Podcasts about spiritual midwifery

In this special episode, Kristin, host of Ask the Doulas podcast and founder of Gold Coast Doulas,  gives tips on building your supportive birth team. Krisin and Meagan talk specifics on HOW to switch providers if you're feeling the push to do so.Once we have our dream team, we're good and don't have to do any more work, right? Nope! We keep educating and preparing ourselves. That's the way to truly get the most out of that dream team. Kristin's book ‘Supported: Your Guide to Birth and Baby' is a one-stop shop where you can get all of the education you need for pregnancy, birth, and postpartum. Her advice is so valuable for VBAC moms and birth workers, too!Supported: Your Guide to Birth and BabyAsk the Doulas PodcastNeeded WebsiteHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull Transcript under Episode Details Meagan: Hello. Hello. We have a special episode for you today. We have my friend, Kristin, who is actually the owner of Ask the Doulas Podcast on with us today. She is going to be talking about establishing our birth team and the importance of it. We're going to talk a little bit more about what to expect when we might not find a provider that's supportive and how to navigate it. She's going to talk more about her book and so many things. You guys, I'm really excited. Kristin is a woman who has always had a passion for supporting other women both personally and professionally. In college, Kristin served on the executive committee of her sorority and organized events on campus related to breast cancer and other women's issues. After the birth of her daughter in 2011, a new passion awoke within her. Kristin began reading and studying birth from all perspectives, philosophies, and medical approaches. She joined organizations like The Healthy Kent Breastfeeding Collation and used her event coordinating skills to build and promote the organization and create community awareness. You guys, she has done so many incredible things. Kristin's research has led her to learn more about doulas, and in 2012, she hired doulas herself for the support of her second birth. The level of compassionate care and comfort that she received from her doulas ignited a spark within her and led her down the path of becoming a doula herself. And man, can I connect to this because this is exactly what happened to me. When you guys have a doula who inspires you and touches you and motivates you the way it sounds like Kristin did and I did, even though my doula wasn't a hired doula, she was just a nurse that was a doula for the time being, it does something to you. She earned the certification and became teaching sacred pregnancy classes in 2013. But as you'll see, Kristin is a firm believer in achieving the highest level of education available when providing a service. Shortly after, she earned the following credentials-- you guys, are you ready for this? She's amazing. Oh my gosh. Certified Sacred Doula in 2014. She is a Certified Elite Labor through ProDoula. She is the Elite Postpartum and Infant Care Doula through ProDoula. She's trained in Spinning Babies, Newborn Specialist, Mother Ship, Certified Health Service Provider, certified in VBAC. She is certified in transformational birth and a birth coach for the Birth Coach Method. She is a certified pregnancy and infant loss advocate and certified gift registry expert through Be Her Village, who we will talk about. We both love them so much.She is also an author of a book which we will be sharing more about. It's called Supported: Your Guide to Birth and Baby. So without further ado, we are actually going to be skipping a review today and an educational topic because this is such a great episode to be educated and learn more about what Kristin is offering in her community. Okay, my love. Hello. Kristin: Hello.Meagan: We're officially getting going talking about this amazing topic. Tell me what you think about this. I think sometimes people want to assemble this dream team, but they let finances or even partners or other opinions get in the way.Kristin: Yes. Partner comfort level, especially with VBACs is key, or with clients of mine who want their dream is to have a home birth and their partner isn't supportive, so then they say, "Oh, it'll be with the next baby if everything goes well in the hospital." But then if they're a complication, they might risk out of the option of home. I think as consumers, we don't fully appreciate the ability to choose all of our birth and baby team. We can change providers. I switched providers with my first pregnancy early on because I didn't feel like that particular OB was on board with my plans to have an unmedicated hospital birth. I ended up switching to Certified Nurse Midwives and completely changed practices, completely changed hospitals in fact. It's a lot. Meagan: Yeah.Kristin: But it was worth it. And I had the time where it was easier to switch, but I've had clients switch very late in pregnancy. It was harder to find the right office to accept them, but with VBACs, it is crucial to have not just a VBAC-tolerant provider, but someone who is fully on board with your unique desires because we are all individuals.Meagan: Yes. I love that you said your unique desires. Everybody is different. I think it's really important to tell these providers what your desires are. We have a list of questions that we give people in our course and, of course, on the podcast. You can go down that list and check and be like, "Okay, this provider seems pretty supportive," but you guys have to tailor your questions and your provider. You have to tailor it to what your individual unique circumstances and desires are because everyone's is different. I would love to know. You said, I was realizing that this wasn't the right place. What kind of things were you hearing or being told or feeling when you were realizing that maybe your first provider wasn't going to be as supportive and in line with your unique decisions?Kristin: Just when I was talking about my wishes, I could tell that that particular provider liked structure and patience to get that epidural, and so once I started talking about movement, delivering in different positions and some of the things I had researched-- I hadn't yet taken a childbirth class because it was early in pregnancy, but I had done a fair bit of research before knowing what a doula was. I didn't hire doulas until my second. But I could just tell in that gut feeling which I rely on. Again, we're all unique. And yes, I do research, but I make decisions on am I comfortable spending my entire pregnancy with someone who can tolerate me and will say, "Okay"? But I could tell it didn't light her up. So once I found a practice where my nurse-midwife spent time with me, I had longer appointments, I could ask questions, and she was 100% on board with me, and then I was able to meet the other midwives and the OBs who oversaw them throughout the remainder of my pregnancy. I felt very cared for. And again, we are consumers. Whether your insurance pays for everything or you're paying for part of it, you don't get a do-over of your birth, and so it is so important, especially with that first birth to get the care team that aligns with you. That could be everything from a Webster-certified chiropractor, a physical therapist, a mental health therapist to deal with any anxieties that may come up with having a VBAC and getting a lot of fear-filled advice from friends and family members. I find that again, my clients are all unique individuals, and my students in Becoming a Mother Course, and now the readers in my book, have different goals, so I want them to choose the best plan for them. I love that you have worksheets and templates, but knowing that every situation is different whether it's a home birth, a trial of labor, or a hospital birth, that setting is different and the type of provider whether it's a nurse-midwife or an OB practice, how likely is the OB that is very VBAC-supportive going to be attending your birth? Are there 12 providers or are there only 4? And so there's just so many things to factor in when deciding what is important to you.Meagan: Yeah. That point that you just brought up, are there 12 providers? Are there only 4? Does your provider guarantee that they'll be there? These are things that I think a lot of people may not be aware of that because they found their provider. They're feeling good about their provider. They're jiving. They're having the feels, but then they may not be the ones to be there, so there are 11 other options. It feels overwhelming to be like, "Wait, wait. Do I interview all 11?" Yeah, guys. Yeah. You set up visits. It's okay. Go and see if you can meet with those. Make sure that that full team is aligned. It is a lot. That's a lot to take on, but it's okay to rotate and say, "Hey, I saw Dr. Jack last time. I'd like to see Dr. Joe this time," or whatever it may be. Really, really dive in, find out more about your provider's team if they have a team, and make sure that they align with your unique decisions and desires.Kristin: Absolutely. And that goes for doulas as well.Meagan: Oh, yeah.Kristin: So for VBAC clients, I, over the last couple of years, I do all of the matchmaking, I like to call it, between client and the birth doulas and postpartum doulas on my team, in fact. I like to find out what they're looking for. If they are attempting a VBAC, then many times, they're telling me they want a VBAC-certified doula. I have doulas that have gone through your program and are certified through you and other different VBAC trainings. They're not just wanting VBAC experience like in my early days of having Gold Coast Doulas. Now, they're wanting that certification because they know that information is being updated as things change. And there's more evidence for VBACs. They also want more than just, "Oh, I've attended four VBACs." They want the education behind it. So I think that is crucial. I'm not going to match, unless there's no one else available on my team, a client with someone who is not certified as a VBAC doula.Meagan: Yeah, I do the same thing with my group here where they're like, "This is really important to me. I want this specific type of doula." Some of my doulas have taken The VBAC Link course. And so I'm like, "Yep, this would be who I would suggest." But I also want to point out that even if you assemble your dream team doula, and they've got all the education and information on VBAC, and they're up to date, I want to just point out that it doesn't mean that you shouldn't inform yourself that you shouldn't get the information because sometimes I feel like it's easy to want to just hire your provider or your doula or your person and let them who know VBAC kind of help and guide you. But it is really important. You're doing yourself a disservice if you personally do not learn more about VBAC and your options as well and rely only on your provider or your doula.Kristin: 100%. The doula, I mean, unless you're paying her for it, will not be attending every one of your prenatal visits during pregnancy. The education that you have to make informed questions and decisions surrounding your birth plan or birth preference sheet, so those conversations are critical. The more information you have as a patient, the better. And as we all know, unless you're having a home birth, your visits are short even with a nurse-midwife. And so it's important to have those questions and to have time to really express concerns. Or if you're finding that that practice or that provider is not in line with your plans, then you can look at other options. And the hospital-- are VBACs even allowed at the hospital that you plan to deliver at? Are they going to induce? What are the Cesarean rates? And looking at all of the different options, and if you need to consider NICUs, that's always a factor in hospital selection as well.Meagan: Yeah, I'm going to kind of go back to where we were in the beginning where you realized based after your feelings and other things that this provider was not the right provider for you, you then changed to CNMs and had a much better experience. Can you discuss your process of that change? How did you change? Did you find the CNMs, have them request your information from the OB? Did you do a formal breakup with your OB? What suggestions would you give to someone who is wanting to do that? I know that sometimes, you were talking about it, in the end, it's a little harder to find, so that's why we stress so importantly to find your provider from the beginning. But we know that sometimes things change. So can you kind of talk about that process in then assembling that dream and getting the steps to get to that dream team?Kristin: Yes. So for me, I had asked friends about which providers they had worked with. So the original OB, a friend of mine, it was her doctor, and she had a great experience. I just wasn't feeling it. She had a student. We have teaching hospitals in my area, so there was a student in the room. I wasn't feeling like she was 100% on board. I could tell that she was very medically driven. I wanted essentially a home birth in a hospital. So I talked to more friends and did research online, and a friend of mine had used this particular practice. I ended up going with the midwife that delivered her three children, and it worked out beautifully because it was early in pregnancy. That practice had openings. It took me a while because I was changing hospitals and practices completely. My insurance, luckily, covered all of the options. But that's another thing to look into. Does your insurance cover the hospital where the provider you want to switch to delivers that if it is a hospital birth? Of course, you can VBAC at home in certain states. So just looking at all of the factors that would come into play. So for me, it was dealing with the paperwork of switching out of that practice, getting admitted, and going to that initial get-to-know-you visit with a nurse and doing my labs before I got to meet with the midwife that I had wanted to work with. And so it took a bit. I mean, no one likes to deal with the paperwork and the phone calls it takes, but your health is so important and especially again, for VBACs.Meagan: Yeah. So you essentially did all the paperwork and the transfer yourself.Kristin: Yes.Meagan: Okay.Kristin: I made all the phone calls, dealt with insurance and made sure that the initial visit was paid for along with the nurse visit, and then that insurance was comfortable with me.Meagan: Yeah. Awesome. Yeah, I did, when I switched, because I switched it 24 weeks, my midwife just faxed a request to my OB office. It took them a while to send it. We had to ask five times which I think probably would have been faster if I, like you, made the phone calls and did all the things, but I was like in this weird, vulnerable spot of like, I don't want to go back there.Kristin: Right. You don't want to deal with it.Meagan: Yeah, I don't want to deal with it.Kristin: Even just talking to the front desk.Meagan: Yeah, yeah. So we waited for it and they eventually got it. But I think that that's important to note. You guys can make the calls too. You can call and say, "Hey, I'd like to request my records to be printed out or to be sent to this place." Kristin: Yes, and that's what I did. Because otherwise it's six weeks oftentimes or you have to keep calling. They get lost. so I just handled it. But it can be challenging. And as doulas and certainly VBAC doulas, we know the providers who would be not only tolerant but supportive of VBAC. So we get those questions frequently from potential clients and clients of, am I at the right place? And of course, we support whoever our clients choose to have care from. But there's also, if asked, I will tell them about the practice and my own experience as a doula or the agency's experience. And again, in those large practices, there might be four who are so VBAC-supportive. They love it, but then there might be some physicians who are not as comfortable. They feel that a surgical birth might be the better route to go, ad so there's that. So what I like to do as a VBAC doula is to have my clients talk to their provider. Again, go over a birth plan or birth preference sheet and have them sign off on it. That way, if they don't attend the birth, then the other physicians know that this was approved. It's not just a birth plan that is thrown out there, but it has been discussed. It doesn't work all the time, but it has been helpful for my clients no matter if they're a VBAC client or this is their first baby, and again, they have certain goals that they want to achieve like potentially avoiding an induction unless medically necessary.Meagan: Oh my gosh. So I'm just going to re-touch on that, you guys, because that was really, really, really good advice and something I've actually never done or even thought about or suggested to my own doula practice clients. Get your birth preference sheet or birth plans everyone calls a difference. I call it a birth preference sheet, which is a list of all your preferences that you desire. Go over that with your provider, and have them physically sign it. Physically sign it and date it showing that your provider went over it. And like she said, every provider may not be willing to do that, but I will say, if a provider is willing to do that, that says something to me.Kristin: It does. Yes.Meagan: Yeah. Super powerful. Oh, my gosh. Okay, nugget. Grab it, put it in your pocket, everybody. Sign your birth preference sheet so you can have it and keep that in your bag, so if you do have that random on-call doctor who may not even know you or not be so supportive, be like, "This has already been discussed. We were aware of this. My doctor has signed off." Also, you could maybe ask if your provider could make a copy of that and put it in your chart.Kristin: Right. Because yes, it's not just the one that they have on file, but it's also for the ones that you have, that copy that you're bringing and showing the nurse so the nurse and everyone is on the same page. Meagan: Love that. Kristin: And again, with teaching hospitals, you might have residents in and out. There can be some difficult conversations with VBAC and residents who have never seen a VBAC. We're not fully trained yet to support VBAC, and so they might be making suggestions while the provider is not in that check-in. So every state, again, every area is different. I just happen to be in an area with multiple teaching hospitals.Meagan: Same here. We have seen it where I think, I don't want to say this badly. The VBAC world is a world that can have a lot of negativities in it, negative things and big words like uterine rupture. We've got residents who may be coming in and may be training under a provider who has seen a uterine rupture or has maybe molded an opinion on VBAC and is projecting their opinion to that student. Whether or not they're consciously doing it or not, they're saying their opinion, and those opinions might morph that resident's opinion into negative for VBAC. You never know. And so they might be doing things or be more hesitant in areas that they don't need to be, but they are.Kristin: Yeah, it's such a good point. And as you mentioned, I mean, we don't know the traumas that our nurses and medical team, even home birth midwives, have experienced, and they carry that with them. And how can they not? Even as doulas, we witness, but we don't have the liability and the medical training to make it, but we are witnesses of trauma and have our own healing to do to be able to better move on and support the next client. So certainly keeping that in mind that they may have seen something that alters the way they practice.Meagan: Yeah.Kristin: It's not just fear of lawsuits.Meagan: It's really not. It's not. There's a provider here in Utah who is literally so scared of vaginal birth herself. She scheduled all of her Cesareans, even the very first one from the get. She never had trial of labor or TOL. She just doesn't. So can you imagine what her Cesarean rate may be? And she kind of reminds me of the provider you're talking about. She really likes it just so controlled. Come in, start Pitocin, and get the epidural. She likes those things, which we know can sometimes lead to those Cesareans. And so really also discussing with your provider, how do you feel about birth? Have you had babies? And then we have another OB who's like, "I work in the hospital, and I love the hospital, and I trust the hospital system, but I actually gave birth at home with all three of my babies," and so really getting to know your provider, I think, is so good. Okay, let's keep going on this topic of assembling your dream team of experts when planning for birth and baby. What other things would you suggest to our Women of Strength?Kristin: Yes. So as we know, birth is as physical as it is mental, and just the opposite, as mental as it is physical. So preparing with a childbirth class, a comprehensive class, even if you took one before, use the lens of your goal of attempting a VBAC, a trial of labor. And so for us, we happen to teach HypnoBirth at Gold Coast Doulas and that mind/body connection that HypnoBirthing or a gentle birth offers where it's more of using the visualization the way an athlete would in preparing for a marathon or a triathlon, you are using things to reduce fear. You're understanding all of your options. It's very partner involved. I think taking a comprehensive childbirth class, whichever meets your individual goals, is great. That childbirth instructor is a great person to add to your birth and baby team. And then moving your body. So taking a fitness class that is appropriate for pregnancy. So prenatal yoga, there are Barre classes for pregnancy. There are prenatal belly dancing classes, whatever it is. Meagan: Aqua aerobics.Kristin: Yeah, water aerobics are amazing. And so thinking about baby's position and helping labor to go on its own or be quicker. There's acupuncture, acupressure, the Webster-certified chiro for positioning or body balancing experts, so many different options. But I am a big fan of educating yourself and preparing because as you mentioned earlier, Meagan, a doula is not your end all, be all. Just because we have the information and the training, we can't think for you. We don't want to think for you. The more informed you are, the more likely you're going to feel like birth didn't happen to you this time around and you were a direct participant, even if you end up having a surgical birth again.Meagan: Yeah, yeah. Yes. Oh my gosh. So talking about courses, you guys, we have our VBAC course. This VBAC course goes into VBAC, the stats about VBAC, the history of VBAC, the history of Cesarean, the stats of Cesarean, the questions, finding the provider, a little bit more of the mental prep, and physical prep. But when it comes to a childirth education course like with the course that she has, they're on different levels. I actually suggest them both.Kristin: Yes, me too. Absolutely.Meagan: But it's so important to know the information that is in your course. I know you go even past preparing for birth and then birth and then postpartum. You go into all of it. We're going to talk more about it. But you guys, we as doulas, love getting information and we love sharing information. But like she said, we don't want to be the only one that knows the information in a team. When our clients come in, at least here in my group, when our clients come in and they are fully educated and we're like, yes. And then we can come in with our education and our experience and knowledge, you guys, it is a powerhouse team. It is a powerhouse team. We have clients who, when they take child birth education classes like yours, they are able to advocate more for themselves. They feel stronger to stand up and say, "Hey, thank you so much, but no thanks" or "Maybe later," when our clients who haven't had that childbirth education or just any information other than maybe what we're providing, which is great, but not enough in the full length of pregnancy, it's a little harder. We have to try to encourage those clients a little bit more because it's harder for them because they don't know everything. We're there to help guide them and help advocate for them and educate them, but it is very different.Kristin: It is. It's so different. And I feel like, again, partners, especially male partners, want to fix things. They don't want their love to feel any pain, and so they may have the fear of a VBAC. So taking a VBAC class course, having a VBAC doula, giving information is just as helpful, if not more for the partner and their comfort level and to have them fully get on board because they may be resisting and just going along for the ride, but if you can get them to be an active participant in education, then they're going to be able to help you. And sometimes in labor, we get to a point in transition where we can't fully speak for ourselves. But if our partner understands, is educated and on board, and if there's time to talk through the risks and benefits and alternatives with your doula, then yes. But sometimes decisions have to be made quickly, and so for that partner to be informed and educated is crucial.Meagan: So crucial. It's so powerful. My husband-- he was not so on board. He was like, "Whatever. I don't care. You can go to the courses. You can do these things."Kristin: And that's very typical.Meagan: It's very typical. And I did. I did do those things. When I said, "Hey, I'm going to birth out-of-hospital," and he was like, "No," I was like, "Well, sorry. I've done the education. I know this is really where my heart is pulling." We touched on this in the beginning how partners really can influence decision making. And in no way, shape or form am I trying to say partners are terrible or don't listen to your partner or anything like that. That's not the goal of what we're saying is have an educated partner. Know that you can assemble a birth team, like a provider, a chiropractor, a massage therapist, a doula, a PT, or whatever it may be, but don't forget about your partner. Your partner is a huge part of your team, and if they're not educated and they're not able to help guide you through, or if they're not being supportive, find ways to help them be supportive by taking a course with them and helping them realize, oh, VBAC actually isn't that scary. Oh, that chance isn't really 50+%. Oh, okay. Hospital birth, out-of-hospital birth. Yeah. They're both reasonable, and really understanding that.Kristin: Absolutely. And sometimes I find that my students and clients may have not had success with breastfeeding the first time and potentially didn't take a class. So if their goal is to breastfeed or pump exclusively, then taking a breastfeeding class and having that IBCLC as a resource for their dream team in case it's needed because many times, you have the lactation consultant who's teaching the class, at least in my practice, and then they're also available for say, a home visit or a hospital visit, depending on where the class is taking place. And so I think that that's something. Even if it isn't your first baby and maybe you breastfed for a little bit or had supply issues or challenges after a surgical birth, that it is important to consider any education during pregnancy because it's much harder to get that education after you have your baby.Meagan: It really is. I love that you're touching on that, really getting into all the things and having your partner go with you. I remember I was like, I had a C-section, and I was swollen and tired, and I couldn't move very well. I was sore and all the things that sometimes come with C-sections. I'm trying to nurse, and I'm engorged.  I don't feel my letdown, and I'm just so engorged. I don't know. All I know is I have really big, swollen boobs. It's all I could tell. I couldn't latch. My husband was like, "That's it. We're going to the store. We're getting formula." Formula is fine. Not anything against formula.Kristin: He's trying to fix the problem and make you feel better.Meagan: Yep, yep, yep. Trying to fix that problem. But I was like, "No, I really want to breastfeed." At that point, I wasn't able to communicate. Like, I didn't get the birth I wanted. I already felt like a failure because I was actually told that your body failed. That's what I was told. So I was already dealing with this mindset that I failed. I had a C-section. I didn't want a C-section. And now the only thing I could try to do because I couldn't take that C-section back is breastfeed my baby. I wanted to breastfeed my baby. And again, we didn't take those childbirth education classes. He for sure didn't download any apps. I at least had an app trying to help me at that point, but he didn't understand. He didn't understand.And I'm like, no.I'm crying, and I'm like, "Please, just help me. I don't know what I need to help me." And he's like, "No, we're going to the store. Our baby's mad. You're crying." He was trying to fix that problem. But if we had already done that information education before and found that IBCLC before and him understanding how important that was to me, he could have been like, "I'm going to call her IBCLC. I'll get her over here right away."Kristin: Exactly. The last thing you want to do is go into the hospital to see a lactation consultant there if you can even get in.Meagan: Exactly. Yeah. So it just could have been so much smoother. Sometimes I feel like we were against each other at that point because he didn't have any education. With our first, I really didn't have much education. But with our third, it was like he really didn't have a lot of education. and I was over-the-top educated, so I was saying these things, and he was thinking I was demeaning him or saying he was stupid because it was just this weird thing. So if we can just come together with our partners and get all the education and get it all before really, find out a postpartum plan. Find out a breastfeeding plan. Right? Find out what you want. You guys, it just makes the pregnancy journey and the postpartum journey, so much better. It truly makes you feel like you're on that team because you are.Kristin: Yes. Absolutely. And certainly, I mean, you mentioned apps. Not everyone has the means or even lives in an area where they can take a comprehensive five, six, ten-week childbirth class. There are, obviously, online classes. There are some Zoom virtual ones where students are all over the place. But there are watching birth videos and YouTube and in my book, Supported: Your Guide to Birth and Baby, we talk about apps, so count the kicks. Especially for VBACs, doing the self-monitoring if there's fear of fetal movement and any sort of distress during the end of the pregnancy, then really understanding your own body and doing monitoring. It's not just when you're in your provider's office being monitored. You can make a difference yourself. So having some different apps and some education on your own, listening to podcasts like yours to get this information and reading books. So there's more than if you can't afford a childbirth class like HypnoBirthing, there are still ways that you can get educated and your partner can get educated. So yeah, take a look at all of your options and your budget.Meagan: Yeah, and we talk about this all the time because I love them, but Be Her Village is a really great resource where you can go fill out a registry and, hopefully, get some help for these things. Childbirth education classes, doulas, IBCLCS. But I want to dive a little bit more into your book, actually, while we're talking about different resources. We talked about the childbirth education, but can we talk about more about Supported: Your Guide to Birth and Baby and how this came into fruition and what all is included in this amazing book.Kristin: Okay, Meagan. So essentially the book came out of our online course. Becoming a Mother launched in the early pandemic when everything was shut down and our classes all had to go virtual. I was fortunate to be in a state where doulas who were certified were able to work thanks to our governor. So we were working, but there was still a lot of isolation even with our clients' prenatal visits. They wanted a connection, so we launched this course. We had talked about and did three live launches, got VBAC from our students, pulled people in from all the moms' groups before creating the first draft of the course. And then the course just led to the book. So the content in Becoming a Mother is what is in the book in a different format. So in Becoming a Mother, we have expert videos, so VBAC specialists and Webster-certified chiropractors talking about what that is. Pelvic floor physical therapists, car seat safety technicians, cord blood banking donation centers.Meagan: Awesome.Kristin: We have the experts speaking for themselves-- a pediatrician. And so in the book, anything that is medical and out of the scope of a doula, we had expert contributors, so I have a pediatrician friend of mine who contributed a newborn procedure section of the chapter and a prenatal yoga studio instructor, she's also a certified body balancer. She contributed to some of the fitness options in the book, and a mental health therapist who is PMA focused and certified contributed to the mental health chapter. We have an IBCLC that contributed to the feeding chapter, and so a lot of involvement, and then sharing client stories throughout the book and then our own wisdom. We have doula tips and wisdom at the end of every chapter. Meagan: Wow.Kristin: And so as clients were asking me for books over the years, I couldn't find anything that was positive. I felt like there were a lot of, this is your cry-it-out method for sleep because we have a whole chapter on sleep and it's very attachment-focused. It's like, one way for feeding, and we wanted our clients, with their unique choices for themselves, to have a book that supports people who want to plan surgical birth like that OB and that's their comfort level and a book for the same person who wants a home birth. You don't have to buy five different books. It's not always Ina May which is a great book but not for everyone. All of her different-- she's got Spiritual Midwifery and so many different books. It is great for grandparents to read and partners but is targeted to the mother or the mother-to-be and is great in preconception in that early planning. But also, we wanted to make it similar to the course and just as valuable for seasoned bombs as it is for new moms. And again, it's affirming. We tried not to have any fear-filled information in a simple, easy-to-read guide that you can pull out for reference and a lot of different, again, apps and podcasts and books to read and resources and evidence-based information about Black maternal health and where we're at in the country now and how the pandemic impacted birth especially, but also that postpartum time.Meagan: Wow. That book sounds amazing. So amazing. And you guys, you can get it in every form, even Audible. I'm a big listener. I like to listen to books. Kristin and Alyssa actually recorded it. She was telling me they had 10+-hour days recording this this book. You can get it, and we will make sure to have the links for that in the show notes. I found it at goldcoastdoulas.com/supportedyourguidetobirthandbaby.Kristin: It's there. You can find it off that website or it has its own page. It's supportedbook.com. Meagan: Supportedbook.com, okay. We'll make sure that's all in the show notes, so you guys can grab that. Okay, so you know a lot. Obviously, you wrote a whole book and a whole course and all this stuff. Is there anything else that you would like to share in regards to just our final assembling of that powerhouse birth team?Kristin: So don't forget, I know we're talking a lot about pregnancy and birth prep, but don't forget your recovery phase. And you had talked about your own personal struggles with breastfeeding engorgement, recovery after a surgical birth. If you have, well, you do have other children at home with VBACs, and so looking at childcare, postpartum doula support, or what kind of family support you're going to have after, it's more than just meal plans and prepping the nursery. We strongly believe that as part of your dream team, the postnatal team is crucial as well. So whether it's a lactation consultant, a pelvic floor physical therapist, if you want to get back to running marathons again or are leaking. I mean, we can all use pelvic floor physical therapy. It's not just the athletes who they support. Some people, again, with building a home or other life occurrences like a wedding or preparing for college, you look at your budget. You look at your main goals. For a wedding, it might be food. For postpartum, it might be sleep. So hiring a sleep consultant when baby's old enough or an overnight postpartum doula or a newborn care specialist. What are your priorities? And take the budget. What might be paid for by insurance or, a health savings flex spending plan that you need to run down? What might be gifted? Like you mentioned, Be Her Village. There are different ways you can budget. And in the book, we talk about all of that and looking at employer plans, how to navigate that, what questions to ask your HR department about other members, like a chiropractor, could that be covered? A therapist? Oftentimes, we don't know our own benefits and certainly, I don't know my husband's benefits fully, so to be able to investigate that early in pregnancy and figure out what might be fully or partially paid for.Meagan: Wow. That is incredible itself. I feel like that's a whole other conversation of, how to navigate how to do that. So definitely go get the book, you guys, because it sounds like there are just so many things in there that are honestly crucial to know. really, really important things to know. You are incredible. Kristin: So are you.Meagan: I just enjoy chatting with you so much. Anything else? Yeah, anything else you'd like to add?Kristin: And obviously, take taking trainings and courses. If I know you have doulas who listen. It's not just parents.Meagan: Yes.Kristin: As doulas go through The VBAC Link. Get certified as a VBAC doula. Keep up with information that is ever-changing. We all want to be the best doula for each of our clients, but I am a firm believer in continuing our own education and that more and more of our clients are choosing to attempt VBACs, and so the more information you can get as a professional, the better you're able to support. It's just not the number of VBACs you've attended anymore. It's clients wanting that knowledge so you can be busier and also a more effective doula by getting that training and then going through the certification process that you offer.Meagan: Yeah, have a directory actually with birth doulas where people can go and find it because when Julie and I created this company way back in the day, we knew that we were just two people here in Utah. We couldn't change the VBAC world. We could give as much information as we could. We could share the podcast. We could do those types of things. But when it comes to birth workers, we wanted to reach birth workers everywhere. It's so great that we have and we're still having more people come on because they're helping people so much. I mean, we know you have doulas that do it all the time. These doulas do help and there are actual stats on doulas that do it. But I agree. If you're a birth worker, stay up to date. Be in the know. Know what's going on because you will likely need to help guide your client through it. Kristin: Then you can charge more. So take that investment in a training like The VBAC Link, and then you're able to charge more because you're more experienced. You have more certifications. So don't look at like, oh, I don't have any money for continuing education. Look at how that's going to change your career.Meagan: Yeah, and I think sometimes too you can charge a little bit more, take less clients, and be more personal with those clients and dive into it. Especially because we do know that VBAC does take some extra stuff that goes on with VBAC. There's some extra work to be worked through. There are some extra things and so yeah, I love that.Kristin: Well, thank you so much for having me on Meagan, I loved our chat.Meagan: Thank you. You as well. As always, I loved our other chat as well. We have to keep going. I think I'm going to order your book today and get going on that. Even though I'm not a mom preparing, I think this would be such a great book to suggest to all of my clients. So thank you for sharing. Thank you.Kristin: Yeah. My secondary audience is certainly anyone who works with families in the birth and baby space, but it is targeted again, just similar to my podcast. It's like I have the listener of the pregnant individual and family, but also birth workers. The book is similar. Thank you for ordering.I appreciate it. Meagan: Yes. And can you also tell everybody where to find you not just in your book, but Instagram, podcast, and all of the social medias?Kristin: So my podcast is Ask the Doulas. You can find us on all the podcast players and you were a guest recently, so very fun. And certainly, we're at Gold Coast Doulas on everything from Pinterest to YouTube to Facebook to Instagram. I don't have separate social sites for my book because I honestly don't have time for that.Meagan: That's okay. Yeah, it's a package. It comes with everything, so you don't need to have another book page. Well, awesome. Well, thank you again so much.Kristin: Thank you. Have a great day.Meagan: You too.ClosingWould you like to be a guest on the podcast? Tell us about your experience at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Meagan's bio, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-vbac-link/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

In this episode, we dive into topics like granting yourself permission to push, navigating free birth, and managing a busy December as midwives. We also cover practical tips for handling diaper rashes, the pros and cons of cloth versus disposable diapers, and how to streamline diaper services. On a deeper note, we touch on the role of spiritual midwifery and explore resources like Weallda and Badger for natural care solutions to rashes. What You'll Learn:​ The empowering mindset of giving yourself “permission to push” during labor.​ Insights into free birth and how it can differ from traditional birth choices. ​ Managing diaper rashes naturally and choosing between cloth and disposable diapers.​ Tips for staying calm and organized during a busy holiday season as midwives. ​ Resources for natural baby care, including Weallda and Badger products.Links and Resources Mentioned:​ EC (Elimination Communication): https://open.spotify.com/show/6ir3EbNKNrAz5chD9SFZjd​ Spiritual Midwifery Book/Resource: https://thefarmcommunity.com/spiritual-midwifery/​ Weallda Products: https://www.weleda.com/product/calendula-diaper-cream-g009831​ Badger Natural Products: https://www.badgerbalm.com/products/zinc-oxide-diaper-creamHave a question or a story to share? Connect with us on social media or check out the links above for more resources to support your parenting journey.Connect with Us:Instagram:​ @sophiabirth​ @bayareahomebirth​ @bornwildmidwiferyStay Wild

Ever wondered what the creative process is behind the films, TV shows and theatre productions you watch? Well, Crew Chats is a podcast that goes behind the scenes and speaks to the crew that help make these productions. One of my favourite shows on television is Call the Midwife, especially at this time of year. I have always been curious about the babies on set, whether they are real or prosthetic, how old they are, how they cry on cue and more. So I was incredibly excited to speak to Sarita Montagu, who is midwife consultant on the show as well as other productions. We discussed how Sarita became a midwife, which led to her work as a midwife consultant for TV, what an average day on set looks like, the intricacies of working with new born babies, parents and actors and more. Also please excuse my voice during the conversation, I was under the weather at the time of recording. Reccomendations: -Out of Africa -Hamnet (book) -Spiritual Midwifery(book)

Confiance et reconnexion Ambre @ambrouillle vient nous raconter son AAD ainsi que sa grossesse libre et enfantement libre à 42 SA . Cet épisode a été enregisté le 21 décembre 2023. Ressources de l'épisode: Livre « Spiritual Midwifery » de Ina may Gaskin https://www.fnac.com/mp4034551/Spiritual-Midwifery?oref=f1087f16-45cd-c228-a5bf-3da9f5b8a2de&Origin=CMP_GOOGLE_FL_LIV « Accoucher par soi même » https://www.fnac.com/a3817129/Laura-Kaplan-Shanley-Accoucher-par-soi-meme-Nouvelle-edition?oref=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000&Origin=SEA_GOOGLE_PLA_BOOKS&esl-k=google-ads%7Cnx%7Cc%7Cm%7Ck%7Cp%7Ct%7Cdm%7Ca20111491090%7Cg20111491090&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAl4a6BhBqEiwAqvrquv510pvj7bDjdHL3VVbhghHp43VNk_Ii4fARsPv3kuLwSxCJ9apmXRoC9aIQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds Formation de naissance libre: https://www.freebirthsocietycourses.com/cgtf Formation Quantik Mama: https://quantikmama.com/seminaires-et-formations/ liste des sage-femme AAD: https://apaad.fr/liste-sf-aad Village en ligne de Johanna https://alchimieinterieure.co/village/ Elisabeth @guerirelanaissance https://www.guerirlanaissance.com/?fbclid=PAZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAaafP-8naAWVsZ1oozlKvGeEtq-hWK6mkXE1vT7m4nSHgWRq9wD9xcJhzfc_aem_HAVeVYUooOXvpRZcP_9spQ Liens de cordon mellune https://mellune.com/boutique/enfants/lien-de-cordon-bio-de-naissance/ Bourse a pasteur contre les saignements https://www.onatera.com/FR/fr/produit-bourse-a-pasteur-bio-extrait-de-plante-fraiche-50-ml-herbagenese?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=FR_PMAX_SHP_Trade&utm_adgroup=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADrwVbYXRBr32IDn-20VAlRbGjZ-S&gclid=CjwKCAiA9IC6BhA3EiwAsbltOHhD-EZASv7CXtGXSAji5tdG28oHLSXB3uj5jrDKDquq5H0LsonJOxoCCf0QAvD_BwE CRDN pour le test de guthrie https://www.chu-toulouse.fr/-centre-regional-de-depistage-neonatal-crdn- Déclaration ANA , Google doc de Cécile @the_zaibre_family https://drive.google.com/drive/mobile/folders/1ryI7eYOjKYCytxShpxhH9Hz9ZvCetmdn?fbclid=PAZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAaaO58-1UvjHqYNKluLkrcGBCjNZIxt1lMPu41i-wXOUDbwgDO3q-eIBsQ0_aem_lxvJSYN-AtAXO2u28GYj_g L'histoire de Noémie, à qui l'on a retiré ses enfants illégalement https://marieblandin-avocate.fr/placement-dun-nourrisson-et-sa-soeur-apres-un-accouchement-non-assiste-a-vitre-eclairage-juridique/?fbclid=PAZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAaYp8blGqbCde2lW4UMfCyhZGGekvqBO9OJy7MrYs6RE4ASR2aN53OXi2Dk_aem_wTD2vGRuA-yvUX3-h88t2Q Interview de Ambre - page 5 - https://www.bouee.fr/fileadmin/user_upload/bouee/PDF/Bouee_Infos/2023/Bouée_infos_239_septembre_2023.pdf Je m'appelle Charlotte Ordoux ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ @charlotte_doulacoeur ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ , doula , autrice du livre jeunesse en cours de création @naitre_mammifere et j'ai l'honneur de vous offrir ce podcast. Pour me soutenir, je vous invite à partager cet épisode, à le commenter et à contribuer en vous rendant sur ma page tipeee https://fr.tipeee.com/recits-ocytocyques/ #aad #grossesselibre #naissancelibre #enfantement #hemoragie #42SA

In this conversation, Mihaela and Maryn explore the journey of midwifery, the importance of understanding birth as a natural process, and the impact of maternal experiences on the birthing journey. Maryn shares her personal story of becoming a midwife, the significance of connecting with the soul of the baby, and the need for women to reclaim their power in the birthing process. They discuss the challenges and misconceptions surrounding pregnancy timelines, the role of nutrition, and the emotional aspects of preparing for birth. The conversation emphasizes the sacredness of birth and the importance of supporting women in their choices, ultimately advocating for a more empowered and informed approach to childbirth.TakeawaysMaryn followed her intuition to move to Hawaii.The journey to midwifery began after a powerful home birth experience.Birth is a natural and sacred process that should be respected.Women often feel powerless during birth due to societal beliefs.Understanding one's own birth story can be healing.Connecting with the soul of the baby is important during pregnancy.Pregnancy timelines are often misunderstood and can be flexible.Nutrition plays a crucial role in a healthy pregnancy and birth.Emotional and spiritual preparation is key for a positive birth experience.Midwifery should focus on empowering women rather than controlling the process.Maryn's Contact Detailshttps://indiebirth.org/author/admin/https://www.instagram.com/indiebirth/https://sacredsisterhooddoula.org/https://indiebirthmidwiferyschool.org/ Time Stamps00:00 Who is Maryn Green03:09 The move to Hawaii05:00 Maryn's Journey to Midwifery09:00 Home birth is an option12:30 What is Normal Birth?17:00 How Hospital Birth may not be Safe for The Mother18:00 The Hospital Interventions23:30 Is the Child being Born in Love or Fear27:00 Connecting with the Soul of the Baby36:00 Question What you Have Been Told About Birth43:30 Preparing for Birth and the Process47:40 How to Fast Forward your Healing51:00 When to Intervene with Birth57:00 A Midwife that Serves the Family59:00 Reflect On Your Own Birth

message me what did you take away from this episode? Ep 80 (ibit.ly/Re5V) Melanie Jackson on birthing outside the system, balancing research, midwifery, and entrepreneurship@PhDMidwives  #MidTwitter  #research #midwifery @westernsydneyu @hannahdahlen @VirginiaSchmie1 https://www.melaniethemidwife.com/Great Birth Rebellion podcast Ever wondered how the worlds of naturopathy and midwifery intersect? Join us for an enlightening episode where we promise you'll uncover the inspirational journey of Melanie Jackson. From her roots as a naturopath to becoming a dedicated midwife and researcher, Melanie shares her unique perspective on pregnancy and birth, influenced by pivotal experiences and the wisdom of Ina May Gaskin's “Spiritual Midwifery.” Discover how her holistic approach complements her midwifery practice and the challenges she faced reconciling these philosophies within hospital settings.Melanie's story is a testament to resilience and passion. Learn about her academic evolution, from a nursing degree at Sydney University to her unexpected dive into postgraduate research under the mentorship of Hannah Dahlen. Melanie's commitment to physiological birth led her to become a private midwife and eventually pursue a PhD. Hear about the intricate balance she maintained while managing her PhD and midwifery work, the importance of mental health, and the support systems that kept her grounded through it all.This episode also sheds light on the systemic issues within maternity care, driving women towards alternative birthing options. Melanie offers insightful reflections on conducting unbiased research in emotionally charged contexts and discusses her transition from private midwifery to mentoring aspiring midwives. Finally, get a glimpse into how she balances her dynamic life, including entrepreneurship, family, and community involvement, illustrating how support and a flexible work model have enabled her to thrive. Support the Show.Do you know someone who should tell their story?email me - thruthepodcast@gmail.comThe aim is for this to be a fortnightly podcast with extra episodes thrown inThis podcast can be found on various socials as @thruthepinardd and our website -https://thruthepinardpodcast.buzzsprout.com/ or ibit.ly/Re5V

Renowned Midwife, Ina May Gaskin, joins Erin to share her extensive knowledge and experiences in childbirth. In this informative episode, Ina May shares about the history of obstetrics and breech birth, the deliveries of her children, The Farm Midwifery Center, her books, and shoulder dystocia.  Connect with Ina: Facebook Books Connect with me: Instagram Website About Ina May: A certified professional midwife who has attended more than 1,200 births, Ina May Gaskin is known as the “mother of authentic midwifery.” Gaskin joined the Peace Corps after college and taught English in Malaysia for two years before returning to the United States to obtain her master's degree. During the birth of her first child in the 1960's, Gaskin experienced the terrible practice of having her child pulled into the world with forceps. The incident fueled her determination to find a saner way to give birth. A few years later, during a five-month long speaking tour with her husband, Stephen Gaskin, and more than two hundred young idealists, she witnessed her first birth, one of many that would occur during the trip. Because many of the women were without health insurance or money to pay for a doctor, Gaskin often assisted in births by default, eventually aided by the instruction and support of a sympathetic obstetrician. In 1971, the group purchased a large tract of land in rural Tennessee and established a cooperative community. Gaskin located a doctor willing to serve as a mentor and medical liaison, and the Farm Midwifery Center was born. During a stay in Guatemala in 1976, Gaskin learned a technique for preventing and resolving shoulder dystocia, a condition that occurs during birth when the baby's head is born, but the shoulders are stuck in the birth canal. After using the method with great success, she began to teach and publish articles about the method. Now referred to as the Gaskin maneuver, it is the first obstetrical procedure to be named after a midwife. Gaskin has lectured in numerous countries and is the author of several books, including Spiritual Midwifery (1975), the first text written by a midwife published in the United States. In 2011, Gaskin received the Right Livelihood Award, an honor bestowed each year by the Swedish Parliament; the award is often referred to as the “Alternative Nobel Prize.”

Ep 74 (ibit.ly/Re5V) Sara Bayes on empowering preparation for cesarean sections and translating research into practice@PhDMidwives  #MidTwitter  @EdithCowanUni @MidwivesACM @CurtinUniresearch ibit.ly/zlXGhWhen Sara Bays, a seasoned midwife and Professor at Edith Cowan University, stumbled upon "Spiritual Midwifery" during her backpacking travels, her life took an unexpected turn. From a nursing career in palliative care to the birth rooms of midwifery, Sara's story is a testament to the profound moments that shape our journeys. This episode is a deep dive into the world of midwifery through Sara's eyes, exploring the emotional and professional highs and lows, and the innovative strategies that are reshaping how we think about birth.Our conversation with Sara reveals the untold stories of cesarean sections and the groundbreaking work being done to bring expectant mothers closer to the birthing experience. Her research not only highlights the challenges women face during planned cesareans, but also showcases interventions that are redefining the role of surgical patients in the birth process. From specialized classes to the removal of the surgical drape, Sara's insights offer a new perspective on how to empower women during one of life's most significant events.As we cast a lens on the future of midwifery in Australia, Sara paints a picture of an evolving landscape, where the role of midwifery unit chairs becomes indispensable in bridging the gap between academia and clinical practice. The emergence of these pivotal roles promises to bolster the profession, advancing both healthcare outcomes and the growth of midwives themselves.  Support the showDo you know someone who should tell their story?email me - thruthepodcast@gmail.comThe aim is for this to be a fortnightly podcast with extra episodes thrown inThis podcast can be found on various socials as @thruthepinardd and our website -https://thruthepinardpodcast.buzzsprout.com/ or ibit.ly/Re5V

Welcome back to another episode of The Mama Village! A podcast filled with education and positive stories about pregnancy, birth and postpartum. I am your host Ellen, and in today's episode, I am honored to sit down with Tempest, a mother of three, who shares her extraordinary twin birth story with us. Tempest's journey is nothing short of remarkable, filled with twists and turns that ultimately led her to an awe-inspiring physiological birth experience in the hospital. As Tempest recounts her pregnancy journey, we learn of her initial decision not to undergo ultrasounds, only to have her plans altered by the intuitive knowing of her 4-year-old daughter and her own maternal instincts, leading to the joyful discovery of expecting twins. She candidly shares the decision-making process regarding her care, originally planning for a home birth but ultimately opting for a hospital setting. With unwavering faith in the natural ability of women to birth, Tempest walks us through her birth story and beautifully articulates the intricacies of her experience. Amidst the intensity of labour, she remains grounded in her belief that women are inherently meant to birth. What I love about Tempest's twin birth story is that it so beautifully demonstrates that twins are just another variation of normal. Tempest's story challenges the conventional medical model that would otherwise push for unnecessary interventions. Tempest's intervention free birth meant that her babies were born healthy and thriving and Tempest was left in awe at her body and her babies ability to birth. Join us as we explore Tempest's journey, celebrating the diversity of childbirth experiences and affirming that twin mamas can absolutely achieve the birth of their dreams. This episode is a testament to the strength, resilience, and unwavering belief in the innate power of women to birth. Don't forget that if you like the show, please subscribe and leave a review on your podcast platform. If you would like to share your positive pregnancy, birth, postpartum and motherhood story, or you have education in the pregnancy, birth, postpartum or motherhood space to share, please send me a DM or email the.mamavillage@outlook.com   Instagram - @the.mamavillage Resources mentioned in the podcast: Dr Stuart James Fischbein - @birthinginstincts Blyss Young - @birthingblyss Books by Ina May Gaskin – Ina May's Guide to Childbirth, Spiritual Midwifery, Ina May's Guide to Breastfeeding Birth with Confidence by Rhea Dempsey Beyond the Birth Plan by Rhea Dempsey   For a discussion around the accuracy of ultrasounds and big babies versus small babies, I recommend you listen to episodes 29 and 30 of The Great Birth Rebellion Podcast. Please remember that this is general information only and not medical advice. Please speak with your professional healthcare provider for any specific medical advice. Disclaimer: I am not a medical professional, and this is not medical advice. Any information discussed in this podcast should not replace the advice of your professional healthcare provider. This podcast is designed for general information only and is not specific to individual needs. Please seek advice from your professional healthcare provider if you have any concerns regarding your pregnancy, birth or postpartum.  For Music: https://soundcloud.com/emotionetoile/kevin-macleod-easy-day-no-copyright-music-103

In this episode, we are joined by Rachel, who shares her triumphant journey of achieving a physiological VBAC against challenging odds. Having undergone a caesarean almost three years prior, she discovered at 37 weeks into her second pregnancy that her medical notes deemed her "not suitable for VBAC." Undeterred, Rachel changed hospitals at 38 weeks, advocating for herself throughout her pregnancy. Rachel's first birth was marked by a cascade of interventions and coercive measures by medical professionals designed to instil fear and doubt in the birthing process. In contrast, her VBAC journey emphasises the transformative power of informed decision-making, education, and self-advocacy in birth. Unable to get on the MGP, Rachel guaranteed herself continuity of care by creating her own beautiful support team, with her husband, doula, and student midwife. Rachel's story exemplifies the incredible strength of women, and demonstrates how education, self-belief, and the right support team can transform pain into power. _____ Resources that Rachel mentioned in this episode include: The Great Birth Rebellion podcast Core and Floor Restore free birth classes VBAC Australia Facebook page VBAC Birth Stories podcast Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskins Rachel's Birth Plan Template: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1RAsK-5vOBLdInR-ZtHCwoAlYdKFZiFNI _____ Please join us on our journey to bringing you all kinds of VBAC stories from across the country from here on in by subscribing and following us on social media, ⁠@australianvbacstories⁠ on Instagram and Australian VBAC Stories on Facebook.  If you enjoyed this episode, we'd love if you could rate, review, and tell your friends! If you are feeling that you might benefit from mental health support after listening to our podcast, please reach out to one of the organisations below: PANDA ⁠https://panda.org.au/⁠ Gidget Foundation ⁠https://www.gidgetfoundation.org.au/⁠ COPE Australia ⁠https://www.cope.org.au/⁠ If you've experienced mistreatment or disrespectful care in your pregnancy, birth or postpartum and are seeking advocacy support, please contact one of the following organisations: Maternity Choices Australia ⁠https://www.maternitychoices.org/⁠ Maternity Consumer Network ⁠https://www.maternityconsumernetwork.org.au/⁠ Thank you for tuning in to our podcast.

How could lessons from surviving cancer empower you in your birth? For Eva Whipple, going through cancer at age 19 shifted up her perspective on things. It taught her about priorities and her ability to push through. She recognizes that it also taught her to be present. And this carried into both of her births, both on the same day two years apart. For her first birth of her daughter Lois, Eva was in a birthing center (birthing at home was illegal). Then for surprise pregnancy number two, she decided on a home birth for son Sonny. We chat about the road to home birth and the comparison of her two births, nursing a toddler while pregnant and how her practice of yoga has been a part of her life as a mother. Links From The Episode: First Descents - https://firstdescents.org/ Ina May Gaskin's “Spiritual Midwifery” - https://www.amazon.com/Spiritual-Midwifery-Ina-May-Gaskin/dp/1570671044 Eva's Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/soulyogamama/ Eva's yoga studio - http://www.soulyogastudiosalisbury.com/ Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH to get 20% off your order Splash Blanket: https://bit.ly/3JPe1g0 - use code DIAH for 10% off your order Esembly: https://bit.ly/3eanCSz - use code DIH20 to get 20% off your order More From Doing It At Home: Send us your birth story: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Are you aware of the benefits of our natural flow of hormones? In this eye-opening episode, midwife Marina Lembo shares her profound wisdom about birthing high - harnessing the power of our natural hormones to facilitate easier, safer births. She explains how activities like hugging, dancing, laughing, and relaxing prompt our bodies to release healthy hormones like oxytocin and endorphins. Meanwhile, common hospital interventions like restrictions on eating/drinking and separation from loved ones spike stress hormones like adrenaline, leading to complications. Marina details the cascading benefits of optimizing hormones during labor and birth, from easier breathing transitions to immediate breastfeeding success, stronger immunity, and even positive epigenetic effects. She delivers an empowering message: no matter what twists and turns a birth story takes, we can tap into our inner “pharmacy” to bathe our babies in hormonal health.   Marina Lembo is an  Argentine Homebirth midwife, with 24 years of practice. 4300 assisted births.  She is a TEDx speaker (2019). Translator of midwifery books (Spiritual Midwifery) and documentary films including our (Orgasmic Birth and Birth Story, Ina May, and The Farm Midwives). Founder and twice president of the Argentine Association of Independent Midwives. She Led the lobby to preserve home birth practice in midwifery regulation and started a national Birth centers network initiative. Marina is a Midwifery professor and Technical expert  She is a National and international lecturer. Human rights in childbirth activist. Homeopath. Mom of 2 children born at home.  We had the pleasure of reconnecting this June in Bali at the International Confederation of Midwives Congress where I was once again inspired by her passion and activism.        In This Episode: Midwife Marina Lembo explains how activities that make us feel good like hugging, dancing, and relaxation prompt the release of healthy hormones like oxytocin and endorphins into our bloodstream. Common hospital interventions like not allowing eating/drinking, and separating women from loved ones triggers increased stress hormones often leading to complications. Optimizing the natural flow of hormones facilitates labor progress and transitions, allows the intelligence of hormones to self-regulate pace and identify problems, and confers many benefits to the baby. Home births allow women to control their environment to lower stress and facilitate the unimpeded flow of natural hormones. Even high-intervention births can help repair a baby's hormonal health by using bonding behaviors like skin-to-skin, eye contact, hugging, and more.     Key Takeaways: You do not need to rely on machines or pills for healthy hormones - you can produce them naturally Harness pleasurable activities to release healthy hormones for a healthy birth Restrictions on normal behavior spike harmful stress hormones Natural hormone flow intelligently regulates labor and protects mom & baby Lowering stress facilitates healthy hormone release Bonding repairs a baby's hormones after difficult births Everyday behaviors boost helpful hormones Poor hormonal flows imprint for generations     Key Quotes:   "Many people think that they can get [a healthy pregnancy/birth] with all the machines and pills and checkups but in fact...when we do activities that we enjoy and when we relax, we are releasing these healthy hormones into our bloodstream." - Marina Lembo   “In some countries, being out of the hospital is related to poverty. [Natural] birth has worked for thousands of years in the history of humanity… Start being more open-minded.” - Marina Lembo   “Taking care of a newborn, it's tough work. Anybody who has had a child knows that. So if you can get all the benefits of this natural cocktail of hormones, it helps a lot to make this work that it's really tough a little bit easier.” - Marina Lembo       Connect with Marina! Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/marina_lembo/ Website: https://www.midwiferytoday.com/author/marina-lembo/  TedTalk: https://www.ted.com/talks/marina_lembo_parir_drogada?language=es      Connect with Debra! Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/orgasmicbirth/   Twitter: https://twitter.com/OrgasmicBirth   YouTube https://www.youtube.com/c/OrgasmicBirth1    Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/@orgasmicbirth   Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/debra-pascali-bonaro-1093471/     Visit https://www.orgasmicbirth.com/ for more information on how to Positively Prepare for birth and parenting   Check out Orgasmic Birth: The Best-Kept Secret, the film creating buzz around the world!    Orgasmic Birth Podcast: Pleasure in pregnancy, birth, and parenting. I believe pleasure is our birthright - from our sexuality, birth, parenting, and beyond, we can find pleasure when we create space for joy and intimacy in our lives. Join me to have deep conversations about breaking the taboos of Sexuality + Motherhood/Parenthood.   Listen to leading experts in sexuality, healing, and childbirth, as well as stories from new parents, doulas, doctors, midwives, and nurses. We will discuss how to positively prepare for childbirth and parenting by expanding love and intimacy in your life.

Women of Strength, believe in yourselves!Brittani shares her inspiring two VBAC stories with us today-- one where she mostly prepared physically and one where she focused on intense mental preparation.While all three of her birth stories are wildly different, each taught Brittani valuable lessons.The image of Brittani standing in her bathroom being held up by her husband and doula while she pushes out her baby girl is absolutely unforgettable. We are so proud of you, Brittani!Additional LinksBrittani's Clothing Website - Nunuy ApparelHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull Transcript under Episode DetailsMeagan: Hello, hello. We have another VBAC story. We actually have two VBAC stories for you today. We have our friend, Brittani and she is in Oregon. She has had two VBACs. Brittani, tell me. You grew up in Florida. Did you have your babies in Florida or were you in Oregon when you had your babies? Brittani: All three babies here in Oregon. I lived in Florida until I was 21-22. Meagan: Okay, all right. So all three babies in Oregon, so Oregon parents. Brittani: We are. Meagan: Listen up here. We have some VBAC stories for you. I don't know if you will share along the way but feel free to share where you gave birth. We have a lot of people a lot of the time write in and say, “Oh my gosh. I heard this story. I am in the same area. I would love to find a provider. Do you know their provider?” So if you feel that you want to share, feel free in your story to share. Brittani: I am happy to give shoutouts, yes. Meagan: Perfect. Perfect. Well, Brittani is a stay-at-home mom with her three children. They are all under the age of four, right? Brittani: Four and under, right? Our oldest will be five at the end of June. Meagan: Yay. Oh my gosh. You are busy. Brittani: Yes, we are. Meagan: Not only are you busy with three beautiful children, but you have created an amazing business. I just want you to share a little bit about this because I think a lot of people will for sure want to go check you out and make sure to know that if you guys miss it while you're driving or something, the link for all of her stuff will be in the show notes. So yeah, Brittani. Tell us a little bit about your clothing line. Brittani: That's so kind. Thanks, Meagan. I don't know if it'll come up in conversation but I had a really, really tough go at breastfeeding. All three babies, but especially with my first, I was really self-conscious about nursing in public. I got really into sewing at home and just had the inspiration to create my own line designed for breastfeeding. I have three pieces currently. They are all ethically made in my husband's home country of Peru. We use organic pima cotton which is the world's finest cotton. I'm working on two new designs, a jumpsuit, and a sweater. It's called Slow Fashion for a reason. It's taken forever because I need to let go of the perfectionism. Meagan: I know. But at the same time, it's your baby. Brittani: Yep. It's my fourth baby. Yep, yep. Maybe fifth if you count my husband. Meagan: Right. Brittani: Yes. I would even be happy to provide a discount code special to the listeners of this podcast, but yes. It's called Nunuy Nursing Apparel. I have an Instagram that I wish I could be more active on, but I have all of these babies. Meagan: You have three kids under the age of four. Brittani: Yes. Yes. I will get there. I will get there. The baby is going to be a year old next month, so yeah. Thank you for letting me touch on that. Meagan: Yay. Happy birthday. Brittani: Thank you. Meagan: Yeah, absolutely. I think It's so important. From one entrepreneur to another, I think it's so important to share. Especially, this is something that really does apply to all of our moms out there who want to breastfeed. Brittani: Yes, totally. Meagan: Well, thank you. Brittani: Thanks, Meagan: Review of the Week Meagan: Yeah, yeah. We'll get into a review and then we'll get into sharing these babies' stories. Obviously, they're all amazing. Okay, so we have a review and it was on Apple Podcasts from sydmobley. It says, “Grateful to have found The VBAC Link. I was recently able to have a successful home VBAC—” so HBAC. H-B-A-C. “—due to a large part of Meagan and Julie and the stories of the ladies featured in The VBAC Link. I cannot say enough about the comfort I found in knowing I was not alone in what I was doing and going through. That so many ladies had come before me and found peace in their empowered birth. What a lifesaver these testimonies were for me.” Oh, I love that. I love that so much. You know, we were talking about this before. I wish—there were birth story podcasts and things like that out when I was going for my VBAC after two Cesarean births. I wish so much that there was something like this that was more specific to VBAC. Something that I can relate to and not feel alone just like Syd because the VBAC world can feel very lonely. Brittani: It is. Meagan: It can feel really lonely and then if you're in an area that is really not supportive—I mean, I felt lonely in Utah where VBAC is supported. I can't imagine how those who are in rural areas or non-supportive areas or even where there are VBAC bans where they feel— Brittani: The bans blew my mind. Someone made a comment to me, “They let you have a VBAC?” I was like, “Let me?” Meagan: Let me, yeah. Yes. You're like, “Hold on. Hold on. No one let me.” But so many people feel so stuck that they have no option. If financial means or whatever are not to a place where you can just pick up your family or yourself and go to another state and have a baby, that can really be terrible. So anyway, thank you for your review, Syd. I really appreciate it and as always, if you love the podcast as well, we'd love your review. Brittani's Stories Meagan: Okay, Brittani. Let's share these baby stories of yours. Brittani: Thank you. I do just want to start by saying thank you for inviting me here. It feels really surreal to tell my—I also never thought I'd have three babies—but to tell my three stories on this podcast that literally gave me all of the strength and guidance to get through my VBACs. Meagan: Oh, it warms my heart. Brittani: We always have a VBAC story because of a Cesarean birth story. I had a primary Cesarean with my oldest, Olivia. The pregnancy was so easy and I did feel like one of those women that were like, you're just glowing and everything's fantastic. But around 28 weeks, my well-established OBGYN told me that she was breech. I didn't really understand what that meant. I'm a very anxious person so I went into full-on panic mode. Meagan: Research mode? Brittani: Yes, yes. You don't really think about Cesareans. I was more terrified to get the epidural because I hate needles. I did try everything. I followed Spinning Babies techniques. I was tortured with needles in my toes and moxi with the acupuncture. I did chiropractic work. Meagan: Bladder 6. Brittani: Yes, yeah. I lay upside down on an ironing board. I did inversions on the stairs and she just was determined to come into the world feet first. My OB wanted me to schedule a Cesarean for 39 weeks. I somehow talked her into going to 39 weeks and 5 days. Her due date fell on a Sunday and they “refused to let me go past 40 weeks.” If I knew what I know now. So we did it on a Friday super early in the morning. I was so terrified. They would not let my husband in for the spinal injection so thankfully, I had established rapport with my doctor. She held my hand through the whole thing. The spinal was done. They did all of the things. I had written a gentle Cesarean birth plan. My doctor followed most of it, but her colleague just started chitchatting her up asking about summer plans. I wish I had the—I don't want to say the guts, but I wish I had spoken up for myself and said, “Yeah, this is my baby's birth. Can you just walk me through what's happening?” because it's so bizarre for half of your body to feel numb. Meagan: Ability, yeah. Brittani: My heart was racing. Oh my goodness. So baby was born. Everything was fine. They did take her from me and wiped her all off before they gave her to me. While the experience wasn't traumatic rushing into the OR, it was planned, but the actual Cesarean experience was pretty traumatic for me. I'm sure some of that still carries on in my nervous system today but because of that experience, we knew we were going to have a second. I just knew. I was like, “I'm never going through that again.” I found your podcast and started preparing. About 15 months after our first was born, I got pregnant with our second. I started out with the same care team, but my doctor had moved on then you get rotated around. I stayed for the first trimester, but every new midwife or OB that I got was just saying all of these bad things about VBAC. I was like, “This is not the place for me.” Meagan: Good for you for recognizing that. It's a really hard place to be. Brittani: Yeah. It's not easy to switch. Meagan: It's really not. It's daunting. It's scary, right? Yeah. Brittani: Totally. I do live in an amazing place with very supportive providers and lots of options. We have several free-standing birth centers. There are birth centers with midwives, so I chose to do an out-of-hospital birth center. The birth team there is called “Omnum Midwifery” and they are just right there in southeast Portland. So they had four midwives at the time. Also, appointments were an hour long. They cared about you and asked you questions. The OB appointments were just so fast. You forget to ask things. It's kind of like a whirlwind. This was a much slower pace. You feel really involved. Meagan: Really, really cared for. Brittani: So different. I wish I knew more about this, but my husband says, “Hindsight's 20/20,” so you just work with what you've got. This pregnancy was really bad with nausea in the beginning, so I kind of had this feeling, “I hope it's a boy,” because we already had a girl. We had two so we thought— Meagan: One girl, one boy. Brittani: Perfect, yeah. He stayed head-down. They found him at his anatomy scan head-down. He stayed there the whole time which was awesome because I was so worried about that, another breech baby. I naturally went into labor at 40 weeks and 2 days. It was pretty early in the morning. I went to the bathroom. I had been having—I don't love the work Braxton Hicks—practice contractions and when I wiped, I had some blood-tinged mucus. I just knew it was different. I called my mom. She came over to be with our oldest. I touched base with the midwives. They actually came and did a home visit to check on me and baby first and then said, “Okay. Let's meet at the birth center in a few hours.”I was already experiencing contractions where I had to hold onto something and I couldn't talk and had to breathe through it. I think that kind of psyched me out. I was like, “If it's this hard right now, what's going to happen in active labor?” I really did trip myself out that way. But we got to the birth center which was so lovely. They had the bath ready for me. I was in and out of the bath, but after struggling pretty hard, I think I was in labor at this point for 15+ hours, I asked for a cervical check. They hadn't even offered or touched. I was at 7 which was pretty exciting. Meagan: Wow, yeah. Brittani: Yeah. It was the first time I had been in labor. I didn't labor with our first. However, things started to get really, really difficult and I had double-peaking contractions for hours on end. Meagan: You weren't getting a break. Brittani: Not even close. And oh, Meagan. I lost my doula because of COVID. They stopped letting people come into the hospitals as a “guest” or “visitor”. I'm putting that in quotation marks because I feel that every single birthing woman on this planet deserves support. It's not a visitor. It's part of your birth team. Meagan: It's essential. Brittani: I agree. Meagan: I know. I know. I was the doula on the other end during COVID dropping at the door just bawling my eyes out— Brittani: Because you feel so invested, yeah. Meagan: Or feeling very angry because someone was like, “Hey, they just told me that you can no longer be with me.” But our hospital did start finding that people were dropping the hospital, so they started making doulas essential. That's why they were like, “They are essential to this plan.” Brittani: So essential, mhmm. Meagan: That is so hard to have a plan and then lose your doula. Brittani: Yes. I guess I should backtrack slightly. I hired a birth photographer because that was super important to me and then I hired a doula. The company my doula was working for offered virtual services, but I'm like, “I'm going to end up throwing the computer at the wall.” Meagan: It's really hard. It's really hard. Brittani: I wanted hands-on. I wanted to be touched. I wanted to be talked through it. So I did lose our doula, but anyway, I really believe that if she had been there, it would definitely have given me a little more strength because nobody was there to just be like, “You can do this.” Meagan: Yeah, your cheerleader. Your husband probably needed her too. Brittani: Yeah, doulas are totally for the partner as well, my goodness, because sometimes they feel totally lost and just don't know what to do. When I was going through contractions, I just started rhythmically tapping on things. I wasn't counting out loud, but I would count in my head because it just helped me feel really present and grounded like I was in control of something. But that counting and tapping in my head turned into pounding on the wall and every time I knew that second surge was coming, my butt would just clench. Meagan: Just tense up, yeah. Brittani: I just couldn't relax. I had some glute pain throughout the pregnancy and at this point, it felt like there were just electric shocks going down my legs. I don't want to scare anybody, but it was so taxing that I literally begged to transfer to the hospital. It took a lot longer to get a call back from the hospital than I expected. When I first asked to transfer, by the time we got there, it had been 4 hours with these double contractions. It was awful, Meagan. So the midwives also couldn't transfer with me because of COVID, so my husband and I were on our own— Meagan: With a new team. Brittani: Yeah, just the two of us there. We get to the hospital. The anesthesiologist was busy so even if you transfer, it still takes a long time to get the epidural. Meagan: So prepare for that mentally, for sure. Brittani: Yes, absolutely. I also forgot to mention they gave me some of the laughing gas at the birth center. Meagan: Oh, nitrous oxide? Brittani: It didn't help. It didn't help. I think I was just too deep into it to get my rhythm back, unfortunately. I prepared so much physically for the VBAC that I really didn't take the time to prepare as much mentally as I could have. So we get to the hospital. I go. I get in. They hook me up to the IV. The nurse offered me Fentanyl. She said it would take the edge off. Meagan: Even at 7 centimeters, I'm shocked. Brittani: It was brutal. I wish I hadn't done it. It made me so dizzy and really disoriented. Meagan: Kind of foggy. Brittani: Yes. I hadn't eaten since the morning and here we were at 7:00 at night. So we're moving on. Everybody's like, “Oh, you transferred from the birth center.” At some point, I wanted to slap somebody. I'm like, “Can we just let me have my baby instead of telling me where I came from? I know that I transferred to the hospital.” Meagan: I just came here to have a baby. That is where I came from. I came here. Brittani: Let's just do this. But really, Meagan, I felt like I should have just gone in with this flashing neon sign, "Danger VBAC, Danger VBAC.” Meagan: Really? Brittani: So I got the epidural placed. I had the machinery hooked up. If you're not breathing well or if you move a little too much, those machines get so wonky. They wanted to break my bag of water to put the little internal monitor on. I really educated myself when I knew our doula wasn't coming. I made a hospital birth plan. I made a backup Cesarean birth plan. We really just advocated for ourselves. We declined the monitor. They ended up bringing in closer to full dilation a piece of paper saying I had a 79% success rate for my VBAC. Meagan: What? In the middle of labor, you're at 7 centimeters. Brittani: I think at this point I might have been at 9 because she checked me and my bag of water hadn't broken yet. Meagan: Oh my goodness. Brittani: So I happily signed saying that I do not want a repeat Cesarean. They did give the risks of VBAC and a repeat C-section which most people don't talk about the risks for both. Both carry risks. Yep. So I agreed to let them break my bag at 9 centimeters. There was some meconium in the water. My poor baby had just been put through the wringer with these double-peaking contractions. She tells me, “Let's do a practice push,” and when I did that, I felt my stomach acid come up into my throat. I was so exhausted, Meagan. I was just like, “I'm going to end up in the OR.” I just was ready to give up. Meagan: You just felt defeat. Brittani: Yeah. My husband was so tired but still there the whole time. I did again advocate for myself and was like, “Look. You guys have been in and out of this room. I've had zero rest. I've been in labor for over 24 hours.” She said, “Well, we'll give you an hour.” But someone was probably in every 15 minutes because they were getting all of the birth stuff ready and there was meconium in the water so they were prepping the NICU team. Somebody was supposed to be there for the actual birth to make sure he didn't need to be suctioned. So they let me rest but I didn't really rest. Then the midwife comes back in and says, “Since this is your first vaginal birth, we're going to prepare to push for 2-3 hours.” I was like, “Nope. That's not happening.” I had this whole vision of me birthing the baby. It was not in a supine position with both of my legs in the air and a nurse on one side and my husband on the other. She's telling me, “Hold your breath. Push as hard as you can.” They call it purple pushing because— Meagan: Your face goes purple. You lose your oxygen. Brittani: Sometimes blood vessels will break. Yes.  So thankfully—my son's name is Enrique—he handled the pushing really well. I got him out in 45 minutes. Meagan: Which is awesome. Brittani: Yeah. The weird thing was—my poor little guy. He had a really rough start. My midwife stepped away. I must have watched dozens of birth videos. My baby is crowning. She asked if I wanted to touch his head which gave me so much more strength. I was like, “Oh my gosh. I'm right there. I know I can do this.” They turn the epidural off when you start pushing, so I got to feel all of that pressure. I felt like I needed to take a really big poop. It was kind of scary. So as he is crowning, I could just feel everything stretching. I don't know why, but she stepped away. We had been doing three pretty valiant pushes. We. I was doing pretty valiant pushes with each contraction. I hated that feeling of him just sitting right there and I needed him out. Usually, just the head is born, so I gave a fourth push even though the midwife had walked away and my little boy just came shooting out. Nobody was there to catch him. Meagan: Oh my goodness. Brittani: His cord was so long and I'm so grateful because they take the bottom of the bed off and what if he had fallen on the floor? My little dude-- Meagan: So did he stay on the bed? Brittani: He did. He did not fall, but my poor little guy. He screamed and screamed for a whole hour. He didn't want to breastfeed. The staff wasn't super duper attentive, but the recovery from that birth was just so much different. I had some pelvic floor damage that I'm still dealing with a little bit today but it's because I've had back to back to back babies and I really do think that athletic pushing just might not have been the sole cause, but it did some damage to my pelvic floor. Meagan: Yeah. Brittani: So after his birth, my husband got a vasectomy. Meagan: Yeah, I was going to say are you going to mention what happened after? Yeah, okay. Okay. Brittani: It was so crazy. In November 2020, he got a vasectomy. We were just two babies, that's it. A boy and a girl. A couple of months go by and he's taking his samples back to the lab. They were like, “You still have lots of activity and it's really plentiful.” I'm just like, “How does this happen?” Meagan: How does this happen? Brittani: Oregon is a great state though. They cover sterilization at 100% when you have insurance so at least we didn't have to pay a ton of money to have it done, but as odd as it sounds, I just kind of felt like I questioned everything in my life. I have two siblings. My husband, Gonzalo, has two siblings and so just literally joking, Meagan, one night, I said, “I think I want another baby.” I thought he was going to say, “We got a vasectomy for a reason. Why would we go for a third?” Meagan: No! Yeah. Brittani: He was like, “Well, we probably would need a bigger car. If it's a boy, he'd have to share a room with Enrique. So he started talking about all of these things and I was like, “What?” Meagan: The logistics of it almost like he had thought about it before. Brittani: So it took us a couple of months and we agreed to have one more baby. I never thought I would have three children ever, but our little girl just really wanted to be here so we did get pregnant with our third. This was by far my hardest, most unpleasant pregnancy. I gained a ton of weight but I was nauseous almost to the end of the second trimester. Awful. So I'm actually really glad. I'm going to miss having life inside of my belly because it's just amazing, but that pregnancy was rough enough that I'm like, “Okay. I think that's good. I'm satisfied.” Meagan: You're like, “Let's make sure that vasectomy is 100% this time.” Brittani: That's right. So this time around, as I stated in my earlier VBAC birth story, I prepared so much physically, so this time unfortunately, the weight gain got the best of me, but I was really dedicated to mental preparation. Meagan: Yeah. Brittani: I chose a home birth midwife team. Their names are Alicia and Nicole and they are with Flourish Midwifery also in Portland. They are amazing home birth midwives. I started with them really early on and my whole deal with this home birth was that I changed my language. I stopped using contractions. I said “surges”. I was just using different terms to describe birth and I went in just feeling like, “This doesn't have to be scary. This could be an amazing experience.” Surges just feel like really intense period cramps and you can literally feel the energy coming down. I don't know if you're a Bruno Mars fan but his 24-karat Magic was like, “Don't fight the feeling. Invite the feeling.” So I just kept saying, “I can do this.” I have a friend. She's a hypnosis coach turned friend and she does Hypnobirthing. My husband also wasn't super involved in the prep for Enrique's VBAC, but he was very involved with this one. So I did Hypnobirthing with my friend, Christy. Her business is called Enter Into Calm. She's also local-ish. She's a couple of hours away from me here in Oregon. So I just meditated to their rainbow—it's Hypnobirthing—relaxation every day. I listened to birth affirmations literally in the car back and forth anywhere I was going. Ina May's Spiritual Midwifery book—I rented it from the library three times and I read all of those birth stories. I dedicated myself so much to all of these positive, amazing birth stories and just gathered that collective strength. I just truly felt it in my bones. I was like, “I've got this.” Then 36 weeks, I had an anterior placenta. I didn't feel—Sophia's her name. I didn't feel Sophia move as much during this last pregnancy, so I was always a little like, “What's going on?” Meagan: Yeah. Brittani: At 36 weeks, we had the placement of my placenta checked and baby was breech. 36 weeks. I have chills all over my body right now just saying it out loud. My husband didn't go with me because it was just going to be a quick check of my placenta. I felt so defeated. I broke down crying and called my midwives. I took a day to just feel really crappy and sorry for myself. Then I decided to do something about it. I was like, “You know what? I prepared so hard for this. I'm not just going to give up these last four weeks or whatever.” Meagan: Right. Right. Brittani: Again, I'm so lucky to be where I am. I declined an ECV, external cephalic version-- I think I'm pronouncing that right—where they manipulate your belly to move the baby with our first because the OB just straight up told me that I'm going to want an epidural placed. “We're going to numb you, give you muscle relaxers and by the way, I have less than a 10% success rate.” So I was like, “I'm not going to do that.” But this time around, my midwives knew another home birth midwife who has her own acupuncture and chiropractic practice as well as delivering babies. Meagan: Breech babies? Brittani: Well, I did find breech home birth midwives but she does ECVs and she's incredibly successful. Meagan: Awesome. Brittani: So I went to her office at 38 weeks. I had done Spinning Babies. The information is all free on their website, but they have a specific program where you can pay a little bit of money to have it all on one sheet. My husband helped me do some belly sifting. I did all of these things for six days which is supposed to give more space in the womb. It's not always going to turn the baby because she didn't turn, but also just creates that extra space to help the ECV have a higher success rate. Meagan: Right. Brittani: So we get there. One of my midwives came with me which was so lovely. We brought some oil. The midwife put those darn needles in my pinky toes and it does hurt. She left us for 10 or 15 minutes. Alicia just massaged my belly and we talked to the baby. It was actually really beautiful. I took some really deep breaths. Meagan: Sounds like it. Brittani: While it was incredibly intense, I ended up with some bruising around my ribcage because she got Sophia transverse then she slipped back. So we had to do a second go and I was really worried it wasn't going to work, but she just had some kind of magic. I remember the rhythmic rocking when I knew she was just getting to the head-down position. My heart is even racing just retelling the story. So when she gets her head down, just busted into tears of relief and disbelief. Then I sat on the stool and she checked the baby's heart rate. Her heart rate never dipped and I just accredit that to me being so calm. I talked to her. I practiced for 5 months at this point doing this meditation and breath work so it was such a crazy, amazing experience. I ended up going into labor on her due date. During my meditation—you can't plan, but in my mind, I was like, “I'd love to go into labor when the older two are asleep and they wake up to a new baby sister.” I went into labor just as the kids were going to sleep. It picked up really quickly. I had the tub, but we didn't have time to fill it up. I was in my tub. I ended up getting out and we called the midwife around 3:00 AM. The midwife and doula got there between 4:00 and 4:30. I was on the bed at this point. I remember feeling this—I don't know how to describe it right at this point, but it was just such an intense feeling in my back. I now know it was her coming through the birth canal, but I screamed and I was like, “Somebody squeeze my hips!” I can't remember how many hours, but instead of doing the tapping like I did with my other when I was unmedicated at the time, it was really crazy. I was so loud. I can't believe the kiddos didn't wake up. It was like, “I can do this,” with this really low voice trying to bring the baby down. Meagan: And opening your throat. Brittani: I was such a low almost like a growl. Meagan: Yeah. Brittani: It was either, “I can do this” or “I've got this”. I felt it in my body, Meagan. I was like, “This is happening.” Meagan: Oh, that's amazing. Brittani: They somehow got me off my bed because they wanted me to move. I think they could tell I was getting ready to push and I was like, “I can't do it.” So the three of them somehow helped me to the short walk into my bathroom. This big birth tub is in there with four adults and they get me to sit down on the toilet. I'll never forget this. My doula who also was a VBAC mama and my acupuncturist for both my second and third pregnancy, she came to be our doula. I was completely naked also which I never thought would happen but that's just what happened. She wiped my sweaty hair off my face and told me how beautiful I looked. I can't even describe how that just changed everything because I was feeling really scared and I said at one point, “I don't think I can do this.” Those women just—I could not have done it without their presence. Anyways, I sat on the toilet and I heard this really loud pop. My water released then the rest of it was kind of just a blur. She'd only checked Sophia's heartbeat twice. I didn't have one vaginal exam and here I am and my baby's getting ready to be born. They asked me to stand up and I was like, “Not happening.” So I'm holding on with one arm on my husband, my doula on the other and I actually sunk my teeth into my doula's arm as I was standing up. It was so intense. Meagan: I was bit one time as a doula! Brittani: Oh my gosh. Meagan: After, she was like, “Did I bite you or did I imagine that?” I'm like, “Yeah, you did. That's okay though.” She bit into my hand. She grabbed my hand. Brittani: It's just such a primal thing. You're not really in control. Things happen. Meagan: Yeah, that's what she said. She said, “I thought I maybe did it but then maybe I imagined it.” Brittani: Crazy. I actually felt the same way. I was thinking about it, then I did weeks later apologize to her, but it was just like, what are you gonna do? What are you gonna do? Sophia was born so quickly. When I stood up, my legs were shaking. I had my husband and my doula. Alicia was like, “Do you want to reach down and touch your baby?” I just couldn't gather the strength to let someone's arm go, so I said, “No.” Then she offered to let my husband catch her and I was like, “You're not going anywhere.” Meagan: He's holding me up! Brittani: I really thought that I pushed for a long time, but she told me it was less than 5 minutes. Meagan: Whoa. Brittani: She just came right out. She had a nuchal cord. She had a really short cord too and she was just placed directly on my belly. They helped me walk from there to the bed and I just couldn't believe I did it. It was so surreal. Then I went through this—I had really bad shakes after. They said, “It's just the hormones.”Meagan: Adrenaline. Brittani: But it was wild. I felt so cold. They popped towels in the dryer for me and got me all warm. Wow. Just what a crazy experience. And Meagan, the second vasectomy worked. Meagan: See? This baby girl just wanted to be in your family. Brittani: Not even kidding. She just made our little family complete. Meagan: So complete. Brittani: Yeah. She really did want to be with us, our sweet Sophia. Meagan: Oh my goodness. I love that too that you were all in this bathroom, everybody hands-on right there and you could feel their strength obviously. Brittani: Amazing. Meagan: Yes, and then just boom. Baby's out. Brittani: I still can't believe it. Intact perineum actually. Both births, intact perineum. Meagan: I think that has something to do with position and control as well. Brittani: Totally. Gravity was so in my favor. Meagan: Mhmm and then not being stuck on your back in a crazy position. Brittani: Yes, which goes against all of the laws of gravity. Yeah. Being on your back is hard but for an epidural, it's kind of the only choice you really have, unfortunately. Meagan: Yeah. Yeah, for sure. They can move you side to side but a lot of the time, the providers don't feel comfortable with that. They really don't. Brittani: Of course. They want you in a laid-back position. I totally understand which is bad for what do they call it? Biological birth. I can't think of the word right now. Meagan: No, I was going to say physiological birth. Brittani: Yes, thank you. I think you're right. I think you're right. Yep. Yep. Meagan: Physiological. Yes, anyway. Yes. That is also to say if you guys are wanting an epidural and you're like, you know, you can still fight for other positions. Speak up and like she was saying in the OR, we wish that we could. It's just hard. We want. We're here in our heads saying things, but we can't vocalize it so if you are one of those people that feel like you would get there, I was too. My doctor was also in the OR talking about how sad they were that it was snowing outside and how they just got back from Hawaii. Brittani: Oh my goodness. Meagan: But have someone else, your birthing partner, your husband or your doula, or someone else there to say, “Hey, I know that this would mean a lot to her,” and communicate that, right? Brittani: I love that. Yes. You absolutely can and should. Meagan: And should. If you feel like you can't articulate it or there's not someone with you, just move as much as you can, right?Brittani: Right. I should have mentioned that I did ask for a peanut ball and we rotated while I had the epidural back and forth. They wanted me to push. I asked for some rest. I didn't get great rest, but you can absolutely advocate for yourself and ask for what you want. And yes, doulas or birth partners are the ones that get to be the bad guy. Let them do it. You do your thing and let somebody else do the uncomfortable things. Let's do it this way. Meagan: Yeah, yeah. We talk about it. I'm happy to be the bad guy. I'm happy to be the bad guy. It's not bad for someone to say something, but unfortunately, sometimes we are looking like the annoying ones but I'll be annoying for you. Well, congratulations. Brittani: Thanks, Meagan. Meagan: Congratulations on the completion of your family. I mean, I would usually say that would suck to not have it work but it sounds like it did not suck to not have the vasectomy go through. It's perfect and is exactly what you needed. Brittani: I quite possibly might have the world's best husband so I wouldn't have done it had I not married him. Meagan: Yes. Well, congratulations. You talked about how with the second VBAC, the third pregnancy, you really focused more on the mental aspect. This is where it's really hard because we want to find this balance between physically and educationally preparing for our VBACs but then also emotionally preparing. So is there anything that you—I mean it sounds like you did a lot. But is there anything that you are like, “This is something that I did that I truly felt I carried through my entire birth?” Brittani: Definitely believing in myself. When you have that self-efficacy, nothing can really stop you. It is important to prepare physically as well because our bodies go through a very physical process and it is physically taxing to be pregnant and then give birth regardless of how your baby enters the world. So just finding that balance of also not overwhelming myself because I get overwhelmed really easily. I just picked one main thing to focus on and where I found the most strength was reading all of the birth stories and listening to your podcast. I even went in the Facebook community, your Facebook group, and told my son's birth story and just sharing things because you really aren't alone. There is somebody else going through it. You can find your little village of people and my biggest thing is I always didn't entertain any negativity. If I talked about, “I'm going to have my baby at home,” or getting the looks or, “Ooh, is that safe?” I'm such a “Let me tell you why I'm right” kind of person. I chose silence at that point. I was like, “I believe in myself. I know I can do this,” and I just kind of put a wall up if you will to any of that negativity. And just know the facts. There is plenty of great information on your website. I knew all of the statistics and I was so educated and when I ended up in the hospital, it worked to my benefit because I was able to advocate for myself. Meagan: Yeah, especially with your team changing. Crazy. I love that. Believe in yourself. Brittani: Women of Strength, yes. Meagan: Women of Strength, you are strong and you can do it. You can get through anything. It's okay if plans change. Brittani: Totally. Mine did several times. Meagan: But also, know that if plans change, it doesn't mean that everything is just out the window. It doesn't have to be that way. We know that sometimes, things happen and it feels like everything just went out the window. It feels defeating and it feels frustrating but know that there are still options. There are still options. Brittani: Always. Meagan: And you are strong.ClosingWould you like to be a guest on the podcast? Tell us about your experience at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Meagan's bio, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/the-vbac-link/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Stephen Faller is a chaplain, educator, and author. He currently serves as a Chaplain Educator at Overlook Medical Center where he runs the Clinical pastoral education program. He is also the director and Founder of The Institute of Spiritual Midwifery which is dedicated to the development of the theory, praxis, and pedagogy of spiritual midwifery in the ministry of individuals, families, and organizations. His work in chaplaincy and his experience with cerebral palsy offer a unique and powerful perspective on the intersections of disability and spiritual caregiving. Through speaking engagements, educational initiatives, and personal interactions he educates and inspires others to approach spiritual caregiving with a more inclusive and compassionate mindset. He is the author of several books including “The Art of Spiritual Mid-Wifery” and most recently “Christianity And the Art of Wheelchair Maintenance”. In this episode we speak about dialogue in spiritual midwifery, dialectic, paradox, parables, barriers to spiritual midwifery, tools of the spiritual midwife, and living with disability.

In this episode, Blaine talks about her experiences with hospital birth, unassisted/free birth, and home birth. We dive into how being a family of color impacted how she was treated while giving birth in a hospital setting and discuss how tricky delivering a placenta can sometimes be. Disclaimer: This podcast is intended for educational purposes only with no intention of giving or replacing any medical advice. I, Kiona Nessenbaum, am not a licensed medical professional. All advice that is given on the podcast is from the personal experience of the storytellers. All medical or health-related questions should be directed to your licensed provider.The resources I mention in this episode are listed below:PNW Apothecary-Blaine Bennet: https://www.pnwapothecaryshop.com/ Birth Doula- Kristin Travis: https://www.BEarthmate.com/Open Arms Perinatal Servies: https://openarmsps.org/ Global Midwifery Services-Faisa Farole: https://www.globalmidwiferyservices.com/  Whole Body Pregnancy-Erika Davis: https://www.wholebodypregnancy.com/Definitions: Pica In PregnancyUnassisted Birth/Free Birth Postpartum HemorrhageTrilobed PlacentaPolydactyl FingersTENS UnitThe links in the section below are affiliate links. This means I get a small compensation from the companies that are linked as a “thank you”. There is no additional cost to you, however. I appreciate your support! Book Resources Mentioned in this episode: Ina Mays Guide to Childbirth: https://amzn.to/4023e92 Spiritual Midwifery: https://amzn.to/3n5Jovb Unassisted ChildSupport the showThank you so much for tuning in to this episode! If you liked this podcast episode, don't hesitate to share it and leave a review. It really helps bring the podcast up for others to find and listen to as well. If you want to share your own birth story or experience on the Birth As We Know It Podcast, head over to https://kionanessenbaum.com or fill out this Guest Request Form. Support the podcast and become a part of the BAWKI Community by becoming a Patron on the Birth As We Know It Patreon Page!

Geneva Montano, a midwife for more than 20 years, discusses the power of putting the authority of pregnancy and birth back into the hands of women and removing the shame around birth. Learn more about the spiritual path of birth, how to connect with baby, and how to step into this work yourself if you feel called to dive into the wisdom of the womb!

Why home birth? For today's DIAH Mama Holly Leever, her answer was: “I knew I would be more comfortable at home and would avoid a lot of unnecessary interventions.” This episode is part of a new format and style we will be featuring on the podcast every so often - a non-interview audio submission from listeners sharing their birth stories with us. We're excited to have this as another way to bring you more birth stories, for when we're at capacity with our interview schedule. And it's great for those who would prefer to share in this way.  Some of the topics mentioned in Holly's story: Practicing FAM Finding out she was pregnant Struggling with eating disorder before becoming pregnant Helpful resources during pregnancy A sweet and simple birth Links From The Episode: Holly's Website: Rosebudwellness.com Love Your Labor: https://brownrootslove.com/ Ina May's Spiritual Midwifery: https://amzn.to/3jVLfkI Steamy Chick: www.steamychick.com Womb Wisdom Podcast episode with Sarah: https://www.rosebudwellness.com/podcasts/womb-wisdom/episodes/2147827042 Offers From Our Awesome Partners: Needed: https://bit.ly/2DuMBxP - use code DIAH23 to get 20% off your order or DIAH100 for $100 off a Complete Plan More From Doing It At Home: Share your birth story with us: https://bit.ly/3jOjCKl Doing It At Home book on Amazon: https://amzn.to/3vJcPmU DIAH Website: https://www.diahpodcast.com/ DIAH Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doingitathome/ DIAH YouTube: https://bit.ly/3pzuzQC DIAH Merch: www.diahpodcast.com/merch Give Back to DIAH: https://bit.ly/3qgm4r9 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Anna is a Swedish-practicing midwife who was professionally trained in Australia. Anna discusses her view of birth as a rite of passage and a transformational experience, and she laments the current state of the maternity system, which often leads to birth trauma for women. She talks about the desire to control every aspect of pregnancy and birth, and the importance of relinquishing to the unknown and trusting in the intelligence and expertise of the mother and baby. Anna also shares her thoughts on the role of birth in society and the need for a more holistic approach to maternity care.This episode discusses birth trends around the world, the corporate and financial influences over birth practices, the meaning of spiritual midwifery and what it looks like in practice, and the ultimate feminine principle that birth is so often missing: Surrender. The fact is that nature is not inherently flawed. And while it is not perfect in every instance, the pursuit in the name of safety to monitor and control every mother and baby through the birth process has led to more problems than it has prevented. Join us in this free-flowing conversation on returning to our roots and fiercely protecting the divine feminine to achieve our safest and best birth with Anna the Spiritual Midwife.  Connect with us on Patreon for our exclusive content.Email Contact@DownToBirthShow.comInstagram @downtobirthshowCall us at 802-GET-DOWN Work with Cynthia: 203-952-7299 HypnoBirthingCT.com Work with Trisha: 734-649-6294 Please remember we don't provide medical advice. Speak to your licensed medical provider for all your healthcare matters.

Waiting for Bear's arrival involved months of preparation for Ellie and her husband Rob. They had a plan for a natural birth at home, including hiring a midwife and doula, taking special birthing classes, and creating a birthing plan (complete with playlists!).    Then … the birth happened. And Bear, it seems, definitely had some different ideas about how and when he wanted to arrive in this world.   We talk a lot about surrender in this work — that sacred way we know we can trust what the Universe is up to and can trust our intuition and desire along the way.    And sometimes surrender feels easy and amazing … and at other times, it is a deep spiritual (and literal!) labor.    It requires heroic levels of inward listening. It asks you again and again to return to the primal ground of your being.    Today, Ellie walks us through her entire birth odyssey, everything she was feeling, experiencing, and struggling with, all the support she received along the way, and what this journey has taught her that she never expected. This is an incredibly vulnerable, tender, and moving conversation!    What you'll learn in this episode:    Ellie's birth plan, and why she decided on a home birth What helped her the most in early labor The experience of a harrowing 30+-hour labor (that definitely did not go according to plan!) How she made it through the hardest parts What she wished she would have known going into labor What she learned — and what she'd like her next birth to be like   Explore our website: https://www.desireonfire.com/ Come and join our FB community: https://www.facebook.com/groups/DesireOnFire/ And connect with us on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/desireonfire/   Connect with Aimee: Check out my instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/aimeebatuski/   Connect with Ellie: Check out my instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/elliemontgomerie   Spiritual Midwifery, by Ina May Gaskin Tranquility by Hehe website and Insta   Rights Over Your Birth Package from Sacred Birth Doula

Join me for a special conversation with spiritual midwife Holly Makimaa—and get ready to go all kinds of places! Holly covers her own evolution as a writer, storyteller, coach, and interfaith/interspiritual minister and we dive into topics like yoga as kale, the mind as Kryptonite, portals and productivity, women as tenders of the collective—and that's just for starters! Holly's resources Visit Holly's website Join Holly's upcoming class on Claiming Strength, Clarity & Compassion Through Journaling—starts July 2022! Check out Holly's conversation with Foundations of Wellness for Women resources Visit my online home Schedule a call to discuss wellness programming for your team Schedule a YOURstory session for yourself. --- This episode is sponsored by · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. https://anchor.fm/app --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/liza-baker/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/liza-baker/support

Links: This episode is sponsored by Fairhaven Health, which is generously offering 15% of all of their products with the code BIRTHHOUR15 at www.fairhavenhealth.com. Know Your Options Online Childbirth Course Beyond the Latch Course (comes free with KYO course) Support The Birth Hour via Patreon! In spite of being a Large Animal Veterinarian (Board Certified in Animal ObGyn) and a Reproductive Physiologist studying human fertility, Dr. Joanna Ellington was surprised when the flu threw off her ovulation cycle and an unplanned pregnancy occurred. Using excellent classic references like Active Birth and Spiritual Midwifery, Joanna used perineal massage to prepare for childbirth, and was maybe a little too active with a 2 mile hike that turned into 5 miles the day before her membranes began leaking. An induction resulted in a normal birth where Joanna used her knowledge of birth and lactation in animals to enjoy the process as much as possible, even telling her midwife “That was kind of fun!” Joanna's second son was born within 10 minutes after she arrived at the hospital. In the chaos and discomfort of having two male doctors she had never met working on her son and her private parts, Joanna coped by switching into “medical professional mode" and talking to them about her research. But, she lost her focus on her baby and the moment. Sadly, she forgot to invite her waiting son and mother in to see the birth, as she had planned. This was a valuable lesson of not “taking care of others” or outwardly focusing during birth, but staying centered and baby focused.

Did you know that in South African private hospitals, where patients are better cared for, the C-section rate is 76%?! Joining us today all the way from South Africa is our friend, Danielle. She shares how she became part of that C-section statistic with her first birth, but also how she refused to let those numbers define her second birth. Though she fought an uphill battle, Danielle's successful VBAC was an achievement that changed the course of her life. Her strength has paved the way for others in her area to no longer become a statistic and to no longer fear natural birth. Additional linksNatural Birth With Great Expectations MidwivesHow to VBAC: The Ultimate Prep Course for ParentsFull transcriptNote: All transcripts are edited to correct grammar, false starts, and filler words. Julie: Welcome, welcome. You are listening to The VBAC Link podcast with Julie and Meagan and we have a really special guest for you today. This is episode number 186. We have Danielle with us and Danielle is from South Africa. She had her C-section and her VBAC in South Africa. We were just chitchatting before we started recording the podcast. There are private and public hospitals and in the private hospitals, which is where you get the best care, the C-section rate is 76%. 76%!Meagan: It's so crazy to me. The crazy thing is that it's where you get better care, but then–Julie: –where you are treated better, I know.Meagan: Yeah.Julie: In public hospitals, the C-section rate is 24%. When you combine those two together– I mean, I guess it just depends on the population density that is giving birth in each of the hospitals and so I guess I can't really come up with an overall rate there for the country. Maybe Danielle knows when she will share her story with us. But that is very, very large. Danielle had quite the battle to fight during her pregnancies, births, and deliveries, but we are going to go ahead and let her share that with you after Meagan reads a Review of the Week for us.Review of the WeekMeagan: Okay. This is from Brittany and it was actually on Instagram. She sent us a message on Instagram. It says, “Meagan and Julie, I just wanted to thank you for your amazing podcast. I just had the VBAC of my dreams a few days ago and honestly could not have done it without the encouragement of you guys and the women who share their stories. I was hesitant in wanting a VBAC going into my second pregnancy, but you guys gave me the confidence to do it.”Crazy enough, we just got a message today from someone saying, “I am super hesitant. I had a C-section with my first. I didn't progress past a 3, so my provider is telling me I am not a good match for a VBAC. I don't know what to do. Is that possible? What do I do?” And that is exactly what this podcast does. It does. It empowers you. It encourages you. It educates you to make the best decision whether it be a repeat C-section or a vaginal birth. So congratulations, Brittany, on your VBAC. We are so happy that this amazing podcast and we could help you. If you guys have had an experience or anything like that with the podcast, we would love to hear it. Feel free to do Apple Podcasts or like I said, Instagram, or Facebook. Send us a message. We would love to read your review on the podcast someday.Julie: I love that so much. I just want to say that whenever people say, “Oh yeah. Your podcast empowered me” or whatever, I will be like, “Well, you had the empowerment in you all along. We may have helped you discover it and open it up a little bit, but you need to own that. You were empowered. You did it You took charge. We might have helped you discover that along the way, but give yourself some credit too because you are pretty awesome.” That's what I think every time I hear that. It's pretty cool. I love all of our listeners and I love everybody that takes the time to leave a review, especially. So like Meagan said, if you have felt like the podcast has helped you on your journey, please drop us a review on Apple Podcasts, Google, or on Facebook. We would love to hear from you.Danielle's StoryJulie: All right. All right. All right. I am really excited and we know that Danielle is really excited to share her story with us as well. So Danielle from South Africa, we are really excited to have you on. Danielle is a busy mom of two little boys and she is an English teacher. She teaches English to foreign learners all over the world online. I think that is a really fun thing to do. I bet you have a lot of stories on that side of things too. But why don't you come on and share your stories with us about your births?Danielle: Hi. Yes, thank you. Thank you so much for having me here. Okay well, I guess I will jump right in and share a little bit about my first birth. I had a really healthy pregnancy. I carried to about 40+5 weeks, so quite a long pregnancy there. The first sign of labor was my waters breaking. In a flurry, we rushed immediately to the hospital. I had lost my bloody show. I was pretty much hooked up immediately to monitors. They confirmed I was having mild contractions. I was in early labor. This was in the night and I kind of went to sleep and thought I'd be woken up by excruciating contractions, but I wasn't. So by the morning, labor hadn't progressed at all. I was given antibiotics because of the membranes rupturing, and then taken to the labor ward basically and given Pitocin to open the labor. The contractions got stronger, but they were pretty manageable. When they did an internal, they saw that I wasn't dilating. I was 2 centimeters.The baby went into fetal distress and I ended up in an emergency C-section. It's not an uncommon thing, this story. But yeah. It left me feeling rather upset and I definitely just did not want it to go down that way. So almost immediately after I gave birth– this was probably two months after the birth– I came across the option of a VBAC. You know, when you are on maternity leave with a baby laying on your chest all day long, you discover these things. I found an amazing Facebook group and started following along, picking up all of the terms, some advice, and key providers, and I got really into it. I knew this was what I wanted to do for the next baby. When I got pregnant a few years later, it wasn't exactly a planned pregnancy. It was a little bit of a surprise, being COVID and locked up is not really an ideal situation for a pregnancy, but nevertheless, it was a happy surprise. I knew immediately that I had a lot of preparation to do. Not just physically, but mentally and emotionally because I had this dream of a VBAC that was now a reality and I knew it was time to go to work.The first thing I did was I contacted a doula who was recommended by a friend of mine. She was pretty shocked because I called her when I was only seven weeks pregnant. She said to me, “What are you doing calling me so early?” But she was amazing and she gave me some recommendations. I immediately started interviewing OBs and very quickly started to distinguish between a VBAC-friendly and VBAC-tolerant OB. I realized that unless the stars were going to perfectly align, I just wasn't going to get my VBAC in a hospital. I just knew that.So I met with Sarah and Elrika who are the midwives of Great Expectations. They are the VBAC dream team. As it is in South Africa, there is quite a stigma around natural birth. Going the midwife birthing center route is considered a little bit reckless and kind of like, “The hippies do it”. It is not really a common thing. So I was a little bit hesitant, but yeah. I went to meet with them. I also met with an OB who is very well known for being VBAC supportive. But still, I had some reservations. I was still very much afraid because we really are conditioned here to believe that natural birth is a scary thing. It's not a safe thing here. That's what we are taught.But I knew this time it was different because I knew if I wasn't happy with my caregivers that I would change the setup. But after every appointment with this team and with these people, I just felt more and more confident and definitely more at ease with my decision. I knew that I was surrounding myself with a really supportive VBAC team.And then I was referred by my midwives to a really wonderful woman called Sally. She is a birth counselor and just an all-around wonderful therapist. I still have session with her today just to deal with all of the struggles of motherhood. We spent about nine months working together because from the outside looking in, everything seemed fine in my first birth and it was okay physically, but emotionally, I was traumatized. I really, really was. So working with Sally was such a big part of the preparation for me. It was so empowering for me because I had to face a lot of heavy stuff. It was a lot of internal work. I really am so grateful that I was able to do that and have that resource because I know there are not a lot of women who do have that available to them. So we made really huge leaps forward, her and I. And of course, there were lots of speed bumps along the way. Even right until the end of the pregnancy, there were some speed bumps, but it was really important for me to get over this trauma. Apart from that in terms of the VBAC preparation, like I said, I was all in. I left no stone unturned. I went to an osteopath regularly. I did pelvic floor physio. Spinning Babies, I did that. I read birthing books. I read The Mama Bamba Way of Childbirth. I don't know if it's available in the states, but my doula recommended that one, and a bit of Spiritual Midwifery.I was listening to Solfeggio Frequencies on pain relief and did Epsom salt baths by candlelight. I was also even thinking of intentional things like, “Let me choose a candle that has a beautiful scent that I'm going to use in my birth,” and just holding up those resources that I could use in the birth. And then, educating myself. I was reading Evidence Based Birth articles. I watched the documentaries like The Business of Giving Birth.And then of course, at two months in, I came across your podcast. That, for me, also became such a huge part of my therapy. For about seven months, I would walk three to four times a week listening to the podcast, laughing and crying. I resonated so much with these stories because these women, what they were saying and the things they were feeling, they were my feelings too, so it was really such an important part of this journey for me.So I guess then fast forward to the VBAC itself. This pregnancy was no different. It was very healthy, thank goodness, and I carried quite late. I was about 40+6 when he arrived. We went into isolation about two weeks before the due date because this was the COVID protocol, and then for a few days, I was starting to lose my mucus plug a little bit. Then one night, I started having some contractions late at night. They were not that strong. I could sleep through them. But I remember it was a Monday morning at 6:00 a.m. when I woke up and they were still there. You just know in your body like, “Okay, something is really happening now.”So I told my husband, Dane, and he took our son Max to school. He came home and we got ready because we actually had an appointment with our midwives, just a routine checkup. They knew what was going down. They said, “Come through. Let's just have them look.” We went there. They were happy with how everything was going and they said, “Well, there is no need for you to check into the birth center right now. Go home and let labor take its course.” And I really wasn't sure. I mean, “Should I be walking up and down the halls trying to get this going?” Both of them and my doula said, “It's going to happen how it's going to happen. The best thing you can actually do is just rest and chill.” And so that's what I did. I lay in bed all day. I watched movies. I ate. I drank. I slept and the contractions were steadily there keeping me company all throughout the day. And I was just excited, really, because it felt so different than the first labor already. My husband was around. I told him to let the family know that things were going down. I was very specific about this though because I didn't really want anyone sending me messages or calling me because as it is, I am such a highly strung, anxious person. I am always in my head and I just knew that the pressure and those questions were going to derail me. It was almost like that big match temperament. I needed to go inside this bubble and just get my head right. So that's what I did. I stayed in this bubble all day radio silent basically.My mom came over around lunchtime. She was going to stay with Max when we were going to the birth center. By the evening, things were definitely intensifying. I went home and we were going downstairs and having some dinner with the family. I will never forget that it was chicken soup. I always think to myself, “What a fantastic pre-birth meal that was.” And then the midwives told me to get into the bath for about an hour and time contractions. So that's what I did. Again, using the same candles, the same music, the same space, and just resourcing on that safe space that I created throughout my whole pregnancy was really, really helpful I think.So my husband was putting Max to bed and my mom was with me while I was in the bath. We spoke a little bit just about random things, and we just sat beside each other. I squeezed her hand through all of the contractions. I have to say because I think it's a rule of thumb that you don't really have your mom around when you're in labor for various reasons, but I do have to say that it was such an unplanned thing, and it was such a lovely moment that we were able to have together for her to just be with me during this part of the labor. It was really, really special.And then, yes. The contractions were really strong at this point. Definitely, I was in active labor. So we called the midwives and told them that we were ready to come. We were on the way. And at this point, I could really barely get down the stairs. It was really tough to even walk. So my mom helped us get loaded in the car. I was in the backseat and I just remember feeling that shift. My moans and groans were getting louder. Dane was playing my VBAC playlist that I had created with all my feel-good songs and he was trying to amp me up, and I don't think I heard any of it. I was just in another zone.When we got there, we were checked into our room. It was so beautiful and so different than the bright lights of a hospital room. It's crazy. I had to do an internal upon arrival. I really told my midwives that I didn't want any unnecessary interventions or internals, but that's when I knew I had to do it, so I was prepared for it. It was really painful by the way. I couldn't actually believe how painful it was. We also had agreed that I didn't want to know how far along I was or how many centimeters I was dilating in case it would also derail me or discourage me. When Sarah, my midwife, finished the internal, she said, “Do you want to know how many centimeters?” And that, for me, was just everything because it was like she was really talking to me, not at me, which was what I had experienced before. I have so much respect for her for that. Really, I do. I said, “I only want to know if it's good news.” She smiled and said, “You are 6 centimeters.” I was so pumped.Julie: Yay!Danielle: It was so electrifying. It was really wonderful. And this was about 9:00 in the evening more or less at this time. So I lay there. My doula was there. Dane was setting up the room so beautifully getting the candles and the same music. Everything was familiar which was really, for me, what I needed. I lay on my side. That was the position I was most comfortable in, my left side. He read the birth affirmations to me that I prepared. They were filling the birthing bath as things were intensifying because I definitely needed something to help with the pain. The whole time, Dane was quite hesitant at the beginning of this whole process to have a doula in the first place and I am so glad that we did, and I think he was so glad we did because she drew him in in such a way that made him such a special part of this. She showed him things that I think he wouldn't have known and wouldn't have noticed. I mean, how could you? He'd never been to a birth before. Things like when I was leaning over the bed and I don't know what it's called, but there's a little bulge that appears in the lower back where you almost see the baby descending in the mom‘s pelvis. Just amazing things like that that she was able to show him which was really, really amazing.So yeah. I was told to empty my bladder before I got in the birthing bath. Again, it was so painful to even walk to the toilet and walk into the birthing bath. But I got in there and my doula just helped me through all of those contractions. I'll never forget, she kept telling me to open up my palms and not to clench them. It's quite an interesting thing going through these contractions and just remembering to keep my palms open. It was there that I really felt that transcendence. The one thing I didn't do was a Hypnobirthing course, but I read about it. It wasn't something I was aiming for, but I went into this really trance-like state. I really did. There were moments when Dane said to me– my eyes were closed pretty much the entire time– but there were moments when I would look at him and he said that it was like I was looking at him but I couldn't see him. My eyes were glazed over. That was such an added bonus for me because again, being such an anxious person, to be able to achieve that level of trance state was amazing and wonderful.I couldn't get it right in the birthing bath. I couldn't get into a good position. The contractions were coming hard and fast at this point. I even remember saying to Sarah, the midwife, “Can you give me something for the pain? Or is there anything you can give me?” and I think she said, “Darling, I want to do another internal before I give you anything.” I think I just scoffed at her because the thought of having another internal, I was like, “Uh no. No way. I will just deal with it.”So we continued with no medication at all. She couldn't really get a good reading of the baby at this stage, so I think they wanted me out of the birthing tub. It was just before I went out that the urge to push just hit me. Like, oh my goodness. It roared out of me and it was just this force that there was no stopping it. I just could not even believe how strong this urge was. But I got out of the birthing bath. I got onto the bed on my side again. I remember my doula whispering in my ear, “Okay. Just listen very carefully to everything Sarah is going to tell you and follow her instructions, okay?” I said, “Okay. I'm going to try.” I was in so much pain at this point. That urge to push just kept coming and coming and my midwife, her procedure or her method is quite slow and controlled. She tries to do it in such a way that is a bit slower but my goodness, that force was like it was bigger than me. I remember also that my doula, Liz, was saying, “Okay. Don't worry about keeping your palms open now. You clench. You bite. You do whatever you have to do to bear down.” My poor husband got the brunt of it. I was clenching his neck, poor guy.I remember that my hands were flailing above my head and both Sarah and Liz said to me, “Grab the inside of your thigh” or “Grab the back of your knee and pull your head down. Pull that energy downwards,” and my goodness, that made such a difference. I pushed. I think it was about 40 minutes of pushing.Meagan: That's not very long.Danielle: Not long at all. I know women in hospitals are sometimes told, “Don't push yet. Let's wait for the doctor,” and that was impossible.Meagan: Yes.Danielle: I could not have stopped it even if I tried. I really couldn't. He came out and I was so excited that I reached down and I grabbed him. The midwife was grabbing him and I was grabbing him, and I pulled him out and obviously wanted to put him on my chest. He had quite a short umbilical cord, so I think he only got to my stomach. But yeah. Then he lay there. Thank goodness, he didn't need any extra medical attention. The energy in the room was just so incredible. As I was getting cleaned up, we were all just talking, laughing, and crying. I think when you go through an experience like that with people– we'd been building this relationship throughout the pregnancy, but once you go through that moment, there's just this unspeakable connection that's created between you, the midwife, and the doula. It's really, really special.Meagan: Absolutely.Danielle: I remember once they had weighed him and I had a little rinse in the shower, I was lying skin-to-skin with him and Dane grabbed my face. I remember he kissed me and he said to me, “You did it. You did it.”Meagan: Aww.Danielle: He said, “I just want you to remember this moment right now. If ever there is something difficult or something you feel like you can't do, I just want you to remember that you did this.” I don't think he realizes how impactful that's been for me because it was such a huge hurdle to get through and I do. I think about how over the past year because it's almost been a year since the VBAC, and going through any tough time when I have this uphill battle, I do. I think back on those words, and what he said, and that experience and I let it fill me up, that feeling, because it's truly one of the most incredible experiences I have ever had, really.Meagan: That is so amazing. I love it so much and I love that he could say that. Like, “I want you to think about this and remember,” because it is. It's such an incredible moment. When you say that you go through all these experiences leading up to having the baby and then you have the baby and it's so much deeper. For me, my team, and the people that were with me that day, there are no words that describe how grateful I am for them and how much I love them and cherish them. I'm sure you will feel the same way forever. It's so special and it's so awesome to hear that you had such a great experience.Danielle: Thank you.Julie: Yes.Meagan: Yes.Danielle: It was amazing.Cesarean Rates in South AfricaMeagan: So I wanted to talk about a little bit at the beginning where we talked about how high Cesarean rates are. When you described your experience, I feel like you said this or maybe I said it in my head, but you were like, “This was not abnormal. This wasn't uncommon.” It's hard to hear that because it sucks. It sucks that it's not that uncommon. I hope that over time we cannot just be The VBAC Link, but that the world can make these experiences better because obviously, your body was very, very capable of having a vaginal birth.But yeah. I wanted to talk about some of the main reasons why a Cesarean should happen. Sometimes, Cesareans are very valid. They are very valid and we are grateful for Cesareans. But there are a lot of times when there are things that are said or done and it leaves questions.But I wanted to talk about some of the biggest reasons why a Cesarean may happen. One of them is failure to progress. The cervix isn't changing, the baby is not coming down, those types of things. It could be for a whole bunch of different reasons– being induced too early, overwhelming the body and not responding, scar tissue on the cervix, baby, and waters breaking early and maybe not coming down, those types of things. And then there are fetal heart problems where our babies' heart rates aren't in a safe zone anymore, so the best case is to have a Cesarean. Malpresentation or breech, meaning baby is not in the best position. On a podcast that we did just a week or so ago, she talked about how they confirmed right when they got there that the baby was OP, but then no one ever said anything about it the entire time, and then she pushed for three hours and they were like, “Oh, you have to have a C-section. Your baby is posterior.” And I am curious. I wish I could observe. I wished I could have come there and observed some of this birth to see what their reasons were and where they fit into these.Based off of friends, what are some of the biggest reasons why people are having C-sections in your area?Danielle: Yeah. Well, I am so glad you brought this up. This is such a big thing that I wanted to discuss because it's happening so much here in South Africa. Even moms that I know have reached out to me because they know that I had a VBAC and they recently had emergency C-sections. They didn't want them. They were led to believe it was the safer and better option and they were like, “Why has this happened to me?” So this is such a big part of why I want to share my story too. I really hope I can reach some people.So maybe just to give you a bit more background about what is going on in South Africa, you mentioned the C-section rates. A lot of women are actually having elective C-sections in South Africa. A lot of it is due to planning. They want to control the delivery date and a lot of this is based on fear and fearmongering by care providers. I mean honestly, we are led to believe C-sections are safer and better than natural birth. I mean, I heard on a couple of occasions women saying, “Oh, if you have a natural birth, you could really cause some brain damage to your child.”Meagan: Oh!Danielle: Honestly, this is our culture and I'm not even kidding. These are the conversations that I have been hearing and there's just so much misinformation about natural birth. Because we have perpetuated this culture of fear, it's taking over. It's being overused. It's been overprescribed for sure. Elective C-sections are even often routine to women, to mothers in their OB appointments. A lot of this has got to do especially with the insurance environment that OBs are working in and I am referring to the medical-legal costs which are extremely high in South Africa if you're in the private sector. This is definitely having a big influence on intrapartum decision making. There are even so many OBs who are going out of practice and only offering gynecological services, not even deliveries. Another big problem is there is such a lack of properly trained staff. There is a huge shortage of trained and qualified midwives in South Africa. Laboring patients in the hospital are often cared for by general nursing staff, not qualified midwives. OBs are getting so scared because of the high level of litigation that they are covering every base. They are covering every base. They are doing every test. Just to give you an idea, in my first pregnancy that was led by an OB, I had about 12 to 14 ultrasounds. 12 to 14.Meagan: Woah.Danielle: With the midwife, I had about 5 or 6. Just to give you an idea of how they are just putting everything on record. They don't want to miss a thing or miss a beat. I mean, it's standard now to have a test for gestational diabetes without any history of diabetes. So it's really, really interesting what is going on, I have to say. And a lot of the gynies– I know you call them OBs, sorry– we call them gynies.Meagan: It's okay. They're gynecologists too.Danielle: There we go. A lot of them, even though they themselves are pro-natural birth, they are operating in hospitals that have stringent protocols in place that are saying– in the hospital that I gave birth in the first time, I heard through the grapevine they are no longer doing natural births. They will not. They will not. They're only doing C-sections. I don't know how, but this is what I heard. I was digging around.So what's happening is, you know we talk a lot about interventions during birth and this cascade of interventions, but there are also a lot of interventions that are happening during pregnancy leading up to the birth. I'm talking about the kind of things that start to play on your emotions, like almost playing mind games with you. They really are. I mean, I know that I am, like I said, a typical case. My gynie was so pro-natural. Everything was cool. Nothing was wrong the whole pregnancy, and then the bait-and-switch started. That's what we call it, the bait-and-switch. You know, you start hearing things like, “The placenta is calcifying. Baby is not moving or descending. There are no signs of labor.” Again, routinely now, women are having internals done at 37 weeks pregnant. Something I didn't know at the time.Meagan: Is that an internal ultrasound?Danielle: No, just an—Meagan: Oh, a cervical exam.Danielle: Cervical exam, yeah.Meagan: Okay.Danielle: And of course, at that stage, do you expect any cervical changes at 37 weeks? Not really. You are not full term, you know? You are not full term. So those things start to discourage you like, “Oh no. Nothing is happening. Oh, maybe I am not going to go into labor or things are not right.” We've seen it. I have heard this in so many different forms where they say that giving birth is like making love for a woman. It's the feeling that she has to feel, the state of being she has to be in physiologically, mind, body, and soul to relax, give in, and let her body just be. And when your mind is being played in such a way, you can't get there. You cannot get there. That's exactly what happened to me. My body, I know, didn't do what it needed to do because it didn't feel safe to do so. It didn't feel safe. I was very afraid and I know that this is happening to so many women. It's quite a thing I have to say that's going on here. It's really, really quite a thing.Meagan: It's so interesting. It reminds me so much of Brazil. I mean, in different ways. They have different reasons why they do C-sections there because that's actually a sign of wealth which is crazy, right? It's a sign of wealth to have a C-section in Brazil from what we have been told.Danielle: That's crazy.Meagan: It's so crazy.Julie: Yeah, of privilege and being like you have enough money for people to take care of you, so you don't need to bother by–Meagan: –having a vaginal birth.Julie: –going through all of the trouble of having a vaginal birth. It's just a cultural mindset shift.Meagan: Yeah. It's fascinating to me. It really is. Like you said, I wonder how these docs are getting away with just scheduling C-sections, especially for first-time moms that have no previous C-sections. It's disheartening to hear and hopefully like I said, they will come around and one day here we will see a shift in the medical system.Danielle: I really hope so. And you know, I think that is why– I mean, a VBAC is not a common thing in South Africa because as you said in the beginning, you are working against the system. You really are working against it. But you know, as with any system, there are cracks in the system. You have got to find them, you have got to work around them, and you have got to fight to get the birth experience that you want because the odds are not in your favor, unfortunately. But I think the more women who push for it and fight for it, then the more we can normalize natural birth in this country.Meagan: Yep. Yeah. Well, it sounds like you are going to be a bigger impact than you even know in your community and I am so grateful that all of the people in your community have you. We are so grateful for your story and I am hopeful that people will listen to this and feel like they can find the tools that they need to get a birth that they deserve and that they want.Julie: Yeah. I absolutely love that. We appreciate you for sharing your story. It was incredible. We love the journey and my goodness, all the way around the world in South Africa. It's incredible. We appreciate you for being here with us today.Danielle: Thank you so much. This was great.ClosingInterested in sharing your VBAC story on the podcast? Submit your story at thevbaclink.com/share. For more information on all things VBAC including online and in-person VBAC classes, The VBAC Link blog, and Julie and Meagan's bios, head over to thevbaclink.com. Congratulations on starting your journey of learning and discovery with The VBAC Link. Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

An electric conversation between midwife and herbalist Krystina Friedlander and Rev Rhetta Morgan, a minister and spiritual midwife.  We discuss the mysteries of accompaniment and birth giving, the violence enacted by the patriarchy including practices of modern medicine, trusting bodies, communal possibilities of spiritual midwifery, and trusting our center. Check out KrystinaKrystina's websiteKrystina's InstaCheck out RhettaRhetta's WebsiteRhetta's LinkedInFollow Sara Jolena and Sequoia SamanvayaSequoia Samanvaya's WebsiteSequoia Samanvaya's Instagram Sequoia Samanvaya's Facebook Sequoia Samanvaya's LinkedInSara Jolena's LinkedInSupport the showLearn more about Sara Jolena Wolcott and Sequoia SamanvayaMusic Title: Both of Us Music by: madiRFAN Don't forget to "like" and share this episode!

Midwife Elena Rosa shares with Michelle the history and benefits of Arvigo Techniques of Maya Abdominal Therapy in this special replay episode. Together they discuss how each person's reproductive journey is their own, how the state of fight or flight affects the body, the connection between the heart and the uterus, deep healing, and following the lead of your heart.   "And just thinking about the grief and what we're told how we're supposed to be as women, what we're supposed to accept, what we're supposed to receive, what we're not allowed to stand up for, what we're not allowed to make boundaries for. You know, what we allow to happen to us because we feel like we're powerless. … But just processing what boundaries we're encouraged to have, but we're not encouraged to have. Like we're not allowed to speak up for ourselves. Like what we allow into our space, what is forced into our space. What is what we're allowed to grieve over. You know, there's so many things that we hold onto in our bodies."—Elena RosaAbout Elena Rosa:Elena is a practicing licensed midwife, an Advanced Arvigo Practitioner, and a retired licensed massage therapist based in Central Florida. As a woman of Puerto Rican descent who has lived throughout the Northeast and Southern regions of the US, Elena sees herself as a US citizen by birth, but a global citizen by responsibility.Elena feels there is no more profound challenge than the mastery of self. The pursuit of the limitless is one of personal growth and spirituality…cultivating self-care, self-awareness, and self-love. Elena had an interest in indigenous medicine since childhood. Elena has sought out personal mentors from North and South American traditions and Tibetan Buddhism. Having participated in countless prayer and meditation ceremonies and her own deep work has provided humility, depth, space for healing herself and others, and an ongoing practice of peacemaking.Most of all, she is the proud mother of a sweet girl who has taught her more about what her body and her heart are capable of than anyone she has ever met. Pregnancy, labor, and motherhood have brought no shortage of lessons in accepting all expected and unexpected challenges. What these experiences taught her is that she is an informed woman who knows her body, and she has all the information she needs to make the right decision for her and her child. This affirming gift is Elena's wish for every family she serves. Connect with Elena Rosa:Website:  https://mykindredmidwife.com/Tree Of Life Birth Center: https://www.tolbirth.com/Facebook:   Elena RosaResources:https://arvigotherapy.com/

"I got started in San Francisco in 1982 as a house dancer first at the Sutter Cinema, which is now defunct, and later on at the Mitchell Brothers O'Farrell Theatre. I was dancing one day a week and going to nursing school five days a week. Dancing was the culmination of a longtime history of public exhibitionism. I'm a '70s feminist, and I was told I had the right to live my life sexually on my terms and the responsibility to do it in a safe manner. For me stripping was that way. That was the place for women to go to be looked at naked while remaining safe. For two years I struggled with thinking, Could I be a feminist and want to take off my clothes? I came down the path that, yes, I could indeed be a feminist and take off my clothes because doing that was my choice. I was not being forced to or coerced to, and it was part of my sexual identity as an exhibitionist to do this. I became interested in sex as an idea when I was 12. I didn't have the words "polyamorous," "non-monogamous," or "queer" growing up, but I did have "exhibitionist," "voyeur," "bisexual," and "swinger." I've been in two long-term relationships. One was my first marriage, which was a triad marriage with a man and a woman. I was in that threesome relationship from 1981 to 2000. They're still together. He and I were legally married in 1986, and the divorce was finalized in 2003. She was with him when we met and is with him, still. They were never married. Let's just say it was a regrettable first marriage. If I had not had the outlet of being Nina Hartley, we would have broken up much sooner, but I'm good at compartmentalizing. When I was on set, onstage, or being Nina, they didn't bother me. My personal life was quite a struggle. It was a long time before I recognized what my responsibility to my own life was. I tell women in their 20s now, "If you're unhappy, leave. You get to go now." I'm very supportive of them. The problems I have in my life now — and this is what I tell young people — a few wrong turns in your 20s and it affects you into your 50s. I try to mentor younger women as much as I can, knowing that they're going to make their own mistakes anyway and you can't stop them from doing anything. I graduated from nursing school in 1985 magna cum laude, and I passed my licensing test on my very first try. I went to nursing school so that I could become a nurse midwife because my feminism was really tweaked in about 1972 when I read Spiritual Midwifery [a classic book about home birth]. My feminism started with wanting to help women reclaim the birth experience as a positive and empowering choice for themselves. If the sex thing in my life had not been turned up so high, I would have been a nurse midwife with a very active social life. I never did work as a nurse though. I wasn't ready for someone to die if I had a bad day. I don't have children. My joke now is that they forgot to wind my biological clock at the factory. I'm a devoted aunt and great-aunt. I'm the only woman I know without kids who did not want her own. I'm very happy not to be a mother. Going back to why I do what I do, I do it for my own jollies, but also because in our culture, sexuality is sick and sick people need a nurse's care. People are suffering with sexuality, suffering from not being able to be at home in their bodies, at home in their skin. They're suffering from not being able to make human connections with other people on a healthy and safe and pleasurable level. Dancing in a club that allowed full nudity, full penetration, full girl-on-girl sex, for me it was awesome." --- Send in a voice message: https://anchor.fm/antonio-myers4/message Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/antonio-myers4/support

Join Nancy Smith and Crystal Cockerham for a conversation about guiding women through the process of transformation, forging & solidifying their innate connection to their inner wisdom, truth and empowerment. Crystal Helps women claim their sovereignty & become the women they are truly meant to be and live a joy-filled life.

In this episode, co-host Maile joins us to talk about her path from women's studies major & birth doula to motherhood, her work as a sex positive professional, and how she & her husband approached opening up their relationship. Show Links & Transcript: http://bit.ly/SiPodcastLinks  Website: http://bit.ly/SocialIntercoursePodcast  Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/socialintercourse The Business of Being Born: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Business_of_Being_Born Ina Mae Gaskin - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ina_May_Gaskin Our Bodies, Ourselves - https://bookshop.org/a/23339/9781439190661 Spiritual Midwifery - https://bookshop.org/a/23339/9781570671043  Early to Bed (Our Advertiser!) - http://bit.ly/Early2BedSI  Polysecure - Attachment, Trauma & Consensual Nonmonogamy - https://bookshop.org/a/23339/9781944934989  #open Dating App - https://www.hashtagopen.com 

Después de quedar embarazada, Laura (o Felisa) se dedicó a hablar con otras mujeres sobre sus experiencias. La intrigó la alegría con la que una amiga que había decidido parir en casa hablaba sobre dar a luz, sobre todo por lo mucho que contrastaba con las anécdotas de sus amigas que habían dado a luz en hospitales. De ahí se interesó por el parto humanizado y por las parteras, y decidió parir en casa. Con Laura hablamos sobre la medicalización de la maternidad, sobre el nivel de soberanía que se les permite ejercer a las mujeres sobre sus cuerpos, y sobre cómo transformó el parto en casa su relación con su hija y con su pareja. A Laura y a Felisa las encuentran como @felisamusica en todas las redes. Su próximo EP, Canciones para crecer en el agua, está inspirado el nacimiento de Aviva, su hija. Pueden encontrarnos en su aplicación de podcasts favorita, o como @expertosdesillon en Instagram, @ExpertoSillon en Twitter, o también pueden escribirnos a expertosdesillon@gmail.com Expertos de Sillón es un podcast donde conversamos con nuestros invitados e invitadas sobre sus grandes obsesiones, sus placeres culposos o sus teorías totalizantes acerca de cómo funciona el mundo. Es un proyecto de Alejandro Cardona, Sebastián Rojas y Sara Trejos. REFERENCIAS: Los libros de Ina May Gaskin: Nacimientos, Guía del nacimiento y Spiritual Midwifery. Los libros de Michel Odent, en especial El bebé es un mamífero.

You're listening to episode 98 of the Happy Homebirth Podcast!Has Happy Homebirth influenced you in a positive way?  As we come up on episode 100, would you take a few minutes to go to speakpipe.com/happyhomebirth and leave a message telling us how it's impacted your life and pregnancy?  We'd love to share your message on episode 100!  What does preparing for a homebirth look like to you?  Do you prefer a done-for-you checklist, or do you enjoy putting the puzzle together yourself?  Although I am, of course, a huge proponent for childbirth education, particularly childbirth education FOR homebirth mothers, I love hearing how mothers choose to prepare for homebirth.  There’s no one right way, and in today’s episode, we’ll hear how amazingly Kyleigh did with her preparation.  From creating a birth labyrinth to practicing pain management techniques, there is so much to learn from this episode.   Show NotesKylie decided she wanted a homebirth before she became pregnant by listening to birth podcasts and realizing she didn’t like the sense of lack of control many seemed to experience in the hospital.  Once pregnant, she read the book Mama Zen, which she credits for her comfortable, mindful attitude during pregnancy and birth.  She feels it truly set her up for success.At 37 weeks her baby was transverse, so she began going to the chiropractor 3x/week, which helped baby into a good position.Before labor, she spent lots of time on her birth ball doing puzzles.  She also practiced pain management techniques by holding ice.Kyleigh’s labor was 9 hours: 5 hours of active labor, then 4 hours of pushing.Favorite books: Spiritual Midwifery, She Births, Unassisted ChildbirthShe created a “labor labyrinth” for herself Episode Roundup:Preparing for birth doesn’t have to look any specific way. When I spoke to Kyleigh before the interview, she was like, “Yeah, I really didn’t prepare.  I just went with the flow.” And she’s definitely not giving herself enough credit.  Kyleigh thoroughly prepared for her birthing experience, she just didn’t attach any unnecessary expectations.  She was there for it, whatever it would be.  I love the sense of mindfulness she brought, and this is absolutely something we harp on inside of Happy Homebirth Academy.Chiropractic care!  Whew, I can’t recommend it enough, and now I know Kyleigh is on board with it, too!  How incredible that she was able to create space for her baby to get in the correct position.Finally, I loved Kyleigh’s discussion of her ability to relax and be exactly as she needed to be to get her baby out of womb and into arms.  She was surrounded by a loving team, and she knew that she could make the noises, move in the ways she needed to move and be completely uninhibited.  THAT. Is what we need more of.  The understanding that we can do exactly what our body is telling us to do.  Whether it seems serene and quiet, or it sounds like a freight train coming at you, it matters not.  Birth is incredible, and allowing yourself to experience it fully— the way your body needs it to happen- is amazing.

Sermon series: 1 Peter 1:22-2:3 / 1 1: 22-2:3: David Ely - Spiritual Midwifery / (The Tron Church Glasgow - Sermons Online)

Sermon series: 1 Peter 1:22-2:3 / 1 1: 22-2:3: David Ely - Spiritual Midwifery / (The Tron Church Glasgow - Sermons Online)

Listen in as midwife Elena Rosa shares with Michelle the history and benefits of Arvigo Techniques of Maya Abdominal Therapy. Together they discuss how each person's reproductive journey is their own, how the state of fight or flight affects the body, the connection between the heart and the uterus, deep healing, and following the lead of your heart. "And just thinking about the grief and what we're told how we're supposed to be as women, what we're supposed to accept, what we're supposed to receive, what we're not allowed to stand up for, what we're not allowed to make boundaries for. You know, what we allow to happen to us because we feel like we're powerless. … But just processing what boundaries we're encouraged to have, but we're not encouraged to have. Like we're not allowed to speak up for ourselves. Like what we allow into our space, what is forced into our space. What is what we are allowed to grieve over. You know, there's so many things that we hold onto in our bodies."—Elena Rosa About Elena Rosa, LM:Elena is a practicing licensed midwife, an Advanced Arvigo Practitioner, and a retired licensed massage therapist based in Central Florida. As a woman of Puerto Rican descent who has lived throughout the Northeast and Southern regions of the US, Elena sees herself as a US citizen by birth, but a global citizen by responsibility.Elena feels there is no more profound challenge than the mastery of self. The pursuit of the limitless is one of personal growth and spirituality…cultivating self-care, self-awareness, and self-love. Elena had an interest in indigenous medicine since childhood. Elena has sought out personal mentors from North and South American traditions and Tibetan Buddhism. Having participated in countless prayer and meditation ceremonies and her own deep work has provided humility, depth, space for healing herself and others, and an ongoing practice of peacemaking.Most of all, she is the proud mother of a sweet girl who has taught her more about what her body and her heart are capable of than anyone she has ever met. Pregnancy, labor, and motherhood have brought no shortage of lessons in accepting all expected and unexpected challenges. What these experiences taught her is that she is an informed woman who knows her body, and she has all the information she needs to make the right decision for her and her child. This affirming gift is Elena's wish for every family she serves. Connect with Elena Rosa:Website:  https://mykindredmidwife.com/Facebook:   Elena RosaResources:https://arvigotherapy.com/ Connect with Michelle Smith:Website:  BirthEaseServices.comFacebook:   Birth Ease,   The Birth Ease Podcast,  Birth Ease Baby Loss SupportInstagram:    @birtheasemichellesmith,  @birtheaselossssupportYouTube:    Birth EaseLinkedIn:  Birth Ease Michelle SmithPinterest:  Birth EaseShow:  Birth Ease

Today’s episode is about birth trauma – whether you’ve experienced it first hand, are on your journey of healing, or want to support fellow mothers on theirs – this episode is for all of us. I’m joined by the founder of the non-profit charitable organisation, Voice For Parents. Carla Sargent helps mothers and whanau to heal their hearts after broken births and quite simply, the mahi she does is incredible.I’ve wanted to speak to Carla since the inception of Motherness, knowing that the saying of ‘at least you’ve got a healthy baby’ that we all hear or sometimes dish out is often well meaning but invalidates and dismisses the right and deservedness we all have to a positive and empowering birthing experience. To many of our mothers, that sentiment that you should be grateful for the physical safety of themselves and their baby is detrimental and it fails to recognize the lasting effects birth can have on the Fourth Trimester and well beyond the immediate postpartum period. The message from today’s episode is clear: however you feel about your birth, your feelings are valid. If today raises some feelings of trauma about your own birth, please reach out for help. Resources:Voice For Parents website & Facebook Carla's Birth Trauma survey reportMy Birth StoryGentle Birth Gentle Mothering by Dr Sarah BuckleySpinning Babies Kelly Spriggs Facebook page Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskin Ina May's Guide to Childbirth by Ina May Gaskin Where the Heart Is by Carla Sargent Birth Trauma Support NZ Facebook group Support services:Perinatal Anxiety & Depression Aotearoa Depression Helpline - 0800 111 757 Lifeline - 0800 543 354 Parent Help - 0800 568 856 Anxiety Phone Line - 0800 269 4389 PlunketLine - 0800 933 922 For a referral to Maternal Mental Health please contact your midwife or GP Mental Health Crisis services (for emergencies only) This episode discusses perinatal depression and anxiety, and mentions suicide which may be triggering for some people, so please take care while you’re listening and take a break if you need to. Follow Skye Ross on Instagram. Follow Motherness on Instagram.

Graham Betchart is on a mission to normalize and popularize mental skills training.  A leader in the mental performance field, he is co-founder of Train the Mind, the first ever online mental training gym which serves as an elite Mental Performance Platform for student and professional athletes, executives and leaders.  Graham has spent over fifteen years training the minds of some of the nation’s most elite basketball talent. He continues to mentally train athletes at all levels -- from high school, to USA Top 100 camps, to collegiate athletes, to the NBA -- including three #1 NBA draft picks (Ben Simmons, Karl Anthony Towns, and Andrew Wiggins). Graham most notably has worked with Aaron Gordon since he was age 13, earning Graham acknowledgement as one of the most influential, yet under the radar, mental performance professionals in the world.  It’s with Aaron Gordon that he founded Train the Mind to promote the well-being of every child, student, and athlete.  Graham and Aaron’s journey together and ongoing work is featured in a new original documentary series titled Moving Minds, which is releasing in 2021. Graham authored Play Present, and was previously the Director of Mental Performance at Lucid, an app to help athletes train their minds to improve athletic ability -- a role he shared with George Mumford, the mental skills coach to basketball great Michael Jordan. The core of Graham’s methodology draws upon meditation, visualization, and present moment awareness practice; he captures and repackages the essence of those practices into easily digestible, powerful, and practical tips for coachable moments in high-stakes situations. Graham’s journey to the heights of this field began perhaps before he was born.  He was delivered on a hippie commune in Tennessee called The Farm by “the Michael Jordan of midwives”, the legendary Ina May Gaskin, author of Spiritual Midwifery.  Raised by a single mother who also became a midwife, he heard at an early age that brain and consciousness can be actively rewired.  Discomfort was something to be leaned into -- that the right consciousness and training in the midst of these intense moments had the potential to transform pain into healing. Authenticity and purpose were also key values in Graham’s home such that failing to follow your passion and true calling was deemed to be the biggest failure of all.   Following that passion initially led Graham to basketball, where he aspired to be a professional player.  Yet his competitive sports career came to a halt in his first year of junior college when a series of injuries and serious personal setbacks sent him into a rapid spiral of depression.  Feeling like he was going to die or that life wasn’t worth living, he called his mother, who reminded him that his brain can be rewired.  She recommended he go to a woman named Jocelyne Nielsen to begin his healing journey.  Joycelyne herself was a student of Babaji Bob Kindler who had been studying and practicing Vedanta since the early 70s when he was initiated by Swami Aseshananda, a direct disciple of the wife and consort of Sri Ramakrishna, Sarada Devi. Graham spent two years with Jocelyne learning meditation, visualization, and positive affirmations before a baseline of joy returned to his life, yet he realized that the healing had begun from the first moment of his initial visit.  Once he felt recovered, Graham decided to start school again and attempt to make the UC Santa Cruz basketball team as a walk-on candidate, a task in which he succeeded against all odds.  Despite not being the best player on the team, he knew he had a powerful mental game that made him a presence on and off the court.  It’s during this period that he recognized and developed the concept of “Victory Goes to the Vulnerable”, reversing a gender scripting where male athletes are often taught that vulnerability is weakness.  Paradoxically, he found that only those with deep confidence have the capacity to move towards and enter their deepest vulnerability, and that those spaces are exactly the ones of deepest learning, healing, growth, and transformation.  After college, he discovered sports psychology, recognizing that earning a master’s degree in this field could be his vehicle to bring the inner technology he had been practicing more broadly into the world. Graham’s first job was accepting a four-year commitment as a junior varsity coach at Mission High School in San Francisco, where he began practically deploying the ideas that he would ultimately pen in Play Present.  The theory revolved around a concept called “next play speed” -- how quickly one could either bounce back from a disappointment or else re-ground after a triumph, to once again have their entire focus on the present moment.  After four years of steady improvement, the team finally won its first championship.  He stayed on for several more years, winning several more championships, just to prove that the techniques and training he was deploying were not a fluke.   Meanwhile, word of his unique training spread, bringing him in contact with more young athletes and in other schools across the San Francisco Bay Area.  He coached many talented kids as a gift, never charging fees or asking for anything.  Besides seeking to be the voice he wished he himself had had when he was younger, his game plan was to propel his athletes to the highest level of the NBA so he could normalize and popularize mental skills training.  Over the years, many of the kids he’s coached have done exactly that.

In this episode Holly interviews Farm Midwife, Sara Rosser about the magic of childbirth & how to support women during the sacred transition from maiden to mother + gives a Tarot Forecast for the upcoming New Moon in Pisces. Mentioned in this episode: Sara Rosser - https://www.sararosser.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/sararosser/ Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskin- https://www.amazon.com/Spiritual-Midwifery-Ina-May-Gaskin/dp/1570671044/ref=sr_1_1?crid=28JB9T8A3VPBA&keywords=spiritual+midwifery+by+ina+may+gaskin&qid=1582396976&sprefix=spiritual+mid%2Caps%2C223&sr=8-1 The Farm- http://thefarmmidwives.org/ --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/tarottalk/support

An international best-selling author, Mentor & Feminine Wisdom Teacher, Crystal Cockerham works with women to guide them through the spiritual alchemical process of transformation in order to be liberated from the world’s perceptions. Using her own special blend of Spiritual Midwifery, she guides women through the process of transformation, forging & solidifying their innate connection to their inner wisdom, allowing them to access their own truth, empowering them to claim their sovereignty & become the women they are truly meant to be, and thus to live a more connected, joy-filled life. To begin your journey, and find out more, visit: www.WisdomAwakens.com

My wife, Lexxaus, and I share information on the professionals who have gotten us to this point in our journey to expand our family.  Lexxaus talks about: home births, water births, our midwife, Charlotte, her chiropractor, Kristin Marchman, and her awesome photographers Brittney Sweat and Jolie Justice.  If you are thinking of adding another awesome human to your family, you should check it out.  Books referenced in this episode are: HypnoBirthing, Ina May's Guild to Childbirth, and Spiritual Midwifery.

In today's podcast Tahnee speaks with Jenny Allison. Jenny is a seasoned acupuncturist with a special interest in women's health postpartum. With 25 years of experience under her belt, Jenny is a wealth of information and a true master of her craft. "A woman is never more beautiful than after the birth of her first child"     The ladies explore: The four common themes integral to postpartum care across traditional cultures. The importance of understanding the physiological processes that take place in the body postpartum. Nutrition care postpartum; how to use food to nourish the blood and strengthen the Qi. The link between food and postpartum depression. The essential role good quality complex carbohydrates play in women's health postpartum. Honouring the transition into motherhood. The East vs West approach to postpartum care. The concept of "the golden opportunity", a healing window available to women in the various seasons of their reproductive cycle. Who is Jenny Allison? Jenny Allison is an acupuncturist and graduate of ACA, Sydney (1984). Jenny has trained with teachers in Nanjing, Hangzhou, London and Sydney. Jenny's passion for the last 25 years has been women’s health, with a special interest in women's health postpartum. An the author of ‘Golden Month, Caring for the World’s Mothers after Childbirth’ (Beatnik Pub. 2016), Jenny has interviewed many mothers, grandmothers and midwives as part of the research for her book. Jenny has found that Chinese medicine offers a unique perspective in interpreting traditional postpartum practices worldwide. These practices have served women well for many generations, whereas the modern Western lack of good postpartum care, along with social pressures around appearance and workplace productivity, is not serving women or their health. Jenny is committed to preserving the worldwide heritage of women’s postpartum wisdom, and to improving the care of mothers everywhere. Jenny has two grown-up children, is grandmother of twin girls and practices acupuncture and Chinese Medicine in Auckland, New Zealand.   Resources: Jenny's Book   Q: How Can I Support The SuperFeast Podcast? A: Tell all your friends and family and share online! We’d also love it if you could subscribe and review this podcast on iTunes. Or  check us out on Stitcher :)! Plus  we're on Spotify! We got you covered on all bases ;P   Check Out The Transcript Here: Tahnee: Hi everybody, welcome to the SuperFeast podcast. We're here today for the women's series with Jenny Allison, author of the Golden Month. Jenny is a acupuncturist and graduate of the ACA in Sydney and she's trained with teachers in China, London, and Sydney. Her passion for the last 25 years has been women's health, and she has a special interest in postpartum, which is what we're going to have a chat about today.   Tahnee: You can get her book from all good online retailers and bookstores or have a look at Beatnik Publishing. I'll put a link in the show notes for you guys to find it. One of my favorite things about the book were all the interviews that she conducts with mothers and grandmas and midwives as part of her research for the book.   Tahnee: It's through this lens of Chinese medicine that Jenny really offers her unique perspective and interpreting all of these traditional practices for the modern woman. Yeah, it's just this idea of how do we bring some of this postpartum care into the West. I know that we have a lot to talk about, and not a lot of time, so we might get going, Jenny, but I just wanted to welcome you first to the podcast, so thank you for being with us today.   Jenny Allison: Oh, thank you. Thank you, Tammy. Yeah, I'm really pleased to be on your podcast.   Tahnee: Very excited. I know you have your own grownup kids and little twin grandbabies, that's very cool. Are you able to tell us a little bit about how you came to be interested in postpartum care? Was that through your own pregnancies and birth or some other way?   Jenny Allison: Yes, actually, straight after I graduated I had my first child, and we'd been given the bear lines of the postpartum's in Chinese medicine theory, and I thought well, just sounds amazing. I'll put it into practice.   Jenny Allison: I was living in Australia, and I called my mom in Syd, "Can you come?" And she didn't have any background in Chinese medicine and she said, "Of course I'll come," so she was waiting in the wings for it to come, and I kind of explained the basic principles to her and she gave me most wonderful postpartum. We didn't do massages. This was a long time ago, and my mom was a bit old school, but she gave me what I think is probably the most important, which a nest of support that I could empower myself, and so I never felt as though she was dictating to me or trying to control the way I was doing things. I just felt that she was there for me, and I think that was really crucial.   Jenny Allison: I've been very inspired by that, and I started to talk to my patients about what they did in their postpartum, and most people said, "Oh, I wish..." It's just a time of complete exhaustion, and although people initially recognize the wonder of birth and they seem to look for hours and congratulations, but it comes down to the practicalities and what you need 24/7 basically. There isn't the framework and the wait for the new mothers' needs to be fulfilled.   Jenny Allison: So from there, sorry this is getting a bit long, I started to just research all around the world, and the most exciting thing I discovered that with these commonalities with almost every traditional country in the world with the Chinese medicine approach. That was just a tremendous validation of the inherent wisdom of these practices.   Tahnee: And so are you able to share the commonalities, because that was something that I picked up in your book, that you've really identified four kind of themes or similar practices across cultures that postpartum care was kind of focusing on.   Jenny Allison: Yeah, I mean there could be five if you stretched it, but I think the basic ones, first of all rest. I'll just list them first for you. So rest is absolutely crucial, and then very important and quite neglected in the West is the idea of warmth, keeping the mother warm, and warming her in certain areas of her body and giving her a massage.   Jenny Allison: Then of course, and this is a very big one, and that is diet, because in Chinese medicine diet is medicine. That's always the first intervention if you like, if you want to restore your health is diet, so that's tremendously important in the postpartum. Then the final one, which is the most important of all, because nothing else can happen without it is support, and just being cared for, traditionally it would be older women, one's partner, and just community around you. Support is crucial for everything else happening.   Jenny Allison: Those are the four basic-   Tahnee: What would the fifth one be? I'm really curious if you could throw that extra one in there.   Jenny Allison: No, it's just some people divide support into honoring the mother as well in quite a formal way. I think in anthropology, that's something that's quite well documented, that the mother is given an honor that everyone else in the community recognize, whether it's giving of gifts to her rather than to baby, or whether it's just acknowledging her on a daily basis like, "Hello new mother," or calling her, I know in North Africa if a mother has twins, she's called Blessed One, so she'll be addressed as Blessed One. That could be the first one, but it's really part of the fourth one.   Tahnee: Okay. I guess, is that in many ways to honor that transition from maiden to mother, and to kind of reposition that woman in the culture or the society that she lives in? Is that kind of the intention?   Jenny Allison: Yes, it's very much a daily reinforcement of her change in role, and the status and honor of her role. I mean, if we think about it, she has to be applauded for her bravery to go through birth, and also after, and her generosity in what she's giving in terms of her total devotion to the baby. She's been through what some cultures call A Woman's War. She needs to be treated as a hero.   Tahnee: When we look at the lens of Chinese medicine and these four commonalities, they seem quite simple, put in practice.   Jenny Allison: Yeah. I think what you have to understand first, I mean for people who haven't a strong cultural background of a postpartum, I've noticed that it's important for them to actually understand in terms of theology what's happening to your body and mind after giving birth in the postpartum.   Jenny Allison: I think women understand, and their partners and people around them understand these messes with all the changes happening that actually involve almost every organ in the body. When they understand that, then they can go, "Oh, okay, it's logical then that we treat this time as something really special, and take this opportunity for women to heal well."   Tahnee: So can you give us a brief summary, and obviously not a lot of time, so we don't... physiology, like-   Jenny Allison: Oh, the changes?   Tahnee: Yeah, what are some of those medical changes in case people aren't aware.   Jenny Allison: First off, the obvious one is that the placenta site has to heal, and that takes six weeks. You get the lock hair discontinuing and slowly diminishing over six weeks. That's in line with the placenta site healing, so that first has to happen.   Jenny Allison: And you've got big changes to the vagina and cervix, and they are quicker to heal, but there are big changes. And there is, in surgery, obviously much, much bigger healing takes place.   Jenny Allison: But then you've got some quite interesting theological changes because the output of the heart changes dramatically after childbirth. Initially the output is quite high because obviously you're supporting the placenta, you're increased blood volume. Once it's delivered, suddenly the output is lower, so it's like a water mill with suddenly the water flows through it is lower.   Jenny Allison: This explains why women can easily feel cold and tired, because their heart output actually takes up to six weeks to normalize to a pre-pregnancy heart output again, so that's just a really obvious reason a woman should be resting and caring for herself well.   Jenny Allison: Then you've got the kidneys. They're excreting quite a lot of the whole process of the uterus coming down and the cells shrinking again back to pre-pregnant state, so the kidney are working hard too. Then you've got these tremendous hormonal changes, which probably are more commonly known, and the other changes of the progesterone and the estrogen dropping dramatically when the placenta's expelled, and at the same time, the beginning of the output of the oxytocin, which will stay high while the mother births feet.   Jenny Allison: You could write, well people have written many books about oxytocin, because it's a huge subject, but a tremendously helpful hormone to have in the postpartum. I won't go into it here, but it's basically about love and trust, and trusting key people. It's not like a love dragon. It's about tuning in to key people, so both the baby and the mother, and father, and those around her to elicit agree to producing oxytocin which is a hormone of bonding.   Jenny Allison: Those are the main things, but the change with the estrogen and progesterone, some women, their brains are more susceptible to low estrogen, which means that there are fewer available to return in the system, and while initially you have this tremendous production called endorphin, which helps with pain, those levels drop after the first few weeks, and then you're left with low estrogen.   Jenny Allison: If you are one of those women who are more vulnerable to return in relationship with estrogen, then you can start to experience depression then. So that's one really obvious reason of why the mother should be absolutely coveted and really well looked after.   Jenny Allison: The final one that is also really important, which is perhaps also not talked about much, and that is cortisol. Initially just after the birth, the cortisol's high and it needs to be because it helps promote proper clotting, and obviously you need the adrenaline and cortisol being high during the labor, but afterwards you want that cortisol to normalize because if cortisol stays high which happens when women are under stress, then you don't get proper wound healing and you get a feeling of being stressed and exhausted, and eventually if the cortisol stays high for ages, you'll get adrenal exhaustion and your milk goes down and you're just totally depleted.   Jenny Allison: One really interesting thing is that cortisol stays high if people's status is in question. It's kind of of physiological truth about human beings, but if you feel that if you're low status your cortisol will stay high or it will go up. If you're on it and you're felt to be of high status, your cortisol level will drop, and so that makes it really obvious while you would honor the mother just for that reason alone.   Tahnee: Yeah, that's a really powerful kind of... Yeah, and when we look at our culture and how postpartum women are treated a lot of the time, it's all about the baby, nobody gives them any attention or takes care of them.   Tahnee: Yeah, I could hear in there that you were also talking about the kind of spleen organ system there when you're talking about the serotonin and this ability for the body to... Because I'm imagining digestion plays a huge part in this, and you talked about that a bit at the beginning like keeping the mother warm and nourished and those things.   Tahnee: You speak about food and herbs in your book, the Golden Month, and I've thought about it a lot in terms of this idea in Chinese medicine invading cold and winds and all of these things which are kind of fundamental ideas of what can create things like aches and pains and chills and fatigue and all this stuff in the body.   Tahnee: I mean, warm, mushy food? Like what other kinds of things that you see being really beneficial?   Jenny Allison: I mean, I've talked about Western medicine, but you could sum up really briefly from a Chinese medicine perspective, the woman is considered to be qi and blood deficient in general after childbirth, so that describes someone who is susceptible to cold, who can easily get tired, and with a blood deficiency can easily become emotional.   Jenny Allison: What you want to do with the food is you want to nourish the blood, and you want to strengthen the qi. As you said, what the very first approach is to make sure that food is digestible and warm, because there's also a very simple mechanical fact that if you put cold food into your stomach, your body has to work harder to actually get the temperature in your stomach up to a point where the enzymes can become properly active. So all you're doing if you put cold food in your stomach, is you're taking away energy that's needed for healing and for breastfeeding.   Jenny Allison: The most obvious thing to do is to prevent any unnecessary use of energy. Of course you put the food already warm into the stomach, and then the body doesn't have to work so hard. In Chinese medicine, we say that that will help to strength the stomach and spleen.   Jenny Allison: Then because there's a lot of healing taking place, and you're producing milk, you have to have food which is nourishing the blood. So if you just translate that into Western terms, basically it's nutrient-rich, and good quality protein. So some people say chicken. All around the world, women are given chicken soup. It's almost everywhere, and when I was interviewing women, and I said, "So, what would be the main things about the diet?" And then they'd go, "I know one thing I can say." And they said, "Chicken soup."   Jenny Allison: Chicken soup is like the most fantastic go-to for postpartum women, because it's nutrient rich. It's got all the minerals, the amino acids, everything that's being leaked from the body, the gelatin at the same time, so it's warm at the same it's helping to strengthen qi because you put other things with it, and it'll have some carbohydrates in it as well. It's almost like a one-stop shop, chicken soup.   Jenny Allison: There's one thing I've really learned, and that's that postpartum is about empowerment. The mother is really, she's in control, she's the queen, and if mother says, "Look, I'm sick of chicken soup," then you don't give her any more chicken soup. You give her what she wants.   Tahnee: Yup. I've really observed reading a lot of work around this that there are quite a lot of animal foods in there for rebuilding, and slow-cooked things, and often a use of herbs. Like, I used personally a lot of jing nourishing herbs, and kind of qi nourishing, and blood nourishing herbs postpartum. I would put them in my food.   Jenny Allison: I think what you can do is put those herbs into bone-based soups like chicken soup, which is a star basically, and then you're really concentrating your intention with all the vitamins, minerals, and the effect of the herbs, the jing herbs.   Jenny Allison: But I suppose I should also say that, I mean, why there's an emphasis on animals foods is because they are a very easy and good quality source of protein, and this is very important for women in the West who follow a vegan diet. Protein grounds the spirit in Chinese medicine, because it nourishes the yin in the blood. It grounds the spirit. That's really, really important postpartum.   Jenny Allison: So for women who are vegan, it's important that they think carefully about their diet, and manage to get a lot of good quality concentrated protein from another source, because that is really an important aspect of postpartum diet, is that it's grounding. It grounds a woman and her body.   Tahnee: Well, it's such a... I mean the marathon analogy gets bandied around a lot, but the process of creating another human and then birthing them, and then nourishing and feeding them intensively for a period of time. It does require resources, doesn't it? It's not something you just take on lightly.   Jenny Allison: Absolutely.   Tahnee: I know for you, we spoke a little bit before we jumped on this call, but around the sort of preparatory, you know making sure that you're ready, I suppose, during pregnancy and even before that.   Jenny Allison: Yeah, that's a really important point, because if you go into childbirth and nutritionally not resourced, then you're on the back foot basically. I think it's really important to make sure that during pregnancy you're eating well.   Jenny Allison: There was a very interesting study done of the Mediterranean diet, which I think everyone knows it's high in antioxidants and low in trans fats and bad carbohydrates. Basically there was a big study done in Crete, and the daily olive oil intake was quite big. It was more than 40 grams, but it was not processed, it was locally produced olive oil. It was very high in antioxidants, but the Mediterranean diet basically is high in antioxidants, so it's got a lot of fresh fruit and vegetable, airy sea food, not a lot of sugar and junk food and overly sweet food.   Jenny Allison: What they found was they compared another group of women who basically ate what they called was a Western diet, consisted of salty chips and red meats and takeaways, trans fats, and a lot of sugar, and they found this relationship that was so clear that it was quite stunning really and that was that 50% more depressive symptoms were recorded in woman who ate a Western diet.   Jenny Allison: The women who ate the Mediterranean diet were half as likely to get postpartum depression as those eating with the diet. It was a good study, so basically it wasn't these women who were upper class and eating well anyway, or got all situations anyway. It was just two different populations, probably rural and probably urban. Anyway, the result was so clear, and it was a big study of 500 women, so that becomes a groundbreaking research I think to show that what you do in the pregnancy is really going to have an effect on the postpartum.   Tahnee: And so simple I think when we look at diets like that, that they're very moderate in all ways.   Jenny Allison: Yes, not expensive. Not an expensive diet.   Tahnee: Yeah, it's not an extreme, because certainly something I'm quite passionate about is moving away from extreme ideologies around eating. I think women have enough pressure on them as it is, you know?   Jenny Allison: Actually on that, I'm sorry to interrupt, but that brings me to a point that is really, really important Western woman that matters, the postpartum is not a time to cut down on carbohydrates thinking that you'll be losing weight, because complex good carbohydrates are absolutely essential.   Jenny Allison: Our midwife, she's now passed and she was in New Zealand, but very China, and she said, "You're down at coal freight. You're like painting, and this is like 25% more energy you need. You've got to have something that gives you energy," and carbohydrates in Chinese medicine, as you know promote qi, sanction qi. In Western terms if you have carbohydrates in the morning you actually get a boost of serotonin. So then definitely not something to be kept down in the postpartum.   Jenny Allison: Sorry, I just-   Tahnee: No, I'm really glad you did, because I was going to talk a little bit about that cultural pressure, and so much... I mean, it's such a complex topic, the world we live in now. But you know I do, I remember like myself, I would eat nearly a loaf of local soda a day when I was breastfeeding. I was shocked by how much bread, because I don't normally eat a lot of carbs. You know, I'll have a little bit of whole grain a day or whatever, but yeah, I was just craving it really hard, and then having more protein and stuff at night.   Tahnee: You know, remember thinking I'm really glad that I'm not having to think about what I look like, because you know, it was such a funny time.   Jenny Allison: You touched on such an important point, because a nutrition they say, "A woman is never more beautiful than after the birth of their first child," and the beauty standard is different after you've given birth. That doesn't mean that you've left go, but you're illuminated from within. I just, clearly the possibility of, in Chinese medicine we say the spirit being fulfilled. That gives a beauty that's just incomparable, I think.   Tahnee: Yeah, I think too that this idea of getting back to something that we were. I think our culture really misses the transition and the honoring of it, and I think what you spoke about-   Jenny Allison: Yes, because you aren't going back to what you were because you've changed fundamentally, and physical, emotional, psychic if you like. It's all over that you've made this transition on, so to want to go back to what we sometimes call the skinny jeans and praters. It just doesn't sooth women, and it's like a misconstruction of feminism. It does not sooth women.   Jenny Allison: The way that postpartum is seen generally in the West nowadays doesn't sooth women, because this is their time, and the whole idea of, "You have to get back into life as soon as possible. You've got to lose weight," and incidentally if you're cortisol's high because you're not rested and you're stressed, high cortisol is much more likely to gain weight, than if your cortisol is normal.   Jenny Allison: Just going back to the idea of losing weight, and that's not really to the process. It's not relevant.   Tahnee: Well I read this really fantastic, actually no, it was through one of my yoga teachers because I study yoga as well, and he's a big advocate for adipose tissue. He calls it an antenna, and he says that when we're holding our babies, that fat is communicating. It's the kind of tissue of love is what he calls it, this transmission. He said hormones, all these sorts of things transmit when there's this fat-to-fat contact, which is through the baby's squishy body and our squishy bodies.   Tahnee: Yeah, I was like, "Oh, that's a really beautiful way of thinking about it." It's just kind of an antenna for qi. For my body as well, once I sort of stopped breastfeeding and was back to my normal life I guess my body did just change back to more or less how it was, you know? I was quite shock at how I just stopped being as womanly. I was like, "Oh, and there I am."   Tahnee: Yeah, it was quite a surprising, almost overnight.   Jenny Allison: I think the point too is that if you haven't had sufficient nurturing and rest in the postpartum, if you've taken this golden opportunity we call it, then your, we think in Western terms, your cortisol will be normalized, and normal cortisol really means that your weight will be more normal as well. So high cortisol, gain weight. Low cortisol, normalize weight.   Jenny Allison: Yeah, it's kind of a no-brainer.   Tahnee: Which is why we see women pushing themselves to be back at work. I've had friends with really brutal maternity leave, contracts and things where they have to go back after six months and all this kind of stuff.   Jenny Allison: Yeah. I think that the workplace has a lot to answer for in terms of women's exhaustion. This is sort of going beyond the postpartum, but yeah, just women feeling that they just have to push on, push through, and that's been what leads, when the baby's a year old or 18 months old, then they're coming into the clinic with exhaustion and catching colds all the time, and feeling in low mood.   Tahnee: Yeah, I think, I guess I don't know what the answer is. I wonder if you have any insights, but I think that's a really tough one for women, especially as the child gets maybe that little bit older, because something I've observed with myself, which was challenging, was that my capacity has changed and I just can't push myself as hard as I used to. That was a big shock for me.   Jenny Allison: I think it's required, both internal and external change, so internally or with your own self as a mother, and with those around, it's a matter of changing your family culture and your wider community culture around the great importance of this, and then from a political perspective, it's really about women getting better pay to to continue the role, and fathers getting paid just a catch on to you, and these are things that Western government always very reluctant to part from the Scandinavian countries.   Jenny Allison: They're very reluctant to concede to women. What I've noticed actually, which is really quite hopeful is in this generation, in your generation of young women having babies now, there is a bit of a ground swell about oh, the postpartum, we forgot about that, because way back when women took control of birth, way back in the '70s, and you got these... The Bible really was Spiritual Midwifery a book [crosstalk 00:23:59] by an American woman.   Tahnee: I love it.   Jenny Allison: Wonderful book, but I found what was interesting was that wasn't a postpartum, it wasn't a change of awareness of the postpartum, and I think it's because by that time in the West, postpartum all the postmodern traditions had basically slipped away while women gained tremendously through this movement in the way that they controlled their birthing processes.   Jenny Allison: Nothing happened about the postpartum because it was already from the West called The Cinderella Period, like unobserved, not even thought about really, whereas all this time in most tradition cultures, it was continuing on strongly. I think sometimes immigrant women coming to Australia and New Zealand are really shocked to find out that the way that they are treated in hospitals is all about the babies. They say, "What about us? We expect to be treated like queens," and this is not happening.   Jenny Allison: I think that an awareness is growing, and there was actually a book published last year from some researchers at La Trobe University in Melbourne. One section of it was some research that they did about women coming from backgrounds where the family supported the mother after childbirth, and the women who had family support after childbirth, it wasn't necessarily the immigrant mothers, it was that the family culture was to support mother, but they reported almost zero distress, whereas those who didn't have family support reported high levels up to 70%, 80% difficult stress.   Jenny Allison: That was another really obvious message to everyone. Look, the evidence is there.   Tahnee: I think that's really interesting, because that idea of feminism and how we've almost interpreted it, because I think about what happened in the '70s as well because it was really that feminist movement, is this idea of taking control of birth is very empowering. Then the yin to that is then the surrender of postpartum. I know for me, there was probably a few weeks where I really resisted.   Tahnee: I felt amazing because of all the wonderful hormones. I felt very strong and had a wonderful birth. I think a part of me was very resistant to this idea of rest. I felt like I was weak and not strong if I rested. I can look back at that time and really feel that there was some subconscious things going on for me around that, and my own sense of self worth.   Tahnee: Yeah, and I think that's kind of a general theme for a lot of, I guess, modern women with this idea of feminism and doing it all, you know? It's an interesting and tricky one.   Jenny Allison: There was a myth going around of you know, well the tribal women just give birth, and she just goes back to work. I don't know how the myth grew, but it became something that Western women, it gave them another high bar that they had to reach. Something else we have to do. We don't just have to work at our jobs and our careers, we have to give birth well, and then we have to just pop straight back. It really is a complete mess because the only circumstances where a so-called tribal woman or a woman in a tradition rural culture would not rest for 40 days in most places, if her family had left or there was extreme poverty and breakup of the family, or there was war or some big social influence that would take away the family's cohesiveness, but otherwise every single time mother would be resting for 40 days.   Jenny Allison: I'm lucky to be married to a man from Marley, whose mother gave me the most amazing instruction about resting for 40 days, and Marley's not a rich country, and the Marlian women and the men around as well insist on 40 days of rest after childbirth. They say, "You are the queen." Everyone runs around doing everything for you. Food, support, you don't even have to bath the baby if you don't want to.   Jenny Allison: My sister-in-law actually said, "You know, I had this situation with my first baby where I was up in the desert near the border of another country, and I didn't have any family support," and she said, "I felt so ill inside, and yet no one knew how I was suffering." For her next baby she was back in the family and had that family support, and it was a totally different experience with her, and she recovered really well. She just gets so wonderful and strong. She was able to describe how it was when she didn't do it, and how it was when she was able to.   Tahnee: I think when you look at what a rural tradition requires, they need people to remain strong and healthy so these periods of rest become, like in Chinese medicine, the confinement period. They become cultural and they become just a non-negotiable I suppose.   Jenny Allison: Yes, I think that's great word. It's actually women's rights to be well cared for after childbirth.   Tahnee: I think the opportunity, one of the things that I was told about Chinese medicine was that when we looked at these big transitions in women's left, there's opportunities for us to become, I think you called them the golden opportunities, which I really like. Could you talk a little bit about how these can become actual healing?   Jenny Allison: Oh yes, because it's a wonderful concept, and it is born out by oxytocin research actually. So cultivating one's health in the postpartum is part of this whole tradition in Chinese medicine, which is called the art of self cultivation for health, it's called yun xin. Within that, there's cultivation of one's health in the postpartum.   Jenny Allison: The term in Chinese medicine for the opportunities in women's life for rehabilitation, restoration, and improvement of one's health, they're called golden opportunities, and there are three.   Jenny Allison: The first is just a small one, and that's every time a woman has her period, that's an opportunity for her to nourish her blood, to look after herself to make sure she's warm. Then the other one is during menopause, which is another huge transition for women, that's also seen as a golden opportunity. They say that the blood goes from the uterus to the heart, and promotes wisdom, so that's a different transition.   Jenny Allison: But the biggest golden opportunity is the postpartum. It's such an intense transition, and it involves such an intense change on almost every metabolic process in your body, every organ. It actually reaches what's call a peak of change, where because of the changes of the metabolism during pregnancy, and then this intense change after birth, you can influence very strongly your health either way. You can either influence it negatively, and become depleted and maybe get depressed, end up with aches and pains, or you can use the opportunity to intensely change in a positive way.   Jenny Allison: Women talk about how old problems are resolved. Some of my patients who've done the postpartum in the Chinese way have said, "Yeah, I find that I'm stronger than before." You're more resourceful than before. Some of my old symptoms have gone. All of these things, so there can be a very strong physical and spiritual change.   Jenny Allison: When we come into intense oxytocin, that is an absolute parallel description, because oxytocin production is probably at it's most intense during the postpartum period, when a mother's beginning lactation and lactating. With oxytocin, because it's a newer modulator, it actually has the ability to annal old uronal connections in the brain to dissolve and new ones to form, so it can be this opportunity to heal former.   Jenny Allison: I finally talked to one other group in the world where they actually recognize that birth is an opportunity to heal former, and Druze mother, in the Druze tradition, which is a very, very strong and very profound tradition of postpartum care as well. But in Chinese medicine that's acknowledge through the concept of the spirit, which we call Shen. The transformation of the spirit allow for this tremendous psychic opening and healing place, specific to the right, and that's the other thing about oxytocin too.   Jenny Allison: If you're in high oxytocin production, but the circumstances are wrong in the sense that you feel endangered, unsafe, stressed, then you'll go into the mother lion aspect of oxytocin, which is aggressive and really stressed and traumatized, so it's an incredible moment.   Tahnee: Well, that just really clarifies this whole birth trauma thing, because I can imagine that hormonal cascade has interfered with intervention or non-optimal birth setting, and then there's some kind of trauma. I can just imagine. Yeah, that's a bit of a recipe for what we say-   Jenny Allison: One mother in the Druze tradition said to me, she said, "Look, in our tradition if someone's had a traumatic birth for whatever reason, I'll work really hard for their next baby to make sure that's healed."   Tahnee: Which country are they from, sorry?   Jenny Allison: The Druze tradition is they are culture that is basically around Lebanon, Syria, and North Israel. They're in a particular part of the world, but Druze immigrants in Australia and there's Druze communities I think around the world, but that's basically [crosstalk 00:32:42].   Tahnee: They have a very strong kind of midwifery tradition too, don't they? Sort of medicine woman kind of... Is that true? Do they have a very strong kind of midwifery tradition that women-based medicine. I feel like I've read something about them.   Jenny Allison: Ah, well I'm not sure, but they have a very strong mother-based postpartum. They also have ideas of a punctilious pregnancy, because what they talk about is that they don't just want quantity of babies, they want quality of soul. They talk about during the pregnancy a real awareness of eating food that comes from places that you've gone, the providence of the food is known so that you're not eating an animal that's been killed inhumanely, or if you're a vegetarian, not eating [inaudible 00:33:25], and you're conscious of not having, not cooking ham in pregnancy, of maintaining harmonious relations with those around you. All of those things.   Tahnee: Sounds really beautiful and intentional. Well, I think that's something I'm seeing is becoming more popular, or there's more emphasis now on women, maybe being conscious conception. I see that popping up a lot in the social media accounts that I follow and things.   Jenny Allison: Yeah, I think they're about conscious conception and conscious pregnancy, and conscious postpartum, because they also believe that there's a soul incarnate. They say how important it is in the first few weeks of the postpartum that the mother is just really takes a warm quiet space that she doesn't even go to a cold window if it's winter. She's just very cocooned with her baby. Her baby's so cocooned, and only basically handed to the father or one or two close relatives so that baby gets to recognize his or her new incarnation with the family that she or he has incarnated into.   Jenny Allison: Some of these ideas, yeah, they're very interesting.   Tahnee: I actually had an experience after my daughter was born, meditating that she was connected to me by this kind of golden tube when she was quite little, and I could really feel-   Jenny Allison: Oh, lovely.   Tahnee: Yeah, but I could really feel that until maybe three or four months, like it was very strong for the first three or four months, and then it started to... I could still feel it quite strongly until probably we stopped breastfeeding, I guess. Maybe around 18 to 20 months.   Tahnee: You know, and now she's two and a half. I don't have that same feeling that she's... We're still spiritually connected, I guess. I could really feel like that psychic connection between her and I when she was really little, and I've read a lot of accounts of those kinds of things. When you were saying it's a possibility for psychic kind of shifts, I could really feel that in my experience.   Jenny Allison: I think many midwives talk about just the first three months alone being the fourth trimester with the baby is so connected with the mother that really the best way to be as a mother is to assume that they're still inside in terms of protecting them, in terms of making a quiet environment.   Jenny Allison: I think all of this stuff is inherent in these really profound worldwide traditions. We've just got so much to learn from them, because of what we've lost.   Tahnee: How do women navigate hospitals like this? I read in your book there was a couple of accounts of women from different cultures who birthed in New Zealand hospitals. They couldn't believe they were sent home after a couple of days. Like you said, they weren't cared for. They baby was cared for.   Tahnee: That really kind of broke my heart in a way because I see that as such an integral part of the birthing system in our culture, and I don't know how we move away from it. It's a tough one.   Jenny Allison: Well, it kind of brings us back full circle, doesn't it, to the mother is to be honored as a queen.   Tahnee: I think you said something earlier that it's not about self care, it's about being held and empowered, and that to me is a really good distinction, because I do see a lot of... I think this is another problem in our culture is we really emphasize-   Jenny Allison: Oh yes, you're making a really good point.   Tahnee: Taking away the community aspect.   Jenny Allison: Not on the mother, actually. It's about allowing herself to be dependent on those around her being totally worth of that dependence, like being absolutely there for her.   Tahnee: Which, again, I guess requires a big shift in how we all relate to that.   Jenny Allison: Absolutely, because we're just taught how important independence is, and I think this is a general kind of Western idea that interdependence is not really something that we emphasize much, where as we know all around the world interdependence at these moment, it's absolutely crucial.   Tahnee: And I read in your book that you did interview a lot of women, and you had some of their dialogue, which I really enjoyed reading. You spoke to women who, you know, they were maybe in African countries or in other parts of the world, and they still did have jobs, and they still went back to work and things, but they did take that time to prepare their bodies. I thought that was really nice, because sometimes I feel like it's either/or, you know you're either the stay-at-home mom who has the support of the family, or you're the mom who puts her kid in daycare and goes back to work. I feel like we've got to be able to have these conversations a little bit more.   Tahnee: My partner calls it in a slippery way.   Jenny Allison: [crosstalk 00:37:35].   Tahnee: Yeah, I know. I mean, I don't think we can solve the world's problems, but it's just something that I'm really aware of. I guess, when you had these women, was it just purely that they've done these 40 days, or do you think it's the cultural thing? What do you think?   Jenny Allison: Depends on the country. I mean, if you're in an extended family, obviously it's real easy to go back to work because everyone around you is going to take the baby if you need to be away for a while, a few hours or something like that while you're working.   Jenny Allison: In a rural situation, obviously it's very different because most people have their babies with them as they do their agricultural work. I remember a Moroccan woman saying, "Look, 40 days you're treated like royalty. After 40 days you're back into everything, whether you're as a working mom outside the home, or a working mom in the home, you're a working mom."   Jenny Allison: I think the importance of 40 days is that there's no other time that you can do this healing. I mean, if you say, "Well, I can't. I haven't got a moment to heal after childbirth. I'll do it six months on," well, the opportunity's not there anymore. All those big changes, each change we talked about, all those other massive changes are no longer happening and what you've done is you've lost that opportunity for your body to recover itself properly.   Jenny Allison: For those important changes to be made, yeah, you can't go, "Well, I'm going back to work, and I'll have a big holiday later," because it just doesn't work like that.   Jenny Allison: It's true that you don't have to have another baby in order to work on a traumatic birth or to work on depletion after childbirth, but you just have to work that much harder, and you have to take time out and go, "Okay, well the next six months, whatever I need, I'm going to look after myself, because I haven't been able to recover my energy since the birth."   Jenny Allison: A lot of women come in to connect, three four years on, and they feel that they still haven't got their energy back.   Tahnee: Wow, I was talking to my acupuncturist about this, and he was saying he thinks it's at least a year of living very, very, very carefully to even start to get some of that energy back, blood back, with women that haven't done their golden month or the 40 days. So I don't know if you agree with that, but that was an interesting perspective. He said it's very, very slow to turn around once you've gotten to that point of depletion.   Jenny Allison: You have to put a lot of effort and time if you want to be able to turn your health around. I mean, it can be done, but why not take this amazing opportunity and not just recover, but actually improve your health?   Tahnee: That sounds exactly perfect. We might wrap it up there. I guess I really wanted to first thank you, because there was some really amazing stuff that I didn't know as well.   Jenny Allison: It's a pleasure to talk to you about it. Very exciting time actually in a way, because we've got to work for. It's going to make a big difference to mothers and children's health.   Tahnee: Yeah, and I think that's... My partner and I talk a lot about this idea of cultural change and generational change. I think my daughter will be raised with these conversations, and I think that's just one of the best things we can all do as individuals is keep it alive, I suppose.   Tahnee: Yes, I appreciate you helping us keep it alive. I know we do have a few practitioners who listen to this, so if you could share... You mentioned that you have a webinar, and I think a talking Melbourne, if that's right?   Jenny Allison: I think that the lecture will be restricted to students from the Southern School of Natural Therapies. The webinar will be available once it's launched. It's not launched yet, but that will be available probably by the end of the year from a group called Native Knowledge, which are up and running and they're based in Vancouver. That will be on there. I'll need just five new interviews.   Tahnee: Okay, so what we might do is we'll update our show note on the blog with all of the links when they're ready to those webinars and things. If people... They can obviously purchase your book [crosstalk 00:41:12]. Yeah, and if they wanted to connect with you, do you have a website or any other way of being found?   Jenny Allison: I don't. I'm sorry.   Tahnee: That's okay.   Jenny Allison: My publisher deals... If there's any kind of social media thing, people write to my publisher.   Tahnee: Okay, so I'll put details up there as well, that's Beatnik Publishing in Auckland. Yeah, okay, fantastic. Well, thank you so much for your time, Jenny. I really appreciate it.   Jenny Allison: Oh, and thank you so much too. That was a great conversation.   Tahnee: Yeah, it's been such a pleasure. Have a wonderful day.   Jenny Allison: You too, Tammie. Thanks.   Tahnee: Thank you so much. You're amazing.   Everybody thank you so much for tuning in today. Now time to take that information, round it into your lifestyle so you can amplify your health to the next level. You can really help amplify the help of this podcast by going on to iTunes and subscribing and leaving us a review. Really helps us spread this information around Tonic Herb, around sovereign help, further out there into the community so we can help more people experience the best out of this life.   Thanks, guys. I'll speak to you next time.

Episode 12 feels like a particularly special episode. I had the pleasure of interviewing Pamela Hunt. If you have heard of the book Spiritual Midwifery or The Farm in Summertown, Tennessee, you may have heard of her. In the 1970s, Pamela was part of a caravan of eighty school buses that went across the United States led by Stephen Gaskin. Stephen was a teacher in San Francisco when his writing class evolved into a discussion group that grew to have 1500 students in attendance each week. A lot of the hippies in attendance made up the caravan and their mission was to save the world! As women became pregnant and started to give birth during their trip, Pamela and a group of a few other women including Ina May Gaskin, Stephen’s wife, fell into the role of the midwives assisting in the deliveries. Over time and with the help of doctors across the U.S. who donated their time and resources to train them, Pamela, Ina May and the others became well-adept in handling various scenarios from hemorrhages, premature babies, breached births, and multiple births of twins and even triplets. Once they settled and established The Farm, they eventually opened the midwifery center, which still exists today. People travel to be trained by Pamela and her team there and they come to be clients of the center as well. When I was planning my trip to Tennessee in April, I found out I would be close enough to visit The Farm and immediately jumped at the opportunity. Pamela was off-site that weekend for a training, but we managed to catch up over the phone and I had the pleasure of talking with her for the podcast. This episode is so special to me because of all that Pamela has done for midwifery in the United States, including her assistance in developing the certification system for midwives today, and her vast knowledge on pregnancy, birth and helping women through it all! My main takeaways: -Amish people have been practicing midwifery forever and Pamela still works with them to this day. -Frequency of appointments are the same with a midwife compared to an OBGYN, but the appointment is 1-2 hours long per appointment with a midwife and covers lifestyle, diet, physical health, and sex, among other things. They start preparing women and couples mentally for delivery from the first appointment. -Midwifery is a huge commitment. If you have a family, it could be harder to do unless you have a solid support system of people around you who can jump in at any moment. -Pamela has tips on what women can do and what support they need to prevent postpartum depression. Sleeping 4-6 hours within the first 24 hours is crucial and having someone to watch the baby so you can do that is important. Another is having someone take care of you for the first ten days so your only priority is being with and bonding with the baby. -Pamela helped develop the certification for people to become midwives in the United States. -Midwives stress health, nutrition, and good habits so women gain an incredible education by working with midwives that they can carry into motherhood and pass down to their child and family! You can find more on Pamela and The Farm here: -Midwifery Center -Pamela’s Bio -The Farm I hope you enjoyed this episode! Would love to know what you thought about it! DM me on Instagram here. Natalie --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/notamamayet/support

Today we'll be speaking with acclaimed midwife Ina May Gaskin about how she came to be a midwife, different schools of thought in birthing, and where she would like to see birthing culture go in the future. Ina May Gaskin is founder and director of The Farm Midwifery Center in Tennessee. Founded in 1971, The Farm Midwifery Center has handled several thousand births, with remarkably good outcomes. Ms. Gaskin herself has attended more than 1,200 births. She is author of Spiritual Midwifery, now in its fourth edition, and Ina May’s Guide to Childbirth. For over 20 years she has published Birth Gazette, a quarterly publication covering healthcare, childbirth and midwifery issues. She has lectured all over the world at midwifery conferences and at medical schools, both to students and to faculty.

In this episode we speak with Rachana Shivam, mother, grandmother, pioneering childbirth educator and advocate for families, doula, primal healing practitioner, principal of the International College of Spiritual Midwifery and author of the leading text on lotus birth, the practice of leaving the umbilical cord intact.Rachana first became a mother in the mid ‘70s during the winds of change for birth in Australia. As you will hear from Rachana it was a very charged and hopeful time for those advocating for families in birth. Unfortunately Rachana still sees a lot of parallels with how birth is managed even 40 years later, but during her lengthy and sustained journey she and her colleagues have paved the way for a lot of what we now take for granted in birth, all of which was thought to be crazy at the time: Waterbirth, self-hypnosis and breathing methods for pain management during labour, preparing for birth by examining our own births through rebirthing, Leboyer birth where the focus is on supporting the mother/baby dyad’s process rather than intervening in it. Rachana shares her experiences of birth and early years of childbirth advocacy.Other references: - Rachana Shivam - www.lotusbirth.net- Prophylactic method for pain relief, also known as the Lamaze Method.- Dr Graham Farrant, http://www.primal-page.com/gfobit.htm- Dr Frederick Leboyer, author of Birth Without Violence- Arthur Janov “Primal Therapy” “The Feeling Child” http://www.primaltherapy.com- Association For Prenatal And Perinatal Psychology And Health https://birthpsychology.com/- Another link of interest: "Don’t Cut Baby’s Cord - We Can Be Much Kinder" https://vimeo.com/21315581A warning if you have children listening, there is brief mention of the old practice of operating on children without anaesthesia (at approx 13’30”), and experiencing orgasm in birth at approx 22’20”.Produced and presented by Sally Cusack 2019Copyright PBB Media and Sally Cusack 2019www.pbbmedia.org

In this episode we speak with Rachana Shivam, mother, grandmother, pioneering childbirth educator and advocate for families, doula, primal healing practitioner, principal of the International College of Spiritual Midwifery and author of the leading text on lotus birth, the practice of leaving the umbilical cord intact.Rachana first became a mother in the mid ‘70s during the winds of change for birth in Australia. As you will hear from Rachana it was a very charged and hopeful time for those advocating for families in birth. Unfortunately Rachana still sees a lot of parallels with how birth is managed even 40 years later, but during her lengthy and sustained journey she and her colleagues have paved the way for a lot of what we now take for granted in birth, all of which was thought to be crazy at the time: Waterbirth, self-hypnosis and breathing methods for pain management during labour, preparing for birth by examining our own births through rebirthing, Leboyer birth where the focus is on supporting the mother/baby dyad’s process rather than intervening in it. Rachana shares her experiences of birth and early years of childbirth advocacy.Other references: - Rachana Shivam - www.lotusbirth.net- Prophylactic method for pain relief, also known as the Lamaze Method.- Dr Graham Farrant, http://www.primal-page.com/gfobit.htm- Dr Frederick Leboyer, author of Birth Without Violence- Arthur Janov “Primal Therapy” “The Feeling Child” http://www.primaltherapy.com- Association For Prenatal And Perinatal Psychology And Health https://birthpsychology.com/- Another link of interest: "Don’t Cut Baby’s Cord - We Can Be Much Kinder" https://vimeo.com/21315581A warning if you have children listening, there is brief mention of the old practice of operating on children without anaesthesia (at approx 13’30”), and experiencing orgasm in birth at approx 22’20”.Produced and presented by Sally Cusack 2019Copyright PBB Media and Sally Cusack 2019www.pbbmedia.org

Sheri Winston is a Goddess Powerhouse. Her journey as a midwife led her to develop and teach some of the most powerful and groundbreaking work on the exploration of the female anatomy and female sexual pleasure.  This conversation is a deep dive into the power of setting boundaries. Sheri shares with us her process for discovering what your boundaries are and how to stick to them when your in the midst of erotic encounters and your brain is like mush. Sheri also shares in depth about the female anatomy and the many layers and levels to our own potentials for pleasure. Episode 75 of Ignite Intimacy is powerful and juicy... you’re going to love it!!    About Sheri:     Wholistic Sexuality teacher, author, and founder of the Intimate Arts Center, Sheri Winston offers pleasure-centered sex-ed for grown-ups with a wide variety of practical and transformational intimate arts education. She delights in inspiring people to have a lot more pleasure, fun and fulfillment!   Website   Resources:   Sheri's Intimate Arts Center   Women’s Anatomy of Arousal: Secret Maps to Buried Pleasure   Succulent SexCraft: Your Hands-On Guide to Erotic Play and Practice   Spiritual Midwifery by Ina May Gaskin  

The Trufaux Sho welcomes Justin the Dude from Colorado, to provide feedback on the show and also share stories from his experiences interacting with this world. 00:05 - Facebook  http://fall-river.wickedlocal.com/zz/news/20180326/ftc-is-investigating-facebook-over-privacy-practices 00:09 - Grimerica Chats https://discordapp.com/invite/fmzuYmz 00:13 - Justin’s sister’s podcast “Start Dis” https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/startdis/id1302791667 00:14 - Justin “The Dude” 00:16 - COG https://www.thesun.co.uk/uncategorized/1229552/is-there-a-secret-bunker-hidden-beneath-a-us-airport-built-to-save-government-chiefs-from-the-apocalypse/ 00:18 - Adirondacks http://visitadirondacks.com/about/mountains 00:20 - Rim to Rim https://www.rimtorim.org/hike-it/ 00:29 - “The Ladder of Consciousness” by David R. Hawkings http://personality-development.org/theories-personality-development/david-hawkins 00:45 - WTO Seattle http://www.globalissues.org/article/46/wto-protests-in-seattle-1999 00:49 - Howard Zinn http://www.historyisaweapon.com/zinnapeopleshistory.html 00:55 - AJ’s sweaty nipples https://www.express.co.uk/celebrity-news/569741/Alex-Jones-nipples-The-One-Show-see-through-white-shirt 00:59 - Dale Pond http://www.grimerica.ca/episodes/ep146/ 01:15 - Slave markets in Libya http://fortune.com/2017/11/29/libya-slave-trade/ 01:25 - Ina May Spiritual Midwifery https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/32129.Spiritual_Midwifery   Thank you Justin for your courage to come out and play Thank you to @BillyBon3s for the intro music Thank you Grimerica.ca for the studio use Thank you Mr. Anderson and Mr. Wein for financial support Thank You for listening, sharing and reviewing!

“Beppe, il calcio è strano”: risuona la suoneria del Ratatelefono. Consigli su come diventare dj radiofonici di successo grazie alla “Spiritual Midwifery”, l’avvincente storia dei Mondiali di Spagna 1707, Paolo Box che tenta di sedurre la nonna di Doc. Quante cose possono succedere in una sola ora di puntata? Boh, 4? 5? Voi ascoltate la […]

In this episode Deb speaks to renowned Midwife Deborah Flowers R.N., C.P.M. Deborah has 30 years of experience at The Farm Midwifery Center in training and service attending over 1,000 births. In addition to working at the farm Deborah served as the lab director and director of midwifery and childbirth education at Plenty International. She has served on the board of Midwife International and regularly leads trainings for midwives specializing in IV therapy and neonatal resuscitation.   Get the most out of each episode by checking out the show notes with links, resources and other related podcasts at: prenatalyogacenter.com If you love what you’ve been listening to, please leave a rating and review! Yoga| Birth|Babies To connect with Deb and the PYC Community:  instagram & facebook: @prenatalyogacenter Youtube: Prenatal Yoga Center Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sally's interview with local mum Ynte Kylstra on her major influences in womanhood, birth and into motherhood, including "Spiritual Midwifery" by Ina May Gaskin, Attachment Parenting by Dr William Sears, how she makes major decisions for her family, how The Flight of the Conchords helped her birth, influences of feminism on her ideas about motherhood :) and soooo much more!!Aired on 99.9 BayFM Byron Bay on 28 March 2016.Produced and presented by Sally CusackCopyright 2016 PBB Media and Sally Cusackwww.pbbmedia.org

Sally's interview with local mum Ynte Kylstra on her major influences in womanhood, birth and into motherhood, including "Spiritual Midwifery" by Ina May Gaskin, Attachment Parenting by Dr William Sears, how she makes major decisions for her family, how The Flight of the Conchords helped her birth, influences of feminism on her ideas about motherhood :) and soooo much more!!Aired on 99.9 BayFM Byron Bay on 28 March 2016.Produced and presented by Sally CusackCopyright 2016 PBB Media and Sally Cusackwww.pbbmedia.org

Join Cameron and Lucia on Begin Again to discuss a rarely talked about spiritual practice that is right in the heart of beginning again called Spiritual Midwifery!!!

Rachana Shivam Evans is the founding Principal of the International College of Spiritual Midwifery. Rachana’s teaching career spans 40 years and she has been  a pioneer of conscious birthing practices since the 1970's , specializing in Water Birth and Lotus Birth. Her book 'Lotus Birth' is now in it's second edition, has been translated into Italian, Polish, and Czech and is a world first publication. She is also executive director of the acclaimed DVD 'The Lotus Birth of the Malcolm Twins' and Co-author of 'The Tantric Path’. I couldn’t have imagined finding a more lovely and inspiring guest for this topic, Rachana greatly deepened my appreciation for the role of the placenta, and I think after listening you will love her as much as I do!    For links to all the amazing resources Rachana outlined, be sure to visit her 'show notes' page at: www.dearestdoula.com       Have you connected with 'Dearest Doula' on social media? Don't wait, do it today!   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/DearestDoula   Twitter: https://twitter.com/DearestDoula   Instagram: https://instagram.com/dearestdoula/   You can also get connected by joining our Facebook group, ‘Birth work is the Best Work’    Also, don’t forget to sign up for the Dearest Doula Accountability Tribe- to join in on weekly discussions with other passionate birth workers who want to deepen their doula philosophy, and grow their business.    I look forward to connecting with you!   *Sound/Music by Setuniman  at www.freesound.org/people/setuniman/        

Today’s guest is Juliet Butters Doty. Born in Australia, Juliet has been involved in the Spiritual Industry for more than 28 years. Living in Europe, Hawaii, Australia, and now back in the USA, Juliet spent 10 condensed years in The Daystar Mystery School of the highest order where rigorous training initiated Juliet into a broad experience. Utilizing multiple healing modalities and ultimately using The Power of the Spoken Word & Prayer, Juliet deals with any & all possibilities of spiritual malaise. With a piercing sight into the electromagnetic field, Juliet is a master healer and gifted Spiritual - Midwife who Unwinds The Soul to the Core. You can find out more about her at www.julietbuttersdoty.com or www.unwindthesoul.com. Be sure to sign up for your Podcasting Mentorship Discovery Call today; and to learn more about Sponsorship Opportunities, send an email to Admin@MichaelNeeley.com.  Thanks! And don’t forget to subscribe to Consciously Speaking so that you don’t miss a single episode. While you’re at it, won’t you take a moment to write a short review and rate our show? It would be greatly appreciated! To learn more about our previous guests, listen to past episodes, and get to know your host, go to www.MichaelNeeley.com and follow us on Facebook and Twitter.

Join Cameron and Lucia on Begin Again to discuss a rarely talked about spiritual practice that is right in the heart of beginning again called Spiritual Midwifery!!!

Ina May Gaskin is an internationally recognized leader in advocating for Spiritual Midwifery. She is also an author, activist and advocate whose spiritual insights and empowerment have been part of the incredible exploration which is The Farm, the spiritual-based intentional community in Tennessee, founded in the early 1970's.