Podcast appearances and mentions of Ina May Gaskin

In this episode we're talking with Megan Kibling as she shares her empowering home birth story with us. Megan is mom to 6-year-old Aurelia and 19-month-old Leonardo Iztali from Denver, Colorado. We connected with Megan via another DIAH mom, Marissa (whom we interviewed a few weeks before). Megan had sent a banner to Marissa to decorate her home in preparation for home birth. The same banner has made its way to other mamas since then, and Megan plans to continue to send it to friends as they want it. Besides supporting other women in their home birth journeys, Megan has an amazing story of her own. After having a great experience with her first birth in a birthing center, she felt inspired to move into home birth for the next time around. She says she felt empowered and knew a home birth was the next step. In between Aurelia and Leonardo, Megan experienced a miscarriage at 10 weeks. Megan shares openly on the fear and guilt that crept in during that time, and how she embarked on a journey of forgiveness, back to grace, comfort and love. By the time she was pregnant with Leonardo, Megan felt in full trust of her body, her baby and herself. She listened to the flow and went the whole pregnancy and birth almost completely unassisted. She did yoga, meditated, read, watched home births, created affirmations and playlists -- all to create the sacred space for her birth. Megan is a total inspiration. This episode has a lot of great quotes and mantras to pull from. My favorite? “PURE MAGIC!” Links From The Episode: Sacred Living Movement - ⁠http://www.sacredlivingmovement.com/⁠ Indie Birth - ⁠https://www.indiebirth.com/⁠ Peaceful Birth Project - ⁠http://thepeacefulbirthproject.org/⁠ Ina May Gaskin - ⁠http://inamay.com/⁠ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://needed.sjv.io/XY3903 - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: https://www.teepublic.com/stores/doingitathome Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Pour ce sixième jour du défi « Janvoix », la contrainte était de rendre hommage à une œuvre, une personne ou un événement marquant. Au départ, je voulais parler d'une sage-femme connue, comme Ina May Gaskin. Mais après avoir passé 26 heures auprès d'une femme, accompagnée d'un accouchement qui s'est terminé par un transfert, j'ai ressenti l'envie de mettre les femmes à l'honneur. Dans cet épisode, je vous partage toute mon admiration pour ces femmes qui, dès la grossesse, donnent tellement. Leur corps change, s'adapte, leur cerveau se transforme pour répondre aux besoins de leur bébé, et elles avancent souvent en mettant de côté leurs propres besoins. Je vois des femmes qui travaillent jusqu'à la veille de leur accouchement, qui repoussent leurs limites, qui écoutent leur instinct sans toujours s'autoriser à le reconnaître. Et pendant l'accouchement, quelle puissance ! Qu'elles accouchent naturellement, avec un déclenchement ou une césarienne, elles traversent des épreuves incroyables. Elles vont chercher une force qu'elles ne soupçonnaient même pas avoir, parfois en affrontant leur douleur, leurs peurs, leur histoire. Et malgré tout, elles avancent. Elles accueillent leur bébé dans un don total, mental, physique et émotionnel. Je veux aussi rappeler que chaque naissance est authentique. Peu importe qu'elle soit naturelle, déclenchée ou avec une césarienne : ce qui compte, c'est ce chemin qu'elles traversent, cette relation vraie, sans jugement, qu'on doit leur offrir. Ces femmes m'inspirent, m'apprennent à devenir encore plus la sage-femme authentique que je veux être. Et pour cela, je leur rends hommage aujourd'hui.Musique utilisée pour le jingle :Titre : NowAuteur : VexentoSource : SoundCloudLicence : Creative Commons BY 4.0Téléchargement : Au Bout Du FilMerci pour votre écoute, et à demain pour le prochain épisode !

In Part II of our holiday countdown, Dr. Berlin discusses numbers 5 through 1 of the top 10 most popular episodes of the Informed Pregnancy Podcast in 2024. Links to the Informed Pregnancy Podcast and other media mentioned in today's episode: #5 Ep. 418: Exploring Freebirth with Catalina Clark #4 Ep. 390: Dr. Nathan Riley and Low Intervention Birth #3 Ep. 413: Aly Michalka: Before Birth and Ep. 414: Aly Michalka: After Birth #2 Ep. 400: Ina May Gaskin on Midwifery #1 Ep. 416: Hilary Duff: A Birth Story Part 1 and Ep. 417: A Birth Story Part 2 Ep. 97 Catalina Clark: Before Birth Ep. 98 Catalina Clark: After Birth Ep. 20 Labor Day Surprises Part 1 Ep. 21 Labor Day Surprises Part 2 Ep. 22 Labor Day Surprises Part 3 Ep. 147 Dr. Jennifer Lang on Prenatal Nutrition Ep. 317 Holiday Rebroadcast: Hilary Duff Before Baby #2 Ep. 318 Holiday Rebroadcast: Hilary Duff After Baby #2 Ep. 92 Yael Cohen Braun: A Birth Story These Are My Hours a birth documentary Orgasmic Birth a documentary about oxytocin and birth  Heads Up: The Disappearing Art of Vaginal Breech Delivery an IP+ original documentary The Business of Being Born THE original and iconic birth documentary BellydanceBirth® with Maha al Musa Learn easy and gentle belly dance movements for pregnancy and birth. No previous dance experience (belly dance or otherwise) necessary! Baby Book Nook a video book review series dedicated to exploring informative books about pregnancy, childbirth, postpartum, and early parenting IP+ original Empowered Mama an IP+ original, Empowered Mama with host Arista Ilona was created to empower and inspire mothers by highlighting stories about pregnancy, birth, and motherhood through a lens of celebration and honor.  My Birth an IP+ original, MyBirth invites you into the intimate world of real mothers sharing unique birth stories through their own voices, with photos and videos capturing raw, emotional moments along the way. One Way or A Mother a new serialized visual podcast coming soon to IP+ *graphic animal birth video* elephant gives birth, saves newborn with “chiropractic adjustment” Want more pregnancy + parenting?  Informed Pregnancy Plus is a new streaming platform by pregnancy focused chiropractor Dr. Elliot Berlin. Dedicated to pregnancy, parenting, and everything in between, IP+ offers everything from prenatal workouts and yoga flows to original series and iconic birth films like The Business of Being Born. (Pssst, subscriptions are a great gift for parents-to-be!) Start your FREE TRIAL of Informed Pregnancy+ and get access to all our curated pregnancy and parenting content HERE!  Keep up with Dr. Berlin and the Informed Pregnancy Project online! informedpregnancy.com Informed Pregnancy on Youtube Informed Pregnancy Media on LinkedIn @doctorberlin Facebook X Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In today's episode we're talking with Marissa Olivera, a mom of 2 from Utica, NY, with both a hospital birth story and home birth story. Marissa experienced intrauterine growth restriction (IUGR) with her first pregnancy. That, along with some early signs of labor made for a hospital birth that included a lot of intervention and fear. The way she sees it, baby Maxwell just wasn't ready yet. She planned for a home birth again with baby number two, Miles. With positive reinforcement from resources like Ina May Gaskin and Birth Without Fear, Marissa went into her second birth tuned in to her intuition and gut feeling (and we're not just talking about the contractions!). Marissa's candor and detail with her birth stories compels you to listen and engage. She's a great example of how to plan the birth you're intending to create - like finding midwives even when you're far away from a big city with more options. We even get a little cameo from surprise guest Maxwell! Links From The Episode: Marissa's blogpost on her home birth Birth Without Fear Ina May Gaskin Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://needed.sjv.io/XY3903 - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order The FamilyAlbum app: Share your family's precious moments with your loved ones + get 11 free photo prints delivered each month CLICK HERE. More From Doing It At Home: Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: https://www.teepublic.com/stores/doingitathome Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

For tickets to the convergence 2025 to hear Ina May Gaskin go to www.melaniethemidwife.com We speak with Dr Kate Levett and Heidi Williams about the use of acupuncture and acupressure in pregnancy. We discover the weight of evidence on the side of acupuncture and Kate and Heidi explore novel ways of integrating it within the maternity care system and acuneedling for midwives. Kate website: https://drkatelevett.com/ https://drkatelevett.com/video-resources-acupressure-for-labourDr Kate Levett: https://www.instagram.com/dr_kate_levett/Kate Levett acupuncture: https://www.instagram.com/katelevettacupuncture/?hl=enFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/kate.levett.14 Heidi Williams Acuneedling and Me @acuneedling and @central_coast_homebirth Facebook https://www.facebook.com/acuneedlingaustralia?mibextid=LQQJ4d https://www.facebook.com/centralcoastmidwives?mibextid=LQQJ4d Websites www.acuneedling.com www.centralcoasthomebirth.com There are a huge amount of resources in this weeks resource sheet, for all the resources, just join the podcast mailing list at www.melaniethemidwife.com To get on the mailing list for the podcast and to access the resource folders for each episode, visit www.melaniethemidwife.com Premium podcast members Hub Being a premium podcast member gives you access to the transcript and additional resources for each episode AND the 'ask Mel a question' button so you can submit questions for the monthly 'Ask me anything' episode. Only available in the premium podcast members hub Find out all the details here You can find out more about Mel @melaniethemidwife Disclaimer: The information and resources provided on this podcast does not, and is not intended to, constitute or replace medical or midwifery advice. Instead, all information provided is intended for education, with it's application intended for discussion between yourself and your care provider and/or workplace if you are a health professional. The Great Birth Rebellion podcast reserves the right to supplement, edit, change, delete any information at any time. Whilst we have tried to maintain accuracy and completeness of information, we do not warrant or guarantee the accuracy or currency of the information. The podcast accepts no liability for any loss, damage or unfavourable outcomes howsoever arising out of the use or reliance on the content. This podcast is not a replacement for midwifery or medical clinical care.

message me what did you take away from this episode? Ep 80 (ibit.ly/Re5V) Melanie Jackson on birthing outside the system, balancing research, midwifery, and entrepreneurship@PhDMidwives  #MidTwitter  #research #midwifery @westernsydneyu @hannahdahlen @VirginiaSchmie1 https://www.melaniethemidwife.com/Great Birth Rebellion podcast Ever wondered how the worlds of naturopathy and midwifery intersect? Join us for an enlightening episode where we promise you'll uncover the inspirational journey of Melanie Jackson. From her roots as a naturopath to becoming a dedicated midwife and researcher, Melanie shares her unique perspective on pregnancy and birth, influenced by pivotal experiences and the wisdom of Ina May Gaskin's “Spiritual Midwifery.” Discover how her holistic approach complements her midwifery practice and the challenges she faced reconciling these philosophies within hospital settings.Melanie's story is a testament to resilience and passion. Learn about her academic evolution, from a nursing degree at Sydney University to her unexpected dive into postgraduate research under the mentorship of Hannah Dahlen. Melanie's commitment to physiological birth led her to become a private midwife and eventually pursue a PhD. Hear about the intricate balance she maintained while managing her PhD and midwifery work, the importance of mental health, and the support systems that kept her grounded through it all.This episode also sheds light on the systemic issues within maternity care, driving women towards alternative birthing options. Melanie offers insightful reflections on conducting unbiased research in emotionally charged contexts and discusses her transition from private midwifery to mentoring aspiring midwives. Finally, get a glimpse into how she balances her dynamic life, including entrepreneurship, family, and community involvement, illustrating how support and a flexible work model have enabled her to thrive. Support the Show.Do you know someone who should tell their story?email me - thruthepodcast@gmail.comThe aim is for this to be a fortnightly podcast with extra episodes thrown inThis podcast can be found on various socials as @thruthepinardd and our website -https://thruthepinardpodcast.buzzsprout.com/ or ibit.ly/Re5V

Marissa is a mom of 2 from Utica, NY, with both a hospital and home birth story.  Marissa experienced intrauterine growth restriction (IUGR) with her first pregnancy. That, along with some early signs of labor made for a hospital birth that included a lot of intervention and fear. The way she sees it, baby Maxwell just wasn't ready yet.  She planned for a home birth again with baby number two, Miles. With positive reinforcement from resources like Ina May Gaskin and Birth Without Fear, Marissa went into her second birth tuned in to her intuition and gut feeling (and we're not just talking about the contractions!). Marissa's candor and detail with her birth stories compels you to listen and engage. She's a great example of how to plan the birth you're intending to create - like finding midwives even when you're far away from a big city with more options. We even get a little cameo from surprise guest Maxwell! Links From The Episode: Marissa's blogpost on her home birth - http://myeggiscracked.blogspot.com/2015/08/the-story-of-miles.html Birth Without Fear - http://birthwithoutfearblog.com/ Ina May Gaskin - http://inamay.com/ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

How can you utilize the power and intention of prayer for your birth? Regardless of your faith, setting intentions for your birth experience can be a big part of preparation for the experience. Today's guest, Josephine Breen, weaves her faith into her birth story of her daughter Myriam. Josephine was born at home, and always remembers her mother being positive and open around the topic of birth. Then at 12 years old, Josephine got to witness the birth of her sister.  Josephine walks us through her pregnancy and birth, including a lot of the curve balls thrown in along the way.  Things we talk about in this episode: military family, being born at home yourself and then choosing home birth to have your children, education for your birth partner, preeclampsia, membrane sweeps, power of prayer, long labor without a lot of sleep, cervical lip, fetal ejection reflex, having community to support you, letting go when labor gets hard Links From The Episode: Josephine's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/magdalenarobes/ Taking Charge of Your Fertility by Toni Weschler: https://www.amazon.com/Taking-Charge-Your-Fertility-Anniversary/dp/0062326031 Fertile Ground by Laura S. Jansson: https://www.amazon.com/Fertile-Ground-Pilgrimage-through-Pregnancy/dp/1944967605 Ina May's Guide to Childbirth by Ina May Gaskin: https://www.amazon.com/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Gaskin/dp/0553381156 Secrets of the Baby Whisperer by Tracy Hogg: https://www.amazon.com/Secrets-Baby-Whisperer-Connect-Communicate/dp/0345479092 Evidence Based Birth: evidencebasedbirth.com Aviva Romm: avivaromm.com  Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome back to another episode of The Mama Village podcast! I'm your host, Ellen and today we have an inspiring story that challenges conventional norms and highlights the power of trust, intuition, and transformation. Our guest today is Kelsey, a first-time mom who brought her baby into the world in the comfort of her own home. What makes Kelsey's story truly remarkable is the serendipitous encounter with a doula that completely changed her planned birth location, leading her to discover just how strong and capable both she and her baby are. But this journey wasn't just transformative for Kelsey. Her partner, who had experienced two C-sections with his other children, also embarked on a new path, reshaping his understanding of childbirth and partnership. Throughout her pregnancy, Kelsey faced unique challenges, including a diagnosis of gestational diabetes and concerns about her high BMI. Yet, she navigated these hurdles with grace and determination, proving that birth is a deeply personal and powerful experience. Stay tuned as we explore Kelsey's journey, the decisions that led to her home birth, and the incredible support system that guided her along the way. From the surprise meeting with a doula to the triumphant moment of welcoming her baby at home, Kelsey's story is one of resilience, empowerment, and love. Don't forget that if you like the show, please subscribe and leave a review on your podcast platform. Thank you all for your continuing support!   Resources mentioned in the podcast: The Great Birth Rebellion podcast The Midwives Cauldron podcast Books by Ina May Gaskin, Dr Rachel Reed, Dr Sara Wickham Hypnobirthing For Music: https://soundcloud.com/emotionetoile/kevin-macleod-easy-day-no-copyright-music-103 Disclaimer: I am not a medical professional, and this is not medical advice. Any information discussed in this podcast should not replace the advice of your professional healthcare provider. This podcast is designed for general information only and is not specific to individual needs. Please seek advice from your professional health care provider if you have any concerns regarding your pregnancy, birth or postpartum.

Renowned Midwife, Ina May Gaskin, joins Erin to share her extensive knowledge and experiences in childbirth. In this informative episode, Ina May shares about the history of obstetrics and breech birth, the deliveries of her children, The Farm Midwifery Center, her books, and shoulder dystocia.  Connect with Ina: Facebook Books Connect with me: Instagram Website About Ina May: A certified professional midwife who has attended more than 1,200 births, Ina May Gaskin is known as the “mother of authentic midwifery.” Gaskin joined the Peace Corps after college and taught English in Malaysia for two years before returning to the United States to obtain her master's degree. During the birth of her first child in the 1960's, Gaskin experienced the terrible practice of having her child pulled into the world with forceps. The incident fueled her determination to find a saner way to give birth. A few years later, during a five-month long speaking tour with her husband, Stephen Gaskin, and more than two hundred young idealists, she witnessed her first birth, one of many that would occur during the trip. Because many of the women were without health insurance or money to pay for a doctor, Gaskin often assisted in births by default, eventually aided by the instruction and support of a sympathetic obstetrician. In 1971, the group purchased a large tract of land in rural Tennessee and established a cooperative community. Gaskin located a doctor willing to serve as a mentor and medical liaison, and the Farm Midwifery Center was born. During a stay in Guatemala in 1976, Gaskin learned a technique for preventing and resolving shoulder dystocia, a condition that occurs during birth when the baby's head is born, but the shoulders are stuck in the birth canal. After using the method with great success, she began to teach and publish articles about the method. Now referred to as the Gaskin maneuver, it is the first obstetrical procedure to be named after a midwife. Gaskin has lectured in numerous countries and is the author of several books, including Spiritual Midwifery (1975), the first text written by a midwife published in the United States. In 2011, Gaskin received the Right Livelihood Award, an honor bestowed each year by the Swedish Parliament; the award is often referred to as the “Alternative Nobel Prize.”

Welcome back to the podcast, everyone! I'm thrilled to announce that I'm officially back after a six-month hiatus, and I have a fantastic excuse for my absence – I'm a new mommy! During this time, I've been dedicating myself to bonding with my baby, and now, as I make a comeback, I can only commit to two episodes a month to ensure my dedication as a wife, mom, and content creator. In this upcoming series, we will deep dive into different topics, starting with "The Price of Parenthood: Understanding the Cost of Having a Baby." We'll cover crucial aspects such as prenatal care cost, labor and delivery cost, postpartum care cost, and budgeting for a baby. Join me as I share my personal experience and insights. In the first episode of the series, I'll be discussing: prenatal care cost, labor and delivery cost, postpartum care cost Stay tuned until the end of the episode for a special bonus, and don't forget to share these episodes with anyone who can benefit from the information. Remember to subscribe to the podcast to stay updated and informed. Thank you for joining me on this journey, and I can't wait to dive into these important topics with you. Resources Mentioned Courses Dona International by Doula Nikia Lawson and Nurse Lydia Robinson is a free 14-hour virtual course broken up into a 4-part series. It's a live class where you can interact and ask questions. The classes aren't recorded, but they are offered every month, so you and anyone caring for your baby can tune in as much as you and anyone caring for your baby would like. https://docs.google.com/forms/d/12lmDgjmnnsUEbjhribDOg5j5ztbPsjcSW9M_cpr8-g0/viewform?edit_requested=true The Baby Academy- These are free and paid virtual courses offered Live by healthcare professionals. If you have insurance, they usually cover the paid courses. Just be sure to check with your provider first. https://yourbabyacademy.com/ Books Guide to Childbirth by Ina May Gaskin, known as the mother of American Midwifery. Bumpin': The Modern Guide to Pregnancy by Leslie Schrock *You can purchase these books or check your local library to see if you can borrow them. YouTube Channels- Free Diana in the Pink is a physician assistant who specializes in women's health https://www.youtube.com/@DianaInThePink Bridget Teyler who is a Dona Certified Doula and Childbirth educator https://www.youtube.com/@BridgetTeyler Websites- Free Spinning Babies is a website that offers tons of resources, including what to expect week by week. Apps- Free and Paid The Flo App has been my bff. I paid for the premium version which is less than $40 for the year. It alerted me when I should take a pregnancy test, what was happening to my body and my baby's body week by week, tips, and community to talk with other moms. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/willita-cherie/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/willita-cherie/support

Breastfeeding is often overlooked by pregnant moms as they prepare for their new babies. We often have no idea what breastfeeding really looks like until we're nursing our own child. The "Mother of Midwives" Ina May Gaskin explains how mothers can prepare themselves for an enjoyable breastfeeding experience.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Meagan has a new co-host today! Rebecca, a pelvic floor physical therapist and a VBAC Link doula located in Georgia joins Meagan while our friend Hannah from North Carolina shares her birth stories. This episode stresses again the true importance of not just a supportive provider, but of a supportive practice including hospital policies, the team of rotating providers, and the nurses. Hannah shows how her borderline preeclamptic symptoms were treated very differently between her first and second births. Her first practice had many red flags she didn't notice until her second practice showed green flag after green flag throughout her entire journey. Rebecca also shares her expertise surrounding pelvic floor PT– who needs it and how it can impact birth outcomes. She also debunks myths about small pelvises and talks in depth about scar tissue. Both women share such valuable tips that we know you will love!Real Food for Pregnancy by Lily NicholsNeeded WebsiteHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull Transcript under Episode Details 03:11 Review of the Week05:13 Hannah's stories08:17 Higher blood pressure readings and induction10:26 Induction due to high blood pressure readings11:52 Interventions and not being able to move during labor16:50 Hannah's C-section19:36 Rebecca's thoughts about pelvic bone structure22:42 Second pregnancy29:01 A medically necessary induction33:27 Ending the first full day of induction38:03 Pushing for 20 minutes39:59 Hannah's advice to listeners - provider support and nutrition44:17 Small pelvises and scar tissue50:13 Other scar tissue that can affect positioningMeagan: Hey, hey Women of Strength. It is Meagan and guess what? We have a cohost today, a new cohost who has never been with us and we are so excited that she is joining us. We have Rebecca Goldberg on our podcast today. Hello, Rebecca. Rebecca: Hello. Meagan: Thank you for taking the time and being with us. Rebecca: Yeah. I really love the resources and the community and I'm just thrilled to be here. Meagan: Well, we are excited and for anyone wondering who Rebecca is, she is an amazing human being. She actually does a lot in pelvic PT and is one of our VBAC-certified doulas. She's in Georgia. Rebecca: Yep. I'm in Atlanta, the Decatur area. Meagan: Decatur area. Is that where you serve mainly? Rebecca: Yeah. I have people who come to me from all over. Some people are traveling up to an hour or an hour and a half, but I actually can go to people's homes who are directly in my area. So, people who are post-C-section, I can come to you as early as the day you are discharged. I can work with you deal with pain, make sure you know what needs to happen, and help you do all of the things. That's where my passion really lies. Meagan: I love that. I love that and for VBAC, how early for pelvic floor and stuff? How early can you start working with them? Rebecca: As soon as they have gotten home. If they are planning on getting pregnant again, we can start building that into what our plans are so that we are starting that process earlier rather than later and you're more likely to have results that when you are ready to get pregnant, you can just get pregnant. Meagan: Love it. Awesome. Well, thank you, thank you for being here. 03:11 Review of the WeekMeagan: You guys, as usual, we have a Review of the Week. You don't have to listen to me stumble upon the review. Rebecca will read it. I'm sure she will do a lot better than I normally do. Rebecca: Well, this review is from Apple Podcasts and it's from semicrunchyyogi. I love that name. The review says, “My personal VBAC journey was actually directly influenced by Meagan Heaton, one of the hosts on this podcast. She was my doula with my second baby, my 10-pound VBAC baby.” Whoa. Meagan: Woo, yeah. Rebecca: “When she started this podcast, I knew it would be something special. I will always be passionate about VBAC and making sure women are given options, respect, and support through their birth journeys. This podcast does just that. This podcast is so needed and addresses important myths about VBAC and birth. Thank you so much, Julie and Meagan, for using your passion to support other women. You two are amazing examples of Women of Strength.” And then there's a heart. Meagan: Aww, I love that. Thank you semicrunchyyogi. Rebecca: Yogi, yeah. Meagan: That is awesome. Thank you so much. 05:13 Hannah's storiesMeagan: Okay, you guys. We have our friend, Hannah, from North Carolina so if you are from North Carolina, listen up. I feel like it's so important for us to start talking about where all of these Women of Strength are coming from because there are so many of us out there in the world who want to know where these people are because finding a supportive provider we know can be challenging. We have our friend, Hannah, from North Carolina sharing her amazing VBAC story. For anyone wondering a little bit more in relation to her story, she had preeclampsia I think actually with her both. Is that correct? Hannah: Yeah. With my first, they qualified it as gestational hypertension and then my second was preeclampsia. Meagan: So your VBAC was actually preeclamptic. Hannah: Yes.  Meagan: Awesome. Okay. That is something that we see a lot in our community. People are wondering if VBAC is possible with preeclampsia. We don't actually have a lot of stories on the podcast. In fact, you may be one of the first actually sharing in almost 300 episodes which is kind of sad. Hannah: Wow. Meagan: So we are really excited to talk about this, and you did have that CPD diagnosis like so many of us. Yeah. I'm going to welcome you on to share your stories. Hannah: Yeah, well thank you so much for having me. I've been listening for a while and I'm so excited to be here. I do live in the Triangle region of North Carolina. I'm just south of Raleigh in a town called Fuquay-Varina. A lot of people probably won't recognize that name, but if you are in the Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill area, I do have a great recommendation for a supportive provider there. Meagan: Is that more of a rural area? Hannah: It used to be pretty rural and just in the last 10-15 years, it's exploded. We're getting a Target and that's a big deal for us. Meagan: Yay! Every place is better with a Target. Hannah: Yes. Yes. Agreed. Meagan: Awesome. Okay, yeah. Let's hear about your 6-year-old, the one that you just started listening to the podcast after. Hannah: Yeah. Yeah, just to jump in, I had my first son in July of 2017 and I was a first-time mom. I went to a midwife practice, but they were midwives who delivered at the hospital that was closest to where I lived. I had been seeing them for a few years just for my general well-woman check-up. I liked them. I felt like I had a good rapport with them, so I stuck with that. My pregnancy was good. I was working full-time. I was a traveling salesperson at the time. That got to be a little tricky towards the end. In my third trimester, I started swelling. They were like, “Oh, we just need to keep an eye on this. It could be normal. If it gets coupled with high blood pressure, then it might be concerning.” 08:17 Higher blood pressure readings and inductionHannah: Around 35 weeks, I did have high blood pressure readings. Just on the side, I have a history of white coat syndrome even as a teenager. My blood pressure would shoot up in the office so that's always been an issue for me and I was concerned about that for pregnancy because I knew high blood pressure, pregnancy, high risk, and I was hoping for an intervention-free birth in the hospital. Meagan: Yeah. Hannah: I did all of the things, I thought. I had a doula. I had read Ina May Gaskin. Meagan: Guide to Childbirth. Hannah: Yes. I did HypnoBabies. Meagan: You were very prepared. Hannah: Yes. I felt very prepared but I think I didn't have the understanding. I just heard midwife and I just thought, “Oh, natural birth.” I didn't research the hospital too much so I just didn't know what I didn't know. At 35 weeks, they diagnosed me with gestational hypertension. They were pretty aggressive in their management of it. They told me, “You are done working. You are not going back to work. You are on bedrest.” Basically, they said, “You can shower, use the bathroom, and make yourself food, but other than that, you should be lying down and we will definitely induce you by your due date at the latest.” Meagan: Do you remember what your readings were reflecting at that time? Hannah: Yes. I think in the office, it would be maybe 140/85 or 90 but then at home, I had my own cuff and they were reading normal like 118/70 and stuff like that. Meagan: Interesting. So definitely some white coat syndrome maybe and then they were pushing the induction when overall, your pressures were probably pretty regular. Hannah: Yes. That was just, I don't know. It was hard to know what was the right thing to do in that situation because I was a first-time mom. I don't want to put my baby at risk. Eventually, they agreed to induce me. I went in the night before my due date. I had been going in for extra monitoring. I had NSTs and biophysical profiles, so everything was good. They just, because I had that gestational hypertension label, they wanted me to deliver by my due date. I did go into the hospital the night before my due date. I think I was maybe a centimeter dilated, 50% effaced. I did the whole Foley bulb overnight. They thought, “Oh, that's going to stay in for 12 hours.” They put it in and then within an hour and a half, it comes out and I'm 4 centimeters dilated. Meagan: That's awesome.Hannah: Yeah. It got off to a good note. They were like, “Oh, this is going to go great. You're going to do great tomorrow.” I'm like, “Oh, okay.” I tried to get sleep. Everyone knows in the hospital even with an ambian, you don't sleep. My doula came the next morning. I believe they started Pitocin around 7:00 AM. I really was hoping not to get the epidural. I just had this fear of that cascade of interventions. I did know about that and I just felt like, “Okay. I'm going to try to do everything I can to keep that from happening,” because a C-section was something I was very fearful of. I'm an only child. My mom delivered me via C-section. It was a hard delivery and I just had always had a fear of that being my story. 11:52 Interventions and not being able to move during laborHannah: Things were going fine on the Pitocin. I was working through the contractions. They were just very odd. They didn't want me out of the bed. Thankfully, I did have my doula there. She was like, “Just stand next to the bed. Sit on the birth ball,” but they were just treating me like someone with severe preeclampsia would be treated and that just was not my case. Even they didn't really want me getting up to go to the bathroom a lot. They were telling me I couldn't walk the halls. I couldn't use the shower. It was very odd. So around noon, the midwife says, “Hey, I want to break your water.” I said, “I'm really not comfortable with that. I think I'm making a whole lot of progress. I've only been on Pitocin for a few hours. I'd really not have my water broken.” She says, “Well, you're here to be induced for a reason. We need to speed this up, so I would really like to break your water.”  Meagan: Oh dear. Hannah: Yeah. That's really where things started going downhill for me. I didn't really understand at the time, a doula can't say, “Hey, she said she doesn't want that done. She doesn't want that.” But I also didn't really get the support I needed I guess in that moment when I was vulnerable. I didn't really have anyone to say, “Hey, do you want to talk for a minute and come back to this?” So I did agree. I mean, I guess verbally I agreed. I didn't feel like I was agreeing, but she broke my water and after that, I just remember things intensified so much. I remember by around 3:00 PM being in excruciating pain and that's when I asked for the epidural. It took two hours for them to bring it. I finally got the epidural and I just immediately fell asleep because we had been there for probably 20 hours at this point.Meagan: Were you feeling any specific discomfort in the back? Were there any signs that maybe baby would have been in a poor position after the floodgates opened? Hannah: It's interesting. That actually will come up once the C-section is performed. We were told at my– I think I had a biophysical profile at 39 weeks and the tech was like, “Oh, your baby is posterior,” but I didn't really understand what that meant. But when he was delivered, they did say he was in the anterior position, so I just remember contractions being unbearable and I think it was because of the level of Pitocin I was on. They just ramped it up. I even remember at one point, the midwife saying to me– so once I had the epidural, I'm laying down resting, I had asked for a peanut ball, but no one really helped me with it. My doula tried to but I don't know. The nurse I got that day was not very helpful. Then my poor husband is usually my rock. He is so strong, but he just was like a deer in the headlights because it was his first time going through this and it was just rough. Hannah: So finally, that night at 8:00 PM, the midwife comes and checks. She's like, “Yeah, you're still only 4 centimeters dilated. I think the baby is developing a caput.” How do you say it?  Meagan: A caput. Which is interesting. At 4 centimeters, do you remember how low your baby was? Because at 4 centimeters, baby getting caput, baby must have been coming low.Hannah: And that's the thing, he wasn't. He was still at a -2 station. Meagan: Huh. So not even engaged. Hannah: Yeah. So I don't know. She was like, “You know, I really think you need a C-section. I think your pelvis is too small.” I was like, “Okay. Wow. That was not something I'd ever been told in all of these years of going to this practice.” She was like, “So that would be my recommendation. I could give you one more hour.” I said, “Okay.” I'm crying at this point. I'm like, “In your professional opinion, do you think an hour would make a difference?” She said, “No.” Again, I did ultimately agree to that C-section. I signed off on it, but I was very upset. This isn't what I want. I was honestly so out of it at this point. It's hard to remember some of it. Yeah. As soon as I agreed, they came in there. They give you the form. They are wheeling you down the hall. There was never really an issue of my baby being in distress. It just was kind of like, “Oh, you've been here for a while. You're not progressing. Let's just go ahead and do a C-section,” and then her commenting that my pelvis was too small. 16:50 Hannah's C-sectionHannah: I go to the operating room. Everything goes pretty standard, but my husband does go to stand up when they are delivering the baby. He was like, “Great. I wanted to see it.” As the doctor goes to pull the baby out, she says, “Oh. I've never seen this before.” She's been in practice for 25 years. It turned out my son had the umbilical cord wrapped around both hands and both feet and then that was together. Meagan: Oh. Hannah: She said, “Oh, your baby is tied.” Meagan: Wow. Hannah: Yeah, so it's like, “Okay. It does make sense why he wasn't descending.”Meagan: Yeah. Hannah: He's good. I'm good. I did have a hard recovery. They tried to show him to me. I start vomiting on the operating table and then it just gets blurry from there. It was just really hard. I don't remember holding him for the first time in the recovery room. All of it is very blurry until the next morning. Yeah, but overall, recovery went well. I had a very hard time breastfeeding him. He was a very, very tense baby– tongue tie, lip tie, and all of that, so that was stressful. Meagan: Man, you had a lot. That was a lot. Hannah: Yeah. It was hard. Meagan: Yeah. It's kind of interesting because knowing that, “Oh, yeah your baby was really wound up in here,” that would make more sense than just diagnosing you with CPD. Hannah: Yes. That's what I thought. I was like, “Okay.” The midwife was saying that during labor. Maybe she just thought that because I wasn't progressing, baby wasn't descending. So then at my six-week checkup, I asked to see the doctor who delivered my son in the surgery. I saw her and I was just debriefing with her. I said, “Do you think that was the reason he couldn't come out?” She was like, “Yeah, probably.” But then she didn't even really examine me. I had to ask. I was like, “Are you going to check my C-section scar? Are you going to do an internal? What am I here for?” She was like, “Yeah, fine. I can do that.” She goes, “Oh, no. You have a flat pubic bone. You shouldn't even try to have a VBAC,” then basically walks out of the room as I'm crying. Meagan: Oh my gosh. I have a question for Rebecca in here and pelvic floor and stuff. Do you see flat pubic bones and is that truly something that causes an issue?19:36 Rebecca's thoughts about pelvic bone structureRebecca: I can't imagine so. I mean, if you think about the way that the baby comes down, the pubic bones are not super involved. You have the pubic symphysis which is the little cartilage between the pubic bones. That gets soft just like all of our other joints due to relaxin and that makes everything moveable. There are people who even have that separate. The shape of the pubic bones– it just seems a little bit odd to me. Meagan: Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. I mean, I'm thinking that I can put my fingers exactly where I felt when mine did start to separate and I have a wonky pelvis too. My pelvis goes all funky. It's just so interesting to me to always hear that providers jump right to, “Your bones are not good enough.”Hannah: Yeah. Yeah. That was so hard to hear because it was like, “Oh, something is wrong with me. It's my fault.” Then a midwife who I was closer with there, when I saw her when my baby was about 6 months old for just my annual exam, I asked her about that comment. She said, “Oh, I think what she was saying is you have a narrow pelvic arch.” Okay. Meagan: Okay, all right. 22:42 Second pregnancyMeagan: Did you go into this next pregnancy feeling doubtful of your pelvis?Hannah: Oh absolutely. Yes. Yeah. I definitely was very nervous. I mean, I remember searching through groups on Facebook or the Babysitter App “Flat pubic bone, narrow pelvic arch” to see if anyone else had been diagnosed with that and gone on to successfully have a VBAC. Meagan: Right, yeah. So baby #2. Hannah: Yep. I ended up actually getting pregnant when my first son was about 3 years old. I literally had just been dreaming about having a VBAC since my first son was born. I feel so thankful that I found your podcast, the Facebook community of The VBAC Link and I also found my local ICAN group who just was so helpful in finding my new provider. I switched to that new provider before I even got pregnant just because I knew I was not going back to that first practice ever for anything. Meagan: Yeah. That's actually something I suggest highly. A lot of the time, we don't think about finding that provider until we are pregnant, but finding a provider when we're not pregnant is kind of weird. There is this vulnerability that we don't have. We have this– it sounds silly– tougher skin when we're not pregnant. Hannah: No, I totally get that. Meagan: You're in a different headspace. You're like, “No, I already know I'm not going back to this person. I'm going to find this new person and go now.” Hannah: Yeah. So thankfully, I did find them. The hospital was a 45-minute drive so it was a big difference from my first where the hospital was only 20 minutes away, but that was so worth it to me. I was pregnant during COVID. I got pregnant in September 2020, so things were weird anyway. Appointments were more spaced out. Some of them were virtual. I feel bad saying this because I know so many people had a hard time with not having their husbands or partners come with them to appointments, but it actually was kind of nice that I didn't have to go in as much just because of my anxiety with the doctor's office. But I really did like the midwives that I was seeing at this new practice and the issue about my blood pressure did get brought up. I had a couple of high readings early on in the pregnancy. I think I went to my first appointment around 13 weeks in person and definitely had a high reading. It sounded like they actually believed me this time though. When I told them about the white coat syndrome and my past, they took my word and were like, “We get it. We see it all the time. Have a blood pressure monitor at home and if you could at your next appointment, bring it in. We'll test your blood pressure on that and on the machine just to make sure it's accurate.” Just with that, I felt so validated. Rebecca: I was just going to say that's really wonderful that your providers did that and they just accepted you at your word. That's really beautiful. Hannah: Yeah. I felt like that was such a difference. People talk about red flags all the time, but I felt like that was a green flag like, “Okay. This is someone who is actually listening to me as a patient.” Things went great. I actually got to a point where my readings in the office were normal. I think just from feeling more relaxed and more supported. I brought up the whole small pelvis thing. I had several midwives say, “I don't believe that. We hear that all the time. We're not going to worry about that.” So everything went great up until about 37 weeks when I got COVID. Thank God I did not have a hard time with it at all. It was a sinus infection, but I missed my 37-week appointment then when I went in for my 38-week appointment, my blood pressure was elevated so that was concerning for them given my history. Meagan: That's interesting. I'm curious if it was correlated at all, or if it was just your history because sometimes we know if we've got preeclampsia in the past, we may be more likely to have it in the future, but I'm curious if that's related at all. Hannah: I know. I know. I've wondered that and it's so hard because I don't think I'll ever definitively know, but it seems like, “Oh, you were fine at 36 weeks. You get COVID at 37 weeks and then high blood pressure the next week.” But I was also going through some other stressful things. I had a family member pass away. I had a situation with my dog where he almost passed away and that's like my first baby. Oh, and then I broke my foot at 36 weeks pregnant. Meagan: Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Hannah: Yeah. I know. Meagan: Holy cow. Hannah: It sounds insane. It sounds insane, but anyway. Meagan: That's a lot to endure right before your birth. Hannah: Yeah, so I'm like, it probably wasn't the COVID, it probably was the stress. Sorry, I'm laughing but that's just my way of dealing with stress. So I go to that appointment and they go, “Ooh, your blood pressure is high.” They did do an NST on the baby and unfortunately, I feel like this happens to me and other people a lot. This midwife that particular day I had not met yet and she was definitely one of the more strict ones. She was like, “You know, I really think you need to go to the hospital to be monitored.” I was like, “Well, let's do the NST. Let's see how that goes.” They had taken my bloodwork. I was like, “Can we just wait and see what the bloodwork comes back as?” She kind of gave me a hard time about that. She was like, “You don't want to leave here not knowing if your baby is okay.” I'm like, “I feel like my baby is fine.” I remember calling my doula on the way home just hysterical about her saying that and thankfully, my doula was amazing and just like, “Don't worry about it. They are checking your blood. Everything will be fine.” I did go home. I rested. Thankfully, my older son was with my mother-in-law, but then that evening, I got a call and they were like, “Hannah, you are showing some signs in your labs on the actual bloodwork of borderline preeclampsia,” is what they were saying. 29:01 A medically necessary inductionHannah: This was a different midwife than I was seeing earlier in the day. She said, “I do think you need to come to the hospital and have a baby tonight.” That was really scary for me in that moment. Meagan: Yeah, it's hard because you are like, “This is not what I wanted.” It's hard to mentally go back to the same beginning in a way. Hannah: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I just remember calling my husband. He was still at work and I was just hysterical. I was like, “This is going to end in a C-section again. This is exactly what I was worried about.” He thankfully was so calming and was like, “You can't think like that. Let's just go and see what happens.” He comes home. We pack our stuff up and we drive the 45 minutes to the hospital. We get there and I'm just very distressed by having the sweetest midwife who just sat on the bed with me and was holding my hand and was like, “Look, it's going to be okay. Everything is going to be fine. We're going to do everything in our power to get you this VBAC. Do not let this make you feel like that's not happening now.” So that was so comforting and being 38 weeks, I was not dilated at all. I think I was maybe 50% effaced and the baby was at -2 station so we definitely had to do the whole Foley bulb again which for anyone who has had that done–Meagan: So you have a Foley placed with a closed cervix. Hannah: Yeah. Meagan: You're a champ. That is definitely something that is not super comfortable for the listeners to know, but it is possible even though a lot of providers say it's not. Hannah: Yeah, and I hear that a lot. I guess I just got very fortunate with the midwife who was on call. They definitely did give me some medication to help me relax. Meagan: Fentanyl or something? Hannah: Actually Adavan.Meagan: Oh Adavan?Hannah: I have very bad anxiety anyway and they gave me that to help me relax which it did. They got that inserted and it was so weird because the time I was expecting the same thing with my first, “Oh, it comes out in an hour and a half.” It didn't. It was there for the whole 12 hours. The next morning, they started Pitocin. Eventually, I think they just took the Foley bulb out and I think at that point I was maybe 3 centimeters dilated. I was on Pitocin for 5 or 6 hours but it was just so crazy to me because even with it being COVID times, I was allowed to walk around the halls. I had wireless monitoring. They even let me get in the bathtub in the room. It was just so different from the experience that I had at the hospital with my first. I just really loved their process. They, of course, were kind of concerned with the preeclampsia diagnosis, but since my labs were staying stable, my blood pressures weren't rising, I think they were probably in the 140s/high 80s-low 90s range, they really did let me take it slow since there wasn't a major concern for me or the baby's health in regards to the blood pressure. I remember they even turned my Pitocin off for a little bit this afternoon and one of the midwives was like, “Hey, this is something that may not work, but would you be willing to take some Tums? There is research showing that it could possibly reset your oxytocin receptors in your uterus.” I remember her being like, “It sounds kind of woo, but it's worth a try.” Meagan: I have never heard of this. I am fascinated. Tums resetting our oxytocin. Hannah: Yeah. It's crazy. The research is there if you just Google “Tums, Pitocin”Meagan: Oxytocin receptors. Okay, you keep sharing. I'm going to dive into this for a bit because I've been a doula for 10 years and I've never heard of this and I love it. This is cool. All right, keep going. Hannah: Yeah. I took the Tums. We turned the Pitocin off for a little bit. They were like, “Try to rest. Eat a snack.” That was the other thing. They were so encouraging of me eating and drinking whereas my first birth, they were like, “You can't have anything but ice chips.” We did turn the Pitocin back on for about 6 hours that evening. 33:27 Ending the first full day of inductionHannah: I think at the end of that day– so this was the first full day of induction, I was still around 4 centimeters. I had a new nurse come on and a new midwife comes on. They were just so awesome. I definitely had an emotional breakdown at that point. My awesome doula had been with me and my husband all day. She went home for the evening to get some rest. They were like, “What do you want to do? You are looking good. Baby is looking good.” My water was still intact at that point. I was like, “I just want to sleep tonight. I know if I do not sleep tonight, I'm not going to have the energy to finish this birth.” It was amazing because the charge nurse did not want me to stop the Pitocin and my midwife and my nurse basically went to bat for me. They were like, “No. She's fine. We're going to give her Benadryl. We're going to let her sleep. We're turning the Pitocin off. And that's what we did. I slept. I actually got to rest that night. They came back at 5:00 AM and rehung the Pit. I did agree to my water being broken at 8:00 AM because at this point, we had been in the hospital for almost 36 hours and baby needed to come out. That just in and of itself, I felt like that was my choice. No one ever pressured me. It was all my choice. I did agree to my water being broken. That was around probably 9:00 AM and I just continued laboring. It was great. I remember I had my bathroom. There are no windows in there and I had my fairy lights and my music playing and my doula had essential oils diffusing and that was my cave. I felt like I could go in there and just shut out being at the hospital and really focus on labor, sitting on the toilet, and eventually, I did get to a point around 1:00 where I started to have a hard time coping. I was like, “You know, I don't know if I want to do this anymore.” I gave it another hour and I was like, “Okay. I need the epidural.” I did get the epidural around 2:00 that day. It was just amazing because even getting the epidural, the nurses were like, “Hey, let's put you in throne position. Let's pull out the stirrups and get one leg up. In 30 minutes, let's switch to the other leg. Let's get the peanut ball.” I felt like they were doing all of these things to help me that I had never experienced in my first birth. I felt like they wanted me to have the birth that I was desiring so badly almost as much as I did. Meagan: I love them already. I don't even know that. Hannah: I know. I know. Can I say who it is? The hospital I was at was actually the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and it was the UNC midwives who was my practice that I delivered with but even the nurses at that hospital are just amazing. They were all literal angels. I love them. Meagan: We will make sure that they are on our provider list. Hannah: Yes. Yes. They are wonderful. So that went on. I think around maybe 6:00 I was checked and I was hanging around 5 centimeters. I got really discouraged at that point. I was like, “You know, maybe I just can't do it. Maybe my body is just not going to dilate.” But they weren't worried. They just kept helping me move and then I do remember shift change happened. A new nurse comes on and a new midwife. This was probably the 5th shift change by the time we had been in there and the midwife came in and checked me. She was like, “Oh, you're 6 centimeters.” I remember so many stories of women being like, “The first 5 are the hardest.” Meagan: Mhmm. Hannah: I was like, “Okay. Maybe that's true.” Then literally, at 9:40, the midwife came back, checked me, and she was like, “How far dilated do you hope you are?” I'm thinking, “Well, gosh. I hope at least a 7 or 8.” She had a tear and she was like, “You are 10 centimeters.”  Meagan: Oh yay! Hannah: Yes. I started bawling and it was so crazy because my first son was born at 9:42 PM and that was right about when I was 10 centimeters. For some reason, I knew if I could make it to 10 centimeters, I knew I could push my baby out. The pushing him out was not the part that I was scared of. It was like, “Oh, is my body going to be able to get to that point?” But yeah. I remember my husband and doula being so excited because they brought in the cart and they brought in a mirror and I started pushing. It's just so crazy thinking back to that seeing that happening. 38:03 Pushing for 20 minutesHannah: I pushed for 20 minutes and both of my boys were a surprise. We didn't know what gender they would be. 20 minutes later, my second beautiful baby boy was born healthy, screaming, put directly on my chest and it was one of the best moments of my entire life. Meagan: Oh my gosh. I love this story. I love all of the support and all of the love and all of the amp that was just completely surrounded around you and then you had the confidence in your body at that end where you were like, “Okay. I've got this.” 20 minutes? Hannah: Yeah. I was like, “Oh, here's my small pelvis with my flat pubic bone.” Meagan: Yeah. I love that so much. Do you know what? I just was looking at our provider list and guess what? It says that UNC midwives are on our list and it says specifically that they are also VBA2C supportive. Hannah: Yeah. I think that's the only hospital in our area that generally will support after two Cesareans. Meagan: So awesome. I'm glad that they are on the list. I wanted to make sure because they sound phenomenal. I would love to connect with one of them and just have them on the podcast honestly and say, “Talk to me about your unit and your guys' way of thinking. This is the way so many people want to birth when they are birthing in the hospital, but we don't have these options and we don't have these systems and we don't have these policies or these beliefs or whatever” because they sound amazing.Hannah: They are. I know they are on Instagram just @uncmidwives so they are easy to find. Meagan: Okay. I might be messaging them. Hannah: If anyone is a Tar Heels fan out there, that was a big portion there too. My husband was like, “Our baby was born at Chapel Hill.” That's a big thing for North Carolina people. Meagan: That is so awesome. Oh my gosh. 39:59 Hannah's advice to listeners - provider support and nutritionMeagan: Any advice that you would give to someone who especially is preeclamptic with induction and all of these things? Do you have any advice that you would give to our listeners?Hannah: Yeah. I mean, number one, and I feel like you guys really help express this, but a supportive provider. Evidence shows that induction for VBAC can be safe. Of course, do we want an unnecessary induction? No, not ever, but in a situation like mine where preeclampsia is a concern, that shouldn't exclude you from being able to have a VBAC. Meagan: Mhmm. Hannah: I think asking a provider those questions maybe before you even get pregnant, “Would you induce for VBAC? Under what circumstances? What is your VBAC rate?” That's what I would tell women who are looking for that. Meagan: I love that and I agree. I would echo that asking those questions and not being scared to ask them because you deserve to know and you deserve to find the provider who is going to connect with you personally and your desires because we know through talking to Dr. Fox and all of these other providers, not every provider is the same and that's okay. That doesn't make them a bad provider. They just may not be supportive of your desires. Hannah: Mhmm. Meagan: With your first one, I feel like you had more of that med-wife mentality. Hannah: Yes. I found that word after I had him and I was like, “Oh, that makes sense.” Meagan: Yes. What else were you going to say?Hannah: Just going back to preeclampsia, the other thing I would say that I didn't know a whole lot about with my second or first pregnancy was how much nutrition affects preeclampsia. I believe you've had someone on your podcast who has discussed that before just how there are so many things you are told like, “You shouldn't be eating salt,” and actually, that's not true. You shouldn't be eating processed food, but women in pregnancy need salt so I did find there's the Brewer diet. I think that can be– I've heard amazing stories about that from women who have had preeclampsia in the past. There is a nutritionist I follow on Instagram. She is Aloha Nutrition and she is pregnant with twins right now. I think she is almost 40 weeks old. Her blood pressure has been awesome and she attributes it to beetroot. Meagan: Uh-huh. Okay, yes. I've had a client who had preeclampsia with her first really, really early, and beets and liver, and these types of things really impact. I mean, that's why I personally and I'm throwing in a shameless plug here, but that is why I personally love Needed so much because they have really dove in to find out what nutrients you need and help you get it because there are so many of these nutrients that are lacking in our day-to-day foods and it's overwhelming to learn about them and find them and then find the good resource of where to get them. It really can be impactful just like Aloha Nutrition is showing. It's very common with twins to get that high blood pressure. Hannah: Yeah, so I think nutrition is huge and I think that's just one of the really big problems is that we are not being looked at as a whole person when we are pregnant. It's just that we are being looked at, “Oh, you have preeclampsia. This is what the research shows,” but so much of that research is outdated and they are not focusing on those foundations like nutrition that are so important during pregnancy. Meagan: Absolutely. Yeah. It was Lily Nichols who I had on, but she has more about gestational diabetes. She also has her book for pregnancy in general and I would highly suggest checking that book out. Rebecca: I recommend it to all pregnant moms. It's on my bookshelf. I love it. Meagan: Same. She really is so incredible. I could talk to her for hours and hours and hours on nutrition and pregnancy and how impactful it is. I mean, yeah. It's just so hard. We have so much processed stuff going on in our worlds and it's easy and it's fast, but yeah. We are lacking a lot so I love that you put that note in. 44:17 Small pelvises and scar tissueMeagan: And then Rebecca, at the end of this, I wanted to talk a little bit about the pelvic floor and how C-sections can actually impact the pelvic floor health, and then ways to address it, what we can do, and how we can plan for VBAC moving forward. Rebecca: Yeah. I just wanted to back up and touch on this idea of having a small pelvis, that your pelvis, the outlet can grow by 30% which is huge, as you are giving birth as long as your sacrum which is your tailbone and your lower pelvis is able to move which is why being off the bed is the place to be because then everything can move and your body can actually grow and expand. Your bones do. That's one of the reasons we have relaxin.So many people are just like, “Yeah. I was told I have a small pelvis.” I'm like, “Were you on your back?” They are like, “Oh, yes I was.” Then I'm like, “Well, your pelvis was likely closed. It can open. We can make it open.” Meagan: It was actually physically smaller. Rebecca: Yes and the bones could not move to make more space for the baby. It's just really interesting. A lot of people actually surprisingly believe that a C-section is a way to save your pelvic floor from any sort of injury or trauma when having children and that is not the case. I don't know if either of you has heard that before. Meagan: Yeah. Okay, so I had a really petite Asian client. She had a C-section. She really wanted a VBAC. I have so many feelings about this birth, but they literally told her that if she wanted to poop herself for the rest of her life, she could have a VBAC and if not, then they would highly suggest a C-section because that would be the only way to avoid her having severe incontinence with her bowels. Rebecca: That is awful. Meagan: It terrified her. Rebecca: That is fearmongering at its worst. Meagan: Yeah. As a doula, sitting there watching it– and I had already watched them preparing the C-section in the hall previously. I had seen the Cesarean coming and I warned them, “They are preparing this. Nothing is showing that we need to do this,” but that was one of the reasons and she was terrified. I just said, “That's not necessarily true,” but it stuck with her. It impacted her so badly that she said, “Okay. Let's do it.” Rebecca: I'm really sorry that she had that experience. Meagan: Me too. Rebecca: Yeah. People think again this idea that your pelvic floor is spared, but you can still have pelvic floor dysfunction even if you have a C-section. You can still have leaking. You can still have pain with sex. You can still have constipation issues because people forget you spent the last 10 months growing this baby and your pelvic floor was working to support it. It is affected regardless of how you birth which is why every person who births should be getting some sort of assessment by a pelvic PT. I don't know if you are aware of that, but then if you have scar tissue because you birthed via C-section, the scar tissue can actually impede all sorts of things. The three most common side effects are hip and back pain, pain with sex, and urgency and frequency with urination which doesn't sound great and nobody really talks about it. Meagan: They normalize it. Rebecca: Yeah, agreed. It's just, “You had a baby so that's what you should expect.” We should expect better. We should always expect better. So by addressing that scar tissue, you can actually manage a lot of those things and hit them off long before they become a problem. Meagan: Yeah, it's interesting. I didn't know about scar massage or pelvic PT a ton until after my second C-section but then I started doing all of the things and I have a lot of adhesions. She could feel them internally and then we would work on my scar. My back pain would reduce. I did notice a difference during sex and things like that. She was like, “No, let's work this out for your vaginal birth because you also have trauma in general” which can sometimes be held in the pelvic floor. We have physical trauma and adhesions being created then I had emotional trauma and a lot of that, I carried in my pelvic floor. Rebecca: It's very common for people to carry that in their pelvic floor because our society says that peeing and pooping and sex is all taboo so maybe you didn't learn about it. Maybe yes, you are having sex but it's a shameful thing for you because of your upbringing. There are a lot of reasons that can contribute to this pelvic floor dysfunction. Constipation is actually one of the biggest indications that you may have a long stage one labor just because you may have a tight pelvic floor which means you may have difficulty relaxing it. Let's be real. You don't need a strong pelvic floor to birth a baby. You need a relaxed pelvic floor. You need to let the muscles get out of the way so that baby can come out because the pelvic floor is not pushing the baby out. Your uterus is.  Meagan: Uterus, yeah. Yeah. 50:13 Other scar tissue that can affect positioningMeagan: All fascinating. I highly suggest checking out a pelvic floor specialist no matter if you've had a vaginal birth but especially if you've had a C-section because like she said, it doesn't mean that we don't have things to work through and even if we've had a C-section too, I want to point out that we can also have scar tissue on the cervix from things like IUPCs being placed or if we have ever had a forceps birth or just in general. Things can happen where we've got cervical scarring that needs to be worked through so that for our VBAC, we can progress. I love hearing that Hannah was able to go in and get a Foley with a closed cervix and have this beautiful VBAC, but sometimes, that is definitely hard to get a provider to even do those interventions, and then if we have scar tissue on top of that, that can also cause things to be a little harder. Rebecca: One more point about scar tissue, even if you've had your appendix out or you have had a laparoscopic surgery, those sorts of things can actually affect the position of the baby. It can cause breech positioning or can cause you discomfort because the scar tissue is not allowing your body to expand as it needs to. So even those things are some really wonderful things that pelvic PT can help you with even if you didn't have a C-section. Meagan: Love it. Awesome. Well, if you are in the Georgia area, definitely check out Dr. Rebecca and if you are in the North Carolina area, definitely go check out UNC midwives. Is that right?Hannah: Right. That's them. Meagan: UNC midwives and keep listening here because these stories just like this and information like this are what we want to do. It's what we want to provide for you. If you have a certain topic or something like that that you are looking forward to, please email us at info@thevbaclink.com because we want to try to make sure we get that on the show. Thank you guys so much for being with us today.Rebecca: Thank you. Hannah: Thank you.ClosingWould you like to be a guest on the podcast? Tell us about your experience at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Meagan's bio, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-vbac-link/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Episode 33 on the 22nd...fitting for a twin freebirth story, and not just any story - because we know these are special...but Georgia shares how she only found out she was having twins as Freddy was being born! Georgia talks us through her first birth with daughter 'Bo' and the immense trauma she experienced. It is an example of how denying women options based on 'low risk' 'high risk' can trigger a cascade of events that ultimately end in trauma and have lasting consequences on future experiences. Based purely on appearance, she was diagnosed with gestational diabetes. Disgraceful and hugely problematic. Georgia, determinded to not place her 'care' in the hands of people who seemingly did not 'care', chose to have a wild pregnancy and freebirth her next baby...or BABIES! The first part of the episode discusses the traumatic birth story. If you're not in a place to listen to this - the WILD PREGNANCY/FREEBIRTH STORY BEGINS AT approx: 1 hour 11 mins Links to resources: Jane Harwicke Collins https://janehardwickecollings.com/EMDR Therapy for Birth Trauma https://fionarogerson.com.au/emdr-for-birth-trauma/Ina May Gaskin https://www.facebook.com/InaMayGaskin/Rachel Reed https://www.rachelreed.website/Support the show

Today's midwife story is from Ineka - mum of one little boy born at home, and a homebirth/private midwife. Ineka is based in the Newcastle region and today share's how initially, she didn't think she would be able to get the results to be accepted in to a Bachelor of Midwifery program. After some soul searching through travel, including attending a talk by Ina May Gaskin, Ineka returned to Australia determind to be a midwife. She talks about how she achieved her 5000 hours and found her way in to private midwifery, reclaiming her own power as a midwife, in a system that generally disempowers midwives and limits their scope drastically to keep the hierachy of the medical model. Please share with any student midwives and midwives, or anyone who may be interested in Ineka's great story :) Links to resources: Ina May Gaskin https://thefarmmidwives.org/Becoming a Private Midwife https://www.homebirthaustralia.org/homebirth-information.htmlJane Hardwick Collins https://www.instagram.com/janehardwickecollings/?hl=enCHAPTERS00:00Introduction and Background10:49Becoming a Privately Practicing Midwife29:35Trusting Birth and Supporting Autonomy52:28Birth as a Transformative Experience59:06Exploring Birthing OptionsSupport the show

Author, educator, mother, and grandmother Ina May Gaskin joins the podcast in celebration of our 400th episode! She single handedly resuscitated the practice of modern midwifery, founded and directed The Farm Midwifery Center in Tennessee, and retired only after 44 years of attending births. We are honored to have Ina May here in conversation. A special thank you goes to Sarah Culver on Ina May's team for her tireless assistance in helping us produce this episode! We appreciate you! Connect with Ina May Gaskin online: Ina May on Facebook Learn more about Ina May: National Women's Hall of Fame Reach Sarah here: @thesteadathomemom Want more pregnancy + parenting? Check out our new visual series Empowered Mama! Join host and mother of two Arista Ilona as she elicits inspiring and hopeful stories of pregnancy, birth and parenthood from everyday mothers through a lens of celebration and honor. Empowered Mama is available exclusively on Informed Pregnancy Plus. Start your FREE TRIAL of Informed Pregnancy+ and get access to all our curated pregnancy and parenting content: https://www.informedpregnancy.tv/  Keep up with Dr. Berlin and the Informed Pregnancy Project online! www.informedpregnancy.com www.instagram.com/doctorberlin/ www.facebook.com/InformedPregnancy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

We love hearing stories of how our Women of Strength navigate birth in an empowered way, no matter the outcome. Rebecca's story shows how she carefully selected the most supportive homebirth midwife, created a safe birth space in her home, labored hard and beautifully with her husband, took time to process information, assessed her situation, and consented to her second Cesarean when the time felt right to her. Meagan also talks about the different types of positioning and some signs that your baby might be in a less-than-ideal position. Rebecca and Meagan discuss tips and tricks to help prevent a swollen cervix and what options you have if that happens to you!Additional LinksNeeded WebsiteHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull Transcript under Episode Details Timestamp Topics01:54 Review of the Week04:31 Rebecca's first pregnancy07:25 Consenting to an unexpected C-section for breech presentation8:53 Fertility Fridays11:02 Sparked interest in VBAC and getting pregnant again13:53 Planning for a HBAC18:00 Tachycardia and GBS positive21:27 Early labor24:18 Calling the team30:10 Laboring through the night39:02 Making the decision to transfer44:53 Consenting to a C-section46:43 Tips for when things don't go as planned50:43 Signs of wonky positioning53:31 What to do57:00 Why you shouldn't skip the repeat Cesarean storiesMeagan: Hello, hello. It is Meagan with another amazing story on The VBAC Link podcast. Thank you so much for listening to us, you guys. I love this community. I know I talk about it. I know it's weird that I don't even know you, but I love you. I love you so much and I'm so glad that you are here with us today. We have our guest today from, let's see, Virginia. I think it's Virginia. That's what my mind is saying. Rebecca: Yep. Meagan: This is Rebecca, so welcome, Rebecca. Rebecca: Thank you. Thank you for having me. I'm really excited. Meagan: Absolutely. Me too. Her story, you guys, today is a repeat Cesarean story so if you didn't know on The VBAC Link, we do share repeat Cesarean stories because they are important to share as well. I'm excited for you to share more about your story and we're going to talk a little bit about swelling of the cervix at the end of this episode because this is something that we see and is a little bit of a part of your story. 01:54 Review of the WeekBefore we dive into the story and all of the things, we of course want to share a Review of the Week. This review is from shotsie3 and it says, “Amazing is not a strong enough word.” That is really awesome. I love that. It says, “I cannot say enough good things about The VBAC Link. Listening to this podcast not only saved my mental health but gave me the knowledge and confidence to take control of my second pregnancy. After my home birth turned into a hospital transfer and Cesarean with my first child, I felt broken. When I unexpectedly found out I was pregnant just 7 months postpartum, I felt scared and lost. I was afraid of failing again and doubted my body's ability to birth naturally, but I knew I absolutely could not have another Cesarean so I started obsessively researching VBAC. That's when I found The VBAC Link. I've been binging episodes ever since. Listening to these stories has been incredible. Each episode is like giving a shot of confidence into the arm.” Oh, I love that. A shot of confidence into the arm. We're giving you guys a little vaccine of confidence. It says, “Both my midwives and doulas have commented on how far my mental prep has come and I know it's all thanks to The VBAC Link. Julie and Meagan have given me lots of tools and resources to control my birth.” I love that. Control your birth. “I am now looking forward to welcoming my second child via HBAC in just five short weeks. I want to shout it from the rooftop, ‘EVERYONE SHOULD LISTEN TO THE VBAC LINK!'”This review was a little while ago, so shotsie3, if you are still listening with us, which we hope you are, email us. Let us know how your birth went. 04:31 Rebecca's first pregnancyMeagan: Okay, cute Rebecca, thank you so much for being here with us today. Rebecca: Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm really excited to share. Meagan: Absolutely. Well, I'd love to turn the time over to you. Rebecca: All right, well I guess I'll start with just a little recap of my daughter's birth who is my first C-section. My daughter was born in January of 2021. We got pregnant with her during kind of the height of COVID. That pregnancy went really smoothly other than it was COVID times so of course, my husband couldn't come to any of the appointments or anything like that. I didn't really do much prep with her because I wasn't going to go to a birth class. There weren't a lot of resources available. All I really did was watch some YouTube videos. I kind of knew I wanted to try to have a natural birth, but I didn't prepare that much for it really. I read Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth and stuff, but I didn't do too much preparation. She went to 41 weeks with no complications. I didn't want to be induced, so my OB was like, “We'll go to 41 weeks and then we'll bring you in for an NST and an ultrasound.” So we went in on January 10th for her NST. She passed that with flying colors and I had asked them if they would give me a membrane sweep before they would induce me. They said they could try that, so they were going to come in and give me the membrane sweep, but luckily, one of the doctors there was like, “Well, let's do her ultrasound first just to make sure that everything's fine because that just makes sense before going down there and doing the membrane sweeps.” They did the ultrasound and she was like, “Did you know your baby's breech?” I was like, “No, I did not.” Meagan: News to me. Rebecca: Yeah. Every time the OBs would very quickly, I will say, very quickly palpate me, they'd be like, “Yep. Feels like she's head down. Everything's good.” She was like, “Yeah. She's breech so we're going to go ahead and schedule a C-section for today at 4:00.” It was around 11:00 or something when this happened, so I just immediately started crying because I did not want a C-section. That wasn't what I was planning for at all. She was like, “Well, we don't do the (ECV)s here.” Is that what it's called? (ECV)? Am I saying it right?Meagan: Mhmm, yeah. Rebecca: Yeah. She was like, “We don't do that here. Your amniotic fluid is kind of low, so yeah. This is your option.” Meagan: I wonder why they don't do it there. Rebecca: I don't know. She just said that they don't offer that service. I guess I didn't really know to ask for a second opinion or to see what other– I was just like, “Well, she's telling me that this is my only option,” so we consented to the C-section which was really disappointing. 07:25 Consenting to an unexpected C-section for breech presentationRebecca: My husband had to go home and get a hospital bag ready because we didn't bring it with us or anything. We were like, “Oh, we will have time to go back if they are going to induce me.” I don't know. We just weren't prepared. Anyways, around 4:00, she was born via C-section and it was uncomplicated. It was uncomplicated. She did well. She did have some hip dysplasia because she was frank breech and they think she was probably frank breech for a long time, so her hips and the bones weren't in the socket at all. But other than that, she was completely healthy. But yeah, I remember that night kind of laying in bed with her nursing, and my husband was asleep. I just was quietly sobbing because I felt like everything that I was looking forward to kind of got ripped away from me and I didn't really have a choice in the matter. So I never got to experience one single contraction or any of that with her. I didn't even really have Braxton Hicks with her. It almost felt like there was no closure to the pregnancy. It felt like I should still be pregnant. I definitely, yeah. That was a struggle. That was a struggle for a while afterward kind of trying to find closure of that whole experience because it was just like, “Okay, you're pregnant and now you're not pregnant.” There was no transition. That was her story. 8:53 Fertility FridaysActually, to be honest with you, shortly after her birth, I was kind of like, “Well, if we get pregnant again, I think I'm just going to do a C-section again because I know what to expect. My body's already been through it. You know, I think I'm just going to do a C-section again.” That was kind of what I was thinking. But as I went on throughout my postpartum time, when I got my period back, I noticed throughout the year that I had some weird issues. I was spotting a lot all throughout the month and just different things were happening that I was like, “This doesn't seem quite right.” When I went to the OB about it, they were like, “Oh, it's fine. Your body is probably just getting back into the swing of things.”But it would be like, “Okay, well I've been postpartum for a while now.” This was two years down the line. I think that there's probably something going on that needs investigating. They were kind of like, “No, it's fine. It's fine.” I ended up finding a podcast actually called “Fertility Fridays”. I don't know if you've heard of it, but it's really awesome. Meagan: I haven't. Rebecca: It just teaches women about their bodies. How to track your cycle and what your cycle means, and how to know if you're actually fertile at that time because that's another thing. It took us a year to get pregnant with Emma Jean. I was also afraid, “Well, it took us a long time last time. Maybe something was wrong.” I just got really into body awareness and women owning their bodies and the different choices that we make and that our bodies have all of these natural processes that we don't even really know about all of the time because we are not educated about those things. Meagan: Yeah. Rebecca; So as I educated myself on how my body worked and all of its amazing processes, I also became really interested in physiological birth again. It re-sparked my interest in that and my passion for that. I kind of was like, “Well, my body is set up to do all of these amazing things. Why don't I let it do that? If I do get pregnant again, I do think I want to try to have a VBAC and let my body do what it's supposed to do.” 11:02 Sparked interest in VBAC and getting pregnant againRebecca: That kind of sparked my interest back into the VBAC and the physiological birth. I got pregnant again in, I guess it was September of 2023. It's 2023 now, right? Meagan: Mhmm, yeah. Rebecca: It was 2022 that I got pregnant again with the first time trying because I had used these methods that I had learned to actually know, “Hey, I'm fertile on these days.” Unfortunately, that pregnancy did end in a miscarriage so we miscarried that baby in November around this time of year. That was also crushing, but luckily, we started again in January, and again, right away, the first time we tried, we got pregnant again with my son, Arthur who luckily is here with us today. We got pregnant with him in January of 2023 and that was a pretty scary first trimester because I was definitely worried about miscarriage and things of that nature. But as soon as we got pregnant with him, I started listening to The VBAC Link. I also just started to think about, because you guys talk about it all of the time, finding a provider that was friendly to VBAC, truly friendly. Meagan: Yes. Rebecca: Based on my experience with my OB that I was with, I felt like they were tolerant of VBAC but not necessarily supportive. I figured with her, I went to 41 weeks and I hadn't experienced a single contraction. I think they would have been like, “Well, if you don't go into labor by 39 weeks, it's going to be a repeat Cesarean.” I wanted to look for other options and one of my friends had a wonderful home birth for her second child and she recommended Kelly Jenkins who is Blue Ridge Birth. Meagan: What city are you in? Rebecca: I'm in Winchester, Virginia and she works all throughout the surrounding area so the Northern Virginia area. I called her around 7 weeks. I was like, “I know it's kind of early.” She was like, “No. This is perfect timing because I'm already almost full for October,” which was when I was due. She was just really great about going through all of the fears and concerns we have as VBAC parents going into a home birth. She just made me feel so comfortable. She was just really thoughtful with all of our questions, had a lot of stats and evidence, and just really practical which was what I was looking for. Somebody who really was practical and knew their stuff, but also wasn't necessarily a traditional OB. 13:53 Planning for an HBACRebecca: We ended up signing on with her for our care. She would come to our house at the normal time and an OB would come and spend a whole hour with us and just answer all of our questions which was awesome. Meagan: Wow. Rebecca: I never felt like, “Oh, well you're a VBAC so you are a huge risk.” Everything was just supportive and always gave us all of the evidence for all of the choices we had to make all along the way. I also did yoga throughout this pregnancy. I immediately downloaded the Spinning Babies yoga thing. We watched the Spinning Babies parent class because I was trying to do everything not to have a breech baby. Meagan: Yes. Rebecca: I went to the chiropractor a lot and yeah. I just tried to do everything with my posture and all of these things to make sure this baby was not going to be breech. That was my biggest fear. He never was breech, so that wasn't the problem. We also took a Bradley class. I have mixed feelings about Bradley, especially as a repeat Cesarean parent. Meagan: Yep. Rebecca: I think Bradley is really great, but I will stand on a soapbox just for a minute and say I also think Bradley is pretty dated and somewhat unfair to parents because it really does villainize any kind of drug or anything. Sometimes you have to do things for the safety of your child and I feel like it really villianizes using a lot of medical tools that sometimes you truly need. Meagan: That are necessary. Interesting, yeah. Rebecca: Luckily, we had a great doula who taught our Bradley class. It was Bethany Bagnell. She definitely gave it her own spin and kind of, I feel like, was more open-minded whereas if you read the Bradley book, I feel like he's very stringent and I just feel like some of the things he promotes are a little bit outdated in my opinion. But I really liked her so it was a very informative class. We felt really prepared going into the birth. 18:00 Tachycardia and GBS positiveWe really didn't have any complications until week– I guess it was 34 or 35. Kelly came to our house to do our normal check-up and the baby's heartbeat was really fast. She called it tachy. She was really concerned about that and so we actually did go to the hospital to get an NST. They were pretty rude to us at the hospital. They were kind of like, “Why are you guys here? I don't understand why you are here.” We were like, “Our midwife–”Meagan: Just checking up. Rebecca: You know, the heartbeat was really high. I don't know. They just weren't very kind to us while we were there. But anyway, they ended up not giving us the test that she asked them for. She wanted them to do an ultrasound and an NST and they refused to do the ultrasound. We ended up having to drive up to Laden to get the ultrasound. Everything was fine. His heart rate had settled back down and he looked fine. He was head down so we were happy about that. But that was the only little scare that we had. The other thing that was a little bit of a complication but not a complication, just something that happened is we did test positive for GBS. That was not a big deal. We could get the antibiotics at home so it did not preclude us from having a home birth or anything. We did research a lot about that because we kind of wanted to avoid antibiotics so we did a lot of research to decide what the best decision was for us whether we wanted to do those antibiotics. We decided we were just going to play it by ear based on how soon my water broke and different things. Meagan: Signs. Yeah, all of those things are really good things to take into consideration. Rebecca: Yeah, exactly. My urine was clear for GBS. It was just the swab so that was another good indicator that it might be okay. Then yeah, we were just going to kind of wait and see. I also went on a really stringent diet. I cut out white foods and a lot of the things that are shown to feed GBS then I added a lot of fermented foods and probiotics and stuff like that. Meagan: Awesome.Rebecca: So those were really the only two little bumps in the road. The whole pregnancy, every time, she would palpate which would be a full belly map by the way. When the OB would touch my belly, it would be for 10 seconds. Kelly would actually go in and she would completely map out my belly and be like, “I can feel his neck here and his butt.” Every time she did that, she would be like, “He's in a great position. He's in a perfect position.” We were really hopeful going into things. Of course, he did go over the due date but I kind of expected that because Emma Jean did the same thing. The difference with him was I had a lot of Braxton Hicks and I did actually have a few days where I had some prodromal labor or some episodes that I was like, “Maybe this is labor,” and then it kind of just fizzled out. 21:27 Early laborHe went to 41 weeks and I was starting to get a little nervous that we might have to induce. I really didn't want to do that, so the day that he was 41 weeks, I started feeling contractions every 10 minutes throughout the day. I was at work and I was just kind of breathing through them. They weren't painful, but I was definitely like, “Okay. These are kind of timable, every 10 minutes or so.” Right after work, I got together with some of my work friends and we went for a really nice, hilly, 3-mile walk and sure enough, by the time I got home from that, I was feeling contractions become stronger and closer together. They weren't painful yet, but around the time that I was cooking dinner, I went upstairs and I went to the bathroom and I had blood all over my toilet paper. I was like, “Okay. That's a good sign. Maybe I am in labor. Maybe this is finally it,” because we had a few episodes and we had been trying all of the things to get things going. I told my husband, “Maybe things are really happening.” I texted my midwife and she just told me, “Go to bed early tonight. After you put your daughter down, go to bed and see if you can get some rest because it sounds like this might be it so try to get some rest.” I got my daughter down and tried to lay down probably around– she went to be around 8:00 and I tried to lay down around 8:30. As I was laying in bed, I just couldn't get comfortable. What it felt like to me was gas pains. I had always heard period cramps, but I was feeling very strong gas pains. I told my husband, “Maybe I just have gas.” He was like, “Your gas doesn't come in waves like that. I think you're having contractions.” I was like, “I don't know.” Meagan: It doesn't come in waves. Rebecca: He was like, “You're having contractions. I think you're really having contractions.” So he started to time those and they were coming every 5-7 minutes and it was too uncomfortable for me to stay in bed, so I was like, “Well, let's go ahead and go into the basement.” We have a nice finished basement and we were going to birth down there. That's where we were going to set up the pool. I was like, “You can get the tub set up and I can kind of pace around and we will make sure we won't wake up Emma Jean,” who is my daughter. We came into the basement probably around 10:00 and pretty much as soon as we got into the basement, my contractions became strong enough that I wasn't really feeling like I could talk through them anymore. I was leaning over the ball and breathing. My dog, Maggie, was right beside me. Her face is right next to mine the whole time. She was kind of starting to distract me so I was like, “Let's call my dad to come get the dog.” I was like, “I think this is really happening.” 24:18 Calling the teamRebecca: We called everyone. We called Kelly and we called my mom and my sister who were going to help and attend the birth. Everybody just started rolling in. My dad came and got the dog. My mom and sister came and then Kelly was coming around midnight. By the time Kelly got there, I was definitely like, Rick was already helping me out with counterpressure because my contractions were so strong in my back. Everything was in my back, not in my abdomen at all. I remember in the back of my head, I was like, “Man, I remember that means position.” Meagan: Usually. Rebecca: It's probably not what it should be. Kelly, on the phone, had told me to try to do some of the Miles circuit. I had been working through that a little bit when she showed up. When she showed up, I was on the bed in the head down position with the butt up which is part of the Miles circuit and my water broke. My water broke right around midnight when she arrived and that was really cool for me because I had not gotten to experience that with Emma Jean so that feeling is still something that I think of fondly because I never got any of that with my first daughter. Kelly was like, “Just so you know, your contractions might pick up now because your water is broken.” I was like, “Okay,” and they definitely, definitely did pick up. I feel like I almost didn't even go through that early labor stage. I feel like I kind of went straight into that active, you've got to focus. You've got to breathe. My husband had to be right there with me with the counterpressure. Things were pretty strong. They were tolerable and I was excited, so I wasn't like, “Oh, this is really painful.” I was like, “Oh my gosh. It's happening. This is all happening.” That really, I think, helped with the pain tolerance. I was excited for it. But for most of that part of labor, I was leaning over the bed or the couch, and my sister, I would hold her hands and look at her. My husband would be behind me with the counterpressure. They were getting the tub all going and everything. Then Kelly was like, “Do you want me to check you?” I let her check me, but I told her not to tell me how dilated I was. She checked me and she was like, “Well, he's really, really, really low. I can already feel his head. You're almost completely effaced so that's good.” She didn't tell me how dilated I was, but I was like, “Okay. He's low. I'm effaced. Things are sounding good.” Then the nurse got there and we had to decide if we wanted to start the antibiotics for the GBS. My water had broken so I was kind of like, “Um, I don't know. Let's see.” Then I asked Kelly, “Can you just tell me how dilated I was so I can kind of get a sense of how much time we have?” She said I was only at a 1. I was kind of disappointed by that, but I was like, “I haven't been laboring that long. I know that dilation can come really quickly. It's not the only thing. I'm effaced and he's low,” so I didn't let it get me down, but we did decide to go ahead and run the antibiotics. She hooked me up with those and I was able to still be in the tub and everything. She just covered it with a dressing and a plastic so I could be in the tub. I did get in the tub at that point. I got in the tub probably a little after midnight. I don't know the exact timeframe. The tub was nice, but my husband hates baths so at first, he was like, “I'm not going to get in the tub with you.” I was like, “Okay, well I need your counterpressure so buddy, you're going to have to.” Meagan: Get in.Rebecca: Yeah. I went through a few contractions in the tub without him in there with me and to do the counterpressure, I would press my butt as hard as I could against the bottom of the tub. I was like, “This is not cutting it. You're going to swim with me now. Get in.” He did. He got in. He's kind of a germaphobe which is part of him not liking tubs thing. Meagan: Okay, fair. Rebecca: He got in with me and he did what he needed to do. He was awesome. Basically, I would just press against– I was lined up against his pelvis and I would press my butt into him as hard as I could because every contraction felt like my butt would fly apart if I didn't have somebody holding it together. Meagan: I  can totally relate. I was in labor. I was like, “He's going to come out my butt.” Everyone was like, “No, he's not.” I'm like, “Yes, he is.” Those posterior babies. Rebecca: Yep. It just felt like my butt would fly apart if no one held it together. That was how I was getting through each contraction. I labored in the tub for a while then I had to use the bathroom so they were like, “You should labor on the toilet for a while. People love laboring on the toilet.” So I was like, “All right.” I did not like laboring on the toilet. Meagan: Dilation station. Rebecca: I think I just really needed my husband's body. I don't know why. I needed to be pressed against him in some form or another. He was definitely my rock through that whole thing. He was really good. He read The Birth Partner book and everything. He really was with me 100% of the way which is another reason I'm so thankful that I got to labor this time because the bonding between the two of us going through that together was just something that I could never replace. It was just amazing. 30:10 Laboring through the nightRebecca: We kind of went back and forth between the tub and the bed and doing different things. Everything was going well. I remember asking people what time it was a few times and I was like, “Man, the night's really going by quickly. I feel like I'm laboring really hard, but I'm managing and everything was going well.” We labored all through the night until my daughter woke up at 7:00 in the morning. I wanted to say goodbye to her before she went off to school to daycare. I waited for a contraction to end because I was like, “I don't want her to come down here while I'm acting crazy.” When the contraction ended, I called up to my mom. I was like, “Bring down Emma Jean.” She was so cute. She was like, “You're swimming? You're in the pool? What's happening?” I was like, “Yeah. Your brother is coming. Kelly is here,” and she was really excited that Kelly was here because she got to know her throughout the pregnancy. She was really excited. She gave us a kiss and we told her, “Probably when we pick you up from daycare, your brother will be here,” so it was really cute. Then my mom took her. She took her to breakfast and was going to take her to daycare. Basically, as soon as she left, that was my permission to make as much noise as possible. Meagan: Let it go, yep. Rebecca: Yeah. My contractions were starting to be really, really strong. I was starting to feel pushy and I was having to basically roar through them. I was really fighting it. I was sounding angry. I was kind of roaring through them with sort of gritted teeth which I know is the opposite. You're not supposed to grit your teeth. You're supposed to let your jaw be loose and all of that. I was definitely roaring through those contractions. At that point, Kelly was like, “Look, it seems like you might be getting kind of close. Let's check you again and see what's going on.” The intensity of where I was and what I was doing to get through the contractions, I was really expecting and hoping that she was going to say I was maybe a 9 or a 10. She told me later she was fully expecting to tell me, “You're a 9 or a 10.” But when she checked me, I was only a 4.That was kind of crushing to me, but I was like, “Okay.” Actually, I told her not to tell me at first. I was like, “Don't tell me. Again, don't tell me unless it's time to push.” Meagan: Do not tell me, yeah. Rebecca: She said, “Okay, it's not time to push.” The way she said it, I was like, “Something's weird. Something's wrong.” She was like, “I really need you to relax. We're not going to get back in the tub. I want you to lay in the bed. I want you to be in a side-lying position.” She put me in very specific positions and she was like, “I really need you to rest and relax.” 33:09 First signs of swellingI was kind of like, “Okay, something is weird,” so I just asked her. I was like, “Well, what am I at?” She was like, “You're only at a 4.” I was like, “What? I've been laboring all night intensely.” She was like, “And the baby's head is already trying to come through and his head at the top is starting to swell a little bit,” which they called a caput. She was like, “So you know, he's good. His heart rate's good. Your heart rate's good. I'm not worried, but we do have to keep an eye on that.” So she was like, “I'm going to have you go through some different phases of the Miles circuit to see if we can change his position a little bit, get him off your cervix a little bit,” and things like that. I was not able to get those really strong counterpressure that I needed from Rick in that side-lying position, so I was like, “Let's get some music going. I need some kind of distraction.” I'm a singer. I love to sing and I play music and stuff so we put on our wedding playlist. We were just both lying on the bed. I had him get my comb for me so I could squeeze it and I was just singing through our wedding songs. That was actually a really beautiful part of the labor for me. I was sitting there and singing through our songs. It was kind of a chance to just be quiet and think about things. I just kept saying in my head, “Okay. Dilate. Dilate. You're going to dilate,” and thinking that over and over again. She had me do 30 minutes in each of these different positions. The one with the head down and the butt up was super uncomfortable I think because my neck was hurting. I was so ready for that to be over. After we went through those, she was like, “Okay, let's get you up and get you moving again.” This was probably at least an hour later that she was like, “Let's get you up off the bed and we'll just move around.” Rick and I danced around. Every time a contraction hit, I would just squat down really low and he would squat down and hold me in a chair almost and just hold onto me, then we would sway and dance. Meagan: How cute. Rebecca: Yeah. It was really special. We did that for probably another half hour, then it was time for me to get another round of the IV which I guess I had been getting every 4 hours is what that generally is. Kelly was like, “How about we do another round of the antibiotics and then I'll check you again because it will have been about two hours more or so. We will see if you have progressed and what is going on.” At this point, I was starting to feel a little discouraged. I remember I was sitting on the birth ball and Bethany, the nurse, was giving me the antibiotics. I just remember looking at Rick and I was like, “I'm trying so hard.” I was tearful. I was like, “I am trying so hard. I know that I'm a good mom.” He was like, “You're the best mom.” He was crying and I was crying. He was like, “We're going to get through this and we're going to do what we need to do.” Throughout my whole pregnancy, I had told him, “If I don't get a VBAC, it's going to be so hard for me. It's going to be really crushing for me.” His perspective on it the whole time was always like, “Look. We're going to make the best decisions possible with the information we have.” He was like, “Hopefully, that is you getting your VBAC, but if it's not, it's because we had to move to the next plan because it was the best decision.” He was kind of like, “Look. That's the same thing. We're going to make the best decisions with the information we have. You're a great mom and you're doing a great job. I'm so proud of you.” That was just really special. We were just going through the emotions. After we got the antibiotics, she checked me again. I want to say this was around 10:00 in the morning and she was like, “Becca, you're still a 4.” And she said, “Now, your cervix is swelling.” She said, “Look. You know, you're not in danger at this point. The baby's not in danger. This is not an emergency. But, I can't tell you that if you keep going for a few more hours, you're going to have your baby here. I don't know.” She was like, “Chances are your cervix will continue to swell. You've also been in labor for a long time. You're getting tired.” She just kind of started to talk to us about hospital transfer. She was like, “Maybe if we go to the hospital and you get an epidural and you can relax and maybe we can try some different positions with the epidural and get the baby to come off the cervix some.” We started talking about it and I remember I was going through a contraction on the edge of the bed. I had my arms up on the bed and I was just sobbing. I was like, “I tried so hard. I'm trying so hard.” But I remember as soon as I found out I was still just at a 4 and that my cervix was swelling, it is very mental because my tolerance of the contractions, my pain tolerance, just went down. Meagan: Yeah. Rebecca: All of a sudden, they just felt so much more painful because I was going from being like, “Well, maybe I'll meet my baby any second,” to “Who knows? Who knows what's going to happen?” Meagan: Starting to feel the defeat and doubt. Rebecca: Exactly. We talked about it and we were like, “Well, we could labor here for who knows how long and still need to transfer, or we could go ahead and transfer and try something new.”39:02 Making the decision to transferWe made the decision to transfer. Luckily, I only live 5 minutes away from the hospital, so it wasn't a super long process to do that. We already had our hospital bag packed this time. I was ready with that. I had my hospital bag packed. I had my C-section plan just in case. I had my hospital plan just in case. I at least felt ready to go. Nobody said, “You have to transfer.” It was our decision. We felt like we had the information and we made the decision together. That part of going to the hospital, I remember just wishing I could turn these contractions off now because now, getting in the car, not having the counterpressure, all that, and the funny thing was we walked out onto our patio. I had a contraction on the side of my patio and of course, my neighbors drive by and roll down their windows and are like, “How's it going?” Meagan: “Are you okay? How's it going?” Rebecca: Yeah. I was like, “Oh my gosh.” I love these neighbors. They are amazing, but I was like, “This is not what I want to be doing.” But we made it to the hospital. We got to triage. They strapped me all up. I was lying flat on my back in the most uncomfortable position, but basically, we got through triage and everything. From the time I got to the hospital to the time I got the epidural was probably still another hour and a half of labor at least. That was really tough. We made it there. We got there. We finally got the epidural placed. I would say it was around noon when I finally got the epidural placed. I will tell you. I am all about natural labor and if somebody had told me, “You'll have to labor 10 more hours, but you're going to push your baby out and everything is going to be fine,” I would have found it in myself to do that.Meagan: Yeah? Yeah? Rebecca: I will still say that epidural felt so freaking good. Meagan: I bet. Rebecca: It was just a warm wave of a warm tingling hug. As soon as I got the epidural, all of the pain just kind of melted away. I was like, “This is where we are so I might as well enjoy this for what it is and take this relief.” Yeah. The other thing was that the doctor was, I would say, VBAC tolerant for sure, the doctor on call. He kind of came in and gave us a big spiel about TOLAC and did we know the risks. He was like, “Look, you can try for a VBAC, but if anything goes wrong, we're not going to try to fix it. It's just going to be a C-section because we're going to play it safe.” I was like, “Okay.” I didn't have any problems with him. He was a nice guy and everything, but as soon as he said that, I was like, “I have a feeling this is going to be a C-section. I think it's just going to be a C-section.” The nurse was very great. She put me on the peanut ball. She moved me around some different positions to try to get him to back off my cervix. When they checked me again, I was still a 4 even after that time. I labored with the epidural for about two more hours to the point where I was like, “I'm getting kind of bored and antsy. I sort of want to know what's going to happen. What's the plan at this point?” At about two hours in, the doctor came back in and he checked me again. He said, “I could push you to a 5, but you're still basically a 4.” He said, “Your cervix is very swollen.” He said, “I could give you Benadryl or something like that for the cervix to come down.” He was like, “But I really don't like to do that because at this point, whatever is happening to your cervix is a position thing. It's a mechanical, positional thing.” Also, the epidural slowed my contractions way down. They went from being 3 minutes apart to being 10-12 minutes apart. He was like, “I'd probably have to give you Pitocin to get this going again.” He was like, “I'm not comfortable doing that.” He basically said, “I recommend a C-section and that's basically your option.”Meagan: I was like, “Okay. Can you give us a few minutes to talk it over?” He did. He left the room. My midwife, Kelly, was still there. She stayed on the whole time as my doula. She basically was like, “You know, I do understand what he is saying.” She was like, “I kind of wish he would have told you that earlier and not made you wait for two hours.” She was like, “I agree. It probably is positional and there's probably not a ton we can do.” Oh, another thing he had said was that the baby was having some decels after my contractions. He was like, “You know, that can show us the baby is in a little bit of distress.” She was kind of like, “You know, I understand what he is saying and I'm not sure that I would give you any other advice. I'm not sure I would tell you anything different.” My husband and I talked it over and we were like, “Let's just meet our baby. Let's just meet our baby now.” We had them go over our C-section plan and of course, they weren't willing to do most of the things that we had on that plan. They didn't have the clear drapes. There were just a lot of things that they weren't willing to do, but they did agree that the nurse could take pictures of the surgery for us which was something I didn't have with my daughter.Meagan: Which is nice. Rebecca: Yeah. She took pictures for me and that's pretty much the only thing, I think, that was really different. She took pictures of everything that happened. 44:53 Consenting to a C-sectionRebecca: Around 4:00, we consented to the C-section, and then yeah. They just prepped me. My sister took a picture of me giving a thumbs up getting ready to go. She took a picture of my husband and his whole suit and everything. I was like, “Okay. Let's just do this thing and get our baby now.” I did shed some tears while they were rolling me into the OR and I remember the anesthesiologist well-meaning was kind of like, “What? Are you afraid of a C-section? You've already done this!” I know she was trying to be like, “There's nothing to be scared of,” but I was kind of like, I even said to her, “I'm not scared. That's not why I'm crying.” She was like, “Well, what's wrong?” I was like, “I'm disappointed.”Meagan: This is not what I wanted, yeah. This is not what I planned for. Rebecca: That was a little bit like, “Okay. Come on. Empathize a little bit here. There are lots of reasons why someone could be crying going into this.” Long story short, the C-section all went to plan, but as soon as they did pull him out, they did say he was OP. He was sunny-side up and then they also said, “And he's 9 pounds.” So he was pretty big. I mean, I could have pushed him out for sure but he–Meagan: Yeah, on the bigger side. Rebecca: But he was in sort of a poor position which could be why I had the swelling and everything of the cervix. He came out and he was really, really healthy. Once we got to the recovery room, he nursed right away. He was definitely a hungry little boy right from the beginning so that was awesome. He latched right on and nursed and everything. Yeah, that's pretty much the story. 46:43 Tips for when things don't go as plannedMeagan: You know, it's so interesting how we have these things. We go through all of these things and we end sometimes in the way we didn't want, right? Rebecca: Yeah. Meagan: I've been there too, not nearly as intense as you. You went through a lot. I just had an unsupportive provider from the get-go. I ended up walking down to the OR in general, but we have these experiences, but we still grow from them. Rebecca: Absolutely. Meagan: I mean, I heard little nuggets within your story like bonding with your husband, having faith in your body, working through it, experiencing labor, having support, but are there any other things that you would tell our Women of Strength, our listeners, especially if something doesn't happen exactly as planned? Rebecca: Yeah. There are a couple of different things. The first one was all throughout when I was prepping for labor in particular, especially for dealing with pain, the word that kept coming up and coming up was surrender. I kept thinking, “Surrender to the contraction. Surrender to the sensation.” I always applied that very specifically to labor and labor pains, but I want people to take it a step further and just be like, surrender to your birth however it's going to happen because even if you do everything right and you do all of the steps, there are no guarantees in birth that you are going to have the outcome that you wanted. Even if you have a good outcome, most likely, there's going to be something about it that was unexpected or wasn't perfect so just try to surrender to the whole experience. Yeah, of course, surrender to the contractions. Surrender to the labor, but surrender to the whole experience and the fact that you can't control it. That doesn't mean you are doing anything wrong. Meagan: Yeah. Rebecca: That's the other thing. I hear it a lot in VBAC and I understand why people use this word, but I feel a little bit, I guess I would say use some caution in using it. A lot of people label their VBAC as a redemption or redemptive. You own whatever experience you have. I'm sure it is redemptive, but I guess what I would say is that we don't need to redeem ourselves. There is nothing we did wrong that we have to have redemption for. Can the experience feel redemptive? Absolutely, but I don't want women to then apply that to themselves like, “I need redemption because I failed at something.” You are making the best decision for yourself and your child with the information that you have at that moment. That is what parenting is all about. You can't control anything when you become a parent either. There are always going to be these little decisions you have to make that are unexpected or huge decisions. I think that was the difference between this C-section for me and the last one was the last one, I didn't feel like I had a choice. With this one, every step of the way, I was given choices by my midwife with my husband. We had time to talk through things. We had time to think through things. We made the choices that we felt were the best choices at the moment. So those are the two things I would really say. Surrender to your whole experience because you have no idea what it's going to bring and you don't need redemption because you are already being the best mom that you can possibly be or the best birthing parent that you can possibly be just by being in the moment and making those good decisions with the information that you have. Meagan: I love that so much. I love that so much. Thank you for sharing that. Rebeca: Yeah, absolutely. 50:43 Signs of wonky positioningMeagan: I want to dial into that. The swelling of the cervix, the “stalling” of this labor and I'm putting it in quotes, but it does happen and sometimes despite all of our efforts, it doesn't change and sometimes it does change, but I wanted to talk about the swelling of the cervix and what that really means and what kind of signs we can look out for to know that we've maybe got a baby in a wonky position that could cause a swollen cervix and then what we can do. I mean, just like you were talking about, we were talking about how you just needed your husband to hold your butt together. That is a sign. If we are having all back or butt labor, that could mean a sign that a baby is in an OP or occiput posterior position. That doesn't always cause a swollen cervix or a delay or a stall in labor or anything like that, but it can.Another position is called asynclitic and that's where the head is kind of tipped to the side a little bit and we're not coming down with a nice chin-tucked position into the pelvis. Another one is where the chin is extended or we're in that military position. I've also seen it sometimes in a transverse. It's like a transverse asynclitic. I don't know exactly what that one is where the head is back, the chin is up, and we're in an asynclitic position. We're not looking straight up. Those are positions that may mean our babies are in a less-ideal position. Some of the things are prodromal labor beforehand. You had mentioned that. That means sometimes there is a baby that needs help getting in a different position or a back labor or a butt labor. A coupling pattern where there are two contractions and then there is a big break and then there's a big strong one. Our body is trying to get that baby to rotate. Rebecca: Yep. I did have really long contractions and I did have some double peaks so that makes sense to me.Meagan: Yes. Yes. I call them coupling contractions where that's what they can do. Our body is brilliant. It's trying to rotate these babies and work with us, but sometimes, it's more difficult and sometimes we have to help our body by rotating and moving and working with the pelvis in things like this. 53:31 What to doSome of the things we can do, it sounds really weird and I saw this from a nurse years ago and I was like, “What is she doing?” Then I was like, “Oh my gosh, it worked.” We had an anterior lip where it was swelling on the one side. She said, “I want you to get in the biggest fetal position that you can, the tightest fetal position.” We're holding her even around and imagine a 9-month belly. So it was a little difficult to wrap ourselves around it, but we brought knees all the way to her chest, had her wrap around her knees like this and she laid there. We had to do a lot of counterpressure. Rebecca: Yeah, I can imagine. Meagan: Because that was not a comfortable position. We did five contractions like that and it was hard, but she said, “I want to do it. I want to do it.” We got into it with lots of counterpressure then we did, I don't know what you call it, but we did the throne where you sit up feet to feet, knees out, but after that contraction, she got a check and the lip was gone. That was something that was kind of cool that I had never heard of. I had been a doula for years then I saw this and I was like, “Huh, okay.” I haven't seen anyone do that. Rebecca: Yeah. I read a lot of the books and I didn't see that anywhere. Meagan: Never saw it anywhere, but yeah. This nurse here in Utah was like, “I know just the trick.” She did it and I was like, “Whoa, okay.” Yeah. Some people will say that sometimes ice, there is a circulation issue and sometimes ice can actually stop circulation. Sometimes ice isn't the best and then Arnica or Benadryl. You mentioned Benadryl that they wouldn't give you but they mentioned it. I don't even know how to say the word. It's actually something that I just was talking to a labor and delivery nurse in our community who wants a VBAC. It's Cemicifuga. I don't even know actually, you guys. I don't know how to pronounce it, but those, I've seen arnica, out-of-hospital midwives will use or getting into a tub. Sometimes that can or sometimes an epidural because it can offer relaxation. But then that always and then yeah, just moving, moving, and working with position. But then sometimes, despite all of our efforts, just like cute Rebecca, for whatever reason it doesn't change. That's when we have to surrender on our whole experience and make the choice that is best for us at that point. If that's a repeat Cesarean, that's a repeat Cesarean. Repeat Cesareans can also be healing. Rebecca: Yeah. I would say this was because I definitely felt totally different about the experience afterward. I still mourned it of course and you will, but I felt much more empowered and I got so much out of just going through the labor process that I wouldn't give it up for the world. It still was healing for me for sure. 57:00 Why you shouldn't skip the repeat Cesarean storiesMeagan: I love that. Well, thank you so much for sharing your stories with us, being here with us today, and talking about swollen cervixes. Rebecca: Yeah. I hope people actually click on this. I know when I was preparing for VBAC, I was kind of guilty of, “Oh, a repeat Cesarean, I don't want to listen to this one.” So again, hopefully, people will be open because you never know what your story is, or maybe you'll come back and find it after you've had a repeat Cesarean and feel proud of yourself for everything that you did because I think hearing these stories after you've had a repeat Cesarean could be really helpful. Meagan: Absolutely. Just like they are helpful after having a Cesarean and preparing for a VBAC, after having a repeat Cesarean, these stories can be very healing and validating as well. These stories, I know that there are so many people out there who won't click or will avoid them because they don't want to even think or go there, but a lot of these stories with repeat Cesareans actually offer tools that can help heal if that does happen and ways that you can prepare for if that does happen because it's any birth. I mean obviously, look at all of us. There are hundreds of us and thousands of us who have had an unexpected Cesarean. We weren't planning on that Rebecca: No. Meagan: So preparing before for all outcomes is so powerful. Rebecca: Definitely. Definitely. Have that backup plan because I didn't even have one at all for my first and I was really glad I had it for my second. Meagan: Yes. Oh, well thank you again so much for being here with us today, and congratulations on your baby. Rebecca: Thank you. Thanks for hearing my story. I love what you do and I think it's really, really important, so thank you. Meagan: Thank you. ClosingWould you like to be a guest on the podcast? Tell us about your experience at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Meagan's bio, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-vbac-link/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Amina's story shows the true POWER of a supportive provider. Both of her birth stories had similar interventions (but given in very different ways) with very different provider reactions and a very different outcome!“That was the biggest change for me. It's not like the second birth was just smooth. There were moments when there was blood. There were moments when her heart rate was in distress, but there was that confidence that this woman could do this. This baby is safe and we are doing this together.” - AminaAmina also shares a very special story about visualization during pregnancy and how that can come into play during birth. Her story is a perfect example of listening to the heart, mind, and body in all stages of childbirth. Additional LinksNeeded WebsiteAmina's AppHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull Transcript under Episode Details Meagan: Hello, Women of Strength. We are in mid-January and we have an amazing story for you today. We have our friend, Amina. She and I were talking before we started recording. She was like, “You are changing lives. You are inspiring. You are changing people's pregnancies,” and I just want to talk on that. One, it's absolutely an honor to even hear those words, and is so touching, but two, I'd like to counteract that even and say you guys, you, Women of Strength, you, Amina, you– every single person that has been on this podcast, is who is changing lives and these Women of Strength wanting to VBAC and know their options. I'm just here creating the platform. I'm so grateful to do this. It really, really is so amazing to hear story after story, to hear journeys, to hear how people overcome fear and anxiety and doubt.You know, we're not here to prove people wrong, but I do love a good proving someone wrong story when it's like, “Yeah, you tell me my pelvis is too small. I'm going to show you.” No, but really, it's just such an honor to be here. I've been on the podcast now for a year solo without my partner in crime, Julie, and it's been really hard without her because I just loved being with her, but I'm still so grateful to be with you guys today. Like I said, our friend, Amina, has a VBAC story. I just want to tell you a little bit about her. She is an International Yoga Teacher. If you haven't checked out her page, you definitely need to. She's a mother of two and the founder of Honey Studio and of the Movement and Mindfulness App. We know mindfulness, breathwork, and movement are all things that are going to benefit us through our child-birthing years. She is uncovering the infinite possibilities within your body and mind. I love that. Uncovering the infinite possibilities within your body and mind. Review of the WeekAmina, we're going to get into your story in just one moment, but of course, we have a Review of the Week. I love reading these reviews so as always, if you haven't had a chance to drop us a review, please do so. You can do so on Apple Podcasts. I don't know, Spotify? Maybe. Maybe. I don't know if I've ever seen reviews on Spotify, or Google, or you can just email us. This is from sydhayes and it's from Apple Podcasts back in May of 2023. It says, “A Wealth of Information.” It says, “This podcast has so many helpful tools when it comes to birth and especially when avoiding a Cesarean. I listened to it every chance I had when I was planning for a VBAC and I know it helped me achieve my goals. Hearing other women's stories is so powerful. Thank you for this resource.”Look, she's saying it too. Your stories are so powerful. We love them so much and if you also didn't know, we are sharing them on social media because we do have so many inquiries on the podcast. We'd like to try to share more stories on social media. So if you haven't submitted your story, you can do so and you can also submit for social media. Amina's StoriesMeagan: Okay beautiful lady. I am just smiling. I feel like my cheeks already hurt just looking at you. You are glowing. I can just see the excitement and the beauty coming out of you to share this story. Well, to share your stories. I'd love to turn the time over to you. Amina: Thank you so much for having me. Like I was telling you before we started recording, this is a dream moment of mine. It's a very manifestation kind of moment because when I was listening to all of these empowering stories, to get to share mine is a true, true honor. It's something on my vision board so I'm just so grateful to be here. Meagan: Well, thank you. I love that you are talking about your vision board. I think sometimes when we step back and we close our eyes and we truly visualize our life, our journey, and our goals, we truly can help achieve those by doing so. Amina: Totally. I'm going to track this a little bit later on, but I was sitting with a friend in the very middle of all of this. She was telling me that she visualized her whole birth from the beginning to the end and that she saw it all. When I heard her calmly sitting over coffee saying that, I was like, “Wait a minute.” I went home and did my homework and I wrote down the kind of birth I wanted to have which I ended up having. Yeah, I'm going to walk you through the story. Meagan: Yes. Let's hear the stories. Amina: Yeah, so basically in 2017, I had very, very painful periods and I decided I wanted to have a baby. I went to just check out just to get a little check-up to see that everything was okay before we started trying. We hadn't started trying yet. I go to the OB/GYN at the time. It was in Dubai. I'm like, “I have very painful periods to the point that I'm crying on the floor and sobbing. No painkiller is working.” She says, “Are you on birth control?” I'm like, “No.” She says, “Well, if you're not on birth control, then don't complain.” These were literally her words. Meagan: What?Amina: I was like, “Well, can you check me first just to see what's going on?” because I was very connected with my body. I had been doing yoga for a few years and I knew something was off. I had this intuition. Something in my body was telling me, “Something is off.” So she's like, “Sure. Let's check.” She checks and finds a big polyp in my uterus that would prevent implantation from happening. She's like, “I'm sorry. You were right. This has to be removed before you start trying to make any babies.” So that was a moment for me where I was like, “This is weird.” We really need to fight for ourselves to be heard. So anyway, we did the polyp removal, and then they said, “Wait three months and then start trying to have a baby.” We waited the three months. It was September 2017. We tried and I got pregnant. Meagan: Yay. Amina: It was just like that. It was amazing. Pregnancy– I felt good. I wasn't nauseous. I was pregnant with a boy. We did all of the testing and throughout the pregnancy, I started to find my way through Ina May Gaskin's book. I started to read about it and just learned a little bit more about the system of birthing in the U.S. at the time. I decided I wanted to have a midwife instead of a doctor so I switched out. Again, uneventful. I wanted the birth at a birthing center and I felt like I was super prepared. We did a HypnoBirthing course and on the due date, on the due date exactly, I started to have a little bit of bleeding, not even a period kind of blood but just a little brownish discharge. My mom was like, “Oh, you are not supposed to be bleeding. Why do you have blood?” I'm like, “I don't know,” but I was super excited. I'm like, “We're doing this. I'm having the baby.” That was at 4:00 AM. I went to sleep. I woke up soaking in a lot of water. The water had broken. We're like, “Okay, let's go to the hospital.” The water was a bit tinted with some blood. I'm still very calm. It's fine. My body knows what it's doing. I had all of the mantras and I showed up to the hospital and everybody was panicking at the hospital. I don't know why, but they were panicking. They're like, “You're bleeding. You shouldn't be bleeding during birth. You have to be monitored.” All of the things that I was prepared for which is to deny interventions, to say, “I don't want to be checked,” I just remember it being a very intrusive experience where I was constantly being bombarded by nurses and by faces I didn't know. I was definitely not relaxed and then my doctor was like, “Look, I'm going to give you a few hours to labor on your own because I know what you want.” It was basically a doctor with a group of midwives. A doctor was there and one of the midwives was also there. The doctor said, “I'm going to let you labor for a little longer. I'll give you the afternoon to labor and we'll see what  happens.” I go into the room and I start to have very intense contractions that were not stopping. It was just like one long contraction. I was just breathing through it and doing all of the coping tools that I was prepared for. My husband is doing the hip squeezes. We're in that labor land, but then someone keeps coming in and I have to constantly argue for myself because you know how they monitor your belly with the contractions, something will move and then they won't get the baby's heart rate and the panic and they run in all of the time. I wasn't really relaxed I would say. Then the doctor comes in. She's like, “Okay, look. We've been monitoring your contractions from the office. You should be in the transition phase at this point, but your contractions are very intense and they are not stopping. I'm suggesting to give you an epidural just to help relax you and we see what happens.” At that moment, I was in so much pain that I was like, “I want a way out. Give it to me. Give it to me.” Meagan: Yeah. Amina: They gave me the epidural and within minutes or so, everything started turning black. I heard the monitors starting to beep and 30 doctors were in the room. Everyone was panicking and my midwife's hand was inside of me moving the baby or doing something and saying, “We're losing him.” I just remember that moment. I was just fighting, fighting, fighting the whole time. In that moment, I was just like, “Surrender. I just want to see my baby. I want to be okay.” My mom was there with me by my side, her and my husband. My mom is this source of strength for me who is always very strong. She didn't panic, but her face was just stricken with fear. I was like, “This is not good. I need to let go of my dream of birthing this way. I can't do it. I give up.” In that moment, my doctor, after they get the baby's heart okay, was like, “Look, I don't know what's going on, but I know that neither you or your baby can handle any more of this labor. We have to get the baby out.” I said, “Okay, go ahead.” I was very okay with it like, “Just do it.” So very quickly, I was in the emergency room or the C-section room. Meagan: The OR. Amina: The OR. I was just in total panic. I was shaking from the drugs and it was just so much. I remember looking into my husband's eyes. He was like, “Just breathe with me.” It was like yoga. I was breathing in, breathing out. This moment was all that mattered. I was just going to stay present.We had the C-section. I had my baby and all of this. He was placed on me in the recovery room and honestly, from then on, it was a very smooth postpartum journey. I healed very well from my C-section. It led me to learning a lot about the core and how to heal and just all of these really amazing things that I didn't know about before. It strengthened my knowledge of its nature. That journey was great and then I think it took me a little while of, “I don't think I want to have any other babies. This was the worst experience of my life.” I kind of just shoved it away. I just didn't think about it. Then he was 3.5 years old. I was like, “Okay. I am starting to miss the baby phase and I would love for him to have a sibling, but I really don't want to go through another birth.” That was just the trauma. But I think the love for him and bringing him a sibling overcame that fear. I was like, “Let's just do it.” So 3.5 years later, we tried to get pregnant and I was expecting it to be just like that just like the first time, but it didn't happen. It was, I think about 6 months that we were trying and when we got into the 7th month, I was like, “Okay. Something's up. Maybe I have another polyp. Maybe I have a fibroid.” I started going from doctor to doctor to check why I was not getting pregnant. It turns out that they were like, “Everything is great. Everything looks perfect. There's no reason why you're not getting pregnant.” Then, in the end, I decided to go the IVF route. I was like, “Let's just do this. Let's save some eggs.” I was 34. I said, “Let's save some eggs in case I want to have future pregnancies and also get genetic tests taken and all of this stuff.” We started doing IVF in July of 2021, I believe, 2022. Yeah. We started doing the first round. We got the eggs out and all of this. It was an easy, breezy IVF cycle I would say. The embryo transfer was in September which was the same time I got pregnant exactly four years apart, almost the same due date so it was crazy. I did the embryo transfer. She stuck and I felt very nauseous for the first few months. I was just super nauseous and I looked up the doctor next to me that was just a great surgeon. I was like, “I'm going to do another C-section. I don't want any surprises. I just want the easiest, safest option.” I go and see him and he's like, “Yeah, you probably had a placental abruption the first time.” Meagan: I was going to ask you if they ever gave you an answer and if it was placenta-related. That's what it sounded like to me. Amina: Yeah, they said that they suspected that the placenta was shaped funny because of my polyp surgery being so close. They said it was a bilobed placenta but they didn't say anything about it was an abruption. They didn't mention those words. They were scared of it at the birth and when I would say, “Is my baby okay?” they were like, “Yes.” So okay, they let me labor until it went to a C-section because of the epidural. It was more that it was the epidural that caused a bad reaction to me and the baby. Meagan: Yeah, blood pressure drops which is going black. Amina: Yeah, going black, exactly. I had all of this fear from all of this and I was like, “I want something very low-risk and safe with a great surgeon, but I want to meet with a doctor.” He was like, “How do you want to deliver this baby?” I said, “I would love to have a repeat C-section.” Then I started to get curious. I was like, “But what if I go into labor?” He said, “Well if you go into natural, spontaneous labor on your own, we can do a trial of labor.”I was like, “Okay. That sounds fair.” Throughout, I think, once I was in the second trimester, I started to feel really good. I started to feel very empowered and strong. I was working out and I was just loving the pregnancy. It wasn't like I felt an alien with the first pregnancy. The second time around, I was savoring it a lot more. I was a lot more in tune and a lot more connected. I was pregnant with a baby girl. Yeah. I was just in this confident feeling. I noticed that whenever I thought of the birth, I started to feel fear. I was like, “I'm going to do a repeat C-section because it's too scary otherwise.” Then I asked myself this question. “Are you avoiding trying for a vaginal birth because you are scared or because it feels like the right thing to do?” It was 100% because I was scared. There was nothing beyond that. There was pure fear. So I started to talk to my therapist. I started to tell her, “I want to dive deeper into my first birth. Why am I feeling this way?” We started to really dive deep and realize that it was a mystery. We're never going to fully know why it happened. I'm not going to get the answer that I need of the reason for my Cesarean. It was just something. This was how he was meant to be born and there was really nothing in my hands. I started to listen to The VBAC Link as soon as I felt that spark of curiosity. I would get on my treadmill and I would walk for, I think, an hour every single day on an incline listening to the stories of all of these women. I started to feel like, “Wait. Maybe this is a possibility. Why am I so scared? Let me see what's on the other side of this fear.” So I decided to have a real conversation with my doctor. He was always throwing around the words “39 weeks”. “When you're at 39 weeks, if you go into labor–” I was like, “Wait a second. The first time, I went into labor at 40 weeks. Why do I have to get to a very small percentage that I go early?” I started to ask him. I was like, “You know what? I would really love to avoid another surgery if possible.” His response was, “First of all, don't glamorize vaginal birth because, with vaginal birth, you're going to most likely tear because you've never had a baby come out of there before. You're not going to be able to hold your pee. You will be in pain sitting down. It's not something glamorous. It's not likely to be the better option,” was what he was telling me. I was skeptical. All the stats that I read was that a repeat C-section is the more risky option. It's not the less and it's a major surgery. And then I said, “The reason that I had a Cesarean the first time was a bad reaction to the epidural most likely.” He said, “No, it was placental abruption and you can rupture your placenta again.” Again, I researched this and I was like, “Wait, just because even if you say it was–” because we don't know it was, “the chances of getting that– it's a whole new placenta, a whole new baby, and a whole new story, so the chances of this repeating again is quite low.” He kind of scared me with these stats that I wasn't convinced with because they are very low. Then I said, “Also, I would love to avoid the epidural because it was the reason everything literally turned black in the birth.” He said, “Well, no. That's not possible because I need access in case I need to get the baby out in 10 seconds.” I realized at that moment that I was just an emergency to this doctor. I am just this emergency case. I'm not seen as a human. I'm not seen as a mother wanting to birth the way that I'm designed to and I'm seen as this scare and this risk. Then he boasted, “I'm very fast. I'm known to be very fast. I don't waste time.” Also, I asked for a gentle C which is like, “Okay, let's get the baby out. Give me a few seconds for the pulsation of the cord.” He was like, “Well, absolutely not. You are cut open. This happens in seconds. I'm very fast.” I felt like I was a medical emergency and also, I felt like, I didn't want someone so fast by my side when I was doing the most intense, intimate thing of my life. I don't want to have this rushed energy by me so I knew I had to get out of there. That was my screaming intuition, “Get out of this practice. Search for a supportive OB/GYN.” Your podcast, The VBAC Link, helped me realize so much with realizing how much that actually can change the outcome. Meagan: Absolutely. Amina: I felt like I was empowered to know that no matter what happens, even if I wasn't with a supportive doctor, I would still try to get my way, but I was like, “Let me just search through my options.” I remember I had seen one of the doctors when I was trying to figure out what was going on with why I wasn't getting pregnant. I had met this beautiful doctor. She was a radiating source of warm, calm energy. I was like, “Why didn't I go to her?” She's more holistic and loves HypnoBirthing and all of this stuff, but she is an excellent surgeon which is why I went to see her. I was standing– I remember this moment. While I was standing in a museum, I was like, “I need to do this.” It was a “yes” in my body. I called them and right away, they were like, “We can take you.” I met with her and as soon as I met her, she was like, “We are going to have this VBAC.” It wasn't “you”. It was “we”. Meagan: As a team. Amina: It was this feeling of a team. She works with a bunch of other female doctors in the same clinic. She was like, “Look, I can't guarantee that I'm going to be there at your birth, but I want you to know that every single person here will advocate for you here in just the same way.” I felt very in touch with her and I would always book my follow-ups with her. I developed this bond with her. But when I would go for my check-ups with her, my body felt relaxed. I wasn't feeling that something was intrusive which was also something. I had faith, I would say. At about 38 weeks, we started to check for dilation. One time, I got this email from her clinic team saying that we were scheduling a C-section for 39 weeks just by mistake. I was like, “I would love to not see that or not have that.” She was like, “I'm so sorry. That was an internal error. There is no C-section being scheduled.” I love that she was just behind me every step of the way. We started to check for the dilation and it was 0. I was like, “Okay. This doesn't mean anything. It's still gonna happen.” Then I was listening to one of the episodes that was talking about the Foley catheter and the low-dose Pitocin. I was very intrigued because I was like, “Okay.” They are starting to say that the baby was getting to 3 kilos or 7 pounds-ish. In the hospital when they would monitor me, they would start to raise the fear of, “Oh, the baby is getting big,” and starting to hint at that. I want to have at least a plan B that's not a C-section but maybe some light interventions. I read about the catheter and I mentioned it to my doctor. She was like, “Yeah. If the time comes and we need to use it, I'm totally fine with it.” She was very humble. She would research things that I mentioned to her that maybe she hadn't tried before and she would be like, “Oh yeah, let me do some research on this,” not as if she knew everything. Meagan: I love that. Amina: She also refers to a HypnoBirthing doula that me and her work with. That's how I knew her from the HypnoBirthing doula. She is so open to maybe we don't have all of the answers already right away. We can go explore our options. I was being monitored consistently at the hospital and they were saying because of the history of the suspected placental abruption. They were always saying, “Yeah. Baby seems very happy. Baby seems very happy.” That made me feel good. Then I heard also about the membrane sweeps so I asked her, “Can we do a membrane sweep at 39 weeks?” She said, “Yes. Let's do a membrane sweep at 38-something.” I went in and I wasn't dilated at all, but she was having a hard time even doing the sweep so she said, “Let's try after you are 39 weeks. Maybe you will be a little more dilated and there is another doctor who has longer fingers who is very good with sweeps.” She said, “I want you to try her next time.” So 39 weeks comes and then I do the sweep. I feel some cramping, but nothing really happens. That day, I go to the hospital and they are monitoring and they say, “The baby is getting big. The baby is over 7 pounds and the more you stay pregnant, the less likely you are to be able to birth vaginally.” I said to my doctor, “Okay, can we book an induction with a Foley catheter and the low-dose Pitocin?” She said, “Let's do it.” I go to the hospital at 6:00 AM with my birthing bag prepared. It ws going to happen. I had read about how painful it is to insert the catheter, but she's just incredible. I was relaxed. Everything was in and it started to do its job. It started to mechanically dilate me because I was at a 0. I was in the room with my husband and my sister just joking and laughing and watching episodes and just not someone in labor. It had nothing to do with labor. Then they would come in. They would check and be like, “Yeah, okay.” I think after 8 hours, they took it out. I was at the 3.5-centimeter dilation from the Foley but she said, “It might close up a little bit.” She said, “Yeah. Let's just see.” So they started the low-dose Pitocin and I remember sitting there on the ball trying to ease into contractions even though they were very mild. I was like, “Wow. I have really good pain tolerance the second pregnancy. I'm not feeling those contractions,” because they weren't real contractions. I'm like, “Oh, wow.” Then I started to feel my baby moving up into my ribs. She was bumping into my ribs. They go and check and they're like, “Yeah, she's at a 0 station. She's not moving down. We have to up the Pitocin a little bit higher.” That day, I had seen an osteopath who had checked me. I was like, “Yeah, I'm going for my induction tomorrow.” She was like, “Why are you going to an induction?” I said, “Because the baby is too big and I need to get the baby out.” She was like, “Your baby is not ready. You shouldn't have the induction.” She said, “Your baby is not ready.” I was like, “Well too bad. I'm not going.” I remembered her words while I was sitting on the ball and feeling the baby move up into my ribs. I was having pain in my ribs. They checked at 6:00 AM. It had been from 6:00 to 6:00, 24 hours in the hospital. My doctor came in. She was like, “Okay, I have the options. You have two options. I either break your water. This has its own risks or you go home. Now you have a more favorable cervix, and let's let labor start on its own.” I thought about it. I was like, “No. I don't want that.” My body was telling me just to go home. So this was 39 weeks and 3 days. My due date was on Saturday and I had all of these things planned that the baby was coming out. My son's birthday, my son's graduation from pre-K. I show up very pregnant and everybody is asking, “Oh, where is the baby?” That was so annoying. I wanted to switch off my phone because everybody knew my due date and was texting, “Hey, where is the baby? Did you have the baby?” I'm just feeling all of this pressure. She was cozy. She was just there happy and not moving down at all. So I started to go to acupuncture just to soothe my anxiety. In the acupuncture, I was just drifting off and then I started to see this round, black, sticky thing. I was like, “What is this? Why does this keep coming to my head? What is this round, black, sticky thing?” Then I realized, it was a head. It's a baby's head. It's black and sticky and has blood on it. I was like, “Why do I keep seeing this? But this is amazing.” Then I realized it was my baby's head. I was like, “It's a good thing I keep seeing a head when I'm doing acupuncture even though I'm not trying to see it.” Two days later, I went back to acupuncture again. I'm drifting off to that space where you're not asleep. You're not awake. You're just in this crazy, floating space. I start to see that I'm feeling my baby's head with my hands and I'm feeling her come out and she's on my chest and I'm sobbing, “We did it. We did it. We did it.” I was like, “Okay, this is beautiful, but I don't know what to do with this. It was just a very cool vision.” Meagan: Hold onto it. Amina: Yeah, hold onto it. The due date comes. The baby is not here. The baby is cozy. We go do another sweep a few days later. I started to feel some cramping and the dilation had even moved backward like she had warned me. I was about 2 centimeters. I was like, “Oh, this baby is never coming out. This is so stressful.” But I was trying to stay positive. The wait was so anxiety-producing because I was like, “What's going to happen? What if I wait all of this time and I end up still having a C-section?” My mind was all over the place. But then I went to see my osteopath four days post-due date. I saw my osteopath. She checks me and she works on all of this deep tissue stuff. She's like, “Yeah. Your baby is ready now.” I was like, “Really?” She's like, “Yeah. All of the muscles that are normally hard and tight are very soft and loose now. Your baby is ready.” That's all she said. Then my mom gets seen by her as well for a session after. She tells my mom, “Make sure you get some rest tonight. Tonight's going to be a big night.” She knew.” Meagan: Oh my. That just gave me the chills. Oh my gosh. Amina: I know. It was crazy. I had no idea. That day, I felt pretty good. I had done the sweep. I had seen my pelvic floor therapist and she was like, “Yeah. Everything looks good. There is no tension.” She was allowed to do internal work at that point. She was like, “Everything looks good.” I was like, “Do you think my pelvis is too small?” She was like, “No. I think everything looks great and you will birth this baby vaginally.” She gave me this boost. It was like someone had seen me on the inside and was like, “You're good to go.” Meagan: You're good. Amina: Yes, you're good. So that day, I went for a walk in the rain with my husband. I came back and I was just suddenly, my mind was somewhere else. I was very distracted. It was like this wave and this film of dreaminess was on top and I wasn't stressed about the time. I wasn't stressed about when she was coming. I just felt very relaxed. My body was super relaxed. After that osteopath, I sat on the ball. I was bouncing and I started to feel a little something. It quickly started to intensify. I couldn't put my son to sleep as I normally do. I was holding his hand while I was on the ball rocking, listening to a playlist that I made that was calming labor music that I liked. While I'm putting him to sleep, I'm holding his hand and I'm just in that world. By the time he fell asleep, it was 9-something and they were ramping up. So my husband was like, “Look. If baby is coming tonight, we should get some sleep.” Meagan: Sleep. Amina: Yeah, right. Yeah right, get some sleep. I got into bed and I tried to start sleeping and it's very intense. I can't sleep. Then I'm like, “Oh. That's the contractions that I forgot about 5 years ago. That's it.” I started to get on all fours and I tried to lay with the ball between my legs in the bed and it ramped up a lot that by midnight, my husband called the hospital, the doctor, and said, “She's having 5-minute contractions. They're getting intense.” The doctor was like, “Okay. Just monitor her for a bit, but if you want, she can come in now and we can get her checked in. She can labor in the room. Let's see.” Oh, the next morning, I had an induction plan already. They had planned it. So she was like, “We'll get her in the room early and she can just labor there and be checked.” I didn't want to go. I said no. I waited for a few hours and I think by 2:00, I was like, “We need to go to the hospital now. Now. This baby is coming now.” I just felt that it was not going to be a long time. We go and this time, the different thing I did from my Cesarean is I had my headphones in and I was not talking to anybody. I was just listening to the song in that dreamy state. I was kind of riding the wave of dreaminess. I was just in that world and listening to the music. My husband was giving them my insurance info, my name, and all of this logistical stuff that didn't make sense at the time with all of the bright lights. Then I'm having contractions. I'm breathing through them. Then comes a resident who is like, “I need to check you. I need to see if your baby is still head-down.” I said, “My baby is head-down. I know that she is. No one is going to check me except my doctor.” He got very angry and he was like, “You're risking your life and the baby's life.” I said, “I know my body. I know my baby. I know that she's head down. I was just at the hospital this morning. If she flipped, I would know.” I was just confident. I was like, “And my doctor can check if she wants, but you're not doing any exams. Thanks, but no.” My husband is the nicest guy. For him to have this kind of confrontation makes him super on edge. Meagan: Uncomfortable?Amina: Yeah. He's like, “He's just doing his job.” I prepped him before. “Look. No means no. No one is going to check me. I'm not being nice to anybody that's in my body or my vagina. No one is looking inside unless I'm comfortable.” We had done also a HypnoBirthing crash course just to remember as a refresher course. We had decided that also, no one can offer me the epidural. If I want it, I'll ask for it, but hopefully, I'm not going to ask for it. At this point, the contractions are super intense. I have to sign this thing that says I'm okay with me and my baby dying. I'm in my world. I'm like, “Sure. Here you go.” Then we get to the room and the contractions get so much that I start to feel paralyzed. I start to feel like first of all, my intention with this birth is to feel good. I want to have a good experience and if I don't get the epidural or if I don't stop this pain, I'm not going to feel good. I tell my husband who is very well-intentioned, I'm like, “Look. I need the epidural now.” He's like, “Amina. We talked about this. We said you're going to ask for this and I'm going to tell you that you can do this.” I'm like, “I don't care what we spoke about. I want the epidural now.” He's like, “You can do this. You said that this would happen, but trust me. You're almost there.” Meagan: That's so cute. Amina: He's really doing all of the stuff that he was told to do, then he gets kind of upset. He's like, “Let me go talk to your doctor.” He goes outside and calls her on the phone. She comes and checks me. I'm still at a 2 so she was like, “Okay. It's going to be a long night.” She explains to him, “Maybe this will help her feel better.” It's going to be a very long night. Let her have it. Let her relax. She'll get some sleep. We're going to be very careful because of the bad reaction last time. We're going to give you a lot of IV fluids. We're going to give you a very tiny dose. We're going to monitor you so well that hopefully, we'll avoid the blood pressure drop thing.”It was very hard to get the epidural in because I was contracting so intensely. It was a lot. They managed to get it in and they were like, “Okay. This is the button. You're going to press it if you want more.” I was terrified. I'm watching the heart rate monitor and the blood pressure watching it and waiting for the emergency. They were like, “You're fine. Relax. Everything is good. Now you can rest.” They put such a tiny amount that I could probably move around if I wanted to. I have the ball in between my legs. I was lying on my side and I could still feel the contractions, but they were just a little bit more manageable which was very nice. This was around, I think I got the epidural around 3:00ish-4:00ish. Someone came to check and I was at a 4. I was like, “Ugh.” They were like, “It's still going to be a long time. Don't worry.” When I was a 4, a woman came in, a resident, and she was like, “You're at a 4. Would you like me to break your water?” At that point, I was in this very surrendery kind of state. I was like, “Sure. Do it.” So she did. She broke my water. As soon as I look, there's red all over the sheets. I was like, “It's blood!” She's like, “Yeah. Birth has blood. There's always going to be blood in birth.” I was just like, “But there's no one panicking around me that I'm bleeding and it's a lot more blood than the first birth?” They were like, “Baby is okay. You're okay. Blood is normal. You're fine. Just relax.” Meagan: Wow. Amina: It was the reverse situation where instead of me being calm and everyone is panicking, it was the other way around where I'm like, “Guys, look. You should panic now!” They're like, “You're okay. Everything is good.”That was just such a moment for me where I was like, “Okay. Blood is normal. I have to not freak out when I see blood.” My doctor had warned me. She was like, “I know you're going to panic when you see blood, but trust me. Bleeding in birth can happen and it's okay. It doesn't mean that something is wrong.” That was a very powerful moment for me. She broke the water and then this was at 6:00 AM. At 6:15, I suddenly felt something shift. I'm like, “I feel a lot of pressure.” They had told me it was going to be a few hours. I tell the nurse, “I feel like I have a lot of pressure like I need to poop suddenly.” She's like, “Poop?” She runs. She gets the doctor and they check. They were like, “You're 8 centimeters. Baby's head is right there. You're almost ready to push.” I start crying. When I heard the 8, I was like, “This has never happened.” That was the first moment that I was like, “This might really happen.” They had this dilation poster on the wall in front of you where you can visualize and see 1 centimeter, 2 centimeters all the way to 10. I would constantly look at it and I was like, “10. It's possible. It's going to happen.” That really also helped me, I think.” So when they said 8 and the baby's head was right there, I had shivers. I was just so happy and so elated. Then they were like, “But it's still a few hours. It's not going to be right away. You're 8. It could take a while until you are ready to push.” 15 minutes later, I was 10 and I was ready to push. Meagan: Oh my goodness. Amina: From 4 centimeters to pushing was in 15-minute chunks. It was very fast, crazy fast. So then at that point, the doctor changed shifts and it was a new doctor, the one with the long fingers who had given me the sweep. She comes in and she's like, “We're having this VBAC. Let's go.” The energy of the room was where everyone was excited for you and cheering for you. It was such a beautiful, beautiful experience. I was like, “I don't care. I'm just so happy to be here.” The epidural stopped working on one side, so I was feeling everything on the right side of my pubic bone, all of this pressure. They were like, “Yeah. It's normal. Sometimes it happens. You're only numb on one side, but the baby is stuck behind the pubic bone, so we need to do some pushes to get her past that.” The pushes, for me, were the hardest part because I felt like I couldn't do the pushing that I prepared for with my pelvic floor therapist or the stuff that I read. It was all just like, “You're going to inhale and then you're going to hold your breath and push, and then you're going to exhale.” It's so counterintuitive to what I was taught to do that I was like, “I don't know if this is doing anything. I don't feel anything. I don't know. Am I doing it?” They're like, “Yes, but you have to keep going.” Her heart rate was kind of in distress in between the contractions and they were like, “You have to push.” She's like, “I'm not telling you that this is an emergency, but I'm telling you that we can't stay here for long, so you have to push.” My husband was like, “Come on, Amina. Push!” I'm like, “Okay. I'm trying,” but I can't connect to it. Meagan: “I'm trying!” Amina: So then I guess I keep purple pushing so much that her heart is going crazy. My heart is going crazy. There is all of this chaos and they were like, “Just forget about all of the monitors. Just push. Push the baby out of your vagina. You can do this.” She moves past my pubic bone and there is a sigh of relief. They start getting out their instruments. There was a guy, a male resident, in the room who started to say, “Can we get out the instruments?” or something like that like the suction. I can't remember what it was called. Meagan: The vacuum? Amina: The vacuum, yes. He started to say, “Can we get out the vacuum?” Meagan: It goes right on their head like that? Amina: Yeah, I didn't even see. He just mentions, “Can I get out–?” The doctor says, “I don't want to hear that word inside of this room.” I was just amazed. Meagan: YES.Amina: Then basically, they were like, “Okay. She moved past your pubic bone. Now is the time to really push.” I'm really struggling with the pushes. I have no idea what I'm doing. I'm getting so tired. I'm about to cry. Then I had this moment of, “Let me just reach down and feel my baby.” I put my hand down. I feel my baby. The doctor is not even cueing me to push at this point, and suddenly, I feel her head. My body's super strength takes over and pushes the baby out without cueing, without noise, and without anything. Just by feeling her head, I don't know what happened. It was like this super strength of all of the women in the world. I pushed her out of me and then out came her shoulders and then she was placed on my chest. I was just sobbing with joy. It was the same moment as my acupuncture. It was like, “We did it. We did it.” I'm just sobbing. Meagan: I was going to say that. It sounds exactly like your visualization. Amina: It was. Meagan: You saw this head. You saw this head and then boom. Out on your chest. Amina: There was another moment while I was pushing. The doctor was like, “I see her head. She has black hair just like her daddy.” I was like, “That's the head I saw the first time.” Meagan: Oh my gosh. Amina: My son was born with lighter hair, so I'm like, “This is that moment, the black, sticky head.” I'm like, “This means it's happening.” She was placed on my chest. My husband cut the cord and it was just the most healing, incredible moment of my life because I felt like in that moment, I was invincible. If I can do this, you just feel like you are so strong, but also so humbled by the experience. Yeah. It was the most beautiful moment of my life. Meagan: You grew right there, right? I think there are so many things to say about birth. We grow through all of these experiences and you grew through your C-section and you have grown through your healing. Look how long this journey has been and you have grown in every single aspect of becoming pregnant, learning how to follow your body from the very beginning, something is not right, and then they find out, “Oh, she has this polyp.” You have grown into this person and you are just amazing. This story is so beautiful and I love how your provider was there to back you up and be there for you and be like, “Nope. Don't even say that. Don't even talk about that.” Amina: “Don't say that word here.” Meagan: “We are here.” Something else that I love is that you recognized. Breaking water is something, especially earlier in labor that we kind of stay away from a little bit, and in your mind and your body, you were like, “I feel good about this. I feel like I'm going to surrender to this. I feel this is right,” and then you did it. Then 15 minutes– and then you have a baby. Amina: So fast, exactly. It's not this black-and-white intervention or no intervention. That's what I love about The VBAC Link because I was learning that, “Oh, the Foley catheter balloon can be a great way to have a VBAC.” There are so many different interventions that can actually help you and I think for me, even trusting the epidural again was a big, big, big lesson. Meagan: Huge. Amina: I was like, “This is the moment where I lost all control in my first birth.” Control is an illusion, but that was the moment where I was like, “Just cut me open. I give up.” Meagan: Well, everything went in a different direction from that moment of your blood pressure dropping and maybe there were placenta issues, maybe not. You know, when you were talking about how this may not be something you'll ever know, you may not ever know the exact reason why you were bleeding in that first pregnancy and things like that, it reminded me of our radical acceptance episodes and me too. There are things about my birth I will never know. It doesn't take the wonder route, but it doesn't consume me anymore. Amina: You are accepting.Meagan: Yeah, you accepted that it was that birth. That was that experience. You've grown from that. You've learned from that. You are going on to this next birth with what you know and accepting this next birth as this new birth, right? I think that is so important because so many times in life in general, but birth specifically, especially if we have maybe had a more traumatic experience or a Cesarean or something that really seems to relate just like you were saying. I got this epidural and then my control was lost. I did this and then this happened. I think we can tend to relate and then fear those things to happen ever again. Yeah, I mean, when my water broke for the third time, I mean they say so few people– 10% of people have their water break before labor begins and then it happened again, I was immediately triggered even though my mind knew that my body just needed time. I triggered back and I started having those doubts creep in and all of these things. We have to be able to dig really, really deep and be strong enough to say, “Okay. This is the situation. This is how I feel about it,” and be willing to make different choices. Going in for an induction again, you were scheduled to go in again. I also love that about your doctor that they were like, “Hey, here are your options. We can push this forward and see what happens or this isn't happening right now. We can send you home.” So powerful. So powerful. Amina: This was unheard of. This was unheard of. Meagan: It's not very heard of, yeah. Amina: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, when I told the nurse that day, “My doctor said I can go home now,” she looked at me and started laughing. She was like, “No, she didn't.” I'm like, “Go ask her. I'm going home.” She came back and she was like, “I guess you're going home.” She was baffled. This person was here to have a baby, but they're going home without a baby because that was how much she honors what her patients want, that they are women, that they are about to have a very important experience in their lives, and that they should be a proactive part of it. That was the part that was so important. To be with a provider that doesn't inherently believe that vaginal birth is always safer than a C-section, I think that was a trigger moment for me. He believed that they were the same or that one was better than the other. Meagan: Well, he was putting a lot of things like, “You're going to pee yourself,” and this. Let's be real here. Those are real risks of a vaginal birth. We can have serious urinary incontinence. We can have serious tearing that needs reconstruction. Those are real. What he was saying is real. He was using them as a fear tactic to steer you away and that's where it's wrong. That's where, okay. I'm sorry. I can't say it's wrong. That's where I believe it's wrong. We should be educating very well on both sides and also talking about the risks of a Cesarean and the risks of having our bladder cut, our baby cut, and having blood issues like having to have transfusions. Also, uterine rupture is not eliminated with a scheduled C-section. It's just not, but we don't talk about those things, right? Amina: We don't talk about it, yeah. Meagan: It's just pushed so heavily. You could tell that he was pretty cool, “Oh, you could TOLAC,” until you were like, “Actually, I want to do that.” He was like, “Wait a minute. No, you don't.” That's where we are lacking here in the world of medicine and that's, I think, a lot of the times why some people don't trust providers and don't trust the hospital because of things like this. We need to steer more into your second provider's direction of, “Let's talk about it. What does she want? We know the risks. We're going to talk about the risks, but what does she want and how can we help her get that in a very safe manner?” Right? We want everyone to be safe, of course, but yeah. Amina: Totally. Staying open. Staying open. If she hears about something that she hasn't used before, she has the modesty to say, “Let me research that,” not just like, “I haven't used this before, so hard no.” It's like, “Oh, let me do some research. Let me ask my doula friends what they know.” I love that about her. Meagan: I love that so much about what you said about this provider. The fact that she was like, “You know, I don't know. Let me look at that.” We can have a conversation that's productive. That's what that is offering is a productive conversation between the two of you and not just shutting you out. She may have seen a different study about that and be like, “Nope. I've seen that. That's not going to work.” But you're like, “This study–”. I love that so much. It sounds like your provider was amazing. We had talked about providers. Sometimes I think on this podcast, we sound a little provider-bashing maybe because we are like, “Don't do that. Why would they do that?” We kind of speak poorly sometimes about certain things that providers do. That is absolutely not the case. We love providers here. We love any provider– OB and midwives both. But what we don't love is when our community is mistreated, when they're gaslighted, when they're completely shut out of any options in their own birth experience, and when they're really pushed in the direction of trauma or lack of support. That's what we struggle with. It's not the provider. It's that this is happening to people who we love in our community. I know I say this time and time again. I love this community. I love you guys so much. You mean the world to me. I see posts and there have been times at 2:00 in the morning. I'll be scrolling my phone in the community and I end up crying just feeling, truly feeling those emotions from these people where they are like, “Help. What do I do?” But then I also start crying when I pull up Zoom to record a podcast like this and I see you just gleaming and bursting for joy, so excited to share your story and inspire someone. So I truly love you guys so much. I am so grateful for you being here with us today and sharing this amazing story. It sounds like I might need to connect with your provider because this is amazing.Amina: She is amazing. Meagan: Remind me where this provider is located. Amina: New York City. In New York City, it's hard to find a provider that's supportive for some reason. I went all over in the first pregnancy even. It's quite hard, but really finding a provider who believes in you, who knows you can do it, who is excited for you, and who doesn't just see you as a number and someone who believes you are a woman. Meagan: Or an emergency. Amina: Yes. You're not just an emergency. That was the biggest change for me. It's not like the second birth was just smooth. There were moments where there was blood. There were moments where her heart rate was in distress, but there's that confidence that this woman can do this. This baby is safe and we are doing this together. Meagan: Yes. Which is so powerful. That's only going to help you during your birth. That's only going to help build you up and move you forward and help you feel like overall, it's a better experience. Like you said, sometimes things don't go exactly as planned or it doesn't go so smoothly where sometimes you have to move around because baby is struggling or there is blood or whatever, right? But because you were built up in this experience and the support was truly surrounding you, you were able to have that better experience. Amina: Mhmm, exactly. I think also, I just learned so much from this the difference between fear and intuition. If you have that feeling within yourself, you can really easily mistake fear as, “This is my feeling,” but actually, is it fear or is it your real intuition? They can be blurred and when you just sit with that for a bit, you will see your body saying, “Hell yes,” then it's most likely a yes. Meagan: Yes. I love that you talked about that with your therapist. Let's dig deeper here. Let's find out. Is it that I'm scared or is it that this is really what I want? Don't be scared, Women of Strength, to dig into that and dive deeper into those feelings because sometimes, it can be fear. You're on social media so much. You're seeing scary things and you're like, “Nope. I'm not going to do that,” but once you dive deeper, you might realize something else. Amina: Yep. Meagan: Yes. Okay, well thank you again so much. Amina: Thank you so much for having me. Thank you. ClosingWould you like to be a guest on the podcast? Tell us about your experience at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Meagan's bio, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link. Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-vbac-link/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

How could lessons from surviving cancer empower you in your birth? For Eva Whipple, going through cancer at age 19 shifted up her perspective on things. It taught her about priorities and her ability to push through. She recognizes that it also taught her to be present. And this carried into both of her births, both on the same day two years apart. For her first birth of her daughter Lois, Eva was in a birthing center (birthing at home was illegal). Then for surprise pregnancy number two, she decided on a home birth for son Sonny. We chat about the road to home birth and the comparison of her two births, nursing a toddler while pregnant and how her practice of yoga has been a part of her life as a mother. Links From The Episode: First Descents - https://firstdescents.org/ Ina May Gaskin's “Spiritual Midwifery” - https://www.amazon.com/Spiritual-Midwifery-Ina-May-Gaskin/dp/1570671044 Eva's Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/soulyogamama/ Eva's yoga studio - http://www.soulyogastudiosalisbury.com/ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

✨ Henio urodzony dokładnie w dniu terminu: 26 listopada 2023 ✨Tutaj zobaczysz nasze pierwsze zdjęcie:KLIK KLIKO MNIE: Mam na imię Kasia i jestem autorką podcastu Kasia o hormonach. Jeśli chcesz dowiedzieć się więcej na mój temat, zajrzyj tutaj ➡ https://wiecejnizhormony.pl/o-mnie/INSTAGRAM ➡ https://www.instagram.com/wiecejnizhormony/YOUTUBE ➡ https://www.youtube.com/@wiecejnizhormonyZapisz się na Hormonalny Newsletter, gdzie otrzymasz w prezencie bezpłatnego e-booka na temat badań jakie warto wykonać, by uregulować hormony ➡ https://wiecejnizhormony.pl/badania/LINKI, O KTÓRYCH WSPOMINAM W TYM ODCINKU:Kanał na YT Pregnancy and Postpartum TV➡ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIakpj3Xn5NBfRH9mfoG43wFilm na YT o tym jak wykonać pozycję 'miles circuit'➡ https://youtu.be/UQ1jKbvyER4?si=3miIVKmnJE3jJirSKsiążka: Poród naturalny Ina May Gaskin➡ https://lubimyczytac.pl/ksiazka/146021/porod-naturalnyWersja tego odcinka na YouTube:➡ https://youtu.be/7GzUb6wbyqg

Meet Megan, mom to 6-year-old Aurelia and 19-month-old Leonardo Iztali from Denver, Colorado. We connected with Megan via another DIAH mom, Marissa (whom we interviewed a few weeks before). Megan had sent a banner to Marissa to decorate her home in preparation for home birth. The same banner has made its way to other mamas since then, and Megan plans to continue to send it to friends as they want it. Besides supporting other women in their home birth journeys, Megan has an amazing story of her own. After having a great experience with her first birth in a birthing center, she felt inspired to move into home birth for the next time around. She says she felt empowered and knew a home birth was the next step.  In between Aurelia and Leonardo, Megan experienced a miscarriage at 10 weeks. Megan shares openly on the fear and guilt that crept in during that time, and how she embarked on a journey of forgiveness, back to grace, comfort and love.  By the time she was pregnant with Leonardo, Megan felt in full trust of her body, her baby and herself. She listened to the flow and went the whole pregnancy and birth almost completely unassisted. She did yoga, meditated, read, watched home births, created affirmations and playlists -- all to create the sacred space for her birth. Megan is a total inspiration. This episode has a lot of great quotes and mantras to pull from. My favorite? “PURE MAGIC!” Links From The Episode: Sacred Living Movement - http://www.sacredlivingmovement.com/ Indie Birth - https://www.indiebirth.com/ Peaceful Birth Project - http://thepeacefulbirthproject.org/ Ina May Gaskin - http://inamay.com/ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Often, we plan for birth, get the nursery looking beautiful and receive a million cute onesies for our baby, but we forget to prepare ourselves for postpartum. Today's episode with Dr Emma Nagy will motivate you to plan and take steps to take care of yourself during this transformative time. That is the best we can do for our babies too. The strategies and mindset shifts that we discuss will help you at any point in your motherhood journey – not just in the early months. So this is an episode not to be missed for all mamas and soon-to-be mamas. Dr. Emma Nagy is a Mama of two boys and the Founder of My Lighter Way. Emma has a PhD in mental health promotion and is a researcher in the health field with over 13 years of experience. She is a mental health and mindset coach for mothers. Through her signature program, My Lighter Motherhood, Emma teaches expecting mothers how to prepare themselves for the newborn stage and protect their mental health as they go through it. Emma and I chat about: Finding the right mental health professional for you How Emma's studies and life experience led her into the perinatal space Why the focus of birth may overshadow the preparation of postpartum How mothers can support themselves in the newborn stage Approaching and addressing ‘mum guilt' The beauty of daydreaming as a tool for planning for the newborn stage The importance of asking for and accepting help when you need it Preparing your subconscious to feel positive towards birth The benefits of hypnobirthing for birth preparation and labour pain management “If you anchor in the skill of enjoying the present, enjoying where you are, you're going to carry that into motherhood with you.” Episode Links: Say hi to Emma on Instagram Listen to Emma's podcast My Lighter Way Podcast Emma's mini-course My Lighter Birth My Lighter Motherhood Pregnancy and Postpartum Program The Mindful Mama-to-be Masterclass Books Emma recommended: Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth Hypnobirthing the Mongan Method Come say hello to me over on Instagram Read my book The Motherhood Reset or check out my program The Motherhood Reset Listen and Subscribe to Wild + Well on: Apple Podcast | Spotify | Google Podcast

In this weeks episode we went through Shaina's peaceful birth story. First time mama, choosing homebirth and all the intentions, prep and surrender that went with it. We hope this episode can shed some light, bring joy to your day and encourage the mama who thinks she can't do it, because you can!!  Now let's grab snack and get to it!  Weekly Favorite: Perfect Supplements is having a 25% off sale through 11/16. Use this Link to shop-  https://www.perfectsupplements.com/?Click=645e732da54af Resources:  Affirmations: Built to birth: https://www.builttobirth.com/meditate Mama natural: https://shop.mamanatural.com/products/pregnancy-affirmation-cards Books mentioned:  Expecting Better, Emily Oster: https://www.amazon.com/Expecting-Better-Conventional-Pregnancy-Wrong/dp/0143125702/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2KEHS4YHJT2CG&keywords=expecting+better+emily+oster&qid=1679031974&sprefix=expecting+better%2Caps%2C145&sr=8-1 Mama Natural, Genevieve Howland https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Week-Week-Pregnancy-Childbirth/dp/150114667X/ref=as_li_ss_tl?creativeASIN=150114667X&imprToken=I06TqM20XZjjZgecIvovaA&slotNum=11&ie=UTF8&qid=1485208140&sr=8-2&keywords=mama+natural+book&linkCode=w61&tag=mamanatural-20&linkId=cbbd1c7aaa034c73736ff05f6dc873ce 3. Nine golden months, Heng Ou: https://www.amazon.com/Nine-Golden-Months-Mother-Be/dp/1419751484/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3MCMDL2ZAD7F2&keywords=9+golden+months&qid=1679032078&sprefix=9+golden+months%2Caps%2C164&sr=8-1 4. Ina May's Guide to Childbirth,  Ina May Gaskin: https://www.amazon.com/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Gaskin/dp/0553381156/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3FVP1AWTEEFFA&keywords=ina+may+guide+to+childbirth&qid=1679032252&sprefix=ina+ma%2Caps%2C179&sr=8-1 Podcasts we encourage:  - Pregnancy & Birth made easy: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/pregnancy-birth-made-easy/id1471731529 - Happy homebirth: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/happy-homebirth/id1446934537 -Evidence based birth: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evidence-based-birth/id1334808138 -Down to birth: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/down-to-birth/id1493130920

Is one way to birth “better” than another? Sometimes there are misconceptions and unhealthy conversations floating about in the birth community around natural vs. medicated birth or hospital vs. home. That one is better than the other or there's a sense of superiority or higher moral code to choose one over the other. And competition comes in as a factor, like there is something to prove or defy. This topic is relevant for the conversation we have today with Lillie Cooke, sharing her birth story with us. Lillie and her husband Josh planned for a home birth with their first child, son Judah. Along the way towards planning for the birth, Lillie noticed little things that indicated she wasn't really connecting deeply with her midwife. There was also a big fear of going to the hospital, seeking to avoid that at all costs. This fear stemmed from, as Lillie put it “hearing terrible hospital stories and only fairy tale home birth stories from the homebirth community.” Labor began at 40 weeks and 6 days. After laboring for 4 days, things started to feel chaotic and the midwife's hands-off approach wasn't very helpful for what Lillie needed. Lillie made the choice to transfer because of pain and exhaustion. What helped make the transfer a less fearful event was the great experience she had with the staff there. They were respectful and she felt empowered, calm and peaceful.  Some words from Lillie: “I ended up having so much better care and such a peaceful birth. The OB was more of a midwife than my own midwife! We ended up with a peaceful vaginal delivery. She also didn't check on me until 3 weeks after my birth. After I just felt abandoned and not welcome in the home birth community. I felt the one in our area was not very inclusive to all births and made it feel like you didn't have a good enough or “superior” birth if it wasn't at home. My experience woke me up from the tunnel vision I had before from being in that community and showed me that none of that was true. That's why I love this podcast because it is the only homebirth podcast that is inclusive with ALL births and shows the pros AND cons of homebirth. I want to share my story to other first time mamas so they have a better perspective and know there is no superior way or place to birth despite what people promote. And there are good stories and traumatic stories at home just like at the hospital. But no one lets people come on and talk about that with home births and that's a shame. Everyone's experience is so powerful. Birth is so powerful. I've learned a lot from my first birth and would just love to share my story and my thoughts surrounding it.”  And - Lillie is currently pregnant with her second child. What birth plan are they creating? Listen in to find out! Topics we cover in this episode: Business of Being Born, Ina May Gaskin, relationship with your midwife, choosing a care provider that's best for you, Miles Circuit, hospital transfer, epidural Links From The Episode: The Miles Circuit: http://www.milescircuit.com/ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Have you ever been disqualified from something?  Maybe you were in a swim meet and your feet touched the bottom of the pool.  Maybe your scholarship essay was too short and you were taken out of the running…. But have you ever been considered disqualified in your birthing location?   This week we're speaking with an incredible woman, Ginny Yurtich, founder of 1000 hours outsideJih, and mother of 5 children with very different birth stories.  In her first birth, Ginny's pre-eclampsia “disqualified” her from her birth center experience, and we'll see just how she handled this in subsequent births.      Episode Roundup: The people who surround us can play such a huge role in our decisions.  When we look back at Ginny's first birth, she was considering an elective c section, as her friend very much enjoyed hers.  But then, her brother's roommate introduced her to the work of Ina May Gaskin, and her whole story was changed.  Though the first two births did not work out nearly how she had desired, the seed was planted, and Ginny's perception on birth was forever changed.  Small changes can add up to massive results.  Ginny discussed how after simply “getting through” her third pregnancy/first homebirth, she was ready to start making changes during her next pregnancy.  She was able to head off her pre-eclampsia symptoms with liver support and appropriate nutrition, and her labor was dramatically shortened. And then… Ginny learned that birth was her responsibility.  She took complete control in her final homebirth, and that 95 minute experience taught her so many lessons.  We are always responsible for our birth, but when we recognize that and actually capitalize on it— what an incredible difference it can make in the lives of our entire family. And finally, simplicity is so beautiful.  Ginny simplified her birth through unmedicalizing it, and she simplified her life by putting the focus on spending time in nature.  The real nectar comes from the basics, and Ginny's life is a glorious testimony to it.    Follow Ginny: @1000hoursoutside Ginny's website: www.1000hoursoutside.com

Episode 5 invites Tony Scialli MD, an obstetrician-gynecologist and reproductive toxicologist, to talk about the overuse of gynecologic surgeries – namely hysterectomies and Cesarean sections. Pharmanipulation is produced by PharmedOut, a Georgetown University Medical Center rational prescribing project. For a transcript of this episode, please visit: https://georgetown.box.com/s/1bdbxvaezezlpu0qsm02q3101mmhsi3a To learn more about Dr. Tony Scialli, please visit his website: https://www.scialliconsulting.com/#about Additional Resources The Cultural Warping of Childbirth by Doris Haire. Link: https://www.abebooks.com/9789315600471/Cultural-Warping-Childbirth-Doris-Haire-9315600479/plp Our Bodies, Ourselves by Boston Women's Health Collective. Link: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Our-Bodies-Ourselves/Boston-Womens-Health-Book-Collective/9781439190661 Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskin. Link: https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=31385160493&ref_=ps_ggl_17730880232&cm_mmc=ggl-_-US_Shopp_Trade_10to20-_-product_id=COM9781570671043USED-_-keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjw1_SkBhDwARIsANbGpFs4ExX1P9YXQFUuTueJytlUy2VdelLMIBU7neywgGu14aYawh1w7hkaArxfEALw_wcB National Women's Health Network. Link: https://nwhn.org/ PharmedOut is supported primarily by individual donations. To donate, please visit: https://sites.google/com/georgetown.edu/pharmedout/donate

In this episode we are chatting with Victoria, mama to two babies who were both planned homebirths in the Pilbara, WA. She birthed her children with the support of her husband, independent midwifes and doula. Victoria was considered a ‘Mature' mum with first born at 35 and second at 38 years of age. We discuss what led her to home birth, and the people and resources (including Sarah Buckley and Ina May Gaskin) that played a role, and how she instinctually used her body in birth which turned out to be exactly what she had read in the books! This is a must-listen for mummas who need to hear how simply birth can be (including walking around the shops and going for a massage all the while knowing baby was on the way!)

Here I am again giving as great detail as I can in my pregnancy experience so far!I hope these help any new Mama's to be in some way by sharing my experience although everyones is unique! Main Nursery Items and baby gear:Crib and dresser : Babyletto Green guard certifiedMattress: Obasan GOTS and GOLS certified Peanut Changer PadDiaper pail : UbbiRocker/Glider : Monte design Green guard certifiedSnuggle me organic sleeper Baby Monitor (no wifi / less EMF and anti-hacker) : Infant OpticsUppa baby Stroller, car seat and playard Off gassing and materials certifications:https://essentialsleepboutique.com/blogs/news/confused-about-green-certificationsGOLS / GOTSFetal HR Doppler Nutriton:Reducing headaches , increasing energy and amniotic fluid : LMNT electrolytesProtein increase : Grass fed whey , Beef protein isolate, collagen powder Pregnancy movement courses:Push Prep ( Prenatal Pilates to prepare for birth and post pardon recovery)Spinning Babies ( yoga for optimal baby positioning for labour)Books / resources :Nuture Month by month pregnancy guide Ina May Gaskin guide to child birthThe business of being born documentary The Natural Minded Mama IGIf you liked this episode please like and share with your friends and family!

This is episode 99 of the podcast, and next week is the 100th episode. it seems a totally fitting tribute, for a podcast dedicated to changing the conversation about this transformation, to have a guest whose profound book is all about debunking our most socially potent beliefs about what defines a mother and where they came from (spoiler alert: they don't come from rigorous scientific examination, at best I'd call them science adjacent).My guest shares the experiences she had in pregnancy and postpartum that inspired her to write this book which so powerfully dispels so many myths around mothers and motherhood. While she was talking, all I could think was: why weren't you whispering this in my ear when I was pregnant? This could have changed how I thought about lots of aspects of my postpartum, although I'm grateful to overturn some of my most oppressive beliefs; hopefully she can change how you think of this period.

In this episode of Kiwi Birth Tales, I speak to Karlie about her pregnancy, birth and postpartum journey with daughter Leynie. In this episode, we discuss:Planned cultural birth approach (Maori Tikanga) with woven a Wahakura, an ipu whenua, had a Muka tie and the birth plan was centred in Te Ao Maori.Ina May Gaskin, Guide to ChildbirthHomebirth / Birth centre planned birthPost-birth complaints and changes in hospital policy as a resultLong early labour phase, 6 days of on and off labourEpiduralTraverse position in labourEmergency C-sectionBirth TraumaVertical uterus tearSepsisDomperidone for breastmilk supplyFind me @kiwibirthtales and @yourbirthproject Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Emily is a midwife and she has seen all types of birth.  Making the decision of where to birth her baby was a big choice and ultimately she chose to birth at home. Emily had to come to terms with her fears. By reading ‘Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth,' and doing the ‘Transform Your Birth' course she manages to harness her mind and steps fully into her confidence and trust in the birth process. The result - well listen in and find out. An inspiring story to support your trust in the process of birth.   Links: Transform Parenting website

What are some of the most important things to do in pregnancy as you prepare for baby? Well, in this episode we discuss our top 3 focuses within birth preparation and what we really like to emphasize with our mama's - fuel, movement and breath work. We talk about some of our favorite resources and ways to implement these practices today! We hope this episode is full of helpful information that you can apply whether you are in the 1st, 2nd or 3rd trimester. So grab a snack and let's get to it! Books mentioned: Expecting Better, Emily Oster: https://www.amazon.com/Expecting-Better-Conventional-Pregnancy-Wrong/dp/0143125702/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2KEHS4YHJT2CG&keywords=expecting+better+emily+oster&qid=1679031974&sprefix=expecting+better%2Caps%2C145&sr=8-1 Mama Natural, Genevieve Howland https://www.amazon.com/Natural-Week-Week-Pregnancy-Childbirth/dp/150114667X/ref=as_li_ss_tl?creativeASIN=150114667X&imprToken=I06TqM20XZjjZgecIvovaA&slotNum=11&ie=UTF8&qid=1485208140&sr=8-2&keywords=mama+natural+book&linkCode=w61&tag=mamanatural-20&linkId=cbbd1c7aaa034c73736ff05f6dc873ce Nine golden months, Heng Ou: https://www.amazon.com/Nine-Golden-Months-Mother-Be/dp/1419751484/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3MCMDL2ZAD7F2&keywords=9+golden+months&qid=1679032078&sprefix=9+golden+months%2Caps%2C164&sr=8-1 Ina May's Guide to Childbirth, Ina May Gaskin: https://www.amazon.com/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Gaskin/dp/0553381156/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3FVP1AWTEEFFA&keywords=ina+may+guide+to+childbirth&qid=1679032252&sprefix=ina+ma%2Caps%2C179&sr=8-1 Instagram Accounts: Painfreebirth: https://www.instagram.com/painfreebirth/ Built to birth: https://www.instagram.com/builttobirth/ Love of a little one: https://www.instagram.com/loveofalittleone/ lalactation: https://www.instagram.com/lalactation/ Wholistic Postpartum : https://www.instagram.com/wholisticpostpartum/ Affirmations: Built to birth: https://www.builttobirth.com/meditate Mama natural: https://shop.mamanatural.com/products/pregnancy-affirmation-cards

Breastfeeding is the next natural step after birthing a baby - but guess what, you AND your baby still have to learn how to do it. In this episode, we discuss several principles to successful breastfeeding, and how to prepare for the process during your pregnancy. Having a newborn comes with many steep learning curves, and this is certainly one of them - but having education and resources to back your inherent instincts and motivation to breastfeed your baby can make or break the experience. We have to remember that we used to get this info as little girls surrounded by community - but today, most new mothers have never even seen a baby latch. From tongue ties to letdowns, building your supply, positioning, and mastitis - let us help guide and pump you up for this special relationship, so there's no surprises - let's go!   DOCTOR'S WEBSITES Dr. Morgan's website: www.milkmedicine.com Dr. Morgan's IG: https://www.instagram.com/morganmacdermott/ Dr. Leah's website: www.womanhoodwellness.com  Dr. Leah's IG: https://www.instagram.com/drleahgordon/    RESOURCES   Breastfeeding videos by Jack Newman's International Breastfeeding Centre: https://ibconline.ca/breastfeeding-videos-english/ Book: The Womanly Art of Breastfeeding by the Le Leche League - click here Haakaa Silicone Breast Pump: https://haakaausa.com/products/haakaa-silicone-breast-pump-with-suction-base-5-oz-1pk-1 Ina May's Guide to Breastfeeding by Ina May Gaskin - click here  Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth by Ina May Gaskin - click here  Kelly Mom Breastfeeding website: kellymom.com Dr. Morgan MacDermott's Mastitis Manual https://milkmedicine.company.site/

Join us today as Kaitie interviews Brittany! Brittany, first time mom, shares how she guarded her peace through the trials of miscarriage and unexpectedly being diagnosed with preeclampsia. This is a story of how to stand on God's Word and receive His peace beyond one's understanding! You can connect with Brittany through social media on: -Instagram - @brittanytprice -Supernatural Childbirth Mamas' Facebook Group Resources Brittany talked about on the show: - Teachings by Nerida Walker on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/@NeridaWalker/videos)and her book, God's Plan for Pregnancy (https://neridawalker.cartloom.com/storefront/category/ebooks) - Supernatural Childbirth by Jackie Mize (https://www.jackiemize.com) - The Bradley Method (https://www.bradleybirth.com) - Kierra Blaser's A Heavenly Welcome on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/@AHeavenlyWelcome )and her podcast, Birth in God's Presence (https://aheavenlywelcome.com/category/podcast/) - Ina May's Guide to Childbirth by Ina May Gaskin (https://www.amazon.com/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Gaskin/dp/0553381156/ref=sr_1_1?qid=1677085931&refinements=p_27%3AIna+May+Gaskin&s=books&sr=1-1) - Pain Free Birth with Karen Welton (https://painfreebirth.com) - The Happy Homebirth Podcast (https://www.myhappyhomebirth.com) We pray you are encouraged by Brittany's story and encounter God in your pregnancies and births!

Ina May Gaskin said in her book Ina May's Guide to Childbirth, "Even if it has not been your habit throughout your life so far, I recommend that you learn to think positively about your body."  The devil's lies have convinced so many women that they are incapable of doing the very thing God designed them to do.  Inside today's episode, we look at 4 ways that you can STOP that negativity and self-doubt and START refocusing on what is possible when we put our faith and trust in GOD!  We can give birth!  We can have healthy pregnancies and grow healthy babies!  We can do all the things He designed us to do if only we will follow Him and His will!   Need help finding a provider?  Want to be added to my email list? Got other questions? Email lori@yourbirthgodsway.com   Join our new community! --> https://www.facebook.com/groups/yourbirthgodsway   DISCLAIMER:  Remember that though I am a midwife, I am not YOUR midwife.  I strive to provide the most accurate information I can, but you must do your research and consult other reputable sources, including your provider, to make the best decision for your own care.  I do not know the specific details about your situation and thus I am not responsible for the outcomes of your decisions.

In the Middle Ages, women in labor could ask for a special birthing stone to help reduce the pain. While this was likely ineffective, pain reduction techniques and the midwives who practiced them were often suspected of witchcraft. We've come a long way since then but when it comes to pregnancy and labor but, just as in the past, there are still many challenges for those giving birth. Hear how advances in medicine and midwifery have improved the experience of labor and increased women's choice for how they give birth. And learn how companies use technology and collaboration to expand access to prenatal care to strengthen the relationship between doctors and midwives on this episode of Trailblazers.   Featuring Tina Cassidy, Ina May Gaskin, Jenny Joy, Kypros Nicolaides, Ryan Kraudel and Ila Dayananda. For more on the podcast go to delltechnologies.com/trailblazers

In this episode of The Mama Psychedelia Podcast, I interview  birthkeeper Linda Hamilton. Linda is a mother of 7 and grandmother and the founder and previous director of the non-profit organization “Birth Without Boundaries”. She continues to be an advocate for peaceful birth practices and honouring of the 42 day postpartum nest, and is currently writing a book exploring her life's work. Linda has lived between Costa Rica and Pennsylvania since 2001 and has been supporting many families during their pregnancy journeys in person and remotely. During our discussion, Linda shares a few of her own birth experiences, starting with what it was like desiring an unmediated birth in the 80's at 19 years old when having her first, declaring after her 4th that she would never birth in a hospital again, on to the story of her glorious free birth of her daughter at home. Linda talks about the early days of being a birth companion in her communities as a young mother, her role in advocacy & activism, time shared with Ina May Gaskin & Michel Odent, living in the jungle of Costa Rica and supporting families in wild free birth settings in their full undisturbed power. She illuminates the importance of witnessing the sacredness that is taking place in birth and giving mothers the opportunity to harvest that magic, and how that sets them up for successful, connected mothering. She tells a story of a client's beautiful birth by the ocean, we talk about birth imprinting, and how the prenatal and birthing time impact each of us and how we relate to the world, and how many of our foundational subconscious beliefs are created at this time. She shares how we can all listen deeper to the baby's intrinsic intelligence during the birthing process alongside their mothers.Multi generational living, coming together with community, pulling together resources. And finally, one of my favourite topics, the importance of centering & honouring mothers in our communities so they can fully thrive in their role of power and guardianship, how we can serve mothers, and stop perpetuating cycles of self sacrificing behaviour so they can better serve the future.———————————————————————————————————Resources: Where you can find Linda: Linda's WebsiteMackenzie's offerings: https://snipfeed.co/hunnywombIG: @mamapsychedelia@hunnywombdoulaIntro Music Snippet of "Waters of the Earth" by Satori covered by me, Mackenzie.(For more of her music, check out her Spotify.

Today I'm giving you the DL on homebirth. I'm going deep in this episode to chat about why I chose homebirth, its benefits, and so much more! My labour with Leo was truly amazing, and I want to share with women so they can feel empowered in their choices around birthToday's Lessons Include:

Deb Flashenberg is the founder and director of the Prenatal Yoga Center in NYC. She is a yoga teacher, labor support doula, Lamaze childbirth educator and has completed a midwifery assistant program at The Farm in Tennessee with Ina May Gaskin and The Farm midwives. On this episode of the Pure Nurture Podcast, Deb is sharing all about five essential questions to ask your care provider before birth. When you're in labor, it's not a good time to start negotiating your delivery wishes. You need to feel heard, respected, and supported BEFORE your big day and be sure you and your support team are all on the same page. In this episode, you'll hear about: Who is Deb Flashenberg & how she got into supporting pregnant women before she became a Mom (2:35) Prenatal Yoga Center in NYC Yoga | Birth | Babies Podcast Who's Afraid of the Pregnant Yogi? online program When you meet your doctor for the first time, ask these 5 key questions to make sure you're on the same page (5:36) Is it too late to switch care providers in your 3rd trimester? (25:00) "As a doula, Deb has heard this lament time and time again: “I received the name of my doctor from a friend, and if I had known what to ask, I probably would have switched doctors a long time ago. Now I feel it's too late to change!” Ideally, it's best to have a very important conversation with your doctor at the beginning of your pregnancy to make sure that the way he or she practices medicine matches up with the way you want to birth. If you're already into your pregnancy and a relationship with your doctor, be sure to ask these key questions at your next appointment! When you're in labor, it isn't a good time to start negotiating your labor and delivery wishes. It's essential that you feel heard, supported and respected long before the big day!" - Via www.prenatalyogacenter.com Click here to read more about the 5 questions Deb recommends you ask your doctor.  If you found this podcast helpful and want more, visit Deb at her Prenatal Yoga Center, on Instagram, and Facebook. Check out her prenatal yoga teacher training (if you're ready to dive deeper) and when you're in New York City, pop in for a yoga class! Best part? You can practice yoga wherever you are with Deb's free yoga videos.

Lindsay's first birth was a planned home birth which ultimately resulted in a hospital transfer and emergency C-section. She was left feeling unprepared, unheard, and committed to fighting for a VBAC next time. Lindsay worked for months preparing for a VBAC both physically and emotionally. Once labor started, she was coping extremely well with her intense contractions. She arrived at the hospital at 10 centimeters, ready to have her baby!Until…her contractions completely stopped. Lindsay shares with us how she overcame ultimate doubt when pushing continued for over four hours. Doubt can creep in at any time on your VBAC journey. Trust yourself and your preparation. Lean into your supportive birth team. We know you can do this!Additional linksThe VBAC Link CommunityHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull transcriptNote: All transcripts are edited to correct grammar, false starts, and filler words. Julie: Welcome, welcome. This is Women of Strength Wednesday and you are tuned in to The VBAC Link podcast with Julie and Meagan and our special guest, Lindsay, today. We were actually just chitchatting a little bit before we pressed record about different providers and how they influence birth outcomes. Sometimes you will have a provider who is surprisingly more supportive than you would expect them to be and vice versa, right? So we are going to talk about that and all the different parts of Lindsay's story in a little bit. Before we do that though, Meagan has a Review of the Week for us.Review of the WeekMeagan: Yes I do. This is from RokFray and it says “Getting VBAC Ready. This podcast has been inspiring and motivational to me as I prepare for a VBAC with my fourth baby. Listening to each of these stories and realizing that through listening I have learned how to advocate for myself and my family has been a true blessing. Thank you!”And I just want to say thank you to RokFray for sharing your review. Julie and I say it all the time. We love your reviews. We truly mean it. And honestly, we are running out of some reviews because we haven't been recording for so long. We haven't had a ton of reviews here coming in and so we would love some new, fresh reviews so we can read them on future podcasts.Julie: You never know. Maybe next week, we will read yours.Meagan: Yep.Julie: I love it. I always remember that time when somebody was Review of the Week and they posted on their Instagram. Well, I guess it has happened a couple of times, but it just makes me happy. Getting reviews, reading them, and everyone letting us know how we have been helping you so thank you, thank you. It means a lot to us.Lindsay's StoryJulie: All right. Let's get to it. We have Lindsay with us today. Lindsay is an Advertising Account Director and a mom of two. She loves being a mom and thinks bringing babies earthside is one of the most surreal experiences that we have as mothers. “Childbirth is the best lesson a mother can experience,” she says. “A lot is out of our control, so plan for the worst and hope for the best.” Do you know what that reminds me of? That reminds me of when I was in the military. Plan for the worst and hope for the best because I don't know if anybody out there listening is in the military, or a military spouse, or has ever been in the military, but you know that whenever things can go wrong if there is a possibility, then it probably will go wrong. So you have got to just kind of expect not very much, but hope for great things. That just reminded me of that when I was just reading your bio. Lindsay. But I like that sentiment because you can prepare for all of the things, right? You can prepare for all of the outcomes, but always hope for and even expect the best outcomes as well. So I love that.But Lindsay, why don't you go ahead and tell us a little bit more and share your story with us?Lindsay: awesome. Thanks so much, Julie. So I will start with my pregnancy and the birth of my son which was my first C-section. It took us a while to get pregnant with my son. We thought that it was going to be quite simple and it turns out it wasn't. So with a little bit of help from a fertility specialist, we successfully got pregnant. We were so excited and he recommended that we be handed over to the care of midwives. I had a low-risk pregnancy. I was in great shape, healthy, and a strong BMI, so he felt like this would be the best care provider for what I needed. And then also with my style, he loved that and recommended that we have someone who would be really guiding throughout.He also recommended that I ask them about homebirth, which was probably unexpected for most coming from more of the traditional Western medicine perspective. So we started on with the midwives. We loved them instantly and homebirth was brought up pretty early on. And so we had planned for a homebirth and in this, my biggest learning was that we really focused on the homebirth and the realities of a homebirth. We didn't necessarily talk about labor preparation.So I had read Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth and I had chatted with friends who had gone through labor, especially in natural labor and delivery, and so I felt like I was prepared enough until I was 40 weeks pregnant– 40 weeks, 4 days exactly– and my water broke. It was the slow leak. We confirmed that the amniotic sac ruptured. I was slowly leaking fluid, but I wasn't under stress and baby's heart rate was fine, so we made a little bit of a plan. If I hadn't gone into labor in 24 hours, then I would go in to the hospital and we would do an induction. If I did go into labor naturally, then I would continue on with a planned homebirth.So we went home with the instruction to just enjoy each other‘s company and try to wind down. It was really hitting home that this was our last moment where we would have just the two of us and our dog in this house. And so we were anxious, excited, nervous and that was when I started feeling the, “Oh my god. I wonder what labor feels like.” At 9:30 p.m., I had my first contraction. It was a very traditional wave. I felt the build. I felt the release. I went through the motions of like, “Okay. I can handle this,” and then quickly let my husband know that, “Okay, so labor is starting.” My mom was coming over and we were prepared for what was about to come. I gave both of them the call sheet for the midwives and we went over the birth plan and were feeling good.Within an hour, I had all back labor, no break between contractions, was really nauseous, and something just didn't feel right. I kept saying to my husband and my mom like, “We need to call the midwife. We need to call the midwife,” and they were just calm and steady like, “Lindsay, you are doing great. It's okay.” And at that point, my mom said, “I think you are having back labor–”Meagan: MhmmLindsay: “–based on the fact that you don't have any breaks and it's just back-to-back.” I had been given the instructions to not go in the water, and so for me, that meant I shouldn't even be standing in the shower. I was a very cautious first-time laborer and after some pretty frantic, “Call the midwife! Call the midwives!”, my mom and husband in fact called the midwives and we agreed to do a home visit. They were going to come and check on me and likely transfer me to the hospital just because I was having a hard time managing the pain.And so my midwives came over and checked me. I was only about 5 centimeters dilated. I was having a really hard time managing the pain. It just goes back to total unpreparedness. I had read one book and had some conversations, but I don't think I necessarily understood the different ways that labor can feel. The thought of it being exclusively in my back was such a foreign concept to me and really unbearable.We drove to the hospital which was less than five minutes away. My husband was asking me on the way there like, “You are going to do up your seatbelt right?” I could barely sit down. I am not concerned about my seatbelt. And so we get to the hospital in the wee hours of the morning. It's about 3:00 a.m. and we were waiting now for an epidural.I am laboring, very vocal, have a lot of discomfort, and am still a little bit unsure if this is normal, where I am feeling it, and not being provided with a lot of reassurance that I am doing great and that this is normal. And so now at this point, I am like a little bit panicked like, “This is a foreign feeling. I don't know what's going on. I feel totally unheard and I also feel voiceless. I'm asking questions and I just feel like I am not really being given reassurance and direction.”Of course, my husband being a first-time dad and first time witnessing labor is also a little bit of a deer in the headlights like, “What is happening? Is my wife okay and is this normal?” And so an hour in, we start asking, “Where is the epidural? Where is the anesthesiologist? We need some sort of pain meds.” My approach was an epidural or bust.I didn't want to take fentanyl or laughing gas unnecessarily. I would rather just go for the good stuff and get the epidural. I don't tolerate pain medication well, and so I was apprehensive about the effects that it would have on me but also recognized that I was feeling like it was an out-of-body experience and like I just couldn't handle this. I did not have confidence in myself.So around 4:30, it was like one of those lightbulb moments where I was like, “My massage therapist said if I feel back labor, ask for the bee stings,” which is sterile water injections in my low back.Meagan: Oh yes.Lindsay: It was the first time I was able to really advocate for myself in labor. I was like, “Can I get a sterile water injection? I will take the bee stings,” which are definitely a little bit more aggressive than a bee sting. I must have just been stung by really a really lightweight bee in the past.But I got the sterile water injection and instantly felt relief. At that moment, I was like, “Man, I can handle this. I feel really good about now.” I started to feel proper contractions and a proper wave inching closer to 5:00 and so at that point, I am like, “Okay. I am handling this well.” I suddenly felt the urge to bear down. And so I went to the washroom and as I am sitting I am like, “It feels like I have to poop.” And so my midwife– I am vocalizing this and she is like, “Okay. Let's give you a quick check,” and so at that point, she was like, “Listen. The anesthesiologist is about to walk in.” She gave me a check and I was 8 centimeters.Meagan: Wow.Lindsay: And so she said, “You are at the cusp and so you either get the epidural now or you don't get it at all.” I was just blindly looking at her for advice and guidance and I was like, “I guess I think I should get it,” and she was like, “I think that is a good decision.” I got the epidural and I felt relief. But going back to preparedness and not feeling heard, at that point, being prepared– I was not prepared for an epidural. And so as I am leaning over my husband, he, in turn, was also not prepared. He was like, “I may pass out. That is a very large needle.” I was just like, “Just stick it in me. I need to feel some sort of relief.” As soon as the effects of the epidural kicked in, suddenly I felt like, “There is no turning back. I have just made a horrible decision.” Maybe I was handling labor okay and I was starting to feel some relief. I was just on the cusp of transition because as soon as I had the epidural, I had the hormone shakes and the sweats, and so I was transitioning naturally anyways. The feeling of defeat was really stinking in.At 5:30 and the direction was, “Rest. You need to sleep and we are just going to flip you on a peanut ball side to side.” So every 30 minutes, my husband and my midwife would wake me up and flip me. It was just side to side with the peanut ball until about 7:00 a.m. At that point, I was 10 centimeters dilated and they decided to just let me continue resting. I felt nothing, so I didn't feel the urge to push. They said, “Around 10:00-11:00, we will check in and you can start pushing at that point.”So at that point, they come in and say, “Okay. You need to start pushing.” The piece I missed in this was that my mom and dad had come to the hospital to give my husband some relief so that he could go and have a coffee and a bite to eat because keep in mind, we weren't planning for a hospital birth, so we were really not prepared. We had a small hospital bag packed and that was about it. My dad is asking my midwife, “What if she can't push this baby out?” and he is kind of leading the horse like, “What is going on? Is there something happening with her or with the baby? What's the next step?” They were like, “No, no. She has had an epidural. Even if this baby is in a bad position, she can push it out.” And this was the first moment where I heard the baby was in a bad position.Meagan: Yeah. No one said anything.Lindsay: No one said anything and I didn't realize that my water breaking early was likely due to an OP baby. And again, it was just a lack of communication or something that I wasn't aware of. My dad keeps asking, “What if the baby is turned a little bit?” or “What if the baby is OP?” Like, “Nope. Nope. She's had an epidural. She can push this baby out okay.”So we have now gone from homebirth to hospital to feeling really in the dark and really unclear about what's happening. I had this epidural that I am deeply regretting at this point, but there's no turning back and it's time to start pushing and I feel absolutely nothing. And so I push for a couple of hours. No headway is being made. At this point, there is a change in the midwife team so I am with a different midwife and she said, “I'm just going to step out of the room,” looking to my husband and I. “When you see a contraction on the monitor, continue to push. Continue to breathe through it and I will be back.”About 15-20 minutes later, which felt like a lot longer, she came back with the OBGYN on call. He, in a very flat and direct way, said, “You are spiking a fever. The baby's heart rate is dipping and your heart rate is dropping.” I have incredibly low blood pressure to begin with. So he said, “These three factors, coupled with the likelihood that your baby is OP– we are bringing you in for a C-section.” I was absolutely gutted.Meagan: Was it like, “Hey, this is why I think a C-section is needed” or it was it like, “This is what we are doing.” Did you feel like you had an option? Do you know what I meanLindsay: Yeah. So like, yeah. Totally, totally. So I'm sure you can see two first-time parents who have from a homebirth to now being a hospital to suddenly being told they are having a C-section, which we know absolutely nothing about other than it was a major abdominal surgery.Meagan: Yeah.Lindsay: And so I'm sobbing saying, “Can we turn off the epidural? Can we bring down the epidural even a little bit? Rip it out of my vein,” beause I have no concept of how it works, right? My husband is saying, “Can she just push for another 30 minutes?” And very flat, he was just like, “No. The difference in time is five minutes to talk about it now and to open you up in here versus bringing you into the OR.”Meagan: Whoa.Lindsay: And so again, my husband and I were just looking at him. There was really no other option that was presented to us at least. We were grasping at straws. He just again reiterated very calmly, “I understand that this is not what you wanted, but we need to get this baby out now.” And so they bring us to the OR. My husband is a wreck. We haven't been prepped for this procedure, so he is waiting as I am signing forms. This amazing nurse is wiping my tears so that I can somewhat sign blindly. It's about 2:00ish in the afternoon. We get into the OR. We had gone from a dark room with no windows and little candles everywhere to this stark, sterile, bright light environment. A different anesthesiologist came in. The energy was so nonchalant in comparison to the fear and grief that my husband and I were feeling. The anesthesiologist was phenomenal. He spoke to us throughout the entire C-section at every stage. He reassured us off the top by saying, “My wife has had two C-sections beyond seeing this through my job on a day-to-day basis. I know exactly what's going to happen. I will talk to you through this.”And so he talked us through it. He held my shoulder. My husband held my hand. By this point, I am maxed out on my epidural. I can feel my left side. It was really traumatic beyond just the flow of how the birth went, but also being in this very sterile environment and feeling a lot of what was happening.But again, the anesthesiologist just was so wonderful, coaching us through it and really, I'm sure he could sense our fear. My sweet little boy came out and was put to my face. I turned and I was like, “I think I'm going to throw up. I am super nauseous.” I am out of it at this point. I wanted to name my son Benjamin, which was not a name that my husband and I had discussed. The anesthesiologist said, “This is no longer something that you have to feel.” He gave me a good shot of fentanyl to really knock me out.And so, three hours later, I woke up to my husband doing skin-to-skin with my son Miles, not Benjamin and from there, I was confused, disoriented and in a lot of pain and discomfort, wanting to nurse. Breastfeeding was really important to me, really wanting to bring him in for our first latch and even from there, trying to latch my son but not being able to sit up and bring him to my chest, and just having a midwife take my breast and shove it in my baby's face. I felt like I didn't matter which, I think, was the furthest thing from the intention. It was rather, “We need to get this done.”Meagan: Yeah. Yeah, but still. I feel like there was such a lack of including you in everything. It was just like things were being done to you versus with you, and so I could see how you were feeling that.Lindsay: Thank you. Yeah, exactly. So we ended up having two days in the hospital and really focused on nursing and controlling what I could control. So making sure that I was walking as quickly as I possibly could. We were really focused on breastfeeding and getting my son on an every two hours nursing schedule on top of on-demand while focusing on letting him get that long stretch of sleep at night. So that's why I started to excel as a mom and really stepped into my own, but I carried a lot of trauma and grief from that birth. I remember the first night being at home laying in bed, my son was fussing and my husband was walking at the end of the bed back-and-forth with him on his chest. I was just sobbing saying, “You don't realize how lucky you are. All I want to do is get up and walk my son back-and-forth. This is what I've dreamed of and I can't.”And so the first few weeks, also feeling like I was pretty helpless in terms of my lack of mobility and how sore I was, and it was just a much longer recovery then I had anticipated and was prepared for. And so at my last discharge appointment, my question was, “Can I do a VBAC? Can I deliver vaginally after a Cesarean?” It was a very clear, “Absolutely. Your baby was OP.” So my son Miles was full OP and he also was 9 pounds, 2 ounces.Meagan: Hmm, a bigger baby.Lindsay: So he was pretty big. A bigger baby and at the point of the C-section, he had descended so far down the birth canal that he was just stuck. And so the message was, “You can absolutely do a VBAC. In your next pregnancy, we will focus on a lot of bodywork, chiropractic care, and massage,” so some of the things that I was doing before. The big one was diet. I had gained a lot of weight in my pregnancy with my son. I definitely was carrying a bigger baby and that showed, but I was an all belly pregnancy and very active. We are talking hiked 15 kilometers at 38 weeks active. I felt, at that point, pretty defeated. Like, “Okay. I must carry big babies, but for my next pregnancy and birth, I am going to do everything within my control to have a VBAC and whatever else is passed over to the higher powers.”And so I continued on raising my little boy, really loved being a first-time mom. We were keen to expand our family, and so we ended up getting pregnant a lot sooner than expected. We got pregnant when my son was about nine months and we just made it in on the cusp of when they would endorse and support a VBAC versus mandate or strongly recommend a C-section. Where I am, 18 months is the standard and my babies were exactly 18 months apart. So I really, really just snuck in there.Julie: Nice, nice.Lindsay: So I'm pregnant with my second and I just started to consume a ton of literature and content all around VBACs. If something was recommended to me, I did it without hesitation. I went for chiropractic care and massage very early on. I saw an acupuncturist. I did Spinning Babies religiously. I hired a doula and I followed her lead and guidance. I used her as a sounding board and I focused on what I could control which was finding my voice and using it, and learning about birth and labor so that I could be undeniably prepared for what was about to happen.I also was really keen to have a homebirth just knowing statistically that homebirths for VBACs statistically are more successful in terms of a vaginal delivery. Unfortunately, my midwife team couldn't endorse that. It was just out of their scope of practice, and so I did have to deliver in hospital. I just focused on really getting over those mental hurdles so that when it came time to being in labor, all I would focus on was just my labor and what was happening within my body.So at about 37 weeks, I started to actively try to induce labor. I wouldn't say I was doing anything like drinking a midwives' cocktail, for example. It was more so just focusing on ensuring that my body was prepared for labor and when my body was ready to go into labor, I was ready right there with it.I started doing acupuncture weekly. I was drinking my red raspberry leaf tea. I was doing my Spinning Babies, really focusing on inversions and bodywork for strong baby positioning. My baby was head down but not engaged in my pelvis yet, and so I was like, “I just want to make sure that this baby stays where he or she is supposed to be.”At 40 weeks exactly– she is a due date baby– I went into labor. The piece before this is, I had started pre-labor at about 38 weeks. So for two weeks I was in prodromal labor. Am I saying that correctly?Meagan: Prodromal labor, mhmm.Lindsay: Thank you. And so I was consistently feeling strong Braxton Hicks and it was manageable, something that I wasn't even really noticing because I was so busy with a 17-18 month old, but it was something I was noticing– the feeling and shift in my body. For the four nights leading up to my birth, every night from 11:00 p.m. to 5:00 a.m., I would have consistent contractions. It was this feeling of the wave, the build, and the release, but by 5:00 a.m., they would just go away. So on a Monday night, we had called our doula thinking, “I am for sure in labor.” My contractions were getting closer together. They were getting stronger and they were definitely more consistent than the previous waves.As soon as she entered our house, they stopped. And so I am like, “Yeah. We have just been up for hours tracking this.” Now it was to the point where I was uncomfortable and couldn't stay in bed. And so we started talking about what I was feeling and I was like, “It just feels like something is tickling my bladder.” She was like, “That, my friend, is a hand. I think your baby has his or her hand in front of her face, so often you will see that start-stop labor pattern because the baby isn't in a position where you can actively go into labor.”This was really the start of feeling so heard, being able to talk through what was happening and have a solution provided and also the validation of, “You're not going crazy. You are feeling something real within your body and it is going to be okay.”And so she gave me some exercises and very strict direction like, “Do these exercises. Rest today and let's see what happens that night. Let's touch base before you go to bed and let see what happens.” So we get my son in bed. We call my doula and she said, “Okay. Here is the plan. You are going to go in the bath. You are going to do this exercise–” where I lay on the pillow and kind of let my leg hang and float.Meagan: Side-lying. Mhmm. Side-lying probably.Lindsay: No like, laying face first in the bath.Meagan: Oh, in the bath. Wow!Lindsay: In the bath. Yeah.Meagan: Okay, cool.Lindsay: Yeah. “You get in the bath. You are going to relax. You are going to lay on your belly and you are going to let it just hang.” My tub was just big enough to do this comfortably. And she was like, “And then from there, you are going to go to bed and you are going to try to get as much sleep as possible. If at 5:00 a.m., your contractions are still strong and consistent, I am coming over and we are going to kickstart this labor.” Let's do it. I felt like we had a plan in place. And so I am laying in the tub and I am just going over my mental mantras like, “You are strong. You are healthy.” I definitely watched my diet in this pregnancy. Not that I was unhealthy with my son, but I was really strict with the sugar that I consumed and what I put inside my body.I was like, “Your body was made to birth this baby. You can do this.” And so I just had my mantras that I said over and over. I got ready for bed. I tucked in. My husband and I were lying there. At 9:30, I have my first contraction and it feels just like my son.Meagan: In the back?Lindsay: All in my back and I am instantly like, “This is–”Meagan: Triggering, probably.Lindsay: Triggering, yeah. It's happening again. And so I'm turning to my husband and I am like, “You need to call the midwives. You need to call the doula. I need to go to the hospital now.” My husband was just such a calm, strong voice of reason. He was like, “Okay Linds. We are going to crank up the bath. We're going to crank up the bath to a hot, hot heat and get you in it for some comfort and relief and I am going to call the doula.” And so I get in the bath and I am sitting facing the long side of the bathtub wall, kind of pressing against it with my knees up, and we are running the water hot. He is pressing on my pressure points and my low back. He calls the doula and he is like. “This is it. She is in labor. This is happening.” And she was like, “Okay. Well, talk to me. What is happening?” And he is now kind of frantic like, “No, no. There is no time for me to tell you what is happening. She is in labor.”And so he quickly says, “She is in the bath. It is as hot as we can get it. I am pressing on her back and if you don't come here, we are going to the hospital.” Keep in mind, I was pregnant during COVID, so our doula couldn't come with us to the hospital. She could only be with us at home.Julie: Oh man.Meagan: Yeah, aww. Oh no.Lindsay: So she gets to the house and it's now like 10:00ish. She takes over for my husband, pressing on my low back and she is like, “Okay. You've got this.” She is like, “You are doing so great, Linds.” She's asking me how I am feeling. She's asking me about the sensation and I am like, “It is in my back, but I do get relief when you are pressing on the pressure points. It is just that it's now in my back and my hips.” I could just feel everything moving down.And so at 11:00, and an hour where I am in this bathwater, she's like, “Okay. Let's get you out and let's make a plan on what we are going to do.” We knew I had to transfer to hospital because I didn't feel comfortable birthing a baby without medical support in my home. And so we are standing in my living room, slowly getting me dressed. She transitions to doing these exercises where every contraction, I press up against the wall with loose knees and she lifts my belly up as I lean over her. The whole intention was just ensuring that we were working with my body and baby to get my baby in the best position.Meagan: Yeah, like an abdominal lift.Lindsay: I think that's what it's called. Don't quote me on that, but I am going to guess.Meagan: Yeah, that's awesome. It's intense too, for you.Lindsay: Super intense, but we are in such a good rhythm. We are like, “Now we have a plan for every contraction.” I have the rhythm. I'm feeling really good. She calls the midwives and she's like, “Okay. Lindsay's contractions are two minutes apart and consistently a minute long,” and the midwife was like, “Meet me at the hospital now.” I had been in labor for an hour and a half and I knew things were moving quickly.And so we hang up in my doula was like, “Listen. You are in charge here. We will go to the hospital when you want to go to the hospital. 30 minutes, an hour, we get there when we get there. So what feels good for you?” Again, it was just that validation of feeling a part of what was happening and feeling like I was steering the ship. We decided that my husband was going to pack the car and in the next 30-ish minutes to an hour, I would be at the hospital. She was like, “Let's just continue to focus on this really good rhythm.” So at 11:15, I looked to her and I was like, “I am in transition.” She's like, “Okay. Tell me what you are feeling. I was like, “I am shaking. My contractions are back-to-back. I am cold and hot at the exact same time. I'm sweating from pores I didn't even know existed.” She was like, “Yep. You're definitely in transition,” and very, very calm.Meagan: Positive things, positive things.Lindsay: Positive things, yeah. She was like, “We should probably get you into the car.” Just as we were getting downstairs, I had that little pause in contractions and she was like, “Okay. So when you get to the hospital–” reminding me of all of the things to ask for like how many centimeters dilated I am, what station I am at, so on and so forth. And so I am feeling good about going and we are kind of waiting. I was still like, “Let's have one more contraction, and then get me in the car and we will go straight to the hospital. So that's the plan.”There was like a little break. I am enjoying the relief and all of a sudden, there was a contraction. I get on the wall and she lifts my belly. I am leaning over her and my husband, and just as she lifts my belly, baby drops and I used some very foul language directing everybody to get their hands off of me. My doula drops to the floor. She just looks up and she is like, “Are you okay?” “I think so.” She was like, “Okay. Are we doing this here or are you going to the hospital? We need to go to hospital now.”So she helps me out to the car, which, I am sure at 11:30p.m. was quite the sight for any of my neighbors because she is behind me but also cautiously ready to drop to the ground at any second. My husband is now panicked in the car honking the horn like, “We need to go!” So I get in the car– quickest ride I have ever had to our hospital. We pull into the labor and delivery ward, do the COVID screen and get in. I go in first, but my husband hast to stay back and wait. And so I go into the first section of the labor and delivery ward and my midwife does my check. She is kind of scolding me like, “You said you would be here in 30 minutes to under an hour and it has been an hour.” I am just calm, cool and collected like, “How many centimeters am I dilated?” I am prepped for an 8. She was like, “All right. So you're 10 centimeters dilated. The next step is to break your water and push the baby out.” So she tells me to go to the end of the hall to labor and delivery room and she was like, “I'm going to go get your husband because it is go time.” We get into the room and everything stopped. My contractions were nonexistent. My energy was different. I no longer felt in the zone. I felt edgy and amped up a little bit. I was totally experiencing fight or flight. And so they were like, “Okay.” We get my doula on the iPad. She is FaceTimed in now. I am excited and nervous, but my body has now totally stopped.That's where the doubt starts to creep and like, “I don't know if I can do this.” All of the literature about feeling not comfortable in your space and all of that, I am like, “I just don't know. I am out of my labor zone.” So they break my water and I feel the pressure of the baby bearing down. I just keep asking, “So when do I start pushing?” I am like, “There are not really any contractions.” This is a very different feeling now. They were like, “Oh, you will feel it. On your next contraction, if you feel the urge to push, you can absolutely bear down.”And so about an hour and a half into being at the hospital, I finally start having consistent contractions again. Because I am a VBAC, I have consistent fetal monitoring. The baby is not in distress and my heart rate is great, so we just carry on. My contractions now are existent but just noneffective. And so between every fourth contraction, my midwives and my doula were getting me into a different position to try to get this baby out. Within the first push they were like, “The baby is right there,” and I just wasn't able to push.I am pushing and my midwife is directing me, so now she is inside me pressing down like, “Push here.” She is like, “You are pushing really effectively,” and so it becomes a little bit of this puzzle. I am fully dilated. My waters are broken. I do have contractions and we are trying different positions, but this baby is just not coming.And so it's about two hours in. I am getting pretty tired because it's the middle of the night and feeling super defeated. The same narrative of, “You can't do this,” is echoed by a member of the care team. At this point, I am like, “Get this baby out of me.” Like, “We are going to need some medical intervention for this baby to arrive Earthside. I cannot do this anymore.”Meagan: Aww yeah. Just total doubt.Lindsay: Total doubt despite being very prepared and having such a strong voice. My husband was like, “Linds, you can do this. You have worked so hard for this.” He was like, “I can literally see the baby. You've got this. It's okay. You can do this.” And then there was a student midwife and a very new midwife– I think she had graduated a year or six months prior– and they were incredibly encouraging. They were like, “Lindsay, we are working with you. You've got this, girl. You've got this.” Every contraction cheering me on, so the energy was so positive, but it was just like, the combination of myself and another provider that lacked confidence that really took the scheme out of the labor.And so now it's 4:00 in the morning, four hours into pushing and they say, “We are going to bring an OB consult.” I am pretty distraught at this point. I have no medication. I am really leaned in to like, “I am going to do this naturally one way or another.” My husband is advocating for me and such a big support system. I have two relatively junior midwives who are like, “You are doing this.” We decide despite all that that we are going to call in an OB consult. By chance, it was one of my most favorite OBGYNs on call that night. She was there to do another emergency C-section.And so she walked in and we went over the chart. She was like, “Man.” She had done my consult for if I was a VBAC candidate, and so she was like, “Linds, you can do this.” She was like, “You are so close.” She said, “Here's the thing. I have another emergency C-section. You are not in distress. Your baby is not in distress. You're both doing well, so while I do this other C-section, your job is to lay on your side with the peanut ball, knees together for the 30-45 minutes it takes me to do my other C-section. I will come back and if you are not progressing and you are still struggling to push out this baby, then we will do a C-section.”And so I felt at that point, “If it goes to a C-section, I am okay with that. I feel like I have really done everything in my power.” Pushing for that long was physically exhausting and not rewarding. So I'm like, “That's cool. I'll lay on my side on the peanut ball as uncomfortable as it is. I will bear down and it's going to be what it's going to be.”And so she leaves the room. I am on my side and because my midwife had kept checking they were like, “The baby is not OP. It just keeps rotating from left to right.” It was my body. I just wasn't working in the right position to have the baby tuck under my pubic bone and out.When the OBGYN checked me she was like, “Absolutely. This baby just keeps rotating right to left,  and so we just need to get it in the best birthing position. Let's have you lay on this side as a last ditch effort.” She walks out and comes back in 45 minutes later and she is like, “Oh my god. We're about to have this baby. Like right now, we are about to have this baby.” She is in full scrubs and walks back out of the delivery room. At this point, I am like, “Where is she going? I need her in here.”Meagan: You're like, “Wait, I thought you said we were going to have this baby.”Lindsay: Yeah. Yeah.Meagan: “And you leave?!”Lindsay: Yeah. I'm like, “Am I doing this solo? What's happening here?” My midwives laugh and they're like, “No, no. She just has to release the OR team because everyone is on standby to see if they are doing a section on me.” And so she walks in 30 seconds later and after about four pushes, my sweet little baby girl was born.Meagan: Aww. That is quite, I mean, gosh. That is quite the journey during the pushing stage. A lot of people would have totally been told like, “You have no option. You are going to a C-section,” after it had been just a couple of hours of pushing. They kept giving you more time and I just think it is awesome. I mean, it is really awesome that you guys had those providers in there to advocate for you.Overcoming DoubtBut I wanted to talk a little bit about that doubt that you talked about was creeping in. It doesn't always just creep in at the end. It can creep in during all periods of labor and even before labor begins. I think it's awesome that you had your team there. I mean, your husband obviously is amazing and was like, “You have worked so hard for this. You can do this.” He built you up, but what's a little piece of advice that you would give to our listeners? Because I think that is something that happens all the time. It happened for me. I mean, I think everyone who has heard my story– I think I shared it. I was throwing a fit in the driveway because my water broke and it triggered me. It was like, “No, it's not going to happen.” I just had this total doubt. What would you say really, really helped you? Do you think it was your team? What did you do physically and mentally to just be like, “Okay, yes,” and snap back into it, water splashed back into your face?Lindsay: It was a combination of having the toolbox and building my own toolbox. So doing the reading, and The VBAC Link was on every morning and every night. I consumed podcasts and good news stories like they were liquid gold. I read the books. If someone made a suggestion, I did it blindly, and so I felt like the toolbox of confidence and support was built and that was me. That wasn't anyone else. That was me wanting to know, wanting to be educated, and wanting to feel empowered and confident going into labor. And then that married with building the team that I knew would support me so that when I had a question and labor, when something came up, I was able to not only go into my toolbox, but also to my support team and know that they had my back.To your point, when that doubt creeped in it didn't creep in on its own. There was an external voice in the room that supported that. It was the moment of my husband saying, “You can do this.” But I was like, “Yeah. He is right. I can do this.” And also, “I don't have to listen to her.” I can listen to everyone else in the room that is validating me, supporting me, and believes in me. And so hat was my two-prong approach to building up my confidence and empowerment. If something doesn't feel right, just continue to ask and lean into that until it feels like you've been heard and it feels like you understand what's happening.Meagan: Yes. I love that. Such great tips because it does. It really does happen and yeah. Like you said, it didn't just happen. It was placed there, and then it got worse. So I love that so, so much. Thank you so much for sharing your story. I loved it. I am so proud of you and I'm so happy that you were able to have your doula there for a little while and all of that. These COVID births, man. They are all so interesting to hear how they went down. But we are so grateful that you had your team. Julie, is there anything you want to add or anything?Julie: Nope. I think that sounds great. It's a great story. I love all of the preparation that you did. I was kind of like that too with my first VBAC. I just did everything. Somebody told me about a resource, I sucked it all up. I went to all of the birthing groups. I soaked in of all of the stories, just all of it. I absolutely love that. I think it's so important.Meagan: Mhmm.Lindsay: My close network of moms that had C-sections either hadn't had a VBAC yet, weren't interested in doing a VBAC, or had just gone straight to a repeat section. So I felt like my personal network was really limited in terms of the resources and questions that I could ask and lean on. And so I just turned on to an online community. So The VBAC Link Community being such a good example. If I don't have someone to ask, where can I find that information from other real-life humans, not necessarily just a book right?So yeah. So that's kind of where I landed and it's so funny because I left the hospital fairly quickly. So I gave birth at 6:13 and I was home by two. And so it was partially due to Covid and partially due to the natural delivery, like let's get her back home and comfortable and that night, my Julie came over to check in and see how we were doing and meet our little baby and the first thing I said was, I can't wait to do it again. Do you know? Our family isn't complete yet and yeah, I can't wait to do it again. And so July 31, we are doing it again.Meagan: No! This year?Lindsay: Yeah. This year.Meagan: Oh my gosh. That's so awesome.Julie: Yay.Meagan: Oh, congratulations. That is so awesome. So, so awesome.Julie: Yeah.Lindsay: Yeah. It's a very similar approach, you know? I went in and went with the midwife team that supports me that I felt heard by and that I feel like the most comfortable with in our monthly appointments. I reached out to my doula right away and she typically doesn't take summer clients, but I snuck in there which was awesome. And yeah. We are just doing everything again that we can. We have the confidence of success, of course, in our back pocket, but it is the same approach. Control what you can control.Meagan: Mhmm. Yeah.Julie: Yeah.Meagan: Oh, I love it. Well, thank you so much for sharing your story and we really, really do appreciate you.Lindsay: Thank you.ClosingInterested in sharing your VBAC story on the podcast? Submit your story at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Julie and Meagan's bios, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link. Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Our special guest today is Shayla from Hey Shayla, a content creator who has gained a loyal following on Instagram and YouTube for her relatable, honest, and hilarious motherhood content. If you aren't following her already, you definitely should be, because as Shayla says, child development is her jam and she actually likes nerding out and reading about it (she'll give you the cliff notes so you don't have to)! Full disclosure, Shayla is one of our amazing ambassadors for Expecting and Empowered and we've had the honor of getting to know her over the past couple of years. We enjoy her so much, and we're sure you will too after hearing the valuable advice, tips, and stories and lessons that she shares in this episode! As always, we want to empower you with the tools and information to help you figure out what it is that you want during childbirth, and to help provide you with more clarity in advocating for yourself during this experience, which is why we think that you'll get so much from this conversation! If you've enjoyed this episode and what Shayla shares here, we would be so honored if you shared it and tagged us, @expectingandempowered and @heyshayla on Instagram so that we can see it! We'd also be so grateful if you would rate and review our podcast in your favorite podcast app, because that's the best way for a new podcast to get more people to listen. MEET Shayla: https://www.instagram.com/heyshayla/ Links & Resources:Shayla's Website, Instagram & FacebookHer YouTube Channel & Podcast HypnoBirthing Positive Natural Birth Story! FAST! (Video)Expecting & Empowered's Hypnobabies Store Ina May's Guide to Childbirth: Updated With New Material by Ina May Gaskin  The First Forty Days: The Essential Art of Nourishing the New Mother  by Heng Ou  Expecting and Empowered Prepping for Labor + Deliver Course - https://www.expectingandempowered.com/fitness-guides/labor-and-delivery-course Expecting and Empowered on App: Apple Store - https://apps.apple.com/us/app/expecting-and-empowered/id1594936110Expecting and Empowered App: Google Play Store - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.expectingandempowered.expectingandempowered Expecting and Empowered Website: www.expectingandempowered.comExpecting and Empowered Instagram: http://instagram.com/expectingandempowered

Do you have enough schoolbi???? Who would you interview? I'm addicted to Nitris...nitrous....you get it. Ina May Gaskin: the barefoot contessa Cool stuff, slick stuff, neat stuff. Turf maintainer... vagina looker. --- Send in a voice message: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/vividapplejuice/message Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/vividapplejuice/support

In today's episode I will lead you through a mindful reflection back to the womb and have a conversation with Brooke Thomas about pregnancy. -MM **Brooke's Resources: Book—“Ina May's Guide to Childbirth” by Ina May Gaskin; Song—“Into the Light” by Emorie. --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/mindfulmotherhood/support

Angela Dexter joins us today on the podcast and gives us such wisdom and insight to her struggles with post-partum anxiety. As a first time mother she loved reading and researching about pregnancy and delivery and felt very prepared when it came to welcome her daughter into the world. However, that is where the her confidence ended and the train wreak started. Angela's daughter had some initial health concerns that contributed to increased fussiness and she felt very unsupported by her pediatrician. She felt she was just being dictated to about what she was supposed to be doing with her daughter. Angela talks about realizing she needed to find a pediatrician that would work with her, listen, and have a conversation.  Being your and your children's advocate is so important. Angela talks to us about learning someone just holding her baby was not helpful, but asking people to help in different ways such a providing a meal or mowing her lawn was what provided her with the help that she truly needed. She also walks us through other resources that she found helpful to help control her anxiety and set her on a path towards health. Angela's passion is to help educate first time mothers about what information is out there and empower them to make informed decision and not just go with the standard because that is what the are being told to follow. Any mom getting ready to have their first baby needs to hear Angela's story and be encouraged about trusting your mom gut. LIKE and SHARE this episode with all of your pregnant mom friends and young first time mommas. Ways to Find AngelaInstagram: @enjoylifewithme.angela Website: www.enjoylifewithme.comEmail - enjoylifewithme.eliza@gmail.com Angela's BioI have been married for almost 8 years to my best friend and am a mom of 2.  I was previously a teacher who found a love for pregnancy, birth, and postpartum education during my own journey.  I have always been a researcher so when I started reading while pregnant with my first I had my eyes opened to new concepts that society wasn't telling me.  I am a firm believer of "informed decision is the best decision"Favorite Resources:Anything by Ina May Gaskin & Jack Newmanhttps://evidencebasedbirth.comEmbrace, Live, ThriveFB: @embracelivethrive Instagram: @embracelivethrive Website: www.embracelivethrive.com

Holly's period, fertility, pregnancy, birth & postpartum. Mentioned in this episode: Love Your Labour: https://webinar.loveyourlabour.com/lyl-sales-page34360749 Labor Prep Steaming Blog: https://rosebudwellness.com/2020/03/22/labor-prep-yoni-steaming/ Ina May Gaskin's Books: https://www.amazon.com/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Gaskin-ebook/dp/B003QHXLKA https://www.amazon.com/Spiritual-Midwifery-Ina-May-Gaskin-ebook/dp/B0026IUOFU/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=spiritual+midwifery&qid=1621821321&s=digital-text&sr=1-1 --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/wombwisdom/message

Not long ago, I attended a birth as a doula. Shortly after the baby was born, I heard the doctor quietly say, “that was the most beautiful thing I have ever seen.” I was touched by her heartfelt words. I was surprised to hear them knowing that she must have witnessed quite a few births. I wish I had thought to ask her to explain her thoughts about it. As I have pondered her comment, I thought of these words by Ina May Gaskin in Spiritual Midwifery: “[This book] is spiritual because it is concerned with the sacrament of birth – the passage of a new soul into this plane of existence. This knowledge that each and every childbirth is a spiritual experience has been forgotten by too many people in the world today”. How wonderful that people from many different walks of life see birth as a sacred, transformative life changing event. The definition of sacrament does refer to different rituals depending on the religion. In the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints the Sacrament refers to an ordinance held weekly to commemorate the Savior's teachings of the Last Supper. However, sacrament is also defined as something consecrated, possessing sacred character or mysterious significance; a sign, token or symbol; an oath or solemn pledge. We go deeper into how birth is like a sacrament in this episode. Find the show notes at thegiftofgivinglife.com And sign up for our newsletter to get access to our online class! You can buy your copy of The Gift of Giving Life on Amazon.

Today I'm sharing my top 3 books to read while pregnant I do not recommend What to Expect When You're Expecting or other mainstream resources on pregnancy and reproductive health Mainstream maternity education or reproductive health education tends to err on side of very medical, very fear-based and often fairly inaccurate information I do suggest reading very specific things by some brilliant leaders in the space Also opening your mind up to the experience of other people who have been pregnant, who have tried to get pregnant and who have given birth in many ways. https://www.amazon.ca/Killing-Black-Body-Reproduction-Meaning/dp/0679758690/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=killing+the+black+body&qid=1617225010&sr=8-1 (#1 Start with Killing the Black Body by Dorothy E. Roberts) This podcast is called an ethical exploration of parenthood so we need to talk about racism right at the beginning Killing the Black Body is something that will help you understand the immense privilege you have as a white person, and the far reaching effects of racism in the world of reproductive health and pregnancy https://www.amazon.ca/Ina-Mays-Guide-Childbirth-Material/dp/0553381156/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2FMP6FDXQLVHA&dchild=1&keywords=ina+may+gaskin+a+guide+to+childbirth&qid=1617224941&sprefix=ina+may+gas%2Caps%2C220&sr=8-1 (#2 Ina May Gaskin's Guide to Childbirth) A cult classic if you will, amongst birth workers and natural birth movement followers The stories that are shared in this book are inspirational and full of hope We do not have to accept the status quo cascade of interventions leading to a surgical birth This is showing us that there is another path; that there are more options available The thing that I find disappointing about this book is that it's very hard to replicate the environment that the book promotes There are some really practical, tactical, strategic things that you will have to do in preparation to have an experience similar to that.  If we're going to give birth in a hospital, we are already stepping outside of our environment and into someone else's I come in at the middle ground, I want you to have a great birth experience in the hospital or at home https://www.amazon.ca/Birth-Partner-5th-Childbirth-Companions/dp/1558329102/ref=sr_1_1?crid=2L77XX872U15B&dchild=1&keywords=the+birth+partner&qid=1617224882&sprefix=the+birth+partner%2Caps%2C201&sr=8-1 (#3 Birth Partner by Penny Simkin) The best resource for birthing partners: the person who will be the primary support for the person giving birth It's an encyclopedia of all the things you need to know  There is a special focus on pain, coping with pain, and the unique experience of pregnancy and birth among survivors of traumatic abuse and sexual assault This book will help YOU understand how to deal with YOUR pain Pain and suffering looks different for everyone It's not a moral issue, something we have to endure or not endure Pain is an intimate issue, which is why I don't spend very much time speaking about pain management in general - however, I am very knowledgeable about pain and it's management so don't be afraid to ask me about it These are my favourite books! Let me know what your favourite are by sending me an email at emily@thegoodbirthco.com Final note: when you are reading about pregnancy and birth, don't feel like you have to finish the book. Just pick and choose what you need! Pain Scale mentioned: Clarifying Your Feelings About Pain and Medications in Childbirth by Penny Simkin https://birthtools.org/birthtools/files/BirthToolFiles/FILENAME/000000000006/MOC-CnC-PainMgmtPreferenceScale-Simpkin.pdf How to prepare for the pregnancy of your dreams is a masterclass revealing the 4 easy steps to take you from stressed about what to expect to excited for what's about to happen. Learn the simple steps to creating the intentional + empowered pregnancy you've always dreamed of so...

On any purpose filled path there are beautiful highs and scary lows - in today's conversation we go there. (TW) In this episode, Karsyn Dupree - a mama, artist and wellness enthusiast - and I share personal stories about finding our way through disordered eating and mental health challenges including anorexia and panic disorder.  I hope you'll listen with an ear for healing. There's an opportunity in this conversation to dig deep into the soul and face the shadow, touching the darkest parts of ourselves. Karsyn and I share how we each came through the fire to move closer to our true purpose.  Karsyn's world includes a variety of spiritually connected passions. She's a multi-hyphenate: a blogger, sharing her home and lifestyle, she's presently training to become a birth doula (which I was so interested in diving into), and she's a gifted artist - making music with her husband. Most recently, she embarked on a new venture - launching the podcast “Conscious As A Mother”. You can find out more about Karsyn and her work at karsynkdupree.com. Follow Karsyn on instagram at @karsynkdupree and her podcast at @consciousasamother. Find more to love and join our community at ouiwegirl.com. Where to find me: ouiwegirl.com @ouiwegirl Follow the show instagram page: @yourwoowoobff This show is produced, mixed, recorded and additional music by T'Ben Alleman Opening and closing music: Pet Fangs Resources: Karsyn's Pod: Conscious As A Mother, CAAM Episode on Body Image, Intuitive Eating & Intuitive Movement, Birth Arts International Birth Doula Training, Ina May Gaskin's book Guide To Childbirth. 

In this episode, Melissa speaks with Brittani Chilson, mother of four and birth doula from Glenwood Springs, Colorado.  Brittani begins by sharing about her life as a stay-at-home mom and about her children's alternative education.  Next, she recounts her journey to become a doula, which began during her first pregnancy.  As the episode progresses, these two discuss everything from the mom-doula relationship, to instincts and rituals during labor, to the importance of postpartum planning during the prenatal period.The Book Blurb in this episode, read by Brittany, is from Ina May's Guide to Childbirth by midwife and birth educator, Ina May Gaskin.  Learn more about Ina May and her work as a midwife and spokeswoman for improving birth culture by visiting https://inamay.com/.One other noteworthy mention is Melissa's reference to a previous Momversation episode, Sacred Spaces: Observing and Attending Birth with Tiana Johnson.

This week I had the honor of talking with a personal hero of mine, midwife Marylou Singleton. Having found feminism at a very early age, Marylou set out on the path of supporting women and families. She has an eclectic and radical background, from living with and training under Ina May Gaskin, being licensed to now unlicensed, and running an alternative community clinic, Marylou possesses a wisdom of the elders that needs to be heard. We dive into the pitfalls of licensing, doulas, the dangers of ultrasound, and how to build community in our own backyards.