Beginning Balance

In today's episode, Mark takes inspiration from George Constanza, the perpetually underachieving and romantically inept character from Seinfeld, to confront his negative business habits. In the episode "The Opposite," George realizes that he's always followed his intuiton, but every decision he's made has turned out to be wrong -- he's dissapointed in where his life has ended up, and in his failures with women. So, he decides to do the opposite, that is, everything his intuition tells him to do, he does the opposite. The result is predictably hilarious, and leads to George talking to women previously out of his league, and eventually landing his dream job managing the New York Yankees.   Mark has started employing the "Constanza Protocol," as he calls it, in business, as a way to break negative habit loops. As he has stated on multiple episodes, Mark struggles with the idea of having and managing employees (even good ones!) and his urge is to retreat to work he can do on his own -- like automating tasks or building new software tools. Under the Constanza Protocol, however, he has to do the opposite and instead run toward the manager/employee relationship, schedule calls and check ins, talk about hours and whether his employees are feeling happy about their workflow.   Maybe he won't be as successful as George, but it is a useful way to recognize your negative patterns and break out of them.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse shares his experience working on the YNAB books for the first time in many years, while YNAB's head accountant is out of maternity leave. Working through monthly and quarterly close  got him thinking about how software automation could free up the accounting departments time wrangling spreadsheets to do more impactful work for the business. To that end, he engaged Mark to consult on how YNAB can improve their accounting processes. Mark and Jesse continue with a discussion about the inevitability of change, and how employees and companies can position themselves to handle the disruptions that technological innovation create.   Jesse references one his oldest son's college courses, where entrepreneurs visit the class and deliver presentations on their careers and the future of business. On two separate weeks, two very successful entrepreneurs shared their thoughts on AI and how it is disrupting entire industries -- one had a very positive, excited outlook, the other a bleak, pessimistic outlook. The change is inevitable, however, so Jesse asks: which side do you want to be on?   You do have a choice.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Recently YNAB announced a major shake up in the way it talks about money. Jesse explains how the realization that each of YNAB's Four Rules was really just a variation of Rule One ("give every dollar a job") led to a deeper conversation about YNAB's core identity. Every year when the executive team met to reasses the company's purpose and direction, the team would change the stated purpose of the company. It became clear that YNAB wasn't a budgeting app, and it wasn't a set of rules for managing money -- there was some self-actualization happening in users that wasn't being captured by the way YNAB presented its method. Eventually the team landed on the word "spendfulness," to describe a state of spending money with purpose and intention.   Jesse discusses how the company has evolved to this point, and where it plans to go now that it has redefined its purpose and even changed it's methods (YNAB dropped the Four Rules for the Five Questions).   Mark wraps up the conversation musing on the pursuit of leisure, and why he has such a hard time indulging in leisure pursuits.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss the pervasive distractions that cell phones and computers cause, and how to fight back against them. Jesse champions the Freedom app blocker, which locks your phone or other device from distracting websites like social media, YouTube, blogs, etc. Since implementing Freedom, he boasts a phone usage time of only 20min per day (!), working toward his stated goal of "making the phone in my pocket feel weird."   Mark questions his propensity to continually start new ventures as part of an anxious reaction to having free time. He realizes that creating leverage in your business ought to lead to free time, which can be dedicated to hobbies and leisure. Without careful attention to cultivating hobbies and other interests, however, free time can become an empty vessel to be filled with more anxious activity.     Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse kick off the New Year with a deep discussion on inflation and how it creates confusion about the most important price of all -- the price of money.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Following up on Mark's admission that he dreads collaboration, whether it's with peers or employees, Jesse discusses one way the leadership team at YNAB has fostered collaboration. They call it the strategic council, and it's a two(ish) day meeting with all the functions at YNAB presenting the challenges and opportunities for growth in each function. The meeting is tightly structured, with desginated time slots for each team to present and field questions. This is critical to keep things moving and keep the focus on getting started with solving problems. It's not a time to fully solve problems and implement strategies, it's simply a time to get everything everyone is working on out in the open, so that everyone is aware of the challenges and no one is caught by surprise.   Mark points out that this type of meeting has the potential to become toxic if teams are concerned about protecting their own reputations rather than being open with their challenges, and thereby use the meeting time to deflect problems and shift blame. To Jesse, this kind of meeting can only happen productively with high trust teams, who are all aligned with the idea that the presentations are a way to make the company better. In a low trust environment, the collaborative aspect of the strategic council falls apart quickly.   Mark and Jesse end on a discussion of collaboration as a way of buying back your time. Jesse explains how his personal assistant has not only saved him time by taking care of mundane problems for him, but has shored up the "mental leaks" that occur when your focus is distracted by competing priorities. Mark shares that despite his preference to use software over humans to free up his time and mental capacity, he has found an employee with high initiative and drive to solve problems on their own to be very useful.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

In today's episode Mark explains what makes the perfect diet coke, and Jesse opens his inbox and reads some comments and questions from Beginning Balance listeners, including tips for improving business leadership skills, how to keep track of all your ideas, and why studies can be highly misleading. Mark and Jesse also address a question about UBI, or universal basic income, and bring up Mark's old standby phrase: "incentives are undefeated."     Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   Jesse Mecham YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse kicks off the episode talking about one of his new endeavours, Ultraspeaking, an effort to double down on one of his biggest strengths: public speaking. This leads to a conversation about embracing your strengths, the things that feed your working genius (see episode #102), rather than trying to build up your weaknesses. Mark shares his comfort speaking in front of audiences, and his fear... of not feeling fear anymore. In many cases, fear is an indicator that you're about to do something that will help you grow. The scary stuff, in other words, is probably the stuff you should be doing in your work, your business, your life!   For Mark, one of the scary things is actually commiting to playing to his strengths in his business, which for him means hiring people to do all the things he's not good at. No business can grow, Mark and Jesse agree, without collaboration of people all playing to their strengths. In Mark's case, identifying and plugging gaps in the business is satisfying work, but it's short lived when it's not aligned with his strengths -- it's really another form of procrastination, chasing the dopamine hit of solving a problem in the short term rather than positioning himself to do impactful work over the long term.   In this vein, Jesse discusses his big 2024 experiment: hiring a personal assistant. While he's still figuring out how best to utilize his assistant, Jesse finds peace of mind in the bandwidth that she creates for him. Knowing he can commit himself to new projects and teams without having to worry about scheduling and other life stuff puts him in the right headspace to focus on the things he's best at and the things most impactful to the business.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse are back after a short break with a discussion about slippery slopes... real and imagined. Jesse delivers an epic rant on the uselessness of economists, while Mark talks about his hesistance applying for graduate school in order to obtain the Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist credential.   Mark presents his dillema: he wants the credential to "reduce friction" for clients when other service providers refer him (say, a divorce attorney that refers Mark to a couple for marraige counseling before going down the path of divorce). Calling yourself a family and marriage coach, Mark reasons, makes you have to explain yourself, whereas the title of therapist is self-explanatory. On the other hand, he already has a busy coaching practice doing the same thing that therapists do, so the actual value of the degree is questionable (and the cost is high, in both money and time).   Jesse has a different take. In his mind, any friction that not having the official "therapist" label might create goes away with a strong referral. As soon as the attorney refers a client specifically to Mark, trust is created and the work can take place. It's all about the strength of the referral.   This leads to a discussion about credentials as a form of permission seeking, and the pricing power of a provider who offers their services as a non-credentialed coach versus a licensed therapist. In many ways, the people who become therapists have what Mark calls permission seeking traits -- they jump through the hoops in school to get the letters after their name, and when they start their practice they look to the rates of other therapists and set their own somewhere in the middle. On the other hand, coaches often position themselves in a more niche area at a higher price point, and command much higher rates.   At the end of the day, credentials may be another one of those slippery slopes -- something with more perceived value than actual value in the marketplace.     Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss their most recent read, Never Enough: From Barista to Billionaire by Andrew Wilkinson, a one-time barista and co-founder of Tiny, a holding company that buys and holds businesses for the long-term (like Berkshire Hathaway). At the age of 36, Wilkinson found himself owner of a company worth over a billion dollars, and in a new stratosphere of wealth he had never experienced before. What he found, though, was that the same problems which pervade life in the lower economic classes are still there in the upper crust. The presentation of the problems are different, sure (the middle class aren't generally obssessed with yachts), but the nature is the same -- jealousy, covetousness, ego, etc.    Jesse shares his own experiences dealing with business and financial success while trying to stay genuine and honest.... while cracking some terrible puns in the process.     Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Good gardens require good soil, and good soil takes compost and plenty of time. Jesse shares his experiences composting soil for his garden, and how it applies to business. Like compost, good business ideas take time to execute. They can be executed more quickly, but that often involves more complexity. Mark and Jesse then pivot to discuss complexity in business plans, and when it's worth pursuing complex solutions to problems.   Jesse's rule of thumb: if the business strategy is simple, but the implementation is complex, it's probably worth doing. Many things that appear simple on the surface involved solving complex problems. YNAB's direct import function is a good example. Direct import means that users can link their bank accounts to their YNAB account, and transactions automatically appear in YNAB for them to categorize. It's an important part of making YNAB a smooth and easy to use tool. The intricacies of actually pulling bank data from various banks, each with their own constantly changing API's and backend implementations, is very complex and requires a lot of effort to solve. On the other hand, if a business strategy complex at the outset, before you get into the details of actually pulling it off, it's probably a bad idea!     Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

The algorithm has come to rule media, and it is a voracious beast. It consumes as much content as people can create, as often as they can create. The ones who rise to the top seem to be those who create the most content, on as many platforms as possible, but what do the economics of this look like? Mark asks the question whether playing the content game is worth it for a business, and if so, what kind of business?   Many would agree that making content purely for quantity's sake, to appease the algorithm and get in front of as many eyeballs as possible, can be a soul sucking endeavour, but not all businesses seem to benefit equally from this type of marketing effort. Some businesses, espcially highly skilled service providers, do just fine relying on word of mouth marketing, and in fact, the more ubiquitous content creation becomes, the more special and valuable word of mouth referrals become.   Books referenced in this episode: Anathem by Neal Stephenson   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse shares one of his recent experiments, inspired by a guest on the Art of Manliness podcast. The challenge was to delete the apps on your phone, especially the ones you feel a "pull" from -- a pull to open it and check it every time you see it (most social media apps would meet this criteria for most people). As Jesse explains, phones don't just suck up your time, they suck up your attention, which is arguably even more valuable. Deleting your apps creates a barrier between your brain and that instant dopamine hit, which can restore some balance to your attention span over time.   It's a simple experiment to try, and the stakes are low. If you really need to access an app, you can always reinstall it, use it for a given task, then delete it again. Chances are, you'll find many apps that you don't need that often.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

On previous epsidoes, Mark and Jesse have discussed the importance of scarcity, and how limitations drive creativity. Mark even goes so far as to argue creativity can't exist without limitations! YNAB, then, is a tool for viewing reality through the lens of money -- a reality mirror if you like. By understanding the tradeoffs you are making with your money, you can see the truth of your financial situation. Instead of saying "it must be nice" to... fill in the blank -- make more money, spend less on X, etc -- YNAB helps you undertstand the choices you have made and, eventually, ask you the question "am I ok with this?"   As Jesse explains, this is the real magic of YNAB: enabling people to look at their money and see future possibilities, to make decisions firmly grounded in reality, and actively shape their life into what they want it to be. It all starts by taking a look in the financial reality mirror.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss YNAB's recent price increase, and the psychology of customers around pricing. You can't make everyone happy, whether you justify the price increase by citing your own increased costs or by plainly stating your price increase without explanation or caveat. Jesse points out that some customers that have complained about the price increase have moved to competing software, which has copied (read: stolen) YNAB's look, feel, and functionality.   Jesse's primary lesson is this: it's important for a business owner to know what is and what isn't important. It seems rational to get worked up about copyright violation and intellectual property theft, but that path leads to headaches and large legal bills, if anything can be done at all. In this case, he chooses to ignore the competing software becasue, in the end, they are focused on different audiences. The audience that wants a YNAB clone for less money is a small segment of the market that is very price sensitive. On the other hand, YNAB focuses on the segment of the market that isn't doing anything to manage their money, to help them get their finances under control and deliver value.   As Mark points out, tweaking a product or service solely based on customer feedback can be a slippery slope. You think you are satisfying everyone by responding to various demands, but there's a danger that you end up building a product customized to a small segment of the market that's already bought into your business, and losing the appeal to the broader market that isn't a customer yet.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse reminisce about the early days of YNAB, and a conversation over lunch in which Mark gave Jesse (what he thought was) sage advice -- to raise prices. Genius right? Jesse recounts how they raised prices in the earliest incarnations of YNAB's product, from spreadsheets to software to software-as-a-service. He also candidly breaks down a price increase that was poorly communicated to the YNAB team and to customers, and which tarnished the brand for a time.   Meanwhile, Mark kicks around the idea of lowering prices in his business!   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

After a conversation about using ChatGPT to organize the weekly recipe calendar for the Mecham household, Mark and Jesse talk about the concept of letting go of control in a business. Mark posits an idea: you can have control or you can have growth, but not both. And Mark hates it! Jesse draws a distinction between control of the business -- that is, controlling the mission of the business and the goals employees are striving for -- and micromanagement, where the business owner retains control over not only what things get done, but how they get done. Micromanagement, they both agree, is bad for both the employee, manager, and the owner.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss the role of customer service in a business, and how the alignment of customer expecations with the business owner's strengths (or working genius, if you like) is crucial to customer satisfaction and avoiding burnout. Mark shares an example from his virtual CFO business, which was highly profitable but making him miserable as his promise of what he would deliver was out of alignment with the type of work he enjoyed and thrived on. Jesse recounts a months-long ordeal getting his new car repaired, which ended on a good note -- a shop manager that took accountability for the mistakes of the business and personally took steps to re-align his customer service with Jesse's expectations.   Mark Butler The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss Patrick Lencioni's The 6 Types of Working Genius, a book exploring various personality types and the kinds of work most suitable to each. It's more than a personality test however! Lencioni's model assesses people according to their genius, competency, and frustrations in six areas: Wonder: The natural gift of pondering the possibility of greater potential and opportunity in a given situation Invention: The natural gift of creating original and novel ideas and solutions Discernment: The natural gift of intuitively and instinctively evaluating ideas and situations Galvanizing: The natural gift of rallying, inspiring and organizing others to take action Enablement: The natural gift of providing encouragement and assistance for an idea or project Tenacity: The natural gift of pushing projects or tasks to completion to achieve results   Mark and Jesse share the results of their assessments -- their areas of genius and their areas of frustration -- and how they have seen these things manifest in problems in their own businesses. They also discuss how understanding your genius and frustrations (notice the word frustration is employed, not weakness) helps to focus your efforts where you will be most impactful, and ultimately build better, more effective teams.   The 6 Types of Working Genius Assessment: https://www.workinggenius.com/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw0ruyBhDuARIsANSZ3wriydJmSn6fd5XTmzV-EF7jo6HeJf5swq4XvPmOtW7fzv2REGhNlcAaAt9oEALw_wcB     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

In today's episode, Jesse discusses his net worth tracker, a basic spreadsheet in which he records the balances of his investments and other assets quarterly. For Jesse, net worth is the scorecard of personal finance -- it's a way of keeping track of what direction you are going with your money. However, scorecard is an impersonal way to describe net worth, perhaps even suggests that one's value is tied to net worth. This could not be further from the truth! There's a lot more to a person than their net worth, but net worth does tell an important story about a person's money, and money is a vital part of a person, even if it's not their whole self.   As Mark has observed during his time coaching people to manage their money, people that routinely spend beyond their means -- that is, accrue negative net worth -- have allowed their desire for consumption to exceed their ability to consume. Their net worth represents a person who is out of touch with their tradeoffs. As Mark has mentioend in previous episodes, YNAB is all about making your tradeoffs crystal clear, and learning to love the choices you make to bring your money in alignment with your priorities. In short, learning to love your spending.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

In today's episode, Mark and Jesse discuss money as a concept, why it exists, and how trade (using money) has created tremendous value for humans throughout history. On the YNAB Podcast, Jesse has spoken about money being far more than a tool, however, and really an extension of one's self -- one's energies and desires. Mark and Jesse then attempt to connect the dots to our modern monetary system, where debt and inflation loom large. What exactly is it about money is essential to human flourishing?   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark kicks off today's episode with a handful of words, hoping to weave them into a broader discussion: vision, goal, strategy, plan, and tactics. Mark and Jesse discuss how many small business owners look for tactics first, various tasks focused on operations: posting on social media, starting a YouTube channel, building an email list. These may or may not be worthwhile activities -- you really need a strategy to understand the big picture of where the business is going (or needs to go), and then select the activities that will get you there. But even then, strategy is hollow, Mark argues, unless there's a why behind what you do. Unless the company has a clearly defined core identity, it will struggle to adopt a good strategy.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

In today's episdoe, Mark and Jesse discuss the importance of developing good systems, not just in business but in life! Mark shares a recent experience in which his wife left for a few days on a retreat, leaving Mark to handle her usual duties. Mark was faced with a lack of systems in day to day tasks, and enough friction to sit her down after the retreat and have a talk about family systems. Kate agreed, and, within a few weeks, became a systems expert, looking for every avenue she could find to create better processes.   Good systems aren't just for increasing business profit, they're for improving quality of life, relationships, and family harmony too!   The Goal by Eliyahu Goldratt and Jeff Cox https://www.amazon.com/Goal-Process-Ongoing-Improvement-dp-0884271951/dp/0884271951/ref=dp_ob_title_bk     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse ponder the question -- what do you do when growth slows and the business plateaus? Mark recalls a story about a successful businessperson who failed at several ventures before striking gold, and notes that the "gold" business was never hard. It grew a lot early on, and continued to grow steadily from there. He juxtaposes this result with some of his clients who spend hundreds or even thousands of hours working on a business, yet never really take off. There were signs of sucess early on in the good business, and likewise there were not signs of success in the failed ventures. Looking for signs of success is a good indicator of whether a business has legs or not. If you don't see any, it's a good indicator that your time is spent elsewhere!   Antifragile by Nassim Taleb https://www.amazon.com/Antifragile-Things-That-Disorder-Incerto-ebook/dp/B0083DJWGO/ref=sr_1_1?crid=JMRX5RI5RNZ8&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.C3e4IagEiQHRzgC0W8S0KkU1s2tYPbhDWivIreUIOtwe2xEXBRSw7sYgY8vGAZxpOF13z-5F3MCQJ00OZnI2iuM5RFHBnnqqX5yeUs348hp-T297HGOx2e0-cQ-XPjqTBF2D8WYJx5Kt0LCnHhsFfmbdwGDgxb3pwniTQYHi71ahb0q4CkhWvUHmByV0dJqUkoIHy2PEFt18GVXgLjePclPH4zK4uOKDXX14x9cdoAc.MlGqTaeOx35qrIkulkswcuGJuF4GOAXfSoFOGSpA4z8&dib_tag=se&keywords=antifragile+by+nassim+taleb&qid=1710465424&sprefix=antifragile%2Caps%2C102&sr=8-1     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

People have been hemming and hawing over the value proposition of college for years now, and in 2024, the value that a bachelor's degree offers is more questionable than ever. Mark and Jesse, both with teenagers staring down the barrel of college (or not) in the next few years, share their thoughts on the subject. As Jesse argues, the purpose of education is "to learn how to do something, when you don't know how to do something." As Mark points out, the resources for self-education are more prolific than they've ever been, meanwhile critical thinking in school appears to be as low as ever.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

We usually talk about stress as something you need to reduce, or recover from. But there are different types of stress -- good stressors and bad stressors -- and sometimes stress drives us to accomplish things and innovate when we otherwise wouldn't. To that end, Mark and Jesse discuss Morgan Housel's book Same As Ever: A Guide to What Never Changes, in which Housel outlines the way stressors and risk taking drives us to grow achieve new things. Mark also shares a recent story about how the stress of a bookkeeping sprint at work provided the spark for him to write new software to automate a key process in his business, and save a lot of time as a result.   Other books mentioned in this episode: Endurance by Alfred Lansing The Psychology of Money by Morgan Housel     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse defends the New Years resolution, and offers up of his own resolutions for the year, namely being kind. Mark resolves to try really hard, and be a better friend.   Harvard study on men's happiness (started in 1938!): https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-secret-to-happiness-heres-some-advice-from-the-longest-running-study-on-happiness-2017100512543   Musical interlude courtesy of Kevin MacLeod: "Investigations" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark shares a trend he has become aware of in his business: his highest revenue clients are also his least time-consuming clients, and thus his most profitable clients. On balance, the clients who pay the least under his sliding scale fee structure end up taking the most time to process. This discussion begs the question -- when do you fire a client?   Jesse hashes out some ideas for a new fee structure so that Mark can retain higher-touch clients while incentivizing them to comply with the best practices that make them easier to process. They discuss the importance of focusing on the client's emotional state and how changing their behaviors to comply with Mark's system (such as opening accounts at banks that are easy to query for data, and minimizing the total number of accounts) can bring them value by reducing stress and increasing insight into the trajectory of the business.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark shares a recent conversation with a client fixated on "diversifying" her business, which to her meant expanding her coaching services from 1-on-1 to group coaching. Diversification is one of those concepts that sounds wise (of course you should diversify!) and is a bedrock concept of investing. However, as Jesse points out, what most people think of as diversifying is really just expanding -- expanding product and service offerings, introducing new price points. The expansion still serves the same market. True diversification is decoupled entirely from the product or service, like using excess earnings to buy Treasury bills. The value of T-bills is independent from the performance of the business.   There is nothing wrong with expansion! It's natural as busineses grow and accumulate more institutional knowledge to seek out new opportunities to leverage that knowledge. But it's not diversification. That prompts Mark and Jesse to ask the question, why? Why do you want to diversify? What's the thought behind the thought? The answer can reveal the true nature of the problem -- maybe the business owner is worried about some risk exposure in the business and is trying to sidestep solving that problem (or perceiving the problem to be bigger than it really is), or perhaps the owner is simply bored and looking for a new problem to solve.   Whatever the answer, before you take steps to diversify your business, understand the why behind the motivation so you don't end up merely distracting yourself from the core business.     Acquired Podcast on Costco: https://www.acquired.fm/episodes/costco     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse shares a conversation he had with the YNAB executive team about spending (and giving) with joy, and Mark relates how many business owners struggle with this problem. Mark also shares a recent talk with a client agonizing over an upcoming vacation, which he believes will require him to make poor financial decisions. As Mark has coached him through the process of planning for the vacation and saving cash beforehand, he has been able to navigate through his all or nothing feelings -- the idea that you either enjoy life or be financially responsible (at the expense of enjoyment). There is a middle way!   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse actually read the book (almost)! After completing most of the book recommended by a listener, 10x Is Easier Than 2x: How World-Class Entrepreneurs Achieve More by Doing Less by Dan Sullivan and Benjamin Hardy, Mark and Jesse share their thoughts on organizing your business and your life to harness your "unique ability."    Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

A listener requested Mark and Jesse comment on the book 10x Is Easier Than 2x: How World-Class Entrepreneurs Achieve More by Doing Less by Dan Sullivan and Benjamin Hardy -- and they happily oblige! Except... they haven't read the book. Yet. Nevertheless the title is thought provoking, and they debate the merits of growing a business slowly vs growing quickly, as well as the difference between doing it as a startup vs a mature business. Jesse shares his experience 10x'ing YNAB over the years, and how the challenges of the business scaled with his own vision and expectations for the company.     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse share a snippet of a long conversation about the nature of opportunity cost in budgeting. They broadly divide people into two different personality types: the accumulators who diligently follow the rules of budgeting and amass cash, and the spenders who focus purely on what that cash can buy them -- experiences, memories, mementos, etc.   Both camps face a hard challenge in budgeting. The accumulators may have a lot of cash, but at what cost to their relationships? What opportunities did they miss or forego to continue accumulating wealth? On the other hand, the spenders face a very concrete cost, that is, the money that they spent to acquire the things they wanted. Perhaps they lack financial stability, or safety, as a result of their spending. Either way, the hard work in budgeting really boils down to understanding what cost you bear in your spending decisions. The above examples are the extremes of a spectrum, but wherever you fall on the line, there is a cost to your current behavior, and understanding that cost -- and aligning that cost with your values and priorities in life -- is the key skill to a fruitful financial life.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark explains his unique system for managing his day to day tasks after years of struggling with ADHD. For Mark, it's all about managing his energy and honoring his mindset in the current moment. If the "dirt pile" calls (his affectionate name for an ongoing earthmoving project in his backyard), then that's what he does, whether or not it's the "best" or most important use of his time in the moment. Over the years, Mark has learned that allowing himself space to indulge in physical tasks often has the benefit of settling his mind and, therefore, putting him in a good headspace to tackle bigger, more stressful business challenges. For Mark, productvitiy follows his headspace.   Jesse, on the other hand, has a very different style for getting things done. Jesse is a man of systems, and he's also a man with a long to-do list. He mentions how in the past he has been called out for letting tasks slip or needing reminders to follow up on things. So for Jesse the priority is making sure that tasks don't live in his head, but are organized in a good system. He likes David Allen's Getting Things Done (GTD) productivity system, which asks a person to first organize and sort through their list of tasks before tackling them. With a good categorization of tasks in place, it becomes easier to execute tasks at the time and place when you can do them, rather than relying on your mind's own reminder system which often reminds you when you can't do anything about the task! Jesse adds a weekly review to his process, to make sure he's working on things that matter -- in business and personal life -- and not avoiding challenging tasks by filing his day with low-level admin work.   The takeaway? People can get things done with very different approaches. One key to figuring out what will work for you is to recognize and honor who you are. As Mark's mentor says, you can't will yourself to be the kind of person who systematically categorizes and organizes tasks if that's who you are by nature. Once you accept that, then you can find the system that works for you.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse answer a listener question about how to run more effective meetings, particularly for introvert-heavy groups. Jesse talks about the importance of ice breakers (although you don't have to call them that) and standardized meeting structures across the company. Mark and Jesse also discuss some new books on their reading list, including a book about the keys to longevity.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark poses a question -- how much knowledge about money does someone need? As in, how much time and energy should one devote toward investing, planning for future needs and problems, and other future considerations? Jesse offers some examples of how people often seek assurances, guarantees that their future income (and circumstances) will be safe. The reality, however, is that if you are in business, or even if you are an employee in a business, you are taking risk, and that risk cannot be mitigated to zero.   One takeaway from this conversation is that when you live within your means and create financial cushion in your life, you leave yourself open to take advantage of future opportunities. And as Jesse points out, the personal bleeds into the business. Business IS personal. So the same thing holds true for both the business' balance sheet and the business owner's balance sheet. When there is ample cash on hand and the owners live well within their means, the business can take more risks and take advantage of opportunities that would have been closed otherwise.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark provides an update on his son Charlie and his budding mechanic career, and voices some concerns about his continuing to work at the auto shop. Charlie made some good money replacing brakes on a family friend's vehicle, and is considering making the jump to a mobile auto service business (as Mark and Jesse first discussed in Episode 79).   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse discuss the process of setting compensation, salaries, bonuses, and communicating those effectively to the team. Compensation is a touchy subject. Businesses want to incentivize employees to perform at a high level and reduce turnover by compensating them well. Employees need to feel like they have space to grow their skills and capabilities in the organization, and be compensated accordingly. And many business owners want their employees to be happy and feel fairly compensated, out of care for the people they have grown close to and relied upon to build their business. Therein lies a minefield, however!   Jesse argues that compensation, including salary, benefits, and bonus, carries a lot of information and expectations. Business owners should set compensation based on market rates for a given role, discounted to what the business can afford (both what the business can afford to pay and what amount of turnover the business is willing to accept if they pay significantly under market). Business owners should NEVER compensate out of a sense of charity, generosity or to "share the wealth," epsecially with unplanned bonuses. While these things can seem great in the moment, they can cause serious confusion for employees. Why did I get this? How do I get it again? Should I expect this every year? If I don't get it next year, does that mean I'm performing poorly, or the business is doing poorly? There are many pitfalls to basing compensation on something other than the cold hard facts of market rates and clear job descriptions.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

...probably comes from doing more of what you're already doing, not a new venture or even a new product. But Mark and Jesse have talked about digging trenches already. Today they ask the question, is it enough for a business owner to put their head down and just dig more trenches? When do you look around, observe broad trends in your industry, and react to those? It's a balancing act, with risks on both sides of the question.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse dissect the culture of striving that pervades American society, in businesses and consumers alike. There seems to be a tacit assumption that all business should be about more -- growing more, making more money, etc -- and you don't have to look far to see the same mentality in consumer culture. In fact, it's the heart of the economy! The desire for more is endless, a hole which can never be filled. So, how do you figure out what is enough?   Mark and Jesse have encountered peers struggling with this question, and have noted that limitations can be freeing. If you simply tell yourself that what you have is what you will have forever, you create boundaries and limitations which actually spur creativity and help you figure out what you really want (not just want other people say you should want). Mark uses the house as an example on the consumer side. What if you said to yourself, this house that you are currently in is it -- this is the house you will own and live in until you die. With no possibility for moving in the future, or building something else, you're free to think about what you don't like about your current house, and what you would change. Maybe there are some things that you dream about having in a future house, like a pool, that you discover you are fine without. Or maybe you can't live without one and must find a way to put one in!   It's a useful creative exercise to get closer to answering the question -- how much is enough?     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark shares a difficult personal situation he and his family have been dealing with, that has signficant financial ramifications. Recently Mark's wife was diagnosed with cancer, and she has undergone chemo treatments and a litany of medical tests. As the medical bills continue to pile up, Mark finds himself having to float tens of thousands of dollars in costs while he waits to be reimbursed by their health sharing plan.   While this can be a very scary proposition, he has found peace and security in the YNAB process. Most importantly, Mark says, YNAB tells him the truth about his financial situation, neither catastrophizing nor softening the ramifications of unexpected large medical bills, and that clarity has been critically important to making good decisions and maintaining sanity.     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

It's happening! Mark's son is taking the step toward business ownership. His plan is to leave his job at the auto shop behind, and start a mobile oil change business. Mark and Jesse discuss some of the challenges of pricing his service, establishing a recurring revenue model, and marketing to the most influential groups he has access to.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse shares a recent situation that would have sent shivers through most owners. Following a revision in the tax code regarding software R&D costs, YNAB discovered it would be facing down a huge tax bill, over triple what they anticipated for the year. While this might bankrupt some companies, Jesse and the executive team were able to take the news calmly, and use the company's cash reserves to easily handle the tax bill.   It's a triumph of cash over the unexpected, and a YNAB success story!   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

What if all your spending... was actually borrowing? Ok, well not ALL your spending, but those situations in which you pull money from one category of your budget and apply it to another. Jesse gives the example of going to a special dinner at an exclusive restaurant. Reservations are very difficult to get, and you finally get one when someone else cancels -- but it's tonight. And you don't have the cash available in your restaurant category! So you move money from another budget category to cover the expense, because this is your only chance to go to dinner. We all run into these situations from time to time. Maybe it's not a fancy restaurant, but situations arise where you have to spend money now or forego an opportunity forever.   YNAB does a good job of making you aware of the tradeoffs. When you move money from, say, car repairs, to cover the restaurant expense, you must acknowledge that your car repair category is now underfunded, and that you'll have to replace that money later. Essentially, you're saying that "future you" will figure it out and generate the cash needed to replenish that fund. Jesse takes this a step further. Really, even though you "had the money" because it was in your budget, you still borrowed from future you -- because you created a liability which future you must take care of.   You didn't actually take on debt per se -- you didn't charge a credit card or take out a loan -- but you did borrow the money, from yourself. In that sense, everything is borrowing. Mark and Jesse explore the implications of this line of thinking, and how YNAB could better illustrate this concept.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse answer a question from Beginning Balance listener Allison (thanks for listening Allison!). Allison asks: what do you do when you get paid? How much should you set aside for taxes and retirement savings?   It's a great question, and many business owners struggle with this. Mark and Jesse explain the concept of "profit first" and why the business should pay you first, then take care of bills and expenses. As it turns out, using YNAB makes this process easy to implement in your business, but profit first does require some patience and discipline. Starting with a small percentage of profit (Jesse offers a few ways to calculate a good profit percentage to distribute) and slowly increasing that amount over time keeps you from overreaching and distributing too much money, which you might have to contribute back to the business in the event of unforeseen expenses. A slow and steady approach also gives you time to dial in your budget, and plan for future expenses as well as build up reserves for unforeseen expenses.    Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com  

On the previous, Mark shared a recent experience about letting an employee go. Not long after, another team member left for a great opportunity at another company. On a small team like Mark's, the loss of two employees back to back poses a big problem, as the workload gets spread to the remaining employees (a BIG increase) and some institutional knowledge is lost. Even with great systems and documentation, there's always some amount of institutional knowledge lost when an employee leaves, not to mention it takes time for their replacement to get up to speed.   This experience of picking up the slack, including both high and low skill work, got Mark thinking -- the curse of a small team is that skilled labor can leave for better opportunities, in which case the remaining skilled labor ends up doing a blend of low and high skill work. Ultimately, the business ends up paying skilled wages for work which is not entirely skilled, cutting into margins.   With this new revelation, Mark describes his plan for moving all low skill tasks in his business to lower skilled, lower wage employees, and why it's critical that businesses strive for this efficiency.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

It's not a fun part of the job, but sometimes you have to let employees go. Mark discusses a recent experience, and why, in retrospect, he should have acted much sooner. Jesse shares his thoughts on when, and why, you should let go of team members, when it's clear they aren't a good fit with the organization.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse consider the wave of AI technology that is rapidly being deployed in a number of industries. Whether it's the dreamlike collage-art of Midjourney or ChatGPT's pedantic essays based on conversational prompts, AI seems to be on everyone's lips these days. What remains to be seen is how quickly -- and broadly -- it will impact businesses. Mark and Jesse both agree, though, that now is the time to consider how it might impact your business and how you could make use of it.   Jesse offers a simple exercise to get started -- write down (without Googling!) every way you can think of that AI could replace or perform some aspect of your business. Write each idea down on a sticky note, and as you amass a lot of sticky notes start to organize them, arrange them into categories, and see what patterns appear. At the very least, this exercise can help you start to understand better what your business is, where and how AI can help or hurt your processes.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Jesse and Mark return to their credit card debate from episode #69 (recorded last year in 2022) and discuss how business is going with using a credit card. Jesse went cold turkey and stopped all use of credit cards, while Mark kept a card for just a couple recurring transactions, but greatly reduced his usage.   The consensus? Even though YNAB attempts to treat credit card spending the same as cash, because you have to set aside cash to cover the credit balance, it's NOT the same as cash. Even if you diligently set aside cash to cover your credit card expenses, until you actually pay off the card... well, the card isn't paid off! There's mental overhead in having to set aside cash for purchases as they occur, while also remembering to pay off the card. And while it may seem small, Mark and Jesse were surprised at the impact it had on their thinking and emotions around money.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse share their New Year's resolutions for 2023, and why their goals and plans are getting simpler as time goes by. One common goal for 2023? Mark and Jesse are recommitting to YNAB, and ditching the credit card.   Mark Butler, Virtual CFO The Money School: https://moneyschool.works https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com

Mark and Jesse have discussed the advantages of being cash focused since the beginning of the show -- such as episode #3: Your Cash Is Your Strategy -- and part of being cash focused is not being focused on debt, or using debt to fund business operations. Most followers of YNAB can agree with this outlook, however credit cards fall into a grey and sticky area.   Jesse contends that credit cards actually pose a number of problems, even for people who use them "responsibly," that is, pay them off regularly and never carry a balance or pay interest. His main problem is the fact that banks push them so hard -- there must be an incentive to have people transact with credit cards rather than with debit cards or cash. Of course, banks and payment processors make money with every swipe, about 3% of the transaction value in fact. As credit cards have become ubiquitous, this transaction cost has been baked into the price of goods, too.   Jesse also cites some research that revealed spending with credit essentially provides you with a dopamine hit similar to what you get just buying things. Credit is an appeal to the lizard brain, the idea that you are getting something without giving something. Of course you are giving something, just not yet. It's the "not yet" part that short circuits our brain. And this psychology often leads us to simply spend more than we would otherwise when we use credit cards.   So, can you stop using credit cards in your own business and personal life? Mark and Jesse are going to give it a try in 2023, and see what happens...     Mark Butler, Virtual CFO https://markbutler.com https://letsdothebooks.com   YNAB https://www.youneedabudget.com