Podcasts about do better work

On this very special episode of Courageous Help, we're joined by Paige McPheely and Casey Putschoegl live at Base's Admin Week Summit. Paige and Casey are long-time friends who co-founded two companies: 33Vincent and Base. Today, they lead the team at Base as CEO and President, working toward a clear mission to make the world's leaders and assistants more productive and successful through innovative technology. They share how they ultimately came to create two companies for assistants based on the undeniable leverage this role provides for companies and people, the most impactful things an assistant has ever done for them, and where they see the future of support roles going in the next handful of years.  Connect with Casey and Paige on LinkedIn.  Resources mentioned in the episode:  Base, the modern solution for Executive Assistants Armored Versus Daring Leadership, Part 1 Armored Versus Daring Leadership, Part 2 “Do Better Work” by Max Yoder

Revenue leaders: Are you thinking like an ecologist?Quick refresher: an ecologist studies how wildlife interacts with their environment.On today's episode, Conner Burt (Co-Founde r and President at Lessonly ) describes Revenue Operations' nirvana state as a "healthy wetland."Now, if you're thinking ew gross a swamp with bugs—you're missing the big picture and how valuable it is to the ecosystem. Plants are improving water quality, food is nourishing the animals, and more.In the same way, RevOps is under-appreciated. Leaders must adopt a strategic, long-term mindset to understand how decisions impact the entire revenue ecosystem.Listen in to unpack this with us.More information about Conner and today's topics:LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/connerburt/Company Website: https://seismic.com/lessonly/Do Better Work by Max Yoder  Meet us here every other week, and we promise to keep it spicy for you. Find Revenue Innovators onApple Podcasts,Spotify, our website, or anywhere you get podcasts.Email us with feedback and guest suggestions at revenue.innovators@outreach.io.

Revenue leaders: Are you thinking like an ecologist? Quick refresher: an ecologist studies how wildlife interacts with their environment. On today's episode, Conner Burt (Co-Founde r and President at Lessonly ) describes Revenue Operations' nirvana state as a "healthy wetland." Now, if you're thinking ew gross a swamp with bugs—you're missing the big picture and how valuable it is to the ecosystem. Plants are improving water quality, food is nourishing the animals, and more. In the same way, RevOps is under-appreciated. Leaders must adopt a strategic, long-term mindset to understand how decisions impact the entire revenue ecosystem. Listen in to unpack this with us. More information about Conner and today's topics: LinkedIn Profile: https://www.linkedin.com/in/connerburt/ Company Website: https://seismic.com/lessonly/ Do Better Work by Max Yoder   Meet us here every other week, and we promise to keep it spicy for you. Find Revenue Innovators onApple Podcasts,Spotify, our website, or anywhere you get podcasts. Email us with feedback and guest suggestions at revenue.innovators@outreach.io.

How do I bring out the best in an employee who has been mandated to a program of professional development — and they absolutely do not want to engage. This sounds like an “eat your vegetables” kind of moment. Am I right? When I first hear this question a knot in my stomach forms >> mandated training just goes against my grain. Yet, when I settle myself down a bit. I know of several situations where I am a firm believer in mandated training. Let me reflect on three of them . . .  Safety – You just can't opt out of this kind of information that could save your life or the life of another person. In this case I would be an advocate for mandated training. Legal - Some churches and nonprofits can get themselves into a mess because they didn't know what they were supposed to know. Mandating this kind of training may be the only way to emphasize its importance because it will never feel immediate until it's too late. Skills development – This third one is probably a little “on the fence” for me. What if you have someone on the team who doesn't have a particular skill that the job really needs. If their job is at risk and it's a critical skill you might need them to develop to do the job. Let's say this third situation is your dilemma. What can you do to reduce resistance? WHAT IS THE “INVITATION” BEHIND THE MANDATE? As a leader we are often the instigators of decisions so we see it deeper. We've had more time to let it “soak” in. You might need to give them the same “on ramp” and time that you have had to see the need and soak in the impact. That's the invitation behind the mandate. Max Yoder in Do Better Work says, “People don't change when they are told to. They change when they're inspired and motivated to.” WHAT IS THE SOURCE OF THEIR RESISTANCE? If you do decide to dig into the resistance, you might find a key that you can unlock to bring out their best – even if it's mandated training that they absolutely do not want to engage. Download a list of questions to brainstorm ways to get below the surface and gain insight into the resistance. UNDERSTAND THEIR LEARNING STYLE People do learn in different ways. I recently did a blog series on different ways we like to learn based on our Myers Briggs Personality Style. Some people are more hands on, others more academic, others learn better with others, still others might be interested in some kinds of content and disinterested in other kinds. Check out more in the Learning Styles Blog Series. If you know their learning style you could look for ways to supplement the mandated training or adjust the training in ways that might connect to how they like to learn.  SOMETIMES YOU CAN'T MANAGE RESISTANCE… Even if the conversation doesn't lead to less resistance, you've still planted a seed that may have an impact even if it wasn't readily received. The best you can do is keep the conversation going.  LINKS TO CHECK OUT: Send your question HERE – in writing or by recording  Annie's Blog: Learning Style Series Episode 19: Recovering from Mistakes Learn more about Annie

In July of 2019, Lessonly Co-Founder Max Yoder joined High Alpha Speaker Series to discuss his book, Do Better Work. In this episode we revisit his overview of the themes from his book, including how to share before you're ready, getting more agreements, and having difficult conversations. No matter your rank, role, or team, the advice in this episode will lead to better understanding, accountability, and progress. Since this recording Lessonly, one of our very first High Alpha Studio companies, was acquired by sales and marketing enablement leader Seismic.

Welcome back to the RecruitingDaily Podcast! Today we welcome Max Yoder, CEO of Lessonly and friend, to talk about doing better work and living a better life. If you want to see it, be it; we love that sentiment and are so happy to share this conversation and Max's novels with you today. We've been lucky enough to have Max on as a guest before and are always excited to speak with him, mostly so we have a chance to share one of the best LinkedIn bios ever: "Every day, I am grateful that I got cut from the basketball team two years in a row."Aside from being CEO to Lessonly, a training software that helps people, teams and customer service teams learn in practice, he is also a husband, father and author of Do Better Work and To See It, Be It.  Max hails out of Indianapolis, is a fan of the little things, and we just so happen to know he's also a talented musician that can be found on Spotify. Do Better Work explores eight ways anyone can be a better teammate and is an Amazon #1 bestseller in the business teams and workplace behavior categories. To See It, Be is a hand-picked collection of Max's intimate notes about what he has learned and is still learning in work and life. Its purpose is simple: these moments have helped Max lead in a balanced, authentic way, and he would like to share that inspiration with you. A few things we cover today: Where did the incentive for Max's books come from? What has been most impactful for others in his sharing? Is there anything in the books that no longer resonates with Max in current time?There's a lot more, of course! This is an enlightening and empowering conversation; we implore you to listen. Also, please check out Max's work and let us know what you think.

- Max Yoder That divine middle is emotional liberation, where I can be compassionate and show compassion to an individual. But I do not need to carry whatever it is that they are feeling, right, not my responsibility to. And the thing about the thing that I think this is so important for me in my life is I think this was my biggest blocker, my biggest blocker to grow like something that I may have gone through my whole life and never addressed if it were not for something like Lessonly.   INTRO   When companies and individuals think about skilling-up in empathy and compassion, there are common questions that arise.  How can I take on the feelings of others without being crushed by them?  What do good boundaries look like?  How am I ever going to keep my people accountable to their actual work if I start being all touchy-feely with the.    My guest today touches on all of these questions and more.  There are many reasons why you should take the time to listen to Max Yoder:  he is erudite, well-read (see all of the books and authors he noted in the show notes), and he really cares about people.    He is also the co-founder of the continually growing learning platform, Lessonly.  Just last week, Lessonly made headlines in the tech world when they were acquired by Seismic.  And the last few years has been a series of success stories for the company.    Max is much more than an executive and a thinker, he is also a crafter of Lego art.    - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Is there anything that you found yourself giving time to in the pandemic, whether that's like a new pursuit or a hobby that you have particularly enjoyed?   - Max Yoder Yeah. I've given myself a lot more time to make art, and I tend to make art with Legos. I really appreciate this man named Joseph Albers, who was a teacher at Black Mountain College, right. During World War two, post World War II. And he created this series of things called Homage to a Square. And he really like color theory. So he would put basically squares inside one another. And he did about two0 of these over a series of 20 years, I think from his 60s to his 80s, if I recall correctly, so hugely inspired by somebody doing 2001 thing from their 60 to their 80s.   - Max Yoder And these squares, like I said, they're color theory. So he was trying different colors, and he said when I put a blue in the middle and I surround it with a red, that blue takes on a different cue, then it visually looks different than if I surround it with a lighter blue. Like what we put around to color changes the way we perceived that color.   - Max Yoder So during COVID, I started doing all of these squares, and they were these really great free flow activity where I could get a 16 by 16 Lego square.   - Max Yoder And I would create my own version of Joseph Albers Homage to a Square, all these different colors, and I have them all around my attic now. And it was just one of those things that I could do without thinking I sift through the Legos, I'd find the right color. I'd build these squares. It was not taxing, but it was rewarding.   - Max Yoder And so I think in general, what I learned to do during COVID was play and not have a goal. And in one way of doing that with art and just really, truly understand what playing is, because I think I spent a lot of my adult life and I think a lot of my adolescent life achieving instead of playing, and I think you can do both at the same time.   - Max Yoder But I don't think I was doing both. I think mostly achieving I love that.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Well, especially with the relentless pace of work in general, but especially accelerated as a result of the pandemic to actually have spaces of purposeful rest, whether that's like actual physical rest of sleeping or encompassing it with the mental release of play is something that I hear again and again as I work with different individuals, even as being really life giving. Yeah. I love that   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes You also have welcomed, I think, a new little person into your home in the midst of the pandemic you find that that has having a child in the home has unleashed some different capacities in you as well?   - Max Yoder Oh, yeah. So my daughter Marnie, she's eleven months old yesterday and eleven months.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Happy eleven months, Marnie.   - Max Yoder Yeah, pretty special. Full name is Marina. When she was born, we didn't know she was gonna be a boy or a girl. She came out of my wife, and we had three names for girls, picked out three names for boys. Marina was the one that was clearly the winner. And then basically, as soon after that, we just started calling her money. So she came home and just changed our lives there's. Covid before Marnie and this COVID after Marnie and COVID after Marnie is excellent. You know, I think COVID before Marnie was really tough for a whole host of reasons, but when Marnie came, she brought this new life to our house, like literal new life.   - Max Yoder Right. And then just this vitality to just and I of seeing the world differently and being a dad and watching my wife be a mom. And now being a husband to a mother, like all these things are life changing. And I'm 33 years old this year, and I just sent myself shifting from this achievement mentality to more kind of focusing on now, what do I care about? Why do I care about it? And am I doing the things that I care about? And my family is something that I care about?   - Max Yoder Music is something that I care about reading or things that I care about. And the difference between that and achievement and Carl, you the psychiatrist, help me figure this all out is I'm not doing them to impress anybody or to get anybody's. Applause I'm doing them because I care about them. And if somebody doesn't care about them, that's okay by me. And somebody does care about them. That's okay by me. But I'm not doing it for anybody else. Right?   - Max Yoder And being with my daughter is just something that is really important to me because she just wants me to be there with her.   - Max Yoder She doesn't even need me to do anything. She just needs me to be watching her spending time with her. And it's just been really cool to over eleven months. Jess, who's a very calm woman, nurture Marni and love on Many. I think I call myself in a big way in front of Many. Many got her grandpa and her grandma, and then we have a woman named Gabs, who is a friend of ours and the caretaker of Mary three days a week. And all these people just are very calm personalities.   - Max Yoder And Marni has just been wrapped around with so much love and kind of calmness. And what I imagine is going to come from that is what has come from that, which she's very adventurous, like, she's not scared. She's vibrant, and I just feel really lucky because it's not that parents don't want to give that to their kids, right? I think it's just sometimes we just don't have the resources, don't have the time, we're overstressed, and we're in a fortunate position where that's not the case. And it is highly rewarding to see my daughter be that's exploring, creative, laughing kid.   - Max Yoder And I want that for everybody because it's a real gift. I.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Love that enjoyment of just her presence and watching her flourishing.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes And something that you said kind of, like, particularly caught my attention, that I'm not thinking primarily of what I'm doing for her. I'm just being with her. I'm paying attention and the power of presence, which is its own segue into some of what we want to talk about today, which is empathy and connection in the workplace, because although it's not like a paternal relationship with those that you work with, I think there's this deeply human need to be seen and acknowledge, and I'd like to kick it off.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I know you're a leader that values cultivating this in your workplace. What is a personal story for you about why empathy and human connection really matter specifically in the workplace?   - Max Yoder Yeah. I think empathy allows me to feel as somebody, so it allows me to kind of sit in their shoes and do my best approximation of what's stressing them or what's bringing them joy, like, empathizing with their situation. And I think that's incredibly important to a certain degree. I think the place where I get the most juice is being compassionate. And I think I've learned to recognize feeling sympathy for somebody, understanding that they are going through pain, but not carrying that pain as my owner running those same circuits myself.   - Max Yoder This is something that Robert Sapolsky to a gentleman from Stanford has helped me understand. If I sit there and run the circuits all day long that somebody else is running and I get stressed with them, I wear myself out, but I can be compassionate and sympathetic to an individual. Like, if they're hurting, I can acknowledge that they're hurting, but I don't need to run the same circuits.   - Max Yoder So I think it's really important to be empathetic because it gives me a chance to kind of sit in something and understand. Oh, yeah, that does not feel good. But I can't run that circuit too much because I'll wear myself out. But I can run the compassion circuit a lot longer where I can see if somebody's in pain, even if they're yelling at me or they're frustrated with something that, you know, life is tough there in a difficult situation that you might describe as suffering. I might describe a suffering.   - Max Yoder And to be a calm presence in the face of that is a gift in and of itself. I might not have to do anything more than that. Then just be calm in front of them, not diminish or dilute. What they're saying also enhance what they're saying. Just be there as a calm presence that listen. And who does that take me? Has that taken me a long time to learn?   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Can you give me an example? What has that looked like for you and your leadership over the last year and a half?   - Max Yoder Yeah. I think we can. I go back longer than that because I think the Lessonly journey is nine years long to date, July 12 today. And I noticed that as we hired more and more people, we hit 17 people, and then we hit 25 people and then hit 50 people, that there was always more feelings coming into the business. Right. A woman named Jill Bolte Taylor, a friend and somebody who I love says we are feeling creatures who think, not thinking, creatures who feel feeling, creatures who think.   - Max Yoder So we are a lot of feelings, right. We are very emotional. And for most of my life, I believe that was responsible for people's feelings. And I believed that I was responsible also for their judgments, which kind of two sides of the same coin. I just feeling responsible for two things that are not my responsibility. Right. Feelings and judgments of other folks. So I would try to carry those feelings as my own, and I would kind of assume those judgments as fact and they crushed me.   - Max Yoder So I'm going to focus on the feelings part today, as opposed to the judgments or for this moment, on the feelings part.   - Max Yoder There was a lot of feelings in the business, and every time we hired a new person, just more and more feelings, and we got to 50 people, and I couldn't take it anymore. I was probably a long pass being able to take it anymore. I was stressed, self medicating, trying to keep up with all the feelings. And it wasn't working because the frantic folks around me, if they were feeling frantic, I was becoming frantic myself, and that's just not what people need.   - Max Yoder So I was fortunate enough. One of my teammates, who her name was Casey Combo. At the time, she's since married, she gave me a book called Non Violent Communication, not because she knew I was struggling with this, but because she knew I was looking for different methods for clear communication that was not aggressive, that was not argumentative, but was clear and compassionate. And in this book, Marshall Rosenberg writes about emotional slavery, which was exactly what I was. I was an emotional slave. I believe other people's feelings my responsibility.   - Max Yoder And then he writes about emotional liberation. And he talks about these stages, the first stage, being emotional slavery of I assume your feelings as my own and my responsibility, and I carry them, and I get tired and you get tired. He says that a lot of times when people do that for so long, they might move into the next stage, which is basically disavowing other people's feelings. And right, about 50 people. That's really the only thing I knew how to do at that point. I was like, I can't carry all these feelings, so I'm just going to say no to all of them.   - Max Yoder We hired Megan Jarvis at that point or head of the yeah, wonderful. Right. And I was like, hey, Megan, I'm so glad you're here. I need you to take the ceilings, like, I just need to go high. But, like, that was so not fun for me, because being with people is why I like my job, you know? So hiding from the feelings, man, I wasn't going to like my job, so it was just not going to work. So depending on my energy levels, I'd either carry people's feelings or I would hide.   - Max Yoder And Marshall Rosenberg showed me that there's a third way. So those are two extremes right side of turning feelings all the way down to I don't care at all. So turning it down to 0% or turning it all the way up to a 100% care about everybody's feelings. And he makes it clear that there's this divine middle and that divine middle is emotional liberation, where I can be compassionate and show compassion to an individual. But I do not need to carry whatever it is that they are feeling, right, not my responsibility to.   - Max Yoder And the thing about the thing that I think this is so important for me in my life is I think this was my biggest blocker, my biggest blocker to grow like something that I may have gone through my whole life and never addressed if it were not for something like Lessonly. Lessonly is this thing that's bigger than me, and it needed me. It was either going to crush me if I didn't figure this out, or I need to figure this out to keep my job. I wasn't going to be able to do my job if I didn't figure this out.   - Max Yoder And so this bigger thing than me forced me to figure this out. And Marshall Rosenberg game is a blueprint of emotional liberation, and that's what I began to practice. And I don't know if I'm never going to be the same because of that.   - Max Yoder In a really, really healthy way. I don't feel responsible for other people's feelings anymore. I feel responsible for my feelings and kind of making sure that I take care of myself. I are responsible for my intent behind my behavior. I'm responsible for my behavior.   - Max Yoder I consider myself responsible for those things. Doesn't mean I consider you responsible for yours. I just telling you, I consider my response for those things. And so that's what I focus on.   - Max Yoder And the reason I bring that up is in the journey of lesson. Like, there's been nothing more important to me than this.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I'm struck in finding that third way that you needed to develop a skill set of perhaps encountering the emotion. And I don't know if discharging is the right word, but even, like, energetically being able to release your feelings of responsibility, what what did that look like?   - Max Yoder Thanks for asking that. I mean, very clumsy at first. Right. Like, understanding something intellectually does not mean that I can do it. Well, I have to practice it again and again and again, which is a whole other topic we should discuss of. Just like, intellectual understanding is not knowing. Knowing is doing. You cannot know something without having done it is otherwise it's intellectual understanding. So I had to practice a heck of a lot and remind myself that when somebody came to me and brought something, it was always coming through the lens of their own experiences.   - Max Yoder And it was never simply about the thing that had happened. They were also bringing to me whatever else was going on in our life, because we can't separate that. We can't separate, like if we're having an emotionally charged home life and something happens at work, and it is like the straw that breaks the camel's back. What I hear from that person is just the work thing, right? What I don't see is all the stuff underneath the water that is happening. That is not my business, but it's always there, right?   - Max Yoder And when I would make a decision network Edwin Friedman, who wrote this book called The Failure of Nerve, he really helped me with this. He helped me understand that I'm always in a relational triangle with each person. And this was a big breakthrough for me. This is like something that intellectually, really helped me break through in terms of my practice, which was when somebody comes to me, there's always a third thing in the room, and that is a prior issue that they might be bringing, or I might be bringing or another person that they might be bringing to the conversation where I might be bringing.   - Max Yoder So to make it clear, like, Liesel, you and I are engaging right now, and we need shortcuts to kind of understand how to behave with one another. So we might filter through other people that we know that remind us of one another. And so when I meet people like Liesel, which this is just a brain by a shortcut, these things you'll come to mind. And in your case, I get a lot of warmth from you. But let's say I reminded you of somebody who really rub you the wrong way in the past.   - Max Yoder You might engage with me through the lens of that person. It's not just about me and you directly. It's a third thing that everything goes through and that's happening all the time everywhere. We're not directly relating to one another, relating through our past experiences and the people that we've known in the past. That helped me a lot, because when somebody would come to me and be really fired up about something that I thought was disproportionate to what it just happened, it helped me understand why that might be.   - Max Yoder There might have been a past issue, that this was emotional wound that was being poked at. It was not my responsibility, right? But I can sit there and be attached into the person. And maybe they don't understand that here, bringing that to the table. But I can have a sense like, this is not just about me and this person and this thing that's happening, they're filtering through their life. Right? And so when I realized that through Edwin Freeman, I realized it almost gave me permission to not carry things, because people are always bringing more to me than was between me and them.   - Max Yoder And I'm always bringing more to people that is between me and them. So I don't want them to carry my stuff. And I don't want to carry theirs. Does that help, or does that make sense?   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Yeah. That understanding. Did you find yourself needing? Some people engage in breathing exercises or they find themselves even to physically move as you are growing in this practice, there were things that you were like reading that were helping contextualize it. Were there other things that you like, embodied practices that were really helping.   - Max Yoder Oh, yeah. Getting sleep sober, sleep hugely helpful. Like, I can show up and be calm in a conversation in a much richer way if I do not drink booze before bed. And I don't mean, like, I mean any amount of booze. And this is a rule that I break a lot for myself, which is like even a glass of wine at 05:00 p.m. Or 06:00 p.m.. It affects my sleep. So if I really want to be the best version of me, I say no, and I sleep better.   - Max Yoder And it's just a fact of the matter. I am much less agitated. I am much calmer. So doing my pre work of getting exercise, eating well, sleeping well. And all those things are intertwined, what I eat and how I exercise to fix my sleep. So that matters to me a lot of just kind of taking care of myself and controlling the variables I can control. And then in that moment, if somebody's losing, they're cool in front of me or I'm losing my cool in front of them.   - Max Yoder And my therapist, Terry Daniel, says it can help basically coach me. It can help to put your hand on your stomach, like, on your skin. And it can be a safer thing to do when we're not physically in the room together. Like, let's say I'm having a different conversation over the phone, like, happening a lot over COVID. And just that skin to skin connection with myself can be very helpful. Breathing. Breathing deeply when I'm with somebody can be very helpful. Breathing and showing them slow my breath down can even be coming to them.   - Max Yoder So, yeah, there's physical things that I can do in that moment. And I hope it's very clear that I'm not suggesting that I nail this every time. Right. These are just tools that I have to do this a little bit better every day.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Yeah. I think that's helpful. As you were beginning, you talked about this inflection point at 50 employees where you started giving more attention to the particular presence that you were bringing. What did you start to notice? Did you notice the difference in people's receptivity to you and the sorts of things they were saying back to you as you grew in this practice?   - Max Yoder Yeah. Here's one thing that comes to mind that I noticed is I noticed I didn't have to solve anybody's problems for them. And I used to think I had to, like, I used to think I had to come up with solutions. And more than anything, now, I can be with somebody ask them questions and ask them questions and do active listening. So, like, one of the things I learned through motivational interviewing is if somebody's telling me something instead of asking a question, saying something like, so maybe somebody comes to me and says they haven't responded to me three times.   - Max Yoder You're frustrated might be the way I summarize where I think that person is at based on what they just told me. And then they had to go, Well, not really frustrated, just a little bit irritated. Or they go, yeah, I'm totally frustrated, and they keep talking. And when I'm getting them to do with this verbally process, and I'm only doing that because when they verbally process this stuff, they come up with answers a lot better. Right. But if I'm talking the whole time, it's tough for them to find answers.   - Max Yoder So when I reflect what I'm hearing with a statement, it gives them a chance to keep talking so that they can kind of maybe all I have to do is just get it out. Right. Not keep it in, just say it to somebody. Some days that's all that happened, and two or three days go by and they call me and they say, I think I figured out what to do. Thanks for listening the other day, it just is it. And I'm somebody who wants to solve a problem.   - Max Yoder Right. But in fact, sometimes I'm doing somebody a major disservice by even if I got the answer right on the off chance I get the answer right. With the limited information I have sometimes saying, hey, maybe here's what you should do is a complete disservice to that individual, because me giving it to them might make them more likely to actually not pick it up and do it. But if I were to just a little calmer and let them give you that conclusion themselves, it's so much more powerful if they thought of it.   - Max Yoder Right. Like, you don't want to be told to do things. So sometimes even if it's the right call, we might do the opposite of what I've just been told because we got told to do it. But if somebody can figure it out themselves, that's the most powerful.   - Max Yoder That's the most powerful recipe, even if it's exactly the same thing I would have said. Right. And most of the time, of course, I don't have the answer. But I guess my point is sometimes even giving somebody the answer unless they're asking me for it.   - Max Yoder Right. Unless they're saying Max, I really want your feedback here, which is a whole different prompt. Right. But if they're not asking for it and give it a I can do a major disservice in that process.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Yeah. I think that's such a good word, because I think especially as people get, we oftentimes promote people on their capacity to solve problems. It's a really valuable skill set to organizational growth and leadership. In my work, I call it the predisposition to be in a Fix-It, Frank.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes And what I heard and what you said is also a comfortability with a slightly extended time horizon. I think as I verbally process something that I see in the leaders that I work with, is there this imperative of like, well, we need to get it figured out now. We need to get it figured out in the moment. And I've got insights and I've got a history, and so I'll give it to you, and then you'll be happy. And how that short circuiting of the process, it can be a move of not believing that there's enough time to let somebody come to their own conclusion or not believing that they have the capacity of do so.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes So I've just got to give it to you in this moment.   - Max Yoder Right.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes And the cost that can be associated with doing that, I think he spoke really eloquently to.   - Max Yoder Well, thank you for hearing me out, because I think that's taking me a long time. Like, what I saw is the people who I would go to therapy with were very reluctant to give answers. So they were modeling for me, and I'd ask them why, and they teach me. And I don't consider myself a therapist. Right. But these people I do consider they are therapists. They're professinally, trained and in some cases, done it for 40 years. That's a long time. And there's a lot of mistakes being made in that process to their admittance, seeing them and seeing how helpful it was for me, but also knowing that there were times when I would go to that person to say I'd really like some advice.   - Max Yoder And I've opened the door at that point to hear them. And many times the advice they give me, I don't take it up with open arms. It's when that advice feels pushed, then that's when it doesn't work, right. When it feels pushed or forced. But when it's invited, that's a whole different motion.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Right. So the acknowledgment of seeing a therapist of some of the things that they have helped you with. You recently did something for your company where you interviewed your therapist to talk about boundaries. I'd like to hear about why that felt important for you to do. And what were some of the key learnings that you felt like were really important for your people,   - Max Yoder Yeah. So while I was important and what do people take away from it? I can only tell you what to away from because they haven't seen the interview yet. At the time of this conversation, we have not shown it to them yet. But I'll tell you what I hope to take away from it. But I'll start with, hey, here's why this is important. Many of my teammates asked me about boundaries just completely unprompted. They would come to me and say, hey, I'm going on a vacation. I know that you encourage us to turn all of our stuff off, to delete our email and our delete our slack from our phones, so we're not going to compulsively check them.   - Max Yoder But I don't know if I'm comfortable doing that. And for whatever reason, they were not willing to accept themselves doing that they were concerned. And that's a boundaries challenge for me. I speak openly about having engaged with people that I love who have substance use challenges. And I speak openly about having to learn about boundaries in that process where I begin and they end in where they end, and I begin. It's a very important part of understanding how to be healthy in the midst of something that is really, really challenging, which is substance use disorder, which you might co alcoholism or any number of things.   - Max Yoder Right. So I speak openly about these things. People come to me, and it's clear to me that this is not something that we get a lot of attention. And I would generally share. See, if somebody wanted something from me, I would generally share a talk by Gabor Monte called "When the body says no" was good.   - Max Yoder He's a master, and he speaks about boundaries. Basically, caregivers tend to struggle taking care of themselves, and they'll just give care and give care and give care, and they will not care for themselves. They'll be asymmetrical in the way they give care. The way that they care for somebody else is one way. And the way that her from themselves is completely opposite. Basically, like, they don't deserve any care, but everybody else deserves all the care. And he basically talks about how this just Withers people away. So all of these things combined, I know boundaries are important in my life, and my teammates come to me and say they matter.   - Max Yoder Gabor Mate gives this talk. And when I share with people, they tell me like, oh, my gosh, my brain just blew open in such an interesting way because he's so profound. So I'm thinking, hey, this is a chance for me, too. And so I asked my therapist about how does he view boundaries? And he gave this just excellent off the cuff answer. And I was like, Can I just interview you sometime about this? And so we can share this with my teammates, because exactly what you just said.   - Max Yoder So he comes in and we talk about boundaries. And I thought it was important because I just it's just not talked about in our world. Right? We think Kind is doing things for other people, kind of at any expense to ourselves. Right. Like, well, they asked for it. So I got to give it because I don't want to be a jerk.   - Max Yoder It's like that. It's not. We have to counterbalance kindness with boundaries, with assertiveness. And I just see people who do not have those tools to be assertive, and it's very stressful for them, and I ultimately think it's slowly killing them. So I think this is important. So here's what I hope people take from it. When they hear a assertiveness, I think they maybe hear aggressiveness. And Terry is very clear that you can be assertive without infringing on anybody else's energy or anybody else's motion. Like, it's not about aggression, right?   - Max Yoder Those are two different things. Assertiveness is the ability to say yes or no based on you wanting to or not wanting to. And he says it ultimately comes from a place of self acceptance. If I enter a space and I accept myself, then I can assert my needs. And asserting my needs does not mean dominating your needs, right? It just means if I'm tired, somebody comes to me and says, hey, can we do this thing today? I might say if I'd like to do it tomorrow, I just don't have the energy today.   - Max Yoder I like to do it tomorrow. And if that person is not willing to accept it, I say I understand, but I still have the energy. Can we do it tomorrow? And he's like, if you don't accept yourself, you won't even ask. You may not even ask the question of can we do it tomorrow? Because you may be coming from a place to say, I'm not good enough in order to feel good enough, I need to answer this request. But he's, like an accepting person, believes they're good enough.   - Max Yoder They don't believe that they're going to be good enough by doing the request on the demanded time. Right. They're just good enough. And so he really clarified in a big way how self acceptance is key here. And what keeps us from exerting boundaries is a fear. And each person's fear might be different. But understanding what that fear is, it might be that you feel like you're not good enough for X, Y, or Z reason might be something different, but getting down to that fear and understanding it and and working through that is the way that we get to a place where we're comfortable enough to say no, thank you and stand by it and not be worried that that person, we're going to lose that person by doing so.   - Max Yoder So there.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Well, and as I think of some of the responses and groups and surveys and the work that I do, I think there's an underlying fear for many people that if I assert this boundary, people aren't going to like me as much. They're going to think I'm lazy. And while you, as a leader, cannot, in a top down way, control people's responses to things like establishing boundaries or expressing vulnerability, that there is an element of culture creation that goes into this. How do we, as a group, you know, not always perfectly respond, but have more of a context where we, like, make the space for that.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes We make the space for it's okay to say no. We make the space for vulnerability. What are some of the ways that you have co created with some of the other leaders at Lessonly, a culture that says it's okay to do that? What are things that you have done that have moved the needle?   - Max Yoder Yeah. So if the executive team at Lessonly is unable to assert ourselves, like, if we are not assertive in a situation, if we say yes to every new thing that comes our way, we are not modeling what we need the rest of our teammates to do. So it's incredibly important that a certain boundaries in my life that the executive team set boundaries and their lives, that when it's too much, we say it's too much. That is the fundamentally most important thing we can do to make it okay for anybody else to do it.   - Max Yoder The opposite approach that does not work is the same as your boss saying, hey, I don't expect you to work on the weekends, but I'm gonna because, you know, I got a lot to do, but I don't expect you to, and that just doesn't work. You know what? People here, I better be working on the weekends, right? If your behavior is not aligned to your words, people are going to look at your behavior, right? Not your words. They're going to trust your behavior, not your words.   - Max Yoder So what I want to do is align my words to my behavior, which is to say weekends are sacred, just like winter is the season that allows for spring. And winter is a season where it looks like there's not a lot happening, but there is a lot happening. Sleep at a time when it look like there's not a lot happening, but there is a lot happening. We need weekends or it looks like there's not a lot happening, but there is a lot happening, right? This resting and recharging is incredibly important.   - Max Yoder And if I don't treat my weekends like I want to people to treat them. And then why would I believe they're going to do that? Right. I can't do anything more than that is just make the space to say like, I mean it when I say this, and I mean it because this is my behavior, and I need my executive teammates to mean it, too. And I need the managers to also mean it, too. And in some ways, that goes well in other ways. It doesn't.   - Max Yoder Right. But it's ultimately out of my hands to some degree. Right. If people are going to pick that up, if we have a chronically, chronic challenge of the teammate, it's my responsibility to have a difficult conversation with them and let them know how important their modeling is, no doubt. But ultimately they're going to make the call if they want to change their behavior or not. And it's out of my hands if I'm doing it myself.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I'm struck right now that it's a tight labor market for many people.  Lessonly is growing. You're wanting to bring more people on. Do you feel like you have seen a through line towards creating this kind of culture where rests and seasons and vulnerability is upheld and valued and the way you're able to attract and retain talent?   - Max Yoder I think we understand part of the recipe, but we exist in a system, though, that is chronically overworked and systems win. Like individuals, we've created a system a lesson that I'm really proud of. But we're also in this broader work environment, in this cultural environment of overwork. And unfortunately, those systems, if we don't kind of remove ourselves from them and do a lot of extra work, they win. The bigger system wins. The culture wins. If they didn't win, we wouldn't probably have 25% to 50% of the population reporting depressive States.   - Max Yoder Right.   - Max Yoder The culture is winning. We've optimized for economic growth, we've optimized for consumerism, we've optimized for commercialism. We haven't optimized for well being. And look what we're getting, right. We're not getting a lot of well being because the system is not in support of of that. So it's discouraging. It just is. And so we can only do so much less only to turn the tide. But it's our job to at least try. And one of the things that I find complete myself to be completely powerless to change is that there is no winter in software.   - Max Yoder There's no winter in the business world. There is no period of three months like there is for a pro athlete or for a farmer, where we work really hard and we plant and then we harvest. I'm not a farmer, so I'm not going to use all the right words, but we create a crop or mini crops. And then we have this period with winter where we take our time to rebuild. And pro athletes have their own seasoned in their off seasons. And this is wise. This is wise.   - Max Yoder I have not figured out how to recreate that in the business world. And I don't know if I ever will. It just is the system at work, right? Our customers, even if we take that time off, if we were to say less, only going to B nine months out of twelve, we're going to lose deals because there's a lot of deals because people need us for those three months, they were going to be off, right? Because they're going to be on. So, you know, it's not an excuse.   - Max Yoder It's just me saying, like, I don't know how to do it, right.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes The pressures of the prevailing system of capitalism that prioritizes growth and efficiency above all else.   - Max Yoder You said it well.   MUSICAL TRANSITION   We'll return in just a moment for the final portion of my engaging interview with Max.  But I want to take a moment to thank our sponsor, Handle with Care Consulting.  In the midst of the unrelenting stressors the last year and a half, are you giving your people what they need to stay engaged?  Empathy is key to building the sort of culture of connection that Max is talking about at Lessonly.  And the good news is, it is a skill that can be learned!  If you want help in skill-ing your people up in empathy and creating a place where people want to come to work, Handle with Care Consulting can help.  With interactive keynotes, empathy at work certificate programs, and coaching options, we can help you show care when it matters most.   MUSICAL TRANSITON   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I would love to hear about times when building connection at your workplace have felt easy for you and why you think they felt easy. And then I'm going to have to underside. What are times when building connections felt really hard for you and why you think to start with when it felt easy?   - Max Yoder Yeah. When it's all easy to build connections, when I am accepting on myself to go back to Terry Daniels lesson. I mean, it has everything to do with my my internal system being an equilibrium, you know, which is a delicate thing, right? One night of sleep and throw it off. But when I am in this place of peace with myself, I'm able to bring peace to my connections and not view myself as needing to be anything other than what I am. But when I'm not at peace with myself, I can go to a state of judgment and criticism.   - Max Yoder And if I drop a ball or miss a mark and these are judgments that I would make of myself, you mess that up, you drop this ball, you miss that Mark. Those are all judgments in their evaluator language. It can be very harsh with myself and showing up to a situation. Putting intense pressure myself does not increase my connection to the person in front of me or the room in front of me. But when I show up and just say, like, you know, I accept myself, and acceptance does not equal agreement.   - Max Yoder Like, acceptance does not mean I've got it all figured out. Therefore, I'm good. Acceptance just means I'm willing to look at my own behavior and accept it. Whether it's behavior that I can objectively say is life giving or soul sucking, I have to be able to look at it to accept myself. And once I can look at it, I might be able to make changes. But if I can't look at something, it's tough to change it. Right. So acceptance is not about saying I like everything that's going on in my life, just about saying I'm willing to look at everthing that going in my life with in an even handed way.   - Max Yoder And when I accept myself, I can show up to a room with my new teammates or my old teammates or a mixture of the two and be peaceful in front of them and talk about mistakes without feeling ashamed and talk about things that I'm proud of without feeling ashamed and and share my humanity. And if I can do that, it maybe gives another person's permission to do the same. So I think it has everything to do with my personal system, being in a good spot here and then acknowledging that my personal system is often not in a good spot to folks so that they understand, like, hey, they're not dealing with somebody who's got this figured out, right?   - Max Yoder Like day in and day out. I might have a different equilibrium, or I might have a different disequilibrium, right? It's not about coming at this from a place like I've got this oneness every day. I certainly do not do. Not at all. Right. But when I'm at peace, I can connect better. And I find that to be a really fun time in that journey towards self acceptance.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Something consistent theme that I hear from leaders is just the particular burden of other people's expectations about what it looks like to lead or manage change in a given season; as you are seeking that equilibrium and self acceptance, what about when you smack up against somebody else's? Like, judgment? I needed you to be different. I wanted you. You're not doing it the way that I would like for you to. How do you encounter those voices, real or perceived and still work to maintain well in the balance?   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Because sometimes we do need to change. Sometimes it's like, oh, that was a blind spot. I need to change. And sometimes we need to be able to have the discernment to say, like, hey, that's your stuff, not mine. How do you navigate that process?   - Max Yoder You nailed it, right? How much does this person love me? Is my first question. How well does this person know me? If it's my wife, I know she deeply loves me. And when she brings me something where she says, hey, what I got and what I needed were far apart, I'm listening. I'm not sitting there saying, hey, your expectations of me don't matter, right? I'm listening. It might not be that I agree with everything she says, right? But I'm definitely not shutting it all out either, right?   - Max Yoder She is just like me going to come at this from an emotional triangle of past wounds, but doesn't mean that there's not real meat on the boat when she's frustrated. Right now, if somebody needs something from me and I don't know them very well, and I'm skeptical that they love me or know me really at all, it's not that challenging anymore for me to just kind of let that. There's a moment at first that I go back to my old self of getting defensive or being hurt.   - Max Yoder And it's more than a moment sometimes, right? It could be an hour. It could be 2 hours. It could be 3 hours. It could be a good night sleep that needs me through it. But then I'm like, yeah, that's okay. Life is too short. So it depends on my relationship to this individual. And Brene Brown has the idea of the Square Squad, where, you know, the coal world can't be my critic, and I can't have nobody has my critic either, right? I need the people who love me, care about me.   - Max Yoder And if the Square Squad is the one inch by one inch piece of paper where I can put the names of the people who I know love me, who will tell me the truth as they see the truth, right? They're version of the truth, and I know that they're not going to willingly hurt me for fun. And those are the folks who feedback. I am a lot more. I'm a lot more discerning with. Right? But if somebody's coming out with this condemnation or an unspoken expectation and they say you didn't meet my unspoken expectation, like, that is not my problem because it's an unbroken expectation.   - Max Yoder There was no agreement there. I've got a chapter and Do Better Work, which is a book I got to write a couple of years ago that uses Steve Chandler wisdom of expectations versus agreement. Like, if we did not agree to that thing, then we have to get that agreement now and then begin to hold another accountable going forward. But if we didn't have an agreement and you're mad about not spoken expectation, like, I need you to look in the mirror and say, like, hey, we get an agreement because I don't remember the agreement now, and I can't read your mind, and we don't need to go back and litigate the path that you're frustrated about when we didn't have this agreement.   - Max Yoder Just an unspoken expectation. But we can make an agreement now. And an agreement is not you dictating at me or me dictating you. It's us going back and forth and negotiating a course of action that we say, okay, this feels good collectively. You know, that is a relationship. When we do that, the other thing is just, you know, I can't live in a world where I just have to respond to everybody's unspoken expectations.   MUSICAL TRANSITION   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Something that I like and have appreciated. I think I've been getting your emails for, like, the last two years just because I enjoy reading them.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes But you compiled them into a book that you just referenced. Do Better Work. You have a new book coming out. Tell us about that.   - Max Yoder Yeah. So I took those notes and compiled it. So the first book do better work. I'd been writing notes, took some of those, turn them into chapters. This one is called To See It, be It. And I'll say that a little slower to see it. Be it. The idea is, if you want to see it, be it. And that's the best you can do. Right. I want to see more patience in this moment. Bring patience. If you want to see more creativity in the world, bring creativity.   - Max Yoder And then let go of all the other stuff of what you want other people to be doing, because I think it's just very, very common and very easy to get wrapped around the axle of what other people are not doing. And I honestly think some people will die spending most of their time complaining about what somebody else is or is not doing instead of going, do I do what I value? Right? Do I live by what I value? And, of course, the answer is going to be no, because nobody does that perfectly.   - Max Yoder And then the next question, if the answer is no, what it always is, how can I begin to spend more time doing what I value? And let go of worrying about what anybody else is doing?  And, of course, there's a relationships with husbands and wives and kids were that's incredibly difficult, right. And there might have to be boundary set where I feel like I'm living my values over here and there's somebody else in my space consistently that I just don't feel like I can do my best self around.   - Max Yoder That might require boundaries of separation. I just don't be together anymore. But what I'm getting at is, I think one of the greatest things we can do for ourselves to say what I want to see in the world, and how do I, at the time align to what I want to see in the world? And I think what happens when we do that is we either find that the things we want to see in the world has validity to them. We start to live them, and we start to see that they're very life giving.   - Max Yoder Like, let's just use an example of getting good sleep. I want to see people well rested in the world. Well, I can't control how you sleep. I can control how I sleep. So if I take care of my rest, I want to see it, and I'm being it, right. And I can let go of all the other things. But at least I'm doing the thing that I want to see more people doing, and I'm letting go of whether they're doing it or.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Yeah, not.   - Max Yoder And as I do that, I might say, hey, this feels pretty good. Like I had a hunch that sleep taking care of sleep was going to be helpful. And look how beautiful life is now that I've been able to take care of my sleep, which I understand is not an option for everybody. But I'm saying it's an option for me. So sometimes living my values strengthens those values. Other times, living things that I believe I value, like I intellectually value it, and then I start trying to live it.   - Max Yoder I found out, oh, I don't really value that as much as I thought I would putting into practice. I see that there is that there are problems and there are always problems with any value is taken to an extreme. Like loyalty. I value loyalty. Taken to the extreme, it becomes blind loyalty. If I turn it all the way up to 100% loyalty, I become blindly loyal. If I turn all the way down to 0% loyalty, I don't have any loyalty at all. Right. I need to have that loyalty dialed into something somewhere in the middle counterbalanced with once again assertiveness and boundaries.   - Max Yoder I'm loyal to somebody, but not at the expense of my own mental health and well being. It those two things counterbalance one another. So only by living that value do I learn those hard lessons, in my opinion. Right. I can't learn them intellectually. I have to live them and say, oh, wow, I do value this, but I value a different permutation of it than I thought. That makes sense.   - Max Yoder So that's what the book that's the first chapter of the book is, or the first note in the book. And then there's 24 notes after that of other things that I just think are important, and I share them because they help me and they help somebody else. Great. I just know for a fact that all 25 of them help me. And my hope is that maybe one day somebody picks them up and they want to read the book. Right. They're choosing to read the book. And one of the notes, as as it helps me in the past, helps them in a similar way or a different way altogether.   - Max Yoder That is healing as the whole point of the book.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Right. Well, and your writing is accessible. It's oftentimes encompassing story. It's nice digestible bits of wisdom that you could blaze through all at once, so you could flip through and take a little at a time. So I'm excited about this new offering.   - Max Yoder Thank you for being open to it. It's a great joy for me to write. I got to dedicate it to my daughter, and I dedicated to her because I just want I could get hit by a bus one day. Liesel. My dad owns a funeral home, and my dad's dad started a funeral home. My dad and his brother ran the funeral home for last 30 years, 20, 30 years. And people just get they just leave, right? They don't choose to go a lot of the time. It's not old age that takes us all.   - Max Yoder So I'm very highly aware that, like, is not my choice when I get to go and so writing for me is a chance to capture a bit of my spirit. And if I have to go for whatever reason, my daughter can pick up this book and do better work and and catch a little bit of her dad and deeply special to me to be able to capture a little bit of my spirit. And it really forced the genuineness out of it.   - Max Yoder Right. Because I don't want it.   - Max Yoder I don't want my I got to be genuine under that premise. Right. Like, I got to say what I believe, what I mean and what I stand by, because I don't want my daughter reading about somebody who didn't exist.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Right. Or reflecting in an individual that is not integrated with their best thoughts. Like, we're always seeking that integration, but you don't want a glaring gap between what you say and how you live, right.   - Max Yoder And I want her to see that I hurt. I make mistakes. Right. She's not going to get a picture of a perfect human being because I've never been one of those and they don't exist. She's going to get a picture of somebody who struggled, and that's what I want her to have, because that's the model I want to be. Hey, life is a lot of struggle, and there's a lot of beauty in that, you know, a lot of beauty in that. I've been very fortunate in that struggle, right.   - Max Yoder I always had a roof over my head. I always had food to eat. I don't pretend my struggles like anybody elses, but I can tell you struggle nonetheless. And I don't want her to think that life should just fall into place and be peachy. And that's what life is.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes So as we draw near the end of our time for listeners who say I want to build more connection in my workplace, I want to be part of that change.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I know it's a broad question, but what words of insight would you offer to them as they think about how to go about doing that?   - Max Yoder So I want people to ask themselves, what do I value? And how do I, 1% of the time seek to live that value and become symmetrical and congruent with what I value in my behavior? And then how do I learn in that process? Because that's the best I can do. And if I'm in a system like, let's say I'm in a work system where it does not align to my values, I have to ask myself, Am I willing to change into those systems value because the work system will change every person in it if they stay long enough, right?   - Max Yoder It could even change them quickly. But if I'm in a system that is not congruent with my values, I'm going to be nervous because it's possible that that system actually has values that are very life giving. It stay long enough, I'll find out. But if I find out they're not life giving, I stick around. There is a casualty there. There is a loss there. So my ask to people is if you want to see it, be it and then pay attention to what the system cares about.   - Max Yoder And if the system is so disproportionately, caring about things that are not what you care about is very important. If possible, you get out.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes That's a good word, Max. Are there any questions that you wish I would have asked you that I didn't ask you?   - Max Yoder Let's see. I mean, I've talked about values a lot, so real quickly, I think something that I love talking about is this idea of reciprocity. Liesel, yeah.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes Tell me more.   - Max Yoder Yeah. So reciprocity is idea of I give what I get. And so let's say I get kindness from somebody, so I give it back. But a lot of times reciprocity comes through in a relationship where people are not communicating very clearly, when maybe somebody is struggling and they take their aggression out at somebody else, reciprocity is oftentimes somebody yelled at me. So I yell at them. Somebody didn't respond to my message, so I don't respond to their message. So it becomes I give what I get. And reciprocal cultures, if we're having behaviors that are life giving really beautiful, right?   - Max Yoder Because somebody gives me patience. Ideally, I respond to them with patience, right? Somebody gives me support. Ideally, I respond to them with support. Reciprocity is not necessarily something that is good or bad. It just is. And it resides about giving what we get. So what's the alternative to that? Well, it's living by values, which is, I think, supremely important to understand. If somebody comes to me, maybe somebody doesn't respond to my message that I sent them. And then later, they need something for me. So now they're asking me for my time.   - Max Yoder If I'm reciprocal, I say, Well, they didn't respond to me when I needed them, so I'm not going to respond to them. But if I value driven, I say I value communication, right? I value support, and I would have value that person responding to me when I needed their help. So regardless of the fact that I didn't get it from them, I'm going to give it to them, not out of fight, not to show them the way. Right. Because I value it. It's really important that we get those two things.   - Max Yoder It's not out of fight, right? It's not to prove anything to this person. It's because I value it. So if you're not having difficult conversations with me, it's not an excuse for me because I'm not living in reciprocal life. I believe in difficult conversations. I believe in having them. I'm going to have them with you. And that's the best I can do. You may not respond in the way that I hope that's out of my hands, right. I just value difficult conversations. I value patients. I value forgiveness whether I get them or not.   - Max Yoder So I think reciprocating can be a race to the bottom. It can be this kind of slippery slope of just degrading cultures, degrading relationships, and values based living. If I do it because I value it, not because I get it in return is the answer, in my opinion.   - Liesel Mindrebo Mertes I love it. I agree.   MUSICAL TRANSITION   Here are three key takeaways from my conversation with Max and I have to confess, there were definitely more than three valuable takeaways, but I have narrowed it down to these three…   Where are you in the spectrum of people pleasing?  Max talked about emotional slavery (feeling responsible for the emotions of others), and emotional disavowal (rejecting the emotions of others), and the third path of emotional liberation:  being able to adknowledge the meotions of others without being ruled by them.  Where are you find yourself most often ending up? Remember, there is always a third person or situation in each interaction:a relational triangle. People bring their previous experiences, their wounding, their successes, and their home life to a given situation.  It is important to acknowledge this reality because it helps us to contextualize situations.  Max encouraged listeners to ask the question, “What are my values?” and then to take a good look at the organization that they are a part of.If you organization is acting, consistently, against your values, there is a cost.  And maybe it is time to leave.    MUSICAL TRANSITION   OUTRO   Max Yoder:  Do Better Work Robert Sapolsky:  Behave:  The Biology of Humans at Our Best and Worst Robert Zapolsky:  Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers Gabor Mate:  When the Body Says No Marshall Rosenberg:  Non-Violent Communication 

Today we have an incredibly special guest on board to discuss a crucial topic: Max Yoder on Managing Culture, Mental Health and Growth.Max is CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the powerfully simple training software that helps millions of people learn, practice and Do Better Work.  Outside of his work at Lessonly, Max is a father, husband, musician, and the author of "Do Better Work." Things we discuss today: How has COVID redefined company culture?  What does it mean to promote vulnerability in the workplace, and how does this shape organizational growth?  How can we teach communication skills and other behaviors that naturally promote mental health and help to resolve conflict?

Kyle Lacy, CMO (and Chief Mario Officer!) at Lessonly, joined me on the Modern Startup Marketing podcast. Kyle has been recognized as one of Indiana's Forty-under-40, is the author of 3 books, built the content marketing team from scratch at ExactTarget (acquired by Salesforce for $2.6B), led marketing at OpenView Venture Partners, and advises a couple of tech startups besides his full-time role. Lessonly was founded in 2012, has 200+ people, and is based out of Indianapolis, Indiana. They've raised Series C ($30.2M total). Lessonly is the powerfully simple way for teams to learn, practice, and Do Better Work. Enabling busy teams (like Sales, like Customer Service) to get on the same page, stay ahead of change, and deliver amazing experiences to customers and prospects. This is NOT your ordinary training software. Here's what we hit on: You updated your title on LinkedIn to Chief Mario Officer - why? What was that for?; Irrational ideas can sometimes work; How we tie marketing to revenue and why that's important; About Lessonly in your own words; What's unique about your marketing team; You've been at Lessonly for 4 years. What did you do in those early days that was critical for success? Kyle introduced an agile marketing framework with 2-week sprints - we dive into why and how this is done; Lessonly moved their outbound sales development (SDR & BDR teams) under marketing - why and how this makes you more successful; Marketing: what's working well for you right now, what channels (HINT: direct mail is part of it); Marketing: what are the challenges, what are you trying to figure out (HINT: hiring while remote is part of it, how to keep the culture); We talk about Ali Llama - who is this llama? Who came up with this? What's the story?; How do you differentiate from other (online training) players in the space; B2C can help inform B2B marketing; Write how you talk when creating content; Having the space to be creative vs. proving ROI on each creative campaign; How to lose money responsibly in order to differentiate; Favorite failures. You can find Kyle on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/kylelacy Find out more about Lessonly: www.lessonly.com Here's the e-commerce site to get your llama gear: https://olliellama.co/ Do Better Work was mentioned in the episode: dobetterwork.com For more content, subscribe to Modern Startup Marketing on Apple or Spotify (or wherever you like to listen). You can find Anna on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/annafurmanov on Youtube: www.youtube.com/channel/UCYgrBn-Y6P9o_OJ2lxHkWyg or visit this website: www.furmanovmarketing.com Thanks for listening! --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/anna-furmanov/message

How do we build a culture of better work? Jeff Echols and Katharine White MacPhail welcome Max Yoder, Co-Founder and CEO of Lessonly, and author of "Do Better Work." • What roles do communication, understanding, and accountability play in creating a culture of good work? • Why is perfectionism a threat? • How should we respond to volatility? Share your experience and advice, and ask your questions.

Max Yoder is CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the training software company that helps teams learn, practice, and do better work. He is also the author of Do Better Work, a book about being a better teammate.

Lessons on How to Create Space for Your Community to "Do Better Work" When software start-up Lessonly began they found space in an old school house in downtown Indianapolis. As they have grown, they've worked to maintain a connection to their values. In this episode we talk with Karlie Briggs and Kimberly Best to explore how Lessonly's mission to "Do Better Work" inspired them to not only create physical spaces that support their company culture but connect them to the local community and how they are now creating those same connections with and for their customers.

We’re all changing all the time. The events and cultures we’re immersed in have an impact on our development. This, in turn, impacts our organizations. Sometimes these changes reveal a new personal and professional mission that we never could have imagined. Max Yoder is the CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the training software company that helps people learn, practice, and do better work. He is grateful that he was cut from the basketball team two years in a row. He’s also the author of Do Better Work, a book about being a better teammate.  Max works to enable people to improve their time at work. That workplace success naturally affects people’s lives in all aspects. Max found that hearing people and empowering them to be their best selves at work leads to better fulfillment all around. He built his company on this premise. Emotions are key to high-performance. Traditionally, workplaces have rebelled against this idea. The workplace is now in a place of transition. Integrating emotional safety in work and allowing feelings in the company pays dividends. We discuss how to listen to each other in a healthy way to improve work culture for all. One thing we’ve come to understand is how important it is for leaders to take care of themselves. A company’s culture is such a reflection of its leader’s state of mind. That’s why failing to nurture one’s own well-being is disastrous. You can’t take care of others without first taking care of yourself. This is more true than ever during today’s crisis.  How can you make your company a safe place for emotional expression? Let’s talk about it in the comments on the episode page!   In this episode Escaping the myth of emotional slavery What happens when you allow emotions and feelings to play a role in your company The most important thing for a leader to do in a time of crisis Why charity and grace are the most important virtues to cultivate How to live according to the same expectations that you have for others Recognizing where we’re fragile and how to get stronger from adversity through support   Quotes “When people do better work, they live better lives.” [2:19] “If I use the tools in my wellbeing toolbox, I’m doing everybody a service. If I don’t, I am not doing everybody a service. What can I control? Am I controlling it? That has always been important. It is incredibly important now.” [10:20] “I think this is where all of our problems come from; we have special logic for our own behavior and we have different logic for other people’s behavior.” [20:29]   Links Lessonly Do Better Work by Max Yoder Antifragile by Nassim Nicholas Taleb   Find 15Five online Follow 15Five on Facebook | Twitter | Linkedin Best-Self Review & Competency Assessment Remote Work Resources Join the Best-Self Academy for free 

Do Better Work is more than a book title. It’s Max Yoder’s mission in leading Lessonly, a growing training software company based in Indianapolis. Outside of work, Max is an accomplished author, musician, and soon-to-be first-time dad.  Max is fascinated by human psychology and understanding relationships. He brings a unique approach to leadership, discussing nonviolent communication, compassion, and mirroring within the workplace. While taking home these practices of self-reflection and observation.  Hear how his focus on self-improvement is connected to the many passions he pursues alongside growing a thriving business.  Connect with Max: https://www.linkedin.com/in/maxyoder/ Get the book, “Do Better Work”: http://dobetterwork.com  Connect with Nick: https://www.linkedin.com/in/smarrelli/ Learn more about GadellNet Consulting Services: https://gadellnet.com/

The Episode in 60 Seconds Kyle Lacy, CMO of Lessonly, joins us via Zoom from Indianapolis, Ind. to talk marketing/sales alignment, customer experience, leadership during COVID-19, and golden llamas. Kyle brings over 12 years of experience in marketing strategy and digital operations and is obsessed with how technology influences and changes human behavior. Additionally, Kyle has written three books: Twitter Marketing for Dummies, Branding Yourself, and Social CRM for Dummies. This interview delves into: The importance of storytelling in marketing and branding A unified approach to sales and marketing Differentiating your company in some way outside of your product’s features The power of customer experience Lessonly’s approach to COVID-19 challenges The mentality of a successful CMO Our Guest Kyle Lacy leads marketing for Lessonly, a training and enablement software company based in Indianapolis, Ind. Kyle's team touches everything you can imagine when it comes to marketing, including demand generation, content marketing, branding, design, messaging, go-to-market development, and thought leadership. He drives growth at Lessonly using the knowledge he has gained while working at a venture capital firm, the largest software company in the world, and the fastest-growing email marketing company. Kyle has authored three books that have been published in five languages and seven countries. The books include Twitter Marketing for Dummies, Branding Yourself, and Social CRM for Dummies. Kyle has spent the last seven years traveling the world speaking at marketing and technology industry events and has been recognized as as one of Indiana’s Forty-under-40 by the Indianapolis Business Journal, Anderson University's Young Alumni of the Year, and TechPoint's Young Professional of the Year.  Show Notes Check out Lessonly CEO Max Yoder’s book Do Better Work. Lessonly sends this book to prospects throughout the entire sales cycle. Your best stories come from your customers. They are your best salespeople. Companies either approach the sales funnel with the power of customer experience or a feature push. Where do you stand? A Unified Approach to Sales and Marketing The traditional sales funnel has radically transformed over the last five years. We’ve seen this self-service sales framework begin to develop in marketing where people are doing a lot of research independent from any sales conversations. Kyle Lacy’s marketing team transitioned from being only top of funnel to being full funnel, touching 100% of everything happening at the company. “The team felt renewed. They were more positive. They felt challenged in a good way. And then because of that, because they had the feeling that they were accomplishing something, we started to see success.” - Kyle Lacy As its sales and marketing teams grew, Lessonly then focused on organization and process development to adjust alignment. The True Value of Brand Experience in B2B Tech If you don’t differentiate in some other way outside of features, you’ll just be another demo. Try telling a story that’s a little bit different, a bit more human. A few things Lessonly has done to humanize the sales cycle: Sent prospects Donors Choose gift cards to give to a classroom in need in their city, so kids can do better work, too  Developed a 13-page coloring book to help working parents entertain their kids during quarantine Sent employees, prospects, and customers golden llamas (spray painted by Kyle, himself!) modeled after Lessonly’s mascot, Ollie Llama. Lessonly receives most of its customer feedback from a weekly personal and leadership development newsletter sent by Lessonly CEO Max Yoder. Kyle on sending prospects Golden Llamas… “We don’t talk about Lessonly at all as a product, but it’s a first touch for us. It works extremely well because it’s different, and it has nothing to do with our product.” - Kyle Lacy #SprayPaintingLlamas   Here’s an unboxing of Lessonly’s Golden Llama by Sendoso. Lessonly has also launched a word search, a board game called Llama Land for their software users, and a Lego Llama. (And if you haven't seen Ludacris freestyle the children's book, Llama Llama Red Pajama, check it out.) Kyle Lacy's Mentality as A Successful CMO What’s the essential mentality for a Chief Marketing Officer to be successful? Timeframes. “Marketing directors think in quarters. Chief Marketing Officers should think in years when it comes to strategy development.” - Kyle Lacy Make your customer the hero. To achieve that, avoid a constant focus on feature development and growth. Instead of focusing on the top of the funnel, CMOs and marketing leaders should focus on two things: 1. Owning a revenue number (and a seat at board meetings) 2. Influencing 100% of company decisions that are related to money Lessonly's Approach to Leadership During the COVID-19 Crisis When attempting to make decisions on an unknown, you must over-communicate with your team and over-index on empathy. What Kyle’s team has been doing to maintain company culture during quarantine: Daily stand-ups Spontaneous happy hours 24-hour zoom room Online games Individual check-ins Great Articles on Sales-Marketing Alignment The Missing Piece of Sales-Marketing Alignment 8 Strategies for Internal Communications Alignment How to Master Sales and Marketing Alignment How to Align Sales and Marketing with Revenue Goals

Leaders bring great impact to the workplace when its employees or staff generate positivity with what they bring to work every day. Today, Jesse Cole interviews Max Yoder, the Founder and CEO of Lessonly and the author of Do Better Work. His book highlight what's working, handling difficult conversation and agreements, and how we can bring brightness to the room. Max talks about leading his company and creating moments that matter for his employees. Join Jesse and Max as they share insights on setting ideal company standards and creating self-awareness.   Love the show? Subscribe, rate, review, and share! Here’s How » Join the Business Done Differently community today: findyouryellowtux.com Business Done Differently Facebook Business Done Differently Twitter Business Done Differently YouTube Do You Stand Out? Take The Yellow Tux Quiz

As CoSchedule’s head of marketing, Nathan Ellering wears a lot of hats. In this Agile Marketing minisode, we speak to Nathan about the role he plays as product owner for CoSchedule’s agile marketing leaders. We discuss how to define Agile and adopt it for your marketing team, as well as other key takeaways from CoSchedule’s book on the subject: 
  “How to Get Started with Agile Marketing and Do Better Work,” available on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Started-Agile-Marketing-Better-Work/dp/169544213X; Produced by Share Your Genius: https://www.shareyourgenius.com/

Nobody enjoys tedious, manual busywork. Precious work time is wasted, instead of spent on completing projects. Makeshift marketing isn’t fun. It’s unproductive and creates inefficiencies due to a disconnected marketing stack. Today’s guest is Jared Rhue, head of business-to-business (B2B) marketing at rewardStyle. Jared describes his strategy of combining a core plan with agile methodologies to improve team collaboration and communication. Some of the highlights of the show include: rewardStyle: Influencer marketing pioneer started from passion for fashion rewardStyle’s revenue model drives more than $1.2 billion annually in retail sales Global Community: More than 250 team members; 50,000 top-tier influencers, and 5,000 retail partners Strategy, Plan, and Review: Jared’s average day at rewardStyle Strategy Steps to Success: Document marketing plan, strategy, and methods Marketers must be agile for ability to ask and listen to audience challenges Short Message Service (SMS): Relevant channel for B2B marketing in the future rewardStyle’s core plan consists of positioning, value proposition, and priorities  Secret to Team Success: Eliminate fire drills/urgent projects created by makeshift marketing chaos Questions to prioritize projects:  Does it support quarterly/yearly Specific, Measurable, Achievable, Relevant, and Time-bound (SMART) goals? Does it drive annual revenue? Are there dedicated deadlines? What’s the scope of work, and which team members will it impact?  Which projects will need to be deprioritized? Stay on Track with Tasks: Implement marketing organizational management platform and agile methodology   Links:  rewardStyle Gartner CoSchedule Academy How to Get Started With Agile Marketing and Do Better Work  

Most of us look at our phones too much and too often. We’re distracted by the sounds and vibrations of notifications. We like to be distracted because it makes us feel important and wanted, but such interruptions can damage personal and professional relationships.  Today’s guest is Nir Eyal, author of Indistractable. He offers several frameworks to understand and control internal urges to avoid being distracted. It’s easy to blame your phone for distractions, but it’s time to gain traction. What and who is more important and to blame? Your phone or your family? Some of the highlights of the show include:  Deep Dive into Human Psychology: Hooked on building habit-forming products If you could have any superpower, which would you want to use for good? Proximal vs. Root Cause: Distractions and reasons to procrastinate  Motivated Reasoning: Place blame and pin responsibility on proximates   Definition of Distraction: Opposite of distraction is not focus, but traction Definition of Traction: Any action that pulls you toward what you want to do External and internal triggers motivate us toward traction or distraction How to channel discomfort into traction, not distraction:   Step 1: Master internal triggers (re-imagine trigger, task, temperament) Step 2: Make time for traction Step 3: Hack back at external triggers Step 4: Prevent distraction with pacts Links: Nir and Far Indistractable Hooked How To Use The Psychology Of Habit Formation To Be A Better Marketer With Best-Selling Author Nir Eyal [AMP 085] Kahoot! Paga Fitbod Slack Carol Dweck How to Get Started With Agile Marketing and Do Better Work

We all have unspoken expectations of our co-workers, significant others, family, and friends. Unfortunately, none of us are mind readers so these expectations often lead to disappointment when people fail to behave exactly as we expect them to. Max Yoder joins us on People at Work to explain how getting agreements, even 1% at a time, contributes to a culture of accountability and responsibility. And, ultimately, a more loving and supportive culture. Re-upload correction: A previous version of this episode had an audio break of several minutes. Our apologies! About our guest: Max Yoder is the CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the powerfully simple training software that helps millions of people learn, practice, and Do Better Work. He lives in Indianapolis with his wife, Jess. For more on Lessonly visit lessonly.com. Connect with Max on LinkedIn at linkedin.com/in/maxyoder/ or on Twitter @maxyoder. Check out his book, Do Better Work, at dobetterwork.com.

In this episode Max shares the secrets of successful learning and giving feedback and you will understand so much more about Lessonly as a business and how he managed to get to grow to over 2 million users! In this interview we learn more about successful learning and giving feedback Max Yoder CEO and co-founder of Lessonly – “The powerfully simple training software that helps teams learn, practice and Do Better Work.” And don't forget to buy Max's new book. Do Better Work :- here :-  Checkout our Previous Interview :- Compassionate Communication Delivers 2 Million Users with Max Yoder – Episode 24 WARNING — AI Transcriptions Below May Cause Grammatically Correct People Serious Stress and Lack of Sleep! Nathaniel Schooler 0:10 Today, I'm interviewing Max Yoder. And he is the CEO and co founder of Lessonly, the powerfully simple training software that helps teams learn, practice and do better work. And he's actually grown that to 2 million users. So he shares some great insights here! Well it's great to speak with you again, Max! Max Yoder 0:47 Nat good to be back. Thank you for having me. Nathaniel Schooler 0:50 My pleasure. My pleasure. You shared so much value last time, that I just thought it'd be rude not to really to be honest. Max Yoder 0:56 But was, it was nice to hang out. We need to hang out twice. And we can hang out three times. So we're on a good trend now. Nathaniel Schooler 1:01 Exactly. I'd like to hang out more it would be cool, man. It would be very cool. Max Yoder 1:05 We are doing a pretty good job, aren't we? Nathaniel Schooler 1:06 Yeah. So today, we're going to talk about learning and development initially. And I know because you run you run Lessonly, you know hell of a lot about this! A lot more than I do. So I'm going to let you kind of take the floor, really? And tell me tell me what you know, Max? Max Yoder 1:25 Yeah, so over seven years of building Lessonly, we've learned a lot about training because we make training software. So we help people ensure that their training programs are rich and successful and driving return on investment. Over time, we learned that everybody had the same question. And that question was, what am I missing? So people were running training programs, but they didn't know if they were hitting all the beats. So what we did was we took it upon ourselves to make sure that we spelled out what all the beats were. When I say beats what I really mean are like the steps in a successful trading program. If you're doing these steps, you're probably doing it well. And then then filling in kind of details with each one of those steps. We call it the better work training method, because lesson is all about helping people do better work. So this is our training method for better work. And it's a six step method, it starts out with assessing your team and what it needs. So a lot of times in the assessment process, when you kind of figuring out what do we need to train on, you talk to managers a lot. And then you roll out a training program, we highly encourage you to both speak to managers, and also contributors, because contributors know what they need. So sitting down with contributors, doing some quick interviews and saying things like:- "What are you missing? What keeps you up at night? What question do you not want to be asked? Then if we could enable you on that answer, you feel a lot more comfortable, get that feedback, find the place where there's some overlap, you might find out that cross selling rates and your business needs to go up. So we're able to sell a product we were not able to cross sell. And you might find out that that's something that is affecting both employees and the management team. The management team doesn't hit that number, nobody gets nobody feels successful. If the individual contributor hit that number, they don't feel successful, they also don't make as much money.

Episode 40: Max Yoder, CEO, Lessonly  Max Yoder (@maxyoder), is the CEO and Co-Founder of Lessonly, a team training software company. He’s also the author of Do Better Work, a foundational book for leaders that focuses on the whole human approach.  Do you ever find yourself getting buried in the ‘How can I make things better?’ mentality? What if instead, you started focusing on what’s going well and doing more of that? In this episode, you’ll hear Max’s thoughts on why it’s important to bring less fear, shame, and guilt into the workplace - and start bringing in more compassion. Listen in as Max shares how you can break down your walls and show your vulnerability, starting with the people you love and trust first.

For many B2B companies, the product journey and brand still feel separate. But in e-commerce, they’re inherently tied together.   For Angie Stocklin, co-founder of online eyeglass retailer One Click Ventures, this presents an assortment of opportunities and challenges. For example, when operating three different eyewear brands under the One Click umbrella, how do you create a unified, but distinct, customer experience for each brand? It all starts with implementing a strategy to understand your customers.   As Angie and her team began to implement new methods for learning customer behavior and developing a customer journey roadmap that aligned with each respective brand’s audience, things began to come into focus.   How did they do it? Listen in to hear the story of how an intrigue in e-commerce led to a successful new venture that put a different spin on product strategy. Connect with Angie Learn more about One Click Ventures Connect with Christian Connect with Anna Learn more about Innovatemap Past Episodes Mentioned:  How a Product-Led Company Utilizes Storytelling Instead of Feature Pushing with Kyle Lacy Resources mentioned: Do Better Work

Most people want to do great work, but they simply don’t know how. The result? Uninspired effort, unremarkable output, and unhealthy communication. We owe our teammates—and ourselves—something better. In his new book, Do Better Work, Lessonly CEO and co-founder Max Yoder shares 8 practical but profound ideas for transforming team culture and performance. No matter your rank or role, if you want to see more understanding, accountability, and progress on your team, Max’s stories and examples are for you. Because when we do better work—we live better lives. In this episode, you'll learn: Why clarity and camaraderie are so essential to team performance How vulnerability transforms teams and workplaces How to communicate more clearly with your team How to foster better work in a hostile workplace BIO: Max Yoder is the CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the powerfully simple training software that helps millions of people learn and practice. He is the author of Do Better Work, a book about finding clarity, camaraderie, and progress in work and life. Max lives in Indianapolis with his wife, Jess. Learn about or buy Do Better Work at https://dobetter.work/ Learn more about Lessonly's training software at lessonly.com/learn-more  

"But my boss." It's the most common objection to doing better work. Today, we find a framework that can help us do the seemingly unthinkable: have an open, honest conversation, rather than avoiding conflict, in order to create consistently great things as an individual and a team. (Featuring Max Yoder, author of Do Better Work, and cofounder/CEO of Lessonly.) Max's book: https://www.amazon.com/Do-Better-Work-camaraderie-progress/dp/1732843902/ref=sr_1_1?crid=21EMGCAYEQTIZ&keywords=do+better+work&qid=1558569526&s=books&sprefix=do+bettetr%2Cstripbooks%2C123&sr=1-1 Jay's book: https://www.amazon.com/Break-Wheel-Question-Practices-Intuition/dp/1544501056/ -- Interested in the craft of creating original series? (Podcasts, video shows, documentaries and more). Explore my new educational venture, Marketing Showrunners, advancing the craft of marketers making shows to build passionate audiences. Subscribers from teams like Red Bull, Zendesk, Salesforce, Adobe, Shopify, and more: www.marketingshowrunners.com You can also explore my keynote speaking for your next event or company meeting: http://jayacunzo.com

Segment 1 with Ilyce Glink: Despite this being the best economy in generations, almost 80% of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck. Why is this? We discuss what's causing these financial stresses and why the financial stress of our employees are actually hurting our businesses. Find out what we can we do as small business owners to dial down this stress on our team and our business. Ilyce Glink is an award-winning financial journalist, television and radio personality, syndicated columnist, and the founder of four Chicago-based companies. Her latest company is Best Money Moves, a cloud-based, mobile-first financial wellness platform that employers give to their employees use to measure and dial down financial stress, lowering turnover and absenteeism while fostering engagement, productivity, and better health outcomes. Segment 2 with Max Yoder. Growing a business is all about leveraging your team. A challenge small business owners have, especially over a long period of time, is how to keep your company energized and your people motivated to achieve more. We show you the keys to teams doing better work. Max Yoder is the CEO and co-founder of Lessonly, the online training software that helps teams learn, practice, and as his new book is called, “Do Better Work”. Segment 3 with Rick Snyder: I have asked many small business owners over the last 25 years how they make decisions. I get everything from doing extensive analysis to they just went with their gut or their intuition. Which is the right decision making method for you? My guest argues that we don't use our intuition enough. He shows us the 6-step process for leaders, executives, and entrepreneurs to harness their intuitive intelligence in decision making. Rick Snyder is the CEO of Invisible Edge™. He is the author of “Decisive Intuition: Use Your Gut Instincts to Make Smart Business Decisions”. Sponsored by LinkedIn, Nextiva, Corporate Direct, MAKO and Web.com

On Epsidoe 34 of the Skill Up Build Up Podcast, we feature Lessonly’s Co-founder and CEO, Max Yoder. Max shares three themes that drive Lessonly forward and what creates the foundation for their culture: vulnerability, clarity, and camaraderie. His new book, ‘Do Better Work’, empowers and helps people become more self-aware and shares his insights as to why the world needs to have a laser focus on personal development. It has people asking themselves: How am I becoming a better human? Subscribe and listen to the Skill Up Build Up Podcast today!

Max Yoder is the founder and CEO of Lessonly, a team learning and training software company that raised a $8M Series B in late 2017. Max’s team is dedicated to helping people “Do Better Work,” which is where he got the title of his new book, Do Better Work: Finding Clarity, Camaraderie, and Progress in Work and Life. In this episode, we talk about vulnerability, sharing work before you’re ready, and why leaders don’t always know the answer (and that’s a good thing).For notes and a full transcription of the episode, visit woventeams.com/17. Max’s book is available here.You can subscribe to Max’s weekly note here.Special Guest: Max Yoder.

Share before you’re ready. Leaders learn the answer. In this episode of Powderkeg: Igniting Startups, you’ll meet Max Yoder making his third appearance on the podcast. As the CEO of Lessonly, a rapidly scaling tech company in Indianapolis, Max views his job as helping people flourish, thrive and understand themselves. In this conversation Max shares his learnings as a founder and breaks down some of the core principles of his newest book, “Do Better Work.” The mantras and habits that he shares are applicable to everyone, whether you’re leading a team, working on a team, or spending any time with people. In this episode with Max Yoder, you’ll learn: --- Methods to create clarity, camaraderie and progress in life and work --- Why it’s important to share your work before you’re ready --- How changing a personal habit is similar to the steps in a marketing funnel --- Ways to model the behaviors you’d like to see on your team --- The importance of processing emotions and how to prevent emotion from spilling over --- Compassionate, thoughtful behaviors that inspire better work If you like this episode, please subscribe and leave us a review on iTunes. You can also follow us on Soundcloud or Stitcher. We have an incredible lineup of interviews we’ll be releasing every Tuesday here on the Powderkeg Podcast.

This week on Let’s Fix Work, I'm talking to Max Yoder, Co-Founder and CEO of Lessonly. Lessonly is an online service that provides bite-sized learning with big impact to today’s trainers, managers, and subject-matter experts to help them create training content in minutes. Max is also the author of Do Better Work: Finding clarity, camaraderie, and progress in work and life. In today's episode, Max and I flex our Midwestern accents and talk about training in the workplace. We also talk about vulnerability, leadership, and nonviolent communication. Not bad for a kid from Goshen, Indiana, right? So if you like tech entrepreneurs who don't pat themselves on the back for simply being CEOs, you're going to love Max! In this episode, you’ll hear: How Lessonly got started and how it addressed the need for training software in the workplace Max’s impression of Human Resources in the workplace today About Max’s book, Do Better Work, and what drove him to write it What is actually means to “do better work” Vulnerability: why Max doesn’t use the word and what he thinks it has to do with work. Plus, what to tell someone who has no space to be vulnerable in their job How Max got to a point in life where he actually gave a shit about work The Lessonly conference, some speakers that will be attending and what attendees can look forward to in 2019 Max shares his thoughts on broken workplaces and what he thinks the first step is in fixing them Resources from this episode: Thank our sponsor: Ultimatesoftware.com/LFW Book: Do Better Work: Finding clarity, camaraderie, and progress in work and life https://amzn.to/2USQlg7 Megan Jarvis, PHR: https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-jarvis-phr-41961327/ https://www.indystar.com/story/money/2015/05/22/lessonlys-max-yoder-next- tech-star/27743731/ Lesson.ly: https://www.lessonly.com/yellowship/ *** We're proud to be sponsored by Ultimate Software. They're a leading cloud provider of people management solutions with a commitment to continuing education for HR, talent, and payroll professionals. Ultimate Software is hosting dozens of free educational HR workshops around the country. Check out ultimatesoftware.com/LFW for more information on how to earn free HRCI, SHRM, and APA recertification credits.

A well-defined company culture serves several purposes. First, it lays out the values that drive the company’s success. Second, it helps employees understand how to create that success. Third, it tells the world what makes the company unique. That last point is the focus of this episode of the Igniting Startup podcast. We explore how to promote company culture as a unique part of your overall marketing strategy. We’ve brought on two experts to help us dive into the subject today. Max Yoder, CEO, and Kyle Lacy, vice president of marketing, are two of the bright minds behind Lessonly, an Indianapolis startup that creates web-based learning software for organizations of all sizes. By hard-wiring company values like “do better work” and “share before you’re ready” into their product and marketing, Lessonly sells its customers a philosophy as well as a training solution. Max and Kyle have successfully transformed Lessonly’s culture into a movement that has culminated in Max’s new book, Do Better Work, releasing next month. Max, Kyle, and I talk in-depth on how to promote company culture and the marketing strategies that have gotten Lessonly to where it is today. We discuss how to build an extraordinary culture in the first place, and how to intentionally and intelligently market that culture to customers. You’ll also get a taste of what to expect in Max’s upcoming book and a preview of the talk that Kyle will deliver as one of the presenters at our MarTech Madness Pitch Night on February 28. In this episode on how to promote company culture with Lessonly executives Max Yoder and Kyle Lacy, you’ll learn: --- The importance of building your marketing around your company’s why. --- How marketing your culture can differentiate your company from competitors. --- Why your product should provide more than just ROI for customers. --- When writing a book might be a good marketing strategy for your company. --- How to build a culture that encourages trust, honesty and creativity. --- The story behind Lessonly’s Ollie Llama mascot and Golden Llama award. If you like this episode, please subscribe and leave us a review on iTunes. You can also follow us on Soundcloud or Stitcher. We have an incredible lineup of interviews we’ll be releasing every Tuesday here on the Powderkeg Podcast. Check it out at powderkeg.com/itunes.

We're taking a break in between seasons to chat with Lessonly's CEO, Max Yoder. Max discusses the background behind his new book, Do Better Work, and how the principles laid out in the book are integrated throughout the Lessonly organization. Learn more and preorder your copy by going to www.dobetter.work.

“If you are waiting around for your company to own your development, you are going to be disappointed because no one can own it for you.” In season 19 episode 6 we are joined by Max Yoder.  He is the CEO of Lessonly and author of the new book "Do Better Work." In our conversation we cover: - How Music and Leadership Intersect - What does "Do Better Work" mean? - Why you should share before you are ready - Why you must communicate early and often - How to be patient with yourself - How to highlight what’s working - Why setting clear expectations is so important Learn more about the book here or Lessonly here.  

Compassionate communication has been one of the building blocks for Lessonly's success and in this interview we learn more about Max Yoder CEO and co-founder of Lessonly - "The powerfully simple training software that helps teams learn, practice and Do Better Work." Nathaniel Schooler 0:10 Thanks for tuning in everybody. Today, I'm interviewing Max Yoder - Ceo and Co-founder of Lessonly, with now over 2 Millions users, we are discussing B2B sales, compassionate communication and having difficult conversations. Lessonly is the powerfully simple training software that helps teams - learn, practice and Do Better Work. Well, it's really nice to see you, Max. Obviously, you're on video for for me, the people listening at home are quite excited to hear about Lessonly as well! Max Yoder 0:58 I appreciate being here. Nathaniel Schooler 0:59 It's quite amazing. I mean, so you've built an E-Learning business? Max Yoder 1:05 We've got training software for sales teams and customer service teams. Nathaniel Schooler 1:10 This is actually being used by lots of FTSE 100s and others? Max Yoder 1:16 We have 600 customers. We just surpassed 2 million unique learners, you know, really, really fun milestones. And we've been doing this for six and a half years, so to say, 600 customers and 2 million learners. When we first got started, I was thinking if we can get, you know, 50 customers, I'm going to be out of my mind! Exciting because I've never had a customer in my life. I had never closed a deal when this business started. So 50 was going to be enormous. It's been it's been great. Nathaniel Schooler 1:42 Wow, that's, that's really quite exciting. So when you when you started, it was a it was a big struggle, right. Like, I mean. Elon Musk talks about startups. And he says "Starting a business is actually a bit like eating glass, and then looking down the Abyss! it just sticks in my mind, you know, because, yeah, you know, I speak to loads of people that are in startups, and you've moved well beyond that, but that pain kind of it shapes you, doesn't it from the early days, right? Max Yoder 2:18 Yeah, I would. Often I would argue that I started a business because of pain, you know, I had a pain and I wanted to fill and it turns out, businesses don't fill pains. You got to go to therapy and counselling for that! But they can teach you a lot about yourself. So I learned a tonne about myself, this was my second business Lessonly. My first business was a polling and surveying tool. I ran that one for two years. And it didn't go great. I still had enough money in savings when we shut it down to get to spin Lessonly up and I had some partners with me at Lessonly as well, that really helps, you know, having other people around instead of kind of feeling like you're going it alone. But with Quipol not doing well, which is the first company I really felt a lot of pressure to make sure that goes well, because one thing not working out, you know, that's an anecdote, two things not working out. Now. It's like, you're just not good at this. So I was really invested in doing everything I could to make Lessonly work. Fortunately, we had a business that had a lot more directed inherent value to customers, which of course, is very important. And we just hit the market at the right time. You know, I think if you tried to start Lessonly today with the exact same playbook, you're going to struggle because markets come in waves, and they don't wait for people. So timing was right. The idea was right, we had enough patience to grow slowly, but surely. But Holy moly, was I stressed out, and I think I missed a lot of the journey by being stressed out. And I think, I'm only now you know only 5 or 6 years in did I realise how much I needed to work on myself, if I was going to be good in this company. And not just focus on the business but, but focus on just being a better version of myse...

An educated and knowledgeable employee is a happier employee, according to our guest on this edition of Brandstorm. Kyle Lacy is the VP of marketing at Lessonly, a modern team-building software company based in Indianapolis. The company provides online training software for those in sales, customer service, and any other customer-facing role. Its biggest customers include the retail, telecom and software industries.   The Six Pillars of Training The mission at Lessonly is to help people do better work so they can live better lives. In most cases, companies supply Lessonly with training information and materials, while Lessonly provides the platform for learning. The customer experience is what makes any company relevant. Kyle says the three most important steps to training success is for employees to be able to learn, practice and perform. The software not only offers training lessons, but it also enables employees to repeatedly practice what they’ve learned right within the app. Management can then review and provide immediate feedback about the employee’s performance. Conversely, leaders within an organization must be able to plan, build and assess an effective training program. Companies provide Lessonly with what they want to accomplish and Lessonly makes it happen through numerous training tools, including video, email pitches, ZenDesk tickets, audio for phone calls and open practicing. According to Kyle, the biggest measurement of how well Lessonly’s software works is in the onboarding process, where the time it takes to train new employees can be cut in half.   Do Better Work Book to be Released in February At Lessonly, employees live the brand every day, marketing the company from the inside out. The company’s CEO and President are both only 30 years old and according to Kyle, wise beyond their years in how they care about employees. In February, Lessonly will release a book based largely on the soft skills that they practice and their approach to leadership, including vulnerability, appreciative inquiry and comradery. To sign up to receive a copy, go to the company’s website, lessonly.com, and click on the “Do Better Work” page.   Connect with Kyle Email: kyle.lacy@lessonly.com LinkedIn: @kylelacy Twitter: @kyleplacy Company Website: www.lessonly.com Company LinkedIn: @lessonly Company Twitter: @lessonly