO and social media management, they provide the comprehensive digital marketing your business needs to grow. Here's an exclusive offer for Above The Business listeners: Visit directclicksinc.com/abovethebusiness for a FREE marketing campaign audit. They'll assess your website, social media, SEO, content, and paid advertising, then provide actionable recommendations. Plus, when you choose to partner with them, they'll waive all setup fees. About Above The Business: Above The Business is hosted by Bradley Hamner, founder of BlueprintOS, and focuses on helping small business owners transition from Rainmaker to Architect. Each week, Bradley shares frameworks, interviews successful entrepreneurs, and provides actionable insights for building businesses that run without you. Whether you're doing $300K or $3M in revenue, this show will help you get above your business and design the systems you need to scale.

This episode's Community Champion Sponsor is Ossur. To learn more about their ‘Responsible for Tomorrow' Sustainability Campaign, and how you can get involved: CLICK HEREEpisode Overview: Geography should never determine whether a patient lives or dies.Our next guest, Dr. Sarah Matt, is on a mission to make that vision a reality.A surgeon turned health technology strategist, Sarah has spent over two decades breaking down the barriers that separate patients from care.From leading Oracle's $28 billion Cerner integration to architecting the first U.S. remote robotic surgery network, she's been at the forefront of healthcare's digital transformation.Now, as a national bestselling author of The Borderless Healthcare Revolution, Sarah is equipping healthcare leaders with a practical framework to eliminate physical, financial, cultural, digital, and trust barriers to care.Join us to discover how we can build a truly borderless healthcare system. Let's go!Episode Highlights:Five Pillars of Access: Physical, financial, cultural, digital, and trust barriers—with cultural and trust most overlookedFrom Bedside to Billions: Sarah left the OR to impact millions through technology instead of 20 patients a day2026 is the Year of Catch Up: Fix data governance and interoperability before AI can deliver real resultsActionable Over Theoretical: Every chapter includes a builder's box and checklist for immediate actionNew Leadership Required: Leaders must think faster, embrace uncertainty, and operate in the gray zoneAbout our Guest:Sarah Matt, MD, MBA, is a surgeon turned health technology strategist, author, and speaker. Her work focuses on how digital tools, from remote surgery to telemedicine to AI, can expand access to healthcare and eliminate the traditional boundaries that separate patients from care.With over two decades of experience at the intersection of medicine and innovation, Dr. Matt has held leadership roles at Oracle Health, NextGen, and multiple health tech startups. She has designed and deployed systems that reach patients around the world, including hard-to-serve and underserved populations.A practicing physician, Dr. Matt continues to treat patients in rural and charity-based settings, keeping her closely connected to the human side of healthcare access. She speaks widely at healthcare and technology conferences and has appeared on national panels about artificial intelligence, care delivery reform, and digital transformation. She is also the author of The Borderless Healthcare Revolution: The Definitive Guide to Breaking Geographic Barriers Through Technology.A graduate of Cornell University, SUNY Upstate Medical University and UT Austin's McCombs School of Business, she blends clinical acumen with deep technical knowledge to challenge the status quo and to reimagine what healthcare can look like when geography no longer dictates your care.Links Supporting This Episode: Dr. Sarah Matt Website: CLICK HERE

On this episode of CFO at Home, Vince·s guest is Scott MacKenzie, author of The Lobster League, A Fable About Personal Finance. Scott and Vince dive into the concept of the book, which is designed as a fable to teach personal financial lessons through relatable stories, inspired by Scott·s extensive experience in the area of behavioral finance. They discuss how the human tendencies of herding and overconfidence can impact our investing. Scott also emphasizes the importance of having a clear set of personal priorities and goals, specifically by creating a bucket list to guide financial decisions. Like the book, our conversation offers valuable insights into personal finance for both money enthusiasts and those not as financially inclined. To learn more about Scott and The Lobster League, go the thelobsterleague.com Key Topics: 01:10 The Story Behind 'The Lobster League' 04:00 Crafting a Financial Fable 05:54 Behavioral Finance Insights 08:56 Herding and Market Trends 21:22 Overconfidence and Fear in Investing 27:48 Creating a Personal Financial Vision 33:23 Conclusion and Final Thoughts Key Links thelobsterleague.com Scott MacKenzie, MBA, CFP®, CIMA® | LinkedIn  Contact the Host - vince@thecfoathome.com  Want to be a guest on CFO at Home? Send Vince a message on PodMatch, here: https://www.podmatch.com/hostdetailpreview/1628643039567x840793309030672500  

Send us a textLynn Thoman is a professor at Columbia University's School of International and Public Affairs and the founder of 3 Takeaways, a top 1% global podcast known for distilling big ideas from influential leaders shaping policy, business, and society. Drawing on experience across corporate strategy, public sector advisory work, and board service at institutions such as the Brookings Institution and Harvard's Kennedy School of Government, Lynn brings a cross-sector lens to how AI is reshaping decision-making, learning, and human potential.In this conversation, we discuss:Why AI is best understood as an amplifier of human capability, especially in leadership, where judgment and choices matter more than technology.How the real upside of AI is giving people more space for imagination, empathy, and meaningful human connection.How to prepare students and professionals for an AI-shaped job market by prioritizing learning paths, adaptability, and relationships over fixed career tracks.Why the biggest risks of AI come from small, hard-to-detect changes in data or models that can create serious downstream harm.How AI is pushing education, work, and leadership back toward core human skills like judgment, curiosity, and imagination.Where cautious optimism comes from, including AI's potential to expand access to knowledge, healthcare, and opportunity when used with care.Resources:Subscribe to the AI & The Future of Work NewsletterConnect with Lynn on LinkedInAI fun fact articleOn How genAI studios launch AI-first companiesOther podcast episodes mentioned on the show:On reinventing the academic curriculum for MBAs with Dave Marchick, Dean of the Kogod School of BusinessFrom 3 Takeaways:The Genetic Revolution Has Begun - George Church on What Comes NextThe Transforming Power of Hospitality in Business: Setting the Table with Union Square Hospitality Group Founder & CEO Danny Meyer

Jordan Amadio, M.D., is a board-certified neurosurgeon, and his clinical practice focuses on minimally invasive spine surgery, surgical neuro-oncology and neurotrauma. Amadio received his medical education at Harvard Medical School and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology before completing a neurosurgery residency at Emory University. At Emory, he pursued research fellowships as a Council of State Neurosurgical Societies socioeconomic fellow and a Congress of Neurological Surgeons innovation fellow. He also earned an MBA from Harvard Business School, with emphasis on medical technology innovation. As affiliated faculty and a National Institutes of Health-funded investigator within Texas Robotics, he works with robotics experts to build next-generation tools and implants for spine surgery. Previously, he co-founded the NeuroLaunch incubator for neurotechnology startups and has since advised dozens of medical technology ventures. Outside his academic work, Amadio is closely involved with the development of brain-computer interface technology as a director of neurosurgery at Neuralink. Amadio is deeply committed to mentoring the next generation of physicians and enjoys teaching students and residents. As a way of giving back, he has also been active in providing neurosurgical care to socioeconomically challenged populations, from Texas to Mirebalais, Haiti.Support the show

Join me and my guest Andrew Grinbaum, founder of Spirituality in Business Institute (SpiritualBiz.org). Andrew is a 5x entrepreneur, 4x author, MBA professor, and ICF-certified coach who fuses rigorous business strategy with mindfulness, meditation, and soul-aligned leadership. He has scaled multiple multimillion dollar companies and coached more than 4,000 leaders, from Fortune 500 executives to 7- and 8-figure small business CEOs. Andrew brings more than two decades of hands-on experience as a business consultant and he specializes in helping leaders design strategies that actually let them work less while increasing profits, all anchored in mindfulness and soul-centered leadership. SHOW NOTES SPONSORED BY: Power of You! https://leader.blainebartlett.com/power-of-you Summary In this conversation, Blaine and Andrew Grinbaum explore the integration of spirituality into business practices. They discuss the importance of mindfulness, customer experience, and the practical application of spiritual principles to enhance productivity and business success. Andrew shares resources from his nonprofit aimed at helping entrepreneurs incorporate spirituality into their work, emphasizing the need for a balance between profit and purpose. The discussion also highlights the significance of personal growth, the impact of nature on well-being, and the necessity of letting go of certain tasks to foster business growth.   Takeaways Spirituality in business is about practical application, not religion. Mindfulness can significantly enhance productivity and sales. Five-star service can double customer referrals and sales. Companies should focus on delivering higher service to increase profits. Taking breaks in nature can improve mental clarity and productivity. Letting go of low-value tasks is essential for business growth. Spiritual principles can unify diverse business practices. Personal growth is linked to business success. A business should be viewed as an asset to be nurtured. Short-term sacrifices can lead to long-term benefits in business. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Sarah Matt, MD, MBA, health technology strategist and author of "The Borderless Healthcare Revolution", discusses her journey from surgery to health tech and shares a framework for improving healthcare access across geography, technology, trust, and equity.

In this comprehensive session, Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS explores the strategic nuances of email marketing. The discussion transcends basic sales tactics, positioning email as a foundational pillar for business documentation, professional credibility, and high-impact communication. Favour emphasizes that while social media platforms often dominate the marketing conversation, email remains a superior channel for conversion and long-term relationship building. The session provides a detailed roadmap for entrepreneurs and developers alike, covering technical infrastructure, audience psychology, and the necessity of intentional engagement.Strategic Insights and Market ComparisonsThe conversation highlights a stark contrast between the ephemeral nature of social media and the enduring impact of email marketing. Favour notes that social media conversion rates typically languish below 1%, whereas search engine optimization (SEO) and email marketing can achieve conversion rates ranging from 16% to over 33%. This discrepancy is attributed to the "currency" of email: the exclusive time and attention granted by the recipient. Unlike social media posts that are quickly buried by algorithms, an email retains its conversion potential long after it is sent, provided it reaches the recipient's inbox through proper technical execution.Need to Book An SEO Discovery Call for Advertising or Marketing Services?>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Book a Complimentary SEO Discovery Call with Favour Obasi-Ike⁠>> Visit Work and PLAY Entertainment website to learn about our digital marketing services>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our exclusive SEO Marketing community⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Read SEO Articles>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to the We Don't PLAY Podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Purchase Flaev Beatz Beats Online| Marketing Channel | Average Conversion Rate | Primary Advantage || Social Media | < 1% | High initial visibility and brand awareness. || Email Marketing | 16% - 33%+ | Direct connection, longevity, and high intent. || SEO | 16% - 33%+ | Sustainable organic traffic and credibility. |Technical Infrastructure and DeliverabilityA significant portion of the session is dedicated to the technical "hygiene" required to maintain high deliverability. Favour introduces Google Postmaster as an essential tool for monitoring domain health and ensuring that communications are not flagged as spam. The technical setup involves a rigorous configuration of DNS records, including MX, SPF, and DKIM, which serve as the digital credentials for a legitimate sender. Furthermore, the discussion touches upon the physical properties of an email, such as file size and font optimization, which can inadvertently trigger spam filters if not managed correctly.| Technical Component | Purpose | Best Practice || Google Postmaster| Domain Health Monitoring | Regularly check [postmaster.google.com](https://postmaster.google.com). || MX, SPF, DKIM | Authentication & Compliance | Ensure all DNS records are correctly configured. || List Hygiene | Deliverability Maintenance | Clean the list after every campaign to remove bounces. || Email Size| Spam Prevention | Use standard fonts (16px-20px) to keep file sizes low. || Segmentation| Engagement Tracking | Group audiences by behavior or interest for targeted messaging. |Content Strategy and Audience EngagementFavour and his guests, including the developer Ifeanyi, discuss the shift toward more sophisticated, developer-friendly tools like Resend, which allow for scalable, code-driven email templates. The consensus is that modern audiences do not "read" in the traditional sense; instead, they "skim" for value. Consequently, the use of listicles, bullet points, and concise subject lines is paramount.A professional subject line should ideally be limited to three or four words to avoid appearing "junior," while the preview text should be leveraged to provide the necessary context that encourages a click.The session concludes with a call for intentionality in marketing. Favour suggests a "Want vs. Need" framework: use the subject line to address what the audience *wants* (immediate value or curiosity), and use the body of the email to deliver what they *need* (tutorials, case studies, or interactive elements like polls). This approach ensures that the communication is not just seen, but acted upon.Podcast Episode Timestamps[00:00] – Introduction to the role of email in documentation and professional communication.[01:03] – Favour Obasi-ike's background in intellectual property and search engine marketing.[02:35] – Comparative analysis of conversion rates across social media, SEO, and email.[04:50] – Technical requirements for deliverability: Google Postmaster and MX record configuration.[06:16] – Reflections on the "We Don't PLAY™️" podcast and Favour's six-year tenure on Clubhouse.[22:37] – The impact of font selection and email file size on technical deliverability.[23:53] – Strategies for audience segmentation and the importance of reviewing engagement analytics.[24:26] – Managing hard and soft bounces through consistent list hygiene.[28:44] – Guest contribution from Ifeanyi on using "Resend" and React for scalable email infrastructure.[45:20] – Timing strategies: Measuring audience activity windows for optimal email delivery.[46:25] – The psychology of subject lines: Why brevity (3-4 words) signals professional maturity.[47:43] – The "Want vs. Need" framework for content delivery and engagement.[49:36] – Utilizing polls for market research: A case study on Google vs. Perplexity preferences.[52:02] – The efficacy of listicles and skimming-friendly formats in modern digital communication.About Favour Obasi-ikeFavour Obasi-ike is a prominent business consultant and entrepreneur specializing in helping creators and business owners secure their intellectual property through search engine marketing, Pinterest, and podcasting. He is the host of the "We Don't PLAY™️" podcast, a long-running series with over 610+ episodes spanning seven years.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this insightful episode, Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS breaks down the critical differences and essential overlaps between traditional Google SEO and the emerging field of ChatGPT SEO (optimization for AI search). The core distinction is framed as Websites vs. Conversation. While Google prioritizes structured, keyword-optimized websites, AI models like ChatGPT, Perplexity, and Gemini focus on providing direct, conversational answers.Favour Obasi-ike argues that the future of content visibility lies in establishing your website as the central anchor for all content distribution. By consistently linking your website across all platforms (YouTube, LinkedIn, podcasts, etc.), you build the domain authority and citation structure necessary for AI models to trust and cite your content. He emphasizes that AI-driven search is shifting the user experience from "clicking" on a link to "trusting" a direct answer, making the source's authority more critical than ever. The podcast episode concludes with actionable advice on technical SEO, including optimizing for page speed, Core Web Vitals, and formatting content with listicles and tables to be easily digestible by AI.Need to Book An SEO Discovery Call for Advertising or Marketing Services?>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Book a Complimentary SEO Discovery Call with Favour Obasi-Ike⁠>> Visit Work and PLAY Entertainment website to learn about our digital marketing services>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our exclusive SEO Marketing community⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Read SEO Articles>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to the We Don't PLAY Podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Purchase Flaev Beatz Beats OnlineKey Episode TakeawaysThe Fundamental Difference: Websites vs. ConversationThe core difference is in the format each search system prioritizes. Google SEO is built around ranking individual websites on search result pages (SERPs) for structured keywords. The user's journey involves clicking through to a website.ChatGPT SEO, on the other hand, is built for a conversational AI interface. The goal is to provide the perfect, direct, and trusted answer within the chat window itself, minimizing the need for a click.The New SEO Ecosystem: LLM VisibilityTo achieve LLM Visibility (Large Language Model Visibility), you must understand that search is now split between two major ecosystems.The Google/OpenAI ecosystem includes Google search, ChatGPT (using the Atlas Browser), and the associated platform, YouTube.The Microsoft/Perplexity ecosystem includes the Perplexity AI platform (using the Comet Browser) and the associated Microsoft-owned platform, LinkedIn.Actionable Steps for 2026 SEO StrategyEstablish Your Anchor: Your website must be the central hub for all your content.Distribute Your Authority: Place your website link on every third-party platform (social media, podcast directories, video descriptions).Optimize for Speed: Prioritize Core Web Vitals and page speed for both mobile and desktop to ensure a positive user experience, which Google rewards.Format for AI: Structure your content using tables, listicles, and concise, keyword-rich formatsto make it easy for AI models to extract and cite direct answers.Build Trust, Not Just Clicks: Focus on building long-term trust and authority with search engines through consistent, high-quality, and structured content.Episode Timestamps[00:00] Introduction: Google SEO vs. ChatGPT SEO, Optimization Showdown.[00:30] Defining the core difference: Google focuses on websites, ChatGPT focuses on conversation.[01:33] The connection: ChatGPT Atlas (browser) citing YouTube (owned by Google).[03:52] The goal: Use your website as an anchor for content distribution.[04:02] Understanding LLM Visibility (Large Language Model Visibility).[04:28] The emerging AI browser landscape: ChatGPT Atlas, Perplexity Comet, and the upcoming Google Disco.[05:30] The two major ecosystems: Google/YouTube/ChatGPT vs. Microsoft/LinkedIn/Perplexity.[06:15] The importance of checking your business's citations with "Google Learn About."[06:56] AI's focus on directness and specificity in answers (Siri, Alexa, etc.).[08:00] The shift from "click" to "trust" in AI-driven search results.[09:00] Why a strong website domain authority is crucial for AI citation.[10:00] The concept of "AI-friendly" content and the need for listicles and tables.[11:00] The future of search: AI-driven answers vs. traditional links.[12:00] The importance of structured data and schema for AI.[13:00] The difference between a website and a social media profile.[14:00] The need for a content mix (audio, video, text, image).[15:00] The role of a website in the new SEO ecosystem.[16:00] The power of a website's domain authority.[17:00] The shift from "click" to "trust" in AI-driven search.[18:00] The importance of technical SEO: Page Speed and Core Web Vitals.[19:00] How to build content that is easy to read and digest.[20:00] The value of brand citations and authority.[21:00] The long-term benefit of placing your website everywhere.[22:00] Final call to action: Check if your content is in table and listicle formats.[23:00] The power of tactics, strategy, and timing in SEO.[24:00] Conclusion: Build structure and trust with search engines, as they are "talking to each other."See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this insightful session, Favour Obasi-ike, MBA, MS, a seasoned marketing expert, delves into the intricacies of launching and sustaining a profitable podcast. This episode is a goldmine for anyone looking to move beyond just creating content and build a podcast that generates both impact and income. Favour breaks down the essential strategies for creating a podcast that stands out and delivers tangible results.This session is a must-listen for aspiring and current podcasters who want to understand the business of podcasting. Favour provides a clear roadmap for building a strong foundation for your podcast, from establishing a web presence to leveraging SEO for discoverability. If you're ready to take your podcast to the next level, this episode is packed with actionable advice and expert insights.Need to Book An SEO Discovery Call for Advertising or Marketing Services?>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Book a Complimentary SEO Discovery Call with Favour Obasi-Ike⁠>> Visit Work and PLAY Entertainment website to learn about our digital marketing services>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join our exclusive SEO Marketing community⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Read SEO Articles>> ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Subscribe to the We Don't PLAY Podcast⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠>> Purchase Flaev Beatz Beats OnlineIn this episode, you'll learn:[03:34] The foundational idea behind a profitable podcast: impact.[05:34] Why your podcast needs its own website and domain.[08:00] The importance of email capture for building a direct relationship with your audience.[10:10] How to think of your podcast as a separate entity from your main business.[11:06] The concept of creating and building capacity for your podcast.[14:00] How to create a content bank and repurpose your podcast content.[20:01] The significance of SEO in podcasting and how to optimize your show notes.[30:04] How to use your podcast to build a community and generate leads.[39:15] The power of anchor text and how to use it to drive traffic to your website.[43:21] The importance of choosing the right genre and categories for your podcast.[50:00] How to create a content strategy that aligns with your business goals.[59:01] The value of guesting on other podcasts to expand your reach.[01:05:00] How to use your podcast to build a personal brand and establish yourself as an expert in your niche.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This episode is a compilation of answers to YOUR questions that were asked directly from my listeners who attend my weekly business education YouTube live webcast. Topics covered include: Chall enge Clinic 1,2,3, How to leverage AI to become the best version of myself, What would you do if you had $50k today and more. Refer to chapter marks for a complete list of topics covered and to jump to a specific section. Download my free "Networking eBook": www.harouneducation.comAttend my weekly YouTube Live every Thursday's 8am-11am PT. Subscribe to my YouTube Channel to receive notifications. Learn more about my MBA Degree ProgramConnect with me: YouTube: ChrisHarounVenturesCompleteBusinessEducationInstagram @chrisharounLinkedIn: Chris HarounTwitter: @chris_harounFacebook: Haroun Education Ventures  TikTok: @chrisharoun300How to forecast a P/E ratio