World of Wisdom

This time Amit Paul speaks into some insights that he has found during spring. He speak of retiring survival in order to be able to fully live. Amit speaks of the sensous and that the posture of attuning to the moment is a more constructive attitude. One that sparks agency and action. He explore the crisis of meaning and propose that it's a crisis of intimacy and Amit Paul explore the distinction between surrender and submission. All of this is an invitation to a new posture towards transformative work one in which attention is your instrument, submission is your stance and the only thing that may look like a goal is becoming intimate with reality. Links: Waves Gathering, website, innrwrks.

Gustaf Tadaa is a thinker, speaker, artist and entrepreneur. His and his wife Malins last exhibition Andetag (Instagram, website) is exhibiting in Stockholm spring/summer 2025. This is a beautiful conversation around how everything is made up, the traps of language, why we should think about teaching kids semantics. We also talk about how trauma therapy is a creative activity not a discovery. How important stories are to shape the world we live in and we end up talking about taxes why that would be a way to really shit the current state of the world. This conversation is wide ranging, concrete, provoking and really useful. Enjoy!

This is a beautiful conversation with Erik Fernholm (linkedIn) co-founder of 29k as well as the IDGs. We speak of emotions, happiness, what it takes to compost, why solutions cannot be perfect. We speak of listening and self-compassion. Why turning towards that which we reject can sometimes be the thing we need to do, even though it's hard. What it is and takes to start ones journey of working with life. Why we are still worthy of love, no matter what. This is a really beautiful one. Both an opening and a scaffold. Enjoy!

Sam Jockel (LinkedIn) came on the show. The founder of ParentTV and the producer of SEEN the film. Our conversation touched in on what parenting may be, both for yourself and for your kids. How does one become a parent? We speak of trauma as something that didn't happen rather than what happened and we speak of what it takes to recover warmth. How seeing your kids, being with them is what parenting is about rather than what you do. This is a wonderfully deep, personal and concrete conversation. It comes with a strong recommendation to actually see the film. It'll be worth it.

Neil Smyth (LinkedIn) founder of Alkemio and I spoke about collective action problems, agency and ownership. Neil is a veteran in the steward ownership space and is also active building the platform Alkemio towards collective action . We speak of the simple but profound transformations that hold the possibility to upend the world we live in. Neil speaks of the start up as a tool for effecting change, we speak of agency as a coordination problem, the principles for how to coordinate and what happens when we center around a problem, not an organisation. Here's the link to Alkemios legal structure. Enjoy!

Adam Widawski (LinkedIn) is an educator and philosopher. Currently working for the think-tank Mindshield. We speak of the immense potential of our times. Why learning is an orientation to life that's served us well. We speak of technology and it's incredible pull as well as the importance of getting inspired by perspectives from the margins. We speak of the silent violence, the obfuscation and fragmentation as well as the possibility our connectivity holds. How do we deal with the demonic pull of technology? How can we combine passionate rebellion with a capacity for finding center and an ableness to direct our attention and retain some agency?

Ola Jönsson (LinkedIn) founder of Coest among other things came by the podcast. We spoke of profit and company growth as a part of but not the goal of companies. We spoke of identities and how they are important and how they interact. What it takes to start from scarcity - why are people that haven't prove extractive capacity as trustworthy in our society? What are Coests investment principles? Why are so many people driven by money and much more. This is a conversation on how to transform business into what we need it to be in our times. Enjoy!

Michael Haupt (⁠LinkedIn⁠) recovering corporate technician, regenerative practitioner and father and I had a wonderful conversation. We spoke about why systems change requires a fundamentally different approach than the one most of us currently take. We also touched on the framework he is developing of 9 mental models for navigating the times we are in. We also spoke of collapse and why our times both are and are not unique. We spoke of why much of what's happening now is expected. Why practice is so important and why shifting our behaviour is at the core. This is a rich and tangible conversation that invites useful perspectives. Here are some of the resources Michael mention: ⁠Mental Model⁠s, ⁠Collapsology⁠, ⁠Evolution of Consciousness⁠. Enjoy!

Audrey Fillion⁠ (⁠EP224⁠), ⁠Ria Baeck⁠ (⁠EP155⁠), ⁠Adrian Wagner⁠ gathered for the second part of the first ever World of Wisdom roundtable. We spoke of evaluation, scaling, micro-moments of empathy and scaling. Beyond scaling up we also need to scale deep and wide. And how we can do that through technology. This deep conversation also touches upon the path dependency of our tools, what it takes to generate healthy soil and most of all what happens when "we take god a bit more seriously than ourselves. Enjoy!

Audrey Fillion (EP224), Ria Baeck (EP155), Adrian Wagner gathered for the first ever World of Wisdom roundtable. This time we spoke about regenerative gatherings. This conversation is a rich and deep exploration with people that probably have a century of experience of gatherings between them. We speak of attention, action, what can be done and what is 'right action'. We speak of the substrate of gatherings, the importance of pioneers and how relationships are like soil that we can then plant seeds in. There is so much more. Take a listen!

Ruben Daniels (Founder of Allelo) and I had a wonderful conversation about systems transformation, digital sovereignty and what it takes to begin living into a stable state of interbeing. Ruben is a successful IT entrepreneur that has since shifted his focus towards sovereignty- food, economic and digital. We speak especially about the economic and digital aspects of this sovereignty. Ruben is also a co-creator of the Masterminding Eden that Camara Cassin recently spoke of on the podcast. Ruben is a fellow ecosystems weaver and systems thinker and this is a wonderful conversation! Enjoy!

Camara Cassin (LinkedIn) mother of 4, Environmental Science Technologist and transformation powerhouse as well as source and Founder of Masterminding Eden. We speak of the technologies that are already there, the seeds of what may come next. The importance of social as well as other technologies to break the silos. Why it's important to build a concrete pilot in a particular place and then replicate that. We also speak of the Overton window, the conditions for transformation and why it's important to both make a difference and to come together. Check out the link to Masterminding Eden event above. Enjoy

Kasper Bjorkskov (LinkedIn) activist, researcher, consultant, father, human has worked on shifting systems tangibly in Denmark. We speak of what it takes, how even activist tactics can create resilient change and why the edges are important in shifting the normal. We speak of architects and caring for the living, we speak of why biodiversity is a better single metric than carbon dioxide and why that holds the potential for bottom up change. This is a wonderfully concrete conversation based in action. Enjoy! (Visit the Substack for more shownotes)

Turiya Hanover (LinkedIn) one of the founders of Path of Love. We speak of the transformation that is possible when we become honest with ourselves and its potential for the world we live in. What does it take to find out what's between yourself and love? What if your deepest pain explored will bring you to your deepest humbleness? What if this notion of equality is misconstrued - what if, instead, we're all invited to come home to the life we're meant to lead? A life where some happen to be big and some not. This is a wonderful, concrete, conversation about what it takes to come home. For more about path of love: https://pathretreats.com

Hanna Moisander (⁠LinkedIn⁠), co-founder of ⁠Deb⁠ is on a mission to democratise boards and radically shift their demographic. As we move through some of the basics of board work there are some radical calls to action that emerge. The notion that the board is one of the few points in the corporate world where there is direct personal responsibility. Deb is pioneering the perspective that we need to radically transform the demographics of boards if we want different outcomes. Also dipping into some of their experience on what happens to company performance as boards are transformed, both in terms of financial and sustainability performance. This is a very practical conversation, an invitation to taking your responsibility right now.

Rory Tews (⁠LinkedIn⁠) visited the podcast and we spoke of his work in societal transformation. Rory's been working in many domains of transformation and transition. From financial markets to building markets and institutions. This is a fundamental rethink and reframe of the challenges and shifts we stand before Rory is a first principle thinker that does not waver in the face of collapse. His notions are radical yet lives in the domain of the possible. One of the most interesting concepts is that of community level resilience. I dare you to listen and not be provoked. I dare you listen and not be inspired. Enjoy!

Donnie Maclurcan (LinkedIn) the Director of Strategy at the Post Growth Institute visited the podcast this week. We have an in-depth conversation about what the core of the matter with capitalism in. We speak bout money, post-growth economics, the needed shift towards circularity. Why he can definitively say that we already know after having run more than 10.000 experiments over the past decade or so. This conversation is such an important primer for getting into these topics and it's not intellectual and difficult it's actually grounded, embodied and compassionate. For more info: How on Earth. Enjoy! For extended shownotes (Substack)

In this episode Amit takes a moment to reflection what is happening. A short list of deep topics. He speaks of integration - being an integrated human being that through his or her complexity was born to live into this humanity. He speaks of the collapse, how it is already here but also that which is beyond. That is already here. There is an innovation and provocation to live sensful rather than meaningful life. Is it so that meaning is a consequence of meaning? Amit speaks of Relationality, self determination and of course Ada - you already got it! Thanks for coming along in 2024. Looking forward to what 2025 has to bring. Some episodes mentioned in the podcast: Navid Zargham EP250, Thekla Teunis EP243, Sam Hinds EP241, Giles Hutchins EP240, Vanessa Andreotti EP238, Grace Ramanchy EP235, Nora Bateson EP213 and EP202, Indra Adnan EP114.

Navid Zargham of Simran Meditation (instagram) came on and we took on one of the most central topics of this shift we're in: separation. Navid is a practitioner and guide for people to find what is sometimes referred to as 'non-duality', or as he says himself "a way of looking behind the scenes, behind the culture and behind the programming" . This is a beautiful conversation, we touch on separation, belonging, the sense of freedom and love most of us want. Why non-duality will not make you less efficient nor will necessarily make you stop doing anything. We speak of detachment and most of all we invite us all to simply stop, ground yourself and check. Enjoy!

Dr. Claudine Perlet (LinkedIn, webpage) stepped out from her top tier corporate job for a large insurance company in 2017 and began exploring alternatives. She landed on Regenerative Economics as her frame for the work she is doing now. This conversation speaks of the regenerative business transformation and we address, head on, some of the things that will no longer be working as we move deeper into ecosystems collapse. We speak of what it takes to afford to contribute to the transition, why community and conviviality is so important and why it, sooner than we might hope, will be important to remember that you cannot eat money. Enjoy! Additional resources from the show: Paradigm Changer Program - https://claudineperlet.com/program/ System Change Investing - https://www.systemchangeinvesting.com/ 30 Min Zoom Meeting - https://calendly.com/businessreinvented/30-minutes-meeting

Renee Lertzman (LinkedIn, webpage) climate psychologist that's worked for more than 3 decades with large corporations and instituations (google included) dropped in for a deep conversations on the conditions conducive to change. We spoke of the importance of questions, how agency is one of the most important aspects of our humanity and how robbing those we try to change of it is counter productive. Renee introduces her framework on cheerleading, educating or 'righting' your way vs the potentially more conducive guiding stance. This is a dive into the world of change making through artful questioning. Also: Project Insideout. Enjoy!

John Mack (LinkedIn) author, speaker, photographer and founder of the non-profit Life Calling, focused on preserving our humanity in a digital age. We get into the weeds of what technology is doing to us at the moment, and why exactly it is so pervasive. We also speak of what it has the potential to do for us. We speak of the meta-crisis and how it is an offer for us to really reimagine the world. John also speaks of his ROH - return on human, we speak of human vs humane tech, touch upon why no-one seems to question the question: what do I need to do to preserve my humanity in this digital age? This conversation goes deep. Enjoy!

Nessie Reid is the director of the Global Diversity Foundation, (linktr.ee) the creator of the Miking Parlour lives with her husband on an organic farm in Wales. We deep dive into food and why food sovereignty and food security are such fundamental topics. Why it is that not more of us care about food. We speak of convenience and price as two important parameters to understand, we speak of environmental justice, the patchwork of belonging, grief work, how to deal with fire without burning out and the importance of humor. Enjoy!

Anna Gyllenklev (LinkedIn) founder of Untra Studio visited the podcast. We spoke about what our environments do to us, we spoke about health and the relational nature of our world. What are the dependencies that structure our thinking? What do we have to do to think outside our brain? What are you cultivating? What do we nurture? What does it do to us when we attend to things that are not living and how can we redesign our lives? Enjoy!

Servane Mouazan (⁠LinkedIn⁠, ⁠webpage⁠) visited the podcast and we spoke of things like collective intelligence, what happens when we invite the organisation as the living entity and inquire into it into the room, we spoke of trust and how capital is not just financial capital but rather many things. We spoke of change, and resistance to change, the invitation to listen deeply to our assumptions. How assumptions drive behavior, the crucial importance of imagination for this moment and how we have an obligation to pay attention. Enjoy this circular or perhaps spiral conversation.

Thekla Teunis (⁠LinkedIn⁠) is the founder of ⁠Grounded⁠ aiming to bring agriculture back into balance. Thekla shares her journey from Shell and McKinsey to her current work of transforming agriculture bottom up from the core. We speak of being with the consequences of what one is doing, what it takes to see and what it takes to take risk. The importance of having a team willing to go the distance and having the courage to act to right something that is fundamentally wrong. And how that, even though it is sometimes hard, is what affords a meaningful existence.

Vicki Saunders (LI) founder of Coralus and I spoke of the new ways of building business, systems transformation, the power of generosity and kindness. What happens when you get 7000 women together and let the community direct investments? What happens when you realise just how expensive control is and how cheap trust is? What are the metaphors that can set us free? We speak of transformation as a step by step approach and our power, agency and responsibility to build a world that works for us. Listen to this one! Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul

Sam Hinds (website, substack) therapist, PhD and lecturer at California Center for Integral Studies, has been on before EP173. We dive into the depths of what some call collective precensing. We speak of faith and trust. We speak of the impatience we feel, the importance of slowing down, of staying with it. We speak of responsibility, relevance, circular time and much else. The practices Sam wrote his dissertation on as practices to reconnect with life, inviting the many to agency and as a practice of attuning to vitality, within and around us. If you are curious about collective practice in some form. This is a must listen. Other resources we mention: Episode with Ria Baeck, Debold & Steininger, Sam's other Podcast with Rosa Lewis. Host Amit Paul.

Giles Hutchins (⁠webpage⁠) has been on the podcast before (⁠EP107⁠). Recently released his 6th book ⁠Nature Works⁠ which we center this conversation around. We deepdive into the meaning of the quote: "being intimate with the immanent and transparent with the transcendent". Giles also positions us nicely in where our society is currently, we speak of the potential of living intimately with our everyday life. We also bring in terms like dinergy, dissect belonging, explore hesitation and uncover stillness. And you'll get to hear the one tip, the core skill of regenerative leadership if you lean in to the episode! Enjoy!

Samantha Sweetwater is a coach, author, holistic practitioner (webpage, LinkedIn, Instagram). We spoke of what is to have lived with the awareness of existential risk for 50 years. Which places it may take you. We speak of what it means to live in these times we live in and the possibilities it offers us. We speak of embodiment, enlifenment, aesthetics, sensemaking, attention, animism, suspension of disbelief. We speak of wisdom. And what we can do now to build capacity. Towards the end there is a radical invitation. What if, we are the ones that in the future will be known as "we were the ones who came home"? Enjoy. Host: Amit Paul

Vanessa Andreotti author of Hospicing Modernity, dean of the faculty of education at University of Victoria and member of the DCF collective came and spoke about what it takes to begin making space for something that isn't modernity. We speak of the importance of humor and humility, staying open to both the good and the sh*t, coming into contact with what modernity is actually doing to us and what it means to be tethered. What happens when there is no away? We speak of form and motion. We speak why fighting or fixing are traps. We speak of the fact that colonialism, the world most of live in, feels good. This is a human, humorous wonderful conversation for those serious about being in service to the different world may also inhabit. Link to facing human wrongs course. Host: Amit Paul

This episode is an intermezzo. It is an audio version of Amit Pauls and Eric Lichtmans article in the Unpsychology Magazine 10: Edges: To move in spaces where worlds shift. Enjoy!

Ida Faldbakken (⁠LinkedIn⁠), CEO of KatapultX and co-founder of ⁠Katapult Future Fest⁠, and I had a deep inquiry into what it is to gather, what it's for and what it means to not waste peoples time. We also spoke about what it takes to break our habits, like what if the people on stage are there to propagate the conversation off stage, what if these contexts do not have to scale in themselves and can still continue to scale their impact in the world, what does it mean to work at the peak of ones capacity - what does it mean to stop when we're not at capacity? This is a rich conversation about our current challenges seen through the lens of gatherings. Enjoy!

Manish Jain, founder of ⁠Swaraj University⁠ and ⁠Ecoversities Alliance⁠ is this weeks guest. We spoke of alternatives to education, why education as we think of it today may be one of the root causes of the metacrisis rather than a solution for it and we spoke of reclaiming learning and knowledge. The treachery of language like 'first generation learners' and types of knowledge - spelling goat vs herding them and which is more knowledgeable for instance. We also speak of how come,outside of our culture, not everything has a price. This is a rich and deep conversation that will have you rethinking everything you knew about education.

Grace Rachmany of the Voices of humanty, Priceless DAO, DAO leadership and many more projects is this weeks guest. We spoke of democracy and the state of it, we spoke of decision making, what happens to a society that has the monetary system as it's primary social structure. We speak of value, commons, technology and responsibility. This conversation is a deep and thoughtful one that points to the many possibilities of what reshaping our societies entails. Enjoy! Link to extended shownotes (Substack)

Tanuja Prasad (LinkedIn) and I had a conversation about her work in regenerative investments. We talked about the spirit of investments, the driving force behind investment up until this point, how to transcend the extractive paradigm and shift away from the control and force as the governing principles towards something more generative. Tanuja and I spoke of the Systems view of life and how it's influenced our work and thinking. This is a conversation that is profound and subtle. It works with a new set of metaphors and concepts with the ambition to reinvent the fundamentals of investing for a regenerative paradigm. Enjoy!

Eva Karlsson (LinkedIn), CEO of Houdini Sportswear visited the podcast. We got to talk about solutions that are not solutions, the planetary boundaries in business, measurement, common sense, why joy at work is a radical thing to focus on. We also spoke of the benefit of having a strict set of design boundaries to work with, spoler: it spurs creativity. We also spoke about responsibility in business and working in synergy with the living planet. Host: Amit Paul Extended shownotes (Substack)

Jeremy D Johnson visited the podcast a second time after 2 years (website). This was a deep and curious conversation about change all the way down. We spoke of emergence happening in the middle, the idea of slowing down, the importance of hesitation, temporics of attention, the awakening of the relational (integrated) worldview in younger generations. We also spoke of this notion of the potential for creative responses in the fisures, in those moments when our habits no longer meets the worlds we live in. Jeremy is a master with words and this is a beautiful weaving that provided me with lots of insight. Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul Extended shownotes (Substack)

Jenny Grettve founder of the Economic Institue For Feminine Futures, author of the upcoming book Mothering economy came by the podcast. We spoke of why, with all our innovative capacity, it is so difficult to create a caring and kind economy? This is a conversation on many levels that zooms in and out of the economic, educational and systemic work Jenny is involved with. We also speak of how to invest in love, what it takes to come into alignment with ones values and what it would take for us to just stop. Other ways to find out more of Jennys work: website, WhenWhen Agency Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul.

Eric "Zippy" Harris-Braun, founder of Holochain, had a conversation about Holochain, agent centric vs data centric blockchains, the power of Holochain as one of the components of the DNA for social organisms. We speak about money and why it is not a very wholesome storage of value. We speak of gramatic capacity and LLMs as grammar deducers, the importance of membranes as well as consent. We also speak about the weave as a new beginning for the decentralised web. Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul

Jeremy Akers from Gospel of change (Substack, X, LinkedIn) came by the podcast. We spoke of liberating structures, how to acheive coherence in groups and why that is crucial for the times we live in, game design and how that may take us forward. This is a conversation that orients towards the practical with some concrete tools and possibilities to look at for shifting habits. Enjoy! Host Amit Paul Extended shownotes (Substack)

Another solo episode with some pressing reflections that wanted to come out. I reflect on the myths of separation, control and survival. Also invite you to consider the Relax, Repurpose and Remember triad that Innrwrks is working on. Most of all I invite you to be with the very challenging (and rewarding perspective): If everything in this world is as its supposed to be - what are we invited to learn? Some of the resources that I touch upon: Episodes from World of Wisdom podcast Karl-Erik Edris, Michel Bauwens. Blogs: Temporal weaving as a practice, My substack, World of Wisdom substack. Other resources: Johnathan Rowson, Caring Economics (Eisler), Innrwrks... enjoy! Extended shownotes (Substack)

Karl-Erik Edris came by for a second conversation (here's the first from nov 2023). This time we spoke of the rise of fall of civilizations, where we currently seem to be in this current change, the axial age, the fall of the roman empire, Jesus, modernity and what might be coming next. What is it that our current ways of treating eachother and the planet can teach us? What are we invited to learn? If you are one of us that is looking for the 'smoke' that connects the real world and language as Karl-Erik puts it this is definitely a conversation for you. Enjoy. Host: Amit Paul Extensive shownotes (substack)

Nora Willhelm (web, linkedin) founder of the well, co-founder of Collaboratio Helvetica, alumn of the European youth parliament and much more came by the podcast. This is a specific and hands on conversation about what it takes to be one of those longing to bridge the existing system towards what is to come. The costs of being a bridge, why systemic work particularly is difficult to navigate and a whole host of concrete tips for those on the path towards working systemically. (Here is the Tedtalk about daily leadership.) Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul Extended shownotes (Substack)

Michel Bauwens (Substack⁠ and ⁠X⁠) is a thought leader and researcher in the space of commons. Also the founder of the P2P foundation. We speak of the state of the commons, dive into the pulsation of the commons, the rise and fall of civilizations, and much more. Michel makes a beautiful argument for why we are currently moving towards a time when communities will again steward commons in ways that has not been deemed efficient for some time and why the state+market structure we are currently in is crumbling under it's own weight. Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul

Audrey Fillon and Victor Vorski came on the podcast and we spoke of Gathering. They are co-creating the Gathering of the Tribes (links: Gathering of Tribes' website, LinkedIn, YouTube channel, Instagram, Newsletter) It was a beautiful conversation touching on the technology of gathering, the need for breaking silos, the Project, what these times are asking of us, why systems thinking is not really a discipline, the importance of practice and action and much much more. Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul

Amanda Argo Efthimiou (webpage, LinkedIn, instagram) is specialized in integration of peak experiences and altered states with a background in Neuroscience. We speak of integration as an ongoing process, how cultural context is critical in understanding how we think about integration. We speak of how to retain the potency of a peak experience and how to think of time during integration, as well as ones integration practice. This conversation introduces a whole new perspective on integration on the high level, for those interested in or in need of more hands on guidance look into this conversation as referenced in the episode. Enjoy! Extended shownotes (Substack)

Christina Bengtsson (LinkedIn, Tedtalk) founder of Reclaim Focus has been a world champion of precision shooting, military officer, author. We speak of what focus is, if it's effortful to be focused? We speak about time as well as the fundamentals: what is focus? We speak about how we create our present as well as our future depending on how we are able to focus and of course about how we can reclaim our focus that is currently under attack. This is a fascinating conversation focusing alot around the experience. Enjoy! Host Amit Paul. Extensive shownotes (Substack)

Louise Rönnerdahl (LinkedIn) executive coach and coach at Leader intelligence came on the podcast and spoke of the current trend towards dehumanisation. We spoke of the IQ the EQ and the SQ (spiritual intelligence) in the model Leader intelligence in Sweden is working with. As well as the intelligence of the body. The fact that a manager is both a manager and a leader and need to have competence in both. We also spoke about what it is we're afraid of and why it is, that for many of us, 'the worst' has already happened. This is a deepdive into the new paradigm of leadership. Enjoy! Host: Amit Paul. Extended shownotes (Substack)

Christian Bason (LinkedIn) the former co-CEO of Danish Design Center and Director of MindLab, currently co-founder of the Transition Collective. We had a deep conversation about what it takes to transition and transform our current society. We spoke of how to take seriously the how and begin to move away from problem solving that creates more problems. Christian also shares his experience of taking an organisation to a full on decentralised mode as he did with the DDC. Enjoy! Extended Shownotes (Substack)

Josephine Sundqvist the General Director and CEO of LM International (Läkarmissionen) came on the podcast. We explored development and the importance of partnership. Why focusing on empowerment is more efficient than maximizing short term returns. Why it might be the right ove for companies as well to stop thinking of profits as the end and instead see it as a means for something greater. We also speak of faith and leadership and the importance of hope. As well as what it means to have keep a gaze oriented towards the potential while not wavering from the (sometimes) harsh reality as it is. This is a truly wonderful conversation. Enjoy! Host Amit Paul Extended Shownotes (Substack)