Podcast appearances and mentions of rob speight

San Francisco is 49 square miles, but contains more than 1,000 miles of sewer mains, running under every block. Take a trip with Bay Curious reporter Carly Severn into the depths of the city, and discover an otherworldly cave that has reached legendary status with some urban explorers. This story first aired in 2019. Additional Reading: Exploring San Francisco's Hidden Tunnels (YouTube) Tunnels Under San Francisco? Inside the Dark, Dangerous World of the Sewers Read the transcript for this episode Sign up for our newsletter Enter our Sierra Nevada Brewing Company monthly trivia contest Your support makes KQED podcasts possible. You can show your love by going to https://kqed.org/donate/podcasts This story was reported by Carly Severn. The episode was also made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Tamuna Chkareuli, Jessica Placzek and Rob Speight. Additional support from Cesar Saldana, Jen Chien, Katie Sprenger, Maha Sanad, Jasmine Garnett, Carly Severn, Joshua Ling, Holly Kernan and the whole KQED family.

If you were walking down San Francisco's Fillmore Street in the 1950s, chances are you might run into Billie Holiday stepping out of a restaurant. Or Ella Fitzgerald trying on hats. Or Thelonious Monk smoking a cigarette. In this episode, originally aired in 2020, reporter Bianca Taylor explores the rise of the Fillmore as a cultural center for jazz, and the "urban renewal" that ultimately changed the identity of the neighborhood, and forced out many of its residents. Additional Reading: How ‘Urban Renewal' Decimated the Fillmore District, and Took Jazz With It Read a transcript of this episode Sign up for our newsletter Enter our Sierra Nevada Brewing Company monthly trivia contest Your support makes KQED podcasts possible. You can show your love by going to https://kqed.org/donate/podcasts This story was reported by Bianca Taylor. This episode was produced by Katrina Schwartz and Asal Ehsanipour. Audio engineering was by Rob Speight and Christopher Beale. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Amanda Font, and Christopher Beale. Additional support from Cesar Saldana, Jen Chien, Katie Sprenger, Jasmine Garnett, Carly Severn, and Holly Kernan.

You probably know the broad strokes of the Donner Party Saga: In 1846, a group of migrants traveling to California got stuck in a surprise October snow storm. After exhausting all their resources, they turn to cannibalism to survive. It's a grisly tale ... but the way it's often told is incomplete. We'll delve into the details many leave behind, and explore what happened to the Donner Party survivors after they escaped the snowy Sierra. This notorious disaster struck deep at the heart of everything California held dear — and came to represent everything it wanted to forget. Additional Reading: Endless Winter: A Fresh Look at the Donner Party Saga, Part 1 Surviving the Donner Party: California, Gold and Lifelong Secrets, Part 2 Experience the saga as an immersive storytelling event from KQED Live! This story was reported by Carly Severn. Featuring the voices of: Lina Blanco, Gabe Meline, Dan Brekke and Mike Hanlon. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Amanda Font and Brendan Willard. Rob Speight mixed our original episodes. Additional support from Cesar Saldana, Jen Chien, Jasmine Garnett, Carly Severn, Anna Vignet, Jenny Pritchett and Holly Kernan.

California is the most expensive state to build affordable housing in part because the costs to build are high. Some builders are turning to modular, prefabricated housing as a way to speed up production and rethink the way we've traditionally built in the Bay Area. Additional Reading: The Bay Area Has a Housing Crisis (Obviously.) Could Prefab Be the Answer? 5 Reasons It's So Expensive To Build Housing In California Take KQED's podcast survey! Reported by Molly Solomon and Erin Baldassari. Edited by Erika Kelly. Bay Curious is made by Katrina Schwartz, Suzie Racho, Rob Speight and Katie McMurran. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Carly Severn, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

For more than a century California has relied on incarcerated firefighters to help combat devastating wildfires. Bay Curious listener Brittany Powers wanted to know how much these firefighters are paid, and why it's so hard for them to find similar employment when they get out of jail. Brittany's question won our September voting round. Additional Reading What's Next For Incarcerated Firefighters in California? Inmates Saved Homes in the Kincade Fire. They'll Face An Uphill Battle Getting Firefighting Jobs After Release Shortage of Inmate Firefighters Hampers Response in Bay Area Reported by Kevin Stark. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Rob Speight and Chris Hoff. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Are ballots counted by machines or humans? How sure are we there was no meddling with votes along the way? When do they stop counting ballots? What happens to ballots after they're counted? We explore these questions and more with KQED's Guy Marzorati. Additional Reading: When to Expect Election Results in the Bay Area Featuring KQED politics reporter Guy Marzorati. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

You probably know the broad strokes of the Donner Party Saga: In 1846, a group of migrants traveling to California got stuck in a surprise October snow storm. After exhausting all their resources, they turn to cannibalism to survive. It's a grisly tale ... but the way it's often told is incomplete. We’ll delve into the details many leave behind. This is part one in a two-part series. Part two follows the Donner Party survivors after they escaped the mountains, and explores the fallout for the entire state of California. Find it now in the Bay Curious podcast feed. Additional Reading: Part I Endless Winter: A Fresh Look At The Donner Party Saga Part II: Surviving the Donner Party -- California, Gold and Lifelong Secrets Reported by Carly Severn. Featuring the voices of: Lina Blanco, Gabe Meline and Mike Hanlon. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

What happened to the Donner Party survivors after they escaped the snowy Sierra? In this episode we explore how this notorious disaster struck deep at the heart of everything California held dear — and came to represent everything it wanted to forget. This is part two in our two-part series. Part one recounts the Donner Party Saga in full -- the version you haven’t heard before. Find it now in the Bay Curious podcast feed. Additional Reading: Part II: Surviving the Donner Party -- California, Gold and Lifelong Secrets Part I Endless Winter: A Fresh Look At The Donner Party Saga Reported by Carly Severn. Featuring the voices of: Lina Blanco, Gabe Meline and Dan Brekke. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Colin Nichols gets the official California voter guide in the mail like folks in 11 million other households. It got him wondering, who puts it together? And why does one guy -- Gary Wesley -- write so many of the arguments? This question won our February voting round. Additional Reading:  11 Million Households, 10 Languages -- That's Right, It's the Official Calif. Voter Guide: https://www.kqed.org/news/11842131 Bay Curious Prop Fest: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED's Voter Guide: https://www.kqed.org/voterguide Reported by Chloe Veltman. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong, Michelle Wiley and Don Clyde.

Proposition 25 would eliminate the use of cash bail in California, replacing it with a threat assessment system using algorithms and judicial discretion. This episode is part of our Bay Curious Prop Fest series, which explores the 12 propositions on California's ballot. The series runs from Oct. 1-16, with new episodes dropping every weekday. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11842445 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Marisa Lagos. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Proposition 24 would expand California's privacy laws, including the creation of a new state agency to regulate how companies collect and use consumer data. This episode is part of our Bay Curious Prop Fest series, which explores the 12 propositions on California's ballot. The series runs from Oct. 1-16, with new episodes dropping every weekday. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11842350 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Rachael Myrow. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

We're exploring the 12 statewide ballot propositions in our Prop Fest series. This episode takes a closer look at Prop 23, which would require dialysis clinics to have a physician on-site during all hours patients are receiving treatment.  Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11842100 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Voter Guide: http://kqed.org/voterguide Reported by April Dembosky. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Proposition 22 asks Californians if they want to define app-based transportation and delivery drivers as independent contractors, instead of as employees, as state law currently requires. This episode is part of our Bay Curious Prop Fest series, which explores the 12 propositions on California's ballot. The series runs from Oct. 1-16, with new episodes dropping every weekday. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11842012 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Sam Harnett. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Proposition 21 asks voters if local governments should be allowed to enact rent control measures. It would replace the Costa Hawkins Rental Housing Act, a state law pass in 1995 that limited what local governments could do. This is part of the Bay Curious Prop Fest series, covering the 12 statewide propositions on the Nov 2020 ballot. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11841779 Bay Curious Episode on Rent Control: https://bit.ly/33ICNuc Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Voter Guide: http://kqed.org/voterguide Reported by Joe Fitzgerald Rodriguez. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

We're exploring the 12 statewide ballot propositions in our Prop Fest series. This episode takes a closer look at Prop 20, which aims to roll back some criminal justice reforms made over the past decade. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11841579 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Voter Guide: http://kqed.org/voterguide Reported by Marisa Lagos. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Katie McMurran, Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Proposition 19 would allow adults 55+, people living with severe disabilities, and victims of natural disasters to transfer their property tax assessment to another home. It would also close the so-called "Lebowski" loophole ... requiring people who inherit property to pay market rate tax assessment if they do not make the home their primary residence. This episode is part of our Bay Curious Prop Fest series, which explores the 12 propositions on California's ballot. The series runs from Oct. 1-16, with new episodes dropping every. weekday. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11841414 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Joe Fitzgerald Rodriguez. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

We're exploring the 12 statewide ballot propositions in our Prop Fest series. This episode tackles Prop 18, which would allow 17-year-olds to vote in primary and special elections, as long as they will be 18 by the general election and are otherwise eligible to vote. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://www.kqed.org/news/11841211 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Voter Guide: http://kqed.org/voterguide Reported by Guy Marzorati. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Proposition 17 asks Californians if people convicted of felonies should be allowed to vote while on parole. This would impact about 40,000 people in the state. This is part 4 in our 12-part Prop Fest series, which explores the statewide ballot propositions Californians are voting on this year. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Guy Marzorati. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

We're exploring the 12 statewide ballot propositions in our Prop Fest series. This episode tackles Prop 16, which asks voters to overturn a ban on the use of affirmative action by public institutions. The ban was originally put in place by California voters in 1996. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://bit.ly/3cPYkUU Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/electionsnews Reported by Katie Orr. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

We're digging into the 12 statewide ballot propositions in our Prop Fest series. This episode tackles Prop 15, which would change how the state assesses taxes on commercial and industrial property to raise money for public schools. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://bit.ly/3cLCvWw Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Election Coverage: https://www.kqed.org/elections Reported by Scott Shafer. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

This year Californians are voting on 12 statewide propositions that will have a big impact on criminal justice reform, taxes, and voting, among other things. Some of them are pretty complicated, so we've broken them down for you. We kick it off with Proposition 14 -- a bond to fund stem cell research. Additional Reading: Episode transcript: https://bit.ly/2G50GU4 Prop Fest Homepage: https://www.kqed.org/propfest KQED Voter Guide: http://kqed.org/voterguide Reported by Danielle Venton. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

The area north of San Francisco has come to be known as "wine country," but listener Michael Viray wanted to know, how did it get that way? Bugs, taxes and war all played their part. We take you through 160 years of wine making history. Additional Reading:  The Birth of 'Wine Country' Is A Story of Bugs, Taxes and War Climate Change Offers Up A New Wine List Take Our Podcast Survey, Please! Reported by Christopher Beale. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

Listener Ryan heard an eerie noise while crossing the Golden Gate Bridge on his motorcycle. He's not the only one -- the sound can be heard from miles away. What's going on? Additional Reading:  The Story Behind the Golden Gate Bridge's New Howl Why the Golden Gate Bridge Is Now A Giant Orange Wheezing Kazoo Engineers discuss the phenomenon on Reddit. Reported by Rob Speight with support from Gabe Meline. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

Recent fires in the Bay Area have a lot of us thinking about how to evacuate our homes, maybe for the first time. We answer all the basics about when you'll know it's time to go, what to bring, and where to go. And, we take some hope from the resilience of our redwood forests, even after tragic wildfires. Additional Reading:  What Big Basin's Redwoods Mean to You (and Why They'll Be OK) Fire Evacuation: What Actually Happens? And How Can You Plan? We Can Make Wildfires Less Horrific. Will We? Reported by Carly Severn and Danielle Venton. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

The lagoon in front of San Francisco's Palace of Fine Arts has been home to swans since its was built in 1915. Bay Curious listener Mishi Nova loves the spot and the swans. She wondered how the swans survive the night and escape the coyotes. Additional Reading:  The Swans at San Francisco's Palace of Fine Arts Have Attitude Check out what different birds sound like on the Audubon website A Very Curious Activity book Reported by Asal Ehsanipour. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Now there’s no question that today the nine-county Bay Area is solidly blue, but it hasn’t always been this way. Bay Curious listener Marcus wants to know: When and why did the Bay Area become overwhelmingly liberal? The answer depends on who you ask. Additional Reading: When and Why Did the Bay Area Become So Liberal? Political Breakdown podcast KQED's 2020 Election Coverage Reported by Scott Shafer. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

On a tucked-away beach in Richmond, Calif., shards of broken pottery outnumber sand or rocks. It’s an odd feeling, like you’ve stumbled on some kind of archaeological site right next to the Costco. Locals affectionately call this place TEPCO beach, after the Technical Porcelain and Chinaware Company that used to operate in nearby El Cerrito. Bay Curious listener Jo Ann Yada wants to know the story behind the beach, and how so much broken pottery wound up here. Additional Reading: The Unassuming East Bay Beach Strewn With Ceramic Treasures TEPCO: The Defunct Ceramics Factory That Still Dishes Out Nostalgia Subscribe to The California Reporter Magazine Podcast on Apple Podcasts Sign up for our monthly Bay Curious newsletter Reported by Katrina Schwartz. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong, and Asal Ehsanipour.

The state of California has incident exposure laws, making it illegal if someone is naked with the intent of being sexual (like masturbating in public), or intentionally offensive (like flashing someone). If you’re just hanging out naked minding your own business, California leaves that up to local governments. Today on the show, we're bring back an episode that first ran in 2017 ... that traces the fascinating history of being naked in San Francisco. Additional Reading: The History of Nudity in San Francisco Uncovered Subscribe to the Bay Curious newsletter Reported by Jessica Placzek. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

Listener Michael Viray wrote in to Bay Curious asking to learn more about the origin story behind ethnic studies: “I’ve heard from one of my professors of ethnic studies at UC Davis that there was actually a revolution in the Bay Area for an ethnic studies field. Is this true? And how did it happen?” Today on Bay Curious, we’re revisiting the longest student strike in U.S. history. We'll learn about the five-month standoff between students and administrators at San Francisco State, that ultimately led to the first College of Ethnic Studies in the nation. Additional Reading: How the Longest Student Strike in U.S. History Created Ethnic Studies Sign up for the Bay Curious newsletter Reported by Asal Ehsanipour. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

San Francisco beat out Los Angeles, New York and Portland as the top vegan city in America. But with COVID-19 wreaking havoc on the food industry — will that title endure? In today's episode we explore what's made vegan eating so popular in the Bay Area, and then learn how businesses are coping during these challenging times. Additional Resources: Read: Vegan Food is Big in the Bay Area — But Will the Scene Survive COVID-19? Get the Bay Curious Activity Book Sign up for our newsletter! Reported by Chloe Veltman. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

This week we learn how one enamored entrepreneur on a shoe-string budget gave birth to the Murphy bed in San Francisco. Then, we revisit one of our most-popular Bay Curious episodes of all time, about the Flintstone House in Hillsborough. The home's architect, who wasn't available for our original story, shares the backstory to his unique design. Additional Resources: Read - How A San Francisco Love Story Inspired the Invention of the Murphy Bed Read - What's That Thing Off 280? The Flintstone House Listen to our original Flintstone House story on Apple Podcasts Subscribe to the Bay Curious newsletter! Reported by Katrina Schwartz and Rachael Myrow. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Bay Curious listener Scott has lived in the Bay Area his whole life. He's always wondered why the weather can be so different just a few miles apart. This week, we dig into Bay Area microclimates -- what are they, why do they exist, and do heat islands affect our weather. Additional Reading:  Why Does The Bay Area Have So Many Microclimates? Why San Francisco Gets So Windy and Foggy In The Summer Sign up for the Bay Curious newsletter! Reported by Daniel Potter. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

Bay Curious listeners Alex Kornblum, 8, and his dad, Heath Kornblum, were talking about their drinking water when they landed on this question: How long does it take for water to get from Hetch Hetchy to San Francisco? And how far does it travel? Resources mentioned in this episode: How Hetch Hetchy Valley’s natural beauty was sacrificed to quench SF’s thirst (SF Chronicle) Video: Hetch Hetchy: To Restore or Not (KQED) Hetch Hetchy the cat's Instagram page Sign up for the Bay Curious monthly newsletter Reported by Sarah Craig. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Last year, this question won a public voting round on BayCurious.org: "The Fillmore district used to be known as the Harlem of the West. What's the story behind what happened to the city's once vibrant Black community and culture?" In this episode we explore the rise of the Fillmore as a cultural center for jazz, and the "urban renewal" that ultimately changed the identity of the neighborhood, and forced out many of its residents. Additional Reading and Listening: Why San Francisco's Fillmore District Is No Longer the "Harlem of the West" Playlist: We made a Spotify playlist featuring artists who played at venues in the Fillmore Reported by Bianca Taylor. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Michelle Wiley.

Juneteenth celebrations in the Bay Area are some of the largest, and longest-running in California. We offer a quick primer on the history of Juneteenth locally, and explore the legacy of Rachel Townsend, an activist and organizer who kept the Juneteenth spirit alive in San Francisco for years. This episode features an excerpt from KQED's The Bay. Reporting by Asal Ehsanipour and Devin Katayama. Production by Katrina Schwartz, Olivia Allen-Price, Ericka Cruz Guevarra. Engineering by Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

We look back at protests from the civil rights era — both nonviolent and violent — to understand how these actions lead to changes in public policy. This history gives us ideas about how the media coverage and public opinion polls of today could be early signs that public policy change will follow. Featuring longtime San Francisco resident Darrell Rogers and Omar Wasow, an assistant professor of politics at Princeton University. Additional Reading: What it Takes for Protests to Bring Change — Clues From History “Agenda Seeding: How 1960s Black Protests Moved Elites, Public Opinion and Voting.” (PDF) Reported and produced by Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour and Olivia Allen-Price. Engineering by Rob Speight and Katie McMurran. Additional support from Nicole Barton, Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Vinnee Tong.

Visitors to Angel Island often learn about how the island was once an immigration processing and detention center where Chinese immigrants were made to wait for weeks or months in sordid conditions. Recently, a Bay Curious listener mused about another dark part of the island’s past: “I wonder about Angel Island and the history of Japanese internment camps.” Turns out the island served a specific role during World War II. Additional Resources: Bay Curious web story, featuring images of Kakuro and Angel Island More on Kakuro Shigenaga’s internment history, and profiles of other Japanese internees Department of Justice case files of “enemy aliens” during WWII Reported by Cecilia Lei. Special thanks to Mina Kim, Yo Ann Martinez and Carly Severn. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Don Clyde.

Bay Curious listener Columbia Shafer was walking along Grand Ave in Oakland one day, when she noticed a new Zachary's pizza shop opening. "They were putting new paint on the doors and it said 100% employee owned," she says. "It seems like a really high percentage of pizza places [in the East Bay] were cooperatives and employee owned." She wants to know ... why pizza? In this episode we dive into local pizza co-op history. We'll also learn how these businesses work. Additional Resources Why Are So Many East Bay Pizza Shops Cooperatively Owned? Reported by Kyana Moghadam. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Vinnee Tong.

There was a time when you couldn't go too long watching television without seeing a commercial for Rice-A-Roni. Many featured images of San Francisco, and ended with a catchy jingle — "Rice-A-Roni. The San Francisco Treat!" Bay Curious listener Kent Barnes has wondered if that advertising slogan is true. Was Rice-A-Roni actually created here in the Bay Area? Additional Resources Hear the full story on The Kitchen Sisters website Mrs. Captanian's Rice Pilaf Recipe on BayCurious.org Vote for which question you'd like to see us answer in our May voting round Original story produced by Nikki Silva and Davia Nelson of The Kitchen Sisters. Adapted for Bay Curious by Asal Ehsanipour. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour, Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Michelle Wiley and Vinnee Tong.

For KQED's annual Youth Takeover project, we hand the mic over to four Bay Area high school students who have been keeping audio diaries while under stay-at-home orders. Without the structure of school, their lives have been turned upside down and many of the high school traditions they've looked forward to for years — prom, yearbook signing, graduation — are cancelled. A longer version of this story will drop in July on KQED's MindShift podcast. Subscribe now so you don't miss it! Share your well-wishes with the Class of 2020 on KQED's Facebook and Twitter pages. Produced by Katrina Schwartz. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Don Clyde and Vinnee Tong.

Listener Russ Johnson asked how coronavirus is impacting undocumented Californians, and if leaders are working to help them. An estimated 2 million Californians are undocumented. Whether they're essential workers or have recently lost employment, none of them are eligible for federal aid right now. State and local governments, and non-profits are filling some of the void, but many are still left struggling. Resources mentioned in the show: Ask your COVID-19 questions in English, or in Spanish. Haga clic aquí para obtener información importante de KQED e historias en Español. Reporting by Farida Jhabvala Romero. This episode was produced by Ericka Cruz Guevarra, Devin Katayama, Alan Montecillo, Olivia Allen-Price and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Vinnee Tong.

The coronavirus pandemic is affecting people in ways big and small. Some are very personal. What's it like to date an immunocompromised person right now? And, listener Marcus Adams wants to know if hair stylists are allowed to make home visits if they take safety precautions. We've got answers. Additional Reading: Getting Through Coronavirus Blues: Cute GIFs and Weird Haircuts Under Stay-at-Home Orders, Bay Area Takes Hair Maintenance Into Own Hands Dating While Immunocompromised Reported by Chloe Veltman and Asal Ehsanipour. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey, Kathleen Quillen, and Sasha Kohka.

As we shelter-in-place, a lot of people on Twitter are sharing the strange dreams they're having. We look into why that might be. And, listener Anne-Marie Rochè wants to know: Are there any positives for the natural environment from humans staying home? Additional Reading: Feel Like COVID-19 Is Invading Your Dreams? You're Not Alone Has Sheltering-In-Place Been Good For the Environment? Bay Area Pollution Way Down, Air District Estimates Reported by Michelle Wiley and Kevin Stark. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

There are so many bay windows in San Francisco, Oakland, and other cities around the Bay Area it would be easy to assume they were invented here. But were they? Listener Ayran Michaels wants to know: Why are they so prominent here? Additional Reading: Did San Francisco Put the 'Bay' in Bay Windows? Victorian Home Walk Reported by Christopher Beale. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Erika Aguilar, Jessica Placzek, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

Thanks to Judith Milgram and Ryan Stauffer for their questions. We cover how to shop safely, bring groceries home, and order takeout during the novel coronavirus pandemic. Additional Reading: How to Safely Grocery Shop During Coronavirus Shelter In Place Coronavirus in the Bay Area: Your Questions Answered Follow Coronavirus Voicemails @coronavoicemail or call 415-316-1542 to record your story of how the pandemic is impacting your life. Reported by Carly Severn and Shannon Lin. Featuring work by audio producers Tina Antolini and Evan Roberts. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

Bay Curious listener Paul Irving wanted to know: "What's the story with the bison in Golden Gate Park?" The park celebrates its 150th birthday this week, so we are re-running this episode digging into the backstory of the herd of American bison who call it home. And there are five cute updates to this story. Additional Reading: What's With the Bison in Golden Gate Park? Golden Gate Park Welcomes Five Young Bison Ahead of 150th Anniversary Reported by Jessica Placzek. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

Listener Mark Isaak heard that the spot on the earth from which you can see the most land is the summit of Mount Kilimanjaro. But that the summit of Mount Diablo comes in second. Turns out, this is a widely-circulated factoid that goes back centuries. Is it true? Additional Reading: Does Mount Diablo Have the Biggest View in the World? Your Coronavirus Questions, Answered Reported by Asal Ehsanipour. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

It has been a week, y'all. We're bringing you some tips on how to care for yourself, an inspiring story about how one neighbor his helping another, and a tour through the creative world of digital gatherings. Sit back, take a breath and hang with us. Links relevant to this episode: Sheltering in Place: What You Need to Know How to File for Unemployment in California During the Coronavirus Pandemic Your Coronavirus Questions, Answered Berkeley Mutual Aid Art classes on Instagram Live with @wendymac One Salon SF Urban Adamah Alison Faith Levy’s Youtube The Feelings Parade Facebook Page Dance parties with @mkik808 Featuring KQED associate arts and culture editor, Nastia Voynovskaya. Produced by Olivia Allen-Price, Katrina Schwartz, Asal Ehsanipour, Jessica Placzek and Katie McMurran. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Rob Speight, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Vinnee Tong and Ethan Lindsey.

What are the recommendations for taking public transit? Should I go to work? Should I cancel upcoming travel plans? How long does the virus last on a doorknob? Can it be transmitted in the air? Will we be quarantined? Find the latest answers to these questions and more in this constantly-changing story. Additional Reading: Public Health Orders and Recommendations for Each Bay Area County Bay Area Hospitals Gear Up for Potential Surge in Coronavirus Cases Coronavirus: Public Health Experts Want to 'Flatten the Curve.' Here's What That Means Featuring KQED reporter Michelle Wiley. Produced by Asal Ehsanipour, Olivia Allen-Price and Katie McMurran. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Asal Ehsanipour, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez and Ethan Lindsey.

Question asker David Shayer has a lot of opinions... about billboards. He says the worst are electronic billboards that flash changing images at night. But in addition to an opinion, David has a question: "Why is Highway 101 plastered with billboards while Highway 280 doesn't have any billboards?" In this episode, reporter Christopher Egusa takes a roadtrip to find out more. Additional Reading: Green Foothills Bay Area, I Love You Reported by Christopher Egusa. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Asal Ehsanipour, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez and Ethan Lindsey Patricia Yollin.

San Francisco’s Tenderloin neighborhood is bordered by some of the wealthiest neighborhoods in the city, yet it has a bad reputation. Tourists are told to avoid the area. You can often see drug dealing out in the open, and garbage on the streets. Today's question asker, Vy Nguyen, lives in the neighborhood and wants to know how the Tenderloin has stayed the same in a city where most low-incomes areas have gentrified. Additional Reading: Why Hasn't the Tenderloin Gentrified Like the Rest of San Francisco? By Randy Shaw: After a Tough 2019, Tenderloin Will Move Forward Reported by Kelly O'Mara. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Carly Severn, Bianca Hernandez, Ethan Lindsey and Don Clyde.

Question asker Lauren Fleming has noticed a lot of signs warning about coyote sightings in San Francisco parks. She wants to know how many coyotes live here, how they got here, and how they manage to live in an urban environment. In this episode, reporter Bianca Taylor meets a woman who has been observing the city's coyotes for thirteen years. Additional Reading:  San Francisco's Coyotes are Back, and They are Thriving The "Coyote Lady's" website, CoyoteYipps.com Submit your love letter to the Bay Area Reported by Bianca Taylor. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Asal Ehsanipour, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

This week the Bay Curious team asked locals to help us make a collective love letter to the Bay Area. We talked to people whose families have been here for several generations, people who just arrived and some who recently left. We heard all kinds of reasons for why you love it. We present to you, your stories and our love letter. Credits Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Kyana Moghadam, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Don Clyde, Carly Severn, Christopher Cox, Bianca Hernandez, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Holly Kernan.

When Nicole was growing up, her grandmother always told her: Don't live anywhere built on fill. Her uncle also had strong memories of watching the Marina burn after the 1989 earthquake — when parts of the ground liquefied, causing buildings to collapse and gas lines to break. Nicole wants to follow her grandmother's advice, but she needs to know a few things: "What neighborhoods and cities in the Bay Area are built on filled land? And what are those cities and neighborhoods doing to mitigate the risk of liquefaction?" Additional Reading Large Parts of the Bay Area Are Built on Fill. Why and Where? MAP: Where We "Created" Dry Land The Precarious Future of Treasure Island: Rising Seas and Sinking Land How Treasure Island Got Made and Why Credits Reported by Kelly O'Mara. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Don Clyde, Carly Severn, Christopher Cox, Bianca Hernandez, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Holly Kernan.

We get a lot of BART questions from our listeners, so this week we're answering a slew of them with long-time transit reporter Dan Brekke. How did they build the underwater tunnels for BART? In its nearly 50 years of existence, why has BART taken so long to extend into Santa Clara County? And only normally protruded into San Mateo County and never expanded into any of the North Bay counties? Why are there news kiosks in the BART station that are closed? Why doesn't BART let people run these news kiosks? What is the history?  At the West Oakland BART Station there are ads right next to the third rail. How on earth do they change those out without getting electrocuted? Why does it seem like the escalators are constantly broken? Why does BART announce elevator status all the time? Our question askers this week were Briana, Brad Meyer, Jay Quigley, Mark, Dan and Eric.  Additional Goodies Why are BART trains so loud? (Apple Podcasts) Sign up for the Bay Curious newsletter The Bay: An Unspoken Guide to Riding BART (Apple Podcasts) Why are BART Escalators Nearly Always Broken? And How Did They Build Those Tunnels? Credits Produced by Jessica Placzek and Olivia Allen-Price. Featuring KQED's transit editor Dan Brekke. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Patricia Yollin, Carly Severn, Christopher Cox, Bianca Hernandez, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and Holly Kernan.

Jerry Brown has been a dominant force in California politics for decades. He spent 16 years as governor of California, ran for Senate twice, ran for president three times, and spent eight years as Mayor of Oakland. In this episode, we explore how Brown's legacy in Oakland is playing out today with Devin Katayama of The Bay, and Guy Marzorati, producer of new podcast The Political Mind of Jerry Brown. You can subscribe to both in the same place you get Bay Curious. Produced by Devin Katayama, Marisol Medina-Cadena, Alan Montecillo, Jessica Placzek and Olivia Allen-Price. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong, Holly Kernan and Patricia Yollin.

Reporter Rachael Myrow and listener Debbie Torrey discover that what we've been told about this famous road is mostly bunk. This story first ran on the podcast in Nov. 2017. Additional Reading: Video: The true story of the 'royal' road El Camino Not-So-Real: The True Story of the 'Ancient Road' Reported by Rachael Myrow. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

The crosswalks in San Francisco, and many other Bay Area towns, play a 'machine gun' sound when the 'walk' sign is illuminated for pedestrians. A Bay Curious listener recalls hearing chirping sounds in other areas. Why do ours sound the way they do? Plus, we get to know an architect who listens to buildings. Additional Reading: An Architect Who Listens To Buildings Reported by Olivia Allen-Price, Annika Cline and Sam Harnett. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

Listener Britt McEachern is a tour guide in San Francisco, and spends a lot of time walking around city streets. He's noticed grids of glass embedded in the sidewalk and wants to know what they are. Take a journey with reporter Jessica Placzek to learn the purpose and origins of these gems beneath your feet. Additional Reading: What Are Those Grids of Glass in the Sidewalk — And Why Are They Purple? Quiz: Test Your Bay Area Knowledge Reported by Jessica Placzek. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

This is the second part of our series on Treasure Island. Listener Gary Pilgrim was taking a drive across the Bay Bridge with his new wife when they decided to stop at Treasure Island. After taking in the sweeping views, he wondered how this manmade island came to be in the first place, and what it's future holds. We're answering Gary's questions in a two-part series exploring the island's past and future. This week: What are the plans for Treasure Island? And does climate change threaten them? Additional Reading: Part I: How Treasure Island Got Made — and Why Part II: Rising Seas and Sinking Land: The Precarious Future of Treasure Island Reported by Kevin Stark. Edited by Kat Snow. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

Listener Gary Pilgrim was taking a drive across the Bay Bridge with his new wife when they decided to stop at Treasure Island. After taking in the sweeping views, he wondered how this manmade island came to be in the first place, and what it's future holds. We're answering Gary's questions in a two-part series exploring the island's past and future. This week: How was Treasure Island made, and why? Additional Reading: How Treasure Island Got Made — and Why Reported by Kevin Stark. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

Question asker José Muñoz wants to know more about the storied history of this place, which was a pivotal stop-off in Charlie Chaplin's career. Was Niles Hollywood before Hollywood was Hollywood? Additional Reading: This Tiny East Bay Town Was Once a Movie Making Hotspot Reported by Rachael Myrow. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

The Occupation of Alcatraz began on Nov. 20, 1969, when a group of Native American students, calling themselves the Indians of All Tribes, landed on Alcatraz Island. They wanted to return the land to native ownership, and felt they had a right to the land because of the Treaty of Fort Laramie, which said that land deserted by the federal government should be returned to the natives who once occupied it. Additional Reading: WATCH: The Occupation of Alcatraz Turns 50, But the Impact of the Movement Lives On A Look Back at the Occupation of Alcatraz, 50 Years Later Reported by Alice Woelfle. Produced by Ericka Cruz-Guevarra, Devin Katayama, Kyana Moghadam and Jessica Placzek. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

Kevin Platt was checking out a flag display outside San Francisco's city hall when he noticed the flag from his home state, Texas, was among them. What gives? Plus, we take a quick dive into the history of San Francisco's oldest square — where the announcement of gold was made, and where the state's first public school house once stood. Reported by Annika Cline and Marisol Medina-Cadena. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

When Bay Curious listener Justin Hartung was growing up in Oakland, he remembers the Bay being blue. After moving to New York for college in the early 90s, and returning back to the East Bay a couple years ago, he noticed a big difference in the hue of the harbor. When did it get so green? Additional Reading: Feel Like the S.F. Bay Used to Be Bluer? You're Not Imagining It Reported by Amanda Font. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Kyana Moghadam, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

To celebrate the third birthday of the Bay Curious podcast we are answering listener questions about our favorite episodes, how we make the show, our theme music, the way we choose questions, and questions we wish we received. Also don't miss our birthday celebration on November 14th from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m. at Babe's Monte Carlo in San Francisco. Register at BayCurious.org/events. Additional reading/listening: Why Do Some Hate the Nickname ‘Frisco’? What Would It Take to Make Lake Merritt Swimmable? Bay Curious has been made possible by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Vinnee Tong, Ryan Levi, Suzie Racho, Julie Caine, Erika Kelly, Paul Lancour, Kelly O’Mara, Carly Severn, Katie McMurran, Rob Speight, Pat Yollin, Maggie Galloway, Holly Kernan, Ethan Lindsay, and Julia McEvoy.

San Francisco is 49 square miles, but contains more than 1,000 miles of sewer mains, running under every block. Take a trip with Bay Curious reporter Carly Severn into the depths of the city, and discover an otherworldly cave that has reached legendary status with some urban explorers. VIDEO: Take A Trip Into San Francisco's Sewer System Web story: Tunnels Under San Francisco? Inside the Dark, Dangerous World of the Sewers Reported by Carly Severn. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Suzie Racho and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Patricia Yollin, Vinnee Tong and Ethan Lindsey.

The Bay Area is defined by water. Not just by the bay itself, but by the Pacific Ocean and myriad rivers, reservoirs, lakes and ponds. Yet most of the bodies of water you drive past are devoid of people. No swimming. No splashing around. Not even on the hottest days. Why is that? Additional Reading (including a list of where you can swim): Why Can’t You Swim in Most Bay Area Lakes? Reported by Kelly O’Mara. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran and Rob Speight. Additional support from Julie Caine, Paul Lancour, Suzie Racho, Ethan Lindsey and Patricia Yollin.

Guest Bios Show Transcript Two Churches in the Chicago area have been rocked by scandal. Now, how does the Christian community move forward? And how do those hurt by these scandals, the so-called church refugees, find healing? This week on The Roys Report, I'll have two refugees from Willow Creek Community Church and one from Harvest Bible Chapel join me. Also joining me will be two area pastors whose churches have taken in a number of refugees.  I really hope you can join us for The Roys Report, this Saturday morning at 11 on AM 1160 Hope for Your Life and on Sunday night at 7 on AM 560 The Answer! This Weeks Guests Joe Thorn Joe Thorn is the Lead Pastor of Redeemer Fellowship in St. Charles, Illinois, and the author of several books, including Note to Self and Experiencing the Trinity. He has been a columnist for Ligonier's Tabletalk magazine and is the co-host (with Jimmy Fowler) of the podcast Doctrine & Devotion. Dave Jones David has been privileged to serve as Senior Pastor at Village Church since 2010.  He seeks to combine the in-depth study of Scripture with a shepherd's heart.  He has been married to Helen for more than thirty years.  They have three grown sons, two daughters-in-law, and one grandson.    Rob Speight Rob Speight graduated from Dallas Theological Seminary and served in vocational ministry prior to working in the market place and attending and volunteering at Willow Creek for 27 years.  Rob started a blog when the Bill Hybels scandal became public.   Carol Behrends Lifelong Christian. . . Survivor of toxic fundamentalism and sexual abuse. . . in attendance at Willow Creek since 1980 (theater days). . . zealot for Truth and accountability Terri Streich Terri was a member of Harvest Bible Chapel for 15 years until she left 1 1/2 years ago. She has also been in Women's ministry as a counselor for 9+years. Currently she is a member of Redeemer Fellowship St Charles, Ill. with her husband of 35 years Dave. Together they have 3 children and 4 grandchildren. Show Transcript Note: This transcript has been edited slightly for continuity. Segment 1 JULIE ROYS:  Welcome to The Roys Report, brought to you in part by Judson University.  I am Julie Roys and today, we're going to be talking about a topic that has absolutely ravaged the Christian community in the Chicago area. And, if you've been listening to the news, you know that in the past 18 months, two major, evangelical megachurches have been rocked by scandal.  First, Willow Creek Community Church, one of the 10 largest churches in the United States—experienced major upheaval after allegations of sexual misconduct surfaced concerning founder Bill Hybels.  Initially, the women who brought those allegations were discredited by the church. But as evidence against Hybels mounted, senior leaders and elders recanted, and resigned. Yet many say the damage that is done is just too much and they've left the church.  Attendance at Willow is down at least 15-percent at Willow's main campus—and at least 9-percent overall.  Then several months later, another megachurch—Harvest Bible Chapel—was upended when its pastor, James MacDonald, was accused of rampant wrongdoing. This included financial misappropriation, bullying, and shocking vulgar speech that was aired on morning-drive radio here in Chicago.  The results were similar.  All the executive staff resigned. The elders resigned.  And there was a major exodus of people away from the church. Obviously, this has sent shock waves throughout the Chicago area.  There are literally thousands of so-called church refugees—people who feel betrayed and hurt and are in need of healing. At the same time, these people are suspicious of anyone in spiritual leadership. Some don't want anything to do with the church. Yet there are others who are coming into these area churches and they're looking for healing and they're looking and longing for help.  And then there are pastors—many of whom are godly, hardworking, and often underpaid.  Yet now, they're viewed with suspicion.  And God forbid, they ask for money or any commitment from people in the pews.  This has become trigger issues for people who are coming into their churches. So how does the Christian community recover from this? How do we move forward as the Bride of Christ? And can we ever again be a city on a hill?  Well, that's what I'm going to explore today. And I've gathered a very special group of people to help me do that. With me today are two Chicago-area pastors and three so-called church refugees. The pastors are Dave Jones, senior pastor of Village Church of Barrington.  And Dave and I met while I was reporting on Harvest Bible Chapel.  In fact, he was a great source of information for me so I'm very grateful for that, Dave.  Dave, you also were on staff at Harvest Bible Chapel—ten years served there, and I know also your church has become just a major wide-open door for an awful lot of refugees.  So welcome to the program.  I'm just really glad to have you. DAVE JONES:  Thank you.  Glad to be here. JULIE ROYS:  Also joining me is Joe Thorn, pastor of Redeemer Fellowship in suburban St. Charles.  Joe also hosts a podcast called Doctrine and Devotion.  And Joe and I also met while I was reporting on Harvest Bible Chapel.  You had me in, I think it was pretty early.  It was after my World piece had hit—that expose which I think was mid-December—came in and really enjoyed the opportunity and had a good time with Joe.  But I know you've been impacted as well and you have a number of refugees at your church.  Correct?   JOE THORN:  Yeah.  Over the years, even before this broke, people started to kind of bail on Harvest for various reasons.  And some of them have made their way towards Redeemer. JULIE ROYS:  Okay.  Let me start with you, Dave, because I know you've had, I think, when I interviewed you, you said maybe 300 or so had come from Harvest at some period of time, stayed for at least six months or more.  I'm guessing that was with, there was kind of like two waves.  There was 2012 when there was gambling exposed and then there was this ex-communication of elders which a lot of people left then.  Then the church kind of rebounded and then this latest, you know, revelations of wrong doing and, you know, James eventually got fired by the church.  Has that brought in another wave, I'm guessing? DAVE JONES:  Yes, it has.  You know, we did have several hundred people, actually, that came from, you know, during like 1.0 and now there's another wave coming yet again.  And we have not tried to, you know, we have no way of really counting that or anything but we are seeing visitors every service, every weekend. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah.  So tell me, I mean, what's it like being a pastor of a church that's receiving these refugees?  Like, what has it been like the past 6-9 months at your church? DAVE JONES:  Well, obviously we're seeing new people every weekend.  So we're trying to, you know, be welcoming and outgoing toward them and just trying to let them find a place where they can find healing.  We get the context.  We know what's happening there.  And so we've just tried to love and we've tried to model Christ-likeness the best we can.  And let them reestablish confidence in the church and in church leadership. JULIE ROYS:  And when you say you get it not only do you get it because you've been there.  But you've experienced spiritual abuse.  Can you talk a little bit about that? DAVE JONES:  Sure.  You know, I was on staff at Harvest for 8 ½ years and that was, you know, I would say those early years were good years.  And there would be occasional things that would happen.  But toward the end especially, my eyes began to get opened to some things.  And once the leadership there got the sense that I was beginning to think and maybe had one foot out the door, it did get really bad.  And so I came out of that situation quite beat up.  And it took me several months just to even get my smile back.  And I was having nightmares.  I was starting to have like some paranoia.  And I was really beginning to wonder if something was wrong with me on the inside.  But God was gracious and through some loving friends who just walked with me through that, and prayed me through it, I did get to a point of healing.  But I would say the healing took place over a 3-4 year period.  So yes, so I get it personally and I also get it corporately. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah, I'm glad you said that about feeling the paranoia and some of that.  I remember when I was reporting on this story and I'm giving these stories to my editor, right?  And I remember one point he said, Julie, these people, you know, I hate to say it, they sound a little crazy.  And I'm like, you should talk to them.  They're not crazy and you have no idea what they've experienced.  And that comment, you know, I know initially, was just getting used to this story.  And now we've seen, as it's come out, the people are traumatized on a level that I think nobody imagined initially.  And the people aren't crazy but what they experienced has been absolutely crazy.  And so I think churches need to be just aware.  So I appreciate that Dave.   So Joe, same question to you.  What has it been like for you the past 6-9 months? JOE THORN:  Well, we have a small church right, relatively small church — 350's probably the average attendance on a Sunday between 3 services.  So we have a small space. JULIE ROYS:  Now why do you do 3 services? JOE THORN:  Because we can't fit everybody into a small space.  Literally it's not to grow, it's to manage the small growth that we have.   JULIE ROYS:  You sure you don't want to start a big building program? Probably not the right time.  (laughter) JOE THORN:  We're not going that way.  We plant churches.  We planted 3 churches out of us so we're sending our people out all the time.  We're not fans of big church for us.  But our people, at Redeemer, don't really have to do anything different than they normally do.  Our congregation, who we are a congregational Baptist church. JULIE ROYS:  Say what that means.  Congregational.  That's a form of government. JOE THORN:  Right.  What it means is that our church is governed or led by a plurality of elders who all function together in parity, meaning, me as the lead pastor, I don't have more say than the volunteer elder.  We all have the same authority.  But the congregational holds us accountable.  They vote on leadership, they vote us in and out.  They can fire me.  They vote on budget.  They vote on members.  So that's a congregational church with a lot of transparency and accountability.  We don't change anything that we're doing other than, because our people are generally nice and welcoming.  They're very warm towards people that are coming in.  The only thing that we've done is we've let our congregation know, a long time ago during our members' meetings, listen these people are hurting.  Some of them are coming in angry.  They're in the rage stage right because they've been betrayed and hurt or abused.  Others are coming in just broken and mourning.  So we just tell them be gentle, give them patience and space but be kind.  And that's all we've had to do.  And our people have warmly welcomed them.  So people, most people from Harvest and that kind of a church, don't come to Redeemer because we are a small, reformed Baptist church.  Culturally it's just very, very different.  But the people that have come, have come because of that almost.  It's like they want to distance themselves from even the culture of what they went through.  Not because the culture was necessarily wrong in every way, but because they want to distance themselves from not only abuse but some of the other trappings and they wind their way towards us.  And I think it's been, for most people that have come and stayed, it's been a pretty seamless transition.   JULIE ROYS:  Yeah.  I mean it's interesting that we mention even in this first segment church government. Because I remember, again, when I was reporting on this, I had all this information, actually I hadn't published yet that about how church government at Harvest changed over time.  And James McDonald took power, you know, and had had this façade of being elder led but it really was James led.  And I think people are asking about church government.  But I remember when I was first reporting, again my editor saying to me, Julie, you and I are interested in that, and about 12 of our readers but that's about it.  You know, I mean people don't care about church government.  I think people care about church government now.  And I think that's a good thing.  I think they need to care about church government.   Real quickly, because we just have like 30 seconds.  What kind of church government do you have Dave? DAVE JONES:  We are also congregational.  We have elders but they are voted on by the congregation. JULIE ROYS:  Okay, so they're actually accountable to the congregation.  That's a very important piece.    Well again you're listening to the The Roys Report.  I'm Julie Roys.  Joining me today Joe Thorn, pastor of Redeemer Fellowship, Dave Jones, pastor of Village Church of Barrington.   And coming up next, I've got some refugees.  Some people who have come from some of these churches who are wounded and hurt and I think you're going to want to hear what they have to say. Stay tuned, I'll be right back.  Segment 2: JULIE ROYS: After being betrayed by a pastor or a church, how do you ever trust again? Welcome back to The Roys Report. I'm Julie Roys. And if you've followed the news at all, you know that two Chicago-area megachurches have been rocked by scandal. At both Willow Creek Community Church and Harvest Bible Chapel, pastors have resigned, or been fired, in disgrace. Elder boards have been replaced. And congregations have shrunk as many people have determined that they no longer can stay in a place where they don't trust the leadership. So, how does the Christian community respond to a crisis like this?  How do area churches welcome literally thousands of people coming to them wounded and hurting? And how do these so-called church refugees heal and learn to trust again? Do they EVER go to a church again?  Our show today is recorded, so I can't take your calls. However, I encourage you to join the live conversation online by going to Facebook.com/ReachJulieRoys. Or to get to me on Twitter, use my handle @ReachJulieRoys. Well today with me are two Chicago-area mega, not mega church pastors. Two Chicago (laughter) pastors—Joe Thorn and Dave Jones. You heard from them in the last segment. But what I want to do now is have you meet three people who have experienced the devastation at Harvest and Willow Creek personally.    First, Terri Streich was a longtime member at Harvest Bible Chapel. In fact, she served in the counseling ministry, but recently she left after experiencing first-hand some of the abuse and the toxic culture there at Harvest.  So, Teri, welcome, great to have you.   TERRI STREICH:  Thank you.  Good to be here.  JULIE ROYS:  Also joining me are two former members at Willow Creek Community Church—Carol Behrends and Rob Speight. Carol was a member at Willow Creek for decades, right Carol, is that right?  And Rob actually served part-time on staff for a time. Both have been disheartened and disillusioned by what they've seen. And I appreciate you coming on as well and being willing to share your stories.  So welcome Carol.  CAROL BEHRENDS:  Thank you. JULIE ROYS:  And welcome Rob. ROB SPEIGHT:  Thanks for having me. JULIE ROYS:  So why don't we start with you Terri.   I know this, I can see it in your eyes, they can't see it, maybe they'll be able to hear it, but this is still raw for you.  I mean, how did you first become aware of the issues at Harvest and how has this impacted you on a personal level?     TERRI STREICH:  Yes, well, it has impacted my husband and I on a personal level. But to give you a little backdrop, we attended Harvest for about 15 years, and it was wonderful at the beginning.  We felt refreshed as if in a dry and weary land. JULIE ROYS:  When was this?  What year? TERRI STREICH:  Boy, you know it's got to be 19 years ago now probably. JULIE ROYS:  Okay. TERRI STREICH:  Off and on.  So, just got plugged in right away and was very honored to be asked to serve in some leadership roles and made some wonderful friendships there. And we loved to serve the Lord and the people that come and that are new to Christianity or that just need encouragement.  Then I got invited to be on staff as the Women's Director in Elgin and over the years the roles somewhat changed and then I did get invited to counsel women at the church and yes. And so for 9 years I was on staff there. And during those 9 years, front row seat witnessed wonderful things of people getting saved but also the things that you only see whether you're on staff or my husband served as an elder for a few years. So we had the interesting dichotomy of once my husband being on the elder board and me being on staff and we would go home and talk about some things. And it was just shocking to both of us in the spin factor on what was said in the congregation from the pulpit and then behind the scenes, whether it's in the staff meetings or in elder meetings. JULIE ROYS:  Two different things and not feeling like they're telling the truth then to the congregation.  And didn't your husband and you, I don't know if you want to talk about it, didn't you originally discover the gambling that James McDonald was involved in? TERRI STREICH:  Yeah, Women's Ministry or the ministries there at Harvest they have small groups and then they have flock leaders that oversee small groups and then elders, of course, oversee the congregation.  But yes, one of the small group, no, one of the flock leaders that I was serving with had witnessed and had heard about some things and so and then there's rumbling behind the scenes.  We sat on it for almost a year, praying about it, hoping, you know, to test it to see if that's true and finally the gal and I went to, you know, one of the pastors and brought this to the attention of the elders and were very concerned . . . JULIE ROYS:  And when you say “this” that James McDonald was gambling in Vegas, right? TERRI STREICH:  Yes, he was yeah.  And the attitude and the language and the amount of money that was being played all in different areas of the city, we were aware of. So we of course brought that to the elder board.  We brought that to Pastor Rick and it was . . . JULIE ROYS:  Rick Donald? TERRI STREICH:  Yeah, he wasn't shocked, I don't believe, but he seemed to listen and then the next elder meeting my husband was there to kind of discuss it a little bit, so. JULIE ROYS:  He wasn't shocked because he probably knew already.  I mean these are some of the things that are coming out.  So much we could talk about. But I want to get everybody involved here.  So Carol you were at Willow Creek Community Church for decades.   CAROL BEHRENDS:  Yes JULIE ROYS:   The only, you grew up, you said, Plymouth Brethren? CAROL BEHRENDS:  Yes JULIE ROYS:  That's an interesting church.  I mean that's a very small church where you're not allowed to have pastors, right? CAROL BEHRENDS:  They choose not.  Yes, that's not their way.  JULIE ROYS:  Yeah. CAROL BEHRENDS:  One-man ministry is not, they think, the way to go. JULIE ROYS:  So you've experienced these two very different churches.  Tell me about Willow. I'm guessing, there were wonderful years. But then it soured for you.  Tell me about that? CAROL BEHRENDS:  Well, growing up in Plymouth Brethren it was like wonderful to come to Willow Creek and see that style of church, yeah, two opposites, that's all I can say.  We jumped right in.  We were small group leaders and my husband was heading up the prison ministry, Exodus, and many, we had several small groups. JULIE ROYS:  And you probably saw a lot of people come to know the Lord in that time? CAROL BEHRENDS:  Yeah, maybe not through the small groups so much.  We had couples that we were bringing along that we were bringing along that who were young Christians and meeting in homes and became very close to the couples and some of them were still, we still travel to visit. JULIE ROYS:  So, when these women came forward, you know, started out with a few in the Chicago Tribune saying that Bill Hybels had, you know, had some sexual misconduct toward them and abusive behavior.  At first when you heard that what was your response? CAROL BEHRENDS:  I believed it immediately. JULIE ROYS:  You did?  And why did you believe it? Because I'm guessing you had a high opinion of Bill Hybels. CAROL BEHRENDS:  I had a high opinion of Nancy Beach and all the other ones. JULIE ROYS:  That's what was, you know, I felt the same way like we had attended Willow actually back in the late 80's, early 90's. And Nancy Beech, Nancy Ortberg, my goodness.  So, but how did, this is your pastor for like decades you know, how did that impact you, to have your pastor now be involved in something like that?  CAROL BEHRENDS:  My pastor suddenly became in the same category of some of the men I had come in contact with in the work place who were, you know, sexual harassment, guilty of. And so then I hear Bill Hybels is behaving the same way so I just lumped him into that category.  JULIE ROYS:  But I'm guessing devastating, yes? CAROL BEHRENDS:  Devastating, shocking, disgusting.  I was disgusted. JULIE ROYS:  Well, and it's interesting you say that about, you know, you kind of think of the people, you've been in the work place.  For women, I know that's me too.  And now, I read those things I'm like, oh yeah, I've had bosses like that, I know what that's like. CAROL BEHRENDS:  I get it. JULIE ROYS:  It's tough and to think that this person that was a spiritual leader, a shepherd over you.  Now, is sort of a wolf. CAROL BEHRENDS:  Exactly. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah and how'd that make you feel about church?   CAROL BEHRENDS:  I don't need church to have a relationship with the Lord. JULIE ROYS:  So you feel done with it? CAROL BEHRENDS:  I am done with it.  For right now, that's where I'm at. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah, understandable.  I get the pain and I get where you're coming from.  Rob you're not going to have a chance to talk in this segment.  I hate to tell you that. ROB SPEIGHT:  That's okay. (laughter) JULIE ROYS:  But when we come back, Rob Speight will tell his story and Rob was at Willow Creek, also served on staff.  So, you have kind of both worlds there from being on staff and being a member. ROB SPEIGHT:  I do. JULIE ROYS: And now you're kind of, you're preaching in a church and doing itinerant thing. ROB SPEIGHT:  Getting back into the pulpit now. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah okay.  And your wife is going to a small group but that's about as much as she can handle right now, right? ROB SPEIGHT:  I'd say that's affirmative. JULIE ROYS:  Yeah, okay.  Well, again, we're going to explore this more when we come back.  You're listening to The Roys Report.  Joining me Carol Behrends, Terri Streich, also Rob Speight and two Chicago area pastors, Dave Jones and also Joe Thorn.  We'll be right back after a short break.  Stay tuned. 3rd Segment JULIE ROYS: Welcome back to The Roys Report, brought to you in part by Judson University.  I'm Julie Roys.  And today, we're discussing Living in the Aftermath of Church Scandals. Here in the Chicago area, we've had two, major scandals—first at Willow Creek Community Church, involving founder Bill Hybels. And then at Harvest Bible Chapel involving former pastor, James MacDonald. Many feel betrayed and duped and are profoundly wary of churches and pastors. And pastors—many of whom are godly and honest—suddenly are viewed with suspicion. In fact, I remember our first show was talking a lot about the Harvest Bible Chapel situation. I got an email from somebody that said, “Man, you sound like you're pastor-bashing.” And I'm like, “Ahh.” It made me feel awful because I do love pastors and I know the majority of them are great people and godly people. But that's just the reality right now. So, as a Christian community—how do we heal? How do we deal with this situation?  Today's show is recorded, so I can't take your calls. But I encourage you to join the live conversation. That's going on online on Facebook.com/ReachJulieRoys. Also, on Twitter, you can use my handle @ReachJulieRoys. Well joining me this morning, two Chicago-area pastors, Joe Thorn and Dave Jones. Also joining me are three people who have left their churches, following scandal there. We just heard in the previous segment from Carol Behrends and Terri Streich. But now I've got Rob Speight. And Rob was at Willow Creek Community Church. But Rob, I'm sure you saw great things at Willow. That's what brought you there. But tell me how you became disillusioned and decided to leave. ROB SPEIGHT: Well, when the story broke, that was the first time I heard it, anything about it, was from the Chicago Tribune in March of 2018. And very much like Carol, I believed it because of the people, and their characters, who were making these claims. And then when I attended the first family meeting, which was a defense of Bill Hybels and a defense of the Elders and how the women were liars and colluders, I immediately began to write to the Elders. Because, even though I'm a lone, or a small voice in large church, I wanted them to know that there were people questioning decisions that were made. And so I started to write to them, and the answers that I continued to receive were lacking in transparency. They were, I don't believe, forthcoming with what was happening. And then eventually, it wasn't too long after, that we stopped attending. But I continued to write to the elders and continued to be shushed. They did not want me speaking up and sharing my thoughts. JULIE ROYS: And then we had, initially what was it, 3 women? Was it 3?  ROB SPEIGHT: Well, it was Vonda Dyer, Nancy Beach,  JULIE ROYS: Nancy Ortberg ROB SPEIGHT: Nancy Ortberg. And then Jimmy and Leanne Mellado were advocates, trying to tell the story of an affair that they knew about, that the elders supposedly investigated . . . JULIE ROYS: And the woman had recanted. Taken back her testimony.  ROB SPEIGHT: They use that as an excuse.  JULIE ROYS: I know . . . ROB SPEIGHT: They use that as an excuse when there are others that know something very different. JULIE ROYS: So since then, though, as it became 10 women or more, and then Pat Baranowski—Bill Hybel's former assistant—when she had her exposé in the New York Times, that seemed to be sort of a, the last straw . . . ROB SPEIGHT: That was the last straw, yes. JULIE ROYS: So then you had Steve Carter resign and apologize. An elder apologized to the congregation. All the elders resigned. It wasn't enough for you, though? ROB SPEIGHT: Steve Carter was, he isn't given enough credit as he deserves for standing up to a machine. And if he hadn't resigned, I'm not sure what would have happened. But he caused, in my opinion, Heather Larson to resign and all the elders to resign. Was it enough? Well it hadn't been enough, because I'd started a blog and I was writing there. And then when there was a meeting called in August, a very spur of the moment meeting, and Heather Larson and the elders resigned, that was enough. And I stopped writing my blog. And I wanted to give Steve Gillen and the new elders to be, space. JULIE ROYS: Well, and we can talk a lot about because just recently there was a meeting, a reconciliation meeting—I know a lot of the victims didn't feel like it was reconciliation at all, didn't feel like—they weren't even mentioned by name. And so, we could talk a lot about those specifics, but I really want to move it now toward what about your feeling now towards the church in general and toward joining another church? You've left Willow, how do you feel about joining another church? ROB SPEIGHT: I like the idea of joining another church. I like the idea of being part of a community. Do I look with a jaundiced eye at what might be going on behind the scene? Ya, I do. JULIE ROYS: You're skeptical. ROB SPEIGHT: I am skeptical. But, for good reason. But I also know that God uses the local church. God wants his followers to be part of a community, and to build into each other's lives and to use their spiritual gifts. And that happens in the local church. JULIE ROYS: But you're kind of in a wasteland right now. I kind of understand that. We're going to need to go to break. When we come back, I want to hear just briefly, what do you need to hear from a pastor for you to feel safe there. Then I'm going to give our pastors a chance to respond to that. Just reminds me, I remember when we were looking for a church years and years ago and we'd had a bad experience on staff at the church. Really bad. Very wounded. And I remember meeting with a pastor, which it took about 6 to 9 months to get a meeting with the pastor. Finally got a meeting with the pastor and he looked at me and he said, “You know, I just get the feeling that you're not that excited about this church and that enthused.” And I looked at him and I'm like, “Well, yeah, you know, but it's kinda the best we could find. We love the church with its warts and everything else, so we're just going to roll up our sleeves and serve.” And he looked at me and he said, “Well, if that's how you feel, you can't serve at this church. We want people who are enthusiastic.” Needless to say, we walked out of that meeting and we didn't join that church. I know some of you are listening, you can relate to this. I hope you'll stick with us, we're going to come right back after a short break. Again, you're listening to The Roys Report with Julie Roys. Joining me, 2 area pastors, 3 Harvest and Willow Creek refugees. It's going to be a great discussion. Hope you stay with us.  4th Segment JULIE ROYS: Well, how does the Christian community recover from church scandals? Welcome back to The Roys Report. I'm Julie Roys. And today, we're tackling a painful subject that has impacted so many people here in the Chicago area, but also around the country. Of course, in Chicago, we've had two major church scandals involving Willow Creek Community Church and Harvest Bible Chapel. But unfortunately, these scandals are not isolated. I can still remember back in the 80s and probably a lot of you listening can remember this as well when Jimmy Swaggert, that scandal hit. When the PTL scandal and Jim Bakker hit. It was disillusioning. It really was, not that I was a big follower of Jim Bakker or Jimmy Swaggert but man, that was the first big evangelical scandal and I just didn't think that was possible for us.  These scandals are so, so painful. And they shouldn't happen. Pastors should love and protect the sheep, not fleece and abuse them. But that is what has been the reality at some of these churches. And what do we do when this unthinkable thing happens? Well, we're going to jump back into that discussion in just a minute. But first, I want to remind you this month for a gift of any size to this ministry I am giving away copies of the book by apologist Norm Geisler, an amazing defender of the Christian Faith, who just passed away last month. The book is I Don't Have Enough Faith to be an Atheist. And it's a great read by someone I greatly admired. And if you read any of my coverage of the battle for inerrancy at the Moody Bible Institute last year, you'll see Norm's name because I interviewed him several times about the issue. He was so passionate about the truth and inerrancy. And I'm thrilled to offer his book. So if you'd like to support this ministry and get a copy of I Don't Have Enough Faith to be an Atheist just go to my website JulieRoys.com and click on the donate button. Also, I want to let you know, if you've missed any part of today's broadcast or just want to listen again, or share it with friends, the audio of today's program will be posted by 1:00 pm today to my website. And again, the website is JulieRoys.com.  You know it's funny, I even feel this because I just asked for donations, that there's a sense in this room, my goodness how dare she (laughter) and I get that. I will say this, we have made a commitment to publishing a line item budget and how much I have made or taken out of that. I can promise you it's a part-time salary to do this radio program. It is nothing anywhere on the level that we have seen by megachurch pastors. But again, I believe completely in open and complete conversation about that and being transparent. But part of that is because it has to be.  So, let me return to this conversation, Rob and I had said this before the break. Again joining me is Rob Speight. Rob is a former member at Willow Creek Community church. Rob, what do pastors need to know about you and people like you that are walking through their door? ROB SPEIGHT: I believe the folks who are visiting churches who have come out of places like Willow Creek and Harvest Bible Chapel, they're going thru various stages of grief. And there are those who want to be left alone. They want to come in, hopefully experience and be part of good worship and be taught from the word of God and I want to leave. But for my wife and myself, that wasn't the case. We had pretty much recovered from some of the shock of what had occurred at Willow. And we had visited a number of churches and we have never stuck anywhere. And one of the—there's a community in a church, there's strengths and weaknesses about community. The strength is, if you've got it, you love it! And you want to hold on to it. But the weakness is, how does a refugee break into that community? So, for the pastors to communicate to their body, who have community, we know you love each other and you have great small groups and all you want to be together and cannot wait to talk with your friends after church or before church. But there are refugees coming. And will you, you've got to go out of your comfort zone. Your comfort zone is to be with your friends. Out of your comfort zone is to be noticing, watching, who is new? And not to be like, “Hey, did you sign in yet?” Not to be over bearing. But to be caring, winsome, and to be sensitive. Are you hearing from someone who wants more or are you hearing from someone who wants their distance? So that is a value that I believe incoming churches need to have for refugees. JULIE ROYS: Absolutely. Carol, that question makes you furl your brow, just the idea of what do pastors need to hear from you? CAROL BEHRENDS: I don't need the pastors. JULIE ROYS: You've kind of had it. CAROL BEHRENDS: I'm really on my own. I have Christian fellowship without being in church. JULIE ROYS: It would take a miracle for you to go back to the church at this point. CAROL BEHRENDS: I don't trust myself to choose a church that in the end I will be able to trust. Because I was in a church for 38 years and didn't realize what the reality was.  JULIE ROYS: Boy that's hard. You know what? And I've heard people say that, like who have had multiple experiences even at bad churches and say, “What's wrong with me? Why didn't I do a better job picking a church?” It's certainly not your fault, Carol.   CAROL BEHRENDS: I pride myself on my intuition and this time it didn't work. JULIE ROYS: That's tough. Terry? TERRI STREICH: Yah, after many, many years of making relationships and but seeing the hypocrisy that was going on in the church, very painful. You can't equate it to anything. They're starting to write about these things now. It is such a grief and a disappointment to come from the Christian community from Holy Spirit led supposedly people. The paranoia that was going on, on the staff at the end, was difficult. And so when I quit, we invited the pastor over, never contacted. There was no love, no outreach. People are left all by themselves, you feel naked. And it is very, very painful. Many tears, you question your own discernment, even. “Why didn't I see that?” Dave and I, we had our meetings. We had a million meetings. And believing the best and nothing. Most things didn't change. JULIE: Yet you ended up at Joe's church. TERRI STREICH: Yes. JULIE ROYS: I don't think I introduced you at the beginning of the segment, Terry Streich you were at Harvest Bible Chapel and Carol was at Willow Creek Community church.  Joe Thorn one of the area pastors on this program also David Jones. You ended up at Joe's church. Did Joe do something right that made you say, “okay, I can trust this dude?” TERRI STREICH: Well this is what happens. ‘Cause a lot of people were calling us and asking. Dave and I had to decide, “what are the main things that God will have us . . .?” It wasn't easy to go somewhere new. But, you can listen to sermons online now. You can kinda check out people's doctrine before you step in and invest yourself or get hurt again. We did our investigation as best we could, and we came. And our hearts, we really ached for the word of God to be preached with no apology. In regards to doctrine, the theology, we weren't distracted because our lens that we were looking through, its sermons before, we were so critical, all of that. And we just didn't want to be distracted. We wanted to hear God's word just wash over us. That's what we were so hungry for. JULIE ROYS: So you were drawn to the preaching, was there something else?  TERRI STREICH: Yes. Well Joe is very accessible. We met him at a Starbucks that week. Dave wrote him an email affirming his gift. And we asked a million questions. The people were lovely there. But our eyes always have to be set on the Lord and trust his leading and guiding. And ask for discernment as we read His word. That's really important. JULIE ROYS: And you said earlier before we were on air, I'm never going to a megachurch again.  TERRI STREICH: No, we won't. JULIE ROYS: That's interesting. Dave, you don't have a megachurch, but it's, you know what would you say, about 600, 650? How do you respond to you know what these women want from a church, what Rob's wanting from a church? What have you guys done? DAVID JONES: Yeah, so again, I think a big part of it for people is just hearing that they understand and know. And so just to let a visitor who's coming know, “I get what you're going through right now. Like I experienced it myself personally.” And I think that is disarming in and of itself. And it begins a process of building trust. I think another thing that's important for them to realize is that even that this is new to you, this is not new to the church. Jesus predicted that there would be ravenous wolves who would come in among the sheep not sparing the flock. He spent His last major discourse of teaching, according to Matthew's gospel warning people about false teachers. The book of Revelation details seven different churches. And some of them received no condemnation. Some received only condemnation. Some received mixed reviews. And, you know, we look at the problems with Corinth and otherwise. Like the early church was not a perfect place. They were real people who wrestled with real issues, and some of these issues were leadership issues. So I think for people who have come to that awareness of, “This has been going on since the beginning of church history. It's just happening to me now.” JULIE ROYS: Man, that is great. Joe I am going to let you land this plane. Although Dave, you just got us down the runway, Joe, speak to these people hurting right now. JOE THORN: Listen to what pastor Dave, said. JUILIE ROYS: You second that? JOE THORN: Yes, he's giving you the truth of God's word. My encouragement to people that are hurting that are coming out of spiritually abusive and toxic cultures, churches and situations is to give yourself time. But to draw near to God through the means of Grace meaning His word and meaning prayer. But the means of grace are really most vibrantly and intensely experienced in the Christian community of faith. And so, I want to say I understand, I am not mad at you that people are distancing themselves. I am angry at the wolves. But, I guess the challenge would be, I don't think that we can be the people that God calls us to be or I don't even think we can do all the things God called us do, outside of the local church. Now that's going to look different, different kind of churches, whether it's house churches, megachurches, big, regular, small churches were made for that kind of covenant Christian community. So, I think the people that I have talked to haven't completely said, “I'm never going back under any circumstances. They just understand, “I don't know when I'm going back.” So, I want to encourage them, “leave that door open. And surround yourself with good Christians who can speak into your life and perhaps you'll find your way back to church through them, eventually.”  But do not distance yourself from the means of grace, that is going to be critical for your spiritual health. JULIE ROYS: I know Dave you've actually done something intentional at your church about spiritual abuse, inviting people in to process these spiritual abusive situations they've been from. I think those are really important, and I so appreciate. Thank you so much Rob, Dave, Joe, Terri, Carol for being willing to come and be a part of this, I think it was really helpful. You know I resonate with what you guys just said and the scriptures that are coming to mind, Matthew 16:18, where Jesus says to Peter, “I will build my church, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.”  So the church is God's church He won't give up on her and I truly believe that these horrible things, and abuses that have come to light, have come to light because God is purifying his church, he has brought these things out, I don't think it's  just man's work, it's God's work. Second scripture is Hebrews 10:25 where the apostle Paul urges us not to stop meeting together and I get it that for some, find fellowship where you can and come to the hospital for healing. We need each other, we desperately need each other. If you missed any of this program the entire podcast will be posted to my website JulieRoys.com. Thank you so much for joining me. Have a great weekend.  Read more

Read our web story: Meet Charley Parkhurst: The Gold Rush’s Fearless, Gender Non-Conforming Stagecoach Driver Reported by Jessica Placzek. Bay Curious is made by Olivia Allen-Price, Jessica Placzek, Katie McMurran, Rob Speight, Suzie Racho, Paul Lancour and Ryan Levi. Additional support from Julie Caine, Ethan Lindsey, Vinnee Tong and David Weir. Theme music by Pat Mesiti-Miller. Ask us a question or sign up for our newsletter at BayCurious.org. Follow Olivia Allen-Price on Twitter @oallenprice.

Traditions. We all have them. Some good and, well, some not so good. Think for a minute. When you were a kid, what were your holiday traditions? Do you still follow some of them today? Put up lights? Bake special cookies or visit relatives? What if the law makes it impossible to follow your traditions? More than two million Americans will spend the holidays locked up in a jail or prison. In the Bay Area, volunteers spend a few hours inside San Quentin State Prison's cell blocks singing holiday songs with the men. It's an annual tradition. What's it like to spend years of your adult life in prison over the holidays? From inside San Quentin State Prison, join Shadeed Wallace Stepter, Rahsaan Thomas, and Emile DeWeaver as they share memories of holidays when they were free, and how, over the years, they have created new traditions, to celebrate the holidays behind prison walls. Emile DeWeaver Secretary of the San Quentin Chapter of the Society of Professional Journalists and reporter for Prison Renaissance, and a contributing opinion writer for San Jose Mercury Newsand Easy Street Magazine. Rashaan Thomas Vice-Chair of the San Quentin Chapter of the Society of Professional Journalists and reporter with Prison Renaissance,The San Quentin News, and a contributing reporter for The Marshall Project. Shadeed Wallace-StepterChair of the San Quentin Chapter of the Society of Professional Journalists, a reporter with the San Quentin Prison Report, and a TEDX presenter. Listen to TRADITIONS Visit our website www.lifeofthelaw.org or listen to all 124 episodes on iTunes. And send us your thoughts on this episode to connect@lifeofthelaw.org. Production Notes:Inside San Quentin: Traditions — was produced by Shadeed Wallace-Stepter, Rashaan Thomas and Emile DeWeaver.  Life of the Law's Senior Producer is Tony Gannon. Our Post Production Editors are Kirsten Jusewicz-Haidle and Rachael Cain. Music in this episode was recorded by Life of the Law's Executive Producer, Nancy Mullane. The song  'Keep It On The Real' (Instrumental) by 3X Krazy is used in the introduction and end credits and is referenced by Emile DeWeaver. Rob Speight was our engineer at the studios of KQED in San Francisco. This episode of Life of the Law was funded in part by donations from our listeners, and by grants from theLaw and Society Association, and theNational Science Foundation. © Copyright 2017 Life of the Law. All rights reserved.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices