Podcasts about robot proof recruiter

On this episode, Chris Hoyt and Katrina Collier, author of Reboot Hiring & The Robot-Proof Recruiter, global keynote and facilitator, will make the case for the value of TA. They'll discuss the pitfalls of automation, the challenges TA professionals face in pushing back against poor hiring practices, and how empowering TA teams can lead to stronger partnerships, better hiring outcomes, and a more humane experience for job seekers. It's time to rethink the role of TA and unlock its full potential.

ENGLISH VERSION BELOW She is on a mission to fix talent acquisition and candidate experience - In dieser inspirierenden Podcastfolge taucht Eliane in die Welt des Talent Acquisition ein und spricht mit der visionären Autorin, Facilitatorin und Sprecherin Katrina Collier. Gemeinsam beleuchten sie die heutige Landschaft des Talent Acquisitions und liefern frische Einblicke sowie praktische Tipps. Themen dieser Folge: - Die Bedeutung des heutigen Talent Acquisitions und was es erfolgreich macht - Eigenschaften erfolgreicher Talent Acquisition Profis - Der richtige Auftritt, um den Respekt von Hiring Managers zu gewinnen - Künstliche Intelligenz im Talent Acquisition richtig einsetzen Ressourcen und Links der Episode: - Metaview Software: https://www.metaview.ai/? - Amy Cuddy's Ted Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_may_shape_who_you_are?language=en Gewinnspiel: Nimm am Gewinnspiel teil und sichere dir eine (englische) Ausgabe von "The Robot-Proof Recruiter": 1. Folge "Impulse Group" auf LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/impulse-group-gmbh/ 2. Schreibe eine Direktnachricht an Impulse-Group und erzähle uns darin kurz, wieso du Katrinas Buch haben möchtest 3. Für doppelte Gewinnchancen: Like den LinkedIn Post vom 27.12.2023 Teilnahmebedingungen: Teilnahmeschluss ist der 17.1.2024 um 23:59 Uhr. Teilnehmen kann jeder ab 18 Jahren aus der DACH-Region. Der Rechtsweg und die Barauszahlung sind ausgeschlossen. Die fünf Gewinnerinnen und Gewinner werden von Impulse-Group GmbH ausgewählt und per LinkedIn Direktnachricht kontaktiert. Dieses Gewinnspiel wird nicht gesponsert. Links zu Katrina Collier: - LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katrinacollier/ - Podcast/Memoir: https://thedamageofwords.com/ - Website: https://katrinacollier.com/ Links zu Impulse Group: - Website: https://www.impulse-group.ch/ - LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/impulse-group-gmbh/ - Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/impulse_group/ Über den Podcast: Hinterlasse eine 5-Sterne-Bewertung auf Apple Podcasts und abonniere den Podcast. Vielen Dank für deine Unterstützung! Produziert von Podcastliebe, deiner Full-Service Podcast Agentur. ----------------------------------------------------------------- ENGLISH: She is on a mission to fix talent acquisition and candidate experience - In this inspiring podcast episode, Eliane dives into the world of talent acquisition and speaks with visionary author, facilitator and speaker Katrina Collier. Together they examine today's talent acquisition landscape and provide fresh insights and practical tips. Topics of this episode: - The importance of talent acquisition today and what makes it successful - Characteristics of successful talent acquisition professionals - The right appearance to gain the respect of hiring managers - Using artificial intelligence correctly in talent acquisition Resources and links from the episode: - Metaview Software: https://www.metaview.ai/? - Amy Cuddy's Ted Talk: https://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_may_shape_who_you_are?language=en Hot to win Katrina's Book: Enter the competition to win a copy of "The Robot-Proof Recruiter": 1. follow "Impulse Group" on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/impulse-group-gmbh/ 2. write a direct message to Impulse-Group and tell us briefly why you would like to have Katrina's book 3. for double chances to win: Like the LinkedIn post from 27.12.2023 Conditions of participation: The closing date for entries is 17.1.2024 at 23:59. Anyone aged 18 or above from the DACH region can take part. Legal recourse and cash payment are excluded. The five winners will be selected by Impulse-Group GmbH and contacted via LinkedIn direct message from the company account. This competition is not sponsored. Links to Katrina Collier: - LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katrinacollier/ - Podcast/Memoir: https://thedamageofwords.com/ - Website: https://katrinacollier.com/ Links to Impulse Group

This week on TRF we cover: Will resumes disappear in the next 5 years? Shelley is confident they will, Serge sees things differently. No FOMO here. As our friends all head to the land of bedbugs and baguettes, we are kind of glad we didn't go to Unleash World in Paris. In the News LinkedIn does some right sizing with laying off 668 positions, including more in talent acquisition.  Stack Overflow hired too many sales people with no direction, at least thats our conclusion with their lay off announcement. AI for headshot, the jury is out. Tip of The Week Book recommendations: The Talent Fix by Tim Sackett, Hiring Humans by Craig Fisher, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and our all time favorite The Robot Proof Recruiter by Katrina Collier. Recruiting Insights By the year 2030 staffing agencies are expected to increase their market size by 12.7%, doing the math, thats $1778.29 Billion. Let's unpack how and why that might be. Moonhub's claim of 1 billion public profiles sounds a bit of an exaggeration. We'd like a demo please! Candidate experience platforms seem a bit optimistic when their success is hinged on hiring managers are tasked with designing the experience. A chatbot wont solve the problem! When designing your campus recruitment program get clarity on what new grads say they ideally want vs what they end up accepting as their first job out of school.

This week on TRF we cover: Will resumes disappear in the next 5 years? Shelley is confident they will, Serge sees things differently. No FOMO here. As our friends all head to the land of bedbugs and baguettes, we are kind of glad we didn't go to Unleash World in Paris. In the News LinkedIn does some right sizing with laying off 668 positions, including more in talent acquisition.  Stack Overflow hired too many sales people with no direction, at least thats our conclusion with their lay off announcement. AI for headshot, the jury is out. Tip of The Week Book recommendations: The Talent Fix by Tim Sackett, Hiring Humans by Craig Fisher, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and our all time favorite The Robot Proof Recruiter by Katrina Collier. Recruiting Insights By the year 2030 staffing agencies are expected to increase their market size by 12.7%, doing the math, thats $1778.29 Billion. Let's unpack how and why that might be. Moonhub's claim of 1 billion public profiles sounds a bit of an exaggeration. We'd like a demo please! Candidate experience platforms seem a bit optimistic when their success is hinged on hiring managers are tasked with designing the experience. A chatbot wont solve the problem! When designing your campus recruitment program get clarity on what new grads say they ideally want vs what they end up accepting as their first job out of school.

This week on TRF we cover: Will resumes disappear in the next 5 years? Shelley is confident they will, Serge sees things differently. No FOMO here. As our friends all head to the land of bedbugs and baguettes, we are kind of glad we didn't go to Unleash World in Paris. In the News LinkedIn does some right sizing with laying off 668 positions, including more in talent acquisition.  Stack Overflow hired too many sales people with no direction, at least thats our conclusion with their lay off announcement. AI for headshot, the jury is out. Tip of The Week Book recommendations: The Talent Fix by Tim Sackett, Hiring Humans by Craig Fisher, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and our all time favorite The Robot Proof Recruiter by Katrina Collier. Recruiting Insights By the year 2030 staffing agencies are expected to increase their market size by 12.7%, doing the math, thats $1778.29 Billion. Let's unpack how and why that might be. Moonhub's claim of 1 billion public profiles sounds a bit of an exaggeration. We'd like a demo please! Candidate experience platforms seem a bit optimistic when their success is hinged on hiring managers are tasked with designing the experience. A chatbot wont solve the problem! When designing your campus recruitment program get clarity on what new grads say they ideally want vs what they end up accepting as their first job out of school.

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In a recent Elite Recruiter podcast episode, host Benjamin Mena interviewed Katrina Collier, author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, about the changing recruitment market and the importance of staying relevant in the age of AI. Katrina Collier shared her background in recruitment, starting as a trainee recruitment consultant after moving to London from Australia. She also discussed the lack of education around the recruitment profession and the importance of improving candidate experience and recruitment practices.  The conversation centered around Collier's book, The Robot-Proof Recruiter, which argues that recruiters cannot be replaced by technology. The book aims to help recruiters understand the challenges of recruitment in a digital age and how to stand out in a crowded market. Collier emphasized the importance of treating candidates with compassion and kindness, pushing back on hiring managers when necessary, and doing proper intakes to ensure a better human experience. The book has received contributions from 85 people worldwide, making it a comprehensive manual that recruiters need to read. Collier donated her royalties from the book to a charity that aims to end modern-day slavery.  The conversation also touched on the impact of the pandemic on recruitment and the need for more education about the profession. The speakers discussed the impact of overhiring in the recruitment industry and how it affects people's lives. They talked about how companies knee-jerk react to economic changes by firing TA teams, the lack of awareness among recruiters about the slowing of hiring, and the responsibility of the C Suite in signing off on requisitions. They also discussed the impact of irresponsible hiring on people's lives, emphasizing the need for recruiters to remember the compassion and empathy that they lost during the pandemic.  The conversation then turned to the impact of AI on recruiters. Collier expressed skepticism, stating that AI will only create more noise and spam unless the person using the tool is creative and curious enough to personalize messages. They also gave an example of a highly personalized message from 2015 that went viral on Twitter but did not elicit a response from the recipient. The speakers also touched upon the issue of overhiring by companies and the need for the C-Suite to be held accountable for the impact on people's lives. However, they remained optimistic that the job market will eventually level out.  The speakers provided advice for recruiters, emphasizing the importance of being more creative and trying different methods to get in touch with hiring managers. They emphasized the need for a proper job intake process, as it is the most overlooked part of the hiring process. Recruiters were encouraged to spend time upfront with hiring managers to understand their needs and not to accept outdated job descriptions. The conversation also highlighted the need to look forward and understand what the company really needs, and the importance of getting hiring managers to invest time upfront to save time and money in the long run. The conversation ended with the advice to drop attitudes and partner with hiring managers to fill roles.  Katrina Collier LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katrinacollier/ Robot Proof Recruiter Book: https://amzn.to/41qGvUy Katrina Collier Website: https://katrinacollier.com/ With your Host Benjamin Mena with Select Source Solutions: http://www.selectsourcesolutions.com/ Benjamin Mena LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/benjaminmena/ Benjamin Mena Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/benlmena/ Benjamin Mena TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@benjaminlmena Benjamin Mena Twitter: https://twitter.com/benjamin_l_mena The Elite Recruiter Podcast Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/theeliterecruiter/

Katrina Collier is p*ssed off! About what, you ask? INTAKE, that's what. Hiring managers don't know how to articulate what they need, and Talent Acquisition doesn't know how to ask the right questions. We need to fix this, and who better to fix it than the author of one of the essential books in recruitment, The Robot-Proof Recruiter? Katrina and I covered the following: Katrina's observations of the market in 2023 What's p*ssing her off about Talent Acquisition right now How to fix the disconnect between TA and the Hiring Managers The most critical questions that TA should ask hiring managers to ensure we qualify the roles most effectively How to manage our hiring managers to the point of understanding the challenges in the market and the type of person they can get rather than the purple unicorn they want How to push back on roles and even walk away from them internally whilst still protecting our position in the business What Katrina thinks about the rise of AI and the impact it will have on TAs and recruiters Katrina's ONE Piece of advice that we all need to follow in TA to be great at our jobs in 2023 Contact Katrina here - https://www.linkedin.com/in/katrinacollier/

One of our favourite guest Katrina Collier who just released the second version of the Robot Proof Recruiter. With relentless passion, Katrina has over 2 decades in the recruitment industry, spoken on 5 continents and now has version 2 of the must read book for everyone in TA. Always generous with her recommendations, add to your must read list, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and take your career to the next level.  Highlights  Lessons learned about interviewing since the pandemic Biggest fail of companies in the last 2 years are those who use monitoring software Essential characteristics for recruiter to be successful Quiet Quitting - Should you just be grateful you have a job? Let's not scare ourselves INTO a recession, its a lot of hype.

It was early on Day 2 of the brilliant ATC in Sydney and (despite a raging hangover) we just had to catch up with Katrina Collier.We have been itching (metaphorically, not literally) to speak with Katrina forever. Design-Thinking Facilitator... Speaker... Author and bloody Legend - Katrina is renowned for her 'no-holds-barred' attitude and forward-thinking in the TA/Recruitment industry.In her own words she is on a mission to fix talent acquisition and candidate experience; often exacerbated by hybrid working. Katrina is one of 2 people globally delivering design-thinking workshops specifically for recruitment, helping companies fix the real issues preventing successful hiring. She is also a Mentor, Author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, leader of The Collective, a global keynote speaker, and co-host of Hear The People.Katrina is an Ambassador for Hope for Justice charity, and you'll find her on LinkedIn and on Instagram & Twitter @KatrinaMCollierThere were many highlights of our catch-up but if we could break it down to just 2 words they are 'be curious.' This is your opportunity to shine; you may not get another - so have a listen and get inspired... we did.Thanks to equidi for your support.

Welcome to Series 5, Episode 5 of the Future of Internal Communication podcast, brought to you by the Institute of Internal Communication   This episode, Cat and Dom chat with Katrina Collier, keynote speaker, facilitator and author of The Robot Proof Recruiter.  With a track record in recruitment, Katrina is on a mission to fix poor candidate experience in hiring; something that's been exacerbated by hybrid working. We talk about changes in the UK labour market since the onset of COVID and the critical role of communication in recruiting.   This podcast series is produced for the Institute of Internal Communication by Jess Williams and Olasubomi Tolu-Ogunpolu.

Shits and Giggles with HR Episode #1 What is Right About the Recruitment Industry Could Be Written on a Stamp! Join Lisa Haggar and Katrina Collier to discuss what is wrong with the recruitment industry. The horror stories of people going through 6 rounds to get a job and then getting no reply, or how people receiving job offers then leave their job, only to be told that the job they applied for & won, has been made redundant before they even start! Sharing Resources Mentioned By Katrina in the Podcast Katrina's Website The Robot-Proof Recruiter Getting back to people: https://circlebackinitiative.com/ https://end-ghosting.com/ Places to feedback: https://www.glassdoor.co.uk/interview/ https://indeed.com https://www.kununu.com/ https://www.reddit.com/r/recruitinghell You Can Read the Shits and Giggles with HR Episode #1: What is Right About the Recruitment Industry Could Be Written on a Stamp! Transcript Below: What is wrong with the recruitment industry?   0:0:0.0 --> 0:0:0.600 Darren A. Smith Let's start. 0:0:10.10 --> 0:0:13.970 Darren A. Smith Welcome to the Shitz and Giggles with HR podcast. 0:0:14.760 --> 0:0:17.830 Darren A. Smith We're here with Lisa. Haggar, Lisa. Say hello, please. 0:0:18.750 --> 0:0:20.20 Lisa Haggar Good evening. Hello everybody. 0:0:20.820 --> 0:0:23.690 Darren A. Smith And we're also here with Katrina Collier. Hello, Katrina. 0:0:24.330 --> 0:0:25.220 Katrina Collier (Guest) Hello. 0:0:25.690 --> 0:0:46.420 Darren A. Smith Hi I'm your host, Darren Smith. We'll come back to these lovely ladies in a moment. Our topic for tonight and I'm going to blame Lisa for this is what is right about the recruitment industry could be written on a stamp. Katrina, I'm just gonna come to you and ask what's your name in this game? What do you do? 0:1:6.690 --> 0:1:7.510 Darren A. Smith Let's stop listening. 0:0:47.140 --> 0:1:11.40 Katrina Collier (Guest) So I am best known as the author of the Robot Proof Recruiter that I have been in the recruitment industry for nearly two decades, and I spend most of my time delivering design thinking workshops to fix candidate experience and recruitment. And I also have a coaching and mentoring group that's probably me in a nutshell, but plenty plenty of experience in their recruitment and talent acquisition space. 0:1:11.700 --> 0:1:18.200 Darren A. Smith Brilliant. Brilliant. But we wanna get into that and ask you what's wrong with this industry. Let me just come to Lisa for first. Lisa, what do you do? 0:1:19.730 --> 0:1:28.920 Lisa Haggar It's a good question. I tell people I knit Jelly for a living because when you tell them the work in HR, it switches people off quicker than if you're the tax man. So I knit Jelly Darren. 0:1:29.530 --> 0:1:30.210 Darren A. Smith Yeah. 0:1:30.280 --> 0:1:30.540 Darren A. Smith Yeah. 0:1:33.520 --> 0:1:33.750 Darren A. Smith It's. 0:1:36.800 --> 0:1:37.350 Darren A. Smith OK. 0:1:37.770 --> 0:1:38.270 Darren A. Smith That's good. 0:1:31.270 --> 0:1:39.940 Lisa Haggar Or otherwise known as the ******** from HR Queen of HR on LinkedIn, the opinionated small 5 foot blonde who has a lot to say about most things. 0:1:40.670 --> 0:1:42.580 Darren A. Smith Lovely. And how do you guys know each other? 0:1:44.250 --> 0:1:44.940 Katrina Collier (Guest) LinkedIn. 0:1:44.200 --> 0:1:48.510 Lisa Haggar Uh, Katrina's fabulous, and I know everybody who's fabulous on LinkedIn. Simple. 0:1:48.490 --> 0:1:52.860 Katrina Collier (Guest) Is it LinkedIn? I don't know how we know each other. That's hilarious. Yeah, LinkedIn. 0:1:50.890 --> 0:1:58.40 Lisa Haggar It is, yes, yes, I remember. I remember the day we met Katrina. Do you mean you? You can't remember that wonderful time? I don't know. 0:1:58.610 --> 0:1:59.110 Katrina Collier (Guest) Yeah. 0:2:0.410 --> 0:2:1.420 Darren A.

This episode of Talent & Growth is in preparation of our live event, happening at the Warner Brothers Discovery Offices in London on the 19th of October 2022. This community of talent acquisition and people professionals will be coming together to network and share their expertise with one another. To join our live event and hear from all of our incredible speakers, you can sign up here: https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/talent-growth-tickets-414487652727 To set the tone for the event, we're throwing it back to some highlights from previous podcast guests. Today we're joined by Katrina Collier, author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter and Rohan Kallicharan, the Director of People and Talent at Carbon Clean. Rohan is also a trustee at Mind, the charity that our live event will be supporting. To find out more about the work that they're doing both on a professional and personal level, listen to this episode of the Talent & Growth podcast now!

In this episode of Tribepod, Jim Stroud, VP of Marketing at Proactive Talent interviews Katrina Collier about her new book - "The Robot Proof Recruiter." During the conversation, the following topics are addressed: How to show you are a recruiter worth talking to How to show you are a company worth talking to Why you should focus your recruitment process on people and not technology And more... Connect with Katrina Collier via her webpage at https://katrinacollier.com/ ... Download free HR resources designed to make your work life a little bit easier. Employer Brand Budget Template, Cost of Unfilled Jobs Calculator, Diversity Statement Examples, Creative Recruiting Strategies and more... https://proactivetalent.com/downloadables ... Please rate our podcast on your favorite podcast platform! ... ABOUT THE ROBOT PROOF RECRUITER The Robot-Proof Recruiter shows you how to use a human-first approach to hiring that will help you grab and hold a candidate's attention better than a robot! It contains essential guidance on overcoming obstacles, including how to recruit without an existing online presence, how to work effectively with hiring managers to improve the outreach and candidate experience, and how to use technology to support the candidate's journey from initial outreach, through to application, successful onboarding, and later to alumnus. The second edition covers the unexpected impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on recruiting, and how using unique human qualities in conjunction with technology can enhance employer branding and candidate experience. Full of expert guidance, practical tips and updated case studies, this book explains what works, what doesn't and how you can stand out and recruit effectively. The Robot-Proof Recruiter is an indispensable book for all recruitment professionals and HR practitioners who want to recruit the right people for their organization. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/proactivetalent/message

Katrina Collier, author of "The Robot-Proof Recruiter" is one of our favorite guests to have on. Aside from being a proud Gen X'er and sharing a birthday with Chad (same year and everything), she is a well-loved global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast. We chatted with her when the 1st Edition of the book came out, pre-pandemic, but the 2nd edition is just as appetizing. In it, Katrina teaches companies how to recruit without an existing online presence, and she covers the unexpected impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on recruiting in detail. Oh yeah, and there are plenty of new case studies to discuss. Enjoy.

Katrina Collier, author of "The Robot-Proof Recruiter" is one of our favorite guests to have on. Aside from being a proud Gen X'er and sharing a birthday with Chad (same year and everything), she is a well-loved global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast. We chatted with her when the 1st Edition of the book came out, pre-pandemic, but the 2nd edition is just as appetizing. In it, Katrina teaches companies how to recruit without an existing online presence, and she covers the unexpected impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on recruiting in detail. Oh yeah, and there are plenty of new case studies to discuss. Enjoy.

Katrina Collier, author of "The Robot-Proof Recruiter" is one of our favorite guests to have on. Aside from being a proud Gen X'er and sharing a birthday with Chad (same year and everything), she is a well-loved global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast. We chatted with her when the 1st Edition of the book came out, pre-pandemic, but the 2nd edition is just as appetizing. In it, Katrina teaches companies how to recruit without an existing online presence, and she covers the unexpected impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on recruiting in detail. Oh yeah, and there are plenty of new case studies to discuss. Enjoy.

The 2nd Edition of The Robot Proof Recruiter will be available in North America on August 30. With relentless passion, Katrina has over 2 decades in the recruitment industry, spoken on 5 continents and now has version 2 of the must read book for everyone in TA. Always generous with her recommendations, add to your must read list, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and take your career to the next level.  Highlights  Lessons learned about interviewing since the pandemic Biggest fail of companies in the last 2 years are those who use monitoring software Essential characteristics for recruiter to be successful Quiet Quitting - Should you just be grateful you have a job? Let's not scare ourselves INTO a recession, its a lot of hype.

The 2nd Edition of The Robot Proof Recruiter will be available in North America on August 30. With relentless passion, Katrina has over 2 decades in the recruitment industry, spoken on 5 continents and now has version 2 of the must read book for everyone in TA. Always generous with her recommendations, add to your must read list, Full Stack Recruiter by Jan Tegze and take your career to the next level.  Highlights  Lessons learned about interviewing since the pandemic Biggest fail of companies in the last 2 years are those who use monitoring software Essential characteristics for recruiter to be successful Quiet Quitting - Should you just be grateful you have a job? Let's not scare ourselves INTO a recession, its a lot of hype.

Katrina Collier is on a mission to end the collaboration chaos that ruins recruitment and candidate experience; exacerbated by hybrid working. She is one of 2 people globally delivering design-thinking workshops specifically for recruitment, that swiftly help companies fix the real issues preventing successful talent acquisition. She is also a Mentor, Author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective podcast. Katrina is an Ambassador for Hope for Justice charity, and you'll find her on LinkedIn and Instagram & Twitter @KatrinaMCollier. In this episode, we covered: The inspiration behind writing The Robot-Proof Recruiter What does Katrina feel is wrong with recruitment and talent acquisition in 2022? Tips for becoming an authentic voice in your market How to make the most out of your LinkedIn profile How we should be using technology to support the candidate's journey News on the included updates for the 2nd edition of Robot-Proof Recruiter, being published on August 3rd Can you train recruiters remotely? Katrina's top tips for becoming a Robot-Proof Recruiter Where we are going in talent acquisition in the next five years Contact Katrina here - Katrina Collier

Katrina Collier is an effervescent human being who is a human in every sense, and that shines through in the work she does. She wrote  The Robot-Proof Recruiter, and runs workshops and gives talks on how we might humanise the hiring process. Together we explore a little of that and a lot of how we construct environments that feel a little more human. Let her warm the cockles of your soul as you hear us speak about: Trust being at the heart of what it means to create work communities thriveRelationships being at the heart of what I means to work together effectively, and how we use design thinking to get thereThe magic of ideas when they come from the whole work community or team Trying things, failing fast and move onI came away full of joy, thinking about how I might create more space to play and I hope you will too.Ps. For those who want a little explanation to design thinking, take a look here.

Author Katrina Collier joins us to discuss what may prove to be some of the toughest talent acquisition trends we have seen in decades.

This week we're joined by Katrina Collier, who is an Author, Facilitator, Mentor & Speaker, on a mission to end the collaboration chaos that ruins recruitment and candidate experience; exacerbated by hybrid working. Her inclusive workshops help companies fix the real issues preventing successful talent acquisition, and her unique shared-learning Mastermind programme develops the skills HR & recruiters need to partner effectively with the business and candidates. She is also a Mentor, Author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast. We're going to talk all about client partnership, candidate partnership, the candidate first approach and what we need to be doing in 2022 and beyond to make sure we can access the right talent for the jobs we want to fill in the short term, but also for the community we want to build in the long term. As always a fascinating half an hour, we hope you enjoy it.

Katrina Collier is on a mission to end the collaboration chaos that ruins recruitment and candidate experience; exacerbated by hybrid working. Her inclusive workshops help companies fix the real issues preventing successful talent acquisition, and her unique shared-learning Mastermind programme develops the skills HR & recruiters need to partner effectively with the business and candidates. She is also a Mentor, Author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast.  Katrina is an Ambassador for Hope for Justice charity, and you'll find her on LinkedIn and on Instagram & Twitter @KatrinaMCollier. Our second guest is Lydia Charilaou. Lydia is a people experience professional and Agile HR coach.  She has been part of multiple People and Culture teams over a decade. Her passions include empowering inclusion, diversity and equity. She is driven by wellness and positive people experiences in the workplace Our third guest is Aby Reynolds. Aby is Head of Operations & Customer Experience at 5App. Aby has a career of over 20 years in a variety of industries including retail, food, banking & finance, digital learning and technology solutions. Aby's also worked in a range of roles,  sales, business management, customer service and consultancy. Aby can be  connected with on LinkedIn. Hooked on learning and passionate about driving business forward, Aimee-Jayne Young is all about helping people make the most of their careers. With a keen interest in performance consulting, learning technology and employee experience, Aimee brings an enthusiastic yet measured point of view on learning and development and where it needs to go for the future. Aimee has experience working in the field of L&D research, HR strategy, learning technologies, professional services, retail and industry and commerce.  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aimeejayneyoung   ========================================================= Show links Why Men Still Get More Promotions Than Women Mean Girls The Debate On Power Posing Continues: Here's Where We Stand   ========================================================= You can contact Women Talking About Learning through our website, womentalkingaboutlearning.com We're on Twitter @WTAL_Podcast You can buy us a coffee to support Women Talking About Learning via Ko-Fi. Or you can email us via hello@llarn.com

Lior Locher is a Learning Consultant with NIIT. They also run their own coaching business where they work with changemakers and start-ups. Lior is a Fellow of the RSA and a multilingual global citizen, based in the UK. Their books “The DIY Phoenix” and “Values-based” are both on Amazon, their TEDx talk is here. You can find Lior on Twitter and LInkedIn. Katrina Collier is on a mission to end the collaboration chaos that ruins recruitment and candidate experience; exacerbated by hybrid working. Her inclusive workshops help companies fix the real issues preventing successful talent acquisition, and her unique shared-learning Mastermind programme develops the skills HR & recruiters need to partner effectively with the business and candidates. She is also a Mentor, Author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast.  Katrina is an Ambassador for Hope for Justice charity, and you'll find her on LinkedIn and on Instagram & Twitter @KatrinaMCollier. Our third guest is Aby Reynolds. Aby is Head of Operations & Customer Experience at 5App. Aby has a career of over 20 years in a variety of industries including retail, food, banking & finance, digital learning and technology solutions. Aby's also worked in a range of roles,  sales, business management, customer service and consultancy. Aby can be  connected with on LinkedIn. Episode Links: Evolution of workwear: https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20190604-how-womens-workwear-has-evolved Workplace dress codes and sex discrimination: https://coodes.co.uk/blog/workplace-dress-codes/ Teenage boys wear skirts to school: https://www.theguardian.com/education/2017/jun/22/teenage-boys-wear-skirts-to-school-protest-no-shorts-uniform-policy The search for clothes is starting to frustrate my daughter: https://www.sbs.com.au/topics/voices/family/article/2021/04/13/its-time-we-got-rid-gendered-clothing-kids The 11-Step Makeup Routine I Do Every Morning on the Train to Work: https://www.self.com/gallery/makeup-products-on-commute How to avoid discriminatory workwear policies: https://www.hbcw.co.uk/news/how-to-avoid-discriminatory-workwear-policies Example grooming policy: https://www.xperthr.com/policies-and-documents/grooming-policy/5955/ ========================================================= You can contact Women Talking About Learning through our website, womentalkingaboutlearning.com   We're on Twitter @WTAL_Podcast   You can buy us a coffee to support Women Talking About Learning via Ko-Fi. Or you can email us via hello@llarn.com.

As agency recruiters, we are often required to collaborate with multiple stakeholders including hiring managers, HR and Talent Acquisition. This can be incredibly challenging and frustrating - especially when there's a lack of cooperation or a breakdown in communication. To facilitate an efficient and successful recruitment process, we must find a way to engage all the stakeholders. So how could you collaborate effectively with your client's HR, Talent Acquisition and hiring managers? My special guest, Katrina Collier, will answer this question. Katrina Collier is on a mission to end the collaboration chaos existing between HR, recruiters & hiring managers, to better recruitment and the candidate experience. She is the author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast.   Episode Outline and Highlights [1:40] Quick snapshot of Katrina's background. [5:20] Underlying challenges contributing to lack of collaboration between HR, Talent Acquisition & agency recruiters. [9:36] MIndset shift - how to get recruiters to think of themselves as Partners instead of just being ‘servants'.  [13:40] What to expect when establishing partnership with hiring managers. [17:20] The human factor in building trust and attracting talents. [21:00] How to be more empathetic. [27:10] Getting people to respond and improving your response rate.  [42:16] “Get off LinkedIn!” - other channels to utilize when looking for candidates. [49:30] What should be the structure of a good recruiting email? [53:44] Re-engineering your business plans because of the pandemic? Katrina shares her experience. [56:39] Hope for Justice - hear about Katrina's advocacy in supporting this charity. Challenges When Collaborating for Recruiters and Hiring Managers From Katrina's point of view, what are the underlying challenges that can affect collaboration among these stakeholders? Two points were shared: Recruiters need a mindset shift in terms of partnership. HR tends to be in competition with Talent Acquisition. How can the above challenges be neutralized? Hear Katrina's pragmatic advice. Mindset Shift to Partnership and Collaboration Equal and mutually respectful collaboration is the ideal scenario for recruiters and hiring managers. Recruiters need to think of themselves as equal partners in the recruitment process, instead of just focusing on a “customer service” type of mindset. Here is what Katrina said, “Get out of your head and into your heart.” It always goes back to the human factor - we are dealing with humans. Human skills are now more relevant than ever! In this episode, you will hear why. Building and Gaining Trust From Candidates As we are dealing with human beings, we need human skills to connect with candidates. So what's the best way to build and gain trust as recruiters? Katrina mentioned important factors such as: Empathy and compassion Being fearless  Providing certainty and clarity Patience Improving Your Response Rate When Contacting Candidates  In line with the above, patience is indeed needed when we seem to be getting minimal response from potential clients and candidates. How do we get people to respond? Katrina emphasized the importance of considering your own profile and brand. Do you look like someone who is worth connecting with and speaking to, someone who could add value and provide expert insight? She also mentioned that although LinkedIn is the mainstream platform when searching for candidates, you should leave LinkedIn. I am sure it was an overemphasis, but to Katrina's point, there are other platforms we can consider when engaging with talents. On top of that, she also gave pointers on how to rethink your approach in engaging your candidates. Hope for Justice Katrina also shared a charity organization that she fully supports, Hope for Justice. She shared how this non-profit organization impacted her life and how it impacts others. If you wish to know more about Hope for Justice, please visit their website in the links below. Our Sponsors This podcast is proudly sponsored by i-intro®.  i-intro® is an end-to-end retained recruitment platform. Our technology and methodology allows recruiters to differentiate themselves from the competition, win more retained business, bigger fees and increase their billings. Be sure to mention Mark Whitby or The Resilient Recruiter for a 25% discount. Book your free, no obligation consultation here: www.recruitmentcoach.com/retained  Katrina Collier Bio and Contact Info Katrina Collier is the owner of Katrina Collier Limited . She is the author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter, a well-loved global keynote speaker, and host of The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) podcast.  Enticed by a newspaper advert in 2003, she started her career in recruitment. She spent 5.5 years in an agency and then 18 months in-house. She started teaching social recruiting and sourcing. Tweeting, blogging and, later, The #SocialRecruiting Show led to unexpected notoriety. This opened up opportunities to work with companies and recruiters all around the world, and even to deliver talks on 5 continents.  She is also an Ambassador for Hope for Justice charity, and you'll find her on LinkedIn and on Instagram & Twitter @KatrinaMCollier. Katrina Collier Limited website link Katrina on LinkedIn Katrina on Instagram Katrina on Twitter @KatrinaMCollier  People and Resources Mentioned Hope for Justice website link Playing Big by Tara Mohr Wayne Daley on LinkedIn Mark Lundgren on LinkedIn How to Get a Meeting with Anyone by Stu Heinecke Connect with Mark Whitby Get your FREE 30-minute strategy call Mark on LinkedIn Mark on Twitter: @MarkWhitby Mark on Facebook Mark on Instagram: @RecruitmentCoach Subscribe to The Resilient Recruiter

What are the skills that a talent acquisition professional should have? What are the facts about hiring which most companies are unaware of?To find answers to these questions, we interacted with Katrina Collier, facilitator in Recruitment & Candidate Experience at the Searchologist.The author of “The Robot-Proof Recruiter”, a well-loved global keynote speaker, and the host of “The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited)” podcast. Katrina talks about her mission to energise the human connection between HR, recruiters & hiring managers to improve the recruitment process and candidate experience. EPISODE HIGHLIGHTS:Tell us something that most Hiring Managers don't know:Katrina explains that most hiring managers do not consider CV hunting as a worthy task. They think recruiting managers simply have to advertise. In reality, recruiting is quite a complicated task.Moreover, the biggest change occurred with the explosion of the internet. All the papers started appearing online and companies started getting direct access. However, these hiring managers don't know that they are being looked up as well. Thus they need to be more aware regarding what they write. Their posts need to be empathetic.Managing relationships between Hiring Managers, Talent Acquisition professionals, and HR:According to Katrina, a few communication issues are prevailing between the Talent Acquisition professionals, Human Resources, and Hiring Managers. It arises problems of politics and misunderstandings between them. However, it is the responsibility of all three to ensure good relations with each other. There is always a debate regarding where talent acquisition should be in an organization.Katrina answers that it should be outside Human Resources, plugging in the Hiring, Marketing, or the Sales department, and being proactive rather than reactive.With the onset of the internet, it has become mandatory for them to be truthful online. All three departments identify the problems and find the solutions to them. Most importantly, they need to understand that it is the employees that make a company succeed. Finance is a secondary factor here.Skills one should have to partner with the hiring candidates:The HR or Talent Acquisition professional needs to know what the Hiring managers want. The candidates need to learn how to trust, be curious, and be empathetic. If they don't create this clarity and certainty for the candidate, they can't build a good relationship with them.Katrina is a big supporter of feedback and discards the idea of leaving interview candidates confused without feedback. They should show compassion towards the candidate.Factors comprising candidate experience:Katrina again highlights the importance of feedback here. The candidates are extremely energetic while applying for different roles. The recruiters can simply match that level of excitement by sending them tips of job search, behind the scenes, adding value, and letting people know where they are. The candidates might be telling their experiences to others. Bad reviews can lead to a loss in the business. She adds that Human Resources, Hiring Managers, and Talent Acquisition professionals should partner together and have open conversations. Basic courtesy such as keeping the camera on can make the candidate feel relaxed.Follow her on LinkedIn & Twitter Produced by: Priya BhattPodcast host: Abhash Kumar

Bennett Sung is one of my favourite HR tech marketers, who also happens to be a hiring manager. I have been lucky to know Bennett for around 8 years so you will also find him on page 71 of my book, The Robot-Proof Recruiter.  Through many laughs, you'll hear us talk about: fax machines and many other things Gen Z may not understand

Bennett Sung is one of my favourite HR tech marketers, who also happens to be a hiring manager. I have been lucky to know Bennett for around 8 years so you will also find him on page 71 of my book, The Robot-Proof Recruiter.  Through many laughs, you'll hear us talk about: fax machines and many other things Gen Z may not understand

Bennett Sung is one of my favourite HR tech marketers, who also happens to be a hiring manager. I have been lucky to know Bennett for around 8 years so you will also find him on page 71 of my book, The Robot-Proof Recruiter.  Through many laughs, you'll hear us talk about: fax machines and many other things Gen Z may not understand

Podcast: How to Be a Robot-Proof Recruiter by Indeed

Why do we struggle so much to be ourselves? 'Being human' is a concept us marketers have been pushing for a while now but we still don't seem to have nailed it yet. In this episode, we are joined by Katrina Collier who is a published author of The Robot-Proof Recruiter which talks about how tech really isn't going to take over our world. If you're trying to make your marketing approach and tactics more relatable as well as attempting your recruiters to take a similar approach then this is a fun and insightful listen. Utilising purpose, empathy and other 'human' levers in your marketing makes commercial sense. And it's the right thing to do. Thanks again Paiger for your ever-continued support to bring this podcast to the masses.

Max: Welcome back to the Recruitment Hackers Podcast. I'm your host Max Armbruster and today I am delighted to welcome Katrina Collier. Katrina is the author of the Robot-Proof recruiter, which I think, it could be retitled-how to protect yourself against the chatbots or how to protect yourself against Talkpush, like the company I started. But that's just me being paranoid, perhaps. Katrina, welcome to the show.Katrina: Thanks Max. I think that's the best introduction I've ever had. Please protect yourself from my business. That's not technically what's written in there. You know that. You've read half of it, maybe you've not gotten to your bit.Max: So I read this book and it's a wonderful reminder to everybody that if you are working in recruitment, you're working in an extremely, I'm not gonna say tactile but extremely high touch human environments, which, if you list all the jobs in the world recruiter should be the last one to go almost, you know. The last one to be fully automated of the jobs that we operate today, like who wants to be hired by robots?  I mean I don't know anybody who would put their hands up. I've seen a couple of case studies here and there, but actually I don't think employers even want to showcase that, they're not that proud. Katrina:  I know we talked about this before we came on. It's just like this book is very much aimed at people who are recruiting people who are in demand. So my whole background is IT recruitment. All of the clients I've ever had have been in IT or health in general it's been a few other things obviously, it's always those people who are to recruit. However, there are examples for high volume there and one of those is Yodel who is a courier company in the UK and all they recruit is drivers. Therefore, actually they can automate it. There is a chatbot on their site that pops up and goes through the process of can you carry a 35 kilo box? no you can't, tell WordPress yes you can proceed through, and they can actually get someone through the application, because they realized their recruiters were on line nine to five and applicants were coming in at 11 o'clock at night. So in that respect when it's the same role, over and over and over and all you really need to know is that they've got to claim a driver's license no criminal record, and you know, they're gonna turn up. Actually you can, but really for the rest of us. Oh my gosh, put a human in please. Max: There is a recruiter and there is recruiters.Katrina: Really and love it. Yeah, and actually if anyone's been following me on LinkedIn lately, I've started the college recruiter revolution which is because the clubhouse has appeared. It's just a conversation in the clubhouse. Yes, it's iPhone snobbery if you can't get on there. But the idea being that like please if you don't love this job that we do please leave the industry, because it's so important we play with people's lives. And I just think so often that's forgotten. Just like you said how we can automate when we play with someone's life which you know I take Max and I put him in the wrong job. He fails. Three months later is out the door. We're in the middle of a pandemic. What happens actually serious case of that someone last night we were on the kind recruiter revolution as I'm calling it was talking about the fact that actually he was hired, and then the person that hired him basically had a meltdown, and said I can't do this job I can't cope I can't bring on someone new right now I have to let you go. And he turned down two other jobs to take this job, has a pregnant wife at home and is now in the middle of a pandemic trying to get another job. And you're like, we can't do that stuff we,playing with people's lives. So that's the book was off the back of that please stop saying tech can do what we do, it cannot.Max: Well taking your example. I would say this person was put in the wrong job because we didn't do all the checks and balances and the psychological assessment and if we had done that if we've done the psychological profiling we could have identified a risk and mapped it against a bell curve and said, spotted something that the individual recruiter might have missed. You can be more thorough when you have an endless battery of tests available to you and you could just plug as many as you'd like.Katrina: Yeah. Or it could be that actually this is an experience, none of us have ever been through before, so no amount of testing would have said that particular team leader was going to meltdown when having to homeschool having to work remotely having to manage your team remotely having to, like you were saying, you're an extrovert you can't wait to get out. I'm an introvert. I'm very loud and by the way if anyone wants to argue the case with me, those that are listening that know me. No, she's not. No, I really am. But I'm really happy in these four walls. I'm missing traveling, but I'm not missing it that much that I could, I could do this for another year or two, but other people are melting down because they're missing. If they've got a close family bond they're missing that so, I don't know I agree, it could have helped. But I also think. Yeah, it's a really interesting example obviously but.Max: I can continue on this example and to say, well, perhaps this person was hired because the recruiter at hand only had five or six profiles to choose from. And because you can only invest so much time in sourcing. But, if you really ramped up to your sourcing and you use. Let's say social media and increase the pool of candidates tenfold or a hundredfold, then you could have eliminated a much higher portion of ice because well.Katrina: Oh sorry, this wasn't about the person that was hired. It was the team leader that melted down and let the person they hired go. So they hired them and let them go in three days. Max: Oh!Katrina: But yeah, absolutely. I think I agree that we need to have a bigger pool of people that we recruit from, and we need to get the hell off LinkedIn. Like, everybody is on LinkedIn going after the same pool of people. Now, most regular people not recruitment, not sales not entrepreneurs not marketers. They're not on LinkedIn every day, like a message one of your mates on there who works outside the industry. Will they get a reply no but if you send them one somewhere else like messenger or WhatsApp, boom they reply. It's like, get off, go. I agree, get off and find for your high volume recruiters obviously you're like, oh my god, no more applications no. But for those that are seeking people who are in demand, please go. You know, go and ask the people in your business if you're in house, go and ask for candidates if you're an agency where are you, you know what social networks do you use. Max: One thing that really got under my skin with the whole AI wave was there was 2017-2018, when you had all of those movies that came out, like Her, and Ex-machina, and a few others like the western TV show in virtual reality. Anyway, I ate all that stuff up. I really loved it, as entertainment but in a span of just a few years. It went from people asking me, oh you're creating a robot that interviews people? What a stupid idea? like nobody will ever do that to like in literally two years people, the question went from that to. Oh that's cool, can you robot tell if the candidate is lying, can your robots, you know, the expectation just inflated all of a sudden there was a complete change of expectation, and perhaps, your book was born out of a backlash right as a reaction to the inflation around expectations. Katrina: Yeah. I was actually asked by Kogan Page who's the publisher, Katrina, would you like to write a book. First, if that doesn't happen so that literally blew my mind, and still blows my mind and sometimes I literally look at the book and god I can't believe I wrote this book. And then it was like, Oh my god, yes, we're going to write about this. Okay. Asa Bien. Right. Humans recruit humans; it's as simple as a requirement that's the case. And what we do is so important because we woo, and we use empathy and compassion and kindness and curiosity and all of that stuff to pull you through the process right. I don't believe technology can replace that. However, I wanted to go. Okay, so in this part of the process. This technology here, that puts the human first because it's supporting you, but the technology is supporting you. And it's freeing up your time to deliver a better human experience. And all the way through the book that's what I'm talking about. So in this particular part of the process I tried this, which would do this, which will help you have more time, again, to deliver a better human experience. And a few people that were surprised when they've read it and they go you talk about tech so much. Yeah, because it can help you. I'm not saying not to use it, I'm the biggest user of technology. I've been using it like I've been working at home for 11 years. So I've been using so much technology to deliver my business for so long, so of course I'm an avid user like everybody, but use the right technology. And on that it's like getting technology where a recruiter had input in creating it or created it, because they've done our job they understand what we do so they understand where we need support to save time and effort and frustration to deliver a better human experience and that's experience for the hiring manager who I'd like to call partner, because I'd like them to partner with us. Now the conversation, the recruiter, and the candidate is everybody so important.Max: And enabling the recruiter to design experiences. I think that's the new role of technology. And so, you know, you can call it robots and not robots because I think robots is kind of a dangerous word because immediately people think Terminator. But think just a robot as in, you know, press button command begins, and then boolean search send a message, you still got a human at the wheel and increasingly technology companies that are doing well now are the ones where the human creates the loop, there's a human in the loop there's an opportunity to send personalized message and so, I don't, I actually specifically picked this area to work in because I thought we've got a ways to go we've got many years before. Yes, industry will be completely poof, disappeared. I don't think it'll ever happen.Katrina: I don't think it'll disappear. But I think that then the recruiter can become more of a talent partner, become more of a, working more to understand what the business is proactively finding out what's the future of that business within your agency or in house, and really almost doing workforce planning, if you will, and pipeline building and all that kind of stuff. But the one thing that nobody at all, ever talks about when they're like AI can do sourcing for you AI can do your messaging all this kind of stuff. Nobody ever talks about a human's inability to write a CV or a LinkedIn profile. During this pandemic thousands of recruiters have lost their job and whenever I've had the opportunity to look at one of their profiles and provide some feedback which some have not wanted but they've got it anyway. Max: Thank you.Katrina: It means you have no achievements on your profile, you don't use the word recruiter you're not going to come up with a search.You spend your day looking at CVS and you have these really bad profiles. So for recruiters and sources and talent acquisition and whatever you want to call us cannot write their own profiles, or CVs, how are we expecting normal, regular people to do that. I shouldn't call them normal, regular people sit outside the industry.Max: You can call them normal.Katrina: It is a massive massive problem. What are we actually what data, are we feeding into these AI tools. And this has always been my issue with the sourcing buttons, it's like, what are you sourcing from because people can't write their profiles. Developers are the worst at writing. Max: So, yeah, there's been a shift away from, the resume has had a bad name for the last couple of decades where people say do away with a resume and I tend to agree with that because I find that if somebody gives me a resume, I'll look at it for exactly three seconds to see if the person stays in the job for more than six months, you know. But then, the first thing I want to do is hear what they have to say. And anyway, I'm just.Katrina: Your high volume recruiters are squirmed and gone. Yeah, no, I don't want to hear what I have to say I've got to get through 100 CVs every time, every hour. Max: My high volume recruiters actually get to hear the candidates. If they want to, because we know we can collect with our robots voice and video, but I feel.Katrina: Okay so I get like what you mean. So then, the issue is uptake. So the issue is, who's comfortable doing that. So you and I before we came on air, you went, I don't feel like I need to prep you will be fine and like no you don't because I have been talking on video for years, as someone of my generation so I've been talking about for years it's quite something. So it's like I'm really comfortable. I'd happily sit here and just talk to this screen and come across as normal. As most people like the second you put a voice video, they go eh ah. First of all generations of all age groups and that's the issue. So, I agree it would be fabulous, but then you've also got to get around the recruiter resistance, and then the old school hiring manager that I just want the CV, don't make me listen to something. You got somewhere to do, like I said, we're not going anywhere. We've got to overcome all these different resistances. I'm not saying it's not valuable. It's just whether you can get people to use it. Does that make sense? This podcast has now been deleted for insulting the host. Max: No no no, it doesn't make sense from the standpoint of everybody's sending videos, spending time on Snapchat, spending time on TikTok, you know, what is the percentage of the population that does not record themselves on videos on a regular basis?Katrina: Massive. What I do if you ask me.Max: Here to great 20 to 30 year olds. Katrina: Okay, so my nephew's actually asked my brother how old they are, isn't it embarrassing. They're 28 25, and they absolutely do not. They are there but they're not there. Because I wrote Happy Birthday to my oldest nephew in brackets so it I don't think you actually see this, and she said oh no I do, I just look like I never, and he said I see all your Instagram posts that he never does a video of himself, or video, oh I'm at a rock concert or I'm at a sporting event. Max: Yeah, so granted, it's good to give them the options and then we do you know we tell them to video if you can if not something else is fine. Katrina: And I think that's it, use it as part of the toolkit that I'm all for it. And if I was a job seeker, job seekers listening to this absolutely stand up. I mean I just follow up, send a video follow up, all that sort of stuff. Absolutely agree with you. Max: What do you think about this technology that is coming from the higher views of the world which gave sentiment analysis on facial analysis on video? They've kind of toned it down in recent years because of some bad PR.Katrina: I'll go with backlash about the bias in the algorithm. Max: Something about the AI doesn't work the same on different skin tones, which.Katrina: Oh gosh!Max: Yeah so, I always thought that was, I mean I think I'm on your side on that one, that it was absolutely inflated, and that there's no value to it. But, and to your point, there were some early studies saying that some people are uncomfortable in front of the video not trained and they don't perform as well as they would face to face, and I've even met somebody who from the retail world in France, who does a lot of thousands of hires who told me.Katrina: Yeah.Max: I know my recruiters are biased, I know that they're racist at some degree. Yeah. And, you know, as we all are. We all have different levels of racism in us. But when they meet someone face to face for 30 minutes. Maybe that'll kind of go away, you know like, the in person experience will make you realize that it doesn't matter, you know, because now you're listening you're looking in their eyes, and it's about content and not about what you see on paper, and in a way it's easier to express your biases in a hidden room where you're just flipping through resumes but in person it's harder. Katrina: Yeah. Unfortunately, we are just naturally biased and everything that happens in our world. So if I go to gender bias. I was, I just recently did a piece of facilitation that where I work with HR talent acquisition and hiring managers to get to the facilitation discovers where all the blocks are and actually create some solutions, it's all design thinking around like what's going wrong with the recruitment, and they had a big gender issue,technology company. And interestingly, I won't tell you what like French hiring managers were thinking about female applicants. But being that you're from France, I'm sure you know what they'd be up against. But I was talking to people about generational stuff. So my mother was born in 1938, and in 1959, when she got engaged to her first husband, engaged. She had to leave the bank. She wasn't even married, and she wasn't pregnant. Max: That's crazy. Katrina: She was engaged. So you think about my eldest brother and sister who are boomers, who are looking at this kind of role model of, well you know mum does the cooking and the cleaning and the, you know, well did your mum worked really hard, but that was the role, and then there's the husband's role and mum gets paid less for the same job as now because that's just how it is. And we've sort of seen that. So even just to the gender bias and like every other bias that exists in our upbringing. This is what we've seen. So for us to sit up and go why should I that's not right, and some of it's subliminal sometimes it's women doing it to other women as well like when the market is put out something that's very putting people in boxes and we just had a big backlash here that the government put out a, stay home, keep your distance thing for COVID, which was like a nice something from the 1950s that literally had man sitting on the sofa women doing household chores and homeschooling. Yeah, oh yeah social media kicked off thank god social media in that respect, that it's like, so if you just think that, here we are, we're trying to get people in an interview to just change everything they've witnessed and heard as they've grown up and it's passed on. So, my parents would pass it on to my brother and sister and they've passed it on to their kids. Not intentionally it's just a thing to go okay right now you need to. This is on behavior and achievements, just ignore all of it's just hard, we're humans, we're flawed. But until then we can create algorithms that are not flawed which was the big problem with the hireview video tool. I'm sure there was a huge thing in the US about that, you're welcome to correct me if I'm wrong, but the algorithms can be biased because they were created by humans. It's like you have stuff going on. Max: Yeah I think that, trying to address missed biases is a good intention. And I think that you know from a technology perspective, I want to minimize my liability, so I'm like, it's dumb it's not my decision. It's your decision. By the way, did you know that you're 20% more racist than your neighbor. If I could just inform the recruiter. Katrina: Exactly.Max: Yeah, just around that stats like that and then let them self adjust, educate them. Katrina: That's where the tools, the brilliant. That's where it's great. That's where you start going okay right we need to do something about this, what can we do and then there are options out there for people who are far more experts in bias than I am. I'm an expert in discovering where the problems are in your recruitment process. I'm not the expert in fixing it I'd rather you put in the experts to then fix. But it's that you know you're doing the same thing you're going Hey, are you aware in comparison to. And I think that's really important, and we have so far to go because the 1950s was not that long ago. If you think about, like, a lot of the racism and the gender biases all stems from around that time, it's not that long ago. Max: And there are some of these biases that could be also by choice, you know, a group or company can decide I want a particular profile. And if we're not talking about profiles that are where adverse it affects their ability to to stay within the law. And of course, you're perfectly allowed to hire only beautiful people or only massive jerks. I mean there are no laws. Yeah, to regulate that.Katrina: Yeah. You also get the, I call it the eye roll. So, you know, I run events here as well, sorry, ideas, when there wasn't any pandemic. I ran events here in London, because I can't see my screen when we're on a podcast. I've got my London view going on zoom. And I would work really, really hard to make sure that it was gender balanced. It was in house to consultant balance. It was like I've got everything, disability, ethnicity, everything I could possibly think of. I was putting a lineup that reflected the audience, that was always my aim and in some cities that was easier than in London, are harder than in London. But, you kind of saw myself and a few other event organizers have taken to calling out other recruitment event audience organizers. If they just have what we call the pale, like a pale male lineup, a metal, if you will, and they usually a boomer aged or male or white, or middle aged men. Max: Of my age?Katrina: You're not that old. Nice try mate. It's kind of a compliment, I think. And what happens is you will get the white boomer male he'll go, oh well then you're just being discriminatory against us you know we've got a right to be here it's like we've been heard for a really really really long time, and we're not saying you're not going to be heard. You might just have to wait a turn or two, but you get that exact resistance and that exact comment every time. And it's just like No. Does it really hurt if you've got a male and a female and you can wait one term and speak the next one. every time. So we've got work to do. I think it's really important that we look and go. Gosh, I really am just recruiting people like me. When was the last time I recruited a load of men for example I probably would be more inclined to recruit women. I may have a bias that way. Thank goodness I'm not recruiting at the moment. I have to check. Max: It's very, very dangerous to start talking about our personal biases on camera. I'd rather not. Katrina: I do when I react to people and I think it's because, and I feel very open about this I have, I'm a survivor of child abuse, I have done a hell of a lot of therapy and life coaching and I bring that into the mastermind that I've created off the back of the book as well. It's amazing. It all comes in. So I've learned to like to listen to that voice when I, and I react to somebody. And I do go, that's really interesting now am I reacting to their behavior or am I reacting to what they look like. And it's like, you have to really think about it, and I think most of us are just going through our day was far too busy to go. Oh, what are you thinking about Max, that's a bit strange. You know.Max: Oh no, we don't have time for that.Katrina: Yeah we don't have time for that we're too busy.Max: How often have you read, and maybe even said yourself, and all you have to follow your instinct. Yeah, it would be extremely presumptuous of us to think that, you know, we should just switch off all instincts. It's like what you're saying I mean, when you're saying the robot proof recruiter. Yeah, if we decide to eliminate all biases what is left of us. There's almost nothing.Katrina: Yeah, absolutely. Because at the end of the day where we are actually going from a hundred applications to one person that we actually have to. I know it's a balancing act. But I did talk about when I got to the interviewing chapter and I know someone called me out for this because I never said I was gonna talk about that, like you really didn't go into like what questions we should ask in an interview I'm like, No, because I'm a really bad interviewer. I will literally go with intuition. I like Max. He is lovely, can we hire him, that is. And so when I got to that chapter I focused purely on the technology side and how it could or couldn't help. And I was like, I didn't want to go into this is how you conduct an interview, but it was more about like you've done the interview, how to record the feedback or how to know how to use the tools to save your time.Max: You're not selling this book well at all right. It has a ton of very practical tips on how to not just protect your career and future profit but also. Every step of the journey from promoting yourself, talking to the hiring manager, preparing your sourcing effort, everything. And you can tell, you know, decades of experience, poured into that. Katrina: Yeah, yeah, yeah I mean I'm not joking about I'm a bad interview, but they. What I realized when I started writing this book was how different it was from when I started in recruiting, because when I started in recruiting the internet hadn't gotten the way technology hadn't gotten the way it was. I Max is in my database. I call Max and have a conversation with you about the role and you go, yes or no, no, it was easier. I didn't send you a message you look at me and God I want to talk to you. You didn't get inundated with all of the jobs that you could say it was like, the world has really changed. But what really got to me was when I realized, chapter five, that is all about the intake strategy session, that is the most crucial thing. If you don't get the right information from your hiring managers. If you don't get them to partner with you. If you don't shift your attitude so they do partner with you. All of the recruitment becomes really really challenging. And I think any recruiters who are working off a job description that they just got thrown via HR, that is three or four years old. They should be going to forget it, unless you're going to give me an hour upfront with the hiring manager, so I can partner with them properly to fill this role. Then don't do it, and that was that to me the whole crux if you get that wrong, then everything goes wrong after that, the interviewing, the pre boarding, the onboarding, the employee experience, the reputation of the company, and then it comes around in a cycle of bad reputation.Max: Same for when you're building software if you're doing a project it's all about requirement capture. I've got a question I ask to every one of my guests so recently because it's emotional, and it's back to a time when you made a, terrible mistake, hiring mistake and identify the room, go back to those days, think about that person visualize that person, and share with us how you got there and how can our audience avoid making the same mistake you made at the time. Are you crying?Katrina: No. I just literally can't think of having made a bad hire.Max: Oh wow!Katrina: I can tell you a different experience, which was not so I can remember the time I didn't give somebody feedback from an interview there was one person I've never given feedback to from an interview and I still feel bad about it. That one person. No, because it was never my, I was not the person making the hiring decision. I was interviewing them and shortlisting them, handing them to a hiring manager who made that decision. So, I've never had a chain. However, I worked at this IT consultancy which is really early on, and the search allergist just says in house I don't really talk about it because it's so toxic in the end. And I brought in people for this. It's quick, do you consultancy so it's really new technology they wanted people who've worked on billions of rows of data, it was, I was bringing people in all over the world. And they decided without any input from me to hire a sales director, and the sales director couldn't sell. And I watched the bench starting to fill up with these IT consultants and I watched the projects not being renewed and the COO was the narcissistic piece of poop. And when I was going. We're going to implode. We are going to implode. He fired me, and he fired the delivery director who was saying the same thing. And sure enough, that's what happens. And it was all because they hired the wrong Sales Director, they hired someone who couldn't sell, and then they didn't manage them properly. And it was absolutely heartbreaking watching the first year it was more than that, that I brought in from all around the world to London to work at this company, and to watching them one by one lose their jobs, was the most heartbreaking thing and then I wasn't even there, I was watching them from afar. So in that respect, I've seen how damaging it is, and how we play with people's lives. And if we get it wrong, my god did we get it wrong but when we get it right. Wow, I know I have somebody it's now I think 17 years since by chance I changed his life, and he will just message me periodically and go dude I'm still so grateful for you, you just put me on this career path and I love it. So we can do either side. So, yes, it is arrogant as you found that of me to say I haven't done that but I haven't because I've only been at the prescreening side.Max: You didn't manage recruiters directly.Katrina: Oh no I have. I think it takes a hell of a lot of self awareness to sit and go, I would be the world's worst manager. I am the world's best, I would not do it. I have no tolerance for it. I have the most incredible virtual assistant who basically self managers or that would be that literally is one person. She is fantastic. And this whole world that she's in Johannesburg. Sorry I think she's in Durban she's in South Africa. This is the world like it is. It is yeah no I could do that kind of robot but what I'm doing isn't like copy and paste stuff. She does all sorts of bizarre stuff for me. But I think it needs self awareness to know that. Max: Thank you, Katrina and I, again, advise everybody who's listening to check out the robot proof recruiter. Katrina: Can I just say one quick thing about it?Max: Yeah. Yes, please. Katrina: Yeah. Max: Where can people get a hold of you? and where can people get a hold of the book?, and I believe this charity is behind. Katrina: That's what I just wanted to make sure I said yes. I have been to Africa and seen firsthand the work of hope for justice charity. They aim to end modern day slavery which impacts 14.3 million people around the world. And I guarantee there are people in slavery in your vicinity wherever you are in the world and it's a massive problem. And I donated the royalties from the robot proof recruiter to that charity and they're really struggling like everybody else's in this pandemic. So, every purchase not only will you get the most incredible book that has contributions from 74 of your peers around the world. You will also get to help end modern day slavery so I cannot recommend that enough. You can get it in all the usual places like Amazon, Kogan page directly, of course, you can get ebooks, you don't have to just get the paperback, personally, I grab both because you want to write one in New Zealand and quick links but I'm biased. And finally oh my gosh Google me, I'm everywhere. I'm very easy to find.Max: I'm Katrina Collier, I'm very easy to find on Twitter and LinkedIn. We'll put the links on the books.Katrina: Yes, please. And if you're in the clubhouse come and join the con recruiter revolution, we have a chit chat might be a bit late for HR actually thinking of it, timewise but we're having fun with it. Max: Awesome. And if you're a Talkpush customer and your favorite chatbot is starting to take too much room in your virtual virtual space. That's the book. That's the book you need to read to to fight back against the robot. I don't think it's a real fight, I think it's good enough for you for joining and looking forward to listening to your upcoming podcast. Katrina: Thank you very much. Thanks Max.

There was never going to be anyone else but Glenn Elliott as the first guest on The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) and why will become very clear to you during the course of this episode. Glenn & I met when I ran the very first DisruptHR London event and he invited me to his offices to discuss how Reward Gateway could support the event. Glenn was totally in support of my decision to use sponsors to raise funds for Hope for Justice charity and RG has supported ever since not only as a sponsor but through the RG Foundation & Catrin Lewis's personal contribution. When you walk the floors of Reward Gateway you become awestruck by not only the kindness of their (now former) leader but how lovely all the staff are. It's something you want to bottle and take into every company! Besides the opportunity to ask Glenn - a CEO!! - why he read The Robot-Proof Recruiter twice, we also talked about how he got so good at hiring great people both at RG and now at Tenzing. Context & vulnerability... and a whole load more!  Grab a pen & paper. Huge

There was never going to be anyone else but Glenn Elliott as the first guest on The Hiring Partner Perspective (Unedited) and why will become very clear to you during the course of this episode. Glenn & I met when I ran the very first DisruptHR London event and he invited me to his offices to discuss how Reward Gateway could support the event. Glenn was totally in support of my decision to use sponsors to raise funds for Hope for Justice charity and RG has supported ever since not only as a sponsor but through the RG Foundation & Catrin Lewis's personal contribution. When you walk the floors of Reward Gateway you become awestruck by not only the kindness of their (now former) leader but how lovely all the staff are. It's something you want to bottle and take into every company! Besides the opportunity to ask Glenn - a CEO!! - why he read The Robot-Proof Recruiter twice, we also talked about how he got so good at hiring great people both at RG and now at Tenzing. Context & vulnerability... and a whole load more!  Grab a pen & paper. Huge

Author Katrina Collier joins Serge and Shelley to discuss her book Robot Proof Recruiter and all things recruitment.

Katrina Collier, a professional recruiter and author of "The Robot-Proof Recruiter," thinks employers can effectively battle the bots of automation and maintain job security as we drive into the 21st Century. Oh, really? Brought to you by the best in "ROBOTS"... Sovren, software so human you'll want to take it to dinner.

In this week's special HRD Summit UK edition of the HRD Live Podcast, Katrina Collier, The Searchologist and author of 'The Robot-Proof Recruiter', Dina Alvarez, Head of Talent and Culture at Everis UK, Jo Davis, Group HR Director and Tara Benton, Director of Talent and Development, Mitie, got together to discuss the future of talent acquisition, onboarding, employer brand, the candidate journey and more. The post Talent 2020: Katrina Collier, Dina Alvarez, Jo Davis and Tara Benton appeared first on HRD.