Podcasts about it's christ

Come find out The Vaccine to Humanity’s Sin Virus. Pastor Jeffrey Quek preaches from John 1:1-4,14-18.

So it's finally almost here - have you had your tree up since June or are you a last-minute Mary, scraping in with all the prep as the turkey's defrosting and the eggnog is being served? Ordinary mums, Serena and Jo, talk honestly and authentically from their own experience, about how they try and look after themselves and sometimes get it wrong. Want to get in touch? We want to hear from you! Go to our Instagram page http://www.instagram.com/goandgetmorepodcast and leave a comment in the episode post tagging @jo.merrett or @serenanovelli You can also find us on Facebook. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/morewithserenaandjo/message

Introduction Christ is our new law Or do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law has dominion over a man as long as he lives? For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the…

Many movies use Christological imagery to cement the main character as the hero. We can certainly see Christ-like characters taking on a variety of forms. What can we learn about these characters, and what might we want to be careful of?

We must maintain the sanctity of the gospel. It's Christ plus nothing minus nothing.

Transcription (was completed by automated process. Please ignore any speech-to-text errors)   [00:00:04] All right. Well, hello, everyone. Thanks for joining us. My name is Penny and we're so glad that you're here with us today for this next session of Get Sellers Calling You. Beatty Carmichael is the CEO of Master Grabber, the creator of Agent Dominator and one of the top marketing experts in the real estate field. Beatty, I'm really excited about our call today. What do you have for us?   [00:00:27] Well, I'm excited, too. And for those listening, this a quick disclaimer and heads up, we do two types of calls. One focused on growing a real estate business. By the way, we'll be doing more on that in the commercial sector as well. So you have commercial business. We got some really cool things on that. But the other type of topic we cover is on a spiritual nature. We call it radical faith. And it's where we talk about Jesus talking about Jesus offense. You you don't want to listen. Then you are forewarned and you can turn off this episode and come back to the next one. So that's what we're going to be talking about.   [00:01:10] Awesome. I'm so excited.   [00:01:12] Yes. Well, I'm kind of excited about this on this call, too, because this is, again, one of those studies I've done that I thought I'm going down this path and I know the answer. And then I start to search scriptures and I go, Huh? That's not the answer I was really expecting.   [00:01:31] So kind of as a way of an intro, things are not always as they may seem. Okay, well, let me ask you a question. Jesus is up on the cross.   [00:01:44] You remember that. You remember Jesus Christ. Just making sure that Jesus is up on the cross. And the question is, did God forsake him while he was there?   [00:01:57] What do you think? No. No.   [00:02:04] Yes. Yes. Well, yes, because I know that God turned his back on the thing. He wasn't turning his back on Jesus.   [00:02:14] He was turning his back on the sin that was upon Jesus. And Jesus cried out, Why have you forsaken me?   [00:02:23] So I could be both of you. You may be right, because a lot of times there's multiple dimensions and God's kingdom.   [00:02:37] So it's not always linear and black and white. But for the sake of discussion, just kind of go down this path.   [00:02:45] If you had to choose one or the other. Most likely. Did God forsake Jesus while he was on the cross or did God not forsake him? He did not.   [00:02:59] Okay, give me your reasoning behind it. Do you have any scripture to back that up?   [00:03:06] I can't think of any off the top of my head. I'm basing it on just what I know to be the nature and character of God.   [00:03:14] Okay, great. Good God. Good woman. All right. So now Jesus does say, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? So does that mean that Jesus was wrong?   [00:03:30] No.   [00:03:32] Jesus was right.   [00:03:34] If that's what he was feeling in the moment. We know that Jesus was perfect. So even though sometimes our feelings can lie to us.   [00:03:46] That's a good question. That's a good question.   [00:03:50] It is because a lot of people say, well, God, obviously for Jesus on the cross because Jesus said he did. You actually have a more accurate answer in reasoning behind it than you may realize. So this is where things are not always as they seem. You have to really look deeper underneath the surface and try to understand what's going on. So let me get you real quickly to turn to Psalm 22.   [00:04:22] Let me give you a little background on Psalm 22. This is David in the Spirit, writing about the crucifixion. This is David watching. I'm assuming he's seen it take place or it's a vision, but he is see, he is writing down what the Lord has shown him. Just start reading the beginning of Psalm 22. And I just want to set the stage of what's going on here.   [00:04:54] My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Why are you so far from saving me so far from my cries of anguish? Oh, my God. Okay.   [00:05:06] So Jesus is quoting Psalm 22? Actually, no. David is writing what Jesus says. And so David is actually quoting Jesus as opposed to Jesus quoting David. Does that make sense? Mm hmm. So here we have Jesus saying, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? As you read through Song 22, you see all the things about the crucifixion. You see them. They take my clothes. They cast lot from my clothes. They split them among I am pierced my my ribs, stand out, all these things that happen in crucifixion. So we know very clearly this is the crucifixion. But down real quickly to verse 24 and tell me. But first, 24 says was 24.   [00:05:58] He has not despised or scorned the suffering of the afflicted one. He has not hidden his face from him, but has listened to his cry for help.   [00:06:09] So this is talking about God. And it says that he has not hidden his face from him. Jesus says, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me?   [00:06:19] And down here, it says that God never forsook and he never hid his face.   [00:06:27] What in the world could be going on in this interesting. Fascinating. Thanks are not always as they seem, are they?   [00:06:36] No, definitely not.   [00:06:37] You got to dig a little bit deeper, especially when you want to really understand what's really going on and how to apply it in your life, how to live in a way that the Lord called us to live and what actually is going on. You've got to dig deeper to tap into a session we just recently did on when bad things happen. Is it God's will? Got some interesting observations there. So let me share it, because this is not the focus of the call. But I thought this was an interesting way to start it. Let me share kind of what's going on.   [00:07:10] Have you ever heard the top concept that thin blinds you from the truth? Scene creates a veil over our eyes. And this is the whole idea of the wedding ceremony. The bride wears a veil and the bridegroom takes the veil off. And now she can see clearly as a as a foreshadowing of the spiritual. Ceremony with Jesus. And where the bride takes the veil of sin that blocks our vision. So when Jesus is on the cross, he became sin. And as soon as he became sin, a veil came over his eyes and he could no longer see the father. My God, my God, why do you forsaken me? David is saying, I'm right here. God never first took you sin blocks. Okay. So a lot of times we all believe what we've been told. But sometimes we don't really know why we believe it. Other times we believe a certain way because we read God's word and it says this and someone else reads that word and they get something totally different out of it. And the question is kind of flood what's right. So I want to move into the topic now because it's a bigger topic. Here's a question.   [00:08:49] Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven? In other words, once you've accepted Christ, can you lose that salvation?   [00:09:00] Oh, gosh, that's one of those questions that just gets so there's so much controversy.   [00:09:09] Let's go. Let's go back. Let's go back to the root of the question. Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven?   [00:09:16] Yes.   [00:09:18] Why do you believe that?   [00:09:23] Because the Bible says.   [00:09:28] It says, if you believe in the Lord Jesus, he will be saved.   [00:09:34] Is that accepting or believing or are those the same?   [00:09:39] Well, maybe that's the translation I learned.   [00:09:43] So let me let me ask you. Are you absolutely positive? That everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven.   [00:09:56] I have to be honest, I'm not actually positive now that we're doing this call and I'll catch you on a number of things in the past, you're starting to think Beatty may know something. I don't. I'm not going to be quite so positive. Right. Right. Okay. Well, good job. Don't be positive. Okay. Okay.   [00:10:19] So the topic of this series that we're going to do, and it's going to be multi part because it's really threw out all scripture, especially New Testament. And that is the question does do all who accept Christ go to heaven?   [00:10:35] This call is going to be part number one. We're going to lay the foundation and then we're going to start to dissect it. And this isn't for just simply an intellectual pursuit of just saying, here's what scripture say. But really to try to understand. What is God calling us to do and why? And as I've gone through this myself, here's the net result. I've changed my perspective of what's most important. It's really amazing. Okay, just a quick disclaimer. I don't have all the answers. This is one of those topics that you mentioned. Everyone has all kinds of different opinions. Scripture is constantly, consistently true is the question of what are we and how we interpreting and why. So we don't want to share is is what I believe the Lord is directing me in understanding. So I want to talk about some of the controversial versus real quickly. So this kind of tees up why this is such a difficult topic. So let's go to Matthew ten, verse 22.   [00:11:39] Okay. All right.   [00:11:43] By the way, this is this is all these things we're going to go through for passages. And they're all Jesus talking. So go ahead, Matthew, 10 22.   [00:11:52] You will be hated by everyone because of all. But the one who stands firm to the end will be saved, stands firm to the end.   [00:12:02] Okay, that's interesting. Let's use also ESV translation on these. Let's now go to Matthew 24 and we're going to read verses 10 and 13, 10 and 13.   [00:12:21] 24, verse 10 and 13 percent says and then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And then verse 13 says, But the one who endures to the end will be saved.   [00:12:37] And they translates that first verse. And then many will fall away from the face. Okay, here we see. But the one who endures to the end will be saved. Let's now go to mark 13.   [00:12:53] Martin, 13 versus 12 and 13. Let's see what that says.   [00:12:58] All right. Verse twelve. And brother will deliver brother over to death. And the father, his child and the children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.   [00:13:17] We see that again. The one who endures to the end. Makes you wonder, well, does that mean not all people who accept Christ? Go to heaven because why would Jesus keep talking about enduring to the end? Let's look at one more loop, 21, 17 through 19.   [00:13:42] All right, 17 to 19 says you will be hated by all for my name's sake, but not a hair of your head will perish by your endurance. You will gain your lives.   [00:13:56] There we have it again. Here's the question. When Jesus teaches that you must endure to the end to be saved. Does that mean that some people don't endure to the end?   [00:14:09] Yes, I could see how some people probably give up or decide that I'm done with this. Okay, okay.   [00:14:17] But the fact that Jesus is teaching that you had to endure to the end indicates that there are obviously those who don't endure to the end. Does that make sense? Yes. By the way, here's something else interesting. This was so important, apparently, that God put it in. The scriptures four separate times just by Jesus. We're going to say that this concept is pervasive.   [00:14:43] But four separate times by Jesus.   [00:14:45] If people don't endure to the end, then does that mean that they don't go to heaven?   [00:14:53] I'd like to investigate that a little further.   [00:14:56] Okay, so let me ask this question. Does being Sayed.   [00:15:00] Does that. Men going to heaven. Do you think?   [00:15:05] According to what we just read. No.   [00:15:09] Okay, can you give me some scripture to back up? We're saved in heaven. Don't necessarily go together.   [00:15:18] Well, the ones we just read, Jesus was speaking in reference to being saved and said those who Indore to the end. So three times we read that right.   [00:15:30] So those who who endure to the end will be saved. Can we probably transliterate that? Those who endured to the end will make it to heaven. Probably is just kind of lame, the fact that Jesus is talking about being saved. Going to what we talk about going to heaven. Probably one in the same with that. Would you agree with that?   [00:15:52] Yes, I would.   [00:15:54] Okay. So if Jesus is saying. Or so is Jesus saying that whether or not they endure determines whether or not they are saved?   [00:16:11] That's a very deep thought. I think so. I think that would go hand in hand. Okay, one influences the other.   [00:16:24] Right. So what we're going to find out as we go through it, it's either a determining factor or an indicative factor. It's either the evidence had been saved or they determine that they are to be saved. So we're going to see what the scripture talks about a little bit more. So when Jesus came to Earth, here's another question. What was the main message that he preached? In other words, why did he come to Earth?   [00:16:50] He preached the kingdom of heaven is near. He preached to be safe so that you could go to heaven. That was his message, to believe him to get right there.   [00:17:02] So true. So he never really preaches forgiveness.   [00:17:07] Have you ever noticed that he didn't have to come to Earth for forgiveness because God gave people all through the Old Testament.   [00:17:16] He didn't come to Earth specifically for salvation. You said that on. He came to preach the kingdom of heaven. In fact, this is his common theme. If you can finish the sentence, repent for the kingdom of heaven is near or near here at hand. It's right here in our midst. Okay, so we had this thing called repentance and forgiveness, salvation going to have been saved. All these things are part of the kingdom of God. But what Jesus came to do was much more holistic than just being saved or forgiven. And I think that if we start to then understand what the kingdom of God really means. And understand more about that make more sense. Why? What Jesus talking about enduring to the end really means if we want to understand what Jesus means, the one who endures to the end. We have to go back to his core message that he's always teaching repent for the kingdom of God is at hand. And if we understand the kingdom of God, then we can then figure out what he really means about enduring to the end. Does that hurt? So with that then the question is. When Jesus taught on the kingdom of God, because that's most of what he taught on what was his primary method of teaching about the kingdom of God.   [00:18:52] Do you recall the parable parables? Good job. Okay. So if we want to understand the kingdom of God, let's look at some of the parables, because that's what he teaches through which other parables is the most important in understanding.   [00:19:11] All of the parables. Do you recall which one?   [00:19:15] Oh, gosh. He had so many. The one that's popping out is the seed and the sower. But that might not be the one you're thinking of.   [00:19:28] Did many good jobs go to Mark for verse 13? This is a commentary of Jesus on the parable of the seed in the summer.   [00:19:41] Okay.   [00:19:42] Four, verse 13. And he said to them, do you not understand this parable? How then will you understand all the parables?   [00:19:53] So here's something here's something real interesting. The parable of the seat in the Sower, I believe I'm correct, is the only parable in all three of the synoptic gospels. That's the same. And it's the only one where Jesus gives a parable and gives the interpretation. In fact, I think it's the only one that he gives the interpretation on. And he says here that if you don't understand this parable, you cannot understand any of the parables because this parable unlocks all the other parable. So this is a pretty important message on understanding the kingdom of God. Makes sense. Yes. Okay, so now let's read into this. Let's go read the parable of the Sower, and we're going to do this in Matthew. Okay. Okay. So, Matthew, 13 versus three through eight.   [00:20:53] All right. And he told them many things in parables saying a sower went out to sow as he sowed some seeds, fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground where they did not have much soil. And immediately they sprang up since they had no depth of soil. But when the sun rose, they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain. Some 100 fold. Some 60, some 30. He who has ears let them hear.   [00:21:37] Very good. So now we have the soil where the seed goes out. And now we're going to replay what Jesus says this means. That's going to be verses 18 through 23.   [00:21:53] Here, then, the parable of the sower, when anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it. The evil one comes and snatches away what has been found in his heart. This is what was sown along the path. As for what was shown on rocky ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately received it with joy. Yet he has no root in himself, but endures for a while. And when tribulation or persecutions persecution arises on account of the word immediately, he falls away. As for what was sown amongst thorns, this is the one who hears the word. But the cares of the world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word. And it proves unfruitful. As for what was sown on good soil, this is the one who hears the word and understands that he indeed bears fruit and yields in one case a hundredfold and another 60 in another 30.   [00:22:51] All right, great. So now we're going back to the Requestion. Does everyone who accept Christ go to heaven? We say that Jesus says only the one who endures to the end will be saved.   [00:23:05] We now go into this parable. He starts to describe it. So now let's get an understanding of this parable as we go in. So there are several parts about this parable that we need to break down first just to really kind of understand a little bit more. The first one is the seed. Okay, this is the seed and the seed is a key part. Here's the question. What is the seed?   [00:23:33] The word.   [00:23:34] Okay, so, Jesus, the seed is the word, the word of the kingdom. And what is the word Jesus?   [00:23:45] Yeah. Okay, John, one one in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God.   [00:23:52] So the seed is Jesus. Right. Okay. Very interesting. So then we have the next. Let's look at the four soils. Okay. What did the soils represent?   [00:24:07] The beginning part where he described it, yes.   [00:24:12] When he's throwing when you're trying to sort out what do the soils represent, there are four types of soil. So what what did they representative of?   [00:24:21] A person's heart, a person's heart. Okay, so four types of heart, four types of people, right. What separates one heart from another? What separates one group of people versus the other group of people?   [00:24:39] The state or the beating of their heart? The state of their heart.   [00:24:45] But less and less narrowed a little bit more. Okay. Okay. I'd like to suggest the stewardship of the seed, which is it represents, to say, the heart, but the state of heart is exemplified and evidenced by how its stewards see. Does that make sense? Okay, so what differentiates one soil from another, one type of person from another is stewardship of the seed. And then if the seed is Jesus and the soil represents the different types of people. What does that mean, that all people receive Jesus?   [00:25:27] No.   [00:25:33] Goes out, the soda goes out and sows the seed. Jesus. Yes. And does the same get sewn on all four soils?   [00:25:47] Yes.   [00:25:49] All four soils receive the seed sown.   [00:25:55] Correct.   [00:25:56] Okay.   [00:25:58] So let me ask the question again. If they did this soil, it's not a trick question. It's a question that.   [00:26:06] We usually don't consider because it doesn't make sense based on what we've been taught. But we have to do is we have to dig deeper than what we've been taught and see what the word says. Because what we've been taught may not be. What the world says, it may be something slightly different. So here's the question at the seat is Jesus and the soul represents people then does that mean that all people receive Jesus? Yes, it does. In fact, Romans, what does it Romans one tells us that everyone has the heart of the law of the Lord written on their hearts already. They see God's law in the skies and in everything. So everyone has received the truth. Jesus says the high priest prayer when he's praying to the Lord of the tables. He says, Die word is truth. God's word is truth. Jesus is the word. Jesus is the seed. And we see truth everywhere in nature that that proclaims God. So everyone has received that seed. But that doesn't mean they've done anything with it. That's the key. So now we've got the seed. We've got the soils. Now we have. Fruit, fruit is really the key message that Jesus is teaching about. And he basically basically says that here's my way of just kind of transliterating a little bit. Only those who produce fruit or are going to be.   [00:27:46] Right, that's basically what we can start to see in his message, and I want to unpack that with fruit.   [00:27:55] Fruit is the key to this parable. Fruit is only found in one soil. Soil is that good soil, the good soil. Okay, great.   [00:28:05] And I want it just for sake of purpose. I'm going to label these soils as soil one, two, three and four soil. One is the path to the rocky soil soil. Three is the thorns and soil for the good soil. And then that way we can just kind of keep keep it simple.   [00:28:23] Okay, so what we had to do is understand what is fruit. So if I were to ask you, what is fruit? This is the kid. This is the key to understanding everything is this fruit? What is it?   [00:28:40] Fruit is what is produced from the seed.   [00:28:47] Very good.   [00:28:49] But what is it that's the prize? What can we call it the result? The seed managed and held and cared for properly.   [00:29:08] All right. All right. We're gonna get there. Let me back up and just kind of bring us into this, because I think this is kind of fun. So seed one of the times another sessions. I was talking about the Bible has been written by one author. Would you agree with that? Yes. Okay. Now, that author inspired many men to actually pen that one author's thoughts, but it's all one author, which is God himself. Exactly. So anytime you have a book, you have characters in the book and those characters keep coming up and they always are the characters that they were.   [00:29:54] In other words, if I'm reading a book and let's say, say, a Tom Clancy novel, I used to read those years back and he introduces a guy named Gosh, I forget the guy, but he introduces a couple of guys up front in the novel.   [00:30:13] Then throughout the novel, every time he calls that person up by name. John did this or John did that.   [00:30:19] It's always that person that he introduced and described at the beginning. Does that make sense? Yes. So the character goes throughout. So we see that same thing in the scriptures.   [00:30:31] We see it with fig trees, olive trees. We see it with light, darkness. We see it with soils. We see it with seed. We see all kinds of thing. So the question is, what does seed represent? What is the character of seed? I like to show you something because this is really cool.   [00:30:46] Where does God first introduce his character seed?   [00:30:54] In the Garden of Eden, if I'm not mistaken, a little bit before.   [00:31:00] Oh, you'll have to tell me.   [00:31:05] Let's go to Genesis 111.   [00:31:10] During creation, now, Save was obviously present in the Garden of Eden, but he introduces what it is.   [00:31:19] During creation, Genesis one 11 with 11 and God said, let the earth sprout vegetation plants yielding seeds and fruit trees bearing fruit and which is their seed, each according to its own kind on the earth.   [00:31:36] And it was so seed reproduces after its own time. We used today's technology words that carries all the DNA to reproduce an exact replica of whatever it is, whatever it came from. Does that make sense? Yeah. And then where is seed formed?   [00:32:03] Well. See, far and within the fruit.   [00:32:08] The fruit is the womb of the seed. Interesting, isn't it?   [00:32:15] I mean, we know that it is insane to think of it that way.   [00:32:18] Okay, so this makes sense. A seed is planted. It has to die. Once it dies. It's burst again. Into a new plant after its own kind, as that plant matures, it produces fruit. And inside, the fruit seed is created so that the plant through the fruit can reproduce itself again. Does that. Soun.   [00:33:00] Similar to something else that we would think about in Christian terms. And that's just what Jesus did. He came as a seed of God. Right. The exact replica. He dies and he's planted into the ground, right into the temple. And then when he dies, he becomes born again into a exact replica. And he produces through. Okay. So we see this this pattern of the seed. And the fruit is the womb that causes that seed to produce fruit is in the process of where seed has been reproduced. Making sense? Yes. Okay, so then why does the characteristic of the seed. What is the characteristic of the fruit? It's kind of an aside, but it kind of ties into this. If I were to say, what is the fruit of? Can you finish that sentence?   [00:34:13] What's it called fruit of? Prudent spirit.   [00:34:19] So let's look at that real quick. This is Galatians five. 22, 23. But I want you to do it in The Passion translation on this one, because I think this song articulates what it's really saying.   [00:34:33] And you said the Galicians five, five, 22 and 23.   [00:34:50] All right, here we go. 22 and 23 says the fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you is Divine Love in all its varied expressions.   [00:35:04] Such a perfect moment.   [00:35:07] A lot of times people say the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace.   [00:35:12] But I think what the term love is, the fruit of the spirit is singular, not plural. There's not multiple fruits. There's one. That's why I love this translation that the fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you. Is Divine Love in all its varied expressions. So now we're talking about love. Where else do you recall what the Bible says about love? We're talking about. This is Paul talking about different things and he said about love.   [00:35:43] First Corinthians 13, I think. Yeah. The love. We call it the love chapter in our house.   [00:35:49] Okay, good. All right. And it says that above all.   [00:35:54] First, love is, love is, and in fact, there's here's something else, it says Faith, hope and love abide. But the greatest of these is love. What are you saying? There is that of everything he's been talking about, faith, hope and love. By that means that they are eternal.   [00:36:17] They never go away. Gifts go away. But faith, hope and love abide. But of all of those, the greatest of them is love. This is what Jimmy. This is who God is, representative. Mostly by the character. Bye bye, love. That's what this is talking about. The fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you is Divine Love in all its varied expressions. Okay, so now I'll let you finish the passage from there. It's now going to define and describe what that Divine Love, how that Divine Love manifests itself.   [00:36:55] Okay, joy that overflows peace, that some patience that endures kindness and action, a life full of virtue, faith that prevails, gentleness of heart and strength of spirit never set the law above these qualities. They are meant to be limitless.   [00:37:18] All right. So now let's go back. See this Jesus? That's what Jesus says is the word of God, right in the. Fruit is where the seed is formed. And that means really that seed, the fruit, is Jesus being formed in you and producing through you. Does that make sense? Yes. OK. So that's really what I believe the fruit is talking about, is that Jesus has been formed in you. So here's a question. If Jesus is formed in you, would you act like Jesus? We should be informed and you are going to carry the characteristics and the more he's formed and living through, you carry those characteristics. What are some of the things that Jesus did that maybe if he was formed in you, you would likely do to.   [00:38:14] Oh, gosh. I mean, just naming things he did heal the sick, raise the dead. He helped all those that were oppressed. He lost. I mean, he loved first. And everything else was just an overflow of the love.   [00:38:33] He went preaching the message, the kingdom of God. Okay. Yeah. All this.   [00:38:38] All these things. Peace, patience, kindness.   [00:38:43] So that is evidence of the fruit. The fruit is Jesus being formed. But evidence of the fruit being formed into you is a manifestation of all these things that Jesus did. Bring a little bit more clarity, right? OK. So here's the big question. If Jesus has never formed Inju, are you born again and go to heaven?   [00:39:12] Tom.   [00:39:15] According to all this. No.   [00:39:21] It's not us that are righteous. It's Jesus, in a sense, righteous, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay.   [00:39:29] Romans side, I think, says that the righteous fulfillment of the law, the righteous requirement of the law has been fulfilled. And you.   [00:39:36] And then we can connect the dots because Christ is in you.   [00:39:41] Who would it be safe to say that only those in soil number four. Hey, bear fruit. Which has been formed in them are the ones who are truly born again, are saved and go to heaven. Does that make sense, do you say? Yes. So now let's look at the four soils. Real quick. No one is the past. This is verse four, so read that again. Let's talk about that.   [00:40:16] And that was go back to that book when we were in Matthew 20.   [00:40:26] Excuse me, Matthew, 13, 13.   [00:40:33] I'm going to switch translations. I'll go back to that.   [00:40:35] I actually actually I got. I think this is versus it's not verse four that I want you to read is going to be verse probably 18 or 19.   [00:40:45] Let me go back. Yes.   [00:40:47] Okay. 18 and 19. Okay. So 19, when anyone hears the word of the kingdom does not understand it. The evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is what was sown along the path.   [00:41:02] I know that.   [00:41:03] So that's the one that's sown along the path.   [00:41:06] Okay, let's see.   [00:41:13] So that person has heard the word of the kingdom. And they do not understand it.   [00:41:18] Right. So how did they steward the seed? Or did they stay where the stayed at all?   [00:41:26] They didn't. They didn't do it because it just says that they did not understand it. And then the evil one came and snatched it away. So that leads me to believe they didn't pursue understanding what had been spoken to them.   [00:41:40] Got you. So no wonder the path does not seem see deceit at all. It's rejected. Correct. Since it doesn't stay where the seed. Does the soil accept the seed? So there are two things you've got to accept it and you, Stuart. So did the soil ever accept the seed?   [00:42:07] No.   [00:42:08] No. Since the seed represents Christ, does that mean that this person did not accept Christ? That's correct. And is this person born again? No. No. And how do we know that?   [00:42:26] Because it says.   [00:42:29] The evil one snatched it away. What was sewn in their heart? So Jesus was taken out from their heart. They can't be born again.   [00:42:38] That's right. Okay, perfect. So now we have soul. No one does not accept the seed, does not therefore steward the seed. The say never forms itself in them through fruit. They are not born again. They don't go to heaven. Okay, so now let's look at soil number two, the rocky ground. This is going to be versus 20 through 21.   [00:43:02] As for what was sown on Iraqi ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately received it with joy. Yet he has no root in himself but indoors for a while. And when tribulation or persecution persecution arises on account of the word, he immediately falls away.   [00:43:24] So does the soil accept the seed?   [00:43:32] A little bit, right? It tries to, but actually I think it's a little bit a little bit deeper. Let's go back to it and look and says yet he has no root in himself. Do you see that? If there is no.   [00:43:50] Yes, go ahead.   [00:43:51] If there's if there's no route, then did the soil ever accept it?   [00:43:58] Go in the soil, right?   [00:44:00] Yes. One head down.   [00:44:04] Have you ever seen trees or plants grow on the side of a cliff where it's just wrong? Yes. Yes. Is there any. There's no soil, but they can still grow by putting roots down a little bit around the rocks. Does that make sense? So the soil does accept the seed. And we know that because there's no root and with no root, there's no acceptance. How does the soil steward the seed?   [00:44:36] Well, it says as soon as he heard it, he received it with joy. Right. But because there's no route. There's nothing to anchor it when the hard things come, he falls away. He gives up.   [00:44:52] Notice it says that he has no root in himself, but endures for a while. What are those passages that Jesus says?   [00:45:00] What does it say about endurance to endure until the end?   [00:45:05] So this guy only endures for a while, but not to the end.   [00:45:09] Okay. So the soil doesn't accept the seed. The soil stewards, the seed only poorly. It's enough that it grew up, got excited. But it did not endure to the end. Here's the question. Is this person born again?   [00:45:30] Now, how do we know that?   [00:45:35] Well, because they had no route. And because they chose to give up almost OK.   [00:45:42] So those are part of it. But the ultimate technical answers because there's no fruit.   [00:45:50] Because fruit is where Christ is formed in you. And there's no fruit. Therefore, there is no Christ formed in you. And only of Christ is formed. And you are truly born again. Makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. So no one. Not a Christian. So, number two, they receive it with joy. A lot of people you share the gospel. They immediately pray the center's prayer type of thing. And you may see some life change. They're all excited, but they don't endure.   [00:46:21] That wasn't a what we would call in our Christian, these terms a true salvation. Christ was never formed in them. Now let's look at soil number three. This is the one with the thorns. And this is going to be verse 22.   [00:46:35] As for what was done along with thorns, this is the one who hears the word. But the cares of the world and deceitfulness of riches choke the word. And it proved unfruitful.   [00:46:49] Turn also real quick, I want to show you one other passage on this that it gives a little bit more information. Luke Eighty-seven. It's the same Jesus describing this, but he gives Luke eight, seven, gives one more piece of information. Let's see if you can find that piece of information.   [00:47:06] And some fell among thorns and the thorns grew up with it and choked it. So this one. Thorns are growing up with the.   [00:47:17] Which means the seed is growing. Right. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Okay. So now let's ask our questions, our diagnostic questions on this. Does the soil accept the seed?   [00:47:30] Yes. Yes.   [00:47:32] Okay. Now, remember, the soil represents people, represents your heart. The seed represents Jesus. So this soil accepts Jesus.   [00:47:44] Yes.   [00:47:45] Follow me. Okay. Okay, so the soil accepts Jesus because the soil accepts the seed.   [00:47:56] How does the soil steward the seed? How well is that seed stewarded? Well, it does it does the soil steward the seat at all. Let's start with their.   [00:48:15] No.   [00:48:17] Maybe a little bit in the beginning, because it says when the cares of the world and deceitfulness come and you choke it.   [00:48:26] Okay, okay. Go back to Luke eight, seven.   [00:48:32] And some fell among thorns and the thorns grew up with it. Grew up with a plant that the seed produced but choked it. So this means that. They grew up means that it actually grew into a plant, which means that the soil did steward the seed enough to produce a plant. Okay, so here soil number three, except the seed. If we put this in human terms, someone accepts Jesus. It's two words.   [00:49:03] The seed enough that it forms a plant. And that plan looks exactly like the replica of what the seed was reproducing, because it is. But is this person born again?   [00:49:22] No, because they do not endure to the end almost.   [00:49:27] Not that they don't endure it to the end. There's the key element. What's the defining moment of whether someone's born again?   [00:49:37] They don't produce fruit.   [00:49:38] It's Christ in you. Right. And the only way to have Christ in you that you have fruit. Where the seed is produced.   [00:49:51] You say that it was unfruitful.   [00:49:53] That's right. There was no fruit. And now here's a person who accepts Christ. Who manifest Christian type of behavior? Because the fruit grows up. But produces no fruit, which is evidence that Christ was never formed in them.   [00:50:17] They did not endure to the end. You had to endure longer for the verb to be formed, that may be one way to describe it. I don't think that's really an accurate statement. But there's something else here. Why was fruit never produced?   [00:50:32] Because of the sarin.   [00:50:35] What are the odds? Come check it out. What do Soren's come from?   [00:50:42] We the ground.   [00:50:48] All blind reproduces after its own time.   [00:50:51] What is blind going? I'll see. There you go. Okay.   [00:50:58] There you go. So here here we have a number three person receives and accepts the seed of the word. But they're also accepting all kinds of other seed and they stoo or the other seed more diligently than they steward the Christ seed.   [00:51:19] And by stewarding other seeds, Jesus calls them the cares of the world. There's this staple ness of riches by stewarding those seeds more. This all number three person allows that stewardship to choke out the Christ. That's pretty interesting. Yeah, that's really good. So is it possible to accept Christ? Had the appearance of growing as a Christian. And yet not actually being born again, having Christ formed into you and ultimately going to heaven. Yes, it is. And this is startling and this interesting.   [00:52:05] Oh, it's going to get a whole lot better. This is setting the stage.   [00:52:12] Now, let's go to soil number four. This is the good soil. This is verse 23.   [00:52:19] As for what was done on good soil, this is the one who hears the word and understands that he indeed bears fruit and yields in one case a hundredfold and another 60 in another 30.   [00:52:36] All right, great. So does the soil accept the seed? How is the seed stewarded? Very well, very well. Is this person first off, what happens with the sea?   [00:52:55] Cared for. It's your word. It's helped nurture so that it can grow.   [00:53:02] All right. Is this person born again? Yes. And how do we know? Because they bear fruit. Okay. In terms of fruit. Some hundred, some 60, some 30. Notice also. It's not the soil that bears fruit. What bears fruit? The seed is the seed that bears the fruit, not the soil. The soil is merely the womb in which the fruit is produced that produces more seed. The seed producing the fruit. In other words, it's not us, it's the Lord.   [00:53:52] Now, we've already been to always been taught. It's Christ living through us. There's nothing we can do of our own. The fruit of the spirit is not what we do. It's Christ in us. This is what's going on. It's the sea that reproduces the fruit.   [00:54:06] It's not the soil. We're just the container.   [00:54:12] So now as we start to wrap up, I wanted to talk on two things. The first one is Convert's versus Disciple's, because I think this is what is this is kind of where where a lot of this starts to focus in on. I want to set the definition first off, let me ask you if I were to ask you to define the difference between a convert and a disciple, what would you tell me?   [00:54:40] A disciple to me is one who has a desire and longing for teaching.   [00:54:46] And then.   [00:54:48] Finding someone else and seeing that same quality in someone else.   [00:54:53] Kind of like a leader, a good leader is going to look for someone who also wants to be a leader. And they're going to raise up that leader.   [00:55:01] Right. Let me.   [00:55:08] Give a simple definition that that I like to include a convert is going to be someone who accepts Christ right.   [00:55:21] But a disciple is going to be someone who follows Christ. And I think there's a difference.   [00:55:29] Does that make sense? Absolutely. I was watching this great documentary on the underground Iranian church and they had people from the church talking and everything and sharing, and it was really cool. But one of the guys made a really interesting comment, Converts versus Disciple's. Here's what he says. Disciples for the world and cling to Jesus till he comes.   [00:55:57] Converts don't. Disciples are not engage in a culture war. Converts are disciples. Cherish, obey and share the word of God. Converts don't. Disciples choose Jesus over anything and everything else. Converts don't. Converts run when the fire comes, disciples don't mean that cool. So can you see a difference between merely accepting Christ, which is a convert, versus following Christ? Can you see that difference in the four soils?   [00:56:35] Sure. Absolutely. Okay.   [00:56:38] So the obvious question, but which of those soils are the disciples?   [00:56:45] The last one.   [00:56:46] Number four, which went to their convert's.   [00:56:57] I would say probably number two. It could be three or four years.   [00:57:06] So technically, I guess you could say was two, three and four. The converse, because they all accept Christ to a degree. They all received the word with joy, but only soil for is the disciple who actually pursues Christ. So back to my original question. Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven? No. Okay, so you change your answer now, right?   [00:57:35] Okay. So wrapping up. Let me share what this parable I think teaches us. No one's really kind of cool.   [00:57:43] I think there shows that to a degree. Now, these aren't exactly accurate. But we can kind of pull some some things out of this parable shows that there are actually two stages of obtaining eternal life, two stages of the kingdom of heaven within us.   [00:58:02] First is the seed is sown and the soul has to accept it. But second, after accepting the soul has to steward, it produces Morsey. And without that stewarding and without the production of fruit.   [00:58:21] Which is the seed being reformed in you then? Then your you haven't gone that second stage of stewarding it. Let me show you this also turned to Matthew three eight two three eight. This is John the Baptist. He's talking the Pharisees. And if you remember, John the Baptist comes baptizing with water for forgiveness, basically repentance leading toward forgiveness. A little bit different type baptism than baptism as a new believer. But reading Matthew three eight.   [00:58:59] Bear fruit in keeping with repentance.   [00:59:03] So now we have fruit again. Do you think this fruit might be similar to the fruit that Jesus is talking about?   [00:59:09] Yes.   [00:59:11] And then you have bear fruit in keeping with what?   [00:59:14] Repentance.   [00:59:16] And what was the key message that Jesus came preaching or intent for the Kingdom of God is near.   [00:59:23] So we see all these all these same characters keep coming back up and cycling around.   [00:59:27] Does that make sense? Yeah. So if we have repented. We will bear fruit if we have not repented. We won't bear fruit. Repentance is a key to bearing fruit. I would say repentance is a key to stewarding the sea.   [00:59:47] Right. So when I started this study, I was kind of amazing what I found. And as I started to pursue it further, what's really cool is I start to see this pattern throughout all of scripture, but specifically in the New Testament where this is highlighted. So what we're going to do not on today's call is because we're at the end of the time. But as we go through, I want to start to dissect and open up a lot of these not only the parables, but the epistles and some more things that Jesus says and just kind of show this whole picture of what's going on. And here's to value. So the question is, well, what's so important about this?   [01:00:28] Well, obviously, it's important if God puts it in there, but how does it change what we do not want to share? Kind of how it changed for me. But first, let me ask you, do you remember there is a section in the Bible that is called the Great Commission. You remember the great commission. Do you remember the first you know where it is?   [01:00:48] I feel like it's. Go go to Matthew. 28 a day.   [01:00:58] Well, it is the very end, Matthew, in Revelations is the end of God's word. So you could have the end, right.   [01:01:06] The great commission, verse sixteen through twenty.   [01:01:11] Looks like somewhere in there. Let's begin with all the authority has been.   [01:01:20] Jesus came and said to the disciples, all authority and heaven on earth has been given to me. Go therefore, and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I had commanded you. And they hold. I am with you always to the very end of the age.   [01:01:41] Great. So where did go out and share the gospel. Is that right? Go out and evangelize. Yeah. Okay. Now that's different than sharing the gospel.   [01:01:56] Make disciples go therefore make disciple.   [01:01:59] Yeah. Okay. So you're going to heaven. Is not the reason Jesus came. But it's a part of the kingdom of God. Sharing the gospel is not the great commission, but it's part. Of making disciples. You got to share the gospel to make a disciple. Yeah, that's true. So this is the focus. This is the thing that really hit me as I've come through here. Our focus isn't let's go evangelize. That's important. It's not the focus of what the Lord is called us to do is to make disciples. And the reason it's so important is only the disciples are the ones for Christ has formed in them. It's not enough just to go share the gospel. It's not enough just to quote unquote live as a Christian. We've got to help those people that we are around to steward the seed well, and we have to be careful that we steward the seed well as well. And if we're stewarding our say, well, it will produce fruit and fruit will manifest itself by the fruit dropping off a tree, say, going back in the ground and reproducing. So we're going to see more of this. But anyway, we'll stop there. But before we wrap up the call, any thoughts or observations that are hitting you?   [01:03:26] Gosh, as always, just eye opening to see scriptures revealed in a way that you don't necessarily ponder and consider on a regular basis.   [01:03:39] I thought it was great. I love the just the analogies between the seed and Jesus and the fruit. And it was really good. It was really good. I enjoyed it. Great. All right. Thank you so much for today. Thank you so much for your expertise. The time again that you put into studying and preparing this message for the listeners. Anything else that you want to share with our listeners before we say goodbye?   [01:04:09] Just make sure you listen to. If you're not listening to our podcast, but you're just kind of get this on the Web site. Go to depending on which podcast you're on. Get cellar's calling you what we do for real estate or we have get radical faith, which is just the radical faith podcast by himself. Go back. There's a lot of great content there. And the other thing I would really encourage is there's a lot of stuff here. Don't listen to one time and say, I got it. Go back and really absorb it. Take some time. Pull out your Bible, read and see what you can see the words in print as you go through this and you'll get a lot more out of it.   [01:04:49] Yes. Such great wisdom. Such great wisdom. Well, thank you. And we thank you to all of you who are listening. And we hope you all have a blessed day. And we'll see you next time.   [01:04:59] Thanks, Beatty. Thank you. Be blessed. Thanks.   P022

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Please ignore any speech-to-text errors) [00:00:04] All right. Well, hello, everyone. Thanks for joining us. My name is Penny and we're so glad that you're here with us today for this next session of Get Sellers Calling You. Beatty Carmichael is the CEO of Master Grabber, the creator of Agent Dominator and one of the top marketing experts in the real estate field. Beatty, I'm really excited about our call today. What do you have for us? [00:00:27] Well, I'm excited, too. And for those listening, this a quick disclaimer and heads up, we do two types of calls. One focused on growing a real estate business. By the way, we'll be doing more on that in the commercial sector as well. So you have commercial business. We got some really cool things on that. But the other type of topic we cover is on a spiritual nature. We call it radical faith. And it's where we talk about Jesus talking about Jesus offense. You you don't want to listen. Then you are forewarned and you can turn off this episode and come back to the next one. So that's what we're going to be talking about. [00:01:10] Awesome. I'm so excited. [00:01:12] Yes. Well, I'm kind of excited about this on this call, too, because this is, again, one of those studies I've done that I thought I'm going down this path and I know the answer. And then I start to search scriptures and I go, Huh? That's not the answer I was really expecting. [00:01:31] So kind of as a way of an intro, things are not always as they may seem. Okay, well, let me ask you a question. Jesus is up on the cross. [00:01:44] You remember that. You remember Jesus Christ. Just making sure that Jesus is up on the cross. And the question is, did God forsake him while he was there? [00:01:57] What do you think? No. No. [00:02:04] Yes. Yes. Well, yes, because I know that God turned his back on the thing. He wasn't turning his back on Jesus. [00:02:14] He was turning his back on the sin that was upon Jesus. And Jesus cried out, Why have you forsaken me? [00:02:23] So I could be both of you. You may be right, because a lot of times there's multiple dimensions and God's kingdom. [00:02:37] So it's not always linear and black and white. But for the sake of discussion, just kind of go down this path. [00:02:45] If you had to choose one or the other. Most likely. Did God forsake Jesus while he was on the cross or did God not forsake him? He did not. [00:02:59] Okay, give me your reasoning behind it. Do you have any scripture to back that up? [00:03:06] I can't think of any off the top of my head. I'm basing it on just what I know to be the nature and character of God. [00:03:14] Okay, great. Good God. Good woman. All right. So now Jesus does say, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? So does that mean that Jesus was wrong? [00:03:30] No. [00:03:32] Jesus was right. [00:03:34] If that's what he was feeling in the moment. We know that Jesus was perfect. So even though sometimes our feelings can lie to us. [00:03:46] That's a good question. That's a good question. [00:03:50] It is because a lot of people say, well, God, obviously for Jesus on the cross because Jesus said he did. You actually have a more accurate answer in reasoning behind it than you may realize. So this is where things are not always as they seem. You have to really look deeper underneath the surface and try to understand what's going on. So let me get you real quickly to turn to Psalm 22. [00:04:22] Let me give you a little background on Psalm 22. This is David in the Spirit, writing about the crucifixion. This is David watching. I'm assuming he's seen it take place or it's a vision, but he is see, he is writing down what the Lord has shown him. Just start reading the beginning of Psalm 22. And I just want to set the stage of what's going on here. [00:04:54] My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? Why are you so far from saving me so far from my cries of anguish? Oh, my God. Okay. [00:05:06] So Jesus is quoting Psalm 22? Actually, no. David is writing what Jesus says. And so David is actually quoting Jesus as opposed to Jesus quoting David. Does that make sense? Mm hmm. So here we have Jesus saying, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? As you read through Song 22, you see all the things about the crucifixion. You see them. They take my clothes. They cast lot from my clothes. They split them among I am pierced my my ribs, stand out, all these things that happen in crucifixion. So we know very clearly this is the crucifixion. But down real quickly to verse 24 and tell me. But first, 24 says was 24. [00:05:58] He has not despised or scorned the suffering of the afflicted one. He has not hidden his face from him, but has listened to his cry for help. [00:06:09] So this is talking about God. And it says that he has not hidden his face from him. Jesus says, my God, my God, why have you forsaken me? [00:06:19] And down here, it says that God never forsook and he never hid his face. [00:06:27] What in the world could be going on in this interesting. Fascinating. Thanks are not always as they seem, are they? [00:06:36] No, definitely not. [00:06:37] You got to dig a little bit deeper, especially when you want to really understand what's really going on and how to apply it in your life, how to live in a way that the Lord called us to live and what actually is going on. You've got to dig deeper to tap into a session we just recently did on when bad things happen. Is it God's will? Got some interesting observations there. So let me share it, because this is not the focus of the call. But I thought this was an interesting way to start it. Let me share kind of what's going on. [00:07:10] Have you ever heard the top concept that thin blinds you from the truth? Scene creates a veil over our eyes. And this is the whole idea of the wedding ceremony. The bride wears a veil and the bridegroom takes the veil off. And now she can see clearly as a as a foreshadowing of the spiritual. Ceremony with Jesus. And where the bride takes the veil of sin that blocks our vision. So when Jesus is on the cross, he became sin. And as soon as he became sin, a veil came over his eyes and he could no longer see the father. My God, my God, why do you forsaken me? David is saying, I'm right here. God never first took you sin blocks. Okay. So a lot of times we all believe what we've been told. But sometimes we don't really know why we believe it. Other times we believe a certain way because we read God's word and it says this and someone else reads that word and they get something totally different out of it. And the question is kind of flood what's right. So I want to move into the topic now because it's a bigger topic. Here's a question. [00:08:49] Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven? In other words, once you've accepted Christ, can you lose that salvation? [00:09:00] Oh, gosh, that's one of those questions that just gets so there's so much controversy. [00:09:09] Let's go. Let's go back. Let's go back to the root of the question. Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven? [00:09:16] Yes. [00:09:18] Why do you believe that? [00:09:23] Because the Bible says. [00:09:28] It says, if you believe in the Lord Jesus, he will be saved. [00:09:34] Is that accepting or believing or are those the same? [00:09:39] Well, maybe that's the translation I learned. [00:09:43] So let me let me ask you. Are you absolutely positive? That everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven. [00:09:56] I have to be honest, I'm not actually positive now that we're doing this call and I'll catch you on a number of things in the past, you're starting to think Beatty may know something. I don't. I'm not going to be quite so positive. Right. Right. Okay. Well, good job. Don't be positive. Okay. Okay. [00:10:19] So the topic of this series that we're going to do, and it's going to be multi part because it's really threw out all scripture, especially New Testament. And that is the question does do all who accept Christ go to heaven? [00:10:35] This call is going to be part number one. We're going to lay the foundation and then we're going to start to dissect it. And this isn't for just simply an intellectual pursuit of just saying, here's what scripture say. But really to try to understand. What is God calling us to do and why? And as I've gone through this myself, here's the net result. I've changed my perspective of what's most important. It's really amazing. Okay, just a quick disclaimer. I don't have all the answers. This is one of those topics that you mentioned. Everyone has all kinds of different opinions. Scripture is constantly, consistently true is the question of what are we and how we interpreting and why. So we don't want to share is is what I believe the Lord is directing me in understanding. So I want to talk about some of the controversial versus real quickly. So this kind of tees up why this is such a difficult topic. So let's go to Matthew ten, verse 22. [00:11:39] Okay. All right. [00:11:43] By the way, this is this is all these things we're going to go through for passages. And they're all Jesus talking. So go ahead, Matthew, 10 22. [00:11:52] You will be hated by everyone because of all. But the one who stands firm to the end will be saved, stands firm to the end. [00:12:02] Okay, that's interesting. Let's use also ESV translation on these. Let's now go to Matthew 24 and we're going to read verses 10 and 13, 10 and 13. [00:12:21] 24, verse 10 and 13 percent says and then many will fall away and betray one another and hate one another. And then verse 13 says, But the one who endures to the end will be saved. [00:12:37] And they translates that first verse. And then many will fall away from the face. Okay, here we see. But the one who endures to the end will be saved. Let's now go to mark 13. [00:12:53] Martin, 13 versus 12 and 13. Let's see what that says. [00:12:58] All right. Verse twelve. And brother will deliver brother over to death. And the father, his child and the children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name's sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved. [00:13:17] We see that again. The one who endures to the end. Makes you wonder, well, does that mean not all people who accept Christ? Go to heaven because why would Jesus keep talking about enduring to the end? Let's look at one more loop, 21, 17 through 19. [00:13:42] All right, 17 to 19 says you will be hated by all for my name's sake, but not a hair of your head will perish by your endurance. You will gain your lives. [00:13:56] There we have it again. Here's the question. When Jesus teaches that you must endure to the end to be saved. Does that mean that some people don't endure to the end? [00:14:09] Yes, I could see how some people probably give up or decide that I'm done with this. Okay, okay. [00:14:17] But the fact that Jesus is teaching that you had to endure to the end indicates that there are obviously those who don't endure to the end. Does that make sense? Yes. By the way, here's something else interesting. This was so important, apparently, that God put it in. The scriptures four separate times just by Jesus. We're going to say that this concept is pervasive. [00:14:43] But four separate times by Jesus. [00:14:45] If people don't endure to the end, then does that mean that they don't go to heaven? [00:14:53] I'd like to investigate that a little further. [00:14:56] Okay, so let me ask this question. Does being Sayed. [00:15:00] Does that. Men going to heaven. Do you think? [00:15:05] According to what we just read. No. [00:15:09] Okay, can you give me some scripture to back up? We're saved in heaven. Don't necessarily go together. [00:15:18] Well, the ones we just read, Jesus was speaking in reference to being saved and said those who Indore to the end. So three times we read that right. [00:15:30] So those who who endure to the end will be saved. Can we probably transliterate that? Those who endured to the end will make it to heaven. Probably is just kind of lame, the fact that Jesus is talking about being saved. Going to what we talk about going to heaven. Probably one in the same with that. Would you agree with that? [00:15:52] Yes, I would. [00:15:54] Okay. So if Jesus is saying. Or so is Jesus saying that whether or not they endure determines whether or not they are saved? [00:16:11] That's a very deep thought. I think so. I think that would go hand in hand. Okay, one influences the other. [00:16:24] Right. So what we're going to find out as we go through it, it's either a determining factor or an indicative factor. It's either the evidence had been saved or they determine that they are to be saved. So we're going to see what the scripture talks about a little bit more. So when Jesus came to Earth, here's another question. What was the main message that he preached? In other words, why did he come to Earth? [00:16:50] He preached the kingdom of heaven is near. He preached to be safe so that you could go to heaven. That was his message, to believe him to get right there. [00:17:02] So true. So he never really preaches forgiveness. [00:17:07] Have you ever noticed that he didn't have to come to Earth for forgiveness because God gave people all through the Old Testament. [00:17:16] He didn't come to Earth specifically for salvation. You said that on. He came to preach the kingdom of heaven. In fact, this is his common theme. If you can finish the sentence, repent for the kingdom of heaven is near or near here at hand. It's right here in our midst. Okay, so we had this thing called repentance and forgiveness, salvation going to have been saved. All these things are part of the kingdom of God. But what Jesus came to do was much more holistic than just being saved or forgiven. And I think that if we start to then understand what the kingdom of God really means. And understand more about that make more sense. Why? What Jesus talking about enduring to the end really means if we want to understand what Jesus means, the one who endures to the end. We have to go back to his core message that he's always teaching repent for the kingdom of God is at hand. And if we understand the kingdom of God, then we can then figure out what he really means about enduring to the end. Does that hurt? So with that then the question is. When Jesus taught on the kingdom of God, because that's most of what he taught on what was his primary method of teaching about the kingdom of God. [00:18:52] Do you recall the parable parables? Good job. Okay. So if we want to understand the kingdom of God, let's look at some of the parables, because that's what he teaches through which other parables is the most important in understanding. [00:19:11] All of the parables. Do you recall which one? [00:19:15] Oh, gosh. He had so many. The one that's popping out is the seed and the sower. But that might not be the one you're thinking of. [00:19:28] Did many good jobs go to Mark for verse 13? This is a commentary of Jesus on the parable of the seed in the summer. [00:19:41] Okay. [00:19:42] Four, verse 13. And he said to them, do you not understand this parable? How then will you understand all the parables? [00:19:53] So here's something here's something real interesting. The parable of the seat in the Sower, I believe I'm correct, is the only parable in all three of the synoptic gospels. That's the same. And it's the only one where Jesus gives a parable and gives the interpretation. In fact, I think it's the only one that he gives the interpretation on. And he says here that if you don't understand this parable, you cannot understand any of the parables because this parable unlocks all the other parable. So this is a pretty important message on understanding the kingdom of God. Makes sense. Yes. Okay, so now let's read into this. Let's go read the parable of the Sower, and we're going to do this in Matthew. Okay. Okay. So, Matthew, 13 versus three through eight. [00:20:53] All right. And he told them many things in parables saying a sower went out to sow as he sowed some seeds, fell along the path, and the birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground where they did not have much soil. And immediately they sprang up since they had no depth of soil. But when the sun rose, they were scorched. And since they had no root, they withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns, and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell on good soil and produced grain. Some 100 fold. Some 60, some 30. He who has ears let them hear. [00:21:37] Very good. So now we have the soil where the seed goes out. And now we're going to replay what Jesus says this means. That's going to be verses 18 through 23. [00:21:53] Here, then, the parable of the sower, when anyone hears the word of the kingdom and does not understand it. The evil one comes and snatches away what has been found in his heart. This is what was sown along the path. As for what was shown on rocky ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately received it with joy. Yet he has no root in himself, but endures for a while. And when tribulation or persecutions persecution arises on account of the word immediately, he falls away. As for what was sown amongst thorns, this is the one who hears the word. But the cares of the world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word. And it proves unfruitful. As for what was sown on good soil, this is the one who hears the word and understands that he indeed bears fruit and yields in one case a hundredfold and another 60 in another 30. [00:22:51] All right, great. So now we're going back to the Requestion. Does everyone who accept Christ go to heaven? We say that Jesus says only the one who endures to the end will be saved. [00:23:05] We now go into this parable. He starts to describe it. So now let's get an understanding of this parable as we go in. So there are several parts about this parable that we need to break down first just to really kind of understand a little bit more. The first one is the seed. Okay, this is the seed and the seed is a key part. Here's the question. What is the seed? [00:23:33] The word. [00:23:34] Okay, so, Jesus, the seed is the word, the word of the kingdom. And what is the word Jesus? [00:23:45] Yeah. Okay, John, one one in the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God. [00:23:52] So the seed is Jesus. Right. Okay. Very interesting. So then we have the next. Let's look at the four soils. Okay. What did the soils represent? [00:24:07] The beginning part where he described it, yes. [00:24:12] When he's throwing when you're trying to sort out what do the soils represent, there are four types of soil. So what what did they representative of? [00:24:21] A person's heart, a person's heart. Okay, so four types of heart, four types of people, right. What separates one heart from another? What separates one group of people versus the other group of people? [00:24:39] The state or the beating of their heart? The state of their heart. [00:24:45] But less and less narrowed a little bit more. Okay. Okay. I'd like to suggest the stewardship of the seed, which is it represents, to say, the heart, but the state of heart is exemplified and evidenced by how its stewards see. Does that make sense? Okay, so what differentiates one soil from another, one type of person from another is stewardship of the seed. And then if the seed is Jesus and the soil represents the different types of people. What does that mean, that all people receive Jesus? [00:25:27] No. [00:25:33] Goes out, the soda goes out and sows the seed. Jesus. Yes. And does the same get sewn on all four soils? [00:25:47] Yes. [00:25:49] All four soils receive the seed sown. [00:25:55] Correct. [00:25:56] Okay. [00:25:58] So let me ask the question again. If they did this soil, it's not a trick question. It's a question that. [00:26:06] We usually don't consider because it doesn't make sense based on what we've been taught. But we have to do is we have to dig deeper than what we've been taught and see what the word says. Because what we've been taught may not be. What the world says, it may be something slightly different. So here's the question at the seat is Jesus and the soul represents people then does that mean that all people receive Jesus? Yes, it does. In fact, Romans, what does it Romans one tells us that everyone has the heart of the law of the Lord written on their hearts already. They see God's law in the skies and in everything. So everyone has received the truth. Jesus says the high priest prayer when he's praying to the Lord of the tables. He says, Die word is truth. God's word is truth. Jesus is the word. Jesus is the seed. And we see truth everywhere in nature that that proclaims God. So everyone has received that seed. But that doesn't mean they've done anything with it. That's the key. So now we've got the seed. We've got the soils. Now we have. Fruit, fruit is really the key message that Jesus is teaching about. And he basically basically says that here's my way of just kind of transliterating a little bit. Only those who produce fruit or are going to be. [00:27:46] Right, that's basically what we can start to see in his message, and I want to unpack that with fruit. [00:27:55] Fruit is the key to this parable. Fruit is only found in one soil. Soil is that good soil, the good soil. Okay, great. [00:28:05] And I want it just for sake of purpose. I'm going to label these soils as soil one, two, three and four soil. One is the path to the rocky soil soil. Three is the thorns and soil for the good soil. And then that way we can just kind of keep keep it simple. [00:28:23] Okay, so what we had to do is understand what is fruit. So if I were to ask you, what is fruit? This is the kid. This is the key to understanding everything is this fruit? What is it? [00:28:40] Fruit is what is produced from the seed. [00:28:47] Very good. [00:28:49] But what is it that's the prize? What can we call it the result? The seed managed and held and cared for properly. [00:29:08] All right. All right. We're gonna get there. Let me back up and just kind of bring us into this, because I think this is kind of fun. So seed one of the times another sessions. I was talking about the Bible has been written by one author. Would you agree with that? Yes. Okay. Now, that author inspired many men to actually pen that one author's thoughts, but it's all one author, which is God himself. Exactly. So anytime you have a book, you have characters in the book and those characters keep coming up and they always are the characters that they were. [00:29:54] In other words, if I'm reading a book and let's say, say, a Tom Clancy novel, I used to read those years back and he introduces a guy named Gosh, I forget the guy, but he introduces a couple of guys up front in the novel. [00:30:13] Then throughout the novel, every time he calls that person up by name. John did this or John did that. [00:30:19] It's always that person that he introduced and described at the beginning. Does that make sense? Yes. So the character goes throughout. So we see that same thing in the scriptures. [00:30:31] We see it with fig trees, olive trees. We see it with light, darkness. We see it with soils. We see it with seed. We see all kinds of thing. So the question is, what does seed represent? What is the character of seed? I like to show you something because this is really cool. [00:30:46] Where does God first introduce his character seed? [00:30:54] In the Garden of Eden, if I'm not mistaken, a little bit before. [00:31:00] Oh, you'll have to tell me. [00:31:05] Let's go to Genesis 111. [00:31:10] During creation, now, Save was obviously present in the Garden of Eden, but he introduces what it is. [00:31:19] During creation, Genesis one 11 with 11 and God said, let the earth sprout vegetation plants yielding seeds and fruit trees bearing fruit and which is their seed, each according to its own kind on the earth. [00:31:36] And it was so seed reproduces after its own time. We used today's technology words that carries all the DNA to reproduce an exact replica of whatever it is, whatever it came from. Does that make sense? Yeah. And then where is seed formed? [00:32:03] Well. See, far and within the fruit. [00:32:08] The fruit is the womb of the seed. Interesting, isn't it? [00:32:15] I mean, we know that it is insane to think of it that way. [00:32:18] Okay, so this makes sense. A seed is planted. It has to die. Once it dies. It's burst again. Into a new plant after its own kind, as that plant matures, it produces fruit. And inside, the fruit seed is created so that the plant through the fruit can reproduce itself again. Does that. Soun. [00:33:00] Similar to something else that we would think about in Christian terms. And that's just what Jesus did. He came as a seed of God. Right. The exact replica. He dies and he's planted into the ground, right into the temple. And then when he dies, he becomes born again into a exact replica. And he produces through. Okay. So we see this this pattern of the seed. And the fruit is the womb that causes that seed to produce fruit is in the process of where seed has been reproduced. Making sense? Yes. Okay, so then why does the characteristic of the seed. What is the characteristic of the fruit? It's kind of an aside, but it kind of ties into this. If I were to say, what is the fruit of? Can you finish that sentence? [00:34:13] What's it called fruit of? Prudent spirit. [00:34:19] So let's look at that real quick. This is Galatians five. 22, 23. But I want you to do it in The Passion translation on this one, because I think this song articulates what it's really saying. [00:34:33] And you said the Galicians five, five, 22 and 23. [00:34:50] All right, here we go. 22 and 23 says the fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you is Divine Love in all its varied expressions. [00:35:04] Such a perfect moment. [00:35:07] A lot of times people say the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace. [00:35:12] But I think what the term love is, the fruit of the spirit is singular, not plural. There's not multiple fruits. There's one. That's why I love this translation that the fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you. Is Divine Love in all its varied expressions. So now we're talking about love. Where else do you recall what the Bible says about love? We're talking about. This is Paul talking about different things and he said about love. [00:35:43] First Corinthians 13, I think. Yeah. The love. We call it the love chapter in our house. [00:35:49] Okay, good. All right. And it says that above all. [00:35:54] First, love is, love is, and in fact, there's here's something else, it says Faith, hope and love abide. But the greatest of these is love. What are you saying? There is that of everything he's been talking about, faith, hope and love. By that means that they are eternal. [00:36:17] They never go away. Gifts go away. But faith, hope and love abide. But of all of those, the greatest of them is love. This is what Jimmy. This is who God is, representative. Mostly by the character. Bye bye, love. That's what this is talking about. The fruit produced by the Holy Spirit within you is Divine Love in all its varied expressions. Okay, so now I'll let you finish the passage from there. It's now going to define and describe what that Divine Love, how that Divine Love manifests itself. [00:36:55] Okay, joy that overflows peace, that some patience that endures kindness and action, a life full of virtue, faith that prevails, gentleness of heart and strength of spirit never set the law above these qualities. They are meant to be limitless. [00:37:18] All right. So now let's go back. See this Jesus? That's what Jesus says is the word of God, right in the. Fruit is where the seed is formed. And that means really that seed, the fruit, is Jesus being formed in you and producing through you. Does that make sense? Yes. OK. So that's really what I believe the fruit is talking about, is that Jesus has been formed in you. So here's a question. If Jesus is formed in you, would you act like Jesus? We should be informed and you are going to carry the characteristics and the more he's formed and living through, you carry those characteristics. What are some of the things that Jesus did that maybe if he was formed in you, you would likely do to. [00:38:14] Oh, gosh. I mean, just naming things he did heal the sick, raise the dead. He helped all those that were oppressed. He lost. I mean, he loved first. And everything else was just an overflow of the love. [00:38:33] He went preaching the message, the kingdom of God. Okay. Yeah. All this. [00:38:38] All these things. Peace, patience, kindness. [00:38:43] So that is evidence of the fruit. The fruit is Jesus being formed. But evidence of the fruit being formed into you is a manifestation of all these things that Jesus did. Bring a little bit more clarity, right? OK. So here's the big question. If Jesus has never formed Inju, are you born again and go to heaven? [00:39:12] Tom. [00:39:15] According to all this. No. [00:39:21] It's not us that are righteous. It's Jesus, in a sense, righteous, right? Yeah, yeah. Okay. [00:39:29] Romans side, I think, says that the righteous fulfillment of the law, the righteous requirement of the law has been fulfilled. And you. [00:39:36] And then we can connect the dots because Christ is in you. [00:39:41] Who would it be safe to say that only those in soil number four. Hey, bear fruit. Which has been formed in them are the ones who are truly born again, are saved and go to heaven. Does that make sense, do you say? Yes. So now let's look at the four soils. Real quick. No one is the past. This is verse four, so read that again. Let's talk about that. [00:40:16] And that was go back to that book when we were in Matthew 20. [00:40:26] Excuse me, Matthew, 13, 13. [00:40:33] I'm going to switch translations. I'll go back to that. [00:40:35] I actually actually I got. I think this is versus it's not verse four that I want you to read is going to be verse probably 18 or 19. [00:40:45] Let me go back. Yes. [00:40:47] Okay. 18 and 19. Okay. So 19, when anyone hears the word of the kingdom does not understand it. The evil one comes and snatches away what has been sown in his heart. This is what was sown along the path. [00:41:02] I know that. [00:41:03] So that's the one that's sown along the path. [00:41:06] Okay, let's see. [00:41:13] So that person has heard the word of the kingdom. And they do not understand it. [00:41:18] Right. So how did they steward the seed? Or did they stay where the stayed at all? [00:41:26] They didn't. They didn't do it because it just says that they did not understand it. And then the evil one came and snatched it away. So that leads me to believe they didn't pursue understanding what had been spoken to them. [00:41:40] Got you. So no wonder the path does not seem see deceit at all. It's rejected. Correct. Since it doesn't stay where the seed. Does the soil accept the seed? So there are two things you've got to accept it and you, Stuart. So did the soil ever accept the seed? [00:42:07] No. [00:42:08] No. Since the seed represents Christ, does that mean that this person did not accept Christ? That's correct. And is this person born again? No. No. And how do we know that? [00:42:26] Because it says. [00:42:29] The evil one snatched it away. What was sewn in their heart? So Jesus was taken out from their heart. They can't be born again. [00:42:38] That's right. Okay, perfect. So now we have soul. No one does not accept the seed, does not therefore steward the seed. The say never forms itself in them through fruit. They are not born again. They don't go to heaven. Okay, so now let's look at soil number two, the rocky ground. This is going to be versus 20 through 21. [00:43:02] As for what was sown on Iraqi ground, this is the one who hears the word and immediately received it with joy. Yet he has no root in himself but indoors for a while. And when tribulation or persecution persecution arises on account of the word, he immediately falls away. [00:43:24] So does the soil accept the seed? [00:43:32] A little bit, right? It tries to, but actually I think it's a little bit a little bit deeper. Let's go back to it and look and says yet he has no root in himself. Do you see that? If there is no. [00:43:50] Yes, go ahead. [00:43:51] If there's if there's no route, then did the soil ever accept it? [00:43:58] Go in the soil, right? [00:44:00] Yes. One head down. [00:44:04] Have you ever seen trees or plants grow on the side of a cliff where it's just wrong? Yes. Yes. Is there any. There's no soil, but they can still grow by putting roots down a little bit around the rocks. Does that make sense? So the soil does accept the seed. And we know that because there's no root and with no root, there's no acceptance. How does the soil steward the seed? [00:44:36] Well, it says as soon as he heard it, he received it with joy. Right. But because there's no route. There's nothing to anchor it when the hard things come, he falls away. He gives up. [00:44:52] Notice it says that he has no root in himself, but endures for a while. What are those passages that Jesus says? [00:45:00] What does it say about endurance to endure until the end? [00:45:05] So this guy only endures for a while, but not to the end. [00:45:09] Okay. So the soil doesn't accept the seed. The soil stewards, the seed only poorly. It's enough that it grew up, got excited. But it did not endure to the end. Here's the question. Is this person born again? [00:45:30] Now, how do we know that? [00:45:35] Well, because they had no route. And because they chose to give up almost OK. [00:45:42] So those are part of it. But the ultimate technical answers because there's no fruit. [00:45:50] Because fruit is where Christ is formed in you. And there's no fruit. Therefore, there is no Christ formed in you. And only of Christ is formed. And you are truly born again. Makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. So no one. Not a Christian. So, number two, they receive it with joy. A lot of people you share the gospel. They immediately pray the center's prayer type of thing. And you may see some life change. They're all excited, but they don't endure. [00:46:21] That wasn't a what we would call in our Christian, these terms a true salvation. Christ was never formed in them. Now let's look at soil number three. This is the one with the thorns. And this is going to be verse 22. [00:46:35] As for what was done along with thorns, this is the one who hears the word. But the cares of the world and deceitfulness of riches choke the word. And it proved unfruitful. [00:46:49] Turn also real quick, I want to show you one other passage on this that it gives a little bit more information. Luke Eighty-seven. It's the same Jesus describing this, but he gives Luke eight, seven, gives one more piece of information. Let's see if you can find that piece of information. [00:47:06] And some fell among thorns and the thorns grew up with it and choked it. So this one. Thorns are growing up with the. [00:47:17] Which means the seed is growing. Right. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Okay. So now let's ask our questions, our diagnostic questions on this. Does the soil accept the seed? [00:47:30] Yes. Yes. [00:47:32] Okay. Now, remember, the soil represents people, represents your heart. The seed represents Jesus. So this soil accepts Jesus. [00:47:44] Yes. [00:47:45] Follow me. Okay. Okay, so the soil accepts Jesus because the soil accepts the seed. [00:47:56] How does the soil steward the seed? How well is that seed stewarded? Well, it does it does the soil steward the seat at all. Let's start with their. [00:48:15] No. [00:48:17] Maybe a little bit in the beginning, because it says when the cares of the world and deceitfulness come and you choke it. [00:48:26] Okay, okay. Go back to Luke eight, seven. [00:48:32] And some fell among thorns and the thorns grew up with it. Grew up with a plant that the seed produced but choked it. So this means that. They grew up means that it actually grew into a plant, which means that the soil did steward the seed enough to produce a plant. Okay, so here soil number three, except the seed. If we put this in human terms, someone accepts Jesus. It's two words. [00:49:03] The seed enough that it forms a plant. And that plan looks exactly like the replica of what the seed was reproducing, because it is. But is this person born again? [00:49:22] No, because they do not endure to the end almost. [00:49:27] Not that they don't endure it to the end. There's the key element. What's the defining moment of whether someone's born again? [00:49:37] They don't produce fruit. [00:49:38] It's Christ in you. Right. And the only way to have Christ in you that you have fruit. Where the seed is produced. [00:49:51] You say that it was unfruitful. [00:49:53] That's right. There was no fruit. And now here's a person who accepts Christ. Who manifest Christian type of behavior? Because the fruit grows up. But produces no fruit, which is evidence that Christ was never formed in them. [00:50:17] They did not endure to the end. You had to endure longer for the verb to be formed, that may be one way to describe it. I don't think that's really an accurate statement. But there's something else here. Why was fruit never produced? [00:50:32] Because of the sarin. [00:50:35] What are the odds? Come check it out. What do Soren's come from? [00:50:42] We the ground. [00:50:48] All blind reproduces after its own time. [00:50:51] What is blind going? I'll see. There you go. Okay. [00:50:58] There you go. So here here we have a number three person receives and accepts the seed of the word. But they're also accepting all kinds of other seed and they stoo or the other seed more diligently than they steward the Christ seed. [00:51:19] And by stewarding other seeds, Jesus calls them the cares of the world. There's this staple ness of riches by stewarding those seeds more. This all number three person allows that stewardship to choke out the Christ. That's pretty interesting. Yeah, that's really good. So is it possible to accept Christ? Had the appearance of growing as a Christian. And yet not actually being born again, having Christ formed into you and ultimately going to heaven. Yes, it is. And this is startling and this interesting. [00:52:05] Oh, it's going to get a whole lot better. This is setting the stage. [00:52:12] Now, let's go to soil number four. This is the good soil. This is verse 23. [00:52:19] As for what was done on good soil, this is the one who hears the word and understands that he indeed bears fruit and yields in one case a hundredfold and another 60 in another 30. [00:52:36] All right, great. So does the soil accept the seed? How is the seed stewarded? Very well, very well. Is this person first off, what happens with the sea? [00:52:55] Cared for. It's your word. It's helped nurture so that it can grow. [00:53:02] All right. Is this person born again? Yes. And how do we know? Because they bear fruit. Okay. In terms of fruit. Some hundred, some 60, some 30. Notice also. It's not the soil that bears fruit. What bears fruit? The seed is the seed that bears the fruit, not the soil. The soil is merely the womb in which the fruit is produced that produces more seed. The seed producing the fruit. In other words, it's not us, it's the Lord. [00:53:52] Now, we've already been to always been taught. It's Christ living through us. There's nothing we can do of our own. The fruit of the spirit is not what we do. It's Christ in us. This is what's going on. It's the sea that reproduces the fruit. [00:54:06] It's not the soil. We're just the container. [00:54:12] So now as we start to wrap up, I wanted to talk on two things. The first one is Convert's versus Disciple's, because I think this is what is this is kind of where where a lot of this starts to focus in on. I want to set the definition first off, let me ask you if I were to ask you to define the difference between a convert and a disciple, what would you tell me? [00:54:40] A disciple to me is one who has a desire and longing for teaching. [00:54:46] And then. [00:54:48] Finding someone else and seeing that same quality in someone else. [00:54:53] Kind of like a leader, a good leader is going to look for someone who also wants to be a leader. And they're going to raise up that leader. [00:55:01] Right. Let me. [00:55:08] Give a simple definition that that I like to include a convert is going to be someone who accepts Christ right. [00:55:21] But a disciple is going to be someone who follows Christ. And I think there's a difference. [00:55:29] Does that make sense? Absolutely. I was watching this great documentary on the underground Iranian church and they had people from the church talking and everything and sharing, and it was really cool. But one of the guys made a really interesting comment, Converts versus Disciple's. Here's what he says. Disciples for the world and cling to Jesus till he comes. [00:55:57] Converts don't. Disciples are not engage in a culture war. Converts are disciples. Cherish, obey and share the word of God. Converts don't. Disciples choose Jesus over anything and everything else. Converts don't. Converts run when the fire comes, disciples don't mean that cool. So can you see a difference between merely accepting Christ, which is a convert, versus following Christ? Can you see that difference in the four soils? [00:56:35] Sure. Absolutely. Okay. [00:56:38] So the obvious question, but which of those soils are the disciples? [00:56:45] The last one. [00:56:46] Number four, which went to their convert's. [00:56:57] I would say probably number two. It could be three or four years. [00:57:06] So technically, I guess you could say was two, three and four. The converse, because they all accept Christ to a degree. They all received the word with joy, but only soil for is the disciple who actually pursues Christ. So back to my original question. Does everyone who accepts Christ go to heaven? No. Okay, so you change your answer now, right? [00:57:35] Okay. So wrapping up. Let me share what this parable I think teaches us. No one's really kind of cool. [00:57:43] I think there shows that to a degree. Now, these aren't exactly accurate. But we can kind of pull some some things out of this parable shows that there are actually two stages of obtaining eternal life, two stages of the kingdom of heaven within us. [00:58:02] First is the seed is sown and the soul has to accept it. But second, after accepting the soul has to steward, it produces Morsey. And without that stewarding and without the production of fruit. [00:58:21] Which is the seed being reformed in you then? Then your you haven't gone that second stage of stewarding it. Let me show you this also turned to Matthew three eight two three eight. This is John the Baptist. He's talking the Pharisees. And if you remember, John the Baptist comes baptizing with water for forgiveness, basically repentance leading toward forgiveness. A little bit different type baptism than baptism as a new believer. But reading Matthew three eight. [00:58:59] Bear fruit in keeping with repentance. [00:59:03] So now we have fruit again. Do you think this fruit might be similar to the fruit that Jesus is talking about? [00:59:09] Yes. [00:59:11] And then you have bear fruit in keeping with what? [00:59:14] Repentance. [00:59:16] And what was the key message that Jesus came preaching or intent for the Kingdom of God is near. [00:59:23] So we see all these all these same characters keep coming back up and cycling around. [00:59:27] Does that make sense? Yeah. So if we have repented. We will bear fruit if we have not repented. We won't bear fruit. Repentance is a key to bearing fruit. I would say repentance is a key to stewarding the sea. [00:59:47] Right. So when I started this study, I was kind of amazing what I found. And as I started to pursue it further, what's really cool is I start to see this pattern throughout all of scripture, but specifically in the New Testament where this is highlighted. So what we're going to do not on today's call is because we're at the end of the time. But as we go through, I want to start to dissect and open up a lot of these not only the parables, but the epistles and some more things that Jesus says and just kind of show this whole picture of what's going on. And here's to value. So the question is, well, what's so important about this? [01:00:28] Well, obviously, it's important if God puts it in there, but how does it change what we do not want to share? Kind of how it changed for me. But first, let me ask you, do you remember there is a section in the Bible that is called the Great Commission. You remember the great commission. Do you remember the first you know where it is? [01:00:48] I feel like it's. Go go to Matthew. 28 a day. [01:00:58] Well, it is the very end, Matthew, in Revelations is the end of God's word. So you could have the end, right. [01:01:06] The great commission, verse sixteen through twenty. [01:01:11] Looks like somewhere in there. Let's begin with all the authority has been. [01:01:20] Jesus came and said to the disciples, all authority and heaven on earth has been given to me. Go therefore, and make disciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I had commanded you. And they hold. I am with you always to the very end of the age. [01:01:41] Great. So where did go out and share the gospel. Is that right? Go out and evangelize. Yeah. Okay. Now that's different than sharing the gospel. [01:01:56] Make disciples go therefore make disciple. [01:01:59] Yeah. Okay. So you're going to heaven. Is not the reason Jesus came. But it's a part of the kingdom of God. Sharing the gospel is not the great commission, but it's part. Of making disciples. You got to share the gospel to make a disciple. Yeah, that's true. So this is the focus. This is the thing that really hit me as I've come through here. Our focus isn't let's go evangelize. That's important. It's not the focus of what the Lord is called us to do is to make disciples. And the reason it's so important is only the disciples are the ones for Christ has formed in them. It's not enough just to go share the gospel. It's not enough just to quote unquote live as a Christian. We've got to help those people that we are around to steward the seed well, and we have to be careful that we steward the seed well as well. And if we're stewarding our say, well, it will produce fruit and fruit will manifest itself by the fruit dropping off a tree, say, going back in the ground and reproducing. So we're going to see more of this. But anyway, we'll stop there. But before we wrap up the call, any thoughts or observations that are hitting you? [01:03:26] Gosh, as always, just eye opening to see scriptures revealed in a way that you don't necessarily ponder and consider on a regular basis. [01:03:39] I thought it was great. I love the just the analogies between the seed and Jesus and the fruit. And it was really good. It was really good. I enjoyed it. Great. All right. Thank you so much for today. Thank you so much for your expertise. The time again that you put into studying and preparing this message for the listeners. Anything else that you want to share with our listeners before we say goodbye? [01:04:09] Just make sure you listen to. If you're not listening to our podcast, but you're just kind of get this on the Web site. Go to depending on which podcast you're on. Get cellar's calling you what we do for real estate or we have get radical faith, which is just the radical faith podcast by himself. Go back. There's a lot of great content there. And the other thing I would really encourage is there's a lot of stuff here. Don't listen to one time and say, I got it. Go back and really absorb it. Take some time. Pull out your Bible, read and see what you can see the words in print as you go through this and you'll get a lot more out of it. [01:04:49] Yes. Such great wisdom. Such great wisdom. Well, thank you. And we thank you to all of you who are listening. And we hope you all have a blessed day. And we'll see you next time. [01:04:59] Thanks, Beatty. Thank you. Be blessed. Thanks. P066 [/fusion_text][/fusion_builder_column][/fusion_builder_row][/fusion_builder_container]

Sometimes we fall into a big mistake. We may be doing a lot of good things, but we may be doing them in the wrong place! A good question that we need to ask ourselves is, "Are we, as a Church, all aiming at the same goal?"Today, we're going to take a closer look at the seven grounds for our unity in Christ, which Paul outlines for us in verses 4-6: "There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all." We are part of one Body, and that Body is Jesus Christ's. That means we are comprised by many members who have different functions. But this isn't just "my church." It's Christ's body, and all the members of His body need each other. We are one in Spirit -- not necessarily that we're always of the same opinion. But we have been sealed by the same Holy Spirit, and brought together as brothers and sisters into the throne-room of God.We have been called in one hope. Our hope is not in financial security, a good job, or even the right President; our hope is in Christ! If all of our eyes are not fixed upon Christ, then we'll find ourselves maybe even doing the right job -- but in the wrong place!But we not only have one hope; we have the Lord Jesus Himself! Just as Deuteronomy 6 teaches, the Lord is one. Jesus is our Lord Who bought us with a great price. He leads us gently and kindly, and He even prays for our unity with Himself and each other (John 17).We have one faith. No one comes to God the Father except through Christ, Who shed His blood for the salvation of all of His people -- even if we are not all necessarily of the same denomination.We are all baptized into one name -- that of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. This means that we are all members of the same spiritual family! Lastly, we serve one God and Father; we are to focus our eyes upon Him, and not ourselves. When everything is centered around Him and His Word and His glory, then we all can be certain of arriving at the same destination!As we are all built upon the one Foundation of Christ Jesus, we will see more and more of true unity in the Church. Let's pray for grace that we may never lose focus on the One Whom we love!

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I would imagine that suffering is not a very popular topic amongst most churches today but suffering is a vital and important part of every believer's life and It should not and cannot be a topic that is left out of our Biblical thinking. Suffering comes in many forms and our heart today is to discuss the biblical view of suffering and how it is a powerful mindset and tool in our lives.Download Free Thinghttp://marriageprayerchallenge.com/Topic NOTESI have bee systematically teaching through 1st peter and last week we got to chapter 4:1-Devotional - what are we learning from the WordRomans 8 "Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, arm yourselves with the same way of thinking, for whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, 2 so as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh no longer for human passions but for the will of God. 3 For the time that is past suffices for doing what the Gentiles want to do, living in sensuality, passions, drunkenness, orgies, drinking parties, and lawless idolatry."Suffering as a believerCease from sinDepriving my flesh is sufferingBeing in human nature and submitting to God is telling your flesh noChoosing to walk in the SpiritUniversal doctrine sufferingRomans 8 to explain whoever suffers … putting away of flesh is causing our flesh to suffer“want to do, living in sensuality, passions, drunkenness, orgies, drinking parties, and lawless idolatry.We have been freed from the “want to do” God gives us new desires new cravings. As we walk in our new selves it growsDefine:Sensuality - Not just sexualTHE WORLDLY DEFINITION IS PURELY SEXUAL.THE BIBLICAL USE is: unbridled lustLiving for pleasure of every sense - pleasing the 5 senses rather than pleasing GodFROM WIKIPEDIA: Hedonism is a school of thought that argues pleasure and suffering are the only components of well-being. Ethical hedonism is the view that combines hedonism with welfarist ethics, which claim that what we should do depends exclusively on what affects the well-being individuals have. Ethical hedonists would defend either increasing pleasure and reducing suffering for all beings capable of experiencing them, or just reducing suffering in the casePassions - Not just what are you passionate about in lifeBeing controlled by our emotions and serving our emotions vs pleasing God - affected by sensuality in that when we are not feeling good or something not pleasing instead of suffering we let our emotional response dictate our actions - flesh isn't getting what it wants so our choice is to suffer in the flesh and choose to walk in the spirit or suffer in the spirit and walk in flesh they are opposedDrunkenness - Not just being drunk from intoxicationOvertaken by a substance or something out side your bodyProverbs 20:1 "Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise."Ephesians 5:18 "And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,"Removal of natural function - (Inhibition) ConscienceOrgies - Not just a sexual experienceOverindulgenceGiving into your flesh never satiated never enoughEcclesiastes 1:8 "All things are full of weariness; a man cannot utter it; the eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor the ear filled with hearing."HISTORICAL "secret rites used in the worship of Bacchus, Dionysus, and other Greek and Roman deities, celebrated with dancing, drunkenness, and singing."Drinking parties - Not just drinking at a party or hosting one intentionallyIt is inviting others to partake with you in all of the aboveNo one likes to feel the weight of shame or guilt alone so if theyMisery loves companyApproval so you can keep doing itWhy godly fellowship is so importantLawless Idolatry - All of this ends with self-worshipHow I feel what I want what I pursueOpposite of dying to self or taking up crossEach one shows the progress of worshipping self vs the CreatorPrayerDear Lord,Thank you for your word and how it cuts us to the heart. Thank you for teaching us through your word. We pray your word would continue to transform us as we learn it and choose to walk out all that you command us to. We pray we would be people who recognize parts of our hearts that need to change, sin that needs to be repented of, motivations that are not pure, and actions that do not reflect your ways for the purpose of repentance and reconciliation and growth. May your will be done in us and through us. May your light shine brightly through our marriages as we encourage one another to draw closer to you.In Jesus’ name, amen! READ TRANSCRIPT- [Aaron] Hey, We're Aaron and Jennifer Smith with Marriage After God. - [Jennifer] Helping you cultivate an extraordinary marriage. - [Aaron] And today we're going to talk about why suffering is good for us. Welcome to the Marriage After God Podcast where we believe that marriage was meant for more than just happily ever after. - [Jennifer] I'm Jennifer, also known as Unveiled Wife. - [Aaron] And I'm Aaron, also known as Husband Revolution. - [Jennifer] We have been married for over a decade - [Aaron] And so far we have four young children. - [Jennifer] We have been doing marriage ministry online for over seven years through blogging and social media. - [Aaron] With the desire to inspire couples to keep God at the center of their marriage, encouraging them to walk in faith every day. - [Jennifer] We believe the Christian marriage should be an extraordinary one, full of life. - Love. - And power. - [Aaron] That can only be found by chasing after God. - [Jennifer] Together. - [Aaron] Thank for joining us in this journey as we chase boldly after God's will for our life together. - [Jennifer] This is Marriage After God. - [Aaron] Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of the Marriage After God Podcast. - [Jennifer] Hi. - [Aaron] We love you guys. I just wanna say, the first episode of this season of this year, I think it got up to number 32 or 33 on the charts in iTunes. So that's all because of our listeners. - [Jennifer] Thank you guys! - [Aaron] Downloading all of these episodes, your guys rock, I just wanna say thank you. - [Jennifer] Hopefully they liked it, you know, thought it was a good episode to kick off the year with. - [Aaron] Yeah, if you liked it, share about the episode, take a screenshot of it, post it on Instagram, Facebook, tag us in it, we love seeing those. - [Jennifer] @MarriageAfterGod. - [Aaron] And we might even share about your post on our Instagram account. - [Jennifer] That'd be awesome. Okay, so Aaron, why don't you just give a little update where you at, how's your week, what's going on? - [Aaron] I think we talked about it last time. I'm starting to get up earlier. For a while I've been getting up around 5:30 and going to the gym, I've been doing that for a couple years now and recently I told you, Jennifer, that I wanted to get up even earlier. - [Jennifer] I was shocked actually. - [Aaron] To give myself an hour in the morning to get in the Word 'cause remarkably if I don't purpose to do it, it doesn't happen. So I figured what's the best way to do that. - [Jennifer] Or your amount of time spent in it wasn't as much. - [Aaron] Yeah, and so I figured the best thing to do would be get up earlier. - [Jennifer] Okay, so now what does your morning routine look like? - [Aaron] So I've been getting up a four, my alarm goes off at four, and then I hit snooze a couple times. I've been getting up around 4:20, 4:30. - [Jennifer] Now, the first time you did it, I was woken up because usually you sneak out of the house pretty quietly. - I turned the light on. - You turned every light on. - [Aaron] I didn't turn every light on. - [Jennifer] It was so bright and then I was up at 4:30. - [Aaron] What the problem was is I forget to set all of my stuff out the night before and I couldn't find anything. - You weren't prepared. - I wasn't prepared. You should always be prepared. If you wanna have a good morning routine. - Good marriage. - Oh. - Oh. - [Aaron] If you wanna have a good morning routine and a good marriage, prepare, put your stuff out, get everything ready that you're gonna be grabbing, so you don't have to look for it and scavenge. - [Jennifer] And I'm just using it, I'm not even mad about it. I went back to bed. - [Aaron] I mean I'm only a few days into it and it hasn't been terrible because I go to the gym now earlier and I'll say this, I really enjoyed going to Starbucks and sitting down, there's no one there, and getting into the Word, that was awesome. And also I started back up doing my intermittent fasting. - [Jennifer] You did that for a while like a year ago. - [Aaron] Yeah, and I only stopped because I was just trying to do something different, get more calories. But I'm going back to it because I feel like I got too much calories. - [Jennifer] Okay. - [Aaron] I really like intermittent fasting. And if you don't know what intermittent fasting is go look it up, it's pretty cool. - [Jennifer] Why don't you just explain real quick briefly what you mean. - [Aaron] Essentially you fast for 16 hours and then you have an eight hour window of eating. Essentially you just miss breakfast. - [Jennifer] I was gonna say most of us fast throughout the night, but this is more intentional, don't have that before-bedtime snack or anything. - [Aaron] Yeah, I'll usually not eat from seven o'clock until 11 or noon the next day. Which is not always easy. - [Jennifer] You also fit in those calories at lunch and dinner 'cause you work out, they know you do CrossFit, you lift heavy weights so you need that energy. - [Aaron] Yeah, I need enough. But it also does help me maintain how much I'm eating and it also makes me think about what I'm eating so I eat better instead of just spreading all those calories out. Anyways I've gotten back into that and kinda liking it. - [Jennifer] Awesome, very cool. Okay you guys, we also wanna encourage you to sign up right now for the Marriage Prayer Challenge if you have not done that yet. It's really awesome. Aaron, how many couples have already joined? - [Aaron] Almost 30,000 couples. There's actually a number counter on the sign up page, and it's a real number counter. I didn't make it up or faked it, it's actually counting people that sign up. - [Jennifer] Okay, so you just go to MarriagePrayerChallenge.com you can sign up for the husband version or the wife version and what do they get? - [Aaron] They're gonna get a email every day around the time that they signed up, giving them a prompt and a reminder to pray for their spouse. - [Jennifer] Awesome, come on you guys, go sign up, it's awesome. - [Aaron] Yeah, so it's MarriagePrayerChallenge.com. Completely free, just give us your email and your name and boom, you'll start getting those emails every day for 30 days. - [Jennifer] So today's topic is on why suffering is good for us. And we're not just talking about physical suffering or sickness or things like that, but we're gonna get into, well we're just gonna get into something that you spoke on recently Aaron that really, really moved me because I love it when you can look at Scripture and see it a different way, I need that help sometimes, someone else coming in and going, "Hey, look at this, this is awesome." So I just wanna dig in. So this is kind of like a devotional style episode. - [Aaron] Yeah, Jennifer and I came up with this idea to do one devotional focused episode every month and so this will be that one. And the topic is something I actually taught on this last Sunday. And you said, "Hey, we should "do an episode on that teaching." So that's what we're gonna do. We'll talk about stuff I brought up from Scripture and then you might have some questions for me, but it's pretty cool, and it's on a very small section of Scripture. - [Jennifer] I'll say this, one reason that I love that you're my husband is that you teach me and I love that. I love that you can look at Scripture and teach me from it and so I'm excited about this episode because I feel like you're gonna have the opportunity to teach others with the same impact that you've had in my life just over this one Scripture. - [Aaron] Well thank you, that's awesome. - [Jennifer] Keep it up, Aaron. - [Aaron] I wanna emphasize that my hope and prayer is that whenever I'm teaching the Word of God that it's not my opinion, not my own flavor of things, but that I'm just trying to clearly teach what the Word of God is saying. So I hope that's what I'm doing right now. - [Jennifer] Yeah, it's good. - [Aaron] So I'll just kick it off that the section of Scripture that we're going to be discussing is mainly from I Peter, chapter four. And it's only the first four verses, which is gonna be the chunk of what we're talking about. And it doesn't sound like a lot of Scripture, but there's actually a lot in here. We're also gonna dig into Romans eight, and that has a little bit more, so there's still a lot of reading. - [Aaron] There's a lot of Scripture to help give context to these few lines of text. So are we gonna start out with you reading I Peter? - Yeah. - Like give 'em just the context of what we're going to be talking about? - [Aaron] So it's actually verses one through three, I'm gonna read it right now, starting at verse one. "Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh, "arm yourselves with the same way of thinking. "For whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin, "so as to live the rest of the time in the flesh, "no longer for human passions, but for the will of God. "For the time that is past suffices for doing "what the Gentiles want to do, living in sensuality, "passions, drunkenness, orgies, "drinking parties, and lawless idolatry." - [Jennifer] Okay, so before we jump into these set of Scriptures, can you just expand a little bit about when it comes to doctrine and universal doctrine? - [Aaron] Yeah, so I start off this teaching actually on Sunday just explaining how when we come up with doctrine, which are the fundamental things that a believer should walk in, teach. These are the things that are core, doctrines in the Word of God. A doctrine, in order for it to be a doctrine, it's gotta be universal. You can't pull something from Scripture and say, "This is doctrine, but it doesn't apply "in Iran, it doesn't apply in Africa, "it doesn't apply in the suburbs." - [Jennifer] Right, or just certain groups of people. Or certain churches. - [Aaron] Right, so if we interpret or pull things from Scripture that isn't universally applied when taught then it's gotta be interpreted through universal doctrine. So that you can't just pull that and say, "Well, that's doctrine." And one example of this would be the prosperity gospel, this idea that God wants every single person to be wealthy, and perfectly healthy, which isn't backed up with Scripture at all. - [Jennifer] We also don't see it in real life. - [Aaron] Yeah, you don't see it played out. There's people all over the world that are not wealthy or healthy, but they love the Lord, God uses them, this is reality on both sides. We see Scripture, like in Ecclesiastes that God gives rain to the evil and the good, evil and the righteous. So there are certain things that he has a certain level of blessing on every person, he gives breath, he gives the sunlight, he gives rain, he gives food, sustenance, regardless of how they are. So the prosperity gospel in the sense of God wants you to prosper financially and with possessions doesn't work universally. But what does work, and this is where I ended off was the universal doctrine of suffering. Without suffering there is no salvation. Christ learned obedience through the things that he suffered. He says that believers will suffer. - [Jennifer] Which kicks us off for this verse that you read, which I don't know if you wanna read it again. - [Aaron] Yeah, it says, "Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh," it doesn't say suffered in the spirit, he suffered in the flesh. It says, "Arm yourselves with this same way of thinking." - [Jennifer] Not just some of you, not just you over there in the corner, arm yourself. - [Aaron] Yeah, it tells every believer to arm themselves with this way of thinking of understanding the suffering of Christ. - [Jennifer] And the suffering of the flesh. - [Aaron] And the suffering in the flesh, which we're gonna get into. So when I say doctrine, this idea that suffering is a doctrinal teaching. We cannot subtract it from Scripture, we cannot subtract it from the Christian life. We cannot say, "Yeah, that's good, but only for Christ, "and then he doesn't want his children to suffer." He says, "If I suffered, you will also suffer. "They hated me, they're gonna hate you." These are all things that the Bible teaches and no matter where you go in the world, it doesn't matter where you live it should be something that is taught and understood by the believer this idea, this doctrine of suffering. But there's many types of suffering. And what we wanna talk about right now is what is this talking about. What am I arming myself when realizing Christ suffered? What's the weapon that I'm using? And what it is is an understanding of what suffering is for the believer and why it's so good for us in the varying aspects. 'Cause the first thing we think of probably is suffering, massive pain or loss, which is definitely a form of suffering. But really what suffering is at the base level is our flesh-- - Dying to ourselves, yeah. - Yeah, dying. That's what suffering is. When Jesus says, "Take up your cross and follow me," the cross is the instrument of death of your flesh, your body. You put a body on it and it dies there. And so suffering in the sense that we're gonna talk about is not just this overtly physical suffering. It's telling our flesh no, that's suffering. And as we go through this scripture, we'll see that more and more. But that's what we wanna get the believer, everyone listening to understand is we shouldn't be running from suffering. We shouldn't fear the idea that our flesh is gonna endure some sort of discomfort and pain and that we're not gonna always get what we want and we're gonna have to tell ourselves no and these are all forms of telling our flesh no, it's suffering. The body suffers when it doesn't get what it wants, that's suffering. When you feel pain, it's something that the body doesn't want, which is why you get that pain signal saying, "Hey, this is not good, stop it." - [Jennifer] Right, we really hope that this episode is encouraging to you guys and gives you a fresh perspective of how suffering is good for us, especially in context to our sin nature and the suffering of our flesh. - [Aaron] Which is the exact purpose of this. Of putting away that sin nature and having the spirit of God win and not the flesh. - [Jennifer] Do you wanna jump in to Romans eight? - [Aaron] Yeah, 'cause Romans eight gives us a perfect context for the second part of the scripture that says "Arm yourselves with the same way of thinking." Right, so we realize that Christ suffered in the flesh, we can have the same way of thinking of recognizing the suffering of our flesh is a weapon against something. And it says, "For whoever has suffered "in the flesh has ceased from sin." And this can be taken very literally, which it should be, I think because if we have perfectly suffered the way Christ has we would have perfectly ceased from sin because once we're dead and gone with God there's no more sin in us. But we're in the flesh, so it says, "Whoever suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin," and I think Romans eight perfectly clarifies what this is saying, and it says this in Romans eight, verse one, "There is therefore now no condemnation "for those who are in Christ Jesus." First and foremost believer, believe this. "There is therefore now no condemnation "for those who are in Christ Jesus. "For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free "in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death." So what has set you free from the law of sin and death? It's Christ and his Spirit, right? It says, "For God has done what the law, "weakened by our flesh, could not do. "By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh "and for sin he condemned sin in the flesh "in order that the righteous requirement of the law "might be fulfilled in us who walk not according to "the flesh, but according to the Spirit." - [Jennifer] I feel like you should reiterate that last part. - [Aaron] What he's saying is the law, which is good, and perfect, and righteous couldn't save any man because man has weak flesh. In our flesh we cannot fulfill the law. But Christ did fulfill the law in his own flesh. Right? And so what it's saying is that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us through the putting away of our flesh through Christ. - [Jennifer] Right, I just love that last part that you just read, it says, "Who walk not according to the flesh, "but according to the Spirit," which is foundational to what we're gonna be teaching from I Peter and it's a choice, they're all choices, right? - [Aaron] These are choices that the believer have because we've been set free, so we have the freedom to now choose righteousness rather than only being obedient to sin. - [Jennifer] Right, and it's through our actions that we walk according not to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. - [Aaron] Right, so this says, "Walk not according to the flesh," so if you take anyone who has suffered in the flesh and say, "Anyone who walks not according to the flesh, "but according to the Spirit ceases from sin," that's kind of what this is saying. This is verse five, "For those who live according "to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, "but those who live according to the Spirit "set their minds on the things of the Spirit." - [Jennifer] Okay, I gotta stop you again because I feel like there's often, I'm sure everybody can relate to this, but when you struggle with sin, and you wrestle with those temptations that come, your mind is on it, right, like when your mind is set on something that your flesh desires and wants to do it doesn't go away until either you do it or you tell it no. - [Aaron] Which is suffering. And this is where we're trying to define this. - [Jennifer] But that whole setting your mind, it starts there. - [Aaron] And it says this, "For to set the mind "on the flesh is death, but to set the mind "on the Spirit is life and peace." - [Jennifer] Raise your hand if you want life and peace. - [Aaron] "For the mind that is set "on the flesh is hostile to God." - [Jennifer] I don't want that. - [Aaron] Hostile, like you're an enemy of God when your mind's on the flesh, "For it does not submit to God's law, indeed it cannot. "Those who are in the flesh cannot please God." So when the Bible tells us that the flesh and the Spirit are opposed to each other, are against each other, that's what this is saying. Saying when you're walking in the flesh you can't please God, you're an enemy. When you walk in the Spirit, you please God. And it's God's Spirit that we walk in. And then it says this, "You," believer, "however "are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, "if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. "Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ "does not belong to him. "But if Christ is in you, "although the body is dead because of sin, "the Spirit is life because of righteousness." So remember we said whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin? Let's put it this way, although the body is dead, suffered in the flesh because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. So the Spirit that God's put in us has brought to life our mortal bodies, and listen to this, verse 11, "If the Spirit of him "who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, "He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead "will also give life to your mortal bodies "through his Spirit who dwells in you." So I thought this Scripture perfectly illustrated what says right here when it says, "For whoever has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin. "So as to live for the rest of the time in the flesh "no longer for human passions, but for the will of God." So when we're gonna get more and more right now into this idea of suffering in the flesh, it's this idea of walking in the Spirit and not the flesh as Romans also says. When you gratify the desires of the flesh you cannot please God, right? But if you walk in the Spirit, you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. Right? - Yeah. - [Aaron] So this is what this is getting to, Peter's talking here, and he's explaining how Christ suffering in the flesh has done this for us. Has given us a way to suffer in our flesh, not in a way of self-salvation because we can't, Christ already did it. His suffering was sufficient. But because of his suffering and from his own words 'cause he left and went home to be with the Father, he sent his helper, the Spirit, to work in us and through us for his will and his work in us. So what we can do now is we can learn to suffer in our flesh via the Holy Spirit. Meaning I don't gratify the desires of my flesh. So when you want a donut, I love donuts. - [Jennifer] I love donuts. - [Aaron] Or you want that new car, or you want your neighbor's thing, coveting, right? Or you want to avoid shame so you lie, these are all fruit of the flesh, these are all things to protect your flesh. I don't like the way that feels, I don't wanna be embarrassed, I don't wanna look shameful, I have pride, I don't want them to think this way about me. It's all the flesh, so suffering is, like here's a form of suffering in the flesh, humbleness. That's painful, humbling yourself. Getting down on your knees and saying, "I am this thing, I did this thing, I said this, "and I want to be forgiven by You." Like humbling yourself, recognizing you're not that great of a person is suffering, is telling your flesh no. I'd rather you suffer and my spirit be lifted up. - [Jennifer] So you started out that little lineup of things that people struggle with was a donut so can you just explain, 'cause eating a donut doesn't have to deal with humility, what does it have to deal with? - [Aaron] Well again, our flesh, and I explained this on Sunday, I was talking about how our brains work. Our brain matter, it's flesh, it's a compilation of cells and there's these chemicals that get released and you have sensors, and receptors, and you have all these things that God gave us to work a certain way, pleasure sensors and pain sensors and all these things, and those are all the flesh. Now what the point is is that you don't just shut 'em all off. It's to put them into submission to the Spirit. So a donut right, having a donut's not sinful. Like, oh, a donut's good. But not having any control and letting your senses control you is not walking in the Spirit, it's walking in the flesh. Like that See Food diet, I see food and I eat it. That's not having any control, the Spirit's not in charge, your conscience isn't in charge, it's, "Oh I see it and I'm gonna put it "in my mouth and eat it." - [Jennifer] So the donut can represent a lot of different things. - [Aaron] Think about pornography. Like you're not controlling your flesh. You're saying, "Flesh, you can have whatever you want." - [Jennifer] That's not suffering. - [Aaron] No, well we suffer in the Spirit. - [Jennifer] And we suffer the consequences. - [Aaron] Yeah, we suffer the consequences, but you're not causing your flesh to suffer, telling your flesh, "No, I don't want you to have it. "I know you want that, I know you crave it, "I know you think that's gonna be good for you, "but the Spirit of God that's in me says no." - [Jennifer] That's good. Okay, so I wanna move on because there's a lot of clarity that comes from this next verse and how you broke it down, which is what impacted me probably the most out of this teaching. And so I'm gonna reread the verse, it's verse three, it says, "For the time that is past suffices "for doing what the Gentiles want to do," and I remember you stopped and said, "Underline that." - Underline want to do. - Want to do. 'Cause our flesh wants to do a lot of things. You just gave those examples. "Living in sensualities, passions, drunkenness, "orgies, drinking parties, and lawless idolatries. - [Aaron] You've read this a lot, right? - [Jennifer] Yeah, I've read this a lot, but I need to explain because I'm sure people relate to me on this. When you read certain scriptures, it's not that you don't say, "And I know I'm not perfect, "I know that there's sin in my life, "and I'm willing to have open eyes "and for God to reveal that to me, "but when I read this I go, 'well, I'm not really "'struggling with those things, "'I don't really have drinking parties or whatever.'" But you broke it down in a way that makes this verse relatable to all sinners. And so I wanna share that. - [Aaron] And let's remember what the context of this is. Christ's suffering, being armed with this way of thinking, recognizing that our flesh, having our flesh suffer while walking in the Spirit is how we cease from sin, it is how we walk the way God wants us to. And so he gives the contrast, he says, "For the time that has past suffices for doing "what the Gentiles want to do." Now when it says, "Gentiles," it's meaning Godless people. Gentiles were anyone that wasn't a Jewish person. And so what he's pointing out is not specifically Gentiles, he's saying anyone doesn't have God, isn't walking with God. And want to do, saying this is the way they want to be. And then it says, "Living in sensualities, "passions, drunkenness," and what I did is I broke down what these things are. - [Jennifer] And how they're all related. - 'Cause they're specific. - Yeah, they're very specific, and I didn't realize that they were even related. I just thought it was one of those lists, you know? - [Aaron] Again, if you're listening and you have your Bible, the want to do part. Okay, it's want to live in sensuality, and passions, and drunkenness, orgies, drinking parties, and lawless idolatry, right? And like you said, "Well see I don't "struggle with those things." And maybe someone like me that struggled with pornography might point out sensuality and passions like okay, yeah, but I've never done orgies, that's not me. But I wanna highlight that through Christ and his suffering and him giving us of his Holy Spirit we've been freed from the want to do, right? He's changing our desires to be his, he's giving us a hatred of sin because he hates sin. - [Jennifer] And I think in conjunction, the convictions become stronger and so we hear the Holy Spirit loud and clear when we go to do something that we shouldn't be doing, right? - [Aaron] Our prayer and constant desire should be that he's consistently giving us new desires and new cravings. I pray, "Lord, give me a craving for your Word." I don't naturally in my flesh have enough craving for God's Word, let alone reading. Sorry if you relate to that, reading's not something I just crave to do, but there's some people that love reading. But I want God to change those desires so the want to do is an amazing thing that God's freed us from that we're no longer slaves to sin. That's the want to do. - [Jennifer] We're not slaves to our flesh. - [Aaron] We're not slaves to our flesh, God severed that slavery with his Spirit. And now we can actually walk in that Spirit when we focus on that Spirit and we walk in his ways in his Word, that's how this works. So I'm gonna define some of these things. Sensuality, it's not just sexual. Our definition of sensuality is usually very sexual and this absolutely does mean sexual, sensuality. But it's not only sexual. Sexual's one sense. It's one sense being usually this physical pleasure. - [Jennifer] That's what comes to my mind when I think about it. - [Aaron] But sensuality in the biblical use is unbridled lust. Unbridled lust. This idea of lust, I see something, I take it. So think about your five senses, sensual, it's a sensation experience. You're looking for you five senses to be pleasured. I want my eyes to see the most beautiful things. - [Jennifer] Or whatever I want them to see. - [Aaron] Or whatever I want them to see. I want my hands to touch whatever is gonna make my mind feel good. - [Jennifer] I want my mouth to say whatever I feel. - [Aaron] Or taste, right? So you think about your five senses and sensuality is living to please your five senses with whatever pleases your five senses. That's what sensuality is. Often, sexual things encompass all of them, which is why it's usually accompanied with sensuality as a sexual thing because sexual things please pretty much all your senses. But food, music, all of these things, not that those things in themselves are sinful, I want everyone to clearly hear me. It's living in a way that you want your senses pleased. 'Cause that's the opposite of suffering. That's the opposite of suffering. It's living for pleasure in every sense. You want your five senses taken care of, and if anyone of them are hindered or hurt or suffer, you're not happy, and something's wrong, and God must be angry or I'm not close to God. - [Jennifer] And you can see this in the flesh when you feel the conviction of either someone saying something to you about something that you're doing or the Holy Spirit just does it and you feel defensive. You immediately wanna justify that thing that it's not that bad, or that it's this or that it's that and you become, you wanna fight for it. There's gotta be a way that I can still have this in my life. - [Aaron] Yeah, so example of this is you're doing something and you're not recognizing it, and a brother or sister in Christ comes up and says, "Hey, I noticed that you're talking a certain way "or you did this certain thing." And you're like, "Don't judge me, get out of my way." And you immediately feel like you've been judged or wronged or hurt. In reality, you're just getting checked in your spirit and your flesh doesn't like it. - [Jennifer] I also wanna be realistic, most people don't say, "Don't judge me." What they'll do is say, "Oh, okay," and then never talk to that person again. They don't even communicate. - [Aaron] Or say, "Well let's just agree to disagree instead of again, suffering the flesh, humbling yourself and saying, "Maybe there is something I need to grow on." - [Jennifer] Or, "Man, that recognition alone just hurt. "And I'm gonna walk in that for a little bit "and see where God wants to take it." - [Aaron] So I wanna read this, I read this from Wikipedia. It's the definition of hedonism, which by the way, is this idea of pleasure-centered living. Like I'm looking to please all my senses, hedonism. "And it's a school of thought," this is what Wikipedia says, "Hedonism is a school of thought "that argues pleasure and suffering "are the only components of well-being. "Ethical hedonism is the view that combines "hedonism with welfarist ethics, "which claim that what we should do depends exclusively on what effects "the well-being individuals have. "Ethical hedonists would defend "either increasing pleasure or reducing suffering "for all beings capable of experiencing them "or just reducing suffering." So think about that. It's as long as I'm not suffering, I'm happy. Or I wanna be pleasured, and if I can't have pleasure I just don't wanna suffer. Now I want everyone listening to think about that 'cause we have areas in our life, Jennifer and I, we were talking about this that we think this way. Like, "Oh, I'm good with all this as long as "I don't have to go without food for a day." Or "As long as I'm not gonna feel this pain over here "or I'm not gonna have to say no to my flesh in this area." Right, we all have this level of pleasure-centered focus or at least avoidance of suffering. That's what this idea of hedonism is. - [Jennifer] Basically if we're living to pleasure our five senses we can't possibly be pleasing or pleasuring God. - [Aaron] Exactly because he might ask us to do something that doesn't feel good. Right? - Yeah. - [Aaron] And so a litmus test is for us to ask ourselves in those situations when we feel like we're just, it doesn't feel good, something's going on, we're having this emotional, which I'm about to talk about, we can ask ourselves, am I trying to avoid letting my flesh suffer a little bit? Am I trying to avoid saying no to my flesh? - [Jennifer] Okay, so the next one is passions and when I think of the word, passions, I immediately think of things that I'm either passionate about or people who've said-- - [Aaron] It's usually a positive thing, yeah. - [Jennifer] "I'm just a passionate person." But yeah, it's usually a positive thing or maybe it has to do with extracurricular activities or something like that. But why don't you share more about that? - [Aaron] So passions, the definition of passions in the dictionary is essentially uncontrolled or emotional outbursts. It's this like passion outburst of anger, which the Bible says wrath is not good, "The wrath of man does not produce "the righteousness of God." And wrath is an uncontrolled, emotional outburst. Or uncontrollable sadness, or uncontrollable joy or happiness. I'm just trying to get whatever emotions these are, out. And what this idea is is someone who lives purely off their emotions. Like, "Oh, I'm not happy, so things are wrong." But you know what, you know how many stories there are in the Bible of people that, like a lot of David's songs or him not happy. Now they still end joyfully 'cause he knows who his Lord is and his Redeemer, but he's in the muck and the mire. He's in a cave, cold and scared, the emotional, passionate person who lives by their emotions would say, "David was doing something wrong because he wasn't happy," but that's not true. David was right where God had him, he was doing what he could do in God's will. Now I'm not saying emotions are bad. God's given us all of these things. Our senses are good things. Our passions, our emotions are good things, but these are fleshly things, meaning if they're the things that drive us and dictate us then the Spirit of God is not. - [Jennifer] Yeah, I was just gonna say if someone's motivated to maintain a certain emotion or are drawn out of their emotions to act, they can't serve their emotions and serve God. - [Aaron] A good example in Scripture says, "Be angry and do not sin." - [Jennifer] So that's a perfect example of having and experiencing an emotion-- - [Aaron] But not letting it control you. - [Jennifer] But not letting it control you and not acting out of it. - [Aaron] Yeah, you know how hard it is to love someone who is harming you or doing you wrong? But that's what Scripture calls us to do. - Because Christ did it. - Because Christ did it. So, there's things that our emotions will want us to do, wrath, outbursts, laughter, like lots of things. But God wants the Spirit to be in control, not our emotions. And I wanna add to this, often, so based on the sensuality things when our five senses aren't being met with what they want that's when our emotions react. I'm hungry, you know the whole term, "I'm hangry." So you're having a sense, one of your five senses not being taken care of. - [Jennifer] Your emotions heighten. - [Aaron] And so you let your emotions go to get what you want, right? That is not being in self-control. That is not walking by the Spirit, that's walking in the flesh. And so I broke these down all like this to show us that this way of being is not the way the believer should be. That doesn't mean we're not gonna fall into our emotions at times, we're not to be these emotionless robots. What happens is God's given us a way to walk in the Spirit, even amidst the heaviest emotional times. Like sadness and brokenness and fear, and we can walk in the Spirit in those things. - [Jennifer] Yeah, how do you submit those to God and walk righteously amidst feeling those really deep things? - [Aaron] So it all goes back to the, men, this is a universal doctrine that it doesn't matter where you're at, it doesn't matter what you're going through, God has given you the freedom and through the Spirit of God to rise above those things and to appropriate those emotions where they belong. In your sadness to go to God and weep before him. And he says, "I've bottled up every tear." So knowing that we can actually run to the Father, "I'm so angry right now, God, take my anger from me. "Show me how to not be angry with my wife, or my husband." - [Jennifer] My kids. - [Aaron] Or we can just handle it ourselves and let's just take that emotion, and let's just-- - Run with it. - Run with it. And what usually happens, and everyone's thinking about those things when they've let their emotions run, we regret it every time. And we look back and we say, "Well, that wasn't godly, "that was not what Christ would've done." - [Jennifer] Or "Man, I just wish I was different." When we can be, it's just the choices we're making. - [Aaron] So I wanna go on to the next part, which-- - [Jennifer] Feels like an obvious one. - Right, drunkenness. - Drunkenness. Well, it's not just intoxication though. - [Aaron] Well, you're right. - [Jennifer] It is, when you look up the definition, drunkenness, it's being intoxicated by something like alcohol. - [Aaron] Right, and this is clearly talking about no believer should get drunk. - [Jennifer] The Bible talks too much about being sober minded. - [Aaron] And not being drunk specifically. So I do wanna clarify I'm not saying this doesn't mean you can go get drunk. No believer should be getting drunk ever. - [Jennifer] All of these things mean what they are. They also have-- - Deeper spiritual meanings. - Deeper spiritual meanings that we can apply to address our sinful nature. - [Aaron] So let's talk about what drunkenness is. Yes, it's being drunk on alcohol or some sort of drug. Your mind, it's overtaken by something else, which is essentially what drunkenness is. You're allowing a substance, an external force to take over your flesh, that's what drunkenness is. You drink enough alcohol, what happens? The Bible talks about it, you start saying things you would never say out loud, you start acting a way you would never act. - [Jennifer] I always say that or associated it with the word uncontrolled, like that person's uncontrolled right now, but I never considered the aspect of it you actually being controlled by that thing that you just ingested. - [Aaron] Yeah, and I'll give an example, Proverbs 20, verse one says, "Wine is a mocker." So it's saying that the alcohol has an influence to cause you to mock. "Strong drink a brawler." Wants you to fight. All of these things are very fleshly things. "And whoever is led astray by it is not wise." So now nowhere in Scripture does it say you're not allowed to drink. Now some people will take it that way, and we're talking about alcohol so I'm just bringing it up. But 100% absolutely no believer should be getting drunk on anything. But the next thing I'm gonna talk about. And it says, "Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, "and whoever is led astray," so I've given myself over to this substance, this thing to now do what it wants with me. Like not as if it's a real person, but we have these basic, all these things that are talking about the flesh, we have these basic ways of being in the deep parts of us. - [Jennifer] It's the way he designed us, like he designed us to-- - [Aaron] But he wants it under control. Not let go of. And so the other part I wanna say is in Ephesians five, 18 it says, "Do not get drunk "with wine," again there's a direct command, don't get drunk with wine, "For that is debauchery. "But be filled with the Spirit." So it's saying, don't let your flesh go by letting it be overtaken with wine, alcohol, other substances, but be filled with the Spirit of God. - [Jennifer] This also shows that deeper spiritual meaning of what we're trying to show here when you talk about drunkenness because drunken by the Spirit, that sounds weird, but it's because of that deeper meaning that we're talking about. - [Aaron] And at the base level of what drunkenness is, it's literally the removal of the natural functions that God's put in us, that inhibition in us, that conscience, that ability and restraint that is naturally in us to like, maybe there's something I wanna say, but I'm not gonna say it 'cause that's not appropriate. You're drunk and it just comes out of your mouth. So what you're doing is you're living in the sensuality way you want all your senses met, you're living with your emotions and then you wanna be drunk and you want to release the natural built in barriers that God's given you to protect you from doing or saying-- - [Jennifer] Sinful things. - [Aaron] Yeah, things that don't honor you, don't honor others, don't honor God. And so again, it's like this, I wanna just let it all out, I don't want any control, it's the exact opposite of self-control. It's no control. Which then leads us into the awkward one, orgies. - [Jennifer] Which everybody's thinking sexual experience. - [Aaron] Which again, it means that. - [Jennifer] It is, but it also means more than that. - [Aaron] Right, if you look at orgies at the base idea of what an orgy is, it's overindulgence. So all the things we just talked about, it's doing all of it without restraint. - [Jennifer] Yeah, no barriers, no limitations, as long as you want, as much as you want. - [Aaron] Yeah, oh and that was another good donut. - [Jennifer] That was a good box of donuts. - [Aaron] Those two boxes of donuts were amazing, right, but of course I would feel gross after that. Or alcohol, like alcoholics, they don't restrain themselves. And we're talking about these things that go in the mouth, but think about anything. Anything in your life that you don't want any restraint on. - [Jennifer] So it's overindulgence, and it's giving into your flesh, and you're never satisfied, you're never satiated. - [Aaron] Yeah, when you're in the flesh-- - It's never enough. - The flesh never has enough. You know who says this, Solomon says it in Ecclesiastes one, eight. It says, "All things are full of weariness, "a man cannot utter it. "The eye is not satisfied with seeing, "nor the ear filled with hearing." - [Jennifer] Okay so just that made me think of the porn industry. They get hooked at an early age, but then it's not enough to gratify what their eye is seeing, so it gets worse and worse, deeper and deeper into these things that are just wicked. - [Aaron] And worse and worse and worse and worse and worse. - [Jennifer] And still yet never satisfied. - [Aaron] And this is like the exact opposite of what Christ wants for us. In that verse it says, "The time has past that suffices," means we've done enough of this. Literally he's saying that we have freedom from this unsatisfied, never ending cycle. - [Jennifer] Well, what did Christ say to the woman at the well? - [Aaron] Oh, yeah, so the woman comes to him and she asks for water and he says, "If you would ask me I would have given you water "that you would never thirst again." And she says, "Where's this water, give it to me." - [Jennifer] So it's this contrast of allow your flesh to rule you and never be satisfied or walk in the Spirit and be who you are in Christ with freedom and be completely satisfied. - [Aaron] Right, and Christ, God wants us to be satisfied in him alone. And so when we walk in the flesh, like this idea of orgies it's like I just wanna go somewhere that's gonna give me everything I want and as much of it as I can. And this is not the way of the believer. We are satisfied, completely satisfied in Christ. And so this was a historical note, I saw when looking up this idea of orgies, which I did very carefully by the way. - [Jennifer] Which if you think about that. - [Aaron] Yeah, and historically the word comes from, it's a Greek word, orgia or something like that, but what it was was it was a ritual, secret rites used to worship a Roman god. And the Roman god was the god of grapes and vines and caused men to be crazy. So it's this idea of when we have this way of being, we're like, "I just wanna go and I wanna throw "all my inhibition out, and I wanna drink, "and I wanna eat, and I wanna have fun, "and I want my five senses pleased, "and I wanna just be happy." You're literally worshiping something other than God. That's this idea when you walk in the flesh in this way. So we're gonna go to the next one, there's two more, we're almost done. Drinking parties, and this idea of drinking parties is exactly what it says, these parties that you're just going to get drunk. - [Jennifer] Again, in reading the list in Scripture I skip over 'cause I go, "Well, I'm not doing that." - [Aaron] But the deeper idea is parties meaning multiple, meaning many others, meaning you're inviting others to partake in all of this way of being. That's the way that the people that don't know God, the Bible says, "Don't associate with the wicked "for they can't even seep until they've caused bloodshed "or until they've caught people in their snare." Like these ideas of drawing others into the same way of living fleshly. - [Jennifer] And it can be as simple as you're sitting in a room full of friends and you start gossiping. The invitations can be subtle, but I think that the reason people do it is because they don't want to do it alone, they don't want to be alone in their sin. They're seeking approval so if I can get so and so to do it along with me, then there's this sense of approval that it's okay. Or maybe wrestling with the shame and guilt that comes with sin that you wanna forget about and so you have others join in, I mean there's a lot of different reasons why. - [Aaron] Well, I'll give a great example in my own life, and it's something I'm not proud of, but when I was deep into pornography, and I would meet new men in churches there were pastors or they were like older or wiser and deep down inside either I thought, "There's no way that he's not addicted to pornography "just like me," or I hoped that he was because I didn't want to be the only one. And I thought, "No, every single one "of these guys does too." - It's so broken. - It's so broken. So in my mind, this drinking parties idea, this idea of like, "Oh, we're in this together. "He's a sinner like me and he does the same things as I do, "and I actually hoped he did." - [Jennifer] I think this is a good time to caution us to evaluate ourselves. Are we inviting others to partake in sin that maybe we're not recognizing as sin or we've pushed away that conviction from the Holy Spirit and let's ask God this week, "What areas of my life "have I been inviting people to partake "in with me that aren't righteous?" - [Aaron] Well, it first takes that self-evaluation of like, "God, is there anything "in me that you want out of me?" A good example in the marriage, do you remember when we were going through financial stuff? I would let you spend the way we probably shouldn't spend knowing that it would let me spend the way I wanted to spend. - [Jennifer] Right, 'cause then when you would request something I would have to say yes. - [Aaron] Because I'd be like, "Well, I let you get your thing." And essentially we were just pulling each other down. - [Jennifer] That's really good. So in marriage that's often where the invitation starts. - [Aaron] Keyword, drinking party. Don't invite me, just kidding. - [Jennifer] Don't invite me. - [Aaron] Last thing, lawless idolatry. Everything we just walked through is lawless idolatry and here's why. It's self-worship. - [Jennifer] Yeah, how I feel, what I want-- - [Aaron] Is god. - [Jennifer] Well, it should be God. - [Aaron] No, what I was saying is what you feel and what you want is god, is your god. - [Jennifer] Right, is your god. But what we should be saying is-- - [Aaron] "God, what you want." "God, do you want me to be hungry right now?" And I keep talking about these physical things because this is the idea. - [Jennifer] Well, that's where it starts. - [Aaron] We are to be spiritual people. Jesus told the woman at the well that same story. She's talking about where they worship 'cause she was a Samaritan, he's a Jew and he says, "There's gonna be a day "that you will neither worship there or here, "but my people worship me in spirit and in truth." Not worshiping in passions and sensuality and as Jude says, and that happens even in the church. I'm gonna worship God with my senses, and if I don't sense God and feel God, and my senses aren't being met and pleasured by the Spirit of God then I must be far from God. But you know what, there's many people in the Bible that were in the pit. I think of Paul, and he's singing worship songs, naked and cold in prison. In that moment most people would be like, "I don't feel close to God. "He's not helping me, this doesn't feel good." But Paul knew exactly who his savior was and he knew that what he was dealing with as he says in Scripture, he says, "For I have ascertained that my current suffering "is nothing to be compared with the coming glory." What that means is that this temporary suffering, the little bit of saying no in my flesh, the little bit of pain that I feel, the little bit of depraving of my own desires for the sake of God's will and God's thing that he wants done in my life and in others is so little to be compared with the glory that I'm gonna experience when he returns. - [Jennifer] Which is a hopeful message for us as Christians. We should hear that and be like, "Yes, we're in agreeance here." We should be willing to suffer, and this is why suffering in the flesh is good for us. - [Aaron] Yeah, and a lot of people don't like talking about suffering, but this again is a universal doctrine that Christians should understand and walk in that my flesh does not get to win in my life. - [Jennifer] And when we feel those convictions from the Holy Spirit going day to day, whatever it might be, when you don't tell yourself no, you're putting yourself in a place of worship that you should not be in. You're idolizing yourself, you're saying, "God, I'm more important that you." - [Aaron] My comfort's more important that your will. My pleasure's more important that your Word. And so each one of these is like this progress of worshiping self verses Creator. Worshiping the creation rather than the Creator. My comfort, my pleasures, my senses are much more important than what God's doing in my life. - [Jennifer] A dangerous place to be. - [Aaron] And a good example of this is the reason why many people have a hard time getting out of debt or quitting certain addictions or making life changes is because that's too difficult for my flesh to handle, even though God's like, "But I'm gonna "give you the strength to do it." - [Jennifer] Yeah, I think too, just to shed a little bit more perspective on this idea of suffering, I think sometimes we only go so far to see what we would suffer in the midst of saying no to our flesh. So like it's that little bit of-- - [Aaron] "I tried." - [Jennifer] Yeah, but we see what suffering equals when we say no to our flesh, but we don't look beyond that to see what suffering looks like when we don't say no to our flesh, the consequences, the hurt, the pain, the death, the sin that comes. - [Aaron] The shame. - [Jennifer] Because of the choices that we make. And that's what all of this, of what we're talking about today comes down to choice. You're gonna choose to walk in the Spirit or you're gonna choose to gratify the desires of the flesh. - [Aaron] And you know what believer, you're listening to this? - [Jennifer] You have been set free. - [Aaron] Yeah, you're not a slave to sin and death. We can choose to walk in the Spirit that God's given us. He dwells in us, giving life to our mortal bodies. How amazing is that? So this isn't a go suffer and find your righteousness through just self-depravity and self-abasement. That's not what we're talking about. There are some faiths and some religions that believe that. If you just make yourself suffer enough, you'll be righteous. Now the point is we're already righteous, and the way a righteous person walks with the Spirit of God is we don't gratify the desires of our flesh. And when we do, we recognize it, we repent, and we say, "Thank you, Lord, for forgiving me. "And give me your power to walk better next time "to beat that thing that is in my life "because you have beat it on the cross." - [Jennifer] Amen, so here's the charge for us this week and forever. And it's that first part of that verse that you started us off with there and it's, "Since therefore Christ suffered in the flesh," our Christ, our Lord, our Savior suffered in the flesh, "Arm yourself with the same way of thinking." We have to think like him. - [Aaron] This current fleshly body we live in is temporary and the simplest way to put this is Jesus says, "Take up your cross and follow me." The cross is the instrument of the death of our flesh. So let's crawl up on that cross and let's take it with us and let's ask the Holy Spirit, "Lord, teach me. "Teach me how to say no to my flesh "when it craves things that are in opposition to you." Some of us struggle with pride, I just wanna throw that one in there, that's a flesh thing. That's pride, that's the flesh wanting to be elevated and recognized, rather than humbled and God being recognized. So we always end in prayer. Jennifer, why don't you pray for us? - [Jennifer] Dear Lord, thank you for your Word and how it cuts us to the heart. Thank you for teaching us through your Word. We pray your Word would continue to transform us as we learn it and choose to walk out all that you've commanded us to. We pray we would be people who recognize parts of our hearts that need to change, sin that needs to be repented of, motivations that are not pure, and actions that do not reflect your ways for the purpose of repentance and reconciliation and growth may your will be done in us and through us, may your light shine brightly through our marriages as we encourage one another to draw closer to you. In Jesus's name, amen. - [Aaron] Amen, we love you guys, and we thank you for joining us this week. Please consider leaving us a review and a star rating. You just gotta go to the bottom of your podcast app and tap one of those stars and leave a review, we love those, and they help other people find the episodes, find the podcast. And also don't forget to get the free Marriage Prayer Challenge, MarriagePrayerChallenge.com. See you next week. Did you enjoy today's show? If you did, it would mean the world to us if you could leave us a review on iTunes. Also if you're interested you can find many more encouraging stories and resources at MarriageAfterGod.com. And let us help you cultivate an extraordinary marriage.

Christians face Perilous times, Baghdadi bagged, Alveda King, Christian Martyrs, reports from India, Nigeria persecution, Cuban oppression, Indonesia injustice, Algeria Strongarms, Burkina in famine, from Warn Radio advocacy. To get the Books from the Watchman Dana G Smith go to his website http://www.DanaGlennSmith.com Christians face Perilous times. This the WIBR/Warn Radio Endtime report and commentary. Today we discuss some political and world events concerning America and the middle east. We also look to India, Nigeria, Cuba, Indonesia, Christian Martyrs, Algeria, Burkina Faso, and more. Christians face Perilous times; it is as our Lord warned. The disciple is not above his master. As the world hated our Lord, so too; it hates us. It despises the Gospel and It's Christ.

The Church is precious. It's Christ's beloved and broken bride. But sex and sexuality conversations have notoriously challenged us for the last ... thousands of years. New York Times bestselling author, Mo Isom, helps guide us through some of these conversations we have forgotten, and does it with storytelling and great passion. (She takes us to church!) Grab a pew, and join us. Highlights: "A lot of my issues grew out of the fact that my family thought the church was talking to me about the hard stuff, and the church thought my family was talking about the hard stuff. So really, no one was talking to me about the hard stuff. Therefore, the world ... was teaching me." --Mo Isom "Nothing you bring to the foot of the cross is going to knock God off of His throne." --Mo Isom Do the Next Thing: Check out the book, Sex, Jesus, and the Conversations the Church Forgot: https://www.amazon.com/Sex-Jesus-Conversations-Church-Forgot-ebook/dp/B0741F8Y3C/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2SRF6QYEHYCM4&keywords=sex%2C+jesus%2C+and+the+conversations+the+church+forgot+by+mo+isom&qid=1567185697&s=gateway&sprefix=sex%2C+Jesus%2Caps%2C154&sr=8-1 Check out that video resource, ​Conversations Continued here: https://moisom.teachable.com Dig deeper into her first book (and testimony) here: https://www.amazon.com/Wreck-My-Life-Journeying-Broken-ebook/dp/B015J8UAFM/ref=pd_sim_351_1/147-5732013-3279728?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B015J8UAFM&pd_rd_r=de2cb64c-8c16-400f-8e03-6bfcf03418bc&pd_rd_w=ec0kS&pd_rd_wg=FWLyJ&pf_rd_p=5c130f77-a5ef-4ffd-9db1-c29a354f52f9&pf_rd_r=AX11KMNGRTJJQ16RHYMF&psc=1&refRID=AX11KMNGRTJJQ16RHYMF Discover More: https://lauriekrieg.com/podcast/sex-jesus-and-the-conversations-the-church-forgot-with-mo-isom/ Question of the Week for Next Week: If you had to be stuck inside of a TV show for the rest of your life, which show and what character would you be? ​Email podcast@lauriekrieg.com or follow Laurie on Instagram to answer: https://www.instagram.com/laurie_krieg/

Original Broadcast: September 2008 Monthly Theme: Stewardship For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for Him who for their sake died and was raised. (2 Corinthians 5:14-15) Controlled No one likes to give up control. It doesn't matter if it's the remote control for the television or preparing for surgery. No one wants to feel that they are out of control or under someone else's control. However, Christians understand that their entire lives are controlled by the love of Christ. It's this love that generates a Christian's every loving and faithful act. It's Christ's love that brings about true stewardship. As St. Paul said, "Whatever does not proceed from faith is sin" (Romans 14:23). The opposite is also true. Whatever DOES proceeds from faith is righteous. But we can't do anything righteous of our own. But we do produce righteous fruits because we are controlled by Christ's love. And the ultimate showing of Christ's love is His death on the Cross and resurrection from the grave. It's because He has done all that for us that we can desire to be good stewards of the world and faith that He has given to us. Amen.

Join the Marriage After God movement and order a copy of our new book today. https://marriageaftergod.com Quote From the book: “...what we see as inadequate, God sees as enough.” Prayer *Dear Lord, We thank You for the way you created us and we thank you for your rich provision. Thank you for equipping us for the work you have for us to do. May our eyes be opened so that we can see all of the wonderful ways you have equipped us. Use us to encourage our spouse in the ways you have equipped them as well. We ask that you use every one of our marriage to bring you glory and to spread your gospel. We pray against fear and against the temptation to bury the gifts you have given to us. We ask that you remove our insecurities far from our hearts and help us to trust in you. We pray that we would walk in confidence as we chase boldly after you and as we pursue doing the very things you created us and created our marriages to do! In Jesus’ name, amen!* READ TRANSCRIPT [Aaron] Hey, we're Aaron and Jennifer Smith with Marriage after God. [Jennifer] Helping you cultivate an extraordinary marriage. [Aaron] And today, we're in part 11 of the Marriage after God series, and we're going to be talking with Katie and Elisha Voetberg about taking inventory. Welcome to the Marriage after God podcast, where we believe that marriage was meant for more than just happily ever after. [Jennifer] I'm Jennifer, also known as Unveiled Wife. [Aaron] And I'm Aaron, also known as Husband Revolution. [Jennifer] We have been married for over a decade. [Aaron] And so far, we have four young children. [Jennifer] We have been doing marriage ministry online for over seven years through vlogging and social media. [Aaron] With the desire to inspire couples to keep God at the center of their marriage, encouraging them to walk in faith every day. [Jennifer] We believe that Christian marriage should be an extraordinary one, full of life. [Aaron] Love. [Jennifer] And power. [Aaron] That can only be found by chasing after God. [Jennifer] Together. [Aaron] Thank you for joining us on this journey as we chase boldly after God's will for our life together. [Jennifer] This is Marriage after God. So today's guests are Elisha and Katie Voetberg from the podcast Now That We're Family. [Aaron] So before we get to the interview with Katie and Elisha Voetberg, we would love to ask anyone that's listening if they have not already to leave a review for us. That helps other people find the podcast. It helps the rankings in iTunes. So if you have a moment, leave us a star rating, leave us a text review. We'd love to see that. [Jennifer] We also wanna invite you guys to check out our new book Marriage after God, which is available at our store. So just go to shop.marriageaftergod.com to check that out and get your copy today. [Aaron] Yeah, that's the whole point of this series, is we're promoting our book coming out on June fourth, and we would love for you to get a copy of it. But following in the series, we're almost done with it, and we're excited to have you. Okay, Katie, Elisha, friends of ours. [Jennifer] Thank you for being here. [Elisha] No, thank you! [Katie] We're so stoked to be here today. [Aaron] We're here in our garage. Usually we record in our office, so there might be a little bit more echo, but this fits all of us. It's this fun little setup we got, I love it. [Jennifer] And it's in person. [Aaron] Yeah. [Jennifer] So I feel like it's just fun all around. [Aaron] So thanks for joining us, and no one is probably gonna know you, so why don't you guys tell everyone who you are, how long you've been married, kids, stuff like that. [Elisha] Right on, yeah. So my name is Elisha Peter Voetberg, and this is my lovely wife Kathryn Joy Voetberg, and we've been married for three years now, and we're pregnant with our third child. [Jennifer] Woohoo! [Elisha] So we've got a two-year-old. Yeah, we're really pumped. We've got our two-year-old, Leon Tucker, and our daughter Lucy's just about a year, and then we've got our third baby on the way. And we love being a part of fellowship with you guys, doing fellowship. [Aaron] Oh, I forgot to mention we go to church with them. [Elisha] Yeah, that's right. That's a huge highlight for us. And we're just really excited about life with each other and seeing what God can do through the family unit and through marriage. [Aaron] Cool, and that's why you guys started your podcast, was you loved what God was doing in your marriage and in your family, and we'll get into some more of your guys' background in a little bit. But yeah, if you haven't checked out their podcast, it's Now That We Are Family, and you can just search for that on iTunes or anywhere you can get podcasts, actually, so. [Jennifer] Awesome, okay, moving right along. [Aaron] This is our fun little section. We love this part. [Jennifer] Yeah, we wanted to invite you guys to join us for the icebreaker question, which is, what is one of your funniest marriage moments? [Elisha] Funniest, Katie? [Aaron] Katie has one, and she's prepared. [Katie] I am prepared. No, well, I would have to say one of our funniest marriage moments is probably the most ironic marriage moment, 'cause it was actually a fight. [Elisha] That's true. [Katie] But people think it's funny. [Elisha] It's funny now, right? [Katie] Yeah, exactly. [Aaron] Not in the moment, but it is absolutely funny now for everyone else. [Katie] Exactly, so it happened at our honeymoon, and I think it was the first wake-up call Elisha had to who he had married. [Aaron] Oh, no. [Elisha] Yeah, so yeah, I guess I'll tell the story. Katie and I, you're gonna hear more about our families, but we were both brought up in big families, and Katie's family was extremely strict when it came to sugar intake. And my family definitely was health-conscientious, but certainly not as strict regarding sugar as Katie's family was. [Katie] Nowhere close. [Elisha] Nowhere close. [Aaron] Yeah. And I think it was day four of our honeymoon, and I viewed our honeymoon as being a time that was celebratory, and you can kinda splurge. [Aaron] Yeah, which means it doesn't matter what you eat. [Elisha] It doesn't matter what you eat. [Aaron] You can have as much as you want. [Elisha] Exactly, that's how I was viewing it. And so, it was the evening of our fourth night, I think, the fourth day in our honeymoon, and we decided to get a little treat for a movie that we were gonna watch. And so, I got a pack of Skittles, just like the normal size. It wasn't the super size, it wasn't the party size. It was just the normal serving size of Skittles. And Katie didn't want anything, and that really blew my mind. I was like, you're not gonna get a treat? She goes, no. She was like, I'll have some of yours, which is classic, right? [Jennifer] Yeah, you're like, no you're not. [Elisha] Classic, yeah, exactly. And so, we started watching the movie, and I had a few Skittles, and then Katie took three Skittles and she told me that that was gonna be enough for her. [Katie] No, I had, okay, yeah. Okay, I guess, but this is a classic like, let me help you tell the story, honey. But I ended up eating 11 Skittles. [Aaron] She remembers the exact number. [Katie] Which was splurging for me. And Elisha was like, you're counting your Skittles? But then I took the Skittles away from him. [Elisha] Yeah, after I had eaten maybe 20 or 25 Skittles. [Katie] That's a lot of Skittles. [Elisha] Yeah. [Katie] Up until this point, I'd maybe had like one. Anyways, like, my family, I'm one of 11 kids, and we would split a bag of Skittles and make it last for two or three days. [Aaron] Wow, that's incredible, actually. [Katie] Anyways, yeah, so it led to kind of a crazy fight, and since then, I realize that I am the one that most people don't agree with on this story. [Aaron] Yeah, Skittles are usually a single-event, single-instance candy. [Elisha] Yeah, that's how I viewed it, exactly. She wanted to save it. [Aaron] It's one serving, isn't it, like, the whole bag? [Elisha] Exactly, I thought it was one serving too. [Katie] I wouldn't believe it, and we had to read the back. [Jennifer] Awesome. [Aaron] That is funny now, for sure. [Elisha] It's funny now. Well, you know what's funny is that we're laughing about it, but she was dead serious at the moment. She grabbed the bag from me. [Katie] I hid 'em. [Elisha] Yeah, and I thought she was being playful and kind of flirtatious. I was like, oh, come on, give me the Skittles back. She's like, no, we'll finish 'em later, like we can have 'em tomorrow or the next day. I was like, are you kidding me? I want them now. [Aaron] I wonder how many people are gonna really relate to this. They're like, this is exactly how we are with Skittles. [Jennifer] That's so awesome. [Aaron] We both would get our own bags of Skittles. [Jennifer] For sure. [Aaron] And our own bag of, what else would we get? [Jennifer] And remind each other that we're not sharing. [Aaron] Please don't have any of mine. Get your own bag if you want some. [Elisha] I don't think Katie can view you the same way anymore, now that she knows that. [Jennifer] That's okay. Okay, so we're gonna, we always share a quote, and we're gonna share a quote from Marriage after God from chapter 11, Take Inventory. Aaron, do you wanna? [Aaron] Yeah, so what we see as inadequate, God sees as enough. It's a smaller part of a bigger quote in a bigger context, but the idea is that oftentimes, we might see things that we have in our life, abilities, skills, and they're not good enough for God or adequate for what God wants to do in our life or through our life. And so we think we need something else. Oh, I don't have what it takes, that kind of mentality, but it's exactly what God's already given us, and he requires and desires us to invest it as we have it. It doesn't mean that we don't get better at things, but that's kind of the context of this, and we're gonna talk about this idea of taking inventory and we're gonna ask the questions to you guys, 'cause you guys haven't read the book yet, which is totally fine. [Elisha] Right. [Aaron] Because I think we all can learn and start to understand in our life that God's given us things, and he desires us to invest them, and not because we're trying to commend ourselves to God, but he wants us to invest them for his sake, for our sake, and it's because we love him that we invest them. So that's the quote, and then we can get into the topic and some questions for you guys. [Elisha] Cool. [Aaron] Are you guys excited about the questions? [Elisha] I am excited. [Aaron] Okay. [Jennifer] Okay, you guys are a young family figuring out what God has for you as a couple. How has that journey been so far? So you can describe things like how you feel about it, highs and lows, or maybe a significant story that stands out to you? [Katie] Yeah, so I think there have been a lot of highs and lows in our three years of marriage, and I think our first month of marriage was kind of indicative to that. Elisha was making I think $1800 at the time working at a restaurant, and our rent was 1150. So I don't even know how we quite managed to make it all work that month. We were doing a ton of odd jobs, and we started three different businesses our first month of marriage, and got pregnant. [Aaron] A little bit of things. [Katie] Yeah, like all of those moving parts I think really affected the last few years, but I think it's been so cool to see how God has worked to make all those things work together, even though there was such a random smattering of things over the years. And I think we've had so much fun, even though we didn't always see the plan, and I think what's cool now is that we trust the process so much more, and we trust each other so much more. We trust God. There were so many things through starting those businesses. Like, well, one of 'em provides for us now. It's a network marketing company, and I think it really has not only provided for us now, but it allows us to pursue our passions, and it helped give us thicker skin to handle rejection and stuff like that. So there were a lot of ups and downs just in that, you know, when you start one business. Elisha was getting his real estate license, so that was new for us, being employed, and then being unemployed it feels like when you don't have a deal. But I just think it's really cool that now, when we're uncertain of today or what tomorrow holds, 'cause I feel like as entrepreneurs, that is life. We just trust each other so much more, and we're like, you know God's gonna work these things together, and we see how he's using those things we started in our first few months of marriage now. [Jennifer] I think that's so encouraging, what you're sharing, because I think everybody has that tendency to wanna know what the next hundred steps are, like, see that bigger picture right away. But I think what you're saying is so encouraging to hear, to remind ourselves we have to just be able to trust God and trust our spouse with just that next step. [Elisha] Mmhmm. [Aaron] Yeah, Elisha, how do you, so, you guys have started businesses, making barely ends meet, which all of us have been there. Some people that are listening right now are probably right there right now. And you're just trying to figure out life. You guys have been married for three years, you have kids. You're just trying to figure out a lot of things, which is totally good, totally normal. But has there been times over the last few years that you feel like you're not moving in any direction, or how could God possibly use all these random difficulties and where we're at in our life? [Elisha] Absolutely. I know there's been numerous times where I've had those exact thoughts probably verbatim in my brain, and even looking back in retrospect over three years, and even though that's not a lot of time to some people, it's enough time for us to really realize that God does work all things together for good. There are some things that I know he's gonna continue to work out over the next 10 and 20 and 30 years of our life. But when you live, early on, month to month when it comes to your paycheck, and then you get pregnant in the middle of that, and then you get pregnant with your second child when you're kind of in the same position, it really makes you realize that the Lord does provide, and I think that that has helped me really embrace the season for what it is. I know that so often, everybody wants to arrive, right? You wanna be there, whatever there is. [Aaron] Yeah, whatever that there is. [Elisha] Whatever that is. [Aaron] How do we get there faster? [Elisha] Exactly. It might be a level of your income. It might be the size of your home or the quality of your vehicles that you're driving, but looking back over these last three years and seeing what the Lord's done, it's made us enjoy the journey and enjoy the process and trust the Lord in that. And when I look at those times where I was questioning what the heck I was doing with my life and what the Lord was gonna use with these things that I was doing, I look back, and so far, he's been so faithful to, in spite of me, a lot of times, use them for his purpose and for his glory. [Aaron] Yeah, so, I love that, and you know, this topic we're talking about, take inventory, is off chapter 11 of our book, and the idea of the chapter, we're not gonna go into too much of it, is that we can look at our lives and realize that there are, not certain things, that everything in our life, the inventory of our life, can be evaluated and looked at and say, okay, Lord, how are you using that season of life, that idea, that business that we wanted to start or that passion we have or that pain we felt? And so, what you're kinda saying is you've been looking back and saying, okay, I didn't know what I was doing then, but God's using that now. [Elisha] Yes. [Aaron] So when you look back over the last few years, and we're gonna get into your family in the next question, you look back over your life, taking this idea of inventory, can you guys pinpoint, be like, oh, wow, these things in our life, this way we were raised, certain giftings we have, talents, that's our inventory, that's what's on the shelf for us. Can you name a few of those things, and then we're gonna go into family next. [Elisha] Sure, yeah. We'll stick with our marriage so far, 'cause we haven't gotten into Katie and I's growing up experience, but I look at the businesses that we started in that first month, or even the job that I was doing. I was a bartender at the time, and obviously, you're dealing with people. You're dealing with all sorts of people as a bartender, and it's so easy for me to look at that season of life as being, man, I was just there to get tips and to go home and to pay rent. [Aaron] Right, meaningless waste of time, yeah. [Elisha] Exactly. [Aaron] However you feel about it. [Elisha] Yeah, exactly. And of course, I was interacting with eternal beings every day, whether that was my coworkers or my boss and my managers, and then, of course, the patrons that were coming and consuming alcohol, or buying food at the restaurant. And so I look back and I think, man, the Lord was preparing me just to have empathy and sympathy for all types of people. And then I think of the businesses that we started in that first month, and it was funny, 'cause we really acquired a lot of skillsets because we were kind of hacks when it came to, one of those businesses was an online music academy because I'm a musician, and I wanted to be able to offer my music lessons in an online format, and neither Katie or I were video people or really recording-type people. [Aaron] Yeah, but you guys did a good job. I remember you guys, it's still up, right? [Elisha] It is still up. [Katie] It is still up, yeah. [Elisha] It's effective, and people still use it. But we just figured it out. We just decided to dive in and go for it, and that was good for me to get over my pride and to let go of that perfectionism mindset that so often keeps us from taking any action. [Katie] And I think too it was good for us because, like, I remember when we first got married and you were a little more focused on your image then, and I was kind of like, I don't know, I was kind of a hack. I think I made you a little nervous, the way I threw around my image. [Elisha] Let's just do it, let's just do it. [Katie] Yeah, I was like, let's just do it, put it up. And I remember the first time I showed you a video that I was gonna post on Facebook. It was just a little parody I made, and Elisha's like, you cannot post that. Like, there is no way. [Elisha] That's funny. [Aaron] You're like, it's going up. [Katie] Yeah. Well, through Voetberg Music Academy, we ended up doing a lot of those little commercials or little parody videos together, and I think that that really, I mean, we use that now. [Elisha] Yep, absolutely. [Katie] And it just really helped us swallow our pride I think and just go for things. [Jennifer] Explain that a little bit more when you say we use that now. [Katie] Well, we use that now on YouTube is probably one of the biggest ways that we use that in just family vlogging now that we're a family on YouTube as well. And I think that that is kind of what spawned the podcast, because if we hadn't gotten enough confidence to just document our lives, I don't think we would have ever taken that next step to podcasting. [Aaron] That's good. So right now, what you're currently doing for the Lord, for your family, you can reach back into the inventory of those experiences and the inventory of those challenges, the trials and errors, and use that now and feel more confident in moving forward and, like you said, you wouldn't have been able to do it now if you didn't try it then or have those experiences. That's awesome. [Jennifer] That is so cool. Okay, so we touched on that we were gonna get into your families a little bit. Katie, you mentioned that you're from a big family, so how do you guys see the unique ways that you were raised or maybe family type being used for what God has you doing today? [Elisha] Yeah, so I was one of 10 children, all from the same mommy and daddy, and my parents are still married. They stayed married throughout our entire childhood, and they're in a great marriage. [Aaron] Which is rare these days. [Elisha] Yeah, and Katie is the oldest of 11 children, where it's same mommy and daddy for all the kiddos, and they're in a vibrant marriage right now. And so we were both homeschooled and brought up just with very Bible-centered homes. We read the Bible every single day as a family at the breakfast table, and sometimes at the dinner table, and I think that when I look at my history, not only was it an extremely enjoyable and relationship-rich time that I loved with my siblings and with my parents, and I know Katie feels the same way. [Katie] Yes. [Elisha] About her childhood, where we both just look back at them with really fond memories. I see that because my parents and Katie's parents, but I'll speak for myself right now, Because my parents become comfortable being unconventional and being counter-cultural, I grew up with this mindset that there are so many blessings in being different than the world. [Aaron] I like that. [Elisha] And I think my parents were the ones that were convicted by the Lord, and obviously, I was just along for the ride as a child and I was following in their leading, but they really exemplified to me that yes, a lot of times, initially, making those decisions to have many children or for the mom to stay home and be with the children and homeschool them or to take 'em out of the public and homeschool them, they can be challenging up front, and they can be challenging even for an extended amount of time. But the payoff is so worth it. So I think that growing up with a big family, in a big family and with parents that really trusted the Lord with their finances, with how many children they're going to have, it made me realize that I've adopted a lot of these mindsets not even knowing it. And so when I hear people that are my age say, well, we couldn't afford to have children now, I just think to myself, well, yeah you could. Where's that coming from? And I think that statements like that are so commonly accepted in our culture and in the world and they're never challenged, and I just don't believe that. I believe that you could probably find a way to afford to have children. I think that you can find a way to afford for the mother to stay home and not go to work and to even homeschool her children. And I think you can find a way to have a romantic and fun and flirtatious marriage, even while you have a bunch of kids, because I saw it exemplified to me. [Aaron] Yeah, that's the magic right there. [Elisha] Yeah, and so I'm not saying that I know how to do it; I just believe it can be done, and I think that Katie feels similarly. [Katie] Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think sometimes, there is this mindset of, we have to do things how everyone else does them, and I think the way we grew up, like, I had some of the best years of my life living in a tent and a trailer, you know? Like, we did that for two years so my parents could save up a down payment for their house, and they had six kids at the time, but those are some of the best memories of my childhood. And I think sometimes, we have this misconceived perception that, oh, we need to earn this amount of money or we need to take our kids to Disneyland or we need to be able to provide these things for our kids, and I just don't have that perspective at all. Because of the way I was raised, I just have incredible relationships with my parents, and I have such amazing memories of growing up in unique situations. I guess my experience helps dispel some of those societal norms. [Aaron] Yeah. So you, you have a lot of resources at your fingertips from the way you were raised, the versatility, the flexibility to make decisions that might be, hey, if we slow down here, we can speed up over here, or if we lessen what we're spending money on over here, we can have money to do something over here. You have those things at your fingertips to use now because of how, and you didn't even get to choose it. [Elisha and Katie] Exactly. [Aaron] Right? 'Cause that's kind of some of the things that we like to point out and we want our listeners to know, fortunately your family stories are powerful and just relationally rich, and then some people listening are gonna be like, well, I didn't have a family like that. My family wasn't that great. I didn't have strong Christian parents. But our point in this idea of taking inventory is that your story and your family doesn't give you something extra. It's what God has given you. And my family story's different, similar in some ways, but different. Jennifer's family story's different. And we we don't have your story to use in what God has for us to do ministry in, right? [Elisha] That's right. [Aaron] We use our story, the inventory that we have that God's given us. And so, that's kind of what's awesome about taking inventory of our lives, is our listeners can take inventory and be like, and I wanna encourage them that are listening not to throw out their story 'cause it's not your story. [Elisha] That's right, absolutely. [Aaron] Because they do have inventory, and God wants us to look at what we have and what he's given us and say, here you go, Lord. [Elisha] That's right. [Aaron] So here's my family and how I was raised, the good things and the bad things that happened to me as a child that I had no choice in, and how do you want me to use this for you, Lord? How do you want me to invest this? How do you wanna redeem this in my life? How do you wanna turn it into something for you, not for me, not for my sake. And so, maybe that gives someone listening right now peace and actually some courage in their own inventory. [Jennifer] Yeah, and something I wanna highlight is just that how cool that God would have you guys here on the show and be able to share your story, 'cause I think it will be an encouragement to someone. 'Cause like you said, there's other ways of living that have been expressed and accepted in our culture, and your story's different, and the fact that you're here and you're sharing and whoever's listening could be encouraged by this, I love that. [Aaron] Yeah, that story by itself right now, whether it has any other implications in your life, could potentially minister to someone today, which is amazing, right? [Katie] Incredible. [Aaron] And that's just one small way that God uses what we are, what we have that he's given to us, is just by saying yes to him, which is a theme that we mention throughout our whole book, is saying yes to God. [Jennifer] Okay, so when we say yes to God, sometimes insecurities flare up, fears, things like that. So what are some of your biggest insecurities when it comes to using your gifts and talents for God? [Elisha] You know, it's funny, 'cause I think that, even piggybacking on talking about our family, our unique story and our unique experiences can often be debilitating to us, and we can oftentimes find ourselves experiencing paralysis by analysis because we feel like we're from such a unique perspective, we can't relate with people. How are we gonna be able to connect and really encourage and exhort, whether that's fellow believers or minister to people that are not saved, and oftentimes, I mean, you can look at that from two ways. One, I feel extremely strong in my faith because of what my parents have done before me, but it also makes me realize it's not about me. It's not about Katie. It's about Jesus Christ. And I think of, is it II Peter chapter one, I think it's verses three and four that whereby are given unto you all things. [Aaron] That pertain to life and godliness, yeah. [Elisha] That pertain to life and godliness through the knowledge of him who's called you to glory and virtue. And that's not the prerequisite. The prerequisite for that is not coming from a Christian family. The prerequisite for that's not coming from the fourth generation or fifth generation of Bible-believing Christians; it's being in Christ. [Aaron] It's being in Christ. [Katie] That's good. [Elisha] It's being a new creation in Christ. But the cool thing about that is that legacy is a real thing, and you have the ability in Christ to start a new legacy. We were just at my grandfather's funeral a week and a half ago, and it was really powerful to be there with his six children and then 42 grandchildren. [Aaron] Wow, that's incredible. [Elisha] And this is my mother's father, and to hear his story of being orphaned at 12 years old, heavily abused, on the street starving, an alcoholic father who ended up being a felon, never knowing his mother and never knowing the love of Christ in his home and making a decision to follow the Lord at 16 years of age, and the legacy that's come from that. [Katie] It's incredible, and we get to benefit from that. [Jennifer] That's powerful, wow. [Elisha] Absolutely, yeah, really is powerful. [Aaron] Wow, love that. [Elisha] And so, to get back to your question, insecurities, I think it's so easy to feel inadequate, 'cause of course, apart from Christ, we are inadequate, but that's not where we're at anymore. So you need to accept the reality that hey, we're in Christ, we are a new creation in Christ, and we do have all things pertaining to life and godliness, and therefore, we are equipped. And so I think our youth can play a factor in that, not feeling old enough. [Katie] I definitely think that plays in too. You feel like, well, I don't have enough experience, you know, life experience. [Aaron] I know, you're not allowed to have a podcast about family yet until you've had a family for a super long time, right? [Katie] Exactly, exactly. [Elisha] Exactly, that's right. [Katie] So I think we do wanna be thoughtful in that and share what we're experiencing more and what we're learning in the moment versus teaching, 'cause obviously, our oldest is two, you know what I'm saying? Elisha and I have been married for three years. [Aaron] Right, there's things you actually don't know, and that's fine. [Katie] Yes. So I think we want to be wise and cautious in that, but that doesn't mean that we can't encourage someone who's in a similar situation. [Elisha] Yeah, and I think that even though there's so much that we have yet to learn and that we need to learn as life goes on, I know that Katie and I are really excited about family, and we're excited about growth, and I think that regardless of what stage of life you're in, if you're in Christ Jesus, you can be excited about the future. [Aaron] Ooh, I like that. [Elisha] I know that's where we're at right now. [Aaron] So that sounds very similar to ours. When we launched Unveiled Wife and then Husband Revolution, how long were we married? Five years? [Jennifer] Yeah. [Aaron] And people even asked us, how long have you been married, like, older people, which rightfully so asking us, but I always tell people, we're not marriage experts. We've never proclaimed to be marriage experts. That would have been wrong of us to do. We're marriage storytellers. [Jennifer] Yeah, storytellers. We're sharing our experience. [Aaron] How are we failing, what's God teaching us, and again, going back to our book, one of the themes is like what you said, it's not us. It's not my experiences that is changing anyone's hearts or that has any value, other than Christ using it. And it's his story. It's his vocation, it's his ministry, not ours. It's his message, not ours. And so, as long as we're going back to the very thing that's changing us and transforming us, like, the gospel's the power of God unto salvation, right? The gospel and Christ in us through the Holy Spirit, that's what we're doing in this world. So we've had the same exact inadequacies and fears almost every time we launch anything. Launching this podcast, we were like, we don't know how to do podcasts. So I hope that encourages people listening to realize, wow, if God's calling me out, and not if, he is calling me out and wants me to follow him and wants me to use my life and the inventory of my life for his glory, they should be encouraged to know that even if they feel doubt and fear, that it's not them anyway. It's Christ doing it. [Katie] Exactly. [Elisha] Amen. [Jennifer] I think it's important to note we have a real enemy who does not like us using the gift and things that God's given us to glorify God. [Aaron] No way, yeah. [Jennifer] And so there's gonna be opposition to that, and I think our flesh is sensitive to that. So sometimes it does come in the form of insecurities or fears and things that we're afraid of, but it's just temptation from the enemy to try and distract us. [Katie] That's a great perspective. [Aaron] Yeah, but I love that you guys use wisdom and thoughtfulness. I don't think we should test God and run into the middle of the street and say, save me! [Katie] Definitely not. [Aaron] We need to present, again, going back to the taking inventory, we don't just say like, oh, I'm gonna use this thing in my life this way. No, we say, okay, Lord, here's what I have. This is what you've given me, this abuse as a child, your grandpa story, or my godly upbringing, or this schooling I went to. Whatever it is, these gifts, these natural abilities that you've given me, here you go. What do you want? How do you wanna arrange this and turn it into a clay pot or a basketball hoop or whatever it is that he wants to mold it into. [Jennifer] It's in humility and submission to his will and his purposes, which leads me to the next question. I'd love for you guys to share on this. What's the purpose of all the gifts and things that he gives to you, or to us? What is the purpose? [Elisha] Yeah, I think big picture answer is it's for God's glory and for the furtherance of the gospel. [Aaron] Yeah, we talked about this on Sunday, didn't we? [Elisha] We did, that's right, a few days ago. And the way that plays out practically with each couple I think is obviously gonna look different, 'cause there are so many different skillsets and passions. And it's fun when you accept that big picture of, man, this is for God's purpose. It's for his glory. It's for the furtherance of his kingdom. Then it almost makes it like a fun game to figure out what your skillsets are and how you can be a part of the puzzle and the pie, realizing, wait, it's not about me. I don't have to get all the credit. [Aaron] Yes, yes. [Elisha] In fact, I shouldn't get all the credit. Like, how can I fit into the strategy that God has? And I think obviously, Katie and I are in the journey of figuring that out, and something that we both talk a lot about is being aware of the desires that are on our heart, and the Lord I think oftentimes places those on your heart, and then also being open to counsel. And you can speak to this, Katie, but I think that we've gone back and forth of caring too much about what people think of us, whether that's close friends and relatives, or even people that we don't know personally, but they have their opinion online of us and we'll let that influence the action we're taking. But then you can swing the pendulum and say, well, forget what people think. I'm just gonna do what I wanna do. And there's obviously, the Bible talks about there being safety in the counsel of many. And so I think finding this place where you say, man, the Lord's put something on my heart. I wanna have a community of counsel that I can go to and be humble before, knowing that they can totally see blind spots in my life, but then also realizing I don't wanna make decisions based off of the fear of man or what somebody might say to me. [Aaron] Right. [Jennifer] So good, and I find so much encouragement in several things that you guys have already shared throughout this episode, things like have fun along the way, enjoy the journey, and I love that, and I just wanted to take note for everyone listening, and for everyone who's gonna read the book Marriage after God, because sometimes, we just tell it like it is and encourage them to do. But I want them to hear this. It is a journey to be enjoyed, and it is something to have fun with yourselves when you're figuring it out. And so I just wanted to make a note, I love that you said that. [Aaron] And the highlight in your story, just all the unique variables, we call it inventory, that God has equipped you guys with to do the unique thing that he's having you do, whatever that looks like. It could be a business. It could be just you working nine-to-five jobs, you just being a mom, but how you guys work together with your gifts and talents, we don't know, but you guys are trying things and chasing after what God wants for you and saying, okay, Lord, okay, that's not it? Okay, cool, and we'll take the experience from that. We're gonna use it for the thing that you do want us to do, and that it's this organic thing. 'Cause God knows the complete picture. [Elisha] That's right. [Katie] He does, yes. [Aaron] It says many plans are in the man's heart, but it's the Lord that directs the steps. So we have these plans, we have these ideas, and we say, if the Lord wills it, and then we take a step, and you say, okay, that's the right step. Oh, no, that's the wrong step. Let's go to this step, let's do this way, and we let him direct us. And what's awesome is along the way, whether you have reached that goal, whatever that thing is, like you said, we always have this picture of what it might be, and we actually don't even know what it might be. We just think, it's usually probably compared to someone else's thing. [Katie] Probably. [Elisha] That's usually what it is. [Aaron] But like even right now, just by you saying yes to him in all of these decisions, you're saying yes to him, and you begin to see him not only change you guys, make you guys more in love, stronger in your marriage, better parents, better brothers and sisters in Christ, but then also, you get used to grow the kingdom, just along the way. Whether you ever achieve that position or ministry or goal or whatever it looks like, it's happening along the way because you're saying yes to God, and I think that's amazing. [Elisha] Yep. [Aaron] So, do you feel like God is currently inviting you two to do anything specific, like, as you guys have been navigating with all these gifts and talents and resources? [Katie] Yeah, well, I think that it's, like we mentioned, it has been a journey. I think it's so cool to see how the Lord has had us work together in little ways right off the bat, because there is no way we'd be able to even do the projects we're working on now if we hadn't taken those little steps, and I think of with Voetberg Music Academy, where I started recording a live show and we started getting into video, but I was so insecure talking in front of a camera in front of Elisha. I wasn't insecure about the camera. [Aaron] Elisha, turn around please. [Katie] Yes! [Elisha] Exactly, she would tell me to leave. [Katie] He'd have to leave. I had a crush on Elisha since I was eight years old, and I tried my entire life to impress him. [Aaron] Oh, that's awesome. And now he's standing there in front of you. [Katie] So then after we got married, I was like, I can't do this, and he was so good at it, and he was so good at communicating that, I don't know, there was just no way we were going to ever be able to talk to a camera together. And I think it was so cool, because I started my own YouTube now that I'm a mother before we did anything online, and it was cool how that just built my confidence, and that was a little step. It was just a hobby and a fun thing, but I do think the Lord was using it to build my confidence for us to be able to start doing video together and starting the vlog, and then starting, and I think it also gave you confidence too. [Elisha] Yes. [Katie] In the flip side, to see me just putting my life out there and people being encouraged by it, and that gave you the urge I think to have us jump into that together. [Elisha] Absolutely. [Katie] Which again led to the podcast, and I do think even though we are young and we are really newly married and a new family, we do have a desire to encourage family and encourage biblical rules and encourage seeking out what God's word says about family in a culture that is so starkly opposed to just the biblical worldview. And so, I think that's our goal, and that might look different throughout the years. The mediums we use to communicate might look different, but I think for both of us, that's what God has placed on our heart, to just encourage young families in our stage of life and newly married couples. [Aaron] Yeah. So I just wanna encourage you guys, 'cause I know you both, we go to church together, we know most of your families. Whether you have direct experience with being parents of large families and have been doing for ages, or you have a two-year-old, right? [Elisha] Yeah, that's right. [Aaron] You have more experience in this than many people, because I grew up in a family of two. You grew up in a larger family, but not the way you guys did. [Jennifer] Yeah. [Aaron] And whether or not you are directly experiencing it, which you are, just with a much smaller size right now, you were drawing from that inventory of how you were raised and the experience that no one has had, rarely, 10 children, 11 children, parents that stayed together that not just stayed together but love each other, 'cause that's a big thing. [Jennifer] Yeah, there's parents that stick it out. [Aaron] Lots of people, they stayed together, but it wasn't very joyful, right? [Elisha] Right, right. [Aaron] And so that's what's awesome, is whether or not you feel completely qualified, you're more qualified than me to talk about it, just by the experience you had, now, as long as we stay humble and we submit to the Lord and say we're gonna do it your way, 'cause it's his story. So I just wanted to encourage you guys that. I think that's awesome you're starting. I think we need more people, more believers. That's the whole purpose of this book, is to say yes to God and say, God, here's what you've given me. How do you wanna use it? [Elisha] Yes, amen. [Jennifer] Okay, guys, this is the last question, and it's in your own words, what is a marriage after God? [Elisha] In our own words, what is a marriage after God? [Katie] Okay, you go first. [Elisha] This isn't fair, 'cause we haven't read the book yet, guys. [Aaron] This is exactly why we're asking. [Elisha] I see. You know, God invented marriage, so I really do think that he gets to choose what the purpose of marriage is, what marriage is, what the end goal is, and something that Katie and I have really been contemplating over the last few months is that when you are joined in holy matrimony, you don't then start to try to become one; he makes you one. And so therefore, you start to act like one. And I think that so often, and this carries over into our faith. We think that when you are made new in Christ, from the day you're saved, you're a son of God. [Aaron] Oh, I love that, yeah. [Elisha] You are free from sin. You're able to live as a son of God. That doesn't mean that you don't need to learn some things, but you're learning to act how he's made you to be. I think it's the same thing with marriage. Oftentimes, we think, man, we need to become one, when in reality, you are one. He says, when two are joined together, they should no longer be called two, but they should be called one. And I think that once we've started to realize that more and more, we've realized that when I make decisions that aren't to the unity of our marriage, it hurts Katie, and similarly, if it's a negative decision, and if Katie makes a negative decision, it hurts me, whether you want it to or not. And I think that once we've started to have our minds transformed, you know, our minds are being transformed because we're renewing them and starting to believe what God says about who we are as Christians and then who we are as a married couple, we start to walk that out, we start to be one. And so once again, that's just one area that God has spoken to about marriage, saying hey, you are one. There's no more two, there's no more Elisha and Katie. You are one. I don't care how you feel. I don't care how she thinks or you think, you are one. So you better start learning how to act like it. Otherwise, it's gonna be a pretty miserable journey. [Aaron] Ooh, I love that. That's awesome, yeah. So a marriage after God is one that recognizes they are one. [Elisha] That's right. [Aaron] Like, not becoming one, they are one. And so, I love that, because you're right. We're not becoming something. We are it the moment we said yes. [Jennifer] Let's live it out. [Aaron] Yeah, and so, either we're living it out or we're fighting against it. [Elisha] Yes. [Aaron] So that's awesome, amen. So, where can people find you at? What are some websites? [Jennifer] 'Cause we know people got encouraged today. They got inspired. They wanna know more about you. [Elisha] Sure, yeah, well, you already mentioned our podcast. It's Now That We're A Family, and then we've got our YouTube channel, which is also called nowthatwereafamily. [Katie] Yep. [Elisha] And Katie's on Instagram at @nowthatimamother. [Jennifer] And she's super active there. She does live videos and interviews people. [Aaron] And her photos are awesome. [Katie] Yes, I was able to interview Jenn. That was awesome. [Elisha] Yeah, that's right, exactly. [Katie] Yeah, and are you? [Elisha] I'm on Instagram. [Aaron] Yeah, is yours @nowthatimafather? [Elisha] @nowthatimafather. [Katie] @nowthatimafather, yeah. [Elisha] That's right. Yeah, so that's really where you can find us, and then our website's nowthatwereafamily.com. [Aaron] So we just wanna encourage our listeners to go follow them and check them out. They have large families, large, awesome, godly families. [Jennifer] And they're growing theirs. [Aaron] And they're throwing theirs, and God's using them. [Elisha] Right on. [Jennifer] Okay, well, at the end of every episode, we just encourage everyone to join us in prayer. So Aaron, would you like to close us out in prayer? [Aaron] Dear Lord, we thank you for the way you created us, and we thank you for your rich provision. Thank you for equipping us for the work you have for us to do. May our eyes be opened so we can see all the wonderful ways you have equipped us. Use us to encourage our spouse in the ways you have equipped them as well. We ask that you use every one of our marriages to bring you glory and to spread your gospel. We pray against fear and against the temptation to bury the gifts you have given to us. We ask that you remove our insecurities far from our hearts and help us to trust in you. We pray that we would walk in confidence as we chase boldly after you and as we pursue doing the very things you created us and created our marriages to do. In Jesus's name, amen. [Jennifer] Amen. [Elisha and Katie] Amen. [Aaron] So thanks for joining us today, Katie and Elisha Voetberg. We love you guys, and we thank you for your story and your testimony. [Elisha] Mm, thank you guys, seriously. Thank you for your ministry. [Katie] Yes. [Elisha] And, I mean, I don't know if you guys are gonna keep this on, but. [Aaron] Oh, yeah. [Elisha] But just as an example you guys have shown to us I've really been thinking about this the last couple of weeks, is your guys' consistency in your faith and in your marriage and in your child training. That's a huge blessing to me as a new father. [Aaron] Thank you. [Elisha] Then also just in being in consistent community, being in consistent fellowship with our local body here. I just know that you'll be there. I know that you're a phone all or a text away and that you will be there on Sunday, and I see you guys being so faithful in your Bible times as a family, and I just never want you guys to question not only the work that's taking place in your own family, but the encouragement that is to me as a believer and I'm sure just to the global body that watches that. [Katie] Yes, you've been such a blessing to our family. [Jennifer] Thank you for sharing that, that's awesome. [Aaron] Thank you, well, yeah, I appreciate that. [Elisha] Actually, I'm gonna say one more thing. Just 'cause I don't know how many people you're gonna have on your podcast that go to your local church, but being the father of a two-year-old boy, I've really started to think more and more about child training within the church service content. And we've been going to church for almost two and a half years now with you guys and seen how you guys have been able to really train your children to sit in church is so inspiring. [Katie] Oh my goodness, yeah. [Elisha] You guys, I know that most of you listeners probably are never gonna have an opportunity to sit in church with Aaron and Jen, but their kids are so well behaved. They sit on their laps, and the only reason that's so remarkable to me now is because I've got a two-year-old, and it feels like I'm in a jiu jitsu match throughout the entire church service with him. [Katie] Yeah, we're trying to take notes from Aaron and Jen. [Elisha] Yeah. [Aaron] Well, thank you. [Elisha] Yeah, no, it's true. [Aaron] Yeah, thank you, I appreciate that. [Jennifer] It is about consistency, I would say, just to encourage others out there. The children just, they're awesome and they're a blessing to us. [Aaron] And it takes lots of hard work, and lots of prayer, and lots of screaming in pillows. [Katie] There you go. [Aaron] So, hey, thank you, that was really encouraging. We love you guys, and all you listening, we love you, and we thank you for joining us, and we pray that you will continue on in this journey with us as we have a few more episodes in this series. We'll see you next week. Did you enjoy today's show? If you did, it would mean the world to us if you could leave us a review on iTunes. Also, if you're interested, you can find many more encouraging stories and resources at marriageaftergod.com and let us help you cultivate an extraordinary marriage.

It's Christ to whom we are committing ourselves.

It's Christ that breathes life into what is dead.

Something has gone wrong with how we define community and how we define and function in relationships. Now at the simplest level, the problem with our relationships, the reason why so few of them are satisfying and long-lasting is because they are built on commonalities that change, and as those commonalities change, so does the relationship.

How did Maryland native and Franciscan University graduate, David Brokke, find himself in Belize?  Listen to David tell his story about how he first felt called to long term mission work, his two years serving and teaching in Belize, and the joys and struggles of being a missionary. It's Christ's call and cockroaches all in one! Interested in mission work yourself? Learn more about David's experience at on his blog.