Podcast appearances and mentions of tom wilde

Welcome to Insurance Covered, the podcast that covers everything insurance. In this episode Peter is joined by Tom Wilde, CEO of Indico Data and in this episode they discuss the importance of having high quality data. In this episode we cover:The importance of good data for making informed decisions in insurance.The role of AI in revolutionising data processing and making data more useable and accessible.The need for insurers to leverage better data for competitive advantage.The importance of having a data strategy in place.How good data can positively impact insurance (underwriting decisions, reserving).We hope you enjoyed this episode, if you did please subscribe to be notified when new episodes release. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Fresh from InsurTech Connect 2024, where the industry gathered to discuss insurance innovation's past, present, and future, host Joshua R. Hollander brings you a special episode revisiting our three most downloaded episodes of the last year: Tom Wilde, CEO of Indico - At the forefront of bringing AI and automation to insurance workflows Suri Bhavan, Partner at William Blair - A leading investment banker tracking where money is flowing in insurtech Michael Nadel, Senior Director at Simon-Kutcher & Partners - A strategic consultant helping companies price and scale their solutions While these leaders view the industry through different lenses, they align on several key points: Insurance is only in the "third inning" of digital transformation Data is becoming the key differentiator in insurance, but most companies struggle to utilize it effectively The industry needs to balance innovation with practical implementation They also offer contrasting perspectives on critical issues: The readiness of AI for insurance (Wilde argues it's ready now, while others suggest a more measured approach) The future of insurance distribution (differing views on the role of traditional channels versus digital-first approaches) How to prioritize innovation investments (varying perspectives on what should come first: customer experience, middle office, or core systems) Key Insights: The evolution of AI in insurance, from mobile transformation to middle-office automation The role of deep learning and large language models in handling unstructured data Challenges in integrating new technologies into legacy systems and how to overcome them The importance of pricing strategy and market entry for insurtech startups The intersection of Insurtech and Fintech: automating payments, claims processing, and beyond The role of data in shaping the future of cyber insurance and climate risk management Key Topics Covered: [00:05] Intelligent intake challenges in insurance operations  [03:42] Evolution from PDF scraping to AI-driven processing  [07:12] The role of generative AI in insurance  [10:18] Investment trends in insurtech  [14:08] Insurtech-fintech convergence  [15:21] Data's role in new insurance products  [17:03] Tech-enabled MGAs and market evolution  [18:40] State of insurance digitization  [21:06] Growth strategy pillars  [23:03] Insurance pricing considerations  [27:07] Market entry strategies  Notable Quotes: "In insurance, data has always been king. But today, the challenge is turning unstructured data into fuel for decision-making." - Tom Wilde "The big breakthrough in AI is its ability to handle context. That's why large language models are changing the game." - Tom Wilde "I think by and large, digitization is still in the third inning for most carriers... When you get to life with annuities, that's probably first inning in terms of actual digitization." - Suri Bhavan "We're just starting to see the convergence of Insurtech and Fintech, especially in areas like payments and claims automation." - Suri Bhavan "Pricing is really just a measure of value, the same way that a foot is a measure of distance. When you're pricing your products, it's really all about what the customer values in this product and matching that value to the price relationship." - Michael Nadel "If you're leaving pricing to chance, you're leaving money on the table." - Michael Nadel About Our Guests: Tom Wilde: CEO of Indico, Tom has over 25 years of experience in solving complex digital content problems and is an expert in applying AI and machine learning to insurance workflows. Suri Bhavan: A partner at William Blair, Suri focuses on technology companies operating in the insurtech space, advising them on mergers, acquisitions, and public offerings. Michael Nadel: Senior Director at Simon-Kutcher & Partners. Michael specializes in growth strategies and pricing for insurance carriers and insurtech firms.   Resources: Tom Wilde https://www.linkedin.com/in/tomwilde/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/indico-data-solutions/  Suri Bhavan https://www.linkedin.com/in/bhavan-suri-074113/ https://www.linkedin.com/company/william-blair-company/  Michael Nadel  https://www.linkedin.com/in/michael-nadel-13656123/  https://www.linkedin.com/company/simon-kucher/  Josh Hollander https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshuarhollander/ https://www.horton-usa.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/showcase/insurtech-leadership-show/ https://www.insurtechassociation.org/ https://innsure.org/ 

“This economy we are heading into [...] we are referring to as the decision economy”.  Robin Merttens spoke to Tom Wilde, CEO of Indico Data on how the company's intelligent intake solution is shaping the decision-making process in the insurance industry by structuring unstructured data.  Data is important in our current 'decision economy'. Indico Data applies generative AI to help insurance companies handle complex and high-volume data challenges, particularly in commercial and specialty lines.  Covering the AI hype cycle, the concept of hallucinations and avoiding hyperbole, tune in to hear Tom Wilde discuss generative AI and why it is an important language for insurers to utilise. Key talking points: Founded by undergraduates - how Indico Data started In the hype cycle - avoiding hyperbole and thinking rationally Defining generative AI - not an application but a language Indico Data's role in the insurance industry - the data problem Programmed with the user in mind Specialising in commercial insurance Indico Data's decision to enter the UK market - and off-siding with some football anecdotes If you like what you're hearing, please leave us a review on whichever platform you use or contact Matthew Grant on LinkedIn. To find out more about InsTech, our membership and offerings visit www.instech.co or contact us hello@instech.co Continuing Professional Development This InsTech Podcast Episode is accredited by the Chartered Insurance Institute (CII). By listening, you can claim up to 0.5 hours towards your CPD scheme. By the end of this podcast, you should be able to meet the following Learning Objectives: Specify why capturing the right data as quickly and as accurately as possible is significant in insurance, to drive correct decision making Explain the term hype cycle and what this means in terms of generative AI Summarise what companies have to focus on when entering a new market If your organisation is a member of InsTech and you would like to receive a quarterly summary of the CPD hours you have earned, visit the Episode 292 page of the InsTech website or email cpd@instech.co to let us know you have listened to this podcast. To help us measure the impact of the learning, we would be grateful if you would take a minute to complete a quick feedback survey.

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.   In this episode, Justin interviews Davis Hake, Co-Founder of Resilience, about his career in national security work, including working with former Congressman Langevin, Homeland Security, and Obama's National Security staff. Davis tells about co-founding Resilience in the private sector to help organizations build cybercrime resilience. He introduces the Resilience Midyear 2023 Claims Report, revealing important trends discovered in cybercrime through claims data, Reliance research, and partner research.   Davis closes the interview with a look to 2024, his plans for pushing the flywheel faster, and his analysis of what it will take to break the new cybercrime business model.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:27] About today's episode, where we will discuss cyber security trends from Resilience's Midyear 2023 Claims Report. [:36] First, a quick shoutout to the RIMS New Zealand Pacific Island Chapter and Marsh Australia and New Zealand, who welcome you to Embrace The Unknown: Unleashing the Power of Risk, a one-day event on February 12, 2024 at the Pullman Hotel in Auckland, NZ. [1:00] It will be a gathering of experts, thought leaders, and professionals from various industries to explore and discuss the critical role of risk management in today's dynamic and uncertain world. There will be sessions on AI, Resilience, and Adaptability, highlighted by case studies and insights. See the link in this episode's show notes.  [1:21] It's never too early to talk about RISKWORLD 2024! Save the date, May 5th–8th, 2024 in sunny San Diego, California. Booth and sponsorship sales are open. Member registration opens this month, November 2023 and public registration opens in December 2023. Visit RIMS.org/RISKWORLD to learn all about it. [1:51] Our guest today, Davis Hake, is the Co-Founder of Resilience, which recently released its Midyear 2023 Claims Report. They say ransomware is entering a new era as cybercriminals have begun shifting their tactics to bypass security controls by hitting critical vendors and seeking larger targets for extortions. [2:14] They're big game hunting again and we're going to talk all about it with Davis Hake. Davis had a fascinating career in government and we will learn about that, as well. [2:33] Davis Hake, welcome to RIMScast! This episode was recorded in October, National Cybersecurity Awareness Month, but as Davis says, every month is National Cybersecurity Awareness Month! [3:18] Davis grew up working in politics on the Hill, for Congressman Jim Langevin. Congressman Langevin was one of the first on the Hill to identify we had serious problems in our critical infrastructure in everything from power plants to communication. At about that time, Stuxnet became a public concern. [3:50] Congressman Langevin dove into looking at what we need to do as a nation to secure these larger problems. He realized cyber is an economic problem of incentives, cost, and how businesses manage their digital innovation. He set Davis on a path to be passionate about trying to fix it. [4:14] Davis worked for a time in the Obama administration for the National Security Council. He came to the private sector to work in cybersecurity and got together with his Co-Founders to build something that would take this technical problem to understand a company's risk and how they invest against it. [4:41] They looked at the insurance industry for how to drive better risk management practices and applied RM to cyber. They started in 2016. Now, in 2023, they have an amazing insurance team with some of the best folks in the industry, serving clients in the U.S., the EU, and the UK with close to 200 staff members. [5:32] Davis praises former Congressman Langevin for his intense concern about national security, not as a politician but as one who served not only his constituents but the nation. He worked across the aisle to serve the national good. Most importantly, he got things done. [6:18] Congressman Langevin left Congress in 2023. Before he left, he worked on the Cyber Solarium Commission, helped establish the office of the National Cyber Director, and helped establish some of the authorities that allowed DHS to build CISA. Congressman Langevin has retired to work on issues in the state of Rhode Island. [7:43] Resilience's Midyear 2023 Claims Report covers events from January through June of 2023. They wanted to report the data with actionable analysis on top of it. Besides Resilience claims data, they analyzed public data from other organizations to understand Resilience's data in the context of the broader cybercrime trends. [9:08] Third-party vendor risk has always been a concern. The change is that fewer and fewer companies are paying extortions to ransomware actors. So now groups are targeting critical vendors and running data extortions with thousands of victims. They don't encrypt. Resilience clients have filed incident reports on these attacks from Clop. [9:47] How do you protect against vendor risk? Risk transfer through cyber insurance is so important. Don't just look at the risk mitigation side, but also the risks out of your control. Insurance helps absorb environmental risks. With vendors, you can require that they prove verification from certain audits, like the SOC 2 Audit. [10:30] You can have vendors tell you best practices they follow with other clients. Are they practicing what they're preaching with their data security? You can limit the data you share with them. By just working with any vendor, which we all have to do, you are assuming their risk if they're holding your data and they're not your company. [11:22] The ransomware criminal marketplace is a bunch of startups, taking the easiest path to revenue. Running a negotiation, locking up a company, and ensuring that you get access to their backups all take a lot of time. [11:52] It is easier to target companies that have highly sensitive data they wouldn't want exposed and threaten to release it. Resilience sees a lower rate of payment for these types of attacks but those who pay, end up paying large amounts. The Moveit attack and following attacks are estimated to have made Clop around $100 million. [12:44] The Resilience report discusses data from other groups that show less than 40% of encryption victims are paying ransom, down from 80% in 2022. Resilience works to prepare their clients against ransomware attacks and about 15% of their clients attacked by ransomware pay the ransom. That number has gone down since 2022. [15:06] Resilience helps clients to imagine the worst day for their clients. Let's work backward to ensure that the worst day doesn't happen. That thinking has been core in helping companies reduce paying extortions. When executives pay extortions, it's usually in a panic, thinking they can make this worst day immediately go away. [15:49] If criminal groups have access to your data, they will do everything they can to use it against you. Prepare to protect that data in a way that is incredibly secure or resilient or make your organization resilient to this type of pressure. That's the best thing you can do to limit financial loss and protect your customers from their worst day. [16:21] RIMS plug time! Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops to see the full calendar. December 7th starts the three-part course, Leveraging Data and Analytics for Continuous Risk Management, which will be led by our friend Pat Saporito. [16:42] Fundamentals of Insurance returns on December 12th and 13th. It will be led by our good friend Gail Kyomura. Information about these sessions and others is on the RIMS Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [16:59] Metrics That Matter has cyber on their minds with Enhance Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program on November 7th. CLARA Analytics makes its RIMS debut on November 9th with Risk Management in the Era of Artificial Intelligence. [17:22] On November 16th, Nationwide returns to present U.S. Customs Surety Bonds: A Primer for Risk Professionals. On November 21st, Beazley returns to present Business Risk: Helping Your Executives to Navigate Today's Volatile Risk Environment. [17:41] On December 12th, Prepare Yourself for the New Generation of Risk with Riskonnect. On December 14th, Aon will be Addressing Today's Risks While Preparing for the Risks of Tomorrow. [17:54] Visit RIMS.org/Webinars to learn more about these webinars and to register! Links are in the show notes. Webinar registration is complimentary for RIMS members. [19:01] After the Colonial Pipeline attack, the U.S. security establishment got much more serious about ransomware. Defense against cybercrime was something that had been left up to the private sector. The administration started to take cybercrime seriously and cooperate with industry, working with CISA and the FBI heavily to fight back. [19:48] When the War in Ukraine happened, the cooperation between the public and private sectors in the fight against ransomware intensified. As organizations have become more resilient against paying extortion, cybercriminals have to go after the big guys to get a payment. Cybercrime is indiscriminate between industries it targets. [20:29] In Q1, 2023 there was a tide of cybercrime targeting healthcare organizations. In Q2, there was a big tide against manufacturing organizations. Clop then hit a few vendors for educational organizations. Organizations like MGM and Caesar's which were hit, have massive networks full of devices they monitor, with different networks. [21:13] MGM refused to pay, while Caesar's paid the extortion. The reporting shows that Caesar's has had an easier road to recovery. It may make more economic sense for large companies to pay the extortion. But that's a bad message. That's what has Resilience concerned. More complex clients, though better defended, are likely to pay. [22:02] Groups like Clop are choosy about their targets and prioritize large organizations with a lot to lose. To successfully defend cyber in an enterprise, all the tech teams must work together and not remain siloed. Incentives have to come from the top that get the CIO, Risk, and Finance planning budgets together. It's how your team works together. [23:06] Davis served briefly on the National Security staff in the Obama Administration after working in Homeland Security. [23:22] After the Obama Administration, a lot of the National Security staff moved to the private sector. Some continued to fight the security fight. The CEO of Resilience is a part-time Reservist working in Cyberdefense. He sees the national-level mission and the larger cyber trends. [24:18] Most insurance is not operational; it's reactionary, working with prior data to price the risk. In cyber, you're too late if you're taking that approach. Resilience has a threat intelligence team, taking in data much faster than a traditional insurance organization. [25:07] Resilience is standing up a team that is working to provide technical analysis and trend analysis. They will show the large trends and the reasons they are happening, and validation from Resilience data and partner data. They're combining financial loss and impact with threat intelligence they are monitoring from the security team. [26:59] Davis says the tactic of encryptionless distortion is an evolution of the cybercrime business model, making it more efficient and effective. It's a call to action for security. Building better widgets will not out-innovate these guys. We have to build better strategies and better business models that take their business models down. [27:28] Resilience is working to build a better resilient flywheel, with insurance, visibility, and working with clients to address that will ultimately lead to lower financial loss for clients and the Resilience insurance company. They want to push the flywheel faster and faster until they can get inside the adversary's business model. [28:03] Special thanks again to Davis Hake for joining us on RIMScast. The link to the Midyear Report is in this episode's show notes. [28:13] Go to the App Store and download the RIMS App. This is a special members-only benefit. Everybody loves the RIMS App! [28:37] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are in our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [29:21] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [29:46] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [30:02] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and in print, and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager at RIMS. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [30:25] Thank you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe!   Mentioned in this Episode: Riskworld 2024 — San Diego, CA | May 5–8, 2024 Embrace The Unknown: Unleashing the Power of Risk | Hosted Live & In-Person by RIMS NZ & PI | Feb 12, 2024 | Register early to save 18%​: Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus Grant RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App Resilience Midyear 2023 Claims Report RIMS Webinars: Enhance Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program | Sponsored by Metrics That Matter | Nov. 7, 2023 Risk Management in the Era of Artificial Intelligence | Sponsored by CLARA Analytics | Nov. 9, 2023 An Introduction to U. S. Custom Surety Bonds | Sponsored by Nationwide | Nov. 16, 2023 Business Risk: Helping your Executives Navigate Today's Volatile Risk Environment | Sponsored by Beazley | Nov. 21, 2023 Prepare Yourself for the New Generation of Risk | Sponsored by Riskonnect | Dec. 12, 2023 Addressing Today's Risks While Preparing for Tomorrow | Sponsored by Aon | Dec. 14, 2023 RIMS.org/Webinars Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Leveraging Data and Analytics for Continuous Risk Management | Dec 7 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops All RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops — Including Chris Mandel's Dec 13–14 Course Related RIMScast Episodes: “Cybersecurity Awareness Month 2023 with Pamela Hans of Anderson Kill” “Cybersecurity Reporting Updates with Hilary Tuttle of Risk Management Magazine” “Cybersecurity and Insurance Outlook 2023 with Josephine Wolff” “Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data” “Getting to Know Jackware with Dan Healy of Anderson Kill” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Cyclone Season: Proactive Preparation for Loss Minimization” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. (New!) “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL   RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Darius Delon! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council   RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts.   Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   About our guest Davis Hake Co-Founder of Resilience   Tweetables (Edited For Social Media Use): Instead of encryption for ransom, it is easier to target companies that have highly sensitive data they wouldn't want to be exposed and threaten to release it. — Davis Hake   Most insurance is not operational; it's reactionary, working with past data to price the risk. In cyber, you're too late if you're taking that approach. — Davis Hake   The current tactic of encryptionless distortion is an evolution of the cybercrime business model, making it more efficient and effective. It's a call to action for security. — Davis Hake    

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society. In this episode, Justin interviews Chris Mandel on his career highlights and service award, being RIMS President, how the tone of the profession has changed, and how ERM has evolved. They explore why having an organizational ERM group is still a tough sell. They discuss Chris's sessions in the upcoming RIMS ERM Conference 2023 on November 2, with one session in the morning and one in the afternoon, and what members can expect when they attend. They wrap up the discussion with thoughts on the RIMS-CRMP Virtual Workshop on December 13 and 14 and some insights into Chris's popular ERM LinkedIn Group.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:14] Register for the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held in Denver, Colorado on November 2nd–3rd. RIMS will also host an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena in Denver on November 1st. Limited seating is available. Visit RIMS.org/ERM to register and listen to this episode to hear the code for 10% off your registration! [:41] About today's episode on all things ERM with former RIMS President, Chris Mandel. [1:01] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! If you will be attending RISKWORLD 2024 in San Diego, California, take a moment to sign up as a volunteer judge on the panel of risk professionals in the Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024. [1:27] The top three teams will be awarded cash prizes and recognized at the Spencer reception and during the RISKWORLD Conference Finale. This is our annual international six-month-long university student competition. Full details can be found on the Spencer website at Spencered.org. [1:44] The application period closes on October 31st, 2023. Get involved; participate. We hope to see you at RISKWORLD! [1:53] The RIMS Legislative Summit is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to register. [2:04] The RIMS ERM Conference 2023 will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado. On November 1st, RIMS is hosting an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena, where the Denver Nuggets and Denver Avalanche play. There is limited seating. Register at RIMS.org/ERM2023. At checkout, type code 2023RIMSCAST for 10% off registration! [2:52] The ERM Conference 2023 will be different than years past. We've got some great changes. Book your travel plans now! RIMS will host a Post-conference Workshop for the RIMS CRMP from 9:00 to 4:00 MT on November 4th and 5th. Save $100 when you register for the conference and workshop in one transaction. Links are in the notes. [3:23] Chris Mandel is well-known in the risk management community and among RIMS members. He served as RIMS President in 2002 and received the Harry and Dorothy Goodell Award for outstanding service and achievement in the risk management discipline in 2016. He's had a wonderful career that seems to go on and on! [3:48] Check out the link and listen to the RIMS Risk Leaders series episode I did with Chris a few years back. Chris is also the President and Managing Consultant for Excellence in Risk Management, an LLC based in Tennessee. He's here today to discuss all things ERM. [4:11] Chris will lead two sessions at the RIMS ERM Conference 2023 in Denver, CO on November 2nd. In the morning, he will lead “The Value Proposition and Process for Operationalizing Risk Appetite Strategies and Frameworks.” [4:28] In the afternoon, Chris, with leaders from HUB International, will co-lead a 45-minute session titled, “Nerd-Out on Numbers: Why Analytics Are Key to Extraordinary ERM.” Chris will also be leading a RIMS CRMP Virtual Workshop on December 13th and 14th. He just can't quit risk management and we're all better for it! [4:55] Justin welcomes Chris Mandel to RIMScast. Chris was RIMS President in 2002–2003. Chris spent the first half of his career in traditional risk management in large corporations. In the first part of this century, Chris was asked to create an ERM strategy and ultimately became Chief Risk Officer for USAA in San Antonio, for 10 years. [6:02] That was where Chris's career became more progressive. Chris was on the RIMS board for seven years, was Risk Manager of the Year in 2004, and received the Goodell Award in 2016 for lifetime achievement. He has retired twice but he can't seem to stop. He has a consulting firm specializing in ERM. [6:27] Chris spent eight years doing strategic work for Sedgwick. He is on the faculty at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University, where he teaches ERM. ERM is a key aspect of his skillset. The risk discipline is advancing and maturing, so there's never a dull moment. [7:41] The risk management profession has changed since 2002. In 2002, risk managers were focused on insurable risk. The Enron debacle raised the question of whether risk was being managed effectively in a lot of companies. Risk management became an explorative discipline of embracing risk and exploring the ERM version of the discipline. [8:53] Chris calls the years since 2002 a time of expanding, exploring, and innovation until now when we are executing on things that were more conceptual in the past, employing progressive tactics and strategies to manage an ever-expanding landscape of risk for organizations that are increasingly being challenged by risks. [9:29] ERM is constantly maturing. RIMS has published its second ERM maturity model. It's recognition of getting to a level of maturity where we might accomplish some other objectives that might push this more from a discipline into a profession. Risk professionals need recognition in their organizations so they can influence decisions. [10:17] Organizations are discovering the need for robust ERM and how it adds value in risktech and insuretech. If you ignore rare risks, and they blow up in your face, you get asked, “How did you miss that?” ERM is coalescing into an issue for serious practitioners who want to rise in the ranks to be more influential in their organizations. [12:30] There are still detractors who believe all you need to worry about is how you insure the organization. They believe that as long as nothing uninsured blows up in their faces. Then they believe in ERM. [12:45] Chris will present “The Value Proposition and Process for Operationalizing Risk Appetite Strategies and Frameworks” at RIMS ERM Conference 2023. Chris just co-authored a paper on risk appetite in financial institutions that is being considered for publication in a journal of risk management for banking. [14:16] The presentation is to convince the audience that even if you're not in financial services, there's good reason why you want to manage risk to risk appetite. That's a simple way to state what can be a very complicated approach and process. How can you manage risk if you don't know how much risk you're able to take or need to take? [15:14] Chris will be presenting with Barry Franklin, former CRO for Zurich North America who is an actuary. [15:31] In the afternoon, Chris, with leaders from HUB International, will co-lead a 45-minute session titled, “Nerd-Out on Numbers: Why Analytics Are Key to Extraordinary ERM.” Jeff Guttman and Chrystina Howard from HUB International, Client Analytics and ERM, had asked Chris to join them on this presentation. [15:53] The session focuses on the evolution from total cost of risk (TCOR) to applying concepts and tools that get risk quantification done in a more robust way and move beyond just those things that are insurable. A lot of people are still skeptical about that. That's one reason risk appetite frameworks and strategies are not always adopted. [16:28] There will be some compelling arguments presented about some ways in which risk can be quantified that people may never have been exposed to. If you thought strategic risk was unquantifiable, you're wrong. Strategic risk has been shown to be the most destructive kind of risk, over financial, operational, legal, and compliance risks. [17:16] These two sessions dovetail nicely for Chris. They are hot topics for him, what he teaches at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University, and what he practices in his consulting. [17:32] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. Justin is pleased, humbled, and excited to announce that RIMS and RIMScast have won the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award on October 24, 2023, from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! [18:18] On Friday, November 10th, from 10 to 11, NYSAE is presenting a virtual program called ”Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association.” Justin is honored to be one of the panelists. A link is in this episode's notes. [18:35] Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops to see the full calendar. Our friend Elise Farnham returns on October 24th and 25th to lead the two-day course Fundamentals of Risk Management. [18:56] Our friend Chris Hansen was recently on RIMScast. He will be leading Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the US on November 7th and 8th. Be sure to register for that course! Information about these sessions and others is on the RIMS Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [19:27] On October 26th, our friends from Zurich North America return to present PFAS Forever Chemicals – Regulations, Litigation, New Technologies. On October 31st, Resolver returns to present Building Your Business Case for GRC Software in 2024. [19:51] Metrics That Matter has Enhanced Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program on November 7. On November 21st, Beazley returns to present Business Risk: Helping Your Executives to Navigate Today's Volatile Risk Environment. [20:11] There is a lot of great educational content for you in the next month! Visit RIMS.org/Webinars to learn more about these webinars and to register! Links are in the show notes. Webinar registration is complimentary for RIMS members. [20:38] Even in college, Chris was deathly afraid of public speaking. For the last 15 or 20 years, it seems all he has done is talk to audiences. As RIMS President, he talked to conference audiences in the thousands. He traveled the world talking to chapters and regional conferences. It's almost 2nd nature to him now. It's what he loves doing. [22:05] Chris brings that same feeling to a RIMS ERM 45-minute session on numbers as well as to an address. He makes it concise and engaging. He plans it as a conversation with the audience, including questions. [23:46] Chris will be leading a RIMS-CRMP Virtual Workshop on December 13th and 14th. Chris was in the first 200 to take the RIMS-CRMP as soon as he qualified for it. He felt he needed it if he was going to keep speaking on risk. There were no preparatory materials at the time but he passed. Now there are the Virtual Workshops to help you. [24:55] Chris tells us how to be better prepared for the RIMS-CRMP examination. It's a reflection of experience and knowledge that goes way beyond the surface. It's designed to cause people to think. People need to properly prepare for it to get through it. CRMP reflects, more than anything, the advancement of the discipline closer to a profession. [26:24] You can't memorize the CRMP test. The test changes every time around. You're learning core concepts in the workshop. The RIMS-CRMP is about what you've put into practice over the years; it's an attempt to measure the depth of your experience, knowledge, and skills. [26:44] Chris uses interaction in his presentation of the RIMS-CRMP Virtual Workshop. It's a combination of lecture and group exercises that keep people engaged throughout. Chris teaches it at the university or master's level. [27:40] Chris created an ERM LinkedIn group in 2004 or 2005. See the link in the show notes. It has around 51,000 members from around the world. Chris blocks people who try to sell things or present topics that do not relate to risk management. Justin is going to post a link to this episode on the group. Any ERM enthusiast can learn from Chris. [31:03] Chris Mandel will be at the RIMS ERM Conference 2023 in Denver, Colorado on November 2nd. The first session he's going to do is 60 minutes, called “The Value Proposition and Process for Operationalizing Risk Appetite Strategies and Frameworks.” [31:19] In the afternoon, Chris, with leaders from HUB International, will co-lead a  45-minute session titled, “Nerd-Out on Numbers: Why Analytics Are Key to Extraordinary ERM.” [31:26] Chris has always been supportive of Justin's work at RIMS. Justin thanks Chris for joining RIMScast. [31:41] Special thanks to former RIMS President, Chris Mandel for joining us on RIMScast. He'll be leading sessions at the RIMS ERM Conference on November 2nd and 3rd and he will be leading the RIMS-CRMP Prep Virtual Workshop on December 13th and 14th. See links in this episode's show notes. [32:02] Go to the App Store and download the RIMS App. This is a special members-only benefit. Justin spoke with Chris Mandel a few years ago about some challenges he overcame during his career as part of the RIMS Risk Leaders audio series. That episode is now on the RIMS App so go check it out! Everybody loves the RIMS app! [32:38] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are in our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [33:19] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [33:43] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [33:59] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and in print, and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager at RIMS. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [34:21] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe!   Mentioned in this Episode: RIMS ERM Conference 2023 | Nov 2–3 in Denver, CO! Enter 2023RIMSCAST at checkout for 10% off registration! RIMS Legislative Summit — Oct 25 & 26, Washington, D.C. Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus Grant Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024 — Be a Case Study or Join Judging Panel! RIMScast to receive the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! “NYSAE Webinar: Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association” ERM Group on LinkedIn RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Chris Mandel: RIMS Risk Leaders Series (Audio Interview About Major Risks & Career Highlights) Chris Mandel Receives RIMS' Top Honors (Risk Management Monitor, 2016) NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App RIMS Webinars: PFAS Forever Chemicals — Regulations, Litigation, New Technologies | Sponsored by Zurich | Oct. 26, 2023 Building Your Business Case for GRC Software in 2024 | Sponsored by Resolver | Oct. 31, 2023 Enhance Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program | Sponsored by Metrics That Matter | Nov. 7, 2023 Business Risk: Helping your Executives Navigate Today's Volatile Risk Environment | Sponsored by Beazley | Nov. 21, 2023 RIMS.org/Webinars Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Fundamentals of Risk Management | Oct 24–25 Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability and Employment Practices in the US | Nov 7 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops All RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops— Including Chris Mandel's Dec 13–14 Course Related RIMScast Episodes: “Harnessing Innovation's Promise with ERM Conference Keynote Bob Roitblat” “ERM in Banking & Finance with Eleni Willis” “The Future of AI and Work with Sinead Bovell” “Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data” “Live from the RIMS ERM Conference 2022” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Cyclone Season: Proactive Preparation for Loss Minimization” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. (New!) “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council   Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts.   Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   About our guest, Chris Mandel President and Managing Consultant ExcelinRisk.com Excellence in Risk Management, LLC, Nashville, Tennessee   Tweetables (Edited For Social Media Use): I spent the first half of my career in traditional risk management with companies like Verizon, The Red Cross, Marsh, and Pepsico. In the early part of the new century,  I was asked to create an ERM strategy and became CRO for USAA. That's where I turned my career. — Chris Mandel   You can't ignore the “black swans,” infrequent as they are, because as soon as you do, they're going to blow up in your face, and then you're going to get that question nobody likes, which is, “How did you miss that!?” — Chris Mandel   The test changes every time around. They're learning core concepts in the workshop. The RIMS-CRMP is about what you've put into practice over the years because it is an attempt to measure the depth of your experience, knowledge, and skills. — Chris Mandel  

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society. In this episode, Justin interviews Pamela Hans of Anderson Kill on the many aspects of Cybersecurity, including who is responsible for it. (If you have a networked device, it's you!) The discussion covers the effects of the new SEC ruling requiring many companies to report a cybersecurity event within four days of discovering that a material event has occurred, and what that means to you and your organization. Justin and Pamela also review her presentation at the RIMS Canada Conference 2023 and how a potential problem became a fun opportunity.   Lots to cover in today's episode. Let's get to it.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:14] Register for the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held in Denver, Colorado on November 2nd–3rd. RIMS will also host an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena in Denver on November 1st. Limited seating is available. Visit RIMS.org/ERM to register and listen to this episode to hear the code for 10% off your registration! [:41] About today's episode on cybersecurity and presentation skills with Pamela Hans of Anderson Kill. [1:01] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! Would you like funding to hire a risk management intern in 2024? If so, take a moment to apply for a Spencer Internship Grant. The application form will close on October 15th. The link is in this episode's notes. [1:28] If you will be attending RISKWORLD 2024 in San Diego, California, take a moment to sign up as a volunteer judge in the Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024. This is our annual international student competition. Full details can be found on the Spencer website at Spencered.org. Get involved; participate. We want to see you there! [1:52] Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to register for The RIMS Legislative Summit, which is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. [2:04] The RIMS ERM Conference 2023 will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado. On November 1st, RIMS is hosting an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena, where the Denver Nuggets and Denver Avalanche play. There is limited seating. Register at RIMS.org/ERM2023. At checkout, type code 2023RIMSCAST for 10% off registration! [2:52] The ERM Conference 2023 will be different than years past. We've got some great changes. Book your travel plans now! RIMS will host a Post-conference Workshop for the RIMS CRMP from 9:00 to 4:00 MT on November 4th and 5th. Save $100 when you register for the conference and workshop in one transaction. Links are in the notes. [3:24] It is October; it's cybersecurity awareness month in the U.S. and several other areas of the world and that's why I'm so excited to introduce our guest, Pamela Hans, managing shareholder of the Philadelphia office of the law firm Anderson Kill. She focuses on insurance coverage, which includes cyber. [3:45] We're going to talk about cyber trends. I met Pamela at the RIMS Canada Conference in Ottawa last month where she was delivering a session on “Getting the Deal Done.” We're also going to hear her tips on how to handle the curveballs that might be thrown at you ahead of a live presentation and how to turn them into opportunities. [4:16] Justin met Pamela Hans of Anderson Kill on the last day of the RIMS Canada Conference 2023 when she was hosting a session. Pamela knows cybersecurity and October is National Cybersecurity Awareness Month in the U.S. [5:57] The trend of the phone calls Pamela gets is all about ransomware. A threat actor freezes up the system, completely takes control, and demands a ransom in return for a description key. But the trend in cybersecurity is data breaches to steal personal data. Recently Topgolf, Freecycle, Forever21, Duolingo, and Discord.io suffered breaches. [6:41] Those are just a few examples of cybersecurity incidents where personal sensitive data has been grabbed by the threat actor, with threats to use the data to do more damage to the individuals whose data was taken. [7:03] Pamela has also seen distributed denial of service attacks. The army of bots seems to be increasing in number while the cost is decreasing to rent a bot to execute a distributed denial of service attack. [7:50] When there is an exfiltration of personal data, that data can be used by the threat actor to do more damage to the individuals by impersonating the user and fraud. [8:29] Pamela addresses the SEC rules on the disclosure of cybersecurity events and the annual obligation imposed on publicly traded and registered companies to disclose their cybersecurity governance. That has an impact on the company and its stock price. The public may then decide which companies to trust by their cybersecurity protocols. [9:30] Justin refers to the RIMScast episode with Hilary Tuttle on the SEC cybersecurity reporting rules. They discussed the four-day reporting rule. Four days after the company finds out they were attacked in a material fashion they have to report the breach. [10:09] Pamela notes that a material breach is one that investors would want to know about before investing in the company, as the breach may affect the value of the stock and the company. This is an important SEC rule on cybersecurity governance. [11:41] Risk professionals should be asking questions about this rule now. Prepare to make these required reports. Run tabletop exercises with your response team. Ascertain now what “material,” in the cyber context, looks like to your company. Getting ready now is important, for when you experience a cybersecurity event. [13:23] Pamela speaks about the need for cybersecurity awareness. Any individual can be the gateway to a cybersecurity event. Everyone who has a device needs to be aware of cybersecurity risks to help prevent infiltration by cybercriminals of our phones, laptops, and businesses. [14:54] Cybersecurity is as simple as multi-factor authentication. Don't give away your passwords. Be thinking about cybersecurity, Don't click on the puppy dog. [15:58] Justin presents a special message from Bob Roitblat in case you missed his RIMScast episode. [16:16] Bob Roitblat is excited to be the keynote speaker for the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, in Denver, on November 2nd and 3rd. His keynote is “Elevate, Revolutionize, Maximize: Harnessing Innovation's Promise.” Bob reveals what to expect and asks you to bring your “A game,” be ready to ask questions and interact to get value. [17:34] Go to RIMS.org/ERM2023 to register. If you enter the code 2023RIMSCAST at checkout, you will get 10% off your registration! It's value with a discount! Bob looks forward to helping you elevate and evolve your risk management processes and your career! Be there in Denver, November 2nd and 3rd! Links are in the show notes. [18:36] Pamela reviews her career path, with degrees in civil engineering and then law school. She knew she wanted to solve technical problems for companies. Cybersecurity is a natural fit for her background. Cybersecurity is everywhere. [21:07] Pamela foresees two things from these new reporting rules. One will be SEC subpoenas to companies for information about their cybersecurity reporting and governance. Another will be shareholder scrutiny and lawsuits around failure to disclose or poor evaluation of materiality. The rule is self-enforcing through shareholder suits. [22:35] Pamela predicts we'll see more D&O coverage activity because of this rule. Risk professionals need to be looking at that when renewing or placing new D&O coverage, asking their brokers about the impact of the new SEC requirement around disclosure and materiality. Risk managers will need to explain this if there is a subpoena or claim. [23:52] Risk managers also need to be thinking of looking across the entire insurance program, to see which insurance policies may respond in the event of an SEC subpoena or a claim related to disclosure. Now is the time to prepare for what may be coming. [24:40] Pamela says risk professionals need to ask their insurance broker what is new in their policy since last year. Are there new endorsements or policy language? New policy language or endorsements for 2024 will be enormously important. Risk managers should also run tabletop exercises with the insurance pre-approved response team. [26:53] Risk professionals should look at your policies now to see what policies will respond if you have an SEC claim and what the policy limits are. Your policies need to be on paper, not on your computer network, and not named “Cyber Policy 1,” or “Cyber Policy 2,” where threat actors can find and read them on the network. [27:54] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. Justin is pleased, humbled, and excited to announce that RIMS and RIMScast have won the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award on October 24, 2023, from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! [28:41] On Friday, November 10th, from 10 to 11, NYSAE is presenting a virtual program called ”Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association.” Justin is honored to be one of the panelists. A link is in this episode's notes. [28:57] Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops to see the full calendar. Our friend Elise Farnham returns on October 24th and 25th to lead the two-day course Fundamentals of Risk Management. [29:20] Our friend Chris Hansen was recently on RIMScast. He will be leading Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the US on November 7th and 8th. Be sure to register for that course! Information about these sessions and others is on the RIMS Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [29:49] On October 12th, AXA XL returns to present Stand Tall: How to Boost your Cyber Posture Against Creative Cyber Criminals. [30:06] On October 26th, our friends from Zurich return to present a session on PFAS,  Forever Chemicals, and PFAS Litigation. On October 31st, Resolver returns to present Building Your Business Case for GRC Software in 2024. Metrics That Matter has Enhanced Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program on November 7. [30:36] There is a lot of great educational content for you in the next month. Visit RIMS.org/Webinars to learn more about these webinars and to register! Links are in the show notes. Webinar registration is complimentary for RIMS members. [31:08] About Pamela Hans presenting the last session on the last day of the RIMS Canada Conference 2023. The session was “Do You Want to Get the Deal Done? Obstacles and Opportunities in Contract Negotiation.” She had a packed house for the session. She discussed deal-breakers and opportunities. [33:58] You have tools as a risk professional to deal with risk transfer provisions you might not want. The session talked about how to make insurance work for you in this context and how to indemnify a counterparty that is 10,000 times larger than you. How can your insurance respond to make these provisions opportunities, not deal-breakers? [35:03] People left the session with ideas about what to ask their insurance broker and the business side, to know what they should be ready for. [36:09] Pamela was scheduled to present with two co-presenters but neither of them could attend. For Pamela, it was an opportunity to have fun with the people who were in the room. Presentations are better when they are conversations with the people in the room. It was terrific! [38:34] Justin suggests if you are going to present and your co-presenters back out, look at it as an opportunity. If you need additional materials get them from the organization you represent, but be confident you can do 20 minutes by yourself. Open it up to Q&A and that will take care of a lot of dialog. Pamela went past 60 minutes. [39:18] Justin fell asleep twice in the 17-minute flight back to the U.S. He was disappointed the flight attendant didn't wake him! [40:54] Special thanks to Pamela Hans of Anderson Kill for joining us on RIMScast for National Cybersecurity Awareness Month coverage. The session handout from her RIMS Canada Conference session, “Do You Want to Get the Deal Done?” is available via the RIMS Canada Conference 2023 Attendees Service Center. See link in show notes. [41:16] Go to the App Store on your phone and download the RIMS App. This is a special members-only benefit. Everybody loves the RIMS app! [41:36] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are in our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [42:17] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [42:41] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [42:56] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and in print, and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager at RIMS. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [43:17] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe!   Mentioned in this Episode: RIMS ERM Conference 2023 | Nov 2–3 in Denver, CO! Enter 2023RIMSCAST at checkout for 10% off registration! NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App RIMS Legislative Summit — Oct 25 & 26, Washington, D.C. RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus Grant Spencer Educational Foundation — Hire A Risk Intern 2024 | Deadline Oct. 15, 2023 Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024 — Be a Case Study or Join Judging Panel! “Do You Want To Get The Deal Done?” — Session handouts still available via the RIMS Canada Conference Attendee Service Center RIMScast to receive the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! “NYSAE Webinar: Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association” RIMS Webinars: Stand Tall: How to Boost your Cyber Posture Against Creative Cyber Criminals | Sponsored by AXA XL | Oct. 12, 2023 PFAS Forever Chemicals — Regulations, Litigation, New Technologies | Sponsored by Zurich | Oct. 26, 2023 Building Your Business Case for GRC Software in 2024 | Sponsored by Resolver | Oct. 31, 2023 Enhance Decision-Making Across Your Cybersecurity Program | Sponsored by Metrics That Matter | Nov. 7, 2023 RIMS.org/Webinars Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Claims Management | Oct 10–11 Fundamentals of Risk Management | Oct 24–25 Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability and Employment Practices in the US | Nov 7 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual WorkshopsAll RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops Related RIMScast Episodes: “Harnessing Innovation's Promise with ERM Conference Keynote Bob Roitblat” ‘Cybersecurity Reporting Updates with Hilary Tuttle of Risk Management Magazine” “Cybersecurity and Insurance Outlook 2023 with Josephine Wolff” “Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data” “Getting to Know Jackware with Dan Healy of Anderson Kill” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response (New!) “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant (New!) “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL “How to Reduce Lithium-Ion Battery Fire Risks” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Managing Global Geopolitical Risk in 2022 and Beyond” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide   Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts. Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn   About our guest, Pamela Hans LinkedIn Pamela HansSenior Shareholder, Cyber practice Pennsylvania office of Anderson Kill   Tweetables (Edited For Social Media Use): Consumers are giving their personal information to a company they want to do business with and then that company is attacked and the individual's information can be used by the threat actor to do more damage to the individual by way of fraud. — Pamela Hans   A material breach is one that investors would want to have information about that might influence their decision to buy or not to buy a stock, because it may impact the value of the stock and the value of the company going forward.— Pamela Hans   Risk professionals should look at your policies now to understand what policies will respond if you have an SEC claim because of the reporting requirement and what the policy limits are. What are the requirements of notice? — Pamela Hans

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society. Justin is delighted to welcome innovation thought leader Bob Roitblat to RIMScast. Bob is the keynote speaker at RIMS ERM Conference 2023. He speaks about his keynote, “Elevate, Revolutionize, Maximize: Harnessing Innovation's Promise.” Bob shares how innovation ties into strategy and risk, and how you can harness the great potential of innovation through careful strategy and risk management. Bob is an engaging speaker who asks his audience to be prepared to participate and learn. Get set for a dynamic keynote presentation on harnessing innovation's promise for your organization!   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:14] Register for the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held in Denver, Colorado on November 2nd–3rd. RIMS will also host an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena in Denver on November 1st. Limited seating is available. Visit RIMS.org/ERM to register and listen to this episode to hear the code for 10% off your registration! [:41] About today's episode with RIMS ERM Conference 2023 keynote Bob Roitblat. [1:01] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! Would you like funding to hire a risk management intern in 2024? If so, take a moment to apply for a Spencer Internship Grant. The application form will close on October 15th. The link is in this episode's notes. [1:27] If you will be attending RISKWORLD 2024 in San Diego, California, take a moment to sign up as a volunteer judge in the Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024. This is our annual international student competition. Full details can be found on the Spencer website at Spencered.org. Get involved; participate. We want to see you there! [1:51] Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to register for The RIMS Legislative Summit, which is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. [2:03] The RIMS ERM Conference 2023 will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado. On November 1st, RIMS is hosting an ERM-based tour of Ball Arena, where the Denver Nuggets and Denver Avalanche play. There is limited seating. Register at RIMS.org/ERM2023. At checkout, type code 2023RIMSCAST for 10% off registration! [2:51] The ERM Conference 2023 will be different than years past. We've got some great changes. Book your travel plans now! RIMS will host a Post-conference Workshop for the RIMS CRMP from 9:00 to 4:00 MT on November 4th and 5th. Save $100 when you register for the conference and workshop in one transaction. Links are in the notes. [3:21] Bob Roitblat is a multiple business owner and well-known TEDx speaker. Bob will kick off the RIMS ERM Conference 2023 on November 2nd with his keynote, “Elevate, Revolutionize, Maximize: Harnessing Innovation's Promise.” Bob is very engaging and I am looking forward to the energy he will bring to the keynote address on November 2nd! [4:30] Bob Roitblat has started a dozen companies. Each company focused on three areas: innovation, strategy, and risk. The three areas are closely tied together. You can't be successful in one without the other two. It's a three-legged stool. [5:03] Bob describes innovation as doing something new and different that makes a difference. It could be new products or services, a new business model, or a new organizational structure. It's something that you haven't done before that will make a difference to your organization. (A positive difference, preferably!) [6:00] Most of the time when people innovate within an organization, they don't call attention to it, they just run more efficiently. Amazon is a huge logistics company that runs smoothly. They spend billions on innovation. They bought a robotics company to have robots to deliver products on schedule. [6:28] There is also the innovation of developing products and services for external consumption by customers. Bob cites Zia Chisti, who invented Invisalign braces. Orthodontia hadn't changed for 100 years until a Stanford student wanted to change the experience of braces. Within 10 years, he completely altered orthodontia. [7:20] Richard Montañez, a janitor who worked for Frito-Lay, invented Flaming Hot Cheetos. He altered the landscape for focus marketing. He went after a segment of the market people didn't think to go after. Now we're not just marketing to people but to segments of those people. Richard retired as the VP of Multicultural Affairs at Pepsico. [10:05] Bob describes the upcoming influence of AI digital workers on innovation. In terms of efficiency, we are underselling the capabilities of digital workers. Let's elevate our perspective. How do we use digital workers to drive the top line, open new markets, and address new submarkets like Montañez did? [11:44] Software bots may or may not use AI but they are digital workers. [11:57] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. Justin is pleased, humbled, and excited to announce that RIMS and RIMScast have won the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award on October 24, 2023, from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! [12:41] On Friday, November 10th, from 10 to 11, NYSAE is presenting a virtual program called ”Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association.” Justin is honored to be one of the panelists. A link is in this episode's notes. [12:57] Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops to see the full calendar. October 2nd is the last day to register for Applying and Integrating ERM, a two-day course on October 3rd and 4th, led by Elise Farnham. On October 10th and 11th, our friend Gail Kiyomura will host a two-day workshop on Claims Management. [13:28] Our friend Chris Hansen was recently on RIMScast. He will be leading Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the US on November 7th and 8th. Be sure to register for that course! Information about these sessions and others is on the RIMS Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [13:56] On October 12th, AXA XL returns to present Stand Tall: How to Boost your Cyber Posture Against Creative Cyber Criminals. [14:10] On October 26th, our friends from Zurich return to present a session on PFAS,  Forever Chemicals and PFAS Litigation. Visit RIMS.org/Webinars to learn more about these webinars and to register! Links are in the show notes. Webinar registration is complimentary for RIMS members. [15:11] Bob's November 2nd keynote preview: Imagine that innovation is a lake. It's full of potential. Unless you harness that flow in some way, you can't take advantage of it. Your strategy is a dam. You set it so the flow doesn't wipe out the town below. That's good risk avoidance. [15:57] Maybe your strategy is to use irrigation pipes to make the surrounding land tillable and farmable. That generates revenue. Maybe your strategy is a hydroelectric plant inside the dam and generate electricity to sell. Unless you have a strategy to extract value from your lake of innovation, it only has potential value. [16:46] The theme of the keynote is how to build your dam strategy to extract value from the innovation that you can identify. [17:11] Bob says to attend the keynote and be prepared to participate! It will not be a one-way data dump! You won't be bored! There will be a QIOS session. Bob won't have all the answers, but he'll answer your Questions with Ideas, Opinions, and Suggestions! Let's start the conversation! [18:00] With Bob's keynote and the following sessions by other speakers, the people who show up will be overloaded with value, and knowledge, and be prepared to go back to their organizations and “take over the world.” [18:29] Bob uses lots of images in his keynote, produced by Gen AI and edited in Photoshop and enhanced with Adobe Illustrator. But digital isn't always the answer. Sometimes analog images are the best way. [19:47] October is National Cybersecurity Awareness Month. It's a subject of the Conference and Bob will address it. Listen in the keynote for the top ten innovations Bob thinks will have the biggest impact on Enterprise Risk Management. Two of the ten deal with cybersecurity. [20:12] Bob shares a point. If you sign up for ChatGPT and you want to have access to the latest LLM, it's a subscription of $20.00 a month. If you subscribe to FraudGPT, a chatbot that helps you hack into things and be fraudulent, you pay a subscription of $200 a month. Don't tell Bob that crime doesn't pay! [21:04] Bob's parting words: “If you see me in the hall, grab me, tell me what you want to talk about. If you disagree with me, please speak up, let's have the conversation. And I've already changed my airfare to stay a little longer 'cause I just saw a new session popped up that I want to go to! So this will be the event of the season! Let's do it!” [21:26] Special thanks again to Bob Roitblat, our RIMS ERM Conference 2023 keynote speaker for joining us. Register today at RIMS.org/ERM2023. You get to hear Bob first thing in the morning on November 2nd and you'll have the chance to connect with him after the keynote, possibly in some other sessions. Links are in the show notes. [21:49] Go to the App Store on your phone and download the RIMS App. This is a special members-only benefit. Everybody loves the RIMS app! [22:08] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are in our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [22:50] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [23:13] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [23:29] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and in print, and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager at RIMS. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [23:49] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe!   Mentioned in this Episode: RIMS ERM Conference 2023 | Nov 2–3 in Denver, CO! Enter 2023RIMSCAST at checkout for 10% off registration! NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App RIMS Legislative Summit — Oct 25–26, Washington, D.C. RIMS Western Regional — Oct 4–6, Vail Colorado RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus Grant RIMScast to receive the 2023 Excellence in MarCom Award from the New York Society of Association Executives (NYSAE)! “NYSAE Webinar: Podcasting — A Revenue Stream for Your Association” Spencer Educational Foundation — Hire A Risk Intern 2024 | Deadline Oct. 15, 2023 Spencer-RIMS Risk Management Challenge 2024 — Be a Case Study or Join Judging Panel! RIMS Webinars: Stand Tall: How to Boost your Cyber Posture Against Creative Cyber Criminals | Sponsored by AXA XL | Oct. 12, 2023 PFAS Forever Chemicals — Regulations, Litigation, New Technologies | Sponsored by Zurich | Oct. 26, 2023 RIMS.org/Webinars Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Claims Management | Oct 10–11 Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability and Employment Practices in the US | Nov 7 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual WorkshopsAll RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops Related RIMScast Episodes: The Future of AI and Work with Sinead Bovell Live from the RIMS ERM Conference 2022 Risk and Leadership with Lt. Gen. (ret) Roméo Dallaire Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data ERM in Banking & Finance with Eleni Willis Security Risks and Implementing ERM with Kelly Johnstone Emerging Risks and Board Reporting with Suzanne Christensen ERM at the Veterans Benefits Administration Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response (New!) “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant (New!) “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL “How to Reduce Lithium-Ion Battery Fire Risks” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Managing Global Geopolitical Risk in 2022 and Beyond” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide   Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts. Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   About our guest, Bob Roitblat Roitblat.com   Tweetables (Edited For Social Media Use): Imagine that innovation is a lake. It's full of potential. But unless you harness that water flow in some way, you're not going to be able to take advantage of it. So you're going to come up with a dam. Your strategy is a dam. — Bob Roitblat   The theme of the keynote is how to build your “dam strategy” to extract value from the innovation that you can identify. — Bob Roitblat   We're going to do a QIOS. … I don't have all the answers, but please, ask your Questions and I will share some ideas, give you my Opinions, and make some Suggestions! Let's start the conversation! — Bob Roitblat   If you subscribe to FraudGPT, a chatbot that helps you hack into things and be fraudulent, that subscription costs you $200 a month. So please don't tell me that crime doesn't pay! — Bob Roitblat

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.   RIMS Risk Management Magazine Managing Editor Hilary Tuttle rejoins RIMScast to discuss new cyber incident reporting policies issued by the SEC. (Press release: sec.gov/news/press-release/2023-139.) Hilary talks about the key role that governance plays in the SEC's announcements and how risk managers need to put this on their radar and even use it as an opportunity to demonstrate their value to the organization. Hilary also discusses a cyber insurance market outlook for the latter half of 2023.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast and the RIMS App, an exclusive benefit for RIMS members. [:32] About today's episode, where we will discuss some major cyber reporting news with RIMS Risk Management Magazine Managing Editor, Hilary Tuttle. [:58] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! Registration is open for the RIMS Canada Conference 2023, which will be held September 11th–14th in Ottawa! Visit RIMSCanadaConference.ca for more information. [1:19] On September 14th, the Spencer Educational Foundation returns to New York City for its Annual Funding Their Future Gala. The event will be held at the Cipriani on 42nd Street. A link is on this episode's notes. You can also visit SpencerEd.org. [1:36] The RIMS Western Regional Conference will be held October 4th–6th in Vail, Colorado. Visit RIMSWesternRegional.com for more information and to register. [1:48] Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to find information about The RIMS Legislative Summit, which is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. [2:02] We are very excited about the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado! The theme is Elevate and Evolve. Registration will open soon as will a call for nominations for the ERM Award of Distinction. Visit the events page on RIMS.org for more information. [2:25] We are accepting educational session submissions for RISKWORLD 2024. See the link to the online submission form in this episode's notes. RISKWORLD 2024 will be held May 5th–8th in San Diego! [2:44] Cyber is on our radar here at RIMScast! In July 2023, The United States Securities and Exchange Commission issued new rules for cyber incident reporting as well as guidance for cybersecurity governance. I asked my colleague Hilary Tuttle to join us here on RIMScast. Hilary is the RIMS Risk Management Magazine managing editor. [3:16] Hillary is our resident authority on cyber. She's been reporting on it for years. She's here to tell us what's going on and what you need to know if you are a business leader, risk manager, or chief technology officer when it comes to these new reporting guidelines. [3:45] Justin welcomes Hilary Tuttle back to RIMScast. Justin says he thinks of Hilary Tuttle when he sees cyber news. [4:10] The big news is the United States SEC adopted some controversial new cybersecurity reporting rules and we need to talk about them. There's the hook, and then there's the deeper understanding of what's going on. First, we'll talk about the hook. [4:38] Hilary says organizations are going to have to report to the SEC any cyber incident within four days of assessing the material financial impact of an incident. A material financial impact is financial losses or a significant impact on a company's financial performance or results. This may be a reputation risk with a potential dip in stock price. [5:34] The SEC has not stipulated what qualifies as a significant impact on a company's financial performance or results. The rule on incident reports starts in December 2023. The rule on incidents that must be reported in annual reports starts in fiscal years beginning in 2024. [6:31] Organizations have to establish that an incident happened. Was there data exposure? Was there a loss? Was there a disruption or outage because of a malicious actor? The forensics on these questions is what takes time for certain cyber incidents. The SEC is not making stipulations about how long the forensics should take. [7:24] The organization has to establish that the incident will have a material impact on financial performance. For large public companies, that can be a high bar to clear. Companies vary widely in the maturity of their current capacity to quantify the impact of the cyber incident. [7:57] The new requirement does not stipulate timing relative to the onset of the cyber attack or exposure. The clock starts ticking once you realize that materiality is involved. That's an easier timeframe to meet. This is an important bar and companies may not be prepared to conduct the set of math that needs to be done to meet it. [8:32] The risk manager needs to align with the CFO and CTO to establish that equation. This also demonstrates what their benefit is in that equation. [9:20] Justin plugs the ERM Conference 2023 in Denver, on November 2nd and 3rd. Registration opens Friday, August 18! [9:41] Will these new reporting requirements lead to an increase in whistleblower claims,  investigation, and litigation? New regulations lead to a formalized focus on what is unacceptable or illegal behavior, so there could be an increase in whistleblowing. [10:32] Hillary has seen a budding class of shareholder-derivative suits that focus on cyber governance, the material impact of cyber incidents, and the board's fiduciary duties for cyber. This development reflects an evolution in our thinking about the tangible impacts of cyber risk, the severity of them, and where the responsibility is. [11:10] The board and management have obligations and their dereliction of those duties has a concrete impact on a company's future and shareholders. That is an actionable claim. We are seeing more formalization of those expectations and, in turn, more consequences for failures. [11:47] The real headline in this decision is that the SEC is requiring formal cybersecurity risk management, strategy, and governance. [12:09] Publicly-registered companies are going to need to incorporate formal disclosures into their annual reports, describing what, if any, processes they have in place for assessing, identifying, and managing material risks from cyber threats, the reasonably likely material impact of cyber threats, and previous cybersecurity incidents. [12:35] The SEC is also going to be requiring companies to describe their board's oversight of cyber risks and management's role and expertise in assessing and managing material risks of cyber threats. That means that companies have to have a cyber risk management strategy and governance processes. Many do not. [13:00] The requirement for a cyber risk management strategy and governance processes is the biggest burden on companies in terms of ensuring compliance with this rule. A lot of boards lack the expertise to effectively oversee a real cyber risk governance. The SEC is highlighting that cyber risk is business risk. It impacts viability. [14:22] Cyber risk has been one of the top global risks listed by the WEF for years. Gary Gensler, chair of the SEC, noted that the requirement is aimed at making disclosures consistent, comparable, and decision-useful. Cybersecurity risk management plays a key part in establishing or maintaining a company's value and survivability. [15:38] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. For upcoming virtual workshops visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops for the calendar. Managing Data for ERM is a three-module course that begins September 21st. [16:21] Optimizing Risk Management with Artificial Intelligence will be led on September 28th by Pat Saporito. Chris Hansen will be leading Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the US on November 7th and 8th. Be sure to register for that course! [16:55] Information about these sessions and others is on the RIMS Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [17:03] The RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep is on August 15th through 17th, 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT. For anyone attending RIMS Canada on September 10th and 11th, there will be a RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep In-Person Workshop in Ottawa, and it will be led by former RIMS President Chris Mandel. [17:29] Visit RIMS.org/Certification for these and future workshops. A link is also in this episode's show notes, as is a link to the full Virtual Workshop calendar. [18:11] Hilary shares thoughts about the cyber insurance market for the rest of 2023. She sees signs of optimism. Some businesses have come a long way toward bridging their cybersecurity risks with the more common, low-hanging fruit of phishing education, implementing multi-factor authentication, and crafting tougher passwords. [18:49] There's been a big shift in victim behavior toward ransomware. Ransomware losses have driven the hard market in cyber insurance. In 2019, 76% of victims paid ransom. In 2022, 46% of victims paid ransom. They are becoming more savvy about phishing and secure backups. Their insurance may have a ransomware exclusion. [20:38] The cyber insurance market is getting more profitable and rates are moderating after a number of quarters of brutal rate hikes. That's great news for risk managers. Marsh's latest Global Insurance Market Index found that globally, cyber insurance pricing moderated to a 1% increase in Q2, compared to 11% in Q1, and 28% in Q4 2022. [21:13] It's better news in the U.S. Rates decreased 4% in Q2, compared to 11% in Q1. So things are looking up. Rates will not return to pre-ransomware days. We know a lot more now about what cyber costs. Hopefully, you know more about your exposure and your modeling. In the light of litigation about cyber coverage, there's more clarity about it. [22:08] We're getting a more realistic perspective of what cyber should be and can be for buyers going forward. When it comes to cybersecurity and vulnerability, there's always something you can do better. There is always a way that a threat actor will get you. But there is a bit more room to feel cautiously optimistic about the cyber insurance market. [23:22] Whether the market remains “flattish” will depend on the companies and their losses in the latter half of 2023. [23:32] Justin thanks Hilary for coming and breaking it down for us. This is valuable for the audience to know. We may follow up on the SEC rule at the beginning of next year, once everything goes into effect for everyone. It will be interesting to see how enforcement shapes up regarding the governance requirements. [24:15] Justin thanks Hilary for joining us again on RIMScast. [24:20] Special thanks to RIMS Risk Management Magazine Managing Editor Hilary Tuttle for joining us here today. Links to RIMS coverage of the SEC's new cyber reporting rules are on this episode's show notes. Be sure to check out Risk Management Monitor and RMMagazine.com for news as well. [24:41] The new issue of Risk Management Magazine is now live in print and online. Visit RMMagazine.com. [24:49] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are on our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [25:34] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [25:59] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [26:15] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and in print, and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [26:37] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! We appreciate all your kind words. Listen every week! Stay safe! Mentioned in this Episode: NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App Submit an Educational Session for RISKWORLD 2024 RIMS ERM Conference 2023 | Nov 2–3 in Denver, CO! RIMS Canada 2023 — Sept. 11–14 in Ottawa! Spencer Educational Foundation — Funding Their Future Gala — Sept. 14, 2023 Contribute to Risk Management MagazineRIMS Western Regional — Oct 4–6, Vail Colorado RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus Grant Upcoming Virtual Workshops: Fundamentals of Risk Management | Aug. 8–9 Optimizing Risk Management with AI | Sept. 28 Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability and Employment Practices in the US | Nov 7 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep Virtual Workshop August 15–17, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep In-Person WorkshopIn Ottawa, ON, Canada September 10–11, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT All RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops Related RIMScast Episodes: “Near-Misses Still Count”: Risk Management Magazine's Morgan O'Rourke and Hilary Tuttle “Mid-Year 2023 Update with Morgan O'Rourke and Hilary Tuttle” “Cybersecurity and Insurance Outlook 2023 with Josephine Wolff” “Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response (New!) “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant (New!) “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL “How to Reduce Lithium-Ion Battery Fire Risks” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Managing Global Geopolitical Risk in 2022 and Beyond” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS Risk Leaders Series RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Path to the Boardroom RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts. Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   Follow up with Our Guest: Chris Hansen on LinkedIn Snug Harbor Risk Consulting RIMS New Jersey Chapter   Tweetables (For Social Media Use):   “Organizations are going to have to report any cyber incident within four days … of assessing material financial impact of an incident. … [A material financial impact is] financial losses or a significant impact to a company's financial performance or results.” — Hilary Tuttle   “You have to establish that an incident happened. Was there data exposure? Was there a loss? Was there disruption or outage because of a malicious actor? The forensics on that part is often what takes time for certain types of cyber incidents.” — Hilary Tuttle   “As Gary Gensler, the chair of the SEC, noted, the requirement here is aimed at making sure that these disclosures are consistent, comparable, and decision-useful and I think that's a really interesting point.” — Hilary Tuttle   “It's kind of a nice affirmation that, again, cyber risk is business risk. And cybersecurity risk management plays a really key part in establishing or maintaining a company's value.” — Hilary Tuttle

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.   Chris Hansen is semi-retired and owns Snug Harbor Risk Consulting. He's a reliable RIMS virtual instructor and he'll be leading two upcoming virtual workshops — Fundamentals of Risk Management on August 8th and 9th and Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability and Employment Practices in the U.S., on November 7th and 8th. Links to the registration pages are on the education page of RIMS.org and this episode's notes.   Chris has had a colorful career managing risk and safety for major companies and chains like Pathmark, Rite Aid, and Walmart. He shares the trajectory of his career and his risk philosophy and how fundamentals of risk management and worker comp played a pivotal role in his career path. Chris Hansen is a longtime, continuing member of the RIMS New Jersey Chapter.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:27] About today's episode, where we will discuss fundamentals of risk management and Worker Compensation with Chris Hansen of Snug Harbor Risk Consulting. [:38] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! Registration is open for the RIMS Canada Conference 2023, which will be held September 11th–14th in Ottawa! Visit RIMSCanadaConference.ca for more information. [:59] On September 14th, the Spencer Educational Foundation returns to New York City for its Annual Funding Their Future Gala. The event will be held at the Cipriani on 42nd Street. A link is on this episode's notes. You can also visit SpencerEd.org. [1:15] The RIMS Western Regional Conference will be held October 4th–6th in Vail, Colorado. Visit RIMSWesternRegional.com for more information and to register. [1:27] Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to find information about The RIMS Legislative Summit, which is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. [1:41] We are very excited about the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado! The theme is Elevate and Evolve. Registration will open soon as will a call for nominations for the ERM Award of Distinction. Visit the events page on RIMS.org for more information. [2:05] We are accepting educational session submissions for RISKWORLD 2024. See the link to the online submissions form in this episode's notes. RISKWORLD 2024 will be held May 5th–8th in San Diego! [2:23] Chris Hansen is a longtime and continuing member of the RIMS New Jersey Chapter. He's semi-retired and owns Snug Harbor Risk Consulting. [2:34] Chris is a reliable virtual instructor at RIMS and he'll be leading two upcoming virtual workshops, Fundamentals of Risk Management, on August 8th and 9th, and Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the U.S., on Nov. 7th and 8th. Links to register are on the show notes. [2:57] Justin talks to Chris about his career managing risk and safety for major companies and chains like Pathmark, Rite Aid, and Walmart and how worker comp and the fundamentals of risk management influenced his career. [3:23] Justin welcomes Chris Hansen to RIMScast. Chris is a longtime member of the RIMS New Jersey Chapter. [4:13] With a degree in industrial engineering, Chris started as an engineer for Pathmark Supermarkets. After the insurance crisis of the 1980s, he became the company's first safety manager. They didn't know what to do with the position until they had him report to Risk Management. When the Risk Director was promoted, Chris took that role. [6:21] Chris led a team of great people until the company was acquired about 12 years later. At its biggest, his team was about 20 people, including clerical support staff. [7:06] In the days before email, if a store had an accident, they filled out a five-part multicolor form and stuck it in the interoffice mail. It showed up in the risk management department after about four days. In the meantime, an injured party was wondering why they weren't getting a phone call. Email is a big improvement. [8:21] Chris went to Walmart from Pathmark, He wanted to work for a company too large to be bought by a competitor. He was a divisional safety manager. Eventually, Chris led the Safety and OSHA Compliance Program in Asset Protection for Walmart's 4,500 retail stores with 1.3 million employees. He focused on reducing loss frequency. [9:42] After Walmart, Chris went to Rite Aid in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. Chris was VP of Risk Management at Rite Aid for about six years. Much had changed in risk management from the time Chris had left Pathmark. At Pathmark, there was no discussion of cyber or employment practice liability. [10:41] When you're in retail, but also you're a healthcare provider, you're right in the crosshairs. He enjoyed the work and had terrific business partners. Chris retired in the Spring of 2020. One of Chris's last projects was helping the offices go virtual. The retail stores remained open during the COVID-19 pandemic. [12:10] Chris's job was about protecting the employees the best they could and coming up with HR policies on the fly, including pay. The pharmacists had to be there to take care of the patients. After that project, Chris was ready to retire. [12:54] Chris tells how his risk philosophy changed from Pathmark to Rite Aid. His aha moment happened in 1992. James Carville, a political consultant for Bill Clinton, came up with, “It's the economy, Stupid!” for the Clinton campaign. Chris printed up a sign, “It's the frequency, Stupid!” as a risk mantra over his desk and he used it for all his career. [14:43] If you take care of eliminating accidents, everything else takes care of itself. All risk-associated costs go down if you take care of frequency first. Chris has 28 consecutive years of claim frequency reductions for his employers! [15:19] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. For upcoming virtual workshops visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops for the calendar. Managing Data for ERMs is a three-module course that begins September 21st. [16:03] Optimizing Risk Management with Artificial Intelligence will be led on September 28th by Pat Saporito. Information about these sessions and others is on the Virtual Workshops page. Check it out and register! [16:22] The RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep is on August 15th through 17th, 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT. For anyone attending RIMS Canada on September 10th and 11th, there will be an in-person workshop for the RIMS-CRMP Exam in Ottawa, and it will be led by former RIMS President Chris Mandel. [16:48] Visit RIMS.org/Certification for these and future workshops. A link is also in this episode's show notes, as is a link to the full Virtual Workshop calendar. [17:11] What mindset is needed for the risk leader of a widely-known brand? What's paramount is that you've got to protect the reputation of the organization. When a company fills 300 million scripts a year, even a low error rate can be disastrous. What can happen if there's a high-profile claim or a data breach? [18:04] Chris has dealt with floods, fires, stabbings, and shootings throughout his career. Those are high-profile events that have to be handled delicately. You have to be in lock-step with your business partners, public affairs people, and the leadership team. Even dealing with an individual claim, that person's a customer and they have neighbors. [18:34] When you're self-administered for liability claims, you're not handing the claim off to someone else. You've got to treat people equitably, with respect, but at the same time, protect the interests of the company the best that you can. It's a delicate balance. [19:23] Chris was at Walmart when an employee was trampled to death at Valley Stream as a store opened on Black Friday in 2008. It was Chris's first Black Friday at Walmart. He had never seen an event of that scale. [20:01] Chris was at a store in Union, New Jersey, standing to the side of the entrance when they unlocked the doors and a horde of people came rushing through. There were pallets of televisions down the first aisle. By the time the crown had thinned, there was nothing left but empty pallets and a few boxes that had been stepped on.  [20:29] It was the most surreal thing Chris had ever seen. Shortly after that, Chris got a call from his vice president at the HQ in Arkansas. She asked where he was and how soon could he get to Valley Stream. Pulling into the parking lot, seeing how desolate it was, and seeing police tape around the entrance, is something Chris will never forget. [21:12] Chris explains the very unfortunate situation. They had started to open the doors to let a pregnant woman through because she was being pushed and the crowd just thought that was the opening. They just came rushing through the doors and an employee who was standing there got trampled and killed. [21:35] OSHA was there and Chris had to deal with their investigation. Nassau County detectives were there, as it was a crime scene. [21:54] What happened as a result of that tragedy was that Walmart put together the most comprehensive crowd-control program that had ever existed in retail. They brought in consultants who were specialists in crowd control who had done security for Super Bowls and big arenas. There's a science to it and Walmart had been a novice. [22:36] From that point forward, there was a plan and everybody stuck to the plan. They have never seen another tragedy like that again. [23:11] That particular store, in Nassau County on Long Island, was the closest store to New York City so it was a very congested, high-volume store. Chris has never seen anything that cataclysmic and he never will again, he hopes. [24:20] As a consultant, Chris is still focused on frequency; preventing accidents, but now it's personal. When he's working with power tools around the house or cleaning gutters, preventing accidents is the first thing he thinks about. He asks himself what could go wrong? Have someone hold the ladder! [25:10] Chris has always felt you have to have good data to manage risk. That means knowing who your business partners are who have that data, whether it's engineering, HR, or others. Chris is still focused on data, making sure he knows his numbers, At this point, the numbers he focuses on are cholesterol, blood pressure, and weight. [25:52] Chris has Fundamentals of Risk Management on August 8th and 9th. Registration closes on August 7th. What will Chris be teaching? The course talks about risk management as a corporate function and how it fits into the organization. Chris talks about risk management processes, fundamentals, and procedures. [26:31] Chris wraps up the seminar by talking about risk management as a profession. From his experience, it's been a heck of a ride. It's a profession that he's very glad to have had an opportunity to work in. “War stories” help Chris cover things in context. If war stories don't get their attention, he talks about his battle scars. [27:17] On November 7th and 8th Chris teaches Managing Worker Compensation Employers' Liability and Employment Practices in the U.S. Chris teaches what is the legal obligation for all employers. It's very procedural and formula-driven. There are nuances to it, as laws vary by state. Worker Compensation is a state-based system. [28:01] Chris gives folks the flavor of everything involved the loss control side, the cost containment opportunities to manage claims more effectively, take better care of your people, and get them back to work. [28:16] From there, Chris teaches Elmployer's Liability, which comes into play when something involving your employee is not covered under Worker Compensation. It's a defense policy. Chris wraps up the seminar with Employment Practices Liability, which covers all the bad things that can happen to people and how the policies respond. [29:02] There are links to registration pages for these courses in the show notes. If you're a RIMS member, you get the benefit of reduced rates. [29:15] Chris shares his advice for young risk professionals or anyone considering the risk management profession: “There are two things. The first is to be inquisitive. Ask questions. RIMS has a whole variety of courses available and so many different publications and things. … Risk Management Magazine is a terrific one.” [30:18] “The other thing I would say is to develop your network and build relationships. Develop relationships with your internal business partners, because risk management is a discipline that touches everything in the organization. And to be effective, you have to have command of pretty much everything that goes on in your organization.” [30:45] “The other thing I would say is if you're in driving distance from a RIMS chapter, get involved with that chapter. You'll get an opportunity to talk to your peers, to share concerns, seek advice and guidance, in real time over lunch, and hear some terrific speakers.” The New Jersey Chapter gets some phenomenal speakers. [31:46] Justin tells Chris it's been a real pleasure to see him again. There are links to the two courses on this episode's show notes. Be sure to pounce on Fundamentals of Risk Management, on August 8th and 9th. Registration closes on August 7th. Justin thanks Chris for joining us on RIMScast. [32:15] “Special thanks to Chris Hansen for joining me here on RIMScast. He's had a fascinating career and I'm glad he's sharing his knowledge in the RIMS Virtual Workshop Series. Register by August 7th for RIMS Fundamentals of Risk Management, a two-day course on August 8th and 9th.” [32:34] On November 7th and 8th, Chris teachest Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the U.S. Links are on this episode's show notes. RIMS members receive steeply discounted registration rates. Learn more about these and other RIMS virtual workshops through the education page of RIMS.org. [32:56] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are on our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of risk professionals, legal professionals, students, business leaders, C-Suite executives, and more. Let's collaborate! Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [33:39] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [34:02] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [34:17] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [34:39] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! Listen every week! Stay safe! Mentioned in this Episode: NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App Submit an Educational Session for RISKWORLD 2024 RIMS ERM Conference 2023 | Nov 2-3 in Denver, CO! RIMS Canada 2023 — Sept. 11–14 in Ottawa! Spencer Educational Foundation — Funding Their Future Gala — Sept. 14, 2023 Contribute to Risk Management MagazineRIMS Western Regional – Oct. 4-6, Vail Colorado RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus GrantUpcoming Virtual Workshops: Applying and Integrating ERM | August 1 Fundamentals of Risk Management | Aug. 8-9 Optimizing Risk Management with AI | Sept. 28 Managing Worker Compensation, Employer's Liability, and Employment Practices in the US | Nov. 7–8 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep Virtual Workshop August 15–17, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep In-Person WorkshopIn Ottawa, ON, Canada September 10–11, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT All RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops Related RIMScast Episodes: “Near-Misses Still Count”: Risk Management Magazine's Morgan O'Rourke and Hilary Tuttle “Genuine Generative AI Talk with Tom Wilde of Indico Data” “Risk Management Education with Ken Goldstein and David Cisneros” “Safety and International Risk Leadership with Franck Baron” “RIMS President Jennifer Santiago: R.E.A.D.Y. for 2023” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Subrogation and the Competitive Advantage” | Sponsored by Fleet Response (New!) “Cyberrisk Outlook 2023” | Sponsored by Alliant (New!) “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL “How to Reduce Lithium-Ion Battery Fire Risks” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Managing Global Geopolitical Risk in 2022 and Beyond” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS Risk Leaders Series RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Path to the Boardroom RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on Apple Podcasts. Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   Follow up with Our Guest: Chris Hansen on LinkedIn Snug Harbor Risk Consulting RIMS New Jersey Chapter   Tweetables (For Social Media Use):   “I graduated from college with a degree in industrial engineering and that's what I was doing at my first employer, the Pathmark Supermarket chain.” — Chris Hansen   “In the early 1980s, there was an insurance crisis. … Up until that point, retailers had guaranteed-cost programs; very low deductibles. That got turned completely upside-down. So [Pathmark] internally posted a job for Safety Manager … It sounded interesting!” — Chris Hansen   “[Before email], if a store had an accident, they had this five-part multicolor form and … they stuck it in the interoffice mail. It showed up in the risk management department about four days later. In the meantime, there's somebody out there with a broken arm!” — Chris Hansen   “You have to have good data to manage risk. That means knowing who your business partners are who have that data, whether it's the engineering folks, … or the HR folks. … I'm still focused on data. I'm still focused on making sure I know my numbers.” — Chris Hansen   “Develop your network and build relationships … with your internal business partners, because risk management is a discipline that touches everything in the organization. To be effective, you have to have command of pretty much everything … in your organization.” — Chris Hansen  

Welcome to RIMScast. Your host is Justin Smulison, Business Content Manager at RIMS, the Risk and Insurance Management Society.   How does Generative AI fit into modern business practices? What are the best practices before any implementation of automation and AI? What are the benefits and pitfalls of ChatGPT and other AI tools? Tom Wilde, CEO of Indico Data, discusses his experiences with risk professionals and how risk managers are in an advantageous situation. Tom gives examples of blindspots and risks with ChatGPT. He shares his thoughts on the trend of CROs becoming CEOs.   Key Takeaways: [:01] About RIMScast. [:27] About today's episode, where we will talk about technological innovation and risk with Tom Wilde, the CEO of Indico Data. [:36] All about exciting, upcoming RIMS events! Registration is open for the RIMS Canada Conference 2023, which will be held September 11th–14th in Ottawa! Visit RIMSCanadaConference.ca for more information. [:57] On September 14th, the Spencer Educational Foundation returns to New York City for its Annual Funding Their Future Gala. The event will be held at the Cipriani on 42nd Street. A link is on this episode's notes. You can also visit SpencerEd.org. [1:14] The RIMS Western Regional Conference will be held October 4th–6th in Vail, Colorado. Visit RIMSWesternRegional.com for more information and to register. [1:26] Head to the RIMS.org/Advocacy page to find information about The RIMS Legislative Summit, which is returning to Washington, D.C. on October 25th and 26th. [1:40] We are very excited about the RIMS ERM Conference 2023, which will be held November 2nd and 3rd in Denver, Colorado! The theme is Elevate and Evolve. Registration will open soon as will a call for nominations for the ERM Award of Distinction. Visit the events page on RIMS.org for more information. [2:06] The prominence of ChatGPT and AI in business has all sorts of upside and downside risks. Here to discuss them and lend his insight is Tom Wilde, the CEO of Indico Data. He is based in Boston, Massachusetts. [2:21] “Has the future arrived?” [2:30] Justin welcomes Tom Wilde of Indico Data to RIMScast. Tom has been in the software space for his entire career, beginning on the consumer internet side and then moving into enterprise software, focused on content technology. [3:18] Tom has been fascinated with trying to sort out the human-machine challenge between the way we produce and consume digital content and the way machines make sense of it. That's been a common thread through all the businesses he has built. [4:01] Tom tells about being a CEO. Tom is a builder CEO. He finds disruptive technologies and turns them into something the market finds useful and valuable. [4:52] The building blocks for ChatGPT, Deep Learning, Large Language Models, and Generative AI, have been in development for the past decade. Everything suddenly came together at the right time to create this “iPhone moment” for artificial intelligence where we all can see the value. [5:40] The invisible tipping point was that the Large Language Model underpinning ChatGPT, GPT 3 (now GPT 4), had reached a critical mass and a set of performance capabilities that suddenly made it viable. [6:28] We're in a classic phase of ChatGPT now, with incredible expectations and excitement about it. This is a moment as big as a browser or smartphone. This is a fundamentally new software programming paradigm. It's not a Swiss Army knife application that can solve everything. [7:10] For the first time, we have a programming language that is based on data and that uses the English language as the programming interface. There are about 25,000,000 software engineers in the world. There are several billion English language speakers on Earth. Suddenly, all of them, conceivably, can program using ChatGPT. [8:23] ChatGPT introduces some challenges to the enterprise, such as having to hold employees back from pushing code directly into production. [8:52] There suddenly needs to be some thought and structure around who can create prompts, what data can be fed to these cloud Large Language models, and what is the audit trail for what prompt was used to create what outcome. [9:09] Using software development paradigms makes sense in how to govern this and deal with compliance. Regarding Generative AI, while we have the huge benefit of programming with data, we have to be aware of what that means. [9:28] The quality of data becomes important in understanding how this new programming language behaves. It's only as good as the data it was trained on. If you take all the English-language content on the internet, what does that represent in terms of our understanding of human knowledge and behavior? [10:03] The English-language content on the internet carries flaws and biases. It has inappropriate and dangerous content. We have to be aware of what this programming language was taught to do and think about. [10:24] You should not use this technology as a black box. Microsoft suggests thinking about this as a co-pilot. The pilot flies the plane and has the final judgment as to what is safe and unsafe operation. The co-pilot reduces the workload as an extra set of hands and works the radio. ChatGPT is a co-pilot, not a pilot. [11:13] You have to have application frameworks in place to deal with hallucinations, to understand what data was used to make that decision at what time, who has been empowered to use this technology to perform part of their job, and what are the guardrails for that. Where can the enterprise's data be sent and stored? [11:45] Indico Data considers the three S's: Safely, Securely, and Scalably. To use this technology, you need a framework for understanding the three S's. [11:58] RIMS plug time! Sponsor an episode of RIMScast! Contact us at pd@rims.org. For upcoming virtual workshops visit RIMS.org/virtualworkshops for the calendar. Applying and Integrating ERM will be held on August 1st and 2nd by Ken Baker of Enterprise Risk Consulting. [12:42] Optimizing Risk Management with Artificial Intelligence will be led on September 28th by Pat Saporito. More information about these sessions and others is on the Virtual Workshops page. See the full schedule and register. [13:02] The RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep is July 19th and 20th, 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT. August 15th through 17th is the RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT. See the links at Rims.org/certification for these and future workshops. A link is also in this episode's show notes, as is a link to the full virtual workshop calendar. [13:57] As a technology CEO, you have to learn to think through the way the enterprise thinks of risk because they're not going to buy or implement your solution if it creates unacceptable risk, regardless of the benefit. [14:22] As a technology CEO, Tom thinks a lot about how to minimize the risks of deploying their product from a data protection standpoint, information security standpoint, and change management standpoint. Those things have to be top-of-mind or you can't engage with the enterprise. They are risk-averse, as they should be. [14:49] In many cases, you're dealing with PII, health data, and other sensitive information, so there are serious data protection requirements. GDPR and regional or national regulations on data security create additional layers of thinking to protect your client from being exposed to regulatory bodies. [15:17] Insurance and banking risk managers are using Indico Data to help them identify and quantify risk. Auditors and risk managers try to consume and make sense of vast amounts of unstructured data, like contracts, policies, documents, and emails, to find the needles in the haystack. What are patterns that suggest risky behavior or exposure? [16:02] Tom has seen a huge uptick in risk management wanting to embrace technology as a “bionic arm,” not as a robot, to allow a much faster and broader perspective on potential threat vectors and exposures. [16:53] Tom tells of a court case where attorneys used ChatGPT to create prior case representation for the court but ChatGPT fabricated the cases. It didn't understand it wasn't supposed to make them up. There's a gap between the way AI and humans work. AI has blind spots and until we find them and fix them, they expose us to risk. [18:12] If you're using AI to make decisions, how are you sure that those are quality decisions, that they're not fabricated or hallucinated, and that they're complete? Generative AI struggles with precision and recall. Precision means that all the answers it gives are correct. Recall is that it found all the possible data it should have presented. [18:51] Generative AI will make recall mistakes and leave stuff out, not knowing that it's supposed to be comprehensive. When you ask ChatGPT why it did not include something in its summary, it says, “Sorry, you're right, I should have included that.” We need to continue to be suspicious of Generative AI's confidence in the answers it brings.  [20:03] The challenge with automation and AI is it allows you to make a bad process even worse, more rapidly. Ask yourself if you are automating a good process. Is it a process that should be automated or is the process itself the problem? Like using a power saw, you need to know what you're doing with ChatGPT. It's a very powerful tool. [21:41] A CEO is a storyteller. To be a technology CEO, with the pace of innovation in the market today, your customers crave for you to help them make sense of it and think about it rationally. They're desperate to do that for their constituents. You become a valuable partner CEO if your product helps them make sense of things and adds value. [22:29] Your storytelling also helps your employees and your investors. Your job as an early-stage CEO is to create that narrative and bring it to light. [23:00] Justin and Tom discuss the trend of CROs becoming CEOs. Being good at understanding risk makes you good at taking bets. As a CEO, you have a key responsibility to make bets where you have incomplete information, understanding the downside and the upside. [23:27] Risk professionals have an advantage in being able to measure the risks in front of them and make bets more confidently and with perhaps better outcomes. [23:42] We are in a world of high beta factors: climate, economic, and social, that have to be understood so that you don't inadvertently bet the whole company. Understanding these factors also puts you in a position to take advantage of opportunities that emerge from the macro elements surrounding us as business leaders. [24:15] “Special thanks to Tom Wilde for joining me today. That was a lot of fun! I've got more links to RIMS coverage of AI and automation on this episode's show notes.” [24:27] You can sponsor a RIMScast episode for this, our weekly show, or a dedicated episode. Links to sponsored episodes are on our show notes. RIMScast has a global audience of professionals, students, business leaders, and more. Contact pd@rims.org for more information. [25:13] Become a RIMS member and get access to the tools, thought leadership, and network you need to succeed. Visit RIMS.org/membership or email membershipdept@RIMS.org for more information. The RIMS app is available only for RIMS members! You can find it in the App Store. [25:37] Risk Knowledge is the RIMS searchable content library that provides relevant information for today's risk professionals. Materials include RIMS executive reports, survey findings, contributed articles, industry research, benchmarking data, and more. [25:53] For the best reporting on the profession of risk management, read Risk Management Magazine at RMMagazine.com and check out the blog at RiskManagementMonitor.com. Justin Smulison is Business Content Manager. You can email Justin at Content@RIMS.org. [26:16] Justin thanks you for your continued support and engagement on social media channels! Listen every week! Stay safe! Mentioned in this Episode: NEW FOR MEMBERS! RIMS Mobile App RIMS ERM Conference 2023. RIMS Canada 2023 — Sept. 11–14 in Ottawa! Spencer Educational Foundation — Funding Their Future Gala — Sept. 14, 2023 Contribute to Risk Management MagazineRIMS Western Regional — Oct 4–6, Vail Colorado RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) Dan Kugler Risk Manager on Campus GrantUpcoming Virtual Workshops: Applying and Integrating ERM | August 1 Optimizing Risk Management with AI | Sept. 28 See the full calendar of RIMS Virtual Workshops RIMS-CRMP Exam Prep July 19–20, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT RIMS-CRMP-FED Exam Prep August 15–17, 2023 9:00 am–4:00 pm EDT All RIMS-CRMP Prep Workshops Upcoming webinar: Trade Credit Insurance Managing Risk and Promoting Growth — July 14, 2023 | Presented by RIMS and Prudent Insurance Brokers Pvt. Ltd. Related RIMScast Episodes: “Risk Management Education with David Cisneros” “‘Near-Misses Still Count': Risk Management Magazine's Morgan O'Rourke and Hilary Tuttle” “Innovation and Improvisation with RISKWORLD Keynote Josh Linkner” “Cybersecurity and Insurance Outlook 2023 with Josephine Wolff” Sponsored RIMScast Episodes: “Chemical Industry: How To Succeed Amid Emerging Risks and a Challenging Market” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD (New!) “Insuring the Future of the Environment” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Insights into the Gig Economy and its Contractors” | Sponsored by Zurich “The Importance of Disaster Planning Relationships” | Sponsored by ServiceMaster “Technology, Media and Telecom Solutions in 2023” | Sponsored by Allianz “Analytics in Action” | Sponsored by Alliant “Captive Market Outlook and Industry Insights” | Sponsored by AXA XL “Using M&A Insurance: The How and Why” | Sponsored by Prudent Insurance Brokers Ltd. “Zurich's Construction Sustainability Outlook for 2023” “Aon's 2022 Atlantic Hurricane Season Overview” “ESG Through the Risk Lens” | Sponsored by Riskonnect “A Look at the Cyber Insurance Market” | Sponsored by AXA XL “How to Reduce Lithium-Ion Battery Fire Risks” | Sponsored by TÜV SÜD “Managing Global Geopolitical Risk in 2022 and Beyond” | Sponsored by AXA XL RIMS Publications, Content, and Links: RIMS Membership — Whether you are a new member or need to transition, be a part of the global risk management community! RIMS Virtual Workshops On-Demand Webinars Risk Management Magazine Risk Management Monitor RIMS Risk Leaders Series RIMS-Certified Risk Management Professional (RIMS-CRMP) RIMS-CRMP Stories — New interview featuring Roland Teo! Spencer Educational Foundation RIMS DEI Council RIMS Path to the Boardroom RIMS Events, Education, and Services: RIMS Risk Maturity Model® RIMS Events App Apple | Google Play RIMS Buyers Guide Sponsor RIMScast: Contact sales@rims.org or pd@rims.org for more information.   Want to Learn More? Keep up with the podcast on RIMS.org and listen on iTunes. Have a question or suggestion? Email: Content@rims.org.   Join the Conversation! Follow @RIMSorg on Facebook, Twitter, and LinkedIn.   Follow up with Our Guest: Tom Wilde Indico Data   Tweetables (For Social Media Use):   “I've been fascinated with trying to sort out the human-machine challenge between the way we as people produce and consume digital content and the way machines make sense of it. … That's been a common thread through all of the businesses that I've built.” — Tom Wilde   “The fundamental building blocks for [ChatGPT]: Deep Learning, Large Language Models, and Generative AI; these have been in development for the past decade. … Everything came together at the right time to create … the “iPhone moment” for artificial intelligence.” — Tom Wilde   “As a technology CEO, you have to learn to think through the way the enterprise thinks of risk because they're not going to buy or implement your solution if it creates unacceptable risk, regardless of the benefit.” — Tom Wilde   “Generative AI will make mistakes of recall and leave stuff off, not knowing that it's supposed to be comprehensive. … We need to continue to be … suspicious of Generative AI's confidence in the answers it brings.” — Tom Wilde   “Being good at understanding risk makes you good at taking bets. As a CEO, one of the key responsibilities you have is to make bets where you have incomplete information, understanding the downside and the upside. … Risk professionals … have a real advantage here.” — Tom Wilde  

Tom Wilde is CEO at Indico, an intelligent intake solution automating critical middle office workflows across insurance, banking, real estate and healthcare. 'Intelligent intake' at Indico means the starting point for insurers' most critical workflows including underwriting, claims and policy servicing. The common denominator is data culled from emails or other documents, taken from an unstructured format to feed core platforms and decision systems.  The original digital transformation started with the new customer-facing mobile device, but transitioned through the back office then into the middle office of insurance where business-critical decisions take place. Tom describes actuaries as the original data scientists, taking data and turning them into decisions.  Their modern engines were designed to run on clean sets of data, but unfortunately the reality is that most data lives as unstructured and requires manual rework before it can be used. Indico was early on understanding the impact of deep learning and large language models, and were the first to build a large language model that allows customers to customize their own machine learning models and solve unstructured data challenges.  Tom feels strongly that generative AI (eg. GPT4) can easily handle the context of insurance, because the depth of context-understanding enabled by trillions of parameters can understand any context a human can. There are however three main problems to commercially scaling insurance use cases today using GPT4: it is extremely computationally expensive, insurers' data is still sensitive and proprietary, and GPT4 essentially makes up an answer (lies) when it doesn't know one.  Until these large language problems get solved, insurers will be held back from using generative AI in core processes.  Prior to joining Indico, Tom was the Chief Product Officer at Cxense, a data management provider and founder of Ramp, an enterprise video content management company. Tom worked at Fast Search, Miva Systems, and Lycos. He has an MBA in Entrepreneurial Management from Wharton. Follow the Insurtech Leadership Podcast airing weekly hosted by Joshua R. Hollander. We give you up-close access and personal insights from the leaders of the fastest-growing #insurtechs and most innovative #insurance carriers and brokers.

This episode features Tom Wilde, CEO at Indico Data. Tom's team is all about making AI accessible and useful in the enterprise and are turning that into reality through the lens of unstructured data. Tom says 90% of the data in an enterprise is unstructured – in documents, images, and videos and accessing and making use of that in automated systems will be a game-changer over the coming years. He is joined by HFS Practice Leader David Cushman in this Hot Vendor Fireside conversation. Indico Data was most recently named an HFS OneOffice Hot Vendor for Q2, 2021. The HFS OneOffice Hot Vendors are an exclusive group of emerging players, each with a differentiated value proposition for the OneOffice. HFS analysts regularly speak with numerous exciting start-ups and emerging players. We designate a select group as the HFS Hot Vendors based on their distinctiveness, ecosystem robustness, client impact, financial position, and the impact on our OneOffice Framework. Those selected are collated and published in our quarterly series. They each have the vision and strategy to impact and disrupt the market. On occasion, we go deeper with a podcast with one of the people behind those winning visions – in our HFS OneOffice Hot Vendor Firesides. The videocast is in three sections in which we: Warm-up: What does this Hot Vendor deliver? Fan the flames: This Hot Vendor's journey, what they learned, what makes them different, how do they see the market? Light the way: Take a glance into what's next on the agenda for this Hot Vendor.

Comedians and co-hosts of the Ya F#cked It podcast, Brian Six & Ryan Shaner join Zac this week for a hilarious and wild ride! Chinese drug dealers are using "vampires" (hopping zombies) to protect coffins worth of their product. Narcotics agent Tom Wilde dies on the job in pursuit of the druglords, but not for long, as luckily he is brought back as an impenetrable cyborg android (which is most definitely not RoboCop as pictured on the cover). One of 39 movies released in 1988 by director Godfrey Ho (as "Joe Livingstone"), a possible cover for money laundering with a budget of $2.5 million, and with no credits, it's Robo Vampire!PLEASE VISIT OUR SPONSORSIf you're over the age of 21 and a fan of marijuana, Hempire Direct can now sell you Delta-8 THC flower, legally shipped to 42 States. Visit www.HempireDirect.com and use code GASFLOWER for 50% OFF any of their premium Delta-8 bud!If you are currently a fan of Kratom, you can save some money and stock up at YoKratom.com, the only place you will find $60 Kilos. Visit www.YoKratom.com where you can buy directly at incredible prices.FOLLOW THE SHOW!Zac AmicoInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/zacisnotfunnyBrian SixInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/brian6ixTwitter: https://twitter.com/Brian6ixRyan ShanerInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/shanercobbedyTwitter: https://twitter.com/_Shaner_Comedy_Ya F#cked ItPatreon: https://www.patreon.com/YaPaidForItTwitter: https://twitter.com/yfipodcastThe newest 15 episodes are always free, but if you want access to all the archives, watch live, chat live, access to the forums, and get the show five days before it comes out everywhere else - you can subscribe NOW at http://www.GaSDigitalNetwork.com and use the code ZAC for a 7-Day FREE Trial and save 15% on your subscription to the entire network.Check out https://www.PodcastMerch.com/ZAC to get EXCLUSIVE Zac Amico merchandise (including the Amico 666 Shirt seen on the Joe Rogan Experience!), with BRAND NEW items coming soon!

I had the opportunity to speak with Dallas Deman, Pam Deman, Brendon Hamilton & Tom Wilde with the Badlands Training Centre in Medicine Hat about their upcoming opening. To hear what their intent is and how they want to help each individual client was so incredible to witness. The audio in this podcast drops out a couple of times but does come back. For more information about what they're up to, check out: https://www.badlandsview.com/badlands-training-centre

Director and writer: Godfrey Ho Narcotics agent Tom Wilde is given a second chance at life after being shot and killed. In a futuristic experiment, agent Wilde is returned to life as an Android Robot and he is sent on a very dangerous mission.

Jane Alexander has completed a PhD in creative writing, and teaches at the University of Edinburgh, and the Open University. Her latest novel 'A User's Guide to Make Believe' explores the near future, with an all-too-plausible slant on reality and fantasy. Menna van Praag has lived in Cambridge all her life, except when she was studying at Oxford University! She is the author of five novels of magical realism, which have sold over 150,000 copies worldwide. Her latest 'The Sisters Grimm' is the story of four sisters born to different mothers on the same day, and gives you a different slant on some of your favourite female fairy tale heroines. Rory Clements is a Sunday Times bestselling author, and twice winner of the CWA Historical Dagger Award. His latest novel 'Hitler's Secret' coincides with the 75th anniversary to the end of World War II. It features history professor Tom Wilde, who is asked by an American Intelligence officer to help smuggle a mysterious package out of Nazi Germany. Annie Beaumont grew up in various places in England and the Middle East, before settling in Norfolk, where her novel is set. She now lives on the Costa Blanca, and spends her winters in Thailand writing novels. Her latest is 'Healing Hearts and Apple Tarts (and a totally demented Dalmatian)'

Narcotics agent Tom Wilde is given a second chance at life after being shot and killed. In a futuristic experiment, agent Wilde is returned to life as an Android Robot. He is sent on a very dangerous mission into the depths of the golder Triangle to rescue Sophie, a beautiful undercover agent who has been captured by the evil drug warlord Mr. Young and his inhuman creation the Vampire Beast.

It's not so rare to find a movie that is a complete rip off of another movie, but it is rare to find a movie that is not only a complete rip off but also 2 totally separate movies smashed together to create that rip off. And that brings us to this week's movie, Robo Vampire. In a futuristic experiment, agent Tom Wilde is returned to life as an Android Robot after being shot and killed. Once rebooted, he is sent on a very dangerous mission into the depths of the Golder Triangle to rescue Sophie, a beautiful undercover agent who has been captured by the evil drug warlord Mr. Young and his inhuman creation the Vampire Beast. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/bmoviebreakdown/support

Narcotics agent Tom Wilde is given a second chance at life after being shot and killed. In a futuristic experiment, agent Wilde is returned to life as an Android Robot. He is sent on a very dangerous mission into the depths of the golder Triangle to rescue Sophie, a beautiful undercover agent who has been … Continue reading "Robo Vampire"

Narcotics agent Tom Wilde is given a second chance at life after being shot and killed. In a futuristic experiment, agent Wilde is returned to life as an Android Robot. He is sent on a very dangerous mission into the depths of the golder Triangle to rescue Sophie, a beautiful undercover agent who has been … Continue reading "Robo Vampire"

If you've listened to this show, it is no secret that I've covered a large number of AI and Machine Learning companies. I promise you, this one is different. There's a common them amongst the AI and ML technologies: They're bloody difficult to deploy, and even more difficult to manage the performance to get results that actually make for a more efficient business. What if I told you there is a company that is doing this kind of integration with 100X - 1000X less data, 10X faster deployment time, and 90% reduction in infrastructure and operating costs. Enter Indico, the first true B2B solution that I feel is really "plug and play". I interviewed Tom Wilde the CEO and Slater Victoroff the founder and CTO of the company. We covered a range of topics including a digestible break down of Machine Learning, the future of the technology, and what you can expect from Indico in the near future. I had an amazing time with Tom and Slater, and I hope you enjoy this interview as much as I did.

The case for always dressing up and looking nice before leaving the house. Charlotte owns many shoes. Find out how many. Is British food as bad as people say? Not according to Charlotte. We speak to author Tom Wilde about his debut novel "The Blood of Alexander", and Indiana Jones-like adventure wrapped into a historic thriller.

The case for always dressing up and looking nice before leaving the house. Charlotte owns many shoes. Find out how many. Is British food as bad as people say? Not according to Charlotte. We speak to author Tom Wilde about his debut novel "The Blood of Alexander", and Indiana Jones-like adventure wrapped into a historic thriller.

Tom Wilde, CEO of EveryZing, speaks about his experience in Internet Search marketing , both on the algorithmic side as well as the paid search side, plus he explains the reason for Google breaking out to become the premier search engine.