Podcast appearances and mentions of kirsten oliphant

“Crumb time” is the little pieces of time that get lost throughout the day. Instead of giving away your crumb time to unproductive distractions, build systems that complete big projects with small actions. Today, I'll tell you how. Crumb time is everywhere throughout our days. Whenever we do something substantial with our time, little chunks of time of various sizes and shapes fall to the floor. What is crumb time? Crumb time has a combination of the following qualities: Short amounts of time. Crumb time can be less than a minute, or several minutes. Unknown lengths of time. You often don't know when your crumb time will be over. It could end in a few seconds, or a few minutes. Distracting environments. It's hard enough to focus when you don't know when you'll be interrupted, but the environments in which crumb time take place are often noisy, with lots of activity. Some examples of crumb time: Standing in line at an airport: Lots is going on, you're waiting for your boarding call. Riding in a cab: The scenery is changing, but you might have a good idea how much time you have. Waiting for a friend to meet you for lunch: They could come in the door in two seconds, or twenty minutes. Why do we give away crumb time? Crumb time feels insignificant, and we think we need a controlled environment and a big block of time to do anything useful. You don't have the time or mental bandwidth, it seems, to make substantial progress reading a book, or writing an article. So, we doomscroll on Twitter, blow off steam with a game such as Wordle, or do something pseudo-productive such as check email once again. Productive uses of crumb time We just give away our crumb time, but we could turn it into something useful. Here are some things you could do with crumb time: Review highlights in your Zettelkasten: My favorite use of crumb time is reviewing my highlights from a book. I export them to Markdown, and whenever I have a moment, I scroll through the highlights in a plain-text app on my phone. I bold any of the highlights that are extra interesting. When my crumb time is over, I mark my place and lock my phone. Learn about something: A crumb-time list is a key component of a system of curiosity management, which I talked about on episode 284. Keep a list of subjects you'd like to learn about, and when you have crumb time, read a Wikipedia page. (I'm not a fan of read-later apps, because the easier it is to save articles, the harder it is to read all of them). Brainstorm social media updates: Twitter is a great place to share ideas, a terrible place to have them. Brainstorm potential tweets in a text file, to polish and schedule later. How about doing nothing at all? Another valid use of your crumb time is simply doing nothing. But when you choose to do something, you may as well do something useful. Anything other than giving away crumb time is better than building that bad habit. The more you give away crumb time, the easier that becomes the default use of your crumb time. Take a seven-day crumb-time challenge You don't need to change your crumb time habits all at once, forever. Instead, try a seven-day crumb-time challenge. Here's how: Delete social media apps. You can do most things on Twitter or Instagram from desktop. Get them off your phone, to force yourself to make good use of crumb time. Block social media websites. Use the parental controls on your phone to block websites to which you give away your crumb time. For me that's twitter.com and instagram.com. On the iPhone, use the “Limit Adult Websites” feature, and add whatever sites you want to the block list. (You can also add adult websites to the allowed sites if that's your thing.) Set up crumb-time actions. If you have a Zettelkasten, you know what to do. If you don't have one, for a quick-start you could export your highlights from your favorite book and have them available on your phone. Set up a list of things you'd like to look up when you have crumb time. Set up a scratch file for brainstorming social media updates, or set up anything else you could make progress on when you have a minute. Audio crumb time You're of course not always able to use your hands during crumb time, such as when you're driving. This is actually a great reason to have a podcast. Sharing your ideas with others is nice, but if you want to review your own ideas during crumb time, with a podcast you already have a convenient format in which to do so. But, you can also listen to articles or text you'd like to review using the text-to-speech feature on your phone, or an app, such as Otter. Crumb time becomes something bigger I like the term “crumb time” not only because it implies crumb time's perceived insignificance, but also because substantial things consist of crumbs. Bakers talk about the “crumb structure” of a cake, which is the mix of air and pastry that makes up the cake. In agriculture, soil has taken on a “crumb structure” when it has the right amount of moisture for the soil to bead into crumbs. Soil with a crumb structure has an ideal mix of air and moisture to be a good environment for plants to take root, and for microorganisms to assist in the plant's growth. Crumb time is powerful because it seems too insignificant to be worth anything. But if you use your crumb time well, those little pieces of time can build into something bigger. Here are some ways: Write a book: A book is little more than a collection of thoughts, and crumb time is enough to develop individual thoughts. I shared on episode 260 my newsletter system, which makes use of crumb time: My tweets grow into newsletters, which grow into podcast articles, which grow into books. Or, you can take a more direct approach. Walter Isaacson has said he writes on his phone while waiting in the airport, and Kirsten Oliphant wrote an entire book during two weeks' time on the treadmill. Build a database of knowledge: Instead of writing a book, you can aim to build a database of knowledge, such as the Zettelkasten I talked about on episode 250. Highlighting highlights is the easiest use of crumb time, but you can do other Zettelkasten tasks with your crumb time, such as clearing your inbox. Make real progress: Even if you don't aspire to write a book or build a Zettelkasten, you can use your crumb time to make real progress on any of your projects. Think of crumb time as a “context”, a la Getting Things Done. Just as you might mark a next action as “@home”, “@office”, or with my Seven Mental States of creativity, you can mark tasks as “@crumbtime”. Then you have a list of tasks you can do with little time and attention. Imagine what your crumb time could become Pay attention to how you use your crumb time, and you'll find significant uses of time and energy that could be put toward something productive. In the same time and mental effort it takes to play Wordle every day, you could build a database of knowledge, write articles, or even books. I encourage you to try a seven-day crumb-time challenge. Let me know how it goes! Image: Pexals Thank you for having me on your podcasts! Thank you for having me on your podcasts. Thank you to Ben Henley-Smith at Cord's Best Work podcast. As always, you can find all podcasts I've been on at kadavy.net/interviews. About Your Host, David Kadavy David Kadavy is author of Mind Management, Not Time Management, The Heart to Start and Design for Hackers. Through the Love Your Work podcast, his Love Mondays newsletter, and self-publishing coaching David helps you make it as a creative. Follow David on: Twitter Instagram Facebook YouTube Subscribe to Love Your Work Apple Podcasts Overcast Spotify Stitcher YouTube RSS Email Support the show on Patreon Put your money where your mind is. Patreon lets you support independent creators like me. Support now on Patreon »       Show notes: http://kadavy.net/blog/posts/crumb-time/

Episode 068 / Thriller, mystery, and horror author Simon Wood joins us this week to talk about how he learned he was his own best advocate in negotiating right and how he’s become a “rights raptor” because he realizes the value of his intellectual property. We also discuss how his background as a mechanical engineer helps him breakdown stories and reverse engineer his plots. Plus tips on pen names, writing flawed heroes, and dealing with impostor syndrome. Intro links: Check out the Wish I’d Known Then Facebook group for the Q&A replay. Kirsten Oliphant’s Create If Writing podcast: Lessons Learned in Three Years as an Author How to Write a Bestseller WIKT Episode 9: Clean Romance, Sustainability, and “Pantsing” books with Kirsten Oliphant Come over and say hi to Jami and Sara in the WIKT Facebook group! You can find show notes and links at wishidknownforwriters.com. Genres discussed include thriller, mystery, and horror. Links: Simon’s website: http://www.simonwood.net Twitter handle @simonwoodwrites Instagram handle @simonwoodwrites Facebook Author Page @simonwoodwriter The Big List of Craft and marketing books mentioned on WIKT podcast episodes

What really is a "writer?" Jesper and Autumn run the gamut in this episode to break down the myth, history, and perception of what being a writer really means. Throw in some great quotes from famous authors, and you have a fun mix that will get you pondering what you call yourself ... and why it is - or isn't - a big deal in the first place! It's true! Pre-orders are LIVE for Story Idea, Plot Development, and Plot Development Step by Step! You can secure your copy for release day of August 3rd through the links below! Story Idea: A Method to Develop a Book Idea at https://books2read.com/StoryIdeas Plot Development: An Outlining Method for Fiction at https://books2read.com/Plot-Development  Plot Development Step by Step: Exercises for Planning Your Book at https://books2read.com/PlottingWorkbook  Tune in for new episodes EVERY single Monday. SUPPORT THE AM WRITING FANTASY PODCAST! Please tell a fellow author about the show and visit us at Apple podcast and leave a rating and review. Join us at www.patreon.com/AmWritingFantasy. For as little as a dollar a month, you'll get awesome rewards and keep the Am Writing Fantasy podcast going. Read the full transcript below. (Please note that it's automatically generated and while the AI is super cool, it isn't perfect. There may be misspellings or incorrect words on occasion). Narrator (2s): You're listening to The Am Writing Fantasy Podcast in today's publishing landscape. You can reach fans all over the world. Query letters are a thing of the past. You don't even need a literary agent. There is nothing standing in the way of making a living from Writing Join two best selling authors who have self published more than 20 books between them now onto the show with your hosts. Autumn Birt and Jesper Schmidt Jesper (30s): Hello I am Jesper Autumn (31s): and I'm Autumn Jesper (34s): Episode 78 of the Am Writing Fantasy podcast. And today we are going to talk with him about what it means to be a writer. And I know that's going to require a bit of elaboration, but I will get back to that a bit later. Yes. I'm still looking forward to it and believe it or not, this will impress you. I did research for this one. Autumn (57s): Did you? I did writing work. Why? Because I didn't want to go outside. No. Aye. Because I wanted it. I like facts. I love history. I like, you know, things or things. You said the repeat themselves and we don't usually appreciate it. Cause we don't realize that if you don't know you're history, you realize that's repeating. So we did some digging on this one. I can't wait to share it. I usually just with all these episodes, maybe we shouldn't tell people that it's all right. I don't mind being notorious for, you know, showing up and doing a presentation with no preparation. Autumn (1m 32s): I just I'm waiting for the day that someone calls me, sees me in the audience and calls me up and asked me to do a whole hour on something. I'm like, Oh geez. I should never have said I do this all the time. Right? Jesper (1m 43s): Yeah. And actually I will say it depends on if it was me. It would depend on what they would want me to speak about. But I do think that certain topics I could probably work in an hour. The, it depends on what it is though. Autumn (1m 53s): Yesper talk about maps one hour ago. You would be all site, but yes. So how are things on your side or the Atlantic this week? No, it's good. Jesper (2m 6s): It's a good, eh, we are trying to get ready for some of occasion, obviously. So a sort of, a lot of things going, I mean, it's still like more than a month away, but were just trying, I'm trying to get everything wrapped up also for our stuff. So it's been actually just the few days ago where, Oh, well, yeah, that's a point of this recording. Of course not. When this episode released this, because that's the wonders of the podcast. And today we always have to be careful with the timing of when we mentioned things because we are prerecording some stuff here. Jesper (2m 40s): Yes. But at least at the point of recording this just a few days ago, I sent out an email to our Am Writing Fantasy lists recruiting what we call typos layers four, not one but three. Yes. You have that right. Three different non fiction books for authors though. Isn't that crazy? Yeah, it is crazy. Oh, come on. You're Autumn (3m 0s): Sending out the emails. I sent you the file's to put it up the pre-orders today. So it feels like this is really half a day. Jesper (3m 8s): Yeah. I am so excited that it is happening. So there are three of them. So just to mention, there is the first one is Plot Development And Outlining Method four Fiction and Plot Development Step by Step So that there was one that is the actual plodding book that we talked about so much. And then the other step by step one is the associated what books. And then we also have Story Idea Book and Method to develop a book Idea so it's basically like creating a whole premise, which we'll talk about later on in a, in a future episode or more on a, more about in a future episode, I meant to say, but that is three books that we are trying to launch right. Jesper (3m 47s): Leading up to summer holiday. So I don't know if we're a bit crazy here, but a lot Autumn (3m 52s): Considering everything we have going on. I know we're crazy, but it feels so good to be getting these things. So finally, after talking about them for so long, finally bringing them out. So Jesper (4m 4s): Yeah. And honestly, I can't, I can't wait to release these. Yes. So they, they are for the listener here. They are going to be out on the 13th of August. Ah, but you can actually, if I do all my time traveling, correct here with podcasting, you should be able to preorder them already now and we'll place the Link's in the show notes so that you can actually go and preorder them if you are interested in these books, which of course you're home. We hope you are. Jesper (4m 34s): But other than that, I just also wanted to mention a Autumn that I finally found a time to go back and listen to episode 75 when you have Kirsten Oliphant on. Yeah. That was a great episode. Yeah. Autumn (4m 45s): Yeah. She was a wonderful, wonderful guest. I really appreciate her time and her tips on pen names. And when you really need to launch a different author platform for what you're writing, writing in multiple genres. Yeah. And I can't believe she, she honestly said that she reads a book a day. She did say that I want to go back going really. I just really let that sink in. I don't understand. I mean, Hello, she has a lot of kids at the house with as well. Yeah. I mean, I don't know, maybe there, I don't want to assume that their kids' books, but she did say maybe she was saying she, maybe she went to say she reads a book. Autumn (5m 24s): She reads every day. Not she is. So she would make sure she reads everyday. Not a whole book. Jesper (5m 30s): All right. I know. Okay. But yeah, I think she said she ran a whole book at day, but yeah, that's a pretty damn amazing. Oh, well done it. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. Autumn (5m 40s): Very good speed reader. That would be amazing. I could read that fast. I would probably read a little bit more because I task oriented. I get so wrapped up in things that I have a hard time switching to something else. So once I get to a good book and you're getting into like that new and getting really close to the climax. So that's back two thirds basically of the novel. That's it I'm hooked. That's all I'm doing. I'm not making dinner. I'm not Writing I'm not working on our courses. Nothing. I'm just reading. So I'm on a reading diet until we get some of this stuff done. Autumn (6m 13s): Alright. Yeah. I have to the opposite problem. It takes to me so long to read the book. Like sometimes I have to remind myself when I go back. What happened last time? I can't see. I'm so bad at it. Usually, you know, I read when I go to bed in the evening and when I go to bed, I'm so tired. I really don't have the energy to read. So I'd just fall asleep. I'm really good at falling asleep. You know, I can fall asleep within a minute or so. Yeah. So yeah, I don't get much reading done. And that was going to say with, and they're a task into, to do list with a vacation coming up. Autumn (6m 46s): I mean, I've already got to be keeping you up late tonight, the record, this podcast. So we can relax when we'd go on vacation, then I hope so. Ah, you better? Yeah. So will you also keeping busy? So how are you on your end or a very good, well, at the time we are recording this things are crazy. I'm in the United States' and I wish I could time travel to see if things are going to get any better when this is really you. So I'm just hoping they do, but it is kind of crazy over here and a little scary at the moment. Autumn (7m 18s): And yeah, I mean, I'm just trying to keep my head down and stay busy, but you know, at least in personal things, I've got a little bit of writing done. I've been doing some cover design, which is always fun. I'm getting our formatting books done. So things are progressing very well. My garden is growing. My husband has been working on 105 year old canvas frame, Cedar canoe, and he just put the canvass in the top coat on it today. And now it gets to cure for four weeks before. Autumn (7m 49s): Are you going painted? So its kinda cool to watch him and restore a hundred, five year old canoe is really something special. And why, where did you find that use? We actually paid a little bit too much for it. Cause we thought it was him. We bought it. It, we thought it was in better shape and its become a project that he's enjoying immensely, but it's Oh my God, this is not something you do because you have some, you know, your, your saving and skimping money. It's not a cheap enterprise, but, and he's doing very well and he's not usually the woodworker in the family. Autumn (8m 22s): I am. So I'm very impressed. We go on the internet with The Am Writing Fantasy Podcast Oh, so we have a lot, lot, lot, lots, lots of interesting potent right in Fantasy Facebook. Hey, we were just going crazy over there. It is. Which I love its been so busy and I have actually managed again in a couple of times this week, so that's good. But yeah, it's such a vibrant, exciting group. Autumn (8m 54s): Yeah. I noticed how it, Chris was very Jesper (8m 56s): Helpful and he pointed out how publishing too Apple books. It no longer requires a Mack. So you just need an iCloud on iTunes connect account and then you can publish directly to Apple books. That's a pretty nice. That is cool. Autumn (9m 11s): Yeah. Pretty cool. That's a very, that doesn't surprise me about Apple. I mean, come on a, use a Mac and I can open any file you send me, but I have the files I want to send you I've come to translate so you can open them on your PC. Yeah, Jesper (9m 25s): Yeah. That's a bit annoying, but yeah, but Chris also mentioned by the way that the Google books appears to be open to anyone. That's what he said. And I have heard this as, as well in other places. So I think its absolutely correct. Yeah, it think so. But of course you and I are and we got in a long time ago, so I'm not sure if it works on it, but I guess for those listening, who haven't yet published their books on Google, you can go and check it out now and you should be able to create an account I think. Jesper (9m 55s): And then afterwards, you know, hit Autumn and I up on Twitter or leave a comment on this episode and let us know if it works. Yeah. I'm really curious. Yeah, that should have a book. Autumn (10m 4s): I was, are they still have so far to go in the dashboard? So I will warn folks if your going over there, it is not the same as Amazon's managed for us or anything else, but it does work and it is nice. You know, I want to change the price on a book. You have to go in and go in to this file and there's just like, you can't just see what the price is on. The main screen kind of would be Jesper (10m 26s): To be useful. But anyway, yeah, that's not the best. I mean by that and you have to download a sales report in Excel, you cannot manipulate it on the screen and stuff, but it's not that bad, but it's just a bit, maybe a bit more old fashioned than they would speak. Yeah. Autumn (10m 43s): Yeah. It's all right. Yeah, it works. So yeah. Let us know if it is working an open to everyone, that's kind of a huge step for Google and I guess if enough people do it, maybe they'll, you know, tweak it a little bit more. So that'd be excellent. I once gave them the feedback that they should have bought pronoun when that, when that site closed down. So probably which they had. Yeah, I can see. Jesper (11m 6s): Yeah. But Jason also mentioned by the way that he has written 40,000 words in the last 10 days, so that's awesome. Congratulations, Jason. Yeah, that is fantastic. Congratulations. That's always exciting to see the authors writing and doing well or a thousand words in 10 days. That's pretty good. That's a good milestone. That is awesome. Yeah. Yeah. So I really liked how lively and helpful to the Facebook group is. So if you haven't joined it yet and you are listening here, then what are you waiting for? Join us in over to the group section of Facebook and simply search for Am Writing Fantasy and you will find us and we will let you in. Jesper (11m 43s): Yes. Autumn (11m 44s): Yeah. And it's fun because it's, it's everything from supportive to asking a fun questions like Hector who had written, you know, what spells would you give your antagonist that isn't to overpowered? So it's everything from pulling apart tropes to question's to support, to celebrating things. So I love it over there. So you actually initially came up with this topic Autumn so perhaps you can set the scene a bit. Autumn (12m 15s): What are we talking about here? We're talking about that idea that all a real Writer and real in quotation marks are a real Writer does, is write. And so this kind of comes up from, you know, lots of beams and things, online threads that you'll see where someone goes up to a famous author and says how much you know, Story I do you have to imagine this, how much do you see time? Do you spend writing every day to become such an amazing famous author? Autumn (12m 47s): And they go, Oh, well I write from nine to noon in the morning. And then from one til five 30, I marketing and the person that's a good question goes, Oh, Oh, you are not a real Writer and walks away. So that sort of where this comes from, it's this idea that a real, Writer a real writer write it's a real writer has a publisher. It's a real writer. Is this, this certain rigid thing that spends only time WRITING, it's a, it's a very, I feel like it's a very outdated way of viewing things to be honest. Autumn (13m 23s): But I, it surprises me because I think, I mean, at least every month I still hear people say that I have to admit, I think it used to be every week that I would hear people say, Oh, you know, Writing is blah, blah, blah. But there are still people who feel that if you're not Writing, you know, if you're not only writing, if your still marketing, then your not a real writer. Right? Yeah. I mean, of course there is some personal belief in this. I mean, everybody probably have their own understanding of what it means to be a writer. Autumn (13m 55s): And what does a writer do on doing well, eight hours of work and or whatever you wanna call it. Right. Write, I mean, we are probably, everybody probably has their own opinion about , but yeah, that's what we are gonna try to dig a bit deeper in here and try to at least share some of the, how have you seen and the, I don't know, maybe challenge you're thinking of it. I am not sure. Let's see. Oh yes. I definitely, I believe me. I think the world needs a lot more time listening to each other and sort of making assumptions and talking to dead air. So I think its just as a dun in an idea of to challenge a challenge, what you think a real writer is. Autumn (14m 30s): And maybe even if you hate marketing and maybe challenge or assumptions, that marketing is a part of Writing. So I tried, I, like I said, I did some digging in history of files to bring up some ideas for today. Okay. Let's hear it. Alright. Well I wanted to go, as I said, I think history itself, a lot of people don't realize that history repeats itself because we think now is like everything we forgotten, like I've was joking with my husband today. Autumn (15m 2s): I looked back at February when the room, my built in my cabin was snow in some debris and I look at it down, it's a room and I'm like, really? That was only a few months ago. So it's so easy to forget, but I looked up the history of self publishing. And what do you think is the earliest example of self publishing? I would say it's Jesper (15m 28s): Well I, I would say it's probably, I don't, I don't know any names of the authors or whatever, but I think it would be half to do something to do with somebody in a way we all times by buying a, a PR you know, getting his own book printed on a press and paying for it himself. Yes. That would be good. Autumn (15m 51s): We have a definition that would say that the definition of self publishing and so yes. So when Johannes Gutenberg invented the printing press, that was 1440. And so yeah, some people say that it's the history of self publishing, but honestly the Chinese were using movable type way before that. So technically it's older even then that, and I mean, technically you, you can go back to it when people are writing scrolls, that would be self publishing. And the earliest evidence of that is 3,100 BC. Autumn (16m 22s): So a technically it depends on how much you want to go into it. So we're not gonna do a history lesson But yeah. So how did they do Amazon? App's in 1300 BC. Oh, I don't think it was him as well as he could have been. It was in the Amazon, right? Yeah. Jesper (16m 42s): But he would be somebody that says sitting out in the treats shop or shouting about it. Okay. The book is out. Yeah, Autumn (16m 48s): Yeah. That's right. Dunn. Yeah. You read it now. Hot off the lift. But so what are some, it was a time period and it was pretty big. So in the 18 hundreds, self publishing was actually very typical and they call it a vanity publishing. So where do you think vanity? Why do they use the term vanity for publishing? Jesper (17m 11s): Aye. I could be wrong on this, but I think that it has to do with is because the, well, the author has a bit of a hit, you know, that they want their own works published and no, at least the connotation it has today is that self publishing some times is called a bandage publishing because it's a bit like it's not, isn't it a really good publishing. It is just like somebody who wanted to put this out into the world. They probably tried to get in a, a, a traditional publishing house to publish it, which they wouldn't because it wasn't good enough. Jesper (17m 44s): So they went ahead and published it on their own. That's a bit of the stigma it has today, at least that Autumn (17m 50s): I don't know if that's way originated from as well. I need a little child little thing. Yes. Gold star for you. That is correct because it's considered vanity publishing because the author was vain and we want it to be published even though they've had been rejected, but that is a stigma. Even back then, that isn't necessarily true. Some people maybe they couldn't get published, but the thing about women writers, they were, they just couldn't even own property. They couldn't even talk to publishers unless they had a male relative. And this was even in England. Autumn (18m 21s): So some of them were paying to have books published and using a pen names or anonymous was very famous, basically meant AU is written by a woman. And so there is a lot of authors who were vanity publishing because they had no other means, but they're books were good because come on, you've got a guest, at least a couple people who, or a self published, just like, Oh, you could pick an author, the author and the author of a historic, you can choose a modern one Plato Oh, you know, I didn't go back that far. Autumn (19m 7s): It's not fair. I self published something. I bet he did too. I'm sure the Greeks were really into self publishing and we just don't appreciate it. But some of my favorites, I couldn't believe this. John Locke was self published, Nathaniel Hawthorne, Martin Luther, Marcel Proust, some of the, what are some of the works that they published it that way. I see, Oh, I'm not even going to go into him. But how about some really good ones? What Whitman, the leaves of grass, in fact, well, Whitman is considered the first one who discovered Author branding. Autumn (19m 44s): He sold the leaves of grass based on his rather notorious lifestyle and who he was. So yeah, I didn't actually realize that he was so scandalous. That was kind of fun to read. It's a very salicious. I now have a new appreciation for the leaves of grass and you have to read it again. But two, the paragons that I could not believe are self published where Emily Dickinson and Jane Rustin, Jean Oxton, I mean, she is considered, she is second to Shakespeare in sales and notoriety and she self published in her lifetime. Autumn (20m 25s): So that kind of says something about what self publishing is. So it's self publishing has been around a long time. So that's only part of this question though. The question is, you know, what does it mean to be a writer? So these authors were self published. What I could not uncover and unbury unfortunately is how much time these Author spent. You know, it was shaking the Busch and telling people about their works, how they went about selling them. Autumn (20m 54s): However Jane Austin. It really was her brother, Henry and her sister Kassandra, who were shouting about our work here. She was very lucky that way to have very strong family support. And she tried very hard to not let people know. First. She tried to have to let people know it was written by a woman and then that kind of leaked out and she just signed her books. They were titled by a lady, but she did get to meet with the Prince Regent, who was a huge fan. So she did do some meetings and things like that. I think later in life, there was a few book signings, but other people, like I mentioned, well, what he was, he was of the brand and he was out all the time selling these books. Autumn (21m 34s): In fact, he basically published the leaves of grass in 18 different versions. He just kept adding on it and putting stuff together. That was his book. It was only, it was his only book, you know? And you just went on selling it and he sold it based on who he was. And people just wanted it because he was like, Oh, you wrote this. Oh my goodness. I want you to read us. So I just found, it's so fascinating to read through some of this history of some of these paragons, you know, people, we never would be like reading, I'm reading this and finding out, but you know, Emerson, you know, actually Benjamin Franklin, I self published. Autumn (22m 12s): A lot of these people published and they would do adverts in the local paper. They would do book signings. They would go to the societal dinner's and bring their book and be like, well, you know, I wrote this so you can do a little reading and the polite society rooms and try to get people to spread the word. I mean, this is, this was the earliest social media of going to these dinners and spreading the word about there books. And these are people that we just think, Oh, it's Dean Austin. Of course, of course she did well, but Nope, she, she had to shake the Busch. Autumn (22m 45s): So I'll think of this stuff up from somewhere. Yeah. You all start from somewhere until you get to be known. So I did really find this fascinating that there is a huge history of being not only self published, but Writer is having to do a lot more and a lot of heavy lifting than just writing. Yeah, absolutely. But I'll also even, even in the modern day, for example, you know, a JK Rowling, self-publishers her eBooks versions of Harry Potter, but I actually didn't know that's the, I didn't bring up to modern. Autumn (23m 18s): That's exciting. Yeah. So, so, so she didn't want to sign a waiver to REITs for the iBooks because it owns so much money. So, so she holds help hold onto those rights herself for her. And she's self publish is the Harry Potter books and books. And then she sign the contract a For, you know, paperback in hot back and whatnot ride. So that's an excellent, she owns the rights herself. So I'm self published. That is fantastic. And I wonder if she owns the IP assume there's audio Jesper (23m 46s): Books, there has to be audio works. So here we have hotter. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Are, there is a, I think that's with a publishing house, but I'm not an a 100% share on that, but I think it is considering, I am sure she would have had the money to hire somebody, but considering how difficult and time consuming of a process, they can do whatever she wants. Yeah. I think she is one of the richest woman in the world. So I think she was doing fine in those days. Yeah. Yeah, indeed. Okay. Well actually I also find found the quote that I was thinking about four for this podcast episode here. Jesper (24m 18s): So I was thinking too, maybe just shared and then follow on with a bit of my thoughts, because if it goes into this entire topic here, excellent. So this is a quote from Ray Bradbury. So it goes like this quote, if you simply define a rider as someone who is WRITING clarity says In, you are truly a rider when you are writing. And if you don't write regularly, don't pretend to give yourself that title start writing more for me, they key is. Jesper (24m 53s): Yeah. And then yeah. End of the quote, write. And then what I want you to say is that for me, the key is in that word regularly because I can agree to that pot. I mean, if you want to, if you want to be an author, that also means that you have to put your butt in the seat and ride at the end of the day, we only authors if we write stuff. So I would say, you know, only writing his writing marketing is not Writing social media is not writing. Jesper (25m 25s): Only writing is writing. However, that does not mean that none of those other activities isn't a part of being an author is. And I think for me, that's where the distinction lies because you also have to do marketing. You also have to do social media and all those other things. So as you set in the beginning of the episode would have been the beginning of the section Autumn when somebody was asking, so how much do you write? And then if the answer was well, our right in the morning and I do marketing in the afternoon, and then people would say, well, then you're not a writer. Jesper (26m 0s): I think it comes from stuff like this. You know, that there was this kind of thinking that well, writers only write. And if you do anything else, then you not a proper right. Or maybe there's a bit of thinking as well that, well, if your a proper righty, your publisher will do all those other things for you. But nowadays in 2020 property says actually expect the authors to due to marketing as well. They do not, if your a Stephen King or something, then he will get whatever he wants. But for everybody else, even those who are those who have traditional publishing contracts, the puppet is that they will not really allocate any funding or attention to watch marketing. Jesper (26m 39s): They actually expect the author to do it. So that's why I also set up at the top that Autumn (26m 45s): I think it's a bit of an old fashioned outdated view on things this whole, this whole conversation, you know, it's, I don't know. I find it a bit weird that unless you ride eight hours a day and do nothing else, then you're not a right. I don't, I can't quite follow the logic day. And I probably can't, if we go 10 or 20 years back than maybe I understand now in 2020 now I don't get it. I agree. And I think that's a really good distinction is like Yeah writers writing is Writing and you're a writer if you're actively writing or at least trying to write every day, or are you have a scheduled in your reading, but an author, it incorporates a lot more. Autumn (27m 26s): And that's even book signings. I mean, we know someone who, you know, their publisher sends them off to some of these book fairs and stuff. That's not Writing, that's being front and center. Even if the publisher is paying your entrance fee, which is always nice instead of having to do it out of your Author business. But it, again, sometimes you go what you do, these book signings, your handing out cards and stuff. As you go and share, you've got a grocery store until when to ask what you do. And you say, you're a writer and you told them about your books and they're you go? Autumn (27m 57s): It doesn't matter if you have a publisher not, but I agree a lot of publishers these days do expect you to have done it. And a lot of publishers like to pick up authors and writers who have been doing it. So that's why there's a lot of hybrid authors that use days where they Be, they started out as a self publishing and they are doing such a good job at getting themselves known in an in demand that publisher thinks, Oh, you are a safe bet. So I'm going to skip, are you up? And you are going to keep doing what you're doing, but now we're going to handle the book sales and maybe some of that advertising or are paying for the expenses for you to go to these big, big book, fair is and booking you out two signings and things. Autumn (28m 36s): Now, I mean, this is just good business, right? Yeah. I mean, if, if you are running a business and you are the head of publishing at a big publishing house, who do you want to sign? And you want to take a chance on an Author. You never heard about And who has no media, a social media following on anything, or do you wanna pick the one where you can see that they have a lot of following a lot of people, you know, talking about them and probably buying the books, which of course is as a publisher, you want know what at that point in time, but you have a pretty strong indication if you see what they're doing on the internet, right. Or whether or not it looks like they have a lot of following. Autumn (29m 9s): And so who do you go with? Of course, you'd pick the one with the following, right. Because you know, well this guy, he or her, yes, they can, they can publish their way. They can promote their own book. I'm going to say, and, and they can make a cell. And that's what do you want? Yeah, that's a publishing house. I mean, right. And there are some benefits. I mean, some the publishing house is they have some great NS with libraries, like the bookstore, as you see it airport's and things like that as well. That's actually kind of hard to get into as an Indy published author. Yeah. I think that's probably the only thing to be honest. Autumn (29m 41s): Autumn Jesper (29m 43s): I say, I, I, going through, at this point in time, I'm recording the, a free course are that we are going to put up later in the year. And actually I was just going through with the other day, one of the modules, when I talk about self publishing and stuff like that. And one of the things I actually set there is that the only thing that traditional publisher can do that we can not do with self publishers, I am getting into bookstores and libraries in effective manner. That's the only thing that they can do, but there is nothing else that they can do at, we can not do as well. Jesper (30m 14s): And probably if we want to better, I agree. I, I, I think, yeah, yeah. And editing might be some slight different that that's probably something where I would say that they can do it well, and it's not that we couldn't do exactly the same thing. I think that the thing is just at when the traditional publishing houses do their editing, they go through like 10 rounds of editing or something. It's very rare that you find a traditional published book with a single type of way that it can happen, but its very rare and it is because it's a, they've gone over, over and over and over and over again. Jesper (30m 47s): And then of course, as self published authors, we could also, we could do the same thing. I mean we could hire 10 different proof reading editor's and then go through one by one by one by one. And hopefully by the end you will, you we'll have gotten rid of any tables. So if you want two, you could go through that labral in the process a as well. But at least that part, I think that they usually do better in the traditional publishing houses that we do. But when it comes to marketing, getting professional covers, at least if we know who to contact and get them to decide for us and even, even editing as well, you know, all, all those things we can do just as well as they can. Jesper (31m 25s): Yeah. I do you think they have the advantage of many different eyes on one thing? Yes. Yes they do. But I definitely, I definitely think there's a split there though, because sometimes you're dealing with lots of people who might give contrary advice and then you have someone who might be really pushing hard for Writing to market. And I have heard stories of authors being really conflicted with getting an offer, have a wonderful, it sounds like a really good deal. You'll be able to a real publisher, but you, no, they want to switch this character and they want to do this and probably still very good book, but that's really hard if you're coming from a creative, I love being in charge of all my creative input. Jesper (32m 5s): So yeah that's yeah. As our one guest Hollie had mentioned about her in her writing partner, Angelina in Delina, they are, they were creating the world together, but they were both writing their own stories because they both a little to controlling what else to share the same book in the same character. It was thought that was kind of a durable it's very honest. Hi. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Well that's not always a, you know, you need to find some, but if your, what writing something together with somebody else, you need to find somebody who you, you aware of writing a new way of thinking and your way of working matches well with right? Jesper (32m 44s): So otherwise you kind of get sort of conflicts about things. So it's a, well, we actually talked about that in the past episode about finding a, somebody to write with. So go and search for that if your interested, but you said something earlier on that, a trigger something in me because I'm, there's also this whole debate about the, what is the difference between a writer and an author. And I did find, I did find some definitions. This is not me making it up. Jesper (33m 14s): This is some stuff I found on that. Autumn (33m 16s): The internet, which is always this. Yeah, exactly. Then Janette is always telling this truth, no matter what do you know? It Autumn that it's the way it is. All right. Never lies and everything you read is true. And you know what? I believe everything can say Jesper (33m 29s): Yes, but I found this ah, this way of wording it. Ah, and I thought it was just shared because then I want, you want us to talk a bit about what we think about it afterwards? So it goes like this, that some say that a writer is someone who writes a book, an article or whatever. Why not? An author is one who originates the idea of the Plot all the content of that it's been what is being written and both of those can of course be at the same person. Jesper (34m 2s): And then there are others who say that right, is our people who write Y all those authors who are those who have published their work and are earning money from it. So that sort of two different ways of Autumn (34m 15s): Distinguishing between being a rider and being an Author. Okay. I hadn't heard that first one before and it doesn't really resonate well with me, but the second one to me is, is more true. I Writer is someone who is REITs is writing. I mean, you could be a writer if your doing blogs and other things, a you're a journalist, you're a writer, but an author is definitely someone who has, you have given birth and produced a novel. And suddenly C's, you know, they've done the editing, they've done the covers. Autumn (34m 47s): Now they see, they had to do ads. They were doing the social media is more of a business idea. Even if they have a publisher, whether or not they have a publisher, they are an author B. It was like becoming a parent. Your not a mom until you give birth. So with the child. But do you know what my view on this? Is that, is that Yeah. Why do we care? It's a good one. Why does it matter? What is a Writer versus what, I mean, if you tie start typing it in, in Google law, in, in a, in your web browser, it'll automatically populate. Autumn (35m 23s): What is the difference between a writer and an author? Just like we can ask, why have we are debating what the differences are? It makes absolutely zero difference. It's very true. I think it's human nature to want categorize things and be able to define things as part of our little curiosity about, you know, understanding the world by putting labels in words, on things. But it does that make a difference at the end of the day, really? Jesper (35m 53s): Alan is like, I really feel like we need to break free of this line of thinking because I really don't think it matters at all. And the other part is that Autumn (36m 3s): Yeah, Jesper (36m 4s): A fair bit that some people might be checking out these definitions because maybe they feel a bit too insecure. So then they want, they don't want to end up saying, well, I, you know, if somebody asked, why do, what do you do to, I say, I'm a Writer or do I say Author? What is the difference between the two? And I definitely shouldn't say I'm an author if I haven't published books. So maybe I need to say I'm a writer. And so you blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And on and on and on there's self goes. It's just like, I don't like it. Jesper (36m 35s): You know, get rid of that stuff. It doesn't matter if you want to say you're right. If you want to say an author or whatever, say whatever you feel comfortable with, but I just don't think in it, if it matters at all, I don't think it as well that it matters what people, other people they're the people or the person who received that answer. How did you receive that answer? It doesn't matter either. Now. Maybe they feel like, well, Writer, Author maybe those data, we didn't even think about it. Some people we'll be thinking about it and they will be the ones we talked about at, at the top, where, well, are you writing it hours a day? Jesper (37m 12s): And if the answer is no Autumn (37m 16s): Not good enough for those standard. No, I think no, an honest answer of, Hey, what are you doing? I'm writing a book that kind of, you know, call me whatever you want. Why do you feel comfortable with, yeah, it that's fine. I agree. I think the ideas, like you said, put your butt in the chair. If your, if you want to do this, but your in the chair and actually REIT, and don't worry at what people call you or define you because some people are going to call you are a writer, so I'm gonna call you Author so we will call you a HACC, but its just do it and you know, do it cause you love it or because it's a drive within you and that's really the important part. Autumn (37m 53s): And yeah, you might, if you go on to publish a book, you're going to find out that there's a lot more to Writing. Whether you are publishing through a publisher or self publishing, you're going to find out there's quite a lot more to it than just, you know, hitting done. And it's suddenly magically out their and selling. There's a lot more shaking. I always think of a word, little worker bees doing their working bee dance to saying I am getting my work done. So yeah, you're gonna, you're going to find that as part of your life too. Jesper (38m 24s): Yeah, that's true. I mean, for me it's like, if you need permission from anybody as a listener, you have my permission permission from now on you can call yourself a writer, an author, the muster of the universe of whatever you want. I don't care. I don't care if I mean, it doesn't matter if you've published anything or if you have that pup, is there anything, if you want to call yourself a writer or an author? I do. So I think that the only thing that matters, as I said earlier on is that you right on a regular basis, whether you are published on it or not, it doesn't really matter if you're right on a regular basis and you, if you're committed to death in my view, then you are a writer. Jesper (39m 2s): I like it. I, I agree with it. And I think that's where we should definitely end on that note that, yes, it's good to call yourself a writer, call yourself an author. Don't don't deny yourself that if that is what you're doing and that is what's in your heart. Yeah. I have a, I actually find just one more quick, which I think we can finish off with that. Both did our homework for this one. I'm so proud. It's amazing. Isn't it? When you put in the effort, something happens. Jesper (39m 33s): He's amazing. But this one, it's a firm Ursula, Kayla Quint and I, I quite like it to so are you ready? All right. Yes, absolutely. From Ursula. Okay. You may have gathered from all of this that I am not encouraging people to try to be writers. Well, I can't, you hate to see a nice young person run up to the edge of the cliff and jump off on the other hand. It is awfully nice to know that some other people are just as knotty and just as determined to jump off the cliffs as you are, you just hope they realize what they are in for at the quote. Jesper (40m 15s): Oh, I love it. I that's why I love isn't that amazing? That does amazing. And that is perfect. So yes, I am so glad. I'm glad for the internet some days, because I've met so many people just as crazy, if not a little bit crazier, which is hard to do than me. So yeah. Yeah. And I like the, I liked the core message in In at least a way I read or hear that quote. It's also that if you wanna be a writer, there is a million things that you could do that will earn you an income at a thousand times faster in a thousand times easier. Jesper (40m 52s): So if you really want to be a writer and you have to be a bit naughty, you really want to go through with this. So, you know, as she says, she just hope that they realized what they're in for For and I think that is such a good message. You know, that tried to go in and if your listening to podcast like this one, you are going in, open-minded all ready. So that is great. You are already enlightened. As you enter on this journey, by listening to podcasts are reading block post or whatever, or you may be doing a learning about WRITING. Jesper (41m 24s): But I like the core message of that, that you can tell people that this should be right. As you know, if they wanna be writers, they want to be right as, and then hopefully they just know Autumn (41m 34s): What's gonna hit them. It was a very good message. And I agree, you know, any bunch of people who, it doesn't mind having characters, talking in their head and the spouses and significant others of all of those people who talked to the partners about the people who are talking in their heads and don't end up in the lunatic asylum. It's good. It's all right. So next Monday and if all goes well, Autumn will take a break and I will have a great interview line up for you about self editing. Narrator (42m 9s): If you like, what you just heard, there's a few things you can do to SUPPORT THE AM WRITING FANTASY PODCAST please tell a fellow Author about the show and visit us at Apple podcast and leave a rating and review. You can also join Autumn in Yesper on patrion.com/am Writing Fantasy for as little as a dollar a month. You'll get awesome rewards and keep The Am Writing Fantasy Podcast going to stay safe out there and see you next Monday.

Have you thought about writing in a different genre and weighed the option of using a pen name or no? Get the tips to decide if your current author platform will encompass something new or if, and how, you should start a new author platform under a pen name with guest host author Kirsten Oliphant! Check out Kirsten's other great tips and wonderful podcast at Create if Writing: https://createifwriting.com/ Tune in for new episodes EVERY single Monday. SUPPORT THE AM WRITING FANTASY PODCAST! Please tell a fellow author about the show and visit us at Apple podcast and leave a rating and review. Join us at www.patreon.com/AmWritingFantasy. For as little as a dollar a month, you'll get awesome rewards and keep the Am Writing Fantasy podcast going. Read the full transcript below. (Please note that it's automatically generated and while the AI is super cool, it isn't perfect. There may be misspellings or incorrect words on occasion). Narrator (0s): You're listening to the Am Writing Fantasy podcast and today's publishing landscape. You can reach fans all over the world. Query letters are a thing of the past. You don't even need an literary agent. There is nothing standing in the way of making a living from Writing Join two best selling authors who have self published more than 20 books between them. Now on to the show with your hosts, Autumn Birt and Jesper Schmidt. Autumn (29s): Hello, I'm Autumn. And we are on episode 74 of the Am Writing Fantasy podcast. And today we have a special guest as a yes for hinted last week, the women have come to take over the Am Writing Fantasy podcasts again, and we've booted Yesper off and given him a pit of a break for today. And I have with me Kirsten, Kirsten Oliphant, who is the author of over 15 books in different genres and the host of the creative Writing podcast, which she started in 2015 way back before podcasting became the cool thing to do. Autumn (1m 8s): So her goal is to help authors learn to sell more books without being smarmy. Hi. Kirsten Kiersten as well. Kirsten (1m 17s): Yeah, you don't have to. It's totally one of those Names and Hey, we're talking about Names today, which is, I mean it's just a perfect yes, absolutely. Thanks for having me on. I'm glad to be here. Autumn (1m 29s): Oh, I'm so happy. And yes, it is amazing. So you have 15 books. I already looked at your profile on Amazon and of course you were going to talk about Pen Names but I love the fact that you, you're not even subtle about it. You can list it right in your bio. Oh, I'm also with this person in Brighton under this name as well. And you have all these wonderful books. So tell us a little bit about your books and how you started writing. It's always fun to hear. Kirsten (1m 52s): Sure. Well I've been Writing I mean since forever, you know, I know some people pick up Writing later in some earlier, but I was writing, I mean I wrote my first novel in like third grade. Yes, it was terrible. But like, you know, it had dialogue and stuff like it, you know, it was like a solid, you know, D effort, right. Autumn (2m 11s): Dialogue in third grade when you read it. Kirsten (2m 14s): Yes. If you read a lot, you just pick things up and I think, you know, it was really instinctive for me. And so, uh, you know I kept writing throughout. I wasn't sure that I was necessarily going to be a writer but I did keep writing throughout. I wrote a bunch of half novel's in junior high or you know, never really finished anything but just did a lot of writing. I went to school Am college, English major, uh, you know, lots of papers. I took creative writing but you know its kind of hard to get into those kinds of classes and they only really have like two, you know, so I took part one in part to have that and loved it and my um, professor really encouraged me to look into MFA programs, which I hadn't thought about. Kirsten (2m 50s): And so, um, I didn't, I went and worked at a church doing youth ministry and then um, a couple of years later when I got married I started again about writing and just really how I stopped and I missed it. And so I did apply and got into an MFA program and you know, win. And we moved to across the country were in Texas. Now I grew up in Virginia, Texas. Now we went to North Carolina, uh, for two years, which is amazing. A really small program at UNC Greensboro. Um, and it was, yeah, it was, it was just so much fun and really got, uh, you know, it's a very literary program, which is so funny that I'm, I feel like I'm out. Kirsten (3m 28s): I'm on like the total opposite end now. Like the bastard child of my MFA program now writing genre fiction. But, um, it's really given me, I feel like I've had a really broad variety of experiences with writing and can really understand, you know, kinda the traditional perspective, indie perspective. And I just love writing. I love story. And so, you know, I'll probably go back to the literary stuff that's well more literary. I mean, it's not like, I don't know, genre fiction is not this, not literary. It's not that it's not good writing, it's just a totally different kind of craft. Kirsten (3m 60s): Um, I think, but anyway, I appreciate both. And so that's kind of, uh, you know, how I got here. I graduated and then started having kids. So for like 10 years, I could not process novel stuff. So I got this degree and then was like, Oh nevermind, let's have a bunch of babies. And I did blogging for a while, um, and professional, you know, like made bunny of blogging. And so I figured out, um, social media and, and uh, was really active in all those kinds of things. And so, uh, when it came to a time to feel like I really wanted to write books again, I had this advantage of sort of knowing the landscape and author platform came pretty easily to me because it was something I was already doing with blogging. Kirsten (4m 41s): It was just kinda putting a different hat on. So that's kind of the roundabout way of how I got here and started the podcast teaching other people, cause I think I enjoy the platform and it was something I knew how to do. But I think a lot of authors and creative people don't like it. It feels like icky. And so my goal is to kind of reframe that conversation and make it feel less icky. Like we should Real like writing more, but it's okay to also like Twitter or Facebook or email lists. Autumn (5m 6s): Well, I get that because I absolutely, I was gone through your website and I'm one of those folks who I still don't, I still, I mean I understand the voice part and everything else, but I just prefer to read it. I learn better by reading it, not by hearing it. And so I absolutely love your creative writing platform because you have blog posts on everything. And I'm like, Oh, I could freeze this. And it's not that I don't like video or voice or sound, but I just like to read things even. Yeah. So absolutely. Kirsten (5m 37s): And I'm going to for podcasts is to have, yeah, all of my podcasts have a full show notes, like a blog post. Um, because I know there are people out there who still want the content, but we all consume content differently. And you know, that actually helps me. Like I kind of, before I sit down to record, I read out the blog post and then I speak sort of conversation. I don't read it or anything, but I kind of have the blogpost in front of me. So it's like helpful to speak conversationally on the podcast and I already know what I'm going to say. But for those people who want to read and also for SEO purposes to get actual traffic on my blog, those meaty blog posts really help. Autumn (6m 11s): No, no, no that's great. And you know you have some stuff in there. I noticed that was even like a marketing for authors who don't like marketing. It's a very helpful, friendly things. So those are great tips. And I know you recently, I think it was episode one 69 so very fairly recently. And you talked about Pen Names so it's already kind of covered it a bit. So we're going to go over it a little bit again, but you have, so you are ready in three different names. You have your real name and then to Pen Names and why did you do that? Kirsten (6m 41s): Well really it kinda came down to the marketing and, and not being, um, muddy and unclear about what I was writing. So I started out, um, the first books I published were nonfiction. I had a couple of devotional books and then, um, was writing marketing books. I have an email book, which is actually down cause I'm updating it. I'm about to rerelease it, um, on email marketing for authors. And then I have one on collaborating with other people and creative ways. And I had run on a blogging, but I took it down because blogging has changed so much. Kirsten (7m 11s): I just was like, I don't want to update this every six months. We'd like something dyes, you know, and the takeaway, a social media platform. Umm, as I just get her to update next, I'll have people email me like this isn't true in the more I'm like, yeah, your right and I don't have time to update those three 99 book over here that sells a couple of copies. Um, but when I started thinking about writing fiction again, it really, um, you know, I hadn't ever really thought about Pen Names but I started, uh, just seeing how for different genres and I really love reading a lot of Genres. Kirsten (7m 44s): I'm one of those people that's all over the place. How it might be a really confusing, if you're going to look at an author and you may, you know, that you may of had this experience for anyone listening where you go and check out an author and you see all these different kinds of book covers and you just kind of, it's a, it's like a disquieting feeling because you're not sure what exactly a signaling, like what can I expect? And that's the thing that Pen Names really helped do. Um, when you're separating out the different Genres, it's setting that reader expectations. So it's incredibly clear. And you know, there are people like, you know, a Stephen King, he can do whatever he wants because it's Stephen King, but we're mostly not there yet. Kirsten (8m 20s): And there are some people I know who write different genres all under the same name and it works to varying degrees, but especially when you're starting out, which I was putting out fiction, um, you know, it really, it, it really is muddy and it really makes things unclear for readers. And so I didn't necessarily want people to go look and be like, Oh, I love this book. Let's see what I'll show you. Oh, a book on email lists. I don't even know what that is. You know? And so that's just kinda how it started. I know some people do this for, um, you know, like maybe you're writing something, you know, like erotica and your husband's a youth pastor. Kirsten (8m 55s): Mine was, which that's not what I write. You know, that would be a reason where you don't want your name attached to it. So for some people it is really about that privacy issue. But for me it was much more about marketing and you know, whichever way you're doing it, it's fine. Um, but yeah, there's a couple different reasons why you might choose a Pen. Names. Autumn (9m 13s): Yeah, I've always, I looked at it cause I write in, I was going to say two different genres, but you're right when you throw in the nonfiction, so I write in three Genres as well and mostly I've always put it all my fictional writing under just the name I go by autumn Bert. So that is sort of my brand and I always figured if my brand was true, which is very fast paced kind of action oriented stories, whether it's Fantasy and I also do some post-apocalyptic kind of dystopian. So whether I Writing and one of those, I just figured my audience is technically the age bracket is the same. Autumn (9m 48s): It is, I'm still the same kind of really well developed characters in action. So I figured it was all of the same. But you're right. I mean in some ways the covers are very different and my readers I have, it's probably split into thirds. I have a third are like hardcore Fantasy Please I never want to see anything with a gun. I have the other third are like Please if nothing is exploding BI, you know something with tea and tea. I do not ever want to read it. There is no such thing as magic. And then I have a third who just like the way I write and they're there. Autumn (10m 18s): But there's definitely some people who are not into the crossover and it's, it's not as clear cut as I was hoping when I did it. And again, but you're right, I have my nonfiction of writing, I do with my husband that's under my married name of autumn, Raven. And I just wanted that clear cut. Like this is something that is totally different. There's the magic is all in your heart and not in, um, you know, blowing things up. Kirsten (10m 44s): Yeah. And you'd hope like, I mean, my dream, I think all of us would love for our audience to love our words enough and love our style and our voice enough that they would go anywhere we go. And that's the goal. But at the end, I think you build that over time, that group of super fans, but it's a, it's a smaller subset of the people who read your books, right? People read your books and they may read all of them, but they may not all be super fans and I do have, you know, especially like on day one of launch, you know, if my also bots kind of pop up and I haven't had a long preorder, I might see one of my nonfiction books in the office of the boss or you know, I write clean romance in urban fantasy, young adult. Kirsten (11m 19s): I read Fantasy and so sometimes those first couple days in either of those I'll see those pop up and I really don't want that. That's the other thing that kind of can make it Monday as I want. My also bots to show, I mean if Amazon is at that point, they're showing those, which right now for me it's like a mixed bag. Like sometimes you'll go on the Amazon page and you'll see Am customers have also read or also bought. Right now I'm seeing books you may like, which is super annoying because it's showing me all my own books because I'm like checking ranks all of the time. And so I'm like, I know I liked them, I wrote them, but I don't want to buy them, you know? Kirsten (11m 52s): Um, but I do want that to be clear for readers as well when they are going up because if they're going and they buy one of my urban fantasy books and then they look and see a clean romance cover, that's, you know, maybe there's some crossover, but those two, especially the two genres I'm running under, there is not a ton of crossover because the clean romance crowd is, there is a variety of their two. But some of them our, there's a heavy influence of like Christian readers and some of them don't want magic at all. And so when you go to the urban Fantasy and I'm like, there's witches and the fan Pires and, and for me, the steam levels kind of the same. Kirsten (12m 25s): Like my goal is not, I don't really have sex on the page in any of my books. I tell them I don't really have, um, language in any of my books and which is actually a real struggle in that the young adult orbit. Fantasy because in my head I get that that's here. I'm like, this is what they'd say, but I don't want to put that. And that's just my own personal, there's nothing wrong. I mean, again, I read all over the board write, but for what I want to put out, that's just kinda the line I've drawn into. It makes me happy to work harder. But if you know of my clean room and people come over, I think they'll be pleasantly surprised. And some of them have, and some of them have written me and said like, I never thought I would like a book about this. Kirsten (12m 59s): Um, but you know, there's also some romance elements in my urban fantasy as well, which I know is like a, you know, debate, hot debate over in fantasy land. So I will always have, I think, some kind of romance in them, but it's not gonna it's not gonna be the main, a part of the story necessarily. Autumn (13m 16s): Yeah. And I think that's definitely, I mean it's your writing style, what you're interested in writing and again, your brand and your platform. So those are things that are going to cross genres no matter what you do. I mean how you develop characters, it's, they're all going to be solid. There's going to be some, I think I read somewhere that someone did it in a review and said the familiar hand of this author. I don't think that's a good, yeah, that's such a good way to say that. Yes. No matter where we stick ourselves, we're probably going to have some kind of resonance and pacing that is very familiar and that's what we're trying to sell our readers on and hopefully bring them across genres. Autumn (13m 52s): But that is, it is fun. So when you, you did this very purposely, you knew you were going to start writing it in a different genre and you set up a whole different platform. I mean, do you, you go as far as the websites, if someone was going to do this and they said, I, I write specifically in this, but I'm going to go ahead and write in a different genre, what are the, the things that you would warn them about or tell them at least to think about before they, they jump into something? Kirsten (14m 17s): Well, for me, you know, given that none of us have a lot of time, right? And I've got five kids at home, things are going crazy. It's, I didn't have a lot of time to build a lot of platform. But what I found is that, um, you know, I kind of pared it down to the bare basics. Like what for me, what does the cornerstone of an author platform, and for me that's an email list because that is where you're going to sell the most of your books. That's where you're going to the most personally connect with your fans in a way that is more permanent, right? Like, so some authors may be more active on Facebook, whether that's an a group or a page or they might be more active on Instagram or some of their platform, but you don't own those connections, right? Kirsten (14m 54s): Instagram and Facebook, do they control how you interact with an email? You actually have their email, you can print it out unless CSV like you know, the spreadsheet thing and hold it in your hand. It's yours. So email is so important. So that's always kind of where I start. Um, and then I do have URLs. Like I do have websites and, but I don't put a lot into it because really they, I think in this day and age, like I, I just don't see a ton of readers caring about your author website. I just don't, and um, you know, I'm not trying for like a traditional platform deal. Kirsten (15m 28s): I'm not trying to like impress some publisher somewhere with, with how many page views I get a month in. And really, because I came from the blogging world, a new how I know how to grow a blog and know how to do SCO, all of that. But I also knew how much work it takes. And for me the return is not huge. I would rather just send people to Amazon and have them buy my books. I don't need a middleman. Now, if you were, um, you know, trying to do a lot of affiliate sales with Amazon, you know, you might want to send it to your website or if you're selling direct or you might be selling like literally from your website. But if you're just doing the bare bones basics, you don't need that. Kirsten (15m 60s): So I did buy the URL, but I actually, for the first Pen Names I was thinking I might do more blogging, but then I, I really didn't, um, cause who has time for that? Like I don't have the time to do blogging and also write a bunch of books. Um, so when I came and I started the second Pen name under Sullivan gray for the urban Fantasy, I got the URL, um, which, you know, I, I think it's good to look those things up. Write, you don't want to have another author with that name. Um, there is a series I think actually with that name but not an author, but I did get the URL and then have it. Kirsten (16m 31s): I had to redirect to a landing page from a mailer light, which was the email that I use. And so if people go to my author website, it's really just a landing page and I think I will build it out a bit, but I've sold a bunch of books without it. So I don't, you know, it's not a priority. The priority to me was growing an email list. I do have a Facebook page, a so I can run ads and uh, I like Facebook groups, although, you know, it is hard to put a lot into the groups, especially to get them off the ground. It takes a lot of you being involved and starting conversations. Kirsten (17m 3s): I do believe in Facebook groups. It's a really great way to be close to your audience. And so I have one of those for each, but you know, I'm not, um, I'm not able to really be all of that active cause I also have a, a very active group for my podcasts. So you really have to think about your bandwidth and, and your ultimate, I'm all about the ROI, like your return on investment of time and money. What is going to sell books, what is going to help you connect longterm with readers who are going to stick with you. And for me that's email. And then having books sold on Amazon. Kirsten (17m 35s): And again, I do use Facebook ads and so the pages were important but I did not. Um, you know, there's a lot of different schools on how to do Facebook ads, but I've had success with ads, with pages that are tiny so you don't necessarily even have to a big page because you can target other people. I am almost never targeting the people who like my page. I'm targeting other people's pages. So if you have a Facebook page of a couple of hundred people, that's fine. You know, you can still make money with Facebook ads. You can still sell books. Kirsten (18m 5s): Um, is Facebook really does make it a lot harder now to grow a page and it's a lot more work. And again, what, what is the least amount of work? I can do on things that don't, you know, bring in a big return. Right. So that's my goal cause I've got too many balls in the air to spend a lot of time blogging if no one's reading it or if it's not selling books. So I think you can absolutely do the bare bones minimum something to run ads on. Um, some kind of like main hub where people can reach you and then your email list is really where I'd put most of the time. Autumn (18m 40s): Yeah. And do you, so you have for each of your Genres in each of your Pen Names uh, different mailing lists. So you never find them across them. Okay. Kirsten (18m 47s): Yeah I don't and I do, um, you know, because my, my um, there is some crossover again like I do every so often mentioned to my, you know, to frictionless like, Oh by the way, you know I have this idea if you like reading about vampires I get out of here. Or if you really like romance, you know, you might enjoy these books or you know, Hey if you're an author just in case you're out there, cause there are a lot of re uh, you know, authors and readers and you know, I've got this podcast thing going on and so I do mention it every so often. Um, but I even have the, um, I have the two fiction, uh, lists over on mailer light and then I also use convert kit, which I used for my nonfiction cause I'm doing a lot more complicated things with my nonfiction. Kirsten (19m 29s): You know, I sell, I used to do a lot more like workshops and webinars and courses and so it matters a lot more if you can use some of the advanced features when you're really trying to separate out and mainly like does a good job with those things for the price. But convert kit is so much smoother and easier for all of that. And so yeah, my nonfiction list hangs out over there and then I've got the two fiction lists and mailer light. Yeah, Autumn (19m 50s): We do the exact same thing. I have mailed a Lite for my frictionless and convert kit for the AmWritingFantasy. And I agree it's just, I absolutely adore mailer lights. Um, way of being able to put together a newsletter actually. And I, I keep looking at ConvertKit going Please come to the 21st century. Please Kirsten (20m 10s): Oh see I'm the opposite. I don't like the fancy email's and so even in low light I'm doing like the very bare bones cause I don't like when I, when something hits my inbox, I don't care. I don't care what it looks like. It's really about the content, but everybody's really different. And so, you know, I don't think ConvertKit will ever go there. I think that's their whole platform but, but I'm there for the features and you know, not necessarily having a pretty background or whatever. Autumn (20m 35s): Yeah. I think I like to do, in my newsletter there's a lot of interactions and questions and polls and convert kit does not, that I've found has, does not make that easy when you're talking to your fiction list and learning to do little poll on, you know, which characters are a favorite. So a light definitely makes that easy. But anyway, we're not talking about how you can easily get a bit lost into the email list because those two, there's so many great platforms though. But those are definitely to me to have the stable ones at the moment. Autumn (21m 6s): Who knows what the future holds. Kirsten (21m 8s): Yeah, you never know. Autumn (21m 10s): That's great. So I love, I do love the Nate like Sullivan grey as an awesome Pen. Names said you did Sue some research, like you said before you went and chose something, you took something that fit the urban fantasy genre and you wanted to make sure no one else was already using it. Kirsten (21m 25s): So if you're coming to think about a Pen Names I mean there's personal reasons and then there's like practical reasons and I think it's totally fine to mix them. So when I started with clean romance, I chose a name. My name is Emma st Claire and I feel like Emma is one of those Names. It's like friendly and happy. Like you can't not like Emma. Right. It's just sounds like a little touch of old fashioned. Yes. You've got to Jane Austin. And then st Claire was my maiden name. And really that was a risk because it's one of those names that always gets miscategorized because it has a period in it and it's like STD periods space Clare. Kirsten (22m 0s): And so like my whole life I grew up getting like having everything lost cause it would be like some people put it like final in her S a for sale, like spelling it out even though it's not, or they put it under STC or they put it under C for clear anyway. It hasn't caused a problem. But the laughter as I was like, what was I thinking? But it was more sentimental. Like let's put something out with my maiden name, you know, bring the family name on. Um, and then with the, uh, but yeah, I absolutely looked at like, okay, is there someone like on Amazon with this name or one really similar or you know, it is the website available. Kirsten (22m 34s): And then with Sullivan gray, um, I did go in and kind of look and I think sometimes with, um, you know, a lot of the white, depending on what John you're writing in sort of a more androgynous name, like whether it, you don't know whether it's a guy or girl. And we actually loved the name of Sullivan. Um, we're going to use it for a girl and we ended up not using it and we're done having kids. We're going to call her Sally. And I just thought that was adorable. So I love, I love strong girl names, I love last names as first names. It's all been great. Just had that ring to it that felt, it felt like kinda cool and powerful and just like a good fit for that. Kirsten (23m 7s): But it also was like a name that I totally loved. And the website you are always taken but not by anyone who's actually using it. So I just have authors, all of it in gray.com but everything else is there. And I will say like, you definitely want to search that because this is hilarious. Last night I was on, I'm in some one of those Am, I'm in a ton of Facebook groups, right, for research and promotion and whatever else. But there was one and it was like a um, Christian Kindle reads or something and one popped up and it was about like prophecy and coven 19. Kirsten (23m 41s): And I was like, I don't, I'm not really into that at all, just FYI. So, but I clicked on it cause I was like, who is this? Cause the person posting, like I didn't, it was posted under a different name. It's, I think it's the person. And I was like, is this a Pen Names this is a kind of stuff I nerd out about. So do I click through and um, I couldn't really tell this looks like that author's first book. So again, I think it's a pen name from somebody. So I clicked on the pen name itself and that name is really close to two different erotica authors. And so when you click on their name, you see that book prophecy and biblical or whatever. Kirsten (24m 14s): And then it's like this giant list of like really raunchy covers that I was like, Oh you really, you really should have done a quick search on Amazon beforehand. Yeah, because it wasn't like it was the same name, but it was to Names close enough that the whole first page, if you go look for the author is all erotica. And I was like, I don't think this is where you want to buy your book to show up. So anyway, a quick search to save you a lot of time. Yeah. Autumn (24m 42s): Yeah. I mean I've definitely thought of it like, Oh well if you're going to write like children's literature and erotica, you definitely need a pen name. But that's sort of of the other guy. So if you're writing a children's literature and your choosing a pen name, make sure it isn't close to something that you used to stumble Kirsten (24m 58s): And you might not think that, but like you know, you definitely, you don't always know until you search things and then then you know. So it's definitely better to search first Autumn (25m 7s): And then the search first or you know, someone else can obviously come along and choose something and totally jumble up the whole thing later. But at least maybe, hopefully you'll be established by then. Kirsten (25m 17s): Yeah, hopefully. I mean, yes, people can totally, yes, come along a mess. All of those things up. So Autumn (25m 23s): No, they always do. That was the other thing though. I mean thinking of Pen Names when I was choosing you, no, I'm going to write this dystopian post-apocalyptic series and I have this Fantasy platform and I was thinking of my readers and the way I honestly, I think it was the same thing. You know, you're busy, you have a life in a job. I didn't have kids, but I have a husband and hobbies and a dog that is my kid. Cause my fuzzy child and I, we were traveling and doing a whole bunch of things and I thought, Oh my goodness, I do not want to start at square one again. Autumn (25m 55s): I don't want to start all over. But do you think it's not so bad because you can tell your other platform, Hey, if you're interested on starting this or did you feel like you really, it took that slow churn and burn to finally build up an audience under a pen name? Kirsten (26m 11s): Yeah, it took time and it, and I'm still building like you know, the urban Fantasy doesn't make as much money right now as the clean romance does. Those are the clean romance readers are just voracious. So, you know, and I'd really already been established. That was the advice I kept hearing cause I was ready. I had a book ready to launch, you know, like six to nine months after I started the clean romance Pen Names was at um, the 20 books to 50 K conference. And I think in like four different sessions, I heard people say like, make sure your established before you switch. Kirsten (26m 43s): And I'm into a new genre. And I was like, okay, I've got the book done but there's no rush even though I love the book. So we'll just wait. And that was a great choice because even when, I think it was like 18 months later, even when I launched, you know, I took a big income hit because I took a break Writing the clean romance, which was making money and also bad timing took a break on ads cause I was like, I don't know if these are fully working, they were turning off your ads, let's you know, really quick whether they're working or not true. But it does take some time to establish and you know, I think you absolutely can't, you don't have to do a Pen Names absolutely. Kirsten (27m 18s): If you know how to do marketing, if you know how to write and you can totally get away, especially if you're, um, you know, if the, the Genres are similar enough in might have some crossover. But if you're doing really different ones, and again, mine really felt pretty different because there are some people who feel really strongly and the clean romance against the whole like paranormal, supernatural stuff. Like they're not just like, I don't like it. They're like, I abhor it, you know, I will not, you know, there was just a pretty strong reaction there. Um, and a lot of my readers who read my a young adult stuff, even though my young adult stuff's clean, I me and my goal is to, I'm not marketing it necessarily as clean. Kirsten (27m 56s): That's just my goal in my own, you know, kinda the line that I've dropped. But I want my books to be good enough that they stand up with books that aren't holding back on anything. So that PE and, and what I found is those readers over there are reading all kinds of stuff. They're reading reverse hair on the reading steamy stuff. They're reading all kinds of, and they still like my books, but they're probably not going to cross over either. So I think that's really the thing to consider is do you have the time? I'm, how different are your Genres? Um, but it is, it is pretty hard to start, but if you, again, if you have the background and no, if you've already done at once, you absolutely can do it again. Kirsten (28m 31s): Right? If was you just do it for maybe a little bit better. Secondly, and you know, kind of we're not to waste time. Um, you know, so for me, I found some author groups and connected and we were writing, um, you know, started out, I launched with doing like a Am an Academy series. And so that was really hot last year. Um, I was kind of on the tail end, but it still did really well. And there's, there were Facebook groups for Academy readers and so, um, you know, I got in to some like promotions with like book funnel with other authors who are also doing Academy reads and, and things like that. Kirsten (29m 2s): And so, um, you know, you already know how to do it. I, uh, took a couple of days in row, like a 12,000 word, a short story that was a prequel to the Academy series. And I use that to build my list. And so, you know, within a couple months I built up a couple thousand people just because there are people out there who want to read things for free. And yes, there's freebie seekers, right? We all with emails, we hate that. But if you grab someone enough with you're writing, if they get it and actually read it, you, you might be hooking reader for a long time. And so I've had good results from, from using that freebie. Kirsten (29m 36s): Um, and also it pulls people right into my pain works. And so, um, it is a pain. I was, I was kind of excited to see like, okay, how well could I do this again? Um, cause for me a lot of it's a test because then I go in and share that on the podcast to talk to other authors about it. In some ways, even if I fail, it's like, okay, well now I have something to share like don't do this. And uh, you know, I never shy away from sharing that. You know, I share my big income months and I share with like I totally screwed things on both of them. Kirsten (30m 8s): But yeah, you don't have to do it. I just think your struggle is going to be a little harder if your not using a pin name and your Writing into Genres that don't have a ton of crossover or um, or you know, again, like if you haven't written a lot of books, if you were only written three books and two of them are in clean romance and one of them is urban fantasy. So when people go to your author page and they just see those three books, it's a little more money. Whereas if they see like 20 books and there's some differences in their, it's a little bit more, um, of a solid feeling that people can get because they know you're established, you're not just jumping around and they can find a couple of different of this kind and a couple of different of this kind. Kirsten (30m 45s): So, um, yeah, you don't have to do a pin name it just for marketing it could be a lot easier to be clear and with those reader expectations. Autumn (30m 53s): Yeah, I think that's a, actually a really good tip is, you know, being established in one. So, you know, finish your first series, are a trilogy, have that under your belt, have that platform established before you launch another book. Cause I do see that. I've, I know when I was doing it, I wrote an entire trilogy and then I wrote this dystopian series and then I did another trilogy back in Epic Fantasy. So I felt like I really knew what I was doing, but I have met so many authors who it's like they've started five different series and they have just the first books out. And maybe they were just attempting to a novella to see if it was going to sell. Autumn (31m 26s): But if you don't have anything complete yet, it just, it does, it looks confusing and you kind of like, where are you? Are you finishing this? Is it going to continue? It's, it's definitely a little, um, it makes you question what's going on and it takes longer to search through things and see if you can find the next book that your interested in. It's so much prettier to see the whole series. Kirsten (31m 46s): Oh, totally. And it's a thing about building trust, right? Like, we want readers who don't just read one book, they read all of our books and I found that it's really easy to break that trust. And so if your, you know, coz I'm a huge reader too, I read probably a book a day. Oh my goodness. It's my escape right now scape. You know when an author like leaves a series forever if or his writing for different at once, like its hard. And then you have a lot of readers who will say things like, well I won't read until the series complete. Kirsten (32m 17s): And then on the author side of this author is like, well this series isn't making money, I'm going to drop it. And so it's like working against each other. So I totally understand why some authors write in multiple cause sometimes also just creatively, some people need a break or a palate cleanser or something else. But as a reader like you just want them to finish that series and um, clean romance, it's a little bit easier because often if your having a series, it's a standalone series, right? Because each book has to have a happy ever after. I'm in romance and a, yeah so you have a related series. Kirsten (32m 49s): I'll have characters from one book, you know in there and the main then the next year, which people love and, and sometimes I'll make the decision based on like I'll get a bunch of reviews where everybody's asking for this one character and I was like all right great. So we'll, we'll do that. But um, yeah when you're coming into and, and I do have a series like that in, in the young adult where I'm, it's been way too long since I've gone back to the second book but it didn't sell as well and its kind of more of a um, a love series to have people asking about it but they, it didn't sell as well and not as many people are asking. Kirsten (33m 23s): So I'm just doing what I can. Right. You have to balance out what are you doing your own life, what are you well you can actually do and, and also um, what the readers want cause you do want to build that trust and establish, you know, a relationship where they know what to expect from you. Cause again, I keep saying expectations and expecting, but like that is, that's kind of the currency for trust. His is the readers have expectations and you give them expectations. Um, whether you mean to or not, whether you outright say, I'm going to publish a book a month. Kirsten (33m 54s): If you start publishing a book a month, they start to expect that. And so, you know, we need to kind of communicate that really well. And unfortunately not everybody joins your email list. They may be fans. You know, I had a book that, um, in the clean room and said, I ended up moving from one series to another and renaming it. And when I first put it back up, the note about that was in the book, but I had forgotten to put it on the Amazon sales page and immediately got a one star review from someone who had read it before and then bought it again. Kirsten (34m 24s): And you know, I, I was like, they were like, you didn't say it anywhere. And like I had it, but, but Amazon also chooses where the book starts. Right? So it started after the note. And so, um, and, and there were massive changes, but whatever I understand I would be tic to, especially if they're not reading through K you and they actually paid full price for to have these books. So, you know, that was a feeler on my part. We've got to really, you know, meet those expectations and, and try to keep that currency of trust with the readers, uh, to keep them knowing that they could trust us and knowing they're not always gonna be on our email list. They might, and I have a lot of authors I read, but I'm not going to set up for the email list because my inbox is jammed, but I'll read all their books. Kirsten (35m 2s): So Autumn (35m 3s): Yeah, I remember when I first published and first started email lists back in 2013 and it was back when it was new and you figured the readers were like, kind of like, Oh, I can actually like talk to an author. And now I just, I can't imagine it's like another Kirsten (35m 16s): Email list. Autumn (35m 18s): No, you just, I know I go through my every month or so. I'm just deleting and unsubscribing from everyone. So I can imagine what poor readers are going through, but it is a great way to get into books and learn more about stories. So you know, I think of that whenever I sit down to write my newsletter is what can I do to make this not to take up too much of their time and show how much I appreciate that they didn't like opt out already. Kirsten (35m 44s): Yes, absolutely. You don't want to, yeah, email. I mean yeah, that's the whole bunch of episodes on the South end, you know yet you don't want to like bother them, but you also like that's another way of, of trust. It's another way of building that relationship. And I think in a lot of ways it's, it is more intimate because for some people, like for me, I like you have been doing this forever. So it's obvious like when you hit reply, like you expect that it's going to the author and it's like a weird thing. If you get one of those, if you've ever got the form of emails, so on and so has read your risk and you're like, Oh my gosh, like just turn that autoresponder off cause that makes it feel super impersonal. Kirsten (36m 18s): But you know, I'll have people hit reply and then when I replied back, they're like, Oh my gosh, emailing me. And they get so excited. And so it really does have this personal feel to it and um, yeah. But, but yeah, you'll for sure how people who aren't on your list, and that's fine too if they read everything, but you just gotta make sure like, okay, like I, I screwed up. I didn't put that note really clearly on the page. We're Autumn (36m 42s): Only human. There's a pandemic. Yeah, totally. As soon as I, Kirsten (36m 49s): Oh yeah. As soon as I saw the review I was like, I knew I forgot something and when added it and you know, but too late, that's fine. But hopefully the reader comes back. But hopefully we just do our best. Right. Provide a lot of books, provide information to keep the trust. But, Autumn (37m 5s): And I do, I, I am totally a home. Please learn from my failure. I think life as an experiment and I'm happily to be my own Guinea pig so I do the exact same thing. I think we'd get along that way if I was closer to the Texas that it's just kind of like, you know, you do it, you try, you tell people about it, you move on. It is Kirsten (37m 27s): As someone else your learning the hard way for somebody else. Autumn (37m 30s): Yes. I am fine being the person who jumps into the fire of so far. I'm a Phoenix so we're good. Kirsten (37m 38s): We're still going right. We're still Writing so no mistake that was permanent just once we moved on from Autumn (37m 43s): That's right. I still, I do love that advice though. Just if you're thinking about writing a new genre, um, to go to like your book page or you know, one of your books and think about what's gonna show up on your also bots and does it fit and if it's not, the cover is not going to look right. If the reader is, would not go pick up a book, that's probably a really good time to think about doing a pen name and starting those steps. Yeah, absolutely. So is there any other takeaways, tips you want to throw out there before we wrap up? Kirsten (38m 15s): Well, I would just say, you know, for the people, if we haven't really touched on the privacy issue, if there is anybody out there, if you're trying to do this for privacy and not have your pin name associated, I think that's where it gets a little bit a trickier. But you know, you can, um, I just had somebody asking me about this this morning in my Facebook group. Um, but you know, you can buy a domain and you can add or you definitely wanna add the privacy on because otherwise you're going to be getting, it's a little bit more per year, but I'm going to be getting emails and your email can be publicly associated with it. Um, Facebook, I find a lot of authors doing this, but Facebook Am you really are not allowed to have more than one personal profile. Kirsten (38m 52s): And the personal profile is where you add friends, right? The page is where you get likes. So you can have multiple pages but you can only have one profile. So I see a lot of authors trying to add a second profile Am under their Pen Names in it. You know, you might get away with it but if Facebook finds out they can take away your whole account and if your, you know matters, right? Like your advertising and things like that on Facebook like that matters to lose that whole platform. And so, um, but you can have a page and have that be anonymous. You can most groups now if you're using groups' to promote Mmm. Kirsten (39m 24s): Most of them allowed to join us at page and say you can do that. But there are ways to do it if you want privacy. But you're, you're going to have to make sure your not like secretly telling a few family and friends because then yeah, your also bots might get jacked up and connect to your other Pen Names so it is, it could be a little bit harder to keep that separate but it's totally possible as well if you're doing it for that reason, not just a marketing reason. Autumn (39m 48s): Yeah. I've always considered it's sort of a nightmare there. You should know a little bit about IP and IP security if your doing it because there really is a privacy concern because it's hard. It's amazing how well people can link things if they really want to trace where something is coming from. So you have to be very cautious. Well thank you so much, Kiersten. This was really fantastic and tell I will put links in the show notes, but if you want to tell folks where to find you, that will be fantastic. Kirsten (40m 21s): Yeah. Well if you're interested in learning more author stuff and getting another perspective, not just on Fantasy but other things, you can just go to Create if writing.com and you can find links to the podcast and my Facebook community there and yep, I do talk about the Pen Names there as well as you can find those. But yeah, thanks so much for having me. It was great to be on. Autumn (40m 40s): Yes, it was so wonderful. I love that. I got a chance to talk to you and so next week, yes, we will be back and will be having a lovely discussion on developing your author brand and what it is. So please stay tuned and we look forward to seeing you stay safe out there. Narrator (40m 59s): If you like what you just heard, there's a few things you can do to support the Am Writing Fantasy podcast. Please tell a fellow author about the show and visit us at Apple podcast and leave a rating and review. You can also Join Ottoman Yesper on patrion.com/am Writing Fantasy for as little as a dollar a month. You'll get awesome rewards and keep the Am Writing Fantasy podcast going, stay safe out there And see you next Monday.

Episode 009 / Kirsten Oliphant writes clean romance--and lots of other sub-genres. She joins Jami Albright and Sara Rosett to talk about the genre of clean romance as well as sustainability and “pantsing” books. They also tackle the pros and cons of author success stories. You can find show notes and links at wishidknownforwriters.com. In the intro, Jami shared that she’s closing in on her deadline and her book is going to the developmental editor in a few days. Sara’s back from London, where things didn’t go as planned. London Book Fair was cancelled, and she had to return to the US early, which meant she missed the SPF-Live event. The upside was that Sara had plenty of time to see London, had several afternoon teas, and met up with other mystery writers. In this podcast episode, you’ll discover: How Kirsten fell in love with the subgenre of billionaire romance while writing a parody of it What audience expectations are in sweet/clean romance The mistake of reading only traditionally published books in for genre research How Kirsten is able to “pants” a book and write instinctively without an outline What Kirsten wishes she’d known about how successful marketing tactics vary between genres Finding balance--or tension--in your writing life The two questions Kirsten uses to decide if something is a good use of her time How to listen to success stories--the benefits and drawbacks of sharing Collaboration Rebranding a book What changes Kirsten has seen in the clean romance genre Things that have helped Kirsten be successful, including her focus on email and continuing to read in her genre Genres discussed include sweet/clean romance, cozy mystery, steamy romance, reverse harem, and bully romance. Links: Kirsten’s website: https://createifwriting.com Kirsten’s podcast for writers: https://createifwriting.com/podcast-and-show-notes/ Podcast on sustainability: https://createifwriting.com/sustaining-your-book-sales-and-yourself/ Podcast on how to listen to success stories - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XJdjrt8Xnc SPF-Live event digital ticket: https://selfpublishingformula.com/digital

The first quarter of 2020 is almost over, what will you be doing in the second quarter of 2020 to market your books? Maybe something out of your comfort zone? Bryan mentions that he will be having a book description webinar coming soon and H. Claire Taylor is recruiting people for her new class. Be sure to check out Kirsten Oliphant's Launch Class. This week’s Super Charger Story Course Winner is Dan Thompson. Thank you to our featured Patrons - Woodpecker Wars: Celebrating the Spirituality of Everyday Life, Taking Charge: Making Your Healthcare Appointments Work for You, and The Final Arrangement. The Top Tips of the week include what is causing Indies to give up on google, how you can use content marketing to market not only non-fiction but also fiction, and why your best promotional tool is your readers themselves. The 5 News stories that matter most to indies this week include how Hachette’s 2019 revenue increased by 5% over 2018’s revenue, why Publishers Weekly believes Amazon Publishing has come out on top, how authors can learn from the marketing mistakes from the movie Birds of Prey, what is being done about book scams starting on April 27th, and why Hachette, Amazon, HarperCollins, Simon & Schuster, Macmillan, and Penguin US are all pulling out of the London Book Fair. Question of the Week: What are you going to do to market your books in the second quarter of 2020? If you try something outside of your usual comfort zone, what will it be?

How much do you usually write during the day? Episode 300 is coming! Bryan is off this week because he is running his 5-day Amazon Ad Profit Challenge. Jim’s cohost is the amazing Kirsten "Beersten" Oliphant. And… Happy Birthday to Jim! This week’s Happy Books Review Winner is Dan Thompson. Thank you to our featured Patrons: A Band Director's Guide to Everything Tuba, The Darby Shaw Chronicles, and Doubt The Stars. The Top Tips of the week include how to navigate Amazon's new ad features, the difference between a website and an ideal website, and 10 words all authors should know. The 5 News stories that matter most to indies this week include the still banned Harry Potter books, reselling used ebooks, why author Heather Demetrios shouldn’t have quit her day job, how ebooks have not taken over the book world, and how outlining could increase your daily word count. Question of the Week: What's your average word count written per day?

Kirsten Oliphant is a writer, blogger, and presenter of the excellent 'Create If Writing' podcast.

Kirsten Oliphant is a writer, blogger, and presenter of the excellent 'Create If Writing' podcast. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/self-publishing-journeys/message

Writer Mom Life Episode 48: Kirsten Oliphant and Hitting Big Goals   In a recent poll of our Facebook group, you all said you wanted more from writer moms making the big bucks, and Kristen has been doing AWESOME the past 12 months! She is a great example of the work and strategy that goes into the "ten year overnight success" and explains how adaptability is essential to making it in the indie world. And as a mom of five, she's gotten pretty good at leaning into the chaos!   Get the full show notes at writermomlife.com/ep48

In this episode I go in depth into my future plans and not all of it is book related. I’ll talk about my personal finances and how they fit into my Rapid Release plans. I also ask my listeners to insult me. Here are the links to the resources I plan on using as I work through my release schedule: Create If Writing Podcast #142 This is a great podcast and a really good episode. This episode was released at exactly the time I needed to hear it.   Free Email Course Created by Kirsten Oliphant who is the host of the Create If Writing podcast mentioned above. I haven’t looked through this yet but I’m a fan of her podcast.   Udemy Course on Copywriting I haven’t actually gone through this yet but I plan on using what I Read more...

In this episode, we focus on working with influencer communities to build your brand by using collaborations, workshops, Facebook Live and even your own platforms. Back in Episode 19, we went into depth about How to Build Your Community Using Joint Venture Partnerships. We recommend that you listen to that episode as a companion to this one Building Community Collaborations Lee Odden from TopRank Marketing often works with trade shows and associations to create ebooks for download before a conference. He collaborates with tradeshow attendees who download the ebooks and share it with their companies and friends. He also creates lists every year, starting with the list 25 Women That Rock Social Media. Every year, he asks those featured for their recommendations for the next list. He has done this very successfully for a number of years. The #SocialROI Chat Madalyn hosts each week is presented by ManageFlitter. They've created an ebook based on the Twitter Chat. They collaborated with 25 social media and digital marketing experts to cover 25 topics. Using Webinars to Activate an Influencer's Community Work with an influencer to create a content-rich webinar for a win-win. This works well for affiliate partnerships. For Madalyn's Video Like A Rockstar mastermind program she is doing webinars to promote it. A great way to do this is to connect with influencers and invite them to be a guest on your webinar. You can also have them as an affiliate too. Using Facebook Live to Build Community Kami uses this every month for Social Media Breakfast and it builds a community beyond the live event. Facebook Live allows more people to attend online than at the live event. Madalyn hosts Facebook Live sessions after her TwitterSmarter Chat and Social ROI every week. It's a great way of opening it up to a wider audience and bringing communities together. Social Media Examiner does a weekly talk show through lilive streamThrough the talk show and podcasts, they highlight thought leaders and guests who usually become speakers for their annual conference, SMMW. They provide speakers with a link for the conference to track who they bring along. Inviting Influencers to Appear On Your Platform Invite people that have communities that match your potential customers to appear on your podcast or YouTube channel and they might share it with their audience as well. Plus, you get some social proof from it as well. Here’s are a few of the people who have appeared on the Communities That Convert podcast: Kirsten Oliphant, Create IF Writing, Creative Collaborations How to Form Lasting and Lucrative Partnerships  Elisa Camahort Page, How I Built That and BlogHer, Inside the Career of a Master Online Community Builder Mikael Yang, ManyChat, Build a Facebook Messenger Bot with ManyChat  Tim Fargo, Social Jukebox How to Promote Your Evergreen Content Sunny Lenarduzzi, YouTube Expert, How to Build a Converting Community on YouTube Sue B Zimmerman, Instagram expert, How to Build a Converting Community on Instagram Gini Dietrich, Spin Sucks,  How to Build a Converting Community Using Content Dorie Clark, Speaker, Author, and Marketing Consultant, Leveraging Community to Build Income Streams Adel de Meyer, Twitter Expert, How to Build a Converting Community on Twitter Zach Spuckler, Heart Soul and Hustle and Marketing Expert, How to Build a Converting Community on Facebook Tools, apps and links mentioned: Episode 19 Lee Odden's List “25 Women That Rock Social Media” #SocialROI Book Social Media Examiner's Talk Show Madalyn’s link to Social Media Marketing World Get a custom short domain like my Sklar.ly Past Communities that Convert Interviews Take Action Make a dream list of ten people who you would love to collaborate with. Of these people, five should be at or about your level and five should be above your level. Come visit us in the Facebook group and share your list with us. How to reach Kami: If you’d like to learn more about Kami Huyse, visit her website at www.zoeticamedia.com. You can contact her by email at kami@zoeticamedia.com or tweet to @kamichat. How to reach Madalyn: If you’d like to learn more about Madalyn Sklar, visit her website at www.madalynsklar.com. You can contact her by email at madalyn@madalynsklar.com or tweet to @MadalynSklar. Join Our Community We have a new community on Facebook. We will extend the conversation from each episode and deliver bonus content. Sign up for our email list at http://bit.ly/CTCVIP to get an invitation to join or go directly to our Facebook (shhh. The codeword is ACTION)!

We cover the latest Facebook changes that will impact your business. There are some big changes happening on Facebook right now, so you know how, when and if they will affect you. What happened with Facebook January 11th and what has been the fallout? Mark Zuckerberg made a big announcement that has since changed the way that posts are shared with your friends and family. With the change in the algorithm, came some revealing issues that have Facebook in some trouble. Data has been misused by third-party applications like Cambridge Analytica, and Mark Zuckerberg had to answer to Congress about how that information was shared. The privacy settings on Facebook were overhauled to make them easier to use so you can now see all of your privacy settings in one place. Click here to review your privacy settings on Facebook. How does this change at Facebook impact you? Outside of Facebook, you may experience less functionality to engage with friends in third-party apps. Facebook ads will still be available and unchanged. Other non-US countries may move more quickly to protect privacy. GDPR is a new standard in the UK where certain rules apply to recipients in the UK. For more information, read Kirsten Oliphant’s great post about this and listen to the Podcast, see the link below. Facebook is shifting to a focus on groups, community building and authentic connections. They’re pushing for tighter connections and an extra layer of relationship beyond sales. The more you build relationships, the better you’ll perform in any social media channel “At its best, Facebook has always been about personal connections. By focusing on bringing people closer together — whether it’s with family and friends, or around important moments in the world — we can help make sure that Facebook is time well spent.” – Mark Zuckerberg What are authentic connections on Facebook? If friends join communities together, they will get notifications when their friends post in the group. Asking questions on Facebook is currently driving engagement, but currently, adding links lowers the effectiveness of the post. It is important to make sure the people in your groups understand that they are an essential part of the group. Live streaming video drives engagement right now, especially when there is a lot of engagement such as comments, likes, and shares. Non-salesy educational Facebook Ads or ads against already well-performing content will be served more often and better. Look at your well-performing content and run an ad against it. What are inauthentic connections on Facebook? Apps using your friends’ data to sell them stuff Anything that requires an O-Auth with Facebook Spammy or Sales Groups: Hate Groups, Low Quality, and Spammy Groups, Pay to Join Groups. If you have a group as an add-on, make sure you have your course materials set up somewhere else like Thinkific or Kajabi, even if your community isn’t leaving Facebook to get the material. Using Facebook Messenger in a spammy manner Using Facebook Ads in a spammy way Product and service sales groups What is coming up in the near future on Facebook? Rumors of a fee structure or ad cost for business groups. Facebook will continue to be under pressure to clean up their act as it pertains to privacy and data. Facebook will be making any changes needed to avoid regulation, so keep an eye on your account and in the Communities That Convert Facebook community for changes. Tools, Resources, Apps, and Links Mentioned: Facebook Privacy Basics Page See where on Facebook you have been tagged Facebook Announcement What Facebook Says It Is Doing to Protect You GDPR FAQS. Kristen Oliphant Tips for GDPR Compliance and Why Data Matters BeLive Facebook Is Shutting Down Its API For Giving Your Friends’ Data To Apps  Thinkific Disqus Kajabi ManyChat  Messenger Limitations for Chatbot Developers Facebook is Not Allowing New Chatbots on It’s Platform Announcement: The Messenger Bot Pause is Over Take Action Share with us in our Facebook community what is working and what isn’t working in your Facebook marketing right now. Have you noticed a difference? How to reach Kami: If you’d like to learn more about Kami Huyse, visit her website at www.zoeticamedia.com. You can contact her by email at kami@zoeticamedia.com or tweet to @kamichat. How to reach Madalyn: If you’d like to learn more about Madalyn Sklar, visit her website at www.madalynsklar.com. You can contact her by email at madalyn@madalynsklar.com or tweet to @MadalynSklar. Join Our Community We have a new community on Facebook. We will extend the conversation from each episode and deliver bonus content. Sign up for our email list at http://bit.ly/CTCVIP to get an invitation to join or go here. (shhh. The codeword is ACTION)!

Welcome to episode 005 of the Blogger Genius Podcast. My guest today is Kirsten Oliphant from the blog, Create If Writing. Kirsten started her first blog in 2007, and has seen her blog, business, and the Internet change so much ever since. In this episode we discuss why adaptability is the key to blogging, and also the importance of understanding "why you're blogging." Resources: Create If Writing blog Create If Writing podcast Creative Collaborations book Own Your List Email Course Create If Writing Facebook group MediaVine ConvertKit MiloTree Subscribe to The Blogger Genius Podcast: iTunes Google Play Stitcher Transcript - Why Adaptability Is The Key To Blogging Jillian: [00:00:09] Hello and welcome. I am so excited to be talking with Kirsten Oliphant from Create If Writing. That's Create If Writing, That's  I - F. She is a writer, a blogger, and a podcaster, and a friend. So welcome to the show. Kirsten: [00:00:30] Thank you so much. I'm so excited to be. I'm so excited you're having a show here. Jillian: [00:00:38] And thank you for being here and for being such a good friend. To be honest, behind the scenes we are really good friends. So absolutely. I want to talk about your blog and I want to start with how did you start, because you've got a lot of titles. Writer, blogger, podcaster. So what inspired you? Starting a blog Kirsten: [00:01:00] Well, I think I sort of have a similar story to a lot of people who started blogging in 2007. And in that, you know, pre 2010, I feel like is a really different world in blogging. Kirsten: [00:01:11] I thought I didn't understand blogs. I didn't really get them. I had a friend who had one, and they seemed like, why would anyone write a blog? It's like a diary online and who wants to read that? Kirsten: [00:01:23] So I kind of thought they were really silly, but then I was living in Texas, and got pregnant with my first child, and my whole family and most of my good friends were in Virginia. Kirsten: [00:01:32] So we were doing a home birth, which everybody thought was completely insane. Ended up not having a home birth. But we were planning a homebirth, so I thought I would start a blog where people could just kind of see, you know, the baby bump pictures, as we go because they weren't seeing me in person, and also I could talk about this home birth thing, because not everybody wanted to talk about it. Kirsten: [00:01:52] I knew they all thought I was nuts because the first friend I had that had a home birth, I wanted to call the authorities. It just is like a weird thing if you don't know... Like now it's so much more known. Birth choice is more of a conversation. And so that's how it started. Kirsten: [00:02:10] And it's interesting, I have all these titles and they were really separate to me back then. It took me four or five years before I realized that blogging was writing, and I know that sounds really silly and I knew it in a way that it was because it was such a good outlet for me. Kirsten: [00:02:27] I have my master's degree in fiction, so that's kind of my background. Like I majored in English and wrote stories and I was a terrible poet. Sometimes I wrote poetry and songs, like I did that in college, but mostly it was short stories and novels. Blogging as an outlet Kirsten: [00:02:40] But having kids also just de-railed that whole thing because it's just too hard for me personally to write fiction with kids. And so while blogging was like a really good outlet, I didn't think of it as writing for a long time. And then one day it kind of hit me. Kirsten: [00:02:57] Hey if this book gets published I'm working on, or any of these books, and people come back to this blog are they going to be confused? And the answer was yes. Kirsten: [00:03:06] I would just write. It was very very personal, very very intimate, very very like post a million times a day, post about what we're eating. And I did amass a following, and it was easier to do that back then because blogs weren't everywhere, and nobody was sharing on social media. People just somehow found you. Which I don't understand how that worked, but it did. Kirsten: [00:03:29] And I am a good writer just on my own, like if I'm not trying too hard, like I still have those skills, right. But there was no intentionality to it. Kirsten: [00:03:37] And I also felt like it was so different than what I was writing, that I realized those things were just too far apart. They needed to be closer together so that's kind of I think when the shift took place, and then I kind of got derailed a little bit where I realized people were making money blogging, like with sponsored posts and stuff, and I was a mom and mommy bloggers, that's a thing, so for a while I was doing a lot of sponsored posts. Kirsten: [00:04:01] And then I think I had that realization again, like hey, like ultimately even though right now I'm not publishing novels, I'm a writer. Like do I really want posts about you know, pepperoni on my site, or diapers, or car insurance, or these things that I'm getting paid for just to have some extra money every month. Kirsten: [00:04:19] You know and I decided no. Mostly I don't. I take very very few sponsored posts now. I've had a lot of shifts over time and I feel like anyone who's been blogging along time has had those same shifts, and they may be different than my shifts. Kirsten: [00:04:35] But like right it's organic, it's changing. And I think the blogging landscape has changed so much. Jillian: [00:04:44] Yes definitely. Oh definitely definitely. Your blog is your spoke and everything else is like a spoke off of that. Kirsten: [00:04:54] Yeah and a lot of the blogging I did back then I would post several times a day, and that wasn't super uncommon. Kirsten: [00:04:59] I mean I kind of cut my teeth on gossip blogs, like I would read those and they post every five seconds, but that's because like Brad Pitt was always out to dinner, and so you keep posting pictures of him. I didn't think about the fact that like that's not like we don't need that, or real life, but now we all do that on Facebook right here, on Twitter and Instagram Stories. Creating a second blog Kirsten: [00:05:18] And then when I started Create If Writing, which is my second blog, it was because every year I did like this yearly survey and I would ask people like, OK I talk about food, I talk about parenting, sometimes talk about faith. I was playing roller derby so I talked about that. And then I talk about writing and blogging. Like what do you not want to hear? What do you want to hear? Kirsten: [00:05:36] And. Every time. Hands down people didn't want to read about writing and blogging. And I was super frustrated because I was like, you guys, how can you want to hear about everything but this? Kirsten: [00:05:47] But my audience was not people doing what I was doing. So they didn't care about writing or blogging and so I went ahead and started a new site, because I really I had an interest in it, and I had a lot of blogger connections with people who were blogging. They just weren't necessarily coming daily. Kirsten: [00:06:05] Like my main readers were not bloggers, they were not writers yet. So I started the separate site and there's some crossover but not very much. Becoming a blogging expert Jillian: [00:06:13] OK so then you've become like this authority, this expert on blogging, and monetizing and all of that, like helping other bloggers. Blogging seems like such a limiting term. Helping people figure out how to create a living online, like a satisfying life online. You teach people. Really you're a teacher, this is how I think about you. Kirsten: [00:06:49] Yeah. Which I love. Thank you. Well I could go to a really specific kind of moment and time for that. I mean I talked a little bit about writing and blogging on my blog, like I said that was one of my categories but it wasn't a big one. Kirsten: [00:07:08] I self-published my first book on Amazon when I realized that was a thing. And I wrote about how you did that, which was yet early early in the days when you could do that. And I learned from somebody else who had done the same thing. So it was mostly learn as I go. Kirsten: [00:07:26] But I was always in the room with people who were smarter than me, or more experienced in the blogging world, because I blogged in a vacuum. Kirsten: [00:07:34] For years I did not ever talk to other bloggers about blogging tips and when I went to my first blogging conference, which was Blog Elevated here in Houston, and I think 2013, and I met other bloggers, I realized how much I didn't know. I was always the person who felt like I was the small one in the room. So I went to a writer's conference in the beginning of 2015. I LOVED IT SO MUCH I started going to all these blogging conferences and social media things. Kirsten: [00:08:02] So I went to this writer's conference, and all of a sudden, I was the expert. I just went to the conference, and it was not like I'm going to go make a name for myself as a whatever. Kirsten: [00:08:16] It just happened that they had somebody speak on Pinterest and she was like really smart. But people, writers especially writers, hate the self-promotion stuff. They hate social media. Kirsten: [00:08:30] They don't like platforms, they just want to write stuff and have people read it, which you know the only way that works these days is that you have to get out there and market. And so I remember there were literally people groaning in the audience, as this woman was talking, and she showed us a slide of a spreadsheet that she had, that was color coded, and how and when she shared pins and literally there was like this like... Kirsten: [00:08:57] There is the girl next to me and she said I'm leaving. And she put her pen down and she left. So this was where I was and I would have conversations with people and they would say something, and I would be like oh... Then it was like people would gather around. It was very weird and all of a sudden I realized I had been thinking of myself as somebody who didn't know anything. And I realized I actually know a ton of stuff that I just picked up along the way right. Kirsten: [00:09:24] It's old hat to me because I was always with bloggers and not with people who speak this language, and I am a teacher. I mean I went through most of the Education Department in college. I dropped out because the only thing they would do is collaborative learning and it was one of those things where you're in the group and you're the only one who does the work. Literally that happened to me every time. And I was like I will not do this anymore. Kirsten: [00:09:51] But I love teaching I've always loved teaching and so I hadn't thought I could do it in this space. I always sort of felt limited and kind of fake. Are we a phony you know? Like that whole not feeling like an expert kind of thing, but it took me having people ask me. Kirsten: [00:10:12] And then after the conference people started following up with me, like can you help me? And so that was actually right before I got a new phone that had the podcast app. Like right there on it. Starting a podcast Kirsten: [00:10:25] And I did not know what podcasts were. I mean I heard of them but I was like I don't know where they live. Like how do you listen to them, which are really common questions people ask. Yes. And I push the button on the app and I started just listening to podcasts. And two weeks later I started my podcast. Kirsten: [00:10:42] And so I just I love the medium and I feel that was a perfect place for me to sort of start doing more of this teaching on this specific topic. And I had a lot to say. Jillian: [00:10:56] Yes. Well again the reason why I'm doing this podcast is because of you. I was inspired by you. So let's go back to your blog or your business. Now since you're not doing sponsored posts for car insurance, how do you monetize? How do you make money at what you do? Kirsten: [00:11:18] Well that was a big shift and kind of a slow one it took me stepping back from any income I was making because I did stop the sponsored posts. I did keep ads up so I have the two sites I have kirstenolipant.com, which is kind of the lifestyle blog and kind of my central hub. And I do have ads on that site, because it gets a good enough traffic to have them pay. Kirsten: [00:11:40] And so that's just like a little bit of money every month and I work with MediaVine who I highly recommend for anyone looking. They are just the best people to work with. Creating multiple income streams as a blogger Kirsten: [00:11:53] What's become interesting to me is I've tried a lot of things, like I want to see what works, and I see what other people are doing. And I just try things. I've had the luxury of that because I'm not the primary person putting the food on the table right. Kirsten: [00:12:05] I didn't have a big budget in the beginning, especially to throw into things, but I was like I can just try stuff and if this doesn't work, then we'll try something else, or we'll adapt it. So I've been able to actually build a much bigger income, like more than double with less than half of the pageviews. And I think that was the thing that really made me like, whoa. Kirsten: [00:12:35] So I have a mix of revenue streams. I have courses. I have books that I sell both on Amazon and also directly on my site with Gum Road and different integrations. Kirsten: [00:12:51] I have affiliate sales which actually have become the biggest piece consistently. It's always up and down like if I have a course launch then that month might be courses, but affiliate sales have become stable, which is interesting again with very low pageviews, very low like under 10,000 pages. Kirsten: [00:13:15] And what else? I do some coaching. I don't do a lot because one on one is so intensive that I you kind of just have to charge this big price and so I take two clients. Kirsten: [00:13:27] And yet I don't have them every month but that's fine because when I'm working with one, it's exhausting to me. It's great but it's for me mentally hardest Like if I could just make all my money creating courses. Yes. Kirsten: [00:13:39] Because I like teaching but like the one on one stuff can be really just so draining. Jillian: [00:13:43] So it looks like you have a variety of income streams, but they're all related. Kirsten: [00:13:52] Yes so they all kind of fall under like a similar umbrella. I teach people. I do a lot of teaching. I would kind of put it under the heading I guess of like platform building, so helping writers and bloggers kind of build e-mail lists is what I'm super passionate about. Kirsten: [00:14:09] So I have my main course like kind of my signature course is called "Own Your List," and it's all about e-mail. How to Make Money With the list you love. Jillian: [00:14:17] OK. Got it. Kirsten: [00:14:19] And then my biggest affiliate commission every month is from ConvertKit, who's an email service provider. Kirsten: [00:14:24] And you know, a lot of people getting started with affiliate sales only hear about Amazon. But the reality is there are so many other programs and to put a word out there about ConvertKit and why their affiliate program so amazing, is it's a recurring. Right. Right. So I make 30 percent of what people under me are paying every month. That versus the two percent or something you get from Amazon. It just doesn't even compare. Jillian: [00:14:55] What I like about what you're saying though is that I know a bunch of bloggers who are kind of grasping at all these different things, and they are they're splitting their focus in so many ways. They're always trying something new. I'm going to put Amazon affiliate links on my site, then I'm going to make a course, but I don't yet know what my course is going to be about. What I love about what you're doing, is this all it's all coming from the same core. Kirsten: [00:15:29] Yes. So definitely they all relate to each other. Jillian: [00:15:33] How do people then find you? Like where are people discovering you and how are you putting yourself out there so they find you? How to get found on the Internet as a blogger Kirsten: [00:15:43] Yeah I feel like there has been a lot more interesting with Create If Writing because again, I don't have a ton of pageviews so people are not finding me necessarily through the blog first. It's harder to track. I will say that. So with kirstenoliphant.com, I know I can look at analytics. I can tell where people are coming from because they're finding me through my site and they're finding me through Pinterest or Facebook with creative writing. Kirsten: [00:16:19] I did some guest posting for a woman named Jane Freeman who's really influential in the writing community. And so every now and then, even today someone join my facebook group, and I have those questions like: How did you hear about this? Because I started getting really interested in that question. I'm like where are people coming from? And that person came from Jane's blog, even though that was like forever ago. Kirsten: [00:16:44] Interesting right. She's an authority and it's perfectly aligned, so that makes sense. Kirsten: [00:16:51] Yes. And so I've had guest posts that were kind of a waste of time, like no traffic. I get new people. Yeah. You kind of have to really vet those places if you're going to take your time. So there's that. People do find the podcast on iTunes. Kirsten: [00:17:03] I've started doing more interviews and other people's podcasts because that way you're not having to convert a blog reader to become a podcast listener. You're already getting people who are podcast listeners who can come and listen to your podcast. Kirsten: [00:17:16] My Facebook group it's still not huge. I don't want it to be huge. It's just getting close to 5,300 people. But it has writing in the title because it's Create If Writing. Kirsten: [00:17:28] People search "writing" and now Facebook is suggesting it to them. It's kind of interesting because it's like you have all these funnels now because it's like people are coming to this group. They don't even know who I am at all. They do not know i have a podcast. Kirsten: [00:17:42] Unlike e-mail where you have a welcome series with a Facebook group, I realize I have to be much more intentional. I have be much more present because otherwise people just think it's like this random group of writers, and I'm like, no this is a group formed by one person. So people have found me there. Kirsten: [00:18:05] I'm in a lot of Facebook groups and they have promo days, which I think can be really over-used. But at the same time, I've started studying those threads, looking at what ones have all the comments. Which ones have the likes, and then trying to choose which of my posts I can put in that day and also how to frame it, because most people just drop a link and no one ever clicks on it. But if you are explaining it and talking in a winsome way, people will find you. Kirsten: [00:18:37] I've started speaking more at events like conferences, virtual summits. I hosted a virtual summit in 2016 and 2017. That's the Profitable Blogging Summit. And other people that we had speak, brought their audiences so people found me through the summit. Kirsten: [00:19:06] So I'm just in a lot of different places. And so even though people are not coming first through my site, and that's one of the big things I'm working on, is getting my SEO working because I feel like something was actually broken. I know how to do SEO and Google is not telling anyone about my site, so I had to hire someone to come in. Jillian: [00:19:30] The one thing I so admire about you is how much content you create. And again it's all about teaching. It's all about trying to show people the path you've walked and helping them find success on those paths. So how many hours a week are you working on both of your blogs and your podcast? Blogging schedule Kirsten: [00:20:02] Not as many as you'd think. Or as I would like, probably. So we have five kids and the oldest is nine. The youngest is nine months, so we're like in the throes of toddlers at home, like up to my neck with little ones Kirsten: [00:20:21] And so and I don't have the kind of kids -- like you hear about people who homeschool and blog. That is not my how my house is loud and insane. And there's always someone fighting with someone or doing something wrong. So it's just crazy. So I try but I don't really work when the kids are around. Which means that I work at night right now and I'm often so tired that's not even the best working time. Kirsten: [00:20:47] I'll try to add it up. It fluctuates but I joined the YMCA just to get two hours of childcare every day. So genius! It turns out that someone in a Facebook group said they did that and I was like yes, because it's $75 or something a month for all my kids. Kirsten: [00:21:07] And that's like two babysitting times if you're paying a babysitter, so I go for two hours not every day of the week but five days usually. So there's at least 10 hours, or I'm at the Y working and then at night sometimes, depending if my husband and I are not hanging out. You know sometimes I'll do like two hours of work but not every night because sometimes again, I'm just like you give me wine and give me Netflix and I can't. I can't. Kirsten: [00:21:33] My kids, there are two of them in preschool. Two are in regular school like elementary. Two are in preschool two days a week and then the baby is not anywhere. I wish it were 30 hours. I love what I do. I would work. I'd be a crazy workaholic if I could, but I am probably working like 15-20 hours. Jillian: [00:22:13] Wow. Because I think you are just so. Prolific. I love that you set your mind something and you do it and that you exude passion in everything you do. It comes through. Jillian: [00:22:34] And you inspire others like me to start a podcast. If you were to think about, when you first started. What do you wish you could have told yourself then that you know now. Kirsten: [00:22:56] Two things. One is more like a tiny technical thing and then one is like a bigger picture thing. Advice: Start your blog on WordPress.org, not Wordpress.com Kirsten: [00:23:02] So the tiny technical thing first is that I wish someone had told me when you start a WordPress blog, start on WordPress.org not WordPress.com. Kirsten: [00:23:10] First of all I used to be a Wordpress or I was a Blogger first. That was a mess to move. So I started on Wordpress.org. But to go into your settings so that your post titles do not have dates. That is like the dumbest thing but it's so important like it really does matter for SEO.You can pay someone to go retroactively do it, but when you've been blogging forever, it's a lot of redirects. And I'm just not willing to do it. Kirsten: [00:24:02] And then the more big picture thing is... I think you need to be connected and I think people do this better now than they used to. Maybe we're too connected. And so I kind of want to qualify that a little bit. Advice: Connect with other bloggers Kirsten: [00:24:15] I blogged in a vacuum like I mentioned. I did not talk to other bloggers except for like we left comments for each other. But we didn't share like hey what are you learning? Hey what's your latest tip? Kirsten: [00:24:26] Once I started doing that and once I went to my first conference and I came out and like eight of us started a little Facebook group and we would share each other's post. We would talk about things we learned. And that's when I started growing. When I started connecting with other bloggers. Kirsten: [00:24:40] But I will say now we're so connected that there are all these gamey things like Instagram pods, which can be good I'm sure. But for the most part it's creating an inauthentic engagement where every time somebody posts, you have to go like it or comment or whatever. Kirsten: [00:25:02] Brands have figured out about this and are getting frustrated with influencers who do this. So I think you have to find the kind of collaborations that work for you and I actually don't know that I told you that but I'm working on a book that's hopefully coming out at the end of September. Kirsten: [00:25:21] The hurricane here in Houston kind of put off a lot of things. And our house did not flood. It just affected like when my books are coming out. But the book is all about creative collaboration and ways to partner with people that are good for both of you. You know not just using somebody to get ahead. Kirsten: [00:25:39] Yes some people do. Yes. Yes. Kirsten: [00:25:42] But that kind of move you forward and I think that's the biggest thing. Like talking to you inspires me. There's something about the energy of talking to other people, working with other people, and learning from other people, that you will move forward so much more quickly if you can do that. Jillian: [00:25:59] Yes and I would say that for me I went to my first Bloggy Bootcamp conference I don't know how many years ago. And I just took copious notes and I was like oh my god, I didn't know this. And I didn't know this. It just took me to a whole new level. And then I would say that there is something about going to blogging conferences and meeting people and just the exchange of ideas, and also connecting with people in real life who you might have been a fan of online or maybe even in e-mails. But all of a sudden you see them and you talk to them, and you will be friends for life. And I feel like that has elevated me so much that I completely agree with what you've said. Jillian: [00:26:54] But I do also agree that today there can be so much information that you can spend your whole life in Facebook groups and still feel like you're not doing it right. And who knows where some of this information is coming from that people are saying is true. They know the truth about the Facebook algorithm. So there's also a part of me where I have to step back and go wait a second. Jillian: [00:27:20] OK I hear what they're saying. I know I could get lost in this forever, and I'm just going to have to listen to myself and my own gut. Kirsten: [00:27:29] Absolutely. And there are so many people giving out bad advice. The Facebook group so many don't know who to trust. Kirsten: [00:27:46] Parenting in this age is the same way. There's like this overload of information. My mom and I were talking about breastfeeding. She was saying that there was no one around back when I was born in 1977. We can all rewind and figure out my age. Kirsten: [00:28:03] But she said no when there was no support like breastfeeding was hard and it didn't work and so she switched straight away but like when I was struggling with my first child and like why isn't this working? I don't understand. Like shouldn't this be natural and just work. Kirsten: [00:28:18] And it's really hard. But I had the lactation consultant and I had friends who'd been there and there were a Facebook group and she was like you know we didn't have this support. The flipside is that we have too much information. If I had posted that little anecdote on Facebook, I'd have 18 people telling me what I did wrong, and what my mom did wrong. Jillian: [00:28:39] Yes. That is so true. When I had my daughter I too had difficulty breastfeeding and I found a breastfeeding support group and had it not been for the breastfeeding support group, I would have quit, because but every week I could go and it was kind of calm you know. It was just a bunch of women nursing their babies and asking the same questions over and over again. Jillian: [00:29:01] But because I had that support I was able to continue. But I agree with you that there is also the flipside of this which is there's just too much. Sometimes you have to trust your own gut. Jillian: [00:29:13] So in terms of what you're most excited about right now, would say it's your new book coming out? Kirsten: [00:29:22] I am and one of the reasons I think I probably am prolific in creating all this stuff is because I get excited about new things. I'm a bad finisher. I'm a really good starter. Kirsten: [00:29:34] So I have a lot of things that are started, no one will ever see, that you'd be shocked by. There are so many of them but I really am excited about what I'm working on at any given moment. So I'm really excited about my book. Writing a book on "collaboration" Kirsten: [00:29:48] And it was fun because I decided, because it was about collaboration, that I not only wanted to talk about kind of the attitude to go into them with, because I get pitches all the time and they're all terrible. Kirsten: [00:30:08] And so I talk about how to pitch something. Here's how to do it well. But the second half of the book is specific examples of collaboration. And I got different people who collaborate in specific ways to send me things. Kirsten: [00:30:26] I had somebody send me a paragraph or two on how it is to collaborate with another podcast co-host and somebody else that does box sets with other people, and works to get on the USA Today bestseller list. Kirsten: [00:30:40] And someone who's a YouTube or talked about YouTube collabs and what that was like. So it was fun because I collaborated on the collaboration of the book. Kirsten: [00:30:55] Only thing is that I want to get something from Vanilla Ice because I feel like anyone from my generation, when you hear the word collaborate, there's like the whole like Stop Collaborate and Listen from Vanilla Ice. Kirsten: [00:31:06] Yeah I don't think that's probably going to happen. But I have a few weeks to make it happen. So we'll see Jillian. Jillian: [00:31:14] So do you have any kind of parting advice for our audience of bloggers? Jillian: [00:31:19] Maybe people just starting out, people who've been at it for a while. But given that blogging can be you in your own little bubble. Like what would you want to say to somebody to keep them on a path. Kirsten: [00:31:33] Yeah yeah. I think one of the most important things, and this is the thing that I always kept coming back to, and I was like having those a ha moments. It's like oh no one would want to believe that this was my blog. As a writer. Advice: Love what you do and think about your "why" Kirsten: [00:31:45] I feel like you have to stick with what you're passionate about with a couple of caveats. But I think that passion will carry you through. So like I'm I always love what I'm doing, and it makes it easy. It does not feel like work. Kirsten: [00:31:59] In fact I have to tear myself away because I enjoy it so much most of the time. I need a break every now and then I burnout like everybody else. But I really love it. So that will carry through. But I hear people say all the time like do your passion and the money will follow. And I just feel like that's such a lovely statement. That may not be true. Like it's just you know we can't possibly all make livings off of what we're passionate about. Kirsten: [00:32:26] So I think you have to think about your "why" as well, because I do have friends who are blogging to put food on the table. And that looks different. Kirsten: [00:32:34] And right now we're in a season where my husband is changing his job and our life is a little bit more uncertain in terms of our financials. And so I've set up some different kinds of funnels and used things like tripwires in my email because the things that I hadn't done before have not been because I was against them but because I didn't need to, whereas now I'm like OK. I need to come up with an extra $4000 this month and next month and the month after. Kirsten: [00:32:58] How am I going to do that? Yeah where can I plug that in. So I'm still trying to put it under my passion. But I think your "why" is really going to impact what that looks like for you. So in an ideal world we would all be passionate and make money. Jillian: [00:33:13] I think that you have to be intentional about making money. It doesn't just fall from the sky. Kirsten: [00:33:21] Yes. The people that are like oh just create the content and it will come. Jillian: [00:33:24] No it doesn't work like that. You have to be strategic. Again it can fall within what you're passionate about but you need to say this I'm doing to make money. Jillian: [00:33:37] How can people connect with you. How can people find all your resources and see what a wonderful teacher you are. Kirsten: [00:33:49] Yes well mostly createifwriting.com is where you can find all those things. We're going to spell it because it's Create If Writing dot com. Kirsten: [00:34:03] And that was because I think when I was starting, I'm really into creative writing, that's where my degree is in. I have a master's in that, but I'm also into all these things. Kirsten: [00:34:15] Other writers have these writing blogs or writing tips and that is not what my site is. It's all about getting your stuff in front of an audience. Like the platform side of things. Kirsten: [00:34:26] So it's kind of like if you're writing or if you're blogging or if you are podcasting or if you have some people in my audience who are like yoga instructors, and you want to get your email list working for you. Kirsten: [00:34:37] I have a Facebook group that you can find if you search Facebook is showing people where that is not just kind of cool but that's just create if writing dot com forward slash community. Kirsten: [00:34:51] And most of the places on social media I'm Kikimojo because I started social media so long ago, that I used my roller derby name and then I have too many followers to change it. Kirsten: [00:35:01] So if you look for Kikimojo, that's me on Pinterest and Twitter and just most places that's where you'll find me. Jillian: [00:35:09] Oh this is such a pleasure. Thank you so much. Kirsten: [00:35:13] Well thank you for having me on. Kirsten: [00:35:14] It was great to have a conversation with you and I'm so excited that you started a podcast. Jillian: [00:35:18] Ah. All because of you. Info on MiloTree If you're trying to grow your social media followers on Instagram Facebook YouTube and Pinterest plus trying to grow your email list. Definitely check out MiloTree. It is the smart pop up. You add to your blog or your site and it asks your visitors to follow you on social media or subscribe to your list. Just a couple of things. It's super easy to add to your site We offer a WordPress plugin or a simple line of code It's Google friendly on mobile so you don't have to worry about showing popups on mobile It's lightning fast it won't slow your site down You can grow multiple platforms at once Sign up for MiloTree now and get your first 30 DAYS FREE!

Today's episode is interview #12 in the Nitty Gritty Blogger Interview series and it's my own interview!! Take a listen as I chat about my own Boss Girl journey with guest co-host Kirsten Oliphant!! BGC ANNOUNCEMENTS * Welcome to the 133rd episode of the Boss Girl Creative Podcast!! Today's episode is Interview #12 in the Nitty Gritty Blogger Interview Series and it's my own interview with Guest Host, Kirsten Oliphant. * Have comments or questions? Tweet/IG using the hashtag #BOSSGIRLQA or call in: (707) BOSS-GIRL * Support Boss Girl Creative endeavors by joining the BGC Crew! * Join me in the Facebook Group on Wednesday nights at 9pm CST for a live Q&A answer session!! Send me your questions through email, phone or #BOSSGIRLQA on Twitter/Instagram * Want a direct link to the podcast feed? Click here. * Use these Hashtags on Social Media: #bossgirlcreative #bossgirlchat **THIS EPISODE IS SPONSORED BY GUSTO. RECEIVE 3 MONTHS FREE AFTER YOU RUN YOUR FIRST PAYROLL!! HEAD TO GUSTO.COM/BOSSGIRL** INSIDE THIS EPISODE * Taylor's story * Blog/Social media posting schedule * The beginning of her blogging career * Beginning discoveries in blogging * First blogging hurdles * Pivotal moment in blogging * First investments in blogging * First thing to outsource * Staying organized * Metrics * Making money * Current challenges * Finding a tribe * Favorite social media platform * Must do tasks each week * Staying on top of blogging laws * Despised tasks + most loved tasks * Brainstorming process * strategies that didn't work * handing criticism * Future of blogging/social media * goals for the future * Inspirational Boss Girl * Currently working on * Funniest thing on this journey * Boss Girl Advice RESOURCES MENTIONED **Some links below contain affiliate links. Purchasing through them, at no further cost to you, help support Boss Girl Creative. Thank you for supporting the brands that support BGC!** * SEO eCourse!!! Unlocking Your SEO Potential * Boss Girl Creative Shop is back open with some cool new merchandise!! * Shout-out to Kirsten (aka Kiki) for being my guest host on the show for my interview! FIND TAYLOR ONLINE Blog - taylorbradford.com Instagram - @taybradfordblog Facebook - taybradfordblog Pinterest - lizmariegalvan Twitter - @taybradfordblog HELP SPREAD THE BOSS GIRL LOVE! It would be amazeballs if you shared Boss Girl Creative Podcast with your fellow Boss Girls on twitter. Click here to tweet some love! If you love this podcast, head on over to iTunes and kindly leave a rating, a review and subscribe! WAYS TO SUBSCRIBE TO THE BOSS GIRL CREATIVE PODCAST Click here to subscribe via iTunes Click here to subscribe via Boss Girl Creative Newsletter Click here to subscribe via Stitcher FEEDBACK + PROMOTION You can ask your questions and leave your comments by either calling (707) BOSS-GIRL, emailing hello@bossgirlcreative.com or go to the Boss Girl Creative Facebook group!

I love featuring fellow entrepreneurs in the authorship and publishing space on the podcast, and in this episode I have a special treat for you. I’m honored to feature an interview with Kirsten Oliphant, who is a true expert when it comes to writing, self-publishing, and all things communications. You probably already subscribe to her podcast, Create If Writing (and if you don’t, you should), where she gives her listeners lots of great tips for putting stellar books out into the world. In this interview, Kirsten and I talk about the writing process and what her process looks like, what she learned from the launch of her most recent book, Creative Collaborations, how she organized and threw a launch party, and more. She also shares some of her favorite tools for self-published and Kindle authors, which I think you’re going to want to run out and snag. Show notes: bloggertoauthor.com/40

Today we have Kirsten Oliphant on the podcast to talk about collaborations. She is an author and blogger. She has a Master of Fine Arts in Creative Writing and is the leader of the CreateIfWriting podcast, website and online community. She is the...

Today we have Kirsten Oliphant on the podcast to talk about collaborations. She is an author and blogger. She has a Master of Fine Arts in Creative Writing and is the leader of the CreateIfWriting podcast, website and online community. She is the author of 5 books, including her latest Creative Collaborations: How to Form Lasting and Lucrative Partnerships without Being Smarmy. Episode Highlights: Kirsten has built a number of online communities. The first community she built was before Facebook communities were prevalent. From a call out on Twitter, she started a support group of women writers to talk weekly about what they were writing and what their struggles were. Kirsten feels the Facebook Groups platform lends itself well to growing communities and moderates several groups. Kirsten’s two most active groups include CreateIfWriting and The Profitable Blogging Summit. She also maintains about 30 other private and pop-up communities. What are some of the top tips you have for building a strong community? Kirsten talks about the most important note, being present and active in the group as the leader and moderator. What is the ideal group size? For Kirsten, she likes to stay between 5,000 and 10,000 people to serve her audience and remain hands-on. Above those numbers, people don’t know each other, it’s difficult to maintain the quality of the group and it’s hard to keep spam under control. How do you approach selling to your community without being smarmy? You have to build a community in which you authentically engage and create value. Different income streams determine how you can sell to your group. Kirsten has products, coaching, courses, books, and affiliates. When doing large promotions, be mindful of scheduling. Be upfront and honest with your community about selling and promoting. Find your sales voice, plan and build a trust with your community. Have you collaborated with others to build your community? Kirsten discusses her different levels of collaboration in her communities. She emphasizes that there has to be value and trust in collaborative relationships to make it work because it’s a commitment. Keeping the lines of communication open, aligning your time and ensuring you have similar goals is also important for collaborative success. Links, Tools and Apps Mentioned: Profitable Blogging Summit Matt McCarrick, One Verse Devotional Podcast Paula Rollo Bryan Cohen, Author Create If Writing Website Book: Creative Collaborations: How to Form Lasting and Lucrative Partnerships without Being Smarmy Free Training Giveaway: Best Practices for Facebook Groups Call-To-Action: Your call-to-action for this episode is to get Kirsten’s book: Creative Collaborations: How to Form Lasting and Lucrative Partnerships without Being Smarmy. For a limited time, she has lowered the price to $0.99 on Amazon for our community! Also check out the free training Kirsten gave us. Tweet to us @madalynsklar and @kamichat or visit our Facebook page, Communities That Convert, and let us know what you think of Kirsten’s book. How to reach Kami: If you’d like to learn more about Kami Huyse, visit her website at www.zoeticamedia.com. You can contact her by email at kami@zoeticamedia.com or tweet to @kamichat. How to reach Madalyn: If you’d like to learn more about Madalyn Sklar, visit her website at www.madalynsklar.com. You can contact her by email at madalyn@madalynsklar.com or tweet to @MadalynSklar.

When I reached out to Kirsten to feature her on this Mompreneur Series, I joked with her that the title of her episode would be Five F*&#^@g Kids and a Business!  Now, obviously, I changed the title to be a bit more appropriate, but that’s pretty much what we’re discussing in this interview.  Kirsten Oliphant is the owner of Create If Writing, a podcast and business that provides education and resources to writers, bloggers and entrepreneurs who want to build their online following and make money through their writing.  During our conversation, Kirsten shares about how her business now looks very different than what it did when she had her first kid and ultimately how her business evolved because of her growing family.  She then gives incredible, practical advice - hacks on how to best manage your time so you’re the best mom and entrepreneur you can be!  From how to organize your schedule to local resources you can take advantage of!  And ultimately, we discuss finding your own place of peace in the ever-moving “mompreneur equation” we must all manage!  Kirsten is a wealth of information and gives great advice for how to do it all (and be okay with the fact that it’s all a mess too!).  She may have convinced me to go for five kids… ;) Check out more about Kirsten and her brilliance here: --> CreateIfWriting.com

Are you wondering what social media platforms are the best to put your effort into? Let's be honest, there's only so much time in the day and figuring out how to use every platform can be time consuming. So why not figure out what platform would bring the best return on investment.Kirsten Oliphant of CreativeIfWriting.com and the Creative If Writing Podcast brings her unique perspective as a published author and full time blogger to the craziness of social media. We are diving in deep into the social media platforms.Grab her Serious Simple Social Download HERE.Topics Discussed:Introduction of Kirsten Oliphant of CreativeIfWriting.com and KirstenOliphant.comCreative If Writing PodcastToughest part of a being a bloggerGreatest gift and how it affects our businesses and personal livesFavorite social media platformsUsing closed Facebook groups to grow your businessWhy certain platforms are not worth the effortSerious Simple Social DownloadSocial media platforms that do not work for specific nichesScheduling tools for social media platformsProjections for 2017Resources Mentioned:I make a portion of any sales made as an affiliate.Serious Simple Social DownloadPop up Facebook groups - Amy Porterfield Podcast #146 3 Types of Facebook GroupsBatdad on YouTubeCoscheduleTailwind for Pinterest & InstagramHootsuiteRecurpostRetweet ChoresProfitable Blogging SummitLinks:jennymelrose.com/podcast-11Click to view: show page on Awesound

Kirsten Oliphant is a writer with a Master's degree in fiction and has been blogging for ten years. In 2015 she launched the Create If Writing podcast for writers and bloggers who want to build an online platform...without being smarmy. She is an email marketing nerd and is the author of Email Lists Made Easy for Writers & Bloggers. She is a mom to four (soon to be five!) kids ages 8 and under and lives with her youth pastor husband just outside Houston. Click to view: show page on Awesound

Welcome to episode 80 of the Food Blogger Pro podcast. This week, Kirsten Oliphant interview Bjork about practicing 1%∞ through the different phases of business. As you may have heard, Bjork and Lindsay recently suffered a loss, which you can read a bit more about on Pinch of Yum. While Bjork takes some time off to grieve their loss and to celebrate Afton’s short life, we’re bringing in a couple interviews that Bjork did with other podcasters. This week’s podcaster is Kirsten Oliphant, author and podcaster at Create If Writing. She interviewed Bjork about a year and a half ago and they talked a lot about what it takes to run a business for the long haul. Bjork chalked a lot of this up to practicing 1%∞, a concept that he put a name to a long time ago and tries to practice every day. In this episode, Bjork discusses: How 1%infinity came about and what it means What the different “phases” of Pinch of Yum were How he and Lindsay applied 1% infinity to the different phases of Pinch of Yum and Food Blogger Pro Why perfecting small things can hinder progress How to determine which things deserve your 1% Why outsourcing everything isn’t always the best option What the reality is for running a membership site How priorities for business investment change over time   Resources: Get the resources for this podcast at createifwriting.com/061

In this episode you'll meet marketing nerd extraordinaire Kirsten Oliphant. She is a prolific blogger and enjoys helping authors learn more about effective email strategies and marketing books.  Show Notes: -Do authors need to have a blog? Kirsten weighs in. -Why authors need an email list. -What's the secret to a good email subject line? -What your life experiences can teach you about writing -Why you need to be a human in your marketing Show Links: Check out all Kirsten's online classes, blog and and subscribe to her email list here Listen to her podcast here Read Kirsten's lifestyle blog here Becca's Sticky Newsletters class coming up      

This week, Demian Farnworth sits down with Kirsten Oliphant to chat about introverts, what unique things introverts can bring to the table when there isn t anything really new, and what drives them crazy about the world we re in right now. In this 40-minute episode, Demian and Kirsten discuss: Finding and connecting with a new audience... Listen to episode

Hey there Word Nerds! Welcome back to DIY MFA Radio. Today I’m talking to Kirsten Oliphant, a writer with an MFA in fiction from University of North Carolina at Greensboro. She has been blogging for eight years and has a lifestyle blog focusing on food and parenting. This year she launched the Create If Writing blog and podcast, which provide inspiration and authentic platform building tools for writers and bloggers. She also shares interviews with bloggers, writers, social media experts, and publishing insiders.  Kirsten is the mastermind behind the Free Email Course, where she helps demystify email lists for writers and bloggers, along with her signature course (Own Your List) that helps people grow, monetize, and manage their lists.When she’s not busy taking the email list world by story, Kirsten lives in Houston, Texas with her husband and four kids. In this episode Kirsten and I discuss: Why an email list is your most important communication option in a world full of options. The personal touch of email versus other social media. 15 Step Intensive List Growth Checklist Finding the email tech that’s right for you. Do's and Don't's to help keep your subscribers happy and engaged once you have an email list. Plus, Kirsten’s #1 tip for writers. Resources: If you want to know more about Kirsten, you can follow her on Facebook, Pinterest, and Twitter or visit her website and join her email list! Email client options for you to consider when building your list (in alphabetical order): Aweber Convert Kit Mad Mimi Mailchimp Other awesome resources include The Persistence of Email Marketing for Book Publishers and the Creative Profitability Course. For more info and show notes: DIYMFA.com/078  

BGC ANNOUNCEMENTS * Welcome to the eleventh episode of the Boss Girl Creative Podcast!! Today I've got Kirsten Oliphant as my Guest Co-Host and we're talking about Collaborations. Have comments or questions? Tweet/IG using the hashtag #BOSSGIRLQA or call in: (707) BOSS-GIRL * Have you seen the BGC Intensive?? * Support Boss Girl Creative endeavors by joining the BGC Crew! * Join me on Periscope (@pnkheelspnktrk) on Wednesday nights at 9pm CST for a live Q&A answer session!! Send me your questions through email, phone or #BOSSGIRLQA on Twitter/Instagram * Want a direct link to the podcast feed? Click here. * Use these Hashtags on Social Media: #bossgirlcreative #bossgirlQA EPISODE AT A GLANCE * Beginning to Collaborate * Reasons to Collaborate * Expanding your Community * Expanding your Horizons * Expanding your Opportunities * Different Types of Collaborations * Building Community * Building Brand Awareness ($$) QUOTES BY TAYLOR "The main part [of a tribe] is to be able to bounce ideas back and forth you know sharing contacts and whatever else we need help with, we celebrate each other. It has been a great place as far as connecting and kind of really growing." Taylor Bradford "[My Book Club] it has kind of evolved over the years from trying to figure out what really works and like what's feasible because you know everybody's busy and trying to maintain an online book club, what I've experienced in person with books clubs is...what keeps the book clubs going is the in person events so trying to figure that out online has been an interesting ride for sure." Taylor Bradford "I think you would just set yourself up to fail if you didn't kind of have that sitting at the back of your brain that it's going to change, you know your idea once you first pitch it is one of the things on collaborations because you are able to test ideas and products and you know what's feasible, what works, what doesn't work I mean I think that's the nature of any kind of business regardless of collaboration, but it does allow you to see what works and truly what you're trying to do with a collaboration is grow...grow in some way and whether it be to grow your community or grow your brand. I mean you are going to grow. So whether it works or doesn't work it helps you figure out what direction to move or to go, in order to continue to grow." Taylor Bradford "It's expanding your community when you collaborate." Taylor Bradford "I want the value in the podcast and my listeners to take away something from everything I put out there so yeah, for sure I don't go into it thinking ‘yeah this is going to push me over the top!'" Taylor Bradford "When you collaborate with someone else, it kind of opens your eyes to see things differently because the person you are collaborating with may view you in a light that you didn't realize and, I am saying this in a positive way." Taylor Bradford "It almost, in a way, secretly reaffirms that you are on the right path that you are doing what you are supposed to be doing when someone does recognize that in you but you don't yet see it. That's a character builder for me is that I know I'm on that right path when someone approaches me and says, ‘I need to learn everything you know.'" Taylor Bradford "What I think bloggers have that no one else has is we have learned the power of our community. We have learned the power of our social media. And we know how to utilize those things to build our brand and build our market and build what we are saying is important to us. And that's the true power of collaborating...to be able to collaborate maybe with similar paths but you guys can both bring something different to the table." Taylor Bradford "Do you have time to collaborate with somebody? And do they have time to collaborate with you? Because you don't want to put all of your eggs in the basket and for them to put two. You know you want it to be a 50/50 thing so it benefits both of you, regardless of it's your idea." Taylor Bradford QUOTES BY KIRSTEN "I blogged in a vacuum, which is to say I did not talk to any other bloggers, I did not know what was going on and I wish now that I did because I just look back at those years and think how much better of a blogger I would be now had I been really learning or talking to other people or implementing things that I know how to implement now." Kirsten Oliphant "The more I hung around with other bloggers and kind of connected with some of those same bloggers at the Blog Elevated conference also, a whole set of new bloggers, I really just started to soak up information like a sponge and not just information. I joined a little tribe of people after the conference and we all had sort of different kind of blogs." Kirsten Oliphant "One of the biggest things to realize as you're doing [in collaborating] so is that they are going to evolve...sometimes you go into something with one sort of idea in mind of what is will be and then it changes and that's sort of necessary." Kirsten Oliphant "Sometimes people go into podcasting thinking they are going to blow up because they have big guests and they think the guests will share with their list...but I do know that some people share better than others. I'll say and I have heard from other podcasters that you know they interview people and it never gets shared." Kirsten Oliphant "Share without expecting things back." Kirsten Oliphant "When you start collaborating with other people and working with them I think you do start to see that value, and other people see the value, and I have started to see value in myself that I didn't know was there until someone was like, ‘you are so good at this!'" Kirsten Oliphant "I am always learning...I feel like I start to see things differently the more I talk to other people and experts in their fields." Kirsten Oliphant "From the conferences I've been to, I get so much value from connecting with other people and the things that come out of that." Kirsten Oliphant RESOURCES AND LINKS MENTIONED Blogger 2 Business Podcast Create If Podcast Blog Elevated Conference Living Well Spending Less: 12 Secrets of the Good Life by Ruth Soukup Podcast Movement Biz Women Rock! Word Press Blogger Twitter Twubs Pinterest SHOUT-OUTS *Links below may contain Affiliate Links. Purchasing through them help support Boss Girl Creative.* Angela Peters: www.hairsprayandhighheels.net #NoExcuses™ Fitness: www.pinkheelspinktruck.com/health-and-fitness Literary Junkies: www.pinkheelspinktruck.com/literary-junkies Ruth Soukup: www.livingwellspendingless.com Katie Krimitsos: bizwomenrock.com Anne Samoilov: www.fearlesslaunching.com FIND TAYLOR ONLINE Blog - pinkheelspinktruck.com Instagram - @pnkheelspnktrk Facebook - PinkHeelsPinkTruck Pinterest - pnkheelspnktrk Twitter - @pnkheelspnktrk FIND KIRSTEN ONLINE Blog - Kirsten Oliphant Instagram - @kikimojo Facebook - Kirsten S Oliphant Twitter - @kikimojo Pinterest - kikimojo Podcast - Create If Podcast HELP SPREAD THE BOSS GIRL LOVE! It would be amazeballs if you shared Boss Girl Creative Podcast with your fellow Boss Girls on twitter. Click here to tweet some love! If you love this podcast, head on over to iTunes and kindly leave a rating, a review and subscribe!