The Pain Cave

Stuff your stockings with an extra-long year end episode of the pod! We bring back our hallowed tradition of arguing over whether or not Barkleys is important. And a bunch of other stuff. It's the Ultrarunner of the Year ballot!!Buy our book!Beer for this episode: Goose Island Bourbon Country Vanilla Stout, Alchemist Heady TopperIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

We welcome back returning champion of the pod Jason Green, the founder and head honcho of the Yeti Trail Runners (not a cult!) to talk about the rebuilding efforts in Appalachia in the aftermath of Hurricane Helene. A relatively tame version of the Jason Green Drinking Game was performed. Buy our book!Links:Yeti Trail RunnersHelp Appalachia rebuild! Feeding Southwest VirginiaDonate to the Virginia Creeper TrailOur first episode with JasonBeer for this episode: Other Half Green City, Wicked Weed Freak of NatureIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Two huge races captured the attention of ultra fans over the past few weeks. In one, a growing multinational entity poised to dominate world ultrarunning hosted one of its flagship events, complete with round-the-clock media coverage and elite athletes redefining what was previously thought possible, even while behind the scenes, there are whispers about whether or not this kind of global expansion is good for the sport.Also, there was Javelina.Beer for this episode: Community Beer Works The Snow, Woodstock Brewing Baby DragonIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

What is the story that forced us to dust off the mics, fire up the sound board, and emerge from a 16-month podcasting hiatus? Is it Katie Schide's epic summer? Dave Roche's insane Leadville CR? Damian Hall's effort to combat greenwashing at the top levels of the sport? Multiple world records at 50 miles or six days? No, of course not. It's Camille doing stupid Camille shit.Beer for this episode: Athletic Brewing Free Wave, Drowned Lands Field and StreamIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

There was a reading assignment for this show…naturally, Phil couldn't be bothered to do any actual work, so I had the great pleasure of speaking with Doug Mayer about his new book, The Race That Changed Running: The Inside Story of UTMB, out TODAY! An American expat living full-time in Chamonix, Doug works as a journalist and runs his own tour guide company, Run the Alps. The new book (his third) grew out of his own personal history with and curiosity about the race that, like it or not, is at the forefront of the world ultra and trail running scene. We talked about many of the issues and controversies around the race and the UTMB series of races, the influence of Ironman, how the book was written, and also Doug's recent trip to Innsbrouck to cover the World Trail and Mountain Running Championships. This was a really fun conversation that I think people will find very thought-provoking. Plus, the triumphant return of Desert Island Picks!LinksOrder The Race That Changed Running or Doug's other booksRun the AlpsDoug's coverage of the World Trail and Mountain Running ChampionshipsDesert Island Picks: The Odyssey, Hot Rocks by the Rolling Stones, Big Mountain Brewing Wild MountainIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Rich Lockwood has been a mainstay on the PNW trail-running scene for several years, but he grabbed the national spotlight in 2022 with a string of world-class performances, capped by a win at the uber-competitive Run Rabbit Run 100 and a podium spot an the Doi Inthanon 100K (by UTMB, blah blah blah) in his first international event. We caught up with Rich after last month's return to racing at the newly-reinvigorated Lake Sonoma 50 mile because we wanted to clarify a bunch of crucial information that hadn't been shared pubicly before, like what cartoon character he identifies with. Let no one accuse us of not asking the tough questions.Links:Follow Rich on IGBeers for this episode: Best Day Brewing Hazy IPA, Two Way Brewing Confusion Saison, Holy Mountain Throne of BloodIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Many of you may not know about Chad Lasater, but you should. He's the current champion of the Grand Slam of Ultrarunning (having finished the GS in both 2021 and 2022) and after a breakthrough performance at Desert Solstice (his first real 24-hour race) he is currently in position for a spot on the US team for the World Championships this fall. We recorded this in late 2022, shortly after Chad's awesome run at DS, where he narrowly missed Bob Hearn's 50+ American Record, but I've been too busy to release the show until now—which is great, since Chad has an insanely busy year about to start up. In this episode, we reminisce about the good old days in the late 2010s, when Phil and I were still able to kind of keep up with Chad, and we try to figure out The Secret behind his incredible progress in the sport and how he is able to be running huge PRs into his 50s. Then, it's time for a very entertaining 20 Questions; Chad has raced 25 100s all over the world and has a million stories to share.Links:Follow Chad on IG - zero posts so far!Beer for this episode: Wicked Weed PerniciousIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Happy New Year! Sneaking in our traditional year-end pod under the wire, my favorite episode every year, debating the Ultrarunners of the Year with recurring guest Jason Mintz, who battled through COVID and came to PLAY! Tons of consensus this year but also some pretty good debate. Phil and I both completely fucked up and somehow both left Matthieu Blanchard out of our top 10, which is a travesty, but otherwise I think we held our own. I had a great time pointing out Phil's lack of internal consistency which is always fun, and Phil made me defend Camille, which was weird.Beer for this episode: Wolf Hills Trooper's Alley, Captain Lawrence Clearwater KolschLinksLaura Kline on the 2017 ballotJason Mintz on the 2018 ballotRich Heffron on the 2019 ballot for the women and menMintz again on the 2021 ballotMy final ballot in 2016, 2017, 2018, and 2019Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It took us way too long to have Beastcoast star Riley Brady on the pod. For some reason we waited until they're getting ready to move to Boulder (like everyone else!) to invite them on. Fresh off a Golden Ticket-winning performance at the Javelina Jundred, Riley joined the show to talk about competition in the sport, The King, karaoke, and much more.Links:Follow Riley on IGBeer for this episode: Treehouse Six, Dancing Grain Harvest SunIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It's always a little scary to double the amount of Brits on the show, but it couldn't have been easier with Pete Mortimer, one of the most accomplished and prolific athletes in our sport today. We talked about some of Pete's most recent exploits at HURT, Run Rabbit, and Barkley, before tackling all-important questions about hashing, Metallica, and (of course) Marmite.Links:Pete's websitePete on IG and StravaBeer for this episode: Treehouse Juice Machine, Radiant Pig Save the RobotsIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Despite being only 36, Sabrina Little has been running ultras for over fifteen years. She won the famed Old Dominion 100 mile at only 23 years old; by the time she was 26, she held American records for 24 hours and 200K, and led the US women to a team gold medal with her runner-up finish at the 24-hour world championships. Now with a PhD in philosophy, Sabrina is one of the leading thinkers in the sport of ultrarunning. We welcomed her onto the show after just celebrating the birth of her second child to talk about some serious but mostly silly stuff, ‘cause you know, that's what we do.Links:Sabrina's websiteSabrina on IG and Strava“Beer” for this episode: Athletic Oktoberfest, Drowned Lands Harvest Kill Sour IPAIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Oh, dear listener, did we have a podcast for you. Recorded in beautiful Dolby surround sound, it was full of ultra musings, information, insights, wit, beer, witbeer, and other hilarity. We talked about UTMB, Leadville, various other goings on. Yes, it had been a while since we podded, but no matter! It was like riding a proverbial bicycle. Truly, a podcast for the ages.That was our last episode, which was our first episode in several months, and which was waylaid by a faulty USB port. Sadly, it is lost to the sands of time. The workd may never understand how truly Phil and I were at the peak of our podcasting powers.So, we took another six weeks to drown our sorrows and now come to you with this suboptimal crap. Enjoy.Beer for this episode: Athletic Brewing Free Wave, Wicked Weed Freak of NatureIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

The Legend returns to the Pain Cave to recap Western States with “Heat Training,” breaking down the juiciest storylines and biggest takeaways from this past weekend in Auburn. Then, we review our men's and women's picks and see who was the best prognosticator this year. Finally, we get Phil's report from his PR at Manitou's Revenge and touch on the rest of the results from a busy week in the trail and ultrarunning world.LinksWestern States preview pod (with picks) featuring Cat BradleyBeer for this episode: West Kill Kaaterskill IPA, Athletic Brewing Upside Dawn (use promo code JASONF20 for 20% off your first order)Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

One more episode to drop into the pre-Western States hype maelstrom: we sit down with former podium finisher Brittany Peterson, one of the world's best trail runners and one the pre-race favorites this weekend at the Big Dance, for our world-famous 20 Questions.Links:Brittany's websiteBrittany on IG and Strava“Beer” for this episode: Synergy Raw Kombucha UnityIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It's that time of year again: Western States! The world's best are gathering in Olympic Valley for the biggest race on the domestic ultrarunning calendar, and we're breaking down our top picks for the Big Dance with former WS100 champ Cat Bradley and her broken hand. We recorded this last week before all the happenings at Broken Arrow this weekend (though I will say we did a pretty good job of calling out some of the best performers to watch) before diving deep into our top 5 men's and top 10 women's picks. Then, Phil and I do a super-quick roundup of some recent Euro and Beastcoast trail news.Beer for this episode: Athletic Brewing Free Wave and Upside Dawn (use promo code JASONF20 for 20% off your first order), Better Booch KombuchaIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

OK, so it's been a teeny bit longer than a month….what can I say, it's hard to pin the Legend down these days! And then when you do, his audio quality is shit….but I digress. We let way too much time pass between episodes, so this is less of a “deep dive” and more of a quick recap of a ridiculous amount of ultra results from around the globe, including the last of the Golden Ticket races for the year, new 100K and 100 mile world records, national championships, Madiera, Miwok, Gorge Waterfalls, and much more!Beer for this episode: Athletic Brewing Rice HellesLinksPhil talks on the Inside the Line podcast about his Catskills Winter FKTPrint coverage of his adventure King vs. Hedges at BreakneckIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Whoa, it's been awhile! Life gets in the way of podcasting sometimes. So psyched to be back with Phil in the Cave for an awesome conversation with our coach, SWAP cofounder, podcaster, author, and world-class trail runner David Roche. In his second appearance on the show, we talk with David about goal setting and the mental approach to racing, before we hit the classic 20 questions topics: you know, Vonnegut, streaking, Michelle Obama, the usual.Links:Team SWAPThe SWAP Adventure PodcastOur first interview with David…and his wife Megan's 20 questions episodeBuy The Happy RunnerDavid's InstagramBeers for this episode: Athletic Brewing Run Wild, Captain Lawrence Orbital Tilt, Hoplark Calm One HopteaIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

West Coast trail goddess Dani Moreno gives us the lowdown on her breakthrough 2021 season before answering twenty stupid questions about cheese, ABBA, Tim Allen, and much more.Links:Dani's websiteBeers for this episode: Ober Creek Sundial, Ommegang Neon Rainbows, Kyla Ginger Tangerine KombuchaIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Wow! One hundred episodes! I couldn't think of a better way to celebrate the centennial than with one of my perennial favorite episodes, debating the mens' and womens' Ultrarunners of the Year. I was once again thrilled to be included on the voting panel for this award. And as usual, I brought in some outside help to set me straight on my voting before the ballot needed to be submitted this week. (I've basically stopped blogging, so you won't see all the changes I wound up making to what we discussed; the main one being my including Marisa Lizak in the top 5 for the women after I called Paul to help me better contextualize her Sparthalon performance.) Phil and I were once again joined by the great Jason Mintz, reprising his role from his initial appearance in 2018, as we talk about the top 10 men and women for the year, the top five performances, and I finally let loose on Camille.Beer for this episode: Alchemist Heady Topper, Definitive FloatLinksLaura Kline on the 2017 ballotJason Mintz on the 2018 ballotRich Heffron on the 2019 ballot for the women and menMy final ballot in 2016, 2017, 2018, and 2019Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

TOO. MUCH. WHISKEY.Links:Previous episodes we referred to on this show:Jason GreenTom KaplanJoe UhanMaggie GuterlAJWBeers for this episode: Industrial Arts Tools of the Trade, Sloop Juice Bomb, Yard Owl Rye Saison, High West Double Rye WhiskeyIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Phil and I sit down with repeat guests and GFOPs Laura Kline and Jason Mintz to drink our sorrows away as we livecast the lotteries for the Western States 100 and Hardrock 100. Spoiler alert: Phil and I don't get in. But a bunch of people who we know did, so that was kind of fun. This one goes off the rails as I get progressively more intoxicated, so tune in for that. (Split into two parts due to what is really criminally ridiculous length.)Links:Previous episodes we referred to on this show:Jason GreenTom KaplanJoe UhanMaggie GuterlAJWBeers for this episode: Industrial Arts Tools of the Trade, Sloop Juice Bomb, Yard Owl Rye Saison, High West Double Rye WhiskeyIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

One of the most fun episodes we've ever done. Jason Green, the founder of the Yeti Trail Cult and the RD of the Yeti 100, sits down in the 20 Questions hot seat to discuss Appalachia, skateboarding, ghosts, and Tyler Perry. Also: FIREBALL!Links:Yeti Trail CultBeers for this episode: Industrial Arts Torque Wrench, Sloop Juice Bomb, Three Taverns TeardrinkerIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Fall is in the air…leaves are falling, pumpkin spice is showing up in beer for some reason, and we are back for another episode of TMIU. We start with the epic performances at Big's Backyard Ultra, where the great Harvey Lewis crushed the world record for the format, and discuss whether experience is a benefit or a hindrance in this discipline. Then we tour the world to chat about Spartathlon, Run Rabbit Run, the Rut, TDG, and much more. Also: Taggart retires?Beers for this episode: Alchemist Luscious, Rushing Duck Irrational NumbersIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale0 Likes

It's been a few years since Matt Flaherty was dominating the roads and trails at the 50 mile and 100K distances, but he came back in a big way this summer when he crashed the Anton vs. Ian show at Leadville with an out-of-nowhere second place finish in his 100-mile debut. In the lates installment of 20 Questions, Matt talks about his training, valuing process over results, tackling environmental issues locally, and much more.Links:This is the article Matt mentioned about the Old Ghost Ultra.Some of Matt's music on SoundCloud Insta: @MattAFlahertyStravaEnvironmental Resilience Institute at Indiana UniversityBeers for this episode: Athletic Brewing Closer by the Mile, Run Wild, and Whirlpool Pale AleIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Did you forget about Cat Bradley? The former WS100 champ and podium finisher at Leadville may have been out of the spotlight during the pandemic, but she is on the brink of returning to the pinnacle of the sport in a big way. We talked to Cat about her recovery from the surgery that kept her from racing in 2020, her return to the trails this summer, her early-career struggles, the next Lord of the Rings, and more.Links:Cat's websiteInstagramThe newest addition to the Boundless Coaching familyBeers for this episode: Oskar Blues Mama's Little Yella Pils, Reed's Strongest Ginger BeerIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It's time you got to know Zack Beavin, an East Coast speedster who in the last couple of years has been shown to be a rising star in the ultrarunning world. An impressive 5:03 in his debut 50-miler at Tunnel Hill last year may have been overshadowed by another young phenom's debut 100 mile performance, but his performance at this spring's Strolling Jim—an amazing 3:50 for 40+ miles, breaking a 30-year-old CR held by Andy Jones (an Olympic marathoner and former national record-holder at distances from 50K to 100 miles)—stamped him as a force to be reckoned with among the wave of young ultra phenoms. We grabbed Zack for twenty questions about whiskey, bananas, Oreos, and many other things a growing body needs.Links:Beavin Endurance, Zack's coaching serviceInstagramTwitterBeers for this episode: Athletic Free Wave Hazy IPA, Oskar Blues Can-O-Bliss Hazy IPAIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

What happens when you don't do a recap pod for the two busiest months on the ultrarunning calendar? You need a MEGAPOD to catch up on everything you've missed. First, Paul Kentor (aka SteelTownRunner) drops by to bring his unparalleled fund of knowledge to bear on Sania Sorokin's astounding 24-hour world record run. Then, it's a blitzkreig of ultra and trail news and results, from Chamonix to Leadville to Silverton and everything in between.Beers for this episode: Lawson's Little Sip, Sloop Juice BombIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

We're heading back into the Tennessee heat for a recap of an epic year at the Last Annual Vol State 500K. We weren't sure anything could top Francesca Muccini's incredible CR performance from last year, until 2020 runner-up and former Pain Cave guest Bob Hearn came back to Tennessee and obliterated both the crewed and screwed course records while running without a crew. Bob agreed to a return visit to the Pain Cave where he was joined by women's screwed champ (breaking her own CR in the process) Beverley Anderson-Abbs, as we discussed this year's race, their approaches to walking, their lowest points, corn dogs, and, you know, searching for enlightenment.Links:Old episodes: 20Q with Bob, LAVS 2020 with Phil and FrancescaBob's blogBev's recent appearance on the UR PodBeers for this episode: Other Half DDH Mosaic + Galaxy IPA, Mikkeller Subway Mosaic IPA, Dogfish Head 60 Minute IPAIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Summer is heating up (or as Phil would say, “hotting up”) and we're here to cool you down with a fire hose blast of ultrarunning news, including recaps from Western States and Manitou's Revenge. We tackle all the big storylines coming out of Auburn, including our biggest surprises, guttiest performances, and how we did with our pre-race picks. We also pour one out for the 24-hour world championships, mispronounce a bunch of French names, and engage in some quickly dated (and wrong) speculation about Taggert's next race.Beers for this episode: Other Half DDH Small Citra Everything, Zero Gravity Green State LagerIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

One last episode before the Big Dance in Auburn! No beer for this morning pod, but The Legend is back as always to discuss the fallout from record attempts at Six Days in the Dome, plus our thoughts on the folks to watch this weekend at Western States. Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Just over a week out from Western States, it was a real honor to have returning top-10 runners on both the mens' and womens' side in the Pain Cave to talk about the Big Dance. Clare Gallagher is the defending champion at the nation's premier ultramarathon, and Kyle Pietari has four times placed in the top 10. The two Colorado residents joined us to talk about their recent trip to the Boundary Waters Canoe Area Wilderness in northern Minnesota, where they helped to crew and pace Alex Falconer to complete the first ever crossing of the preserve on foot. We spoke about their efforts to protect this wilderness and to bring awareness to the negative environmental impacts of proposed mining operations in the area. Then, we talked about this year's fantastic fields at Western States and how these two legends of the sport will approach the race. Finally it was Twenty Questions time, talking tapers, books, Instagram, and more. Links:Alex's pre-run summary of the Boundary Waters Traverse project, and his recap of the runFKT.com: The Boundary Waters TraverseSave the Boundary Waters: urge your representative to support the bill to protect the Boundary WatersAlso here; from this site specifically about the runBeers for this episode: Athletic Brewing Free Wave, Pawley's Island Big Sandy BeachesIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

The pride of the Cornell Big Red machine and perhaps the most versatile runner on the MUT scene in the past 15 years, Max King is one of my running heroes and now one of my all-time favorite guests. Know how many people have won both the World Mountain Running Championship and the World 100K Championship? One guy. That's the list. But he's also qualified for the Olympic Trials five times by my count (twice in the steeple, three times in the marathon) and has represented the US at the World XC Championships four times. We caught up with Max after he just got back from the Salomon young athlete training camp to talk about why it's taken him so long to get back to the 100 mile distance, his goals for Western States, adventure racing, longevity, and of course, the Dining Hall Classic.Links:Famous enough to have a Wikipedia page!Max's trail running campsWorld Athletics profileInstagramThis older interview gives you a little beta on the DHCBeers for this episode: Foreign Objects Mind Body Light Sound, Maine Beer Co. Lunch, Deschutes Teeny Hazy Ale Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

A true legend of the sport joined us in The Pain Cave this week. The great Andy Jones-Wilkins dropped by to offer his perspective on the state of the sport following the big announcement of the new partnership between UTMB and the Ironman Group. We also talked briefly about our excitement for the upcoming Western States 100 before we dove into 20 Questions to discuss skeleton, pierogis, and the best way to fertilize a tree.Links:Famous enough to have a Wikipedia page!AJW's Tap RoomInstagramCoaching for CTSBeers for this episode: Lawson's Little Sip, Jackie O's Who Cooks For You?, Sierra Nevada Hazy Little Thing Intro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

For the first time ever on the pod, two Brits are on the mic as we welcome in the amazing Beth Pascall. A top 10 finisher at both Western States and UTMB, Beth has to be considered one of the favorites for the big dance next month following her dominant win at the Canyons 100K. We talk about her win at Canyons and being back on the WS course again, before diving into 20 Questions to learn about her background, lobsters, and what she has in common with the Stanford mascot.Links:Beth's websiteBeth runs for SalomonFollow her on IGWe referenced her appearance on the Pyllars pod multiple timesBeers for this episode: Drowned Lands Soft Terra, Yard Owl Grisette Intro music: “God Save the Queen” by QueenOutro music: “God Save the Queen” by the Sex PIstols

Racing is back! And so are we, IN PERSON to drink some beer and throw out some lukewarm takes about the latest happenings around the ultra world. We dive deep on the big announcement on UTMB and Ironman, dissect results from Canyons and Jackpot, and discuss 100-mile world records on both the track and the treadmill. Also, I insult 200-mile trail races.LinksUTMB + IMBeer for this episode: Westkill Brewing CreeksideIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Another awesome guest joins the pod as we welcome in neuroscientist, Skyrunning champion, author, and North Face athlete Hillary Allen into the Pain Cave for the latest episode of Twenty Questions. We talk about Hillary's new book, Out and Back, which chronicles her recovery from a near-fatal accident while racing in Tromso, Norway, before turning our attention to the usual 20Q fare: you know, unicorns, chafing, and things of that nature.Links:Hillary's websiteHillary on IGBuy the book!Beers for this episode: Drowned Lands Deep Terra, Jackie O's Mystic MamaIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It's our second-ever EMERGENCY POD, and we finally wore down Paul Kentor (a.k.a SteelTownRunner) to come on the show and share his unparalleled fund of ultrarunning knowledge with us. We discuss Des' amazing (if not unexpected) performance, the history of the road 50K as a competitive event (on the world scene not much), the historical context of this performance, and where we'd want to see Des go next.LinksAmong many other articles about this, here's irunfar's coverage of the WRSteelTownRunner on Twitter and IGBeer for this episode: Industrial Arts Wrench

It's been a LONG time since our last TMIU episode, so here goes! Phil is back in the Pain Cave to discuss all things ultrarunning, including his return to racing at GDR, results from the first two GT races of the year, the Barkley Marathons, and the Ohio Backyard ultra. (We touched on the Carbon X2 record attempt in February's shoe draft episode, so decided to skip it here.) We also talk about the changes to the Western States lottery rules, Taggart vs. the haters, Koop vs. everybody, and much more.LinksKoop's IG postWS lottery changesOur interview with Joe Uhan about the WS lotteryOur interview with Taggart VanEttenBeer for this episode: Lawson's Sip of Sunshine, Pawley's Island Brewing Co. Big Sandy BeachesIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

We're back on the 20 Questions beat with #beastcoast stud and US National Snowshoe team member Cole Crosby. We talk to Cole about his recent run across the entire length of New Jersey, plus ducks, horses, motivation, pizza, and much more.Links:Cole's business, Cresting the SummitCole on IGBeers for this episode: Lawson's Sip O' Sunshine, Woodstock Brewing Mega Super Pixelated DIPA, Jackie O's Mystic Mama, Ommegang Abbey AleIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

We've drafted ultrarunning fantasy teams, we've drafted the elements of the perfect aid station, and now we're drafting the perfect shoe closet. Bryon Powell of iRunFar and Ian Golden of the Trails Collective join Phil and I for a brief state-of-the-sport discussion before we select our favorite all-time shoes in each of eight different categories. Charge your flux capaciters and gas up your DeLoreans, we're taking you back to 1993…and even a little farther.Vote here for the winner of our inaugural shoe draft!Beers for this episode: Equilibrium DHop 28, 4 Noses El Jefe Caliente, Alchemist Focal BangerLinksiRunFarThe Trails CollectiveRed Newt RacingIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

The defending champ at Transgrancanaria and the newly minted holder of the Wonderland Trail FKT, Kaytlyn Gerbin faces her toughest test: the 20 Questions hot seat. We talk about her favorite races, snowboarding, watermelons, weird costumes, and much more.Links:Instagram: @kaytlyn_gFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/kaytlyng/Strava: https://www.strava.com/pros/kaytlyn_gTwitter: https://twitter.com/kaytlyn_gerbinBeer for this episode: Sixpoint Sweet ActionIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

We start the new year off right with a visit to the Pain Cave from Taggart VanEtten. Who is that, you ask? He's the triathlete-turned-marathoner who shocked the ultrarunning world with an outstanding 12:19 win at the Tunnel Hill 100 in his ultramarathon debut. Taggart tells us about how his tri background helps him as an ultrarunner, why he decided to run Tunnel Hill this year, his training and nutrition, and more. LinksFollow Taggart on InstagramTaggart's blogDesert Island Picks: How Bad Do You Want It by Matt Fitzgerald, Tickets to my Downfall by Machine Gun Kelly, Miller LiteIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Time to bid goodbye to the possibly the strangest year in ultrarunning history. Phil and I do a quick recap of recent results before we welcome back the great Dylan Bowman to look back at the yar that was and to make our picks for Ultrarunner of the Year, Performance of the Year, FKT of the Year, and much more.Links:DBo's websiteDBo on the Pain CaveDBo's podcast, The Well (soon to be rebranded as Pyllars)Beers for this episode: Other Half DDH Monteuka + Galaxy, Peak Organic Slim Hazy, Great Notion Cloud Forest, Zero Gravity Little Wolf, Jackie O's Cool BeansIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

The pride of the #Beastcoast, Patrick Reagan, joins us in the Pain Cave for another edition of 20 questions. We talk about his favorite race, why he like racing in hot weather, playing guitar, racing 100s, why watermelon is awesome, and much more.Links:Follow Patrick on InstagramPatrick's websiteInterested in being coached by Patrick?Beers for this episode: Jackie O's Who Cooks For You, Peak Organic Slim HazyIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Phil gets to fanboy out as we welcome in defending Hardrock champ Sabrina Stanley to the Pain Cave to sit on the 20 Questions hot seat. We cover Sabrina's exploits on Nolan's 14 this summer, her favorite race and toughest race (hint: they're the same race), which one of us won the Ultrarunning Fantasy Draft by selecting her (hint: it was me), and more.Links:Follow Sabrina on InstagramThe truth will out: the Women's Ultrarunning Fantasy DraftBeers for this episode: Equilibrium/Great Notion Juice = Juice, Foreign Objects Ritual ColorsIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

British ultrarunner Kristian Morgan had to forego a second attempt on the Appalachian Trail this summer due to the travel restrictions in place because of the pandemic. Instead, he stuck close to home and took on the longest trail in the UK, the 630-mile South West Coast Path, taking aim at the four-year-old record set by the great Damian Hall. Kristian joined us for the third time in the Pain Cave to talk about his experiences on the trail, training during the pandemic, running with gratitude, and more. LinksKristian's pre-AT interview and post-AT interviewKristian's website and podcastSouth West Coast Path FKTIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Trail running beast Zoë Rom is the Associate Editor of Trail Runner magazine and the host of the DNF Podcast—a show about “failure in life and running…about unfinished business, and the unglamorous work of picking yourself up, dusting yourself off, and moving on.” Zoë joins us to talk about failure vs. hardship, overcoming fear, practicing self-compassion, FKTs, sled dog racing, and more. Also, how to say “hedgehog” in Italian. LinksZoë's website and coaching siteSocial media: Strava, IG, Facebook, TwitterDesert Island Picks: The Elegance of the Hedgehog by Muriel Barbery, Songs by Adrianne Lenker, Nutella, Outer Range Brewing Co. Meadows IPAIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

In the past two years, SoCal native Jake Jackson has progressed from a solid competitor on the southwestern trail-running scene to a top-10 finish at the 24-hour World Championships. Jake joins us on the show to talk about his meteoric rise to becoming one of the top US runners ever at 24 hours, how he balances his training with full-time work and family obligations, why he started working with a coach, battling imposter syndrome, and more.LinksFollow Jake on InstagramJake runs for rabbit, Spring Energy, XOSkin, Squirrel's Nut Butter, and Prevail BotanicalsDesert Island Picks: Born to Run by Christopher McDougall, S&M by Metallica, Rancid by Rancid, Miguel's Jr. burritos, Newcastle Brown AleThanks to Himalaya Botanique for sponsoring this episode of the Pain Cave. Himalaya Botanique— the toothpaste that's free from fluoride, SLS, and artificial colors and flavors, but bursting with foam and flavor! Enjoy 20% off your purchase of Himalaya toothpaste, using discount code PAINCAVE20 at Amazon. To learn more about Himalaya Botanique and Ayurvedic wellness visit Himalayausa.comIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

Are you ready to rock? Author, music journalist ,and trail runner Tony Fletcher makes his face-melting debut in the Pain Cave. We talk about how he cut his teeth in the British punk scene of the late 1970s, becoming a de facto professional journalist at fourteen, the Who vs. the Stones, trail running in the Catskills, traveling around the world, Crystal Palace, and more.LinksTony's website, where you can find info on his books and his blogOne Step Beyond, Tony's excellent podcastInstagram and TwitterDesert Island Picks: A Short History of Nearly Everything by Bill Bryson, Born to Run by Christopher McDougall, Tommy by The Who, Peanut Butter Clif Bars, Gipsy Hill Hepcat

Nice! The Legend is back for a “This Pandemic in Ultrarunning” update, as we check in on some of the recent trail and ultra races starting to every so slowly come back on line. We cover results from the Bear 100, IMTUF, Yeti, and Stumpjump and discuss our own returns to racing at Cat's Tail and 3 Days at the Fair. Plus, we discuss qualification for the Golden Trail finale, the starting field for Hardrock 2021, miniature goats, and more.Beer for this episode: Treehouse Julius, Lagunitas DayTime IPAIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale

It's a Some Work, All Play party in the Pain Cave this week as we welcome physician, epidemiologist, coach, author, and five time US trail running champ Megan Roche onto the 20 Questions hot seat. We talk about Megan's favorite race, her dream running partner, the loss of the North Face 50, how to cook a scoby, and much more.Links:Some Work, All Play (Team SWAP)The SWAP Adventure PodcastMegan's book, The Happy Runner (and our interview with co-author and husband David)Beers for this episode: Athletic Brewing Oktoberfest, Alchemist Focal Banger, GT's Trilogy KombuchaIntro music: "Fine Line" by the BloodlettersOutro music: "When I Was Still Young" by Yard Sale