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Episode 291-Drop Your Socks and Grab Your Glocks Also Available OnSearchable Podcast Transcript Gun Lawyer — Episode Transcript Page – 1 – of 14 Gun Lawyer — Episode 291 Transcript SUMMARY KEYWORDS Gun rights, Second Amendment, gerrymandering, New Jersey, federal law, AK-47, AR-15, gun laws, Supreme Court, carry permit, gun dealers, political power, racial discrimination, gun ownership, legal battles. SPEAKERS Speaker 1, Teddy Nappen, Speaker 3, Evan Nappen Speaker 1 00:11 Lawyer, Evan Nappen 00:18 I’m Evan Nappen. Teddy Nappen 00:20 And I’m Teddy Nappen. Evan Nappen 00:22 And welcome to Gun Lawyer. So, Teddy, what’s on your mind today? Teddy Nappen 00:27 Well, I never realized the guy that wrote the Zombie Survival Guide, Max Brooks, was related to Mel Brooks. I thought it was a common name. Evan Nappen 00:38 What? How is he related to Mel Brooks? Teddy Nappen 00:40 It’s his son, so. Evan Nappen 00:42 Oh, my G-d! Is he gonna make a movie, you know, Young Zombie or something? Teddy Nappen 00:44 Yeah, no, Young Zombie. Evan Nappen 00:46 Or a zombie movie with lots of farts? Page – 2 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 00:52 No. Evan Nappen 00:53 Blazing Zombies, Blazing Zombies. Teddy Nappen 00:55 Yeah! Blazing Zombies, that’s it, kind of like what was it, Abraham Lincoln and the Vampire Abraham Lincoln. Evan Nappen 01:02 Right. I think Blazing Zombies would probably be very popular. Teddy Nappen 01:06 Yeah, I know, right. Let’s see them try to reboot Blazing Saddles. Good luck with that. Evan Nappen 01:12 Well, they could do Blazing. Yeah, but if they did Blazing Zombies, they would never be able to say certain words that they used in Blazing Saddles. Teddy Nappen 01:23 Yeah, like calling the zombies a bunch of leg draggers. Evan Nappen 01:26 Ha, ha, ha, ha. Actually, we’re kind of dealing with a zombie apocalypse with the Democrat party lately. I think they are a bunch of, you know. They don’t have brains. They just try to eat brains. Teddy Nappen 01:48 Yeah. And unfortunately, they keep coming up with new ideas to screw us out of our rights. Evan Nappen 01:55 Right! That’s it. That’s what they do. They send the horde out to eat our rights. They do the horde, and they just try to get everybody on board to sacrifice for their pure unadulterated political power. Like trying to get college athletes to boycott their entire athletic career, over, for example, they’re flipping out over the ending of racial gerrymandering. I mean, it’s kind of unbelievable when you watch them talk about this being, you know, Jim Crow II, when all that is being done is ending racial discrimination, with setting up voting districts. Somehow ending racial discrimination is Jim Crow. Only a Democrat with zombie brains could ever make that argument with a straight face. Teddy Nappen 02:59 Well, it’s also very funny because, if you cut to all of New England, where the breakdown is roughly like 40 to 50% Republican, and there’s no representation for that. And so, they, and it’s all the states are heavily, heavily gerrymandered, like zero representation for Republicans, but oh, that’s fine. It’s only Page – 3 – of 14 when the Republicans say, you know what? You’ve established the rules of engagement, and we will oblige. That’s just how the game is played. Evan Nappen 03:29 Now, you would think that the Democrats would have expert knowledge on Jim Crow, because they’re the ones that started it. The original Jim Crow laws were done by Democrats after the Civil War. And, of course, who opposed the Civil Rights Act? The Democrats. They were the originals. And then for them to get up now and claim how much they want to oppose what they are perceiving as Jim Crow laws are kind of rich. And, of course, it isn’t. It is the actual elimination of the racial discrimination that is in place by way of their gerrymandering, and this is very important to our gun rights, Teddy. Very important to our gun rights. As voting is turned around, so that it actually reflects the voters, as opposed to these bizarre jurisdictions engineered for Democrats just to maintain power, we will see more and more advances in the fight for our gun rights. It is the other side there that constantly is trying to take away our Second Amendment rights. Teddy Nappen 04:52 What always makes me laugh, though, is they always try to say the party switched. They always make that argument. By the way, it’s a completely disproven argument. Like, okay, what time period? Was it under Senator (Robert) Byrd, who was a, what was it? The Grand Wizard? Evan Nappen 05:07 The Grand Wizard of the KKK. Teddy Nappen 05:10 Which, by the way, he was a mentor to Joe Biden throughout his political career. But no one talks about that. Or when Joe Biden, what did Joe Biden say on the stage? Evan Nappen 05:21 Oh, don’t even. Teddy Nappen 05:21 Yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah. Evan Nappen 05:25 party, Evan Nappen 05:25 The party hasn’t switched. They’re just trying to build a bigger fence with a plantation. They are the ones trying to run a plantation, and that’s what gerrymandering, prior to this Calais Supreme Court case, that’s what it was really about. How does the Democrat maintain their plantations of voter districts, to maintain their power? Page – 4 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 05:50 Yeah, exactly. They put up the creation that Johnson, what was it? We’re going to get these guys voting Democrat for the rest of their lives. They created the giant welfare state. Evan Nappen 06:01 Yeah. And by the way, he didn’t even call them “these guys”. Teddy Nappen 06:05 I know I was trying to, I was paraphrasing. Evan Nappen 06:11 Describing them. Yeah, just their hypocrisy definitely knows no bounds, and this time period now is somewhat encouraging, because a lot of everything that they’ve built on, including taking our gun rights, it’s collapsing all around them. It’s very encouraging to see that. You just saw the primaries go here. Trump with what 34 zero or whatever on his picks, and that helps get us further with the expansion of our Second Amendment rights. This is all a part. Because part of MAGA is the rebirth of the power of the Second Amendment, that is a part of MAGA, guys. You’ve got to know that, and you can see it. We are now in a completely different world than in the Biden era. I mean, Biden was essentially engaging in a clamp down, a clamp down on our rights in every way that he could abuse federal power to do so. And we’re seeing incredible changes in the other direction now. Teddy Nappen 07:29 I’ll give you the highlight of that. We dealt with this, where it was weaponization. They were going after dealers for the most minuscule things with a zero tolerance. And now that’s been eliminated, and it has been helping. Of course, New Jersey picks up the mantle from their new AG. Now they’re going after FFL dealers and demanding records detailing the sales of Glocks, which I could have sworn they already knew about the sales, because every time you purchase. Evan Nappen 08:01 Yeah, this is what is such crap about these subpoenas to all the dealers to turn over their records of the last decade for every Glock sold. New Jersey has a pistol purchase permit system, which is a form of register. So, the State Police already have the computerized registered database of every purchase of a Glock since the computerization of the pistol permit system, which completely covers the decade that they’re requesting. In other words, the only reason for this subpoena is essentially, in my opinion, to harass dealers because the information itself is already at their fingertips. Now, the bigger legal question is, is that something legally they’re allowed to access because New Jersey has Administrative Code provisions that mandate confidentiality on all gun records of purchase acquisition. All that kind of stuff is protected by that confidentiality. So, maybe they themselves thought that trying to just get dealer records, maybe could do an end run over their own Administrative Code, preventing the release of this information. Although there is a provision in the Code that says for law enforcement purposes it can be accessed. But this is a lawsuit, not law enforcement purposes. So, it really is interesting the approach they’re taking. If they’re righteous in the law, in being able to access this data, then they can access it through the database in the appropriate legal manner, if they are qualified. And if not, why are they subpoenaing dealers to turn over information that is already in the possession of the State of New Page – 5 – of 14 Jersey? And these application forms, et cetera, are protected by way of their own Administrative Code provisions, setting out confidentiality. Teddy Nappen 10:20 So, Teddy Nappen 10:21 Yeah, I will say what’s really messed up is I love the AG’s response. So, this was actually from 2A News Team. They asked these questions and the AG responded. Oh no, no. These requests are not seeking information about individual purchasers or any person’s identifying information about their purchases. However, the subpoena says that exact wording. Evan Nappen 10:50 Right. Teddy Nappen 10:51 Documents show sufficient sale or transfer of Glock handguns from you to New Jersey customers. Literally, it’s the first line in the subpoena. Evan Nappen 11:03 Right. And the thing about Glocks. Look, if you own a Glock, you know you better hold on to it. This is the new tactic of the anti-Second Amendment rights movement. To try to ban and restrict Glocks because of a claim that they can be relatively easily converted to fully automatic using what’s called a Glock switch. But mere possession of a Glock switch under federal law is considered a machine gun in and of itself, and these switches are banned in New Jersey as well. The component is already illegal. So, trying to link Glocks to them so that they can further take away one of the most popular self-defense handguns in the world. This is their gambit. This is their gambit now to try to do that. Teddy Nappen 12:10 So, it was also interesting, is pull it was from the article. Out of the 15 FFLs that they subpoenaed, they were roughly, there was 15 of those FFLs were out of the total authorized Glock dealers. So, I’m trying to think the strategy of it. If they’re trying, if these were just the 15, were kind of like where they went after those two gun dealers and forced them to basically have to essentially declare and register every purchase or gun-related material. Are they just going for the small fish to then go after the whole? Kind of like a staff? Teddy Nappen 12:46 Out of curiosity. Could there be a constitutional challenge because there’s a federal firearms license? Could you either make the Supremacy Clause argument or just going with the idea of there shouldn’t be a state license, too? Evan Nappen 12:46 Okay. At a minimum, it’s designed to harass gun dealers. I mean, New Jersey is dedicated to that principle, given the excesses that they go to regarding being a New Jersey retail firearm dealer. I mean Page – 6 – of 14 having an FFL, that’s a federal firearm license. New Jersey also requires for a dealer to have a New Jersey retail dealer firearms license, and the retail dealer firearms license is what is managed by the state of New Jersey. And that’s where you see an incredibly excessive and additional amount of requirements, far beyond what federal law requires, designed to be a legal discouragement to being a dealer. Also, it’s been used in the past as a pretext to raid individuals that had FFLs but did not have a NJ retail dealer license. I’ve had cases on this where individuals that had a federal firearms license for Curio and Relic, collector licenses, the state alleged they were federal firearm licensees and acting as dealers, which they were not. They are collectors. And because they alleged they had a federal license, they needed a New Jersey firearm retail dealer license. They proceeded to conduct raids on the individuals that held Curio and Relic licenses. So, this is one of the risks out there. They were able to purge and merge the federal list to the state list of New Jersey retailers. Evan Nappen 14:31 Well, the problem is that the federal firearm law is expressly not preemptive. It’s designed to be the absolute minimum gun control harassment that exists throughout the entire country. And then states are invited to, you know, this was the philosophy, invited to go wild. So, you have the baseline of the federal law, which has many constitutional questions about it itself, expressly not being preemptive, and the states are left to their own devices to create whatever stricter and stricter and more harassing and more discouraging gun laws that they want to pass. And as long as those laws are somehow upheld constitutionally, they can keep on going. There is no cap. There’s no cap placed on the attack on our rights. It should exist, but doesn’t, except in a few very narrow areas where there is express preemption. Evan Nappen 16:22 One of those places where there is express preemption is Title 18 926 A for interstate transport of your guns. You can transport your guns cased, unloaded, locked, not readily accessible, etc., so that you can go through bad states in your travels. There’s areas of preemption, specifically for carry, like LEOSA, Law Enforcement Officer Safety Act, where retired and active law enforcement can carry, regardless of the state law that might otherwise try to prevent them from doing so. There’s actually preemption for carry. It was the original carry preemption, which a lot of people don’t know was for armored car security. Armored car personnel was actually the first federal carry preemption. And then today we’re pushing to try to get national reciprocity, which is in effect national preemption, mandating that every state recognize every other state’s carry rights to that particular resident in whatever state that resident might be in. But generally across 99% of all the federal gun laws, it is expressly not preemptive. So, this is where the problems come in, because there is no cap on the damage that states can do. Teddy Nappen 17:55 So, it would require an, it would basically either require an act of Congress to amend it to include the preemption. Evan Nappen 18:02 Yes, literally, what would be great is if we finally get a cap. Now, in theory, the cap on bad gun laws is this little thing we call the Second Amendment, and the Second Amendment’s cap was fairly broad. The Page – 7 – of 14 cap, as I recall, it said shall not be infringed. Okay? Shall not be infringed. So, any infringement is arguably a violation of the Second Amendment. Therefore no state or federal government, because we now have it incorporated to the states through the McDonald case, through the 14th Amendment, like many of our other constitutional rights. No state or federal law should infringe on our gun rights. Yet we’re knee deep in battles over various gun laws that are utterly passed with contempt of the Second Amendment, and then we have to go through these fights over it. Teddy Nappen 19:09 Yeah, and it’s definitely. I noticed that whenever it comes to New Jersey, I mean, I know people always talk about state powers, how they, you know, always leave it to the states. However, there are some things that there’s just so much abuse by the states that what they do, I mean, just right now, what they are doing right now is disgusting. Where they’re just harassing these dealers, going after them, wasting the taxpayers dollars. And it’s the level of where, all right, the federal government needs to step in, and I can see everyone’s like, “Oh, don’t allow the feds to get in, but here is the truth. They abuse it so much that there’s just no, there’s no value. Evan Nappen 19:54 Well, frankly, if we simply made the federal law, as it stands right now, as the preemptive. Just passed a law saying federal law preempts state law. Then every state gun law would become mooted out. Done. Invalid. Because only the federal law would apply. And currently under federal law there are no prohibitions on carry. There’s no addressing that in a negative way. Now, they might say, because the federal law doesn’t address it at all, then the states could still try to regulate carry. But then we still have the constitutional Second Amendment with the Bruen decision and such regarding carry. Then if we look at how the impact would be beyond that, well, everything else that these states try to pass, particularly on sale, possession, or on any of that, it would all be preemptively null and void by way of a federal law that they first engineered to just be a minimum to suddenly become the maximum. And that would concentrate our efforts only to having essentially federal fights, which would be pretty good, because instead of the pro-gun movement, those that defend our gun rights, and instead of having them fighting in every jurisdiction, everywhere, every state or county or town that passes some anti-Second Amendment gun rights law that we have to go in and challenge, we would have a preemptive federal law. So, every battle would simply be taking place, for the most part, at the federal law level of preemption, and it would basically gut that entire expenditure of the battle that we constantly have to foot the bill and pay for. It would be an interesting thing to conceptualize, to finally have a federal full preemption. I think it’s workable. Teddy Nappen 22:18 Yeah, and look, I never thought we’d ever see, like, the tax stamp removed for suppressors, and having a chance for it to be removed from the NFA, so anything is possible. We just need to get the right people in, and the right amount of votes. Evan Nappen 22:30 Yeah, it might, it might actually be, but then you’ll have even pro-Second Amendment folks, say, oh, states rights, states’ rights, you know. And they become so focused on so-called states’ rights that we still are losing our rights, because, as you say, Teddy, there’s an abuse by the states of our rights, and Page – 8 – of 14 this could end that abuse. So, when you have an abuse of state power, then the federal government really should come in to stop the abuse by the states. Teddy Nappen 22:53 I think it was in New York, and this might have been years ago. Do you remember they posted the map of who owned firearms? Evan Nappen 23:15 Yeah, it was New York, yeah, right. And then the public record, and then you could, it was searchable when you could find the gun owners. Teddy Nappen 23:25 Of course, a lot of them got robbed and harassed, and everything in that, which is just like, all right, fine. And you know what? When is it going to be enough for states’ powers? When they say everyone wears a yellow armband? It’s a picture of an AR, like states power, states rights. It’s such BS for allowing the abuse that comes down from New Jersey. Where you have the gulag that is the symbol of oppression of a totalitarian regime, and it just pisses me off so much when I hear that argument. I hear the people that make perfect the enemy of good, every time. How long did it take us to lose our rights to these people? Decades. And that’s what it’s going to take to get them back. It’s just disgusting. Evan Nappen 24:12 It is. But we’re in the fight, and we have to keep this fight on. Politically, the big picture is critical in our ability to win and get these changes. As much as all this is aggravating, if you step back, man, I can step back and look from having been practicing gun law for over 40 years. I can look and say we have come a long way. We’ve come a long way. The fact that we can finally have a carry permit in New Jersey is astounding. It’s astounding that we got to that, because that was something that seemed like an impossibility, and yet it got achieved. You can see amazing other advances. Evan Nappen 25:07 Hopefully, shortly, we will see the Supreme Court take a hardware case. We need them to take a hardware case. What I’m talking about is so-called assault firearms or assault weapons, magazines, where there is hardware that’s been banned. Where the constitutionality of the ability to ban hardware finally gets established out of the Supreme Court to end it, to stop it. That’s something that we’ve got to get to, and I think we’re going to see that soon. It is coming. There are so many cases, and they’ve been going up the chain. I think we’re going to see it. I don’t know if it’ll be, you know, this session. We’re getting close, and that’s what we saw, the prediction by even the U.S. Attorney General. The U.S. Attorney General saying they believe that ARs and others, Supreme Court will eventually pronounce they are legal. Teddy Nappen 26:16 I know there’s like, I know there’s rumors, everyone, about the different justices retiring. Imagine if Justice Thomas’s retirement, his last decision that he does, is he legalized and ends the assault firearm bans across the country. Page – 9 – of 14 Evan Nappen 26:31 Oh, that’d be just wonderful. I’d like to see St. Thomas. Teddy Nappen 26:36 Yeah. You know they did the commemorative, like Heller, like revolver, I remember that they. Evan Nappen 26:43 Which I have, I have a commemorative Heller Smith & Wesson .38. Not only was it commemorative and put out by Smith when the Heller decision came down, so it’s actually a Smith & Wesson bonafide commemorative, but I have that, I think I showed it to you, Teddy, it’s signed personally by Dick Heller, who’s a friend. So, I have a signed commemorative of the Heller decision, signed by Dick Heller himself. Teddy Nappen 27:10 Well, the next one I want it to be just, it’ll say the name of the case, and it’s just the Clarence Thomas smile that you see. The GIF area Thomas commemorative AR. Evan Nappen 27:23 And then, of course, the Left would complain that it’s racist because it’s a black rifle. No. You can’t be racist against Thomas, right? I mean, they always talk. Teddy Nappen 27:37 No, no, they say you can, because they say that he’s not black enough. If you know his entire history, the like, his, you could not, you could not live as a like a black American, like his entire thing, like inner city kid, like I think he was a single, like single mom, they like raised, like literally did the like live the entire black experience like it would be a lifetime movie. It would be amazing. Evan Nappen 28:05 He is an amazing man with actually the embodiment of the American dream, in effect. Coming from an absolutely underprivileged, you know, situation where he rose to be one of the greatest Supreme, one of the greatest, for sure, Supreme Court justices. His amazing story about an amazing man. Just great. And they don’t, because just like with gerrymandering, where there are plenty of Republican minority reps out there, it’s not racism at all. It’s the Democrat power grab, and because Judge Thomas is conservative, they refuse to acknowledge the benefit of having such a great man. Teddy Nappen 29:03 Yeah. And he is what Joe Biden would describe as articulate, bright, and clean. Evan Nappen 29:09 Oh G-d. Teddy Nappen 29:13 I love how Biden said that to Obama. I know. Page – 10 – of 14 Evan Nappen 29:16 I mean. He would constantly say these things. And yet they will extrapolate 10 times out to try to paint Trump as racist when Biden was. He bona fide said stuff that was absolutely insane with racism. Stereotypical racism. Teddy Nappen 29:44 Yeah. Evan Nappen 29:45 Yeah, really. I mean, just come on. Insulting and amazing. Well, and let me tell you, Teddy, about our good friends at WeShoot. WeShoot is an indoor range. You and I have shot there, and you love WeShoot, don’t you, Teddy? Teddy Nappen 30:04 I had a great time. Evan Nappen 30:05 We always do, every time. We got our certifications there for our carries, and you can do the same. They’ve got a great pro shop, great trainers, great facility, and it’s really conveniently right off the Parkway in Lakewood, New Jersey. Lakewood, New Jersey. You want to check out the WeShoot website at weshootusa.com. And you should make sure you get on their email list, because WeShoot sends out a lot of great stuff via email. All their great deals and specials and cool events they’re doing and all kinds of fun things. WeShoot is extremely dynamic, and they are always doing something. WeShoot is just super fun. So, if you’re looking for a great range to belong to, a great place to shoot, a great place to hone your skills, get your training, you cannot do any better than WeShoot in Lakewood. Check out weshootusa.com. Evan Nappen 31:18 Let me also mention my book, New Jersey Gun Law. It’s the bible of New Jersey gun law. It is a book used by, well, everybody. If you want to understand New Jersey gun law, you need my book, which is not surprisingly titled New Jersey Gun Law. You can get your copy at EvanNappen.com, EvanNappen.com. When you get the book, you’ll see it is very large. It is over 500 pages. It’s 120 topics, all question and answer. And the greatest thing about my book is that the book itself can be used as a weapon. It’s that big. I’m not advising you to do that, but should you need to, yes, that is a book you don’t want to get hit in the head with. So, check out New Jersey Gun Law at EvanNappen.com. Teddy, I bet you have something else up your sleeve to tell us. Teddy Nappen 32:18 Well, one of the things that did come up, and I just thought, what the heck? This is in the feed of the New York Times. Where are all the AK 47s? Like, where have all the AK 47s gone? I know. Evan Nappen 32:19 I don’t know. Where have they gone? Page – 11 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 32:21 I know. It was a very interesting article, but it was also very strange. Just reading through, I don’t know if you ever heard of Jim Fuller? Evan Nappen 32:47 The Fuller Brush Man? Teddy Nappen 32:49 Apparently, he’s a gunsmith. He makes custom AKs. I’m not too familiar on that, but he was going into details of, like, and they were talking about the collapse of the AK market. Evan Nappen 33:01 Well, there is a downturn, but prices aren’t collapsing. Teddy Nappen 33:06 Yeah, I mean, how much are you going for? Evan Nappen 33:08 One of the Russian AKs going. You know the problem is, what led to the big boom, of course, was when we were importing AKs. We could have them from China and Russia. Although we were getting really cheap ammo, and there was so much of the surplus ammo, the 762 by 39 that it became extremely popular, because you could so reasonably shoot. Then it became so overwhelmingly possible that even American-made guns, like the Ruger Mini 30, for example, were being made in 762 by 39. Then you also had the influx of very reasonable SKSs. I mean, I remember when SKSs were under $100, for an SKS, and then you know the reasonable AKs and all that coming in with cheap ammo. Man, it was great. Then they started to ban the import, the ban of Chinese, ban of Russian, and the cheap ammo dried up. The guns that were coming in, the imports like those were dried up. Teddy Nappen 33:56 Apparently, it was in 1989 under Bush, because the shooter used the Chinese AK. Evan Nappen 34:32 Please remember, it was Bush. It was Bush, the Republican, the neocon, and this is one of the things that you got to always remember. Even though they may have the “R” there, they’re not necessarily a friend of the Second Amendment. Teddy Nappen 34:47 Yeah. And then the article tries to highlight more of like 2014 where the annexation of Crimea, the U.S. put sanctions on Russia. So, there goes all the Russian AKs. Evan Nappen 34:57 Well, not just Russian AKs. I mean, we were getting a lot of great guns, really cool guns from Russia, you know. We’re getting SKSs – originals, beautiful guns. I mean, phenomenal. Russian SKSs are probably the best SKS ever made, machined, gorgeous. Mosin-Nagant rifles, right? They were very Page – 12 – of 14 reasonable, and you know, you want to do the enemy at the gates, man. You got your gun and super strong, tough rifles. You know, a lot of great stuff could come in, and now we don’t see it anymore. And prices have skyrocketed. I mean, if you look at SKS prices today, holy crap. You’d be lucky to find a Chinese SKS that you used to be able to buy for less than $100, one in great shape today for 600 bucks, you know? I mean, easily 600, some even more. I’ve seen Russian SKSs pushing $2,000 a piece at the gun show. I mean, the prices are just unbelievable, because the market has a limitation now to the quantity that’s out there. And by the way, there’s probably only a 10th of the amount of Russian SKSs compared to Chinese SKSs. Even with that, the prices are way up there, and one of the reasons is that the SKSs, for example, are excellent functioning rifles. They’re handy. They function great and are very popular. Evan Nappen 36:36 With AKs, you know, there was that whole growth of it, and we were able to have all that great, cheap ammo. Once you got into an introductory, reasonable AK, then you wanted to up your game with other AKs, and all that. But what’s happened is, with the close out of that, we’ve become more, much, much more AR focused. The AR-15 platform, and everything about it. That’s all, a lot of it is U.S. made, and kind of America’s rifle. I would have to say today that America’s rifle, without a doubt, is the AR-15. Teddy Nappen 37:17 I would also say there’s also just the customization, and I think modularity. Evan Nappen 37:23 Its modularity seems to appeal to a lot of gun folks, because you can add and change and put all kinds of whistles and bells. Teddy Nappen 37:32 That also goes to the tone of American culture versus like the Eastern Bloc of the AK 47. We’re very individualistic, where we will make it so it is something that works for us, versus, you know, the AK 47 is designed, it is designed in that shape or form. You can do some small mods, but generally speaking, you pick up an AK 47 it’s, you know, hold it up to another one, like that’s the level of it. Evan Nappen 37:58 That’s an interesting point, Teddy, about how in those countries they don’t. It’s hard to find a Bubba AK in countries where they make the AKs, isn’t it? They don’t Bubbafi much, do they? But we love to modify, change, and customize, and that’s actually a lot of the fun of it. Let’s face it, it’s fun. It’s fun to add the accessories to fit your needs, make it look cooler, make it function better, make it more appropriate for whatever your needs may be. But then again, the anti-gun rights crowd will suddenly take any given feature and demonize certain features. So, if they are intrinsically evil, that if for some reason you have a telescoping stock on your AR or any other semi-auto, because your stock moves one or two inches back and forth, somehow that is such a huge impact on crime. Teddy Nappen 39:09 Or has a barrel shroud, which they can’t define. Page – 13 – of 14 Evan Nappen 39:12 Oh yeah, well, they try to. Remember. Teddy Nappen 39:15 The shoulder thingy that goes up, you know, the seat belt. Evan Nappen 39:18 The shoulder thingy that goes up is a barrel shroud. Isn’t that interesting? These are the experts that are voting for these laws. They have no clue what they’re even voting for, nor do they care. As long as it’s going against gun owners, they’re for it. They don’t care what it is. Teddy Nappen 39:39 Yeah, and I will say, just from the article, like, they try to, of course, they try to say, oh, Trump’s tariffs is what killed the AK market. There’s like also going from Russia, Ukraine, which they tried to say, you, oh, Poland is one of the key suppliers of Ukraine. No, the United States is one of the key suppliers of military to Ukraine. We’ve, you know, what is it, 40 billion, 80 billion, like crazy amounts, like they’re just still in that. And then again, tariffs are non-inflationary. We’ve known that, we’ve proven it. And I love how they try to say, well, we could get more AKs if we removed tariffs on Poland. Evan Nappen 40:21 Well, you know, it’s pretty bad when the Left media is trying to lure removal of tariffs by saying we could get more AKs in the country. That’s a pretty interesting stretch for them. Teddy Nappen 40:34 I know why they’re doing it. They’re trying to turn gun owners. They’re trying their best to turn gun owners into the debt, which is a ridiculous concept. They’ve demonized them, called them racist, call them everything under the sun. So, good luck trying to convince a gun owner to be considered a Democrat. If they are voting Democrat, you’re voting for your own destruction. I’m sorry. Evan Nappen 40:54 And speaking of destruction of gun owners, that is what GOFUs are. GOFU is our Gun Owner Fuck Ups. Every show we like to highlight the GOFU of the week, and this week’s GOFU is something that is constantly coming my way in the practice of law. And some of you listeners may say, yeah, it’s obvious, but I still have to say it because I keep getting case after case after case. It’s real simple, folks. You need to know your state’s gun laws. Most people understand that they need to know their state’s gun laws, but it doesn’t end there. If you travel out of state, you need to know the state’s gun laws that you’re traveling to. I constantly get cases of individuals that come from other states and end up being criminally charged in New Jersey because New Jersey’s gun laws are nothing like the gun laws of the state they were traveling from. The reverse is true, my friends. The reverse is true. Evan Nappen 42:13 You may have a New Jersey carry permit, but you need to know, if you don’t know, that no other state in America is recognized by New Jersey. No other state’s gun license is recognized by New Jersey. New Jersey has no reciprocity per se. When you travel, there are states where you can carry, because Page – 14 – of 14 despite New Jersey not recognizing their carry license, they’re willing to recognize any lawfully issued state carry. Many of the states, over 70% of the land mass in America, is constitutional carry, where as long as you’re law-abiding, you can carry even without a permit. But you still have to know, because I get calls from New Jersey folks that are getting jammed up in other states, making the mistake that others frequently make coming into New Jersey. Evan Nappen 43:24 So, the GOFU is real simple. Know the gun laws. Know the gun laws of the jurisdiction that you are residing in, and know the gun laws of the jurisdiction that you may be traveling in. It’s critical! I see it every day as a classic of virtually all GOFUs. This is Evan Nappen and Teddy Nappen reminding you that gun laws don’t protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens. Speaker 3 44:05 Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state. Downloadable PDF TranscriptGun Lawyer S5 E291_Transcript About The HostEvan Nappen, Esq.Known as “America's Gun Lawyer,” Evan Nappen is above all a tireless defender of justice. Author of eight bestselling books and countless articles on firearms, knives, and weapons history and the law, a certified Firearms Instructor, and avid weapons collector and historian with a vast collection that spans almost five decades — it's no wonder he's become the trusted, go-to expert for local, industry and national media outlets. Regularly called on by radio, television and online news media for his commentary and expertise on breaking news Evan has appeared countless shows including Fox News – Judge Jeanine, CNN – Lou Dobbs, Court TV, Real Talk on WOR, It's Your Call with Lyn Doyle, Tom Gresham's Gun Talk, and Cam & Company/NRA News. As a creative arts consultant, he also lends his weapons law and historical expertise to an elite, discerning cadre of movie and television producers and directors, and novelists. He also provides expert testimony and consultations for defense attorneys across America. 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Episode 289-Remember Bryan Malinowski Also Available OnSearchable Podcast Transcript Gun Lawyer — Episode Transcript Page – 1 – of 14 Gun Lawyer — Episode 289 Transcript SUMMARY KEYWORDS ATF raid, Brian Malinowski, unlicensed dealer, Arkansas lawmakers, DOJ investigation, no-knock warrant, self-defense, gun laws, Biden administration, Waco incident, Ruby Ridge, gun deserts, consumer protection, defensive property, gun rights. SPEAKERS Evan Nappen, Teddy Nappen, Speaker 2 Evan Nappen 00:17 I’m Evan Nappen. Teddy Nappen 00:19 and I’m Teddy Nappen. Evan Nappen 00:21 And welcome to Gun Lawyer. Teddy Nappen 00:24 So. Evan Nappen 00:25 Teddy, what’s up, man? Teddy Nappen 00:28 Well, just flipping through Ammoland from John Crump, by John Crump. I never even heard of this story. Like, I’m going to be very honest. I did not know this happened under the, by the ATF. Arkansas lawmakers are demanding the DOJ investigate the ATF raid on Brian Malinowski. (https://www.ammoland.com/2026/05/arkansas-lawmakers-doj-investigation-atf-raid-bryan-malinowski/) Evan Nappen 00:54 Are you talking about Malinowski? Teddy Nappen 00:56 Yeah, Malinowski. When reading the article, I was shocked, because I remember from all the criminal procedures of like, what you would do. And I’m like, this is the, I was getting flashbacks to watching the Waco documentary, from reading, like. Page – 2 – of 14 Evan Nappen 01:14 Teddy, let me explain. Yeah, I’m familiar with the Malinowski case. So, Malinowski was a total law-abiding guy. No priors, no issues, a law -abiding guy. He lived in, I believe, it was Alabama, and he was gun collector. He’d go to gun shows, and he would trade for guns. Sell private sale guns, etc., okay? A collector. And what happened was, as you may recall, the Biden bull garbage that we were dealing with. Trying to turn people into dealers who weren’t dealers. Well, ATF apparently believed that Mr. Malinowski was being an unlicensed gun dealer. Now, here’s the thing. He is a professional, first of all. As I recall, his background was in air traffic, you know, with the airline. Air Traffic Control, I think it was. Teddy Nappen 02:37 He was the, he looked like he was the head of the Clinton National Airport of Little Rock. Evan Nappen 02:43 Yeah. Here is a guy who’s a professional, head of an airport, that has his hobby of firearms, as many of us do. And Alabama is a private sale legal state. Teddy Nappen 02:56 I think it was Arkansas. Evan Nappen 02:59 Arkansas? Oh, yeah, yes, Arkansas, Arkansas. Teddy Nappen 03:02 Or the proper term, ArKansas. Evan Nappen 03:04 Well, it was legal for. Right! It was Arkansas, and it was legal to do. And what happened was just outrageous. They claimed he was in the business of selling firearms without an FFL. So, that’s the charge. You know whether they could prove it or not prove it or whatever, that’s what their claim was. And what happened was, ATF and Little Rock Police got a search warrant, and they came to his home at 6 am to look for evidence of wrongdoing. ATF breached the door with a battering ram. And I think, according to his wife, Malinowsky believed that these were intruders breaking into his home at 6 am, and he fired at the agents, not realizing, of course, what the hell’s going on. He hit one in the foot, and law officers there returned fire. Shooting Malinowski in the head and killing him dead. Evan Nappen 04:27 So, here’s what the lawmakers, they sent a letter to DOJ about this, and the letter reads, listen to this. “Awakened by the sound of the breach, Mr. Malinowski retrieved a handgun and encountered an armed silhouette entering his home. He fired toward the intruder’s feet. An ATF agent immediately returned fire, striking Mr. Malinowski in the forehead and killing him. Mrs. Malinowski was standing only inches behind him.” Now, this is activity by ATF, where they are going after, you know, what is essentially paperwork crime, if it even qualifies as crime. They busted down his door at 6 am. How come this was done as a no knock for this guy? Who knows? Crazy. He ends up getting killed. And yet here, Teddy, you didn’t even hear about it. Yet, we take cases with, and hear about cases with, with ICE, right? Page – 3 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 05:46 Pretti and Good. (Alex) Pretti and (Renee) Good. Evan Nappen 05:47 Yeah, Pretti and Good. Where, you know, with Renee Good, she was, you know, trying to run down, allegedly, this officer. She went there to protest. She was there knowing there was going to be agitation, knowing there’s going to be trouble going there. Same with Pretti, same with Pretti. Teddy Nappen 06:10 Who actually was fighting with the police. Evan Nappen 06:12 Fighting with them and going there. Evan Nappen 06:14 That’s not what happened here. We have a guy in his home! A law-abiding guy in his home, who at best, has paperwork violations. A licensing violation at best. Not even that that is necessarily legitimate, and he ends up shot in the head over the actions taken by ATF. And you don’t hear a peep about it in the lame stream media. Teddy Nappen 06:42 The other part that really, there’s two pieces that stick out. Three pieces, actually, stick out to me. Number one, the knock and announce. So, I remember, in criminal procedure, we talked about this. It is very important on the knock and announce for the officers. They waited 23 seconds. They knocked, waited 23 seconds, and then break the door down. They also had enough time to tape the camera, the doorbell camera. And no body cams, because apparently, their excuse was low funding. Not enough funding for body cams even though they are supposed to have. Evan Nappen 07:19 They had enough money to buy tape. Teddy Nappen 07:21 Yeah, they had enough money to buy tape. Yeah, they had enough. Evan Nappen 07:24 To cover the doorbell lock camera, cover the door. Look, if they’re there as law enforcement, don’t you want it known to this guy, who has no priors, who’s not a problem? Don’t you want it known that it’s law enforcement there? You want to make it crystal clear! Hey, Government, law enforcement here. Boom! You want to be seen on the Ring that you are law enforcement and not 6 am house hot invaders. Teddy Nappen 08:01 The other factor is there is clear. There have been other encounters with the ATF with this exact same scenario. You know what they did? They knocked on the door and said, Hi, we’re with the ATF. It’s the Page – 4 – of 14 Ring doorbell camera there. That situation. They’ll you say, No, I’m, you know, I’m not talking to you, or we’re here to arrest you. Okay, we’re, that’s it. They had so many other encounters where this could have been. But instead, they decided to go full Waco SWAT team and assassinate this man. Evan Nappen 08:30 It’s insane. It’s insane. And, you know, their history of activities. I mean, we know, you know, Waco was just horrible. They had a guy inside of the facility that could have easily made that encounter completely non- violent. Instead, way back in those days, you know, with Clinton and company, they did it to try to make an example out of this guy’s church, etc. And of course, it was all to “save the children”, to save the children, which all end up dying because of what they did. Teddy Nappen 09:13 And then tried to cover it up. Evan Nappen 09:13 With the fire, and then tried to cover it up. Oh, they bulldozed the scene as quick as they could afterwards. Teddy Nappen 09:20 Yeah. Evan Nappen 09:21 You know, because the stuff they used lit the place on fire. Teddy Nappen 09:28 My favorite was, if you do, you remember the hearings? Where you know how the you could clearly see the Dems trying to justify the ATF murdering people? Evan Nappen 09:36 Right! Teddy Nappen 09:37 Republicans fighting, and I love the one. Evan Nappen 09:39 Don’t forget Ruby Ridge as well. Teddy Nappen 09:41 Yep. Evan Nappen 09:42 I mean, over a shotgun barrel, that was where they entrapped the guy, literally entrapped the guy. They ended up paying like $3 million in civil damages for their actions there at Ruby Ridge. Okay? So this kind of rogue insanity, oh, it’s fine, as long as it’s on gun owners, you know. Page – 5 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 10:08 But this is the key. What really bothers me the most, Dad. The biggest question they’re asking from the lawmakers, the political motivation. The question remains, is whether the timing and aggressiveness of the operation were influenced by the impending rollout, by the ATF’s final ruling of the “engaged in the business of selling firearms”. So, imagine if, right now, and I always have to tell this to all those out there who are trying to say, you know, Republicans and Democrats are the exact same thing. Or should have just voted for Kamala Harris. Imagine Kamala Harris now with their current ATF, and they enforce that law, where you and I are going to be assassinated in the night by armed guards bursting in accusing people of being unlicensed. It’s disgusting! Evan Nappen 10:58 The armed agent nonsense of doing this. Luckily, you know, President Trump and his administration are taking steps now to remove, in the 39 rule proposals, remove that absurd “doing business” expansion that Biden did. So, basically, if you sell a gun, you’re considered a dealer under the old Biden. Ending the so-called, where even going after dealers themselves by saying, one error, one error, and you can lose your FFL completely. I mean, these activities are just outrageous. What takes place there barely gets any attention. But if you’re out there causing problems regarding other wrongdoers, that being illegal aliens, that are themselves having broken the law, and here they’re trying to protect other lawbreakers. And then you go to this cause a conflict, the media blows that all over the place. But here, this guy gets shot in the head in his home. Teddy Nappen 12:30 You know, it’s also people don’t talk about that, comparatively to the ICE tactics. The ICE tactics, what they do are actually far much more safer. They do everything they can to not escalate and just go full SWAT team and shoot people on that. The two extremes, where someone is trying to run you over with a car, or the other individual who is attacking and fighting with them, and then during the scarcity of when in the chaos of all them trying to hold him down the confusion, he gets shot. That’s the clear difference here. Let’s just say, for the sake of argument, justification, all right. He fired at them. They fired back. Looking at everything prior to where there was barely any knock. They taped the cameras. No body cams. They just went into the night. The wife says, I think there is an intruder. By the way, their warrant said not a dangerous threat, not a dangerous criminal. Evan Nappen 13:26 So, they were even told, so why are they taping the doorbell camera? Just act normal. You know, we’re here. We’re law enforcement. We have a warrant. Let us in. We have a warrant. I would bet you anything, as long as they made it clear they had a warrant, this guy is going to be okay. You have a warrant come in. Instead, he’s under this impression that his house is subject to a hot robbery. Teddy Nappen 13:53 Yeah, by the way, it’s dark. Where were the, you know, badges, anything, just to say, anyone, you bust down the door and yelled police on that front. SWAT teams are trained in that engagement where you’re going in to a situation, clearing rooms, if you’re going to go in that hot. I mean, where’s the justification for that? Where the guy had no priors, nothing. It’s insane. Page – 6 – of 14 Evan Nappen 14:17 It is. And, you know, I visited the site at Waco. If you ever get out there, they have a memorial site. This is, of course, not official, but they have it there, and you can pay a visit. You know, the I saw the actual warrant for Koresh for the raid on Waco. The actual search warrant that they were using. And one of the lines that stuck out to me was where they said they observed, when they had their inside man, that he had subversive literature there. This is actually in the warrant, in the affidavit for the warrant. That he had subversive literature. And the subversive literature, written in the warrant, was Shotgun News and Soldier of Fortune Magazine. Did you know that that’s known as subversive literature? SOF and Shotgun News. Yeah. That was Janet Reno. She was the Attorney General back then. Whoof. Bad news, bad news. Evan Nappen 15:29 And those incidents, you think they would learn from these other horror shows that they conducted. Not to pull that again. But once Democrats are pushing it, especially as you point out, when they want to make an example, they will try to do something like this to push their agenda. I’m sure that was part of their motivation. We’ve seen them try to lay groundwork anytime they want to push an agenda. A great example of it is the so- called, which you don’t hear about anymore after the incident, as you recall the Fast and Furious Operation. With the Fast and Furious Operation, they were providing arms to the Narco terrorists. So, the U.S. Government, through them, gave arms that supposedly had trackers or something to arm the bad guys. And one of the arms ended up killing a Federal officer later. (https://www.grassley.senate.gov/news/news-releases/facts-are-stubborn-things-connection-between-fast-and-furious-and-agent-terrys) I think it was Terry. Brian Terry was his name. They ended up killing Terry with guns supplied by the Government. Now, why were they doing this? Well, they were pursuing an anti-Second Amendment agenda. Teddy Nappen 16:52 Wasn’t it the steel pipeline? Evan Nappen 16:54 Well, the iron pipeline. What it was they. At the same time that they had tried this Fast and Furious Operation, to try to somehow demonstrate that guns are flowing from the U.S. to Narco terrorists. That’s when they also put in the multiple rifle reporting requirements on the border states. And that’s also when they changed the 4473 where you have to either admit or deny your Hispanic heritage. This was all part of this approach that was the iron pipeline idea. It blew up in their face. So, they had to abandon it after Fast and Furious. But that was their evil plan back then. So, it wouldn’t surprise me that this was part of their propaganda campaign, and it ends up with this guy shot in the head. It’s just outrageous. Teddy Nappen 17:59 As I recall, I think it was the head of the operation, during some interview where he’s talking about it. How we planned to put GPS trackers into the firearms to see where they ended up. And did you? No. They just handed the guns, just handed them over. Yeah, then when they found it for some murder or Page – 7 – of 14 some crime, they’re like, oh yeah. They trace the serial number, and like, oh, that’s one of ours. Our bad! Whoopsie. Evan Nappen 18:27 Yeah, yeah. So, as long as the U.S. Government was arming Narco terrorists, that’s okay. Teddy Nappen 18:34 I know, right? Evan Nappen 18:35 And putting guns into. You know, you see from the Left, and this even reflects in the Southern Poverty Law Center. Well, we don’t really have enough racism. So, I guess we’ll pay racists to make sure, you know. Hence, you get Charlotteville and all those things happening. By a creation. by the Left, to create the issue for them to then create more intrusion, more laws, more of their agenda by doing these operations. This is their M.O. Teddy Nappen 19:11 Take it a step further, Dad. You have to remember when it comes to the Left, and this is just, they recruit the mentally ill. I’ll give you the best one. 45% of liberals describe their mental health as poor. 45%. That’s right from a pole. Evan Nappen 19:29 I think that’s low. Teddy Nappen 19:29 It probably is higher, but this is my point. They recruit the mentally ill. They scream and call people Nazis, fascists. They’re going to kill you. They’re gonna go after your family. They’re doing everything they can. Evan Nappen 19:30 Pedos. Smear with everything they can come up with. Smear, smear, smear. Make sure you populate the internet with all the smears. Make sure you have the paid protesters pushing the smears. I mean, their propaganda machine is second to none. Teddy Nappen 20:02 And then when one of them, who’s mentally ill enough to say, yeah, let’s do it. And then tries to run down a hallway and get shot down by an MP7. Thank you, Secret Service. Or another individual tries to shoot at our President, multiple times, different ones. Evan Nappen 20:20 No. Now they want to blame, somehow it’s President Trump’s fault. Teddy Nappen 20:25 Yeah, yeah. Page – 8 – of 14 Evan Nappen 20:26 You know what? Teddy Nappen 20:27 It’s so disgusting. Evan Nappen 20:31 Well, and it’s not just Democrats, but also, as you call the black pillars. They don’t help the situation. Teddy Nappen 20:37 They’re the, I like what Stephen Crowder calls them. They’re the woke Right, the horseshoe Right. They’re saying they’re all the same, man. They’re all the same. Look at the inroads that Trump has made, and imagine. Do you really want to give the other party that power where they’ll send in a hit squad to kill you because they think you’re illegally selling guns? That is what you want? No, thank you. Do not hand it. You’re a bunch of accelerationists thinking that we’re gonna really make change. No, you’re handing power to the individuals that want to destroy us. That is insane. Evan Nappen 21:16 I mean, you know, look back just under the Biden administration, what we put up with. Curtailing freedom of speech, with the conspiracies that are shown to be absolute lies against the President and against Republicans. I mean, the stuff they did is unbelievable. I guess you saw Dan Bongino talking about the burn bag that has all that information in it. They wanted to burn it, and somehow ended up not burned. Somebody, I think, didn’t want that to get burned. Somebody there wanted the truth. Teddy Nappen 21:55 You also have to remember the Twitter files. Mark Zuckerberg admitting that he was pressured by the Biden administration to censor Republicans and the pressure that Democrats in charge to censor Republican and conservative voices. The YouTube censorship. All the big tech censorship, all up and down. Now you’re saying, no, no. Let’s give this back to the Left. It’s no. You’re ridiculous if you think that is actually a good strategy. So, yeah. Evan Nappen 22:23 Well, Teddy. Let me tell you what’s going on this week at WeShoot. So, WeShoot has Smith and Wesson Bodyguards, the 2.0 Performance Center, Carry Comp. This is a pretty hot gun. It’s ultra concealable, which is very important in New Jersey. And it has upgraded performance center tuning and an integrated compensator that keeps recall flat and control high. They also have the Radian Ramjet and Afterburner Barrel and Comp, which is really the ultimate Glock upgrade. It transforms that platform to having reduced muzzle rise, faster follow up and next level shooting dynamics. They also are offering the Daniel Defense DDM4 MK18, which is a short barrel legend with military roots, and that gun will deliver unmatched reliability and maneuverability in tight spaces. And you don’t want to miss Karly Morgan, she’s the “Dirt Bike” All-American Girl, bringing raw energy, independence and fearless spirit to the WeShoot lifestyle. Proving, once again, that freedom isn’t just protected, it’s lived. Page – 9 – of 14 Evan Nappen 23:57 And by the way, WeShoot is running a Mother’s Day special promo, and they have some great deals going on there. WeShoot is the place. It’s an indoor range conveniently located in Lakewood, right off the Parkway. It’s where Teddy and I shoot, and we get our training there. You can get your training there, too. Get your necessary CCARE certificates for New Jersey carry. You can get any of the beginner to advanced training. WeShoot really has it all. It’s a great range, great place. We love it. You’ll love it, too. Check out. weshootusa.com, weshootusa.com. Evan Nappen 24:47 Let me also shamelessly promote my book, New Jersey Gun Law, the Bible of New Jersey gun laws. It’s over 500 pages, 120 topics, all question and answer to guide you through the matrix of insanity that we call New Jersey gun law. It’s all done in that question and answer format. You’ll get answers to your legal questions out of that book in writing by me. That’s right. An attorney who has dedicated his life to defending law-abiding New Jersey gun owners and trying to make it so we don’t commit GOFUs. Because New Jersey is loaded with them. And protect yourself, man. Knowledge is power. Go to EvanNappen com. You’ll see the big orange book there and get a copy today. Hey, what else, Teddy, is on your mind that you’ve discovered? Teddy Nappen 25:47 So, this one came up recently. As everyone’s favorite, I am Spartacus, Senator Cory Booker. One of his staffers decided to bring a his carry into the Capitol. And every time I see that individual, I think of, didn’t you debate Cory Booker? Evan Nappen 26:09 I did. I debated Corey Booker. Teddy Nappen 26:11 When what was it? Evan Nappen 26:13 I debated Cory Booker a number of years ago on TV. He came in, and we were arguing about New Jersey gun laws. They brought him in as, big surprise, for the anti-Second Amendment arguments. And I’ll tell you upfront, as a person, he’s a very personable guy. Like personable. Talking to him, he’s friendly. But, of course, you know, the anti-gun arguments always fail. This was no different. Teddy Nappen 26:46 He’s a Gavin Newsom. He’s slick. Evan Nappen 26:48 Right. He’s slick. But you know, unfortunately, their agenda is that of being anti-rights. They love to claim that they, oh, I support the Second Amendment, BUT. It’s always that, BUT. And the but is, I want to ban all guns or whatever. But they somehow support the Second Amendment, and they’ve never met a gun law they didn’t like. So, so much for that lie. Page – 10 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 27:11 I always think of the Left. They always try. If they ever took power and packed the court, they’re just going to go to the Second Amendment and go, look, that’s a comma. See that comma? That means we can pass whatever we want, like. Evan Nappen 27:32 Well, it’s a living document. It’s a living document. In a modern society, there’s no reason why anyone needs, whatever, fill in the blank. Teddy Nappen 27:44 Yeah. Fill in the blank. Evan Nappen 27:45 As if need has got anything to do with anything. Teddy Nappen 27:48 You know, like the ATF rolling up on your house and trying to assassinate you. Evan Nappen 27:52 Well, you know, what do you need a sports car for? What do you need a supercharged bass boat for? What do you need any. You know, we’re not a needs-based society. We’re not each according to their needs. That ain’t us. Okay? Needs ain’t about it, all right? Teddy Nappen 28:14 Well, the Socialist got nothing to do with it. Evan Nappen 28:17 Yeah, and they do. Evan Nappen 28:18 And that’s a growing movement. You know, you hear the term Democrat socialist. The only difference between a Democrat socialist and a socialist is a Democrat socialist is trying to impose socialism by way of our elections and the political process, to make a socialist. And make the same. Yeah. Teddy Nappen 28:41 They’re communists. They’re just communists. They literally. You had Bernie Sanders honeymooning in the USSR, and you had Sean Penn praising Venezuela. And what was it? Jane Fonda and Cuba praising the Cuban regime. Evan Nappen 29:00 Just recently, Jayapal, the legislator, was caught trying to figure out how they can get oil past the U.S. sanctions embargo to Cuba. (https://www.foxnews.com/video/6395078651112?utm_content=other&utm_source=flipboard) Isn’t that great? Just try to undermine our foreign policy. Isn’t that cute? Page – 11 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 29:00 You know, some might say that would be aiding a foreign adversary, but, you know. Evan Nappen 29:25 Right. Yeah. I mean, who knows, but somehow they just keep on going with this stuff, with our enemies. With folks that are opposed to what has created the greatest standard of living in the history of humanity, and that is capitalism. Teddy Nappen 29:48 But going back to it Cory Booker. His staffer was a retired law enforcement officer. He had the gun on him, and he went into the Capitol. He was arrested last year, and of course, the charges were dropped without any consequences lingering. And now the debate on whether he could carry or not, I went. Evan Nappen 30:08 He may have been retired law enforcement. I don’t know if LEOSA applied in that particular situation in law enforcement safety. Teddy Nappen 30:17 Yeah, I pulled it from the U.S. Capitol Police. Their rules are all weapons are prohibited, even if you are a retired law enforcement officer. Evan Nappen 30:28 So, I don’t know how it got dismissed. Teddy Nappen 30:32 Well, you know why. Evan Nappen 30:35 Yeah, exactly. Teddy Nappen 30:36 But it could have been, the minutia of the staffer had gotten permission. Apparently, if you meet certain requirements, you could have, but it didn’t seem, there was no mention if he even met the requirements. Doesn’t matter. They just walked away the charges. It’s right there with, uh, Mr. Pull the fire alarm because I don’t understand how to open a door. What was his name? Evan Nappen 30:56 I don’t remember. But yeah, yeah, right, yeah. Teddy Nappen 30:59 Like that. Yeah. Charges dropped. But this is the thing. It’s always about the elitism. Where you have, here’s someone extremely anti-gun pushing the anti-gun agenda. Right here, the newest article right from them. U.S. Senator Cory Booker leads colleagues renewed push to establish safety standards for Page – 12 – of 14 firearms in an effort to save lives. Pushing a new bill right here. They’re going to add the Firearms Safety Act. It creates a Consumer Product Safety Act that was first passed in 1972. It corrects the gap. Evan Nappen 31:36 The gap, the so-called gap. What it is they want this mechanism in the Government so that they can ban guns via Consumer Protection. The idea is to abuse Consumer Protection laws, and you see New Jersey doing this state side. They’re alleging the Consumer Protection violations under state law against legitimate dealers, gun makers, etc. So, beware. This is yet a further angle that they’re pursuing to take away our rights. It’s the movement of gun rights suppression is to go at every angle. Whether they can link guns to a health care problem, whether they can link guns to a consumer protection problem, whether they can, you know, anything they can somehow tag it on with that’s what they try to do to expand their suppression of our rights. It’s classic tactics by those that oppose the Second Amendment. Teddy Nappen 32:53 Well, what they’re trying to do is create and I’ve coined this term. I don’t know who else coined it, but I like it. Gun deserts. They are trying to, the Left are trying to, the Left are trying to push the stupid argument of a food desert, which you can have food delivered very easily. From what they’re doing, going after gun dealers in Jersey, making extremely hard to even open a shop. I’m taking this term gun desert. They’re trying to create gun deserts. Making it extremely hard to get a firearm. Because they know they can’t win on the legislation and our rights, so now they’re just going to sue our rights away by going after the very people. Evan Nappen 33:26 And what’s interesting, one of the regs being put forward, actually a combination of them, federally, will, and I haven’t read the text, but apparently, what they’re looking to do is have the 4473 computerized. Then you’ll be able to purchase a gun online, and the firearm can actually be delivered to your door. Now, I don’t know how that might work under New Jersey state law, probably not able to do it. But in many, many states, it will be feasible if it first goes through a dealer. They’ve recently allowed guns to be shipped even via the post office. Of course, it’s regulated how to do it, but there was at one point a complete ban. That’s no longer the case. Evan Nappen 34:20 And if they get this electronically set up and they change the rules, they can allow it. Right now, for example, you can buy a suppressor and have it go directly to your door. They’ve set up a network of dealers in suppressor-legal states. These companies like Silencer Central, etc, they’re able to process your NFA form online. They have an interface to the e-forms for the federal government. You can do the prints by way of a computer, and then once everything gets approved, you’re literally mailed your suppressor to your door. Now, of course, not in New Jersey. New Jersey has a state ban on suppressors, but that is currently being challenged as to its constitutionality. So, this is where we’re at. There is still good hope. I still am optimistic, seeing these fundamental changes take place federally, and we’re seeing victories politically still happening. The fight is full bore in the courts. Don’t lose hope. We are winning slowly but surely. We’re gaining ground in many of these areas, even though these Page – 13 – of 14 problems are still there that need to be addressed. But the good news is it is a new day when it comes to the ability to have the tools to fight for rights. Evan Nappen 36:06 And that’s something I’ve seen over four decades of gun law practice, my friends. I see it. I remember way back when I started, you couldn’t even find a law journal article that spoke about the individual right to keep and bear arms. And frankly, thanks to the NRA, let’s give credit where credit is due. Early on, they pushed the academic side of researching the truth about our Second Amendment rights, and that became critical in the Heller decision and decisions that have followed from Heller. Having that depth of historic scholarly research on our rights, which 40 years ago didn’t exist, did not exist, because it had been suppressed and ignored. Look, I started my practice with a very you know, I became an attorney, and I had the honor of working for the very first firearm law firm in America, which was Benenson, Kates & Hardy. There was no such thing prior to that of a firearm law firm. And back in those days, you know, another attorney would ask, what kind of law do you practice? I’d say, you know, firearm law. They go, what? What do you mean firearm law? They wouldn’t even know what it was. Couldn’t even wrap their head around it. Evan Nappen 37:44 And now, of course, with the Supreme Court decisions and this growth of challenges, etc, you see a completely different view and understanding of what firearm law means and its importance, and the practice of gun law is accepted. I remember at one point in the old Red Book, they called it, where they list lawyers by categories. And I said, hey, I want a listing of firearm law. They said, we don’t have firearm law. I said well make the category firearm law, because it even exist as a practice area, right that you would focus on for your practice. So there’s been a lot of advancement. The fight is, of course, on, but this is, this is where we are. It is interesting looking back and seeing and I do believe that we will succeed. We will succeed. Truth is on our side. Truth is absolutely on our side, and the day when we no longer have to be victims, but can be defenders, and not just our right to keep their arms being respected, but our right to self defense being respected, because that too is protected by the Second Amendment our right to defense. And don’t take that lightly, because throughout the rest of the world, particularly in the formerly Great Britain, use a gun to defend yourself. You get arrested, charged and prosecuted for using a firearm to defend yourself, right? That’s where our rights are critical, not just having the hardware to do it, but also the legal and lawful ability to do it, and our self defense laws, though, still need to be changed and worked on. Matter of fact, Teddy, we were talking about that, weren’t we? Teddy Nappen 39:56 Yeah, one of the big things we were discussing as well as back from the previous podcast. One of the previous episodes, we were talking about the right of defense of property. I felt that there should be a change in the law. I know you always said “life wins over property”, but. Evan Nappen 40:16 It does. Page – 14 – of 14 Teddy Nappen 40:16 There needs to be. Correct. But there needs to be a deterrence, because right now, heavy amounts of robberies, car jack, like carjacking, the car theft. It’s one of those where I always looked at Jeff Cooper’s quote. I always think to that quote. The criminal does not fear the police. The criminal does not fear the courts. The criminal must learn to fear the victim. That is the only way I can see us solving this issue of crime. To deter the individuals. Knowing, oh, my G-d, if I do this, I might get my head blown off. Evan Nappen 40:56 So, you’re right, and that brings us to the GOFU. The GOFU, of course, is the Gun Owner Fuck Up. We look at mistakes and things to be very concerned about, where others have paid a dear price. And that is important when it comes to self-defense. Because self-defense in the law is known as justification for the use of force. And what a lot of folks don’t realize is that self-defense or justification for the use of force is an affirmative defense. And when something is an affirmative defense in law, it means the burden of proof initially shifts to the defendant. So, if you use force, deadly force, if you use that even though you may say, hey, it was self-defense, the burden of proof is on you to be able to prove that you were reasonable. And that reasonableness of your force gets determined by those 12 people who aren’t smart enough to avoid jury duty. So, you better be very reasonable. And the problem is if you depart from that knowledge where you are essentially guilty until proven innocent, and you better realize that if you pull that trigger, the burden of proof is, under our current laws, on you. Evan Nappen 42:35 Now, that’s not everywhere, believe it or not. In Florida, for example, they have put that burden back on the state initially before they can even proceed with the prosecution. They first have to demonstrate that you were not justified in using force, at least to the degree of making their initial charges. But in New Jersey and most other states, it is still an affirmative defense, where, in essence, you’re guilty until proven innocent. Make sure you know the self-defense laws. Make sure that your fear was reasonable. Make sure it was justified under the laws. Because, if not, you’re going to pay a very steep price. Evan Nappen 43:29 Hey, this is Evan Nappen and Teddy Nappen reminding you that gun laws don’t protect honest citizens criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens. Speaker 2 43:40 Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state. Downloadable PDF TranscriptGun Lawyer S5 E289_Transcript About The HostEvan Nappen, Esq.Known as “America's Gun Lawyer,” Evan Nappen is above all a tireless defender of justice. Author of eight bestselling books and countless articles on firearms, knives, and weapons history and the law, a certified Firearms Instructor, and avid weapons collector and historian with a vast collection that spans almost five decades — it's no wonder he's become the trusted, go-to expert for local, industry and national media outlets. Regularly called on by radio, television and online news media for his commentary and expertise on breaking news Evan has appeared countless shows including Fox News – Judge Jeanine, CNN – Lou Dobbs, Court TV, Real Talk on WOR, It's Your Call with Lyn Doyle, Tom Gresham's Gun Talk, and Cam & Company/NRA News. As a creative arts consultant, he also lends his weapons law and historical expertise to an elite, discerning cadre of movie and television producers and directors, and novelists. He also provides expert testimony and consultations for defense attorneys across America. Email Evan Your Comments and Questions  talkback@gun.lawyer Join Evan's InnerCircleHere's your chance to join an elite group of the Savviest gun and knife owners in America.  Membership is totally FREE and Strictly CONFIDENTIAL.  Just enter your email to start receiving insider news, tips, and other valuable membership benefits.   Email (required) *First Name *Select list(s) to subscribe toInnerCircle Membership Yes, I would like to receive emails from Gun Lawyer Podcast. (You can unsubscribe anytime)Constant Contact Use. Please leave this field blank.var ajaxurl = "https://gun.lawyer/wp-admin/admin-ajax.php";

LEO Round Table with Chip DeBlock S11E088, Maniac Stabs Officer During Tense Domestic Dispute Encounter On Video! 47 Trump named as the main target of man who stormed Correspondents'' Dinner. Three officers fired for having disabled veteran license plates. Maniac stabs officer during tense domestic dispute encounter on video. LEO Roundtable: Assassination Plots, License Plate Scandals, and the Lethality of Edged Weapons LEO Round Table: May 06, 2026 Professional Law Enforcement Perspectives on Current Events & Tactical Safety TRANSCRIPT SUMMARY Top Briefings The "Rambo" Assassination Plot Prosecutors reveal a 31-year-old NASA intern targeted President Trump at the WHCA Dinner. Despite carrying "low-tech" gear (revolver, shotgun, knife), the suspect's aerospace background and digital tracking show calculated intent. Riverside Firing Controversy Three Riverside officers fired for using 100% disabled veteran license plates on personal cars while serving on high-intensity SWAT teams. Debate centers on "stolen valor" vs. legitimate disability management. Fort Wayne Tactical Analysis Bodycam review of an officer stabbing during a domestic call. Key takeaway: The extreme danger of edged weapons in tight quarters and the risk of conflicting verbal commands during high-stress encounters. Expert Insight "Knives are super, super dangerous... it's not like a flesh wound where you walk away. It can be a career-ender." — Dr. Joel Schultz Keywords #TacticalSafety #Bodycam #PoliceFiring #DomesticViolence #SiriusXM Host: Chip DeBlock Guest: Dr. Joel Schultz Media Update: Transitioning from Westwood One to SiriusXM. LEO Round Table © 2026 | Episode: 2026-05-06 Sponsors: Galls (Radio15), Compliant Technologies, GunLearn In this episode of the LEO Roundtable, host Chip DeBlock and retired Police Chief Dr. Joel Schultz analyze the latest developments in a high-profile assassination attempt, a controversial disciplinary firing in Riverside, and the tactical realities of a violent domestic dispute in Fort Wayne. The discussion provides a unique law enforcement perspective on the intersection of criminal intent, departmental policy, and survival tactics. Detailed Summary The NASA Intern's Plot Against Donald Trump Federal prosecutors have released evidence regarding a 31-year-old former NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory intern who allegedly targeted Donald Trump at the White House Correspondents' Association Dinner. Investigators recovered a six-minute video and digital data showing the suspect tracked the President's exact movements within the hotel. Despite holding a master's degree in aerospace engineering, the suspect's choice of weaponry—a revolver, a shotgun, and a knife—surprised analysts, as it suggested a lack of proficiency with modern tactical firearms. The discussion highlighted that the suspect was "armed to the teeth" and fueled by specific animosity, dismissing suggestions of a mental breakdown in favor of a calculated mission. Suspect Profile: The "Rambo" Wannabe Background Aerospace Engineer NASA Intern Arsenal Revolver Shotgun Knife Target WHCA Dinner Donald Trump The panel further explored the technical aspects of the case, noting that a canine at the scene may have alerted to gunpowder, a detail that warrants further investigation. Dr. Schultz pointed out the legal complexities of the Firearms Owners Protection Act (FOPA) regarding the suspect's interstate travel on Amtrak with weapons. There was also a tactical discussion on weapon reliability; while semi-automatics are prone to jamming if not handled with high proficiency, revolvers offer a "fail-safe" alternative, which may have been the suspect's rationale. The Riverside License Plate Controversy A significant portion of the show addressed the firing of three Riverside police officers who utilized "Disabled Military Veteran" license plates on their personal vehicles. The controversy stems from the fact that these plates require certification of severe mobility issues or a 100% disability rating, yet the officers were actively serving on high-intensity units like SWAT and the Honor Guard. Chief Larry Gonzales terminated the officers following a "Skelly hearing," citing an investigation into how the plates were obtained. The case has sparked a national debate over "stolen valor," the incongruity of active-duty status versus total disability, and potential discrimination against veterans 16:37-20:0923:11-24:58. Tactical Analysis: The Fort Wayne Stabbing The team reviewed harrowing body cam footage from Fort Wayne, Indiana, where an officer was stabbed multiple times during a domestic dispute call. The incident underscored the extreme danger of "edged weapons" in tight quarters. The suspect, Jacob Lee Legansbe, ambushed officers from behind a door, leading to a fatal officer-involved shooting. Dr. Schultz critiqued the "conflict commands" given during the stress of the encounter—where one officer yelled "don't move" while another yelled "drop the knife"—noting that such contradictions can confuse a suspect and complicate the tactical response. Tactical Communication: The WAIT Model Dr. Schultz's recommendation for high-stress verbal de-escalation WWhy AAm II TTalking? Ask: Is this command accomplishing the goal or creating noise? Key Data 250,000+: Total deployments of "The Glove" by Compliant Technologies with zero reported injuries or deaths. 15 Seconds: The average time a reader spends skimming an internet article before moving on. 100% Disability: The VA rating required for certain California disabled veteran plates, which triggered the Riverside PD investigation. 100 MPH: The speed an off-duty Temple Terrace officer was allegedly traveling during a fatal crash involving a six-year-old. To-Do / Next Steps Law enforcement officers should verify state reciprocity for concealed carry permits before traveling, as LEOSA status may vary by agency discharge type. Viewers are encouraged to support "The Wounded Blue" to assist officers injured in the line of duty. Use the discount code "Radio 15" at galls.com for 15% off equipment purchases. Transition following the show's move from Westwood One to SiriusXM for future broadcasts. Conclusion This session of the LEO Roundtable highlights the evolving nature of threats against public figures and the internal ethical dilemmas facing modern police departments. Whether analyzing the physics of a "Rambo" wannabe's arsenal or the split-second life-and-death decisions in a hallway, the panel emphasizes that in law enforcement, "nothing is routine".

Episode 286- Shoot New York’s Eye Out Also Available OnSearchable Podcast Transcript Gun Lawyer — Episode Transcript Page – 1 – of 10 Gun Lawyer — Episode 286 Transcript SUMMARY KEYWORDS Air guns, BB guns, federal law, state law, preemption, New York ban, imitation firearms, gun rights, mental health, firearm safety, historical context, Vatican security, Pope’s stance, gun control, legal advice. SPEAKERS Teddy Nappen, Evan Nappen, Speaker 3 Evan Nappen 00:17 I’m Evan Nappen. Teddy Nappen 00:19 and I’m Teddy Nappen. Evan Nappen 00:20 And welcome to Gun Lawyer. So, you know, my whole life I’ve really loved air guns. I had BB guns and air rifles as a kid. I had my, of course, the classic Red Ryder, and I had a Crosman 760 XL. Now, that was the Crossman 177 pellet and BB rifle, and the XL had the beautiful golden receiver on it. I don’t know if any of you had an XL version of the 760, but that was a really fun, great air gun. And I had a Benjamin. Man, that was a powerhouse, and it was .22 caliber pellet. You can pump that baby up, and that was my number one squirrel killer. And all as a kid. I shot squirrels in my yard, where my father had a giant garden. He needed to keep the squirrel population down, and I shot those squirrels. Then I cut off their tails, and then I sold the tails to Mepps Lure company, which would buy squirrel tails. I think they still might do that. And that got me some money as a kid. And it was used, of course, to buy more pellets and fun things. And I progressed, as maybe some of you did, to a love of adult air guns. Evan Nappen 01:59 And then, of course, Robert Beeman and air rifle headquarters. They were bringing in those premier, phenomenal air rifles that today are the standard of an entire sector of what I’ll call the gun world. Some of you may have had great RWS guns. My favorite were the Feinwerkbaus. I’ll never forget, my dad got a Feinwerkbau 124 from Beeman that he ordered. He had it custom ordered, and they worked out, worked up the innards on it. So, that thing was sweet. And ever since then, I’ve acquired many adult air guns. I have, you know, the finest Feinwerkbau ever made, the 300 series, the Olympic Feinwerkbau. It just shoots through the same hole. Evan Nappen 03:01 There are so many phenomenal air guns. And today, of course, the revolution in air guns is the pre-charge air gun. They have air guns that have tremendous ability for hunting, and air guns are just a blast. They’re fun. They’re a great way of learning firearm safety and shooting skills. A great way of Page – 2 – of 10 introducing young folks into firearms and the fun and joy of shooting. So, air guns are great. I have a deep love of air guns. Always have. I’m a collector of air guns. I love the history of air guns. And you may know that an air gun was taken on the Lewis and Clark expedition, which made a lot of sense, because the ability to get gunpowder in the wilderness is not an easy task. And with an air gun, there’s always air around. They would pump up that air gun and could use it to take big game. It was that air rifle. It is actually still known and around, that was used on the St. Louis, you know. When they left St. Louis, they had it with them on that great exploratory mission under President Jefferson. And air guns, even at one point, they were used militarily by the Austrians. Napoleon had the death penalty for anybody caught with an air rifle, and those were able to fire repeatedly with enough power to be used militarily. There’s an amazing history and air guns. But the modern sporting air gun today, all the way down to the BB gun, has a tremendous role. Evan Nappen 05:02 Yet, despite the tradition and the history of air guns in America, New York is now proposing a law to ban BB guns and air guns. The law that New York Democrats, of course, are proposing is to ban air guns by making air guns all being placed in a category of “imitation weapons”. (https://bearingarms.com/camedwards/2026/04/13/new-york-lawmakers-take-aim-at-bb-guns-n1232199) And by doing that, it would require that every air gun has a plug and specific coloration, and by putting them in that category, they will no longer shoot. Okay? So, you know, what’s the point there? The idea here being, if you make them an imitation firearm, and then they want to raise the age from 16 to 18. They’re selling this nonsense under a typical gun oppressionists lie of claiming police-involved shootings involving individuals who possessed an air gun, which was designed to look like a firearm. You know, the same way they sold the nonsense of cop-killer bullets, of which no cop has ever been killed by one. But why should that stop them from banning so-called cop-killer bullets. Anytime they get any angle that they can sell to the public and fool the public, who doesn’t have an understanding of guns as such, they do it. Evan Nappen 07:11 And here, New York now may become subject to what would essentially be a ban on air guns and BB guns. But let me say right now on the Gun Lawyer podcast that if New York succeeds in passing this law, there is a magic bullet, shall we say, that can kill this law. New Yorkers can shoot the eye out of New York’s air gun ban. The way to do it, I’m going to give you right now how to kill an air gun ban. It is under the United States Code, Title 15 (Commerce and Trade, Chapter 76), Section 5001. (https://law.justia.com/codes/us/title-15/chapter-76/) Evan Nappen 08:12 And this, my friends, is a federal law. It is a federal law that deals with imitation firearms. The reason this federal law is such an incredibly powerful weapon is that this federal law is an area of firearm pre-emption law. What it means is that federal law preempts state law. Federal law supersedes and is superior to, overrides. Overrides it, my friends. Overrides it. And because of that, we are able to take out state laws that attempt to interfere with air guns, and, for that matter, imitation firearms. The very thing that New York is attempting to use as the vehicle to create an air gun ban. Page – 3 – of 10 Evan Nappen 09:27 Let me tell you about Section 5001. Section 5001 first defines and lays out what is required to be on imitation firearms. It lays out what we have seen in the last few decades of having the distinctive markings, the blaze orange plug on look-alike or toy air guns and other imitation firearms and such. The look-alike firearm, which is what the law refers to, is defined as any imitation of an original firearm which was manufactured, designed or produced since 1898 including and Evan Nappen 10:21 limited to toy guns, water guns, replica non guns, airsoft guns firing nonmetallic projectiles, you know, such as airsoft and such. The term does not include any look alike, non firing collector replica of an antique firearm developed prior to 1898 or traditional BB, paintball, or pellet firing air guns that expel a projectile through the use of force or air pressure. And lo and behold, this section has a statement that says, preemption of state or local laws or ordinances. Preemption. The provisions of this section shall supersede any provision of state or local laws or ordinances which provide for markings or identification inconsistent with provisions of this section. Okay. Then it goes on and it says, ready? No State shall and then number one, prohibit the sale or manufacture of any look-alike, nonfiring, collector replica of an antique firearm. So, replica collector firearms are protected. And two, very important here for New York and any other state that wants to try to ban air guns, prohibit the sale parentheses, other than prohibiting the sale to minors end parentheses, of traditional BB, paint ball or pellet-firing air guns that expel a projectile through the force of air pressure. So, should New York be as repressive and stupid as to attempt to ban air guns, federal law preempts and nullifies, supersedes, that state law. Evan Nappen 12:54 Let me tell you another little factor, very interesting. I used this law successfully to attack New Jersey’s assault firearm law. In the case of Coalition of New Jersey Sportsmen versus Florio, which you can find at 744 F. Sup. 602, back in 1990, I challenged the then Attorney General, Robert Del Tufo. I brought an action, a civil action, challenging New Jersey’s assault firearm ban on a number, and magazine ban, by the way, on a number of things. One of the specific challenges was utilizing 15 U.S.C. 5001, which is the air gun preemption. New Jersey’s assault firearm ban, as written, included air guns, because air guns are firearms in New Jersey, and the ban on assault firearms and magazines by definition included air guns. And this case with Judge Garrett Brown, federal judge, had an injunction, which, by the way, this is why today you can still buy air guns, BB guns, pellet guns in New Jersey that may seem at first to fall under the definition of New Jersey’s assault firearm law because of this case and its outcome. The court found that the prohibition as it affects air guns was unconstitutional in that it was preempted under this federal law. Evan Nappen 15:06 So, there’s even case law enforcing this federal preemption as it comes to air guns, even in an assault firearm ban, no less a ban that specifically attempts to ban air guns and BB guns. So, I am giving this to New York as information, folks, and anywhere else that there is an air gun ban that we have a weapon. Believe it or not, air guns, BB guns, etc, are more protected than firearms in America. More protected because federal law preempts state laws from banning them. If we had federal preemption for firearms, then the only firearm law would be the federal law, and no state law banning guns would stand. But we don’t have federal preemption. Our federal gun laws, except with very limited narrow, a few laws like Page – 4 – of 10 Title 18, 926a for interstate transportation and for LEOSA, for law enforcement carry, and retired law enforcement carry, and for armored car carry. Except for a few areas like that, we don’t have federal preemptive laws on firearms, but we do have a federal preemptive law that protects air guns, BB guns and replica firearms. Evan Nappen 16:55 If we ever wanted to wipe out all the state bans, we’d simply have to make the federal law preemptive, but instead, the federal law specifically says it’s not preemptive. So what it does is it creates a situation, when it comes to firearms, that the federal law is the minimum gun law for the United States. Then the states are given carte blanche to go crazy, to do whatever the hell they want, to maximize the gun laws. Then the only thing that possibly limits states is the Second Amendment and its impact that we’re gaining ground every day in the courts. But if we simply said that the Gun Control Act of 1968, for example, and any of its other amendments are preemptive, it would wipe out all state bans instantly. Well, we haven’t done that, but we did do it for air guns, folks, and BB guns and replica firearms. It needs to be known out there so that when these attempts at bans are made by states or towns, this weapon, this hammer in our law, can be used to defeat them. Teddy Nappen 18:19 Out of curiosity, just thinking on New York and their other attempts, you know, they, I give them credit, they’re always very creative on finding ways to take away people’s rights. Could they make any laws that either try to make weird compliance requirements for air guns or air pellet guns? Where they would be effectively banned, basically, without saying, oh, you can’t have it. You just have to have all these different bells and whistles. Or is it just full preemption? And there’s nothing they can do. Evan Nappen 18:52 Well, it might, you might be able to create a license or permit system, maybe, if there’s no ban. Because currently in New Jersey, you still need a Firearms ID Card to purchase an air gun, or, you know, long arm. Air guns are technically defined as shotguns, even if they have a rifle barrel, and therefore a firearm, because they don’t fire fixed ammunition. So, it puts them into the shotgun long arm category, which is why you would need a Firearms ID Card. And if it’s a handgun, then you would need a Pistol Purchase Permit, if you’ve acquire those air guns in New Jersey. Now, if you acquire air guns outside New Jersey, federal law doesn’t view them as firearms. If the state you’re in doesn’t view them as firearms, like Pennsylvania doesn’t, you can acquire air guns outside the jurisdiction of New Jersey, and you can bring them back to New Jersey and possess them in New Jersey. Without even having a Firearm ID Card, if you possess them, by way of the exemptions. But New Jersey regulates air guns by way of firearm licensing, but it doesn’t, it cannot ban them. Judge Brown declared New Jersey’s assault firearm law a de facto ban, and because it’s a de facto ban, you can’t ban air guns with a ban, and the de facto band did just that. So, maybe New York, in theory, could create, you know, licensing, maybe. Depending on how they structure it. But an outright ban that forces guns that are air guns into an imitation firearm category, that requires a plug, is completely and utterly contradiction to the federal preemption law regarding those type of guns. Teddy Nappen 20:59 Watch as Hakeem. Watch as Hakeem Jeffries introduces a bill to repeal the air gun preemption. Page – 5 – of 10 Evan Nappen 21:06 You never know, right? I mean, he might. He might decide that. But this was fought for back in the day, and it was great that, I know, Daisy played a major role, by the way, in getting that legislation through. And it is why we have actually stronger protections for air guns, BB guns and traditional pellet firing guns of that nature, and for that matter, paintball as well. Even though we also have the In Re Gong case in New Jersey that protects paintball markers and why you can have paintball. Essentially soft air falls under this protection as well. So, it’s interesting how our laws have evolved. But this preemptive federal law needs to be better known and out there, to be used to stop these repression Second Amendment states from doing their thing. Teddy Nappen 22:11 Just to play with the idea. Let’s say, if things get very, very bad and the states start legislating. In terms of technology, do you think they’ll ever get to a point for air guns to be essentially like carry guns, almost where there’s a way around it? Evan Nappen 22:27 Well, you know, we have Byrnas, right? They fire projectiles that are essentially pepper balls. It was, given how much, you know, we might be able to do that. But federal law doesn’t preempt carry. They would preempt sale. And according to Judge Brown as well, sale extends to possession. It’s not just limited to sale. And really Judge Brown in the logic in that case could actually be used, I think, as an argument against what recently has been determined in the weird trick, as they call it, the weird trick, where they’re claiming that a sale isn’t protected under the Second Amendment, just possession. And that they can ban the sale of various semi-automatics that they feel shouldn’t be possessed, even though they’re not banning possession, and that somehow you can distinguish that. Evan Nappen 23:38 But Judge Brown cut through that garbage in terms of the air gun preemption by saying no, it is a de facto ban. When you ban the sale, you ban the possession. You could follow the logic of Judge Brown in that case and maybe apply it even in these other challenges and fights that we have. But, yeah, I mean, to make an air pistol that has the power of a weapon probably could be done. Look, even I don’t want to get shot with anything, even a BB pistol. Who wants to get shot with anything? But whether it would be effective enough for general, truly effective self-defense, remains to be seen. I don’t know of any actual lethal handgun development in air guns out there that is truly designed to be a self-defense gun. I don’t know of that. Now, less than lethal, of course, you’re dealing with Byrnas, when it comes to less than lethal. Evan Nappen 24:43 Hey, let’s mention our good friends at WeShoot. So, WeShoot is a range in Lakewood, New Jersey. It’s a wonderful indoor range. That’s where Teddy and I both shoot, and it’s where we got our certifications. As a matter of fact, WeShoot is offering New Jersey carry permit certification for a new price of only $225. You can get your certification that you need so that you can get your New Jersey permit to carry and get it right from we shoot. You can go to weshootusa.com and check out their website. You can learn about the great programs. They’re offering USCCA, NJ CCW, carry dates. They have that. They Page – 6 – of 10 have NRA CC carry dates, and they can help you doing renewal classes, right? They have all this here. They have New Jersey carry certification for seniors, and they have special day for that. So, WeShoot is really going all out with multiple abilities here for you to get your certification. We are currently hovering somewhere around 90,000 carry permits, and we’re going to be breaking that 100,000, unless we maybe even already have. In order to join the ranks of those that choose to be defenders instead of victims, check out WeShoot. We shoot will help you to get your New Jersey carry and other states carries as well. They even have more training. From novice to the most advanced shooter, they can meet your needs. Great pro shop, too. They can get you set up with the perfect firearm for defending yourself and your loved ones or for enjoying a great day at the range. They have great rentals and a great facility. We love WeShoot, and I know that you will, too. Check out weshootusa.com. Evan Nappen 27:01 Let me also not forget to shamelessly promote my book, which is New Jersey Gun Law. The Bible of New Jersey gun law. It is 120 topics, all in a question and answer format, and it’s over 500 pages. It will help you from becoming a GOFU. And it is the guidebook used by all. It is the authority of New Jersey gun law. Get your copy today at EvanNappen.com, EvanNappen.com. Go right there, and you’ll be able to order your book. You’ll have it to you within a matter of days. So, Teddy, what is on your mind today? Teddy Nappen 27:45 Well, as you know, Press Checks are always free. I think everyone’s been kind of seeing the news hit with what’s been going on. You know, Trump with the Pope. And I want to start things off. To every, you know, all the Catholic listeners, do not think on this as a theological lens. Think of this as a political. They were not, you know, I’m not arguing spiritual, the spiritual aspect of it. I am talking the politics, the hard core politics. And what do I see here? I see an individual arguing. If you were to listen to someone who made an argument for climate change, open borders, against capitalism and economic inequalities, and also pushing for gun rights oppression, you would assume it’s a woke Democrat, progressive. Yet, those are the views espoused by the Pope. The sources are here for that. (https://www.newsweek.com/what-pope-leo-said-abortion-gun-control-2070019) You can look it up. You can see it all across the internet. Teddy Nappen 28:51 Crowder did a great job breaking it all down. (https://rumble.com/v78i7r0-trump-vs.-the-vatican-why-the-pope-should-stay-out-of-politics.html) But I wanted to dive a little deeper on the thing that matters to us the most, which is the Second Amendment. Evan Nappen 28:59 Wait. Who’s Crowder? Teddy Nappen 29:00 Steven Crowder. He is Louder with Crowder. He does a great show. He breaks down the whole deal and shows what this individual, prior to becoming Pope, would go to bat on. Bashing Trump, bashing J.D. Vance, pushing for open borders. Oh, my God, what’s that thing surrounding the Vatican? Page – 7 – of 10 Evan Nappen 29:19 Oh, you mean the wall. It’s pretty crazy. I’ve been there. Vatican is cool. It really is. Teddy Nappen 29:24 Yeah, and that’s what I mean. You have to. And then, of course, he goes on and says, I don’t want to talk about politics, but then voices his opinion on every political stance. It’s incredibly disingenuous. And almost I want to call, to call, like, cognitive dissonance, where he’s understanding, like, how much that comes off. So, just to point out a few things here. This comes right from the NCR online, right here. From the Pope, when it was two bishops, we hold prayer. This is after one of the big shootings. We hold prayer for the countless to the countless children killed and injured every day around the world. Let us plead to G-d to stop the pandemic of arms, large and small. I have heard that term many times, the pandemic of arms. Where does that come from? Oh, the gun rights oppressors. And the same Cardinals. Evan Nappen 30:24 Well, wait and the reason is, by making it, putting it in a health context, they want to use it. So, they can use it to go after the political issue regarding health insurance. They want to make it a health issue. This was their actual plan, and I personally heard it espoused early on by Josh Sugarman, when Hillary Clinton was pushing for national health care. How they want to make guns a health issue, and they sure as hell have done a good job of that, actually. And they’ve gotten the CDC involved. They got the pediatricians and the doctors. You’re asked questions about, are you a gun owner? By your doctor. This didn’t happen by magic. This is all part of the plan. So, by calling it pandemic, by looking at it in that way, it’s pushing the gun rights oppression via the political issue of health care. Teddy Nappen 31:32 Yeah, and also the fact that his fellow Cardinals at that time were also taking it a step further, saying the facts are clear. Guns are plentiful and common sense attempts to limit their availability have largely been rejected in the name of freedom not found in our Constitution. Huh? I don’t think they read the Constitution, or they skipped some pages. You know, they only went to the things that mattered to them. But I didn’t hear him call out and say, no, no, we’re not about that. We’re not about disarming our people. By the way, it doesn’t really work out too well when a group of individuals are disarmed. You know, those of religion, of religious faith. Just looking at history, mind you. Going back, by the way, this goes back even prior to, when he was just the Cardinal. In 2017 after the mass shooting in Las Vegas, he reposts Senator Chris Murphy, Democrat, to my colleagues, your cowardice to act cannot be whitewashed by thoughts and prayers. None of this ends unless we do something to stop it. Increase access to mental health care and stronger, quote, unquote, sensible gun control laws. Hmm, I wonder what that sounds like. Evan Nappen 32:48 Yeah, it’s true. Well, you know, there’s the politics of it, then there’s the economics of it. You know, there’s donations and such. There’s all these kind of things that have unfortunately skewed, skewed what’s going on. As a matter of fact, I want to mention, and I don’t know if I ever told you, Teddy. About the time that Frank Perdue, okay, remember Frank Perdue with Purdue chicken there? Well, he wanted to better promote chicken, which was always his mission. You know, it’s true, true story about him. Page – 8 – of 10 Remember his slogan? It takes a tough man to make a tender chicken. Right? That was his slogan for many, many years. You’d see Frank Perdue’s face on billboards. It takes a tough man to make a tender chicken. And this is a true story now. I know this is a little bit off the topic, but I’m going to get back to how this applies to what you’re talking about. Evan Nappen 33:49 But they did try to market in Spain, true story. And when the translators translated, it takes a tough man to make a tender chicken in Spain, they put up the billboards with Frank’s face, you know, with his slogan. And the translators for the word “tough” used the word “macho”. We all you know, in America, macho means tough. However, in Spain, in Spanish, “macho” means “sexually excited”. So, everyone was driving by billboards with Frank Perdue’s face, saying, it takes a sexually excited man to make a tender chicken. But I digress. Evan Nappen 34:27 Let me tell you about what happened when Frank Perdue really wanted to market chicken. And, you know, he went to the Pope and he said, I would like you to change, Give us this day our daily bread, to Give us this day, our daily chicken. And the Pope said, No way. I’m not going to do that. He goes, look, we’ll donate $10 million to the church. What do you say? Pope said, No, not doing it. Frank Perdue upped his offer, 100 million. The Pope wouldn’t do it. Finally, Perdue says, look, $1 billion to change, give us this day, our daily bread, to give us this day our daily chicken. And look for a billion dollars. He figured how much good the church could do around the world with a billion dollars, and agreed to do it. And at that time, the Pope had a big meeting with all the Cardinals and everyone, and he said, I have good news and I have bad news. He said, the good news is the Purdue chicken company has donated $1 billion to the Catholic Church, and it’s going to be wonderful for us. The bad news is we lost the Wonder Bread account. Okay, so anyway. I know. That was pretty bad. Teddy Nappen 35:51 Well, I know. Funny enough, sure enough, from MSN last Thursday, Pope Leo also met with David Axelrod, Democrat strategist. Evan Nappen 36:00 Oh, really? Teddy Nappen 36:01 Advisor to Barack Obama. Evan Nappen 36:03 Oh, is that all. Teddy Nappen 36:03 Right up in the midterms, when, when things are coming up and trying to go after the Catholic vote. But this is my point. This is where and to show the true hypocrisy. Like I said, that wall surrounding Vatican City and yet talks about open borders. I thought to myself, what do the Vatican guard carry? What does Page – 9 – of 10 the Swiss guard carry? What is their, what is their choice? (https://maxtacticalfirearms.com/blog/vatican-armory-swiss-guard/) Evan Nappen 36:26 Wait, the Swiss guard has guns? Teddy Nappen 36:28 I know, right? Evan Nappen 36:29 In the Vatican? Teddy Nappen 36:31 Not just guns, the deadly assault firearms. If they can define it for me. Evan Nappen 36:36 No way, no way. Wait, actually, I think they’re truly assault firearms because I believe they’re select fire. So, those are actual assault firearms, not the nonsense of what the gun rights oppressionists claim are assault firearms. So, what model? Do you know what model they have? I think it’s one of the SIGs. Teddy Nappen 37:03 Well, the original one, they were using the K31s. Evan Nappen 37:07 Oh, well, those are bolt actions. Teddy Nappen 37:11 They decided to upgrade after, apparently, there was an attempted attack on the Pope in 1981. So, they upgraded their arms, and now they are using, apparently, they got the Sig Sauers. They love Sig Sauer. They got the Sig Sauer SG 552 commando as their current choice. Evan Nappen 37:32 Oh, commandos. Nice. Well, look, I totally am in favor of the Pope and the Vatican being protected by firearms. Absolutely. It makes sense. But then try to promote disarming anybody else, that’s another story. Teddy Nappen 37:50 Yeah. And also, they upgraded themselves with Sig Sauer P220s, and along with the and that’s there. By the way, the Honor Guard carry those. The plain clothes travel ones will carry Glock 19s. Evan Nappen 38:03 So, other than having a wall and having guns, that all makes sense for their positions. Page – 10 – of 10 Teddy Nappen 38:13 Oh, and also on the politics sevens, when they want to swap out every occasion, oh, G-d, okay. Evan Nappen 38:21 Well, Teddy, I appreciate you pointing this out. And as you said, it’s not about the spiritual issue. It’s just that the politics are there, and we have to be vigilant about the politics. No matter where it creeps in. Even if it’s in our beliefs. You know, it’s still there, and we need to always vigorously defend our rights and put the arguments forward. And that’s what’s important. Evan Nappen 38:52 Hey, let me tell you about this week’s GOFU. And this week’s GOFU, you know the GOFU is the Gun Owner Fuck Up. And I’m going to tell you, man, I have seen it. This one is just everywhere, because New Jersey has made anyone who gets a mental health commitment, involuntary or voluntary, it becomes a disqualifier to get a gun. Folks, let that sink in. If you voluntarily check in to get mental health help, as soon as you voluntarily commit to getting the help, guess what? You now have cost yourself your gun rights. Under New Jersey law, within five days of that, you’re supposed to turn in your Firearms ID Card. You become disqualified under New Jersey gun law. If you simply have seen any doctor or psychiatrist for a mental health reason, New Jersey will question you about it. And now you will have the added burden, just on seeing a doctor, no less a voluntary commitment, okay? Just seeing the doctor. Now you’re going to have to find a doctor willing to say that you’re safe for firearms. And the problem is, doctors are cowards. Even if they know you’re good for guns, they don’t want to say it. Because if there’s ever a problem, they’re afraid they’re going to get sued. And if you ever have a voluntary commitment, well, that’s just a per se bar. If it’s an involuntary commitment, well, you’re not only banned under state law, but you’re banned under federal law, my friends. Beware of the mental health trap that exists which will disenfranchise you of your gun rights. And look, I get it. If you need mental help, then I don’t want to say, don’t get it. But make sure you have, in your calculation, what will the ramifications be? It’s not something to do lightly, that is for sure. Evan Nappen 41:23 This is Evan Nappen and Teddy Nappen reminding you that gun laws don’t protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens. Speaker 3 41:34 Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state. Downloadable PDF TranscriptGun Lawyer S5 E286_Transcript] About The HostEvan Nappen, Esq.Known as “America's Gun Lawyer,” Evan Nappen is above all a tireless defender of justice. Author of eight bestselling books and countless articles on firearms, knives, and weapons history and the law, a certified Firearms Instructor, and avid weapons collector and historian with a vast collection that spans almost five decades — it's no wonder he's become the trusted, go-to expert for local, industry and national media outlets. Regularly called on by radio, television and online news media for his commentary and expertise on breaking news Evan has appeared countless shows including Fox News – Judge Jeanine, CNN – Lou Dobbs, Court TV, Real Talk on WOR, It's Your Call with Lyn Doyle, Tom Gresham's Gun Talk, and Cam & Company/NRA News. As a creative arts consultant, he also lends his weapons law and historical expertise to an elite, discerning cadre of movie and television producers and directors, and novelists. He also provides expert testimony and consultations for defense attorneys across America. Email Evan Your Comments and Questions  talkback@gun.lawyer Join Evan's InnerCircleHere's your chance to join an elite group of the Savviest gun and knife owners in America.  Membership is totally FREE and Strictly CONFIDENTIAL.  Just enter your email to start receiving insider news, tips, and other valuable membership benefits.   Email (required) *First Name *Select list(s) to subscribe toInnerCircle Membership Yes, I would like to receive emails from Gun Lawyer Podcast. (You can unsubscribe anytime)Constant Contact Use. Please leave this field blank.var ajaxurl = "https://gun.lawyer/wp-admin/admin-ajax.php";

The viral claim that Riverside County Sheriff Chad Bianco "bent the knee" to BLM is broken down, using full context and on‑scene footage from an early 2020 protest that had real potential to turn into a riot. Find out what actually happened on the front line, why Bianco chose to kneel and pray with community leaders, how that differs from later performative political kneeling, and why critics are now weaponizing a few seconds of video to damage one of the strongest Republican prospects for California governor.​​ In this episode: Take a hard look at the viral "bent the knee" clip of Sheriff Chad Bianco as the full context shows a frontline sheriff de‑escalating a potential riot, kneeling to pray with community leaders—not surrendering to BLM or changing his pro‑law‑and‑order stance.​ Dr. Roy Taylor, a law enforcement veteran and author, joins the show to talk about use of force, CCW standards, LEOSA, national reciprocity, and how cops and gun owners can actually get on the same side of the Second Amendment.​ A recent Megyn Kelly rant wishing drug runners would "bleed out" sparks a deep dive into how real gun owners view lethal force as a last‑resort defensive tool, not a vehicle for revenge or entertainment.​ A new UCSD‑linked study on guns and intimate partner violence gets pulled apart to reveal what it really shows about women arming for self‑defense, correlation vs causation, and why both sides of the gun debate will try to spin the same data.​ A brutal "ultimate car holster test" exposes how popular magnetic car mounts can launch guns during crashes, fail with airbags, and encourage dangerous gun‑handling in vehicles—plus safer carry setups that actually work in the real world.​

Congressman Don Bacon (R-NE) joins Dan to discuss Israel-Iran Tensions, DOJ Investigations, and the LEOSA Act Re-Introduced in House. Also, they discuss the Trump administration's agreement to pay nearly $5M to settle suit over Ashli Babbitt shooting in Capitol.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this week's episode we talk with Steve Burnett from HandgunDrills.com and Carl Hasler from Charlestown, Indiana about LEOSA training. Today's episode is also brought to you by the following: KSG Holster are professional grade kydex hand-crafted in the USA and are available for a large variety of firearms.  Each one is purpose built for… The post S8E04 Kids to Kings first appeared on The Firearm Trainer Podcast.

In this week's episode we talk with Steve Burnett from HandgunDrills.com and Carl Hasler from Charlestown, Indiana about LEOSA training. Today's episode is also brought to you by the following: KSG Holster are professional grade kydex hand-crafted in the USA and are available for a large variety of firearms.  Each one is purpose built for… The post S7E09 LEOSA Training Discussion first appeared on The Firearm Trainer Podcast.

00:00 Intro 01:19 Suspect with air rifle shot by cops on video 07:50 New Jersey appeals LEOSA lawsuit LEO Round Table (law enforcement talk show) Season 8, Episode 01d (1,898) filmed on 01/02/2023 Topic 1 concerns Jacksonville (Florida) Sheriff's Office deputies shooting Brian Charles Jornet, after he pointed an air rifle at them. Topic 2 concerns a discussion on New Jersey's appeal of the LEOSA lawsuit, with guest panelist Donald Mihalek. Also mentioned: the Law Enforcement Officer's Safety Act. Show Panelists and Personalities: Chip DeBlock (Host and retired police Detective) Special Guest: Don Mihalek (Executive VP of FLEOA Foundation) John Newman (retired police assistant Chief) Bret Bartlett (retired police Captain) Randy Sutton (retired police Lieutenant) Bob Kroll (retired police Lieutenant) David D'Agresta (retired police Officer and sheriff's Corporal) Will Statzer (Producer) Related Events, Organizations and Books: The Wounded Blue - Lt. Randy Sutton's charity https://thewoundedblue.org/ Rescuing 911: The Fight For America's Safety - by Lt. Randy Sutton (Pre-Order) https://rescuing911.org/ Books by panelist and retired Lt. Randy Sutton: https://www.amazon.com/Randy-Sutton/e/B001IR1MQU%3Fref=dbs_a_mng_rwt_scns_share Book by panelist and retired Lt. Bob Kroll's wife (featuring Lt. Kroll and Off. Derek Chauvin) They're Lying: The Media, The Left, and The Death of George Floyd - by Liz Collin https://thelieexposed.com/ Books by panelist and retired Secret Service Agent Mike Roche including "Mass Killers": https://www.amazon.com/Mike-Roche/e/B00BHEIF78%3Fref=dbs_a_mng_rwt_scns_share Content Partners: ThisIsButter - One of the BEST law enforcement video channels https://rumble.com/user/ThisIsButter The Free Press - LEO Round Table is in their Cops and Crimes section 5 days a week https://www.tampafp.com/ https://www.tampafp.com/category/cops-and-crime/ Video Show Schedule: Mondays at 7pm ET - 90 minute LIVE show on YouTube, Facebook1, Facebook2, LinkedIn and Twitter Tue - Sat at 9am ET - Excerpts from LIVE show are uploaded to YouTube and Rumble (approx. time) Syndicated Radio Schedule: http://leoroundtable.com/radio/syndicated-radio-stations/ Podcasts: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable Website: http://leoroundtable.com/ Rumble: https://rumble.com/user/leoroundtable Parler: https://parler.com/profile/LEORoundTable/media YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/leoroundtable Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/leoroundtable/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/LEORoundTable LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/leo-round-table Sponsors: MotionDSP - Video enhancement/redaction and audio redaction https://www.motiondsp.com/ Galls - Proud to serve America's public safety professionals https://www.galls.com/leo Bang Energy - Energy drinks and products https://bangenergy.com/ The International Firearm Specialist Academy - The New Standard for Firearm Knowledge https://www.gunlearn.com/ MyMedicare.live - save money in Medicare insurance options from the experts http://www.mymedicare.live/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/support

Grace is joined by Toby Leary of Cape Gun Works to discuss all things Second Amendment. Toby explains the legal protocol for avoiding "straw purchase" status and gives insight into the best "first gun" to purchase. Tune in for answers to all your LEOSA, black powder, and license-to-carry questions!

Yooooooooo This episode we meet the new host of the podcast and speak with Jim of GymTanPatrol. He is a cop from the Garden State. We discuss him humble beginnings as a poor Jersey boy to the Top memelord in the State. We discuss the absolute madness of New Jersey policing - PBA cards, LEOSA, can cops smoke weed, ETC? We also talk about the death of the job, why he hates fat people, finishing in second place, why everyone in Jersey can't drive, why they are angry, pineapple on Pizza, Snooki, Spray Tans, Jim's love of Crown Vics and much much more. Please patronize and support the LEO businesses that made this podcast possible. How are First Responders hitting huge fitness / body/ health goals? Don't miss this one! Fit Responder Fit Responder is the top remote coaching program for first responders around the US. Having support that understands the demands and stressors of the job helps when you need an effective and realistic action plan to make your goals reality. Follow FIT RESPONDER for tips, guides, memes, etc. https://fitresponder.com/ Pick up some PMPM Christmas Ornaments from https://kfrantadesigns.com/collections/poorly-made-police-memes-christmas-ornaments PMPM coins - www.ghostpatch.com PMPM Merch - https://poorly-made-police-memes.creator-spring.com/? --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/poorly-made-police-memes/support

00:00 Intro 01:14 State has to honor national concealed carry for LEOs LEO Round Table (law enforcement talk show) Season 7, Episode 37a (1,815) filmed on 09/12/2022 Topic 1 concerns a successful U.S. District court hearing that orders New Jersey to fully implement LEOSA rights, going against Attorney General Grewal's motion to block them. Show Panelists and Personalities: Chip DeBlock (Host and retired police Detective) Special Guest: Don Mihalek (Executive VP of FLEOA Foundation) Special Guest: Mike Roche (retired United States Secret Service agent) John Newman (retired police assistant Chief) Bret Bartlett (retired police Captain) Randy Sutton (retired police Lieutenant) David D'Agresta (retired police Officer and sheriff's Corporal) Will Statzer (Producer) 25th Annual Community Harvest https://www.1905familyofrestaurants.com/ Upcoming Event From The Wounded Blue (Randy Sutton's charity): THE 2ND ANNUAL National Law Enforcement SURVIVAL SUMMIT https://thewoundedblue.org/event/the-2nd-annual-national-law-enforcement-survival-summit/ Content Partners: ThisIsButter - One of the BEST law enforcement video channels https://www.youtube.com/c/ThisIsButter1/ The Free Press - LEO Round Table is in their Cops and Crimes section 5 days a week https://www.tampafp.com/ https://www.tampafp.com/category/cops-and-crime/ Video Show Schedule: Mondays at 7pm ET - 90 minute LIVE show on YouTube, Facebook1, Facebook2, LinkedIn and Twitter Tue - Sat at 9am ET - Excerpts from LIVE show are uploaded to YouTube and Rumble (approx. time) Syndicated Radio Schedule: http://leoroundtable.com/radio/syndicated-radio-stations/ Podcasts: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable Website: http://leoroundtable.com/ Rumble: https://rumble.com/user/leoroundtable Parler: https://parler.com/profile/LEORoundTable/media YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/leoroundtable Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/leoroundtable/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/LEORoundTable LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/leo-round-table Sponsors: Galls - Proud To Serve America's Public Safety Professionals https://www.galls.com/ Bang Energy - Energy drinks and products https://bangenergy.com/ The International Firearm Specialist Academy - The New Standard for Firearm Knowledge https://www.gunlearn.com/ Guardian Alliance Technologies - Hire Smarter, Investigate Applicants with Precision & Speed https://guardianalliancetechnologies.com/ MyMedicare.live - save money in Medicare insurance options from the experts http://www.mymedicare.live/ TAC-TOTE - Rapid access and deployment with magnetic technology https://tac-tote.com/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/support

01:01 Suspect shot eight times during gun battle 05:39 Huge 2nd amendment news on gun control laws LEO Round Table (law enforcement talk show) Season 7, Episode 26b (1,761) filmed on 06/27/2022 Topic 1 concerns Buffalo (New York) police shooting suspect, Nakeem Haynes, during a gun fight with officers after Haynes fatally shot Atlas Johnson. Topic 2 concerns President Joe Biden signing a bipartisan "watered down" bill as a result of the Uvalde (Texas) school massacre, the U.S. Supreme Court striking down New York's restrictive handgun law, and a United States District Court judge ruling in favor of a LEOSA Suit against state of New Jersey. Also mentioned: Nancy Pelosi, Justice Clarence Thomas, Justice Brett Kavanaugh, FLEOA President Larry Cosme, the Federal Law Enforcement Officers Association, and the New Jersey Fraternal Order of Police. Show Panelists and Personalities: Chip DeBlock (Host and retired police Detective) Ward Meythaler (Attorney and former Federal Prosecutor) John Newman (retired police Chief) Bret Bartlett (retired police Captain) David D'Agresta (retired police Officer and sheriff's Corporal) Andrea Casale (retired police Officer) Will Statzer (Producer) Content Partners: ThisIsButter - One of the BEST law enforcement video channels https://www.youtube.com/c/ThisIsButter1/ The Free Press - LEO Round Table is in their Cops and Crimes section 5 days a week https://www.tampafp.com/ https://www.tampafp.com/category/cops-and-crime/ Video Show Schedule: Mondays at 7pm ET - 90 minute LIVE show on YouTube, Facebook1, Facebook2, LinkedIn and Twitter Tue - Sat at 9am ET - Excerpts from LIVE show are uploaded to YouTube and Rumble (approx. time) Syndicated Radio Schedule: http://leoroundtable.com/radio/syndicated-radio-stations/ Podcasts: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable Website: http://leoroundtable.com/ Rumble: https://rumble.com/user/leoroundtable Parler: https://parler.com/profile/LEORoundTable/media YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/leoroundtable Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/leoroundtable/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/LEORoundTable LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/leo-round-table Sponsors: Galls - Proud To Serve America's Public Safety Professionals https://www.galls.com/ Bang Energy - Energy drinks and products https://bangenergy.com/ The International Firearm Specialist Academy - The New Standard for Firearm Knowledge https://www.gunlearn.com/ Guardian Alliance Technologies - Hire Smarter, Investigate Applicants with Precision & Speed https://guardianalliancetechnologies.com/ MyMedicare.live - save money in Medicare insurance options from the experts http://www.mymedicare.live/ TAC-TOTE - Rapid access and deployment with magnetic technology https://tac-tote.com/ --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/leoroundtable/support

The Battle Over Bump Stocks continues as 6th Circuit Court cleared the way for the GOA Lawsuit to continue. Before you tune out, know this; the fight over bump stocks is NOT about bump stocks.  During our Brownells Bullet Point segment, we have commentary from Mr. Pete Brownell himself. We'll tell you just what Brownells is doing to help fight for your Constitutional Rights. Also, for our SOTG Homeroom from CrossBreed Holsters, we will consider what is going on regarding concealed carry down in Alabama. Also, are gun control laws based on racism? We will present the facts, you be the judge.  Thanks for being a part of SOTG! We hope you find value in the message we share. If you've got any questions, here are some options to contact us: • Send an Email • Send a Text • Call Us Enjoy the show! And remember…You're a Beginner Once, a Student For Life! TOPICS COVERED THIS EPISODE • [0:04:13] Brownells Bullet Points - Brownells.com     • TOPIC: Brownells Donates Portion of Sales to FPC• Huge thanks to our Partners: Brownells | CrossBreed | Duracoat | SWAT Fuel• [0:16:13] SOTG Homeroom - www.CrossbreedHolsters.com     • TOPIC: AL Gov Signs “Lifetime” Permission Slip Bill• [0:32:59] WCSO Pistol Purchase Permits www.wakegov.com• [0:36:15] Bump Stocks are NOT Machine Guns – 6th Circuit Vacates GOA v. Garland www.thefirearmblog.com    • What was the NUMBER of the House Bill that was passed to make bump stocks illegal; HR4594 www.congress.gov FEATURING: WakeGov.com, The Firearm Blog, Madison Rising, Jarrad Markel, Paul Markel, SOTG University PARTNERS: Brownells, Inc., CrossBreed Holsters, DuraCoat Firearm Finishes, SWAT Fuel FIND US ON: Full30, Parler, MeWe.com, iTunes, Stitcher, AppleTV, Roku, Amazon, GooglePlay, YouTube, Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, tumblr SOURCES From www.thefirearmblog.com: Aidan Johnston, Director of Federal Affairs for the GOA announced via his Twitter yesterday (June 25th, 2021) that the previous judgment regarding Gun Owners of America v. Garland has been vacated via a three-judge panel. This essentially means that the panel ruled that bump stocks are not machine guns. This is a victory for the 2nd Amendment community even if you're not a fan of the bump stock. The battle determining the legality of bump stocks has been raging on for quite some time and the GOA has been working to restore these firearms accessories back to legal status as non-machineguns since they were first banned on March 26th of 2019. (Click Here for Full Article)

Podcast: Raider-Cop Podcast Date: July 22, 2020 Episode #149 Subject: Law Enforcement Officer Safety Act (LEOSA), So What's The Problem ? Host: Al Martinino aka Alpha Mike Word Of The Week: Taste and see that the Lord is good. How happy is the man who takes refuge in Him. Psalms 34:8  Main Topic: LEOSA Law Enforcement Officer Safety Act / HR-218 Enacted July 22, 2004 Amended in 2010 and 2013 Amendment: Extend to those separated after 10 years (Active, Reserve, Auxiliary, Volunteer) Amendment: Extend benefits to active, retired military Department of Defense MP, & Amtrak Police Amendment: Retired LEO's must carry photo ID with authorized under LEOSA Qualify to receive the privilege issued by the State (pass qualification) Problem A. Definition of firearm based on State rules Problem B. Gun free zones Problem C. Some States do not issue a LEOSA authorization ID Problem D. Annual firearms certification per LEOSA, listing of certified instructors LEOSA is not clear on which firearm authorized to carry Reference: LEOSA 18 U.S. Code § 926B.Carrying of concealed firearms by qualified law enforcement officers (Cornell Law School)  LEOSA state by state: Why are retired police officers having problems? Eric Daigle Esq Law Group DLG Aug 6, 2019   Song Of The Week: Tiers on my pillow by Little Anthony Up Next: G-Shock #150 Become a member of the USCCA by hitting the link below or text "Raider" to 87222  @RaiderCopNews @TestEvery1521 Test Everything 5 minutes on the Power of God Instagram @day_with_milo Co-host of Raider-Cop Tube coming 2021 @raidercoppodcast Parler: @RaiderCopNation Facebook  Twitter iTunes  Spotify   Stitcher  Google Play  PodBean  YouTube TuneInJoin the Raider-Cop NATION Pistol Pete the Gunsmith Kilo Sierra’s Firearms Training or Investigation: Sepulveda inc #EmpanadaLadiesOfGeorgia #MoxieMatron @TanTenacity74 Twitter Manifest Your Dreams With Moxie Matron #JailsLASD #CACorrections #MDCR #NYPD #LAPD #LASD #MDPD #MPD #NYSP #NJSP #LVPD #Security #HCSO #PBSO #BSO #OCSO #PCSO #SFPD #DPD #HPD #SAPD #LCSO #FMPD #CCSO #NYC #NYCDOC #NJDOC #PPD #SLPD #CPD #TestEverything @RaiderCopNation #RaiderCopNation #TrainUp #o9TG #WiseGuySeries #TrainUpSeries #RollCallSeries #ThinkOuttaDaBox #SideBarSeries #BeLikeJack #Corrections Twitter @RaiderCopNation, Parler @RaiderCopNation, FaceBook @RaiderCopNation, Instrgram @DayWithMilo, Tik Tok @RaiderCopNation, Linkedin @raider-cop-podcast-ao12b96b/  Youtube Free Music: Triumph by Yung Logos, Rodeo Show by The Green Orbs, Minor Blues for Booker E’s Jammy Jams, Happy Birthday Mambo, by E’s Jammy James. The Awakening Patrick jazz Space, The Current Blues, Blue Infusion, Front Porch Blues, Crazy Blues, Midnight Special, Super Blues, Bright Eyed Blues, Bleeker Street Blues, Olde Salooner Blues, Miles BeyondPatrikiosMusic: I'm Back by Eye of the beholder.This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 4.0 International License.   

In this episode Kevin and Tom get started talking about whether you can detain a lawbreaker and traveling in your vehicle with a gun. They then move on to cover your responsibility or lack thereof should you walk into a robbery or assault in progress. Should you get involved? Is it smarter to walk away? These are potentially life-altering choices you must be prepared to make on the spot. Also find out when it's legally defensible to use your gun in self-defense in various situations, if you should consent to a search by law enforcement, and whether you should carry a round chambered in your carry gun. Shownotes: When traveling in my car can I carry my gun concealed or does it have to be locked up? (~0:58) Should a private citizen who is not law enforcement attempt to detain a lawbreaker? (~3:12) If I'm involved in a self-defense shooting do I have no choice but to also allow the police to search my entire home? (~7:24) If you walk into a convenience store and see someone threatening another person with a gun should you get involved? (~10:03) What should you do if another concealed carrier draws their gun and starts shooting at an attacker? (~13:18) Is it usually legal to carry more than one gun? (~14:39) Do the same laws apply to guns and secondary weapons such as pepper spray? (~15:40) Is it good practice to pay for range time and gear with a credit card to keep a record of the transaction or can it be used against me in court? (~17:30) What happens if you act in self-defense in a public place and injure an innocent bystander? (~20:17) How often should I practice at the range? (~22:45) Discussion of negligent discharge. (~24:51) Where should I put my gun immediately after a self-defense shooting? (~25:12) What are the benefits to being LEOSA certified? (~27:18) Should I tell a law enforcement officer that I have an AR pistol in my vehicle during a traffic stop and how do I explain it is a non-NFA item? (~28:30) Can you shoot someone who has a weapon and is trying to break into your home at night? (~35:11) If someone aims a gun at me and I don't know why, can I use deadly force to defend myself? (~37:43) If the police want to search your house absent exigent circumstances should I tell them to get a search warrant? (~39:20) My Colorado concealed carry permit is no longer valid. I applied for a new Oklahama concealed carry permit but haven't received it yet. Will non-resident permits from other states be recognized by Oklahoma? (~41:40) What do I do if a bad actor is telling law enforcement I'm the one who is a bad guy? (~42:47) When is it legally defensible to draw my gun against a deadly threat? (~45:05) What happens if you check your gun for a flight but your flight ends up delayed to a state where the gun laws are not friendly to the guns you checked? (~46:51) Does an attacker have to have a weapon of some sort in order for me to see them as a deadly threat and respond in kind? (~49:23) Is it safe to carry a round chambered? (~52:25) I don't have a concealed carry permit. Can I legally transport my guns, locked in a case, between Ohio and Florida? (~53:40) More to Explore: Visit on the web at uscca.com, Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook law enforcement, reasonable force, deadly force, self-defense, self-defense shooting, searches, totality of circumstances, innocent bystander

In this podcast, Stan and Mike talk with Gary Eastridge, Critical Response Coordinator and Affiliate manager for CCW Safe.   Gary is a retired law enforcement officer. He started with the Oklahoma City Police Department in February 1979 retiring in 2000 as an Inspector in the Homicide Unit. Gary also served as a department firearms instructor after receiving his CLEET certification in 1986. After retirement he worked as a police officer with the International Police Task Force (IPTF) in support of the United Nations Mission in Kosovo (UNMIK). Gary worked homicides with counterparts from 53 nations as well as mentoring local Police officers. Gary was named Chief Investigator for the Oklahoma County District Attorney’s office in January of 2007 where he served until his retirement in April of 2017 to accept his position with CCW Safe. He reviewed all officer involved shootings occurring in Oklahoma County as well as in custody deaths and other significant and high profile investigations / prosecutions. Gary is helping head up our new HR218 plans, along with Mike and Stan.  Full transcription: Speaker 1: 00:01 Welcome to the inside. CCWSAFE podcast with founders, Stan Campbell and Mike Darter. If you're forced to fight the battle for your life, CCWCSAFE will fight the battle for your future. Mike Darter: 00:22 Welcome to the inside CCWSAFE podcast, I'm Mike Darter in Oklahoma City. Stan Campbell: 00:27 I'm Stan Campbell in California right now. Mike Darter: 00:31 And we got Gary. Gary: 00:33 Hey guys. Mike Darter: 00:34 Gary's also in Oklahoma City. Stan Campbell: 00:37 That's right. Mike Darter: 00:38 So we normally do a weather report. I want to hear this, Stan? Is it nice out there? Stan Campbell: 00:42 It really is kind of nice today. Mike Darter: 00:45 You suck. Stan Campbell: 00:46 It's like, it's like 68 degrees. It's kind of beautiful. Mike Darter: 00:49 It's such a ... It's not bad here. Stan Campbell: 00:52 Yeah. You know how it is though, but you know. Mike Darter: 00:55 Yeah, yeah. Stan Campbell: 00:56 Yeah. Mike Darter: 00:59 What's been going on with you two, anything new on the CCWSAFE front, you guys? Stan Campbell: 01:06 Well, we are, I mean, we're just all over the place. You know, we've been dealing with our awesome new clients over there in New York. Gary and I had been helping the NYPD retire guys in joining and welcoming them to the family. So we're real happy about that. And we have ladies day is coming up, right Gary? Ladies days coming up this next month. And that's in Orlando- Gary: 01:37 A little over two weeks. Stan Campbell: 01:39 That's right in Orlando, so if you guys are in Orlando area, make sure you stop by and see me at Gary because we'll be there with the ladies. We always sponsored that event, it's an awesome event there. And so I think something about 500 women show up. Mike Darter: 01:53 Wow. Stan Campbell: 01:54 You know, for safety and concealed carry classes, a little bit of everything, right Gary? Gary: 01:59 Yeah. Mike Darter: 02:00 Now, where is that at? Gary: 02:03 It's at the Central Florida Rifle Pistol Club in Orlando. Just outside of Orlando, Florida. Good group. This is what, the fourth year I've think you've, we've been going down there. Stan Campbell: 02:14 Yeah. We're pretty much their main sponsors and we understand the importance of supporting women in the industry. You know, female carriers, the numbers are going up and we welcome them with open arms so we make sure we get down there and support all of our affiliates down there. Mike Darter: 02:36 That's cool. Then we also have the police week coming up as well in May. Stan Campbell: 02:42 Yeah, police week. Yep. Mike Darter: 02:44 What date is that? Stan Campbell: 02:45 What's the dates, Gary? Gary: 02:46 May 12th through May 16th. I just worked out my calendar up there on the white board, which is now full. The next about six weeks we're going to be really busy. Stan Campbell: 03:00 That's right. Mike Darter: 03:02 All right. So if you're going to be out in a police would come by and see us. We're going to have some pretty, some kind of cool stuff to give out there. Stan Campbell: 03:09 That's correct. And then also myself, you, and Gary, we're going to be in California supporting Unite Inland Empire 2019 Conservative Conference. So we'll be out there. There's about thousand in attendance out there. It's being sponsored by AM590, The Answer. Those guys, they, we really help them out. They help us out. You know, we partner a lot. You got Phil with Firing Line radio show. I've been on there several times myself, Mike, our entire crew, I've had the opportunity to cohost, I have the opportunity to stand in as a host there on the radio show, and I mean they really take care of us. It's just, they're part of our family. So we're going out to support them with the United Inland Empire Conservative Conference 2019, so we'll be there also. That it's April 28th, so if you guys are in that area, believe it or not California is our number two state in reference to a membership base. So if you there in that area come through and see is there as well. Mike Darter: 04:14 Yeah, it's going to be good time, man. I forgot about that. Stan Campbell: 04:16 That's right. Mike Darter: 04:17 That's coming up pretty quick too. Stan Campbell: 04:18 Yeah, a lot going on. Mike Darter: 04:20 So what are we talking about today? Stan Campbell: 04:22 Well today we brought on Gary, because we want to kind of talk about, we've been going a lot of calls from retired policemen mostly, not truly having a good grasp on HR 218, the rules that apply, any changes that are being made there. So I wanted to bring Gary on to kind of talk about HR 218 and kind of break it down for folks, some myths, some problems, some things to watch out for. So it's really important that all three of us carry under that realm as well and it's important to know the do's and don'ts. So I wanted to bring Gary on for that reason. Mike Darter: 05:08 Cool. So Gary, so what, do you have any specific questions we could like start out with that you've got, or do you just want to start going over what it is? Gary: 05:20 Well, I think the important thing for everybody ... I think most officers have a general understanding of what's commonly referred to as HR 218 it's actually the law enforcement officers safety act. It was signed into law in 2004 by President Bush. It's been amended a couple of times over the last what, 15 years that it's been in existence. But it's really a pretty simple law. The HR 218 was the house resolution ... (silence) ... forces that I use myself of the NRA ... (silence) ... They're not fully on board with LEOSA because they don't have a whole lot of input with it. And that was, that's actually by design that ... (silence) ... offices they let her stay ... (silence) ... know the extended coverage for a corrections officers and ... (silence) ... to be able to carry a gun anywhere in the US ... (silence). Mike Darter: 19:32 ... often. Thank God I got a couple of family members that are policemen there. But ... (silence). Gary: 21:03 ... it multiplies your force. But I'm thinking, so what happens is if you have a jurisdiction that may not be pro gun, that wants more gun control, they see this as an extension of that. And this is one way they want to limit LEOSAs. Stan Campbell: 21:29 Got You. Now and I'm just asking your opinion now, Gary, but what's your thoughts on, if it's not too big of a deal to back up with a concealed carry in a specific state that you visited a lot. Like you go to Virginia a lot, you and I go to Orlando, we all go to Vegas, you know, so Nevada and stuff like that. What's your thoughts on that? Gary: 21:53 I have an Oklahoma permit. I don't see a downside to having the state permit. In reality it should not be necessary with LEOSA. If this bill passes, I'm not sure I will re-up my state permit, but I don't see a downside to having multiple permits. Stan Campbell: 22:15 Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to get your opinion because I'm an advocate of getting the multiple permits as a backup. I mean it doesn't take much to do so. And if you do run into that green officer, somebody who's brand new and has no idea what LEOSA is, they, normally they know what concealed carry permit is. So that way you do have some type of backup as well. You have to think about how you engage, because no matter what, when we retire, it's a culture. So when you retire, I mean once a policeman, usually always a policeman, it's just in you. And you see something that goes wrong, you feel like you need to just jump in. So, you really have to be careful, and remember that hey I'm retired now. One of the things I might need to do before I just jump on into somebody's domestic or whatever the case may be, or try to make a citizen's arrest, because that's what's going to end up being, you might want to make sure you call 911 first too as an officer. Because we kind of move and think that we can handle something and then at times we'll get in over our heads as well. It doesn't take much. Gary: 23:26 Yeah, absolutely. And then when the cops do show up, they're not going to know you from anybody. Mike Darter: 23:33 No, that's right. Gary: 23:34 I'm a firm believer as someone who carries under LEOSA and under a state permit, that before I'm going to intervene in a situation, someone has to be being hurt physically. I'm not going to try to stop a theft, I'm not going to try to stop an argument. I may watch it, call 911, tell them, hey this is getting ready to, this has potential to become violent. But I'm not gonna interject unless it becomes a, it's a matter of significant injury to somebody. Stan Campbell: 24:15 Yeah, absolutely. And you know, I mean I think of it the same way, you know, any more because of politics and because of the gray areas, you have got to absolutely think about taking care of yourselves out there. Take a extra moment. You know, if it's not a Isis, al Qaeda situation, you're not talking about somebody gunning down people in the church, of course you have to just react to that. But if it is like something simple arguments, the domestics, you know it's not some serious violence going on, somebody steals a bag of Skittles, don't think that you have to be the hero on that. So yeah. So that's kind of where we are there. But anything else on that Gary, on any LEOSA issues? Gary: 25:09 Well, I'm not being specific. I think it's incumbent on any officer who is eligible for LEOSA to carry under LEOSA, to research and know the law. Because you remember how it was when we were on the streets, Stan. We had a thumbnail idea of a lot of laws. We had a not a real good understanding of maybe other than the handful that we routinely enforce. As an officer, I think it's incumbent on you to learn LEOSA, plan ahead on how to respond to an officer who may not understand LEOSA. Research. When I started writing an article late last year only I was amazed at how much information is available on the Internet. And really even though it's not as simple as it seems, it's a pretty simple law. Stan Campbell: 26:14 Yeah. Yeah. I mean- Mike Darter: 26:19 One of the things I was going to say was one of the things we're creating for this, for our members that are going to be HR 218 is a membership card that will have information on that card for law enforcement should you have to display it. And it's going to be a card that states, the person carrying this card meets the requirements by LEOSA. You'll have to carry it with ... Gary, kind of talk about just right quick, the requirements, the things you have to have with that card. Gary: 27:06 Yeah. The law requires you to have two things. It requires you to have a photo ID from the agency that you are or were a police officer at, excuse me, and proof of qualification within the last 12 months. So what I carry is my retired card and on the back of it I put on my qualification card. And every year, as long as it's, here in Oklahoma, it's CLEET, as long as a CLEET authorized instructor signs off and qualifies me, I update my card. That's the only two things that are required by the law for an officer to carry. Now if I were in a situation like with you, I would probably take a snapshot of that letter showing my 10 years plus service to just to confirm my eligibility under LEOSA. Mike Darter: 28:11 Right. Yeah. So that's- Gary: 28:14 Nowadays with smart phones it's so easy to carry all that with you that you can produce that and for that matter you can show them the actual law for those that don't understand. Mike Darter: 28:27 Right. So that's what I carry now is I have another card that I have that I carry with my card that you signed on my qualification that's dated. And then I do have my police ID, or a copy of my police ID and I have a copy of that letter. So, and I'm actually looking forward to these cards cause they look awesome. Justin's done them. Gary: 28:58 I was gonna say, our content guy is pretty good at that kind of thing. Mike Darter: 29:01 Oh yeah, yeah. He's been killing it so. So I'm excited about this new plan coming out. I think it's going to be one thing with, generally with law enforcement officers, retired and former officers, we all know the possibilities of what can happen and it's going to be a good deal. The everything wrapped into it with the civil liability coverage and the extended bail and all that. So yeah, I'm excited to get it out. Gary: 29:39 It's going to be a good product. Mike Darter: 29:42 I've got, I've found one email that I'd like to, while I've got you guys on here, from Matt [Bell, 00:29:53] he sent in a copy of his umbrella plan document from his, and he said, "I listen to your podcast, episode number 26 I checked my umbrella policy, which I hoped would cover us in a self-defense situation. It appears that it does, but I would appreciate if you would confirm this. I," and he attached a document of his plan. And you know this is one thing that has kind of come up recently more and more and it's one thing that really for us to confirm it, we're not the ones that need to confirm it. Your insurance company is the one that's going to have to confirm this and here's what my take is on it for Mark and whoever else, or Matt and whoever else has this question, because it comes up a lot. Mike Darter: 30:51 You have to remember that your insurance company, first of all, have you guys, I know you three have dealt with insurance in the past, correct? Stan Campbell: 30:59 Mm-hmm (affirmative). Gary: 30:59 Yes. Mike Darter: 31:01 And when you're making a claim, they, whether it be a car or roof or whatever, they send adjusters out, they send people to come out and especially if it's a use of force situation, there will be attorneys involved for that insurance company. And here's my fear with anything that goes through an insurance company. I don't know about you guys, but my experience with insurance companies has not been, I mean it's been okay, I guess. I mean, I've been covered on things, but it's always not what you think you're gonna get back. There's always some, well, it was this, so that gets deducted, it isn't. Gary: 31:58 And those attorneys are working with the interest of the insurance company, not the insured. Mike Darter: 32:04 Right, and this is one thing when we created our service, when we first started this back in 2012 we said, we don't want to be grouped or seen as an insurance company because most states, if not all states, it's illegal to cover an intentional act or an illegal act with an insurance policy or coverage. So any attorney working on the behalf of an insurance company, I think it easily argue, even if your homeowner guy says, "Oh yeah, we're going to cover you," well, he's not the one that's going to be going to bat for you when that time comes, if you have to try to make a claim. The person who is going to be going to bat is going to be going to bat for the insurance company trying to deny that claim. Gary: 33:08 Mike have, I've had several members asked that exact question and I told each of them to call their broker and get them to put it in writing. Of the ones that responded, 100% have told me that their agents said they would not cover a self-defense situation. Mike Darter: 33:27 Yeah. So I just, I saw that come in and I just wanted to address that because I know we have that topic discussed a lot with you guys, especially with David, but you guys who are answering the calls and and all that. So- Gary: 33:48 I think it gets down to that issue. Just like in New York and Washington state. Insuring for intentional acts. Mike Darter: 33:56 Yup. Yup. So Matt, I would definitely say to check, Like Gary said, like Gary tells everybody, get it in writing. Call your insurance agent, get it in writing. I don't think they're going to put that in writing. So I didn't see any others. I thought I had some others that I had set aside on the, in reference to the podcast, but I can't find them now. Stan Campbell: 34:25 So well, what would we do Mike, is being that we're not interviewing anybody on the next one. If we do one by ourselves, we'll make sure we'll have a list and we'll go through them as well. Mike Darter: 34:36 Okay? Cool. All right guys. Well, Gary, thanks for your time, man. Gary: 34:42 Enjoyed it. Stan Campbell: 34:42 Thanks Gary. Mike Darter: 34:42 Stan, good to see you again. Stan Campbell: 34:46 I'll see you soon. Mike Darter: 34:47 All right, man. Take care, bye-bye. Stan Campbell: 34:47 All right, bye.

In 2004, Congress passed the Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act (also known as LEOSA), which allows qualified active and retired officers to carry a concealed firearm in any jurisdiction in the United States—with certain exceptions and restrictions. Recently introduced legislation—the LEOSA Reform Act—would expand where current and retired officers can carry a concealed firearm, as well as reform the qualification standards for retired officers to ease superfluous burdens for anyone carrying in accordance with LEOSA. If passed, some of the hurdles put in place in states like New York, New Jersey and other places would come down. In this podcast segment, Jim and Doug discuss whether or not the LEOSA Reform Act will pass, and what it would mean for officers if it does.

HR 218 (LEOSA) vs Concealed Weapon License (CWL) Preguntas y Respuestas Asociación Hermanos azules, INC