Podcast appearances and mentions of Wendy Day

For this week's episode, we compiled 8 of our favorite moments from previous episodes (featuring expert music marketers) around running paid ads to grow your music career.Every clip we posted of these moments did NUMBERS on social media, so we wanted to unpack why they are so valuable, and why musicians should start using these methods IMMEDIATELY to maximize the efficiency of their marketing dollars.Featured guests: Amber Grimes, Rick Barker, Promo God, Wendy Day, & Megh from SymphonyOSWe hope you enjoy and find value! Don't forget to subscribe if this helped

This week on Country Rap Tunes Podcast, Cory Mo & Kimberly Jones Interview Wendy Day, Music Industry Veteran & Founder of The Rap Coalition. They discuss the groundbreaking deals the she has negotiated during her 30 plus year career in the Music Business & she shares classic stories about the up's & downs of the Industry. Wendy has worked with & negotiated deals for Eminem, Cash Money Records, No Limit Records, Twista, David Banner Do Or Die & Many More. This Episode will teach you to understand the good & the bad of the Entertainment Industry for sure! Ep. 11 Season 2 Executive Producer / Host / Engineer: Cory Mo Co Host: Kimberly Latrice Jones AKA Kimbo Slice Director: Alvin Agarrat Producer: Kevin Bryant Production Assistant: Kiannah McClure Camera Operator: Aaron Robey Camera Operator: Jax FOR MUSIC, MERCH & CULTURE GOTO - www.CountryRapTunes.com #CoryMo #CountryRapTunes #KimboSlice #CountryRapTunesPodcast #KimJones #Interview

In this powerhouse episode, I sit down with the legendary Wendy Day—a hip-hop consultant and industry trailblazer who has brokered record label deals for icons like Cash Money Records, Master P, Eminem, Twista, and countless others. Wendy has spent decades helping artists dodge predatory label contracts and take control of their earning potential, making her one of the most respected voices in music business strategy. We unpack the common traps hidden in record label deals, why so many artists lose control of their careers, and the essential steps you must take to protect your music and maximise your income. Wendy's no-nonsense approach to empowering artists is a masterclass in how to take ownership of your career and build long-term wealth in the industry. This is the episode every serious artist needs to hear. If you want to stay in control of your record deal, protect your vision, and get paid what you're worth, don't wait—watch now!

If you were an artist back in the day, the most common question you'd ask is “how do I get a record deal”. Wendy Day has spent over 30yrs helping artists understand they don't need a major label and can build sustainable businesses independently. She is a hip hop executive, mentor and consultant who's worked with the likes of Tupac, No Limit, Cash Money, Twista and more. In this episode, Wendy breaks down strategies for artists to build their own independent empire.GET 30% OFF DISTROKID: http://distrokid.com/vip/onemoretimeFREE ACCESS to "100 VIRAL CONTENT IDEAS FOR MUSICIANS": https://forms.gle/zGWuUrLA8mBfqz7F8JOIN OUR DISCORD: https://discord.gg/un6ZFCjSWANNA WORK WITH US? Make us an OFFER! https://forms.gle/tVdon5vyoGAqPjx6ASUBSCRIBE to the OMT YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@OneMoreTimePodFOLLOW Wendy Day:https://www.instagram.com/rapcoalitionFOLLOW One More Time:https://www.instagram.com/onemoretimepodhttps://www.tiktok.com/@onemoretimepod

What happens when a Brooklyn native travels to Belize, returns to New York, and then finally finds a home in the Chicago hip-hop scene? On this episode of The S.H.I.T.T.S  Podcast, our special guest, GQ, shares his incredible journey and how he transitioned from reggae music to becoming a prominent figure in Chicago hip-hop. GQ takes us through the vibrant party scene of the early '90s and introduces us to key influencers like Tony Baines, Cool Out Chris, and Crunch (aka Jitu The Juggernaut), while candidly discussing his personal health battles and unwavering commitment to music.From unforgettable battle rap events like Rhyme Spitters to the evolution of the underground scene, this episode offers a rich tapestry of Chicago's hip-hop history. You'll hear about the pivotal contributions of figures such as Pink House, DJ Timbuk2, and Wendy Day, who have helped shape the landscape for artists in the city. GQ also emphasizes the significance of presenting intelligence and maturity in the genre, celebrating the diverse talent that extends far beyond just drill music, including notable names like Mr. Misfit, Andreas Haley, Asha Omega, Jay Bambi, and Brittany Carter.We also pay tribute to the legendary Clarence Avant, known as the Black Godfather, and explore the critical role of networking in the music industry. GQ shares personal anecdotes that highlight the challenges and rewards of forming genuine connections, offering insights into the importance of unity and collaboration within the Chicago hip-hop community. From platforms like Fake Shore Drive and Illinoize Radio to the enduring legacies of figures like Bernie Mac and Brother Hashim, this episode is a heartfelt homage to the resilience, dedication, and untapped potential of Chicago's hip-hop artists.Subscribe to our YouTube Channel: The SHITTS Podcast. Follow us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, and iHeart Radio. Subscribe and comment.

In this week's episode of The Cheat Code, we embark on a journey through the vibrant cultures of iconic cities like Miami, New York, and Los Angeles. Exploring these diverse urban landscapes offers a profound appreciation for the richness of local culture and the unique experiences they offer. During our discussion, we pause to extend our heartfelt gratitude to SebCashin for his thoughtful gift of Garrett's and a heartfelt hand-written note. His gesture serves as a testament to the camaraderie and mutual appreciation within our community, and we're deeply touched by his generosity. Transitioning into our main topic, we delve into the power of details and how they contribute to leaving a lasting impression. Whether it's in personal interactions or professional endeavors, paying attention to the finer points can elevate our impact and resonate with others on a deeper level. Furthermore, we explore the concept of "Earned Media Value" and its significance in today's digital landscape. By understanding and calculating the value of our online presence, we gain insights into how to leverage our content effectively and measure its impact in tangible ways. As our conversation unfolds, we emphasize the importance of research in informing our decisions and strategies. In an era driven by statistics, numbers, and data, conducting thorough research empowers us to make informed choices and navigate the complexities of the modern world with confidence. Tune in to the latest episode of The Cheat Code as we unpack these insights and explore the intersections of culture, appreciation, and strategic thinking in today's dynamic environment.   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In the latest episode of The Cheat Code, we delve deep into the nitty-gritty of the music business, emphasizing the importance of paying attention to the smallest details. We kick off the discussion by highlighting the significance of metadata, shedding light on how it can make or break an artist's career. From understanding ownership rights to negotiating deals, we stress the need for artists to be well-informed and proactive in every aspect of their journey. Drawing from personal experiences, we share anecdotes and insights into how being vigilant about details has helped us navigate the complex landscape of the industry. Whether it's asking the right questions before collaborating or knowing the ins and outs of studio sessions, we underscore the value of being proactive and assertive in protecting one's creative work. Join us as we unravel the intricacies of the music business and empower artists to take control of their careers by mastering the art of paying attention to the details. Tune in to The Cheat Code and stay ahead of the game!  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 107 of The Cheat Code, we're brewing up some serious insights!

Get ready for a no-holds-barred episode of the Cheat Code Podcast! We're diving deep into the world of authenticity in the music industry. Our hosts kick things off with a bold statement: stop pretending to be someone you're not. Authenticity is key to building a genuine connection with your fans. Join us as we explore the journey of artist development and the importance of finding your unique voice and lane in the industry. We emphasize the value of consistency, hard work, and staying true to yourself throughout your career. But that's not all – we're dropping truth bombs left and right! From the real deal about music distribution to game-changing techniques for optimizing your online presence, we're sharing insights that will revolutionize your approach to the industry. And let's talk about "Cap Rap." We're calling out the trend of dishonesty in music and why it's a surefire way to flop. Plus, DJs, it's time to step up and keep it real. When was the last time you championed the hottest record in your market, not just the one you're paid to promote? Prepare for a rollercoaster ride of hard-hitting facts, opinions, and outbursts. This episode is not for the faint of heart – buckle up for a wild journey through the music industry!   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Exciting news alert!

In the latest episode of the Cheat Code Podcast, we tackle the complex and often misunderstood relationship between artists and DJs. From the behind-the-scenes workings of the music industry to the frontline battles for recognition and support, we leave no stone unturned. Join us as we dissect the role of DJs in breaking hit records, explore the true meaning of artist support, and delve into the crucial importance of ownership in the digital age. With candid insights, real-world examples, and a healthy dose of industry wisdom, we navigate the ever-shifting landscape of music promotion and distribution. From the power dynamics at play in the DJ booth to the strategic considerations of building a lasting legacy, we equip you with the knowledge and tools you need to succeed in today's competitive music market. Whether you're an aspiring artist looking to make your mark or a seasoned industry veteran seeking fresh perspectives, this episode is packed with valuable insights and actionable advice. Tune in as we uncover the secrets of success and reveal the true power of the Cheat Code.   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Welcome to our 100th episode of the Cheat Code Podcast, where we're "Keeping it 100 for our 100th"!  In this monumental episode, we dive straight into the heart of the music industry, discussing the intricate dynamics between artists, record labels, and business savvy. Join us as we celebrate the success stories of independent labels like Strange Music and TDE, highlighting the power of self-sufficiency in today's music landscape. We take a moment to honor the legendary Killer Mike for his recent Grammy wins and commend his impactful community activism. Amidst the celebrations, we pause to acknowledge the significance of reaching this milestone and express our gratitude to our listeners for their unwavering support. Turning our focus back to the business of music, we dissect the importance of synergy in propelling artists and records to new heights. With TikTok emerging as a dominant force in music discovery, we emphasize the value of cultivating fan-generated content to foster deeper connections with audiences. Delving into a thought-provoking discussion, we challenge conventional notions of success and redefine what it means to be a "loser" in the music industry. We explore innovative revenue streams, including platforms like Even.Biz, empowering artists to embrace fan funding and monetize their craft in unprecedented ways. Join us as we embark on this landmark episode, filled with insights, inspiration, and a renewed commitment to empowering artists to thrive in the ever-evolving music landscape. Here's to the next 100 episodes and beyond!  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Here's the description for Episode 99 of the Cheat Code: In Episode 99 of the Cheat Code, we kick things off with a TikTok "Effect House" gem for all aspiring creators out there. Check out the Effect House link for some fantastic examples of how artists can create different effects to enhance their content. During our on-camera moment, we discovered that many artists we referenced were unavailable on TikTok due to the ongoing dispute between Universal Music Group and TikTok. Despite this inconvenience, artists continue to sell and stream their music. We delve into some licensing facts about TikTok, shedding light on the complexities of the platform's agreements with major music labels. Shifting gears, we dive into the Super Bowl extravaganza, discussing how this year's game in Vegas is shaping up to be the most capitalistic yet. With tickets fetching exorbitant prices and sportsbooks and gambling houses sponsoring events, the commercialization of the Super Bowl is reaching new heights. In Atlanta, the DJ vs. artist controversy takes center stage, but we opt to stay neutral on the matter. Instead, we commend everyone working to push the culture forward, recognizing that difficult conversations are sometimes necessary for progress. Tune in to Episode 99 for insightful discussions and valuable insights into the music industry and beyond.   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In this episode, we kick things off by showcasing some amazing Champa Bay merchandise from our friend Aych302. We're all about supporting fellow creatives, and Aych's work is nothing short of impressive. As we gear up for the big game on the horizon and the excitement of All-Star Weekend, we dive into the world of advertising, particularly Super Bowl commercials. We challenge our listeners, known as the "coderz," to watch those commercials and take notes. Why? Because scaling your brand through commercials is a powerful strategy. We'll dissect what these big brands are doing right and how you can apply their techniques to connect with your fans on a larger scale. Ferrari shares his thoughts on dubplates, a fascinating way for artists to add their name to a song and make connections with influencers and tastemakers in their local music scene. It's an invaluable asset for musicians looking to expand their reach. But we also touch on a sensitive topic in the music industry – the necessary work. What happens when artists aren't willing to put in the essential effort? We dive deep into this issue and share our frustrations. Finally, we get into the radio spins game, discussing what it means to get your song on the radio and the key steps to keeping it there. We'll reveal the best-kept secret in the radio business that can make all the difference. Tune in to Episode 98 for an insightful and engaging discussion about the music industry, branding, and what it takes to succeed.

Wendy Day Talks Label Offering Juvenile 75k Before Her, Baby & Slim Worked A 30 Million W/ Universal --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/nolazine-network/support

In this episode of the Cheat Code Podcast, we dive into the world of music merch, travel, and networking. Our hosts kick things off by announcing new Rari merch just in time for Valentine's Day, bringing you the latest in style and support. As February unfolds, we discuss the unique marketing opportunities that come with holidays like St. Patrick's Day and an early Mardi Gras, providing insights into how these festivities can impact your marketing plans and travel budgets. Get ready to hit the road as we explore the invaluable routes of I-10 East and West, and I-20 East and West, connecting you with key markets to help your music movement thrive. We emphasize the importance of intentional building and networking, especially when searching for DJs in cities like Las Vegas during events like the Super Bowl. But it's not just about transactional relationships; we delve into the significance of self-worth and genuine connections within the industry. Plus, we share our enthusiasm for Wendy Day's internship program and the incredible opportunities it offers aspiring artists. Discover how building a year-long relationship with a peer can evolve into exciting opportunities, just as it did for Rari and his new brand ambassador partnership. Tune in to Episode 97 and gain valuable insights into bridging connections and building lasting brands.

Join us for an exciting new episode as we kick off with style and swag! Rari showcases his Yalee Merchandise, sharing his thoughts on the talented artist Yalee and his music. Meanwhile, Kingpin proudly flaunts his DRO Life Clothing, featuring the DRO Racing Line in this episode's sponsor spotlight. Our conversation takes a thought-provoking turn as we delve into the music landscape. Today, it's not just about making music; it's about making noise for attention. Likes, comments, and applause can sometimes be mistaken for success, and we're here to dissect this evolving aspect of the music industry. Atlanta, GA, has been a hub of music culture, but even the club scene is experiencing a transformation. Rari candidly shares his perspective, calling the new club scene "boring" and elaborating on why this shift has occurred. Clubs are no longer the primary grounds for breaking records; instead, they serve music. As we explore the dynamics of music promotion, we tackle the question: Can you break a hit record? We clarify the roles of record-breaking DJs and record-introducing DJs, shedding light on what it truly means to break a record. Furthermore, we discuss the crucial relationship between DJs and record label A&R professionals. Plus, we share valuable insights on how artists can effectively network with DJs in their target markets, revealing a strategy that's both simple and brilliantly effective. Join us for Episode 96 as we navigate the evolving music scene, celebrating true artistry and the professionals who are shaping its course.

Welcome to a power-packed episode of the Cheat Code Podcast! In Episode 95, we start with style, showcasing our exclusive "Writ3rs Block" hoodies – a perfect blend of comfort and style that echoes the spirit of creativity. In this episode, we ask, "What grabs your attention in marketing?" Before we unveil our truth-bomb on this, we delve into Luminate's 2023 Music Streaming Report, providing our Coderz with essential context to navigate the ever-evolving music industry. Wendy drops a game-changing gem – before releasing your music, test it! Discover the meticulous process behind this strategy, arming our Coderz with a competitive edge over the rest. Shifting gears, we explore the world of DJ marketing. Learn how DJs can elevate their digital value, breaking more records and leaving an indelible mark in the industry.As we enter the new year, Episode 95 is your guide to unlocking success in 2024. Tune in for insights, strategies, and insider knowledge that sets you apart in the competitive music landscape. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 94, we kick things off with some exciting news about where you can stream The Cheat Code Podcast and grab our merch. We're making it even easier for our Coderz to connect with us and represent the Cheat Code community. Next, we dive into the world of music and monetization. Rari shares his journey with his new intro song for his iHeart Radio show, featuring Young Dro. We celebrate Rari's successes and discuss the strategies he used to monetize and register his song. It's all about making the right moves in the music industry, and Rari is a prime example. We also take on a burning question from one of our Coderz: Should they release singles or a full project? Our advice: consistency is key. We recommend consistently releasing track after track, closely monitoring the results, and adjusting your release strategy accordingly. It's a singles-driven streaming market, and we break down how to navigate it successfully. Rari shares his insights into curation and how he keeps his playlist fresh and relevant. It's all about staying hip and current in the ever-changing world of music. But we don't stop there. We tackle the issue of accountability head-on. Blaming others for what you won't do for yourself is an easy trap to fall into, and we discuss the importance of taking responsibility for your own success. In this episode, we drop some truth bombs: entitlement and poor time management are an artist's two biggest enemies. So, tune in, and let's conquer these challenges together. It's time to level up and make 2024 your year of music mastery   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In the first episode of 2024, we're bringing you fresh inspiration and insights to kickstart your year in the music industry. We kick things off by unveiling the story behind our "Federal Bureau of Promotions" T-Shirt, a fun addition to our merchandise lineup that's bound to spark some laughs. For those of you who received music equipment or instruments over the holidays, now is the time to channel that newfound creative energy into your music career. We urge our fellow "coderz" to consider investing in merchandising and think creatively about how to leverage new tools and gadgets for content creation. From streaming devices to video games, there are unique opportunities waiting to be explored. We dive into the business cycle, emphasizing the importance of understanding your audience, turning a profit, and eventually expanding your team. The journey to success is a cycle of growth and learning, and we're here to guide you through it. As we close out the episode, we leave you with a valuable thought: If your goal is to make money, do things the right way. But if you're not concerned with profits, then by all means, do things your way – just be prepared to get out of your own way! 2024 is your year to thrive, and we're here to help you navigate the path to success in the music industry. Tune in and let's get started on the right note! getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Interview by Haze   / mike_tall   We recently sat down with another one of our Day 1 family members, Kingpin for an exclusive “Off The Porch” interview! During our conversation he discussed his gratitude for the Dirty Glove Bastard family, growing up in Miami, being in the streets at an early age, studying ownership over the pandemic, being a source when it comes to the music business, starting “The Cheat Code” podcast with Wendy Day & Ferrari Simmons which helps artists, giving out knowledge about the music industry, providing consultations for artists to help their brands, and much more!  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In Episode 90 of The Cheat Code, we embrace the holiday season, delving into the festive spirit. Our hosts discuss the dichotomy of the holidays for artists, balancing the joyous season with the challenges it brings. Amidst family celebrations, they shed light on the emotional and financial struggles many artists face during this time. To uplift spirits, we launch the "Obnoxious Christmas Decorations Challenge," urging followers to showcase their extravagant setups for a chance to win a Cheat Code Hoodie. The hosts share Christmas advice, emphasizing safety and gratitude. They introduce a new perspective for starting the day: listing five things to be thankful for, fostering appreciation and resilience. Highlighting a community hero who champions education and generosity, the episode explores the power of self-affirmations. As the holiday season unfolds, the hosts encourage spreading cheer through actions, content, words, or music. Join us in celebrating the season with joy and empowerment! getthecheatcode@gmail.com

n this episode, our hosts embark on a journey deep into the realm of ownership, kicking off the discussion with an intriguing question—how many songs are dedicated to actual dances, step-by-step, not just associated with a viral challenge? The conversation pivots towards ownership: Can an artist claim a dance, trademark it, and register it? They delve into the strategy of creating songs, dance moves, and content simultaneously to monetize every piece in preparation for a comprehensive rollout. The dialogue extends to the crucial topic of owning your likeness. The hosts emphasize the significance of this aspect and raise a pertinent question—have we unwittingly relinquished our rights by agreeing to upload content on specific platforms? Join us as we unravel the complexities of artistic ownership and provide insights on securing your image in the dynamic landscape of the music industry. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Although E-40 is the mainstream face of the Hyphy Movement, Northern California residents view another rapper as the anchor of Hyphy. He went by Mac Dre. This episode of Remember the Time breaks down the larger-than-life persona of the late rapper—from his pre-and-post incarceration sound to his Thizz Entertainment empire.Host Branden LSK speaks with rapper LaRussell about Mac Dre's cultural impact and speaks with Steph Curry about his forthcoming documentary on the artist. Expect to hear from Hyphy pioneer E-40; rapper, Keak Da Sneak; hip-hop consultant, Wendy Day; radio personality, Big Von; rapper Mistah F.A.B, producer Droop-E and more.

Get ready for a festive episode as we dive into the holiday spirit on Episode 87 of The Cheat Code!  Rapjuggernaut declares his love for the holidays, family traditions, and the unique opportunity the season brings for focused work. We explore the powerful connection between gratitude and happiness, backed by a recent study.  Shifting gears, we delve into strategic planning with insights from an Eventbrite creators email. Planning schedules, budget breakdowns, and meticulous preparation take center stage. For our Coders working with limited resources, we emphasize the importance of resource allocation and focus. As the year winds down, executing current plans and laying the groundwork for the new year becomes paramount. Addressing the cost of doing business, we discuss the necessity for artists to itemize wants vs. needs, fostering a strategic approach to acquiring resources for successful execution.  In the realm of social media, we unravel the new shop requirements, highlighting the need for UBO verification before diving into the world of online sales. Homework is assigned to our Coders: set up Black Friday, Small Business Saturday, and Cyber Monday pricing, along with Christmas discounts. Paying attention to details now ensures a smooth sail through the holiday sales season.  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

Embark on a deep dive into the beating heart of the music industry in Episode 86, "What Are You Willing To Do?" We kick off with merch vibes, showcasing Rari's "Fanbase" hoodie and paying homage to Isaac Hayes III's cultural contributions. As we dissect industry dynamics, ponder the question: is hip-hop down, or is it the battleground of heightened competition with 100,000 daily releases? Explore the post-pandemic scene, where streaming soars, and discover why some believe hip-hop might be facing a crossroads. Insights from Cory Sparks and Jimmy Iovine add sparks to the conversation, questioning whether today's artists seek greatness or just popularity. Join us for an insightful exploration of the music realm, where dreams are chased, and the pursuit is not for the faint-hearted. Welcome to The Cheat Code – where we decode the industry for you. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 84 of The Cheat Code, we kick things off by sending a big shoutout to Aych for the fantastic Champa Bay merch he sent our way. It's incredible to see our Coderz bringing their visions to life, and we're here to celebrate and help them market their creations. Cheers to you, Tampa Bay, Florida! We also reminisce about some of our cherished memories from that vibrant city. From the world of merch, we seamlessly transition into the realm of events, specifically DJ listening parties or, as they're often called nowadays, "Artist Playbacks." What exactly is an artist playback, and what distinguishes it? Is the music showcased at these events released or unreleased? Tune in to learn the ins and outs of planning and executing a successful artist playback. Planning is key, and our hosts emphasize that, on average, it takes about 30 days to meticulously plan and flawlessly execute an event. Major kudos to Eventbrite for providing event checklists and budget sheets, invaluable tools that make organizing events more manageable. If you're wondering about the right venue, the ideal number of attendees, or the best day and time to host your event, we've got you covered. We share tips, insights, and cost-effective strategies for Indie artists looking to host artist playbacks even with limited resources. We dive into the resources available to us through major platforms for data mining and analytics. Building a strong resource pool and striving for constant improvement with each release are essential. Our hosts pay their respects to Atlanta's hip-hop staples, including The Coalition DJs, ATLTop20 Family, Off the Porch with DGB, the Big Facts podcast, and more. Their unwavering support is invaluable as we strive to reach a wider audience and build a thriving community. Tune in to Episode 84, titled "Surrounded By Winners," for an insightful and engaging discussion on artist playbacks, event planning, and making your mark in the music industry.  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In this episode, we kick things off with an exciting update on our latest merchandise. We're thrilled to see our Coderz turning their visions into reality, and it's a win-win when they send us some swag to help them celebrate and promote. From T-shirts to hats and hoodies, it's all about embracing creativity and showcasing it to the world. But we don't stop there. We take a moment to shine the spotlight on Aych from Tampa, Florida, who's not just an artist but a true representation of hip-hop in the Sunshine State's central region. We delve into our relationships with Florida and acknowledge the DJs who are making waves in the local music scene, including DJ C-Nazte, DJ Shizim, DJ Headbussa, DJ Winn, and many more. The episode takes an exciting turn with a breaking announcement – Ferrari Simmons, our co-host, shares the news that he's no longer with Warner Records. Instead, he's back on the radio with iHeart Radio, hosting his new show "Rari at 2," which is set to be syndicated by 2024. It's a significant move, and we couldn't be more excited for Ferrari's next chapter. Acknowledging the mentors at Warner Records who've played a pivotal role in his journey, Ferrari expresses his gratitude for the valuable experience and learning opportunities. Gratitude is indeed the word of the day. We continue to explore the power of email and the benefits of setting up your inbox effectively. Ferrari gives a special shoutout to Kingpin, another co-host, for encouraging him to optimize his music servicing email blasts. We emphasize the importance of filters, organization, and customizing your email setup according to what matters most to you. Cheat Code subscribers can DM us on Instagram for exclusive email optimization documents, as email remains an underrated yet powerful tool in the digital age. Email's accountability, date and time stamps, and file-sharing capabilities can empower you to handle business more effectively. Understanding the full potential of your email is the first step in maximizing your efficiency. The episode then shifts to discussing the "Dj Blast" and why it's an invaluable tool. Sending music via email is more professional than texting, and it allows for sharing multiple versions, links to drops, analytics, visuals, and more. Building a community is a key part of our discussion, and we share our Community Building 101 tips, emphasizing the importance of engaging with your audience and keeping them informed. In the grand finale, we leave you with this thought: the music business is participatory, and you have to actively engage in your journey to success. It starts with checking your email and staying connected. Join us for another insightful episode on The Cheat Code! Stay tuned for more and keep those messages and feedback coming. Let's continue to grow together. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In this episode of The Cheat Code, titled "A Winning Environment," we kick things off with a nod to the BumpBoxx, diving right back into the world of salesmanship. The spotlight shines on becoming an Amazon Influencer, sharing how you can turn your daily product usage into money by recommending and selling these products. We emphasize the importance of using the Paid Advertisement sticker, showing that transparency can open doors for brand collaborations that you may not have known were possible. Want to start creating content that attracts brand partnerships? We discuss the methods to achieve just that, but remember, it requires dedication and effort. As we pivot, we ponder which areas of the music industry lack sufficient information. Producers and Production need more education and information circulating within their community. The digital side, including Metadata, Data Mining, and Analytic Reviews, requires an overhaul to stay relevant and competitive. We address a somewhat misleading social media post that suggests it takes zero money to start an account or a business. In reality, there are operating costs, and the importance of infrastructure setup cannot be understated. Our hosts reminisce about the '80s classic "War Games," reflecting on its prescient exploration of A.I. – a concept introduced to us 40 years ago. Staying current on trends and remaining informed opens doors to becoming a beta tester on platforms like Instagram. We invite our CODERZ to DM us for access to a valuable social media news blast. Want to unlock the full potential of a platform? Dive in and explore the platform's intricacies. Want to learn? The answers are out there, waiting for you like Power Pellets in Pac-Man. We delve into a research paper discussing the connection between emotions and virality, reminding us that topics are constantly evolving and require ongoing study. Beware of those who claim expertise in the unknown. We shift gears to address the frustration of working with individuals on different thinking tiers. To leave the world, the business, better than we inherited it, we surround ourselves with those who crave progress and action. Handling personal situations at work can be tricky. We advocate for dialogue but discourage public grandstanding. Address issues privately to identify and solve any underlying concerns. It's possible to coexist with lazy colleagues by ensuring your department is immaculate and focusing on your own excellence. Remember, breeding a winning environment and addressing issues respectfully is key. We conclude with a wise adage we've picked up along the way: "If you hang around a barber shop long enough, you'll get a haircut." See you next week for more Cheat Code insights.   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 81 of The Cheat Code, titled "Money, Money, Money," we're diving into a wealth of essential topics. Our hosts kick things off with a reminder about our awesome merch, including the coveted Cheat Code coffee mug – perfect for your morning inspiration! But the main course for this episode is all about money. We explore the intricate relationship between money and the music industry. It's not just about making money; it's about understanding that money is a vehicle that grants you the freedom to make moves on your own terms. Money is fluid, and knowing how to navigate its ebbs and flows is key. We discuss downsizing and how it happens in various aspects of life and business. We emphasize the importance of knowing what you want to do, as it's the first step in budget allocation and successful planning. If you're considering investing in your music project or seeking an investor, research and knowledge about how your music is received are crucial. The living legend, Wendy Day, shares her valuable method for determining the right time to drop songs, and it's a golden nugget of wisdom you won't want to miss. Our hosts dive into how the film and TV industry is adopting data monitoring and tracking techniques from the music industry, making it a relevant topic for artists. We also celebrate the Writers of America returning to work and bringing back late-night TV and other beloved shows. Adding value to your craft is essential, but it goes hand in hand with learning how to monetize your work. Elevating and growing require effective marketing and promotion, which means knowing your target audience and how to reach them. The Cheat Code isn't just about shortcuts; it's about preserving your money, safeguarding your intellectual property, and maintaining your sanity. To help you on this journey, we break down the "Cost of Doing Business" for artists, giving you insights into how much you need to invest to make your music career profitable. It's a must-listen for anyone hungry to learn and reap the rewards of the music business. Join us as we navigate the complex world of music and finance, providing you with valuable insights and strategies to thrive in the industry. For more episodes and updates, follow us on our social media platforms and stay informed. #TheCheatCode #MoneyTalks #MusicIndustry #FinanceMatters   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 80 of The Cheat Code, titled "You Can, But Will YOU?" we kick things off with a shoutout to our incredible supporters, urging them to grab our exclusive merch and coffee mugs—one for themselves and one for a friend. It's a great way to share the love!   Shifting gears, we delve into the fascinating world of Momagers. Rari highlights the growing trend of mothers taking on executive roles in their kids' careers, while Wendy reflects on the days when parents used to plead with her to dissuade their children from pursuing a career in the arts. We discuss the essential roles parents should play in nurturing and managing their kids' careers, emphasizing the need to understand the music business and commit to the journey.   Our conversation leads us to the topic of learning, where we debunk the notion that learning through authority or coercion is effective. We confront a stark reality—options are scarce, and only a select few are willing to work to become champions. The secret? Mastering the art of turning moments into more moments is a skill that megastar artists have honed to perfection.   Reflecting on the past, when the "work records" mentality prevailed, we marvel at today's wealth of resources. Artists now compete with fellow musicians and with books, shows, gaming, and various platforms. We explore why many artists perceive social media posting as fruitless labor and reveal the transformative power of monetization. Once accounts are approved for monetization, a world of perks and unlocked features awaits.  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 79 of The Cheat Code, your hosts kick things off with an exciting announcement about our exclusive "Thank God for Wendy Day" t-shirt, available on our website. But we dive straight into the captivating world of music industry updates. Ferrari brings up the fascinating news of Warner Records signing a brand-new AI artist, pushing the boundaries of what's possible in music creation. Kingpin delves into the realm of Roblox, exploring its potential for adults, and he also shares insights about Boss clothing's dynamic collaboration with the NFL and Roblox. But that's not all; we touch upon TikTok's Creator Program, designed to develop AR filters for the platform. It's an innovation that's changing the game for creators and influencers. We also encourage our listeners to subscribe to our social media platforms, where insider information flows freely, helping our Cheat Coders stay ahead of the curve. The episode takes a thought-provoking turn as we discuss "Gatekeeping." Is it a problem? Our hosts narrate a powerful story of how a simple act of kindness, offering an ice-cold bottle of water, forged a valuable relationship that secured five paid bookings for our client. In a world where gossip and judgment often overshadow genuine conversations, we lament that "People would rather talk about you than sit down and talk with you." It's a poignant issue facing us in 2023, and we explore the importance of building connections and nurturing relationships. Music executives, industry professionals, and those working behind the scenes get an encouraging message to step out, network, and be open to both learning and mentoring others. Kingpin shares a personal journey of reconciliation with his father, highlighting the transformative power of love and understanding over time. This poignant moment leads to a discussion about the difference between a perfect result and a flawless execution. The goal isn't unattainable perfection but continual improvement, which demands diligence, tracking, and the courage to release and grow. The episode concludes with a profound reflection on pain: "What is Pain? Pain is the question that asks, How bad do you want this? Embrace the pain!" Join us as we explore the multifaceted world of the music industry and the wisdom it imparts. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 78 of The Cheat Code, titled “The “Seven P's For Winning” our hosts kick off the show with a shout-out to DRO Clothing, a brand that consistently provides them with stylish attire for their episodes. With gratitude in mind, they delve into a compelling discussion. Wendy Day reminisces about reconnecting with an old friend, an encounter that stirred bitter memories of the past. This trip down memory lane serves as a poignant reminder of how the unchecked greed of a select few self-centered artists once dismantled what could have been a game-changing, culture-shifting record label. The hosts shine a spotlight on a critical issue—the unpredictable external factors that pose the most significant threat to an artist's career. They stress the importance of having an advocate who not only supports the artist's vision but also possesses a deep understanding of the music business. All too often, artists are sold dreams because that's what's in demand. The discussion shifts to artist plans and how some endeavors fail because the artist might not be the right fit for the intended recipe. Drawing parallels between the music industry and sports, our hosts liken it to a team with an owner, coach, superstar, and role players. They highlight the defining factor between winners and losers—the distinction between those who want to go to practice and those who have to go. Our hosts propose the implementation of a new artist orientation provided by record labels. This orientation would comprehensively cover all the requirements and expectations of the artist within the record deal. They emphasize the importance of retaining a sense of self-sufficiency and not relying solely on talent, as true talent should motivate artists to take initiative. The hosts recount a recent encounter with an indie artist who presented a well-structured 5-song rollout plan. This encounter instilled hope that the industry is evolving, with artists becoming increasingly savvy and avoiding the pitfalls of premature content release. A key takeaway is revealed—the #1 question asked in all interviews: "What's next?" The hosts question the wisdom of participating in an interview without a clear plan for the future. Having a well-thought-out rollout and game plan not only enhances the fan experience but also attracts industry professionals eager to join a winning team. As our hosts succinctly put it, "Prior proper planning prevents piss-poor performance." Join us as we explore the strategies, insights, and game plans that lead to success in the ever-evolving music landscape. “The “Seven P's For Winning is the Cheat Code to making impactful decisions and achieving your creative potential  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 77 of The Cheat Code, we kick things off with an exciting discussion about the No Label Academy presented by Harvard and the visionary IDK. Wendy Day, who was fortunate to attend this remarkable event, shares her experiences and emphasizes how rewarding it was. IDK's ability to leverage his relationships and execute such an outstanding event serves as an inspiring example. We delve into a profound transformation within the music industry, as tomorrow's music executives are being groomed and educated with skill sets that have the potential to change the world. The No Label Academy is at the forefront of this evolution, equipping aspiring artists and executives with the knowledge and tools they need to thrive. Our hosts shift gears to explore the world of work schedules and time management. They offer insights into optimal times for productivity and introduce time management tools that can empower emerging artists and executives to excel in their endeavors. In this episode, we shine a spotlight on BigBank, the host of the Big Facts Podcast, as he embarks on a remarkable health journey. His transformation and evolution serve as a testament to the potential for growth and change within the Atlanta music scene. Towards the end of the episode, we address a common concern shared by many artists. What should you do if you've signed a deal and later realized it's not in your best interest? Our hosts offer valuable advice, emphasizing the importance of seeking legal counsel before signing any contracts. Join us as we navigate the ever-evolving music industry, share inspiring stories, and provide practical guidance to help you succeed in your creative journey. The Cheat Code is your trusted source for insights, tips, and strategies to thrive in the world of music. Stay tuned for more thought-provoking discussions and informative episodes. Subscribe to The Cheat Code now! getthecheatcode@gmail.com

On Episode 76 of The Cheat Code, “Work Hard, Win Big” our hosts embark on a journey through a diverse range of topics, from the warmth of spreading love to the intricacies of small talk, travel tales, culinary delights like Philly cheesesteaks, and much more. They delve into the heart of what it means to win and emphasize that when winning is your ultimate goal, you'll find the determination and resolve to overcome any obstacle. Our hosts shed light on a common misconception: the idea that moving to a city like Atlanta guarantees success. They underscore the necessity of putting in the hard work, dispelling the illusion that success comes effortlessly. Unafraid to confront the challenging aspects of success, our hosts explore those tasks that often seem daunting or undesirable but are essential for progress. They stress the importance of learning these vital skills or, alternatively, expending all your resources trying to compensate for what you haven't mastered. The episode advocates for professionalism as a critical skillset that should be cultivated and nurtured. It encourages artists to ask themselves pivotal questions: What can I do to become a better artist? Where do my fans reside? What are their preferences? Our hosts advocate dedicating time to perfecting your craft, ensuring that you can reap the rewards of your hard work. Because if you're not profiting from your music, rest assured that someone else is. Join us as we explore these profound insights and actionable advice to help you flourish in your creative journey. The Cheat Code is your trusted guide to unlocking your true potential in the ever-evolving music industry.   getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 74 of The Cheat Code, titled "Touring and Super Fans," our hosts delve into the dynamic world of touring and the pivotal role of super fans in an artist's journey. The episode opens with a spotlight on the thriving touring landscape, where legacy artists capitalize on the support of dedicated Baby Boomers and Millennials who continue to invest in the culture. Building a solid fan base takes center stage as our hosts explore the nuances of fan servicing or direct-to-consumer engagement. They stress the importance of reaching fans across various platforms and highlight that successful artists today often prioritize and excel in fan interaction. The concept of super fans takes the spotlight as our hosts share insights into creating a loyal and engaged community. They emphasize the necessity of readiness to meet the demands of super fans, underscoring that an unprepared response could lead to fan disengagement. In an era of technology-driven choices, our hosts highlight the evolving landscape where mediocrity is no longer sufficient. They discuss the shift from entertainment that educates to pure joy, particularly in hip-hop culture, and how AI has become a tool for entertainment rather than education. Distinguishing between complacency and consistent drive, the episode delves into the traits that creative individuals and successful entrepreneurs embody. The quest for improvement, innovation, and personal growth remains a driving force. Addressing a common pitfall, our hosts caution indie artists against mimicking established artists' social profiles, urging them to focus on authentic growth instead of projecting an image of success without a solid fan base foundation. Join us as we navigate the intricate world of touring and super fans' pivotal role in an artist's trajectory. Uncover the strategies and insights to cultivate a dedicated community, stay relevant in an ever-changing landscape, and harness the power of genuine fan engagement. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 73 of The Cheat Code, titled "Blessings + Boundaries,” our hosts embark on a journey of self-discovery and growth. The episode delves into the importance of establishing boundaries and recognizing one's limits. Our hosts contemplate the concept of favors, pondering whether to extend help to everyone or to discern when to assert the power of saying no. Life lessons take center stage as our hosts reflect on their personal experiences and how these valuable insights have shaped their future decision-making processes. The discussion delves into the complexities of strength, acknowledging that true strength lies not only in being formidable but also in forming alliances with like-minded individuals. Building a resilient and united community paves the way for unstoppable progress. The episode emphasizes the importance of fostering an environment free from fear and intimidation. Our hosts highlight that a culture of fear can lead to one's downfall, underscoring the significance of nurturing a supportive and empowering atmosphere. Additionally, the hosts explore the dynamics of strength in both mindset and action. They stress the value of assisting those in positions of power, particularly when such partnerships yield mutual benefits. Understanding one's role, executing tasks diligently, and actively learning contribute to continuous personal and professional growth. Join us as we unravel the intricate dance of blessings and lessons, discovering how they intertwine to shape our journeys toward success and fulfillment. Stay tuned for more insights, inspiration, and transformative discussions as we navigate the intricate landscapes of the music industry. getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 72 of The Cheat Code, titled "Emotionally Driven," our hosts dive into the fascinating world of metadata and its profound impact on various aspects of our lives, from the way we use our devices to our daily living. The algorithms that govern our digital experiences can significantly influence our choices and behavior. In the music business, emotions play a pivotal role, guiding decisions and creative expressions. Art and music have the power to evoke emotions, and it is only natural that our industry operates from an emotionally driven perspective. However, the challenge lies in striking a balance and managing emotions without allowing them to cripple us. Our hosts extend heartfelt gratitude to the Cheat Coderz for providing a compelling reason to continue seeking accurate and truthful information, essential for ongoing education and growth. They touch on the significance of saving people's jobs, acknowledging the importance of supporting and helping others. Yet, when faced with individuals who drain our energy and hinder progress, it becomes necessary to let go and prioritize a team-focused approach for collective success. Building meaningful relationships is at the core of success, surpassing monetary gains. Our hosts highlight the value of hard work and networking, as relationships form the foundation of long-lasting achievements in the ever-evolving music landscape. Join us as we explore the power of emotions, the impact of metadata, and the importance of cultivating a harmonious blend of emotions and logic to thrive in the music business.  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 71 of The Cheat Code, titled 'How To Stay Sharp,' our hosts take a deep dive into the world of staying sharp and on top of the game. The episode begins with reflections on the successful Cheat Code Live event, where positive energy flowed, ideas were exchanged, and everyone sought real insights from our hosts. Discover the secrets of staying informed as our hosts discuss their favorite newsletters and websites, highlighting the wealth of information available. They encourage listeners to sign up for newsletters that pique their interest, offering a direct pipeline to valuable knowledge delivered straight to their inboxes. As industry professionals, our hosts know the importance of taking a break, and they unveil the key to finding balance - schedules. Learn how to strategically plan your calendar to incorporate necessary resets between projects and tasks. 'Eat the Frog' - a concept explored by our hosts - advocates tackling the most challenging task first, allowing for smooth sailing ahead. Tune in to learn how to prioritize and optimize your productivity. Join us for a dynamic episode filled with motivational insights, actionable tips, and strategies to stay sharp in the ever-evolving music landscape. #CheatCode #StaySharp #MusicIndustry #Success #Productivity #Balance #Motivation getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 70 of The Cheat Code, titled “Eyes Sell More Than Ears.” our hosts dive into the exciting world of merchandise and its impact on the music industry. They kick off the show by discussing their preference for cool promotional items and independent clothing designs over mainstream products. The episode explores various merch styles and designs that are revolutionizing the clothing and apparel marketplace. Our hosts share inspiring stories of artists who have created custom promotional items that left a lasting impact on them. They delve into the concept of artists incorporating their lyrics into their merchandise and how independent artists can leverage this strategy to boost merch sales. Drawing inspiration from infomercials, our hosts reveal marketing tricks and highlight the importance of packaging and presentation to captivate the audience. Innovating on social media, our hosts suggest engaging with fans and searching for shared lyrics, providing valuable insights to test and create merchandise that resonates with the audience. They also share design tips and emphasize the significance of research in planning releases. Properly tagging releases to monitor growth becomes a vital component of an artist's campaign success. Join us as we explore the art of merchandising, discover valuable marketing tricks, and learn how to connect with your fans on a whole new level. Uncover the secrets to a successful merchandise campaign and elevate your brand in the ever-evolving music landscape.  getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 69 of The Cheat Code, titled "Appreciation and Recognition," our hosts shed light on the crucial aspects of appreciation and recognition in the music industry. They emphasize the significance of team building and the transformative power of showing genuine appreciation. Through heartfelt expressions of gratitude, individuals can make a profound difference in an industry that often overlooks or overshadows those who make things happen. The episode delves into the accessibility of major labels and the multitude of entry-level positions available, providing easier access to the industry's inner workings. The emergence of digital teams for artists and the increased focus on metadata analysis by major labels are also explored. The hosts stress the importance of spreading positive news and celebrating the achievements and aspirations of peers and the community. They touch upon the enigmatic "Black Box" and reveal hidden truths that industry insiders may not want you to know. Join us as we uncover the secrets to cultivating appreciation, recognition, and success in the ever-evolving music landscape. Send us your Questions and Feedback getthecheatcode@gmail.com

In Episode 68 of The Cheat Code, titled "Negligence or Incompetence," our hosts shed light on the flaws within the music industry. They explore how many errors and setbacks are a result of negligence rather than incompetence. Our hosts discuss the importance of artists heeding the advice and warnings of industry pioneers who have experienced the pitfalls and dangers firsthand. They emphasize that incompetence can often be attributed to laziness and a lack of willingness to learn. Not knowing how to do something is often a result of not taking the initiative to acquire the necessary knowledge. Our hosts stress the significance of understanding process procedures and industry verbiage to avoid potentially devastating consequences. Join us as we uncover the critical lessons necessary for success in the ever-evolving music industry.   Additionally, our hosts address the importance of going above and beyond to protect what you have. They remind artists that becoming rich and successful requires ongoing effort, and part of that effort is learning how to safeguard your art. Join us as we delve into the strategies and insights that can help you navigate the industry with confidence and protect your creative work. https://linktr.ee/getthecheatcode | thecheatcodepodcast@gmail.com

On Episode 66 of The Cheat Code, our hosts delve into the essential preparations that artists, venues, and promoters need to undertake before hosting events for independent artists. They uncover the crucial factors that artists should consider before paying to perform, the steps venues can take to ensure artists get paid, and the strategies promoters should implement to help artists leave a lasting digital footprint. Our hosts also provide valuable insights on studio session dos and don'ts, along with effective content creation solutions. They engage with studio engineers, urging them to tighten up their skills as the industry evolves. The path to success lies in sacrifice and continuous learning from every setback. Mark your calendars for the highly anticipated Cheat Code Live event on July 8th, where you'll embark on a transformative journey towards mastery. Only a select few will seize this opportunity to rise above the rest. Will you be one of them? The countdown has begun, and the stage is set for an unforgettable experience in the realm of entrepreneurial success. Event Details: Date: July 8th, 2023 Time: 12:00 pm - 2:00 pm (EST) Ticket Link: Eventbrite Join us on this remarkable episode as we unlock the secrets to success in the ever-evolving music industry.

Wendy Day serves as a guide and advisor to hip-hop musicians, offering her expertise and support. In 1992, she established the Rap Coalition, a non-profit entity that assists artists in navigating the music industry with greater advantage. Additionally, she created PowerMoves, a consultancy firm aimed at providing advice to artists and record labels regarding independent opportunities.No Labels Necessary is a Weekly Podcast hosted by Sean "BrandMan" Taylor and Jacorey "Kohrey" Barkley, unveiling the world of marketing from Indie Artists to Major Labels.To See More of Wendy Day, Check out:https://www.instagram.com/rapcoalition/Topics Covered:02:52 Wendy Day's Biggest Misconception07:17 What an Artists Successful Team Looks Like08:52 Wendy Day - Working With Death Row and Bad Boy10:11 What Made Tupac So Unique12:26 Why You Will Fail if you're not Authentic and Genuine16:03 Wendy Day: Why I Stay Away From The Music Industry18:11 The Business Model of The Music Industry is Flawed29:20 What Do You Say To Music Investors32:33 Wendy Day: I Never Owned a Label Because of This Mistake34:16 Renegotiating Deals: Timing an Artists Leverage36:45 Wendy Day: How I positioned myself to help artists40:40 Without A Vision You Will Fail46:18 $250K Music Marketing Budget Breakdown57:34 Growing an Artist Incubator01:09:34 What Content Can Teach Artists01:13:29 Top Moods in Music01:18:39 Causes Fans Care About01:29:17 Black Sheep Sues Universal Music GroupHOW J.R. MCKEE INDEPENDENTLY BROKE A 32 YEAR OLD ARTIST AND GOT THEM THEIR FIRST GRAMMY: https://www.brandmannetwork.com/grammy?el=dsp

Confucius and Fresh talk to Wendy Day -- who helped discover Eminem and helped Cash Money land an unprecedented $30 million dollar deal with Universal Music Group -- about the realities of the music industry, and how independent artists should approach their careers. Plus Hip-Hop Facts, Unpopular Opinion and Confucius Reads the News.

There's always talk in music circles saying that artists can seek out investors for financing their music business, but little talk about how to actually do it. The discussion stops at the possibility of finance outside of record deals and glazes over the practical steps...   So in this episode of Creative Juice, we're joined by special guest Wendy Day to talk about what artists need to know about investors and music industry finance today! Learn directly from Wendy's experiences in finding investors, working on deals, and building music careers spanning an amazing career working with artists from household names to successful indies!   If you've ever considered seeking outside capital for your music business, this episode will give you a sense of where to start looking, what assets you'll need in place, and what investors are looking for in the new music business!   DISCOVER: Why Record Label Deals Don't Make Sense For Most Artists What Is The Best Place To Start Looking For An Investor What Assets To Have In Place When Looking For A Deal Why Partnership Deals Are Like A Marriage Where 3 Different Artists Found Their First Investors What Investors Look For When It Comes To ROI   RESOURCES: Learn The Top Music Marketing Strategies Inside IndiePRO Looking to expand your team or need marketing help in 2023? Apply to work with IndieX! Find Wendy Online At WendyDay.com Follow Wendy on IG at @rapcoalition YOUTUBE: How The "Music Business" Actually Works Join Us In The Indepreneur Discord Server!  

Everybody's got something to say about Cash Money Records and the brothers who co-founded the label —Bryan “Birdman” Williams and Ronald “Slim” Williams. To paint the full Cash Money full picture, good and bad, I brought on Zack O'Malley Greenberg who has interviewed the brothers at-length while working at Forbes.Cash Money has one of the deepest catalogs in the game with several classics. And unlike some other upstart hip-hop labels, Birdman and Slim maintained control as they rose up. Their 1998 distribution deal with Universal is hip-hop's Louisiana Purchase.But we can't ignore Cash Money's lows either. There is a long, long list of artists who claim they were not compensated fairly by Birdman and Slim.Zack and I go through 30 years of Cash Money as a business, its competitive advantage, and what comes next now that Drake and Wayne are gone from the label. [1:44] Is Cash Money the greatest hip-hop record label of all time?[7:34] What people sleep on about Cash Money[11:01] Cash Money's history of not paying artists [16:52] Did Cash Money succeed because of Birdman and Slim or despite them? [19:29] Biggest signing? [20:29] The 1998 Universal-Cash Money deal [25:31] Lil' Wayne's mixtape run[29:03] The benefit of partnering with Republic Records[31:49] Bidding wars for Lil Wayne, Drake, and Nicki Minaj[33:21] Connection with New Jack City [40:56] Cash Money catalog valuation ?[43:00] Lil Wayne's beef with Birdman [45:48] Can Cash Money strike platinum again? [50:44] Birdman's love for music [56:08] Hopes for a Cash Money reunion tour and biopic [58:24] Who “won” the most in Cash Money's history?Listen: Apple Podcasts | Spotify | SoundCloud | Stitcher | Overcast | Amazon | Google Podcasts | Pocket Casts | RSSHost: Dan Runcie, @RuncieDan, trapital.coGuests: Zack O'Malley Greenburg, @zogblogEnjoy this podcast? Rate and review the podcast here! ratethispodcast.com/trapitalTrapital is home for the business of music, media and culture. Learn more by reading Trapital's free memo.Transcription[00:00:00] Zack: You know, some of the subsequent deals that they worked out with Universal, you know, maybe some of the deals where they were able to get universal to, to tackle some of the back office stuff. I mean, it's very unsexy, but you know, that's clearly an area where they needed to improve. So, let's say,to give some cash in terms of like higher distribution fee in order to have Universal, you know, cover some of this stuff. It's kinda like a boring, dark horse candidate, but you know, I mean, you could say that, that's probably useful in terms of buttoning things up.[00:00:37] Dan Intro: Hey, welcome to the Trapital Podcast. I'm your host and the founder of Trapital, Dan Runcie. This podcast is your place to gain insights from the executives in music, media, entertainment, and more who are taking hip hop culture to the next level.[00:00:57] Dan: All right. Today's episode is all about the one, the only cash money records. I got the one and only Zack Greenberg here who has reported on this company many times before we ran to this company and the business moves they did in our Top 10 Revolutionary list last year. So Zack, welcome back. I'm excited for this one.[00:01:18] Zack: Always good to be here with you, Dan. [00:01:19] Dan: Yeah. So for the folks listening, we are gonna do this in a few ways. We got a bunch of categories here that we're gonna run through, just evaluating Cash Money as a business, some of the highs, some of the lows, and just where they stand overall. But I think it'll be great to kick it off with the question that we often hear from folks is Cash Money, the greatest hip hop record label of all time? What's your point? What's your take?[00:01:44] Zack: How, man, you know, I mean, I think it's sort of like, any of these greatest ever are you talking about, overall body of work or sort of like, you know, The label at its peak. But you know, I think you gotta take it in an overall body of work, you know, type of thing. You know, it's hard to top Def Jam, I think, you know, if you were gonna go with an overall body of work, hip hop, legacy. But, you know, I don't know other than that, I mean, it's hard to say that there's anybody who you'd put above cash money, I'd say. Especially something that is, you know, really artist founded in that same way. I mean, you could talk about Bad Boy, you could talk about Rockefeller. But I think that, you know, Cash Money has staying power. You know, through Drake and Nikki and Lil Wayne and so forth, you know, in a way that, you know, I would argue that a lot of these other labels haven't, and, you know, who else can say that they've had Drake for that long? And I guess he's not there anymore. But man, that was pretty recent development and it's been a pretty great run. So, you know, to go all the way from the early nineties, you know, through basically now being relevant, stacking up all that catalog, you know, it's certainly, if not number one, it's, you know, gotta be top three, if not top two.[00:03:00] Dan: Yeah. So my answer is Def Jam as well, and we'll get to Def Jam in a minute. But, the case for Cash Money is this, and I know a few people have said it. Irv Gotti recently said it. Russell Simmons himself said that Cash Money was the greatest hip hop company that has come through. But the case for cash money, you mentioned it earlier, the fact that they did it while owning the core asset and the music and still doing that moving forward says a lot. Not something that can be said about Def Jam, many of the others that would be even in the conversation. I think even with a newer label at Quality Control, they've still done it while owning it. Well, at least up to this point from some rumors that are happening. But I think that's one case for Def Jam. But then I think of the continued run of success from everything that happened in the nineties from I guess we could start with like juvenile drop in HA in 98 and then pretty much everything from Drake's last Cash Money album, which I believe was Scorpion. So if you're looking just at like that run from everything there, that is such a strong hit rate. And I think that's the thing too that I would give them over Def Jam is the hit rate of who were the artists we signed and what was their likelihood of success and they were just able to do it. Even with the imprints, I mean, I think major record labels. So wrong with so many imprints. I just never worked out and for them to have, whether it's Young Money or even the smaller moments with the best music or with Rich Gain, there was always something there. And even though there was some conflict, and we'll get to that, I think that's the Cash Money case. The Def Jam case though, I think this is where I think of course Def Jam did end up becoming a major record label, so it's a little bit nuanced there, but I do think you have that eighties run Beasties LL Public Enemy. You got the nineties run with all those artists too. Especially looking at what Red Band met the man DMX. I feel like they had New York on Locke and then two thousands, the Rockefeller partner. Murder Inc. The video games, I mean, it's, I know the last decade hasn't been there, but it would be tough to not put Def Jam up top, but I understand if some people would consider Def Jam a major as opposed to, you know, an independent. So, I get the nuance there. [00:05:10] Zack: right, right. And, and being, you know, fully owned by a major as opposed to Cash Money, which really has distribution agreement. You know, and you could look at, you know, I guess Def Jam was sold in chunks, but the total amount that sold for, you'd have to adjust for inflation and stuff. But I wonder how that would stack up against the current value of cash money today, which, you know, it's incredibly driven by the copyrights that they still control and, you know, definitely hundreds of millions of dollars. You know, if you look at, Lil Wayne kind of quietly sold his The Young Money, Cash Money Partnership for a hundred million bucks a couple years ago, that was before the catalog boom, got really crazy and then kind of died down again. So, you know that that's valuing what Birdman and Slim Own, you know, just on the Young Money, Cash Money side of the business, you know, at nine figures. So there's, you know, there's a lot more to the company than that, although that's, you know, that's kind of the gold line. But still, you gotta think that, you know, this is still, you know, sent a million dollar business and, you know, I'd be curious to see what a proper valuation, you know, what it would look like against the total value that Def Jam got, you know, in terms of dollars over the years. But, you know, when you think about who was hottest and what record label was hottest at any particular point, Yeah, I think probably the peak was there was that year that Def Jam was, you know, getting sold or the second half of it was getting sold. And, Lyor basically said to Jay and D M X, like, let's have two albums this year. And, you know, because the valuation is gonna be based on revenues, not earnings. And like, the more you can sell, the more we get. And so, you know, that moment at D M X at his peak, and you know, Jay, I think, I'd say at least at his commercial, you know, record Sales Peak, you know, as an individual artist, you know, that was about as hot as, as it could ever get for, for any record label, I think. [00:07:08] Dan: That's a good point. So I guess if we were to compare Def Jams 98 and 99, like that run to Yeah. Cash Money, and I know there's a few runs you could put in there, but from an overall commercial perspective, it would have to be 0 8, 0 9 20 10, I would probably assume, because you get. Carter three, and then you get, you know, Drake's debut, Nikki's debut. I feel like it would probably be somewhere in there. [00:07:34] Zack: Yeah, that's probably pretty close. I mean, that was a lot, you know, that was a lot of concentration within a couple year period as well. You know, and I think the other thing about Cash Money, that maybe people sleep on to some extent is, you know, just like the efficiency of the label, especially in the early days. And, you know, of course we can get into some of the issues with paying producers and so forth, but, you know, they really had a system and you know, it was going and finding artists that were bubbling up, you know, first in the New Orleans area. I mean, this is in the nineties, and, you know, and then kind of just plugging them into the machine. Right. You know, put them with stable producers in-house, get Manny Fresh on there and, you know, it was not like a, you know, high expense kinda situation. Like maybe you would've seen with Def Jam or, you know, some of the New York, LA labels, it was just like, you know, you know, probably low, low cost, high output. You know, like there's a high margin business, low overhead, you know, it's lean and mean. So I think from, in that regard, Cash Money, you know, it might have been, it might have been the best business, you know, out of any record label. Right. In terms of sort of like efficiency and profitability and stuff like that.[00:08:47] Dan: That's a great point because if you look at that vibe, I think that was the vibe for the South overall. We saw that with no Limit as well, just with in-house production sheep, that production does almost everything and the music videos aren't flashy and the fact that I think they stuck with what they do and what they work with well, and eventually I think collaborations came, but that was something that they were hesitant about as well. Just thinking about juvenile dropping 400 degrees, and I'm going back to that just because that's the first album that comes after that 1998 Universal deal, which we'll talk about soon, but, that album, I'm pretty sure the entire production value for those music videos probably costs less than one of the suits that Puffy and Mace wore in the music videos. or, yeah, Jay-Z's Sunshine Music video, which I know has been talked about for years on end, but that's what the vibe was. There were no Hype Williams music videos coming through Cash Money. Right. At least at that point. I know they came later when Wayne blew up further, but that's what they did. They stuck to what they did and it worked. It worked so well. [00:09:55] Zack: Warren Buffet would love Cash Money. [00:09:59] Dan: Oh yeah. He loves little cost.[00:09:59] Zack: Cash Value. Value, cash value investor. Right. Early cash money would be the Warren Buffet play.[00:10:06] Dan: Yeah, absolutely. Definitely. And the thing is too, you talked about it earlier, just some of this things leading up to the big deal that they had, but even back in those early days, even before the Universal deal, Birdman and Slim, the co-founders of Cash Money Records had a history of legal issues with artists and not paying artists on time. And I actually have a list here, and it's probably an incomplete list, but artists that have had some type of dispute or issue with Cash Money records when it comes to payments. So I have Lil Wayne, Pharrell, Clipse, David Banner, Bangladesh, the producer, at least five or six artists before 1998, Wendy Day, who's not an artist, but one of the attorneys and people that helped make this deal happen. Behi Turk and Shal and Jazz Prince, of course himself. Tiger, Manny Fresh, and I'm sure I'm missing people from that list. [00:11:01] Zack: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it's a long and storied list of people to have disputes with and, you know, it really is something that goes, you know, hand in hand with success.You can't ignore that history. So, you know, I think it is important to remember some of the context. You know, these guys were coming out of a completely different world. You know, and they were hustlers. They were legit hustlers in New Orleans. And, you know, in doing some reporting, you know, I verified it. I mean, you know, they were the real deal. They moved things over. They went legit. They became record moguls and Bird Man's Case became a rapper himself. And, you know, they were not people who had dealt with, you know, sets of books, right? There was not really necessarily like bookkeeping apparatus in their form of business. So, you know, I think there was an adjustment period that, you know, let's say perhaps went on for too long in terms of, you know, getting things papered up and straightened out. But, you know, I wrote a big story on them in 2019 for Forbes, where I went down to Miami and spent some time with Birdman and Slim. I talked to their lawyers a lot. I talked to Wendy Day. Spend some time in the studio with them and you know, I mean, everybody of course has, if you ask people in the Cash Money camp, they're gonna have their side of the story. If you ask whoever they're having the dispute with, you know, they're gonna have their side of the story too. And you know, obviously when there's smoke, there's fire, there's a hell of a lot of smoke when it comes to not getting paid on time. But… [00:12:29] Dan: What would you say is the Cash Money side of the story, though? The Cash Money is this it?[00:12:33] Zack: They, you know, started out as people who had not had formal training in business, doing business with a lot of other people who had not had formal training in business, who were represented by people who had not had formal training in business. And so when you go back to some of these early documents, it was not properly papered over on either side. And so there's a lot of question over, you know, who owns what, you know, I don't know that anybody who was involved in some of those early deals really, you know, had a full grasp of sort of, you know, music copyright and publishing and, and master recordings and all that. I mean, you know, it's not like an intuitive business, you know, it's like, wait, what? There's two writes to every song. They've like, there's a publishing and a recorded music. It's separate. How does that work? So I think a lot of that was, you know, kind of like if you go back the nineties and early nineties, especially when they're getting started, you know, before the Universal deal there was just really like, you know, I would imagine a lot of handshake deals, a lot of just, you know, kind of like, let's see how, how it goes sort of stuff. A lot of, you know, here we're gonna give you a bag of cash and you do you give us this beat or you give us a verse or whatever. So, you know, it makes sense to me that it might not be papered up properly. But, you know, the fact that that's continued, you know, so far into the future, you know, that's another story. So, you know, what they did say was that, you know, after, and we can talk more about this Universal deal, but after the Universal deal started and then, you know, as it continued to evolve, you know, to where Universal got an even bigger cut of, you know, distribution fee or like an even bigger distribution fee than it had signed up for in the beginning. Universal took on more and more of sort of the back office function. And so, you know, some of the more recent stuff is, you know, a little bit more papered up properly. So that's the Cash Money side. But, you know, it's funny, I mean, when I did this story and I reached out to all these folks, you know, what I got was like a no comment, which says to me that, you know, things have been settled up and they kind of don't want to get into it anymore. Right. Or maybe there was an NDA involved. But yeah, a lot, a lot of smoke. A lot of smoke in that area, for sure. [00:14:42] Dan: Yeah, the NDAs are key. I remember there was one of the people that I had mentioned earlier that I was going to have on the podcast of Trapital, the interview timing didn't work out, but that was one of the first things they said. If you have any questions for us about Birdman and his relationship with this artist or anything like that. No, we're not answering it. And I was just like, all right, noted. Like, and I feel like that's kind of RANE with a lot of this, but I think they and Birdman and Slim specifically in an odd way. It wasn't even just to them alone. I feel like there was this ethos of, you could almost put Suge Knight into this same category as well, but these people that were cut throat with business folks that they were doing major deals with, whether it was Suge Knight with the folks at Interscope or Birdman with Universal, I'm like, Hey, I'm gonna take what's mine. And rightfully so. They kept ownership over what worked for them and they did that, but they kept that same energy with a lot of the people that like worked with them on the other side too. And that's the piece of it that while it was frustrating to see there are actually some other sides of this too, because even the fact that I think we can get into it in a little bit, but just some of the artists, they were able to sign how they went about that. As frustrating as it was about them not paying artists, like there not every aspect of the business was and is predatory. So that's one thing that you know started to come up more and more as once you get past the salacious parts of the details and stuff, you're like, okay, no and no different than why you went down there to report them. Right. There is nuance and there are a number of things to dive into. For sure, for sure. So shifting here, one of the other things that I've thought about, we talked a little bit about what set Cash Money apart. We talked a bunch about the backstory and the bad rep, but the next thing up here is about Cash Money itself and whether or not you think that it succeeded cause of Birdman and Slim or it succeeded despite them. So thinking about this hypothetical world, if it even is possible, other folks that would've had this label in their hands and what things would've looked like, what's your take there? If we're really isolating them as business leaders.[00:16:52] Zack: I absolutely think it succeeded because of them. I mean, did they get in their own way some of the time? Absolutely. But I think, you know, anybody who can run a business that goes from like the early nineties in an informal economy, you know, in like the Louisiana area to being this global thing, to this day that is still, you know, very much at the forefront of an industry. I mean, you know, like they gotta be doing something right. You know, 30 plus years on the staying relevant and, you know, from like the early days Hot Boys to like the late nineties and, you know, remember Big Timers and Oh yeah. Still flying, all that, you know, heyday as we were alluding to, and sort of like the late s apparently, you know, 2010s, you know, of Cash Money, Young Money with Nikki and Drake and Wayne. Even coming through to, you know, to you to say Scorp. I mean, that's a really long run of relevance and you know, have that, I mean, yeah, like I said, they gotta be doing something [00:17:53] Dan: Right. Yeah. I think it's because of them too. I will. Because as much as there are issues, and we've talked about a lot of them here, There's so much of this that would've succeeded with folks, other folks in charge, because there are a lot of record labels from the South that tried to do what Cash Money did as well. And a lot of them came and then most of them went. And the fact that we're having this conversation and not having it about them is part of it. And a lot of those record labels had talented people as well, but things just didn't carry over. They may have taken, you know, a bigger deal to get more money upfront, but then the hypothetical is, let's say it was in the hands of someone else that wouldn't have been able to push it forward, then it becomes part of the Island Def Jam conglomerate and then just kind of gets mixed and mixed. And then it becomes one of the many labels that you hear about where it's like, oh yeah, whatever happened to this one or that one. And I think it took what could have been easily, because there would've been enough meat on the bone if we just talked about Cash Money from the early nineties up until, let's say the mid two thousands. Right. And I think that's, inflection point that we can talk about in a little bit. Even that itself was a great run itself. And then you look at the second half of the career from like the mid two thousands on, that's a whole other historic record label. They have two of those under the same house. I think it's because of them and as much as it can be frustrating to hear and see and, you know, unlikely there's some critical things. But let's jump into that now though, because I think one of the questions we have here is the biggest signing that this record label has had. What do you think is the biggest signing for Cash Money?[00:19:29] Zack: Oh man. You know, I think probably easy answer is Drake, but you know, I would actually say Lil Wayne because if you don't have Wayne, I don't think the Drake thing happens, you know, and really Lil Wayne from such a young age going all the way back to the hot boys and, and you know, coming through. All those Carter albums, you know, like he's the backbone of this whole operation, you know, musically, sonically. And I think without him you don't get everything else that comes along. What do you think?[00:19:58] Dan: Yeah, it's Wayne too. That's who I have. I know that Drake is the highest commercial artist. If you were to look at all of the numbers and I think without him, the past decade would've looked very different. But we would still be having this conversation in some form. Likely if it wasn't for the past decade of Drake, it may be a bit more truncated. But we may not be having this conversation at all if it wasn't for Wayne. So I think it has to be Wayne there. What do you think is the best business move for Cash Money?[00:20:29] Zack: You know, I'm gonna go back to that first deal that they struck with Universal. I was in the early nineties at Wendy Day, who he mentioned earlier. It was sort of like a go be who helped, you know, really get them, you know, kind of set up properly with this deal. But you know, they negotiated it and they wouldn't take anything less than something that they felt was an incredible deal. And, I remember the story that Slim told me as they went in, they sat down some mid-level executive at Universal and low-balled them to straight up buy half the company. And so he and Birdman just got up to leave. Then Doug Morris walks in and he was the head of Universal at the time. Comes in with another colleague, Mel Lo winter and Slim members, you know, Doug saying, Hey, if I were you, I wouldn't sell my company. He comes in and offers him 30 million advance just for the privilege of doing business. And, what does Universal get a 7% distribution fee, which is not a lot. So kind of almost doesn't make sense from Universal's perspective unless you think about it in terms of market share. Market share is so important when you're the biggest record label because there are all these great things that happen when you have the most market share. There are all kinds of rights that are assigned based on market share. Like anytime there's, you know, a mislabeled song that gets played or gets spun,and this happens a lot, the metadata in music is a disaster. So if, you know, there are these huge pops of sort of like unresolved money and you know, what they eventually do is they get resolved down by market sharing. So if you're Universal, you know, you get the land share of that and there's a lot of other things, a lot of other places where calculations are done based on market share. You can also brag and say that you're the biggest stuff like that. So, you know, certainly it was worth it for Universal to come in and especially, you know, you think about at the time, You know, hip hop was still at a nascent stage and particularly hip hop in the South was like, not even really on the map for Universal to be able to come in and have this connection was really great for them. But, yeah, I mean, what a great deal. 30 million bucks. You don't have to give up anything. You just give, you know, just give a distribution fee and frankly, you would want your stuff to be distributed by this, you know, enormous record label anyway, so that you could expand and get bigger and better. So I think hands down, that's it. You know, that didn't stop, that there were rumors, you know, that they were even bootlegging their own music, like out the back or wherever, so that they didn't have to pay the 7%. But I, you know, I don't know. I mean, that's that talk about, you know, efficient business. But, you know, I think you go back to that deal that kind of laid the groundwork. Cause if they had given up half of their company way back then, I mean, you see what happened, Jay-Z he up, you know, a huge chunk of Rockefeller early on and. And I think was never really that incentivized, you know, to make that his main thing anymore because, you know, he'd given up such a big chunk early on.[00:23:29] Dan: Yeah, it's one of the best deals we've seen in music and one of the best deals we've seen in hip hop over the past 30 years without question. And the fact that they were able to get everything you mentioned, plus 2 million advance for three years. They kept ownership of the Masters too. And that's the thing that, as we talked about, Birdman and Slim are still collecting on that year after year. So it's up there. It's incredible. And I know that there were other labels that tried to do the same, but just couldn't. I think part of the reason is that this goes back to them focusing odd, what works for them. They had a unique sound. Universal saw this as their entryway to the south in an authentic way because back then, you know, the south was still vying for dominance. And I know that, you know, things were happening at LaFace, but this was different. The New Orleans sound was different from what was happening in Atlanta at the moment. And this gave you an entry path into that. So it was big time. [00:24:27] Zack: Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, I think, you know, also 30 million back then, I mean, probably more like 50, 60 million when you talk about inflation. But you know, I would, to our earlier point, you know, did Cash Money succeed? You know, or despite Slim and Birdman, you know, that's situation where, you know, obviously I wasn't there and there wasn't a video of it, but, you know, when you sit down with Slim and Birdman, like you can get the sense that it would be tough to negotiate with that.You know? I mean, Slim's sitting there, he's like 10 feet tall. He doesn't really talk very much, you know, and Birdman, he can get pretty loquacious, but like, uh, he, you know, when he wants to, you know, be kind of stone based, you know, I mean, he can, he can have a great poker face. So I think, you know, if you're some executive, you're going in and you're trying to get them to sell, and they have really no incentive to sell, and they're sitting. Just like, Nope, we're good. You know? I think that that leads you to offer them some crazy deal, like the one that Universal offered and so I really would chocolate up to some very good negotiating, on their part as well. [00:25:31] Dan: Yeah. You need to be able to negotiate to pull off hip hop's Louisiana purchase. Got to at least one half. Absolutely. At least one half of it. Yeah. So, yeah. The other thing that I did have was a dark horse move and a move that doesn't get talked about as much, and as much as that move does get focused on the one dark horse that I did have is the, well, I guess too, but let me focus on this one. I would say that the mixtape strategy that they had with Lil Wayne in the mid to late two thousands, even though cash money had ownership of the music, even though this, I think that worked so well. One of the questions that we have is just how well did this company record label transition from different stages of music, whether it was from the CD era, ringtones or ringtones, to streaming it, Cash Money knocked it out of the park. With each of their albums sold, especially when they did this deal at the height of the CD era, when the music industry was struggling in the mid two thousands and they were trying to get people to buy CDs. They were just like, Hey, let's give away the music for free. And Wayne was rapping over other beats. He was in his bag more than anyone, and from dedications to Drought, all of those, just so many classics in there that I think real Hip Hop fans and folks that were following Wayne were following even more so than the next album. So all of that speaks. Lil Wayne being able to sell over a million albums in the first week when the Carter three drops in 2008, which is still a very tough time for CD sales to even happen. So that whole run and just the thought to do that. And granted, I think some of this may have been a bit more on Lil Wayne's push himself, especially because at that point he had his own young money imprint. But all of this is happening and you know, Birdman and Slim had a problem with it. They could have said no. But I think the fact that they leaned into the change that was happening, you already saw what 50 Cent did with his mixtapes in the mid two thousands. You get drama, you get the other folks in the south to be able to help make this happen. And I think it worked out well for them.[00:27:34] Zack: Yeah, absolutely. That's a really good point too. So, you know, I mean, I guess when you have a label that has been that successful, that long, Yeah, there should be a couple different options for what the best move was. Yeah, I like that as a sleeper pick. [00:27:47] Dan: Yeah. And Lollipop is the best selling ringtone of all time too. over 5 million ringtones sold, and I mean, ringtones, were selling for like three bucks each to that point. So I mean 15 million just from folks wanting to, you know, have, you know, that little jingle on there, Motorola razors or whatever the hell people were using at that point. But, what was your dark horse? Oh [00:28:10] Zack: Oh man, that's a really good question. I don't know. I mean, I guess it was just so clearly the Universal deal to me. But, you know, and Drake wouldn't really be considered a dark horse candidate, I guess you could say. As time went on, you know, some of the subsequent deals that they worked out with Universal, you know, maybe some of the deals where they were able to get Universal to tackle some of the back office stuff. I mean, it's very unsexy, but you know, that's clearly an area where they needed to improve. So, let's say,to give us some cash in terms of like higher distribution fee in order to have Universal, you know, cover some of this stuff. It's kinda like a boring, dark horse candidate. But you know, I mean, you could say that that's probably useful in terms of buttoning things up and you know, there was a lot of smoke, like we said, but you know, nothing ever, like the house never burned down. So, you know, maybe, maybe those kinds of arrangements really kind of help prevent something like that from happening.[00:29:03] Dan: And I think that back office piece also just makes me think about the broader partnership and the expertise that they were able to lean on. And a question that I actually didn't explore, but now I'm thinking more about it, is how different do we think that the Universal partnership would've been, let's say Cash Money had partnered with another label under the Universal umbrella? Because obviously part of this is very close. There was Universal Republic at the time and they've been hand in hand working with Monte and Avery Lipman ever since, and they are two of the most highly regarded executives in the game that have now being, year after year after year, the label with the number one market share. And part of that is because of Cash Money itself, but it's also because of all the other stars, even outside of that label, they have been able to bring it to, as opposed to many of the other labels in the Universal Umbrella or the umbrella of Universal Music group labels that have not had that consistency. So I also think there's a dynamic there where, let's say there's another world where cash money was under capital or cash money was under some of these other labels that have struggled to stay relevant, what that would've looked like.[00:30:10] Zack: Yeah. I mean, I think if you, if you kind of need to go back to Def Jam, you know, some of the back and forth that Def Jam has had over the years. It gives you an idea of, or even as like a top label, the kind of trials and tribulations you might go under. But you know, when you're coming in, you know, going directly to Doug Morris, you know that that gives you a lot of leeway, a lot of leverage. You got that line straight to the top. And, you know, even with somebody like Jay, it took him, it wasn't until, you know, I don't know, when he was dealing directly with Doug Morris, when Doug, this is, I think around the time of Blueprint three, and Jay had that line. I gave Doug a grip. I lost the flip for five stacks. He could have the album. They bet 10 million on a coin flip and like, you know, one way or the other. So, you know, but Birdman we're doing that like, you know, 15 years earlier, having that kind of direct line. So, you know, again, I think going straight to serve them incredibly well.[00:31:09] Dan: Definitely. Yeah. Another, another piece too. So, two other, like sonically three other dark horse candidates, I'll bring 'em, but they're all under the same thing, was Bird Man's ability to win bid wars and win huge bidding wars, I think is an underrated piece of this record label. So I'll bring up three of them. First one, go back to 2004. So this is around the time thatCarter came out and Wayne was considering to leave Def Jam, and this was around the time that Jay-Z had just became president and Jay-Z pushed hard, make that happen and couldn't leave cash money for Def Jam. That was the thought, right?[00:31:43] Zack: Yeah. Yeah. Carter boys, and there were all these, you know, kind of …[00:31:49] Dan: Yeah, they're trying to push the whole Carter board thing and yeah, Birdman was like, all right, come through. I'll give you your own imprint and you are the president of that imprint and let's continue this thing. And that obviously sets up young money and then the next 15 years after that, right. So he does that. Yeah. And I think that's huge because then that sets the stage for the bidding war for Drake, because Drake drops so far gone beginning of 2009. And this is like, you know, everyone is trying to, it's like when Yaba sweepstakes we're seeing in the NBA right now everyone wants this person and everyone is going after them. I mean, truly Greenwall Lior, everyone was trying to get 'em. And it was that connection that Drake had with Cortez, Brian and Jay Prince Ja Prince and that whole crew that I think eventually helped keep him on the cash money roster there. So that was a huge one. And I think we saw something similar with Nicki Minaj as well. A couple months later. Everyone wanted her to beat me up. Scotty the mixtapes were hot and he and Wayne, Wayne was like, no, I want her to be the, the first lady of the label. That was the whole thing in the two thousands, right? Everyone wanted to have the first lady. You saw it in the nineties, right? But like everyone wanted to declare and elevate this person and rightfully so, but like that's who we had. And then we obviously saw the beginning and the middle part of that next decade. Just go on one of the all-time runs. So Bird Band's ability to win against the biggest people in the industry for record label that his men, you know, his brother own is really impressive for sure.[00:33:21] Zack: And you know, it served Lil Wayne well in the end because Young Money became something that he was able to sell for, you know, about a hundred million dollars for his stake later on too. So, you know, keeping that ownership as opposed to just chasing the biggest advance time and time again we see in hip hop. You know, it's so important. But, you know, I was thinking the other night, it is funny, like everyone has watched New Jack City, and it had been ages, ages, ages. And if they reminded me, I mean, how much of the whole Young Money, Cash Money situation is modeled after elements of that movie. I mean, even just like, The name Cash Money or C M B Y M C M B. The shirts, like the shirts, are incredibly similar that, you know, a lot of the lines, even the Carter, you know, the albums are named. I mean, the Carter was the building, you know, where Wesley Stein's character was like running this whole operation you know, that's kind of like another interesting element to the whole, you know, to the whole narrative. Like, you know, these guys coming out of Louisiana, you know, had their eyes up on this very New York kind of, you know, almost role model, for a business. And, you know, they had been hustlers. They were kind of modeling themselves after these, you know, fictional hustlers in New York and, you know, and then in a way out hustled sort of like the New York record label establishment. So I thought that was kind of an interesting, you know, little side bit of color to the whole story. And, like a bit of irony as well, you know, when you talk about, South versus, New York kind of situation too. [00:34:59] Dan: And I think that also speaks to some of that mentality too, because here you have Birdman that was getting inspiration from a black crime movie. And I think a lot of the ways of him doing business are very much central on, okay, I wanna support and uplift the black community, do what I can here and grid. And I think, you know, part of how he was able to do that has, you know, been quite controversial just with certain artists he's had on. Yeah. But still, I think that ethos stems back from ownership in trying to keep things in-house as much as you can. And it took them a lot to even partner with other artists from other parts of the countries and stuff like that, that I think you saw with Dino Brown and how he was in that movie and how he carried versus I think someone like Jay-Z who record label Rockefeller named after one of the great white business magnets that you had in this country. Right. And so many Jay-Z bars, whether it's Black Axl, Rose Black, Kirk Cobain called me this. I feel like, you know, people always get on Kanye for some of that. Like always trying to like be okay. I'm, you know, the black version of whatever X person. But I think Jay-Z, you know, also had a lot of that too. And then I think also looking at his business mentality, a lot of his success came from his huge and lucrative partnerships with established companies in this space. So the inspiration I think also became kind of telltale sign for the type of businesses these types of folks ended up creating too. [00:36:23] Zack: Yeah. And you know, I mean, you know, brown was a really ruthless character. And you know, I think there's like the money and the success that's glamorized. But you know, it's a gritty movie. I mean it seems like he is not a likable guy in the end. You know, without giving too much of the plot, I'm sure everybody's seen it, but like, I was like, wow. Yeah. I don't know if I'd be wanting to model myself after this dude. You know, he's pretty brutal. But, you know, even on the, you know, kind of the lighter side, there's a scene where he's like giving out turkeys at Thanksgiving. Yep. And you know, the Cash Money guys always give out turkeys in New Orleans at Thanksgiving and I wonder if they got that directly from the movie. You know, cuz so many of you know, from the Carter. You know, the c n b kind of, kind of like whole, you know, ethos there. I wonder how much of that they just pulled directly from the movie, so…[00:37:16] Dan: Oh, yeah. I could definitely see that mentality too. And speaking about it, you know, full circle. I could also see Birdman having a bit of that cancel that bitch mentality too, in short situations.[00:37:28] Zack: Right, right, right, right. Exactly. So, yeah, I mean, and they won't talk about that part of it, the interviews maybe, but you kind of get the sense of like that's where the negotiation and the cash element of the Cash Money comes in. Yeah. [00:37:42] Dan: The aita literally held people over the balcony of a building to get what he wanted. Right. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of that came through to fruition. But next category up here. So missed opportunity. Is there anything that you look at that you're like, man, obviously it's an overall successful company. Is there anything you look back on about what if they did this differently or what if they did that differently?[00:38:02] Zack: I think the number one thing I wonder is what if they had sold the whole thing, you know? A year and a half ago, could they have gotten just an insane multiple? I mean, you know, you're seeing like Springsteen staying and all these guys getting hundreds of millions of dollars for their catalogs. So, you know, I get it. And there's, you know, catalogs, hip hop catalogs are valued differently from rock catalogs. And also one of the benefits of rock catalogs is they're usually, you know, written and owned by, you know, all the rights are with the band. There's not like a million different producers coming in. It's not as complicated. So like, you know, they can sell the whole thing, you know, a hundred percent of the rights and you don't have to, you know, it's not like you're just buying like, you know, I don't know, 30% of this and 50% of that and whatever. It's, it's not this complex web, let's say there may not be as many things that haven't been papered over as there were with Cash Money, but man, you know, there were some pretty insane, numbers flying around and I really wonder if, you know, if they had, been applying some of, you know, 20 or 30 x multiple. To whatever they were pulling in, you know, which is, you know, they can just sit there and make, you know, tens of millions of dollars a year, just off of this catalog. I mean, so what would the market have been if they had went and sold the whole thing at the peak of the catalog? Boom. That's what I really wonder. [00:39:21] Dan: That's a good one. So I guess some high level back of the envelope math on that. So let's say that the peak of the catalog boom was like December, 2020 maybe, and then like, you know, into the spring of 2021 and we definitely saw some 30 x multiples there and at least the last public number I saw, and I think you had this in one of your latest articles as well, but that Cash Money's Masters generated around 30 million annually, or 20 to 30 million. Was that the number?[00:39:49] Zack: Yeah, I think it was at least 30. And you know, cuz Bird, like most of hey Birdman, you know, has been making like close to 20 million a year, for a while, give or take. And you know, most of that is just, you know, the catalog. So yeah, I mean that's just his cut. And then if you figure you double that for Slim, yeah, probably, you know, it was around 30, 35, something like that, so, you know. Yeah. I mean, are they gonna get a 30 x value even at the peak? I don't think so because just hip hop wasn't getting that kind of valuation. I don't really understand that because everybody's like, oh, rock and roll music gonna stand the test of time. It's like if you ask the average 20 year old who Bruce Springsteen is, they're not gonna know. I mean, so I would argue that hip hop is actually gonna be more valuable down the line. But just the valuation, you know, that's not what people have been paying for. So even at the peak, you know, I, I don't know that I saw any valuations anywhere near 30. I think Kanye was shopping his catalog at one point and wanted a 30 x multiple, but, you know, didn't get any bites. So I think it comes down to like, yeah, what kind of multiple could they actually have gotten? [00:40:56] Dan: Yeah, because even more recently, so yeah, we're recording this now. January, 2023, there was a report that just came out about Dr. Dre selling a collection of music assets that I believe are worth different multiples. But the number that I heard from that was, They generate around 10 million per year and that he wanted 250 and he's getting just over 200 million or somewhere between that. So that's around a 20 x multiple for a deal. That sounds like it was still coming underway in 2022. So if you were to put that multiple on, let's call it 35 million for maybe what Birdman and Slim have collectively, then that is you're talking $700 million. So that's a pretty sizable number, not a billion. But maybe if there are some concerns about, maybe there's a bit more of a split of who owns what. We didn't even talk about publishing right now, but there may be a split too, especially if everything was captured. and even thinking about quality control, for instance, and I think they got around 400 million, 300, got 400 million, but this was last year. So I would assume that 500 to 750 sounds, if I heard a number there, I would be like, sounds about right. If I heard a number lower than that or higher than that, I would probably be surprised one way or the other. [00:42:15] Zack: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I think that makes sense. And it's not just one artist, you know, obviously it's a whole bunch of artists and a bunch of pieces of different artists. But I think another thing, and this is maybe one of the reasons why the hip-hop valuations are lower, is like when you have all those producers, it might not be as easy to get, you know, to get clearances for using stuff in commercials and that sort of thing. Whereas if you buy a hundred percent of the rights, there's no question. Right. And so I'm not even sure if somebody owned 1% of, of something, whatever. Like I don't think they would have some, like, veto right. About the song being played in a commercial. But, you know, when you start to have so many different parties owning bigger stakes, a particular song, it can get a little convoluted and, you know, I do wonder if that's a big part of it as well.[00:43:00] Dan: Yeah, no, that's a good point. Yeah. Cuz I think sampling also is a huge piece of that as well. The missed opportunity for me, this is a bit more of a specific one from like a timeframe, not like a specific move, but Birdman and Little Wayne not settling and squashing the beef, the issues that they had in the mid 2010s. I think we lost out on Wayne. I know Wayne was in prison during part of this, but we lost out on his momentum. We lost out on a lot there because I feel like a lot happened from the Carter four coming out in 2011 to the Carter five coming out in 2018. I believe. There was so much back and forth. There was so much drama. You know, Drake was going on his all time run at that point. Nicki was doing the same. And the fact that the signature biggest artist is literally tweeting out, I want off this label, but it's not that easy. Or sending these messages out in the middle of Wayne and Drake having their tours and him still being on albums and trying to figure out how to drop things.I think it was obviously a great decade in run, but I think it could have been even greater if they were able to solve some of that stuff and figure it out. [00:44:11] Zack: Yeah, a hundred percent, you know, that that was like, it's a long time to be going between, proper albums, you know, so, and I think that was a really interesting time in the music business. And, I mean, the music business changed completely right from, from 2011 to 2018 from being, you know, oh, this new streaming thing is gonna be important to like, you know, it is the entire business basically. So, you know, and I think that an artist like Wayne, you know, as somebody whose music translates really well to, you know, to that medium. And, you know, as we know, hip hop is a monster on streaming and, you know, tends to do really well. So I would've been really curious to see if he had been able to continue that momentum, you know, just how much bigger he could have gotten in that period of time too.[00:44:57] Dan: Yeah, definitely. The next piece we add too, I think we talked a little bit about this just in terms of how did the label handle the transitions? And I think you just mentioned it there. They were able to do a lot of it well, especially the mixed day piece and the ring toes. And then I think a lot of it laid the work for streaming and Drake is streaming, did a lot of that, the Cash Money labels. So I think that worked. But this next question is interesting though, because it's been around three years, I think it's been at least three years since you did your deep story, the Forbes cover story on Cash Money, where you went down and interviewed them. And then I know it's been four years since I had written a piece around the time that Drake had completed Scorpion and we knew that it was going to be, or at least I thought the future may be bleak. And I think the question that you pose into the piece was, can they strike platinum again? It's been three years since now. What do you think? [00:45:48] Zack: You know, I don't know. I mean, the rules for platinum, like what constitutes platinum have changed so much that, you know, all it takes is, you get, you know, one hot signing and they do really well on streaming and suddenly you have a platinum whatever. And, you know, it's like, okay, I think that, you know, Drake is gone. Wayne is gone. When I went down there, they were really big on blue face and Jack Reese, you know, I don't know what either of them are turning out to be like, I mean anywhere near Drake, Nikki, Wayne, et cetera. Jack Reese is the king of R&B though, right? That was the whole thing too. So what I'm gonna go with, no, I don't think they will begin Drake Platinum. But I would caveat that by saying it doesn't matter because they can just sit back, and collect these checks. And that's gonna happen. That'll happen even if, you know Drake and Nikki and Wayne retire. I mean, their back catalog stuff is still gonna be a gold mine. And you know, when I was down there, what they said was that they're forever in business with Drake. But they wouldn't get more specific. And so what I took that to mean was, you know, at the time, you know, he was kind of an ex extra kidding himself. But even once he's gone, they're still sitting on these, you know, their share of the copyrights that will be, you know, Drake is a streaming king and they have a big piece of that. So, yeah. Do I think they'll strike platinum again? You know, probably not, but I don't really think it matters. I don't think so, what are they gonna do? Like what are they gonna do? They're gonna sit back and collect those checks. Yeah. [00:47:26] Dan: Yeah. I came to the same spot as well. I guess platinum in the purest sense of having a chart hit. Sure. There could be a legacy hit that gets, you know, some viral thing on TikTok and then that becomes a hit. Like, I don't know, I don't know if I like slow motion singles, like juvenile when platinum, but I feel like that's the type of song I could see go viral and some TikTok thing and then bring new, that's one of my cat favorite Cash Money songs. And I feel like I could see something like that happen. But I feel like you were kind of posing it more so in the moment of looking at these runs of like late two thousand, late nineties, early two thousands, that Cash Money is like a platinum moment or mid two thousands. Wayne's mixtape ran late two thousands, early 2010 or to mid 2010s. Young Money rises to the highest of heights. I don't think we'll see that moment again. And it's crazy cuz I think there's times where maybe things could have happened. You had the rich gang moment where he looked like he was so close with Young Thug. And I feel like especially in 2014, people expected Thug to go on to that superstar level and still be very successful. But I think that the stock for Thug at that moment was a little higher than it may be actually reached. And I think some of Thug's proteges kind of reached the heights that we thought Thug would've reached at one point, just in terms of a commercial success perspective. But it just never quite happened. But again, they own this. It's not like they missed some opportunity. This is something that is literally generating tens of millions per year and that's not changing anytime soon.[00:48:54] Zack: Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. So, you know, it's funny, they have, I guess just to sort of like switch gears a tiny bit, but you know, last moment when they said when Birdman and some said they're forever in business with Drake. It wasn't in Miami, but I met with them for some follow-up questions in New York. and they have, like within Universal's building in Midtown, they have a Cash Money conference route. Like there are actually these, I mean I don't think it's diamond play, but the door handles are giant dollar signs, like the Cash Money logo. And, and it looks like they're diamonds in the dollar sign and whatever it is. But, you open up the thing and you go in and there's like all these plaques on the wall and it's just a conference room that's always there. And it's sort of like their designated conference room when they, when they cut the tat. And I remember, yeah, we sat down in that conference room and I really tried to press them on the Drake thing. And I mean, if you dig up the Forbes story, we did a video too. And there's this great kind of tense moment where I'm like really kind of pushing them about it and they're like, we're forever in this with Drake. And like, that's it. And it's clear that's all you're gonna get out of that. But, you know, so, in terms of striking platinum again, yeah, I mean, I could almost envision a scenario where Drake like does the Super Bowl and he plays some, you know, catalog hit that never went platinum. And just purely by the exposure of people hearing it be like, oh man, listen that again, it just suddenly goes platinum again. You know, or for the first time. But yeah, short of that, I know I'm gonna agree with you. I think probably not again, but that it doesn't matter anyway. [00:50:32] Dan: Yeah. So we have a couple questions left here. This one, and I think it's maybe similar to the fourth you're bringing up, but if you were in Birdman and Slim's shoes today, is there anything that you would be doing differently?[00:50:44] Zack: You know what, I think I go back to that question of like, would you sell the whole thing? Especially if the prospects are kind of dimming a bit and, you know, it's like, I don't know though. I mean, you know, it's like if you're getting up there in age, like would you sell you, you know, you got this great house that you bought, you know, you got this great penthouse apartment in New York that you bought. For like, you know, a hundred thousand dollars in, you know, 1982. And, you could probably get, you know, I don't know, 10 million bucks for it. And then you could just like rent and do whatever you want and you know, for the rest of your life. But like, you don't really need the money. Like, you're fine as it is, like you sell it. Like what would you even do with the money that you got? You really love living in that apartment. Maybe you just stay. And I think that's kind of the point. Like, just remember being in the studio with Birdman and he doesn't need to be doing this. Like, he doesn't need to be running around with Jack in Miami trying to make him the, the king of r&b or whatever. But he truly loves it. Like you, you can tell that he's passionate about it and. After the interview was over, and I wish I had this on tape, but we're just like a dozen of us sitting there in the room. And, Birdman, he goes, Zack, why do people think I'm scary? And I remember he said, he was like, really pointy moment. He's like, I'm respectful. You know, I'm not a clown. I don't turn tables over. I don't scream and yell. I'm respectful. Why are people so afraid of me? And I thought for a minute and I said, you know, as like, look man, like, to be honest, I think the base tattoos really are kind of like off putting some people who are not used to that sort of thing. And, he was like, yeah, I've been thinking of getting them removed. You know, I think it'd be better for business. So, you know, it's like there's still this element of, you know, even though he's made it and he's got everything he wants, there's still this part of him that came from a different world. That, you know, he's kind of like still stuck between two worlds, between the world that he came up in and the world that he can afford to live in. And, I think, you know, where he feels at his best is in the studio. So why would you sell that whole thing? Why would you, you know, I mean, why would you kind of give that up? And I think Slim likes it too. And you know, they have this really funny relationship and, you know, Birdman's in the studio and Slim does live the business. And that's kind of the breakdown of it. And I just remember, like after this interview, you know, after leaving the studio, I went and we were all supposed to have dinner together and I went off with Slim and we waited for like a half an hour in the parking lot for Birdman. And he just never showed up. And then we went to dinner and he just never showed up. And it's cuz he wanted to stay in.He just stayed in the studio all freaking night. Cuz that's what he really loves. So, yeah, I guess it's a long way of saying, what would I do if I were them? I mean, you know, probably like the financial advisor advice would be. Sell this big thing and then you're totally set for the rest of your life. But you know, if it's throwing off enough, more than enough money, tens of millions of dollars every year for you to live on, what's the point? You know, why not just do that and do what makes you happy?[00:53:59] Dan: I think that's a piece that often gets for guys and understands what some of this stuff is, that some people really just love the craft. It makes me think too about someone like Martin Scorsese or Steven Spielberg and these directors that are now in their seventies or eighties, they're not doing these movies to try to make more money. Well, granted, yes, I think they're bought into the financial success. They want fair terms. But this is what they enjoy doing. They've been doing it since they were kids and they wanna just find outlets to be able to do this in the best way possible. And I think the same could be said about Birdman of wanting to be in the studio and just wanting to have that energy. And if you sell that, then what do you do? I think especially for someone like him that's stuck to the thing that he does well. And you know, like he isn't out here like Jay-Z trying to be mogul in the sense of having different things. I mean, there's a mogul aspect in terms of media ownership, but not in the sense of like, yes, I own this, I do this, I do that as well. Sure. Maybe there's some smaller things that are in the, you know, new Orleans or, or the Louisiana area, but not in that same way. So I do think that speaks a lot to that. [00:55:06] Zack: Yeah. And I think they have dabbled in other stuff for sure. And you know, real estate, and I think there was some period of time where they had like some oil rigs or something like that.They had a vodka called G T V. They were trying to really build up Y M C M B as like, as a clothing line type of thing, rather than just merch. But, you know, none of that really kind of like ever went viral in the way that any of their artists did. So, you know, and maybe because it was that they just didn't have the passion for it that they have for music. Like that example of Birdman. So, you know, Jay clearly has the passion for the business. He clearly has the passion for, you know, doing the champagne thing or, you know, doing the VC thing. And you can tell cuz he's out there doing it. He's doing it cuz he loves it, and he makes money. But, I think it's hard for something to do well if you aren't truly passionate. Because consumers can kind of see through that. And also, you're not gonna go the extra mile for something if you don't truly care about it either. Definitely. [00:56:08] Dan: Definitely. And mine is a little different. And this may be more so from a selfish perspective of what I would do, but that's part of the question, right? Yeah. As someone that is such a fan of the vibe and the culture that they were able to create, I want to be able to relive that in different ways. I wish that Birdman and the team could patch things up and there could be a true Cash Money reunion tour that goes across the country. I know there's been different things here or there, but the same way that Didat did the Big Bad Boy Arena tour in 2016. I wanna be able to see that. I'd love to be able to do that. And I also wanna see a music biopic and the same style and the same budget and energy of Straight Outta Compton. I would love to see that about the Cash Money story. And to be honest, I feel like, I know there's a lot of energy around these biopics, but like I may be biased because it's the genre I like since Street Outta Compton came out, I just haven't seen one that's, you know, as good as that. And sometimes it's a bit frustrating when I see movies like Bohemian Rhapsody or Elvis, which I think they're fine, but I don't think they're as good as Straight Outta Compton and they're getting all these awards and stuff. And it makes me think that okay, I don&#