Podcast appearances and mentions of simon schuster

What if one of the most powerful medicines for longevity, resilience, happiness, cognitive health, and disease prevention wasn't found in a supplement, a prescription, or a cutting-edge biohack—but in the people around you? In this powerful solo episode, Darin Olien dives into one of the most overlooked health crises of our time: loneliness. Drawing from the landmark 85-year Harvard Adult Development Study, the U.S. Surgeon General's loneliness epidemic report, Blue Zones research, neuroscience, and evolutionary biology, Darin reveals why meaningful human connection may be one of the strongest predictors of health and longevity ever discovered. From oxytocin, cortisol, inflammation, vagal tone, and nervous system regulation to suburban design, social media, and the collapse of community structures, Darin exposes the hidden biological costs of isolation—and offers a practical roadmap for rebuilding the human connections we were biologically designed to need.     What You'll Learn The stunning findings from Harvard's 85-year Adult Development Study Why relationships outperform wealth, genetics, diet, and exercise as predictors of well-being How loneliness increases the risk of premature death, dementia, heart disease, and stroke Why social isolation creates measurable biological stress responses The role of oxytocin in lowering inflammation and regulating stress How human connection affects the autonomic nervous system Why Blue Zone communities consistently prioritize social connection The biological difference between digital interaction and real human presence How modern architecture and technology contribute to loneliness Why community is a biological necessity—not a luxury Practical ways to rebuild meaningful relationships today How connection may be one of the most powerful health interventions available   Chapters 00:00:00 – Welcome to SuperLife 00:00:33 – Sponsor: Bite Toothpaste and reducing plastic waste 00:02:49 – The most powerful health study ever conducted 00:03:01 – Harvard follows 724 people for 85 years 00:03:40 – The surprising predictor of a long, healthy life 00:04:00 – Why relationships beat wealth, genetics, diet, and exercise 00:04:42 – The Surgeon General's loneliness epidemic warning 00:05:19 – Introducing the medicine you're not taking 00:05:53 – The health benefits of genuine community 00:06:21 – The fatal convenience of modern life 00:06:47 – Replacing human connection with digital connection 00:07:12 – Why modern convenience may be creating isolation 00:07:23 – Social isolation and premature mortality 00:08:02 – Loneliness and the equivalent of smoking 15 cigarettes a day 00:08:43 – Increased risks of heart disease, stroke, and dementia 00:09:10 – Why loneliness is a biological threat 00:09:52 – The science behind social isolation 00:10:11 – Sponsor: Manna Vitality 00:12:06 – Humans as the most socially dependent species 00:12:53 – Why connection regulates the nervous system 00:13:29 – The autonomic nervous system and social safety 00:13:56 – The brain's constant question: Am I safe? 00:14:03 – The biology of belonging 00:14:24 – The ventral vagal state explained 00:14:55 – Why connection creates measurable physiological changes 00:15:03 – What happens when isolation becomes chronic 00:15:52 – Oxytocin: far more than the "love hormone" 00:16:20 – Eye contact, touch, meals, and human bonding 00:16:42 – How oxytocin lowers stress and inflammation 00:17:04 – Why no supplement can replace connection 00:17:17 – The pharmacology of authentic human moments 00:18:06 – Free medicine hidden in plain sight 00:18:39 – Dan Buettner and the Blue Zones 00:19:29 – What the world's longest-lived populations have in common 00:19:36 – Okinawa's lifelong friendship circles 00:20:08 – Sardinia's active elders and social roles 00:20:40 – Greece's culture of connection and communal meals 00:21:03 – Why longevity wasn't hacked—it was lived 00:21:38 – Social connection as the foundation of daily life 00:22:01 – The shocking decline in face-to-face interaction 00:22:21 – Young people losing 70% of in-person social time 00:22:58 – How community was systematically dismantled 00:23:00 – Robert Putnam's Bowling Alone 00:23:49 – Doing life together versus doing life alone 00:24:05 – How suburban design creates isolation 00:24:49 – The built environment shapes human behavior 00:24:55 – Social media and the promise of connection 00:25:20 – Why digital connection fails biologically 00:25:33 – Social comparison, anxiety, and nervous system stress 00:25:49 – More connected online, more isolated in reality 00:26:03 – A call to action: treating relationships like health practices 00:27:00 – Practical ways to rebuild community 00:28:00 – Prioritizing people over convenience 00:29:00 – Deep conversations, presence, and intentional connection 00:30:00 – Reclaiming community in modern life 00:31:00 – Final thoughts on connection, belonging, and health 00:31:53 – Closing remarks and outro     Thank You to Our Sponsors Bite Toothpaste: Go to trybite.com/DARIN20 or use code DARIN20 for 20% off your first order Manna Vitality: Go to mannavitality.com/ and use code DARIN12 for 12% off your order.     Join the SuperLife Patreon: This is where Darin now shares the deeper work: - weekly voice notes - ingredient trackers - wellness challenges - extended conversations - community accountability - sovereignty practices Join now for only $7.49/month at https://patreon.com/darinolien     Find More from Darin Olien: Website: darinolien.com Instagram: @darinolien Book: Fatal Conveniences Platform & Products: superlife.com New Show: Roadmap to Happiness     Key Takeaway "The longest-running study in human history reached a conclusion that should fundamentally change how we think about health: the quality of our relationships predicts our happiness, resilience, and longevity more than almost anything else. Human connection isn't a luxury, a personality trait, or a nice bonus when life slows down. It is biology. It is medicine. And in a world increasingly designed for isolation, rebuilding community may be one of the most important health decisions we ever make."     Bibliography/Sources: Primary Research — Loneliness, Social Isolation & Health Associated Press. (2023, May 2). Surgeon general: Loneliness poses health risks as deadly as smoking. PBS NewsHour. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/surgeon-general-loneliness-poses-health-risks-as-deadly-as-smoking Cacioppo, J. T., & Hawkley, L. C. (2009). Perceived social isolation and cognition. Trends in Cognitive Sciences, 13(10), 447–454. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.tics.2009.06.005 Holt-Lunstad, J., Smith, T. B., & Layton, J. B. (2010). Social relationships and mortality risk: A meta-analytic review. PLoS Medicine, 7(7), e1000316. https://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pmed.1000316 Office of the Surgeon General. (2023). Our epidemic of loneliness and isolation: The U.S. Surgeon General's advisory on the healing effects of social connection and community. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/surgeon-general-social-connection-advisory.pdf Waldinger, R. J., & Schulz, M. S. (2010). What's love got to do with it? Social functioning, perceived health, and daily happiness in married octogenarians. Psychology and Aging, 25(2), 422–431. https://doi.org/10.1037/a0019087 Neuroscience — Oxytocin, Polyvagal Theory & Community Biology Carter, C. S. (1998). Neuroendocrine perspectives on social attachment and love. Psychoneuroendocrinology, 23(8), 779–818. https://doi.org/10.1016/S0306-4530(98)00055-9 Eisenberger, N. I., & Lieberman, M. D. (2004). Why rejection hurts: A common neural alarm system for physical and social pain. Trends in Cognitive Sciences, 8(7), 294–300. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.tics.2004.05.010 Heinrichs, M., Baumgartner, T., Kirschbaum, C., & Ehlert, U. (2003). Social support and oxytocin interact to suppress cortisol and subjective responses to psychosocial stress. Biological Psychiatry, 54(12), 1389–1398. https://doi.org/10.1016/S0006-3223(03)00465-7 Porges, S. W. (2011). The polyvagal theory: Neurophysiological foundations of emotions, attachment, communication, and self-regulation. W. W. Norton & Company. https://wwnorton.com/books/9780393707007 Blue Zones Research Buettner, D., & Skemp, S. (2016). Blue Zones: Lessons from the world's longest lived. American Journal of Lifestyle Medicine, 10(5), 318–321. https://doi.org/10.1177/1559827616637066 Kreouzi, M., Theodorakis, N., & Constantinou, C. (2022). Lessons learned from Blue Zones, lifestyle medicine pillars and beyond. American Journal of Lifestyle Medicine. https://doi.org/10.1177/15598276221118494 Suzuki, M., Willcox, B. J., & Willcox, D. C. (2001). Implications from and for food cultures for cardiovascular disease: Longevity. Asia Pacific Journal of Clinical Nutrition, 10(2), 165–171. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1440-6047.2001.00219.x The power of environment: A comprehensive review of the exposome's role in healthy aging. (2025). PubMed Central (PMC11858149). https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC11858149/ Social Capital & Community Decline Oldenburg, R. (1999). The great good place: Cafés, coffee shops, bookstores, bars, hair salons, and other hangouts at the heart of a community. Marlowe & Company. https://books.google.com/books?id=cK80BwAAQBAJ Putnam, R. D. (2000). Bowling alone: The collapse and revival of American community. Simon & Schuster. https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Bowling-Alone/Robert-D-Putnam/9780743203043 Sbarra, D. A., Briskin, J. L., & Slatcher, R. B. (2019). Smartphones and close relationships: The case for an evolutionary mismatch. Perspectives on Psychological Science, 14(4), 596–618. https://doi.org/10.1177/1745691619826535 Twenge, J. M., Joiner, T. E., Rogers, M. L., & Martin, G. J. (2018). Increases in depressive symptoms, suicide-related outcomes, and suicide rates among U.S. adolescents after 2010 and links to increased new media screen time. Journal of Adolescent Health, 62(1), 78–85. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jadohealth.2017.06.014 U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics. (2020). American time use survey. U.S. Department of Labor. https://www.bls.gov/tus/ Pennebaker & Authentic Disclosure Brown, B. (2012). Daring greatly: How the courage to be vulnerable transforms the way we live, love, parent, and lead. Gotham Books. https://brenebrown.com/book/daring-greatly/ Pennebaker, J. W. (1997). Writing about emotional experiences as a therapeutic process. Psychological Science, 8(3), 162–166. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-9280.1997.tb00403.x

On the nuances of grief and loss, personal rituals, and our willingness to be transformed.  0:00 — Introduction and Guest Introduction 3:04 — Marissa's Personal Story and Grief Journey 7:38 — Building a Grief Plan 13:24 — Understanding Trauma and Its Impact 17:27 — Boundaries and Self-Care 22:52 — The Role of Prayer and Rituals 28:22 — Memorializing Losses and Rituals 32:18 — Connecting with Nature and Finding Support 37:46 — Conclusion and Final Thoughts Merissa Nathan Gerson is the author of Forget Prayers, Bring Cake: A Single Woman's Guide to Grieving, and her writing appears in Modern Love for the New York Times, The Atlantic, Playboy, Tablet, CNN.com and beyond. Merissa trained in Shambhala Shamatha meditation, graduated with an MFA in Writing and Poetics from Naropa University, is a certified Sivananda yoga teacher, and holds an MA in Jewish Studies with a focus on inherited trauma as well as sex and gender from the Graduate Theological Union in Berkeley, California. She was the Inherited Trauma consultant to Amazon's Transparent and is the daughter and granddaughter of war refugees. She is currently training to be a rabbi. Forget Prayers, Bring Cake: A Single Woman's Guide to Grieving came out in 2021 from Mandala Press for Simon & Schuster. This book is a companion for these times. As McArthur Genius Kiese Laymon describes: "Merissa Gerson has created a neon treatise on the art and necessity of grieving."

Sarah Damoff joins Book Gang to discuss The Burning Side, a powerful family saga of marriage, memory, and the secrets that bind generations. This week's Book Gang conversation welcomes back acclaimed author Sarah Damoff, whose new novel, The Burning Side, delivers a gripping book club premise: a multigenerational family forced to rebuild after tragedy, now under one roof. Opening with a house fire, readers witness the unraveling of the tangled lives of April and Leo, who must seek shelter with April's parents—only to discover old wounds and new truths simmering beneath the surface of Deb and Billy's life as they navigate carrying a heavy secret of their own. Damoff draws on her experience as a social worker to craft heart-wrenching, compassionate scenes of family struggle, childhood trauma, and the hard choices that shape marriage and parenthood. In this inviting and deeply immersive conversation, we discuss:

What if loneliness isn't just an emotion… but one of the most dangerous biological threats to your health? In this deeply personal and scientifically explosive solo episode, Darin opens up about something he recently realized in his own life: despite being surrounded by people, he was lonely. But what began as an emotional realization quickly became a deep dive into some of the most shocking research he's ever uncovered, showing that chronic loneliness may increase the risk of heart disease, dementia, cancer, autoimmune dysfunction, accelerated aging, and early death. From inflammatory gene expression and cortisol dysregulation to oxytocin, vulnerability, and the collapse of real human connection in the digital age, this episode reveals why loneliness may be the most overlooked "fatal convenience" of modern life, and how vulnerability may be the medicine. What You'll Learn Why loneliness is a biological crisis, not just an emotional feeling The shocking link between loneliness and heart disease, dementia, and early death Why the quality of your relationships is the #1 predictor of long-term health How loneliness activates inflammatory genes inside your body The role of cortisol, sleep disruption, and chronic stress in social isolation Why social media and "surface-level connection" are replacing real intimacy The connection between loneliness and Alzheimer's disease How oxytocin and genuine connection reduce inflammation Why vulnerability is the gateway to meaningful relationships Practical ways to create deeper connection starting today Chapters 00:00:33 – Sponsor: the truth about the exploding NAD supplement market 00:01:04 – Why supplement verification and transparency matter 00:02:17 – Opening: Darin admits something deeply personal 00:02:30 – "I realized recently… I'm lonely" 00:02:37 – The difference between being surrounded by people vs being truly known 00:03:06 – Loneliness as a biological experience, not just an emotional one 00:03:27 – The hidden risks: heart disease, dementia, cancer, early death 00:03:45 – Why this is not fringe science 00:04:13 – The most important predictor of long-term health 00:04:34 – Why relationship QUALITY matters more than quantity 00:05:06 – The global loneliness epidemic 00:05:11 – U.S. Surgeon General advisory on loneliness 00:05:39 – Loneliness declared a public health crisis 00:06:02 – 50% of Americans report measurable loneliness 00:06:22 – "A generational collapse of connection" 00:06:30 – 29% of adults have no close friends 00:06:40 – Face-to-face interactions dramatically declining 00:07:01 – The UK, Japan, and Australia loneliness crisis initiatives 00:07:32 – The paradox: hyperconnected but deeply isolated 00:08:04 – Loneliness as a biological alarm signal 00:08:31 – What loneliness actually looks like in modern life 00:08:42 – The lonely CEO, the unseen mother, the isolated social media addict 00:09:31 – "Perceived social isolation" and why the brain can't tell the difference 00:10:21 – Meta-analysis of 3.4 million people 00:10:55 – Loneliness vs obesity and smoking risk comparisons 00:11:18 – The biology of loneliness begins 00:11:50 – NF-kB: inflammatory gene activation explained 00:12:33 – How loneliness changes gene expression 00:13:02 – Chronic inflammation and disease pathways 00:13:21 – Cortisol, sleep disruption, and immune dysfunction 00:14:00 – How loneliness affects brain repair and amyloid plaque clearing 00:14:21 – Sponsor: Fatty15 and cellular health 00:18:02 – The Alzheimer's and dementia connection 00:18:25 – Loneliness as a major modifiable dementia risk factor 00:18:57 – Cortisol, neuroinflammation, and brain degeneration 00:19:16 – The hippocampus physically shrinking in lonely people 00:19:27 – Social media as a "fatal convenience" 00:19:57 – The oxytocin economy: connection as medicine 00:20:15 – Oxytocin as one of the body's strongest anti-inflammatory molecules 00:20:30 – HeartMath research: emotional synchronization between people 00:20:48 – "You regulate each other's biology" 00:21:07 – The real barrier: vulnerability 00:21:32 – Darin's recent experiences with radical vulnerability 00:21:54 – Conversations with family, ex-partners, and loved ones 00:22:35 – Brené Brown's research on connection and worthiness 00:23:14 – The "depth audit" exercise 00:23:42 – Reaching out, expressing appreciation, and owning your emotions 00:24:01 – Sacred hours: spending time without phones 00:24:13 – Questions that create real intimacy 00:24:30 – Darin's emotional conversation with his brother 00:25:03 – Protecting yourself from social media disconnection 00:25:20 – Becoming a source of joy and connection in everyday life 00:25:25 – Darin reflects on seven years of subtle loneliness 00:25:48 – The shift from surface conversations to meaningful connection 00:26:01 – "If you want love, give love" 00:26:19 – Final message: generate the connection you want to receive 00:26:22 – Closing thoughts and outro Thank You to Our Sponsors Truniagen: Go to www.truniagen.com and use code DARIN20 at checkout for 20% off Fatty15: Get an additional 15% off their 90-day subscription Starter Kit by going to fatty15.com/DARIN and using code DARIN at checkout. Join the SuperLife Community Get Darin's deeper wellness breakdowns — beyond social media restrictions: Weekly voice notes Ingredient deep dives Wellness challenges Energy + consciousness tools Community accountability Extended episodes Join for $7.49/month → https://patreon.com/darinolien Connect with Darin Olien: Website: darinolien.com Instagram: @darinolien Book: Fatal Conveniences Platform & Products: superlife.com New Show: Roadmap to Happiness Key Takeaway "Loneliness isn't weakness. It isn't failure. It's a biological signal telling you that something essential is missing. And in a world addicted to surface-level connection, the real medicine may simply be this: vulnerability, presence, eye contact, honesty, and the courage to let yourself truly be seen." Bibliography/Sources The Loneliness Epidemic & Public Health Data Bureau of Labor Statistics. (2023). American time use survey. U.S. Department of Labor. https://www.bls.gov/tus/ Cigna. (2023). Cigna U.S. loneliness index. Evernorth Health Services. https://newsroom.cigna.com/loneliness-epidemic-continues-to-rise-cigna-study Murthy, V. H. (2023). Our epidemic of loneliness and isolation: The U.S. Surgeon General's advisory on the healing effects of social connection and community. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/surgeon-general-social-connection-advisory.pdf Survey Center on American Life. (2021). The state of American friendship: Change, challenges, and loss. American Enterprise Institute. https://www.americansurveycenter.org/research/the-state-of-american-friendship-change-challenges-and-loss/ Mortality & Systemic Health Risk Cohen, S., Doyle, W. J., Skoner, D. P., Rabin, B. S., & Gwaltney, J. M. (1997). Social ties and susceptibility to the common cold. JAMA, 277(24), 1940–1944. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9200634/ Hawkley, L. C., & Cacioppo, J. T. (2010). Loneliness matters: A theoretical and empirical review of consequences and mechanisms. Annals of Behavioral Medicine, 40(2), 218–227. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20396846/ Holt-Lunstad, J., Smith, T. B., Baker, M., Harris, T., & Stephenson, D. (2015). Loneliness and social isolation as risk factors for mortality: A meta-analytic review. Perspectives on Psychological Science, 10(2), 227–237. https://doi.org/10.1177/1745691614568352 Valtorta, N. K., Kanaan, M., Gilbody, S., Ronzi, S., & Hanratty, B. (2016). Loneliness and social isolation as risk factors for coronary heart disease and stroke. Heart, 102(13), 1009–1016. https://heart.bmj.com/content/102/13/1009 Genetics, Inflammation & The Immune System Cole, S. W. (2013). Social regulation of human gene expression: Mechanisms and implications for public health. American Journal of Public Health, 103(S1), S84–S92. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3786756/ Cole, S. W., Hawkley, L. C., Arevalo, J. M. G., Sung, C. Y., Rose, R. M., & Cacioppo, J. T. (2007). Social regulation of gene expression in human leukocytes. Genome Biology, 8(9), Article R189. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2375027/ Sleep & Cognitive Decline Cacioppo, J. T., Hawkley, L. C., Berntson, G. G., Ernst, J. M., Gibbs, A. C., Stickgold, R., & Hobson, J. A. (2002). Do lonely days invade the nights? Potential social modulation of sleep efficiency. Psychological Science, 13(4), 384–387. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12137144/ Holwerda, T. J., Deeg, D. J. H., Beekman, A. T. F., et al. (2014). Feelings of loneliness, but not social isolation, predict dementia onset. Journal of Neurology, Neurosurgery & Psychiatry, 85(2), 135–142. https://jnnp.bmj.com/content/85/2/135 Oxytocin & The Biology of Connection Szeto, A., Sun-Suslow, N., Mendez, A. J., Hernandez, R. I., Wagner, K. V., & McCabe, P. M. (2017). Regulation of the macrophage oxytocin receptor in response to inflammation. American Journal of Physiology—Endocrinology and Metabolism, 312(2), E183–E189. https://journals.physiology.org/doi/full/10.1152/ajpendo.00424.2016 Uvnas-Moberg, K. (2003). The oxytocin factor: Tapping the hormone of calm, love, and healing. Da Capo Press. https://books.google.com/books?id=b-aKjQoB_nQC Psychology, Vulnerability & Relationship Science Aron, A., Melinat, E., Aron, E. N., Vallone, R. D., & Bator, R. J. (1997). The experimental generation of interpersonal closeness. Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 23(4), 363–377. https://doi.org/10.1177/0146167297234003 Brown, B. (2010). The gifts of imperfection: Let go of who you think you're supposed to be and embrace who you are. Hazelden Publishing. https://brenebrown.com/book/the-gifts-of-imperfection/ Cacioppo, J. T., & Patrick, W. (2008). Loneliness: Human nature and the need for social connection. W. W. Norton & Company. https://wwnorton.com/books/9780393335286 Dunbar, R. I. M. (2012). Bridging evolutionary approaches to the social brain and social bonding. In F. B. M. de Waal & P. F. Ferrari (Eds.), The primate mind. Harvard University Press. https://www.hup.harvard.edu/books/9780674063104 Dunbar, R. I. M. (2021). Friends: Understanding the power of our most important relationships. Little, Brown and Company. https://www.hachettebookgroup.com/titles/robin-dunbar/friends/9781408711736/ Waldinger, R., & Schulz, M. (2023). The good life: Lessons from the world's longest scientific study on happiness. Simon & Schuster. https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/The-Good-Life/Robert-Waldinger/9781982166694

2026-05-07 | UPDATES #196 | The fall of an empire – the humbling of the Russian bear and elimination of its vast stock of Soviet weapons, and Soviet-minded population of Putin's Russian Federation. A victory made by housewives: how a German CEO insulted the drone revolution he cannot compete with. Today's episode is a breakdown of why Ukraine's mil-tech threatens every defence prime in NATO and the U.S. with a new paradigm of how to fight wars, and how to supply them. Last Friday, the Atlantic magazine published an interview with one of Europe's most powerful defence executives. The man is Armin Papperger, Chief Executive Officer of Rheinmetall AG — Germany's largest arms manufacturer, market capitalisation north of fifty billion euros, supplier of tanks, 155mm artillery shells, and air defence systems to NATO and to Ukraine itself. The Atlantic's journalist Simon Schuster asked Papperger about Ukraine's domestically-produced drones — the cheap, mass-manufactured, daily-iterated weapons that have, by independent count, destroyed roughly two-thirds of Russia's tank fleet and account for 80 percent of all combat casualties on both sides of this war.----------SUPPORT THE CHANNEL:https://www.buymeacoffee.com/siliconcurtainhttps://www.patreon.com/siliconcurtainhttps://www.gofundme.com/f/scaling-up-campaign-to-fight-authoritarian-disinformation----------ACTIVE CAMPAIGN:We are raising funds for 5 of 15 Vampire DronesSilicon Curtain for Kupiansk Vampires. Dzyga's Paw, together with Jonathan Fink, is joining forces to raise $40,000 to provide the Khartiia Brigade with Vampire Drones.https://dzygaspaw.com/silicon-curtain-for-kupiansk-vampiresThese heavy bombers are designed to destroy manpower and equipment, as well as for remote mining. The Vampire UAV, manufactured by Skyfall, has proven itself to be one of the most effective weapons in the Kupiansk direction. Skyfall is one of Ukraine's largest defense tech companies, producing Vampire bomber drones, various modifications of Shrike FPV drones, P1-SUN, Shahed drone interceptors, communication systems, and components.----------PLEASE HELP ME ME TO GROW SILICON CURTAINWe are planning our events for 2026, and to do more and have a greater impact. After achieving more than 12 events in 2025, we will aim to double that! 24 events and interviews on the ground in Ukraine, to push back against weaponized information, toxic propaganda and corrosive disinformation. Please help us make it happen!----------SOURCES: 1. The Atlantic — Simon Schuster interview with Armin Papperger (published Friday, late March 2026)France24 / AFP — "Rheinmetall addresses row over CEO's Ukraine 'housewives' comment" (29 March 2026) Euronews — "'Every housewife could be CEO of Rheinmetall': Zelenskyy hits back at German weapons boss" (30 March 2026)Ukrainska Pravda — "'Housewives' and 'Lego': Rheinmetall says it respects Ukraine after CEO's controversial remarks" (29 March 2026)Militarnyi — "Rheinmetall Apologizes for CEO's Comments About 'Ukrainian Housewives With 3D Printers'" (late March 2026) The Print — "More 'hits' than Rheinmetall ever — Ukraine drone manufacturer claps back at CEO's 'housewives' remark" (1 April 2026) Bull Source — "Social media backlash as Rheinmetall's Armin Papperger says Ukraine's drones are made by housewives" (April 2026) United24 Media — "Ukraine's New Point-Based Rewards System for Drone Operators Is Rewriting War Management from the Ground Up" (May 2025) United24 Media — "Ukraine Launches Combat E-Points System: Troops Can Now Redeem Kills for Drones and EW Kits" (10 July 2025) SOFREP — "Ukraine Launches Combat-Based Reward System to Equip Troops With Cutting-Edge Tech" (8 May 2025)----------

    Simon Elegant's City on Fire: A Novel of Hong Kong  John chats with writer and journalist Simon Elegant about his third novel, a crime thriller set during the Hong Kong protests of 2019. City on Fire is published by Pegasus Crime, an imprint of Simon & Schuster. The novel follows Inspector Killian Tong's investigation of a brutal murder against a backdrop of political chaos, police tensions, and also personal conflict – Killian's half-sister is a radical protester. John and Simon also discuss the background to the 2019 protests, including the National Security Law and the earlier 2014 Umbrella Movement. Among the books mentioned were: Manchu (1980) by Robert Elegant (a swashbuckling novel by Simon's father). Gorky Park (1981) by Martin Cruz Smith Among the Braves: Hope, Struggle, and Exile in the Battle for Hong Kong and the Future of Global Democracy (2023) by Shibani Mahtani & Timothy McLaughlin Simon's recommendations The Immobile Empire (French 1989, English 1992) by Alain Peyrefitte. This is on the 1973 Macartney mission to Peking. Apple in China (2025) by Patrick McGee, which explores Apple's deep entanglement with China's manufacturing system. Ginkgo Season (2025) by Naomi Xu Elegant, a coming-of-age novel set in Philadelphia. To learn more about Simon Elegant and his novel, visit the publisher's website at www.pegasusbooks.com  The Books on Asia Podcast is co-produced with Plum Rain Press. Podcast host Amy Chavez is author of The Widow, the Priest, and the Octopus Hunter: Discovering a Lost Way of Life on a Secluded Japanese Island. and Amy's Guide to Best Behavior in Japan.The Books on Asia website posts book reviews, podcast episodes and episode Show Notes. Subscribe to the BOA podcast from your favorite podcast service. Subscribe to the Books on Asia newsletter to receive news of the latest new book releases, reviews and podcast episodes.

April 29, 2026 ~ Eli Newman, health reporter for Bridge Michigan and Simon Schuster, Capitol Reporter for Bridge Michigan joins Kevin to take a look at Michigan's healthcare system and what our gubernatorial candidates are saying about it ahead of the election. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

April 29, 2026 ~ Full Show: Kevin Dietz tackles a wide range of major stories, starting with legal and political fallout tied to an alleged COVID cover‑up with attorney and strategist Roshini Rajkumar. Congressman Tim Walberg recaps King Charles' address to Congress and its diplomatic significance, while Bridge Michigan reporters Eli Newman and Simon Schuster break down key health and policy developments inside Lansing. Former DOT Inspector General Mary Schiavo weighs in on the rise of electric air taxis and whether the technology is truly ready for passengers, attorney Steve Haney analyzes the NBA gambling scandal following its first guilty plea, and DraftKings analyst Julian Edlow breaks down Pistons odds and how betting lines have shifted throughout the series. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

A new book provides both a candid and humorous insights to help bridesmaids set boundaries, manage emotional and financial stress, and support their friends without losing themselves in the process. Ruhama Wolle, author and the style partnerships editor at The Cut, to discusses her book, I Hope You Elope: A Bridesmaid Survival Guide. Cover art courtesy of Simon & Schuster

SERIES 7: Better With Age. It takes courage to reinvent yourself professionally, yet it becomes a necessity for many people over 50. Bestselling author Kathy Lette and publishing exec Jane Curry share their hilarious experiences of pushing through career blocks and tiresome ageing stereotypes. Brought to you by Australian Seniors, in partnership with RSPCA. Join Jean Kittson for the seventh season of DARE: The Time of Your Life (formerly Life’s Booming), called Better With Age. Australians are actually living longer, healthier lives, and reshaping what older looks like. So in this series, we are chatting with over 50s who are rewriting the ageing rule book, from career pivots to second acts. This episode celebrates the Reinvention Generation, and explores how we can continue to push through career blocks and debunk tiresome stereotypes as we age. Is it because that's just how we're wired? Or is it to prove that our best work is still ahead? Kathy Lette is an internationally bestselling author of more than 20 books, which have been translated into 20 languages. Her latest bestselling book, The Sisterhood Rules, takes readers on a rollercoaster ride that proves that from pain comes healing, from honesty comes forgiveness, and that nothing is more important than your sisters. Jane Curry is a highly experienced publishing executive, and managing director of Simon and Schuster, Australia and New Zealand. Jane is also the founder of Ventura Press, which she established to champion older female (and male) authors. Watch DARE: The Time of Your Life on YouTube Listen to DARE: The Time of Your Life on Apple Podcasts Listen to DARE: The Time of Your Life on Spotify For more information visit seniors.com.au/podcast Produced by Medium Rare Content Agency -- TRANSCRIPT Jean Kittson: Welcome to a new season of DARE: The Time of Your Life, formerly Life’s Booming, brought to you by Australian Seniors, in partnership with RSPCA. Hello I'm Jean Kittson, and this season is called Better With Age. We're flipping the script and showing how ageing is NOT a dirty word, rather it’s your time to live your life to its fullest. Australians are actually living longer, healthier lives, and reshaping what older looks like. So in this series, we are chatting with over 50s who are rewriting the ageing rule book, from career pivots to second acts. This episode celebrates the Reinvention Generation, and explores how we can continue to push through career blocks and debunk tiresome stereotypes as we age. Is it because that's just how we're wired? Or is it to prove that our best work is still ahead? To help us answer such questions is Jane Curry, a highly experienced publishing executive and newly-appointed managing director of Simon and Schuster, Australia and New Zealand. Jane is also the founder of Ventura Press, a company she started as a way of championing older female authors, many of whom only turned to writing later in life. And joining Jane is the fabulous author and beloved friend Kathy Lette. Her career has pushed boundaries from the get go, when she left school at 16 to write her debut novel, Puberty Blues. It had parents wringing their hands while teens lapped it up. And it was later turned into a movie and a TV series. She's gone on to pen more than 20 bestselling books, including her latest, the Sisterhood Rules, which has topped bestseller lists worldwide, and it's funny, fabulous and always empowering. Jane, Kathy, it's wonderful to have you both in the studio to speak about yourselves and your work. Kathy Lette: …and about you and your amazing work and your incredible life. Jean Kittson: Oh, do go on! Kathy Lette: My comic goddess right here before us, Jean. Jean's broken so many boundaries with her comedy. Jean Kittson: Oh Kathy, you’re amazing, and she's a long, long time beloved friend. And as you, in your words, you are my human wonder bra… Kathy Lette: …uplifting and supportive. I'd also say we are each other's big pair of knickers. We've got our asses covered. Jean Kittson: Mm-hmm. That's right. I can always, I mean, Kathy's the best friend you could possibly have. And don’t we all need… Kathy Lette: …Ditto. Jane Curry: …Don’t we all need female friendships, they keep us all going. Jean Kittson: You, Kathy. Kathy Lette: Yes. Jean Kittson: On a more serious note about, you have covered, you have written about all aspects of life from puberty to marriage, childbirth, menopause. Often based on your own experiences, you've inspired and entertained and soothed millions of readers, including your latest book, the Sisterhood Rules, which I absolutely love and should be a manual for any woman breaking up or any older woman wanting a bit of spice in her life, really. Kathy Lette: Haha, great, ha ha. Jean Kittson: But, um, when your previous publishers said to you. That nobody wants to read about middle-aged women. And they dropped you after 19 books in 17 languages. Kathy Lette: Yes. Jean Kittson: Bestsellers. Kathy Lette: Mm-hmm. Jean Kittson: And you went on to write the Revenge Club, another bestseller. I mean, how did you do that? Kathy Lette: I went to see my agent and said, I wanna write a book about four middle-aged women who take revenge on the men who've sidelined them and ruined their careers. And he was like, yeah, I dunno. Yeah, middle-aged women just aren't that sexy. And then I went to see my publisher at the time and my publisher was like, Hmm, middle-aged women. We know they exist, but nobody wants to go there. Jane Curry: Oh my goodness. Kathy Lette: And I looked at books written about women my age, like Anita Brooklyn novels, for example. And there was about sad, depressed, lonely women who wilt away and die in their flats and get eaten by their cats. Now I don't know any women like that. All my women friends are like Jean. They're swinging off a chandelier with a cocktail between their teeth. But when they, when they first said that to me, then my publisher dropped me. I thought, gosh, maybe I have passed my amuse-by date. And just for a moment, I did, I did have a real crisis of confidence. But then of course I'm an Aussie girl and we, Aussie girls are made of stern stuff Jane Curry: Dig deep. Kathy Lette: So I thought, nah, he's wrong. They're both wrong. So I got a new, I got a gay agent and I got a new publisher, Bloomsbury, and the book went to number-one on the bestseller list, which was the best revenge. It's called the Revenge Club – success! So yeah, it was so exciting. And also, I love writing about women this age because our hinterland is huge. You know, we've had the marriages, the divorces, the breakups, the promotions, the back stabs. We've raised the kids. We've looked after our aged parents as Jean did so, so devotedly. We've got so much to talk about and so much to share, and so much wisdom. Just at the time, society hands us the old invisibility cloak and puts us out to career pasture. It's not just me imagining that we, women my age, are given the cloak of invisibility. A few years ago, MI5 said they wanted to hire middle-aged women as spies because nobody sees us. Jean Kittson: Oh. Kathy Lette: Soak that up. And I remember the governor of the board of the Bank of England. He said, not long ago, that the economy was going through a menopausal phase. Sluggish. Jean Kittson: Oh. Kathy Lette: And I was like, tell that to Oprah Winfrey and Nicole Kidman, and Cate Blanchett… Jane Curry: Michelle Obama… Kathy Lette: …all the other people. Michelle Obama, all these other menopausal and postmenopausal women. So the sexism is sewn into our psyche. We really have to fight hard against that. And thanks to Jean and others of our generation. We've taken the stigma out of menopause. But the next big feminist hurdle for us is sexist ageism, because we get treated in a different way to men our age and, and we really have to rail against it. Because we're now prime, we're in the peak of our productivity. Jane Curry: But also we've all had to witness when the BAFTAs was on, every time we see these women who are completely transformed because they're not allowed to age in public. Kathy Lette: Mm. Jane Curry: So that's the standard. Yes. I mean, we are fortunate in where we're in the book business, so it's brain first in our business and always has been. Kathy Lette: Better to be witty than pretty. Jane Curry: Yeah, yeah – witty than pretty. And I remember a friend of mine who is actually a cosmetic surgeon, he said to me that it, you know, it's the women who are, have always been beautiful, that have had that sense of power when they walk into a room and they turn heads because of their beauty, they're the ones that find it harder to age. Kathy Lette: Well, it's a diminishing asset. Jane Curry: Yes. So whereas, you know, when you're in the book business as I've been, and Kathy, the entertainment book, um, you know, women of letters, we do have that our brain is our superpower. Kathy Lette: Yeah, yeah. Jane Curry: And then what we look like comes after that. Yes. Jean Kittson: It's hard to fight it though, isn't it? Kathy Lette: It is hard to fight it, Jean Kittson: …especially when you are performing and… Jane Curry: Oh yes. Well, in this new job I've just got, I got tapped on the shoulder to run Simon Schuster. So the first thing I found was all the, the settings on Zoom and teams. Because I’m reporting to the UK and I'm having meetings in the US all the time and sometimes I first thing in the morning, like 7.30 in the morning. So I'm like, where's the filter. Jean Kittson: Where’s the sparkle wand! Jane Curry: You know, we used to laugh when I worked at Macmillan. You know, we used, you know, there's fabulous filters that Jackie Collins had on all their photographs. Kathy Lette: Oh my gosh, yes. In fact, I've had lunch with Jackie Collins a few times with Joan Collins. Joan and Jackie, I mean, the double whammy. Jean Kittson: Yes. Jane Curry: Talk about sisterhood. Kathy Lette: Sensational broads. But, um, Joan Collins will move everybody around the table till she's got the right lighting. And isn't she clever? You know that when you do, when you're filming, they have that big silver thing that reflects the [light], why can't we have a dress made out of that? Jean Kittson: Well, why can't we! Kathy Lette: Or shoes? Jean Kittson: Because we don't care, Kathy. We don't care. Kathy Lette: We don't care. Jane Curry: Often we’re rushing from one thing to the next. Kathy Lette: Don't care. We don't care. But Jean, see, Jean and I don't do, don’t do any of that Botoxing stuff. Jane Curry: No. Nor do I. Kathy Lette: I think men should just read between my lines, the books, the babies, the hours of fun-loving flirtation. But it does get hard to resist it whenever all the other women… Jane Curry: …I think that's the thing when… Kathy Lette: …look much younger Jane Curry: that, right, what they call in the, you know, in data they call it benchmarking. So like any set of data figures in my world, you know, you benchmark against what was the bestseller. And so it's sort of benchmarking when you're talking about sales and all of that. But it's benchmarking with what we look like. So you sort of benchmark against, we, I think we're very critical of ourselves, because you look at another woman who's the same age and they've had the facelift and they've had everything done. And then look, I momentarily worry about it. And then honestly, you, I look at my to-do list and I think, no. Jean Kittson: Yeah, and I've got two daughters, so I don't want to be that role model. I've always said it's not what you look like, it's what you feel like, you know? Kathy Lette: Yes. Keep the lights low. Greatest beauty aid known to woman for all time. You know, what's happened in Hollywood, the pediatric, um, technicians there. The doctors noticed that the babies were not hitting their developmental milestones. And they were saying, is it because they're, they're having too much, um, carcinogens in their smoked salmon? I'm thinking, no, it's Botox. Because babies look at your face, like when you go, I love your little baby. The baby goes and you go, ah… If you've had Botox and you're going, ‘I love you’, and the baby's going, ‘uh’, you’re going, ‘uh’. They're not learning anything. Jean Kittson: Absolutely. Jean Kittson: You should write a research paper on that. They should do it. Kathy Lette: This is hysterical, isn't it? I know. Jean Kittson: I was told not to go, I mean. Not to go grey because I wouldn't, in the gig economy, I wouldn't get work. Apparently the research shows that if you, that men don't like actually working with women with grey hair. Kathy Lette: …Because it reminds them of their mothers, is it? Jean Kittson: …Maybe they feel that they… Kathy Lette: …it's ageing them… Jean Kittson: Have to defer or - No, not defer… Kathy Lette: …but they can have grey hair. Jean Kittson: They can have grey hair. So there are some interesting facts their. Kathy Lette: I was gonna say, part of the problem is that we never see women who look like us. 85% of people on British and Australian television over 50 are men. So the women just get immediately sidelined and put out to career pasture when they get one grey hair and one wrinkle. We should be saying, we wanna see ourselves reflected. Don't, don't disappear us. Jean Kittson: You know, Jane, you would see, um, this in the industry. You've seen this before. What happened to Kathy? Have you? Jane Curry: Oh, yes, because a lot of decisions are made on data. You know, they'll say, oh, and particularly I think people got very frightened when social media arrived. They got very frightened that they had to chase people with massive Instagram following. Oh, yes. And then there was this sort of Sally Rooney phenomena where everybody wanted a ‘Normal People’. And that was that emerging, you know, Kathy Lette: Irish writers… Jane Curry: …Irish and, and all that sort of coming of age story that, and we are, we are just, we move as a pack, the publishing industry. So once there's one Normal People, you can guarantee the next year there'll be 10 Normal People. And that's a book for people that haven't read it, that was published by Sally Rooney. It was a debut novel and you know, it was one of the zeitgeist novels. Kathy Lette: She became a publishing phenomenon. Jean Kittson: In terms of ageism in comedy, it's just a general feeling that I think women, first of all, women in comedy has been really hard from the start and you really have to push and it's a much more sort of natural environment for men because they're confident and some, some comedians can go on and and not even have thought about what they're going to say, they're just so confident. Kathy Lette: Yeah. Jean Kittson: When I was starting out in comedy, I would be starting out with other, the few women that were around in the 80s and we'd be in pubs and we'd go on stage and everyone would be drinking and eating their pizza, and no one would listen and the women would come off and going, oh my God, I'm just not funny. I haven't got good material. I stink. I can't do this. The men would go out there and they would get exactly the same reaction. People are just drinking and they'd come back and they'd go, that audience wouldn't know a joke if it was up them. They're just so freaking hopeless, and they'd just blame the audience and women would blame themselves, and I don't know where that comes from, but I think it can become more pronounced as you get older and there's slowly, more and more diminishing things that happen to you Like walking into a butcher and the butcher saying, hello, young lady, and you think I'm too, I'm too young to be called a young lady. You know, I not old enough. That's something that they would say to your grandmother, Hello, young lady, and expect you to like that. Expect it to be a compli–– Jane Curry: …A pat on the head. Jean Kittson: …Yeah, a pat. It's so patronising. Kathy Lette: Yeah. There's also this, it's an inbuilt prejudice against women that were not funny, and I, I was at a dinner party in London once and, and the hostess made a really good joke and the husband and men didn't pay any attention. The husband just went, oh, you know, embarrassing women can't tell jokes. And I was like, that's because we marry them. It made everybody laugh at him and that did take away his power. So just lean into that, that verbal ability that women have, you know, we’re more verbally dexterous. So use it like, develop what I call the black belt and tongue-fu! Quiplash, you know! Jean Kittson: Yeah, that's fantastic. Don't censor. Good comeback. Kathy Lette: Yes. Yeah. Good comeback. Jean Kittson: I know, I think we are getting stronger and we shouldn't, we shouldn't, um, suppress our strength as we probably have to keep peace, you know, with the family. That's right. With our work to balance everything. Yeah. You suppress a lot of who you are. Jane Curry: My eldest always says to me. Mum, you're overthinking. And that's the best mental health advice or whatever we do. We do overthink, Kathy Lette: But I think women should just or never go… You're underdressed if you go out at night without a couple of good one-liners tucked up your trouser leg. Jane Curry: That's really good advice. Kathy Lette: Because if, if you whack it back… Jane Curry: yes, Kathy Lette: …and make other people laugh at them, you completely take away their power. Jean Kittson: Well, you've got so many good one-liners, so you're like a one-liner factory. Jane Curry: I've got, I've gotta lift my game. Jean Kittson: Ah, yeah, exactly. So do I. So when your publishers said that ridiculous thing that nobody wants to read about middle aged women… Kathy Lette: …mm-hmm… Jean Kittson: Did you ever doubt yourself and think that I might have to reinvent myself in any way? Kathy Lette: I did. I, just for a moment, I lost confidence and I thought maybe I have passed my amuse-by-date. But then I looked around at my own female friends and I thought, they're so wonderful. They're all, you know, swinging off a chandelier with a toyboy between their teeth. I wanna write about these women. But I think as a writer, I'm always reinventing because I cannibalise my own life. My mother's a teacher and I think I've got a bit of her teacher gene that I always write the book I wish I'd had when I was going through something. So from, to the girls in Puberty Blues, you know, to teach them that they were more than a life support system to, to a pair of breasts, you know, to girls dating and, and then to motherhood and, and marriage and divorce and menopause, and raising an autistic child, raising a teenager, you know, now this post-menopausal second act. So I'm always reinventing because I'm, I'm changing. You know, women are used to change. We've got so much change going on in our lives. So, yeah, I think it comes naturally to women. So if you are reinventing yourself post menopause, you know, it's just, it's almost like situation normal. We're always constantly changing. And even divorce, I don't see divorce as a failure. I just see it as a change. Jean Kittson: Yes. Kathy Lette: You know, life is long from honeymoon to tomb to be like 80 years so, just if you need to reinvent, you know it's okay, and it comes more naturally to women. So don't be afraid of change. Change is good. But I would say women this age, this is a coming of age time. Jane Curry: Yes. Kathy Lette: Because we're the first generation who are economically independent. We've got the, the rock of fuel of HRT, we've got the chutzpah and the the courage to say what we are thinking. We are reinventing ourselves, having a sensational second act. Because I always say this time of your life, for women, is the best because post menopause, you know, you've, you've got no, you don't have to worry about period cramps or pregnancy scares. You've got all that tampon money to spend, you know… Jean Kittson: …and kids are grown up. You've got all that crystallised experience, as they call it. Kathy Lette: Yeah. I wanna know what you think of this, Jane. Because I accidentally invented – I hate the term – chick lit… Jane Curry: …I know what you're going to say… Kathy Lette: …I accidentally invented it in the 70s with Puberty Blues.. Jane Curry: Yes. Yes. Chook-lit. Kathy Lette: And then, then when I wrote Mad Cows and Fetal Attraction, I sort of invented Mummy-Lit. Jane Curry: Mm-hmm. Kathy Lette: And then when I wrote Nip and Tuck, that was nip-lit. And I'm like, I need a new genre for women our age. And I, and I thought, well, post 50, you get that fabulous, ‘Oh, feck it I'm 50’ gene, where you no longer care what people think about you. So I was thinking. What about, I-don't-give-a-s***-lit? Mm-hmm. Jane Curry: That's brilliant. Jean Kittson: Oh, good. You got the tick from a publisher! Kathy Lette: Wouldn't that be a good. And imagine we’re at Booker Prize and they go, ‘And now in the genre of I-don't-give-a -s***-lit. Yeah. Jane Curry: You know, in Hollywood, all the entertainment [industry] is catching. If you think of the Thursday murder club, that was Richard Osmond, of course, he's an older man, so he can get away with it. But you know, the adaptation with Helen Mirren and you know, those amazing actors. So Kathy Lette: Yes Jane Curry: So there is starting to be balanced… Kathy Lette: But that's even older. That's, that's when they're in the retirement home. I'm talking about this moment. Yeah, just postmenopausal, where we're the publishers are saying it's not sexy, it's not attractive. It's right when you're older, for some reason there's a jump to the Judi Dench. Jane Curry: It’s called the silver dollar then. Kathy Lette: Yeah. Jean Kittson: Oh yes. The silver dollar. Kathy Lette: Well, what about the postmenopausal dollar? Yes. You know who thinks reading books? It's women our age. Jane Curry: Well, actually, I always say to any publisher, go to a writer's festival. It's all women, of a certain age. Our age Jean Kittson: Over 50. Jane Curry: Over 50. Yeah, filling the audience. Jean Kittson: Yes, Kathy Lette: I'm on book tour right now for the sisterhood rules and I'm going around the country. It's been to Perth. I've been doing them in Sydney and Melbourne, and I'm about to go up, up to Queensland and I meet, I get to meet the readers, which is so fabulous. It's my favorite thing. Wonderful. And they're, they're women of a certain age. They bring me up little, little kind of anecdotal, doggy bags, a little story they've saved up for me about who their husband had an affair with or how they got revenge or whatever it is. And they're so funny and they sometimes they cry as well. Yeah. They'll have a cry and they'll tell me something very personal that's happened to them. And we have a hug and they're all so interesting. I wanna go out on a girl's night out with all of them all the time. Jane Curry: Yes, we be… Kathy Lette: …and yet they're written off. Jane Curry: Yeah, I was thinking a lot about it getting ready this morning and yeah, as, as you get older, you look back at how society's structured and it is so sort of primally structured around power and money and… Kathy Lette: …which has predominantly been male… Jane Curry: …which is predominantly male. So I've, so then I thought, so you've got, as a woman, you've got two ways of doing that. You can either become, marry into that and become the trophy wife and be terrified that they're going to leave you. So there's that way of attaching yourself to money or there's the other way of doing it, which is the way I did it, was to make it yourself. Kathy Lette: Yes, exactly. So always a better option. Jane Curry: So that was my option. So that's why I've sort of admired those other women from afar because I've never been part of their world. Even at university, I was never part of that world. I, we as, women, have to decide very early on, I think it's innate, I don’t know whether you make an actual decision, how you're gonna fit around that, those two binaries, power and money. But as women. It's not naturally given to us. So we have to decide. Even in the corporate world, that means we've got to constantly keep up with that. Kathy Lette: …Appearances. Jane Curry: …Appearances or… Kathy Lette: …Trophy mustn't be tarnished. Jean Kittson: Well, that's right. That's right. It's a big role to fill for the whole of your life. Trying to live up to that. Yeah. Sorry. There was a billboard saying, um, many years ago, which was a brilliant billboard saying, which I had a picture of a young woman, don't marry a millionaire. Become a millionaire. Kathy Lette: But when I, when I give talks in schools to girls, which I do often, I always say to them, choose your partner carefully. Because if you wanna be an alpha, alpha female in having a big career, if you choose an alpha man, guess who's gonna be the one who has to pull back when the child's sick or whatever. But if you choose a beta male, someone who'll adore you, not bore you and do all your chores for you, who wants to put you on a pedestal and will probably polish it while you're up there. You know, you've gotta have a much bigger and better and more satisfying career. So just, I've, I've been married to two Alphas whom I adore, but I've, I've now gotta beta boyfriend and beta’s, beta’s better. You know, like my fa— The women who are very successful in British television, for example, Sandy Toksvig, Sue Perkins, Claire Balding, are all gay. What do they have wives? Yeah, wives, and I've kind of got a male wife now and it, and it's fabulous. I highly recommend it. Jean Kittson: That's a really good, Jane Curry: That's funny because Kathy's just in from Perth. I'm just in from Brisbane. My overnight bike from Brisbane is just on the floor of my bedroom, just and so yeah, that's, we don't have wives. Kathy Lette: No, that's what need Jane Curry: We need, we need the backup. Jean Kittson: Yes. So what would you say to people or at who are already over 50 and who are confronting this ageism? I mean, how do, how do they manage it? What should, because the confidence… I'll tell you a quick story. A friend of mine's a teacher and she retired. She was a brilliant teacher, still is. She was doing some casual work and she, uh, went to the person organising the casual work at the, at the secondary college. She'd been working. At for 20 years and said, I'm really liking the casual work. You know, any casual work you can throw my way, that'd be good because I'm finding it hard to live on the pension. And he said, ‘Ah, I don't know. There's a lot of younger casual teachers around and they've got more longevity and productivity than you have.’ You don't need productivity and longevity to be a good teacher. Kathy Lette: No. Jean Kittson: For a developing mind. Kathy Lette: She needs to teach him that lesson. I hope she got up on the table and tap danced. Jean Kittson: You used to say, Kathy, in television, it doesn't matter what you, um, uh, what age you are, as long as it, you don't look at, that's what the producers used to say. Kathy Lette: Oh, yes. They're saying you've passed your use by date. Well, guess what? Tesco, a big supermarket chain in Britain, just took use-by dates off the food, because they said, make up your own mind. And I think the same should be done for women. Jean Kittson: Exactly. Kathy Lette: Take our use-by date off, judge us on our performance and our enthusiasm and our flexibility and our knowledge and our… Jean Kittson: Exactly. Kathy Lette: …sense of humor. And we're, we're individuals. You know,. what you have to do to survive the second act is go a lot of girls' nights out, a lot of laughter and, and sisterly camaraderie and um, strength in numbers, you know, and just boost each other up, give each other work. Like really put the, put your hand down and, and pull women up behind you. Jane Curry: Yeah. Kathy Lette: But in this, in the Sisterhood Rules, I've put lots of rules in the beginning about sisterly solidarity, like love and loyalty and sticking to each other like a nylon dress in a heat wave. And it also encouraging women to think big, like don't tell men you want their seats on the bus. You want their seats on the board. Like, think big. We're too, we don't have big enough ambitions for ourselves. Husbands come and go, but um, the sisterhood lasts forever. That's the most important rule I will share with you. Jean Kittson: I agree totally. It's really important to have people you can ring up when you're feeling really down and just have a chat with them and then they lift you up and that's so important. And I, I wonder if you'd want to talk about when you gave up publishing — I mean, when you left your job and opened your own publishing company, did you have a mentor then or, well, who was supporting you? Jane Curry: Amazing timing to ask me that. because I'm just about to go to the London book Fair and I got my first job in publishing in London and my boss, who must be now in her eighties, is still an absolute mover and shaker. Kathy Lette: What's her name? Jane Curry: Kit Van Tulleken. She's the mother of the Van Tulleken twins. Kathy Lette: Great name. Jane Curry: The Van Tulleken twins. Who are those… They're doctors that sell millions of copies of their books. Twins, identical twins. Jean Kittson: Oh, you've written about twins. Kathy Lette: Yeah. Jane Curry: Yeah. So they, she had the corner office when I was literally sitting in a corridor at about age 22 or 23, and there she was in the corner office and her two boys would come in after school. And I just looked up and thought she was my absolute role model. Kathy Lette: Oh, great. Jane Curry: And I'm seeing her in the London book fair. Kathy Lette: Nice. Jane Curry: And then I think it's important for other women who are, you know, working. I have a coach, I have a business coach, so I see her once a month and she sorts my head out – not a psychologist, but business wise. So where we have our natural weaknesses and we, you know, she'll always say you've – she's the ones that send, sends me those texts when I'm saying, I've got this difficult discussion, or I, you know, or different, you know, different emotions that you're taking to meetings just to take the emotion out of it and rely on the business. So I think that's important for people as who are working, because we are older, so we do have the capacity to sort of resource ourselves. So rather than have a cleaner, I'd rather have a business coach. Jean Kittson: Yeah. Oh, absolutely. That's such a good… Kathy Lette: …To clean out your, your, your brain. Yes. We do a lot of mentoring in England to younger women through the Women of the World Festival. We mentor young girls at school. We go in the wheel, we go, you know, the, you know the millennial wheel? Jane Curry: Oh yes. Kathy Lette: And we're in different pods and we go around in a pod with a group of girls, and then the next time we get off and get in another pod. So it's, we make it fun, but it's also very helpful for them And it's good for me. I learn a lot from them as well. Jane Curry: Yeah. One of the things I've learned going back into corporate after about 10 years of running my own business is, you know, the young women that we employ, you know how they're much more in their power than I ever was at that age. Jean Kittson: Oh, definitely. Jane Curry: When I was getting divorced, my lawyer turned around and said, are you okay? And I said, yes. I think looking at the kangaroo and the emu on the coat of arms thinking, how on earth did I end up here? Um, but then I said afterwards, I said, how do you do that every day? And he said, take the emotion. There's no emotion in it for me, Jane. I take the emotion out of it. And I've always remembered that advice. So take the emotion out of things. Even the most difficult business transaction, you know, when you've, particularly in publishing, you're dealing with creative people, you know, but take the emotion out of it. Look at the bare bones of the business transaction. Put the emotion in at the beginning and the end. But when it comes to actually achieving an outcome that is to the satisfaction of both parties, take the emotion out of it. So, channeling my divorce lawyer! Kathy Lette: When I got divorced, I remember saying – I knew they charged by the hour – so I used to go in and say, no adjectives, no adverbs, no anecdotes. Just get straight to the facts! But getting back to the mental thing, I just like to say that I, I do wanna encourage all women to always help other women. And when I published, when I wrote Puberty Blues as a teenager, that was rejected by about 10 publishers. Then I saw Anne Summers had written a piece in the paper about, um, gang rapes in Queensland or something. I thought she'll get this surfy brutality that goes on, and I sent her some of the manuscript and she sent it to a small feminist publishing group called McPhee Gribble in Melbourne. And the rest is history. So that was an absolute perfect example of the sisterhood supporting each other. Jean Kittson: And getting it, understanding each other. Kathy Lette: Understanding each other. That's right. Jean Kittson: And what they're going through and the importance of talking about it. Kathy Lette: We just need more women in power. Why can't, why can't women just run the world just for a year? We say to the men, go play golf. Do whatever you like. Just go for a year, just let us take over. We can't do a worse job than you've done and see what we could achieve. Jane Curry: Well, fortunately COVID has given us flexible work conditions. We couldn't get it beforehand, but most of my staff now, we've got nearly a hundred people and it's fantastic. So we've got lots of young mothers on the payroll. Jean Kittson: Oh that's great Jane Curry: And they work, you know, it's great. I've re and I think it took COVID to allow the bosses… Kathy Lette: Yes. Jane Curry: …the patriarchy, to see that working from home is, it can work. Kathy Lette: Because that's another big sexist trope. You know, that society expects women to raise children as though we don't work as well. Jane Curry: That's why I started my own business. Yes. Because when I told my boss I was expecting. The very first thing he said to me was, well, you can't work part-time. That's what he said to me. And I was the managing director at the time, and I actually miscarried that baby. So it gave me a little window to get out from under. So that's when I went to Macmillan because Ross Gibb, who's just retired from publishing, he said over lunch at Machiavelli's – because publishing still has a few lunches – I told him the story and he said, Jane, you can work part-time for me. He's lovely any day. Kathy Lette: He lovely. He was my publisher for a while. Jane Curry: So that's why I went to Macmillan. Because people say, why did you go from being a managing director to being a publisher? And I did that because Ross said, you can work for me any day. He saw the value of female talent. Kathy Lette: Yeah. Yes. Jane Curry: So I had a fantastic year, few years. What about seven years at Macmillan whilst I had my two boys. I'm like, Kathy Lette: See, revenge, revenge! Fabulous. I think the reason women are drawn, I've them… Jean Kittson: …outlive them! Kathy Lette: I think the reason women are drawn to revenge is it's sweet, but totally non fattening – fabulous. Jane Curry: It is, it is. So Ross Gibbs – we do have our allies. Kathy Lette: We do, we do. And it's been important to say that… Jane Curry: …yes… Kathy Lette: …that of course there are great men who do support us and want the best for us. But we need more, we need more men, at the barricades. I've been saying the same feminist things – Jean and I have been saying the same thing through our comedy since we were teenagers, and we still don’t have equal pay. So we need men to get on the barricades with us and say, enough, you know, we, we need equality, we need it now. And I often say, some men challenge me when I'm on tour and they'll say, you know, you feminists are asking for too much. And I'm like, are we, are we really asking for too much equal pay? We'd like men to help us more around the house, which is in their interest. Is it scientifically proven? No woman ever shot a husband while he's vacuuming. We'd like them to do the odd sensitive thing with snow peas in the kitchen, because the weight to a woman's heart through her stomach. Not aiming too high. Jane Curry: Because I've got boys who are now in their 20s, so I've looked at it through that, you know, men's mental health, they don't want to always be the strong and the tough ones. Kathy Lette: No. Feminism works for men as well. Jane Curry: Yes. That's the thing. Exactly. They're allowed to have emotions… Kathy Lette: …and not have the pressure to be the breadwinner and all of that. Jane Curry: Yeah. So I see it, you know, having raised boys as a feminist, you know, to make sure that we can have open discussions. And, yeah, I'd like to think that they're well on the way to being good allies. But yeah, it is a brutal world out there. So I just think we do have to look out for each other and I'm really thrilled to be working with young women, again. Jean Kittson: To sum up this fantastic conversation, which could go on for hours, um, how would you, uh, what is the main message you like to say to people over 50 who are confronted by ageism or sexism, and how do they find it in them, the courage to stop that voice going, maybe I am too old. Kathy Lette: Well, I would say carpe diem, like there's no tomorrow. You know, tempus is fugiting – if not now, when, and you know. One of my mottoes is adventure before dementia. Not that I'm making light of that terrible disease, but you never know what's around the corner. So there's no time to waste. Be… have as much fun and frivolity. Be as outrageous as you can possibly be because you know, this is your last big hurrah. You know… Jean Kittson: Be assertive now! Kathy Lette: Yes, don't have any qualms. Just, you know, tap dance on that tabletop. Jane Curry: When I've had moments of self-doubt, I get moving. Not necessarily tap dancing, but get active, lift weights, go to the gym, run, walk the dog – dark clouds, gather. That's what I'd say if I was in that frame of mind and wondering how the world was going to greet me, I'd take the world on and get active, get those endorphins flowing. Because then you feel so much better. Kathy Lette: And also lean into the sisterly comradery. Jane Curry: Yes. Kathy Lette: Go out with your girlfriend as often. Which Jean and I do. Jean Kittson: Yes. Find beautiful women like yourselves and ring them up or have a glass of champagne. Kathy Lette: Yes. The human wonder bras uplifting, supportive, and make each other look bigger and better. Which is what Jean has done for us today. Thank you. Jean Kittson: Oh no, you two have, you've both been fantastic been great fun. Thank you so much. What a great conversation. Kathy Lette: Thank you Jean. Jean Kittson: Thanks. Kathy Lette: Sisterhood rules. ALL: Sisterhood Rules! Jean Kittson: Thank you to Kathy Lette and Jane Curry. You've been listening to DARE: The Time of Your Life, brought to you by Australian seniors. Please leave a review and share this show with someone you know. Visit seniors.com au/podcast for more episodes. I’m Jean Kittson. Thank you. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This week we are digging into our broadcast archives to bring you an encore of an episode that is perfect in this 250th-annivesary year of the start of the American Revolution.Walter's guest is Dr. Woody Holton of the University of South Carolina, and they will be talking about Horton's book, Liberty is Sweet: The Hidden History of the American Revolution. (2021, Simon & Schuster).Liberty is Sweet has been described as a “deeply researched and bracing retelling” of the Revolution, which shows how the Founders were influenced by overlooked Americans—women, Native Americans, African Americans, and religious dissenters.

Scott Scovill shares his journey from a young man sneaking onto a U2 tour to a successful entrepreneur and leader in the entertainment industry. He discusses the importance of tenacity, character, and love in business and life, and offers insights into managing multiple companies, building a strong team, and pursuing dreams with relentless passion. His new book Tenacious: The Art of Relentlessly Pursuing Your Wildest Dreams, published by Simon & Schuster, is now available. Sound Bites: "I dropped everything to sneak onto the U2 tour" "The power in my life is tenacity"

In this episode of Capital for Good, we speak with John Fabian Witt, the Allen H. Duffy Class of 1960 Professor of Law at Yale Law School, a professor of history at Yale, and one of the country's most distinguished legal historians. The author of numerous award-winning books, including American Contagions: Epidemics and the Law from Smallpox to COVID-19 and Lincoln's Code: The Laws of War in American History, Witt joins us to discuss his latest, The Radical Fund: How a Band of Visionaries and a Million Dollars Upended America (Simon & Schuster, 2025). We begin with the genesis — of the Garland Fund and Witt's interest in writing about it. He explains that most histories of the Brown v. Board of Education Supreme Court case include mention of a "funny little foundation" that gave early support to the NAACP, launching the legal campaign that would culminate in the desegregation landmark. Witt discovered, however, that Brown was "just the tip of the iceberg." The Garland Fund — named for the young idealist Charles Garland, who at twenty-one refused a million-dollar inheritance — in fact had its fingerprints on a sweeping range of progressive movements in the United States that would shape American democracy. And Witt notes, the conditions of 1920s America that shaped the fund's creation — deep economic inequality, declining labor unions, surging ethno-nationalism, immigration backlash, threats to free speech — look "astonishingly like 2020s America." The fund would come to be known officially as the American Fund for Public Service.  We discuss the fund's three principal focus areas — labor, civil liberties, and civil rights — and the extraordinary cast assembled by inaugural director Roger Baldwin, founder of the ACLU, to govern it, including labor leader (and New Deal "industrial democracy" architect) Sidney Hillman; James Weldon Johnson of the NAACP; and editors from The Nation and The New Republic. We explore some of the initial tensions between the fund's labor and racial justice priorities, and the eventual fusion of the two via efforts like A. Philip Randolph's creation of the Brotherhood of Sleeping Car Porters, the all-Black union within the Pullman Car Company. Witt suggests that this marriage of civil rights and labor organizing — "working class solidarity across racial lines" — was a central contribution of the fund and its grantees. We also touch on the fund's intentionally unconventional approach to philanthropy. Conceived as a kind of "anti-Rockefeller Foundation," the Garland Fund had virtually no staff and was deeply conscious of the "paradox" of "using a Wall Street fortune to attack capitalism and inequality." Many of the fund's progressive investments failed, and others would take years to come to fruition, paying dividends in the newly "plastic" political landscape of the Great Depression.  We conclude with lessons for today from the Garland Fund's experience. Witt asks, if the industrial union was the unit "well suited to manage mass production capitalism" and therefore "responsible for a good deal of equalization of the American economy" for much of the 20th century — what is the 21st century equivalent. "What's going to connect people together and to their economic futures such that some kind of decent political coalition of people who feel the security sufficient to be good citizens can come out of it?" This episode of Capital for Good was recorded at a book talk hosted by the Open Society Foundations in New York. Mentioned in this Episode:  The Radical Fund: How a Band of Visionaries and a Million Dollars Upended America, (Simon & Schuster, 2025) Lincoln's Code: The Laws of War in American History, (Simon & Schuster, 2012) How to Save the American Experiment, (New York Times, 2025) NAACP CIO ACLU

Can Ketamine Help Benzodiazepine Withdrawal? - Melissa Bond & Dr. Amy de la Garza In this episode of The Psychedelic Podcast, Paul F. Austin speaks with Melissa Bond and Dr. Amy de la Garza about the hidden risks of benzodiazepines, the reality of dependency, and what recovery can require. Find full show notes and links here: https://thethirdwave.co/podcast/episode-350/?ref=278  Melissa shares her experience of becoming dependent on prescribed medication, and the physical and emotional challenges of withdrawal. Dr. de la Garza brings a clinical perspective, explaining how benzodiazepines affect the nervous system and why withdrawal can be prolonged and destabilizing. The conversation also looks at where conventional care often falls short, and how more integrative approaches are beginning to emerge. This includes the use of low-dose ketamine as a potential tool to support the nervous system during withdrawal, particularly in more complex or prolonged cases. Melissa Bond is a narrative journalist and poet. Her memoir Blood Orange Night, which chronicles her experience with benzodiazepine dependency, was published by Simon & Schuster and recognized by The New York Times as one of the best audiobooks of 2022. Her work has appeared on PBS, The New York Times Podcast, RadioWest, and TEDx. Dr. Amy de la Garza is a board-certified physician in Family and Addiction Medicine, a certified Functional Medicine practitioner, and co-founder of Nosis Health, a virtual outpatient addiction medicine platform. Her work integrates functional, lifestyle, and emerging therapies, including ketamine-assisted treatment, to support recovery. Highlights: Melissa Bond's experience with benzodiazepine dependency and withdrawal How prescribed use can gradually lead to physical dependence Why benzodiazepine withdrawal can be prolonged and destabilizing The neurological effects of benzodiazepines on the nervous system Gaps in conventional approaches to anxiety and addiction treatment The role of functional and lifestyle medicine in recovery How low-dose ketamine is being explored to support withdrawal What a more integrative, whole-person model of care can look like Episode Links: Melissa's memoir, "Blood Orange Night" Dr. Amy de la Garza's Website Nosis.health Episode Sponsors: The Microdosing Practitioner Certification at Psychedelic Coaching Institute. The Practitioner Certification Program by Third Wave's Psychedelic Coaching Institute. Golden Rule - Get a lifetime discount of 10% with code THIRDWAVE at checkout Disclaimer: This content is for educational, informational, and entertainment purposes only. We do not promote or encourage the illegal use of any controlled substances. Nothing said here is medical or legal advice. Always consult a qualified medical or mental health professional before making decisions related to your health. The views expressed herein belong to the speaker alone, and do not reflect the views of any other person, company, or organization. Third Wave occasionally partners with or shares information about other people, companies, and/or providers. While we work hard to only share information about ethical and responsible third parties, we can't and don't control the behavior of, products and services offered by, or the statements made by people, companies, or providers other than Third Wave. Accordingly, we encourage you to research for yourself, and consult a medical, legal, or financial professional before making decisions in those areas. Third Wave isn't responsible for the statements, conduct, services, or products of third parties. If we share a coupon code, we may receive a commission from sales arising from customers who use our coupon code. No one is required to use our coupon codes.

To kick off National Poetry Month, former poet laureate Ada Limón discusses her new book, Against Breaking: On the Power of Poetry, and listeners share what poetry means to them. Cover courtesy of Simon & Schuster

Join hosts J.D. Barker, Christine Daigle, Jena Brown, JP Rindfleisch, and Kevin Tumlinson as they discuss the week's entertainment news, including stories about Amazon categories, Spotify, and Simon & Schuster's new CEO. Then, stick around for a chat with J.R. Thornton! J.R. Thornton is a writer and the author of two novels, Beautiful Country, and Lucien. Born in London, UK, J. R. graduated from Harvard College in 2014, where he studied history, English, and Chinese. An internationally ranked junior tennis player, he later competed for Harvard and on the men's professional circuit. Shortly after graduating from Harvard, J. R. published his first novel, Beautiful Country, loosely inspired by experiences he had living in Beijing as a teenager. The novel became a best-seller in China, and the film rights were subsequently purchased by WME/IMG. J. R. returned to China in 2016 as a member of the inaugural class of Schwarzman Scholars, earning an M.A. from Tsinghua University. He speaks Chinese and Italian, and lives in Milan, where he works for AC Milan. Lucien is his second novel. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Get Dr. Vonda's latest insights on strength, bone health, longevity, and aging with power delivered straight to your inbox. Join her free health & longevity newsletter here: https://www.drvondawright.com/resources/aging-longevity What if the single most powerful window to shape your child's lifelong health isn't in the pediatrician's office, it's in the nine months before they're even born? In this episode, I sit down with Jessie Inchauspé, the French biochemist and NYT bestselling author known worldwide as the Glucose Goddess, to explore her groundbreaking new book Nine Months That Count Forever and why pregnancy nutrition is the most underestimated conversation in medicine today. What we cover: - How four pillars of pregnancy nutrition: choline, protein, omega-3s, and glucose control actively shape your baby's brain and metabolic health. - Why 90% of pregnant mothers lack enough choline, and how this egg yolk nutrient shapes your baby's brain cells and cognitive performance. - How glucose spikes pass to your baby in utero, programming greater vulnerability to obesity and diabetes for life. - Why building muscle before pregnancy protects both mother and baby from excessive blood sugar spikes. - What to do when first-trimester nausea strikes, and why one extra egg yolk a day can still make a difference.   About Jessie Inchauspe: Jessie Inchauspé is a French biochemist, founder, and international bestselling author. She has devoted her career to translating cutting-edge science into easy tips to help people improve their physical and mental health. Through her books Glucose Revolution and The Glucose Goddess Method, which have sold over 3 million copies in 43 languages, she has reshaped the global conversation around blood sugar. Nine Months That Count Forever, her latest, breaks down the complex topic of pregnancy nutrition. Jessie is the founder of the wildly popular social community @GlucoseGoddess, where she reaches over seven million people across platforms. She holds a BSc in mathematics from King's College, London, and an MSc in biochemistry from Georgetown University. Connect with Jessie Inchauspe: Website: https://www.glucosegoddess.com/pages/9-months-that-count-forever Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/glucosegoddess/ ▶️Jessie's new YouTube series on "What I (Glucose Goddess) Eat in a Day: Pregnancy Edition", a preview of what is to come in her new book.

On February 28, 2026, Ali Khamenei was assassinated. He was killed in a joint American and Israeli airstrike, in a bunker so deep the elevator took five minutes to reach it, at a meeting with senior advisers whose location intelligence services had tracked for months. The infrastructure that made this targeted assassination possible—the human networks engaged in the patient penetration of one of the most hostile intelligence environments on earth—had been built over more than two decades. Today, Yonah Jeremy Bob joins Mosaic's editor Jonathan Silver to delve into how the Mossad build that infrastructure. Bob is the senior military and intelligence analyst for the Jerusalem Post and has deep access to the Israeli intelligence community. His book Target Tehran, co-authored with Ilan Evyatar and published by Simon & Schuster in 2023, was named a top book of the year by the Wall Street Journal. When Prime Minister Netanyahu was photographed in his war room during Operation Midnight Hammer in June 2025, a copy of Target Tehran was visible on the table in front of him. Bob also has a forthcoming book with the Wall Street Journal's Elliot Kaufman, titled In the War Room: The Inside Story of Israel's Fight Against Hamas and the Iranian Axis. Before the airstrikes, there was a decades-long effort to recruit agents inside the nuclear program, to infiltrate Iran's supply chains, and to track and, when necessary, to assassinate the Iranian officials and weapons producers who posed the greatest threat to Israel and America. This episode examines three operations in depth—the 2018 theft of Iran's nuclear archive, the assassination of the weapons-program chief Mohsen Fakhrizadeh, and the infiltration of the supply chain for the Natanz nuclear complex—and asks what Israeli human intelligence is contributing to Operations Roaring Lion and Epic Fury. This episode of the Tikvah Podcast is generously sponsored by Dr. Michael Schmerin and Family. If you are interested in sponsoring an episode of the Tikvah Podcast, we invite you to join the Tikvah Ideas Circle. Visit tikvah.org/circle to learn more and join.

This spring, I'm going to try a small experiment: a live studio for writers actively building a novel, where I'll read your opening pages and we'll work on them together, live.____Atelier Skye: The Studio for Serious NovelistsHere's what this will look like:Twelve novelists. Six Saturdays. Live sessions. Direct developmental critique.No recordings. No passive consumption. A working studio.This studio is designed for writers who:* Are actively drafting a novel* Have 8–10 strong opening pages ready* Want developmental-level critique* Care about both craft and industry positioning* Take their work seriouslyThis is not an introductory writing class.It is a professional room.REGISTER here: https://buy.stripe.com/fZu5kCgtd5PY1nV1Fs8EM00Enrollment is first come, first served until the atelier reaches 12 writers.About the Studio Lead:I'm Evelyn Skye, a New York Times bestselling novelist and the author of eleven books, published by major houses including Penguin Random House, Simon & Schuster, HarperCollins, Macmillan, and Disney, and translated into sixteen languages worldwide. I have also written for Netflix in a literary-film collaboration starring Millie Bobby Brown, Angela Bassett, and Robin Wright.My work has been featured in PEOPLE, Newsweek, The Hollywood Reporter, CBS New York, The Morning Blend on NBC, The Mirror, Woman's World Magazine, South China Morning Post, Book Riot, PopSugar, Bustle, Psychology Today, Mochi Magazine, and more.I've been a featured speaker and guest of honor around the world—at the Festival du Livre de Paris, the Danish Fantasy Festival, San Diego Comic Con, Emerald City Comic Con, and more. I have a Bachelor's degree in Russian literature from Stanford University and a J.D. from Harvard Law School.Over the past decade, I've developed a deep understanding of what makes a manuscript not only compelling on the page, but viable in the marketplace.In this studio, I bring that experience directly to your opening pages.More details about the studio at:https://www.creativeinspiredalive.com/p/the-studio-for-serious-novelists-writing-workshop This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.creativeinspiredalive.com/subscribe

How can trauma become a catalyst for creative transformation? What lessons can indie authors learn from the music industry's turbulent journey through technological disruption? With Jack Williamson. In the intro, Why recipes for publishing success don't work and what to do instead [Self-Publishing with ALLi Podcast]; Why your book isn't selling: metadata [Novel Marketing Podcast]; Creating a successful author business [Fantasy Writers Toolshed Podcast]; Bones of the Deep – J.F. Penn. Today's show is sponsored by ProWritingAid, writing and editing software that goes way beyond just grammar and typo checking. With its detailed reports on how to improve your writing and integration with writing software, ProWritingAid will help you improve your book before you send it to an editor, agent or publisher. Check it out for free or get 15% off the premium edition at www.ProWritingAid.com/joanna This show is also supported by my Patrons. Join my Community at Patreon.com/thecreativepenn Jack Williamson is a psychotherapist, coach, and bestselling author who spent nearly two decades as a music industry executive. He's the founder of Music & You, his latest nonfiction book is Maybe You're The Problem, and he also writes romance under A.B. Jackson. You can listen above or on your favorite podcast app or read the notes and links below. Here are the highlights and the full transcript is below. Show Notes Finding post-traumatic growth and meaning after bereavement, and using tragedy as a catalyst for creative transformation Why your superpower can also be your Achilles heel, and how indie authors can overcome shiny object syndrome Three key lessons from the music industry: embracing change, thinking creatively about marketing, and managing pressure for better creativity The A, B, C technique for PR interviews and why marketing is storytelling through different mediums How to deal with judgment and shame around AI in the author community by understanding where people sit on the opinion-belief-conviction continuum Three AI developments coming from music to publishing: training clauses in contracts, one-click genre adaptation, and licensed AI-generated video adaptations You can find Jack at JackWilliamson.co.uk and his fiction work at ABJackson.com. Transcript of the interview with Jack Williamson Jo: Jack Williamson is a psychotherapist, coach, and bestselling author who spent nearly two decades as a music industry executive. He's the founder of Music & You, his latest nonfiction book is Maybe You're The Problem, and he also writes romance under A.B. Jackson. Welcome to the show. Jack: Thank you so much for having me, Jo. It's a real honour to be on your podcast after listening all of these years. Jo: I'm excited to talk to you. We have a lot to get into, but first up— Tell us a bit more about you and why get into writing books after years of working in music. Jack: I began my career at the turn of the millennium, basically, and I worked for George Michael and Mariah Carey's publicist, which I'm sure you can imagine was quite the introduction to the corporate world. From there I went on to do domestic and international marketing for a load of massive artists at Universal, so the equivalent of the top five publishers in the publishing world that we all work in. Then from there I had a bit of a challenge. In December 2015, I lost my brother, unfortunately to suicide. For any listener or any person that's gone through a traumatic event, it can really make you reassess everything, make you question life, make you question your purpose. When I went through that, I was thinking, well, what do I want to do? What do I want out of life? So I went on this journey for practically the next ten years. I retrained to be a psychotherapist. I created a bucket list—a list of all the things that I thought maybe my brother would've wanted to do but didn't do. One of the things was scatter his ashes at the Seven Wonders of the world. Then one of the items on my bucket list was to write a book. The pandemic hit. It was a challenge for all of us, as you've spoken about so much on this wonderful podcast. I thought, well, why not? Why not write this book that I've wanted to write? I didn't know when I was going to do it because I was always so busy, and then the pandemic happened and so I wrote a book. From there, listening to your wonderful podcast, I've learned so much and been to so many conferences and learned along the way. So now I've written five books and released three. Jo: That's fantastic. I mean, regular listeners to the show know that I talk about death and grief and all of this kind of thing, and it's interesting that you took your brother's ashes to the Seven Wonders of the world. Death can obviously be a very bad, negative thing for those left behind, but it seems like you were able to reframe your brother's experience and turn that into something more positive for your life rather than spiralling into something bad. So if people listening are feeling like something happens, whether it's that or other things— How can we reframe these seemingly life-ending situations in a more positive way? Jack: It is very hard and there's no one way to do it. I think as you always say, I never want to tell people what to do or what to think. I want to show them how to think and how they can approach things differently or from a different perspective. I can only speak from my journey, but we call it in therapeutic language, post-traumatic growth. It is, how do you define it so it doesn't define you? Because often when you have a bereavement of a loved one, a family member, it can be very traumatic, but how can you take meaning and find meaning in it? There's a beautiful book called Man's Search for Meaning, and the name of the author escapes me right now, but he says— Jo: Viktor Frankl. Jack: Yes. Everyone quotes it as one of their favourite books, and one of my favourite lines is, “Man can take everything away from you, apart from the ability to choose one thought over the other.” I think it's so true because we can make that choice to choose what to think. So in those moments when we are feeling bad, when we're feeling down, we want to honour our feelings, but we don't necessarily want to become them. We want to process that, work through, get the support system that we need. But again, try to find meaning, try to find purpose, try to understand what is going on, and then pay it forward. Irrespective of your belief system, we all yearn for purpose. We all yearn for being connected to something bigger than ourselves. If we can find that through bereavement maybe, or through a traumatic incident, then hopefully we can come through the other side and have that post-traumatic growth. Jo: I love that phrase, post-traumatic growth. That's so good. Obviously people think about post-traumatic anything as like PTSD—people immediately think a sort of stress disorder, like it's something that makes things even worse. I like that you reframed it in that way. Obviously I think the other thing is you took specific action. You didn't just think about it. You travelled, you retrained, you wrote books. So I think also it's not just thinking. In fact, thinking about things can sometimes make it worse if you think for too long, whereas taking an action I think can be very strong as well. Jack: Ultimately we are human beings as opposed to human doings, but actually being a human doing from time to time can be really helpful. Actually taking steps forward, doing things differently, using it as a platform to move forward and to do things that maybe you didn't before. When you are confronted with death, it can actually make you question your own mortality and actually question, am I just coasting along? Am I stuck in a rut? Could I be doing something differently? One of the things that bereavement, does is it holds a mirror up to ourselves and it makes us question, well, what do we want from our life? Are we here to procreate? Are we here to make a difference? Some of us can't procreate, or some of us choose not to procreate, but we can all make a difference. And it's, how do we do that? Where do we do that? When do we do that? Jo: That's interesting. I was thinking today about service and gratitude. I'm doing this Master's and I was reading some theology stuff today, and service and gratitude, I think if you are within a religious tradition, are a normal part of that kind of religious life. Whether it's service to God and gratitude to God, or service and gratitude to others. I was thinking that these two things, service and gratitude, can actually really help reframe things as well. Who can we serve? As authors, we're serving our readers and our community. What can we be grateful about? That's often our readers and our community as well. So I don't know, that helped me today—thinking about how we can reframe things, especially in the world we're in now where there's a lot of anger and grief and all kinds of things. Jack: That's what we've got to look at. We are here to serve. Again, that can take different shapes, different forms. Some of us work in the service industry. I provide a service as a psychotherapist, you serve your listeners with knowledge and information that you gather and dispense through the research you do or the guests you have on. We serve readers of the different genres that we write in. It's what ways can we serve, how can we serve? Again, I think we all, if we can and when we can, should pay it forward. Someone said this to me once in the music industry: be careful who you meet on the way up and how you treat them on the way up, because invariably you'll meet them on the way down. So if you can pay forward that kindness, if you can be kind, considerate, and treat people how you want to be treated, that is going to pay dividends in the long run. It may not come off straight away, but invariably it will come back to you in some way, shape, or form in a different way. Jo: I've often talked about social karma and karma in the Hindu sense—the things that you do come back to you in some other form. Possibly in another life, which I don't believe. In terms of, I guess, you didn't know what was going to happen to your brother, and so you make the most of the life that we have at the moment because things change and you just don't know how things are going to change. You talk about this in your book, Maybe You're The Problem, which is quite a confronting title. So just talk about your book, Maybe You're The Problem, and why you wrote that. Put it into context with the author community and why that might be useful. Jack: Thank you for flagging my book. I intentionally crossed out “maybe” on the merchandise I did as well, because in essence, we are our own problem. We can get in the way, and it's what happened to us when we grew up wasn't our fault, but what we do with it is our responsibility. We may have grown up in a certain period or a climate. We didn't necessarily choose to do that, but what we do with that as a result is up to us. So we can stay in our victimhood and we can blame our parents, or we can blame the generation we are in, or we can blame the city, the location—however, that is relinquishing your power. That is staying in a victim mindset rather than a survivor or a thriver mindset. So it's about how can we look at the different areas in our life. Whether that is conflict, whether that is imposter syndrome, whether that is the generation we're born into. We try to understand how that has shaped us and how we may be getting in our own way to stop us from growing, to stop us from expanding, and to see where our blind spots are, our limitations are, and how that may impact us. There's so much going on in the moment in the world, whether that is in the digital realm, whether that is in the geo-climate that we're in at the moment. Again, that's going to bring up a lot for us. How can we find solutions to those problems for us so that we continue to move forward rather than be restricted and hindered by them? Jo: Alright. Well let's get into some more specifics. You have been in the author community now for a while. You go to conferences and you are in the podcast community and all this kind of thing. What specific issues have you seen in the author community? Maybe around some of the things you've mentioned, or other things? How might we be able to deal with those? Jack: With authors, I think it is such a wonderful and unique industry that I have an honour and privilege of being a part of now. One of the main things I've learned is just how creative people are. Coming from a creative industry like the music industry, there is a lot of neurodivergence in the creative industries and in the author community. Whether that is autism, whether that is ADHD—that is a real asset to have as a superpower, but it can be an Achilles heel. So it's understanding—and I know that there is an overexposure of people labelling themselves as ADHD—but on the flip side to that, it's how can we look at what's going on for us? For ADHD, for example, there's a thing called shiny object syndrome. You've talked about this in the past, Joanna, where it's like a new thing comes along, be it TikTok, be it Substack, be it bespoke books, be it Shopify, et cetera. We can rush and quickly be like, “oh, let me do this, let me do that,” before we actually take the time to realise, is this right for me? Does this fit my author business? Does this fit where I'm at in my author journey? I think sometimes as authors, we need to not cave in to that shiny object syndrome and take a step back and think to ourselves, how does this serve me? How does this serve my career? How does this work for me if I'm looking at this as a career? If you're looking at it as a hobby, obviously it's a different lens to look through, but that's something that I would often make sure that we look at. One of the other things that really comes up is that in order for any of us to address our fears and anxieties, we need to make sure that we feel psychologically safe and to put ourselves in spaces and places where we feel seen, heard, and understood, which can help address some of the issues that I've just mentioned. Being in that emotionally regulated state when we are with someone we know and trust—so taking someone to a conference, taking someone to a space or a place where you feel that you can be seen, heard, and understood—can help us and allow us to embrace things that we perceive to be scary. That may be finding an author group, finding an online space where you can actually air and share your thoughts, your feelings, where you don't feel that you are being judged. Often it can be quite a judgmental space and place in the online world. So it's just finding your tribe and finding places where you can actually lean into that. So there'd be two things. Jo: I like the idea of the superpower and the Achilles heel because I also feel this when we are writing fiction. Our characters have strengths, but your fatal flaw is often related to your strength. Jack: Yes. Jo: For example, I know I am independent. One of the reasons I'm an independent author is because I'm super independent. But one of my greatest fears is being dependent. So I do lots of things to avoid being dependent on other people, which can lead me to almost damage myself by not asking for help or by trying to make sure that I control everything so I never have to ask anyone else to do something. I'm coming to terms with this as I get older. I feel like this is something we start to hit—I mean, as a woman after menopause—is this feeling of I might have to be dependent on people when I'm older. It's so interesting thinking about this and thinking— My independence is my strength. How can it also be my weakness? So what do you think about that? You're going to psychotherapist me now. Jack: I definitely won't, but it's interesting. Just talking about that, we all have wounds and we all have the shadow, as you've even written about in one of your books. And it's how that can come from a childhood wound where it's like we seek help and it's not given to us. So we create a belief system where I have to do everything myself because no one will help me. Or we may have rejection sensitivity, so we reject ourselves before others can reject us. So it's actually about trying, where we can, to honour our truths, honour that we may want to be independent, for example, but then realising that success leaves clues. I always say that if you are independent—and I definitely align a hundred percent with you, Joanna—I've had to work really hard myself in personal therapy and in business and life to realise that no human is an island and we can't all do this on our own. Yes, it's amazing with the AI agents now that can help us in a business capacity, but having those relationships that we can tap into—like you mentioned all of the people that you tap into—it's so important to have those. I always say that it's important to have three mentors: one person that's ahead of you (for me, that would be Katie Cross because she's someone that I find is an amazing author and we speak at least once a month); people that are at the same level as you that you can go on the journey together with (and I have an author group for that); and then someone that is perceived to be behind you or in a younger generation than you, because you can learn as much from them as they can learn from you. If you can actually tap into those people whilst honouring your independence, then it feels like you can still go on your own journey, but you can tap in and tap out as and when needed. Sacha Black will give you amazing insights, other people like Honor will give you amazing insights, but you can also provide that for them. So there's that safety of being able to do it on your own. But on the flip side, you still have those people that you can tap into as and when necessary as a sounding board, as information on how they were successful, and go from there. Jo: No, I like that. If you're new to the show, Sacha Black and Honor Raconteur have been on the show and they are indeed some of my best friends. So I appreciate that. I really like the idea of the three mentor idea. I just want to add to that because I do think people misunderstand the word mentor sometimes. You mentioned you speak to Katie Cross, but I've found that a lot of the mentors that I've had who are ahead of me have often been books. We mentioned the Viktor Frankl book, and if people don't know, he was Jewish and in the concentration camps and survived that. So it's a real survivor story. But to me, books have been mostly my mentors in terms of people who are ahead of me. We don't always need to speak to or be friends with our mentors. I think that's important too, right? Because I just get emails a lot that say, “Will you be my mentor?” And I don't think that's the point. Jack: Oh, I a hundred percent agree with you. If you don't have access to those mentors—like Oprah Winfrey is one of the people that I perceive as a mentor—I listen to podcasts, I read her books, I watch interviews. There is a way to absorb and acquire that information, and it doesn't have to be a direct relationship with them. It is someone that you can gain the knowledge and wisdom that they've imparted in whatever form you may consume it. Which is why I think it is important to have those three levels: that one that is above you that may be out of reach in terms of a human connection, but you can still access; then the people at the same level as you that you can have those relationships and grow with; and again, that one behind that you can help pave the way for them, but also learn from them as well. So a hundred percent agree that that mentor that you are looking for that may be ahead of you doesn't necessarily need to be someone that is in a real-world relationship. Jo: So let's just circle back to your music industry experience. You mentioned being on the sort of marketing team for some really big names in music, and I mean, it's kind of a sexy job really. It just sounds pretty cool, but of course the music industry has just as many challenges as publishing. What did you learn from working in the music industry that you think might be particularly useful for authors? Jack: The perception of reality was definitely a lot different. It does look sexy and glamorous, but the reality is similar to going to conferences. It's pretty much flight, hotel, and dark rooms with terrible air conditioning that you spend a lot of time in. So sorry to burst the illusion. But I mean, it does have its moments as well. There is so much I've learned over the years and there's probably three things that stand out the most. The first one was I entered the industry right at the height of the music industry. In 2000, 2001. That was when Napster really exploded and it decimated the music industry. It wiped half the value in the space of four years. Then the music industry was trying to shut it down, throwing legal, throwing everything at it, but it was like whack-a-mole. As soon as one went down such as Napster, ten others popped up like Kazaa. So you saw that the old guard wasn't willing to embrace change. They weren't willing to adapt. They assumed that people wanted the formats of CDs, vinyls, cassettes, and they were wrong. Yes, people wanted music, but they actually wanted the music. They didn't care about the format, they just wanted the access. So that was one of the really interesting things that I learned, because I was like, you have to embrace change. You can't ignore it. You can't push it away, push it aside, because it's coming whether you like it or not. I think thankfully the music industry has learned as AI's coming, because now you have to embrace it. There's a lot of legal issues that have been going on at the moment with rights, which you've covered about the Anthropic case and so on. It's such a challenge, and I just think that's the first one. The second one I learned was back in 2018. There was an artist I worked on called Freya Ridings. At that time I was working at an independent record label rather than one of the big three major record labels. She had great songs and we were up against one of the biggest periods of the year and trying to make noise. At the time, Love Island was the biggest TV show on, and everyone wanted to be on it in terms of getting their music synced in the scenes. We were just like, we are never going to compete. So we thought, we need to be clever here. We need to think differently. What we did is we found out what island the show was being recorded on, and we geo-targeted our ads just to that island because we knew the sync team were going to be on there. So we just went hard as nails, advertised relentlessly, and we knew that the sync people would then see the adverts. As a result of that, Freya got the sync. It became the biggest song that season on Love Island, back when it was popular. As a result of that, we built from there. We were like, right, we can't compete with the majors. We have to think differently. We need to do things differently. We need to be creative. It wasn't an easy pathway. That year there were only two other songs that were independent that reached the top 10. So we ended up becoming a third and the biggest song that year. The reason I'm saying that is we can't compete with the major publishers. But the beauty of the independent author community is because we have smaller budgets—most of us, not all of us, but most of us—we have to think differently. We have to make our bang for our buck go a lot further. So it's actually— How can we stay creative? How can we think differently? What can we do differently? So that would be the second thing. Then the third main lesson that I learned, and this is more on the creative side, is that pressure can often work against you, both in a business sense, but especially creativity. I've seen so many artists over the years have imposed deadlines on them to hand in their albums, and it's impacted the quality of their output. Once it's handed in, the stress and the pressure is off, and then you realise that actually those artists end up creating the best material that they have, and then they rush to put it on. Whether that's Mariah Carey's “We Belong Together,” Adele with her song “Hello,” Taylor Swift did the same with “Shake It Off”—they're just three examples. The reason is that pressure keeps us in our beta brainwave state, which is our rational, logical mind. For those of us that are authors that are writing fiction, or even if we are creating stories in our nonfiction work to deliver a point, we need to be in that creative mindset. So we need to be in the alpha and the gamma brain state. Because our body works on 90-minute cycles known as our ultradian rhythm, we need to make sure that we honour our cycle and work with that. If we go past that, our creativity and our productivity is going to go down between 60% and 40% respectively. So as authors, it's important—one, to apply the right amount of pressure; two, to work in breaks; and three, to know what kind of perspective we're looking at. Do we need to be rational and logical, or do we need to be creative? And then adjust the sails accordingly. Jo: That's all fantastic. I want to come back on the marketing thing first—around what you did with the strategic marketing there and the targeted ads to that island. That's just genius. I feel like a lot of us, myself included, we struggle to think creatively about marketing because it's not our natural state. Of course, you've done a lot of marketing, so maybe it comes more naturally to you. I think half the time we don't even use the word creative around marketing, when you're not a marketeer. What are some ways that we can break through our blocks around marketing and try to be more creative around that? Jack: I would challenge a lot of authors on that presumption, because as authors we're in essence storytellers, and to tell a story is creative. There's a great quote: “One death is a tragedy. A thousand deaths is a statistic.” If you can create a story, a compelling narrative about a death in the news, it's going to pull at the heartstrings of people. It's going to really resonate and get with them. Whereas if you are just quoting statistics, most people switch off because they become desensitised to it. So I think because we can tell stories, and that's the essence of what we do, it's how can we tell our story through the medium of social media? How can we tell a story through our creative ads that we then put out onto Facebook or TikTok or whatever platform that we're putting them out—BookBub, et cetera? How can we create a narrative that garners the attention? If we are looking at local media or traditional media, how can we do that? How can we get people to buy in to what we're selling? So it's about having different angles. For me with my new romance book, Stolen Moments, one of the stories I had that really has helped me get some coverage and PR is we recorded the songs next door to the Rolling Stones. Now that was very fortunate timing, very fortunate. But everyone's like, “Oh my God, you recorded next door to the Rolling Stones?” So it's like, well, how can you bring in these creative nuggets that help you to find a story? Again, marketing is in essence telling a story, albeit through different mediums and forms. So it's just how can you package that into a marketable product depending on the platform in which you're putting it out on. Jo: I think that's actually hilarious, by the way, because what you hit on there, as someone with a background in marketing, your story about “we recorded an album for the book next door to the Rolling Stones”—it's got nothing to do with the romance. Jack: Oh, the romance is that the pop star in the book writes and records songs. Jo: Yes, I realised that. But the fact is— For doing things like PR, it's the story behind the story. They don't care that you've written a romance. Jack: Yes. Jo: They're far more interested in you, the author, and other things. So I think what you just described there was a kind of PR hook that most of us don't even think about. Jack: I'm sure a lot of authors already know this, so it's a good reminder, and if you don't, it's great. It's called the A, B, C technique. When you get asked a question, you Answer the question. So that's A. You Build a bridge, and then you go to C, which is Covering one of your points. So whenever you get asked a question, have a list of things you want to get across in an interview. Then just make sure that you find that bridge between whatever the question is to cover off one of your points, and that's how you can do it. Because yes, you may be selling a story, like I said, about writing the songs, but then you can bridge it into actually covering and promoting whatever it is you're promoting. So I think that's always quite helpful to remember. Jo: Well, that's a good tip for things like coming on podcasts as well. I've had people on who don't do what you just mentioned and will just try and shoehorn things in in a more deliberate fashion, whereas other people, as you have just done with your romance there, bring it in while answering a question that actually helps other people. So I think that's the kind of thing we need to think about in marketing. Okay, so then let's come back to the embracing change, and as you mentioned, the AI stuff that's going on. I feel like there's so many “stories” around AI right now. There's a lot of stories being told on both sides—on the positive side, on the negative side—that people believe and buy into and may or may not be true. There's obviously a lot of anger. There's, I think, grief—a big thing that people might not even realise that they have. Can you talk about how authors might deal with what's coming up around the technological change around AI, and any of your personal thoughts as well? Jack: I was thinking about this a lot recently. I mean, I guess everyone is in their own ways and forms. One of the things that came up for me is we have genre expectations and we have generation expectations. When we look at genres, you will have different expectations from different genres. For romance, they want a happily ever after or a happy for now. For cosy mysteries, they expect the crime to be solved. So we as authors make sure we endeavour to meet those expectations. The challenge is that if we are looking at AI, we are all in our own generations. We might be in slightly different generations, but there are going to be different generation expectations from the Alpha generation that's coming up and the Beta generation that's just about to start this year or next year because they're going to come into the world where they don't know any different to AI. So they will have a different expectation than us. It will just be normal that there will be AI agents. It will just be normal that there are AI narrators. It will be normalised that AI will assist authors or assist everyone in doing their jobs. So again, it is a grieving period because we can long for what was, we can yearn for things that worked for us that no longer work for us—whether it's Facebook groups, whether it's the Kindle Rush. We can mourn the loss of that, but that's not coming back. I mean, sometimes there may be a resurgence, but essentially, we've got to embrace the change. We've got to understand that it's coming and it's going to bring up a lot of different emotions because you may have been beholden to one thing and you may be like, yes, I've now got my TikTok lives, and then all of a sudden TikTok goes away. I know Adam, when he was talking about it, he'll just find another platform. But there'll be a lot of people that are beholden to it and then they're like, what do I do now? So again, it's never survival of the fittest—it's survival of the most adaptable. I always use this metaphor where there are three people on three different boats. A storm comes. And the first, the optimist, is like, “Oh, it'll pass,” and does nothing. The pessimist complains about the storm and does nothing. But the realist will adjust the sails and use the storm to find its way to the other side, to get through. It's not going to be easy, but they're actually taking change and making change to get to where they need to go, rather than just expecting or complaining. I get it. We are not, and I hate the expression, “we're all in the same boat.” I call bleep on that. I'm not going to swear. We're not all in the same boat. We're all in the same storm, but different people are going through different things. For some, they can adjust and adapt really quickly like a speedboat. For others, they may be like Jack and Rose in the Titanic on that terrible prop where they're clinging to dear life and trying to get through the storm. So it's about how do I navigate this upcoming storm? What can I do within my control to get through the storm? For some it may be easier because they have the resources, or for some of us that love learning, it's easy to embrace change. For others that have a fear mindset and it's like, “Oh, something new, it's scary, I don't want to embrace it”—you are going to take longer. So you may not be the speedboat, but at some point we are going to have to embrace that change. Otherwise we're going to get left behind. So you need to look at that. Jo: The storm metaphor is interesting, and being in different boats. I feel I do struggle. I struggle with people who suddenly seem to be discovering the storm. I've been talking about AI now since 2016. That's a decade. Jack: Yes. Jo: Even ChatGPT has been around more than three years, and people come to me now and they're talking about stories that they've seen in the media that are just old now. Things have moved on so much. I feel like maybe I was on my boat and I looked through my telescope and I saw the storm. I've been talking about the storm and I've had my own moments of being in the middle of the storm. Now I definitely do struggle with people who just seem to have arrived without any knowledge of it before. I oscillate between being an optimist and a realist. I think I'm somewhere between the two, probably. But I think what is driving me a little crazy in the author community right now is judgment and shame. There are people who are judging other people, and there's shame felt by AI-curious or AI-positive people. So I want to help the people who feel shame in some way for trying new technology, but they still feel attacked. Then those people judge other authors for their choices to use technology. So how do you think we can deal with judgment and shame in the community? Which is a form of conflict, I guess. Jack: Of course. I think with that, there's another great PR quote: “If it bleeds, it leads.” Especially in this digital age, there's a lot of clickbait. So the more polarising, the more emotion-evoking the headline, the more likely you are to engage with that content—whether that is reading it or whether that's posting or retweeting, or whatever format you are consuming it on. So unfortunately, media has now become so much more polarising. It's dividing us rather than uniting us. So people are going to have stronger positions. There's so much even within this to look at. One is, you have to work out where people are on the continuum. Do they have an opinion on AI? Do they have a belief? Or do they have a conviction? Now you're not going to move someone that has a conviction about something, so it's not worth even engaging with them because they're immovable. Like they say, you shouldn't talk about sports, politics, and religion. There are certain subjects that may not be worth talking about, especially if they have a conviction. Because they may not even be able to agree to disagree. They may not be willing or able to hear you. So first and foremost, it's about understanding, well, where are those people sitting on the continuum of AI? Are they curious? Do they have an opinion, but they're open to hearing other opinions? Do they have a belief that could be changed or evolved if they find more information? That's where I think it is. It's not necessarily our jobs—even though you do an amazing job of it, Joanna—but a lot of people are undereducated on these issues or these new technologies. So in some cases it's just a case of a lack of education or them being undereducated. Hopefully in time they will become more and more educated. But again, it's how long is a piece of string? Will people catch up? Will they stay behind? Are they fearful? I guess because of social media, because of the media, as they say, if you can evoke fear in people, you can control them. You can control their perspectives. You can control their minds. So that's where we see it—a lot of people are operating from a fear mindset. So then that's when they project their vitriol in certain cases. If people want to believe a certain thing, that's their choice. I'm not here to tell people what to think. Like I said earlier, it's more about how to think. But I would just encourage people to find people that align with you. Do a sense test, like a litmus test, to find where they sit on the continuum and engage with those people that are open and have opinions or beliefs. But shy away or just avoid people that have convictions that maybe are the polar opposite of yours. Jo: It's funny, isn't it? We seem to be in a phase of history when I feel like you should be able to disagree with people and still be friends. Although, as you mentioned, there's certain members of my family where we just stay on topics of TV shows and movies or music, or what books are you reading? Like, we don't go anywhere near politics. So I do think that might be a rule also with the AI stuff. As you said, find a community, and there are plenty of AI-positive spaces now for people who do want to talk about this kind of stuff. I also think that, I don't know whether this is a tipping point this year, but certainly— I know people who are in bigger corporates where the message is now, “You need to embrace this stuff. It is now part of your job to learn how to use these AI tools.” So if that starts coming into people's day jobs, and also people who have, I don't know, kids at school or people at university who are embracing this more—I mean, maybe it is a generational thing. Jack: Yes. Look, there were so many people that were resistant to working from home, or corporations that were, and then the pandemic forced it. Now everyone's embraced it in some way, shape, or form. I mean, there are people that don't, but the majority of people—when something's forced on you, you have to adapt. So again, if those things are implemented in corporations, then you're going to see it. I'm seeing so many amazing new things in AI that have been implemented in the music industry that we'll see in the publishing industry coming down the road. That will scare a lot of people, but again, we have to embrace those things because they're coming and there's going to be an expectation—especially from the younger generations—that these things are available. So again, it's not first past the post, but if you can be ahead of the wave or at least on the wave, then you are going to reap the rewards. If you are behind the wave, you're going to get left behind. So that's my opinion. I'm not trying to encourage anyone to see from my lens, but at the same time, I do think that we need to be thinking differently. We need to always embrace change where we can, as we can, at the pace that we can. Jo: You mentioned there AI things coming down the road in the music industry. And now everyone's going, wait, what is coming? So tell us— What do you see ahead that you think might also shift into the author world? Jack: There are three things that I've seen. Two that have been implemented and one that's been talked about and worked on at the moment. The first, and this will be quite scary for people, is that major record labels—so think the major publishers on our side—they're all now putting clauses in their contracts that require the artists that sign with them to allow their works to be trained by their own AI models. So that is something that is now actually happening in record labels. I wouldn't be surprised, although I don't have insight into it, if Simon & Schuster, HarperCollins, et cetera, are potentially doing the same with authors that sign to them. So that's going to become more standardised. So that is on the major side. But then on the creative side, there are two things that really excite me. The music AI platforms that we're hearing about, the stories that we've seen in the press, and it's the fact that with a click of a button, you can recreate a song into a different genre. I find it so fascinating because if you think about that—turning a pop song into a country song or a rap song into a dance song—the possibilities that we have as authors with our books, if we wish to do so, are amazing. I just think, for example, with your ARKANE series, Joanna, imagine clicking a button and just with one click you can take Morgan Sierra and turn her into a romantic lead in a romance book. Jo: See, it's so funny because I personally just can't imagine that because it's not something I would write. But I guess one example in the romance genre itself is I know plenty of romance authors who write a clean and a spicy version of the same story, right? It is already happening in that way. It's just not a one-click. Jack: Well, I think you can also look at it another way. I think one of the most famous examples is Twilight. With Twilight and Stephenie Meyer, if she had the foresight—and I'm not saying she didn't, just to clarify—but fan fiction is such a massive sub-genre of works. And obviously from Twilight came 50 Shades of Gray. Imagine if she had the licensing rights like the NFTs, where she could have made money off of every sale. So that you could then, through works that you create and give licence, earn a percentage of every release, every sale, every consumption unit of your works. There are just so many possibilities where you can create, adapt, have spinoffs that can then build out your world. Obviously, there may need to be an approval process in there for continuity and quality control because you want to make sure you're doing that, but I think that has such massive potential in publishing if we wish to do so. Or like I said, change characters. Like Robert Langdon's character in Dan Brown's books—no longer being the kind of thriller, but maybe being a killer instead. There's so many possibilities. It's just, again, how to think, not what to think—how to think differently and how we can use that. So that's the second of three. Jo: Oh, before you move on, you did mention NFTs and I've actually been reading about this again. So I'm usually five years early. That's the general rule. I started talking about NFTs in mid-2021, and obviously there was a crypto crash, it goes up and down, blah, blah, blah. But forget the crypto side—on the blockchain side, digital originality, and exactly what you said about saying like, where did this originate? This is now coming back in the AI world. It could be that I really was five years early. So amusingly—and I'm going to link to it in the notes because I did a “Why NFTs Are Exciting for Authors” solo episode, I think in 2022—it may be that the resurgence will happen in the next year, and all those people who said I was completely wrong, that this may be coming back. Digital originality I think is what we're talking about there. But so, okay, so what was the other thing? Jack: So the third one is the one that I'm most excited about, but I think will be the most scary for people. Obviously consumption changes and formats change. Like I said, in music I've seen it all the time—whether it's vinyl to cassettes, to CDs, to downloads, to streaming. Again, there's different consumption of the same format, and we see that with books as well, obviously—hardbacks, paperbacks, eBooks, audiobooks. Now with the rise of AI, AI narration has made audiobooks so much more accessible for people. I know that there are issues with certain people not wanting to do it, or certain platforms not allowing AI narration to be uploaded unless it's their own. The next step is what I'm most excited about. What I'm seeing now in the music industry is people licensing their image to then recreate that as music videos because music videos are so expensive. One of my friends just shot a music video for two million pounds. I don't think many authors would ever wish to spend that. If you can license your image and use AI to create a three-minute music video that looks epic and just as real as humanly possible, imagine if those artists—or if we go a step further, those actors—license their image to then be used to adapt our books into a TV series or a film. So that then we are in a position where that is another format of consumption alongside an audiobook, a paperback, an eBook, hardcover, special edition, and so on and so forth. It potentially has the opportunity to open us up to a whole new world. Because yes, there are adaptations of books that we're seeing at the moment, but for those of us that are trying to get our content into different formats, this can be a new pathway. I'm going to make a prediction here myself, Joanna. Jo: Mm-hmm. Jack: I would say in the next five to ten years, there will be a platform akin to a Netflix, Amazon Prime, Disney Plus, Apple Plus, where you can license the rights to an image of an actor or an actress. Then with the technology—and you may need people to help you adapt your book into a TV series or a film—that can then be consumed. I just think the possibilities are endless. I mean, again, I think of your character and I'm like, oh, what would it be if Angelina Jolie licensed her image and you could have her play the lead character in your ARKANE series? I mean, again, the possibilities potentially are endless here. Jo: Well, and on that, if people think this won't happen—1776, I don't know if you've seen this, it's just being teased at the moment. Darren Aronofsky has made an American revolutionary story all with AI. So this is being talked about at the moment. It's on YouTube at the moment. The AI video is just extraordinary already, so I totally agree with you. I think things are going to be quite weird for a while, and it will take a while to get used to. You mentioned coming into the music industry in 2000, 2001—I started my work before the internet, and then the internet came along and lots of things changed. I mean, anyone who's older than 40, 45-ish can remember what work was like without the internet. Now we are moving into a time where it'll be like, what was it like before AI? And I think we'll look back and go like, why the hell did we do that kind of thing? So it is a changing world, but yes, exciting times, right? I think the other thing that's happening right now, even to me, is that things are moving so fast. You can almost feel like a kind of whiplash with how much is changing. How do we deal with the fast pace of change while still trying to anchor ourselves in our writing practice and not going crazy? Jack: Again, it's that everything everywhere all at once—you can get lost and discombobulated. I always say be the tortoise, not the hare—because you don't want to fly and die. You want pace and grace. Everyone will have a different pace. For some marathon runners, they can run a five-minute mile, some can run an eight-minute mile, some can run a twelve-minute mile. It's about finding the pace that works for you. Every one of us have different commitments. Every one of us have different ways we view the industry—some as a hobby, some as a business. So it's about honouring your needs, your commitment. Some of us, as you've had people on the podcast, some people are carers. They have to care. Some people are parents. Some people don't have those commitments and so can devote more time and then actually learn more, change more as a result. So again, it's about finding your groove, finding your rhythm, honouring that, and again, showing up consistently. Because motivation may get you started, but it's habit and discipline that sees you through. Keep that discipline, keep that pace and grace. Be consistent in what you can do. And know where you're at. Don't compare and despair, because again, if you look at someone else, they may be ahead of you, but the race is only with yourself in the end. So you've got to just focus on where you are at and am I in a better place than I was yesterday? Am I working on my business as well as in my business? How am I doing that? When am I doing that? And what am I doing that for? If you can be asking yourself those questions and making sure you're staying true to yourself and not burning out, making sure that you are honouring your other commitments, then I think you are going at the pace that feels right for you. Jo: Brilliant. Jo: Where can people find you and your books and everything you do online? Jack: Thank you so much for having me on, Joanna, today. You can find me on JackWilliamson.co.uk for all my nonfiction books and therapy work. Then for my fiction work, it is ABJackson.com, or ABJacksonAuthor on Instagram and TikTok. Jo: Well, thanks so much for your time, Jack. That was great. Jack: Thank you so much. The post Post-Traumatic Growth, Creative Marketing, And Dealing With Change with Jack Williamson first appeared on The Creative Penn.

February 20, 2026 ~ Jamie Edmonds and Lloyd Jackson speak with Simon Schuster, Capitol Reporter for Bridge Michigan. They discuss Jocelyn Benson's vision for high-speed rail and a statewide transit network. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See https://pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

It's been 30 years since award-winning author Anita Heiss made her debut on the Australian literary scene. She reveals the moment she finally felt she'd made it in the industry and why her powerful historical novel, Dirrayawadha, was one of the most challenging books of her career. Anita opens up about crafting a love story against the violence of the Bathurst War, and how she balances stories of trauma with scenes of profound love and joy. Plus, she shares about her forthcoming rom-com with a political heart, The Paradise Pact, and the insights she's learned from her latest role as publisher-at-large of Bundyi, a First Nations imprint from Simon & Schuster.   Dr Anita Heiss is an internationally published, award-winning author of over 20 books, including non-fiction, historical fiction, commercial women's fiction and children's novels. She is a proud member of the Wiradyuri Nation of central New South Wales and Publisher at Large of Bundyi, an imprint of Simon & Schuster cultivating First Nations talent. Today we're discussing her career, including her historical fiction novel, Dirrayawadha (Rise Up), about the Bathurst War of 1824, and her latest rom com, The Paradise Pact.  Find The Paradise Pact and Anita's other books at Booktopia or from your local bookshop or library.  Books & authors discussed in this episode: Who Am I? The Diary of Mary Talence, Sydney 1937 by Anita Heiss Not Meeting Mr Right by Anita Heiss  Secrets by Judy Morrison I Am Nannertgarrook by Tasma Walton  Robbie Arnott  Larissa Behrendt Tell Her She's Dreaming by Simone Amelia Jordan, from ep 106 It's Been a Pleasure Noni Blake by Claire Christian  The Pearl of Tagai Town by Lenora Thacker The Strangers by Katherena Vermette Test Cricket: A History by Tim Wigmore  The Graduate by Rebecca Lim  Upcoming events James is speaking at Fresh Voices: The Penguin Literary Prize Shortlist on Wednesday 11 March Ashley is on book tour across Australia with events in Canberra, Perth, Bowral, Hobart, Launceston, Brisbane, Melbourne, Mornington, Wollongong, the Central Coast, Sydney and Adelaide (and Darwin TBA) Ashley is Teaching Unexpected Editing Strategies in person at Avid Reader on Sunday 15 March  Ashley is at Manly Writers Festival on Friday 20 March  James is teaching Setting & Landscape for Writers at the Woolshed on Saturday 21 March Ashley is teaching Online: Crime Writing for Faber Academy starting 12 May Learn more about Ashley's thrillers, Dark Mode and Cold Truth, and get your copies from your local bookshop or library. Plus check out Like, Follow, Die from Audible or pre-order the book – out 24 February 2026! Learn more about James's award-winning novel Denizen and get your copy from your local bookshop or library.   Get in touch! ashleykalagianblunt.com jamesmckenziewatson.com Instagram: @akalagianblunt + @jamesmcwatson

This week we'll be talking with Charleston author Victoria Benton Frank about her new novel, The Violet Hour. Victoria was born in New York City, raised in Montclair, New Jersey, but considers herself to have dual residency in the Lowcountry. She is a graduate of the College of Charleston and the French Culinary Institute. Her mother was the late Dorothea Benton Frank, a best-selling novelist and native of Sullivan's Island.With the release of The Violet Hour (2026, Simon & Schuster), her second novel, she continues to hone her craft, this time with a story of grief and healing.

This week on Enjoying Orange Slices with Jeff & Ian

Oren Cass, founder and chief economist of American Compass and editor of The New Conservatives: Restoring America's Commitment to Family, Community, and Industry (Simon & Schuster, 2025), argues for a new approach to global trade, one based on balance.

On this week's episode of The Professional Noticer, Andy welcomes Pat Kelly—retired Hollywood screenwriter and debut novelist behind the upcoming thriller Rifle Season, already being hailed as "the first big thriller of 2026."  Tune in to hear Pat and Andy walk through the heart-pounding premise of Rifle Season. Listen as Pat explains the authenticity behind the hunting details, the character dynamics that drive the story, the almost-missed Glock safety error caught by publicist David Brown, and why Simon & Schuster and 20th TV are already all-in on this gripping new series. Pre-order "Rifle Season: A Thriller" on Amazon — Available January 27, 2026: https://amzn.to/48mxD8D

Mark interviews J.D. Barker about his writing and publishing journey and his many collaborations over the years, including with James Patterson, and the unique publishing and distribution collaboration with Simon & Schuster that combines the best of the self-publishing and the traditional publishing worlds. Prior to the interview, Mark shares comments from recent episodes, a personal update and a word about this episode's sponsor. This episode is sponsored by an affiliate link to Manuscript Report. Use code MARK10 at checkout and save 10% off your own personalized report. In their interview, Mark and J.D. talk about: How JD was always interested in writing including a little business endeavor he had when he was youngBeing told by his mother that writing is a fantastic hobby, but you have to get a "real job" - and following her advice The main day job he had, which he hated, and coming home at night to write How the first two decades he'd been writing he did ghost writing and did book-doctor sort of work Having written six different books that hit the New York Times bestseller list but had other people's names on the cover JD's wife coming up with a plan to get him to writing for himself How putting his feet to the coals was what JD really needed What it was like writing on his own The value that JD recognizes in the 20 years of writing other peoples' books Having Asperger's which often involves mimicking other people (which JD could do on paper, continuing to write in another person's voice) How ghostwriting for celebrities/NYT Bestselling authors can be very lucrative What it was like co-authoring with James Patterson Being the only guy who has ever gotten James Patterson to "pants" a novel, but how Patterson convinced him to outline, which he now does for certain projects What a typical work-day looks like for JD Making a change in terms of what time of day JD does interviews Working with a virtual assistant and the various PR agencies JD works with Switching over to paying for PR a la carte rather than a monthly retainer Selling more than half a million copies of his first self-published book, which caught the attention of agents That "taste" of being an indie author which mean a loss of freedom Creating his own unique path within publishing that's a blend of self-publishing and traditional publishing models The imprint JD has with Simon & Schuster - Hampton Creek Press How JD has done a number of recent co-authored titles under his imprint by paying the co-authors up front in a work-for-hire manner, which removes the complexity of paying royalties The way JD can pay it forward by helping the mentor the co-authors that he is working on Why JD gave away a skid of hardcover books at Reader Nation in Vegas Advice JD has about authors who are constantly "chasing each other" The unique marketing JD created for his book SOMETHING I KEEP UPSTAIRS that involved an overnight stay in a real haunted house What James Patterson did to get his book ALONG CAME A SPIDER onto the New York Times bestseller list And more... After the interview Mark reflects on a few of the things from the conversation that have inspired him in different ways.   Links of Interest: J.D. Barker's Website EP 445 - Overcoming The Self Sabotage From Buried Trauma with Andrea Torrey Balsara Manuscript Report (Mark's affiliate link - use MARK10 to save 10%) Buy Mark a Coffee Patreon for Stark Reflections Mark's YouTube channel ElevenLabs (AI Voice Generation - Affiliate link) Mark's Stark Reflections on Writing & Publishing Newsletter (Signup) An Author's Guide to Working With Bookstores and Libraries The Relaxed Author Buy eBook Direct Buy Audiobook Direct Publishing Pitfalls for Authors An Author's Guide to Working with Libraries & Bookstores Wide for the Win Mark's Canadian Werewolf Books This Time Around (Short Story) A Canadian Werewolf in New York Stowe Away (Novella) Fear and Longing in Los Angeles Fright Nights, Big City Lover's Moon Hex and the City Only Monsters in the Building The Canadian Mounted: A Trivia Guide to Planes, Trains and Automobiles Yippee Ki-Yay Motherf*cker: A Trivia Guide to Die Hard Merry Christmas! Shitter Was Full!: A Trivia Guide to National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation I Think It's A Sign That The Pun Also Rises   J.D. Barker (Jonathan Dylan Barker) is an international bestselling American author whose work has been broadly described as suspense thrillers, often incorporating elements of horror, crime, mystery, science fiction, and the supernatural.   The introductory, end, and bumper music for this podcast ("Laser Groove") was composed and produced by Kevin MacLeod of www.incompetech.com and is Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0  

On this episode of ‘The Write Question,' host Lauren Korn speaks with debut novelist Eliana Ramage, author of ‘To the Moon and Back' (Avid Reader Press, Simon & Schuster).

On this episode of ‘The Write Question,' host Lauren Korn speaks with debut novelist Eliana Ramage, author of ‘To the Moon and Back' (Avid Reader Press, Simon & Schuster).

Lisa Adler of Unity Books Wellington reviews Queen Esther by John Irving, published by Simon & Schuster.

Why do some romance authors build decades-long careers while others vanish after one breakout book? What really separates a throwaway pen name and rapid release strategy from a legacy brand and a body of work you're proud of? How can you diversify with trad, indie, non-fiction, and Kickstarter without burning out—or selling out your creative freedom? With Jennifer Probst. In the intro, digital ebook signing [BookFunnel]; how to check terms and conditions; Business for Authors 2026 webinars; Music industry and AI music [BBC; The New Publishing Standard]; The Golden Age of Weird. This podcast is sponsored by Kobo Writing Life, which helps authors self-publish and reach readers in global markets through the Kobo eco-system. You can also subscribe to the Kobo Writing Life podcast for interviews with successful indie authors. This show is also supported by my Patrons. Join my Community at Patreon.com/thecreativepenn Jennifer Probst is a New York Times, USA Today, and Wall Street Journal bestselling author of over 60 books across different kinds of romance as well as non-fiction for writers. Her latest book is Write Free. You can listen above or on your favorite podcast app or read the notes and links below. Here are the highlights, and the full transcript is below. Show Notes How Jennifer started writing at age 12, fell in love with romance, and persisted through decades of rejection A breakout success — and what happened when it moved to a traditional publisher Traditional vs indie publishing, diversification, and building a long-term, legacy-focused writing career Rapid-release pen names vs slow-burn author brands, and why Jennifer chooses quality and longevity Inspirational non-fiction for writers (Write Naked, Write True, Write Free) Using Kickstarter for special editions, re-releases, courses, and what she's learned from both successes and mistakes – plus what “writing free” really means in practice How can you ‘write free'? You can find Jennifer at JenniferProbst.com. Transcript of interview with Jennifer Probst Jo: Jennifer Probst is a New York Times, USA Today, and Wall Street Journal bestselling author of over 60 books across different kinds of romance as well as non-fiction for writers. Her latest book is Write Free. So welcome, Jennifer. Jennifer: Thanks so much, Joanna. I am kind of fangirling. I'm really excited to be on The Creative Penn podcast. It's kind of a bucket list. Jo: Aw, that's exciting. I reached out to you after your recent Kickstarter, and we are going to come back to that in a minute. First up, take us back in time. Tell us a bit more about how you got into writing and publishing. Jennifer: This one is easy for me. I am one of those rarities. I think that I knew when I was seven that I was going to write. I just didn't know what I was going to write. At 12 years old, and now this will kind of date me in dinosaur era here, there was no internet, no information on how to be a writer, no connections out there. The only game in town was Writer's Digest. I would go to my library and pore over Writer's Digest to learn how to be a writer. At 12 years old, all I knew was, “Oh, if I want to be a famous writer, I have to write a book.” So I literally sat down at 12 and wrote my first young adult romance. Of course, I was the star, as we all are when we're young, and I have not stopped since. I always knew, since my dad came home from a library with a box of romance novels and got in trouble with my mum and said, basically, “She's reading everything anyway, just let her read these,” I was gone. From that moment on, I knew that my entire life was going to be about that. So for me, it wasn't the writing. I have written non-stop since I was 12 years old. For me, it was more about making this a career where I can make money, because I think there was a good 30 years where I wrote without a penny to my name. So it was more of a different journey for me. It was more about trying to find my way in the writing world, where everybody said it should be just a hobby, and I believed that it should be something more. Jo: I was literally just going back in my head there to the library I used to go to on my way home from school. Similar, probably early teens, maybe age 14. Going to that section and… I think it was Shirley Conran. Was that Lace? Yes, Lace books. That's literally how we all learned about sex back in the day. Jennifer: All from books. You didn't need parents, you didn't need friends. Amazing. Jo: Oh, those were the days. That must have been the eighties, right? Jennifer: It was the eighties. Yes. Seventies, eighties, but mostly right around in the eighties. Oh, it was so… Jo: I got lost about then because I was reminiscing. I was also the same one in the library, and people didn't really see what you were reading in the corner of the library. So I think that's quite funny. Tell us how you got into being an indie. Jennifer: What had happened is I had this manuscript and it had been shopped around New York for agents and for a bunch of publishers. I kept getting the same exact thing: “I love your voice.” I mean, Joanna, when you talk about papering your wall with rejections, I lived that. The only thing I can say is that when I got my first rejection, I looked at it as a rite of passage that created me as a writer, rather than taking the perspective that it meant I failed. To me, perspective is a really big thing in this career, how you look at things. So that really helped me. But after you get like 75 of them, you're like, “I don't know how much longer I can take of this.” What happened is, it was an interesting story, because I had gone to an RWA conference and I had shopped this everywhere, this book that I just kept coming back to. I kept saying, “I feel like this book could be big.” There was an indie publisher there. They had just started out, it was an indie publisher called Entangled. A lot of my friends were like, “What about Entangled? Why don't you try more digital things or more indie publishers coming up rather than the big traditional ones?” Lo and behold, I sent it out. They loved the book. They decided, in February of 2012, to launch it. It was their big debut. They were kind of competing with Harlequin, but it was going to be a new digital line. It was this new cutting-edge thing. The book went crazy. It went viral. The book was called The Marriage Bargain, and it put me on the map. All of a sudden I was inundated with agents, and the traditional publishers came knocking and they wanted to buy the series. It was everywhere. Then it hit USA Today, and then it spent 26 weeks on The New York Times. Everybody was like, “Wow, you're this overnight sensation.” And I'm like, “Not really!” That was kind of my leeway into everything. We ended up selling that series to Simon & Schuster because that was the smart move for then, because it kind of blew up and an indie publisher at that time knew it was a lot to take on. From then on, my goal was always to do both: to have a traditional contract, to work with indie publishers, and to do my own self-pub. I felt, even back then, the more diversified I am, the more control I have. If one bucket goes bad, I have two other buckets. Jo: Yes, I mean, I always say multiple streams of income. It's so surprising to me that people think that whatever it is that hits big is going to continue. So you obviously experienced there a massive high point, but it doesn't continue. You had all those weeks that were amazing, but then it drops off, right? Jennifer: Oh my goodness, yes. Great story about what happened. So 26 weeks on The New York Times, and it was selling like hotcakes. Then Simon & Schuster took it over and they bumped the price to their usual ebook price, which was, what, $12.99 or something? So it's going from $2.99. The day that they did it, I slid off all the bestseller lists. They were gone, and I lost a lot of control too. With indies, you have a little bit more control. But again, that kind of funnels me into a completely different kind of setup. Traditional is very different from indie. What you touched on, I think, is the biggest thing in the industry right now. When things are hot, it feels like forever. I learned a valuable lesson: it doesn't continue. It just doesn't. Maybe someone like Danielle Steel or some of the other big ones never had to pivot, but I feel like in romance it's very fluid. You have genres hitting big, you have niches hitting big, authors hitting big. Yes, I see some of them stay. I see Emily Henry still staying—maybe that will never pause—but I think for the majority, they find themselves saying, “Okay, that's done now. What's next?” It can either hit or not hit. Does that make sense to you? Do you feel the same? Jo: Yes, and I guess it's not just about the book. It's more about the tactic. You mentioned genres, and they do switch a lot in romance, a lot faster than other genres. In terms of how we do marketing… Now, as we record this, TikTok is still a thing, and we can see maybe generative AI search coming on the horizon and agentic buying. A decade ago it might have been different, more Facebook ads or whatever. Then before that it might have been something else. So there's always things changing along the way. Jennifer: Yes, there definitely is. It is a very oversaturated market. They talk about, I don't know, 2010 to 2016 maybe, as the gold rush, because that was where you could make a lot of money as an indie. Then we saw the total fallout of so many different things. I feel like I've gone through so many ups and downs in the industry. I do love it because the longer you're around, the more you learn how to pivot. If you want this career, you learn how to write differently or do whatever you need to do to keep going, in different aspects, with the changes. To me, that makes the industry exciting. Again, perspective is a big thing. But I have had to take a year to kind of rebuild when I was out of contract with a lot of things. I've had to say, “Okay, what do you see on the horizon now? Where is the new foundation? Where do you wanna restart?” Sometimes it takes a year or two of, “Maybe I won't be making big income and I cut back,” but then you're back in it, because it takes a while to write a few new books, or write under a pen name, or however you want to pivot your way back into the industry. Or, like you were saying, diversifying. I did a lot of non-fiction stuff because that's a big calling for me, so I put that into the primary for a while. I think it's important for authors to maybe not just have one thing. When that one thing goes away, you're scrambling. It's good to have a couple of different things like, “Well, okay, this genre is dead or this thing is dead or this isn't making money. Let me go to this for a little while until I see new things on the horizon.” Jo: Yes. There's a couple of things I want to come back to. You mentioned a pen name there, and one of the things I'm seeing a lot right now—I mean, it's always gone on, but it seems to be on overdrive—is people doing rapid-release, throwaway pen names. So there's a new sub-genre, they write the books really fast, they put them up under whatever pen name, and then when that goes away, they ditch that pen name altogether. Versus growing a name brand more slowly, like I think you and I have done. Under my J.F. Penn fiction brand, I put lots of different sub-genres. What are your thoughts on this throwaway pen name versus growing a name brand more slowly? Jennifer: Well, okay, the first thing I'm goign to say is: if that lights people up, if you love the idea of rapid release and just kind of shedding your skin and going on to the next one, I say go for it. As long as you're not pumping it out with AI so it's a complete AI book, but that's a different topic. I'm not saying using AI tools; I mean a completely AI-written book. That's the difference. If we're talking about an author going in and, every four weeks, writing a book and stuff like that, I do eventually think that anything in life that disturbs you, you're going to burn out eventually. That is a limited-time kind of thing, I believe. I don't know how long you can keep doing that and create decent enough books or make a living on it. But again, I really try not to judge, because I am very open to: if that gives you joy and that's working and it brings your family money, go for it. I have always wanted to be a writer for the long term. I want my work to be my legacy. I don't just pump out books. Every single book is my history. It's a marking of what I thought, what I put out in the world, what my beliefs are, what my story is. It marks different things, and I'm very proud of that. So I want a legacy of quality. As I got older, in my twenties and thirties, I was able to write books a lot faster. Then I had a family with two kids and I had to slow down a little bit. I also think life sometimes drives your career, and that's okay. If you're taking care of a sick parent or there's illness or whatever, maybe you need to slow down. I like the idea of a long-term backlist supporting me when I need to take a back seat and not do frontlist things. So that's how I feel. I will always say: choose a long, organic-growth type of career that will be there for you, where your backlist can support you. I also don't want to trash people who do it differently. If that is how you can do it, if you can write a book in a month and keep doing it and keep it quality, go for it. Jo: I do have the word “legacy” on my board next to me, but I also have “create a body of work I'm proud of.” I have that next to me, and I have “Have you made art today?” So I think about these things too. As you say, people feel differently about work, and I will do other work to make faster cash rather than do that with books. But as we said, that's all good. Interestingly, you mentioned non-fiction there. Write Free is your latest one, but you've got some other writing books. So maybe— Talk about the difference between non-fiction book income and marketing compared to fiction, and why you added that in. Jennifer: Yes, it's completely different. I mean, it's two new dinosaurs. I came to writing non-fiction in a very strange way. Literally, I woke up on New Year's Day and I was on a romance book deadline. I could not do it. I'll tell you, my brain was filled with passages of teaching writing, of things I wanted to share in my writing career. Because again, I've been writing since I was 12, I've been a non-stop writer for over 30 years. I got to my computer and I wrote like three chapters of Write Naked (which was the first book). It was just pouring out of me. So I contacted my agent and I said, “Look, I don't know, this is what I want to do. I want to write this non-fiction book.” She's like, “What are you talking about? You're a romance author. You're on a romance deadline. What do you want me to do with this?” She was so confused. I said, “Yes, how do you write a non-fiction book proposal?” And she was just like, “This is not good, Jen. What are you doing?” Anyway, the funny story was, she said, “Just send me chapters.” I mean, God bless her, she's this wonderful agent, but I know she didn't get it. So I sent her like four chapters of what I was writing and she called me. I'll never forget it. She called me on the phone and she goes, “This is some of the best stuff I have ever read in my life. It's raw and it's truthful, and we've got to find a publisher for this.” And I was like, “Yay.” What happened was, I believe this was one of the most beautiful full circles in my life: Writer's Digest actually made me an offer. It was not about the money. I found that non-fiction for me had a much lower advance and a different type of sales. For me, when I was a kid, that is exactly what I was reading in the library, Writer's Digest. I would save my allowance to get the magazine. I would say to myself, “One day, maybe I will have a book with Writer's Digest.” So for me, it was one of the biggest full-circle moments. I will never forget it. Being published by them was amazing. Then I thought I was one-and-done, but the book just completely touched so many writers. I have never gotten so many emails: “Thank you for saying the truth,” or “Thank you for being vulnerable.” Right before it published, I had a panic attack. I told my husband, “Now everybody's going to know that I am a mess and I'm not fabulous and the world is going to know my craziness.” By being vulnerable about the career, and also that it was specifically for romance authors, it caused a bond. I think it caused some trust. I had been writing about writing for years. After that, I thought it was one-and-done. Then two or three years later I was like, “No, I have more to say.” So I leaned into my non-fiction. It also gives my fiction brain a rest, because when you're doing non-fiction, you're using a different part of your brain. It's a way for me to cleanse my palate. I gather more experiences about what I want to share, and then that goes into the next book. Jo: Yes, I also use the phrase “palate cleanser” for non-fiction versus fiction. I feel like you write one and then you feel like, “Oh, I really need to write the other now.” Jennifer: Yes! Isn't it wonderful? I love that. I love having the two brains and just giving one a break and totally leaning into it. Again, it's another way of income. It's another way. I also believe that this industry has given me so much that it is automatic that I want to give back. I just want to give as much as possible back because I'm so passionate about writing and the industry field. Jo: Well, interestingly though, Writer's Digest—the publisher who published that magazine and other things—went bankrupt in 2019. You've been in publishing a long time. It is not uncommon for publishers to go out of business or to get bought. Things happen with publishers, right? Jennifer: Yes. Jo: So what then happened? Jennifer: So Penguin Random House bought it. All the Writer's Digest authors did not know what they were going to do. Then Penguin Random House bought it and kept Writer's Digest completely separate, as an imprint under the umbrella. So Writer's Digest really hasn't changed. They still have the magazine, they still have books. So it ended up being okay. But what I did do is—because I sold Write Naked and I have no regrets about that, it was the best thing for me to do, to go that route—the second and the third books were self-published. I decided I'm going to self-publish. That way I have the rights for audio, I have the rights for myself, I can do a whole bunch of different things. So Write True, the second one, was self-published. Writers Inspiring Writers I paired up with somebody, so we self-published that. And Write Free, my newest one, is self-published. So I've decided to go that route now with my non-fiction. Jo: Well, as I said, I noticed your Kickstarter. I don't write romance, so I'm not really in that community. I had kind of heard your name before, but then I bought the book and joined the Kickstarter. Then I discovered that you've been doing so much and I was like, “Oh, how, why haven't we connected before?” It's very cool. So tell us about the Kickstarters you've done and what you know, because you've done, I think, a fiction one as well. What are your thoughts and tips around Kickstarter? Jennifer: Yes. When I was taking that year, I found myself kind of… let's just say fired from a lot of different publishers at the time. That was okay because I had contracts that ran out, and when I looked to see, “Okay, do we want to go back?” it just wasn't looking good. I was like, “Well, I don't want to spend a year if I'm not gonna be making the money anyway.” So I looked at the landscape and I said, “It's time to really pull in and do a lot more things on my own, but I've got to build foundations.” Kickstarter was one of them. I took a course with Russell Nohelty and Monica Leonelle. They did a big course for Kickstarter, and they were really the ones going around to all the conferences and basically saying, “Hey guys, you're missing out on a lot of publishing opportunities here,” because Kickstarter publishing was getting good. I took the course because I like to dive into things, but I also want to know the foundation of it. I want to know what I'm doing. I'm not one to just wing it when it comes to tech. So what happened is, the first one, I had rights coming back from a book. After 10 years, my rights came back. It was an older book and I said, “You know what? I am going to dip my foot in and see what kind of base I can grow there. What can I do?” I was going to get a new cover, add new scenes, re-release it anyway, right? So I said, “Let's do a Kickstarter for it, because then I can get paid for all of that work.” It worked out so fantastically. It made just enough for my goal. I knew I didn't want to make a killing; I knew I wanted to make a fund. I made my $5,000, which I thought was wonderful, and I was able to re-release it with a new cover, a large print hardback, and I added some scenes. I did a 10-year anniversary re-release for my fans. So I made it very fan-friendly, grew my audience, and I was like, “This was great.” The next year, I did something completely different. I was doing Kindle Vella back in the day. That was where you dropped a chapter at a time. I said, “I want to do this completely different kind of thing.” It was very not my brand at all. It was very reality TV-ish: young college students living in the city, very sexy, very angsty, love triangles, messy—everything I was not known for. Again, I was like, “I'm not doing a pen name because this is just me,” and I funnelled my audience. I said, “What I'm going to do is I'm going to start doing a chapter a week through Kindle Vella and make money there. Then when it's done, I'm going to bundle it all up and make a book out of it.” So I did a year of Kindle Vella. It was the best decision I made because I just did two chapters a week, which I was able to do. By one year I had like 180,000 words. I had two to three books in there. I did it as a hardback deluxe—the only place you could get it in print. Then Vella closed, or at least it went way down. So I was like, “Great, I'm going to do this Kickstarter for this entire new thing.” I partnered with a company that helps with special editions, because that was a whole other… oh Joanna, that was a whole other thing you have to go into. Getting the books, getting the art, getting the swag. I felt like I needed some help for that. Again, I went in, I funded. I did not make a killing on that, but that was okay. I learned some things that I would have changed with my Kickstarter and I also built a new audience for that. I had a lot of extra books that I then sold in my store, and it was another place to make money. The third Kickstarter I used specifically because I had always wanted to do a writing course. I go all over the world, I do keynotes, I do workshops, I've done books, and I wanted to reach new writers, but I don't travel a lot anymore. So I came up with the concept that I was going to do my very first course, and it was going to be very personal, kind of like me talking to them almost like in a keynote, like you're in a room with me. I gathered a whole bunch of stuff and I used Kickstarter to help me A) fund it and B) make myself do it, because it was two years in the making and I always had, “Oh, I've got this other thing to do,” you know how we do that, right? We have big projects. So I used Kickstarter as a deadline and I decided to launch it in the summer. In addition to that, I took years of my posts from all over. I copied and pasted, did new posts, and I created Write Free, which was a very personal, essay-driven book. I took it all together. I took a couple of months to do this, filmed the course, and the Kickstarter did better than I had ever imagined. I got quadruple what I wanted, and it literally financed all the video editing, the books, everything that I needed, plus extra. I feel like I'm growing in Kickstarter. I hope I'm not ranting. I'm trying to go over things that can help people. Jo: Oh no, that is super useful. Jennifer: So you don't have to go all in and say, “If it doesn't fund it's over,” or “I need to make $20,000.” There are people making so much money, and there are people that will do a project a year or two projects a year and just get enough to fund a new thing that they want to do. So that's how I've done it. Jo: I've done quite a few now, and my non-fiction ones have been a lot bigger—I have a big audience there—and my fiction have been all over the place. What I like about Kickstarter is that you can do these different things. We can do these special editions. I've just done a sprayed-edge short story collection. Short story collections are not the biggest genre. Jennifer: Yes. I love short stories too. I've always wanted to do an anthology of all my short stories. Jo: There you go. Jennifer: Yes, I love that for your Kickstarter. Love it. Jo: When I turned 50 earlier this year, I realised the thing that isn't in print is my short stories. They are out there digitally, and that's why I wanted to do it. I feel like Kickstarter is a really good way to do these creative projects. As you say, you don't have to make a ton of money, but at the end of the day, the definition of success for us, I think for both of us, is just being able to continue doing this, right? Jennifer: Absolutely. This is funding a creative full-time career, and every single thing that you do with your content is like a funnel. The more funnels that you have, the bigger your base. Especially if you love it. It would be different if I was struggling and thinking, “Do I get an editor job?” I would hate being an editor. But if you look at something else like, “Oh yes, I could do this and that would light me up, like doing a course—wow, that sounds amazing,” then that's different. It's kind of finding your alternates that also light you up. Jo: Hmm. So were there any mistakes in your Kickstarters that you think are worth sharing? In case people are thinking about it. Jennifer: Oh my God, yes. So many. One big thing was that I felt like I was a failure if I didn't make a certain amount of money because my name is pretty well known. It's not like I'm brand new and looking. One of the big things was that I could not understand and I felt like I was banging my head against the wall about why my newsletter subscribers wouldn't support the Kickstarter. I'm like, “Why aren't you doing this? I'm supposed to have thousands of people that just back.” Your expectations can really mess with you. Then I started to learn, “Oh my God, my newsletter audience wants nothing to do with my Kickstarter.” Maybe I had a handful. So then I learned that I needed longer tails, like putting it up for pre-order way ahead of time, and also that you can't just announce it in your newsletter and feel like everybody's going to go there. You need to find your streams, your Kickstarter audience, which includes ads. I had never done ads either and I didn't know how to do that, so I did that all wrong. I joined the Facebook group for Kickstarter authors. I didn't do that for the first one and then I learned about it. You share backer updates, so every time you go into your audience with a backer update, there's this whole community where you can share with like-minded people with their projects, and you post it under your updates. It does cross-networking and sharing with a lot of authors in their newsletters. For the Write Free one, I leaned into my networking a lot, using my connections. I used other authors' newsletters and people in the industry to share my Kickstarter. That was better for me than just relying on my own fanbase. So definitely more networking, more sharing, getting it out on different platforms rather than just doing your own narrow channel. Because a lot of the time, you think your audience will follow you into certain things and they don't, and that needs to be okay. The other thing was the time and the backend. I think a lot of authors can get super excited about swag. I love that, but I learned that I could have pulled back a little bit and been smarter with my financials. I did things I was passionate about, but I probably spent much more money on swag than I needed to. So looking at different aspects to make it more efficient. I think each time you do one, you learn what works best. As usual, I try to be patient with myself. I don't get mad at myself for trying things and failing. I think failing is spectacular because I learn something. I know: do I want to do this again? Do I want to do it differently? If we weren't so afraid of failingqu “in public”, I think we would do more things. I'm not saying I never think, “Oh my God, that was so embarrassing, I barely funded and this person is getting a hundred thousand.” We're human. We compare. I have my own reset that I do, but I really try to say, “But no, for me, maybe I'll do this, and if it doesn't work, that's okay.” Jo: I really like that you shared about the email list there because I feel like too many people have spent years driving people to Kindle or KU, and they have built an email list of readers who like a particular format at a particular price. Then we are saying, “Oh, now come over here and buy a beautiful hardback that's like ten times the price.” And we're surprised when nobody does it. Is that what happened? Jennifer: Exactly. Also, that list was for a non-fiction project. So I had to funnel where my writers were in my newsletter, and I have mostly readers. So I was like, “Okay…” But I think you're exactly right. First of all, it's the platform. When you ask anybody to go off a platform, whether it's buy direct at your Shopify store or go to Kickstarter, you are going to lose the majority right there. People are like, “No, I want to click a button from your newsletter and go to a site that I know.” So you've got that, and you've got to train them. That can take some time. Then you've got this project where people are like, “I don't understand.” Even my mum was like, “I would love to support you, honey, but what the heck is this? Where's the buy button and where's my book?” My women's fiction books tend to have some older readers who are like, “Hell no, I don't know what this is.” So you have to know your audience. If it's not translating, train them. I did a couple of videos where I said, “Look, I want to show you how easy this is,” and I showed them directly how to go in and how to back. I did that with Kindle Vella too. I did a video from my newsletter and on social: “Hey, do you not know how to read this chapter? Here's how.” Sometimes there's a barrier. Like you said, Joanna, if I have a majority that just want sexy contemporary, and I'm dropping angsty, cheating, forbidden love, they're like, “Oh no, that's not for me.” So you have to know whether there's a crossover. I go into my business with that already baked into my expectations. I don't go in thinking I'm going to make a killing. Then I'm more surprised when it does well, and then I can build it. Jo: Yes, exactly. Also if you are, like both of us, writing across genres, then you are always going to split your audience. People do not necessarily buy everything because they have their preferences. So I think that's great. Now we are almost out of time, but this latest book is Write Free. I wondered if you would maybe say— What does Write Free mean to you, and what might it help the listeners with? Jennifer: Write Free is an extremely personal book for me, and the title was really important because it goes with Write Naked, Write True, and Write Free. These are the ways that I believe a writer should always show up to the page. Freedom is being able to write your truth in whatever day that is. You're going to be a different writer when you're young and maybe hormonal and passionate and having love affairs. You're going to write differently when you're a mum with kids in nappies. You're going to write differently when you are maybe in your forties and you're killing your career. Your perspective changes, your life changes. Write Free is literally a collection of essays all through my 30 years of life. It's very personal. There are essays like, “I'm writing my 53rd book right now,” and essays like, “My kids are in front of SpongeBob and I'm trying to write right now,” and “I got another rejection letter and I don't know how to survive.” It is literally an imprint of essays that you can dip in and dip out of. It's easy, short, inspirational, and it's just me showing up for my writing life. That's what I wish for everybody: that they can show up for their writing life in the best way that they can at the time, because that changes all the time. Jo: We can say “write free” because we've got a lot of experience at writing. I feel like when I started writing—I was an IT consultant—I literally couldn't write anything creative. I didn't believe I could. There'll be people listening who are just like, “Well, Jennifer, I can't write free. I'm not free. My mind is shackled by all these expectations and everything.” How can they release that and aim for more freedom? Jennifer: I love that question so much. The thing is, I've spent so many years working on that part. That doesn't come overnight. I think sometimes when you have more clarification of, “Okay, this is really limiting me,” then when you can see where something is limiting you, at least you can look for answers. My answers came in the form of meditation. Meditation is a very big thing in my life. Changing my perspective. Learning life mottos to help me deal with those kinds of limitations. Learning that when I write a sex scene, I can't care about my elderly aunt who tells my mother, “Dear God, she ruined the family name.” It is your responsibility to figure out where these limitations are, and then slowly see how you can remove them. I've been in therapy. I have read hundreds of self-help books. I take meditation courses. I take workshop courses. I've done CliftonStrengths with Becca Syme. I don't even know if that's therapy, but it feels like therapy to me as a writer. Knowing my personality traits. I've done Enneagram work with Claire Taylor, which has been huge. The more you know yourself and how your brain is showing up for yourself, the more you can grab tools to use. I wish I could say, “Yes, if everybody meditates 30 minutes a day, you're going to have all blocks removed,” but it's so personal that it's a trick question. If everybody started today and said, “Where is my biggest limitation?” and be real with yourself, there are answers out there. You just have to go slowly and find them, and then the writing more free will come. I hope that wasn't one of those woo-woo answers, but I really do believe it. Jo: I agree. It just takes time. Like our writing career, it just takes time. Keep working on it, keep writing. Jennifer: Yes. And bravery, right? A lot of bravery. Just show up for yourself however you can. If “write free” feels too big, journal for yourself and put it in a locked drawer. Any kind of writing, I think, is therapeutic too. Jo: Brilliant. So where can people find you and your books and everything you do online? Jennifer: The best place to go is my website. I treat it like my home. It's www.JenniferProbst.com. There is so much on it. Not just books, not just free content and free stories. There's an entire section just for writers. There are videos on there. There are a lot of resources. I keep it up to date and it is the place where you can find me. Of course I'm everywhere on social media as Author Jennifer Probst. You can find me anywhere. I always tell everybody: I answer my messages, I answer my emails. That is really important to me. So if you heard this podcast and you want to reach out on anything, please do. I will answer. Jo: Fantastic. Well, thanks so much for your time, Jennifer. That was great. Jennifer: Thanks for having me, Joanna.The post Writing Free: Romance Author Jennifer Probst On A Long-Term Author Career first appeared on The Creative Penn.

What if great friendships aren't found by luck but built through effort?Bestselling novelist Fredrik Backman, the mind behind A Man Called Ove (adapted into the Tom Hanks film A Man Called Otto), Anxious People, and the beloved Beartown series, has spent his career writing about the quiet power of ordinary people. But in his real life, he learned one of his most important lessons from his best friend of 30 years: meaningful friendship is a skill you develop, not a lottery you win.Despite being a self-described introvert, Fredrik discovered that you don't need hundreds of friends. You only get a few humans who truly shape your life. His newest book, My Friends, is a tribute to those relationships and the daily work of showing up for the people who matter most.In this candid and inspiring conversation, Fredrik and I talk about the healing power of friendship, why differences make relationships stronger, the value of having friends who edit us, and the joy of being genuinely happy for someone else.If you want to become a better friend and build deeper connections, this episode offers heartfelt lessons from one of the world's most compassionate storytellers.This is A Bit of Optimism.---------------------------This episode is brought to you by the Porsche USA Macan---------------------------To check out Fredrik's newest book, “My Friends,” visit: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/My-Friends/Fredrik-Backman/9781982112820Find the full-length speech Fredrik gave for Simon & Schuster here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSuSyZ92Cjg

In August 2025, Polish researchers tested something nobody had thought to check: what happens to doctors' skills after they rely on AI assistance? The AI worked perfectly—catching problems during colonoscopies, flagging abnormalities faster than human eyes could. But when researchers pulled the AI away, the doctors' detection rates had dropped. They'd become less skilled at spotting problems on their own. We're all making decisions like this right now. A solution fixes the immediate problem—but creates a second-order consequence that's harder to see and often more damaging than what we started with. Research from Gartner shows that poor operational decisions cost companies upward of 3% of their annual profits. A company with $5 billion in revenue loses $150 million every year because managers solved first-order problems and created second-order disasters. You see this pattern everywhere. A retail chain closes underperforming stores to cut costs—and ends up losing more money when loyal customers abandon the brand entirely. A daycare introduces a late pickup fee to discourage tardiness—and late pickups skyrocket because parents now feel they've paid for the privilege. The skill that separates wise decision-makers from everyone else isn't speed. It's the ability to ask one simple question repeatedly: "And then what?" What Second-Order Thinking Actually Means First-order thinking asks: "What happens if I do this?" Second-order thinking asks: "And then what? And then what after that?" Most people stop at the first question. They see the immediate consequence and act. But every action creates a cascade of effects, and the second and third-order consequences are often the opposite of what we intended. Think about social media platforms. First-order? They connect people across distances. Second-order? They fragment attention spans and fuel polarization. The difference isn't about being cautious—it's about being thorough. In a world where business decisions come faster and with higher stakes than ever before, the ability to trace consequences forward through multiple levels isn't optional anymore. Let me show you how. How To Think in Consequences Before we get into the specific strategies, here's what you need to understand: Second-order thinking isn't about predicting the future with certainty. It's about systematically considering possibilities that most people ignore. The reason most people fail at this isn't lack of intelligence—it's that our brains evolved to focus on immediate threats and rewards. First-order thinking kept our ancestors alive. But in complex modern systems—businesses, markets, organizations—first-order thinking gets you killed. The good news? This is a learnable skill. You don't need special training or advanced degrees. You need two things: a framework for mapping consequences, and a method for forcing yourself to actually use it. Two strategies will stop your solutions from creating bigger problems: Map How People Will Actually Respond - trace your decision through stakeholders, understand what you're actually incentivizing, and predict how the system adapts. Run the "And Then What?" Drill - force yourself to see three moves ahead before you act, using a simple three-round questioning method. Let's break down each one. Strategy 1: Map How People Will Actually Respond Here's the fundamental insight that separates good decision-makers from everyone else: People respond to what you reward, not what you intend. When you make a decision, you're not just choosing an action—you're sending signals into a complex system of human beings who will interpret those signals, adapt their behavior, and create consequences you never imagined. Your job is to trace those adaptations before they happen. This strategy has three components that work together: First: Identify ALL Your Stakeholders When considering a decision, list everyone it will affect directly and indirectly. Don't just think about your immediate team—think about: Your customers (current and potential) Your competitors (how will they respond?) Your suppliers and partners Your employees at different levels Your investors or board Regulatory bodies or industry watchdogs Adjacent markets or ecosystems Most executives stop after listing two or three obvious groups. The consequences you miss come from the stakeholders you forgot to consider. Here's what research shows: Wharton professor Philip Tetlock spent two decades studying how well experts predict future events. His landmark finding? Even highly credentialed experts' predictions were only slightly better than random chance—barely better than a dart-throwing chimp. But the real insight came when Tetlock discovered that certain people can forecast with exceptional accuracy. These "superforecasters" share one key trait: they relentlessly ask "And then what?" before making predictions. They don't just see the immediate effect. They trace the decision through the entire system. The people making million-dollar decisions are operating blind beyond the first consequence. Our job is to see what they're missing. Second: Understand What You're Actually Rewarding This is where most decisions go wrong. You think you're incentivizing one behavior, but you're actually rewarding something completely different. Here's the test: For each stakeholder, ask yourself: "What does this decision make easier, more profitable, or less risky for them?" Quick example: Remember the daycare that introduced a late pickup fee to discourage tardiness? They thought they were incentivizing on-time pickup. But here's what they actually rewarded: guilt-free lateness. Parents who felt terrible about being late now had a clear price for that guilt. The fee didn't discourage the behavior—it legitimized it. Late pickups skyrocketed. The daycare asked the wrong question. They asked: "What punishment will discourage lateness?" Instead, they should have asked: "What does a $5 fee actually incentivize?" Another example: You add a performance metric to improve efficiency. First-order thinking says: "People will work more efficiently." But what are you actually rewarding? Optimizing for the metric—often at the expense of things you didn't measure but actually matter more. Sales quotas reward closing deals, not necessarily solving customer problems. Employee of the month awards reward visibility, not necessarily the best work. Quarterly earnings targets reward short-term thinking, not building long-term value. When you rush a hiring decision to fill a role quickly, you're rewarding speed over quality. The second-order effect? Your team learns that urgency matters more than fit, and future hiring suffers. The pattern: People don't follow the spirit of your policy—they follow the incentives. And they're incredibly creative at finding ways to game systems when the incentives misalign with the goals. Third: Trace Each Response Forward Now that you know who's affected and what you're incentivizing, trace how they'll respond—and then how the system responds to THEIR response. This is where the stakeholder analysis and incentives analysis combine into real predictive power. Example: When ride-sharing apps added surge pricing to solve driver shortages, here's how it played out: First-order: More drivers show up when prices surge. Problem solved, right? Second-order stakeholder responses: Customers started waiting out surge periods, meaning fewer overall rides Drivers started gaming the system—turning off their apps to create artificial shortages that triggered surges Competitors without surge pricing captured price-sensitive customers Media coverage made "surge pricing" synonymous with price gouging, damaging brand trust Third-order systemic effects: The solution trained customers to use the service less frequently It taught drivers to manipulate the platform rather than respond to genuine demand It created a PR vulnerability that regulators could exploit The very mechanism designed to solve shortages created new shortages through gaming behavior The original problem (driver shortages during peak times) was real. The first-order solution (higher prices attract more drivers) was economically sound. But nobody mapped how customers and drivers would actually respond to the incentives created by surge pricing. The key insight: Complex systems don't just accept your decisions—they adapt to them. And those adaptations often work directly against your original intent. Try it now: Pause this video for 30 seconds. Think of one decision your company made in the last year. Who were the stakeholders? How did they actually respond? Was it what you expected? [5-second pause built into video] If their response surprised you—you just found a second-order effect you missed. Strategy 2: Run the "And Then What?" Drill Now you have a framework for thinking about consequences. But frameworks don't change behavior—practice does. This is your daily practice method. Before any significant decision, literally ask yourself "And then what?" at least three times. Out loud. Make it awkward. Make it unavoidable. Here's why this works: Your brain will naturally stop at the first answer. The question forces you to keep going. It's a cognitive override—a way to fight your brain's preference for first-order thinking. The Three Rounds: Round 1: Immediate Consequence State the obvious first-order effect. This should come easily. "We'll discount our product by 20%." And then what? "We'll attract more customers and gain market share." Round 2: Response and Adaptation Now apply Strategy 1. How will stakeholders respond? What are we actually incentivizing? And then what? "Competitors will match our discount to protect their market share. And customers will start expecting permanently lower prices—we've trained them that our regular price was inflated. Early adopters who paid full price feel cheated." Round 3: Systemic Effects Trace the second-order responses forward. What happens when multiple stakeholders adapt simultaneously? And then what? "We're now in a price war. Our margins erode across the entire product line. We can't fund innovation or customer service improvements. Competitors with deeper pockets can outlast us. We've commoditized our own product and destroyed the brand value that justified our original pricing. We're stuck in a race to the bottom." The pattern you're looking for: Are the third-order effects consistent with your goals, or do they undermine them? Most people never get past Round 1. By forcing yourself to Round 3, you'll see patterns others miss. Try it now: Think of a decision you're facing right now—any decision. Say out loud what happens first. Now say out loud: "And then what?" Answer it. Now say it again: "And then what?" [5-second pause built into video] Did Round 3 surprise you? If yes—you just found your blind spot. Let Me Show You How This Actually Works Let me walk you through a decision I faced as CTO at HP. We were under pressure to cut R&D spending by 15% to hit quarterly earnings targets. Round 1: Immediate consequence. "We hit our quarterly numbers. Wall Street is happy. Stock price stays stable. The board is pleased." Round 2: Response and adaptation. And then what? "Our best researchers—the ones working on breakthrough projects with 3-5 year horizons—see the writing on the wall. They start looking at competitors who aren't cutting R&D. Meanwhile, the teams that survive shift focus to incremental improvements with shorter payback periods because that's what won't get cut next quarter." Round 3: Systemic effects. And then what? "Eighteen months later, our innovation pipeline is empty. We're selling the same products with minor tweaks while competitors who maintained R&D investment launch breakthrough products. We lose market leadership. Now we need to spend 3X what we saved just to catch up—but our best people are already gone." We fought that cut. We protected the long-term R&D. Some of those projects became billion-dollar product lines. But I watched other companies make that first-order decision and destroy their innovation capability. That conversation took maybe five minutes. But it saved HP from years of playing catch-up. Put This Into Practice Right Now Take a decision you're facing this week—any decision with financial or operational implications. Write down the decision at the top of a page. Be specific. List three immediate consequences. These should come easily. Take each consequence and ask "And then what?" twice. Write down both second-order and third-order effects. Find which effect you hadn't considered. That's your blind spot. Do this for one decision this week, and you'll start seeing consequences others don't. Make it a habit, and it becomes automatic—like a chess player who sees five moves ahead. The Unfair Advantage Right now, in your company, there are people who seem to always be one step ahead. They don't work longer hours. They're not more talented. But somehow, they avoid the disasters others walk into. They see opportunities others miss. They get promoted while others are fixing problems. Here's their secret: While everyone else celebrates the first-order win, they're already managing the second-order consequences. While you're implementing the solution, they've already anticipated what breaks next. That gap—between first-order thinking and second-order thinking—is the difference between running in place and actually advancing. Your challenge: For the next 30 days, before every significant decision, ask "And then what?" three times out loud. Not in your head. Out loud. Make it awkward. Make it unavoidable. Because the ones who rise aren't the fastest problem-solvers, they're the ones who solve problems that stay solved.. So …  Start asking the question. Three times. Every decision. The question isn't whether we have time to think this way. It's whether we can afford to keep making decisions that create bigger problems than they solve. Your Thinking 101 Journey The Thinking 101 series teaches how to think clearly in a world designed to confuse everyone—here's our journey so far: In Episode 1, we exposed the thinking crisis—AI dependency is creating cognitive debt, and independent thinking has become the most valuable skill in the modern world. In Episode 2, we learned to distinguish deductive certainty from inductive probability and stop treating patterns as proven facts. In Episode 3, we discovered how to distinguish true causation from mere correlation—saving ourselves from solving the wrong problem perfectly. In Episode 4, we learned how to harness the power of analogies while avoiding their traps—generating useful comparisons systematically and spotting false analogies that manipulate thinking. In Episode 5, we mastered probabilistic thinking—how to make decisions with incomplete information and act wisely when nothing is guaranteed. Today, in Episode 6, we learned how to stop our decisions from creating bigger problems—mapping how people actually respond to our decisions, understanding what we are truly incentivizing, and asking "And then what?" until we see patterns others miss. Up next—Episode 7: "Proportional & Numerical Thinking—Understanding Scale and Magnitude." We will learn how to think in terms of scale, ratios, and relative magnitude—understanding when numbers matter and when they don't, spotting statistical tricks used to mislead, and developing intuition about large numbers that most people lack. Hit that subscribe button so you don't miss future episodes. Also—hit the like and notification bell. It helps with the algorithm so others see our content. Why not share this video with a colleague who you think would benefit from it? Because right now, while you've been watching this, someone just made a decision that solves today's problem perfectly—and just created three bigger problems for next quarter. The only question is: will you be the one who sees them coming?     SOURCES CITED IN THIS EPISODE 1. Cost of Poor Operational Decisions Rathindran, R. (2018, December 20). Gartner Says Bad Financial Decisions by Managers Cost Firms More Than 3 Percent of Profits. Gartner Press Release. https://www.gartner.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2018-12-20-gartner-says-bad-financial-decisions-by-managers-cost-firms-more-than-3-percent-of-profits 2. Expert Forecasting Accuracy and Second-Order Thinking Tetlock, P. E., & Gardner, D. (2015). Superforecasting: The Art and Science of Prediction. Crown Publishers. 3. AI Impact on Medical Diagnostic Skills Romańczyk, M., et al. (2025). Endoscopist deskilling risk after exposure to artificial intelligence in colonoscopy: A multicentre, observational study. Lancet Gastroenterology & Hepatology. As reported by NPR Health News, August 19, 2025. https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/08/19/nx-s1-5506292/doctors-ai-artificial-intelligence-dependent-colonoscopy 4. Unintended Consequences of Incentive Systems Merton, R. K. (1936). The unanticipated consequences of purposive social action. American Sociological Review, 1(6), 894-904. 5. Second-Order Effects in Economics Henderson, D. R. (2018). Unintended consequences. In The Concise Encyclopedia of Economics. Library of Economics and Liberty. https://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/UnintendedConsequences.html     ADDITIONAL READING On Second-Order Thinking and Decision-Making Marks, H. (2011). The Most Important Thing: Uncommon Sense for the Thoughtful Investor. Columbia University Press. Dalio, R. (2017). Principles: Life and Work. Simon & Schuster. Tetlock, P. E., & Gardner, D. (2015). Superforecasting: The Art and Science of Prediction. Crown Publishers. On Systems Thinking and Consequences Meadows, D. H. (2008). Thinking in Systems: A Primer. Chelsea Green Publishing. Senge, P. M. (1990). The Fifth Discipline: The Art & Practice of The Learning Organization. Currency. On Incentives and Unintended Effects Levitt, S. D., & Dubner, S. J. (2005). Freakonomics: A Rogue Economist Explores the Hidden Side of Everything. William Morrow. Munger, C. T. (1995). The Psychology of Human Misjudgment. Speech presented at Harvard Law School.     Note: All sources cited in this episode have been accessed and verified as of November 2025.

Phil Rosenthal is the award-winning creator, executive producer, and host of "Somebody Feed Phil," as well as a two-time New York Times Best Selling Author and soon-to-be restaurant owner. "Somebody Feed Phil" – one of Netflix's most popular food and travel shows – has garnered a cult-like following and released its eighth season on June 18th in 190 countries. The Emmy-nominated series is Netflix's longest unscripted series and combines Rosenthal's love of food and travel with his unique brand of humor and has become must-see TV for foodies, restaurateurs, travelers, and armchair enthusiasts all over the world. Rosenthal has been nominated for a 2024 Critics' Choice Real TV Award, after winning Critics Choice Real TV Awards in 2022 and 2021 for "Best Travel/Adventure Show" and "Male Star of the Year" on behalf of the series. He also garnered a 2022 James Beard Award nomination for "Visual Media—Long Form." Currently, Rosenthal has embarked on his highly anticipated third US live tour –  An Evening With Phil Rosenthal "Of Somebody Feed Phil" – in over 25 North American cities August-October 2025. On tour, Rosenthal shares insights into his 40-year entertainment career, while incorporating his love of food, storytelling, and humor to audiences. He also invites special guests to be moderators on stage, ranging from local celebrities to famous chefs. The North American tour comes after his second European tour, which was received with resounding praise from fans across Europe. Up next, Rosenthal will also make a significant mark in the culinary world with the 2025 opening of his diner, Max & Helen's, in Los Angeles. Named after his parents, who were beloved series regulars in "Somebody Feed Phil," the dishes will not only be elevated by great ingredients but the brilliance of Executive Chef Nancy Silverton. Following a resounding call from fans, Rosenthal created a companion book to the series, "Somebody Feed Phil The Book" which was released in the US on October 20th, 2022, via Simon Element (an imprint of Simon & Schuster). It immediately landed on the New York Times Best Seller list, which then led to a UK release in January 2023 and a multi-country tour selling out venues across the globe. To expand on this, Rosenthal is set to release a second cookbook in the series, "Phil's Favorites," available for pre-order now and releasing on November 4th, 2025 in the US and November 6th in the UK.  It is more than just a cookbook; it's a celebration of food, family, and friendship incorporating recipes from his family and friends including Judy Gold and Anna Romano. In 2024, he released his first children's book, "JUST TRY IT: A Phil and Lil Book," co-written with his daughter, Lily on March 5, 2024. The hilarious children's picture book about a food-loving dad encouraging his picky eater daughter to just try something new. This once again put Rosenthal on the New York Times Best Seller list, leading to his second national book and live tour, both of which packed bookstores and theatres from coast to coast, including a sold-out crowd at The Beacon in New York City. Up next, they will launch its companion book, "JUST TRY IT: SOMEPLACE NEW!," about an encouraging dad easing his daughter's worries about staying at Grandma's for the first time. Rosenthal has further expanded his love of humor, food, and human connection through a podcast called "Naked Lunch." Launched in May 2022, his podcast is live on Stitcher, SiriusXM's mobile app, and wherever podcasts are available. Co-hosted with his friend and longtime Rolling Stone journalist David Wild, each episode of this weekly talk-show podcast features a special, world-renowned guest to discuss what's going on in their lives – "an informal meeting of wits, minds and hearts" – while eating lunch from some of Phil's favorite local LA eateries.  In 1995, Rosenthal created the hit CBS comedy "Everybody Loves Raymond" which premiered the following year. He served as the showrunner and executive producer for all nine years of the show's very successful run, which ended in 2005. During its original run, the show was nominated for over 70 Emmy Awards, and won 15 awards, including two for "Best Comedy Series" in 2003 and 2005. Rosenthal won the 2002 Writers Guild Award for "Excellence in Television Writing" for his "Italy" script. After the series wrapped, Rosenthal penned a book on the art of comedy and the making of a sitcom classic. YOU'RE LUCKY YOU'RE FUNNY: HOW LIFE BECOMES A SITCOM was published in 2007 via Penguin Publishing Group. His early writing credits include the comedy series "DOWN THE SHORE" and "Coach." Rosenthal also co-wrote "America: A Tribute to Heroes," the 9/11 telethon which aired on all four networks in September 2001, for which he won a Peabody Award and an Emmy nomination for "Outstanding Writing." Rosenthal then went on to write, direct, and star in his first feature film for Sony Pictures. EXPORTING RAYMOND, the true story about the attempt to turn "Everybody Loves Raymond" into a Russian sitcom, was met with critical acclaim upon its release in October 2010. In 2015, Rosenthal embarked on a new journey by creating his first travel food series "I'll Have What Phil's Having." This PBS documentary series, which is the precursor to "Somebody Feed Phil," received two Taste Awards and won the 2016 James Beard Award for "Best Television Program, on Location." In October 2020, Rosenthal launched Somebody Feed the People, an initiative of the Rosenthal Family Foundation that supports organizations making an impact and building community through food. This inclusive and non-partisan initiative partners with organizations across the U.S. that address food access and insecurity, support chefs and restaurant workers, create employment pathways, and strengthen the health of our food systems. This foundation is ongoing yearly. Rosenthal continued his philanthropic efforts in 2022, serving alongside Katie Couric and Jeff MacGregor as an executive producer of the documentary FOR LOVE AND LIFE: NO ORDINARY CAMPAIGN. The film follows Brian Wallach and Sandra Abrevaya, a couple battling ALS and leading a revolutionary movement to help victims of the disease around the world. "For Love and Life" went on to win awards at the SXSW Film Festival, the Chicago International Film Festival, and the Virginia Film Festival.  We chat about executives trying to sabotage him, writing what you want, gratitude, Somebody Feed Phil, Everybody Loves Raymond and almost quitting twice, writing, crazy story as a security guard, creating your own ticket plus plenty more! Check Phil out on: Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/phil.rosenthal/ Book (Phil's Favorites): https://philrosenthal.store/books/ Website: https://www.philrosenthalworld.com/ Tour dates/ shows: https://www.philrosenthalworld.com/media Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/c/PhilRosenthalWorld Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/philrosenthalofficial/ Max and Helens Restaurant (California): https://www.instagram.com/maxandhelens/ ------------------------------------------- Follow @Funny in Failure on Instagram and Facebook https://www.instagram.com/funnyinfailure/ https://www.facebook.com/funnyinfailure/ and @Michael_Kahan on Insta & Twitter to keep up to date with the latest info. https://www.instagram.com/michael_kahan/ https://twitter.com/Michael_Kahan

This month, Jude and Stef have the pleasure of interviewing Tolkien educator, influencer and now biographer Don Marshall about his new book, “J.R.R. Tolkien: The Father of Modern Fantasy” which will be published on November 25, 2025, by Adams Media, an imprint of Simon & Schuster. We chat with Don about how the book came about, the challenges and delights of the writing process, and the surprises Don found along the way. Thanks for joining us again on Athrabeth, Don!  Citations: Thank you to our special guest Don Marshall! You can find links to Don's social media below:https://beacons.ai/donmarshall72  J.R.R. Tolkien: The Father of Modern Fantasy by Don Marshall will be published on November 25, 2025, by Adam's Media, an imprint of Simon & Schuster, in both book and audiobook format!Find your copy at the link below:https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/J-R-R-Tolkien/Don-Marshall/Pocket-Portraits/9781668135440

AN ELEGY FOR THE ELITE—Michael Grynbaum is a correspondent for The New York Times, where he has covered media, politics, and culture for 18 years. He's reported on three presidential campaigns, two New York City mayors—they're always so boring—and the transformation of the media world in the Trump era. He lives in Manhattan and he's a graduate of Harvard.His first book, Empire of the Elite: Inside Condé Nast, the Media Dynasty that Reshaped America, was published by Simon & Schuster in June, 2025. In the book, Michael chronicles the origins of the company, its go-go boom days in the eighties and nineties, and its more recent post-print transformation into whatever Condé Nast is these days. We'll figure that out later.Michael's bestseller captured a lot of attention when it was published—it's a bestseller and it's the latest in the line of books by and about Condé Nast magazine makers—full of great anecdotes and good stories. The kind of stuff we love here on Print Is Dead (Long Live Print!), and it's extremely readable.—This episode is made possible by our friends at Commercial Type and Freeport Press. A production of Magazeum LLC ©2021–2025

Try to go through a day without using an analogy. I guarantee you'll fail within an hour. Your morning coffee tastes like yesterday's batch. Traffic is moving like molasses. Your boss sounds like a broken record. Every comparison you make—every single one—is your brain's way of understanding the world. You can't turn it off. When someone told you ChatGPT is "like having a smart assistant," your brain immediately knew what to expect—and what to worry about. When Netflix called itself "the HBO of streaming," investors understood the strategy instantly. These comparisons aren't just convenient—they're how billion-dollar companies are built and how your brain actually learns. The person who controls the analogy controls your thinking. In a world where you're bombarded with new concepts every single day—AI tools, cryptocurrency, remote work culture, creator economies—your brain needs a way to make sense of it all. By the end of this episode, you'll possess a powerful toolkit for understanding the unfamiliar by connecting it to what you already know—and explaining complex ideas so clearly that people wonder why they never saw it before. Thinking in analogies—or what's called analogical thinking—is how the greatest innovators, communicators, and problem-solvers operate. It's the skill that turns confusion into clarity and complexity into something you can actually work with. What is Analogical Thinking? But what does analogical thinking entail? At its core, it's the practice of understanding something new by comparing it to something you already understand. Your brain is constantly asking: "What is this like?" When you learned what a virus does to your computer, you understood it by comparing it to how biological viruses infect living organisms. When someone explains blockchain as "a shared spreadsheet that no one can erase," they're using analogy to make an abstract concept concrete. Researchers have found something remarkable: your brain doesn't actually store information as facts—it stores it as patterns and relationships. When you learn something new, your brain is literally asking "What does this remind me of?" and building connections to existing knowledge. Analogies aren't just helpful for communication—they're the fundamental mechanism of human understanding. You can't NOT think in analogies. The question is whether you're doing it consciously and well, or unconsciously and poorly. The quality of your analogies determines how quickly you learn, how deeply you understand, and how effectively you can explain ideas to others. Remember this: whoever controls the analogy controls the conversation. Master this skill, and you'll never be at the mercy of someone else's framing again. The Crisis of Bad Analogies Thinking in analogies is a double-edged sword. I learned this the hard way. A few years ago, I watched a brilliant engineer struggle to explain a revolutionary idea to executives. He had the data, the logic, the technical proof—but he couldn't get buy-in. Then someone in the room said, "So it's basically like Uber, but for industrial equipment?" Instantly, heads nodded. Funding approved. Project greenlit. One analogy did what an hour of explanation couldn't. Six months later, that same analogy killed the project. Because "Uber for equipment" came with assumptions—about pricing, about scale, about network effects—that didn't actually apply. The team kept forcing their solution to fit the analogy instead of recognizing when the comparison broke down. I watched millions of dollars and two years of work disappear because nobody questioned whether the analogy was still serving them. The same mental shortcut that helps you understand new things can also trap you in outdated patterns. Consider Quibi's spectacular failure. In 2020, Jeffrey Katzenberg and Meg Whitman launched a streaming service with $1.75 billion in funding—more than Netflix had when it started. Their analogy? "It's like TV shows, but designed for your phone." They created high-quality 10-minute episodes optimized for mobile viewing. Six months later, Quibi shut down. What went wrong? The analogy was flawed. They assumed mobile viewing was like TV viewing, just shorter. But people don't watch phones the way they watch TV—they watch phones while doing other things, in stolen moments, with interruptions. YouTube and TikTok understood this. They built for distraction and fragmentation. Quibi built for focused attention that didn't exist. That misunderstanding burned through nearly $2 billion in 18 months. We see this constantly where complex issues get reduced to simplistic analogies that feel intuitive but lead to flawed conclusions. Someone compares running a country to running a household budget—"If families have to balance their budgets, why shouldn't governments?" The analogy sounds intuitive, but it ignores that countries can print currency, carry strategic long-term debt, and operate on completely different time horizons than households. The cost of bad analogical thinking is enormous. You waste time applying solutions that worked in one context to problems where they don't fit. You miss opportunities because you're trying to squeeze new situations into old patterns. And worst of all, you become easy to manipulate—because anyone who controls your analogies controls how you think. How To Think Using Analogies So how do we harness the power of analogy while avoiding its traps? Let me show you five essential strategies that will transform how you use comparison to understand your world. Generate Analogies Systematically The first skill is learning to create useful analogies on demand. Most people wait for analogies to pop into their heads randomly, but you can develop a systematic process for generating them whenever you need one. Map the structure of what you're trying to understand, then search for similar structures in domains you know well. Netflix's recommendation algorithm didn't come from studying other algorithms—it came from asking "How do humans recommend things?" and mapping that social process onto a technical system. Steps to generate powerful analogies: Identify the core function or relationship: Strip away surface details and ask what the thing actually does. A heart pumps fluid through a system. Now you can compare it to anything else that pumps fluid—engines, wells, plumbing systems.  Look across multiple domains: Don't limit yourself to obvious comparisons. The best analogies often come from unexpected places. The inventor of Velcro, George de Mestral, understood how burrs stuck to fabric by comparing them to hooks and loops—leading to a billion-dollar fastening system.  Map specific correspondences: Once you find a potential analogy, be explicit about what maps to what. If you're comparing your startup to a marathon, what corresponds to training? What's the equivalent of hitting the wall? What represents the finish line?  Test the analogy's limits: Push the comparison and see where it breaks down. This isn't a failure—it's information. Every analogy has boundaries, and knowing them makes the analogy more useful.  Consider multiple analogies: Don't settle for the first comparison that works. Electricity is like water flowing through pipes AND like cars on a highway. Each analogy reveals different insights.  Recognize When Analogies Break Down Most people fall in love with an analogy and push it beyond its useful range. A powerful analogy becomes a dangerous one the moment you forget it's just a comparison, not reality itself. The human brain loves patterns, and once we find one that works, we want to apply it everywhere. This is how we end up with terrible advice like "Just be yourself in job interviews" because "authentic relationships require honesty"—taking an analogy from personal relationships and stretching it to professional contexts where it doesn't fit. How to recognize the breakdown: Watch for forced mappings: If you find yourself struggling to make pieces fit, the analogy might be wrong. When the comparison starts requiring elaborate explanations or special exceptions, it's probably breaking down.  Check for contradictory predictions: A good analogy should help you predict behavior. If your analogy suggests one outcome but reality keeps producing another, the comparison isn't working.  Look for what's missing: What does the analogy leave out? Understanding the gaps is as important as understanding the matches. Social media isn't "the modern town square"—because town squares had time constraints, physical presence, and social accountability that platforms lack.  Test edge cases: Push your analogy to extremes. If "your body is a temple," does that mean you should let tourists visit? When an analogy gets absurd at the edges, you've found its limits.  A good analogy is a map, not the territory. The moment you forget that, you're lost. Use Analogies to Explain Complex Ideas Analogies are your secret weapon for making complicated concepts accessible to anyone. The person who can explain quantum physics using everyday comparisons has a superpower in our information-saturated world. Match the analogy to your audience's knowledge and choose comparisons that illuminate rather than obscure. The explanatory analogy playbook: Know your audience's knowledge base: You can compare machine learning to "teaching a child through examples" for general audiences, but that same analogy won't work for computer scientists who need technical precision.  Start with the familiar: Always move from what people know to what they don't. "Imagine your favorite playlist, but instead of songs it recommends..." grounds abstract concepts in concrete experience.  Be explicit about the comparison: Don't assume people will automatically see the connection. Say "Think of it like this..." and make the mapping clear.  Use multiple analogies for complex concepts: One analogy rarely captures everything. Combine several different comparisons to give people multiple angles of understanding.  Identify False Analogies in Arguments People will use analogies to manipulate your thinking—sometimes intentionally, sometimes not. Workplace debates are full of analogical arguments: "Remote work is like letting students do homework unsupervised—productivity will plummet." But is professional work really like homework? The analogy assumes similarities that may not exist. Recognizing false analogies protects you from being intellectually hijacked. When someone uses comparison to make their argument, your job is to evaluate whether the comparison is valid. Your defense against false analogies: Ask what's being compared: Make the analogy explicit. Often people use vague gestures toward similarity without stating exactly what maps to what.  Examine the relevant similarities: Are the things being compared actually alike in ways that matter to the argument? Comparing a business to a family sounds warm, but families don't fire members for poor performance.  Identify critical differences: What's different between the two things? Sometimes those differences destroy the analogy's validity. Saying "hiring is like dating" ignores that employment is a contractual relationship with completely different expectations and legal frameworks than romantic partnerships.  Consider alternative analogies: If someone says "Unlimited vacation policies are like giving employees a blank check," counter with "Actually, it's more like trusting professionals to manage their own time like we trust them to manage budgets." Different analogies suggest different conclusions.  Demand literal argument: When someone relies heavily on analogy to make their case, ask them to make the argument without comparison. If they can't, the analogy might be doing rhetorical work rather than logical work.  Build Your Analogy Library The final strategy is long-term: deliberately expand your collection of mental models and experiences so you have more source material for analogies. The person who only knows their own industry can only draw comparisons from that narrow domain. But someone who reads widely, pursues diverse experiences, and studies multiple fields can make unexpected connections. Steve Jobs famously took a calligraphy class—years later, those insights about typeface and design influenced the Mac's revolutionary interface. The analogy between typographic beauty and digital design wouldn't have been available without that cross-domain experience. Building your source material: Read across disciplines: Don't just consume content in your field. Read history, science, philosophy, biography. Each domain gives you new patterns to recognize elsewhere.  Study other industries: How do restaurants manage inventory? How do sports teams develop talent? These patterns might apply to your completely different context.  Learn the fundamental models: Some analogies recur because they capture universal patterns. Evolution, network effects, compound interest, equilibrium—these models apply across countless domains.  Practice deliberately: Make it a habit to ask "What is this like?" when you encounter new ideas. The more you practice generating analogies, the faster and better you'll become.  Practice A practical and effective way to develop this skill is to practice explaining concepts across contexts. Here's how you can sharpen your ability to think in analogies: Choose a concept you know well: Pick something from your area of expertise—a technical process, a business strategy, a creative technique, whatever you know deeply.  Identify three different audiences: Consider explaining this concept to a child, to someone in a completely different profession, and to an expert in an unrelated field.  Generate three analogies: For each audience, create a different analogy that would make the concept clear. Force yourself to draw from domains that audience would understand.  Test your analogies: If possible, actually explain your concept to someone using your analogy. Watch their face—confusion means the analogy isn't working, clarity means it is.  Refine and iterate: Share your analogies with others and adjust based on their feedback. The best analogies often emerge through conversation and iteration.  This exercise trains you to think flexibly, draw connections across domains, and understand the mechanics of what makes analogies work or fail. The more you practice, the more naturally these comparisons will come to you when you need them. The Rewards Mastering analogical thinking is a journey, not a destination. It requires constant practice, intellectual curiosity, and the humility to recognize when your comparisons break down. But the rewards are transformative. You'll learn faster by connecting new information to what you already know. You'll explain complex ideas with clarity that makes you invaluable in any professional setting. You'll spot flawed reasoning in arguments before others even notice something's wrong. You'll generate creative solutions by borrowing patterns from unexpected domains. Most importantly, you'll develop the mental flexibility to navigate an increasingly complex world. When AI reshapes your industry, you'll understand it by comparison to previous technological disruptions. When new social dynamics emerge, you'll make sense of them by recognizing familiar patterns in new contexts. The best thinkers aren't those who memorize the most facts—they're those who see connections others miss. Steve Jobs didn't invent the smartphone—he saw that a phone could be like a computer in your pocket. Jeff Bezos didn't invent retail—he saw that a bookstore could be like an infinite warehouse. Every breakthrough starts with someone asking "What if this is like that?" That's the power of thinking in analogies. And now you have the tools to make it yours. Your Thinking 101 Journey The Thinking 101 series is teaching you how to think clearly in a world designed to confuse you—here's our journey so far: In Episode 1, we exposed the thinking crisis—AI dependency is creating cognitive debt, and independent thinking has become the most valuable skill in the modern world. In Episode 2, you learned to distinguish deductive certainty from inductive probability and stop treating patterns as proven facts. In Episode 3, you discovered how to distinguish true causation from mere correlation—saving yourself from solving the wrong problem perfectly. Today, you learned how to harness the power of analogies while avoiding their traps—generating useful comparisons systematically, recognizing when analogies break down, and spotting false analogies that manipulate thinking. Up next—Episode 5: "Probabilistic Thinking—Living with Uncertainty." You'll learn how to think in probabilities rather than certainties, make decisions with incomplete information, and act wisely when nothing is guaranteed. Hit that subscribe button so you don't miss future episodes. Also—hit the like and notification bell. It helps with the algorithm so others see our content. Why not share this video with a colleague who you think would benefit from it? Because right now, while you've been watching this, someone just pitched a billion-dollar idea using a flawed analogy—and investors nodded along because it "sounded like" something that worked before. The only question is: will you be the one who sees through it? SOURCES CITED IN THIS EPISODE Cognitive Science Research on Analogical Reasoning Green, A.E., Fugelsang, J.A., & Dunbar, K.N. (2006). Automatic activation of categorical and abstract analogical relations in analogical reasoning. Memory & Cognition, 34(7), 1414-1421. https://link.springer.com/article/10.3758/BF03195906  Brain Pattern Recognition and Memory Storage Gentner, D., & Smith, L. (2012). Analogical Reasoning. Encyclopedia of Human Behavior (Second Edition), 1, 130-136. https://groups.psych.northwestern.edu/gentner/papers/gentnerSmith_2012.pdf  Neuroscience of Analogical Thinking Parsons, S., Maillet, D., Sayfullin, A., & Ansari, D. (2022). The Neural Correlates of Analogy Component Processes. Cognitive Science, 46(3). https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35297092/  Quibi Shutdown and Funding Details Spangler, T. (2020). Quibi Confirms Shutdown, Jeffrey Katzenberg Startup Will Shop Assets. Variety. October 22, 2020.https://variety.com/2020/digital/news/quibi-confirms-shutdown-jeffrey-katzenberg-meg-whitman-1234812643/  Quibi Funding History Crunchbase. (2020). Quibi Is Shutting Down After Raising $1.75B In Funding. October 22, 2020. https://news.crunchbase.com/startups/quibi-shutting-down/  Steve Jobs Stanford Commencement Speech Jobs, S. (2005). 'You've got to find what you love,' Jobs says. Stanford Commencement Address. June 12, 2005. https://news.stanford.edu/stories/2005/06/youve-got-find-love-jobs-says  ADDITIONAL READING On Analogical Reasoning and Cognition Holyoak, K. J., & Thagard, P. (1995). Mental Leaps: Analogy in Creative Thought. MIT Press. Gentner, D., Holyoak, K. J., & Kokinov, B. N. (Eds.). (2001). The Analogical Mind: Perspectives from Cognitive Science. MIT Press. On Thinking and Decision-Making Kahneman, D. (2011). Thinking, Fast and Slow. Farrar, Straus and Giroux. On Innovation and Cross-Domain Learning Isaacson, W. (2011). Steve Jobs. Simon & Schuster. Note: All sources cited in this episode have been accessed and verified as of October 2025.

Blanchard* trains more than 150,000 people annually in 30 countries. The firm's founder, Ken Blanchard, is one of the all-time outstanding leadership and management experts. His books, including most notably The One Minute Manager, have sold more than 28 million copies. That's what pretty much everyone knows. However, in her new biography, Catch People Doing Things Right: How Ken Blanchard Changed the Way the World Leads, veteran book editor and author Martha C. Lawrence reveals a side of Blanchard that few people outside of his immediate circle know — an exceptionally kind and generous man of deep conviction who had to overcome numerous hardships and setbacks to achieve his global stature. Martha has worked closely with Blanchard for more than two decades, following stints at Simon & Schuster and Harcourt Publishers, where she edited hundreds of books.  Catch People Doing Things Right delivers an inspiring roadmap for anyone seeking to lead with both results and relationships in mind. Blanchard, who is now 86 years old, has been a guest on Monday Morning Radio twice, in 2019 and 2022. *Formerly The Ken Blanchard Companies Monday Morning Radio is hosted by the father-son duo of Dean and Maxwell Rotbart. Photo: Martha C. Lawrence, Catch People Doing Things RightPosted: October 20, 2025 Monday Morning Run Time: 48:23 Episode: 14.20 Popular Books By Ken Blanchard: The Secret: What Great Leaders Know and Do Simple Truths of Leadership: 52 Ways to Be a Servant Leader and Build Trust  The Simple Truths of Service: Inspired by Johnny the Bagger The New One Minute Manager: A Timeless Guide to Effective Leadership, Stress Reduction, and Success in a Rapidly Changing Workplace Martha Lawrence's Mystery Novels Include: Murder in Scorpio The Cold Heart of Capricorn Ashes of Aries

Waaaaaay back in early 2023, Adam Godfrey's novella NARCISSUS landed on my radar. I don't know how or why, but it caught my attention and I was hooked by that evocative cover image. Then by then hook of the story. So I read it and I loved it! Then I had to have Adam on and he talked about how great his experience was working with Shortwave Publishing.So when Chloe Spencer's novella MEWING caught my attention, I was ready to give it a chance on the strength of my previous experience with Adam's book. Then I loved it and had her on! So when the next caught my attention… you can see where this is going.So for a couple years I have had a very happy relationship with Shortwave. I'm on their reviewer list, I bought their subscription for 2025, and I've talked to like eight of their authors. What made me finally break and ask Alan Lastufka to join me for a conversation was the very exciting news that Shortwave has signed a distribution deal with Simon & Schuster, which will be a game changer for them. Think of it - the Killer VHS series is gonna be on shelves at Barnes & Noble!What's great for listeners is that Alan shared a whole mess of details about his plans for what his existing titles will do in the future. He shared the fate of the chapbook series. He talked about specific revisions/reissues that are so exciting!It's a great story of how he got where he is today, and it's packed with details about goodies coming in the future. What more could you ask for? Well, whatever it is, I'm sure Alan is working on it and it's gonna be cooler than you would expect.For the folks who prefer to watch on YouTube: This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.thearcparty.com/subscribe

Can you be the "perfect mom" while secretly drinking around the clock? In this raw and honest conversation, Rebecca Greene sits down with Emily Redondo, author of Wife Mother Drunk: An Intergenerational Memoir of Loss and Love. From the outside, Emily had it all—four kids, a loving husband, and the picture-perfect family life. But behind closed doors, she was hiding bottles, cycling through seven rehab stays, and battling the shame that comes with chronic relapse. Emily opens up about what it's really like to struggle with alcohol addiction as a mother, why relapse doesn't mean failure, and how generational trauma shaped her relationship with drinking. This isn't a neat redemption story—it's the messy, complicated truth about recovery while raising kids, the unrealistic expectations we place on mothers, and why simply "quitting" isn't always the answer. In this episode, you'll discover: ➤ Why Emily's "perfect mom" appearance masked years of hidden drinking and multiple rehab stays ➤ The reality of chronic relapse and why it doesn't look like the stereotypical image of an "alcoholic mom" ➤ How generational patterns and her own mother's alcoholism influenced Emily's journey ➤ The changes Emily had to make at home beyond just getting sober—including boundaries, dividing household labor, and honest conversations with her kids ➤ Why self-care for mothers goes far beyond bubble baths and manicures Two powerful quotes from Emily "I never, ever quit trying. There was not like this point where it was like, I'm just gonna quit trying to quit. It was every day, every single day." "The more I wallow in what's happened and try to grapple with how terrible I was as a mom, then the more I'm robbing myself of right now. I've used up all the time to do that, and now I'm gonna get over it." Connect with Emily Redondo: Website: https://www.emilyredondoauthor.com/ Instagram: @emily_redondo_author Book: Wife Mother Drunk: An Intergenerational Memoir of Loss and Love (available on Amazon, Simon & Schuster, and other retailers) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

If you love great storytelling, you'll connect with this conversation. I sit down with Walden Hughes, a man whose Unstoppable passion has kept Old Time Radio alive for decades. As the voice behind YESTERDAY USA and a driving force with REPS, Walden has dedicated his life to preserving the art, sound, and soul of classic radio. We talk about what made those early shows so timeless, the craft of the actors, the power of imagination, and how simple audio could create entire worlds. Walden also shares how modern technology, archives, and community support are bringing these programs to new audiences. This conversation is about more than nostalgia. It's about keeping storytelling alive. Walden reminds us that great radio never fades and that imagination will always be Unstoppable. Highlights: 00:10 – Discover why Old Time Radio still captures the imagination of listeners today. 01:19 – Hear how the end of an era shaped the way we think about storytelling. 02:32 – Learn what made the performances and production of classic radio so unique. 04:25 – Explore how legendary shows left a lasting influence on modern audio. 05:16 – Gain insight into what separates timeless audio drama from today's versions. 08:32 – Find out how passion and purpose can turn nostalgia into something new. 12:15 – Uncover the community that keeps classic radio alive for new generations. 16:20 – See how creativity and teamwork sustain live radio productions. 24:48 – Learn how dedication and innovation keep 24/7 classic broadcasts running. 33:57 – Understand how listener support helps preserve the magic of radio history. 37:38 – Reflect on why live storytelling still holds a special kind of energy. 41:35 – Hear how new technology is shaping the future of audio storytelling. 46:26 – Discover how preservation groups bring lost performances back to life. 50:29 – Explore the process of restoring and protecting rare audio archives. 55:31 – Learn why authenticity and care matter in preserving sound for the future.     About the Guest: From a young age, Walden Hughes developed a lifelong love for radio and history. Appearing in documentaries on “Beep Baseball,” he went on to collect more than 50,000 old-time radio shows and produce hundreds of live nostalgic broadcasts. His work celebrates radio's golden era through events, celebrity interviews, and re-creations performed nationwide. His deep family roots reach back to early American history — from a Mayflower ancestor to relatives who served in major U.S. wars — shaping his respect for storytelling and legacy. With degrees in economics, political science, and an MBA in finance, he built a successful career in investments before turning his passion into purpose. As general manager and producer for Yesterday USA and longtime board member of SPERDVAC, he's preserved classic entertainment for future generations. Honored with awards like the Herb Ellis and Dick Beals Awards, he continues to consult for icons like Kitty Kallen and the Sinatra family, keeping the voices of radios past alive for audiences today.   Ways to connect with Walden:   Cell:  714/454-3281 Email:  waldenhughes@yesterdayusa.com or www.yesterdayusa.com Live shows are Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights beginning at 7:30 PDT.     About the Host:   Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening!   Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast   If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset .   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review   Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.       Transcription Notes:   Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:20 Well, hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of unstoppable mindset. Wherever you are listening from, we're really glad you're here, and we are going to have a guest who we've had on before we get to have him on again, and we're going to grill him really good. I want you to remember that a few weeks ago, we talked to Walden Hughes. And Walden is a collector of old radio shows. He's been very involved with organizations that help promote the hobby of old radio shows, and old rate Old Time Radio, as I do, and I thought it would be kind of fun to have him back, because there are a number of events coming up that I think are very relevant to talk about, and so we're going to do that. So Walden, welcome back to unstoppable mindset. We're glad you're here. Michael, been such a long time, and glad you invited me back. Well, I know it's been so long well, so tell me, let's, let's go back again. You know, radio people talk about the golden days of radio, or the time of old radio. When do we think that? When do we say that officially ended, although I think it went beyond   Walden Hughes ** 02:29 it. I though I jumped 30th, 1962, I'm, yeah, I I think the style changed a little bit, I'm probably a romantic somewhat. I love the style of old time radio. I love how it sound. Yeah, I think in in the 3040s and 50s, the studios and the theater that they use sounded great for radio, and it disturbed me, and I bet you have the same feeling, Michael, that when you get new production and new the new studio, it just doesn't sound right. I feel the equilibrium is not quite the way. I love old time radio. I think Old Time Radio A prime web. I think a lot of new productions out there that, you know, release their podcasts and things on a weekly basis. I think they're handicapped. They just don't have the budget to really create and build a studio the way I think it should be, that if they have, it sound just natural and just right.   Michael Hingson ** 03:43 And I think that's part of it, but I think the other part of it is that people today don't seem to know how to act and create the same kind of environment with their voice that Old Time Radio actors did in the 30s, 40s and 50s and into into the early 60s, even we had Carl Amari on several weeks ago. And of course, one of the things that Carl did was, did complete recreations of all of the Twilight Zone shows. And even some of those are, are they sound sort of forced? Some of the actors sound forced, and they they haven't really learned how to sound natural in radio like some of the older actors do.   Walden Hughes ** 04:34 Yeah, and I know Bob we call did it for a bike I get thrown off when he generally way. Did have the highway stars remote end, and he had a Stock Company of Chicago after, and I could hear the equilibrium just not quite right. That bothers me. I don't know if the average person picks up on that, and you're right. I don't know if. Is it the style of acting that they teach in film and TV? It needs a radio acting different in a lot of ways, and you got it as you point. It's got to be realistic into the environment. And actors don't get that for radio,   Michael Hingson ** 05:25 yeah, and you talked about the last day for you of real radio was September 30, 1962 and we should probably explain why that is   Walden Hughes ** 05:36 diet throughout the CBS your Troy John and suspense as the two main keys of old time radio. And that was the last day of old time radio out of New York. And I hardcore Lacher sister. Think that's one radio Shane died per se   Michael Hingson ** 05:58 Gunsmoke and Have Gun Will Travel were gone, right,   Walden Hughes ** 06:01 and the soap operas ended in November 2560 I like soap operas. I know a lot of people do not, but there's something can't there's something campy about it that I like. I would, I would like, I prefer to listen to somebody also proper than do some of the new production and make sure the acting style,   Michael Hingson ** 06:27 but I think there's a lot to do with it that that makes that the case. And I think you're absolutely right that so many things are different, but at the same time, radio did sort of continue. And there was, there were some good shows zero hour, the Hollywood radio theater that Rod Serling did later. And of course, NPR did Star Wars.   Walden Hughes ** 06:58 And I like that I did.   Michael Hingson ** 07:02 Yeah, I think that was done pretty well. And what do you think of CBS mystery theater? Honestly, CBS mystery theater, I thought that generally, CBS mystery theater had some good actors, and they did a pretty good job. I I can't complain too much about that, and it was on for a long time.   Walden Hughes ** 07:18 But what do you think of the script, though?   Michael Hingson ** 07:22 Well, part of the problem for me and CBS mystery theater is, and I'm sure it was a cost issue. There weren't very many people in most of the scripts. There was like two or three or so and and that was a problem. But I think that that the scripts suffered because there weren't more people in the scripts to really make it again sound pretty natural. I think that was a problem.   Walden Hughes ** 07:52 Yeah, Hyman Brown really knew how to crank it out. I think it has a good, solid B production, you know, the scripts. And I think the scripts are quite hampered. You couldn't, actually couldn't knock the actors. I thought the actors were Mercedes McCambridge and all those were terrific actors, but you're right. Sam dam wrote a lot of them, yeah, and things like that. But I   Michael Hingson ** 08:21 think, I think they would have been nicer to have more people in the scripts. But I understand that, that that probably was more difficult to do just because of union and scale and the cost. But gee, I think it would have made a big difference in the shows. But Hyman Brown really knew, as you said, How to crank them   Walden Hughes ** 08:39 out. Yeah, that's why, in some ways, I think the series, radio theater, the way 70 is a it's a terrific series. Didn't have the financial backing to make it last longer than the two years I was   Michael Hingson ** 08:52 on. Now, one show I really liked on in PR later was alien world, which I thought was good. I'd never heard any of them, so they were good, yeah, yeah, okay. I'm very happy with alien worlds. There were some actors from radio and in early television and so on. Hans con read, for example, was on some, yeah, I thought alien worlds went really well. I guess we're gonna have to get you some and get you to lose, Okay, interesting.   Walden Hughes ** 09:21 I just got done taking a eight week course on entrepreneurship for disabled people, and my idea is to pitch that we should be doing audio theater as a podcast. I think if it's big enough, it attracts national sponsors. And if you look at the numbers, everybody podcasting, 135 million people in the USA download a podcast once a week. Revenue, $2.46 billion yeah. Worldwide, 5 billion people download a podcast once a week. Revenue, three. $4 billion and so she had a well known he had a podcast with well known stars. I think she could get that 1% in that market, and then you can generate between the 24 to 40 million, $40 million in revenue a year. That would easily sure be a good financial model, and that's what I'm pitching. But when I went to the court, they asked me what to analyze, what's wrong with my what obstacles I have. And one of the things I put down is besides the studio we talked about and the acting, which a really good actor, actress, everybody, like a Beverly Washburn can pick up a script and knock it out of the park right away. Most actors are not able to do that. That's a real gift, as Michael was pointing out. But the other thing most scripts are written for film and TV, which is a verbal which is a eye medium, and a radio script is written for the ear, and I have produced enough the ear is faster than the eye. If you take like a TV script and a book and read it out loud, the mind wander. It has to have a faster pace for the ear. And I don't think more people notice that when they're analyzing a script,   Michael Hingson ** 11:31 yeah, but you you're sort of treading around the edges of something else. I think that is fascinating, that we can start to talk about one of the things that has occurred some over the past few years, and whether it be with a podcast or even just with the mechanisms we're using today, is there are some attempts to recreate some of the old radio shows and and you and I have both Well, we Have to get you acting in one of those shows, Walden. But I have, I've acted in the shows Walden works behind the scenes, and there are a number of people who have been involved with him. And you really can tell some of the good actors who performed in old radio as you said, Beverly Washburn, Carolyn Grimes and others. Carolyn, of course, is Zuzu from It's A Wonderful Life, and by the way, she's going to be coming on unstoppable mindset in the not too distant future. But, but the point is that you can tell those people because they've done it, and they're very comfortable with it, and they know how to make it come across really well. So for example, you're the president of the radio enthusiasts of Puget Sound. Now you're down here in Southern California. How did you work out being the president of reps?   Walden Hughes ** 13:01 Why my closest friends a hobby, Brian Haygood, and Brian's been one of the big movers and shakers of reps over the years. And when the founder, Mike Sprague, decided to step down, they were looking for new people to run showcase back in 2007 so Brian asked me, because I'm the one that has the contacts, you know, I'm the one booking guests for y USA rep, I'm sure the go to person with contacts and phone numbers, everybody. And so I just wound up doing the CO produced showcase back in 2007 with Brian. So that's been one of the things I wound up doing.   13:50 I produce   Walden Hughes ** 13:52 almost 30 923, or four days events of All Time Radio around the country. So tell us about showcase, showcase. It will be September 18, 19/20, 21st is a big event for us, for reps, and we got funding thanks to Ford culture and the state of Washington to do this. And it's free. You can go to reps online.org, and RSVP and come. And people that you get to see this time around are Beverly Washburn from Star Trek, when the bear ministry shows, yeah, when, when the bear man a good, solid voice actress, and also is a coach. Carolyn Grimes, as you mentioned, Margaret O'Brien, of course, you know Margaret from Oscar war winner from meet me in St Louis, Gigi Perot, and she goes back to the 40s and 50s. And did the belly hunting TV show, Tommy cook and Lacher Riley, a radio show. Ivan Kirk. Troy. Bobby Benson. Bill Owen, who you had on ABC TV announcer, author of The Big broadcast, Ron cocking. He and his great wife, Gloria Macmillan ran acting school for children.   Michael Hingson ** 15:15 Bill Ratner Miller, of course, is famous for radio.   Walden Hughes ** 15:18 Right arm is Brooks. Bill Ratner from GI Joe. Bill Johnson, who does Bob Hope around the country. John provoke to Timmy Lacher. Chuck Daugherty, the announcer for second announcer for Sergeant president of the Yukon King and discover the Beach Boys. David Osman from fire sign theater. Phil prosper from fire sign theater. John Iman, who was from the TV show Lacher. And there was Larry Albert and John Jensen, the big band Lacher. John Laurie gasping, and Dan Murphy used to be the program director ki Xi out in Seattle. And so that's gonna be a great weekend. We'll produce close to it, I think, 1819 radio recreation that's still negotiating. And we have several interviews and panel. It's all free. So you can go to repsonline.org, and that's one of our two major events, the other major events at the Christmas show in December, the first week in December. I'm hoping Mike can make it up that   Michael Hingson ** 16:31 weekend, I was hoping to be able to come to the Showcase. And one of my favorite shows, and Walden and I had talked about doing it, is Richard diamond private detective. And I actually asked to be cast as Richard diamond, but then a speaking engagement came up. So unfortunately, rather than being in Washington, I am going to be in Minnesota, I'm sorry, in Pennsylvania, speaking. So I won't be able to be there, but we'll do Richard diamond. That's gonna be a fun show one of these days. We'll do it.   Walden Hughes ** 17:06 We'll put we put it aside. So when Mike can can do it, we can do it so but no, really blessed to have the financial grants to keep audio theater live on a nonprofit basis, and that that that's a great board, and cannot every group's had that financial abilities right now to do that, and it's so expensive around the country to do it, terms of airfare, hotel commitments and Just meeting room costs, I mean, for people who may or may not know, when you go to a hotel a live event now, a lot of hotels expect that that meeting room needs to generate at least $10,000 of income per day. That that's a lot of money. And so we have a place that doesn't, that doesn't do that, and we're able to produce that. And so rep definitely focus on the live, live audio theater part, and also has a large library, like 33,000 shows I heard where we have so people can download, and we're also aggressively buying discs and things to add to the library. And I remember spur back I part of and I'll tell you some of the latest news and that when we talk to that topic, but it's just old time radio is in really good   Michael Hingson ** 18:41 shape at the moment. You mentioned Larry Albert, and most people won't know, but Larry Albert's been in radio for what, 40 years, and has played Detective Harry Niles that whole time, and he's also Dr Watson on Sherlock Holmes again, there are some really good professionals out there, which is cool, yeah, yeah, who understand and know how to talk in a way that really draws people in, which is what it's all about,   Walden Hughes ** 19:15 absolutely. And considering Larry and a co founder, they run all vacations, sure, the after of imagination theater. Sure they carry the banner up in Seattle, and it's pretty amazing what they're able to produce.   Michael Hingson ** 19:32 Yeah. Now, in addition to the Showcase and the Christmas show that reps is going to be doing, reps also does some other shows, don't they, during the year for like veterans and others up in the Seattle area, Tulsa, right?   Walden Hughes ** 19:46 We I thought that idea down here at spur back in 2017 the Long Beach Veterans Hospital, they still have the original theme. Leader, Mike, that Jack Benny and Bob Hope did their shows in front of the Vets at Long Beach. And I know you and I have radio shows from the Long Beach Veterans Hospital. Yes, and the stage is still there. It's the biggest stage I've ever seen. Mike, the seating area is mobile, so that way they can bring patients in who are wheelchairs or whatever, or in bed. They still have the 1940 film projectors and booth up above that they want to run movies in there, and it's just a remarkable feeling to be on stage that Bob Hope and and Jack Bailey did a show, and then the famous broadcast were Ralph Edward consequences, yeah, the Hubert Smith, who was A patient at the hospital and and so in 2017 we did. It's a Wonderful Life. And we had a gigantic crowd. I think it was almost 200 people came to that. And I was for the public and people inside the hospital. And it was, it was a exciting event to have deluxe version of It's a Wonderful Life, which was the 70th anniversary of the broadcast, right? And so I decided to take that concept and take up to Seattle and start performing shows inside the VA hospital system in Seattle. It took a while. It's hard, it's hard to get into the VA, VA system to put on shows, because you got to talk to the right people, and you gotta get a hold of PR and not always easy. So I found the right contacts, and then the state awards, and then has a grant for for veterans or veteran family member to be in shows, and so we're able to get some funding from the state for that so, and then we will also encourage them to come to showcase in September so. But no, that's that's another program we got going for that,   Michael Hingson ** 22:20 someone who I unfortunately never did get to meet, although I heard a lot of his shows, and he helped continue to bring memories of radio to especially the military. Was Frank brazzi, who was around for quite a while, and then he he was also on yesterday USA, a lot. Wasn't he sure where he's   Walden Hughes ** 22:46 from, from 1993 until 2018 so he had a good 25 year run on why USA, Frank and I co host the Friday night show for many years, until he passed away in 2018 show from 2000 to 2018 Frank was amazing guy. He was. He owned his own radio station in South Carolina, South Carolina Island. When he was 19, he had to form the first tape course in Hollywood show Bob Hope would hire him, and he would record all Bob stuff at Paramount Studio and sit to radio station and travel with Bob to record his radio Show. He also was Jim Hawthorne producer for television, Frank wound up developing board games a pass out sold 6 million copies in the new wedding the dating game. He had a company that got gift for game shows on television. He also set up a brother in a company to monitor when commercials were run on TV. Frank also produced record albums every day. He had Walter Winchell record the life of Alex joelson. Met with Jimmy Durante, had Jimmy Durante do an album, Eddie Cantor and so frank is one of these great entrepreneurs that was able to make a lot of money and spend a lot of it on his love for radio. He was the substitute for little beaver, for example, on Red Rider so and he loved doing the show the golden days of radio, which started in 1949 and from 1967 on, it was part of the Armed Forces Radio Service, which was put on 400 stations. And I'm the, I'm the care caregiver, caretaker of. All that items. So I have all the shows and getting them transferred and play them on y USA and Frank wanted to make sure his entire collection was available to collectors. So we want to make sure things were copied and things like that for people to enjoy. But no big part of old time radio, in a lot of ways, not behind the scene a little bit. You know, wasn't a big name person during the golden days of radio, but afterwards, wound up being a major person that carried the fire Troy, full time radio.   Michael Hingson ** 25:35 I know we talked about a little bit, but talk to us about yesterday, USA, that has been around quite a while, and in general, for those who don't know, yesterday, USA is an internet radio station, actually two, if you will. There's a red and a blue network of yesterday USA, and they both stations broadcast to old radio 24 hours a day, although conversations and up to date conversations are interspersed, it still primarily is a a vehicle for playing old radio shows, right?   Walden Hughes ** 26:13 Yeah, been around since 1983 founded by its start. Yeah. Founded by Bill Bragg, Bill started the largest communication museum in the world back in 1979 in Dallas, Texas, and he had a film exchanger. And there was a TV station called a nostalgia channel, and it had these films of old TV shows, but they didn't have the media to transfer it, and so they contacted Bill. Bill agreed to transfer the film. He asked what it is exchanged for him. They said, we can give you an audio channel on satellite. And they gave that to him. And so he tried to decide what to do. So he started a broadcast Old Time Radio over satellite, and he was over the big C span satellite   Speaker 1 ** 27:12 until Oh into the 2005   Walden Hughes ** 27:16 era or so. Wound up being the audio shop carrier for WGN got it high in 2000 at the third most popular internet broadcast site in the world, behind the BBC and CNN around the Lacher saw around 44 that's not too bad, with 15,000 stations online.   Michael Hingson ** 27:41 I remember, I remember it was probably like 1998 or so, maybe 97 we were living in New Jersey, and I was doing something on my computer. And I don't even remember how I discovered it, but suddenly I found yesterday, USA, and at that time, yesterday, USA was one channel, and people could become DJs, if you will, and play old radio shows. You could have an hour and a half slot. And every other week you updated your broadcast, and they put on your shows at different times during the the two week period. But it was a wave that, again, a lot of people got an opportunity to listen to radio, and I'm sure it was very popular.   Walden Hughes ** 28:32 Yeah, yeah, if they'll to Lacher show, we don't, we don't get 40,000 to 60,000 listening hours a month, with it a lot, because a lot, maybe some people might listen to seven minutes, some might people listen to a half hour and all that accumulative, it's almost 60,000 hours a month. So that's a lot of hours that people are accessing in it, there's something nice about being alive. I don't know what you think Mike, but doing something live is pretty special, and that's, that's the nice thing about what yesterday USA can provide, and we can talk, take calls, and then, you know, in the old days, you have more and more people talk about Old Time Radio. No doubting, but a lot of new people don't have those memories, so we we might do some other things to keep it interesting for people to talk about, but it's still the heart and soul. Is still old time radio in a lot of ways, and we're definitely the fiber, I think for new people to find old time radio.   29:43 How did you get involved with it?   Walden Hughes ** 29:47 I became aware of it in the early 80s when sperback mentioned it in the news trailer, so I knew it's out there. And I called, and Bill returned my call. I said, I would like my cable TV. A company to play it, and I contacted my cable TV. They couldn't get to that channel that was on the satellite, so they put big band music on those dead on the community board. And so at the same time as you about 1998 I had a good enough computer with a good enough sound card I could pick up yesterday, USA. I was aware of it. It started on the internet in 1996 I started to listen, and then I would sort of call in around 2000 they would ask a question Bill and Mike and not really know the answer, so I will quickly call and give the answer, then leave. Eventually, they realized that I knew kitty Cowan, the big band, singer of the 40s and 50s. They asked me to bring on and do the interview, which we did September 17 of 2000 and then they asked, Could I do interviews on a regular basis? And so when a kiddie friend who I knew, Tess Russell, who was Gene Autry's Girl Friday, who ran kmpc for the audience, that was the station with the stars down the road, easy listening music,   Michael Hingson ** 31:21 golden broadcasting, and that was the station Gene Autry owned, yep.   Walden Hughes ** 31:26 And I think everybody in the music business but the old touch rush all favor. So she she hooked up, she signed up. She gave me set book 17 guests for me, right away from Joe staff or the Troy Martin to Pat Boone Patti Page, who wrote them all out. So I had a major start, and then I started to contact people via letters, celebrities and things. And I think it's a really good batting average. Mike, I had a success rate of 20% Wow. Wish it was a person that didn't I had no contact with that I could turn into a guess. I always thought I was a pretty good batting average. Yeah, and I got Margaret Truman that way. I mean, she called me, said, Wong, I forgot I did this radio show with Jimmy Stewart. She did jackpot, you know, the screen director of Playhouse. And we talked about her time on The Big Show with Tallulah Bankhead. They said, a big help with Fred Allen to her. She we talked about she hosted a show, NBC show called weekday with what the weekday version of monitor was, Mike Wallace. And she talks about how Mike had a terrible temper, and if he got upset with the engineer, she has to grab his jacket and pull him back in his chair just to try to cool them off. And so we had a great time with Margaret O'Brien, Margaret Truman, but, but I always thought that would a pretty good bat Navy getting 20% and in those days, in early 2000 a lot of celebrities would be were willing to interact with the through the website, with you, and so I did that. So I booked hundreds of celebrity interviews over the years, and so it's been a, I think, an important part what I do is trying to preserve people's memories, right that way we have the recordings.   Michael Hingson ** 33:43 And so how long was Bill with yesterday, USA.   Walden Hughes ** 33:49 I passed away in 2019 so Bill from 83 to 2019, to us, 10 years or so of his wife, though he had   Michael Hingson ** 34:05 Alzheimer's and dementia, and so you could tell he was he was sounding older, yeah, and   Walden Hughes ** 34:11 he wasn't behind the scene. He was really erratic in a lot of ways. So Kim, Kim and I wound up his wife, and I wound up running the station for the last 10 years, behind the scene, okay, Bill wasn't able to do it, and so I would be the one handling the interaction with the public and handling the just jockeys, and Kim would do the automation system and do the paperwork. So she and I pretty much ran the station.   34:43 And now you do   Walden Hughes ** 34:45 it, I do it, yeah, and so I think Bill always had in mind that I'd be the one running the station in a lot of ways. And think to the listeners, we've been able to pay the bills enough to keep it. Going, I would love to generate more income for it.   Michael Hingson ** 35:03 Well, tell us about that. How are you doing the income generation? And so most of it is through   Walden Hughes ** 35:09 a live auction that we have in November this year, will be on Saturday, November 22 and people donate gift cards or items, and people bid on it, or people donate, and that money we basically use to help pay the monthly bills, which are power bills and phone bills and things like that, and so, which is a remarkable thing. Not every internet radio station has a big enough fan base to cover the cost, and so all the internet stations you see out there, everybody, the owners, sort of really have to pull money out of their own pocket. But why USA been around long enough, it has enough loyal following that our listenership really kicks in. I mean, we built a brand new studio here with the with the audience donating the funds, which is pretty remarkable. You know, to do that,   Michael Hingson ** 36:16 yeah, you got the new board in, and it's working and all that. And that's, a good thing. It really is. Well, I have been a listener since I discovered y USA. When we moved out to California for a while, I wasn't quite as active of a listener, but I still worked at it as I could. But then we moved down here, and then after Karen passed, was easier to get a lot more directly involved. And so I know I contribute to the auction every year, and I'm gonna do it again this year.   Walden Hughes ** 36:49 So would you, when you were after what you knew, why you said, Did you did you come with your question still quite a bit when you were working and traveling all the time over the years.   Michael Hingson ** 37:01 Oh, yeah, yeah, oh, I did a lot of times, and still, do I listen to some internet radio stations? Why USA among them when I travel, just because when I go to a new hotel, sometimes I can make the TV work, and sometimes I can't, but also sometimes finding the stations that I want to listen to is a little bit more of a challenge, whereas I can just use my my smartphone, my iPhone, and I've got a number of stations programmed in the only time I have had A little bit of a challenge with some of that is when I travel outside the US, sometimes I can't get direct access to some of the stations because of copyright laws. They don't they don't allow them to be broadcast out of the US, but mostly even there, I'm able to do it. But I do like to listen to old radio when I travel, typically, not on an airplane, but when I when I land, yes, yeah.   Walden Hughes ** 38:08 I think that's one thing that they ended up taking over. I think a lot of people grew up listening to the radio. Enjoy the uniqueness of radio station had. I don't know if you see that today, but I think the internet have replaced that.   Michael Hingson ** 38:24 Well, somewhat, I've seen some articles that basically say that there is a lot more shortwave listening and actual radio listening to radio stations than there is through the internet, but there is an awful lot of listening to the radio stations through the internet as well, but people do still like to listen to radio.   Walden Hughes ** 38:50 What do you think podcast? How you think podcasts fit in? I mean, you'd be hosting your own show. How you think that fit into the overall consumer questioning habit?   Michael Hingson ** 38:59 Well, I think then, what's going on with podcasts is that, like with anything, there are some really good ones. There are a lot of people who just do do something, and it's not necessarily really great quality. They think they're doing great, and they maybe are, but, but I think that overall, podcasting is something that people listen to when they're running, when they're walking, when they're doing exercising, when they're doing something else, running on a treadmill or whatever, a lot More than listening to a radio program that probably requires a little bit more concentration. But make no mistake about it, podcasts are here to stay, and podcasts are very dominant in in a lot of ways, because people do listen to them   Walden Hughes ** 39:56 a niche audience. So you find you find your audience who. Are looking for that particular topic, and so they tune into that their favorite podcast that they knew there really might be covering that topic.   Michael Hingson ** 40:07 Sure, there is some of that. But going back to what you were talking about earlier, if you get some good audio drama, and I know that there are some good podcasts out there that that do some things with good drama, that will draw in a wider audience, and that gets to be more like radio and and I think people like radio. People like what they used to listen to, kids so much today, don't but, well, they never heard old they never heard radio. But by the same token, good acting and good drama and good podcasts will draw people in just like it always has been with radio.   Walden Hughes ** 40:54 What I'm also noticing like the day the disc jockeys are, they somewhat gone. I mean, we grew up in an era where you had well known hosts that were terrific Dick jockey that kept you entertained. And I make it, I don't listen to too much because, for example, everybody the easy listening big band era, pretty much not in LA in the La radio market right now, right and I missed it.   Michael Hingson ** 41:23 I miss it too. And I agree with you, I think that we're not seeing the level of really good radio hosts that we used to there are some on podcasts. But again, it is different than it used to be. And I think some podcasts will continue to do well and and we will see how others go as as time passes, but I think that we don't see a Gary Owens on television on radio anymore. We don't see Jim Lang or Dick Whittington and whitting Hill and all those people, we don't see any of that like we used to. And so even Sirius XM isn't providing as much of that as as it used to.   Walden Hughes ** 42:20 And so what do you think AI is going to fit? I was listening to, I'm a sport fan, and Mike is a sport fan, so I like listening to ESPN and Fox Sports Radio.   Michael Hingson ** 42:32 And I was listening to a discussion over the weekend that they are, they are working some of the immediate it to replace the play by play announcer they're working with. Ai, can I figure eventually that can be a caution. It to do away with all announcers. I'm not sure that's going to happen, because I don't know. It doesn't seem like it could. I'm not sure that that will happen. I think that even if you look at the discussions about audible and other organizations providing AI voices to read books, what people say, and I'm sure over time, this will change a little bit, but and I'll get back to the button in a moment, people Say, I would much rather have a human narrated book than an AI narrated book, and the reason is, is because AI hasn't captured the human voice. Yet you may have somebody who sounds like an individual person to a degree, but you don't have the same pauses, the same intonations, the same kind of thing with AI that you do with humans. Now, will that get better over time? Sure, it will. But will it get it to be as good as humans? I think that's got a long way to go yet, and I don't think that you're going to see AI really replacing people in that regard. I think AI's got a lot that it can do, but I actually had somebody on the podcast last year, and one of the things that he said is, AI will never replace anyone. People will replace people with AI, maybe, although that may or may not be a good thing, but nobody has to be replaced because of AI, because you can always give them other jobs to do. So for example, one of the discussions that this gentleman and I had were was about having AI when you have autonomous vehicles and you have trucks that can drive themselves, and so you can ship things from place to place, keep the driver in the truck anyway. And instead of the driver driving the vehicle, the driver can be given other tasks to do, so that you still keep that person busy. And you you become more efficient. And so you let i. I do the things that it can do, but there are just so many things that AI isn't going to do that I don't think that AI is ever going to replace humans. The whole point is that we make leaps that AI is not going to be able to do.   Walden Hughes ** 45:15 Yeah, I think a good example in the audio book field, a really great reader can give you emotion and play the characters and make it realistic. And I don't know AI ever going to reach that point to bring emotions and feelings into a reading of story   Michael Hingson ** 45:32 not the same way. And as I said, I've been involved or listened and watched discussions where people say, for example, I might use AI to read a non fiction book because I'm not really paying so much attention to the reader and I'm just getting the information. But when it comes to reading a fiction book, and when it comes to really wanting to focus on the reader, I don't want AI is what I constantly hear. I want a person, and I understand that,   Walden Hughes ** 46:00 yeah, I think what you'll see AI, especially, take over the drive thru when people go to a fast food place. I can see AI replacing the interaction and trying to get those things corrected. I can see that   Michael Hingson ** 46:14 maybe, maybe, I mean, you know some of that to a degree, but I think that people are still going to rule out in the end, for quite a while. Well, you know, in talking about all the different radio organizations, I know we talked about a little bit last night last time, but tell me about spurt back.   Walden Hughes ** 46:36 Yeah, I can give you some new updates. Spoke actually been around to 1974   Michael Hingson ** 46:42 I remember when spurred back began a person who I knew, who was a listener to my radio program, Jerry Hindi, guess, was involved with with all of that. My problem with attending spurred back meetings was that it was they were way too far away from me at UC Irvine to be able to do it, but I joined by mail for a while, and, and, and that was pretty good. But by the same token, you know, it was there,   Walden Hughes ** 47:11 it was there. And spur back. Have honored over 500 people who worked in the golden days of radio. A lot of district donated. They had the meetings in the conventions now we're evolving very quickly this year into more preservation work. So we have bought over $10,000 in computers here recently. We bought and we donated, actually, we won a prize, although the first Lacher disk turntables from Japan, which is over a $10,000 turntable, we'll be using that to help dub disc. And the board is just voted in. It's going to increase the board to at least 11 people next year who will have a carryover of the seven board member and we want to have no new board members. So maybe you and I can talk about that Mike for you to be on for next year, because we'll be definitely expanding the board with 11 one. So I think it'd be really strong in the preservation stuff, because perfect got 20 to 30,000 deaths that need to get out there. And with all your new equipment, it's amazing how full time radio sounds so good today terms of the new technology, and compare where I started collecting the 70 and I ran into a lot of even commercial stuff really muddy in those days. Mike, I bet you did too, and it's a remarkable difference. Spur back is planning to be at the Troy Boston festival next April, what does spread back? Stand for the society to preserve and encourage radio drama, variety and comedy. And you can go to spur back.com Join. You can go to repsonlect.org to join. And we then mentioned yesterday, USA. Yesterday usa.com or.net and can go there and listen away and participate in the auction, which will be coming up November 22 Yeah, very important to do as well. But anyway, I really think full time radio is in a really good spot. Mike. I think if it was for the internet, I don't know if we would find all the young people who are interested in it. I think it then it been a double edged sword. It knocked out a lot of dealers. You know, they used to make money selling their tapes and CDs and everything, and I bought a lot. I know you did too over the years, but those days are pretty. Pretty much done, and but if found a lot of new younger people to find the stations or find podcast and they get to learn about yesterday USA and Old Time Radio, and all the different radio ones more and all the different internet station are playing it until they can expose and I don't think that would have happened before the internet, so I think it'll always have it created a whole new listenership.   Michael Hingson ** 50:30 I am still amazed at some of the things that I hear. I remember once when somebody found a whole bunch of old Petri wine sponsored Sherlock Holmes with basil, Rathbone and Nigel Bruce. They were horrible quality. Was it Chris who   Walden Hughes ** 50:50 found? Yep, Chris one best founded me up and found me a bookstore.   Michael Hingson ** 50:55 And the quality wasn't wasn't good at all, but they were remastered, and they sound incredible. They do how they do it, because I'd love to be able to do that with shows that I have, and like to remaster them.   Walden Hughes ** 51:13 Yeah, what happened was, you know, they were two writers, green and Boucher, Lacher, Lacher, right, and Boucher was a famous bachelor Khan. The famous mystery convention is named after him. And Dennis Green was an actor on radio, and he was also a historian. He knew, like all everything about Sherlock Holmes. And so they created the new venture who saw a comb based upon maybe a scene from a previous right story and gets expanded upon it. And so when it when one of them passed away, the collection wound up in a bookstore in Berkeley, California, and crystal investor found out. And so there became a buying group led by John tough fellow, Kenny Greenwald, Dick Millen, Joey brewing and others, got in a bidding war with the Library of Congress, and they outbid and won. They paid $15,000 for the sets of Sherlock, Holmes and so and Shirley Boone was an NBC audio engineer and chief film engineer. He really knew how to dub, and so they they did a terrific job. And then they decided to put out a record album on their own with the first two episodes. And then after that, they decided to market it to Simon Schuster, and they decided to do small vignettes. They could copyright the vignette. These were quite three minutes introduction, so they would get Ben Wright, who wanted to always Sherlock Holmes and Peggy Webber in order to reminisce and or create little scenes to set up the stories that way they could copyright that part. They couldn't copyright the show because they fell in the public domain, right? But they wound up paying the estates of everybody anyway. But that's what how they all came out, and they were hoping to do Gunsmoke. We talked to Kenny Greenwald and others, but that never, that never came off and but that's part of the remarkable thing that Karl Marx done. He's been able to get into CBS, and I think he's working on NBC, and he licensed them, so he'll be able to get into the vault and get more stuff out for all of it to enjoy. And that's an amazing thing that Carl drives for the hobby is to get new stuff out there. It's been locked away for all these years.   Michael Hingson ** 53:53 I am just amazed at the high quality. I'd love to learn more about audio engineering to be able to do that, because I have a lot of recording I'd love to make a lot better than they are.   Walden Hughes ** 54:05 Yeah, Jerry Henry used to use a software called Diamond Cut, ah, and I would the those originally was used for the Edison solder records. And the guy who issued this, Joe, they developed the software. And that's where Joe, hi, who did so much transfer work, that was the program he wound up using to create good sound,   Michael Hingson ** 54:32 yeah, and, and did a lot of it,   Walden Hughes ** 54:36 yep, see there, see, there was a software, everybody, I think original is hardware. And I think originally almost was a $50,000 piece of equipment, harder before 2000 now it's gone to software base and a couple $1,000 that's another way. That's another program that people use to clean disk. Now. Crackles and pop out of the recording.   Michael Hingson ** 55:02 So but it's not just the snap crackle and pop. It's getting the the real fidelity back, the lows and the highs and all that you said, what was the one he used? Diamond Cut. Diamond Cut, yeah. Diamond Cut, yeah. But yeah. It's just amazing. The kinds of things that happen, like with the Adventures of Sherlock Holmes and and others.   Walden Hughes ** 55:23 But you also have good ears for that. Because, yeah, I remember about 2025, years ago, it was serious. XM. Everybody has this stereo sound, I know, if you're shooting, has a certain ambiance about it. And there were companies that were taking old time radio and creating that same effect, and that could bug me. I was so used to listen to old radio show in an analog feel about it. And they when they try to put false stereo in a recording, yeah, oh my gosh. It just didn't sound right. And so they've gotten away from that pill, a lot of new dubbing. They do don't have that. So it sounds terrific now, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 56:15 sounds a lot better. What do you think is the future of the hobby?   Walden Hughes ** 56:19 I think more and more stuff are coming out. A lot of stuff that were with agreements to hold on to the material have disappeared, because a lot of it is passing from generation to generation. And so I think over the next 10 years, you see so much more stuff coming out. In some ways, that's sort of what you John Larry and I do. We collect almost everything, just because you got to make sure it's captured for the for the next generation, even though we might not be listening to it. There's so much stuff we don't listen to do everything. But I think we're, we're short of the wide billions of old time radio so we try to capture all of it and preserve it on hard drives, yeah, but eventually it'll go to future generations. But I really think more and more stuff are coming out. I think with the yesterday USA, more and more people will find it. And I'm hoping, with creating new audio theater, I would like to reproduce the great radio scripts we have no recordings for, like one man, family, I love, a mystery, all those things. That's sort of what I want to do, is one of my goals. And I think be great to hear stories that we've all collected, that we wonder about, and to get audio production behind some of these scripts. And I think it's in very good shape. It will all come down to money, Michael, as you know, you know,   Michael Hingson ** 57:58 but I also think that it's important that we, as we're recreating the shows, that while we can, we have people who understand what we really need for actors who are going to be recreating the shows, are able to find the right people to do it, train them how to do it. I think that's so important.   Walden Hughes ** 58:19 I think so. I think, I think you find a lot of young people who like theater, who are not necessarily radio fan, if they came, if the radio fan, like Brian Henderson and people like that, they become really good actor because they love to listen to the shows ahead of time. Yeah. Beverly Washburn does the same. She likes hearing the original performances that way. She get field for me to the show. And I think you and I think Larry does it that way. And you might not necessarily want to copy everything, but you got a benchmark to work from, and you sort of know what, with the intent when   Michael Hingson ** 59:01 you say Larry, which Larry? Larry Gasman,   Walden Hughes ** 59:03 great, yeah. And I think that's a great help to study and listen how people did it, because I think a lot of old time radio, it's like the prime rib. It was the best of the best of all time of radio drama, and it's a great way to learn the craft, by listening to it and absorbing it.   Michael Hingson ** 59:30 Well, if people want to reach out to you and maybe learn more about yesterday, USA or reps and just talk with you about radio, how do they do that, they can give me a   Walden Hughes ** 59:41 call at 714-545-2071, that's my studio number for the radio stations. Lot of times I can, I'll pick it up and talk to on air, off air. They can always drop me an email Walden shoes at yesterday. Us. Dot com and happy the answer, you can always call my cell phone at 714-454-3281,   Walden Hughes ** 1:00:11 you can chase me down at over, at reps, at reps online.org. You know, get forward to me or spur vac at S, P, E, O, D, V, A, c.com, or you can even get hold of Michael Henson and Mike.   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:26 You can always get a hold of me. And people know how to do that, and I will get them in touch with you as well, you bet. So I'm glad to do that. Well, I want to thank you for being here, and I want to thank all of you for listening. I hope you've enjoyed this. This is a little bit different than a lot of the podcast that we've done. But it is, it is so important to really talk about some of these kinds of concepts, and to talk about old radio and what it what it still adds and contributes to today. So I hope that you enjoyed it. I'd love to hear from you. Feel free to reach out to me. Michael H, i@accessibe.com that's m, I, C, H, A, E, L, H, I at accessibe, A, C, C, E, S, S, i, b, e.com, love to hear from you. Wherever you're listening, please give us a five star rating. We value that a lot, and I hope that you'll go listen to YESTERDAY usa.com, or.net then again, in both, there's the red and the blue Network, or repsonline.com, and we, we have a lot of fun. Every so often we do trivia contests, and we'll take hours and and gentlemen in New Jersey and his wife, Johnny and Helen Holmes, come on and run the trivia, and it's a lot of fun, and you're welcome to add your answers to the trivia questions, and you can come on in here and learn how to even do it through the chat.   Walden Hughes ** 1:01:51 But my kids watch this every Friday night on, why USA too?   Michael Hingson ** 1:01:56 Yeah, I get to be on every Friday night, and that's a lot of fun. Yeah. So we'd love to hear from you, and we'd love you to to help us further enhance the whole concept of old radio show. So I want to thank you again. And if you know of other people who ought to be on the podcast, Walt, and of course, you as well as you know, please introduce us. We're always looking for more people to talk to us about whatever they want to talk about. So I want to again. Thank you all and for being here. And Walden, thank you for being here as well.   Walden Hughes ** 1:02:27 All right, Mike, I'll be talking a little while.   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:33 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com . AccessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for Listening. Please come back and visit us again next week.

Struggling with self-doubt or pressure as an entrepreneur? Learn how to think like an elite athlete. In this episode, Dr. Cindra Kamphoff reveals the mindset strategies used by NFL players and Olympians to build confidence, resilience, and unstoppable mental strength. In this powerful conversation, host David Hill sits down with Dr. Cindra Kamphoff — mental performance coach to the Minnesota Vikings and Team USA Track & Field — to uncover how entrepreneurs can master the same mindset tools as top athletes. Dr. Cindra shares actionable strategies to overcome self-doubt, manage pressure, and build the confidence needed to pursue your biggest goals. From her “Learn, Burn, Return” method to the “Truth Meter” framework, you'll discover how to silence your inner critic, reframe failure, and perform at your best — even under stress. Whether you're leading a team, launching a business, or chasing a dream that scares you, this episode gives you the mental tools to stay focused, confident, and resilient through every challenge.     Key Takeaways How to transform anxiety into focus and excitement The “Learn, Burn, Return” tool for bouncing back fast after setbacks Why confidence is a decision, not just a feeling The truth about inner critics — and how to quiet yours Daily mindset routines used by elite athletes and leaders Why psychological safety drives peak team performance     Guest Bio: Dr. Cindra Kamphoff Dr. Cindra Kamphoff is an award-winning keynote speaker, certified mental performance coach, and author of the Amazon bestseller Beyond Grit: Ten Powerful Practices to Gain the High Performance Edge. She has provided mindset coaching for the Minnesota Vikings and U.S. Olympic Track & Field team and is the founder of the Mentally Strong Institute, where she and her team help leaders, athletes, and entrepreneurs unlock mental toughness and resilience. Her podcast, The High Performance Mindset, ranks in the top 0.5% globally with over 4 million downloads. Her next book with Simon & Schuster, coming soon, dives into the science of confidence.    

This week on Bound + Determined, I'm beyond thrilled to introduce you to my editor and book collaborator, Hannah Robinson. She has been an integral part in helping me make Do the Thing all that I want it to be for you. I have 3 weeks until my manuscript deadline, and I'm right on time! In this episode, you'll hear how we worked together, and some of the challenges I came across in my writing. Hannah and I crossed paths many times over the years, as she was previously at Simon & Schuster and Hachette, where many of my clients have published. Now, Hannah is out on her own and eager to shed light on how editors can support authors in diverse ways. Hannah is an absolute stand-out talent at what she does, and she's breaking down all the ways an outside editor/collaborator (someone beyond your Publisher's editor) can enhance your writing experience and the final product. Don't miss it!  

Eden Denyer of Unity Books Wellington reviews My Friends by Frederik Backman, published by Simon & Schuster.  

In this warm conversation Tembi and Albiona cover:How From Scratch began — writing personal grief into a story that reaches others, and how that book later became a Netflix limited series. (Simon & Schuster)What “re-nesting” means (replacing the idea of an “empty nest” with a more generative, whole concept) and practical ways parents can prepare emotionally for children leaving home. (People.com)The creative process Tembi uses: listening, journaling, & exploring different art forms; writing as a practice to slow down and make meaning. (tembilocke.com)Concrete ideas listeners can use right away: short daily rituals (15–45 min), journaling prompts, scheduling “pre-planned joy,” somatic self-care, and negotiating new family rhythms like weekly check-ins.A deep look at Someday, Now — why Tembi created an immersive audio experience (ambient Sicily soundscapes plus narration), and what she hopes listeners will feel after they finish it: that there is possibility, love, and room for transformation even in endings. (Audible.com)Resources & linksTembi Locke — official site / about & book resources. (tembilocke.com)From Scratch — publisher page (Simon & Schuster). (Simon & Schuster)Someday, Now — Simon & Schuster audio page (audio edition/details). (Simon & Schuster)Someday, Now — Audible audio listing/preorder. (Narrated by Tembi Locke; release details & preorder.) (Audible.com)Tembi Locke on Instagram (announcements & behind-the-scenes). (Instagram) Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Kelly Drane, research director at Giffords Law Center, Ned Parker, investigative reporter at Thomson Reuters, and McKay Coppins, staff writer at The Atlantic and the author of Romney: A Reckoning (Simon & Schuster, 2023), talk about guns and the state of political violence in America after conservative activist Charlie Kirk was shot and killed at an event on a Utah college campus.

Welcome to Season 5, Episode 33! Our guest today is Ada Tseng. She's a journalist, editor, podcaster, runner, wellness advocate and karaoke enthusiast. She is the co-author of the new book Breaking Into New Hollywood: A Career Guide to a Changing Industry. It just came out on August 12 2025, and it's co-written with Jon Healey and published by the Los Angeles Times and Simon & Schuster.  Breaking Into New Hollywood is a practical collection that offers insights on navigating the Hollywood industry today and how it's changed with CGI, AI, video streaming, social media, and more. Whether you're an aspiring set designer, agent, director, writer, actor, manager, or anything to do with making films in front or behind the scenes, this is an invaluable resource. Ada has written for a variety of outlets including the LA Times, National Geographic, Center of Asian American Media, Women's Wear Daily, HowStuffWorks, The Washington Post, Public Radio International, NBC, LA Weekly, Asia Pacific Arts, and Audrey Magazine (just to name a few). We should also mention that Ada is the co-host of the Saturday School Podcast with Brian Hu which is one of our favorites, especially for Asian American pop culture. In our conversation, we talk about how she got involved with pop culture and this book, how she organized the book, the importance of adding in diversity to the different featured insiders in the book, what she thinks is the most important element of making it in Hollywood, what her fantasy career in Hollywood could be, and a lot more. As a veteran podcaster, she even turns the tables and asks us a few questions. For more of Ada's work, you can check out her website, follow her on Instagram, subscribe to the Saturday School Podcast, and get Breaking Into New Hollywood. If you like what we do, please share, follow, and like us in your podcast directory of choice or on Instagram @AAHistory101. For previous episodes and resources, please visit our site at https://asianamericanhistory101.libsyn.com or our links at http://castpie.com/AAHistory101. If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, email us at info@aahistory101.com.

Donald Trump has sued the Wall Street Journal over its story saying he wrote a weird poem to Jeffrey Epstein and drew a caricature of a naked woman with his own signature as her pubic hair as part of a book wishing a happy 50th birthday to the New York financier. Ken and Josh discuss the suit, which looks more like an exclamation point on his claims that he never even liked that Epstein guy! than a serious effort to win damages from (or extort) the Rupert Murdoch empire. Meanwhile, Trump is seeking the release of grand jury testimony from the investigations into Epstein and his henchwoman Ghislaine Maxwell — a release that wouldn't be likely to include any books of ribald poetry.Also this week: Trump's lawsuit against Bob Woodward and Simon & Schuster — claiming that Woodward and S&S violated Trump's copyright by publishing the audio of interviews Trump thought were only for use in a written book — has been dismissed; Trump is facing difficulty with another novel application of IEEPA — this time, not tariffs, but an effort to sanction the International Criminal Court, there's a certified class in the birthright citizenship litigation; a federal judge in California says ICE can't pick people up just because they look Mexican; and some government immigration lawyers have started appearing anonymously in immigration court; an extra-bizarre civil RICO suit against Eric Adams and the NYPD, from Adams's own ex-interim NYPD commissioner; Douglass Mackey, a.k.a. “Ricky Vaughn,” has won an appeal of his conviction for trying to trick Hillary Clinton voters into “voting” by text.Visit serioustrouble.show for a transcript of this episode. This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.serioustrouble.show/subscribe

Susan Page, USA Today Washington bureau chief and the author of several books, including The Rulebreaker: The Life and Times of Barbara Walters (Simon & Schuster, 2024), talks about the latest national political news including reactions from both sides of the aisle to Zohran Mamdani's win in the New York City Democratic mayoral primary, funding for ICE in the budget bill in light of news of the 'Alligator Alcatraz' detention facility in Florida, environmental funding cuts in the wake of floods in Texas, and more. 

In the gripping conclusion of The True Tale of Lizzie Borden, we turn to the defense's side of the story. What arguments did Lizzie's lawyers make to counter the damning evidence? What did the jury ultimately decide—and why? Join me as we uncover the final chapter of this notorious case, from the courtroom verdict to the lasting legacy Lizzie Borden left behind. Don't miss the dramatic end to one of America's most enduring true crime mysteries. Catch Up: Missed Part 1 or 2? Be sure to listen to the previous episode to hear about the Borden family, the murders, and the investigation that led to Lizzie's arrest. Sources: The Trial of Lizzie Borden, Cara Robertson, Simon & Schuster, 2019  https://www.grunge.com/69553/untold-truth-lizzie-borden/  https://www.wickedlocal.com/story/archive/2013/08/02/timeline-lives-lizzie-emma-abby/38186480007/  https://famous-trials.com/lizzieborden/1449-bowentestimony  https://www.encyclopedia.com/law/law-magazines/lizzie-borden-trial-1893  https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/how-lizzie-borden-got-away-with-murder-180972707/ https://www.biography.com/crime/lizzie-borden-life-after-murder-trial https://lizzie-borden.com/ Sponsors:  Zealthy - To see if you qualify for GLP-1 medications and get started, text ONCE to 200-300. Thrive Market - Go to ThriveMarket.com/onceuponacrime for 30% off your first order PLUS a FREE $60 gift!  Kikoff - Get your first month FREE at GetKikoff.com/once  To advertise on this podcast please email: ad-sales@libsyn.com    Or go to: https://advertising.libsyn.com/onceuponacrime  Links:  Patreon - www.patreon.com/onceuponacrime  Our Website -  www.truecrimepodcast.com  YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@OnceUponACrimePodcast