Women in Charge

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by porn historian Noelle Perdue, author of the Porn World newsletter. OpenAI announced that they'd allow adult users to have erotic conversations with ChatGPT, just one more way AI and porn are becoming intertwined. As sex becomes more online, not only does it become more solitary, but also more surveilled. Both of these things are intended to divide us, but Noelle is confident that AI's attempted sex-takeover will fail.  This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Scott and Bruce were the hottest couple in church. Scott, a hula dancer, seemed destined for Bruce, the hunky “lumbersexual,” and the church delighted when they got together. Their brief love affair sparkled before Bruce got sick and died. Their story is one of multiple “dress rehearsals”– when friends, family and lovers went through AIDS with their loved ones wondering who would be next and sometimes knowing it might be you.  You can see Scott perform in a 1992 InterPlay piece called “God, Sex and Power” here. He's the one with the bandaids on his knees.  Singing Positive is a two-part documentary film about the San Francisco Gay Men's Chorus (SFGMC) and its experience with AIDS that spans 15 years. The first film, which featured Scott, was produced in 1992 and is hard to find online. The second film, produced in 2009, saw the filmmakers return to SFGMC to explore the impact of AIDS on the chorus over time. The 2009 film, with clips of Scott from the first film, is here. And you can watch some amazing SFGMC performances on their YouTube channel here.  Scott's San Francisco hula school was Nā Lei Hulu I Ka Wēkiu. They celebrated their 40th anniversary in 2025. Scott's teacher and friend, Kumu Patrick Makuakāne is in the 2023 cohort of MacArthur Fellows. His recent work includes Māhū, a work by and with trans hula performers.   On the MCC in Hawai'i, see the Queer Histories of Hawai'i's story here.  For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-7 .  When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Domestic BGM.  “Spirit of the Living God” is by Daniel Iverson. “In the Garden,” also known as “I Come to the Garden Alone” is by C. Austin Miles. It's the favorite hymn of many a Christain mother, aunt, and grandmother. The soloist is Juliette Galuteria, Scott Galuteria and Brickwood Galuteria's mother  “God Prepare Me to Be a Sanctuary” is by Randy Scruggs and John Thompson.   Special thanks to the friends and experts who helped us think through this episode.  Frank DeLuca William Salit and Stan Stone Dr. Rachel Gross Dr. Christopher Cantwell Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.   Some links to good groups: The Hawai'i Health and Harm Reduction Center – reducing the harm and fighting the stigma of HIV in Hawai'i.  International EMS and Firefighter Pride Alliance – courage over adversity.  Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Sunday after Magic Johnson announced his HIV-status, Jim Mitulski preached a sermon on being tired of people dying. We're sharing it as an interlude, a pause, and an immersion into one moment in AIDS' bleak midwinter.  For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/interlude. In the sermon Rev. Mitulski refers to ARC. That means AIDS-Related Complex, a diagnostic category meant to indicate an earlier stage of HIV infection than AIDS. It was common in the period to hear references to both AIDS and ARC.  “Old Devil Time” is by Pete Seeger. The AIDS verses are by MCC San Francisco congregant Paul Francis.  You can see Magic Johnson's press release, announcing his HIV status here.  The biblical passage Rev. Mitulski is preaching on is John 11:1-44. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Domestic BGM.  Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.   Some links to good groups: AIDS Healthcare Foundation – provides medical care and support for people living with HIV/AIDS and preventative care for people at risk for contracting it.  The Magic Johnson Foundation – founded to address HIV/AIDS. Expanded to include education and community engagement.  San Francisco AIDS Foundation – a place to seek information about HIV.  POZ Magazine – a place to learn everything else about HIV (information included).Save AIDS Research – their recent, epic 24 hours to Save Research conference with all the latest HIV research is available on YouTube through this site. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode host Kate Lindsay is joined by writer and content creator Josh Lora, who also goes by TellTheBees. Josh's Substack essay, Boyfriendland, was cited in the viral Vogue article written by Chanté Joseph, “Is Having a Boyfriend Embarrassing Now?” Many women are hiding their boyfriends online, or losing followers if they hard-launch. Some go as far as to say having a boyfriend “feels republican.” Is this heterofatalism gone too far, or a long-overdue correction to the patriarchy? This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It didn't take long to go from Beyoncé holding for applause in front of the word “FEMINISM” to a headline in the New York Times asking “Did Women Ruin the Workplace?” How long is this backlash going to last? Guest:  Danielle Kurtzleben, political correspondent at NPR.  Want more What Next? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and across all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

San Francisco's gay/lesbian community in the 1980s wasn't just facing an AIDS crisis, they also struggled against ongoing  anti-gay violence. In 1989, in the midst of a campaign to legally establish anti-gay violence as a hate crime, MCC San Francisco made headlines when their AIDS minister was attacked in her home. The city, the police department, and the LGBTQ community rallied around the church and the minister. And when they finally solved the puzzle of who did it, the answer shocked the church.  For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-6. The voices from the service after the first attack include Rev. Troy Perry, Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches – “If you come for one of us, you come for all of us.”  Kevin Calegari, Dignity San Francisco – “Somebody by the name of Jesus…” Harry Britt, San Francisco City Supervisor – “It hurts to be reminded of the power of evil.” Gayle Orr-Smith, representative of the Mayor's Office – “I am moved when I hear you say you are an angry people.”  Rev. Duane Wilkerson, United Methodist Church – “But in the event that doubt has crept into your mind…”  Rev. Troy Perry, Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches – “And to the enemies who are attacking us…” “The Call” is by George Herber with music by Vaughan Williams. The soloist is Bob Crocker. “Nearer My God to Thee” is by Sarah Flowers Abrams. Some links to good groups Community United Against Violence – still working for safe communities for queer people.  National Alliance on Mental Illness LGBTQI Information Page The Shanti Project - is a pioneering nonprofit that builds human connections to reduce isolation, enhance health and well-being, and improve quality of life. It innovated enduring models of attentive companionship to people facing the end of life through their work during the height of the AIDS crisis.  The Trevor Project – the leading suicide prevention and crisis intervention non-profit organization for LGBTQ+ young people.  Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Production credits:  When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit http://heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Domestic BGM.  Special thanks to Kelsy Pacha, Dr. Janis Whitlock, and Dr. Mary Hunt for consulting with us about this episode.  Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When Rev. Ron Russell Coons got diagnosed with AIDS he thought a lot about what healing meant when death was certain. He pursued it in his strained and broken family relationships and he preached about it from the pulpit. Though he knew, without a doubt, that he would die from AIDS, Ron claimed that he believed in and had experienced healing. What does healing mean when everybody knows it can't mean survival? Maybe healing is one's biological family and queer kin showing up and reaching for connection across those fractures. For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-5. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Domestic BGM.  “When the Roll is Called Up Yonder” is by James Milton Black.  “Give Me Jesus” is a traditional spiritual arrangement by Charles Ivey. The soloist is Maria Barnet.  “It is Well with My Soul,” also known as “When Peace, Like a River,” is by Horatio Spafford. Thanks to  Ron's family for speaking with us on and off the record. We know this was a stretch and we appreciate it. Dr. Joseph Marchal, for helping us understand Ron's “We Have AIDS” sermon and the biblical text it was based on. It'll be a great special episode one day.  Steve Russell for sharing his memories of Ron and his brother, Chuck Russell Coons. Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As MCC grew as a denomination, they tried to figure out if and how to relate to other churches. Would any befriend a queer church? And if so, would that friendship help other churches shift their perspective on homosexuality? These questions got harder as AIDS numbers grew—it made people more afraid yet friendship more vital. But sometimes friendship emerges in the most unlikely of places. Like when a children's choir visited an AIDS ward in San Francisco and sang for an MCC member there. That connection started a partnership between their churches that changed them both. For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-4. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Production credits:  When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Domestic BGM. “Who Kept Us” is by Dr. Margaret Douroux. “The Wicked Shall Cease” is by Jessy Dixon. “Jesus is Here Right Now” is by Leon Roberts. “Child of God” and “Walk Together Children” are traditional African American spirituals.  Special thanks to Mary Clover Obrzut, Stephen's sister, for insights into his life and for so much great audio. Dr. Cheryl Townsend Gilkes for telling us about Stephen's time at Union Baptist and connecting us with folks there.  Alfred Williams for helping us get connected to Double Rock. Dr. April Parker and Mardy Coates for facilitating the use of “Who Kept Us.”  And to the folks at Double Rock Baptist Church, past and present, especially the beloved Minister of Music.   Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.   Some links to good groups Balm in Gilead – works to integrate public health and faith principles. It was founded by Dr. Pernessa Seale in to help Black churches address HIV/AIDS and support people and families living with AIDS. Double Rock Baptist Church – is still worshipping and ministering in Bayview/Hunters Point. They were deeply involved in community support during the Covid-19 epidemic.  Love All People – is the ministry that introduced MCC to Margaret Douroux's song, Who Kept Us, to MCC.  National Minority AIDS Council – works for heath equality and racial justice to end the AIDS epidemic. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by writer and streamer Laura Kate Dale to talk about what happened to Emiru at this year's TwitchCon. The streamer was assaulted during a meet-and-greet, after a number of female streamers had already dropped out of the convention in fear for their safety. What is it about TwitchCon that makes creators feel unsafe, and why are female streamers, in particular, still paying the price?  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In the late ‘80s, two MCC San Francisco ministers wrote an article called “We Are the Church Alive, the Church with AIDS.” We wanted to know how a gay/lesbian church came to call itself “a church with AIDS.” The answers lie in the years before our audio archive begins. So we started asking people. We explore two stories in what's likely a more complicated shift. One story is about a pair of religion geeks who learned to make queer church in New York during the early years of the AIDS crisis and then came to San Francisco to lead MCCSF. And the other is how an Easter Sunday ritual made the Christian hope of life through death viscerally real. “We Are the Church Alive, the Church with AIDS,” by Kittredge Cherry and Jamies Mitulski was published in the Christian Century on January 27, 1988. For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-3. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Production credits:  When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit http://heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Tasty Morsels.  “We See You God” is a variation on the anonymously written hymn “We See the Lord.” The soloist in “I Lift Mine Eyes Up” is Bob Crocker. It's by Antonin Dvorak, Biblical Songs, Op. 99, no. 9 on Psalm 121.  “Hush, Hush. Somebody's Calling My Name” is a traditional African American spiritual.  Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.   Some links to good groups: The Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco – the congregation's current website.  Metropolitan Community Churches – the denomination of which MCC San Francisco is a part.  San Francisco AIDS Foundation – a place to seek information about HIV.  POZ Magazine – a place to learn everything else about HIV (information included). Save AIDS Research – their recent, epic 24 hours to Save Research conference with all the latest HIV research is available on YouTube through this site.   LGBTQ Religious Archives Network – the place to get lost in LGBTQ+ religious history. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

If you recently lost your job—or think you might lose it soon—Laura Brown and Kristina O'Neill are here to help! On this episode of How To!, Carvell Wallace talks to the authors of All the Cool Girls Get Fired about what to do when you get the ax—and how to turn termination into a real opportunity.  If you liked this conversation, check out the Slate podcast Death, Sex & Money's recent episode on “Why Job Hunting Feels So Grim Lately, Especially for Gen Z.” Looking for a different kind of career advice? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson and Sophie Summergrad. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Christine Brown Woolley grew up in Utah with a dad and two moms, in a polygamist community called the Apostolic United Brethren. When she became an adult, she joined a polygamist marriage as a third wife, helped raise more than a dozen kids, and became co-star of the TLC reality show Sister Wives.  Fast forward to 2025, and she has left her marriage and her polygamist faith. This week, she talks to Anna about the pros and cons of her former lifestyle, how being on a reality show helped her family to confront and process conflicts, and why she's so happy being re-married and monogamous. Her new memoir is Sister Wife: A Memoir of Faith, Family, and Finding Freedom.  This episode was produced by Cameron Drews. Get more Death, Sex & Money with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of DSM and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Death, Sex & Money show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/dsmplus to get access wherever you listen. If you're new to the show, welcome. We're so glad you're here. Find us and follow us on Instagram and you can find Anna's newsletter at annasale.substack.com. Our email address, where you can reach us with voice memos, pep talks, questions, critiques, is deathsexmoney@slate.com. Get 50% Off Monarch Money, the all-in-one financial tool at ⁠www.monarchmoney.com/DSM⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On this episode: Friend of the show Jamilah Lemieux tackles helping kids get a better night's sleep. She's joined by gentle sleep coach Macall Gordon. They discuss what to do with “live-wire kids”, how to avoid burnout when trying to get your kid to sleep, why we need to stop blaming parents for kid sleep issues, and more.  But first, Care and Feeding producer Cheyna Roth joins the team to talk about a recent New York Times piece, “How Video Games Are Shaping a Generation of Boys, for Better and Worse”. They dig into the pros and cons of gaming as a social activity, whether it's possible to get kids to touch grass anymore, and how to navigate these tricky waters.  Join us on Facebook and email us at careandfeedingpod@slate.com to ask us new questions, tell us what you thought of today's show, and give us ideas about what we should talk about in future episodes. You can also call our phone line: (646) 357-9318. If you enjoy this show, please consider signing up for Slate Plus. Slate Plus members get to hang out with us on the Plus Playground every week for a whole additional grab-bag of content — and you'll get an ad-free experience across the network. And you'll also be supporting the work we do here on Care and Feeding. Sign up now at slate.com/careplus – or try it out on Apple Podcasts. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Why would an out queer person in the Gay Liberation Days of the 1970s go to church? What church would they go to? And why would they stay? In the 1960s, and ‘70s, the separation between God and gays was not as vast as it seemed. Rev. Troy Perry started the first Metropolitan Community Church in his Los Angeles living room. Tired of flying to LA every week, a Navy veteran started the second one in a San Francisco gay bar. And the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco was there for a young lesbian as she navigated spirituality, coming out, and her increasingly conservative family. When her friend got sick, she tried to be there for him. Church helped.       For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-2. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Production credits:  When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit http://heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Tasty Morsels.  Thanks to Dr. Heather White, author of Reforming Sodom: Protestants and the Rise of Gay Rights. Scott Bloom and Trogoidia Pictures for the use of clips from the film Call Me Troy. The Center for LGBTQ and Gender Studies at the Pacific School of Religion and the Graduate Theological Union for the use of an archival recording of Troy Perry's last sermon as the minister at MCC Los Angeles.  Kirke Machem for the use of his beautiful composition, “Blow Ye, the Trumpet,” from the opera, John Brown. Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As Outward proudly presents the 10-episode series When We All Get to Heaven, from Eureka Street Productions, Christina and Bryan had the privilege of sitting down with series host Lynne Gerber. Lynne explains how 1,200 cassette tapes became a wealth of archival audio that infuses this series with so much vitality, joy, and shared mourning of queer churches during a devastating epidemic. Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Produced by Palace Shaw. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In 1993, more than 10 years into the AIDS epidemic, the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco (MCC-SF) tries to remember all they've lost. We think about remembering too after encountering an archive of 1,200 cassette recordings of this queer church's services during the height of the epidemic. Whether you're a regular church goer or would never step into one, we invite you to spend time with this LGBTQ+ San Francisco church as it struggles to reconcile sexuality and faith in the midst of an existential crisis.  For images and links about this episode visit https://www.heavenpodcast.org/episode-1. About the montage: The worship service in this episode was on February 28, 1993. The Dyke March proclamation was written and read by Rev. Lea Brown. Rev. Karen Foster read the statement that sexual orientation does not need to be changed. Jim Mitulski recalled his hospital visit with the man who recognized him by his shape. Paul Francis told strangers at a restaurant to get ugly lovers and Eric Rofes told his mother that he was going to stay safe and keep having sex. Cleve Jones had the vision of a thousand rotting corpses, Rev. Ron Russell Coons preached that we have AIDS as a community, and Rev. Troy Perry proclaimed a revival on Eureka Street. The other people heard in the episode are either unknown or did not want to be named.    When We All Get to Heaven is produced by Eureka Street Productions. It is co-created by Lynne Gerber, Siri Colom, and Ariana Nedelman. Our story editor is Sayre Quevedo. Our sound designer is David Herman. Our managing producer is Krissy Clark. Tim Dillinger is our consulting producer and Betsy Towner Levine is our fact-checker. We had additional story editing help from Sarah Ventre, Arwen Nicks, Allison Behringer, and Krissy Clark. For a complete list of credits, please visit http://heavenpodcast.org/credits. This project received generous support from individual donors, the Henry Luce Foundation (www.hluce.org), the E. Rhodes and Leona B. Carpenter Foundation, and California Humanities, a non-profit partner of the National Endowment for the Humanities (www.CalHum.org). Eureka Street Productions has 501c3 status through our fiscal sponsor FJC: A Foundation of Philanthropic Funds. The music for this episode is from the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco's archive. It was performed by MCC-SF's musicians and members with Bob Crocker and Jack Hoggatt-St.John as music directors. Additional music is by Tasty Morsels.  Thanks to Paul Katz and Henry Machen for permission to use “June in San Francisco” from their fabulous 1991 musical Dirty Dreams of a Clean Cut Kid. The estate of Leonard Bernstein for the use of “Somewhere” from West Side Story.  Great thanks, as always, to the members and clergy of the Metropolitan Community Church of San Francisco who made this project possible.  Get more Outward with Slate Plus! Join for weekly bonus episodes of Outward and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Outward show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or visit slate.com/outwardplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Contemporary women are primal-screaming and hitting rage rooms, but are these really the solutions to our personal and political anger? On this episode of How To!, Courtney Martin talks with Soraya Chemaly, journalist and author of Rage Becomes Her: The Power of Women's Anger, about her own recent upsurge of anger. Soraya explains how to identify, understand, and harness what's bottled up inside you—and use it for change. If you liked this episode check out How To Make Imposter Syndrome Your Superpower and How To Be Lonely.  Do you have a problem that needs solving? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson, with Sophie Summergrad. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by culture writer Aja Romano to try to make sense of Theo Von. Von was one of the podcasters credited with helping Donald Trump win the election, but in recent months, he's deviated from the administration when it comes to his views on ICE raids and the war in Gaza. Who is Theo Von, really? What does it mean that influencers like him are part of the future of politics? And what does it say about us if we find him…kinda funny? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Kate Lindsay and Candice Lim wade through the negative reactions to Taylor Swift's album The Life of a Showgirl. From outdated meme references to clunky shots at other female artists, Swift's album indicates an oddly distant relationship with the internet. However, is she a devious online mastermind or a blundering millennial? Plus, why it's important that this album's backlash has gone largely unchallenged by fellow Swifties. Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by Slate senior editor Tony Ho Tran to talk about why it matters that EA Games has been sold to Saudi Arabia and Jared Kushner. In addition to likely cost-cutting, this new ownership puts games like The Sims even more at risk of censorship, especially when it comes to LGBTQ+ characters. If your Sim groom can't end up making out with his new father-in-law at the end of his wedding, then what is The Sims even for? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay pour one out for MTV's Catfish, which was recently cancelled by MTV after 9 seasons and 12 years. Back in 2010, Nev Schulman was the subject of the Catfish documentary, which revealed the heartbreaking truth about a woman he fell in love with online. The documentary helped coin the internet phenomenon of people creating fake personas to manipulate, extort, or trick others online. However, instead of scamming for money, the protagonists of MTV's Catfish were coerced into emotional relationships that turned their rom-coms into horror films. With Catfish leaving the airwaves, what has changed about the show (and the internet) since its inception? And why couldn't the show keep up with a scam culture that is more advanced than ever before? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay break down the drama between Vlogbrothers star Hank Green and the online knitting community. Earlier this month, Green posted an educational SciShow episode about the knitting community's contribution to physics. What the SciShow team didn't expect were almost 30-minute long reaction videos and accusations of belittling and misogyny. This saga has spurred apology TikToks, vows to knit simple socks, and a bigger discussion about how an offline pastime became one of the most drama-filled communities online. Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this mailbag episode of How To!, we get an update from Elizabeth, the 43-year-old listener who contacted us for advice on her plan to have sex for the first time. Then, co-hosts Courtney Martin and Carvell Wallace get listeners' takes on our most talked-about episodes of the year—and the staff holds an impromptu idea meeting for upcoming episodes. Links Mentioned:  My Old Books Do you have a problem that needs solving? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson, with Kevin Bendis and Sophie Summergrad. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Over the past few months, we've been asking you to tell us stories about your beauty interventions. You told us about feeling caught between viewing appearance improvements as vanity and recognizing how much looking a certain way affects your relationships, career, and self-worth. In this episode, Anna talks to listeners about their appearance choices: Asher, who spent $43,000 on plastic surgery and openly celebrates his investments; Caroline, who used fillers and Botox after her divorce but recently filed for bankruptcy and can no longer afford treatments; Alexandra, who stopped dyeing her gray hair at 38 despite pushback from family; and Nick, whose multiple cosmetic surgeries nearly ended his marriage and forced him to confront deeper issues. Read Nick Dothée's essay: What Plastic Surgery Couldn't Fix Podcast production by Zoe Azulay Death, Sex & Money is now produced by Slate! To support us and our colleagues, please sign up for our membership program, Slate Plus! Members get ad-free podcasts, bonus content on lots of Slate shows, and full access to all the articles on Slate.com. Sign up today at slate.com/dsmplus. And if you're new to the show, welcome. We're so glad you're here. Find us and follow us on Instagram and you can find Anna's newsletter at annasale.substack.com. Our new email address, where you can reach us with voice memos, pep talks, questions, critiques, is deathsexmoney@slate.com. Get 50% Off Monarch Money, the all-in-one financial tool at ⁠www.monarchmoney.com/DSM⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by writer Virgie Tovar, whose latest podcast, GLP-1 Truth Serum, explores the predatory nature of GLP-1 marketing, and companies' attempts to target plus-size creators. But #BodyPositivity was getting backlash long before these new weight loss drugs became trendy, and now social media has gone from a safe space to a minefield. Is #BodyPositivity really gone for good?  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by Spitfire News writer Kat Tenbarge, who came to the defense of the Gaylor fandom (people who believe Taylor Swift is secretly queer) after they were accused of “crashing out” in light of her engagement to Travis Kelce. But who are the Gaylors, really? And why are they always the butt of the joke? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay talk about the backlash surrounding The Cutting Room Floor, a fashion podcast you may know from its Leandra Medine Cohen episode or its viral Steve Madden interview. Last week, host and creator Recho Omondi went on TikTok to hire a full-time staffer who would be an office administrator, bookings coordinator, and personal assistant. Fans were intrigued until she dropped that this role would pay a salary of $55,000 with no healthcare benefits. TikTok reacted strongly and immediately, taking issue with the low salary and bringing up the privileged candidate who could afford to take a job like this in New York City. Omondi responded by going on TikTok Live and posting a short Patreon episode she titled “$55k Gate,” but doubling down seemed to triple the discourse.  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When comedy writer Tamara Yajia talks about her childhood, she's sometimes unsure what tone to strike. Her new memoir Cry for Me Argentina: My Life as a Failed Child Star depicts a very fun nuclear family with parents and grandparents who are loud, crass, and sex-positive. There are hilarious moments and situations that seem wildly inappropriate. In this week's episode, Tamara tells Anna about the ups and downs of her childhood, which was spent in both Argentina and the U.S., and what she wishes her parents had done differently.   This episode was produced by Cameron Drews. To check out the episodes about Hurricane Katrina that Anna mentioned, click here: https://www.wnyc.org/story/in-new-orleans/  Get more Death, Sex & Money with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of DSM and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the Death, Sex & Money show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/dsmplus to get access wherever you listen. If you're new to the show, welcome. We're so glad you're here. Find us and follow us on Instagram and you can find Anna's newsletter at annasale.substack.com. Our email address, where you can reach us with voice memos, pep talks, questions, critiques, is deathsexmoney@slate.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Candice Lim tells Kate Lindsay about two recent BookTok conventions that went off the rails. While the first convention become known as the “Fyre Fest” of BookTok, the other faced troubling allegations of sexual assault against an employee. Is BookTok or social media to blame for how often attempts to bring a fandom together end up shattering the community apart?  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Katie Miller, whose husband Stephen Miller is Trump's right-hand man, launched a new podcast to join the growing ranks of content made specifically for conservative women. But is there enough demand—in listeners and supplement sponsorship—to make the same impact that the conservative manosphere has? Guest:  Emma Goldberg, business features writer at The New York Times. Want more What Next? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and across all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Ethan Oberman, Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Women were prosecuted for experiencing miscarriage or stillbirth even before the Supreme Court swept away the protections of Roe v. Wade. But these prosecutions have ramped up since, in both red and blue states. The stakes are ramping up too, with legislators introducing bills that would treat abortion as homicide, potentially subjecting patients to the death penalty. This week, Mark Joseph Stern talks with Karen Thompson, the legal director of Pregnancy Justice. They discuss what happens when the state decides a fetus, or even an embryo, has equal or greater rights than pregnant people. As fetal personhood legislation moves ahead in more and more red states, this concept is also seeping into the law in blue states. Women have been jailed because their pregnancies ended in a way the state disliked. Grandmothers have been prosecuted decades after pregnancy loss thanks to investigators using forensic genetic genealogy to hunt them down. As Thompson explains, a frightening frontier in the battle for bodily autonomy and reproductive rights is here, and it demands our attention.    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay explain what's going on between the internet's favorite sad girls, Ethel Cain and Lana Del Rey. Where did their beef start and why is Peter Griffin involved? Then, they dive into a new TikTokker who dresses up as the Lorax, does spot-on Ariana Grande impressions, and could be our next big comedian. But first, our favorite TikTok dolls may finally start posting again. Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Casey Johnston grew up in a family where being thin mattered. In college, the internet told her to eat 1,200 calories and do endless cardio if she wanted to lose weight. That habit followed her into her late twenties, until she came upon a Reddit post about weightlifting that changed her relationship to her body and just about everything else. Casey Johnston is the author of Physical Education: How I Escaped Diet Culture and Gained the Power of Lifting, and she writes the substack, She's a Beast. Podcast production by Zoe Azulay  Death, Sex & Money is now produced by Slate! To support us and our colleagues, please sign up for our membership program, Slate Plus! Members get ad-free podcasts, bonus content on lots of Slate shows, and full access to all the articles on Slate.com. Sign up today at slate.com/dsmplus. And if you're new to the show, welcome. We're so glad you're here. Find us and follow us on Instagram and you can find Anna's newsletter at annasale.substack.com. Our new email address, where you can reach us with voice memos, pep talks, questions, critiques, is deathsexmoney@slate.com. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by Slate senior writer Scaachi Koul to talk about the return of the girlboss. Over five years after various exposes exposed their poor management and, in some cases, racism, former it-girls like The Wing's Audrey Gelman and Outdoor Voice's Ty Haney are back in the spotlight. Their new projects, however, are falling flat. Is there any room for redemption in 2025, or is time to leave girlbosses behind for good? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay, with help from Kevin Bendis. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

On today's episode, host Kate Lindsay is joined by senior supervising producer Daisy Rosario to talk about Kendra, the woman whose 25-part TikTok series about falling in love with her psychiatrist has captivated the internet. However, what viewers thought would be the next Reesa Teesa “Who The Fuck Did I Marry?” series turned out to be something much more complicated, as Kendra's story went from suspicious to downright troubling. Now, TikTok is diagnosing Kendra with mental health issues, while still consuming her content like entertainment. Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sarah loves her in-laws, even though their politics send her running for the exits. Now, her daughter is starting to ask questions about her grandparents' patriarchal, conservative views. How can Sarah raise her kid to be self-assured, justice-oriented, and open-minded—without spoiling the connection between her in-laws and the grandchild they adore? On this episode of How To!, Courtney Martin brings on Melinda Wenner Moyer, science journalist and author of the new book Hello, Cruel World! Science-based Strategies for Raising Terrific Kids in Terrifying Times. Melinda gives Sarah strategies for talking to all parties, reinforcing values in her daughter, and avoiding an irreparable break with her relatives. If you want more Melinda, check out: How To Raise Kids in a Nation Full of Guns.  Do you have a problem that needs solving? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson, with Kevin Bendis. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Kate Lindsay and Candice Lim discuss the latest in Labubu-land, from a TikTok blackface controversy to leaving one on an iconic anti-capitalist's grave. Then, they dive into the growing trend of fanfiction getting a big marketing push from the publishing world. From Ali Hazelwood's The Love Hypothesis starting as Reylo fanfic to Julie Soto basing her latest novel on a Dramione ship, traditional publishing is reaching into the channels of AO3, Tumblr, and Wattpad to find their next big hit. But what do we lose when our favorite fanfictions get taken mainstream? And is it good or bad for the community they originated from? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Outward is going on a little summer break, in the meantime we're leaving you with a delightfully queer episode of Slate's Hit Parade with Chris Molanphy called Mighty Real. This is part two—catch part one in our previous episode. Little Richard was rock ‘n' roll's flamboyant architect. Lesley Gore sang that no one owned her. Sylvester was a gender-fluid icon who helped define disco. Freddie Mercury made rock operatic, and George Michael demanded freedom. What all of these LGBTQ artists had in common was bold hitmaking—and fear of being fully out of the closet. For decades, queer acts topped the charts while cloaking their true identities and paving the way for today's more openly queer stars. For Pride Month, join Chris Molanphy as he traces the hidden history of queer hitmakers on the charts—including those that managed to be both out and No. 1, right up through our modern age of Lil Nas X and Chappell Roan. It's a celebration of these artists' quest to feel… mighty real. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by writer and senior editor at Playboy Magazine, Magdalene Taylor, to talk about Tea. The app for women to crowdsource any “red flags” about the men they're dating was hacked shortly after it hit #1 on the Apple Lifestyle app chart. Now, the private information of thousands of women has been shared across 4Chan and Twitter, all thanks to a platform that was supposed to keep them safe. But was Tea even a good idea in the first place?  Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A shadow app for the dating world had its data hacked and exposed, and it laid bare the perils of creating safe spaces for women online — and of relying on tech companies. Guest: Kate Lindsay, host of Slate's ICYMI Want more What Next TBD? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Kate Lindsay and Candice Lim run through some updates following the Coldplay concert cheating scandal, and why Astronomer's latest PR stunt is hitting them differently. Then, they surprise each other with two stories from different sides of the internet. First, what's going on with this fake TikTok cult that possibly involves animal sacrifices, skin carvings, and questionable leadership? And who is Jessie Murph, the pseudo-country singer whose recent performance on The Tonight Show with Jimmy Fallon has the internet questioning whether her lyrics are satirical or regressive? Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Trans rights and access to health care have been under attack on the state level for years, but the second Trump administration and the Supreme Court have accelerated a chilling effect at clinics across the country. Guest: Grace Byron, author of “The Grim State of Trans Health Care” and “The Bureaucratic Nightmares of Being Trans Under Trump” for the New Yorker.  Want more What Next? Subscribe to Slate Plus to access ad-free listening to the whole What Next family and across all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe today on Apple Podcasts by clicking “Try Free” at the top of our show page. Sign up now at slate.com/whatnextplus to get access wherever you listen. Podcast production by Ethan Oberman, Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme, and Rob Gunther. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Psssst. You didn't hear this from me, but gossiping—can be good for you! … our series on embracing your inner antihero wraps—for now—with a guilty pleasure: gossiping. Normal Gossip host (and beloved former Slatester) Rachelle Hampton sits down with How To!'s Carvell Wallace to dish on the right way to gossip, the link between whisper networks and safety, and the importance of leaving no receipts.  This conversation concludes—for now!—our miniseries on embracing your inner antihero. Check out our episodes on How To Get Sweet, Sweet Revenge and How To Be an Ethical Hater.  Do you have a problem that needs solving? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson, with Kevin Bendis. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. This episode was produced by Sophie Summergrad. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay investigate the disappearance of SylvanianDrama. The creator behind the account gained millions of followers for role-playing salacious narratives with the fuzzy Calico Critters children's toys, but a copyright lawsuit from the brand itself has threatened the future of the account. Fans of SylvanianDrama are in an uproar, but the story isn't black and white. Instead, it's a warning for all of us about how personal posts online could end up paying professional consequences. Get more of ICYMI with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of ICYMI and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the ICYMI show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/icymiplus for access wherever you listen. This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Outward is going on a little summer break, in the meantime we're leaving you with a delightfully queer episode of Slate's Hit Parade with Chris Molanphy: Little Richard was rock ‘n' roll's flamboyant architect. Lesley Gore sang that no one owned her. Sylvester was a gender-fluid icon who helped define disco. Freddie Mercury made rock operatic, and George Michael demanded freedom. What all of these LGBTQ artists had in common was bold hitmaking—and fear of being fully out of the closet. For decades, queer acts topped the charts while cloaking their true identities and paving the way for today's more openly queer stars. For Pride Month, join Chris Molanphy as he traces the hidden history of queer hitmakers on the charts—including those that managed to be both out and No. 1, right up through our modern age of Lil Nas X and Chappell Roan. It's a celebration of these artists' quest to feel… mighty real. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Our series on embracing your inner antihero continues with a look at superheroes who definitely don't wear capes: ethical haters. Slate culture writer Scaachi Koul sits down with How To!'s Carvell Wallace for a conversation about the power of haterade—and why “hating up” distinguishes ethical haters from run-of-the-mill, establishment negativity. Links Mentioned:  Sucker Punch by Scaachi Koul Scaachi's Substack, Hater Nation Banal Nightmare by Halle Butler Scamfluencers Missed our first installment? Check out How To Get Sweet, Sweet Revenge. Next week: How to gossip! (But we didn't tell you that...) How are you exploring your inner antihero? How can we help you? Send us a note at howto@slate.com or leave us a voicemail at 646-495-4001 and we might have you on the show. Subscribe for free on Apple, Spotify or wherever you listen. The show is produced by Rosemary Belson, with Kevin Bendis. This episode was produced by Sophie Summergrad. Our technical director is Merritt Jacob and our supervising producer is Joel Meyer. Get more of How To! with Slate Plus! Join for exclusive bonus episodes of How To! and ad-free listening on all your favorite Slate podcasts. Subscribe from the How To! show page on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Or, visit slate.com/howtoplus for access wherever you listen. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay are joined by New York Times reporter and former ICYMI host Madison Malone Kircher to break down the internet history of Jojo Siwa. The 22-year-old got her start on Dance Moms over ten years ago, and has gone on to be a singer, performer, and serial reality TV show contestant. During this time she came out as queer, and attempted to have her own Miley Cyrus Bangerz rebrand. Now, with a new single and a new boyfriend, Jojo is entering yet another era, prompting the question: Who is Jojo Siwa, anyway? This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay, with help from Benjamin Frisch. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

After a contestant was kicked off Love Island USA for resurfaced racist social media posts, the internet backlash was swift. But some think the show mishandled her exit, especially in light of the UK franchise's past failure to protect the mental health of those in the villa. Hosts Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay dive into the show's rocky relationship with social media harassment during its decade on air, including the tragic deaths of two UK contestants and host, Caroline Flack. How can the USA series learn from these tragedies, and how can the fandom stan—and unstan—responsibly? This podcast is produced by Daisy Rosario, Vic Whitley-Berry, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This week, Bryan is joined by theologian, activist, and ballroom historian Michael Roberson to discuss his new book, Ballroom: A History, A Movement, A Celebration. Roberson traces the rich legacy of the ballroom scene—from its origins in resistance and survival, to its role in shaping public health responses during the height of the AIDS crisis and beyond, to its ongoing significance as a spiritual and communal refuge for Black and Latinx queer and trans people.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Candice Lim and Kate Lindsay discuss an American woman in her 50s who is going viral for her plastic surgery journey. Michelle Wood is a mom who traveled to Guadalajara to undergo several procedures, including a facelift and a chin implant. She documented her journey before and after the procedure, creating intrigue, curiosity, and surprisingly positive responses online. TikTok reacted similarly when Kylie Jenner revealed the details of her boob job and broke the internet within the same week. So what do Wood and Jenner's transparency say about the way women are talking about their bodies, and their surgeries, in 2025? This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Kate Lindsay and Candice Lim are joined by Ingrid Nilsen, an OG beauty lifestyle YouTuber who you may know as “MissGlamorazzi,” to reflect on the 10-year anniversary of her most iconic video to date.  Throughout the 2010s, YouTube was the platform of choice for “coming out” videos. During those years, the U.S. saw progress in LGBTQ+ acceptance and representation, including a SCOTUS decision legalizing gay marriage nationwide in 2015. A part of this growing acceptance online included prominent creators speaking up about their own sexuality, creating essentially, an entire genre of YouTube videos. Entering that genre in 2015 was Nilsen, whose coming out video has more than 18 million views, and became perhaps the most memorable coming out video from that era.  Ten years later, Nilsen joins the show to talk about the moment before she hit upload, what she's been up to since, and how the reaction — and backlash — to that video affected her coming out journey. This podcast is produced by Vic Whitley-Berry, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim, and Kate Lindsay. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices