Podcasts about prosecuting attorney

10:05 – 10:15 (10 mins) Weekly: Tim Jones @SpeakerTimJones “The Tim Jones and Chris Arps Show” weekdays 4p-6p on NewstalkSTL Here Is Why We Need To Stay On Top Of Ending Wokism And DEI 10:41 – 10:56 (15mins) WEEKLY with Mark Harder, St. Louis County Council also featuring: Melissa Price-Smith, Prosecuting Attorney of St. Louis County Our office will work in partnership with law enforcement to achieve a safer community for people to live in, work in, and visit. It has been my honor to work side by side with the great men and women of in the St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney's Office. It will also be my honor to lead them in our shared goal of vigorously prosecuting violent offenders and towards a safer St. Louis County for us all."Melissa Price Smith Melissa Price Smith was sworn in on Friday, January 3, 2025, as the St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney. Smith is the first woman to hold the position. Smith has been a member of the St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney’s Office since 2008 and served as assistant prosecuting attorney and supervisor of the office’s Sexual Assault and Child Abuse Team. Throughout her 20 years of experience as a prosecutor she has worked closely with law enforcement to fight crime and hold criminals accountable. Ms. Smith earned a Bachelor of Science from the University of Missouri-St. Louis. She then attended St. Louis University School of Law where she earned her Juris Doctor. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

New St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney Melissa Price - Smith: McGraw Show 1 - 6 - 25 by

In this segment, Mark is joined by Jane Dueker, a local attorney and regular participant of the Reardon Roundtable. They discuss her thoughts on the St Louis County Prosecuting Attorney appointment battle as well as the New Years Eve violence in downtown St Louis.

Brad Young, KMOX Legal Analyst and partner with Harris, Dowell, Fisher and Young joins the show to talk about St. Louis Smiley Face Cookie Co. receiving a cease-and-desist letter from a Pittsburgh-based chain, and the ongoing Prosecuting Attorney battle.

Attorney Bevis Schock joins the Marc Cox show to break down how the legal battle between St. Louis County & the Governor over their Prosecuting Attorney picks will continue, the big three steps that they argument will go through (constitution, stature, charter) and why the courts interpretation of the law will be the last word.

John Hancock and Michael Kelley join Chris and Amy to talk about the controversy on who appoints new County Prosecuting Attorney, President Biden pardons Hunter and more.

John Hancock and Michael Kelley stick around for the hour with Chris and Amy as they discuss snooker, St. Louis' mishandling of ARPA funds, controversy on who appoints new County Prosecuting Attorney, and the grants of clemency by President Joe Biden.

Cort VanOstran, who was selected to be St. Louis County's Next Prosecuting Attorney by Sam Page, joins Chris and Amy to talk about his nomination, his priorities for his position, and the incoming pick for the same role by Governor Mike Parson.

In the second hour Chris and Amy are joined by Cort VanOstran, Selected to be St. Louis County's Next Prosecuting Attorney by Sam Page joins Chris and Amy to talk about taking on the role and his intensions. KMOX Sports Contributor Bernie Miklasz joins Chris and Amy to talk about the market for Nolan Arenado and Bill Belichick going to the college level. Finally, Rongey had a bad spicy coffee.

On today's episode of The Chris and Amy Show, Governor Mike Parson joins Chris and Amy to reflect on his administration's notable accomplishments in workforce development, infrastructure growth, and attracting new businesses to Missouri. He candidly discusses unresolved issues, such as daycare access, and his commitment to a seamless transition for Governor-elect Mike Kehoe. The governor also weighs in on the ongoing dispute regarding the appointment of St. Louis County's prosecuting attorney and shares his insights on the progress and continued challenges in the St. Louis region.

That was the week that was... In the main event, the Prosecuting Attorney loses to the convicted criminal. On the national undercard: Republicans are winning on points, with the possibility of a full takeover in Washington depending on a dozen or so congressional races. Closer to home: Michigan provides a mixed message: Trump carries the state by 80,000 vote Elissa Slotkin shows how to buck the headwinds and moves to the U.S. Senate Democrats hold one hotly contested U.S. House seat but lose another The narrowly divided state House goes from a 2-vote Democratic majority to a 6-vote GOP advantage Democrats add to their majority on the state Supreme Court Back in 1992 James Carville famously preached during the Clinton campaign “It's the economy, stupid”. The nation had experienced high inflation during the George H.W. Bush administration, and Carville's mantra proved the winning strategy for Bill Clinton. Flash forward 32 years, another bout of inflation thanks to the Covid pandemic … and again, the voters punish the ruling party. It is part of the story of the Trump victory, but more complex than that. Mark and Jeff offer their thoughts on the election that turned the political world upside down. This last week brings to mind a couple of TV shows: the mid-1960s political satire program “That Was the Week That Was”, and more recent “House of Cards.” The latter starred a criminal President who even murders his political and media opposition. Reality has now exceeded fantasy. Next up in the bizarre world of Trump-era politics: the President-elect could be sentenced to prison for his 34 felony convictions in New York. Meanwhile, we stand by the name of this podcast: A Republic, If You Can Keep It. These days Franklin's warning is a one-weel-at-a-time proposition. We will continue in our mission to rightsize Michigan and national politics over the coming months. Ben would have it no other way. Chris Britt - Creators =========================== This episode is sponsored in part by EPIC ▪ MRA, a full service survey research firm with expertise in • Public Opinion Surveys • Market Research Studies • Live Telephone Surveys • On-Line and Automated Surveys • Focus Group Research • Bond Proposals - Millage Campaigns • Political Campaigns & Consulting • Ballot Proposals - Issue Advocacy Research • Community - Media Relations • Issue - Image Management • Database Development & List Management

Listen every weekday for a local newscast featuring town, county, state and regional headlines. It's the daily dose of news you need on Wyoming, Idaho and the Mountain West — all in four minutes or less. 

Will Jones, the Prosecuting Attorney for the 6th Judicial District, has had a busy first year in office. He took over from Larry Jegley, who retired after over 30 years in the role. Jones has been working to address the backlog of cases caused by the COVID-19 pandemic, as well as the high number of homicides in the area.To address these challenges, Jones has emphasized the importance of working closely with law enforcement agencies, particularly the Little Rock Police Department (LRPD). Both Jones and LRPD Police Chief Heath Helton have held their respective positions for one year, and they have been collaborating to change the trajectory of crime in the area. Jones believes that by strengthening the partnership between his office and the LRPD, they can more effectively investigate and prosecute homicide cases, ultimately leading to a better quality of life for Little Rock residents.

A 62-year-old West Virginia man, Carl Cox, was found guilty of two counts of first-degree murder for the killings of his daughter, Rhonda Cox, 38, and son-in-law Jimmy Neal, 34. The tragic incident occurred in January 2022 at the family's residence. During the trial held in Fayette County, West Virginia, Prosecuting Attorney Anthony Ciliberti painted a grim picture of the events leading to the double homicide. Cox was accused of engaging in an illegal sexual relationship with his daughter when she was a minor, which continued into adulthood—an act condemned by West Virginia law.  Ciliberti further argued that Neal, Rhonda's husband, had discovered this illicit relationship and urged his wife to report it to the authorities. The prosecution's case was bolstered by witness testimonies and surveillance footage obtained from Cox's home. Witnesses attested to the ongoing incestuous relationship between Cox and his daughter, while footage purportedly showed Cox carrying the murder weapon—a detail starkly contrasting Cox's own claims during the trial. According to a statement released by the Prosecuting Attorney for Fayette County, West Virginia, law enforcement responded to reports of gunfire at Carl Cox's residence. Upon arrival, Cox informed the police that he had heard a gunshot coming from his daughter's bedroom. Rushing in, he purportedly heard his daughter cry out, alleging that her husband had shot her. The statement further details Cox's account, asserting that he claimed to have encountered Jimmy Neal still holding the firearm and firing recklessly within the room. Cox asserted that he intervened, wrestling the weapon from Neal's grasp before using it to fatally shoot him. However, subsequent investigations, including scrutiny of surveillance footage and purported conversations relayed by Cox to fellow inmates, painted a conflicting narrative. Prosecutors revealed that the inquiry indicated both victims were discovered in bed, with gunshot wounds indicating they were likely shot where they lay. Rhonda sustained a fatal shot to the chest, while Jimmy endured multiple wounds to the neck, chest, and hand. Additionally, investigators found two bullet holes in the mattress near Neal's body, hinting that he may have been shot while lying down, contradicting Cox's account of a struggle. Surveillance footage purportedly captured Cox walking towards the bedroom with the murder weapon visibly holstered at his side, contradicting his assertion during the trial that he had left the firearm elsewhere. Cox purportedly claimed that Neal might have discovered the gun in the bathroom, a claim refuted by the evidence presented. Contrary to Cox's defense, the investigation revealed that both victims were found shot in their bed, with no signs of a struggle. Prosecutors argued that the killings were executed in cold blood, with Cox as the perpetrator. Despite the guilty verdict, jurors recommended mercy during Cox's sentencing, granting him the possibility of parole after serving either 15 or 30 years, depending on the sentence imposed by the court. However, Cox's reaction to the sentencing was anything but remorseful. In a shocking turn of events, he unleashed a tirade of threats against Prosecutor Anthony Ciliberti and Fayette County Sheriff Mike Fridley, blaming them for his predicament. “He had a boisterous outburst laden with expletives, cussing at the judge, cussing at me, we're all out to get him (Cox said) and that's been part of his defense and that Fayette County is out to get him,” Ciliberti said following Monday's sentencing. Cox has shown no remorse, Ciliberti said. “None whatsoever. He threatened to kill me during the sentencing hearing if he ever got out,” Cliberti said. “Apparently it's my fault that he is where he is.” Ciliberti said the murders were senseless. “There was no reason for these two individuals to be killed, none whatsoever,” he said. “Mr. Cox knows for sure why this happened but regardless the killings were not justified and I don't believe the evidence showed that they were.” Fayette County Circuit Judge Paul Blake sentenced Cox to consecutive life terms, with the earliest chance for parole at the age of 92. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

A 62-year-old West Virginia man, Carl Cox, was found guilty of two counts of first-degree murder for the killings of his daughter, Rhonda Cox, 38, and son-in-law Jimmy Neal, 34. The tragic incident occurred in January 2022 at the family's residence. During the trial held in Fayette County, West Virginia, Prosecuting Attorney Anthony Ciliberti painted a grim picture of the events leading to the double homicide. Cox was accused of engaging in an illegal sexual relationship with his daughter when she was a minor, which continued into adulthood—an act condemned by West Virginia law.  Ciliberti further argued that Neal, Rhonda's husband, had discovered this illicit relationship and urged his wife to report it to the authorities. The prosecution's case was bolstered by witness testimonies and surveillance footage obtained from Cox's home. Witnesses attested to the ongoing incestuous relationship between Cox and his daughter, while footage purportedly showed Cox carrying the murder weapon—a detail starkly contrasting Cox's own claims during the trial. According to a statement released by the Prosecuting Attorney for Fayette County, West Virginia, law enforcement responded to reports of gunfire at Carl Cox's residence. Upon arrival, Cox informed the police that he had heard a gunshot coming from his daughter's bedroom. Rushing in, he purportedly heard his daughter cry out, alleging that her husband had shot her. The statement further details Cox's account, asserting that he claimed to have encountered Jimmy Neal still holding the firearm and firing recklessly within the room. Cox asserted that he intervened, wrestling the weapon from Neal's grasp before using it to fatally shoot him. However, subsequent investigations, including scrutiny of surveillance footage and purported conversations relayed by Cox to fellow inmates, painted a conflicting narrative. Prosecutors revealed that the inquiry indicated both victims were discovered in bed, with gunshot wounds indicating they were likely shot where they lay. Rhonda sustained a fatal shot to the chest, while Jimmy endured multiple wounds to the neck, chest, and hand. Additionally, investigators found two bullet holes in the mattress near Neal's body, hinting that he may have been shot while lying down, contradicting Cox's account of a struggle. Surveillance footage purportedly captured Cox walking towards the bedroom with the murder weapon visibly holstered at his side, contradicting his assertion during the trial that he had left the firearm elsewhere. Cox purportedly claimed that Neal might have discovered the gun in the bathroom, a claim refuted by the evidence presented. Contrary to Cox's defense, the investigation revealed that both victims were found shot in their bed, with no signs of a struggle. Prosecutors argued that the killings were executed in cold blood, with Cox as the perpetrator. Despite the guilty verdict, jurors recommended mercy during Cox's sentencing, granting him the possibility of parole after serving either 15 or 30 years, depending on the sentence imposed by the court. However, Cox's reaction to the sentencing was anything but remorseful. In a shocking turn of events, he unleashed a tirade of threats against Prosecutor Anthony Ciliberti and Fayette County Sheriff Mike Fridley, blaming them for his predicament. “He had a boisterous outburst laden with expletives, cussing at the judge, cussing at me, we're all out to get him (Cox said) and that's been part of his defense and that Fayette County is out to get him,” Ciliberti said following Monday's sentencing. Cox has shown no remorse, Ciliberti said. “None whatsoever. He threatened to kill me during the sentencing hearing if he ever got out,” Cliberti said. “Apparently it's my fault that he is where he is.” Ciliberti said the murders were senseless. “There was no reason for these two individuals to be killed, none whatsoever,” he said. “Mr. Cox knows for sure why this happened but regardless the killings were not justified and I don't believe the evidence showed that they were.” Fayette County Circuit Judge Paul Blake sentenced Cox to consecutive life terms, with the earliest chance for parole at the age of 92. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on The Downfall of Diddy, The Trial of Karen Read, The Murder Of Maddie Soto, Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

In a harrowing case that has gripped the nation, Kristel Candelario, 32, of Ohio, has been sentenced to life in prison without parole for the tragic death of her toddler. The sentencing, handed down by Judge Brendan Sheehan, marks the culmination of a disturbing saga that unfolded in June 2023. Candelario's descent into infamy began when she abandoned her daughter for a staggering ten days while indulging in vacationing escapades across Michigan and Puerto Rico. The child's fate was sealed when authorities discovered her lifeless body in a Pack-N-Play, marred by extreme dehydration and surrounded by filth, a grim testament to the depth of neglect endured. Facing charges of aggravated murder and endangering children, Candelario pleaded guilty, accepting accountability for her heinous actions. However, her attempts to mitigate culpability were met with skepticism by prosecutors, who challenged claims of diminished capacity with compelling evidence. Prosecutors presented a damning narrative, punctuated by images of Candelario frolicking on beaches and exuding joy in Puerto Rico, seemingly oblivious to the grave consequences of her actions. Anna Faraglia, the Prosecuting Attorney, underscored the calculated nature of Candelario's deeds, citing incriminating phone calls wherein she nonchalantly discussed plans for life beyond bars and downplayed the severity of her daughter's demise. The gravity of the case weighed heavily on all involved, with lead detective Sgt. Teresa Gomez described it as the most "horrific" of her career. Details of the child's suffering left an indelible mark on those tasked with unraveling the tragedy, etching traumatic memories that lingered long after the investigation concluded. In a courtroom fraught with emotion, Judge Sheehan delivered a scathing rebuke, denouncing Candelario's betrayal of maternal duty in the strongest terms. He lamented the heinous act of abandonment, emphasizing the sacred bond between mother and child, irreparably severed by Candelario's callous indifference to her daughter's welfare. "The bond between a mother and child is one of the purest and most sacred bonds between human beings," remarked Judge Sheehan. "Yet, in a shocking betrayal of fundamental trust, you committed the ultimate act of betrayal." As Candelario begins her life sentence behind bars, the community grapples with the sobering reality of maternal neglect and the enduring legacy of a life cut short by unfathomable neglect. In the pursuit of justice, amidst the echoes of a child's cries and the solemnity of a courtroom, one truth remains unassailable: the innocence lost can never be restored, but justice must be served. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com 

In a harrowing case that has gripped the nation, Kristel Candelario, 32, of Ohio, has been sentenced to life in prison without parole for the tragic death of her toddler. The sentencing, handed down by Judge Brendan Sheehan, marks the culmination of a disturbing saga that unfolded in June 2023. Candelario's descent into infamy began when she abandoned her daughter for a staggering ten days while indulging in vacationing escapades across Michigan and Puerto Rico. The child's fate was sealed when authorities discovered her lifeless body in a Pack-N-Play, marred by extreme dehydration and surrounded by filth, a grim testament to the depth of neglect endured. Facing charges of aggravated murder and endangering children, Candelario pleaded guilty, accepting accountability for her heinous actions. However, her attempts to mitigate culpability were met with skepticism by prosecutors, who challenged claims of diminished capacity with compelling evidence. Prosecutors presented a damning narrative, punctuated by images of Candelario frolicking on beaches and exuding joy in Puerto Rico, seemingly oblivious to the grave consequences of her actions. Anna Faraglia, the Prosecuting Attorney, underscored the calculated nature of Candelario's deeds, citing incriminating phone calls wherein she nonchalantly discussed plans for life beyond bars and downplayed the severity of her daughter's demise. The gravity of the case weighed heavily on all involved, with lead detective Sgt. Teresa Gomez described it as the most "horrific" of her career. Details of the child's suffering left an indelible mark on those tasked with unraveling the tragedy, etching traumatic memories that lingered long after the investigation concluded. In a courtroom fraught with emotion, Judge Sheehan delivered a scathing rebuke, denouncing Candelario's betrayal of maternal duty in the strongest terms. He lamented the heinous act of abandonment, emphasizing the sacred bond between mother and child, irreparably severed by Candelario's callous indifference to her daughter's welfare. "The bond between a mother and child is one of the purest and most sacred bonds between human beings," remarked Judge Sheehan. "Yet, in a shocking betrayal of fundamental trust, you committed the ultimate act of betrayal." As Candelario begins her life sentence behind bars, the community grapples with the sobering reality of maternal neglect and the enduring legacy of a life cut short by unfathomable neglect. In the pursuit of justice, amidst the echoes of a child's cries and the solemnity of a courtroom, one truth remains unassailable: the innocence lost can never be restored, but justice must be served. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

In a harrowing case that has gripped the nation, Kristel Candelario, 32, of Ohio, has been sentenced to life in prison without parole for the tragic death of her toddler. The sentencing, handed down by Judge Brendan Sheehan, marks the culmination of a disturbing saga that unfolded in June 2023. Candelario's descent into infamy began when she abandoned her daughter for a staggering ten days while indulging in vacationing escapades across Michigan and Puerto Rico. The child's fate was sealed when authorities discovered her lifeless body in a Pack-N-Play, marred by extreme dehydration and surrounded by filth, a grim testament to the depth of neglect endured. Facing charges of aggravated murder and endangering children, Candelario pleaded guilty, accepting accountability for her heinous actions. However, her attempts to mitigate culpability were met with skepticism by prosecutors, who challenged claims of diminished capacity with compelling evidence. Prosecutors presented a damning narrative, punctuated by images of Candelario frolicking on beaches and exuding joy in Puerto Rico, seemingly oblivious to the grave consequences of her actions. Anna Faraglia, the Prosecuting Attorney, underscored the calculated nature of Candelario's deeds, citing incriminating phone calls wherein she nonchalantly discussed plans for life beyond bars and downplayed the severity of her daughter's demise. The gravity of the case weighed heavily on all involved, with lead detective Sgt. Teresa Gomez described it as the most "horrific" of her career. Details of the child's suffering left an indelible mark on those tasked with unraveling the tragedy, etching traumatic memories that lingered long after the investigation concluded. In a courtroom fraught with emotion, Judge Sheehan delivered a scathing rebuke, denouncing Candelario's betrayal of maternal duty in the strongest terms. He lamented the heinous act of abandonment, emphasizing the sacred bond between mother and child, irreparably severed by Candelario's callous indifference to her daughter's welfare. "The bond between a mother and child is one of the purest and most sacred bonds between human beings," remarked Judge Sheehan. "Yet, in a shocking betrayal of fundamental trust, you committed the ultimate act of betrayal." As Candelario begins her life sentence behind bars, the community grapples with the sobering reality of maternal neglect and the enduring legacy of a life cut short by unfathomable neglect. In the pursuit of justice, amidst the echoes of a child's cries and the solemnity of a courtroom, one truth remains unassailable: the innocence lost can never be restored, but justice must be served. Want to listen to ALL of our podcasts AD-FREE? Subscribe through APPLE PODCASTS, and try it for three days free: https://tinyurl.com/ycw626tj Follow Our Other Cases: https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com The latest on Catching the Long Island Serial Killer, Awaiting Admission: BTK's Unconfessed Crimes, Delphi Murders: Inside the Crime, Chad & Lori Daybell, The Murder of Ana Walshe, Alex Murdaugh, Bryan Kohberger, Lucy Letby, Kouri Richins, Malevolent Mormon Mommys, Justice for Harmony Montgomery, The Murder of Stephen Smith, The Murder of Madeline Kingsbury, and much more! Listen at https://www.truecrimetodaypod.com

Jason, a long time resident of Berkeley County, looks to serve the citizens as Prosecuting Attorney. https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100094779073618   Podcast Sponsored by Brackens Painting Since opening our doors for business back in 2011, Brackens Painting LLC has been associated with a high level of quality and professionalism throughout Northern Virginia and the Eastern panhandle of West Virginia. Classically trained by 4 generations of painters, Brackens Painting can still call on many years of experience.  We want to be the first company you think of when you need painting done. www.brackenspainting.com   Business Coaching with Limitless Potential From strategic planning and market research to scaling and exit strategy, We've got you covered. https://crystelclearbusiness.com/

  Kara Petro loves the courtroom. The Honorable Kara Ann Petro is a local girl who wants to be District Judge for Garland County. After life in a private law practice, then as prosecuting attorney and now appointed as a Circuit Court judge Kara aspires to serve as a District Judge because she's dedicated to community service. These elections are non-partisan. Early voting begins February 20th. The election is scheduled for March 5, 2024. NOTE: HSV Inside Out was not compensated for Judge Petro's appearance. As a community minded podcast we share her story so citizens can make their own determination about whom to support. Thanks to our exclusive media partner, KVRE • Join Our Free Email Newsletter • Subscribe To The Podcast Anyway You Want • Subscribe To Our YouTube Channel (click that bell icon, too) • Join Our Facebook Group • Tell Your Friends About Our Show • Support Our Sponsors (click on the images below to visit their websites) __________________________________________

MDJ Script/ Top Stories for Jan 26th            Publish Date:  Jan 25th    Commercial: From the Drake Realty Studio, Welcome to the Marietta Daily Journal Podcast.    Today is Friday, February 9th, and Happy 81st Birthday to singer Carole King. ***02.09.24 – BIRTHDAY – CAROLE KING*** I'm Dan Radcliffe and here are the stories Cobb is talking about, presented by Credit Union of Georgia. Teen Driver Faces Charges in Fatal Accident Involving Pope High Student Local Marietta Resident Miraculously Survives Headshot During Motel 6 Robbery Attempt Pebblebrook High School Teens Arrested for Possession of Firearms on Campus   All of this and more is coming up on the Marietta Daily Journal Podcast, and if you are looking for community news, we encourage you to listen and subscribe!    BREAK: CU OF GA   STORY 1: 18-Year-Old Driver Charged in Crash That Killed Pope High Student An 18-year-old driver, Oliver Luis Roman, from Powder Springs, was arrested following a fatal car crash on Jan. 9 in Woodstock. The crash resulted in the deaths of two teens, Gabriel Escandon, 17, and Esteban Cortez-Rendon, 18. The Cherokee Sheriff's Office reported that the Mazda 6, carrying five occupants, left the roadway and hit a tree. Roman and two other teens were injured. Speed was identified as a contributing factor. Roman, a student at Hillgrove High School, faces charges including vehicular homicide, serious injury by vehicle, reckless driving, and license violation. He is currently in custody without bond at the Cherokee County jail. STORY 2: Marietta Man Survives Gunshot to Head in Attempted Robbery at Motel 6 A Marietta man, Garrett Osteen, was shot in the head during an attempted robbery while dropping off a friend at a Motel 6 on Delk Road on Jan. 14. Five armed individuals, linked to a recent carjacking at Kennesaw State University, demanded money from Osteen and his friend Willie Ruffin. Osteen attempted to drive away but was fired upon, sustaining a head injury. Remarkably, Osteen recovered quickly and provided witness testimony the following day. Four suspects are in custody, with one juvenile outstanding. The arrests, involving multiple law enforcement agencies, are part of a larger crackdown on a series of carjackings and robberies. Collaboration between agencies and advanced technology have facilitated swift communication and coordination in combating crime. STORY 3: Teens Charged With Bringing Guns to Pebblebrook High School Two Mableton teenagers, Malik Ta'Veon Watkins, 18, and Heaven Marrow, 17, were arrested for bringing handguns, one of which was stolen, to Pebblebrook High School on Jan. 31. Watkins allegedly concealed a loaded Glock 44 handgun in Marrow's backpack to evade detection by staff. Both face charges including felony carrying weapons within a school safety zone and felony theft by receiving firearm. Marrow was arrested on-site by Cobb Schools Police, while Watkins was apprehended by Cobb County Police later. The school district emphasized adherence to policy and law, highlighting investments in safety measures like Cobb Shield, comprising trained police officers and crisis response systems to protect students and staff.   We have opportunities for sponsors to get great engagement on these shows. Call 770.799.6810 for more info.    Break:  GCPS LIVE READ ***GCPS READ*** Hey, Cobb County! Don't forget to add the GCPS Teacher Job Fair to your schedule for tomorrow! Join us on February 10th at 8am at the Gas South Convention Center. This is a golden opportunity to be a part of Gwinnett County Public Schools - Georgia's largest school district and a top employer recognized by Forbes. Whether you're kick-starting your career or seeking a change, your passion for education could find its perfect home with us. Say 'yes' to GCPS, where passion meets opportunity! STORY 4: Attorneys Accuse DA of Improper Handling of Police Shooting Case Attorneys representing the family of Devonte Brown, shot and killed by a Cobb police officer in 2021, allege that the Cobb District Attorney's office failed to present a complete case to the grand jury, which could have indicted the officer, Ian McConnell. Brown was killed after a car chase where he drove recklessly in a stolen vehicle. The DA's office disputes the claims, stating that investigations must be completed before presenting to the grand jury. Body camera footage showed McConnell firing 12 shots as Brown reversed his vehicle into police cars. Despite the grand jury's decision not to charge McConnell, attorneys argue for a special prosecutor and a fair presentation of evidence. The appointment of a special prosecutor would typically be overseen by the Prosecuting Attorney's Council of the state. STORY 5: School Safety Meeting Scheduled in Wake of McEachern High Shooting Cobb school board member Leroy Tre' Hutchins has organized a school safety town hall in response to the recent shooting at McEachern High School. Scheduled for Thursday night, the event aims to provide a platform for the community to express concerns and generate actionable solutions for Superintendent Chris Ragsdale and the school board. Notable attendees include Cobb County Commissioner Monique Sheffield and state Rep. David Wilkerson. Hutchins hopes to address ongoing school safety efforts, particularly regarding the recent incidents involving firearms on campus. The town hall, open to all Cobb County residents, will be held at the Vaughn Cultural Arts Center from 6:30 to 8:30 p.m. We'll be back in a moment.   Break: DRAKE STORY 6: 'A Bridge Builder': David Hankerson Remembered Cobb County Manager Jackie McMorris honored David Hankerson, the late county manager, at his funeral, recalling him as a respected figure known affectionately as "Mr. H." Hankerson, who passed away on Jan. 25 at 77, was remembered as a pioneering African American leader and the longest-serving county manager in Georgia history. Notable attendees included county officials and community leaders, all paying tribute to Hankerson's impactful legacy. Speakers highlighted Hankerson's leadership, compassion, and commitment to bridging divides within Cobb County. Family members shared personal anecdotes, describing Hankerson as a "savior in a suit" and a resilient figure who tackled challenges with unwavering strength. The funeral service, held at Turner Chapel AME Church, included military honors for Hankerson, a veteran of the U.S. Army. STORY 7: Boggs: Georgia court system still suffering staff shortages Georgia Chief Justice Michael Boggs addressed the decline in backlogs of court cases following the pandemic but highlighted ongoing shortages of prosecutors, public defenders, and other court staff. He noted that federal funding from the American Rescue Plan Act has helped alleviate some staffing issues and upgrade technology in judicial circuits. However, Boggs emphasized the need for legislative support, including passing House Bill 947 to reform judge payment systems and proposed legislation to keep judges' personal information confidential due to increasing threats. Additionally, he mentioned revisions allowing spouses of active-duty service members to obtain provisional law licenses, aimed at increasing legal availability in rural areas. Break: INGLES 5  Signoff-   Thanks again for hanging out with us on today's Marietta Daily Journal podcast. If you enjoy these shows, we encourage you to check out our other offerings, like the Cherokee Tribune Ledger Podcast, the Gwinnett Daily Post, the Community Podcast for Rockdale Newton and Morgan Counties, or the Paulding County News Podcast. Read more about all our stories and get other great content at MDJonline.com.     Did you know over 50% of Americans listen to podcasts weekly? Giving you important news about our community and telling great stories are what we do. Make sure you join us for our next episode and be sure to share this podcast on social media with your friends and family. Add us to your Alexa Flash Briefing or your Google Home Briefing and be sure to like, follow, and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.   Produced by the BG Podcast Network   Show Sponsors: ingles-markets.com cuofga.org drakerealty.com gcpsk12.org/jobs   #NewsPodcast #CurrentEvents #TopHeadlines #BreakingNews #PodcastDiscussion #PodcastNews #InDepthAnalysis #NewsAnalysis #PodcastTrending #WorldNews #LocalNews #GlobalNews #PodcastInsights #NewsBrief #PodcastUpdate #NewsRoundup #WeeklyNews #DailyNews #PodcastInterviews #HotTopics #PodcastOpinions #InvestigativeJournalism #BehindTheHeadlines #PodcastMedia #NewsStories #PodcastReports #JournalismMatters #PodcastPerspectives #NewsCommentary #PodcastListeners #NewsPodcastCommunity #NewsSource #PodcastCuration #WorldAffairs #PodcastUpdates #AudioNews #PodcastJournalism #EmergingStories #NewsFlash #PodcastConversations See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

On Tuesday, Rob Anderson, the sponsor of the ‘Restore Election Confidence' initiative, filed a formal ethics complaint with the Clark County Ethics Commission against Prosecuting Attorney Tony Golik and Senior Deputy Prosecuting Attorney Amanda Migchelbrink. http://tinyurl.com/4fr7xyh4 #RobAnderson #RestoreElectionConfidenceInitiative #FormalEthicsComplaint #ClarkCountyEthicsCommission #ProsecutingAttorneyTonyGolik #SeniorDeputyProsecutingAttorneyAmandaMigchelbrink #VancouverWa #ClarkCountyWa #ClarkCountyNews #ClarkCountyToday

  CCW Safe CEO and Co-Founder Mike Darter interviews Attorney Jennifer Chance who is the CCW Safe Assistant General Counsel. Jennifer is a former Prosecuting Attorney for Oklahoma County (Oklahoma City) and was Chief Counsel for Oklahoma Governor Mary Fallin.

On this segment of Copper Country Today, host Todd Van Dyke welcomes new Houghton County Prosecuting Attorney Dan Helmer for a discussion about the challenges his office faces. Copper Country Today airs throughout Michigan's Keweenaw Peninsula Sunday mornings at 7:00 on WOLV 97.7 FM, 8:00 on WCCY 99.3 FM and 1400 AM, and 9:00 on WHKB 102.3 FM. The program is sponsored by the Copper Shores Community Health Foundation.

Today marked a crucial step in the pursuit of justice as a Writ of Mandamus was filed against Clark County Prosecuting Attorney Tony Golik in the Superior Court of the State of Washington, Skamania County. http://tinyurl.com/y9dpwvzp #RobAnderson #ReformClarkCounty #WritOfMandamus #ClarkCountyProsecutingAttorney #TonyGolik #SuperiorCourtofWashington #SkamaniaCounty #HomeRuleCharter #RestoreElectionConfidence #VancouverWa #ClarkCountyWa #ClarkCountyNews #ClarkCountyToday

For adults, it could mean revenge porn or sextortion. For minors, it can mean very adult trouble.On January 4, 2024, Calhoun County (Michigan) Prosecuting Attorney David Gilbert issued an alert to all residents warning about the potential pitfalls of a very modern practice: Sexting.The message is especially aimed at parents and students, given the law's very serious interpretation of Child Sexually Abusive Material.While some may look at the practice of sexting among minors (sharing and receiving of sexually explicit messages and nude or partially nude images via computer or cell phone) as just kids being kids, Gilbert points out the law sees it much more seriously. "Even if pictures are sent voluntarily, if someone shares that image, it can be socially, emotionally and academically devastating," Gilbert said."With children the problem is not just immaturity and the likelihood of using poor judgement; sexually explicit photographs of minors, whether voluntary or not, are considered child sexually abusive material [CSAM]," he added.That means possession of this material can be construed as a felony. If convicted, a person could be looking at a 20-year felony requiring sex offender registration. Click the links below for more information including information on common tactics used to lure minors into sharing such material, as well as tips for parents and students who might become targets.If you have questions or concerns, contact your local police agency or the Calhoun County Prosecutor's Office. ResourcesResource page with more info for parents and studentsFull press release from the Calhoun County Office of the Prosecuting Attorney

Have you ever had an unsettling feeling about someone? Did it make you anxious? Dr. Wendy Patrick, a career Prosecuting Attorney with degrees in Psychology, Divinity, and a Doctorate in Theology, shares why you get those feelings. Author and media commentator, her most recent book, Why Bad Looks Good, reveals some of the insight and wisdom that has made her a valued source for outlets such as Fox News, Fox Business, CNN, and Inside Edition. She credits the Bible for her wisdom, and strips away common excuses, providing tools for separating what we want or hope to see, from what is truly being demonstrated. She shares tools for listening to the Holy Spirit's promptings and exchanging fear for freedom. Gain skills and become empowered as Dr. Patrick offers a mini-Master Class on understanding people, behavior, and truth. For Show Notes & Episode Details: https://theinfluencerspodcast.org Get more inspirational content all week… FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/theinfluencerspodcastofficial INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/theinfluencerspodcastofficial/ TWITTER: https://twitter.com/hearinfluencers YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/@TheInfluencersPodcast Learn more about Wendy Patrick and get a copy of her book Why Bad Looks Good at https://www.wendypatrickphd.com

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Michael Kelley joins John Hancock in discussing the bid for Senator from St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney and wheather or not he will win against incumbent John Hawley.

Mike Elam is At Your Service! In the first hour of tonight's show, Mike is joined by: -Joe McCullough, Prosecuting Attorney in St. Charles County -Ed Akers of Local 636 who discusses 636 Day in St. Charles -Casey Van Allen, Owner of KRMS Radio and TV in Osage Beach and former KMOX Production Director, who shares all the great things to do at the Lake of the Ozarks

Prosecutor Melissa Powers has been knocking down walls her whole career. As the first female Prosecuting Attorney in the history of Hamilton County, Ohio (Cincinnati), she holds the highest law enforcement position in the city. But that's just the start. From getting a confession from a serial killer, to taking the stand to break a 17 year-old cold case, to fighting for veterans and juveniles, Prosecutor Powers has truly given her life to serving the public. She's an inspiring woman of high ideals and accessible wisdom who will push your life forward. 

GUEST OVERVIEW: Dr Dan McMillan is a History Professor, Prosecuting Attorney and Author of 'How could this Happen : Explaining the Holocaust'.

With a new official role and new official last name, Sonia F. Hagood joined the show to tell us what life is like as our district attorney. She discusses the issues we face in the legal system and shares stories about her experience of working as defense and prosecuting attorney on murder trials. 

#STSNation,Welcome to Surviving The Survivor the podcast that brings you the best guests in true crime. Week 3 of the Lori Vallow Daybell began a day late after a death in the family of one of the prosecutors. The trial of the so-called “Doomsday Mom” is the wildly twisted story of a seemingly loving mother, a self-proclaimed devout member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints who clearly veered way off course …. And became involved in the deaths of as many as five people, including her own children. #BestGuests Anne Bremmer is a trial attorney, and one of the nation's most recognized legal analysts. In her 35 years of practice, she has been lead counsel for many highly-publicized court cases. She was a Prosecuting Attorney for the Criminal Division of the King County Prosecutor's Office in Seattle from 1983 to 1988. She is a regular contributing legal analyst on TV and cable, including FOX, CNN, MSNBC and HLN.Dr. Laura McNeal is currently a Professor of Law where she teaches Civil Procedure, Education Law, Urban Revitalization and the Law, and Employment Discrimination. Her scholarly interests examine issues of access and equity in employment and education law, with a particular emphasis on issues of access and equity for individuals from traditionally marginalized populations. Professor McNeal has contributed to the national debate on law, education policy, and race relations through op-eds and radio and television news features for the Dr. Phil Show, CNN, MSNBC, CBS, NBC, and various other national media outlets. Joshua Ritter was named the 2015 Outstanding Prosecutor of the Year by the Association of Deputy District Attorneys. Upon joining his current personal injury firm El Dabe Ritter Trial Lawyers, Joshua has continued to devote his talents to the tenacious and zealous defense of his clients. Joshua also hosts the podcast True Crime Daily: The Sidebar, which takes listeners behind-the-scenes of the country's most high-profile and notorious legal cases.#LoriVallowDaybell #LoriVallow #DoomsdayMom #DoomsdayMother #Boise #TJ #Tylee #TrueCrime #TrueCrimeCommunity #LoriVallowTrial #LoriVallowDaybellTrialFor Ad-Free & BTS Content ...Support the show ❤️https://www.patreon.com/survivingthesurvivor

Hamilton County Prosecuting Attorney Melissa Powers joins the That's So Cincinnati podcast with City Hall reporter Sherry Coolidge and Executive Editor Beryl Love. Produced by Senior Photographer Kareem Elgazzar.

On this Hacks & Wonks week-in-review, political consultant and host Crystal Fincher is joined by Associate Editor of The Stranger and noted poet, Rich Smith! They look at tragic traffic deaths in Seattle, track leg updates on free school meals and minimum wage for incarcerated workers, discuss the Washington Supreme Court's hearing on our capital gains tax, outline County Prosecutor Leesa Manion's changes to the office, update us on Seattle's social housing initiative, and react to candidates running for Seattle City Council.  Crystal and Rich start the show by covering this week's tragic traffic deaths, including the death of 23-year old grad student Jaahnavi Kandula, who was hit by a police vehicle. The number of these incidents is a horrific reminder that these fatalities aren't due to random chance, but are the result of numerous policy priorities and choices by elected officials and institutions.  Turning to the state legislature, our hosts give overviews on a bill to give free lunches to all public school students in Washington state and a bill that would provide minimum wage to incarcerated individuals for their labor. In state Supreme Court news, this week the court heard arguments for the suit over our state's capital gains tax that the legislature passed last year. We'll be keeping an eye out to see when we finally get a decision on this case.  King County's new Prosecuting Attorney, Leesa Manion, outlined her new approach to the office, including the creation of a gun violence prevention unit and a division focused on prosecuting gender-based violence. Rich also updates Crystal on the Stranger's Election Control Board's endorsement of Seattle's social housing initiative I-135, which will be on the ballot for the upcoming February 14th election. Finally, we end the show catching up on the newly announced candidates for this year's Seattle City Council elections, and ask why some candidates are announcing their campaigns without a clear vision of why they want the seat.  As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Find the host, Crystal Fincher on Twitter at @finchfrii and find today's co-host Rich Smith at @richsssmith.   Resources “Evaluating the Role of Incarceration in Public Safety with Criminologist Damon Petrich” - Hacks & Wonks    “Casual Friday with Crystal Fincher & Besa Gordon” by Patricia Murphy & Brandi Fullwood from KUOW    “Officer Responding to Overdose Call Killed Woman In Marked Intersection Where City Canceled Safety Project” by Erica C. Barnett from Publicola    “Three pedestrians taken to hospital after collision in South Seattle” by Amanda Zhou from The Seattle Times    Follow Ryan Packer twitter: @typewriteralley   “Prevent traffic deaths with proven solutions for Seattle streets” by Gordon Padelford from The Seattle Times    “WA bill would make school meals free for all students” by Ruby de Luna from KUOW   “WA lawmakers consider minimum wage requirement for incarcerated workers” by Libby Denkman & Sarah Leibovitz from KUOW   “Supreme Court Ruling Could Allow Washington to Tax the Rich” by Will Casey from The Stranger   “Public safety is focus of new prosecutorial units” by Christine Clarridge from Axios    “Vote Yes on Initiative 135” from The Stranger    “Who's running for Seattle City Council in 2023“ by Melissa Santos from Axios   “Formerly Unhoused, Andrew Ashiofu Wants to Fight for Housing Progress on City Council” by Hannah Krieg from The Stranger   “Central District Resident Joy Hollingsworth Is Running for City Council” by Hannah Krieg from The Stranger   “Urbanist Alex Hudson Enters Council Race to Replace Sawant” by Hannah Krieg from The Stranger “Assistant Attorney General Sarah Reyneveld Is Running for King County Council” by Rich Smith from The Stranger   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher, and I am a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington state through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast to get the full versions of our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, the most helpful thing you can do is leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. Full transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. If you missed our Tuesday midweek show, we re-aired our conversation with criminologist Damon Petrich, who led the most comprehensive analysis of incarceration and crime data to-date, which found that incarceration doesn't reduce the likelihood of reoffending. Damon and I talk about how to design and evaluate programs that do work to deliver greater public safety for everyone. Also today, I appeared on KUOW's Casual Friday podcast - we'll put a link to that in the show notes and on the website. Today, we're continuing our Friday almost-live shows where we review the news of the week with a co-host. Welcome back to the program, friend of the show, today's co-host: Associate Editor of The Stranger and noted poet, Rich Smith. [00:01:30] Rich Smith: Thanks for having me again - so good to be back. [00:01:33] Crystal Fincher: Great to have you back. This is a week that was packed full of news. Starting off - some news that really sucked - really sad and tragic events happened this week when it came to pedestrians being hit by cars. One killed by an SPD officer driving a car on the way to a substance abuse call. And another - family, a parent and two kids, hit in a crosswalk. It has just been a horrible week. What happened and where do we stand on this? [00:02:15] Rich Smith: Yeah, it was on Monday - Fire was called to an OD [overdose] call, cops responded along with that. And a young woman, 23-year-old woman, named Jaahnavi was crossing the road - she's a grad student. And the cop hit her with her car. She died later of injuries later that evening. The cops slow rolled the information on this, at first saying that there had been a collision, putting the blame on the fire department. And then later on Tuesday, they finally confirmed that she died after being hit. And it's a tragedy, and it's one of those stories that show just how few choices we have - or how constrained our choices really are - by policy that we don't even see. We think we're out here making decisions - we think people are out here making decisions - but those decisions are circumscribed. And there are so many of those policies hidden in the background of this story. For instance, that intersection where she crossed was due for a while to get a revamp - a protected intersection - that would have prevented, or that may have prevented, this tragedy from occurring. We haven't seen the video - I don't know where she crossed in the crosswalk, I know she was in the crosswalk. But the design of this protected intersection may have prevented that from happening. The mayor took it out of his budget this year due to a giant $140 million hole that they had to work around and as a result of slowing real estate market, et cetera. The City Council didn't put that money back in and so - obviously, work wouldn't have started on that project before this incident happened - I don't want to get into butterfly effect stuff. But had we moved on that earlier, had we treated this Vision Zero - the city's plan to reduce all pedestrian deaths to zero - more seriously than we have been, if we'd been prioritizing that earlier, then tragedies like this could have been prevented. Also, there's the policy of having a police officer respond alongside a medic when they're doing an OD call. My understanding is that if the medic has to give the person who's suspected of having an OD Narcan, they want a cop there in case there's some kind of violent response to reversing the overdose with Narcan - and so they request this backup. The person who the medic checked on declined medical assistance at the time - it turns out it wasn't an emergency, but they were called. I'm not sure who called or why, but they were called because they thought someone was having an OD - and now it creates this emergency situation where if the cop threw on his lights, then they're racing to the scene. It's hard to really put the whole picture together because we haven't seen the video. We only know what the police are saying and what Fire is saying, but it does seem to be this confluence of questionable policy decisions that allowed for this tragedy to happen. [00:06:18] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, absolutely. And at least the information that we have now - as you said, the police have been slow to release information - but it appears that dispatch made the call to dispatch the police, that it wasn't actually requested by the fire department. But they were co-dispatched to the call along with Fire once they determined that was the case with the call, which is questionable - these are the things that we're talking about. So many times you talk about how all of these issues are related - how when we're talking about housing, we're talking about poverty. How we're talking about health, we're talking about equity - and so many of these failures came together. And just overall, even with the timing of this thing, this is a result of longstanding neglect. How long have we been talking about how unsafe this is? And this was just one pedestrian collision and injury this week. We also had a family mowed down in a crosswalk. [00:07:20] Rich Smith: Did you see that video? [00:07:21] Crystal Fincher: I unfortunately did see that video. We have to do better. I think a lot of people are wondering - we hear lip service being given to this year, after year, after year. Certainly there have been some electeds who have tried to propose money and others - Tammy Morales comes to mind - but overall between the council and the mayor, we have not gotten this to be a priority. And we have to do something different, we have to do something substantial. If we had the amount of poisoning deaths by some source that we do with pedestrian deaths and collisions, we would be doing something about it. If there were a Brown person walking around and beating up people to this magnitude, we would be doing something different. This is a crisis. And just because it's happening to people outside of cars doesn't mean that we just give thoughts and prayers and don't do anything. And it's feeling like the situation where we all know we need to do more to stop gun violence, yet so much action isn't taken. There's an excellent article that was written last year, I think, by Gordon Padelford at The Urbanist, which kind of goes through - Hey, this is what percentage of pedestrian deaths are caused by this type of issue, this is the recommendation or the ask to solve it - this is what can happen. There's short term stuff, there's long term stuff. I just hope to see some action here. And it appears that there are some things that don't require the building of new infrastructure, but some signal timings - we need to look at how we allow drivers to turn both right on red and left turns - and we can be doing those in a safer way. And just all of that. I hope we get real serious about this across the region real quick. We just talked last week about the alarming skyrocketing pedestrian deaths and injuries across South King County. And I follow Ryan Packer on Twitter and their Patreon, and they cover the majority of these pedestrian-involved collisions. And just watching the amount of those come down the timeline is sobering. [00:09:45] Rich Smith: That's another sort of system - just people being in their cars and having car brain and forgetting - the great lie of the car is that you're not a 2-ton steel cage traveling down the road at 70 mph or 40 mph that could just absolutely wreck the fragile human body. For some, the car - you don't feel like that when you're in the car and that - so we got to kill the car in our head. [00:10:16] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, and the mind frame that comes with it - I drive, I have a car. I drive a lot less than I used to, but still drive. And I've had feelings before - of that feeling of inconvenience and wanting to get somewhere as fast as possible, but I really do think it takes a reframing to be like - Okay, I am in a 2-ton vehicle that can instantly kill or maim someone. It's okay if it takes me literally two minutes longer to get somewhere. When we talk about traffic calming, when we talk about signal timing, or not taking a right on red - yeah, it may delay you for 30 seconds - for 30 seconds, right? It may delay you for two minutes. But if the trade off of two minutes - that we can plan around, we can manage - is people not getting gruesomely killed, that's a trade off we can make. And we need to have more conversations that you don't just have free rein and cars aren't this - the ultimate priority above and beyond anything else. We have to also address - everything is culture now, but car culture - and how we teach people to drive, how we talk about driving, how we design around that. Until we reframe that it's okay if cars stop every now and then or go slow every now and then, we're going to continue to see this kind of stuff. [00:11:42] Rich Smith: Absolutely. And when I drive, I feel myself like I just turn - I'm like, when I'm a pedestrian, I'm like, are you kidding me? It's the - the roads are ours, I'm fragile, I could be destroyed by your machines. Stop, slow down - in the crosswalk, you monsters. But then when I'm in a car, I'm like - all of these pedestrians don't care about their lives at all. They're walking into the middle of the road. They're dressed the exact same color of the night. They need to get out of my way - blah, blah, blah. So I have to consciously remind myself - I'm in a climate-controlled environment. I'm listening to the music that I want to listen to, or the radio that I want to listen to, or the podcast I want to listen to - like Hacks & Wonks. And if I need to pause - to pay more careful attention to my surroundings - then I'm the one who should because I'm the one who's basically a weapon right now. It just, yeah - and it's - you'll get there, it's not going to take - even if you're 30 seconds later, two minutes late, you'll get there. People will welcome you - so just chill out, cars. [00:12:52] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. This week - more action in our legislative session that we have this week - there were two bills in particular that caught my eye. One to make all school lunches in Washington free, which I think is an excellent idea. And another to require that incarcerated workers at least make minimum wage, because right now they don't and it's basically slavery. What's your take on these bills? [00:13:24] Rich Smith: Yeah, it's weird to make anybody - they're kind of related - but it's weird to make children go to a place for - whatever, 7-8 hours, and then make them buy their food there if they want to not operate at a caloric deficit. And poverty is high. Child poverty is shockingly high. And it just shouldn't be an expense. As somebody who went to school and - I could have made my lunch before I went, but I always just tried to bum money from other people so that I could have the pizza or whatever at school. So I don't know, it was always embarrassing to bring lunch. And so I just always wanted to have the school lunch. I remember being - as a kid, school lunch was somehow prestige - even though in popular culture, school lunch is stereotypically lunch lady giving you neon food or whatever. In any event, it's just - I really would have benefited from this bill. I wouldn't have had to convince so many of my fellow students to give me dimes and quarters so that I could get bad pizza or whatever. But yeah, philosophically, kids shouldn't have to pay for food. Poor families shouldn't have to be scrounging up a couple of bucks just so that they can eat. And similarly, if we are forcibly incarcerating people and they are working, they should make the minimum wage and not, as Representative Tarra Simmons - who brought this bill to the Legislature - testifies, 42 cents an hour because of how much the jail can just dock from your pay for medicine, for this, for that, for this financial obligation, for this financial obligation. Basically, you're paying to incarcerate yourself. You're paying the state to make you less free, to take away your freedom. And you are effectively a slave. It's unconscionable. [00:15:33] Crystal Fincher: It is unconscionable. And when this is an exception in the constitutional amendment banning slavery - means it's literally slavery. These people are working and doing the same kind of work that everyone else is. Just because they're incarcerated does not mean that their labor has no value. And there is such a problem with making elements of our criminal legal system profitable for people - we have seen how corrupting and how corrosive that is. We should not be incentivizing people to lock people up and keep them locked up. We just re-aired our midweek show about how problematic carceral solutions are, and it just makes no sense. And also we spend so much time and energy, so much administrative resources on managing who gets lunch, who doesn't get lunch - just tracking and doing the - tracking who does qualify for free lunch, and who doesn't, and who's behind, and how to collect it. That all takes money too. We're requiring them to be there, just as you said. And the consequences - say a family is having trouble affording food, so their kid needs to be shamed and humiliated and can't eat or get something - how does that make any kind of sense? And also, we just got so much data from the unfortunately brief free school lunches that we provided nationwide and what kind of an impact that had on child poverty, on child hunger - was absolutely a positive and way more transformative than most people even anticipated. Really, why are we not doing this? It seems cruel not to. So I'm very excited to see both of those making their way through the Legislature. Also big news this week - on the wealth tax issue - the Supreme Court heard the capital gains tax case. How is that playing out? Where do we stand with that? [00:17:45] Rich Smith: Well, we'll see. They just heard - that is, the Supreme Court just heard - oral arguments on the case yesterday. It's difficult, really, to follow the arguments because Justice Steven González is so fine that I have trouble paying attention to what the lawyers are arguing about, the difference between the excise tax and income tax, etc. I'm joking - he's a good-looking man, but he didn't actually talk that much during the oral arguments. But he did ask a kind of prescient question, or a useful question, that was interesting to me. This is all to say that - yeah, we'll see - they presented their arguments yesterday. Backing up a second, the State Legislature - after a decade of arm twisting and back bending and watering down bill after bill after bill - finally decided to pass a capital gains tax on the richest 8,000 Washingtonians. That is a 7% tax whenever you realize capital gains, which is a financial asset over - $250 million is the threshold of the tax. If you cash out stocks for more than $250 million, then you're going to get hit with a 7% tax. A bunch of conservatives sued and said this isn't a excise tax or a sales tax - a transactional tax as the state is arguing - this is an income tax because that property, or that $250 million is property. According to the State of Washington's Constitution, that's income. State's taxing that money at 7%. Constitution says you can only tax property at 1%, so it's unconstitutional. Also, the fact that there's an exemption means it's not taxed uniformly, so that's unconstitutional. They also argue that it's a violation of - they have some kind of commerce clause argument that I didn't understand and that didn't seem to apply. It didn't seem particularly sophisticated - the justices didn't seem particularly bothered by it during oral arguments yesterday, but that's basically the gist. And it's up to these political figures - these justices after hearing the arguments - to determine whether or not we're going to allow the state to raise $500 million to pay for education. The state hoped that they're - or asked the court to give a decision before April 18th on the matter, so that the lawmakers who are busy writing the state budget can know if they can include this $500 million that we raised from the capital gains tax in their bottom lines or not. The Supreme Court didn't seem bothered by that, didn't seem like they were moved by that request and will release a decision on their own time - a little sort of cross-branch flexing back and forth there during the oral arguments. But we know that on some Thursday, sometime in the next few months, we'll get an answer to whether or not we can tax them. And there's also the possibility that the court could, in their decision, say - Actually, income tax - or income isn't property. Those court rulings that determine that, the court decisions that determined that in the '30s were wrong. And that would allow Washington State to pass income taxes for the first time in over 100 years, which would really give us the opportunity to rebalance the tax code that is right now balanced on the backs of the poor. Every recession we dig ourselves out of - we do it from sales tax, property taxes, taxes on gross receipts of small businesses and other businesses - and large businesses, frankly. And that's the most regressive way to do it. And we're the most regressive state - in terms of taxes - in the country. So there's a slim possibility that we could change the whole game, but I don't know if they'll do that. They don't seem hungry to do that. [00:22:35] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. And Will Casey had a great breakdown of this all in The Stranger, in a piece that we'll link in the show notes and in our social media threads on this show. But to your point, they can - they do actually have a few different choices. This isn't necessarily just a binary - it's allowed or not allowed. They could agree with the lower court that it's not allowed. They could also agree with the Attorney General's opinion, which doesn't take any view on overturning the prior case that said income is property, we can't have an income tax, and just say it's an excise tax. It doesn't even get into the other discussion. And then that third option, as you articulated, can have them overturn the ruling that made an income tax illegal. One of the most foremost Washington State constitutional scholars and professors that we have in the state - Hugh Spitzer and some others - thought that that isn't likely - just overturning the whole thing and finding that income tax is legal to do in the state is unlikely. That if something does happen, they predict it would be agreeing that it's an excise tax. But who knows? They can do anything. We will see what happens. [00:24:01] Rich Smith: Sorry, just one correction. We can have an income tax, but it just has to be uniform and it can't be more than 1% because that's - yeah. But yeah, just to clarify - we all know, and I know - I said it too. But it's just - it's like a shorthand - it's we can't do an income tax that makes sense - is what we mean when we say we can't do an income tax. [00:24:17] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. A graduated income tax. Thank you for that clarification. [00:24:21] Rich Smith: Yeah. Yeah, but I agree that - listening to oral arguments in any case, and especially in a case like this, just makes me go crazy because the arguments are never about the moral value of the question at hand. The judges aren't deciding whether or not it's - we should have a capital gains tax if the Legislature does it. It's based on previous case law triangulated over the course of many different years - is it technical - are these definitions, does this definition of capital gains and income and property align with the plain language of this law or not, and to what degree do we care that it does? It seems like it's all up to us to decide, right? You've got Noah Purcell, the Assistant Attorney General, arguing on behalf of the state saying stuff like, This is an excise tax because when we're taxing the capital gain, we're taxing it at the point of the transaction - not taxing the actual - we're taxing the transaction, not the money, but the ability to do the transaction, not the money that you get coming in. And the other side says like, In all 50 states, or in every other state in the country, they have capital gains taxes - but those taxes are called income taxes. And yet here we have a capital gains tax and suddenly it's not an income tax? And then the state says, Well, we're the only state in the country that defines income as property, right? So it just dwindled - the entire argument dwindles into definitions and it just makes you feel insane while you're watching it, because it has nothing to do with this. It has little to do with the substance of the policy matter. So we just make it up anyway and decide - the entire law is based on language, which is quicksand, it's soup, it changes constantly. The definitions are made from language and so their meanings change over time, and yet we've got these clerics in robes pretending like they're mystical beings seeing the true intent of the law or whatever and just argue. It's just, it's witchery. But anyway, I just really - if you want to feel that, if you want to feel insane, I recommend going to TVW and watching the oral arguments. [00:26:55] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, we will stay tuned to what happens and await the upcoming some Thursday where we eventually hear what the fate of the capital gains tax is. Also this week, we heard from our new King County Prosecutor, Leesa Manion, about some of her plans for the office - the establishment of some new units focusing on gun violence, sexual assault, economic crimes, and others. How did you view this? [00:27:27] Rich Smith: Rearranging the office chairs? I don't know, right? Creating these units and - on the one hand, making it someone's job to focus on certain crimes does matter, right? It changes the focus and the thrust of the work that gets done on a daily basis. But I don't know to what degree that's going to fix the problems in the office. You're not really dealing with - it's not like we're still concentrating on "repeat property crime" which seems to be, what, a euphemism for graffiti, which is one of the - or, broken windows - which is one of City Attorney Ann Davison's big areas of focus as well as the mayor's office. But I don't - I'm not quite sure, really, how this rearrangement will impact the scope and work of the office. They don't expect it to help knock down the 4,000-case backlog that developed over the course of the pandemic. They're not really - there's some stuff to like in there in terms of focusing on diversion, which would be better than if we had Jim Ferrell in there, who was the hard right - or a conservative Democrat, I should say - running against her in the November elections last year, but I'm not sure. What's your take on it? [00:29:17] Crystal Fincher: You know, I am reserving judgment. I'm willing to see how this turns out. It does actually matter - to create units where people are focusing, where they're able to share resources to investigate and - within our current system of both policing and among the prosecutor - investigation is an important thing. That's the meat of how we figure out who does stuff and especially if we want to stop playing whac-a-mole with people doing low-level crimes that are often the result of some other root cause. The ability to move further up the chain and address some of those systemic issues, or if they are actually targeting organized retail theft or domestic violence, intimate partner abuse - to really go after people who are doing that, or who are defrauding seniors, and going after wage theft - that requires focus and investigation and specialized resources and they're not going to get pulled away on to whatever the newfangled thing is that they're focusing on that week. And that's shown to have an impact and make a difference. I also recognize that this is one piece in the criminal legal system puzzle. And on that investigation issue, we still have issues with police who are doing the frontline work in this and not investigating many things. And having those who were in investigative roles moved out to patrol - because of their conversations on staffing and feeling that they need to do that. And then we wind up in situations where we aren't investigating sexual assault. And even when there's gun violence and a business owner has a bullet that they collected that went through their window, the police aren't showing up for days or weeks to pick that up and even process that. So it's like what can the prosecutor do if police are only focused on patrol, surveillance, low-level crime and not able to put the resources into investigation in order to address these issues. So it feels like everything's a mess systemically and they're trying to wade through that. But I do think that - we know that certain interventions with gun violence, we know that certain types of diversion, we know that focusing on crimes of abuse and manipulation and fraud make a difference. I was excited to actually see named - wage theft - which is one of the biggest crimes being perpetrated in the City, that so often doesn't get talked about because it is perpetrated by more wealthy people, business owners. But that also comes with a pause, because in the quote that I saw in the paper, it talked about, Hey, we - last year, we filed more charges against organized retail theft than any others before. The Stranger had done excellent reporting on what they call organized retail theft - sure does look the same as small-time petty theft. And so if we're laying out this big - saying we're focusing on wage theft and economic crimes and fraud and organized retail theft - but every focus, all the resources, and all of the energy is going towards this "organized retail theft" that looks like the same old theft that we've been dealing with that is not very organized. We'll have to see how this turns out. So willing to give the benefit of the doubt, see what happens, see what kind of an impact can be made, but I'm definitely waiting to see what the impact is. [00:33:23] Rich Smith: Yeah, could just - want to triple underline that. The categories look okay to me. It'll be, it'll just be telling to see where they put, or the prosecutors put, their emphasis. [00:33:34] Crystal Fincher: Okay. With that, also wanted to talk about Initiative 135 on the docket. There is an election coming up on Valentine's Day, February 14th, to decide whether Seattle is going to have social housing and The Stranger took a stance on it. What did you guys decide? [00:33:56] Rich Smith: The Stranger Election Control Board is Pro - we want you to vote Yes on Initiative 135 for social housing. It's not perfect, but it is good. And so it's worth, it's worth your time. It's worth your Yes vote. Certainly. [00:34:15] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely is. I was in a conversation yesterday - with Axios actually - and talking about what the prospects of this look like. But I also think this is an interesting time - with all of these tech layoffs that we're experiencing and talk of an economic recession, there've been some people who have been fortunate enough to be insulated from the worry and concern about being priced out of Seattle and feeling secure with income. And there are lots of conversations about the working class and whether different workers, or a different class of worker, not feeling the same kind of solidarity or vulnerability to some of the challenges that other people have been facing when it comes to trying to fight for their rights, for unionization, for recognizing that they could be a paycheck or two away from financial instability, poverty or homelessness. And there are a lot of new people contending with some of that insecurity. This is unfortunate wherever and however it happens - absolutely not rooting for anyone to lose their job - there's a lot of pain and struggle and uncertainty going on now. But I do think this is all part of this same conversation and crisis that we're facing - we have a whole new class of people wondering if they can afford to remain in Seattle. If they are upside down on their mortgages with the way things are right now, if they can afford rent - continue to afford rent if they lose their job and don't get another one very frequently - how we're going to weather this predicted recession that's coming. So it really does seem like the time for varied action, new action, different action, not letting perfect get in the way of the good, and do something here. And this seems like it has a track record elsewhere. The reasoning behind it is sound. And let's kick this off. And let's see if we can get this right. And if it needs fine tuning as we go along, let's do that. But it really seems like the time for some different decisive action is now. [00:36:39] Rich Smith: Yeah, one of the members in the SECB highlighted this initiative as optimistic. And it's something you can rally behind, it's something you can really organize around - not just to get it passed, but once it's implemented, and once they start going through the steps of actually creating the social housing - it is a site for organizing, a site for movement building. And that's just - there's so few exciting, actual things like that - having a public developer, which this initiative would create, to acquire and build housing for people between 0% and 120% of the area median income that the City would own and make affordable - that is lower than 30% of your income, if you're living in those buildings - forever, it's just exciting. And yeah, it's forward thinking. And as we argue in the endorsement, we suck at thinking for the future - Seattle does a horrible job of thinking ahead. And I think it's because a lot of people who are here don't want to. They have - a lot of people have their house, who have their little nautical village, like being in the corner of the country, have this identity of being away from it all and that's why we're out here in the first place - and just emotionally blocked out the 2010s, where people flooded into the city, into the area - because of how prosperous all the companies were, because of all these opportunities. And then just did nothing to build the infrastructure for it. And this has been a curse of this town going back decades. 1970 - we didn't get the trades, and so the trades went to Atlanta. In 1990, or '95, we settled for a much smaller light rail extension that we possibly could. We have made the mistake of not making room for people who want to move to this beautiful place time and time again. And it is the root cause of so much of the pain and struggle that we see outside. And this initiative comes along and says, Okay, let's have a 50-year plan. And let's start now. Let's add another tool to the housing toolbox that can - if we plant this seed, grow into thousands and thousands of affordable units built sustainably, with union labor, that can keep housing - a certain amount of housing stock - affordable forever. Not like affordable housing - government-subsidized housing - which can go back on the unaffordable market in 30 years most of the time. And not like the market rate housing, which nobody's been able to afford for as long as I've been alive. But permanently affordable housing. And, yeah, as we mentioned, and as the advocates for this initiative will mention, it's working in France, it's working in Vienna, Austria, it's working in Singapore, it's working all around the globe. And it can work here - granted, very different housing markets, very different tax structures - in those places. But we can do it here, and we should. Because as Representative Frank Chopp of all people, who has dedicated his public life to building affordable housing, said about the affordable housing system we have now - it doesn't work. We need to try something else. And this is that something else. So it's exciting, and people should vote for it. [00:40:36] Crystal Fincher: Also coming on a later ballot to you - in August, in the primary - will be a number of councilmembers vying for several open seats. We had several announcements so far, some new ones this week. Who's running for City Council? Who's not running for City Council? And what does it mean? [00:40:57] Rich Smith: Everybody is running for City Council, it seems like. Well, last week - was it? Kshama Sawant, who represents District 3, the central area of the City, announced her plans to leave. And this sort of spurred some people to announce, though others had done it around that time or a little before that time. But it's really motivating people to jump in. And so yeah, we've had a number of people jump in in that race, in that City Council race. Joy Hollingsworth - runs Hollingsworth Cannabis, Central District resident, comes from a lineage of civil rights organizers - and she's in, she announced on MLK Day. We've got Alex Hudson - just announced this week - who was the Executive Director of Transportation Choices and runs the neighborhood board over at First Hill. Andrew Ashiofu, the Co-Chair of the Seattle LGBTQ Commission, jumped in to the race. Hannah has got great profiles on all of these people - you should check them out at The Stranger. And just this morning, Sarah Reyneveld, who is a Assistant Attorney General - she's jumping into the King County race to replace Jeanne Kohl-Welles, who was on the King County Council in District 4, representing Ballard, Queen Anne, Belltown, South Lake Union, that kind of area, on the County Council. She was in that seat for two terms. So Reyneveld is trying to swoop in and keep her legacy going there. And yeah, we've got another ex-Amazon worker, who was legally fired, is jumping into the race to replace Lisa Herbold. She was not one of the ones reportedly recruited by Bruce Harrell - still waiting for that person, whoever he is, to jump in at some point. So yeah, a flurry of activity and many more to come, I'm sure, as the balance of the City Council is up for grabs this year. [00:43:21] Crystal Fincher: This is going to be interesting with so many open seats - Lisa Herbold, Kshama Sawant, Alex Pedersen are not running again. We're going to see a lot of turnover, the potential for a switch in the balance of power with the council. And as you said, there are great profiles in The Stranger about some of these candidates. I think Capitol Hill Seattle and The Urbanist also had a couple of profiles. We will continue to see what they say, but I will say - one, it's early. It's early - running for office is hard and people are starting to get this together. But I do hope to see overall a greater articulation of vision. And hearing what they actually want to do, what they want to accomplish for the City and for the residents of Seattle. I was struck - in a few different situations where - being asked about issues, policy, where do you stand on this, do you support social housing, do you support this or that? And - Well, I'm not sure. I'm interested in hearing more about it. I want to hear what the community has to say. I'm looking forward to bringing people together to discuss it. I support this, but don't know if I can commit to it before I hear more information. And this is a time where you are running and making the case that you are the person most qualified to make this change. And to bring about the change that a lot of people are frustrated that they haven't been seeing after hearing promises for so long. And so it really seems like a missed opportunity to not at least take a stand on some things, let people know where you're at - and that may be a differentiator for people in crowded primaries. If someone is willing to stand up with certainty on issues and others aren't, that's absolutely a differentiator. And this is across a variety of issues, a variety of candidates. This is not about one candidate - have seen this widespread. So I do hope we see a greater articulation and greater commitments on what they're going to be, because I do worry about people who are afraid of offending people this early in the game. Campaigns are hard - don't get me wrong - but they don't compare to governing and the type of pressure and accountability that's there. And so if you cannot commit here, what are we going to get when you're on the council? [00:46:02] Rich Smith: I'm trying to hold it in, Crystal - but yeah, I couldn't agree more. Why are you running for office? You decided to announce - you could control that decision. If you don't have definitive answers for where you're at on problems that have existed for years in this city, if you still need to learn more from the community, hear more from the community on hiking the JumpStart Tax to fill budget gaps, or where you're at on pedestrian improvements, or where you're at on this or that - then why did you decide to run? All you're telling me whenever you say that - when you say, I need to listen to the community more on this issue - is that you are running as a matter of course, because you want the power of the position, not that you have something that you want to do with that power. And saying, Ah, but how I will wield my power is to be a collaborator, or to listen, to bring the community together, bring everyone around the table - then you are saying that - that you suck. I don't know how to say it - that you're going to defer to whoever's interests seem to have the most sway over - I don't know. You don't have principles in that moment, right? You're just a funnel for other people to use. And as we've seen in the past, that means you're going to bend to big business, you're not going to stand up for stuff that you know is right. And that's, or at least that's what that signals, and it just boggles the mind. And then this little ouroboros of the community asked me to run - Okay, great. What are you going to do? I'm going to listen to community. Well, what did the community - why do they want you to run? Presumably they want you to run because they already agreed with you on stuff. And so just - trust your instincts, say what's right - and people will respond. I don't know why everyone's trying to not offend X. I know why - because they don't want to offend the money - because they need the money, and they need the endorsements, and they need the support in order to win. And so whatever - people aren't going to say what they actually believe. It's either that, or they actually don't believe anything and there's just a transparent grab for power on assumption that you've been working toward this, and so it is yours. It's disgusting to see, frankly. And I don't know - maybe I'm just getting over this, but I'm - it's, it's, I find - it sucks. It's offensive. [00:48:47] Crystal Fincher: I'm gonna choose to try and have a charitable interpretation of where they may be. It is early in the campaign. Maybe they haven't figured out the best way to articulate where they stand yet. But I do think they need to hurry up and get to it. Anyone - you don't have to be elected to bring people together and listen to community. The reason why you run for office is to have the power to make decisions. It's to make those decisions. We give you that authority through an election. And so we need to hear about what decisions you plan on making. We need to hear about the policy that you plan on crafting and passing in specificity. That is why you run. We are not trying to elect a convener here. We're not trying to elect a moderator for the community, someone to conduct listening sessions. We can do that any day of the week. We can pay other people for that. But only a few people can sit and make those decisions. And so hearing about those is really important. And to your point, Rich, we have heard that from people who have done nothing, from people who have gone back on their promises that they made while they were running, from people who did say - I'm different, money has no hold on me. But lo and behold, they wind up doing different things than they said when they were running. And it's exactly what their list of top donors wants. That's what we're used to seeing when we hear this. And so a red flag automatically pops up. Maybe that's not ultimately where these people are going to be coming from, maybe that's not their intent, maybe they're still working on that - I would encourage them to work on it quickly. [00:50:34] Rich Smith: Yeah. I agree. And that's - thinking of Sawant - that's part of what made her refreshing was - she was just like, she just tried to do what aligned with her principles. She had no power, so she ended up spending a lot of time just like dunking on her colleagues a lot in ways that were not particularly productive or whatever. But she was like, Okay, we want to protect abortion in Seattle. Let's pay for it all. Let's pay for all abortions. Here's a plan to pay for everybody's abortions every year. It costs $3.5 million. Sign it up. Oh, we got a $140 million budget hole. Let's raise the JumpStart Tax to fill it. Sure, we're going to have to fill it with something else in the meantime and then backfill with JumpStart, but let's do that. And so it's not hard to have a policy position and to try to do what you, try to hold onto that principle when you finally make it into office. And so I just wish people wouldn't hedge. And if you say something and then you change your mind later, you can just - you just do that. You could say I changed my mind for this reason or that reason. And then you won't have the - oh, broken promise mailer, or whatever that you're scared of. People just don't know how to be people on the campaign, and it's incredibly depressing. And it just takes so much time to parse. And I amplify your call and your hope that people will get better quickly on these issues. [00:52:04] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, and I think it's going to be a competitive advantage for those - who do still have to hit all your campaign marks, do the things that get votes and connect with people. But the way to connect with people is to tell them concretely how you plan to improve their day-to-day life. And with that, we will wrap up today's Hacks & Wonks. Thank you so much for listening on this Friday, January 27th, 2023. I cannot believe the month of January just evaporated like that. How dare it. But we're almost to Black History Month. Anyway, Hacks & Wonks is co-produced by Shannon Cheng and Bryce Cannatelli. Our insightful co-host today was Associate Editor of The Stranger and noted poet Rich Smith. You can find Rich on Twitter @richsssmith, with three S's in the middle. You can follow Hacks & Wonks on Twitter @HacksWonks and find me on Twitter @finchfrii, with two I's at the end. You can catch Hacks & Wonks on iTunes, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts - just type "Hacks and Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast to get the full versions of our Friday almost-live show and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the podcast episode notes. Thanks for tuning in - talk to you next time. [00:53:31] Rich Smith: Thanks - bye.

Join host Vanna as she talks with Rev. Charlin Hughes Co-Manager of the Law Enforcement Assisted Diversion (LEAD) Program for St. Louis County Prosecuting Attorney's Office and Co-Founder of Humanity in the Middle Nonprofit Organization. TAP IN to hear how the nonprofit is working to bridge the gap between law enforcement and the community served by engaging youth. And learn about the diversion program they are now offering and how it benefits the community. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/dahoodtalkspodcast/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/dahoodtalkspodcast/support

Kylar Broadus  is a true warrior for equality, civil rights, the LBTQ community in general but especially Transgender individuals from communities of color. This attorney, long-time activist, public speaker, author and professor is a groundbreaking trailblazer who forged the way for many of today's leaders. Not content to sit on his laurels, Kylar continues his advocacy in New York, Washington DC and across the nation. He was awarded the Trans Trailblazer Award by the LGBT Bar Association of Los Angeles. He was awarded the 2018 Gentleman of Excellence Award. Mastercard in 2018 featured Broadus for Pride Month. He was recognized by the Prosecuting Attorney's Office of King's County in Brooklyn, New York in 2018 for his contributions to the legal field.In 2017 Liberty Mutual honored him at the GLAAD Awards for his 30 years contribution to the movement. The Advocate recognized Broadus as one of “25 Legal Advocates Fighting for Trans Rights.”  He was named to the Out 100 by Out Magazine in 2013. Broadus was the first out transgender American to testify before the United States Senate in favor of the Employment Nondiscrimination Act in 2012. Broadus was given the Pioneer Award at the Trans faith of Color Conference by the Freedom Center of Social Justice.   In 2011, he was awarded the Sue J. Hyde Activism Award for Longevity in the Movement at Task Force National Conference on LGBT Equality: Conference Creating Change.  He has been featured in Esquire, BlackEnterprise.Com and Diversity, Inc. and numerous other publications. He is founder and director of the Trans People of Color Coalition the only national organization dedication to the civil rights of transgender people of color

Clark County Prosecuting Attorney Tony Golik has informed the Clark County Sheriff's Office that Deputy John Feller should not be criminally charged in the death of Vancouver Police Department Officer Donald Sahota. https://bit.ly/3Zzo9k4 #ClarkCountyProsecutingAttorneysOffice #ProsecutingAttorney #TonyGolik #ClarkCountySheriffsOffice #CCSO #DeputyJohnFeller #OfficerDonaldSahota #OfficerInvolvedShooting #SheriffJohnHorch #UseOfDeadlyForce #VancouverWa #ClarkCountyWa #ClarkCountyNews #ClarkCountyToday

A panel of five elected prosecutors were unable to reach a consensus on whether the shooting of the off-duty Vancouver Police officer was reasonable or not. https://bit.ly/3ZdpkFx #OfficerInvolvedShooting #OfficerDonaldSahota #VancouverPoliceDepartment #VPD #ClarkCountySheriffsOffice #CCSO #ClarkCountyProsecutingAttorneysOffice #TonyGolik #JonFeller #WashingtonAssociationOfProsecutingAttorneys #VancouverWa #ClarkCountyWa #ClarkCountyNews #ClarkCountyToday

With Election Day looming and ballots due in a few days, this week's show is a Ballot-In-Review! Crystal is joined by perennial favorite Mike McGinn along with the rest of the Hacks & Wonks team - Bryce Cannatelli and Shannon Cheng - to discuss the recent political climate, break down the context of down-ballot races and why your vote matters. Listen in as the crew opens their ballots and thinks their way through the important choices in front of them. As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Follow us on Twitter at @HacksWonks. Find the host, Crystal Fincher, on Twitter at @finchfrii and find today's ballot party attendees: Mike McGinn at @mayormcginn, Bryce Cannatelli at @inascenttweets, and Shannon Cheng at @drbestturtle. More info is available at officialhacksandwonks.com.   Time Stamps Washington State Advisory Votes - 05:57 King County Charter Amendment 1 and Proposition 1 -  08:25 Federal Races - 16:54 Washington Congressional Races - 18:00 Secretary of State - 32:00 Washington State Legislature Races - 33:13 LD26 - 33:27 LD47 - 35:30 LD42 - 36:57 LD30 - 38:09 LD44 - 38:22 LD46 - 38:55 LD36 - 39:45 LD37 - 39:56 LD34 - 41:05 King County Prosecuting Attorney - 41:32 City of Seattle Municipal Court - 52:40  City of Seattle Proposition Nos. 1A and 1B - 1:01:48   Reminders Don't forget to vote! Visit votewa.gov for voting resources.   Institute for a Democratic Future 2023 applications are live! The initial deadline is November 2nd, and the final deadline is November 13th.   Learn more about how to get involved in Seattle's budget season at this link and about King County's budget timeline here.   Student debt relief sign-ups are live! Visit this link to enroll.   Resources  Washington State Advisory Votes:  “Tim Eyman's legacy of advisory votes on taxes hits WA ballots again” by David Kroman from The Seattle Times King County Charter Amendment 1 and Proposition 1: “King County considers moving most elections to even years” by Joseph O'Sullivan from Crosscut   King County Proposition No. 1 - Conservation Futures Levy Washington Congressional Races: “Congressional candidate Joe Kent wants to rewrite history of Jan. 6 attack” by Jim Brunner from The Seattle Times   Straight Talk bonus round: Marie Gluesenkamp Perez and Joe Kent from KGW News   “Rep. Schrier, challenger Matt Larkin clash in debate over who's extreme” by Jim Brunner from The Seattle Times Secretary of State: Hacks & Wonks Interview - Julie Anderson, Candidate for Washington Secretary of State   Hacks & Wonks Interview - Steve Hobbs, Candidate for Washington Secretary of State   Hacks & Wonks - Secretary of State audiograms - Addressing Democratic criticism of Julie Anderson   Hacks & Wonks - Secretary of State audiograms - Thoughts on Ranked Choice Voting   Hacks & Wonks - Secretary of State audiograms - Experience to manage the broad portfolio of the SoS office Washington State Legislature Races: LD26 - “New ad highlights Washington candidate's past behavior against staffers” by Shauna Sowersby from The News Tribune   Sign up to volunteer for Emily Randall's campaign here on her website.   LD47 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - Claudia Kauffman, Candidate for 47th LD State Senator   “Boyce, Kauffman vie for WA senate in swing district with Kent, Auburn” by Daniel Beekman from The Seattle Times   LD42 - “Sefzik-Shewmake forum highlights abortion, health care” by Ralph Schwartz from Cascadia Daily News   LD44 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - April Berg, Candidate for 44th LD State Representative   LD46 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - Darya Farivar, Candidate for 46th LD State Representative   LD36 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - Jeff Manson, Candidate for 36th LD State Representative   Hacks & Wonks Interview - Julia Reed, Candidate for 36th LD State Representative   LD37 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - Emijah Smith, Candidate for 37th LD State Representative   Hacks & Wonks Interview - Chipalo Street, Candidate for 37th LD State Representative   South Seattle Emerald 37th LD Candidate Forum   LD34 - Hacks & Wonks Interview - Emily Alvarado, Candidate for 34th LD State Representative   Hacks & Wonks Interview - Leah Griffin, Candidate for 34th LD State Representative   Hacks & Wonks Elections 2022 Resource Page King County Prosecuting Attorney: "PubliCola Questions: King County Prosecuting Attorney Candidate Leesa Manion" by Erica C. Barnett from PubliCola   "PubiCola Questions: King County Prosecuting Attorney Candidate Jim Ferrell" by Erica C. Barnett from PubliCola   "Leesa Manion, Jim Ferrell tied in the 2022 contest for King County Prosecuting Attorney" by Andrew Villeneuve from The Cascadia Advocate   "Leesa Manion Holds Razor-Thin Lead in King County Prosecutor Race, NPI Poll Finds" by Douglas Trumm from The Urbanist Washington Supreme Court: Hacks & Wonks Interview - Washington Supreme Court Justice Mary Yu   Hacks & Wonks Interview - Washington Supreme Court Justice G. Helen Whitener City of Seattle Municipal Court: Hacks & Wonks City of Seattle Municipal Court Judge Candidate Forum   "Defense Attorneys Say Harsh Sentencing Decision Reveals Judge's Bias" by Will Casey from The Stranger City of Seattle Proposition Nos. 1A and 1B: City of Seattle - Proposition Nos. 1A and 1B   Ranked Choice Voting vs. Approval Voting from FairVote   The Stranger - City of Seattle Propositions Nos. 1A and 1B   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I am Crystal Fincher, and I'm a political consultant - a busy one - and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington state through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Full text transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. Today, we are continuing our Friday almost-live shows where we review the news of the week with a co-host - and we're adding a little twist. So first, we want to welcome back to the program, friend of the show and today's co-host: activist, community leader, former mayor of Seattle, and Executive Director of America Walks, the popular Mike McGinn. Welcome back. [00:01:03] Mike McGinn: Not quite popular enough - Crystal - you have to acknowledge that, but I think we need to go to the other guests on the show today. [00:01:12] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, so we're coming with you with a full Hacks & Wonks crew today. We have the incredible Bryce Cannatelli, who coordinates everything with the show and holds it down. Pleased to have her with us today. Hey, Bryce. [00:01:29] Bryce Cannatelli: Hey, Crystal. [00:01:30] Crystal Fincher: And we have Dr. Shannon Cheng, who is here to enlighten us also with her wisdom and insight, along with Bryce. Hey, Shannon. [00:01:39] Shannon Cheng: Hey, Crystal - super excited to be here. [00:01:42] Crystal Fincher: You could probably hear the sarcasm in that - but this is going to be fun. We are having a Hacks & Wonks little ballot party - we thought it may be helpful - because we talk about several things on the ballot, we talk about several races. But a lot of times we open up the ballot and there are things on there that we haven't seen, haven't heard of, and are trying to figure out. So we thought we would all just open up the ballots, go through them together - some of us in this call are later-voting people because we like receiving all of the voter communication until the last minute, so we haven't turned them in - but we encourage everyone to turn in their ballots as soon as possible. As we go through this ballot, we will add timestamps and let you know when we discuss the different areas of the ballot. So if you have a particular question about a particular area, you can just go to that portion in the show and figure out that, because we actually have taken some time to discuss what is in this ballot and on this ballot. So good luck. Make sure you get your ballot in. If you can't find it, if something happens to it, if you have questions, votewa.gov, V-O-T-E-W-A.gov is a resource. Or hey, just @ the show @HacksWonks to reply to us and we will try and chase down any answers to questions that you have. So vote, make sure everyone you know votes. This is really important and a lot is at stake locally and nationally. And what we do locally is going to dictate what happens nationally. And with that, I will give a few reminders today. And yeah, number one is vote. Don't forget to vote. The election - Election Day is Tuesday, November 8th. You can go to votewa.gov, that's V-O-T-E-W-A.gov to get all of the information about voting. If something has gone haywire, if you can't find your ballot, if you're not sure what you need to do, if you need information about accessible voting, or if you need to figure out about how to register to vote - which you still can do in person if you haven't registered to vote or changed your address or anything like that - go to votewa.gov and you can get all that figured out. Also, the Institute for a Democratic Future is accepting applications for this coming year's new class. The deadline is November 13th and so make sure to get those in there. I've talked about this before on the show, the Institute for a Democratic Future is great for people who lean left and who want to learn about making a difference in their community, who want to learn about politics and policy, or potentially even having a career - it's responsible for my career in politics. So if you want to learn more about that, feel free to hit me up or visit the website, which we'll link in the show notes. Also, it is budget season around the state - and including in Seattle - and so we're going to include resources for the Seattle budget process as well as King County in our show notes, so stay tuned with that and make sure that you get involved in making your priorities and needs known to your elected officials who are allocating money for the next year or two there. Student debt relief - signing up is happening now. Don't forget to do that. Don't wait to do that. We'll put a link to that in the show notes. And Daylight Savings Time ends this Sunday at 2 a.m. We're falling an hour back. We're moving into darkness in dismay and it's a very sad time for some of us here at Hacks & Wonks who like the extra sunshine in the evening. So here we go into the dark months of winter. [00:05:31] Mike McGinn: But Hacks & Wonks will be on every week to bring some sunshine into your life. [00:05:37] Crystal Fincher: We will try. We will try. [00:05:40] Mike McGinn: Stay tuned in on a regular basis. Yeah. [00:05:43] Crystal Fincher: So let's open up our ballots, crew. Let's see what we have here and start to talk through - for those of you who still have to vote - some things that may be useful, helpful. So the first things we see on this ballot that we've opened up are Advisory Votes. Man, these Advisory Votes on every freaking ballot. We have two Advisory Votes here. How did we get into this Advisory Vote situation, Mike? What is this going on? [00:06:15] Mike McGinn: This was part of the Tim Eyman Full Employment Act where he was trying to find yet another ballot measure to put in front of the people. So what this one does - it is passed by the people - and basically they have the opportunity to have a second opinion on every tax that's passed by the Legislature. So that's why you always have all these Advisory Votes at the top. But everybody approves to-date, the public approves the votes that are passed by the Legislature. It's why we elect people, send them to the Legislature. It's really just turned into extra space on the ballot, which costs money and makes the ballot a little longer. And so we could all save a little space on the ballot if the Legislature changed this. In the meantime, don't upset that budget that your Legislature worked to craft - just vote to approve. [00:07:08] Crystal Fincher: I completely agree with that. I cannot wait until we get to the time where we get the opportunity to repeal this. It makes our ballot longer. It confuses people. This is just anytime there is basically revenue passed, it has to appear as an Advisory Vote, which does not have any force of law. It doesn't actually do anything. It is basically a poll about something that has already happened. So yes, vote to approve. But also I would really like a movement to vote to eliminate these Advisory Votes. One thing it does is it makes the ballot longer, which is not pleasant for a lot of people. What do you think, Bryce? [00:07:49] Bryce Cannatelli: Yeah, I wanted to hop in just to say that the choices are Repealed and Maintained. And so the suggestions to vote to approve them are to Maintain them as the maintain option. But yeah, no, I definitely agree. We've talked about it in past shows. We talk about it off the air. Getting people to vote down-ballot is always a challenge. And these Advisory Votes just get in the way of that. I think we'll have more to talk about when we get to the Proposition Nos. 1A and 1B question on the back of the ballot about what length might do to people answering those questions. [00:08:25] Crystal Fincher: All right. So we are here in King County. We all have King County ballots. The next thing I see on my ballot - I think you probably see the next thing on yours - as we travel down from the Advisory Votes, is actually King County, a County Charter Amendment. Charter Amendment No. 1 - even-numbered election years for certain county offices. Question: Shall the King County Charter be amended to move elections for the county offices of Executive, Assessor, Director of Elections, and Councilmembers from odd-numbered years to even-numbered years? Why is it important to move from odd-numbered to even-numbered years according to the advocates for this charter amendment, Mike? [00:09:10] Mike McGinn: The single most important thing you can do to improve voter turnout. When you look at election results in the state of Washington, Oregon, anywhere else around the country, so many more people turn out in an even year because you also have congressional elections or presidential elections. It's just a more momentous ballot than the odd year elections. And so if you think people should vote more, if you think democracy is a good thing, moving it to an even year is great. The county has the option to do that. Cities can't just do it on their own - they need a change in state law. Representative Mia Gregerson has been pushing for that and others have pushed for it. In addition to getting more people to vote, it also really improves the demographics of the ballot. We're getting more young people, more people of color, more immigrant refugees - who are here and can legally vote. We're just getting so many more people voting that we're getting a more representative ballot. So I've been a big proponent of this. You just get a different electorate. You get a better, more representative electorate. And if what you care about, and I do, is more affordable housing - if you get an older, more conservative electorate, they're going to oppose new housing and they're going to oppose new taxes for affordable housing. They're going to be more likely to say, keep the car lane and don't make it easier to walk or bike or use transit. So we need to get an electorate and get elections in even years where we have an electorate that more reflects where we need to go. And hearing from more people, if you believe in democracy, it's great. So big kudos to King County Council for - and Girmay Zahilay, in particular - for championing this. And hopefully we can move all the elections to even years. By the way, we'll save some money too. We'll have fewer elections that the elections offices have to step up for. [00:11:15] Crystal Fincher: I'd love to see it. What do you think about it, Dr. Cheng? [00:11:18] Shannon Cheng: I'm really excited. We talk a lot about - on this show - about how local elections really matter and that local government is really where you feel the actual changes and impacts in people's day-to-day lives. And so having some of more of our local elections in a year where more people are going to be paying attention to it, I think it will be super helpful. I know I talked to somebody recently who felt like they were in Washington state and so their vote didn't matter. And, we're going to get to these other races. And I was trying to tell them, no, we have things on our ballot that really do matter, like the King County Prosecutor and judges and all that. And I think just combining it in a way where people are going to be paying more attention to these things that really matter in their lives will be super helpful. [00:12:03] Crystal Fincher: Absolutely. Well said - I agree. Next up on the ballot for King County is Proposition No. 1, the Conservation Futures Levy. So the King County Council passed Ordinance 19-458 concerning funding to protect open space lands in King County. The proposition would provide funding to pay, finance, or refinance acquisition and preservation of urban green spaces, natural areas, wildlife, and some salmon habitat, trails, river corridors, farmlands, and forests. And would reauthorize restoration of the county's Conservation Futures property tax to levy a rate that will be assessed for collection in 2023 and use the dollar amount from 2023 for the purpose of computing subsequent levy collections. So should this be approved or rejected? There are some really compelling statements about this, but this is really important for protecting open space lands in King County. There have been lots of conversations just about the preservation of land, the preservation of open and undeveloped land, and how important that is. These are conversations related to sprawl, related to just air quality, related to just people having the opportunity to recreate near where they live and not selling or developing all available land and the consequences that potentially come from that. So it is important, I think, widely acknowledged as important from people all across the aisle. It's important to maintain all of this. I see a statement submitted by Sally Jewell, who I believe is a former CEO of REI and served in a presidential administration, and De'Sean Quinn, who is a Tukwila City Council member, as well as Dow Constantine. And really, we have to take this action to protect climate change, to protect these last best places throughout King County. So far, this program has safeguarded over 100,000 acres of land, including Cougar Mountain, the Duwamish Waterway Park, and Sammamish River Trail. And they can accelerate that with this proposition. Statement in opposition to it really basically says that, hey, parks are having challenges being maintained, and we've already done enough. I don't know that there's a lot of people here in King County feeling that we've done enough to address climate change or that we've done enough to protect local land. Protecting farms and fresh water, and open space seems like a priority to so many people in this area - and what makes this area so desirable to the people living here and those who visit and eventually come here. What do you think about this, Mike? [00:15:08] Mike McGinn: It's a parks levy. I'm for parks levies, generally. I actually got to run one once, and it was just great. And there's so much more in it than you might think. And if we talk about community - that to me is ultimately what this is about. There's clearly the environmental protection, but that's the quality of life and the community gathering places as well. So yeah, and it's a renewal. It's an expansion and a renewal of an existing levy. And I think every time you get to go to a great county facility, you just have to remember that the money came from somewhere, and this is where it comes from. They really have to pass these levies to make it work, given the way finances work for county and municipal governments. [00:15:54] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. And so this will cost the average homeowner about $2 more per month. There is relief available to qualified low-income seniors and other households. And the funding recommendations are made by an independent advisory committee and subject to external audit. So it's not just, hey, willy-nilly stuff happening here. There is accountability and oversight - looks like it is endorsed by the Nature Conservancy, Mountains to Sound Greenway Trust for Public Land, the Wilderness Society, Seattle Parks Foundation, REI, Dow Constantine and council members - just a lot of support there. I find those arguments to be particularly convincing. But this is an important one that's flown under the radar for a number of people, I think. I've gotten a lot of questions from people saying, whoa, what should I do with these county amendments and this proposition? And so just wanted to make sure that we went through that. Next on my ballot are the federal races, which have gotten a ton of coverage. I think if you listen to the show, odds are you probably know if you're going to be voting for Senator Patty Murray or her challenger, Tiffany Smiley, but that is at the top of the ballot right now. Do any of you have anything to chime in with about this race? [00:17:22] Mike McGinn: It's really fascinating to watch how this race is starting to become part of a national narrative about whether or not there's a red wave - going to hit the federal elections. And then there's some counterarguments. And we could pundit all afternoon on this one. And I'm sure a lot of you, if you're politically oriented, have really been watching the national news about what will happen in Congress. Will the Senate remain Democratic or will it turn Republican? Is the House going to flip? Most pundits say it will flip to Republican control, but there are still some folks out there holding hope that it might not. So I think the real message just is - if you cared about the national scene, you have an opportunity to play locally too. There's a Senate election in the state of Washington as well. [00:18:15] Crystal Fincher: All right. And next up on people's ballots - is going to vary based on where we live. It's going to be the congressional races. So I actually live in the Ninth Congressional District. We have a very competitive Eighth Congressional District race between Kim Schrier and Matt Larkin. Kim Schrier, the Democrat, Matt Larkin, the Republican. We have other races. Who's on your ballots? What congressional districts are you in? [00:18:43] Mike McGinn: I've got Seven, which is Pramila Jayapal and Cliff Moon. [00:18:46] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I think all three of you are in Seven there. Those races are a bit less competitive. I think two of the most competitive races here are going to be Kim Schrier versus Matt Larkin. And then down in southwest Washington, actually - in the Third Congressional District - between Marie Gluesenkamp Perez and extremist Republican, MAGA Republican Joe Kent, who is just... It's hard to do justice to him by describing him because I've tried to do it and then I've been like, okay, I can't do this. Here, watch this clip of him and Marie Gluesenkamp Perez in this sit-down with a reporter, just answering questions. And it is wild. He does not think January 6th happened in the way we all saw it happened with our eyes. He thinks that it was a CIA false flag operation. He doesn't think that police officers were killed as a result of that. He's deep into conspiracy theories, deep into the election denial of the 2020 election. Just deep into so many things - eager to cut social security, eager to cut so many things, eager to defund Ukraine between Ukraine and Russia, eager to do all sorts of things at the border. This is someone who eagerly and has multiple times appeared on Tucker Carlson. This is not Jaime Herrera Beutler. This is not the type of Republican that people are used to seeing in this district, or even as people think about Republicans in this country now - even the more extreme version that people are getting familiar with. This is the tip of the spear of the most extreme. He models himself after Marjorie Taylor Greene, says he looks up to her and wants to do that, does not want to work across the aisle, doesn't see a point to it. Rarely does media outside of the conservative bubble, does not want to debate Marie Gluesenkamp Perez. This is a race where a lot is at stake. Jim Brunner just wrote an article about it this morning in The Seattle Times. Actually, he shared it - I'm not sure if he wrote it. But this is an important one for people to get engaged in. We've talked about the importance of - even if you don't live in a district, hey, why don't you adopt a district, make some phone calls, do some phone banking, get down there and canvass - do what you can. Don't let this slip away without doing everything possible. The Third Congressional District is traditionally a Republican district, but it's traditionally a Republican district that has elected Republicans like Jaime Herrera Beutler, who were nowhere near as extreme as Joe Kent. This is a closer race than we've seen there in quite some time. If enough people get involved and if enough people get engaged, who knows what could happen? Democrats seem energized down there. This is one where - don't let it go by without everyone pitching in and doing what they can to engage in that race. Any thoughts that you have on that one? [00:22:10] Mike McGinn: This race, yeah, it does highlight just where the Republican Party has been going. I think you see some of this in the Murray-Smiley race as well. I've been really impressed by the campaigning of the Democrat in the race and the way in which she's approaching the race. This is a district that is - it's a swing district, but it's a lean-R swing district, if that makes sense. It has the Portland suburbs, but it also has more rural areas as well. Yeah, maybe this - if this were on the East Coast, people would be looking at this as a bellwether of which way the trend is going in national politics. Who knows? Maybe we'll be able to tell a little bit from the East Coast about how this race might work out by the time they start announcing results from this coast. But really, I think the D in this race - she's run a really solid race, speaking directly to people's economic concerns as a small business owner as well. And there's this thing where reporters want to talk about partisanship or polarized politics or divisiveness. And yeah, I would say the electorate is polarized - there are a hell of a lot of folks nationwide who are going to pull the lever for candidates because they want to see Republicans have charge of the chamber, regardless of the shortcomings of the local candidate. It's a really fascinating phenomenon that's going on. But I'm going to make an argument that it's - the Democrats look a lot like candidates I've seen in the past running. And the Republicans don't, in my mind, in terms of the extremism that we start to see on whether or not the election was stolen. The number of election deniers that are out there for the last election - there's just no credible evidence that there was any voter fraud. It went in front of numerous, numerous courts. It went in front of judges appointed by Republicans and Democrats. There's just no evidence for this. And I don't know that the media knows how to handle this - that when you have one side that just denies reality and the other side is still operating mostly within the frame of U.S. politics, as I've seen it in the years I've been involved in U.S. politics, but they both-sides it so much. And I think this raises a great illustration of that. The Democrat is really a right down the middle-of-the-road type of politician, and the Republican here is espousing things that just aren't so, and it's one hell of a tight race down there, according to all the polls. And portraying this as Americans are divided or the politicians are polarizing doesn't capture what's going on. [00:25:19] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I think that is a good point. What do you think, Bryce? [00:25:23] Bryce Cannatelli: Yeah, I just wanted to weave back in something that Shannon mentioned earlier, which is that there are still people who live here and who vote here, who think that they live in Washington - they live in Western Washington - they're pretty safe from things. And I think this race is an important reminder that there are people running with these extreme views. There are these people running here in the state with really far-right priorities and goals. And this is a federal race, so it's gotten a lot of media attention, but it just highlights how important it is to pay attention to local races as well - races that for the State House and for State Senate and other positions - and just pay attention to what people are running on and making sure when we see people coming with extreme and dangerous views, that that's called out, that we let people know. Election Day is still in a few days. There's still opportunities to inform voters in this district about the candidates. There are still opportunities for voters who are really worried about rhetoric like this and candidates like this to get out there and talk to voters and inform them about this race. [00:26:32] Crystal Fincher: This conversation reminds me of one other thing, and actually was having a conversation about this as we were punditing on Kiro the other day. And there are some Republicans who are going - well, they're calling everybody extreme. Yeah, they're calling Joe Kent extreme, but they're also calling Tiffany Smiley extreme. And they're not the same extreme, but they're painting them with the same brush - you're hearing that for everybody, all the Republicans. If you say it about everybody, it's meaningless. And the challenge is, and the thing that the Republican Party has set up, is that they do have these extremists who are out further than a lot of the other Republicans that are elected, at least outwardly, right? And saying things that have been openly covered as white nationalism, Christian nationalism, that have been anti-Semitic, that have been racist, that have been homophobic, anti-trans, anti-gay - just very openly blatant right? And that is absolutely extreme. And no, not every Republican is outwardly openly saying that. They leave that to the Joe Kents and the Marjorie Taylor Greenes. But what is striking to me is how they have not been reined in by the people who have previously been considered as moderate and have previously been considered as the adults in the room. Those adults in the room are doing nothing to contain that extremist element in the party, and in fact, have given them more power, more visibility. The Republican Party, all of their caucuses have pumped money into these campaigns. Their allied PACs and supporters have pumped money into these campaigns and have been apologists for them. So if you will not rebuke when you hear those things said, if you will not stand up and say, you know what, I'm standing for these principles, and that person is not doing that, and we're both carrying the same label - I don't want to carry the same label as a person who is saying that - that is not what I stand for. We're not standing shoulder to shoulder. We're hearing none of that. We're hearing silence. And there are some people who want to interpret that silence as, well, clearly they don't agree. And when I talk to them, they sound perfectly reasonable, and they've been moderate in the past. We're hearing some of the most troubling things that we have in a while. Just the open anti-Semitism, the open racism, the open homophobia and transphobia that we're seeing is alarming. They're passing laws against it. This is not theoretical language. And we're seeing political violence as a direct result. That, of course, was predicted, right? When we hear speech like that, it incites violence. We have talked about it inciting violence, and it incited violence in multiple places, in multiple ways. And we've seen that just in the past couple of weeks - from January 6th to Nancy Pelosi to the Michigan governor - we're seeing this all over the place, right? And so silence is enabling violence. Silence is not moderation. It's enabling this extremism and violence. So yes, when you hear them all being painted with the same broad brush, it's because they're doing nothing to stop this rapid descent into this cesspool that we're on the precipice of, and that some states have already fallen to, right? It's important to vocally stand up against this, against hate, whenever we see it. And that's not a partisan statement. And if a party is trying to say that when you say that you need to call out violence, that you need to call out political violence, that you need to stand up and talk against anti-Semitism and call it what it is, and somehow they're putting a partisan label on that, be very wary of a party that says that speaking against those things is speaking against their party. They're telling you what the party is about if those things they're labeling as a partisan attack. I think that's very important to be said. This is so far beyond a Democratic and Republican issue, and we have to be aware that these Republicans are caucusing together, right? They're voting together for a national agenda, and we've heard this national agenda articulated. We've heard the things that they're queuing up. We've seen the types of policies that they're passing in places like Florida and Texas. We have the preview of what's coming there, and it is ugly, right? And ugly to people who used to consider themselves Republican. So to me, this is beyond the conversation of just Democrat and Republican. This is a conversation that we have to have before we even get to issues, because if we're leading with that hateful rhetoric and we're leading with that extremism, it really doesn't matter what someone is saying about issues, because the things that they are saying about people in their community is already excluding people and already doing that. I think that's extremely important to say, that we can't say that enough, and that trying to dismiss this extremism, and dismiss criticisms of it, and dismiss the refusal to call it out for what it is - is extremism itself. All right. So next on our ballot, we have the state races, starting with Secretary of State, which is a lively race. Now, we have talked a bunch about the Secretary of State race, and have also been posting a lot about it on the Hacks & Wonks Twitter account this week. So for that, between Democrat Steve Hobbs and Non-partisan Julie Anderson, we're going to refer you to those other shows. We'll put links in the show notes. We'll put links to the little audiograms and snippets that we have of the candidates' takes on different things. Steve Hobbs was a longtime Democratic senator known as a moderate for quite some time - and Julie Anderson actually just released a new ad that talks about that and him as a moderate. And then Julie Anderson has been the Pierce County auditor in Pierce County for 12 years, I believe now, and has built relationships around that area. So that's an interesting race to follow. We'll put those links in there, but that's the next one on the ballot. And then we get into the legislative races, which are going to be different depending on which legislative district that you're in. I just wanted to mention a few of the battleground districts here in the state. So one of them is in the 26th Legislative District Senate race - very important - between Emily Randall, Senator Emily Randall, and current Representative Jesse Young, who's running for that Senate seat. Emily's a Democrat with a strong record and has been representing that community and been in the community for quite some time. Jesse Young is one of the more extreme Republicans in our legislature, has - in the mold of the Matt Sheas, who made a lot of news for his activity in domestic terrorism. And if you think that sounds like a euphemism or like a stretch of the truth, I mean literal domestic terrorism like running a camp training people for war and putting tracking devices on law enforcement vehicles, and making threats to political opponents - extremism - and advancing bills to outlaw abortion in Washington state under threat of putting doctors in prison - that kind of extremism. And Jesse Young, as we talked about last week with Pierce County Council Chair Derek Young, has actually been suspended from working with legislative staff because of his past behavior and harassment or abuse. He is no longer permitted to have legislative staff, which is certainly hobbling in one's ability to get their job done. They lean very heavily on those staff. And so not being allowed to have one and having to do or not get done all of the administrative work, preparation work, ability to meet with constituents, ability to review and prepare legislation and represent the community is absolutely hobbled by that. But that is actually a really close race. Another one where it makes sense if you can adopt a race, that 26th Legislative District is a really important one where people can get involved with and make their voices heard. Also, the 47th Legislative District is a hotbed of activity - a competitive Senate race there - open seat left by the exiting Senator Mona Das and is being competed for by former State Senator, Democrat Claudia Kauffman and Republican Bill Boyce. This has been a purple district, a swing district, has elected both Democrats and Republicans. This district has a history of extremely close races. And so we have a race here where we're seeing some of the dynamics that we see in Democrat versus Republican races. Choice is a huge issue here. Bill Boyce - being bankrolled by far-right Republicans - has been giving really mushy responses about what he thinks about a woman's right to choose. And so that is certainly on the ballot, as well as just the history of corporate giveaways, tax - as was quoted in the paper - tax breaks and sweetheart deals given to rich developers and donors. And so certainly looking at the donor rolls there, you get a different story of who those legislators would be based on the activity there. So another very important partisan race. 42nd Legislative District, a very competitive race between Sharon Shewmake and Simon Sefzik - another Democrat versus Republican race - very important here for the Senate and just a variety of things. And again, we're seeing just greater space between the two parties. Here in the state, we, I think, have seen Republicans who have considered themselves moderate and who have been less eager to engage in some of the social wedge issue rhetoric that sometimes we see on a national basis. There have been Republicans who wore it as a badge of honor previously to say, no, that's not me. I'm focused on these other issues, but stand up. And whether it's being pro-choice, whether it is standing up for marriage equality. There have been some before here who have done that, some who haven't, but some who have. We are not seeing that now. Things are following the direction of some of the national races. And so we have that there. 30th Legislative District with Claire Wilson and Linda Kochmar, as well as the race between Jamila Taylor and Casey Jones are close - and so engaging in those is important. And then the 44th Legislative District with John Lovick, the Democrat who was previously a representative, currently a representative, now running to be a Senator, against Republican Jeb Brewer. Republican Mark Hamsworth for the House seat versus Brandy Donaghy, who was appointed to that seat and is running to fill the term, this new term. And then April Berg versus her Republican opponent. So pay attention to those races. Please make sure that you're engaging in these battlegrounds. And then we also have just Seattle races and - that we've covered. So in the 46th Legislative District, we have a classic Seattle moderate versus progressive race. Even though those, when you get into it, the labels might be a little bit simplistic, but certainly someone who seems more resistant to taxation, more resistant to change in Lelach Rave versus Darya Faravar, who wants to take more of an active approach in addressing issues like homelessness, housing affordability, and public safety - and move more in the direction of things that we've seen with the history of working versus those that have not. So that's a choice that we have there. We also have previously interviewed Darya, and so we'll link that in the show notes for your information. The 36th Legislative District features a race between Democrats Julia Reed and Jeff Manson. We've also interviewed both in that race. And we'll link that in the show notes. The 37th Legislative District is one where we did a primary candidate forum, have interviewed both of those candidates there - Democrat Chipalo Street and Democrat Emijah Smith. And we also did a debate in partnership with the South Seattle Emerald and others - hosted by the South Seattle Emerald - an in-person debate, actually. And we will link those there. I think that there are some interesting issues in that race, notable differences. We will also share kind of the lightning round stuff. But also, hey let's make sure that we're recognizing the full humanity of people and that we are not treating people who are in the LGBTQ community any differently than others. And that is an issue of difference in that race. So I encourage you all to do your homework about that and make sure that any candidate that you're voting for fully stands up for the rights of all people in our community. And that you communicate with the candidates about that and make sure all of your candidates know how important that is to you. And then we have the 34th Legislative District with Democrats Leah Griffin and Emily Alvarado. We've interviewed both of them. We'll link both of those shows in the show notes. So there are contested races throughout Seattle. Encourage you to vote in those races and make your choice. If you need help, refer to our show notes or to officialhacksandwonks.com. We have an Election 2022 page there and we'll put all of the resources on there. Next, we go to the County Prosecuting Attorney's race here in King County, that is between Jim Ferrell, who is the mayor of Federal Way, and Leesa Manion, who's the current Chief of Staff in the Prosecuting Attorney's Office. Jim Ferrell has been endorsed by folks like the King County Republican Party, some mayors, King County Council member Pete von Reichbauer, like the Covington and Algona mayor. Leesa Manion has been endorsed by the King County Democratic party, former governor Gary Locke, local labor unions. So there's a little bit of a difference in the profile of their supporters that kind of indicates the approach that they're looking to take. One, being more in line with some of the data that we're seeing in the most effective approaches to addressing crime and accountability - that has yielded some results in what we've seen, especially with youth crime and youth intervention, which seems to be particularly effective with Leesa Manion and her managing this office and hundreds of staff and attorney, which is certainly in line with what the County Prosecuting Attorney needs to do. Jim Ferrell, coming from the mayor of Federal Way, has talked about more of a punitive approach to this and is talking about cracking down on some of the things that we have been seeing as successful. It's interesting in how this race is shaping up and what the candidates are talking about and what they aren't talking about with them. Certainly Leesa has been leaning into her experience, the type of coalition that she's building, whether it's people who are in support of more common sense gun reform and making sure guns don't proliferate on the streets, to those who are looking to maintain accountability but make sure that we're doing the things that give folks the best chance of reducing recidivism, or people returning, or revictimizing people who are committing further crimes. Jim Ferrell seems very focused on trying to apply longer sentences, lengthier sentences, talking about a more, again, punitive approach, prosecuting more, longer sentences - that type of stuff. So with that, what do you think? What is your take on this race, Shannon? [00:44:01] Shannon Cheng: So this race is between Leesa Manion, who's the current Chief of Staff for the outgoing King County Prosecutor, Dan Satterberg - she's been in that position for quite a time. And her opponent is Jim Ferrell, who is the current mayor of Federal Way. So when I look at this race, I see - with Leesa Manion who - it's a continuation of what King County has been doing, which I would characterize as incremental reform of the criminal legal system to be more fair and equitable. I think this can be embodied in initiatives they aspire to, such as declaring racism as a public health crisis or the goal of Zero Youth Detention. So I think with Manion, you will get a continuation of the slow work that the county is doing to try to make our criminal legal system more equitable and fair. Whereas with Ferrell, I see this as a candidate who's trying to throw us back to punitive tactics that have been proven to be ineffective. He wants to be more tough-on-crime and is riding this wave of Republicans pointing to crime as being the reason not to support the Democratic candidate. I think that Ferrell has specifically spoken about being against and wanting to roll back some of the diversion programs that King County has started to try to use, especially for youth. And I also - even if you don't - if you agree on this punitive approach, I think it's also worth considering that right now the legal system is kind of at capacity. So what Ferrell is suggesting is going to put even more strain on it. The courts are already - have backlogs coming from the pandemic and the jails are full and not functioning well and not providing people humane conditions to be in there. So I just fear that that will lead to a lot more suffering for many people across our county. And I think this is a really important race to look at and think about. [00:46:12] Crystal Fincher: So Mike, what's your take on this? [00:46:14] Mike McGinn: It's interesting to see the contrast here. It's a local version of this national debate that we have now seen - that the proper response to crime is to crack down harder. And we're seeing this here as well. I worked with Dan Satterberg and he was a really interesting elected official. And honestly, to me, I may not have agreed with him on every decision - I know I didn't agree with him on every decision he made. But he was a civil servant first and foremost. He was trying to figure out what was the right path forward. He was engaged in the discussion. He led on things like Law Enforcement Assisted Diversion, people returning to the community from jail - getting their records cleared and restoration of rights. So he was really, and it's interesting, he was elected as a Republican, moved the race to a nonpartisan race and then was elected as a Democrat. So he clearly was somebody who was willing to go where the evidence led and not go based on ideology. So that's the experience we've had from that office, which is, I think, what you want in a prosecutor's office. It's a pretty important position. The effect it has on people's lives is immense. I think that really says something that we see someone looking to continue that tradition. And then we see someone coming in with - if only we punished people more. How's that been working? Really? We have some information on that, which is it doesn't really work. It takes a combination of the judicial system and community systems to really try to deal with root causes of crime, to deal with recidivism, to deal with the issues here. And I think that this is a little bit of a bellwether here. Are we going to try to be a progressive place, a progressive county that adopts and looks at new approaches? Or are we going to go to a more regressive approach to this? Because, yeah, that's worked so well in solving crime over the decades. [00:48:34] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I think so. What's your take, Bryce? [00:48:37] Bryce Cannatelli: Yeah, I don't know how much more I have to add to this other than just the importance of this race and the importance of making sure we have somebody who's really thinking about the - not just people's emotional concerns about crime, but the actions and the strategies and the programs that have been proven to address the things that actually lower crime. We've talked on a number of different episodes throughout this year about programs that have successfully reduced recidivism. And those are programs that often get criticized by people who claim to be tough on crime. And I just think that's something to interrogate our candidates about for this position, because the county prosecutor has a lot of influence in terms of how the county addresses crime in a way that's going to impact real people in big ways. [00:49:29] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I agree. I will chime in and say that we just got a new public poll here that was just reported on, I think yesterday, showing that this race is basically statistically tied. So turnout is going to be really important. Lots of people talk about - they look at the federal races - they wonder if their vote matters. They're going, okay millions of people are voting. Why does mine make a difference? Really what makes a difference are these down-ballot races, are these local races. If you care about the issues of homelessness, justice, equity, affordability, what our community looks like, who it serves - our criminal legal system is an essential part of that equation. And we're talking about, in so many of these conversations, how we intervene and address victims. And most people who have perpetrated crimes have been victims of them. And how we intervene when people are victims, especially early, and especially when they're young, dictates how their future goes and whether they end up on the path to criminalization and poverty or a better path. So the way we intervene in that makes a difference. The way we treat and handle these cases that come through and how we address accountability depends on whether our streets are made safer, whether our tax dollars are used in a way that makes it less likely that people are going to commit crime and less likely that people are victimized or more, right? And we're seeing the impacts of the status quo of a more punitive approach. And either we choose to keep doing the same thing, and polls keep showing that no one is satisfied with the condition of things today. And so we do need to consider that when we are making these choices. And I hope you take a long, hard look at that. And most of all, get engaged and vote, make sure other people vote. And talk about these races, talk about the county attorney races, talk about the judicial races that we're going to talk about in just a moment, right? These are very important. Turnout is not where we would love it to be. It's lagging behind some previous years here locally, especially among younger people. And I know that is concerning to some. So the more that people can do to make sure that everyone can - and the most impactful thing you can do is just text those close to you, call those close to you, talk to them. Hey, coworker - hey, did you get that ballot in? What are you doing for this race? Remember, this is important. Hey, cousin, hey, brother, sister, mom - it's those connections close to you and those personal contacts that actually make it more likely for those people to vote. External organizations can try and do all the voter mobilization that they can and that work is valuable and good and should happen. But hearing from someone who you care about and who cares about you saying, hey, make sure you do this, you have any questions, you need help - is one of the best things you can do to make sure that people actually turn out to vote. So with that, we can talk about a couple of these judicial races, which are next on the ballot. Now we see the state Supreme Court races and we see Justice Mary Yu, who - you probably hear affection and admiration in my voice because I have affection and admiration for Justice Mary Yu. We also have a great interview with her from a few months back that we will post in the episode notes. Justice Barbara Madsen, also wonderful. Justice Helen Whitener, who is just - look, I'm going to just go ahead and get personal. Justice Helen Whitener is everything. I just need everyone to know that Justice Whitener is everything from - just everything. Her experience - vast, broad experience - in so many elements and areas of the law. The thoughtfulness, the lived experience, the outreach into the community - just a beautiful human being and an effective and intelligent justice. I am a fan of Justice Helen Whitener and we've done a couple interviews with Justice Whitener. And fortunately this time she isn't being challenged by anyone mediocre like she was last time, so this is an uncontested race. And when I say mediocre - I mean just got his license to practice law in order to run against someone with a resume as vast and deep as Justice Whitener's. And so now we'll talk about the contested municipal judge races in the City of Seattle between Damon Shadid, who is the incumbent in that one seat - has been endorsed by a number of Democratic organizations, received Exceptionally Well Qualified by a number of organizations, and is standing on his record. And a new challenger from the City Attorney's Office, Nyjat Rose-Akins, who is endorsed by the King County Republican Party and Jenny Durkan, and is wanting to make changes to some things and talking about the record of Community Court and changes that she wants to make there. In the other race, we have judge Adam Eisenberg, who has been rated Exceptionally Well Qualified by a number of the local and ethnic bar associations, but also has received a high number of negative feedback and surveys from the King County Bar Association and concerns about management and whether women are treated fairly under his management. And then Pooja Vaddadi, who is a newcomer and a new challenger, who has been - received a number of Democratic endorsements, but also has not received any ratings from local judicial bar associations because she has chosen not to stand in front of them for ratings. Bryce, how would you characterize those races? [00:55:42] Bryce Cannatelli: Like Crystal said, we got to hear from all of these candidates in a forum. I'll start with the Damon Shadid and Nyjat Rose-Akins portion of it - they're running for Position 7. Damon Shadid has been a judge in this position for quite a while. And the main point of difference between the two is Nyjat Rose-Akins often talked about during the forum criticisms of Community Court and her interest in making a lot of changes to the Community Court system, whereas Judge Shadid has defended what that court has been able to do and hopes to see it continue in its current direction. As far as Pooja Vaddadi and Judge Eisenberg, that's another kind of longtime incumbent in the position - I can't remember how long he's been in that role - and a newcomer. And Pooja Vaddadi brought up concerns about the way that Judge Eisenberg has handled himself in the courtroom. You can hear her talk about that in our forum specifically at the end - is something that her campaign has been highlighting as of late, but also just the need that she claims there is in the municipal court for some changes. [00:56:52] Crystal Fincher: What's your take on those races, Shannon? [00:56:55] Shannon Cheng: So I think - so for the Judge Eisenberg and Pooja Vaddadi race - Pooja Vaddadi is a practicing public defender. And I think her experience in being in the court with somebody such as Judge Eisenberg presiding - it was a maybe not great experience for her. And so she saw a lot of injustice there and felt called to try to step up and bear witness and call out what was happening and how she has a different vision for how that court could be run. I personally appreciate that because I think judicial races are just very low information. It's really hard - as Crystal just went through, there was a long list of uncontested judges on the ballot - and I often look at those names and I have no idea who those people are. And so it has been interesting in this race to get a window into how courts work. And I know for me, it's been very educational. And I continue to aspire to learn more about how courts are run and what matters. And yeah, so for the Damon Shadid and Nyjat Rose-Akins - as Bryce said, I think it comes down to the vision of how Community Court will be run in the future in Seattle. Whether you want somebody from the City Attorney's Office driving the vision of how to handle low-level offenses in the city versus the path that we had been on to to try to support people in need and not further entangle them in a system that kind of - a system that can snowball on people's lives. [00:58:41] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, I think that's right on. And I think in these races, we are seeing a little bit of a difference. There has been a lot called out by Pooja Vaddadi's campaign. But in fairness, I think you referred to Pooja talking about how she was partly moved to run for this position based on some of the injustices she saw. But one of the issues in this race that has been brought up is that Judge Eisenberg was the recipient of the highest number of - basically highest amount of negative feedback. King County Bar Association does an anonymous poll of its member attorneys for judges and the highest percentage of attorneys returned negative responses for Judge Eisenberg - higher than all of the other judges and gave that feedback. Judge Eisenberg didn't seem to feel that that had any validity. And he talked about how he had been rated Exceptionally Well Qualified, which is the highest rating given by a number of different bar associations. And it being pretty standard that judges go before different bar associations and get interviewed and they evaluate their fitness for judicial office and provide a rating from Exceptionally Well Qualified, I think Very Well Qualified, just on there. And so he had a number of highest ratings. And Pooja Vaddadi decided not to sit in front of those. And she said it was because she felt that it was biased or tilted or they would automatically give high ratings to incumbents, but not give high ratings to people who weren't incumbents. So she didn't feel the need to sit before them, which is a bit different. A lot of first-time candidates do go before those bodies and are evaluated and come out with decent ratings. I'm trying to think if I recall first-time candidates getting Exceptionally Well Qualified - I think I recall a couple, but also some who haven't. So I don't know, there very well may be a role that incumbency plays in that, but that was an element in that race that came through. As well as prior coverage about whether Judge Eisenberg potentially gave someone a harsher sentence for exercising their right to a jury trial instead of accepting a plea deal. And that being a wrong thing - that is a right that people have to exercise. And whether someone pleads guilty to a charge on a deal or is found guilty on that charge, penalizing someone simply for choosing to go to trial is not something that should happen and is certainly frowned upon. And so there was some coverage in question about that. We can also link that in the show notes. So those are certainly interesting races. And I think Shannon summed up really well just what's at stake moving forward in the Damon Shadid and Nyjat Rose-Akins race. So now let's get into the meat of a Seattle big-time initiative - Propositions 1A and 1B, which are on the City of Seattle ballot. They are not on my ballot, but we've got ballots waving with Shannon and Bryce and Mike over here talking about this question. [01:02:10] Mike McGinn: Do you want me to take a shot at it? [01:02:11] Crystal Fincher: Yeah, go ahead. Take a shot at it, Mike McGinn. [01:02:16] Mike McGinn: Okay. We all know how ballots work - you get a choice between - in the primary, you normally get a whole lot of candidates to vote for and you pick one. And what this is proposing is that in the City of Seattle, whether you want a different way to vote that will give you more choices. So the first question is, and let me tell you what the two choices are. One is called approval voting. So you'd look at your ballot and you'd have multiple people on the ballot and anyone that you approved of, you'd vote for. So you could vote for one, two, three, four, to approve as many as you want. And the idea there is that you don't want to have to restrict your vote to one candidate. And I have to say there have been times when I've had multiple friends on the ballot - I just want to be able to say I voted for all of them. But there are other good reasons to want to maybe approve multiple candidates. The other style is something called ranked choice voting. So in that case, you'd rank the candidates - one, two, three, four, five. And they'd add up the votes, and whoever the lowest vote getter was would get dropped off. And so let's say - I'm standing here with Bryce and Shannon and Crystal - let's say I had ranked them Crystal first, and then Bryce, and then Shannon. If Crystal was the lowest vote getter, she'd be off the list. And my vote would now go to Bryce - my second vote would be counted. And you do this by a process of eliminating the lowest-ranked candidate until you get to a winner. And we'll probably get more into why - what are the differences between the two systems and why they're better. And there's a whole world of election nerddom, which is substantial - what is the best way to represent what the voters really want, but you're going to get to choose here. So the real question is, do you want to keep the existing system - and that's the first question on the ballot - or do you want a new system? And if you vote Yes, I want a new system, you'll also be asked - well, actually, no matter how you vote on whether you want a new system - you're then asked, which one do you like more, approval voting or ranked choice voting? So yeah, it is pretty dense and complicated. You probably want to sit down and look at this. But if I could break it down for you - if you think you want more ways to have your vote count and have more discretion in how to award it to people, you'll want to vote Yes on the initial question. And then you'll get to weigh in and decide which one of those two - approval or ranked choice voting - you like more. And that'll tee it up for people to offer their opinions on what they like more on the rest of the podcast. How was that? Did I do okay, guys, in getting the description out? [01:05:13] Crystal Fincher: You did! You did, in fact, do okay of getting the description out. And I think also just the - functionally on the ballot - what you said was really important and I just want to reiterate. So this - we're talking about - okay, there are two choices there, approval voting and ranked choice voting. But when you get your ballot, you're going to see that it is constructed in a way that's not just that simple choice. There really is an initial question and then a secondary question. The initial question - why don't you just read what's on the ballot? [01:05:47] Bryce Cannatelli: Yeah, I could do that. I can also hold it up to you, so you can see the wall of text that happens beforehand. Shannon is shaking her head on the video feed, because - Seattle voters will know it if they've opened their ballots - there's a lot of text that goes before you can actually answer the question. So please read your ballot from top to bottom to make sure that you vote for everything. But the way that it's formatted is we get an explanation of both of the individual propositions. So it says Proposition 1A, submitted by initiative petition number 134, and Proposition 1B, alternative proposed by the city council and mayor, concern allowing voters to select multiple candidates in city primary elections. Proposition 1A would allow voters in primary elections for mayor, city attorney and city council to select on the ballot as many candidates as they approve of for each office. The two candidates receiving the most votes for each office would advance to the general election consistent with state law. The city would consult with King County to include instructions on the primary ballot, such as vote for as many as you approve of for each office. As an alternative, the city council and mayor have proposed Proposition 1B, which would allow primary election voters for mayor, city attorney and

KUOW reporter Amy Radil joins Soundside to discuss the upcoming election for King County Prosecutor.

As we evolve Lawyer Talk to Common Sense Ohio, here's what we cover this week. The final J.D. Vance/Tim Ryan debate - racist accusations, and are debates worth anyone's time? 17-year-old girl shot in Short North/Columbus Ohio is the https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/crime/2022/10/17/columbus-loses-fourth-teen-in-less-than-a-week-to-gun-violence/69568152007/ (fourth teen slain in Columbus) in less than a weekWhy is the death toll for teenagers so high? Have we now "handcuffed" our police so they can't be on the streets to help prevent shootings? Another teenager story. https://www.nbc4i.com/news/local-news/new-miami-high-school-coach-pleads-guilty-to-sexual-contact-charges-with-a-student/ (New Miami high school coach) pleads guilty to sexual contact charges with a student. Customers receive help with grocery costs at conservative-backed ‘inflation' event. Did https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/2022/10/16/conservative-libre-initiative-gives-customers-at-market-gift-cards/69558317007/ (GOP buy votes)? Another Columbus-named area in Columbus, OH to be renamed. Christopher Columbus Park in Italian Village appears headed for a name change to https://www.dispatch.com/story/news/local/2022/10/12/christopher-columbus-park-faces-renaming-columbus-italian-village/69553743007/ (Warren Park.) 4 masked and armed teenagers were allowed to https://fox8.com/news/i-team/how-armed-teens-got-into-cleveland-school-i-team/ (enter school in Cleveland). A salute to https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/delgazette/name/henry-shaw-obituary?id=36835765 (Judge Henry Shaw). In 1968, he began serving the citizens of Delaware County as an Assistant Prosecuting Attorney. From 1970-1976, he was the county's Prosecuting Attorney, and he took office as a Judge of the Common Pleas Court, General Division, in 1976. He served 27 years in this capacity until his retirement in 2003, making him the longest-serving General Division Common Pleas Judge in Delaware County history. Submit your questions to http://www.lawyertalkpodcast.com/ (www.lawyertalkpodcast.com). Recorded at Channel 511, a production of 511 South High Media LLC. Stephen E. Palmer, Esq. has been practicing criminal defense almost exclusively since 1995. He has represented people in federal, state, and local courts in Ohio and elsewhere. Though he focuses on all areas of criminal defense, he particularly enjoys complex cases in state and federal courts. He has unique experience handling and assembling top defense teams of attorneys and experts in cases involving allegations of child abuse (false sexual allegations, false physical abuse allegations), complex scientific cases involving allegations of DUI and vehicular homicide cases with blood alcohol tests, and any other criminal cases that demand jury trial experience. Steve has unique experience handling numerous high publicity cases that have garnered national attention. For more information about Steve and his law firm, visit https://www.ohiolegaldefense.com/ (Yavitch & Palmer Co., L.P.A.)  You can also find Lawyer Talk on these platforms: Rumble: LawyerTalkPodcast Brighteon: LawyerTalkPodcast Gab: @LawyerTalkPodcast GETTR: @LawyerTalk Copyright 2022 Stephen E. Palmer - Attorney At Law

Sean Goode and Rebecca Thornton from Choose 180 stop by to share how to transform systems of harm and injustice - by supporting young people impacted by them as well as their own staff in doing this work. They discuss a better world where neighborhoods are resourced, generative programs are co-created, and the humanity of those accused of causing harm is centered alongside the healing of those who are harmed. Such a world is not as far off as one may think, but does require the transfer of power to those closest to the pain and a long-enough runway to have lasting effects. As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Find the host, Crystal, on Twitter at @finchfrii, find Sean at @GraceNotGuilt, and Choose 180 at @ICHOOSE180   Resources Choose 180: https://choose180.org/   “A King County nonprofit raised all staff salaries to $70,000 minimum. Will more organizations follow?” by Naomi Ishisaka from The Seattle Times: https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/labor-shortage-or-living-wage-shortage-one-king-county-nonprofit-is-taking-a-different-approach/   "Disparities in Wealth by Race and Ethnicity in the 2019 Survey of Consumer Finances" by Neil Bhutta, Andrew C. Chang, Lisa J. Dettling, and Joanne W. Hsu for FEDS Notes: https://www.federalreserve.gov/econres/notes/feds-notes/disparities-in-wealth-by-race-and-ethnicity-in-the-2019-survey-of-consumer-finances-20200928.htm   “Closing the racial wealth gap requires heavy, progressive taxation of wealth” by Vanessa Williamson from The Brookings Institution: https://www.brookings.edu/research/closing-the-racial-wealth-gap-requires-heavy-progressive-taxation-of-wealth/   “The economic impact of closing the racial wealth gap” by Nick Noel, Duwain Pinder, Shelley Stewart, and Jason Wright from McKinsey & Company: https://www.mckinsey.com/industries/public-and-social-sector/our-insights/the-economic-impact-of-closing-the-racial-wealth-gap   “An Unjust Burden: The Disparate Treatment of Black Americans in the Criminal Justice System” by Elizabeth Hinton, LeShae Henderson, and Cindy Reed for Vera Institute of Justice: https://www.vera.org/downloads/publications/for-the-record-unjust-burden-racial-disparities.pdf   “Prosecutor-funded program helps kids do a 180, avoid charges” by Sami Edge from The Seattle Times: https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/law-justice/prosecutor-funded-community-effort-helps-kids-do-a-180-on-jail-bound-route/   King County Prosecuting Attorney - Choose 180 Youth Program: https://kingcounty.gov/depts/prosecutor/youth-programs/choose-180.aspx   Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher, and I'm a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington State through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Full transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. Today, I'm very excited to have joining us Sean Goode, the Executive Director of Choose 180, and Rebecca Thornton, who's the Office Manager and bookkeeper for Choose 180. Thank you so much for joining us today. [00:00:50] Sean Goode: It's an honor to be here, Crystal. Thanks for the invitation. [00:00:52] Rebecca Thornton: Thank you for having us. [00:00:55] Crystal Fincher: Excellent. So as we get started here, I just want to open up with you talking about what Choose 180 does and what brought you both into this work. And we can start with you, Sean. [00:01:09] Sean Goode: Yeah. Our organization exists to transform systems that cause harm, systems of injustice, and support the young people who've been impacted by those systems. And what that looks like is we partner intentionally with folks like prosecutors to co-create programming that exists outside of the traditional criminal legal system and alleviates the need for them to continue to prosecute young people. So in practicality, it's a young person lives in a neighborhood that's overly policed, their behavior's criminalized, the police send that referral to the prosecutor - but because of our relationship with them, they get community instead of a criminal conviction. And for the young people who engage in our traditional programming, over 90% of the time, they don't return to the criminal legal system within 12 months of participating in our programming. And so that's an example of one of our many models of service, but all of them have a genesis point of partnering with systems to transform the way they administer justice and supporting young people as an outcome to help alleviate the harm that those systems cause. My brother was incarcerated as a 13-year-old boy until he was a 21-year-old man and how he was stigmatized as a problem. And yet how, when he was released, saw me beginning to engage in some of those same problematic behaviors, but saw the possibility that lived within me and was able to call that out from a dark place and show me, by the way of his light, that there was something else that I could become. [00:02:30] Crystal Fincher: And what brought you to this work, Rebecca? [00:02:33] Rebecca Thornton: About six years ago, I was looking for just some way to donate my time, because I just felt I had survived so much and that was just a way I wanted to give back. And I stumbled upon what was the 180 Program at the time. And they were like, "Hey, do you want to come and share your story at one of our workshops?" And I agreed, and I just jumped right in, and I just kept coming back. And about maybe eight months in, Sean ended up coming on and I got to watch that whole process. And then the team started to grow. And then about two years ago now next month, I came on full time as the Office Manager and bookkeeper. And I stayed with Choose 180 because of my lived experience with drugs specifically. I hold this core belief that especially young people should not be criminalized for their behavior because so much of it comes from the things that have happened to them in their lives and the circumstances in which they lived, because that's what happened to me. And I just want to give back in that way so that people don't have to take as long to turn their life around like I did. [00:03:46] Crystal Fincher: You actually made news last year for something that we don't see often, and that was for deciding to make sure everyone at Choose 180 is making at least $70,000, who's there full-time, which is a huge part of a discussion that we're having just around paying people a living wage in the first place and making sure people who are around us that we work with can also afford to live within our communities. But also particularly in the nonprofit space, where, so often, we are used to hearing about thin budgets and even thinner salaries, and there's just not that much money to go around. And this is a pursuit that people get into, not for the money, but for serving the community. How did this conversation start within Choose 180? And how did you arrive at the place where you decided to say, "You know what, everyone deserves to have a fair wage and to have the ability to live where they're working."? [00:04:47] Sean Goode: Yeah. Thanks for that question, Crystal. I think I want to start by saying we're fortunate to serve in a community where there's organizations like Collective Justice, Creative Justice, and Freedom Project, who have all done work around wage equity. And some of them have started the organization out flat, or paying already close to or living wage. And so we're fortunate to be able to have examples like that ahead of us that make the journey that we're traveling easier. And fortunately, we had a couple of our team members speak up who were asking questions about, well, how does it work around here? How do we determine what people make? And how does one get a raise? And do we do things by merit? Do we do things by a degree? And what we didn't want to do is provide any one-off answer and fix one person's situation. We wanted to go about it in a way that addressed it holistically. We convened a committee from our board to assess our compensation philosophy, and they spent time interviewing our team members and listening to their voices. And then they brought their recommendations to me. And their recommendations were many. There were things like, how do we value lived experience? How do we value college degrees? How do we value time served at the organization? But a throughline that was consistent was living wage. And I heard the report, I looked at the report, and I said, "Yeah, that sounds good, but we're at a nonprofit and we're already paying above market rate in many of these positions. So I don't know what more people want from me." And I thought the conversation was done there. I thought, at that point, I was finished and we could move on, but then we had to build a budget out for the next year. And as the story goes, one of our team members was working on their budget and I told them to dream big. And if we need to add to staff, consider what that might look like, which is where I always start budgeting - to think big. And she came back to me and said, "Well, if we're thinking about adding staff, I can't do that and not have our teammates who are currently here making less than a living wage." And then it became a back-and-forth conversation where I still didn't really get what it was I was being asked to do. And at the end of that conversation, she said, "Look, we work to support young people and their families in escaping the material conditions they're living in that are contributing to the harm that they've experienced. Could it be that we're resourcing our team to live in those same material conditions?" And that cut deep. And so - [00:07:18] Crystal Fincher: That cut deep, didn't it? [00:07:20] Sean Goode: Yeah. Yeah. And then I went to Rebecca, because she was in the office that day, and I tugged on her and I said, "Rebecca, do you ever think about buying a home for Maddie?" And Rebecca, you can go ahead and talk about what that was like for you. [00:07:33] Rebecca Thornton: Well, I laughed at him. Maddie is my daughter - she's kind of the office kid, honestly. Everyone is just in love with her - she's eight. But Sean pulled me aside and he asked me if I was able to save money or if I had plans to ever buy a house, and I laughed at him. That was my first instinct because that's never been in my plans [00:07:54] Crystal Fincher: From your end, as you're following this process, Rebecca, a lot of times we hear about this as employers and people who hire people and determine how much people get paid - we frequently hear this conversation from their perspective. But for someone who's working in that condition and you are not dictating what your salary is, but you're living there, and as you said, it was laughable to you that thinking about saving for a house, or anything like that, was a possibility. What was this conversation like as someone working for the organization? [00:08:28] Rebecca Thornton: Well, I know a lot of my coworkers were of the stance of, "Yes, we deserve this. We're going to fight for this." And I was more of Sean's thinking. I'm just so used to making below a living wage that that's kind of all I knew and kind of a core belief of all I thought I deserved. So for this to be on the table, I didn't believe it. I was like, when it's in my bank account, then I might believe it. And it was also odd because here I am, a white person in a Black-led organization. Do I deserve to make that kind of money at the same time? I don't know. There's a lot of - it gets down to all the core beliefs I have in making sure that I know that I deserve that. And it comes - I didn't have a lot of education, and I'm working on my degree and things like that. It's just, it brought up a lot of emotions in me, honestly, more than I thought it would. And I'm glad I had stronger coworkers that could keep the faith in it for me because I don't know - I was a little more pessimistic about it, I feel. [00:09:52] Crystal Fincher: But I think you get to the root of something that a lot of people face - if they're just used to something and you think this is just how it is and there's not really a possibility for it to get any better, you just kind of accept the conditions and go along with the flow. To me, it seems like there's such a synergy between conversations and beliefs that you are bringing into the community, and this conversation that you had within your organization, which is something I feel a lot of organizations need to do. And there is a tension between what they're saying their values are, what they're saying they're working for in the community, and what they're perpetuating through their practices and their budgets. We talk publicly - budgets are moral documents. They're also moral documents within nonprofit organizations and businesses. So what got you to the point, Sean, where you were like, okay, this is something that we can make happen? And how did you work through that? [00:10:50] Sean Goode: Hearing from Rebecca and another one of our co-laborers here - just, it hurt because I care deeply for our team. And then I had this moment of realization, Crystal, where I recognized the only thing getting in the way of this happening is me. And there's also holding attention of this opportunity to build wealth and I know very well, as a multiracial Black man, that the wealth gap between Black Americans and white Americans is 95 cents to the dollar. So for every nickel that Black Americans hold, white Americans hold 95 cents. One of the principal ways to close the wealth gap in our nation is through home ownership. If I am an employer that's largely employing Black and Brown people and not paying them a rate that allows them to build wealth, then I'm perpetuating a historical harm on the very people who I believe are entitled to benefit from the same system that they've suffered from for 400 plus years. [00:11:58] Crystal Fincher: I think that is so important - appreciate you being transparent about the tensions. I think that a critical part of this conversation is acknowledging that those tensions exist, talking through how you work with it. And to your credit and to your team's credit, Rebecca, the willingness to say this is possible and, hey, we believe in better and we're going to stand in this belief while you catch up. And for you, Sean, we talk about empathy and compassion. Those things, to me, are only useful as verbs. And I believe to my core that that enables people to work more effectively, to carry the message more effectively, to intervene effectively, and those in the community to see, okay, you actually mean what you're saying. It's like a bridge to build trust. And so I do want to talk about this work. And so in that context, how do you start conversations with people who start out with that belief - "Hey, someone does the crime, they do the time. And looks like that fixes the problem to me." [00:13:01] Sean Goode: What I'd love to do is this - I'd love to start back and say, hey, let's talk about slave patrols. And then let's talk about abolition, which then led to vagrancy laws, which meant that Black folks could be criminalized for standing on street corners - being unemployed because they weren't employable because the white farmers, who were no longer enslaving them, wouldn't hire them unless they could be servants again - would then be arrested. And then when they are arrested, they would be leased out as convicts, which then put them back on the very same plantations that they were supposedly liberated from. I would love to be able to dive into the prison industrial complex and talk about how for-profit prisons have driven an industry and a practice towards incarcerating people. I would love to highlight the fact that there's more Black people incarcerated today than were ever enslaved at any point of time in our country. I would love to talk about the disproportionate policing and how policing is focused in impoverished areas that are highly under-resourced and undersupported and frequently neglected, where there's not access to quality education, quality healthcare, quality schools. I would love to talk about the many depravities that are present in the places where young people aren't allowed to have behavior listened to before it's criminalized. I would love to bring all those things to the forefront, but what I know to be true is most people who don't understand this reality, are too distant from that place that - for them, that seems like history and not present. And it's difficult for them to draw a throughline. Where I do believe we can start at is a simple conversation around cause and effect. If historically, policing behavior would lead to a decrease in behavior that causes harm, then we should be seeing, year over year, a decrease of the number of people who are incarcerated. We should be seeing a decrease in violent crime. We should be seeing a decrease in property crime. If these systems were preventative measures that were persuading people away from making these types of decisions, then after all these years, it should have had an impact that demonstrates that things are getting better in that regard. Everything we look at would tell us otherwise. Either it doesn't work, or humanity is so inherently evil that no matter how much we police behavior, it'll never change. I don't believe that humanity is so inherently evil. In the work we do, the majority of the folks that we're supporting are people who are committing - whose behavior's being criminalized because they're living in poverty. If someone steals from the Goodwill, it's not because they're some sort of malicious criminal. If somebody's stealing from Target, it's not because they're looking to make some sort of substantial come-up off of what it is that they've taken. So as a result, it's upon us to begin to think outside of our traditional pathways and lean in with the lens of empathy and grace, and understand that we can't police our way out of poverty. [00:16:13] Crystal Fincher: I couldn't agree more with every single thing that you just said. So with that conversation and people going, well, okay, yeah, we see that there were problems with what we've been doing, but I still don't see what the solution is. You're talking about all this compassion stuff, and you're talking about let's treat people better and not put them in prison. What is the answer that you have and the programs that you are working on that are okay, so what is that different thing? [00:16:41] Sean Goode: The work that we do and the work that we do in community with others creates an off-ramp from the criminal legal system and an on-ramp into community where both the young person who is accused of causing harm is invited to be on a healing journey of accountability, and the person who was harmed is also made whole and invited to be on a journey where they're healing. And we've had terrific impact because we center the humanity of those that we're serving - and not a humanity that's absent of being accountable to what you've done, but a humanity that doesn't limit the person to what it is they've done and creates a pathway to what it is they can do, and then provides them with the resources they need to fully lean into that possibility. [00:17:21] Crystal Fincher: Focusing on the stopgaps, what types of programs are there and how do they compare? Because a lot of people are still, I think, having challenges contextualizing - well, yeah, recidivism rates are high, but we see what happens when, okay, someone's arrested, they're sentenced, they go to prison, and then they come out. They see something happening and they're like, "Okay, that is something." It's not as visible to people yet - what the interventions are outside of the criminal legal system that are like, okay, this is the process of healing, this is the process of justice, this is how we work to prevent further harm from happening and also work on healing people who have been harmed - which, to your point, is usually everybody involved in the scenario. What do those look like? And what are those programs? What are those processes? [00:18:21] Sean Goode: Yeah. They look like eviction moratoriums, which keep people housed and not living on the street. They look like the County buying up hotels in places that are inconvenient for some homeowners, but necessary for those who can't afford to live in a home. They look like investing in mental health services at a statewide level, which is something that we failed to do for a very long time in Washington. They look like re-examining our tax code and considering more ways to be able to raise the resources necessary to meet the needs for the collective us, instead of prioritizing the needs for those of us that have already established the foundation of wealth. They look like initiatives like Best Starts for Kids in our region that allow organizations adjacent to ours and like ours to be able to stand up innovative programs that can serve as a stopgap to alleviate some of the hurt and harm that's been caused. They look like many things similar to what it is that I'm sharing. They look like - how do we make sure we get more farmers' markets and healthy foods into neighborhoods that haven't had access to them historically? How do we make sure that people who have access to those healthy foods have the time and space to prepare them because they're not on public transit hours a day going to and from work for a less-than-a-living-wage job and picking up their kids from childcare, and then finally getting home at an odd hour where it's cheaper to buy a Happy Meal than it is to make a meal? Right? These are all contributing factors to the spread of this disease of violence. So it's so multifaceted, but also, if you're wondering and you're listening to this - well, that sounds ambitious. That sounds huge. That sounds like a wonderful utopian society, but how do we deal with what it is we're dealing with today? I'd say, just imagine for a moment, close your eyes and - picture the suburbs - picture places where you can walk to the grocery store, like a gentrified Columbia City, picture places where you have access to green spaces and parks and healthy foods. I know it seems like it's abstract when we put it in the context of underserved neighborhoods, but in neighborhoods where people are paying $1.5 and $1.8 million for houses that were initially purchased for a couple hundred thousand dollars because they were dilapidated in squalor because the areas were underinvested for decades - if we just take a minute and imagine, how do we make sure people have equal access to those type of services, then we wouldn't be having a conversation about violence at all. We'd have a conversation around how do we make sure that there's equitable distribution of services, equitable access to quality healthcare and quality foods and quality education. This is not a profound innovation that we're talking about. It is a profound effort only in the context of the fact that we've historically neglected those that have suffered, hidden them away, and hope that they disappear, and as we all should eventually benefit from a system of capitalism. We are still here. We still persevere, but we could thrive if people saw our humanity and began to make sure we had living wages. I mean, this goes right back into the wage conversation that we began with. If organizations - I was reading a book about the economics in Black community and one of the things that it stood up was that the middle class of Black folks across the country is largely comprised of people who work in social services. So we are the ones who are serving those of us who are impacted, and simultaneously impacted because the majority of our jobs don't provide a living wage that allows us to build wealth to benefit from capitalism, to build up communities that aren't living in the conditions that are causing the harm that's leading to the crime that people are complaining about because they don't want that to be present in their neighborhood. And then where are we supposed to go? [00:22:22] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. And absolutely valid and another - so many of those conversations about - as people explain the difference between Columbia City and an area that has been underinvested and under-resourced for so long - we can talk about Skyway, we can talk about a lot of different areas - it really comes down to the value that people place in those communities. To your point, about most Black people in the middle class being in the - basically serving and helping others, and that our value or people's value being tied up into their labor for others. And if you are laboring, then you have some value - not too much, but some, we'll recognize some. And if you don't, then we don't just value you. These are ultimately investment decisions based on value judgements of who deserves what and who deserves how much. And we repeatedly see and have a lot of empirical evidence about the judgements that our society has made about who is deemed worthy and who is deemed unworthy just for existing. And who has to do all of these shows of worthiness and value and labor to be considered worthy. And who just kind of gets that - because they exist. Now, kind of circling back around to Choose 180 - within Choose 180, you talked about earlier partnering with prosecutors, partnering within the system. Certainly, these are stopgaps and not the entire solution, but what do those partnerships, programs, interventions look like? [00:24:12] Sean Goode: Yeah. It begins with a genuine effort to connect with the people who are generally at the forefront of perpetuating harm, right? So the work with the Prosecuting Attorney's Office in King County goes back to 2011 when Dan Satterberg, now outgoing King County Prosecutor, was engaged with Doug Wheeler, community leader, and said, "Look, we're failing our Black and Brown children. Can you help me?" Right? And because Dan reached out to Doug - together, they created what at that time was called the 180 Program with other community leaders, and stood up an alternative that's continually alleviated the need for juvenile prosecution in our region. It begins with a willingness of those who are holding power to understand that their ability to hold power isn't going to transform the harm. It's their ability to release that power and give it back to those that put them in power, and allow them to co-create solutions that then serve the needs of those who have been impacted the most. And our existence is a manifestation of what is possible there, but it takes a lot of deconstructing of narratives. It takes a lot of trust building. It takes a lot of empathy and understanding, and it takes a lot of grace. Grace selectively applied is favoritism. And so what that means is we have to extend the same grace to prosecutors and law enforcement and court folks that we do to young people and families that we serve, because otherwise, we're just doing the same thing that law enforcement and court system and criminal legal system has done historically, which is prioritize people that they're preferential to while neglecting those that they don't care for. [00:26:00] Crystal Fincher: As the community is looking at programs that are happening through Choose 180 and the diversions that you're doing, as you're working with people to help connect them to resources, to coach them in better ways, provide better examples, and make sure they have the tools and support to sustain a different direction permanently, you talked about your success with recidivism rates. In terms of people sitting back - okay, things are broken, okay, totally not ideal. All right. Great. You have these programs. All right. How are they working in comparison to the traditional system? How do we know what you are talking about is working any better? [00:26:49] Sean Goode: Yeah. Well, Crystal, what I'm asking the community to do is give us the same runway that we've given the systems that have historically caused harm. Give us the same runway that we give the systems that historically cause harm. If we're only - we've been in practice for 10 years and have had great impact. Our systems of oppression have been in place for hundreds of years and have caused a ton of negative impact. How much of a runway do we get to prove that we can be successful? Do we get a year? Do we get two years? Do we get three years? Do we get four years maybe to stand something up for it to be proven wrong? How many iterations do we get to come up with, right? Are we allowed to have as many moments of reform - calls for reform - as law enforcement has in our nation. Historically year over year, do we get that same grace? That's what I'm asking for. If you want to stand up an alternative that's going to help deconstruct years upon years of perpetuated harm, then it's going to take more than 24 to 36 months to do that. It's going to take more than 10 years. It's going to take a generation of commitments to innovative ideas that we don't run away with the first time that they don't have the impact that we're looking for, because candidly, Crystal, if we ran away from the criminal legal system every time someone was released to the community and caused harm again, then we wouldn't be using it today at all. We wouldn't be resourcing it today at all, but we do because we believe that that can be fixed and it can be made better. Well, I'm asking folks to carry that same conviction in the community-based alternatives that are being stood up by the people who are closest to the pain points. Just like when it came to our wage conversation as an organization, the folks who are closest to the pain point understood what they needed to be healthy and whole. In community, the people who are closest to the pain point know what they need to experience safety in their community. Why don't we begin to just stand up what it is that folks are asking for and see what happens, and give it a runway like we've given to these other antiquated systems? [00:28:48] Crystal Fincher: I feel like that is a big thing that we're running into today - that we are sure we haven't had the best results, but we can change, we can fix it. While at the same time, demanding that community-based alternatives - one, present all the data that we need to see that this will fix all of the problems in order for us to consider investing in you at one-tenth of a percent that we invest in the rest of our criminal legal injustice system. Within there - certainly, goodness, you give it a 50- or 60-year runway, the change that you could see, it's hard for me to envision that change. Because if you just look on the short term, better results when it comes to reoffense and recidivism at the 12-month mark and other month marks - immediate results that are, sure, not perfect, but certainly better than the existing traditional systems. What would you say makes you most optimistic about the work that you're doing? And with this, I would just say also, Rebecca, in this question, what makes you most optimistic about the work that you're doing and the changes that you're seeing throughout the programs that you have, and the people who you're working with in the community? [00:30:16] Rebecca Thornton: Well, for me, I'm so excited that it's being talked about because it's something that I've always believed in, and I just never believed it was possible. Coming to Choose 180 and starting working full-time and being totally enmeshed into the programs and the people, I've started to look at things differently and looking at ideas differently. Things are possible if you can come together as a group and work for it and have that belief in it. You can make things happen. I've never seen that before. But I come from corporate America - there's no room for that there as well. It's been so cool to see - and that can be applied out in the community as well. If people can come together and they have the will - and like Sean said, the stamina - they can make stuff happen. But they need the tools to be able to do that as well, because I was out in the community on drugs years ago. I had no idea that change could happen for anyone. And I just think of how differently my life would've been had I had access to the things that could be possible in the 50 years that Sean is talking about. Or the things that my daughter's going to be able to have access to is just so important. My daughter - we have what's like "a broken home." There's statistics and stigma in that, right? So I've worked very hard to make sure that she sees me work hard and surround her with good people and all of that. But at the same time, there's still things in the way there. There's still stigma, right? And I just want to make sure that she knows that anything is possible. And I feel like what we're doing at Choose 180 just shows that, and it's pretty powerful. [00:32:15] Crystal Fincher: And what makes you most optimistic when you look at the work you're doing and the impact that you're having, Sean? [00:32:23] Sean Goode: I think about - brief history lesson here for some folks who might be listening. In the 1700s in Boston, there was a smallpox outbreak and there's an enslaved African American man who had established - there was a tribal cure for smallpox, a practice. And he introduced it to his enslaver, but for five years, the people of Boston refused to listen to this cure for smallpox because it was coming from an enslaved African American, from a tribal custom, because they felt like it couldn't possibly be an answer that would come from an enslaved person. It couldn't possibly be an answer. We need the richness of our white dominant medical science to be able to solve for this. And hundreds of Bostonians died because of their failure to listen to this enslaved African American man. I find hope that as a country, over the past 300 years, that we may have evolved past the point of ignoring those who are bringing solutions from nontraditional spaces, and that we may now be at a position, 300 years later, to lean in and say, "Well, if you think you have the cure, let's go ahead and give it a shot, because quite possibly your way could save lives." [00:33:59] Crystal Fincher: Amen. So I just thank you both for coming on this show, for sharing your experience and your journey and your wisdom, and just encourage people to continue to pay attention to Choose 180, get involved, support. And certainly at a neighborhood and community level, you can do these things where you're at, and that's actually the most powerful place you can activate and get involved. So please make sure that we don't just talk about Choose 180 and other organizations in the abstract, and this is what someone is doing over there, and this is what's possible over there. It is possible everywhere and exactly where you are. And help to be part of what makes that happen. Turn what's possible into what's happening. So with that, I just thank you once again for being here, and hope the listeners have a wonderful day. I thank you all for listening to Hacks & Wonks on KVRU 105.7 FM. The producer of Hacks & Wonks is Lisl Stadler with assistance from Shannon Cheng. You can find me on Twitter @finchfrii, spelled F-I-N-C-H-F-R-I-I. Now you can follow Hacks & Wonks on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever else you get your podcast - just type "Hacks & Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to get our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the episode notes. Thanks for tuning in. We'll talk to you next time.

John Norman Collins was an all-American boy. He was handsome, lived in Ann Arbor, and belonged to a fraternity. But there was a dark side to this young man. The media and others dubbed John Norman Collins "The Michigan Murderer." In the late 1960s, Collins stalked college-age women like prey. His hunting grounds were near the campuses of the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor and Eastern Michigan University in Ypsilanti, Michigan. The Michigan murderer terrorized the public. The media breathlessly reported the latest rape murders of women near two prestigious Michigan college campuses. John Norman Collins is a suspect connected to seven young women's vicious and heinous murders. John Norman Collins eventually found his way into a Washtenaw County, Michigan courtroom. A state prosecutor charged Collins with the first-degree premeditated murder of 18-year-old Karen Sue Beineman, a student at Eastern Michigan University. A jury convicted Collins. The judge sentenced him to a mandatory life sentence. Author Gregory Fournier was upset because the prosecutor never prosecuted six other rape-murder cases. The Prosecuting Attorney decided not to bring other cases. He was holding off in other murder cases as an "insurance policy" in the event John Norman Collins was successful on appeal. Collins lost all of his appeals as the courts upheld his conviction. Presumably, because Collins faced the rest of his life in prison, the Prosecuting Attorney decided not to spend public resources holding Collins responsible for other alleged murders. Some claim the police investigators had DNA evidence waiting in the other rape-murder cases. Fournier shares his extensive findings of these murders in our interview. The book "Terror in Ypsilanti: John Norman Collins Unmasked" is available at bookstores. Fournier, a Detroit native, is one of America's premier true crime authors. He has written several other books, including about Detroit's Purple Gang. ----------- Obtain a copy of the book "Terror in Ypsilanti: John Norman Collins Unmasked" by visiting your local bookstore or Amazon Books. To learn more about Gregory Fournier and other published true crime books, visit the Author's Website. ----------- --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/radiofreeflint/message

On this midweek show, Crystal chats with Leesa Manion about her campaign for King County Prosecuting Attorney - why she decided to run, her endorsement by outgoing prosecuting attorney Dan Satterberg, and the experience she brings with 15 years as Chief of Staff in the KC Prosecuting Attorney's office. They then discuss the responsibility of the prosecutor's office in building and maintaining relationships with law enforcement partners, the suitability of diversion versus incarceration as paths in the criminal legal system, and what needs to happen to make prison lead to rehabilitation instead of recidivism. The conversation then shifts to how to balance people's concern about public safety with trust issues with law enforcement and the court system, the ethics of when prosecutors should turn over evidence, her decision to not seek police guild endorsements, and how the system can do better in advocating for victims rather than re-traumatizing them. The show wraps up with the importance of prosecutor accountability and what is at stake in her race against a seemingly more hard-line and punitive opponent. As always, a full text transcript of the show is available below and at officialhacksandwonks.com. Find the host, Crystal, on Twitter at @finchfrii and find Leesa at https://www.facebook.com/leesaforprosecutor. Resources Campaign Website - Leesa Manion: https://leesamanion.com/   “Juvenile division prosecutor defends Restorative Community Pathways” by Henry Stewart-Wood from The Courier-Herald: https://www.courierherald.com/news/king-countys-juvenile-division-prosecutor-defends-restorative-community-pathways   “King County to continue new juvenile restorative justice program, despite pushback” by David Gutman from The Seattle Times: https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/king-county-to-continue-new-juvenile-restorative-justice-program-despite-pushback/   Investing For No Return - Final Report from King County Prosecuting Attorney's Office Reentry Summit: http://clerk.ci.seattle.wa.us/~public/meetingrecords/2013/cbriefing20130225_4a.pdf   Seattle Community Court: https://www.seattle.gov/courts/programs-and-services/specialized-courts/seattle-community-court   Filing and Disposition Standards - King County Prosecuting Attorney's Office: https://kingcounty.gov/depts/prosecutor/criminal-overview/fads.aspx   “WA prosecutors who withhold evidence rarely face discipline” by Melissa Santos from Crosscut: https://crosscut.com/news/2022/04/wa-prosecutors-who-withhold-evidence-rarely-face-discipline Transcript [00:00:00] Crystal Fincher: Welcome to Hacks & Wonks. I'm Crystal Fincher, and I'm a political consultant and your host. On this show, we talk with policy wonks and political hacks to gather insight into local politics and policy in Washington State through the lens of those doing the work with behind-the-scenes perspectives on what's happening, why it's happening, and what you can do about it. Full transcripts and resources referenced in the show are always available at officialhacksandwonks.com and in our episode notes. I am very happy to welcome to the show today: candidate for King County Prosecuting Attorney, Leesa Manion. Welcome to the program. [00:00:45] Leesa Manion: Well, hello, Crystal. Thank you so much for having me, it's a pleasure to be here.  [00:00:50] Crystal Fincher: Pleasure to have you here. So you have decided to run for King County Prosecutor. What made you decide to run now?  [00:00:59] Leesa Manion: Well, I'm running because I care so much about the work of the office - I care about its importance, I care about its impact on our communities, and I also care about the women and men who have dedicated their careers to public service and are looking for experienced and proven leadership. [00:01:15] Crystal Fincher: So you talk about proven leadership - our current King County Prosecutor, Dan Satterberg, is leaving the office, but has endorsed you and has worked with you. Why do you think he has endorsed you and he supports you?  [00:01:29] Leesa Manion: I think it is because of my deep level of experience, I think it's because of my proven leadership. I have had a hand in implementing all of the really good reforms that have come out of the office in the past 15+ years that have earned our office a national reputation of being fair, just, and effective. I am definitely a candidate who can hit the ground running - I'm very deep in operations, I also have very deep ties to our community, and I have really good working relationships with our employees in the office.  [00:02:01] Crystal Fincher: So you talk about having a hand in a lot of what has gone on over the past 15 years - what has worked well and what hasn't worked well?  [00:02:10] Leesa Manion: One thing that I think has worked well are all of the juvenile justice reforms that we've made - I'm really proud of the fact that I am a co-founding partner of Choose 180. And I have to say - at the time, Choose 180 was revolutionary in the sense that it was the first time that the prosecuting attorney's office intentionally shared power with community, and allowed the community's voice to shape justice and to be equal to ours. And it led the way for a lot of really good reforms that followed. So I think diversion works really well - it doesn't mean that it's foolproof. We've definitely had some pilot projects that didn't yield the types of results that we wanted, but we continued to refine our process, we continue to refine partnerships, we continue to decide how to offer services in a way that is fully funded and effective.  And in terms of something that hasn't gone well, I would say - everyone has been affected by the pandemic and we, in the prosecuting attorney's office, aren't any different. I think some of our relationships over the course of pandemic have been frayed, I think our relationships with some of our law enforcement partners have been frayed. And if selected, I would be committed to rebuilding those relationships. And it looks something like this - I think that we have to - as an elected, I would have to go to our Police Chiefs and Sheriffs meeting. I've always said to Dan that I thought it was a mistake that he wasn't in the room as an elected. I think, as an elected, you have to be in the room to develop relationships and to be accountable and to build partnerships. So I would be committed to doing that.  [00:03:50] Crystal Fincher: So would you say it's the fault of the prosecutor's office, that there is a frayed relationship?  [00:03:57] Leesa Manion: I think we definitely play a role in it, and I think we definitely can take a leadership role in rebuilding that relationship. And I've been doing that in my current role. For example, just last week I met with our Kent Police Chief and our Des Moines Police Chief and our juvenile leadership team to talk about some of the juvenile justice reforms that have gone on in recent years. And talk about the new juvenile diversion program, Restorative Community Pathways. And that was a really good conversation because we had an opportunity to share information, to air some frustrations, to clarify some misunderstandings, and to really start to build an open line of communication. And I really think that we have a lot of opportunity to do that with law enforcement throughout King County, but also with community partners. I really think that we in the prosecutor's office can serve as a bridge.  [00:04:49] Crystal Fincher: When you talk about that bridge, it seems like there has been some resistance to moving toward diversion, certainly from some entities in law enforcement. We have recently seen an attempt to move some folks away from diversion from the Seattle City Attorney's office. Do you think that there's a possibility that you have of convincing folks like that to move in a different direction and to partner with you in doing that, or do you also see a hesitance?  [00:05:25] Leesa Manion: What I see is a request to partner, I see a request for additional information, I see a request to have a seat at the table to help shape what diversion looks like. And I think that sometimes those questions can be mischaracterized or misunderstood as rejection or maybe resistance. But when I met with law enforcement, I found that they were curious. I found that they wanted to ensure that we were working together. I found that they wanted to ensure that there was some accountability, that if we offered diversion and there were individuals who were not successful - because sadly we will have some individuals who are not successful in diversion, what's the backup plan? What is the next step? What does accountability look like? And I think that we can have those conversations and have some agreed standards of conduct, but in order to do that, we really have to have relationships. We really have to start the conversation. We really have to bring people together to work on a common goal. [00:06:29] Crystal Fincher: So when do you think diversion is appropriate, and do you think incarceration is appropriate in the cases when diversion is not?  [00:06:39] Leesa Manion: I think diversion is appropriate for low-level offenses. I think that there are individuals, particularly among youth, who make some poor decisions that shouldn't haunt them for the rest of their lives, that shouldn't define who they are as individuals. And I think that we can offer some services that look like getting to the root cause of poor decision-making, that give them tools, that provide some guided opportunities - maybe job training - a way to redirect behavior into something that's more positive and that also increases pro-social behavior. I think for violent crimes, of course, incarceration is definitely appropriate. I think that most people can agree that homicides and violent assaults and violent sexual assaults are the type of behaviors where we would expect that the individuals are processed through our traditional legal system, and if convicted are isolated away from our community. I think that there are a lot of areas in between where we can talk about what's appropriate for diversion. I think that there are some low-level first-time felony offenses that would be right for diversion as a way to keep people out of the court system and into something that is more effective - whether it's actually more response, not less response than what we're getting through our regular legal court system. [00:08:13] Crystal Fincher: And one question I have - when we talk about locking people up and putting them away, certainly we need action to make our streets safer - there's a lot going on that is unacceptable and not okay. And it really is helpful to focus on what makes the community safer. So with evidence and research - a large body of research - pretty conclusively pointing towards - when people get out of prison, prison is actually making them more likely to reoffend. If the goal is to prevent people from being victimized, how do you square that with incarcerating people and the approach that we're taking now?  [00:08:58] Leesa Manion: Well, I really think we owe it to ourselves to have an honest conversation about prison reform. I am a strong believer in prison reform. I think that we talk a lot about the Department of Corrections being a place of rehabilitation, but we actually do not fund the level of services that are needed to address trauma, to address substance use disorder, to address underlying health conditions, mental health, or behavioral health issues. And until we get honest about that, we won't actually have the results that we want that help people while they are literally a captive audience, have the tools they need to be released better than when they first entered into prison. I think we have to be really honest about the fact that we have, stepping apart from the criminal justice system but through our legislative process, put up a lot of barriers to people who have criminal convictions or former contact with the criminal justice system. And if we expect people, because we say this a lot - you have served your time - then we have to be honest about the fact that they've served their time, they've paid their debt to society. And not continue to ask them to pay in all kinds of ways that are hidden - that prevent people from getting housing, jobs, access to student loans and education.  [00:10:18] Crystal Fincher: I think that's an excellent point. And given that, I'm wondering - they seem to be not the only ones who are paying, that the community is also paying because they - a lot of people coming out of prison and prison itself makes people more likely to reoffend. So until we have those kinds of supports in place that are consistent with people committing less crime, not victimizing people - does it make sense to put people into a system that is creating victims? [00:10:55] Leesa Manion: Well, I think it only makes sense if we're willing to make the investments to get the returns that we want. I do think that when people commit violent crime, I do think that our community is asking for safety. I think our community is asking that certain individuals be isolated until they have, to be quite frank, have been held accountable - and sometimes that means punishment or rehabilitated. And in order to have rehabilitation, we have to have services. There are on average 8,000 women and men released from Washington State prisons every year back into our community - and unless we equip those individuals with the tools they need to be successful, they will go back to committing crime to survive - out of trauma, out of poor decision-making, out of criminogenic both behaviors and maybe patterns. And as a result, we are creating future victims of crime. So if we want to reduce crime and reduce victimization, we have to make the investment in prison reform and in re-entry.  [00:12:04] Crystal Fincher: Can you impact that investment from your office? [00:12:08] Leesa Manion: I was really proud to be one of the key stakeholders behind the scenes in our 2012 conversation around re-entry. Dan Satterberg was the name on the door and the elected official who got people into the room, but I was the person who was helping behind the scenes, put all of those reforms into place to help create our report "Investing for No Return," shopping it with lawmakers and legislators, convening voices to weigh in on recommendations. I was meeting with the Black Prisoners' Caucus at Monroe and solicited from them an unedited chapter into the report, because the men and women who are leaving prison are the experts on re-entry and the barriers that they face. So I think I could, as an elected official, continue that conversation. And one thing about being an elected official is that your voice is given a megaphone and you have the power to convene, and convene really important and necessary conversations. [00:13:12] Crystal Fincher: I completely agree those conversations are absolutely necessary and it is really important to include the voices, as you have, of people who have been incarcerated or are currently incarcerated. I guess my question is - we seem to be in complete agreement and I think most of the community probably agrees - that the current system is broken and we are in desperate need of reform. Until it's reformed, and even if we're all pushing for that, does it make sense to keep putting people into that broken system? Is there an alternative that you see, or do you feel that we don't have an alternative?  [00:13:49] Leesa Manion: Well, I think diversion, for certain cases, is the alternative that we're all looking for. And connecting young people in particular, or people facing their first offense, into community-based resources - not only is it wise, not only does it help people avoid the criminal justice system and the harmful impacts and collateral consequences of criminal history, I think it's more cost-effective. I think we can also agree that there are certain crimes where, when people are charged and convicted, they are going to go away to prison - and we can still offer services to those individuals. I'm a firm believer that we should be offering services and treatment in our community and our jails and in our prison.  [00:14:35] Crystal Fincher: So you talked a little bit about meeting with different departments across the County. You will definitely be working with all of the cities and the counties. How are you going to approach those relationships? And are you asking any of the cities to do anything different than they're doing now?  [00:14:56] Leesa Manion: Right now, we are starting a new partnership with the Seattle City Attorney's office. And it's really about how do we share information on individuals who are cycling in and out of our system. And some of that information sharing is how do we best pivot those individuals into services. And then for some who are systematically preying on individuals and small businesses in our communities, how do we trade information so that we can hold that person appropriately accountable? Whether it's with misdemeanor filings or with felony filings. And again, it's because our community is asking for us to take public safety seriously. They're asking us to look at behavior and to make it stop, and they're asking for accountability. And accountability for people who are systematically preying on individuals and communities can look one way, and people who are committing non-violent offenses over and over again, out of mental health disorder, substance use disorder, or to basically survive - that kind of accountability can look different as well.  [00:16:03] Crystal Fincher: Well, and that brings up a question. It seems like the City Attorney, even for people who may not be committing crimes against other people, she's looking to remove them or to eliminate the possibility of diversion for those and move in the opposite direction. Are you aligned with that belief? Do you think that's the right approach?  [00:16:27] Leesa Manion: I don't know all of the details of Ann Davison's proposal, but my understanding is that she has it very narrowly drawn - those are individuals who have been referred to the system - I believe it's eight times in a year. That maybe those individuals have been given an opportunity to participate in Community Court, but have committed eight offenses within a short period of time and maybe it's an opportunity to try something different. So I think that having the courage to try something new is something that we should endeavor for. And then we should be willing to pivot if it doesn't yield the results that we want.  [00:17:08] Crystal Fincher: Okay. So there have been a wide variety of challenges when it comes to public safety - crime is up, people are very, very concerned - but also people have issues with trust and law enforcement and in the court system. How do you plan to prioritize truth and justice when sometimes there's seemingly a conflict of interest with your relationship with the police? [00:17:41] Leesa Manion: Again, I'm the type of leader - I like to identify common ground and build from there. And I think, when it comes to police, I think that there's so much common ground in terms of police reform. I think we can agree that when we are afraid and we call 911, we want a response. Maybe the response is from a sworn officer, maybe the response is from a social worker, but we all know that we want a response. And I think we can all agree that if we have officers who are abusing their discretion, we want them off the force. We want that, and I think the police want that too. So when I think about building trust, I really think, again, it begins with building relationships. And as I mentioned, I'm hard at work in rebuilding relationships with law enforcement. I presently have very deep ties within our community, and what I'd like to do is take the trust of the community, that they have instilled in me, and be the bridge into convening some conversations with law enforcement. And I also know and recognize that there are law enforcement officers who have really deep ties in the community. And so can we work together to broaden that circle, broaden those partnerships, and build trust together?  [00:18:59] Crystal Fincher: There was recently a story in Crosscut by Melissa Santos talking about a challenge and problems with prosecutors sometimes withholding evidence improperly in those situations and that being another issue that is a challenge. It was not about the King County Prosecutor's office, specifically talking about the issue as a whole. Do you see that issue and tension, and how do you approach that?  [00:19:29] Leesa Manion: I am really proud of the fact that we have built a model Brady policy. We take that very seriously and we have a conservative filing policy. We endeavor to turn over all evidence as soon as we are able, and I think those practices should continue. One, it's not just about being ethical. It's also about building trust and transparency into our system. And if we aren't transparent, people will never perceive our office as fair. If they don't understand our decision-making, they will never perceive our office as fair. And tying in this issue of fairness and transparency and also talking about trust and our relationship with law enforcement, as a candidate, I have been intentional about not seeking the endorsement of police guilds and it's not because I dislike police, it's because I fought for resources to create a public integrity unit within the office to look at officer-involved shootings and use-of-force cases that are coming to us as a result of I-940. And if I am endorsed by a bunch of police guilds, it doesn't appear to be fair, it doesn't appear to be neutral. And so I just wanted to explain that because it is another action that goes toward trust. And for some people that might seem like a really small thing, but to me it's a really big thing. [00:21:01] Crystal Fincher: Are there any other items like that, or within your office, that you feel you can do to help restore trust in a similar way, and in that same way? Is there anything else that you think would be helpful, or that you have planned, to increase the amount of transparency and trust in the process?  [00:21:22] Leesa Manion: I'm currently working with our communications team to create a list of frequently asked questions to put on our website, because there's a lot of confusion about the criminal justice system and the various stakeholders and actors in the justice system. For example, there are a lot of people who are really confused about what's the difference between the King County Prosecuting Attorney's office, the City Attorney's office, the US Attorney's office - and being able to have that information that's readily accessible is super helpful. I'm also a big fan of being really transparent in our decision making. We have long had filing and disposition standards that we share and we share openly, but I think that there are opportunities to invite in media to have them read our FADS, to ask questions. We could do that with community groups as well. I think the more that we can have people understand our work, the more that they will begin to trust the work. [00:22:23] Crystal Fincher: Gotcha. That makes sense. Now, a lot of crimes are currently going unreported and victims are hesitant to report - whether it's elder abuse, or intimate partner abuse, sexual abuse - and a lot of people citing that going through the court system and the process of prosecution and investigation is retraumatizing. How would you handle these situations so that further victimization of people, who've already been violated, doesn't happen?  [00:22:58] Leesa Manion: I really care about victim services. And one of the things that I've done is I've added 10 victim advocate positions within the office, including some bilingual advocates, because access and representation really matter. I've also secured funding and created a Director of Victim Advocacy. And that's with the sole purpose of really examining and really challenging ourselves within the office of what does it mean to be a victim. And sometimes the victim is someone who is going through the criminal justice system, sometimes it is a person who might have one loved one who's being prosecuted by the system and maybe lost another loved one to gun violence. Sometimes victims don't report crimes because they don't understand the process. Sometimes victims don't report crimes because they don't feel that they have an advocate or someone who will respect their cultural difference and their view of our US justice system. Sometimes people don't report crime because they really want something that's more restorative - they're not looking for retribution, they're looking for explanation and healing. And so I think we have an opportunity to really expand how we provide victim services so that it's more culturally responsive, more inclusive, more understanding - so that we actually have more voices from impacted individuals who help us shape what that looks like. [00:24:24] Crystal Fincher: How would that look different to a victim, or what are you proposing that would look and feel different to someone who has previously been hesitant to come forward or fearful?  [00:24:39] Leesa Manion: Well, I think for some individuals, it might be that they need some reassurance that there are not going to be immigration consequences to them reporting their crime. I think for some individuals they're going to need access to an interpreter because language is a barrier. I think for some individuals, they really want to know what's going to happen to the person that they have complaints about. For example, in the realm of domestic violence, I think that there can be some barriers to reporting because maybe the person who's committing the violence is someone who is the father of your children, or it's someone that you care about or love, maybe it's a young person or a sibling or a child. So how can we take this fear - working with communities, because we really have to rely on our communities to help us build those bridges and also to expand the reach of our services. So how can we demystify the process? How can we make it feel more safe? [00:25:38] Crystal Fincher: How do you navigate - you've talked about so many societal challenges, so many challenges from the pandemic. We are dealing with a lack of adequate support in - whether it's substance use disorder, behavioral health, and mental health resources - with that and basically putting people in the criminal legal system, who are suffering from other issues that may prevent them from acting rationally and having a calculation that we may think - okay, I don't want to experience consequences, so I'm not going to do this. Not everyone is in that frame of mind or maybe going through something preventing that. How do you handle, or what is your approach to people who are clearly suffering and the root cause of the issue is a lack of a basic need not being met in a different area? We can put them in jail, we can send them to diversion, but until those needs are met, we're looking at landing in the same place. What do you do in that situation? [00:26:52] Leesa Manion: I think in those situations, we really have to rely on alternatives that are therapeutic. I am a really big supporter of our Drug Court, our Veterans Court, or Mental Health Court. Those are collaborative team models where we have all of the actors - we have the court, we have probation, we have designated crisis responders, we have public defenders, and we have prosecutors - really working together to ensure that the person has access to services, that they have access to housing, that their basic needs are being met, and that they have the supports and the structure they need to be successful. So how can we build more of that? And here's an example of an area that I think I'm curious about and I think it's prime opportunity, but it would require a change in state law - in our Involuntary Treatment Act Court. Right now that's an adversarial model where I have prosecutors representing designated crisis responders and hospitals, trying to get someone committed for services. And on the other side of the table, I have a public defender who is advocating for the release of that individual. And often that leads to nothing and sometimes against the wishes of the family. So if we were able to make that a more therapeutic collaborative model, not only do I think that it would offer better outcomes, we could also use our mental illness, drug dependency tax dollars to support the therapeutic court. So I would really love to work with lawmakers and experts and leaders in this field - to launch that conversation, to see if that's something that we could have happen.  [00:28:39] Crystal Fincher: Should we be charging people with crimes related to possession of substances, or is that more appropriately handled in a different way?  [00:28:52] Leesa Manion: Well, as you know, because of the Blake decision, the possession of drugs was declared unconstitutional. And in our most recent legislative session, it was re-criminalized for a period of a year, but we have to offer two diversion opportunities. I will be really curious to see what that year experiment reveals, but personally I think those are opportunities for us to try to get to the root cause of behavior. And I don't think there's anything magical about a jail cell or a prison cell - because, as I mentioned earlier in this podcast, there aren't enough services to really adequately address the amount of need that we're seeing behind bars. So how can we, in a more cost-effective way, offer those services in lieu of jail or prison, but still meet the desire for public safety, to still ensure that those individuals are stopping their harmful behavior, to ensure that those individuals are themselves safe and not creating chaos in our communities.  [00:30:06] Crystal Fincher: Yeah. Now we have - you talk about being in that conversation about keeping people safe and that being the ultimate goal. Lots of elements in the criminal legal system - you're one of them, you can't control all of them or all of the societal issues that may be contributing to that - but in your role, if you were to be elected as the prosecuting attorney, what changes, could you make that would have the largest impact on preventing people from being victimized?  [00:30:41] Leesa Manion: Well, I really think that again goes to the heart of partnership and it really goes to the heart of identifying common ground and building from there. I'm a 'Yes, and...' thinker and that 'Yes, and...' thinking has come to me and been shaped by my lived experience. And I want to share just a little bit of a story and a little bit of my personal story, because it helps explain why I'm a 'Yes, and...' thinker. So I know I've shared with others - I was born in South Korea to a Caucasian father and a Korean mother. And when my father brought us to his home state of Kentucky, my mother was met with discrimination and racism. And when I was about four years old, my dad's mother, my grandmother, got into an argument with my mom - threw her out of the house with only the clothes she was wearing. And my brother and I did not see her again for 25 years. And so, that story and that experience taught me a lot about what happens to someone who was marginalized, who doesn't have a voice, who doesn't have advocacy. It also taught me about forgiveness. My grandmother was someone who advocated for me, she shaped me, she taught me about hard work, she loved me, and she was not the sum of her worst decision. My brother and I grew up in an area where we experienced discrimination and racism - and the disproportionate school discipline, the disproportionate law enforcement contact that so many young men of color experience, my brother experienced too. And when I think about public safety, it means a lot of things to me. It means that we are free of hate crimes that are born out of discrimination. It means that no person is the sum of their worst mistakes. It means that we can offer non-violent young people a second opportunity because sometimes they make really stupid choices. It means that we have to respect that people who live in our community may have experienced law enforcement differently, and we have to build trust, and we have to be able to show that we respect their lived experience before they will come to us with their problems. It also means that we can hold repeat perpetrators accountable, that we can hold violent crime and violent criminals accountable. It means that our victim services have to be responsive. It means that they have to be culturally sensitive. That's a lot of my, 'Yes, and...' So it drives how I approach this work, it drives my desire to create partnerships, it tries my desire to say 'Yes, and...' how can we work together? Yes, we can address the incidents of crime, and we can address the root cause.  [00:33:39] Crystal Fincher: Before we go, also wanted to talk about issues of fairness and frustration that people are having in feeling like - hey, if you are rich or if you're powerful, we're watching you get away with stuff that it looks like other people are not. And that there's a disproportionate focus on people who are at the bottom, people who are struggling or poor or marginalized - while watching people in power seemingly skirt laws without people blinking an eyelash, whether it's watching some Seattle Police Department officers vote from an unauthorized address, or watching text messages get deleted, or watching corporations sometimes flaunt the law and victimize their employees. What can you do, or how would you approach fostering a sense of transparency and fairness as to who you seek to intervene with? Whether they're rich or poor or powerful - are you tracking that? What are your plans? What's your general approach to that?  [00:34:59] Leesa Manion: It really, at the heart of it, is transparency and accountability. And prosecutor accountability in this sense. So that really means, and it starts with how we bring people into the office - what do our job announcements look like? Who has a seat at the table? What characteristics are we looking at? What barriers would be put away so that more people have an opportunity to join the office and have a seat at the justice table? What values do we reward? When it comes to our decision-making, it's really about being very transparent about the disproportionality that's in the system - being honest about that and not pretending that it doesn't exist. But then also inviting others to the table to help us get to the heart of that, and to be really open about what that conversation looks like, what that type of decision making looks like. And it also involves being willing to change our behavior, being able to change our practice around certain areas, and also being willing to admit - if we make a change and it's not successful, then we have to be willing to pivot and try something different. And not hiding that, but really sharing that with our community, sharing it with our law enforcement stakeholders, sharing it with the court. They're all part of our community and we all have to work together to make this happen. It's too important not to.  [00:36:20] Crystal Fincher: It really is. Now you have an opponent who has done some of the things that you haven't been willing to do. He has sought and received endorsements from police unions and from public safety organizations, has taken seemingly a more hard-line and punitive approach - focused a lot on punishment and does not seem to be welcoming diversion to the degree that you do. And just seems to have a completely different perspective. Why, if you're talking to voters, why should they choose you? And what is at stake in this race?  [00:37:04] Leesa Manion: I think the thing that is at stake is that we have this opportunity right now to continue to build this justice system that we should all be proud of. Right now, we have earned a national reputation of being fair, just, and effective. But that doesn't mean that we're perfect, it doesn't mean that we don't have work to do, it doesn't mean that everyone trusts us. So we have an opportunity to build trust. I'm someone who's been doing this work for a very long time. I can hit the ground running, I'm a 'Yes, and...' thinker, representation matters - my lived experience matters. If elected, I would be the first woman and the first person of color to hold this seat, and my perspective and my community involvement and the way I build broad coalitions and the way I collaborate matter. And I think that's why people should vote for me because we have this common ground of wanting things to be fair. We want to feel safe where we work, live, and play. We want to be the community that gives young people a second chance. We want to be a community where victims feel safe, and come forward, and report, and ask for help. We want to be a community that is in this together working toward a common goal.  [00:38:27] Crystal Fincher: Well, thank you so much for spending the time with us today. We will include links to your website for people who are looking for more information and information about your campaign. And just appreciate you taking time to help us get to know you better.  [00:38:41] Leesa Manion: Well, thank you so much, Crystal. Thank you for having me - this was a pleasure and it was a great conversation. Thank you so much.  [00:38:49] Crystal Fincher: I thank you all for listening to Hacks & Wonks on KVRU 105.7 FM. The producer of Hacks & Wonks is Lisl Stadler with assistance from Shannon Cheng. You can find me on Twitter @finchfrii, spelled F-I-N-C-H-F-R-I-I. Now you can follow Hacks & Wonks on iTunes, Spotify, or wherever else you get your podcasts - just type "Hacks & Wonks" into the search bar. Be sure to subscribe to get our Friday almost-live shows and our midweek show delivered to your podcast feed. If you like us, leave a review wherever you listen to Hacks & Wonks. You can also get a full transcript of this episode and links to the resources referenced in the show at officialhacksandwonks.com and in the episode notes.  Thanks for tuning in - we'll talk to you next time.

Shaunestte talks with Lee Buckingham, Prosecuting Attorney for Hamilton County. The Indiana primary election is May 3rd and Lee is running for re-election. They discuss how the population in Hamilton County has grown over the years and the work that Lee's office has done to support public safety efforts and serve its residents. Lee joined the Hamilton County Prosecuting Attorney's Office in 1995 as a Deputy Prosecuting Attorney. And has spent the bulk of his first 16 years with the office handling major felony cases from financial and property crimes to violent offenses like rape, child molesting, burglary, robbery, and murder. Since 2011 Lee has been leading the Hamilton County Prosecuting Attorneys Office as the elected Prosecuting Attorney. The population has grown from approximately 274,000 to over 350,000 today. Despite the monumental growth and change, one thing has not changed. Hamilton County has remained a wonderful and very safe place to live, often ranked as one of the top places in the nation to live.Host- Shaunestte TerrellGuest- D. Lee Buckingham II, Hamilton County Prosecutor