Been There Got Out Podcast

If you've been told that mediation is impossible when you're dealing with a high-conflict ex—or that it's never safe when there's been domestic violence—this conversation with New York family law attorney Ian Steinberg is going to challenge that assumption.Ian is a matrimonial attorney with Burkman Botker Newman & Shane, a 25-attorney firm based in Manhattan with offices in Westchester and Long Island. He joins Lisa Johnson of Been There Got Out for his second appearance on the show, and this time the focus is entirely on mediation—what it is, what it isn't, and how to navigate it when your ex has a history of coercive control, manipulation, or abuse.The family court system is broken. Ian doesn't sugarcoat that. The system wasn't designed to handle what targeted parents deal with every day, and being forced into litigation often just gives an abusive ex another arena to exert power.That's why understanding your alternatives—including the different forms of mediation—matters so much.In this episode, Ian breaks down a distinction that most people don't know exists: Capital M Mediation versus lowercase m mediation.Capital M is the classic format—just you, your ex, and a neutral third party working toward agreement. Lowercase m covers a broader range of attorney-assisted, structured alternatives that can be more appropriate when power imbalances are a serious concern.He also introduces something Lisa and Chris have seen work with their own clients: the use of retired family court judges as mediators.These aren't people with formal mediation authority—but they bring decades of experience sitting on the bench, and sometimes that gravitas is exactly what it takes to get a controlling ex to actually listen and move.If you are a domestic violence survivor wondering whether mediation is even an option for you, Ian's answer is: sometimes yes, if the right guardrails are in place. He's clear about when it shouldn't happen—when the power dynamic is so extreme that you simply can't withstand it, or when the conflict is too fresh to be productive. But he also explains the tools that can make it safer, including virtual Zoom-based shuttle negotiation, where the parties never have to share a screen or a room.Before you walk into any mediation session, Ian says three things matter most: talk to your attorney beforehand, work with your coach to manage your emotions and know your triggers, and make a clear list of your asks. And remember—nothing is final until you put pen to paper. You are allowed to say, “This sounds interesting. Let me think about it and speak to my attorney.” That is not weakness. That is informed consent.The cost savings of resolving even some issues through mediation can be staggering. Every issue you settle is one that doesn't have to be litigated. Going from ten contested issues to two is real progress—and it also signals to the court that you've made a genuine effort to cooperate, which matters.Whether mediation is right for you depends on your specific situation. That's why working with coaches who understand high-conflict dynamics—and who can help you prepare strategically—is so valuable. Lisa and Chris offer a free 30-minute discovery call where they can help you assess your situation and figure out the right next steps.➡️ Book your free call: https://beentheregotout.com/➡️ Follow us on Instagram: @been_there_got_outConnect with Ian Steinberg: https://www.berkbot.com/attorneys/ian-steinberg/

If you've ever found yourself paralyzed by the fear that your ex is slowly turning your children against you and there's nothing you can do about it, this conversation is for you.In this episode of Been There Got Out, Lisa Johnson sits down with Dr. Alicia del Prado, a licensed counseling psychologist based in the San Francisco Bay Area, to talk about one of the most painful experiences a parent can go through: parental alienation. But rather than focusing only on what's happening, Dr. del Prado brings her clinical expertise to what you can actually do — specific, grounded strategies to prevent alienation from taking hold, minimize its impact when it has already started, and stay psychologically intact through all of it.One of the most important things she says: fear is a filter. When we're operating from that deep, primal terror of losing our kids, we make decisions that can actually make things worse — not because we're bad parents, but because our nervous system is in survival mode. Understanding that is the first step toward changing it.WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE:✅ What parental alienation actually is — and why it affects an estimated 22 million divorced and separated parents in the US and Canada alone✅ Why feeling hopeless about parental alienation is understandable — and what to focus on instead✅ How fear acts as a "filter" that distorts your decisions and what to do about it without suppressing your emotions✅ The most common misconceptions people have about alienation — both from inside the situation and from the outside✅ How to support a friend or family member going through parental alienation without saying the wrong thing✅ How to use your child's love language to stay connected even when they're pushing you away✅ What to do when your child screams at you, ignores you, or says they hate you✅ The micro goals framework: how to keep showing up consistently even when you see no results✅ Why children in these situations usually do come back — and what gives them the courage toTIMESTAMPS:00:00 — Introduction: Why we're revisiting this conversation (audio issues from previous recording)01:10 — What parental alienation actually is: a definition from a clinical psychologist02:30 — The 22 million statistic: how widespread parental alienation really is03:15 — Dr. del Prado's personal background and why this topic is close to her heart04:30 — "I feel like it's destined" — addressing the hopelessness alienated parents feel06:00 — Fear is a filter: how trauma responses hijack parenting decisions in high-conflict situations08:15 — Misconceptions about parental alienation from the inside: why catastrophizing makes it worse10:00 — Misconceptions from the outside: what friends and family get wrong and how to ask for support12:30 — The Constructive Conversations model (with Dr. Anastasia Kim) for difficult dialogue14:15 — Using love languages with alienated children: quality time, words of affirmation, gift giving, touch17:00 — When your child doesn't respond to your love language efforts: the power of repetition18:30 — Reliability and consistency: why attachment is built over time, not in a single reunion20:00 — When children are openly hostile: what to do in the moment when your child screams at you22:45 — Self-regulation tools for targeted parents (including Marsha Linehan's distress tolerance skills)24:30 — Setting limits with your child during a hostile encounter without escalating26:00 — Micro goals: why big reunion fantasies set you up to fail — and what works instead28:30 — Making micro goals about your behavior, not your child's response30:15 — Do alienated children come back? What the statistics actually show31:30 — How to find Dr. del Prado and her practiceABOUT DR. ALICIA DEL PRADO:Dr. Alicia del Prado is a licensed counseling psychologist and the founder of a group practice in the San Francisco Bay Area. Her clinical work spans children, adults, families, and couples navigating relationship challenges, depression, anxiety, and trauma. Dr. del Prado brings both professional expertise and personal perspective to the topic of parental alienation — as a child of divorced parents herself, she understands both the systemic challenges families face and the emotional complexity children carry through these transitions. She is co-developer (with Dr. Anastasia Kim) of the Constructive Conversations model, a step-by-step approach to having difficult but necessary dialogues with people we care about.CONNECT WITH DR. DEL PRADO on Instagram: @DoctorDelPrado & @DelPradoCounseling

If you've been ordered into parenting coordination, or you're wondering whether a parenting coordinator could help your high-conflict custody case, this conversation is for you.Lisa sits down with Nicole Sodoma, a family law attorney with 26 years of experience, founding partner of Sodoma Law (seven locations across the Carolinas), and a practicing parenting coordinator since 2005. What makes Nicole's perspective uniquely powerful is that she's not just an expert — she's a targeted parent who has personally worked with three different parenting coordinators since her own separation in 2019. She knows this process from every angle.Together, they break down what a parenting coordinator actually does, who gets one (and why), what the most common and costly mistakes parents make are, and the practical communication and documentation strategies that can help you stop making them — starting today.Whether your parenting coordinator seems to be favoring your ex, you're confused about what decisions they can and can't make, or you're just trying to understand how to use this process strategically, Nicole gives you a clear, honest roadmap.

What does a Guardian Ad Litem really think when a 10-year-old says they want 50/50 custody?Crystal Wright has heard it hundreds of times — and she can tell instantly when a child has been coached. As a family law attorney AND a working GAL in Atlanta, Georgia, Crystal is one of the rare practitioners who has seen the custody system from every angle: as the attorney fighting for clients, as the neutral investigator protecting children, and as the professional who has had exactly one parent incarcerated for defying her court orders.In this conversation, Crystal joins Lisa Johnson to unpack one of the most contentious questions in family law: when should a child's voice be allowed to decide their custody arrangement — and when should it be completely disregarded?The answer, Crystal says, has nothing to do with how articulate or advanced your child is. It has everything to do with whether the language they're using sounds like an actual child — or like someone's lawyer.What You'll Learn in This Episode:✅ How GALs instantly detect when a child has been coached — and what specific language is a dead giveaway✅ Why "I want 50/50 custody" coming from a 10-year-old should raise immediate red flags✅ What the 'borrowed scenarios' phenomenon looks like in a real investigation✅ How Crystal visits kids at their schools — without telling the parents — and why she always gets new information✅ The real impact on children when they're put in the middle: clinical depression, self-harm, 17-year-olds calling their GAL crying at 10pm✅ At what ages (11 and 14 in Georgia) a child's preference becomes legally relevant — and why that still doesn't mean they get to choose✅ The non-negotiable case for reunification therapy — and what Crystal does to parents who try to block it✅ How to find a qualified GAL and what to look for in a mental health expert for an older, refusing child✅ What to do when your child won't see you: Crystal's direct advice to rejected parents⏱️ Timestamps:00:00 — Introduction: How Lisa and Crystal met at the Bridging the Gap conference in London01:45 — How a GAL tells the difference: coached child vs. genuine preference04:30 — Crystal's background: family law attorney, boutique firm in Atlanta, and why she loves GAL work06:00 — Advanced children vs. coached children: why intelligence isn't the issue08:15 — "I want 50/50" — why that phrase signals coaching immediately10:00 — Age and preference in Georgia: the affidavit of election at 11, determinative weight at 1413:30 — Why Crystal stopped having children sign affidavits of election15:45 — The 17-year-old: even at near-adulthood, best interest analysis still controls18:00 — Reaction to New Jersey's ruling: what does it mean for children's long-term wellbeing?21:00 — Why Crystal visits children at their schools — without telling parents — and what she learns23:30 — Children and truth-telling: parroting, fawning, and protecting a parent26:00 — Loyalty conflicts: the real emotional impact on children stuck in the middle29:00 — Clinical depression, self-harm, and older kids calling Crystal crying at 10pm32:00 — Older children refusing contact: how to make the case for intervention to the court35:00 — Reunification therapy: Crystal has never been denied an order for it — and here's why38:30 — What happens to parents who block reunification therapy: contempt motions and incarceration41:00 — What kind of expert witness to bring in for an older refusing child43:30 — False allegations and fake documents: how they're handled in investigation46:00 — How to find a good GAL and what qualifications actually matter48:30 — How to prepare your child for a GAL interview (and what NOT to say)51:00 — Advice for rejected parents: don't give up, keep reaching out, send birthday gifts54:00 — Memory, photographs, and why fighting for a child who doesn't want you right now still matters56:30 — How to find Crystal Wright and closing remarks

He hadn't heard from one of his four daughters in four years. Then she reached out. And the first thing she said changed everything.Jon McKenzie, founder of @malevictimsoffemalenarcissists (IG) and a returning BTGO guest, joins Lisa to share something that happened just two weeks before this recording: his adult daughter reached out after four years of complete silence, asked to rebuild their relationship, and opened with the words every alienated parent needs to hear: "I'm very sorry for the words I said. My words were very hurtful and disrespectful."If you've been told to "just wait," or you're wondering whether your adult children will ever come back, this conversation is the living proof that they can. And it gives you a philosophy and a framework for surviving the wait.IN THIS CONVERSATION:The two types of parental alienation — legally imposed separation vs. the quiet, psychological erosion that's often more devastatingWhy Jon chose not to divorce until his kids were out of high school — and whether, looking back, that was the right callThe prodigal son framework: how Jon made peace with not chasing his children — and what 'waiting with open arms' actually costs a parent emotionallyWhat his daughter said the moment she reached out — and why Jon didn't pull his punches in their first conversationHow reconciliation with one adult child is opening a possible door with a second — while a third may be permanently enmeshed with their motherWhy Jon refused to badmouth his ex to his children — even after years of alienation — and why he believes that was the single most important thing he didWhat he says to the client who says: 'If one more person tells me the kids will just figure it out, I'm going to lose my mind'GUEST INFO:Jon McKenzieMale Victims of Female Narcissistshttps://malevictimsoffemalenarcissists.comJon's Instagram: @malevictimsoffemalenarcissists

Facing a negotiation with your high-conflict ex can feel like showing up to a battle already defeated — especially when they have more money, more confidence, or a better attorney. But corporate negotiation expert Lynn Price says the power imbalance you're feeling may be less real than you think. What IS real is whether you make the ask.Lynn spent 25 years as in-house corporate counsel and completed over 11,000 negotiations. In this conversation with Lisa Johnson, she breaks down her Three Rs Framework — Ready, Relatable, and Reasonable — and explains exactly how to apply it when you're co-parenting with someone determined to make your life miserable.In this episode, you'll learn:- The one mindset shift that lets you make the ask even when you feel powerless- How to use the 'have to haves / helpful haves / hopeful haves' system to walk into mediation with a clear, strategic game plan- Why you must stop talking after you make a request — and how to handle the silence- The acting technique that protects your most important priorities (your ex will never see it coming)- How to build enough rapport with a difficult person to actually move the negotiation forward- A general rule from a retired army general that will keep you out of trouble in every difficult conversation- Why practicing out loud — even to your mirror or your dog — can change how you show up in mediation- How to use AI to prepare for your next difficult conversation with your co-parentLisa and Lynn also explore the difference between negotiation and mediation, the psychology of letting the other side 'win' things that don't actually matter, and why knowing your 'walk-away' point before you sit down is one of the most powerful moves you can make.This isn't just theory — Lynn spent nearly 14 years in the construction industry, where her company had no leverage, going up against huge players and still getting what they needed. Her approach works on everyone from Fortune 500 executives to toxic co-parents. And it can work for you.If you're heading into custody mediation, a co-parenting negotiation, or just trying to get your ex to switch a weekend, this conversation will change how you approach it.About Lynn Price:Lynn Price is a negotiation speaker, trainer, and attorney. She spent over 25 years as in-house corporate counsel, completing more than 11,000 negotiations.Website: lynnpriceconsulting.comBook: 'Negotiate It!' on Amazon

What does a family court judge actually think when you walk through those courtroom doors?If you have ever walked out of a hearing asking "why did the judge do THAT?" — this conversation is for you.Peggy Walsh spent 18 years as a family court judge — after first building her career representing parents, caregivers, and children as a family law attorney. Then she took off her robe. Not because she stopped caring, but because she believed that the people who love a child should be the ones making decisions for that child — not a stranger, however well-intentioned, in a black robe.Today, Peggy works as a co-parenting coach, helping parents stay out of court altogether — or, when court is unavoidable, understand exactly what to expect and how to show up effectively.In this conversation, Lisa and Peggy go deep on what family court actually looks like from the inside — and what most attorneys never tell their clients before they walk into that hearing.WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS INTERVIEW:✅ Why judges assume BOTH parents are high conflict — and how that shapes everything they observe✅ What judges really notice about demeanor (and why the person blurting things out in court isn't necessarily the problem outside of court)✅ The one question you should always ask your attorney before your first court appearance — and why most attorneys forget to answer it✅ What "forced resolution" vs. "compromised resolution" actually means — and why Peggy always preferred to help parents reach their own agreements✅ The specific things only you know about your family that no judge ever could — and why that makes negotiated parenting plans almost always better✅ What status conferences are, why Peggy loved using them, and how they can reduce conflict over time✅ Why appearing to "want it all your way" in front of a judge rarely ends well — and what to do instead✅ How to think about co-parenting communication as modeling behavior for your children — not just logistics management✅ Why your child hears your tone of voice even when they are upstairs and cannot hear your words✅ What it looks like to stop making your ex the "star of your show" — and why that shift changes everythingTHIS INTERVIEW IS ESSENTIAL IF YOU:- Are going to court and do not know what to expect- Are frustrated by a custody decision you do not understand- Are trying to build a parenting plan and wondering whether to negotiate or let the judge decide- Keep getting pulled back to court by a high-conflict co-parent- Want to understand what judges actually value — not what TV court dramas portray- Are ready to shift from reactive victim to proactive problem-solver in your caseABOUT PEGGY WALSH:Peggy Walsh is a retired family court judge who served for 18 years, primarily handling divorce and family law matters. Prior to her time on the bench, she represented parents, caregivers, and children as a family law attorney. She is now a co-parenting coach, helping parents navigate high-conflict situations, create workable parenting plans, and stay out of court whenever possible.Connect with Peggy Walsh: https://peggywalsh.com/

If you have a court date coming up, a difficult phone call with your ex on the calendar, or you're just sick and tired of going blank exactly when you need to be sharp, this conversation is for you.Lisa sits down with Annie Brook, a body-centered somatic psychologist who has trained therapists for decades and spent time in courtrooms testifying for children. Annie brings something genuinely different to this conversation: not just the why behind the freeze, the anger, and the exhaustion you've been feeling, but practical, body-based tools you can use covertly, right now, even with a judge watching.In this episode, Annie explains:- Why hopelessness after a toxic relationship is neurological, not a character flaw- How your birth experience and earliest attachment moments may have shaped the "blind spots" your ex exploited- The science behind why you freeze when you're attacked in conversation or in court, and how to break it- Four covert grounding techniques you can use during a custody hearing without anyone knowing- The "hula hoop" exercise that rebuilds your sense of personal space and power- What "middle tone" is and why it's the secret to staying credible and relational under pressure- How self-attack thinking is not just emotionally exhausting — it may be affecting your physical healthAnnie Brook's website: https://www.anniebrook.com#NarcissisticAbuse #NervousSystemHealing #SomaticTherapy #FamilyCourt #HighConflictDivorce #ParentalAlienation #TraumaHealing #CoParenting #CustodyBattle #AnnieBrook #BeenThereGotOut 

Finding the right therapist for your child during a high-conflict divorce is one of the most important and misunderstood decisions you'll make.Most parents want immediate results. They want their child to sit down in session one and start processing everything that's been happening at home. But experienced art therapist Ahimsa Luciano has seen this expectation backfire again and again, and she has a more effective approach to share.In this conversation, Ahimsa breaks down what effective therapy for children in high-conflict situations actually looks like, why it takes longer than parents expect, and why that's not a bad thing. She explains how to match your child's personality to a therapeutic style, what to say when the other parent has told your child therapy means something is wrong with them, and exactly why the therapist can't be your source of custody intel, even when you desperately want updates.WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE:- Why AI will never replace a human therapist, and what the 7-38-55 communication rule reveals about what's really missing- What makes an experienced intake truly different and why this first step is the most important one- How to give a resistant child space to open up, even when their world feels like it's in chaos- Why it can take months (or longer) before a child talks, and why that's not failure- How to handle a child who's been told therapy means they're damaged - a trauma-informed response that actually works- The truth about "parentification" in high-conflict families and its long-term impact on relationships and boundaries- Why children tell each parent something different and why that doesn't mean anyone is lying- What 'your child is fine with both parents' in an evaluation actually means, and why it's not the betrayal it feels like- Why custody exchanges are a major anxiety trigger for children and the specific harm of using kids as tools at handoffs- Questions to ask when choosing a therapist for your child including how to match personality type to therapeutic style- Why your child's therapy space must be private and what the therapist will and won't share with youABOUT AHIMSA LUCIANO:Ahimsa Luciano is an art therapist licensed in New York State and the co-founder and co-owner of Pleasantville Wellness Group, a multidisciplinary therapy practice in Pleasantville, NY serving children through adults, couples, and families. She began her career at a domestic violence and sexual assault agency as the children's therapist — an experience that gave her deep roots in working with kids navigating high-conflict separations, divorce, and trauma. Pleasantville Wellness Group offers a broad range of therapeutic modalities including art therapy, play therapy, and individual and group services, and is currently in-network with NYSHIP, United Healthcare, and Oxford for New York State clients. Some therapists in the practice are also licensed in additional states.  https://www.pleasantvillewellnessgroup.com/home#highconflictdivorce #childtherapy #parentalalienation #coparenting #arttherapy #custodybattle #parentification #divorceandkids #traumainformedparenting #beentheregotout #kidsanddivorce #therapyforchildren

If your child just told you something terrible — or if you're afraid they're trying to — this conversation is for you.Lisa sits down with Julia Hochstadt, a licensed clinical social worker specializing in trauma, childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence. Julia works with adolescents (15+) and adults, including many parents navigating high-conflict custody situations where their children may be in danger. She also testifies as an expert witness in DV and intimate partner violence cases.This interview was recorded during Sexual Assault Awareness Month — but Julia's guidance is something every protective parent needs to hear, no matter what month it is.In this conversation, you'll hear:→ The #1 thing Julia urges parents to do immediately when a child discloses abuse — and the exact words to say→ Why disclosures can sound unbelievable — and why that doesn't mean they're not true→ How years of gaslighting from an abusive partner erode your ability to trust your own instincts (and what to do about it)→ The behavioral signs that should prompt a protective parent to lean in — not wait and watch→ A practical, age-appropriate framework for building a child's safety plan — including how to plan for different times of day, different scenarios, and changing circumstances→ Why Julia compares child safety planning to how the fire department talks about home fire safety — and why you should revisit it every time life transitions happen→ What research says about the #1 protective factor for a child whose abuse was not properly addressed by the legal system→ How to comfort a terrified child when you have to send them on a court-ordered exchange you know is unsafeLisa also shares a real situation she encountered that same morning: a mother whose child disclosed the worst kind of abuse, survived two investigations that were not acted upon, and is now being forced into a form of reunification therapy that's making things dramatically worse. Julia's guidance for this mother, and for the many parents in this community who are living this nightmare, is both clinically grounded and deeply human.ABOUT JULIA HOCHSTADT, LCSWJulia is a licensed clinical social worker licensed to practice in New York and New Jersey. She specializes in primary and secondary survivors of childhood sexual abuse, sexual assault, and domestic violence. She does training, education, and outreach nationally, and testifies as an expert witness in DV and IPV cases. She is also available for consultation to individuals and clinicians nationwide.Website: https://therapywithjulia.com#ChildAbuse #ChildSafety #ParentalAlienation #HighConflictDivorce #ProtectiveParent #DomesticViolence #SafetyPlanning #ChildDisclosure #SexualAssaultAwarenessMonth #CustodyBattle #CoParenting #TraumaTherapist #BeenThereGotOut

If you've ever sat in a courtroom waiting for a judge to address what your ex is doing... and walked out with nothing... AGAIN, you already know this truth in your bones: justice delayed is justice denied.Criminal defense attorney, legal analyst, and law professor James Porfido has spent more than 35 years watching the American legal system from every angle: as a prosecutor in the Morris County Prosecutor's Office, as a certified criminal trial attorney, and as a defense attorney for people caught in a system that often seemed designed to work against them. His book, Unequal Justice, is a frank accounting of what he witnessed.In this conversation with Lisa, James brings that rare "both sides of the courtroom" perspective to the world of high-conflict divorce and custody — and what he sees mirrors exactly what our community lives every day.In this episode, you'll learn:- Why family court cases drag on for months and years, and why judges often feel they have no choice- How a toxic ex uses court delays strategically to wear you down, separate you from your children, and drain your finances- What "parental alienation" looks like through the eyes of a criminal attorney who has represented falsely accused parents- How coached child testimony works and what it means for your case- The single most important thing to look for when hiring an attorney (hint: it's not their fees)- Why knowing the "lay of the land" in your local court system is as important as knowing the law- How court staff relationships can quietly determine whether your case moves forward... or stalls- James's framework for what questions to ask when interviewing a potential attorneyAbout James Porfido James Porfido is a New Jersey-based attorney with over 35 years of experience as both a prosecutor and criminal defense attorney. He is a Certified Criminal Trial Attorney, certified by the Supreme Court of New Jersey. He is currently of counsel at a 65-attorney New Jersey firm, an adjunct law professor teaching advocacy and persuasion at Seattle Law School, and a legal analyst who has provided commentary on high-profile cases including OJ Simpson, the Menendez brothers, and Scott Peterson. His book, Unequal Justice, is available on Amazon and Barnes & Noble.#HighConflictDivorce #FamilyCourt #ParentalAlienation #JusticeDelayed #CustodyBattle #FalseAllegations #DomesticViolence #CoerciveControl #BeenThereGotOut #UnequalJustice 

You pick your child up from their other parent's, and within minutes, the screaming starts. Maybe they're throwing things. Maybe they're kicking you. Maybe they're saying things you never imagined hearing from your own kid's mouth - things that sound frighteningly like your ex.You're doing everything you can think of. Talking. Reasoning. Setting consequences. Nothing works. And you're starting to wonder if your child is broken... or if you are.You're not. And neither is your child.In this episode, we welcome back Tosha Schore, founder of Parenting Boys Peacefully and co-author of the book "Listen: 5 Simple Tools to Meet Your Everyday Parenting Challenges." Tosha has been a trusted voice in the BTGO community for years, and this conversation may be the most important thing she's shared with us.Here's what she wants you to understand: when your child comes home from the other household and erupts, that behavior is almost never about you. Their limbic system, the emotional brain, has been flooded by stress, fear, and unpredictability. Their prefrontal cortex, the part of the brain responsible for reasoning, self-regulation, and respect, is offline. You can't talk them out of it. You can't punish them out of it. And time-outs make it worse.What you can do - what actually works - is exactly what Tosha walks us through in this conversation.In this episode, you'll learn:→ Why children in high-conflict divorce situations are wired for aggression, and why it's a fear response, not a character flaw→ The one thing you should do first when your child is escalating (hint: it's not talking)→ Why consequences and time-outs create the exact opposite of what you need in these moments→ The stay-listening technique and why staying quiet and present is the most powerful tool you have→ What to say (and what NOT to say) when your child is in a rage spiral→ The note-under-the-door strategy that has helped hundreds of parents reconnect with an escalating child→ The surprising reason why your child's laughter after hurting you doesn't mean they don't care→ How to use "special time" to rebuild connection — and why it creates a window into your child's inner world when nothing else will→ The difference between a stress-driven outburst and a chronic pattern that needs more support→ Why the fastest way to earn respect from your dysregulated child is to stop demanding it in that momentTosha also shares what she calls "good enough parenting shape," and why what you need most before your child gets home is to take care of yourself first, so you can show up fully for them.If your child seems to become a different person after exchanges - angrier, crueler, more out of control - you need to hear this conversation. And if you've ever felt your ex's voice coming out of your child's mouth while they're screaming at you, that's not your imagination. Tosha has words for that too.

If seeing your ex, even from across a parking lot, sends your body into overdrive, you're not overreacting. You're experiencing a trauma response. And it has a name.In this episode, Lisa sits down with Dr. Andrea DePetris, a clinical psychologist at Yale School of Medicine and private practice therapist, for a conversation that will genuinely change how you understand yourself in these moments.We start with something that gets thrown around a lot - the word "trigger" - and Dr. DePetris explains precisely what it means in a trauma context: a stimulus that activates your trauma memory network and makes your brain and body feel like the danger is happening right now. Not overreaction. Biology.From there, we dig into the window of tolerance, a concept developed by psychiatrist Dan Siegel that describes the range in which we can think clearly, connect with our kids, and respond (rather than react) to what's in front of us. Trauma narrows that window. Chronic high-conflict divorce narrows it even further. And when something pushes us outside that window, our nervous system responds in one of two ways: it speeds everything up (hyperarousal: fast talking, heat in the body, urgency, needing to win), or it slows everything down (hypoarousal: going quiet, shrinking, emotional flatness, checking out).Both responses make complete sense. Both were designed to protect you. And both can absolutely get in the way of the parent you want to be in that moment.he good news (and Dr. DePetris is practical and clear about this) is that these patterns are learnable and changeable. In this conversation, she walks you through exactly what to do in the moment and how to build the self-regulation muscle when you're not activated, so it's available to you when you are.What you'll take away from this episode:→ The clinical definition of a trigger — and why trigger warnings may not work the way we think→ How to recognize whether you tend toward hyperarousal or hypoarousal when you encounter your ex→ The single best thing to do in any activation moment (spoiler: it's a pause — but Dr. DePetris shows you exactly what that looks like for each response type)→ A breathing technique you can practice with your children right now: breathe in like you're smelling flowers, exhale long like you're blowing out birthday candles→ The '5 neutral things' grounding exercise and why naming them moves you from feeling to observation→ Why stepping away isn't avoiding — it's modeling self-regulation for your kids→ How to repair with your children after a hard moment, and why kids don't need perfect parents — they need present onesDr. Andrea DePetris is a clinical psychologist at Yale School of Medicine and works with adults in private practice. She specializes in helping people understand the internal patterns — shaped by early life and relationship history — that drive how they feel and respond, and supports them in updating those patterns to feel more integrated and at peace.#CoParenting #HighConflictDivorce #WindowOfTolerance #Triggers #EmotionalRegulation #NarcissisticEx #CustodyExchange #TraumaResponse #HighConflictCoParenting #ParentalAlienation #DivorceRecovery #ToxicEx #GroundingTechniques #MentalHealth #BeenThereGotOut

If your ex keeps dragging you back to court - filing motion after motion just to control, harass, and drain you, you already know how the legal system can become the abuser's most powerful weapon. What you might not know is that California is on the verge of changing that.In this episode, Lisa sits down with Monique, one of BTGO's own success stories. After years of navigating the family court system herself, Monique went to law school and founded the Women's Healing Resource Clinic SoCal, a grassroots domestic violence advocacy organization. And she's here to break down a bill that has us genuinely excited: California Senate Bill 1192, known as the RECLAIM Act.This legislation is designed specifically to address post-separation abuse through vexatious litigation — the pattern of filing frivolous court motions not because the filer expects to win, but because being in court means being close to you. It means draining your money, disrupting your work, and reminding you who still holds power over your life.Here's what SB 1192 would actually do, in plain language:- The three-part framework of SB 1192: how to qualify as a victim of litigation abuse, what the affidavit process looks like, and what protections kick in once you do.- Who can write your affidavit: certified domestic violence advocates with 40 hours of DV training under California Evidence Code 1037.1, as well as mental health professionals who know your case.- What "frivolous litigation" actually means under the law, and why the bill's updated language (removing the word "abusive" and leaving just "frivolous") may actually make it easier for survivors to qualify.- The most stunning piece: if approved, all future court filing fees could be waived, and you may be entitled to legal representation at no charge.- How to support the bill right now, including how to contact Senator Rubio's office, how to share your survivor story in a way that makes the most impact, and what Lisa learned from giving live testimony for Connecticut's Jennifer's Law.- What the national coercive control law landscape looks like, from California to Connecticut to Utah to the UK, and how to push for similar legislation in your own state.- The role of domestic violence resource centers in your area (and why so many survivors never think to call them).PLUS: Monique shares her incredible personal journey — from being a client of Lisa and Chris's coaching practice, to representing just 2% of Latina women who go on to become attorneys. Her story is a powerful reminder that people do rebuild, and that sometimes, that rebuilt life becomes a force for change.ADVOCATE FOR SB 1192:- Contact Senator Susan Rubio's office: sd22.senate.ca.gov- Co-sponsor: Family Violence Appellate Project (Oakland, CA)

What if the moment your child starts pulling away isn't a sign of failure, but the beginning of a chapter you can still write?Dr. Gloria Vanderhorst has spent 50 years as a psychologist inside divorce cases, family courts, and the offices of struggling parents. What she's learned might change the way you see everything.In this powerful conversation, Lisa sits down with Dr. Vanderhorst to explore the real psychology behind parental alienation - how it starts, why children pull away, what's actually happening inside your child's developing mind, and what you can do right now to protect and rebuild your relationship with them.Dr. Vanderhorst introduces a framework that most parents have never heard: divorce doesn't just disrupt your child's relationship with you, it disrupts their sense of place and their attachment to the world itself. When children lose two of their three core attachments simultaneously, their behavior shifts in ways that look like alienation but are rooted in survival. Understanding this changes everything.She also offers a deeply compassionate reframe for parents whose children are actively refusing contact: treat your child like a traumatized rescue animal who needs to earn safety at their own pace, not a family member who owes you time. Set your ego aside. Give them space. Stay consistent. That patience, she explains, is what eventually brings children back - and she has decades of cases to prove it.If your relationship with your child has been damaged by a toxic co-parent, this conversation gives you both the psychological foundation for understanding what's happening and the practical strategies for responding with patience, dignity, and hope.WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE✅ Why divorce disrupts a child's three core attachments — and what that means for their behavior✅ The subtle, nonverbal ways alienation happens without any spoken words✅ How to talk about your ex's traits in ways that help your child without harming yourself✅ What to do when your child's alienation is getting worse, not better✅ Why age 14 is the most critical and dangerous period for refusal behavior✅ The 'letter strategy' that kept one father connected across years of complete estrangement — and resulted in every one of his children returning✅ How to survive the shame and social isolation that comes with being a rejected parent✅ A simple feelings vocabulary tool that can help you and your children rebuild emotional connectionABOUT DR. GLORIA VANDERHORSTDr. Gloria Vanderhorst is a licensed psychologist with 50 years of clinical experience spanning the full human lifespan. She began her practice with preschool children and has worked with individuals and families through every stage of development. Dr. Vanderhorst has extensive experience in divorce-related psychological work, including court testimony, child and adult evaluations, and post-divorce parenting support. Her website offers a range of downloadable resources, including her highly regarded feelings vocabulary sheet.Website: www.drgvanderhorst.com

What CPS Is Actually Looking For When They Knock on Your DoorWhen Child Protective Services shows up during a high-conflict divorce or custody battle, the fear can be overwhelming. You might be terrified of losing your children, furious at your ex for weaponizing the system, and completely in the dark about what happens next.In this episode, Lisa sits down with Sara Vandenberg, a trauma psychotherapist and former CPS caseworker in Texas, for one of the most practical, fear-reducing conversations we've ever had about what CPS investigations actually look like from the inside.Here's what Sara wants you to know before anything else: about 6-7 million children are investigated by CPS each year in the United States. Only about 5% are ever removed from the home. CPS is not a custody agency, and they cannot take your children and give them to your ex. That's not how the system works.Sara pulls back the curtain on the risk-versus-danger framework that CPS workers use when they walk into your home. Risk is the deer crossing sign on the road at night. Danger is the deer standing in the middle of the road. CPS is concerned with danger, not with judging you as a parent.She also shares something critical that surprises most parents: CPS is not looking to see if you are a good or bad parent. They are looking to see if your child is safe. Understanding this distinction can completely change how you approach a CPS investigation and how the investigator perceives you.

Have you ever looked back at your relationship with your ex and wondered: how did I get here? Why did I choose someone who would eventually turn the courts, the kids, maybe even your own family against you? Why did this feel so normal... at first? The answer might be encoded in your DNA. In this conversation, Lisa sits down with Dr. Sylvia Kalachinsky — a PhD family therapist with 21 years of clinical experience, a faculty career that took her from Mount Sinai Medical Center to working with migrant families in the California fields, and a newly released book called “Lonely AF.” She is also someone who grew up with a narcissistic father and learned, in adulthood, to trace her own relational patterns back to their roots. Together, they unpack intergenerational trauma — not as a heavy clinical term, but as the lived experience of patterns passed down through families across at least three generations. Patterns encoded not just in behavior but, according to the science of epigenetics, in your actual DNA. In this episode, you'll discover: - Why we are often unconsciously attracted to partners who mirror how we felt emotionally with our primary caregivers, even if that feeling was painful - The science behind “your nervous system will reject what's unfamiliar, even if it feels good,” and why a healthy relationship can feel suspiciously boring at first - Big T vs. little t trauma - why your pain counts even if it “didn't seem that bad” - How to do a genogram to identify the patterns your own family has been running for generations - The BODY Skill: a 90-second grounding technique you can use silently in mediation, at a deposition, or while waiting for a call from your lawyer - Why your healing is the single most powerful gift you can give your children and how modeling emotional regulation stops the cycle of transmission Lisa also shares her own story about how, after 20 years in a high-conflict marriage, a loving, stable relationship initially felt “too boring.” Her nervous system had been conditioned to chaos. The moment you hear Dr. Sylvia's response to that story might be the thing you share with a friend today. Whether you're in the middle of a custody battle, co-parenting with someone you can't trust, or already on the other side and trying to make sure the cycle ends with you — this conversation is going to give you something you've been looking for. Dr. Sylvia's new book “Lonely AF: A Therapist's No-B.S. Guide to Feeling Less Alone” is available now. Find Dr. Sylvia at: Instagram @doctorsylviak | drsylviak.com | The Doctor Sylvia K Show podcast

Your child cried at your house about how much they hate going to their other parent's home. Then you found out they had a great time. Or they came home from your ex's house perfectly happy, when you expected them to be upset. Or they told you one thing — and told your ex something completely different. It can feel like a betrayal. Or proof that something is wrong at the other house. Or maybe it makes you doubt your own perception of what's happening. Here's what's actually going on — and it's less alarming than you might think. Dr. Jill Leibowitz is a clinical psychologist and play therapist in New York City who works with children and families navigating high-conflict divorce and co-parenting situations. In her third conversation with Lisa and Been There Got Out, Dr. Jill unpacks one of the most confusing and emotionally loaded experiences in shared custody: why children behave so differently depending on which parent they're with — and what it means for you as the parent trying to protect them. This conversation also addresses what happens when parents respond to the "two-faced" experience in ways that escalate conflict — even when they mean well. From reporting back what the kids said, to demanding consistency in rules, to getting pulled into a group text where the kids are being used to pressure a decision, Dr. Jill walks through the specific behaviors that keep the conflict burning and the concrete steps parents can take instead.  In this conversation: - Why kids bring different emotional parts of themselves to each parent — and why that's developmentally normal - What it means when your child complains about the other parent's home (and what it doesn't mean) - The "code switching" concept: how kids adapt to different homes the same way they adapt to different classrooms - Why demanding the same bedtime, diet, and screen time rules in both homes creates more conflict than it solves - The group text trap: what your ex is doing and the precise way to step out of it - Why children who seem to want decision-making power are often overwhelmed by it — and what to do instead - How to be the parent your child brings their full self to, not just the brave parts or the scared parts  If you've been confused, hurt, or worried by your child's behavior between homes, this is the conversation that will finally make sense of it.  CONNECT WITH DR. JILL LEIBOWITZ: Website: https://realtkseveryday.com Instagram: @realtkseveryday Facebook: Real Talks Everyday  #KidsBehavior #CoParentingHelp #HighConflictCustody #ChildTherapist #DivorceKids #ParentingAfterDivorce #CoParenting #ParallelParenting #NarcissisticEx #FamilyLaw 

When Kasia Bukowska's horses refused to cooperate, she thought she was failing. What she discovered instead changed everything she understood about trauma, healing, and why we stay stuck. Kasia is a Polish equine-assisted therapist, equestrian coach, and artist who has spent years learning how to use horses as healing partners for clients working through deep emotional pain - including survivors of narcissistic abuse, people in the middle of high-conflict divorces, and anyone whose nervous system has been shattered by years of coercive control. But here's the most important thing she says right at the start of this conversation: you don't need a horse. The lessons horses teach — about nervous system regulation, about authenticity, about the way your energy affects everyone around you — apply to your dog, your cat, a rabbit, even a tree. If you've ever wondered why you can't seem to calm down no matter how hard you try, or why you walk into a custody evaluation dysregulated even though you desperately want to present well, this conversation is going to give you a completely different lens for understanding what's happening in your body. Lisa and Kasia go deep on how horses act as biological mirrors — literally responding to your internal state in real time — and what that reveals about the patterns keeping you stuck. Including a story about a giant shire horse and a little wooden pole that will stay with you. In this episode: 00:00 - Introduction: Who is Kasia Bukowska and why horses?01:45 - The one thing Kasia says immediately: you don't need a horse!03:30 - Kasia's background: equestrian coach, equine-assisted therapist, and artist05:20 - How she discovered the connection between her paintings and her horses' messages08:10 - What actually happens in an equine-assisted therapy session12:00 - Why Kasia works with horses at liberty (no halters, no riding) and what that makes possible16:30 - How a horse responds when you're reliving trauma vs. when you're regulated19:45 - "The way you do one thing is the way you do everything" - what this means for your healing24:00 - The cavaletti story: what a ton of horse taught one client about softening instead of pushing30:15 - How addiction, self-harm, and deep shame show up in equine sessions33:40 - What to do if you see horses on the side of the road and can't stop36:20 - How to use any animal (or a tree!) as a grounding tool right now40:10 - Can you do equine therapy online? Kasia explains how44:30 - How to find equine-assisted learning and equine gestalt practitioners near you47:00 - Where to find Kasia: Instagram, websites, and upcoming webinars Find Kasia Bukowska:Instagram (coaching): @equestrian_kasha_bukowskaInstagram (art): @kasha_bukowska_artCoaching & therapy: hearthorseexperience.comArtwork: kashabukowska.com Been There Got Out:We are Lisa Johnson and Chris Barry: veteran high-conflict divorce, custody, and co-parenting strategists who help targeted parents navigate one of the most painful experiences a person can face. We fill the gap between what family law attorneys are trained to do and what therapists understand about the legal system. If your ex has a personality disorder, if you're fighting to protect your relationship with your children, or if you're trying to rebuild your life after years of coercive control, you are in the right place! #equinetherapy #traumahealing #narcissisticabuserecovery #nervousystemregulation #highconflictdivorce #equineасsistedtherapy #healingafterabuse #beentheregotout 

No one believes you.  You've said it in every room. To every professional. To the judge, the GAL, the CPS worker. You didn't do this. The allegations are false. And yet — somehow — your children are not with you.  There's a tool that most people in your situation have never heard of. It's not new. It's not experimental. It's legally recognized, it produces a certified written report within 24 hours, and it has caused CPS cases to be dropped and charges dismissed before parents ever set foot in a courtroom.  It's a polygraph — and not the made-for-TV version you're thinking of.  Lisa brought polygraph examiner David Goldberg onto the show specifically because false allegations are one of the most devastating — and most common — tactics used by toxic co-parents in high-conflict custody battles. David has administered more than 20,000 tests over 25 years, many of them for parents exactly like you: falsely accused, emotionally overwhelmed, and desperately looking for something concrete to fight back with.  This conversation covers the practical reality of polygraph testing in custody situations: what it actually costs in time and emotion, what the report contains, how attorneys and judges interact with it, and — perhaps most surprisingly — how many people find the experience therapeutically transformative, not just legally valuable.  About David Goldberg: David Goldberg is a state-licensed, advanced board-certified polygraph examiner based in Virginia. He spent the early part of his career in law enforcement, where he watched innocent people struggle to prove their innocence in a system that defaulted to suspicion. That experience drove him to open his private practice, where he now serves individuals outside the criminal system — people dealing with custody battles, workplace conflicts, past trauma, and more. With nearly 25 years of practice and more than 20,000 examinations behind him, David is also a court-certified expert witness. He is one of the few examiners in the country who takes a full-day approach to each client — never watching the clock, never rushing to the next appointment — because he understands that the conversations that happen before the test determine the accuracy and usefulness of everything that follows.  

You know you shouldn't react. You know exactly what your ex is doing when they push, bait, violate the court order, or put the kids in the middle. You've read the articles. You've heard about grey rock. You're smart — you've built a career, raised children, solved genuinely complex problems.And you still react. Every time.This is not a character flaw. This is your nervous system doing exactly what years of coercive control trained it to do — and no amount of willpower changes a nervous system. You have to work with it.Dr. Jordin Wiggins is a naturopathic doctor, author of The Pink Canary, and fellow survivor who has spent years studying exactly this: why the people least likely to be fooled are the ones most likely to be targeted, what coercive control does to the body at a physiological level, and how to start reclaiming your regulation — and your identity — one small pleasure at a time.Dr. Wiggins' clinical work began at the intersection of women's health and sexual dysfunction — and she quickly realized that a significant portion of the women she was seeing with libido issues were also living with coercive control and abuse. That professional observation, combined with her own experience as a survivor who didn't recognize her abusive relationship until the damage was deep, shaped an entirely new area of practice. She developed a healing model rooted in pleasure — not as a luxury, but as a physiologically grounded return to the self that coercive control erases. Through her book The Pink Canary, her Pleasure Collective community (founded in 2018), and her Pleasure Principles Podcast, she has supported thousands of survivors in reclaiming their sense of self from the inside out. She works with high-functioning, high-achieving survivors who carry the double burden of 'I should have known better' — and she has a particular gift for helping them understand why their very excellence made them a target.00:00 — Introduction: The impossible co-parenting situation — and why smart people keep getting baited01:45 — How Dr. Wiggins discovered the coercive control connection through clinical work in women's health04:20 — Super traits: the qualities that make you exceptional — and that make you a target07:10 — The professional's shame: 'I counsel people on abuse and I didn't see it in my own home'09:30 — The boiled frog analogy: how coercive control escalates in ways that are impossible to detect in real time11:45 — Why the violent incident model of abuse completely misses coercive control — and leaves survivors unprotected14:00 — How small moments of deference establish power dynamics long before abuse is recognizable17:20 — When the erosion is complete: Dr. Wiggins' personal turning point — 'I didn't know what food I liked'20:10 — What chronic hypervigilance does to the body — sleep, weight, immunity, mood, thought clarity23:30 — The MRI research on pleasure centers: abuse literally turns off your brain's capacity for desire27:45 — Pleasure research: how discovering what you want — even in tiny ways — starts rebuilding identity31:00 — Emotional baiting decoded: what it does to your nervous system and why your response is predictable35:20 — A real case study: a male client being deliberately baited through court order violations in front of the children39:00 — The wise owl, watchdog, possum model: how to identify where your brain is in a triggered moment42:30 — Overexplaining — the most expensive mistake in co-parenting with a toxic ex, and how to stop46:00 — Learning to feel your feelings: why victims of coercive control lose access to their own emotional experience50:15 — The feelings wheel and why naming the precise emotion is the first step to regaining power53:40 — Holding rage at an unjust system while still functioning — and not getting stuck in it57:00 — The lotion challenge: five minutes,

There's a moment most people in our community know well. Your phone lights up with a message from your ex. Or you're sitting in the parking lot outside the courthouse. Or you're on the phone with your attorney and your voice starts shaking.You know the response you want to give. You know the person you want to be in that moment. And then something happens — a thought spiral, a surge of adrenaline, a reaction you didn't plan — and afterward, you're sitting there wondering what just happened.That's not a character flaw. That's dysregulation. And it is absolutely something you can learn to change.Our guest today, Bonnie Butler, knows this from two directions: as someone who lived through her own version of emotional chaos — adopting six traumatized teenagers at once after years of fostering — and as a certified emotional regulation coach who has helped hundreds of clients transform the way they respond to stress, conflict, and the impossible situations life throws at them.This conversation with Lisa is one of those episodes where you'll want to stop and take notes. Or maybe you'll just find yourself nodding along, because finally someone is naming what you've been experiencing.Timestamps:00:00 — Opening: the problem of knee-jerk reactions with a toxic ex01:20 — Bonnie defines emotional regulation in plain language03:45 — The pause technique: interrupting the thought spiral with a physical cue07:10 — Why holding your breath makes rational thought impossible09:30 — Bonnie introduces herself: from overwhelmed foster/adoptive mom to regulation coach14:00 — The turning point: hitting a wall and learning the hard way18:20 — Why no one ever teaches us to manage our emotions21:40 — Her 12-week program and what transformation actually looks like25:00 — Why clients resist the tools at first — and what happens when they try anyway29:15 — Self-regulation explained: what it feels like when you've got it33:00 — Co-regulation: how your state spreads to everyone around you37:20 — The heartbreaking thing that happens when kids try to regulate their parents40:45 — How modeling regulation teaches your kids to regulate themselves43:00 — "Name it to tame it": why naming an emotion is the first step to releasing it46:15 — "The anxiety I'm feeling" vs. "my anxiety": a small shift, a big door48:30 — Meet Jim: how one client made friends with their anxiety to stop being controlled by it51:00 — Our thoughts are not facts — and you don't have to keep every thought you have54:20 — The thought closet: choosing what you keep and what you let go57:00 — Change, loss, and grief — why healing always has a harder side01:01:00 — "Paddles in the canoe": taking back the steering wheel of your life01:04:30 — What you focus on grows: the profound shift in how Bonnie saw her own life01:08:00 — From "what might have been" to "what could be"01:12:00 — How to connect with BonnieConnect with Bonnie Butler:Website & booking: bonniebutlercoaching.comInstagram: @bonniebutlercoachingFacebook: Bonnie Butler CoachingEmail: bonnie@bonniebutlercoaching.com#EmotionalRegulation #HighConflictDivorce #CustodyBattle #CoParentingHelp #NarcissistEx #DivorceCoach #BonnieButler #BeenThereGotOut

If your spouse owns a business — or if you co-own one together — your divorce just got significantly more complicated. The business isn't just a job. It's potentially a marital asset, a hidden income source, and a leverage point all at once. And if your ex controls the books? You may have no idea what it's actually worth.In this episode, we sit down with Sara Nanchanatt, a forensic accountant and founder of SN Forensics in New York City, to break down exactly what a business valuation is, why it matters so much in divorce, and what you can actually do — right now, and often for free — to start building your financial picture even when your ex isn't cooperating.About Sara Nanchanatt:Sara Nanchanatt is a forensic accountant and the founder of SN Forensics, a forensic accounting firm based in New York City that works remotely with clients across the United States. Sara and her team specialize in divorce-related financial analysis, including business valuations, income available for support calculations, and uncovering financial manipulation by business-owning spouses. Sara brings a practical, cost-conscious approach to forensic accounting — her firm offers multiple levels of service, from streamlined "indication of value" analyses used in mediation all the way to full court-ready expert reports. Her goal is always to make sure that whatever you spend on financial analysis actually makes sense given the value of what's at stake.TIMESTAMPS:00:00 - Introduction: Business and divorce — why it's uniquely complicated01:20 - Sara introduces herself and SN Forensics02:05 - When one spouse doesn't have access to the business financials: what to do03:10 - The "check your mail" strategy for identifying unknown financial accounts03:45 - What IRS tax transcripts are, how to get them, and why they matter05:00 - What a business valuation is and why courts care about it05:50 - How forensic accountants identify income hidden in business expenses06:40 - "Instant poverty syndrome": when the business mysteriously loses money before divorce07:30 - What happens when tax fraud surfaces in a divorce proceeding08:20 - Using business valuations as leverage to push your ex toward settlement09:10 - Service businesses and the "discount for lack of marketability"09:50 - Free spousal labor in a business — and why it may not protect you in court11:00 - Types of valuation: back of the envelope, indication of value, and full expert report12:00 - How to find Sara Nanchanatt and SN ForensicsConnect with Sara Nanchanatt:

Sara Vandenburg brings a perspective you won't find anywhere else: she's both a highly credentialed therapist specializing in childhood sexual abuse AND a survivor who has done the deep healing work to talk about her own experience "like the weather." In this profoundly important conversation with Lisa Johnson, Sara shares insights that could literally save children's lives and transform families.Why Sara's voice matters: As someone who experienced incest by both biological parents over an eight-year period and has trained extensively in trauma therapy (LCSW Supervisor, Certified Sex Addiction Therapist, Brain Spotting certified), Sara understands both the clinical realities and the lived experience of familial sexual abuse. Her ability to discuss her own trauma with complete peace demonstrates what's possible with proper therapeutic support.This interview offers guidance no other resource provides - the intersection of professional expertise, personal recovery, and practical strategies for parents navigating the most difficult situations imaginable in high-conflict custody cases.What You'll Learn:✅ How one in three girls and one in ten boys experience childhood sexual abuse✅ Why incest may occur in one in ten households (and why it's severely underreported)✅ The critical difference between sexual abuse by anyone vs. abuse within families✅ Sara's concept of the "elephant in the room" - why untreated trauma affects your children✅ How family secrets travel through generations even when children don't know the details✅ The neuroscience behind why stored trauma in your body creates vulnerability in your kids✅ A powerful story of three-generational disclosure and healing✅ How to create an environment where children feel safe telling you anything✅ Why your reaction to small disclosures determines whether children will share bigger concerns✅ What brain spotting therapy is and how it releases stored trauma from the body✅ How brain spotting differs from EMDR (both use bilateral brain stimulation)✅ The importance of finding therapists who understand your trauma doesn't define you✅ Age-appropriate language for teaching body safety to children as young as 4-5✅ Why pornography exposure at ages 8-9 means earlier conversations are essential✅ Documentation strategies when you notice behavioral changes in your child✅ How to distinguish between patterns and isolated incidents✅ Understanding healthy shame (humanity, humility, responsibility)✅ Understanding healthy guilt (values and amends)✅ What complete healing looks like - being able to discuss trauma matter-of-factly✅ Why waiting until children are 25+ is often best for certain disclosuresAbout Sara Vandenburg, LCSW-S: Sara Vandenburg is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker Supervisor in Texas and Licensed Clinical Social Worker in Hawaii with specialized training in treating familial sexual abuse and trauma. Her credentials include:- Licensed Clinical Social Worker Supervisor (Texas)- Licensed Clinical Social Worker (Hawaii)- Certified Sex Addiction Therapist- Licensed Chemical Dependency Counselor- Certified in Brain Spotting (advanced somatic therapy)Sara's micro-niche is familial sexual abuse, and she offers counseling, coaching, and energy healing services through her practice. Her forthcoming book, "Choosing to Love Again: Overcoming the Kind of Betrayal That Nobody Talks About," provides 60% personal memoir and 40% clinical guidance with experiential exercises for healing from profound betrayal.

Making critical decisions in high-conflict divorce when you can barely trust your own judgment? This interview is essential viewing. After experiencing gaslighting, manipulation, and betrayal in a toxic relationship, many people struggle to trust their instincts—especially when the stakes are highest. Should you push for a custody evaluation? Is your ex really alienating the kids, or are you being paranoid? How do you read the Guardian ad Litem? What if you're wrong about everything? Strategic intuition expert Jock Brocas—who used intuitive intelligence to stay alive in military operations and high-risk security situations—shares practical techniques for cutting through fear and confusion to make sound decisions when everything is on the line. This conversation goes far beyond typical "trust your gut" advice. You'll learn pattern recognition techniques, box breathing for high-stakes court situations, and how to distinguish between fear-based panic and genuine intuitive warning signs. These are military-grade tools adapted for family court survival. Perfect for anyone facing custody evaluations, court hearings, mediation with a difficult ex, or any high-conflict situation where you need clarity but fear is clouding your judgment. WHAT YOU'LL LEARN:✓ Strategic intuitive intelligence: Combining your experiences, training, and natural intuition✓ Why fear gives you the wrong signals exactly when you need accuracy most✓ Pattern recognition for identifying your ex's manipulation tactics✓ How to tell if it's genuine intuition or just anxiety/ego✓ Box breathing: Military technique for staying calm in court or evaluations✓ The power of "the pause" before responding to provocations✓ Simple practices that train your mind to recognize signals vs. noise✓ Why going silent is your superpower in high-conflict situations ABOUT JOCK BROCAS:Jock Brocas brings a unique combination of military intelligence, high-risk security experience, and spiritual research to the question of how we make critical decisions under pressure. With 25+ years as a professional medium and extensive work in executive protection and undercover operations, Jock now works with lawyers, scientists, and professionals on strategic intuition. He's completing a master's in psychology (PhD starting October) and founded Help4Lawyer to support legal professionals in high-stakes cases. Author of "Powers of the Sixth Sense." LIKE this video if it helped you see your situation more clearly. SUBSCRIBE for weekly expert guidance on high-conflict divorce. COMMENT: What decision are you facing right now where you need better intuition? #HighConflictDivorce #CustodyEvaluation #FamilyCourt #StrategicIntuition #DivorceStrategy #ToxicCoParent #CourtPreparation #GuardianAdLitem #CustodyBattle #IntuitiveIntelligence

"I'll never trust again."That's what Lisa thought after discovering the truth about her nearly 20-year marriage—the serial affairs, the unprotected sex that put her health at risk, the father-in-law who helped finance the betrayals while smiling at Sunday family dinners. For two years, she told only three friends, consumed by shame and terrified that if others knew the truth, she'd never have the chance to "fix" her family.Maybe you've thought those same words. Maybe you're living that same silence right now.In this deeply personal conversation, Lisa opens up about her own betrayal trauma journey while Dr. Debi Silber—who conducted a PhD study specifically on betrayal after experiencing it twice herself—explains why betrayal destroys us differently than any other loss, and more importantly, how to actually heal.If you're stuck in hypervigilance, unable to trust your own judgment, or wondering if you'll ever feel safe again, this conversation offers both validation and a clear roadmap forward.IN THIS CONVERSATION:- Why betrayal feels intentional in ways other trauma doesn't—and why that matters for your healing- The "Window of Willingness" that reveals instantly whether your partner is truly remorseful or just protecting themselves- The five stages everyone moves through after betrayal (and why being "fine" might actually mean you're stuck in Stage 3)- Why you can't trust others until you rebuild trust with yourself first—and exactly how to do that- How Lisa went from "I'll never trust again" to an 11-year relationship built on genuine safety- The critical difference between a betrayer who has potential to change and one who's just buying timeYOU'LL RELATE TO THIS IF:- You discovered your partner's affair and your entire reality feels like a lie- You're stuck replaying moments, wondering "how did I miss the signs?"- You've been told you're "too sensitive" or need to "just get over it"- You're covering for your ex because explaining the truth feels too shameful- You don't know who to trust anymore—including yourself- You're "fine" on the outside but completely numb on the inside- You're co-parenting with the person who betrayed you and it's destroying youDR. DEBI SILBER'S THREE GROUNDBREAKING DISCOVERIES:Discovery #1: Betrayal is fundamentally different from all other trauma because it shatters every aspect of self—your identity, your judgment, your ability to trust reality itself. Traditional grief models don't work because you're not just mourning a loss; you're rebuilding who you are from scratch.Discovery #2: Everyone moves through five predictable stages after betrayal, but most people get stuck in Stage 3—a deceptive phase that looks like healing but is actually just survival mode. This is why therapy often fails: therapists see you're "functioning" and think you're healed, but you're actually trapped behind walls of protection.Discovery #3: You cannot rebuild trust with others until you first rebuild three specific types of trust within yourself: trust in your judgment, trust in your perception of reality, and trust in your ability to make decisions. This is why "just trust again" advice fails—it's asking you to build the roof before you've laid the foundation.ABOUT DR. DEBI SILBER:Dr. Debi Silber is the founder and CEO of The Post Betrayal Transformation Institute. After experiencing betrayal first from her family and then from her husband, she enrolled in a PhD program to study betrayal—even though she "could barely breathe" at the time. Her research led to the three discoveries shared in this video and has transformed how thousands of people understand and heal from betrayal trauma. Her upcoming book "Unstuck" (launching March 22) helps practitioners better support clients dealing with betrayal.RESOURCES:

Is your child struggling with your separation or divorce? Wondering if they need professional help? Licensed play therapist Jenny Hornby joins Lisa to discuss the critical signs that children need therapeutic support during high-conflict divorce - and why getting help for yourself might be even more important.In this essential conversation, you'll discover when therapy becomes necessary, what different therapeutic approaches can offer, and how to find the right mental health professional for your family's specific situation. Jenny shares expert insights on play therapy, EMDR for trauma processing, and why the "oxygen mask principle" applies to parents navigating custody battles.Whether you're just starting separation proceedings or deep into a custody battle, this conversation provides the guidance you need to support your child's emotional wellbeing while taking care of yourself too.

"I finally got out of that toxic relationship! I'm never doing that again!"Six months later: Same person, different body.If this pattern sounds familiar, you're not alone—and according to trauma therapist Sherry Gaba, it's not your fault. But it is something you need to understand if you ever want to break free."Love addicts are in love with love," Sherry explains. "And when they don't have a relationship, it feels like they are in the ethers of emptiness. So they will often settle for less because they feel so empty."That emptiness isn't weakness. It's not being "too needy" or "not strong enough." It's an attachment wound—often formed before you could even speak—that created a nervous system wired to associate chaos with love and safety with boredom.The good news? Once you understand how trauma bonds form, how intermittent reinforcement hijacks your dopamine system, and why your body literally becomes addicted to emotional chaos, you can finally start rewiring your patterns.What Makes This Conversation Essential:

Danny Karon, fondly known as "your lovable lawyer," offers a fresh perspective on the legal system by championing accessibility and empowerment. In this enlightening conversation, Danny shares his journey and mission to demystify legal complexities and reduce the prohibitive costs associated with legal services. With insights from his book "Your Lovable Lawyer's Guide to Legal Wellness," he equips listeners with practical tools to navigate legal challenges independently. We also tackle the evolving role of AI in law, highlighting both its potential and pitfalls, as Danny shares his cautious outlook on its current capabilities.Shifting gears to the courtroom, we explore the unique hurdles faced by women attorneys and the importance of gender equality in the legal profession. Dispelling Hollywood myths, we shine a light on the nitty-gritty of courtroom dynamics. From understanding court rules to the pivotal role of courtroom demeanor, our discussion is packed with real-world tips for those considering self-representation. Danny's anecdotes serve as a powerful reminder that, often, success in court is as much about presentation as it is about the facts.Finally, we delve into the concept of legal wellness, stressing the importance of understanding legal rights to avoid costly missteps. Through high-profile case studies like Amber Heard versus Johnny Depp, we underscore the value of legal literacy. Danny's passion for spreading hope through education is contagious, as he channels his efforts into building a brand that resonates with college students and the general public alike. His aim is simple yet profound: to make the law approachable through humor and clarity, empowering everyone to protect their interests effectively.

What if the child who seems to have it all together is actually struggling the most? Join us as we sit down with Colorado therapist Stacy Schaffer, who offers her expertise on the hidden emotional battles children face during parental conflict and divorce. We examine the façade of the "shiny kid," outwardly thriving yet internally wrestling with feelings of guilt and responsibility. Stacy shares strategies to empower these young ones by focusing on their ability to control their emotions and reactions, providing them with a much-needed sense of agency and resilience.We also explore the creation of "comfort kits," a resourceful way to help children engage their five senses to navigate challenging situations. Discover how to fill these kits with comforting sensory items, such as personalized notes and soothing scents, to offer solace and connection wherever they are. Additionally, we discuss the potential future of counseling services beyond Colorado and Texas, as changes in professional licensing could soon make mental health support more accessible. Tune in for practical strategies and insights that promise to support children in managing their emotions and to stay informed on the evolving landscape of mental health services.

Dr. Elizabeth Polinsky, a distinguished psychologist and marriage and family therapist, returns to share her invaluable insights on one of the most challenging issues faced by military couples: infidelity. With infidelity rates climbing by 22% during deployments, Dr. Polinsky unveils the seven distinct types of affairs that can arise, offering a clearer understanding of the underlying motivations. The conversation delves into the immense stress and separation distress that deployments can impose, often leading to emotional disconnection and conflict that may drive individuals to seek solace elsewhere. Her expertise helps listeners navigate the murky waters of self-blame and relationship challenges.As technology bridges the distance between separated partners, it also introduces new dynamics that can inadvertently fuel infidelity. Our discussion touches on how tools like Wi-Fi on military ships enable frequent communication but also open doors for missteps. Dr. Polinsky categorizes affairs into three main types—protest or revenge, "come and get me," and burnout exit—each with its unique emotional drivers. With her guidance, we unravel the complex emotions at play and the potential pitfalls for long-distance and military relationships, offering a roadmap to understanding and addressing these issues.In our final segment, we tackle the intricate psychological factors that often underpin affairs, especially in those with trauma histories or in hyper-masculine professions. We explore the role of compulsive sexual behavior as an escape from emotional pain, drawing connections to childhood experiences that stunt emotional growth. Dr. Polinsky underscores the importance of understanding and patience, highlighting the potential for healing and growth despite the challenges. Through her insights, we aim to inspire hope and foster long-term commitment to change, providing a beacon of hope for those navigating the complexities of infidelity.

Comedian and relationship coach Paul Roseberry joins us for a candid chat about the transformative power of confidence in relationships. Discover the "security method," a fresh perspective on understanding personal worth and the courage to walk away from toxic dynamics. Through Paul's blend of humor and wisdom, we address the all-too-common fear that keeps people stuck in need-based relationships and unlock the potential of interest-based connections.Journey with us as we reflect on the profound impact of past relationships on our self-esteem and the art of building a solid foundation before diving into partnerships. With sharp insights and personal anecdotes, we critique the romanticized notions perpetuated by pop culture, encouraging listeners to create intentional relationship goals. This episode is your guide to forming authentic partnerships rooted in mutual respect, with a focus on building self-awareness and a strategic plan for personal growth.Drawing from his personal experiences and challenges, Paul shares stories of resilience, from overcoming poverty and stuttering to thriving as a vegetarian in the 80s. This is a narrative of perseverance, urging listeners to learn from past mistakes and minimize negative thought patterns. In an episode that balances life's struggles with its joys, we leave you with a sense of gratitude, a commitment to personal growth, and a reminder that even amidst technical hiccups, the journey to self-discovery is a rewarding one.

Unlock the secrets to nurturing resilient children with insights from our special guest, Olaolu Ogunyemi, a dedicated Marine officer, mentor, and parenting advocate. Learn how community support can be the cornerstone of raising well-rounded individuals as Olaolu shares his transformative journey from a self-proclaimed "knucklehead" to a respected figure in mentorship. We tackle the isolation challenges modern families face and explore how engaging communities can bolster emotional well-being, providing children with the support they need to thrive.Discover the fine line between discipline and punishment as we navigate the complexities of parenting in the digital age. Together with Olaolu, we delve into strategies for fostering self-discipline and critical thinking in children, equipping them with the tools to become independent decision-makers. Our conversation emphasizes the importance of teaching empathy and emotional intelligence to help children articulate their emotions and build healthier relationships. And, of course, we introduce Olaolu's impactful children's book, "Crow from the Shadow," which beautifully aligns with these themes of self-determination and personal growth.Our episode also celebrates the power of connection, both in family dynamics and in leadership. Through the Parent Child Connect initiative and the upcoming "Lead Last" book, Olaolu inspires us to create supportive environments that nurture future leaders. As you listen, you'll hear a heartfelt exchange of gratitude and respect, underscoring the shared commitment to community support and personal development. Join us in this inspiring episode to gain fresh perspectives on parenting and leadership that may transform how you engage with the young minds in your life.

Join us as we welcome Ron Platt, the founder of the National Association for Single and Divorced Families (NASDF), to discuss the innovative ways this organization is transforming support for single and divorced families. Inspired by the success of AARP, NASDF offers a $19 monthly membership that provides access to a host of benefits aimed at alleviating the financial and emotional burdens faced by its members. Ron shares how NASDF acts as a "Costco for single and divorced families," offering discounts on daycare services, mental health care sessions, and real estate transactions, among others. This episode is packed with insights into how NASDF is creating partnerships and resources, including mediation services and potential collaborations with grocery stores and car dealerships, to enhance the well-being of its members.In our conversation, we also explore NASDF's advocacy for foster care reform, emphasizing the urgent need for systemic change. Ron, who brings personal experience as a foster parent, sheds light on the organization's goals to address underfunding and support overburdened social workers within the foster care system. With a target of reaching 10,000 members, NASDF is committed to championing the needs of foster children and ensuring they receive the care and attention they deserve. This episode is a must-listen for anyone interested in the intersection of community support and social advocacy, as we discuss the importance of staying connected and the excitement surrounding these impactful initiatives.

Could personality disorders be more flexible than we think? Discover surprising insights with psychotherapist Marissa De Sa as she dismantles the misconception that personality disorders are unchangeable. Marissa's expertise in Dialectical Behavior Therapy (DBT) and Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) reveals how our environments and early experiences shape these conditions, providing a pathway to healing and growth. You'll hear about the transformative potential of DBT beyond its roots in treating borderline personality disorder, offering hope for managing a wide range of disorders including narcissistic and obsessive-compulsive types.Marissa takes us on a journey through the structured and life-changing processes of DBT, where motivation, commitment, and dialectics play crucial roles. Dive into the core elements of DBT that help clients cultivate a "wise mind" for managing intense emotions and avoiding impulsive decisions. Through individual therapy and skills groups, clients master mindfulness, interpersonal effectiveness, distress tolerance, and emotion regulation, showcasing promising outcomes in therapy. Plus, discover the visible indicators of success that mark a client's progress and transformation.We also tackle high-conflict situations with practical strategies for effective communication. Learn how DBT's DEAR MAN technique can defuse defensiveness and reduce emotional reactivity, especially in sensitive interactions involving personality disorders or addiction. Explore powerful communication and negotiation tactics, such as those from David Burns' five secrets of effective communication, that offer solutions for high-conflict family dynamics. As we conclude, Marissa emphasizes the significance of hope and the continued conversation around mental well-being, inviting you to stay connected through the resources available at the Cognitive and Behavioral Care Center.

Join us for a compelling discussion with Alexa Sasha, a dedicated narcissistic abuse healer and results coach, as we explore the nuances of emotional and narcissistic abuse and the path to healing. Alexa shares her unique journey from high school special education teacher to a coach focused on helping individuals actualize their dreams. Her background in education has equipped her with the skills to break down complex concepts and advocate for those healing from trauma. Alexa explains the profound impact of narcissistic and emotional abuse, highlighting how it can be more damaging than physical abuse due to its insidious effects on self-esteem, intuition, and even finances.In this episode, we also tackle the challenges of breaking free from toxic cycles, especially when going "no contact" isn't an option. Alexa emphasizes the importance of holistic support that addresses mental, physical, and spiritual needs, recommending practices like breathwork and trauma release exercises. We underscore the role of creativity in healing, with personal stories about rediscovering joy and empowerment through art. Additionally, Alexa introduces her "Lunch, Learn and Heals" workshops, designed to help women navigate the aftermath of toxic relationships with support, connection, and a touch of joy. Whether you're seeking healing or looking to support others, this episode offers valuable insights and resources for anyone on a journey to recovery.

Renowned Los Angeles private investigator Ken Childs takes us inside the world of PI work, from tracking a sneaky cat's midnight escapades to unraveling tangled webs of insurance fraud. Ken's journey began with aspirations in law enforcement, but he found his true calling in the nuanced world of private investigation, where every case is a puzzle and "instant justice" is a rewarding reality. Whether it's navigating emotionally charged divorces or conducting meticulous evidence gathering, Ken's story is one of empathy, skill, and a relentless pursuit of the truth.We also dig into the art of fraud detection, where confidence and a keen eye are crucial—whether you're working in Beverly Hills or a less affluent area. Ken draws us into the heart of complex insurance fraud cases, sharing anecdotes from his career, including a daunting six-year case that's now headed to court. Hear Ken's invaluable advice for selecting the right attorney—one who listens and fights for you—and learn how to document assets to counteract financial deceit during divorces. This episode doesn't just entertain with intriguing stories; it equips listeners with practical insights for navigating the tricky waters of legal and personal affairs.

Join us for an intriguing discussion with Doug Fifer, a former Alaskan police officer and expert negotiator, as we explore the complexities of Alaska's unique environment and its impact on crime. With breathtaking landscapes that mask a darker reality, Doug shares his insights into the high rates of domestic violence and serial killings that plague the state. Discover how isolation, harsh weather, and substance abuse contribute to these issues and learn about the peculiar gender ratio in Alaska and its implications for relationships. Doug also recounts his journey from growing up in the small town of Homer to a 25-year career with the Anchorage Police Department.Listen in as Doug, a seasoned law enforcement officer, shares his invaluable experience in negotiating with difficult individuals. Negotiation skills, Doug explains, are essential not only in law enforcement but also in everyday life, such as mediating custody battles. He reveals key strategies like building rapport and identifying common interests, while emphasizing the importance of honesty to maintain trust and safety in high-stakes scenarios. This conversation sheds light on the mental and physical demands of hostage negotiations, highlighting techniques that can be universally applied to daily interactions.Our conversation takes a closer look at managing emotions during domestic violence cases, particularly in Alaska, where such incidents are prevalent. Doug discusses the challenges officers face and strategies for victims to protect themselves, including the potential role of AI in verifying evidence. He emphasizes the importance of de-escalating situations to prevent further violence and shares a humorous story from his time as a hostage negotiator. As we wrap up, Doug talks about the significance of trusting your instincts for personal safety, particularly in dangerous situations, and introduces his book "Fifty Shades of True Crime," which offers an engaging look into criminal cases from his perspective as a law enforcement officer.

IFS therapist Jane Frumberg joins us on this episode to unravel the profound world of Internal Family Systems Therapy. Jane, who leads Light Within Therapy, distinguishes between family systems therapy and reunification therapy, emphasizing the unique approach of IFS in helping individuals connect with their inner parts, particularly those influenced by trauma. Unlike traditional family systems therapy, which analyzes family roles and dynamics, and reunification therapy, which rebuilds relationships between estranged parents and children, IFS offers a deeply personal exploration. We also tackle the complicated terrain of domestic violence cases, where participating together in therapy may not be advisable.We navigate the challenging waters of high-conflict parenting, focusing on how child therapists play a crucial role in supporting children embroiled in parental disputes. When one parent isn't willing to participate, Jane stresses the power of a steadfast and consistent presence from the engaged parent, offering hope even when a child has been turned against them. Our conversation with Jane is filled with valuable insights and a shared eagerness for future collaborations. We close with gratitude for her expertise, encouraging listeners to remain hopeful and resilient in the face of familial challenges.