Podcast appearances and mentions of natasha daniels

Bedtime shouldn't feel like a battleground—but for many families raising a child with OCD, nighttime is when the OCD compulsions ramp up and take over. In this episode, child therapist and OCD parenting expert Natasha Daniels breaks down the most common nighttime OCD compulsions that trap both kids and parents in exhausting loops.You'll learn:What nighttime OCD rituals look like (and why they're so common)How OCD pulls parents into the loop through reassurance and ritualsWhy giving in fuels OCD—even when it feels easier in the momentHow to set clear, loving boundaries that break the OCD cycleWhat to do during the day to reduce OCD struggles at nightWhether your child is stuck repeating bedtime routines, seeking endless reassurance, or confessing before sleep—this episode will help you understand what's happening and what to do next.Listen in and learn how to take back bedtime—without feeding OCD.

Child OCD Therapy is important—but it's not the whole answer.In this episode, child therapist and OCD parent Natasha Daniels explains why therapy alone isn't enough to help a child with OCD truly thrive. You'll learn how your daily responses can either empower your child's progress—or unintentionally grow their OCD. Discover practical ways to become a supportive, confident, and crucial part of your child's treatment journey. Because when parents know what to do, real change happens at home.Want in-depth support? Got on the AT Parenting Community waitlist here.***This podcast episode is sponsored by NOCD. NOCD provides online OCD therapy in the US, UK, Australia and Canada. To schedule your free 15 minute consultation to see if NOCD is a right fit for you and your child, go tohttps://go.treatmyocd.com/at_parentingThis podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be used to replace the guidance of a qualified professional.Parents, do you need more support?

This week 411 Teen discusses social anxiety disorder, the intense and persistent fear that one is being watched and judged, with Natasha Daniels, author of "Out Of MY Shell".

Social anxiety is an interesting topic. Natasha Daniels is a social anxiety therapist and mom who joined us recently to discuss OCD and kids; today, we are exploring another form of anxiety as Natasha helps us understand social anxiety. She wrote a memoir, Out of My Shell, detailing her personal experience.  Show Highlights: Natasha's background, personal experience, and book about social anxiety The neuro-divergent affirming movement The difference between social anxiety and introversion Do we ALL have some degree of social anxiety? Thoughts on “bed rot,” social anxiety, and what's “normal” Social anxiety as a defense mechanism The isolation that comes with social anxiety OCD, social anxiety, and autism—a common connection? “A paralyzing fear of others' perceptions and a preoccupation with managing those perceptions” The difference between a defense mechanism and a personality trait An overview of Natasha's experience with social anxiety and why she wrote her book Social anxiety is NOT a self-esteem issue. Outsmarting the negative critic in your head Dr. Kristin Neff's concept of “fierce self-compassion,” which is “a feistiness of advocacy” Resources and Links: Future Fans:Helping little kids become BIG fans Connect with Natasha Daniels: Website (and book) and Instagram Connect with KC: Website, TikTok, Instagram, and Facebook Get KC's book, How to Keep House While Drowning We love the sponsors that make this show possible! You can always find all the special deals and codes for all our current sponsors on our website: www.strugglecare.com/promo-codes. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

CALM AND CONNECTED - EPISODE 167What is social anxiety and how big an impact does this have for a child and the difference for an adult? How can you tell the difference between social anxiety and being an introvert? These are just some of the questions Janine speaks about with Natasha Daniels as she also talks about her memoir Out of My Shell. They also speak about:What the definition of Social Anxiety actually isWhat does it look like in children compared to adultsFeeling the fear and doing it anywayThe potential to lack other social awarenesses The difference between introversion and social anxietyHow Natasha likes to rest and relaxAnd remember, do not forget about yourself, take a few minutes for you and have a little fun!About The Guest - Natasha DanielsNatasha Daniels has been an anxiety & OCD therapist for over two decades. She combines both her clinical expertise with her lived experience, raising her own three kids with anxiety and OCD.She is the creator of the website AT Parenting Survival, As well as the host to the show AT Parenting Survival Podcast and the Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist. She also gives in-depth support to thousands of parents raising kids with anxiety or OCD through her books, courses in the AT Parenting Survival Online School and in her online membership AT Parenting Community. Her latest books include Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids and her memoir, Out of My Shell: Overcoming Social Anxiety from Childhood to Adulthood.Website: www.socialanxietyreality.com Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/socialanxietyreality/ About The Host - Janine HalloranJanine Halloran is a Licensed Mental Health Counselor, an author, a speaker, an entrepreneur and a mom. As a Licensed Mental Health Counselor, Janine has been working primarily with children, adolescents, and their families for over 20 years. She is the Founder of 'Coping Skills for Kids', where she creates products and resources to help kids learn to cope with their feelings in safe and healthy ways. Janine also founded 'Encourage Play' which dedicated to helping kids learn and practice social skills in the most natural way - through play!If you're interested in learning more about how to teach kids coping skills, download your free Coping Skills Toolkit:https://copingskillsforkids.com/newsletterIf you're interested in joining the Coping Skills Community Hub, an ever-expanding resource library and community of families and professionals teaching kids how to cope, learn more at https://copingskillsforkids.com/hubIf you'd like to purchase Janine's products, including the Coping Skills for Kids Workbook, Coping Skills for Teens Workbook, Social Skills for Kids Workbook, Coping Cue Cards, and more, visit https://store.copingskillsforkids.com or https://amazon.com/copingskillsforkidsConnect with Janine on Social MediaInstagram: @copingskillsforkidsFacebook: facebook.com/copingskillsforkids and facebook.com/encourageplayYoutube: https://www.youtube.com/c/JanineHalloranEncouragePlay

Jim Mellin talks with Natasha Daniels, a remarkable financial professional who made a bold career switch from healthcare to finance during the Covid-19 pandemic. Natasha opens about the life-altering events that led to her transition, including her father's illness and a significant personal loss. She discusses the crucial role of mentorship and community in her journey and shares insights on how she managed to thrive in a new industry. This episode is a testament to Natasha's determination and commitment to helping others achieve their financial goals.

Today's episode will be helpful for all parents—and for anyone who has ever been a child. We are discussing OCD, specifically in children, with Natasha Daniels. She has been an anxiety and OCD child therapist for over two decades. As the mother of three kids with anxiety and OCD, her passion and perspective is both professional and personal. Join us to learn more! Show Highlights: OCD differs from general anxiety and requires very specific therapies. Signs of OCD, a diverse, idiosyncratic disorder that shows up differently for each person In children, a common sign of OCD is the tendency to ask theme-based, repetitive questions. Is it anxiety or OCD?  Autism and OCD: Comfort/coping skills or compulsion? When does my child need professional help? How do I know? OCD or nervous tics? A discussion of mental health issues in families, social anxiety, neuroplasticity, and addiction Finding “the sweet spot” as a parent (so as not to coddle but not fuel anxiety) The best approach: parents can refuse to participate in the “overblownness” and drama while not being dismissive The wisdom in coaching our kids Resources and Links: Connect with Natasha Daniels: Website (find resources, courses, podcast episodes, and more) OCD Resources: International OCD Foundation and Treat My OCD Connect with KC: Website, TikTok, Instagram, and Facebook Get KC's book, How to Keep House While Drowning We love the sponsors that make this show possible! You can always find all the special deals and codes for all our current sponsors on our website: www.strugglecare.com/promo-codes. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

15 million American adults have social anxiety—roughly 7% of the entire population. More than two-thirds of those adults showed their first symptoms during their childhood years. And yet, it often takes up to ten years to seek help. In her memoir, OUT OF MY SHELL, therapist Natasha Daniels brings her own social anxiety into the open, on her journey to find healing through self-acceptance. Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD child therapist who has published six other books including How to Parent your Anxious Toddler, It's Brave to Be Kind, and Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids.

Cultural historian Elsa Richardson takes a deep dive into the history of what she calls the most fascinating organ — the gut. Then, therapist Natasha Daniels describes the difficulties of having social anxiety in her vulnerable memoir, "Out of my Shell: Overcoming Social Anxiety from Childhood to Adulthood."

Send us a textAn informative discussion with Natasha Daniels about her memoir OUT OF MY SHELL: Overcoming Social Anxiety from Childhood to Adulthood.Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD child therapist and has published six other books including How to Parent your Anxious Toddler, Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, Social Skills Activities for Kids, It's Brave to Be Kind, The Grief Rock and Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids. She also hosts the AT Parenting Survival Podcast and has a Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist. You can find her work at https://www.socialanxietyreality.com/; www.ATparentingsurvival.com or on social media @Atparentingsurvival.

Mike Chmielewski is joined by Natasha Daniels, anxiety and OCD therapist. She combines her clinical as well as her life experience with social anxiety in her new book, to help you understand and find peace with yours or your loved ones social anxiety.

In episode 453 I chat with Natasha Daniels. Natasha is an anxiety & OCD therapist. She runs her online membership AT Parenting Community. And recently authored the book, “Out of my shell: overcoming social anxiety from childhood to adulthood”.  We discuss her community, her social anxiety story, the loss of her husband, working through social anxiety, exposure and response prevention therapy (ERP), her new book, social anxiety and OCD, and much more.   Show notes: https://theocdstories.com/episode/natasha-453  The podcast is made possible by NOCD. NOCD offers effective, convenient therapy available in the US and outside the US. To find out more about NOCD, their therapy plans and if they currently take your insurance head over to https://go.treatmyocd.com/theocdstories Join many other listeners getting our weekly emails. Never miss a podcast episode or update: https://theocdstories.com/newsletter   Thanks to all our patrons for supporting our work. To sign up to our Patreon and to check out the benefits you'll receive as a Patron, visit: https://www.patreon.com/theocdstoriespodcast 

What do you do with social anxiety and OCD? Write about it. Don't miss this lovely chat with Natasha and Rachael! Natasha Daniels is a child anxiety & OCD therapist, who has battled her own anxiety throughout her life. She is the author of Social Skills Activities for Kids, It's Brave to Be Kind, Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, How to Parent Your Anxious Toddler, The Grief Rock, Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids and her latest, Out of My Shell, a memoir about overcoming social anxiety from childhood to adulthood. She is the creator of ATParentingSurvival.com, the host of the highly ranked, AT Parenting Survival Podcast and creator of the Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist. Her work has been featured in various places including Huffington Post, Scary Mommy, PsychCentral, The Child Mind Institute and The Mighty.

Join your host, Nicole Morris, LMFT and Mental Health Correspondent, as she welcomes the creator behind AT Parenting Survival, Natasha Daniels, to our family table. Natasha describes her journey in treating anxiety and OCD, as well as becoming a global resource for parents through her books, podcasts, YouTube channel and the AT Parenting Community. Join the conversation to gain practical tips and access supportive resources for helping parents navigate OCD and anxiety with hope and resilience.

This week, 411 Teen discusses the nature of obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD). We sit down with Natasha Daniels, a child therapist specializing in OCD and anxiety.

This episode is the final part of our two-part chat with Natasha Daniels. Natasha is a Therapist specialising in anxiety and OCD in children and created AT Parenting Survival to help the parents of children living with anxiety and OCD.  In our last episode, Natasha shared how she got into working with children, how to adapt ERP for young people, and the importance of rapport, fun, and play in therapy.  In this episode, Natasha opens up about why she loves working with the parents of children with OCD and anxiety. She explains how she works with parents and shares her helpful tips for helping kids with OCD and anxiety while they're at school.   Resources and links: AT website  AT Parenting Survival School website AT Parenting Survival School on Instagram Natasha Daniels on YouTube   Connect: https://www.melbournewellbeinggroup.com.au/ http://www.drcelingelgec.com.au/ This show is produced in collaboration with Wavelength Creative. Visit wavelengthcreative.com for more information.

Natasha Daniels is a Therapist specialising in anxiety and OCD in children. Natasha is the creator of the AT Parenting Survival website to provide parents with advice for helping their children living with anxiety and OCD. Natasha has drawn on two decades of experience to create a YouTube channel and a podcast and has also written several books. In this episode, Natasha reveals what drew her to working with children and teens with anxiety and OCD, as well as their parents. She discusses how to adapt ERP for younger clients, the significance of building rapport, and how to incorporate playfulness and creativity into therapy. This episode is part one of our two-part chat with Natasha. Keep an eye out for part two, where she'll focus on one of her biggest passions: working with the parents of children with OCD and anxiety.   Resources and links: AT website  AT Parenting Survival School website AT Parenting Survival School on Instagram Natasha Daniels on YouTube   Connect: https://www.melbournewellbeinggroup.com.au/ http://www.drcelingelgec.com.au/ This show is produced in collaboration with Wavelength Creative. Visit wavelengthcreative.com for more information.

SPP 176: Anxiety and OCD Treatment #psychedpodcast is excited for a great episode! Please join us as we chat with Natasha Daniels https://www.anxioustoddlers.com/https://hillchildcounseling.com/

Anxiety and OCD therapist Natasha Daniels joins us with a new workbook just in time for summer break! CRUSHING OCD WORKBOOK FOR KIDS: 50 Fun Activities to Overcome OCD with CBT and Exposures. Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD child therapist and has published five other books including How to Parent your Anxious Toddler and It's Brave to Be Kind. For more, visit ATparentingsurvival.com.

Dr. Morin's course can also be taken as part of our membership! If you love our podcast, you need to check out our membership with ICP!   80+ Parenting & Mental Health Courses Certificates of Completion for Continuing Eduaction Weekly Parent Coaching sessions Printables & Parenting Scripts Resource Library Webinars & Live Events And a Supportive Community Listeners can take 40% OFF their annual membership (or $19.99/m). Get your 7-Day Free Trial today! And we do not want to forget about our Best-Seller The Parenting Handbook: Your Guide to Raising Resilient Children For a limited time only, buy a copy of our book and recieve a free gift! Yes, you get access to our Compassionate Discipline workshop valued at $87.84. Click here for more info or navigate to www.icphelps.com !  

Chad and Nikki are joined by Natasha Daniels of AT Parenting Survival. Natasha hosts a podcast and has published books, all about OCD. She is also the parent of children with anxiety and OCD. In this episode, she shares her professional and personal take on OCD in children and teens. 

Writer Tom Seeman, who grew up in a family of fourteen on welfare and food stamps in the projects of Toledo, Ohio, tells his story in his page-turning book, "Animals I want To See: A Memoir of Growing Up in the Projects and Defying the Odds." Then, Natasha Daniels talks frankly about childhood obsessive compulsive disorder and her workbook for kids called "Crushing OCD."

Are you thoughts intrusive? Could it be obsessive compulsive disorder. Natasha Daniels is an expert who specializes in helping kids with OCD. So much to learn!

Scoot speaks with Natasha Daniels, Child Anxiety and OCD Therapist and author of "Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids"

This hour, Scoot talks to Natasha Daniels, Child Anxiety and OCD Therapist author of "Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids". Then Scoot brings on Bryce and Scarlette to talk about enjoying gun shots.

Helping children navigate the complexities of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD) requires a delicate balance of understanding, patience, and empowerment. Natasha Daniels, a renowned expert in this field, shares invaluable insights into how parents can support their children in overcoming OCD with positivity and resilience. Normalizing OCD: One of the first steps in supporting children with OCD is normalizing the condition. Both parents and children need to understand that they are not alone in this journey. Natasha emphasizes the importance of taking things one step at a time and not allowing the overwhelming nature of OCD to overshadow the progress being made. Education is Key: Understanding OCD is crucial for effective support. Natasha urges parents to educate themselves about the condition, its symptoms, and the most effective treatment approaches. By arming themselves with knowledge, parents can better support their children through the challenges of OCD. The Concept of "Crushing" OCD: Natasha introduces the empowering concept of "crushing" OCD.” Instead of viewing OCD as an insurmountable obstacle, children are encouraged to see it as something conquerable. This shift in perspective can be transformative, instilling a sense of empowerment and resilience. Making Treatment Fun: To engage children in treatment, Natasha suggests incorporating fun activities. By turning exposures into games or playful challenges, children are more likely to participate actively in their own recovery journey. This approach not only makes treatment more enjoyable but also fosters a positive attitude towards facing fears. Bravery Points: Natasha introduces the idea of "bravery points" as a motivational tool for children. By rewarding bravery in facing OCD-related fears, children are incentivized to confront their anxieties and engage in exposure exercises. This gamified approach can be highly effective in encouraging progress. Adapting for Teens and Adults: While bravery points may resonate well with children, Natasha also offers insights into adapting these strategies for teenagers and adults. Creative incentives tailored to different age groups can help individuals of all ages stay motivated and committed to their treatment goals. Creative Exposures: Incorporating creative exposures into treatment can make confronting fears more engaging and less daunting for children. By turning exposures into interactive experiences, such as games or role-playing exercises, children can develop essential coping skills in a supportive environment. Collaborative Approach: Natasha emphasizes the importance of collaboration between parents and children in the treatment process. By working together to develop coping strategies and respond to OCD-related behaviors, families can create a supportive and empowering environment for children with OCD. Addressing Parenting Challenges: Managing the emotional challenges of parenting a child with OCD can be overwhelming. Natasha offers insights into coping with feelings of anger, frustration, and helplessness, providing strategies for maintaining patience and support during difficult moments. Long-Term Perspective: Supporting children with OCD requires a long-term perspective. Building resilience and fostering a family culture that promotes bravery and resilience are essential for long-term success. By focusing on progress rather than perfection, families can navigate the challenges of OCD with hope and determination. Conclusion: Natasha Daniels' insights offer a beacon of hope for families navigating the complexities of OCD. By normalizing the condition, educating themselves, and adopting creative and empowering approaches to treatment, parents can support their children in overcoming OCD with positivity and resilience. TRANSCRIPTION:  Kimberley: Welcome everybody. Today we have Natasha Daniels. She's the go to person for the kiddos who are struggling with anxiety and OCD. And I'm so grateful to have her here. We are going to talk about helping your kid crush OCD and how we can make it fun and how we can get them across the finish line. So welcome Natasha. Natasha:  Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. Kimberley okay. We've had you on before and I think so much so highly of you. I'm so honored to have you on here again talking. We were talking about kids as well last time but first of all let's just talk about the kiddo, right? The kiddo who has OCD. They're starting this process. Let's sort of even say like they're ready for help, like they want to get better, but at the same [00:01:00] time getting better feels like a huge mountain that they have to climb. What might you say to the kiddo and the parents at that beginning stage of treatment? Natasha: A lot of times I think kids don't even realize that they're not alone. They think they have like these really bizarre thoughts and that they'll never be able to stop those bizarre thoughts. So I the first step is really normalizing it for both the parent and the child and letting them know that lots of people have this struggle and that they are able to get through it and have a healthy, productive life. And for parents in particular. about tunnel vision, you know, because it can feel so big. And it's like, let's just, what's your next move? What's your next step that tunnel vision so that the overwhelm doesn't skew your perspective Kimberley: Yeah, what might be those steps? Like what, what, [00:02:00] what, how would you, how would you have that conversation? I mean, I know for parents, I think there's some relief in getting a diagnosis and being like, Oh, okay, so we know now what this is. And we're here to get treatment and we're assuming this is the right treatment. But they're still just, you know, it's such a mountain to climb. So what might you say to them? Natasha: The first step is really educating yourself. I think parents learn a little bit and they just like want to jump into the deep end. They learn a little bit, like, Oh, you shouldn't be accommodating the OCD. So they're like, well, now I don't know what to do because I was doing something that at least help my child in the, in the moment. But now I'm hearing that that actually makes it worse. And so they start to feel really overwhelmed by the little bit of information they get. So I would say. You know, get some education, whether you read a parent book, or you take a course, or you just watch a bunch of videos, but [00:03:00] like, get some basic foundation of what OCD is because it's going to shift and morph and change and look different. And so understanding, like, lay of the land of like, oh, okay, this is what OCD is. You know, it, it's demanding and it wants me, my child to do or avoid something to get that brief relief. And sometimes that hooks me in and the more they do or avoid that, the bigger it grows, like understanding it would be the first step. Kimberley: So you wrote an amazing workbook called Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids. Let's talk about this term crushing like crushing OCD and that's sort of the title of our episode as well Like do we want that mindset if we're gonna crush it? Like what does that look like? How does that change our mindset? Do we need to really think of it like crushing it? Can you kind of share a little bit more about that mindset shift? Natasha  Yeah. I do use the word crushing a lot. [00:04:00] My courses are all about crushing. My, my book is crushing um, we're not getting rid of. Um, and so. There is a reason why I use crushing versus like overcoming or getting rid of, it is a powerful, kind of aggressive word. And, and I do feel like seeing OCD as kind of like this adversarial thing that you are crushing. Um, 1 can be very therapeutic and empowering for the child, especially when it's externalized and it's personified. So it's this Mr. OCD or this O cloud is us and we're going to crush it. Um, and then physiologically, do see it differently than anxiety. And I think sometimes with anxiety. we talk about, I kind of equate anxiety as like the overreactive lifeguard, and he's trying to, he's trying to look out for you, but just kind of, [00:05:00] he's sending the emergency alarm bells all the time. So maybe he needs some retraining. Maybe we crush him too, but that I think has more flexibility physiologically. Where I feel like OCD is like this foreign thought that's coming into my brain that is so incongruent with who I am, depending on the theme. And there's no part of it that feels like protective or aligned, um, in the way that OCD can show up. And it's very glitchy, you know, and physiologically, a different part of the brain. And it is. It's a, you know, it's more of a glitch versus an overreactive. So I do feel like about crushing it is a good analogy. Kimberley Well, I think too it's OCD can be so powerful and make us feel like we have to kind of like gulp down and, and wither it. Right. And so it does kind of require our kiddos to stand up to it. And I think crushing it [00:06:00] really gives that metaphor of like, we're going to stand up to it. We're going to win. This is like, we're going, you know, it's point systems or something like that. Like who's going to win this baseball match, but we're going to beat it against OCD. So I think that that is really helpful. And I think kids get behind it too, like Kids want to crush things. Natasha: Yeah. And, and they really need to feel empowered because it is so overpowering more than really any other disorder. It is just, it's they're being bombarded with these thoughts and feelings and to, to sit in a storm. And not do what OCD wants you to do a, is a really brave thing to do. And I do feel like kids can really get behind the idea of overcoming and crushing, not overcoming, but crushing it and feeling empowered that they have more strength than OCD does. Kimberley: Okay. So in the workbook, you talk about these fun activities and I have found having my own [00:07:00] children, but also being a clinician, if it's not fun, they're not that interested. What's the payoff really? So, so can you share with us some of the fun activities or ways in which we can start to approach this topic with our kids? Natasha: Yeah, I think anything can be fun and we want our kids to, to have fun and we want to gamify it. So a lot of the workbook talks about One, how to view OCD in a really fun way. So I use a lot of cartoons and a lot of metaphors so they can see it. Um, also talking about incentivizing them and, you know, adding points or bravery points to do, do scary things. And so it becomes kind of this, Gamified version of, of, of crushing their OCD. Kimberley: So bravery points. What does that mean? Natasha: So bravery points can be different for different families. Um, and we use them in my, my house as well for [00:08:00] my own kids with OCD, where we set up kind of like a virtual store. And there are certain things you can have this pretty structured or not structured where you points and, um, you know, kids can do things that OCD will not. Want them to do or do things or not do things that OCD wants them to do, whichever way OCD is working or do exposures they're purposely triggering OCD and then they earn points and they can cash those points in and so Even at my house, you know, my child does not get Roebucks unless he cashes his points in There's like a direct line there. My daughter doesn't get slime from very expensive place, unless she wants to cash her points in. And those are done through steps that are, that's crushing their anxiety and OCD. Kimberley: And so I was actually going to ask this in terms of bravery points. This is not just for kids. This is for teens too. So you might be doing this for like, how might this apply to [00:09:00] teens or do we use bravery reward points for teens as well? Natasha: Yeah. I think it can be used for anyone. I mean, I think even adults can, can gamify their battles with anxiety and OCD. Um, I mean, I've set that up for myself where I've done something that would be really hard. And then I've offered myself incentives, you know, ironically, or not really ironically, but interestingly. Intrinsic incentive does start to happen. You start to get traction. Um, I know for, for the kids that I've worked with in my practice and even my own kids, I've seen the, the pride when they've done something really scary and the relief of like, Oh my gosh, that was not nearly as bad as I thought it was going to be. And then the empowerment. So I kind of want to preface this with. can have these external reinforcers, but they're there to celebrate those brave moves. They're there to make the association of this is really fun, but the internal motivation does start to get some traction down the [00:10:00] road. And so even with teens offer them incentives, and that might look different. I know, um, I've used this example a lot, like for my older daughter, she would net, she would not be driving today. Absolutely not be driving. If it wasn't for me. ordering her Starbucks. And I would just order her Starbucks and I'd be like, okay, it's ordered, you know, you just need to go pick it up. And she, she has social anxiety as well. So she'd like, and she feels bad about spending money. So there was all sorts of things that were actually working in my favor. Cause she felt so bad. She's like, mom, you just ordered it. But I said, I wasn't ready to drive. And I was like, you don't have to pick it up. It'll just be sitting there. It'll just be wastey wastey. And she would go there. I mean, she had three. cycles of driving school before I did this. Natasha: She was well skilled, but I mean, that's a very basic incentive. It was like, I'm going to reward you. Here's an extent, you know, an incentive to go do it. And, you can be creative with teens, [00:11:00] whether it is. I mean, in my practice, I would get like Xbox controls or like one girl wanted a green screen for her YouTube channel. Like, and it was just that weren't like far, far down the road, but little incentives to celebrate and say, you know, you're doing really hard stuff and it doesn't have to be all boring and, and miserable. It can be fun too. Kimberley: Yeah. In our house, it's Taylor Swift records. We're working our way to get every single one of them. Um, right. And, and, and you get them after you, you know, achieve a certain amount of things. So I think I love this. Um, and I think it, it can, again, it can be age dependent. My son is working towards Pokemon cards as well for different things as well. So I love that. Natasha: Yeah. Kimbelrey: So, okay. So bravery rewards. What about, um, The, the other work of treatment and crushing OCD, are there other [00:12:00] fun activities that you have found to be really powerful, whether it's more in how we educate and conceptualize OCD or get them to do the scary thing? Natasha: Yeah. I think you can get creative and really anything that you're doing, uh, exposures can be fun as far as creating things that are triggering the OCD on purpose. They don't always have to be serious and boring. Um, you can create. Fun things, um, you can do interesting exposures, whether you create a game and you're playing games around it, like go fish, but you change the go fish to different names related to what they're struggling with. Or used, like, um, jelly beans, you know, that tastes gross for my child that has, like, metaphobia and issues. And so thinking out of the box, um, in my practice, I would use, like. like two truths and a [00:13:00] lie they had moral OCD. And so we talk about, you know, I'm going to tell you two truths, but one and the, the third one will be a lie and you have to guess which one it is. And that's a fun game in general, uh, but very overwhelming for someone with moral OCD. And so I think sometimes we think it all has to be serious, but there are a lot of creative ways that we can do exposures that. that can make us laugh. And even when we're responding to our kids, and let's say you don't want to feed the OCD. And so, um, let's just use a concrete example. Like if your child has moral or scrupulosity OCD, and they're always saying, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. You know, repetitively, that's kind of a compulsive thing and you know that you're not going to feed it. And so you come up with a plan of, I'm not going to accept your sorry. You can even do something silly with that, um, and I've had parents who like, they would say it in a different accent or they would sing it or they'd say, you know, sarcastically, I'm sorry. [00:14:00] You're sorry is not accepted or, you know, like you can, you can even come up with fun, sarcastic things in your response to OCD as long as you're partnering with your child. Kimberley: Tell me about the partnering though, right? So in an example of where you're like, you know, let's say you use your most funny Donald Duck accent, um, in saying, I don't, I don't want to, you're sorry. Um, um, You know, how, how, what if that doesn't feel like partnering to them? What if that feels like, you know, uh, like a, a betrayal to them or they, they're very invested in getting that compulsion done? What would you suggest? Natasha: Yeah. You definitely want to collaborate with your child first and say, you know, I know either they bring it to you or you bring it to them. Like I noticed that when you say this, it's actually your OCD saying that to me. And because I love you, I'm not going to give what OCD wants [00:15:00] anymore. So prefacing it with, I'm noticing that this is a compulsion that I'm part of, and I'm, I love you. And so I'm not going to be part of that compulsion. And can respond in these ways, how would you like me to be, or how do you, how would you like me to respond so you can partner if they can come up with a creative way? Um, like, for instance, in my case with my son, he said, tell me, say, I'm sorry, is not accepted. Like, he literally scripted it for me. when I said it in the moment, he wasn't happy with that because then he was panicking and he was feeling overwhelmed. And so he, I don't like when you say that, but that was our agreement. Um, I might pivot in that moment if he's looking really overwhelmed and I might not say anything because maybe it's not a time to be funny or maybe poking back in a really aggressive way isn't being well received in that moment, but that doesn't mean I'm going to feed the OCD. Okay. you might have a child that doesn't want to partner with you that says, I want you to do this and this makes me feel better. And [00:16:00] why are you being mean? Um, and in that case, humor is not appropriate. You know, you're not going to use humor. You might just say, well, I love you. And so I'm not going to respond and you let them know you're going to respond, but the humor part, if we're the only ones laughing, then it's not really funny. So we have to be very careful about that. Kimberley: Yeah. So, and I mean, it's true that crushing OCD or any, you know, mental health disorder is like a family affair. And so as a, as a parent, What is the training for them in this sort of idea of crushing it and making it fun? What, what personal work would you recommend they do, um, on their own in their own therapy, whether they're with a parenting coach or a therapist or with each other as partners, what would you suggest a parent do to prep for this [00:17:00] sort of marathon that we're on? Natasha: It's a great question because there is so much parenting work that, that needs to be done because it's our journey too. And so I feel like the parent journey is unique in and of itself, you know, raising a child with OCD Um, it's not for the faint hearted. So learning, how do you sit in discomfort when your child is sitting in discomfort? you handle your child being triggered and not swooping in and doing what your child's OCD wants? hard to, to be a witness to your child's struggles, to know that in the short term, you can do something. Some of the time. appeases the OCD, but then grows it long term. And so, um, getting your own support or finding your own way to ground or your own coping skills of how do you handle that when you're, when the child's OCD is having a tantrum. Um, and it will try to kind of break you down so that you [00:18:00] give in so that there's work in that area. I think also, how do we handle our own, how do we handle our own mental health when our child is having mental health issues? Because We are not a blank slate. We come with a lens and that lens has our own childhood. It has our own experiences, has our own mental health issues. And and so we're seeing our child's mental health issues through our lens no one can have a clear lens, but to have some awareness of I'm bringing this to the table, When my child does this, it triggers this for me, which is actually not about my child, but that's about my dad, or that's about my childhood experience. And how do I work through that so that it's not impeding how I'm my child. I'm not dealing with that. Yeah. Kimberley: Yeah, for sure. What's, what's interesting for me. is I was thinking about this about parenting in general is [00:19:00] sometimes I parent the way my parents parented without even Questioning. Is that the way I want to parent like it'd be sometimes I'll catch myself Parenting my child in the way my parents was when I'm like didn't help me like that wasn't helpful You know what? I mean? And and it's so automatic. It really takes slowing down and being like wait I'm What did I need during that time? How can I be that for my child? It's so automatic sometimes. And I think that, um, so many parents, I mean, I wish we were given a manual, but like, it's a lot of emotional regulation work of our own to sit while your child is struggling. Um, especially with anxiety, cause you know, we just, it's so easy to fix it by giving them the compulsion or. You know, so I really feel for the parents that I, you know, that we treat in that it's so much emotional regulation. Would there be a specific [00:20:00] set of tools that you would give them or do you think it's very much dependent on the person? Natasha: I think it's dependent on the person as far as what they're bringing. What they're bringing in the moment. Um, but I do talk about lovingly detach and, and a lot of times parents hear that and they get concerned because they think detachment means that I'm not present for my child. And it's actually the opposite to me. It's like, how can I be? 99 percent or 95 percent there for my child. I'm like, I'm an anchor for them and I'm not bringing anything to the equation. Kimberley: Yeah, Natasha: And that is hard. And a lot of it actually is this. It may seem really weird, but I feel like a lot of it is building up your skills. Through like mindfulness, you know, how do I stay in the moment? I'm only eating this food. I'm only petting my dog and that training like that mental training of your brain of like being Literally only in the [00:21:00] moment and learning how to fine tune that is actually a great survival tool because I find that When I'm in the moment with my kids and I have been working on that muscle in my brain, I'm able to not see as much through that lens of my own childhood or my own triggers. And I'm just like, what does she need from me right now? And that's the question I always tell parents to ask. What do they need from me right now? Like, what is my job in this moment right now? And sometimes it is to ignore them because I know with my daughter, at least, she doesn't like the attention of anxiety. Like when I can tell clearly she's having an anxiety attack, she doesn't want me to hover. And that's really hard because. Inside, you're feeling really anxious about it, but you know that your anxiety or your, your energy is contagious. And so yourself and be like, in this moment, she needs me to go, you know, about the morning routine and just act like nothing's happening. Or it might be the opposite for your child, right? But knowing it's not about us, what do they need in [00:22:00] that moment? Um, and that is a powerful skill that has to be, it's a daily practice. Kimberley: and different for each kid. Natasha: Right. Vastly Kimberley: Yeah, Natasha: Yeah. Kimberley: where it gets complicated. I think he's like because you know, we go Okay, this is the way we do it This is how we do it from now on and then you have another kid and you're like wait that doesn't work for them Natasha: Yup. Kimberley: let's shift it up and let's change it I'm wondering if we, you can quickly speak to a couple of emotions that I know show up with parents, you know, cause again, it's as much the parent game as it is the kids game. So where as clinicians and as parents, where they're to really champion our kids to ride the wave of discomfort and to use their skills and to manage it. What about for the parent they might be experiencing? I know a lot of parents report. anger that shows up at the, you know, when their kid isn't [00:23:00] using their skills and so forth. Um, do you have any, any advice to them when anger does show up or frustration? Yeah. Yeah. And Natasha: being angry then we're like, Oh, I responded angrily or I'm feeling frustrated and I shouldn't. And being accepting of the fact that it's okay, it's normal for me to feel angry. This is a frustrating situation and I want to change it and I want to steer the ship and I can't. Yup. You know, my child's not picking up their part. And so I think just validating that anger, um, which I can be, I think can be sometimes hard because we want to. Kind of we feel guilty about the anger, but then understanding where it's coming from and and again going inward There's so much inward work I think when you're raising a child with anxiety and OCD because it brings out all sorts of stuff for us So asking oh, it's interesting that I'm angry or that made me really [00:24:00] angry or sometimes I'll even say to myself like in my head like Natasha, that was like a huge response. why did you blow up so big on that? That was more than what was actually just happening then. And then do some self diving of like, what was that about it? Oh, that reminded me of this. Or I feel like I'm doing 99 percent of this and he's doing 1%. And what do we, what can we control? And so maybe if I'm feeling that way, then it's a shift of, to pull back. If I'm feeling like I'm doing 99 percent and that's making me angry. I can't control the pace of my child and their ability to use their skills because that's their journey, but I can control invested I am. And so if I'm doing 99 percent of this, then I'm going to pull back a little bit give, you know, invite them to meet me more in the middle. Kimberley: often I find under the fear is, I mean, so under the anger is the fear that we're going to be managing this for a while, or, you know, the parents grief [00:25:00] of This is interrupted the family system. So I think it's so normal. Um, I agree with you just to normalize that as a normal part of parenting, a kiddo who's struggling. Um, yeah. Okay. So in terms of getting that kid across the finish line or setting them up better things like setting them up for success, is there anything that you would tell the parents? as a mindset shift, like, you know, again, this is a marathon, not a sprint. What would you tell them in terms of the whole family system? How, what are skills and tools that they can be using to help set up a system or a family that can help this child crush OCD? Natasha: Yeah. I think mindset's really important because a lot of times is a perception of, I need to cure this, you know, or we need to get the skills and that they can overcome this and OCD is a chronic [00:26:00] condition. so we're wired, you know, if we're going to have anxiety or OCD, that this is going to pop up possibly in our life periodically. yeah, Yeah. So instead of thinking, like, how do I, you know, get rid of this cold or give them the skills and then we've we're done with this because that sets you and your child up for failure. I think having an idea of I'm going to create a home a family culture where we. Where we know we have the skills. We know what OCD is. We know how to identify it. Um, we live a life of exposures. We live a life of doing brave things. we talk about it and it doesn't have to be, I mean, I think once you're in maintenance, and you've really kind of. Learned all the skills that you have learned. I mean, we live in my house. It's a, it's a culture of anxiety. And OCD is kind of just part of our family culture. Like we do scary things or my kids might say that was an exposure or they earn points periodically. And so developing that in your, in your family as a system of like, just part of [00:27:00] your family, just the way your family functions and it works can be really helpful. And there's, there's, Brave things that anyone in the family can do. And so it can be a family affair where I had to go present at work and I didn't really want to present, you know, but I did it. It was really brave. And so using those analogy, using those examples, I think can be really. Normalizing for the child with with OCD. Kimberley: Yeah. So even, even for the non OCD kiddos, you would use that in terms of if they had to do a violin recital or a math. a national math test or that kind of thing. Natasha: Yeah, I mean, I think it can go way beyond OCD. It's how to build resilience because really at the crux of OCD is resilience. It's how to sit with discomfort, how to sit with uncertainty of not being 100 percent of something how to how to deal with something that feels uncomfortable and do it anyway. And so those are those are resiliency [00:28:00] tools that anyone Kimberley: Yeah. And it's such a great mind shift for everyone because parents are doing exposures. They are doing scary things by not accommodating their child as well. That's an exposure for a parent pretty well. Um, so you can conceptualize it that way. I love that. Yeah. Um, What does it look like? I love that you also mentioned in terms of like this is a long term thing. Like this is just a family culture thing. This is how we exist in the world. What does it look long term though? You know, do we do, I've had so many parents say to me, I don't want to give, but you know, the, the, um, The bravery points forever. I don't want to over saturate extrinsic motivation. Like, do you have any thoughts on that in terms of long term use of that method? Natasha: mean, it depends on your child's age and like where they are as far as building up skills. we have it in the background because I don't, [00:29:00] I don't give my kids money for chores, I don't. And so it's just been part of our thing where if they want, I guess what they would call in the UK pocket money, you know, if they want, they want spending money. In general, that really works for me for them to do brave things in general. Um, and so that is just part of the way that we have that now, my 20 year old's not earning like bravery points, you know, across, you know, state lines in California where she's in college, you know, but she's, she's, doing that lifestyle. And so I don't feel like you necessarily have to have these systems or incentives. Um, you might hit a bump and you might say, you want to earn something to overcome this thing that you're working on. Um, you know, a new struggle that they're having. So you might pull it out periodically for me. I don't want I'm like, I'm trying to teach my kids the idea of earning in general. And so it kind of. Fits well, because it's like, [00:30:00] you're not going to get things for free. And then there's this pride of like, oh, I earned that. Or let me work really hard at something. So you can get very ambiguous about it. You can have it be of just kind of your, your regular family incentives and how you're doing it, or you don't do it at all. I mean, It does eventually, um, get stale and so you have to either change it up or you take a break from it or your child is motivated by intrinsic motivation that they're feeling really great that they're able to go to school again or sleep on their own or do the things that were overwhelming for them. Kimberley: Right. Exactly. Yeah. I think that's the beauty is once you've done some exposures, you see that it works. There's a buy in. Um, but that buy in is hard at the beginning, which is why you do have to make it fun. And sometimes you do have to have it be sort of outside motivators to get you there. Yeah. Excellent. So, um, tell me about [00:31:00] your workbook where people can get it, where people can hear about you. Um, cause I know you have so many awesome resources. Natasha: Yeah. Well, I wrote, um, OCD workbook for kids because I wanted people to be able to have a book that was very simplistic that would walk them through basically what I would do in a therapy session, or therapy sessions. And so it just kind of walks them through OCD treatment. So it could be a great supplement to therapy. It could be great for a therapist to use, but it can also be a great standalone. Um, and it's meant for kids to be able to do either on their own or navigate with a parent depending on their age. And starts off with educating them on what is OCD because I told you, I feel like that's so important. Many disguises of OCD, um, normalizing it all the way to understanding how OCD works and then offense and defense about if OCD is knocking versus [00:32:00] knocking on OCD. How to do exposures at home and then how to, how to maintain that. And I also touch on like self esteem as well, because I feel like. OCD can really hurt the self esteem. So there's a little bit of empowerment and self identity in there as well. Kimberley: So important too. OCD can be mean, right? So, and knock people down. So I love that you're talking about that. And where can people find out more about you? Natasha: Um, well they can get the book on Amazon. They can find anything about me at my website at at parenting survival school. com. I mean, nope. At parenting survival, at parenting survival. com too many websites. Kimberley: No, I understand. I'm in the same boat. Well, thank you so much for coming on and talking about crushing OCD with kids. Is there anything you would leave parents and children with a little bit of inspiration or? One last point that you think that you really [00:33:00] want them to know. Natasha: Well, I think there's always hope. I mean, I have seen kids in very acute stages of struggling with OCD and I have seen kids make such big project progress. So there is always hope. And our kids are more than our, their OCD and kids with OCD tend to be the most, of the most compassionate, kindhearted, out of the box thinkers. And, and so I wouldn't even trade that with my own kids because I feel like the, the positive personality traits that, are underneath all those struggles are, are beautiful. So Kimberley: Yeah. Natasha: that's important to do. Track 1: And, and I think from, from my experience is nurture those parts that are not OCD, like what are their hobbies? How can we really build a life around OCD in terms of, you know, the instruments and the hobbies and the talents and the sports and the, you know, the community and that. So forth. So yeah, thank you so much Natasha for coming on. I am so I [00:34:00] love, I love your book. Thank you for writing it. I know writing a book is no easy feat. So congratulations on your book. Um, and I'm excited because you've got more on the, on the coming down the pipeline. I know you have a memoir coming out, so we'll be having you back on later in the year. Natasha: appreciate that. Thanks.

Did you know that OCD affects up to 3% of adolescents in the United States?  That's roughly one in every 30 teens. While OCD can manifest in various ways, the constant worry and intrusive thoughts it generates can be incredibly difficult for teenagers to navigate. And let's be honest, parents often worry they're not doing enough to help their teens overcome OCD. That's why I'm thrilled to have Natasha Daniels join us today. Natasha has been an anxiety & OCD therapist for over two decades. She combines both her clinical expertise with her lived experience, raising her own three kids with anxiety and OCD. She is the creator of the website AT Parenting Survival, As well as the host of the show AT Parenting Survival Podcast and the Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist.  Feeling lost in the sea of parenting advice? Wish you had a supportive community to navigate the ups and downs of raising happy, thriving teens? **Introducing Thriving Parent Academy! ** This online community equips YOU with the tools and knowledge to: ⭐ Foster strong parent-teen relationships ⭐Set clear boundaries and expectations ⭐ Navigate attitude and meltdowns with confidence ⭐ Raise kind, responsible humans   Join our amazing community of parents and: ⭐ Connect with like-minded individuals who "get it" ⭐ Learn from me through exclusive laser coaching sessions and master classes ⭐ Get personalized support and guidance tailored to your unique needs Stop feeling overwhelmed and start thriving! Limited spots available! Enroll now at thrivingparent.org. P.S. Share with any parent friends who might benefit!

SHINING WITH ADHD  EPISODE #149: Understanding Obsessive Compulsive Disorder and ADHD with Therapist Natasha Daniels 3/27/2024 SUMMARY In our culture, we hear the term “OCD” thrown around a lot. “I'm so OCD about…” While this isn't intended for harm, it does foster confusion about what it really means to have Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. It's far more nuanced than the common idea of constant hand-washing or organization. OCD can be common in kids with ADHD, so in today's episode, we talk with OCD therapist Natasha Daniels to hear from her 20+ years of experience with treating OCD. From understanding the diagnosis to getting the right treatment, Natasha shares what every parent needs to know to support their kids.  MEET NATASHA Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD therapist with over two decades of experience. She combines both her clinical expertise with her lived experience, raising her own three kids with anxiety and OCD.  She is the author of several books, including Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, How to Parent Your Anxious Toddler, Social Skills Activities for Kids, It's Brave to Be Kind, and The Grief Rock. She is the creator of the website AT Parenting Survival, as well as the host of the show AT Parenting Survival Podcast and the YouTube channel Ask the Child Therapist. Her work has been featured in various places, including Huffington Post, Scary Mommy, PsychCentral, The Child Mind Institute, and The Mighty. OFFERS AND AFFILIATE INFORMATION Creating Calm is a video-based course that will teach you simple, step-by-step strategies to help you parent a happy and independent child with ADHD (ages 4-12 years old). Whenever and wherever you have an internet connection. Use the code PODCAST for 10% off!   Hungryroot offers “good-for-you groceries and simple recipes.” We have loved having one less thing to worry about when it comes to raising kids. As always, we want to help you, so we've got a code for 40% off your first box.  Just click the link and use CHILDHOODCOLLECTIVE40 in all caps to get the discount.    We LOVE the Zenimal. It's amazing for kids who are feeling anxious or need a little help calming their busy body before bed. The best part? Each meditation ends with the most beautiful message: “You're a good kid!” Use our code: TCC for a discount. LINKS + RESOURCES Episode 149 Transcript Natasha's Instagram OCD Courses for Families Creating Calm - Code PODCAST Hungry Root - Code CHILDHOODCOLLECTIVE40 Zenimal - Code TCC The Childhood Collective YouTube *Closed Captioning Available The Childhood Collective Instagram Have a question or want to share some thoughts? Shoot us an email at hello@thechildhoodcollective.com  

It's been a while since we've talked about OCD on the show, so when anxiety and OCD expert Natasha Daniels reached out about her new book, Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids, I was excited to get into it all and pulled together a lot of questions ready to make this conversation as helpful as possible for our community. You may know Natasha from her popular AT Survival Parenting podcast, or some of her other books like Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, How to Parent Your Anxious Toddler, Social Skills Activities for Kids, andIt's Brave to Be Kind, or from her past visit to this show. She has more than two decades of experience as a child therapist, and combines her clinical expertise with her lived experience in her work, as she's raising her three kids with anxiety and OCD. You also may have seen her work featured in places like Huffington Post, Scary Mommy, PsychCentral, The Child Mind Institute and The Mighty. So for today's conversation, I wanted to do a deep dive into OCD and learn more about what it is, how it manifests, signs of OCD that might be missed by parents, how to tease out when something is OCD versus anxiety or ADHD or other types of neurodivergence, and lastly, how parents can support their children if they have OCD. And of course, Natasha shared some insights and tools from her new Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids, which is truly a powerful, and easy-to-use resource for any child navigating OCD and the challenges that come along with it.   About Natasha Daniels Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD child therapist with over two decades of experience. She combines both her clinical expertise with her lived experience, raising her own three kids with anxiety and OCD. She is the author of several books including Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, How to Parent Your Anxious Toddler, Social Skills Activities for Kids, It's Brave to Be Kind, The Grief Rock, and Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids. She is the creator of the website AT Parenting Survival, As well as the host of the show AT Parenting Survival Podcast and the Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist. Her work has been featured in various places including Huffington Post, Scary Mommy, PsychCentral, The Child Mind Institute and The Mighty.   Things you'll learn from this episode How OCD begins and manifests in children What intrusive thoughts or feelings are and how they can lead to compulsions Why OCD is often misdiagnosed as ADHD, anxiety, or self-harm and why it's important to receive an accurate diagnosis What exposure response prevention (ERP) therapy is and how it supports individuals with OCD What OCD with support looks like over time with helpful treatment and the development of coping skills The importance of early intervention in supporting children with OCD How Natasha's book Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids provides evidence-based tools and strategies to help children understand and manage their OCD   Resources mentioned for Unmasking Autism Natasha Daniels' website Crushing OCD Workbook for Kids: 50 Fun Activities to Overcome OCD With CBT and Exposures by Natasha Daniels Natasha Daniels Talks about Anxiety and OCD in Kids (Tilt Parenting Podcast) AT Parenting Podcast AT Parenting Survival Online Courses AT Parenting survival on Instagram AT Parenting survival on Youtube Filmmaker Chris Baier Helps Families Get Unstuck from OCD (Tilt Parenting Podcast) UNSTUCK: An OCD Kids Movie (Available with Spanish, French, Russian, Greek, Portuguese subtitles and an audio description) Help for Childhood Anxiety and OCD with Dr. Eli Leibowitz (Tilt Parenting Podcast) Space Treatment website   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

An estimated 6 million children in the US will experience the death of a parent or sibling by age 18. Natasha Daniels, mother, child therapist and author of "The Grief Rock", shares her expertise this week on 411 teen.

OCD can manifest itself in different ways with different obsessions and focus that are going on in your life. Children's author, Marin Canaday describes OCD feeling like a monster devouring your emotions and feelings, where you could get to the point where you feel out of control and you begin to believe the lies the OCD obsessions tell you about yourself. Marin joins me today in this episode and we discuss some of the following areas: Marin discusses how the idea for her book, My Little Monster came aboutDoubting yourself and OCDContamination and germs and OCDReligion and OCDHarm and OCD Hiding symptoms and coping strategiesGetting diagnosedHow Marin likes to rest and relaxAbout The Guest - Marin CanadayMarin grew up with OCD from an early age, although she was not sure what it was that she struggled with until her 30's. A lot of her struggle was internal. As a child, she found that studying and sports helped take my mind off of the OCD thought patterns. When she studied or played a sport, she felt like she had a brain break, so she threw herself into both with vigor. Her study habits paid off, and Marin graduated in the top of her classes in both high school and college. She also went on to play collegiate volleyball, earning All American honors in her senior year. Her struggle with OCD really became more evident externally when she reached adulthood. Without studying or sports to hide in any longer, she came face to face with her anxiety disorder. She couldn't eat, sleep, or function in day-to-day tasks. Marin's struggles with her thoughts were all that she could fight all day and night. It was grueling.Today, with therapy and medication to help, she is much healthier and confident. Marin writes in her free time to inspire others who may be struggling with anxiety as well. She is the the author of two books, My Little Monster and The Very Best Me. Her OCD still whispers to her and at times begins to shout. She finds relief in gardening, crafting, reading, and writing.Website - www.mylittleocdmonster.comFacebook - My Little OCD Monster https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100090423289366Resources mentioned: Marin has two books, My Little Monster and The Very Best Me.Dr. Dawn Huebner - https://www.dawnhuebnerphd.com/Natasha Daniels - https://www.anxioustoddlers.com/When a Family Member has OCD by John Hershfield, MFT. About The Host - Janine HalloranJanine Halloran is a Licensed Mental Health Counselor, an author, a speaker, an entrepreneur and a mom. As a Licensed Mental Health Counselor, Janine has been working primarily with children, adolescents, and their families for over 20 years. She is the Founder of 'Coping Skills for Kids', where she creates products and resources to help kids learn to cope with their feelings in safe and healthy ways. Janine also founded 'Encourage Play' which dedicated to helping kids learn and practice social skills in the most natural way - through play! If you're interested in learning more about how to teach kids coping skills, download your free Coping Skills Toolkit:https://copingskillsforkids.com/newsletterIf you're interested in joining the Coping Skills Community Hub, an ever-expanding resource library and community of families and professionals teaching kids how to cope, learn more at https://copingskillsforkids.com/hubIf you'd like to purchase Janine's products, including the Coping Skills for Kids Workbook, Coping Skills for Teens Workbook, Social Skills for Kids Workbook, Coping Cue Cards, and more, visit https://store.copingskillsforkids.com or https://amazon.com/copingskillsforkidsConnect with Janine on Social Media Instagram: @copingskillsforkids Facebook: facebook.com/copingskillsforkids and facebook.com/encourageplayYoutube: https://www.youtube.com/c/JanineHalloranEncouragePlay

It was a pleasure to have Natasha Daniels as a return guest on this podcast to talk about her new book Crushing OCD: Workbook Kids.  This book is going to be an excellent resource for families and therapists trying to help children with OCD. One of strengths of this book is that it lays out in very digestible units the sequence of steps needed in order to "crush OCD". It is also no small feat the language in this book is very child friendly but always respectful.  https://hillchildcounseling.com/ https://atparentingsurvivalschool.com/p/difficult-behaviors

EP361. Natasha Daniels is a child therapist who specializes in anxiety and OCD. She founded ATParentingCommuity.com where she has helped over 8 million parents since 2015. Natasha's 42-year-old husband passed away suddenly and she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Inspired by conversations with her own grieving children, Natasha wrote The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love. In this episode she tells us about her family's experience with grief and she gives us insight into child anxiety and OCD. RENEE REINA www.themomroom.com Instagram: @themomroompodcast | @thereneereina TikTok: @thereneereina Facebook Community Youtube: Renee Reina- The Mom Room Podcast NATASHA DANIELS @atparentingsurvival SPONSORS Little Spoon Earth Breeze Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

One in twelve children will lose a parent or sibling by the time they reach age 18. Experiencing grief of this kind is unbearable at any age, but in children it can present differently and may require more of a tailored approach. We speak with child therapist Natasha Daniels to get a better understanding of this emotion and how there can be different variations of grief depending on the severity of the life event. Learn More: https://viewpointsradio.org/is-there-a-right-way-to-grieve-parenting-picking-up-the-pieces-after-loss Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The death of a parent, sibling, or other important person in a child's life is one of the most frequently reported disruptive childhood experiences…and without appropriate support, can lead to adverse health and welfare outcomes. When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. They had to learn how to navigate in a world that felt upside down. Inspired by conversations with her own grieving children, Natasha Daniels wrote The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love. The Grief Rock goes beyond the surface platitudes that many other children's grief books provide and offers validation of the physical and social implications one often experiences with grief. It also helps children understand that often our grief is so big because our love is so big.

Natasha Daniels is an anxiety and OCD child therapist and has published multiple books including How to Parent your Anxious Toddler, Anxiety Sucks: A Teen Survival Guide, Social Skills Activities for Kids and It is Brave to Be Kind. She also hosts the AT Parenting Survival Podcast and has a Youtube channel, Ask the Child Therapist. She joined me on Uncorking a Story to talk about her latest book, The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love. Key Takeaways Processing Grief: The discussion centered on how to help children process grief, especially when the person assisting them is simultaneously dealing with their own grief. Writing as Therapy: Natasha turned to writing after the sudden passing of her husband, which left her widowed with three young children who were each expressing their grief in unique ways. Silver Linings: The conversation revealed that Natasha has a strong focus on her relationship with her children and her parenting, emphasizing the importance of not getting lost in the details of life and appreciating every moment: Grief can lead to a greater appreciation for life, as it makes you realize that tomorrows are not guaranteed. Grief can bring families closer together, as it did for Natasha and her children, strengthening their bond. Experiencing grief can lead to significant lifestyle changes that prioritize family and personal well-being, such as closing a private practice to focus on more flexible work that allows for traveling and spending quality time together.  It can inspire personal growth and new experiences, like traveling to different parts of the world, which might not have been considered before the experience of loss. Buy The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love Amazon: https://amzn.to/40ztEQs Bookshop.org: https://bookshop.org/a/54587/9781839974397 Connect with Natasha Website: https://www.anxioustoddlers.com/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/anxioustoddlers78 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/atparentingsurvival Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/atparentingsurvival Twitter: https://twitter.com/gingerpin TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@atparentingsurvival Connect with Mike Website: https://uncorkingastory.com/ Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCSvS4fuG3L1JMZeOyHvfk_g Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/uncorkingastory/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@uncorkingastory Twitter: https://twitter.com/uncorkingastory Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/uncorkingastory LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/uncorking-a-story/ If you like this episode, please share it with a friend. If you have not done so already, please rate and review Uncorking a Story on Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Some six million children in the U.S. will experience the death of a parent or sibling by the age of 18. Their grief is personal and not widely understood by those around them. When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. Inspired by conversations with her own grieving children, child therapist Natasha Daniels wrote The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love. Natasha Daniel was on The Spark Tuesday, who described what she and her children went through when her husband and their father died suddenly,"It really was like a boulder came and cracked our foundation. I never realized that, physiologically, grief really impacts your body and brain. And so it's like everything shuts down. I couldn't really communicate. I really couldn't speak, I couldn't read, I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep. My kids were having their mini versions of this. You just feel like you kind of woke up and everything looks the same. But it's all in a foreign language." Daniel said her three kids grieved differently,"My youngest -- she sobbed. It was so hard to adjust. Hold that space for her because I feel like I was like literally in shock. And so, just her sobbing was exhausting. And my son was quiet, like, everything was fine, like he didn't want to rock the boat. Everything's fine. And my older daughter became very parental very quickly. At 18, she kind of just swooped in and was very concerned about me. And I had to kind of let her know that she doesn't need to be a parent." What does she want parents of grieving kids to know? "This is what grief can feel like, and it's normal. It's going to feel horrible, but it's normal and you're not alone. So I think the first step is validating that and letting them know what the experience of grief may feel like for them."Support WITF: https://www.witf.org/support/give-now/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

The death of a parent, sibling, or other important person in a child's life is one of the most frequently reported disruptive childhood experiences…and without appropriate support, can lead to adverse health and welfare outcomes. When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. They had to learn how to navigate in a world that felt upside down. Inspired by conversations with her own grieving children, Natasha Daniels wrote The Grief Rock: A Book to Understand Grief and Love. The Grief Rock goes beyond the surface platitudes that many other children's grief books provide and offers validation of the physical and social implications one often experiences with grief. It also helps children understand that often our grief is so big because our love is so big.

Kathryn interviews Author Connie McReynolds PhD.So your child has been on Ritalin or one of the other ADHD drugs -- and you're thinking perhaps even possibly for life. Or maybe your youngster has been diagnosed, but no amount of school behavioral therapy or special education is easing your child's struggle. Until now, the interventions that have been proposed for children who are diagnosed with some aspect of ADHD have failed to get to the root cause of ADHD. In other words, doctors, psychologists, administrators, teachers and parents are treating symptoms, but not the cause. According to Connie McReynolds PhD, the real cause of ADHD is that a child's brain has auditory and visual processing shortcomings. That's not a hearing or seeing issue—it's that the brain cannot fully hold or interpret the information coming in. She is a licensed psychologist, professor certified rehabilitation counselor, and podcast host of Roadmap to the Brain.Kathryn also interviews Author Natasha Daniels.When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. They had to learn how to navigate in a world that felt upside down. Daniels goes beyond the surface platitudes that many other children's grief books provide and offers validation of the physical and social implications one often experiences with grief. It also helps children understand that often our grief is so big because our love is so big. She is an anxiety and OCD child therapist. She also hosts the AT Parenting Survival Podcast and has a Youtube Channel, Ask The Child Therapist.

Kathryn interviews Author Connie McReynolds PhD.So your child has been on Ritalin or one of the other ADHD drugs -- and you're thinking perhaps even possibly for life. Or maybe your youngster has been diagnosed, but no amount of school behavioral therapy or special education is easing your child's struggle. Until now, the interventions that have been proposed for children who are diagnosed with some aspect of ADHD have failed to get to the root cause of ADHD. In other words, doctors, psychologists, administrators, teachers and parents are treating symptoms, but not the cause. According to Connie McReynolds PhD, the real cause of ADHD is that a child's brain has auditory and visual processing shortcomings. That's not a hearing or seeing issue—it's that the brain cannot fully hold or interpret the information coming in. She is a licensed psychologist, professor certified rehabilitation counselor, and podcast host of Roadmap to the Brain.Kathryn also interviews Author Natasha Daniels.When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. They had to learn how to navigate in a world that felt upside down. Daniels goes beyond the surface platitudes that many other children's grief books provide and offers validation of the physical and social implications one often experiences with grief. It also helps children understand that often our grief is so big because our love is so big. She is an anxiety and OCD child therapist. She also hosts the AT Parenting Survival Podcast and has a Youtube Channel, Ask The Child Therapist.

Kathryn interviews Author Connie McReynolds PhD.So your child has been on Ritalin or one of the other ADHD drugs -- and you're thinking perhaps even possibly for life. Or maybe your youngster has been diagnosed, but no amount of school behavioral therapy or special education is easing your child's struggle. Until now, the interventions that have been proposed for children who are diagnosed with some aspect of ADHD have failed to get to the root cause of ADHD. In other words, doctors, psychologists, administrators, teachers and parents are treating symptoms, but not the cause. According to Connie McReynolds PhD, the real cause of ADHD is that a child's brain has auditory and visual processing shortcomings. That's not a hearing or seeing issue—it's that the brain cannot fully hold or interpret the information coming in. She is a licensed psychologist, professor certified rehabilitation counselor, and podcast host of Roadmap to the Brain.Kathryn also interviews Author Natasha Daniels.When Natasha Daniel's healthy 42-year-old husband suddenly died of a blood clot, she and her three children were thrown into the darkness of grief. Her children experienced difficulty eating, sleeping, and focusing. People treated them differently and they lost some friends. They had to learn how to navigate in a world that felt upside down. Daniels goes beyond the surface platitudes that many other children's grief books provide and offers validation of the physical and social implications one often experiences with grief. It also helps children understand that often our grief is so big because our love is so big. She is an anxiety and OCD child therapist. She also hosts the AT Parenting Survival Podcast and has a Youtube Channel, Ask The Child Therapist.

EPISODE 32: In the Calm the Chaos corner of the internet, we're talking about raising out-of-the-box kids, the ones who don't fit the usual mold and sometimes act in ways that make us worry. But there's one challenge that many parents face, yet it hardly gets talked about.That's why I've decided to dive into that big three-letter topic in this ep - OCD.And I've got the perfect guest to help us understand it. I'm super pumped to welcome Natasha Daniels, an anxiety and OCD therapist with over two decades of experience. She's got the know-how from her professional life and personal insight from raising three kids with anxiety and OCD. Being in the trenches both as a parent and a professional makes her super passionate about this.Natasha offers in-depth support to thousands of parents raising kids with anxiety or OCD through her books, courses at the AT Parenting Survival Online School, and her online membership in the AT Parenting Community. She's also the host of the AT Parenting Survival Podcast. So, if you are concerned or already know that your child (or a child you care about) has OCD, tune in to this episode. We'll dive into all things OCD – what it really means, how it shows up, and the signs to look out for. Natasha will also share insights on how to support and work with kids dealing with OCD.Join us, and let's crush OCD together!Key Takeaways:Intro (00:00)Who is Natasha Daniels? (01:05)What is OCD, and how does it work? (02:24)Mindset changes parents need to help kids with OCD (05:07)How to talk about OCD with your kids without giving in to it (06:46)Separating OCD from kid's identity (10:44)Does OCD ever fully go away? (14:13)Top tools to help parents and kids crush OCD (16:43)A quick advice for parents worried that their child has OCD (19:29)Natasha's resources for parents worried about their kid's OCD (20:57)Additional resources:The AT Parenting Survival Online School The AT Parenting Survival website The AT Parenting Survival Podcast Natasha's YouTube channel - - - 

Anxiety and OCD can be dehabilitating for anyone to live with - so how do we care for children facing these struggles so early in life? Natasha Daniels, founder of AT Parenting Survival (anxioustoddlers.com), has been both guiding parents on this journey as an Anxiety and OCD Child Therapist, and walking the road herself as a mother of three children with anxiety and OCD. Her unique blend of training and experience has showed her what is helpful, how to be an advocate, and how to see your child as more than just their struggles. 

Rachel Kapp, M.Ed., BCET, and Stephanie Pitts, M.Ed., BCET welcome back Anxiety Expert and OCD Child Therapist Natasha Daniels to the podcast. Today they dig into how anxiety and OCD impacts learning and school. Natasha shares how OCD can be missed in school or misinterpreted as a learning disorder and shares what teachers need to know about OCD. She further discusses what teachers can look out for in learners with OCD, and she shares what the impact of reassurance is on anxiety versus OCD. She also shares the unique benefits of a 504 and how to figure out which accommodations would work best for your learner.  Connect with Natasha Daniels Support us on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/learnsmarterpodcast How to connect with us: Join our e-mail list Rachel's Kapp Educational Therapy Group website Steph's My Ed Therapist website  @learnsmarterpodcast, @kappedtherapy, @myedtherapist Other episodes mentioned: Ep 251: Understanding OCD and Anxiety with Natasha Daniels (Part 1)

If you have a child with OCD, Natasha Daniels is a resource you want to know about. She has a variety of online course such as "How to Teach Your Kids to Crush OCD" and "Crushing OCD Classs for Kids & Teens" and actually much more.  She can be found at natashadaniels.com

Rachel Kapp, M.Ed., BCET, and Stephanie Pitts, M.Ed., BCET welcome Anxiety Expert and OCD Child Therapist Natasha Daniels to the podcast. They chat about how people misunderstand OCD and what the true definition of OCD is. Natasha digs into the different types of OCD and how they play into each other. She shares about how personification of OCD and how it can help. They dig into a conversation about the difference between perfectionism and OCD and their overlap. She shares her thoughts on anxiety and how to talk about it with kids. She further digs into anxiety and OCD and gives concrete examples of OCD red flags. Connect with Natasha Daniels Support us on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/learnsmarterpodcast How to connect with us: Join our FB Group Join our e-mail list Rachel's Kapp Educational Therapy Group website Steph's My Ed Therapist website  @learnsmarterpodcast, @kappedtherapy, @myedtherapist

SUMMARY:  How to include family members in ocd treatment Supporting siblings during ocd treatment  How to apply the “be seen” model Ocd family therapy: including siblings as “assistant coaches”  Developing empathy during ocd treatment Links To Things I Talk About: ERP School https://peaceofmind.com/for-siblings/ OCD Stories (with Jessica Serber) https://theocdstories.com/episode/dr-michelle-witkin-siblings-and-ocd/ https://www.amazon.com/When-Family-Member-Has-Obsessive-Compulsive/dp/1626252467 When a Family Member has OCD https://www.anxioustoddlers.com/psp-050-explaining-ocd/#.Y2Lc2S1h2Tc Krista's webpage Instagram: @anxiouslybalanced Episode Sponsor:This episode of Your Anxiety Toolkit is brought to you by CBTschool.com.  CBTschool.com is a psychoeducation platform that provides courses and other online resources for people with anxiety, OCD, and Body-Focused Repetitive Behaviors.  Go to cbtschool.com to learn more. Spread the love! Everyone needs tools for anxiety...If you like Your Anxiety Toolkit Podcast, visit YOUR ANXIETY TOOLKIT PODCAST to subscribe free and you'll never miss an episode. And if you really like Your Anxiety Toolkit, I'd appreciate you telling a friend (maybe even two). EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION Kimberley Quinlan: Well, welcome Krista Reid. I am so excited to number one connect with you, but to talk about a topic that I don't talk a lot about which is something that I'm excited to really talk about with you today. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yes, thank you so much for having me. Kimberley Quinlan: So welcome. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I'm excited. Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. Look at you. You're all the people who don't see, you're like everything's bright and it's so happy. It makes me so joyful just to see you. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Thank you, anybody. That has met me. Will get it. I'm a very colorful person. Thank you. Kimberley Quinlan: I love that that we need more of you in the world. Kimberley Quinlan: I really feel Yeah, good thing. I made children that sort of created more of me, right? That's the best I can do. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I we need more of you. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  You go. There you go. Kimberley Quinlan: All right, let's talk about supportive siblings. Let's talk about… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yeah. SIBLINGS AND OCD Kimberley Quinlan: how the family can play a role in recovery. I kind of want you to take the lead here and tell me everything, you know. So tell me a little bit about why this subject is important to you and how you used it in clinical and in the field of OCD. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yeah, absolutely. And so I'll give you just a little bit of background. I always have been interested in sibling dynamics, and in fact, when I was in grad school completing my thesis, I even consulted the director of the program. I said, Are there any theories about siblings? And he's like, well, you know, there's the one by Alf or Alfred Adler on birth order. But really outside of that, no and that has just always been so entirely profound. Because when we think about family work, if you're looking at family theories, if you're looking at different types of family interventions and models, a lot of them really focus on parent child. And when you're dealing specifically with a child who has an, I'll go into the physical medical side as well, because I don't think this is exclusively just OCD or just mental illness. Kimberley Quinlan: Mmm. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: when we're seeing that a lot of times, the model is fixated on the child with the medical issue and the parent And what I was finding was that siblings. They kind of get othered In this. It's full process and the definition of other. It is essentially, you know, being excluded from meetings being excluded from family sessions being excluded in some way, shape or form. Now I could see how potential listeners will say, Well, isn't it that child with the OCD the child with the medical issues othered Yes, I'm not debating that at all, I'm saying, primarily within the family unit, that the sibling themselves can get very other and siblings struggle when their sibling has a disorder. You… Kimberley Quinlan: Mmm. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: they can struggle emotionally, they can struggle behaviorally. You know, just looking at the construct of OCD, they could struggle with the with the grief. Of their sibling having OCD, the moods that may come with the disorder. And oftentimes, this can lead to resentment within the sibling relationship, or even guilt or shame. And I I have siblings, and I think this potentially might be even where a lot of my work is very important because I am very close to my siblings. I am super close. Like I I feel like I'm very fortunate. I have, I have amazing relationships with my siblings and so it absolutely breaks my heart when you see a child. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Who who has this? Some type of distance within their sibling relationship either because they themselves have the disorder or their sibling has the disorder. And so, I started finding different ways to incorporate siblings and to the therapeutic model. I'm really big into family work. I don't understand how special when you're working pediatrics pediatrics. And that's primarily what I'm going to focus on today is a pediatric work. I don't understand how when you're working with pediatrics? How you you can't have the family involved? To me, that doesn't make any sense because we're seeing, especially in the outpatient world, we're seeing these kids an hour a week, so tops four hours a month. Pretty sure there with their families, a lot more than just four hours a month. and then thinking about, A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  The siblings. What can we do to make them feel like they're not being other? How can they also not be parentified? Because that's sometimes happens within the disorder. World is the siblings may feel that they have to have some type of responsibility for their siblings medical issues. And that is Absolutely. I don't want any sibling to have that. I want them to have a childhood. I want them to be kids, but how can we incorporate them without parentifying them and without othering them and also bringing in the family as a whole and tackling this beast together whether that's OCD or whatever? That beast might be. 00:05:00 Kimberley Quinlan: That's so interesting because as someone who treats OCD but also treats eating disorders, I have found that, you know, you'll treat the one child who has the primary disorder. We get them better. And then a year or two later, the other kid that didn't have the the diagnosis starts to suffer and all this emotion comes out and they start to really acknowledge how painful it was for them and and it all comes out later. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Okay. Kimberley Quinlan: But I know that there are other cases where it comes out during and you've got multiple things happening at once. So, that is why I think this is so important is Kimberley Quinlan: In my early days of treating you would be like, no, that the siblings. Fine. Look at how well they're doing. They're they're doing well in school and it's quite a miracle,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yeah. INCLUDING THE WHOLE FAMILY IN OCD TREATMENT Kimberley Quinlan: isn't it? But then Yeah, it all comes out, right? It all comes out. So I love that you're talking about this, right? So you you And number number one, before we move on. Is this true of not just siblings, Would we say? This is true of partners of OCD or eating disorders or depression as well. Like Does this spread to that or… A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yeah. I I agree a hundred percent,… Kimberley Quinlan: What are your thoughts? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: you know, this, I hate to call it curriculum because that makes it sound so sterile. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Process I guess I'll call it and I feel that this process is and as as you know aforementioned it's not just about OCD. I can see this being across the board for any medical issue. Absolutely. It could be for Let's a roommate. Let's not even like let's let's take out the family part. Kimberley Quinlan: um, And here. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: You know what, working with a college. I college student, who has a roommate that, maybe they're pretty close with. Absolutely. I if they're willing to bring that person in, How can we incorporate them? Because doesn't that client win? That's what we're wanting… Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: because we know that no matter what your medical diagnosis might be relationships, struggle, and… Kimberley Quinlan:  Mm-hmm. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: that absolute last thing I would wish upon anybody. Kimberley Quinlan: yeah, I'm even thinking of me as someone with a chronic illness On how I think it even like you said it stretches to medical to like that. You know, I know I look back until tell a quick story. I look back to when I was really sick and really sick. And I even remember seeing my children, Starting to play a parental role on me. Like, What do you need today? Mom, instead of like, No, I'm supposed to be asking you that Hun. Like, I think that it's,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yeah. Kimberley Quinlan: it can spread. So I I think that this is that's again why? I think this is so important. So I'm gonna skip to my main sort of questions here. Now, it's like you talk about what is called a coach Like an OCD coach. I know I've watched one of your presentations like Do you want to share with us What this model may look like? BE SEEN MODEL A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yeah. Absolutely. So before I even talk about the OCD coach, because that's not like, I'm not reinventing the wheel, this isn't something that I think a lot of your listeners are going to say, Oh like that's that's a new thing. No, it's not a new thing especially when working pediatrics. That's a pretty common term because that's what we really want these parents, or caretakers to be of these kids. As we want them, to be able to learn how to do what we are doing with their kids. So they don't have to be in therapy forever. So, I developed this process and I call it BE SEEN  seen as an acronym, because why not us medical professionals. We love our acronyms. So let's make another acronym. And also it's really easy to just to remember Kimberley Quinlan:  Right. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  And I chose this specific, acronym one. It fits the letters, really nicely of what I was hoping to explain throughout this process but also for a couple different reasons. One I have OCD and I struggled as a child and adolescent and one of the primary factors in my own recovery, that was so A profound was I realized I did not want to be seen. I did not want people to note because I felt I felt bad, You know that shame just smothers you like a blanket and it just it it was embarrassing. And then I was thinking about it from the other side of siblings. 00:10:00 A Peaceful Balance Wichita: When you have a child who has a chronic illness, you think about how often, are they going into doctors appointments? How often are they going into whatever type of treatment facility? They may they may be utilizing. The sibling is often and they can get hidden. They can get hidden. And if I in fact, I think it was Chris Baer who did unstuck who actually called the sibling, the forgotten child. and I,… Kimberley Quinlan: Such a crisp, man. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I absolutely, I'm gonna, I'm gonna get to how that whole thing. Actually, kind of birthed this idea here in a bit. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: But thinking about just how profound it could be for the sibling to be seen. And as I mentioned before,… Kimberley Quinlan:  Hmm. SUPPORTING SIBLINGS DURING OCD TREATMENT  A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I don't want them to be responsible for their siblings treatment. That is so incredibly inappropriate. And I want them to have a childhood, but I also want them to participate and have a relationship with their sibling. So when I think of an OCD coach essentially, how I define an OCD coach, is going to be that's going to be the adult figure. So that is going to be the person that is going to take the the child to therapy to treatments. That's going to be the main one, utilizing, exposure and response prevention therapy. They're going to be kind of the one overhead and I like using the word coach. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Because one, I really like sports and I just think that there's something kind of neat about a coach because a coach is going to be, they're gonna be tough. They're gonna be fair. And at the end of the day, all they want is for you to win. I just think that's such a cool concept and when you tell that to a parent, a parent, a lot of times can say, Okay, so I get that because I could say, I want you to be the parent to the kid but also think about a coach because when you have your child on a team, OCD FAMILY THERAPY: INCLUDING SIBLINGS AS “ASSISTANT COACHES”  A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  In OCD Family Therapy, that coach is going to be tough. And I'm not trying to take the emotions out at all because we know coaches can be incredibly empathetic. The coaches are probably going to push your child a little bit more than you would put child. And so putting yourself into that role and thinking about this is for a win, I know my child might be hurting, I know my child because they're doing the exposures because you're not allowing them to have the OCD accommodated, you're pushing them to grow. So, Putting yourself into the coaches role versus only solely. The parents' role can be such a powerful metaphor for parents and I just really, really love that. So when I'm looking at the siblings, I call those the assistant coaches, those are the ones that can assist and help out. The players. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  So the child that is in OCD  therapy or in treatment or whatever necessarily it might be and so be seen. So each letter of scene represents something s is supportive. How can you support the child? And I've actually created Worksheets, that are age appropriate for the sibling and the child with OCD, which again, it really could be any kind of medical thing because the acronym really doesn't exclusively cover OCD. They can do this together and so s is supportive finding different ways to support and A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  With the worksheets that I've developed with ages five to 10. I just love this. It's it's an art activity and the kids together get to draw them slaying. I mean I'm using quotation marks slaying the OCD monster or making a can of like OCD away spray and so it's just a really, really cute. A activity to do and again because it's ages five to ten, that's such a level of mastery and explorative and, you know, they, they like to draw in color and play at that time. So, even if their sibling with OCD, it's a lot older. Think about what an amazing bonding experience that could be, you have a five year old sibling, and a 12 year old with OCD, that's a pretty cool, a situation able to put those two together to talk about it. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Because then that five year old. I mean, how empowering and beautiful that is is like, okay, so you know, sibling older sibling, I'm going to draw a can of a way spray, and this is what it's going to do, and it's gonna get it's gonna help get rid of this and this. And we know that children think so highly a metaphors. That, that could be such a really cool way for them to interpret that. And to be able to understand that because we also don't want little kids to well, it's not, we don't want to, it's they just simply don't have the cognitive abilities to understand OCD comprehensively So let's find age appropriate manners to be able to do that. 00:15:00 Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah. DEVELOPING EMPATHY DURING OCD TREATMENT A Peaceful Balance Wichita: And then the next one is developing empathy during OCD treatment. I'm not gonna lie doing an empathy exercise with kids can be a little bit challenging and I think I think that because the Emotions are so complex. In situations are so complex. And so I was trying to find a way to be able to put this in a manner that A five-year-old is going to comprehend and yet also like a 15 year old is not going to think is to babyish. Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Per se. So it's a it's another worksheet because they're all worksheets it's another worksheet where the siblings can work alongside each other and it really can go either way. It usually works better if the child with OCD goes first. And so the child with OCD can share a so, for instance, I feel disgusted. When I'm around a bad food, I'm just gonna say something super blanketed and then the child the sibling with who does not have OCD could say, Okay? So let's talk about disgust. When do you feel disgusted? And they might say I feel disgusted when my parents make me eat broccoli. And so that's just a really cool and simple way for them to see that this is, you know, we can we can relate on emotions. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: And we don't have to agree on your, on your emotional reaction, but we can all we can realize that we all have these emotions and this is how we can bond. And for a young young child,… Kimberley Quinlan:  Hmm. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: This could also be a really cool lesson in emotional intelligence, because they may not necessarily understand or comprehend. All these different kinds of emotions I'm not gonna lie. I think this might be my favorite one because I think this really encompasses a lot of different things. I love empathy exercises, I'm sure you like being big. Kimberley Quinlan: Well, I think it builds on that common humanity, doesn't it? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: But it really does. And that's the whole point is, you know, going back to what I mentioned about being seen, we're all humans and we're flawed and we don't want anybody to feel like they have to be perfect in this process and we don't want anybody to feel like they have to be all knowing, because there's such a beautiful way to which is actually Um, I was gonna go back to support. I've already talked about supportive, but it's a really cool way to support each other. and also not feel like you have to be an expert or Creating them per say,… Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: all right. So then the next one. The next E is encourage this one and the worksheets is make a sign. So like if you were at because again, these are assistant coaches and I'm kind of using the metaphor of sports or games or like, if you're running along a marathon, what sign would you hold for your sibling? And so, then they get to make a sign for older kids. It could be a Post-it notes, have Post-it notes, and then put it like in your siblings lunch or on the bathroom mirror, draw a picture of them, make a card for them, You know, finding different ways to encourage your sibling with out feeding and to the OCD. That could be a really big part of it. Because let's say, for instance, you have a sibling. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Who their OCD attaches on to the color? Black black is death. Black is some. Well, you know what, we're just not going to draw with the color black because it's not the siblings responsibility to do the exposures. Unless that is something that has been discussed actually in the therapy session, because, again, I can't say it enough that I do not want the sibling, to ever be in charge of treatment, or exposures or anything along the lines of that, of course, without actually working with a therapist beforehand. Kimberley Quinlan: Right, right? Can I ask you a question really quite just to clarify Tim? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: And yeah. Absolutely. Kimberley Quinlan: So that parent is the coach. Right? And… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yes. Yes. Kimberley Quinlan: then the child is the assistant coach, you mentioned. Do they get assigned that or… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Correct. Kimberley Quinlan: Do we just call them that? Do they know they're the coach? Do we use those words? Do we assign them? That? What are your thoughts? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I think that could really be up to a parent. Those are just terms that I've used you. 00:20:00 Kimberley Quinlan: They're like,… Kimberley Quinlan: conceptualizations. Okay. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Exactly it… A Peaceful Balance Wichita: because children work, so highly with metaphors and they can use whatever, I had a child. Once say, a lot of want to be a coach, I want to be a cheerleader. Cool. Then you could cheerlead we really kind of whatever it's like… Kimberley Quinlan:  Okay. Kimberley Quinlan:  Right. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: if they want to be the waterboy, I mean I don't care as long as they whatever they can conceptualize it as and we can still kind of follow this supportive method fine. Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah. Okay, thank… Kimberley Quinlan: I just want to clarify that. So okay,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yep. Right. Kimberley Quinlan: we're up to we're up to N. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: That's just great. I say in is non-judgment. And this is the part that we really, really, really like to push that OCD is not your siblings fault. Absolutely did not ask to have OCD. They're not doing this on purpose to despise you or for whatever reason. And also realizing that as the sibling, the way the sibling with OCD behaves is not the siblings fault. This can be a part where you have some psycho education and learning more about what OCD is and what OCD is not. And finding different ways to be able to talk about that. Because that itself can be very difficult and… Kimberley Quinlan: Mmm. Right. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I have, I do a lot of OCD psychoeducation when I work with families. And this is where I was going to bring unstuck back. I think that even before going through this process with families unstuck in my opinion I I'm sure other professionals you know, have their own ways of doing it but I find it to be one of the most profound psycho education methods to use for families. Because, and I'm, I do you work with kids as well. Okay, I'm sure you can, you can relate that when you're having that Psychoed session with a kid, it gets lost. They're done. They're bored. They're just like, well can I just do something else? When you have a which I love that, it's like 20 minutes, it was so made for kids the unstuck documentaries. It was beautiful. And kids talking about OCD to kids. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I mean I I don't know how it it is more impactful than that. Because a long treatment, it's funny enough, my clients will actually refer to the kids in the movie. Like oh, okay. Well, that one boy. Um, he was able to wear Hulk mask or that one, that one girl was able to hug a tree. Oh, that one. She ripped out pages of the Bible and they'll actually refer to that and they see that as being incredibly empowering. what that also does is it lets the parents know that here are some kids… Kimberley Quinlan: You. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: who I mean, you hear their stories, you know that those were pretty severe cases These are kids who came out the other side and are in recovery. and they're talking about these challenges, they're talking about How difficult it was for them. And so when parents are learning about ERP for the first time, it's it's very scary, it's very and so I think it's not only powerful for the children with OCD and their siblings but also their parents to be able to see this documentary, I can't speak highly enough about it, but that's not why we're here. Kim, we're not here to talk about this documentary. Kimberley Quinlan: No, but I think I mean that's the beauty of the community, right? Is we all bring little pieces to what's so important. As you're talking, I'm thinking like A Peaceful Balance Wichita: That. Kimberley Quinlan: He sees that movie because that's the impact it's having. I mean I've seen it and I loved it it's so it's when we can't miss the siblings, right? Like that's some important piece. So I love that you're talking about that and I do think you're right. Question totally off topic. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yeah. Kimberley Quinlan: But on topic is, when you're with a client, do you? Encourage them to watch on stock. Do you bring the family in and do this training with them? What kind how do you apply these concepts in session or Are you know, for someone who doesn't have therapy, what might they do? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Oh, okay, I'm gonna answer that. Someone who doesn't have therapy. Might what they do. I'll go. The therapeutic route to begin with, of course, after you solidify the diagnosis? Which again, for kids can be boy, that can be a challenge that can be such a challenge. So, this is after diagnosis, This is just part of the therapy. I do I, I will say, Okay, so bring in the family and I would say, I would love to have siblings here and they'll say, Well, the sibling is five or six, is that? Okay, absolutely, because you will be surprised at how aware the young sibling is going to be their older sibling. 00:25:00 A Peaceful Balance Wichita: And all time, you will also be surprised at how much accommodation the young child might be doing because they might see that as being. Well, that's just my older sibling. My only can't cut food. Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah, right. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: My older sibling doesn't walk down this one hallway. That's just how they are. Well, we also want to teach them that, you know, this is this, This has a name and here's some ways that you can be encouraging for your sibling. And so I have an entire session where I invite the entire family in and we watch the movie and then we process it together. and from there,… Kimberley Quinlan:  Right. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: We go on to. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Week, We go on to just write right away going on into the bc model and figuring out different ways how the sibling can be involved. Not other not excluded and then we'll go into more of kind of like, the clinical stuff, the Y box, exposure, higher and… Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: and so forth. But you ask, how can people that don't have therapy being able to utilize this. Honestly, it's on silly. I I'm probably the. Okay, there's two ways. I'm very competitive but I'm not competitive. When it comes to This this work, I post these worksheets for free on my website because this is something that I'm not here to make a profit off of it. I'm not here to, I'm not even gonna copyright it because at the end of the day, if we can help one sibling feel heard, Cool. That's it. That's that's amazing. No, no amount of money or… Kimberley Quinlan:  Right. And A Peaceful Balance Wichita: anything could ever be better than that? Kimberley Quinlan: We can link the links to these worksheets in the show notes. You're comfortable with that. That would be amazing. Yeah. Okay,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Absolutely. Kimberley Quinlan: that is so cool and so people can kind of work through them on their own. Okay. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Mm-hmm. And in fact, there there was a family that I worked with whose younger sibling had had some special needs. And what I did with the parents, is I just kind of briefly explained this to them and because they know their kid better than, I know, their child and they know How how their child is going to be able to kind of understand process. This, they were able to take the information they did and that they needed to be able to help out the sibling who now helps out. That the sibling with OCD. Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah, yeah. Okay. So a couple of quick questions that I want to ask is so and it's a sort of going off of some past cases that I had. So what about the the sibling, Who's just really angry. Kimberley Quinlan: the situation at how the, you know OCD has made their family, very For treatment before they were getting resources. Do, do they There's those children who have a lot of resistance to this idea of being a coach. You work with that. Is it through the empathy? Do you have any thoughts? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Door. And that's a fantastic question. Because we can't, we can't force. We can't force anybody to do anything. And I kind of view it like the child with OCD, If the child with OCD does not want to do the treatment. Well, then my job as a clinician is to meet that child while they're at and… Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: that very much with the sibling, you know, of the child with Ocds, I'm gonna have to meet that sibling where they're at, if they don't want anything to do with this, if they want nothing to do with any of this process at all. I'll do one of a couple things one. I, I might refer the sibling on to a therapist who doesn't necessarily like they don't necessarily have to treat OCD but they can understand OCD comprehend OCD. Well enough to be able to have a conversation. And sometimes the sibling is like, Well, I'm not the one with the problem. I don't need to go into therapy, so I'll do my best. I can to coach the parents and help them to support that sibling as well. Kimberley Quinlan: Right. Right, so. Okay and just conceptually. So the parents are using the parent. Coaches are using the bc model the children. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yeah. Kimberley Quinlan: If they're ready and willing, they're using the bc model. And the person with the disorder or the medical condition is also using the bc model. Be seen model for the sibling and the family correct. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Yeah, I mean this this doesn't have to just be with OCD, In fact, you know, as as I'm looking at just the the acronym of seeing, I don't know if you just has to just reach the medical stuff. Because at the end of the day, don't we generally want to be supportive and empathetic and encouraging and non-judgmental humans. I think just kind of a neat model just to teach our children in general. 00:30:00 Kimberley Quinlan: Mmm. Yeah. Kimberley Quinlan:  That's what I was thinking. business sort of, like, 101 Training to be a nice. and like, A Peaceful Balance Wichita: It really is it really? Like I said, I'm not reinventing the wheel, you know, I was able to use some different strategies that I've learned with. So originally as a therapist, I was on the way to becoming a play therapist. And a lot and also dealing with Dr. Bruce Perry's neurossequential model of. Oh My Gosh. Oh my gosh. Why can't I think what it is? It's his nurse sequential model for trauma. That's what it is. Oh wow. And then just just pulling different plate therapy, text me techniques. And I kind of just establish this thick this and… Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: you're right. This is basically just Yeah, I like how you said 101. Be a nice person. Kimberley Quinlan: Yeah, but the truth is and that's why I think it's so important is we all are nice people. We all want to be but when we get hit by a disorder, It's easy to go into reactivity as a parent. I know for myself or as I've seen, you know, siblings it's easy to go reactive. So these are sort of basic tools to come back to the basics and and recalibrate,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Exact. Kimberley Quinlan: which is why I love it. Okay. So no,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Ly. Yeah. Kimberley Quinlan: I love this so much is before we finish up. Is there anything that we haven't touched on that? You want to make sure we address here and we're talking about Supporting the siblings, but supporting the person with the disorder, any I've missed. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Um, can I list some resources? Oh, okay. Kimberley Quinlan:  And please. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: There's really not a ton of information out there about how can the sibling be involved with any medical treatment to be honest with you and I'll focus specifically on the OCD portion. Of course, John Hirschfield's amazing book in regards to family at the,… Kimberley Quinlan: On a family,… A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Yes at the very tail,… Kimberley Quinlan: I see. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: and he talks about different ways, family members can can be helpful. Natasha Daniels on her YouTube channel, she's so great. They're all great everybody. I'm listing is like All Stars. She specifically has a video about how to talk about OCD with young children and I think there's actually even more specific video about how to talk with siblings. Dr. Areeen Wagner on the Peace of Mind Foundation website. There is a whole slew of stuff about how to talk with siblings and I think the Bear Family is even involved in some of those presentations as well. And then this is gonna sound silly because I'm gonna shout out another podcast. Is that okay? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: Okay, there's a couple on the OCD stories that they talk about siblings. Jessica, Surber rested. Kimberley Quinlan:  Yes. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: One about her own experiences being a sibling. And then, this is an older one. Maybe two, three years ago. Dr. Michelle Witkins. She does a lot of advocacy for siblings and so she has an amazing podcast on there where she talks about that work. Kimberley Quinlan: Right? No, I will link to Eyes and you know I'm a massive stew fan so don't wait. Don't worry about it. No, I he's been on our show. I've been on his show a bunch of times. We are very much in Communic. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  I figured, I don't think there was a feud going on. Kimberley Quinlan: Around food at all. No, that's that's so good that you have those and I will list those in the show notes for All as resources to use. I love. Thank you so much for sharing all those and we will have links to your sheets as well. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: ah, Kimberley Quinlan: You can An excellent resources. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  oh, you're sweet. Thank you. Kimberley Quinlan:  Well, I am so grateful for you to come on and talk about this. I think it's really, really important that we talk about siblings, you know, address the whole family because it is a family condition, right? Thank you. I'm so just overjoyed to have you on the show. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Well, thank you. I'm overjoyed to be here. Kimberley Quinlan: Where can people hear from you or get information about you? A Peaceful Balance Wichita: So my website, so my practice name is a peaceful balance, Wichita Kansas, and my website is a PB wichita.com. and really, to be honest with you, probably the easiest way to To contact me is on Instagram. I'm probably on their way more often than I'd like to admit and… Kimberley Quinlan:  Yeah. 00:35:00 A Peaceful Balance Wichita: my handle is at anxiously balanced. Kimberley Quinlan: Love it and you put some amazing exposure lists and movies. It's so good. You but no it's so it's such a huge resource. A Peaceful Balance Wichita: I think I have way too much fun with those. Kimberley Quinlan: If you're looking for specific movies, documentaries songs, I think you do a great job of listing exposures. A Peaceful Balance Wichita:  Thank you.Kimberley Quinlan: Thank you so much.

Natasha Daniels, LCSW Child Therapist, Author & Creator of www.ATparentingSurvival.com is on the podcast this week! Natasha is an expert on OCD, anxiety, and helping parents raise kids with OCD and anxiety. To view her books or her online school for kids and parents visit: https://www.amazon.com/Natasha-Daniels/e/B011K5IIWA/ Online school www.atparentingsurvivalschool.com Main site www.atparentingsurvival.com

SUMMARY:  Today we have Natasha Daniels, an OCD specialist, talking all about how to help children and teens with OCD and phobias.  In this conversation, we talk all about how to motivate our children and teens to manage their OCD, phobias, and anxiety using Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT), Exposure and Response Prevention (ERP), and other treatments such as self-compassion, mindfulness, and ACT. We also address what OCD treatment for children entails and what changes need to be made in OCD treatment for teens. In this episode, Natasha and Kimberley share their experiences of parenting children with phobias and OCD.   In This Episode: What does sitting with emotions mean?  How to sit with difficult feelings  How to sit with your sadness  How to sit with uncomfortable feelings,  Sit with the feelings  Links To Things I Talk About: ERP School: https://www.cbtschool.com/erp-school-lp Episode Sponsor: This episode of Your Anxiety Toolkit is brought to you by CBTschool.com.  CBTschool.com is a psychoeducation platform that provides courses and other online resources for people with anxiety, OCD, and Body-Focused Repetitive Behaviors.  Go to cbtschool.com to learn more. Spread the love! Everyone needs tools for anxiety...If you like Your Anxiety Toolkit Podcast, visit YOUR ANXIETY TOOLKIT PODCAST to subscribe free and you'll never miss an episode. And if you really like Your Anxiety Toolkit, I'd appreciate you telling a friend (maybe even two). EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION This is Your Anxiety Toolkit - Episode 304.  Welcome back, everybody. It's a delight to have you here with me today.  Oh, I've got so much I want to talk to you about and this is actually coming from an emotion of frustration, this episode, which every time I check in and I begin a podcast, I try to come from a place of fun. And am I feeling calm? And am I feeling completely connected to you, the listener? But today, just for fun, I'm coming to you from a place of frustration. And the frustration, promise, this is not going to be a vent episode – it's actually a frustration in that I caught an error that I've made, and I think a lot of clinicians are making. And it's not an error in that it's bad or wrong or problematic. It's just that I caught something in my own practice, and I was like, “Oh, hold up, we have to talk about this.” So, saddle in, get your cup of tea, settle in, because we're going to have to have a conversation about wording. It might be really nuanced and I want you to take what's helpful and leave the rest. I want you to think about it with an open, curious mind, and decide what's best for you.  So, before we get into the show, as always, let's start with the “I did a hard thing.” Let's do it. This one is actually from someone that says-- the handle name is GottaCatchEmAll, and they said: “Thank you so much for your recent series on mental compulsions. Your podcast is truly a godsend and I've been listening nonstop ever since my friend shared it with me last month.” Now, for those of you who don't know, the mental compulsion series was a six-part series that we created here on the podcast. It had so many amazing clinicians on. If you want access to that series, you can go back and listen to previous podcasts. Or, if you sign up for our newsletter, you'll go to CBTSchool.com/newsletter. I will actually send you an amazing webpage, just one link where all the episodes are there, all the PDFs are there. It's so pretty. I have to say it is so pretty, and it's like a one-stop shop for that series. So, go over to the newsletter, CBTSchool.com/newsletter. Sign up for the newsletter. You'll get an email from me every week. But on the front end, you will receive that link. I'm so proud of it. I love it. So, I digress, sorry. They went on to say: “I suffer from a plethora of different anxieties, OCD, scrupulosity, hoarding, body dysmorphia, perfectionism. So, basically a bunch of normal human things, right? Exactly. The other day, I told my therapist that dealing with all of these issues felt like playing a game of whack-a-mole in my head, except that instead of the typical game, the mole would pop up and then a zebra and a giraffe, and so on, in a quick succession throughout the course of the day. While sobbing, I told my therapist that I didn't want to have a zoo in my head and I didn't know how to treat so many issues simultaneously. Imagine my surprise when I heard a recent episode called Whack-a-mole Obsessions, it was a relief to discover that I wasn't alone and weird or broken as I thought. I realized, instead of trying to resist or whack the zoo in my head, I could approach my anxieties and compulsions like they were different Pokemons that I could catch and train and carry around with me while I live the rest of my best life. Thank you, Kimberley, for putting on such an incredible content and for helping me and so many others navigate this difficult thing.” That is so good. Look at you working through that whack-a-mole ongoing struggle with different thoughts, different disorders, and so forth. I think so many of us resonate with this and you are definitely doing hard things. So, so, so cool.  All right. Real quick, before we get to the frustration that we're all hanging out for, let's just quickly do the review of the week. This one is a shorty from Inventedcharm, and they said: “It is a mental pick me up. I love listening when I need a mental pick me up. Kimberley's voice is soothing, and she offers great tools for self-compassion and interviews other experts in the field of mental health.” So, thank you, Inventedcharm, and thank you, GottaCatchEmAll. Okay. So, here we go. I'm going to tell you a story of why I'm landing here on this episode with you today. So, once I got back from Australia, a lot of you know I spent five and a half weeks in Australia over the summer with my children. It was so beautiful. I can't tell you how full my heart was when I returned. I was energized. I was the happiest I've ever been. And you know where this is going. Yeah, we do. I crashed big time. I just went through so much sadness. I missed my family. I was angry. I had so much grief. I was feeling, actually, if I'm going to be completely honest, quite a lot of resent towards even my husband, who I love and is such a wonderful human. But I was observing resent show up because I was like, “I don't understand. I just want to be with my family and why can't I have all the things I want?” So, all these emotions started showing up.  WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO SIT WITH EMOTIONS?  My therapist – of course, I talked with a therapist – was saying, “Everything, Kimberley, that you're saying makes complete sense. Why don't you practice sitting with your emotions?” And of course, I was like, “Yeah, that makes sense. I have given that advice myself.” And so, off I went right onto the roller coaster, or we could say the whack-a-mole to talk about the “I did the hard thing” segment, the whack-a-mole of emotions with the agenda of not numbing them like I often do. Sometimes when I work, I engage in these numbing behaviors where I just numb all of everything out by working. It's something that I've overused as a coping skill, is when I work. So, I'm not doing that anymore. I'm not using any other problematic safety behaviors. I caught all these problems. So, it's like, “I think really all you've got left to do is just sit with your emotions.” So, I went, “Okay, let's do it. There's no solution. There's nothing I can do about this. Let's just sit with it.” And I started to play with this idea of, okay, let's talk about what does it mean to sit with your emotions. Now, this is where, again, I'm going to identify, I've given this advice and I'm going to say, I don't think I'm going to give that advice anymore. Or if I do give it, and for any reason you don't catch me doing this, you can always bring it to my attention, but I'm going to do my best, is I'm going to add another sentence to the whole “sit with your emotions” concept, because let's say often you guys have heard me say, “Sit with anxiety, sit with your anxiety.” And that's helpful because we know that doing compulsions with anxiety is a problem. If you resist or avoid or try and remove your anxiety, it's going to create more problems. But where that gets in the way is it doesn't mean you just sit there and do nothing but stare at the wall and just let the anxiety beat you into a pummel. No. I think that the mistake I'll make, and I'm going to be completely transparent, I think the mistake I make is I'm assuming you guys know what I mean by that, and I'm assuming that you know, I mean, don't just sit there and stare at the wall.  There were a couple of days where I was so overwhelmed with emotion that I did just sit there and be like, “Okay, I'm allowing this. I have to allow it. I'm sitting here. I'm allowing it. Oh man, this is hard,” until I was like, “Wait a second. This is not helpful. Just sitting here and letting it pummel me, that's not the whole picture. There has to be tools and skills associated with it.” That's where I'm talking about in regards to anxiety. It's a great concept, but what do we actually mean when we say, “Sit with your emotions”? We mean, allow it, particularly when we're talking about fear. We're saying, don't interfere with it. Don't engage with it. Don't wrestle with it. Don't stir it up. And we're also saying, don't run away from it. We don't thought suppress. So important.  So, I totally believe that sitting with emotions is an important concept, but we must, and I am sorry if I haven't mentioned this and I haven't gone a full explanation, we then must engage back into life. We must engage back into the things that we value. We must engage, even if we don't like it. Sometimes you have to do the dishes. Sometimes you have to get out of bed. And sometimes we have to allow emotions, embrace emotions, bring on emotions in order to get up and do those things. But that's just anxiety.  HOW TO SIT WITH DIFFICULT EMOTIONS?  Now, let's talk about which emotions should you sit with and which ones shouldn't you? Now, number one, there is no bad emotion. There's no such thing as a bad emotion, a negative emotion, a problematic emotion. They're all just neutral. And that's huge to know. But as I was sitting in the chair of the client instead of being the therapist, and I was really going, “Okay, I'm not going to engage in these behaviors. I'm going to instead just allow them and sit with them,” I realized sometimes asking yourself to sit with an emotion, particularly ones like guilt and shame, that too isn't completely helpful. We need to put an extra sentence on the end of that as well. So, we can say, “Sit with your emotion of shame, but also be aware of the stories it's telling you, not taking it as a fact.” Because as I was noticing, so much shame showed up for myself in this specific situation. I was thinking, wait, if I told my client to sit with shame, but I hadn't taught them the skill of diffusing from shame or observing the story of shame, they're going to have shame and be like, “Oh yeah, it's true. I am bad. I'm just going to sit with the fact that I'm bad.” So, no, no, no, no, no. That's not what we mean, again, by sitting with emotions. We're not saying we're going to sit with them and accept them as fact.  Let's talk about sitting with sadness and grief because, boy oh boy, did I have sadness and grief. And it would come in waves that punch me in the face. I'd be like-- and again, I want to validate grief. Doesn't matter, it's not just losing a human body. Nobody passed away. That's definitely grief. But I was handling grief and loss of like, “Oh, I missed my family. I wish I was there. I wish I lived there. I wish I could just snap my fingers and be there. I wish the world was different. I wish COVID didn't happen.” All these things. So, I just was getting these waves of sadness. And it was important as I was “sitting with sadness.” That's okay. We want to do that. We want to allow it. We don't want to interfere with it. We don't want to run away from it. We want to embrace it. But we don't want to thicken it with hopelessness as we sit there. We don't want to thicken it with like, “Yeah, bad things are going to keep happening and there's not hope.” That will only create more problems.  HOW TO SIT WITH SADNESS?  So, when we say “sit with your emotions,” particularly the one of sadness, we actually want to sit in sadness again with non-judgment, with curiosity, with awareness of other things. And when I did that, when I sat with my emotions and was curious and open, I noticed like LA's got a beautiful, beautiful scene. The vibe is really cool. I love my house. I really do love my house. I love the fact that my house is surrounded by trees. I love my family. And I allowed me to be open to sadness and other parts of my life here. So, again, I'm bringing this up of just like in that moment of doing the action, I was thinking, oh my goodness, we need to make sure we expand our description of what it means to sit with your emotions.  If you need more step by step, in my book, The Self-Compassion Workbook for OCD, if you have OCD, I actually have a full chapter on managing strong emotions. And in that book, I actually did, I believe, a good degree of explanation. But I wanted to get on here and set the-- what do you say? Set you straight? That's not right. Set the story straight. I don't really know what that saying is, forgive me. But I wanted to be really clear and actually correct if I've ever said this term, “sit with your emotions.” It's not a bad term. I actually almost called this episode “Why I'll never say sit with your emotions again.” But the truth is, I won't. I can't hold that as true. So, I changed it to “What does it really mean to sit with your emotions,” and how can we add additional context to that statement so that it doesn't mean you're just indulging the emotion and all of the trash that some emotions can leave behind. And what I mean by trash, I'm not judging, it is like, with sadness comes hopelessness sometimes. So, we want to be careful not to engage with that and infuse too much with that. With shame comes a story that you're bad, that you're wrong, that you don't have any worth. We don't want to indulge or engage in that while we allow and experience the emotion of shame.  HOW TO SIT WITH ANGER?  Anger was another one. I went through these crazy waves of anger and talking with a therapist like, “Okay, you're having your anger.” Of course, don't lash out or say me unkind things, or catch yourself if you're starting to feel highly dysregulated. And then just sit with your emotions. And I thought, wow, again, there's that saying. But if I'm angry and I'm sitting with it, I could easily percolate on some pretty hateful thoughts. I could be sitting with and ruminating with that emotion. And that is not what we mean when we say “sit with your emotions.” So, I really wanted to just drop into this. If I were to sum up this whole episode, the thing I want you to think about the most is, there is no right way to manage an emotion and there is no right or wrong emotion. There is no-- and I talk with my patients all the time about this. There is no playbook on how this is supposed to go. The metaphor I often use is, it's like any sport. Some of you may know, I'm learning tennis. I actually pretty suck at it, but that's a whole nother story. The whole thing I'm learning is, and the reason that I suck, and I don't say that in a judgmental way, I actually think it's hilarious, is it's all about being super flexible. So, I'm standing and my knees are bent and I'm holding my racket and I'm going left to right, left to right on my feet, and I'm getting ready for this constantly changing direction of a ball. And I have to stay really flexible. So, if the ball goes all the way to the right, I have to move my legs so I can move to the right. And then if next time it goes to the left, I have to be ready to make that maneuver.  HOW TO SIT WITH OTHER DIFFICULT EMOTIONS Same goes with emotions. Your emotions are going to flip flop and go from left to right and north to west, and it's going to give you a run for your money. And we have to be able to adjust the strategy depending on what's coming to us. And that's true of emotions. In simple, we're always going to observe it, allow it, acknowledge it. In some points, we have to be curious instead of being closed and judgmental. These are skills you can use with all of them. But as I've gone through some of the more difficult emotions today, sometimes we have to catch the themes that percolate and loop us into it when “sitting with emotions.” So, that's the main thing I want to talk to you. Again, I'll tell you, as I-- I was actually driving to the dentist and I called a very dear friend of mine, and I just said, “I actually just had a major epiphany. We can't keep saying ‘sit with your emotions' as clinicians. We have to make sure we add context to what that looks like, and it means not just sitting still and doing nothing, except focusing on the emotion.” So, if this resonates with you, I hope it does. It was such an important thing I wanted to talk with you about again. Does it mean it's wrong? Absolutely not. If you're a clinician or you hear this, or you've probably even heard it from me – if you've heard it, it doesn't mean they've done anything wrong. I just want you to understand what it actually means when they say that and to add those extra sentences at the end and give context to like-- again, don't interfere with them. Don't run away from them. Allow them. Also, don't calculate and ruminate on them either.  Sending you so much love. As always, this is really hard work. So, please do remember, it is a beautiful day to do these hard things. And I will add, for any of you who are writing out waves of emotion right now, I salute you. I have such deep respect for you because it's no easy feat to choose an emotion, to choose to tolerate it and interrupt behaviors that are problematic and allow emotions to rise and fall. That is some pretty impressive work you're doing. And I just want to give you a massive shout out because it's not fun. It's hard. It's not easy. It's skillful work. It takes some stamina to do it, and it's exhausting. And so, if you're doing even 10% of this work, I applaud you.  All right, my friends, I will see you next week. Have a wonderful, wonderful week. Again, please do go to CBTSchool.com/newsletter if you want access to that mental compulsions worksheet. And I'll be seeing you in a week.