The Areté Institute presents an edgy and entertaining educational podcast for teachers, students, parents, administrators and anyone else who cares about the state of education. While it is playful and fun, we also address the revolutionary changes that are happening and need to happen to create mor…
The Overthrowing Education podcast is an incredible show that provides valuable insights and truths about education. The guests on the podcast bring a wealth of knowledge and expertise that add immense value to the purpose and mission of the podcast. This podcast is a must-listen for every educator as it shares wisdom that can be immediately implemented in the classroom. Batsheva Frankel, the host, does an excellent job of finding great content to share, keeping listeners entertained throughout each episode with her lighthearted faux-mercials and game show segments.
One of the best aspects of The Overthrowing Education podcast is its ability to balance lightheartedness with substantive discussions about education. The show captures the essence of how educators feel about their jobs, providing a refreshing perspective on teaching. It challenges archaic teaching methods and promotes forward-thinking ideas on how schools can adapt to modern society. The guests and conversations are engaging, and the emphasis on listening to student voices is commendable.
However, there are no apparent negative aspects to this podcast. It consistently delivers great content, entertaining segments, and thought-provoking discussions. It keeps listeners engaged from start to finish, leaving them eagerly anticipating future episodes.
In conclusion, The Overthrowing Education podcast is a remarkable show that offers innovative ideas and perspectives on education. Batsheva Frankel's creativity and experience shine through as she navigates each episode with enthusiasm. The inclusion of faux-mercials and game show segments adds an extra layer of entertainment while maintaining a focus on the urgent need for educational reform. This podcast is truly inspiring for educators seeking ways to connect better with their students and create equitable learning environments.
This is the first totally new episode in about 10 months. What could get me to put aside my other work to make sure this episode gets out? Only something as important as the death of critical thinking in our education system and how it has especially played out this school year of 2023-24 would make me drop everything to make sure to get this out. Please open your mind and heart while listening to this episode. I want to thank Distant Cousins, one of my favorite bands, for their incredible music that opens and closes my show. Give them a listen! Want to get in touch with me? IG: @batsheva.frankel X: @batshevafrankel website: batshevafrankel.com
In this encore of the 4th episode in the series on AI in education, my guest, Matt Miller and I discuss the issues we need to consider as well as some very practical ideas for using ChatGPT and other really cool AI in our classes. Matt has been digging deep into this subject and brings so much wisdom and insight into our conversation. Matt shares some great resources to explore in the links below. And he also plays a fun version of The 5-Minute Game Show called “ChatGPT, Google or Me?” I'd like to thank my awesome guest Matt Miller and my fauxmercial helpers including my award-winning Voice Actor friend, Eli Schiff as the announcer and Jakey Schiff, Yossie and Tuvia Frankel. This is a great time to buy any burned-out or otherwise deserving teacher friend or colleague some Overthrowing Education Swag. Or buy some for yourself. You totally deserve it! Links and Resources: ChatGPT, Chatbots and Artificial Intelligence in Education Tons of great resources and classes: DitchThatTextbook.com Get on Matt's email list to get all kinds of amazing resources: DitchThatTextbook.com/join Classroom videos to use in class TODAY: Teachflix This project provides you with research-based teaching practices you can use in class tomorrow to save time AND teach better: EfficienTEACH.com
This encore episode is a favorite of mine, but maybe I'm just partial. Here is the description from the original version: Is it possible that Robots/AI will replace teachers someday? II first examined this question in an episode in early 2020. My guests said no, but my son, 14 at the time, predicted much of what we are seeing now with the explosion of growth in Artificial Intelligence. So, I brought my son, now almost 18, back on the show to give his reflections on his past predictions and update us again. Is it inevitable that teachers will become obsolete? What can we do to make sure that we, as real live educators, are irreplaceable? What do you think? What do your students think? Let me know on the platform formerly known as Twitter @overthrowinged. I want to thank Tuvia for indulging me and coming back on with his updated reflections, and a special shout out to the amazing voice over artist Eli Schiff for playing the male teacher and Robo-Helper on the fauxmercial. I also want to thank all the teachers who originally let me know what tasks they dread that they would love to outsource to a robot which were reflected in Robo-Helper Make someone's day with cool Overthrowing Education swag!
This encore episode is the second part of my early exploration of AI in education. Here is the description of this episode from January, 2023: If you haven't yet listened to the first in this AI in Education series, episode 89, you might want to do that first. It's not essential but it does give some background that feeds this episode's discussion. In that episode, I mention some excellent essays by super prolific author and culture writer Stephen Marche. And now Stephen is my special guest on the show today. He is a font of information and a lot of fun to talk with. Among many other aspects, we discussed some great things we can do with AI in our lessons, along with other potential benefits. Additionally, we addressed how AI will affect homework, tests, and essays in many subjects. We also get into the scary potential for increasing inequity in the education system. And I asked a really important question on many educators' minds – Can AI write lesson plans for us? Speaking of AI writing things for us, I decided to see what would happen when I asked ChatGPT to write my fauxmercial. And I really did give it the first and second prompt that were described in today's fauxmercial, and those really were the responses it gave me. The rest of it I wrote and performed along with Yossie Frankel as the announcer, Tuvia Frankel as the first AI response and Robin Glickstein as the second AI response. After sort of co-writing with ChatGPT, I was really happy to co-write The 5-Minute Game Show with an actual person – Eve Hirschman. It was a lot more fun. Spoiler: Stephen aced his game show. I believe that educators everywhere should be hearing what Stephen has to say, so please share this episode with every educator you know. @stephenmarche on the platform formerly known as Twitter Find Stephen's essays, novels, non-fiction books, appearances and more at www.stephenmarche.com
This episode was orginally recorded in November of 2022, just as we were hearing about ChatGPT and AI in education. Many of us were wondering what will happen to the way we teach and the way students learn. This is the first part of my exploration about AI in Education. My views on it, my concerns, my hopes have all changed many times over the last year and 1/2. It's interesting to go back and see how far we've come. Here is my original description of the episode: There has been an explosion of handwringing among educators and academics, and cheers from students about the strides and easy accessibility of Artificial Intelligence that will probably change the entire nature of how we educate. What can we expect? How do we adapt? Can anything good come out of this? This is just the first in a series of examinations of this incredibly important topic that will certainly affect every aspect of education at least from middle school through higher education. On this episode it's just me and AI. We even had fun playing The 5-Minute Game Show! Well, at least I did. I can't speak for my friendly AI. I want to especially thank Tuvia Frankel for clueing me in to the importance of dealing with this issue right away, and for writing the fauxmercial! Resources and Links: Various great essays on AI by Stephen Marche in The Atlantic The End of High-School English by Daniel Herman in The Atlantic The Brilliance and Weirdness of ChatGPT by Kevin Roose in The New York Times
I've been taking a break from publishing new episodes since mid-August, and now I have a special announcement!
My awesome guest on this encore episode is educator, author, and lovely, charming human being Lindsay Portnoy who joins me today to talk about why playing games, and playing in general are the best way to learn and how to incorporate games and play into any subject or grade. Lindsay has so many inspiring and wise approaches to education and we really geek out together on this favorite topic for both of us. As for the 5-Minute game show, Lindsay racks up lots of imaginary points as she slays it! Thank you so much to Lyndsay Portnoy and also to Yossie Frankel, the deep voice that joined me on the Edu-game-arama fauxmercial. Resources: www.lindsayportnoy.com Game On? Brain On! Designed to Learn The episode that Lindsay mentions that has the singing game show, featuring the amazing voice of Barbara Heller: Kevin Stoller: Why Kids Hate Math and How to Fix it. The episode with Micaela Blie's hilarious story about the Oregon Trail game she played with her students: Jon Cassie: Game-Based Learning Batsheva's workshop on Deeper Learning Games (and other workshops): https://www.newlensed.com/workshops
What is a fauxmerical? It's a commercial parody with fake educational products we wish were real. They come towards the beginning of every episode. What is an encore? It means I've played it before, in this case 12/22. What is 12/22? A year I was relieved was almost over, until experiencing 12/23, that is. This last year was so awful that I'm nostalgic about 2022. Go figure. Anyway, now, I really need to laugh. I hope you enjoys these as much as we enjoyed making them. Special thanks to all the voice artists who contributed to not only these fauxmercials, but all of them from the last 4 years.
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! On this episode, Zaynab Baalbaki joins me. She is a passionate educator who is truly working on and supporting others in overthrowing education and creating amazing and equitable learning spaces joins. She talks about an incredible public school, Escuela Verde, where she worked in and I also talk about Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning, another example of education at its best. We also discuss how more traditional schools and districts can start slowly to incorporate elements of both these and other transformative schools into their learning spaces. Don't forget to listen to The 5-Minute Game Show at the end of the interview, not only because it's fun, but also because we drop more good ideas and some cool facts about Wisconsin. Lastly, astute listeners will notice that the fauxmercial in this episode is related to the one from the previous episode. I had so much fun with Jake Miller from the last episode, I asked him to help me again with the fauxmercial for this episode. Special thanks to my guest Zaynab Baalbaki, and my terrific voice actors who joined me on today's fauxmercial, Jake Miller who hosts the Educational Duct Tape podcast and Tuvia Frankel who is always a good sport. Links and Resources: Contact: zbaalbaki@gmail.com Twitter: @zbaalbaki Escuela Verde Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning Teacher Powered | Ambassador Wisconsin Resource Center for Charter Schools | Charter School Consultant Wisconsin Association for Environmental Education | JEDI Committee
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! In this episode, veteran educator and podcast host Charles Williams and I have a great conversation about the work we need to do to create true equity in education and the importance of challenging our current narratives. We also talk about problematic intrinsic biases that we all have and how to change them. Even though the topics we discuss are serious and important, along with all the practical ideas, we do get very silly (and not just on The 5-Minute Game Show, although he slays his food themed game show!). Special thanks to Charles and to my fauxmercial helpers Yossie Frankel and the wonderfully talented Linda Korn for writing and singing the original Paradigm Shifters jingle that I borrowed. Important Links and Resources: CW Consulting Service The Counter Narrative Podcast Inside the Principal's Office Podcast Twitter: @_cwconsulting School Rubric Team Code Breaker
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! Long-time educator Jared Magee, from the very cool The Winchendon School, shares what Impact Learning is, why it's important, and how to make it happen for all educators. Jared and I discuss ways to take what he has learned from his experiences there and mine working for another non-traditional school, Arete Preparatory Academy , and apply them to other, more traditional school situations. Special thanks to guest Jared Magee, and also Yossie Frankel for joining me on today's fauxmercial! Check out all of things we spoke about on this episode: The school's website The Winchendon School A (literal) product of ColLABs The Little Elf Cutter from Mr. Bryan Perla Prose's (Jared's podcast) Official Website Prose @Mr.JaredMagee¸ @winchendon_brooklyn @MrJaredMagee
Even before the extreme challenges of pandemic teaching, my guest, Amber Harper of The Burned-In Teacher Podcast was a valuable resource for helping with the very real problem of teacher burn-out that affects most teachers even multiple times in a career. But now, with everything educators have been through trying to teach in 2020, Amber's Burned-In Teacher approach is a true remedy where she gives solid tools and advice on what to do when you're feeling burnt-out. And then Amber plays a fun The 5-Minute Game Show, where the clues are Haikus. Thank you so much to my wonderful guest, Amber Harper, and to my fauxmercial actors Dr. Shindale Seale, who has been an In the Trenches guest on past episodes, and of course, my husband, Yossie Frankel Links for Amber: www.burnedinteacher.com www.burnedinteacher.com/burnoutquiz Twitter, IG @burnedinteacher Facebook: facebook.com/burnedinteacher support@burnedinteacher.com Shows we love that we mentioned: The Great British Baking Show Sugar Rush The Kids Baking Championship Project Runway Nailed It
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! This episode explores why kids hate math and what we can do about it featuring a conversation with John Bianchette of Mathnasium from January 2020 with a recent additional talk to reflect the radical changes that have taken place since then. In the Trenches, I trace my journey from hating math as a student and defining myself as “I'm not a math person” in adulthood to finally realizing that I actually enjoy math because of the math teachers at Areté Preparatory Academy. I'll share some of their tips and tools that transform students, too. Also, The 5-Minute Game Show features a musical parody game you won't want to miss. It features amazing voice impressionist and artist Barbara Heller. Today's Fauxmercial, Math-o-matic, features Yossie, Tuvia and me. www.mathnasium.com https://www.mathnasium.com/mathnasium-at-home https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-bianchette-52404a40/ https://www.facebook.com/mathnasium https://twitter.com/mathnasium https://www.instagram.com/mathnasium/
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! Engaging educator, author and speaker Antero Garcia discusses how cell phones and games can be used effectively in a class, as well as other important issues surrounding cell use, games and technology. And then Antero nails The 5-Minute Game Show! The fauxmerical parody, “TAC vs. Worksheet” starts us off and we finish with students from St. Mary's High School in Owen Sound, Ontario sharing the ideas they came up with after analyzing an “anti-cell phone for teens” article on the In the Trenches segment. Special thanks to Antero, Anna, Max, Eamon, Rachel and Laura Honegger Big thanks to the fauxmercial stars, Ben Elterman as TAC and Spencer Krull as Worksheet. And the fauxmercial music used is called Kat and Tanner by Twin Musicom which is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution license https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/) Artist: http://www.twinmusicom.org/
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! Blended Learning expert, Catlin Tucker converses with me about the why's and how's of Blended Learning. Then we play The 5-Minute Game Show Flippin' Fictional Schools. Our In The Trenches segment features some food for thought from Rabbi Doctor Reb Mimi Feigelson. Then we honor a few teachers in Teacher Shout Outs. More special thanks to Catlin Tucker, Reb Mimi, our announcer, Yossie Frankel and Distant Cousins for our theme song. Our Fauxmercial sponsor is “Blend It” - and special thanks to Linda Korn - composer, vocalist and musical director of the spot, and Amy Ritz and Karen Holender for the wonderful vocals!
Jump into the Overthrowing Education archives with me in this encore episode! We start with a conversation filled with practical tools about games and gamification with educator, author and expert Jon Cassie of Game Level Learn and Qulia: The School for Deeper Learning. Then play along as Jon is subjected to The Five Minute Game Show where he has to determine whether the unusual games describes are Fact or Fantasy. Special Thanks to our guests Jon Cassie and Micaela Blie (and check out a great interview with her on our episode, “From Blah to Hazzah”). Our Edu-Gamerama Fauxmercial actors are , Yossie Frankel (Also our announcer) and Batsheva Frankel. And thanks to the wonderful band Distant Cousins for our theme song, Raise it Up.
This is kind of a bittersweet episode for me. I was blessed to get the job of my dreams, and I couldn't be happier, but it means I'll be wrapping things up for this podcast. After 4 amazing years, this will be my last new episode. I'm going to give everyone a chance to catch up by rereleasing older episodes. I've been thinking about what I would want to say in this last episode. What are some magical words of wisdom I can leave you with? Then I decided that the best way to end this run is to chat with the person who helped me start the podcast and continued to sponsor and support it for the last 4 years, Jim Hahn. In this conversation we talk about our “origin story”, how education has changed for better and for worse during this time, how long it takes a bowl of Cheetos to burn and a lot more. I feel so lucky to have had this opportunity to chat with over 120 incredible educators, students, and parents in these last 4 years. I've learned so much from all of them, and I've made some friendships that I truly cherish. I've also given away a lot of mugs!! I've been embraced by the “edupodster” community who are just the best, and I feel grateful that this show is part of the Education Podcast Network. I'm so thankful for all the talented voice actors who've helped me with my fauxmercials including Eli Schiff, Barbara Heller, Jill Moray, Spencer Krull, Ben Elterman, Karen Hollender, most of the Bookstein family, and my family Rivi, Tuvia and my awesome husband, announcer, and the builder of my recording booth, Yossie Frankel. And also those that helped write and produce some of the fauxmercials like Joshua Silverstein, Ben Talsma, Noah King and Eve Hirschman. And for my musical helpers Linda Leah Korn, Robby Helperin, Casey Arillaga and Barbara Heller, and for my theme music – Raise it Up, I thank the wonderful Distant Cousins. I really want to thank you, the listeners for sharing this continuing journey in bettering education for our students! Please stay in touch with me at Batsheva@overthrowingeducation.com I'd love to hear from you. And this is a great time to get your Overthrowing Education swag. Who knows, maybe one day those mugs will become a collector's item.
In this episode, my guest, Crystal Frommert, and I have a great conversation about something that challenges new and veteran teachers alike: How to have better conversations with our students' parents and/or guardians in order to make connections and ensure collaboration that will really enhance our work with their kids. I love learning new things from my guests, and I certainly got some tips and ideas from Crystal that I wish I had known earlier. But it's never too late! And if you love Ted Lasso as much as Crystal and I do, you'll have a blast playing my Ted Lasso themed The 5-Minute Game Show! I want to thank my special guest, Crystal Frommert and my fauxmercial helper today, Yossie Frankel. Please make sure to subscribe to and review Overthrowing Education if you haven't already. Links and Resources: www.crystalfrommert.com When Calling Parents Isn't Your Calling Find Crystal on LinkedIn, Twitter, and now Threads You can now find me on BlueSky @BatshevaFrankel Teaching Like Ted Lasso Podcast Lots of great essays from Crystal on Edutopia
After a long, tough school year, I figured we could all use a good laugh. In this encore interview in Episode 45 from April of 2021, I interview the one and only Mr. D, Joe Dombrowski the educator and comedian who performs around the country and whose videos have gone viral. We talk about the importance of using humor when teaching, and how to do it, even if you don't think you're funny. I also share a taste of how I recently used humor to connect with students. This is the perfect summer episode: Learn a little something and laugh a lot. I want to thank my special guest, Joe Dombrowski, and my fellow education podcasters who helped with my fauxmercial today: Charles Williams, Host of The Counter Narrative Podcast, and Shane Lawrence of The Ed Podcast and Unprofessional Development, and of course, Yossie Frankel. I can watch this a million times and still laugh: https://youtu.be/RwnBAHtc1D0 Joe's first appearance on Ellen: https://youtu.be/SqoJMbLRNjc See more of Joe's great video's and listen to his podcast: https://www.mrdtimes3.com/ Find Joe on Twitter: @MrDtimes3
My guest today, passionate educator and prolific author Connie Hamilton, is returning for her 3rd time. Her first visit was in Episode 53: Asking and Getting Students to Ask Great Questions, one of the most episodes so far. Another popular visit was in Episode 53 when I had Connie and Starr Sackstein talking about hacking homework. Today, however, I chatted with Connie about her new book Hacking Group Work. She shares wisdom and really practical ideas and tools for all teachers. I'm a veteran educator of over 25 years, and you can hear in the interview that I learned a lot from her! Connie also shares her smarts on the 5-Minute Game Show! It's a great one to play along with and yell out answers to in your car, or wherever you listen. I want to give special thanks to Connie Hamilton and the super talented Eli Schiff for helping me with the Great Group Dynamics fauxmercial. If you haven't already, please subscribe and rate and review this podcast to help others find it so that we can all make education as great as possible and actually change what's possible! Links and Resources: Twitter: @conniehamilton website: conniehamilton.org
What happens when a veteran teacher working as a professional learning consultant during the last 4 years returns to the classroom? What's happening in the classroom now that was different than a few years ago? Spoiler Alert: A lot. I share my journey back into classroom teaching, at a time when so many teachers can't wait to get out (and who can blame them?). So, while I confess a bunch of stuff, I also rant (and who can blame me?). Also, in today's fauxmercial – A film noir detective parody – I actually play both roles. Check it out! For transformative professional learning check out New Lens Ed.
Welcome to the 100th episode of Overthrowing Education! On today's episode, I have the awesome privilege of chatting with 5 inspiring high school students – Pauline, Drizzle, Ella, Fahmi, and Katie and their equally inspiring teacher, Stacie Oliver. We mostly talk undgrading. Obviously, this is a topic I am passionate about, and I noticed in the Edu Twittersphere a teacher, Stacie, who was posting about her journey with her students about ungrading. I was impressed not only by Stacie, but also with her students whose work and reflections she sometimes posted. I realized that with all of my episodes, and there are lots of good ones, about going gradeless and ungrading, they were mostly from the teacher's point of view. So, I reached out to Stacie to see if I could have her and her students on to tell us about their adventures in ungrading. And also play The 5-Minute Game Show, of course! I'd love to do this for 100 more episodes, at least and continue bringing passionate, creative and inspiring voices of educators and students, so please subscribe if you haven't yet, and tell friends and colleagues to as well. And if you find yourself wanting an OE mug, t-shirt or tote bag here's the Swag Shop. Check out John Atkinson's clever and funny cartoons including the ones that I used for The 5-Minute Game Show. I want to thank my special guests Katie, Fahmi, Ella, Drizzle, Pauline and Stacie Oliver. Also, I'd like to thank the wonderful Barbara Heller who sang all the songs on the UnGradist Hits fauxmercial.
As I get ready for my 100th episode celebration, I thought it would be great to look back at my very first episode from August of 2019. I featured educator of excellence Jesse Stommel and we discussed Ungrading (of course!). My show was so different in the beginning, and I've streamlined it quite a bit since my earlier episodes. I originally had a feature called In the Trenches, and my guest on this episode was Leora Smith. I also had something I called Tirades, Tips and Tools. I don't think this 2-minute segment lasted more than 2-3 episodes. It was a good idea, but kind of redundant. I initiated my first fauxmercial which is called Grades-Be-Gone and of course, Jesse and I played the first The 5-Minute Game Show based on Two Truths and a Lie. Even though the show has grown quite a bit 98 episodes after this one, I think that for the most part, it holds up. What do you think?
It is the 99th episode of Overthrowing Education and today's topic is one I've haven't addressed on the show yet, so I've brought on Sharon Duncan, who works extensively with gifted students and their families. And I also bring back innovative educator Jim Hahn, the founder of Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning and Arete Preparatory Academy before that. Last time Jim joined me with the co-founder of Qualia, Jon Cassie on episode 77. And of course, Qualia is also the sponsor of this show. When a school sponsors a podcast called Overthrowing Education that tells you a lot about how amazing that school is. In our conversation, Sharon defines the various kinds of gifted students, and she also helps us understand how to best help them in our classes and schools. Jim continues to share some amazing ways to engage not only gifted students, but also curious students. And actually, these are things we can do to awaken curiosity in all of our students. And that's about it. I'd like to thank my guests today, Sharon Duncan and Jim Hahn, and my fauxmercial helping family Yossie and Tuvia Frankel.
My guest today is Lindsay Lyons. We talk about what a culturally responsive sustaining classroom is, as well as why and how to make it happen, especially through PBL. She shares a lot of practical ideas and resources. Then Lindsay knocks it out of the park playing a literature focused The 5-Minute Game Show. I want to thank my guest today, Lindsay Lyons, and for help with the fauxmercial - Shane Lawrence, who is now on the podcast Unprofessional Development, and also Shane's daughter. Resources and links: Lindsay's Website YouTube Twitter https://extras.lindsaybethlyons.com/overthrowsurvey https://extras.lindsaybethlyons.com/overthrowcircle https://extras.lindsaybethlyons.com/overthrowplanne
My guest today is Adam Bellow the co-founder of the very cool Breakout EDU. We talk Game-based and play-based learning in general and a lot about the magic of escape rooms. It's a fun episode with some practical ideas, as well. Also, in this episode I give a sort of overview of a game for humanities classes call Battle of the Big Ideas. For more information see below. It's not too early to be thinking about end of the year gifts for your colleagues or yourself for making it through this school year and Overthrowing Education swag is the perfect gift! Resources and Links: Breakout Edu Find out more about Battle of the Big Ideas and how you can adapt and use it in curriculum: DM me @overthrowinged or @BatshevaFrankel or send an email to Batsheva@overthrowingeducation.com
Is it possible that Robots/AI will replace teachers someday? II first examined this question in an episode in early 2020. My guests said no, but my son, 14 at the time, predicted much of what we are seeing now with the explosion of growth in Artificial Intelligence. So, I brought my son, now almost 18, back on the show to give his reflections on his past predictions and update us again. Is it inevitable that teachers will become obsolete? What can we do to make sure that we, as real live educators, are irreplaceable? What do you think? What do your students think? Let me know on Twitter @overthrowinged. I want to thank Tuvia for indulging me and coming back on with his updated reflections, and a special shout out to the amazing voice over artist Eli Schiff for playing the male teacher and Robo-Helper on the fauxmercial. I also want to thank all the teachers who originally let me know what tasks they dread that they would love to outsource to a robot which were reflected in Robo-Helper Make someone's day with cool Overthrowing Education swag!
In this episode, I speak with Barbara Smith, a long-time forward-thinking educator and prolific writer. We talk about her upcoming book, The Gatekeepers: Why School Systems Should Rethink Resisting Change. We discuss who the gatekeepers are that keep us from moving education forward and creating a better system. Of course, that includes the U.S. and other countries' obsession with standardized tests, ranking schools and students, and a whole more. This conversation got me riled up, in a good way, to continue the work so many educators like you are doing to overthrow education. And bonus: we talked about the connection between a certain TV franchise and its connection to better education! Also, this episode's fauxmercial was borrowed from Episode 60 with Zaynab Baalbaki about creating transformative schools, because this episode is really about overcoming the challenges to create transformative education. Once again, the awesome Jake Miller joined me in this fauxmercial flashback. I want to thank my special guest, Barbara Smith, and my fauxmercial helper, Jake Miller. I also want to remind you to please rate and review this podcast so others can find it. And of course, if you share it with your colleagues, friends, and some of those gatekeepers, we can help make some really positive changes in education. Of course, it couldn't hurt to get some Overthrowing Education swag to really make your point! Links and Resources: For all of Barbara's books and resources: www.z-pd.ca Contact information: zpdschoolandcurriculumdesign@gmail.com or Barbaraj.smith@utoronto.ca
In the 4th episode in this series on AI in education, my guest, Matt Miller and I discuss the issues we need to consider as well as some very practical ideas for using ChatGPT and other cool AI in our classes. Matt has been digging deep into this subject and brings so much wisdom and insight into our conversation. Matt shares some great resources to explore in the links below. And he also plays a fun version of The 5-Minute Game Show called “ChatGPT, Google or Me?” I'd like to thank my awesome guest Matt Miller and my fauxmercial helpers including my award-winning Voice Actor friend, Eli Schiff as the announcer and Jakey Schiff, Yossie and Tuvia Frankel. This is a great time to buy any burned-out or otherwise deserving teacher friend or colleague some Overthrowing Education Swag. Or buy some for yourself. You totally deserve it! Links and Resources: ChatGPT, Chatbots and Artificial Intelligence in Education Tons of great resources and classes: DitchThatTextbook.com Get on Matt's email list to get all kinds of amazing resources: DitchThatTextbook.com/join Classroom videos to use in class TODAY: Teachflix This project provides you with research-based teaching practices you can use in class tomorrow to save time AND teach better: EfficienTEACH.com
This episode is important for parents and educators to listen to. In it, my special guest – a teenage boy - and I dig deep into the ever increasing problem of teens and pre-teens being influenced by toxic people and dangerous messages online. The most popular is Andrew Tate whose sexist and misogynistic views are couched between advice that many teen boys find empowering. How do we deal with his and other toxic influencers' bile as educators and/or parents? Special thanks to my very special guest, Tuvia, and my awesome fauxmercial voice actor, Jake Miller. Here are just some of the many articles to check out: BBC Andrew Tate: How schools are tackling his influence Andrew Tate: 'I fear online influencer radicalised my son' TES Magazine How to respond to boys inspired by Andrew Tate Education Week Misogynist Influencer Andrew Tate Has Captured Boys' Attention. What Teachers Need to Know Votes for Schools MISOGYNY & ANDREW TATE Part of our Classroom Conversations Series The Guardian Vulnerable boys are drawn in': schools fear spread of Andrew Tate's misogyny ‘We see misogyny every day': how Andrew Tate's twisted ideology infiltrated British schools NY Post UK schools grappling with teens brainwashed by Andrew Tate: report Independent School holds Andrew Tate assemblies over fears of ‘toxic misogynist's influence on children' Edit CM Andrew Tate and His Boys: An Educators Guide
After 2 more philosophical looks at AI in education, I wanted to bring in some super practical ways to incorporate ChatGPT and other AI sites into your lessons and schools as a whole. My guest is Ben Talsma who you might remember from Episode 28 which is all about making meaningful PBL units. Recently I saw that Ben is sharing some very meaningful, practical weird and wonderful ways to incorporate AI into all kinds of lessons, including, but not limited to PBL units. Did you ever wish you could talk to me about something you heard on the show? Have a question? Want to share an idea? Or just let me know that you totally aced The 5-Minute Game Show? You can! Go to the Overthrowing Education website scroll down and record a message to me. I can even respond! I just want to give special thanks to Ben Talsma. And don't forget to get your Overthrowing Education swag. Links and Resources: Twitter: @BenTalsma. To find great stuff that Ben has created for teachers, including awesome PBL units and tons of free resources, can be found at www.blueappleteacher.org. This is really cool and helpful: ** The Sentient Syllabus Project ** ATLIS Association of Technology Leaders in Independent Schools: ATLIS: Artificial Intelligence in Edu (padlet.com) AI - A Discussion for Education - Google Slides More to come soon!!
If you haven't yet listened to the first in this AI in Education series, episode 89, you might want to do that first. It's not essential but it does give some background that feeds this episode's discussion. In that episode, I mention some excellent essays by super prolific author and columnist Stephen Marche. And now Stephen is my special guest on the show today. He is a font of information and a lot of fun to talk with. Among many other aspects, we discussed some great things we can do with AI in our lessons, along with other potential benefits. Additionally, we addressed how AI will affect homework, tests, and essays in many subjects. We also get into the scary potential for increasing inequity in the education system. And I asked a really important question on many educators' minds – Can AI write lesson plans for us? Speaking of AI writing things for us, I decided to see what would happen when I asked ChatGPT to write my fauxmercial. And I really did give it the first and second prompt that were described in today's fauxmercial, and those really were the responses it gave me. The rest of it I wrote and performed along with Yossie Frankel as the announcer, Tuvia Frankel as the first AI response and Robin Glickstein as the second AI response. After sort of co-writing with ChatGPT, I was really happy to co-write The 5-Minute Game Show with an actual person – Eve Hirschman. It was a lot more fun. Spoiler: Stephen aced his game show. I believe that educators everywhere should be hearing what Stephen has to say, so please share this episode with every educator you know. @stephenmarche on Twitter Find Stephen's essays, novels, non-fiction books, appearances and more at www.stephenmarche.com
I am so ready for some huge, great changes, to education. How about you? How are we going to make this happen? How can we provide a super high quality education for every student? My guest today, Dr. Lacrecia Terrance, has been working toward this goal for a long time. In our conversation she shares a lot of practical experience with how PBL and the concepts of unschooling can genuinely create a better and more equitable education experience. We do talk a little educational philosophy, but there are also practical ideas and tools, as well. After our chat, Lacrecia crushes an NFL/PBL hybrid The 5-Minute Game Show! I want to thank Dr. Lacrecia Terrance and re-thank Shane Lawrence who is now a co-host on the Unprofessional Development podcast for joining me on the fauxmercial. Follow Dr. Terrance's journey on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram @TheEduProject Visit the EduProject website Email lterrance@theeduproject.org PBL Works
In September of 2022, Fauxsie awards were given out at a fake, but very fun awards ceremony honoring the talented people who have helped me create the commercial parodies - fauxmercials - that come at the beginning of each episode. As a little gift this holiday season, I present some of the award-winning performances that listeners voted on. These are the commercials you won't mind sitting through.
There has been an explosion of handwringing among educators and academics, and cheers from students about the strides and easy accessibility of Artificial Intelligence that will probably change the entire nature of how we educate. What can we expect? How do we adapt? Can anything good come out of this? This is just the first in a series of examinations of this incredibly important topic that will certainly affect every aspect of education at least from middle school through higher education. On this episode it's just me and AI. We even had fun playing The 5-Minute Game Show! Well, at least I did. I can't speak for my friendly AI. I want to especially thank Tuvia Frankel for clueing me in to the importance of dealing with this issue right away, and for writing the fauxmercial! Resources and Links: Various great essays on AI by Stephen March in The Atlantic The End of High-School English by Daniel Herman in The Atlantic The Brilliance and Weirdness of ChatGPT by Kevin Roose in The New York Times
Today, I'm continuing a hot topic in education right now -homework. My guests in this episode are incredible educators Starr Sackstein and Connie Hamilton who co-authored the excellent book, Hacking Homework. We have a great conversation that explores homework issues including giving practical ideas for how to do it right, if you have to do it all. And we also have a lot of fun! When I asked parents and teachers on Twitter, “How do you feel about homework?” I received almost 500 answers, along with a healthy discussion. And while people had a variety of passionate opinions, most were respectful of each other. In addition to a lively Twitter discussion, one teacher, Alex Giorgianni, reached out to me with an amazing assignment he's and his colleagues, Mike Rinyu and Maryann Hilton gave their sophomore World History/English 2 and Junior US History/English 3 classes when they were studying propaganda in the US. It was called “The War on Homework” – you can find the assignment on their episode page on the Overthrowing Education website. Also, you can see the incredible results of Flagler Palm Coast HS students here. I want to give special thanks to my guests Connie Hamilton and Starr Sackstein, my fauxmercial helpers Yossie and Tuvia Frankel, and Alex Giorgianni and the students of Flagler Palm Coast HS for sharing their work with us. Links and Resources For Connie: Twitter: @conniehamilton website: conniehamilton.org For Starr: Chief Operating Officer at Mastery Portfolio Chat with Starr: sign up for a time Starr's TEDx Talk A Recovering Perfectionist's Journey to Give up Grades Amazon Author page Starr's website Twitter @MsSackstein Starr on LinkedIn Starr on Facebook
My guests on this episode, Noah King and Peter Littig have podcast called The Math Club that I really love. I would never have guessed that I would enjoy a podcast about math, but I really love it. The show is a funny, clever and down to earth mode of explaining interesting math concepts . . . that I mostly understand. Pete, Noah and I discuss how to make math approachable and fun to learn, and also fun to teach. We discuss a lot of really practical ideas and resources for that K-college math teachers as well as for other subjects wanting to try something cross curricular can use to make math relevant and meaningful to all students -even the ones who think, “I'm not a math person.” Also, when I asked the guys if they wanted to write a fauxmercial with me, all I had was a title idea, Revenge of the Math People. Noah took that idea and ran with it - he wrote the script and produced it. He also designed a movie poster to go with it! I want to thank my guests today, Peter Littig and Noah King, with a special thanks to all the Revenge of the Math people players: Noah, for writing and producing, and voice acting along with Eli Schiff, Tuvia Frankel, Yossie Frankel, Barbara Heller, Peter Littig, and me, and of course the amazing Math People kids -Mrs. Martinez's 3rd grade students from Marylin Avenue Elementary School. Please don't forget to recommend this episode, and the whole podcast to people you know would benefit from and/or enjoy it! Looking for a great gift for you or your favorite educators? Check out the Overthrowing Education Swag shop. Links and Resources: email: mathclubpodcast@gmail.com Twitter: @MathClubPodcast The Math Club can be found on Spotify, Apple, and Audible, and we're hosted on Libsyn.
My guest on this episode is awesome educator and author Elizabeth Jorgensen who I initially met on a social media platform that rhymes with bitter (which is basically how many of us feel about it right now). We discuss Process Based Assessment, moving away from grades, and of course, why and how to make a homework-less teaching practice. Recently, I reached out to educators to get there take on homework and I got an incredible response- very diverse and passionate. Elizabeth reached out to me to share an essay she wrote (see link below) that I really loved. She is also the author of Hacking Student Learning Habits: 9 Ways to Foster Resilient Learners and Assess the Process not the Outcome, among many other books. I'd like to thank my guest, Elizabeth Jorgensen and my Almighty Mouse fauxmercial helpers, Yossie and Tuvia Frankel. Links and Resources: The Essay I reference https://twitter.com/LyzaJo https://www.facebook.com/elizabeth.jorgensen1 https://www.instagram.com/lyzajoelle/ website: www.lizjorgensen.weebly.com Gwen Jorgensen: USA's First Olympic Gold Medal Triathlete (Meyer & Meyer Sport) Sijo: Korea's Poetry Form (Parkyoung) Hacking Student Learning Habits (Times 10 Publications) Go: Gwen, Go: A Family's Journey to Olympic Gold (Meyer & Meyer Sport) SIJO: Korean Poetry (Edited by Lucy Park and Elizabeth Jorgensen) sold at Amazon. Also, complimentary copies of this book are available for educators who teach sijo in classes in the USA. Send an email to sejongculturalsociety@gmail.com My latest project is a Young Adult/Middle Grade nonfiction biography: Gwen Jorgensen: USA's First Olympic Gold Medal Triathlete. My co-author and I are offering no-fee author talks to school groups, classrooms and sport teams. We also have a free educator guide for anyone who teaches this book. Send an email to elizabeth.jorgensen@gmail.com
On this episode, I reflect on the past - sharing ideas, musings, anecdotes, subtle hints, honest confessions, and a look at how reflection moved education forward for all of us. Special thanks to Barbara Heller and Yossie Frankel, my fauxmercial helpers. Newlensed.com Lenses of Questioning Course DISCOVER Assessments Overthrowing Education merch
My guest today is longtime educator and author Jason Ablin. We talk about creating gender equality in education – what does it mean? What would it look like? And how to get it. Then Jason performs well with a music/literature mashup on The 5-Minute Game Show. I did indeed pilfer today's fauxmercial from an earlier episode on implicit bias and micro aggressions. But it could still apply here. Speaking of fauxmercials, we held our first Fauxsie Awards Show honoring all the great talent that has helped me over the years with the commercial parodies near the beginning of every episode. We had a blast and I'll share parts of it at a later date. I want to give special thanks to Jason Ablin and an encore thanks to my fauxmercial helpers Jill Moray, Tzofiya Bookstein, Spencer Krull and Tuvia Frankel. If you like what you hear, please subscribe on your platform of choice, and tell friends and colleagues to check it out. And perhaps get some Overthrowing Education swag while you're at it. Jason's Book: The Gender Equation in Schools: How to Create Equity and Fairness for All Students Website: Ablin Educational Services, LLC. Blog: Educating Gender Twitter: @jasonablin
In this episode, I have a great conversation with Alfonso Mendoza, also known as Fonz, of the website and podcast My EdTech Life. He is an Instructional Technologist and Google Innovator who shares a huge range of insights, ideas, effective pedagogy and of course, a slew of powerful tech tools. We also discuss his ideas of the future of education technology, and I hope his vision pans out, because it would be truly incredible. Don't forget check out the Overthrowing Education swag! Alfonso can be reached at @myedtechlife on all socials
My special guest today is educator and author Jacki Edry. I learned so much from Jacki about neurodivergence in many forms. She has experience with neurodivergence as an educator, a mother, and through an experience she herself had. Jacki has great insights into how teachers and parents can help our neurodivergent students and children, to understand them, and give them the tools to really succeed. We packed a lot in this discussion! Also, I have a favor to ask, which I do from time to time, in addition to the usual pleas of make sure to subscribe and leave a review (although, please do those things!). It really makes a difference when you share an episode of Overthrowing Education with a friend or colleague. Whether it's this one (that I think every educator would benefit from) or another episode that really resonated with you, or an episode you think someone else would connect with or it would be helpful to. If you're listening to this podcast, it's probably because you really care about making education much, much better. The more we can share what good education could and should be, the faster we can make it happen. So, this week, please tell at least one person about this or another episode or the show in general. Students and parents will thank you for it. Don't forget about the Overthrowing Education swag. Get a great gift for an educator, including yourself. I'd like to thank my guest today, Jacki Edry and my fauxmercial voice actors, Spencer Krull and Ben Elterman. Links and Resources: Book: "Moving Forward: Reflections on Autism, Neurodiversity, Brain Surgery, and Faith" on Amazon Website and blog on jackisbooks.com LinkedIn: Jacki Edry Facebook: @jackisbooks
Remember mix-tapes? This is formative assessment is about curating music. I share two ways to use published music and songs for quick check-ins. Need help getting started? Wanna share something cool your students have done? Any questions? DM me on Twitter @BatshevaFrankel or drop me a line at Batsheva@OverthrowingEducation.com
My guest is Starr Sackstein, who is returning for a third time! We are both extremely passionate about going gradeless and its very important companion - creative and authentic assessments. Our conversation is all about practicality. I have lots of episodes about going gradeless – all good, check them out, one of them also features Starr. Some focus on the philosophy behind going gradeless and some that are more like “how-to” do it? This discussion is more in the latter category. But we add that extra important piece mentioned above, creative and authentic assessments. It's really hard to give feedback only and not a grade with traditional tests and quizzes. It won't work. So, we also talk practically about assessments, as well. The fauxmercial on this episode, a parody of an old Discover card commercial, will make much more sense after you listen to the episode. I'd like to thank my awesome guest, Starr Sackstein. Get your Overthrowing Education swag so you can show where you stand and that you care about education. Want to get the conversation started? Try an OE shirt, hoodie, mug (of course!), tote bag, and a lot more. It'll do the trick! Links and Resources: MsSackstein.com mssackstein@gmail.com Twitter: @MsSackstein Starr Sackstein on LinkedIn and Facebook masteryportfolio.com Twitter: @masteryforall Mastery Portfolio on Facebook and LinkedIn Learn more about DISCOVER assessments
Episode 80: Micaela Blei: The Pedagogy of Story Framing Overthrowing Education's 3rd anniversary is this month, and one way I wanted to celebrate was by replaying an early interview I loved with incredible educator and award-winning storyteller, Micaela Blei. She joined me for a great conversation about how to use story frames to bring learning alive, engage students and provide deeper learning. We also talk about all the amazing ways we can use storytelling in our teaching. The fauxmercial parody, “Story Surprise” starts us off and after her interviewed, Micaela plays a hilarious, and very challenging version of The 5-Minute Game Show. Special thanks to Micaela and my fauxmercial cast - the incredible Holender family actors Sophie, Benji and Karen, as well as Yossie Frankel and Eve Hirschman for helping write The 5-Minute Game Show. Links and Resources: Find Micaela at https://micaelablei.com/ and on Twitter @mblei Vote for the Fauxsies! Get your ballot. Shop for Overthrowing Education swag
My guest is a fellow edupodster. Christopher J. Nesi is from House of Ed Tech, among others, and he's an ed tech tool maven. In this episode, you'll hear all about the awesome things he does in our discussion, which ranges from why podcasting is great for teachers and students to sharing some great tech tools and how to use them, and to giving some bold predictions of the future of tech education, as well as technology in general. And speaking of the future - in the very near future, on Aug. 18th, 2022 you can watch the Fauxsie Awards. Aug 18th, happens to be the 3rd anniversary of this podcast. To celebrate, I am honoring the commercial parodies that come near the beginning of each episode and the talented people who helped me make them. We are having a live, online streaming ceremony, where you can meet some of the voices behind your favorite Overthrowing Education fauxmercials. And don't forget to vote. Everyone who does can enter the raffle for great OE swag, and more prizes. You have until Aug. 10th to vote. The competition is heating up, so make sure to get your ballot in. And On July 26th at , I'm giving a free on line workshop to humanities teachers about a game frame I co-created called Battle of the Big Ideas. This fantasy football meets big ideas game frame can be easily adapted to your curricula and student needs. It's a fun and creative way for students to dig deep into the content while developing the skills they need. This is not a badges or leveling up thing; it's a sophisticated game frame which means that you take the basic frame work of the Battle of the Big Ideas game play, and have total freedom to create the perfect game for your content and students. Come join me at 4 pm PT on July 26th, for this free workshop! Register here. I want to thank my warm and wise guest, Chris Nesi. And special thanks to my husband, Yossie Frankel, who put on his star trek hoodie and socks to help write most of the script for the Star Tek fauxmercial, and he provided all of the male voices, possibly with some help from his star trek shot glass! Links and Resources: https://twitter.com/mrnesi https://instagram.com/houseofedtech https://chrisnesi.com/linkedin https://thepodjournal.com
In the last episode, I interviewed Jim Hahn and Jon Cassie, the founders of Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning to find out what their secret sauces to success are and how they can be added to other schools and classrooms. I thought it was important to also hear from some students at Qualia, Jiyen, Diego, and Ella. I asked each of them similar questions, as you'll hear, and I think their answers are very telling and informative for educators and parents. Also, I want to let you know about a great opportunity: I'm giving a free online workshop on a game frame for humanities classes called Battle of the Big Ideas which is like combining fantasy football (or other sports) with philosophy and big ideas. I've given this workshop at ISTE and other conferences for the last couple of years, and I wanted to share it with you. It's a unique way to help your students dig deep, think critically and creatively, and enjoy learning, in any humanities subject. The workshop is on July 26th at 4pm PDT. Get more information and register here. Lastly, don't forget to vote for your favorite fauxmercial (the commercial parodies near the beginning of almost every episode) for the Fauxsies Awards. The battle is heating up. We're announcing the winners in August to celebrate Overthrowing Educations 3-year anniversary! Fill out your ballot! My special thanks to my guests Ella, Jiyen and Diego. And my fauxmercial helpers (which, full disclosure, was taken from another episode), Yossie and Tuvia Frankel. Jiyen's Podcast Unknown Knowns
In this episode, Jim Hahn and Jon Cassie from Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning and The Arete Institute, are not only my wonderful guests, but they also the sponsors this podcast. Jim and Jon chat with me about the many lessons and approaches more traditional style -schools, and actually all schools, can learn from Qualia and from its predecessor Arete Preparatory Academy. Of course, we talk about some of my favorite topics such as going gradeless and authentic, creative assessments, but there is even more practical wisdom they that share - things we can start doing right away. I want to thank my guests Jim Hahn and Jon Cassie as well as my fauxmercial helpers Yossie and Tuvia Frankel. Links and Resources: Serving students in grades 4 through 12, Qualia: The School for Deeper Learning offers online and in-person courses for highly curious students looking to explore and expand their passions in an intellectually stimulating environment. Jon's Podcasts: www.gamelevelearn.com www.manywindows.net
For this series, on each mini-episode, I share one quick idea that can be applied to any subject. Some of them you may have already mastered, or maybe just tried once, or hadn't even thought about yet. Today's DISCOVER assessment idea is based on roving or on the street reporters. It's a fun formative assessment that can help students express deeper understandings. Need help getting started? Wanna share something cool your students have done? Any questions? DM me on Twitter @BatshevaFrankel or IG @Batsheva.Frankel See New Lens Ed. for more information about great assessments.
My guest, Jess Fuller tells us about RESCHOOL, the creators of the amazing game Revolve as well as other education-changing tools. I love game-based learning – I don't really video games, and I definitely don't mean badges and leveling up. I mean learning content, deriving meaning, or assessing for understanding through playing or creating games. But can games actually have an impact on bigger changes in education? And if so, how? Jess and I discuss all of these questions, among other important issues. Then play along with Jess on The 5-Minute Game Show as she knocks it out of the park! In our chat, I mention a game-frame approach that I've been using and teaching to humanities teachers called Battle of Big Ideas. I designed this flexible and fun “philosophy meets fantasy football” type game to help students dig deeper into literature and history, finding connections and relevance as they create and build teams based on big ideas. It's great for grades 7th -12th. I'll be giving a free interactive Battle of the Big Ideas workshop session on July 26th at 4 pm PT. If you teach a humanities class or if you're just curious and want to see what it's all about, sign up here. I'd like to thank my wonderful guest, Jessica Fuller and re-thank my fauxmercial helpers, Jake Miller and Tuvia Frankel. And speaking of fauxmercials, don't forget to vote! You don't have to fill out every category, just the ones you want. Here's your ballot. Resources: RESCHOOL website: www.reschoolcolorado.org Link to RESCHOOL's newsletter https://www.reschoolcolorado.org/newsletter/ Twitter handle: @ReSchool_CO. The REVOLVE site: www.revolvethegame.com Jessica Fuller's contact information: LinkedIn profile link: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jessica-fuller-b8244b11/ Email: jfuller@reschoolcolorado.org Sign up for the FREE Battle of the Big Ideas workshop on July 26th, 2022 at 4 pm PT Get your Overthrowing Education merch here.
This episode's topic couldn't be timelier. I have a really enlightening conversation with my guest, Carter Weinstein, who as a high school senior wrote a book to help teens dealing with anxiety, and also to help parents and teachers understand what it's like for teens to experience anxiety. I thought this would be a a helpful way to honor Mental Health month. We talk about his book and also what factors in education are causing or exacerbating so many mental health issues for students, and what we can do to fix them. Carter also does a great job playing The 5-Minute Game Show. Please remember to vote for your favorite Fauxmercials with this ballot. Contact and Resources: Conquering Fear: One Teen's Guide to Overcoming Anxiety Website: www.carterweinsteinbook.com Instagram: @carterweinsteinbook Facebook: Conquering Fear: One Teen's Guide to Overcoming Anxiety I want to thank Carter Weinstein. And thank you all for listening and caring about education. Please rate and subscribe to this podcast so others can find it!