Code 3 - The Firefighters' Podcast

This edition of Code 3 is a little different than most.It's about a Fire Chief who lost his job after he incurred the wrath of the UnionLocal's officials and, ultimately, the IAFF. Scott Freitag was the chief of the Central Arizona Fire and Medical Authority, orCAFMA. The agency was created under Scott's leadership when two fire districts combined undera JMA to form CAFMA in 2015.CAFMA covers 365 square miles of territory of Yavapai County, Arizona. And it servesabout 100,000 residents from 12 stations.One day in August 2024, a press release showed up in email inboxes saying that theIAFF had censured Scott Freitag by a vote of 2,520 to 0. Iwas pretty startled to get this news because I know Scott Freitag to be anhonest, decent Fire Chief who was genuinely concerned about the welfare of hisfirefighters.As you'll hear, the no-confidence vote led to Scott's firing after 11 years asFire Chief in September 2024.How this all went down depends on whose story you believe. It may well have hadlittle to do with firefighting and much more to do with politics and a healthplan.

Are you tired of being told to “think outside the box?”Well, if you are, I have good news: today's show is about thinking inside thebox.It's about looking at structures as a series of boxes, determining which box has theactive fire in it, and how to attack that fire. Boxes determine flow path inlarge modern residential structures.It's an interesting idea, and it was developed for the Plano, Texas fire departmentby Eric Wahlberg, a 30-year veteran of Fire/Rescue and an assistantchief. He is also a Master Firefighter with the state of Texas.

One of the first tools you were taught about when you started this job is the basic groundladder.Once you learned how to throw one, it was no big deal, right? The longer the ladder, the more firefighters get to carry it. Except…What if there's not enough people on the fireground to do that?You might be surprised to find that the 24-foot extension ladder can safely be carried and placed by just one firefighter. Now, a lot of understaffed fire departments, especially volunteers, already know this. But if you started at a fully-staffed department, you may not have had to throw a ladder this size alone.Today's guest runs seminars on the use of ground ladders, and this is one of his favorite topics.Kevin Weis started his career in the fire service in 2012 as a volunteer firefighter in Coldwater, Ohio. He's been on the career side since 2014, starting in Defiance, Ohio. In 2020, he moved to the Glendale, Arizona Fire Department. Kevin's currentlya firefighter/ paramedic and specializes in TRT & Haz Mat. He's also been afire inspector. He teachesseveral hands-on-subjects, including searchtactics, forcible entry, hose line management, and of course, ground ladders.

One of the least exciting jobs for a firefighter is the dreaded Community Risk Reduction assignment.In an urban environment, CRR may mean doing a meeting with the people you serve. Or maybe you're changing smoke alarm batteries.Either of those—not exciting, but not so much work, either.But if your department covers urban and rural areas, where you could be tasked to fight a brush fire, well, now you may have to do some physical labor ... plus those meetings.Not all, or even many, departments have dedicated crews to community risk reduction. Often, CRR is one person, whose job may include other responsibilities.Today, I'm talking with one of our favorite guests, Chad Costa, about what CRR can do for your community…and what you can get out of it, too.Chad is assistant fire chief for the Petaluma, California, fire department. He has over 25 years on the job.

Incident commanders, here are some questions for you:How much thought do you put into where you set up your command post?Is it usually on the alpha side of a structure? Why is that? Routine? Street access?What about distractions? For example, noise. That can not only give you a headache but also make you miss an urgent radio call, right?My guest on this edition of Code 3 has been considering questions like this for a while. He has suggestions for things to think about the next time you pull up to the fireground and are ready to drop that tailgate.Robby Bergerson is the executive deputy chief of the Waco, Texas Fire Department. He's got three decades in the fire service, having served in every rank and supervising every division. He's also a credentialed Chief Fire Officer through CPSE.

This week's show is related to last week's. If you haven't heard episode 344 with Jennifer Stanislaw, go ahead and listen to it—it dovetails nicely with this one.On this episode, we're talking about the importance of setting standards for probie training.Years ago, that training consisted of handing the probie a mop as often as a ladder. It was designed to “teach a solid work ethic.”But just as hazing has (mostly) faded away in the firehouse, new firefighters expect better training on the techniques they'll need in the field. Their bosses expect them to know those tactics as well.That's why today's guest says it's important to set the bar for probies and keep raising it. He has some ideas of how to do that.Jesse Marcotte is the training chief for the Northville Township, Michigan Fire Department. He is a member of the UL FSRI Training Advisory Committee. And he served as a board member of the ISFSI.He also spoke on today's topic at FDIC 2024.

Firefighters around the country are looking at the possibility of a new OSHA ruling very carefully.I'm talking about the two-in/two-out rule, contained in NFPA 1500.There's a new report written by five prominent members of the fire service that says two-in/two-out doesn't make firefighters any safer. Instead, the time wasted waiting for a RIC crew to get ready makes it more likely that civilian victims will be killed.The report uses data from Project Mayday to support this claim. It points out that when firefighters die in the line of duty, it isn't usually in a mayday situation.It also says that if a mayday is called, it's more likely that another interior crew member will make the save. The rule is routinely circumvented by departments that need to get inside a building but don't have enough people on the fireground to do it.An OSHA ruling would add some enforcement teeth to NFPA 1500. The report's titled, “Removing Two-In/Two-Out: A Modern, Data-supported Defense of Our Core Mission." It was written by Bill Carey, Sean Duffy, Nick Ledin, Chris Thompson and Scott Thompson.Sean Duffy is acting as the PIO for the group and spoke to me about the report.

From Day One in the fire service, the lecture is the standard teaching method. Sometimes, it seems like fire departments must keep Microsoft in business, what with all the PowerPoint software they must be ordering.And you know the instruction -- notice I didn't say “learning” – keeps going like this until you retire. Want to be a Battalion Chief? There's a lecture and PowerPoint for that. An Engineer? Yep, got it covered. Captain? Of course.Now, I know the fire service doesn't like change. As Chief Brunacini said, "Firefighters hate two things—change and the way things are now.”But maybe it is time to teach differently. If you've ever lectured to a room full of Millennials or Gen Z, you know they don't get much out of it. They're on their phones.Here to explore some fresh ideas for teaching is Jennifer Stanislaw.She heads up the West Salem, Oregon, High School Emergency Services Program. She also has over 25 years of experience as a paramedic and volunteer firefighter.

Every firefighter who rides an engine has a favorite tool: The Halligan Bar. As nearly all young firefighters learn, it was invented in 1948 by an FDNY Deputy Chief named Hugh Halligan.Not long after that, he created the Halligan Hook. Sometimes it's called a New York Roof Hook.This six-foot bar is a favorite of truckies who need to open up roofs.But there's another way to use the Halligan Hook: as a rescue tool. It takes a little creativity to see a bar meant for ripping open a roof as a way to save a firefighter's life. Today's guest is here to explain how to do it.AB Turenne is the captain of training and safety with a career department in Middlesex County, Connecticut. He's got 25 years on the job and is a certified Level III Fire Service Instructor.

If you were among those fortunate enough to be in the audience at the opening of FDIC 2024, you heard something special.I'd say it was a call to arms… a call to take revolutionary action.Chief David Rhodes spoke for about a half-hour, laying out a case for change in the fire service.His main argument: that the fire service has become too risk-averse. That the leaders of departments are so afraid of injuries—and of course, lawsuits—that they don't want firefighters to take any risks on the fireground.Or even in training.He said that puts citizens in danger. And he said that change needs to happen, from the bottom up. It sure won't come from the top down.Here to discuss that with me is David Rhodes.Chief Rhodes had nearly four decades in the fire service when he retired from the Atlanta, Georgia Fire Department. He currently serves as the Editor in Chief of Fire Engineering magazine. He's also the Educational Director for FDIC.

Fire departments around the U.S. are approaching a tipping point.At the same time career departments are seeing a drop in applicants, they're also losing existing firefighters.This is a problem. Once upon a time, not so long ago, it was tough to get a job in the fire department.But now, fewer people line up for those spots. Maybe it's generational, maybe it's just a natural cycle and it'll change.Or maybe it's something more.Here to discuss that with me is Dr. Reggie Freeman.He's the chief risk officer for the HAI Group, based in Cheshire, Connecticut. He's served as the fire chief of three departments: Oakland, California, Hartfort, Connecticut and Lockheed Martin Aeronautics. He's also a member of the board of directors of the NFPA.

There's a constant battle between firefighters who believe that safety on the fireground precludes aggressive tactics.The opposite is also true.What's the compromise between the two?It seems as if firefighters don't believe that it's possible to be both aggressive and safe. It is, of course, and my guest today is here to offer some suggestions about how you can implement both.He's no wimp—he puts Mrs. Smith first, his crew second, and his own personal safety third.Ryan Scellick is a Captain at the City of Pasco Fire Department, in Washington State. He is the co-owner of Young Officers on Fire which puts on annual conferences, trainings, and manages a national non-profit mentorship group.

What's potentially harder to locate victims in than a hoarder house?A stuffed-full self-storage locker.But that's exactly what can happen. And even if the victim's not inside at the time of the fire, their activities may have caused it.Those storage spaces are frequently climate-controlled, and they're cheap…maybe $100 a month for a small one. That makes them seem like a great place to live for someone who can't afford to rent an apartment.They aren't, of course, and occupants who choose to try living in one can become the victim of a fire they can't escape.This week, my guest tells us about his experiences with homeless people who tried to make a storage unit home…and regretted it.Tim Thompson is chief of the Georgetown, Kentucky Fire Department. He's worked his way up over 19 years of service from firefighter to the boss. He's also a member of the Kentucky Association of Fire Chiefs.

Are you ready for this?There's a whole class of hazardous chemicals that can damage your hearing, and they're by-products of your average structure fire.Yes, that's right: When you burn home furnishings, you don't just get carcinogens. You get “ototoxic” chemicals. Now, the PPE you wear routinely for firefighting protects against this.But—just like the stuff in smoke that causes cancer—ototoxic chemicals are a threat when you least expect them: during overhaul and even standing outside a burning structure.And when you combine exposure to ototoxins with screaming sirens and fireground noise, well, it's no surprise that firefighters are often retiring with substantial hearing loss.Here to tell you what you need to know is Brian Daboul. He's chief of the Mine Hill Fire Department in New Jersey. That's a volunteer department, and Brian's paid job is in occupational safety strategy and program development. He is also the owner of BGD Safety and Compliance, LLC, which serves industry and fire departments.

A recent study done at North Carolina State University took a look at PFAS chemicals used in turnout gear and came to some interesting conclusions.PFS layers are what give current turnout coats and pants their oil and water repellency.They're also a known carcinogen, so donning PPE made with PFAS is dangerous even before you step onto your engine or truck. Unfortunately, when the study looked at alternatives, it found that all oil repellents can also repel water, but all water repellents don't necessarily repel oil. My guest on this show is Bryan Ormond, an assistant professor of textile engineering, chemistry and science at NC State. He also wrote up the results of the study.

Oneof the best ways to learn anything is by experience.Abetter way, though, is to learn from others' experiences. That'swhy we're talking with today's guest—to get some insight from someone wholearned the hard way.CaptainJeremiah King has been with the Central Arizona Fire and Medical Authority formore than 20 years.Butthe story of this response takes place when he was about four years into his career.Andas you'll hear, that career—not to mention, his life—nearly came to an end onenight on a structure fire in a large home.One of the best ways to learn anything is by experience.A better way, though, is to learn from others' experiences. That's why we're talking with today's guest—to get some insight from someone wholearned the hard way.Captain Jeremiah King has been with the Central Arizona Fire and Medical Authority formore than 20 years.But the story of this response takes place when he was about four years into his career.And as you'll hear, that career—not to mention, his life—nearly came to an end onenight on a structure fire in a large home.

Anyone who has ever fought a wildland fire knows situational awareness is critical to safety and effectiveness on the fireground.But visibility, a key part of that awareness, is often limited by thick smoke in the wildland fire environment.Call it the fog of war, if you like.No matter what you call it, it's tough to fight a fire when you can't see through the smoke.That lack of visibility can lead to all kinds of trouble—especially vehicle accidents.Today, in this special edition of Code 3, we'll explore one commercial product that can make the wildland environment safer for firefighters.It's called Hypersight, built by RPX Technologies. It's a tough, vehicle-mounted thermal imaging camera. It allows the crew in the cab to see through smoke as they drive.But it can show more than that, and as you'll hear, it also has applications in urban firefighting settings.And joining me is Stan Cannata, to explain how the HyperSight system gives fire crews an advantage in dangerous situations.

The National Fire Protection Association seems like a pretty importantorganization. For example, Its reports are routinely used by fire departmentsto justify staffing requests.But not everyone is satisfied with how the NFPA operates. Some members of the fireservice believe the standards for equipment service life are too inflexible.And there's the question of who writes the standards in the first place.One of the NFPA's loudest critics on social media is Bobby Eckert. He's aCaptain with the City of Camden Fire Department in New Jersey. Bobby also ownsand operates Eckert Fire Tactics.We decided to ask Bobby to explain his concerns about the NFPA. We initially asked the NFPA to participate in a debate-style format with Bobby,but they declined the offer. Instead, they offered a representative who woulddo a one-on-one interview. We agreed to that, and I was able to ask questions of the NFPA's Responder TechnicalLead, Curt Floyd. Then we matched up Curt's answers with Bobby's questions.

If you've ever known a firefighter who committed suicide, you know how it can change your life.It may have come as a complete surprise to you. Or maybe you had been worried about the firefighter's state of mind.There's been a lot said and written about what we can do for ourselves to prevent suicide.But today, we're going to talk about a program designed to help you intervene in another firefighter's emotional crisis before it becomes a fatal one.It's called “Small Bites.” Because that's how you fix an elephant-size problem…one small bite at a time.The program was developed by Sheena Glover. She is a captain with the Omaha, Nebraska Fire Department. She's a 15-year veteran and holds several specialty ratings. Sheena is just the fourth Black female in the history of the department.

Friday, June 30, 2023, is the 10th anniversary of the deaths of 19 wildland firefighters in Arizona.They were hotshots, the kind of people who really do fight fire with fire. Led by a consummate professional, the team made a move that no one expected and no one can explain.That move caused the deaths of the entire crew except for a lookout, who was stationed some distance away.To help me tell their story today, I've enlisted the help of Todd Able. He's a battalion chief with the Central Arizona Fire and Medical Authority. He is also an experienced Type I Operations Section Chief for wildland fires. And that's where he was assigned on the Yarnell Hill fire.

It's getting hotter outside, and that traditionally signals the start of wildland fire season in the U.S.Nowadays, of course, there's no real “season” when wildland fires burn. The season can be all year long in some parts of the country.We won't argue about the reasons why—suffice it to say, wildland fires are growing bigger and more frequent than in the past.And, as residents of the northeast U.S. can attest, they are starting to burn in less fire-prone regions.With that in mind, and considering that this month is the 10th anniversary of the loss of the Granite Mountain Hotshots in Arizona, we're talking wildland fires.This time, it's a sort of primer on decision-making for those fighting fires in the backcountry. And some lessons learned from a guest who's familiar to those who have listened to Code 3 for a while.Chad Costa is Assistant Fire Chief for the city of Petaluma, California. He's had 24 years of experience working in both urban and wildland firefighting environments. That includes time at Cal Fire and as an Operations Branch Director for California Interagency Team 1.

How fit are you?If you're newer to the fire service, say two or three years in, you're probably still in reasonably good shape. After all, you had to meet minimum standards at the fire academy.But unless you've kept up with the physical fitness regimen, you may be getting a little soft around the middle.Or losing endurance.My guest today says it's time to do something about that.Aaron Zamzow is a firefighter/training officer at the Madison, Wisconsin, Fire Department. He has 20 years of experience as a fitness trainer, for athletes and others. He created Fire Rescue Fitness and lectures everywhere. And he has a podcast, too, called Better Every Shift, on FireRescue1.com

On this episode, we're talking with Phil Jose, the expert on reading smoke.As you may know—and as Phil likes to remind us—smoke is fuel.In most cases, it's just waiting for the right conditions to ignite.We'll discuss how to keep that from happening. Also on the agenda is a little talk about the relative merits of vertical ventilation. When do you go to the roof and start opening it up? It's all about coordination.And finally, we'll talk about when it's time to change how things are done on your fireground.Sounds interesting, doesn't it?Phil Jose retired from Seattle Fire Department as the Deputy Chief of Operations/Shift Commander after 31 years of service. He's had the opportunity to work in the training division as a Lieutenant, Captain, and Deputy Chief. Phil is a popular seminar speaker around the country, a published author, and he also runs Ignition Point Training.

We've talked several times on this show about PTSD and its effects on firefighters. It's a serious problem, one that affects nearly 40 percent of first responders.On this edition of Code 3, we're going to talk about a documentary available on YouTube that brings the problem home in a very impactful way.It's titled, “The Call We Carry: Confronting PTSD in the Fire Service.” It's quite a good documentary, packing a lot into just over an hour of screen time, and winning some prestigious film festival awards.The film was produced and directed by firefighter-paramedic Cody Shea. He's been with the Tacoma, Washington Fire Department since 2018.

This week, we're going to make some people angry.We're talking structure fires, risk, and SLICE-RS.If you're a probie, that's an acronym for Size-up, Locate the fire, Isolate the flow path, Cool from a safe distance, Extinguish, Rescue and Salvage at any time in the process.Today's guest says that, by following those steps in that order, you'll have a less risky fireground.But what about those who advocate for RECEO-VS? That's Rescue, Exposure, Confine, Extinguish, Overhaul and Ventilate, Salvage.That puts “rescue” first, which, while it may not be as safe for the firefighter, suggests that saving lives is the priority in a structure fire.But can using SLICE-RS result in more lives saved? How is that possible?I'll ask that of Robert Avsec.He retired as a Battalion Chief with the Chesterfield, Virginia Fire & EMS Department after 26 years of service. He's instructed fire, EMS and hazardous materials courses at the local, state and federal levels, including 10 years with the National Fire Academy. He writes a blog and is a published author.

Today's subject may make you uncomfortable. If it does, that's not a bad thing—so stick with me. You could save your own career.I am talking about harassment in the fire service, both sexual harassment and other types.Now, look, you know and I know that it goes on. And you know and I know that there have been so-called “sensitivity training” seminars. We also know that they usually aren't well received. Go ahead, admit it. You snickered—or groaned—the last time word came down that there was one you had to attend.And by the way, if your department or house doesn't have these problems, that's great. But it doesn't mean they've been extinguished. Harassment still goes on.My guest on this edition knows all that, too. She's here to talk about how strong leadership can help eliminate it.Linda Willing is one of our favorite returning guests here on Code 3.She's a retired career fire officer from the Boulder, Colorado Fire Department, who consults with emergency services agencies and other companies through her company, RealWorld Training and Consulting. She's also a published author and instructs at the National Fire Academy.

The fire service is often called a brotherhood…or a sisterhood, these days. But how strong is that bond, really? One of the best places to see the strength of the brotherhood in action is when tragedy occurs. A mayday call on the fireground results in heroic efforts…and, if those efforts should fail…then the observances for a line-of-duty-death are truly heartwarming.But what about the rest of the time? When things are routine, how's your family doing?My guest today says the brotherhood these days may need some work. John Cuomo has nearly three decades in the fire service. He's worked just about every position you can have in the job. He also served as pension representative for a police and firefighter pension fund for 10 years.He's also written a book, titled "Leadership Refined by Fire".

There's a lot of talk in the fire service about the culture. It's important, which you already know. It's even celebrated in many cities.But one thing that's more dependent on the culture of your department than you might think is recruiting.This is especially important if you need to recruit volunteers.Luckily, it's possible to build the culture you want to see, if you address the issue specifically.My guest today has some ideas on teambuilding by developing a positive culture. Jason Caughey is the fire chief at Laramie County Fire District #2 in Cheyenne, Wyoming. He's also been the fire chief of Gore Hill Fire Rescue in Great Falls, Montana.

Large-city fire departments with multiple PIOs have been showcasing their activities on social media for some time. If you have enough people, it's no problem.But what if you want to try to engage the community without those resources?Social media can be a direct link with the customers your department serves, so it's a no-brainer that you'd like to be all over Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok, and all the others. Even podcasts.Not to mention that your message can be sent the way you want—not filtered through the editors and reporters of your local news providers.How do you do it?My two guests today come from the Central Arizona Fire and Medical Authority, or CAFMA. It's medium-small career department, covering several small cities and a lot of rural area, populated by about 106,000 residents. They do it with 10 full-time stations and 2 reserve stations.And NO full-time PIO. et CAFMA's social media program is impressive. And I'm saying this as someone who has seen the Los Angeles City Fire Department's social media program at work.My guests today are here to explain how they do it.We're talking with CAFMA Chief Scott Freitag, an old friend of Code 3, and Kathy Goodman, Scott's Community Relations Coordinator, who is the driving force behind this social media campaign.

Just about every area served by fire departments includes a large warehouse or two. If you drive by it, I am sure you wonder how well your department would deal with a fire inside it.But in the last few years, truly massive warehouses have started to appear. These monsters aren't measured in square feet, they're measured in acres of land covered.If anything—from a fire to a natural disaster—brings you to one of them, your department may well be unable to deal with the situation.That's why today's guest says you must prepare well in advance for a mega-warehouse fire.Steve Lohr is the fire chief in Hagerstown, Maryland. In 2014, he retired as chief of the Montgomery County, Maryland Fire-Rescue Department after a 30-year career.

Earlier this month, about 400 members of the fire service-from more than 20 states—got together for the Phoenix Firefighters Symposium.They were gathered to hear about Mrs. Smith.Back in 1996, Chief Brunacini—Bruno, to his friends—came up with the idea of Mrs. Smith. She represents why the fire service exists—she's the first priority for firefighters, the customer they serve. She stands for all the people who call for any kind of help from the fire department.Bruno left us in 2017, but Mrs. Smith remains as his legacy, with her influence growing. As each class of recruits is taught to remember her, and more members of other departments hear about what she stands for, they carry the message of customer service nationwide.So what was the big deal about this two-day event? It was-and is—about just what the Symposium's slogan says: Taking Care of Mrs. Smith.

If you do enough training evolutions, you will inevitably come up against a trick scenario.You know, the ones where the instructors design something totally implausible into the scenario.They usually fool the firefighters doing the training…and then that allows the instructor to say something that seems wise.Like, “expect the unexpected.”Sometimes, they'll simply judge a specific thing with undue emphasis. Like always using a stopwatch, no matter the circumstances.Why shouldn't instructors use these kinds of tactics? Today's guest explains what can happen when they do. And why they don't end up with the real-world results the trainers want to see.Doug Cupp is the fire chief at the Greater Eagle Fire Protection District in Colorado. His company, Doug Cupp and Associates, delivers courses based on his research on critical decision-making, leading to crisis and human error. Doug holds a master's degree in Emergency Management and Fire and Emergency Services Management.

As a firefighter, you have probably developed some strong opinions on at least a few topics.Some people call them “the hill you're willing to die on.” But no matter what you call them, you need to pick your battles when it comes to spouting off about these points of view.My guest today wrote an article about his experiences fighting the smooth bore vs. fog nozzle debate. He finally realized, years later, that he wasn't going to change peoples' minds, and, more importantly, he didn't need to. Water will get on the fire either way.That's when he decided to start thinking about issues that do have an impact, things that should maybe be changed for a good reason.Philip Clark works as a full-time firefighter with the Lincolnton, North Carolina Fire Department. Phil joined the fire service in 2002 as a volunteer and has worked for several volunteer and combination departments since then. He lives in Dallas, North Carolina, and is a captain for the Town of Dallas Fire Department.

We're getting close to the end of another year, and this one, like the last few, seems to have been pretty difficult in a lot of ways.Things are looking a little murky as we try to see the future of the fire service.Of course, firefighters in general can be just a bit pessimistic. But is it justified?That's why I've asked today's guest to give us some insight into next year. I figure, if we have an idea of what's coming, we can be better prepared for it.Dr. Randall W. Hanifen is an assistant chief of operations for West Chester, Ohio, Fire. He's also an associate professor at the American Public University's Emergency Management program, and an adjunct professor at the University of Cincinnati.He's CEO of Hanifen & Associates, a national fire service consulting company.

Do you detect a lack of willingness among your firefighters to take risks? Have company officers –or your department policy—made “2-in-2-out” a hard-and-fast rule? Are they lacking passion for the job? Today's guest has been noticing that trend, and he's concerned. Now, let's be clear: no one is advocating that firefighters freelance or even take uncalculated or foolhardy risks. But whether it's making entry at a partially-involved structure fire or treating a COVID patient, he's more than a little concerned that risk-taking is not something firefighters are prepared to do. And, he points out, that's why you took the oath in the first place, right? Steve Prziborowski has more than 30 years of fire service experience. He's a retired deputy chief of training for the Santa Clara County Fire Department in CA. He runs Code 3 Fire Training and Education. (No relation to this podcast.) He has written and been a part of articles, podcasts, videos, blogs and published four career development books, with a fifth on the way.

If you've been listening to this show for a while, you've probably noticed that I talk a lot about realistic training. It's because there are fewer actual structure fires these days for younger firefighters to see first-hand. That means they need to learn both skills and understanding in training. And to absorb the concepts well enough that it doesn't take thought to do them. They become automatic. So you do it over and over. Because it may take a couple of dozen reps to build muscle memory. A firefighter who is struggling with the ladder is not paying attention to the conditions around him or her. My guest today is an expert on training and the difference between performance and understanding. Fred Kauser is the chief of the Mifflin Township, Ohio, Division of Fire. He runs a career department with 100 members. Mifflin Fire responds to about 11,000 incidents a year. He has a PhD and teaches various topics related to firefighting.

Today's episode is going to be a little different. It's a look back at a major learning event in a firefighter's career. But, as you'll hear, the lessons taught weren't necessarily clear. And years later, the firefighter involved is still trying to sort out all of what she should take from the experience. It's not cut-and-dried by any means. But it's worth hearing about, no matter how long you've been a member of the fire service. Returning to Code 3 to tell her story is Kaci Corrigan. She's a battalion chief at a department in Northwest Pierce County, Washington. She's also an instructor with First Due Training in Washington State, as well as an adjunct instructor with Fire By Trade.

No matter how large—or small—your fire department may be, it has one house that's just not as busy as the others. Sometimes, that house is really slow. And it may feel like you're missing all the action if you're assigned to it. If you're new to the fire service career, you may wonder if you'll ever go on a structure fire run. If you're an officer, you might worry that your career is stalled. But there are some things to consider before you decide that it's hopeless. My guest today says being assigned to that station can be like “being sent to Siberia.” Linda Willing has been on Code 3 before. She's a retired career fire officer. She owns RealWorld Training and Consulting, which works with emergency service agencies. She is also an adjunct instructor and curriculum advisor for the National Fire Academy, and has written a book, titled On the Line: Women Firefighters Tell Their Stories.

On this show, we're going to explore some of the unique experiences of a firefighter who is in the minority on two fronts: She's a woman and she's Black. Jennifer Osborne is a 16-year veteran of the Clark County, Nevada, Fire Department. They cover an area in and around Las Vegas. She first became a paramedic in Colorado in 1999 before heading to the fire academy. So she's been around long enough to have gained some perspective on what it's like to be in a very small minority…in fact, she was just the third black female firefighter in her current department when she finished the academy. Jennifer has enjoyed her career—she's an engineer now—but, as you might expect, there have been a few struggles along the way.

If you're about to promote to company officer, this show is for you. Most firefighters want to move up and take charge of the crew. It's natural to assume you could do it better, right? And there's the pay bump. But once you pass the test and are selected, you may find it's a whole different ballgame than you thought. Especially these days, there isn't a whole lot of fireground commanding involved in being a company officer. It's a good dose of administrative work punctuated by training evolutions and then…then…you need to be ready for the structure fire when it happens. My guest today is here to discuss what he's learned about what it is to be a company officer. Jacob Johnson is a returning guest to Code 3. He's an assistant chief for the city of Pearland, Texas Fire Department. He over has two decades in the fire service.

I started out today's interview intending to talk about the conflict between fire officers and lower-ranked—but certified--paramedics. It wasn't long before I got caught up in a discussion about the “state of the Union” of Fire vs. EMS. It's a hot button issue, for sure. My guest on this edition of Code 3, Wes Ward, says there's a “ridiculous gap” between the two, one that's totally unnecessary. And if you don't know him, Wes has been a battalion chief serving as the director of EMS for Center Point Fire District in Alabama. Before that, he was a fire captain at Birmingham Fire and Rescue. So, yes, he's been on both sides of the divide, and he believes there shouldn't even be a divide between Fire and EMS.

Usually, I talk with a member of the fire service on this show, but today's a bit different. Brian McDonald is an author, but not a firefighter. He's written several books about New York City, and his latest is about the FDNY. Five Floors Up focuses on two firefighting families, and one man specifically. William Feehan worked his way from probie to Fire Commissioner. He lost his life on September 11, 2001, along with 342 other members of the FDNY who were at the World Trade Center scene. As Brian tells his story, he delves into the history of the department, giving us an honest appraisal of its darker days and politics. Still, it's an inspiring story of two families, covering four generations of everyday heroes. Brian is a native New Yorker, born in the Bronx, He has written other non-fiction books about the city, with titles like My Father's Gun and Last Call at Elaine's.

What do you think of your city's news media? Maybe you think of reporters and photographers as an annoyance. Perhaps you view them as a necessary evil. Or—and this is the best, I think—do you look at them as professionals just doing their jobs, reporting the news? I've been a journalist for 30-plus years, and I can tell you that, while reporters sometimes make mistakes, very few are out to “get” you, as a firefighter. They're also generally not out to make your department look bad. So, the question is, how do you get the news media to help you? It's not hard. Just give them what they want—a good story—and they'll be happy. Don't act like there's something to hide, especially when there isn't anything to hide! My guest today will explain how to do that better. Robert Leonard has over 30 years of service as a firefighter, officer and EMT. Rob's been FDNY's Deputy Director of Public Information and Deputy Press Secretary for Uniformed and Emergency Services to the Mayor of the City of New York. He is an Assistant Chief of the Syosset Fire Department on Long Island and a Second Deputy Chief Instructor at the Nassau County Fire Service Academy. He is also a senior executive at a national public relations firm, leading the public safety and local government practice, and a member of the Public Relations committee for the Firefighters Association of the State of New York.

If you're thinking you'd like to try for a company officer or to move up to a chief officer position, I have a question for you: Who has been your example for how you should lead? I ask because the leadership landscape has changed over the last few years. Even in my business, TV news, I was once told that you can't just tell people to jump and expect them to ask, “How high?” anymore. So you can imagine that the old ways of being in charge aren't really appreciated anymore. But people are slow to change their ways, and if you're working with a salty officer who became a firefighter 15 or 20 years ago, you might be seeing a bad example and not even realize it. That's why I'm talking with today's guest. Sal Scarpa believes we can lead today's younger firefighters in better ways than simply barking commands at them. Sal is the Fire-EMS Chief for Columbus, Georgia. He's also the Emergency Management Agency Director for Columbus and Muscogee County. He's been in the fire service for over 30 years, having worked in Kansas City, as well as Shawnee, Kansas, and the North Kansas City, Missouri Fire Department.

Some people call it auto-pilot. It's that ability to arrive at a scene and immediately go to work. That's a learned skill, and it has a place on the fireground. But another learned skill that may be even more important is the ability to analyze decisions before they're made. You may know it by a more familiar term, situational awareness. Most firefighters believe they have it already, and many do. Some really don't. But just like anything else, you can develop it, or improve on what you have. The difference between situational awareness on the fireground and in other jobs is, of course, that people can get hurt or die if it's not done well on this job. My guest today is an expert in helping firefighters build their situational awareness skills and he has some tips that may make yours a bit better. Doctor Richard Gasaway is the President of Situational Awareness Matters. He leads a team of expert instructors who train and consult on safety and leadership topics. He's written 7 books related to situational awareness, high-risk decision making and leadership, He served 33 years as a firefighter, EMT-Paramedic, company officer, training officer, fire chief and incident commander.

Every firefighter can recall the worst incidents in his or her career—you know, the ones that made a serious impact on their psyche. They may not have realized it at the time, but these are the days that helped shape their philosophy. You might remember that I was a helicopter pilot years ago. In flying, we called these kinds of days the times we “scared ourselves.” You invariably learn some lessons from those times, and usually humility is one of them. The realization that you could have had a very bad day is burned into your mind. Then there are the days and weeks or even months where thing just go badly. Where we question if we're meant to do the job in the first place. The ones that keep us awake at night, wondering, "what if...?" My guest today has experienced both of these situations, and he has the benefit of a long career to measure their value. He's here to discuss what happened, how it affected him, and the lessons learned. Chad Costa is a returning guest to Code 3. He's a battalion chief for the city of Petaluma, California Fire Department. He has two decades in the fire service, covering diverse territories from city to rural districts.

I have a question for you today. Why did you become a firefighter? I know, you probably haven't had to think about it since you were interviewed before hiring. But why did you choose this career? If you're like most people, you'll probably mention something, at some point, about saving lives. And that's great. It's noble. It's important. Now, a second question: when was the last time you trained on saving lives? (Not counting paramedic skills.) Sure, you can pull a line or throw a ladder in your sleep. You can force a door. You can even find a rescue dummy in a maze-training exercise. But that isn't really rescuing someone, is it? Finding them is hard enough, but getting them out of a fire is a whole ‘nother thing. My guest today says his department's culture had emphasized putting out fires so heavily that they had practically overlooked training to rescue victims of those fires. So he changed that philosophy. Daniel Folks has been the chief of the Hammond, Louisiana fire department since June, 2019. He has 23 years of fire service experience, both as a volunteer and career firefighter. He is an instructor at the Louisiana Fire and Emergency Training Academy.

Smaller fire departments often work with less personnel than they need. That means there are very few specialists in a volunteer department or a rural agency. One of the specialists you'll miss right away if you join one is the truckie. While city departments are having (good-natured) arguments over who's better or more important, small town engine companies need to do both jobs. And, sometimes, they need to do them with two or three firefighters on the engine. How do you manage those roles? What's more important when you arrive on scene? Today's guest works at both a career department and as a volunteer and he has some thoughts. Justin Bailey is a return guest to the Code 3 podcast. He's the fire chief of the Oliver Springs, Tennessee, Fire Department. He's also a master firefighter with the Knoxville, Tennessee, Fire Department, where he's worked since 2007.

Firefighters are athletes. You may be part of the culture that already knows and accepts this truth. But if this is a foreign idea to you, or if you disagree, consider this: Even if you mostly run medical calls, physical conditioning is critical to your career. In fact, you need to be in top condition because you mostly run medical calls. And it isn't just because patients are getting larger and heavier, although that is a good reason. My guest today isn't a firefighter or a paramedic. But he has a strong interest in helping the fire service community maintain its health. And he can tell you why it's important to think like an athlete. Daniel Higuera is an Assistant Professor of Kinesiology, in the Department of Fire Technology at Santa Ana College in Santa Ana, California. He specializes in working with athletes and firefighters, both studying and teaching them how and why physical conditioning is so important.

Now that the wildland fire season lasts pretty much all year long—and homes continue to be built further from city centers--the focus is turning to homes in the wildland-urban interface. Fires that threaten homes along the edge of cities and towns have turned some metro departments into wildland companies as well. It's not always a comfortable fit for crews that usually wear turnouts and expect a charged hoseline. Now, they don the yellow shirts and work without water, digging fire breaks. My guest today has been watching the situation and has some observations about how the transition is going. Clare Frank retired after 30 years in the fire service. She was the State of California's first and only female Chief of Fire Protection. And she served as fire chief at the Milpitas, California Fire Department. She's also found time to earn a law degree and her bar card.

I have no idea how many times I have heard the old phrase, “Practice makes perfect.” Of course, nowadays, we understand that it's wrong. If practice is going to be worthwhile, we need to practice the right things the right way. Practicing the wrong things is a waste of time. And practicing doing things incorrectly only leads to learning bad habits. And in this job, that can get you killed. So how do we avoid this? Ever heard of Reflexive Readiness? If you've heard my guest speak at a conference—you may have. Making his return to Code 3 to explain this is Corley Moore. Corley is a battalion chief for the Moore, Oklahoma Fire Department. He's got 25 years in the fire service. And he also hosts “The Weekly Scrap” at Firehouse Vigilance.