Podcasts about san jiao

En este episodio podrás descubrir las bases de los trabajos realizados en el Grupo 21 I+D sobre la utilización del San Jiao y el Xin Bao en enfermedades genéticas.Conviértete en un seguidor de este podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/medicina-integrativa-grupo-21-i-d-clase-de-los-miercoles--2714602/support.

Zang Fu Chapter 12 Xin Bao (Pericardium : 心包) and San Jiao (Triple Burner:三焦) Xin Bao (心包) Functions Patterns of Disharmony San Jiao (三焦) The four main conception of San Jiao San Jiao as the Three Divisions of the body San Jiao as part of the Six Stages San Jiao Classification of Warm Diseases San Jiao as Three Divisions 2. San Jiao as the Fu system Transformation and Movement of Fluids Transformation and Movement of Qi Misinterpretation and Misunderstanding 3. San Jiao as the Jing Luo Distribution Signs 4. San JIao as the San Jiao points Relieving pain and inflammation along the course of the superficial channel Dispersing External Disease Factors Invigorating Qi circulation in the Jing Luo, to remove obstruction Treatment of San Jiao Disharmonies Summary

En este programa encontrarás información sobre el resonador energético 6SJ, punto río, punto de comando del canal energético de San Jiao.Conviértete en un seguidor de este podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/clase-de-los-miercoles--2714602/support.

Author and Therapist Michele Broadhurst joins Ane live to discuss the connection between the myofascial system, and the San Jiao meridian. Learn more about Michele Broadhurst: https://rehab4pets.com/  Learn more about our The Vet Rehab Summit: https://vetrehabsummit.com/ Join The Vet Rehab Summit Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1917965645047880  Learn more about Respond Systems: https://respondsystems.com/ To learn about Onlinepethealth, watch a free webinar, or join any of our Facebook groups, click here: https://onlinepethealth.com/podcast

Mingmen (命門) is a lifeblood point in the flow of fire and qi in the body, yet remains shrouded in an enigma. For those who seek to understand their fate, the point—which translates to “Gate of Destiny” or “Gate of Life”—can be perceived as a gateway leading to a realm beyond our understanding, offering a glimpse into the unknown. Like the beating of our hearts, the strength and vitality of the Mingmen can determine the course of our lives. Its fiery heat, fueled by the blood of life that courses through us, illuminating the path to our destiny. In this conversation with Thomas Sorensen, we seek to understand and unlock the mysteries of the Mingmen—including its significance in our clinical work and how to attend to it. Thomas talks about the need to get heat in the right place and how the heart, the kidney, the Mingmen, and the San Jiao (triple burner) tie into all this. We also fiddle with the idea of destiny, the physiological and psychological aspects of our clinical work, and the role of the small intestines.Listen into this discussion on the relationship between the pericardium, the San Jiao, and the Mingmen.

"This is probably the first time we've talked about the San Jiao meridian- the invisible Yang Organ System. The San Jiao is responsible for the transportation of fluids through the body. It's responsible for the functional relationship between various Organs involved with fluid metabolism and metabolism in general. It's between the Lungs, Spleen, Kidneys, Small Intestine, and Bladder, and it's paired with the pericardium. It helps the body transport lymphatic fluid and prevents toxic build up". - Mason Taylor    Today on the podcast, we're taking a moment to observe and acknowledge the ancient healing tradition of Gua Sha. A healing technique that spans ages and cultures, bridging the gap between the practitioner's office and the home through direct engagement with the physicality of our bodies. Mason runs through the specific techniques and details of using the SuperFeast Bian stone Yin/Yang Gua Sha tools- how to engage, use them safely and feel connected to this ancient wisdom and ancient lore. Mason explains the function of eliminating internal heat and stagnation through the gentle scraping of the Gua Sha tool, supporting and assisting the movement of lymphatic fluids through the San Jiao meridian system. The Gua Sha tool offers profound benefits when incorporated into a daily facial-beauty routine, offering lasting radiance and buoyancy to the skin. But it is far more than just an elegant beauty tool for the face- it is a safe and gentle way of moving Qi around the body and preventing disease in our daily lives.   "The San Jiao meridian is the regulatory capacity for the body to move between the lower dantian, the middle dantian, the upper dantian, and the three burners-the three centres. And when they're in sync, you're connecting the Three Treasures, the Jing, the Qi, and the Shen. Everything's being regulated, harmonised, and connected, and the waters are moving on".  - Mason Taylor   Mason discusses: -Facial Gua Sha for detox. -Why Bian Stone for Gua Sha? -Chi Nei Tsang organ massage. -Immune function and Gua Sha. -How long do we use Gua sha for? -Gua Sha and the lymphatic sytem. -Gua Sha and the meridian systems. -San Jiao- the invisible Yang organ system. -How to use SuperFeasts Yin Yang Gua Sha tools. -The distinction between facial Gua Sha and body Gua Sha.  -Gua Sha and the distribution of Qi through the Gallbladder. -Why the San Jiao meridian system is essential for detoxification. -Stagnation-an indication of disease and disharmony within organ systems.   Resource guide Guest  Mason's Instagram SuperFeast Instagram    Mentioned in this episode  Movement Monk SuperFeast Gua Sha Bundle SuperFeast Yin Gua Sha Tool SuperFeast Yang Gua Sha Tool Chi Nei Tsang massage (Mantak Chia)    Beauty Tonics Tremella QI BLEND Schisandra BEAUTY BLEND I AM GAIA BLEND. Radiant Skin Bundle Relevant Articles:  Schisandra and Detox Go Hand in Hand Detoxification Guide -  A look At The Body's Detox channels Relevant Podcasts: Healing Heat: Infared Saunas with Sebastian Mierau (EP#84)   Check Out The Transcript Here:  

In this episode, I talk about the functions of the pericardium and san jiao in acupuncture.Thank you so much for taking the time to listen to this podcast episode and stay tuned for tomorrow's! Our website: https://acupunctureismylife.com/ Follow our social media for more information on acupuncture: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/acupunctureismylife/ Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/acupunctureismylifeTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@acupunctureismylife?lang=en

In this video, I explain what the pericardium and san jiao are and how they function in acupuncture. #heart #pericardium #hearthealth 0:00 Introduction 0:15 What Does The Pericardium Do 1:53 What is The San Jiao 2:13 What Does The San Jiao Do 2:30 Conclusion - heart - heart anatomy - pericardium - what is the pericardium - where is the pericardium located - how does the pericardium function - pericardium anatomy - pericadium of the heart - pericardium function - pericardium location - acupuncture for percardium - where is the pericardium - san jiao - san jiao meridian - where is the san jiao - what is the san jiao - san jiao in acupuncture Follow us on social media: Tik Tok: @acupunctureismylife Facebook: @acupunctureismylife / https://facebook.com/acupunctureismylife Instagram: @acupunctureismylife / https://www.instagram.com/acupunctureismylife/ Twitter: @acu_ismylife / https://twitter.com/acu_ismylife Vimeo: http://www.vimeo.com/acupunctureismylife Tumblr: https://acupunctureismylife.tumblr.com/ For more information, visit: http://www.acupunctureismylife.com/ Thank you for watching How Do The Pericardium and San Jiao Function in Acupuncture? | Acupuncture is my Life

We think of the meridians as being a connective network within the body. But it is the fluids that actually permeate all the organs and tissues, and in a sense connect and allow for communication between all aspects of the body. And at the same time provide the medium for nourishment and exchange. In this discussion with Steve Clavey we discuss the vital role of fluids, the vast connectivity of the San Jiao, the mischief created by phlegm, and how some simple herbal formulas can make a big difference in the state of a patient’s fluids and health. Listen into this conversation on fluid physiology and pathology and how the process of learning medicine is an ongoing investigation in proving to ourselves how this medicine works. Head on over to the https://www.qiological.com/blog/fluid-physiology-pathology (show notes page) for more information about this episode and for links to the resources discussed in the interview. 

Chinese Medicine Study Guide Fundamentals Chapter 2 Visceral Manifestations Section 2 The Six- Fu Organs For everyone who has intention to learn TCM This show is read at laud version of Chinese Medicine Study Guide; Fundamentals which I currently work on. Traditional Chinese Medicine is full of knowledge and human wisdom contains several thousands years our ancestors have accumulated. At the same time I also studying English. Please be patient when you find my mispronounce and reading mistake. I would love to share this contents with reading and studying English , hoping with all of you paying respect all the informations what the TCM has. Unfortunately, this text is currently unavailable to order at amazon. Even though let me introduce the link and the front page of the text below https://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-Chinese-Medicine-Study-Guide/dp/7117092408/ref=sr_1_2?crid=33PYFP1EBMXKI&dchild=1&keywords=chinese+medicine+study+guide+fundamentals&qid=1602218891&sprefix=Chinese+medicine+study+guide+%2Caps%2C318&sr=8-2 Enjoy learning!

Raymond & Billy talk about the supplemental fire meridians of the body, the Pericardium and Triple Heater (aka Triple Warmer aka San Jiao). We talk about the three burners, the discovery of a new organ that acupuncturists already knew about, how to give your heart a hug, and some general overview of these meridians in the body and what select points we use most often. --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/raymondandbilly/support

Mason and Tahnee (the dream team) join forces on the podcast today, to introduce us to Shen, the Third Treasure of the Daoist system. Mason and Tahnee reveal our new SuperFeast baby - the SHEN blend, journeying through the herbs present in the formula and the actions and virtues they afford us when we work in harmony with them. We're beyond thrilled to finally have our beloved SHEN blend launching ready for our SuperFeast community to explore, completing our propriety Treasure series, sharing the stage with our darling JING and QI blends. If you're new to the Three Treasures and want to learn more, check out our JING podcast here and QI podcast here. Mason has also written a brilliant article on the Three Treasure so you can read it here. Enjoy!  "Shen.. It's just you, without the bullshit"  - Mason & Tahnee   Mason and Tahnee discuss: The Three Treasures of the Daoist system. The treasure of Shen, what it is, how it is embodied. The East vs West approach to the mind, the Heart vs the brain. The importance of building strong foundations within the body in order to cultivate Shen. The healing profiles of the herbs in the new SuperFeast SHEN blend. When to use the SuperFeast SHEN blend and why. The difference between the Poria in our Masons Mushrooms and the Spirit Poria in our SHEN blend. Harvesting our Poria and why we source all our herbs Di Dao. The beautifying effects of the SHEN blend.   Who Are Mason Taylor and Tahnee McCrossin? Mason Taylor: Mason’s energy and intent for a long and happy life is infectious. A health educator at heart, he continues to pioneer the way for potent health and a robust personal practice. An avid sharer, connector, inspirer and philosophiser, Mason wakes up with a smile on his face, knowing that tonic herbs are changing lives. Mason is also the SuperFeast founder, daddy to Aiya and partner to Tahnee (General Manager at SuperFeast). Tahnee McCrossin: Tahnee is a self proclaimed nerd, with a love of the human body, it’s language and its stories. A cup of tonic tea and a human interaction with Tahnee is a gift! A beautiful Yin Yoga teacher and Chi Ne Tsang practitioner, Tahnee loves going head first into the realms of tradition, yogic philosophy, the organ systems, herbalism and hard-hitting research. Tahnee is the General Manager at SuperFeast, mumma to reishi-baby Aiya and partner to Mason (founder of SuperFeast).   Resources: The Video Of Mason Harvesting Poria In China   SuperFeast SHEN Blend Product Page Superfeast SHEN Blend Blog  Q: How Can I Support The SuperFeast Podcast?   A: Tell all your friends and family and share online! We’d also love it if you could subscribe and review this podcast on iTunes. Or  check us out on Stitcher, CastBox, iHeart RADIO:)! Plus  we're on Spotify!   Check Out The Transcript Here:   Mason: (00:01) Hey, everybody. Here with Tahns.   Tahnee: (00:02) Hi.   Mason: (00:03) So we're going to be talking about Shen today, Third Treasure.   Tahnee: (00:06) Mm-hmm (affirmative). Exciting time.   Mason: (00:08) Yeah. It's finally about the combination of the Three Treasures of blends in the superfoods range, so it's been awhile.   Tahnee: (00:15) Jing, Qi, and Shen.   Mason: (00:18) Very good, Tahns.   Tahnee: (00:18) I've been spending too much time with Aiya.   Mason: (00:21) Yeah, Daoism for kiddies.   Tahnee: (00:29) All right, boys and girls. Yeah, I think it's exciting because we really like this Daoist idea of Jing, Qi, Shen. It's such a great way to kind of view the body and our experience as a human on this earthly plane. The Jing holding our DNA and our kind of, I guess, connection to our ancestry and the strength of our constitution, our bones and our body and the Qi being the animation of that, the metabolism and the fire of our life and then Shen being that which is eliminated by those forces being in harmony, right?   Mason: (01:07) Yeah, exactly. I mean there's so many different ways. It's such a colourful conversation. I've been thinking about Jing, Qi, and Shen a lot lately and how to make them as something that doesn't seem theoretical like you have to remember, but something-   Tahnee: (01:21) Lived?   Mason: (01:22) Yeah, exactly. It's why metaphors are so good. It's why I've been enjoying talking about thinking if you take the human body and it's just a bunch of bones and DNA and hips and marrow. And you just lay it there and it's not moving and it's got all this potential, but in order for it to have potential, you need to put the batteries in and the batteries need to have charge. Batteries being the Kidneys, the Jing is so if you just take that human body and all its potential, it can't do anything yet, it's just pure physical potential, and then you plug the Jing in by putting the batteries in and they're charged batteries. They're not batteries that are Jing deficient, smashing coffees and absolutely flogging yourself. Put the batteries into the Kidneys and then all of the sudden, you have the rising of Qi.   Tahnee: (02:08) The lights go on.   Mason: (02:09) Exactly, the lights go on. Qi moves. That body can get up and animate and move around. Then to really drop into Shen and live and for me to be feeling Shen. Because I used to use analogies about the candle, which I still enjoy. Talking about it like this in the human body, then from there, if you just have potential in the physical body, the Jing, amazing. You've got life.   Tahnee: (02:31) Lights are on but nobody's home, right?   Mason: (02:34) Exactly. You're animating and you're moving, but where's the personality and the soul and the lessons and the enjoyment and all that? That's Shen, and that's why it's important, it's an important distinction that the spirit, because that's one spirit, your spirit can emerge from your heart, come through. Therefore, you have your soul present and you can become wiser and more virtuous. These are all things that are your Shen, and it's an important distinction that Daoism, Classical Chinese medicine before it was modernised and colonised in the 50s, to turn it into what's known as Traditional Chinese Medicine currently.   Mason: (03:11) The Spirit was cut away and definitely in the Western medicine, there's no Spirit that's present. It's just all... Literally a scalpel's gone and cut away the spiritual elements of medicine, but Shen, you can't really talk about health long term from a Daoist perspective or yogic perspective, any of these that will kind of have ancient roots, without acknowledging that the spirit and the spirit of organs and one's own soul and spirit, it's pivotal to understanding how we can become healthy long term.   Tahnee: (03:45) Mm-hmm (affirmative). It's funny you talk about analogies because I've been studying a bit with Nevine Michaan from Katonah Yoga, and she talks about the body as a house. And if you've got the architecture and the structure, which is your Jing effectively. And then you've got the lights on and you start to move in, that's the Qi. And then, if you make it a home, you make it a place where you want to be where it has a comforting essence of pleasure and joy and warmth, then that's the Shen.   Mason: (04:17) You weren't there on our last retreat at Tanya's when I used that exact analogy. I said, "Look at this room. This is the Jing. See how there's nice things and people. Put flowers over here and some incense on. It keeps it moving, the doors are open. That's the Qi. There's life moving through it. But then, only over years can laughter settle in, and oils settle in to the kitchen, that have actually been lived in."   Tahnee: (04:44) Yeah. And that's what makes something beautiful. And that's what the Daoists say. When someone's Shen is harmonised in their body, then they're lit up from within. And they're attractive, and they're expressed. They're just full of purpose and intention and presence, but it's not seeking or striving. It's just like a nice home where you go in and you're just... It's nice to be in their presence.   Tahnee: (05:12) I think that's such a beautiful way to think about it.   Mason: (05:15) You can't fake Shen. You definitely can't. You might be able to on Instagram, but not in real life.   Tahnee: (05:21) Well, I think when we look at what Shen even does, if you have a Shen disturbance manifesting as a symptom of anxiety, well that's the opposite of a comforting, safe environment. You don't feel safe. You feel unsettled and unhinged and stressed and out of alignment. Well that's a Shen disturbance. And so yeah, absolutely. We want to support this in ourselves and in others. And when we see it, when we recognise it in ourselves and in others, it's a nice thing to cultivate and build.   Tahnee: (05:56) And that's what all these practises are about. Meditation and even the Qi Gong and the cultivation exercises are about stabilising the Shen so that energy, that soul lives in the body and is expressed through this life. And then, we move on to whatever, higher points of consciousness, whatever you want to do. After that, it's up to you, guys. We're here for the Shen.   Mason: (06:17) Yeah, I've been talking about the fact that it comes when Shen is in harmony and able to consistently express itself. Obviously guys, at the end of this, you'll see Shen isn't something to be developed overnight. It's certainly not something you get. Everyone's just got their Shen, and it's highly correlated. It is literally like emerging from the Heart organ system, so the Heart Fire. So the Heart is the emperor organ. And all the other organs are essentially serving the emperor.   Mason: (06:51) When the Heart Fire Qi is flowing harmoniously... That's the idea behind the Shen herbs and all these practises, to ensure that we've got enough Blood so that the Shen can travel through the Blood. The Blood's Shen's home-away-from-home.   Tahnee: (07:07) Envoy.   Mason: (07:08) Heavy envoy.   Tahnee: (07:09) Take it around.   Mason: (07:10) To take it around to ensure that we're enlivening and bringing light and soulfulness and consciousness to every little area of our body. Tahns is just getting some water because water is needed to build Blood. These herbs and practises are also ensuring that we've got Qi tonics to support the movement of blood; therefore, the movement of Shen through the body because life requires movement. If the waters get stagnant, Blood gets stagnant, then we're not able to bring in life to ensure that there is a harmonious flow of the surrounding organs, which is all of them, but especially the Liver. We really want a smooth Liver flow, the Liver being the mother.   Mason: (07:51) The Liver-Wood, being the mother to the Heart Fire to ensure that... The Liver is ensuring that we've got strong strength through the capillaries and ensuring that we've got that uprightness so that Blood can move through and get through as well as Qi can get through and move through the body, as well as creating that suppleness, especially through those Blood vessels which means that we can bring curvature to the way that the Blood is moving, and therefore, cool the Blood down.   Mason: (08:19) And so, if you don't have those things, if you're stagnant, which is something I'm prone to, as you know, Tahns, if you're stagnant through your Liver Qi and especially if you lack that Yin and that suppleness through your Liver, Liver-Wood, then you're going to get a downstream effect where there's going to be a lot of Heat through the Blood, therefore, a lot of potential excess Fire.   Tahnee: (08:43) Yeah, when you think about friction, right? If you're rigid, so this is a thing. The Blood moves in spirals or vortexes. When you go and check out Gil Hedley's work, he talks about the heart not being a pump but being a valley where the vortex water layer... It's just spring water does in nature.   Mason: (09:00) Creating more of an implosion suction.   Tahnee: (09:03) Yeah. Exactly. More like your circulatory organ than a pumping organ. And if you think about rigidity, if you think about the vessels becoming really rigid and you think about a movement along that, rigidity creates this friction which creates Heat in the body. And so, that's not idea. That's going to burn up your Fluids. It's going to create all sorts of implications down the track.   Tahnee: (09:26) And yeah, the Hun as well. There's a spirit in the Liver called the Hun which can invade the Heart, can invade the Shen and cause mental disturbances and the psychological aspects of that. So when we're looking at a Shen, harmonised Shen in a human is like a person who's healthy mentally and not got a lot of psychological disturbances. But when we do have these imbalances, we can end up with the Liver invading the Heart. We can end up with all sorts of troubles.   Mason: (09:58) So the Hun is the part of our... It's more of our infinite Spirit guys, that travels after this lifetime, the Spirit that goes on.   Tahnee: (10:07) Yeah. Well I always think of the Shen as my universal consciousness, the part of me that came down to be, to animate the form. My Shen is that. My Hun is my astral self, so the part of me that can travel the realms. And it's one thing to take it to a really advanced, philosophical level. But the way it works in the body is why we're here. We want a clear path for consciousness, a clear channel for consciousness to come through. And it shines out of us. That's the idea.   Tahnee: (10:44) And then, this Hun is meant to keep connecting us to this astral self that can live beyond the physical realms, I suppose. So it's the creative. It's the vision. It's the future seeing. It's time doesn't exist because I live in all time.   Mason: (11:03) Yeah. Part of our intention here is to bring our higher consciousness, our Shen, and bring it through and crack it through into this reality that we're at now. What I was talking about, all the things that these practises and Shen herbs do in bringing a smooth flow of that hot Fire Qi, ensuring that we've got a smooth flow of the Liver cooling the Blood, so and so forth, stabilising the Heart.   Mason: (11:26) What happens then, the Heart as the emperor that all the other organs serve, that is when you get a smooth flow of Qi through that organ system, that's when the spirit of that organ system may express itself. So it's the same when we have a smooth flow of Qi through the Liver, then the Hun may express itself.   Mason: (11:47) If you have disturbance, if you have Heart Fire disturbance, what happens is it's like frustration that's going to get expressed from the Liver, but I just use that term. It's frustrating for the Qi. And then Shen's going to... The spirit of that organ system is not going to be able to express clearly. And therefore, we're going to see that expressed in anxiousness, mental disturbance, depression, insomnia. And then, going down the line, psychosis, so and so forth.   Mason: (12:23) As you know, you can see the Shen is the window... The eyes are the window to the Shen or to higher consciousness or to the soul, as we say. This is what our Daoist herbs are doing. This when you need to be working with someone clinically if you have this level of psychosis or mental disturbance. But you can see as someone moves down that line of having extreme anxiety, extreme depression, mental disturbance, and psychosis, you see the eyes starting to glaze over or to grey or to dull, and that's where Daoist would immediately go, right there's a direct Shen disturbance.   Mason: (13:06) And then, you'd need appropriate diagnosis at those points.   Tahnee: (13:10) Well that's when you lose your grip with reality. Right? And that's the Hun because the Liver's also the outward expression of... I would say they eyes are the outward expression of the Liver. I don't understand the psychology of TCM as well as I would like to, but from what I understand, the Hun... Because the Liver does invade and overtake the Shen, we sort of lose touch with reality. Because that sort of sense of schizophrenia and a lot of those... Because Chinese medicine doesn't talk about symptoms or diseases like we do in the West. It talks about patterns that would be Liver Heat or Liver invading Spleen or whatever.   Tahnee: (13:57) But what I understand is something like a schizophrenic episode would be literally a case of the Hun becoming more dominant. Or when you have poor Blood to anchor the Hun, you don't sleep well, and you have wild dreams where your Hun will wake you up, Liver will wake you up in the middle of the night at 1:00. That's a really common thing we hear here in customer service a lot of the time.   Tahnee: (14:20) It's like, "I wake up every night between 1:00 and 3:00."   Tahnee: (14:23) And it's like, "Oh well, that's a sign that you probably don't have enough Blood to anchor the Hun, so you're not getting a really good sleep. So when it starts to move, that Liver time, it wakes you up because it's such a burst of Yang energy through the body."   Tahnee: (14:38) So the psychological stuff's super interesting and definitely something I'm still learning a lot about. But just understanding these kind of energies that animate us and create our experience is really interesting. So we would not look at... Even when we go to talk about the herbs and what they do from a Daoist expertise, if you nourish the Fire, if you nourish the essence of the Heart, if you work with that energy, if your intention and your presence and your practise is about that, it's going to feed it.   Tahnee: (15:11) I know Tony Robbins hijacked it, but intention, Qi, Blood, those things all follow one another. I think it's where your energy intentionally goes, your energy follows.   Mason: (15:21) Where the mind goes, energy flows.   Tahnee: (15:25) Yes. That ability to focus your intention, your energy, your mind. And then, let your energy follow that. And then, your Blood will follow that because Blood follows Qi. That's how you do a Qi Gong practise. That's how you do even when you practise the medicine. You have to be so focused on so present because you're conducting the flow of Qi and the flow of Blood. You're giving Shen to that practise, whether it's your Qi Gong practise or your healing practise or your herbal practise.   Tahnee: (15:52) So intention is such an important part of what we do of Shen because it's bringing Shen into your life.   Mason: (15:59) And guys, when we're looking at Shen, the mind is put in there in terms of the definition, within the definition. And it's kind of like the mind is definitely a tool used in the personality. It's something that's used in order to express our personality, process what's going on in life so that we can gain more and more wisdom, when Tahns talking about being there and being a practitioner bringing Shen to the table.   Mason: (16:26) In order to offer a healing space for someone, people around you, be a good person, be less of an asshole, I think we'd all agree that continuing to cultivate our virtuous nature, which isn't an easy thing to do but it is considered a dividend of developing your Shen, that you cultivate those that are associated with strong Shen. Forgiveness, compassion, love, like deep love, deep gratitude, and the capacity to really have that virtuous nature be a part of yourself.   Mason: (17:07) And so, the mind and Shen have an interesting relationship. Because if you are extremely Shen deficient, and if you're shying away from that part of yourself which is more than just the physical, then you see the mind take over the show more and more. And therefore, you move into this place of the way that you get virtuous, you have less... You put a glass ceiling on yourself, I find, in terms of your capacity to really tap into your higher self. And over years and decades of work, have that higher consciousness emerge through your organ systems and be embodied so that forgiveness and that love and that gratitude is something that's just... You don't have to think about it. It's just there, and it's just dripping from you. And that's when you see that in 90 year-olds and 100 year-olds.   Mason: (18:02) They just come to work, and they're just legends. And they're just beautiful white lights to be around. And you see when you don't do that work or don't allow that more mystical aspect of yourself that the mind can't grasp, whether you really want to go into Daoist thought or be religious or spiritual or whatever it is, it doesn't matter. Just let go, just that little bit. Then the mind needs to go into morality.   Mason: (18:23) And so, you do the right thing and be forgiving. Whereas, Shen is where you start to dissolve any sense of right and wrong. And when you can move into that place and get to that, when you can get away from wrong and right, you really do have an opportunity to discover that part of yourself which is virtuous that's outside of the morality and the right and wrong of what you're current clique is telling you, how you should be and how you should be a good person.   Tahnee: (18:53) That reminds me of Rumi, "Out beyond the idea of right doing and wrong doing, there is a field, and I will meet you there." It's just like my teacher says the more spiritually aware you become, the less you'll subscribe to cancel culture and woke movements and all of this stuff because we start to see that everything, depending on your perspective, exists in shades of grey. There's no... I could say I'm right, but I could just as easily say you're right, really if I start to think about it.   Tahnee: (19:27) I think one thing I wanted to quickly make the distinction on too is the mind as in the brain, and the mind as in the Heart. Because in Daoist thought, the Heart is the mind, but it's not how we think about mind. So we think about the cognitive machine that whirls around in our heads which is more associated with the Kidneys. In Chinese medicine, it's called the Sea of Marrow. So it's literally an extension-   Mason: (19:54) The brain.   Tahnee: (19:55) Yes, so the brain is literally an extension of the marrow in your bones. It's kind of this blood-filled goopy thing floating around in your skull. And if you think about your skull as being a bone, it could really be the marrow because it's literally encased in bone on most sides. But yeah, the Heart is more the perceiving mind that is beyond that logical idea of things being rational. Because if you've ever had even a kind of heart-based experience, it's not a rational experience. It's sublime, and it's feeling-based. And it's intuitive, and it's everything that the mind is not.   Tahnee: (20:37) So there's this... I guess the best analogy I have is from yoga, but it's this idea that yeah, we have the functions of the mind which are useful and essential. We can't get through life without them, and great, but we don't want to live there and limit ourselves to that. We want to remember that there's this bigger self that is perceiving all of this and living all of this as well, and that can hold all of this even though the little mind might not think it can.   Tahnee: (21:05) And that to me, is sort of what Shen and the Heart hold in our... No matter how much weird shit goes on around us or what traumas we experience, there's this part of us that's bigger than all of that that can hold it. Like I said, the language I have for this is more out of yoga than out of Daoism, but I've seen this stuff in the Daoist texts as well. From working with Mantak Chia, I know that he also speaks about these things too. That's kind of the big, capital S, self. So that's what the Heart really projects, I suppose, and holds for us in this lifetime.   Tahnee: (21:40) So it takes us out of this small s, selfish self that has greed and wants to be pissed off at someone and wants to be right, and wants to be at war with the world in some ways. The best example of that I think of is a meta-meditation, like a Buddhist where you make all beings be happy. And then, make people that hate be happy, people that are evil be happy.   Tahnee: (22:04) It's this kind of practise where you practise being grateful and being compassionate to people you would normally not like to yourself, which is a massive thing for a lot of people. "can I truly be loved and be happy?" So I just wanted to distinguish between the mind and the brain which we would naturally link to as Westerners, having been raised in our culture and the mind to be the Heart, which from an Eastern perspective, is a little bit more out there and broad and big.   Mason: (22:34) Yeah. Well the taking of Shen herbs, I'm glad you brought that up. And just to keep it really simple, it is associated with the Shen herbs if you are feeling what we call that monkey mind, you'll find that through developing Shen and through taking Shen herbs and focusing on bringing your virtuous nature through. I find it to become evident, we all have this experience. But especially we can think about having a chip on our shoulder.   Mason: (23:05) In business, it's the best dojo, having resent towards competitors or someone that's wronged me. I'm not saying it takes... Forgiveness isn't something that just is done. The capacity needs to be developed. And over the years, I've experienced that nature of, "Do I really want to live with this resentment of someone because they're ripping this off, or they're not doing it the way that I think they should be doing it?"   Mason: (23:36) And it's the classic, spiritual one-on-one lesson that you're the one that needs to live with it. I don't need to live with it. But in order to calm yourself enough, just quiet that monkey mind. And as well, go through and do that deep work over decades and decades so that the monkey mind can be quiet to begin with. You see the pay off. You can see why the Daoists are like, "Yeah look, of course we need a strong body. We start with Jing, and we start with a strong body so that the Qi can move, and we want to cultivate lots of Qi and life."   Mason: (24:10) But what's the point if you don't develop your Shen and your virtuous nature? The reason we do that, the reason we want to be athletic and athletically apt is because you see a lot of people say, for example, a lot of people whose parent here. You'll see they'll get to 60, say 65 or 70, and there is just no way they've got the Jing and the Qi to get in there and do some deep psychological work and create forgiveness or get off the right or wrong. So just say politically, be able to get to the point where they can open up and take more of a broad view of life for their capacity to be happy, not have a monkey mind, not have resentfulness.   Mason: (24:54) And therefore, it kind of goes a little bit further with the dysfunction, if you don't develop your Shen. All of the sudden, you're stuck with your dysfunctions. You haven't developed a virtuous nature, and therefore, you become one that projects onto children, other family members, society, "This is what's wrong. This is why I'm right." Or you become extremely timid and don't have the capacity to stand for yourself and express your spirit. And it's an absolute, to be really blunt.   Mason: (25:24) I don't think it's right or wrong that people end up that way. But when you look at an objective level, if you have people who don't go into maturation, which is what Shen is, a lot of wisdom, then you become a burden. Right? And you become someone that projects, and it's not my job to be like, "That person's making me a victim."   Mason: (25:47) That's not what I'm saying. But if I'm saying from myself, if I got to the point where I'm 70 and I've got my anger issues that I haven't really worked on, "I don't like being judged," I know how much of a problem I'm going to be and a drain I'm going to be for Aiya. And that's really a harrowing feeling, and the Daoist and all these wise cultures saw that's the point. I don't care how big your muscles are, how much Qi you've got in your Spleen, if you can't really embody compassion, then what was it for?   Tahnee: (26:22) That's interesting because this phase of life... I think I'm right on this. I think earlier, when you're a little kid, you're in the Wood phase. And we're in the Fire phase now which is really about the soul learning through living and learning through trial and error and making mistakes. And it is kind of like a student-ship of the soul, ideally. And it's interesting given our culture how little people invest in their own spiritual development, I guess. I'm sure the people in these podcasts are slightly different, but in general, it's just not really a priority for people until they get a lot older. And like you said, the baggage is so heavy by then, yoga talks about every experience we have creating an impression. And if you dig the same line 100 times in the sand, it becomes a very deep line, and it's very hard to get rid of.   Tahnee: (27:12) And I think that's these kind of... You see people as they age becoming really stuck on certain ideas or certain things just loop and loop. It's because early on, when they had the opportunity, I think, to become conscious of that and to start to shift their perspective and their behaviour and their patterns, they've chosen not to do that. And the Bhagavad Gita talks about you want to put the reins on the horse and teach the horse. And then, learn to control the horse so it pulls the chariot in the right direction, not too fast, not too slow. And that's what I think this Shen stage of life is about.   Tahnee: (27:48) And then, we hit the declining... Oh sorry. I think we're always ascending. We hit the declining years, and then we hit the deep wisdom years in the 70's. And all of the things have to happen for us to end up there. And I think that's where-   Mason: (28:03) A lot of opportunity's lost.   Tahnee: (28:04) Yeah. If you've just hustled and made sure there's money and done your thing and whatever, you've not spent a lot of time on yourself and worked through your own stuff that you've brought through, which we all have. That's part of living. Then, you're going to end up in a bit of a shit fight later on, I think. And I think that's a lot of the people I talk to with menopause and when I spoke to Jane Hardwicke Collins about this. We talked about how women have that transition period in their late 40's, early 50's where suddenly their life catches up with them. And they realise all the places where they've bent over and not given to themselves first, and where they've been taken for granted or prioritised the things that weren't in service to them.   Tahnee: (28:53) That's the teaching of that time, and it's an invitation. The Blood has stopped. The Blood remains in the body, and that's when the Shen really rises in a woman if she's willing to meet it. But it means looking at all the things that are uncomfortable and all the things... Shen isn't all just sunshine and rainbows unfortunately. Sometimes for it to shine through, like you're saying, we have to do a bit of work. Peel away some of the layers.   Tahnee: (29:15) And that's why meditation is correlated with Shen building. It's being able to sit there. And again, I don't know the Daoist language for this, but in yoga, you've got the higher mind and the lower mind. And the lower mind is always there. It's not like you're calling it, the monkey mind. It's just monkeys are monkeys. No point trying to stop a monkey, but you don't want to live from that place. You want to live like you're watching the monkey and going, "What a funny monkey," and giving it a banana and being kind to it, but knowing that monkeys will do what monkeys will do.   Tahnee: (29:48) And living in this higher place that takes a bit of practise because A, it's not common in our culture. It's not really celebrated to not be easily reactive, and people love drama. How much do people love drama? Netflix is just drama to the enth degree, and it's fun.   Mason: (30:07) Drama's fun.   Tahnee: (30:07) It is fun. But it also catches us, and it spirals us through these emotional things. And it really can be damaging to our health.   Mason: (30:15) Well it's distracting. I think the biggest thing, if you start looking at the fact that you've got... You're saying we're in our 30's. We've got a good 10 years to dive in there and maybe do some therapy or do some... For me, it's do some integrating from a crazy amount of plant medicine I did in my late 20's and actually allow that to maturate into something. Consistently catch myself, consistently make decisions about where I dramatise. And just get in there and get really gritty. And you only have a certain amount of time.   Mason: (30:48) I'm not saying we're not allowed to do anything that's completely entertaining or total drama-dom.   Tahnee: (30:53) Well it's supposed to burn.   Mason: (30:54) Yeah, exactly.   Tahnee: (30:55) It's meant to be fun as well.   Mason: (30:55) Exactly. Oh, god to be meant to be fun. But in terms of just how distracted we let ourselves go, without going into morality, it's right or it's wrong kind of thing. But at some point, you go, "Shit, I better get on the horse here and develop myself a little bit."   Mason: (31:14) So the nature of meditation, the nature of why the Daoists saw Shen herbs... These are the herbs that tonify the organs associated with Shen, mainly the Heart, Heart Fire. But also, we're seeing the correlation between Shen tonics, Liver-Wood tonics. And then, you see some supporting herbs in there that are doing some work on the Spleen and Lung, and then, the Kidneys of course. Because you were talking about the lower mind and the upper mind, being the Kidney associated with that monkey mind.   Mason: (31:52) You can't really correlate the way the mind is seen the West with the way the Daoists see it.   Tahnee: (31:56) Oh yeah, where the brain is the Kidney.   Mason: (31:58) Exactly. So if the brain is the Kidney, and then the Heart is our higher thinking and our Shen, that's why there's herbs like polygala root that are in the SHEN blend that are actually running along the psychic vessel, the penetrating vessel from the Kidney to the Heart in order to connect those two styles of thought and bring sexual energy and bring a virtuous way of relating to our sexual energy, and merging that with the heart. It's also called our Will Strengthener, and it brings pure will power to our way of being.   Mason: (32:31) So you'll see herbs like polygala being some of the most potent Shen tonics because it brings a calming effect, not because it's a carminative, not because it down regulates the nervous system, but because you come integrated in a way. That without, you're not going to be able to spiritually develop yourself because you've got this drive and this sexual hunger and this power to create. Yet, that's not merging necessarily as smoothly as it could with this loving, forgiving, jovial, non-judgmental, non right and wrong, non shame-based way of living.   Mason: (33:06) And so it's really just calming. So these Shen herbs, you can see quite often, you start taking a herb like reishi, many people have felt it, but especially if you take SHEN blend with herbs like polygala. You can immediately feel, due to all the various actions, a calming effect. And that's good, but we're not taking this so you can be calm today. The idea of the SHEN blend and Shen herbs is we're going to be taking them either sporadically or over time. Maybe it's week on, week off, however. I don't know how you're going to take it.   Mason: (33:41) But in conjunction with meditation, doing your work, doing your practise, showing up with self, going to therapy, just being real. Taking that trajectory towards being someone who is, in their older age, able to have a laugh and a sense of humour. When life hits them, have water go off a duck's back. What happens if you lose a million dollars? Are you going to be able to let that go?   Tahnee: (34:06) Well that's the thing with the Heart because it's so much about... So the Heart has four... Normally in Chinese medicine, all the organ systems are in pairs. But the Heart is two pairs, four in total. And it's administrative role of the Triple Burner, the San Jiao, which is about regulating temperature and fluids across the three Dan Tien. So around your Heart-Lungs, around your digestive function, around your reproductive function. So that's one aspect of it.   Tahnee: (34:35) Then you've got the Small Intestine, which is about the ability to be discerning. So that's a really important function of the Heart, not judge but to just discern, to know the difference between what's true and what isn't true, it's own perception, which is assimilative and eliminative, getting rid of, a function of the Small Intestine. And then you've got this pericardium which is this protection around the Heart because the heart gets damaged by our interactions with humans.   Tahnee: (35:06) If we get heartbroken or even if we're just treated poorly in any way, every little cut starts to go deeper and deeper. And so, that's so much of the Fire years. Like I said, the human is also learning to relate and learning to forgive and not be hurt by our interactions with each other and to find the people or the types of people that are going to be the most suited to us, and this idea of remaining open-hearted throughout our lives.   Tahnee: (35:40) And that's something you see again in older people that have been hurt. They close off from love. They close off from receiving any goodness from anyone because they've been hurt once, or twice, or three times. So that's one of the offerings of working with the Heart energy and Fire energy, to stay in the space of open-hearted-ness and to remember that the Heart is protected. It has this whole meridian designed just to protect it from overheating, from being hurt, from being damaged.   Tahnee: (36:09) And when we do get broken-hearted, to honour that, and to let ourselves time to heal instead of rushing on. So I think that sometimes the Shen can get hidden when we've become so damaged that we won't let ourselves be seen.   Mason: (36:25) So heart-broken.   Tahnee: (36:26) Yeah. It's a classic thing, but this is just our relating and our ability. If you think about a saint, they're able to sit with anyone and not judge. The leper comes to Jesus, and he's like, "I love you. I love you like my child." The rich billionaire, fat person, the whatever, everyone comes, and they don't care. They sit there, and they love them. And there's no judgement , and there's no story.   Tahnee: (36:54) They accept things for what they are, and that's something that is an offering, I guess, of this Heart energy. So yeah, that's what I thought would be a useful thing to remember. As well, it's our relating and our inter-relating, and our joy in being social and being with others and being a part of a tribe. And again, it's what these years are about. Finding our tribe, finding the people that we want to be with, finding our place in the world, finding the people we want to share our lives with.   Mason: (37:27) And remember that there's no definition. We're not looking at important... I can feel Tahns is really honing in and giving you an example of what the pure energy of Shen is terms of a saint. That is within us, but integrated with all the other parts of our body. That's there and can be purely expressed while you're a smart ass, while you're just enjoying what's... You don't have to walk around being-   Tahnee: (37:51) Yeah. Whatever your personality is.   Mason: (37:52) Exactly.   Tahnee: (37:53) And most saints are very funny, give them half a chance. That's Buddha, you have a sense of humour. I think people forget that the cosmic joke is very funny.   Mason: (38:07) One of the virtuous things when you're high in Shen is extreme political incorrectness.   Tahnee: (38:13) I've never met a Daoist that wasn't funny, ever. They've all been f-ing hilarious.   Mason: (38:18) Uh-huh (affirmative). So Shen herbs, the way they're going to generally work is to bring a stability to the way that Fire rages. Remember, Tanz was talking about being comfortable within your body. It's like the fire in the hearth, the fire in our home, that is the Heart. And if it's raging too high or if it's erratic, it's going hot and cold. And when you think about it, you're sitting next to that fire. The flames are licking out. You're not going to be able to sit next to it.   Mason: (38:49) Now, that's your Shen. Your Shen is you, your Spirit, sitting next to the fire in that home. And if it's raging, it's going to be start and a bit fiery itself. And it's not going to be able to sit there and be calm. You're not going to be able to have calm emotions. You're going to have erratic emotions. You're going to have an erratic mindset. You're going to be cracked out.   Mason: (39:07) If it's too cold, how are you going to really... You're really cold long enough, you are not going to allow joy in your life. You're not going to be able to express it. And that's what Shen is about as well. So a lot of these Shen herbs are about bringing a stability to that Fire. And that stability, a lot of the time, is coming directly through the Heart, maybe moving the water Qi from under the heart in the case of spirit poria.   Mason: (39:33) Pearl, a great stabiliser, especially because it's a real cold herb for the Liver Yin. Therefore, it's going to ensure that we don't have this excess Fire, Yang, within the Liver-Wood, which is going to create these brittle branches that are then going to excessively feed the Fire very fast. We have suppleness and cooling within the Liver-Wood so that we don't have as much Fire. And Wood being fed into the Fire; therefore, we're more stable.   Mason: (40:01) And then the other way that they work, they're basically nourishing of the Shen. So the reishi mushroom, the asparagus root, the albizia flower, these are Shen nourishers. And so, that's literally about cultivating that Fire and going and building in a way that's going to be burning appropriately for the season. And this is why our practises, our spiritual practises, our meditation, the way that we're interacting with nature and our emotions, it needs to be seasonal. Because you remember, everything is really coming down to us developing Shen.   Mason: (40:40) And different seasons, you need your Fire to be doing different things that requires you acting in very different ways. Remember, all organs and practises are essentially serving the emperor of the Heart eventually. So just being aware of that and remembering Shen, developing your own Shen. Getting to know you and your Shen, you're going to keep on hitting brick walls in terms of being the way you think you should be, the way you think is virtuous. And you might have to go and do some... You might have to have some real dark nights of the soul as you go along. And they get easier as you go along to really learn, "Well, that's just not going to happen. This is the nature of who I am and how I act. I'm going to have to go and deal with it and express myself in a way that isn't the Disney version or the picture-perfect way."   Mason: (41:23) And if you can do that on the other side of it, there's this ease where all the crap, more and more... It's never perfect, I'm being idealistic. But more and more, all the crap falls off you like water off a duck's back. And there's some things with us, and now it's a funny time to bring up relationships since I just put that post up on Instagram about us quitting SuperFeast and being an official power couple.   Mason: (41:49) But one thing I've just noticed, like most relationships, it's always the amount of Shen you can develop in a relationship... And it's chalk and cheese if you look four years ago to something you'd say, and I'd take it personally and bring it up in a hostile way. Verse now, if you bring it up, a lot of the time it can just be, like I said, water off a duck's back.   Mason: (42:15) And the same with you. I can feel adjustments to the way that you say things, and I feel less and less when you bring them up. I don't feel them as injustices. Not all the time, but I can bring things up a little, with a little bit less charge and a little bit more forgiveness. And I tried doing it the right way for a couple of years and being a better man, and it just wasn't working. I had to go in and be like, "Far out, what's actually going on here?"   Mason: (42:42) And sure enough, after a while, as everyone's experienced with relationships and at work and with their children, things start smoothing out a little bit more. And since we've all had the experience of seeing ourselves develop and potentially becoming less erratic or less timid or something like that, you just go, "Wow, I've got the opportunity to take this and run with it, make this the main driver of my life to make sure I end up as an 80 or 90 year-old that's super functional and fun to be around, or at least carries a little bit of wisdom, has the energy and the capacity to share my wisdom and be a joy to be around."   Mason: (43:20) That's why the Shen herbs... That's why reishi was depicted in Heaven by the Daoists. It's why the Shen herbs were considered... They were the most revered. And it's why they were the ones that would eventually be consumed the most. You can just get yourself and your lifestyle set where you're developing your Jing, and you're not leaking a battery. Easy. You've just got your sleep practises, cool. Eventually, you don't have to think about that quite as much.   Mason: (43:50) And the same as Qi. You've got your practises. You've got your Qi Gong. You're allowing your emotions to move smoothly. You're eating an appropriate amount, appropriate for the body. You've got deep breathing going on. You're spending time in the sun. You're charging. You're developing that Qi. Then, you're free to just go in and actually just consistently work on your Shen. It's always where it ends up. It seems boring in the beginning of the journey. But at some point, you're like, "God, this is where it's at."   Tahnee: (44:26) Boring to whom? I think it's such a pleasant outcome, I suppose. When you start to feel like you've integrated and settled and grounded, and obviously a continuing process. But I remember the first time I took reishi. I think I took it to... It wouldn't have been vipassan. It must have been a non-vipassana, but it was a 10-day retreat. I think it was a tantric retreat in Thailand. But just the grace of the herb with the practises, it was just so beautiful and really connecting to yourself in that way, I think there's something really beautiful about when you start to experience your Shen. It's definitely not boring. I think there's an ideological thing, perhaps it's a little bit virtuous sounding. And a bit like, "Oh."   Mason: (45:27) It sounds wanky.   Tahnee: (45:28) Yeah. I get that.   Mason: (45:29) Me too.   Tahnee: (45:29) I definitely thought that as well sometimes. But I think the lived experience of it is really beautiful. And when you're living in that place, even if it's for periods of time as it becomes more integrated, you tend to sort of move in and out of your own evolution. I'm sure many of you can relate to that. But yeah, there's this real beauty and grace in sitting and resting in that kind of awareness of the Heart. You look at all the traditions from the Christian traditions, I may argue that they all came from the same place, possibly the Vedas. But they're pointing to this union of fire and water, this Heart, Kidneys, the Daoist example of this.   Tahnee: (46:17) And yeah, when we've nourished ourselves on this level, which many of you have working with Jing herbs, and working with changing lifestyles and building more functional ways of being, and you start with herbs. Herbs in the SHEN blend or just Shen herbs in general, it's a very quick and powerful transition, I suppose, into that more conscious state, without sounding like a total douche.   Mason: (46:48) But you're easy to be around.   Tahnee: (46:49) Yeah.   Mason: (46:50) Way easier to be around. And the whole factor, we talk about personality. Because we're not talking about an idealistic way of being or a spiritual way of being.   Tahnee: (47:00) It's just you.   Mason: (47:01) It's just you. That's the whole point of it.   Tahnee: (47:03) Without the bullshit.   Mason: (47:04) Without the bullshit. We can't reiterate that enough. And I think everyone has to go through their experience of trying to develop themselves towards an ideological way of being. To think, "I'm going to be accepted by this little cult here if I act in this way." And that doesn't just count towards spiritual hand-on-heart stuff, which for some people, that's-   Tahnee: (47:25) Their truest expression.   Mason: (47:28) Exactly. But it's in all manner of ways. The guy who's working on Wall Street and thinks that he's gotta be a hustler and work that way his entire life. It's same deal. Its just like, "Pop your head out of ideology a little bit. Maybe you have to stop being so Jing deficient to begin with. Get your lifestyle where I can see you can have some Qi. And all of sudden, you've got the energy to actually get some Shen coming, developing, and cracking through."   Mason: (47:50) And that's what the Shen character is, the written character. It's the sun, moon, and stars with a rope coming up to them. The two hands pulling down to signify the connecting of the supernatural and that part of ourselves that's way beyond this.   Tahnee: (48:09) Yeah, highest consciousness.   Mason: (48:11) Bringing it down here and merging it with us. So you're going to like this blend, guys. It tastes bloody delicious.   Tahnee: (48:19) Which is lucky because Shen herbs are bitter usually.   Mason: (48:22) Yeah. And of course, we've got reishi in there as a big one. It's the queen of the mushies. So you can already see, it's going to be working on the nervous system, immune system, Kidneys, Liver health. It's going to be doing a bunch of other things. But in terms of calming the monkey mind, bringing some calmness to yourself, less erraticness in the emotions, giving you the capacity to express a bit more happiness and develop that Shen and everything else that we've talked about. Go deeper in meditation. For some of you, it's going to be really, really good for sleep.   Mason: (48:53) We've had a couple of people who have just been atrocious with their sleep. And Shen's been able to come in quite immediately and help them go super deep with continued usage. For others, it's not a sleep blend. For some people, when you get your Shen expressing, perhaps too quick sometimes, the dreams can become quite out there. Some people love it.   Tahnee: (49:20) Especially if you're Blood deficient, I think.   Mason: (49:22) Yeah.   Tahnee: (49:23) Yeah. It's good to check up with a practitioner if you're not sure.   Mason: (49:28) Don't try and treat any kind of psychosis or extreme insomnia or depression or anything with this SHEN blend. And we're not just saying that as a disclosure.   Tahnee: (49:41) Disclaimer, yeah.   Mason: (49:42) I said disclosure. No, that's like a UFO podcast is next. Talk to your practitioner. But the Shen herbs can be used in conjunction with other treatments you're doing. But just go slow with it. But reishi's in there, so of course, that's just opening the heart wide open. I'm very excited that a bunch of you... Another major herb in the blend is the albizia flower. It comes from the tree of happiness.   Mason: (50:05) This flower is an absolute shining light. You just smile. I smile when I look at it. It's just a great mood elevator. And then we've got asparagus root as the third major herb in there.   Tahnee: (50:22) She's a legend.   Mason: (50:23) Yeah, shatavari's a legend. And so, there's a lot going on, integrate hormone regulator, integrate Jing tonic in itself. But asparagus root was used by the Daoists in order to allow us to fly. And so, with our meditations and in life, the idea is in life, if something happens and shit's hitting the fan, you're going to be able to fly up, rise above the situation. Look down, get a more of a bird's eye view so that you're not just reacting to it down on this animalistic level, this reptilian level.   Mason: (50:52) And it's the same in your meditations. You bring this buoyancy so you can fly through yourself with greater ease and just get a couple of, "Ah yeah, all right. I can see how I'm doing that and doing that." Such a great herb. But that's the one sometimes people... I don't think you like that at night.   Tahnee: (51:09) I was laughing because it makes me fly at night, only if I take large doses. I remember taking three teaspoons one night, and I was up till about 4:00 in the morning.   Mason: (51:19) Jesus.   Tahnee: (51:19) Do not do that at home.   Mason: (51:21) Oh I'm sorry. I wasn't Jesus in exclamation. I was just like, "I'm pretty sure that's what Jesus did when he went to India and studied his spiritual practises." But whatever.   Mason: (51:29) And then, we've got some more support, a secondary, bringing in spirit poria. So spirit poria, medicinal mushroom, bringing in that secondary medicinal mushroom magic.   Tahnee: (51:41) Not to be confused with regular poria.   Mason: (51:41) No, it's a much more precious, I guess I'd say. Poria's one of my favourite herbs by far. Spirit poria is the sclerotium that makes up about sometimes 10, 20% of the actual... You break off the fruiting body-   Tahnee: (52:03) Which is regular poria.   Mason: (52:04) Which is regular poria growing off the pine. The mushroom was inoculated into the pine, then put under dirt. But right there, normally you can't get access to the mycelium, the body, the inside. But with spirit poria, that is just that 10% or maybe 20% where it's emerging from the pine. And it's in that transformation. It's in that process of transforming the pine.   Mason: (52:31) And you can also get to access to the body, which you can't get in the wild of any other herb. And so, it's got this otherworldly quality. So it's got all the Qi, Spleen tonifying-   Tahnee: (52:43) Functions.   Mason: (52:44) Water metabolism functions and immunological functions. But it's just got this additional bringing of transformational light into the Heart.   Tahnee: (52:54) So just a quick fun fact, because chaga is also a sclerotium. So that means they aren't true mushrooms in terms of the actual expressed fruiting body, which is what you would normally get. So just for people that are interested. Because I think a lot of the time, we say chaga mushroom, we say spirit poria mushroom. And we say that because it's easier than saying chaga sclerotium and explaining that to someone. But this is what makes these particular herbs really special, chaga and spirit poria because you can't really cultivate sclerotium.   Tahnee: (53:33) Chaga's never been able to be cultivated. Spirit poria isn't cultivated in a lab or anything like that like you can get with most medicinal mushrooms. They can grow them in an artificial environment. You can't do that with these guys. So these are cultivated in an outdoor setting, like how they would grow in nature. So just a fun fact.   Mason: (53:52) We'll put a video of me-   Tahnee: (53:55) Harvesting.   Mason: (53:57) Yeah. At the poria farm. And I explain what spirit poria is, and you can actually see me pointing out. So go to the show notes for that.   Tahnee: (54:04) And they grow in tropical parts.   Mason: (54:06) Yeah. Yunnan.Yunnan provence. There was a hotter region, they were growing in the middle.   Tahnee: (54:13) In the grass. In the middle, yeah.   Mason: (54:14) In that middle belt of China, but it poria was becoming more popular. And the local government or the provincial government, wasn't regulating the harvesting of pine. And so, 95% of the herbal world doesn't give a shit about that, and they continue to do that there. But those doing Di Dao, who were doing true Di Dao, part of Di Dao is sustainability or leaving it intact. And so, it moved to secondary preference. And we moved to a secondary preference, which is Yunnan Province. It's still Di Dao. It's still said, "You go get your herbs from Yunnan Province in this micro-climate in the ancient text."   Mason: (54:56) But it's just not our first-   Tahnee: (54:58) Preference.   Mason: (54:58) Preference. Which is as always, guys, with the sourcing. We're going to prioritise the environment.   Tahnee: (55:03) Longevity of it. Yep.   Mason: (55:05) And so, yeah. So the farmers who I was meeting, they moved their whole operations and their whole family. And they moved to Yunnan. And there, the government's like crazy regulatory. And that's why there's a cap on how big your farm can be because you can only go and harvest so much wild pine. And they send helicopters over. You've got to prove and show that you've used all your tags. And they go through, and basically if they find that you've taken any other additional pine, then you're going to get some serious fines.   Tahnee: (55:36) Fine-age. And I think too, when you think about what sclerotium is, it does have this part of the tree still in it. That's where a lot of these medicines come from. Because if you look at pine and you look at birch were chaga grows, they're both very potent trees in their own rights. Spiritually, the pine is the Daoists' favourite bloody tree. I talked to Master Chia about the pine. He loves a pine. But incredibly medicinal trees as well.   Tahnee: (56:07) And then, even oak, which is what lion's mane is grown on.   Mason: (56:10) And reishi.   Tahnee: (56:11) Yeah, really medicinal trees. So for us, having that tree energy is really important.   Mason: (56:19) Tree Qi.   Tahnee: (56:19) Yeah. So we don't work with grain growing or anything like that which is, again, another thing that's commonly done in cultivated environments. So you've just got to think about what the energetics are going to be of these herbs when you consume them. So again, another fun fact.   Mason: (56:38) Yeah. Then we start getting to the assistant herbs. Pearl, I've talked about. That is a micro-ground pearl.   Tahnee: (56:50) Yeah. So it's not an extract. Sometimes people get confused, but it's literally ground up pearls.   Mason: (56:51) It's ground up pearls, very ancient medicine, very mineral rich, energetically Cold. Just a beautiful Shen tonic, so calming to the mind, and one of the most beautifying. It's a really beautifying blend as well for the skin. Between the asparagus root, the pearl, and all the Blood building herbs that we've got in there, plus no scrunching with anger. No crow's feet. That's what happens when you're a bit more happy, but pearl, and yes-   Tahnee: (57:22) Just smile lines.   Mason: (57:22) As always. Yeah, just smile lines. And pearl, as always, sustainably harvested, because we've had a few people ask where they're farmed. In the wild.   Tahnee: (57:28) In fresh water.   Mason: (57:29) Yeah, fresh water. Polygala, I talked about. It's one of my favourite herbs, the will strengthener, connecting the Kidney sexual energy, the Waters, as Tahns was saying before. The ideal behind this life is taking the Water, mixing it with the Fire, creating alchemy. And polygala is one of those herbs that is taking the Water of the Kidneys and connecting it with the Fire of the Heart. And of course, the Kidneys are the regulators, kind of like the grandma of the Heart. Just clipping it, we need Water in order to keep that Fire under control and keep it grounded and rooted.   Mason: (58:06) So I'm very excited that you're all going to be taking polygala when you take this blend. Got rehmania in there as a Blood builder. Beautiful Shen tonic in itself, but especially grounding in bringing that Yin Jing Water energy and that building of Blood so that we can get the Shen moving around.   Tahnee: (58:22) Love rehmania.   Mason: (58:22) Rehmania's amazing. And then, some aged citrus peel. That's in there as a Spleen-Lung tonic as an augmentor of the Spleen, Stomach, and Lung to ensure smooth integration of the other herbs. It's a beautiful assistant herb. And then, the other assistant which goes in, which is a pretty typical one traditionally in Shen with other Shen herbs, is longan. It's a beautiful Blood and Qi tonic. Heart and Spleen energy, so longan is used in smaller amounts. It's considered in its own right, the longan fruit, as a Shen tonic just to be taken on its own.   Mason: (59:03) In terms of when you put it in there as an assistant to other Shen tonics, you see this amplification of the nourishing of the Heart. It's palpable. I've tried it without the longan, and then with. And it's super palpable.   Tahnee: (59:22) So that's probably why it tastes good because longans are delicious.   Mason: (59:26) Longans are delicious. That's the dragon eye energy coming through, guys. So it's also a Qi tonic. So it supports the Blood moving through the channels because you can't just build the Blood. You need the Qi tonics there moving it around.   Tahnee: (59:43) It's a really good women's herb too. And it is kind of like a lychee if you've never seen a longan before.   Mason: (59:43) A little lychee.   Tahnee: (59:43) Yeah, like a little, round, brown lychee. But they grow around this area and in the tropics.   Mason: (59:51) You find them at Harris Farm when they're in season.   Tahnee: (59:56) There you go. Harris Farm.   Mason: (59:58) Yeah, I know.   Tahnee: (59:59) First time they've been mentioned on the SuperFeast.   Mason: (01:00:00) Yeah. I know because every time... My mum was at her old place, Harris Farm was up the road.   Tahnee: (01:00:07) Yep. I've been there.   Mason: (01:00:10) Yeah. You've been there.   Tahnee: (01:00:11) They have some good organic stuff actually.   Mason: (01:00:13) Boronia Park.   Tahnee: (01:00:14) Shout out Boronia Park.   Mason: (01:00:15) Yeah, shot out Harris Farm, Boronia Park yeiiiiiwwww! Down in Sidney there. Mom's moved on up the road to Putney since then. But guys, any questions let us know, in terms of taking the Shen. I personally like it in the morning. It sets me up for a really calm, it's not calm as in a floppiness. When you have your Shen tonics coming through, there's a calmness. But I feel really my value, I feel principled in that sense, just to give you that little bit of a sense of how I feel. It's not just calm and just like, "Yes. Sweet, man. My thoughts are slow."   Mason: (01:00:56) No, no, no. My thoughts are kind of like... My mind is calm. My thoughts are able to come through real clearly. I feel crispy, and I feel my principles. I feel virtuous in hopefully a non-egoic way.   Tahnee: (01:01:10) You're tuned in, like the radio channel's clear, it's coming through. You've got that connection. I think that's the feeling of being dialled in to yourself, which I think is not a... The calm is from the steadiness of the mind instead of the doubting mind, the kind of the mind that is not completely satisfied is a very agitated state to be in. And so when we're calm, when we're just clear and we're getting the frequency right for ourselves, it's a really beautiful feeling.   Mason: (01:01:45) Mm-hmm (affirmative).   Tahnee: (01:01:45) I think, and I agree. I personally like it in the morning, I've taken it at night while we're trialling it. I didn't have any issues with it, but I just feel like it's a really nice way to start the day.   Mason: (01:01:55) Yeah.   Tahnee: (01:01:57) Beautiful intention to set.   Mason: (01:01:59) And it's good. It's like smoothies. Adjusting hot water with a touch of milk and honey works that way. Goes in with any teas. You can do hot chocolates and coffees with it and smoothies with it. Same deal. If you're doing it at night... As I said, I've got to reiterate, for some people, they didn't love it in the morning. Some people were just like, "Nah, I didn't really need to be that... " They didn't need that Shen tonifying steadying.   Tahnee: (01:02:23) Stillness.   Mason: (01:02:23) But at night, was when they really benefited and really were able to go deep into a Yin state for them. So find, pick your time. Pick what's appropriate for you. Chamomile tea at night, beauty. You're laughing.   Mason: (01:02:37) Hit us up if you've got any questions.   Tahnee: (01:02:38) Yeah, really excited to hear your feedback your all, and experiences and all those things. So let us know. We love hearing from you guys, and-   Mason: (01:02:49) Shen on.   Tahnee: (01:02:49) Shen on. I also say [shu-yage 01:02:51], bon voyage.

Welcome to our final stop in our journey! It's been fun riding with everyone but now it's time to for our final stop at the Pericardium and the Triple energizer (or Triple burner or San Jiao). With a name that long, you bet there's going to be just as long as an explanation on what that is.  For now, Seatbelts everyone!Will this be a normal field trip? No way! Join the yangsters as we finish our journey back to the heart and sanjiao!

Today on the pod, we're joined by Jost Sauer. Jost Sauer is an author, acupuncturist, therapist and all round legendary character who has a deep passion for health and fitness. Jost's loves to share his ongoing discoveries about making lifestyle your best medicine through his books, blogs, articles, workshops and retreats. Jost share's his experience using the principals of the Tao to create health and vigour in the body, mind and spirit. Jump in folks, it's a fascinating, mind expanding ride.   Jost and Mason explore: Jost's journey from drugs to the Tao. The power of the Taoist practices. The importance of integration when "enlightened" states are experienced. Yin and Yang theory. The TCM body clock. The matrix of the Qi cycle. Herbal alchemy and personal practice -  "I use my practice to correct symptoms, and I'd do the herbs to nourish my soul."   Who is Jost Sauer? Jost (aka the lifestyle medicine man) was born in Germany in 1958 and is an ex-hippie, anarchist and drug runner turned acupuncturist, popular author and healthy lifestyle expert. His background includes competitive skiing, body-building, and ironman training, but after post-drug suicidal depression led him to martial arts and the study of TCM, he discovered the power of Qi, the cycle of Qi of Chinese medicine and that a natural rhythmic lifestyle holds the secrets to anti-ageing, health and success. Jost has been using lifestyle therapeutically for his clients for over 20 years. Jost is an expert in Chinese Medicine, which he lectured in for over a decade at the Australian College of Natural Medicine, he has been running successful health clinics since 1991, initially specialising in addiction recovery, and has treated tens of thousands of clients. His passion is sharing his ongoing discoveries about making lifestyle your best medicine through his books, blogs, articles, workshops and retreats.    Resources:  Jost Website Jost Facebook Jost Instagram Jost Youtube   Q: How Can I Support The SuperFeast Podcast? A: Tell all your friends and family and share online! We’d also love it if you could subscribe and review this podcast on iTunes. Or  check us out on Stitcher :)! Plus  we're on Spotify! We got you covered on all bases ;P   Check Out The Transcript Here:   Mason: (00:00) Jost, thanks so much for being here, man.   Jost: (00:01) Thank you. It's amazing.   Mason: (00:02) It's so good to meet you man. And it was so cool. Everyone here might be a little bit of a gap between the interviews, but I've just had Nick Perry on the podcast this morning and I know I've already told you, but he really wanted me to tell you he's a massive fan of yours. He was-   Jost: (00:15) It's awesome to hear that.   Mason: (00:17) Yeah. And I am as well. Let's jump in, in where you first started getting your fascination with Chinese medicine and Taoism. You were just 10 years old, were you saying?   Jost: (00:27) Yes. It was back in 68. I was just 11 years old and I was fascinated into China. China was on my mind, on my radar, and the cultural revolution was big. So, I started writing letters to the Chinese committee and-   Mason: (00:41) Well, what was the Chinese committee?   Jost: (00:44) There was the public affairs committee in which we are running the cultural revolution. They were communists big time. Yeah. And I started expressing my interest and what an amazing philosophy that is. Obviously, I had no idea that cultural revolution and China's philosophy actually got nothing in common.   Mason: (00:58) Yeah.   Jost: (00:59) And I talked about Yin and Yang and all that kind of stuff and how fascinated I am by the magic of it.   Mason: (01:07) How did you learn about Yin and Yang?   Jost: (01:08) Not by these sort of interplay of forces. I was already fascinated by it, because I mean kung-fu started to evolve and came to the West. And so, the whole idea of Yin and Yang, sort of I saw those symbols already, but I didn't really know what it meant but I was drawn to it intuitively. So, some people would say, "It must be past life," whatever. "It most likely is the case, because why would you be interested in it?" Yeah?   Mason: (01:36) Mm-hmm (affirmative).   Jost: (01:36) Because I wasn't really interested in the mundane world. And I grew up in Germany, in Western Germany when post war economy was peaking and everything was about working hard to succeed to get the house and the cars and the prestige. And I said, "No, I don't want this."   Mason: (01:52) Yeah. And you were young, when you got that. Right?   Jost: (01:55) Yeah. I didn't want it. I just always already was dreaming myself being on top of the mind, the magic and the sorceress and evolving the forces from the cosmic and doing sort of martial art fairytales, like what you see this day in crouching tiger. This sort of stuff I dreamed about over and over. But every time I mentioned that to people, obviously everyone said, "Oh, you're just a dream." And so, I realised I can't really talk much about it. And, yeah. I mean, I was 14 and someone gave me hashish, very good quality from Amsterdam, because I lived only one hour away from Amsterdam.   Mason: (02:33) Yeah.   Jost: (02:34) So, I had drugs and then I realised, "Oh, it is a reality." So, obviously I started to explore the drugs. And I got into university, I studied social work, but I also love that psychedelic aspect more and more and more. I moved to Amsterdam when it was 19, 20. And so, I worked there for a while. I did my experience year in social work there in Amsterdam in the Milky Way.   Mason: (03:00) [inaudible 00:03:00]. Nice.   Jost: (03:01) The classic Milky Way where they sell hashish on the ground floor, and then they do counseling on the top floor. It's like the-   Mason: (03:08) ... the whole package.   Jost: (03:10) Yeah, the whole package. Amsterdam in those days, whatever your interest is, there's a business.   Mason: (03:16) Yeah, right.   Jost: (03:17) Whatever you want, someone sells it to you.   Mason: (03:19) Yeah. Okay.   Jost: (03:22) And there were some straight people in those days, but they lived outside Amsterdam. And even the cops, the police, [inaudible 00:03:30] had red hair, henna in there hair, they had earrings. One day we were smoking hashish in the car in my really bumped out VW van and we were in the stop sign and smoking. We couldn't even look through the windows. And we heard a knock at the window. We put the window down, and there was a cop there. And he said, "Hey guys, you can't park here." "Okay, man." So, we kept driving in Amsterdam. So, everything went down. You just do it. So, you explore the psychedelic on every level. So, I really went with it and I wanted more of it. But, exploring more by drugs doesn't work. That was the big learning curve.   Mason: (04:15) How long did it take you to learn that?   Jost: (04:17) I was 22, 23 by the time I realised, "I can't get more on drugs."   Mason: (04:23) Well, it's something to get. That's interesting to even ever be able to catch that and get that. Is that because you had an intention?   Jost: (04:30) I was a drug dealer by then. I was organized. I always loved the entrepreneurship, so I had access to quantities big time, which is all in my books. I talk about it in my books.   Mason: (04:43) Especially in high-   Jost: (04:43) Higher and Higher, Drug Repair That Works, fully describe the stories.   Mason: (04:45) Oh man, I'm really looking forward to reading this.   Jost: (04:48) Yeah. It's full, it's incredible really. Great stories like dealing with Chinese people in Amsterdam, with opium and things like that. In those days it was pretty hardcore.   Mason: (04:58) Did they have genuine Chinese opium den's?   Jost: (05:02) Yeah. Full on. It had everything. You had an underground scene. So, it was like the Chinese were running the drugs. They were just like the Hell's Angels were running the drugs. The had Hell's Angels cafes. It was enormously multicultural. But for some reason, it all worked. They knew their territory and everyone kept sort of by the boundaries very well.   Mason: (05:26) Yeah. Okay.   Jost: (05:27) But because I had access to so many drugs, I could have what I wanted. And I had access to really the best mescaline. I mean, I'm talking to serious quality in those days, and LSD as much as I want. I actually came to Australia with a bottle of LSD liquid. And I actually took it with me to Nimbin in 1981-   Mason: (05:49) And became the king of the town.   Jost: (05:50) I was in the pub one day, in the middle of Nimbin.   Mason: (05:55) Yeah.   Jost: (05:56) We're talking '81 Friday night pub. And there was a guy, I was beside this guy at the counter. And I asked him, "Do you want some LSD liquid?" And he looked at me if asking me a thirsty man in the desert, "Do you want some water?"   Mason: (06:09) Yeah, right.   Jost: (06:11) And I said, "Yeah, of course." So, I gave him two drops in the scooner. And within half an hour, he was just like going all over the place. It was serious stuff.   Mason: (06:20) That was good.   Jost: (06:20) Yeah. The whole pub suddenly knew, there's this German guy who's got a bottle of LSD liquid, the real thing. So, there were 50 people in the pub, so I put everyone two drops in. The whole pub, off their face. So, some people-   Mason: (06:37) And Nimbin has never been the same again.   Jost: (06:38) ... have never had that quality.   Mason: (06:39) Yeah, right.   Jost: (06:40) Because, we told them serious quality. It was pure. Three drops would've burnt to your brain. So, I made sure everyone only two drops. But a lot of people, in that center of Nimbin, they couldn't... they were going in circles and couldn't hack it. It was just too much.   Mason: (06:56) Who are you?   Jost: (07:01) So, I had an incredible introduction to Nimbin, because within three weeks the whole bottle went that night and everybody knew me. But I lived in Nimbin for the whole year, and I survived on jobs. One day I went to the job vacancy board, end up with a job there. And there was helping the artist to upgrade the murals, all the pictures of Nimbin.   Mason: (07:26) Oh, nice.   Jost: (07:26) And I got this beautiful job, for six months paid, to, to work on the murals and all those pictures.   Mason: (07:32) Yeah.   Jost: (07:33) And people came up, "How did you get the job?"   Mason: (07:36) Yeah.   Jost: (07:36) I said, "I went to the job vacancy board." There was only one job on that job vacancy board in 20 years.   Mason: (07:45) I mean, there's some kind of flow there.   Jost: (07:47) Yeah, it's sort of faith, yeah?   Mason: (07:48) Yeah. Obviously, there's some kind of faith. I mean, like some kind of, you bring in the lady sky dancer kind of energy as well. You would have been like, yeah, you're cruising on some kind of etheric reality.   Jost: (07:58) Yeah.   Mason: (07:59) And so, the whole time, did you maintain your interest in Chinese medicine and Taoism during this?   Jost: (08:05) Yes. All along. Because, always when I was doing the drugs, it always is working with Yin and Yang symbol that came to me all the time.   Mason: (08:12) In artistry?   Jost: (08:13) Yeah, in artistry. Yeah. I just saw those symbols all the time. And I did the Chinese philosophy. Every poetry I could get, I was putting down. I was looking for the Chinese artists books. Obviously, when I lived in Nimbin, I lived in [inaudible 00:08:28] and I lived with someone who introduced me to the macrobiotic cooking, the Chinese cooking. And then, I learned about Tai chi, I learned about Qigong. I mean, I came from Amsterdam heavy on drugs, addicted to speed and every possible drug known to man, I came to Nimbin and I got off drugs.   Mason: (08:50) Yeah. I mean, yeah, that's very interesting.   Jost: (08:50) So, I went to Nimbin to get off drugs.   Mason: (08:52) Yeah.   Jost: (08:54) And, so actually I didn't do much drugs in Nimbin.   Mason: (08:57) What was it about where you were at?   Jost: (08:59) Because, I arrived really broken from the drugs, because I tried to get the Tao on drugs.   Mason: (09:05) Interesting.   Jost: (09:06) I tried to reach that consciousness on drugs. I tried to reach it. And because I had access to as many drugs as I wanted, there was no limitations to how much I could explore. And I realised very quickly, it will not work. I realised by then, "Okay, it shows me what I need and what I want, but it will not deliver."   Mason: (09:29) And so, okay, let's talk about that peak experience, because that's something that comes up again and again. How do you see the relevance of using these psychedelics now in the search for the Tao. And then there's one thing I've said there, there's a bit of contradiction there in terms of searching for the Tao in the first place.   Jost: (09:50) I've done the drug, so I can't really judge drugs. So, it would be hypocritical. My personal experience is you don't need the drugs to find it.   Mason: (09:59) Yeah, right.   Jost: (10:01) I actually haven't done drugs for over 35 years. Not because I shouldn't have drugs, it's because I write books about it. I actually don't want, because it just takes me backwards not forwards. So, because I studied under that Chinese master, I studied in all kinds of Chinese martial art practices and meditation practices and I've explored really good revenues with them, with all kinds of avenues with masters I met in my time. And I was explored to cosmic. I was introduced to cosmic consciousness via techniques. And that took me further as on the drugs. I couldn't go further. Then, I met those techniques, and in particular with under [inaudible 00:10:40], who run the transcendental meditation with the Maharishi in the '60s. I met him and he was my main... the main guru I followed. And he was a friend of Osho. We're talking back obviously 25, 30 years when it all started. And so, he introduced me to the cosmic consciousness via a meditation technique that took the next level from the transcendental meditation to the spontaneous expression that the transcendental meditation only you could do in a contained form by sitting down.   Mason: (11:11) Yeah.   Jost: (11:11) So, they had this big fall out in the '60s. [inaudible 00:11:16]... that you actually need to learn, make the body stand up to express your energies more effectively so you can actually open up all the [inaudible 00:11:22] channel and all the other points. So, the water [inaudible 00:11:25] points that all lead up to the brain to hold them up for this aspect of the cosmic consciousness that's all within us. According to my personal experience in having studied both modalities, like the cosmic consciousness of walking by the meditation and having done LSD and mescaline and etc, and all the mushrooms, there start on the same pathways. There start there. But, the technique goes further, simply because when you take a drug, you've got a chemical running through your system and it directs you what to do. Whereas, if you don't have a chemical, you're spontaneous. You can take it to a level where you're not subject to the chemical.   Jost: (12:08) So, the chemical can take you to say to step eight, but it may leave you at step eight. So, you start at step one, bang straight to step eight. It can do that within 20 minutes, but then the chemical may leave you there, because you got a software now running through your system.   Mason: (12:26) Well, this is the whole nature of having a complete system that through antiquity right has been proven and in its holistic nature can work in moving a human forward verse the Western what we do is we'll take one particular meditation technique out of a very advanced system, and then apply that, and then sit there excessively with it. And you see like with transcendental meditation, right?   Jost: (12:46) Yeah.   Mason: (12:47) So, how did you complete the system? Obviously, you've just moved through different techniques and adopted what you need out of them. Is that something that just happened for you through your will or intention or subconsciously? Or, did you purposely go and look for that?   Jost: (13:01) Because, I want more.   Mason: (13:02) Yeah. Okay.   Jost: (13:04) I want more. I'm the classic definition of an addict. I want more.   Mason: (13:06) Does that still motivate you?   Jost: (13:10) I search.   Mason: (13:11) Are you still searching, or is that-   Jost: (13:14) I've got really good techniques now, because I'm 61 years old. So, I've obviously have found my ways, my techniques I can work with. But there are those techniques I work with, firstly of all this, the cosmic consciousness via the meditation technique derived from the Vedas, which is the VC environment cosmic meditation. Which Is spontaneous expression. So that is the equivalent in the Taoist tradition, is the yuanyou meditation, the ecstatic travel. So, that's spontaneous. But then, I also study the lineage of the Tai Chi, of the Chen family. So, the Chen family, has got an enormous, powerful way to get to your right up to the top, but it's way of the body.   Mason: (14:01) Who's the Chen family?   Jost: (14:02) The Chen family started from the Chen village. They're the ones who started Tai chi in the 1600s.   Mason: (14:07) Wow. Okay.   Jost: (14:09) We're talking 1640 when the general in that Chen village introduced the first form that is now in the West, known as Tai chi. It wasn't martial art, but he took it from the Buddhist and from the Taoist. So, there's a taoist cultivation principle in there, the Buddhist transcendence and the ability to generate your energy so you can fight and be a victor, so you can win. So, it's martial art. So, it's a combination of a longevity of strengths, of power, martial art, but also transcendence way, the Buddhist view. And so, that form was fiercely guarded for 400 years by the Chen family. Because in those days, when you develop a form, you don't show others, because it's your livelihood of survival. Because, your form gives you the strengths over others. Which is why in the 1800s, all the bodyguards for the caravans would travel the country and to protect the cars off the bandits, they used Chen fighters that are cheap people from the Chen village, because they were the best fighters.   Jost: (15:22) And so, the Chen Tai Chi utilizes this opening up the cosmic consciousness in a massive, in an extremely grounded way. So, you become very, very solid. Really so solid, you can't move a Chen fighter. It's just bang, you're solid like a pyramid. You just root yourself into the ground. You're trying to move like a Chen fighter, it's not possible. You can take a big Mack, truck, not possible. And they're doing all kinds of experiments and presentations and demonstrations on YouTube, where those 10 fighters can't be moved by 100 people. So, you developed this enormous solidity, this enormous power that is incredible. And it's all in the body.   Mason: (16:05) Yeah.   Jost: (16:05) And there's always the Jing. And the Jing, then to the Shen, and then obviously the Qi. And/or Jing, Qi, Shen, whichever way you want to put first, but it's works via what we've given. Because, the strengths, the power that the Chen family tapped into and developed over the hundreds of years, based on the Taoist principle, but is now available to people. That allows them to utilize this in order to deal with obstacles in life, in order to become strong, in order to become fit.   Jost: (16:35) So, what I learned with my cosmic consciousness techniques, especially with my hippie life and things like that back in the... 40 years ago-   Mason: (16:42) Yeah. You got to really explore.   Jost: (16:43) Yeah. You go right out there, but not grounded.   Mason: (16:49) Yeah. That sounds familiar.   Jost: (16:51) So, I went right out there. So, when I was 22, 21, 19 with all the drugs, I was just so out there. I could see the whole creation of the universe. I was as ready to tell God what to do.   Mason: (17:04) Yeah. I hear you. Highly existential.   Jost: (17:09) Boom!   Mason: (17:09) Yeah.   Jost: (17:11) So out there, and understanding everything. I even could've looked at a quantum mechanics formula and, "Yeah. I get this." It's unbelievable.   Mason: (17:23) Well, that's like there is a somewhat reality to whether you can intellectually ground in and an apply something being tapped into that source field where all information comes from.   Jost: (17:34) Yeah, that's it. You tap into it. It's like, it's all there. And the drugs take you there, but they don't teach you how you get there, and they don't tell you and they don't teach you how to return. Yes.   Mason: (17:46) And then, how to take any kind of any kind of... how to realise and form anything in reality with what you've tapped into as well.   Jost: (17:56) Yeah. It's called to integrate it.   Mason: (17:57) Yeah.   Jost: (17:58) And most importantly, how to tell others what it is. You can't communicate with others.   Mason: (18:03) Yeah.   Jost: (18:03) So, I went right out there and I realized very quickly when I expressed my position, which was totally removed from the local point that other people were operating on. If I then reflected my perception of reality from my point of view, the people at the local point couldn't find... they couldn't get me. And as I more and more realized, it's not of any use.   Mason: (18:31) That's a harrowing realization when you find that no longer... that's not useful.   Jost: (18:37) Yeah. So you see it, but you don't know what to do with that.   Mason: (18:40) Yeah. Okay.   Jost: (18:41) Yeah.   Mason: (18:42) And so, that was a catalyst for you whenever you want more. You got frustrated.   Jost: (18:45) First of all, it made me angry.   Mason: (18:46) Yeah. Well, was that because you've done so much? You've done so much work and you'd realized so much and yet you couldn't... Was that what was frustrating?   Jost: (18:54) Yeah. First of all, what happened to you, first, I couldn't express. I could say, but I couldn't express it suitably nor effectively.   Mason: (19:01) Yeah. [inaudible 00:19:02], I kind of get that when you're like, "Hey, I experienced this." And people go, "Oh yeah, no, I know what you mean." You're like, "No, you don't." And that frustration that you can't actually communicate who you are genuinely as a person, right? You don't have the stamina, or the... You don't have the ability to slow down and consciously, consistently communicate who you are with the world, right? You need to do everything right-   Jost: (19:28) Not slow, not consistent, all over the place, because obviously that what held my perception together is Yin. So, whatever I perceived, it didn't have a connection. For me, it was obvious, but for others who are trying to observe, they couldn't follow. That's classified as psychosis.   Mason: (19:49) Yeah, absolutely.   Jost: (19:50) So, I developed all kinds of various levels of psychosis. Which was very interesting once again, because by being right out there and actually unable to integrate, you get an incredible insight into how society works, because you an outsider looking in, Timothy Leary. Yeah? So, suddenly I was out there watching in, but couldn't go in. And first of all that made me angry, because if the organism can't express itself, that other people want to listen to and follow, the Yang rises. That means the Yang and the liver rises, and it's anger. So, which means in those days it translated, I became an anarchist. So, from the hippie, I became an anarchist. Now, I become angry with society, so I started to blame society.   Mason: (20:40) Which is the classic pattern.   Jost: (20:41) Yeah. I told people, "Society is fucked. We are going to fucking blow this all up."   Mason: (20:45) Well, that's somewhat even the, as you come back down, it's almost a search for identity. You need something to oppose in order to get some formation for yourself, right? And who you are and what you stand for.   Jost: (20:57) Yeah, because you need to be integrated.   Mason: (21:00) Yeah.   Jost: (21:00) The thing is we, this is the thing as being in this physical form of being here in this world is we need to be working with others. At the soul, we are united with everyone. But when we incarnate into this world, we feel separation. And then, we open up with drugs. We're going to back to the cosmic consciousness, where everything's united. But now, I can't integrate that. Which is why it made me angry. And everyone that was with me in my times, or my hippy buddies, we all became anarchist.   Jost: (21:31) So, we started getting very violent with these cops and demonstrations. And yeah, it became dark. It became very, very dark. And so, it was more a means of trying to make sense of myself, as you said. It's right. And then, I had this opportunity back in, we're talking... just in the turn of 1980 to 1981, I had an opportunity to escape, because by that time the police was after me, the army was after me, the drug bust went bad, the drug dealers were after me, the bikers were after me. It was a little too much.   Mason: (22:07) That screw your head just a little bit too much.   Jost: (22:10) So, I lived illegal already in the underground. But if the bikers are also after you, it's like, "Get out."   Mason: (22:19) That's when it's real. Yeah.   Jost: (22:21) And, on this Sunday night, someone offered me to go to Australia on a plane to be a translator. And within three days, I was on the plane. I had no idea what I was doing. This is one of the things you go with the flow. So, I landed in Sydney in 1981, and I landed... So, that was in Sydney. And obviously, in those days the plane flew four days. And four days in a plane as a drug user, my God, you'd have to take a lot of drugs with you. Yeah? So, obviously I had packs of, stacks of gear with me. When I arrived in Sydney, I realized that I had a big block of Lebanese hash in my pocket I forgot to smoke. And when I was in the queue, I thought, "I'd better go to the toilet to destroy the evidence." Because I thought, "If they're going to find this, it's not a good way to start my journey in Australia." Obviously I looked very suspicious. Long hair, bare feet, green pants, purple jacket. I didn't look quite normal.   Mason: (23:17) Yeah. The whole look, yeah.   Jost: (23:21) So, I went off to the toilet to destroy the evidence, but a custom officer followed me. And I thought, "Oh shit, I can't destroy it." And I thought, "Okay, maybe they haven't noticed me. Maybe everything's got to be fine." So, I got to the custom, to the queue, and obviously straight they took me into the room and searched everything. And they found the hashish. And they said, "What's this?" And I said, "Look, I forgot to smoke it." And they looked very, very puzzled and the found all the amphetamine pills, I had a lot of drugs with me. And they said, "What's this?" And I said, "I'm a junkie. I need it to stay calm." They found the bottle with the LSD liquid which was in a nose drop bottle. This guy says, "Nose drop." So, they didn't look at that. They didn't taste it for some lucky reason. And then they told me to fuck off. And I thought, "gee this is a very rude country."   Mason: (24:10) Yeah.   Jost: (24:11) It was like, Australia, my God, different to Amsterdam and Germany where they don't swear. And I said, "Where should I go?" And they looked at me and said, "You go to Nimbin."   Mason: (24:21) No way.   Jost: (24:23) So, I've never heard of Nimbin. So, I got out of the custom, I asked him, "Can I get my hashish back? And they said, "No, fuck off." So, for some reason I didn't get thrown in jail. Nothing. One of those weird stories. It wasn't that much in hindsight, it was only about five grams. But it was good block of beautiful Lebanese red hashish. And anyway, I got out of the airport and hitchhiked north, for Nimbin. And I arrived. I'll never forget that. All the cars until Lismore looked ordinary.   Mason: (24:59) Yeah.   Jost: (25:00) Then hitchhiking from Lismore to Nimbin, everything changed. Cars stopping with three wheels and three different wheels and the goat in the back and weird looking people. I said, "This is my world."   Mason: (25:12) Yeah, I hear you. All right. So then you land and... Okay. So, we've kind of almost gone from that, from the void comes the one, the Tao, and then the two, the Yin and Yang.   Jost: (25:22) Yes, correct.   Mason: (25:23) So, the Yin and Yang is a continuing concept for you and obviously a reality and continues to be today. Where have you from that period to now, how have you related to Yin and Yang in life? And I know this is a huge conversation, but especially for people listening who haven't quite understood the realities and intricacies and all of Yin and Yang dominating and being the reality of their body and the universe, where are you now in terms of communicating in Yin Yang in your relationship with it?   Jost: (25:56) Yeah. Obviously, I understand that everyone of us is on a journey here. And obviously in Chin... In the taoist philosophy, they call it, your contract with heaven. So, the highest form of medicine in Chinese Medicine is nourishing your destiny. Because I've been using Chinese Medicine for 30 years now, and as a registered acupuncturist I obviously work with all kinds of people from all different walks of life, but I never ever used the herbs to treat a symptom. I always identify the person's destiny first.   Mason: (26:36) Dude, yeah. Speaking our language.   Jost: (26:38) Yeah. Because, everyone, it's just like the universe. Everything is created with a purpose, and that's the Tao. The Tao runs everything. So, we know this purpose, but not so much on conscious level we can feel it, but very, very difficult to put into words. And so, Yin and Yang, the fluctuation between the polar forces guides me along this journey. That means I get drawn to an absolute. Then, I realize it's not me, but it shoots me to the next absolute, which is the opposite. And then, it's not me either, then it shoots me to the next absolute. So, it's like a process. So, between Yin and Yang.   Jost: (27:16) So, obviously for me it was like, first of all, getting involved with the cultural evolution back in '68 when I realized it had nothing to do with Taoism. And so, I was always exposed to communism. Then, I actually realized, I found the real modality, which is why the Tao isn't, but that took me to the drugs. The drugs then took me to the anarchism, to violence and pain, which then led me to the realization it's within. And that led me to the meditation, which, so that was the Yin aspect. And then from the Yin aspect, I realized I need to strengthen myself, otherwise I can't express what I see. So, if I'm weak and I can't fulfill my destiny. So, in order to fulfill my destiny, in order to live my destiny, I have to go Yang. And that took me to Chinese martial art. And Chinese martial art, well, we're talking now 35 years ago, my first exposure was kung-fu. And I practiced very hard.   Jost: (28:13) And that then led me to the Chen family, the Chen Tai Chi, which is not the Tai chi that you see people do in parks. You got to look that up on YouTube, Chen Tai chi, C-H-E-N, the origin Tai Chi. It's a different world. It's very, very intense, very powerful, incredibly expressive, but it's hard to learn. It's really hard on your body. You have to work very hard. So, from the Yin, the hippie aspect of going to the cosmic consciousness, which is like without the effort, I then was taken to the Yang with a lot of effort. So, for me, the Yin Yang is always the mix between receiving, perception and having a mental idea, "oh gee I love this." And then the yang, the effort to integrate that. So, which is Gongfu, effort over time. That's the classic translation of Kung-Fu, effort over time.   Jost: (29:09) So, that means I constantly get the idea what I want, the vision, the beauty via poetry or via music or via meditation or even via sexual practices, I get the idea, but then the Yang via the effort, I moved towards it. So, this is one thing that I've never really discovered in the Western world, the perfect blend between your vision, your idea and the effort. So, in the West, we see success strategies, but they don't integrate with your heart so much. Because in order to integrate your heart, you need to feel it. So, now you need a practice that actually takes you into feeling. And so, this is where meditation, cosmic consciousness meditation come in too. That's where sexual practices come in. That's alchemy. So, I need to feel it, because if I put into word what I think my destiny is, then it's concept. Then, it's most likely based on a conditioning and an upbringing from a previous time or parents or I follow security principles. It's based on all kinds of other values. It's interfered with values.   Jost: (30:16) But if I go alchemically into it, that means via practice, and the Tao is alchemic. Alchemy is the way of the body. So, by working with the body, I then can actually feel it. And once I feel it, I then moved towards it. And that feeling is what they call the Yuanyu, is the ecstatic travel. So, that's where the drugs come into. So, the drugs can show you, but unless you put the effort in, the Gongfu, which is the Yang, it will not work. So, to me that's the Yin and Yang.   Mason: (30:49) Yeah. And then almost, the whole idea behind the drugs and the plant medicines is you become externally reliant on something to be able to show you that vision, which is innately in there rather than a daily practice being... that tune in and feel.   Jost: (31:03) Yes. In Chinese medicine we always say, "Don't think, feel."   Mason: (31:09) Okay.   Jost: (31:10) The whole training and the Tai Chi, "Don't think, feel." So, we've constantly like every morning and we go first into, into feeling. So, I never start the day with thinking. So, this is where I work with Yin and Yang, because the thinking takes me into the Yin not into the Yang. And so, I need to start the day with going into Yang first. And that means I'm not thinking. So, I'm actually moving. So, of course when we wake up, we want to think about all kinds of stuff, but the idea is to shut up. I spend a lot of time in, having studied under the masters, and personally direct the training under them. It was every morning. You just don't think.   Mason: (31:53) Yeah.   Jost: (31:54) You don't think.   Mason: (31:54) Which is the practice.   Jost: (31:56) Yeah. Which I explained in that book Clock on to Health in the large intestine chapter. Because, when we wake up, the energy, you see the Tao is very, very intelligent. Yeah? The Tao has given us everything what we need in order to fulfill our destiny. But in order to find our destiny, first of all, we need to feel not think.   Mason: (32:21) Yes.   Jost: (32:21) Yeah?   Mason: (32:22) Yes.   Jost: (32:22) And in order to feel, not think, the Tao has given us the uniform, and the Qi starts with Large Intestine and Lung, Lung and Large Intestine. And the Large Intestine is the organ that lets go off negative thinking.   Mason: (32:38) Yes.   Jost: (32:39) So, every morning we got the opportunity to let go of thinking. Because, forgetfulness is the highest form in Taoism, the art of forgetting. But what they mean with the art of forgetting is not to think about it, to feel. But that's something you can't put into words. You try to do, and I would say we tried to do, but you can't really do it. Because, I wake up and I think about a certain area. I'll wake up immediately and think about my books, my business, what I need doing, but I can't make sense of my thoughts. Obviously, I can make sense of my thoughts, but they don't suit me. So, as soon as I get up and go into my practice, I go into feeling. Large intestine takes over, and then it delegates my thoughts into the direction that they need to go, so they're not a hindrance to me.   Mason: (33:31) Yes.   Jost: (33:31) So, that's where the Tai Chi goes into. That's why it's a martial art. When you go in front of an opponent and you start thinking, you get wrecked. It has to be spontaneous. Because, if you don't think, then you've got the highest response. And then it's always correct, because then you don't have an opinion about your opponent, nor do you have a judgment, nor do you have a feeling about any criteria. So, you are in a perfect state of neutrality.   Mason: (34:07) And you're in reality.   Jost: (34:09) Yes. You are. You're real there, you're right at the moment. And you actually look at that person as what the person is, not what you think it is. So, you're not using judgment, you're not using analysis. And then, you realize there's no need to fight that person anyway.   Mason: (34:25) Yet.   Jost: (34:25) which is why Tai Chi, this is the interesting thing, it's so Yang, but it takes you so Yin.   Mason: (34:33) In original. You're talking about original Tai Chi.   Jost: (34:35) Yeah. They are the most peaceful people I've ever met. It's makes you totally peaceful, because you actually don't see the point to fight. But, you are a little better. You can immediately change the situation, but there is no interest.   Mason: (34:51) Well, that's the irony and the cosmic giggle of the universe, right?   Jost: (34:56) Yeah. That's the Yin and Yang. So, you are in the state of Yin, but you're very Yang. When you meet those masters, they're so compassionate. They don't have an issue with you. They don't judge you. It doesn't matter what you do. Whatever habits you have, it's irrelevant, because there's not thinking. It's pure feeling. It's just like goes back to the old days when people met in the park and hit a few joints. You just feel with each other.   Mason: (35:21) Yeah.   Jost: (35:21) Yes.   Mason: (35:22) Yeah. That's the peak experience to what-   Jost: (35:24) Yeah, the peak experience, just feel with each other. In the morning have a joint, the day is your friend. Yeah? So, it's like all this hippie festivals I went into. Have a joint and straight away you communicate what you're feeling not thinking.   Mason: (35:36) And then having the, I don't know whether it's the practice or the ability or just getting to the point where you're so frustrated that you need to constantly go to something external to get that experience, even just going and having the intention. This is why I want to talk about the day plans and clock...   Jost: (35:52) Yes.   Mason: (35:52) Because, for me that fits, that slides into the lifestyle design based on the reality of how Qi transforms in our body. And it's obviously a very ancient system. It's one I feel has become, if you look at the TCM body clock and the organ clock, it's become something that... everyone's like, "Oh yeah, no, I've seen that before. This times that, this times that," and there's this like breadth of awareness but not that much depth of actually being to able to know what's going on in our organs at that time.   Jost: (36:23) Yeah.   Mason: (36:24) But, what I'm thinking is just like, with that having a joint in the morning with mates and just getting into that connection, then being able to go like those masters you're talking about at 80, at 90 years old, "What does my whole life and my lifestyle and my practice needs to look like in order to embody that, and not only feel this level of connection and compassion and love for everyone, but be transcending even what I'm feeling here on this substance and embody that and then share that with the world," that takes serious consideration. And that's kind of what I feel, for me, that's what I kind of get in... I've gone through Clock On. I've got my copy at home, and been going through it. You know what I mean?   Mason: (37:04) Like, "Yeah, I'm going to really consider this organ clock more than I have in the past and really give this a few years to permeate me and allow me to understand [inaudible 00:37:13], allow me to understand my own Qi and my own wu-xing five element phase transformation. That's what I see as the point of this, is designing a day where we can tonify from the two things, the three things, the Jing, Qi, Shen, so that then we can do exactly what you're saying in terms of being able to embody these things. So, I don't know if that's got a correct assessment, but that's been my takeaway so far. But, is that kind of fair in to what the intention is behind clocking on to this?   Jost: (37:47) Yeah. What happens is that, okay, in a Taoist tradition, our information of who we are, our true nature is energetic.   Mason: (37:56) Yeah.   Jost: (37:56) And the structure is, of our nature, is structured by meridian systems. So, before we incarnate in this physical form, we are meridians. And we actually, the energy organs exist before we incarnate.   Mason: (38:12) And the embryology is kind of proving that as well, right?   Jost: (38:17) Yeah. In Chinese medicine, we have an energy organ and a physical organ. Which is why scholars all over the world, the academic agreement is, "Let me talk Chinese, spleen. We have to write the spleen in upper cases." So, when we talk spleen in Chinese Medicine, we have spleen and Spleen. The upper case spleen is different to the lower case spleen. The lower case spleen resembles Western medicine. The upper case spleen is Chinese medicine. And Chinese medicine has identified that this energy organ exist before we are born in physical form, and it will stay with us when we leave.   Mason: (38:59) And it's referring more so to the Qi.   Jost: (39:03) It's an energy. So, what happens is that each... in order to structure this body, in order to structure the soul, which is a complex entity anyway, we are really complex beings. And, I mean, the whole of creation is very complex. But in order to hold this unity together, it's run by 12 organ systems. And that's why the 12 [inaudible 00:39:23] universe. 12 hours in the day, 12 months in a year. And the Chinese and Western philosophers agreed on the 12th. 12 months and 12 years, because they work with the yearly cycles and monthly cycles. And 12 hours in the day, by two makes it 24 hours. So, it's all held together by time. And as quantum mechanics has identified, space is in time. So, in order for the physical to exist, first of all it needs time. So, as soon as you take time out of the equation, the physical collapses. It can't exist.   Mason: (39:57) Yeah.   Jost: (39:57) So, what it means to be in the physical world rather than the spiritual world is, here in the physical world, we have time, in a spiritual world, we don't have time. So, when this organ system now goes into the physical system, now it's regulated by time. And the Taoist already tapped into that 5,000 years ago for some reason. Without them having a perception of a clock, they knew that it's time that holds it all together. Which is why so many quantum mechanics look at Chinese Medicine, which is why Niels Bohr, used the Yin Yang, as his logo as a symbol, when he did his coat of arms.   Mason: (40:38) Yeah. Right.   Jost: (40:39) And so, it's all done. If you put it up on internet, it all comes up. Niels Bohr, Yin and Yang, coat of arms. Because, he understood what quantum mechanics is trying to say. The Tao has already tapped into it many thousands of years before them. And I realized that you'd never be able to put two things together, as Heisenberg uncertainty principle says, "One cannot know the velocity of a particle and not the direction of the particle at the same time." So, you cannot be Yin and then Yang. It's always happening at the same time. So, it's Yin and Yang. That's why it never says anywhere, Yin or Yang.   Mason: (41:19) So, is this the concept that they don't, they cannot exist without each other?   Jost: (41:23) Yes. But it never is, like you can't understand who you are and the direction at the same time. Which is why thinking about your destiny will never work. It's based on the uncertainty principle, Heisenberg uncertainty. So, "One cannot know the velocity of the particle and at the same time know the direction of the particle." So, you can't know who you are and know the direction you go by knowing, you need to feel it. Because then, Yin and Yang becomes one.   Jost: (41:48) So, when people do drugs, Yin and Yang become one. When we observe, academically or intellectually a situation, it's a Yin or Yang. But once you take a joint, it's all one. Which is why when you're with people, it becomes like, you feel with each other on a... You know each other.   Mason: (42:09) Yeah.   Jost: (42:09) You can go into other experience that, you can go with people you don't speak their language and you smoke hashish and you suddenly connect, unite. Yeah?   Mason: (42:18) Mm-hmm (affirmative).   Jost: (42:19) So, there's a lot going on. So, Yin and Yang is really exemplifying what that all is. And the Qi cycle put the whole complexity together via time. Because if you take time out of the equation, it will collapse. These days, people live, make up their own times, which is why they got all kinds of symptoms.   Mason: (42:39) Yes.   Jost: (42:40) 5:00 AM is different to 12:00 PM. 12:00 PM is different to 5:00 PM. And it has got a totally different influence on your body. If it has a different influence on your body, that means there's a totally different velocity and a different direction. It means there's a different feeling. So, how you feel at 5:00 AM is different to how you feel at 5:00 PM, but that feeling is essentially in order to understand who you are.   Jost: (43:02) So, the Qi cycle gives you the matrix of how to tap into these incredible complex information that your soul is, structured via the meridians and the 12 energy organs. So, each energy organ has got a very specific information. And the Taoists called it the orbs. The orb of the Spleen, which is the heavenly messenger. So, each organ has got a very specific information about who you are as your soul. There's all your akashic record is in each of the organs. You can tap into anything. So, the Spleen knows exactly when it comes about your intellect. Your Kidney knows everything about who you are in terms of your willpower. The Liver knows exactly when it comes in terms of your direction. But, putting that into words is not possible. So, we need to feel it. Feel, don't think.   Jost: (43:52) So, by living the Qi cycle, we tap into this different time zones, which then creates a sink into this energy organ. And now, it's almost like you open up a gateway. And every two hours, there's a different gateway to perceive a different perception about who you are, what you're feeling. If you integrate that now with action, which is doing, which is now you give the particle its direction, first of all, when you zone in to the time zone, it's a velocity. Now, you give it its direction by doing according to what it needs to be done at this time. You actually feel what you're supposed to be doing.   Mason: (44:31) Yeah.   Jost: (44:32) It's absolutely magic. So, suddenly life gets mystical and rather than mundane.   Mason: (44:40) I like that. I can do a little bit more mystical. And quite often something that's occurring in the West, is reverse in the East, is the East is, it is a reality and a fabric of society that... Let's just make it really obvious one. Qi exists, verse in the West where something that... sometimes just even talking about the Qi cycle to someone off the street, it's known as a bit of a, it's interesting like a mystical Chinese concept, a Chinese medicine concept. And quite often, I'm just curious as to your experience and really... And likewise, we're educating people about the reality of Qi and Taoist theory, so I can relate. But, how are you going about teaching people about this Qi cycle to Western reductionist minds that almost need to go like, "well, what are you talking about? What?" What is the Qi?"   Jost: (45:39) It's very, very simple. That's why I use archetypes in my book Clock on. I don't talk about the large intestine Qi. I talk about the cleaner. Okay. What I'm saying here is, you can't put into words what Qi is.   Mason: (45:51) Yeah.   Jost: (45:52) Because the definition of Qi is information, energy and consciousness. Quantum physics can measure the impact consciousness has on matter, but it can't measure consciousness. So, you will never be able to put Qi into words. So, in China, over the thousands of years, everyone has developed an association with Qi. So, you go into a village and you talk with an 80 year old man, and it's, "Oh, the Qi is very good here." The association is on common ground. Everyone has got no association with that word. In the Western world, there's not association with that word yet. So, when you talk to someone Qi, if they have an association, it's most likely so removed from what it is, because they don't have the experience in it yet. It will take a few generations for us to actually have an association.   Jost: (46:40) So, at this stage, in the Western world, most people don't have enough association in their unconscious about the word Qi. So, when they hear the word Qi, they don't know what to associate with it. So, it goes mental. So, once you've got mental there, it's not Qi.   Mason: (46:56) Yeah. I mean, once you try to intellectualize the concept-   Jost: (46:59) You can't. Niels Bohr already realized you can't put it into words. The quantum mechanics already understood it's not possible, because you've got consciousness. Once you gone into consciousness, you've got all kinds of dilemmas, because you get the double slit experiment, where the particle goes through both slits at the same time, but only one particle arrives at the wall. And kind of like quantum mechanics full of paradox. And that's Chinese Medicine. So, when you talk Qi, you're always with a paradox, because you've got the Yin and Yang at the same time. But when you talk, it's Yin or Yang.   Jost: (47:30) So, you will never be able to put Yin and Yang and Qi into words. But, because I've worked with so many people and I did so many talks in my time, I understand the dilemma of, "okay, how can you create an association in people?" Which is why this book, Clock on, I worked with, "okay, what is an association?" Instead of me talking about large intestine Qi, I talk about the cleaner. Instead of talking about the Spleen, the energy Spleen, I talk about the builder. Instead of talking about the Small Intestine Qi, I talk about the judge. Because, Chinese medicine started with archetypes and storytelling and poetry, not with the textbook. Chinese medicine didn't start at a textbook. It started with storytelling. The shamans told stories. It had beautiful feelings. It evolved the feeling in people. And that feeling then got ingrained and now develop an association. When they heard the word, it brought the feeling up. So, in Chinese Medicine, you always have to work with both. You have to bring the word to arise a feeling, otherwise it will not work. It's not based on science.   Mason: (48:42) Well, and then people are trying to lay them over each other.   Jost: (48:45) They can't.   Mason: (48:45) And they can't, right?   Jost: (48:45) No. It's a fairy tale.   Mason: (48:48) I mean, and that's the interesting in what you were just saying about if you say Spleen, and in conversation, you almost need to say Spleen earth in order to... because you can't go capital S spleen.   Jost: (49:04) Upper case spleen. It just goes on and on and on.   Mason: (49:10) And that is the interesting thing in terms of, I feel like most Westerners learning these concepts is arriving in an acceptance and acknowledges... And a feeling state rather than a thinking state when tuning in to this Qi. And rather going, "Okay, what time is it? Oh, okay, I'm waking up at Liver time. Maybe physiologically something is happening to my Liver." And feeling like that possibly could be, and there is probably a reality to that.   Jost: (49:40) Which is there in the correlation, the correspondence to that Liver time isn't actually in the large intestine time. It's never at the time.   Mason: (49:45) Well, that's the interesting thing. You can't think about the physiology necessarily. That's where I've tripped up, years ago when I was starting out, it's where I kept on tripping up. And probably when I talked to most young acupuncturists not getting taught the reality of not trying to fit this Qi model or like this reality, this gigantic system into Western pathology. Although there can be crossovers, that's fun and interesting, but you need to stay within that system that's respecting the classics, right?   Jost: (50:21) Yeah. My observation is they work very well together as long as you don't try and explain with Western words what Chinese phrases are.   Mason: (50:30) I think that's the distinction. Yeah.   Jost: (50:30) And you can use a Chinese to explain the West. I believe that both work very well, because I work with supplements which are based on Western sciences, I work with all kinds of Western science principles, but that's a different approach. It's Yin and Yang. You can't explain Yin with Yang. They are a totally different approach, but if you put the two things together, that's what I believe the future is.   Mason: (50:56) Absolutely.   Jost: (50:56) Chinese Medicine is fairytale. It's magic, it's psychedelic. It takes you into feeling, and it shows you your potential. It's power, it's magic. It makes you strong, incredibly powerful. And, it's longevity. I mean, at my age of 61, I can't relate to men of my age, because-   Mason: (51:18) Too much Jing.   Jost: (51:19) Yeah. I relate more to the 30 year old, because when I work out, I work out more on the 30 year olds level, not the 61 year old level. So, obviously I go into the Qi. If you go into chi, you always rectify symptoms. You always rectify symptoms. So, that's why I talk in my book Clock On, how to direct it. You wake up to a symptom for a reason, and Large Intestine is designed to move the symptom. So, if you use the Western signs and use Chinese lifestyle, medicine lifestyle, wow that's the potency. And I believe this is where we moving towards. And it was prophesied by Waysun Liao, a famous Tai chi master in 1974, when he wrote that book treatise of Tai Chi, and you talked to the Chen family. He talked about the Chen Tai Chi.   Jost: (52:12) I need to say there are a lot of people have a misconception of Tai chi, because what we see in the West, old people in the park is not Tai Chi. It's like saying a skateboard is a Lamborghini.   Mason: (52:21) Yeah. I mean, I think that's something that's happened in a lot of these traditional. If you look at yin yoga, then practices like restorative yoga just flopping into a position verse of very active intentional five minute hold in a position that is designed to completely transform and open a meridian, it's a very different concept. So, it's hard fucking work. And that's what Tai Chi being, "Well, this nice. I'm just going with the energy of the universe without going through the methodical work of learning to engage the [crosstalk 00:52:57].   Jost: (52:58) And your legs, and you burn your legs, it's so intense, so painful, so incredible, intense. But then, you just, you can see your direction. You can see your purpose. So, while you do the move, it's enormously intense, but you can see who you are and it moves you. So, it puts you in an altered state immediately. But Waysun Liao prophesied in the 1970s, that what the Chinese started, this [inaudible 00:53:30] and the whole Tai Chi, the Supreme ultimate, not the Tai Chi, the form, but the the supreme ultimate, the yin yang, "What they're tapping to is profound." But he said, it will be completed in the West.   Mason: (53:43) Yeah, and well, that integration model is, and that's I think there's this distinction, because this is where it's such... it's slippery. Of course, this is always going to remain slippery. The distinction to not try and layer these two systems over each other, but allow them to sit side by side and work together-   Jost: (54:03) If you're trying to sort out Chinese medicine and Western medicine, it's like giving a male, trying to sort out hormonal problems with a woman.   Mason: (54:12) Yeah.   Jost: (54:12) Or, a woman telling a man what ejaculation should be about, or a man telling a woman how she should psychologically feel. It doesn't work. It's asleep, doesn't work in harmony.   Mason: (54:23) Where can I just leave them to be who they are.   Jost: (54:27) Work in harmony. You can't understand day, when you're at nighttime. You won't say, "we're getting sick of wet. We need from now only to have dry," or, "we don't need cold anymore. We only have hot," or, "we don't need men anymore, we only have women." It's just bullshit.   Mason: (54:50) Yeah, man, sing it. Before we go, for some people that aren't aware of that organ clock, can you run us through kind of an example? A very general, because obviously this is a huge conversation. You've got two books really tapping into it, but can you run us through an example?   Jost: (55:15) Yes. It's very simple.   Mason: (55:16) Yeah. Okay.   Jost: (55:16) Yeah. You wake up today to let go of the previous day.   Mason: (55:19) Yes.   Jost: (55:19) So, you wake up to Large Intestine time. That means, Large Intestine is you go to the toilet.   Mason: (55:24) Yeah.   Jost: (55:25) You clean out your system. That's your cleaner. Before you start the day, you clean out your unit. You clean your apartment, you clean everything out. That means Large Intestine gets rid of negative thoughts. If you start the day without cleaning, the negative thoughts of yesterday will dominate you today. So, in the Qi cycle lifestyle, we always start with letting go of the old first, because it's a new day. So, we do these via Qi practices. We do this with yoga, with core training, but we don't engage with the work yet. We don't engage with talking to people. We don't engage with having breakfast yet. First of all, detox the system. And that's what pretty much like all of Western medicine cancer researchers revealed, you want to get rid of the bad cells. You want to eliminate toxins and you want to get rid of waste products, because if the bad cells, negative cells go, the good cells can flourish.   Jost: (56:29) So, in order to be healthy, first of all, we need to let go. So, that's like Large Intestine. Let go. Because if it goes, bang, then you can come in. So then, because we let go, the next thing is, we're working with the peacemaker, which is stomach Qi. And that means after we have cleaned out everything, we now sit down and have a mindful breakfast. So, we have nice, we've got to be aware we're not getting up and have breakfast. We clean out first, detox. Then, whatever time it's required to do that. Then, when we finish, we move into sitting down mindful and eating a warm breakfast. The happiest people I've met in my time in all the East, the happiest and happy, really strongest people all have cooked warm breakfast. But they do practice beforehand. So, I never have fruit juice and stuff like that.   Mason: (57:25) You don't go in and dampen the stomach.   Jost: (57:26) No. You start with warming. So, the reason why the stomach is called, why I call the stomach the peacemaker is, because the stomach is in fact your system in order to negotiate with other people in harmony. So, if you start the day correctly by going into mindfulness, you then have the ability to engage with others in a peaceful intent. So, it becomes natural. So, you have this 20 minutes where you sit and eat and go mindful and you don't multitask. If you don't, , and you multitask and you stand up and rush around, you're not the peacemaker. You're a troublemaker, because now you get to reactive throughout the day. Because, you didn't let go of your negative thoughts through your practice. You didn't have the peacemaker. You didn't settle in the morning with breakfast. Now, you've got too much negativity and you got to dump it on others. Road rage, anger, telling other people what they should be doing, getting judgemental, critical and things like that.   Jost: (58:34) The peace maker means, you're not judgemental. You just going through the day, whatever it is, but you know exactly who you are, so you keep moving. Then after that, after the peacemaker, after a beautiful peaceful breakfast, you go hard. Work very hard. And that's the builder and the emperor and that Spleen and Heart. So, you work very, very hard on your journey, on your job, on whatever needs to be doing. You know who you are, because you have seen who you are and you felt who you are during your morning practice. It was all downloaded via the breakfast. The breakfast gave you the piece, now you work hard. So, it's you start with the Yang, breakfast at Yin, then you go Yang. Then, about one o'clock, it's Small Intestine time and it's now judgment. So, that means you need to sit back and allow the whole day to be looked at. So, you stop rushing. You're in front of the judge, and the judge will look at your case, because you've done already a major part of your day. Because really when you look at, you started the day about by transforming negativity into positivity. You did the detox, you then had peaceful intent set at breakfast. You then worked very hard in your destiny. Then at one o'clock, or 1:30, you sit down... And then you sit down and you have a meal, lunch.   Jost: (59:56) And then, in the afternoon you go more into the Yin mode. And then, at five o'clock you go into Kidney time. It means you switch off from the day. And at switch off time, between 5:00 and 7:00, you're actually switching off from the day.   Jost: (01:00:13) [inaudible 01:00:13].   Mason: (01:00:16) Jake, you can edit that part, yeah?   Jost: (01:00:18) Yeah. [inaudible 01:00:18].   Jost: (01:00:27) So then, this is another important part, between 5:00 PM and 7:00 PM is exactly the same importance as between 5:00 AM and 7:00 AM. That sometime in the time, you need to switch off from the day, because the Yang phase is moving into the Yin phase. So, the Qi side is all about Yang, Yang, Yang, Yang, going to mid time. And then, from the afternoon it goes into Yin phase. But then, between 5:00 and 7:00, we need to consciously switch off. Once again, we work with the practice, a little bit of Chi Gong, a bit of yoga and it takes us away from thinking into feeling. But because it's supported by the Kidney, and the Kidney is the puppeteer. And the Kidneys are another of Yin and Yang. You actually have a direct access to the scene behind the curtain. Actually you feel mystical in that moment.   Jost: (01:01:19) So, the switch off practice, when you look at the ancient cultures, between 5:00 and 7:00, the farmers, everyone, the workers came into the village, into the center and played bowls. They're switching off from the day.   Mason: (01:01:32) That's the same with the Italians playing dominoes at the day.   Jost: (01:01:34) Yeah. Domino, connecting, not via work, connecting via play.   Mason: (01:01:44) Yes.   Jost: (01:01:44) So, if you connect via play, you work with Yin and Yang. So, that means you're actually letting go of the day. At the same time, you're embracing the joy of being in the company of others. So, this is all ancient cultures follow the Qi cycle.   Mason: (01:02:00) Yeah, you're right.   Jost: (01:02:01) And then, between 7:00 and 9:00, they all go home and then you're just by yourself, with your family, with your loved ones, and you go completely into yourself. And that's when you have another meal and a glass of wine. And it's completely just cut off from the day. It is like, now you had security at home. And Pericardium time between 7:00 and 9:00 is actually being at home. And, it's called the bodyguard in my book, because if you get this right, you will actually guard the heart off cardiovascular disease and anxiety and all kinds of other stuff. Because the Pericardium channel is the channel that got discovered in the 1600s hundreds, and it's the main channel used in order to treat CVD, cardiovascular disease, anxiety, depression, etc. And, that you regulate that simply by between 7:00 and 9:00 PM, you're just going into yourself and being with loved ones and you're not doing anything in order to project outside. You guard your heart. It's your body guard. You got your heart. It's like the body guard in front of the prime minister, it ushers all the journalists the way.   Mason: (01:03:08) Yeah.   Jost: (01:03:09) So, by seven o'clock you're going into your own world. So, it is the pajamas, whatever, cross fitting, whatever. It's irrelevant, as long as you're completely calm. And then, usually, if you follow the cycle so far, at nine o'clock, the energy goes into San Jiao, which is a mystical organ. And I call it in the book the ferry man, because it's actually involved with the lubrication. It's like a ferry man in Venice. And what it is, it's

Resonance, 感應 gan ying, is an aspect of Chinese philosophy that runs through many aspects of our medicine. We see resonance as we look through the unfolding of life through the five phases. The way we see east, spring, liver, green, beginnings and wood as having shared energies; the way they resonant the phase of wood. We see it in the how the six conformations express health or illness through five phase relations that are emblematic of each side of the conformation. The way Tai Yang can express with the cold of the Urinary Bladder, or the heat of the Small Intestine. The way Shao Yang Gall Bladder and San Jiao tend to go outwards, while the Jue Yin aspects of Liver and Pericardium move inward. Resonance is built into how we work. And in this conversation we explore how resonant nature of music and vibration can be used in our clinical practice. Along with a look at the kind of knowing that arises when you have the ability to cozy up to irrationality.   Head on over to the show notes page for more information about this episode and for links to the resources discussed in the interview.  

Entrevista San Jiao

Entrevista San Jiao

This podcast explores needling technique, indications, and clinical applications for the individual acupuncture points of San Jiao 23 to Gall Bladder 5. As seasoned practitioners work many years with different points, a certain distinct pattern of usage arises from these experiences. This discussion is more highly focused than what an acupuncture textbook can provide. The conversation is based on our own experience in working with these individual points over a period of 30 years in clinical practice. It is our hope that acupuncture practitioners will gain a refreshed new view of these points with renewed clinical insights. About the authors: Dr. Daoshing Ni is the co-founder of Yo San University of Traditional Chinese Medicine, and serves as chair of the Doctoral program in Women’s Health and Reproductive Medicine. Dr. James Skoien is an international lecturer on the topic of Chinese Medicine with over 33 years of teaching experience.

This podcast explores needling technique, indications, and clinical applications for the individual acupuncture points of San Jiao 17-22. As seasoned practitioners work many years with different points, a certain distinct pattern of usage arises from these experiences. This discussion is more highly focused than what an acupuncture textbook can provide. The conversation is based on our own experience in working with these individual points over a period of 30 years in clinical practice. It is our hope that acupuncture practitioners will gain a refreshed new view of these points with renewed clinical insights. About the authors: Dr. Daoshing Ni is the co-founder of Yo San University of Traditional Chinese Medicine, and serves as chair of the Doctoral program in Women’s Health and Reproductive Medicine. Dr. James Skoien is an international lecturer on the topic of Chinese Medicine with over 33 years of teaching experience.

This podcast explores needling technique, indications, and clinical applications for the individual acupuncture points of San Jiao 11-16. As seasoned practitioners work many years with different points, a certain distinct pattern of usage arises from these experiences. This discussion is more highly focused than what an acupuncture textbook can provide. The conversation is based on our own experience in working with these individual points over a period of 30 years in clinical practice. It is our hope that acupuncture practitioners will gain a refreshed new view of these points with renewed clinical insights. About the authors: Dr. Daoshing Ni is the co-founder of Yo San University of Traditional Chinese Medicine, and serves as chair of the Doctoral program in Women’s Health and Reproductive Medicine. Dr. James Skoien is an international lecturer on the topic of Chinese Medicine with over 33 years of teaching experience.

This podcast explores needling technique, indications, and clinical applications for the individual acupuncture points of San Jiao 5-10. As seasoned practitioners work many years with different points, a certain distinct pattern of usage arises from these experiences. This discussion is more highly focused than what an acupuncture textbook can provide. The conversation is based on our own experience in working with these individual points over a period of 30 years in clinical practice. It is our hope that acupuncture practitioners will gain a refreshed new view of these points with renewed clinical insights. About the authors: Dr. Daoshing Ni is the co-founder of Yo San University of Traditional Chinese Medicine, and serves as chair of the Doctoral program in Women’s Health and Reproductive Medicine. Dr. James Skoien is an international lecturer on the topic of Chinese Medicine with over 33 years of teaching experience.

This podcast explores needling technique, indications, and clinical applications for the individual acupuncture points of Pericardium 8 to San Jiao 4. As seasoned practitioners work many years with different points, a certain distinct pattern of usage arises from these experiences. This discussion is more highly focused than what an acupuncture textbook can provide. The conversation is based on our own experience in working with these individual points over a period of 30 years in clinical practice. It is our hope that acupuncture practitioners will gain a refreshed new view of these points with renewed clinical insights. About the authors: Dr. Daoshing Ni is the co-founder of Yo San University of Traditional Chinese Medicine, and serves as chair of the Doctoral program in Women’s Health and Reproductive Medicine. Dr. James Skoien is an international lecturer on the topic of Chinese Medicine with over 33 years of teaching experience.

In this episode with Dan Bensky we discuss the intricacies of palpation, his insights around palpating the San Jiao, and how refining your palpation skills can assist with your diagnosis, your acupuncture choices, and better inform your herbal prescriptions. Inspired by his background in osteopathy and craniosacral methods, Dan brings the classics of ancient acupuncture descriptions to life using the osteopathic approach to help bridge the gap in the practical hands on palpatory learning of acupuncture.Dan Benksy has a diploma in Chinese medicine from Macau institute of Chinese medicine, and a PhD from the China Academy of Chinese Medical Sciences. He also has a Doctor of Osteopathy. He practices in Seattle and you can find his clinic here. (www.danbensky.com).Dan has authored and co-authored many important Chinese medicine texts including the Shanghai Acupuncture text, Chinese medicine material medica, and Chinese Herbal medicine formulas and strategies.We'd love to hear your comments and feedback on this episode. Please drop by our Facebook page to let us know what you think on this topic!

In this episode with Dan Bensky we discuss the intricacies of palpation, his insights around palpating the San Jiao, and how refining your palpation skills can assist with your diagnosis, your acupuncture choices, and better inform your herbal prescriptions. Inspired by his background in osteopathy and craniosacral methods, Dan brings …

Using anatomical terminology I describe the pathway of the San Jiao (Triple Heater) Meridian