Novel Dialogue

Introducing Season 4.0 of Novel Dialogue! Hosts John Plotz and Aarthi Vadde welcome new lead hosts Emily Hyde and Chris Holmes. This will be Novel Dialogue's first themed season focusing on conversations between translators and novelists. Our hosts offer a sneak peek into a very exciting season. Find out more about Novel Dialogue and its hosts and organizers here. Contact us, get that exact quote from a transcript, and explore many more conversations between novelists and critics. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Colm Tóibín, the new laureate for Irish fiction, talks to Joseph Rezek of Boston University, and guest host Tara K. Menon of Harvard. The conversation begins with Colm's latest novel The Magician, about the life of Thomas Mann, and whether we can or should think of novelists as magicians and then moves swiftly from one big question to the next. What are the limitations of the novel as a genre? Would Colm ever be interested in a writing a novel about an openly gay novelist? Why and how does death figure in Colm's fiction? Each of Colm's revealing, often deeply personal answers illuminates how both novels and novelists work. As Thomas Mann wrote of the “grubby business” of writing novels, Colm reminds us of the “day to day dullness of novel writing.” Insight and inspiration only arrive, he warns, after long, hard days of work. Mentioned in this episode: Robinson Crusoe (1719), Daniel Defoe Pride and Prejudice (1813), Jane Austen The Portrait of a Lady (1881), Henry James The Wings of the Dove(1902), Henry James The Ambassadors (1903), Henry James The Golden Bowl(1904), Henry James The Blackwater Lightship(1999), Colm Tóibín The Master (2004), Colm Tóibín Brooklyn(2009), Colm Tóibín The Testament of Mary(2012), Colm Tóibín Nora Webster(2015), Colm Tóibín The Magician(2021), Colm Tóibín Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Shola von Reinhold is the author of LOTE, a novel about getting lost in the archives and finding what the archives have lost. LOTE won the 2021 James Tait Black prize so who better to join Shola on Novel Dialogue than Ben Bateman of Edinburgh University, lead judge of the prize committee? This conversation takes listeners back to all yesterday's parties as Shola, Ben, and Aarthi time travel to the Harlem Renaissance and the interwar modernist era. Shola offers up Richard Bruce Nugent as their current figure of fascination (or “transfixion” to use a key image from LOTE), and wonders what it would have been like to move through Harlem and London by Nugent's side. Recovering the stories of black writers and artists is essential to Shola's literary project. It is also inseparable from restoring queerness to the once hyper-masculine and “muscular” paradigm of modernism. In a stirring discussion of the aesthetic forms and moods of historical recovery, Ben and Shola sink into the “purpleness” of the fin-de-siècle and explore the critical power of black sensuousness. Talk of decadence, ornamentality, and frivolity shapes the latter half of this episode, and Doris Payne, the West Virginian jewel thief, emerges as an exquisitely improbable modernist heroine! Mentioned in this episode: -Richard Bruce Nugent -Dorothy Heyward and DuBose Heyward, Porgy -E.M. Forster -David Levering Lewis, When Harlem was in Vogue -Saidiya Hartman -Benjamin Kahan, The Book of Minor Perverts -James Joyce, Ulysses -Willa Cather, “Paul's Case” -Ornamentality via Kant, Hegel, and Adolf Loos -Susan Sontag -Doris Payne – a.k.a “Diamond Doris” -Édouard Glissant Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Charles Yu won the 2020 National Book Award for Interior Chinatown but some of us became fans a decade earlier, with How to Live Safely in a Science Fictional Universe (2010). He brilliantly uses SF conventions to uncover the kind of self-deceptive infilling that we all do every day, the little stories we tell ourselves to make our world seem predictable and safe when it's anything but. His other work includes two books of short stories (Third Class Superhero 2006 and Sorry Please Thank You in 2012) and some episodes of Westworld, He speaks with John and with Chris Fan, Assistant Professor at UC Irvine, senior editor and co-founder of Hyphen magazine, noted SF scholar. The conversation gets quickly into intimate territory: the pockets of safe space and the "small feelings" that families can and cannot provide, and that science fiction can or cannot recreate. Graph paper and old math books get a star turn. Charlie's time as a lawyer is scrutinized; so too is "acute impostor syndrome" and the everyday feeling of putting on a costume or a mask, as well as what Du Bois called "double consciousness." In conclusion, we followed the old ND custom of asking Charlie about treats that sustain him while writing. Later, we reached out with this season's question about what new talent he'd love to acquire miraculously. He had a lightning-fast response: "the ability to stop myself from saying a thing I already know I will regret. I would use this on a daily, if not hourly, basis." Mentioned: Dale Carnegie How to Win Friends and Influence People (1936) W. E. B. Du Bois on "double consciousness" (and so much more): Souls of Black Folk (1903) Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ruth Ozeki, whose most recent novel is The Book of Form and Emptiness, speaks with critic Rebecca Evans and guest host Emily Hyde. This is a conversation about talking books, the randomness and serendipity of library shelves, and what novelists can learn in the editing room of a movie like Mutant Hunt. Ozeki is an ordained Zen Buddhist priest, and her novels unfold as warm-hearted parables that have been stuffed full of the messiness of contemporary life. The Book of Form and Emptiness telescopes from global supply chains to the aisles of a Michaels craft store and from a pediatric psychiatry ward to the enchanted stacks of the public library. The exigencies of environmental storytelling arch over this conversation. Evans asks Ozeki questions of craft (how to move a story through time, how to bring it to an end) that become questions of practice (how to listen to the objects stories tell, how to declutter your sock drawer). And we learn Ozeki's theory of closure: her novels always pull together at the end so that readers are free to continue pondering the questions they raise. Mentioned in this episode: Mutant Hunt, directed by Tim Kinkaid (1987) My Year of Meats, Ruth Ozeki (1998) All Over Creation, Ruth Ozeki (2003) The Book of Form and Emptiness, Ruth Ozeki (2021) The Life-Changing Magic of Tidying Up, Marie Kondo (2014) Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Guest host Chris Holmes sits down with Booker Prize winning novelist Damon Galgut and Andrew van der Vlies, distinguished scholar of South African literature and global modernisms at the University of Adelaide, Australia. Andrew and Damon tunnel down into the structures of Damon's newest novel, The Promise to locate the ways in which a generational family story reflects broadly on South Africa's present moment. The two discuss how lockdowns during the Covid-19 pandemic invoke for some the limitations on movement during the Apartheid era in South Africa. The Promise is a departure from Damon's previous two novels, which were peripatetic in their global movement and range. Damon describes the ways in which this novel operates cinematically, as four flashes of a family's long history, with the disembodied narrator being the one on the move. Damon provocatively divides novels into two traditions: those that provide consolation, and those that can provide true insight on the world but must do so with a cold distance. While he does not call The Promise an allegory, Damon admits to the fun that he has with inside jokes that play with allegorical connections, as long as the reader is in on the joke. Damon directly takes on his choice to leave a pregnant absence in the narrative's insight into his black characters “sitting at the very heart of the book.” Mentioned in this Episode: The Promise, Damon Galgut (2021) The Good Doctor, Damon Galgut (2004) The Conservationist, Nadine Gordimer (1974) No Time Like the Present, Nadine Gordimer (2012) Chris Holmes is Chair of Literatures in English and Associate Professor at Ithaca College. He writes criticism on contemporary global literatures. His book, Kazuo Ishiguro as World Literature, is under contract with Bloomsbury Publishing. He is the co-director of The New Voices Festival, a celebration of work in poetry, prose, and playwriting by up-and-coming young writers. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Season three of Novel Dialogue launches in partnership with Public Books and introduces some fresh new voices into the mix. John and Aarthi welcome Chris Holmes, Emily Hyde, Tara Menon, and Sarah Wasserman into the ND pod as guest hosts. And have they brought a series of scintillating conversations with them! In our series premiere, Sarah sits down with acclaimed novelist Chang-rae Lee and Anne Anlin Cheng, renowned scholar of American literature and visual culture at Princeton. The conversation goes small and goes big: from the shortest short story to the totalizing effects of capitalism. Chang-rae is no stranger to such shifting scales: his novels sweep through large stretches of time and space, but their attention to detail and meticulous prose makes for an intimate reading experience. Chang-rae's latest novel, My Year Abroad, fuels a discussion about how we can form meaningful bonds in current conditions (hint: it's often around a table) and about the specters of other, better worlds that haunt Chang-rae's fictions. He discusses his relationship to his own work and the benefits of taking an “orbital view” on his writing. Chang-rae also offers a tantalizing glimpse into his current project, a semi-autobiographical novel about Korean-American immigrants in 1970s New York. In response to a brand new signature question for the podcast this season, Chang-rae reveals the talent he wishes he could suddenly have... one that Anne already possesses! Mentioned in this Episode Crazy Rich Asians, Dir. Jon M. Chu (2018) Parasite, Dir. Bong Joon-ho (2019) Friedrich Nietzsche, Ecce Homo: How One Becomes What One Is Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Our second January Novel Dialogue conversation is with Caryl Phillips, professor of English at Yale and world-renowned for novels ranging from The Final Passage to 2018's A View of the Empire at Sunset. He shares his thoughts on transplantation, on performance, on race, even on sports. Joining him here are John and the wonderful comparatist Corina Stan, author of The Art of Distances: Ethical Thinking in 20th century Literature. If you enjoy this conversation, range backwards through the RtB archives for comparable talks with Jennifer Egan, Helen Garner, Orhan Pamuk, Zadie Smith, Samuel Delany and many more. It's a rangy conversation. John begins by raving about Caryl's italics–he in turn praises Faulkner's. Corina and Caryl explore his debt (cf. his The European Tribe) to American writers like Richard Wright and James Baldwin. Meeting Baldwin was scary–back in those days before there were “writers besporting themselves on every university campus.” Caryl praises the joy of being a football fan (Leeds United), reflects on his abiding loyalty to his class and geographic origins and his fondness for the moments of Sunday joy that allow people to endure. John raises Orhan Pamuk's claim (In Novel Dialogue last season) that the novel is innately middle-class; Caryl says that it's true that as a form it has always taken time and money to make–and to read. But “vicars and middle class people fall in love, too; they get betrayed and let down…a gamut of emotion that's as wide as anybody else.” He remains drawn to writers haunted by the past: Eliot, W.G. Sebald, the huge influence of Faulkner trying to stitch the past to the present. Mentioned in the Episode James Baldwin, Blues for Mister Charley, The Fire Next Time Richard Wright, Native Son Johnny Pitts, Afropean Caryl Phillips, Dancing in the Dark J. M. Coetzee, “What We like to Forget” (On Caryl Phillips) Graham Greene (e.g Brighton Rock and The Quiet American) wrote in “The Lost Childhood” (1951) that at age 14 ” I took Miss Marjorie Bowen's The Viper of Milan from the library shelf…From that moment I began to write.” Maya Angelou, Letter to My Daughter William Faulkner, Absalom, Absalom Read a transcript here Elizabeth Ferry is Professor of Anthropology at Brandeis University. Email: ferry@brandeis.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week on Recall this Book, another delightful crossover episode from our sister podcast Novel Dialogue, which puts scholars and writers together to discuss the making of novels and what to make of them. (If you want to hear more, RtB 53 featured Nobel Orhan Pamuk, RtB 54 brought in Helen Garner, and in RtB 72 we haveCaryl Phillips). Who better to chat with John and Jennifer Egan--prolific and prize-winning American novelist--than Ivan Kreilkamp? The distinguished Indiana Victorianist showed his Egan expertise last year in his witty book, A Visit from the Goon Squad Reread. Jennifer Egan © Pieter M. van Hattem Their conversation ranges widely over Egan's oeuvre–not to mention 18th and 19th century literature. Trollope, Richardson and Fielding are praised and compared to modern phenomena like TikTok and gamers streaming (including gamers streaming chess, a very special instance of getting inside someone else's thought process). The PowerPoint chapter in Goon Squad gets special treatment, and tantalizing details from Egan's forthcoming novel, The Candy House (April, 2022) make an appearance. Egan discusses her authorial impulse towards camouflage, her play with genre's relationship to specialized lingos and argots–and the way a genre's norms and structure can function like a “lifeline” and also a “portal.” Mentioned in the Episode Jennifer Egan: Visit from the Goon Squad; Look at Me; Manhattan Beach; The Keep Samuel Richardson: Clarissa; Pamela Henry Fielding, Shamela Herman Melville, Moby Dick Patrick O'Brian (e.g. Master and Commander) Alfred Hitchcock, Lifeboat Read the transcript here. Elizabeth Ferry is Professor of Anthropology at Brandeis University. Email: ferry@brandeis.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Viet Thanh Nguyen, author of the Pulitzer Prize winning The Sympathizer and its sequel The Committed, joins esteemed scholar Colleen Lye of UC-Berkeley for a candid discussion about the Asian-American novel and the role of literature and theory in radical social movements. Colleen is drawn to the mix of philosophy and suspense in Viet’s workContinue reading "2.7 The Novel of Revolutionary Ideas: Viet Thanh Nguyen and Colleen Lye (AV)"

Viet Thanh Nguyen, author of the Pulitzer Prize winning The Sympathizer and its sequel The Committed, joins esteemed scholar Colleen Lye of UC-Berkeley for a candid discussion about the Asian-American novel and the role of literature and theory in radical social movements. Colleen is drawn to the mix of philosophy and suspense in Viet's work and wonders if he considers himself a member of the theory generation (those writers for whom literary theory is not just a way of reading texts but an impetus to create new literary forms for grappling with ideas). Viet, schooled in deconstruction and postcolonial theory, accepts the designation with a caveat: If he is a novelist of ideas, then he is a novelist of revolutionary ideas. Inspired by Fanon's anticolonialism and Gayatri Spivak's concept of the double bind, Viet's defiantly politicizing aesthetic looks to place the colonial subject, particularly the Vietnamese refugee, at the center of multiple stories of American and French imperialism. Colleen and Viet reflect on the role of academic training in Viet's transformation from Asian-Americanist scholar into Asian-American novelist and discuss the peculiarities of immigrant Asian identity in terms of language. Mother tongues, bilingualism, orphaned language, and adopted language all become metaphors for how Asian-American writers must balance the loss of heritage and weight of expectation with the call to self-invention. Plus, Viet reveals the not-so-wholesome treats that enabled him to complete The Sympathizer! Mentioned in the Episode Frantz Fanon, Black Skin, White Masks Jean-Paul Sartre Nicholas Dames, "The Theory Generation" Maxine Hong Kingston, Woman Warrior John Okada, No-No Boy Cathy J. Schlund-Vials, Flashpoints for Asian-American Studies W.E.B. DuBois, Double Consciousness Gayatri Chakravorty Spivak, Double Bind Ocean Vuong Transcript Available Here: https://noveldialogue.org/transcripts/ Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

ND stages a trialogue this week with MacArthur "Genius" Cristina Rivera Garza and Notre Dame critics Kate Marshall and Dominique Vargas. Professor Rivera Garza recalls roadtripping through Mexico in a bochito (a Volkswagen). For her, such drives became the mother of literary invention: there was no car radio and when family conversations died down, the window (and not an iPhone) became the screen that occupied her. In a more serious vein, CRG, Kate, and Dominique also discuss the role of linguistic mobility and translation in bringing Rivera Garza's novels and essays to English-speaking audiences. CRG reflects on how books change when they cross languages and reminds us that the United States is the second largest Spanish-speaking country in the world. This episode productively estranges us from a number of received narratives about national monolingualism and experimental writing. Professor Rivera Garza rejects the notion of aesthetic individualism and the idealized image of the solitary writer. She declares that language always has plural roots and her work is underpinned by the belief that we only become individuals when community fails. Mentioned in the Episode Juan Rulfo Rosario Castellanos Ramón López Velarde Virginia Woolf Marguerite Duras Suzanne Jill Levine & Aviva Kana, Translators of The Taiga Syndrome Sarah Booker, Translator of Grieving: Dispatches from a Wounded Country Transcript available here. Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Caryl Phillips, professor of English at Yale, world-renowned and prize-winning novelist (from The Final Passage to 2018's A View of the Empire at Sunset) shares his thoughts on transplantation, on performance, on race, even on sports. Joining him here are John and the wonderful comparatist Corina Stan, educated in Romania, Germany, France and the US, authorContinue reading "2.5 Stitching the Past to the Present: Caryl Phillips speaks with Corina Stan (JP)"

by Diana Filar “Home is a place where I exist at every age.” What does “home” refer to in the title of Kamila Shamsie's 2017 novel Home Fire? For a book that opens in an airport, and whose characters travel between London, Karachi, Amherst, Raqqa, Istanbul, and Guantanamo Bay, home is no simple matter. Moreover,Continue reading "5. Writing Home"

Acclaimed novelist Kamila Shamsie joins esteemed Oxford scholar Ankhi Mukherjee for a wide-ranging discussion of literature and politics. Ankhi raises the unique challenges facing postcolonial and specifically Muslim writers in the wake of 9/11 and the war in Afghanistan, including the pressure to become commentators in times of crisis (our episode was recorded in AugustContinue reading "2.4 In Medias Res: Kamila Shamsie and Ankhi Mukherjee (AV)"

Novels, she says, should provide a “vision of life” rather than a “fascinated horror” of it.

The brilliant New York writer Sigrid Nunez‘s most recent novel is What Are You Going Through; her previous one, The Friend, (2018) won the National Book Award. She speaks with Tara Menon, of the Harvard English department, and author of a terrific article about Sigrid Nunez in the Sewanee Review. The conversation ranges widely andContinue reading "2.3 Because I Couldn’t Be a Dancer: Sigrid Nunez and Tara Menon (JP)"

"Who do we, as writers, choose not to leave behind?"

Novelist, screenwriter, and HBO showrunner Tom Perrotta joins his old friend Mark Wollaeger (who also happens to be a top scholar of modernism) for a wide-ranging conversation about literature, television, and everything in between. Tom reveals that he has been reading a most peculiar self-help book: Richard Ellmann’s biography of James Joyce. Mark then sharesContinue reading "2.2 Adaptation: Tom Perrotta and Mark Wollaeger Go from Page to Screen (AV)"

"The novel wraps itself around you like a cocoon.”

We are just delighted to welcome you back to the second season of Novel Dialogue, putting scholars and writers together to chew the fat, and spill secrets of the trade. It begins with a bang; who better to interview the prolific and prize-winning American novelist Jennifer Egan than Ivan Kreilkamp? The distinguished Indiana Victorianist showedContinue reading "2.1 Fiction as Streaming, Genre as Portal: Jennifer Egan and Ivan Kreilkamp (JP)"

Our two hosts play guest, and dive into the season’s high and lowlights, starting with the role humor played on the show. We also talk through the affordances of the “virtual” studio as opposed to the brick and mortar one where John recorded podcasts in “the before time.” Literary critics that we are, we can’tContinue reading "1.9 Season Wrap: Aarthi and John Reflect and Ruminate"

Our two hosts play guest, and dive into the season's high and lowlights, starting with the role humor played on the show. We also talk through the affordances of the “virtual” studio as opposed to the brick and mortar one where John recorded podcasts in “the before time.” Literary critics that we are, we can't help but consider the podcast as an audio form that solicits different kinds of listening. Aarthi wonders if it's “close” vs “ambient.” We both reminisce fondly about radio shows, especially Dr. Drew and Adam Corolla on Loveline. While discussing how editing decisions might contribute to an immersive listening experience, John becomes the worst version of a “Foley man” (Aarthi had to google that one). The show and the season end with a hopeful glance forward to Season Two, coming your way in Fall 2021. Hope to catch up with you then! Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Novel Dialogue sits down with Michael Johnston of Purdue University and George Saunders, master of the short story form and author of the Booker-prize winning novel Lincoln in the Bardo. This conversation was defiant of novelist and chemist C.P. Snow’s lament that the sciences and humanities have become siloed from one another. George shows usContinue reading "1.8 The Novel is like a Stack of Yurts: George Saunders talks with Michael Johnston (AV)"

Novel Dialogue sits down with Michael Johnston of Purdue University and George Saunders, master of the short story form and author of the Booker-prize winning novel Lincoln in the Bardo. This conversation was defiant of novelist and chemist C.P. Snow's lament that the sciences and humanities have become siloed from one another. George shows us how works of fiction are laboratories for all sorts of experiments. He also explains how his background in the sciences and engineering has shaped his approach to writing fiction. (Hint: it has a lot to do with the search for truth and a faith in iteration.) Michael, George, and Aarthi get into the nitty gritty of truth-seeking and how good literature moves us away from the simplified “Cruella DeVil model of morality.” Indeed, some of the most interesting moments in fiction reveal the patterns of self-deception by which good people justify bad actions. George explains how achieving moral seriousness in literary composition demands playing bouncer to direct moral concerns. Instead, he engages in a process of “micro-choosing” that allows morality to emerge from revisions and decisions that might not be entirely conscious. We move from the writing process toward its result: an intelligent but “shaggy” efficiency. Shagginess is what keeps literary form – whether the short story or the novel – moving dialectically between fun and function. George has taught creative writing for almost as long as he has been a professional writer (and his recent A Swim in a Pond in the Rain is a brilliant foray into his course on the Russian short story). In the final part of the show, he discusses the value of literature for the individual reader and for anyone struggling to balance material survival with a sense of purpose. Mentioned in the Episode James Joyce, Dubliners Robert Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance Ayn Rand Lisa Feldman Barrett, How Emotions are Made: The Secret Life of the Brain. Stuart Cornfeld George Orwell, “Politics and the English Language” American Academy of Arts and Sciences, “The Humanities in American Life” Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Helen Garner sits down with John and Elizabeth McMahon, a distinguished scholar  of Australian literature. Helen’s novels range from the anti-patriarchy exuberance of Monkey Grip (1977) to the heartbreaking mortality at the heart of The Spare Room (2008). She has also authored a slew of nonfiction, plus screenplays for Jane Campion’s Two Friends and GillianContinue reading "1.7 Helen Garner is Hacking at the Adverbs (Elizabeth McMahon, JP)"

Helen Garner sits down with John and Elizabeth McMahon, a distinguished scholar of Australian literature. Helen's novels range from the anti-patriarchy exuberance of Monkey Grip (1977) to the heartbreaking mortality at the heart of The Spare Room (2008). She has also authored a slew of nonfiction, plus screenplays for Jane Campion's Two Friends and Gillian Armstrong's wonderfully Garneresque The Last Days of Chez Nous. After a reading from John's favorite, The Children's Bach, the trio discusses Garner's capacity for cutting and cutting, creating resonant, thought-inducing gaps. Garner connects that taste for excision, perhaps paradoxically, to her tendency to accumulate scraps, bits and pieces of life. She relates her father's restlessness to her own life-total of houses inhabited (27; do you think that's lot, dear listeners?). “Why wouldn't I write about households?” asks Helen, “They're just so endlessly interesting.” Who shaped her writing? Raymond Carver: packed with power, but the pages white with omissions and excisions. Helen offers an anecdote about her own pruning that ends with her “ankle-deep in adverbs.” That's how to escape the “fat writing” that stems for distrust of the reader. She thoughtfully compares the practical virtues of keeping notebooks for the “music” of everyday life to the nightly process of diary-writing (more analytical). John raises the question of pervasive musical metaphors in Helen's writing, and she reports her passion for “boring pieces” and the “formal” side of Bach, which makes a listener feel that there is such a thing as meaning. “There's something about shaping a sentence, too, which can be musical.” A deep Garner insight: “I find chaos quite frightening, actually, I feel an urge to impose order.” You can see an image of one of Helen's treats above: she confessed to that particular indulgence off-air. Her other choice may surprise you–John's never had one! Which certainly could not be said of martinis….. Mentioned in the Episode Marilynne Robinson, Housekeeping (the fixed people and the wandering people), Gilead, Home, The West Wing (yes, the TV show! Helen watched it during lockdown when she couldn't bear fiction…) Raymond Carver‘s minimalist fiction (his first collection) Tess Gallagher (as writer and as Carver's editor) Willa Cather, “The Novel Démeublé” (1922; on how to un-furnish fiction, leaving it an empty room) Ernest Hemingway, A Moveable Feast Sigmund Freud on “the day's residue” (e.g. in The Interpretation of Dreams, 1900) George Eliot, Quarry for Middlemarch Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Gerry Canavan talks to geek feminist author Kameron Hurley about her Hugo-nominated novel The Light Brigade. A love-hate letter to military science fiction, The Light Brigade turns the form on its head. It is built around women fighters, queerness, and defying authority while being at the bottom of the chain of command.  The novel also has surprisingContinue reading "1.6 Military Sci-Fi Minus the Misogyny: Kameron Hurley with Gerry Canavan (AV)"

Gerry Canavan talks to geek feminist author Kameron Hurley about her Hugo-nominated novel The Light Brigade. A love-hate letter to military science fiction, The Light Brigade turns the form on its head. It is built around women fighters, queerness, and defying authority while being at the bottom of the chain of command. The novel also has surprising roots in the history of anti-apartheid resistance in South Africa where Kameron lived for a time to research women's roles in armed revolt. We discuss delayed reveals of characters' race and gender in sci-fi in light of the genre's history of White supremacy and male-dominated narratives. Kameron and Gerry also revisit some of the juiciest, pulpiest fiction around – the stuff we loved as kids but don't talk about or teach in the classroom (shh!).  Mentioned in the Episode Octavia Butler Samuel Delany Robert Heinlein, Starship Troopers Joe Haldeman, The Forever War uMkhonto we Sizwe – armed wing of the African National Congress Robben Island – where Nelson Mandela was imprisoned Ursula LeGuin Alexandra Rowland, coiner of the term “hopepunk” Joanna Russ Robert E. Howard, author of the “Conan the Barbarian” stories Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

James Robertson, brilliant author of The Testament of Gideon Mack, and University of Edinburgh’s top prof. Penny Fielding beam in from their respective corners of Scotland. Extensive reference is made to (John’s madly beloved) James Hogg and to Robert Louis Stevenson, especially his Jack-the-Ripperesque Jekyll and Hyde. The violence that underpins slavery–aye, even in Scotland,Continue reading "1.5 Getting Into Other Worlds: James Robertson with Penny Fielding (JP)"

James Robertson, brilliant author of The Testament of Gideon Mack, and University of Edinburgh's top prof. Penny Fielding beam in from their respective corners of Scotland. Extensive reference is made to (John's madly beloved) James Hogg and to Robert Louis Stevenson, especially his Jack-the-Ripperesque Jekyll and Hyde. The violence that underpins slavery–aye, even in Scotland, and even during the enduringly influential Scottish Enlightenment–is dredged up, as is the question of feeling implicated in the legacy of an enslaving system. James sketches a generous theory about what and how a novel signifies: it is simply asleep until a reader picks it up and invests imagination into it. Hints are dropped regarding James's newest novel, News of the Dead due for release in May. And, of course, we learn about his writerly treat… Mentioned in the Episode Louis L'Amour, J. T. Edson and Will Henry Robert Louis Stevenson, Jekyll and Hyde, Weir of Hermiston (“a tragic part of his life….and I'd like to finish it for him”) James Hogg, The Private Memoir and Confessions of a Justified Sinner Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho (imagine watching during its first release and…. not knowing! Joseph Knight…..and the actual Joseph Knight (“a history I didn't know, and I'd done two history degrees!”) The Fanatic Edinburgh's Dundas Statue Johns Hopkins, a slaveowner Ben Okri, Birds of Heaven, “Nations and peoples are largely the stories they feed themselves.” Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Novel Dialogue sends Martin Puchner (polymathic author of The Written World and most recently The Language of Thieves) out to speak with Pew author Catherine Lacey. They go a-wandering. Lacey’s earlier works include a 2018 collection of short stories,  Certain American States, and two  novels: The Answers in 2017 and 2014’s Nobody is Ever Missing, a delightful roadContinue reading "1.4 Feral Fiction: Catherine Lacey and Martin Puchner (JP)"

Novel Dialogue sends Martin Puchner (polymathic author of The Written World and most recently The Language of Thieves) out to speak with Pew author Catherine Lacey. They go a-wandering. Lacey's earlier works include a 2018 collection of short stories, Certain American States, and two novels: The Answers in 2017 and 2014's Nobody is Ever Missing, a delightful road novel set in New Zealand–always a sure way to win John's admiration. Martin starts by noticing the feral through-line in Catherine's work, a way that people escape or withdraw from socialization. And things go rapidly uphill and downhill from there. In short a rollicking rhythm prevails–you may want to listen while out rambling yourself. Even though Catherine proclaims “we are all housecats now.” Mentioned in the Episode Mark Twain, Huckleberry Finn Marilynne Robinson, Housekeeping (1980) Jen George, The Babysitter at Rest (The Dorothy Project) Tove Ditlesen, The Copenhagen Trilogy (very dark, very wintry, very icy-but elegant) P.G. Wodehouse Haruki Murakami Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ulka Anjaria and Madhuri Vijay sit down to talk about Madhuri’s prize-winning first novel The Far Field. They discuss what it’s like to write intimately about a place – Kashmir – that many people even within India know only through headlines and news stories. Getting intimate with a place moves us into talking about the IndianContinue reading "1.3 Oh, The Places You’ll Go: Madhuri Vijay talks to Ulka Anjaria (AV)"

Ulka Anjaria and Madhuri Vijay sit down to talk about Madhuri's prize-winning first novel The Far Field. They discuss what it's like to write intimately about a place – Kashmir – that many people even within India know only through headlines and news stories. Getting intimate with a place moves us into talking about the Indian novelist as a guide to Indian society. Sometimes guiding readers reflects a legacy of cultural imperialism where writers in the Global South gain prestige and fame from addressing audiences in Europe and the United States. Other times guiding readers enables citizens of India to see regions of conflict, like Kashmir, with more sensitivity rather than sensationalism. The serious overtones of the conversation relax into reflecting on the pleasures of creating fictional characters and watching them grow as if they were real people independent of the writer. Ulka and Madhuri reflect on the urge to read and write stories where relationships are hard and not everything is a damn metaphor! In our search for a metaphor-free zone, we did not have to go to any far field. Turns out it was right there in mother-daughter relationships and the less dignified aspects of parenting. As Madhuri says, the silly is much harder for the novelist to get right than the serious! Mentioned in the Episode Ismat Chughtai Anita Desai Salman Rushdie Arundhati Roy Kashmir Conflict Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Pamuk plays scholar and novelist both. He reads the cheekily postmodernist final page of his novel Snow, while also talmudically interspersing comments on the text. Listen to the Bonus here:

In Episode Two of Novel Dialogue, critic and scholar Bruce Robbins sits down with Nobel Laureate Orhan Pamuk. They have taught classes on the political novel together at Columbia for years, and it shows. They ask how the novel can ever escape its roots in middle-class sensibility and perspective: Joseph Conrad comes up, but so does modern BrazilianContinue reading "1.2 That Demonic Novelistic Impulse: Orhan Pamuk with Bruce Robbins (JP)"

Pamuk plays scholar and novelist both. He reads the cheekily postmodernist final page of his novel Snow, while also talmudically interspersing comments on the text. Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In Episode Two of Novel Dialogue, critic and scholar Bruce Robbins sits down with Nobel Laureate Orhan Pamuk. They have taught classes on the political novel together at Columbia for years, and it shows. They ask how the novel can ever escape its roots in middle-class sensibility and perspective: Joseph Conrad comes up, but so does modern Brazilian film. Then they discuss the demonic appeal of Russian novels—and why retired military officers produced so many great Turkish translations of Russian novels. We hear tantalizing details about Pamuk's forthcoming pandemic novel, Nights of Plague. He discusses his move away from “highbrow ironical postmodernist” fiction and reveals his affection for talking about politics–along with his distaste for what the consequences of speaking out may be. “I am not shy about talking…but there are consequences!” Finally, he tells Novel Dialogue what he did to celebrate the news of his Nobel, which came on “a surrealistic day.” Mentioned in the Episode City of God (Brazilian film, 2002) Joseph Conrad (Under Western Eyes, Nostromo) Ivan Turgenev Gayatri Spivak, “Can the Subaltern Speak?” Karl Marx, “18th Brumaire of Louis Napoleon” Fyodor Dostoyevsky, The Demons (1871-2), A Writer's Diary, James Joyce, Dubliners Louis Aragon, (Zolaesque romances at the end of his career), Aurélien Vladimir Nabokov, Lolita Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Novel Dialogue kicks off with the writer and photographer Teju Cole and literary critic Kelly Rich of Harvard University talking about “saying yes to the text” as the first rule of good literary critical reading. But they also consider what happens when the urge to affirm a text gets swept up in the larger social and political dilemmas of our time. How do we celebrate great works of literature and art while also questioning the standards that have historically granted some writers “greatness” and left others out due to race, gender, and national background? In this episode, we look for ways of preserving excellence while also questioning greatness. Mentioned in the Episode Rachel Cusk George Lamming Johann Sebastian Bach Ludwig van Beethoven George Bridgetower Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Novel Dialogue : where unlikely conversation partners come together to discuss the making of novels and what to make of them. Join Aarthi Vadde, a scholar of contemporary literature and Victorianist John Plotz as they take a four-continent journey (ok, fine a virtual four-continent, Zoomish journey….) to talk turkey with novelists and critics the world over. In fact, episode two takes place in….Turkey, where Orhan Pamuk , in conversation with Bruce Robbins, reveals a hankering for french fries… Aarthi Vadde is Associate Professor of English at Duke University. Email: aarthi.vadde@duke.edu. John Plotz is Barbara Mandel Professor of the Humanities at Brandeis University and co-founder of the Brandeis Educational Justice Initiative. Email: plotz@brandeis.edu. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Novel Dialogue kicks off with the writer and photographer Teju Cole and literary critic Kelly Rich of Harvard University talking about “saying yes to the text” as the first rule of good literary critical reading. But they also consider what happens when the urge to affirm a text gets swept up in the larger social andContinue reading "1.1 Do Great Novels Set the Standard or Challenge it? Kelly Rich and Teju Cole (AV)"

Novel Dialogue : where unlikely conversation partners come together to discuss the making of novels and what to make of them. Join Aarthi Vadde, a scholar of contemporary literature and Victorianist John Plotz as they take a four-continent journey (ok, fine a virtual four-continent, Zoomish journey….) to talk turkey with novelists and critics the worldContinue reading "1.0 Introducing a New Podcast: Novel Dialogue with Aarthi Vadde and John Plotz"