Diversity Hire

Hello and welcome to episode 59. This is our last interview for a while, and we decided to talk to our friend Camille Bromley, who is one of our favorite magazine editors. We talked about why magazines still matter, even when working at them is incredibly painful. We think you guys will really like this conversation and have so enjoyed all the conversations we’ve had so far. Thank you (REALLY) for listening. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Today, Kevin & Arjun talk about nihilistic tendencies with regards to Ben Simmons, 1 on 1 hangouts, The Believer, and our own podcast. We’ll have a guest next week! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 57 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Ian F. Blair, the editor of the LA Times’ weekend magazine Image. Our conversation covered: keeping a low profile online, why the fuck do we keep making magazines, how not to make a bland milquetoast publication, telling the story of a community, Laker fandom, and much more. Kevin and Arjun talked about not understanding the Bad Art Friend discourse and why Franklin Park is the lamest party location in all of New York. Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome! We are back from the hiatus. We talked to journalist and editor Tristan Ahtone about how badly the mainstream media covers Native issues and what can be done to make it better, how the edit a magazine like a painter, the vast and weird world of the Southwest, getting to know a community rather parachuting in for one-off reports, the cruel history of land grant universities and whether and the possibility of reparations, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also deliver a state of the pod (we might be winding down soon and working on new projects!!!), our favorite grocery stores, why media news is so boring right now. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 55 of Diversity Hire. We are proud to present our state of the pod with a podcast reporting legend and small business owner Nick Quah. We talked about the past, present, and future of the medium we all participate in, vibes vs audio fidelity, why narrative podcasts are annoying, why we keep listening to podcasts we know are bad for us, why we pod (friends!!), and much more. Also, Kevin and Arjun are going to take a month off from the pod! See you guys in September. Thanks for all the support so far. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Diversity Hire. Today is a special episode, a pilot for a potential pay-walled project we are thinking of calling The Minority Report. Our inaugural guest is art world maven Dean Kissick. Lots of tea was spilled about the origins of current hot neighborhoods, E-flux talks, autofiction, the SCENE, working out and staying healthy, and why fiction is the hardest art of all. Kevin and Arjun talk about the misplaced nostalgia of current partying, being grumpy, and whiteboy bands that suck. Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 53 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest is Wesley Lowery, who is a journalist at CBS News for 60 Minutes and a contributing editor at the Marshall Project. We talked about the ways public humiliation can be used to create change inside newsrooms, the publishing power afforded to journalists via social media, the myth of objectivity, and what virtues journalism should instead model itself after, being profiled by Ben Smith, and much more. This episode was part of our collaboration with Montez Press! Welcome if you came upon it from there. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 52 of Diversity Hire. Longtime listeners will be glad to know this is the episode with the BEST AUDIO QUALITY we’ve ever achieved. That’s because we got a professional podcast producer to talk to us: B.A. Parker of the Cut. We had a really fun and wide-ranging conversation about Columbia grad programs, having NO JOURNALISM EXPERIENCE!!!, developing one’s podcast/radio voice, the presumed (white) audience for podcasting, and much more. Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to an old episode of the Diversity Hire. It’s our podcast’s first birthday and we’re tired. We are busy at work on our collaboration with Montez Press Radio, so we decided to revisit an episode we released on July 1, 2020: Our conversation with Jay Caspian Kang. Pretty much everything Jay has said about the cynical way the media implicated itself during the uprisings of last summer came true.Anyway….thanks for bearing with us and we are excited to bring you a new episode next week. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

(Sorry if you’re receiving this for a second time, there were technical difficulties)Hello and welcome to Episode 50 of Diversity Hire. Thanks for making it this far with us. We have a special guest for you guys this week: Max Tani of The Daily Beast. WE 👏GOT👏 MESSY👏A few of the topics include: Who invented the concept of Dimes Square, going to parties, Google docs full of gossip waiting to become news, hating DC, the ups and downs and ups of the media labor movement, our thoughts on B*n Sm**h, media’s broken star system, shouting out our influential listeners, and a WHOLE LOT more. If you are a new or old listener, thanks for sticking it out with us. Enjoy this episode!! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 49 of Diversity Hire.Today we talked to Arit John, who is a lifestyle reporter for the LA Times. We talked about the surprising similarities between politicians and Tik Tok stars, covering the 2016 campaign, how awful the three media capitals - NYC, LA, DC - truly are, appearing on C-SPAN, and much more. Kevin and Arjun talked about the end of Gemini season and a special birthday. Thanks for listening.Arit’s work:Some Democratic Candidates Face a Reckoning in a Diverse FieldThe Future Teen Stars of America Live on TikTokMeet the influencers who actually stayed home during the pandemicInside TikTok’s effort to open doors for its Black rising starsArit on C-SPAN Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 48 of Diversity HireKevin and Arjun dished on: boat parties, roof parties, gallery parties, the Deans list (Baquet, Blunt, & Kissick), the NBA playoffs, friends leaving NYC for LA, giving up on veganism, the A**a W*nt*ur picket, Bugbee/Sicha Freaky Friday, the future of the Styles desk, dating, practicing ad reads for when we get bought, our new favorite coffee startup, and a whole lot more. Thanks for listening!! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 47 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Tyler Tynes who is the staff sports writer at GQ. Our conversation covered annihilating objectivity in order to cover athletes and the politics of sports more honestly, Tyler’s stint as a local beat reporter in Atlantic City, the commodification of protest, why sports reporting always seems to lack a much-needed dose of nuance, and much more. Kevin and Arjun talk about how it sucks to be busy as the season of Summer Friday approaches. Thanks for listening!Tyler’s writing discussed in the episode:Leave Naomi Osaka Alone“This Has to Happen for Change to Happen”: A Night of Protest, Pain, and Peace in BrooklynThe Great NBA AwakeningColin Kaepernick’s NFL Exile Feels Like Forever Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 46 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Julia Carrie Wong, who is a reporter at the Guardian US. Much of our conversation focuses on Julia’s incredible reporting on Facebook’s abuses of power and oversight all around the world. If you wanted to hear about just how evil Facebook is—from its colonial disposition to its thirst for global power—this is the podcast for you. But we also talked about the state of freelance journalism, the long shadow of the Karen meme, and burning out from tech reporting. Kevin and Arjun talk about partying in the 2010s and Facebook’s role in that too. Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 45 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest was New York Times sports reporter Andrew Keh. We talked about the meaning of sports and competition in our times, how bad the food in Berlin is, what it’s like to travel around the world to cover every kind of sport imaginable, how Andrew practices a kind of reporting that looks beyond boxscores, the Olympics and protest, and much more. Kevin and Arjun talked about the arrival of shorts weather, complicated feelings about experiencing Indian culture in Dimes Square, and demystifying some big stories in the world of freelancing and media unions. Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to our 44th episode.Today we talked to Terry Nguyen, who is a reporter at the Goods by Vox. Our conversation covered generational politics and why they are rooted in whiteness, the feeling of being caught between generations (AKA cusp-fucked), talking to our Asian American elders, memes, crushes, and much more. Arjun and Kevin talked about the narcissism of differences that define young millennials and elder millennials and how the only real difference between generations is how each shows their ass. Thanks for listening!Terry’s writing:what if gen z picks the red pillHow thrifting became problematicHow social justice slideshows took over InstagramSupport for Trump is tearing apart Vietnamese American familiesThe torturous delight of having a pandemic crushThe challenge of combating fake news in Asian American communities Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to 43 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Justin Ellis, who is the special projects editor at Defector and is also at work on a book about Black life in Minneapolis. We talked about reporting from his hometown in the last year, what it was like to be at the courthouse when the decision from the Chauvin trial was made public, the unsavory and exhausting but sometimes necessary task of being asked to report on your identity and race, how reporting on the media during the heyday of the pivot broke his brain, if the Minnesota Timberwolves will ever be good in our lifetimes, and much more. Thank you for listening!Justin’s writing:Minnesota Values White Comfort More Than Black LivesMinneapolis Had This ComingRich People Are Never Going to Save MediaExit music (for content): Parting #hottakes on the life cycle of the media business Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 42 of Diversity Hire. (This episode is rated M for Mature. Listener discretion is advised.)Today we talked to New York Magazine’s Allison P. Davis, America’s greatest commentator on sex, love, dating, and the myriad ways those forces intersect with power and celebrity. Our conversation covered Allison’s incredible skills as a host, dating during COVID, the different definitions and expressions of being horny, the life and death of the celebrity profile, celibacy, intimacy, touching, making out, and much much more. Arjun also opens up about his sexuality, or, lack thereof.Thanks for listening and please take Allison’s horny census.Allison’s writing:‘Yeah, I’m Not for Everyone.’ Lena Dunham comes to terms with herself, 2019Are You Ready to Be Touched?, 2020Dating in Captivity, 2020Living With Karens, 2020The End of Kimye’s Wild Ride, 2021 Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to the 41st episode of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Joshua Hunt, a globe-trotting freelance reporter, who originally hails from Petersburg, Alaska. We talked about Josh’s winding path to journalism, the consequences of the personal essay economy, writing from an Indigenous perspective, how and why first-person experience can affect reporting, ageism, hype beasts and sneakerheads, why you shouldn’t wear Nike, and a lot more. This was a really fun conversation and a bit different from our previous ones, so hope you stick around to the end. Kevin and Arjun also talked about our promise to stop talking about Dimes Sq, feeling incoherent, and the worst feeling of all: being perceived. Thanks for listening!Joshua’s writing:We Didn’t Stand a Chance Against Opioids, TNR, 2019The Art of Eviction, The Nation, 2020To Catch a Counterfeiter, California Sunday, 2017Sneakerheads Have Turned Jordans and Yeezys Into a Bona Fide Asset Class, Bloomberg, 2021University of Nike, HOW CORPORATE CASH BOUGHT AMERICAN HIGHER EDUCATION, Penguin Random House, 2018 Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 40 of Diversity Hire.We had planned to release a wonderful interview (which will come out next week), but instead, we decided to give ourselves some breathing room and talked about media, perception, and being seen/scene.No guest this week, just vibes, mostly bad ones! Twitter sucks (Kevin just deactivated!!) Work sucks. And most of all Kevin and Arjun hate being perceived right now. So pull up a chair, and listen to our 20-minute rant about why we need a break this week.Thank you for listening :) We have an incredible guest lined up for next week, and until then we hope you enjoy two idiots talk about LIFE.As always, if you have questions: diversityhirepod@gmail.com Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 39. To all the new listeners who found our podcast from Camille Bromley’s CJR profile, welcome. To our Day Ones, welcome back.Today we talked to Siddhartha Mahanta, who is an editor at the New York Times Opinion section. We talked about the oft-ignored humanity of journalism, the journalist’s commitment to be humane, why publications need to stand up to bullies, why writers hate the dreaded ‘nut graf,’ the fine art of editing, corny Indian-Americans, and much more.Kevin and Arjun talked about their recent profile in CJR and the spate of incredibly nice weather in NYC. Thanks for listening!Sid’s editing and writing:The story of Jamal Khashoggi's murder and how the world looked the other way, Evan Ratliff, Business Insider, 2019There Are Two Asian-Americas, and One Is Invisible, Claudine Ko, The New York Times, 2021Journalism Under Siege, Samanth Subramanian, Rest of World, 2021When It’s Time to Say Goodbye to the Old House , Longreads, 2017This is your brain *picture of your brain*. This is your brain on Diversity Hire *it’s the same picture of your brain, but this time it’s wearing Issey Miyake trousers*. Any questions? If so, email us at diversityhirepod@gmail.com. We’ll read your questions in an upcoming Q&A episode. Also, please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts. You can use your review to share anonymous experiences of working in corporate media, and we will read those on the pod as well.Thanks,Arjun & Kevin Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 38! Listen on Apple PodcastsListen on SpotifyToday we talked to Delia Cai, who is the proprietor of the wonderful Substack Deez Links and a growth and trends editor at Buzzfeed. We talked about go-to orders at Dimes, content strategy, why she’s optimistic about the future of the media, the pernicious feeling of needing to catch up to your peers, knowing when things reach their natural end, what it’s like to be in the Substack game, and much more. Arjun and Kevin also had the debate of the century: Vaccine posting etiquette. Thanks for listening.Delia’s work mentioned in this episode:The Small-Town America I Love Is The One I See At Football Games, Buzzfeed, 2017Subscriptions start working for the middle, Neiman Lab, 2020Newsletter internships = the new foot in the door?, Deez Links, 2021finding asian joy on (duh) tiktok, Deez Links, 2021>> Diversity Hire Links:Tammy has a new labor story about the PRO ActLauen has been writing about the Amazon piss situationHua wrote about basketball podcastsMarie wrote about rent controlDoreen wrote about Michelle Obama’s new TV showRachelle has a cool new podcastIsabelia covered women in the Brazilian grime sceneBijan’s latest video game columnHere’s a video Arjun made for Vanity Fair Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 37 of Diversity Hire. Listen on Apple PodcastsListen on SpotifyToday’s guest is Doreen St. Felix, who is the New Yorker’s television critic. We have been looking forward to this conversation since we first started the pod, and we think you guys will enjoy everything we talked about, which ran the gamut from the art of ambiguity and ambivalence, when we figured out what a critic even was, finding a place in white-dominated spaces, the concessions we make to do the work we want to do, and is Virgil Abloh actually cool? This was a super fun episode and if you are a new listener who caught this on Montez Press Radio, WELCOME! Kevin and Arjun also talked about the week in brutal media news and why it feels like 2016. Thanks for listening.Doreen’s work mentioned in this episode:December 19, 2015 Part I, Enormous Eye, 2015KARA WALKER’S NEXT ACT, Vulture, 2017On the Street in Brooklyn the Morning After the Police Shooting of Saheed Vassell, The New Yorker, 2018Virgil Abloh, Menswear’s Biggest Star, The New Yorker, 2019Queen Latifah Obliterates Trumps n’ Musks in “The Equalizer”, The New Yorker, 2021The Embarrassment of Democrats Wearing Kente-Cloth Stoles, The New Yorker, 2020———This is your brain *picture of your brain*. This is your brain on Diversity Hire *it’s the same picture of your brain, but this time it’s wearing sunglasses and an Eckhaus Latta lapped t-shirt*. Any questions? If so, email us at diversityhirepod@gmail.com. We’ll read your questions in an upcoming Q&A episode. Also, please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts. You can use your review to share anonymous experiences of working in corporate media, and we will read those on the pod as well.Thanks,Arjun & Kevin Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to P̶o̶p̶u̶l̶i̶s̶t̶ ̶T̶i̶p̶s̶ Episode 36 of Diversity Hire.It has been a tough and trying week and we weren’t sure if we should even do an episode this week. But we’re so happy that our guest, Chris Gayomali, was down to talk with us.Chris is an articles editor at GQ. Fifty weeks ago, Chris wrote an article for GQ titled “The New Fear for Asian-Americans Going Out in Public.” It’s surreal to think about what has and, sadly, hasn’t changed since March 2020. In today’s episode, we spoke about identity, invisibility, and the interstitial space that Asians occupy in America. We also talked about basketball, Steven Yeun, Filipino food, “menswear”, and shopping tips.Thanks for listening. Thanks for subscribing. Thanks for being here for us.Chris’ work:The New Fear for Asian-Americans Going Out in PublicSteven Yeun’s New FrontierErrolson Hugh Sees the FutureInside the NBA Bubble by Taylor RooksThe Phrase "People of Color" Needs to Die by Damon Young Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 35 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest was Tommy Craggs, and we had a rollicking conversation about an era of media we are still trying to understand: the reign of Gawker. We dove into Tommy’s time as the editor Deadspin and later the executive editor of Gakwer and what both of those sites contributed to what we now call THE DISCOURSE. We also talked about the halcyon days of NY media, why blogging sucks, arbiters of bad faith and the climate around cultural politics, and finally a question I’m sure you guys have been thinking about for ages: What even is journalism? Kevin and Arjun also talked about Ben Smith’s EXPOSÉ of the downtown scene and the difference between scolding and clowning people. Thanks for listening.Articles:What’s the Matter With Cultural Politics? (written 1 month after the 2020 election)This Election Was About the Issues (written 2 days before the 2016 election)Journalistic standards in reporting of the Te’o hoax: Q&A with Deadspin’s Tommy CraggsAn Exclusive Interview With Tommy Craggs About The Bill Simmons "Grantland" Project 2 Gawker Editors Resign Over Article’s RemovalThe SideshowDark Side Of The Locker Room: Stephon Marbury Is Puzzled By My GodlessnessWe’re gonna skip doing timecodes this week because I (Arjun) just got back from Rhodora and am a bit too tipsy to find the topics in the episode. Maybe I’ll edit it tomorrow. Maybe not. Let us know if the timecodes are useful. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 34 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest was Emmanuel Felton, who is an investigative reporter at Buzzfeed. We talked about his experiences covering education and segregation in the South and in Boston, why the identity and biases of journalists matter, especially when covering race and education, what it was like to talk to Black police officers who fought back rioters at the capitol on 1/6, abolishing Ivy League schools, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about their favorite snacks and the revenge of FOMO that spring will bring. Thanks for listening!Kevin and Arjun talk about early-onset FOMO (0:00)Emmanuel Felton leads us through his career timeline (8:43)On the diploma factory, aka Columbia Journalism School (12:48)How Emmanuel began covering education (15:03)Emmanuel’s writing a book about the Boston school desegregation program (17:42)The new mainstream media interest about desegregation (20:50)How are people rationalizing resegregation (re: “The Department of Justice Is Overseeing the Resegregation of American Schools,” The Nation, 2017) (23:17)Who “gets” to tell the story about school segregation? (25:00)Being a justice-oriented reporter (27:45)Will the media start ignoring stories of injustice under Biden? (29:50)Joining BuzzFeed and covering race and racism (33:19)Reporting on Black cops at the insurrection (re: “Black Police Officers Describe The Racist Attacks They Faced As They Protected The Capitol,” BuzzFeed News, 2020) (36:20)Coving Black police officers in the aftermath of last year’s protests (42:30)On living in SoHo (47:10)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Have Facts Corner (49:07)The Diversity Tribunal (55:03) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 33 of Diversity Hire.No guest this week, so go ahead and 30-second-fast-forward through this entire episode. Kevin and Arjun ramble incessantly about how you can’t mourn the loss of something that was already dead (Dimes Square), the problem with “diversity” in the New York Times Diversity Report, how white people need to stop telling other white people what is and isn’t cultural appropriation, and more. If you like this episode please tweet at us about it because we are very self-conscious and shy.Arjun’s Twitch Obama impersonation (0:58)The Drunken Canal, the death of little New York, and the problem with little magazines (3:58)The New York Times Diversity Report (12:03)TNYGuild’s unrecognized workBari Weiss’s does it again! (19:14)TTSG’s episode with Jaeki Cho (24:22)Daft Junk? (28:27) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to our longest episode of Diversity Hire yet!!On our 32nd episode, we were honored to have a conversation with Asian America's foremost tastemaker, the one and only Hua Hsu. This barnburner of a conversation covered Julius Randle and the Knicks, how campus politics has changed since Hua was in college, what it was like to teach one of our podcast co-hosts, being washed and making zines, being a public school person, West Coast vs East Coast aesthetic and intellectual experience, can representation still matter???, what does it mean to be an activist, and MUCH MUCH MUCH MORE. Kevin and Arjun also talk about the Reply All controversy and how darkly ironic it is. Stick around and listen to this full episode, you won’t regret it ;) Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about Reply All [this was recorded before the hosts stepped down] (0:00)We’re joined by Hua Hsu, a dedicated Diversity Hire listener (6:40)Quick Take! (9:45)Hua leads us through his career timeline (11:22)Why east coast kids feel like they’re a step a head of everyone else (17:39)What was it like to teach Kevin at Vassar? (26:30)How has teaching the youth shaped Hua’s views of idpol and progress (re: “Corky Lee’s Photographs Helped Generations of Asian-Americans See Themselves", The New Yorker, 2020) (31:36)Being an “activist” (36:52)What is diversity? (re: “The Rise and Fall of Affirmative Action”, The New Yorker, 2018) (47:11)Why do Asians act like that? (49:52)Who is winning the narrative of Asian America? (re: “Are Asian Americans the Last Undecided Voters", The New Yorker, 2020) (57:27)Can we organize via a cross immigrant identity? (1:02:07)How did hustle become an excuse for labor exploitation? (re: “How Can We Pay for Creativity in the Digital Age”, The New Yorker, 2020) (1:09:04)What place does the critic occupy in a world where art is infinitely accessible? (1:18:10)Reminiscing on the good ol’ Warriors (1:21:00)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:24:10)The Diversity Tribunal (1:41:43) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 31 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest was Osita Nwanevu a staff writer at The New Republic. We talked about why we are all sick of talking about cancel culture, the shitty incentives of the online writing economy, reactionary liberals, the ups-and-downs of elite media, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about one podcast host’s grievous injury and why you should go to urgent care when you get hurt. Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about Arjun’s finger injury and mid-century modern furniture. (0:00)Osita Nwanevu walks us through his career timeline (11:00)Osita on his political evolution (16:25)Osita on the influence of 2010s policy political blogs (21:00)Osita on Substack, platforms, and the rise of reactionary liberalism (22:00) (re: The Willful Blindness of Reactionary Liberalism, The New Republic)Osita on the echo chamber of the commentariat. (re: It’s Time to Stop Yammering About Liberal Bias, Slate) (25:55)Osita on the pitfalls of the freedom of speech beat and campus politics. (29:00) (re: Political Writings, Harpers)Osita on the loosening grip of the anti-woke commentariat on public opinion. (38:30)Osita on what the elite media can offer and what it cannot. (41:30)Osita on Rick MacArthur’s soft ball game (47:00)Osita on how his own politics have functioned in his various media workplaces. (49:30) Osita on the terrible incentives of the online writing economy (53:00)Osita on the value of debate (59:00)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:00:02)The Diversity Tribunal (1:00:13) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Welcome to the 30th episode of Diversity Hire! Today’s guest was New York Times critic-at-large Maya Phillips. We talked about the pleasure and terror that comes with fandom, the perils of colorblind casting, the role a critic’s identity and politics play in the way they evaluate art, why there need to be more editors of color, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about the novel the media elites are all reading and the media elites who are listening to the podcast. You can buy Maya’s first book, Erou, here, and be on the lookout for her second book, NERD: On Navigating Heroes, Magic, and Fandom in the 21st Century, dropping in 2022.Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about viral novels and bluechecks (0:00)Maya Phillips talks about her recent move (7:07)Maya walks us through her career timeline (8:19)What Maya thinks about colorblind casting and the discourse around representation in film and TV (re: “‘Hamilton,’ ‘The Simpsons’ and the Problem With Colorblind Casting,” The New York Times, 2020) (15:30)On having to deal with assignments where you’re asked to translate Black art to white audiences (re: “August Wilson, American Bard,” T Magazine, 2020) (20:40)How can we change the critical lens to account for the lack of racial analysis of white-led films? (24:46)What does Maya make of the kind of anxiety editors have about making sure the identity of the critic lines up with the art? (28:13)It feels like we’re constantly having to explain ourselves (re: “The Smithsonian’s Black-History Museum Will Always Be a Failure and a Success,” The New Yorker, 2019) (31:09)Maya’s experience with working with editors of color (33:20)How does Maya’s political diet affect her role as a critic? (re: “Black Women Are the Superheroes the World Needs,” The New York Times, 2020) (35:45)What’s Maya watching? (40:56)How has writing about theatre, film, and television affected Maya’s consumption (43:03) On fandom (re: NERD: On Navigating Heroes, Magic, and Fandom in the 21st Century, 2022) (45:58)Do fans misunderstand the place that criticism is supposed to inhabit in our society? (49:33)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (52:58)The Diversity Tribual (1:00:42) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to the 29th episode of Diversity Hire. Today's guest was Isabelia Herrera (Pitchfork, Remezcla, MoMA PS1 Warm Up). We talked about explaining facets of one’s culture to a dumb Anglo-American audience, toxic media workplaces, why Latinx and POC are similarly toothless terms, and Kevin’s attempt to DJ at the next edition of Warm Up. Arjun and Kevin also talk about the pay transparency discourse and living in New York when you make NO MONEY. Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about starting salaries (0:00)Isabelia calls in from Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic (9:04)Isabelia leads us through her career timeline (10:29)We talk about Isabelia’s experience at Remezcla, an outlet that came under fire last year for having a toxic work environment (re: “'He Broke Me': Inside the Toxic Workplace at Groundbreaking Latinx Culture Site Remezcla”, Emily Alford, Jezebel, 2020) (13:48)What does Isabelia make of terms like Latinx and Latinidad (19:44)Why do white people hire people of color to explain to them why they’re racist? (“How Much of the New American Songbook Will Be Sung in Spanish?,” Slate, 2018) (29:56)How are perspectives changing with regard to colorism in criticism? (re: “An Introduction to Urbano in 50 Songs,” Pitchfork, 2020) (37:47)What’s it like to be one of Forbes’ 30 under 30? (41:57)What’s it like to help curate MoMA PS1 Warm Up? (45:24)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (50:00)The Diversity Tribunal (53:43) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 28 of Diversity Hire. Today’s guest is Iva Dixit, who is the audience editor of the New York Times Magazine. Previously she has held positions at The New Yorker, Newsweek, and the Economist. We talked about being an immigrant in the media, the reasons why most social media departments are filled with women and people of color, how the nerd culture mindset has infiltrated the antiracist discourse, becoming a grown-up who buys antiques, and more. Also, Arjun and Iva wax about their dear alma matter, Columbia Journalism School, and Kevin gives us an update on his new apartment.Stick around for the Diversity Tribunal, Iva dropped some bars. Also make sure to check out Iva’s latest article on Bollywood Wives, which was her first piece published in The New York Times Magazine.Thanks for listening!Kevin talks about his brand spanking new apartment (0:00)Iva calls in from The New York Times building (suck on that Barbaro) (5:29)Iva leads us through her career timeline (7:56)Iva’s recaps her prolific 4-day tenure at Mic (11:26)Arjun and Iva talk about why Columbia Journalism School sucks (16:16)Iva talks about how social media professionals are treated in the newsroom (21:11)Iva’s jaw-dropping story about an unnamed editor at an unnamed publication (24:54)Why are most social media professionals women and people of color? (30:40)Being an immigrant journalist at the mercy of the whims of a hostile country (re: “Notes from a Sink-less Underground,” The Regular, 2020) (35:00)Kevin asks the corny American question :3 (39:30)Skin routines, and finding stability (re: “I Quit My Elaborate Skincare Routine,” The New York Times, 2020) (42:02)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (57:30)The Diversity Tribunal (51:55) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 27 of Diversity Hire. Today's guest is Donnie Kwak who is the General Manager of Complex. We talked about how Donnie survived decades of many media pivots, music blogging in the early 2000s, why Asian American Twitter sucks, the vexed relationship ASAM folks have with other marginalized peoples, the plague of corniness, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about the James Harden trade...and Kevin’s podcast listening habits.Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk basketball and podcasts (0:00)Donnie Kwak on being Gen X (8:10)Donnie leads us through his career timeline (10:13)What does Donnie do as the GM of Complex? (19:08)What Donnie has learned from working through various forms of media (22:20)On giving Desus and Mero their first break (25:18)On representation and being a racial cheerleader (re: “‘Crazy Rich Asians,’ ‘To All the Boys I’ve Loved Before,’ and the Growing Pains of Representation,” The Ringer, 2018) (29:19)The lack of criticality in Asian America and Asian Twitter (32:13)The narrative hasn’t shifted (35:30)Donnie’s hypothetical book, Stop Being Asian (40:02)On 88Rising and the ways in which Asian Americans can profit off of Black culture while benefitting from white privilege (44:18)On the power of group chats (re: “The Internet’s Safest Space Is Group Chat,” The Ringer, 2017) (54:14)Against corniness (59:06)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:01:52)The Diversity Tribunal (1:12:02) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Welcome to 2021 aka the 26th episode of Diversity Hire. Today on this guestless episode, Kevin and Arjun talk about what the hell happened on Capital Hill yesterday, how the internet and the media working in concert destroyed discourse, why having an opinion sucks, why you should save all your thoughts for the group chat, and why, amidst it all, Kevin is having a good 2021 so far. Thanks for listening! We’ll have a guest next week we promise. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to the 25th episode of Diversity Hire: Our season 1 finale!! Today we talked to the wonderful Rachelle Hampton, who is a staff writer at Slate. Our conversation covered why you should appreciate your fact-checker, the psychic toll of being a diversity hire, Charlamagne Tha God and white America’s desire for one Black voice, the experience of being a Black journalist in the last decade, and much more. Kevin and Arjun meanwhile didn’t talk about much besides the snow day that just hit NYC. We’ll be back in 2021. Thanks for listening!Arjun and Kevin talk about feeling hygge (0:00)We talk to Rachelle Hampton about her current work setup (8:15)Rachelle leads us through her career timeline (12:00)Having to meet traffic goals as a journalist (15:30)Rachelle talks about the sneaking question in the back of our minds: What if I’m just a diversity hire? (17:50)Rachelle explains how she put together a group chat of Black journalists for Slate (re: “White People Don’t Respond to Our Pain; They Respond to Theirs,” Slate, 2020) (24:03)How did Rachelle feel with regards to having to report on the same, unchanging Black tragedy in America (30:33)The way in which Black journalists have to be spokespeople for their entire race (35:22)Charlamagne Tha God and the ways in which white America have used the Breakfast Club to reach the Black audience (re: “The Voice of Black America?,” Slate, 2020) (39:07)How Rachelle developed her story about college debt (re: “Debt Nation,” Slate, 2020)Everyone should be a simp for their fact-checkers (49:28)We decide the fate of The New Republic (54:44)The way in which white journalists see the Black struggle in the newsroom as a “young person” issue (55:42)We talk about our favorite guy (1:01:45)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:06:15)The Diversity Tribunal (1:16:45) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 24. This is Arjun.My head hurts. I feel like I’ve been in nonstop pain this entire year. Yes, it’s because of the pandemic, and we cannot forget the unmanageable political anxiety that continues to fester in Biden’s America. But on top of it all, the question that has prolonged this never-ending migraine is: How can I fix the lack of diversity in the media?Over the course of this podcast’s existence, we’ve presented this mind-melting noggin noodler to some of the most talented journalists of color in the industry. There were many answers, but there seemed to be one overarching sentiment: this is a dumb question and we shouldn’t be wasting our guests’ time with it. But we begged them to humor us.In this week’s episode, Kevin and I look back at the various outcomes of The Diversity Tribunal.Arjun and Kevin talk about the year’s end and New York’s death (0:00)The Diversity Tribunal (6:46)“People should leave.” -Jay Caspian Kang (7:55)“The media industry exists as an exploitative force.” -Maya Binyam (12:17)“We have to stop letting old institutions and bastions of corporate media be our gods.” -Jazmine Hughes (15:15)“Fire everybody. Cancel media.” -K. Austin Collins (17:35)“Random selection.” -Katie Way (18:07)“A lot of people need to quit their job and create space.” -Gabe Schneider (18:32)“Abolish legacy media.” -Lauren Kaori Gurley (18:49)“There needs to be more well paying entry-level jobs.” -Madeline Leung Coleman (19:45)“Disempower every white person at the top of a magazine and empower every young person at the bottom.” -Bijan Stephen (23:03)“Pay yourselves less, pay others better starting salaries, stop hiring people from fancy colleges.” -Gaby Del Valle (24:41)“Hire people who worked, who are poor, who experienced these platforms.” -Edward Ongweso Jr. (25:31)“Every publishing company has to have quotas.” -Rafia Zakaria (28:50)“Hire more non-white people. Quotas.” -Meher Ahmad (28:58)“I don’t know, guys. Does it matter?” -E. Tammy Kim (29:07)“I don’t believe in the media.” -Rahel Aima (30:11)“The only answer I can think of is to unionize and organize. That is the one sign of hope that I can see.” -Vinson Cunningham (31:35)“Above all, we need to take care of each other.” -Marie Solis (32:22)“The best way to diversity the media is to ensure more people can prop up a shop of their own” -Giri Nathan (36:44)“I just want to be a junior staff writer.” -Clio Chang (38:05) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 23 of Diversity Hire. Listen on Apple PodcastsListen on SpotifyToday we talked to one of the best labor reporters in the game—Lauren Kaori Gurley. We talked about why labor reporting was once (and still is to some) an underappreciated beat, how race informs the way we talk about workplaces, her run-ins with the feds while reporting on meatpacking workers, why unions are GOOD, and much more. Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about the upcoming layoff nightmare (0:00)Lauren Kaori Gurley guides us through her career timeline (6:09)Was journalism school helpful? (14:42)Why is the labor beat underappreciated and why it’s so important now (15:39)Why are we experiencing a labor journalism revival? (17:22)Lauren’s story about getting arrested at a hog farm (19:24)How monopolistic companies are incentivized to abuse workers (24:38)Is the labor beat going mainstream? (26:04)The depressing reality of reporting on Amazon (re: “Secret Amazon Reports Expose the Company’s Surveillance of Labor and Environmental Groups,” Motherboard, 2020) (27:55)How did Lauren develop her sourcing on her Amazon stories (30:32)What is the future of labor reporting under a Biden NLRB? (33:40)How corporations benefit from dividing workers through racist narratives (re: “Instacart Hacks and Bots Have Fueled a Racist Class War Among Shoppers,” Motherboard, 2020) (36:24)The fallacy of “freedom” for gig workers (39:45)What is the role of race in labor journalism? (43:01)The lack of media literacy when it comes to labor reporting (50:21)The reciprocal nature of labor reporting in an industry that often shows little respect for workers (52:40)The superficial complaints of journalism (56:15)What has been the response to Lauren’s piece about secret organizing (re: “How to Organize Your Workplace Without Getting Caught,” Motherboard, 2020) (57:00)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (58:50)The Diversity Tribunal (1:03:05) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to the twenty-second episode of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Rafia Zakaria, who is a lawyer, activist, and columnist for Dawn and the Baffler. This was a very spicy EP! We talked about white supremacy in second-wave feminism, “allies of whiteness” in the media and politics, Kamela Harris’ place in the diaspora, how Rafia writes for both audiences in Pakistan and in the states, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about recent articles from friends of the pod - Jay Caspian Kang and Maya Binyam - which tangle with our favorite topics: POCs and DNI. Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin discuss recent articles by past guests (re: “‘People of Color’ Do Not Belong to the Democratic Party,” Jay Caspian Kang, The New York Times; “Diversity Work,” Maya Binyam, CJR) (0:00)Rafia Zakaria on submitting her manuscript for her upcoming book, Against White Feminism (15:45)Rafia leads us through her career timeline, from Pakistan to her law Ph.D. to becoming a fulltime writer (20:17)The legitimacy in media that is only granted to Western writers (28:25)How Rafia manages writing for a different audience, between Dawn, the oldest Pakistani newspaper, and Baffler, a publication read by guys named Connor (32:45)Bringing the discussion about the other to the other, especially when nonwhite people aren’t in control of their narrative (re: “The Pulitzer Problem,” The Baffler, 2020) (38:06)The hopeless state of whiteness (re: “The Allies of Whiteness,” The Baffler, 2020) (46:00)Has @NYRDaily reached out to Rafia after they blocked her for criticizing them? (53:00)How the altruistic mission of diversity is based on inherent racism (57:34)Is Kamala Harris an ally of whiteness? (1:03:45)The white supremacy of Western feminism (re: Against White Feminism, W. W. Norton, 2021) (1:10:57)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:18:39)The Diversity Tribunal (1:25:33) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Listen on Apple PodcastsListen on SpotifyHello and welcome to episode 21 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Gabe Schneider, the assistant managing editor Vote Beat and the co-founder of The Objective, a Substack newsletter that focuses on media criticism and covering communities ignored by mainstream journalism. We talked to Gabe about the Substack economy, what it was like to publish a rebuttal of the Harpers letter, what’s the deal with ‘open debaters’ who are deathly afraid of cancel culture, what it was like covering the presidential election, the sorry state of media criticism, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about the latest corporate media merger, the NBA draft, and Kevin’s love of Mad Magazine. Thanks for listening.Arjun and Kevin talk about media news (0:00)Gabe Schneider introduces us to his dog (10:02)Gabe talks about how he started a student-led campus blog (12:19)How Gabe became a Washington correspondent (15:44)What led Gabe to start The Objective (17:48)The response to the Harpers Letter (re: “A More Specific Letter on Justice and Open Debate,” The Objective, 2020) (20:16)On the “Open Debaters”: Fang, Greenwald, Stephens, Weiss, Williams, et al. (re: “How to erase Black journalists,” The Objective, 2020) (22:10)The Open Debaters’ move to Substack (24:50)Is anyone buying this “Substack is the savior of media” bullshit? (re: “The Substackerati,” Clio Chang, CJR, 2020) (27:20)When will the Substack business model burst? (30:12)What is the future of the Objective in a broken media industry? (32:00)The Open Debaters’ skewed view of objectivity (34:00)The wide latitude that tends to be offered to white journalists (re: “Re: About Your Tweet,” The Objective, 2020) (36:18)Negative responses about The Objective (38:17)The failings of diversity & inclusion (39:54)The business model of The Objective (41:14)On Vote Beat (42:15)On covering the elections as a Washington correspondent for MinnPost (44:16)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (47:15)The Diversity Tribunal (51:21) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Listen on Apple PodcastsListen on SpotifyHello and welcome to our 20th episode of Diversity Hire. Today's guest is tech writer and Vice/Motherboard staffer Edward Ongweso Jr. We talked to Edward about living a post-Prop 22 world, his winding path to the media which includes stops in labor organizing, politics, and other random gigs, the ways in which hollowness of diversity in the media overlaps with the tech industry, how to center tech reporting on workers, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talked about what they did the day Biden won. Thanks for listening!Arjun and Kevin on Biden’s America (0:00)Post-election chat with Edward Ongweso Jr. (5:30)Edward leads us through his career timeline (8:04)Edward explains why he has such a peripatetic career (10:11)How does Edward feel about the passing of Proposition 22 (re: “Proposition 22 Passes, But Uber and Lyft Are Only Delaying the Inevitable,” and “Proposition 22's Victory Shows How Uber and Lyft Break Democracy,” Vice, 2020) (13:05)The vexed nature of the Biden team and anti-trust regulations (17:12)How Edward’s background benefits his singular labor-focused voice in the tech reporting industry (22:16)Now that the ubiquity of tech clouds ethics, is the fight against giant tech corporations hopeless? (re: “Why We Should 'Abolish Silicon Valley',” and “What If Technology Belonged to the People?,” Vice, 2020) (25:07)By seeing the misery and suffering at the backbone of convenience, we may be able to alieve our unethical addiction to tech (29:19)Edward’s experience in reporting on exploited Uber drivers (re: “The Lockout: Why Uber Drivers in NYC Are Sleeping in Their Cars,” Vice, 2020) (31:33)Tech reporting’s obsession with founders instead of the workers (35:30)The disconnect of diversity when regarding tech workers; 2nd generation Desi diversity hires in high places exploiting their workforce of immigrant South Asians (39:50)The disgusting nature of tech wokeness (re: “Police and Big Tech Are Partners in Crime. We Need to Abolish Them Both,” Vice, 2020) (42:37)Will tech continue to foster the oppression of Black Americans under Biden? (45:38)What does it feel like, after years spent in politics and organizing, to be terminally online? (48:20)Does Edward like media people? (49:50)Arjun’s Feelings About Facts Corner (53:57)The Diversity Tribunal: Tech Edition (57:29) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Diversity Hire election headquarters in Brooklyn, NY—the bellwether district for media idiots. Today Arjun and Kevin invited some special correspondents—Maya Binyam and Gaby Del Valle—to talk about exit polls, post-election narratives, and DATA. We also talked about the usual things: Why POC is a meaningless term, Thomas Chatterton Williams, and gossip. Enjoy this special episode! And thank you for listening.Arjun’s disclaimer (0:00)Kevin & Arjun reporting live from Brooklyn (1:57)Our chat with Maya Binyam (6:29)What Maya did on election night (6:50)On poll workers and hypocritical liberals (9:20)Kevin took the day off (15:00)Maya’s reactions to election narratives (17:42)Would Bernie have won? The answer may surprise you (19:43)Nicole Hannah Jones’ tweets about the monolithic synchronicity of racial groups (27:10)We try to figure out why Thomas Chatterton Williams is the way he is (33:35)Maya’s hopes and predictions (44:36)Our chat with Gaby Del Valle (48:34)What Gaby did on election night (48:58)Gaby voted in Florida (51:03)Gaby tries to explain Florida to us (52:09)Gaby' reacts to a dumb fucking tweet about “the Latino vote” (53:35)Again, we talk about Nicole Hannah Jones’ tweets (58:56)Boomers don’t want to think too much about things (1:04:02)Gaby tries to explain the Latino vote in Florida (1:08:18)Why are Latinx countries flipping red? (1:11:39)Are conservatives a step ahead on class analysis? (1:16:30)How does Gaby feel? (1:18:34)What’s is currently at stake wrt new federal immigration laws? (1:20:34)Vote! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 18 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Clio Chang about how we balance loving the work of reporting and the undeniable shittiness of the media world/life generally, why unionizing is not just great for your workplace but also your social life, how our generation’s work lives have been shaped by layoffs and how she became an expert in the unemployment beat, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talked about Chris Christie’s Cameogate, fellow Substacker Glenn Greenwald, Thomas Chatterton Williams trying to get a haircut in Paris, and other media blowhards in the news this week. Thanks for listening!Kevin and Arjun talk about shitty media men (0:00)Kevin’s pie is introduced (7:56)Clio talk about her home office (8:13)Clio leads us though her career timeline (10:23)What gravitated Clio to join the media after working at a think tank (13:22)How Clio become an “unemployment beat” writer (14:35)Navigating and documenting the unemployment bureaucracy maze (re: “My 98 Days in Unemployment Purgatory,” TNR, 2020) (15:53)How labor organizing fits into the future of the media (re: “The Generation Shaped By Layoffs,” Gen, 2020) (17:58)Arjun’s funny question: what’s the point of doing this anymore? (re: “How to Save Journalism,” TNR, 2020) (22:23)We miss offices (25:54)Are labor organizing spaces the new media hangouts? (27:18)Arjun’s other funny question: what do you make of the push for diversity hires? (28:17)On Leon Wieseltier (re: “Leon Wieseltier Was Always Hiding in Plain Sight,” Splinter, 2017) (30:58)The media ecosystem that props up bad men in media (re: “The Familiar Defiance of Wesley Yang,” Jezebel, 2019) (34:49)Kevin leaves to take out his pie and Arjun and Clio goss about him (39:09)How Clio was radicalized by Lucy Liu (re: “When Lucy Liu Used a Riding Crop to Seize the Means of Production,” Gen, 2020) (40:19)On writing about Asian America (re: “Whose Side Are Asian-Americans On?,” TNR, 2018) (44:26)Clio’s process when picking topics to write about (47:50)Clio talks about working with non-white editors (49:54)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (53:03)The Diversity Tribunal (1:01:51) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 17 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to freelance critic, editor, and writer Rahel Aima, who lives between Dubai and Brooklyn. We talked about the uncertain future of art criticism post the Covid lockdowns, the role art criticism used to play in the art market, why museums and galleries and most cultural institutions continue to be evil year after year, the misunderstood heyday of aughts NYC little magazines, what it's like to be a journalist beholden the whims of visa bureaucracy, and much more. Subscribe to Rahel’s substack, niͥghͪᴛⷮliͥfeͤ.Thank you for listening!Arjun & Kevin recap their Q&A zoom panel with the Harvard Crimson (0:00)Rahel Aima talks about being back in Dubai (6:28)Rahel’s career timeline (10:46)Discussing the early 2010s, the era of postinternet optimism and ironic hope (re: “The Printernet, The State,” Red Hook Journal) (19:28)The decline of the magazine as a font for intellectual culture (24:05)Why do we keep putting our faith into industries that continue to prove to be not trustworthy? (re: “Depleting Felix Gonzalez-Torres,” MOMUS, 2020) (26:10)Pointing out moral inconsistencies in our lives (30:50)What made Rahel gravitate toward art writing, and what has changed since then (34:30)Who reads art criticism? (40:15)Everybody resents reviews. So do we need criticism anymore? (44:15)What criticism does is to extend the work (48:24)The best criticism is adjacent (51:20)We’re all stuck online now. WTF happened to netart? (51:54)Art world’s tendency to seek relevance to a political moment on an aesthetic level (56:08)Art criticism under the pandemic (re: “Following Closures, Art Criticism Faces an Uncertain Future,” Study Hall, 2020) (57:52)On Study Hall, JOC, and journalism peer networks (59:50)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:02:16)The Diversity Tribunal (1:10:50)Arjun’s disclaimer: The podcast is not a reflection of my employer (Conde Nast), and is a reflection of my own opinions. All opinions are my own and do not represent or reflect on the company's opinions. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 16 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Madeline Leung Coleman, writer and editor based in New York City, who writes about art, immigration, race, labor, food. We discussed the need for both class diversity and non-NYC perspectives in the media, why liberal arts colleges suck, the limits of a term like Asian American, and hapa pride. Also, Kevin and Arjun talked about autumn in NYC and Kevin's OOO vibe this week. Thanks for listening!Arjun & Kevin talk about the elite college-NYC media feeder system (0:00)Madeline Leung Coleman thinks media guys *cough* Kevin & Arjun *cough* talk too much about basketball (6:55)Madeline leads us through her career timeline (9:22)Madeline talks about having a normal life and a normal job before entering media (13:55)Madeline shares her perspective of NYC media as a Canadian who didn’t go to an elite east coast school (14:52)Does the abundance of two-syllable-school alumni in media negatively affect the product journalists make? Does it make the culture worse? (21:04)We talk about driving (23:19)What does Madeline think we can stand to gain from having more class diversity in media? (24:41)Madeline talks about her time at Topic, a magazine that was “too beautiful to live” (26:09)Madeline talks about her time at The Nation and her masterful coverage of Hong Kong (30:21)Does it matter if you’re being edited by a POC? Does being a POC editor have an added benefit to writers? (37:01)What to do about anti-Asian racism (re: “Coronavirus is inspiring anti-Asian racism. This is our political awakening,” Washington Post, 2020) (40:38)Why doesn’t “Asian American” work as a term? (re: “What It Feels Like to Inhabit an Asian Body in America,” GEN, 2020) (45:22)Asian American representation politics in media and Hollywood (re: “How Chinese Food Fueled the Rise of California Punk,” Topic, 2019) (49:46)Will Asian American representation evolve past Crazy Rich Asians, or, white-approved Asians (52:50)Arjun, for some reason, talks about Rooftop Koreans (54:34)Madeline talks about the ways in which our people are only portrayed in relation to whiteness (56:20)Madeline talks about a very important person (58:32)Madeline has been threatening to drop the definitive hapa essay (1:01:10)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (imposter syndrome, racism) (1:02:42)White people will say things in front of half-white people that they wouldn’t if they were talking to a 100% nonwhite person (1:07:11)The Diversity Tribunal (1:10:00) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 15 of Diversity Hire. Apple PodcastsSpotifyToday we talked to Meher Ahmad a senior editor at Rest of World, an international nonprofit journalism organization that focuses on global stories about technology and culture. We discussed Meher’s time as a hardboiled kid journalist in Indianapolis, how she went from a blogger to a globe-trotting video journalist and foreign correspondent, what it feels like to be a fish out of water as a brown ex-pat journalist and the challenges of reporting on your own home country, how the three of us balance being both cool and brown, and much more. Kevin and Arjun also talk about basketball and the wine bar of their dreams, which they hope listeners will one day help them open. Thanks for listening! Kevin and Arjun talk about the NBA Finals (0:00)Meher talks about living on the worst block in Brooklyn (7:40)Meher leads us through her career timeline (9:35)The ins-and-outs of being a kid journalist (13:21)Working at Gawker and Vice during the 2010s heyday (17:31)Why Meher prefers print journalism to TV journalism (22:04) How Meher balances mental anxiety while reporting and traveling around the world (23:21) [The New York Times Magazine, Letter of Recommendation: In-Flight Moves ]Reporting on your home country as an ex-pat and the difficulty of being accepted by the locals (29:20)Meher’s meet-cute in Pakistan (34:23) [The New York Times, In My Sari, Kissing the Soccer Coach]Transitioning to life back in the states (36:00)Why the Bay Area sucks (38:00)Being cool and being brown (39:00) [The Outline, MIA Is Too Raw for the Radio]Why Kumail Nanjiani sucks (45:15)Representational politics SUCK! (48:00)Social life as an ex-pat in Karachi (50:00) Learning how to be an editor and learning how to cover tech (53:30) [Rest of World, Audrey Tang on her “conservative-anarchist” vision for Taiwan’s future]Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (58:06)The Diversity Tribunal (1:06:53) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Wassup...(not hello and welcome) to a guestless episode of the pod. Today Arjun and Kevin talked about why Arjun left Twitter, a psychoanalytic method of understanding social media (courtesy of Max Read in Bookforum), student journalists vs. old school journalists, why journalism school is a waste of time, how hopeless we feel about the future of the media, and much more. We also have some more clips for you guys. We'll have a guest next week. Enjoy the episode!Arjun and Kevin try something new up top (0:00)Arjun talks about leaving Twitter (re: “Going Postal,” Max Read, Bookforum, 2020) (2:12)This kind of tweet haunts Arjun (7:56)Media people talking about media people with non-media people (re: Episode 13 - Everybody's Really Weird with Gaby Del Valle) (12:26)How young journalists are challenging the old guard’s obsession over objectivity (re: “College newsrooms challenge an industry’s status quo,” Serena Cho, CJR, 2020) (16:20)The freedom of college newspapers (re: Episode 7 - The Precarity Gauntlet with Marie Solis) (17:53)How objectivity in journalism has become a neoliberal tool for corporate media (20:51)Will this new class of “heroic” college journalists save us? (24:28)Arjun shares stories from Columbia Journalism School (27:27)Kevin asks Arjun whether Journalism School was worthwhile (29:34)Clip time!Using the entire spectrum of your emotions in your work (re: Episode 12 - Projecting Hope with Vinson Cunningham) (33:39)Are we scared about the future of our profession? (re: Episode 8 - "People of Color" with E. Tammy Kim) (38:57)How can we look forward to work when the jobs we were promised are disappearing? (re: Episode 6: Open Mic Night with K. Austin Collins) (43:58)Arjun has some thoughts about the fashion choices of powerful media men (46:45)Arjun shares David Rudnick’s pasta twitter thread with the guys at Caputo’s and Kevin gets noticed by a listener (hey Ritu!) (49:22) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 13 of Diversity Hire. Apple PodcastsSpotifyToday we talked to Gaby Del Valle a freelance immigration reporter and the co-author of BORDER/LINES, a newsletter about immigration policy. We discussed how Gaby connects with her sources, the prejudices publications have around her beat, how media people were not cool in high school, the pros and cons of starting a Substack newsletter (you should subscribe to Gaby’s!!), and how she balances grad school, freelancing, and many other side gigs. (P.S. - We had some mic issues so the audio is scratchy at the start, but it gets better…we promise!!)Thanks for listening!Arjun and Kevin, again, talk about nothing (0:00)Gaby leads us through her career timeline (6:53)Prejudices publications have around immigration coverage and the need for novelty (10:50)How Gaby is juggling all of her jobs, both writing and non-writing (14:20)What’s it like to be in grad school right now? (16:39)Gaby leads us through the reporting of a recent feature and how she develops relationships and trust with her sources. (17:50) (re: “Waiting to Be Thrown Out,” The Verge)Why Gaby started BORDER/LINES (w/Felipe de la Hoz) and how she developed an expertise in the subject. (25:33)Are newsletters really the future of journalism? Or maybe the better question is: Do normal people really care about journalists and bylines? (32:57)Most normal people don’t care about media people (34:27)WTF is a Michael Tracey? (36:16)Gaby’s grand theory about why media people suck (37:21)Are people still partying? (38:42)How does Gaby manage to still be a fun writer whilst writing about really depressing topics (re: “When Environmentalism Meets Xenophobia,” The Nation) (39:32)How to be a compassionate and understanding observer of a story (46:33)Has Gaby been edited by a POC and does that matter in regard to her beat? (re: “Real American Terrorists,” The Outline) (49:51)Writing about immigration that doesn’t take for granted material concerns and is conscious of nationalist assumptions. (51:57)Gaby’s own immigration story (54:43) Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (56:07)The Diversity Tribunal (1:06:32) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 12 of Diversity Hire. Apple PodcastsSpotifyToday we talked to Vinson Cunningham, a staff writer and theater critic at The New Yorker. We discussed the politics of criticism, artistic and ethical awakenings, our collective miseducations and misspent youths, what it was like working in the Obama White House, the NBA after the so-called “strike,” THE DIASPORA, writing during and after the George Floyd protests, and so much more. (PS: Kevin is sorry for the terrible audio on his end - his apartment is cursed)Thanks for listening!Arjun and Kevin talk about nothing (0:00)Vinson Cunningham, staff writer at The New Yorker (3:40)Vinson leads us through his career timeline (5:09)Why Vinson stopped working in politics after his time at the Obama White House (11:57)Vinson details the evolution of his politics, from the Berlin Wall to 9/11 to Katrina to Obama (14:26)Developing politics while working for the Obama campaign/administration (20:22)What drew Vinson to write criticism (26:35)The politics of criticism (27:59)Understanding the argument of Afropessimism through the lens of the protests (re: “The Argument of “Afropessimism”,” The New Yorker, 2020) (33:43)Projecting hope of internationalist solidarity (37:30)Progressing past geopolitical binary arguments (re: “Transnationally Asian,” E. Tammy Kim, CJR) (40:35)The fleeting dream of a player-led NBA strike (re: “The Exhilarating Jolt of the Milwaukee Bucks’ Wildcat Strike,” The New Yorker, 2020) (41:18)Stephon Marbury and basketball’s fatal synchronicity with capitalist exploitation (re: “Stephon Marbury Has His Own Story to Tell,” The New Yorker, 2020)Basketball talk (49:44)Arjun talks about wanting to be a Knicks fan (51:09)Is basketball discourse ready for a white guy to be the GOAT? (53:03)Who cares about “diasporicism”? In essential things: unity. In nonessential things: liberty (56:40)Vinson’s struggle with something he said in 2017: “Is what I’m doing a credit to my race?” (re: “Jerrod Carmichael Talks with Vinson Cunningham,” WNYC, 2017) (1:01:38)The expectation that Black writers need to carry a searing, profound tone, (re: “An Interview With Vinson Cunningham, Staff Writer for the New Yorker” The Politic, 2017) (1:04:13)Struggling to maintain control of your tone when working with an editor (1:09:24)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (1:11:55)The Diversity Tribunal (1:17:38)Email your questions, comments, and concerns to diversityhirepod@gmail.com. Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 11 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Katie Way, a staff writer at Vice, who covers health, culture, and the police. Our conversation looked at Katie’s experiences working at Babe.net, a content blog mill aimed at millennial women, media precarity, what it’s like to be the “main character” in a Twitter conflagration, and why you shouldn’t be friends with media people.  Kevin and Arjun also talk about their very low serotonin levels and the end of summer. Thanks for listening and enjoy the episode!The end of summer, traditions we miss like the MOMA PS1 book fair, shorts inseam discourse, and our low energy :/ (0:00)Katie Way leads us through her career timeline (8:00)Katie on being “the queen of job precarity” (12:30)The workplace at Babe.net and media workplaces more generally (15:00)Image rehab-post Babe.net and Katie’s work at Vice (19:22)The representational politics beat (re: “Despite Racist Asian Tropes, YA Novel’s Film Adaptation Moves Ahead,” Vice) (24:59)The posting and blogging rat race and how it influenced Babe.net (re: “The Wild Ride at Babe.Net,” New York Magazine) (32:50) Why the social life of NYC media sucks (34:41) The pressure of always having a take (36:40)What it feels like to be the “main character” of a Twitter controversy (40:10)The cop social media world (re: “Cops Love to Falsely Claim People Have Messed With Their Food,” Vice) (43:00)The time Nicki Minaj fans came after Katie for making a joke about the Harper’s letter (46:35)Can you trust media to be a supportive industry ever again? (48:50)What happens when trolls think you’re a white journalist (50:15)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (55:15)The Diversity Tribunal (1:05:00) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to Episode 10 (!!!) of Diversity Hire. Haters said we wouldn’t make it...but here we are with a conversation with Giri Nathan, a co-founder of Defector Media, an exciting new worker-owned publication from the people who brought you Deadspin.We talked about Defector’s business model and what he and his colleagues learned about running a successful sports blog during their time at Deadspin. We also ask Giri how the company plans on creating a diverse workplace. Come for the media industry shop talk, stay for the discussions on the beauty of tennis writing, sports conspiracy theories, and Giri and Arjun’s new Tamilian Idol, Kamala Aunty.Kevin and Arjun also talked about the “death” of the New York downtown scene and why Gen X is the worst generation. Thank you for listening, enjoy the episode, and send us questions, reactions, or any mail at diversityhirepod@gmail.com!Disclaimer about NBA boycotts (0:00)Arjun and Kevin blabber about the intrinsicality of basketball, Gen-X apolitical apathy, and the lack of accountability amongst the downtown literati (2:00)Giri Nathan leads us through his career timeline (12:18)What did Giri do between Deadspin and Defector? (17:54)How can a horizontally-composed organization litigate internal beefs? (20:27)How will Defector, which currently has a majority white male staff, commit to diversity? (22:05)Plans for growth and revenue models. You know, business talk. Nerd shit. (24:16)Is Defector a sports website? (re: “The Former Deadspin People Explain How to Launch a Worker-Owned Media Co-op That Might Succeed,” Hamilton Nolan, In These Times, 2020) (28:04)The pros and cons of blogging as a form, its democratizing power vs. its use as a tool under the late-capitalist ad revenue model (re: “Some Personal News From Samantha Irby,” The New York Times, 2020) (29:43)Arjun talks about being bullied on his music blog in 2006 (33:15)How is Defector going to make blogging good again? (34:32)Arjun announces the Thunder’s game 4 win (37:00)Giri’s singular venture into tennis blogging (37:09)Writing about sports without having to write about sports (re: “The Stefanos Tsitsipas Channel Is Always On,” Deadspin, 2019; “The World’s No. 1 Player Wants to Sell You Nootropic Garbage,” Racquet, 2020) (43:35)Geopolitics and sports (re: “When N.B.A. Players Go to Israel,” The New Yorker, 2015) (45:50)Kamala Harris and Tamil representation in pop culture (53:26)GIRI’S BIG CONSPIRACY THEORY (55:45)Basketball talk (59:50)Arjun’s Joel Embiid story (1:02:41)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner, including diaspora and identity (1:06:52)Fuck Joel Stein (1:13:45)Corny South Asians in American culture (1:15:45)The Diversity Tribunal (1:20:17)(There is a possibility that all these timestamps are all fucked up. Sorry. -Arjun) Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com

Hello and welcome to episode 9 of Diversity Hire. Today we talked to Bijan Stephen, a staff writer at the Verge. We discussed Bijan's circuitous and wide-ranging career in the media, which included stops at Vanity Fair, The New Republic, Vice News, a Yale gossip rag, and much more. We also talked about his early reporting on social media and BLM, what's changed with the recent protests, streaming, gaming criticism, natural wine, secret executive toilets, and how the internet changed media consumption.Also, Arjun and Kevin talk about Arjun's two-week quarantine, and Arjun drops a BOMB at the end of the podcast.Follow Bijan on Twitter and watch him stream on Twitch.Please get in our inboxes with your questions and stories. We wanna hear from you and read your messages on an upcoming episode!Bijan explains why and how he got into the media (4:25)Bijan talks about being a college media member and if that helped him get his start (7:20)Bijan’s weird first job with an old media venture guy (9:27)Bijan’s pulls up his resume to go through his career timeline (11:22)Today in Tabs and New York Media as an institution (19:58)TFW you realize you’re the only person of color in the workplace (re: “I Will Only Bleed Here," n+1 2014) (21:51)When Bijan decided to not write about race anymore (26:43)How the Black Lives Matter movement has and has not changed (re: “How Black Lives Matter Uses Social Media to Fight the Power,” WIRED 2015)Is the corporate adoption of the movement a form of progress? (33:53)Bijan cracks a White Rascal! (37:54)Bijan talks about bringing gaming into his work life (39:38)Is gaming criticism good? (44:29)Bijan wants to write about games, not race (51:45)Why traditional media doesn’t work right now, (re: “How MSCHF managed to dominate the internet — with fun!,” “THE MAN BEHIND THE MUSTACHE,” The Verge 2020 (55:56)Failing editors in digital media (59:26)Arjun’s Feelings Don’t Care About Facts Corner (Imposter Syndrome, Diaspora, and Racism) (1:02:31)The Diversity Tribunal (1:09:35)Arjun drops a BOMB (1:15:25)Thanks for listening! Get on the email list at diversityhire.substack.com