Podcasts about so kate

Today I'm speaking with Kate Pearce, of Kate Pearce Educational Services, about reading deficits, assessments, and the importance of proper reading instruction. Kate is a reading specialist, educator, advocate, mom, and, yes... proud dyslexic! She provides reading assessments, instruction, and consultative services to parents and schools. Join us while we discuss what you need to know about reading issues! You can find Kate here: https://www.empoweredreader.com/ And you can find me here: https://www.facebook.com/NTKWDJ TRANSCRIPT (not proofread) SUMMARY KEYWORDS reading, child, teachers, dyslexia, students, parents, read, writing, teaching, kids, hear, orton gillingham, language, talking, learn, dyslexic, test, kate, knew, trained SPEAKERS Kate Pearce, Dana Jonson Dana Jonson 00:00 Today I am speaking to Kate Pierce from Kate Pierce educational services. Hi, Kate, thank you for joining me. Hi, I Kate is a reading and language specialist or what I would call a reading and language specialist. I don't know if there's an actual list of criteria for that. But you are one of the go twos here in Connecticut. So I wanted to talk to you today because what I'm seeing, at least in my office, the vast majority of cases we've been getting over the last year, which would, by the way, coincide with the global pandemic, I've been mental health and reading. And not necessarily they go hand in hand, I don't want to freak anybody out. But I have noticed that those are the two primary that are coming to my office. And so we here in Connecticut are searching for people to assess and make recommendations for children with reading and language issues. And so that's why I wanted to have you on here because I want to talk to you about some of these critical pieces for teaching children with reading or language deficits that we may not fully understand. So for example, I'm sure many people have heard the term. If you're familiar with reading programs, you've heard the term Wilson reading or Orton Gillingham, or maybe even Linda mood Bell, or something along those lines. And these are different strategies. So Kate, I wanted to bring you in to talk about what are the issues that we're seeing pop up now? And and how do we address them? How do we assess them? And what what is the right way to find the proper services moving forward? So first, I'm going to ask you, why am I asking you? Why are you the person I meet is going to tell me what I need to know about reading and language. How'd you get here? Well, it's been a very long journey. Kate Pearce 01:51 It's not something you just fall upon. For me, I think everything in life kind of happens for a reason. And as a proud dyslexic, and the youngest of three with dyslexia, it's been long, but each phase of my career and life has brought me to this phase. So I was a special ed teacher in New York, and a general teacher and I have a master's in literacy. And no one ever taught me how to teach your child to read. And that's pretty scary when you have a master's in literacy. And I was gonna say and undergrad in special education. But I knew that I could help children in special ed in a special ed round because I too struggled. And here I was smart. College graduate from Fordham honor roll student in college, not so much my younger years or high school. School Board me in high school, I just was like, it's I went, I want to go to college because I wanted a party to be honest. And I want that social interaction and experience. But the thought of adulting was just a lot for me. Because I knew I was meant to do great things. But I just never thought I was smart enough. But I knew kids and I know people really, really well. So and I knew I couldn't be a psychologist or psychiatrist because that is just way too enjoyable for me. So long story short, I went to education became a special education teacher. And I was I realized I wasn't prepared to be it. You know, I have these students that couldn't read, but no one, I would give them more guided reading. And I have them in small groups, and I'd be looking at pictures with them. And they would make progress, but not the progress that they should have. I had a parent It was kind of like, you know, several years in and I had a parent say to me that she thought her child was dyslexic, and I 100% agreed with her. I just didn't know how to prove it. And it was the first time that a parent said that to me. And I went to the school psychologist and said, I have a student mom thinks the child's dyslexic. He said there's no test for dyslexia. And then I thought, That's odd. How is there no test for dyslexia? I know. You know, my brothers and I lived in the neighboring town and we have classifications is that how is there no real task, there has to be something. And I as a dyslexic, you do become insecure. You start to doubt your own knowledge and your own like I'm like, Oh, I guess he's right. There is no real test, although I knew I was right. But I just didn't know how to prove it. And Google wasn't really a big thing then. So I just kind of kept doing what was not really working. And at the time, I had a stepsister who was started. She was recently classified or got started privately working with an Orton Gillingham teacher. She was like in fifth grade or so. And she was making all this progress. And I heard her talking about her tutor and how and I'm like, wow, that's what my students need this explicit instruction that like So I brought it up. I said, I want to be trained in this thing called Orton Gillingham. Or maybe Wilson. And I was poopoo. They're like, no, you're in there, the literacy specialist came back up to my classroom showband do more guided reading. And I'm like, I just don't I don't get it. I don't get how these kids are going to learn how to read. And then I'm thinking, How the heck did I learned how to read. And really, I learned how to read because I did get some phonics instruction. And so they kept saying that the more you immerse, then these parents are not reading to their children. I'm like, No, these parents, they want to help them too, because they're struggling, but and they just don't know how to help these kids. They want to help. Dana Jonson 05:39 I remember that, too. I remember when I was teaching, there was a big, and to some degree, it was true, which was some of our students really didn't have anyone reading for them at home. And I, you know, in the population I was teaching, but at the same hand, I thought, I can't imagine that every kid here hasn't been read to do you know what I mean? It was a little hard to imagine that that was the number one reason for everyone's failure in the reading program. Yeah. Kate Pearce 06:08 Yes. And it's so I'm like, these parents are willing to their grandparents are willing to giving them sending them home more books, they can't like, and then I start to doubt yourself. And I don't know, like as a dyslexic, I just think I think you doubt yourself more, even though. And I do feel like coming back to that, you know, you're at the beginning of this like pandemic and depression. It's true, like, you do start to doubt yourself. And, you know, it's a terrible feeling. And it was, Dana Jonson 06:40 I think one of our coping mechanisms for dyslexia, at least for me is guessing. Right. So I'm guessing and when you get used to guessing it's a crapshoot. You're not always right. So I think maybe we condition ourselves to know that, you know, I might not be right. I might be guessing. I'm just used to doing that most of the time. And so I think you're right, that self doubt comes into play. When that's how you learned you learn by guessing all the time. Kate Pearce 07:13 It shouldn't, you shouldn't really have to learn to guess. And, like, yeah, it's an efficient way. And it definitely takes you longer to get there. But anyway, I was pregnant with my oldest. And it was I was a leave replacement. And it was just like, you know what, I can't do this anymore. And I decided to leave teaching. And I was like, I'm done. I'm saying goodbye to the teaching world. And I was going to be a stay at home for a little bit. But I knew financially we couldn't really do it. But I also knew that there was something else greater than me, although it was a very dark time and thinking I just have this new baby, I have a house have a mortgage, I have a family, and how am I going to support them? Because what else am I good at besides people and knowing them? And it's like the stars all aligned, and I was looking for jobs on Craigslist before it was creepy. And I saw an advertisement for this woman from the academy board Gillingham, which I had no idea what it really was opening a practice in that in Chappaqua, New York. And she was hiring people. So I went and sent her my resume. And I sat and talked further and I just fell in love from the first conversation and she just got me and it was amazing. And as we were talking, I asked her Wait a second is your daughter Katie, and she's like, yes. Turned out her daughter was the one who taught my stepsister how to read. And so it was kind of like, wow, this is ours aligning, stars aligning, and she was like, I'm a fellow from the Academy of Orton Gillingham. And I smiled not because I had no idea what the hell that was. And she's like, I'm going to teach you this program. And the first five minutes of her Orton Gillingham course, I was hooked. I couldn't eisert became a The good thing about being dyslexic and ADHD become obsessive over things. And I think I became obsessive like I it was my brain she was talking about it was how you learn how we're totally brilliant. It's not an intellectual disability, but a literally different wiring in our brain and how we process information and just getting the information to the right spot. And for the next decade, I was able to learn under her and learn the Orton Gillingham approach one student at a time with not having judgment or the pressure of a school district or I could do what's right and I could ask questions and Learn it. And it's taken me over a decade to really learn it well. And I think that's what teachers need to realize that it's okay. You might not know all the answers right away, because it is a process. It does take a long time to learn. But it's fascinating. And then long, long, long story short, after our business started growing so big in Connecticut that three years ago, almost she said, you know, Kate, time you take the reins, would you like to take over my business? And I did, I took over that portion of Connecticut, and we just have kept getting bigger and bigger. And so here we are today trying to educate parents. And yeah. Dana Jonson 10:42 And I think it's really critical, because, you know, dyslexia has become more known and understood, I think, over the years, but I also find in the last year, as I said, the uptake has really been in reading and mental health. And I think we can all assume we know what the mental health issues are, we're all stuck at home, there's a global pandemic. You know, I'd be shocked if we didn't have mental health issues going on with our students and our parents and our teachers and everybody else. But this reading component that has popped up, is it. Are you feeling that this is because I mean, are parents noticing more? Is it because we're relying more on reading? What is happening, that we're seeing this uptick in reading? deficits that we're finding during this pandemic time? Do Kate Pearce 11:38 you see I don't think there's an uptick of seeing, I think it's always been there, one in five children are dyslexic, one in five. But I think it's becoming we're shining a bigger light on it now. And there's a few reasons for that one, social media and decoding dyslexia groups like that. Parents are becoming more educated on what is happening in reading, they're starting to realize that their child is not reading. But what's happened is them the student being home, and the parents that the parents might be working right next to them. And they can't help them because they're working themselves. And the child is sitting there because they really aren't independent, like they, the parents thought they were. And it's the parents anxieties are going up, like why is like someone help my child, they're drowning, I'm trying to work. It's all and the kids being kind of left to their own devices. And then the kids feeling their own anxiety, because there's really no one there to help them unless they're in a breakout room. And they and they're being asked to be independent. And they're not independent. Dana Jonson 12:50 And if you find their kids, you can, sorry, do you find that kids can mass that more when they're in the classroom, because that's what I think is happening, I feel that it's not suddenly more kids have dyslexia or reading and language issues, it's that they're not able to pick up on all the cues that they were able to enlist before, that they had strategies, maybe that were helping them get through the classroom or through the day, and now all of that is removed? Kate Pearce 13:21 Is that part of it? I think that's part of it. Like, you know, I remember like, copying off the kid next to me in second grade. 13:28 Yeah, Kate Pearce 13:29 like, oh, okay, it looks and making it look like I knew what I, you know, I was doing kids are really good at faking what looks appropriate, because they want to be that. Right? So I do think that like, that's part of it, I think teachers could move around a little bit, obviously easier in a classroom or be like, sit over here, let me show you this, while they do three other, you know, work with three other students at the same time. So I do think that's part of it. I think that for the most part, kids that are just just struggling because there's no one there really to help them. And the parents are getting really frustrated because they're starting to see it too. And there's only one modality that they're being taught through the computer, and there's not teachers are not doing reading kind of the way it should be done. Dana Jonson 14:20 So when we're talking about deficit, such as dyslexia, and and I do think there's a good point that you brought up before we started recording, which was, I'd mentioned that you were a reading specialist, and you said, well, it's reading in language, which I think is a really important point. Because I think sometimes we think of reading as sort of off on an island there and either you can do it or you can't. But it's it's a much bigger component than that. Excuse me. So, when you talk about reading and language, how do those tie in together as, as a whole component that we're working on with children? Kate Pearce 14:57 Well, because reading is The goal of learning of reading is for comprehension, right, that's our end goal is to obtain more knowledge, but also part of reading. And language together is writing, writing is the highest order of language, and so be able to output their thoughts. So first comes reading, lots of first come speaking and listening. And then the next comes reading. So then writing. So if as soon as starting with a leaky bottom with like speaking and listening, if you have a child that's, you know, our late talker, or would get speech and language services for articulation, they might be starting with a leaky bottom. And so we got to make sure that we're addressing those students at the bottom. And then we go, you know, into that learning how to read properly. And then the writing, you know, writing is the highest order of language, it's the hardest thing. I'm a very good writer now, but it's also probably takes me twice as long to write more than other people. Dana Jonson 16:03 Yeah, I find it's really hard for I have all the ideas in my head, it's focusing them, to get them out is usually the challenging, narrowing them down when you talk about, you know, researching things incessantly, I call them my rabbit holes, you know, as I jumped down my rabbit holes, which has been helpful for me, and once I was finally diagnosed with ADHD, and dyslexia at 19, I had I knew which rabbit hole to go down, you know, and, and instead of studying everything a little bit, I could figure out what it was, and dive into that entirely. So, you know, as you said, you had a diagnosis of dyslexia, there had to be some kind of test for it. I am still hearing that I'm still having parents come to me and say, I know they have dyslexia, but I can't get a diagnosis. I can't get the school to a grade. Where does a parent start? When when you feel that their language and or reading issues for your child? And? And I do you think it's important to identify that those are the same and different? Because language is much bigger? Right? Reading just falls under one component of language? Yes. And so when you have any language deficit, it's going to impact you in any of those areas. Correct. It's not just like, Oh, I just suddenly don't have an issue here. But over here, I'm just fine. Right? It's it's across the board. So how do we as parents go about figuring out exactly what those deficits are? And how to address them? If we're not, if you know, if there's no test for dyslexia, but I'm pretty sure there is now Kate Pearce 17:42 Yes, I mean, for Yes, that is a lie. And if any district tells you that, or they can't identify dyslexia as a school team. Now, a guidance came out in 2016, saying that school teams are allowed to identify students with dyslexia and say dyslexia, it's not like there's a whole movement called the SE dyslexia movement, like, say it like it's a dirty, bad word. And some teachers are holding on to these old administrator tales that have been passed down to them. That saying that you can't say that, that it's not true. You can and the way we tell is, by not just there's not one test for dyslexia, there's many, and you look at, you just have to have a deficit in, you know, fluency, comprehension, decoding spelling, one of those will give you a, that is dyslexia, you don't have to have all of them. Usually you do, but you don't. But I always ask parents, when they come to me, I say, Well, where do you What were you like as a reader? And usually, that's the biggest indication. And for me with I have two boys that I started from the beginning. Like, I am going to teach them how to read properly from the beginning. And my oldest actually did a really good job. My youngest, of course, we were talking about four, our youngest kind of slipped through the cracks sometimes. Yeah, he is probably one of those kids out, although I was very with phonological awareness with him. I was crazy. He knew all his rhymes, and like he was ready to return to kindergarten. And so he did struggle though, because I kind of let him go off to dinner thinking that everyone knows who I am. And the fact that they know that this is how I want him to be taught. And he kind of got caught up in the whole language component of reading and by January, the kid who wouldn't go to school, and it was heartbreaking as a parent, but it was also Oh my God, I see. This is how all these kids that and I was able to catch it, but I had to prove that his stupid tra he couldn't read even though it was putting on kindergarten level. But one thing I do and parents, I think I suggest that if you really are concerned that your child's not reading, type up the book that the school says their reading and what level they are, put it on a piece of paper and type it and then have your child read it, and then record them reading and bring it to me. This is sound like a reader, you told me my child read that. And that's kind of what I did. Like you're saying, My child's a reader, but he's not. Dana Jonson 20:27 So what's the difference? When you say type up the book that they're reading? What is the difference between handing them that piece of paper versus the book that they're used to reading? Kate Pearce 20:34 So by doing that I'm taking I'm only making my child focus on the words and be seen not pictures, or the story or telling him background information like this little this book is about Bobby and Bobby is going to a circus today. And can you help him look for? And so I'm not giving him any other clues, just the words. And that's what we want. We want to I want to know if he could read the words. And it's really evident early on that. They're not readers based on, you know, your assessments, but Connecticut is getting better, although it is. They're doing universal screeners now. And so all kids from kindergarten through third grade have to take a universal screener, and it tests for red flags of dyslexia, or like any reading reaction, not just Oh, Alexia Butlin, Dana Jonson 21:33 so when you say universal screener, that means, like some kind of assessment that they give all students, Kate Pearce 21:39 all students so, and our My goal is to start it with pediatricians started at four, three and ask, you know, we asked, we're so we asked parents, like, pediatricians will say to me, I remember with my son's a little can, it doesn't make eye contact doesn't, you know, trust himself, can you do this, but they're not asking Kenny Ryan? And he, you know, what else can he do? Can he if I say cup, can he say, Towson that rides with a cup or a cup without the cup? Can he hear we're not asking those questions early on, which we should be because for having a phonological awareness is what we know. Now children need to learn to read Dana Jonson 22:22 how to children develop that phonological awareness. And, you know, I guess, you know, without getting into the argument over who should be raising our children, you know, whether it's a stay at home mom who happens to be a reading specialist, or, you know, or, or a child in daycare, or a child, wherever they are, what should we be doing to, you know, support the phonological awareness, because I think that we all think we are, I mean, I know I did, I knew I had dyslexia, I knew there's a good chance my kids might have it. I surrounded them with, you know, books and stuff like that, but even just listening to you. And as somebody who taught Wilson for five minutes in my life, at some point, as a special ed teacher, I still wasn't 100% sure what I was doing was right. So How can parents be more secure and sure about what they should be supporting, and then that's looking for in their child. Kate Pearce 23:22 So I would, I think the way I handled it with my second, I did a pretty good job, with the fact with rhyming, nursery rhymes, music, all of that will benefit your child before they start with kindergarten, we do not want to be showing kids, you know, letters, we're so obsessed with letters, and showing them letters and the sounds that they make. And we our brains were never designed to learn to read, our brains were designed to see objects. And the objects we see are in 3d. So when we give a child, a three year old, four year old, and we're showing them all these letters and sight words to memorize, that is not helping them learn to read, that's actually just doing the opposite. What they're doing is clogging their brains to memorize more things, and they're not going to have enough data in their brains to hold on to what they need to hold on to when they get there. So if I was, as a parent, what I tell all my clients that come through our door is start with phonological awareness, making sure they hear sounds, manipulating sounds, take little pom poms, different colors, and say, okay, up with different colors for each sound before without letters attached. You don't want the letters attached. And when they're so young, you just want them to be able to hear and manipulate the sounds. And then when they get to first grade or kindergarten, I mean, they will learn the letters, and then they'll be able to correlate the sounds with them and be able to manipulate them because they're starting to have a phonological awareness. A third of kids pick that up automatic They just have to be exposed to it, they hear it, they put it into their graphic memory. And they're, they're good to go. Those are natural readers. Dana Jonson 25:10 But I think I heard that because again, like I have one foot in the homeschooling world, and I hear people say, Oh, well, I never taught my kids to read ever, and they just sort of learned. And I think, well, there is a third of children who will write if they're just, if they're given material, and it's around them, they will develop that skill of reading. But that's only one third of children. Kate Pearce 25:36 Exactly. And what we do know is another third children need that explicit, or they get need to be exposed to phonics, and phonological awareness and the phonemic awareness and hearing the different sounds, but they'll get it sprinkled here and there and a teacher will point something out, and they'll be okay. Yeah, then we know another third children, the one and five are dyslexic, that need that explicit, multi sensory structured, sequential approach to learning to read. So they don't have to, you know, guess later on, Dana Jonson 26:15 get used to guessing. So, how do we, if we've assessed it, we, you know, when a parent comes to school and says, I have a concern, is it a regular psycho educational? That is the standard evaluation that all school districts do when we're talking about special education? Is that type of assessment going to identify dyslexia or rate reading and language deficits to the extent that we need them to? Kate Pearce 26:44 I will tell parents this, if you have concerns early on, like kindergarten, first grade, look at those assessments, ask them what screeners they're using, that are based on science, not observation, not like a D RA, or an F NP, they're called, those are all based on observations. We don't want that we what are we want evidence based screener and I'd look at those screeners because some kids do pass them, you then if you really do still have concerns, I would go to your school first ask for the testing, then when the testing comes back, they should be showing every substance core in there, because Dyslexics hide in the sub tests. And it's not just one sub test. It's not and it's not just one test. They shouldn't be doing, you know, just a regular cognitive. But they should be doing a gamut, like I'd want like it's called the sea top like that's a test of phonological processing. I want a real more in depth writing as if they're like, in fourth grade or actual third grade and above, you know, what schools will do it they'll say, Oh, well, we did the you know, cognitive Woodcock Johnson and in that their writing is average. Well, their writing is average, because all they have to do is put words in order, just like a spark. It's not intellect. This is not an intellectual disability. Dana Jonson 28:10 I think that's where we get confused. Because typically, children with dyslexia, again, their coping mechanism is to figure it out. And the coping mechanism is to present like you understand, not to actually understand. So the fact that a child with those deficits could present as fully understanding is what we should expect 28:36 your act. Dana Jonson 28:38 Yeah. Right. So I mean, that's that's the whole thing. That's I mean, when we talk about the insecurities and all those pieces that come from the entire coping mechanism is to guess what they're doing and and figure out how to get really good at that. So then I agree with you i that's why I was asking about the the psycho educational because a lot of times, I'll have a student come back and it says, well, the overall is well within the average range, but we have to look at Yeah, but within those smaller sub tests within it, do we see a lot of scatter? Are their skill sets all over the place? Or if the test comes back, that they're average, and they're still struggling? I would argue we need more assessments. And I feel like sometimes the the response that parents get are no, your child tested in the average range, so they're fine. This is not our problem. So what can parents say or do to dig a little deeper? I always say, you know, the more information the better. But would you recommend like a specific is there specific language that you think triggers that evaluation? Like what is it the parents are looking for? like yeah, I know this test says average but I'm still really concerned. Kate Pearce 29:54 This is I also this is my hurdle lately, what I've noticed now students grades are totally inflated, especially because of the pandemic. Yeah, it's really cannot. And so you have kids that are getting A's and are on honor roll, but they don't even deserve those A's. But the teachers feel like they're one they can't really assess because of the way they everything is. And they, they, meanwhile, teachers, they, they want, you know, all there for them, that is really, you know, they earned it because they are working really hard. So it's a false sense of security that parents are seeing, because teachers are giving these kids grades that are not really where they are. And we and the assessments that they're giving in the classroom are just complete garbage, and are not Yeah, like, accurate of who they are. And we're also not assessing writing, I give the child a writing sample, I can tell you so much about how that child can read their spelling, and what is going on just by looking at their writing sample. So as a parent, a give your child a piece of paper and say, write a story about a friend. Is there Can they write more than two sentences? Like Where are they? They should be able to write multi paragraphs by fourth grade. Dana Jonson 31:15 Yeah, I have. Well, so we had a foster some foster children living with us and over the holidays. And I asked the 10 year old, you know, I asked all of them, give me your Christmas list, right? So I get this list from a 10 year old and I was appalled. It was just it was there was no, it was not a child who knew how to write period yet. And he's doing great in school. Right? So I reached out to his teacher directly. And, of course, she's his new teacher this year, she's never seen a piece of his writing, because they've been distanced the whole time. So there's no writing sample. I don't I don't blame her. She had no clue. You know, when I when I showed her the Christmas list, she said her response was Yes, that's probably, you know, but we're in this crazy time right now, where it's, I don't know, if it's harder to identify or easier to ignore. Kate Pearce 32:14 It's easier to ignore. I think teachers are just so overwhelmed with putting everything on line and trying to figure it all out that and parents, some parents just don't want to know right now. They're just treading water themselves. And they're trying to manage working from home and making sure their kids are online, and they're trying to feed their families. So right now, parents are just in survival mode. But if this is our new reality, and who knows what the fall will bring, as schools and teachers, we have to get better at identifying them. So if that means having a parent, take a picture of your child's writing, and email it over to you, that's what we got to do. And let me just these kids are so computer savvy, they could figure out how to take a picture and send it to you, there's going to be very few children that you're not going to be able to get that from if you ask. Dana Jonson 33:14 Now when I was growing up and and to date myself, the world of computers was up and coming. And everything well, you don't have to learn how to write because you're going to type, that's what you're going to do. So you no longer need to learn how to write no one, you just need a signature. That's it, you don't really need to and I have heard the suggestion a few times that children get text to read software, which is a little different than just audiobooks. Text to read has a different sound. It's not somebody reading the material attempting to be just, you know, computer, generating the words, I have found, at least with my daughter that books on tape significantly helped her reading she actually reads while listening to them. And that was huge for her with fluency because she gets stuck when she doesn't understand something. So with the tape to push her forward, but what are your thoughts on on text to speak because I don't envision a world where we still don't need our reading and language skills. And I worry that we're looking towards sort of putting a bandaid on some of the issues and saying, Well, you know, maybe we could just get someone to read them the questions or we can get a reader. You know, what, what is your take on those kinds of accommodations that maybe aren't actually teaching the student but maybe just helping them get through. Kate Pearce 34:41 So as far as audiobooks and books on tape, I'm all for it, especially in the older grades because reading is made up of a formula. It's decoding plus vocabulary equals comprehension. So you want that vocabulary and the only and they're not reading grade level. material, that the only reason the way they're going to get vocabulary is by reading. So we Sorry, my son is half naked in front of me and happens. So you want that vocabulary. So if they're in seventh grade, fifth grade, and they're really at a first grade level, they have to have access to the same grade level materials, and they're not going to be able to read them. So right, what you want them to do is find a way to build that vocabulary and access to the same curriculum. Again, I cannot stress this enough, they are had the same if not higher, IQs as their peers, they just don't process language the same, but they can listen to it and be have access to the same vocabulary and the higher level conversations and thinking, I recently and this infuriates me, and I'm telling because I'm angry, I won't call out the district, but it's very hard for me not to, but I had a fifth grader barely read a second grade level. And I want them a part of this history and science cannot read the material. So instead of giving them audiobooks, or different little readers to help accommodate that, they put them in a second grade history curriculum, oh my gosh, is learning about communities don't even get me like I don't know why we're learning about communities. in second grade, we should be learning that preschool like every kid knows, the fireman is in the United States. So it's just, it was so one How humiliating for this child, who can't imagine to be part of the conversation and has great thoughts and ideas. There's learning about community workers. And that was their solution. Because he's reading at a second grade level, we'll put them in a second grade. And I'm like, absolutely not. The only way to build that reading is also to give them access to the curriculum and the vocabulary. So that's why with the writing, we have so far to go. In this country with how we teach writing we've gotten, we know what science tells us about reading, we know that they need a direct explicit structure, multi sensory approach to reading, writing, they need the same thing. So just letting a child dictate into a computer. First of all, it's going to be all off anyway, because they don't know they have a hard time with grammar. And it's not directly taught. Now, again, I never was told how to teach someone how to write I was, I would read books, and I knew I was a big into Teacher's College. And I think what I liked about teachers college was that it gave me something coming out of school, it gave me every lesson. Now knowing it wasn't backed by science or anything. But at least it gave me something, I had nothing. I had no idea what I was doing. So giving now looking back, like I'm like, Oh my god, all these kids need a direct writing program. And so that's what I've really been fighting for just as much in schools is to get these kids at direct writing program, like writing revolution, by Judith Hoffman, who taught at windward, it's a direct, multi sensory structured program that teaches kids from basic sentence levels and fragments to multi paragraph and how to come up with those ideas. Kids with dyslexia have a hard time with language in general, it's hard for them. So they're not going to have all the words to help them. But by just having them talk it. You don't talk the way you write. And it's unrealistic to think that if you could just do text to speech, all of a sudden there, it's going to solve their problems. Because what happens a teacher comes in and edits it makes it sound right. And then lo and behold, you have an A student that goes to college and Dana Jonson 39:04 doesn't know how to write that doesn't matter. Right? No, it's Kate Pearce 39:06 it's, it's Dana Jonson 39:08 interesting that you say that, because that is so true. And I think about even in my own office, when, you know, pre COVID, I spent a lot of time on the road. And so I do a lot of dictating, and it is not easy. It's really not it's not easy to dictate the way I want something written when I'm speaking. So I would imagine the reverse is just as difficult. And I think it comes down to that piece where we're not just talking about reading, we're not just talking about writing, we're talking about language, and the writing and the reading are the byproducts of understanding language. And I think we get that confused with as you said, cognitive ability. You know, if it's easy for us to read, somehow we must be smarter, which is just not the case at all. 40:01 But you also Dana Jonson 40:01 talked about very specific instruction for reading and writing. And that, you know, brings me to this other piece, which is once we've identified children with dyslexia or a writing issue, and they need that support, how are we providing it, and I feel like the reluctance to identify a child with dyslexia was really a reluctance to acknowledge they needed a specific kind of instruction that the school doesn't have. And that was the case versus the child doesn't have dyslexia. But now, we're allowed to say dyslexia, we're allowed to diagnose with dyslexia, we're allowed to say the child has dyslexia. So once we've established that, just saying a multi sensory approach is not the way to do it. And I know that because that's what we did when I was teaching way back when which was it's multi sensory, which means it's a little bit of everything and a lot of nothing. So what are we looking for with that instruction, once we identify that there's a deficit, whether we're calling it dyslexia or not, and it is impacting writing, and it's impacting everything else about this child's ability to communicate and learn what what type of instruction are we looking for, for the student who needs this? Kate Pearce 41:21 We do need a derived has to be it. This is a rabbit hole in itself. But it definitely has to be the teacher, the level of training has to be the highest level of training, at least, you have to have two teachers in a building that have or that are highly trained in a direct, explicit multi sensory, structured approach to reading. Now, every program, Orton Gillingham is an approach. And there's many different types of Orton Gillingham programs out there. But they all should follow a clear scope and sequence. And they all should have. And when I say multi sensory, I don't just mean i think that means something different to everybody. I don't know, like I was in a meeting last week. And I asked the teacher Well, what does that mean, multi sensory, and she was like, well, they have, you know, a pen, and they're writing. And I'm like, no, it multi sensory includes all senses, your reading and writing and seeing and speaking all at the same time. And you're using manipulatives. And you are addressing that phonological awareness component and phonemic awareness component. So many programs are not addressing that kids get into like a small group. And the teacher just starts, you know, talking and lecturing more than the kids are actually writing, hearing it, seeing their mouth feeling it. That's what we want our students to do that we want them to hear, see, feel, use all their senses at the same time to really get it in their brains, because especially Dyslexics, they don't see. They see pictures, they need that other sense to understand and really make it concrete. And I think that's where teachers get a little confused. Dana Jonson 43:23 And I think there's a lot you know, when you talk about something like Orton Gillingham, there is a specific training, right? So yeah, a lot of these programs, have specific trainings have specific hierarchies of who's trained and who they should be following under. So my frustration is, in hearing teachers or staff say, Oh, well, they're trained, and then find out they went to a weekend workshop. So, I mean, it's better than nothing. But are you finding that schools are getting to a place where they're willing to invest in the proper training for their staff? Or are we still, you know, under the, the pandemic, I think what we've really discovered in many ways is what schools can and can't do. And I find that we are seeking outside reading evaluators, much more than we were before, which I think is good, because I think school districts are starting to recognize that their own staff is not able to identify these issues at this point. And I feel like if you can identify them, how on earth are you going to address them? Kate Pearce 44:31 Well, this is the problem. They think they can identify them. But they're not. And that is a major problem. When they think they're a they think they're doing the right thing. They had a workshop, they had a training, oh, I'm trained now. But when you the way I could tell I could tell everything by a program by the IEP goals. Okay, I read an IEP goal, and it's says, You know, I just won recently and was like, will read more fluently I'm like, fluidly? What does the hell does that mean? At what level you have a third grader? Like? Are they reading at a first grade level more fluently? And how many words correct are they reading? Like, we're in knowing that knowledge and then at digging a little deeper, like, well, what were you using to it was all based on observation. And I'm like, Oh, no, but what we know with kids that struggle, and most kids need an a plan, an explicit plan to learn how to read, and they're doing a hodgepodge program. So these teachers get some training, and they come back to the classroom, and they don't implement it correctly, because they're still using their toolbox. Or they'll say Orin Gillingham is just a tool in my toolbox. 45:51 That's what I hear a lot. Kate Pearce 45:52 I do not want to hear that is a tool in your toolbox for my dyslexic child's? Because they don't need any other tool except knowing Is it a sound outward? Or is it a sight word, those are the only two tools they need, and that toolbox in the beginning. And then as a real strong Orton Gillingham tutor or teacher will know that, of course, our end goal is comprehension. And our our end goal is to teach them how to read and we're going to teach them comprehension and fluency. A good teacher incorporates all of the components of reading into their instruction. What we don't do is give them strategies. A little bit of this strategy and a little bit of that I do not want to see a child looking at the picture, and the first letter of a word to figure it out. Because what do they do when there's no pictures? If we're not teaching? And how do we know this is another big hot button issue got me all fired up now is that we're doing these, they'll say, I'm going where the child is. So I noticed today that they didn't know AI. So tomorrow's lesson is gonna have a lot of words with AI. And then I might notice that they have Oh, art tomorrow, but then it's not building on it. And so when that foundation, 47:13 yeah, and that's when I get Dana Jonson 47:14 frustrated, because the science shows that doesn't work. So why are we still doing it? And I have had to find a nice way to say that no, Kate Pearce 47:26 no, I don't I I will, I will tell you this. I recently was in a district, same actually same district that was using the second grade curriculum. And I said, the same thing. I said, Why are we using other strategies? like looking at the picture? And they were like, that director of Special Ed said, we're not a one trick pony. I said, Oh, no, no, no, yes, you are a one trick pony. When it comes to the science of reading, that we know what the neuroscience says how kids learn to read. And pictures is not beneficial to them as a reader. And her argument was at that level at a second grade, first grade reading level pictures is absolutely appropriate. You could sit there and argue to you're blue in your face, the face, I just send them the data and science after the meeting and just have them document that we don't want them using that strategy. It's not beneficial to them as a reader, because I'm also seeing kids whose parents think they have tracking issues. And I'm like, why I'm getting all these kids with tracking issues. So of course, my obsessive compulsive, nerdy side of me needed to dig deeper into why am I getting all these tracking issue kids? And because I and then I doctors are not really seeing it as well. It's because we're teaching kids to look everywhere. But the words, they're looking up at the pictures, they're looking, they're skipping, they're looking for clues. They're looking for clues, and they're not focusing on the actual word. And so like, Well, that makes sense. And so we have a bunch of kids that have look like they're having tracking issues, but it's not really tracking. It's just they're looking for other clues. And yes, we have to get, and I also had a superintendent of school I was pretty close with. And we were talking and she was telling me like, honestly, it's so expensive to get these two teachers trained, like, but what happens, you get them trained, and she found a workshop for them, which was great, like a 30 hour one and he listened. 30 hours is better than no hours. Yeah, but the poor teachers come back. And they don't know how to implement it. They have no one to supervise them. They have no one to supervise them or give them actual tools and like ideas on how to implement it. And here's a really great lesson in how we do it. And a plan, like your plan should follow this scope and sequence every time you Your your students should know where you're going to start every single time they should be able to tell you what's going to come next. And what that and it's reciprocal keeps going around like you every single time and it's just part of it. It's time teachers just don't have the time. Yeah. Dana Jonson 50:19 Well, and I think that's why we're looking so strongly to outside sources now, because we don't and training is harder to do in a pandemic. So we're looking to people who are already trained, who know what they're doing. So what is it that you bring to the table? Okay, so you do assessments, do you? You know, I'm just curious, like your cape Pierce educational services, do you consult? Do you help set up programs? Do you just do assessments? What do you bring to the table in this process, Kate Pearce 50:54 I bring it all to the table, I bring my everything I bring my knowledge of you. I have over 15 to 16 tutors that are all trained in Orton Gillingham at a minimum of a 16 hour course by a fellow Dr. Brown, who trained me. And then they get to learn just like I did one student at a time they get, you know, we bounce ideas off each other, I get to mentor them, and they become experts, if not better than I am now at it, because they get to have that luxury as well. So when this child comes into my practice, I do an assessment, usually informal assessments to kind of see where I would start and where the holes are. Sometimes I'd say listen, they need more speech and language testing, or they need a full neuro psych. There's more going on globally than right now then I could test for if you come to me with a lot of testing from the school or what have you, I will take it and I will come up with a treatment plan. I tell kids, I'm like a detective. I take clues. I will take clues from your parents, I take clues from the student, I asked them a ton of questions like how do you feel about reading? What do you struggle with it? Don't tell me what your parents you've heard your parents say? Or you've heard teachers say what are you feel like it's happening, kids are really a really good indication of where they struggle, what they need help with. And then I put it all together in a treatment plan of what skills we're going to work on right away. This is where we're going to start in the word Gillingham program. And this is how we're going to remediate it. And this is I'm going to put this child with this tutor because they're a great match. Now sometimes we get calls a lot of times now from schools and they'll call me and say, Kate, we have a student for you that really needs a more intense, you know, remediation, and one of my tutors will go into this, we'll do the same process, I'll look through their IEP, we'll come up with a plan, we'll meet with the schools. And that's actually becoming one of the more favorite parts of my job. Because I do get to for so long, I felt a little lonely. I just saw these students and then I leave and then I had no other adults around. Right? You know, but so it's great to collaborate with these teachers and be like, Okay, what is happening? Why are you able to, you know, we're going to do the decoding part you work, you could work on fluency. And the way you're going to work on fluency is we're going to give you what to work on. So you're not kind of overstepping or we're going to help you understand that you're missing you're doing Wilson but your child's not making progress, why well look at their phonological awareness. Again, that's where we learn start to learn how to read they don't hear sounds, listened doesn't incorporate that how could so I'll help teachers and give them actual lessons and do it with them and show him how to do it instead of just giving them a bunch of theory about how it should I will show them how to do it. Dana Jonson 53:49 And I think an important piece that I've heard you haven't said it directly but what I've heard from you is that just because you are following a very prescriptive program does not mean there's no individuality individuality sorry you know you're still individualizing for the student. Kate Pearce 54:05 I think we get confused with that sometimes Dana Jonson 54:07 I hear teachers say no I individualized so I just use what I need. No is a complete comprehensive program whichever one you choose, and or that the child requires. And following that program within it there is individuality 54:23 Yes. Kate Pearce 54:25 Individually says but this pick your own adventure. Yeah to read is not beneficial to any student at all. And we've gotten so far out into that's how that you know, it's reading is boring. We need to give them a they love. No, it's not. You are the teacher, you need to direct the ship and that is how they're going to learn. They will love to learn how to read when they learn to read. 54:52 Yeah, Kate Pearce 54:53 but we can't do this pick your own adventure. If you're into butterflies, you're gonna learn about butterflies and if you're into space, you're going to learn how to space And then we're going to go from that note we were on. And that's how I was trained, I was trained, and we have to make reading fun and engaging. But it'll be fun into gauging when they actually learn how to do it individually. So it's a science, if you go to the doctor, they're going to give you a formula to follow. It's not, it might be a little different than the next person that comes in, but they're probably going to give you you have to follow it to the tee. And that's, you know, what we do. And there are times where I'm like, this tutorial model one on one is not helping, they need more than what we can give them. And sometimes students need to be in a program at like a school, where they're immersed in it all day long. Yeah, and they are getting it from every angle in writing, reading, you know, science, math. And that's okay, that's my job to be like, it's time to wave that white flag and say, we surrender, because, as teachers, we want to say we can do it all. But there are students that just need more than what we can give them. And a good educator will be the one to say they need more. Dana Jonson 56:07 And I think it's fair to say that we can't all be good at everything. So that includes teaching. And I think a good teacher understands when they don't understand something. And yes, you know, most I find most teachers are in it, because they like to learn and they want to keep learning and your class is never the same. And it's always different. And a lot of that is exciting. But there's no shame and I can't do this. And and I think we rely too much. And we expect teachers sometimes to be miracle workers and and they're not, you can't be providing a one on one instruction for a student, when you've got 25 kids in the class. That's just a reality. But that's why parents have to become their number one advocates for their students. And so for parents who are listening to this, who are saying the only person I can talk to is Kate Pierce, she's the only person who knows what's going on. That's a smart Kate Pearce 56:58 person, Dana Jonson 56:59 that's a smart person, right? How are they going to find you? Where am I going to so Kate Pearce 57:04 you could go to the empowered reader.com. And you can find me there. I'm also on Facebook under Keith Pierce educational services, but probably through my website, and you could just send me an email. Dana Jonson 57:18 groovy. And I'm gonna have all that information in the show notes. So if you're listening to this, and you can't remember it, it's non-problem, go back to the show notes and all of Kate's contact information will be there, as well as other information we discussed. And I really do hope that you'll come back and and do more podcasts with me because I feel it is even scratched the tip of the iceberg of reading and language. But I am really glad that we got this sort of overall 57:50 picture of Dana Jonson 57:53 what we need to be doing, because I think it's really helpful to hear the bigger process and say, you know, this is, we are individualizing, even though it's within specific programs, and that the hodgepodge take a little bit of everything really isn't the way to teach this skill. So I'm hopeful that people will take that away from this and call you or call me and make sure they get the right services they need for their child. Kate Pearce 58:19 And what just one thing I want to add is we need to get teachers to be on the same side as the parents. So often we're on the opposite side, and it kind of puts the teachers back up against the wall. If we were able to empower the teachers, by getting them the right instruction that they need will only help not only our children, but other students as well. So as frustrated as we might be, we have to be advocating to get the teachers the right support. Dana Jonson 58:49 Agreed. And I I do say that, you know, parents have to become the number one champion for their child's education. And if that means a staff working with your child needs additional training, then that's part of it. Yep. And we should not be afraid to ask for it. So thank you, Kate. I really do appreciate all of this insight. Thanks.  

Kate Christie, Founder and CEO of Time Stylers, is a Time Management Specialist. An Australian mom of 3, Kate is a best-selling author, speaker, coach, and attorney. You name it; she does it all! She’s spent years working with high performing individuals and teams to help them get to the next level.  Kate shares with us that it all comes back to time and productivity. After reading her new book, Me First, I just had to have Kate on the podcast. Her book is about how women can find 30 hours a month to get back to themselves.  If you’re wondering how to get back your time, handle interruptions, get the kids to pick up after themselves and whether work-life balance exists, this is a must-listen!   Let's talk about finding time so that working moms can get back to themselves.   What we're talking about Kate Christie’s 4th Book, Me First How To Get Control Of Your Time How To Handle Interruptions Does Work-Life Balance Exist? Kate Christie’s 4th Book, Me First Kate’s new book, Me First, is her 4th best-selling time management book.  It is now available in Target in the United States!. She shows women how to get 30 hours a month back for themselves as a working mom.  Kate guides us to reflect on what your priorities and values are. Growing up in a generation where women were told they could have it all, Kate developed inner confidence.  She shares her simple formula for success and explains how she felt she could have whatever she wanted. Her inner confidence changed once Kate started having babies. She felt that the wheels had fallen off, and she was overwhelmed by mom guilt and imposter syndrome. She decided she could either be a really great mom or have a really great career, but not both. So Kate opted out of her career. The timeout from her career gave Kate the perspective to re-frame and realize she didn’t need to have it all. Kate explains that you just need to be chasing after the parts that are most important to you. She shares that once you define what is essential, that becomes your all. You shouldn’t have to choose between an amazing career and being a mom because of want of time. Her book offers practical suggestions and outlines how you control your time and have what is most important to you. Kate says you really can have it all! How To Get Control Of Your Time Stats show that moms carry more of the burden. To get control of your time, you need to figure out who can help you in your household. And this includes your children; having them help in the home teaches your child to be an independent person. As Kate explains, your first step is that you need to identify everything you can outsource and everything you can reject to manage your time. We all have habits that rob us of time, so it’s about shining the light on those things and working out what you don’t need to do and what you can do differently. Kate goes on to describe that there are two types of outsourcing. The traditional outsourcing of hiring an expert who can do it faster, better, and cheaper than you.  And the other is insourcing. Insourcing requires you to identify everything you currently do for the people you live with and what they can do for themselves that you don’t have to pay them for. You need to get everyone engaged and involved as young as possible. Family is a team sport, and establishing those habits and patterns helps empower and create independence for your children. And best of all, it frees up more of your time. How To Handle Interruptions Interruptions generally cost us time and productivity. According to Kate, every time we are interrupted, we have to multitask, decreasing productivity by up to 40%. She discusses strategies that parents can use to reduce those interruptions. Kate tells us that we have to start pushing back, but part of this can be letting them make choices and being part of the process. One strategy I’m going to try with my family is batching your time into 30-minute bursts of work. Kate shares how you get your child to set the oven timer for 30 minutes; you explain that everyone will work quietly until the timer goes off.  Once the timer goes off, your child is rewarded with 15 minutes of your time to do something fun together of their choosing.  Does Work-Life Balance Exist? As high achieving women, we are very focused and driven. Kate explains that we have a lot of confidence around our careers, but we feel we have no idea what we are doing when the baby comes along. Everyone has an opinion on how we are mothering, and it erodes our confidence. Imposter syndrome starts to creep in. We take our career drive back into the home and want to be the best mom and be present for our children. We want to do it all and we feel we have to do it all across all aspects of our lives. In her book, Kate describes work as our drug of choice. It’s like an addiction; you get a high and feel validation from your work.  The concept of work-life balance is an aspiration that we are set up to achieve, but you can not perfectly balance work and your life. Work is a part of your life.  You shouldn’t have to give up what you love because you have a family and you shouldn't feel guilty about that. Kate explains that it’s not about balancing it out. You have to give yourself permission to love all those elements of your life and give yourself permission to focus on yourself from time to time. Remember, you are in charge of your time and future, so go make it happen! How are you implementing more self-care for yourself with your extra 30 hours? LINKS MENTIONED Kate Christie’s Website https://www.timestylers.com Kate Christie’s LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/kate-christie/ Kate Christie’s Email kate@timestylers.com Me First https://amzn.to/3lHYSQy  Michelle’s Podcasting Confidence course - get on the waitlist https://podcastingconfidence.com/

"Bring me a bad book. Like, a really good bad book." So Kate asked Betsy. Well, we don't want to give anything away but Betsy may have hit on something. If you were born in the late 70s or early 80s, the odds are good that somebody you know read it to you. And this all ties in quite closely to current discussions of picture books with racist elements that sit blithely on shelves in children's rooms anywhere. Show Notes: In case you've ever wondered what this show's recording set-up looks like, Drew, the resident Penguinologist, put together this quickie video on a whim. It's haphazard but fun: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rP3f_UtbXK0 While we appreciate that The Book Hound took the time to draw a connection between the Dionne quintuplets and the publication of this book, the assertion that, "While it is possible to conclude the illustrations in The Five Chinese Brothers are ethnic stereotypes, although not everyone agrees with that, it is impossible to make a case that the text contains or implies a racist premise, unless one misreads the first sentence," is an idea that holds no water: https://thebookhound.com/2018/07/31/when-looking-alike-is-not-racism-the-five-chinese-brothers-the-dionne-quintuplets/ It is not difficult to find the Weston Woods/Scholastic Teacher's Guide for this book. Note what it says at the end: "Other book based films and videos about Chinese culture are available from Weston Woods. These include: THE STORY ABOUT PING by Marjorie Flack TIKKI TIKKI TEMBO written by Arlene Mosel and illustrated by Blair Lent". Just . . . . wow. http://teacher.scholastic.com/products/westonwoods/study_guides/the_five_chinese_brothers.pdf Finally, Betsy was able to track down the video of the boy reading Owl Babies to actual baby owls: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-i33i2VDsRU For the full Show Notes please visit: http://blogs.slj.com/afuse8production/2020/07/13/fuse-8-n-kate-the-five-chinese-brothers-by-claire-huchet-bishop-and-kurt-wiese/

On the episode today, I decided to do something a little different. On previous episodes, I've been the one asking questions and digging into people's lives. On this episode, the subject of the interview is me. How can I be someone taken seriously to ask people questions when so little is known about me or even why I started this podcast in the beginning. So for this and a future episode, the focus is on my life.I had to decide whether I wanted to just go solo and talk about myself, but then I remembered I really dislike talking about myself by myself. So, I called (well, text) a friend, a former guest, and someone that you all loved from her episode, Kate Puckett to interview me. I'm sure you're wondering, why Kate? Well, when going over my options the choice was pretty simple. Kate and I share a very good connection where we can just talk and talk about real and deep stuff. I trust her, I knew she would knock it out of the park, and I knew she wouldn't let me slide on anything.. Sounds like a great interviewer to me, am I right? So Kate is back and I want to thank her for being apart of this podcast once again.Thank you all for the many downloads! This is doing so much better than I expected starting out so I am very appreciative of that! Please keep downloading, subscribing, and sharing the podcast! This isn't done for monetary gains, everything has been paid for with my own money and I nor my guests are being financially compensated for our time. We all just have a desire to share our stories in hopes that it will help someone else who may be on the same type of journey.If you like this episode, stay tuned for part 2. Please leave a 5* review, those help more than you know. I plan to release episodes more regularly, so subscribe and you will automatically download every episode!Thank you and God bless!

What can startup founders learn from the marketing strategies of high growth, silicon valley tech companies? This week on The Inbound Success Podcast, Traction Hero founder Kate Walling talks about her experience helping VC-backed tech startups develop marketing and business strategies, and the specific things she recommends they focus on to achieve exponential growth. Highlights from my conversation with Kate include: Kate advises early stage tech companies on their marketing and business growth strategies. When she starts working with a new company, the first thing Kate looks at is the product and business model to determine whether there are opportunities to use product-led growth. After that, she evaluates the company's brand and positioning within the industry, and then focused on the sales team. One strategy that Kate has seen several companies use successfully to drive growth is community, and specifically building a community of their customers, users and fans and allowing that community to mostly self-moderate. To be successful, Kate says marketers need to be a part of the larger corporate strategy conversations around what the product is, how it will be positioned, what the tech stack is, and how sales will go to market. Another effective way to raise your brand profile is to work with industry influencers. Kate says that these do not always have to be paid relationships, and that its important for your marketing team to be aggressive in building relationships. If you have a small budget, one of the best ways to gain early traction as a founder is through a personal email newsletter. This is a strategy employed by many of the accelerators. Send it to friends, family, former colleagues, etc., but NOT clients, and share your journey as a startup founder. You can also use this to ask your audience for help and introductions. PR is another good way to get the word out at a low cost. While you can always hire a PR agency, there are plenty of opportunities for you to directly pitch yourself to local media, and you can subscribe to HARO and respond to those pitches at no cost. Tools like Canva are handy for making marketing collateral that looks like it was created by a designer but really uses templates to look professionally made. Kate's advice to founders is not to try and take on too many things. Find a few channels and platforms that are a good fit with your audience, do them well, test and iterate. Resources from this episode: Visit Kate's personal website Check out the Traction Hero site Email kate at kate[at]katewalling.com Following Kate on Twitter @katewalling Listen to the podcast to get specific strategies you can use as a startup founder (whether you have a big budget or a small one) to hit your growth goals. Transcript Kathleen Booth (Host): Welcome back to the Inbound Success Podcast. I'm your host Kathleen Booth and today my guest is Kate Walling, who's the founder and CEO of traction hero. Welcome Kate. Kate Walling (Guest): Hello Kathleen. I love your podcast. Kate and Kathleen recording this episode. Kathleen: Thank you. I'm excited to have you here. I am going to do a little bit of an announcement for my listeners before we dig in. Um, if you have listened to my last few episodes, you might've heard this, but it's late March, the coronavirus pandemic is happening. We are recording on Zoom and Zoom is having some bandwidth issues. So just saying, if you're listening, be patient with us. If the audio gets a little funky from time to time, we're going to do our best and hope that Zoom holds up for us as we go. But, these are interesting times we're living in. Lots of people working remotely, lots of people using video conferencing software. So it is what it is. But with that said, welcome Kate. Can you please tell my listeners a little bit about yourself and Traction Hero? About Kate Walling and Traction Hero Kate: Absolutely. So let me try to make this the short version of the story. I've been an entrepreneur since a really young age. I started my first startup at 23, which was a consumer facing startup. I've kind of been an entrepreneur since then, although I've had a corporate stint. I'm in the middle because at one point I realized that being an entrepreneur from a young age means that you don't understand corporate structure and you just hit some walls because you have a lack of understanding. So I've also worked in a public tech company here in Silicon Valley and now I'm back with Traction Hero, which is a marketing agency for startup companies where right now we provide a lot of tech companies with on demand services just as they need it. So basically they can email with a quick project they need done and we turn it around in a couple of hours. So it's really good for companies that have large budgets, but not enough team. Basically there's a lot of those. And then we're also slowly building out services that are really focused on the deliverable so that startups can say, "I need a market research study done" or "I need a new identity." Everything is focused toward what needs to happen to get that done. So as you know, when you're doing a lot of projects, you've got to have a writer, a designer, a printer, all these different people, and it's very stressful for marketers. There's not really been a solution so far where they can just cross that thing off the list and know that the whole thing is getting done. So that's what we're working toward, is really solutions that help marketers get stuff done as they need it.  Kathleen: I love that you personally have been a startup founder and that you've done a lot of work with startup founders because I'm personally passionate about that. I have been a business owner. I've started a couple of different businesses. Having walked in the shoes of the founder, I think you described it so well where there's so many things that need to get done. And that's just from a marketing standpoint, right? You're wearing all the hats when you're in a startup. You could be the owner, the chief salesperson and the marketer as well as other things. And in those early days it can be really hard to zero in on, what are the most important things I should be doing in order to gain traction? That is one of the reasons, FYI, that I love your company name. You stay focused without falling victim to shiny object syndrome or you know, working so much in the business and not on the business, et cetera. It's a challenging, challenging time. Kate: It is. And I think, you know, marketing's been already challenging for a number of years because the MarTech stack keeps getting larger and, and Silicon Valley, the budgets keep getting larger, but your team size doesn't. But marketing is getting more and more responsibility for profit and loss. So there's a lot of pressure and I think what I hear from clients is, what you're saying, is that this was a different style with Traction Hero. And that's because I've personally been through the technology accelerator programs. I am on my fourth startup. I really know what it's like. The interesting thing is that I started this agency model in Seattle. I built an agency in Seattle before I came down to Mountainview California and the model works so well, so it's called scrappy face and it was scrappy, right? And we just went in and we helped these funded tech companies and we just moved as fast as we could. And we had a great team. I closed the agency because I went through a divorce and growing a company really quickly in the middle of a divorce in a city that was always raining is brutal to say the least. But the model was so interesting and when I went into corporate tech, what I realized is that I kind of thought their needs would be different. What I saw was just maybe limited, but it really wasn't, it was pretty much the same concerns of "I've got money, I don't have enough people to spend it." You know, "I don't have enough hands." And then marketing has gotten so specialized that you can't possibly hire enough people to do all these things well, like they can't be experts at everything. So, you know, I'm a big proponent now of having smaller marketing teams, but knowing how to get more done quickly and having whatever workforce you need, that's really fluid. Kathleen: I love that.  should take a step back because this topic, when you talk about startups, I feel like it's a Rorschach test because the word "startup" can mean a lot of things to a lot of different people. And for some people, they hear "startup" and they think little, you know, two or three person company. And yes, of course every startup has to start somewhere. But then there are startups that are incredibly well funded, VC funded, that go from being one or two people to 20 to 30 people within a span of a month. When I think the conversation we're having, it's more around that high growth startup, not that little company that's gonna slog along for five years. We're talking about, you know, startups that have a lot of potential that need to move fast. I think that's really key here. That's the experience I've had working in startups, is that it's all about speed, especially if you're looking for investment. Because as soon as you bring on investors, there are high expectations. There are benchmarks you have to hit. There are thresholds that you need to get to. And all of that needs to happen really quickly. And you're right, you know, you couldn't possibly hire enough people to do that and you can't have a team that includes the world's best in everything, right? Because you'd need to segment out each little thing you do and hire a different person for it. So what's the best way to move ahead? And the other element of that that, I think, is so interesting is this need to balance brand with demand generation because those are two really important components. And especially if you're in a high growth startup, you absolutely need demand generation. There is no company that doesn't, but brand is really important these days. How early stage startups can quickly gain traction Kate: So like, yeah, how do you do all the things? It's so hard and I mean, you bring up a great point first. Defining "startup" is important. I think right now I do tend to concentrate on the tech startups that are scaling and have money. I also tend to help entrepreneurs that are somehow very well resourced and there's an opportunity that needs to move quickly. Those were the fun ones. That can be anywhere. It's like there's been a regulatory or legal change and so it's presented this opportunity and you've got to go fast to take advantage of that opportunity. So that looks different different ways, but it's typically those two categories in terms of entrepreneurs who are working on a smaller project or evolving it. There's so many tools now that they can use that would save them so much money that I think just having that right tool stack is a better situation. But back to your question about balancing brand and demand gen. It's super hard and I think what I used to do is go month by month, quarter by quarter in my corporate role and say "What are the business objectives here? And so what does what makes the most sense?" So if all of a sudden the sales team is growing from 40 to 90, right? I've got to get the demand gen up and going. I've got to get tools in place to deal with that. And that evolves into other things like what type of sellers are they? How are these tools going to work together? Whereas if the brand is newer or there's been a change in the industry or there's some kind of potential in terms of content or positioning, you go on the brand side. I think you just have to kind of reevaluate it every several weeks when you're, when you're at scale, when you're trying to work with scale. Kathleen: Yeah. It's funny that you say that because I think the last month or two have been the best example of why it's important to reevaluate every few weeks because I can speak for myself. I had a beautiful 90 day marketing strategy that I finished at the end of January. I'm a big believer in planning in quarters and adjusting in months. And so I had the strategy put together and I was starting along my merry way, implementing my strategy and then coronavirus hit and blew it all up. I feel like I, I, you know, I want to do air quotes, "go into work every week." You know, I'm not going anywhere. I'm working out of my house right now. And the priority is constantly changing based on the current fire. And I say that not meaning that like, the house is on fire and the company's in jeopardy. That's not our case. In fact, oddly we have an increase in demand because of what our product does. But, it's about pivoting and shifting and recognizing now it's all about remote work and you know, that sort of thing. And that's different than what I had planned out, but when things are moving fast, you gotta be able to go with it. Kate: You do. And I think, you know, in terms of the virus, it's the emotional roller coaster for us personally. It's the same with business. And I think it's that way with most parts of businesses, right? It's like, "Oh, I don't know if I have enough toilet paper. I don't know if I have enough this or the National Guard is moving in," you know? So it's like, every day, assessing where things are and what your needs are. And I'm seeing that with my clients. The first week was about "What should we be doing? Should we do a campaign?" So we do an email and alert people of what services we're changing. Now it's moved to, "Okay, competitively, what do we need to do? What's going on in the industry? What's the overall campaign, you know, with our overall strategy here?" And that strategy ends up being not just marketing, that's the whole business offering. We need to move products. But marketing from my observation right now, which is, you know, limited in the grand scheme of things, marketing is driving some of those business questions, right? Because you can't go to a marketer right now and say, "I need you to do something about this virus." The marketer has to say, "Well wait, what are we, what are we offering here?" You can't just throw together some kind of campaign or ad without meaning. I mean, this is not a, um, you know, "throw a graphic on it" type of problem. How do VC-backed startups approach marketing? Kathleen: Yeah, absolutely. So let's put the pandemic aside for a minute because I feel like we could have an entire episode on that and I may need to do that at some point soon. My curiosity has been peaked by what you said about how you tend to work with these well-resourced, need-to-move quickly, but potentially bandwidth-constrained companies. I think what is really interesting about that is that a lot of marketers see those kinds of companies that do grow really fast and they think, "What are they doing? What is the secret sauce? What's happening behind the scenes that's enabling them to go so quickly?" Maybe I'm wrong, but I suspect it's not that they're just throwing money at the problem. It has to be more of, yes, you need money, but what are you going to do with that money that supports a really high growth kind of scenario? So maybe you could talk a little bit about that and pull back the curtain on, if somebody does come to you and say, you know, we just got VC funding, we've got to triple the size of this company in a year. We've got the budget to do it. As a marketer, what kinds of things are you doing and looking at for them? Kate: The first thing I look at is, is there anything in their model that should be evaluated overall for marketing in terms of distribution or influence? For scalability, like you said, it's demand gen and brand. However, for a lot of things it's, is there something that needs to be built into the product from a marketing positioning standpoint or differentiation to make sure that that scale can happen with the brand and demand gen tools? That's one of my favorite parts and that's where your puzzles come in. So if you're a SaaS company, do you need to be offering some kind of certification program because you need more people using the software? What are the different channels? How is that working? I think getting a grasp on, is there something from a business model perspective that needs to happen? The other thing is, a lot of companies at that point have some juggernauts, right? Like, we're seeing churn is hitting here and it's too high, or we're seeing these little scenarios happen with customers, or our lifetime value is off. So we start trying to troubleshoot some of those things so that, that first step is really about marketing and the product and the operations of the business, and then also what needs to be worked out before you scale. There are usually some major learnings there. Once those kinks have been ironed out, we start looking at where are we positioned in the industry? Where is brand awareness? And then what is the plan with the sales team? So if you've got two sellers and you're going to hire maybe one more, that's a pretty basic stack because you don't want to build anything too complicated until you understand, are these relationship-based sellers, are these more tech savvy sellers? There's a difference in the tools required. So you can do something more basic in the meantime, just getting them basic collateral, making sure they have that stuff on the brand side. You start wanting to do more PR, more on positioning and really claiming your spot in the industry landscape. Then, as your sales team picks up, so when you start getting to like 20, 40, 50 up and up sellers, you're looking at a lot more sophisticated systems. You're usually looking at a change of how sales works. So if you have inside sales reps, how are they working, how are they using your marketing software? You get into really complex software decisions, and that's usually driven by marketing. How can startups use product-led growth? Kathleen: There's so much there. I have so many questions I want to ask you. Let's go back to one of the first things you said, which is that you actually begin in many cases by looking at product. So it sounds like what you're talking about is product led growth, and really going in and looking at what are the opportunities to bake something in -- the product that we have that can itself be a growth driver. I would love it if you could just talk a little bit more about that. Kate: It's both from a positioning standpoint, and distribution comes up. That comes up with SaaS companies a lot. And positioning can come up with B2C, right, of like what is this particular opportunity here? With direct to consumer you see it because you'll see, like, consumer products that are extremely well designed or they're really hip or something like that. So that's where you'll see that brand move play in really big. And, and usually with D2C, that's part of the initial product development. But sometimes that can come in as like, how do we do that? Sometimes it can be, with B2C, how do we build a community around the product, right? So some companies are doing a really good job of using Facebook groups. I think Facebook groups are amazing for marketers right now of, we're going to liberate our whole community and let them build with one another. But what are the rules of that? So I think there's just a lot there in terms of B2C, it depends. If it's a commodity-based business, it's harder. A lot harder, right? You're looking at, how do we feel different to the buyer? How do we provide a different experience? If we're not really offering something different, can we deliver it different? Is there really strong brand value that can go throughout the whole company and how would that be protected? So it really has a lot of different shapes. Think of channel partners or technology partners who are taking our API and installing it. But is there something more? Is there a way to even scale it bigger than that? Right? Like get like a whole group of individuals selling this thing for you. So I think it's really out of the box type thinking. And generally at this point, you know, the startup's been going for awhile, they've had some success, they're ready to, you know, commit, and they're ready to scale. They're leaning that way. So it's a really good time to do this work. How marketers can play a role in the broader business strategy? Kathleen: You're coming in as a marketing advisor. At the same time though, it goes to the core of the business strategy. It's not just a marketing strategy. If you're talking about putting an evangelist program in place or changing elements of the product or building a certification program, some of these are business strategies. So how do you navigate that conversation? Because I think often marketers are really challenged with, we're really comfortable staying in our marketing lane. But a lot of the times, when we get out of that lane -- and sometimes it manifests as, you know, we're starting to make recommendations about sales software, other times it's like the things you're talking about that can get rocky if you don't do it right -- how do you approach that? Kate: Yeah, that's a great statement. It's so true with this early stage stuff that I'm talking about. It's typically before a startup has hired a CFO or a senior level marketer. And so you're working directly with the CEO and they have some marketing resources. They'll have a small agency, they'll have a couple freelancers, right? Part of their problem is that they don't know who to hire. And most of the time what I tell them is you can't make that hiring decision yet. We don't know what the marketing is, so we don't know what type of marketer to hire, you know? So I'm a huge proponent of fractional CMOs because I think it's just too early and you don't want to get the wrong person. There's a lot at stake. And I think a lot of startups at that base, they've got revenue coming in, hire a CMO to come in four hours a week and figure this out slowly. And who realizes that you're going to hire for that position when you know what the direction is? So that's more early stage. And the company usually has maybe five to 10 employees, but marketing's not built out yet at all. Later on is where you get really more tricky. You've got someone in charge of sales and they have a particular way that they're hiring. Then as a marketer, you're supposed to bring in demand gen, right? And the demand gen you need to bring in is a different skillset than the sellers have. And the sellers were not aware of the software that you have to do. In my corporate role, it was a rollout plan. I started with HubSpot and got people used to this idea, this is what's going on and why. Then I moved into Marketo, which is super hard. Kathleen: I just went in the opposite direction. I went from a company with Marketo to a company with HubSpot and I'm like, "Thank God. It's so much easier." Kate: And then with Marketo, the sales team was growing. We had to do much more sophisticated type rules and stuff too, because all of a sudden you can have a sales team and you start bringing in all these leads and a sales team does not care. They don't care. And they're not gonna answer them. And you've got a cultural problem of you have to educate them toward how do you deal with these leads, what it means, their job and that it is, and you have to have support from the management team that this is going to be required. There's a whole lot and it just really depends on who you're working with and what their background is. You have to take it one step, one day at a time. So I think it just depends on the team. It depends on where people are. You have to be pretty fluid marketer. You have to be able to say, "This is what I need and it's going to be a process and I'm going to have to get buy in. And so how do I do that?" So you have to be patient. Kathleen: I think you raised something really important, which is, when you're coming into the job, you're at an advantage because you're working with a CEO. But just one thing I've learned is that when you, when you're in those hiring conversations, you have to, you have to have a conversation about that. I might be making some recommendations that are outside of what you might think of as marketing. How are you going to feel about that? Are you open to it? Are you willing to keep an open mind? You know, really, really figuring out that the personality type of the founder, the CEO, and whether they're willing to listen and, and consider other things I think is so important at that stage of a company. Kate: Critical. Specific strategies that startups can use to drive exponential growth Kathleen: Moving onto something else. You said you started talking about community and I love that topic. I could talk about it forever. And I guess this is, this is part of a bigger question I have, which is, I'd love it if you could share some examples of what you have seen work really well to fuel fast growth in some of the companies you've worked with. And maybe we could start with community because I came from a company a few jobs ago where we built a very large community and it was huge for us and it was a Facebook community. Through that experience I became really passionate about that. So that's just one example but, but there may be others. So, specific things that you have seen really deliver for the companies you've worked with. Kate: It's different for B2B and B2C. So I'll start with B2C because it's the easy, fun one. What I'm seeing right now that I love are these Facebook groups around certain products. This is not a client of mine, but it's actually a product I use. There was, what's it called, the meal delivery company that I was using for awhile when I had really busy days. It was all plant-based food and then they had this Facebook group and you could join it and people were just sitting there and they let people post whatever they want. They can sit there and post like "I really hate this smoothie. How am I going to get through this or am I supposed to do this later or not?" And it's super interesting to watch how that worked because the community moderated the community members for the brand. Brilliant. People will say, you know, "I did lose weight, I did not lose weight. This is really more about health." And so you start seeing these advocates come up and then they would use those advocates for their Instagram stories and other things. So that organic way of building a community that moderates itself is really interesting. Now initially, you have those questions about when do we step in and when do we not, and how do we moderate? I think if you can get by with moderating lightly, but you know, the feel of the brand is so positive, right? So that's a brand value that you have less of those issues but they're going to come up. But I think you have to have a very careful strategy about how to moderate that. The other thing that people are using a lot on B2B is obviously these micro influencers. There's some startups paying a lot of money for this and it's all over the place. Traction on that sort of slowed down the end of last year and now I'm starting to see clients pick back up on interest in that because everybody's at home and online, right? So we're starting to feel like there's opportunity there. I'd say if you can build your own organic community, that would be ideal, right? If you can't, you can use these micro influencers and that's great content as well. I talked to someone last week and their product's working and they're sold out, and they've gotten all this influencer marketing and that helped. But then all of a sudden years later, they don't have brand values. And so when you're needing to do more, you're needing to build content, you're needing to build demand and you're needing to build, you know, other parts of marketing, if you don't have those brand values built out, then all of a sudden you're like, well, who are we? We were using everyone else for the voice. So you'll run into that for B2B. It's true here. I think some of this comes to hiring. So what I've seen work really well is that you become friends with all the influencers in the industry and you sponsor their podcast and you appear on their podcasts and you go to their events and you just kind of make sure the team knows who the influencers are. And then you do everything you can to get involved with people at every level. You'll have local events and you'll bring the people in that you know, in that city and have them share their stories. And so it's a constant kind of industry networking. I've seen that work really, really well on the B2B side. But it's definitely different. Kathleen: It's so interesting that you say that because I've seen that work really well too, where people have formed strategic relationships with industry influencers and sometimes, not paid as you say. It doesn't always have to be paid. It could just be really showering them with love in the form of, you know, having them on your podcast or going on theirs or commenting and sharing and making introductions. I worked for a marketing agency for awhile and they did this exact thing and their way of forming those relationships was by offering to make personal branding websites for influencers. That was a great way to get to know them. Then you've done them a favor. So there are a lot of different ways that that that can be done. I think that's really smart. How to hit big growth goals on a small budget Kathleen: You work with well-resourced companies that are able to do a lot of these things. Any lessons learned or suggestions for companies that don't have those giant budgets? What are some things they can do in the early days? Kate: Oh yeah. I love the scrappy brands and helping startup founders. So I advise a lot of startup companies. I love this part of the work cause I obviously identify with it a lot. Being an entrepreneur for so long, I think, you know, when founders are trying to grow a brand unlimited budget, one thing I always bring up is never forget about email, because if you create an email list of your friends and family and colleagues and anyone that you meet with, those people become very loyal to your process. If you share with them where you are and what you're going through and what you need help with, they will help. It will absolutely help. I've seen that be really successful. Now your tone has to be right because nobody owes you anything and you want to be entertaining and kind of make them feel a part of it. And that's part of the email structure, right? Of like, "Here's what's happening and you know, these exciting things are happening, these challenges are happening. Here's how you can help." That is the basic format that does incredibly well. And that is one of the main marketing tricks that comes out of the Silicon Valley tech accelerators. They have all their founders do a weekly email and it works. I, on my own, I've had open rates of like 90% or higher, very high. Kathleen: I want to talk about that for a second because I'm fascinated by this. I also believe strongly in email. I also think that people think of email as this old, tired, dead strategy, but there's some really interesting things being done in the world of email right now. So you're talking about founders doing a weekly email. Can you peel the layers of that back a little bit for me? What does that look like? Who does it go to? Kate: Sure. So this is not client facing or customer facing. My personal list is maybe 200 people and it's my closest friends, my family members, colleagues I've worked with for years, people that I've met with on this journey. So it's people that know what you're up to and what you're striving for basically. But not clients. Clients and customers would get something different. They don't need to understand the process. So that email list is specific for friends and family colleagues. And what you do is, every time you send, you add more people that you've met along the way. I usually start it with like "Hi friends" or something like that. And then I usually say something seasonal about what's happening in the world and that I'm thinking about them because I am. All these people, they're cheering you on. And then I'll typically say, if you're new to the list, here's a link to the previous email, right? So that there's some sort of context in there drawn into the story correctly. And then I'll put some kind of update about where I am or what challenges are happening. And it's usually interesting stuff because when you're building a business, you hit all kinds of things in the world that are happening. So for example, with Traction Hero, there've been changes in California privacy law, changes in California employment law that have really changed the model. And that stuff is interesting. If you're not in it all day long, it's pretty interesting. So share the challenges you have. And then I usually say, "Here's the ways you can help. So if you just open your social accounts, we're now on Instagram. Would love if you would follow," and people will, they'll do it. Or "If you happen to know a friend who knows anything about X, Y, or Z, would you mind connecting me?" They will. This technique is straight from accelerator programs and it is a good one. Kathleen: Do you add these people to the list or do you ask them if they want to opt in? How does that work? Kate: I add them. I often will mention it to them. Like, "I'm going to add you to my newsletter. Let me know if it's okay." You're not doing it for a business so the rules are different. This is actually a question I'm curious to know. I mean I still send, so my recommendation is, I send it through MailChimp, their most basic template. And the reason why is people can unsubscribe. It does hurt your feelings a little bit more when someone does that you know. It's also interesting because if sometimes there'll be like a vendor or somebody and if they offer, I've actually had this happen, someone unsubscribed and I was like, then you're not interested enough in my story for me to pay you. Kathleen: Yeah. Right. Kate: Like, if you're not interested enough in this email because this is just basically what's happening with my business, if you're not interested in that, then I mean, I don't think that we'd be a good fit in terms of working together. I mean, I'm not bothering you. It's like once every six months, I mean slow, but I used to try to do them once a month. MailChimp's most basic template is perfect. And just text. I mean I throw in, maybe, you know, if I done a new logo design or something, throw it in. But keep it pretty simple. And that way people can unsubscribe. Kathleen: I'm a big fan of not overly designing emails. I mean these days, most people have the images in their emails turned off by default. And so if you've got a lot of design in there, it just doesn't get seen half the time anyway. And it looks crappy to have a lot of those image boxes. Like, "Turn your image on," you know, it just doesn't look good. So simpler is better all around with email in my opinion. Kate: Yeah, I know, I totally agree. And that MailChimp basic template's nice. The fonts big, it works well on mobile. It's, it's a nice one. These emails still take, I'm going to say it like if I'm fast, two hours. They still take time. You don't want to bother anybody and you want it to be entertaining and you want it to be, you know, uplifting, even if you're talking about your challenges. The most important thing is tone. I've seen some of these founder emails and if you use the wrong tone, people are like, "No thanks." Kathleen: So what is the right tone? Kate: I think it's friendly and I think it's engaging. You know, I don't think it's like, "Hi friends, hope you're enjoying this day. Please like my Facebook page, please sign up, please send me people who should be customers." It's not about a million asks. People have a lot going on in their lives. It's more of like, "Here's what's going on with building this startup right now. Here's what I'm trying to do. Here are the challenges I'm having. And that's interesting to people, because a lot of people haven't gone through it or want to go through it. And you know, entrepreneurship is never a straight line at all.  Kathleen: I love that idea. I mean, that's something that really any founder in any industry can do. I think for some it's going to put them in a place of discomfort because a lot of the founders I've met don't like talking about themselves that much, which is kind of funny because you're going to have to at some point as a founder.  But I think that's neat because that's something you can do that doesn't take really any money, that just takes your time. Kate: I'd say founders who have marketing backgrounds definitely have a hand up on this one. In tech accelerators, what would happen is I would send in mine first and then whoever in my batch would typically take mine and copy it. So people need examples of this. Email me and I'll send you one of my past ones because it does help to see some kind of, you know, formula that's worked for people and it's so much easier for marketers. Kathleen: I love that. So maybe we'll put Kate's email in the show notes and you can email her and say, Hey, I need your newsletter so you can see what it looks like. So you had, you said you had some other things to be on that and I took you on a tangent with that one.  Kate: So other things on my list. Definitely write industry articles on LinkedIn so that you're showing industry expertise and what you're learning. I think that's very important just to start showing industry expertise and that you're connected to the industry. The other thing I'll say is look for media stories where you might fit in and ping the journalists. So a quick side story, do we have time for that? Kathleen: Yeah, go for it. Kate: When I started my Seattle agency, I had just been through this issue of what's called domain front running, which is when you go in and you're buying a domain and before you can hit checkout, someone takes it from you. So they're capturing it on the domain register thing. Well, King Five, the big news station in Seattle ran a story about how these guys were making all this money on domain names and how it was such an innovative business. Well, I got the journalist name and I sent them an email and I said, "I totally disagree with you. This is really bad for entrepreneurs. It's, you know, it's not right. There's some negative things happening that are just unfair." So they came to the office and filmed me talking about the story about how someone stole my domain name and then sold it back to me for a lot more money than if I'd just been able to push the button. And that was a great opportunity. I've had a lot of luck. You know, my first startup was around printing cookbooks and I had a lot of luck just calling local news stations and cooking on air. Free PR. I've gotten a lot of clients placed, um, if you have a consumer based business, there are a lot of news stations that their lunchtime, they'll have like a third hour, they have a third hour. It's usually lifestyle and you can get pretty easily placed on it if you have some sort of presence and something to talk about. They need people for that lifestyle hour. So always look for PR and media opportunities. Kathleen: Yeah. And I would say a great resource for that also is help a reporter out -- HARO. I mean that's a no brainer. It doesn't cost anything. You subscribe to it, you get an email, however many times a day with reporters looking for sources for stories. It can be overwhelming, but it also is full of opportunity. Kate: Yeah, if you have gmail, you can put on a label and then go in and look when you have time. But yeah, that's an awesome recommendation. Podcast interviews are great. You find people like yourself and you have similar topics and interests. There are websites like Canva that make building marketing collateral so easy and you look like you know what you're doing design-wise and it doesn't cost you extra money. So by all means, make your decks, make your one pagers, make collateral for all these different use cases. Think about collateral. Kathleen: Oh my God, I have to stop you and just say, I am the biggest Canva fan girl on the planet. I am not a designer. I do not know how to use the Adobe suite to design anything. That's the one thing I've just realized. I'm not, I don't have the aptitude for it, but I can go into Canva and make the most beautiful things and I do it probably four times a day. I love it. Yes. It's amazing. Kate: Yeah. Canva, huge. When you get later on in your startup and you have to have brand differentiation and you know, you don't want to use simple stuff, that's different. Early on, use Canva, print this stuff, have leave behinds for customers. It doesn't cost that much money to just really work on your marketing collateral. I think also when you're on the topic of press, look at your local press opportunities, where can you talk at local events, whatever works locally. We'll end up working in different geographies and at larger scale. So learn locally first and that stuff is free. It just takes time. And also work on your industry. So look, so look at this stuff in terms of, are you being, are you B2B or B2C? So where does that fall in? Then look at your media, look at it local and look at an industry as well. And then you want to start growing your community in terms of media. I see entrepreneurs, it's kind of painful to see that they're trying to do all the platforms and it's terrible on all of them. Just choose the ones that are most relevant and a couple to start and just start figuring it out. There's some great tools. A lot of people are saying, "Well, I don't want Twitter because it's not working." Okay. But the thing about it, the people who are on Twitter right now are really passionate and they stay on it. They're a very, very, very passionate bunch. My favorite Twitter tool for growing a Twitter audience is called Jooicer, which is J. O. O. I. C. E. R. Have you seen it? It's awesome. It's like 30, 40 bucks and will grow your Twitter audience for you beautifully. So you know, find tools like that. And again, like we were saying with Canva, you can make beautiful social media posts in Canva since you now have to have more designed content. Use Canva for that.  Kathleen: Yeah, I love this and I will tell you right now as the head of marketing at a startup, I use Canva, I use helper a reporter out. I totally, totally agree with you on those suggestions. Those are great. Kate's advice for startup founders Kathleen: Well we are running low on time. So any last words of advice for startup founders out there who really want to take that fast path to growth? Kate: Yeah, I think the important thing is to try to not get overwhelmed. And so what I recommend doing is, do a list of 10 to 15 different things. You can try figure out a small test for that, that's feasible. Like, if it's an ad unit, put enough money so it's actually worth the test and go through and test them and concentrate on one thing, like one thing a week, step by step by step. If you try to do it all at one time, you get really overwhelmed and it ends up not diluting the quality of it. So, one foot in front of the other is what I always tell people. Kathleen: Yeah. That's good. Kathleen's two questions Kathleen: Now changing gears because I have two questions I always ask all of my guests. We're all about inbound marketing on this podcast. So when you think about inbound, is there a particular company or individual that you can point to that you think is really doing it well? Kate: The first thing that popped in my mind was not what you asked. It was a company that helps people do it well. I really like Unbounce for landing pages. I think you can get a very beautiful landing page up quickly. I would have to think on that. I think, sorry, I was not prepared for this one. Kathleen: That's okay. Unbounce is a good suggestion actually. I can just keep that. Kate: Okay. I'm a huge proponent of Unbounce. There are other cheaper tools, but I really like the quality of Unbounce. Kathleen: Yeah, they're a great company. Second question, the biggest pain point I hear from marketers is that they can't keep pace with all of the different ways that digital marketing is changing. So how do you personally stay up to date with all of it? Kate: Being an agency owner, I've spent a lot of time and resources going through MarTech tools and organizing them. If anybody wants these reports, just please email me. And that helped organize my brain a lot and help me understand if I was doing the right thing or not. So we've done reports where we analyze CRM tools. There's one on website development tools. We've got one on email marketing and one on marketing automation. What those reports did, because in my head I just couldn't keep it all straight, was say here are the solutions, here are all the features that they all have comparatively. And then here are the integrations they have. Because I think what's so hard about MarTech right now is it's not only like I like this product, so I've got 20 products I have to put together. And when you're going out to buy, it's, it's not a great way for marketers to have to spend time of like, which tool, and having to analyze this themselves. So one of my goals to help marketers is to say, here's some reports. Go through everything that you need to know and hopefully you can pick a tool or at least narrow it down to two or three that you should get a free trial on before you commit to it. So I think any website like that, save yourself time on evaluating tools. Find people who've done the research for you. I think that that is really overwhelming. Kathleen: That's so true. It is. It's a lot. There's so many MarTech tools now. How to connect with Kate Kathleen: All right, well we're just about out of time. So Kate, if somebody's listening and they want to learn more about you or traction hero or they want to reach out and ask a question, what's the best way for them to connect with you? Kate: Katewalling.com is my personal website and Tractionhero.com is for the agency. It's a very landing page type website. Right now we're kind of building, um, by doing the work first. You can always reach out to me on my email, which is kate[at]katewalling.com or Twitter, which my handle is @Katewalling. You know what to do next... Kathleen: All right, fantastic. If you're listening and you liked what you've heard or you learned something new, please head to Apple podcasts and leave the podcasts a five star review so we can get in front of some more folks just like you. And of course, if you know anybody else who's doing kick ass inbound marketing work, tweet me @workmommywork, because I would love to make them my next guest. That's it for this week. Thank you so much, Kate. Stay healthy. Kate: Thank you so much for having me.

This week, the Miracles in Manhattan Podcast proves an impossible thing. Also we get to the bottom of lost loves, god, sex, cheesecake, and even lesson 14 of A Course in Miracles. Steph and Marco make a triumphant return to form - If there's one thing your hosts know how to do, it's claw their way out from under. Politics, Zen, spirit are, as ever, on the table. ---------------- ------------- ------------- You tell me that there is just one of us in this room. You hear me begin to say, "And that's one too ma--" but my voice is washed out. The hatch closes. A view through the porthole shows a Stranger pushing themself into inky water, swimming up, toward a stranger land above. Find us! WildManhattan.com Steph's book: The Art of Romance Marco's book, reviewed Transcript (or see video transcript on our website): [00:00:02.910] All right. Hi, we're back. Happy New Year. It's the end of February. And somehow you're listening to Miracle's in Manhattan again. This is producer Marco happening at the top of the episode to just say thank you to anybody who is tuning back in after a bit of an unexpected hiatus in which we went to podcasting camp and became epic. So if you would do us the kindness of just chillin out and giving us three years to talk into. For a while, I think everybody's going to be really happy about the outcome. [00:00:41.010] Seriously, we missed you and sorry to go off the radar. We've got some episodes in the can and we are excited to hear from you. Four episodes going forward. You can e-mail us by checking us out on Twitter. Our Web site. You know how to find it. Anyway, we are back and we will be releasing on Wednesdays. Author stays for the foreseeable future. So stay tuned. And most of all, to keep it wavy. [00:01:11.230] God did not create a meaningless world, the law of cause and effect, of course, and in living in fear is a a guaranteed way to make it so that you don't know how to love anything. [00:01:30.580] - Stephanie Wild Yeah. Fear and love that those are the only two things. And that's the only place we have free will so we can choose love. Or we can choose fear at any moment. [00:01:40.810] - Marco Maisto That's that's all that we can do. And that's what determines what happens next. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, for sure. Like the graveyard of of failed romance. Romance, I guess is the word that I that I should use is more of a garden. It absolutely is. [00:02:14.680] And we are moving towards the point where sorrow and happiness are the same thing. So hopefully this provides some comfort to out here. Exactly. On the other hand, it could totally freak them out. [00:02:40.200] But we'll see. You look skeptical about that. Do you feel like a trembling to hear a trembling tremble, tremble, tremble? Were you there when they crucified my lord? So there was a hymn. So there was a hymn from my school. Oh, Stephanie, no, that was a gift to your producer. Cause that's the is the first thing pepople will hear. [00:03:04.740] But autotuned. [00:03:13.600] And the sooner we accept that there is only one of us in this room, the sooner we will behave with compassion. [00:03:26.170] - Marco Maisto Wait a minute. There's only one of us in this room. Yeah, because bodies are an illusion. Separation is an illusion. Oh, I see. Know why I assumed you meant it was you. [00:03:42.610] They're black, but they're blaming the other person for hurting them. If he didn't do that, I wouldn't be in this pain. Or if I was more lovable, I wouldn't be in this pain. [00:03:55.230] - Stephanie Wild But what this means is that we can be free from all of that angst and we can just enjoy sex and cheesecake. [00:04:06.460] So if you remember. Stuff. Yeah. Well, do. Why? What happens? He can say the name of the show and everything. Oh, I forgot. What do we got? This is miracle's in Manhattan. Hi, Marco. Hey, Steph. [00:04:20.110] How are you? Hi. Good. I'm really, really well. I'm really, really well. Every day I just. He's always good no matter what. [00:04:30.640] - Stephanie Wild And that's where we want everyone to be. Yeah. [00:04:33.760] - Stephanie Wild 7:45 p.m. in New York. Drinking coffee? Yeah. Use this as a coaster. I'm sorry. I know the tap tap tapping you don't like. [00:04:40.920] - Marco Maisto It's not for me is for the Rs. [00:04:43.240] - Marco Maisto It's for the unique downloaders. Hey, stuff. Yeah. Well, let's do it again. So I'm Reverend Stephanie Wilde, psychic medium and spiritualist minister, spiritual counsellor. And you are? [00:04:57.650] Marko Meansto, taxi driver, owner of a fleet of taxi drivers. I'm Mark on me. So writer. I think that's a producer. Producer? Yeah. Make the show happen. And today is lesson 14 of a course in Miracles. God did not. Yeah, well, let's do it. Didn't say the name of the show and everything was oh, I forgot. We say usually. Welcome to Britain's Manhattan. So welcome to Miracle's in Manhattan. [00:05:28.460] I am the Reverend Stephanie Wilde, spiritualists minister, a psychic medium. And you are ha. I am Marco Maisto, poet and producer. And this is the show or two spiritual delinquents. [00:05:41.480] Try to wake up in the city that never sleeps. There you go. And that's why we're having coffee at 7:45. Yeah. Good morning. [00:05:58.040] We're up to listen 14 of a course in Miracles. And the lesson is, buckle up. Did not create a meaningless world. [00:06:08.540] What do we mean by God in this? Right. [00:06:11.990] Well, you can substitute the word God with spirit or universe or infinite intelligence or quantum field, or you can just take the word God out of it completely. [00:06:28.640] And you can say, I created this world with my thoughts. [00:06:34.130] We all together created this world with our thoughts and actions. [00:06:38.870] And it does not exist because we know now from the previous exercises. Right, that we create all of our experiences with our thoughts. We give everything we have given everything in this room all the meaning it has for us. Yes. They're not in control of everything. [00:06:55.580] They don't have to be responsible for everything. Right. [00:06:58.680] Okay. This gets us away from questions that theists might have issues with, such as why is there suffering exactly. [00:07:09.470] So many organized religions grapple with that question and it's pointless question what's going to be meaningless? But we use that word to me. It's a it's a pointless question because because God did not create suffering. [00:07:27.020] - Marco Maisto We did again. Yeah. Straight on the money with the better part of my hack of Zen as I understand it. [00:07:37.040] Oh, yeah. I mean, a key a key principle design is is that life is pain or life is suffering. And the solution to that is to detach from attachments and desires and things like that because they are illusions. Right. [00:07:54.590] And that's that's it. [00:07:58.520] But for the atheists, well, this is a really easy lesson because, you know, if God doesn't exist, he couldn't have created a meaningless world. He didn't create that world any way. [00:08:08.620] That is very sad. That's a very good observation. I really take that. So if you want to do the exercise itself with eyes closed. [00:08:17.450] Think of all the horrors in the world that cross your mind. Name each one as it occurs to you and then deny its reality. [00:08:26.620] - Stephanie Wild Say, for example, God did not create that war, and so it is not real. God did not create that airplane crash. And so it is not real. God did not create insert name of any politician that you hate. [00:08:39.640] - Marco Maisto Devin Nunes is an idiot. [00:08:41.560] - Stephanie Wild And so it is not real. [00:08:44.470] - Stephanie Wild And if you don't want to use the word God, you know, you can just take that out of the out of the equation and say we all collectively created wars. It's not real. It doesn't have to be that way. [00:08:57.940] - Stephanie Wild We all collectively created this political horror that we're living in, and we didn't have to do that. [00:09:05.840] - Stephanie Wild And it's not real. It doesn't have to exist. [00:09:10.810] - Marco Maisto That's interesting. Yeah. [00:09:13.840] - Stephanie Wild And one of the big criticisms that I've heard from people who don't understand what this work is really about is that they say, well, this just leads to nihilism, because if nothing exists, well, we can do whatever we want. [00:09:32.740] - Stephanie Wild But that denies consequences. There are consequences. The law of cause and effect is is in play. [00:09:40.090] - Stephanie Wild And what we do does matter at the level of form in if we if we act with fear, which means anger, hatred, all that of ego, then we're just gonna have to keep coming back and learning these spiritual lessons until we free ourselves from that and we can enter serenity. [00:09:58.690] - Marco Maisto So it is not about nothing mattering. [00:10:03.580] - Stephanie Wild It's about changing our perspective on our own, our experience. [00:10:08.440] - Marco Maisto Right. Yeah. The law of cause and effect karma, if you like. I was gonna say, you know, I think in a future episode, it's a shout out to a friend of mine by the name Caroline, who knows more about Zen than I do. I would love to have her call in for an episode and sort of break down some of these things in those terms. I don't have to shoot from the hip all the time or just to share her thoughts. [00:10:33.100] - Stephanie Wild That said, I'm talking to you, see. And yeah, the law of cause and effect, of course. [00:10:41.530] - Marco Maisto And living in fear is a a guaranteed way to make it so that you don't know how to love anything, isn't it. [00:10:49.330] - Stephanie Wild Yeah. Fear and love. Those are the only two things. That's the only place we have free will so we can choose love. Or we can choose fear at any moment. That's that's all that we can do. And that's what determines what happens next. [00:11:04.450] Can you stand up? And when you say it's the only two things we can choose. [00:11:08.690] The only freewill we have to choose between love and fear in any moment in. Oh, and how we approach this situation. Yeah. [00:11:15.350] Yeah. Mm hmm. This this lesson really makes me. It it hits home again about how important it is to recognize that these are meant to be done. [00:11:30.620] Kind of like a on a on a one day and then move on to the next one. Oh yeah. Because well, because I think sitting around Internet deeply dive into this to write a note to take, to try to write, to try to go too deep into just this, which I mean it's based on this. [00:11:48.800] It's based on this statement that is not substantiated. It's a thing where it has to be. Yeah, exactly. [00:11:56.750] And the case value for now under AB. So that's absolutely correct. Your text does say that, you know, you'll you'll you'll meet resistance. [00:12:03.770] You'll try to decide what's true, what's not. Don't worry about it. Just just do it and see how you feel. [00:12:10.890] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. [00:12:13.310] And no, no more than three practice periods with today's idea unless you find them comfortable. So if you're feeling like, oh yeah, this is taking me to Serenity, then yeah, you can keep doing it. [00:12:26.120] So there's a therapeutic something in. Well. Well yeah. [00:12:31.070] So we're moving towards. Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think if you get up to this point in this lesson 14 and you stop there. I don't recommend stopping. [00:12:41.720] But if you do, you kind of got you kind of got it. You know, you've got it. The world doesn't exist. We make it. Let's unmake it by changing our perspective and enter into the experience of of serenity. [00:12:53.750] And in fact, the text calls it salvation. This is the second coming of Christ. He's not going to fall down out of the sky. [00:13:03.110] This is that is the Bible discussed? Yeah, great. He's gonna. I mean, he doesn't he's not doing anything. We didn't exist anyway. [00:13:12.830] But we are going to be reborn with this new perspective. Right. So we're gonna we're gonna leave the our bodies, which are illusions behind. [00:13:23.120] We're going to leave all of the war and the terror and the evil, all of this nasty stuff behind because it doesn't exist and we can be reborn with into true love, true perception and just experience of bliss. [00:13:41.960] What's the moment in your recovery or post recovery where you kind of tangibly felt a feeling of rebirth that could have been or or the rearranging of perception that could be associated with this lesson? Are you thinking. Do you have. No, this is not a loaded question. Matthew, you can think of like any particular moment, you're like where it was like you let out a deep breath. You're like, ha, OK. [00:14:17.090] Well, I think when I first realized you really understood that I didn't have to drink. I mean, in that moment, I did not have to do that. [00:14:28.940] That was all just my own illusion. That was all just my own thinking. [00:14:32.150] And at that, I'd created this this belief system for myself that that I had to drink. And and and all of a sudden I realized I didn't. That wasn't true. Yeah. And I felt completely free. [00:14:51.080] You didn't say that. That statement. You know, in I've heard that saying before and it's a little open ended, right, because I don't have to drink. And it almost begs the question in order to blank. Right. [00:15:02.690] In order to get through the day, whatever you want. Yes. What was what did it mean to me? Yeah. [00:15:07.120] The beliefs that I that I built up around it to be a grown up kids are meant to be an adult. You know, like grownups drink. You go out to some party and you and you have to drink. You go out to dinner and you have to drink. [00:15:20.910] You know, it was all this Grown-Up stuff that was that was. [00:15:26.480] I remember thinking that years and years and years ago, that's something that I absolutely believe. I never questioned it. Interesting. You know, I guess I had I mean, I have I have others that I could think of. But to riff on that, I for a long time when I was like really, really trying to chase after when I was getting sober, what was it? [00:15:54.600] I entertained a fantasy of a. [00:15:58.920] And it's great because the image of this fantasy is so on this like even without the alcohol in this scene I'm about to describe, this scene would never happen. It was like it was like being on some sort of Yop sunset somewhere. [00:16:14.400] Yeah. [00:16:15.290] And and enjoying like, I don't know, single malt whiskey was right. Beautiful woman. [00:16:22.250] Well, it's in the end that's what they sell. You're right. That's what they sell us. Okay. That's a good point. But yeah. [00:16:27.830] Oh, we believe it. You know, we believe it. And then they sell it back to us kind of thing. I had a similar one one day. [00:16:34.970] That will be fine. Yeah. [00:16:36.590] Yeah. One day. Yeah. I had a similar one. Oh God. What's that movie. The what. [00:16:41.840] They remade it. And it had Pierce Brosnan in it. And Rene Russo he said. [00:16:49.580] And I know it's not this but. So when a man loves a woman. No, no, no. That was Andy Garcia and Meg Ryan. You know, this is where he's the art safe. [00:17:01.700] Oh, right. Yeah. What was that? [00:17:04.050] I know someone will know. Email us. Plays miracles in Manhattan at G-mail dot com. Yes. And I remember this scene on the court. I think I've mentioned this scene before in this podcast. [00:17:14.210] Really, though? Yeah, we may have we may have lost that one. Right. I've crashed. [00:17:18.190] But but those two characters. See, she's supposed to be Chase. She's supposed to be getting this art thief and he's seducing her, you know, and convincing her not to run away with him and not to turn him in. [00:17:33.710] And they're sitting at his luxurious hideaway and he's burning masterpieces of Osh and they're drinking red wine. [00:17:46.010] And that's my equivalent of what you just as I want your equivalent. [00:17:50.210] Bear in mind. I think I was also in the body of Burt Lancaster or someone like that. Well, yeah, I was in Rene Russo. Yeah, buddy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. [00:17:59.360] I was told there for sure. [00:18:03.980] Or actually not in her body but in her body doubles body weight. Right. Okay. [00:18:09.500] Hey Mel. Yeah. Right. [00:18:12.170] Okay. Neat. So I ask you that. I wonder. Well, because I think we're talking about the beliefs are rare that we no longer need to believe in order to be happy. [00:18:21.590] Yeah. The beliefs that that bring you peace or the beliefs that. Yeah. They get you closer to away from assumptions and illusions and closer to just kind of living what you love. [00:18:34.670] Yeah. [00:18:35.030] So you know the boat and the single malt and the red wine and burning masterpieces, you know, is not in fact going to bring us closer to serenity. [00:18:46.980] Yeah. It's just not right. This stuff is changing our perspective. [00:18:54.260] Interesting. [00:18:55.340] I'm starting to think now that that one of the reasons we talk a lot about relationships on the show, sex and stuff like that, is that is that that is maybe like a sort of second was maybe for me a second act of coming to realize that what assumptions I'd made about how to relate to other people were not written in stone and things like that. Yeah. Yeah. We should think about what I mean by that. I'm saying like there I think for a long time I operated under the position of like this is what it means to be a boyfriend or husband or this or that. [00:19:33.190] No, that's absolutely true. So and and we learn those from the tribe. Right. The conventions of the culture that we live in. And that's my what's my second book is about the art of romance. [00:19:45.150] And I was going to give you an alley. You on that? Well, I mean. Yeah. The art of romance. Oh, with a forward by yours truly. Oh, that's right. Yes. [00:19:59.020] That is a really great forge. It's really nice, isn't it? I love reading that. [00:20:04.290] So, yeah. And the other thing, the other reason why we talk about relationships and sex and all that so much here is because we learned through relationships, that's how we learn these spiritual lessons. [00:20:15.820] We're here as different parts of ourselves to teach each other, teach ourselves how to throw off these illusions. [00:20:27.460] Yeah. You know, and maybe we don't want to speak too soon because maybe for somebody who is suffering the pain of a breakup or something like that. [00:20:37.390] You know, I think maybe I've sort of harbored a thought like the one you just articulated without having the word thought. [00:20:43.920] But, you know, in a more I don't mean this in a in a astrological kind of way, but in a more cosmic from a more cosmic point of view or a far removed point of view, you couldn't you could say something about relationships being, you know, that the the the proving ground or that the the the laboratory of becoming a better person. Adam Lutely. [00:21:16.180] Absolutely. And and and the sooner we accept that there is only one of us in this room, the sooner we will behave with compassion. [00:21:30.610] OK. Wait a minute. There's only one of us in this room. [00:21:34.840] Yeah, because bodies are an illusion. Separation is an illusion. [00:21:38.650] Oh, I see. [00:21:41.360] I don't know why I assumed you meant it was, you know. But I am not God. I know. [00:21:49.350] I know. That's true. It was more just like him. OK. [00:21:53.980] Yeah, for sure. Like the graveyard of of failed romance. [00:22:00.940] Romance, I guess is the word that I that I should use is more of a garden in that way. It absolutely is. [00:22:07.480] And we are moving towards the point where sorrow and. Happiness. Ah, the same thing. Neither, neither. Sorry. Doesn't hurt us. [00:22:21.610] We can just observe it and say, well, that's chemical that's made up of thoughts that doesn't exist to Simon's excitement, happiness, anticipation and what we what we call in Western thought positive and negative emotions. [00:22:36.720] Right. Yeah. That's I mean, that's a tall order, but certainly that's what this is. Oh, that's a lame duck. Yeah. What do you think? [00:22:43.450] That a person, our hero, if you will, who is suffering from a breakup or something like that right now is is saying to themself, instead of this is chemical. [00:22:56.620] This is a thought thing. [00:23:00.950] What if they're black, but they're blaming the other person for hurting them? If he didn't do that, I wouldn't be in this pain. [00:23:09.100] Or if I was more lovable, I wouldn't be in this pain. Yep. Yeah. So, yeah, it's some. And, you know, you can't just jump straight to that. [00:23:22.700] That's why these exercises are here. [00:23:25.560] Sure. Because we move incrementally and we feel that it's true. [00:23:32.030] We get a little happier, a little happier day by day by day when we get to the point where we understand that it's not someone else causing us pain and it's not because we are defective in some way. [00:23:45.650] Sure. Sure. I bring up sometimes the you know, I get a little bit ahead of things to project a solution down the road, largely so that people don't jump over to another podcast. [00:24:00.530] You know, listen to episodes later on. We want them to stay on this. [00:24:05.000] Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And we want to we and I mean, this is where the point of it is happiness. And that's why we are where we are going. [00:24:12.440] And, you know. So. Yeah. Know that. And that's and it's normal to to to wonder and to want an answer. [00:24:20.180] And, you know, that's our ego. But. But that's the human condition. So. Yeah, that's that's fine. OK, so. And by the way, yeah, I did get a message from a listener that they like your banter. [00:24:40.650] They like your side. That's not when you sent me, though, is it? I don't know. But anyway, we did get that, so don't worry. [00:24:51.370] I'm not worried about that anymore. No, I'm. I am. I am who I am. [00:25:01.980] Sorry. Yeah. [00:25:05.940] Now, you sent me a screengrab of a something from a listener who said Marco is about to launch into some sort of explanation. And then you just said this. Oh, yeah. No, that was different. [00:25:18.030] Yeah. That's good. That's good. [00:25:21.600] Great. Great. Yeah. [00:25:22.820] And I feel yeah, I feel very comfortable with the way you make putting me on the spot here. There's a one of us. [00:25:29.700] I think that, you know, there was a moment of silence there and I had to fill it. [00:25:36.330] It was my Instagram. Yeah. Oh my God. No, no, that's fine. That's fine. [00:25:40.830] This is this is a it just seems like a very serious episode. It does, doesn't it? And but I guess it is. I mean, it is all about salvation that this is it. I suppose. But you know what? Doesn't have to be serious. You know, why can't it be right? [00:25:53.220] I mean, I know you've got Christ trawling with Buddy Holly from an airplane to earth. And I introduced the idea of the graveyard of lost love affairs. [00:26:06.940] But what this means is that we can be free from all of that angst and we can just enjoy sex and cheesecake shit. Because. [00:26:15.720] Yeah, that's one of the I that's one of the the sort of truisms that you believe that it was something you told me early on. [00:26:25.290] Yeah. Well one of my teachers says it that way. Yeah. [00:26:28.830] Oh this was the other question I was gonna ask because I see what I see how this got a little dark. Okay. Yeah. [00:26:34.680] Because I was gonna for some reason I thought you're gonna have a quippy answer to my recovery question. And then I was going to launch it to what's the worst subway ride you've ever been on? [00:26:43.830] Oh, the worst of what you describe like the moment where everything was peak shit. [00:26:50.900] I was in a very crowded subway car and I couldn't move and so one was feeling me up. [00:27:03.690] OK. Yeah. Move. Couldn't get away. [00:27:07.100] Well, thanks for keeping it light stuff. No, just junk. Really. And truly junk. Of course, that's going to be a woman's experience. Yeah. Yeah, it's sort of. You know, I feel like New York City in the 70s. Same situation, perhaps more perilous, but the subway car is empty or more empty. Yeah. [00:27:28.420] Yeah, that's the other nightmare when it's sushi like the middle of the night and. Yeah. Yeah. But you know, in much the time when I was on the subway, an empty subway, an empty ish. Well I mean it's more terrifying when there's just one other person in there. [00:27:45.580] I was completely wasted so I didn't really sense any danger. [00:27:49.480] Was this on your great a train trip around the city. Probably. And see, it wasn't just one trip either. Oh, God. Yeah. That happened a lot. [00:27:58.650] Right. Let's see. In terms of sinister experiences, which is not really what I was after, but you brought it there. [00:28:07.960] They all seem to involve a largely empty subway car. [00:28:11.830] Yeah. And then someone either already has on or more disturbingly, gets puts a mask on. Oh, well now that's happened a lot to me and I'm real walking. [00:28:23.650] Yeah, that has never happened to me. You know what? [00:28:27.040] It's you don't need it. They held it there. [00:28:29.980] I mean, like so most general example, it was it was recently and it was like close enough to Halloween that like some kid was sort of just still wearing his his non monster Halloween mask, which makes it much worse. [00:28:43.600] Yeah. [00:28:44.350] It was just like sort of feel like a like a like a yellow rubber head. [00:28:49.370] Oh. And he. And he was doing these convulsions. And then I realized he's just listening to music. Yeah. But, you know, so there's that. [00:29:00.010] And then there and then other times, like I've been on a crowded train where somebody just reached into a bag and put on Blake, you name it. On one occasion, a gas mask. [00:29:14.620] That's not cool. Lord on a Morse. [00:29:17.350] In a more strange turn of events in the heat of the summer on the train to Brooklyn. Course dude reaches into his bag and puts on a paintball man. [00:29:30.220] I don't know why he just wanted a rocket just getting prepared. [00:29:33.870] I guess I feel like it would have been fine if people had broken out on that train. But yeah. Masonite cool to wear on the subway. So what's all this got to do with anything? [00:29:44.050] How do you. Oh, yeah. So Kate actually has to be a little bit more about the crowded type example. So how do you find in a moment like that? [00:29:52.330] How does the thought God didn't make this happen to help you through it? [00:29:58.100] Well, let me think, because I didn't know any of this. Then you can think. So if it happened now, what do you do? [00:30:05.830] You can help. I can do what you want. [00:30:07.720] It sounded like you needed to think. Yeah, well, I can provide one more subway example. Okay. Go ahead. This one has me being less panicky. [00:30:16.720] It was late, relatively empty subway and a woman sitting across from me was with some friends and stuff. [00:30:27.100] So it wasn't like a worry. But she, uh, she was definitely wasted. And she did that. She did this thing. But like I seen way too many times in the subway where you think someone is sort of sleeping. And so they're bobbing and weaving with emotional as far as me. And then they just sort of tip an extra inch forward and vomit in. [00:30:46.800] Oh, in their lap. No, I didn't do that. [00:30:49.210] I used to vomit in my bag. At least I was that aware. [00:30:51.790] Yeah. No, no. And lap and then the floor. [00:30:54.460] And I was sitting directly across Schumer and I didn't move now and I wasn't interested in like being there. And so I was also like, I've never done this before. [00:31:05.740] So I just hung out for the next 10 stops and, you know, played Angry Birds or some shit. [00:31:13.020] Yeah. I mean, that's very New York too isn't. It's just like that. I mean, yeah, we can detect we do learn to detach don't we. [00:31:20.530] In New York. Yeah. I mean I knew be healthy or unhealthy I suppose. [00:31:24.970] But yeah we do. We do learn to do that. Yeah. So how to deal with getting felt up in the subway when you can't live. Well I was kind of I was hoping to avoid this answer because it really is one of the answers that people get very angry about. [00:31:43.870] Because it seems to put the responsibility on what's happening on the victim victim blaming. [00:31:52.080] But, you know, let's just see what happens here as I as I talk and think it through. [00:31:58.240] So so. No one's doing it to me, right? It doesn't exist because my body doesn't exist. And the subway doesn't exist. And none of it exists. It's all in thought. It's all. Thought form. It just seems real. And so this helps me not get it ingrained into my subconscious so that I don't get traumatized, so that I don't have to step out of the subway and replay it and replay it and replay it and get angry and fearful and mad and then look at every other man who's ever gonna step near me and. [00:32:33.670] Right. Right. [00:32:34.930] It frees me from that. [00:32:38.080] Now, you know, if you if you go and say that to someone and there and there and they're right in the middle of of the trauma like I was at the time, because I'd been abused as it as a child, it does seem to be victim blaming. [00:32:56.110] So you just can't go from A to Z. You know, you have to go through. [00:32:59.910] Oh, you don't have to. But most people need to go through the process of this court. These kinds of exercises. Sure. [00:33:10.600] And you tell me if I'm wrong on this, by the way. I think we should release a companion episode to this one where I say all those things instead of you and just see which gets more clicks. Okay. No, we won't do that because I value my everything. [00:33:30.730] So I it sounded to me that I cannot imagine. I certainly can't fully empathize with that experience. Right. I can I can make analogies. That's that's about as close as I get. [00:33:44.890] But I don't I don't imagine that. I mean, yeah, there is a guy grabbing on you. That's that's a fact. That's material fact. [00:33:55.330] And and it seems to be. Yeah. Or seems to be. Yeah. [00:33:59.350] I mean not in the level of form. Yes. And the level of form. [00:34:02.720] Right. I mean like just to keep this a little bit away from what solves this too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And to because I think what I'm trying to say because what I think. [00:34:12.070] Cause all those things transpired. [00:34:15.220] But the question it seems to me like what you're saying is you then are empowered to. Be the agent or the art or the author of how they inscribed themselves or don't hit upon. Yes, precisely. Right. [00:34:30.720] So you want to deny the fact that some dude felt you were right. [00:34:34.110] Right. Because he's laughs actually causes the trauma is the belief that follows. [00:34:40.080] Oh, I'm dirty, shameful in that. And that's all part of society in women's oppression and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. All of that stuff. So it's not what actually happens that causes the suffering. It's the belief that follows. So what you say is precisely true. [00:34:58.510] Yeah. Yeah. I think in a in an example like the one he gave, that's probably pretty accurate. Yeah. [00:35:03.040] And I mean, you know, if I could have I could've turned around, elbowed him or whatever and you know that that's fine too as long as I do it with love. [00:35:09.690] Right. Right. I love you and you need to learn this lesson. Yeah. I'm going to obey you in the fire in the head. And I don't do that again. You know, I'm doing a service to my sisters. As long as I do that with love and not hatred. [00:35:23.100] Yeah. Okay. Talk to a Shaalan monk. They can help you with that. Yeah. Okay. [00:35:30.780] So anything else, too? Anything else? No, nothing more. But yeah, I think we're good. [00:35:37.740] I think we're going on that. But say something awesome. There will be editing on this. Just a little bit. No, I guess you know what? I was I was looking for some some kind of pretty bow to tie around this. [00:35:52.590] And I think that if this is a module or lesson, I've become sort of prickly about the word lesson for some reason. It speaks volumes about me personally. [00:36:03.090] Yeah, I know. Exercise. You know. On this little exercise because. Yeah. Yeah. We I think it's fine to be prickly but isn't because cause you know you want to be lecturing in tone. You have to do it Texas. Try this, try this little exercise you know and and people get caught up in like oh I have to do them all in order and I have to do them one a day and I have to do it right. [00:36:27.330] No, no, you don't. No, no, no, you don't. Just try them out. See how it makes you feel. You know, this is a suggested order. [00:36:37.350] But if you've come to understand parts of this, you know, series already, you know, you you know, you'll be able to skip around or stick to one a little bit longer or, you know, it's not it doesn't have to be linear. [00:36:54.300] It's set out this way. It's convenient. But yeah, it's it we don't want to give that impression. No, no. [00:37:00.230] Yeah. I mean, lessons. Examiner What would you say? Exercises. Brain traps. [00:37:05.910] Yeah, whatever you like. Okay, cool. Wow. I interrupted myself, which is probably for the better part. Yeah. Yeah, I think I was I was part of me was searching for a a something to tie this together conveniently. [00:37:22.650] And I think that if this is a brain trap exercise that is really clearing the deck, I'm sort of savage that it's it's fair not to expect that that there will be a clean resolution coming out of this, because like you said, this is a this is a pivotal year in the book. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. We'll we'll make this pretty. We'll make this one pretty. Right. Okay. No problem. All right. [00:37:54.780] We got a lot of this. A lot of good in there. Let me get in there system. That was tough. Sometimes things are tough. What's next? My thoughts are...    

Hey everybody, we're super excited about this week's interview with ex-Mormon activist and all around badass, Kate Kelly! We hear all about what she's been up to, and she wasn't afraid to tackle the tough questions we threw at her, like, "So Kate, is it true ya like the ladies?" We learned so much, and laughed of course...ya know, the usual. Also, want to express a heartfelt congratulations to the state of Virginia for finally getting their shit together! Join us, won't you?Kate's references in this show: www.equalitynow.org/era, author Sonia Johnson: "From Housewife to Heretic", Kate's article: "The ERA is Queer", and of course her new podcast: Ordinary Equality (available wherever you listen to podcasts).Music provided by Purple Planet: https://www.purple-planet.com

Hey everybody, we're super excited about this week's interview with ex-Mormon activist and all around badass, Kate Kelly! We hear all about what she's been up to, and she wasn't afraid to tackle the tough questions we threw at her, like, "So Kate, is it true ya like the ladies?" We learned so much, and laughed of course...ya know, the usual. Also, want to express a heartfelt congratulations to the state of Virginia for finally getting their shit together! Join us, won't you? Kate's references in this show: www.equalitynow.org/era, author Sonia Johnson: "From Housewife to Heretic", Kate's article: "The ERA is Queer", and of course her new podcast: Ordinary Equality (available wherever you listen to podcasts). Music provided by Purple Planet: https://www.purple-planet.com --- This episode is sponsored by · Zhou Nutrition: At Zhou Nutrition, we believe greatness comes from within. We make supplements in our own facilities in the heart of Utah with carefully crafted formulations to support essential wellness, mind, mood, beauty, and the keto lifestyle. https://www.zhounutrition.com/ · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app

If you didn't tune into Tuesday's episode with Amy Taylor, The Shame Eliminator, I'm going to highly recommend you put on the breaks, pause this episode, and go back. But if you did listen to it, you know all about shame and those things we tell ourselves. For this week's Powerback, we're going to talk about our inner thoughts. So we say a lot of shit to ourselves, but we don't say it out loud. We say it internally. Because realistically—we don't really want anyone else to hear what we're saying. But we believe it ourselves. If you've been following along with me on social media this week, you know I've been doing something that has taken an immense amount of gutsy for the last eight weeks. I've invested my time and energy into working with an executive coach named Kate Blake.If you're not familiar with Kate, I highly recommend you look her up. She is a spitfire and she's been helping me to overcome beliefs that have been ingrained in me; deep, dark insecurities that I've allowed to influence what I have and have not been able to do. Ultimately, this shit has held me back from being 110% who I know I can be. So I just kinda got to a point in life where I'm not willing to be stuck anymore.There's the saying that a rising tide lifts all ships. And guess what? When we're hanging on to mental baggage, we're not raising the tide or the ship. So Kate posed me with this challenge to wear my insecurity is on a t-shirt. And my first thought was, why in the hell would you have me do that? And then she explained to me that to ultimately overcome your insecurities, you have to not only be willing to face them but not be ashamed of them.So the trick here is just to be insanely aware of what you're saying to yourself. Pause and reroute. What else can you say to yourself in replace of that negative thought? If you're saying I'm fat, try I'm gorgeous. If you're saying I'm a shitty business person, what about look at this incredible business that I have made and how far I have come. It's all about stopping in the moment and replacing those things with healthy, beautiful statements to encourage yourself to keep going. Because guess what? If you can't believe those things, then how on earth do we expect anyone else to? It's not everyone else's responsibility to make us feel amazing. We have to be willing to own those things first.- - -For more inspiration, follow along with us at:thegutsypodcast.comfacebook.com/thegutsypodcastinstagram.com/thegutsypodcastinstagram.com/thatlauraaura

Author Kay Eck joins us to answer some BIG spiritual questions like: Why are we here? What is the purpose of life? Why do we have to experience suffering here on Earth? Why are people experiencing stress, anxiety and depression more now than ever before? And how do we slow down, and dive deeper into ourselves? Kay Eck is the Author of Divorce a Love Story, which could really be titled, Life a Love Story because it is more about your relationship with yourself than anything else -- and she'll be on the show again on March 19th talking about her book and conscious couples! Connect with Julie & Continue the Conversation on Instagram! Website:  www.jancius.com Instagram: www.instagram.com/angelpodcast/ Facebook: www.facebook.com/angelpodcast/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLOL5Dgsssv7A4C7SLvyqWg?view_as=subscriber   Connect with Kay Eck! Buy the Book on Amazon! YouTube Facebook Instagram   Show Notes *Show notes recorded by Sonix.AI computer.   [00:00:00] Hello beautiful souls before we begin I just want to share a few freebies with you first. If you subscribe on my Web site your name and contact info will be put in a jar that I pray on every morning. The Angels also have me pick a few people from that jar every week to text personalized Angel messages too that could be you. All you have to do is subscribe on my Web site. Also you can win a free session with me if you write a positive review of this podcast on iTunes after you post a glowing positive review on iTunes. Just e-mail me with your name contact info and review and you'll be entered into a monthly drawing to win a free session. For details on all of this visit my Web site: www.jancius.com. You're listening to angels and awakening where we believe daily life can be lived from a constant state of love, joy, peace, bliss, ease and grace Why are people always searching for a better way to live because there is one life doesn't have to be stress filled and anxiety ridden you can make lasting changes that lead to a life you love. My name's Julie Jancius I have the gift of connecting with angels and bringing through their healing positive messages to my clients every day. Join us on the angels and awakening podcast each week as we explore big spiritual questions. Interview experts and bring through Angel messages. I am so excited you're here!   [00:01:38] Hello everybody. Welcome back to five minute Fridays. We're here with Kay Eck.   [00:01:44] She is the author of Divorce a Love Story which is a magnificent book. If you haven't read it yet you definitely should. We are going to have her on in a couple more weeks talking about the book, talking about conscious uncoupling, talking about having more consciousness in relationships. But Kay is with us here today for our five minute Friday to just answer some big spiritual questions. So welcome Kay.   [00:02:14] Thank you. Julie it's great to be here.   [00:02:17] Oh good. Can you talk just a little bit about yourself and your book.   [00:02:21] Yes. So I have just written a memoir called Divorce a love story the power of self-love to heal every last thing. And this has definitely been a journey for me. It is my memoir of my process of consciously uncoupling from my husband of 30 years. And so it kind of takes you through my process and how I was able to heal from that and to create a loving path forward for my family. So yeah I've been busy promoting that and getting the word out because I'm hoping that it's it's it's really something that I feel we really need right now is to bring a lot of healing around the area of relationships.   [00:03:12] I'm so excited for our listeners to get to hear the episode because I know how they write how much they're just going to love it because it's not just about people going through uncoupling our conversation there was really about just relationships in general where women as mass consciousness where we are at in our relationships and where we're at with a marriage and how we see marriage changing really over the next 10 15 20 years. So that was a really fun conversation. But today we're going to kind of get to the heart of you and and your ideas and some big spiritual questions. Great. Yeah.   [00:03:57] The first one is have you ever connected with an angel or loved one on the other side or had kind of a supernatural experience and can you tell us about that.   [00:04:08] Oh well where do I begin. Well so I have throughout my life experienced sort of so I guess you could call them supernatural phenomenon and I feel like I have a couple of different areas that are kind of common themes.   [00:04:34] So one of them is that I often get medical information about people and it's not like earth shattering and it isn't something that I have spent any time developing so right now it's kind of more of a novelty but when I'm in someone's company that I know well and they express some concern about something going on I'll get some information about what's going on. So for instance I'll get information that they need to check their lungs or that they don't have this. They actually have that or that something it's not serious and it's going to resolve itself. So I'll get that and then I have often had the experience of people who've passed coming into my field and asking to deliver messages to their loved ones. That's not a super common experience but if I have a close friend typically I will hear from their loved one and passing that on is this my is it is a gift and I've I've I've had many experiences of connection with other dimensions primarily through my higher self. And yeah so that's a that's like how I live my life. So it's hard to talk about it in a   [00:06:04] Way that is episodic. Yeah yeah no that's perfect that's perfect. You   [00:06:11] Know I think what we're trying to do here with the podcast is we all have an intuition right. Which Spirit shows me is really our souls thought system.   [00:06:21] On the other side and what I see so much of is that talking about our intuition talking about these intuitive hits that we get is really Tabu right now in most parts of our society that we just don't talk about out how we're hearing from the other side. So kind of shedding some light on that and helping people to see that it's not just me it's not just you. Everyone has this. Everyone can learn how to develop this more is definitely one of the things that we want to do here.   [00:06:56] And it's just a matter of listening isn't it and not ignoring the small still voice as I call it which is your higher self or your soul. And you know in some respects we're very tuned in to the fact that we have a soul but we we have a disconnect. We think it's something outside of ourselves that we can't have a conscious relationship with on an everyday basis. And so it's it's there it's just a matter of accepting and listening.   [00:07:28] Yeah. OK. Next question. What is the purpose of life.   [00:07:36] Well my current thinking on this subject is that we are aspects of God experiencing everything. So I am an aspect of God or wanting to experience life as K EK And what I've really come to understand is the reason that there's no that I that there's no judgment about good bad right wrong is because it's all a divine experience and it's you can really relate it to the relationship between a parent and child in that having children is an experience that we're really a lot of us feel called to have. And yet we create something that is of us but is also autonomous. And this is exactly how our relationship with the divine is. We get to kind of choose these paths but this is all from God's perspective that we're living.   [00:08:42] Yeah. Yeah. That I couldn't have said that better. That is perfect. So then when people come in and they say well then why on earth do we have to experience pain.   [00:08:56] Why do we have to experience suffering. That's such a good question of course we're all wondering that. Well I guess I would say that our human minds are the ones that want to put labels on these experiences that if you go into a dark room you don't necessarily say that that's a bad room.   [00:09:23] You just say that it's a dark room. If you go into a light room you don't say it's a good room you just say it's a light room. And so when we can open up ourselves to explore and and understand that there there's no judgment of these experiences that our higher selves just wanted to experience every aspect of being human. And what that means then we can understand that. But there's also you know this concept that we don't grow unless we meet some resistance and the darkness can definitely be thought of as some resistance and we can decide how we want to interact with that whether we want to be enveloped by it or to transform it or to supersede it or to ignore it or you know we have all these choices that we our souls can grow from. So I mean it's hard to understand also that souls are autonomous and that they've asked for these experiences they know they knew what they were getting into when they decided to incarnate as a human. And so it's not really for us to judge whether those are good or bad experiences. They're just human experiences.   [00:10:44] That's perfect.   [00:10:47] Why are people experiencing stress anxiety and depression at such an increased rate than ever before.   [00:10:59] My perception of that and this is an issue very close to my heart is that we are experiencing an increase in polarity or in duality.   [00:11:16] So as our vibration lifts as a collective we become more aware of the lower densities for a period of time. So it's almost like you have like let's say you have a piece of play dough and you're pulling a top portion of the Plato up you can see that there's it's there's creating some tension between the lower caution and the upper portion. And that's kind of what we're experiencing now where we're especially amongst younger people they're coming in at a higher vibration. So the the three dimensional density of life on Earth is so much more intense for them. They really feel it. I also feel that what we are experiencing the anxiety and the depression is a clarion call to look at those feelings and to explore the roots of them so that we can set them free. So I tend to think of those things as coming up and out of the field as opposed to coming into us or being a part of us. And so I know from my own experience with anxiety and depression it was asking me to look at something look deeper sit with the fear why are you so afraid and what what. I came to was the realization that I felt alone on this planet. I didn't feel my connection with my source. I felt like I had been abandoned. I felt like I was unworthy of God's love. Of that I had no power. And so I once I uncovered those issues then I could say well is that true or is that not true. Is that my truth or is that not my truth. And so this is the process of discovery that that for me the anxiety and depression was was a gift to help me uncover   [00:13:24] And I know in your next book you're talking about really getting to a place of inner freedom. And you know I gotta tell you as we've been talking I can see there being a workbook with this. Have you thought about that.   [00:13:40] Wow that's interesting. I'm right at the beginning of this project and so there I am I'm seeing all kinds of possibilities. So I'm going to put that one up there.   [00:13:52] Yeah. Yeah. And I can see you talking in front of just a massive amount of people and they have you know a lot of them are women. They have the workbook right in front of them and they're they're going through.   [00:14:09] And you're kind of teaching and they're going through. Yeah I I think that I have really felt the calling to teach and have been doing that for a long time.   [00:14:25] Just on a smaller scale and I have also felt that I have also felt a larger and larger platforms and I think that one of the reasons why that is happening for me now is because I feel very rooted and grounded in my sovereignty. And I understand how self-love plays into that. So I can I can feel a great deal of compassion for people who are still working their way toward that. So thank you so much for that I appreciate it.   [00:14:59] All right. We're going to ask a couple more questions. What is the greatest quality humans possess.   [00:15:08] I personally have such a huge love and compassion for humanity as a whole. It is such a singular experience. We are as individuals really entrenched in the experience of being human that we don't have the perspective of how incredible it is to be human right now. And we're like these huge fields of light and love and energy that have this very special form of the human body with all the power of our source or all the creative power of our source we can literally create something out of nothing.   [00:16:01] We do it all the time without even realizing it. So we're sort of have this way of mimicking the creative expression of God in a very particular way. And I just think that's incredible.   [00:16:17] It's incredible to watch. If you think about the unlimited ways in which God expresses itself it's it's just unbelievable mind boggling and overwhelming.   [00:16:32] Mm hmm yes. Brings up a lot of emotion. So two of the most biggest forces of energy that we have in our experience here is creation and being creating and just really being in our life.   [00:16:53] And I know there are some people in the spiritual community whose message is really to live in the beingness live in the high vibration 24/7. But when we're in the creation process we're in the doing. I do feel like we come down in the vibration a little bit and I'm just wondering how you balance that. How do you stay in flow when life gets really busy. I of course I have a little bit of distance on this since my children are now in their twenties but   [00:17:31] The the busy lives are our creations. I really don't have to be that way. So that's something that we've created. But to answer the question about being in flow I think that the being in flow is a creative process. And I have always had this really close connection with my creative aspect. So I've I've always. When I was a kid I would create little sayings and little stories and games and plays and all that kind of stuff that kids do and that that ability to tap into the creative Essence has never left me. So to me the creative process is about opening up your connection to what wants to be expressed through you. So your higher self or your soul is an aspect of your Creator that wants to be expressed specifically as you. And if you could just imagine that those are like gates that you open and allow the flow to come through. And it requires stepping out of the mind and just setting the mind aside and and letting it come through the heart because when we think about high levels of expression whether it be visual arts or music or dance or performance writing all of these things we don't think of that as coming from the mind. We think of it as coming from a higher place and that higher place is the heart I see.   [00:19:11] I love that. Kay for anybody who wants to connect with you online on your website and social media where can they go. So right now the best places to reach me are on Facebook either at my personal page Kay Eck. Or on the page for my book Divorce a love story and also on Instagram @KaysAwake.   [00:19:41] And I know I got my copy of the book Divorce a love story on Amazon and it just I was able to start reading it on Kindle while I was waiting for the hard copy to be delivered to my house.   [00:19:55] Where else can people buy the book.   [00:19:57] I saw the book is available on Amazon but it's also available at Barnes and Noble dot com.   [00:20:03] Fantastic and I definitely recommend it it's a must read to anybody out there. It's not just about divorce you said once it could really be called life a love story. And that's very true it's for everyone. So Kate thank you so much for being on the show today. We are just so excited and everybody stay tuned for Kay's upcoming interview a longer in-depth interview about the book about life about kids about everything.   [00:20:31] So thank you Kay.   [00:20:34] Thank you so much. Truly it was really fun.   [00:20:48] My dear friends you don't know what an incredible huge huge huge blessing it is to this podcast when you write a glowing positive review for us. It truly helps us get the best experts on the show. I know this might sound a little complex but if you send me an email after you post a glowing positive review here I will put your name into a monthly drawing to win a free 30 minute Angel message session with me and it may just be broadcast on this show at a later date. Your name will be kept in the drawing every month until you win when you email me. Don't forget to include your name contact information and positive review. I hope you win.   [00:21:31] Tune in for a new episode next week where I'll share tools and guidance that can help you fall in love with your life and start living it from a place of peace bliss and ease.   [00:21:42] Thank you so much for listening to the angels and awakening podcast. Until next time knowing your heart just how deeply you're loved on the other side and open up your heart to all of the random unexpected blessings that your angels and your spirit team are trying to bring into your life right now.   [00:22:06] Disclaimer this podcast provides general information and discussion about energy healing spiritual topics and related subjects the conversations and other content provided in this podcast and in any linked materials are not intended and should not be construed as medical psychological and or professional advice. If the listener or any other person has a medical concern he or she should consult with an appropriately licensed physician or other health care professional. Never make any medical or health related decision based in whole or even in part on anything contained in the angels in awakening podcast or in any of our linked materials. You should not rely on any information contained in this podcast and related materials and making medical health related or other decisions. You should consult a licensed physician or appropriately credentialed health care worker in your community in all matters relating to your health. If you think you may have a medical emergency call your doctor or nine one one immediately. Again Angel messages energy healing and the information you receive here does not constitute legal psychological medical business relationship or financial advice. Do not take any of the advice given and any angels in awakening podcasts or sessions in lieu of medical psychological legal financial or general professional advice. Please note angels in awakening is a podcast produced by Chicago energy healing a company with locations in Wheaton and Naperville Illinois.   KEY WORDS: God, Universe, Source, Spirit, Guardian Angel, Angel, Angel Message, Angel Messages, Angel Reader, Angel Readers, Angel Whisper, Angels, Anxiety, Archangel, Archangels, Arch Angel, Archangel Gabriel, Archangel Michael, Archangel Raphael, Ask Angels, Attraction, Law of Attraction, The Secret, Oprah, Super Soul Sunday, Soul Sunday, Aura, Aura Field, Author, Awakening, Being, Bliss, Bible, Bible Verse, Bliss and Grit, Buddhism, Catholic, Chakra, Chalene, the Chalene Show, Realitv, Change Your Life, Chicago, Naperville, Wheaton, Chicagoland, Christian, Christianity, Church, Pastor, Preacher, Priest, Co Create, cocreate, Consciousness, Spirit Guide, counselor, therapist, Dax Shepard, Death, Depression, Died, Grief, Divine, Doctor, Dream, Angel Therapy, Gabrielle Bernstein, Ego, Empath, Energy, Energy Healing, Enlightened, Zen, Enlightenment, Enneagram, Fabulous, Faith Hunter, Family, Feelings, Goal Digger, Jenna Kutcher, Ancient wisdom, Brandon Beachum, girl boss, badass, life coach, sivana, good, gratitude, great, school of greatness, greatness, the school of greatness, lewis howes, the Charlene show, rise podcast, Rachel Hollis, Tony Robbins, the Tony Robbins Podcast, guardian angels, guides, happy, happier, happiness, Hay House, summit, hayhouse, healed, healing, health, heart, heart math, heaven, help, high vibration, higher self, highest self, holy, I AM, illness, inner peace, inspiration, intention, intuitive, jewish, joy, Julia Treat, Julie Jancius, learn, lesson, light worker, Louise Hay, Love, Marriage, Magical, Manifest, Manifesting, Marie Kondo, Master Class, Meditate, Meditation, Medium, Mediumship, the Long Island Medium, the Hollywood Medium, Message, Metaphysics, ACIM, A Course In Miracles, Method, Mindful, Mindfulness, Miracles, Mom, Motherhood, Naturopath, New Age, Passed Away, Past Lives, Peace, Positive, Power, Pray, Prayer, Prosperity, Psychic, Psychic Medium, Psychology, Purpose, Quantum Physics, Life Purpose, Ray of Light, Reiki, Relax, Religion, Robcast, Sadness, Depression, Sahara Rose, School, Science, Shaman Durek, Shift, Sleep, Soul, Source, Spirit, Spirit Team, Spiritual, Spiritual Awakening, Spiritual Gifts, Spirituality, Stress, Synchronicity, Tara Williams, Tarot, Teacher, Thinking, Thoughts, Transcended State, Transcendence, Universe, Vibration, Vortex, Wellness, Worry, Worship, Yoga, Zen, Afterlife. Copyright: Chicago Energy Healing

To continue with our Podcast Showcase Series, we have an episode from Katie Jones from the Food Heroes Podcast. In this episode, she interviews a cool startup in the UK, a company that makes beer out of old bread. Katie Jones popped out of the scene last year when LinkedIn had this weird power of getting individuals to talk more. I was fortunate to ride the wave of this, and so did Katie. Katie has a very interesting story. You can actually listen to it on her podcast. I believe it’s episode 20. It’s a really good episode and you learn a ton about Katie’s background. Also, I get a shoutout on this episode, if you’re interested in seeing the inception of this, I’ve posted it on the show notes. So Kate is also an expert in plant-based foods such as vegan ice cream and vegan cheese. This is because of her experience at So Delicious, a very popular vegan ice cream company. Katie, who is inherently entrepreneurial, stayed in the company for 6 years building the company and creating vegan products and creating systems to execute these vegan products. After being laid off at So Delicious through an acquisition, she took time to find herself. How did she do this? Well, she took her dog and her RV and traveled around the United States. Through her RV journey, she really explored herself.  Around that time, she researched Copywriting and jumped into it. After a few months of writing, she decided to well, start a podcast! Her fascination with B-Corp spurred the development in podcasting and with 20 episodes, Katie has had some amazing guests who are doing good work in the food system we live in. Many of her episodes focus on things such as food waste, or ethical sourcing of unique ingredients like saffron or eggs. If you’re into hearing the stories of the people who are making the world just a little bit better, this is the podcast for you. Sponsor This episode is sponsored by the West Coast Nuriv Music and Tech festival a free music festival on March 6th, or the day before Expo West opens its doors. We have bands like The Bombpops, Direct Hit, Dog Party (opened for Green Day tour, 2017), Get Dead and a "Mystery" Headliner! FAT Wreck Chords presents, NURIV 2019 at the E Sports Arena in Santa Ana. email: innovate.today@virun.com to get on the list and a chance for a VIP spot as well. invite your friends! If you want to sponsor, email customer.service@virun.com ..we have a few open spots for sponsorship.    

Kate White was the editor-in-chief of Cosmopolitan magazine for 14 years. And in addition to being a busy journalist, Kate has written 12 mystery novels. But what this episode focuses upon is how Kate also has emerged as a career guru for women. She made headlines in the 90’s with her groundbreaking best-seller: Why Good Girls Don’t Get Ahead … But Gutsy Girls Do. Since then, although women in the workplace have made progress, some things haven’t changed. So Kate recently released her fifth career guide for women: The Gutsy Girl Handbook: Your Manifesto For Success. In this book, and in this podcast episode, Kate encourages women to “go big or go home.”

How Kate Fisher found herself at the brink of death, having to choose between this world and the next. Plus one of the best foods to feel grounded: for keeping a level head and making good decisions(!) Hi everybody, I'm Barbara Fernandez, the Rocking Raw Chef, here with my Clean Food, Dirty Stories: one to entertain, the other to inspire.I help people stamp out stress, depression and fatigue over at RockingRawChef.com, and today's title is:This world...Or AnotherIn addition to this story, at the end of this episode I'll share with you one of the best foods to feel grounded – in other words, to help us stay clear-headed and even make better decisions in our lives.OK enough hints from me, I'm sure you have no idea what that food is...or maybe you do, so let's get on with the story.Our guest, Kate FisherI am super excited to be joined here today for our story by Kate Fisher. Kate is a shamanic practitioner who specialises in helping others to connect with the power that is already within them. She is also an artist, and she works with drums, paint and clay to create shamanic tools, paintings and ceramics. And she works with people not only face to face, but also at a distance which I think is very cool. She has a pretty incredible story to share which I think you're going to love!So Kate, welcome to the Clean Food, Dirty Stories podcast!Kate: Thanks Barbara.Me: Yeah, it's great to have you. I'm looking forward to sharing your story.Kate's storySo you work in Norfolk, you live in Kent, but do you have a lot of trees surrounding you now? Because I know that you spent a lot of your childhood in trees, is that what you told me? Is that where your story begins?Kate: Yeah, it kind of is, I was much more into sitting in trees and hanging out there and not really with the other kids. It just felt calming and I later found out that what was actually happening was that I was speaking with the tree deities and the tree spirits themselves. Me: So like when most kids had imaginary friends, like little playmates and stuff, then you just had your playmates that were like in the trees and nature spirits and everything.That's really cool, when I was little actually, I didn't play with the other kids either. I was with them but I was a tiger roaring and crawling on the floor. So there were no nature spirits for me, just a bunch of crawling around.On to herbalismAt one point you studied herbalism, is that right? How did you come to study that?Kate: Well, I began studying it. After doing my art degree, I actually got a job in Neal's Yard Remedies in Norwich. And so that just kind of brought me back to plants and their uses. The medicinal uses were the sort of thing I was drawn to. I was going to move to Australia to do the whole course of naturopathy. There was something still missing from that for me. So from that I actually found magical herbalism.Me: Okay.Kate: Yeah, so that's kind of like hedge witchcraft. It's understanding that everything has an energy and you can use that energy to help heal and help rebalance.Me: I know about wild plants, you know, and collecting wild plants and just eating them because they taste really good, and I know that nettles for example are really good for arthritis, just little things that you kind of pick up. But that's kind of all I know. So is it like making teas for people and poultices and things like that out of plants and stuff?Kate: No, no, it's purely energetic, so it's basically like spellcasting.Me: OK.Magic herbalism, then on to the PhilippinesKate: So you would use certain herbs and plants that have certain attributes and they often correspond with the medicinal uses as well. And you'd kind of enchant them and then you'd make them into little sachets to hand to people and once they'd got their use from it, they would bury it. It was always just for an energetic purpose.Me: Oh OK.Kate: It's like the old wives' tale of putting certain things above the door so things can't come in.Me: I get it. OK. So you were doing herbalism but then I think you stopped, is that right, and you moved to the Philippines? Is that right?Kate: Yeah, that's right. So magical herbalism still wasn't doing it for me and I still felt there was something more. And I came across a book and it was called Chance Spirit Shamanism, and this just sent me off! I knew that I had to do something with this because it would take me deeper into that plant realm. The way I actually got to the Philippines was through my ceramics, with a job as a teacher over there.Manila and the Saturn returnMe: How did you get that job? That's really cool.Kate: A Filipino lady, her family ran the college there and she approached me and asked if I would teach there.Me: Wow!Kate: Unfortunately it was in Manila and for me that was just too busy. It's a really built city with really rich and really poor areas. I found this place called Bahay Kalipay which means the House of Happiness. So I went there, I volunteered and from there I taught this process called The Inner Dance, and this was precisely when my Saturn return hit. I had just turned 28 and I decided to drop everything, I sold everything that I owned in England basically, and I decided to move to the Philippines.Kate's Saturn ReturnMe: Wow. So can you just...sorry, can you explain to people, some people that may not know, what is a Saturn return and why does it just – cause I've experienced one too – what is a Saturn return and why does it turn your life upside down?Kate: Yeah, well, OK. The Saturn return is...Saturn's in a certain place in the night sky and what happens is when that then comes around which obviously it takes 28 to 30 years to come round in your astrological chart, that changes everything. You're then kind of pushed or encouraged onto a path that you should have been taking that you may have been diverted from. Some people's is really turbulent, other people it can be quite free flowing depending on what their life path life has taken. And then this happens again normally in women's time, it's normally around the menopause.Me: Well it would be like 28 years later, right?Kate: Exactly, yeah, it's on that time scale. So it really can turn your life upside down because Saturn's known as the teacher. If you haven't learned your lessons, you're gonna learn them!Why the PhilippinesMe: Yup! I've experienced that so I know exactly what you mean. Yeah, so it can be quite big life changes and stuff, right? What made you decide to move to the Philippines?Kate: Well, in all honesty a man.Me: (laughs) As so often happens...Kate: And he worked at the retreat center that I went to. Yeah, I kind of knew that it wasn't gonna work out but I'm always this kind of romantic person, I'm just gonna follow my heart...I loved it there anyway because it was just so beautiful and I felt so held there, just on the land.Me: Yeah. So you moved to the Philippines, so if you moved because of him, did you stay with him and then, like, what happened?Releasing inner blocksKate: Well, I think I moved in with him to begin with, him and his family. And then I went back to work at the retreat center for meditation and the inner dance which is kind of meditative. It allows the flow of energy and any blockages to come out, it can be quite cathartic and transformative in itself. So I went back there and lived there, and I did that for 8 months. I was looking for land to buy as well.Me: So you were gonna buy land in the Philippines? That's very cool. You said at one point that you had a kind of like dark night of the soul, was that related to the guy? Or...Kate: It was all, you know, a whole lump of stuff rolled in together (laughs). That's what happens, isn't it?Me: All at the same time, of course, yeah.Crying in paradiseKate: All at the same time. So yeah, for me, I was in paradise but I was crying my eyes out every day.Me: Oh!Kate: Yeah, and it was just this kind of ultimate depression, but this was something different, it was a transformative kind of time. And I ended up not really seeing the point in life, so I went from, you know, being on a real high and feeling the connection between all things and all of this and then just fell apart and thought, “Well, if everything is nothing and nothing is everything, then what's the point?”Me: Oh, yeah, I've felt like that before so I can relate, yeah. Wow.From the Philippines to PeruMe: And so from there, how did you...you said that you then went to Peru, right? So how did you go from the Philippines to Peru? Did you just one day up and decide to leave, or was there a specific incident where you thought 'OK I've had enough, I'm going to leave now'? Or...Kate: Well I, I'd gone to America to visit my friends over there and then while I was there I phoned this person...Me: Somebody in Peru?Kate: No, sorry, I phoned my boyfriend at the time. Yeah, and he ended up going “Oh I've decided I'm going to be a Peace Pilgrim”.Me: A Peace Pilgrim? What's that?Kate: So it's someone who walks around without anything, but just goes spreading peace and basically relies on anyone around them to support them. He said “This is my highest excitement”. So I was like, “OK, fine”. Obviously I was a bit heartbroken because I'd just travelled the other side of the world, but it made me suddenly realize that I wasn't following my highest excitement. So I thought “OK, what's happening right now? Where's the mother of all plant learnings?” And it's happening in Peru, with Ayahuasca, with Huachuma... Ayahuasca and HuachumaMe: What's huachuma? I mean, I know Ayahuasca and in fact I spoke about that in a previous episode, but what's huachuma?Kate: Huachuma is also known as San Pedro. San Pedro was the Catholic name they gave when they kind of came over to the South Americas. Huachuma is the original name for it. It's a cactus that is mescalin-based, so it's similar to the peyote which is a mescalin-based medicine.Me: Oh OK. So it's a similar kind of experience with...like a journey like you would do as if you were taking Ayahuasca but you're taking Huachuma?Kate: It's similar, yeah. Huachuma's much more about the earth and less cosmic. Ayahuasca is out there, attaching to everything that is. Huachuma's about the heart, about connecting back to the earth.Me: Wow. OK, so you did both of those when you were there?Kate: Yeah, that's right, so I spent 6 months being an apprentice to both of those plants.Me: Oh wow! So now are you able to perform Ayahuasca and Huachuma ceremonies for other people?Kate: I believe I can hold ceremony for Huachuma for other people. With Ayahuasca I decided that I'm just always going to be her apprentice (laughs). I just don't see how people hold space for that, it's such a powerful thing.Temazcals (sweat lodges)Me: OK. So you did those, and you also mentioned temazcals, you know, the sweat lodges, what were those like?Kate: It's really magical.So for somebody who doesn't, who doesn't know about a temazcal, can you say a little bit about like what it is? Because I've done one, but not everybody knows about it, right? Could you say a little bit about like what it is and what happens and why you might want to do a sweat lodge?Kate: OK. It's a really sacred ceremony and our ancestors have always used it to cleanse, to rebirth. To go into those sweat lodges is like going back into the mother's womb. You go in there with thanks, knowing what you want to get rid of or what you want to transition into. And you bless the rocks which are put into a sacred fire.Me: Sacred fire?Kate: Yes. They then heat those for several hours and then you will go into the lodge. You normally go through about four, yeah, four rounds. They'll bring in a certain number of rocks, and then water is poured onto the rocks once the door is closed.Me: And it gets really, really hot, I remember.Kate: It does. But it builds, it's not like going into a sauna. Your body gradually kind of gets used to it until it gets so hot that you're just like “Oh no I can't do this!” But quite often, we always say that the heat is your friend. Because that heat is sometimes not physical heat, it's sometimes you know, coming up against maybe a blockage of the energy of the thing that you're trying to shift, so if you can, stay in.The eyebrow of the Peruvian jungleMe: And so how did you...how did you go from doing the sweat lodges and the Ayahuasca and Huachuma ceremonies to the jungle? Cause you said that you were...I know that you mentioned to me that you were in the jungle with some friends and you had a pretty scary experience there. Can you say a little bit about like how you came to be there, and what happened?Kate: Yeah, definitely.I was a, I suppose an assistant to the woman that owned the retreat center. And we'd become really good friends because we obviously worked really closely together. We were offered a piece of land possibly in a part of the jungle called Manu which is known as the eyebrow of the jungle of Peru. So we went to visit, and our friend who also went with us, he was also an Andean priest. He went and hired a boat and took us to this special island which had quite rare breeds of certain animals, mammals and things. So he takes us over there and we're just so excited to see a different part and see rare species. Onto the land, you know you just start walking around and admiring things and I think it was about a third of the way around this island and all of a sudden something hit me.When the jungle gets angryKate: It felt like I'd suddenly started menstruating but it wasn't that time, it felt like all of my guts were just turning around. I just suddenly went white. Me: Wow!Kate: Literally it just felt like, I don't know, I could have eaten something that didn't agree with me, all that kind of stuff. So my friend tried to do an echo cleansing on me. Now all that did - this is the dirty part of the story – was give me diarrhea. It was awful. My body was emptying, everything was too heavy. I was getting rid of everything. It was really quite scary as it progressed.And then this feeling came over me that the jungle was angry. There was always this element of kind of doubt, skepticism I guess.Getting lost in another worldBut I was about to get lost in another world. The jungle felt like it was pulling me. The world that I knew, that part of the jungle that I was seeing with my physical eyes was disappearing. Me: Wow! That's scary!Kate: Terrifying. And interesting at the same time.Me: Yeah, kind of like 'this is really scary but this is really cool!'Kate: I mean I got really scared up until the point where I thought, 'OK, maybe I'm going to leave this other world that I know and I'm gonna be taken to another world'. And when I reached that level of acceptance, you know, that strange place of like 'OK this is just happening', I told my friends to go on without me. I said, “This is where I stop”. And it was like, it was, I don't know, it was like I was disappearing.Me: Wow.Kate: Yeah, I...after feeling scared it was suddenly this peace that took over. But then my friends became scared because they realized how real this had become. You know, they couldn't just leave me in the jungle.Me: Yeah.Kate: And the Andean priest, he was suddenly panicking around me. He was saying in Spanish, in Quechua, panicking about “Oh I haven't done it, I haven't done it, I haven't done it!” He was going on about the ritual or the ceremony that we were supposed to do when we arrived at this land.A hurried ceremonyKate: And so all of a sudden he's scrambling in his pockets to get things out and I was just flopped on the ground at this point and I had no idea what was going on around me other than his scrambling. He got out the cocoa leaves and he made like a little fan of these and he started doing ceremony. And he was doing all these different things around me but I didn't have any awareness to be able to learn or witness or anything, it was like I was being absorbed into the jungle floor.The next thing I know he's yanking me up off the ground saying “Stamp on the floor! Stamp on the floor!” Like this. And I was just like “I can't do it, I can't even lift my leg,” like I had nothing left, no physical ability whatsoever. But he was so persistent I just went and I just, I just kind of just flopped my foot on this space and I later found out that he'd buried the cocoa leaves there.And as I touched my foot down, something happened and I felt a little bit stronger. So then he went, “Again!” I stamped again a little bit harder with the strength that I'd found. And he said, “Again!” I stamped my foot even harder, and every time we did this, my energy started coming back and my color started coming back and I felt myself being drawn in, like my energy bodies being drawn back into this physical body. Until we'd done it enough that they felt comfortable with us making our way away from there.Me: Wow. Yeah, and then you just left at that point? Were you supposed to stay longer?Kate: I had to lay there while they went off in the boat for a while so I had to lay in the jungle for a bit and stop. Just to kind of recoup and make sure that I'd gathered all the parts of me back together I think. Me: Yeah, of course, yeah.Fear as teacherKate: And I gave my thanks and you know, and I said, “Sorry for not knowing better”. I should have known better, that's what I was there to learn, you know. How to respect these places.Me: Yeah, but you were there to learn. I would have thought the Andean priest would have... I mean, I would have been blaming him! (laughs) Right? Wasn't he kind of there to, you know, to guide you and look after you? I mean I would have been like, “Dude you forgot something! Look what happened to me!” No?Kate: Well, I suppose, but I didn't see things that way at that time. I kind of overtook responsibility if that makes sense. But I gave my thanks to the jungle at that point because that's when my skepticism left and I really started to trust that Spirit is there to guide. And it really showed me its strength, and the only way it could do that was through fear.Me: Wow.Kate: Yeah, I was really, really grateful to have learned that lesson because without that I wouldn't be able to practice, you know, the techniques that I do today.Me: I bet the Andean priest learned a lot too, right? I bet he never did that again! (laughs) Right?Kate: (laughs) I don't think so!Me: Almost killed a tourist, can you imagine? Oh my goodness. Wow!What Kate does todaySo then you said that that experience helped you do the techniques that you do today, so how? Like, how come? What was it about that particular experience and what did you take from there I guess is what I want to ask, that you now use? Yeah, that you use now?Kate: Well it's just the level of trust.Me: Ah, OK. That makes sense.Kate: When I'm doing the healings or ceremony or anything, I endeavour obviously – I mean sometimes ego gets in the way and makes you feel small. But that's quite rare these days. I just allow Spirit and the ancestors to guide me.Me: Yup. Yeah, because you have that trust now thanks to your experience in the jungle. I get it, yeah. Wow!So then, yeah, what do you do now to help other people? Because I know you do lots of different things, do you want to say a little bit about that?Kate: Yeah, well the main thing that I endeavour to do, like anyone that I come across I try and support and empower. Even if it's the smallest thing. And give people that different perspective on themselves. I think we're so made to feel belittled and that we think that, you know, to think good of ourselves is to be arrogant. But actually we need to come to a space where we can be comfortable and love ourselves without that. Me: Yeah.Kate: It's really hard to explain! I lead retreats and...Finding the Wild WomanMe: So what kinds of things do you do at the retreats? For example, do you take people on shamanic journeys as a group? Kate: So for the retreats, what I focus on at the moment is women. And I do this alongside a lovely lady called Amy who runs SoulShine social enterprise and we, well we call it Finding the Wild Woman. And it's all about rewilding, so finding that part of you that's been repressed through, you know, all the things that we should and shouldn't do and expressing your authentic self.Me: Oh I like the sound of that, yup!Kate: So we do all sorts of things.Me: Wow, that sounds quite fun.Kate: Yeah, we use all the different elements as well. So you know, we run through kind of water, earth, fire, air, spirit...so people can connect back with those. The very base elements of this world.Me: Wow, that's very cool.Individual help, even at a distanceMe: So you do those at the retreats, and then I think you said for individual people you help them find balance and things? Like what do you do for individuals? Because I know you also said you do some things at a distance as well. Kate: Yeah, so whether it's distance or whether people are there, I'll connect with them and I'll allow Spirit and ancestors again to work through me. I use my drum, rattle, feathers, anything. I always ask if the person's comfortable with it. Yeah, and then I use the vibe to kind of realign, as everything's made of vibration. The intention is to realign those things, on any level that person wants to work.Me: OK. So do people normally come to you...yeah I would imagine people would come to you with a really specific problem, right? Can it be any kind of problem? Like, I don't know, like everything from physical problems like physical ailments to maybe emotional problems or mental problems? Kate: Yeah, definitely.Me: So a bit of everything. Super! OKKate: The most common tends to be physical or emotional, but actually you find out that they're all interlinked so you just follow that path until...Me: Yeah, I know what you mean. Training for the Celtic sweat lodgeMe: So do you run sweat lodges? Do you use that tool in your work at all?Kate: I'm not running them yet, I'm gonna do another 2 years learning the Celtic lodge.Me: So how long does it take then to train to learn the Celtic sweat lodges?Kate: Well, I'm taking three years to do it.Me: Three years, OK. Is that your choice to do it over a longer period?Kate: Yeah, I know that you can learn the practicalities in a couple of weekends, but to have the experience of actually supporting people through that process...Me: Oh yeah, that's the biggest bit, yeah.Kate: It's a very different ballgame.My own experience in a sweat lodgeMe: Yeah, of course, cause I know, I mean I know for me that when I did a sweat lodge, yeah it was years ago now. And at the time I was...I was a total mess!And so when it got really, really hot, I could feel that kind of...how can I describe it? It was kind of like as if there was a well at the bottom of my being that was filled with all these like dark stuff. You know, fears and things like that that never got to come up to the surface, you know? That never got acknowledged.Just like really primal stuff, you know, almost as if you could tap into your most primal fears because there was no cultural barrier. There was no mental barrier, you know.You were just so hot that your mind...I mean for me my mind almost just left my body really because it was just so hot. And I thought that was...that was quite an amazing experience.I mean for me I was like wow! It was scary but it was also really cool and I can imagine that for some people... I mean, I like to think that I'm a pretty strong cookie but I imagine it would be scary for people to come to grips with what they find and to have to kind of, yeah, deal with that. I mean if they uncover something they didn't know about themselves before, maybe something that's super scary, then yeah I would imagine you have to have the tools to deal with that, right?Kate: That's right, yeah. You've got to be able to support people after they've kind of gone through the sweat lodge process. Like you say, sometimes people are left with things that they need to kind of then kind of speak through or go into a bit more.Me: Wow, yeah. But I'd definitely say better out than in, right? All that stuff.Where to find KateKate thank you so much for coming on to share your story. There's a friend of mine that also mentioned that when you hold any kind of retreat or workshop or any kind of event in nature, she said just ask the spirits there for permission so you're on their terrain as it were. So that's a really good example of what can happen if you don't, right? I'll have to tell her about it. Well, I'll have to get her to listen to the episode.But thank you so much for sharing that, I really appreciate it and I'll link to everything that you do below, but do you just want to say where... Where can people find you? What's the easiest way to find you?Kate: Yeah, it's easiest to find me on Facebook at the moment because I'm still working on my website but that's at kfheartwisdom.Me: Super! OK. I'll put the link to your site as well. Is it katefisher.co.uk? Is that right?Kate: Yeah.Me: Thank you so much, I really appreciate it, and I think I'm going to dive into our food tip.Foods to feel groundedAnd it's really funny that there was all this stuff about stamping on the ground and everything because...I mentioned at the beginning of this episode that I would share one of the best foods to feel grounded. And first I do want to kind of emphasize what I mean when we say grounded.When we feel grounded, we feel more connected to the earth. Now this might sound airy-fairy, but it's actually really important. So you can think of feeling grounded as the opposite of scatterbrained. In other words, instead of feeling confused, all over the place, not knowing what to do, when you're grounded you actually have a clarity of purpose. It enables you to not only get things done but to know what those things actually are that you need to do for your own happiness.And believe me, this is really, really important. I speak from very personal experience. The other way that you can think of being grounded is eating foods to feel grounded. It's kind of like getting the benefits of comfort food without gaining weight, if that makes sense. You do get that, yeah, that sense of comfort from these particular foods, but you're eating good food, you know? Rather than junk.And for those of you who want to do some of your own shamanic journeys as Kate did, this particular food that I'm going to talk about can help you stay connected to this world too.So although there are many foods to feel grounded, the ones that I want to mention here, or the one specific one is...squash!Benefits of squashAnd when I say squash, this actually covers a variety of vegetables: so you've got spaghetti squash, summer squash, zucchini, marrow and pumpkin. Those are all types of squash. Gourds as well, those are squash.Squash is one of the oldest foods around – it's been cultivated for at least 10,000 years, and it may look kind of ordinary, but it has a lot of health benefits.Now you may not know this, but squash is listed as anti-fungal, antibacterial and anti-inflammatory! It contains vitamin A, several B vitamins, folates, magnesium, potassium, iron, copper, zinc, manganese, calcium, and beta carotene among other antioxidants.So it's insanely good for a whole host of things, including managing our blood sugar, keeping our lungs healthy, helping keep our eyes sharp and strong, having strong bones, and reducing the risks of many diseases including lung cancer, emphysema and glaucoma, and that's just to name a few.Squash has many other benefits and I'll link to an article in the show notes if you'd like to read more about it.Now however before you decide to start eating bushels of squash, I do have to warn you about one thing. Squash is very good at lowering blood pressure, and if you have low blood pressure already, squash could lower it even further. So if that's you, best to eat other veggies instead. Fortunately there are lots of other alternatives that I do mention in other podcast episodes!How you eat squashNow as to how you eat squash, well there are so many ways to eat it! Most people puree it and make pancakes, or they slice it and fry it. My favorite way to eat it – and if you know me you'll know what that is – it's to spiralize it! I'll link to an article in the show notes where I show you how to do just that. You can make great pasta using squash, and you don't even have to boil it. Plus it's naturally gluten-free, so everyone can eat it!I've also got some delicious recipes that use squash in my 5-Minute Mains recipe ebook that I'll link to as well.So I hope you've enjoyed our story this week!Have YOU got a story to share?And if you've got a crazy, true story to share (and you'd like to know what food could have saved the day or enhanced your particular situation), I'd love to hear from you! Email me at barbara@rockingrawchef.comIf you enjoy my stories and want to hear more, join us and subscribe! I share one amazing, true story a week. And if you've got any questions, just pop them in the comments! And if you're listening on iTunes, do give me a review, that would be awesome.I hope you have an amazing day, thank you so much for being here with me to share in my Clean Food, Dirty Stories. Bye for now!RESOURCESHow to spiralize veggies: http://rockingrawchef.com/what-is-a-spiralizer-and-what-can-it-do-for-me/5-Minute Mains and other recipe ebooks: https://rockingrawchef.com/5-minute-recipes/Foods to feel grounded: https://www.sarahpetrunoshamanism.com/blog/12-foods-for-feeling-grounded/Benefits of squash: https://www.organicfacts.net/health-benefits/fruit/squash.htmlKate's bioKate has studied many esoteric and spiritual practices to a basic level from an early age (13). When her Saturn return began (age 28), Kate moved abroad to study different healing techniques with healers and shaman of Philippines and Peru. She learnt that to know and embrace all parts of yourself is where true healing happens. With a holistic attitude to life and endeavouring to approach life from the heart, Kate believes that all aspects of the self - mind, body and spirit - play a part in the health of the person. Finding balance in all these aspects, we can live to our full potential.Kate's website: http://katefisher.co.ukKate on Facebook, YouTube​