Winsome Conviction

How do friends who hold differing views of religion and faith maintain a friendship? How do friends handle central and fundamental disagreements about God and faith? On today's episode, Tim speaks with two such friends - Andrew Reid, professor at Brigham Young University, and Greg Johnson, founder of Standing Together, a bridge-building ministry focused on LDS/Evangelical dialogues. Over the course of 11 years, Andrew and Greg have cultivated a friendship around interfaith dialogue that is intriguing, but it's been a very challenging process. They unpack parts of their story and what has helped them to maintain their friendship, and they discuss the importance of establishing common ground when working through religious differences and disagreements.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Undergraduate students have a thirst for interfaith conversations. So this past spring professors and students from Brigham Young University traveled to Southern California to engage in meaningful conversations and build relationships with professors and students from Biola University. On today's episode, Tim speaks with Andy Reid, associate professor of religious understanding and church history at BYU, and Greg Johnson, a pastor and the founder of Standing Together ministries, a bridge-building ministry focused on LDS/Evangelical dialogues. They reflect on this experience at Biola and consider features of spending time together that provided opportunities for learning and ways to seek God in the faith of others, even while drawing attention to clear differences.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

On today's episode, political commentator, author, and attorney Denise Gitsham speaks with Tim about some major themes in her book, Politics for People Who Hate Politics. Through a series of personal anecdotes and stories, they discuss some of the challenges to being winsome and loving in our current political climate, especially when you're being steamrolled by the opposition. They discuss the frequency of offense and the spiritual battle that can accompany offense, and they unpack an interesting 4-way test to evaluate whether truth is spoken in love.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

On today's episode, Tim speaks with Michael Wear, President and CEO of the Center for Christianity and Public Life and author of the book, The Spirit of Our Politics: Spiritual Formation and the Renovation of Public Life, on features of Christian faithfulness and civic engagement. Michael talks about his role as a faith advisor in the White House during the Obama administration, and they discuss the influence of Dallas Willard and the role of spiritual formation in the context of political life, with particular interest on the role anger plays in our political aims and discourse. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Stephen Lloyd-Moffett, professor of Religious Studies at California Polytechnic State University in San Luis Obispo, CA, is also a campus moderator for the Veritas Forum, a non-profit organization that seeks to help students on college campuses explore truth in dialogue across religious beliefs. On today's episode, Tim, Rick and Stephen consider: What makes for a good moderator when disagreement pops up? And how do you keep the relationship in tact when a pointed and meaningful disagreement occurs? They discuss the importance of building muscle for inquiry and learning how to use educational environments to challenge and strengthen faith convictions. Tim and Rick also ask Stephen about the perceptions of evangelicals on the campus.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

On today's episode, Stephen Lloyd-Moffett, professor of Religious Studies at California Polytechnic State University in San Luis Obispo, CA, speaks with Tim and Rick about the deeply human tendency to search for meaning in religious experience. Stephen shares a story from his younger years that would set him off on a vocational path of religious scholarship. The three then spend time discussing whether God can be found and whether we can know God - important questions that invite points of agreement and respectful disagreement. Through the discussion we also see a common value of wanting to acquire a conception of God that can profoundly shape how to live a life.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Today's episode is a collaborative effort with the Think Biblically podcast, where Scott and Tim speak with Rev. Chris Brooks on the meaning of Dr. King's legacy and some of its implications for institutions, churches, and individuals today. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Preston Sprinkle (Ph.D.), good friend of Biola University and The Winsome Conviction Project, knows that being a public figure comes with a cost. Preston joins today's episode to reflect with Tim and Rick on the times he has been critiqued and what it is like to be called out as heretic. They discuss the importance of accurately representing someone's views when offering a critique, the kinds of critiques to take seriously, how good critiques can help us make intellectual progress, and Preston reflects on a lesson learned when he reached out to a critic and the result did not go well.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Although trends show declines in church attendance, Dr. Rebecca McLaughlin (Ph.D. Cambridge University) believes we are living in an evangelistically pregnant time. Rebecca is back on the podcast to speak with Tim about this cultural moment and the need to learn from Jesus - his manner of living and his teaching, including the parable of the sower, to help cultivate a consistent, Christian ethic.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Dr. Preston Sprinkle (Ph.D.) joins today's episode to speak with Tim and Rick on the work he's doing to help foster civil, thoughtful, and faithful disagreements on contentious issues. Preston unpacks some of the motivations with his wildly popular Theology in the Raw podcast, and they also discuss the Theology in the Raw conference - an annual conference where people of differing views come together for 3 days to speak with one another on some of the more polarizing topics affecting the church today.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Special guest Tim Milosch (Ph.D.) joins today's podcast to speak with Tim and Rick on the multifaceted phenomenon of Christian Nationalism. They cover questions including: What is Christian Nationalism? Why has it been important and garnered so much attention? Who are the kinds of people who identify with this cultural phenomenon? What are some of the confusions around Christian Nationalism? And what are noteworthy cautions for Christians who are thinking through how to practice political engagement?Show notes and a full transcript are available.

We like to do segments that highlight people who are doing civility right, and it's pretty special when we see Biola students who are doing it right. On today's episode, Tim speaks with one of his students, Markus, who is also a film major at Biola. Markus wrote and directed a short film, “Halfway,” that addresses the animosity and reconciliation between two families, Israeli and Palestinian. Tim and Markus also reflect on the role of film in helping to foster perspective-taking, including Markus's stint as an intern on the set on the wildly popular tv series, The Chosen.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

On today's episode, Rachel Gilson speaks with Tim about sexuality, same-sex attraction, and living faithfully as a follower of Jesus. The conversation dips into Rachel's journey in coming to faith, being attracted to the same-sex and yet choosing to follow the Bible's teaching on sexuality, considerations of sexuality for discipleship, and what the Church is doing well and not doing well with transgender and LGBTQ communities. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

We regularly host episodes speaking with people who are doing civility right. These “Reports From The Front” provide insights and illustrations from people who are practicing civility and conviction in the day to day. On this episode, Tim and Mark Muha, Vice President for Student Development at Biola University, reflect on a recent learning experience they went through that involved engaging their political opposite. Tim and Mark discuss and unpack some of the stigmas people have with “conservative” and “Christian,” the need for nuance and humor, and leading with curiosity when listening to another's personal story.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Dr. Rebecca McLaughlin (Ph.D. Cambridge University) joins today's episode to speak with Tim on how to engage challenging questions and challenging people. Through the course of the conversation they consider such questions as: How can persuasion be an act of love? When can challenging a person's belief be a sign of respect? What are the telltale signs that someone is listening to you? And what might loving and respectful engagement look like in contentious topics such as homosexuality and abortion? If Jesus is the truth and the life, this should shape the manner in which Christians engage with others, especially when we engage with people who do not believe in the claims of Christianity. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Chris McKinney, co-author of the book Neighborhoods Reimagined, is back on the podcast to speak with Tim and Mike on the surprising relevance of the beatitudes for being better neighbors. They also talk about a litmus test for gauging individualism, the challenges of “having time,” and Chris shares stories on the role of food in bringing people together, including a food event they creatively call “Bite of the World.”Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Recent surveys say less than half of Americans trust their neighbors. What might be some of the reasons for this erosion of trust? On today's episode, Chris McKinney, co-author of the book Neighborhoods Reimagined, speaks with Tim and Mike on some of factors contributing to healthy and unhealthy neighborly relations, and they discuss the surprising relevance of the beatitudes. Chris also shares some of the practical steps he and his family are taking to build trust with their neighbors and the lessons they have learned.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

The presidential election is about to happen, so Tim and Rick take time on this episode to reflect on our cultural moment. They share ideas for having perspective, provide tips for speaking with people who are affiliated with another political party, and emphasize the need for the Church to preserve her integrity regardless of the candidate who becomes president elect.Show notes and a full transcript are available. 

Do people even want to engage in civil discourse? How does myside bias keep us from engaging others? On today's episode, Mike and Tim discuss these questions and more as they discuss some of the motivations in writing End the Stalemate: Move Past Cancel Culture to Meaningful Conversations, a recently published book that Tim co-authored with Sean McDowell.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Mike Ahn (Ph.D.), Dean of Spiritual Development at Biola University, is also a new co-director with the Winsome Conviction Project, and we wanted to give you a chance you learn a bit about Mike on this episode. Tim and Mike play two truths and a lie; Mike talks about the role of spiritual formation for helping to foster civility; and they dig into some of the projects on campus Mike is leading that aim to promote faithfulness among undergraduate students, including a training on civility with Pomona College and Biola University.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Why are we experiencing so much polarization in culture? A common answer is social media. But what is some of the reasoning on how social media contributes to polarization? Today on the episode, Tim and Rick speak with Michael Whitenton (Ph.D.) about three types of polarization that social media incites - ideological, perceived, and affective. Michael also talks about the books and resources he uses for a course he teaches to undergraduate students on how to have courageous conversations in divided times, and they get into some of the hard realities of fostering bridge building conversations in public spaces.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Radio host and pastor Bob Lepine is back on the podcast to speak with Tim and Rick about notable changes in our cultural communication since late 1970's, including changes in our cultural tone. They discuss the loss of common ground, the dangers of one-sided winsomeness, how to engage fellow Christians with whom we disagree, and a significant communication pattern with Jesus and the Apostle Paul in the way they communicated with others, including their criticisms of others.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

What are our expectations for rules of engagement in building a healthy democracy? What shared commitments can we make in our civic aspirations? At the heart of answers to these questions is the issue of pluralism, which was one of the founding creeds of the United States for helping to live peaceably and with civility despite deeply engrained differences. John Inazu, professor of law and religion at Washington University, and author of the book, Confident Pluralism: Surviving and Thriving through Deep Difference, is back on the podcast to discuss pluralism and ways to foster persuasion rather than coercion for a pluralistic society.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Michael Whitenton (Ph.D.) directs the Bridgebuilding Fellows program at Baylor University, a program that seeks to help students to engage in healthy and virtuous civil discourse. Michael joins today's episode to speak with Tim and Rick about the origins and aims of the program. Today's episode helps listeners become aware of other groups and organizations who are responding to issues of polarization by championing the work of bridge building in civil discourse. Michael also gives examples on the art and value of constructive dialogue, and they discuss the importance and difficulty of achieving genuine disagreement. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

When we move from influencing an individual to influencing a community or a body of people, the field of communication studies would say we transition from persuasion to rhetoric. In this transition, we often find ourselves in “rhetorical situations.” Tim and Rick unpack the rhetorical situation, including elements and affects of this communication event. They also discuss how skills in rhetoric can help you make the most of those moments when you have an opportunity to speak to an audience.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

In this episode, Austin Suter, executive director for United? We Pray, interviews Tim on his recently released book, End the Stalemate: Move Past Cancel Culture To Meaningful Conversations (released by Tyndale House on June 18, 2024), which Tim has co-authored with Sean McDowell. Tim speaks with Austin about the purposes in writing this book, which is less about learning how to win an argument and more about learning how to foster productive conversations and find common ground. They consider two fundamentally different views of communication, the emotional influence upon beliefs, dangers of straw man arguments, and how to remain hopeful given the current state of things. You can learn more about ways to find common ground at the End the Stalemate website.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Some stories in the Bible are hard to understand, let alone approve. For those who are questioning and finding it difficult to trust the God of the Bible and certain historical events as recorded in the Scriptures, it helps to hear stories from people who have worked through their own questions and doubts to arrive at healthy, more firmly held beliefs and convictions. On today's episode, History scholar Susan Lim (Ph.D.) speaks with Tim and Rick about her own journey of coming to love the Bible, and they speak about her book, Light of the World: How Knowing the History of the Bible Illuminates Our Faith.  Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Susan Lim (Ph.D.) is a history scholar and writer who decided to follow Jesus in her teenage years after having grown up in a Buddhist family. Susan joins today's episode to share her story from Buddha to Jesus, and it's a powerful story that has reverberated through her family. She also speaks with Tim and Rick on the similarities and differences between Buddhism and Christianity. They discuss what Buddhists get right that Christians can learn from, differing views on suffering, and what happened when Susan told her mom she had become a Christian. If you're interested in learning how to communicate with your Buddhist family and friends, you're sure to gain insight by listening to today's episode.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

What are communication spirals and how do they contribute to the argument culture? On today's episode, Tim and Rick discuss these patterns of negative communication and what can trigger them. They also draw from research in communication theory to suggest ways to de-escalate situations when we become perturbed, frustration boils, and we want to up the negative communication. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Earlier this year, a convictional firestorm ensued over advice Alistair Begg, a prominent North American pastor and radio host of Truth for Life, gave to a woman about attending her grandchild's gay wedding. Bob Lepine, the on-air announcer for Truth for Life, joins today's episode to speak with Tim and Rick about how this situation provides us with an opportunity to clarify our thinking around convictions and guidelines for faithful conduct. Bob provides a quick summary of what happened before they discuss some ideas to help foster biblically-based convictions around attending a gay wedding.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Can principles from law and a legal education help us in our day to day disagreements with colleagues, neighbors, family and friends? Our guest today, legal professor John Inazu, thinks so, and he speaks with Rick about his newly released book, Learning To Disagree: The Surprising Path to Navigating Differences with Empathy and Respect. They discuss the value of legal education for learning to get good at disagreement, and they also venture into the cultivation of empathy and fairness, how to think about occupying “middle ground,” and the need to be careful with our language when labeling people with whom we disagree.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Isaac Adams and Austin Suter are back on the podcast to recount a significant disagreement they experienced in their friendship. They go back into the disagreement with Tim and Rick and discuss issues of contempt, interpersonal differences, complexities and wounds, and spiritual battle. They caution against a bulldozer mentality and highlight how to press into hard conversations with gentleness in order to save and deepen a relationship rather than to abandon it.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Today's episode is a joint podcast with the Think Biblically podcast, and we have a great conversation with artist and Connecticut state representative Treneé McGee, who is a pro-life member of the Democratic Party. Rep. McGee has a knack for holding together responsibilities and convictions that don't often go together in our current political climate - artist/politician and pro-life/Democrat. She shares her backstory and talks through some of the challenges and opportunities of engaging the black community and women on pro-life related issues, including ideas for engaging state and local governments. This recording took place as part of a broader initiative at Biola's campus to honor National Sanctity of Human Life Day.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Isaac Adams and Austin Suter join today's episode to discuss the challenges and camaraderie they've experienced in their interracial friendship. They speak with Tim and Rick about the beginnings of their friendship and the importance of having an established relationship when the difficulties and disagreements hit, which inevitably occur. They discuss the relational elbow grease that is required for friendships to make it through the hard times, and some great insights are provided on how we can get better with disagreements in our own friendships. And Isaac wrote an article, “Before You Ask Your Black Friend About Race," which they reference in this episode. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

On this segment of Reports From The Front, two of Tim's students, Helena and Carson, who are studying Communications at Biola University, discuss their recent experience on Unify America. They seized the opportunity to speak with their political opposites on contested issues, including abortion, and they speak with Tim and Rick about what it was like. Over the course of the conversation they also consider why it would be good for churches to take part in these Unify America discussions. If this episode generates interest in Unify America, visit www.unifyamerica.org, and check out episode 90 where we speak with Abby Ferguson of Unify America.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Today on the podcast we have another segment of Reports From The Front, a positive story of someone who is doing things right. Tim and Rick speak with Abby Ferguson, Director of Partnerships with Unify America, on the challenges of communicating personal convictions to people we disagree with as well as progress Unify America is seeing with students who participate in the Unify Challenge College Bowl. They discuss how Unify America brings people together to replace political fighting with collaborative problem-solving, and Tim and Rick share examples of using some of the methods and practices in the classroom with their students.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Jim Davis, pastor and co-author of the recent book, The Great Dechurching: Who's Leaving, Why Are They Going, and What Will It Take to Bring Them Back, is back on the podcast to speak with Tim and Rick about some of the reasons why people are leaving churches. They talk about the role incivility, poor communication, “clustering,” and online habits play in the process of dechurching. They also reflect on the Apostle Paul's teaching on the body life of the Church and consider whether there are areas in contemporary church life and education that ought to be reconsidered.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Through our connections with CRU, a ministry that engages students and faculty on college campuses across the U.S., the Winsome Conviction Project received an invitation to provide training for a student group at UC Berkeley on how to have winsome conversations with people who hold opposing views. Tim and Rick reflect on this learning experience and the key questions and issues discussed among the group, including student's perceptions of Jesus, and they share ideas on how to show faith matters in an environment that is rife with disagreement.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

In 2 Corinthians 5:20, the Apostle Paul tells Christians they are “ambassadors for Christ.” Ambassadorship is part of our Christian identity. Paul wrote these words a long time ago, so what does it look like to be an ambassador today? On this episode, communication theorist Tim Downs returns to the podcast to discuss this question with Tim and Rick. They discuss the difference between citizenship and statecraft, the nature of statecraft, including its practices and temperament, and consider what ambassadorship would look like when discussions turn to contentious issues such as gender pronouns and transgenderism. They highlight the importance of what C.S. Lewis called “the sense of the center” and the need for more Christians to be shrewd, especially in a culture that prizes audacity.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Conflict in relationships is unavoidable. Healthy and successful relationships know how to counteract unhealthy communication styles and adopt alternative forms of discourse to work through the conflict. On this episode, Tim and Rick discuss John Gottman's famous metaphor for unhealthy communication styles that lead to failure in relationships, the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. They unpack each horseman - complaints vs criticism, contempt, defensiveness, and stonewalling, and they discuss diagnostic questions and ways to be diligent in addressing the horsemen when they crop up in our relationships and faith communities.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

American psychologist John Gottman has a knack for discerning healthy arguments from unhealthy ones, and he is known for identifying pattern markers that spell doom for a relationship. On this episode, Tim and Rick draw key insights from Gottman's body of research on disagreement in relationships and patterns of healthy communication and discuss application for civility and unity in disagreement, with special consideration for relationships in the Church.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Culture changes, and rapid shifts in culture generate challenges in communication. Although the truth of the Gospel is timeless, Christians should do their homework on changes in culture and figure out how to shape the Good News so that it is hearable. On today's episode, Tim and Rick are joined by Tim Down, author, cartoonist and communication theorist. They discuss both timeless and changing methods of communication, and Tim provides insights he has learned on the value of indirect communication from his work as a writer and cartoonist.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Jim Davis, pastor and co-author of the recent book, The Great Dechurching: Who's Leaving, Why Are They Going, and What Will It Take to Bring Them Back, comes on the podcast to talk about the current and fastest religious shift going on in America. Tim and Rick speak with Jim about a comprehensive study he help conduct looking at people who are leaving churches and the reasons why they are leaving. They discuss characteristics of people who are “dechurching,” including misconceptions on why people are leaving, as well as cultural factors and hinge points which have contributed to this phenomenon. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

We're revisiting a question we frequently get: “Why bother talking to somebody if you aren't going to change their mind?” Especially in the argument culture, conversing with someone who won't change their mind can seem pointless, an exercise in futility. While persuading someone to change their mind is a good and worthy goal in a conversation, and sometimes people's opinions need to be changed, it's also worth recognizing goods that often come about even if the other party isn't budging on their views. On today's episode, Tim and Rick spend time spotlighting signs of change that aren't immediately evident and points of unobvious agreement, and they also identify some of the benefits we often miss in our disagreements with others.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Tim Keller was a pastor in New York City who had enormous influence far beyond the city limits. He died of pancreatic cancer in May 2023. One of his many influences that is sure to endure will be on how engage public life with faithful Christian witness. On this episode, Tim and Rick share lessons they have learned from Tim Keller on representing the Christian faith and Christian convictions with remarkable civility, especially during difficult times and in hard places. They discuss Keller's habits of civility, his ability to disagree without being overly critical, and the effects of being confident in Christianity.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Why bother having a discussion if the other party isn't going to change their mind? Fair question, and it's one we get a lot. So, let's consider what makes the struggle of sticking with it worth it. On this episode, Tim and Rick discuss what to keep in mind when a disagreement appears pointless and going nowhere, and they highlight that appearances of futility oftentimes yield fruitful learning and a deeper relationship with the other party.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

It can get messy when you seek to have a faithful presence in your community and love your neighbors while holding to your theological convictions. Greg Stump, pastor at Redeemer Church in La Mirada, CA, is back on the podcast to talk through how he navigated having faithful presence when presented with a great ministry opportunity in his neighborhood. Greg, Tim and Rick then shift gears and have a theological disagreement on hell. Yes, you read that right - Tim and Rick have a disagreement with Greg on this episode and model how to disagree in a respectful and civil manner on a major Christian doctrine. They outline some of the differing views on hell and then highlight the importance of both the content and the relational aspects of disagreement. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

“Can we love our neighbors if we don't even know them?” This question helped to kickstart a summertime series on interfaith conversations at Redeemer Church in La Mirada, CA, to engage people and leaders of different faiths in the community. On this segment of Reports From The Front, Greg Stump, executive pastor at Redeemer Church discusses these Redeemer Conversations with Tim and Rick. Greg shares stories and insights on how they host these conversations. This episode highlights the importance of the virtue of intellectual curiosity, the rule of reciprocation, and practical ideas you can do to converse with others who hold different core beliefs and values.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

There are a handful of bedrock principles and practices that inform having a winsome conviction, and a big one is perspective-taking. Tim digs into his graduate education in communication studies and draws out the difference between listening to evaluate and listening to understand. Usually, we jump right to evaluation before seeking to understand, and this often results in communication gridlock. So, they explore practices for listening to understand, ways to embody perspective-taking and whether perspective-taking is biblically-based. Show notes and a full transcript are available.

Tim and Rick discuss a recent Barna study that highlights notable differences involving perceptions - how Christians perceive themselves and how Christians are perceived in culture. Rick also draws from his bag of metaphors and considers whether the Church is a thermometer or a thermostat in the argument culture, and they spend some time discussing aspirations to holiness and the charge in the old hymn, “Trust and Obey” in light of contemporary challenges.Show notes and a full transcript are available.

For another segment on Reports from The Front, Tim and Rick continue the discussion with pastor Dan Broyles on how social services and faith communities can work together to address social problems. Dan talks about the misconceptions social services and faith communities have of each other that oftentimes prevent collaboration, and they consider ways these groups might build trust and partner to help local families and communities.Show notes and a full transcript are available.