Ungrafted

Today I speak with François de Nicolay from Domaine Chandon de Briailles in Savigny-les-Beaune, Burgundy. The 14 hectare biodynamic domaine started experimenting with spraying with skim milk instead of sulfur against powdery mildew in 2013. Powdery mildew (oidium in French) is a major fungal disease that affects vitis vinifera worldwide by decreasing grape quality and yield.  Francois talks about how milk works as a preventative and curative measure, as well its advantages and disadvantages.  @chandon.de.briailles

Brian McClintic is an ex Master Sommelier who worked at the Little Nell in Aspen and starred in the SOMM documentary films. Brian launched Viticole Wine in 2016, a wine club for which he collaborates with organic wine and cider producers around the world on custom bottlings.  Today I speak with Brian about fermented beverages of the future, including multiple fruit ferments and herbal infusions. We also chat about regenerative agriculture, racism, and how to make our lives and businesses more sustainable with glass bottle recycling, homesteading, and B Corp certification.Instagram @brianbmcclintic @viticolewine

Today I speak with Carlton McCoy MS from the Roots Fund and Demeine Estates about Black representation in the wine industry.     Carlton grew up in southeast Washington DC where wine was not part of his family or culture.  After winning the C-CAP (Careers Through Culinary Arts Program) cooking contest, he earned a full scholarship to the Culinary Institute of America in Hyde Park, NY, which kickstarted his wine career. Carlton became a Master Sommelier when he was only 28 years old, and was the second African American to earn the title. To date, there are only 3 Black Master Sommeliers out of 269. He was the Wine Director at The Little Nell in Aspen before becoming President and CEO of Heitz Cellar and Demeine Estates.Carlton and I discuss the situation of black wine professionals and the importance of mentorship. We also chat about the Roots Fund, which provides wine education, mentorship, and job opportunities for people of color.  To learn more about the Roots Fund founded by Carlton McCoy, Tahiirah Habibi, and Ikimi Dubose, please visit www.rootsfund.comInstagram: @carltonmccoy @rootsfund @sippingsocialite @thehuesociety 

Today I speak with Olivier Lamy of Domaine Hubert Lamy in Saint Aubin, Burgundy. Olivier is one of Burgundy's cult winemakers and a pioneer in the return to high density plantings.  Olivier discusses the history of plantations in Burgundy and Champagne, the practical choices that led to a lowering of the vine densities after phylloxera, and how his vines yield better quality grapes and perform better in warmer vintages.  Photo by: Gretchen Greer

I speak with Steve Matthiasson, vineyard consultant and owner of Matthiasson Vineyards in Napa, about water conservation in the vineyard.Steve gives an overview of Napa’s climate and how farming practices have changed over the last 20 years. He cautions that drought cycles are more extreme and that all indicators show that there will be less water in the future.  He discusses farming practices that help conserve water including planting cover crops, increasing soil organic matter, tilling differently, changing row orientations, and using different trellising systems and deeper rooted rootstocks.  It turns out that farming practices that conserve water are also good for the soil.Steve also talks about how certain wine styles require more irrigation, and that there is an aspect to sustainability on the consumer side as well. Photo Credit: Elaine Chukan Brown Instagram: matthiasson_wineWebsite: matthiasson.com

I speak with Christina Rasmussen and Daniela Pillhofer, cofounders of Little Wine about carbon neutral shipping.  Little Wine is an online wine content platform focused on organic plus and climate positive growers.  Little Wine also has an online bottle shop and wine club, with carbon neutral shipping.  Since their founding in April 2020, they have offset 100+ tonnes of CO2 to date.  According to German nonprofit Atmosfair, that’s around 100 round trip flights from London to New York City.  Christina and Daniela talk how they chose EcoCart and a water purification project in Cambodia for their carbon neutral shipping program, where they have prevented 25,000 trees from being chopped down to date.  We also talk about the future of wine distribution, and how they are inspired by fashion brand Organic Basics and Jancis Robinson.Instagram: @littlewine.co @winecarbonara @christinarasmussen_ Website: https://littlewine.co/

Today I interview Cristiana Tiberio from Agricola Tiberio in Abruzzo about biotypes.  Cristiana discusses the difference between biotypes and clones.  She also shares her journey identifying biotypes in her vineyard, including the Fonte Canale biotype of Trebbiano Abruzzese and 4 distinct biotypes of Montelpucinao d’Abruzzo which behave differently in the vines and the cellar.Instagram: @cristianatiberio

Today, I chat with Elaine Chukan Brown about Indigenous representation in the wine industry.  Elaine is an Alaskan Native, from the Inupiaq-Unangan-Sugpiaq tribes.   She started fishing commercially when she was nine years old and worked in various industries before starting her wine career.  Elaine is a wine educator and writer.  She is the American wine specialist at JancisRobinson.com and has contributed to the 4th edition of the Oxford Companion to Wine and the 8th edition of the World Atlas of Wine.  She was voted IWSC Wine Communicator of the Year in 2020.We discuss the history of Indigenous Americans and alcohol, misguided stereotypes, cultural appropriation, and what it means to be an Indigenous-owned winery.Photo by Elaine, with her grandmother, an Alaskan native from the Inupiaq-Yupik tribes.Instagram: @hawk_wakawaka

We conclude Regenuary with our interview with Mimi Casteel. Mimi is one of the preeminent voices for regenerative agriculture and no till, which she practices at Hope Well Vineyard in Eola-Amity Hills, Oregon.Mimi explains the advantages and disadvantages of tilling, one of which is the release of carbon into the atmosphere, contributing to climate change.  She addresses what she believes are necessary changes to farming subsidies and viticultural regulations if we are to achieve a sustainable future.  Instagram: @mimicasteelWebsite: hopewellwine.comPhoto by: Aubrie Legault

We continue our celebration of Regenuary with our interview with Nigel Greening, proprietor of Felton Road in Central Otago, New Zealand.  Nigel discusses the role of animals in the vines and the winery’s ecosystem. Nigel explains the difference between sheep (which are grazers) versus goats (which are browsers) in managing their wild rose population.  While some believe the best way to restore land is by removing grazing animals, Nigel believes the contrary--their highland cattle has helped restore soil fertility and encourage grass growth. He also shares their experience with helping raise New Zealand endangered native falcons and managing birds, rabbits and other creatures in the vines. 

Today, we celebrate #Regenuary with Jordan Lonborg, viticulturist of Tablas Creek.  Tablas Creek farms 120 acres of Rhone varieties in Paso Robles, California.  They were certified organic in 2003.  They have been farming biodynamically since 2010, and received their biodynamic certification in 2017.  They are the first Regenerative Organic Certified (ROC) winery by the Regenerative Organic Alliance, established in 2017.  The 3 main pillars of the ROC include soil health, animal welfare, and farmworker fairness.  ROC requires minimal irrigation with the idea that healthy soils need less water.Jordan and I talk about these 3 pillars, including regenerative farming, climate change, tilling, carbon sequestration, cover crops, mob grazing, bees, compost and biochar, and lastly, animal and worker welfare.Instagram: @tablascreekWebsite: tablascreek.com

Today, I speak with Zach Lawless, founder of Good Goods, a bottle return program where you bring back your empty wine bottles to participating wine stores in exchange for credits towards future wine purchases.  A bottle of wine’s biggest carbon footprint is the manufacturing of the glass bottle.  In the Good Goods program, the bottles are reused instead of recycled--recycling a bottle saves 7% in carbon emissions whereas reusing a bottle saves 52%.Zach and I talk about his market research with the glass milk bottle reuse programs, how the Crying Indian Campaign helped people recycle more, and how the current situation with recycling is not as good as it should be.Instagram: @_thegoodgoods.co_Website: thegoodgoods.co

Jasmin Swan of Katla Wines, is a new negociant from the “Alt Mosel", a term she coined for the new faces making wines with diverse approaches in the Mosel Valley.  Today, I interview Jas about her journey from sommelier in Iceland to winemaker in Germany.  Specifically, we chat about the use of PIWI’s as part of sustainable agriculture.  PIWIs are hybrids-varieties made by crossing 2 different Vitis species-- bred specifically for their fungus resistant capabilities.  This means that they require less spraying, therefore less costs, less tractor emissions, and less soil compaction.  Finally, Jas and I talk about the market reception of PIWIs and her future projects.Instagram: @terroirmerroir 

Today we will be broaching a subject that might make you uncomfortable--the relationship between alcohol and cancer. The reason for this discussion is personal; I was diagnosed with breast cancer this October. The causes of breast cancer are debated, but it is pretty clear that alcohol does not help. So how do I continue a life now devoted to wine? What is a suitable balance between my passion and its risks? The opinions of doctors vary considerably on the subject.  Today, I welcome Amy Christine, Master of Wine, owner of Holus Bolus winery, and sales representative in Los Angeles for Kermit Lynch. Amy wrote an insightful and personal article about her journey with breast cancer, which is included in the episode’s notes.  We are joined by Pat Farrell, Master of Wine and Doctor of Medicine. Our conversation will highlight some research on the causes of certain cancers, including alcohol.  Please be aware that what we discuss is for informational purposes only. Everyone is different, everyone’s family history is different, it is important that you consult your own doctor for medical advice.  Amy's article: https://www.imspeakingwine.com/writings/wineandcancerInstagram: @holusboluswine @acloveswineWebsite: https://www.thejoyfantastic.com/https://www.mastersofwine.org/patrick-farrell-mw

In an October 2020 New York Times article, Julia Moskin shared accounts of sexual harassment and assault of 21 women at the Court of Master Sommeliers Americas.  She wrote a follow up article, where the Chairman of the Court, Devon Broglie, stepped down amidst sexual misconduct allegations of his own.  Many sommeliers, wine professionals, and some Master Sommeliers were vocal about their outrage and much-needed changes.  Alpana Singh is one of them.  At 26, she became the youngest female and only South Asian to pass the rigorous Master Sommelier test.  Her impressive resume doesn’t end there.  She is the host of the Emmy-award winning TV Show “Check Please” on Chicago’s PBS station and the owner of 3 restaurants. Today, Alpana and I talk about her rocky 20+ year history with the Court, what changes are needed, why she gave up her Master Sommelier title, advice she has for younger wine professionals, and how this experience influenced her professionally and personally.Instagram: @alpanasinghWebsite: www.alpanasingh.com

We speak with grower Mathieu Lapierre from Domaine Marcel Lapierre about the use of microscopes to monitor yeasts, bacteria, and other microorganisms during vinification. He also discusses the different methods he uses when issues arise.  In the 1960s, Beaujolais négociant, researcher, and father of natural winemaking Jules Chauvet and Paul Bréchot used the microscope to monitor alcoholic fermentation in order to make wine more naturally and reduce the use of sulfur dioxide during vinficiation.  They passed on this knowledge to Rene Boisson, who is the microbiologist of a group of Beaujolais winemakers called the Gang of Four, which included Mathieu's father, Marcel. Instagram: domainelapierre

Today we speak to winemaker Diana Snowden Seysses about carbon capture and re-use at Domaine Dujac in Burgundy.Carbon is essential for life. There are pure forms of carbon such as diamonds and combined forms such as CO2, which makes up the majority of greenhouse gases —around 80%.   Although they are not the biggest contributors to greenhouse gases, emissions produced as a by-product of wine fermentation are 5 times more concentrated than those of cars or planes. Instead of letting this gas get released into the air, we have the option to trap it and turn it into something useful.Instagram @dianasnowsey @snowdenvineyards

We speak to Professor Benjamin Bois from the University of Burgundy about climate change and viticulture.In Burgundy, harvesting in August is the new normal. Indeed, there have been 7 vintages with August harvest dates since 2003.  However, some questions remain.  How will this warming trend continue?  What about rain, frost, hail, and diseases? And what about some of the proposed strategies to combat climate change such as using different varieties and rootstocks?    

We speak with Joel Burt, winemaker of Las Jaras Wines, a project he shares with comedian Eric Wareheim.  He discusses how winemakers deal with smoke taint, ash and soot.  He worked with interventionist methods in the past while he does minimal intervention winemaking now. We also talk about California's wildfires and how they affect vineyards and vineyard workers.This interview was recorded on October 2nd, 2020, the week of California’s Glass Fire.  https://lasjaraswines.com/

We speak to sommelier and importer Jane Lopes who, along with her husband,  Jonathan Ross have donated a Ruth Bader Ginsburg lot to the Vines 4 Votes online wine auction. This was in honor of the wine and cheese tasting they held for the late Supreme Court Justice’s 83rd birthday in March of 2016.  Jane shares how RBG inspires her to fight for justice and equality.Vines4Votes is an online wine auction from October 12 to 16, 2020.  All proceeds are donated to the ACLU of Texas and earmarked for their vote against voter suppression.https://www.legendaustralia.com/Instagram: @vines4votes

We speak to Zev Rovine about his "working contract" with his wineries. It will "address issues such as sexist behavior, racist behavior, labor rights, and responsible stewardship of the land we farm.”This was in response to one of Zev’s Italian producers, Valentina Passalacqua, who was under scrutiny when her father was placed under house arrest by the police. He owns a vegetable company and is accused of exploiting his migrant workers.Zev has since discontinued his relationship with Valentina.Zev Rovine started his natural wine company, Zev Rovine Selections in 2009.  They are based in Brooklyn, NY.https://zrswines.com/ 

Hi, my name is Icy Liu. Welcome to Ungrafted, a podcast about wine, humanity and the planet. I interview scientists, wine growers, importers and other folks about topics such as regenerative agriculture, carbon footprints, how we treat human beings and so much more.