The Pursuit of Perfectness

This is it! The last episode. Ever. Did we, in the end, reach the pinnacle of perfection? Or did we realize perfection is not something that can be achieved? Something in between? Folks, did we ever nail down what this podcast is even about? The Pursuers (Dennis and Ellen, naturally) are joined by producer Richard […]

Leaving anything can be tough. The Pursuers (Ellen and Dennis) talk you through it.

If you're looking for the one where we talk about marriage proposals, you've come to the right place. Dear listener, would you make us the happiest podcast in the world and give this episode a listen?

There are so many messages making demands on our time. What do we do when we feel overwhelmed? And what are some strategies you can use to keep the flood of notifications, messages, alerts, and badges down to a manageable level? The Pursuers dig in and explore the topic, leaving the world a little better […]

What's your relationship with Social Media Scrolling (particularly video scrolling)? Do you feel your brain turning to mush? Do you think it’s added any good to your life? Do you set up time limits, and do you abide by them? The Pursuers (Ellen and Dennis, naturally) explore these questions and more, plus we share feedback from […]

The Pursuers (Ellen and Dennis, naturally) have a big conversation about small talk. And we hear from you, the listeners!

It’s the end of 2023 and the Season 5 wrap, aka “The Big Finale”! The Perfectionists™️ (Ellen and Dennis, naturally) take a look back at the year, the season, and the evolution of PoP Pod as a whole, and share their (our) thoughts about what they (we) learned and where they’re (we’re) going. So what […]

Do you struggle to keep your living space neat and clean? Welcome to the human race, bud! This week, the Perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis) share their thoughts on tidying and reveal some hidden, dark truths about their own struggles with tidiness. Also, PoP listeners share their own tips on how to keep your living space… […]

The title says it all, folks! This week, Ellen and Dennis rank all the time-based Batman villains and crown a winner. All this plus listener emails!If you like what you hear, please consider writing a review on Apple Podcasts. And tell your friends!

Do you consider yourself a failure whenever you order food delivery vs. cooking a meal? Oh, sorry, a projection right out of the gate! What we mean to ask is, what is your relationship like with cooking? Do you enjoy it? Do you feel like an artist making a beautiful piece of work? Do you […]

Perfect people read books, right? Man oh man, have the Perfectionists got some things to say about that. Ellen and Dennis talk about their experiences reading (and not reading) books, confess some embarrassing book-related secrets, and try to exorcise some of their guilt about not being perfect readers. All this and listener mail, too! If […]

Exercise. It’s tough to get out there and do it sometimes! And if you’re a perfectionist who tends to be hard on yourself, it’s even harder. What’s a perfectionist to do? Ellen and Dennis share their tips, strategies, and strained metaphors to help you get back on the hamster wheel. Plus, listener responses! Follow us […]

It had to happen! For 4 seasons The Perfectionists (Dennis and Ellen) have danced around it, referenced it, alluded to it, even performed it… but they’ve never actually devoted an entire episode to it. Until now! Saddle up, improv nerds, ‘cuz this episode we are talking all! Things! Improv! Ellen and Dennis sit down with […]

It’s the episode YOU demanded! Strap in folks, ’cause we’re talking about Wordle, the digital word game that’s taking America by storm! Fan favorite guest Rob Penty returns to gab about his essay on his complicated and sometimes heated relationship with our favorite daily word puzzle. The Perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis) commiserate… and maybe do […]

Is there anybody out there who regularly gets a perfect night’s sleep? Your hosts Ellen and Dennis sure don’t. This episode, we try to crack the code. We share our tips, tricks, and personal stories—plus we hear from our listeners about their experiences trying (and sometimes succeeding!) to get perfect sleep. Subscribe, rate us, write […]

It’s hard to make friends as an adult. Right? It’s not just us? Okay, cool. So what’s the secret? Join us this episode as we explore the perfect way to make friends as an adult. Plus, hear from our very insightful listeners who write in with their own advice for making new friends. Look out […]

How do you spend your birthday? Is it a day, a week, a month of celebrations? Do you have an annual tradition or ritual? Is it a time of somber reflection or a wild bacchanalia? Do you try to ignore it? We hear from listeners and share our own personal stories of perfect birthdays. If […]

Oh boy, do we get into it this episode! Rude strangers. They’re out there! And sometimes you can’t avoid them. What do you do? Ignore them? Lead with compassion? Do you get aggressive, or do you practice kindness and patience? Folks, we’ve tried all strategies and we’re here to share our real-world takeaways. Also, listeners […]

What is coolness? When do you got it? When do you not? From their rarefied position as two of the coolest average Joes in Podland, Ellen and Dennis peel back the mysteries of cool and reveal how anyone can achieve perfect coolness. Also, listeners of the PoD write in and relate the times in their […]

It’s time to check in with our New Year’s Resolutions. How are we doing? Perfect? Probably not, and that’s okay! In this episode, Ellen and Dennis dig in to the mentality of New Year’s self improvement pledges and talk about out how to make those life changes we all want to make—without beating ourselves up […]

Ever been embarrassed? Yeah, us too! This episode, your intrepid hosts Ellen and Dennis focus on listener input about how to handle embarrassing moments perfectly. It’s Season 4: Overthinking with Dennis and Ellen! This season will be cozier and more intimate, focusing on stories and opinions from you, the listeners. Each episode we’ll drill down […]

This week on the pod we talk “Perfect” Parenting with our friends Mike and Tayler Westervelt! The Westervelts invite us into their world over a glass of wine (because, according to them, it's been a DAY). They tell us about raising their two “adorable terrorists” and how they went from warming their daughter's bath towel to being satisfied with Goldfish crackers for dinner. We also discuss parenting culture on social media, learn about generational differences in parenting philosophies, and try to guess what Mike and Tayler's daughters will complain about in therapy when they're adults. Parents and nonparents alike will love this authentic, vulnerable, and fun conversation!

This week on the pod we've got legendary improv instructor and founder of the Magnet Theater Armando Diaz! Armando talks to us about his improv journey from Chicago to New York, where he became the Johnny Appleseed of New York improv theaters—from UCB in its earliest days, to the PIT, and finally to founding the Magnet (where your intrepid hosts Ellen and Dennis trained and flourished)! Sure, this is a must-listen for improv philosophy and improv history nerds, but we've also got a lot to chew on for everyone else—including ruminations on what it means to come into your own and become an adult. Folks, this is a good one. But don't take our word for it—listen now!

This week we have science writer Luis Enrique Sandoval Del Prado. Luis recounts the story of how a college drama department production of Beauty and the Beast helped him defeat the demon of negative self talk, and we talk more generally about creative expression and how it can help us manage stress. All that, PLUS Ellen and Dennis do a science quiz Luis wrote about plants! How did we do? How many will you get right? Stick around and find out! (Watch out for the tomato question—everybody's getting it wrong!)

Folks, this week we present our lovely chat with the wonderful Adam Wade. Adam is a 20-time Moth Story Slam winner (18 StorySLAM victories and 2 GrandSLAM Championships). He has toured across North America with The Moth Main Stage, and his stories have appeared on The Moth Radio Hour and The Moth Podcast. He's also a Storytelling Instructor at the Magnet Theater. We talk with Adam about the importance of making a connection with your audience--whether that's 100,000 people in an opera house or five friends at a party. We also discuss the efficacy of consistent meditation, learning to appreciate the people who love you, and the value of being yourself. This is a great one. Tell your friends.

This episode we break down our second season, guest by guest and episode by episode, and try to see if we managed to take any lessons away. Join us (Ellen and Dennis, natch) as we wax nostalgic about a truly fun and rewarding sophomore season. We made friends. We influenced people. We talked about tightening up the intro (and we never did). Dennis offered his half-baked theory about the two types of perfect. Ellen dropped some Aristotle, as she does. Personally? I think this is a great jumping on point for new listeners!

This week we talk to the wonderful Malcolm Pradia, M.S.W., L.I.C.S.W. Malcolm is a licensed independent clinical social worker offering outpatient psychotherapy in Western Massachusetts. He also serves as an adjunct faculty member and clinical supervisor to graduate social work students. Malcolm's clinical practice and teaching focuses on the importance of connection and the healing power of relationships. Malcolm provides us with some free therapy (score!), and helps us to name our behaviors without judging them. He also leads us through a discussion on embracing vulnerability in order to be our most authentic selves. Finally, he connects the systemic view of "perfectionism" to white supremacy, and how our rejection of this system can be an act of social justice. You can find Malcolm on Instagram @pradia2040 and @haveyoutalkedtomalcolm.

This week we talk to Ian Chillag, creator and host of the hilarious and beautiful podcast Everything is Alive. Ian talks with us about some of the defense mechanisms we use to protect ourselves and seeing the kindness behind harsh criticism (aka the vanity of niceness). He also gives us a peek into an audio project he's working on (a post-apocalyptic public radio pledge drive) and tells us his favorite kinds of podcasts to listen to and make. This was a fun one! Listen and subscribe to Everything is Alive on the Radiotopia network. You can find Ian on Instagram and Twitter @ianchillag.

Folks, we're not going to lie to you -- this week's guest is a GET. We welcome the wonderful Geri Cole to the PoP Pod studios! Geri is a four-time Emmy award winner (!!!), podcast host, and writer on the beloved children's series Sesame Street (um...ever heard of it??). We talk about writing for Cookie Monster vs. writing for Big Bird, the Dos and Don'ts of collaborating with your partner (see: The Perfect Couple's Guide), and we land on the perfect definition of perfectionism. You can hear Geri interviewing some of your favorite writers on OnWriting: A Podcast of the Writers Guild of America, East.

We're back, and boy have we got a corker for you this week! The Perfectionists sit down with Dennis's old mentor -- New York Times bestselling cartoonist and teacher at the School of Visual Arts, Nick Bertozzi! They talk about learning to stay true to yourself as a professional artist, unlearning the habit of people pleasing, projecting your dang voice in the classroom and on the stage, and most importantly assertiveness (when do you have it, when do you not, and how can you learn it?). Nick's upcoming graphic novel is called BOMB! (based on a YA novel by Steve Sheinkin) and it's about how the Soviets stole the secrets of the Manhattan Project to create their own atomic bomb. It'll be out in Winter of 2023 from Roaring Brook Press.

This week the Perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis) talk to stand-up comedian, filmmaker, producer, podcaster, actor, director, and New Yorker cartoonist Victor Varnado (who, he assures us, also wrote all the good parts of the bible). Our friend Victor is not only a multitalented, cross-medium, cross-platform artist and comedian, he's also a successful entrepreneur/businessman who empowers others to do the same. A big theme of our conversation was finding ways to work on things you're truly passionate about and inspired by. Victor is the host of at least two podcasts: Six Unseemly Questions and Arts Academy. His next podcast is called Wiki Listen. So after you wiki listen to this, go wiki listen to those!

Strap on your headphones and get ready for this "movie for your ears"—this week we've got Jonathan Mitchell, creator and producer of one of our favorite podcasts, The Truth, which just celebrated its tenth year. We get into Jonathan's history in public radio and the early days of podcasting, experimental electronic music, the process of breaking a Truth episode, and we even get into Jonathan's new hobby: DIY stop motion animation!

This week we welcome our BFF Jamie Rivera to the pod! Jamie's a performer and teacher at Magnet Theater, as well as an amateur toy photographer. What's amateur toy photography? Give this episode a listen and find out! We discuss the challenge of embracing hobbies deemed "juvenile," the perfect way to receive a compliment, and learning to love the burn of Scotch (and the burn of making art)! Check out Jamie's toy photography on Insta: @jamrivfigs, and his tweets @mr_jamriv. Interested in signing up for one of Jamie's improv classes? Or seeing him perform live? Check out magnettheater.com for both!

This week improviser, storyteller, and writer Rob Penty talks perfectionism and how it's really about minimizing risk. Then, Rob and the Perfectionists somehow do a "sober drunk history" on psychological experiments. If you're looking for a fun convo about hypochondria, OCD, Catholicism, and mindfulness meditation, you've come to the right place. Folks, if this one don't have it, you don't want it! You can find Rob performing monthly on The Little Big Show at the Magnet Theater. Read his writing at www.actuallyitsrobpentydotorg.com. Rob's ebook was designed by Carly Monardo and laid out by Nick Jaramillo.

We're back, baby!!! Join us as we kick off Season 2 with our friends Jessica and Richard, hosts of our sister podcast "Made Up Talk Show" (also on the Let's Hear It Network). We discuss the journey of starting a podcast from scratch and how to deal with the successes and failures along the way. We also talk ADHD and rejection-sensitive dysphoria. Let's get into it!

Hold on to your hats, folks—it's a crossover! This week, as a special BONUS, the PoP Pod crew is thrilled to present this episode of Made Up Talk Show, guest starring our very own Ellen Matthews and Dennis Pacheco! Made Up Talk Show is a comedy improv podcast on the Let's Hear It Network (the very network Pursuit of Perfectness is a part of!) in which guests bring in little known (i.e., completely fictional) podcasts. This week Ellen and Dennis bring in an obscure (again, completely made up) talk show about unconventional couples called How Did These Get Met? The Perfectionists had a blast improvising wild characters and situations with the hilarious Jessica Coyle and Richard Krysztoforski. We hope you enjoy it! And hey, check out Made Up Talk Show!

What was it all about? Dennis and Ellen take a fond look back at Season 1 episode by episode and prepare to come roaring back in just three little weeks for an even bigger Season 2. Join us, won't you?

This week the wonderful Amanda Rothman joins Ellen and Dennis to talk drama therapy, our need to take care of others (including, sometimes, our therapists), and how shame is a driving force behind perfectionism. They also go off on a tangent about The Matrix for ... way? ... too long? Is this officially a kung fu movie review podcast now? Maybe! You can find Amanda Rothman on Psychology Today. Hire her!

Actor, improviser, and founder of Rubbish Comedy Collective Xave Padin joins the Perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis) to talk about the gift (and curse) of word-perfect script memorization and what it took to create a new comedy collective founded on equity, representation, and integrity. All that, plus Xave gives Ellen and Dennis the gift of a brand new podcast intro. You can find out more about Xave and Rubbish Comedy Collective at rubbishcomedy.com.

The Perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis) get their very first live-in-the-studio guest, and what a get she is! Robyn Chapman is the editor of American Cult, a comics anthology about religious cults in America. She talks with Dennis and Ellen about the importance of self-compassion and how Kristin Neff's book Self-Compassion helped her get through a particularly hard time. Then they discuss cults throughout American history and determine once and for all whether or not improv counts as a cult. (The answer may surprise you!) Robyn runs a micropress called Paper Rocket. Find it online at paperrocketcomics.com.

Abby Russell is a content producer in the video game industry. The perfectionists (Ellen and Dennis, natch) have a delightful chat with Abby about Twitch streaming, comedy writing, and the high stakes (low stakes) world of improv. You can find Find Abby on Twitch, Twitter, and Instagram. Her handle is @ybbaaabby on all the things.

This week the Perfectionists (I've decided that's what Ellen and Dennis are called--it's canon now) welcome motion graphics designer and storyteller Jenny Bee to the studio to talk about mental health in art. We get into how school and work cultures wrongly glorify sacrificing our bodies to get ahead. Mentioned in this episode: Kelly McGonigal's TED Talk on stress: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/looking-up-with-dr-deepika-chopra/id1519100248?i=1000482856868

Health writer and wonderful human Hannah Chase gabs with the perfectionists (aka Ellen and Dennis) about being a perfect patient, advocating for yourself, and people pleasing--and we learn what a mustache does for your resting neutral face. Check out our Instagram for more fun with mustaches and wigs! @pursuitofperfectness You can find Hannah's writing at hannahchase.medium.com where she mostly writes about chronic illness.

Ellen and Dennis have their first guest, and it's--spoiler alert--Ellen's brother! Greg Matthews is a data scientist and visual artist, an improviser, a fledgling standup, and a father. He talks about which of these things fill him with anxiety and how he copes, plus he shares some cool data art. You can find Greg's art at statsinthewild.com and on our instagram @pursuitofperfectness.

In this inaugural episode, Ellen and Dennis introduce the concept of perfectionism and the specific shapes it tends to take in their lives and in the broader culture. They also talk about what the show is, what the show isn't, and what's coming up in the first season.

Hosts Ellen Matthews and Dennis Pacheco introduce The Pursuit of Perfectness, a podcast for perfectionists and people who are just a bit too hard on themselves. New episodes every Thursday.