Whenever there's a decision to be made or something really needs my attention, like many of my clients I often catch myself saying, "I just need to figure it out." As a result, I ended up spending a lot of time in my head trying to use my intellect and reasoning to come up with a solution - when I could be slowing down, getting quiet and listening to my intuition.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're looking at the intelligence that goes beyond just our brain. Whether we call this “inner knowing” that comes from within - Spirit, inner teacher, intuition, gut instinct, divine intelligence, or spiritual team, there's so much wisdom to be found if we can just slow down enough to feel our way through a situation.It is the reason why over the years I've learned to hit the pause button and check in with my body and it's “three brains' — the mind, heart, and belly —- for navigating life's challenges.So if you find yourself caught up in the stress and pressure of needing to “figure it all out”, I encourage you to take a moment to sit still, get quiet, go within, take a few deep breaths in and nice long exhales out, connect with your intuition, and trust your “inner smarty-pants” to show you the way. Find balance between using your mind and listening to your body, and you might just find the answers you've been seeking.KK's Takeaways:Intro (00:00)Body Compass (3:00)Mind Overrides Gut Instinct (7:13)How Are We To Trust? (13:25)The Mind Is Greater Than The Brain (17:30)Get Back To The First Floor (24:51)You Are Your Own Smarty Pants (28:30)Allow Yourself To Feel (31:38)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Rambling Through Everyday Life Podcast
We are going out with a bang! This episode was so fun! We got caught up on our latest adventures and resurrected Fran's prayer for "big fun surprises." Angela shared what she's learning about persisting in prayer from her beloved "monk fools" book. We also share our summer bucket list: where we are going, what we are watching, reading and listening to. Y'all - we LOVE rambling with you each week! We are taking a break for summer but we have so many big fun surprises planned for y'all when we return in August! We are so grateful for all the ways y'all encourage us each week. We love y'all so much and hope you have the very best summer! You can also watch this week's episode on our YouTube Channel! Here are all the ways we can keep in touch! We love hearing from you! Join our Facebook group • Follow us on Instagram • Follow us on TikTok • Follow us on Pinterest Proverbs 16:24: "Kind words are like honey— sweet to the soul and healthy for the body." Fave quotes from "Praying Like Monks, Living Like Fools" by Tyler Staton "Pain and suffering have the capacity to deepen and transform you, but they also have the capacity to destroy you." "On Wrestling with God in persistent prayer: The Lord descends into the mess with me. I just have to choose to trust him." How do we persist in prayer? Say it like you mean it. Forget your manners. Tell it like it is. Listen for the question. invite God to show you what you are doubting about the character of God. Invite God to heal you through your questions. Order "Praying Like Monks, Living Like Fools: An Invitation to the Wonder and Mystery of Prayer" by Tyler Saton here Listen to Episode 108 "Cooking with KK" here Listen to Episode 111 about the power of being seen, heard and understood here Order Firefly Lane book here or watch it on Netflix Listen to Christy Nockels podcast "The Glorious in the Mundane" here
On a planet of almost eight billion people, there's only one you!And as a creative, entrepreneur or artist, if there's only one you and you're the first YOU, others can't really copy that sh*t!! (Although they may try!) HA!When it comes to creating content and sharing yourself and your work with the world, you might be thinking that your life is boring or that you don't have anything someone else would want to see, hear about or interact with. But the truth is when you are fully yourself — when you are truly standing in your own spirit, essence, and power…When you're sharing directly from that place of knowing yourself, this is what makes you attractive, magnetic and will have people wanting to work with you. Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about being YOU - the authentic, real, one of a kind YOU… and not some watered down version of someone else.But you've gotta' ask yourself, what does the real, first, one of a kind of YOU look like?Do you know what it means to be you and how to share that with the world? Send me an email or shoot me a DM, I'm curious to hear what you discover, when you slow down enough to ask yourself those questions.If you're looking for help figuring it out, I have a brand new workshop series starting this month (May 2023) with my good friend and fellow weirdo, Emily Aborn - that I'd love to have you join us for. It's called The Content Compass and you can learn more here: https://www.thecontentcompass.com/KK's Takeaways:Deep Intuitive Senses (6:25)Nobody Can Be You (10:46)Be The First You (13:08)Content Compass Workshop (17:20)Give Credit Where It Is Due (19:55)Be YourSelf (22:15)You Don't Have To Seek Love (25:49)Upcoming Online Workshop Series Mentioned: thecontentcompass.comKaren Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no bullsh*t approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, Integrative Change Worker + Life Coach, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast.Karen guides those she works with to trust themselves, to learn through their own unique experience and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program: THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, integrative hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives! KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways - by coaching the conscious and unconscious mind and helping to transform Your Story To Your Glory! She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, life-changing, healing work while still laughing and having fun!She's been a student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, plus a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Do you often feel unlovable, unworthy, or like you're not good enough? Do you often doubt yourself, find yourself talking shit to yourself or worry that you're being judged by others?Do you and your nervous system feel stressed all the way out and sorta' overwhelmed and you just wish that you could slow everything down and catch your breath? If so, you're not alone. So many of us carry old stories, limiting beliefs, and habituated patterns, from our childhood (and beyond) that keep us stuck and hold us back from living our best lives.It's kinda' like we've been conditioned by, imprinted upon and indoctrinated into ways of thinking, speaking, behaving and believing that aren't all that supportive and definitely not fun!The good news is that there are tools, techniques and practical solutions to change things and one of them I found to be helpful is hypnosis.Now you might be thinking; “Hey, I don't want to be running around clucking like a chicken, making a fool of myself”… and don't worry that is not at all how it works. [leave all that stuff to the Scooby Doo cartoons and movies!] I like to use hypnosis as a way to “de-hypnotize” people from those old stories, patterns, habits and ways of being that just aren't working anymore!There's no shame in any of this. The truth is we've all been “hypnotized” in life in lots of different ways.Think about it, even as children, we were taught to recite and “pledge allegiance” to the flag - without even understanding its meaning. We were exposed to jingles and commercials and family trauma and cultural systems that became so deeply ingrained in our minds that even now as adults; we continue to absorb messages from the media and society and family that shape our beliefs about ourselves and the world around us.It is an opportunity for you to release those old stories, patterns, and habits that no longer serve you and replace them with more loving and empowering beliefs!Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about breaking free from our old habits, interrupting our negative thoughts and casting new spells - spells of love, if you will.So if you're ready to de-hypnotize yourself and unleash your true potential, listen to this episode and then come join me for my group session; “Storytime Hypnosis”. This is a session of healing… or as I like to call it “de-hypnosis'. Hope to see you there, it's gonna' be wicked fun!KK's Takeaways:Unlock The Doors Of Your Mind (3:39)Hypnotize Yourself (14:33)Programming Starts In The Womb (17:23)Unconscious Beliefs (22:57)Shift Our Mind From Fear To Love (27:45)Storytime Hypnosis (34:27)How Does It Work? (39:24)Casting New Spells (44:51)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and...
Your correspondent, still on vacation, reviews two recent 5/5/10 sessions.1:05 Session 11:26 QQ no spade on T64ssx5x4:12 TT on T42r3ss8:27 KdKx on T75ddx3ddd11:04 AKo all-in preflop13:03 3s3x on J96ssx4xAsss14:58 KK no club on AQ5ccx7ccc3cccc18:06 AJo no diamond on QT2dxd6xKx19:49 QQ on T86r6hhTx25:51 Session 226:10 (at 2/5) AA on 875hhx27:49 (at 5/5/10) 53hh on 764shs30:38 AA all-in preflopForum Discussion: CLICK HEREhttp://twitter.com/thirdwalkinghttp://crushlivepoker.com
We're diving into the fascinating realm of global citizenship through the lens of a fantastic program called World Savvy. Our esteemed guests are Dana Mortenson, co-founder and CEO of World Savvy, a national education nonprofit working to educate and engage youth as responsible global citizens, and KK Neimann, World Savvy's Director of Professional Learning, with an impressive 20 years of teaching experience in social studies across fifth to 12th grades.We explore the changing landscape of education and the pivotal role of World Savvy in fostering global competence among K-12 students and teachers. We discuss the importance of integrating global competence into education, preparing students for an interconnected and rapidly changing world. World Savvy's approach champions project-based learning, empowering students to tackle real-world issues while honing critical thinking and problem-solving skills.Join us as we underscore the importance of global competence and adapting to change to better prepare students for the challenges of the 21st century.To learn more, visit: pastfoundation.orgWe unbox:Cultivating global competency in K-12 educationCreating a future-proof model of educationGetting everyone in the school community to work togetherResources:Learn more at worldsavvy.orgConnect with Dana on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/dana-mortenson-a691893Connect with KK on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kk-neimann-2875144Produced by Nova Media
The long fabled, sometimes loved and mostly hated SLC T3 has gone the way of the dodo. What's next for KK? The boys discuss that, Nemmy, Grizzly, Mine Blower, Cedar Fair's chaperone policy, your fan questions and so much more in this episode!
Here's a wicked good question to ask ourselves: Am I motivated by fear or Love? If you follow me at all online, you've probably seen me share some pictures of the strength training journey I've been on. It's from the interactions and questions inspired by these posts that got me thinking about what creates a desire for change - are we doing things out of fear versus because we love to do them?Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about what motivates us, what lights a fire under our ass and the intentions behind why we do what we do.Are we doing things because we hate some aspect of ourselves, or we feel the need to “fix” ourselves or we're afraid of what will happen if we don't do a particular thing?Or are we simply choosing things because we love doing them - we love how it makes us feel or the way it connects us more deeply with ourselves, others and with the world around us? Today's episode is an invitation from my heart to the heart of anyone who's listening…If you're going to do something, do it because you love to do it, do it because you love yourself (or want to love yourself), and most importantly seek transformation, change and change work for the LOVE of what's possible for you, your well-being, your happiness, inner peace and your life!KK's Takeaways:Flexing My Muscles (3:17)Do What Feels Good For You (8:25)Getting Back To The Gym (11:05)Do It For The Love Of It (13:04)Lower Your Blood Pressure (15:24)The Fear Of God (18:26)Why Am I Doing This? (20:41)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, Integrative Change Worker and Life Coach. She's also a writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Here's the thing… Life can be hard sometimes. Now don't get me wrong, life can also be wonderful and full of all magic and miracles and all kinds of incredible things like babies laughing, puppies frolicking, or getting to be on the beach. Yes, there's a lot to show gratitude for… and let's just be real, life can just sometimes be a straight up totally brutal, knock you on your ass kind of journey. Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about how life can be difficult… and even those hard moments are not something we want to skip over. The suffering and the grief comes with the territory and is part of the journey of the human experience. It's in those rough patches that we might want to cut ourselves some slack — give ourselves the room and space to grieve, get upset and move through the range of emotions that may come up so that we can heal.What we don't need when we're working stuff through or out is our own contempt or critiquing. Instead, we need to provide some breathing room, and a little bit of compassionate space for us to simply catch our breath and calm our nervous systems, so we can approach things with calm and curiosity instead of judgment.From my heart to yours, please be more gentle with yourself - extend some grace and tenderness to yourself because as we all know the world could use more of that.KK's Takeaways:Watch Your Mind & Mouth (2:35)Cut Yourself Some Slack (8:39)Slow Down Enough To Notice (13:30)Devil's Advocate vs Inner Teacher (17:45)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
KK Whitaker, also known as Christy's mom, joins the Noisy Narratives podcast to discuss her life story and her new memoir, "Flourish Because". We listen as Kay walks through her first marriage to Christy's dad and that difficult ending, as well as her heartache when she is hurt by not one, but two more men who swore to love her more than themselves. KK also shares her devastation at the loss of her son through suicide. Her love for God and her belief in His sovereignty shines through the conversation. This is a story of endurance and thriving through suffering. We hope this podcast inspires you to live fully with those you love.
Thank you to Better Help for sponsoring this episode. Visit http://BetterHelp.com/KitAndKrysta for 10% off your first month Thank you EwinRacing for our beautiful new desk! Get 20% off your order using the code KK using this link: https://bit.ly/3lGIBQV (US) https://bit.ly/3JMB8b0 (Canada) *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Hello and welcome to episode 61 of the Kit & Krysta Podcast. Today we're going to be spotlighting one of our favorite people of all time, Mr. Iwata. We'll tell you why The Super Mario Bros. Movie is actually the culmination of Mr. Iwata's vision for Nintendo that he was championing over 10 years ago. We miss him so much and we're grateful to have known him. We know that seeing the success of the Mario Movie would have made him proud. Also in this episode, we tell you a really fun story about Mr. Miyamoto and his favorite food. It's the end of the first quarter of 2023 so we do a little check in on the games we've played so far and if there is a GOTY contender among them. One of us beat Resident Evil 4 Remake so we go into that in detail in the games we are playing segment. We dig into the news and answer some great questions from our wonderful Patreon subscribers. All this and more is coming up. 0:00 - Let's-a go 11:16 - Nintendo Storytime - Mr. Miyamoto loves In N Out (he has good taste) 24:22 - Quarter year GOTY check in 39:14 - Games we are playing 56:18 - News news news + Mr. Iwata's vision discussion 1:23:46 - Questions from our Patreon subscribers Thank you to our Patreon Super Stars tier! Aaron Hash, Ben Eichhorn, MaruMayhem, Eigenverse, KissMyFlapjack, Mike Chin, Mr. Rogers, Roy Eschke, Switchingitup_, Sephazon, TheSharkAmongMen, vgmlife, Link The Hero of Winds, Angela Bycroft, TurboChargeNerd, Thomas O'Rourke, Kyle LeBoeuf, Twindragons76 Follow Us! https://www.patreon.com/kitandkrysta https://www.youtube.com/@kitandkrysta https://twitter.com/kitandkrysta https://www.tiktok.com/@kitandkrysta https://www.instagram.com/kitandkrysta/ http://www.facebook.com/kitandkrysta/ -Kit & Krysta
I love this quote from my brilliant friend and today's guest, Linda Thai. She says, “Trauma isn't just what happened, that shouldn't have happened. It's also what didn't happen, that should have happened.” Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're once again super-duper lucky to be talking with trauma therapist, educator and storyteller Linda Thai. Whenever I spend time with or speak with Linda - I always walk away having discovered something about myself, learned something new or have an opportunity to stretch myself through visiting places of creative tension.So buckle up for the ride, because in this episode, we go on a fantastic journey that covers a range of topics that I think will land, resonate, create curiosity and be helpful for so many listeners!One of the things we discuss is her newest therapy that walks people “back in time” to face the hurt, pain, and people in their past, and ultimately helps release some of the burden of their childhood traumas.In providing the space to speak through their younger selves to the ones that hurt them, this liberating process leads to a greater understanding of the actions of the adults in their life who failed to provide the care they so desperately wanted and needed. It is through these powerful realizations, that individuals find their way to release the burden of childhood trauma and move forward as a more empowered version of themselves.This episode isn't just about surface level healing, it's an invitation to dive deep into ourselves and to learn how to be better advocates for ourselves and others on their journeys. The possibilities are endless. Get ready to embrace a whole new perspective on healing!PS - If you haven't listened to the first episode I did with Linda - EP114 - Our Bodies Hold Our Stories - I encourage you to check it out… I think you'll love it!KK's Takeaways:Secure Attachment (15:00)Sharing The Blessings (29:50)The Purpose Of Therapy & Healing (39:47)Understand Each Other (47:25)Social Media Is Not A Safe Space (1:02:52)Get Out Of Your Comfort Zone (1:21:13)Relationship Advice (1:29:39)Earn The Love (1:40:35)Linda Thai is a somatic therapist, trauma therapist, mental health clinician, storyteller, and educator who has had her own lived experiences of individual, collective, historical and cultural traumatization...and healing. She uses her background in trauma therapy, somatic therapies and yoga to guide others through steps that help you to recognize and safely release tension through resourcing the body. She believes in empowering others through education and skills, thereby igniting potential and fueling your innate desire to learn, to grow, to heal.Connect with Linda:WEBSITE: https://www.linda-thai.com/FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/LindaThaiCoachingConsultingRECOMMENDED READING: https://www.linda-thai.com/resources/recommended-readingsKaren Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for...
Shawnna Sumaoang: Hi, and welcome to the Sales Enablement Pro Podcast. I'm Shawnna Sumaoang. Sales enablement is a constantly evolving space, and we're here to help professionals stay up to date on the latest trends and best practices so that they can be more effective in their jobs. Today, I’m excited to have Kristin Klinkner from Zumper join us. Kristin, I would love for you to introduce yourself, your role, and your organization to our audience. Kristin Klinkner: Hi Shawnna. I am the sales enablement manager at Zumper, which is a platform you can use to find your next rental property, whether long-term, short-term, or vacation rentals, we have them all in one place. We’ve got a fantastic user experience and because of that, we attract our audience organically, and then we’re able to provide our clients with high-quality leads for renters to their properties. I’ve been at Zumper for a bit over two years. I’m a team of one, and this is the first job I’ve had with the official sales enablement title. I took a really non-traditional path to a formal sales enablement position as I spent the first 18 years of my career in the non-profit sector. The last 15 of those were for the American Cancer Society, where I started as a local staffer working on raising funds through events and sponsorships in a local community. I moved into a manager role and then into a national role coordinating corporate engagement strategy for some of the world’s largest fundraising events. I didn’t realize it at the time, but all of that work in the early part of my career was sales. Fundraising is sales. My national role was really sales enablement. I built the strategy, infrastructure, marketing, resources, support, and training for thousands of employees and tens of thousands of volunteers to attract corporate financial support, essentially B2B sales. We were hugely successful raising around 80 million per year for cancer research and support through just my B2B programs, but when Covid hit, our in-person fundraising event method for the American Cancer Society had to change as our strategy for bringing in revenue. My department was eliminated, as I’m sure many people can relate to back during the pandemic, but I really saw that as a great opportunity to find a role that encompassed all of what I truly love doing and it boiled down to the positive impact, the changes in programming, infrastructure, and strategy for gaining corporate partners through others providing the resources necessary for others to be successful in landing those partners, not doing it myself. That’s what I really loved about the last role I had there. We also had just gone through a transition to Salesforce as our CRM and I liked learning the technology and figuring out how I could use that technology to help our fundraisers achieve goals. I started looking at the SaaS world and tech companies and startups, and I discovered some podcasts, probably sales enablement PRO, that mentioned sales enablement. As I dug in and joined webinars and online career fairs like I know you all hosted, I heard leaders in enablement talk about their roles and strategies to be effective, and I knew this was the right place for me, but I needed to figure out how to translate my career in nonprofits to sales, and that’s where a huge network of sales enablement professionals were really sold me on it and helped me find my way. It was really scary at first, but I started being vulnerable and just asking to connect with some of those speakers in those webinars and asking them just to connect or give guidance. So many of them were willing to chat and give coaching advice and connect me to other leaders. That’s really where I started to take off, and one of the best pieces of advice I got was to do a better job of clearly translating fundraising to sales. That piece of coaching that I received. When I figured out how to do that, I very quickly secured a few offers and accepted my first enablement position. That’s a really long-winded way to say that the coaching I received allowed me to see a clear path to achieve what I wanted to do with my career shift. I immediately started finding ways when I got into that sales enablement role to build the type of into the company where I work now. SS: I love that. One of the things that stood out to me about you on LinkedIn was that you really focus on building a sales culture that values coaching, as you mentioned, and celebrates success, which I can’t stress how important that is these days. I’d love to learn more about some of the ways that you’ve built this into your company’s culture. KK: I really do value a strong culture of coaching and celebrating wins in a sales team. Coaching is not something that came naturally to me, but I’ve seen that as more and more people in an organization embrace it, we can achieve greater things. Taking a step back for a second, about me, I’m a doer, a problem solver. When I was younger, I felt if I could just figure out a way to do something and then share it with other people, they could just copy what I did and we’d all be fantastic top performers, right? That didn’t go over super well, especially when I became a people manager, so I did a lot of introspection and work on emotional intelligence, and that helped me see that I didn’t need to, nor should I, solve everything for everyone because when I tried to do that, nobody was bought in and they really didn’t adopt my solution long term even if they gave it a shot. Learning about and improving my EQ helped me figure out how to be a coach instead of a fixer, and that really gave better results for the whole team. There’s a quote in an episode of Ted Lasso that has really stuck with me, and it’s something to the effect of all people being different people, and that’s what I think building a culture of coaching can do. Explaining to our sales leaders or coaching them to see that all of the sellers on their team are different and need different approaches and methods of feedback delivery and have different learning styles is a good way to introduce some initial changes to our onboarding and ongoing development opportunities. The way I did that was by adding role plays to our formal onboarding and training cadence. I know people hate role plays, because I kind of hate them too, but the vulnerability you need to show and the trust that you need to give that everybody there on that call or who’s giving you feedback is there to help you. All of that helps build engagement and really solidifies every person on a team or, hopefully, solidifies for everybody on the team who’s involved with this, that they are a valuable part of that team or that company and the shared success. When you’re open to receiving that help, many times it results in growth or a tangible win that then we can call attention to. It's sort of a cycle, right? Then as we start seeing those wins, based on a result of something we learned in a role play, it gains acceptance as a development strategy and garners buy-in for continuing that type of exercise. Even when I ask really directly after a role play, like, how’d you feel about that, I usually start by sharing where I messed up and saying like, ooh, I felt really awkward at this part. Then people also feel like it’s okay to say like, yeah, I didn’t love that either. In the end, they always talk about what they did learn and how it really did help them feel more comfortable with whatever skill they’re working on. It’s kind of those shared awkward experiences that propel a team to build stronger bonds, have more engagement, greater success, and then eventually enjoy helping others and celebrating those successes as a team. SS: I love that. One of the ways that you’ve improved coaching at your organization is through sales management training to help them also become better coaches for their reps. Why are the role of the manager and their effectiveness as a coach so important, especially amid changing times? KK: I think we can all agree that coaching is better in the long run. For somebody coaching them to find a result is better than me just fixing it. I think we can also agree and I can get a team of leaders to agree that if I’m the only person providing that coaching that’s not very effective either. Having several people in an organization who are strong coaches out in the field with our sellers can really amplify my work in enablement. I can’t be in every sales meeting and my particular industry is very face-to-face for our sales, so I can’t even listen to recorded calls to give coaching. That’s not a function of our company for me in enablement that I know a lot of other companies have. Instead, it all has to be done either as a group on a call or face-to-face when out in the field and really making those presentations. When I know that a manager who is going to be in some of those meetings is capable of providing the coaching a seller needs to improve, or even just to keep doing the things they’re already really good at, that’s easier for me to focus then on correcting skills and knowledge gaps that can be detrimental to our sales. It’s amplified even further when our sellers feel comfortable coaching each other. So we incorporate that a lot at Zumper too. For example, as I said, our industry is multifamily real estate. I didn’t know anything about that when I started here. I know how to sell and I know how to do enablement and coaching, all that kind of stuff, but multifamily, I’m not the expert there. Luckily we have a lot of those, like Patty, one of our VPs. She provides a lot of the coaching right alongside me for our sellers and where I can point out a different strategy or execution or something like that, Patty has actually had these conversations with clients so many times. The coaching that she provides is a whole other level of credibility and expertise, and when she takes the time to coach, it really encourages our sellers to grow because they see that somebody else, a teammate is investing her time in them and they can also see that these things work because of the massive success that she’s had in her career doing the same thing that they’re doing. SS: I love that. What does that sales manager training program look like though? What do you think about measuring the success of that program? KK: A lot of our sales leaders are competitive and they want to be the best. On that road, it’s maybe easy to default to ‘I’ll just fix it myself now and I’ll try to remember to talk to you more about this later'. The way we build our manager training is that it’s a lot of practice and it is, again, those live role plays and exercises and really learning and ingraining it in your day-to-day work how to take that pause and maybe rewire those managers for the tendency to immediately fix for somebody else, and instead shifting to ask questions and coaching a seller to see the fixes that they need to make for themselves. That’s often a big change for a manager. I often start by explaining the benefits in the terms of what’s in it for me. The manager may have more time to do other things or focus on other team members, build strategies, and even maybe take some time off that they don’t seem to find enough time to do during the year. When we flip it in the terms of like, what’s in it for me, it might be a little uncomfortable at first for me to not just fix this and to see if they can work through it, but in the long run, it is going to pay off. Then, we teach how to coach instead of fixing and hardwiring that defaults to coaching. We practice coaching over a substantial period of time, so it’s not just a one-and-done type of learning. This is a really ingrained long-term program that we work on all the time. Practicing with other leaders, with me, applying what they learn to sellers and receiving feedback and coaching on their own coaching, and then we repeat it over and over again, and that’s what helps it to stick. When they start using it and seeing the growth in their teammates, the bigger or more frequent wins that they get, they really become invested in coaching as a strategy for leadership and it helps the culture of coaching really take hold at our company. Some of the ways that we measure this, yes, you can see more frequent wins or bigger wins or things for each of the sellers you’ve been working with. There are some of those sorts of lagging indicators that you can see movement, but there are other ways that we measure this at our company, and that is through engagement surveys. What we’ve seen as we’ve started to build the culture of coaching where we’re all supporting each other and working together to get better and improve, we see that people are really connecting with each other and that has improved our engagement scores tremendously. It’s really helped build a lot of teamwork when we are mostly remote and don’t actually get to see each other face-to-face very often. SS: I love that. I have one last question for you. You have mentioned on LinkedIn too that you’ve seen some exceptional business outcomes from this approach to building a healthy sales culture. What do you think about tying the impact of sales culture back to things that the business cares a lot about? KK: I think one of the things our company focuses on a lot is our core values. We’ve got five core values and we like everybody to feel part of the team. We call each other roomiez with a Z at the end. It’s funny, we add Zs to everything, so roomiez with a Z. When I started during the height of Covid, a lot of that engagement and people were shifting to a remote environment and they really started feeling disengaged, not just with each other, but I think even with the company. As we, in the sales team, started to build that culture where we’re all going to work together on this thing, we’re going to help each other out and we’re going to celebrate those wins, we really have seen an improvement in commitment to our company, commitment to the key performance indicators and the objectives of our organization, and just a real general enthusiasm to achieve it together and to do whatever you need to do, help wherever you need to help build the relationship within the company internally even, or eternally with clients in order to build that culture that we’re looking for in our company, which is just very inclusive and celebratory. Did that answer your question? SS: That did. It’s important I think, to your point, to ground it back into the core principles of the company, so that makes a ton of sense. KK: Obviously we have hard dollar goals and numbers to hit, but a lot of times what I’ve seen is sometimes it is just like a feel and those can be just as important to hit those number goals as well. SS: Absolutely, because, well, there’s number goals behind some of the fields too, like retention of your top employees and all that fantastic stuff. Also, mental health keeps you from having to take massive amounts of sick days. Totally. KK: 100%, yes. SS: Thank you so much for joining us. KK: Thank you for having me. SS: To our audience, thanks for listening. For more insights, tips, and expertise from sales enablement leaders, visit salesenablement.pro. If there is something you'd like to share or a topic you'd like to learn more about, please let us know we'd love to hear from you.
Rambling Through Everyday Life Podcast
Y'all are in for a treat with the fabulous Kristin Kluck, a personal chef who is the wife of Ted Kluck and will instantly feel like your new best friend. We ask her all the things we need to know to make the kitchen less intimidating. KK explains how to create fresh, simple meals including steak, fish, & veggies. For picky eaters, she shares her genius hack for sneaking veggies into a delicious meal. KK also gives us a list of cooking essentials, including the budget-friendly chef knife we all need in our kitchens. We learned so much and had so much fun cooking with KK! Local friends, come to her pop-up this Saturday, April 15th from 11-2 at J-Town Coffee! KK's favorite cooking magazine : Cooks Illustrated KK's website: Chezvou Connect with KK on Instagram Kitchen basics we all need: Digital thermometer Chef Knife Paring knife Y- Peeler Cast iron skillet Nonstick fry pan Cookie sheets Kitchen aid mixer Silicone hot pads Immersion stick blender Lodge cast iron skillet Proverbs 16:24: "Kind words are like honey— sweet to the soul and healthy for the body." We LOVE connecting with you! Join our Facebook group • Follow us on Instagram • Follow us on TikTok • Follow us on Pinterest
Life is like some kind of wicked big experiment.And like all experiments, some things will go great and some things might fail and one thing for sure is there will be mistakes.Through these mistakes, we're all gonna' be invited, in one way or another, to maybe learn something, heal something, grow from something or see something from a different perspective. Sometimes we'll be clumsy and slip up with our words or actions, and we won't always get it right. Depending on what has happened to us along the way, making mistakes can make us feel like not only did we do something wrong, but that WE ourselves are wrong. Like we screwed up and are now somehow worth less because of it.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about shifting our perspective on making mistakes, embracing them and learning from them what we can do better the next time around.We all make mistakes and in my opinion each one can be a valuable lesson. They can be a way for us to learn what works for us, what it is we really like or don't like, where we have strengths and weaknesses, where we need to draw the line and what boundaries we aren't willing to have crossed.The key is to recognize the pattern of making the same one again and to stop ourselves from running in this loop or casting shame.Mistakes are part of the human experience – and our humanity is part of what makes us beautiful and brilliant.So I say, go live, be yourself and make mistakes, and then learn from them shame free… embrace the lessons they might bring and keep moving forward with curiosity and the new insights and knowledge you've gained!KK's Takeaways:Making Little Mistakes (3:45)Afraid To Make Mistakes (9:07)Learning In Our Younger Years (11:52)Proof The World Wasn't Safe (18:18)Internal Effects External (21:43)Experience Is Important (30:38)What Did You Learn? (36:17)Time Can Be A Great Healer (44:13)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Your correspondent reviews a portion of Nik Airball's recent interview with Doug Polk, in which Nik describes what it means to be "good for the game." Your correspondent discusses what being "good for the game" means in for the games he plays in and for the the lives he and other mid-stakes pros are trying to lead. The Airball/Polk interview: https://www.youtube.com/live/WTFM_dEj_XU?feature=share&t=27730:17 On being good for the game15:30 A brief recap of an annoying few weeks of poker16:10 Mistaking variance for dynamics at the table that aren't actually there17:20 JsJx on Q54rTss21:46 Bad vibes in a 5/10 session24:00 JdJx on J84xdd2ddd5x25:21 AxKd on QQJr2dd9x26:39 AQo on QTJrAx928:07 KK on 985cxcKdd29:57 JJ (no diamond) on AQ4ddx5ddd2dddd31:42 J9cc on KT6cxc3ccc9xhttp://twitter.com/thirdwalkinghttp://crushlivepoker.comFor discussion: CLICK HERE
Thank you EwinRacing for our beautiful new desk! Get 20% off using the code KK using this link https://bit.ly/3lGIBQV (US) https://bit.ly/3JMB8b0 (Canada) *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Hi, so we don't do video game reviews BUT apparently we do movie reviews. Welcome to a very special edition of the Kit & Krysta Podcast where we review The Super Mario Bros. Movie! We got a chance to see the movie early at the world premiere. If you haven't seen our vlog from the event, check it out now! We can't wait for you to see the movie and tell us what you think. Let us know in the comments below some of your favorite moments and easter eggs. As always, thanks for watching and we'll see you later! Follow Us! https://www.patreon.com/kitandkrysta https://twitter.com/kitandkrysta https://www.tiktok.com/@kitandkrysta https://www.instagram.com/kitandkrysta/ http://www.facebook.com/kitandkrysta/ -Kit & Krysta
As it tells us in the ancient text of the Bhagavad Gita, “On this path, effort never goes to waste and there is no failure. “Meaning that even a little bit of effort toward your own spiritual awareness can yield protection from the greatest fears. Because a lot of times, one of the ways that we can combat our fear and anxiety is simply by taking the next, most aligned, smallest step.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about our committed actions and how even the smallest, most consistent efforts can yield incredible results and how important it is to acknowledge and appreciate them. So here in this moment, I welcome you to celebrate the little hinges in your own life that swing open the big doors of your dreams, hopes, visions, or whatever your ministry, mission, message, or mandate is in the world!Those “big door” things you're trying to create in the world; whatever that looks like, I encourage you to just take the next smallest, most aligned step and consistent action towards your goals!KK's Takeaways:Celebrate What You Did (8:46)A Little Effort Can Yeild Great Results (12:40)Little Hinges Swing Big Doors (16:00)Use The Tools (20:30)Get Stronger & Feel Healthier (24:21)Habits Of A Happy Person (30:06)Commit To Aligned Consistent Action (38:26)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Life is full of all kinds of sales pitches! Even if you're not a business-owner or entrepreneur, in your own way you're still “selling” somebody something or trying to persuade the people around you. Just think about the last time you tried to get your kid to go to sleep, or suggested a meal to your sweetie, or tried to convince your friend to watch a particular show or movie. We may not even realize it, but we're always marketing our ideas and opinions. How we do that can vary drastically, depending on the situation and or what we've been taught.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're taking a closer look at the difference between “promising” people an outcome, versus sharing the powerful possibilities a client could experience in their work with us. The thing we don't want to forget is that part of the outcome (what people get out of it) - depends on their participation, proactiveness and priority (what people put into it.)This is why I prefer to dwell more in the realm of what is possible, to tell the truth about what becomes possible when we're willing to do the work, put in the effort and stay consistent and committed!KK's Takeaways:Transformation Requires Change (8:47)How Do You Know? (15:43)We Are Not Special (19:31)Be A Willing To Be Part Of The Process (27:44)Promises (33:07)What Becomes Possible (38:02)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter.An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she...
Joining us this week is the head coach of the hottest team in America. That's right, Trevor Large, Bench boss for the Canisius Golden Griffins! First, Connor and James break down the latest in college hockey news (NCAA Women's Frozen Four, Last Weekend recap, Shay Dono glue guy, Pro signings, Hobey finalists, Weekend Predictions, Gophers vs Michigan pregame at KK, Alaska to the moon, etc.) Next (25:11), Trevor joins the boys to talk about the best thing on earth: Atlantic Playoff Hockey. Hear about what makes this Canisius team special, how they're gearing up to host a Conference Championship to go to the NCAA Tournament, what made him want to be a coach, having the most electric Elite Prospects photo ever, playing for Ferris State, his advice to all coaches, and much more! Thanks again to our sponsors: Take Profit Trader, Enduraphin & Draftkings for helping us grow the great game of college hockey and thank YOU for listening! Need more college hockey coverage? Follow us here: Everything College Hockey ◦ Website →https://www.echlocker.com/shop ◦ Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/everythingcollegehockey ◦ Facebook → https://www.facebook.com/everythingcollegehockey ◦ Twitter → https://twitter.com/TeamECH ◦ Tiktok → https://www.tiktok.com/@everythingcollegehockey Tag us on social media: #Everythingcollegehockey #ECH Gambling Problem? Call (800) 327-5050 or visit gamblinghelplinema.org (MA), Call 877-8-HOPENY/text HOPENY (467369) (NY), If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (CO/IL/IN/LA/MD/MI/NJ/OH/PA/TN/WV/WY), 1-800-NEXT STEP (AZ), 1-800-522-4700 (KS/NH), 888-789-7777/visit ccpg.org (CT), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), visit OPGR.org (OR), or 1-888-532-3500 (VA). 21+ (18+ NH/WY). Physically present in AZ/CO/CT/IL/IN/IA/KS/LA(select parishes)/MA/MD/MI /NH /NJ/ NY/OH/OR/PA/TN/VA/WV/WY only. VOID IN ONT. Eligibility restrictions apply. Bonus bets (void in NH/OR): Valid 1 per new customer. Min. $5 deposit. Min $5 bet. Promo code req. $200 issued as eight (8) $25 bonus bets. Bonus bets are non-cashable and cannot be withdrawn. Bonus bets must be wagered 1x and stake is not included in any returns or winnings. Bonus Bets expire 7 days (168 hours) after being awarded. Promotional offer period ends 3/19/23 at 11:59 PM ET. See terms at sportsbook.draftkings.com/basketballterms No Sweat Bet (Void in OR): Valid 1 offer per customer. Opt in req. Valid only on college basketball bets 3/13/23 - 3/19/23. First bet after opting in must lose. Paid as one (1) bonus bet based on amount of initial losing bet. Max $10 bonus bet awarded. Bonus bets expire 7 days (168 hours) after being awarded. See terms at sportsbook.draftkings.com/basketballterms. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
“Evolved Masshole” is a term I coined to describe the process of moving away from shame or guilt about our younger selves and moving towards love and understanding as we adapt, transform, grow and change over time! Today on the Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about releasing the shame we sometimes carry around the actions, behaviors and choices from our younger years. Those earlier versions of ourselves that were just doing the best they knew how to find a safe place in the world. So no matter where we're at in our journey, let's embrace and celebrate those parts of ourselves without judgment or shame, and instead forgive where needed and embrace our growth and journey with humor and love. From my “Evolved Masshole” heart - to whatever kind of heart you're carrying around these days - just know that I appreciate you, I see you and I celebrate those parts of you, even the ones that you might still have a little awkwardness about — and together let's keep moving forward into the evolvement of our truest nature; Love. KK's Takeaways:Massholes Are Defined By Their Feisty Spirit (11:10)People Pleasing Is Not The Answer (27:00)Anxiety, Stress & Trauma (35:15)When We Evolve (39:31)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
What I see talked about a lot in the world, and especially in the personal development, coaching, transformational and “spiritual spaces”, is the learning process. People want to know how we learn to do things like; create new habits and build new neural networks in our brains.They want and even ask for help learning how to be the best version of themselves, and how to do X, Y, and Z. But the part a lot of people skip, or that doesn't get a lot of attention, is that at first there has to be an unlearning process.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about what it takes to unlearn our old ways of being before we can step into the new ones.It's through my own personal life experience that I discovered, if I try to be a bull in a china shop and come into a situation with just my sheer willpower to force change or overthrow my long-standing habits - the ones that have been in place forever - without trying to undo first… I am going to run into some resistance and eventually maybe even hit a brick wall.WHAM!! Change comes to a screaming halt!!If we want real, lasting change we have to understand that before we can learn, before we can relearn, before we can remember who we truly are, we have to unlearn and let go of who we've been.Are you ready to let go?KK's Takeaways:We Have To Rewire (4:35)Pattern Interrupts (8:56)Stop Old Patterns (13:47)The Unlearning Process Is Powerful (16:57)Change your Habits (19:17)We Were Born With Love (21:30)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter.An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Integrative Hypnotist, change worker, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
We often divide ourselves into categories like pro vs. amateur or as a friend and I used to joke: VARSITY vs. JV. Despite these differing levels of experience and expertise, we're all humans who sometimes mess up – simple as that! Rookie mistakes – we all make them, even the pros! But with every mistake comes a lesson we can learn; it's up to us how often and quickly we choose to use that knowledge from previous mishaps as fuel for our future development.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about making mistakes, reflecting on our setbacks; and asking ourselves where we could improve and how we can show up as our best self.Don't let the fear of failing hold you back. Instead embrace your mistakes and glean wisdom; it's where greatness can be born.KK's Takeaways:From Tomboy To Leader (4:38)Difference Between Professional + Amateur (7:18)Rookie Mistake (16:56)Chump or Champ (21:35)Getting In Our Own Way (27:22)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Welcome to the Grow Thrive Inspire Podcast, Season 6 Episode 1. In this episode, we are delighted to introduce Baristago Coffee Co., a brand-new coffee shop in Osage Beach, down KK at Lake of the Ozarks. The passionate owner, Ashley Hayes, opened Baristago with the intention of providing the surrounding community with a high-quality coffee experience, all while bringing locals together and promoting local! The shop offers a wide selection of coffees and specialty drinks, from espresso and cappuccino to iced lattes and cold brews. The beans are locally roasted, ensuring that each cup of coffee is as fresh and flavorful as possible. Baristago also offers delicious pastries and other treats, and meals to accompany your coffee. Ashley, and her team are committed to providing an outstanding customer experience. We spoke with some of the regulars and found that they enjoy the cozy atmosphere and the friendly staff, who always make them feel like family. In this episode, we get to know Ashley and find out what inspired her to open Baristago. We also discuss the importance of supporting local businesses and learn some tips for creating an exceptional customer experience. We hope you enjoy this episode of Grow Thrive Inspire. Thank you for listening and don't forget to support Baristago Coffee Co.! Connect with Ashley on Facebook at @baristagocoffeeco!
In this Tech Talks Daily podcast episode, I'm joined by Kalyan Kumar, the Global Chief Technology Officer at HCL Technologies & Chief Product Officer at HCL Software in London. We discuss the impact of technology trends on businesses over the next year. One of the main topics of the conversation was the role of cloud infrastructure in the quantum revolution. According to Kalyan, by 2030, businesses will no longer be talking about which cloud services to use but how the cloud can deliver on business priorities so they can be ready for the quantum era. The quantum market is predicted to reach $1 trillion by 2035, and businesses must level up their cloud infrastructure to take advantage of this next generation of computing. However, only those businesses that have nailed the cloud and made it instinctual to them will benefit from the full potential of quantum. Another topic discussed was the move toward carbon neutrality in the tech sector. HCL Technologies has committed to becoming net zero by 2040, reflecting the increasing pressure from customers for organizations to become greener. KK believes that the tech industry, one of the planet's biggest producers of carbon, will focus on developing new approaches for trapping and removing carbon dioxide from the air. This will lead to a significant focus on carbon sequestration in the next decade in enterprise IT. Kalyan Kumar's insights provide a glimpse into the future of technology and how it will impact businesses. Cloud infrastructure will be a crucial aspect of the quantum revolution, and organizations must level up their cloud infrastructure to take advantage of this next generation of computing. In addition, businesses must also consider their environmental impact and focus on achieving carbon neutrality to meet the growing demand for a more sustainable future. Only by embracing these changes will businesses be able to thrive in the coming years.
Kæru Endalínu hlustendur, Fimmtudags þáttur þessa vikuna! Við ræðum landsleikinn við Spænska stórliðið, það er allt undir á Sunnudaginn með troðfulla höll af Georgískum ljúfmennum. Hvað gerist á KKÍ þinginu, hvernig verða reglurnar? Elvar Már Friðriksson í léttu spjalli og kemur með nýjustu tíðindi af spurningarkeppninni! Allt í styrku samstarfi með Cintamani, Viking Lite og Brons og auðvitað á bestu stöðinni, Podcaststöðinni!
If you're a loyal listener, you may remember, a few months back, I was doing a podcast episode where I dropped a line mentioning I was doing a little “shameless plug” about something I was offering - complete with my own silly sound effects. My podcast person, Aaron, thought it was hilarious and she made a funny clip of it for me. This moment caught on camera got me thinking about something I believe is wicked important about self-promotion, shame and shining your light.So this episode is a little love letter from me to all the people who are out there trying to create things in the world, who have big or small dreams and who are doing something new or scary or trying something else in their business, once again. Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about how we don't need to be ashamed about sharing our excitement with the world about the stuff we're working on, what kind of magic we're creating or what kind of programs we're offering in our business.We also dive into how some people in the world, unfortunately, including the ones closest to us, have a way of just sh*tting on our dreams and trying to shut them down. Of course they don't always do it on purpose, but here's the thing… countless dreams have been stopped in their tracks because of family members, friends or whoever is trying to make you believe it's not cool to get “too excited” about what we're up to.Well, guess what? I'm not interested in being cool. Ha! I'm just interested in being myself and so I want to touch back on the concept of the shameless plug. I mean why should there be any shame at all, around sharing what we've been up to or dreaming about? If you are an ambitious dreamer and are tired of people dragging down your dreams and aspirations, then this episode is for YOU! KK's Takeaways:Shame Around Sharing (3:27)Who Do You Think You Are? (8:07)Not Everybody Has Earned The Right (12:07)Share What Lights You Up (17:09)No More Shame (21:50)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Integrative Hypnotist, Life Coach, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Listen up, metalheads! This is not a drill! We've got the legendary KK Downing on Chris Akin Presents... and he's spilling all the details about his new band KK's Priest. If you call yourself a true metal fan, you better tune in because this is an episode you cannot afford to miss! KK talks about the band's lineup, the creation of their new killer tunes, and even sets the record straight on why he's more entitled than anyone to call his band "Priest". And if that's not enough to get your blood pumping, he also gives us a glimpse into what the future holds for KK's Priest! So don't be a poser and hit that subscribe button right now to never miss an episode of Chris Akin Presents..., where we bring you the most exclusive interviews with the biggest names in metal! BECOME A VIP: https://bit.ly/cms-vip GET A FREE RUMBLE ACCOUNT: https://rumble.com/register/classicmetalshow/ GET A FREE ODYSEE ACCOUNT: https://odysee.com/$/invite/@ClassicMetalShow:a Please SUBSCRIBE, click the notification bell, leave a comment or a like, and share this episode! **NOTE: Everything said here, and on every episode of all of our shows are 100% the opinions of the hosts. Nothing is stated as fact. Do your own research to see if their opinions are true or not.** Get all our episodes at www.chrisakin.net. Facebook: www.facebook.com/chrisakinpresents Instagram: www.instagram.com/chrisakinpresents Twitter: www.twitter.com/realchrisakin Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCol9mEEohs58oVsvtcnCevA --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/cmspn/message
A second working over JBP and KK. Lots to talk about here in terms of pantheism and the contemporary fashion of the unnecessity of "religion". @JordanBPeterson Konstantin Kisin and the Counter-Woke Revolution | EP 333 https://youtu.be/xnpUFLD_xlw Paul Vander Klay clips channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX0jIcadtoxELSwehCh5QTg Bridges of Meaning Discord https://discord.gg/hYkJNRuq https://www.meetup.com/sacramento-estuary/ My Substack https://paulvanderklay.substack.com/ Estuary Hub Link https://www.estuaryhub.com/ If you want to schedule a one-on-one conversation check here. https://paulvanderklay.me/2019/08/06/converzations-with-pvk/ There is a video version of this podcast on YouTube at http://www.youtube.com/paulvanderklay To listen to this on ITunes https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/paul-vanderklays-podcast/id1394314333 If you need the RSS feed for your podcast player https://paulvanderklay.podbean.com/feed/ All Amazon links here are part of the Amazon Affiliate Program. Amazon pays me a small commission at no additional cost to you if you buy through one of the product links here. This is is one (free to you) way to support my videos. https://paypal.me/paulvanderklay Blockchain backup on Lbry https://odysee.com/@paulvanderklay https://www.patreon.com/paulvanderklay Paul's Church Content at Living Stones Channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCh7bdktIALZ9Nq41oVCvW-A To support Paul's work by supporting his church give here. https://tithe.ly/give?c=2160640
Kk Naimool was born in Trinidad and Tobago and followed a winding path to Beacon. Kk, who uses all pronouns, has worked closely with Newburgh's LGBTQ Center and the Cornwall school district to support gay and trans people. She is also on Beacon's Human Rights Commission and helped found a consulting group called Collective Justice that works with mutual aid pods and other community nonprofits. “Wherever you start is a good place to start,” Kk says in this surprisingly hilarious interview.
Leopold and Lobe - two brilliant guys, and two awesome co-hosts (KK and Bri Bri)Support the show
When you're trying to make progress or bring about a change in a particular area of your life, seeking support, guidance or direction outside of yourself, is one of the greatest tools at your disposal. You might often find yourself stuck in your own habits, patterns, stories, identity and ways of doing things, and enlisting a mentor who has walked the path before you - can help you to see your problem from an alternate point of view. Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about how beneficial it can be to bring in another perspective. Enlisting the assistance of someone who has experience and expertise will allow you to, as I like to say, “borrow their brain” and explore different methods for solving a problem, seeing yourself in a new light or examining a situation from another angle. This kaleidoscopic point-of-view allows for new perspectives and getting yourself the feck' out of your own way'.The reality is, your best thinking is usually what got you to where you are right now - so maybe it's time to “borrow a brain” and seek out another way of thinking in order to change, grow, heal, take action or move forward.KK's Takeaways:Light Your Torch From Your Teacher's Fire (7:39)The Power Of Borrowing A Brain (12:07)When You Don't Have It All Figured Out (20:14)How To Ask (27:43)There Is Value In Borrowing Someone Else's Brain (36:47)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
For MSWL's 10th anniversary (we know! We can't believe it either!) we've invited KK Hendin, co-founder, who made us legit within four minutes of the first tweet. ***The next MSWL day is February 16, on Twitter *and* on your favorite platforms*** We talk about how we went from Tumblr to a real life site to a site where agents and editors could update their own wishes (Jessica and KK were updating them manually before that), the stories we've heard of how it's impacted writing life, and the amazing, serendipitous coincidences that made it all possible. Please note that, as of Monday, ManuscriptWishList.com will go into version 4.0! Check out the site for a list of upcoming updates (rolling out slowly over the next few weeks).
Over the course of my life I've had way too many of what I like to call, “universal signs” to not pay attention and listen to them.They've given me so many incredible and fun opportunities, such as my first introduction to Marianne Williamson, discovering A Course of Miracles, finding the spot for my first yoga studio… to now in 2023, having a beautiful, new space to work with clients in.You may find there are some super scientific people that would say, these “universal signs” are really just because 95% to 98% of our decisions are coming from the unconscious mind and I'm just not aware of them - and maybe this is the case – but what I know to be true is that it works for me and has been a gift in my life!Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about how something more Divinely Intelligent than me always seems to know my path or my next tiny step even before I do. They nudge, impress, speak up and propel me forward into what I am made for in that current moment. My only job in those moments is to slow down enough to become consciously aware, listen to what I'm feeling and hearing, trust and recognize what's happening and then have the courage to ask …Does this feel aligned?Does this feel congruent?Does this light me up?…and if so, then to finally just say yes and take courageous action on whatever the next step may be. Whether we call them Universal signs, synchronicities or coincidences doesn't matter to me and whether we say it's my intuition, inner teacher, Holy Spirit, gut instinct, divine guidance or Spiritual Team On The Job (STOTJ), I don't really care. I just know that for me it happens a wicked lot of the time and I've learned to trust it. I also believe it's something that all of us can become more sensitive to, more aware of and more finely attuned to, if we make knowing ourselves a priority and pay attention to how we respond to things like: people, places, projects and collaborations as a either full bodied “Yes!” versus a full bodied “No!”Are you receiving your Universal Signs?KK's Takeaways:My New Magical Space (9:51)In Person Versus Online Work (17:48)Spirit Speaks On My Behalf (23:58)What's The Lesson (32:50)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime...
Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking to my first ever podcast guest (EP04), Jordan Dranes or some of you may know him as, “Conscious Muscle”. When I first saw Jordan online over 7 years ago, I was so impressed with him being a vegan bodybuilder, an animal activist, a dad, the founder of Conscious Muscle: Online Fitness & Nutrition Coaching, co-founder of a 100% Vegan Supplement Company and a successful entrepreneur with a huge following - who uses his platform to not only help animals, but to help humans, too. The work he does and what he stands for inspired me and created so much curiosity, I just had to reach out to him!Jump ahead to now, I wanted help creating a Kick-Ass strength and conditioning program that would also include all of my nutrients and macros (from a vegan standpoint) and I knew Jordan was the ONE to call! In this conversation, Jordan and I are telling stories, talking shop and busting some vegan myths, bro-science and misinformation about vegans, being vegan, going vegan and how it's absolutely possible to build muscle, get strong and be healthy - without the cholesterol, carcinogens and cruelty to animals from eating them!Jordan's motto is, “We kill workouts, not animals!” and in today's episode we dive deep into what it means truly to be a heart-centered vegan. I've been vegan for 20+ years and Jordan went vegan 9 years ago - so we also share what inspired us to start our own journeys and to make that change.So, whether you're already living a vegan lifestyle, looking for some new information or are just starting out on your path of wanting to make the switch, Jordan is my super-duper smarty pants friend, trainer and coach, who can provide you with the right info, inspire your journey forward and answer the usual kinds of questions that come up so often; like, “How do you get your protein?”This is a really down to earth, raw, honest, passionate, in-the-moment conversation between two friends, peers, colleagues and also clients of one another! We go with the flow in this episode and we also hone in on the points and places where our lives intersect. So buckle up for safety (click, click) and most of all, I hope you enjoy this wicked fun conversation between me and one of my favorite people on the planet, Jordan Dranes of Conscious Muscle and CM Supplements.[JUST A HEADS UP:] This episode contains some sensitive topics where Jordan and I share some deeply personal stories, that include graphic details of violence and adult language. KK's Takeaways:Jordan's Story Of Self-Defense & Prison (10:07)When You Have Great Losses (18:48)All Beings Want To Live (24:12)Question Your Entire Belief System (36:06)Transitioning To Vegan (46:04)Tracking Your Macros (56:25)Be Your Best Self (1:19:15)Bodybuilding Vs. Powerlifting (1:35:21)Vegan At Competitions (1:42:08)Consciousness (1:49:24)Meet Jordan DranesJordan Dranes is a vegan coach, bodybuilder/powerlifter, animal activist, a dad, and a plant-based entrepreneur from Southern Florida. He's the founder of Conscious Muscle: Online Fitness & Nutrition Coaching and the Co-founder of Conscious Muscle Supplements, which is a 100% Vegan & Cruelty Free Supplement company. His motto is, “We Kill Workouts – Not Animals”. He's also a big proponent of Mental Health awareness and the power of personal development! JORDAN'S SOCIAL MEDIA LINKS: CONSCIOUS MUSCLE WEBSITE: https://consciousmuscle.net CM SUPPLEMENTS: https://cmsupplements.com/ INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/conscious_muscle/ FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/consciousmuscle YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/@consciousmuscleKaren Kenney is known for her dynamic...
Slam the Gavel welcomes Sylvia Beachy and Kajal (KK) Emmett to the podcast. Rescue The Fosters is founded by Sylvia Beachy and Kajal Emmett. Sylvia Beachy has 5 years of experience working in the foster system. She has had many roles that include Staff Member, Case Manager, Transporter, Parent Aide, and Behavior Aide. She started out as a staff member at Elks Aidmore group home which is where she met KK. KK was a foster youth at Elks Aidmore! However, KK had aged out of the system with absolutely no place to go! This began the journey of Rescue The Fosters. Their mission is to give the children and youth in Foster Care a voice! They also provide resources to youth aging out of the system to keep them off the streets and out of prisons! Additionally, they also strive to keep FAMILIES TOGETHER! Therefore, they additionally assist families navigating the CPS! Excellent conversation regarding how foster children are in "survival mode" at all times. They have been ripped away from their families and question themselves or if anyone loves them. In Foster Care, the goal is surviving. Sylvia Beachy told her story of how she started out in the system and how workers become desensitized with new influx of children coming into the group home. She also told her story of meeting a young man wearing a homeless sign and she got out of her car and questioned him. He told her he had gotten out of Foster Care with no PAPERWORK. Sylvia helped him get the paperwork he needed to get a job and find his biological mother. Sylvia's message: LISTEN TO THE CHILDREN. Kajal Emmett explained that she was just a little girl roaming the streets as an orphan and how a police officer found her and took her to the proper authorities and he guessed her age by her teeth. Sylvia explained that they still don't know her true age. KK stated to all youth in Foster Care not to be afraid and not to be trapped by fear, that they have rights and to keep track of all paperwork, emails (make copies) and documents.https://youtu.be/qhzuSxirGGMTo reach Sylvia Beachy and Kajal Emmett: RescueTheFosters@proton.me and 770-861-0898Rumble "INSITE" Podcast Thursday 7:30pm ESTSupportshow(https://www.buymeacoffee.com/maryannpetri)dismantlingfamilycourtcorruption.comSupport the showSupportshow(https://www.buymeacoffee.com/maryannpetri)http://www.dismantlingfamilycourtcorruption.com/
Solving Healthcare with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng
In this episode we welcome critical care nurse practitioner, Kali Dayton, DNP, AGACNP. Kali is a member of the Society of Critical Care Medicine and host of the ‘Walking Home From The ICU' podcast. Kali works closely with international ICU teams to help transform patient outcomes. They focus on early mobility and management of delirium in the ICU. She joins us to chat about her early days and experience in the ICU, sedation in patients and the effects of mobility of patients in the ICU, medications, how she helps with patient healing and more. Kali tells us about what inspired her to start her podcast and shares a story about her experience with an ICU survivor.SPONSORBETTERHELPBetterHelp is the largest online counseling platform worldwide. They change the way people get help with facing life's challenges by providing convenient, discreet, and affordable access to a licensed therapist. BetterHelp makes professional counseling available anytime, anywhere, through a computer, tablet or smartphone.Sign up today: http://betterhelp.com/solvinghealthcare and use discount code “solvinghealthcare"TRANSCRIPTKK: We are on the brink of a mental health crisis. This is why I am so appreciative of the folks over at BetterHelp everybody the largest online counseling platform worldwide to change the way people get help with facing life's challenges by providing convenient, discreet, and affordable access to licensed therapists. BetterHelp makes professional counseling available anytime, anywhere through a computer, tablet, or smartphone. Sign up today go to better health.com And use a promo code solving healthcare and get 10% off signup fees.SP: COVID has affected us all and with all the negativity surrounding it, it's often hard to find the positive. One of the blessings that has given us is the opportunity to build an avenue for creating change. Starting right here in our community discussing topics that affect us most such as racism and health care, maintaining a positive mindset, creating change the importance of advocacy, and the many lessons we have all learned from COVID. If you or your organization are interested in speaking engagements, send a message to firstname.lastname@example.org or reach out on Facebook @kwadcast or online at drkwadwo.caKK: Welcome to ‘Solving Healthcare', I'm Kwadwo Kyeremanteng. I'm an ICU and palliative care physician here in Ottawa and the founder of resource optimization that one, we are on a mission to transform healthcare in Canada. We're going to talk with physicians, nurses, administrators, patients and their families because inefficiencies, overwork and overcrowding affects us all. I believe it's time for a better health care system that's more cost effective, dignified, and just for everyone involved. KK: Kwadcast nation super exciting episode I got flowing with you. We got Kali Dayton. She is a nurse practitioner that has taken ICU delirium, ICU mobility so seriously, she's got her own consulting firm. She also has her own podcast ‘Walking from the ICU'. Such a great phenomenon. So, we got her you'll hear this episode. It's a live cast that we did a couple of weeks ago. I'm just proud of her. Someone that's taken getting people healthier and out of the ICU and functional seriously, and we need more of that going on right now. We're only gonna see higher demands. So, without further ado, I'm gonna bring Kali on but first, check out our latest newsletter, kwadcast.substack.com It has everything Kwadcast, our episodes, or newsletter, guest blog appearances, guest vlog appearances, you're gonna love it. Kwadcast.substack.com Check it out. Without further ado, I want to introduce you to Kali Dayton. Welcome to the podcast.KD: Thank you so much for having me on. I've been following your podcast; I appreciate your mission. I see a lot of our objectives are in line.KK: Oh 100% 100%. So, Kali, can you walk us through your story? You're a nurse practitioner. That is, like I said, changing the outlook for critically ill patients. How did you get here?KD: Absolutely. I'm sure a lot of my listeners know my story very well. I started out as a brand-new nurse, many years ago, over a decade ago, in awake and walking ICU. That's just what I call it now. That's the term that I've coined to describe what they do there. In the interview in my naivete, I was just excited to be there. I had no idea what they were talking about when they asked, ‘Would you be willing to walk patients that are on ventilators?' and I was willing to do anything, right. I was just brand new graduate. I said yeah, of course absolutely teach me everything. I didn't understand the magnitude of that question until probably three to eight years later. Because when I started working there, no one made a big deal out of it, for decades and that ICU it's a medical surgical ICU, its high acuity, they've had a COVID ICU throughout the pandemic. They've maintained it this practice of allowing almost every patient to wake up, usually right after intubation, unless there's an actual indication for sedation. What's been intubated on mechanical ventilation is not an indication for sedation. So, unless they have an inability oxygen with movement, seizures and cranial hypertension, something like that, otherwise they are awake. They're reoriented and they're allowed to communicate, tell us what they need. We manage their pain according to what they tell us. They're usually mobilizing shortly after within hours after intubation, and throughout the day, and throughout their time on the ventilator. So that was completely normal. No one told me ‘Hey, Kali, this is the gold standard of care. This is the model for all early mobility protocols in the world' Everyone knows about this ICU. No one told me that. So, I spent a few years there thinking that that was normal critical care, medicine, knowing none the wiser. Then I became a travel nurse, and I went to other ICUs in the in the United States. My very first contract when I walked into the ICU, it just felt different. But I knew I expected things to feel different, right? It's a new environment. But everyone was in bed. Everyone looked like they were asleep. There were very few signs of life, and I got my patient assignment, and the patient was sedated and on the ventilator. I didn't know why they were sedated. I wanted to continue my routine, do a neuro exam, hopefully get the patient in the chair ready for physical therapy, because that was my routine, in the wake & walk ICU. A lot of times physical therapy comes out of that patient is in the chair waiting for the physical therapist, take them on a walk even on the ventilator. So, I asked my orientee nurse, ‘Hey, can I get this patient up and take him for a walk?' and she looked at me in horror and said, ‘No, they're on the ventilator. They're intubated' What didn't make sense to me, because I've cared for at least hundreds, maybe even 1000s of patients that were on the ventilator and were awake and walking. I had no idea what she was talking about. I said, ‘I know that they're intubated. But why are they sedated?' ‘Because they're intubated?' and I say, ‘Okay, but why are they sedated?' and we went in circles. That was the first time it ever crossed my mind that a patient would be automatically sedated, just because they were intubated. I quickly realized that that was the common perspective throughout the ICU, that I was the odd man out there. Here's the thing. Despite my years of experience, treating patients like that, I knew how to do it. I didn't know why we did it. No one had taught me what sedation actually does. No one taught me what it's actually like for patients, and how much it changes outcomes. So, in that environment, I didn't have the tools to support my approach and my practices and to advocate for my patients. I was still kind of a new nurse, and I was, you know, you just had to fit in in the ICU. There's so much peer pressure, there's the culture is such a huge part of it. I ended up just taking the ‘When in Rome' approach and I just went with what I was surrounded with, and I ended up following along sedating my patients. I didn't really obviously know the difference. I mean, I saw a difference in outcomes. I saw patients stay on the ventilator for far longer. I missed the human connection, I noticed that there were a lot of tracheostomies and nursing home and LTech discharges that I did not see the way can walk in ICU 93% of survivors from that high acuity medical surgical ICU that I came from, went straight home after the after the ICU.KK: That is nuts. That is nuts.KD: That's what I thought was normal. So, I was noticing things, but I couldn't really put my finger on it. I couldn't advocate and I just went with it. Right. I even laughed at some of the nursing jokes about yeah, I hope my patient sedated, and totally snowed today. Thinking that that was funny, and it wasn't till years later that I was in grad school. Of course, even in my acute care doctorate program, nothing was mentioned about sedation or mobility practices. It was just assumed even in our case studies, it was assumed that if a patient came in with pneumonia, they were going to be sedated if they were on a ventilator. I was on a plane ride, and I sat next to a survivor. When he heard that I was a nurse and ICU nurse, the color dropped from his face. He started telling me about his experience over four years before that moment when he was a patient. He told me what it was like to be on a ventilator. He just barely mentioned the ventilator. All he could fixate on was what it was like to be in the middle of a forest with his limbs nailed to the ground and trees were falling down on him and he couldn't run away. Demons were coming to the sky and lots of things that he still couldn't talk about, because he was so deeply traumatized. I was stranger on this plane and he's sobbing to me, telling me about what he experienced. Of course, I wanted to diagnose him and I said ‘it sounds like you had ICU delirium' but that meant nothing to him. I came to realize as I listened with real empathetic ears, that that wasn't just a nightmare. Those weren't hallucinations. Those were vivid and real. He was psychologically scarred as if he physically lived through those scenarios. I was really shaken. I really hoped that he was one in a million, because he was telling me that for year after discharge, it was really difficult to relearn how to sit, stand, walk, swallow, that was really hard. The hardest part was that for year after discharge, every time he closed his eyes, he would be lost back in that forest back in that scenario, and he could not sleep. So, the depression, anxiety, physical disability, I didn't ask about the cognitive function because I didn't enough know enough to know that he wouldn't be at high risk of having post ICU dementia. He said that he still had not returned to his career. His life was over. He said ‘I know I feel bad even telling you this, I should be grateful to the ICU to him for saving my life, but my life is over. The life I knew before the ICU is gone. I lost my life in the ICU. If I were ever to become sick, I would never cross a toe back into the ICU. He was a DNR/DNI in his 40s, with no other real comorbidities because he never wanted to live through that again. I think what he meant by that was ICU delirium. I had worked in the ICU about six years. We have never I never heard anyone talk about anything like that. So, I thought this must be a fluke, he must be one in a million. So, I went survivor groups. I thought I would have to post and ask survivors questions. No, the second I got into survivor group, I just scroll through and almost all their posts were about the trauma suffered under sedation and these medically induced comas, what it was like to not be able to balance their check book, read a book, read a clock, like they were barely able to text. These are people thinking ‘How long is this going to last? my brain is not the same'. So that is what got me into looking into the research. I was shocked to find decades of research, exposing the harm of our normal practices. Yet we continue to do those things and I was back in that awake and walk ICU. Seeing a completely different way and I've seen this contrast from what I experienced for years as a travel nurse. Then where I was currently at as a doctorate student, nurse, and then I started working as a nurse practitioner, in that same ICU. That's when I started this podcast ‘Walking home from the ICU' to show what they were doing in the ICU and now it's turned into ‘how do we revolutionize our normal practices in the ICU?'KK: I got so much here, first. I never even would have comprehended or would have thought that your initial experience, I didn't realize that your initial experience was people were able to ambulate and get out of bed and reduce the amount of sedation. KD: People are gonna say ‘Oh, well, that must have been, you know, long term mentors or not that high acuity' They were the first ICU to publish the study back in 2007, showing that it was safe and feasible to walk patients on ventilators and in that study, they had PF ratios less than 100.KK: What that means in nonmedical folk is that your lungs were extremely damaged and require a lot of supplemental oxygen to make sure your saturations are high enough that your oxygen levels are high enough. So, this is the sickest of the sick. From a breathing perspective, getting up and hustling and movement answered. So that is amazing. From a personal side, it must have been an absolute mind F that you couldn't, that you went from one extreme to the other. I'm doing tell you from my I've worked in several ICUs in my country, and the latter is the norm, people aren't getting up on a ventilator, you know, they're not getting, they're barely getting up into a chair on a ventilator. KD: They aren't even getting sedation vacations, they're snowed. KK: One of my main jobs in the ICU when I walk in is minimize the sedation and even often I've seen in practice, they're getting Dilaudid or opioid infusions for no real reason to be honest with you. They're not post op. They have no pain syndrome and we're given pain medication in infusion, which accumulates and what you're describing to amongst patients, my other job is in palliative care when they get toxic or delirium. Delirium from medication. Yeah, that can be traumatic, these memories, these images. That must have been an absolute frustrating experience to go from one version to the other.KD: I was just really confused. I mean, I was still I feel like I'm still new in my career and impressionable. No one taught me the why that's the unfortunate thing about a lot of our medical education is we're taught how we're taught task lists, but we're not taught the why that allow us to critically think and see a bigger picture. I feel like looking back I was really victim to that. I but I would still ask every ICU ‘So, shouldn't this patient get up? Can I get them up?' because it I knew that was beneficial. I wanted that and a lot of it for me was, I wanted to see my patients get better. When you're walking a patient moments later, you know that they're progressing, you get to connect with them, you get to know who your patients are, I had no idea who my patients were, they were just bodies in the bed. That's not why I got into medicine. So even just selfishly, I wanted them to be off sedation, had I known that by taking off sedation, we could decrease their seven-day mortality by 68%. Oh, I would have been all over that, but I didn't know. I did work in one ICU, where they had some level of ABCDEF bundle, which is a protocol to help guide teams to minimize sedation and get patients up. There's such a spectrum of compliance and different approaches to it. So, I was taught to do an awakening trial, which means you turned on sedation. The purpose really should be to get them off sedation, it should be sedation cessation, but I was taught. So, you know, at five o'clock in the morning, we must turn down sedation, it's super annoying, I know but just turn it down. Wait to see them thrash - that's how you know, when you see all their limbs move that they haven't had a stroke. When you can tell they can't tolerate the ventilator, then you turn the sedation back on and call it a failed trial, just chart it. I was confused. I didn't know what the objective was, I didn't know what we were doing. I didn't know why they were agitated. For her to say it's because I can't tolerate the ventilator. That was confusing to me because I'd seen so many patients tolerate the ventilator. I didn't understand delirium, and I hated awake new trials. They were laborious, they were stressful, they felt unsafe. It's hard to see patients between delirium, it's hard to see them be so uncomfortable, and you can see the terror in their eyes. But again, when in Rome, I just did what I was told, unfortunately. So, this is my journey now is almost my penance for the harm that I caused my patients during those years. KK: Well, Let's be honest, Kali, you can't be looking at it that way, man. We all remember sedation is the norm. What we're doing now is trying to advocate for change. I can't emphasize enough the change can be dramatic for people like it really comes down to function. If you in the ICU and you're paralyzed into intubated on sedation and analgesia, you're not moving, like you're not using your muscle. Then when you're trying to go back to what you want it to where you want it to be. I think a lot about our COVID patients. They were in the 40s/50s/60s, that are trying to get back to working, trying to get back to doing the activities that they love to do. When you think about this not only are you impacting their ability, like they're not getting to their functional level, but what's it doing for their family. Now you got a loved one that's got to take care of them, that might have to take off time off work too. It just is an absolute amplifier when people can't be functional.KD: For those that maybe don't work in the medical field, or even especially those that do, here's what we're not talking about the bedside, here's what we're not telling patients and families. When we go into surgery, they give us informed consent, they tell us here are the remote risk that things that could happen, right. What we don't do before intubation for patients and our families is tell them the actual risks of sedation. We don't understand ourselves that sedation is not sleep, it disrupts the brain activity so severely that they don't get real REM cycle. So, my perspective is that it's a form of torture, really, I mean, that's what we do, and war in the military, we deprive people of sleep, and that's what we're doing to our patients when we give medications that make it so they cannot get restorative sleep. Many of our study, sedatives are myotoxic, meaning that they're toxic to the muscles, so it causes more muscle breakdown. Then on top of that, if there's absolute disuse when you're stopped sleeping deeply sedated, you're not even contracting a muscle usually. So that disuse makes it so that our muscles break down more. That disruption of sleep often caught is one of the mechanisms that causes delirium, which is acute brain failure. It's an organ dysfunction. That can turn into long term post ICU, dementia, cognitive impairments. So, they cannot return to their normal lives can't take care of their families can't go back to their jobs because they can't. Cognitively their brains can't function the same way anymore. They have this post ICU PTSD because of those vivid scenarios that they live. I'm not going to call them hallucinations, because that's, that's not accurate. Those were real to them. We just don't see that big picture of sedation, and we just don't even question and I do that a lot in my life too. They're things that I'm just taught that I don't question, but we don't question whether or not sedation is necessary. Sometimes it is. When we understand how risky it is, then we can do a true risk versus benefit analysis for each patient to say, ‘they're intubated for this reason, does that necessitate sedation?' If not, let's get it off and see what they need. Let them communicate. Let's prevent delirium. Your platform is all about preventative medicine. In the ICU you come in with one acute critical illness and we sign them up for chronic conditions?KK: Absolutely, as you said, like it really is about what can we do to prevent this from becoming a chronic condition. Honestly, it's a culture change, from what I could see. What's sad about medicine, is that we have data to support how bad things are or how good things are. The amount of time we invest in create that change is limited. If you look at the data for sedation vacation, so that same principle of, turn off someone's sedation, periodically, that we know that has positive outcomes, like we know that, but you could go through an ICU, throughout any country in North America and the odds are that they're not getting it routinely. Why doesn't that happen? That's why I'm proud of Kali. Number one, being a champion of this, ICU care sucks, but a lot of us that will end up in there. So, we want to be able to optimize care, but also like just doing some about it. It's one thing to want to bring attention to it but also, being an activist. I think it helps. So, you've got the podcast, Kali, you've done some other work, how else have you been able to increase awareness? You could even get into like, what the podcast also has done for you or in the people around you?KD: So with a podcast, I started that right before COVID hit. I don't know if your god person but I, God told me to start a podcast in December 2019. I barely even listened to podcast didn't know how to start one, but I couldn't. I couldn't rest. I knew exactly that I had to start, I had to put out 32 somewhat episodes by the beginning of March of 2020. I didn't know why it had to be so fast and so furious, and survivors came out of nowhere. I interviewed my colleagues, researchers, it was just this miraculous setup that just came together, put out all these episodes, and then COVID hit. I thought ‘well now it's all gonna be all about COVID, and no one's gonna care about this'. God back handed me and said, ‘This is for COVID They're gonna be millions of people on ventilators, how is this not relevant to COVID'. So, I continue to throw out COVID Even though I recognize that the ICU community was not really in a place to revolutionize. The hard thing is that this could have been so beneficial to COVID we created more work for ourselves with the sedation practices, you talked about awakening and breathing trials. Once I just looked at only wake & breathing trial started sedation, turn it off once a day and then turn it back on. Decrease ventilator days, by 2.4 days, days in the ICU decreased by three days in that hospital decreased by 6.3 days, when we're in a staffing crisis, we need to have a process of care that's efficient actually gets patients out of the ICU. Instead, we created this bottleneck where patients are now stuck on the ventilator because they're too weak to breathe on their own. Even if their lungs are better. Now they need tracheostomies. They're stuck in a ventilator. We can't at least in the States, we couldn't get them to LTACH because LTACH's were too full of all the other COVID long term patients. So, then the ICU wasn't rehabilitating these patients, and so then they develop more hospital complications, and then they ended up needing more care. It's just we created so much more work for ourselves. It just was a hard time to really take on a new endeavor and totally change your practices. But during COVID, everyone ran back to the 90s. Not everyone but a lot of people ran back to the 90s. As far as using benzodiazepines, higher doses of sedation, deeper sedation longer times, there was so much fear. We did a lot of fear-based medicine. So, I just kept chugging along with my podcast, knowing that the community was going to need healing after all of this. We were going to need a lot of rehabilitation within our own clinicians, but also within our practices. So now, teams are coming to me saying what we're doing now. We're still doing COVID care even these are not COVID patients, we're still we're back to deeply sedated patients. Where are we lost so many seasoned clinicians, new clinicians came in during COVID. They've been trained to deep deep, deeply sedate, they don't know how to move patients they're scared to. But one team said I look on my ICU It's not an ICU, these aren't ICU patients. These are LTACH patients. These are rehab patients that we're not rehabilitating. We're bottlenecked. We can't get these patient outpatients out, we can't get new patients, we're stuck. We're creating that kind of scenario. So now, I work as a consultant and I do training with the teams, I teach them the why the reality of delirium, giving them a picture of an awake & walking ICU using real case studies, pictures, videos, so that we have a vision of what could be I feel like the ABCDEF bundle when it was rolled out in the mid 2000's good change happened, a lot of things moved forward. I do feel like we didn't explain fully the why behind it. Until every ICU clinician hears the voice of survivors, they won't be afraid of sedation, they'll still be inclined. We started, we continued this start sedation automatically, then at some subjective point down the road, start to take it off, when they come out, agitated, turn it back on, we just didn't, we didn't give them this perspective of ‘Hey, most patients should be awakened walking. Here's how to treat delirium and here's how the team works together' we put a lot of it on nurses, which is not fair, feasible or sustainable. So, as I work with teams, I tried to really give them a foundation of why, and then how, how to treat patients without automatically sedating them. When the sedation necessary. How do we navigate appropriate and safe sedation practices? When do we use it? How do we mobilize patients, I go on site with teams and I do simulation training, we do real case studies and practice and the whole team practices together. Because it's a skill set, we think about pronation, when we started printing patients, everyone was terrified. And it took so many people and it took so long, you know watching every little line and now teams flip them like pancakes, right? It becomes a skill set. So, I tried to get them opportunity to practice that on a pretend patient. So, they can think through critically think through the scenario, think through delirium, thanks for ICU acquired weakness, then practice mobilizing patients with different levels of mobility.KK: My brain is going like, the whole time, it's like you need to come see our group.KD: Let's do it. I'll hope on a plane tomorrow – I can't actually. I'm going to Kentucky tomorrow, but let me know I'll be there!KK: We would absolutely love to have you. Just knowing where a lot of clinicians lack is hearing the voice of the people that have gone through it. Clearly, that's been a motivator for you in terms of why we need to pivot and provide less sedation to our patients and mobilize our patients and avoid them from having all these secondary complications as a result of being immobile. The means are there. KD: The data is strong; the data is really powerful. I mean, decreased mortality by 68%. Who doesn't want to do that, right? So, but almost even more powerful are the voices survivors, when you hear their voices in your head when you're sitting in a patient. It's haunting COVID, there were times when patients could not oxygenate the movement. I had to sedate them. I hated it. I just felt sick because I, I just didn't know what they were experiencing. I didn't know if they were in pain. I didn't know what was going on underneath that they were going to live with us the rest of our lives, it's because of the survivors that have interviewed on my podcast, they are the educators.KK: Yeah, I have so many ideas going through my head. I would love after when we jump off, links to the some of the episodes from the survivors that we can pass along to our group, to our show in general, but our group to give a sense of what it really is like to go through this. Yeah, our patients don't come I mean, every once in a while we get a patient come back and say how they're doing but they don't give us the they don't give us the negative side, they really focus on showing some gratitude. KD: Which is good, but if they came back, it's probably because they weren't too traumatized to come back. The ones that don't come back. I mean, why would you go back to the place that you are sexually assaulted?KK: Yeah, no, yeahKD: It's like to trigger and some people can't even go the same street as that hospital. On my website under the resources tab, the clinician podcast, at the bottom, the page is organized by topics. One of those topics is survivors of sedation and mobility, as well as survivors of an awake & walk ICU. So, you can hear their different perspectives and testimonies, it's organized by different topics. KK: You're an organized cat, I'm looking at it right now. I can tell you, you're very structured and organized just by the way your website is set up. It's on point.KD: It's curriculum. This is education, this is not just a hobby. I mean, this is we've got to make sure we get the right information to the right people.KK: You're so boss. You're gonna be running an organization one day, and ICU, I don't know. I see big things for you.KD: We'll see. I mean, I have a lot of optimism for the future of critical care, going to conferences, meeting with people at the bedside podcast listeners reaching out. It's not just me that cares about this. That's why I continue is that there are so many people that I call revolutionists, sometimes as the lone voice in their ICUs. But they're bringing big changes, they're making waves there so my motivation with podcasts is to provide the ammo, the quiver the arrows in their quiver, so that they can share that with their colleagues get more buy in, so that they don't have to reinvent the wheel. It's a lot to change a perspective and change a culture. It's hard.KK: Yeah, and maybe just seeking some advice, we had Dr. Wes Ely on the show and how to create some culture change around this issue. I want to hear your perspective. Kali, how do you think you do create that culture change? Because you bring this up to many staff, and they'll be like, ‘Oh, they're gonna extubate themselves? Oh, we're short staffed. This is not gonna be able to work.' What are your thoughts?KD: Yeah, this has been a lot of my journey is figuring out what are the barriers? and how do we address them? I think we're over the checklists. I think it is important to systemize and protocolized our practices. When we implement these kinds of changes, we this can't just be “Hey, Nurse, take off the sedation' that is not going to work. They have some valid fears at all I had ever seen. With a patient coming off sedation. After days, two weeks of sedation, I would have a lot of inhibitions. When I'm busy. I don't have time to wrangle that patient. I don't have time to make sure they don't self extubate. I have a Thank you for reading Solving Healthcare Media with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng. This post is public so feel free to share it.whole episode on unplanned extubations, but delirium increases the chances of unplanned extubations by 11 times. So, it's just changing the perspective understanding what is delirium? why should we be panicked about it? What causes it? We are practices are some of the biggest risk factors and culprits of delirium in the ICU, and to learn doubles that are in hours required for care. So, when we're short staffed, why would we create a delirium factory? When it doubles our workload? It doesn't make sense, but when that's all we know, we don't understand that there's a better way to do it. So, my approach when I go to help a team have culture change is to, again explain the ‘why' give a perspective of what could be, here's what patients can be like, when we don't sedate them. If they when they wake up after intubation, it's like coming out of a colonoscopy. Endotracheal tubes not comfortable. Here are some tools to help make it more comfortable. Here's how we can talk to them. Give them a pen and paper, I would get agitated and panicked. I couldn't communicate. Here's how you involve the family, here's the toolbox to help you succeed and have that patient be calm & compliant. And they will protect their tubes. I've had patients write ‘please be careful my tube' That's what I need to experience. So, when you find a couple of case that isn't so easy hits, easy wins. Allow your team to see a patient awake, communicative, calm in even more while on the ventilator, the perspective starts to shift. Then they start to ask, okay, that was easy. That was fun. That changed outcomes. They walked up the ICU. Who else can we do this on and it starts to have a domino effect. So suddenly, we expect him to just shut up and do it. That's, that's not going to cut it. I don't think that I think that's partially why the ABCDEF bundle rollout, years ago was not has kind of gone away, because we didn't provide the why. We also, again, I think starting sedation, and then taking off later, is a lot of work. We should only do that if it's absolutely necessary. Otherwise, I mean, I have an episode with a hospital in Denmark, they do the same thing and that allow patients to wake up right after intubation. They are so much easier, more compliant, because they don't have delirium, we have to understand that that agitation is usually rooted in delirium, we have to come to really be terrified of delirium.KK: I'm really enjoying this, I'm really liking this because it's even at that added perspective of saying, ‘Hey, your workload is going to be worse if people are delirious, so let's avoid going delirious in the first place' Let's just get a grip on this bad boy, out of the gate.KD: You're all about preventative and it's like, Let's prevent one of the biggest culprits of mortality. Delirium doubles the risk of dying in the hospital. So, people say we don't have time to mess with all sedation practices, like let's just sedate them and like, save their lives and figure it out later. No. By doing that, by increasing the risk of delirium, we could double their chances of dying. So, if we care about mortality, then we will care about our sedation practices. We also know that ICU acquired weakness is really laborious. When people imagine mobilizing patients on ventilators. What they're imagining is taking off sedation days to weeks later when they're delirious. They can barely lift a finger and now we're trying to mobilize these, you know, 200 plus pound adults to the side of the bed. That's dangerous, laborious, it takes so many people. If a patient walks into the ICU or into the hospital, hypoxic hypotensive, whatever. We have moments later, we haven't stabilized. Why can't they walk? Did we cut their legs off? Right? So, once we have oxygenated, perfused, what's the harm in sitting outside of the bed and seeing how they do when they're not delirious, they can tell us how they're feeling. We can provide more support on the ventilator; they can probably walk better than they did come in and hypoxic. Once they're stabilized hours later, or even 24 hours later. So that is so much easier when they maintain their ability to walk. So, in the COVID ICU, many patients were standby assists to the chair with a nurse while they were on a ventilator, because they're alone in the room, right? Physical therapy could go in and work with a patient, just scoot the ventilator wall to wall as they're stuck in their rooms, help them stand or sit, step on steps, they were alone in that room with these patients, because they were strong enough to do it, because we didn't allow them to be under myotoxic sedation and I would say rot in the bed. So, all of that plays into an ease of workload. Then obviously the get off the ventilator sooner, get out of the ICU sooner. It makes the workload easier. So, it's a little bit of an exchange and efforts in some ways. Yes, you must talk to a patient. Yes, you must assess them a little bit more. But also, could during COVID, I was hearing about swapping out propofol bottles every hour, picking up to go in and out to titrate vasopressors that we were getting just because of the sedative and hypotensive effects. All of that is effort but wasn't necessary and wasn't beneficial.KK: I'm telling you, you are changing the boogie. Yeah, changing the conversation and perspective. This is something that can dramatically impact patient care. If we could get the buy in, in the culture. Wow.KD: You know, people will say ‘Well, we don't have we're trying to save $25 million this year. We can't afford to pay our payer clinician some extra time for education or whatnot' The ABCDEF bundle, even in their spectrum of compliance, decreased healthcare costs by 24 to 30%. KK: Oh, yeah. KD: ICU acquired weakness increases healthcare costs by I want to say 30-40%. Delirium increases healthcare costs by 40%. ICU acquired weakness increases healthcare costs by 30.5%. So, by having a process of care that prevent those complications with decreased healthcare costs. So why wouldn't we, right? KK: 100%. We even we had a paper out last year showing the financial impacts of ICU delirium. We always think to have the opportunity cost, that money could be diverted into more staffing, more resources for physio, optimizing nutrition, all these things can be enhanced. If we, if we make it a priority. KD: I think it's one of our one of our strongest cards to play for staff, safe staffing ratios. To say staff is better, we'll get better care in this using this protocol. We will save you so much money so it's investing thousands to save millions or billions.KK: I love it. You're speaking my language. We are definitely going to have you back in some capacity. I don't know that for some reason. It's not just gonna be the show. I really want to get you talking to our group. Maybe regional rounds, or something. I don't know what it's gonna be. It's something that we need to hear more of talked about the patient experience, your own experience and the drive like what's pushing this. Knowing my people a lot of intensivists and an ICU nurses and allied health professionals, we want to achieve this, get our patients to a point where they are better. Really better, not just alive, but thriving. This starts here. I really do believe it starts here. So I just want to give number one, Kali some mad love on what you're doing and continue to hustle, it's paying off. Second. How do people get to know you a little bit more? and about the show and the consulting and so forth?KD: So, have a website www.daytonicuconsulting.com. There's more information about consulting services available, the podcast is on there, the podcast has transcriptions and citations organized by topics. KK: So organized folks. KD: 116 episodes, and I really didn't even know how much of a what's called a rabbit hole that this would become. There's so much to learn about the science behind what we're doing as well as the patient and clinician perspective. So, check that out, find the topics. If nothing else start at the beginning. I think the beginning lays a foundation, I was very intentional about how I organized it at the beginning to lay a foundation of ‘why' and ‘how' comes later. I'm on Instagram @daytonicuconsulting, Twitter, Tik Tok. Go ahead and set up a consultation with me send me an email and we can chat about your team, your barriers, even your family members what's going on? I'm obviously obsessed. So, I'm here for you! let me know.KK: So good. So good. Thank you so much for joining us. Those on the chat group or that are watching live. You want a piece of this episode just tap NL into the chatbox will give you a copy the video and the end the podcast when it's released. Awesome work. Congratulations.KD: Thanks for caring about this.KK: 100% KK: Kwadcast nation that's exactly what I'm talking about changing the boogie right here in ICU care. Follow us on Instagram, YouTube Tiktok Facebook @Kwadcast Leave any comments at email@example.com, subscribe to our newsletter. Essentially, it's like a membership you want to know more about Kwadcast nation. Go to Kwadcast.substack.com Check it out. Leave that five-star rating and continue to allow us to change boogie in unison. Take care, peace. We love you.Solving Healthcare Media with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Get full access to Solving Healthcare Media with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng at kwadcast.substack.com/subscribe
Spencer Kietzman fills in for KK discussing the Chiefs AFC Championship win over the Bengals, as the Lamar Hunt trophy is back at ARROWHEAD! Stan Weber joins with his thoughts on the Chiefs-Eagles Super Bowl match-up, and we end with College Basketball.
When people are trying to create solutions, they'll occasionally roll the dice and just “wing” the crap out of things. Hoping to skate by and rely on results that they've gotten in the past.Sometimes it works out. Sometimes it's a shit-show. Ha!When I was a kid I was often told, “Don't do anything half-assed. If you're gonna' half ass it, don't bother doing it.”If you want to put your best foot forward and not settle for half-ass inputs and outcomes, then that's the perfect time to call in an expert. A professional with experience and education that will help you dial a direct line to the results you're seeking.Today on The Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about making the investment in yourself and hiring the help you need to get you where you want to be. If you're looking to create change or transformation in some part of your life and business, sometimes winging it on your own just won't cut it. There are times when you need the insight, skill set and training of another person who has walked the path before you to help you navigate the way to your top!This might mean paying money to hire a coach, mentor or a trainer to guide you along the way - but the actual investment you're making is in YOU!Remember; you matter, you're valuable and you are worth the investment that's sometimes necessary to help you achieve your goals and dreams. So, how about taking that next aligned step to show up with purpose and on purpose and not just wing it?KK's Takeaways:• Going Back To The Gym (10:38)• Investing In Myself (19:58)• Willing To Be Vulnerable (25:21)• Winging It Can Be Fun But… (29:06)• Make The Investment (33:05)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Two New Yorkers A Thousand Opinions
This week the co-hosts chat about the Oscar nominations, Pasquale asks Evelyn-Google “Who invented windows?” Our Sandra- Wisdom is back with her sage words and KK buys Diana's necklace. Like us AND SHARE on https://www.facebook.com/2newyorkers1000opinions/and follow us on Twitter and Instagram and Subscribe on your preferred podcast platform --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/2newyorkers1000opinions/message
Welcome to Episode 163! In this episode, MTT Coach Gareth James and Peak Performance Mindset Coach Dr. Tricia Cardner are back discussing all things poker strategy & mindset. In this episode, the hosts answer a question from a listener who wants some advice on how to cope with your KK getting cracked by a fishy player. Topics discussed include: A quick discussion on WSOP dates and Gareth's upcoming book release The Final Table (preorder here!)Whether or not open-jamming T7o (in a satellite) with 34bb is ever a good ideaWhy it's useful to take a range perspective instead of focusing on a singular handHow to use the Occam's razor to simplify assumptionsWant us to answer your poker question?Post it in Dr. Tricia's private Facebook group! Join here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/PokerMindsetMasteryLabOr in Gareth's private Facebook group! Join here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/pokerprofits Or Tweet us: @drtriciacardner @MTTpokerschool @PokerOnTheMindResourcesCheck out Gareth's program Train and Play Like the Pros that will prepare you for large MTT series (both online and live): https://www.mttpokerschool.com/ Check out Tricia's digital offerings at: https://www.peakpokermindset.com/
Keeping Karlsson Fantasy Hockey Podcast
Lewis and Jeremy are back to celebrate the end of the workweek and the start of fantasy crunch time in style! They start with a trip through the many recent injuries and outjuries, including Makar, Crouse, and Bobrovsky missing time and Kreider's return. Then the guys tackle some KK patron questions, touching on Svechnikov's slump, Campbell's win streak (and what to do with Skinner as a result), and preaching patience on some Pens with a paucity of present production. Finally, Killorn features in the hot streaks. Follow Ben and Lewis on Twitter @ShortShiftsKK as well as Elan and Brian @keepingkarlsson. Want to stay up to date on all the latest NHL line combos, goalie starts and fantasy news, all sorted by team? Visit the absolutely essential GameDayTweets.com today. We always invite and appreciate your feedback. Let us know what you think @keepingkarlsson, and if you love the show, please rate and write us a five-star review on Apple Podcasts. * * * Join our inclusive, passionate and brilliant Keeping Karlsson community by becoming a patron of Keeping Karlsson. For the cost of one arena soft pretzel each month, patrons help us keep making new episodes and get all kinds of perks in return, like managing teams in the Keeping Karlsson Ultimate Patron Fantasy League (aka the KKUPFL), access to our patrons-only Discord Server, bonus monthly Patroncasts, and weekly show scripts. Keeping Karlsson is proudly presented by DobberHockey. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Last episode you heard from Kay and she shared how to stop the drinking spiral and unleash your Future. This episode you'll discover 3 reasons why Kay Allison is so Badass. To include: ✅her unique roadmap ✅her scripted responses and ✅for the KK love jar. --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/ordinarytobadass/message
Mike Tyson had a wicked funny quote about social media, that alluded to people getting a little too mouthy on the platforms without having any real-world consequences.Where I grew up as a kid, that shit would not have been tolerated. Ha!But I believe it's best not to just go around popping people in the face. Rather, it can be wicked helpful to learn how to direct our energy into discerning how and when to fire “warning shots” - that let people know that they're about to cross a boundary you have set. The thing is, a lot of people don't know how to set boundaries and they often end up feeling trampled on, taken advantage of or that people kinda' use them as a doormat. The flip side to that is people who don't even wait to fire a warning shot. They just go right in, stepping up toe to toe and leading with their power and aggression. So there's a lack of boundaries on both sides of the metaphorical “boxing ring”.Today on the Karen Kenney Show, we're talking about how to move through the world without becoming a doormat, but also not being a perpetrator of violence. Whether that's with your thoughts, your words, your actions, or your literal fists.I think it behooves us all to kind of know how to do this and the best way to ensure it happens is to think about it and talk about it ahead of time. Learning how to practice “nonviolent resistance” is a very powerful thing. We discover, as the ancient sages instructed us, “How to hiss and not to bite.”We learn to fire warning shots when necessary and keep our healthy boundaries intact.KK's Takeaways:Bunchie's Warning Shots (3:59)Title Boxing (7:23)Learning How To Fire Warning Shots (13:07)Keyboard Warriors (16:21)Dealing with Difficult People (20:39)Sometimes Setting Boundaries Is Hard (25:59)Karen Kenney is known for her dynamic storytelling, sense of humor, and her no BS approach to Spirituality. She's a sought-after speaker, podcast guest, spiritual teacher, and workshop presenter. An entrepreneur for 20+years, Karen brings a down-to-earth and practical approach to spiritual concepts that can be powerfully applied in both people's personal and professional lives. She's a Certified Spiritual Mentor, Certified Hypnotist, writer, speaker, and the host of The Karen Kenney Show podcast, as well as the founder of the community: THE NEST.Karen guides those she works with to create their own unique experience with spirituality and to not just “take her word for it”. In her 1:1 program THE QUEST, she brings together brain science, subconscious reprogramming, healing hypnosis, and spiritual mentorship to help her clients remove limiting blocks, rewrite old stories, rewire in new beliefs, and reimagine their lives!KK supports her clients, communities, and audiences to deepen their connection to themselves and the Divine in tangible, relatable, and actionable ways. She leads by example and shows that you can do deep, transformative, and healing work while still laughing and having fun!A student of A Course in Miracles for nearly three decades, a certified yoga teacher for 22+ years, and a longtime practitioner of Passage Meditation, Karen's also a Certified Gateless Writing Instructor, and a transformational retreat leader.
Your correspondent looks back on his approach to poker in 2022 and looks ahead to 2023. Along the way, he wonders whether it's better to stay in one stake at one casino, or to play a variety of NLHE cash games at different venues. Then, he reviews a 5/10 (and then 5/10/20) cash session.0:18 How much I played poker in 20220:59 The advantages of usually playing at the same casino4:09 The case for playing at a variety of casinos and stakes7:45 5/10 NLHE session9:14 66 on J65cxcQx13:01 KK all-in preflop14:45 AQcc on 882rQhh7hhh19:01 QdQx on J76ddxKddd22:00 AQo on QT2r6cc9ccc23:55 AA on JJ9rQcc6x25:26 QQ on 853ddx7hhTxDiscussion on this episode: twitter.com/thirdwalkingcrushlivepoker.comCLICK HERE
We had the pleasure of interviewing Track45 over Zoom video!Rising country trio Track45 announces its signing with United Talent Agency (UTA) for booking. The trio, made up of siblings Jenna, Ben and KK Johnson, will be working with UTA booking agent Lance Roberts as its day-to-day.Track45 signed to BBR Music Group's Stoney Creek Records in August of 2020 and is managed by T.R.U.T.H. Management's Missi Gallimore. The band recently released its own version of “Family,” a song written by Jenna, Ben and KK that was made famous last year when it was recorded by David Guetta featuring Bebe Rexha, Ty Dolla $ign, A Boogie wit da Hoodie. Listen to Track45's “Family,” here: track45.lnk.to/FamilyPR"I have been wanting to work with these guys for a couple of years now," says UTA booking agent Lance Roberts. "Very excited that we are finally doing it and excited for what the future holds for them with help from our team at UTA.""We are all about Family, and are so excited to add to ours by partnering with UTA," says Track45. "We are extremely thankful for their belief in us and excited to see what the future holds!"Members of Track45 have written songs for artists including Justin Timberlake, Charlie Puth, Dierks Bentley, Weezer, Lee Brice, HARDY, Lauren Alaina and others, and Ben Johnson was recently honored for five songs at the 2022 BMI Country Awards.The band is set to announce new music in the coming months. In the meantime, visit track45.com for more info.We want to hear from you! Please email Hello@BringinitBackwards.com. www.BringinitBackwards.com#podcast #interview #bringinbackpod #Track45 #Family #JennaJohnson #BenJohnson #KKJohnson #NewMusic #Zoom #NewMusicListen & Subscribe to BiBhttps://www.bringinitbackwards.com/follow/ Follow our podcast on Instagram and Twitter!https://www.facebook.com/groups/bringinbackpod
Solving Healthcare with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng
Episode SummaryIn this livecast episode, we welcome back Dr. Zain Chagla, Dr. Stefan Baral, and Dr. Sumon Chakrabarti to address some of the issues we've seen throughout the pandemic, new variants and what to expect with future variants, discussing what we've done well over the past few years, misinformation, the effect of social media and the messaging on Twitter, the role media plays and the influence of experts on policy, public health agencies, booster shots to combat new variants and who actually needs them, where we are at with public trust, and much more!SHOW SPONSORBETTERHELPBetterHelp is the largest online counselling platform worldwide. They change the way people get help with facing life's challenges by providing convenient, discreet and affordable access to a licensed therapist. BetterHelp makes professional counselling available anytime, anywhere, through a computer, tablet or smartphone.Sign up today: http://betterhelp.com/solvinghealthcare and use Discount code “solvinghealthcare"Thanks for reading Solving Healthcare with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.Thank you for reading Solving Healthcare with Dr. Kwadwo Kyeremanteng. This post is public so feel free to share it.Transcript:KK: Welcome to ‘Solving Healthcare' I'm Kwadwo Kyeremanteng. I'm an ICU and palliative care physicianhere in Ottawa and the founder of ‘Resource Optimization Network' we are on a mission to transformhealthcare in Canada. I'm going to talk with physicians, nurses, administrators, patients and theirfamilies because inefficiencies, overwork and overcrowding affects us all. I believe it's time for a betterhealth care system that's more cost effective, dignified, and just for everyone involved.KK: All right, folks, listen. This is the first live cast that we have done in a very long time, probably a year.Regarding COVID, we're gonna call it a swan song, folks, because I think this is it. I'm gonna be bold andsay, this is it, my friends. I think what motivated us to get together today was, we want to learn, wewant to make sure we learned from what's gone on in the last almost three years, we want to learn that,in a sense that moving forward the next pandemic, we don't repeat mistakes. We once again, kind ofelevate the voices of reason and balance, and so on. So, before we get started, I do want to give acouple of instructions for those that are online. If you press NL into the chat box, you will be able to getthis. This recording video and audio sent to you via email. It'll be part of our newsletter. It's ballin, you'll,you'll get the last one the last hurrah or the last dance, you know I'm saying second, secondly, I want togive a quick plug to our new initiative. Our new newsletters now on Substack. Everything is on therenow our podcasts our newsletter. So, all the updates you'll be able to get through there. I'm just goingto put a link in the chat box. Once I find it. Bam, bam, bam. Okay, there we go. There we go. That's itright there, folks. So, I feel like the crew here needs no introduction. We're gonna do it. Anyway, we gotDr. Zain Chagla, we got Dr. Stef Baral, we got Dr. Sumon Chakrabarti back in full effect. Once again, like Isaid, we were we chat a lot. We were on a on a chat group together. We were saying how like, we justneed to close this out, we need to address some of the issues that we've seen during the pandemic. Talkabout how we need to learn and deal with some of the more topical issues du jour. So, I think what we'llstart with, well get Sumon to enter the building. If you're on Twitter, you're gonna get a lot of mixedmessages on why you should be fearful of it or why not you should be fearful of it. So, from an IDperspective, Sumon what's your what's your viewpoint on? B 115?SC: Yeah, so, first of all, great to be with you guys. I agree, I love doing this as a as a swan song to kind ofmove to the next stage that doesn't involve us talking about COVID all the time. But so yeah, I think thatwe've had a bit of an alphabet soup in the last year with all these variants. And you know, the most oneof the newest ones that we're hearing about recently are BQ 1, xBB. I think that what I talked aboutwhen I was messaging on the news was taking a step back and looking at what's happened in the last 14months. What that is showing us is that we've had Omicron For this entire time, which suggests a levelof genomic stability in the virus, if you remember, variants at the very beginning, you know, that wassynonymous with oh, man, we're going to have an explosion of cases. Especially with alpha for the GTAdelta for the rest of, of Ontario, and I'm just talking about my local area. We saw massive increases inhospitalizations, health care resources, of patients having been sent all over the province. So, it was itwas awful, right. But you know, I think that was a bit of PTSD because now after anybody heard theword variant, that's what you remember. As time has gone on, you can see that the number ofhospitalizations has reduced, the number of deaths has reduced. Now when omicron came yeah, therewas an explosion of cases. But you know, when you look at the actual rate of people getting extremely illfrom it, it's much, much, much less. That was something that, you know, many of us were secretlythinking, Man, this is great when this happened. So now where we are is we're in January 2023, we'vehad nothing but Omicron, since what was in late November 2020, or 21? Maybe a bit later than that.And x BB, if you remember, be a 2x BB is an offshoot of BH two. Okay. Yeah, if you're noticing all thesenew variants are their immune evasive, they tend to be not as they're not as visually as, I see this in myown practice, like all of us do here. You know, they are, well, I'm kind of piecemeal evolution of thevirus. Now, there's not one variant that's gonna blow all the other ones out of the water, like Oh, microndid or delta. Right. I think this is a good thing. This is showing that we're reaching a different stage of thepandemic, which we've been in for almost a year now. I think that every time we hear a new one, itdoesn't mean that we're back to square one. I think that this is what viruses naturally do. And I thinkputting that into perspective, was very important.KK: Absolutely. Zain just to pick your brain to like, I got this question the other day about, like, what toexpect what future variants like, obviously, is there's no crystal ball, but someone alluded to the ideathat this is what we're to expect. You feel the same?ZC: Yeah, absolutely. It's interesting, because we have not studied a Coronavirus this much, you know, inhistory, right. Even though we've lived with coronaviruses, there probably was a plague ofcoronaviruses. What was the Russian flu is probably the emergence of one of our coronaviruses areseasonal coronaviruses. You know, I think we had some assumptions that Coronavirus is when mutate,but then as we look to SARS, cov two and then we look back to see some of the other Coronavirus has,they've also mutated quite a bit too, we just haven't, you know, put names or other expressions tothem. This is part of RNA replication of the virus is going to incorporate some mutations and survival ofthe fittest, the difference between 2020, 2021, 2022, and now 2023 is the only pathway for this virus tokeep circulating is to become more immune evasive. This is what we're seeing is more immune evasion,we're seeing a variant with a couple more mutations where antibodies may bind a little bit less. But Ithink that the big difference here is that that protection, that severe disease, right, like the COVID, thatwe saw in 2020/2021, you know, that terrible ICU itis, from the COVID, you know, for the level ofantibody T cell function, non-neutralizing antibody functioning mate cell function, all of that that's builtinto, you know, humanity now through infection, vaccine are both really, you know, the virus can evolveto evade some of the immunity to cause repeat infections and, you know, get into your mucosa andreplicate a bit, the ability for the virus to kind of, you know, cause deep tissue infection lead to ARDSlead to all of these complications is getting harder and harder and harder. That's us evolving with thevirus and that's, you know, how many of these viruses as they emerge in the population really have kindof led to stability more than anything else? So, yes, we're going to see more variants. Yes, you know, thisis probably what what the future is, there will be some more cases and there may be a slight tick inhospitalizations associated with them. But again, you know, the difference between 2020/2021/2022/2023 is a syrup prevalence of nearly 100%. One way or another, and that really does define how thisdisease goes moving forward.KK: Yeah, absolutely. Maybe Stef we could pipe it a bit on, the idea that, first of all, I just want toreinforce like as an ICU doc in Ottawa with a population of over a million we really have seen very littleCOVID pneumonia since February 2022. Very minimal and it just goes to show know exactly whatSumon and Zain were alluding to less virulent with the immunity that we've established in thecommunity, all reassuring science. One question I want to throw towards Stef, before getting into it. Youdid an interview with Mike Hart. As you were doing this interview, I was going beast mode. I was hearingStef throw down. I don't know if you were, a bit testy that day, or whatever. There was the raw motionof reflecting on the pandemic, and how we responded and far we've gone away from public healthprinciples, was just like this motivator to say, we cannot have this happen again. I gotta tell you, boys,like after hearing that episode, I was like ‘Yeah, let's do this'. Let's get on. Let's go on another, doanother show. I'm gonna leave this fairly open Stef. What has been some of the keyways we'veapproached this pandemic that has really triggered you?SB: Yeah, I mean, so I guess what I'd say is, in some ways, I wish there was nobody listening to this rightnow. I wish there was like, I don't know what the audience is. I don't know if it's 10 people or underpeople, but I think it's like, I wish nobody cared anymore. I want Public Health to care. I want doctors tocare, we're going to keep talking because you know, Kwadwo, you've had folks in the ICU we we'vewe've seen cases in the shelters, we have outbreaks, like public health is always going to care aboutCOVID, as it cares about influenza cares about RSV, and other viruses, because it needs to respond tooutbreaks among vulnerable folks. That will never stop COVID, it was just clear very early, that COVID isgoing to be with us forever. So that means tragically, people will die of COVID people. I think that, youknow, there's that that's a reality, it's sometimes it's very close to home for those of us who areproviders, as it has for me in the last week. So COVID never ends. I think the issue is that like when doesCOVID And as a matter of worthy of discussion for like the average person? The answer is a long timeago. I mean, I think for the folks that I've spoken to, and the way that we've lived our lives as a family isto focus on the things that like bring folks joy, and to kind of continue moving along, while also ensuringthat the right services are in place for folks who are experiencing who are at risk for COVID and seriousconsequences of COVID. Also just thinking about sort of broader systems issues that I think continue toput folks at risk. So, one: I think it's amazing, like how little of the systematic issues we've changed,we've not improved healthcare capacity at all. Amazingly, we've not really changed any of the structuresthat put our leg limitations on the on the pressures on the health system, none of that has changed. Allof it has been sort of offset and downloaded and just like talking about masks and endless boosterswhen we've never really gotten to any of the meaty stuff. As you said three years into it, andeverybody's like, well, it's an emergency. I'm like, it was an emergency and fine. We did whatever wasneeded, even if I didn't agree with it at the time. But irrespective of that, whatever that was done wasdone. But now it's amazing that like the federal money expires for COVID In next few months, and allwell have shown for this switch health guys got became millionaires like a bunch of people, I don't mindnaming and I don't care anymore. These folks, these Grifters went out and grabbed endless amounts ofmoney. These cash grabs that arrival, the ArriveCan app with, like these mystery contractors that theycan't track down millions of dollars. So it's like all these folks like grabbed, you know, huge amounts ofmoney. And I think there's a real question at the end of it of like, what are we as a country? Or youknow, across countries? What do you have to show for it? How are you going to better respond? Andthe answer right now is like very little, like we have very little to show for all this all these resources thathave been invested, all this work that has been done. That I think should be the conversation. That tome needs to be this next phase of it is like billions and billions and billions of dollars trillion or whatever,like 10s of billions of dollars were spent on what? and what was achieved? And what do we want to donext time? And what do we have to show for it? that, to me feels like the meat of the conversationrather than like silly names for these new variants that do nothing but scare people in a way that isn'thelpful. It does not advance health. It doesn't you know, make the response any more helpful. It justscares people in a way that I think only detracts them from seeking the care that we want them to beseeking.KK: Yeah, I think you brought up a point to about or alluded to how some of this was the distraction.That was one of the points that really stuck home is that we, we didn't really dive into the core s**t, thecore issues. This is why at the end of it all, are we that much more ready for the next pandemic that wellsee, you know, and so like maybe Sumon, what do you think in terms of another tough one, are weready for the next pandemic? Do you think we've done enough? do we think are in terms of what we'veinvested in, how we've communicated to the public. The messaging to the public. Are we learning? Is myquestion, I guess.SC: I'm a clinician and I don't work with the public health and the policy aspect as closely as Stefan does.But I will say that, obviously, I've been in this realm for quite a long time, since in ID, I think that, youknow, what that's important to remember is that for SARS 1 we actually had this document thatoutlined all of this, you know, masking, social distancing, what to do with funding and all that kind ofstuff. Basically, I was actually interviewed about this, I remember back way back in 2020, and half of itwas basically just thrown out the window. I think that a lot of what happened is that fear came indecisions were made from emotion, which is, by the way, understandable, especially in April 2020. I'veshared with you guys before that, in February 2020, I was waking up at night, like nervous, that I wasgonna die. I that that's where I was thinking I it was, it was terrible. I completely understand makingthose decisions. I think as time went on, I wish that, you know, there's a bit more of public healthprinciples. You know, making sure that we're dealing with things without, you know, stepping onpeople's bodily autonomy, for example, you know, doing things in an equitable way, where you, youknow, we all know that every intervention that you do is squeezing a balloon, you must remember theunintended consequences, I think that we did. So, kind of putting that all together. I think, right now, aswe stand in Canada if we do have another pandemic. I fear that a lot of these same mistakes are goingto be made again, I should say, a disruptive pandemic of this because it's not forgotten H1N1, thepandemic it that was a pandemic, right. It wasn't nearly as disruptive as COVID was, but I do think thatinquiry and like you mentioned at the beginning, Kwadwo was talking about what we did, well, we didn'tdo well, and making sure the good stuff happens, and the bad stuff doesn't happen again, because this islikely not the last pandemic, in the information age in our lifetimes.KK: Zain, was there anything that stuck out for you? In terms of what you'd really want to see usimprove? Or whether it is messaging, whether it is public health principles, does any of those stick out inyour mind?ZC: Yeah, I mean, I think the one unique thing about this pandemic that is a lesson moving forward andfor us to kind of deal with I think we talked about messaging. This was the first major pandemic thatoccurred with social media and the social media era, right, and where, information, misinformation,disinformation, all the things that were all over the place, you know, we're flying, right, and there doesneed to be some reconciliation of what's been we have to have some reconciliation of some of thebenefits of the social media era in pandemic management, but also the significant harms the people,you know, we're scared that people got messaging that may not have been completely accurate, thatpeople had their biases as they were out there. I will say even that social media component penetratedinto the media. This is also the first time that I think we saw experts you know, including myself andSuman and all of us you know, that you know, could be at home and do a news interview on NationalNews in five minutes and be able to deliver their opinion to a large audience very quickly. So, you know,I think all of that does need a bit of a reconciliation in terms of what worked, what doesn't how youvalidate you know, good medical knowledge versus knowledge that comes from biases how we evaluatepsi comm and people you know, using it as a platform for good but may in fact be using it you know,when or incorporating their own biases to use it for more, more disinformation and misinformationeven if they feel like they have good intentions with it. I you know, I think this is a, you know, for thesociologists and the communications professionals out there, you know, really interesting case exampleand unfortunately, I don't think we came out the other side. Social media being a positive tool, it mayhave been a positive tool, I think in the beginnings, but, you know, I think I'm finding, it's nice tocommunicate with folks, but I'm finding more harm and more dichotomy and division from social mediathese days is compared to the beginnings of the pandemics where, you know, I think, again, there's justbeen so much bias, so much misinformation so much people's clouds and careers that have been, youknow, staked on social media that it's really become much, much harder to figure out what's real andwhat's not real in that sense.KK: Absolutely, I fully agree Zain. At the beginning, in some ways, I'll tell you, ICU management, thatwhole movement for us to delay intubation, as opposed to intubation early, I really think it was pushedby in social media. So, I think it saved lives, right. But then, as we got through more and more thepandemic, wow, like it, like the amount of just straight up medieval gangster s**t that was going on thatin that circle, in that avenue was crazy. Then just like, I mean, this might be controversial to say, I don'tknow, but news agencies got lazy, they would use Twitter quotes in their articles as, evidence, or asproof of an argument. It's like, what is happening? It? Honestly, when you think about it, it was it wascrazy. It still is crazy.ZC: Yeah. And I think expertise was another issue. Right. And, you know, unfortunately, we know of, youknow, certain experts that were not experts that weren't certified that weren't frontlines and a varietyof opinions and various standpoints and epidemiology, public health, intensive care, infectious diseases,whatever is important. But, you know, there were individuals out there that had zero experience thatwere reading papers and interpreting them from a lens of someone that really didn't have medicalexperience or epidemiologic experience, that chased their clout that made money and, we know someexamples that people that eventually had the downfall from it, but you know, at the end of the day,those people were on social media, and it penetrated into real media, and then that is a real lesson forus is that validation of expertise is going to be important. You know, as much as we allow for anyone tohave an opinion, you know, as they get into kind of real media, they really have to be validated that thatopinion comes from a place that's evidence based and scientific and based on a significant amount oftraining rather than just regurgitating or applying one small skill set and being an expert in many otherthings.KK: SumonSC: So we're just gonna add really quickly is that, in addition to what Zain saying. When this stuff bledover from social media to media, the thing that I mean, at least what it seemed like is he was actuallyinfluencing policy. That's, I think that's the important thing is, so you can have 10 people 20 peopleyelling, it doesn't matter if they're extreme minority, if it's influencing policy that affects all of us, right.So, I think that's important.KK: I'll be honest with you, like, I got to the point where I really hated Twitter, I still kind of hate Twitter.Okay. It was conversation. I remember Sumon that you and I had I don't remember it was we weretexting. I think we talked about this. But the fact that policy could be impacted by what we're throwingdown the facts or the messages that we were doing on media that this can impact policy, you had tolike, especially when there was some badness happening, we had to step up. We had to be a voice oflogic, whether it was mandates, whether it was you know, lockdown school closures, whatever it mighthave been like, the politicians, we heard about this politicians looking at this, the mainstream medialooking at this, and for us not to say anything at this point, like we had, we had to do something Sorry,Stef, you're gonna jump in?SB: Yeah, I think I think what was interesting to me to see and I think a clear difference between H1N1was that in a lot of places, and including in Ontario, across the US, where this sort of emergence of theselike the science tables, these task forces, these whatever you want to call them, it was like a new bodyof people often whom had never spent a day in a public health agency. Often academics that you know,are probably good with numbers, but really don't have a lot of experience delivering services, you know,all of a sudden making decisions. So I think there's a real interesting dynamic that when you compare,for example, Ontario and British Columbia, one has this science table one does not, and just howdifferent things played out, I mean, given it's a, you know, an end of have to, or no one in each camp,but I think what you see is like, there's a place there where like public health or you know, let's say,Sweden, you know, as a public health agency that didn't strike up its own taskforce that used itstraditional public health agency. I think was in a place to make more like reasoned and measureddecisions, and just was better connected, like the relationships exist between the local healthauthorities and the provincial health authorities and the national ones. I think when you set up these,the one thing that I hope we never do, again, is that something like the science table never happensagain. That's not to sort of disparage most of the people. Actually, most of the folks on the science tableI like, and I respect, say many of them, maybe not most, but many of them, I like and respect, but it isthe case that there was it was they weren't the right group of people. They weren't representativeOntarians he was like, ten guys and two women, I think, I don't know many of them white, they weren'trepresentative socio economically, racially diverse, anything. They didn't have the right expertise onthere. I would have liked to see some like frontline nurses on there to say ‘listen, this stuff is silly' orsome frontline, whoever just some frontline folks to be say ‘listen, none of the stuff that you're sayingmakes any sense whatsoever'. And luckily, there was some reason, voices on there, but they were theminority. But luckily, they prevailed, or we would have had outdoor masking and even tougherlockdowns. I don't know how folks really; it was really close. I think we fortunately had thatrepresentation, but that should have never even happened, we should have had public health Ontario,being its agency and making recommendations to the ministry and to the government. There shouldhave never been a science table. Then second thing, I just want to say I've we've talked about thisforever and I do think we should talk about this more, not in the context of like this, this podcast, but isalso just absolutely the role of the media. I do want to say that, like historically, media had to do a lot ofwork, they had to go to universities or hospitals and ask for the right expert, and then the media orcomms team, ‘you should really talk to Zain Chagla' Because he has good example, you know, it givesgood expertise on this or you start to like, I don't know, like Dr. so and so for this or that, and they puttogether the right person, they organize the time and then they talk. Now you know that it was reallylike the story I think was more organically developed on based on what the experts had to say. Nowyou've got reporters, for people who are not from Ontario, there's a sports reporter in the city ofToronto that I looked historically, I can't see that they've ever done anything in public health suddenlybecame like the COVID reporter in the city of Toronto, for a major newspaper. It's like this person hasnot a clue of what they're talking about, just like has no clue they've never trained in. I don't disparagetheir sports reporter like why should they? but they became the voice of like public health for like theaverage person. It just it set us up where that person just had a story and then just found whateverpeople on Twitter that they could to like back up their story irrespective to drive controversy, to driveanger towards the government based on sort of political leanings. Even if maybe my political leaningsare aligned with that person, it's a relevant because it's not about politics, it's about public health. So Ithink the media, we have to think about, like, how do we manage the media's need for clicks and profit,you know, during this time, in with, like, their role as like, the responsible are an important part of like,you know, social functioning, in terms of the free press. So, I, there's no easy answers to that. But I'll justsay, I think there was a fundamentally important role that the media played here. And I have to say, itdidn't play out positively, in most places.KK: I gotta say, like, this is gonna be naive talk. But we're in a pandemic, there had to be so many of ushad a sense of duty, like, I was surprised at the lack of sense of duty, to be honest with you. Even if youare about your cliques, ask yourself, is this is this about the greater good here? Is this really gonna get usfurther ahead? I've said this a few times on my platform, I would have a balance of a mess. The balancedmessage on was usually one specific network that would bail on the interview. They would literally bailon the interview because my message might not be as fearful. What the actual f you know what I mean?Like it's crazy.(?) I will say there were some good reporters. I don't want to say that that you know, there were someincredible folks. I was talking to someone the other day, I won't mention who but I think the mark of thegood reporter was, you know, they have a story, they want to talk about it. They contacted us. And theysaid, what time can we talk this week, right? They didn't say I need to get this filed in three hours. If yousay you need to get this filed in three hours, the expert you're gonna go to is the one that's available inthe next three hours, right? They wanted to hear an opinion, they wanted to get multiple opinions onthe table, but they would carve out the time so that everyone could give their story or, what theiropinion was or what evidence they presented. They made sure it rotated around the experts rather thanthe story rotating around being filed. I think it's important and, you know, you can get a sense of certainthings that are on the need to be filed this day, or even on the 24/7 news cycle, where they may not beas well researched, they're they're a single opinion. They're quoting a Twitter tweet. Now, I think insome of these media platforms, you can just embed that Twitter tweet, you don't even have to, youknow, quote it in that sense, you just basically take a screenshot of it basically. Versus again, thosearticles where I think there was there more thought, and I think there were some great reporters inCanada, that really did go above and beyond. Health reporters, particularly that really did try to presenta picture that was well researched, and evidence based, you know, with what's available, but therecertainly are these issues and it's not a COVID specific issue, but with media ad reporting, in that sense.Yeah, it's and it's important to say like, it's not actually just the reporter, it's the editors, its editorialteams, like I had said, OTR discussions with reporters very early on, I've tried to stay away from themedia, because I think the folks who have done it, I've done it well. But it was interesting, because BobSargent, who sadly passed away, an internal medicine physician, and an amazing mentor to manyclinicians in Toronto. Put me in touch with a couple of reporters. He's like, you know, you're a publichealth person, you should really talk to these reports. We had this; can we talk to you privately? It wasso weird. This was summer of 2020. So, we had a very private discussion where I said ‘Listen, I haveconcerns about lockdowns for like, these reasons' I think it's reasoned, because it's not it, I've got noconspiracy to drive, like, I've got no, there's no angle in any of it. So, but it was just fascinating. So, theywere like we might be able to come back to you, and maybe we'll try to do a story around it. Then theycame back and said, we're not going to be able to pursue it. I said that's fine. It's no problem. It just sortof showed that I think, similar as academics, and clinicians, and all of us have been under pressure basedon everything from like CPSO complaints, the complaints to our employers, to whatever to just saw, youknow, the standard attacks on Twitter. I think there was also a lot of pressure on reporters based on thiswhole structure, and of it. So I think, I don't mean to disparage anybody, but I do think the point thatyou made is really important one is. I'll just say, in our own house, you know, my wife and I both werelike talking at the beginning of this and being like, what do we want to know that we did during thistime? So, my wife worked in person, as a clinician alter her practice all throughout her pregnancy? Shenever didn't go, you know, she did call she did all of that, obviously, I have done the work I've done interms of both clinically and vaccine related testing. But this just idea of like, what do you want toremember about the time that you would like what you did when s**t hit the fan? And, you know,because first, it'll happen again, but just also, I think it's important to sort of, to be able to reflect andthink positively about what you did. Anyways,KK: I hear you both, part of it, too, for me, I'll just straight up honesty. In some ways, I'm just pissed, I'mpissed that a lot of the efforts that were that a lot of people put into to try and get a good message outthere. The backlash. Now people reflecting saying, ‘Oh, I guess you did, you know, many of you do tohad a good point about lockdowns not working out'. I know it may be childish in some way, but it's just,you know, a lot of us have gone through a lot to just try and create a balanced approach. I think therewas a little bit of edge in this voice, but I think it comes with a bit of a bit of reason to have a bit of edge.I think in terms of the next couple questions here are areas to focus on. A lot of people in terms of like,decisions regarding mandates, boosters, and so forth, like we talk a lot about it on public health, it's thedata that helps drive decisions, right. That's really what you would think it should be all about. So, one ofthe many questions that were thrown to us, when we announced that this was happening was, the needfor like, almost like universal boosters, and Sumon, I'll put you on the spot there, at this stage in thepandemic, where I'm gonna timestamp this for people on audio, we're on January 10th, 2023. There aresome questions that we get, who really needs to push through to we all need boosters? What's yourthoughts on that?SC: So, I think that one of the things that I said this, as Zain makes fun of me throughout the pandemic, Icame up with catchphrases, and my one for immunity is the way that we've conceptualized immunity inNorth America. I think a lot of this has to do with an actual graphic from the CDC, which likens immunityto an iPhone or a battery, iPhone battery. So, iPhone immunity, where you have to constantly berecharging and updating. I think that has kind of bled into the messaging. That's what we think of it. Iremember back in I think it was October of 2021, where they were also starting to talk about the thirddose. The third dose, I think that at that time, we knew that for the higher risk people, it was probablythe people who would benefit the most from it. We had Ontario data from it was I think, was ISIS.There's vaccine efficacy against hospitalization, over 96% in Ontario in health care workers 99%, if you'reless than seventy-seven years of age, yet this went out, and everybody felt like they had to get thebooster. So, I think that the first thing that bothered me about that is that there wasn't a kind ofstratified look at the risk level and who needs it? So now we're in 2023. I think that one of the big thingsapart from what I said, you know, who's at higher risk, there's still this problem where people think thatevery six months, I need to recharge my immunity, which certainly isn't true. There wasn't a recognitionthat being exposed to COVID itself is providing you a very robust immunity against severe disease, whichis kind of it's coming out now. We've been we've all been talking about it for a long time. And you know,the other thing is that the disease itself has changed. I think that I heard this awesome expression, thefirst pass effect. So, when the COVID first came through a completely immune naive population, ofcourse, we saw death and morbidity, we saw all the other bad stuff, the rare stuff that COVIDencephalitis COVID GB GBS tons of ECMO, like 40-year old's dying. With each subsequent wave asimmunity started to accrue in the population, that didn't happen. Now we're at a different variant. Andthe thing is, do we even need to be doing widespread vaccination when you're with current variant, andyou can't be thinking about what we saw in 2021. So, putting that now, all together, we have as Zanementioned, seroprevalence, about almost 100%, you have people that are well protected against severedisease, most of the population, you have a variant that absolutely can make people sick. And yes, it cankill people. But for those of us who work on the front line, that looks very different on the on the frontlines. So, I really think that we should take a step back and say, number one: I don't think that thebooster is needed for everybody. I think number two: there are under a certain age, probably 55 andhealthy, who probably don't need any further vaccination, or at least until we have more data. Numberthree: before we make a widespread recommendation for the population. We have time now we're notin the emergency phase anymore. I really hope that we get more RCT data over the long term to seewho is it that needs the vaccine, if at all. And you know, who benefits from it. And let's continue toaccrue this data with time.KK: Thanks Sumon. Zain, are you on the along the same lines assume on in terms of who needs boostersand who doesn't?ZC: Yeah, I mean, I think number one: is the recognition that prior infection and hybrid immunityprobably are incredibly adequate. Again, people like Paul Offit, and we're not just talking about youknow, experts like us. These are people that are sitting on the FDA Advisory Committee, a man thatactually made vaccines in the United States, you know, that talks about the limitations of boosters andprobably three doses being you know, The peak of the series for most people, and even then, you know,two plus infection probably is enough is three or even one plus infection, the data may suggest maybe isas high as three. Yeah, I think, again, this is one of these things that gets diluted as it starts going downthe chain, if you actually look at the Nazi guidance for, you know, bi-Vaillant vaccines, it's actuallyincorporates a ‘should' and a ‘can consider' in all of this, so they talked about vulnerable individuals,elderly individuals should get a booster where there may be some benefits in that population, the restof the population can consider a booster in that sense, right. And I think as the boosters came out, andagain, you know, people started jumping on them, it came to everyone needs their booster. Andunfortunately, the messaging in the United States is perpetuated that quite a bit with this iPhonecharging thing, Biden tweeting that everyone over the age of six months needs a booster. Again, wereally do have to reflect on the population that we're going at. Ultimately, again, if you start pressing theissue too much in the wrong populations, you know, the uptake is, is showing itself, right, the peoplewho wanted their bi-Vaillant vaccine got it. Thankfully the right populations are being incentivized,especially in the elderly, and the very elderly, and the high risk. Uptake in most other populations hasbeen relatively low. So, people are making their decisions based on based on what they know. Again,they feel that that hesitation and what is this going to benefit me? and I think as Sumon said, theconfidence is going to be restored when we have better data. We're in a phase now where we can docluster randomized RCTs in low-risk populations and show it If you want the vaccine, you enter into acluster randomized RCT, if you're in a low-risk population, match you one to one with placebo. You wecan tell you if you got, you know, what your prognosis was at the end of the day, and that information isgoing to be important for us. I don't think that policy of boosting twice a year, or once a year is gonnaget people on the bus, every booster seems like people are getting off the bus more and more. So, wereally do have to have compelling information. Now, as we're bringing these out to start saying, youknow, is this a necessity? especially in low-risk populations? How much of a necessity is that? How muchdo you quantify it in that sense? And again, recognizing that, that people are being infected? Now, thatadds another twist in that sense.KK: Yeah, and we'll talk a little bit about public trust in a bit here. But Stef, you were among someauthors that did an essay on the booster mandates for university students. As we've both alluded toZain, and Sumon there's this need to be stratified. From an RCT booster point of view that we're not wellestablished here. When Stef's group looked at university mandates and potential harm, when we'redoing an actual cost benefit ratio there, their conclusion was that there's more room for harm thanbenefits. So, Stef I want you to speak to that paper a bit.SB: Sure. So, I will say this, I don't actually have much to add other than what Zain and Sumon said. Runa vaccine program we are offering, you know, doses as it makes sense for folks who are particularlyimmunocompromised, multiple comorbidities and remain at risk for serious consequences related toCOVID-19. We'll continue doing that. And that will, you know, get integrated, by the way into like, sortof a vaccine preventable disease program, so offering, shingles, Pneumovax, influenza COVID. And alsowe want to do a broader in terms of other hepatitis vaccines, etc. That aside, so this, this isn't about, youknow, that it was really interesting being called antivax by folks who have never gotten close to avaccine, other than being pricked by one. Having delivered literally 1000s of doses of vaccine, so it'salmost it's a joke, right? but it's an effective thing of like shutting down conversation. That aside, I thinkthere's a few things at play one as it related to that paper. I find it really interesting, particularly foryoung people, when people are like, listen, yes, they had a little bit of like, inflammation of their heart,but it's self-resolving and self-limiting, and they're gonna be fine. You don't know that. Maybe sure we'llsee what happens with these folks twenty years later. The reality is for younger men, particularly, thishappens to be a very gender dynamic. For younger men, particularly, there seems to be a dynamicwhere they are at risk of myocarditis. I don't know whether that's a controversy in any other era for anyother disease, this would not be a controversy would just be more of a factual statement, the data wereclearer in I'd say, probably April, May 2021. I think there's lots of things we could have done, we couldhave done one dose series for people who had been previously infected, we could have stopped at two.There are a million different versions of what we could have done, none of which we actually did. In thecontext of mandating boosters now for young people, including at my institution, you were mandated toget a booster, or you would no longer be working. So obviously, I got one. There's a real dynamic ofwhat is it your goal at that point? because probably about 1011 months into the vaccine programbecame increasingly clear. You can still get COVID. Nobody's surprised by that. That was clear even fromthe data. By the way, wasn't even studied. I mean, Pfizer, the way if you just look at the Pfizer, Moderna,trials, none and look to see whether you got COVID or not, they were just looking at symptomaticdisease. That aside, I think that it just became this clear thing where for younger men, one or two doseswas plenty and it seems to be that as you accumulate doses for those folks, particularly, it's alsoimportant, if somebody had a bad myocarditis, they're not even getting a third dose. So, you're alreadyselecting out, you know, some of these folks, but you are starting to see increased levels of harm, as itrelated to hospitalization. That what we basically did, there was a very simple analysis of looking ataverted hospitalization, either way, many people say that's the wrong metric. You can pick whatevermetric you want. That's the metric we picked when terms of hospitalization related to side effects of thevaccine versus benefits. What it just showed was that for people under the age of 30, you just don't seea benefit at that point, as compared to harm that's totally in fundamentally different. We weren't talkingabout the primary series, and we weren't talking about older folks. So indeed, I think, you know, thatwas that was I don't know why it was it was particularly controversial. We it was a follow up piece tomandates in general. I'll just say like, I've been running this vaccine program, I don't think mandateshave made my life easier at all. I know, there's like this common narrative of like mandates, you know,mandates work mandates work. I think at some point, and I'll just say our own study of this is like we'rereally going to have to ask two questions. One: what it mandates really get us in terms of a burdenCOVID-19, morbidity, mortality? and two: this is an important one for me. What if we caught ourselvesin terms of how much pressure we put on people, as it relates to vaccines right now, in general? Thevery common narrative that I'm getting is they're like, oh, the anti Vax is the anti Vax folks are winning.And people don't want their standard vaccines, and we're getting less uptake of like, MMR andstandard, you know, kind of childhood vaccines, I have a different opinion. I really do at least I believesome proportion of this, I don't know what proportion, it's some proportion, it's just like people beingpushed so hard, about COVID-19 vaccines that they literally don't want to be approached about anyvaccine in general. So, I just think that with in public health, there's always a cost. Part of the decisionmaking in public health as it relates to clinical medicine too. It's like you give a medication, theadvantage and then you know, the disadvantages, side effects of that medication. In public health, thereare side effects of our decisions that are sometimes anticipated and sometimes avoidable, sometimescan't be anticipated and sometimes can't be avoided. You have to kind of really give thought to each ofthem before you enact this policy or you might cost more health outcomes, then then you're actuallygaining by implementing it.KK: Yeah, number one: What was spooky to me is like even mentioning, I was afraid even to use a termmyocarditis at times. The worst part is, as you said, stuff, it's young folk that were alluding to, and for usto not be able to say, let's look at the harm and benefit in a group that's low risk was baffling. It reallywas baffling that and I'm glad we're at least more open to that now. Certainly, that's why I thought thatthe paper that you guys put together was so important because it's in the medical literature that we'reshowing, objectively what the cost benefit of some of these approaches are. Sumon: when you think ofmandates and public trust, that Stef was kind of alluding to like, every decision that we madethroughout this thing. Also has a downside, also has a cost, as Stef was mentioning. Where do you thinkwe are? In terms of the public trust? Talking about how the childhood vaccines are lower. I don't knowwhat influenza vaccine rates are like now, I wouldn't be surprised if they're the same standard, but whoknows them where they're at, currently. Based on your perspective, what do you think the public trust isright now?SC: Yeah, as physicians, we obviously still do have a lot of trust in the people we take care of. People arestill coming to see us. I wish they didn't have to because everyone was healthy but that's not the case. Ido think that over the last two and a half, we're coming up on three years, I guess right now, that peoplethat we have burned a lot of trust, I think that mandates were part of it. I do think that some of it wasunavoidable. It's just that there's a lot of uncertainty. There was back and forth. I think that one thingthat were that concern me on social media was that a lot of professionals are airing their dirty laundry tothe public. You could see these in fights, that doesn't, that's not really a good thing. We saw peoplebeing very derisive towards people who were not listening to the public health rules. You know what Imean? There's a lot of that kind of talk of othering. Yeah, I think that that certainly overtime, erodedpublic trust, that will take a long time to get back, if we do get it back. I think that the bottom line is that,I get that there are times that we have to do certain things, when you have a unknown pathogen comingat you, when you don't really know much about it. I do think that you want to do the greatest good forthe, for the population or again, you always must remember as Stefan alludes to the cost of what you'redoing. I do think that we could have done that much early on. For example, Ontario, we were lockeddown in some areas, Ontario, GTA, we were locked down in some regard for almost a year and a half. Ifyou guys remember, there was that debate on opening bars and restaurants before schools. It's just like,I remember shaking my head is, look, I get it, I know you guys are talking about people are going to beeating a burger before kids can go to school, that might ruin everything. But the problem is, is that youmust remember that restaurant is owned by someone that small gym is someone's livelihood, you'remoralizing over what this is, but in the end, it's the way somebody puts food on the table. For a yearand a half, we didn't let especially small businesses do that. I'm no economist, but I had many familymembers and friends who are impacted by this. Two of my friends unfortunately, committed suicideover this. So, you know, we had a lot of impact outside of the of the things that we did that hurt people,and certainly the trust will have to be regained over the long term.KK: It's gonna take work. I think, for me, honestly, it's, it's just about being transparent. I honestly, I putmyself in some in the shoes of the public and I just want to hear the truth. If we're not sure aboutsomething, that's okay. We're gonna weigh the evidence and this is our suggestion. This is why we'resaying this, could we be wrong? Yes, we could be wrong but this is what we think is the best pathforward, and people could get behind that. I honestly feel like people could get behind that showing alittle bit of vulnerability and saying ‘you know, we're not know it alls here' but this is what our beststrategy is based on our viewpoint on the best strategy based on the data that we have in front of usand just be open. Allowing for open dialogue and not squash it not have that dichotomous thinking ofyou're on one side, you're on the other. You're anti vax, you're pro vax, stop with the labels. You know,it's just it got crazy, and just was not a safe environment for dialogue. And how are you supposed to he'ssupposed to advance.SB: Yeah, I do want to say something given this this is this idea of our swan song. I think there was thissort of feeling like, you know, people were like ‘you gotta act hard, you gotta move fast' So I thinkeverybody on this, you guys all know I travel a lot. I like to think of myself as a traveler. In the early2020's I did like a COVID tour, I was in Japan in February, then I was in Thailand, and everywhere Ilanded, there were like, COVID here, COVID here, COVID here. Then finally, I like got home at the end ofFebruary, and I was supposed to be home for like four days, and then take off. Obviously things got shutdown. It was like obvious like COVID was the whole world had COVID by, February, there may have beena time to shut down this pandemic in September 2019. Do you know what I mean? by November 2019,we had cases. They've already seen some and Canadian Blood Services done some showing someserological evidence already at that time. There was no shutting it down. This thing's gonna suck. Thereality is promising that you can eliminate this thing by like, enacting these really like arbitrary that canonly be described as arbitrary. Shutting the border to voluntary travel, but not to truckers. Everythingfelt so arbitrary. So, when you talk about trust, if you can't explain it, if you're a good person do it. If youdon't do it, your white supremacist. Kwadwo you were part of a group that was called ‘Urgency ofNormal' you are a white supremacist. It's so ridiculous. You know what I mean? It creates this dynamicwhere you can't have any meaningful conversation. So, I really worry, unless we can start having somereally meaningful conversations, not just with folks that we agree with. Obviously, I deeply respect whateach of you have done throughout this pandemic, not just actually about what you say, but really whatyou've done. Put yourselves out there with your families in front of this thing. That aside, if we can't dothat, we will be no better off. We will go right back. People will be like ‘Oh, next pandemic, well, let'sjust get ready to lock down' but did we accomplish anything in our lock downs? I actually don't think wedid. I really don't think we got anything positive out our lock downs, and I might be alone in that. I mightbe wrong, butut that said it needs to be investigated and in a really meaningful way to answer that,before it becomes assume that acting hard and acting fast and all these b******t slogans are the truthand they'd become the truth and they become fact. All without any really meaningful evidencesupporting them.KK: I gotta say, I'll get you Sumon next here, but I gotta say the idea of abandoning logic, I think that'sthat's a key point there. Think about what we're doing in restaurants, folks. Okay, you would literallywear your mask to sit down, take off that bloody thing. Eat, chat, smooch even, I mean, and then put itback on and go in the bathroom and think this is meaningful. Where's the logic there? You're on a plane,you're gonna drink something, you're on a six hour flight, you know what I'm saying.(?) During the lockdown, by the way, you're sending like 20 Uber drivers to stand point. If you ever wentand picked up food, you would see these folks. It'd be like crowding the busy restaurants all like standingin there, like arguing which orders theirs, you know what I mean? then like people waiting for the foodto show up.KK: I mean, that's the other point. The part that people forget with the lockdowns, tons of people willwork. I'm in Ottawa, where 70% are, could stay home, right? That's a unique city. That's why we werevery sheltered from this bad boy.(?) Aren't they still fighting going back to the office?KK: Oh, my God. Folks, I'm sorry. Yeah, it's like 70% could stay home, but you're in GTA your area. That'sa lot of essential workers. You don't have that option. So, how's this lockdown? Really looking at the bigpicture? Anyway, sorry. Sumon you're gonna hit it up.SC: We just wanted to add one anecdote. I just think it kind of talks about all this is that, you know therewas a time when this thing started going to 2020. Stefan, I think you and I met online around that time.You put a couple of seeds after I was reading stuff, like you know about the idea of, you know, risktransfer risk being downloaded to other people. That's sort of kind of think of a you know, what, like,you know, a people that are working in the manufacturing industry, you're not going to receive them alot unless you live in a place like Brampton or northwest Toronto, where the manufacturing hub of, ofOntario and in many cases, central eastern Canada is right. So, I remember in, I was already starting touse this doing anything. And when I was in, I guess it would have been the second wave when it was itwas pretty bad one, I just kept seeing factory worker after factory worker, but then the thing that stuckout was tons of Amazon workers. So, I asked one of them, tell me something like, why are there so manyAmazon workers? Like are you guys? Is there a lot of sick people working that kind of thing? Inretrospect, it was very naive question. What that one woman told me that her face is burned into mymemory, she told me she goes, ‘Look, you know, every time a lockdown is called, or something happenslike that, what ends up happening is that the orders triple. So, then we end up working double and tripleshifts, and we all get COVID' That was just a light went off. I was like, excuse my language, guys, but holys**t, we're basically taking all this risk for people that can like what was it called a ‘laptop class' that canstay home and order all this stuff. Meanwhile, all that risk was going down to all these people, and I wasseeing it one, after another, after another, after another. I'm not sure if you guys saw that much, but Iwas in Mississauga, that's the hardest, Peele where the manufacturing industry is every single peanutfactory, the sheet metal, I just saw all of them. That I think was the kind of thing that turned me andrealize that we what we'll be doing. I'll shut up.ZC: Yeah, I would say I mean, I think Stefan and Sumon make great points. You know, I think that thatwas very apparent at the beginning. The other thing I would say is 2021 to 2022. Things like vaccinationand public health measures fell along political lines. That was a huge mistake. It was devastating. Iremember back to the first snap election in 2021. Initially great video of all the political partiesencouraging vaccination and putting their differences aside. Then all of a sudden, it became mudslingingabout how much public health measure you're willing to do, how much you're willing to invest in, andit's not a Canadian phenomenon. We saw this in the United States with the Biden and Trump campaignsand the contrast between the two, and then really aligning public health views to political views, andthen, you know, really making it very uncomfortable for certain people to then express counter viewswithout being considered an alternative party. It's something we need to reflect on I think we havepublic health and public health messengers and people that are agnostic to political views but are reallythere to support the health of their populations, from a health from a societal from an emotional fromthe aspects of good health in that sense. You really can't involve politics into that, because all of asudden, then you start getting counter current messaging, and you start getting people being pushed,and you start new aligning values to views and you start saying, right and left based on what peopleconsider, where again, the science doesn't necessarily follow political direction. It was a really bigmistake, and it still is pervasive. We saw every election that happened between 2021 to 2022 is publichealth and public health messaging was embedded in each one of those and it caused more harm thangood. I think it's a big lesson from this, this is that you can be proactive for effective public healthinterventions as an individual in that society that has a role, but you can't stick it on campaigns. It reallymakes it hard to deescalate measures at that point when your campaign and your identity is tied tocertain public health measures in that sense.KK: Amen. I am cognizant of the time and so I'm gonna try to rapid fire a little bit? I think, there's only acouple points that people hit up on that we haven't touched on. There was a push for mass mandates inthe last couple months because of of RSV and influenza that was happening. It still is happening in,especially in our extreme ages, really young and really old. Any viewpoint on that, I'll leave it open toalmost to throw down.(?) I think mass mandates have been useless. I don't expect to ever folks to agree with me, it's like it's aninteresting dynamic, right? When you go and you saw folks who were on the buses, I take the bus to theairport. Our subway in Toronto just for folks only starts at like, 5:50am. So, before that, you gotta jumpon buses. So the construction workers on the bus who were wearing masks during the when the maskmandates were on taking this what's called, it's like the construction line, because it goes down Bloorare basically and takes all the construction workers from Scarborough, before the subway line, get todowntown to do all the construction and build all the stuff that you know, is being built right now.Everyone is wearing this useless cloth mask. It's like probably the one thing that the anti-maskers who Ithink I probably am one at this point. The pro-maskers and all maskers can agree on is that cloth masksare useless. That's what 100% of these folks are wearing. They're wearing these reusable cloth masksthat are like barely on their face often blow their nose. So, to me, it's not so much about like, what couldthis intervention achieve, if done perfectly like saying the study you were involved with the help lead,it's like everybody's like, but all of them got COVID outside of the health care system, they didn't get itwhen they're wearing their N95. That's like, but that's the point, like public health interventions live ordie or succeed or fail in the real world. I was seeing the real world, I would love to take a photo but Idon't think these folks have been friendly to me taking a photo of them, but it was 100%, cloth masks ofall these folks in the morning all crowded, like we're literally like person to person on this bus. It's like aperfect, you know, vehicle for massive transmission. I just I just sort of put that forward of like, that'swhat a mask mandate does to me. I think to the person sitting at home calling for them, they are justimagining, they're like ‘Oh but the government should do this'. But they didn't. The government shouldbe handing out in N95's. How are you going to police them wearing a N95's and how are you gettingthem? It would be so hard to make a massive program work. I would say it's like if you gave me millionsand millions and millions of dollars, for me to design a mass program, I don't know, maybe I could pull itoff you really with an endless budget. But for what? So, I just think that like as these programs went outin the real world, I think they did nothing but burn people's energy. You know because some people itjust turns out don't like wearing a mask. Shocking to other folks. They just don't like wearing a mask.Last thing I'll say is that just as they play it out in the real world, I think we're functionally useless, otherthan burning people's energy. I'm a fervent anti masker at this point because it's just an insult to publichealth. To me everything I've trained in and everything I've worked towards, just saying these two wordsmask mandate, as the fix. That is an insult to the very thing that I want to spend my life doing .ZC: Yeah, I mean, three points, one: you know, masks are still important in clinical settings. I think we allunderstand that. We've been doing them before we've been continuing to do them. So I you know,that's one piece. Second: I mean, to go with the point that was raised here, you know, the best study wehave is Bangladesh, right? 10% relative risk reduction. It's interesting when you read the Bangladeshstudy, because with community kind of people that pump up masking that are really trying to educateand probably are also there to mask compliance. Mask's compliance people, you get to 54% compliance,when those people leave compliance drops significantly. Right. You know, I think you have to just lookaround and see what happened in this last few months, regardless of the messaging. Maybe it's thecommunities I'm in, but I didn't see mass compliance change significantly, maybe about 5%. In thecontext of the last couple of months. You must understand the value of this public health intervention,Bangladesh has actually a nice insight, not only into what we think the community based optimalmasking efficacy is, but also the fact that you really have to continue to enforce, enforce, enforce,enforce, in order to get to that even 10%. Without that enforcement, you're not getting anywhere inthat sense. That probably spells that it's probably a very poor long term public health intervention in thecontext that you really must pump it week by week by week by week in order to actually get compliancethat may actually then give you the effects that you see in a cluster randomized control trial. Again, youknow, the world we live in is showing that people don't want to mask normally. Some people can, i