Podcasts about Uptown Records

Casey Gane - The Sex Scandals of P Diddy4 days agoCasey Gane-McCalla is a writer, actor, musician, journalist and the author of "Inside The CIA's Secret War In Jamaica."He talks to Ed Opperman about the behaviour of P Diddy.The rapper Sean Combs, known more commonly as P Diddy, Puff Daddy or Diddy, has been accused of over 15 years' worth of physical, sexual and mental abuse by his ex-girlfriend, the American singer-songwriter Cassie. P Diddy denies all the allegations.Combs, whose 1997 debut album No Way Out catapulted him onto the rap scene and eventually went on to be certified seven times platinum, is one of the biggest names in American hip hop. He got his start at Uptown Records, where he helped develop R&B legends like Mary J Blige and Jodeci, before pivoting into creating music himself, then later becoming a record label executive and producer.Twitter SpreakerBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-opperman-report--1198501/support.

Derrière l'icône, le bourreau. Fêtes privées sous contrôle, viols ritualisés, humiliations filmées, compromissions archivées, P. Diddy a transformé son label en une véritable machine à broyer les corps et les volontés. Dans cet épisode, Gaël et Geoffroy plongent dans l'univers glaçant d'un magnat du hip-hop protégé par des policiers corrompus et des élus complices. De la naissance de Bad Boy Records aux soirées “Freak-Offs”, ils décryptent les rouages d'un empire fondé sur la peur, le sexe et le silence et révèlent comment le rap est devenu un levier d'influence politique, où la rébellion se vend et l'impunité s'achète. Musique : Thibaud R. Habillage sonore / mixage : Alexandre Lechaux Le Shop Tous Parano

The Radio Boys C.Truth & Kev Lawrence are joined by artist, executive and writer Jeff Redd (@therealjeffredd). Jeff talked about his father's influence on singing, his days as a Grammy winning A&R, history making times at Uptown Records, how it feels to have a forever hit record, why he rewrote "You called & told me”, how talent was made in the 90s, helping a young Busta Rhymes, setting fashion trends, the things you couldn't do as artists, the importance of movie soundtracks, promoting your records in person, movies up next, re-imagining BK fashion store, doing art exhibits, why it's time to put some clothes on, the reason customer service is everything, in store tailor service, art in current times and more.For additional content visit: ⁠⁠https://www.thermalsoundwaves.com⁠⁠⁠⁠IG: ⁠⁠@thermalsoundwaves⁠⁠ 
Twitter/X: ⁠⁠@thermalsoundwav⁠⁠ 
Facebook: thermalsoundwaves

Sean "P. Diddy" Combs' Dark Past Revisited as New Documentaries Expose Allegations Sean "P. Diddy" Combs is once again in the spotlight, not for his music or business ventures but for the controversies and scandals that have marked his rise to fame. With two new documentaries—Peacock's Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy and Investigation Discovery's The Fall of Diddy—examining his past, long-standing allegations and tragic events are resurfacing. One of the most harrowing chapters in Combs' history took place on December 28, 1991, during a charity basketball game he co-hosted at New York City's City College. Then a 22-year-old working at Uptown Records, Combs partnered with rapper Heavy D to organize the event. However, the venue, with a capacity of 2,730, was packed with over 5,000 people, while thousands more were stuck outside. The overcrowding led to a deadly stampede as fans surged into the gymnasium. The inward-opening doors created a bottleneck, resulting in 29 injuries and nine fatalities, mostly teenagers. Victims' families filed lawsuits, accusing Combs of overselling tickets, failing to provide adequate security, and promoting the event as if the venue could hold 10,000 people. While Combs and Heavy D were held 50% responsible, with City College bearing the other half, Combs never faced criminal charges. Instead, he settled civil lawsuits, paying families of the victims, including $40,000 to Jason Swain, whose brother died in the stampede. Swain stated in The Making of a Bad Boy: “We got $40,000 from Sean Combs directly. But he never owned up to it, never just said, ‘I apologize.'” In the newly released The Fall of Diddy, other allegations of misconduct add to the controversy. Danyel Smith, former editor-in-chief of VIBE magazine, shared how Combs threatened her over editorial control of a 1997 cover shoot. “He said he would be seeing me dead in a trunk if I did not show it to him,” she recalled. Smith pursued legal action, forcing Combs to issue a written apology. Further claims delve into Combs' time at Howard University, where an anonymous witness recalled him beating a woman with a belt outside a dorm. “When we told him to stop, he yelled for us to stay out of it,” she said. Another pivotal scandal revisited in the series is a 1999 nightclub shooting involving Combs. Wardel Fenderson, Combs' former driver, claimed he witnessed Combs carrying a gun into the venue and later discarding it after the shooting. Natania Griffin, a victim who was shot in the face, identified Combs as the shooter. Fenderson alleged that Combs offered him $50,000 to take the blame, which he refused. Combs was later acquitted, while his associate, Jamal “Shyne” Barrow, was convicted. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend of Combs, revealed further troubling details about his relationships. “Any girl that's with Sean has to be fixed to Sean's specs,” Patterson said, citing incidents of jealousy-fueled abuse against partners, including the mother of Combs' child, Mysa Hilton. These documentaries reveal a complex and controversial figure, whose path to fame is marred by tragedy, unresolved accountability, and allegations of abuse and violence. As legal battles continue, the spotlight on Combs raises questions about power, fame, and justice. #SeanCombs #DiddyControversy #CelebrityScandals #MusicIndustry #Documentaries #LegalDrama #PopCulture Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Sean "P. Diddy" Combs is once again in the spotlight, not for his music or business ventures but for the controversies and scandals that have marked his rise to fame. With two new documentaries—Peacock's Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy and Investigation Discovery's The Fall of Diddy—examining his past, long-standing allegations and tragic events are resurfacing. One of the most harrowing chapters in Combs' history took place on December 28, 1991, during a charity basketball game he co-hosted at New York City's City College. Then a 22-year-old working at Uptown Records, Combs partnered with rapper Heavy D to organize the event. However, the venue, with a capacity of 2,730, was packed with over 5,000 people, while thousands more were stuck outside. The overcrowding led to a deadly stampede as fans surged into the gymnasium. The inward-opening doors created a bottleneck, resulting in 29 injuries and nine fatalities, mostly teenagers. Victims' families filed lawsuits, accusing Combs of overselling tickets, failing to provide adequate security, and promoting the event as if the venue could hold 10,000 people. While Combs and Heavy D were held 50% responsible, with City College bearing the other half, Combs never faced criminal charges. Instead, he settled civil lawsuits, paying families of the victims, including $40,000 to Jason Swain, whose brother died in the stampede. Swain stated in The Making of a Bad Boy: “We got $40,000 from Sean Combs directly. But he never owned up to it, never just said, ‘I apologize.'” In the newly released The Fall of Diddy, other allegations of misconduct add to the controversy. Danyel Smith, former editor-in-chief of VIBE magazine, shared how Combs threatened her over editorial control of a 1997 cover shoot. “He said he would be seeing me dead in a trunk if I did not show it to him,” she recalled. Smith pursued legal action, forcing Combs to issue a written apology. Further claims delve into Combs' time at Howard University, where an anonymous witness recalled him beating a woman with a belt outside a dorm. “When we told him to stop, he yelled for us to stay out of it,” she said. Another pivotal scandal revisited in the series is a 1999 nightclub shooting involving Combs. Wardel Fenderson, Combs' former driver, claimed he witnessed Combs carrying a gun into the venue and later discarding it after the shooting. Natania Griffin, a victim who was shot in the face, identified Combs as the shooter. Fenderson alleged that Combs offered him $50,000 to take the blame, which he refused. Combs was later acquitted, while his associate, Jamal “Shyne” Barrow, was convicted. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend of Combs, revealed further troubling details about his relationships. “Any girl that's with Sean has to be fixed to Sean's specs,” Patterson said, citing incidents of jealousy-fueled abuse against partners, including the mother of Combs' child, Mysa Hilton. These documentaries reveal a complex and controversial figure, whose path to fame is marred by tragedy, unresolved accountability, and allegations of abuse and violence. As legal battles continue, the spotlight on Combs raises questions about power, fame, and justice. #SeanCombs #DiddyControversy #CelebrityScandals #MusicIndustry #Documentaries #LegalDrama #PopCulture Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Sean "P. Diddy" Combs is once again in the spotlight, not for his music or business ventures but for the controversies and scandals that have marked his rise to fame. With two new documentaries—Peacock's Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy and Investigation Discovery's The Fall of Diddy—examining his past, long-standing allegations and tragic events are resurfacing. One of the most harrowing chapters in Combs' history took place on December 28, 1991, during a charity basketball game he co-hosted at New York City's City College. Then a 22-year-old working at Uptown Records, Combs partnered with rapper Heavy D to organize the event. However, the venue, with a capacity of 2,730, was packed with over 5,000 people, while thousands more were stuck outside. The overcrowding led to a deadly stampede as fans surged into the gymnasium. The inward-opening doors created a bottleneck, resulting in 29 injuries and nine fatalities, mostly teenagers. Victims' families filed lawsuits, accusing Combs of overselling tickets, failing to provide adequate security, and promoting the event as if the venue could hold 10,000 people. While Combs and Heavy D were held 50% responsible, with City College bearing the other half, Combs never faced criminal charges. Instead, he settled civil lawsuits, paying families of the victims, including $40,000 to Jason Swain, whose brother died in the stampede. Swain stated in The Making of a Bad Boy: “We got $40,000 from Sean Combs directly. But he never owned up to it, never just said, ‘I apologize.'” In the newly released The Fall of Diddy, other allegations of misconduct add to the controversy. Danyel Smith, former editor-in-chief of VIBE magazine, shared how Combs threatened her over editorial control of a 1997 cover shoot. “He said he would be seeing me dead in a trunk if I did not show it to him,” she recalled. Smith pursued legal action, forcing Combs to issue a written apology. Further claims delve into Combs' time at Howard University, where an anonymous witness recalled him beating a woman with a belt outside a dorm. “When we told him to stop, he yelled for us to stay out of it,” she said. Another pivotal scandal revisited in the series is a 1999 nightclub shooting involving Combs. Wardel Fenderson, Combs' former driver, claimed he witnessed Combs carrying a gun into the venue and later discarding it after the shooting. Natania Griffin, a victim who was shot in the face, identified Combs as the shooter. Fenderson alleged that Combs offered him $50,000 to take the blame, which he refused. Combs was later acquitted, while his associate, Jamal “Shyne” Barrow, was convicted. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend of Combs, revealed further troubling details about his relationships. “Any girl that's with Sean has to be fixed to Sean's specs,” Patterson said, citing incidents of jealousy-fueled abuse against partners, including the mother of Combs' child, Mysa Hilton. These documentaries reveal a complex and controversial figure, whose path to fame is marred by tragedy, unresolved accountability, and allegations of abuse and violence. As legal battles continue, the spotlight on Combs raises questions about power, fame, and justice. #SeanCombs #DiddyControversy #CelebrityScandals #MusicIndustry #Documentaries #LegalDrama #PopCulture Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Sean "P. Diddy" Combs' Dark Past Revisited as New Documentaries Expose Allegations Sean "P. Diddy" Combs is once again in the spotlight, not for his music or business ventures but for the controversies and scandals that have marked his rise to fame. With two new documentaries—Peacock's Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy and Investigation Discovery's The Fall of Diddy—examining his past, long-standing allegations and tragic events are resurfacing. One of the most harrowing chapters in Combs' history took place on December 28, 1991, during a charity basketball game he co-hosted at New York City's City College. Then a 22-year-old working at Uptown Records, Combs partnered with rapper Heavy D to organize the event. However, the venue, with a capacity of 2,730, was packed with over 5,000 people, while thousands more were stuck outside. The overcrowding led to a deadly stampede as fans surged into the gymnasium. The inward-opening doors created a bottleneck, resulting in 29 injuries and nine fatalities, mostly teenagers. Victims' families filed lawsuits, accusing Combs of overselling tickets, failing to provide adequate security, and promoting the event as if the venue could hold 10,000 people. While Combs and Heavy D were held 50% responsible, with City College bearing the other half, Combs never faced criminal charges. Instead, he settled civil lawsuits, paying families of the victims, including $40,000 to Jason Swain, whose brother died in the stampede. Swain stated in The Making of a Bad Boy: “We got $40,000 from Sean Combs directly. But he never owned up to it, never just said, ‘I apologize.'” In the newly released The Fall of Diddy, other allegations of misconduct add to the controversy. Danyel Smith, former editor-in-chief of VIBE magazine, shared how Combs threatened her over editorial control of a 1997 cover shoot. “He said he would be seeing me dead in a trunk if I did not show it to him,” she recalled. Smith pursued legal action, forcing Combs to issue a written apology. Further claims delve into Combs' time at Howard University, where an anonymous witness recalled him beating a woman with a belt outside a dorm. “When we told him to stop, he yelled for us to stay out of it,” she said. Another pivotal scandal revisited in the series is a 1999 nightclub shooting involving Combs. Wardel Fenderson, Combs' former driver, claimed he witnessed Combs carrying a gun into the venue and later discarding it after the shooting. Natania Griffin, a victim who was shot in the face, identified Combs as the shooter. Fenderson alleged that Combs offered him $50,000 to take the blame, which he refused. Combs was later acquitted, while his associate, Jamal “Shyne” Barrow, was convicted. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend of Combs, revealed further troubling details about his relationships. “Any girl that's with Sean has to be fixed to Sean's specs,” Patterson said, citing incidents of jealousy-fueled abuse against partners, including the mother of Combs' child, Mysa Hilton. These documentaries reveal a complex and controversial figure, whose path to fame is marred by tragedy, unresolved accountability, and allegations of abuse and violence. As legal battles continue, the spotlight on Combs raises questions about power, fame, and justice. #SeanCombs #DiddyControversy #CelebrityScandals #MusicIndustry #Documentaries #LegalDrama #PopCulture Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

In a highly anticipated revelation, R&B singer Al B. Sure! speaks out for the first time about Sean "Diddy" Combs in the new Peacock documentary Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy. The "Nite and Day" artist shares shocking claims, including allegations about Diddy's behavior, his ex Kim Porter's fears, and the broader music industry's hidden dangers. “For the record, I received more than 40 inquiries from production companies and networks since brother Sean's incarceration,” Al B. Sure! explains in the film. “I decided to speak out because I owe it to the late Kim Porter to share the truth.” Al B. Sure! and Porter, the biological parents of actor and musician Quincy Brown, maintained a close relationship even after their romantic involvement ended. Porter later dated Diddy, with whom she had three children. Porter, a model and former Uptown Records colleague of Diddy, reportedly confided in Al B. Sure! about her growing unease regarding the music mogul. “She did say that something's not right. His soul was going completely dark, like he's just not there,” Al B. Sure! shares. He claims Porter made him promise, on their son Quincy's life, not to disclose what she revealed, fearing for his safety. The singer-songwriter also alleges Porter kept detailed notes about her experiences with Diddy. “She was keeping a diary and things of that nature. Someone got the passcode to her phone and computer and found out she was writing what was going on behind closed doors,” he says. Porter tragically passed away in 2018 at 47 years old. The Los Angeles County Coroner's Office determined her death resulted from lobar pneumonia, but Al B. Sure! disputes this. “That's just a day that will never, ever leave my mind. And just that empty feeling of like, ‘Nah, something is not right with this.'” The documentary delves into broader accusations, with Al B. Sure! hinting at sinister patterns within the music industry. “Let's just say there's a lot to uncover, a lot that goes on in the industry, which is not my job to uncover. But it's something that's been going on, and those who speak about it usually meet their demise.” In response, Diddy's legal team categorically denied all allegations presented in the documentary. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories that have been slung against Mr. Combs for months. It is disappointing to see NBC and Peacock rolling in the same mud as unethical tabloid reporters. By providing a platform for proven liars and opportunists to make false criminal accusations, the documentary is irresponsible journalism of the worst kind,” they stated to Extra. Al B. Sure! also recounts his own near-death experience in 2020, alleging foul play. “I was in a coma, having multi-system organ failure. Every organ is working off of a machine, except for the liver,” he reveals. The singer suggests someone attempted to take his life. “I kept a record of every single one of you who was sent to set me up, to assist in the attempted murder of Al B. Sure!” Sean "Diddy" Combs, currently jailed at Brooklyn's Metropolitan Detention Center, faces federal charges of racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges and awaits trial in May 2025. Al B. Sure!'s revelations come as a significant addition to the ongoing conversation surrounding Diddy, shedding light on alleged misconduct and raising questions about the treatment of those who dare to speak out in the entertainment industry. #Diddy #AlBSure #KimPorter #MusicIndustry #SeanCombs #PeacockDocumentary #EntertainmentNews Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

In a highly anticipated revelation, R&B singer Al B. Sure! speaks out for the first time about Sean "Diddy" Combs in the new Peacock documentary Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy. The "Nite and Day" artist shares shocking claims, including allegations about Diddy's behavior, his ex Kim Porter's fears, and the broader music industry's hidden dangers. “For the record, I received more than 40 inquiries from production companies and networks since brother Sean's incarceration,” Al B. Sure! explains in the film. “I decided to speak out because I owe it to the late Kim Porter to share the truth.” Al B. Sure! and Porter, the biological parents of actor and musician Quincy Brown, maintained a close relationship even after their romantic involvement ended. Porter later dated Diddy, with whom she had three children. Porter, a model and former Uptown Records colleague of Diddy, reportedly confided in Al B. Sure! about her growing unease regarding the music mogul. “She did say that something's not right. His soul was going completely dark, like he's just not there,” Al B. Sure! shares. He claims Porter made him promise, on their son Quincy's life, not to disclose what she revealed, fearing for his safety. The singer-songwriter also alleges Porter kept detailed notes about her experiences with Diddy. “She was keeping a diary and things of that nature. Someone got the passcode to her phone and computer and found out she was writing what was going on behind closed doors,” he says. Porter tragically passed away in 2018 at 47 years old. The Los Angeles County Coroner's Office determined her death resulted from lobar pneumonia, but Al B. Sure! disputes this. “That's just a day that will never, ever leave my mind. And just that empty feeling of like, ‘Nah, something is not right with this.'” The documentary delves into broader accusations, with Al B. Sure! hinting at sinister patterns within the music industry. “Let's just say there's a lot to uncover, a lot that goes on in the industry, which is not my job to uncover. But it's something that's been going on, and those who speak about it usually meet their demise.” In response, Diddy's legal team categorically denied all allegations presented in the documentary. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories that have been slung against Mr. Combs for months. It is disappointing to see NBC and Peacock rolling in the same mud as unethical tabloid reporters. By providing a platform for proven liars and opportunists to make false criminal accusations, the documentary is irresponsible journalism of the worst kind,” they stated to Extra. Al B. Sure! also recounts his own near-death experience in 2020, alleging foul play. “I was in a coma, having multi-system organ failure. Every organ is working off of a machine, except for the liver,” he reveals. The singer suggests someone attempted to take his life. “I kept a record of every single one of you who was sent to set me up, to assist in the attempted murder of Al B. Sure!” Sean "Diddy" Combs, currently jailed at Brooklyn's Metropolitan Detention Center, faces federal charges of racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges and awaits trial in May 2025. Al B. Sure!'s revelations come as a significant addition to the ongoing conversation surrounding Diddy, shedding light on alleged misconduct and raising questions about the treatment of those who dare to speak out in the entertainment industry. #Diddy #AlBSure #KimPorter #MusicIndustry #SeanCombs #PeacockDocumentary #EntertainmentNews Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

In a highly anticipated revelation, R&B singer Al B. Sure! speaks out for the first time about Sean "Diddy" Combs in the new Peacock documentary Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy. The "Nite and Day" artist shares shocking claims, including allegations about Diddy's behavior, his ex Kim Porter's fears, and the broader music industry's hidden dangers. “For the record, I received more than 40 inquiries from production companies and networks since brother Sean's incarceration,” Al B. Sure! explains in the film. “I decided to speak out because I owe it to the late Kim Porter to share the truth.” Al B. Sure! and Porter, the biological parents of actor and musician Quincy Brown, maintained a close relationship even after their romantic involvement ended. Porter later dated Diddy, with whom she had three children. Porter, a model and former Uptown Records colleague of Diddy, reportedly confided in Al B. Sure! about her growing unease regarding the music mogul. “She did say that something's not right. His soul was going completely dark, like he's just not there,” Al B. Sure! shares. He claims Porter made him promise, on their son Quincy's life, not to disclose what she revealed, fearing for his safety. The singer-songwriter also alleges Porter kept detailed notes about her experiences with Diddy. “She was keeping a diary and things of that nature. Someone got the passcode to her phone and computer and found out she was writing what was going on behind closed doors,” he says. Porter tragically passed away in 2018 at 47 years old. The Los Angeles County Coroner's Office determined her death resulted from lobar pneumonia, but Al B. Sure! disputes this. “That's just a day that will never, ever leave my mind. And just that empty feeling of like, ‘Nah, something is not right with this.'” The documentary delves into broader accusations, with Al B. Sure! hinting at sinister patterns within the music industry. “Let's just say there's a lot to uncover, a lot that goes on in the industry, which is not my job to uncover. But it's something that's been going on, and those who speak about it usually meet their demise.” In response, Diddy's legal team categorically denied all allegations presented in the documentary. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories that have been slung against Mr. Combs for months. It is disappointing to see NBC and Peacock rolling in the same mud as unethical tabloid reporters. By providing a platform for proven liars and opportunists to make false criminal accusations, the documentary is irresponsible journalism of the worst kind,” they stated to Extra. Al B. Sure! also recounts his own near-death experience in 2020, alleging foul play. “I was in a coma, having multi-system organ failure. Every organ is working off of a machine, except for the liver,” he reveals. The singer suggests someone attempted to take his life. “I kept a record of every single one of you who was sent to set me up, to assist in the attempted murder of Al B. Sure!” Sean "Diddy" Combs, currently jailed at Brooklyn's Metropolitan Detention Center, faces federal charges of racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges and awaits trial in May 2025. Al B. Sure!'s revelations come as a significant addition to the ongoing conversation surrounding Diddy, shedding light on alleged misconduct and raising questions about the treatment of those who dare to speak out in the entertainment industry. #Diddy #AlBSure #KimPorter #MusicIndustry #SeanCombs #PeacockDocumentary #EntertainmentNews Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Al B. Sure! Breaks Silence on Diddy, Kim Porter, and Music Industry Dark Secrets In a highly anticipated revelation, R&B singer Al B. Sure! speaks out for the first time about Sean "Diddy" Combs in the new Peacock documentary Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy. The "Nite and Day" artist shares shocking claims, including allegations about Diddy's behavior, his ex Kim Porter's fears, and the broader music industry's hidden dangers. “For the record, I received more than 40 inquiries from production companies and networks since brother Sean's incarceration,” Al B. Sure! explains in the film. “I decided to speak out because I owe it to the late Kim Porter to share the truth.” Al B. Sure! and Porter, the biological parents of actor and musician Quincy Brown, maintained a close relationship even after their romantic involvement ended. Porter later dated Diddy, with whom she had three children. Porter, a model and former Uptown Records colleague of Diddy, reportedly confided in Al B. Sure! about her growing unease regarding the music mogul. “She did say that something's not right. His soul was going completely dark, like he's just not there,” Al B. Sure! shares. He claims Porter made him promise, on their son Quincy's life, not to disclose what she revealed, fearing for his safety. The singer-songwriter also alleges Porter kept detailed notes about her experiences with Diddy. “She was keeping a diary and things of that nature. Someone got the passcode to her phone and computer and found out she was writing what was going on behind closed doors,” he says. Porter tragically passed away in 2018 at 47 years old. The Los Angeles County Coroner's Office determined her death resulted from lobar pneumonia, but Al B. Sure! disputes this. “That's just a day that will never, ever leave my mind. And just that empty feeling of like, ‘Nah, something is not right with this.'” The documentary delves into broader accusations, with Al B. Sure! hinting at sinister patterns within the music industry. “Let's just say there's a lot to uncover, a lot that goes on in the industry, which is not my job to uncover. But it's something that's been going on, and those who speak about it usually meet their demise.” In response, Diddy's legal team categorically denied all allegations presented in the documentary. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories that have been slung against Mr. Combs for months. It is disappointing to see NBC and Peacock rolling in the same mud as unethical tabloid reporters. By providing a platform for proven liars and opportunists to make false criminal accusations, the documentary is irresponsible journalism of the worst kind,” they stated to Extra. Al B. Sure! also recounts his own near-death experience in 2020, alleging foul play. “I was in a coma, having multi-system organ failure. Every organ is working off of a machine, except for the liver,” he reveals. The singer suggests someone attempted to take his life. “I kept a record of every single one of you who was sent to set me up, to assist in the attempted murder of Al B. Sure!” Sean "Diddy" Combs, currently jailed at Brooklyn's Metropolitan Detention Center, faces federal charges of racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges and awaits trial in May 2025. Al B. Sure!'s revelations come as a significant addition to the ongoing conversation surrounding Diddy, shedding light on alleged misconduct and raising questions about the treatment of those who dare to speak out in the entertainment industry. #Diddy #AlBSure #KimPorter #MusicIndustry #SeanCombs #PeacockDocumentary #EntertainmentNews Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Ari Mark, producer of Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy, a new Peacock documentary that tells the story of Sean Combs' early years and offers crucial insight into the forces that shaped the man and may have made him a monster. The special also includes exclusive, never-before-seen footage of Diddy partying at home and in the studio. Diddy's labelmate at Uptown Records, Al B. Sure also speaks out for the first time on his relationship with Kim Porter before she started dating Diddy. Reality Life with Kate Casey What to Watch List: https://katecasey.substack.com Patreon: http://www.patreon.com/katecasey Twitter: https://twitter.com/katecasey Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/katecaseyca Tik Tok: http://www.tiktok.com/itskatecasey Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/113157919338245 Amazon List: https://www.amazon.com/shop/katecasey Like it to Know It: https://www.shopltk.com/explore/katecaseySee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Diddy's Journey from Mount Vernon to Music Mogul Spotlighted in New Documentary A new Peacock documentary, Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy, delves into the life of Sean “Diddy” Combs, offering fresh perspectives on his youth and rise to fame while confronting recent controversies surrounding the music icon. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend, painted a vivid picture of Diddy's early years in Mount Vernon, New York. “I know Sean, not Diddy, not Daddy Love,” Patterson shared in the film. “I have to tell people about what they don't know about his childhood.” He described young Sean as a wealthy outlier, often bullied due to his privileged background. “Sean was the different kid. People could smell he wasn't tough,” he added. The documentary explores how Diddy's father, Melvin Combs, was killed in what former bodyguard Gene Deal described as a retaliation for cooperating with law enforcement. This loss left Janice Combs, Diddy's mother, to raise her children alone. Patterson explained that Janice's inheritance allowed the family to move to a more affluent area, fostering a life of luxury for her son. “He was the one in the hat, with jewelry on, at four years old,” Patterson remarked about an old photo. Diddy's childhood also involved exposure to lively, unconventional environments. “Sean's house was the party spot,” Patterson recalled, citing wild gatherings that mirrored the flamboyant celebrations Diddy would later host as an adult. According to Lee Davis, a friend and DJ, “She made sure everybody was comfortable,” though Janice Combs did not comment on her portrayal in the documentary. The film highlights Diddy's relentless ambition, which emerged during his time at Howard University. Ron Lawrence, a college classmate, noted that Diddy declared, “I'm gonna be the biggest record producer in the world.” His determination paid off after dropping out of college and securing an internship at Uptown Records in 1990. Patterson recalled, “He'd show up anywhere to get the bigwigs' attention—even sleeping outside of Andre Harrell's car.” Despite his success, Diddy's legacy faces challenges. In September 2024, he was arrested on charges of sex trafficking, racketeering conspiracy, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges, and his representatives vehemently deny the allegations. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories,” a spokesperson told Us Weekly, criticizing NBC and Peacock for amplifying what they view as baseless claims. The documentary premieres on Peacock on January 14, offering a multifaceted view of one of music's most influential and polarizing figures. While it unearths stories of childhood resilience, ambition, and transformation, it also raises questions about the darker chapters of Diddy's life. #SeanCombs #DiddyDocumentary #MountVernon #MusicMogul #Peacock #HipHopHistory #Controversy Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

A new Peacock documentary, Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy, delves into the life of Sean “Diddy” Combs, offering fresh perspectives on his youth and rise to fame while confronting recent controversies surrounding the music icon. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend, painted a vivid picture of Diddy's early years in Mount Vernon, New York. “I know Sean, not Diddy, not Daddy Love,” Patterson shared in the film. “I have to tell people about what they don't know about his childhood.” He described young Sean as a wealthy outlier, often bullied due to his privileged background. “Sean was the different kid. People could smell he wasn't tough,” he added. The documentary explores how Diddy's father, Melvin Combs, was killed in what former bodyguard Gene Deal described as a retaliation for cooperating with law enforcement. This loss left Janice Combs, Diddy's mother, to raise her children alone. Patterson explained that Janice's inheritance allowed the family to move to a more affluent area, fostering a life of luxury for her son. “He was the one in the hat, with jewelry on, at four years old,” Patterson remarked about an old photo. Diddy's childhood also involved exposure to lively, unconventional environments. “Sean's house was the party spot,” Patterson recalled, citing wild gatherings that mirrored the flamboyant celebrations Diddy would later host as an adult. According to Lee Davis, a friend and DJ, “She made sure everybody was comfortable,” though Janice Combs did not comment on her portrayal in the documentary. The film highlights Diddy's relentless ambition, which emerged during his time at Howard University. Ron Lawrence, a college classmate, noted that Diddy declared, “I'm gonna be the biggest record producer in the world.” His determination paid off after dropping out of college and securing an internship at Uptown Records in 1990. Patterson recalled, “He'd show up anywhere to get the bigwigs' attention—even sleeping outside of Andre Harrell's car.” Despite his success, Diddy's legacy faces challenges. In September 2024, he was arrested on charges of sex trafficking, racketeering conspiracy, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges, and his representatives vehemently deny the allegations. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories,” a spokesperson told Us Weekly, criticizing NBC and Peacock for amplifying what they view as baseless claims. The documentary premieres on Peacock on January 14, offering a multifaceted view of one of music's most influential and polarizing figures. While it unearths stories of childhood resilience, ambition, and transformation, it also raises questions about the darker chapters of Diddy's life. #SeanCombs #DiddyDocumentary #MountVernon #MusicMogul #Peacock #HipHopHistory #Controversy Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

A new Peacock documentary, Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy, delves into the life of Sean “Diddy” Combs, offering fresh perspectives on his youth and rise to fame while confronting recent controversies surrounding the music icon. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend, painted a vivid picture of Diddy's early years in Mount Vernon, New York. “I know Sean, not Diddy, not Daddy Love,” Patterson shared in the film. “I have to tell people about what they don't know about his childhood.” He described young Sean as a wealthy outlier, often bullied due to his privileged background. “Sean was the different kid. People could smell he wasn't tough,” he added. The documentary explores how Diddy's father, Melvin Combs, was killed in what former bodyguard Gene Deal described as a retaliation for cooperating with law enforcement. This loss left Janice Combs, Diddy's mother, to raise her children alone. Patterson explained that Janice's inheritance allowed the family to move to a more affluent area, fostering a life of luxury for her son. “He was the one in the hat, with jewelry on, at four years old,” Patterson remarked about an old photo. Diddy's childhood also involved exposure to lively, unconventional environments. “Sean's house was the party spot,” Patterson recalled, citing wild gatherings that mirrored the flamboyant celebrations Diddy would later host as an adult. According to Lee Davis, a friend and DJ, “She made sure everybody was comfortable,” though Janice Combs did not comment on her portrayal in the documentary. The film highlights Diddy's relentless ambition, which emerged during his time at Howard University. Ron Lawrence, a college classmate, noted that Diddy declared, “I'm gonna be the biggest record producer in the world.” His determination paid off after dropping out of college and securing an internship at Uptown Records in 1990. Patterson recalled, “He'd show up anywhere to get the bigwigs' attention—even sleeping outside of Andre Harrell's car.” Despite his success, Diddy's legacy faces challenges. In September 2024, he was arrested on charges of sex trafficking, racketeering conspiracy, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges, and his representatives vehemently deny the allegations. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories,” a spokesperson told Us Weekly, criticizing NBC and Peacock for amplifying what they view as baseless claims. The documentary premieres on Peacock on January 14, offering a multifaceted view of one of music's most influential and polarizing figures. While it unearths stories of childhood resilience, ambition, and transformation, it also raises questions about the darker chapters of Diddy's life. #SeanCombs #DiddyDocumentary #MountVernon #MusicMogul #Peacock #HipHopHistory #Controversy Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

A new Peacock documentary, Diddy: The Making of a Bad Boy, delves into the life of Sean “Diddy” Combs, offering fresh perspectives on his youth and rise to fame while confronting recent controversies surrounding the music icon. Tim Patterson, a childhood friend, painted a vivid picture of Diddy's early years in Mount Vernon, New York. “I know Sean, not Diddy, not Daddy Love,” Patterson shared in the film. “I have to tell people about what they don't know about his childhood.” He described young Sean as a wealthy outlier, often bullied due to his privileged background. “Sean was the different kid. People could smell he wasn't tough,” he added. The documentary explores how Diddy's father, Melvin Combs, was killed in what former bodyguard Gene Deal described as a retaliation for cooperating with law enforcement. This loss left Janice Combs, Diddy's mother, to raise her children alone. Patterson explained that Janice's inheritance allowed the family to move to a more affluent area, fostering a life of luxury for her son. “He was the one in the hat, with jewelry on, at four years old,” Patterson remarked about an old photo. Diddy's childhood also involved exposure to lively, unconventional environments. “Sean's house was the party spot,” Patterson recalled, citing wild gatherings that mirrored the flamboyant celebrations Diddy would later host as an adult. According to Lee Davis, a friend and DJ, “She made sure everybody was comfortable,” though Janice Combs did not comment on her portrayal in the documentary. The film highlights Diddy's relentless ambition, which emerged during his time at Howard University. Ron Lawrence, a college classmate, noted that Diddy declared, “I'm gonna be the biggest record producer in the world.” His determination paid off after dropping out of college and securing an internship at Uptown Records in 1990. Patterson recalled, “He'd show up anywhere to get the bigwigs' attention—even sleeping outside of Andre Harrell's car.” Despite his success, Diddy's legacy faces challenges. In September 2024, he was arrested on charges of sex trafficking, racketeering conspiracy, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He has pleaded not guilty to all charges, and his representatives vehemently deny the allegations. “This documentary recycles and perpetuates the same lies and conspiracy theories,” a spokesperson told Us Weekly, criticizing NBC and Peacock for amplifying what they view as baseless claims. The documentary premieres on Peacock on January 14, offering a multifaceted view of one of music's most influential and polarizing figures. While it unearths stories of childhood resilience, ambition, and transformation, it also raises questions about the darker chapters of Diddy's life. #SeanCombs #DiddyDocumentary #MountVernon #MusicMogul #Peacock #HipHopHistory #Controversy Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, The Menendez Brothers: Quest For Justice, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, The Murder Of Sandra Birchmore, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

On this episode, we're discussing one of our favorite albums, My Life by Mary J. Blige. If you're anything like us, you've been bumping this consistently for the past 30 years. Yes, 30 years! Originally released on November 29, 1994, this album is a reflection of Mary's struggles with heartbreak and depression. Her vulnerable lyrics paired with lush production from Chucky Thompson created a groundbreaking piece of work that redefined R&B, and still resonates today. This is the album that solidified her title as the "Queen of Hip Hop Soul."If this little jaunt down memory lane wasn't enough for you, check out another episode of ours, "No Hateration, Holleration, In This Dancery," (Episode 9) where we get into Mary's entire career. From her early days at Uptown Records to her Academy Award nominations, we dig into it all.If you enjoy the content that we're making and you're looking for ways to support our independent podcast, here's a little something that you can do:Please leave us a 5 star rating or review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or Goodpods.You can also drop a few coins in our tip jar here: https://ko-fi.com/troypodcast if you're feeling generous.If it's merch that you're looking for, check out our store, Nuthin' But A Tee Thang, at teethang.comSpreading the word about the show to your friends and family helps too.Sign up for our monthly newsletter, Liner Notes.However you choose to support, know that it is greatly appreciated as always.

LORD JAMAR INTERVIEW- SAYS DIDDY WAS FIRED FROM UPTOWN RECORDS AFTER BEING WITH A MAN

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.in this episode we, we take a look at the recent raid on Puff Daddy's homes and where it all may go from here.(commercial at 7:22)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Homes Tied to Sean Combs Raided by Homeland Security in L.A. and Miami Area - The New York Times (nytimes.com)Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 10:16)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox News

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 7:08)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox NewsBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owned the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.In this episode we take a look at some of the people around Diddy who were allegedly integral the operation and who, according to court documents, took part in the criminal enterprise.   (commercial at 11:28)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Inside Sean 'Diddy' Combs' circle of sex, drugs & violence (nypost.com)

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 10:16)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox NewsBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.in this episode we, we take a look at the recent raid on Puff Daddy's homes and where it all may go from here.(commercial at 7:22)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Homes Tied to Sean Combs Raided by Homeland Security in L.A. and Miami Area - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

Did Sean "Diddy" Combs orchestrate a web of sex, drugs and violence scandals that could eclipse the darkest Hollywood tales? After a federal grand jury in New York indicted the 54-year-old, and a judge ordered him to a notorious jail, we examine the history of the torrid accusations and rumours, and ask whether society is finally closing in on wealthy abusers.  Kristi tells of her time at the Playboy Mansion: "I never saw any oil, I never saw naked bodies" but she also recounts the story of when she was propositioned on the floor of the US Senate.  The charges against Combs include sex offenses and transportation for prostitution, with the indictment claiming he "abused, threatened, and coerced women and others around him to fulfill his sexual desires, protect his reputation, and conceal his conduct." His lawyer, Mark Agnifilo maintained at Combs' initial court appearance that his client is "an innocent man with nothing to hide." STORIES 00:00 Start 00:02 This week, we're helped by some unusual props00:48 Diddy's upbringing01:32 Reacting to his experience growing up02:20 Uptown Records, becoming an executive02:57 The birth of Bad Boy Records03:35 Jeffrey Epstein04:20 The song Justin Bieber wrote05:10 This could take down an empire of celebrities05:40 He's got nothing to lose07:10 Rihanna's allegations08:25 "They want to get the bigger fish" 08:40 Clive Davis, who came out in the early nineties09:40 Sexual identities and the Mormons 10:41 Diddy's lawyer defends him 11:35 A thousand bottles of baby oil13:55 Surrounded by yes people14:45 Art Acevedo, dealing with corruption in Miami as Police Chief16:00 "He predicted this about himself"17:22 Diddy's relationship with Clive Davis18:25 Justin Bieber's discomfort19:25 Turning off Michael Jackson music 20:16 The Cassie relationship22:20 Meeting Wendy Williams23:55 Oprah, and the Kardashians25:15 Drug allegations26:58 The party attendee list28:28 "It's all coming to light" 29:10 "I never saw any oil, I never saw naked bodies"30:35 It's still happening to Harvey Weinstein31:58 "I was propositioned on the floor of the Senate" 

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owned the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.In this episode we take a look at some of the people around Diddy who were allegedly integral the operation and who, according to court documents, took part in the criminal enterprise.   (commercial at 11:27)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Inside Sean 'Diddy' Combs' circle of sex, drugs & violence (nypost.com)Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

pWotD Episode 2695: Sean Combs Welcome to Popular Wiki of the Day, spotlighting Wikipedia's most visited pages, giving you a peek into what the world is curious about today.With 319,582 views on Tuesday, 17 September 2024 our article of the day is Sean Combs.Sean Love Combs (born Sean John Combs; November 4, 1969), also known by his stage name Diddy, formerly Puff Daddy and P. Diddy, is an American rapper, record producer and record executive. He is credited with the discovery and cultivation of artists such as the Notorious B. I. G., Mary J. Blige, and Usher. Combs has won three Grammy Awards from 13 nominations, two MTV Video Music Awards, and a Guinness World Record for "Most Successful Rap Producer" in 1997.Born in Harlem and raised in Mount Vernon, New York, Combs worked as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. He embarked on his recording career following the mainstream success of his first signee, the Notorious B. I. G., for whom he served as manager and hype man. Released in the wake and memory of B. I. G's unsolved murder, Combs' debut studio album, No Way Out (1997), was met with critical acclaim, peaked atop the Billboard 200 and received septuple platinum certification by the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA). Its two preceding singles, "Can't Nobody Hold Me Down" (featuring Mase) and "I'll Be Missing You" (with Faith Evans featuring 112), both peaked the Billboard Hot 100—the latter became the first hip hop song to debut atop the chart. His second and third albums, Forever (1999) and The Saga Continues... (2001), both peaked at number two on the Billboard 200 despite mixed critical reception, while his fourth, Press Play (2006), peaked atop the chart once more. Combs then formed the musical group Diddy – Dirty Money—with R&B singers Kalenna Harper and Dawn Richard—to release the collaborative album Last Train to Paris (2010), which peaked at number seven and was supported by the single "Coming Home" (featuring Skylar Grey). His fifth studio album, The Love Album: Off the Grid (2023), was met with moderate critical and commercial response, and served as his first release without a major label.Outside of music, he has worked in production for other media, including MTV's reality series Making the Band. He launched the clothing retailer Sean John in 1998, for which he won Menswear Designer of the Year by the Council of Fashion Designers of America in 2004, having previously been nominated in 2000. Combs served as brand ambassador for the vodka retailer Cîroc from 2007 to 2023, and co-founded the television network Revolt in 2013. Zack O'Malley Greenburg estimated Combs' net worth at US$1 billion in 2022, making him one of the wealthiest musical artists.Combs has been the subject of a number of sexual misconduct allegations, which began in late 2023 after Cassie Ventura, with whom Combs had a long-term relationship, filed a multi-million dollar lawsuit against him for sexual assault, which was settled out of court. In the following days, weeks, and months, over 11 more lawsuits were filed by additional claimants, with similar allegations of misconduct ranging from 1991 to 2009. In the wake of the allegations, various companies and brands dissociated themselves from Combs, and an honorary doctorate from Howard University was revoked. In March 2024, several properties tied to Combs were raided by the Department of Homeland Security as part of an ongoing investigation. In May 2024, surveillance footage of Combs physically assaulting Ventura at a hotel was released, for which Combs issued a public apology. After several similar misconduct allegations arose, he was indicted by a federal New York grand jury and arrested in Manhattan on September 16, 2024; he was charged with sex trafficking and racketeering. His commercial enterprises were additionally alleged to have been involved with narcotics offenses, kidnapping, arson and bribery, and Combs was alleged to have committed physical and sexual abuse against victims.This recording reflects the Wikipedia text as of 02:31 UTC on Wednesday, 18 September 2024.For the full current version of the article, see Sean Combs on Wikipedia.This podcast uses content from Wikipedia under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License.Visit our archives at wikioftheday.com and subscribe to stay updated on new episodes.Follow us on Mastodon at @wikioftheday@masto.ai.Also check out Curmudgeon's Corner, a current events podcast.Until next time, I'm standard Joey.

Beneath the glittering lights of the music industry lie three iconic names – Ms. Whitney Houston, Jennifer Lopez, and Sean Combs, also known as Diddy. While each has carved their unique path to stardom, their universal impact on pop culture remains immense.Whitney Houston, dubbed as The Voice, still holds an irreplaceable place in the hearts of many. Her soaring vocals and soulful melodies continue to influence contemporary artists, and her groundbreaking career, albeit marked by personal turmoil, has set a high bar for success in the industry. Houston's music thrived in the late '80s and '90s, a period often heralded as the pinnacle of pop and R&B. Songs like 'I Will Always Love You', 'Saving All My Love for You', and 'How Will I Know' are etched into the collective consciousness, demonstrating her vocal prowess and emotional depth.Her legacy also prevails in records. Houston was the first artist to have seven consecutive number one Billboard Hot 100 songs, and her album, 'Whitney,' is the first album by a woman to debut at number one on the Billboard 200. Houston isn't merely a singer; she's a symbol of tenacity, talent, and triumph over adversity.Like Houston, Jennifer Lopez has established herself as a multifaceted star. Beginning her career as a dancer, Lopez quickly ascended the ranks of Hollywood, becoming an accomplished actor, singer, and producer. Lopez's success lies not only in her string of hit singles, 'If You Had My Love', 'On The Floor', and 'Jenny From The Block', but also in her engaging performances on both film and television.More so, Lopez's influence extends beyond music and acting. She's launched successful ventures in fashion and fragrances, written an autobiographical book, and is an active philanthropist. Lopez, a third-generation American of Puerto Rican descent, has challenged Hollywood stereotypes, proudly representing Latino culture on a global stage.Sean Combs, also known as Diddy, has made an indelible mark through his work as a rapper, songwriter, record producer, and entrepreneur. Combs began as an intern at Uptown Records before founding Bad Boy Entertainment in 1993, launching the careers of several successful artists like The Notorious B.I.G. and Faith Evans.Beyond music, Combs has demonstrated keen business acumen with his clothing line Sean John, his ownership of Cîroc vodka, and his executive producer credits on the MTV reality series 'Making the Band'. Diddy's ability to transform his brand into a diversified empire is a testament to his dynamic capabilities.Whitney Houston, Jennifer Lopez, and Sean Combs – three distinct voices, one unified influence. Their significant contributions to music are an enduring testament to their hard work, talent, and innovative spirit. Through their palpable impact, they have redefined popular culture, impacting generations to come. Their stories stand as a beacon of aspiration for many — a testament to the magic that can be created when passion meets perseverance.

Renowned rapper and entrepreneur Sean Combs, famously known as Diddy, disputes recent sexual harassment allegations against him. Within the intricate tangle of 2024 court documents, amid the bustling hum of XL Motors, Combs finds himself at the center of a storm, sternly repudiating the accusations that threaten his reputation.Of note is that fellow artist Meek Mill, although not directly identified in the lawsuit, conspicuously dots the legal narrative. Discerning readers may find their curiosities piqued at the subtle hints and veiled references to his potential involvement.These allegations present a significant blow to Combs' highly esteemed public image. Known for dominating the music industry, his immensely successful career spans decades, from his days working as a talent director at Uptown Records to founding his own record label, Bad Boy Worldwide Entertainment Group.As a music producer, Combs has fostered the careers of multiple reputable artists, helping to mold and shape the dynamic soundscape of the industry. As an entrepreneur, he has shown his versatility by branching out into various ventures including fashion and premium spirit brands. An extremely visible figure, any tarnish on his reputation could have significant impact on his varied fields of interest.Combs' adamant denial underscores the complexity and intensity of the situation at hand. Accustomed to the spotlight, he handles the unfolding controversy with a surprising degree of discretion and decorum, underscoring his resolve to maintain innocence.In the legal sphere, anonymity is often granted to offer protection, thus, the indirect reference to Meek Mill raises more questions than answers. Known for an illustrious career in the music industry, Mill's potential involvement raises eyebrows and fuels speculations across both public and legal spheres.Mill, just like Combs, rose to fame after years of perseverance amidst initial challenges at the advent of his career. His chart-topping hits and collaborations with top-tier celebrities have placed him as one of the staples in the global hip-hop scene. How this situation could potentially affect his career remains an uneasy question hanging in the air.Situations such as these serve as important reminders of the legal scrutiny and public judgment celebrities often face. Whether Combs' denial will hold up in court remains to be seen and the indirect involvement of Meek Mill adds another layer of intrigue. In the world where fame, reputation and public perception play monumental roles, both Combs and Mill must navigate their vessels with even more care now. Also, it calls upon the public and fans to respond with mature empathy and withhold hasty judgement until the full truth is revealed.

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owned the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.In this episode we take a look at some of the people around Diddy who were allegedly integral the operation and who, according to court documents, took part in the criminal enterprise.   (commercial at 11:28)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Inside Sean 'Diddy' Combs' circle of sex, drugs & violence (nypost.com)

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 10:16)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox News

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, and Diddy, is a multifaceted American entertainment mogul whose influence spans music, fashion, and business. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York, and raised in Mount Vernon, Combs has been a defining figure in the hip-hop industry since the early 1990s.Combs began his career as an intern at Uptown Records where he quickly rose to the position of A&R executive. He played a pivotal role in developing and promoting the careers of Mary J. Blige and Jodeci. His remarkable acumen in identifying and nurturing talent became evident early on. However, his journey at Uptown was cut short after he was fired, which led him to establish his own music production company, Bad Boy Entertainment, in 1993.Bad Boy Entertainment soon became a powerhouse in the music industry under Combs' leadership. The label was instrumental in the careers of some of the biggest names in hip-hop and R&B, including The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, Mase, and 112. Combs himself also released several successful albums, such as "No Way Out" (1997), which featured hits like "I'll Be Missing You" — a tribute to his friend and artist Notorious B.I.G. This song, a collaboration with Faith Evans and 112, showcased Combs' ability to blend hip-hop with heartfelt emotion, helping it to win a Grammy Award for Best Rap Performance by a Duo or Group.Beyond music, Combs has made significant strides in other industries. In fashion, his clothing line, Sean John, launched in 1998, has been praised for its style and innovation. It successfully bridged the gap between streetwear and high fashion, receiving critical acclaim, including a Council of Fashion Designers of America (CFDA) Award in 2004.In addition to his fashion line, Combs has ventured into the realms of reality TV, beverages, and fragrances. His entrepreneurial spirit saw him creating the Sean John fragrance in collaboration with Estée Lauder and the premium vodka brand, Ciroc, in partnership with Diageo, which he helped to transform into a globally recognized brand through his marketing prowess.Philanthropy is also a significant aspect of Combs' career. He has contributed to various causes and launched initiatives such as the Sean Combs Scholarship Fund, which aims to help underprivileged students attend college. His commitment to education was further highlighted when he opened Capital Preparatory Harlem Charter School in 2016, demonstrating his passion for education reform and community development.Despite controversies and challenges, including legal issues and feuds within the hip-hop community, Combs' impact on music and culture remains undeniable. His work has not only shaped the landscape of hip-hop and R&B but has also influenced the broader culture of fashion and entrepreneurship.In summary, Sean Combs is not just a rapper or producer; he is a visionary entrepreneur who transcends music and embraces a range of industries, from fashion to spirits and beyond. His legacy is characterized by his relentless innovation, influential artistry, and philanthropic contributions, making him one of the most impactful figures in the world of entertainment and business.

We have a BONUS episode only for Supporters! This episode is the grand daddy of all Diddy Deep Dives! For three hours we'll detail his rise and fall- from blood sacrifice tragedies at Uptown Records to his connections to the murder of 2Pac and Notorious BIG with Bad Boy Records, as well as his legal issues and allegations going back to the 1980s up to Cassie and Lil Rod. We'll also look at his connections and parallels to Epstein blackmail sex trafficking and surveillance operations which get into secret society practices of mind control and occult beliefs in false apotheosis with magickal Synchromysticism hidden in plain sight!Here's how I'm mapping out this exhaustive journey into the occult world of Diddy:Diddy Deep Dive Topics-Gangster BeginningsMelvin Combs was gang member turned informantDenzel Washington, Ridley Scott, Nicky Barnes (also informant), Cuba Gooding Jr, Jay-ZRudy Giuliani let Barnes out early releaseDrug Industry and the Illuminati wealthBloodlines that started America would utilize illegal drugs, addiction and privatized prisonsConnections of Mob, Contras, MKULTRA, CIA, FBI & IlluminatiDeath Row Records, Suge Knight, Freeway Ricky Ross, CIA, Seagrams, NXIVM, Harry OTrump pardoning Harry ODiddy's Influence on musicBlood Sacrifice beginningsUptown Records, Bad Boy, Sean JeanMurder of BIG and 2Pac (and alleged 2pac murderer Keefe D's Diddy claims)Russell Simmons- another abuser on the runLawsuitsLegal troubles go way backKim Porter's mysterious deathCassieLil RodBritney Spears connection- Lou Taylor and Robin GreenhillAbuse & SatanismGay rumors in hip hopAshton Kutcher connections- Harley Pasternak, Brittany MurphyCandy Michelle Johnson- adrenochrome witch and other booksMarc Curry bookDiddy's back tattoo of a voodoo goddessDiddy's adoptionDiddy's 3AM cologne & Cassie abuse videoJay-Z, Meek Mill, Prodigy from Mobb Deep, Danity Kane's Aubrey O'Day, Jamie Foxx, Diddy Parties, 50 Cent, Suge Knight, Lucian Grainge, YeSynchomysticism: Joker Tarot, Will Smith slapUPDATESRolling Stone article revelations: accusations,Cassie video from 2017 and Tarot symbolismNOW UP AD-FREE, ONLY ON SUPPORTER FEEDS!SPECIAL EVENT: Isaac, Jay Dyer & Jamie Hanshaw Lecture Meet & Greet in Las Vegas June 22nd- Get your tickets: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/jamie-kennedy-jay-jamie-isaac-hollywood-conspiracy-comedy-live-tickets-882418596777?aff=oddtdtcreatorLinks:You've got until July 1st to use coupon code offer "badboy" to try the VIP Section supporter feed at cost! That's right- you'll get into my Tier 1 or Tier 2 Monthly plans for 80% off the first month so you can try it out for cheap! Offer expires July 1st and is LIMITED TO THE FIRST 100 CUSTOMERS! Just go to the IlluminatiWatcher.com VIP Section menu (or click here: https://illuminatiwatcher.com/members-section/), scroll all the way down, register and use Coupon Code "badboy" for Tier 1 or Tier 2 monthly plans.I can't offer this on Apple Podcasts Premium or Patreon.com/IlluminatiWatcher because VIP Section is the only supporter platform I have full control over.Two previous Supporters Only Diddy shows:Dec 2023 BONUS: Diddy's Darkness: Cassie, Ye, 50 Cent, Jamie Foxx & the Synchromysticism of 2Pac, Jada Pinkett, Will Smith Slap! https://illuminatiwatcher.com/bonus-diddys-darkness-cassie-ye-50-cent-jamie-foxx-the-synchromysticism-of-2pac-jada-pinkett-will-smith-slap/March 2024: BONUS- Diddy Conspiracy: Epstein Blackmail, Sex Trafficking, UMG, Lucian Grainge, JLo, Cuba Gooding Jr, Jay-Z & More! https://illuminatiwatcher.com/bonus-diddy-conspiracy-epstein-blackmail-sex-trafficking-umg-lucian-grainge-jlo-cuba-gooding-jr-jay-z-more/So SOME of this is repeat info, but it's all important in the scheme of thingsSUPPORTER FEEDS: Go ad-free with HUNDREDS of bonus episodes, early access and books!Patreon.com/IlluminatiWatcher,VIP Section (*with comparsion of Apple vs Patreon vs VIP): https://wp.me/P2ijVF-aRLApple Podcasts Premium! You can now go ad-free with ALL the bonus episodes on the Apple app- just open up the podcast and subscribe!

On this episode we're talking about Mr. Big Stuff, The Heavster, The Overweight Lover, out of Moneyearnin' Mount Vernon, the diddly, diddly, diddly, diddly, diddly D. One of a small number of people who have done a song with both Michael and Janet Jackson. The man who is pretty much responsible for kicking off Uptown Records, since he was the first act signed to the label, and as an executive at Uptown he's was instrumental in bringing Jodeci, Monifah, Soul For Real and others to the company.Along with DJ Eddie F, Trouble T-Roy and G-Wiz aka The Boyz, he brought us hit after hit. He could do new jack swing, boom bap, reggae, pop...he could do it all. There have been very few hip hop artists who could seamlessly maneuver through so many styles and genres at such a high level, all while never compromising his authenticity. Since his untimely passing in 2011, he's been sorely missed, and that's why we're talking about none other than Heavy D.If you enjoy the content that we're making and you're looking for ways to support our independent podcast, here's a little something that you can do:Please leave us a 5 star rating or review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser or Goodpods.You can also drop a few coins in our tip jar here: https://ko-fi.com/troypodcast if you're feeling generous.If it's merch that you're looking for, check out our store, Nuthin' But A Tee Thang, at teethang.comSpreading the word about the show to your friends and family helps too.Sign up for our monthly newsletter, Liner Notes.However you choose to support, know that it is greatly appreciated as always.

Diddy did it? This week we are talking about the now infamous Sean Combs and the Epstein-like drama that has built after a CONCERNING amount of allegations have come out against the media mogul.  In Part 1 of 2 we are talking about how Diddy got to where he is today. We review his early days at Uptown Records, the creation of Bad Boy entertainment, and of course his time on Making the Band (miss you Danity Kane). But the real star of this episode is Diddy's time as a true bad boy with multiple arrests, assaults, and a pep rally gone VERY wrong. This is all child's play compared to the more recent allegations that have come up so be sure to subscribe for part 2 where we will go over his time with Cassie, the laundry list of accusers and how other celebrities may be tied in. It's like Epstein's island but with attractive people! Follow us @risquebusinessnews @laurasogar @mae_planert and write us a kind review for a good old fashioned in the mail gift! https://forms.gle/gRZ1j9vEwoGYhWQR9

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owned the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.In this episode we take a look at some of the people around Diddy who were allegedly integral the operation and who, according to court documents, took part in the criminal enterprise.   (commercial at 11:28)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Inside Sean 'Diddy' Combs' circle of sex, drugs & violence (nypost.com)

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owned the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.In this episode we take a look at some of the people around Diddy who were allegedly integral the operation and who, according to court documents, took part in the criminal enterprise.   to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Inside Sean 'Diddy' Combs' circle of sex, drugs & violence (nypost.com)Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Buckle up for a wild ride into the eye of a storm that's shaking the very foundations of the music industry on Episode 135 of the Black Lincoln Collective Podcast. Our hosts Parker, Fred, and Allan (the man behind the soundboard) navigate the tumultuous revelations surrounding hip-hop mogul Sean "Diddy" Combs. Dive into a sea of allegations, lawsuits, and jaw-dropping claims that have everyone questioning the past and bracing for the future. The BLC team dissects the complex web of accusations against Diddy, from exploitation to sex trafficking, and the potential involvement of other high-profile figures. They explore the untimely deaths of industry insiders, the eerie commonalities between them, and the bombshell lawsuits that could topple empires. But it's not all heavy; the crew lightens the mood with a dose of humor and some truly wild prank ideas for April Fool's Day. From laugh-out-loud gags to cringe-worthy stunts, find out which pranks are hot and which ones are definitely not. Join us for a no-holds-barred discussion that's part investigative journalism, part comedy, and entirely BLC. This episode is not just a conversation; it's a revelation. #BLCpodcast #Episode135 #DiddyDrama #AprilFoolsFollies #MusicMogulMeltdown (00:54) This is the 135th edition of the Black Lincoln Collective podcast(01:28) Fred is leaving the show to be part of Joe Rogan's traveling show(02:48) Allen Draper says April Fools is the fooliest day of the year(06:47) DJ went on vacation with some buddies from the bar used to work at(10:05) Fred says there are some great April fools pranks you can play(15:46) Frank the prankster has some great April Fool's pranks for you(21:10) I pay somebody to cut my grass. I hate it. So, yeah, I did mine, uh, last week(22:33) An anus eating virus is killing 30% of people and spreading rapidly(27:51) Doctor Frenchie speaks about the Black Lincoln collective podcast(28:43) There's been some allegations about puff daddy over the last couple of days(33:18) All these lawsuits against Puffy expired in November of 2023(38:10) Craig Mac: After Biggie's album, Harrell started Uptown Records(40:30) Andre Herrera's death was initially thought to be connected to pneumonia(42:45) There were rumors that Beyonce was pregnant before she married Jay Z(47:39) So, uh, all that led to what happened earlier last week(48:30) Brendan Paul was arrested Monday in Miami as part of a sex trafficking investigation(50:30) Do you think Diddy had something to do with Biggie's death(54:25) Clive Davis was the first mogul to openly come out as gay(58:02) Fred: Do you think Drake is involved in this in any way(01:01:20) Fred: This is crazy. It's crazy. Just insanity. If it's true, P. Diddy will end up dead(01:04:37) Fred tried to get us all to play monopoly. It ended up being human #blcpodcast #podcastingforthepeople #funny #podcast #greenvillesc #scpodcast #yeahthatgreenville Listen at: https://blc.world/ Tweet the Show: https://twitter.com/blcworld Follow us on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/blcpodcast/ Check us out on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/blcpodcast/ Buy Fred and Allan Beer: https://www.patreon.com/blcworld

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 10:16)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox News

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.As we begin to learn more about the raid on P. Diddy's homes over Human trafficking allegations, it's become apparent that the Feds are serious and that they have at least enough evidence to initiate a gigantic operation such as the raids we saw yesterday.    That usually spells trouble for the person being investigated and in this episode we hear from several experts talking the extreme jeopardy that Puff Daddy now finds himself in.   (commercial at 10:16)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Sean 'Diddy' Combs human trafficking investigation raid is 'just the beginning' of legal hurdles: expert | Fox NewsBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.in this episode we, we take a look at the recent raid on Puff Daddy's homes and where it all may go from here.(commercial at 7:22)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Homes Tied to Sean Combs Raided by Homeland Security in L.A. and Miami Area - The New York Times (nytimes.com)

Sean Combs, also known by his stage names Puff Daddy, P. Diddy, Diddy, and Brother Love, is a prominent figure in the music industry. Born on November 4, 1969, in Harlem, New York City, he has established himself as a rapper, singer, songwriter, actor, record producer, and entrepreneur.Combs initially gained recognition as a talent director at Uptown Records before founding his own record label, Bad Boy Records, in 1993. Under Bad Boy Records, he produced and released albums for artists like The Notorious B.I.G., Faith Evans, and Mary J. Blige, among others, contributing significantly to the East Coast hip hop scene of the 1990s.In addition to his music career, Combs has ventured into various business endeavors, including fashion, fragrance, and media. He founded the clothing line Sean John, which became highly successful, and has collaborated with several other brands over the years. Combs also owns the television network Revolt TV and has investments in other sectors.Throughout his career, Combs has faced various allegations and controversies, some of which include:Legal issues related to nightclub incidents: Combs has been involved in altercations at nightclubs over the years, including a highly publicized incident in 1999 at Club New York where shots were fired. Combs was subsequently charged with weapons violations and bribery, although he was acquitted of all charges in 2001.Allegations of assault: Combs has faced accusations of assault from multiple individuals. One notable incident occurred in 2007 when a man claimed that Combs and his bodyguards attacked him outside a nightclub in Atlanta. Combs denied the allegations, and the case was settled out of court.Legal disputes with former associates: Combs has been embroiled in legal battles with former associates and business partners over the years, including disputes over contracts, royalties, and intellectual property rights. These disputes have sometimes resulted in lawsuits and settlements.Financial controversies: Despite his success as an entrepreneur, Combs has faced criticism and legal challenges related to his financial dealings. In 2017, he was sued by his former chef for unpaid wages and emotional distress, leading to a settlement. Additionally, there have been reports of financial difficulties and unpaid debts associated with some of Combs' business ventures.Allegations of Human trafficking/sexual abuse have plagued him for years and all of those allegations along with the previous lawsuits have culminated in this investigation and the raid.in this episode we, we take a look at the recent raid on Puff Daddy's homes and where it all may go from here.(commercial at 7:22)to contact me:bobbycapucci@protonmail.comsource:Homes Tied to Sean Combs Raided by Homeland Security in L.A. and Miami Area - The New York Times (nytimes.com)Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-epstein-chronicles--5003294/support.

Casey Gane - The Sex Scandals of P Diddy3 days agoCasey Gane-McCalla is a writer, actor, musician, journalist and the author of "Inside The CIA's Secret War In Jamaica."He talks to Ed Opperman about the behaviour of P Diddy.The rapper Sean Combs, known more commonly as P Diddy, Puff Daddy or Diddy, has been accused of over 15 years' worth of physical, sexual and mental abuse by his ex-girlfriend, the American singer-songwriter Cassie. P Diddy denies all the allegations.Combs, whose 1997 debut album No Way Out catapulted him onto the rap scene and eventually went on to be certified seven times platinum, is one of the biggest names in American hip hop. He got his start at Uptown Records, where he helped develop R&B legends like Mary J Blige and Jodeci, before pivoting into creating music himself, then later becoming a record label executive and producer.TwitterSpreakerBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-opperman-report--1198501/support.

Casey Gane - The Sex Scandals of P Diddy4 days agoCasey Gane-McCalla is a writer, actor, musician, journalist and the author of "Inside The CIA's Secret War In Jamaica."He talks to Ed Opperman about the behaviour of P Diddy.The rapper Sean Combs, known more commonly as P Diddy, Puff Daddy or Diddy, has been accused of over 15 years' worth of physical, sexual and mental abuse by his ex-girlfriend, the American singer-songwriter Cassie. P Diddy denies all the allegations.Combs, whose 1997 debut album No Way Out catapulted him onto the rap scene and eventually went on to be certified seven times platinum, is one of the biggest names in American hip hop. He got his start at Uptown Records, where he helped develop R&B legends like Mary J Blige and Jodeci, before pivoting into creating music himself, then later becoming a record label executive and producer.Twitter SpreakerBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-opperman-report--1198501/support.

This is our longest episode to date, and long overdue.  Take a trip down the Hiphop History Highway with the Legendary Jesse West as he speaks on his works with The Notorious B.I.G, KRS One, Xzibit, and others.    Jesse West, a.k.a. 3rd Eye is a producer/rapper. Jesse grew up in the Bronx River Projects, where the Master/Teacher DJ Afrika Bambaataa founded the Universal Zulu Nation.  Born Jesse Williams III, he was one of the first rappers signed to Motown Records and, in 1989, released the album "No Prisoners". He then went on to produce hit songs with many artists including GZA, Xzibit, Heavy D and KRS-One among others. One of Bad Boy Records' original "Hitmen", West recorded Biggie Smalls first demo as well as produced remixes for songs on Mary J. Blige's album, What's the 411?As rapper 3rd Eye, it has been argued that Jesse West was the first rapper to use the term "bling"  on Super Cat's 1993 hit "Dolly My Baby (Remix)" - a song that West produced and also featured Puff Daddy and a young Biggie Smalls in his recording debut.Jesse West continues to create tracks and produce music for artists.This week's episode is brought to you by Manscaped! Get 20% Off and Free Shipping with the code THECHOPSHOP at Manscaped.com. That's 20% off with free shipping at manscaped.com and use code THECHOPSHOP. Unlock your confidence and always use the right tools for the job with MANSCAPED™.Support the showWEBSITE AND MERCH! - http://www.officialchopshoppod.com

Cassie vs. Puffy..   Need we say anymore?  This week has been crazy with Puffy aka Brother Love settling this lawsuit in about 24 years.   Do we ban Puffy like R. Kelly? 

Hip Hop Legend Father MC talks about his come up and getting signed by Andre Harrell's Uptown Records, Puffy bringing him Jodeci, Mary J. Blige, how close him & Heavy D were , seeing the rise of the Notorious BIG and so much more Follow @bhightv and @bhighatl --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/b-high-atl/support

August 11, 2023 is the 50th anniversary of hip-hop. What started out mostly as a spoken word artform has become a worldwide juggernaut. Thanks to the moguls who pushed the genre forward, hip-hop went from 0 to 100.In this episode, we rank the 50 greatest moguls in hip-hop's history. We reached out to industry experts — from artists to execs to media personalities — to help us compile the list. Friend of the pod, Zack O'Malley Greenburg, joins me to count them down from No. 50 to No. 10:39 How do we define “mogul”7:06 Honorable mentions09:10 The “Don't overlook their influence” group (ranks 50-41)16:19 The “Playing chess not checkers” group (ranks 40-31)23:38 The “Our impact runs deep” group (ranks 30-21)33:47 No. 2035:37 No. 1937:56 No. 1841:32 No. 1744:27 No. 1647:21 No. 1551:22 No. 14 55:55 No. 1359:09 No. 121:00:46 No. 111:02:16 No. 101:04:39 No. 91:06:44 No. 81:10:20 No. 71:14:06 No. 61:15:37 No. 51:17:11 No. 41:20:53 No. 31:29:06 No. 21:30:34 No. 11:33:22 Who got snubbed?1:35:42 What trends stick out from the list?1:41:21 Who would you pick to run your empire?Listen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | SoundCloud | Stitcher | Overcast | Amazon | Google Podcasts | Pocket Casts | RSSHost: Dan Runcie, @RuncieDan, trapital.coGuests: Zack O'Malley Greenburg, @zogblogThis episode is sponsored by DICE. Learn more about why artists, venues, and promoters love to partner with DICE for their ticketing needs. Visit dice.fmEnjoy this podcast? Rate and review the podcast here! ratethispodcast.com/trapitalTrapital is home for the business of music, media and culture. Learn more by reading Trapital's free memo.TRANSCRIPT[00:00:00] Zack Greenburg: ownership. Was just such an important thing for Nipsey. Such an important thing for Berner. And, you know, interviewing the two of them, I would say, their mindset around ownership was the closest I've ever seen to Jay Z.[00:00:13] Dan Runcie Intro Audio: Hey, welcome to the Trapital Podcast. I'm your host and the founder of Trapital, Dan Runcie. This podcast is your place to gain insights from the executives in music, media, entertainment, and more who are taking hip hop culture to the next level.[00:00:39] Dan Runcie Guest Intro: This episode is a celebration to hip hop's 50th anniversary. This is a countdown on the 50 greatest moguls ever in hip hop. I'm joined by Zack O'Malley Greenburg, friend of the pod, and we both reached out to. A bunch of label heads, executives, people in hip hop that would know best. And we put it together in an aggregate list.And we're here to break down that list today. We talk about what does it mean to be a mogul? What are some of the considerations we made when we were looking into this list ourselves, how the results looked, what surprised us? What were the snubs? What were the misses? And what can we learn from this overall?And if Zack and I were putting together our dream teams, what would that look like? This is a lot of fun. Really happy with how it turned out. So let's dive in.[00:01:25] Dan Runcie: All right, hip hop's 50th anniversary is right around the corner and we decided to celebrate it in the only way that we know best countdown hip hop's greatest moguls and I'm joined by Zack O'malley Greenburg, who reached out to me about this. I was really excited about it and we spent some time over the past couple of weeks, reaching out to people we know, making sure that we have the best insights looking through and making sure that we had all of the. Breakdowns to share. So Zack, I'm ready for this. How are you feeling?[00:01:55] Zack Greenburg: I am stoked. Yeah, I mean, you know, 50th anniversary of hip hop. We reached out to 50 different judges. amongst, you know, the sort of, the most respected folks from, you know, label heads to artists to entrepreneurs, you know, I think we've got half of them, roughly half of them replied since in their votes, we're going to keep their individual votes anonymous, but, you know, Dan could tell you about some of the judges.Yeah, and it was just really fun to kind of mix it up, you know, I think the thing about this list, a lot of these characters are just kind of an apples to oranges comparison as you'll see once we dive into it, but that's the beauty of it, right? I mean, how do you, you know, compare like a pioneering executive to like a modern day artist mogul? And we really kind of left it in the hands of the judges. And we just said, basically the only guidance was, this is a business focused list, but you know, you can rank artists, executives, people who are both. It just, whatever your definition of mogul is, that's how, you know, that's how you should rank them. And people submitted lists and obviously the higher they rank somebody, the more points we gave them and, you know, the lower they got, but, you know, so there's some people on there who are like accumulators. They ended up on everybody's list, but not so high, but, you know, as a result, they ended up on the top 50.And then there are some who were just like, not ranked at all by most people, but had a couple of really high ranks so that they made the list. So I think it's a pretty cool mix.[00:03:10] Dan Runcie: Right? It's kind of like how we look at artists. There's some artists that have just been consistent, steady through and through each year. You'll always get some reliable output from them, but then there are other artists too. They were the best for a certain amount of time. Maybe they cooled off for a bit.Maybe they came back and that's kind of the way music is too. One of the things that. I was asked whenever I was reaching out to people about this was the same thing that you posed earlier. People wanted to know, how are we defining mogul and we left it up to their interpretation. It is a term that means different things to different people, but maybe for the sake of this conversation, let's kick it off here.Zack, how do you define mogul? And how did you define it when creating your list?[00:03:51] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, I mean, to me a hip hop mogul, more general is just, you know, somebody who not only is a business person, but has some degree of ownership, in whatever it is that they're doing. that's not the only definition of it for me, but like, you know, when I was putting together my rankings, I thought, you know, who are the owners?the same time, you know, people who are executives who are in a decision making place. you know, that counts for something. And I think also, you know, if you're an artist, and you simply have some control over your own work, you maintain your copyrights, whatever, like that counts as being a mogul. So, you know, specifically when it comes to hip hop, you know, I'd say people who are, you know, definitely getting in charge of your own work, but also creating new lines of business, you know, influencing the culture. but you know, a way that they've got some skin in the game from a business perspective, you know, that, kind of thing.That's kind of how I looked at it. but you could see from the votes that, you know, everybody had a slightly different definition too.[00:04:47] Dan Runcie: Yeah, there was definitely a lot of correlation with the artists who tend to be the ones that are the wealthiest. They end up at the highest rankings in on some of those lists, too, but it wasn't exactly correlated because there's a difference. And these are some of the things I kept in mind, too, with the mogul definition, thinking specifically aboutinfluence and impact, were you having, or did you create opportunities for others around you? Were you able to be a bit of a kingmaker or queenmaker in your respective right? Was there a impact in terms of other generations that either looked and modeled how they're doing what they're doing and looking at you as some form of inspiration with that?So there's the indirect impact and influence, but also the, Indirect piece of it too. So there's the money piece as well, but then what do you do with that money? And then that's how I had went about it. And similarly, everyone had their own unique spin to it.[00:05:42] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, for sure. And, you know, and I think the definition changed over time, of what a mogul really is, but when I was putting my rankings together, I think the idea of starting something new, you know, that's also paramount, amongst all the criteria as well.[00:05:55] Dan Runcie: Right? So, of course, Zack and I had our list, but we reached out to a number of people and several other label heads, executives, and people that are in the game.So thank you all to your contributions. We couldn't have done this without you. And if anything, it helped add a variety beyond just you and I, getting and putting our list out there. It added a more full scope and like anything. Oh, this is how you look at it. Interesting and being able to pull unique insights there.[00:06:21] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, for sure. you know, one thing I think we probably ought to point out, on the list, you know, the list is, heavily male. but it's about only 20% women on the list. you know, we did everything we could obviously to make it more equitable, but, you know, the votes are the votes.And, you know, I think there is a bit of a reflection of sort of the state of affairs over the past half century, you know, unfortunately, like many parts of music business, hip hop has been, you know, heavily overindexing for males. So, you know, here's hoping that when 50 years to do a hundred years of hip hop, you know, we'll have even things out a bit or completely, let's say maybe even, you know, made up for lost time, but I think some of the spots on the list, you know, the rankings do kind of reflect an industry reality that we've seen, unfortunately for 50 years.[00:07:06] Dan Runcie: Right? And hopefully this gets better. We do feel and you'll see when we talk about some of the people here, glad about some of the names that got mentioned. Of course, there's always room to be able to have more and hopefully for hip hop's 100th anniversary. If when and people are breaking that down, there's hopefully even more representation there.So, with that, I think it's probably good for us to get started right before the list, but talk about some of the honorable mentions. So, there were people that didn't quite make the cut of 50, but we still wanted to highlight them and the work that they. Did here. So a few of those names here to give a shout out to.So we have Cindy Campbell, Jermaine Dupree, Audrey Harrell, Jay Cole, Damon John. What comes or what do you think about when you hear those names?[00:07:55] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, you know, I mean, Cindy Campbell, I think in many ways you could look at her as the first promoter in hip hop history, right? I mean, you know, we're talking about 50 years of hip hop. That's 50 years from that first party that. She and DJ Kool Herc through, you know, in the rec room on Cedric Avenue.And, I think the idea was that they were going to raise a little bit of cash so she could go get herself a new back to school wardrobe. Now, if that's not, you know, entrepreneurship and hip hop, you know, from the very beginning, I don't know what it is. And so I think Cindy deserves a ton of credit, for being there at the very beginning, you know, but I think on the honorable mentions to a lot of the folks that are on here, you know, or maybe like a little bit, you know, not exactly falling on the same radar, you know, for the list. So like, you know, Damon John, obviously he did with, you know, creating FUBU and, you know, everything he's done as an entrepreneur, it's incredible, but it, I think it's sort of like more of a national brand that is, you know, apart from hip hop and so is his personality, right? Like you see him on shark tank or, you know, whatever, like he sort of moved past, I wouldn't necessarily categorize him, as just hip hop, although he's had a tremendous impact on hip hop.So I think probably that's why, he wasn't on more lists. It's not to sort of ding him his impact, which is considerable.[00:09:10] Dan Runcie: Right, and I do think that of course, music is one element of hip hop. You do have fashion, you do have others. So music definitely got weighted heavily in this list, but Dave and John and his influence in fashion, and there's other people in fashion and we'll get into them in this list too, but we can't overlook everything he did there and some of the more unique and clever marketing tactics that came from food booth that other people did who will mention in this list as well. 1 person that I do want to highlight here from that list 2 people. So, Jermaine Dupri want to give him a shout out as well. Just everything he was able to do with.So, so Def records. He was part of that movement in the 90s, where you saw LaFace and then all these other groups in the South be able to come up, do their own. There was a so so deaf sound, a so so Def vibe and his ability to do it both in rap, but also have a bit of the soul there. Some of the epic production that he's been involved with, even outside of hip hop, thinking about albums like Mariah Carey's Emancipation of Mimi and others, even though he didn't always do everything in hip hop. I think that some of his influence can't go overstated there. And then the second person who's similar in that regard, I would say is Andre Harrell. We talked about him in past episodes, especially the bad boy one, but everything that he did from Uptown Records and then moving on to Motown Records and gave in many ways helped give Puff the blueprint for what he was able to do years later.[00:10:37] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, I think Andre had a lot of successes, also had a lot of failures, not necessarily, you know, through his own doing, the time, but definitely somebody who deserves, you know, a hat tip at the very least. And, you know, I'm sure Puff would agree about that too.[00:10:52] Dan Runcie: Agreed. Agreed. All right. We ready ready to get into it.[00:10:57] Zack Greenburg: Let's do it.[00:10:58] Dan Runcie: All right. So in the initial group here, which we're calling the don't overlook their influence group. This is people who are ranked 50 through 41. so in order we have Ethiopia have to Marion at 50. She was the former CEO of Motown. We have Top Dog, co founder and CEO of Top Dog Entertainment. We have Mona Scott Young from her work at Violators and more recently Love Hip Hop. And what she also has done with Hip Hop Homicides and some other multimedia projects. We have T.I. with everything he's done with Grand Hustle and Multimedia. We have Eazy E with Priority Records. Many ways pioneering so much of the stuff we saw.We have Todd Moskowitz, L. A. Reed, Craig Kalman, former CEO from Atlantic. We have Sylvia Roan and then tied for 40. We have Desiree Perez and Steve Stout. What are your thoughts on that group list?[00:11:55] Zack Greenburg: Oh, man, I don't know. Maybe we should just pick out a few here and there that we thought were particularly interesting. I mean, you know, I think Ethiopia is a good example of somebody who would be higher up if she were identified, you know, solely as a, you know, as a hip hop mogul, but she's had kind of like a pretty wide reach, you know, especially in R and B, and pop. I mean, some of the stuff she's done with Erykah Badu, NeYo, Stevie Wonder, you know, like over the years, you know, wouldn't be classified as hip hop, but it's worth it nonetheless. just think that, you know, being kind of like in between, in between genres, you know, resulted in her being down a little bit further on the list.But, you know, somebody who had a tremendous impact. you know, I would also, I would highlight TI here, you know, the self proclaimed King of the South, but, you know, in terms of, I remember the years when, you know, we were putting together the Forbes list and, you know, kind of looking at, you know, kind of regionally who is most important to me.Yeah, he was sort of like. The Jay Z of the South. And he was really, especially when he was having that moment, you know, getting a lot of songs on, you know, national radio and, kind of being in the public eye, I mean, had a tremendous business focus, you know, he was always interested in sort of like, what's the next thing that I can create?and you know, that kind of entrepreneurial energy, you know, I think, especially within the context of the South, like taking the blueprint, from guys like Jay Z, you know, I think he certainly deserves a mention. I kind of thought he'd end up higher here, but I guess he's been, not as, especially in the music front lately.and then I would definitely highlight, Desiree, you know, she's somebody who's been behind the scenes for a really long time, with Jay Z and rock nation, but like. she runs rock nation. And although Jay Z obviously has the final say in things, you know, a lot of things that you see, come out of that camp are, you know, her doing and have her fingerprints all over them.And I know some of y'all might have seen the Book of Hove exhibit at the Brooklyn Museum or the Brooklyn Public Library that was a Desiree Perez production and, you know, she said that it was like her emptying her 80, 000 square foot storage unit into the library, but, you know, but to have, you know, that kind of, impact at a place like Roc Nation and to help, you know, Jay Z do what he's done, you know, I think those are all worthy, of notation and, you know, I think she deserves her spot there for sure.[00:14:09] Dan Runcie: Yeah, Desiree is someone that has been working with Jay Z for a while now, and I feel like she deserved a shout out on Jay's verse in Pound Cake, the Drake song. You know where he's like, Dave made millions, Lyor made millions. I feel like Desiree should have gotten a shout out there too, but yeah.I'm glad that she got mentioned here. Two other names I'll run through quickly. Steve Stout, someone who I thought would have ended up higher, and I know that, you know, it was interesting to see how the results played out, but I do think that one of the best marketers that we've seen come through hip hop.He was ahead of the curve in a number of ways, dating back to the 90s with seeing the men in black sunglasses and everything that he's done there from his time working with Nas, everything that they've done, whether it was the firm or, him being a record executive himself and then showing as well, how he's able to do it in advertising and bringing a lot of these companies and brands that didn't necessarily align or think about being related with, you know, hip hop culture and those elements to be able to do it.You look at a company like State Farm and how we now look at what that company has done. And a lot of that is through his work and obviously with what he's done at United Masters. So shout out there and I also do want to give a shout out to Mona Scott Young mentioned her earlier, but she was a right hand to someone who will mention on the list as well coming up soon with everything she did in Violator, this is back when, you know, Q Tip and Busta Rhymes and that whole crew were doing their thing. And then later, I know people have a lot of polarizing opinions about love and hip hop, but if you look at the career opportunities that were created for people that have came through, and the longevity that she's granted, a lot of people that the record industry forgot about that she was able to continue to give opportunities for think about the trick daddies, Trina's and folks like that. I know people hate to see them arguing on camera, but would we have Cardi B where she is today? If it weren't for the platform of love and hip hop, and she's continued to do things with other vocals on the list that we'll get into. So I do want to give a shout out to her[00:16:08] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, definitely a worthy shout out. And we could probably go on and on about even just like the tent in this bracket here, but I suppose we ought to, we ought to move on to the next room before, before we run[00:16:19] Dan Runcie: indeed. Yep. So the next group is playing chest, not checkers. So at 39, we have Dave Mays, founder of the source 38. We have Irv Gotti, founder of Murder, Inc. 37, Cardi B 36, Lil Wayne 35, Nipsey Hussle, 34. Steve Rifkin, from Loud Records 33, Missy Elliot. 32 Birder from Cookies, 31 Kevin Lyles and 30 Chris Lighty.[00:16:47] Zack Greenburg: Oh man, this is a pretty stacked bracket, I must say. I think that, you know, there are a couple of names that stick out to me here. I'm going to go with Nipsey and Berner, because in a funny way, I think, they have like a sort of a similar, a sort of similar strategy, which is like, you have a very clear idea of what it is that you're going to do.You own it, and then you, you know, you continue to own it like ownership. Was just such an important thing for Nipsey. Such an important thing for Berner. And, you know, interviewing the two of them, I would say, their mindset around ownership was the closest I've ever seen to Jay Z. and they really understood from the beginning that they had to own all their music.Own all of their branding own, you know, the companies that create on the side and then they can monetize it later. And, you know, with Nipsey rest in peace. I mean, he was just on the cusp of, of kind of like becoming a mainstream superstar, you know, when, his life ended all too soon. So, I think what Berner is doing with cookies is really fascinating like Berner is, you know, you want to talk, lists. I mean, he's in the top five, probably the top four or three at this point, in terms of net worth for actual, hip hop artists. And that's because of the success of cookies and, you know, there's been, a lot of ups and downs in the cannabis business lately, but like the amount of ownership that he has, you know, I think it amounts to about one third still of cookies, which is, you know, a billion dollar brand. When we gets legalized, you know, like he's going to see the fruits of his labor and, that focus on ownership I think is really going to pay off on the longterm.So I would highlight those two guys, in this tier as the ones that, I think were the most impressive to me. That's not to shade anybody else, but,[00:18:25] Dan Runcie: Yeah, those two guys are also two of the few people who I see people still wearing their merchandise on a regular basis. Granted, I live in San Francisco. There's a cookie store here. So, I mean, I know there is a local connection for sure, but same with Nipsey Hussle. I mean, sadly, it's now been over 4 years since he passed away, and you still see Crenshaw shirts.He understood, Nipsey especially, understood exactly where everything's going. And it's just so sad that, you know, it was gone so soon. Two names, I'm going to shout out here. I'm going to shout. I'm going to shout out Cardi B and I want to shout out Chris Lighty. So Cardi B talked about her a little with the Mona Scott young piece, but she's entered and ran her rap career more uniquely than other artists that we've seen at her level have. And I think that speaks a lot to just where the game is now. It's been over six years since Bodak Yellow came out. And it's been over five years now since her debut album. This is someone who hasn't put out a studio album in over five years.And hasn't gone on tour in a traditional way, but it's still doing her thing. And I think this is one of the things that's unique. She finds interesting ways to monetize herself and to put herself on. She's like, Hey, I can do these private shows and they're going to pay me, you know, 1. 5 million or 3 million just to do a half an hour set.I'm going to do my thing. I'm going to be there at Super Bowl weekend. I may not be performing at the Super Bowl, but I'm going to go do these private shows for Bob craft or the fanatics event or all these things and collect the checks. it's very interesting to see younger artists to do that Lionel Richie playbook, but she is like, Hey, I don't necessarily have to do that. And even though people always do try to, you know, loop her into the Nicki Minaj versus Cardi B beef, she still has lended her hand and extended it to other young artists, especially women in the game, whether it's Ice Spice and others, whether she's doing it through her talents and others. So she's someone that I hope as she continues on, you know, into her thirties and into her forties can continue to rise up this list.And then Chris Lighty talked about a little bit with Mona Sky Young, co founder of Violator and everything they're able to do there. Sad that he was taken away so soon, but if you have not heard this yet and if you haven't listened to the podcast, I highly recommend the Mogul podcast series that was done several years ago on it.It was done by Reggie Yose, who is Combat Jack, who has since passed away as well, but I highly recommend that if you want a full breakdown on everything Chris Leite did. Violator and after that was truly one of the early ones looking at product partnerships and a lot of the things that we see now that are common in hip hop.[00:21:07] Zack Greenburg: And, you know, if we didn't have Chris Lighty, I don't think we would have had 50 Cent. I mean, at least not to the extent that we have him. you know, I mean, I remember writing my first story about 50 and like for Forbes, maybe 2008 and sitting down with Chris and just kind of like hearing him lay out the plan.And again, it's the emphasis on ownership, right? you know, Chris Leidy, I think was the one who really pushed, 50 to take the equity in vitamin water and his parent company, rather than just do an endorsement. And, you know, obviously that became a huge, deal and really like a model for so much, not only of hip hop, but like other parts of the entertainment industry, you know, I think Chris definitely deserves a spot, maybe even should be a little higher. and you know, probably also, there's, you know, again, all these folks deserve a shout out, but Kevin Lyles, I think is, got one of the most inspirational stories. you know, it's another person, I think we've both interviewed a bunch of times, but, you know, just his journey from intern to president of Def Jam and I think seven years. And he just did it by working harder than everybody else like he wasn't an artist that got put there because he had some hit, it wasn't some kind of like nepotism deal, you know, he just outworked everybody and, you know, he had the talent and, you know, the horsepower to just like get it done. And to make that journey within seven years. So I think it's, for people who are listening and, you know, want to do something like that with their own career, you know, study Kevin Miles because he was able to make it, without being, you know, some kind of like preternatural, singing talent or something like that he just did it on smarts and work ethic.[00:22:39] Dan Runcie: And one of the few people that co founded a record label and sold it a decade later for hundreds of millions of dollars, which is what he did 300 as well. Right? So of course, not 300 now underwater, but everything he did with Lyor and Todd, there, is impressive. There's not that many black founders in general. In tech, any sector that have built and exited companies for several hundred, a million dollars, the way that he was able to be a part of that. So, hats offhim.[00:23:09] Zack Greenburg: yeah, I think it takes a special kind of guts to be able to, you know, I mean, he was a well paid executive with a cushy music job, you know, to leave that world, start your own thing. I mean, I know they had, you know, big backers and everything, but like to take a risk once you've already experienced that level of success and to go out and start something, you know, as opposed to starting something from scratch when you have nothing anyway.I mean, it, takes a lot of gumption to do that. So, you know, again, yes, a pretty cool second act for Kevin miles.[00:23:38] Dan Runcie: Indeed, the next group here, our impact runs deep. It is Nicki Will Smith at 28, Swiss beats 27, LL Cool J, 26, Coach K and P, 25, Julie Greenwald, 24. The E40 23, Pharrell 22, and Rick Ross, 21.[00:24:01] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. I think, that's a pretty strong, deck there. And I think also, you know, here, you find some people who, you could argue should be higher or lower based on, you know, how much of their career was done in the hip hop music world, right? Like Queen Latifah, LL Cool J, Will Smith.Obviously those are huge crossover acts. but I think they all got a lot of points from some of the voters because, you know, that is in one way, the measure of a mogul, like you're diversifying your portfolio and whether that's by owning different things or, you know, by getting into, different types of performance, you know, on the silver screen, I think that's a viable path too.but just from like a purely musical entrepreneurial perspective, I would highlight, Swiss Beats and Pharrell, who I think, you know, the two of them are more influential than anybody in terms of like, I'd say Swizz in terms of art and Pharrell in terms of fashion. and you know, some of the things they've done around those two areas and, you know, Pharrell certainly, now with LVMH, but also before with Ice Cream, Billionaire Boys Club, you know, he was very active in starting his own things on the fashion side.And, you know, kind of inspiring artists to do that. you know, would we have had a Yeezy if we hadn't had Pharrell, you know, doing what he was doing and, you know, and even doing what he did with Adidas? you know, I don't know about that. And, Swiss beads certainly, you know, not only from the art side of things, but you know, it's a really impressive art collection.I did a story on him a few years ago and, you know, he's got like, Jeff Kuhn sculptures and Basquiat's and Warhol's and his, you know, like in his foyer. I mean, it's, pretty impressive stuff. but the way that he moves behind the scenes, as sort of like a corporate brand whisperer, at places, you know, like Bacardi, Lotus, you know, this goes on, you know, I think he, he's sort of like more quietlyinfluential than, some folks realize. And, you know, certainly has been earning, on par with, you know, with all the, you know, most of the names, if not higher than most of the names we've mentioned so far. and you know, what he's done on the, both of them, what they've done on the production side, also hard to top.So that must count for something as well. I kind of went more than one shout out there, didn't I? So[00:26:06] Dan Runcie: Yeah. No, that was good. That was good.I'm glad you mentioned the two of them though, because if you didn't, I probably would've called the other one out. The thing about Swiss as well, everything that he's done with versus specifically also embodies this idea and definition of a mogul because he was able to be.A kingmaker in the sense of creating opportunities for others. He did that through the equity that he was able to give all of those early participants in versus in trailer itself. And then additionally, with the careers that we're able to have a boost because of. everything that happened, with the matchups from versus specifically, you look at someone like Ashanti, who is now doing tours and pop it up every now and then she wasn't doing that before her versus and her battle versus Keisha Cole was one of the not, if not the most watched one that we've had.You look at Jadakiss and everything that he's been able to do since his epic showdown against, with Lox versus Dipset with that versus you look at Jeezy versus Gucci Mane. I know that versus definitely had its peak popularity during the pandemic, but that kind of stuff that he was able to do with Timbaland, I think also speaks so much to everything that he's been able to do there.And another person I want to mention to that was in this group as well that I think is similar is LL Cool J because I think similar to the way that. Swiss beets is Ella is also with someone that's been involved with multimedia with everything from the jump. He was the 1st artist to truly breakthrough from Def Jam and did it as a teenager.So, of course, he gets plenty of shout out for that, but he's also always been trying to find ways to look out for that next generation of artists. And he's been doing some of that more recently with rock the bells, and that's its own. Company and entity now where they have a festival coming up as well to celebrate things that are happening with hip hops anniversary.So it's been cool to see him do things as well. And I'll give a very brief shout out here to, coach K and P because they, similar to how I mentioned, Kevin Liles were able to build and grow a company and then sell it for, I believe, forget the exact sale price for, quality control. But they were able to do that thanks in part to a lot of the work that Ethiopia had done, helping to give quality control, the platform that it did, and especially in an era where I think it's harder for a record label to have a true brand, they were able to help give it a boost.[00:28:36] Zack Greenburg: That's true. And on that note of labels, I think Julie Greenwald, there's a mention, you know, she and Craig Kalman, who's mentioned, in an earlier grouping, you know, run Atlantic together. And there's a lot of, of music that we wouldn't have seen if it had been for the two of them, you know, running the show over there.So, shout out to Julie. I mean, the only one actually we haven't discussed here with E40 and Rick Ross. And I don't know, you know, probably get moving, but, do you think Rick Ross deserves to be number 21 on this entire list? Like ahead of Pharrell, ahead of, you know, some of the other names on here. I was surprised that he was ranked this high.[00:29:09] Dan Runcie: I love the spicy questions. Cause this is what people wanted to hear the podcast about, right? They wanted to hear one of us, you know, poke the bear a little bit.If Rick Ross was able to nail that dive in the pool, do you think you would have ranked him higher?[00:29:21] Zack Greenburg: Ha ha ha ha ha ha. No, no, I wouldn't. I mean, I still know. I mean, you know, like I get it, you know, he's called the boss that he must be a mogul, You know, and, some of the things he's done in terms of, you know, Bel Air and Maybach music and all that. Sure. But like, you know, when you put them up against like some of the other ones, did he really do something new or was he more just like following a, blueprint that had worked for others before and, you know, executing it to a degree success, but like, again, not, you know, not to the level of, let's say Pharrell.I think maybe I just, I'm salty that he ended up ahead of Pharrell. I think Pharrell is just way more influential and Mowgli, but, I don't know. What do you think?[00:29:59] Dan Runcie: So, I've read 2 of Ross's books and I interviewed him once on Trapital. I think that, to your point, he did follow the blueprint that we saw from others. I think he is smart about the types of partnerships he does, but it does feel like a ditty light. Type of playbook that he's been able to do and build.And I do think a lot of it makes sense. He may not necessarily have the large media entities the way that he does. Although I do think he's overdue for some type of comedy show or some type of reality show just following him around because I think he's hilarious. And anytime that he gets that, it could just generate something unique.And I'm sure he's been hit up about it. I do think that he's done well for himself. Just thinking about. Now, how his career is growing, I think it's been what, 16, 17 years since hustling 1st came out. I think in this range, there is some flexibility there in terms of like, where people are in certain ways.I get why he may not necessarily be as high. I'm sure if you looked at the net worth or the earnings, that some of the people that are lower than him may actually be higher. I think 1 of the knocks potentially is although Maybach music was cool. I wrote about this in Trapit as well. I think there was a missed opportunity.And part of that comes from, huh, did Ross do all the things that he probably could have done from a leadership perspective to especially like, when Meek Mill and Wally were beefing and stuff. And I think Ross had a bit more of a laissez faire approach to things, which in some ways is kind of the opposite of King making as we're talking about this, right?Can we really bring folks together and make something larger than it is. I think it was a bit tough in general for people to try to do everything themselves, try to be the boss of this label, which is signed to a different label because Rick Ross was signed to a different label than MNG was himself. And I think anytime you have that type of dynamic, it's just splitting the leadership interests. So I hear you.[00:32:00] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. So then how much of a mogul are you, if your label is really, you know, so I guess everybody's labels on somebody else's label and have you distributed by something, but you know, it's like when they're like multiple labels kind of, you know, intertwined with your label, it kind of causes the question.are you really the boss? If you have several bosses that you're answering to, but you know, I think actually though. in Rick Ross's defense, what he's done with Wingstop, I mean, that is pretty unique and, I don't know that anybody else on this list has something comparable in that space.So, you know, maybe that's why, I think, you know, by virtue of that, you could put them pretty high up. And maybe that's what some of the judges were thinking, you know, but he also ended up on a lot of lists, you know, so some of the judges just kind of like, maybe we're getting to some of the judges sent rank lists, and they're like, you know, this person is the top and they should get the most points and other people were like, here are my people.And you can just rank them evenly. and I think Rick Ross ended up on a lot of those lists. So, you know. I think again, maybe like I was alluding to earlier, he's a bit of a compiler, nothing wrong with that, you know, you can get into the hall of fame by compiling 3000 hits, but, it's interesting to see how, how the opinions differ. That's the whole fun of it.[00:33:06] Dan Runcie: He runs his business is almost like how a small business owner would in a number of ways where he has a bunch of car washes and, you know, his is 1 of the family members does that he has his wing stops, right? He has that. And it is a bit of this, like, mogul dumbness from that perspective in terms of like, okay, I have my hands in these things and I've hired people to have, you know, different roles within that that doesn't necessarily have things in aggregate. It's a bit more of the strip mall mentality as opposed to the, you know, building a skyscraper that could then build other skyscrapers, but it's something worth mentioning, but I hope we keep that up with a few of the other rankings we have coming up as we dig into the top 20, here.So, yeah, let's start with 20. So, 20, Queen Latifah, I think that she and, Ice Cube, who we'll get into in a minute, were one of the first that noticed, hey, I may not be able to do this rap thing forever, what are areas that I can expand this multimedia empire and everything I'm building.She was able to do this with Living Single, the show that was Friends before Friends was, and even the way that she was able to show young black people that were having, you know, highly sought after roles, but they still had their interpersonal dynamics. It was cool. It was refreshing. It was aspirational, which I do think that a lot of the black sitcoms were in the 90s.And she was able to do that, continue finding ways to put other people on as well through the work that she did. She was also willing to take risks. Like I remember when she was in set it off, people had a bunch of questions about, Oh, you're going to play a lesbian in this heist movie. What is this going to do for your career?And she was willing to do that. And I think she is always, you know, be willing to take risks. So, you know, shout out to her and I'm glad that several people have mentioned her[00:34:56] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. And I think she gets credit for, like you say, diversifying her portfolio. you know, into the acting world. it's worth noting, you know, she was barely ahead of Rick Ross. but you know, there is a big difference between 21 and 20. It's the top 20. So, again, I think, you know, she was a bit of a compiler, but there were a couple of people who ranked her in the top 10.and, you know, I think just like in terms of the breadth of her career, you know, the longevity, the diversity of the things that she's gotten into. you know, even if it's not as much ownership as somebody, even like a Rick Ross, it's just like, having your hands in a lot of pies and like that really counts for something as a mogul.So, I think it makes sense to see you there.[00:35:36] Dan Runcie: Agreed 19 is Eminem. So let's talk about it. How do we feel about Eminem in 19?[00:35:43] Zack Greenburg: You know, I think it's a weird one, honestly. you know, there's no doubting, his lyrical prowess and where, you know, where he kind of stacks up as part of like the pantheon of lyricists, like fine. But is he really a mogul? I mean, he's somebody who has been, you know, very reclusive at times. Who has, you know, kind of gotten in his own way at other times. I mean, I could see ranking him up here though, just by virtue of ownership of the music and sort of like the quality and quantity of his catalog. you know, what he did with D12, you know, he did have shady records and, you know, and all that.So again, you know, there, there is kind of a layer cake of a label situation, like some of the folks who mentioned earlier across, but, you know, that was at least important to him to set up, you know, as his continued ownership of, You know, his work and, you know, certainly when it comes to like raw commercial prowess, you know, Eminem, is one of the best selling hip hop artists of all time.If not the best, depending on how you look at it. And just, you know, simply by virtue of the amount of revenue he generated, you know, throughout the late 90s and early aughts at the peak of the sort of CD age there. you know, that deserves, some kind of something, even if he wasn't running around starting his own, you know, side businesses as much as some of these other folks[00:37:02] Dan Runcie: Best selling artist of the 2000s by a pretty strong amount, I believe, and has the most of any genre, right? And the most streamed song of the 2000s as well, at least on Spotify with Lose Yourself, and I'm pretty sure Till I Collapse and maybe a couple of others aren't too far. Behind as Will Page as Spotify's former chief economist said, anytime Eminem farts or burps or releases anything on a streaming service, it provides a huge bump to everything in this back catalog.So, I still laugh about that, but I do think that speaks to it there and. If, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think he was one of the first hip hop artists to have a Sirius XM channel himself.So that's something that's unique and obviously Sirius is still doing its thing. So, shout out to him there. A bit higher than I probably would have ranked him, but that's why it's interesting to get the group results here. Ah, this one's gonna be spicy. Number 18. Your boy, Suge Knight.[00:38:02] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, you know, I mean, I think this is one of the tougher ones on the entire list. You know, this is not like a list of, Ms. Congeniality or Mr. Congeniality, as you'll see, you know, some of the other names on here. Obviously, you know, Suge is in jail. he's been involved in the death of, you know, human beings that like that is, you know, not sort of like what you're after in a mogul here, but, enough people, you know, I guess felt that the business, if you just, you know, looking at it from a pure business perspective, was enough to put them up here. And, you know, there is no arguing that death row at its peak was one of the most influential record labels, you know, not just in hip hop, but of anything. I mean, any genre, when death row was at its hottest, I don't know any, kind of moment where any other, you know, you'd have to stack that up against peak Motown or, you know, Atlantic or something like that, but, you know, that was really like a, peak moment. So, you know, I think this is one of the things we run into on this list like if somebody exhibits, a level of, you know, sort of business ingenuity, you know, that counts for something and, you know, the other things that you do in your life and your career, you know, we'll detract from that, but, you know, what you did at your peak, I think will get you pretty far in a list like this when people kind of count, you know, we kind of count sort of like the ceiling as opposed to the average, in some cases. So, I don't know. What do you think?[00:39:27] Dan Runcie: These are the two most impressive business moves that Suge Knight has done. Number two is shaking down Vanilla Ice to get his points for everything that he did on the album that had Ice Ice Baby there. Because he was able to use that money to then start and co found Death Row with Dr. Dre. That's number two.Number one is at the 1995 Source Awards where he publicly makes his Call to attract Tupac to say, Hey, I know you're in jail, but we're riding with you. Tupac wasn't signed there at the time, but he knew that this was an opportunity. Tupac likely needed somewhere to call a home and he called his shot. He was able to make it happen.I know everyone talks about the diddy shot about, you know, being all in the video death row. And that, of course, is infamous in its own right. But I think the number one thing that should night did is that that said. those 2 things speak to what should night is, 1, it is that muscle and the prowess of being able to overpower a situation and then take advantage.And I think those were things that he was good at. That said, I don't think he was necessarily strong as a. Business leader, the company imploded in large part. And I don't think it imploded because of Dr. Dre, it imploded because of all of the things, all the shenanigans. And I think for what he was building, some of that just got a little too close to the sun, unfortunately. And, that's Chuck Knight[00:40:49] Zack Greenburg: And, I think that, you know, in some of the reporting I've done over the years, One of the things people say is that Shug and a lot of the guys around him, you know, it wasn't that they were necessarily like that. It's just they kind of had been watching too many bad gangster movies and the music business, didn't know what to do with somebody like Suge Knight.And so the more he kind of like played this role, the more he grew into it to where, to the point where he was actually living sort of a bad gangster movie. and sort of like created, turned himself into a monster. Yeah, so I think like the evolution. or the evolution, of somebody like Suge Knight is sort of fascinating in terms of like what you can, what sort of playing a role can do to you, over the course of time.[00:41:32] Dan Runcie: Agreed. And well said number 17 here is America's most wanted ice cube. I'll start here to kick things off. I think that Ice Cube, like Queen Latifah mentioned earlier, was one of the early ones who had said that he knew that living and doing everything off a raft wasn't gonna last forever. And I think a lot of it was because he experienced some of the brunt and ugliness of it.I mean, we've all seen the Straight Outta Compton movie. He goes into Jerry Heller's office. He starts smashing shit. He releases no Vaseline. There was definitely a no fucks given that carried through even after he was done with NWA, but he saw what this industry is like as well and then that's when he starts writing screenplays.And then that's how Friday because the thing becomes a thing. And then. His career just continues to take off after that he still dabbled in rap and did his thing, but he definitely became known early on for one of the people that took a risk with cube entertainment and everything that he was able to do there.And with any of the movies that he had, whether it was the movies with Mike Epps and plenty others, I do believe that most of these movies were pretty profitable. And he was able to. Do it work within the confines that he had and just continue to build everything he did from a career. We've seen him expand as well into everything that he's done with the big 3 specifically giving a home for basketball players that can still play, but maybe they can't make, you know, a 13 person NBA roster anymore.I do think that some of his more recent news highlights that are a bit more politically driven or him walking around with Tucker Carlson and probably take it away from some of the more prominent memories of Hugh Ice Cube is, but yeah, that's why I had had him or that's why he, I think deserves to be, you know, where he is, on the list.[00:43:27] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. And I think it's interesting, you know, you see, Eminem, Suge Knight, Ice Cube, all together, you know, they're all, inextricably connected to Dr. Dre. one way or the other. Right. and you know, would there, would Dre have been Dre without the three of them? you know, at different phases of his career, you know, I don't know, I mean, I think certainly what, Ice Cube did as part of NWA, you know, I wouldn't say that, that NWA was like.like a business first organization. But like that wasn't the point of NWA and if it hadn't been for NWA, I don't think you would have been able to have business first organizations come out of hip hop in the way that you did. and certainly, you know, somebody like Dr. Dre, so. I think he gets extra points for that.and, you know, this is probably why, you know, he was again, I don't know, was he compiler? He was, you know, he had like a lot of kind of middling, a lot of lists, a couple of top 10 votes, you know? So, you know, I think again, everybody has their favorite and he's up there for a lot of folks.[00:44:27] Dan Runcie: Agreed. Number 16 is Drake. Should we poke the bear again?[00:44:33] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. Does Drake deserve to be at number 16 on this list?[00:44:37] Dan Runcie: This one surprised me, I was very surprised at the number of people that had him on the list, because you can make a case for the opposite, right? It's similar to the M and M thing, but almost to the extreme because M and M, yes, most commercially successful artists, XYZ. There's other artists that are less commercially successful at M and M that did more in that mogul definition but for Drake, it's even bigger of a Delta between these two, because here you have the most streamed artists of all time. So clearly commercially successful on its own, but people believe that OVO. Records or OVO sound itself actually could hurt an artist's career. And when you think about that, you think about some of the other multimedia things that he's done.I know he's been active as an investor and I know that people like Nicki Minaj and others have said, Oh, you know, Drake's a low key billionaire. He just doesn't want you to know it personally. Again, he may be, I mean, I'm not sure what he may not disclose, but it isn't always just about wealth. It's like, what opportunities were you able to create for each other?I do think it's good. That drink has been able to have different people that have been working alongside that. I think did get a bit of that drink stimulus package. And I think that's something that is quite debated, but I do think that. I feel like 21 Savage has definitely benefited from it. I mean, he was already commercially successful, but for him and Drake to do a joint album together was huge.I think it was the same way that it was huge for Future and the same way that the Migos going on tour with Drake in 2018 was huge for them and anything else that Drake continues to do from that perspective. So I think it is, you know, debatable, but I mean, people do definitely add some weight to the artists themselves.[00:46:18] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. And, you know, I think he should be around Eminem and whether they're both too high is an open question, but, you know, there's no doubting the commercial viability of what he's done. He did start more side businesses in Eminem, right? With OVO, whether it's the label, the festival, the clothing line, you know, he started a whiskey brand called Virginia black, which I tried once.It tasted okay. but I don't think it's selling, you know, I don't know if he's even still doing it. yeah, he is definitely involved as a startup investor, so maybe, you know, we'll see some exits and we start to think of him differently at that point. But, yeah, you know, again, I think it's, some voters just kind of overweighted, you know, musical prowess and pop culture influence.And if you're talking about that, I, I don't know anybody who's been as influential in the past 15 years. I mean, he's, you know, he's the most streamed artist of all time and that's got to count for something.[00:47:08] Dan Runcie: Right. I know his cannabis line failed, but there's a lot of people, even people that we'll get to in this list that have also had failed or struggling cannabisbusinesses. And, there's a lot that we could discuss there, but moving on number 15 is Sylvia Robinson, the originator.[00:47:26] Zack Greenburg: I think she deserves to be in the top five, personally. because if there were no Sylvia Robinson, yeah, I mean, I don't know that we have hip hop and, you know, it's, you know, for those who don't know the story, she was running sugar hill records with her husband, Joe sylvia was actually a child star singer herself.And, you know, they kind of had this like middling existence with their label. And then all of a sudden she's at this birthday party that she didn't even want to go to in Harlem and she sees Lovebug Starsky up on the microphone. A hip hop hippie to the hippie to the hip hip hop. You know, this is early, early seventies.She's never heard anything like it. All the kids, you know, hands in the air, like you just don't care. And the whole thing. she tries to get Lovebug to sign. There's some kind of dispute, like with his management, never happens. And so she just goes to the pizzeria in New Jersey, finds three kids, get him, gets them to talk real fast over this record is how she described it.and that's, you know, that's Rapper's Delight. That's the first hip hop song on Wax. That's the first hit. you know, that sort of spawns the whole genre. So, you could certainly argue, that, you know, she, borrowed or she hired, hired people who borrowed or whatever to do this, you know, like the idea that, that the first hip hop, track on wax was like, you know, originated in a pizza shop in New Jersey is really unfortunate cause it started at the Bronx, but like, you know, Sylvia came from Harlem.She, you know, she, she knew that world. Like, you know, she was part of the music business and, for better or worse, she took hip hop from being, you know, just basically like spoken word in person kind of thing to being, you know, national events. Would it have happened eventually?Yeah, I think so. But you know, who knows? I mean, it could have taken years longer and if it took years longer, you know, are we going to have the eighties with like run DMC and Def Jam and all that? Like, you know, I don't know. I mean, it, could have taken a lot longer to get off the ground if she hadn't done what she'd done.And, you know, I don't think we, I don't think we should really be dinging Sylvia Robinson for her Machiavellian tactics, given some of the other people on this list, you know, we're talking like Suge Knight and whoever else, you know, there's quite nefarious characters, you know, as we get higher up too in this list.So, you know, I don't think anything she did was. remotely as bad as, as like a lot of the dudes on this list. and, you know, so, you know, let's, I think we give her her due and yeah, I would definitely put her higher, but, you know, I think that's part of the deal when, when you have somebody who's that early on.You know, people are going to say, Oh, well, you know, the total gross is not quite as much as so and so or whatever the case may be. And she wasn't as famous as some of the artists. So, but you know, she's up there, I mean, ahead of some pretty big names, Drake, Eminem, what have you. So, I think she's getting some flowers here[00:50:00] Dan Runcie: The total gross knock is always one that makes me roll my eyes a bit because even if you take out the inflation aspect and the amount of money that's now in the industry, this is something that happens with pioneers in any type of industry. They are the ones that take the early hits to make it possible.She and her work is what made it possible for rappers to like, she and her workers have made it possible for the message and anything else that we then see after that. Yes. Sugar Hill. records did have its struggles, afterward, like many other labels. But what do you think about broader context of the eighties being a very tough time in general for black music?And there were only a certain number of decision makers in power that could make that happen. Yeah. You have to take that into account. And then additionally, she did stuff outside of even just this record label itself. As you mentioned, she was a recording artist herself. She also owned a nightclub. So there were other mogul type things that she had her hands.And so shout out to Sylvia, who knows where this would be without her.[00:51:00] Zack Greenburg: And probably worth caveating also that, you know, she did have some, Disputes over paying artists, as the years went on. So did like really a lot of people on this list is we could do like a whole separate, you know, like has some kind of dispute on how they pay artists. So, you know, that, that's probably worth noting too, but yeah, I mean, so does everybody else.And, you know, I think she deserves her flowers.[00:51:22] Dan Runcie: Number 14, Dame Dash,[00:51:25] Zack Greenburg: Another, another hot one coming in. I mean, I think a lot of people would disagree with this, but you know, some people would put them even higher. I mean, I think he might be the most polarizing name on this entire list. Like some people had on top five, you know, some people didn't list them at all.you know, I think it kind of comes in. We've had this conversation before. Would there be a Jay Z without a Damon Dash? you know, I mean, I think so, but it's that part of the, you know, we've talked about him in the context of startups and do you, you know, you need a different kind of founder for your like pre seed days than you do for your series B.you know, if you're like a mafia, family, you need like a wartime Don, you know, versus like a peacetime Don or whatever it's called. But like, you know, I think, Dame Dash is a wartime Don. He's a seed stage startup founder. and he does it fair as well. You know, when it comes to like the growth stage and the corporate boardrooms and stuff, but, you know, there's no denying his brilliance.you know, I think what he did, you know, certainly with rock aware, you know, expanding, the Roc-A-Fella empire beyond music. you know, maybe he realized that Jay was eventually going to leave and that they just, it wasn't going to be forever. And so he wanted to get his hands into, you know, as many different areas as he could, but, you know, there's like a lot of pro and a fair bit of con, but, you know, I think again, he's one who, you know, the pro outweighed the con, he didn't kill anybody, you know, so there's some people on here who did.yeah, the con is only like so much con in my opinion.[00:52:56] Dan Runcie: This conversation makes me think about, that backstage documentary that. Roc-A-Fella had put out after the hard knock life tour. And there's that infamous scene of Dave dash yelling and swearing at Kevin Lyles, who was at Def Jam at the time about the jackets and where what logo was supposed to be, or something other than that.And thinking about that in context now of like, you know, how we talked about Kevin Lyles and everything he was able to do from that run and still can continue to do. And with where Dame Dash is, is in his career, Dame Dash doing his thing. I think he very much lived through and practice and preach the ownership standards that worked for him, where he has Dame Dash Studios, Dame Dash this, and he's been able to.Create exactly what he wanted to. We heard him on that infamous 2015 breakfast club interview where he's yelling at DJ Envy and Charlemagne about, Oh, well, if your son wants a job, can you get him a job here at power 105 or whatever? No. Well, I can do him at where I'm at. And as comic as the delivery was, there is some aspect of mogul dumb.That is a bit of that King making aspect of, okay, can you create opportunities for others around you? What those opportunities look like definitely vary. And I think that is a factor. So I do highlight that is something that Dame is able to do. And Dave is also similar to he's similar to a polarizing basketball player in the sense that the media may look and be like, why do you all fuck with this guy?Like, what's going on? But if you ask the people that are actually in it, a lot of that would be like, oh, well, you got to look at Dame dash, Dame dash is the guy. And when I have. Interviewed. I'm sure you've interviewed and talked to many of young artists, too, or young label executives, too. A lot of them will reference Dave Dash.A lot of them will look at what he was able to do alongside Roc-A-Fella, almost in the same way that, you know, players will swear by Kyrie or swear by James Harden or some other type of athlete that may be polarizing in their own right. And the media is like, Oh, why do you all like this guy? And it's like, Oh, well, no, you don't understand.So there's something about. The people, and obviously I say that being self aware is us as people more so on the media side, as opposed to being in it themselves. But there's something about these young artists and moguls as well that have always looked up and respected what Dame has built. And even though it may not resonate, like, personally, I acknowledge that.[00:55:23] Zack Greenburg: I would say, if you're going to make a basketball reference, Maybe not personality, but like basketball style, I'd almost liken him to Carmelo Anthony, you know, like he's an isolationist. He's a scorer, like, you know, he may not be very good at distributing the basketball, but like, you know, you throw him the ball in the corner and he's going to find a way to get it in.And, You know, like a lot of people wouldn't think that he belongs in the Hall of Fame at all, you know, but some people would, be insistent on it. So, you know, yeah, I think that sort of like singular focus, you know, you could definitely give him credit for that,[00:55:55] Dan Runcie: Agreed. Number 13, we are Cohen.[00:55:58] Zack Greenburg: man, another like bulldozer of a human being, but, you know, certainly somebody who, you know, maybe he has also got the finger roll, you know, like he, he can have a light touch when needed. you know, I think just like in terms of longevity, we talk about longevity with some of the names on this list, you know, Leroy was there in the very beginning of hip hop, you know, managing rappers, and it gives the road manager run DMC, taking the leader

Few record labels have left their stamp on the industry quite like Motown. This assembly line churned out hit song after hit song in the ‘60s and early ‘70s. With a who's-who roster — Marin Gaye, The Jackson 5, Diana Ross, and Stevie Wonder, among others — The Hitsville U.S.A. sign Gordy put on Motown's front door became warranted. This episode is the story of Motown Records — it's formula for success, what led to its decline, and where it stands today under Universal. I'm joined by friend of the pod, Zack O'Malley Greenburg. Here's what we covered in this episode:0:38 Berry Gordy's origin story8:08 Motown museum in Detroit9:20 Cultivating a culture of creativity13:05 Shifting the sound of Black music20:12 Motown's knack for discovering talent 34:29 The beginning of the decline36:12 80's decade of transition39:48 Post-Gordy struggles45:51 Motown's uncertainty today53:59 Best signing?55:16 Best business move?568:45 Dark horse move?1:01:58 Biggest missed opportunity?1:07:13 Motown big-screen picture1:09:22 Berry Gordy won big1:10:41 Who lost the most?1:14:56 Zack's Jay Z indexListen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | SoundCloud | Stitcher | Overcast | Amazon | Google Podcasts | Pocket Casts | RSSHost: Dan Runcie, @RuncieDan, trapital.coGuests: Zack O'Malley Greenburg, @zogblogThis episode is sponsored by DICE. Learn more about why artists, venues, and promoters love to partner with DICE for their ticketing needs. Visit dice.fmEnjoy this podcast? Rate and review the podcast here! ratethispodcast.com/trapitalTrapital is home for the business of music, media and culture. Learn more by reading Trapital's free memo.TRANSCRIPT[00:00:00] Zack Greenburg: Berry Gordy created with Motown and sort of the Motown genre, which I think really like more than any label has become synonymous beyond just sort of like the name of label itself, you say Motown music, and a testament to the sound that he created,[00:00:13] Dan Runcie Audio Intro: Hey, welcome to the Trapital Podcast. I'm your host and the founder of Trapital, Dan Runcie. This podcast is your place to gain insights from the executives in music, media, entertainment, and more who are taking hip hop culture to the next level.[00:00:38] Dan Runcie Guest Intro: Today's episode is a deep dive into the one and only legendary Motown records. At its peak, Motown was the most successful black business in the country. It peaked at 30 million dollars of revenue in 1968 and Barry Gordy and his team assembled a sound. a unique genre of music that produced hit after hit after hit and Hitsville USA lived up to its promise.So in this episode, we take you through the origins of how Motown came to be. What are some of the business principles and strategies that worked in its favor? And then what are some of the challenges that Motown faced too? It's now been 50 years since the peak of Motown. And this record label has had plenty of ups and downs and plenty of journeys that we went deep on in this episode. And I'm joined by Zach Greenburg He is a biographer of Jay Z and several others, and he also wrote about Michael Jackson. And in that he talked about Michael Jackson's time with Motown, especially in the Jackson 5. So we had a lot of fun in this one. So come take a trip down memory lane with us. Here's our episode on Motown.[00:01:42] Dan Runcie: All right. Today we're back with another case study style episode, and we're going deep into Hitsville, USA. Motown, baby. Let's do this, Zack, I'm excited for this one.[00:01:53] Zack Greenburg: Thanks for having me as always.[00:01:55] Dan Runcie: Berry Gordy is so fascinating because At one point, this was the most successful black business. They're the most successful black entrepreneur in the country invented a genre.And it's so hard to be able to do that. And that legacy still lives on today. We know so many record labels that have taken inspiration from what Berry Gordy built with Motown records, but let's start from the beginning. What inspired Berry Gordy to even want to get involved with music in the first place?[00:02:23] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. So, you know, Berry Gordy, and his family were in the Detroit area, you know, a bunch of serial entrepreneurs, get a record shop early on, but he was actually like semi professional boxer coming up. And, think one thing led to another and you just kind of saw that, you know, there was a market that was not being served in music.you know, certainly like the business was concentrated, on the coast and particularly in New York at that time, you know, eventually more in LA, but. you know, there was some stuff going on in Chicago. there was some regional acts, regional labels, things like that. But, you know, I think he just basically saw an opportunity, to start something.And, you know, sort of in the way that if you look at, Richard Branson or Puffy or, you know, what are those types of entrepreneurs? It's almost It doesn't really matter what they get into. They find a way to make it work. and they're just always on the lookout for a new sector. That's, kind of, you know, right for some creative destruction, know, and some refreshing or some freshening, some revising, I don't know, whatever you would call it.And, you know, in the case of Berry Gordy. Kind of amazingly, when you think about music over the past half century, he looked around and he thought, well, this is actually, this is a sector that is very promising amongst all the sectors that I could possibly get into. So, that's how Motown came to pass.[00:03:36] Dan Runcie: That point about whether it's Diddy, Branson, Gordy, and I think a lot of the tech CEOs fall in this category as well. You're going to put them in any generation. And I do think that these people would have found a way to make things work. And that's the same point you're making, right? He saw an opportunity to music, but let's say he came 30 years later.It could have been another aspect. Let's say he came today, probably could have been trying to do something in AI or even figure it out, how to make AI, be transformative with his music. And I think a lot of his work, whether you think about how he built derivative work or how he had this process with artists that we'll get into so much of it taps into, okay, here's an opportunity to optimize things.Here's how we can make things work. And music just happened to be the format. He chose it.[00:04:21] Zack Greenburg: Absolutely. And even, you know, when you think about it, he got started sort of mid century 30 years later, he was looking into other things, getting involved in film and TV. And You know, moving the business out West, but, you know, we'll get there eventually, but, he certainly did, you know, find other ways to extend the Motown brand as time went on.[00:04:37] Dan Runcie: So he starts off, he has this record business and things go okay with that. specifically talking about the store. And that was a lot of it was connected a bit more from the family perspective, but then he ends up getting the job at Ford specifically working with that Lincoln mercury plant. And that's when he was only there for 2 years, but he then sees how the process works and the whole concept of Ford is, which is that assembly line process that Henry Ford has been famous for.He sees that and then he taps back into his opportunities with music and he's like, okay. Okay, there's an opportunity to do the same with music. So he sees this assembly line, essentially have all these parts go through the inputs. And then the output, you get this car, he wanted to be able to pull some kid off the street, bring them into the Motown and bring them into this record label facility.And then outcomes a star. And he felt like he had the ability to be able to create that type of dynamic. And it took some time to get there, but that's essentially what he did. And a lot of the creations of what we saw from Hitsville USA was that exactly.[00:05:48] Zack Greenburg: Absolutely. And, he'll tell you that, I've interviewed him a couple of times. Once for Forbes, once for my book, Michael Jackson Inc, where he talked a lot about that. And, you know, he really has a formula, for making a hit song. And, you know, it's sort of like the song has to have a clear beginning, middle at an end. The chorus has to have a sort of grand arc that summarizes the song every time it happens.And then there's a sort of like grand finale bridge ending thing that, brings it all together, always at the end you hear the artist shout out the song's name almost, you know, invariably one last time and you know, that's like pure marketing, right? And you think about it in those days, this great songs on, you're hearing it, but like, you know, maybe you're in the car, it's on the radio, maybe you're artist and a record player.It's not popping up on your phone. So you know what it's called when you hear Michael Jackson shout out, I want you back at the end and I want you back. what you're going to go out and buy, you know what, you're going to call in, you know, to the radio station and ask them to play. So, it's very calculated, it really works and it's proven and, you know, if it sort of seems like, gosh. You know, this is like a cliche. This is obvious. I think part of it is because he helped create this cliche, obvious thing, right? I mean, things become cliche or obvious because they're smart or necessary most of the time.So, you know, at some point it was novel and, you know, very corny, I think was part of, making that whole song structure novel. And, you know, really. When you look at how he executed it, you know, I think a modern day analog, we talked about this, you know, before on our bad boy episode, but so, you know, his role was very much like the Puffy role, or at least the early Puffy role in production. So, you know, he had a hand in songwriting and production, but, you know, mostly he figured out who he wanted to have producing his labels, songs and sort of who he wanted to be in charge of authoring that certain type of sound.So for Berry Gordy, it was a handful of, producers called the corporation, just like Puffy had the Hitmen. And, you know, then he would kind of come in and do his own little thing on top when he thought it was necessary. But, you know, in a way it kind of adds that whole assembly line aspect, right? Where, you know, that there's going to be a certain level of quality, there's going to be like a distinctive sound, whether it's a bad boy or Motown, or, you know, even going back to, you know, what a Ford car was, you know, in those days you had kind of an ideology to get.And I think that's one of the things that really set Motown apart.[00:08:08] Dan Runcie: Exactly. And I think with that too, you have him going through the process of starting this. So this record label started with an 800 with 800. That's what he had initially. And he uses that to then start Hitsville USA. So that's the location on Grand Ave in Detroit.Have you been to this museum by the way?[00:08:30] Zack Greenburg: I did. We did a special event there. One time we had the Forbes 30 under 30, Summit and we did this like, special, like one off private interview where I went there with Quavo and we sat in Motown studios, you know, where Michael Jackson and all them had recorded. and we did a little like video discussion on the state of the music business, I think it's floating around the internet somewhere, but, it's a really cool building. I mean, I think what strikes. Me the most, you know, like the first time I went in is like the fact that just a house.I mean, it really just looks like a house. the rooms are sort of like room size, you know, it's not some sprawling like, you know, I don't know, institutional type place like a lot of modern, recording studios, you know, it's just a converted house but you know, you kind of walk through each room and it's museum and everything now, so you can kind of get a feel for it. It's very different from the modern day glitz and glamour of the record business for sure.[00:09:20] Dan Runcie: Yeah, been there twice. it was really cool because just like you said, you feel like you're actually in a home and that's the vibe that the studio gives you. And I felt like the people that were the tour guides as well, they clearly knew their history in a way where it should sound obvious, but that could obviously be hit or miss with museum sometimes.So I felt like that piece of it was good. And it ties back to a few things that tap into the culture that it is. Gordy wanted to create that. I think make it work. He lived upstairs. Studio is downstairs. So he has everything there and he wanted to make this somewhere that creativity could spawn at any particular moment.So he wanted to create a 24/7. Set up where he had made sure the vending machines were always stocked. So people could stay there year, you know, day in day out. If creativity comes to you at 3 p. m. or 3 a. m. you can go right there and do what you have to do. And you could keep things moving there internally.And this is one of the things that I do think worked really well for them because. Although I think the music industry has gotten away from this, there was this era where the culture and the vibe that you could create from a label and all that continuity really helped things. So when you saw how deliberate he was from an assembly line perspective was essentially keeping his product in place and keeping all the materials in place so that it can produce outputs at any given moments to just increase the likelihood that you could have hits coming time and time again.[00:10:49] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, for sure. And, you know, I mean, he certainly spoke a lot about, quality control, which is, it's kind of funny, you know, given the eventual QC relationship, but, you know, I think that's a really big part of it. And when you're that hands on and, you know, in some cases you could say micromanaging, but it does enable you to really have a unified.We can also get into this, fact that at some point it can become a bit of a creative constraint for artists as they mature.[00:11:14] Dan Runcie: Right, because with quality control, there was someone on the team that listened to everything that came through Motown and they essentially picked the best. They brought it to this weekly meeting and most of the Motown artists weren't writing or producing their materials necessarily, but they were going in and you had all these artists that would essentially sing.The same exact song and then they would pick the best version that came out of that to then release the song. Sometimes they had multiple artists that would end up releasing a version. And we saw different versions of this where you had both Diana Ross and Marvin Gaye have their versions of Ain't No Mountain high enough.Granted it was a few years later in different songs, but a lot of that stems from that quality control aspect. And there's this one quote that, was here from One of the books that was written about, Berry Gordy and Motown, where they talked about quality control and they said, quote, the artists were a means to an end in a way, end quote.And that's exactly what we're talking about how the downside is that it could limit creativity, but the upside is that it gives you the opportunity to get the best polished diamond from all of the creations that come from this studio.[00:12:24] Zack Greenburg: Absolutely. And man, there were quite a few, right? I mean, when you look through, I mean, the heydays, Smokey Robinson, the Miracles, Diana Ross, the Supremes, Four Tops, Marvin Gaye, coming into, you know, Michael Jackson, the Jackson 5, you know, think we've talked about in our previous discussions about hip hop, you know, like sort of the staying power, of different labels and, you know, and how you can kind of keep identifying talent and keep it coming. I mean, that's quite a breadth You know, of like musical accomplishment that they've got, that you could say that Berry Gordy identified over the years.So, you know, I would really, obviously I'd put him up against any other, identify any A& R, any, you know, music mogul in the history of the business, for sure.[00:13:05] Dan Runcie: I agree. And I think the other thing that's interesting too, is This taps back into the whole process and quality management things. Berry Gordy really wanted to help shift the sound and direction of this label because at the time, black music and music that was made by black artists was quite segmented where people didn't feel like it could reach beyond a certain audience.And he experienced some of this himself. One of the reasons that his record stores closed was because he was focused primarily on jazz music. At the time, even Black folks weren't really into jazz at that particular moment. So he just didn't have the market to be able to continue this. So I think that helps Chase Motower.He says, okay, I want the music that's able to be listened to by everyone. I want Black people to ride with it. I want white people. I want anyone in America to be able to ride with the same way that people would listen to the Beach Boys. And he had a few more interesting things that were part of this process.One, everyone had an etiquette coach. And these are things that we're teaching them, essentially, how you have black people essentially speak to white people. Granted, I think there's a lot of that that is problematic. That probably wouldn't fly into the same ways today, just given some of the language there.but then additionally, he also had white salesmen that were essentially the ones that were promoting the records in different areas, going to different radio stations. And he would go as far to insert in records that he's promoting to not even show the artist on the cover because he wanted the record to reach.And he didn't want people to necessarily immediately see or relate it to a black artist, which I thought was interesting, but lined up with a lot of these things. So, even though some of the choices clearly were problematic, it probably wouldn't fly at the same way today. That's how he was about process and wanting to essentially be able to sell this talent anywhere in the country.[00:15:01] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, and it's especially remarkable when you sort think of the cultural context of, you know, of when this is all happening in the 60s. You know, I mean, this is a time of great polarization and social change and, you know, really like turmoil, in a lot of ways, disunity, but, what Berry Gordy created with Motown and sort of the Motown genre, which I think really like more than any label has become synonymous like a genre, you know, beyond just sort of like the name of label itself, you say Motown music, and you're talking about like a genre, as much as you're talking about a label, the fact that you'd be able to sort of create that it like in the 60s, even the late 60s, when things were really why we think we're polarized now.I mean, the late sixties, oh my gosh. Like what a testament to the sort of the sound that he created, which, you know, just like bridged all these divides and, you know, you obviously still go to any wedding, black, white, you know, at anything. And, you're gonna hear Motown all over the place.So I think that kind of goes back to what he created, you know, even at the time. being so accessible to so many different audiences and, you know, one of the things he told me, when I interviewed him, he said that, Martin Luther King came to see him, in Detroit, at the peak of the civil rights movement.And apparently, according to Gary Gordy, MLK said, he said, what I'm trying to do politically and intellectually, you're doing with your music. I love the feeling people get when they hear your music. And so maybe we can make a deal. And they made a deal to actually put out some of MLK's greatest speeches.They put out three albums on Motown and Gordy kind of summed it up by saying, if you do the right thing will come to you. So I thought that was such a cool. Little nugget that people don't necessarily realize. and, you know, I think people don't, think of Berry Gordy as like avant garde, you know, civil rights activist or anything, but, he kind of approached it in his own way, which was to make this music that could, you know, that could really bring people together.They could also get black culture, you know, into the mainstream us culture, at the same time. And, you know, I mean, we saw that, you know, decades later with hip hop, but. Berry Gordy, you know, he made that blueprint, you know, very, very, very early on.[00:17:03] Dan Runcie: It's a great story because I think it highlights the complexity and that people just aren't in these corners. And as you mentioned, Berry Gordy wasn't known for his civil rights activism. In many ways, people would often point to things that he may have shied away from, where I remember, especially in the 70s when you started to hear a bit more of a pacifist and things like that, there was a push and people wanted Motown to lead more into this and he necessarily wasn't as eager at the time and I remember even Marvin Gaye's What's Going On, one of the biggest records that was ever made.There was tension leading up to that because Gordy was like, wait, what is this? you want to do this? Like, what are we doing here? And then it eventually gets made. And then you see how I feel like every time that one of these publications has one of the greatest songs ever made, I'm sure it's come up on number one, or at least on several, one of these.So you see that, and you've seen other areas where he clearly has leaned into this, but I do think that his. Place in his role at that time, often highlighted some of that ongoing tension that we've seen from black leaders over the years about people want progress, but what's the best way to agree with this?And you date back to some of the more public debates between folks like Booker T. Washington and W. E. B. Dubois about what is the best way for black progress and group economics and things like that. And I feel like Berry Gordy clearly was on a Particular side of that, that not everyone may have agreed with, but he clearly still wanted to be able to help progress things in a particular way.So he's a very fascinating figure as we look at this progression, especially in the 20th century.[00:18:42] Zack Greenburg: Well, that's right. And, you know, I think there's a reason you see him put out MLK speeches. I don't, think he put up Malcolm X's speeches, you know, but that was just sort of his approach, right? He was more Martin than Malcolm.And, you know, obviously you could speak to the merits of either method, but, Berry Gordon definitely, had his preference there.[00:18:59] Dan Runcie: The other thing that I want to talk about, you mentioned it earlier, but the talent and the breadth of talent that was in this place is such a constraint and such a valuable time.It's one of those things where just imagine walking through on a, some day in, let's say 1964, you're just walking through Motown and all of the names that you could just see there making music on a Wednesday afternoon. It's crazy to think of the names and also how he found folks because. Look at Smokey Robinson and Smokey Robinson, the miracles essentially end up releasing shop around, which I do think ends up becoming the first true hit that, or the first, hit single that comes from Motown.He found that he found Smokey on a street corner performing almost, and in many ways, it feels similar to. What we see decades later with Sylvia Robinson driving around the New Jersey tri state area, finding hip hop artists for Sugar Hill Gang. This is how these early entrepreneurs did it. They were the talent development.They saw things and granted it was a much less crowded market. So the people that were pushing music onto folks had a little bit easier time breaking through, but it was still tough, especially at the time. And he was able to make it work in that way, which was, cool.[00:20:13] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, I mean, he actually did. And, you know, of course, like the one group that we haven't talked about too much yet is Jackson and sort of the way that, different groups were signed in those days, you know, they're all the stories about, well, you hear, you see somebody busking and you sign them and this and that.And, sort of some of the stories, though, if you talk to a lot of different people, you get, you talk to 3 people, you get 3 different stories. Right? So, I think for my book on MJ, I talked to. His dad, I talked to Berry Gordy and I talked to the guy who signed them to this little record company called Steel Town in Gary, Indiana.And they all had three different versions of, you know, how it went down, right? And so, there's that old saying, basically that the winners get to write history and, you know, Berry Gordy won. So, you know, whether his version is a hundred percent, accurate or not, that's kind of the version that, you know, we tend to hear I think his version is usually correct, but there's definitely some, you know, embellishment or some showmanship from time to time.So, you know, I think, for example, with the Jackson 5, Berry Gordy decided to put out, I think it was their first album as Diana Ross presents the Jackson 5 and, you know, she had this little thing where she's like, I discovered this group from Gary, Indiana and like blah, blah, blah, and that wasn't really how it happened at all.And it was really, you know, depending on who you ask, but I think what happened is Suzanne DePasse, who was one of Berry Gordy's lieutenants, had discovered them, and I think it was, there's another band who heard them, like sent them along to Suzanne DePasse that like, she kind of did the legwork for Berry Gordy.And it was like many times, many. Kind of connections later that Diana Ross, you know, became connected, to the group. but, you know, it's such a better story, right? Like Diana Ross has found these kids from, from the Midwest and, you know, bringing them out, onto Motown. So. I always think that's, kind of funny how, the stories end up getting presented and, you know, when you hear it from everybody else involved, I mean, and Diana Ross, of course, did become, really instrumental and especially Michael's life, as time went on, moved to LA and I think she, he actually lived with her for a little while while they were, you know, making the move and all this stuff, but, you know, it, didn't exactly start out that way.[00:22:18] Dan Runcie: Right. And the Jackson 5 is interesting because they, in many ways were the last group that came through in the heyday of Motown because the heyday we're really talking about is that 50 to 60s run that we've been talking about with a lot of the groups and the artists that we mentioned, especially young Marvin Gaye, young Stevie Wonder, Diana Ross and the Supremes.And then Jackson 5 comes along. But they come along towards the end of the decade. And just for some context setting, in 1968, Motown is doing 30 million in revenue. And they at one point had a 65% hit rate on the songs that they released in terms of actually being able to chart. So the highs were quite high and they were, killing it.The thing is, though, in the early 70s, this is where things start to shift a little bit, because at this point, Berry has his eyes set much bigger, and he wants to move beyond things in Detroit, because of course he was in the Hitsville, U.S.A. house, solely, after the riots that happened and there was some damage there, they ended up expanding things closer.they ended up expanding further in Detroit to just get a bigger size studio there as well. But then, he eventually wants to go to Hollywood so that he could get more into film. He wants to get into production for plays. He wants to bring these artists on the big screen. And it makes sense. We see why this is a huge medium.You saw how much, popular this talent is. And if you can get people to see them and buy into this, visual image that he's clearly curated, no different than we saw someone like Diddy decades later curating things, he wanted to do that. And I think that in many ways, this was one of those big challenges that any leader can have.Do you stay with the thing that's working really well? Or do you try to expand? And when you do expand, how do you find out? How do you make sure that you have the best talent around you? How do you make sure that you're well equipped? And I think that bowtie really started to strain because as things started to grow for the label, a lot of the artists started to feel like they were getting neglected because of these broader ambitions.And that in many ways, now we're dating 50 plus years ago to like 1972 timeframe. That's when a lot of ways was the beginning of the end, at least in terms of the Motown that a lot of people grew up with and knew.[00:24:41] Zack Greenburg: I think so for sure. And, you know, I think as an entrepreneur, you have to seek the next thing, right? I mean, you don't want to stagnate and you kind of have to take the risk and go for the next big thing and maybe you succeed and maybe you don't, and I think that's at least the way we've been conditioned to think. On the other hand, there could be an argument for like, we don't need to have this growth at all costs mindset as a society, you know, what's wrong with having a really awesome business that's just like constantly, you know, successful has happy employees, you know, that kind of thing. But, I guess that's, you know, this is, you know, Trapital not, you know, Trapsocialism, I dunno, we're talking within a certain realm of, you know, of economic, styles and systems.So that's what's gotta happen. And that's what Berry Gordy decided to do, you know, by moving everything to LA but we talked, a while ago about John McClain, and his role in kind of in, in the past few decades as an executive. He's somebody who rarely talks, but somebody interviewed him at some point.He said that he thought that moving to LA was, kind of the beginning of the end for Motown, because it, kind of changed Motown from being a trendsetter to being a trend follower. And, I think I agree with that. And, you know, that's not to say that there wasn't additional success, especially, you know, beyond the recorded music business that occurred. And that moving to LA kind of, you know, like supercharged some of that, but yeah, you know, I mean, I think when Motown was in the Motor City, in its namesake place, like, You know, it was sort of like, I don't say the only game in town cause there were other labels, but I think it was sort of, the main game in town and, being in a place that, you know, wasn't sort of the epicenter of the music business allowed it to have kind of its own unique style and not sort of be influenced as much by what else was going on.And, you know, don't forget in those days, it wasn't like everything was, you know, it wasn't like we were all tuning into the same social media channels. you know, we weren't even like really tuned into cable TV or anything like that, you know, there wasn't the same kind of like national culture that there is today that, you know, where trends just kind of like fly across in a second. And things did kind of take time to move from one place to the other. throughout the country. So, you know, there was like a certain regionalism to it that I think set Motown apart and, you know, maybe you lose a little bit, you know, once you're out in LA, but, you know, certainly around that time, you really start to see some of the artists who wanted more creative freedom, leaving, you know, some others pushing back, you know, I think even within, a few years of moving to LA, the Jackson 5, we're kind of, having some issues with Motown and in terms of, you know, can we make some of our own types of music? You know, do we really have to stick to quite the assembly line? So, yeah, I do think it was a mixed bag for Berry Gordy to head west.[00:27:20] Dan Runcie: And this is where things really started to struggle because a lot of what worked for Berry Gordy was so perfect for. The Hitsville USA West Grand Ave mentality of building everything there and not to say that he was only an early stage founder that couldn't necessarily progress. But I think a lot of the processes he had were more fit for that era. So naturally, you see the growing success of the Jackson 5 and Michael is no longer 9 years old.He is at this point now a full on teenager, but unfortunately, it just didn't quite. Progress in a few things, as you mentioned, you wanted more, they wanted more creative control. They also wanted to have a bit more ownership. There were disputes about royalties. And I remember reading something that said that the Jackson 5 had calculated how much they got.And it was only a 2.3% stake of how much revenue was either coming through or would be coming through in the future. And they see this and they're like, okay, well how can we see our opportunity to get more of that? So then they leave for Epic. And then you also saw a handful of artists at this point were already on their ways out and things were definitely starting to look a little bit more bleak because by the time you get to the end of the seventies, the beginning of 1980s, The music industry was already, granted things are cyclical, but they were starting to sour a bit on black music.This was the end of disco and people wanted nothing to do with that genre. And even though Motown wasn't disco necessarily, there was vibes of the types of artists they were trying to naturally capture in the 70s. So then that had all of black music taking a hit in a lot of ways and there were groups like the barge and others that I think they tried to make work. Obviously, I think Stevie Wonder was a mainstay during all this and that worked out really well for them, but he was really just 1 mainstay. You did have Marvin Gaye, but again, still, it just wasn't necessarily. The same, and I think that they definitely started to struggle even more at that particular moment.And even as early as the 80s, you start to see more of that narrative that honestly, you still hear today about recapturing that Motown magic or recapturing that Motown journey. People have been saying this now for 40 years.[00:29:40] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, for sure. And I think one thing that people forget is that even though the Jackson 5 moved on to Epic, you know, and that's where MJ ended up, you know, Epic and CBS, and, that's where MJ ended up launching a solo career, people forget that Jermaine actually stayed at Motown initially. He had married Berry Gordy's daughter and, you know, they had this whole wedding with like, you know, 150 white doves were released and, you know, they had this, you know, kind of fairytale situation. And apparently, Berry said to Jermaine, like, Hey, you can go with your brothers and stay with me, whatever you want.And, you know, knowing Berry, I think he maybe didn't put it that delicately or, you know, that was kind of a huge break from Motown because you know, he had really taken the Jackson 5 under his wing. They used to have, Gordy versus Jackson family, baseball games. Michael Jackson would play catcher. It was very So, you know, I think Tito was like the big power hitter, is what I heard. but yeah, for, you know, I mean, these were two families that were really intricately linked. And I think ultimately it kind of came down to, you know, there was some creative control issues, but, you know, Joe Jackson was, pretty controlling, Berry Gordy was pretty controlling and at some point, you know, it just, I think it became impossible for them to coexist.And so, Joe kind of guided them over to Epic to get that big deal, but, you know, Jermaine. It wasn't obvious that Michael was going to be, you know, by far the superstar of all the Jacksons. And, you know, Jermaine did seem at the time to be like the one who had the most promising solo career, or at least it was, you know, pretty close.And, you know, he never really found his niche is a solo act and eventually it would go on to get back every night with his brothers and go on tours and that sort of thing.[00:31:22] Dan Runcie: I think that's a good distinction because people will often point to and think about what are the big nine and then he drops off the wall. This isn't what happened. There's a pretty big difference between those few years. No difference than anyone where naturally there's a difference between a 15 year, but there were others that experienced.So many of the artists that ended up leaving at that particular year old artist and a 19 year old artist. You're a completely different person at that point. And that's exactly what we ended up seeing with Michael. So missed opportunity for sure missed opportunities that Motown had, we'll get to miss opportunities in a minute, but you often hear people talk about them not being able to keep Michael, but to your point, the Jackson 5 leaving Motown in 1975, 76, isn't the same as.Them leaving in 1970 time ended up having greater,success once they were able to have a bit of freedom after leaving Motown, which was a bit unfortunate because obviously, I think it would have been great to see them continue that success under Berry Gordy's umbrella and continue to see them grow.But not everyone is going to be Stevie Wonder. Not everyone is there to say, Hey, I'm with you until the end. And I'm going to be riding with you during this entire journey. It just doesn't work that way. People have careers. No different. You see them today where people see a bigger opportunity and the grass is greener.They want to take advantage of that, especially if they don't feel like they are being put in the best position to thrive. So in the 80s, Motown is now officially in its transition recovery mode, trying to recapture what was there and we see a few things happen.So they start leading in on debarge. And a lot of people, DeBarge did have a pretty big hit with Rhythm of the Night, but I do think that they tried to make the DeBarge family replicate some of this Jackson family, where you had El DeBarge, and you had all of these others, but it just didn't quite click, at least in a mainstream way to that perspective, but then you did have Lionel Richie, who did end up having a pretty big career, especially with everything he had done since the, Commodores and, but then you also had Berry Gordy's son that they were also trying to work into the mix, who performed under the name Rockwell, who had had that song, somebody's watching me that Michael had sung the hook on.So you had a few things there, but just didn't exactly click because again, it's stuck in two models. Berry wanted to continue to have complete control over it. And the artists just didn't want that anymore. I think that worked when you were literally giving artists. No giving artists in a region of the country like Detroit a platform and opportunity, but they had no other options.But now they had leverage. Now they could go talk to mca Now they could go talk to CBS Epic and some of these other labels. So Berry's mentality just didn't work as much. And then by 1988 is when we see him transition on from the label, at least as the CEO level. And then we start to see the new blood come in to run the record label.[00:34:30] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. I mean, I think it is important to note that, you know, although you could characterize the 80s as sort of like musical decline era for Motown, you know, in the way that many artists are entrepreneurs, like, seem to be in a period of delays over some decade or whatever, they actually get much richer during that period of malaise, because what they had built before was so good.And there's still kind of like, they're finally cashing in on it, whereas maybe they didn't cash in on it when it first happened. But like, enough of the sort of like older, wealthier decision makers who can pay them more are like, finally getting hip to the fact that, you know, this is a big deal.So, I would definitely think about Motown that context and that, you know, when Berry was able to sell, you know, a huge chunk, of the company kind of like step back from it, that was after like a a period of time when Motown was not as hot as it had been.But you had things going on, like Motown 25 in 1983, that special. Put together, where MJ came back and reunited, with his brothers and the whole Motown crew and he had, you know, all these other artists, but that was actually the first time I think that MJ moonwalked, you know, sort of in public, like you know, he sort of like the popular debut of the moonwalk and it just really kind of, Created, so much buzz around that, that then kind of rubbed off on Motown and didn't really matter whether he wasn't on Motown anymore, but it just kind of gave a little more shine to the label and gave it sort of like, a relevance, I think that helped kind of carry through to the end of the 80s and helped get Berry Gordy, this really big payday.So, I wouldn't discount like You know, I don't know the sort of like delayed reaction that sort of the half life of fame or whatever you want to call it. But, there were still some of these moments that were created, that kept paying dividends as the time went on. I think[00:36:13] Dan Runcie: That's a fair point because he also sold at this smart time when right as we're seeing in this current era that we're recording, it's a very hot time for music asset transactions as were the late 80s and early 90s too. That's when you saw Geffen do many of the deals that he had done and Gordy. Did the same where I believe he made 61 million from the sale, or at least his portion of the sale in 1988, which is huge.You didn't see people, especially black business owners that fully owned everything being able to cash out at that level. So that's a good point. I'm glad that you mentioned that. And with this is when we start to see the transition of leadership. And we start to see a few things that do ring true.Where the first person that takes over is Gerald Busby, who was leading black music at MCA at the time. And even though Motown had had a bit of its malaise in the 1980s, MCA did not, in many ways, it was seen as the leader in black music. And Bubsy was able to. Have quite a good amount of success there with all of the work that he had done.the thing is though, he had started to run into some issues because he was in this weird dynamic where this company, Polygram had owned part of the label, as did Boston Ventures, his private equity group, and Bubsy was at odds with the folks at Boston Ventures about. some creative control. And he had this quote where he says he'd rather quit Motown president than see the label become a cash cow for a huge corporation trafficking off of nostalgia.And that was a quote that was said back in the 90s just thinking about how. Similar, some of those quotes now come to today. And this was someone who was largely credited from helping to say blast black music from that disco era. But unfortunately, I think a lot of those tensions that he had had, at the time just made life a little bit more difficult for him at Motown.So he eventually we Left. And while he was there, he was able to at least get a few things under. Like he was the one that had brought in voice to men. He had Queen Latifah there. He had Johnny Gill, who was another artist at the time that was quite popular, but maybe hadn't necessarily lived on in the way.And his dreams were, he wanted to have Motown cafes, the same way you had hard rock cafes. He wanted to have the young acts going and touring around at different places to recreate that vibe. And this is something that we'll get into. I think we see time and time again, where these leaders have all these dreams and visions for what they see.Motown can be, but because of the powers that be because of other things, they just can't quite get there to make it happen.[00:38:51] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. And I think that one of the things that set Motown apart early on, you know, as sets many startups apart early on, and many record companies are early on is that they were independent and they could do whatever they wanted.And, you know, Berry Gordy was, sort of like the unquestioned leader and, you know, things kind of, in the way that things kind of get done, let's say more efficiently, if not, more equitably in dictatorships, like he could just get shit done, move things around, have it happen immediately. And so when you started to have, you know, these corporate parents, parent companies, you know, you'd have to go through all these layers of approval to do anything.And, kind of like stop being able to be agile. and I think that's especially important in the music business when, you know, you have to. Not be reactive, but proactive, right? You have to be ahead of things. So, you know, if you're getting to a point where you're having to wait on approvals and things like that, you've already lost because you should have been out in front to begin with.[00:39:48] Dan Runcie: And this is something that I think plagued Motown time and time again, because Gordy didn't necessarily operate in this way. He had so many people that wanted to replicate what he did, but they didn't have the same parameters and the same leeway to make those decisions. As you mentioned, they're now working for corporations that now have their own vested interest.And to be frank, one of the tensions that we see often in music is that these brazen, bold leaders want to be able to take big swings and do things that are innovative and off the cuff. And these corporations are hard set pressed on efficiency. They don't want to see overspending. They don't want to see over commitments, or they want to be able to feel like this is being run in a strategic way.This is something that in the Interscope episode that we talked about, Jimmy Iveen struggled with this as well, even as recently as his tenure with Apple music. But this is one of those frequent tensions that happens with music executives. And we saw that continue with the person that replace Busby, which is Andre Harrell.We talked about him a bit in the Bad Boy episode, but Andre, of course, at this time was coming fresh off of Uptown Records where he was working in collaboration with MCA and he was able to build a little bit of his own fiefdom there where granted he still had people he had to answer to, but I think he had a pretty good relationship with the folks at MCA up until the end there.Then he goes to Motown and he sees this opportunity. And there's a few things that stick out about this because. As early as a year ago, he was starting to get rumored as to be the next person to then take over. But then he gets 250k as an initial announcement. He takes out this full page ad, New York Times.And then he has this ad that essentially says from Uptown to Motown, it's on. And it's him sitting in the back of the chair and you see a sweatshirt in the back. And people hated it. People grilled him. The way that they talked about him, the trades and even Russell Simmons and others coming in and giving him shit about it.He had pretty verbal flight fights with Clarence Avon, who was pretty powerful at the time. And Clarence even said he had swung on him at one particular point and was quite critical of him as well. There's this one quote that I think was really funny here, where this was from the Netflix documentary that was, The Black Godfather, which was about Clarence Avon.And, or actually, no, this is before this summer variety interview, but they talked about this as well. The doc, Clarence says, Andre and I didn't get along. And then he pointed to an image of the Motown boy band, 98 degrees. And Avon says, Andre wanted to send these white boys to Harlem to make them sound black.And I was like, you're out of your fucking mind. And it's a funny quote, because I do think that 98 degrees. Maybe didn't exactly have as many hits as they probably would have thought, but in Andre Harrell's defense, and sadly, but true, the mentality wasn't necessarily wrong because of the 90s, the most successful Motown act that you had was Boyz II Men, and we saw at the end of the decade that, what's that guy's name, the con artist that had the boy bands, Lou Pearlman, like, he literally modeled Backstreet Boys and NSYNC after How can I find white boys to men and make them see modern contemporary and make this happen?And that's how he was able to have success there. And that was before, what's his name? That was before Andre Harrell was really getting going. So he saw where things were going. But it just didn't click at the time. It just wasn't right. And obviously 90 degrees ends up having some decent success, but that's well after Andre Harrell had left the label.So he ended up leaving and the press was not kind to him. Literally headlines were. Andre Harrell gets fired from LA Times it's a type of headline that we probably don't see now when record label execs get fired in the same way. I think the industry is much more controlled in its PR sometimes to a fault, but it was very interesting to see that, come through. And another interesting quote from that, Lucian Grange had called the Andre Harrell at Motown relationship, an organ rejection. In terms of the relationship there.[00:43:56] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, no, I mean, and it's kind of interesting if you think about, you know, around that same time. What was going on in the music business, what would have been a great fit at Motown that didn't happen, would have been to sign Eminem, right? I mean, rather than try to do it with 98 degrees, if you really want to go and sort of like figure out what the kids are listening to, and do the thing where you have a white guy making black music, like. Holy shit. There's Eminem from Detroit, you know, doing his thing. But, you know, I think it took different kind of Andre to pull that one off.So, you know, in a way well played, you know, I mean, in a way it was like Andre was maybe Andre Harrell was taking some risks, but he wasn't taking quite enough. Like, he wasn't going far enough. He wasn't going way out enough on a limb. So, if you were really going to try to read that Motown, then that then go all the way at the same time, though, I would argue.I mean, if you look back, it's sort of like what worked with Motown and what did it, I think one of Motown's greatest attributes is also a limiting factor. And that's the thing we talked about before it, it's a label, but it's also a genre. And so if you have Motown making hip hop, it's like, wait a minute this isn't Motown. Like this isn't the genre of Motown. Like this is not the thing that I heard at my aunt's wedding, you know, this is something different. So, I think that they got kind of caught in between and I know that they've done all this stuff in hip hop over the years and, whatever, but it still doesn't feel like quite a fit because Motown, I mean that, you know, Motown was Motown, Motown wasn't hip hop and, you know, maybe if it had started getting into hip hop in the early days of hip hop.you know, it would have felt a little bit different about that, but, you know, hip hop is Def Jam, hip hop is is Roc-A-Fella hip hop is Bad Boy, and I just, you know, for all the efforts that Motown has made to get into hip hop, I think, it, has had a hard time, you know, fully sticking in the way that it would need to for Motown to replicate its, early success.[00:45:51] Dan Runcie: And one of the things that I think that a lot of these post Berry Gordy leaders struggled with was... As you mentioned, yeah, with Andre Harrell or others, there was the desire and opportunity to be able to do more, but the combination of the corporate structures in place that just didn't give them the same freedom that a Berry Gordy himself would have had.And then secondly. The business structure of how Motown itself as a company was set up didn't necessarily allow that because even things like radio or promotion and things like that, they still relied on other labels under the corporate umbrella, even to this day to get some of those things in place.So it really wasn't. Given the same freedom, even though their name, especially in the late 90s early two thousands was used in, especially back then it was the whole universal Republic Motown group or whatever the amalgamation was at the time. It really wasn't given the same freedom as some of those other record labels were.And I think we saw those challenges come in from time with some of the other leaders as well, because. Afterward, after, Harrell left, you had George Jackson who was there, felt like a bit more interim there for a couple of years. And then you had Kedar Mazenberg who was there late 90s early 2000.And that was a bit more than Neo soul vibe. You had India, Ari and a few others, but he has this quote that he gave to the independent, 2000 where he says, but we're not going to dominate the pop charts. Like we used to, how can we, there are too many other companies out there for that. So please don't compare it to the Motown of yesteryear.This is someone that is in the leadership role saying that exact quote. like How do you get past that? And then he talks again. I think they made a comparison to Def Jam where he said, you know, Def Jam, it took 10, 20 years to get to this established guidance, the way that you did with someone like a Lyor Cohen.And you essentially had that with Berry Gordy. But again, Lior was doing this before Def Jam ended up, you know, becoming under the whole Island Def Jam group and everything happened there. After that, you have Sylvia Roan, who was rising up the ranks herself. Still one of the most successful Black women in media and music right now.She's currently at Epic, but she had her time at Motown as well. And I'm going to get into her because I have something I want to say for missed opportunities there. And then you get more recently to the era of Ethiopia Habtamirian, who was there from 2011. Up until 2022, and she's 1 of those that I do feel like was put in a pretty hard spot because on 1 hand, she was able to essentially double the market share.Thanks in part to the partnership that she had made with hip hop through quality control to be able to help. them succeed And this is especially when the Migos are first starting to pop off, and then that transitions into the success of artists like Lil Yachty and Lil Baby and City Girls and others. But I think that also some of the overspending and things like that were quite critiqued.And especially from a PR perspective, the same way I was mentioning earlier when. Andre Harrell's challenges were bright front and center for the entire industry to read. Ethiopia's necessarily weren't in the same way. And even in some of the aspects of her leaving, the media had they called it a bit more reflective of, oh, Ethiopia has chosen to step down.When, yes, that's true, but there was also a pretty large severance package from Lucian and others at UMG. And again, I don't think she was necessarily given as much leadership either, because Motown was kind of, and still is kind of under capital, but now they've essentially moved it back. They had announced that she was solely the CEO back in 2021, but that was a pretty short lived.And to be honest, it felt like. Yeah. 1 of those announcements that the industry made in this, like, post George Floyd era to try to highlight and support black CEOs, which was great to see, but she's someone that's talented. You don't want to see her just become a tokenized person to have this. So, even though, like any CEO, I think there was things you could point out that she probably could have done differently.Still wasn't given the most leeway to begin with it. Now we're back in this point where what is Motown who's leading Motown. It's essentially the subsidiary under capital, but it's now a brand. And who knows where things are going to be. And it's quite unfortunate, but given everything that we've said up into this point, it also, isn't that surprising just given the dynamic.[00:50:21] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think, you know, like you mentioned the the partnership with quality control. I mean, I think. That was a smart way to get more involved in hip hop because that was a brand that did have roots in hip hop more that, kind of resonated. and so when you sort of like, build as a partnership and look at it that way, it seems a little more credible than like,you know, Motown is doing hip hop now. so it's too bad that, you know, things kind of turned out the way they did, but, it's an interesting asset, right? I mean, it's a brand that has a lot of value. But it's not exactly clear, you know, how to sort of monetize it. And I think with Motown right now, it's like, it's probably about more, than the music, right?Like that's maybe where most of the monetization opportunity would be, whether it's, you know, Motown branded, you know, I don't know, films and, you know, I don't know, products, whatever the case may be. It resonates more, I think, than it does, as a record label. And people don't care so much about record labels anymore.Like we've talked about this, you know, in prior episodes, but it's not the same. You're not going to put on your record on a record player and see that big Motown logo on it, you're having something pop up your ear. And there, there's no visual, like, you don't know whether it's on Motown or Def Jam or Universal or Sony or, and you don't probably don't care.Right. I mean, and I think as things have kind of blurred together, genres are blurring together, you know, different, labels are gobbling each other up over the years, you know, people have just kind of like lost track and, you know, sort of like the idea of a label just isn't as important anymore.So, I do think that it's. a valuable piece of IP and, you know, there's things to do with it still. But, you know, I think, Berry Gordy certainly like squeezed, you know, all he could out of it and, did a great job of sort of ultimately profiting off of what it was that he built.[00:52:04] Dan Runcie: Right. Because what you have right now is this brand where they do have Motown the musical, which I do think has been pretty successful, both in the US and in Europe and elsewhere that it's traveled. but that's it. I mean, quality control partnership doesn't exist in the same way since they've been now bought by hive.Hopefully, Ethiopia and those folks were able to at least retain some type of revenue for helping to set the framework to make that deal possible, but we'll see I, where I landed with this is that. The way to quote unquote, I don't want to say save Motown because that can just seems like such a blanket statement, but if you were trying to improve it from its current inevitable state, it would be finding a way to spin off the asset and the catalog from Universal and having it be in the hands of someone else who can make it work.The challenge is Universal isn't going to want to give that asset up. That's one of their most valuable back catalogs that they have. So. I was thinking through it in my mind, the same way that you have someone like a Tyler Perry, who are these modern moguls that have a bit of that Berry Gordy vibe to them.The way that Tyler Perry is, we'll see whether or not he ends up buying BET, but could that same mentality be applied to a record label? And then with that, you're able to then build up your own promotion. You're able to build up your own talent, and then you take things in a slightly different way. I still don't think that guarantees success, but at least you shake things up in a particular way and you still give it that black ownership mentality.You give it a bit more of that independence and the autonomy and you could potentially see what happens because. We all know what the continued fate is as a legacy entity of a catalog holder that it would be under the UMG umbrella.[00:53:50] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, a hundred percent. Totally agree.[00:53:52] Dan Runcie: And with that, I think it would be a good time to dig into some of these categories here. So what do you think is the biggest, this will may be obvious, but what do you think is the biggest signing that they've done or that Motown ever did?[00:54:04] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, I think I'd go with the Jackson 5 I mean, you know, although Motown did not ultimately profit off of MJ's solo career, in the way that it would have if it had retained him for a solo career, Motown did profit off of the association as he became the biggest musical star, but basically entertainer of any kind in the world.and, you know, going back to the Motown 25 moment, you know, other kinds of associations. So I would say like good process. Not really a bad outcome, but like signing the Jackson 5 could have been the path to also signing Michael Jackson as a solo artist. And then, you know, just because that didn't work out in the end, does it mean that that wasn't a huge signing for them?[00:54:47] Dan Runcie: Yeah, I was going to say Jackson 5 or Stevie Wonder, which is the one that I had and I say him because of the longevity because even when times were rough, Stevie Wonder still had arguably his best decade in the 70s But, he had a number of them that were there, especially in the seventies. I think that was his strongest run and he stayed through. And I think that in a lot of ways helped bridge the gap during some of those low moments when other artists did come and went. Did come and go. So that was the one I had there.What do you have as the best business move?[00:55:18] Zack Greenburg: Well, okay. This is something we haven't talked about and maybe we should talk about it but more, but here we are, we'll talk about it more now. I think it was Berry Gordy setting up, his publishing company. So, I mean, maybe that's cheating a little bit because it was outside of, Motown itself but of He set up Joe bet, publishing, you know, pretty early on. And he didn't realize, you know, his big payday for it until later 1997, but he sold it for 132 million for just for half of it. so the EMI, and then he sold another 30% for I think 109 million. And then he sold the rest of it for, something like 80 million in, what was that?It was like 2004. So, you know, we're talking like over a quarter billion dollars and that's not inflation adjusted. you know, for the publishing and that, you know, that dwarfed whatever he got for Motown itself. So, and, you know, think about if he held onto it until, the recent publishing Bonanza, I mean, I mean, it could have been close to a billion dollar catalog, right?I mean, you know, there's nothing, really like it out there. So. He was always very smart about ownership and I think Michael Jackson knew that and, you know, studied him as a kid growing up. And that's kind of what convinced Michael to want to own his own work, and also in the Beatles work, which then became the basis of Sony ATV.And that was another massive catalog. So, yeah, I think the publishing side of it definitely gets overlooked and, you know, was ultimately the most, financially valuable part. But, even though it was sort of a separate. Company, you know, I would argue it, for sure it wouldn't have happened without Motown happening.[00:56:51] Dan Runcie: That's a great one. And I'm glad you mentioned that. Cause definitely could get overlooked and doesn't get talked enough about in this whole business. I think publishing in general is something that people don't understand. And so they just don't, dig into it, but he wrote it. I mean, he owned everything.And obviously when you own the value. When you own something that valuable, it has its assets. And I think why publishing continues to be so valuable in the industry i

We can't tell the story of hip-hop without mentioning Diddy and the record label he started. Bad Boy took off in 1993 after Puff was fired from Uptown Records. He brought TheNotorious B.I.G. with him from Uptown Record, and signed a 50-50 deal with Clive Davis's Arista Records, and it was off to the races.Bad Boy survived the tragic fallout of the East Coast vs. West Coast rivalry, and reached even bigger heights after Biggie's death. Puff began to rise as a solo artist, but did the rest of the artists suffer as a result?Friend of the pod, Zack O'Malley Greenburg, joins me on this episode to cover 30 years of Bad Boy Entertainment. Here's what we hit on:0:35 Sean Combs come-up story5:16 Diddy breaks in with Uptown Records8:22 Starting Bad Boy Records14:11 What sets Diddy apart21:04 How Diddy controlled the narrative23:58 Bad Boy's formula for success 29:00 East Coast vs. West Coast rivalry30:39 Bad Boy's historic 1997-98 run45:42 Bad Boy curse?48:44 Diddy's reputation compared to Cash Money54:50 Best signing? 55:19 Best business move?57:19 Best dark horse move?1:00:19 Missed opportunity?1:08:52 Possibility of biopic?Listen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | SoundCloud | Stitcher | Overcast | Amazon | Google Podcasts | Pocket Casts | RSSHost: Dan Runcie, @RuncieDan, trapital.coGuests: Zack O'Malley Greenburg, @zogblogThis episode is sponsored by DICE. Learn more about why artists, venues, and promoters love to partner with DICE for their ticketing needs. Visit dice.fmEnjoy this podcast? Rate and review the podcast here! ratethispodcast.com/trapitalTrapital is home for the business of music, media and culture. Learn more by reading Trapital's free memo.TRANSCRIPT[00:00:00] Zack Greenburg: Diddy's ability to sort of walk the line and step back, you know, I think that's what ultimately kept Bad Boy in the position that, you know, that stayed and kept him in the position that he continued to be in.[00:00:09] Dan Runcie Outro Audio: Hey, welcome to the Trapital Podcast. I'm your host and the founder of Trapital, Dan Runcie. This podcast is your place to gain insights from the executives in music, media, entertainment, and more who are taking hip hop culture to the next level.[00:00:35] Dan Runcie Guest Intro: Today's episode is another case study style breakdown, and this time we chose to dive deep on the one, the only Bad Boy Entertainment when it comes to branding and when it comes to marketing. I don't know if there's another record label that has as identifiable as a sound of vibe as bad Boy, you knew what that vibe was.Puff said it himself, they take hits from the eighties, but do it sound so crazy? And that was the formula, and it worked time and time again. What Puff did was smart, it was a modern approach to how Berry Gordy approached the record business with Motown. But then he put his own spin on it, interning with Andre Harrell at Uptown Records, learning from him and then putting his own spin on it even more, making it relevant for the 90s and truly becoming the icon that was synonymous with shiny suits with that Bad Boy flavor.And so much of the success of one of the best MCs ever, the Notorious BIG, some of the most iconic R&B groups at the time, and singers such as Faith Evans, 112 and many more. And plenty of artists that unfortunately also had plenty of challenges and issues when it came to payment, drama, legal disputes and more.And we dive into all of that. I'm joined again by Zack O'Malley Greenburg. He wrote a book called Three Kings, where he dived deep into Diddy, as well as Dr. Dre and Jay-Z in this book, so he's well-versed and shared a bunch of great stories in this one. So let's dive in, really excited for this one. Hope you enjoy it.[00:02:06] Dan Runcie: We are back to talk about the wondrous world that Sean Combs built himself Bad Boy entertainment and joined by the one and only Zach Greenburg. Welcome back[00:02:15] Zack Greenburg: Oh, thanks for having me, Dan.[00:02:17] Dan Runcie: Bad Boy is so fascinating because Puff is someone who has in many ways been this larger than life character even before people knew him externally as that.And he has really stayed true with that throughout his time in hip hop and even before then. And most people know the origin story starting back in his days at Howard. But I think based on the research you've done, I know you have some backstory with some of the lessons and some of the things he did even before that.So walk us back. Who was puff in the early days before the world? Got to know him.[00:02:52] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, I mean, you know, I think the funny part is that, that puffy was always puffy and, you know, it just took a while for a little while for the world to kind of figure it out. But you know, there are these kind of consistent themes when you go back through his youth and you, kind of get a sense of who he was.And, you know, I remember writing my book Three Kings, you know, Diddy being one of these kings, talking to people who grew up around him. He really was that same guy from the very beginning. So even when he was a kid, you know, he spent his very earliest years in Harlem, but then moved to Mount Vernon, kind of a suburban neighborhood.you know, just north of the city limits. And you know, he had not just one paper route, he had multiple paper routes and on every, you know, every route. He had this philosophy of like, he wasn't just gonna take the paper and fling it into the family's yard. He was gonna get up and he was gonna go, you know, open the screen door and put the paper in between the screen door and the main door so that people didn't have to go up and do so like he was, you know, that dedicated, that hardworking from the very beginning. you know, I think another story I learned from his youth, Puffy was like, there was some, Some debate, you know, some kid had a pool party and, Puffy wasn't invited. there may have been some racism at play, we don't know. But anyway, Puffy's solution was to convince his mom to build a pool in their backyard and then start his own pool parties and, you know, I mean, it's like the most puffy move ever, right? So he just ended up finding, you know, wealthier and wealthier backers to build the proverbial pool as the years went on.[00:04:23] Dan Runcie: That is the perfect story to encapsulate him because I feel like I could imagine other people having white parties. He doesn't get invited to the white party, so he's like, all right, bet I'm gonna go start my own white party. And now it's this annual thing, however many years running.[00:04:37] Zack Greenburg: Exactly. I mean, and you know, you know, as you kind of trace his evolution, you know, in between it was the same thing. So, you know, we all know the Howard Days, he was taking the Amtrak up, sometimes hiding in the bathroom, so they didn't have to pay for the tickets. He didn't have any money but, you know, he would go up back up to New York on the weekends, he would plan these parties.He started to build a name for himself. and it was exactly that, you know, so from the pool parties, in Mount Vernon to the parties that he was throwing, you know, his colleges to the White party, you get that through line of Puffy that, you know, kind of continues all the way through, through the Ciroc era, you know, I think, which really makes this sort of art celebration, ethos, you know, all the more credible, right.[00:05:16] Dan Runcie: Right, and you mentioning him taking Amtrak. Of course, that's him going from DC to New York to go to Uptown Records where he pushes and fights to get his unpaid internship. Working with Andre Harrell, who was on the Ascension himself. He had started that record label in the mid to late eighties. He then sees the rise.He's early on, new Jack Swing has so many of the early folks making that sound there. And then Puff comes in, he sees a opportunity to elevate and position that brand because the whole thing that Uptown was about, they were trying to push Ghetto Fabulous. They wanted to show that there was a opportunity for people who grew up with nothing to feel like they had that release.And Andre Harrell, he since passed away a few years ago, but he spoken about this a few times and you can see how Puff at the time adapted a lot of that. He worked with Jodeci. He was so integral with how he styled them and making sure they had the right jackets. And at the time, Jodeci was very much seen as this alternative to Boys to Men, Boys to Men was a bit more buttoned up.They made music that was G-rated that you could play everywhere. And Jodeci definitely leaned into the sex appeal, which is something that we saw continue play through with. Bad Boy records of Bad Boy Entertainment in the future. He did similar with Mary J. Blige, taking her from just being a R&B singer to giving her more of a hip hop Ben, and doing a bit more of that crossover vibe, which is something that we saw again with Bad Boy too.And as Puff continued to show his influence, things started to clash because the intern then becomes VP of A and R, and that VP in A and R starts to butt heads and really challenge Andre Harrell on a number of things.[00:07:06] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. And, you know, I think, you know, like you said, Puff really had an idea of what Uptown could be that was, you know, a little bit different from Andre. But it really worked, right? It was the idea that it was, it had a little bit more of an edge to it. you know, like Jodeci had a little more edge than boys to men.you know, that every artist that was gonna be out on Bad Boy would have like, you know, would have that level of class, but also would have kind of like, you know, kind of like a street smart edge. And so, right, it was like the Tims and the backwards hat, but, you know, maybe you had like a nice jacket.It was that kind of mix. And it was very much like in line with Puffy himself. and I think, you know, it's a theme that you kind of started to see. as kind of, he moved on, you know, whether it was Bad Boy or Roc or whatever it was, the thing was synonymous with Puffy. Puffy was synonymous with the thing. But as he began to later on build these assets, you know, he could sell the businesses in a way that he couldn't sort of sell his own image and likeness necessarily. So, that started with, Uptown for sure, it was Andre's thing, but it started to feel like it was Puffy's thing.And I think there was some thought that, you know, that there sort of couldn't be two kings in the castle. And Andre eventually pushed him out and, you know, that kind of left it, the Diddy, you know, in his early twenties kind of figuring out like, Hey, you know, what am I gonna do next? How am I gonna really start my own thing here?[00:08:22] Dan Runcie: And I have this quote from Andre. This was from a documentary a few years later. He says, when Puff got fired, he was on payroll and his artists were on payroll. He's still recording his artists, but he was able to find the best deal, so we never fired him to hurt him. But he fired him to basically make him rich.I will say that quote is much nicer than certain things that Andre said immediately after that firing, especially in the 90s. But it was cool to see the two of them find opportunities to continue to work together after that. But I think the key thing from his time in Uptown is that he was able to find and work with art is that eventually he started working with on Bad Boy.That's when he first works and discovers Big. That's when he first works and really begins to hone in on that sound. And then he officially launched Bad Boy in 1991, but it really wasn't until 1993. He starts working with Big, he starts working with Craig Mack and then it all leads up to this deal that he ends up signing with Arista records to officially do this joint venture with Arista.Arista, of course, was run by Clive Owen, legendary music executive, and they do their 50 50 split. And as the story goes, Clive was on the fence. At first he wanted to hear more, but then Puff Plays flavor in your ear. Craig Max first single, and he was like, all right, I need to be part of this, whatever it is.So that was the song that took things off and made it happen.[00:09:50] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, I mean, Clive Davis, of course, you know, legendary, record men, you know, discovered Janice Joplin, Whitney Houston, Puffy, like you could say, he discovered all these people. they were, they were kind of there already, and, I sort of suspect they would've had their success even if it were not for Clive Davis.But, you know, that, we could debate that. But, know, Clive Davis certainly had an eye for talent, one way or the other. So, I mean, I think what's really fascinating too is, you know, you got think where Puffy was at that point in his life before he got that deal. He was shopping Bad Boy around right?To a bunch of different labels and it says so much about him and his whole ethos, the way he approached it, and this was another anecdote that I found in my reporting, by one of the founders of The Fader who happened to work at EMI at the time. He was in the room when Puffy brought the Bad Boy deal, to the folks at e Emmi and, you know, so like, just to refresh, here's Puff early twenties, just been fired.Just had his first kid, I think. And also, you know, he'd been a part of, this charity basketball tournament at City College where a bunch of people got, crushed in a stampede. He was ultimately found, you know, not guilty of any kind of criminal charges or anything, but his name was all over the papers.Like there's a lot of negative press around him. He was kind of, you know, almost radioactive at this point, or at least one might have thought that turned out he wasn't. But, so anyway, he goes into this meeting with e Emmi and, you know, Their big thing was, Vanilla Ice. And he sort of goes into this meeting and he's like, that dude's corny.Like, I have no interest in anything having to do with Vanilla Ice. Let me tell you how to run your business. And, you know, so he proceeds to like, give them this vision. And then at the end of it, I mean, and I'll read the quote cause it's just so good. he says, when you guys get in a room with all them suits and you're gonna decide what you're gonna pay Puff, just when you get to a number that you think is gonna make Puff happy, I love how he was referring to himself the third person, right?He says, get crazy on top of that. And then when you're there, I want whipped cream and a cherry on top. and this is the best part, he goes, I don't even want to think about the money. That shouldn't even be an issue. Don't be coming at me with no n-word money. Goodbye. And like that was vintage puff.Like that was billionaire Puffy. Before he was billionaire, before he even had. Like before we had a company. So, you know, I think there's just such a great lesson in there, which is kind of like, you know, the sort of, if you can pull off the, fake it till you make it, if you can have that kind of swagger. And to be fair, not available to everybody and like, you know, don't try this at home, kind of if you don't have it.But man, if you can pull that off, if you have that kind of confidence in yourself, you can accomplish some pretty incredible things. He didn't even, you know, end up going with EMI but I think he made a similar pitch at Arista and, you know, and that ultimately got him the deal, that created Bad Boy and, you know, that was really the engine for so much of, what he ended up achieving as the years went on.[00:12:46] Dan Runcie: That story is one of the reasons why he has lived on to become meed and in many ways become a bit of a gift himself. Whether you look at the Chappelle Show skit where, Dave Chappelle is making fun of making the band, and he has that whole sketch about, I want you to get me some Cambodian milk from a goat, or whatever it is.And it's something that sounds completely absurd, but one, it sounded like a lot of the shit that he would say in that MTV show make in the band. And it sounds exactly like that quote that you just shared from that story. The difference is he did this, whether it was for pure entertainment on a show like making the band or when there was really things at stake, like he was at this point when there wasn't a deal in place, he was recently fired.But regardless of whether he's up or down, trying to get it still the same guy.[00:13:39] Zack Greenburg: Absolutely. You know, and I think it just kind of goes to the point like, did he creates brands. He is the brand. He imbued the brand with his essence. And then the brand becomes that much more valuable, whether it's a brand that he can sell, you know, for some huge gain, or whether it's a brand that is compensating him, you know, handsomely for his association or in some cases both. That's kind of the formula and, you know, not everybody can pull it off because not everybody has a brand that is that clear.[00:14:11] Dan Runcie: And let's dig into this because I think this is one of the things that does set him apart. Denny used to be a club promoter as well. And this is a persona that we've seen oftentimes in music where the club promoter or the party promoter works their way up to then become the executive. You see it now with Scooter Braun, someone who's a billionaire now, or close to it in his own right.And he was a party promoter in Atlanta. You saw with Desiree Perez who now runs Roc Nation. She was a party and a club promoter before as well. And you've seen it plenty of times before and I think there's a few things there. There's a hustle and a relentlessness that you need to have to make that work.You need to create momentum around some of that isn't there. You need to understand and be tapped into what people want to hear and what people wanna do and how people wanna feel entertained and how they wanna leave from something feeling like, damn, I had a good time. We need to go do that again. And that is a lifestyle and what Puff did was aligned himself by building businesses that allowed him to do that. Some of those businesses worked better than others, but I think that is the key through line there. On the flip side, I do think that some of these operators and business leaders can often struggle with the bigger picture because there's so many more elements to building companies outside of the marketing brand promotion and those things, and I think we can get into some of that here because I think we saw some of those dynamics play out with Bad Boy as well.[00:15:39] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, for sure. And you know, I mean, I think one of the things about Bad Boy is it wasn't like this was the first record label to develop an ethos and kind of build a lifestyle around it. And, almost like, assembly line, right? I mean, Puffy was doing that himself at Uptown before he just took that same idea and, Pufified it even more.But, you know, I would kind of almost liken it to Motown. I mean, if you look at, Berry Gordy's role, I mean, you see Berry Gordy, credited as a producer on so many, of those songs and, you know, he wasn't like the only person in the room, producing right? he was putting together the right songwriters, the right musicians, everybody to be in the same place. And he was tying it all together with this kind of Motown ethos. And when, you know, when you had a Motown record coming out, you knew what it was. And I think that's why people in the old days used to be fan people would be fans of like, specific labels, right? They're like, I like the stuff that this label puts out, you know, I trust them. It's almost like, you know, I don't know, you know, Coachella sells out, even before the artists are announced because you know what you're gonna get if you like Coachella and you just trust that that's what's gonna happen. That's what it was like, Motown, that's what it's like with Bad Boy.So I think Diddy really followed that model that he was going to be the person, you know, sort of putting things together, you know, maybe he was going to, do a guest verse here and there. Maybe he was gonna be more involved in the production of this play of this song or another song. but it was really more in the vision and the ethos of the brand, the Bad Boy brand, what that looked like, what success looked like, you know, the Diddy version of success looked like maybe a little different from the Uptown Andre Herrell version. And, you know, it was like, like a little more swagger, like, you know, like a little more edge to it. And he was really able to kind of like, make that tangible. So, you know, I would keep going back to that as like something that sets him apart, you know, following the footsteps of the likes of Berry Gordy and[00:17:34] Dan Runcie: The Motown example is good because they also were able to maximize the most from the broader roster they had from the hits that they had Berry Gordy, of course, was famous for one artist on his record, has a huge deal. Okay, we're gonna get another artist on that record on that label to then do it again.You saw that with Aint' No Mountain High Enough. Marvin Gaye has his version that goes through the roof. Okay, let's get Diana Ross to do her own version, her own spin on it. That becomes a song in its own right. And you saw, did he do this to some extent with remixes? How one artist had the remix that worked out well.Okay, or one artist had the original song that worked out well, okay, let's get the remix now. Let's get the whole Bad Boy crew on this remix to go do their own verse and do this thing. They did that time and time again, and then in the early two thousands he had that album. We invented the remix, and there's plenty of debate on whether or not they actually did invent the remix, but that remix that they did of Flava in Ya Ear with, Craig Mack, and they had Biggie on that one as well. That is one of the more classic iconic remixes that people do go back to. And I think the other way that they're , similar too is some of the disputes that artists have had about pavements and things like that, which we can get into eventually.But that's always been the model. I think there in many ways, you're right, it's more like Motown than it is like uptown.[00:18:58] Zack Greenburg: for sure. And you know, on the Biggie point, I mean, people forget sometimes, but Biggie was originally signed to Uptown and Puffy had to go and get him back, and I think they were able to negotiate his release or his transfer of his deal from Uptown to Bad Boy for something like half a million dollars, which, you know, turned out to be, a pretty good deal all the way around.So, you know, he knew that sometimes he would have to shell out and, you know, he did from time to time. That certainly didn't stop there from being disputes, as time went on. But, you know, I think one of the other fascinating things is sort of this interplay, you know, he really walked this line, of sort of like, you know, the corner in the corner office, right?you know, the boardroom, and the street, and, he played up this sort of like lineage that he had of the Harlem gangster world like his dad, Melvin was an associate of Frank Lucas from, you know, the subject of American gangster. And you know, like his dad was known in Harlem. I think they called him, pretty Melvin.Like he was very flashy, you know, he always had the best suits and, you know, and all that kind of thing. But, you know, he definitely came from that sort of like grand gangster era. you know, Frank Lucas and Nick Barnes and all those guys. I mean, that was sort of Puffs lineage.And he definitely played up and he certainly played up, you know, sort of different sort of, street edge, you know, when things got heated in the Bad Boy Death Row situation. But at the same time, he never really wanted to go too deep into it.And I talked to somebody who sort of grew up around him, and he called him Jimmy Clean Hands, you know, because he didn't really want to get like, like he used the association. When it was sort of convenient, but also he didn't want to get too deeply associated, with that side of things.So, to me it's, a really fascinating tightrope walk, how he pulled it off. And, if he'd gone further, toward that side of things, I don't think that would've ended well for him. And if he hadn't gone quite as far as he might not have had, you know, a certain credibility or an edge that, you know, that contributed to so much of the success of Bad Boy, especially in those days.[00:21:04] Dan Runcie: And he did it at a time in the 90s when it was easier for hip hop stars to be able to control the narrative and push what they wanna push and not have other things cover or not have other things be uncovered, or all these internet rabbit holes. I could imagine him trying to do this 10, 15 years later, and it could be a situation like Rick Ross where all of a sudden there's photos of you as a correctional officer popping up on the internet and people are like, bro, what the hell's going on here?I thought every day you were hustling. I could have seen something like that happening the same way that Diddy, but by the time that plenty of people have had those debates about, oh, well, you know, Diddy was actually a kid that grew up in the suburbs and went to college and X, Y, Z, and there's plenty of ways that you could flip that story, but by the time that even became a discussion point, at least in circles where I heard him growing up, he was already an established star.So there was really nothing else that you could do at that point.[00:21:58] Zack Greenburg: yeah. And I guess he could walk that line because he really did kind of embody both, right? Like he was the son of a, you know, a Harlem gangster. he was born in Harlem. His dad was killed, you know, on I think Central Park West and 108th Street or something, you know, in a dispute a case of I think mistaken identity.I mean, so there were real, you know, tough things that, he was born into. And at the same time, he was also, you know, like the college dropout. Like you know, he went to school, he did his thing like, you know, you could say he was like a proto backpack rapper in some ways, like if you wanted to spin it that way.And he kind of embodied both of these worlds, but I think that really, if he hadn't actually lived both those lives, it would've been harder to sort of embody them simultaneously as he did.[00:22:47] Dan Runcie: And even in him, in his own right, there were many incidents that he had that people felt could have supported this narrative that he wanted to, for better or worse, whether it was the 1990 Club nightclub, the 1999 nightclub shooting after the Nas Hate Me Now Music video, him and his team going into Steve Stout's office and then, you know, assaulting him.And then everything that came up after that, or even as recently as within the past 10 years, the incident at UCLA with the coach yelling at his son. There's been plenty of things that have came up that show, you know, that the relentless, the temperament that could often work against his advantage as well.[00:23:26] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. I mean, you know, didn't he bash Steve Stout over the head with a champagne bottle or something? I mean, you know, but what's that line? We back friends like Puffy and Steve Stout, you know, like it, 50 cent had that line. I think he has a remarkable ability to, you know, to end up being sort of friendly with, people who he had these disputes with in the past.So, you know, whether, Steve Stout or, Shine or whoever, like, he finds, various ways to, sort of bridge divides in the end. I don't know how it turned out with the coach from, was it UCLA, or USC. But I suspect that's fine too. but yeah, he does find a way of patching things up.[00:23:59] Dan Runcie: No, he definitely has and we could talk a little bit more about some of the disputes that came with some of the artists, but I do wanna talk a bit about the business of Bad Boy itself and how it went about things. And one of the things that we saw from successful record labels, of course, Zach and I have done past conversations on Cash money, and Roc-A-Fella, and they'll always find innovative ways to work within their constraints or find ways to make things work even when you don't have all of the resources in the world.And one of the things that Bad Boy did was they really leaned into sampling and sampling hits from the eighties and making them the most successful things they could be. What's that line from that May song Making, taking hits from the eighties make 'em soundso Make it sound so crazy. Yeah.so they have their in-house production as well with hit men who then do most of the production, and they give you that Bad Boy sound that you can identify when you hear it immediately on a song, whether it's a total song or it's a one 12 song.And they were able to do that and that formula worked so well because you had this generation that grew up listening to those songs because their parents heard all those songs as well. These are black music classics and then they were able to repurpose them and because of the time and things weren't quite as oversaturated, it sounded quite authentic in a way where I think even some samples now can feel almost a bit forced because you can be like, okay, they're really trying to work that artist.And who knows? I might be also looking at this now, someone in my thirties as opposed to in the 90s, looking at it as someone that's growing up experiencing this. But still, I do think that there was a bit of like a authenticity and a vibe that they were able to create with each of those sample tracks.And plenty people tried to do it. Of course they didn't invent it. I know that Death Row and NWA, Dr. Dre had done it successfully before Diddy, but Diddy and Bad Boy were definitely able to put their own unique spin on making that as effective as it was.[00:25:57] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, definitely. I think, you know, I mean, I think to your point, but it, like it really opened up this sort of aspect of mainstream hip hop when, you know, maybe there were some radio stations that weren't gonna play some of these songs, but, you know, like a puffy song or a biggie song ordinarily, but, you know, if you have like, Oh, that's David Bowie in the background.Like I'm familiar with this. then, you might be sort of like more inclined to put it on the radio if you were a certain kind of dj, which then might reach a certain kind of listener who didn't, you know, ordinarily listen in hip hop and, you know, and you kind of have this, kind of snowball effect.you know, sure.[00:26:32] Dan Runcie: And then from a personal perspective, I'll be the first to admit the amount of songs that I had heard the first time as Bad Boy Version. And then growing up, you then later hear the original one that they sampled from the eighties or seventies, whatever Disco tracker, soul Tracker was, and you're like, oh, that's what that song was from.It's happened endless times and it continues to still happen.[00:26:54] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. I must confess, I heard I'll be missing you before, I heard I'll be watching you, so, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. you know, so yeah, and I think a lot of that narrative around the sort of peak Bad Boy sampling era, you know, I think it gets unfairly criticized as sort of being uncreative and like, you know, essentially just being cover and, not adding much to it.But, I disagree entirely, and I think that in addition to creating a different song with a different vibe and everything, you know, th those songs did introduce a whole generation of people, to eighties music that, you know, they may not have been alive to have heard, you know, from, you know, let's say I was born 85, some of these songs came out before I was born.So, yeah, I think that does get missed sometimes.[00:27:35] Dan Runcie: Yeah, and I'm in the same boat. I knew Juicy before. I knew the original Juicy Fruit. I knew Mase Bad Boy before I knew Hollywood Swinging, and I could go on and on with all the songs that they were able to help in introduce and connect the dots there. Another thing that I think Bad Boy did at this time that was a continuation of Uptown was how intentional and borderline maniacal Puff was about continuing that image.So, they had the Can't Stop Boat Stop documentary that came out a couple years ago. And the artist from one 12, which was the main male R&B group that Puff had signed to the record label at the time, they said that they were styled, dressed and personified to be an image of Puff themselves, to essentially be Puff as R&B singers, which was really interesting.And then on the more controversial side, which I don't think would ever fly in the same way today, Faith Evans, who was married to Biggie at the time, she was sent by Puff to go to tanning salons cuz she a light-skinned black woman. They sent her to tanning salons so that her skin can be darker because he wanted to be able to sell her as a certain image that would never fly again the same way today.But that's how Puff was. He was so maniacal, even things down to the nail color and things like that for women. He wanted to make sure that people looked a certain way.[00:29:01] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, and I think what's, you know, especially interesting when you, kind of zoom back on the 90s and that, that era of Bad Boys, you know, given the level of control he had over, you know, that level of detail, you know, the whole east coast, west coast thing, the whole Bad Boy Death Row thing obviously got way out of control.and, you know, culminating in, the desert of big and pop and you know, obviously we don't know exactly who was behind each of those things, but it's, you know, still kind of debate to this day. But, the fact is that, you know, got kind of wrapped up in this kind of, know, sort of thing, like the fact that Puffy could bring Bad Boy back from that, and kind of like continue to have the same brand, you know, after everything that went down, you know, I think is another testament to like the identity of the brand, right? I mean, you know, cuz I remember in that period of time hip hop was really under fire from, you know, so, you know, like the Tipper Gores of the world and the parental advisories and all that, and there was this narrative of like, oh, this music is dangerous.And there was a whole period of time, you know, after everything that went down, in the mid to late 90s, like there were questions like, is hip hop? You know, really a viable commercial genre? Are brands really gonna want to be attached to this? you know, because of the violence that happened, you know, really publicly there.And I think, you know, whether you love him or hate him, like, I think he deserves some credit for pulling things back from the brink. you know, regardless of whatever role he played in getting them, to the brink, but he really did kind of pull things back from the brink and show that hip hop could be this, you know, commercial force.you know, that would be like a mainstream success sort of thing. And really pretty quickly, after all this went down,[00:30:39] Dan Runcie: If you go back to winter 96, the height of this beef, you have that infamous vibe cover with Tupac, Dr. Dre Snoop, and Suge Knight. They're there, the Beef and Bad Boy and, Biggie as well. Were on respective vibe covers as well. If you asked people, okay, five, 10 years from now, which of these two record labels will be in the stronger position, you probably would've put your money on Death Row.To be frank, they had the better artists just from like a roster perspective. With those four, the leadership seemed in many ways quite as strong and there were similarities there as well. You had these two relentless, large and life figures. Granted, Suge and Puff are very different in a lot of ways, but that's where you would've taken things.But then two years later, it's a completely different story. Death Row is imploding and bad Boy had the biggest year that any record label has ever had. If you look back at that 1997 to 1998 stretch, and this is after the death of the biggest rapper as well, they end up releasing Biggie's second album, Life After Death, ironically, 16 days after he passed away.And then Puff himself becomes this larger than life icon. He releases his own album, Puffy, P uff Daddy, the Family, No Way Out. And they continue to go on this run. And in many ways, as other heads and other figures in hip hop have faded and necessarily taken their own path, he continued to stay on that.It really is a remarkable journey when you look at each of those steps in it, because I probably would've put my money on Death Row if I didn't know better.[00:32:21] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, Yeah, I mean, it sure felt that way, right? I mean, but if you kinda, if you compare the leadership, if you compare Puffy to Suge, you know, I think that so much of, you know, the back and forth between Bad Boy and Death Row, you know, it was a case of like, these guys were playing a role, right?I mean, they were, it is funny in some of my reporting, people say like, both Puffy and Suge, especially Suge, were sort of, it was like they were acting in their own bad gangster movie. And I think the main difference was, you know, Suge really came to believe it and live it in a way, that Diddy, didn't quite do it you know, as we were saying before, Diddy kind of walked that line.but Suge just kind of got deeper and deeper into it, and that was kind of who he was, you know, all the time. So, you know, that there's not really like, kind of like a way to, back out, you know, to kind of come up for air when you, when you've kind of like gotten that deep into it like Suge did. I think that was the main difference, you know? I mean, I think he became just completely, you know, is like possessed by this image that he created for himself. And he started to live it, you know, all the time and Diddy's ability to sort of walk the line and step back, you know, I think that's what ultimately kept Bad Boy in the position that, you know, that stayed and kept him in the position that he continued to be in.in[00:33:42] Dan Runcie: And everything that went down to that 1995 Source Awards is a perfect example about how they dealt with this whole thing. Suge and Death Row, famously win Best soundtrack for Above the Rim. He goes up, accepts the award, and he makes the infamous line. If you wanna sign with the label, you don't wanna have your executive producer all on the record, all on the video dancing come to Death Row, and then you see.Puff is there just looking, not saying anything, but everyone knows who he's talking about. But then later on the night Puff goes and is on the mic, he doesn't go necessarily take a shot back at Suge, but he just makes some type of more global statement, Hey, we're all in this together. I forget Puff's exact quote, but that's a perfect example of this, right?Of knowing that line cuz as we know, puff had a temper. Puff wasn't afraid to throw down in the moments, right? But he knew that in that stage, in that setting, especially even on his home turf, this was all the West Coast guys coming there because, you know, there was that famous scene of Snoop Dogg standing up being like, East Coast ain't got no love for Dr. Dre and Snoop.That's my horrible Snoop dog voice there. But Puff was cool, calm, collected during all of that, and as you put it, the difference behind the difference between the two of them is more than puff deciding to be all the video and should not be in, the video. The same way it was everything that you explained it more.And that is one of the biggest reasons, I think for that difference. And what helped Bad Boys essentially be even stronger, unfortunately. So after Big's death,[00:35:21] Zack Greenburg: yeah, totally. And you know, I think with Puff, he ultimately. He had that calm, cool, collected side to him that came out, you know, I think at, helpful points, but he was ultimately about, you know, protecting the bag, right? Like Diddy is a business, he is the business. And he, knows that he has to kind of keep that in mind.And I think, you know, Suge on the other hand just kind of like got too deep in his own narrative and couldn't kind of like poke his head up over the clouds and see the view from, you know, 35,000 feet or whatever. So, I think Diddy's business sense, you know, I think ultimately helped keep him, keep him, you know, just above the fray.So, still super remarkable when you look at it. He threw that first white party in 1998. That was really, that was what, like a year, a year after Biggie was killed. And, you know, just to give you an idea of the kind of stuff that was going down. I mean, he bought this house in East Hampton, and he decided that he was gonna throw the most exclusive party people just to give the background.I did some reporting on this too, but like, it apparently if you got invited to the white party and Puffy's White party, you could not get in If you wore like a cream suit, they'd throw you out. If you had, like a blue stripe on your white shirt, they would throw you out.So you had like grown men running home to get like an all white proper shirt to go to these parties. And you know, like pretty quickly you had Martha Stewart and Howard Stern and Donna Koran and like, Donald Trump used to go to these parties, you know, with his daughter everything. So, it was kind of like a who's who of like a certain type of celebrity in the late 90s.And to go from, you know, from the depths of the East coast, West coast thing to that, in like a year. I think it just shows how Puffy's able to kind of flip things around and that's what he was able to do with Bad Boy. He pivoted the whole narrative and suddenly it was about Puff Daddy, the family.It was about, you know, Godzilla soundtrack and, you know, doing the thing with an orchestra and Jimmy Page and whatever. And, you know, singing, he's able to like recreate himself and also these brands like Bad Boy that's created in his image. you know, like in a remarkably quick timeframe, I think.[00:37:38] Dan Runcie: And to share some numbers on this era. This is peak Bad Boy. I would say this whole 97 to 1999 stretch. 1999, they sold 130 million worth of records. And for some context there, that was more than Madonna's Maverick label had that year. And this was, or Madonna, during that whole Ray of Light era, if I'm remembering the timeline, and Beautiful Stranger, if I remember the timeline correctly and more than Def Jam had at its peak that year, and this was, we did the Def Jam pod recently.This was around the same time that Lyor was trying to get X and Jay-Z to release those albums in the same year, and Bad Boy was still doing its thing then they're Puff Daddy and the Family Tour. They went on their own arena tour, they made 15 million that year, and Puff was starting to extend himself in the same way that we saw other moguls do the same.We talked in the Roc-A-Fella episode about, this was the time that Dame Dash had started to have different partnerships in film and district and sports and things like that. We saw Master P as well in the late 90s get his hand involved with a number of things. And one of the things that stuck out from this era is that Sean, is that, did he actually made a partnership with Johnny Cochran at the time, who was his attorney during all of the drama that he had in the late 90s after that nightclub shooting. And they started a management business that was gonna be focused on NBA players. And this just gives you an idea of all of the things that he was interested at the time.So it really is remarkable. And a lot of it came because Diddy himself was putting himself out there. He became the brand, it was him putting it on, and he really became the most successful artist on this label. But around this time, if you start talking to some of the other artists on the label, they start to get a bit frustrated because they feel it's no longer about their development.It is now about Puff building and doing everything for himself.[00:39:36] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, and I think that's when you know, he really starts to have all these brand extensions and, you know, you can see there's actually, I think the first Forbes cover on a hip hop artist was Puffy in 1999. And, it was a celebrity issue. And they had, Puffy and Jerry Seinfeld on the cover together, which always cracks me up.But, you know, Seinfeld's wearing this suit and Puffy's got this like Sean John denim t-shirt on. you know, just like a walking advertisement on the front of this magazine, which is just brilliant. And, you know, so he is got that going. He's like opening restaurants, you know, and like really kind of like realizing that, he could be not only the sort of the straw that stirs the drink and like the producer and whoever behind the scenes, but also the, you know, the main artist.And you know, I can imagine that being another artist on Bad Boy at this point, could start to get a little frustrating.[00:40:28] Dan Runcie: Right. And I think he had a quote around the time he wanted to be David Geffen. He wanted to be bigger than David Geffen. And of course this was Pete Geffen making moves with Dreamworks and everything else. Still being, in many ways, music's prominent mogul. That was due his thing there. And this was around the same time that we have another quote from, Andre Harrell.And I remember if you mentioned earlier, or if I mentioned earlier, there were some other quotes at the time that were less favorable than Diddy, than the ones that Harrell ended up having later. This was one of them. He said, and this was in a New York Times 1999 interview. He, Puff, gotta separate the young man thing from the business thing.If there's an incident where the situation is going in a way that he feels slighted or disrespected, the only way for him to handle it is as if he was a 45 year old IBM, CEO, which is a very interesting way. But he's essentially saying, Hey, you gotta change your act based on where you're going and where things are.And this is, that trending the line that we're talking about that I think that Diddy was eventually able to get to. But there was still some question marks about that and the trajectory in 1999. But to some extent, I think that kind of played to as factor. There was something about, especially some of those celebrities you mentioned, these are some more buttoned up, you know, white celebrities that never really did much on a, anything that was risky.So someone that has the image of Puff at that time, it's like, Ooh, I'm doing this risky thing. It's almost like the person in high school that wants to date the Bad Boy literally called his label bad voice. So they're leading into that whole persona, and I think it worked a bit to his advantage there as well.[00:42:07] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, totally. And you know, another thing people talk about, you know, I think that this time, and a lot of times I think there's a lot of jealousy going around and, you know, Puffy does this, puffy does that. But, know, one of the things that I, that I've always heard is that, Like, yeah, he's the last one at the club and you know, he's always out and, doing whatever, but he's also the, first one in, like, he outworks everybody and you know, he's somehow manages on, you know, like a couple hours of sleep at night or something.I mean, this is another thing you sometimes hear about fantastically successful people. I hear about this, about like Richard Branson and other people too, that they just can operate on four hours of sleep or something like that. And man, you know, I mean, if you think about it, if you have that much confidence and you're that brilliant, and then also you get an extra four hours a day, you know, you get another, was it, 28 hours a week, you get like an extra day every week basically to just like do shit.that's pretty hard to, contend with. I mean, like an extra day, like two extra waking days, to get things done. I mean, that, that's a pretty big advantage.[00:43:13] Dan Runcie: That was a whole 90s mentality from, overall, from people that were successful. Now that I'm thinking about it, cuz of course Richard Branson, that the 90s was a transformational decade for him. You are Bill Clinton, especially when he was president, talk about getting four or five hours of sleep at night, still being able to operate and do his thing.Even folks like Madeline Albright, who worked for him and in his cabinet were doing the same thing. And even someone like Kobe Bryant, there's that memorable. A piece of the Redeem Team documentary that came out on Netflix last year, where the younger guys at the time, LeBron, Bosh, Wade, were all going out to the club.Were all gonna go out for the night because that Olympics was in Beijing and they're coming back from the club and Kobe's on his way to the gym in the morning. And then Kobe spoke about this himself as well. He is like, no, I'm gonna do another practice to wake up earlier than everyone else. So you think about how this compounds over time, and that's what you're saying about how that essentially gives you two, three extra days a week.You do that time and time again, and just how much better you get. Granted the fact that those people can still do that while not requiring that much sleep. I know. I mean, I couldn't do that myself. I need those hours of sleep, but I commend those people that can.[00:44:25] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. I mean, and who knows, you know, from a health perspective, how it affects you, you know, sort of like later in life and whatever. And, you know, do you lose more years of your life on the tail end because you didn't sleep more earlier? I mean, I guess we'll never really know, and it's hard to kind of pull out the factors and really test that. But in any case, you know, it does give a decided advantage, at least in the, present tense. And, he really kind of like worked with that. but you know, I mean, and then just when you thought that he was kind of out of the woods, with the specter of violence, you know, again, 1999, there's the whole thing in the club, a gun goes off, you know, there's this whole like, situation, Diddy and Shine are in the club. There's this dispute, whatever, and you know, who knows what really happened, but at the end of it, Shine went off to go to jail. And, you know, and Diddy ended up, you know, without really any kind of anything other than like, a little bit of reputational hit.So, I think that, you know, he continued to walk that line, right? And there were just these instances kept popping up. But once again, he always managed to sort of, you know, avoid any really serious repercussions and then, you know, go on to some even bigger and better commercial thing, shortly thereafter, you know, which he did eventually with Ciroc and, what have you.But, you know, it didn't really seem to hurt anything with Bad Boy. Although I think around that time, you know, his career as a solo artist started faltering a little bit to be sure[00:45:42] Dan Runcie: And I think this is a good time to talk about the proverbial Bad Boy curse that's been discussed. There are a number of artists that have had their issues with Bad Boys, specifically with Diddy in terms of whether they feel like they were fairly compensated for things. And it's artists like Faith Evans 112, Mark Curry, and the Locks as well as most recently as a couple years ago, Mase famously people that have publicly claimed to try to get what's theirs called out Diddy for not doing certain things.And then on the flip side, you have people that surrounded themselves with Diddy, and Diddy was the one that came out, scott free, and they were the ones that ended up in challenges and some of that Diddy benefited from by associating himself with them, but they didn't necessarily work outta that same way.You of course mentioned Shine, who, his career never really took off after he had that brief moment where that Bad Boy song came out. I think that was in 2000. They had sampled that, the Barrington Levee reggae song and then had him on that. But you had a few instances like that. I look back on one of my favorite songs from The Bad Boy era.let's Get It with G. Dep and Black Rob. And the sad part about that song is that you have G. Dep, the first person that was. Or essentially his lead single, he's saying that he's saying, or he did special delivery as well. G. Dep eventually ended up being locked up for a murder that he had done in the 90s, but then it had some run-ins after that Black Rob unfortunately passed away a few years ago, and I don't think was ever really able to capture that momentum after Whoa. And a few of the other songs he had with Bad Boy had come out. And then of course you had Diddy who, you know, is still thriving doing his thing.And I think that's true as well. You look at an artist like Lone who l kind of had his moment where they were trying to make lone really be a thing, especially with the, I need a girl, part one and part two, but then Loon as well, ends up getting locked up. I think there was a heroin charge or something like that.So all of these folks that were around Diddy in some way ended up having their challenges. Not all of them, but some of them.[00:47:50] Zack Greenburg: For sure. And I think, you know, probably around this time, you know, the sort of like the turn of the millennium was, you know, the moment, when did he kind of realize that he had to, he did have to start figuring out his next step. And if it wasn't gonna be him, as an artist, you know, and it wasn't gonna be somebody else on his roster, it was gonna have to be something else. And so I think this is sort of like when you think about the Bad Boy era, you know, I don't know, I think about it as sort of like early 90s to late to, you know, to really the end of the decade. And although, you know, of course it went on and it continues to stay at different, you know, sort of capacities.It's like that was sort of the prime era. And, I think once the fortunes of the label became too closely intertwined with Diddy's as a solo artist, then when he stopped being such a big deal as a solo artist, the prospects of the of Bad Boy itself were a little bit more limited.[00:48:45] Dan Runcie: Agreed. Question for you. Do you think that, well, lemme take a step back. In the Cash Money episode that we talked about not just the disputes people have had with Birdman and Slim over the years, over disputes, but also the notorious reputation that they've built up. Do you feel like the reputation with Puff is similar in that way?And if it's different, why do you think so?[00:49:09] Zack Greenburg: So you mean Puff like the Cash Money sort of similarly having trouble paying people?[00:49:13] Dan Runcie: Yeah, Yeah, and whether that reputation has stuck with Puff the same way that it's clearly stuck with Bert and Slim.[00:49:21] Zack Greenburg: I think they both have, you know, or rather the three of them, I think it does follow them around, but in different ways. I mean, I think, I think with cash money, there's some element of it that's like, well, you know, I think their response to a lot of it is this stuff began when, you know, the things weren't properly papered up and, you know, nobody really knew how these things worked and blah, blah, blah.And you know, you can sort of agree with that or not, right? Or maybe you could say it is to some extent your responsibility to make sure things are paid up, you know, once you become that successful. but, you know, I think that Puff was sort of like, you know, Bad Boy was, done through Clive through real estate.It was done through a major label, sort of from the beginning. And, you know, I think you could argue actually that that's why Cash Money was ultimately worth more, like, was like a bigger source of the Williams Brothers wealth than Bad Boy ever was, for Diddy. And he had to go, you know, do these other things. But you know, like it wasn't as though there were no lawyers involved. It wasn't as though there wasn't some big record label apparatus. There absolutely was. And you know, so I, think that excuse sort of like, doesn't fly quite as much. it's probably not leveled quite as much with him either, but, you know, but it's definitely there and, it's sort of like, it's hard to look past it in some regards.[00:50:41] Dan Runcie: Yeah. I think that one of the reasons why I think the public image of it is different is because of the businesses that the two are involved in. Bird man's a music man almost in the same way that Clive Davis is a music man. That's what we know him as even in the conversation you had shared last time where you were doing this extensive feature profile with them on Forbes and you were gonna have another follow-up conversation with him that night, and he's like, no, no.Bird Man's still in the studio. He's doing his thing like that's what he wants to do versus Puff has his interest in all these other areas, beverages, spirits, sports, entertainment, now with Revolt or Sean John, or whatever it is. So there's so many more things we know him as, or he's running the New York City marathon, he's trying to launch this thing, and all of those things can broaden your image of him.So if you hear a complaint about the one particular aspect of this business, that's one area of what he's doing, as opposed to us knowing Bird and Slim as. The owners of this record label, and now there's a dispute with the one thing that we know them for.[00:51:49] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. Okay. I see what you mean. So it's sort of like, in a way it's less central like the music is less central to his identity, therefore we hear less about the disputes because we just hear less about the music side overall.[00:52:01] Dan Runcie: Right.[00:52:02] Zack Greenburg: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, and then, when you look at what happened to Bad Boy, you know, even just from a corporate perspective, it was a 2005, he sold 50% of it to Warner for 30 million bucks, something like that.So, obviously that, means, you know, by those numbers it was worth 60 million. At the time there was probably just the recorded music side and there was publishing as well, which is separate. I think you did some other publishing deals too, but you know, that number in 2005, I mean, I'm sure that's lower than.Cash money was valued at in 2005. But, you know, he just kind of made the decision to pull some money off the table, right? And I think that says some, something about his priorities too, that he wasn't that focused on the music side of things. So, you know, like, let's make this deal and then move on, to the next thing.And I think a couple years after that was when he launched Ciroc or, you know, came on with Ciroc and launched his Ciroc campaign presence, whatever you wanna call it. you know, partnership thing. So, I think ultimately for Bad Boy, you know, I think it had a peak that was as high as really, you know, any label, in hip hop did.But its fortunes became so wrapped up with Puffy that once, once he moved away from music, it's like, how are you ever really gonna come back from that?[00:53:15] Dan Runcie: Right. It really wasn't a business it was a business, but almost in the same way that a lot of people that are creators now and trying to do things, there's this ongoing discussion or debate they have about whether are you trying to build a business with a roster around you, or is this more so a soul entity?And I think Bad Boy definitely saw both of those things, but you normally seen in the flip side where you start with the lead person being known as the thing, and then they add the roster around them. But Bad Boy was kind of the opposite, where you had this roster and then it becomes the lead person becoming more known for the thing.[00:53:48] Zack Greenburg: And I think it moved away from that assembly line idea, you know, the Motown thing, the Coachella thing, whatever, you know, you're gonna, buy the tickets for, you know, who's there. It just became all about Puff and, you know, I think in a way he realized it was more lucrative that way, right? N o matter how involved he was in however many different pro projects as sort of the, the Berry Gordy, he could make more, you know, for himself being Puff. And in a way, when you look at Ciroc, it's like, you know, it's the same thing, right? Like he's selling the Art of celebration. He's selling his brand of success. He just doesn't have to sign other artists to it, you know? So I see has Ciroc Boys, you know, that's, I mean, it is almost like a record label to some extent, you know, if you like an extension of, Bad Boy. If you think about, you know, the different artists who are kind of like involved on some level, you know, over the years with that brand, it just, you don't have to get involved in like publishing and, you know, licensing and mechanical royalties and all of that fun stuff.[00:54:50] Dan Runcie: Right. And I think with that it's a good chance to talk about some of these categories we have here. So what do you think is the best signing that Bad Boy did?[00:54:59] Zack Greenburg: I think a hundred percent, you gotta go with Biggie, no doubt. I mean, you know, if you're calling the signing $500,000 to get him over from uptown, you know, plus whatever they ended up paying him. I mean, you think about the success of Life after Death and all the other albums and, you know, the albums that, were sort of in the hopper after he died.I mean, I think hard to top that.[00:55:19] Dan Runcie: Agreed. Yeah, No debates there. That was the same one. What do you think is the best business move to come from Bad Boy?[00:55:26] Zack Greenburg: I would, I would argue that, I would argue Sean John because, you know, in creating the Bad Boy image, that was, you know, really bankrolled like all those videos, obviously Bankrolled by Arista, bankrolled by, you know, the, parent company, you know, Puffy created this aura around himself, which was very fashion oriented.And then he was able to parlay that into creating, you know, an actual fashion brand that he owned, or at least, you know, partially owned and himself, which then generated hundreds of billions of dollars. And then he sold and got, you know, whatever it was, a hundred million dollars and he bought it back.but anyway, he did really well for himself. I think with the help of this shine that was kind of like given or enabled at least, by a Bad Boy.[00:56:13] Dan Runcie: Yeah, I think that's a good one. The other thing that I wanna give some love to, that we haven't talked about much yet, but was the Bad Boy Street team and how they went about promoting and pushing their records all over the major cities. A lot of people may think that Bad Boy invented to the street team.I think I still do give loud of records credit for that, but Bad Boy did take things to another level, and this goes back to Puff and his strength as a promoter. This is what Club promoters do. This is how you push and get the word out there. So he's able to replicate himself. He's able to empower the people to feel like they're part of Bad Boy himself and making sure that they're styled in the same way, to be able to help sell that same image that Puff wants to sell himself.And you saw him replicate this as well with Ciroc Boys and things like that. And shout out to Sean Perez, who worked with Puff at Bad Boy and on Ciroc on this same strategy.[00:57:07] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. Although, you know, it was a great one, and a great strategy, but it didn't always work. What's the line? I felt like Bad Boys Street team, I couldn't work. the locks.True.[00:57:19] Dan Runcie: Yeah. Usually worked. But yeah, they just needed to see the vision as they said. what's the best dark horse move? You have a good one for this.[00:57:27] Zack Greenburg: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Okay. maybe a little controversial. I don't know. I'm gonna go shine. Because if Paul hadn't signed Shine, I mean, I don't know, you know, I'm not a lawyer or anything, but, all I know is that something went down in that