Podcast appearances and mentions of van moody

This episode of Unstoppable Mindset is for me a special one. It has been three years in the making. It is a celebration by any standard. At the beginning of the pandemic, I began realizing that while I had talked for years about escaping from the World Trade Center I had not begun teaching people to control fear: something I did successfully on September 11. So, I began working toward writing a book about the subject. I approached my co-author of Thunder Dog, Susy Flory, but she was quite busy studying in a PHD program, her own writing and running a writers conference. Susy introduced me to Keri Wyatt Kent. A friendship and team bond were formed. Today, August 20, 2024 the fruits of Keri's and my labors are released in a new book entitled “Live Like A Guide Dog: true stories of a blind man and his dogs about being brave, overcoming adversity and walking in faith”. The book is our effort to help people realize that they can learn to control fear rather than being “blinded by it”. On this episode, Keri, Susy Flory and I discuss the book. Lots of stories as well as a discussion of what went on behind the scenes. I hope you like the episode and, if you haven't done so already, please order a copy of the book. About the Guest: Keri Wyatt Kent is the author or co-author of more than two dozen books. (see her website portfolio at www.keriwyattkent.com) She has been published in Christianity Today magazine, Today's Christian Woman magazine, Outreach magazine and many other publications. She is the founder and principal of A Powerful Story, an editing and publishing company. She publishes two newsletters on Substack: Welcoming and Wandering, which explores hospitality and travel (at https://welcomingandwandering.substack.com/ ); and A Powerful Story newsletter, which offers writing and publishing advice (see https://keriwyattkent.substack.com/. Susy Flory is a #1 New York Times best-selling author or co-author of fourteen books, including The Sky Below, a new memoir with Hall of Fame Astronaut/Explorer Scott Parazynski, and Desired by God with Van Moody. Susy grew up on the back of a quarter horse in Northern California and took degrees from UCLA in English and psychology. She has a background in journalism, education, and communications and directs a San Francisco Bay Area writers conference. She first started writing at the Newhall Signal with the legendary Scotty Newhall, an ex-editor of the San Francisco Chronicle and a one-legged cigar-smoking curmudgeon who ruled the newsroom from behind a dented metal desk where he pounded out stories on an Underwood Typewriter. She taught high school English and journalism, then quit in 2004 to write full time for publications such as Focus on the Family, Guideposts Books, In Touch, Praise & Coffee, Today's Christian, and Today's Christian Woman. Susy's books include So Long Status Quo: What I Learned From the Women Who Changed the World, as well as the much-anticipated 2011 memoir she co-wrote with blind 9-11 survivor Michael Hingson, called Thunder Dog: The True Story of a Blind Man, His Guide Dog, and the Triumph of Trust at Ground Zero. Thunder Dog was a runaway bestseller and spent over a dozen weeks on the New York Times bestseller list. Ways to connect with Kerri & Susy: www.facebook.com/keriwyattkent www.instagram.com/keriwyattkent https://www.linkedin.com/in/keri-wyatt-kent-328b2810/ http://www.susyflory.com/ https://www.facebook.com/everythingmemoir About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset . Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes: Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us. .   Michael Hingson ** 01:21 Well, Hi again, everyone, and welcome to another episode of unstoppable mindset. Today is a special one. I think it's special anyway, and I think our guests will agree today you're listening to this. It's It's August 20, 2024, and it's special because for the past almost three years, I and Kari Wyatt Kent, who you'll meet in a moment, have been working on a book. It's my next book, and the we had various titles, but we ended up deciding with the publisher, Tyndale house, to call it live like a guide dog, true stories from a blind man and his dogs about being brave, overcoming adversity and walking in faith. All three of those are relevant, and we can talk about those. And along the way, we've also had a lot of help from Susy Flory, who worked with me when we did thunderdog, and we wrote thunderdog, which was a number one New York Times bestseller and was published in August of 2011 I don't know what it is about August, but, oh, that's okay, but I think there's relevance to it being August this time anyway. Susie Flory was on Episode 10 of unstoppable mindset, way back in December, December 1, specifically, of 2021, and 12 days later on the 13th of December, Keri Wyatt Kent was on episode 12 of unstoppable mindset. So if you guys want to hear those two episodes, you can go back and find episodes 10 and 12 and hear our individual conversations with Susie and Carrie. But now I'd like to introduce you to both of them and all three of us, I think, we'll tell you a little bit about ourselves, and then we'll get into other things that are related to what we want to talk about, unstoppable mindset. But the big thing is, today is the day we're celebrating that live like a guide dog is released. It was released today. It's out there. If you haven't ordered it, we hope you will from wherever you want to order books, and if you have pre ordered it, you'll be getting your copy pretty soon. So anyway, welcome Susy and Kari. I'm glad you're here. We really appreciate your time, Susy. Why don't you tell us a little bit about you? I   Susy Flory ** 03:33 certainly will. But first I want to say congratulations to the both of you. I'm so excited about this book. Can't wait for it to get out there and for people to enjoy it. Mike, I was thinking I did a little quick math, and you and I have known each other for 15 years now we have we How many marriages don't even last 15 years? Right? Really,   Michael Hingson ** 03:58 well, we we met because you called one day and were writing a book called Dog tales, and you wanted to include Rozelle story, and you asked me to tell what happened on September 11. And so I bit I did, and I took maybe, I think, close to 45 minutes, and then afterward, there was this pause, and all of a sudden, Susie said you ought to write your own book, and I want to help you write it. And I sort of was a little bit reluctant, because I'd been working on it for a long time and had some ideas and advice from people, but it just wasn't going anywhere. But it did with Susie and her agent became my agent. He got a contract with Thomas Nelson publishing, and the rest, as they say, is sort of history, yeah. And I   Susy Flory ** 04:43 have always loved animal stories. My first few books, I didn't get to do anything like that, but as soon as I could, I started writing animal stories. Dogtails was the first one, and then working with you on thunderdog was the second one. Yeah. And that's kind of been a theme of my life. My dad was a Texas cowboy, and I grew up on horses. He was kind of a horse whisperer. My daughter works in wildlife rescue, and she's a squirrel whisperer. And I just love the way that animals sort of make their way into your heart, and there's a healing and bonding process that happens that so gentle most of the time you don't even realize it's happening until you need them. And that really, has truly been my experience. So Mike, that's really a part of your story that captured my heart, along with a lot of other elements of the story, I've been writing now for about 20 years, writing and publishing, I direct a writer's conference, and Carrie's actually part of that. And we try to help writers become the best that they can be. And then in the last few years, I've been in seminary, furthering my education. Right now I'm in a doctoral program and working on my dissertation, so my hair is becoming more and more gray in that process. Well,   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 06:17 and I met Susy probably at least 15 years ago, maybe more, I'm not sure when it was, but we were both writers. We worked with the same agent at the time, and then I pretty soon got involved with the West Coast Christian writers the conference that Susie was leading, and we just clicked. We We are both animal lovers. I think that's part of it. I love dogs. I also grew up riding horses, as she did and and we both had horses later in life at at the same time. And I agree there's that there's just something that animals kind of intuitively know and connect with you on this emotional level. And, you know, the the dogs that that I met through helping Mike right live like a guide dog, when we initially started it, we were going to do, we were going to include some other dogs, you know, service dogs and other people's dogs. And so I just, I got to meet some really cool dogs during this whole research project. And so I think that people who you know, if the idea of this book is about overcoming fear and managing our fear figuring out how to live courageously. And I think even if you don't have a guide dog or a service dog, animals can help you do that. They force you to be in the moment, which is one of the one of the ways we that we can deal with fear and anxiety, is to be in the moment. And animals sort of force us to do that   Michael Hingson ** 08:02 if we pay attention to them. I think you're absolutely right. And one of the lessons that we talk about in the book is the whole issue of living in the moment, not doing so much, what if? Because, if we What if everything to death, we create a lot of fear in our own lives. And one of the the basic mantras I have lived by, especially since September 11, although even before, but mostly after September 11, is don't worry about what you can't control. Focus on what you can, and the rest will take care of itself. And the lesson really comes from dogs, because after September 11, I contacted the veterinarian department of Guide Dogs for the Blind, and also talked to Roselle trainer and so on and and said, How do you think that this whole event would affect Roselle? And one of the things that they asked me was, was Roselle threatened along the way? And I said, No. And they said, well, was she hit with anything? Or did anything endanger her? And I said, No, not that she would notice at all. And they said, Well, there you are. Dogs. Don't do what if and when it was over. And we got home on the night of September 11, I took Roselle harness off, and I figured I was going to take her out. She would have none of it. She ran off, went to her toy box, grabbed her favorite tug boda bone, and started playing tug of war with my retired guy, dog, Lenny, and that was it. The two of them just played. Eventually, she did have to go out, but by the same token, they played. It was over. Roselle was glad to be home, and we moved on from there, and I think it's an important lesson. When the pandemic began, I realized that although I've been talking for at that time, 19 years about surviving the World Trade Center terrorist attacks and so on, and being able to go down the state. And not exhibiting fear and not exhibiting panic. I learned to do that and created a mindset in my head, because I spent a lot of time prior to September 11, learning about all of the issues in the World Trade Center. Where do you go if there's an emergency? What are the rules? Because for me, of course, I'm not going to read signs, but also, I was the leader of an office, and I was responsible for the people in that office, or whoever might be in the office at the time. So it was really important for me to know that. And so as a result, I learned what I could I learned how to travel around the world trade center, learned where things were and all of that, although it wasn't until much later that I realized it. All of that created a mindset in me, you know, what to do if there's an emergency and when it actually happened, although certainly we didn't expect it, the mindset kicked in and when the fan, when the pandemic began, I realized we really needed to start to talk about teaching people how to deal with fear, and as I would put it, teach people that they don't need to be blinded by fear or overwhelmed by fear, that fear is an important tool, no matter what you might think about. Oh, well, if it happens, it's a natural reaction. You have control over what you do and how you feel when something horrific or something unusual happens, then fear can be a powerful tool that you can use to benefit you, rather than letting it overwhelm you and cause you not to be able to make decisions. And you know, today in our in our world, politicians and others are doing nothing but promulgating fear in so many different ways. And we don't learn enough about stepping back and really analyzing what they say, whoever they are, and going back and saying, wait a minute. Is this real? Do I need to be afraid of this? Or is there anything that I can do about it? And that gets back to the don't worry about what you can't control. Most of it we don't have direct control over, except, I would say, at the ballot box on november 5. But by the same token, there's so much that we take personally that we shouldn't because we're not going to have any effect on it. And so what we need to do, and what live like a guide dog allows us to do is to learn how to control fear. We talk about being introspective. We talk about taking time at the end of every day to look at what happened. Why did it work? What didn't work? I don't like the concept of failure. I think that failure is only a lesson that we can use to move forward and that it doesn't need to be bad if we don't allow it to be bad, but if we use it as a tool. So that's what live like a guide dog really is about, and it is one of the, I think, the books that can truly help so many people recognize that they have a lot more control over the specific things in their lives than they think they do. Or, as we say here on the podcast, they can be more unstoppable than they think they are.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 13:12 Mike, I think that's so good. And you know, some of the things that we have in the book, as you recall, um, are strategies like we can't worry about what we can't control. But for example, you mentioned, like learning your way around the world trade center. That was a step of preparation that enabled you to then in the moment when things were you know, where there's chaos. You had been. You had prepared yourself, and all of us can prepare ourselves, you know, for understanding the world around us, for gaining information that will help us in a long when, if, when, and if something happens, to deal with it in a in a brave way and not let fear get the upper Hand. Yeah, still feel afraid, but if we're prepared, we go, okay, I know we're I know what to do next. I know what you know. I know where the exit door is, whatever it was that you know, you were able to know your way around the world trade center that helped you as you were, you know, evacuating from a tower that was on fire, you know? Yeah, so it preparation was a great tool, and it's one of the strategies that we talk about in the book that can help us to not let our fear make us panic. So,   Michael Hingson ** 14:37 you know, one of the things that we do a lot in the book, at various places, is tell stories. And I, as a person who's been involved in sales most of my life, believe that the best salespeople are people who can tell stories that relate to whatever their customers are interested in, and so on. So one of the things that comes to mind is a story that took place a few years after September 11. I was in Oregon in. Working for Guide Dogs for the Blind, and I had to go up to Gresham, Oregon, where the, well, our boring Oregon, actually, I love that name, where the second campus of Guide Dogs for the Blind is located. And I got there and put stuff away, and decided I was going to go out to dinner. And I had learned where a restaurant was and how to get there. And I got there, that was no problem. But coming back for some reason, and I don't remember what specifically happened, but for some reason, I couldn't get back to the apartment where I was staying, and I felt real concern when I when I first couldn't make it work, I retraced my steps, got back to the restaurant, and then tried it again, and still we didn't get to the right place. But what I also realized is you've got to deal with this, because it's not rozelle's job to know when Roselle was the guide dog at the time. Guide Dogs don't lead. They guide. Their job is to make sure that we walk safely. I have to give and had to give Roselle direction, and that is the case with anyone who uses a guide dog. People always want to say, well, of course, the dog just leads you around. No, that's just not true. Anyway, as I after the second time of not making it work right, I suddenly realized, wait a minute, I have in my pocket, and it was fairly new, so we didn't think of using it as much at the time, but I had a talking GPS system. I turned it on, I put in the address of where I wanted to go, and within five minutes, I was at the apartment where, where we were staying. But the issue is, I had to step back and recognize, don't be afraid. There are ways to make this work, and what you need to do is to use your skills to resolve the problem and solve the problem. And so many people won't do that. They they just get afraid. Blind people oftentimes do it. Sighted people do it in so many ways. But the fact is that it's it's a very powerful tool to use something that we call in the rehabilitation world with blind people today, and I think others, but the National Federation of the Blind calls structured discovery. You get lost, you start to go back and analyze where you were supposed to go and how you were supposed to get there, and maybe where you actually went wrong. And structured discovery is a very powerful thing. I also think that using technologies like GPS have, especially now, become a lot more dominant, and that's fine, because it's the technology's job to give me the information that allows me to decide what I want to do. But you know the bottom line is that the fear went away as soon as I recognized, oh, I know how to do this, and I'll just use the talking GPS system, and it should be able to give me what I want to know. And it did,   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 18:07 yeah, I love that story. And I think one of the things I learned as as your co author, you know, it's your story, and I was, you know, helping, you know, you write it, but, but I learned so much about guide dogs. For instance, what you mentioned when you were telling that story, that the guide dog doesn't lead you, you don't say, go back to the apartment you've been to once, Roselle, she's, you know, it's not like Lassie, you know, movies,   Michael Hingson ** 18:35 and that's all right. And no matter what they say, Timmy never did fall down the well, but that's never fell down   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 18:39 the well, ever is that was just, anyway, the idea of, and I've, you know, when I was I got a copy of the book recently, and, you know, had a publication. And the I was explaining to my husband, well, the guide dog doesn't lead and he goes, Well, how does he know where he's going? I said, Well, the same way you do but, but it's, it's that the guide dog guides, but the the handler has to give direction to the dog. Because I think it would be more scary if, if the dog had the magical ability to just take you where you want to go. I feel like it would be scarier because that's literally you have no control or no awareness of what's going on, whereas the way guide dogs actually work, you're a team, and you're doing it together, so you both have agency and control over various aspects of your journey together, and I think that makes it less scary. So   Michael Hingson ** 19:41 it is a team effort, and, and you're absolutely right, and that the reality is that it's a team effort where we both learn to trust each other. And, yeah, I think that families who have dogs really need to learn more about their their dogs. Um. Or and other animals too, but we're going to talk about dogs today. The the fact of the matter is that, in reality, dogs love to be around people, and they actually want us and hope that we will set the rules so that they know what they're supposed to do. They love rules, and that doesn't mean in a negative sort of way. But you know, if you just let your dog run around the house, tear up the furniture and all that, and you don't do anything about it, the dog's going to do that until you say, wait a minute, this isn't what you're supposed to do, and you don't need to deal with that in a negative way. There are so many ways to train a dog properly with positive rewards and so on, food rewards and clickers and other things like that, to to really set the rules. But when the dog knows what the rules are, and you continuously say, Good dog, when they do the right thing, they love that, and they will be a much more value added member of the family. As I tell people, dogs do I think love unconditionally, but they don't trust unconditionally. And you have to develop that trusting relationship with your dog, whoever you are. It isn't just service dogs, but with service dogs especially, it is a true, absolute team effort that we need to deal with and that we need to form. I need to know that Rozelle is going to do or now Alamo, current black lab guide dog, is going to do his job and convey to him I trust you. And likewise, he wants to know that I trust him. It. It really does go both ways. And when you develop that trusting relationship, it's second to none. Just like any other kind of teaming relationship,   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 21:52 I think you hit on something important, Mike, is that your dog wants the structure of of rules and knowing your expectations and wants to meet them, and you'll enjoy your dog more. And your dog will enjoy being a part of what he's considers the pack you know, of your family. Everybody will enjoy it more and feel safer and less fearful if they their structure. You know, I think sometimes dogs are when they're they act out it. They're kind of like kids who act out they are because they're afraid, and they don't know where, where the boundaries are, and   Michael Hingson ** 22:30 they don't know what you expect of them. And if you don't convey that, and again, it's a positive thing, you don't go up and beat a dog because it doesn't do what you want. That's not the way to handle it. And there are humane societies, humane associations, and so many organizations around the country that can help you appropriately train your dog. And you should, you should do that. You should really learn what training is all about. But if you do that, you're also training yourself, by the way, we used to live up in Novato, California, which was right by the marine Humane Society. And one of the things that we had discussions with people at the society about, many times, was, in reality, they do more training of people than they do of dogs, because it's really teaching the person how to address and deal with the dog much more than it even is just teaching the dog what the rules are. Right. Now, I don't know about squirrels, Susie, but you know,   Susy Flory ** 23:34 they're in a whole other category. They're   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 23:37 a whole other category, although I think your daughter, who is very good with all animals. I I remember seeing her with her dog when I visited, and she had an amazing bond with them, with with, you know, and, and that was really cool to watch. There was just this mutual respect between the two of them.   Susy Flory ** 23:59 Now, our career actually came as a result of my dog. I have a little Terrier named sprinkles, a Silky Terrier who's 14 now, and when she was really young, I had taken her out in the backyard. Teddy was, I think, 16 at the time, and sprinkles started pointing. And I didn't know these little terriers did that, but she just looked like one of those English hunting dogs. And she had her paw up, her tail out, she was pointing at something. And so I went over to look. She wouldn't come inside. There was a nest of baby birds that had the nest had been destroyed, and the birds were on the ground, these little, tiny babies, and I just left them. That's how heartless I was. I just thought, you know, they're not going to survive. They looked like they were dead. I just left them and picked up sprinkles, took her in, and Teddy came home from school. About a half hour later, I was telling her, you never guessed what sprinkles did today. Well, she didn't care what sprinkles did, but as soon as she heard the word baby birds. She ran out and back. She picked them up, she nursed them back to hell. She stayed up all night feeding them, and the next morning, she said, This is what I want to do for my life. And there's just sometimes an intuition that dogs have, you know, sprinkles found these baby birds, and that connection I will never forget, you know, that bond between her and the dog and the birds and many other animals afterwards. So there's sometimes a mysterious way of working in our lives that dogs can have.   Michael Hingson ** 25:36 Well, talking about bonding in mysterious ways brings up the memory of a story of how you two bonded. Does anybody want to tell that story? You told it to me. So now you're stuck.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 25:49 Susy, this is your favorite story so and I've been talking so go ahead.   Michael Hingson ** 25:55 Susie,   Susy Flory ** 25:56 yeah, you know how sometimes in a friendship, when you go through something hard that I know you and Rozelle went through, and you know many of the other stories you tell them in the new book, it brings you closer together. And Carrie and I had a moment. We were already friends, but we decided to go snow skiing one day, and we both were not like champion skiers. It was just for fun, and we were all dressed in our gear and headed up the hill, and a woman came running from the side of the road up at the top of the mountain and was yelling at us that there was a man in the ditch, and we didn't know what was going on. We stopped. We went over and looked, and there was a man unconscious in a ditch with this motorcycle on top of them. And so it turned out that he had passed away. But, you know, there was a good couple of hours of, you know, summoning the fire department. We had no cell service, giving statements to the authorities, you know, taking this woman back to a restaurant nearby for soup, and really just kind of going through this awful experience together. I mean, it's very traumatic, you know, to see someone who's just passed away from an accident. And, yeah, I think sometimes those things bond us and give us that, that relationship of trust and of teamwork that goes very deep. And Mike, I'm remembering how thunderdog had the working title of trust and teamwork, and I learned so much from you about that concept and kind of how that works. And it's not easy to have a relationship like that. Sometimes the hard things are what, you know, kind of forges that bond. Well, you know,   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 27:45 Susie, as you were saying that, I thought, You know what? That's when I knew Susy was someone I could turn to in a crisis, and she would keep a cool head and know what to do, because you just went, Okay, this lady's crazy. You know, having this woman was, like, panicking. She was, she was having a panic attack, you know, almost ran in front of our car and, and you said, alright, we don't have cell service. Carrie, you're going to stay here with this lady and I'm going to drive to where I can get get help. And you just, like, kind of had very decisive, clear, but very calm, very nurturing kind of way with this lady. And I was like, I don't know what to do, and you're like, Carrie, you're going to do this, and I'm going to do this. And I was like, I really like how decisive and yet compassionate you are, and I think that's part of what bond just not just finding a dead guy, which makes for a great story, and, like, a traumatic experience we shared, but I saw you your leadership in action, and I was like, this is a person I can trust. And so I think sometimes that's true with our animals as well, you know, like but when you go through a difficult situation, a fearful situation, if, if you are with someone who handles that well, you learn from them, and you also learn to trust them.   Michael Hingson ** 29:06 So, you know, we talk about telling stories and so on, and one of the stories that I told a little bit in thunderdog, but didn't really, at the time, internalized it like I should have, and I have since is regarding going down the stairs. We got to about the 50th floor going down, and I mentioned it in thunderdog, and we also talk about it in more detail and live like a guide dog. But suddenly my colleague David Frank, who was in the office with me that day, because we were going to be doing sales seminars. And David came from our corporate office in California, and David's job was to deal with pricing models and all that, and he was going to teach our resellers all about the pricing options and so on, while I was going to do all the major technical stuff, because I was going to be the regular contact for these people. Anyway, we were going down the stairs and we got to about the. 50th floor. And suddenly David said, Mike, we're going to die. We're not going to make it out of here. And immediately I went, I got to stop that. I can't let him do that. We've been trying to keep panic off of the stairs, and various people at various times, help with that. So I just said in the sharpest voice, I could stop it, David, if Rosella and I can go down these stairs so can you. And that was intentional. What David told me later was that that did bring him out of his funk, and what he decided to do, and asked me if it was okay, and I didn't really care, but yeah, it really was okay. He asked if it would be a problem if I if he just walked a floor below me on the stairs and shouted up to me everything that he saw. And I said, Sure, go ahead. So we start down the stairs. I get to the 49th floor, and all of a sudden I hear, Hey, Mike, I'm on the 48th floor. All clear here, going on down. And he told me that he wanted to do that because he needed to take his mind off of what was bothering him, which was, who knows what and what are we going to get out of here? So then I get to the 48th floor, and he's on the 47th and says, 47th floor. All good couple floors later, I'm on floor 45 and he goes, Hey, this is the 44th floor where I am now. This is where the Port Authority cafeteria is not stopping going on down the stairs, and he went all the rest of the way down the stairs shouting up what he saw. Did I need it? No, was it helpful? Sure. It was. Because we got to the 30th floor, and all of a sudden, David said, hey, the firefighters are coming up the stairs. Everybody moved to the side. Let them buy and we had some interactions with them. But the point of telling you the story is that I realized, actually only in the last few years how important and how absolutely useful and necessary what David did was all about that is to say he kept saying, I'm on whatever floor he was on and going on down the stairs, he became absolutely a focal point for anyone on the stairs who could hear him. So anyone within the sound of his voice knew that somewhere on the stairs there was someone who was doing okay, or at least who sounded okay, and that had to keep so many people from panicking going down the stairs. 19th floor. All good here, and I think that's so wonderful that he did that. And he was doing it, I think, and he said to keep his own fears in check, but he was helping so many people go down the stairs and that that kind of thing isn't really talked about so nearly enough, but it helped him deal with his own fear, and it helped so many people as we went down the stairs. It   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 32:53 was just very reassuring, not only, you know, to every like you said to everybody who could hear him, and you know, sometimes we just need to know it's going to be okay. There's somebody you're not alone, you know, well,   Michael Hingson ** 33:04 and the re the reality is that he conveyed that message to so many people, probably 1000s of people, because, you know, we were all on these open stairwells, and so so many people above and below him could hear him. And I think that I love how important?   Susy Flory ** 33:22 Yeah, I love how he was keeping people in the moment. You know, everyone was focusing on the task at hand. And I think that helps keep fear at bay. It   Michael Hingson ** 33:33 does. And you know, the other part about that is we didn't know what was going on. We didn't know that it was a hijacked aircraft that crashed into the towers. We figured that an airplane hit the building because we were smelling burning jet fuel, but we didn't know what the details were. And so I'm sure minds were going in so many different directions as to what was going on. As I tell people, I love to read science fiction, so I was imagining all sorts of things. But I also knew that no matter what I was imagining, we got to deal with going down the stairs and focusing and all that which which we did. And I know people followed me because they kept hearing me telling Roselle What a good girl she was. Good dog. Keep going, what a good dog you are. And they, they, they told me later, look, if you could go down the stairs and just encourage Roselle and all that, we're going to follow you. Which is, which is what they did. And you know, the reality is that we can control fear. Fear doesn't need to overwhelm us. And again, as I've said, it's a it's a very powerful tool. And we talk about ways that you can learn to do that, ways that you can learn to calm and quell fears in your own lives, by introspection, by thinking about what goes on on any given day, and anybody who says that they don't have time at the end of the day or at the very beginning of the next day, but I think especially at the end of the day, to take a few moments. And go. How did it go today? What worked, what didn't? Why didn't? What didn't work? Why did that happen? What do I learn from that I'm a firm believer, not that I'm my own worst critic in everything that I do, although that's what I used to say, I've learned that I'm my own best teacher. Because ultimately, people can provide me with information, but I have to teach it to myself, and I have to take the time to allow myself to learn from what I'm thinking. And I believe that all of us are our own best teachers, and that we need to take into account what we feel and analyze it, and the more of that that we do, the more introspection, and the more self analysis that we do, the the stronger that mind muscle becomes, and the less we're afraid. And that's, of course, a lot about what live like a guide dog is really about.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 35:55 Mike, I'd love to share with your the listeners some of the strategies that, as we talked through, you know, your story, and the way that you have, you know, figured out how to, like you said, become more self aware, some of the strategies that are, you know, offered to people so that they can learn. In the book, we talk about awareness and we talk about preparation, which mentioned that before we talk about flexibility, we talk about perseverance, empathy, trust and teamwork, which, obviously that's a big one, right, even things like listening and rest, which seem more passive, actually help us to do like what you're talking about, live in the moment, right? And of course, Faith is an important part of of not being afraid, and we talk about that a lot, and just of listening to your instincts, listening to your own, you know, your own intuition. Um, so those are some of the like, the strategies in the book. And I think if people will, you know, read the book, they'll, they'll learn how to implement those strategies and teach themselves how to turn their Fear into Courage. And that's one of the reasons I'm excited about this book,   Michael Hingson ** 37:17 and the reason we call the book live like a guide dog is that it's all about all of these lessons that we're talking about are lessons that I learned from observing dogs over the years. I've said a number of times, no offense to them, but I've learned a whole lot more about trust in teamwork and dealing with life from working with now eight guide dogs and my wife's dog, Fantasia, who was Africa's mother, and Fantasia was a breeder for guide dogs also. But I learned so much more from those dogs than I ever learned from all the team experts like Tony Robbins and Ken Blanchard and all that, because it's no offense to them, they teach a lot of good things, but it's personal and internalized when you have to live it, and you live it working with dogs, when the team learns how to to work well together, and I think it's so important to do that. So there's no doubt that in so many ways, this is a book about dogs, but it's also a book about more than that people and the relationship between dogs and people, the human animal bond, and something we haven't talked a lot about, which we can talk about briefly here, is that this book, just like thunder dog, since I am a firm believer in teamwork, was a collaborative effort. Susie and I worked together on thunderdog. We both wrote, we we evaluated each other's writings, and we put together a book that was very successful. And Carrie and I have done the same thing with live like a guide dog. It is a collaborative effort, and I think that's so important, because I think that the whole idea of teamwork brings different perspectives and different ideas that all ended up going into the book, and I think will make it a very successful book.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 39:13 Yeah. Well, thanks, Mike. It's been a really a lot of fun to work on. And like I said, I learned a lot. You know, it's interesting. You talked about learning from the dogs. There were times where your dogs had to learn from you, not to be afraid. Like, I don't know if you want to tell the story, sure, Klondike, when you were training him.   Michael Hingson ** 39:32 Well, let me, let me first of all say, Well, I'll tell the story, and then I have a second Klondike story. So, and by the way, we talk about these in live like a guide dog, and some of it was referenced in thunderdog, but we get more relevant and detailed in live like a guide dog. But when I first met Klondike at Guide Dogs for the Blind, the class supervisor was Terry Barrett, who. Who I hadn't really gotten to know. But because of what happened, we became pretty close afterward. And what happened was when about the last week of the class, we started going into San Francisco to get good city work in and more populated areas and so on. And the first time we went in, everything was fine, but the second time we went in, when it was my turn to get off the bus, I stood up with Klondike, and as the closer I got to the front of the bus, the slower Klondike walked, and he started shaking and shivering and didn't even want to get off the bus. And so everybody else was off, and Terry came on and he said, what's going on? And I said, Well, I'm really concerned about this. And he said, Just be patient with him. Work it through. Dogs do develop beers from time to time, but they also are depending on us to show them the way to to to be calm. So we finally got Klondike off the bus, and as soon as we got off the bus, he began to work pretty well. The next day, the same thing happened, and again, Klondike was very fearful. By the third day, being patient with him and encouraging and supporting him, saw Klondike actually becoming less fearful, and we were able to work through that. You know, dogs do have fears. Roselle became afraid of thunder. And, in fact, the night before September 11, well the morning of September 11, at one or 12th midnight, or 112 30 in the morning, we had a thunderstorm, and Roselle was afraid of thunder. And I took Roselle downstairs, and she was shaking and shivering, but she was under my desk, and we got through it, and then we went upstairs, and we got some more sleep. And then, of course, we went into the World Trade Center, and people have said, well, she was afraid of thunder. Why wasn't she afraid when there was an explosion or whatever happened in the World Trade Center? The answer is, first of all, it wasn't that loud, but second of all, it wasn't thunder, they know. And so Roselle didn't have a problem with all the other stuff. Now, Klondike, let's just point out that Klondike is one of those religious dogs. One day we we were members of the San Marcos United Methodist Church, and the church had invited itinerant Minister Kimball Colburn to come and and do some some teaching. And that night, then the main night, he was there. He did an altar call, and Karen and I decided we'd go up. Karen was in her her wheelchair and and I said, you want to go up? And she said, yeah. So we, we were there. Klondike was there. And I told Klondike, just stay here. We'll be back. Just stay we get up to the front of the room. We're standing in line, and all of a sudden, right in front of us, comes Klondike and sits down. He wanted to be part of the altar call, and Kimball gave him the sacrament, you know, which? Which was great. But he was that kind of a very sensitive dog in so many ways, and so it's fun that he he did participate, and was such a wonderful companion for so many years.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 43:24 You know, Mike, I um, you said something about like when Klondike was afraid to get off the bus, and you didn't get mad at Klondike, you didn't shame him. You were just patient and reassuring and encouraging. And I think that you know whether you have a dog or not, when, when I feel afraid, one of the things I think that I live more like a guide dog now than I used to, is I try to be patient with myself and be okay. Kari, what's going on? Like, what's this fear? What? And instead of going, Oh, why are you so dumb, you should just be you should, you know, just tough it out and be brave and be strong. No, I'm patient with myself, I think, more than I used to be before I worked on this book. And I encourage myself. You can do this. You know, your feelings make sense. It's okay. Just stay in the moment. I kind of pep talk myself, but I'm very patient with myself, and I think that's a hard thing to do. We're all harder on ourselves than we are on other people. We say things to ourselves that we would never say to someone else, like, how many times you go I'm so that was so dumb. You know? You wouldn't say that to somebody else.   44:38 Some people do anyway,   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 44:41 and and we don't, because that's not helpful, right? So it's more helpful to be kind to yourself, and I think that's one of the things I learned from this that has helped me deal with when I feel anxious or afraid, to just be patient with myself.   Michael Hingson ** 44:56 Lashing Out is usually something that occurs because. Are afraid, and we've we've grown up learning those kinds of things rather than learning. Wait a minute, there are better ways and and unfortunately, as a society, we don't really teach people how to learn to deal with fear and to make it a positive attribute in our lives and help us stay more focused on whatever it is that we need to stay focused on, and that, in reality, the fear isn't the problem. It is how we deal with it. That's the problem, and we don't learn enough about how to step back and go, Wait a minute. We can do this differently. And the reality is, the more that we take the approach of Wait a minute and really analyze, the quicker the process becomes, yeah, the first or second or third time perhaps you do it, it's going to take you a while and you got to stop and analyze and so on. But that's why I say that the mind is a muscle, and you can develop that muscle and get yourself and your mind to the point where when something happens that's unexpected, you can have a mindset kick in that says, Wait a minute. Let's look at this, and very quickly, make the kind of determinations and decisions that you really want to make and that that other people learn to make, you know, I talk about steel Team Six and other kinds of military things, and all the things that that that they learn to do, and they do learn to do them, it's learned behavior. And the reality is that we all can do that we all can recognize that we can live in the moment, we can function in very productive ways, and that we don't need to allow fear to blind us or overwhelm us. I will not say, Don't be afraid, but you don't need to let it overwhelm you.   Susy Flory ** 46:59 Yeah, Mike, I have a question for you that I don't remember if I've ever asked you this before, but it seems perfect for this concept of live like a guide dog, and that is, I know you were really quite young when you had your first guide dog. They made an exception for you, and I'm wondering what was the very first lesson you learned as a teenager from your very first guide dog.   Michael Hingson ** 47:23 I think the very first thing that I learned, well there, there are a couple. The first thing that comes to mind is responsibility, because I was responsible for that dog, and at 14 years old, that's a pretty awesome kind of a task to be able to perform, and it isn't just feeding the dog, it's supporting the dog. And I had a month at Guide Dogs for the Blind where the trainers really talked a lot about that, and being the youngest kid there, it is something that I didn't necessarily learn instantly, but I did learn well over a few years. But the other thing that I did learn was a lot about trust. The the the trainers always said, Follow your dog. And I think some schools for a while were were very much in the mindset of your dog never makes mistakes, just follow your dog. Well, that doesn't work, and we all, I think, understood that, at least over time, but following your dog and learning to trust your dog and learning to establish that relationship with your dog was important. And what what happened was things like, I get to a street corner, and now, of course, it's even more relevant than it used to be. I get to a street corner, we stop. I'm listening to hear which way the traffic is going, and I will cross the street the way I want to go when I hear the traffic going parallel to where I want to travel, because if it's going across in front of me, it, you know, I have a master's degree in physics. I know about classical mechanics. Two pieces of matter can't occupy the same space at the same time. And classical mechanics, and I don't want the second piece of matter to be a big car that hits me, you know. So I need to make sure that the traffic is going the way I want to go before I cross, but I tell the dog forward, and the dog doesn't go. I have learned instantly, probably there's a reason. Now, it could be that the dog is distracted, although that's rare, because I've learned to trust my dogs. I mean, the dog could see a duck and wants to go visit, but typically, that isn't what happens, especially the more you get to know the dog and you realize there's a reason for the dog not moving. When we were running away from tower two, and we came to a place where there was an opening in the building next to us, and then we wanted. Get in and out of the dust cloud. I didn't know whether Roselle could hear me or see my hand signals, but I kept telling her right, right, right. And I heard an opening, and she obviously knew what I wanted. She turned right, she took one step, and she stopped. She would not move. And it took me a few seconds to realize, wait a minute, she stopped for a reason. It's what we call Intelligent Disobedience. That wasn't the term that we learned when I got squire my first dog. It was all about follow your dog, but Intelligent Disobedience is a very important part of working with a guide dog. The fact of the matter is that I need to trust the dog. When the dog stops and doesn't do what I expect, there's probably a reason. Well, Roselle stopped and wouldn't move. I investigated and discovered that we were at the top of a flight of stairs, and when I said forward, we went down the stairs, or likewise, getting back to the street corner. If I say forward and she doesn't go, or he doesn't go. There's probably a reason, and the reason, most likely today, is quiet cars or hybrid vehicles that are running in electric mode and I can't hear them, and there's one coming down the street and the dog doesn't want to get killed, much less get me killed, unless the dog doesn't like me very well. But I don't want that to be the case. So the fact of the matter is that we we develop that level of trust, and when the dog doesn't move, I'm going to stop and try to analyze and figure out what's going on, and then we go. But that trust was one of the most important things that I had to learn a lot about in ways that I had never learned before. You know, I've been blind my whole life. I trusted my parents and so on, and I I trusted my own skills. I walked to elementary school every day until we went to the fourth grade, and then I took bus to a different school, and I was able to learn to travel around the campus and all that, but still, creating a team was pretty new to me overall, when I got squire. And so learning that trust and learning that that's a very important thing, was something that that I had to do. And again, I think it's also important to recognize you don't trust blindly. And as I said before, dogs don't trust unconditionally. They're looking to develop trust, and dogs want to develop a trusting relationship with us, but it is something that that has to be done. So even today, if the dog stops and doesn't move, I'm not going to yell at the dog. I may be wondering, well, what's the issue here? But I will stop and recognize that most likely, there's a reason. And like I said, there's always that one possibility that it could be that they see a bird and they want to go visit the bird, but guide dogs generally are are chosen because they're not overly distracted. And I want to keep it that way, so it is all about trust. And that's that's something that we all need to learn. You know, I keep hearing people talk about in our political world, well, I trust this guy. He's talking to me. Sorry, that doesn't work. Trust has to be earned, and we have to each step back in whatever we're doing and look at what's going on around us, and when somebody says something to us, I'm generally going to take the time to analyze it and see if that's really true or not, and and the more that I find that I can relate to what someone says, the more I'm really apt to trust them. But I'm not going to trust them arbitrarily or, as I would say, blindly. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, that's great   Susy Flory ** 54:02 trust, but verify.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 54:04 Yeah, it's important Exactly, exactly.   Michael Hingson ** 54:08 But you know it's, it is? It is so wonderful when that kind of a relationship does occur, working with a guide dog, when the teaming relationship is there, working with people, when the teaming relationship is there, is so important and it's it's such an awesome experience to have.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 54:34 I think if you have trusting relationships, whether with an animal or another person, you will be generally less afraid because you feel a little safer in the world, not that you trust everyone, and not that you're never afraid, but if you have safe people or animals, or you know connections with others, that builds sort of a a. Reservoir within you of of goodwill that you are not afraid of everything you know. I think that's why you know people or animals who have been who have suffered abuse, are less are more fearful, right? They're less likely to trust because their trust has been betrayed in the past.   Michael Hingson ** 55:21 We had one of those in 2003 we indicated, when I was at guide dogs that we would care for geriatric dogs. And in 2003 I was called. I was in my office at guide dogs, and the veterinarian department called and said, we have a senior dog. She's 12, and we were wondering if you could take her. She's fearful, she's deaf, she's got arthritis. She's got a big lump on her back, which we think is an infected cyst that we can take care of. But she had never been a guide dog. She was career changed before becoming a guide dog, and they just said it was temperament. We figured it probably later we realized it was very strong willed. It wasn't a bad thing, and that today, or in 2003 they knew more about how to deal with that, and she would have made a great guide dog. But anyway, I called Karen and told her about this dog. And so we met Panama, who was a 12 year old golden retriever. She was very fearful. They thought she was deaf because they dropped a big, large Webster's Dictionary right by her in Panama. Didn't even respond. We took her home, and over a couple of months, we discovered that she wasn't really totally deaf. She was she was old and she was fearful. We think that the people who had her last had just locked her in a garage, and they maybe abused her, I don't know, but we just supported her. She was afraid to go on walks with Karen in the wheelchair, but eventually she decided that that was okay, and so Karen and she would walk. And you know, of course, all of us supported her. She was she had enough arthritis. She really couldn't play roughly with the other dogs, but she liked to be around them. One day, we were going up to Oregon for a guide dog event from where we were in Northern California, and I was putting luggage in our car, so I opened the door going from our house into the garage, and all of a sudden, like a shot, this dog ran past me out into the garage, and the van was open. She ran up into the van and went into the main part of the car, the vehicle. We knew when that happened, that Panama had gone somewhere, she had crossed a line and developed enough of a trust that she was willing to go out and get in the car and be more a part of the family. But she was very fearful, and there were still a lot of other issues with her, but the more we worked with her, the more she realized that she could trust us and we had her. For before that, she had been afraid of the car, she had been afraid of the car, she had been afraid of people were afraid. She was afraid of everything. She was afraid of everything. And it was pretty amazing when suddenly she took that leap, and it got better from then on, but she knew that we were with her and that we would support her.   58:35 Yeah, that's a great story.   Michael Hingson ** 58:36 Well, Susie, any any other thoughts or questions that you might have you you've been quiet lately.   Susy Flory ** 58:45 What is your newest lesson? I that makes me curious too, because you've had Guide Dogs for a while now. You had a number of them. Each one's different. Each relationship is different. So with LMO, what might be your latest lesson that you're learning? Because we're all lifelong learners, right?   Michael Hingson ** 59:05 I have been really impressed with some of the new training techniques that I've seen at Guide Dogs for the Blind. I mentioned clickers, which is sort of like a, you know, those metal crickets, you squeeze a minute ago, something like that. But the idea is that when I got Roselle, they had started really investigating new and better training techniques. And what I have found is that they actually have developed techniques using technologies and just different processes that they've been able to shorten the length of time it takes to learn to use, or it takes shorter times for the guide dog to learn to be a guide dog. When I went up to Oregon to get Panama. On excuse me to get Alamo, which was the first guide dog I've gotten in Oregon. So we went up in 2018 to get Alamo, and we graduated on my birthday, so he's a great birthday present. But anyway, when I was up there the first day we started walking, the trainer was right behind me, and I knew that she was carrying a clicker. We cross the street, and actually we got to the curb and and stopped, and she immediately clicked the clicker. What a clicker is is a device that's a demarcation. And when the dog does what you want, if you immediately click and then you follow it with food rewards, the click really tells the dog, good job. You don't use it in a negative way, and that's one of the positive ways to really work to develop good, strong relationships with dogs. Well, anyway, we crossed the street, and then we walked a little bit further, and suddenly we came to the opening to an alley, and the trainer said, Let's try and experiment, because Klondike or rose Alamo was going to just go across the alley, she said, the trainer did stop and back up. And when you get to the end of the alley, stop and tell the dog halt. I did. The trainer clicked. I gave Alamo a food reward. We went back a little bit and did that two or three times, and suddenly Alamo regularly would stop at the opening to that alley, which was a wise thing to do, because cars could come out. I don't know, but I bet today, six years later, if I were to go up to warring and we went down that same sidewalk and we got to that alley, Alamo would stop because the clicker reinforced the behavior in a very positive way, so much that he'll remember it. He's a very bright dog, and I'm absolutely confident that he would so some of the new training techniques and the brightness of the dogs to be able to take advantage of those things, I think, is so important. And I think one of the things that I found most intriguing going forward.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 1:02:06 I think you know that really points to positive reinforcement again. You know, with ourselves, with others. You know, if we're you know, you know, if we say we have a friend who is always fearful, and we if we just say, Don't be afraid. Don't be afraid, that doesn't really help, but if we notice them doing the right thing to point it out, I think that improves our relationship, and it can help that person overcome fear. Yeah, you know, yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:32 And we've got to get away from so much negativity and really find more positive ways for us to reinforce ourselves and also to get that same behavior from other people. I think it is so important. Yeah, well, we've been doing this for a while. I guess I would ask if there are any kind of last thoughts that either of you have. We're, of course, excited that little like a guide dog came out today, and that hopefully everyone will now even be more intrigued and go buy it. We'd love it to be another best selling book. So we hope that you'll really join us in that journey. And so if anyone, if either of you have any other final comments or whatever, let's go ahead and do them. Just   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 1:03:20 you know what? I hope that people will get this book and tell others about it, you know, write a review, tell a friend. You know. I'm sure we all have people in our life who love dogs and people who wrestle with fear, and either those type people would love to get a copy of this book. I   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:41 think between those two classes of people that takes in everyone and I'm, I'm everyone   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 1:03:46 in the world, everyone they either love dogs or they're afraid,   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:51 or both, or both, and dogs can help teach us so many things.   Susy Flory ** 1:03:57 Dogs are bridge builders. You know, everyone, almost everyone, can look at a dog and, you know, kind of feel that connection to the dog. Dogs feel the connection to people. And dogs don't care what political party we are or what we think about the news or which way the economy's going. I love how they live in the moment. They look for opportunities to connect, to play, to rest and just the rhythms of life of a dog. I think, you know, there's something that we can learn there about what's important and what is not as important. And the people in our lives and those we connect to are important. The labels, not so much.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 1:04:45 Yeah, love that. That's good word, Susy.   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:48 And as long as at the beginning and end of the day we get fed, we're happy. That's what Alamo said. We   Susy Flory ** 1:04:55 get our treats, then we gotta get our toys. Yeah?   Michael Hingson ** 1:05:03 That is what matters. Well, I want to thank you both for being here and if, if either or both of you want to come on again. We we should do it, but I really want to thank you for taking the time to be here with us today. I would love to hear from all of you out there. Love to hear your thoughts about what you've heard today, what you learned. We would certainly appreciate it wherever you're listening or watching. If you'll give us a five star rating, we value those ratings very highly. If you'd like to reach out to me, it's easy. You can email me at Michael h i@accessibe.com that's M, I, C, H, A, E, L, H, I at accessibe, A, C, C, E, S, S i b, E.com, or go to our podcast page, www, dot Michael hingson.com/podcast, and Michael hingson is M, I C, H, A, E, L, H, I N, G, S O N.com/podcast, and for you, Kari and Susy, both of you, how do people maybe reach out to you.   Keri Wyatt Kent ** 1:06:02 I have a website, Carrie Wyatt, kent.com it's K E R, I, W, Y, A, T, T, K E N T. I'm also easy to find just by Googling and on on social media. My My full name is my handle on everything. So I'd love to connect on Instagram or Facebook. Um, it's my where I'm mostly at, or LinkedIn. Um, so yeah,   Susy Flory ** 1:06:30 Susie, Yeah, same as Kari. You can find me kind of in those different places. And if you have a cute dog video or squirrel video, be sure and send it my way. And   Michael Hingson ** 1:06:40 so what's your website? And   Susy Flory ** 1:06:43 it's my name? Yeah, Susy flory.com my name is

Have you heard the word "covenant" in the bible or people talk about it but struggle with how to live it out? Today I am going to share with you guys a definition I learned about covenant while reading a very helpful book from Van Moody called The People Factor. Here is a link for that book on Amazon: https://a.co/d/0W1DsTo Want to order a signed copy of my book? I only have 4 copies left! https://buy.stripe.com/dR68xdg6F9Nr6e4aEF --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/ashley-campbell29/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/ashley-campbell29/support

Check out this episode to find out more about this book! You can listen to this podcast on Apple, Anchor, Amazon, Google, and Spotify! The information for all my social media is in the description of the actual podcast! Thanks for listening! Feel free to follow or share with a friend! Peace& Blessings! #bookreview #DesiredbyGod #VanMoody #BEEChannel #faith #biblestudy #bibleverse --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/amber-johnson40/message

Become a Member for ad-free listening, video versions and exclusive content: https://benlionelscott.com/subscribe — This episode is spoken by Les Brown, TD Jakes, Andy Frisella, Robin Sharma, Van Moody. You can see more of Les Brown at instagram.com/thelesbrown, TD Jakes at instagram.com/bishopjakes, Andy Frisella at instagram.com/andyfrisella, Robin Sharma at instagram.com/robinsharma, Van Moody at twitter.com/Van_Moody. The music is No Man's Land by Zack Hemsey. You can see more of Zack Hemsey at facebook.com/zackhemseymusic.

This episode is spoken by Les Brown, TD Jakes, Andy Frisella, Robin Sharma, Van Moody. You can see more of Les Brown at instagram.com/thelesbrown, TD Jakes at instagram.com/bishopjakes, Andy Frisella at instagram.com/andyfrisella, Robin Sharma at instagram.com/robinsharma, Van Moody at twitter.com/Van_Moody. The music is No Man's Land by Zack Hemsey. You can see more of Zack Hemsey at facebook.com/zackhemseymusic.

Become a Member for ad-free listening, video versions and exclusive content: https://benlionelscott.com/subscribe — This episode is spoken by TD Jakes, David Goggins, Van Moody, Eric Thomas. You can see more of TD Jakes at instagram.com/bishopjakes, David Goggins at instagram.com/davidgoggins, Van Moody at twitter.com/Van_Moody, Eric Thomas at instagram.com/etthehiphoppreacher. The music is The Way by Zack Hemsey. You can see more of Zack Hemsey at facebook.com/zackhemseymusic.

This episode is spoken by TD Jakes, David Goggins, Van Moody, Eric Thomas. You can see more of TD Jakes at instagram.com/bishopjakes, David Goggins at instagram.com/davidgoggins, Van Moody at twitter.com/Van_Moody, Eric Thomas at instagram.com/etthehiphoppreacher. The music is The Way by Zack Hemsey. You can see more of Zack Hemsey at facebook.com/zackhemseymusic.

What would you do if you had nothing to fear? Often times the very thing that you are afraid is where God is, where He is moving and where He has called you to be. You just have to push past your fears and GO FOR IT! Bishop Van Moody stops by this weekend with a reminder that those impossible odds set the stage for God to show up and do His best work!

In this episode, we talk with Bishop Van Moody about his leadership journey, his superfood cafe, Kale Me Crazy, what it looks like to steward your health and body well, the multiple books he has published, and more! It costs more to repair than to prepare, so gear up to live excellently and draw closer to God for His glory!

On August 2, 2011, Thunder Dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog, and the triumph of trust at Ground Zero was officially released. Overnight it became a bestseller book on the NY Times Bestseller list and even rose to the #1 rank. I was the principal author, but in 2010 I met Susy Flory, herself a full-time author, who helped bring the story alive.   Now, you get to meet Susy and hear her story. There is an incredible and fascinating story to Susy's life and her books. She even gets into a discussion of the need for authors to make their websites accessible for persons with disabilities during our interview. My time with Susy in this interview was fun, informative, and not boring in any way. I hope you think so as well. Some directories do not show full show notes. For the complete transcription please visit https://michaelhingson.com/podcast About Our Guest: Susy Flory is a #1 New York Times best-selling author or co-author of fourteen books, including The Sky Below, a new memoir with Hall of Fame Astronaut/Explorer Scott Parazynski, and Desired by God with Van Moody. Susy grew up on the back of a quarter horse in Northern California and took degrees from UCLA in English and psychology. She has a background in journalism, education, and communications and directs a San Francisco Bay Area writers conference. She first started writing at the Newhall Signal with the legendary Scotty Newhall, an ex-editor of the San Francisco Chronicle and a one-legged cigar-smoking curmudgeon who ruled the newsroom from behind a dented metal desk where he pounded out stories on an Underwood Typewriter. She taught high school English and journalism, then quit in 2004 to write full time for publications such as Focus on the Family, Guideposts Books, In Touch, Praise & Coffee, Today's Christian, and Today's Christian Woman. Susy's books include So Long Status Quo: What I Learned From the Women Who Changed the World, as well as the much-anticipated 2011 memoir she co-wrote with blind 9-11 survivor Michael Hingson, called Thunder Dog: The True Story of a Blind Man, His Guide Dog, and the Triumph of Trust at Ground Zero. Thunder Dog was a runaway bestseller and spent over a dozen weeks on the New York Times bestseller list. .http://www.susyflory.com/ https://www.facebook.com/everythingmemoir About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app. Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes Michael Hingson  00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i  capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson  01:21 Welcome to another episode of unstoppable mindset. And today we have a person who I regard as a very special guest. I'm a little bit prejudiced, though. You know, my story if you've listened to these podcasts regularly, 20 years ago, I worked in the World Trade Center and escaped with my guide dog Roselle. And in I think, June, if I recall, right, maybe it was earlier than that. Maybe it was like April or May of 2010. I got a phone call on a Sunday afternoon from a woman who said that she was writing a book called Dog tails. And she said she wanted to include Roselle story. I noticed that wasn't my story. It was rosellas story in her book, and asked if I would tell her our story. And I did. There was this pause afterward. And then she said, Why aren't you writing your own book. And she offered to help. And the result of that was that Suzy Florrie introduced me to her agent, we created a proposal and thunder dog was published in August, officially released in August of 2011. And I thought it would be kind of fun to have Susie on to tell her story. And to compare notes and talk about whatever comes along. So Susie, welcome to unstoppable mindset.   Susy Flory  02:38 Thank you, Mike, I'm so glad to be here with you.   Michael Hingson  02:43 I'm been looking forward to this for a while. And I think that we'll have a lot of fun. And we'll see who all we can can pick on what can I say. But here we are. So So tell me what got you into writing in the first place, what made you start to go down that that path.   Susy Flory  03:04 It was kind of a childhood dream. It's kind of one of those, you know, I want to be a lion tamer, I want to be an astronaut kind of dreams for me. Because I didn't know any writers. And I didn't, I had no idea how to go about it. But I just always loved reading. And I know you love reading too. We're very alike in that way. And so I just grew up in a book of world, a world of books and ideas and stories. And just always thought, Wow, if I could do that, but I didn't think it was a real kind of dream. And then I got to work at a newspaper. And I sort of started to see that there might be a way in. And it wasn't until my late 30s that I went to a Writers Conference. And I remember seeing a book editor walk by for a publishing house and he was wearing kind of grubby tennis shoes and jeans and a T shirt. And I thought he's just a normal guy. He's just a regular person because I think I thought you know, people who did writing and publishing were highly evolved beings that I could not be a part of. And so that was just kind of my way it was just seeing Hey, maybe I can do this.   Michael Hingson  04:23 And there you are.   Susy Flory  04:26 So you know overnight successn 20 years.   Michael Hingson  04:30 So you were working. You were working in a newspaper what were your reporter   Susy Flory  04:35 I was a features writer. Okay, I'm not really a hard news person. All they love to read the news, but I love the stories behind the news, and particularly people stories. So even though I was reading that book, dog tails, you know, I was very interested in the people's tails as well. And so I love meeting interesting, unique people who have a story to tell which is almost everyone in the world. If you sit down and talk to them   Michael Hingson  05:03 well, how did you? So how did you get into doing a book.   Susy Flory  05:09 So that's another big jump. So when you're in a newspaper, you know, you get an assignment or you get a lead, or you have an idea yourself, and you got write a little story on it. And you can do it in a few days, typically. So I kind of knew how to do that. But it wasn't enough for me, I, you know, wrote some shorter stories, got some things published. And then just found myself wanting to go deeper and do research and be people and just get bigger stories down on paper. So that was kind of a craving for me. And I think it's because I gravitated towards books, because I loved books so much. And so what my second book, one of my very early books was a memoir that I wrote for myself. It's called a stunt memoir. And it's kind of where you're set yourself some assignments, and then you live them out and write about them. So I decided to investigate women who I thought had changed the world, people like Harriet Tubman, Eleanor Roosevelt, you know, Rosie the Riveter and do something that those women had done. And I just created like this little set of assignments for myself. And I was terrified because writing a book is really hard, as you know, or maybe it was easy for you. I don't know, like, maybe it was easy for you. But writing a book is hard for me. But I enjoyed it so much the challenge, and it pushed me and challenged me. So that's kind of how I shifted from writing articles, which felt doable to books, which seemed extremely hard and scary.   Michael Hingson  06:50 What was your first book published?   Susy Flory  06:53 So my first book was about the Davinci Code. Do you remember that story? Yes. It was published in the early 2000s. And it really took the writing and publishing world by storm unexpectedly. And there was a lot to talk about in the book was about Jesus, and maybe he was married. Maybe there was this whole mystery that we didn't know. And the book was fiction, it was all made up. But it really touched on some things I think people were curious about. So my first book was called fear, not the VINCI. And it kind of centered on these big questions that people had.   Michael Hingson  07:32 How did you get it published? Since you had not published a book before?   Susy Flory  07:37 Good question, because I didn't have an agent at that point. And basically, what you do is you start submitting. So without an agent, you create what's called a query letter. And it's basically a pitch a short pitch. And back in the day, you could either mail them, so you would write a letter with a self addressed stamped envelope, hoping that you would get a response. Or it was really kind of early days of email correspondence, as well. So you can do either and you would contact, you would basically be cold, calling editors, and trying to get them excited about you and your writing, and whatever your idea was. So that's what I did. And I got 13 rejections on that first book. And number 14, I found an editor who was interested, who I had met at a writers conference. So I think when they meet brand new writers at a Writers Conference, industry, people, they can see that you're not a crazy person, and they might want to work with you. So it's a good groundwork to lay. So going to a conference meeting another and then writing these query letters. That's how I got that book deal.   Michael Hingson  08:53 I was that evolves to today, is the process different now do you think,   Susy Flory  08:59 um, it's very similar. If you don't have an agent, you still have to jump through these hoops. And that's how they weed a lot of people out to, you know, are not informed to want an easy way in. And so the pitching process is similar, but right now I have an agent so that that literary agent helps with that process. But I still have to create the pitch, still create a book proposal still, you know, develop the whole thing without actually writing it yet. And then, you know, the publisher needs to see what this book is going to be. They need a very good idea of it before they invest in it. So it's a lot of work. It's kind of that pre production part.   Michael Hingson  09:49 Yeah. Which is true, whether it's in writing or in selling or anything that you do, or that anyone does. There's always going to be a process and In a sense, it's good. It hasn't changed. Because, as you said, so many people want an easy way in. And the fact is, there isn't an easy way in,   Susy Flory  10:09 right? You gotta do your homework and prepare ahead of time. And then you may or may not be lucky. Yeah. But you can't be lucky if you don't prepare. And I know that you are so good at that, Mike, you're really great. You're an inspiration to me how you do the homework and prepare for everything that you do.   Michael Hingson  10:31 Well, thank you. You mentioned about easier, harder writing what I did when we did thunder dog, I had written lots of notes, I had created a lot of thought, on paper, and wrote a lot of the history. But that wasn't a book yet. And then when you said, Well, why, why aren't you writing your own book, and we, we started working toward that, and created a proposal that that was sellable. And of course, you having an agent, that was that was valuable, too. But the the point is that then when we started working on the book, all those notes came together. And what you did was you, you used your newspaper skills, if you will, to to coalesce that. And then we work together on on creating it, I'll never forget, when we were working with the folks at Thomas Nelson, and they came back and they said, The problem with your book right now is that you don't have good transitions between being in the World Trade Center and going back to previous places in your life. And it hit me I know how to do that. And I had never really thought about it before, but over a weekend created those, those transitions. And they love that. And of course, Curtis like that when they when they did their review of the book, but we worked well as a team. And I think there's there's value in that too. Because we we had a story to tell him, You adopted our story. And we made it a collective story, which I think helped.   Susy Flory  12:03 Yeah, because you can have a wonderful story and a lot of people do. But you have to make it entertaining, and enjoyable and readable and engaging and almost like addictive. You know, it's like the kind of think of it like the first date, you have a cover and a title and maybe a first page to connect with the reader. And then after that they better work. So we're not gonna stick around for long, if he's not excited, exciting to read,   Michael Hingson  12:32 right. I remember reading the first Harry Potter book, and it took a while to catch on. But we read it after lots of others had gone. I think actually it was the third book had already come out. By the time we discovered it. And Karen and I stuck with it. We read the audio version with Jim Dale. And for a while, we kept saying what is it that excites people about this? Because it just started out so slowly, but because there was such a big furor over it. We stuck with it. And it got better as it went along. But it didn't start out grabbing us with that first page.   Susy Flory  13:14 Yeah, it felt like that, too. But I think maybe children, you know, I mean, it was kind of geared towards what 6/7 eighth graders kind of that was maybe the primary audience at first. Yeah, like that's, yeah, yeah. And like, they might stick with something longer than a grown up reader would. And so in that case, I think we kind of followed what the kids were enjoying, and then kind of figured out, oh, this is good storytelling, it did kind of build, you know, it had the build. I agree with you on that.   Michael Hingson  13:46 And we have now read them all three times. You know, they're, they're great. They're great books to read. What about self publishing? How does that fit into the scheme of just the world of writing a book? And getting a book out? But also, can that help in terms of either that book or later books getting noticed by editors?   Susy Flory  14:14 Yeah, so self publishing, there are so many options. These days. It's kind of the wild west of publishing. And, you know, you have so many ways that you can be published, it's actually kind of confusing and overwhelming for people where it used to be more kind of straightforward, I think, with self publishing, if you have some sort of platform. So if you are out there speaking teaching, you have some sort of, you know, media channel a name for yourself, I think it's a really, really great option. If you don't have that you need to be prepared to do some advertising. And people have made a way for themselves self publishing that way as well. But it also works for someone who wants to publish something for friends and family. So I think a lot of this depends on your expectations. And in a world where physical bookstores, many of them have gone away, and much book shopping has gone online, it really is a viable option. But you really need to educate yourself and, you know, be involved at every step of the process, where when you're with a traditional legacy publisher, there are times you can kind of just let them take the lead on certain things.   Michael Hingson  15:31 Do you think that the traditional publishing world is going to go away with everything being online and so on?   Susy Flory  15:38 That is such a great debate, and it's been raging for years? Yeah. Yeah, it really changes like, you know, depending on what's going on in the world, and what's going on in the culture, the type of books that sell, or don't sell change. But right now, the publishing industry is doing just fine. And so I, I think there's always the danger. But there's something about physical books that people love and have loved for 1000s of years. So I don't see it completely going away, I do see it completely, you know, continuing to change and evolve.   Michael Hingson  16:16 I hope that libraries and bookstores, and the traditional publishing world doesn't go away. I think you're right. And I, I don't know how to really describe what it is to sit down with a book. You know, for me, it's in Braille, of course, but still, reading a book in Braille is not the same as listening to a recorded book, just like reading books with an electronic device, just apparently, isn't the same as sitting there and being able to turn the printed page, time after time, I hear people say that there's just nothing like reading that printed book.   Susy Flory  16:57 And, you know, people worry about television, and the streaming services, you know, Netflix, and all those things that offer so many options for entertainment. But there are still, I think, a very loyal and solid segment of the population that are word people. We love words, and you know, words in a book are they speak to us deeply? And so I think we're safe for now, Mike?   Michael Hingson  17:25 Yeah. Well, and and if you could get some of those people who watch TV, to sit down and read an engaging book, and if they truly get engaged, I wonder if that would, would change some of their views. Because what a book brings that television doesn't is the whole issue of imagination. I have, I have listened to radio shows that really evoke imagination. And I've even watched a few television shows that compel you to imagine, they don't spell everything out. And I find those to be most engaging a ball.   Susy Flory  18:10 I love that. Yeah, I'm actually in school right now, working on a master's, and my thesis that I'm working on touches on this idea that the reader collaborates and participates in the story. And so a book is going to be different. Every time a person picks up a book, whether it's fiction or nonfiction, it's going to be a little different, it's going to hit that person differently. Because they're participating. In that experience. It's like, as a writer, you're talking inside of their head and having a conversation with them. But you're not just dictating what they're gonna think and feel and imagine. So yeah, I love that. It's the process of, of engaging the imagination.   Michael Hingson  18:53 It's interesting to think about textbooks, I am still of the opinion, having read many textbooks in my life, especially physics textbooks, and so on. I think authors of textbooks are really missing it. By just making the textbooks about fact and theory and teaching what they teach and never putting stories in. I think they could do so much more if they both personalized it, and put some stories behind the teaching in the books that would make them more compelling for people to want to read.   Susy Flory  19:35 I agree. And when I used to read, I don't read magazines too often these days, but back in the day, I used to read a lot of women's magazine, infant fashion and culture and all the stuff and I would always read the story, story part of the article and just skip over the teaching and bullet points and facts parts so I totally agree with you.   Michael Hingson  19:57 Well, even magazines like Playboy, you You know, I don't know how many people know. But one of the best science fiction stories of all the fly was originally published in Playboy, and Playboy had stories no matter what else it was doing. And, and all the other different things that went into it. The creators of that magazine recognize the value of good stories and good writing to one of my favorite stories about September 11. Is that a week or so later, after the the events of September 11. And we got very visible in the media. We got a call, I got a call from America Media and of course, are the people who publish the National Enquirer and other magazines, and, and papers which tend to be weak on accurate content and more on sensationalism. And this person wanted to do an interview and they said it was going to be serious, and we talked on the phone, and they wanted to send someone out to take pictures. And I said, okay, and I went off and I told my wife, Karen, that this was happening. And of course, she immediately hit the roof, they're going to sensationalize it. How could you even agree to that? You know who they are. They're crazy. And, in fact, the guy called the day before he was going to come out to take the picture. And he said, I want to make sure that that I'm calling the right person. This is Michael Hinkson, who was in the elevator that fell from the 100th floor to the bottom and survived and, and he's the guy right. And Karen immediately said, nobody's coming out to take pictures. Well, what we found out later was that, in fact, there had been that rumor and they were investigating it. But American media still published our story as part of a journal that they put out around the World Trade Center. And it was actually one of the most journalistically best pieces, not just my story, but the whole magazine was one of the best pieces that that I had ever encountered. And Karen acknowledged it as well. They were very accurate. They were very thorough and told a great story. So you know, they can do it, sir, like the Harlem Globetrotters. Right? They have to be great basketball players to do what they do.   Susy Flory  22:24 Yeah, I know that. Sometimes they hire really good writers for their special editions, too. And they charge more for them. Because it's, you know, they're putting out a book basically. Right?   Michael Hingson  22:36 And they did a really great job with this one. And so, you know, people can do, what do publishers look for when someone is sending them a proposal and so on? What are they looking for?   Susy Flory  22:49 They look for three things, Mike, they look for a great idea. They look for great writing superior writing with a distinctive voice to it. And then they look for a platform, that you have some kind of connection with your readers, and that there are people out there who will buy what you have to fix. A lot of people have great ideas or they can write. But you know, to get someone to actually purchase a book. Yeah, to invest in it, there has to be that connection in some some way, some fashion or another. So those are the three things they look for, they will sometimes accept two out of three. So if you have an incredible story or book idea, and incredible writing gifts that you have refined, and with a distinct voice, sometimes you can squeak by without a platform, or, you know, one of the other things. So that's, that's kind of the scoop.   Michael Hingson  23:50 Well, I noticed that when we did thunder dog, the world had already changed to the point where they weren't doing as many book tours, and the publishers weren't doing as much marketing. They were also requiring that, that we as the people who were writing the book and proposing had to demonstrate what we were going to bring to marketing the book.   Susy Flory  24:14 That's right. Yeah, we had a lot of fun coming up with ideas and, you know, having meetings and things like that.   Michael Hingson  24:22 Well, and and we did and, you know, I think it actually did help a lot in not only getting visibility for the book, because we had, of course, you and I the biggest steak of all, we were the the authors, the creators of the book, but that also it gave us an insight into the world and the things that the publishers do and wanted to do, but they did their part as well. But today it is true that an author has to be ready to be able to to help sell the book   Susy Flory  25:00 Absolutely, you kind of become almost like your own little multimedia Corporation. But you know, on a very small scale, but you have to get the word out. And that doesn't mean just going on Facebook and saying buy my book, you have to look at where people are hanging out and what they like to read and do. You need to be out there, being excited about your book, which is easy to do, if you have written something that you know, is very meaningful that you care about deep. Lee, I always had a great time talking about thunder dogs. I was out there talking about it. You were talking about it 10 times more and more effectively. But we did we just had a good time sharing the story sharing the things that you have learned and wanted to share in the book.   Michael Hingson  25:50 And still do, by the way.   Susy Flory  25:54 That's right. And it's a story that never gets old Mike.   Michael Hingson  25:58 No, it doesn't get old it is it's gonna be there. It's fun to go out on on the road still and do speeches and travel and tell my story and talk about teamwork and trust and all sorts of things. And one of the things that I love to do somewhere in the course of of every talk that I give is to to encourage people to buy the book and then I have well nowadays Alamo set up and I say look, Alamo just told me that we're running low on kibbles. And so we poor starving off and we need you guys to buy books because Elmo says he's got to be able to eat tomorrow.   Susy Flory  26:30 Which is the trip which, by the way, right? Writers work hard for their kibble.   Michael Hingson  26:36 That's right. And their dogs and their dogs expected piece of the action.   Susy Flory  26:42 Right? Yeah, that was such a fun summer Mike hanging out at your house with Roselle and Africa. And Fantasia, you had three big beautiful labs that would be kind of wrestling at our feet as we talk. Yeah, it was a wonderful summer.   Michael Hingson  26:59 Yeah, it was. And we we, we lost well, Africa, retired in 2018. And then Fantasia passed away the next year. So we are now one dog family. But we also have a cat. So we we do keep busy with all of those. So tell me what, what is the difference between a memoir and a biography or an autobiography?   Susy Flory  27:27 Yeah, I think one thing to talk about it with that question. First is to say that there are kind of two categories of memoir, there are memoirs by big celebrities. So this might be a person like Michelle Obama, or Bill Gates or something like that. They can write whatever they want to write. So they may call it a memoir, more often, it's an autobiography. And they tell you the whole story of their life. And it's like 500 pages, you know, it's like this big huge brick of a book. But they're in a different category. They're just a household name. For most of us, myself included, people don't know us, as well. And so we write, we try to write an exciting story. So a memoir is making a story of your life. It's a true story. But you're doing some storytelling, and you have a beginning, middle and an end, you have an exciting moment that you're building to, and a lot of times that focuses on a season of your life. So thunder dog, focused on your 911 story. And then, you know, brought in things from your life as part of the book. And so a memoir is, is more focused than an autobiography. It's not a history, it's not a comprehensive history of your life.   Michael Hingson  28:46 Yeah, and I've read some pretty boring autobiographies. And there again, it goes back to what I said earlier. My My theory is that, putting some stories in help, where we're preparing, as you know, and have now submitted a proposal for a book. Originally, we were talking about calling it blinded by fear. But Carrie and I are, are calling it now a guide dogs Guide to Being brave. And it's about fear, and it's about overcoming fear. And it's about how, when you're confronted with an unexpected life change, you are often so fearful that you become blinded to making good choices. You don't learn how to use that fear in a positive and strong way. But one of the things that that I believe is important in writing that book is is to include stories to illustrate points along the way, because I think that makes any book more interesting.   Susy Flory  29:47 Yeah, I find that stories stick with me. And so you know, if I go to church and the preacher is preaching this amazing 10 points sermon, I'm not going to remember the points Unless they're stories involved, so I'll walk out and remember the stories. But remember the point?   Michael Hingson  30:06 Well, and the stories may be able to take you back to the points but but still, the stories are what sticks with you, because they're personal, you can you get drawn into the stories, because you can make them personal and kind of make them your own and, and you can feel what's going on in the story.   Susy Flory  30:27 Yeah, I love that. And that's, that was so important with your story, because most people are never going to have the set of experiences that you had on 911. They just aren't, you know, that was a unique event. But by telling your stories, and opening up your life in your world, you know, your hopes, dreams, fears, all of that people can relate to that. And that's what made your story. So I think a gauge engaging makes it so engaging and relatable.   Michael Hingson  31:01 So going back to memoirs, you created a community called educational memoir, right? It's called Everything, everything memoir, is that to teach people to write memoirs, or   Susy Flory  31:13 Yeah, and it's not it's, it was not never aimed at professional writers, although some writers are part of the community. But any ordinary person who wants to write their story, and so you probably have people ask you for advice with writing and publishing. And I've had that a lot. And at some point, you can't help everyone. You can't give every person individual person, you can't go to coffee with them, and tell them what to do, and help them and so I created this educational community. And it's on Facebook, we have a private group. And then I'm also doing a one year coaching group where people can write their memoir in a year with some coaching and help and feedback. And so, so many people want to write their stories, and they just don't know how to do it, or they write something that's difficult to read, that's not engaging. So my my mission and goal is to help people write a good, readable, interesting them more.   Michael Hingson  32:14 Well, and you said at the beginning, that most everyone has a story to tell. And I think that's absolutely true. You know, I'm working, as you know, with accessibility, so we we deal with making websites more accessible. And the whole story is about the fact that only 2% of websites today are usable, and most are not, they're not fully inclusive. And I'm looking forward to the time when someone will really write the story, it's, it's still new, because there's so much of it that's being written in history, if you will, but I'm looking forward to the time that we can write the story of accessiBe in the story of how the Internet becomes more inclusive. And there. And already, there are just so many incredible tales to tell, about website access things that that people have done. Things that people have learned along the way that have helped them create more inclusive environments in their own world and how making a website inclusive is made other parts of a company inclusive, and so on. And it'll be a fun story to tell at some point. It's kind of one of those things that's evolving today.   Susy Flory  33:30 It'll be nice when it's history, right? Rather than a current problem.   Michael Hingson  33:34 Yeah, well, and in a current event, but but it will happen and that's what's going to be a lot of fun. But but people do have stories and it would be nice if more people would learn how to articulate and tell their stories. I think that too many people are are losing the the whole idea and the whole ability of using words to create images that people can read and see. So they're, they're losing this ability to write which is extremely unfortunate.   Susy Flory  34:10 Yeah, they may feel like I did once upon a time that there are these amazing books and stories out there, but that they can't do that themselves. And I feel like with some help, and some practical, you know, solutions and templates that people can what,   Michael Hingson  34:28 what about fiction as opposed to nonfiction in terms of writing skills and so on, because people like we mentioned Harry Potter what a creative thing which is just totally out of imagination. Yeah,   Susy Flory  34:43 when one big way to learn if better, if you should aim at fiction or nonfiction if you're, you know, want to write a book is what do you enjoy reading? And for me, I enjoy reading nonfiction. I love true stories big true kind of adventure. citing stories. And so that's what I gravitate to when I go into a bookstore or library. That's where I'm heading. And I read fiction sometimes, but not not heavily. And so that's one good way to figure out what you should be writing. And fiction. People are interesting novelists, they have stories inside of their heads. And so they walk around the story. And these characters and these, you know, events, and eventually they have to write it down. It's, it's like they're always incubating these stories.   Michael Hingson  35:33 Yeah. And you and I both have our favorite authors. I'm still working on convincing you that Mark Twain is the best, but you know, we'll get there.   Susy Flory  35:43 I'm not saying I don't like   Michael Hingson  35:48 who's your favorite author?   Susy Flory  35:50 Oh, goodness. That's such a great question. We'll do fiction, fiction fiction fiction. Right now I'm enjoying reading Barbara Kingsolver. So she wrote, she's written several things. But she's a great storyteller. And Ann Patchett. I love me and Patchett, who's a southern novelist, who kind of writes his big epic novels, about families that are all interconnected and have secrets and things like that. So those are probably my two favorites.   Michael Hingson  36:22 We, we do a lot of fiction reading at home here, because we play audio books, and can listen to them while doing other things. That's really hard to do with a nonfiction book, you do have to concentrate differently and more on nonfiction.   36:39 I think so. Although memoir can read it, you know, it depends on the memoir, the famous ones, you know, the famous celebrity memoirs, no, but a really well, that memoir can almost be like a novel, it's very similar to how a novel, you know, unfolds. And so those can be super engaging, that they have to be well written.   Michael Hingson  37:02 It's, it's all about the story, right?   Susy Flory  37:06 Yeah. And engaging, the reader could have no ageing   Michael Hingson  37:09 the reader. And yeah, that's, that's, again, easier to do. Both Karen and I find sometimes that we're reading, and suddenly, we go, how did how did they get there? Because our mind went off in a different direction, you know, the book just took us somewhere. And we just leaped off into a theme, and then we come back, and they're in a different place now.   Susy Flory  37:36 Yeah, there has to be a logic, you know, there has to be planning that's happened behind the scenes that maybe you aren't aware of as a reader, but it does all have to fit together kind of like the structure of a house, the framing of the house.   Michael Hingson  37:49 Well, in the case of audio books, also, the other part of it is that the reader of the book, the person reading the book, and recording, it, has something to do with it. I've been spoiled by some really good readers of talking books over the years for blind people, and find that there are some people who professionally are recording books for everyone today who are good, but I also find that sometimes there aren't good readers, or that for some reason, we don't react well to them. And that diminishes the book a great deal. Unfortunately. They may very well be good books, but still   Susy Flory  38:29 some audio do you call them a performer or a narrator? What's an audio Column A   Michael Hingson  38:34 reader but you know, people reader former some people call them narrators.   Susy Flory  38:38 Yes. And some are like an actor's Yeah, some are like, Yeah, they just make it come alive, and some are very dead. So I totally get that.   Michael Hingson  38:47 Some are actors. I remember years ago as a child reading, kidnapped by Robert Louis Stevenson and Roddy McDowell read it. The actor, and there have been others. My favorite science fiction book of all times, the Moon is a Harsh Mistress by Robert Heinlein was read by Robert Donnelly, who was primarily a radio actor, but was perfect for this book. And, and I, I've read other books by actors who've just been very good. And they put voices in the books and they they use different voices for different characters, and they pull it off really well.   Susy Flory  39:29 Yeah, I have a book coming out in February that's set in Ireland and I'm hoping for the audio book that they have somebody who can, you know, an Irish person or somebody who can have a really good Irish accent, because I just listened to have you ever listened to Angela's Ashes on audiobook?   Michael Hingson  39:47 A while ago?   Susy Flory  39:48 Yes. Yeah. Frank McCourt. He bred it. Oh, yeah. His voice. He was so alive. He did voices and he would also sing Irish songs as part of the and you wouldn't Totally missed that if you were reading it on paper.   Michael Hingson  40:03 Yeah. Yeah. Again, some people can bring, bring a book to life and sometimes the author is the best one to do that. Tell us about the book in February.   Susy Flory  40:15 Yeah, this is a book I've been working on for a couple of years. It's called sanctuary. And it's about a real life donkey whisper in Ireland. The man named Patrick Barrett and he grew up his father started Ireland's Donkey Sanctuary. So they've rescued 1000s of donkeys over the years, because the problem is donkeys can live 50 to 60 years. They're sort of like parrots, and people will grow old or their life conditions will change. And this poor donkey is just kind of left to fend for itself. And it happens all the time, they'll find donkeys by the roadside that are starving. And so he grew up in this atmosphere. And as he grew up, he ran into different kinds of troubles and struggles. And it ended up that his father's Donkey Sanctuary actually rescued him. And so it's small town Ireland, small village Ireland with the castle, you know, on the main street and donkeys and Irish family and redemption.   Michael Hingson  41:20 It was a great book to read. I remember you asked me to read it and write the foreword in the endorsement for it. And   Susy Flory  41:28 that's right. Yeah, your forum forward is right up front there.   Michael Hingson  41:32 The only thing I never did see in the book was a leprechaun. So I still teach about that.   Susy Flory  41:38 We made a rule now leprechauns in the book are on the cover.   Michael Hingson  41:41 They might get you in trouble you know, those leprechauns they know these things.   Susy Flory  41:46 There are fairies of their I don't know if they're leprechauns. But there's a strong belief in fairies and Banshee as well. So yeah, Irish about to talk about imagination. The Irish have strong literary and beautiful imagination really   Michael Hingson  42:03 don't want to run into a banshee, though.   Susy Flory  42:04 Do you don't know.   Michael Hingson  42:08 I've seen Darby. Oh, Gil, I know about these things.   Susy Flory  42:13 Apparently, they make a really strange noise at night and you want to stay inside when you hear   Michael Hingson  42:17 that? You don't, I don't really want to come out where they are. Well, so that book is coming out in February. And I'm really looking forward to to seeing it out. And do you have any say? Or do you have any ability to to provide input into who will read it? If it gets on to Audible or in a recorded form?   Susy Flory  42:38 No. So far, I have not had that. And I don't think Patrick wants to read it himself. He's super busy. It's lots of kids and a busy life. So I think they, you know, will choose the best person that they can.   Michael Hingson  42:56 I would hope they would do an interview with him though. I mean, he is very interesting person just having read the book, and I would hope that there'd be an opportunity to to hear his voice somehow.   Susy Flory  43:08 Yeah, that's a great idea. Yeah. And he can do voices himself, you know, he can. The whole one of the reasons he's called the donkey whispers he can talk to donkeys in their own language, the way that they talk. They have very extensive vocabulary. And he can also imitate people as well. So he's very good at that. He has that year for that.   Michael Hingson  43:31 That will be exciting to to have come out. Now you also have another book that has been made into a movie that's coming out next year, right?   Susy Flory  43:40 Yes. And you know, I said sanctuary was coming out in February. I was wrong. It's actually coming out St. Patrick's Day in March. Oh,   Michael Hingson  43:48 my goodness. Good day for it to come out.   Susy Flory  43:52 But that same week, it's very odd net. This was not planned, but a book that I did a few years ago called The Unbreakable boy. It's a father son story about a boy with brittle bone disease and autism. That was made into a movie recently, it's being released by Lionsgate studios. And Zachary Levi and Patricia Heaton are starring and it comes out the exact same week as sanctuary. So it's a very strange and unusual week in my world.   Michael Hingson  44:24 Well, double double opportunity.   Susy Flory  44:29 That's right, we're gonna try to do we have plans to do a movie premiere. Up in the San Francisco Bay area, we're renting out a small theater, a single screen theater, so I'm hoping that will all come to fruition and we'll have some fun with a little we're gonna have some red carpet and the whole thing. Oh, cool. Did you know about red carpets? You've been on red Park? Yes.   Michael Hingson  44:53 Yeah. Well, here's a question. How has the pandemic of affected reading and books do you think and writing for that matter?   Susy Flory  45:05 I know children's books and why a young adult books have been selling like crazy, you know, with kids at home, and homeschooling and things like that. I do know, fiction and novels. Novels are fiction, but fiction is much stronger right now. People want entertainment and escape. Escape. Yeah. So yeah, they don't necessarily want to read heavy, you know, dark, difficult, you know, material challenging material, they want to, they want to, they want to escape, they want to move to someplace like Ireland or, you know, something like that. So fiction's doing law?   Michael Hingson  45:44 Well, it's, it's, um, it's very understandable. I mean, there's so many heavy things that we're dealing with the things that have happened over the past two years. And we're just slammed with the media, or by the media with all of the stuff that you want to escape. We've stayed home. And, and not done any travel, I did my first trip to speak in well, in May of this year, and that was the first one since March of last year. And traveling has been significantly less. But you know, staying at home has been a lot more bearable when we read books together. And so it also Karen and I are sharing it, but reading and and I've met as I said before, a fair amount of fiction helps just escape and get away from all this stuff that we're sick and tired of seeing on television and hearing.   Susy Flory  46:41 Yeah, I agree. I've been reading a lot and watching a lot as well, watching things like the Great British baking show. So yes, Escape has been important. We want that to be the beautiful thing about stories. They do sweep you away.   Michael Hingson  46:57 We watched the holiday bake off this last Sunday. Learn some new recipes. I don't know whether we'll try them. But we're trying to keep the calorie count down too. That's the unfortunate thing about the Bake Off.   Susy Flory  47:14 So true. That's been a hard thing for me during the pandemic because I love chocolate. Well, yeah. So yeah, we I have a little country grocery store that I go to if you're in Volcano, and they have See's Candy, right by the cash register. It is a big, it's been a big temptation, temptation, have a box of chocolate and a good black and sit there and enjoy it.   Michael Hingson  47:40 Well, I must admit, as I've said many times over the past year Instacart and Grub Hub are our friends. And it's very convenient that we can get some things like now that Christmas is here, peppermint bark from Costco, and, and other things. So yeah, that's it's always good to have a little chocolate around. Every time we we do have to go deal with Kaiser or a doctor or anything like that. I keep saying when you're writing prescriptions, please put that 10 pound box a season. Nobody's done that yet. It's very disappointing.   Susy Flory  48:17 Yeah, they should make a deal with fees. I think that could work out.   Michael Hingson  48:21 I think so I don't quite see the problem. I don't either. Well, in another thing. I know that it's very important for authors to have websites and have things up on the internet. That's, of course, a great way not only to advertise, but to establish personal relationships with people. And of course, I'd be remiss if I didn't explore how we might help authors do a better job of making their websites accessible so that people with various disabilities who might not be able to access part of their sites, get the access that everyone else has. Probably a lot of author websites are not overly complex websites, they're, they're not. They will have pictures and so on. But they're not necessarily overly complex. But it would be great to explore ways to work with the author world, to help them make their websites more accessible.   Susy Flory  49:23 Yeah, and kind of the probably that one of the most influential organizations as the author's skill. So I think, you know, if they can jump in and cooperate and partner with you, I think it would be a huge victory.   Michael Hingson  49:41 Well, you and I have talked about that before and we never did really follow through much but there's been a lot going on. So I'd love to, to get any help you can and reaching some of the folks that are but also if any authors are listening. As we've talked about on these podcasts, accessiBe helps makes websites a lot more accessible and it's not an expensive process. And I mean, it's really not an expensive process. So people ought to go to accessiBe.com and check it out. And also they can go to our website audit tool called ACE which you can get to it accessiBe.com, or just go to ace.accessiBe.com and plug in your website address and see how accessible it is and and learn about the things that you need to do to make it more accessible and usable. Because the reality is that over 20% of people in the world have a disability. And if you make your website accessible to those people, you can get up to 20% more business. And I mean, who could argue with doing that?   Susy Flory  50:48 I love that. Yeah, as writers, we want to speak and write and communicate and tell our stories to everyone. And no one should be excluded from that.   Michael Hingson  51:01 It's not that magical or hard to do. And so, you know, I hope that that it will happen more and more. And I know authors tend to really, truly be starving, don't have a lot of income, but accessiBe and is a way to do it. But we could certainly explore working with the author skilled, and you're right, that is something that we should do. So   Susy Flory  51:25 and also as published authors who have if you're a traditionally published author, or self published, you go through publishing companies who offer those services. It's something that we can recruit request for by publishers.   Michael Hingson  51:40 Good point that, that they also deal with access and make it accessible right from the outset, we had to do some of that, as I recall, with Thomas Nelson, there were some things that weren't accessible, but they fixed it.   Susy Flory  51:53 That's right. That's right.   Michael Hingson  51:56 And it is one of the things that as we're dealing with a guide dogs Guide to Being brave, however, that goes, access has to be a part of it. We've been working toward making thunder dog, a movie, although that's moving very slowly, the pandemic hasn't helped. But again, as that happens, it will need to have an audio track and be accessible so that it'll have to be described. So blind people can have access to it, much less everything else that goes along with it. So it will be fun to see how it goes. But you know, the reality is access is just something that tends not to be included in the conversation. We need to figure out ways to to get it more visible and get more people making sure that they provide inclusion. It's just not that expensive and hard to do.   Susy Flory  52:51 Yeah, I love that you're advocating in this area mica that you're persistent and consistent with it.   Michael Hingson  52:58 We need to get some of those Irish ferries to help us.   Susy Flory  53:01 That's right.   Michael Hingson  53:02 They have influence either out of their friends to leprechauns who stay in hiding, but they have to have   Susy Flory  53:08 and some of the stubbornness of the donkeys. You know, donkeys are stubborn, because they're smart. And they are opinionated. And so they come off as stubborn.   Michael Hingson  53:19 Oh, I know that if I ever get to Ireland, I do want to go be Patrick. I look forward to that. And you know, the other thing is, if people don't deal with access, we could always point out that we we probably can find people who can help us get a deal with a banshee you know, to get them to make their sites accessible.   Susy Flory  53:39 That's right, we'll set the Banshees on Yeah,   Michael Hingson  53:41 we'll set the Banshees on works for me. I really want to thank you for for being here and being a part of unstoppable mindset. But just, we haven't had a chance to chat for a while and the pandemic has has been for me, it's actually kept me pretty busy just with with things going on. And so I can't complain about that. But I think also again, it comes back to how you approach it. And you know, so this is just another adventure in a chapter in life, too.   Susy Flory  54:18 That's right, so fun to visit with another storyteller Mike and I love that you are telling your story of this new venue now with your podcast.   Michael Hingson  54:28 It's a lot of fun. Well invite people to come and listen. And of course, we hope that people will will give us good five star ratings. And if you know of anyone else who ought to be a guest, I'd love to chat with people and and bring them on. So we really love to to deal with this unstoppable thing and I just realized there's something else that we should talk about in your life, because you've been confronted by a couple of major life changes like with The whole breast cancer concept and so on that have suddenly thrown things in your way. But you you motored through   Susy Flory  55:07 them. That's right, I had breast cancer just before you and I started working together. And so I was still recovering from it, because it takes a while, you know, with surgeries and treatment and medication and all the things. And I decided that I didn't have time to wait anymore, or to be afraid, or, you know, to let things hold me back. And so, I'm not saying I became unstoppable. But I did feel like I went into turbo, after I recovered from breast cancer, and I literally did think I was gonna die. My dad had died in his 40s of cancer. And so I thought that might be my path. And so when I survived, I decided to move forward and, you know, have courage. And I think that's probably what led to me writing you that email that one day.   Michael Hingson  56:10 Well, the the issue isn't unstoppable. But unstoppable mindset, it still is, it's all about how you choose to approach things, whoever you are. And the bottom line is that mostly, we have control over a lot of things in our lives. And there are things that we don't have control over. But if you worry about things you can't control, you'll go off on strange paths, if you focus on what you can, and let the rest take care of itself. Most always, you're better off for it.   Susy Flory  56:44 That's right. i My mindset became my unstoppable mindset became for me the thought or the idea of why not, you know, what do I have to lose? Why not try? And so I became more comfortable with the idea of having some failures, which is going to happen whenever you try something new. But, you know, just the idea of why not, why not try.   Michael Hingson  57:11 But also love the idea that the whole point behind a failure is not that it's a failure. It's a it's an opportunity to learn and move forward to.   57:21 And it's normal. It's not fun. Yeah, some amount of failure is normal in this life. And once you realize that, that that's just part of it. And maybe you had to get that out of the way before you can move forward.   Michael Hingson  57:34 Right? Which gets back to mindset, which is cool. Well, again, I want to thank you for taking the time to be here. You got lots going on and a book, I'm sure books to write what's the next project   Susy Flory  57:51 I This one's kind of funny. It's called The Ultimate Bible nerd and I bought the format's Bible Dictionary, it's in six volumes. So if you kind of picture your whole desk being taken up by these giant bar, and I'm going to read through it, it's 7 million words. I'm going to read through 7 million words the year and write about it so we will see what comes out with that. I'm not quite sure yet.   Michael Hingson  58:20 Make it a novel.   Susy Flory  58:24 It's not going to be 7 million words I'll tell you about.   Michael Hingson  58:27 That is a little bit long to deal with. But I bet that whatever comes out is going to be fascinating and worth reading. I'm gonna have to go off and look up fear not the VINCI   Susy Flory  58:44 it's out of print, but I think there's a few copies floating around   Michael Hingson  58:51 I'm assuming it wasn't an audio book.   Susy Flory  58:54 I think this was before audio books were routine. Yeah, and yeah, so it was not   Michael Hingson  59:04 have to look anyway. You never know. Well, thanks again for be here. And it was good talking with you. And I want to thank everyone for listening. And again, if you have any questions you want to reach out Susie how can people reach out and find you?   Susy Flory  59:25 My website is SusyFlory.com and my name is spelled S U S Y F L O R Y or you can find me on Facebook at everything memoir.   Michael Hingson  59:39 Cool. And as always, if you have questions, comments, thoughts, please feel free to reach out to me Michael Hinkson web address to reach out to is MichaelHi@accessiBe.com M I C H A E L H I @ A C C E S S I B E dot com. Please go to Michael hingson.com/podcast. To learn more about the podcast. If you haven't listened to us before, we hope that you'll give us a five star rating in whatever podcast host you are using. If you know anyone who might be a good guest, or if you'd like to talk about coming on the podcast and chatting with us, please reach out. We'd love to hear from you. And you can, you can rest assured that I will respond. So, thank you very much for listening to unstoppable mindset, the podcast where inclusion, diversity, and the unexpected meet. Thanks for listening.   Michael Hingson  1:00:48 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com. accessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for listening. 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Book: The People Factor by Van Moody

Faith is the currency of God's Kingdom. But if you don't know the value of the $100 bill in your hand, you won't believe that it can do anything for you, and you won't claim the things that you have the power to purchase. Through insights found in the story of Jericho, Bishop Van Moody teaches us how to take the next step of faith in our lives. This is the sixth message in the summer sermon series "Action Heroes" at One Community Church. Drop a comment below! We'd love to connect!

In this episode of the Inspire Collective Podcast we're sitting down with Ty Moody. Ty Moody serves alongside her husband Van Moody at The Worship Center. Ty also has a passion for educating the next generations and equipping them for lifelong learning and growth through institutions she's helped create such as Einstein's Playground.

One of the great blessings of the digital age is that we can connect to more people, and have access to more information, than any other time in history. So our core challenge today is not letting this embarrassment of riches overwhelm us. Yes, we can know anything we want to know, but is knowledge the same thing as wisdom? Yes, we can connect to anyone in the world, but is a retweet the same as a real relationship? How do we make sure we're committing to the ideas and people that will actually enrich our lives, and help us enrich the lives of others? This week, Rabbi Lamm spoke about all this with leading author and pastor Van Moody, of the Worship Center in Birmingham, Alabama.

Bishop Van Moody from The Worship Center Church talks about his church's efforts to help local organizations and families during the pandemic.

Video of this podcast can be found at https://youtu.be/__H3jGJeJt81. How do we seek out our own blind spots in regard to prejudice, biases, or racism? What questions should we be asking?2. Do you feel the white evangelical church has had an unholy silence and not spoken up enough as they did in the 1960’s? Are they committing the same sin over again?3. What if the revival that white evangelicals have been praying for was meant to come through the restoration and revitalization of the black community and home? Would white evangelicals still pray and act toward it?4. How do you dialogue/engage a Christian who is not ready to have conversations about racism in their life and in the life of the church? Is this different from not being ready to have conversations about abuse (caring well), pornography, etc.? God moves in difficult times (Israel in exile, Jews being oppressed in the Book of Acts)EC30 Mission StatementAffirming Imago Dei (every human life bears the image of God) and through biblical community relationships, we strive to confront the sin of racism. Grounded in the truth and hope of God’s Word, we press into hard conversations asking, listening, and learning about experiences beyond our own to gain a deeper understanding from our marginalized brothers and sisters in faith. We commit to learning individually and collectively from Scripture, each other, and other resources that speak directly to racial issues, inequalities, and injustices. We will use our voices in our circles of influence to speak the truth to policies, institutions, and individuals concerning racism. Finally, we recognize our utter dependence on God’s grace and strength for this journey in seeking to walk together more effectively, and that His Glory through His son Jesus is our greatest calling.

Ever had that feeling like there is just too much on your shoulders - that feeling of overwhelm. In today's episode, we discuss how to ‘shortcut the overwhelm' and take back control. We also share with you a free resource that is available to you right now that can help you thrive financially in today's atmosphere. We discuss: Van Moody's Financial Empowerment Seminar and some of its key highlights What leads to a feeling of ‘overwhelm' and … … how to shortcut the ‘overwhelm' and thrive instead MORE INFO Link to Bishop Van Moody's Financial Empowerment Seminar: https://vmm.mykajabi.com/financial-empowerment-webinar-replay For a transcript of this episode, go to: https://georgebthompson.com/ep2-how-to-re-focus-when-you-feel-overwhelmed Leave a question for George to address in a future episode at https://anchor.fm/set-4-life/message Browse his books at https://georgebthompson.com/books/ Visit his website at https://georgebthompson.com SOCIAL MEDIA Facebook: George: https://www.facebook.com/george.thompson Thomas: https://www.facebook.com/tzlukoma/ Instagram: George: @thompsongb - https://www.instagram.com/thompsongb/ Thomas: @tzlukoma - https://www.instagram.com/tzlukoma/ Twitter: George: @georgebthompson - https://twitter.com/GeorgebThompson Thomas: @tzlukoma - https://twitter.com/tzlukoma LinkedIn: George: https://www.linkedin.com/in/georgebthompson/ Thomas: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tzlukoma/ MUSIC CREDIT “Angels” produced by TZillA | https://www.beatstars.com/tzilla/feed

In this episode, Van Moody discusses the importance of praying and praising no matter what God's answer to our prayers. Just like Joshua and the children of Israel, we must learn that He is always worthy of our trust and worship!"

“The opposite of love is not hatred, but indifference.” Elie Weisel If you’ve been here for a while, know that we don’t usually interview men on this show (Quick shout out to past guest guys like Joel Smallbone and Van Moody). Most of our guests are female because one of our main goals is to highlight positive role models for girls and that means, most of the time, those role models are women. But we’re switching things up for today’s show, and I’ll tell you right now -- this one’s gonna be a tough and emotional one for me. When Brent and I got started in ministry and trying to impact girls, come alongside and support them to walk in their God-given identities, we started to reach out to a lot of different people mostly because we were entering uncharted territory for us. We had both spent time working in the professional world. So we started to branch out and build relationships with lots of people all over the place – church leaders, people in the book publishing and media industries and we found so many amazing people who helped us, supported us and as you know even now the circle of folks who have dedicated their lives to helping girls follow Jesus, be who God made them to be, that circle is a small one but we did find one couple we immediately gravitated to and became friends with for a lot of reasons – Jonathan and Wynter Pitts. And while I wish Wynter could be here with us (Be sure to go back and listen to her episode – it’s #71), I’m so excited to have Jonathan here for this interview because I know you’re going to be blessed by this conversation. Father to four girls, Alena, Kaity, Camryn and Olivia, Jonathan’s heart for God and his girls is so inspirational. To me, he is a modern hero of faith whose friendship has meant so much to our family. Don’t miss today’s episode. It’s gonna bless you to hear all about how the Pitts family is adjusting to life in Tennessee after moving there from Texas. Any Friday Night Lights fans out there? #texasforever He also shares a lot about what the Lord is showing him in this season and all about the book he and Wynter wrote together (JP sent in the final manuscript for #Emptiedbook the day Wynter passed away). He’s sharing details and insights for how to approach marriage with intentionality, sacrificial love, and the grace that covers it when we get it wrong. Other questions from today’s episode include: Do you feel like the approach to marriage that you and Wynter took relieved any pressure of you feeling like all the other married people were doing it better? What has it meant to you to carry Wynter’s legacy forward – not just in your shared approach to marriage – but the impact she had in her ministry for girls all over the world? What’s up next for you and the girls and how can we be praying for you? All our married, soon-to-be-married, and single people looking to marry one day, be sure to get over to emptiedbook.com watch the video and download the F R E E devotional. You will NOT regret it!

"The opposite of love is not hatred, but indifference." Elie Weisel If you've been here for a while, know that we don't usually interview men on this show (Quick shout out to past guest guys like Joel Smallbone and Van Moody). Most of our guests are female because one of our main goals is to highlight positive role models for girls and that means, most of the time, those role models are women. But we're switching things up for today's show, and I'll tell you right now -- this one's gonna be a tough and emotional one for me. When Brent and I got started in ministry and trying to impact girls, come alongside and support them to walk in their God-given identities, we started to reach out to a lot of different people mostly because we were entering uncharted territory for us. We had both spent time working in the professional world. So we started to branch out and build relationships with lots of people all over the place - church leaders, people in the book publishing and media industries and we found so many amazing people who helped us, supported us and as you know even now the circle of folks who have dedicated their lives to helping girls follow Jesus, be who God made them to be, that circle is a small one but we did find one couple we immediately gravitated to and became friends with for a lot of reasons - Jonathan and Wynter Pitts. And while I wish Wynter could be here with us (Be sure to go back and listen to her episode - it's #71), I'm so excited to have Jonathan here for this interview because I know you're going to be blessed by this conversation. Father to four girls, Alena, Kaity, Camryn and Olivia, Jonathan's heart for God and his girls is so inspirational. To me, he is a modern hero of faith whose friendship has meant so much to our family. Don't miss today's episode. It's gonna bless you to hear all about how the Pitts family is adjusting to life in Tennessee after moving there from Texas. Any Friday Night Lights fans out there? #texasforever He also shares a lot about what the Lord is showing him in this season and all about the book he and Wynter wrote together (JP sent in the final manuscript for #Emptiedbook the day Wynter passed away). He's sharing details and insights for how to approach marriage with intentionality, sacrificial love, and the grace that covers it when we get it wrong. Other questions from today's episode include: Do you feel like the approach to marriage that you and Wynter took relieved any pressure of you feeling like all the other married people were doing it better? What has it meant to you to carry Wynter's legacy forward - not just in your shared approach to marriage - but the impact she had in her ministry for girls all over the world? What's up next for you and the girls and how can we be praying for you? All our married, soon-to-be-married, and single people looking to marry one day, be sure to get over to emptiedbook.com watch the video and download the F R E E devotional. You will NOT regret it!

For one pastor the issues facing his community was more important than partisanship. The Rev. Van Moody talks about why it was important for him to speak with President Trump, despite criticisms he faced.

This week we are breathing rarefied air as we are welcoming back one of just two guests that have appeared twice on Pairadocs podcast.  While Jimmy is out healing hearts and generally making the world a better place, Josh sits down, once again, with Van Moody about his latest book, Desired by God: Discover a Strong, Soul-Satisfying Relationship with God by Understanding Who His Is and How Much He Loves You

Machine Mouth Preachers starring (dialogue about) Darryl Scott, Van Moody, and all the other preachers drinking Trumps kool-aid. Conversation Con Artists dive into social commentary about some of the events that transpired this week. Help us #contheconvo!!

Van Moody by Rotaract Club of Birmingham

Do you feel like your relationships could be healthier, but you're unsure of what that process looks like. Take notes as Pastor Lawrence walks us thru "The People Factor". A book by Van Moody concerning relationships.

Dr. Van Moody is the founding pastor of The Worship Center Christian Church in Birmingham that draws more than 8000 members over multiple locations and has an online campus where people tune in from as far away as Kuwait, Australia, and South Africa.   He is also on the board of Joel Osteen's Champions Network, is a member of Dr. Oz’s Core Team, and is an associate trainer in Japan for Dr. John C. Maxwell’s EQUIP leadership organization. In addition, he's written two books related to social health titled The People Factor and The I-Factor.   Learn more about author and host, Sarah Raymond Cunningham, at sarahcunningham.org

One question lies behind every struggle we face: how do I deal with myself?One question lies behind every struggle we face: how do I deal with myself? Behind all our stumbles, behind each of our missteps, behind every one of our failings lies an inability to handle what Van Moody calls the “I-Factor.” More than self-worth or self-respect, beyond even character and perception of purpose, the I-Factor is about managing yourself—your whole life—well. In his inspiring new book by the same name, Moody reveals how to get hold of your I-Factor.Moody identifies three dynamics essential to winning the battle of the I-Factor: identity, significance, and perspective. When you understand your identity you know who you are, setting your foundation for everything. When you understand your significance, you see the purpose and the greatness you were created for. And, when you understand perspective, you can view the problems you face as stepping-stones to greatness rather than stumbling blocks. Properly understand these three dynamics, and you will be able to master your I-Factor.Weaving together personal stories, practical principles, and profound biblical truth, The I-Factor provides the key to achieving the life of greatness that you are destined for.Listen as Van joins Dr. Bond to discuss the concept of the I-Factor.Buy on AmazonThe I Factor: How Building a Great Relationship with Yourself Is the Key to a Happy, Successful Life

One question lies behind every struggle we face: how do I deal with myself?One question lies behind every struggle we face: how do I deal with myself? Behind all our stumbles, behind each of our missteps, behind every one of our failings lies an inability to handle what Van Moody calls the “I-Factor.” More than self-worth or self-respect, beyond even character and perception of purpose, the I-Factor is about managing yourself—your whole life—well. In his inspiring new book by the same name, Moody reveals how to get hold of your I-Factor.Moody identifies three dynamics essential to winning the battle of the I-Factor: identity, significance, and perspective. When you understand your identity you know who you are, setting your foundation for everything. When you understand your significance, you see the purpose and the greatness you were created for. And, when you understand perspective, you can view the problems you face as stepping-stones to greatness rather than stumbling blocks. Properly understand these three dynamics, and you will be able to master your I-Factor.Weaving together personal stories, practical principles, and profound biblical truth, The I-Factor provides the key to achieving the life of greatness that you are destined for.Listen as Van joins Dr. Bond to discuss the concept of the I-Factor.Buy on AmazonThe I Factor: How Building a Great Relationship with Yourself Is the Key to a Happy, Successful Life

“To thine own self be true.”    You know I love a good Shakespeare reference! We switched things up a bit for today’s show. Since we started the Heroes For Her podcast last year, we’ve had only two male guests: Joel Smallbone from for KING & Country and the amazing other half of the Bible Belles founder team, Brent Weidemann. Our #3 is Pastor Van Moody!   As a pastor, speaker, and leadership trainer, Van Moody’s voice has been heard around the world at the 30th Anniversary of the March on Washington, with Pope John Paul II and his Pontifical Council in Rome, Italy,  and in Tokyo, Japan as an Associate Trainer for Dr. John Maxwell’s leadership organization, EQUIP. Most recently, he became a member of Dr. Oz’s Core Team and is featured on the Dr. Oz Show on ABC. He lives in Birmingham, Alabama with his wife, Dr. Ty, and their two children, Eden Sydney and Ethan Isaiah.    Van Moody has a passion for healthy transformation in individuals, organizations and the world. In today’s episode, he breaks down The I Factor: the three dynamics that are essential to understanding ourselves and discovering what God has for all of us. He talks about how identity significance, and perspective are the keys to managing yourself – your whole life – well. We talked about how these ideas apply to parenting and helping our children live healthy, purpose-filled lives from the inside out.    Don’t miss today’s episode, “Intentional Parenting: The I Factor”, and find out more about how to help our kids know who they are, see purpose and greatness in what they were created for, and view the problems they face as stepping stones rather than stumbling blocks.

"To thine own self be true."    You know I love a good Shakespeare reference! We switched things up a bit for today's show. Since we started the Heroes For Her podcast last year, we've had only two male guests: Joel Smallbone from for KING & Country and the amazing other half of the Bible Belles founder team, Brent Weidemann. Our #3 is Pastor Van Moody!   As a pastor, speaker, and leadership trainer, Van Moody's voice has been heard around the world at the 30th Anniversary of the March on Washington, with Pope John Paul II and his Pontifical Council in Rome, Italy,  and in Tokyo, Japan as an Associate Trainer for Dr. John Maxwell's leadership organization, EQUIP. Most recently, he became a member of Dr. Oz's Core Team and is featured on the Dr. Oz Show on ABC. He lives in Birmingham, Alabama with his wife, Dr. Ty, and their two children, Eden Sydney and Ethan Isaiah.    Van Moody has a passion for healthy transformation in individuals, organizations and the world. In today's episode, he breaks down The I Factor: the three dynamics that are essential to understanding ourselves and discovering what God has for all of us. He talks about how identity significance, and perspective are the keys to managing yourself - your whole life - well. We talked about how these ideas apply to parenting and helping our children live healthy, purpose-filled lives from the inside out.    Don't miss today's episode, "Intentional Parenting: The I Factor", and find out more about how to help our kids know who they are, see purpose and greatness in what they were created for, and view the problems they face as stepping stones rather than stumbling blocks.

The guys sit down with Van Moody, pastor, author and international speaker. Van discusses his latest book, The I Factor. His work stresses the importance of knowing and accepting yourself as a child of God, first, and a spouse, parent, and/or friend, second.  

 Our guest today is Pastor Van Moody. Van is a member of Dr. Mehmet Oz’s core team, is an associate trainer for Dr. John Maxwell’s EQUIP leadership organization and pastor at The Worship Center in Birmingham, AL. According to Van Moody, having a strong I-factor is the cornerstone to a successful life. One question lies behind every struggle we face. And in his new book, The I-Factor: How Building A Great Relationship with Yourself is the Key to a Happy, Successful Life (November 22, Thomas Nelson), Moody challenges readers to get in tune with the core issues holding them back from the next level.  Moody identifies the three dynamics that are essential to winning the battle in life: identity, significance and perspective. When you understand your identity, you know who you are, which sets the foundation for everything else. When you understand your significance, you see the purpose and greatness you were created for. And when you understand perspective, you can view the problems you face as stepping-stones to greatness, rather than stumbling blocks.