Scaling DevTools

This episode is with Sunil Pai. He works at Cloudflare after his startup PartyKit was acquired. Previously he was on the React core team at Meta.He's a great guy. And obsessed with AI agents. This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links:- Sunil Pai on X - Sunil Pai's site- Building agents with Cloudflare - PartyKit - Durable objects 

Thomas Paul Mann is the cofounder of Raycast. I use Raycast every day as a replacement for Spotlight. For me, shortcuts are the most useful feature. I put curl requests I commonly use as well as random things like email snippets. It's a massive time saver and really well built.Raycast is a genuinely well built product so Thomas talks quality, getting feedback and how they ship features. We also talk about their unique YC experience and how they've been building AI into Raycast. This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links:RaycastRaycast Extensions StoreTerminal Coffee x RaycastThomas on Twitter/X

Russ D'Sa is the founder of LiveKit. They are an open source tool for real time audio and video for LLM applications and they power the voice chat for ChatGPT and Character AI.We discuss:- How lightning works (using ChatGPT/LiveKit)- How LiveKit started working with OpenAI- Why Russ turned down an early 20m acquisition offer- What it's like to work with the fastest growing company (ever?)- How to prepare for massive scale challenges- Russ's 3 letter twitter handleThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign-On and audit logs. Links:- LiveKit  - Russ's Twitter 

Pete Hamilton and Chris Evans are cofounders of Incident.io. Incident is an incident management tool. We discuss:How they think about brand and how it comes from their deep understanding of incident cultureLawrence's article asking for new macbooks that went viralGallows humor in incidents Why incident.io started on Heroku despite being an incident response platform—and why “shipping fast” mattered more than “scaling perfectly.”The benefit of building for users who are just like youHow Incident is using GenAIThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign-On and audit logs. Links:Pete Hamilton on Twitter Chris Evans on TwitterIncident Macbook articleThe flight plan that brought UK airspace to its kneesHow Netflix drives reliability across their organizationNote: this was recorded on 13th December 2024.

David Cramer, co-founder of Sentry talks M&As and why they should be utilized more when you don't achieve huge success. Plus we talk about the importance of good branding.We discuss:The biggest mistake small startup founders make by not exploring potential acquisitions.The role of ego in startupsProduct-market-fitHiring entrepreneurial talent and why acqui-hiring is so big.The significance of branding beyond just marketing – how it builds trust, recognition, and demand.Sentry's approach to branding, emphasizing authenticity, community, and accessibility.What DevTools can learn from Liquid Death and PorscheWhy brand mattersThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign-On and audit logs. https://workos.com/Links:David Cramer's blogDavid Cramer on XSentry

Ramon, creator of Raylib, joins us to discuss his journey from building an educational tool to establishing one of the most popular open-source game engines. As of February 2025, Raylib is the second most popular open-source game engine behind Godot, boasting 25,000 GitHub stars, 13,000 Discord community members, and over 8,000 subreddit members. Ramon has transitioned from lecturing and consulting to focusing on his paid tools built around Raylib.We discuss:How Raylib started as a teaching project to help art students learn programming through simple and intuitive function naming.The active community behind Raylib and how Ramon personally engages with new members, contributing to the project's growth.Why simplicity and not making assumptions about prior knowledge can create a strong foundation for both beginners and experienced developers.The benefits of using a low-level library like Raylib versus higher-level game engines like Unity, particularly for small indie games.Ramon's approach to managing his workload as a solo developer, emphasizing organization, automation, and using his own tools to build tools.His method of testing new tools by quickly launching them, observing market response, and iterating on the most successful ones.The importance of enjoying the process of building an open-source project rather than focusing solely on commercial success.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/Links:Raylib (https://www.raylib.com/)Cat and Onion game (https://store.steampowered.com/app/2781210/CAT__ONION/)Raylib GitHub (https://github.com/raysan5/raylib)Raylib Discord (https://discord.gg/raylib)Raylib Subreddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/raylib/)Ramon's Tools (https://raylibtech.com/tools/)

Maxim Fateev and Samar Abbas from Temporal join us to discuss how their durable execution platform ensures processes complete reliably at scale.We discuss:How Temporal gained enterprise adoption with companies like Airbnb, HashiCorp, and Snapchat.Why Temporal compensates salespeople based on customer consumption.Temporal's role in Snapchat's story processing and Taco Bell's Taco Tuesday scalability.How Temporal earns enterprise trust through security, reliability, and scalability.The structure of Temporal's sales team and their focus on long-term customer success.Exciting trends in AI and low-code/no-code development.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links: Temporal Temporal GitHub

Nikita Shamgunov is the founder of Neon, an open-source serverless Postgres company. Before Neon, Nikita co-founded MemSQL, now SingleStore, which is valued at over a billion dollars. He has also worked as a VC at Khosla Ventures and held engineering roles at Meta and Microsoft. Nikita is known for his strategic thinking and transparency about his decision-making process.We discuss:The importance of storytelling and providing a clear narrative for your companyWhen to introduce a sales team and how to build a sales and marketing "machine"Pricing strategies, including pricing for storage and compute in the data and analytics spaceThe evolution of revenue models in DevTools: from selling seats and storage/compute to selling tokensLessons learned from hiring MongoDB's VP of Engineering, focusing on improving reliability and building strong team management processesThe benefits of using a high-quality recruiting firm and avoiding the pitfalls of bad hiresBalancing competitiveness with respect for competitors to maintain credibility, particularly in the developer tools marketThe idea of “developing your taste” in product development, inspired by Guillermo Rauch from VercelHow modern dev tools can monetize through seats, storage/compute, or tokens, with tokens currently being the most profitableWhy Nikita advises DevTools founders to understand the business model framework and align it with their strategyThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links:NeonSingleStore Khosla Ventures Fusion Talent 

 David Placek from Lexicon - the man who named Vercel and Azure - explains the importance of selecting a name that goes beyond simply describing what a product does. He shares what you can do to come up with a great name. We cover:Common Naming Pitfalls: Discusses why names that merely describe a product or service fail to capture imagination and differentiation.The Strategic Impact of a Name: Explains how a well-chosen name can deliver significant returns on investment by reinforcing brand behavior and market positioning.Sound Symbolism and Cognitive Science: Covers research into how letter sounds (for example, the “V” in Vercel) influence perception and contribute to a name's effectiveness.The Naming Process: Details the rigorous process behind naming—from trademark searches and legal reviews to global linguistic evaluations and whiteboard sessions with clients.Advice for Early-Stage Founders: Encourages startups to first define their market behavior and the change they intend to create. The right name will emerge from a clear strategic vision.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links:Lexicon BrandingVercelPG .com quote

Mitchell Hashimoto - famously the founder of HashiCorp (creators of Terraform, Vault etc.) joins the show to discuss his latest open-source project, Ghostty, a modern terminal emulator. We discuss:Designing dev tools with a focus on human experience.Taking on large technical projects and breaking them down into achievable steps.Open source sustainability and the role of financial support.The impossible goal of building a perfect human experience with software.Passion and hiring—why obsession with a topic often leads to the best hires.Using AI as a developer and why Mitchell considers AI tooling essential.The motivation behind Ghostty and the idea of "technical philanthropy."The vision for libghostty as a reusable terminal core for other applications.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/Links:Ghostty (https://ghostty.org/)Mitchell Hashimoto on Twitter (https://twitter.com/mitchellh)Mitchell's blog (https://mitchellh.com/)

Guillermo Rauch is the founder of Vercel. Vercel is a cloud infra platform so easy to use that it's almost become a category: “I'm building the Vercel of X”. Vercel also recently launched v0 which is potentially the next evolution of web development - type what you want and it builds it and deploys it for you. He's also the creator Next.js, socket.io and a ton of other open source tools and startups. Plus he's a prolific investor in DevTools. I've missed a ton of his achievements here but essentially, he's the king of DevTools and you probably know him already.What we talk about- Why Guillermo bets on people who ship- What AI has in common with Prettier- v0 puts design first- Saying ‘not yet' is a boss move- Why Guillermo thinks devs won't lose their jobs- How you can learn product building- Why you should be careful when hiring from rocketships - not everyone was in the control room- The value of people having a full stack skill set. And why communication is more important than ever- Why it's so important to explain what you do in simple terms- Tools Guillermo is excited about right nowLinks:- Guillermo Rauch - Vercel - v0 - NextJS- Socket.IO - Browserbase - LiveKit- LanguineThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/

Jacob Eiting, CEO of RevenueCat, joins us to discuss mobile developers and how they're different, RevenueCat's recent acquisition of Dipsea - and how it helps them dogfood.We also go hard on content - something RevenueCat is great at.We also talk about charisma in founders (but don't worry neither of us said rizz)This was especially fun because I actually used RevenueCat way before I started this show. We discuss:How RevenueCat simplifies in-app subscriptions and why mobile monetization is more complex than it appears.Making developers feel like heroes instead of struggling with tedious implementation.RevenueCat's acquisition of Dipsea—a customer with over 100,000 subscribers—and how it benefits both companies.The advantages of operating an app at scale to better test and iterate on new RevenueCat features.How in-app subscription businesses differ from traditional SaaS in terms of pricing, churn, and optimization.The importance of content marketing and transparency in building trust with developers.The role of personality and authenticity in developer-first marketing.The long-term vision for RevenueCat and how they plan to expand beyond their core subscription infrastructure.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/Links:Jacob Eiting (https://x.com/jeiting)RevenueCat (https://www.revenuecat.com/)Dipsea (https://www.dipseastories.com/)

Taylor Otwell is the creator of the Laravel framework. Taylor has created numerous paid products that have generated millions, such as:Laravel Forge (server provisioning/management)Laravel Vapor (serverless Laravel hosting with AWS)Laravel Envoyer (zero downtime PHP deployments)Laravel Nova (Laravel admin panel)In this interview, Taylor shares why he is now building Laravel Cloud - an infrastructure platform for Laravel apps and why Laravel Cloud needed VC funding.We also cover:The different challenges of bootstrapped and VC funded startupsHow the Laravel ecosystem became so entrepreneurial Building products for the average joe developerThe role of taste and craft in developer toolsWhat Taylor and Adam Wathan learned from each other Fear and Taylor's comparison with  Alex Honnold This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links: Laravel  Taylor Otwell Laravel Cloud Open jobs at Laravel Adam Wathan Chapters:00:00 The Journey of Laravel's Creator02:48 Transitioning from Bootstrap to VC Funding06:10 Building Laravel Cloud: A New Challenge09:04 The Shift in Company Structure and Culture11:50 Maintaining Quality and Usability in Development15:09 Community Impact and Collaboration17:56 Craftsmanship and Design Philosophy20:45 Navigating Growth and Market Needs23:54 Advice for Aspiring DevTool Founders26:48 Future Directions and Innovations in LaravelThank you to Michael Grinich for making this happen. Thank you to Ostap Brehin for introducing me to Laravel. Thank you to Hank Taylor for helping me prep.  

In this episode, I pull out some of the key DevTools lessons I've learned in the last 120 interviews. Including:The importance of deeply understanding the problem you're solving by talking to developers directly, as emphasized by Adam Frankl.Ant Wilson's advice on experimenting with different go-to-market strategies and channels rather than relying on conventional wisdom. Zeno Rocha's emphasis on the importance of the last mile—packaging and presentation. He shares how spending more time on documentation and onboarding materials helped his open-source project gain massive traction.Gonto's perspective that "it's better to be different than better," and how creativity, uniqueness, and understanding developer habits are key to successful marketing.My personal reflections on overcoming fear and discomfort in go-to-market efforts.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com.

Søren Bramer Schmidt, co-founder and CEO of Prisma, joins us to discuss the journey of building one of the largest developer communities in DevTools. Søren shares how Prisma's deliberate strategies have shaped its growth, feature prioritization, and the launch of new products like Prisma Postgres. We also explore the challenges of managing a vast user base and how Prisma is adapting to shifts in application development.We discuss:How intentional partnerships with educators and influencers fueled Prisma's early growth.Strategies to engage the GraphQL community and gain visibility on platforms like Hacker News.Managing a large developer community while balancing innovation with stability.The evolution from Graphcool to Prisma ORM, including lessons from early pivots.Launching Prisma Postgres and how community feedback influenced its development.Implementing a simple, usage-based pricing model and reducing infrastructure costs through self-hosting.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/Links:Prisma (https://www.prisma.io/)Prisma Postgres (https://www.prisma.io/postgres)Feldera (https://feldera.com/)

Keith Casey aka Danger Casey is a Senior Product Manager at Pangea - a Security Platform as a Service.Before Pangea, Keith was Director of Product Marketing at ngrok and worked at Okta and Twilio in a variety of roles - including DevRel.  Keith also curates API Developer Weekly.In this episode we discuss Keith's writings on the future of DevRel.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Links:- original article - followup article- How to kill your sdks in one easy step- Developer productivity and selling to developers- api developer weekly - Pangea - DevRel = zirp phenomenom? 

Louis Knight-Webb is the CEO and co-founder of Bloop.Bloop helps with modernizing legacy software, particularly focusing on COBOL and mainframes. This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Takeaways:- Mainframes and COBOL are still foundational in many industries.- Bloop started with a focus on code search but evolved to address legacy code modernization.- The transition from COBOL to Java is a significant challenge for many enterprises.- Innovative approaches are needed to effectively translate legacy code.- Ensuring code quality during migration is crucial to avoid operational disruptions.- AI can enhance the code translation process but has limitations with legacy languages.Links:- Louis Knight-Webb - Bloop  Chapters:00:00 The Legacy of Mainframes and COBOL03:05 The Evolution of Bloop and Code Search05:58 Challenges in Modernizing Legacy Code08:48 Navigating the Enterprise Code Landscape12:11 The Transition from COBOL to Java15:05 Innovative Approaches to Code Translation18:02 Ensuring Code Quality and Functionality20:56 The Future of Development and AI Integration23:52 Building Relationships in the Enterprise Space26:45 The Long-Term Vision for Legacy Code Modernization

Guy Podjarny is the founder of Tessl - a startup that is rethinking how we build software.Guy previously founded Snyk - a dependency scanning tool worth billions of dollars. Before Snyk, Guy founded Blaze, which he sold to Akamai.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. In this conversation, we talk about the future of programming and the future of DevTools. The future of programming will focus on writing specifications.Trust in AI toolsSnyk is an example of how tools can integrate into existing workflows.Code can become disposable, allowing for flexibility in development.Specifications will serve as repositories of truth in software development.Developers will need to adapt their skills to leverage AI tools effectively.Community collaboration is essential for the evolution of AI development tools.AI simplifies and democratizes the process of software creationThanks to Anna Debenham for making this happen. 

Tessa Kriesel is the founder of builtfor.dev, where she helps DevTools founders with GTM.In this episode we talk about how she helps founders improve their go to market strategy in a short sprint.Links:Built for DevsTessa Kriesel This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. https://workos.com/

We dig into the the build vs. buy dilemma for APIs, and the role of OpenAPI in effective documentation. This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.We explore how AI is transforming the landscape of APIs and developer tools, and discuss the future of coding.The choice between building and buying SDKs depends on company maturity.OpenAPI is crucial for generating quality API documentation.AI is revolutionizing how APIs are created and consumed.Maintaining SDK libraries can be a significant challenge.Developer tools must evolve to keep pace with API design changes.Trust in AI-generated code is growing among developers.The future of coding will likely involve more AI integration.Links:APIMaticSid Maestre

Jake Cooper is the founder of Railway - an infrastructure platform that let's you build powerful infrastructure in a simple way. This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. In this episode we discuss:- Building a remote team with a flat structure- Railway's sales team doing their best Minority Report impression- Why leverage matters- Building their own data centers- Why it's important to do hard thingsP.s. here's news about the tsunami warning  Links:- Railway  - Jake Cooper - Angelo from Railway 

In this conversation, Daksh Gupta, the CEO of Greptile - an AI code understanding API - shares:Why it's important to do unique types of marketing, like making an energy drinkWhy most people misunderstand salesHow companies are buying AI tools and why it will probably change soonThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.Links:Greptile greptile.com Mintlify https://mintlify.com/Greptile energy drink https://x.com/dakshgup/status/1769813883194130856 Steve Ballmer boxes https://x.com/dakshgup/status/1854224733086359582 PostHog competition https://x.com/james406/status/1854557581030670478  

Ankur Goyal is the founder of ​Braintrust​, a year old LLM eval platform that is already used by Figma, Vercel and Stripe and just raised $36m from a16z. It's a rocketship.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Key Success Factors- Started with a targeted list of ~50 companies already working with AI- Focused on early adopters and innovators in the space- Strategy: If they could make the frontrunners happy, others would followLinks:- Braintrust - Ankur Goyal - Alana Goyal - Basecase  - Elad Gil  - Martin Casado Chapters:* 00:00  Introduction to BrainTrust and Its Success* 02:52  The Importance of User Research in Product Development* 06:11  Building Relationships with Key Customers* 09:05  The Role of Feedback in Product Improvement* 11:54  The Impact of Mentorship on Entrepreneurial Success* 15:11  Identifying Market Opportunities in AI Development* 18:00  Effective User Interviews and Problem Validation* 20:59  The Evolution of BrainTrust's Product Features* 23:55  Advice for Aspiring DevTool Founders* 26:48  Exciting Developments in the DevTool Space

​Samuel Colvin​ - the creator of ​Pydantic​ - the most popular data validation library for Python. Used by literally everyone (Anthropic, OpenAI, Meta, NVIDIA, even the NSA). He shares the story behind his startup ​Logfire​ which just raised $12.5m from Sequoia.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs. Key takeaways:- You can just build a different product to your open source project and leverage your brand- Quality of product matters a LOT (if you can build a popular open source project, can probably build a quality paid product)- Really helps to be part of a movement. Hard to predict but Pydantic benefited from two (types and LLMs)- GitHub stars are a vanity metric compared to download numbersLinks:- Pydantic - Logfire - Samuel Colvin Chapters00:00 The Genesis of Pydantic02:46 The Evolution of Software Development06:02 Building a Successful Open Source Library08:52 The Impact of Community and Adoption11:51 Metrics of Success in Open Source15:08 Transitioning from Pydantic to LogFire17:59 The Vision Behind LogFire20:50 The Connection Between Pydantic and LogFire24:05 Navigating the Challenges of Building a Startup26:56 The Future of Observability and DatabasesP.s. thanks to my friend Abeed for making the episode happen!

There are more and more open source DevTools startups. I've interviewed dozens. But I am still confused about open source licenses. So I decided to ask questions to two people who actually understand them: my friends Eric and Matt - founders of open source background jobs tool Trigger.dev.This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.What we discuss:Two Key Questions for License SelectionWhat are the benefits of permissive licenses?What are the main licenses?Why shouldn't you write your own (open source) license?What is Copyleft?Post Open Source" Movement(00:50) - Open Source Licensing (18:18) - Protective Licensing (23:12) - Copy Left Concept (43:30) - Wordpress Trigger:Eric Allam - https://x.com/maverickdotdev Matt Aitken - https://x.com/mattaitkenTrigger.dev https://trigger.dev/JSON Hero https://jsonhero.io/ LicensesMIT License https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIT_License - Matt's “most permissive license”Apache-2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apache_License - “Like MIT but with trademarks”FSL / Fair Source License https://fair.io/ - created by SentryHeather Meeker - Open Source Licencing expert https://www.linkedin.com/in/heathermeeker/ A practical guide to Open Source Licencing https://www.amazon.co.uk/Open-Source-Business-Practical-Licensing/dp/1544737645 ReferencesSentry https://sentry.io/welcome/ Redis https://redis.io/ Valkey https://valkey.io/ Clickhouse https://clickhouse.com/ Background to Continue.dev and PearAI https://techcrunch.com/2024/09/30/y-combinator-is-being-criticized-after-it-backed-an-ai-startup-that-admits-it-basically-cloned-another-ai-startup/ 

John O'Nolan is the Founder and CEO of Ghost.org. Ghost is an open source blog & newsletter platform. We use them for the Scaling DevTools' blog.Note: this episode was recorded on 17th October 2024.We talk about:How to communicate the benefits of Open Source to non-developersHow Ghost manages to align open source and money makingJohn's thoughts on the Automattic/Wordpress dramaAdvantages and disadvantages of VC funding and open sourceWhat would John do with VC dollarsResources:Ghost https://ghost.org/John's website https://john.onolan.org/The WordPress vs. WP Engine drama, explained https://techcrunch.com/2024/11/07/wordpress-vs-wp-engine-drama-explained/ Indie Hackers podcast https://www.indiehackers.com/podcast/139-john-onolan-of-ghostCursor cursor.comBen Thompson's blog https://stratechery.com/This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

Gonto (Martin Gontovnikas) was the 6th employee at Auth0 and helped them grow fast and sell for $6.5billion to Okta.  Now he is the founder of Hypergrowth Partners and helps DevTools grow fast.We discuss:What Auth0 did to become so valuable so fastWhat the best founders do (Guillermo Rauch)Different is better than better People follow people not brandsWhy bleeding edge mattersResourcesWhy Technical SDRs are the Future of DevToolshttps://playbooks.hypergrowthpartners.com/p/product-advocates-technical-sdrsGonto's website https://gon.to/Gonto's Twitter https://twitter.com/mgontoHypergrowth Partners https://www.hypergrowthpartners.com/Code to Market https://codetomarket.fm/Guillermo Rauch https://x.com/rauchgThis episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

Mike McQuaid and John Britton are cofounders of Workbrew - a tool that gives you the missing features for enterprises running homebrew. John has previously worked at GitHub and Twilio and is a contributor to Homebrew. Mike has also worked at GitHub as well as being the project lead and longest running maintainer at Homebrew. We dig into:How Homebrew can trace its origins to a pub in LondonHow Apple actually work with HomebrewHow Homebrew managed to grow and scale upHow Workbrew are avoiding misaligned incentives so common in open sourceLinks for Mike, John and WorkbrewMike McQuaid https://mikemcquaid.com/John Britton https://johndbritton.com/Workbrew https://workbrew.com/This episode is brought to you by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

Paul Klein is the founder and CEO of Browserbase - one of the fastest growing DevTools in 2024.Browserbase is a headless browser API focused on helping AI Agent startups.We dig into:Why browser automation?How Browserbase hit "VC-market-fit"Visionary is revisionist-history Tips for hiring your friendsWhy buying a jacket is like buying a devtoolBuilding an in-person DevTool in San FranciscoMaking priorities (what Paul doesn't care about).Where to find Paul and Browserbase:Twitter/X https://x.com/pauljasonklein?lang=enLinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulkleinivBrowserbase https://www.browserbase.com/ReferencesMux acquires Stream Club https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/mux-acquires-stream-club-to-enable-developers-to-build-live-streaming-studios-into-their-applications-301449407.htmlLevelsio on VPSs https://x.com/levelsio/status/1827308534645572015 Charly Poly https://www.linkedin.com/in/charly-poly/?originalSubdomain=frDevTools Pauls: Paul Butler https://x.com/paulgb?lang=en and Paul Copplestone https://www.linkedin.com/in/paulcopplestoneSolaris office space https://www.solarissf.com/To support Scaling DevTools, please check out the Enterprise Ready Conf from WorkOS https://enterprise-ready.com/

In 2017, Rasmus Makwarth sold his previous APM (Application Performance Managment) startup Opbeat to Elastic for an undisclosed amount. Opbeat became Elastic APM, which became a big part of the Elastic Observability solution and Rasmus became Senior Director of Product Management - with a focus on Developer Experience.Today, Rasmus is the founder and CEO of Bucket.co - a feature flagging tool built for B2B teams. Bucket has raised $5.7m from investors such as Project A and Creandum. We dig into:The realities of fundraising on a deadlineThe role of San Francisco in fundraising - do you need to be there?How exit opportunities can come from unexpected sources and the importance of showing up The importance of building a great productWhat Rasmus learned at Elastic - one of the biggest DevTools in the world Why Bucket is betting on helping engineers at b2b companies understand how users use their featuresThe future of product engineeringWhere to find Rasmus:LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/makwarth/?originalSubdomain=dkTwitter/X https://x.com/makwarthBucket https://bucket.co/ReferencesElastic https://elastic.co/Opbeat acquisition announcement https://www.elastic.co/blog/welcome-opbeat-to-the-elastic-familyShay Banon - founder of Elastic https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimchy/Gregory Tademoto - VP Global Business & Corporate Development https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregorytademoto/To support Scaling DevTools, check out the Enterprise Ready Conf from WorkOS https://enterprise-ready.com/

Shawn Wang (aka swyx) is the founder of smol.ai (AI news curation), and the cohost of Latent Space (popular AI Engineer podcast). Plus, Shawn started the AI Engineer movement with his essay Rise of the AI Engineer and organized two incredible AI engineer conferences in the past twelve months - AI Engineer World's Fair and AI Engineer SummitAnd Shawn has angel invested in DevTools like Airbyte, Railway, Supabase, Replay.io, Stackblitz, Flutterflow, Fireworks.ai while running the DevTools angels community. Besides this, Shawn curates DX.tips (DevTools magazine) and in a past life wrote the Coding Career handbook, championed learn in public, cofounded Svelte Society and was previously Head of Developer Experience at Temporal, and a Developer Advocate at AWS and Netlify.Also, before this, Shawn had a very successful career in investment banking, trading, building data pipelines and performing quantitate portfolio management. I think this brings him a very unique perspective - I've always admired his ability to zoom out and see the big picture and the trends. Even though Shawn is now all-in on AI, he's still one of the go-to authorities on DevTools go-to-market.As you can tell, Shawn is someone I deeply admire. So I'm glad he came back.What we discuss:Organizing the AI Engineer ConferencesRise of the AI EngineerIntentionality and principles (yes we even talk about Alcoholics Anonymous)The AI CEOInvisible deadlinesIlya believing in AGI more than most people at OpenAIAre developers going to be obsolete? Thor convinced swyx to invest in SupabaseBuilding DevTools that work well with LLMsAngel investing in DevTools - why and howIs DevRel dead?How to hire DevRelWhy DX.tips existsLinks:Rise of the AI Engineer https://www.latent.space/p/ai-engineerLatent Space Podcast https://www.latent.space/swyx's Twitter https://x.com/swyxswyx's website https://www.swyx.io/swyx's LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/shawnswyxwang/smol.ai https://smol.ai/DevTools Angels https://github.com/sw-yx/devtools-angelsDX.tips https://dx.tips/DevRel's Death as Zero Interest Rate Phenomenon https://dx.tips/zirp AI Engineer Summit https://www.ai.engineer/summit/2023AI Engineer World's Fair https://www.ai.engineer/worldsfairCoding Career Handbook https://www.learninpublic.org/Shawn's previous appearance on Scaling DevTools https://podcast.scalingdevtools.com/episodes/swyx Eisenhower Matrix https://asana.com/resources/eisenhower-matrixThor from Supabase https://x.com/thorwebdevSolaris AI coworking space in SF https://www.solarissf.com/Browserbase https://www.browserbase.com/Indent https://indent.com/ and Fouad https://x.com/fouadmatinHow to do hackathons https://dx.tips/hackathonsHow to do conferences https://dx.tips/conf-guideHow to hire DevRel https://dx.tips/mailbox-first-devrel-hiringClimbing the ladder of abstraction with Amelia Wattenberger https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAy_GHUAICwCheck out the Enterprise Ready Conf from WorkOS https://enterprise-ready.com/

Sagar is the CEO and co-founder of Speakeasy - an API tooling platform. We talk about the journey of Speakeasy. The challenges of startup life. How they developed the product and how they work with influencers in a surprising way.Building relationships with influencers can significantly enhance product development.Importance of listening to customersFine line between product and consultingThe role of documentation in user experienceBeing responsive to customer needs builds long-term relationships.The startup journey requires patience and adaptability.Links:Sagar Batchu Speakeasy https://www.speakeasy.com/Check out the Enterprise Ready Conf from WorkOS https://enterprise-ready.com/

In this conversation, Anurag Goel, founder and CEO of Render, discusses the evolution of Render as a cloud infrastructure platform is actually simple to use.He shares insights from his time at Stripe, emphasizing the importance of customer focus, crafting a seamless user experience, and the philosophy of progressive disclosure of complexity. Anurag also highlights the significance of customer support as an integral part of the product and offers advice for aspiring founders on finding their passion and maintaining empathy in their work.What we discuss:Building in special details enhances customer experience.The delicate balance between simplicity and capability. How the power of sensible defaults. and progressive disclosure of complexity improves usability.Focus on customer needs drives product development.Customer support should be treated as a product.Finding founder market fit is crucial for success.Empathy for users is essential in product development.LinksAnurag's Twitter https://x.com/anuraggoelRender https://render.com/Stripe https://stripe.com/KeywordsRender, developer experience, cloud infrastructure, customer support, startup culture, Anurag Goel, Stripe, product development, user experience, technology

This is our 100th episode! And we're thrilled to welcome back fan favourite Ant Wilson - the cofounder and CTO of Supabase.They discuss the evolution of Supabase, the importance of open source, and effective marketing strategies. Ant shares insights on community engagement, the significance of developer-centric branding, and the challenges of navigating the enterprise landscape. We also touch on the rise of AI and vector databases, emphasizing the power of open source in development. The conversation concludes with reflections on the journey and future aspirations.Thank you to everyone who made it our 100th episode!TakeawaysOpen source can significantly enhance hiring opportunities.Building a strong brand requires understanding your audience.Open source provides a competitive edge against incumbents.The importance of stability and security for enterprise clients.Time in the market builds trust with potential customers.LinksSupabase https://supabase.com/Ant Wilson's Twitter https://x.com/antwilsonpgvector https://supabase.com/docs/guides/database/extensions/pgvector  Greg Richardson https://x.com/ggrdsonPrevious episode with Ant https://podcast.scalingdevtools.com/episodes/product-market-fit-is-one-pivot-away-with-ant-wilson-founder-of-supabaseKeywordsopen source, developer tools, marketing strategies, community engagement, AI, vector databases, enterprise solutions, product development, tech podcast

Nick Gomez is the co-founder and CEO of InKeep. InKeep is an AI customer support tool focused on Developer Tools.They discuss the importance of understanding developer needs, the role of AI in technical support, and how community engagement can enhance support efforts. What we discussAI support for developer tools is different from traditional B2B SaaS support.Developers often seek help through documentation and community forums.Scaling technical support requires understanding the developer's tech stack.Clear communication channels can improve support efficiency.AI solutions must prioritize quality to build trust with users.Community engagement can help crowdsource support efforts.Support teams should continuously improve documentation based on user inquiries.24/7 support can be achieved through AI tools.Investing in customer relationships can lead to valuable insights and support.Innovative tools are changing the landscape of developer support.Links:Nick Gomez's Twitter https://x.com/nickgomezcInKeep https://inkeep.com/ KeywordsAI support, developer tools, technical support, community engagement, customer investment, quality assurance, support team structure, 24/7 support, innovations in development

Adam Frankl has been VP at four Developer Tools unicorns, including JFrog, Neo4J and Sourcegraph.Adam is the author of the Developer Facing Startup and recently launched the Developer Facing Startup Founders Academy: a program that helps founders launch and grow their developer tools. In this conversation, Adam Frankl discusses the critical role of a Technical Advisory Board (TAB) in the success of developer-facing startups. He emphasizes the importance of understanding developer needs, effective interviewing techniques, and the necessity of building credibility and community. Adam outlines a structured approach to gathering insights from developers. He also highlights the significance of storytelling in marketing and the need for founders to engage deeply with their user base to discover and address their problems effectively.Takeaways:A Technical Advisory Board is essential for startup success.Founders must prioritize understanding developer needs.Effective interviews should focus on the problem, not the product.Social proof is crucial for building credibility.Developers are influenced by their peers and community.The 'Dream Sequence' outlines the developer adoption process.Storytelling is key to engaging potential users.Founders should continuously engage with their user base.Identifying key personas is vital for targeted outreach.Developers are not leads; they require a different approach.Links:Developer Facing Startup Founders Academy https://developer-facing-founders-network.mn.co/Adam Frankl's LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/adamfrankl/The Developer Facing Startup https://www.amazon.co.uk/Developer-Facing-Startup-market-developer-facing/dp/B0D4KJNSPPKeywords:Technical Advisory Board, Developer Startups, User Research, Developer Needs, Social Proof, Community Building, Founder Responsibilities, Developer Adoption, Interview Techniques, Startup Success

In this conversation, with Michael Grinich - founder and CEO of WorkOS. WorkOS helps you start selling to enterprise customers with just a few lines of code. We discuss the challenges and strategies of navigating tough conversations in a startup environment, the importance of understanding engineering leadership, and the role of empathy in user experience. The conversation covers the significance of conferences for startups, the necessity of articulating the 'why' behind a business, and the challenges faced by solo founders. The discussion also touches on decision-making processes, handling competition, and the future direction of WorkOS.If a conversation scares you, it's probably necessary.Engineering leaders focus on business goals, not just technology.Conferences can be a great way to connect with potential customers.Building relationships at events can lead to long-term success.Frameworks can be constraining; focus on user empathy instead.Understanding user needs is crucial for product development.Articulating the 'why' can enhance customer connection.Maintaining focus on your mission is key to success.Finding a deeper mission can drive your startup forward.The journey of building a startup is often unclear at the beginning.Links:WorkOS https://workos.com/Michael's Twitter https://x.com/grinich ELC https://sfelc.com/ Crossing the Enterprise Chasm Podcast https://workos.com/podcastStart With Why https://simonsinek.com/books/start-with-why/AWS reinvent https://reinvent.awsevents.com/ 

In this episode, we're joined by returning guest Colin Sidoti - the cofounder and CEO of Clerk.Clerk is a comprehensive user management platform.  What we cover:- The origin story and South Park Commons- Clerk's dramatic growth since the first episode - what changed? What did they do right?- 7% growth per week- Tiny details that improve the developer experience- How to you know if a change is better - watching people's faces as they try it - The difficulties of bringing new joiners up to speed in a very high context environment- Obsessions of founders- Zuckerberg's obsession and South Park Commons talk- Nick Parsons appreciation: why it's hard to hire good developer marketing people - The uniqueness of marketing developer tools- Buying a van and parking it outside YC- Local marketing campaigns in San FranciscoLinks:- Clerk https://clerk.com/- Colin's Twitter https://x.com/tweetsbycolin- Nick Parsons' Twitter https://x.com/nickparsons- Jakob's tweet https://x.com/jakeplusev/status/1827791946380877828- Malte Ubl's blog https://www.industrialempathy.com/- Zuck's talk at South Park Commons https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02fBBoZa9l4

David is the CEO of Arcjet. Arcjet is a tool that helps developers protect their apps once they go into production. It offers Bot detection, rate limiting, email validation, attack protection, data redaction.David is also the creator of the console.dev newsletter and podcast. It's where thousands of developers discover developer tools. In this episode we discuss how David thinks about creating content. Why he believes go-to-market is more difficult than product and how he works on creating great developer experience. Links:- Arcjet https://arcjet.com/- David Mytton - https://davidmytton.blog/ - Console https://console.dev/AI DevTools hackathon this weekend in SF:- Event page https://lu.ma/devtools-hackathon- More info https://www.devtoolshackathon.com/

Vlad Matsiiako is the CEO and co-founder of Infisical. Infisical is an Open Source Secret Management tool.What we discuss:- The story of Infisical- How the team has made Infisical easy to adopt- How being open source helps you with trust at the beginning stages- How do enterprises adopt Infisical- How do developers at enterprises discover tools like Infisical- The different mini-games at various stages of a startup (Dalton Caldwell)  LinksVlad - https://www.linkedin.com/in/vmatsiiako/Infisical - https://infisical.com/

Andrew Lisowski is the cohost of devtools.fm. In this episode we talk about why Andrew started devtools.fm and what he's learned along the way. Life as an open source maintainer.How the JavaScript ecosystem is different to other developer ecosystems.The importance of dogfooding.The power of DHH.Why obsessing over one problem eventually leads to great resultsShould DevTools start podcasts and how?Links:devtools.fm - https://www.devtools.fm/Andrew's Twitter - https://x.com/HipsterSmoothiedevtools.fm Twitter - https://x.com/DevtoolsFMInterview with DHH https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEZNbM4MUdoInterview with Evan You https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycuYlzuBqcAInterview with Richard Harris https://www.devtools.fm/episode/15

Robby (Amanda Robson) is the co-host of Open Source Startup Podcast (with Tim Chen).In this episode we discuss:There are many ways to open source successWhen open source is a good strategy and when it isn'tWhy open source projects usually need time to brewHow to know if your project is venture scaleWhy Robby believes in the Open Source modelRobby is working on a highly mysterious new thing

Hamzah Chaudhary is the cofounder of Lightdash, an open source, self-serve BI tool. In this episode, Hamzah shares:Their initial plan to build a consultancy and how it morphed into a product to solve their customer's needsHow open source works as a strategyBringing software engineering tools to the BI domainHow they reach their usersHow they partner with bigger organizationsLinks:Lightdash https://www.lightdash.com/Lightdash GitHub https://github.com/lightdash/lightdashHamzah's Twitter https://x.com/hamzahc1

Han Wang is co-founder of Mintlify - modern, out the box documentation.In this episode, Han shares the story of Mintlify and how to make great docs.We even talk about the time Paul Graham told them to change their name.What we cover:- the origin story of Mintlify- what is good documentation- the process of documentation- how AI is affecting documentation- why PG told them to change their nameLinks:- Han https://han.dev/- Mintlify https://mintlify.com/

Kate Holterhoff - an analyst from RedMonk - shares why frontend developers are increasingly dictating the adoption of new developer tools.Kate shares specific examples, including Supabase. Links:Frontend Developers: the Newest New Kingmakers https://redmonk.com/kholterhoff/2024/02/15/frontend-developers-the-newest-new-kingmakers/Kate's website https://www.kateholterhoff.com/RedMonk https://redmonk.com/Kate's Twitter/X https://x.com/KateHolterhoff

Vivian Dufour is the CEO and co-founder of Meterian.Meterian is an open source vulnerability scanner.In this episode we talk about topics like:Selling to enterprisesWhy you need to make your product easy to testHiring and managing salespeopleLinks:Meterian: https://www.meterian.io/Vivian Dufour - https://www.linkedin.com/in/viviandufour/ 

Ellen Chisa is a partner at Boldstart Ventures. Prior to Boldstart, Ellen founded Darklang - a programming language. Before Darklang, Ellen worked in product. What we discussed: Startups should focus on building one SDK and doing it well, rather than trying to build multiple SDKs at once.North Star metricsDeveloper tooling companies can learn from consumer-facing companies in terms of marketing and creating an identity for their product.Being authentic as a founder and actively engaging with the community can help establish a strong brand and attract users. Recognize and leverage your unique strengths and skills.Busy work can be valuableThe importance of segmenting your messageLinks:Ellen's Twitter/X https://x.com/ellenchisa?lang=enBoldstart Ventures https://boldstart.vc/darklang https://darklang.com/

How do you write a developer quick start guide that they will love?That's what we talk about with Amit Jotwani. Amit is the founder of HelloDX and previously worked in developer experience at Retool and Amazon Alexa.This came about because I was reading Amit's fantastic guide on EveryDeveloper. Links:Amit's website https://ajot.me/HelloDX https://hellodx.co/Craft Quick Start Guides That Developers Will Love https://everydeveloper.com/quick-start-guides/Amit's Twitter/X https://x.com/amitThis episode is sponsored by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

James Hawkins is the cofounder and CEO of PostHog. PostHog is a platform to analyze, test, observe, and deploy new features.This is the second time James has been on and the episode is mostly about how they run PostHog.It's a pretty unconventional approach - probably because James thinks very deeply about how organizations should operate. What we discuss:How PostHog hireHis approach to one-on-one meetingsThe role of engineers in product developmentThe impact of open source projects on PostHog's successA surprising secret to success (fun)Importance of listening to developersLinks:James's Twitter https://x.com/james406PostHog https://posthog.com/The Mental Workload of Hoovering https://jefhawkins.com/blog/mental-workload-of-hooveringRay Dalio's Principles https://www.principles.com/  James's first interview https://podcast.scalingdevtools.com/episodes/working-with-enterprise-clients-with-james-hawkins This episode is sponsored by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

Greg Lazarus and Matt Althauser are two of the cofounders of Polychrome - a company that buys small to medium sized B2B software businesses: with a focus on Developer Tools. Their portfolio includes the feature flagging tool Flagsmith (we recorded an episode with them last week) and the browser automation tool Browserless.In this episode we cover the ins and outs of buying developer tools. Links:- Polychrome https://www.polychrome.com/- Matt Althauser https://x.com/malthauser?lang=en - Greg Lazarus https://x.com/greglaz5This episode is sponsored by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.

Ben Rometsch is the founder of Flagsmith. Flagsmith is a Feature Flag & Remote Config Service that recently reached $3m ARR.Ben candidly shares exactly how they started, how they got enterprise customers and how they worked with Polychrome to take Flagsmith to the next level.Links:Ben's Twitter https://x.com/dabeeeensterFlagsmith https://www.flagsmith.com/Polychrome https://polychrome.com/This episode is sponsored by WorkOS. If you're thinking about selling to enterprise customers, WorkOS can help you add enterprise features like Single Sign On and audit logs.