Podcast appearances and mentions of Joseph Boyden

This week the gang gets together to discuss the rest of Inroduce Yerself.Transcript:Track 1:[0:00] Hey, it's Justin. You know and love us on the Discovering Downey podcast, right? So come hang out with us in person for the finale. Join us for Long Slice Brewing presents a celebration of Gord Downey at The Rec Room in downtown Toronto on Friday, July 19th. Craig is coming from Vancouver, Kirk is coming from LA, I'm driving from Vermont, and JD's like walking down the street or wherever he lives in Toronto. Tickets are available now on our website at discovererndowney.com, and when you get your tickets, that means you can come Come hang out with us and our very special guest, Patrick Downey, and you can bid on some incredibly cool silent auction items, all while jamming along with tragically hip cover band The Almost Hip, and most importantly, helping us raise money for the Gord Downey Fund for Brain Cancer Research. Crack open a long slice, put on some Gord tunes, take a journey with us on discovering Downey, and then crack open another long slice on July 19th and hang out with us in the six. I always wanted to sound cool and say that. For more information, follow us on all the socials and visit DiscoveringDowny.com. Christmas Day for Edgar. My dad always used to say just after the presents, well, it's as far away now as it will ever be. I'm thinking about that as the stewardess cracks the public address system. For those sitting in economy, there's no music for you today.Track 1:[1:21] Welcome, music lovers. Long Slice Brewery presents. Discovering Downey.Track 2:[1:31] Hey, it's JD here and welcome to Discovering Downey, an 11-part project with a focus on the music and poetry of Mr. Gord Downey. The late frontman of the Tragically Hip gave to the world an extensive solo discography on top of the hip's vocal local acrobats that wowed us for years. So far, he's released eight records in total, three of them posthumously. Now listen, you might be the biggest fan of the hip out there, but have you really listened to these solo records? Because I'm an inquisitive podcaster, I enlisted my friends, Craig, Justin, and Kirk, giant fans of the hip in their own right, to discover Downey with me, JD, as their host. Every week, we're going to get together and listen to one of Gord's records, working in chronological order. We discuss and dissect the album, the production, the lyrics, and we break it down song by song. This week we're going to be talking about the back half well plus two songs from the front half of introduce yourself justin my friend how are you doing on this gray fucking oh is it gray there toronto oh oh it's terrible all day maybe because i was wearing sunglasses wait a minute.Track 4:[2:55] It is it was the opposite of that here in in beautiful vermont today it's it was a beautiful day i I think it's going to be great for the rest of the week, though. So whatever you're getting today, we'll get tomorrow.Track 1:[3:05] Oh, that's weather with Justin. We'll be back with Craig and Traffic. Remember, news on the fives.Track 2:[3:12] Where in the world is Kirk from Fuckachino? How's it going, man?Track 5:[3:22] I am in Washington, D.C. Right now for work in a hotel room. so having some technical difficulties so my apologies but things are good and uh excited to continue the conversation greg.Track 2:[3:41] What say you things.Track 3:[3:44] Are going well a little uh a little tired after a night out uh watching the sadies last night so they played a small venue downtown and got to see the boys rock out and um yeah it was it was a pretty awesome show a big banner of Dallas in the background and yeah, some touching moments, but mostly they, they just rocked.Track 2:[4:03] I haven't been to a live show in a little while now.Track 4:[4:06] Super cool.Track 2:[4:12] All right, fellas, before we get into the music, I want to talk to you about an email that I got from an organization called Lake Fever Wilderness Company. Basically, the gist of this email is that the Lake Fever Wilderness Company has submitted all the paperwork required to City Hall to get At Riverdale Park East, here in Toronto, mere footsteps from my home, renamed Gord Downie Park. I saw an article on BlogTO, and then they also gave us a couple other links to stories. But I'm hoping that our little podcast here, that people who listen to it will hear this, and you know we can build some awareness around this somehow anything you want to say about this or comment about this are you jealous and ate in your town yes.Track 4:[5:17] That sounds like a great cause and um for what it's worth i love the song lake fever so.Track 2:[5:25] Right Right?Track 4:[5:26] Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's a, that's whatever we can do to help, man. That sounds great.Track 5:[5:31] Sounds very cool.Track 3:[5:32] I'm jealous. We, who do we get? Brian Adams Avenue.Track 2:[5:39] Probably already have it. Don't you?Track 3:[5:41] I don't know. I don't know. Maybe in England.Track 2:[5:45] Really? There's not a. Right mind-blowing to me one of the top songs of all time in terms of played, everything i do i do for you right, yeah but this is not a brian adams podcast this is a podcast called discovering downy and let's pick it up where we left off last time that puts us on side two of the first record With the very candid, my first self.Track 5:[6:47] I mean, just explains it like I remember it. And yeah. could feel all of those crazy, stupid emotions and, uh, could just totally wrap my head around and embrace, you know, the message that he was writing, you know, a piano forward tune again. You know, I think we talked about that the last one, uh, I love the vocal and the background that starts coming in uh you know echoing essentially the line um and then the last line is just classic so yeah uh it's a it's a brilliant tune in my assessment.Track 3:[7:28] Yeah, what I liked about it is that it really instantly just takes you to a place in your own life, whether the story is one you connect with or not, it takes you back to, you know, when you were in your teens or whatever. And that's what I appreciated about this song. Another thing before the echoing vocal you're talking about there's i just noticed today for the first time very very faintly in the opposite channel is something that sounds like a, a meowing cat i think it's a person but it's almost this little it's so subtle it's almost like one of those hearing tests you get where there's a little beep and you're like did i hear that but i listened a second time and there's something that comes in about 30 seconds before for the more noticeable vocal on the other side so i.Track 4:[8:19] Did not on that view yeah i listened to it today too actually and.Track 3:[8:24] Um i.Track 4:[8:26] Mean this this girl sounds cool as hell you know like he says in the song six years older so it's definitely you know she's his girlfriend but he may not be her boyfriend from what i'm picking up on you know like and and i certainly related to the you.Track 3:[8:41] Told me off and could she be responsible for uh hooking gourd on reading because he wanted to be like her.Track 4:[8:50] Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah interesting thought yeah yeah yeah i don't know again like i did feel a little awkward listening to this song let's.Track 2:[9:02] Move to the next track on the record you're ashore.Track 3:[9:05] Well this is probably the song i have the least to say about it's maybe the least memorable for me I think probably it's the type of song that if it's about you it's probably a maybe a bit of an inside joke or I'm not really sure what the you know what it's about who it's about, I appreciated the gentleness in his voice. I was glad that it was the length that it was because it was not my favorite. What did you guys think?Track 5:[9:38] I loved it me too i uh i i uh i mean it's the shortest song on the album it's a minute 30 you know the lyrics are simple it's you know essentially you're sure you're sure repeated and a few little straight lines but the brilliant in the very beginning is you know he's strumming and then it's the let flow it down i believe is what he says and uh yeah it's um Um, I think especially amongst this body of work amongst this album, like, you know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of piano, there's a lot of synths, there's even some beats and things of that nature. And it was kind of nice to just get a little short acoustic ditty in my opinion. But, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm a sucker for that. That's, uh, just like, just like back in the eighties, right? Every metal band had its little ballad. so uh i i love the ballads so.Track 4:[10:38] Yeah i don't know who it's about but it's an earworm i find myself humming the tune uh quite often and there's only a few words in the song so it's not like, you know like you said craig the lyrics aren't nothing about it is really memorable but it is it does get into your brain and it's an easy little like you could just walk through the the park and just sing that all day. But yeah, I mean, it's a minute 30 and that's about right.Track 2:[11:07] Yeah, that's about right. It's interesting you say that you couldn't determine who that's about, because I, so far, have really sucked at that game, listening to the first record. So, as we go into the second record, Gord lobs a softball at me, and even I know that this next track, Love Over Money, is about the fucking Tragically Hip.Track 4:[11:37] Damn right it is.Track 2:[11:39] Yeah who wants to go first here kirk.Track 5:[11:42] Yeah i'll go first um yeah i i you know uh i would say jd i've had a similar you know a similar experience in in trying i have little parentheses in my notes of who i think the note might be or the song might be too and i you know i can't even get specifics i just write like brother you know question mark things of that nature so this one was obvious what i loved about it as well and and i think i might have mentioned it on on the last of the first the first album it's such a pop it's like a synth pop tune is what i have and this is gonna sound weird but for whatever reason when i hear the song i think of that snl skit where you've You've got like Jimmy Fallon and they're all playing like they're doing that little, you know, they do the little dance.Track 2:[12:36] Oh, right, right, right.Track 5:[12:37] You know, when I heard this song, I, by the second time, I just, I couldn't get that shit out of my brain. So, but just beautiful lyrics talking about the band. So direct and so loving and so to the point. To me, an absolute, brilliant Gord Downie song. I mean, you know, just wonderful, wonderful song.Track 3:[13:06] The moment he said the line, we played to no one, and then no one plus one, I knew it was about the hip. Because I remember in 1996, a band I played in, we went across Canada two times that year, self-booked tours. And we ended up in Thunder Bay on one of the tours.Track 3:[13:24] And we played in a tiny club called crocs and rolls which is sort of like a legendary club in in thunder bay a guy named frank lefredo was the booker there who was kind of like a legend, in uh in music across canada and anyway frank um the first night we we played and we didn't draw much of a crowd and he said you know don't worry guys the you know first time the tragedy hit played here they played to to no one and then they played a second night and they got a couple more and the next night and you know they played i think three nights in a row on an early tour, and so that made us feel a little better and he and he um he felt bad about the the draw so when we came back um he found us a gig at another venue um for the for the drive back so that's the the memory that that comes up for me um and also the other thing the queen's jubilee uh so the reference to the um to the playing to the the deafening the husband of the queen um that would be that that show which i looked up and uh and yeah they played poets and interesting enough in that version of poets he changes the lyrics he censors himself a little bit i noticed so for the queen he he He changed bare-breasted to bare-chested, and there was one other change I can't recall.Track 4:[14:44] Yeah, it was a great performance. I remember seeing that. I wish that I had looked it up just to bring the memory of it back, but that line stuck out to me. I remember seeing that performance.Track 3:[14:57] And he used the laminar flow line as well in that version of Poets.Track 4:[15:01] Oh, that I didn't remember.Track 2:[15:04] Wow.Track 3:[15:05] Which ended up in Coke Machine Glow on Every Irrelevance.Track 4:[15:11] Yeah. Obviously, the bond between those five guys is unbreakable, and this song is funny, too. I laughed at this song the first time that I heard it and heard the lyrics. We missed death and marriage and a birth. I did notice the words hotel worth, which is kind of a preview to an upcoming thing. There's a song that actually got a lot of airplay here locally a few years ago. But yeah, yep, it did. Yep, it was on the radio two or three times a day for a couple months here.Track 3:[15:47] The love over money line um made me also think about the way that they split their royalties and i'm not sure if if it was like a 20 all the way around that would be my guess but but often the the lyricist will take 50 and then the people who wrote the music take the other 50 so you know maybe it's not that simple but the fact that all five of them were as far as i know listed on all all the all the credits sort of um you know over their career that's something that drives so many bands apart is that fight over you know well i wrote this i wrote this and like even in the band i spoke about a while ago like we had some really crazy discussions around royalties and who should get what and you know in my mind i've always been a equal share guy i don't care if you're the drummer if you're you know you wrote your part that's just you know then again i've not not like i'm making a ton of a ton of money in music or anything but but um it was nice to to see them stick together so long and the same five guys like what other band can you think of that released that many albums with the same lineup it's got to be a very very.Track 2:[17:02] Very short list.Track 3:[17:03] Like there may be some three pieces i mean but a five piece band think of all the potential for conflict and for you know one guy leaving it like no one there's some sleuthing.Track 2:[17:17] Some sonic sleuthing for you listeners out there send us an email at discovering downy at gmail.com with bands that have a lineup up that was consistent with at least 15 records released? Are there any? Is there a database that you could just plug that into and get it from?Track 3:[17:40] No idea. I mean, Aerosmith would be close, but they had that lineup change in the mid-career.Track 2:[17:49] Right.Track 3:[17:51] For one album anyways.Track 2:[17:53] Joe Perry left, right? Joe Perry and Brad Whitford.Track 3:[17:55] Yeah.Track 2:[17:57] Yeah, yeah. Okay, so the next track is You, Me, and the Bees. Do I go two for two here when I say this is an ode to the Boston Bruins? Yeah. And its ability to connect with your family, particularly in this case to Gord's brother, Patrick.Track 3:[21:03] That sounds about right to me.Track 2:[21:04] Take us away.Track 3:[21:06] Took me right to my childhood as well. And a good friend of mine, so my friend Blair and I, we played a game called hall hockey. Hockey's in my parents basement with you know those fisher price um bowling sets we take take one of the pins and a ball and we would just hit the ball back and forth and if you hit the wall you score and we had this ongoing game every time he came over and we would you know do the play by play and we were both oilers fans so you weren't allowed to be the oilers you had to choose another team and i'll never forget the quebec nordique if you were the nordique and you you know you'd be Stastny and then you pass over to to you know Michelle Goulet and as soon as Michelle Goulet, got the puck you know you're getting a shot in the balls every single time I don't know what it was but and um yeah and then Blair became a little bigger than me and started winning every single game and then we yeah we aged out of that game but anyways that's where it took me yeah what What about you guys?Track 4:[22:06] Oh man, this was me and my old man playing pond hockey. Yeah, I loved the song and I loved I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. And you know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton and you know, it's, I don't know, like Like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time. This song is that relationship. And, you know, and as a Habs fan, I freaking hate the Bruins, but I get it. You know, I totally get it. And, yeah, this is just a really cool song about your brother. You know, it's fun.Track 5:[22:57] Yeah, I loved the song. And I loved, I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. You know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton. And, you know, it's, I don't know, like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time, you know, and the song is that.Track 4:[23:30] I, um, I really liked how Gord's voice was very staccato and this, um, he was really kind of a minimalist with, you know, he didn't drag any of the, any of the, the lines out the Bruins. You know, like just very on the beat and kind of not screwing around. Or maybe this is screwing around for him, I guess. But, you know, he turned the word Bruins into Bruins, just one syllable. And I don't know, it felt like a different approach lyrically or sonically, I guess.Track 3:[24:02] Yeah, that phrasing really matched the style of the song too. That sort of, like the percussion that Kirk was talking about. It just, yeah, had that staccato feel.Track 5:[24:11] The phrasing, thanks for bringing that up, Craig. I had just recently watched the Juno Award tribute, Dallas Green and Sarah Harmer and Kevin Hearn, I believe it was, and I believe it was the Junos. And gore you guys both talked mentioned like the way he phrases like the way he takes his lyrics and will you know enunciate them to fit into the line it is like no one else right and then when you watch this tribute and you see her singing introduce yourself and trying to you know keep the cadence that that that gourd has i guess that's a good way to describe it there's a uh, a unique cadence to it so i i was blown away by that if you guys haven't seen it you you must watch it and then when they go into bob cajun and the harmonies are just incredible but like goosebumps you know it's so incredible and then especially when she comes in with that harmony But to hear her do the phrasing was wonderful as well, because that has to be difficult.Track 2:[25:25] Yeah, it's what we love about him, right? His ability to twist and turn and put round pegs into square holes or square pegs into round holes probably is more difficult, in fact. Snowflake has a haunting piano line that works well with Gord's almost pastime. What do you think of Snowflakes.Track 5:[25:46] Kirk? Yeah, Melancholy was my note. Again, the piano is used heavily throughout this whole album, but on this song in particular. My guess at who it is to is just a girlfriend is all I wrote. Um but uh the the other note that i wrote was the the woman leaned in to say goodbye but i don't remember his name and uh just the um where is gourd going with that you know i i uh i i wondered i wrote that down as a note so um but just again uh fully emotional song.Track 3:[26:34] Yeah i wondered if that was almost like a reference to maybe his fading memory yeah the oh yeah i was a bit puzzled by that too craig yeah it was a very eerie song and i really loved it i love the um the jangling sounds gave it like a really eerie feeling like you're in a i don't know like a haunted ballroom of some ancient house like i just picture this as a movie when I'm listening to it the the, vocal delivery makes me wonder if it was one of the later tracks that he he did and i really love the chorus and the the reverb they put on like just like in a natural there is a ton of reverb, like way too much reverb but it works really well it's so powerful when they do it on this album not something i would normally like um yeah his voice is is gorgeous in the song um a lot of feeling to the piano playing as well by by kevin um yeah and again i had a note about phrasing when he says my name and when he says goodbye it's kind of rushed and it made me wonder if it was just a lack of time just you know doing it in one take and not worrying too much about yeah about how it came off um but again that's what we love about you too yeah yeah.Track 5:[27:58] You i mean craig you sing when you play takes a lot of energy um so that's that's one thing that i wondered throughout this this album in particular when like if you just say you're looking at it on your phone and you're listening and you bring up the lyrics and you're you're you're questioning some of the enunciations i guess of some of the words but it's that's gourd and that's uh you know Him making it work for that particular song. And sometimes different than what the lyrics are written as. I don't know if that's just typo type stuff or if that's on purpose. this.Track 4:[28:37] So I actually, I don't know, my, my thought on this was that maybe this was, um, something that he was remembering from his childhood and maybe, um, with a, an older sibling or, a relative or somebody, you know, that he knew well. And, um, the thing that stood out to me.Track 4:[29:00] More was the, his recollection of the lake and, um, of the house and describing everything about the scene and that this woman is somebody, an acquaintance of whoever he's walking down the road with, and they're going to see her. Um, cause there's the line, she told me to go explore the quiet rooms. Uh, it like, so this is all right, kid, go check out the house. We got stuff to talk about you know um and i actually um somehow connected this to the you know affluent woman in the video for it's a good life if you don't weaken um my my head kind of went to that music video and i don't don't know why or where that happened but um it just felt to me like it that type of house and that type of, of meeting. And, you know, and then at the end of that video, Gord leans down and whisper something into her ear and, and then, then they walk out. I don't, I don't really know why that's where I went, but, um, it's sort of a mishmash of two different things. Yeah.Track 4:[30:13] So like there's the song that we'll get to called the lake. When I first heard that, I thought that was about the lake, But now I think this song might be about the lake. I don't know.Track 5:[30:23] Just the fact that when he writes his lyrics, like, yeah, he, it's inspired by something, but it may even have a different meaning than what it was inspired by for him. And I don't think he really intends for the listening audience to do anything other than interpret it for their own selves or application. So, um, you know, I, you just, I never got the feeling like he'd be offended by that.Track 2:[30:49] Yeah, I can't agree with you more. Again, that's one of these great things about this performer that we all love. We can get behind that. The next song is called A Better End, and it makes me sad. Lonesome for Gord, I suppose. How does it make you feel, Justin?Track 4:[31:17] Yeah, the same. I mean, it sounds a lot like the Man Machine Poem album. There's some melancholy in a lot of those songs. And this album came together in a different context, but it's musically a lot similar to or very similar to a lot of the songs on there. And there are connections with the lyrics, the line, for treasure or worse. That's in, is that in Man? or machine, one of the others. You know, where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed, that line crushes me every time I hear it.Track 2:[32:00] Repeat it?Track 4:[32:02] Where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed. And, you know, there's an end to that sentence, right? There's a finality in that one. And I don't know. I don't know who it's about. The song is called A Better End, but he says bitter. Um you know and that only at the very end of the song does it say the better end um so maybe there's some letting go you know i i i don't know yeah.Track 5:[32:37] I i uh i have a description written as dark melancholy but then my final note was a plea and that to me as i think you had mentioned, Craig, you know, maybe it was to a family member. And I kind of felt like it was to all family members and all of his like close friends, like, this is the letter, like, this is it. And so I just wrote a plea, question mark. And the beat, I think we talked about this before, you know it's it had the clock feeling to me throughout um and then like you had mentioned justin uh you know you you the title's a better end the the lyric that he uses is stay to the bitter end but it stayed in the bitter end and uh uh just uh, He's put out so much energy at this point, you know, because it is when they've recorded this, you know, it's 20, 2017. They've done the they've done the. The tours, he's done the secret path stuff like he knows what's coming, he knows the bitter end and he gave everything he could. And this is like his like, hey, somebody give me some energy for, you know, here for a better end.Track 3:[34:04] Yeah, I wondered if this was a close family member maybe saying to stay with me until the bitter end. Really, yeah, this was an emotional song, but it's also the type of song that's going to keep bringing me back to this album. I love this song. i found that again another powerful chorus with that big reverb sound and the way he belts out songs like this and snowflake and uh in the choruses is a real strength of this album nancy and yeah just a very powerful um i i had a note i would be interested to hear a heavy version of the song like a full band version um yeah but yeah haunting piano it gave me um secret path vibes it felt very much like musically could have been on secret path he.Track 4:[35:02] He hits a lot of different spots um um in his range too he sings very deeply and then he sings very high um there's There's a lot of, you know, he's probably in three octaves or maybe four during the song. Probably three.Track 2:[35:22] Yeah. So when I hear this song, I think of it, I think of an LP, like an old LP, like a 72, you know, RPM record. And I picture it being played on my grandparents' couch-sized hi-fi. It just sounds, it sounds old. It sounds authentic.Track 5:[35:50] Authentic it sounds like a needle you know the indie rock on the vinyl right it.Track 2:[35:56] Sounds like which sorry.Track 5:[35:57] It sounds like the needle on the vinyl it's just yeah it's you you and then you got that the dining you know the the dining room or whatever recording that's going on in the background and then and then it just sounds like they have the actual, you know the the needle and the vinyl that that that that static sound going it's it's brilliant it's a little soft guitar it's it's a sweet song it really is it's a sweet song yeah.Track 3:[36:28] And the way he sings it too it's almost like a bit of a like a shaky vocal like a bit of a warble to his voice which maybe it was actually maybe they added an effect to make to give it that vinyl quality to it. But I think maybe it's just his, I think it's just his performance. And when I say shaky, I mean, in a deliberate way, I talked last week about how I can't think of any singer who has as many qualities to his voice as Gord and he does it better than anyone. Yeah. Yeah.Track 2:[37:09] But then it did go away. You know, sort of, right? Yeah.Track 3:[37:17] When he wanted it to, yeah. He just gained so much control over his voice. He had power from early on, but then he developed different subtleties. And when he gets into an album like Secret Path, and he's singing sort of in character, he can just go into all these different places depending on the emotion of the song. And another note about Nancy is, first of all, I'm guessing it's about a sister. I didn't actually look up the names of his sisters, but that's just my guess. I liked how it talked about the beginning, the middle, and the end. And Gord forever being the storyteller. He's always thinking in terms of story. Just a little nugget I picked up. And the conversation at the beginning too when they're just starting to hit record he's talking about his cuff link.Track 4:[38:16] It's a good one.Track 2:[38:17] It is. It's really good. And I think on first listen, it would have been bottom third for me. And now it's firmly somewhere in the middle third. Like, it has a crack top third for me. But, you know, it's moved up for sure.Track 4:[38:36] Yeah.Track 3:[38:37] I feel like this album gets better as it goes on. I actually prefer the second half.Track 5:[38:42] That's fair.Track 3:[38:43] Um i think at first i really enjoyed the first half more maybe because i was really preparing for that first half um for our pod but i i love the the second half yeah i.Track 4:[38:57] Actually very much agree with that i think for me it starts to really get good at you're ashore and like i said it's it's a kind of a forgettable song but the the tone sort of changes isn't that wild yeah well.Track 2:[39:11] We are at the last song of the first side the remarkably upbeat think my about us.Track 5:[41:21] This is brilliant. This song is brilliant for me from the first listen to the critical listens in the middle to listening again just recently before this. And just the way it made me feel, the swagger it had, the message it had, um that just incredible descending piano line um it it was uh it it it's up there for me it's really really really up there i love love this tune i.Track 3:[42:03] Agree this is a masterful song really it's just it comes at a place on the album.Track 3:[42:11] Where you really need something that's a little, kind of cute is the word i'll use and you've got that little piano melody that almost just sounds like a finger exercise you would do if you're learning how to play piano and some really cool sounds on the synth or maybe it's a theremin but i'm pretty sure it's a synth, and i also had a note that the the drums enter in an interesting way the bass and drums come in and just maybe a spot you're not quite ready for and yeah just just like a playful song that i really enjoy just super catchy i i wish the world could hear this music like i wish more people, would give this a chance because it should be words were i mean maybe this is my thesis for the end of this whole thing but gourd's work should be appreciated like like josh even said like they're both up they're both equal they're both amazing yeah.Track 4:[43:09] I had the word super catchy exactly the same in my in my notes and i really don't have a lot of other notes about this song but i i can't stop listening to it i know that um it's a yeah it's a it's a and you're right craig it came at the right time um in the sequencing um it was needed in this spot.Track 3:[43:31] It's a little heavy before that.Track 2:[43:32] Right?Track 3:[43:33] Yeah, and it's going to get heavy again. Yep, that's right. Really heavy.Track 2:[43:37] I learned a really valuable... I gained access to some valuable experience today, when I was preparing for this recording, because it's the first time that I've flipped the record over, and had to tackle the final five songs that we ever get to hear from Gord Downie, or so we thought at the time. You know, like, we didn't know there was going to be posthumous releases.Track 5:[44:17] Right.Track 2:[44:19] We knew he wrote this right before he passed, So either way, you know, it's fucking heavy. Craig, when you think of The Road, do you think of that as heavy?Track 5:[44:35] Yes.Track 3:[44:36] Wow, The Road, this song destroys me. Again, there's a bit of a theme on the album in a few songs about The Road, about missing out on life events. Yes. On, you know, the sacrifice. Of you know being a touring musician um you know a dream that i had when i was young and it didn't work out and you know i'm you know thankful for the life i have um and you know i'm sure gourd was as well but man like it had to be there had to be some really tough times being out away from your family all the time and missing things and um anyways this song is so good and the um the thing i want to say about this is when the drums come in there's no hi-hat it's just sort of kick and snare and that space really sets the the mood for this song um you know along with you know the piano of course um and there's one line i want to point out the machines are somewhat suitable now um you know is that is that the hospital machines is it is it a reference to man machine poem um i'm not sure but but this song like.Track 3:[46:06] Depresses me almost as much as the the book the road which destroyed me when i was um a young parent uh you know or not you know i wasn't young but my my son was young and if you you know um cormac mccarthy's the road it is absolutely devastating it is the a book that took me well i've never gotten over it really and the movie as well i watched the movie and it took me about six months to watch the movie i had to watch it like a little bit at a time when i was in the right headspace and it just it is if you haven't read it's maybe don't but it's incredible um but this this yeah if you name something the road it's probably going to destroy me well.Track 4:[46:51] So I had a bit of an awakening about three years ago when in May of 2021, my wife had something that she had to do at work late at night or 8 o'clock, 9 o'clock, whatever. And she couldn't be home to make dinner. And it was like a Tuesday or something. I don't know. And she messaged me during the day and said, you need to be home and make Evelyn dinner tonight. night. Evelyn's our daughter. And at the time she was, uh, almost four and I got home and I realized, holy shit, I've never made dinner for my daughter before. Um, I was working 80 hours a week and I was missing everything. And my wife had an Instagram account for our daughter. And that was the only way that I was keeping up. I lived in the same house, but I wasn't in the same family. You know what I mean? And yeah, the song brings all that back and made a big life change that very night. I sent a long message to my boss and said, we got to talk tomorrow, but I'm going to get it all out right now. Cause if I didn't say it now, I'm not going to say it. And I told him I'm done at the end of the year. I've I'll stick with you for my commitment through this year, but but I'd put 10 years into my job and missed everything in that 10 years. And, um.Track 4:[48:16] Give Gord another three decades on top of that. Um, I don't know who the song's about and I guess it doesn't matter, but, um, but obviously it matters, but, um, yeah, I, I really identified with the missing everything and even going back to the song about, um, uh, what is it? Love over money, um, about the band, you know, we missed funerals and births and all this stuff. And yeah, that's me. I've been there, man. I've, I still, to some degree, I'm there a little bit, but, um, yeah, I missed my daughter's first four years of her life.Track 5:[48:54] Everyone knows in this group here, I'm on the road all the time. I'm talking to you from a hotel room in, in Washington, DC. And, um, and so, I mean, Justin, I think this is actually a letter to the road and a letter to everyone that he's been on the road with, including his wife, his part, you know, his, his kids, his bandmates. It's, it's that, you know, that's that life you choose, you know, whether it's a traveling musician, whether it's a a traveling salesman, whether it's a, you know, a producer. Um, and, and, and it's, uh, it's tough, but when you're not on the road, if you are a road person, it's your, your, you know, jittery, you're nervous, but how do you, how do you give to your family and to yourself and to your job and to your art? And, uh, he wouldn't have been able to do that without the road. So but you know it's a blessing and a curse um i we mentioned this about another song here and this one i wrote was also a song that could have been on secret path was the note for me.Track 4:[50:17] Yeah yeah but musically yeah again.Track 5:[50:19] We there's not enough hours in the day right lads to uh just talk about the amazing insight and that we have it here you know to listen to to watch to read to just just beautiful.Track 4:[50:36] Well there's there's that point where you know you're you're young and and full of energy and you've got these huge goals and then you start to achieve them and then at the same time you have this other life going on behind the scenes that has always played second fiddle to that and then you realize at some point you're too deep into the pursuit to stop now but that this other life that was didn't even exist when you started uh has now taken the spot you know is number one on your on your pecking order and how the hell do you make that change without destroying everything that you've created you know yep.Track 5:[51:14] Oh you are the bird.Track 2:[51:18] Yeah it's uh it's a slow and lovely song right what do you think about it kirk to.Track 5:[51:28] Me this this was uh uh, uh, just a letter. It seemed like a letter to a sibling, right? You, you became the bird you, uh, and then it just, it made sense. And, uh, um, um.Track 5:[51:44] I, it, it starts getting heavy after a while, right? When you, when we break, I mean, we talked about it with the last week when we talked about the first one and how emotional it was and, you know, here we are, you know, however many songs in and you just, you stop. And like you said, you know, JD, it was like, these are the last five tunes and it's, it's, it's almost hard to embrace, um, and think about without just getting, you know, overwhelmed. I, I think it is, I think largely because of the love we have for, uh, you know, what, what, what Gord Downie has done solo and with the hip and, and in jazz as a human. So, um, but, uh, yeah, just, uh, you know, Another note was, again, I think I mentioned it earlier, just lyrics that are written different than what is being sung. And I didn't know if that was on purpose. I think I mentioned that. And I didn't know if it was something Gord was trying to do on purpose. Or it's probably nothing. It's probably just what was written and what was sung.Track 5:[53:04] You know, he probably had it written down as such and just like we do when you have a script in front of you, your brain has already chosen what the next word is going to be. So, anyway.Track 4:[53:15] I noticed that this shared a lot of similarities with Spoon from the first half where he talks about help being the only reason why we're here. You help others and the child in the song Spoon is, I guess, tasked with the same thing. I don't know if task is the right word, but this is a common thread throughout the album. And this lyrically shares a lot with that song.Track 3:[53:48] Yeah. I agree, Justin. That was my real only, my only real note on this song was that, that, you know, it's the only reason we're here. And that seems to be like, yeah, like if I had to break down this album into one message, that would be, I mean, other than like a goodbye and, uh, you know, uh, a lot, you know, a love letter to his close ones. Um, that is like the, yeah, the summation of this album. I also thought probably about A Child, the song, and also there's the line about he was the bird, he passed it down, you want to help people out. So, you know, he's referencing not only the person he's talking to, but someone, maybe another family member, a grandfather or someone who's passed down that quality that, he respects.Track 4:[54:35] There's one of my mentors. I kind of think of him as a father figure. His name is John Adams and he was a very bottom level race car driver around these parts. And, he and my father were about the same age and they were friends. And I started hanging out with John when I was 13 or 14 years old, trying to learn how to work on race cars. And there was one night he went off, he got pushed off the racetrack and he's, you know, this massive six foot six, 300 pound guy. And he comes barreling out of the car and climbs up to the top of the racetrack and gives a, gives the driver that, that wronged him the double bird. So he became the bird man that night. Um, that was his, that was his nickname. And so everybody calls him bird. And, you know, I thought, wouldn't that be silly if he passed his nickname down to me somehow, how you know because he doesn't all of his all of his kids are girls and i'm kind of like his sort of son um i don't think that's going to happen but i i know the song isn't made to laugh, but i laughed thinking about that that's.Track 2:[55:42] A nice memory though yeah.Track 4:[55:44] He's still with us he's still with us flipping people off all the time, yeah i.Track 5:[55:51] Love that the lake.Track 2:[58:56] Yeah, this one's a fucking tearjerker to me. So proceed with caution on this one. Justin?Track 4:[59:04] Yeah. I kind of mentioned it before that I thought that this song was about Lake Ontario, which has been such a constant theme throughout Gord's entire career with the hip and with the solo stuff. And there's so many references to the lake. Um but this song is not about the lake this song is is about his daughter willow i mean that's right at the end of the song uh i realized today you are lake ontario the love of my life you are willow and then he does this fantastic call and answer thing with his own you know backup vocals um saying willow over and over again and it's like wow this one this one is something um it's a it's a beautiful song um it's just gorgeous um and yes he does describe the lake or a lake um but all these same qualities could be about your child and man it's uh it's a crusher very.Track 5:[1:00:09] Astute observation mr justin that's uh i i think spot on um and as you mentioned you know it's obviously and and to compare the two is is that there's no disservice in that he loves them both dearly so um i loved how the keys on this made it feel like you were on the lake like you listen to the.Track 4:[1:00:37] Song and you feel like.Track 5:[1:00:39] You're floating in you know in a boat a canoe whatever on the lake and you hear the lake in that song. Um, absolutely amazing. Absolutely amazing.Track 4:[1:00:55] You know, I, I grew up on the water. Um, Lake Champlain is, they call it the sixth great lake. Um, and that's, I can see it out the window. Um, and my family had a camp on a little lake, uh, Hall's lake. And my wife grew up on a lake in Ohio, Guilford lake. And we go there They're three, four, five times a year. We're headed there next week. And she also came to Vermont working at a summer camp for, I think, seven summers on Lake Fairley, which is a gorgeous resort area. And so on first hearing this song, The Lake, and probably the first 10 times I heard it, I was like, man, I can see it. And then I picked up on the willow thing after, you know, 11th on my 11th listen, I guess. And I was like, Oh no, it's just something completely different. But if it is just about the lake, Oof, that's just as devastating and lovely.Track 3:[1:01:57] Yeah, I also grew up near a lake. Our house in Peachland, which my parents still live in, overlooks Okanagan Lake, which is a very large lake. And yeah, it just brings back memories. And it is maybe my favorite spot on earth. Right across the lake from where we live is a small island. There's no roads. There's no power. There's no development on the other side of the lake. And it's just a place that we would boat to when I was a kid and try to get over there every summer. And it's just, you know, this song takes me there. And also, you know, with the mention of his daughter at the end and, you know, the, you're the love of my life and it, yeah, it's just a beautiful song.Track 2:[1:02:46] It's gorgeous. Kirk?Track 5:[1:02:49] Again, we've said it already. you know these last five songs are they're crushers it's like it it was really hard to listen to them in succession like i really needed to stop you know this these last two far far away and blurred i you know my my my space that i left for what is supposed to be my guess of who it is who the song is to the letters to, is blank. And it is blank because to me it could be anyone. Maybe it was obvious to one of you guys, but I really felt like it was almost like a letter to everyone.Track 5:[1:03:34] We smile. All that we've been through, up and down for sure, onwards and upwards, up close, far away, and blurred. Um, the tempo changes in this song are amazing. It goes into a, a swing almost during the chorus. Um, and, uh, I, I, again, just the instrumentation and the, the combination of what, you know, uh, you know, obviously not just, um, Gordon, Kevin, but, you know, the others that contributed as well. So just add, I think, to each one of these letters, as it were, you know, as they started out. What'd you think about Far Away and Blurred, Craig?Track 3:[1:04:25] I really love this song. Another strong song on the second half of this album. And I almost wondered if maybe it could be another touring song, or maybe he's talking about traveling with his family. Great melody. And I agree with what you said, Kirk, when it changes tempo halfway through the song, and the drums come in with that slow beat, and the echo the the vocals are echoing and i i found that part very powerful and it's like, again i just can't, get over the the brilliance of his work it is like so emotional um and there's this like guitar pattern going on that's really really cool in the background as well and yeah and justin you yeah.Track 4:[1:05:20] I i guess i'm echoing what you guys have said um it's just a if i mean it's a little bit upbeat um for a hot minute there and again comes at a at a place where you need it um Um, yeah, it's, it's lovely. It's how it's a guy who's frigging dying, um, and telling everybody how much he loves them and that he always has, whether, whether you're in view or not. Right. Um, yeah, the.Track 5:[1:05:53] Passion in his voice in the vocal, um, is just so palpable. And so it just, I mean, wrenching, but almost in a, just again, another reminder of just how amazing, how amazing every part and ounce of the art that comes out of this guy is just incredible, incredible.Track 3:[1:06:23] Yeah, JD, did you have anything to add for this one?Track 2:[1:06:26] I don't know if I could get anything out right now if I tried. it's.Track 3:[1:06:30] A tough one I.Track 2:[1:06:32] Think you know his voice in the verses I've got written down that it's playful and painful at the same time, and you know it builds the chorus is obviously as powerful a gourd voice as we've heard in almost any song on this record, We'll get more of that in later records that we'll discuss in future episodes, but yeah, it's a great song, but it's the second-to-last song, and the North is a really powerful way to end. A callback to Secret Path and The Bridge. But overall, it's an interesting tracking decision. It can't be a coincidence. Right, Justin?Track 4:[1:11:07] No, of course it's not. It's a reminder. It's like he spent a good portion of that final show in Kingston reminding everybody to pay attention and to keep paying attention. And that's exactly what this song is. is it's it's uh yeah i did secret path but keep going forward keep talking about it keep moving keep changing um keep trying to figure this out um you know i don't know if we i don't think we've said this on air but when we first started talking about this album there i i mentioned to you guys in our in our group chat that i thought this was some of the songs on this album were like a stream of consciousness and i think i know that there's the video of of them recording this song and i know that it's not a stream of consciousness but i think when he was writing this song, what he wrote down is whatever came to his head first and i'm going to find a song to to put it to and i got to get this message out i don't care if it's rhymes or makes sense musically or what This has to be said again and again and again and again. And good on him, you know. Yeah.Track 3:[1:12:22] Yeah. So he makes the reference to, um, you know, a place West of, of James Bay, which would be Ottawa, Piscat, which of course the hip have, have the song about. And, um, I, I, I'm wondering if this song is either about or to Joseph Boyden, the author who, at the same time secret path was released, released a book called when Jack, um, I didn't mention him on the secret path episode only because there is some controversy you can look it up if you're interested but calling his um his roots into you know question um you know people questioning that he may not be in fact indigenous so you know that's definitely something you can kind of look into yourself but um joseph boyden is famous for a book called three day road and And just an interesting little thing that I came across about a week ago was a story related to this. So this story, Three Day Road, is about from just, I haven't read the book, but I've read a different story about a sniper in World War I named Francis Paganagabo. And he was nicknamed Peggy. And he has more kills than any sniper in North America.Track 3:[1:13:44] And his story is relatively unknown. And it's a really fascinating story. And anyways, I was reading a short story about that last week and then made this discovery about the connection to Joseph Boyden. Anyways, I highly encourage you to check out a story called Peggy. There's actually a podcast too by CBC called This Place. which is 150 years of Canadian history told by indigenous voices. And the episode on Peggy is incredible.Track 5:[1:14:19] The line Canada, we should have never called Canada. Um, I thought was pretty bold as well to put out there as you guys all had been mentioning, you know, obviously when he had addressed the crowd, you know, at several of the shows and, and several of his interviews. So I think that's, uh, bold, but expected. So I, I, uh, I think we all appreciate that. He would, would, go out there to this level.Track 3:[1:14:51] Yeah there's definitely a call back to that that statement in the last show that he made to the prime minister and i always um really admired that and, i always wondered what it would be like if an american artist did the same thing, you know like a high profile of bruce springsteen or someone went out and said something like that just the absolute division that would that would ensue um yeah yeah oh.Track 5:[1:15:18] Yeah I was going to say the dick and chicks are a good example.Track 3:[1:15:22] Of it.Track 4:[1:15:22] Happening.Track 5:[1:15:23] So but yeah.Track 4:[1:15:27] Or the opposite of that lady antebellum who's then sued the person that they stole their name from well fellas.Track 2:[1:15:36] It's time to ask the question will you be keeping this record in your rotation.Track 4:[1:15:44] I'm going to say not all the time And it's got nothing to do with the music. It's the subject. It's the heaviness of it. It's I don't want to, I don't want to be down. Um, there are some songs on this, on this record that are frigging awesome. They're all, they're all very good, but you know, there's some songs that certainly fit into the hip like catalog.Track 2:[1:16:07] Sure. And you can add them to your mixtape, right?Track 4:[1:16:10] Exactly. And that's probably how I'll consume them. Um, but this is going to be something that I listened to once every couple of years, maybe.Track 5:[1:16:19] Yeah, it's a commitment. I was just going to say it's a commitment. So I would answer very similarly to what Justin said. Even for this particular purpose of this podcast, it was heavy listening every time, every time you went through it. And so definitely some tunes I want to keep hearing regularly, but it's not something that I would. All i have on regular rotation like like i would would some of the others that that have definitely been fantastic in my opinion i.Track 3:[1:16:58] Agree with you guys i i definitely will come back to this album, um considering i gave it you know it took me six and a half years just to give it a first listen i'm definitely not going to wait that long um but i think i'll just have to be in the right frame of mind to put it on but i absolutely will i really do love it in fact coming up with an mvp track for this is definitely the hardest decision i've had to make i was hoping we were going to do one last week and one this week but so i'm it's going to be a last uh last second decision i was.Track 4:[1:17:31] Hoping jd would forget the question this time.Track 2:[1:17:33] I've got it written down so i don't forget my My memory is so piss poor.Track 3:[1:17:39] Right in on your hand.Track 2:[1:17:40] I call it a format sheet, but for real, it's cheating. Craig, we're going to stick with you. And we're going to go to MVP track.Track 3:[1:17:48] I want to know what they say first. So to clarify, is this my absolute favorite track or is this the track that I want to put onto a mixtape?Track 2:[1:18:00] It can be, that can be your interpretation. It can, it's the most valuable player. It's the, you know.Track 3:[1:18:07] So I had so many I mean my first instinct was a natural but I think I'm going to have to go with Snowflake it's.Track 2:[1:18:17] So good it.Track 3:[1:18:18] Is such a powerful song to me and I love the chorus I love the way again that big reverb sound and it's just a really gorgeous song and takes me you know visually takes me somewhere.Track 2:[1:18:36] We could definitely overuse the word gorgeous on this record because there's so much gorgeosity on it, you know?Track 4:[1:18:45] Nice.Track 5:[1:18:46] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:48] Right?Track 5:[1:18:49] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:50] Kirk.Track 5:[1:18:51] Yeah. MVP? Thinking about us, man.Track 3:[1:18:54] Good call.Track 5:[1:18:55] That tune, just thinking about us. It's thinking about us. That's all I need to say.Track 2:[1:19:01] You didn't have to hesitate at all. Wow.Track 5:[1:19:04] No.Track 2:[1:19:06] Justin, how are you going to react to the question? Craig was very concerned and didn't want to say anything. Kirk was very resolute and just put a flag in her. And Justin, where are you on this one? I'm giving you some time to think, so it's not really fair.Track 4:[1:19:25] Well, I don't need time to think. I just don't have an answer. I've been thinking about this since the first listen because I knew that this was coming. Um i will i i do have an answer um but i'll tell you the pics that i had wolf's home because it makes me think of my dad bedtime because of just the connection with my daughter and when this song or when this record came out um i love introduce yourself for the reasons that we talked about it's it's a great song about your buddy and and you know get me out of another jam please you know There was some interview that Gord did that he told Billy Ray. He goes, something happened with a guitar. And he goes, I will literally blow you if you fix this. I love Spoon, that song Spoon, because I really like the band. But I also like the story of going to the show with a kid. um but i'm gonna go with love over money because that's why we're all here in the first place yeah right good job justin yeah thank.Track 2:[1:20:37] You what bow you put in it love.Track 4:[1:20:39] It yeah yeah.Track 2:[1:20:42] And that brings us to the end of Introduce Yourself. Just a, you know, what a, I'm going to use the word again, what a gorgeous piece of work. And so memorable and so thoughtful. And, you know, this is the last stuff he recorded. It's really, really quite heavy. And we're sorry if we brought you down a little bit with these last two episodes, um but trust us we're celebrating this music we're not mourning we are celebrating and.Track 3:[1:21:23] Jd i want to thank you one more time for bringing me on board for this project because this is the album that i told you right from the start has been sitting on my shelf and i needed i wanted to listen to it. It's been staring at me for years and I just couldn't do it. And I think maybe just having, you know, you guys along with the ride makes it, you know, easier to do.Track 2:[1:21:50] Thank you very much. Thank you for doing it.Track 4:[1:21:53] Yeah. I a hundred percent. Thank you. I, I didn't know about any other records, um, um that gourd had done um but i knew about this one and i was choosing to not listen to it you know i i wanted nothing to do with it um and i gotta be honest with you i'm glad it's over i'm glad it's behind us um i listened to this this album in its entirety probably 25 to 30 times um it's.Track 2:[1:22:22] A lot yeah.Track 4:[1:22:23] It's a lot and the last week or so um leading up to recording this i stopped listening completely um i had to stop it was just killing me and i started listening to um some of the older hip stuff and i started listening to some sadie stuff and i listened to conquering sun quite a bit um but i had to get away from the heaviness and go back to being a fan, because this was a hard one.Track 2:[1:22:57] Completely agree well on behalf of uh craig and justin and kirk it's me jd and we're saying goodbye for another week we'll be back we've just got a couple episodes left fellas we've got away is mine and we've got luster parfait and then we've got the finale and i'm getting excited about yeah.Track 4:[1:23:21] Hell yeah oh yeah yeah and you know it's gonna.Track 2:[1:23:26] Be a good time.Track 4:[1:23:27] I got it you know we got to give a shout out to our our social media following you guys are really starting to step up and kick ass lately and it's really re-energized all of us a lot um we're our group chat has been on fire the last several days as we record this because we're just like did you see this one did you see the message there did you see the email oh my god you know it's yeah we're obsessing over the rankings and it's it's great it's fun it's a lot of fun well.Track 5:[1:23:52] So it was so crazy too to get some like some you know some of the official accounts of these people that we were talking about are.Track 4:[1:24:01] Right are.Track 5:[1:24:02] Sharing some of the you know the links and stuff to some of these episodes and and uh we're getting just some great amazing comments you know through the right you guys mentioned social media you know instagram facebook and uh just i don't think any of us had that on our bingo cards when we woke up in the morning, you know?Track 2:[1:24:22] I didn't.Track 4:[1:24:27] Right. And the Sadies messaged you back today, Craig. That's cool.Track 2:[1:24:33] Holy shit.Track 4:[1:24:34] And JD's putting in the legwork tenfold over what we're doing.Track 2:[1:24:38] Stop.Track 4:[1:24:39] He's listening. He's throwing everything together and doing interviews and making all this happen. I mean, I don't know if any of us are getting rich off this.Track 2:[1:24:48] Oh, not fucking me.Track 4:[1:24:50] You know, JD is certainly reaping the benefits of, I think a lot of people are appreciating what you're doing and I know we are.Track 5:[1:24:57] Yeah, absolutely.Track 2:[1:24:59] It's a group effort, guys. It's a group effort, man. All right, folks. Pick up your shit.Track 1:[1:25:07] Thanks for listening to Discovering Downey. To find out more about the show and its host, visit DiscoveringDowney.com. You can email us at discoveringdowney at gmail.com. And hey, we're social. 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This week the gang gets together to discuss the rest of Inroduce Yerself.Transcript:Track 1:[0:00] Hey, it's Justin. You know and love us on the Discovering Downey podcast, right? So come hang out with us in person for the finale. Join us for Long Slice Brewing presents a celebration of Gord Downey at The Rec Room in downtown Toronto on Friday, July 19th. Craig is coming from Vancouver, Kirk is coming from LA, I'm driving from Vermont, and JD's like walking down the street or wherever he lives in Toronto. Tickets are available now on our website at discovererndowney.com, and when you get your tickets, that means you can come Come hang out with us and our very special guest, Patrick Downey, and you can bid on some incredibly cool silent auction items, all while jamming along with tragically hip cover band The Almost Hip, and most importantly, helping us raise money for the Gord Downey Fund for Brain Cancer Research. Crack open a long slice, put on some Gord tunes, take a journey with us on discovering Downey, and then crack open another long slice on July 19th and hang out with us in the six. I always wanted to sound cool and say that. For more information, follow us on all the socials and visit DiscoveringDowny.com. Christmas Day for Edgar. My dad always used to say just after the presents, well, it's as far away now as it will ever be. I'm thinking about that as the stewardess cracks the public address system. For those sitting in economy, there's no music for you today.Track 1:[1:21] Welcome, music lovers. Long Slice Brewery presents. Discovering Downey.Track 2:[1:31] Hey, it's JD here and welcome to Discovering Downey, an 11-part project with a focus on the music and poetry of Mr. Gord Downey. The late frontman of the Tragically Hip gave to the world an extensive solo discography on top of the hip's vocal local acrobats that wowed us for years. So far, he's released eight records in total, three of them posthumously. Now listen, you might be the biggest fan of the hip out there, but have you really listened to these solo records? Because I'm an inquisitive podcaster, I enlisted my friends, Craig, Justin, and Kirk, giant fans of the hip in their own right, to discover Downey with me, JD, as their host. Every week, we're going to get together and listen to one of Gord's records, working in chronological order. We discuss and dissect the album, the production, the lyrics, and we break it down song by song. This week we're going to be talking about the back half well plus two songs from the front half of introduce yourself justin my friend how are you doing on this gray fucking oh is it gray there toronto oh oh it's terrible all day maybe because i was wearing sunglasses wait a minute.Track 4:[2:55] It is it was the opposite of that here in in beautiful vermont today it's it was a beautiful day i I think it's going to be great for the rest of the week, though. So whatever you're getting today, we'll get tomorrow.Track 1:[3:05] Oh, that's weather with Justin. We'll be back with Craig and Traffic. Remember, news on the fives.Track 2:[3:12] Where in the world is Kirk from Fuckachino? How's it going, man?Track 5:[3:22] I am in Washington, D.C. Right now for work in a hotel room. so having some technical difficulties so my apologies but things are good and uh excited to continue the conversation greg.Track 2:[3:41] What say you things.Track 3:[3:44] Are going well a little uh a little tired after a night out uh watching the sadies last night so they played a small venue downtown and got to see the boys rock out and um yeah it was it was a pretty awesome show a big banner of Dallas in the background and yeah, some touching moments, but mostly they, they just rocked.Track 2:[4:03] I haven't been to a live show in a little while now.Track 4:[4:06] Super cool.Track 2:[4:12] All right, fellas, before we get into the music, I want to talk to you about an email that I got from an organization called Lake Fever Wilderness Company. Basically, the gist of this email is that the Lake Fever Wilderness Company has submitted all the paperwork required to City Hall to get At Riverdale Park East, here in Toronto, mere footsteps from my home, renamed Gord Downie Park. I saw an article on BlogTO, and then they also gave us a couple other links to stories. But I'm hoping that our little podcast here, that people who listen to it will hear this, and you know we can build some awareness around this somehow anything you want to say about this or comment about this are you jealous and ate in your town yes.Track 4:[5:17] That sounds like a great cause and um for what it's worth i love the song lake fever so.Track 2:[5:25] Right Right?Track 4:[5:26] Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's a, that's whatever we can do to help, man. That sounds great.Track 5:[5:31] Sounds very cool.Track 3:[5:32] I'm jealous. We, who do we get? Brian Adams Avenue.Track 2:[5:39] Probably already have it. Don't you?Track 3:[5:41] I don't know. I don't know. Maybe in England.Track 2:[5:45] Really? There's not a. Right mind-blowing to me one of the top songs of all time in terms of played, everything i do i do for you right, yeah but this is not a brian adams podcast this is a podcast called discovering downy and let's pick it up where we left off last time that puts us on side two of the first record With the very candid, my first self.Track 5:[6:47] I mean, just explains it like I remember it. And yeah. could feel all of those crazy, stupid emotions and, uh, could just totally wrap my head around and embrace, you know, the message that he was writing, you know, a piano forward tune again. You know, I think we talked about that the last one, uh, I love the vocal and the background that starts coming in uh you know echoing essentially the line um and then the last line is just classic so yeah uh it's a it's a brilliant tune in my assessment.Track 3:[7:28] Yeah, what I liked about it is that it really instantly just takes you to a place in your own life, whether the story is one you connect with or not, it takes you back to, you know, when you were in your teens or whatever. And that's what I appreciated about this song. Another thing before the echoing vocal you're talking about there's i just noticed today for the first time very very faintly in the opposite channel is something that sounds like a, a meowing cat i think it's a person but it's almost this little it's so subtle it's almost like one of those hearing tests you get where there's a little beep and you're like did i hear that but i listened a second time and there's something that comes in about 30 seconds before for the more noticeable vocal on the other side so i.Track 4:[8:19] Did not on that view yeah i listened to it today too actually and.Track 3:[8:24] Um i.Track 4:[8:26] Mean this this girl sounds cool as hell you know like he says in the song six years older so it's definitely you know she's his girlfriend but he may not be her boyfriend from what i'm picking up on you know like and and i certainly related to the you.Track 3:[8:41] Told me off and could she be responsible for uh hooking gourd on reading because he wanted to be like her.Track 4:[8:50] Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah interesting thought yeah yeah yeah i don't know again like i did feel a little awkward listening to this song let's.Track 2:[9:02] Move to the next track on the record you're ashore.Track 3:[9:05] Well this is probably the song i have the least to say about it's maybe the least memorable for me I think probably it's the type of song that if it's about you it's probably a maybe a bit of an inside joke or I'm not really sure what the you know what it's about who it's about, I appreciated the gentleness in his voice. I was glad that it was the length that it was because it was not my favorite. What did you guys think?Track 5:[9:38] I loved it me too i uh i i uh i mean it's the shortest song on the album it's a minute 30 you know the lyrics are simple it's you know essentially you're sure you're sure repeated and a few little straight lines but the brilliant in the very beginning is you know he's strumming and then it's the let flow it down i believe is what he says and uh yeah it's um Um, I think especially amongst this body of work amongst this album, like, you know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of piano, there's a lot of synths, there's even some beats and things of that nature. And it was kind of nice to just get a little short acoustic ditty in my opinion. But, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm a sucker for that. That's, uh, just like, just like back in the eighties, right? Every metal band had its little ballad. so uh i i love the ballads so.Track 4:[10:38] Yeah i don't know who it's about but it's an earworm i find myself humming the tune uh quite often and there's only a few words in the song so it's not like, you know like you said craig the lyrics aren't nothing about it is really memorable but it is it does get into your brain and it's an easy little like you could just walk through the the park and just sing that all day. But yeah, I mean, it's a minute 30 and that's about right.Track 2:[11:07] Yeah, that's about right. It's interesting you say that you couldn't determine who that's about, because I, so far, have really sucked at that game, listening to the first record. So, as we go into the second record, Gord lobs a softball at me, and even I know that this next track, Love Over Money, is about the fucking Tragically Hip.Track 4:[11:37] Damn right it is.Track 2:[11:39] Yeah who wants to go first here kirk.Track 5:[11:42] Yeah i'll go first um yeah i i you know uh i would say jd i've had a similar you know a similar experience in in trying i have little parentheses in my notes of who i think the note might be or the song might be too and i you know i can't even get specifics i just write like brother you know question mark things of that nature so this one was obvious what i loved about it as well and and i think i might have mentioned it on on the last of the first the first album it's such a pop it's like a synth pop tune is what i have and this is gonna sound weird but for whatever reason when i hear the song i think of that snl skit where you've You've got like Jimmy Fallon and they're all playing like they're doing that little, you know, they do the little dance.Track 2:[12:36] Oh, right, right, right.Track 5:[12:37] You know, when I heard this song, I, by the second time, I just, I couldn't get that shit out of my brain. So, but just beautiful lyrics talking about the band. So direct and so loving and so to the point. To me, an absolute, brilliant Gord Downie song. I mean, you know, just wonderful, wonderful song.Track 3:[13:06] The moment he said the line, we played to no one, and then no one plus one, I knew it was about the hip. Because I remember in 1996, a band I played in, we went across Canada two times that year, self-booked tours. And we ended up in Thunder Bay on one of the tours.Track 3:[13:24] And we played in a tiny club called crocs and rolls which is sort of like a legendary club in in thunder bay a guy named frank lefredo was the booker there who was kind of like a legend, in uh in music across canada and anyway frank um the first night we we played and we didn't draw much of a crowd and he said you know don't worry guys the you know first time the tragedy hit played here they played to to no one and then they played a second night and they got a couple more and the next night and you know they played i think three nights in a row on an early tour, and so that made us feel a little better and he and he um he felt bad about the the draw so when we came back um he found us a gig at another venue um for the for the drive back so that's the the memory that that comes up for me um and also the other thing the queen's jubilee uh so the reference to the um to the playing to the the deafening the husband of the queen um that would be that that show which i looked up and uh and yeah they played poets and interesting enough in that version of poets he changes the lyrics he censors himself a little bit i noticed so for the queen he he He changed bare-breasted to bare-chested, and there was one other change I can't recall.Track 4:[14:44] Yeah, it was a great performance. I remember seeing that. I wish that I had looked it up just to bring the memory of it back, but that line stuck out to me. I remember seeing that performance.Track 3:[14:57] And he used the laminar flow line as well in that version of Poets.Track 4:[15:01] Oh, that I didn't remember.Track 2:[15:04] Wow.Track 3:[15:05] Which ended up in Coke Machine Glow on Every Irrelevance.Track 4:[15:11] Yeah. Obviously, the bond between those five guys is unbreakable, and this song is funny, too. I laughed at this song the first time that I heard it and heard the lyrics. We missed death and marriage and a birth. I did notice the words hotel worth, which is kind of a preview to an upcoming thing. There's a song that actually got a lot of airplay here locally a few years ago. But yeah, yep, it did. Yep, it was on the radio two or three times a day for a couple months here.Track 3:[15:47] The love over money line um made me also think about the way that they split their royalties and i'm not sure if if it was like a 20 all the way around that would be my guess but but often the the lyricist will take 50 and then the people who wrote the music take the other 50 so you know maybe it's not that simple but the fact that all five of them were as far as i know listed on all all the all the credits sort of um you know over their career that's something that drives so many bands apart is that fight over you know well i wrote this i wrote this and like even in the band i spoke about a while ago like we had some really crazy discussions around royalties and who should get what and you know in my mind i've always been a equal share guy i don't care if you're the drummer if you're you know you wrote your part that's just you know then again i've not not like i'm making a ton of a ton of money in music or anything but but um it was nice to to see them stick together so long and the same five guys like what other band can you think of that released that many albums with the same lineup it's got to be a very very.Track 2:[17:02] Very short list.Track 3:[17:03] Like there may be some three pieces i mean but a five piece band think of all the potential for conflict and for you know one guy leaving it like no one there's some sleuthing.Track 2:[17:17] Some sonic sleuthing for you listeners out there send us an email at discovering downy at gmail.com with bands that have a lineup up that was consistent with at least 15 records released? Are there any? Is there a database that you could just plug that into and get it from?Track 3:[17:40] No idea. I mean, Aerosmith would be close, but they had that lineup change in the mid-career.Track 2:[17:49] Right.Track 3:[17:51] For one album anyways.Track 2:[17:53] Joe Perry left, right? Joe Perry and Brad Whitford.Track 3:[17:55] Yeah.Track 2:[17:57] Yeah, yeah. Okay, so the next track is You, Me, and the Bees. Do I go two for two here when I say this is an ode to the Boston Bruins? Yeah. And its ability to connect with your family, particularly in this case to Gord's brother, Patrick.Track 3:[21:03] That sounds about right to me.Track 2:[21:04] Take us away.Track 3:[21:06] Took me right to my childhood as well. And a good friend of mine, so my friend Blair and I, we played a game called hall hockey. Hockey's in my parents basement with you know those fisher price um bowling sets we take take one of the pins and a ball and we would just hit the ball back and forth and if you hit the wall you score and we had this ongoing game every time he came over and we would you know do the play by play and we were both oilers fans so you weren't allowed to be the oilers you had to choose another team and i'll never forget the quebec nordique if you were the nordique and you you know you'd be Stastny and then you pass over to to you know Michelle Goulet and as soon as Michelle Goulet, got the puck you know you're getting a shot in the balls every single time I don't know what it was but and um yeah and then Blair became a little bigger than me and started winning every single game and then we yeah we aged out of that game but anyways that's where it took me yeah what What about you guys?Track 4:[22:06] Oh man, this was me and my old man playing pond hockey. Yeah, I loved the song and I loved I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. And you know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton and you know, it's, I don't know, like Like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time. This song is that relationship. And, you know, and as a Habs fan, I freaking hate the Bruins, but I get it. You know, I totally get it. And, yeah, this is just a really cool song about your brother. You know, it's fun.Track 5:[22:57] Yeah, I loved the song. And I loved, I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. You know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton. And, you know, it's, I don't know, like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time, you know, and the song is that.Track 4:[23:30] I, um, I really liked how Gord's voice was very staccato and this, um, he was really kind of a minimalist with, you know, he didn't drag any of the, any of the, the lines out the Bruins. You know, like just very on the beat and kind of not screwing around. Or maybe this is screwing around for him, I guess. But, you know, he turned the word Bruins into Bruins, just one syllable. And I don't know, it felt like a different approach lyrically or sonically, I guess.Track 3:[24:02] Yeah, that phrasing really matched the style of the song too. That sort of, like the percussion that Kirk was talking about. It just, yeah, had that staccato feel.Track 5:[24:11] The phrasing, thanks for bringing that up, Craig. I had just recently watched the Juno Award tribute, Dallas Green and Sarah Harmer and Kevin Hearn, I believe it was, and I believe it was the Junos. And gore you guys both talked mentioned like the way he phrases like the way he takes his lyrics and will you know enunciate them to fit into the line it is like no one else right and then when you watch this tribute and you see her singing introduce yourself and trying to you know keep the cadence that that that gourd has i guess that's a good way to describe it there's a uh, a unique cadence to it so i i was blown away by that if you guys haven't seen it you you must watch it and then when they go into bob cajun and the harmonies are just incredible but like goosebumps you know it's so incredible and then especially when she comes in with that harmony But to hear her do the phrasing was wonderful as well, because that has to be difficult.Track 2:[25:25] Yeah, it's what we love about him, right? His ability to twist and turn and put round pegs into square holes or square pegs into round holes probably is more difficult, in fact. Snowflake has a haunting piano line that works well with Gord's almost pastime. What do you think of Snowflakes.Track 5:[25:46] Kirk? Yeah, Melancholy was my note. Again, the piano is used heavily throughout this whole album, but on this song in particular. My guess at who it is to is just a girlfriend is all I wrote. Um but uh the the other note that i wrote was the the woman leaned in to say goodbye but i don't remember his name and uh just the um where is gourd going with that you know i i uh i i wondered i wrote that down as a note so um but just again uh fully emotional song.Track 3:[26:34] Yeah i wondered if that was almost like a reference to maybe his fading memory yeah the oh yeah i was a bit puzzled by that too craig yeah it was a very eerie song and i really loved it i love the um the jangling sounds gave it like a really eerie feeling like you're in a i don't know like a haunted ballroom of some ancient house like i just picture this as a movie when I'm listening to it the the, vocal delivery makes me wonder if it was one of the later tracks that he he did and i really love the chorus and the the reverb they put on like just like in a natural there is a ton of reverb, like way too much reverb but it works really well it's so powerful when they do it on this album not something i would normally like um yeah his voice is is gorgeous in the song um a lot of feeling to the piano playing as well by by kevin um yeah and again i had a note about phrasing when he says my name and when he says goodbye it's kind of rushed and it made me wonder if it was just a lack of time just you know doing it in one take and not worrying too much about yeah about how it came off um but again that's what we love about you too yeah yeah.Track 5:[27:58] You i mean craig you sing when you play takes a lot of energy um so that's that's one thing that i wondered throughout this this album in particular when like if you just say you're looking at it on your phone and you're listening and you bring up the lyrics and you're you're you're questioning some of the enunciations i guess of some of the words but it's that's gourd and that's uh you know Him making it work for that particular song. And sometimes different than what the lyrics are written as. I don't know if that's just typo type stuff or if that's on purpose. this.Track 4:[28:37] So I actually, I don't know, my, my thought on this was that maybe this was, um, something that he was remembering from his childhood and maybe, um, with a, an older sibling or, a relative or somebody, you know, that he knew well. And, um, the thing that stood out to me.Track 4:[29:00] More was the, his recollection of the lake and, um, of the house and describing everything about the scene and that this woman is somebody, an acquaintance of whoever he's walking down the road with, and they're going to see her. Um, cause there's the line, she told me to go explore the quiet rooms. Uh, it like, so this is all right, kid, go check out the house. We got stuff to talk about you know um and i actually um somehow connected this to the you know affluent woman in the video for it's a good life if you don't weaken um my my head kind of went to that music video and i don't don't know why or where that happened but um it just felt to me like it that type of house and that type of, of meeting. And, you know, and then at the end of that video, Gord leans down and whisper something into her ear and, and then, then they walk out. I don't, I don't really know why that's where I went, but, um, it's sort of a mishmash of two different things. Yeah.Track 4:[30:13] So like there's the song that we'll get to called the lake. When I first heard that, I thought that was about the lake, But now I think this song might be about the lake. I don't know.Track 5:[30:23] Just the fact that when he writes his lyrics, like, yeah, he, it's inspired by something, but it may even have a different meaning than what it was inspired by for him. And I don't think he really intends for the listening audience to do anything other than interpret it for their own selves or application. So, um, you know, I, you just, I never got the feeling like he'd be offended by that.Track 2:[30:49] Yeah, I can't agree with you more. Again, that's one of these great things about this performer that we all love. We can get behind that. The next song is called A Better End, and it makes me sad. Lonesome for Gord, I suppose. How does it make you feel, Justin?Track 4:[31:17] Yeah, the same. I mean, it sounds a lot like the Man Machine Poem album. There's some melancholy in a lot of those songs. And this album came together in a different context, but it's musically a lot similar to or very similar to a lot of the songs on there. And there are connections with the lyrics, the line, for treasure or worse. That's in, is that in Man? or machine, one of the others. You know, where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed, that line crushes me every time I hear it.Track 2:[32:00] Repeat it?Track 4:[32:02] Where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed. And, you know, there's an end to that sentence, right? There's a finality in that one. And I don't know. I don't know who it's about. The song is called A Better End, but he says bitter. Um you know and that only at the very end of the song does it say the better end um so maybe there's some letting go you know i i i don't know yeah.Track 5:[32:37] I i uh i have a description written as dark melancholy but then my final note was a plea and that to me as i think you had mentioned, Craig, you know, maybe it was to a family member. And I kind of felt like it was to all family members and all of his like close friends, like, this is the letter, like, this is it. And so I just wrote a plea, question mark. And the beat, I think we talked about this before, you know it's it had the clock feeling to me throughout um and then like you had mentioned justin uh you know you you the title's a better end the the lyric that he uses is stay to the bitter end but it stayed in the bitter end and uh uh just uh, He's put out so much energy at this point, you know, because it is when they've recorded this, you know, it's 20, 2017. They've done the they've done the. The tours, he's done the secret path stuff like he knows what's coming, he knows the bitter end and he gave everything he could. And this is like his like, hey, somebody give me some energy for, you know, here for a better end.Track 3:[34:04] Yeah, I wondered if this was a close family member maybe saying to stay with me until the bitter end. Really, yeah, this was an emotional song, but it's also the type of song that's going to keep bringing me back to this album. I love this song. i found that again another powerful chorus with that big reverb sound and the way he belts out songs like this and snowflake and uh in the choruses is a real strength of this album nancy and yeah just a very powerful um i i had a note i would be interested to hear a heavy version of the song like a full band version um yeah but yeah haunting piano it gave me um secret path vibes it felt very much like musically could have been on secret path he.Track 4:[35:02] He hits a lot of different spots um um in his range too he sings very deeply and then he sings very high um there's There's a lot of, you know, he's probably in three octaves or maybe four during the song. Probably three.Track 2:[35:22] Yeah. So when I hear this song, I think of it, I think of an LP, like an old LP, like a 72, you know, RPM record. And I picture it being played on my grandparents' couch-sized hi-fi. It just sounds, it sounds old. It sounds authentic.Track 5:[35:50] Authentic it sounds like a needle you know the indie rock on the vinyl right it.Track 2:[35:56] Sounds like which sorry.Track 5:[35:57] It sounds like the needle on the vinyl it's just yeah it's you you and then you got that the dining you know the the dining room or whatever recording that's going on in the background and then and then it just sounds like they have the actual, you know the the needle and the vinyl that that that that static sound going it's it's brilliant it's a little soft guitar it's it's a sweet song it really is it's a sweet song yeah.Track 3:[36:28] And the way he sings it too it's almost like a bit of a like a shaky vocal like a bit of a warble to his voice which maybe it was actually maybe they added an effect to make to give it that vinyl quality to it. But I think maybe it's just his, I think it's just his performance. And when I say shaky, I mean, in a deliberate way, I talked last week about how I can't think of any singer who has as many qualities to his voice as Gord and he does it better than anyone. Yeah. Yeah.Track 2:[37:09] But then it did go away. You know, sort of, right? Yeah.Track 3:[37:17] When he wanted it to, yeah. He just gained so much control over his voice. He had power from early on, but then he developed different subtleties. And when he gets into an album like Secret Path, and he's singing sort of in character, he can just go into all these different places depending on the emotion of the song. And another note about Nancy is, first of all, I'm guessing it's about a sister. I didn't actually look up the names of his sisters, but that's just my guess. I liked how it talked about the beginning, the middle, and the end. And Gord forever being the storyteller. He's always thinking in terms of story. Just a little nugget I picked up. And the conversation at the beginning too when they're just starting to hit record he's talking about his cuff link.Track 4:[38:16] It's a good one.Track 2:[38:17] It is. It's really good. And I think on first listen, it would have been bottom third for me. And now it's firmly somewhere in the middle third. Like, it has a crack top third for me. But, you know, it's moved up for sure.Track 4:[38:36] Yeah.Track 3:[38:37] I feel like this album gets better as it goes on. I actually prefer the second half.Track 5:[38:42] That's fair.Track 3:[38:43] Um i think at first i really enjoyed the first half more maybe because i was really preparing for that first half um for our pod but i i love the the second half yeah i.Track 4:[38:57] Actually very much agree with that i think for me it starts to really get good at you're ashore and like i said it's it's a kind of a forgettable song but the the tone sort of changes isn't that wild yeah well.Track 2:[39:11] We are at the last song of the first side the remarkably upbeat think my about us.Track 5:[41:21] This is brilliant. This song is brilliant for me from the first listen to the critical listens in the middle to listening again just recently before this. And just the way it made me feel, the swagger it had, the message it had, um that just incredible descending piano line um it it was uh it it it's up there for me it's really really really up there i love love this tune i.Track 3:[42:03] Agree this is a masterful song really it's just it comes at a place on the album.Track 3:[42:11] Where you really need something that's a little, kind of cute is the word i'll use and you've got that little piano melody that almost just sounds like a finger exercise you would do if you're learning how to play piano and some really cool sounds on the synth or maybe it's a theremin but i'm pretty sure it's a synth, and i also had a note that the the drums enter in an interesting way the bass and drums come in and just maybe a spot you're not quite ready for and yeah just just like a playful song that i really enjoy just super catchy i i wish the world could hear this music like i wish more people, would give this a chance because it should be words were i mean maybe this is my thesis for the end of this whole thing but gourd's work should be appreciated like like josh even said like they're both up they're both equal they're both amazing yeah.Track 4:[43:09] I had the word super catchy exactly the same in my in my notes and i really don't have a lot of other notes about this song but i i can't stop listening to it i know that um it's a yeah it's a it's a and you're right craig it came at the right time um in the sequencing um it was needed in this spot.Track 3:[43:31] It's a little heavy before that.Track 2:[43:32] Right?Track 3:[43:33] Yeah, and it's going to get heavy again. Yep, that's right. Really heavy.Track 2:[43:37] I learned a really valuable... I gained access to some valuable experience today, when I was preparing for this recording, because it's the first time that I've flipped the record over, and had to tackle the final five songs that we ever get to hear from Gord Downie, or so we thought at the time. You know, like, we didn't know there was going to be posthumous releases.Track 5:[44:17] Right.Track 2:[44:19] We knew he wrote this right before he passed, So either way, you know, it's fucking heavy. Craig, when you think of The Road, do you think of that as heavy?Track 5:[44:35] Yes.Track 3:[44:36] Wow, The Road, this song destroys me. Again, there's a bit of a theme on the album in a few songs about The Road, about missing out on life events. Yes. On, you know, the sacrifice. Of you know being a touring musician um you know a dream that i had when i was young and it didn't work out and you know i'm you know thankful for the life i have um and you know i'm sure gourd was as well but man like it had to be there had to be some really tough times being out away from your family all the time and missing things and um anyways this song is so good and the um the thing i want to say about this is when the drums come in there's no hi-hat it's just sort of kick and snare and that space really sets the the mood for this song um you know along with you know the piano of course um and there's one line i want to point out the machines are somewhat suitable now um you know is that is that the hospital machines is it is it a reference to man machine poem um i'm not sure but but this song like.Track 3:[46:06] Depresses me almost as much as the the book the road which destroyed me when i was um a young parent uh you know or not you know i wasn't young but my my son was young and if you you know um cormac mccarthy's the road it is absolutely devastating it is the a book that took me well i've never gotten over it really and the movie as well i watched the movie and it took me about six months to watch the movie i had to watch it like a little bit at a time when i was in the right headspace and it just it is if you haven't read it's maybe don't but it's incredible um but this this yeah if you name something the road it's probably going to destroy me well.Track 4:[46:51] So I had a bit of an awakening about three years ago when in May of 2021, my wife had something that she had to do at work late at night or 8 o'clock, 9 o'clock, whatever. And she couldn't be home to make dinner. And it was like a Tuesday or something. I don't know. And she messaged me during the day and said, you need to be home and make Evelyn dinner tonight. night. Evelyn's our daughter. And at the time she was, uh, almost four and I got home and I realized, holy shit, I've never made dinner for my daughter before. Um, I was working 80 hours a week and I was missing everything. And my wife had an Instagram account for our daughter. And that was the only way that I was keeping up. I lived in the same house, but I wasn't in the same family. You know what I mean? And yeah, the song brings all that back and made a big life change that very night. I sent a long message to my boss and said, we got to talk tomorrow, but I'm going to get it all out right now. Cause if I didn't say it now, I'm not going to say it. And I told him I'm done at the end of the year. I've I'll stick with you for my commitment through this year, but but I'd put 10 years into my job and missed everything in that 10 years. And, um.Track 4:[48:16] Give Gord another three decades on top of that. Um, I don't know who the song's about and I guess it doesn't matter, but, um, but obviously it matters, but, um, yeah, I, I really identified with the missing everything and even going back to the song about, um, uh, what is it? Love over money, um, about the band, you know, we missed funerals and births and all this stuff. And yeah, that's me. I've been there, man. I've, I still, to some degree, I'm there a little bit, but, um, yeah, I missed my daughter's first four years of her life.Track 5:[48:54] Everyone knows in this group here, I'm on the road all the time. I'm talking to you from a hotel room in, in Washington, DC. And, um, and so, I mean, Justin, I think this is actually a letter to the road and a letter to everyone that he's been on the road with, including his wife, his part, you know, his, his kids, his bandmates. It's, it's that, you know, that's that life you choose, you know, whether it's a traveling musician, whether it's a a traveling salesman, whether it's a, you know, a producer. Um, and, and, and it's, uh, it's tough, but when you're not on the road, if you are a road person, it's your, your, you know, jittery, you're nervous, but how do you, how do you give to your family and to yourself and to your job and to your art? And, uh, he wouldn't have been able to do that without the road. So but you know it's a blessing and a curse um i we mentioned this about another song here and this one i wrote was also a song that could have been on secret path was the note for me.Track 4:[50:17] Yeah yeah but musically yeah again.Track 5:[50:19] We there's not enough hours in the day right lads to uh just talk about the amazing insight and that we have it here you know to listen to to watch to read to just just beautiful.Track 4:[50:36] Well there's there's that point where you know you're you're young and and full of energy and you've got these huge goals and then you start to achieve them and then at the same time you have this other life going on behind the scenes that has always played second fiddle to that and then you realize at some point you're too deep into the pursuit to stop now but that this other life that was didn't even exist when you started uh has now taken the spot you know is number one on your on your pecking order and how the hell do you make that change without destroying everything that you've created you know yep.Track 5:[51:14] Oh you are the bird.Track 2:[51:18] Yeah it's uh it's a slow and lovely song right what do you think about it kirk to.Track 5:[51:28] Me this this was uh uh, uh, just a letter. It seemed like a letter to a sibling, right? You, you became the bird you, uh, and then it just, it made sense. And, uh, um, um.Track 5:[51:44] I, it, it starts getting heavy after a while, right? When you, when we break, I mean, we talked about it with the last week when we talked about the first one and how emotional it was and, you know, here we are, you know, however many songs in and you just, you stop. And like you said, you know, JD, it was like, these are the last five tunes and it's, it's, it's almost hard to embrace, um, and think about without just getting, you know, overwhelmed. I, I think it is, I think largely because of the love we have for, uh, you know, what, what, what Gord Downie has done solo and with the hip and, and in jazz as a human. So, um, but, uh, yeah, just, uh, you know, Another note was, again, I think I mentioned it earlier, just lyrics that are written different than what is being sung. And I didn't know if that was on purpose. I think I mentioned that. And I didn't know if it was something Gord was trying to do on purpose. Or it's probably nothing. It's probably just what was written and what was sung.Track 5:[53:04] You know, he probably had it written down as such and just like we do when you have a script in front of you, your brain has already chosen what the next word is going to be. So, anyway.Track 4:[53:15] I noticed that this shared a lot of similarities with Spoon from the first half where he talks about help being the only reason why we're here. You help others and the child in the song Spoon is, I guess, tasked with the same thing. I don't know if task is the right word, but this is a common thread throughout the album. And this lyrically shares a lot with that song.Track 3:[53:48] Yeah. I agree, Justin. That was my real only, my only real note on this song was that, that, you know, it's the only reason we're here. And that seems to be like, yeah, like if I had to break down this album into one message, that would be, I mean, other than like a goodbye and, uh, you know, uh, a lot, you know, a love letter to his close ones. Um, that is like the, yeah, the summation of this album. I also thought probably about A Child, the song, and also there's the line about he was the bird, he passed it down, you want to help people out. So, you know, he's referencing not only the person he's talking to, but someone, maybe another family member, a grandfather or someone who's passed down that quality that, he respects.Track 4:[54:35] There's one of my mentors. I kind of think of him as a father figure. His name is John Adams and he was a very bottom level race car driver around these parts. And, he and my father were about the same age and they were friends. And I started hanging out with John when I was 13 or 14 years old, trying to learn how to work on race cars. And there was one night he went off, he got pushed off the racetrack and he's, you know, this massive six foot six, 300 pound guy. And he comes barreling out of the car and climbs up to the top of the racetrack and gives a, gives the driver that, that wronged him the double bird. So he became the bird man that night. Um, that was his, that was his nickname. And so everybody calls him bird. And, you know, I thought, wouldn't that be silly if he passed his nickname down to me somehow, how you know because he doesn't all of his all of his kids are girls and i'm kind of like his sort of son um i don't think that's going to happen but i i know the song isn't made to laugh, but i laughed thinking about that that's.Track 2:[55:42] A nice memory though yeah.Track 4:[55:44] He's still with us he's still with us flipping people off all the time, yeah i.Track 5:[55:51] Love that the lake.Track 2:[58:56] Yeah, this one's a fucking tearjerker to me. So proceed with caution on this one. Justin?Track 4:[59:04] Yeah. I kind of mentioned it before that I thought that this song was about Lake Ontario, which has been such a constant theme throughout Gord's entire career with the hip and with the solo stuff. And there's so many references to the lake. Um but this song is not about the lake this song is is about his daughter willow i mean that's right at the end of the song uh i realized today you are lake ontario the love of my life you are willow and then he does this fantastic call and answer thing with his own you know backup vocals um saying willow over and over again and it's like wow this one this one is something um it's a it's a beautiful song um it's just gorgeous um and yes he does describe the lake or a lake um but all these same qualities could be about your child and man it's uh it's a crusher very.Track 5:[1:00:09] Astute observation mr justin that's uh i i think spot on um and as you mentioned you know it's obviously and and to compare the two is is that there's no disservice in that he loves them both dearly so um i loved how the keys on this made it feel like you were on the lake like you listen to the.Track 4:[1:00:37] Song and you feel like.Track 5:[1:00:39] You're floating in you know in a boat a canoe whatever on the lake and you hear the lake in that song. Um, absolutely amazing. Absolutely amazing.Track 4:[1:00:55] You know, I, I grew up on the water. Um, Lake Champlain is, they call it the sixth great lake. Um, and that's, I can see it out the window. Um, and my family had a camp on a little lake, uh, Hall's lake. And my wife grew up on a lake in Ohio, Guilford lake. And we go there They're three, four, five times a year. We're headed there next week. And she also came to Vermont working at a summer camp for, I think, seven summers on Lake Fairley, which is a gorgeous resort area. And so on first hearing this song, The Lake, and probably the first 10 times I heard it, I was like, man, I can see it. And then I picked up on the willow thing after, you know, 11th on my 11th listen, I guess. And I was like, Oh no, it's just something completely different. But if it is just about the lake, Oof, that's just as devastating and lovely.Track 3:[1:01:57] Yeah, I also grew up near a lake. Our house in Peachland, which my parents still live in, overlooks Okanagan Lake, which is a very large lake. And yeah, it just brings back memories. And it is maybe my favorite spot on earth. Right across the lake from where we live is a small island. There's no roads. There's no power. There's no development on the other side of the lake. And it's just a place that we would boat to when I was a kid and try to get over there every summer. And it's just, you know, this song takes me there. And also, you know, with the mention of his daughter at the end and, you know, the, you're the love of my life and it, yeah, it's just a beautiful song.Track 2:[1:02:46] It's gorgeous. Kirk?Track 5:[1:02:49] Again, we've said it already. you know these last five songs are they're crushers it's like it it was really hard to listen to them in succession like i really needed to stop you know this these last two far far away and blurred i you know my my my space that i left for what is supposed to be my guess of who it is who the song is to the letters to, is blank. And it is blank because to me it could be anyone. Maybe it was obvious to one of you guys, but I really felt like it was almost like a letter to everyone.Track 5:[1:03:34] We smile. All that we've been through, up and down for sure, onwards and upwards, up close, far away, and blurred. Um, the tempo changes in this song are amazing. It goes into a, a swing almost during the chorus. Um, and, uh, I, I, again, just the instrumentation and the, the combination of what, you know, uh, you know, obviously not just, um, Gordon, Kevin, but, you know, the others that contributed as well. So just add, I think, to each one of these letters, as it were, you know, as they started out. What'd you think about Far Away and Blurred, Craig?Track 3:[1:04:25] I really love this song. Another strong song on the second half of this album. And I almost wondered if maybe it could be another touring song, or maybe he's talking about traveling with his family. Great melody. And I agree with what you said, Kirk, when it changes tempo halfway through the song, and the drums come in with that slow beat, and the echo the the vocals are echoing and i i found that part very powerful and it's like, again i just can't, get over the the brilliance of his work it is like so emotional um and there's this like guitar pattern going on that's really really cool in the background as well and yeah and justin you yeah.Track 4:[1:05:20] I i guess i'm echoing what you guys have said um it's just a if i mean it's a little bit upbeat um for a hot minute there and again comes at a at a place where you need it um Um, yeah, it's, it's lovely. It's how it's a guy who's frigging dying, um, and telling everybody how much he loves them and that he always has, whether, whether you're in view or not. Right. Um, yeah, the.Track 5:[1:05:53] Passion in his voice in the vocal, um, is just so palpable. And so it just, I mean, wrenching, but almost in a, just again, another reminder of just how amazing, how amazing every part and ounce of the art that comes out of this guy is just incredible, incredible.Track 3:[1:06:23] Yeah, JD, did you have anything to add for this one?Track 2:[1:06:26] I don't know if I could get anything out right now if I tried. it's.Track 3:[1:06:30] A tough one I.Track 2:[1:06:32] Think you know his voice in the verses I've got written down that it's playful and painful at the same time, and you know it builds the chorus is obviously as powerful a gourd voice as we've heard in almost any song on this record, We'll get more of that in later records that we'll discuss in future episodes, but yeah, it's a great song, but it's the second-to-last song, and the North is a really powerful way to end. A callback to Secret Path and The Bridge. But overall, it's an interesting tracking decision. It can't be a coincidence. Right, Justin?Track 4:[1:11:07] No, of course it's not. It's a reminder. It's like he spent a good portion of that final show in Kingston reminding everybody to pay attention and to keep paying attention. And that's exactly what this song is. is it's it's uh yeah i did secret path but keep going forward keep talking about it keep moving keep changing um keep trying to figure this out um you know i don't know if we i don't think we've said this on air but when we first started talking about this album there i i mentioned to you guys in our in our group chat that i thought this was some of the songs on this album were like a stream of consciousness and i think i know that there's the video of of them recording this song and i know that it's not a stream of consciousness but i think when he was writing this song, what he wrote down is whatever came to his head first and i'm going to find a song to to put it to and i got to get this message out i don't care if it's rhymes or makes sense musically or what This has to be said again and again and again and again. And good on him, you know. Yeah.Track 3:[1:12:22] Yeah. So he makes the reference to, um, you know, a place West of, of James Bay, which would be Ottawa, Piscat, which of course the hip have, have the song about. And, um, I, I, I'm wondering if this song is either about or to Joseph Boyden, the author who, at the same time secret path was released, released a book called when Jack, um, I didn't mention him on the secret path episode only because there is some controversy you can look it up if you're interested but calling his um his roots into you know question um you know people questioning that he may not be in fact indigenous so you know that's definitely something you can kind of look into yourself but um joseph boyden is famous for a book called three day road and And just an interesting little thing that I came across about a week ago was a story related to this. So this story, Three Day Road, is about from just, I haven't read the book, but I've read a different story about a sniper in World War I named Francis Paganagabo. And he was nicknamed Peggy. And he has more kills than any sniper in North America.Track 3:[1:13:44] And his story is relatively unknown. And it's a really fascinating story. And anyways, I was reading a short story about that last week and then made this discovery about the connection to Joseph Boyden. Anyways, I highly encourage you to check out a story called Peggy. There's actually a podcast too by CBC called This Place. which is 150 years of Canadian history told by indigenous voices. And the episode on Peggy is incredible.Track 5:[1:14:19] The line Canada, we should have never called Canada. Um, I thought was pretty bold as well to put out there as you guys all had been mentioning, you know, obviously when he had addressed the crowd, you know, at several of the shows and, and several of his interviews. So I think that's, uh, bold, but expected. So I, I, uh, I think we all appreciate that. He would, would, go out there to this level.Track 3:[1:14:51] Yeah there's definitely a call back to that that statement in the last show that he made to the prime minister and i always um really admired that and, i always wondered what it would be like if an american artist did the same thing, you know like a high profile of bruce springsteen or someone went out and said something like that just the absolute division that would that would ensue um yeah yeah oh.Track 5:[1:15:18] Yeah I was going to say the dick and chicks are a good example.Track 3:[1:15:22] Of it.Track 4:[1:15:22] Happening.Track 5:[1:15:23] So but yeah.Track 4:[1:15:27] Or the opposite of that lady antebellum who's then sued the person that they stole their name from well fellas.Track 2:[1:15:36] It's time to ask the question will you be keeping this record in your rotation.Track 4:[1:15:44] I'm going to say not all the time And it's got nothing to do with the music. It's the subject. It's the heaviness of it. It's I don't want to, I don't want to be down. Um, there are some songs on this, on this record that are frigging awesome. They're all, they're all very good, but you know, there's some songs that certainly fit into the hip like catalog.Track 2:[1:16:07] Sure. And you can add them to your mixtape, right?Track 4:[1:16:10] Exactly. And that's probably how I'll consume them. Um, but this is going to be something that I listened to once every couple of years, maybe.Track 5:[1:16:19] Yeah, it's a commitment. I was just going to say it's a commitment. So I would answer very similarly to what Justin said. Even for this particular purpose of this podcast, it was heavy listening every time, every time you went through it. And so definitely some tunes I want to keep hearing regularly, but it's not something that I would. All i have on regular rotation like like i would would some of the others that that have definitely been fantastic in my opinion i.Track 3:[1:16:58] Agree with you guys i i definitely will come back to this album, um considering i gave it you know it took me six and a half years just to give it a first listen i'm definitely not going to wait that long um but i think i'll just have to be in the right frame of mind to put it on but i absolutely will i really do love it in fact coming up with an mvp track for this is definitely the hardest decision i've had to make i was hoping we were going to do one last week and one this week but so i'm it's going to be a last uh last second decision i was.Track 4:[1:17:31] Hoping jd would forget the question this time.Track 2:[1:17:33] I've got it written down so i don't forget my My memory is so piss poor.Track 3:[1:17:39] Right in on your hand.Track 2:[1:17:40] I call it a format sheet, but for real, it's cheating. Craig, we're going to stick with you. And we're going to go to MVP track.Track 3:[1:17:48] I want to know what they say first. So to clarify, is this my absolute favorite track or is this the track that I want to put onto a mixtape?Track 2:[1:18:00] It can be, that can be your interpretation. It can, it's the most valuable player. It's the, you know.Track 3:[1:18:07] So I had so many I mean my first instinct was a natural but I think I'm going to have to go with Snowflake it's.Track 2:[1:18:17] So good it.Track 3:[1:18:18] Is such a powerful song to me and I love the chorus I love the way again that big reverb sound and it's just a really gorgeous song and takes me you know visually takes me somewhere.Track 2:[1:18:36] We could definitely overuse the word gorgeous on this record because there's so much gorgeosity on it, you know?Track 4:[1:18:45] Nice.Track 5:[1:18:46] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:48] Right?Track 5:[1:18:49] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:50] Kirk.Track 5:[1:18:51] Yeah. MVP? Thinking about us, man.Track 3:[1:18:54] Good call.Track 5:[1:18:55] That tune, just thinking about us. It's thinking about us. That's all I need to say.Track 2:[1:19:01] You didn't have to hesitate at all. Wow.Track 5:[1:19:04] No.Track 2:[1:19:06] Justin, how are you going to react to the question? Craig was very concerned and didn't want to say anything. Kirk was very resolute and just put a flag in her. And Justin, where are you on this one? I'm giving you some time to think, so it's not really fair.Track 4:[1:19:25] Well, I don't need time to think. I just don't have an answer. I've been thinking about this since the first listen because I knew that this was coming. Um i will i i do have an answer um but i'll tell you the pics that i had wolf's home because it makes me think of my dad bedtime because of just the connection with my daughter and when this song or when this record came out um i love introduce yourself for the reasons that we talked about it's it's a great song about your buddy and and you know get me out of another jam please you know There was some interview that Gord did that he told Billy Ray. He goes, something happened with a guitar. And he goes, I will literally blow you if you fix this. I love Spoon, that song Spoon, because I really like the band. But I also like the story of going to the show with a kid. um but i'm gonna go with love over money because that's why we're all here in the first place yeah right good job justin yeah thank.Track 2:[1:20:37] You what bow you put in it love.Track 4:[1:20:39] It yeah yeah.Track 2:[1:20:42] And that brings us to the end of Introduce Yourself. Just a, you know, what a, I'm going to use the word again, what a gorgeous piece of work. And so memorable and so thoughtful. And, you know, this is the last stuff he recorded. It's really, really quite heavy. And we're sorry if we brought you down a little bit with these last two episodes, um but trust us we're celebrating this music we're not mourning we are celebrating and.Track 3:[1:21:23] Jd i want to thank you one more time for bringing me on board for this project because this is the album that i told you right from the start has been sitting on my shelf and i needed i wanted to listen to it. It's been staring at me for years and I just couldn't do it. And I think maybe just having, you know, you guys along with the ride makes it, you know, easier to do.Track 2:[1:21:50] Thank you very much. Thank you for doing it.Track 4:[1:21:53] Yeah. I a hundred percent. Thank you. I, I didn't know about any other records, um, um that gourd had done um but i knew about this one and i was choosing to not listen to it you know i i wanted nothing to do with it um and i gotta be honest with you i'm glad it's over i'm glad it's behind us um i listened to this this album in its entirety probably 25 to 30 times um it's.Track 2:[1:22:22] A lot yeah.Track 4:[1:22:23] It's a lot and the last week or so um leading up to recording this i stopped listening completely um i had to stop it was just killing me and i started listening to um some of the older hip stuff and i started listening to some sadie stuff and i listened to conquering sun quite a bit um but i had to get away from the heaviness and go back to being a fan, because this was a hard one.Track 2:[1:22:57] Completely agree well on behalf of uh craig and justin and kirk it's me jd and we're saying goodbye for another week we'll be back we've just got a couple episodes left fellas we've got away is mine and we've got luster parfait and then we've got the finale and i'm getting excited about yeah.Track 4:[1:23:21] Hell yeah oh yeah yeah and you know it's gonna.Track 2:[1:23:26] Be a good time.Track 4:[1:23:27] I got it you know we got to give a shout out to our our social media following you guys are really starting to step up and kick ass lately and it's really re-energized all of us a lot um we're our group chat has been on fire the last several days as we record this because we're just like did you see this one did you see the message there did you see the email oh my god you know it's yeah we're obsessing over the rankings and it's it's great it's fun it's a lot of fun well.Track 5:[1:23:52] So it was so crazy too to get some like some you know some of the official accounts of these people that we were talking about are.Track 4:[1:24:01] Right are.Track 5:[1:24:02] Sharing some of the you know the links and stuff to some of these episodes and and uh we're getting just some great amazing comments you know through the right you guys mentioned social media you know instagram facebook and uh just i don't think any of us had that on our bingo cards when we woke up in the morning, you know?Track 2:[1:24:22] I didn't.Track 4:[1:24:27] Right. And the Sadies messaged you back today, Craig. That's cool.Track 2:[1:24:33] Holy shit.Track 4:[1:24:34] And JD's putting in the legwork tenfold over what we're doing.Track 2:[1:24:38] Stop.Track 4:[1:24:39] He's listening. He's throwing everything together and doing interviews and making all this happen. I mean, I don't know if any of us are getting rich off this.Track 2:[1:24:48] Oh, not fucking me.Track 4:[1:24:50] You know, JD is certainly reaping the benefits of, I think a lot of people are appreciating what you're doing and I know we are.Track 5:[1:24:57] Yeah, absolutely.Track 2:[1:24:59] It's a group effort, guys. It's a group effort, man. All right, folks. Pick up your shit.Track 1:[1:25:07] Thanks for listening to Discovering Downey. To find out more about the show and its host, visit DiscoveringDowney.com. You can email us at discoveringdowney at gmail.com. And hey, we're social. Check us out.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/gettinghiptothehip/exclusive-contentAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

This week the gang gets together to discuss the rest of Inroduce Yerself. Transcript: Track 1:[0:00] Hey, it's Justin. You know and love us on the Discovering Downey podcast, right? So come hang out with us in person for the finale. Join us for Long Slice Brewing presents a celebration of Gord Downey at The Rec Room in downtown Toronto on Friday, July 19th. Craig is coming from Vancouver, Kirk is coming from LA, I'm driving from Vermont, and JD's like walking down the street or wherever he lives in Toronto. Tickets are available now on our website at discovererndowney.com, and when you get your tickets, that means you can come Come hang out with us and our very special guest, Patrick Downey, and you can bid on some incredibly cool silent auction items, all while jamming along with tragically hip cover band The Almost Hip, and most importantly, helping us raise money for the Gord Downey Fund for Brain Cancer Research. Crack open a long slice, put on some Gord tunes, take a journey with us on discovering Downey, and then crack open another long slice on July 19th and hang out with us in the six. I always wanted to sound cool and say that. For more information, follow us on all the socials and visit DiscoveringDowny.com. Christmas Day for Edgar. My dad always used to say just after the presents, well, it's as far away now as it will ever be. I'm thinking about that as the stewardess cracks the public address system. For those sitting in economy, there's no music for you today.Track 1:[1:21] Welcome, music lovers. Long Slice Brewery presents. Discovering Downey.Track 2:[1:31] Hey, it's JD here and welcome to Discovering Downey, an 11-part project with a focus on the music and poetry of Mr. Gord Downey. The late frontman of the Tragically Hip gave to the world an extensive solo discography on top of the hip's vocal local acrobats that wowed us for years. So far, he's released eight records in total, three of them posthumously. Now listen, you might be the biggest fan of the hip out there, but have you really listened to these solo records? Because I'm an inquisitive podcaster, I enlisted my friends, Craig, Justin, and Kirk, giant fans of the hip in their own right, to discover Downey with me, JD, as their host. Every week, we're going to get together and listen to one of Gord's records, working in chronological order. We discuss and dissect the album, the production, the lyrics, and we break it down song by song. This week we're going to be talking about the back half well plus two songs from the front half of introduce yourself justin my friend how are you doing on this gray fucking oh is it gray there toronto oh oh it's terrible all day maybe because i was wearing sunglasses wait a minute.Track 4:[2:55] It is it was the opposite of that here in in beautiful vermont today it's it was a beautiful day i I think it's going to be great for the rest of the week, though. So whatever you're getting today, we'll get tomorrow.Track 1:[3:05] Oh, that's weather with Justin. We'll be back with Craig and Traffic. Remember, news on the fives.Track 2:[3:12] Where in the world is Kirk from Fuckachino? How's it going, man?Track 5:[3:22] I am in Washington, D.C. Right now for work in a hotel room. so having some technical difficulties so my apologies but things are good and uh excited to continue the conversation greg.Track 2:[3:41] What say you things.Track 3:[3:44] Are going well a little uh a little tired after a night out uh watching the sadies last night so they played a small venue downtown and got to see the boys rock out and um yeah it was it was a pretty awesome show a big banner of Dallas in the background and yeah, some touching moments, but mostly they, they just rocked.Track 2:[4:03] I haven't been to a live show in a little while now.Track 4:[4:06] Super cool.Track 2:[4:12] All right, fellas, before we get into the music, I want to talk to you about an email that I got from an organization called Lake Fever Wilderness Company. Basically, the gist of this email is that the Lake Fever Wilderness Company has submitted all the paperwork required to City Hall to get At Riverdale Park East, here in Toronto, mere footsteps from my home, renamed Gord Downie Park. I saw an article on BlogTO, and then they also gave us a couple other links to stories. But I'm hoping that our little podcast here, that people who listen to it will hear this, and you know we can build some awareness around this somehow anything you want to say about this or comment about this are you jealous and ate in your town yes.Track 4:[5:17] That sounds like a great cause and um for what it's worth i love the song lake fever so.Track 2:[5:25] Right Right?Track 4:[5:26] Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's a, that's whatever we can do to help, man. That sounds great.Track 5:[5:31] Sounds very cool.Track 3:[5:32] I'm jealous. We, who do we get? Brian Adams Avenue.Track 2:[5:39] Probably already have it. Don't you?Track 3:[5:41] I don't know. I don't know. Maybe in England.Track 2:[5:45] Really? There's not a. Right mind-blowing to me one of the top songs of all time in terms of played, everything i do i do for you right, yeah but this is not a brian adams podcast this is a podcast called discovering downy and let's pick it up where we left off last time that puts us on side two of the first record With the very candid, my first self.Track 5:[6:47] I mean, just explains it like I remember it. And yeah. could feel all of those crazy, stupid emotions and, uh, could just totally wrap my head around and embrace, you know, the message that he was writing, you know, a piano forward tune again. You know, I think we talked about that the last one, uh, I love the vocal and the background that starts coming in uh you know echoing essentially the line um and then the last line is just classic so yeah uh it's a it's a brilliant tune in my assessment.Track 3:[7:28] Yeah, what I liked about it is that it really instantly just takes you to a place in your own life, whether the story is one you connect with or not, it takes you back to, you know, when you were in your teens or whatever. And that's what I appreciated about this song. Another thing before the echoing vocal you're talking about there's i just noticed today for the first time very very faintly in the opposite channel is something that sounds like a, a meowing cat i think it's a person but it's almost this little it's so subtle it's almost like one of those hearing tests you get where there's a little beep and you're like did i hear that but i listened a second time and there's something that comes in about 30 seconds before for the more noticeable vocal on the other side so i.Track 4:[8:19] Did not on that view yeah i listened to it today too actually and.Track 3:[8:24] Um i.Track 4:[8:26] Mean this this girl sounds cool as hell you know like he says in the song six years older so it's definitely you know she's his girlfriend but he may not be her boyfriend from what i'm picking up on you know like and and i certainly related to the you.Track 3:[8:41] Told me off and could she be responsible for uh hooking gourd on reading because he wanted to be like her.Track 4:[8:50] Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah interesting thought yeah yeah yeah i don't know again like i did feel a little awkward listening to this song let's.Track 2:[9:02] Move to the next track on the record you're ashore.Track 3:[9:05] Well this is probably the song i have the least to say about it's maybe the least memorable for me I think probably it's the type of song that if it's about you it's probably a maybe a bit of an inside joke or I'm not really sure what the you know what it's about who it's about, I appreciated the gentleness in his voice. I was glad that it was the length that it was because it was not my favorite. What did you guys think?Track 5:[9:38] I loved it me too i uh i i uh i mean it's the shortest song on the album it's a minute 30 you know the lyrics are simple it's you know essentially you're sure you're sure repeated and a few little straight lines but the brilliant in the very beginning is you know he's strumming and then it's the let flow it down i believe is what he says and uh yeah it's um Um, I think especially amongst this body of work amongst this album, like, you know, there's a lot of, there's a lot of piano, there's a lot of synths, there's even some beats and things of that nature. And it was kind of nice to just get a little short acoustic ditty in my opinion. But, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm a sucker for that. That's, uh, just like, just like back in the eighties, right? Every metal band had its little ballad. so uh i i love the ballads so.Track 4:[10:38] Yeah i don't know who it's about but it's an earworm i find myself humming the tune uh quite often and there's only a few words in the song so it's not like, you know like you said craig the lyrics aren't nothing about it is really memorable but it is it does get into your brain and it's an easy little like you could just walk through the the park and just sing that all day. But yeah, I mean, it's a minute 30 and that's about right.Track 2:[11:07] Yeah, that's about right. It's interesting you say that you couldn't determine who that's about, because I, so far, have really sucked at that game, listening to the first record. So, as we go into the second record, Gord lobs a softball at me, and even I know that this next track, Love Over Money, is about the fucking Tragically Hip.Track 4:[11:37] Damn right it is.Track 2:[11:39] Yeah who wants to go first here kirk.Track 5:[11:42] Yeah i'll go first um yeah i i you know uh i would say jd i've had a similar you know a similar experience in in trying i have little parentheses in my notes of who i think the note might be or the song might be too and i you know i can't even get specifics i just write like brother you know question mark things of that nature so this one was obvious what i loved about it as well and and i think i might have mentioned it on on the last of the first the first album it's such a pop it's like a synth pop tune is what i have and this is gonna sound weird but for whatever reason when i hear the song i think of that snl skit where you've You've got like Jimmy Fallon and they're all playing like they're doing that little, you know, they do the little dance.Track 2:[12:36] Oh, right, right, right.Track 5:[12:37] You know, when I heard this song, I, by the second time, I just, I couldn't get that shit out of my brain. So, but just beautiful lyrics talking about the band. So direct and so loving and so to the point. To me, an absolute, brilliant Gord Downie song. I mean, you know, just wonderful, wonderful song.Track 3:[13:06] The moment he said the line, we played to no one, and then no one plus one, I knew it was about the hip. Because I remember in 1996, a band I played in, we went across Canada two times that year, self-booked tours. And we ended up in Thunder Bay on one of the tours.Track 3:[13:24] And we played in a tiny club called crocs and rolls which is sort of like a legendary club in in thunder bay a guy named frank lefredo was the booker there who was kind of like a legend, in uh in music across canada and anyway frank um the first night we we played and we didn't draw much of a crowd and he said you know don't worry guys the you know first time the tragedy hit played here they played to to no one and then they played a second night and they got a couple more and the next night and you know they played i think three nights in a row on an early tour, and so that made us feel a little better and he and he um he felt bad about the the draw so when we came back um he found us a gig at another venue um for the for the drive back so that's the the memory that that comes up for me um and also the other thing the queen's jubilee uh so the reference to the um to the playing to the the deafening the husband of the queen um that would be that that show which i looked up and uh and yeah they played poets and interesting enough in that version of poets he changes the lyrics he censors himself a little bit i noticed so for the queen he he He changed bare-breasted to bare-chested, and there was one other change I can't recall.Track 4:[14:44] Yeah, it was a great performance. I remember seeing that. I wish that I had looked it up just to bring the memory of it back, but that line stuck out to me. I remember seeing that performance.Track 3:[14:57] And he used the laminar flow line as well in that version of Poets.Track 4:[15:01] Oh, that I didn't remember.Track 2:[15:04] Wow.Track 3:[15:05] Which ended up in Coke Machine Glow on Every Irrelevance.Track 4:[15:11] Yeah. Obviously, the bond between those five guys is unbreakable, and this song is funny, too. I laughed at this song the first time that I heard it and heard the lyrics. We missed death and marriage and a birth. I did notice the words hotel worth, which is kind of a preview to an upcoming thing. There's a song that actually got a lot of airplay here locally a few years ago. But yeah, yep, it did. Yep, it was on the radio two or three times a day for a couple months here.Track 3:[15:47] The love over money line um made me also think about the way that they split their royalties and i'm not sure if if it was like a 20 all the way around that would be my guess but but often the the lyricist will take 50 and then the people who wrote the music take the other 50 so you know maybe it's not that simple but the fact that all five of them were as far as i know listed on all all the all the credits sort of um you know over their career that's something that drives so many bands apart is that fight over you know well i wrote this i wrote this and like even in the band i spoke about a while ago like we had some really crazy discussions around royalties and who should get what and you know in my mind i've always been a equal share guy i don't care if you're the drummer if you're you know you wrote your part that's just you know then again i've not not like i'm making a ton of a ton of money in music or anything but but um it was nice to to see them stick together so long and the same five guys like what other band can you think of that released that many albums with the same lineup it's got to be a very very.Track 2:[17:02] Very short list.Track 3:[17:03] Like there may be some three pieces i mean but a five piece band think of all the potential for conflict and for you know one guy leaving it like no one there's some sleuthing.Track 2:[17:17] Some sonic sleuthing for you listeners out there send us an email at discovering downy at gmail.com with bands that have a lineup up that was consistent with at least 15 records released? Are there any? Is there a database that you could just plug that into and get it from?Track 3:[17:40] No idea. I mean, Aerosmith would be close, but they had that lineup change in the mid-career.Track 2:[17:49] Right.Track 3:[17:51] For one album anyways.Track 2:[17:53] Joe Perry left, right? Joe Perry and Brad Whitford.Track 3:[17:55] Yeah.Track 2:[17:57] Yeah, yeah. Okay, so the next track is You, Me, and the Bees. Do I go two for two here when I say this is an ode to the Boston Bruins? Yeah. And its ability to connect with your family, particularly in this case to Gord's brother, Patrick.Track 3:[21:03] That sounds about right to me.Track 2:[21:04] Take us away.Track 3:[21:06] Took me right to my childhood as well. And a good friend of mine, so my friend Blair and I, we played a game called hall hockey. Hockey's in my parents basement with you know those fisher price um bowling sets we take take one of the pins and a ball and we would just hit the ball back and forth and if you hit the wall you score and we had this ongoing game every time he came over and we would you know do the play by play and we were both oilers fans so you weren't allowed to be the oilers you had to choose another team and i'll never forget the quebec nordique if you were the nordique and you you know you'd be Stastny and then you pass over to to you know Michelle Goulet and as soon as Michelle Goulet, got the puck you know you're getting a shot in the balls every single time I don't know what it was but and um yeah and then Blair became a little bigger than me and started winning every single game and then we yeah we aged out of that game but anyways that's where it took me yeah what What about you guys?Track 4:[22:06] Oh man, this was me and my old man playing pond hockey. Yeah, I loved the song and I loved I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. And you know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton and you know, it's, I don't know, like Like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time. This song is that relationship. And, you know, and as a Habs fan, I freaking hate the Bruins, but I get it. You know, I totally get it. And, yeah, this is just a really cool song about your brother. You know, it's fun.Track 5:[22:57] Yeah, I loved the song. And I loved, I could tell right away that the percussion was a hockey stick scraping on the ground. I loved it. You know, again, I laughed in this song several times and the line about the trading of George Thornton. And, you know, it's, I don't know, like, I'm so excited to get to meet Patrick Downey because it sounds like these guys just had fun the whole time, you know, and the song is that.Track 4:[23:30] I, um, I really liked how Gord's voice was very staccato and this, um, he was really kind of a minimalist with, you know, he didn't drag any of the, any of the, the lines out the Bruins. You know, like just very on the beat and kind of not screwing around. Or maybe this is screwing around for him, I guess. But, you know, he turned the word Bruins into Bruins, just one syllable. And I don't know, it felt like a different approach lyrically or sonically, I guess.Track 3:[24:02] Yeah, that phrasing really matched the style of the song too. That sort of, like the percussion that Kirk was talking about. It just, yeah, had that staccato feel.Track 5:[24:11] The phrasing, thanks for bringing that up, Craig. I had just recently watched the Juno Award tribute, Dallas Green and Sarah Harmer and Kevin Hearn, I believe it was, and I believe it was the Junos. And gore you guys both talked mentioned like the way he phrases like the way he takes his lyrics and will you know enunciate them to fit into the line it is like no one else right and then when you watch this tribute and you see her singing introduce yourself and trying to you know keep the cadence that that that gourd has i guess that's a good way to describe it there's a uh, a unique cadence to it so i i was blown away by that if you guys haven't seen it you you must watch it and then when they go into bob cajun and the harmonies are just incredible but like goosebumps you know it's so incredible and then especially when she comes in with that harmony But to hear her do the phrasing was wonderful as well, because that has to be difficult.Track 2:[25:25] Yeah, it's what we love about him, right? His ability to twist and turn and put round pegs into square holes or square pegs into round holes probably is more difficult, in fact. Snowflake has a haunting piano line that works well with Gord's almost pastime. What do you think of Snowflakes.Track 5:[25:46] Kirk? Yeah, Melancholy was my note. Again, the piano is used heavily throughout this whole album, but on this song in particular. My guess at who it is to is just a girlfriend is all I wrote. Um but uh the the other note that i wrote was the the woman leaned in to say goodbye but i don't remember his name and uh just the um where is gourd going with that you know i i uh i i wondered i wrote that down as a note so um but just again uh fully emotional song.Track 3:[26:34] Yeah i wondered if that was almost like a reference to maybe his fading memory yeah the oh yeah i was a bit puzzled by that too craig yeah it was a very eerie song and i really loved it i love the um the jangling sounds gave it like a really eerie feeling like you're in a i don't know like a haunted ballroom of some ancient house like i just picture this as a movie when I'm listening to it the the, vocal delivery makes me wonder if it was one of the later tracks that he he did and i really love the chorus and the the reverb they put on like just like in a natural there is a ton of reverb, like way too much reverb but it works really well it's so powerful when they do it on this album not something i would normally like um yeah his voice is is gorgeous in the song um a lot of feeling to the piano playing as well by by kevin um yeah and again i had a note about phrasing when he says my name and when he says goodbye it's kind of rushed and it made me wonder if it was just a lack of time just you know doing it in one take and not worrying too much about yeah about how it came off um but again that's what we love about you too yeah yeah.Track 5:[27:58] You i mean craig you sing when you play takes a lot of energy um so that's that's one thing that i wondered throughout this this album in particular when like if you just say you're looking at it on your phone and you're listening and you bring up the lyrics and you're you're you're questioning some of the enunciations i guess of some of the words but it's that's gourd and that's uh you know Him making it work for that particular song. And sometimes different than what the lyrics are written as. I don't know if that's just typo type stuff or if that's on purpose. this.Track 4:[28:37] So I actually, I don't know, my, my thought on this was that maybe this was, um, something that he was remembering from his childhood and maybe, um, with a, an older sibling or, a relative or somebody, you know, that he knew well. And, um, the thing that stood out to me.Track 4:[29:00] More was the, his recollection of the lake and, um, of the house and describing everything about the scene and that this woman is somebody, an acquaintance of whoever he's walking down the road with, and they're going to see her. Um, cause there's the line, she told me to go explore the quiet rooms. Uh, it like, so this is all right, kid, go check out the house. We got stuff to talk about you know um and i actually um somehow connected this to the you know affluent woman in the video for it's a good life if you don't weaken um my my head kind of went to that music video and i don't don't know why or where that happened but um it just felt to me like it that type of house and that type of, of meeting. And, you know, and then at the end of that video, Gord leans down and whisper something into her ear and, and then, then they walk out. I don't, I don't really know why that's where I went, but, um, it's sort of a mishmash of two different things. Yeah.Track 4:[30:13] So like there's the song that we'll get to called the lake. When I first heard that, I thought that was about the lake, But now I think this song might be about the lake. I don't know.Track 5:[30:23] Just the fact that when he writes his lyrics, like, yeah, he, it's inspired by something, but it may even have a different meaning than what it was inspired by for him. And I don't think he really intends for the listening audience to do anything other than interpret it for their own selves or application. So, um, you know, I, you just, I never got the feeling like he'd be offended by that.Track 2:[30:49] Yeah, I can't agree with you more. Again, that's one of these great things about this performer that we all love. We can get behind that. The next song is called A Better End, and it makes me sad. Lonesome for Gord, I suppose. How does it make you feel, Justin?Track 4:[31:17] Yeah, the same. I mean, it sounds a lot like the Man Machine Poem album. There's some melancholy in a lot of those songs. And this album came together in a different context, but it's musically a lot similar to or very similar to a lot of the songs on there. And there are connections with the lyrics, the line, for treasure or worse. That's in, is that in Man? or machine, one of the others. You know, where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed, that line crushes me every time I hear it.Track 2:[32:00] Repeat it?Track 4:[32:02] Where God walks with persons, even the may be doomed. And, you know, there's an end to that sentence, right? There's a finality in that one. And I don't know. I don't know who it's about. The song is called A Better End, but he says bitter. Um you know and that only at the very end of the song does it say the better end um so maybe there's some letting go you know i i i don't know yeah.Track 5:[32:37] I i uh i have a description written as dark melancholy but then my final note was a plea and that to me as i think you had mentioned, Craig, you know, maybe it was to a family member. And I kind of felt like it was to all family members and all of his like close friends, like, this is the letter, like, this is it. And so I just wrote a plea, question mark. And the beat, I think we talked about this before, you know it's it had the clock feeling to me throughout um and then like you had mentioned justin uh you know you you the title's a better end the the lyric that he uses is stay to the bitter end but it stayed in the bitter end and uh uh just uh, He's put out so much energy at this point, you know, because it is when they've recorded this, you know, it's 20, 2017. They've done the they've done the. The tours, he's done the secret path stuff like he knows what's coming, he knows the bitter end and he gave everything he could. And this is like his like, hey, somebody give me some energy for, you know, here for a better end.Track 3:[34:04] Yeah, I wondered if this was a close family member maybe saying to stay with me until the bitter end. Really, yeah, this was an emotional song, but it's also the type of song that's going to keep bringing me back to this album. I love this song. i found that again another powerful chorus with that big reverb sound and the way he belts out songs like this and snowflake and uh in the choruses is a real strength of this album nancy and yeah just a very powerful um i i had a note i would be interested to hear a heavy version of the song like a full band version um yeah but yeah haunting piano it gave me um secret path vibes it felt very much like musically could have been on secret path he.Track 4:[35:02] He hits a lot of different spots um um in his range too he sings very deeply and then he sings very high um there's There's a lot of, you know, he's probably in three octaves or maybe four during the song. Probably three.Track 2:[35:22] Yeah. So when I hear this song, I think of it, I think of an LP, like an old LP, like a 72, you know, RPM record. And I picture it being played on my grandparents' couch-sized hi-fi. It just sounds, it sounds old. It sounds authentic.Track 5:[35:50] Authentic it sounds like a needle you know the indie rock on the vinyl right it.Track 2:[35:56] Sounds like which sorry.Track 5:[35:57] It sounds like the needle on the vinyl it's just yeah it's you you and then you got that the dining you know the the dining room or whatever recording that's going on in the background and then and then it just sounds like they have the actual, you know the the needle and the vinyl that that that that static sound going it's it's brilliant it's a little soft guitar it's it's a sweet song it really is it's a sweet song yeah.Track 3:[36:28] And the way he sings it too it's almost like a bit of a like a shaky vocal like a bit of a warble to his voice which maybe it was actually maybe they added an effect to make to give it that vinyl quality to it. But I think maybe it's just his, I think it's just his performance. And when I say shaky, I mean, in a deliberate way, I talked last week about how I can't think of any singer who has as many qualities to his voice as Gord and he does it better than anyone. Yeah. Yeah.Track 2:[37:09] But then it did go away. You know, sort of, right? Yeah.Track 3:[37:17] When he wanted it to, yeah. He just gained so much control over his voice. He had power from early on, but then he developed different subtleties. And when he gets into an album like Secret Path, and he's singing sort of in character, he can just go into all these different places depending on the emotion of the song. And another note about Nancy is, first of all, I'm guessing it's about a sister. I didn't actually look up the names of his sisters, but that's just my guess. I liked how it talked about the beginning, the middle, and the end. And Gord forever being the storyteller. He's always thinking in terms of story. Just a little nugget I picked up. And the conversation at the beginning too when they're just starting to hit record he's talking about his cuff link.Track 4:[38:16] It's a good one.Track 2:[38:17] It is. It's really good. And I think on first listen, it would have been bottom third for me. And now it's firmly somewhere in the middle third. Like, it has a crack top third for me. But, you know, it's moved up for sure.Track 4:[38:36] Yeah.Track 3:[38:37] I feel like this album gets better as it goes on. I actually prefer the second half.Track 5:[38:42] That's fair.Track 3:[38:43] Um i think at first i really enjoyed the first half more maybe because i was really preparing for that first half um for our pod but i i love the the second half yeah i.Track 4:[38:57] Actually very much agree with that i think for me it starts to really get good at you're ashore and like i said it's it's a kind of a forgettable song but the the tone sort of changes isn't that wild yeah well.Track 2:[39:11] We are at the last song of the first side the remarkably upbeat think my about us.Track 5:[41:21] This is brilliant. This song is brilliant for me from the first listen to the critical listens in the middle to listening again just recently before this. And just the way it made me feel, the swagger it had, the message it had, um that just incredible descending piano line um it it was uh it it it's up there for me it's really really really up there i love love this tune i.Track 3:[42:03] Agree this is a masterful song really it's just it comes at a place on the album.Track 3:[42:11] Where you really need something that's a little, kind of cute is the word i'll use and you've got that little piano melody that almost just sounds like a finger exercise you would do if you're learning how to play piano and some really cool sounds on the synth or maybe it's a theremin but i'm pretty sure it's a synth, and i also had a note that the the drums enter in an interesting way the bass and drums come in and just maybe a spot you're not quite ready for and yeah just just like a playful song that i really enjoy just super catchy i i wish the world could hear this music like i wish more people, would give this a chance because it should be words were i mean maybe this is my thesis for the end of this whole thing but gourd's work should be appreciated like like josh even said like they're both up they're both equal they're both amazing yeah.Track 4:[43:09] I had the word super catchy exactly the same in my in my notes and i really don't have a lot of other notes about this song but i i can't stop listening to it i know that um it's a yeah it's a it's a and you're right craig it came at the right time um in the sequencing um it was needed in this spot.Track 3:[43:31] It's a little heavy before that.Track 2:[43:32] Right?Track 3:[43:33] Yeah, and it's going to get heavy again. Yep, that's right. Really heavy.Track 2:[43:37] I learned a really valuable... I gained access to some valuable experience today, when I was preparing for this recording, because it's the first time that I've flipped the record over, and had to tackle the final five songs that we ever get to hear from Gord Downie, or so we thought at the time. You know, like, we didn't know there was going to be posthumous releases.Track 5:[44:17] Right.Track 2:[44:19] We knew he wrote this right before he passed, So either way, you know, it's fucking heavy. Craig, when you think of The Road, do you think of that as heavy?Track 5:[44:35] Yes.Track 3:[44:36] Wow, The Road, this song destroys me. Again, there's a bit of a theme on the album in a few songs about The Road, about missing out on life events. Yes. On, you know, the sacrifice. Of you know being a touring musician um you know a dream that i had when i was young and it didn't work out and you know i'm you know thankful for the life i have um and you know i'm sure gourd was as well but man like it had to be there had to be some really tough times being out away from your family all the time and missing things and um anyways this song is so good and the um the thing i want to say about this is when the drums come in there's no hi-hat it's just sort of kick and snare and that space really sets the the mood for this song um you know along with you know the piano of course um and there's one line i want to point out the machines are somewhat suitable now um you know is that is that the hospital machines is it is it a reference to man machine poem um i'm not sure but but this song like.Track 3:[46:06] Depresses me almost as much as the the book the road which destroyed me when i was um a young parent uh you know or not you know i wasn't young but my my son was young and if you you know um cormac mccarthy's the road it is absolutely devastating it is the a book that took me well i've never gotten over it really and the movie as well i watched the movie and it took me about six months to watch the movie i had to watch it like a little bit at a time when i was in the right headspace and it just it is if you haven't read it's maybe don't but it's incredible um but this this yeah if you name something the road it's probably going to destroy me well.Track 4:[46:51] So I had a bit of an awakening about three years ago when in May of 2021, my wife had something that she had to do at work late at night or 8 o'clock, 9 o'clock, whatever. And she couldn't be home to make dinner. And it was like a Tuesday or something. I don't know. And she messaged me during the day and said, you need to be home and make Evelyn dinner tonight. night. Evelyn's our daughter. And at the time she was, uh, almost four and I got home and I realized, holy shit, I've never made dinner for my daughter before. Um, I was working 80 hours a week and I was missing everything. And my wife had an Instagram account for our daughter. And that was the only way that I was keeping up. I lived in the same house, but I wasn't in the same family. You know what I mean? And yeah, the song brings all that back and made a big life change that very night. I sent a long message to my boss and said, we got to talk tomorrow, but I'm going to get it all out right now. Cause if I didn't say it now, I'm not going to say it. And I told him I'm done at the end of the year. I've I'll stick with you for my commitment through this year, but but I'd put 10 years into my job and missed everything in that 10 years. And, um.Track 4:[48:16] Give Gord another three decades on top of that. Um, I don't know who the song's about and I guess it doesn't matter, but, um, but obviously it matters, but, um, yeah, I, I really identified with the missing everything and even going back to the song about, um, uh, what is it? Love over money, um, about the band, you know, we missed funerals and births and all this stuff. And yeah, that's me. I've been there, man. I've, I still, to some degree, I'm there a little bit, but, um, yeah, I missed my daughter's first four years of her life.Track 5:[48:54] Everyone knows in this group here, I'm on the road all the time. I'm talking to you from a hotel room in, in Washington, DC. And, um, and so, I mean, Justin, I think this is actually a letter to the road and a letter to everyone that he's been on the road with, including his wife, his part, you know, his, his kids, his bandmates. It's, it's that, you know, that's that life you choose, you know, whether it's a traveling musician, whether it's a a traveling salesman, whether it's a, you know, a producer. Um, and, and, and it's, uh, it's tough, but when you're not on the road, if you are a road person, it's your, your, you know, jittery, you're nervous, but how do you, how do you give to your family and to yourself and to your job and to your art? And, uh, he wouldn't have been able to do that without the road. So but you know it's a blessing and a curse um i we mentioned this about another song here and this one i wrote was also a song that could have been on secret path was the note for me.Track 4:[50:17] Yeah yeah but musically yeah again.Track 5:[50:19] We there's not enough hours in the day right lads to uh just talk about the amazing insight and that we have it here you know to listen to to watch to read to just just beautiful.Track 4:[50:36] Well there's there's that point where you know you're you're young and and full of energy and you've got these huge goals and then you start to achieve them and then at the same time you have this other life going on behind the scenes that has always played second fiddle to that and then you realize at some point you're too deep into the pursuit to stop now but that this other life that was didn't even exist when you started uh has now taken the spot you know is number one on your on your pecking order and how the hell do you make that change without destroying everything that you've created you know yep.Track 5:[51:14] Oh you are the bird.Track 2:[51:18] Yeah it's uh it's a slow and lovely song right what do you think about it kirk to.Track 5:[51:28] Me this this was uh uh, uh, just a letter. It seemed like a letter to a sibling, right? You, you became the bird you, uh, and then it just, it made sense. And, uh, um, um.Track 5:[51:44] I, it, it starts getting heavy after a while, right? When you, when we break, I mean, we talked about it with the last week when we talked about the first one and how emotional it was and, you know, here we are, you know, however many songs in and you just, you stop. And like you said, you know, JD, it was like, these are the last five tunes and it's, it's, it's almost hard to embrace, um, and think about without just getting, you know, overwhelmed. I, I think it is, I think largely because of the love we have for, uh, you know, what, what, what Gord Downie has done solo and with the hip and, and in jazz as a human. So, um, but, uh, yeah, just, uh, you know, Another note was, again, I think I mentioned it earlier, just lyrics that are written different than what is being sung. And I didn't know if that was on purpose. I think I mentioned that. And I didn't know if it was something Gord was trying to do on purpose. Or it's probably nothing. It's probably just what was written and what was sung.Track 5:[53:04] You know, he probably had it written down as such and just like we do when you have a script in front of you, your brain has already chosen what the next word is going to be. So, anyway.Track 4:[53:15] I noticed that this shared a lot of similarities with Spoon from the first half where he talks about help being the only reason why we're here. You help others and the child in the song Spoon is, I guess, tasked with the same thing. I don't know if task is the right word, but this is a common thread throughout the album. And this lyrically shares a lot with that song.Track 3:[53:48] Yeah. I agree, Justin. That was my real only, my only real note on this song was that, that, you know, it's the only reason we're here. And that seems to be like, yeah, like if I had to break down this album into one message, that would be, I mean, other than like a goodbye and, uh, you know, uh, a lot, you know, a love letter to his close ones. Um, that is like the, yeah, the summation of this album. I also thought probably about A Child, the song, and also there's the line about he was the bird, he passed it down, you want to help people out. So, you know, he's referencing not only the person he's talking to, but someone, maybe another family member, a grandfather or someone who's passed down that quality that, he respects.Track 4:[54:35] There's one of my mentors. I kind of think of him as a father figure. His name is John Adams and he was a very bottom level race car driver around these parts. And, he and my father were about the same age and they were friends. And I started hanging out with John when I was 13 or 14 years old, trying to learn how to work on race cars. And there was one night he went off, he got pushed off the racetrack and he's, you know, this massive six foot six, 300 pound guy. And he comes barreling out of the car and climbs up to the top of the racetrack and gives a, gives the driver that, that wronged him the double bird. So he became the bird man that night. Um, that was his, that was his nickname. And so everybody calls him bird. And, you know, I thought, wouldn't that be silly if he passed his nickname down to me somehow, how you know because he doesn't all of his all of his kids are girls and i'm kind of like his sort of son um i don't think that's going to happen but i i know the song isn't made to laugh, but i laughed thinking about that that's.Track 2:[55:42] A nice memory though yeah.Track 4:[55:44] He's still with us he's still with us flipping people off all the time, yeah i.Track 5:[55:51] Love that the lake.Track 2:[58:56] Yeah, this one's a fucking tearjerker to me. So proceed with caution on this one. Justin?Track 4:[59:04] Yeah. I kind of mentioned it before that I thought that this song was about Lake Ontario, which has been such a constant theme throughout Gord's entire career with the hip and with the solo stuff. And there's so many references to the lake. Um but this song is not about the lake this song is is about his daughter willow i mean that's right at the end of the song uh i realized today you are lake ontario the love of my life you are willow and then he does this fantastic call and answer thing with his own you know backup vocals um saying willow over and over again and it's like wow this one this one is something um it's a it's a beautiful song um it's just gorgeous um and yes he does describe the lake or a lake um but all these same qualities could be about your child and man it's uh it's a crusher very.Track 5:[1:00:09] Astute observation mr justin that's uh i i think spot on um and as you mentioned you know it's obviously and and to compare the two is is that there's no disservice in that he loves them both dearly so um i loved how the keys on this made it feel like you were on the lake like you listen to the.Track 4:[1:00:37] Song and you feel like.Track 5:[1:00:39] You're floating in you know in a boat a canoe whatever on the lake and you hear the lake in that song. Um, absolutely amazing. Absolutely amazing.Track 4:[1:00:55] You know, I, I grew up on the water. Um, Lake Champlain is, they call it the sixth great lake. Um, and that's, I can see it out the window. Um, and my family had a camp on a little lake, uh, Hall's lake. And my wife grew up on a lake in Ohio, Guilford lake. And we go there They're three, four, five times a year. We're headed there next week. And she also came to Vermont working at a summer camp for, I think, seven summers on Lake Fairley, which is a gorgeous resort area. And so on first hearing this song, The Lake, and probably the first 10 times I heard it, I was like, man, I can see it. And then I picked up on the willow thing after, you know, 11th on my 11th listen, I guess. And I was like, Oh no, it's just something completely different. But if it is just about the lake, Oof, that's just as devastating and lovely.Track 3:[1:01:57] Yeah, I also grew up near a lake. Our house in Peachland, which my parents still live in, overlooks Okanagan Lake, which is a very large lake. And yeah, it just brings back memories. And it is maybe my favorite spot on earth. Right across the lake from where we live is a small island. There's no roads. There's no power. There's no development on the other side of the lake. And it's just a place that we would boat to when I was a kid and try to get over there every summer. And it's just, you know, this song takes me there. And also, you know, with the mention of his daughter at the end and, you know, the, you're the love of my life and it, yeah, it's just a beautiful song.Track 2:[1:02:46] It's gorgeous. Kirk?Track 5:[1:02:49] Again, we've said it already. you know these last five songs are they're crushers it's like it it was really hard to listen to them in succession like i really needed to stop you know this these last two far far away and blurred i you know my my my space that i left for what is supposed to be my guess of who it is who the song is to the letters to, is blank. And it is blank because to me it could be anyone. Maybe it was obvious to one of you guys, but I really felt like it was almost like a letter to everyone.Track 5:[1:03:34] We smile. All that we've been through, up and down for sure, onwards and upwards, up close, far away, and blurred. Um, the tempo changes in this song are amazing. It goes into a, a swing almost during the chorus. Um, and, uh, I, I, again, just the instrumentation and the, the combination of what, you know, uh, you know, obviously not just, um, Gordon, Kevin, but, you know, the others that contributed as well. So just add, I think, to each one of these letters, as it were, you know, as they started out. What'd you think about Far Away and Blurred, Craig?Track 3:[1:04:25] I really love this song. Another strong song on the second half of this album. And I almost wondered if maybe it could be another touring song, or maybe he's talking about traveling with his family. Great melody. And I agree with what you said, Kirk, when it changes tempo halfway through the song, and the drums come in with that slow beat, and the echo the the vocals are echoing and i i found that part very powerful and it's like, again i just can't, get over the the brilliance of his work it is like so emotional um and there's this like guitar pattern going on that's really really cool in the background as well and yeah and justin you yeah.Track 4:[1:05:20] I i guess i'm echoing what you guys have said um it's just a if i mean it's a little bit upbeat um for a hot minute there and again comes at a at a place where you need it um Um, yeah, it's, it's lovely. It's how it's a guy who's frigging dying, um, and telling everybody how much he loves them and that he always has, whether, whether you're in view or not. Right. Um, yeah, the.Track 5:[1:05:53] Passion in his voice in the vocal, um, is just so palpable. And so it just, I mean, wrenching, but almost in a, just again, another reminder of just how amazing, how amazing every part and ounce of the art that comes out of this guy is just incredible, incredible.Track 3:[1:06:23] Yeah, JD, did you have anything to add for this one?Track 2:[1:06:26] I don't know if I could get anything out right now if I tried. it's.Track 3:[1:06:30] A tough one I.Track 2:[1:06:32] Think you know his voice in the verses I've got written down that it's playful and painful at the same time, and you know it builds the chorus is obviously as powerful a gourd voice as we've heard in almost any song on this record, We'll get more of that in later records that we'll discuss in future episodes, but yeah, it's a great song, but it's the second-to-last song, and the North is a really powerful way to end. A callback to Secret Path and The Bridge. But overall, it's an interesting tracking decision. It can't be a coincidence. Right, Justin?Track 4:[1:11:07] No, of course it's not. It's a reminder. It's like he spent a good portion of that final show in Kingston reminding everybody to pay attention and to keep paying attention. And that's exactly what this song is. is it's it's uh yeah i did secret path but keep going forward keep talking about it keep moving keep changing um keep trying to figure this out um you know i don't know if we i don't think we've said this on air but when we first started talking about this album there i i mentioned to you guys in our in our group chat that i thought this was some of the songs on this album were like a stream of consciousness and i think i know that there's the video of of them recording this song and i know that it's not a stream of consciousness but i think when he was writing this song, what he wrote down is whatever came to his head first and i'm going to find a song to to put it to and i got to get this message out i don't care if it's rhymes or makes sense musically or what This has to be said again and again and again and again. And good on him, you know. Yeah.Track 3:[1:12:22] Yeah. So he makes the reference to, um, you know, a place West of, of James Bay, which would be Ottawa, Piscat, which of course the hip have, have the song about. And, um, I, I, I'm wondering if this song is either about or to Joseph Boyden, the author who, at the same time secret path was released, released a book called when Jack, um, I didn't mention him on the secret path episode only because there is some controversy you can look it up if you're interested but calling his um his roots into you know question um you know people questioning that he may not be in fact indigenous so you know that's definitely something you can kind of look into yourself but um joseph boyden is famous for a book called three day road and And just an interesting little thing that I came across about a week ago was a story related to this. So this story, Three Day Road, is about from just, I haven't read the book, but I've read a different story about a sniper in World War I named Francis Paganagabo. And he was nicknamed Peggy. And he has more kills than any sniper in North America.Track 3:[1:13:44] And his story is relatively unknown. And it's a really fascinating story. And anyways, I was reading a short story about that last week and then made this discovery about the connection to Joseph Boyden. Anyways, I highly encourage you to check out a story called Peggy. There's actually a podcast too by CBC called This Place. which is 150 years of Canadian history told by indigenous voices. And the episode on Peggy is incredible.Track 5:[1:14:19] The line Canada, we should have never called Canada. Um, I thought was pretty bold as well to put out there as you guys all had been mentioning, you know, obviously when he had addressed the crowd, you know, at several of the shows and, and several of his interviews. So I think that's, uh, bold, but expected. So I, I, uh, I think we all appreciate that. He would, would, go out there to this level.Track 3:[1:14:51] Yeah there's definitely a call back to that that statement in the last show that he made to the prime minister and i always um really admired that and, i always wondered what it would be like if an american artist did the same thing, you know like a high profile of bruce springsteen or someone went out and said something like that just the absolute division that would that would ensue um yeah yeah oh.Track 5:[1:15:18] Yeah I was going to say the dick and chicks are a good example.Track 3:[1:15:22] Of it.Track 4:[1:15:22] Happening.Track 5:[1:15:23] So but yeah.Track 4:[1:15:27] Or the opposite of that lady antebellum who's then sued the person that they stole their name from well fellas.Track 2:[1:15:36] It's time to ask the question will you be keeping this record in your rotation.Track 4:[1:15:44] I'm going to say not all the time And it's got nothing to do with the music. It's the subject. It's the heaviness of it. It's I don't want to, I don't want to be down. Um, there are some songs on this, on this record that are frigging awesome. They're all, they're all very good, but you know, there's some songs that certainly fit into the hip like catalog.Track 2:[1:16:07] Sure. And you can add them to your mixtape, right?Track 4:[1:16:10] Exactly. And that's probably how I'll consume them. Um, but this is going to be something that I listened to once every couple of years, maybe.Track 5:[1:16:19] Yeah, it's a commitment. I was just going to say it's a commitment. So I would answer very similarly to what Justin said. Even for this particular purpose of this podcast, it was heavy listening every time, every time you went through it. And so definitely some tunes I want to keep hearing regularly, but it's not something that I would. All i have on regular rotation like like i would would some of the others that that have definitely been fantastic in my opinion i.Track 3:[1:16:58] Agree with you guys i i definitely will come back to this album, um considering i gave it you know it took me six and a half years just to give it a first listen i'm definitely not going to wait that long um but i think i'll just have to be in the right frame of mind to put it on but i absolutely will i really do love it in fact coming up with an mvp track for this is definitely the hardest decision i've had to make i was hoping we were going to do one last week and one this week but so i'm it's going to be a last uh last second decision i was.Track 4:[1:17:31] Hoping jd would forget the question this time.Track 2:[1:17:33] I've got it written down so i don't forget my My memory is so piss poor.Track 3:[1:17:39] Right in on your hand.Track 2:[1:17:40] I call it a format sheet, but for real, it's cheating. Craig, we're going to stick with you. And we're going to go to MVP track.Track 3:[1:17:48] I want to know what they say first. So to clarify, is this my absolute favorite track or is this the track that I want to put onto a mixtape?Track 2:[1:18:00] It can be, that can be your interpretation. It can, it's the most valuable player. It's the, you know.Track 3:[1:18:07] So I had so many I mean my first instinct was a natural but I think I'm going to have to go with Snowflake it's.Track 2:[1:18:17] So good it.Track 3:[1:18:18] Is such a powerful song to me and I love the chorus I love the way again that big reverb sound and it's just a really gorgeous song and takes me you know visually takes me somewhere.Track 2:[1:18:36] We could definitely overuse the word gorgeous on this record because there's so much gorgeosity on it, you know?Track 4:[1:18:45] Nice.Track 5:[1:18:46] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:48] Right?Track 5:[1:18:49] There is that.Track 2:[1:18:50] Kirk.Track 5:[1:18:51] Yeah. MVP? Thinking about us, man.Track 3:[1:18:54] Good call.Track 5:[1:18:55] That tune, just thinking about us. It's thinking about us. That's all I need to say.Track 2:[1:19:01] You didn't have to hesitate at all. Wow.Track 5:[1:19:04] No.Track 2:[1:19:06] Justin, how are you going to react to the question? Craig was very concerned and didn't want to say anything. Kirk was very resolute and just put a flag in her. And Justin, where are you on this one? I'm giving you some time to think, so it's not really fair.Track 4:[1:19:25] Well, I don't need time to think. I just don't have an answer. I've been thinking about this since the first listen because I knew that this was coming. Um i will i i do have an answer um but i'll tell you the pics that i had wolf's home because it makes me think of my dad bedtime because of just the connection with my daughter and when this song or when this record came out um i love introduce yourself for the reasons that we talked about it's it's a great song about your buddy and and you know get me out of another jam please you know There was some interview that Gord did that he told Billy Ray. He goes, something happened with a guitar. And he goes, I will literally blow you if you fix this. I love Spoon, that song Spoon, because I really like the band. But I also like the story of going to the show with a kid. um but i'm gonna go with love over money because that's why we're all here in the first place yeah right good job justin yeah thank.Track 2:[1:20:37] You what bow you put in it love.Track 4:[1:20:39] It yeah yeah.Track 2:[1:20:42] And that brings us to the end of Introduce Yourself. Just a, you know, what a, I'm going to use the word again, what a gorgeous piece of work. And so memorable and so thoughtful. And, you know, this is the last stuff he recorded. It's really, really quite heavy. And we're sorry if we brought you down a little bit with these last two episodes, um but trust us we're celebrating this music we're not mourning we are celebrating and.Track 3:[1:21:23] Jd i want to thank you one more time for bringing me on board for this project because this is the album that i told you right from the start has been sitting on my shelf and i needed i wanted to listen to it. It's been staring at me for years and I just couldn't do it. And I think maybe just having, you know, you guys along with the ride makes it, you know, easier to do.Track 2:[1:21:50] Thank you very much. Thank you for doing it.Track 4:[1:21:53] Yeah. I a hundred percent. Thank you. I, I didn't know about any other records, um, um that gourd had done um but i knew about this one and i was choosing to not listen to it you know i i wanted nothing to do with it um and i gotta be honest with you i'm glad it's over i'm glad it's behind us um i listened to this this album in its entirety probably 25 to 30 times um it's.Track 2:[1:22:22] A lot yeah.Track 4:[1:22:23] It's a lot and the last week or so um leading up to recording this i stopped listening completely um i had to stop it was just killing me and i started listening to um some of the older hip stuff and i started listening to some sadie stuff and i listened to conquering sun quite a bit um but i had to get away from the heaviness and go back to being a fan, because this was a hard one.Track 2:[1:22:57] Completely agree well on behalf of uh craig and justin and kirk it's me jd and we're saying goodbye for another week we'll be back we've just got a couple episodes left fellas we've got away is mine and we've got luster parfait and then we've got the finale and i'm getting excited about yeah.Track 4:[1:23:21] Hell yeah oh yeah yeah and you know it's gonna.Track 2:[1:23:26] Be a good time.Track 4:[1:23:27] I got it you know we got to give a shout out to our our social media following you guys are really starting to step up and kick ass lately and it's really re-energized all of us a lot um we're our group chat has been on fire the last several days as we record this because we're just like did you see this one did you see the message there did you see the email oh my god you know it's yeah we're obsessing over the rankings and it's it's great it's fun it's a lot of fun well.Track 5:[1:23:52] So it was so crazy too to get some like some you know some of the official accounts of these people that we were talking about are.Track 4:[1:24:01] Right are.Track 5:[1:24:02] Sharing some of the you know the links and stuff to some of these episodes and and uh we're getting just some great amazing comments you know through the right you guys mentioned social media you know instagram facebook and uh just i don't think any of us had that on our bingo cards when we woke up in the morning, you know?Track 2:[1:24:22] I didn't.Track 4:[1:24:27] Right. And the Sadies messaged you back today, Craig. That's cool.Track 2:[1:24:33] Holy shit.Track 4:[1:24:34] And JD's putting in the legwork tenfold over what we're doing.Track 2:[1:24:38] Stop.Track 4:[1:24:39] He's listening. He's throwing everything together and doing interviews and making all this happen. I mean, I don't know if any of us are getting rich off this.Track 2:[1:24:48] Oh, not fucking me.Track 4:[1:24:50] You know, JD is certainly reaping the benefits of, I think a lot of people are appreciating what you're doing and I know we are.Track 5:[1:24:57] Yeah, absolutely.Track 2:[1:24:59] It's a group effort, guys. It's a group effort, man. All right, folks. Pick up your shit.Track 1:[1:25:07] Thanks for listening to Discovering Downey. To find out more about the show and its host, visit DiscoveringDowney.com. You can email us at discoveringdowney at gmail.com. And hey, we're social. Check us out.

The pretendian phenomenon has been known and discussed in indigenous circles for years, but it's become mainstream Canadian news lately thanks to three big name exposés: Buffy sainte Marie, Joseph Boyden, and Michelle Latimer. These people were arguably the most famous indigenous songwriter in Canada, the most famous indigenous novelist in Canada and the most famous indigenous filmmaker in Canada. And all three were revealed to not actually be indigenous or at a minimum, all three misrepresented their ancestries and their community connections.But they are just the tip of the iceberg. The real issue with pretendians, according to a growing chorus of Indigenous leaders, is that Indigenous identity theft is vast and it poses an existential threat to First Nations. In the United States, the number of people who identified themselves as native has grown from 552,000 back in 1960 to 9.7 million in 2020. That is a growth rate almost ten times as high as overall population growth in America. And most of it did not happen because new native people were born. It happened because millions of people shifted their identities. Here in Canada, we have 1.8 million people identifying as Indigenous today, up from just under half a million in 1980. That is almost a 400% increase. And again, most of it is not because indigenous people are having so many kids. Most of it is happening because so many Canadians are deciding that they're Indigenous. So what happens when people with newly claimed and highly contested Indigenous identities outnumber the Indigenous people that precede them? Host: Jesse Brown Credits: Tristan Capacchione (Audio Editor and Technical Producer), Bruce Thorson (Senior Producer), Karyn Pugliese (Editor-in-Chief)Featured guests: Robert Jago, Angel EllisAdditional music by Audio NetworkFor more information:Find Pretendians on your favourite podcast appThe Newfoundlander — CanadalandAFN National Chief speaks at UN Permanent Forum on Indigenous Issues — APTN NewsSponsors: AG1, CAMH, SquarespaceFor a limited time, get 6 months of exclusive supporter benefits for just $2/month. Go to canadaland.com/join to become a supporter today.You can listen ad-free on Amazon Music—included with Prime. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Ever since author Joseph Boyden was called out for his claims of being an Indigenous author, every few weeks seems to bring a new story of a prominent researcher, writer or academic who has exaggerated or falsified their Indigeneity in order to secure grants or posts. But it's not just them, the numbers of people claiming Indigenous heritage in general has skyrocketed.What changed? Why are these claims only being parsed now? What do people who make these claims stand to gain, and how does it harm people of actual Indigenous ancestry?GUEST: Michelle Cyca, writing in The Walrus

Joseph Boyden. Michelle Latimer. Carrie Bourassa. There has been a growing list of people who are accused of pretending to be Indigenous.Jean Teillet is a lawyer who was commissioned by the University of Saskatchewan to write a report about the issue of Indigenous identity fraud and to determine how postsecondary institutions can identify fraudulent applicants.Questions? Comments? Ideas? Email us at thedecibel@globeandmail.com

Where does an authentic Indigenous identity come from?  Is bloodline or community a more important foundation for acceptance?  What are the appropriate ways to serve as an ally to various minority communities without overstepping boundaries?

Discussion about The first few chapters of The Three Day Road by Joseph Boyden.

My guest today is Geoff Henshaw, former CMO of Stoko. Stoko manufactures and distributes kneebraces built into athletic wear that is comfortable enough to use everyday. Yesterday we explored Geoff's career at Shoes.com, 1-800-GOT-JUNK and more. Today we focus on how he was growing the Stoko brand. Note this episode was recorded Geoff was still CMO of Stoko. HE is now looking for his next CMO opportunity. Feel free to reach out to me if interested and I can put you in touch. You can also listen to these interviews in your podcast player of choice: Apple, Sticher, TuneIn, Overcast , Spotify. Private Feed (for premium episodes).TranscriptEdward: This is part two of my interview with Geoff Henshaw. Today, we're going to dive into how he is growing Stoko. Geoff, can you start by describing what Stoko is and what they do?Geoff: Yeah, for sure. Stoko is a company that creates supportive apparel. Our first product launched in October of this year. It's a compression tight with the same support as a conventional knee brace.Edward: Is Stoko a product or is it a company? Geoff: Stoko is a company. Our first product is called the K1 as in Knee 1.Edward: Is the idea that you're going to introduce a series of these products that are all related to bracing the body?Geoff: Exactly. We found that with knee braces, specifically—the knee brace actually from a technology perspective—hasn't evolved or changed meaningfully in about 50 years. People's relationship with knee braces is obviously horrible. People emotionally despise their knee braces. Through four years of research and development at the University of British Columbia, this product was created, which is incredible. Thinking of a compression tight, almost like a tighter version of a very tight Lululemon tight. It's got over 50 meters of cabling going through the garment. That cabling is connected to two dials in the waistband. You put the tight on, you can click the dials in the back, you can turn them, and your legs are fully supported.As you can imagine, the application is huge for a number of sports across North America. Since our launch, we're just hearing tremendous feedback from both elite athletes and weekend warriors like myself.Edward: Who uses it? Is it people that would normally use a knee brace, or is it more than that?Geoff: Great question. When we looked at the product, we looked obviously at the end-user. We believed that the time that they would be using the product would be in relation to when they'd had a knee injury. There's a lot of technology in the product, so the product costs are quite high, to be honest. What we believed is that we needed to sell it at a $400 MSRP. We believed in that MSRP price. We needed to compare it against a knee brace.One of the things that we are finding is that elite athletes, particularly, we've actually got it on a number of national team freestyle skiers and snowboarders, young people that never had a knee injury in their careers. They are terrified of knee injuries, and they're starting to use the product preventably, which we're really excited about because obviously, that's a huge market. For the general population, we felt like the value proposition was strongest for people that had—either recently or in the past—a knee injury and they're not happy with the knee brace solution.Edward: Does it totally replace a knee brace? It is more comfortable than a knee brace but as effective as a knee brace?Geoff: Exactly. Customer utility is highest when you're looking at brace support. It has all the support of a conventional knee brace, but the level of comfort is so much better. I don't know if you wear a knee brace. Do you wear a knee brace? Edward: I have at times in my life, but I don't now.Geoff: Okay. The level of comfort is like 9 out of 10 and a knee brace would be like a 2 out of 10. That bracing support plus comfort equals something called compliance, which means that you're going to be wearing it more. Therefore, you're less likely to reinjure yourself or get injured in the first place.Edward: Is it preventative? The elite athletes that are using it as a preventative measure, do we know if it actually is preventative, or is it just a matter of it makes them feel like it might be?Geoff: Well, I'm going to avoid the legality in that question. We believe that it protects from the potential of future injury. There's a bit of a placebo effect also where you can feel the cabling actually holding your leg in place if it's moving into a compromised position. I would say that certainly early indicators are that you could imply that it could be preventative. But certainly, there's a lot of legalities as you know as a marketer, so we need to be really careful about that claim.Edward: Is there any downside? Does it limit mobility at all to be wearing this as an elite athlete?Geoff: No, there's literally no downside. I just got an email from a kid on the Canadian freestyle team. I'm saying kid, I think he's like the early 20s. He just is now sitting 13th in the world in freestyle skiing. He said he's been wearing it every World Cup run that he's been doing. Certainly, there are no limitations, which is really the beauty of the product.Edward: But he doesn't wear it when he goes out for a run around the block?Geoff: Yeah, he wears it. Compression is huge right now. The idea of really pushing yourself is obviously important. But I think things are now really starting to shift towards recovery. There are compression benefits actually in the product also. For someone like that, if he's actually wearing it on his flight home because it benefits him from a compression perspective and a recovery from the flight. He's kicking around wearing it day to day because, as you know, it's a common fashion to wear compression tights underneath shorts just like skateboarders do and professional basketball players do.Edward: Where is the path for more products? Do I just go through the joints in the body and say you're going to have an ankle one, an elbow one, and a shoulder one?"Geoff: Great question. Our vision is that we have our product for every athlete in the world. We consider anyone who has the ability to walk or to move an athlete. That really helps inform our product roadmap and it also helps form our pricing. Our pricing is really sharp. And our product roadmap would consider joints in the future that have a high incidence of injury. That would include ankles and shoulders, for example. But certainly, we're focused very much on the knee right now.Edward: Start with one before you start jumping to the next. What does your distribution look like? Is it all direct to consumer?Geoff: Yeah, the primary channel is direct to consumers, and that's commerce specifically. But we do see a huge opportunity around retail. We're starting with specialty retail because oftentimes, people are going to specialty retailers to find a solution to this problem that we have. We've found it to be sort of a logical intersect. The second area that we're looking at is around medical professionals. That includes, for example, physiotherapists where they, from their clinic, can actually recommend their patients to purchase our product to help them with an injury that they have.Edward: But you have not gone into that. So far it's 100% ecommerce?Geoff: No, we've actually pushed into relationships. I'm in Vancouver, so we pushed into relationships with a couple of national retailers in Canada. More on the specialty side, which we're really excited about, and then we have medical professionals currently referring our product to their patients. They would refer a patient, and then we would provide them with a commission based on that transaction.Edward: That referral though is still done through the website or some sort of platform?Geoff: Yeah, that transaction occurs on the platform because really their core business for medical professionals in treating patients, obviously. If they're getting into fitting and returns, that's not going to help their business. At that point, they hand it over to us and we're able to interface with the customer from there.Edward: Are there any concerns around the doctors themselves? If they get a commission from you every time they push this out to their patients, are the doctors themselves worried about the conflict of interest of them getting paid to push a product?Geoff: Yeah, very much. Again, we launched this in October, what we've heard back from that group of medical professionals is they are very patient-focused and they'll do the right thing for their patient. If that includes referring our product, they'll absolutely do that. It's been interesting because I would describe their reaction to a referral fee as being indifferent. What that's meant for us is that as an organization, we've had to invest more heavily in product knowledge and product understanding. Oftentimes, that means that those medical professionals actually have to wear the product themselves before they're comfortable referring it on to their patients.Edward: Does it come back to your Coastal Contact days of providing free products to the physiotherapist with the hope of getting a revenue stream?Geoff: Yeah, totally. One of the things that we found is that because people have had this tough relationship with their solution—being a conventional knee brace, for example—there's a multiple on each product that we sort of seed.They're wearing it, then they're liking it, and then when appropriate are recommending it to patients. But then they're also telling others in their network, family, and friends about this great product really is incredible. Ultimately, that solution feels better than paying Google and Facebook for acquiring new customers.Edward: It's always better when you have a marketing channel that isn't in an auction to the highest bidder, but obviously harder to build, though, too. I could turn on paid search tomorrow, but if I want to build a network of physiotherapists, that's a lot of work over a lot of years.Geoff: Tell me about it. Trust and scale are critically important for that particular program, for sure.Edward: How do you scale that? Do you have a sales team that's calling on all these? It's not really sales because you're not selling them anything, but like a community relations team that goes and calls on all these physiotherapists across the country?Geoff: Yeah, we have an outbound team that is looking to set up product knowledge sessions. I think, for us as a startup, looking to immediately automate or scale things, that wasn't really (in my opinion) a great solution because you need to get in there and figure it out yourself first and have these one-on-one interactions. Ideally, you want a few people to go first. That's really important because it creates a little bit of a flywheel effect where you can then point to other people that have joined the program and then that I think adds and builds a little bit of trust for future people who aren't going to join the program. As we build that out now, we're at a stage where we're looking at digital channels to generate leads for our sales team then to speak to.Edward: Yeah, it's always a challenging thing because you have this upfront cost of getting a physiotherapist on board, but you don't know what that revenue stream is going to look like or what type of physiotherapist to get on until you've invested it for a considerable period of time.Geoff: Exactly. With that said, within physiotherapists specifically, generally, they have a binary opinion towards bracing in general, so we identify that first. And then the second part is to understand what percentage of their patients that come through their practice have, for example, a knee injury currently. From there, we can rough out whether we think this is a good partnership to pursue.Edward: What does it look like? You get a physiotherapist on board and they're excited about working with you. How many products will physiotherapists sell in the next month or 12 months? Have you even thought up through that?Geoff: That's a great question. Generally, we believe it would be close to 30% of people that are coming through a physiotherapist would be appropriate for our product. That's kind of the way that we think about it.Edward: That's because 30% of physiotherapists are dealing with knee injuries, 30% of their patients?Geoff: Exactly.Edward: You mentioned a little bit before about when someone tries this thing, they tell their friends and family about it. That type of viral coefficient is, first of all, fairly common in unusual products and it's fairly common in apparel. You're both an unusual product and a piece of apparel. How do you accelerate that? Do you make sure that you have a really big logo on the side of your pants?Geoff: The logo on the K1 tight is something that we're always talking about. Currently, it might be a little bit too subtle. That said, you can actually aesthetically see that there's kind of cabling within the tights, which actually looks cool, and we believe sparks conversation.The things that we really look at are through the customer journey or athlete journey, as we call it. What are opportunities for people that have purchased the product to actually share their experience? Obviously, if you look at the unboxing, that's an opportunity. A small card saying, hey, if you love this, tell members of your family or friends about it.The second is obviously digital. Even within an automated welcome series, post-purchase, and if we see someone has given us 9 or a 10/10 from an EPS perspective, we will send them an offer that they can distribute to members of their family or friends to really encourage that advocacy. Edward: Have you estimated what that viral coefficient is? For every product that you sell or every customer you acquire, how many more customers are you getting over the next 12 months from that customer telling people?Geoff: My gut tells me it's three. Edward: Well, that seems really high. Geoff: It does seem really high, but if you talk to and I probably talk to a customer at least once every two days, they have had something dramatic happen in their lives, which is this knee injury. It's impacted them from, oftentimes, being able to do something that they have a spiritual relationship with, which is exercise. The solution that they have is either wear a brace or not wear a brace, neither of which is particularly compelling. We're providing them with this incredible solution that they will then wear doing this activity that they have this great relationship with and often there's a social component. That is just ripe for them to talk about the product that they're wearing.Edward: Even so, most people who have knee injuries don't have a lot of friends who have knee injuries, or do they?Geoff: Great question. There are particular sports where the product is particularly relevant. The two sports segments that we're looking at right now—and we're actively focused on—are ski and snowboard.Edward: If you could get someone on a ski team, it quickly spreads to the rest of the team.Geoff: Exactly. If you get even within skiers and snowboarders, certainly, there's a ton of, unfortunately, a knee injury. Those opportunities for people to talk about the solution that they have are right there.Edward: My wife gave up skiing just before we met. She had a big accident at Whistler, and she hasn't skied since because she's so afraid of hurting her knee. Do you think this is going to change her mind? Now she can put on one of your pants and start skiing again?Geoff: I'm going to give you a promotional code, so that should help even more.Edward: If it gets her back on the ski hill, I'm happy to pay full price.Geoff: The other nice thing is that—depending on who your insurer is—it should be reimbursed.Edward: Geoff, you do a bunch of retargeting. How do you account for incrementality? How do you know how many of those people would have come back to you anyway?Geoff: Good question. I think retargeting is certainly challenging within a digital marketing mix. For us, in all transparency, we haven't proven that out with Stoko yet. One of the things that you can do pretty clearly is also looking at what you're more established competitors are doing. If it looks like they're doing heavy retargeting, you can probably make a bit of an assumption that, okay, this is a high consideration purchase. People are going to be coming back to your website multiple times and checking out what their options are. We started with that kind of thesis and then started to invest more heavily in retargeting. Obviously, there's a number of different channels that you can look at from a retargeting perspective—everything from Google to Facebook to [...] et cetera.Right now, we're fairly heavily invested in retargeting. I think what I have found is that certainly, you want to look at the full journey of your customer. To me, the best test for retargeting is what happens when you turn it off. I think one of the nice things is that we're at a stage as a company where we can run those tests. We're not looking at attributing 15%-20% of our revenue to retargeting. We can do it in a fairly binary way where we're, okay, let's turn off retargeting and see what happens. I think that's generally the best way to test retargeting personally.Edward: That's one of the nice things about when you're a small enough company. If Coke turns off the retargeting, they have no idea what it exactly did to sales. When you're small enough, you can see any given channel, you can actually see the differences that happen. Geoff, this has been fantastic. Thank you so much for your time today. Before you go, can you tell us about your quake book and how it changed the way you think about the world?Geoff: Yeah, for sure. It's actually an author that I've been reading this year. He's a Canadian called Joseph Boyden. What he looks at is First Nations experience in Canada, really starting with their first relationships with European settlers. For me, obviously, a lot has happened this year. But for me, it really helped me understand the condition of First Nations in Canada, which is not great, not good. It helped me understand how things that happened generation after generation after generation ago impacted where we're at today. That it's important to acknowledge those things to understand how we could even attempt to make things better.Edward: Thank you, Geoff. I really appreciate your time today.Geoff: Thank you. Thank you for having me. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit marketingbs.substack.com

“感谢收听“普通读者”的第12期播客节目！这期我们很有幸请到另一个读书播客《咸鱼罐头》的主播“罐头”做嘉宾，我们四个人共同读了四本书，然后一起聊一聊。 时间节点： 0:57 H的推荐 "The Poet X", by Elizabeth Acevedo 11:19 罐头的推荐《心灵的焦灼》斯蒂芬·茨威格 27:44 徐慢懒的推荐 "The Bass Rock", by Evie Wyld 44:53 堂本的推荐 "The Bear", by Andrew Krivak 共同阅读书目： "The Poet X", by Elizabeth Acevedo 《心灵的焦灼》斯蒂芬·茨威格 "The Bass Rock", by Evie Wyld "The Bear", by Andrew Krivak 提到的书： “Long Way Down”, by Jason Reynolds 《悲伤与理智》约瑟夫·布罗茨基 《昨日的世界》斯蒂芬·茨威格 《喀耳刻》马德琳·米勒 《路》科马克·麦卡锡 "Wenjack", by Joseph Boyden 提到的影音： 谭维维《小娟（化名）》 嘉宾罐头的即刻：咸鱼罐头Crown 收听和订阅渠道： 小宇宙App，Apple Podcast, Anchor，Spotify，Pocket Casts， Google Podcast，Breaker， Radiopublic；网易云“普通-读者” 电邮：commonreader@protonmail.com 豆瓣“普通读者播客”：https://www.douban.com/people/commonreaders/ 微博： 普通读者播客 片头音乐credit： Flipper's Guitar - 恋とマシンガン- Young, Alive, in Love - 片尾音乐credit：John Bartman - Happy African Village (Music from Pixabay)

On this episode we talk with David Jones a Troop Commander in the 1980s who came to the Special OP Troop from 148 (Meiktila) Commando Forward Observation Battery.  A specialist Naval Gunfire Support Forward Observation unit within 29 Commando Regiment Royal Artillery of 3 Commando Brigade Royal Marines David covers the Troop Commander's perspective of the unit including how the Troops in 32 and 5 Regt were organised and tasked, the pressures to get more volunteers through selection, the widening of recruitment and the attachment of SAS Captains to the Troop.  We will finish off with how two separate troops were brought together to form firstly 73 (Sphinx) Special OP Bty and finally 4/73 (Sphinx) Special OP Bty. On desert island dits David's choice of book is a two part series by Tim Cook At the Sharp End: Canadians Fighting the Great War 1914–1916, Volume One, and: Shock Troops: Canadians Fighting the Great War 1917–1918, Volume Two.  His fiction choice is Three Day Road . A book by Joseph Boyden.   Finally his choice of film is Das Boot. The team's pick this week is Unreasonable Behaviour the life story of the photographer Don McCullin. Find out about the current serving unit at STA Patrols Special Observer. Follow us on Instagram "the_unconventional_soldier_pod" and Facebook "The Unconventional Soldier Pod" (search for @lateo82). We are also available to download on iTunes, Spotify, Youtube and Google podcasts. Email us: unconventionalsoldier@gmail.com This episode brought to you in association with ISARR a veteran owned company.    

This week Shannon, Stacy, Brooke, and Natalia discuss books set in various places they've lived. Titles mentioned include: Rachel Vincent, Stray (Shifters #1) Molly Fader, The McAvoy Sisters Book of Secrets C.B. Forrest, The Weight of Stones (Charlie McKelvey Mysteries #1) Harlan Coben, Hold Tight Karen Dionne, The Marsh King's Daughter Reese Ryan, Making the First Move (Bad Boys Gone Good #1) Joseph Boyden, Through Black Spruce (Bird Family Trilogy #2) Barbara Parker, Suspicion of Innocence (Gail Connor and Anthony Quintana #1) Fiona Davis, The Lions of Fifth Avenue Emilie Richards, Whiskey Island Maureen Jennings, Except the Dying (Detective Murdoch #1) Lisa Gardner, Touch and Go (Tessa Leoni #2) You can always contact the Book Bistro team by searching @BookBistroPodcast on facebook, or visiting: https://www.facebook.com/BookBistroPodcast/ You can also send an email to: TheBookBistroPodcast@gmail.com For more information on the podcast and the team behind it, please visit: http://anchor.fm/book-bistro.

Joseph Boyden is serving 10 of a 25 year sentence in federal prison for armed robbery. He is currently in a West Virginian Federal prison describing his his experience as an inmate staying safe from COVID 19. --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/aaronesmith/support

For the second year, we are excited to explore three of the Global Read Aloud books. (You can find out more information about the Global Read Aloud here.) We are thrilled to begin Season 3 with a discussion of three amazing novels for middle grade, middle school, and young adult readers.Listen to the episode, and then let us know what you think!   timeline *Introduction and General Discussion: 00:00 - 01:16 *Cherie Dimaline's The Marrow Thieves: 01:17 - 18:45 *Padma Venkatraman's The Bridge Home: 18:46 - 31:59 *Kelly Yang's Front Desk: 32:00 - 43:40   other mentions  *Leslie Marmon Silko’s Ceremony *Cormac McCarthy’s The Road *Peter Heller’s The Dog Stars *Mindy McGinnis’s Not a Drop to Drink *Emily St. John Mandel’s Station Eleven *Alan Gratz’s Refugee *Neal Shusterman’s Dry *R. J. Palacio’s Wonder *Katherine Boo’s Behind the Beautiful Forevers *Amy Tan’s “Mother Tongue”​   other resources  *Joseph Boyden’s Wenjack *​Louise Erdrich’s Tracks *Louise Erdrich's Love Medicine *Cynthia Leitich Smith’s Hearts Unbroken Check out what's coming up next.   want to support unabridged?Become a patron on Patreon.​ Follow us @unabridgedpod on Instagram. Like and follow our Facebook Page. Follow us @unabridgedpod on Twitter. Subscribe to our podcast and rate us on iTunes or on Stitcher. Check us out on Podbean.

On this week’s show: "Through Black Spruce" stars Tanaya Beatty and Brandon Oakes and director Don McKellar.In “Through Black Spruce,” an adaptation of Joseph Boyden’s Giller Prize-winning novel, Beatty stars as Annie Bird, a Cree woman from James Bay who travels to Toronto in search of her twin sister Suzanne, a model who disappeared without a trace.As Annie explores the dark underbelly of the city’s fashion scene at home in Moosonee her Uncle Will (Mohawk actor Oakes) runs afoul of local drug dealers. They think Suzanne’s boyfriend ripped them off and want to talk to her about where he is. When Will won’t tell them he is beaten within an inch of his life.

Don McKellar and Tina Keeper and Face2Face host David Peck talk about their new film Through Black Spruce, residential school and family history, responsibility of Canadians, a lack of understanding and stories and truth. Trailer Synopsis The film was shot on location in Moosonee, Moose Cree First Nation, Sudbury, Atikameksheng Anishinawbek First Nation, Killarney and Toronto, Ontario and it’s a ‘Collaboration and reconciliation,’ says producer Tina Keeper. ‘That’s what this production was all about. Indigenous and non-indigenous filmmakers coming together to tell a story that mattered to everyone.’ It’s the project she’s been building towards since founding Kistikan Pictures back in 2010, in partnership with Buffalo Gal Pictures in Winnipeg. The company is dedicated to the development and production of film and television with Indigenous artists. Based on the Giller Award-winning novel of the same name by Joseph Boyden, Through Black Spruce is a story of identity and survival. The disappearance of a young Indigenous woman named Suzanne Bird triggers events in two worlds: in Moosonee, the remote Northern Ontario community she fled years ago, and Toronto, where she modelled for a while before vanishing into the ether. Her sister Annie is a hunter, a fiercely-independent woman who’s always resented her weaker twin. But their mother’s despair sends her south to retrace Suzanne’s steps. Her life in Moosonee soon recedes as she’s drawn into the glittering “artists and models” scene her sister left behind. Meanwhile, her uncle Will copes with the dangerous consequences of Suzanne’s disappearance… and comes up against the ghosts of his own private tragedy. The two worlds finally collide in the fallout from the missing woman's troubled life. Biography Don McKellar Don McKellar was born in Canada and has had a varied career as a writer, director and actor. He was the screenwriter of Roadkill and Highway 61, and co-writer of Dance Me Outside, the Genie Award-winning Thirty Two Short Films About Glenn Gould and The Red Violin (he also appeared in the latter two). He received a Genie Award as Best Supporting Actor for his role in Atom Egoyan’s Exotica and the Prix de la Jeunesse at Cannes for his directorial debut, Last Night, which he also wrote and starred in. He also wrote, directed and played the lead in his second film, Childstar. His stage writing credits include the five plays he co-created with the Augusta Company and the book for the musical The Drowsy Chaperone, for which he won a Tony Award. He also wrote and starred in the CBC television series Twitch City. Other film and television appearances include David Cronenberg’s eXistenZ, Atom Egoyan’s Where the Truth Lies and the series Slings and Arrows for the Sundance Channel. He collaborated on the film adaptation of Jose Saramago’s Nobel Prize-winning novel Blindness. Directed by Fernando Mereilles, he also starred with Julianne Moore, Gael Garcia Bernal and Mark Ruffalo. His recent work includes the Max Films feature The Grand Seduction, for which he won a DGC Award for Best Direction in 2014. Tina Keeper Tina Keeper is Cree, originally from Norway House Cree Nation, now a Winnipeg based media producer. She is President of Kistikan Pictures, a partner company to Buffalo Gal Pictures. Tina was formerly an actor, best known for her work on the hit Canadian series North of 60. Recent productions include Through Black Spruce, the 360-3D VR short film Sky Stories, Road of Iniquity, the critically acclaimed Royal Winnipeg Ballet, Going Home Star about the Indian Residential School history in Canada, and The REDress REdress Project a short documentary on the issue of Murdered and Missing Aboriginal women in Manitoba. Tina also served as a Member of Parliament for the federal riding of Churchill. Tina has a BA Theatre from the University of Winnipeg and has trained at the Centre for Indigenous Theatre, the Banff Centre and the Sundance Film Institute Tina currently serves as Chairperson of the board of trustees for the Helen Betty Osborne Memorial Foundation, member of the advisory Committee to Urban Shaman Gallery, the advisory committee to Red Cross Manitoba, Honourary Witness for the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, and is member of the Order of Manitoba, Canadians for a New Partnership, a recipient of an Aboriginal Achievement Award, a Gemini Award, 3 American Indian Film Festival awards for acting and producing, a 2014 Canadian Civil Liberties Association award for Public Engagement, was named ACTRA’s 2017 Women of the Year. In June 2017, Tina received an Honorary Doctor of Letters from Wilfred Laurier University and a Governor General Meritorious Service Medal along with the late Elder Mary Richard, and RWB Artistic Director Andre Lewis for the ballet Going Home Star. Image Copyright: Serendipity and D Films. Used with permission. For more information about David Peck’s podcasting, writing and public speaking please visit his site here. With thanks to producer Josh Snethlage and Mixed Media Sound. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information.

After ending the campaigns of several Tory candidates with his muckraking during the 2015 federal election, Macleans dubbed Robert Jago, "the most dangerous blogger in Canada". The next year, Jago broke the Joseph Boyden scandal, and this past January he exposed Senator Lynn Beyak for publishing racist letters on her website, which resulted in her being ousted from the conservative caucus. Jago has quickly risen as an incisive, evocative voice in Canadian media. He's now a regular contributor to The Walrus and CANADALAND — but he says he doesn't plan on giving up his day job anytime soon. So. Who is this guy? Robert Jago joins Jesse. — This episode of CANADALAND is brought to you by Endy. Support CANADALAND: http://canadalandshow.com/join See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Joseph Boyden has emerged from his winter burrow like a collared lemming (it's an arctic mammal -- look it up!) to plug his forthcoming book weigh in again on questions of his Indigenous ancestry. Despite his insistence that his connection to -- and friendship with -- Indigenous communities should automatically confer some sort of Indigenous status, he went ahead and got a DNA test anyway. Robert Jago wrote an excellent dissection of Boyden's latest plea for acceptance/publicity stunt, while Eric Andrew-Gee dug into Boyden's complicated family history in a Globe & Mail feature. Also, with literally no Canadians waiting with baited breath, the CBC finally announced its cadre of Peter Mansbridge replacements. Rosemary Barton, Ian Hanomansing, Adrienne Arsenault, and Andrew Chang have collectively made the cut, while network mainstays Ernie Coombs, Bruno Gerussi, and Al Waxman remain in reserve in case any of the lead anchors bolt for CTV. National Post journalist and Commons co-host Ashley Csanady joins us. Support CANADALAND: http://canadalandshow.com/join See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Three Day Road is an award-winning Canadian novel centered on First Nation characters. It’s been heralded for celebrating forgotten heroes: natives who fought for Canada during World War I. But recently, it’s author Joseph Boyden, has come under scrutiny regarding his claims of aboriginal heritage. And so, on this episode of the Disco, we tackle some of the thorny issues surrounding cultural appropriation… Who has “the right” to pen books of marginalized peoples? Does the ethnicity of an author matter? When? Who decides? We’d love to hear your thoughts, so jump onto our Facebook page.       Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

CBC's miniseries “The Story of Us,” is only two episodes in, but manages to upset literally everyone (except Joseph Boyden). Justin Trudeau endorses CBC's Canada 150 fiasco--and his favourite microbrew, Labatt150. Everyone forgets the Junos were on Sunday and Russell Peters makes a statutory rape joke. The Globe and Mail issues Leah McLaren a gag order, following the coded memo sent out to staff. Following McGill's brand-sensitive lead, Ryerson University issues an apology for a short documentary about poverty in Niagara Falls, made by its students.   An access-to-information request made by VICE reveals that CSIS has been secretly watching and reporting on events at the Standing Rock pipeline protests. How freaked out should journalists be about surveillance and border crossing? VICE Canada's Hilary Beaumont joins Jesse.Support CANADALAND: https://canadaland.com/joinSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Conservative leadership candidate Kellie Leitch released a video this week that was somewhere between political platform and performance play. Also, Kevin O'Leary continues to draw a paycheque from CNBC while running for the same role.  Finally, accusations of plagiarism are now dogging Joseph Boyden. National Observer Associate Editor Sandy Garossino joins Jesse from Vancouver.Support CANADALAND: https://canadaland.com/joinSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Joseph Boyden is a celebrated, award-winning indigenous novelist - who might not actually be native. Indigenous media broke the story while mainstream media was on Christmas vacation. Ryan McMahon's Twitter: @RMComedy and his Indigenous podcast network, @indianandcowboy Ryan's VICE piece, "What Colour Is Your Beadwork, Joseph Boyden?" (Dec 30th, 2016) Robert Jago's Tweets for @IndigenousXca Jorge Barrera's APTN piece, "Author Joseph Boyden's shape-shifting Indigenous identity" (Dec 23rd, 2016) Robert Jago's Canadaland piece, "Things Joseph Boyden Has Claimed To Be But Is Not" (Dec 29th 2016) Konrad Yakabuski's Globe and Mail piece, "Attacks on Joseph Boyden's identity should set off alarm bells" (originally titled "Boyden's lynching should set off alarms.") (Dec 29th 2016) Jon Kay's Walrus piece, "Why Is Joseph Boyden's Indigenous Identity Being Questioned?" (Dec 28th, 2016) Wab Kinew's Globe and Mail piece, "There is room in our circle for Joseph Boyden" (Jan 3rd, 2017) Joseph Boyden's piece, "An Open Letter To UBC: Steven Galloway's Right To Due Process" (Nov 14th, 2016) Hayden King's Globe and Mail piece, "Joseph Boyden, where are you from?" (Dec 28th, 2016) Nahka Bertrand and Nickita Longman's Ricochet piece, "How Joseph Boyden's claims to Indigeneity affect us all" (Jan 1st, 2017)Support CANADALAND: https://canadaland.com/joinSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

On this week's Indigenous roundtable, we look back and ahead—what were the trends and themes that defined this past year for Indigenous peoples, and what might the next 12 months bring? According to our roundtable, 2016 was a breakout year for empowering Indigenous media artistry and activism. It also ended with a bang, as heated discussions about identity fraud re-ignited after new revelations about acclaimed author Joseph Boyden. Joining us once more are Cutcha Risling Baldy, Assistant Professor of American Indian Studies at San Diego State University, and Taté Walker, editor of Native Peoples magazine.

Without a doubt, it was our worst-ever show. We never had a guest walk out on us before; the shitstorm that followed saw us branded all over the Internet as racially-insensitive bigots. The author’s publicist swore never to work within us again, and insinuated that he’d try to pull us off the air. All this happened because the Canadian novelist Joseph Boyden walked out of the studio when invited by host Ian Winn to discuss his First Nation origins. We thought at the time – and still do – that it was a direct but fair question, given Boyden’s close association with First Nation matters. All this happened three years ago, and but the topic has suddenly been given new prominence by an Aboriginal Peoples Television Network investigation by award-winning reporter Jorge Barrera. Download the show as an audio file Subscribe in iTunes

Without a doubt, it was our worst-ever show. We never had a guest walk out on us before; the shitstorm that followed saw us branded all over the Internet as racially-insensitive bigots. The author’s publicist swore never to work within us again, and insinuated that he’d try to pull us off the air. All this happened because the Canadian novelist Joseph Boyden walked out of the studio when invited by host Ian Winn to discuss his First Nation origins. We thought at the time – and still do – that it was a direct but fair question, given Boyden’s close association with First Nation matters. All this happened three years ago, and but the topic has suddenly been given new prominence by an Aboriginal Peoples Television Network investigation by award-winning reporter Jorge Barrera. Download the show as an audio file Subscribe in iTunes

Bulletproof Dental Practice Podcast Episode 9 Host: Dr. Peter Boulden Atlanta Dental Spa   Guest: Darren Shaw Founder & President of Whitespark Email: darren@whitespark.ca Darren is literally the authority when it comes to LOCAL search.  He's a frequent lecturer to others SEO's in the industry.   Darren's company - Whitespark is almost completely focused on how to help businesses rank better locally.  As we know, local search is what most brick & mortar businesses are concerned with.  Ranking nationally is great but as dentists we have geographical limitations (i.e. we have to do business in our office and not online).  There are some AWESOME tips and advice in this episode.  I have know Darren and consume his articles and content but I was still taking notes during the podcast!   Key Takeaways: Local SEO is about making sure your business appears in local search. Google has become better at showing you relevant search results that are near your location. Google is mobile-first. You need to design your website for mobile by either having a mobile-specific site or have a responsive site. Organic SEO is based on the content and the links on your website. Local SEO adds reviews, citations (listing in business directory) and Google My Business listing. Citations Citations is anywhere in the web where your name and business address is mentioned. Be careful not to overdo or it will appear spammy. Note: If you use Yext, cancelling it will have major impacts to your listings. Reviews You can ask people to write reviews for you in Google by sending them a link. For Yelp, only ask active Yelpers for review. Otherwise, the review won’t be credited. Tip: Connect your Yelp account to your Facebook account to find active Yelpers among your friends. Tips on how to check your local SEO Ask your customers to write reviews for you in Google. Build your listings online in the Top 50 directory website. Claim your business in Google. Increase relevant content in your website. Resources: Google Review Link Generator by Whitespark   Book: The Orenda by Joseph Boyden   Productivity App: AHRefs   Tweetables: “Reviews have massive impact on your business, not just your ranking. - Darren Shaw”

Mike welcomes Much marketing coordinator Dan Carruthers to the show. Mike and Dan discuss Dan's path to working at Much, his love for music, their experience together doing cartoon voiceovers and Arkells' upcoming shows with Frank Turner. Ian "DJ NDN" Campeau, Tim "2oolman" Hill and Bear Witness of A Tribe Called Red ("R.E.D.") tell Mike about forming, their process, Tanya Tagaq, Yasiin Bey, representing their culture, Joseph Boyden, Gord Downie, recognizing privilege and their hopes. For dessert, Shane describes his Halloween night and talks offensive costumes.

A panel discussion, January 28, 2016 Cathy Levy hosts a pre-show talk with the Royal Winnipeg Ballet's Artistic Director André Lewis, choreographer Mark Godden, novelist Joseph Boyden, Inuk throat singer Tanya Tagaq, and composer Christos Hatzis on the genesis, development and collaborative process of the ballet Going Home Star –Truth and Reconciliation. The Royal Winnipeg Ballet created this contemporary full-length work relating to the legacy of residential schools with the aim of bringing Indigenous and non-Indigenous people closer together. As they describe their own individual contribution and creative process, the panelists pay homage to Winnipeg Elder Mary Richard, actress, producer and Indigenous activist Tina Keeper, and Steve Wood & the Northern Cree Singers. The closing remarks by Tanya and André are both sobering and hopeful.

CBC Radio One is pleased to present Red Man Laughing, a special hour of indigenous comedy, music and interviews hosted by stand up comic Ryan McMahon. After 3 successful seasons of the hit podcast, the shows format was tweaked & twisted into this 1 hour National comedy special! In January 2014, Ryan invited a group of fellow aboriginal artists to join him onstage at the Capitol Theatre in Edmonton’s historic Fort Edmonton Park. The show was recorded over 2 sold out nights (honestly, we could have sold out for a week straight there was such a demand for tickets) at the historic theatre. The show aired during the 2014 National Aboriginal Day weekend. Guests include champion hand-drum singer Fawn Wood, singer/songwriter Nick Sherman, author and film-maker Richard Van Camp, and Canada Reads winning author, Joseph Boyden.

Mission Encre Noire Tome 12 Chapitre 170 Dans le grand cercle du monde de Joseph Boyden paru en 2014 aux éditions Albin Michel. Après Le chemin des âmes et Les saisons de la solitude, voici un roman situé dans les espaces sauvages du Canada du XVII siècle, roman épique et puissant, empreint à la fois de beauté et de violence. La nation huronne alliée aux français est en guerre, les iroquois ont mis la main sur les bois brillants anglais. Fuite, tortures savantes, cérémonies lugubres, scènes de chasse, guerres tribales, voici les étapes incontournables de votre lecture en forme de témoignage de destins scellés à jamais dans un monde sur le point basculer. Extrait: ''L'hiver s'étire, et le froid brutal s'installe durant tout le mois de février. La maladie qui frappe tant de nos Sauvages nous montre à nous aussi son horrible visage. Il s'agit d'une grippe accompagnée de fortes fièvres, de vomissements et de diarrhées. Alors que les donnés en souffrent pendant une semaine ou deux avant que leur état ne s'améliore assez vite, nombre de Hurons en meurent.Je perds mes brebis juste au moment où mon troupeau semblait s'agrandir. Isaac, Gabriel et moi avons administré l'extrème-onction à huit reprises au cours de ces deux dernières semaines. Nous avons tous de la fièvre. Le sol est trop profondément gelé pour que nous puissions enterrer les morts, si bien que nous les entreposons dans l'une des petites maisons construites à l'intention des visiteurs.''  De retour du 37 ème Salon du livre de Montréal, je vous propose un entretien avec Michel Vézina à propos de son dernier roman: Disparues paru en 2014 aux éditions Coups de tête.

Mission Encre Noire Tome 12 Chapitre 170 Dans le grand cercle du monde de Joseph Boyden paru en 2014 aux éditions Albin Michel. Après Le chemin des âmes et Les saisons de la solitude, voici un roman situé dans les espaces sauvages du Canada du XVII siècle, roman épique et puissant, empreint à la fois de beauté et de violence. La nation huronne alliée aux français est en guerre, les iroquois ont mis la main sur les bois brillants anglais. Fuite, tortures savantes, cérémonies lugubres, scènes de chasse, guerres tribales, voici les étapes incontournables de votre lecture en forme de témoignage de destins scellés à jamais dans un monde sur le point basculer. Extrait: ''L'hiver s'étire, et le froid brutal s'installe durant tout le mois de février. La maladie qui frappe tant de nos Sauvages nous montre à nous aussi son horrible visage. Il s'agit d'une grippe accompagnée de fortes fièvres, de vomissements et de diarrhées. Alors que les donnés en souffrent pendant une semaine ou deux avant que leur état ne s'améliore assez vite, nombre de Hurons en meurent.Je perds mes brebis juste au moment où mon troupeau semblait s'agrandir. Isaac, Gabriel et moi avons administré l'extrème-onction à huit reprises au cours de ces deux dernières semaines. Nous avons tous de la fièvre. Le sol est trop profondément gelé pour que nous puissions enterrer les morts, si bien que nous les entreposons dans l'une des petites maisons construites à l'intention des visiteurs.''  De retour du 37 ème Salon du livre de Montréal, je vous propose un entretien avec Michel Vézina à propos de son dernier roman: Disparues paru en 2014 aux éditions Coups de tête.

Tin Mine mix tape for Urban Accents: May 2014. Featuring the ideas of Ron Finley, Allan Watts, Michael Meade & Joseph Boyden.

To celebrate the vernal equinox in the tradition of Chris’ ancestors, we at once lamely lament the continued dearth of female voices on our podcast, and simultaneously criticize The Agenda for their disingenuous comments about their own sausage party. We then recap this year’s Canada Reads series and how it brought some passionate discussion about colonization onto the mainstream airwaves, as well as the critiques and responses around Joseph Boyden’s book The Orenda. Then Chris launches an Escape Velocity Radio Reads segment featuring books he hasn’t yet finished, and we discuss some ideas on how decolonization, indigenous resurgence, and animal liberation might relate to each other.Episode LinksWhere, Oh Where, Are All the Female Guests? Canada ReadsCritical Review Of Joseph Boyden's "The Orenda": A Timeless, Classic Colonial Alibi The Ecological Hoofprint: The Global Burden of Industrial LivestockBlack Flags and Windmills: Hope, Anarchy, and the Common Ground CollectiveVeganism in the Occupied Territories: Anti-Colonialism and Animal LiberationIs There No Room for Rod Coronado in the Animal Rights Movement? The Problem with Veganism as the Moral BaselineEpisode MusicBikini Kill – Statement of Vindication

Libby Purves meets former soldier-turned-writer Andy McNab; Cheryl Knight, who is in charge of shoes at the Royal Opera House; author Joseph Boyden and producer John Lloyd. Andy McNab is a former SAS soldier-turned-writer. He was a foundling who joined the infantry with the Royal Green Jackets, progressing to the SAS. In the Gulf War he commanded the Bravo Two Zero patrol and later wrote a book about his experiences. He has just spent the last year as the Reading Agency's literacy ambassador for the 6 Book Challenge visiting prisons and factories to encourage young people to read. Cheryl Knight is opera footwear supervisor at the Royal Opera House and in her spare time performs as Joyce Grenfell in her one-woman show, Turn Back the Clock. The show is Cheryl's tribute to the writer and performer who died in 1979 and is remembered for her witty monologues - including her popular sketch as a harassed nursery school teacher. Cheryl is currently assembling the shoe collection for two Royal Opera House productions - Parsifal and Carmen. Turn Back the Clock is at Waterloo East Theatre. Joseph Boyden is a prize-winning Canadian author whose new book, the Orenda, draws on his own background. He is a descendant of Canada's First Nations and was educated by Jesuits. The Orenda is set in the wilds of 17th century North America when Europeans were colonising the region and the First Nation tribes fought among themselves and suffered under the invaders. The Orenda is published by Oneworld. Producer and writer John Lloyd is best known for his work on comedy programmes including Not the Nine O'Clock News, Spitting Image, the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy and QI. He is currently the Radio 4 presenter of the Museum of Curiosity, a spin-off from QI. His new book Afterliff - the New Dictionary of Things There Should Be Words For, written with Jon Canter, is published by Faber and Faber. Producer: Paula McGinley.

Joseph Boyden, Sarah Elton, and Thomas King are three of Canada’s most acclaimed authors. Boyden splits his time between Ontario and New Orleans and his first novel, 2005’s Three Day Road, about a pair of Cree soldiers fighting in World War I, received a number of awards and was shortlisted for the Governor General’s Award […]

Joseph Boyden talks about his novel "Three Day Road", which tells the story of two Cree hunters who serve as snipers during World War I, where their skills in tracking and marksmanship are much valued. The novel starts after the war, in 1919, when an elderly Oji-Cree woman, Niska, meets Elijah, one of the two snipers, who has returned gravely injured and addicted to morphine. As Niska paddles him home in her canoe on the three-day journey, she tells him stories of her life and Xavier wrestles with his conscience about the horrifying experiences on the battlefield. (Originally aired June 2005.)

Joseph Boyden talks about his novel "Three Day Road", which tells the story of two Cree hunters who serve as snipers during World War I, where their skills in tracking and marksmanship are much valued. The novel starts after the war, in 1919, when an elderly Oji-Cree woman, Niska, meets Elijah, one of the two snipers, who has returned gravely injured and addicted to morphine. As Niska paddles him home in her canoe on the three-day journey, she tells him stories of her life and Xavier wrestles with his conscience about the horrifying experiences on the battlefield. (Originally aired June 2005.)

Author Joseph Boyden explores the aboriginal experience in much of his writing. He has written novels like "Three Day Road" and the Giller Prize Winning "Through Black Spruce", as well as the non-fictional account of Louis Riel and Gabriel Dumont. He was at the IFOA's Aboriginal Authors Festival in Barrie.

Joseph Boyden is the author of "Louis Riel and Gabriel Dumont", which tells us how the two Metis leaders shaped Canada as we know it today. It is part of the Extraordinary Canadians Series.

Joseph Boyden (born 31 Oct 1966) is, Wikipedia tells us, a Canadian novelist and short story writer. "He grew up in Willowdale, North York, Ontario and attended the Jesuit-run Brebeuf College School." His father Raymond Wilfrid Boyden, was a medical officer who was awarded the Distinguished Service Order and was the highest-decorated medical officer of World War II. Of Irish, Scottish and Métis decent, Boyden writes about the First Nations heritage and culture. Three Day Road, is a novel about two Cree soldiers serving in the Canadian military during World War I. It was inspired by Ojibwa Francis Pegahmagabow, the legendary First World War sniper. Boyden's second novel, follows the story of Will, son of one of the characters in Through Black SpruceThree Day Road. It won the Giller Prize. He studied creative writing at York University and the University of New Orleans, and subsequently taught in the Aboriginal Student Program at Northern College. He divides his time between Louisiana, where he and his wife, Amanda Boyden, are writers in residence, and Northern Ontario." We met recently in Ottawa to talk about his contribution to Penguin's Extraordinary Canadians series, Louis Riel & Gabriel Dumont (apologies for all the background clammer. It recedes a bit after the first few minutes).

We get together once again to talk about Pixar's Up and 3D in general. Trevor reviews a book in which a dude makes friends with a bear (amongst other things). Finally, we talk about Terminator: Salvation and how Sam Worthingtom totally showed up Christian Bale and Moon Bloodgood's tits showed up everyone.

Joseph Boyden won The 2008 Giller Prize  for his novel Through Black Spruce.  We talk here about the novel, and the psychic distance Joseph requires to write novels about Northern Ontario and the Cree; the similarities between North and South, James Bay and New Orleans; snowmobiling over vast amounts of snow-covered bush, isolation in the wilderness; bridges between communities, oral culture, First Nation humour, respect for myths and legends, and soapboxes. Please excuse the abrupt ending!