Podcast appearances and mentions of Mark Driscoll

Well nerds, buckle up for this one. My buddy Ryan Burge has returned with his latest graphs about religion and the 2024 election, and let me tell you - it was zesty. We started talking about minor league baseball, chicken raising, and somehow ended up dissecting why 83% of white evangelicals voted for Trump (spoiler: it's not shocking). Ryan breaks down the real story of the 2024 election - how non-white evangelicals are now 50/50, why mainline Protestants aren't actually that liberal, and the fascinating shifts happening in the Catholic vote. We dive into the data that shows education and church attendance create some pretty stark political divides, and why Democrats might want to rethink their approach to people of faith. But this is us, so we also talked about LeBron's hair transplants, whether 100 men could take down a silverback gorilla, why online gambling is destroying America, and Ryan's ongoing campaign to get academics to eat at steakhouses instead of Sweet Green. Plus, Ryan explains why Mark Driscoll might be the godfather of the manosphere, and we debate whether Joe Scarborough and Mika have the worst work schedule in television. Oh, and we somehow got into a deep discussion about Mayor Pete's beard and why Democrats need to learn how to talk about their faith without sounding like they're apologizing for it. Because apparently that's where our brains go. Want the full conversation? This is just a taste of what we covered in over two hours of completely unhinged discussion. If you're a member of either Graphs About Religion (Ryan's substack) or Process This (mine), you get access to the entire unedited conversation, plus invitations to join us live for future streams where things get even more zesty - and yes, I'm using that word in the Whitehead sense, not the Gen Z sense.   Previous Visits from Ryan Burge Distrust & Denominations Trust, Religion, & a Functioning Democracy What it's like to close a church The Future of Christian Education & Ministry in Charts The Sky is Falling & the Charts are Popping! Graphs about Religion & Politics w/ Spicy Banter a Year in Religion (in Graphs) Evangelical Jews, Educated Church-Goers, & other bits of dizzying data 5 Religion Graphs w/ a side of Hot Takes Myths about Religion & Politics Ryan P. Burge is an assistant professor of political science at Eastern Illinois University. Author of numerous journal articles, he is the co-founder of and a frequent contributor to Religion in Public, a forum for scholars of religion and politics to make their work accessible to a general audience. Burge is a pastor in the American Baptist Church. Upcoming Online Class:⁠⁠⁠⁠ Rediscovering the Spirit: Hand-Raisers, Han, & the Holy Ghost⁠⁠⁠⁠ is an open-online course exploring the dynamic, often overlooked third person of the Trinity. Based on Grace Ji-Sun Kim's groundbreaking work on the Holy Spirit this class takes participants on a journey through biblical foundations, historical developments, diverse cultural perspectives, and practical applications of Spirit theology. ⁠⁠⁠⁠As always, this class is donation-based, including 0. To get class info and sign up, head over here. ⁠⁠⁠⁠ _____________________ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Hang with 40+ Scholars & Podcasts and 600 people at Theology Beer Camp 2025 (Oct. 16-18) in St. Paul, MN. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ This podcast is a ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Homebrewed Christianity⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ production. Follow ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠the Homebrewed Christianity⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Theology Nerd Throwdown⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, & ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Rise of Bonhoeffer⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ podcasts for more theological goodness for your earbuds. Join over 80,000 other people by joining our⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Substack - Process This!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Get instant access to over 45 classes at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.TheologyClass.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Follow the podcast, drop a review⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, send ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠feedback/questions⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ or become a ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠member of the HBC Community⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In Episode 170, Sean Miller, founder of Upper 90 HQ, talks with Phil and Paul about his entrepreneurial journey that started with filming soccer games, leading to the creation of his video company that serves soccer teams and players around the US. Sean dives into his personal story, emphasizing how faith and soccer have influenced his leadership and shift in life priorities. He discusses the challenges and opportunities within the US soccer landscape, drawing from his family's extensive involvement in the sport. The discussion also covers Sean's leadership principles, his defining moments in soccer, and how the game has shaped his approach to marriage and parenting. Specifically, Sean discusses: ·      His story, his passion for soccer, leadership, entrepreneurship, and how he started Upper 90 HQ (6:54) ·      His personal why/life purpose and how he is living it out (15:43) ·      How he has used lessons learned in soccer in his business life (20:15) ·      The power of vulnerability (27:05) ·      Lessons he has learned from a couple defining moments in his soccer career (33:03) ·      His thoughts on the current state of soccer in the US, from the youth to professional ranks, from the “Alphabet Soup” to the “Merry-Go-Round” (40:17) ·      Lessons learned from soccer that he is using in his marriage and parenting (55:28) ·      His recommendations (57:47) Resources and Links from this Episode ·                Upper90HQ Website ·                Uncut Video of the Episode ·                HSEL Facebook Group ·                Warrior Way Soccer ·                Coaching the Bigger Game Program ·                Phil's email for DISC Training ·                “Adolescence” (Netflix Series) ·                “The Chosen” ·                “House of David” ·                Act Like Be a Man: 9 Ways to Punch Life in the Mouth, Mark Driscoll

Steve and the crew discuss President Trump's Easter message and why he captured the spirit that made this country, all while sharing the gospel. Then, Pastor Mark Driscoll joins the show to talk about his new book, "King of Kings." In Hour Two, Fake News or Not is a hodgepodge of items that caught Steve's eye over the past few days. Pop Culture Tuesday is a review of the excellent new movie "The King of Kings." TODAY'S SPONSORS: BACKYARD BUTCHERS: https://www.backyardbutchers.com/products/steer-in-a-year use promo code DEACE RELIEF FACTOR: VISIT https://www.relieffactor.com/ OR CALL 800-4-RELIEF VOICE OF JUDAH ISRAEL: Visit https://donate.vojisrael.org/steve to support VOJI's mission of sharing hope in Israel REAL ESTATE AGENTS I TRUST: https://realestateagentsitrust.com/ FREEDOM PROJECT ACADEMY: https://fpeusa.org/ KEKSI: https://www.keksi.com/ use promo code DEACE15 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

This 1 sin is leading millions of people to destruction.✝️ COACHING WITH US HERE! https://biblicallymasculinepod.com

Get 45% off the Magic Mind bundle with with my link: https://www.magicmind.com/preacherjan#magicmind #mentalwealth #mentalperformance✖️✖️✖️Nothing like a bit of satanic panic to kick off the new year.Pastors like Mark Driscoll and Daniel White are labeling the musical Wicked as “demonic” and accusing it of corrupting young minds. But here's the irony—Wicked is all about challenging fear, prejudice, and black-and-white thinking.In this video, I dive into their critiques and why they completely miss the mark. As a former fundamentalist, Wicked struck a personal chord with me. Its themes of questioning authority and redefining good and evil mirror real-life struggles within high-control religious communities.I also explore how Wicked invites us to think critically about the labels we place on others and the motives of those in power. Maybe that's why some pastors feel so uncomfortable with it—it hits a little too close to home.Join me as I unpack the controversy, reflect on Wicked's deeper meaning, and share why this misunderstood musical deserves more credit than it gets from its critics!✖️✖️✖️Sources mentioned:Mark Driscoll on Wicked - https://youtu.be/mz_5OxyHRJcJoe Brown's UNHINGED Sermon at FBC Hammond Youth Conference - https://youtu.be/GHGnaZfd4WsIsaiah Saldivar on Wicked - https://youtu.be/YVLtPRxpRjADaniel White's sermon - https://youtu.be/fXEJovbfK_Y?t=4670April Ajoy links - https://linktr.ee/aprilajoy✖️✖️✖️If you or someone you know has experienced abuse, visit courage365.org/need-help✖️✖️✖️Support the Show: Patreon.com/PreacherBoys✖️✖️✖️CONNECT WITH THE SHOW:preacherboyspodcast.comhttps://www.youtube.com/@PreacherBoyshttps://www.facebook.com/preacherboysdoc/https://twitter.com/preacherboysdochttps://www.instagram.com/preacherboyspodhttps://www.tiktok.com/@preacherboyspodTo connect with a community that shares the Preacher Boys Podcast's mission to expose abuse in the IFB, join the OFFICIAL Preacher Boys Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1403898676438188/✖️✖️✖️The content presented in this video is for informational and educational purposes only. All individuals and entities discussed are presumed innocent until proven guilty through due legal process. The views and opinions expressed are those of the speakers.This episode is sponsored by/brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/PreacherBoys and get on your way to being your best self.Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/preacher-boys-podcast/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Get Ad-Free Episodes on Patreon: Want exclusive, ad-free episodes? Visit us on Patreon, link at rainydayrabbitholes.com.This Week's Episode: Shea & Jody welcome the hilarious Kevin Ryan of Tyrant In Training, a podcast where guests live out their inner tyrannical fantasies. Jody dives into the rise and fall of Mark Driscoll and the Mars Hill Church. From salacious sermons to cult-like scandals, we're breaking it all down with laughter and a bit of shock.Follow Kevin: Check out Kevin's podcast at tyrantintraining.io and follow him for more hilarity!Umbrella Podcast Collective: Kevin is part of the Umbrella Podcast Collective—a little cult of podcasters with big ideas. Learn more at rainydayrabbitholes.com/umbrella.Tags: #MarsHillChurch, #MarkDriscoll, #TyrantInTraining, #UmbrellaPodcastCollective, #FunnyPodcast, #CultPodcast, #ScandalousSermons, #ReligionDebate, #HistoryOfReligion, #PodcastCollab, #TyrannyUnleashed, #PodcastCommunity, #RainyDayRabbitHoles, #PacificNorthwest, #JodyAndShea, #FYP, #ViralPodcastSources: Edinburg Scotland Sex, a Study of the Good Bits from Song of SolomonArchive of Driscoll Sermons at Mars Hill ChurchGrace and Lies - The Mars Hill Storyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-SI2OgePrkhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_DriscollRise and fall of Mars Hill ChurchDriscoll's current sermon vile websiteBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/pacific-northwest-history-humor-rainy-day-rabbit-holes--6271663/support.

What happens when ideology takes over church leadership? In this episode, Martha Tatarnic welcomes Mike Cosper, creator of The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill and director of podcasts at Christianity Today. Mike explores the dynamics of ideology within church leadership, particularly how ideological thinking can lead to disastrous decision-making. Together, they discuss the influence of secularism and the anxiety surrounding church decline, as well as the allure of charismatic leaders like Mark Driscoll. In a thought-provoking dialogue, they consider the role of populism, the importance of resisting the cult of personality in church leadership, and the practices of worship and storytelling as acts of resistance. Mike also reflects on the reception of his work within the evangelical world and the importance of truth-telling in journalism. He emphasizes the mysterious ways God shows up in broken places, even amidst the church's failings.   Mike Cosper has been creating music, radio shows, and podcasts for more than 20 years. He produced and hosted The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill podcast and is director of podcasts at Christianity Today. He now cohosts a weekly podcast called The Bulletin. Cosper also leads cohorts for church leaders and is the author of four books, including Recapturing the Wonder. He and his family live in Louisville, Kentucky.   Presenting Sponsor: Phillips Seminary Join conversations that expose you to new ideas, deepen your commitment and give insights to how we can minister in a changing world.  Supporting Sponsors: Restore Clergy If you are clergy in need of tailored, professional support to help you manage the demands of ministry, Restore Clergy is for you!   Future Christian Team: Loren Richmond Jr. – Host & Executive Producer Martha Tatarnic – Co-Host Paul Romig–Leavitt – Associate Producer Dennis Sanders – Producer Alexander Lang - Production Assistant

We react to this excited video from Mark Driscoll this last campaign season, I met President Trump, Is He A Real Christian? We discuss the intersection of Driscoll and American politics, if Christian politician matter and everything related a long the way. We only get half way through this video and the rest will be finished in a future Patreon episode. So sign up for the Patreon for that coming gold. This episode is brought to you by soap! Use code "RESTLESS" to get 10% off at https://spindlesandscarlet.com/   You can follow this podcast all over the internet. twitter,   instagram.    or facebook Or email us at restlesspodcasting@gmail.com

Send us a textJimmy Evans started XO Marriage over 30 years ago, and his book Marriage on the Rock became a best-seller. He leads marriage conferences around the country. But for years he also Mark Driscoll on his leadership team. He got his start at Gateway Church under Robert Morris, who has been accused of grooming and sexually abusing a teen girl, starting when she was 12. And more recently audio of Evans' bullying behavior has dropped. So let's examine his book Marriage on the Rock—and we'll find that he stresses one-sided sex as obligation; says dangerous things about abuse; and expects women to shoulder the mental and emotional load for the family. Our Sponsor:Ever, AJ: Uniquely crafted vegan leather Bible cases.These Bible Cases are GORGEOUS and FUNCTIONAL! Use it as a traditional case, or you can also buy purses and wristlets. Makes a great gift too!Stocking Stuffers:Check out our biblical womanhood line of merch, or our Prayer and Tent Pegs lines! They're wonderful with mugs, notebooks, stickers, tshirts and more!LINKS: Get Our One Sheet Download of Marriage on the RockTO SUPPORT USJoin our Patreon for as little as $5 a month to support our workFor tax deductible donations in the U.S., support Good Fruit Faith Initiative through the Bosko FoundationAnd check out our Merch, or any of our courses!Join our email list!THINGS MENTIONED:The audio of Jimmy Evans' bullying behavior in the Daystar meetingEvidence of Mark Driscoll being on the leadership team at XO MarriageJoin Sheila at Bare Marriage.com!And her FACEBOOK PAGE has been HACKED--so please join the new official one!Check out her books: The Great Sex Rescue She Deserves Better The Good Girl's Guide to Great Sex and The Good Guy's Guide to Great Sex And she has an Orgasm Course and a Libido course too!Check out all her courses, FREE resources, books, and so much more at Sheila's LinkTree.

Is there any hope for America heading into November? Listen in as Sean and Mark discuss this and more. 

A series of high-profile scandals have rocked the evangelical church. Politicisation and Christian nationalism are on the rise. How can the the church recover from abuse and leadership failures in order to meet the rising tide of meaning seekers? Justin relives an infamous interview with Mark Driscoll, and hears from Mike Cosper, Karen Swallow Prior, John Dickson, Phil Cooke, Rasool Berry, Esau McCaulley and other leaders seeking to move beyond celebrity, power and politics. More info, book & newsletter: https://justinbrierley.com/surprisingrebirth/ Support via Patreon for early access to new episodes: https://www.patreon.com/justinbrierley/membership Support via PayPal: https://www.paypal.com/paypalme/brierleyjustin Support via Tax-deductible (USA): https://defendersmedia.com/portfolio/justin-brierley/ Buy the book or get a signed copy: https://justinbrierley.com/the-surprising-rebirth-of-belief-in-god/ Ep 29 show notes: https://justinbrierley.com/surprisingrebirth/episode-29-the-problem-with-church-recovering-from-power-politics-scandal-and-abuse The Surprising Rebirth of Belief in God is a production of Think Faith in partnership with Genexis, and support from The Jerusalem Trust & the Christian Evidence Society. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Steve discusses comments from the father of Aiden Clark, the 11-year-old killed at the hands of a Haitian in Springfield, Ohio, and says that father is anything but a man. Then, Pastor Mark Driscoll joins the show to discuss his new book, "Vote Like Jesus." In Hour Two, Steve and the crew continue their study through the book of Romans. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Send us a textIn this episode, we tackle a pressing issue that has left many believers disillusioned: scandal fatigue. From the moral failures of once-trusted Christian leaders like Mike Bickle, Robert Morris, Ravi Zacharias, Jerry Falwell Jr., and Mark Driscoll, to the widespread misconduct uncovered within organizations such as Hillsong Church and the Southern Baptist Convention, the Christian community has faced a barrage of betrayals. These scandals cut deep, leaving behind a trail of hurt and a growing sense of apathy and distrust.As Christians, we understand that leaders are human, fallible, and susceptible to sin. Yet, the repeated revelations of moral failures among those who should know better have left many struggling with a profound sense of betrayal. How do we cope with the emotional toll of these scandals? How can we overcome the fatigue that threatens to erode our faith and commitment?Join us as we explore these questions, looking to Jesus—who Himself was betrayed by a trusted friend—for guidance. We'll discuss how to heal from church hurt, regain our focus on Christ, and continue being a light in a world overshadowed by the failures of those we once admired. Don't miss this critical conversation on restoring trust and hope in the wake of scandal.

This podcast is your resource for all things Splankna, the faith-based inner healing and deliverance modality. In this episode, we will highlight areas of conflict that make you uncomfortable and how to handle conflict resolution with assertiveness and curious questions. We tend to have an emotional reaction to conflict and can create relationships based on the rigidity of our reactions rather than a thoughtful, assertive response. Mark Driscoll, on his podcast, Real Faith with Mark Driscoll describes the Jezebel spirit as a controlling spirit and the Ahab spirit as a passive spirit. Yet, what we most need when navigating our way through conflict is steady assertiveness. Join us as we explore practical strategies for maintaining composure and curiosity in the face of conflict, ensuring that our responses are both firm and compassionate.

Jeremy converses with Janet Mefferd about her history in Christian journalism, her famous conflict with Mark Driscoll, and the latest controversies surrounding Megan Basham, Doug Wilson, and the Christian Nationalism movement. The over-arching concern about each of these topics is for Christians to care about maintaining a standard of ethics in their ministries.   Subscribe to the podcast: https://linktr.ee/DoTheology Check out Foundations Media: https://foundationsmedia.org   https://dotheology.com https://store.dotheology.com https://www.buymeacoffee.com/DoTheology   Contact Us: show@dotheology.com https://twitter.com/dotheology https://facebook.com/dotheology   0:00 Introduction 2:14 History of The Janet Mefferd Show 7:34 Confronting Mark Driscoll 21:03 Knowing When Risks Are Worth It 25:13 Megan Basham's Book, Shepherds for Sale 28:29 Basham's Erroneous Citations 32:20 Why Journalistic Integrity Is Important 37:51 Is Investigative Journalism an Easy Critique? 43:55 Christian Nationalism Tactics 48:26 Doug Wilson's Defense of Basham 53:42 Christian Nationalism as the "Woke Right" 1:10:00 A Better Approach to Christian Discernment

Unlock the profound and sometimes controversial beauty of the Song of Solomon as we sit down with Pastor AJ in this enlightening episode. Discover why this often overlooked book of the Bible captivated AJ's heart and how it can enrich your spiritual journey. Be prepared to challenge your perceptions and gain new insights as we discuss its artistic value, varied interpretations, and how it reflects the immense love of God. AJ shares his personal experiences and the mixed reactions he's encountered, making for a compelling discussion about faith, scripture, and devotion.Journey with us as we explore the wisdom of renowned commentators like Chuck Missler, Charles Spurgeon, and Mark Driscoll. Their unique perspectives provide a deeper understanding of how the Song of Solomon speaks to marriage, sex, and God's love for individuals. Learn how historical figures found solace in these scriptures during times of persecution and how these timeless messages can provide you with courage and strength in your ministry and personal life. Through AJ's anecdotes, discover how immersing oneself in the Song of Solomon can be a transformative experience, offering resilience and inspiration for new and challenging roles.Finally, we dive into the themes of worship and identity, emphasizing the power of praising God and finding intimacy with Jesus amidst life's challenges. As we reflect on Spurgeon's commentary and other biblical passages, we uncover how focusing on God's beauty and faithfulness can shift our perspective from hurt to healing. This episode isn't just about understanding scripture; it's about experiencing the intense love of God in a way that transforms and sustains us through every season of life. Tune in to enrich your faith and discover a deeper connection with God through the lens of the Song of Solomon.Support the Show.

Are you living The Wealthy Way? Join us as we dive into the pressing issue of "soft men" in America. In this eye-opening discussion, we tackle the societal factors contributing to this problem and explore effective solutions. Our guest, Mark Driscoll, shares powerful wisdom from his new book "Act Like a Man," inspired by 1 Corinthians, and we dive deep into the responsibility and activation that men need today.In this video, we cover:- The pitfalls of modern masculinity and how to overcome them.- The role of faith and wisdom in strengthening men.- Practical advice for men to take responsibility and activate their lives.- The impact of societal pressures on young men.- The importance of fatherhood and building a legacy.---Secure your spot at the #1 conference for real estate, entrepreneurship, and social media here - https://www.wealthcon.org/Feeling lost as an entrepreneur or real estate investor? Get access to our community, coaching, courses, and events at Wealthy University https://wealthyuniversity.com/If you want to level up, text me at 725-444-5244! ---About Ryan Pineda: Ryan Pineda has been in the real estate industry since 2010 and has invested in over $100,000,000 of real estate. He has completed over 700 flips and wholesales, and he owns over 650 rental units. As an entrepreneur, he has founded seven different businesses that have generated 7-8 figures of revenue. Ryan has amassed over 2 million followers on social media and has generated over 1 billion views online. Starting as a minor league baseball player making less than $2,000 a month, Ryan is now worth over $100 million. He shares his experiences in building wealth and believes that anyone can change their life with real estate investing.

KUOW's podcast Let The Kids Dance! is the story of Seattle's Teen Dance Ordinance in a seven-part docuseries chronicling an untold chapter of pop-culture history. It's a story about moral panic, grassroots activism and an unstoppable music community that fought for its freedom, created and hosted by Jonathan Zwickel.The TDO made it impossible for venue owners to turn a profit while hosting all-ages shows. But the law contained a few exceptions, allowing concerts at nonprofit spaces and religious institutions. Savvy promoters take full advantage. In the latter half of the 90s, two all-ages venues sent a lifeline to the all-ages community by hosting unforgettable shows, leading to dramatically different results. One of those venues was Mars Hill's The Paradox. It was one of Mark Driscoll's early footholds in Seattle and hosted all ages concerts by secular and Christian bands- as well as worship services.Listen to the official Let the Kids Dance! playlist on Spotify. Do you have a Christian rock story to tell? Leave RTDR a message at (629) 777-6336.If you want more seasons of Rock That Doesn't Roll, you can support us on Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/rtdrYou can connect with us on Instagram or by emailing RTDRpod@gmail.comSign up for our Substack to keep up with show developments.Buy RTDR merch here.

In this episode, Ekkie and Nathaniel discuss the dangers of following men like Mark Driscoll and James MacDonald.Hyperlinks may not work on certain platforms.Looking for cool gear? Shirts, Mugs, Hoodies, Etc.:https://truth-be-known-podcast.creator-spring.com/Email us at:truthbeknownpodcast@gmail.comYouTube handle: @truthbeknownpodcast

Summary The conversation discusses the technical difficulties faced before the recording and the humorous incidents that occurred. It then delves into the scandal surrounding Robert Morris and Gateway Church, where allegations of sexual abuse have been made against Morris. The conversation highlights the contradictory statements made by Gateway Church and the need for a thorough investigation. It also addresses the toxic culture within evangelical churches, the impact of purity culture, and the importance of holding leaders accountable. Cindy, the alleged victim, releases a statement expressing her disappointment in the church's response and calling for justice and reform. In this conversation, Tim and April discuss the hypocrisy and lack of accountability within certain religious circles, particularly in relation to the handling of sexual abuse allegations. They highlight the case of Robert Morris, a megachurch pastor who platformed Mark Driscoll, despite Driscoll's history of abusive behavior. They also criticize the selective outrage and silence of certain evangelical influencers, such as Meg Basham and Allie Stuckey, who condemn Morris but defend John MacArthur, despite his involvement in covering up child abuse within his own church. The conversation emphasizes the need for accountability and the dismantling of toxic systems within religious institutions. Takeaways Technical difficulties can occur before a recording, but it is important to persevere and find solutions. The scandal surrounding Robert Morris and Gateway Church highlights the need for thorough investigations and accountability within religious institutions. Toxic culture and purity culture within evangelical churches contribute to the protection of abusive leaders and the blaming of victims. Victims of abuse should be supported and encouraged to come forward, and justice and reform should be pursued. The statements made by Gateway Church and the alleged victim, Cindy, reveal the need for transparency and genuine repentance. There is a lack of accountability and hypocrisy within certain religious circles when it comes to handling sexual abuse allegations. Some religious leaders and influencers selectively condemn certain individuals while defending others, based on their theological alignment or personal biases. The focus should be on protecting victims and holding abusers accountable, rather than protecting the reputation of religious institutions. Toxic systems within religious institutions need to be dismantled in order to prioritize the well-being and safety of individuals. Accountability and transparency are essential in creating a healthy and safe environment within religious communities. Check out our website for merch, educational materials, and how to join our community! If you'd like to support our work, you can DONATE here! Follow Us On Instagram @thenewevangelicals  Subscribe On YouTube The New Evangelicals exists to support those who are tired of how evangelical church has been done before and want to see an authentic faith lived out with Jesus at the center. We are committed to building a caring community that emulates the ways of Jesus by reclaiming the evangelical tradition and embracing values that build a better way forward. If you've been marginalized by your faith, you are welcome here. We've built an empathetic and inclusive space that encourages authentic conversations, connections and faith. Whether you consider yourself a Christian, an exvangelical, someone who's questioning your faith, or someone who's left the faith entirely, you are welcome here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Steve discusses the new Fox News poll, why it may be important, and why it's confounding that the Trump campaign seemingly has no overarching message for the 2024 election. Then, Mark Driscoll joins the show to talk about his book “Act Like a Man.” In Hour Two, the team studies Romans 2:5-16. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Live podcast on stage from the "Kill Dragons" Stronger Man Conference! Pastor Josh's son Levi and Pastor Adam's son Ben each ask their father questions sent in from the audience. Some questions include the following: How do I redeem going to college?What do I do if someone keeps "drilling holes in the boat" in Christian community?What do I do if my In-Laws are the biggest dragon in my life?How do I prepare for my son's next season of life?How to encourage your son to grow towards the Lord?To receive the "Leave & Cleave" resource by Mark Driscoll: https://www.RealFaith.com/cleaveThanks for listening! Go to www.StrongerManNation.com for more resources.

Guest Bios Show Transcript https://youtu.be/XKwF1N--a00For more than two decades, Patrick and Mary DeMuth faithfully served as lay leaders at Lakepointe Church, a megachurch in the Dallas/Fort Worth area pastored by Josh Howerton. But as concerns about Howerton grew, Patrick and Mary found they could no longer stay in good conscience. And now, they're dealing with the anger and grief so many so-called “church refugees” feel. In this edition of The Roys Report (TRR), Mary DeMuth joins host Julie Roys to talk about navigating church bewilderment. This is a condition more and more Christians are experiencing today, as scandal and corruption are increasingly seeping into the church. And if you caught the previous TRR podcast with Amanda Cunningham, you heard about many of the concerning issues at Lakepointe Church. This is the church where Mary and Patrick served for 23 years. How do you deal with righteous anger? How do you navigate the grief? How much is okay to say, and what is gossip? How do you find another church home when you're dealing with feelings of betrayal and lack of trust? How do you avoid getting in the same situation again? These are crucial questions, which Mary—an internationally known author and a repeat speaker at our Restore Conference—admits she is wrestling with. And, as is so characteristic of Mary, she engages these questions with grace, wisdom, and a passion for truth and justice. Sadly, many churches have created a culture where it's not okay to talk about leaving a toxic church. But as Mary explains in this podcast, the church won't get better until we talk about it. Believers must begin to evaluate and process the toxicity in churches—and how we can truly become the Body of Christ. Mary has recently developed a Church Hurt Checklist to help people understand their situation and begin to process and articulate it. Download it free at marydemuth.com/churchhurt Guests Mary DeMuth Mary DeMuth is an international speaker, podcaster, and author of over 40 books, fiction and nonfiction, including The Most Misunderstood Women of the Bible and We Too: How the Church Can Respond Redemptively to the Sexual Abuse Crisis. Mary lives in Texas with her husband of 30+ years and is mom to three adult children. Learn more at MaryDeMuth.com. Show Transcript Julie Roys: For more than two decades, Patrick and Mary DeMuth faithfully served as leaders at a megachurch in the Dallas Fort Worth area. But as concerns about the current pastor grew, they found they could no longer stay in good conscience. And now they’re dealing with the anger and grief so many so-called church refugees feel. Julie Roys: Welcome to The Roy’s Report, a podcast dedicated to reporting the truth and restoring the church. I’m Julie Roys. And today, Mary DeMuth joins me to talk about navigating church bewilderment. Sadly, this is an issue many Christians are dealing with, as abuse, scandal, and corruption increasingly seem to be seeping into the church. Julie Roys: And if you caught our last podcast with Amanda Cunningham, you heard about many of the concerning issues at Lake Point Church in the Dallas Fort Worth area, where Josh Howerton is Pastor. This is the church where Mary and Patrick served for 23 years. And if you missed our prior podcast, it was a real eye-opener and I encourage you to go back and listen to that. Julie Roys: Today’s podcast is a sequel to my podcast with Amanda, but rather than exposing the issues at Lake Point today, Mary is going to be discussing the aftermath of leaving. How do you deal with righteous anger? How do you navigate the grief? How do you know how much is okay to say? And what is gossip? And how do you find another church home when you’re dealing with feelings of betrayal and lack of trust? How do you avoid getting in the same situation again? Julie Roys: These are crucial questions and ones that I know many of you are dealing with today. And so I’m so looking forward to diving into this topic with Mary DeMuth. But first I’d like to thank the sponsors of this podcast, Talbot Seminary and Marquardt of Barrington. Julie Roys: Are you passionate about impacting the world so it reflects biblical ideals of justice? The Talbot School of Theology Doctor of Ministry program is launching a new track exploring the theological, social, and practical dimensions of biblical justice today. The program equips students with the knowledge, skills, and spiritual foundation needed to address social issues with wisdom and compassion. Julie Roys: Justice has become a key issue in our culture, but more importantly, it’s an issue that’s close to God’s heart. While it’s clear the Bible calls God’s people to pursue justice, we must be guided by His Word within that pursuit. Talbot has created this track to do just that. As part of this program, you’ll examine issues such as trafficking, race, immigration, and poverty. Julie Roys: And I’ll be teaching a session as well, focusing on the right use of power in our churches so we can protect the vulnerable, rather than harm them. So join me and a community of like-minded scholars committed to social change and ethical leadership. Apply now at TALBOT.EDU/DMIN. Also, if you’re looking for a quality new or used car, I highly recommend my friends at Marquardt of Barrington. Marquardt is a Buick GMC dealership where you can expect honesty, integrity, and quality. That's because the owners there, Dan and Kurt Marquardt, are men of integrity. To check them out just go to BUYACAR123.COM. Julie Roys: Again, joining me is Christian author and podcaster, Mary DeMuth, and many of Mary from her excellent books like We Too: Discussing the Sexual Abuse Crisis in the Church, and also her memoir, Thin Places. Mary also was a guest speaker at our last Restore Conference in 2022, and she’ll be speaking again at our Restore Conference in Phoenix in February in 2025. So we’re super looking forward to that. Julie Roys: But she joins me now to talk about something that’s been a very painful process for both her and Patrick, and that is leaving her church of 23 years, Lake Point Church there in the Dallas Fort Worth area. So Mary, Thank you so much for being willing to talk about what I know has been a really difficult journey. Mary DeMuth: Thanks. I certainly prayed about this conversation and what I’ve noticed in this space is that a lot of people in the middle of it. are not articulating how they’re feeling because there’s this general pressure from churches that you leave that you aren’t supposed to say anything. And I think there’s a difference between, and we’ll talk about this, I’m sure, throughout this episode, but there’s a difference between leaving quietly and running around gossiping about things. Certainly, those are two different things. Mary DeMuth: But I think what we’ve done is we’ve created a culture of silence; you can’t talk about it and literally we won’t get better unless we do talk about it. So that’s one reason why I am having this conversation today, because this is not a completed story. This is a messy story. I’m in the middle of it. Mary DeMuth: I am heartbroken, and I don’t have all the answers. But I wanted to give word to those of you that may be in that same space, that may be hurting and don’t have words to say about it. And maybe I can articulate some of those things for you. Julie Roys: And I so appreciate that. I find that people often are willing to talk about experiences years after the fact, when they’ve worked it all out and they can tie it all up in a neat bow and we can all go, Oh, that’s so nice. And here’s three ways that you can apply this message. But I knew you were going through a really painful thing that it was messy. You’ve been tweeting about it, or I should say posting on X. Julie Roys: You’ve been very open and honest with your pain. And I really appreciate that. And I love the topic. You actually gave me the title for this, about navigating church bewilderment. And I love that word bewilderment because I feel like it really captures the confusion, the real disillusionment, and then the grief and the pain. Julie Roys: All of these things bound up in one. And so we’re going to get to all that and unpack all of that. But I think to understand the depth of it for you and for Patrick, first I have to understand how deeply vested you were in this church. So talk about what this church has meant to you over more than two decades and the roles that you played in it and the community that you had. Mary DeMuth: Yeah, we’ve been there for 23 years, and we immediately started serving the moment we landed there. And we also were the first non-IMB, it was an SBC church at the time, and we were the first non-IMB missionaries to be sent out from Lake Point. Julie Roys: Define IMB for those who . Mary DeMuth: Yes. International mission board. So typically SBC churches send, they don’t really send their own missionaries. They sponsor IMB because all the money comes out of the SBC into this fund for the International Mission Board. We didn’t want to do that. We wanted to be actually supported because we believed that people who paid prayed. And so we were not IMB, but Lake Point sent us out. So we were church planters in the South of France for a couple of years. And honestly the leadership there at our church, even though we weren’t going through our church, they were the ones that helped us through a really untenable situation. And our loyalty to that church was because they put us back together when we got back from the field.. Mary DeMuth: So much pouring in and so much love. And so we have been a life group leader for 20 of the 23 years. The only three years we weren’t was when we were in France, planting a church. And then I have run a couple of conferences, interestingly enough, called the Re-story Conference, which was very similar sounding to the Restore Conference. Mary DeMuth: And I also recorded a Life Way study at Lake Point for an audience. And then my husband was an elder at the church for five years. And so we have led mission teams all over the world for Lake Point. We have definitely been in the upper levels of volunteer leadership all these years and have enjoyed a lot of conviviality and fellowship. Mary DeMuth: And I never never. I always bragged about my church. It never crossed my mind that there would be a day that I wasn’t at that church anymore. And so as of December of 2023, we are away from there and making our way into a new space. Julie Roys: And I’ve talked about this on this podcast, but we’re in a house church with, some of the folks in our house church were at their previous church for over 30 years, and the amount of pain and loss and especially when you’re, when you’re our age, early 40s. Julie Roys: That’s it. It’s early 40s. No, when you’re a little bit older and later in life and to be at this point where you’re starting over is not at all where you expected to be, and it’s pretty tough to be there. You retain some of the friendships, but everything’s changed. And it just makes for a really really difficult road that you never planned to be on. Julie Roys: Your church; and this is a lot of the reason behind you leaving, changed dramatically in the last 5 years. Stephen Stroop was your previous pastor. And in 2019, I believe Josh Howerton came in. Your husband actually was on the elder board that approved him, right? Mary DeMuth: Yes. Yes. And we’ve had to work through that as you can imagine, because that’s painful to think about. And just to expand a little bit about the why is the basic reasons why we left. There’s a lot of things. As an author, as a published author and as a speaker, the plagiarism was just grating on me and I couldn’t stomach it, but that wasn’t the main reason. Mary DeMuth: Although it’s still very problematic to me. What’s more problematic is that they don’t think it’s a big deal and they don’t see it as sin, and I just disagree. But the two things that we, the two main things that caused us to walk away, one was we were told by leadership, by upper-level leadership, that there was no place for us to serve. Mary DeMuth: And that was really, that was about a year ago. And so it took us about a year to make that decision. Like we were still serving in our life group, but there were things that God has put in us as church planters. And as me, as an author and an advocate that we have a lot that we would love to be able to offer, and to have that cut off when we feel like we’re in the prime of service right now. We weren’t asking to be paid. This is all volunteer, but we were told we couldn’t. Mary DeMuth: And then the second thing that was kind of the straw was all of the crude words and the misogynistic statements that started around 2022 almost every sermon. And as an advocate for sexual abuse victims and as an advocate for women, I could no longer be associated with that church because it just didn’t, I just couldn’t be associated with it. Mary DeMuth: I have stood in front of the Southern Baptist Convention, and I have spoken and advocated, and I have been chewed up and spit out for it. And if I’m going to a church that is marginalizing women, it does not make sense. And so no place for us to serve, big, huge problem. And then I just couldn’t be connected with a church that had that kind of reputation. Julie Roys: Those reasons are huge. and make an awful lot of sense. The plagiarism as you said, the crude remarks, the misogynistic remarks. And for a lot of folks, if you’re like, what are they talking about? I do encourage you to go back and listen to our last podcast with Amanda Cunningham, where we went over a lot of these things that Mary’s talking about that have happened in her church. Julie Roys: I’m sure there’s people listening, and they’re like, okay, that sounds really, really awful. But how do you know when you hit that tipping point? Because I remember talking to you a couple of years ago and me going, Hey, is this really your pastor? I’m seeing some stuff. How is this your pastor? And you’re like we’re serving, and we love our life group. I get it. I totally, totally get it. But how did you and Patrick, how did you get to the point where you’re like, this is the tipping point, no more? Mary DeMuth: We decided we went into this together, so we decided that we both had to have the same decision. We weren’t going to have one of us leave and one not leave. We were going to do this together. So that took a year of a lot of conversations. And we saw those red flags when you saw them. So we’ve seen them, but as you mentioned, the model of Lake Point used to be, it seems to be shifting now, but it used to be church within a church. And so your life group was really basically what you’re doing, Julie. It’s a small gathering of people where there is someone who teaches, and there’s someone who’s the missions coordinator. And there’s someone who, it’s that’s how, like your church is that group. And so we felt a deep, strong connection to our group. And we felt like we were the pastors of that church within a church. Mary DeMuth: The model has shifted. And I don’t know, it has never been articulated publicly, but it seems from the exterior looking in that it’s more becoming a franchise model, which is where you create this mother church, and it can be duplicated like MacDonald’s in any context. Therefore they may not have that idea that it is church within a church anymore. It has to be something replicatable on all other campuses. And so we began to see this shifting of, this is no longer church within a church, which is really what kept us there. We had people we were serving. And then honestly, I just couldn’t stomach sermons anymore. I couldn’t walk into that building anymore. Mary DeMuth: And as everything became a spectacle the longer we were there, it was all about Sunday morning and the spectacle that it had become like a circus, and I could not find Jesus there. And I would sit in the audience. We had beautifully. articulated and performed auto-tuned worship. It was beautiful. It sounded amazing. There was a lot of rah-rah-rah. There was a lot of energy and it felt like Ichabod to me, like to me as a Christ follower, a mature Christ follower of many years, I couldn’t feel the presence of the Lord anymore. And for me, that’s what is the point of going to a church, if that has happened to you? Mary DeMuth: I’m not saying that other people aren’t experiencing the Lord there. I’m not saying that other people aren’t becoming Christians there. They are. And that’s probably the most problematic part of this whole thing is that they are easily able to point to numbers that are flowing in through the front door, ignoring all of us that have left out the back door. Mary DeMuth: And because it is successful, therefore they can just call me names and malign me or people like Amanda and others, and they can dismiss us because look what God is doing. Julie Roys: And Amanda talked about that same thing about the church within a church and even how each of the churches had different women’s ministries. Julie Roys: And I think about it, it was so personal because people are different and they all had different campuses, have different makeup, they have different cultures and now, this franchise model where you go in, you order a Big Mac, and you get a Big Mac. That’s what you’re used to, right? Julie Roys: But is it? And probably our conversation today, we probably don’t have enough time to really delve into this, but this is something I have been thinking more and more about, is it even church if you have a place where it, maybe a Christian organization and maybe a Christian organization that blesses a lot of people but is it a church where you say to members of the body, we don’t need you, we don’t need your gift, and you can’t serve here? If we have a pastor who doesn’t even know people’s names, if we don’t have that kind of shepherding, is it even a church anymore? Mary DeMuth: I’ll back up before I answer that in that I’ve, been overseas and, anyone that’s been overseas and gone to a McDonald’s overseas knows they have different categories. So even franchises like McDonald’s in France has McWine, right? Or McVine. McDonald’s even understands contextualizing the hamburger to the person, and to the people. So that’s an odd thing for me that there would be this idea that you can just, this is the model and we’re superimposing it on all sorts of different economic people and people in different cultures, and we’re just gonna superimpose it there, which seems super weird to me. Mary DeMuth:  On the, is this a church? We have to just go back to simplicity, which is, are we celebrating the Lord’s Supper? Are there sacraments there? Is the word of God being delivered and is it? Mary DeMuth: And then deeper than that, are  disciples being made? because there’s a big, huge difference between converts who hear something. And I think about the parable of the soils, they hear it, they receive it with joy, they have no root and then they walk away. We’re not teaching a theology of suffering in most of these bigger churches for sure. Mary DeMuth: But I think we need to remember that a church is supposed to be a place of koinonia, a place of fellowship, a place where we are iron sharpening iron, and a place of discipleship where people are not just converted, but they are just doing the slow work of people pouring into each other’s lives. That’s discipleship. That’s not a top-down model. That’s not pastor to congregation. That’s person to person. And when a church gets so big for its britches these things can fall through the cracks. Mary DeMuth: Now, Lake Point had done a very good job of doing that discipleship piece through their vehicle of a life group. But as things have shifted, we’re seeing a lot less of that. And again, I haven’t been there for six months, so they could be doing it. I don’t know, but just from my perspective today that’s something that’s been difficult to see. Julie Roys: You alluded to this earlier, this idea of leaving well. It’s hard to leave well and even to define what leaving well is. I will say there was one church that my husband and I ended up leaving and it was over a theological disagreement that we just felt we couldn’t bend on. And at the same time, we felt really pulled to another church. They actually had us come up and explain why we were leaving and gathered around us and prayed for us. Julie Roys: That was the most beautiful thing I have ever seen where it was just like, differences and God makes calling you here. We want to bless you as you go. And you’ve met a lot to this church and we mean a lot to each other and let’s just bless each other. It was so beautiful, and I don’t know why this can’t happen more. But usually it’s just a lot of pain and a lot of heartache And when you talk about leaving well, what it usually means to a lot of people, and I’ve heard even Christian leaders talk about this. When you leave well, you just keep your stuff to yourself. Julie Roys: The issues that you had, you suck them under, and you don’t speak about it. And honestly, I think that’s part of our problem in the church is that we don’t talk about our problems. And so we wait till they become a major scandal or crisis. And then they really blow up. And we allow abusive pastors just kind of reign; to continue doing what they’re doing. Julie Roys: So talk about this concept of leaving well. Obviously, you’ve chosen to speak rather boldly about what happened there. I think really from a heart of love and concern for both the church and the people there, not just to vent how you’re feeling. But talk about that and how you’ve come to the decision you have about that. Mary DeMuth: First, I’ll say there’s been kind of  an unholy silence. We were pretty high up and we have not been followed up with, and the very few times we were invited into those spaces, it was difficult. So there is that. I would encourage church leaders to do what your former church did, because I think there’s a lot to be learned. Mary DeMuth: I also need to say that we didn’t leave from a position of canceling and of immaturity. There’s one thing if you’re like a church hopper and you’re like, just running around with a consumeristic mindset like, what do I get in this for me? A lot of people that are leaving churches are being accused of being that. But the ones that I know that have left this church are mature, deep believers in Christ who are seeing so many red flags. Mary DeMuth: And the reason I articulated it was because I was running into people who were brokenhearted and didn’t have words for it. And somehow through the grace of God and through his power and his ability, I was able to say the things that people were feeling so that they would no longer feel alone. I would rather have been silent if the Lord hadn’t put his hand on me. Mary DeMuth: I would rather grieve this alone and quietly, but I have seen a lot of really good conversation and ministry happen because of this. I’m not out to harm the reputation of the church. I will never tell someone to leave a church unless they’re being abused, obviously, that’s their own decision. Mary DeMuth: They have the autonomy to make that decision between them and God. But I do want to be a listening ear and an empath for those who are bewildered at the church they’re going to that no longer looks like the church they used to go to. Julie Roys: So tell me what is gossip because this is what is, this is the word, I’ve gotten called this myriads and myriads of times. But what is gossip? And clearly you don’t believe this falls into that category. Why? Mary DeMuth: It’s not gossip to share your emotions about how you’re reacting to an abuse. That is actually being a lot like Paul. And if you look at the letters throughout the epistles in particular, you see Paul saying things about churches. Mary DeMuth: And so if we’re going to talk about gossip, we’d have to call him a gossip because he was constantly calling out, Hey, listen, those Judaizers, they don’t really have it right. Oh, listen, this Gnosticism isn’t good. And that guy’s having sex with his mother-in-law. These kinds of things are, he’s very clear. Mary DeMuth: These are not untrue things he’s saying. These are actually true statements. And underneath all of that is a desire for the church to be the body of Christ and to be holy. It’s not slander because it’s telling the truth. And it’s always with a desire to see God do good work in the local church. And if she is straying, if you love her, you will say something about it. Mary DeMuth: Now there’s a manner in which you can do that. You can be really caustic. You can speak the truth without love, but we are called to speak the truth with love. And I believe that we have conflagrated speaking the truth in love with gossip, and those are two different things. Gossip intends to harm the reputation of another or of an entity; telling the truth in love tries to help that institution have a mirror and see what’s going on. Julie Roys: The motive is really important, although I always get frustrated when people try to judge other people’s motives because the truth is, you don’t know somebody else’s heart. And that’s something I never do. I’ll talk about actions, but I don’t know someone’s heart. Only God knows the heart. But I know that’s something I constantly check myself about is my desire for repentance? is my desire to see these leaders repent? 100 percent, and I know you well enough to know that you would be absolutely thrilled and would extend grace if the leaders who have hurt you so deeply would repent of their sin and would change their ways. I know that and I’m sure you pray for that, that you and Patrick are praying right now for that. Am I right? Mary DeMuth: Absolutely. That is  underneath all of this, is just a desire to see the local church healthy and to see her lift up the name of Jesus. And we also just want to again put up a mirror of is this representing the kingdom of God or is this representing something else? And that’s what we were coming to find. Patrick and I both were. The kingdom’s upside down. It’s counterintuitive. It’s the least is the most. And the most is the least. It’s not about building platforms. It’s not about being the winner. It’s not about Christian nationalism. It’s none of these. I don’t even like those two words together. Mary DeMuth: It’s not about power. Jesus willingly laid down his power and he considered equality with God, not something to be grasped. He made himself nothing. And when I see a lot of these big churches and not all of them, but a lot of them where it is very male leader centric celebrity driven. And really about, we want to be the coolest people with the biggest numbers. Mary DeMuth: I don’t get it. They’ll point to Acts chapter two. They’ll talk about how many were added to the kingdom on that day. They’ll call that a mega church. It was not a mega church. People were still meeting in homes. So we just have to be careful. I’m not against mega churches. I actually think that there’s a place for them. Mary DeMuth: Over the years, they we have had the benefit of a megachurch that can go into a community and say, oh, you need a church building, here you go. Like they can do some things that a littler church can’t do. So I’m not against the megachurch, but there is something fallible in the model, the consumeristic model, that is causing all of this anguish. Julie Roys: And I’d say the leadership model. Because we have imported a leadership model that’s of the world and done the exact opposite of what Jesus said, don’t be like the Gentiles who lorded over them, but instead, whoever wants to be first should be last, whoever wants to be greatest should be least. Julie Roys: It is the upside-down kingdom, and we’ve forgotten that. We’ve become just like the world, and we count our success the same way as the world. And we’ve seen this going, it’s been going on a very long time, and I think the megachurches get a lot of the criticism because they’ve. been kind of doing it in spades in an awful lot of them and then exporting these values to all the smaller churches who are wannabes, right? Julie Roys: So you even have smaller churches that are trying to do the exact same thing and they think it’s right because it’s successful very much in the American model of success, which is bigger and better. Before we go forward, there is something I do want to ask you, though, and I would be remiss if I didn’t. What was it about what you and Patrick that you were doing that they didn’t want you serving? Mary DeMuth: I don’t know. They just didn’t want us. That’s what’s been hard is, it’s a speculative, I just don’t know. And I’m willing to be talked to about those things, of course. Like if they feel like something that we’re not godly enough or we’re, or I’m too public or whatever it is, I don’t know. Mary DeMuth: But I do know this, I do know this. When we were told this, what we learned was that they had been morphing from a church that had a lot of lay leaders to a higher control situation where only people who are employed by the church could be in charge of ministries. And so, you can control that. If you can control someone's salary, you can control the whole thing. Mary DeMuth: And so we were just told there is no place for you because we’re not on staff. So that’s probably my guess at a reason is that we were not controllable. And the statement made to us is I’ve got 30 other people just like you that are well trained and that have gone, my husband went to seminary, and all that, but will never use them. We will never use them. And basically, you just need to get over it. You will never be used. Julie Roys:  What a waste of resources. Unbelievable. The kingdom is not so well resourced that we don’t need every single person; that God didn’t give gifts every single one of them to be used. Julie Roys: But I will say, I’ve seen this happen before. And the beautiful thing is, people get dispersed, people like yourself and like Patrick, too often churches that are very needy very welcoming. Like Oh, thank God. It’s like Christmas come early, come to Moots, come to our church. And I’m sure you’re experiencing that because I can’t imagine not wanting you and Patrick at my church. It’s just shocking to me. But yeah, that is a benefit of it. It’s the church in Jerusalem getting persecuted. Then they went to the ends of the earth, and we can do that. Julie Roys: One of the things that I’ve seen be a silver lining, if you can call it that, in these sorts of situations is you’re a church refugee, but there’s a lot of other ones out there, too. And there can be a great deal of deep fellowship. And, in many ways, that’s what RESTORE is. It’s a gathering of a lot of not just refugees, a lot of helpers and pastors and people who are allies who just want to know more. But. There’s an awful lot of us there that have been hurt by the church, and there’s just this beautiful, sweet fellowship. Julie Roys: And my understanding is, and Amanda alluded to it in our last podcast, that you guys have served as pastors to these refugees. Would you talk about that sweet group that you were able to love on and pastor through this and just help them? Mary DeMuth: Yeah, we definitely were praying, and we just kept coming upon people. And in particular, people who had been employed but had been harshly fired in very traumatic ways. And we just felt so deeply. I mean for us, it’s sad and we were highly involved and it’s sad, but it wasn’t our job. And so we just had this empathy for those folks. And so we gathered as much as we knew, we put the word out quietly. Mary DeMuth: We gathered people for several weeks and met with them. And these were people that some were still there, and some were not, and some were walking away from Jesus. It was just the whole gamut of a wide variety of people in a lot of pain. And what we wanted to do was just to help them know our first session was called, You are not crazy. We just wanted them to know. that what they had seen and experienced was real and validated by the rest of us. And then we’ve just been walking through Chuck DeGroat's information about narcissism in the church and narcissistic church systems. And then talking about what is a safe person and what is a safe system. And then praying and crying and grieving and giving people the space that they are not allowed to have to get out all this junk that’s inside of us because it’s been so, so painful. Julie Roys: And I want to get to the safe system and the safe person, because I’m sure there’s a lot of people listening who would like that information as well. Julie Roys: But let’s talk about the feelings first, because when this happens, there is. Again, we talked about bewilderment. There’s just this mix of negative emotions that you don’t know what to do with a lot of times. One is anger and anger in the church has been one of these emotions that we just don’t deal with very well. And I’ve said this numerous times, but this is one that we’ll get. We’ll get thrown back in my face and people say, you sound like you’re angry and I’m like, darn I’m angry. Why aren’t you angry? Why wouldn’t we be angry when these awful things are happening in the church? And yet again, as a Christian, we feel guilty when we’re angry. So how have you dealt with your own anger, and helped others who are dealing with similar anger? Mary DeMuth: The first thing that we did was we process outside of the circle of the church because we needed to know if we were going crazy. Is this normal? Are these things that we’re saying? Is it a big deal? Or are we just being babies? We definitely did that. And then it’s been the prayer of let this anger fuel something beautiful, because I do believe that great movements of God happen because there’s injustice and we are angry at the injustice. Mary DeMuth: I often joke that I write a book when I’m angry, so I must be a pretty angry person at book 52. There’s injustice in this world and our God is righteousness and justice are the foundation of his throne. When we do the work of making note of people who are being hurt and oppressed and harmed, we are doing the Lord’s work. And so that anger can be a fuel to doing positive things Mary DeMuth:. Now, I also just want to say, it’s okay to be angry. I’m angry and I have been angry and I’m processing that with friends and I’m processing it with my husband and with the Lord. Rightfully so, because I see so many people, to use Mark Driscoll’s frustrating phraseology, the people behind the bus. I’m meeting so many people behind the bus that are getting the bus is backing up over the people. Because not only cause when if you say anything, if you dare to say anything, you will get run over again and again, you will be accused of all sorts of things when really your desire is to see people set free and to open the eyes of people that are being harmed so that they no longer have to be in that system anymore. Julie Roys: And what a great deal of fear these leaders must feel. to behave that way that you have to annihilate people who say anything negative. I’ve gotten quite comfortable with people saying negative things. I just want to make sure if there’s truth in it, that I take it to heart. It’s okay, but in the end of the day, you’ve got to be okay with who you are before your Lord. And those closest to you who will tell you the truth when you’re veering off. That desire to control that desire that you have to shut down negative communication. I can’t imagine living in that much fear that you constantly are doing that. And yet that’s what we see. Julie Roys: And that whole thing about feeling like you’re crazy. So much of that’s because you’ve been told you’re crazy. You’ve been told that because that’s the gaslighting that happens when you say there’s a problem. No, there is no problem. You’re the problem. Mary DeMuth: It’s back to the emperor with no clothes. We all see the naked emperor and only a little kid says he’s not wearing any clothes. And we’re like Oh, yeah, but there’s this like kind of delusional thing or czarist Russia, the Potemkin village. If you know what that is, it was a village that was just set up like a movie set so that when the czar went by he could see that this Potemkin’s village was actually a really cool place, but you open the door, you walk through, it’s just mud and dirt on the other side and some horses grazing in a field. Church is not a Potemkin village. It should never be. It should not be a facade that we are trying to hold up by shaming people who say negative things. The church is a living, breathing organization. It is the body of Christ. Mary DeMuth: God does not need to be defended. He can do just fine by himself. And this fear that you talk about is very real because it’s about human empire. Whenever we build our Roman empire on our cult of personality and our particular views about things and not on the word of God and not on studying the word of God, then we will be threatened by anyone who says anything negative because that will eat away at the foundation of our FACO empire. Julie Roys: Very well said. That is very well said. Let’s talk about grief. And I was reminded of the Kubler Ross Stages of grief. And let me see. Those are denial, which is often where we start, right? When things go wrong, anger, the bargaining we can work this out somehow, right? Depression and sink into that deep depression. This is just so sad. And then there’s acceptance, which is that last one. And it’s not like these are completely linear because what I found is you go through, oh, I’ve worked through to acceptance. No, I haven’t. I’m back at anger again. Julie Roys: Something will happen. it'll put you right back there. So it’s not completely linear, but how have you moved toward acceptance? What does acceptance look like? And maybe that’s a long way off but talk about where you’re at in that whole process. Mary DeMuth: I think a lot of people are in this space. There’s a lot of loyal people and that’s where the bargaining comes in. And a lot of the people I’ve talked to are like, yeah, I never go to that church anymore, like to the services, but I’m here because of my small group and they’re my church. There’s this, that we were in that space for a really long time. We can make this work. This is our church, not that other part is not the church, but it’s all together. Mary DeMuth: So once we got to the decision and made the decision, then the depression set in for sure. And I think I’m still there working my way through it of thinking that I was going to be there the rest of my life. As a person who grew up in a really difficult home and met Jesus at 15 years old, the church became my family. My family was not my family. And the church was the one place where I could go to be loved, to be healed, to be worked, just to work through my salvation with fear and trembling. And so, to walk away from something that you’ve been at the most we’ve ever been at a church is 23. This is the longest we’ve ever been somewhere to walk away from. It felt like I lost my limb. I lost my family, my father’s in the faith, my mother’s in the faith, my aunts, and my uncles in the faith. And then to be villainized for just having eyes to see what the heck is going on, has been devastating, devastating. So I’m still in the grief phase and I don’t cry much about it because I’ve sometimes just shoved it way down deep because I did not ever expect that I was going to have to leave a place I loved so much. Julie Roys: There’s a, I think it’s a short story and I should know the name of it, but it’s about someone, a man who goes to a cemetery and he sees a woman just weeping and weeping, and he’s there to visit his partner who had died. I don’t think he had actually married her. But he realizes in that moment that the person who’s grieving, who’s crying and just sobbing is the richer person. Because they had loved deeply and he had never loved that deeply. And I’ve thought about that, I lost my mother over 20 years ago and she was so special and I never like, I hear some people talk about their mothers, and how difficult or what I never felt that way. My mother was just a joy, but it was so hard to lose her, but it was hard because I loved her so much. Julie Roys: And I think, I’m so grateful for you that you did have that church experience where you were loved so deeply, where you loved deeply, and I’ve got to believe that God will provide that family again. It will be different. And I know I just feel so blessed by our church family that we found in this wasteland or out of the wasteland. Julie Roys: But it’s been really, really special because I don’t have to explain anything to these people. They understand the world I work in. They understand. It’s just, it’s really been a gift. And I think it’s been a gift too. And I know you have adult children. I’m glad I had these adult children because they’re a blessing in ways that they couldn’t be and a support in ways that they couldn’t be when they were younger, when we had to be everything to them. Julie Roys: And I’m glad I’m not dealing with, and I know a lot of people are,  is what do we do for our kids now? And then there’s that pressure to find something for your children right away. And that makes it really hard. But as believers, we are taught, Hebrews 10:25, let us not give up meeting together as some are in the habit of doing, but all the more as the day of the Lord approaches, let us encourage each other and all the more as the day approaches. I have found sometimes that can be used as a club against people who are just grieving, and they’re dealing with a great deal of betrayal trauma at this point. Julie Roys: And now we’re going to hit them over the head and say, you better be in church on Sunday. When they walk into a church and it just triggers, it’s a trigger for them. I believe in fellowship. I believe in the church. I love the church, but I am concerned about the process of helping people reengage after they’ve been wounded so profoundly. Julie Roys: So speak to this process of finding a new church home, or even having the freedom for a period of time to say, I don’t know. I don’t know that I can do that right now. Obviously, there is a danger if we’re out of fellowship for too long. But speak to that person who right now is outside of fellowship and really afraid to reengage with it. Mary DeMuth: Yeah. First, you’re super normal. And if you’ve been wounded in a terrible community, the stakes are pretty high, when you walk in, especially if you’re triggered or traumatized by walking into a building. I don’t know that I could walk into a big church right now. Like I just don’t think I could, I think I would have a hard time with that. Mary DeMuth: So for us, how we went about it and everyone’s going to be different, we did want to land somewhere because we just feel like we’re in that stage of, we want to serve the church. And so for our little parameters, and I think it’ll be different for every person. Ours was, it needs to be local. And we’re hoping that there will be people there already that we’re friends with. Mary DeMuth: And since we’re in a little town, right? So there’s, 1 billion churches and little towns in Texas, right? So we had plenty to choose from so many, and we didn’t even get to all of them, but that was our parameter in choosing a home. In fact, we just officially joined a church yesterday. So it did take some time to get to that place. But I just want to let you know that it’s normal to be scared, to be triggered, to be in pain. Mary DeMuth: Don’t let it stay there. You are wounded in a negative community and the Lord is very frustrating and he asks you to be healed in good community. That’s hard. But a relational wound requires a relational cure, and that’s one reason why Patrick and I have been pouring into people who are hurt because we want to be that safer relationship for people to be falling apart or hurting or ask really blunt questions and be really ticked off. Because I believe people are healed in community when they’re wounded in community. Julie Roys: 100%. And I know when I came through just so much grief and pain and church hurt. I know a lot of people go to therapy and I’m not against therapy, but I was like, I don’t need to talk to this about this with a counselor. It’s just not like that. I need to be in a community where there’s love. I need to see beauty in people like again. And even though I’m afraid to be vulnerable on some levels at the same time, I’m compelled to be vulnerable because I know until you do that, you can’t heal. Mary DeMuth: When we met with the person who became our pastor and there’s a multiplicity of pastors in this particular denomination, but we sat across from him and we told him our story and he just listened, and he dignified the story. And then he said this, he said, we just want to love you. And I just immediately just, I was like, what? you don’t want to use me? Cause we’ve been in leadership positions in the church for so long, our whole adult lives we’ve been in those positions and for him to say, we just want to love you. And that was foreign to me, but that was the beginning of that healing journey. Julie Roys: I had a pastor at one of the churches we visited when we were in this search process. And it was at a very large church I would say it’s probably a megachurch, and we sat across from him and he said a very similar thing. It was really wonderful. And he said, “I think you guys have been wounded deeply, and you need a place to heal. And we do just want to love you. What was interesting is when I came back to him with a follow up email, because part of me is like wait, this is a megachurch. Am I insane? Julie Roys: I’m just like looking at it and being like,  I don’t think this is at all what I want. And then I emailed him. I said, we want a pastor. Would you be able to pastor us? And then he basically declined as nicely as he could; like I’d love to be, but I can’t and I’m like I don’t need a small group leader to try and pastor me. I was just kind of like of course, you can’t because you have the corporation to run. And so that is again a fundamental issue that I do have with the mega church. Julie Roys: One thing I found and I see it here, because I don’t know how many people in the Chicago area who have left Willow Creek and ended up at Harvest. They’re like, wow, di I know how to pick them! They’re going from something that’s become familiar. And if you became a believer at Willow, then that big model, that big service, whiz bang entertaining sermon or inspirational talk, whatever you want to call it. Julie Roys: Although I’ll say at Harvest, he preached he discipled people. I know a lot of people from Harvest that were discipled shockingly by a really depraved pastor. But I see them going from what they’re used to. And it’s almost like when I see people who grew up in a dysfunctional home and thank God you didn’t do this, but they often then replicate that in their own home, or they’re attracted to that same kind of dysfunction in the next home. Julie Roys: And I’ve seen it with churches and I’m just like, why are you going to the same model of church that you just left? And I see that there’s this thought in their head that it’s just the one bad apple. That’s all it is. It’s the one bad apple, but basically there’s nothing wrong with the system. Julie Roys: I think there’s something fundamentally wrong with the system. So speak to that. Do you think, I know you’ve got some pretty strong opinions now about celebrity megachurches, even though you said some megachurches we’ve seen work. Do you have some thoughts about the model of church and what makes a safe church? Mary DeMuth: Yes. So many thoughts. I’ll start with a story. In the early two thousand, I went to my first Christian writers conference before I was published and on the airplane on the way there, my story flashed before my eyes and I said, Lord I’ve withstood a lot of trials. Like I’ve gone through a lot of trials. Mary DeMuth: And he said clearly to me, you have withstood many trials, but will you withstand the trial of notoriety? And that has stayed in my mind all these years because fame emaciates, fame makes you think that you’re better than other people and that people exist to serve you rather than you equipping the saints for the work of service. Mary DeMuth: And when the systems are in a place, typically what happens is the ego takes over. There’s something deep within the narcissistic system. And in the narcissistic pastor, they have this wound that they can’t fill except by acclaim. And then it’s like a drug, so they have to keep being acclaimed. They cannot have negative things said about them. Mary DeMuth: Therefore, the next thing they’ll do is they will dismantle the elder board, or they will significantly reduce the influence of the elder board that exists or completely dismantle it altogether. They will gather yes-men around themselves who will only say positive things to them that are not in their context that cannot see them do the bad things And who are other megachurch pastors. So there’s just this like cabal of megachurch pastors that are sitting on each other’s boards saying you can do whatever you want and have fun. Mary DeMuth: That system is ungodly and that will cause the fall of many leaders, which we have already seen over and over and over. It’s like a broken record of sameness. It keeps happening. Why? Because I think we are creating a church structure from a pyramid, which if you look in the Bible, the Israelites left Egypt, but were still looking back at it. One person at the top, one Pharaoh at the top, one supreme ruler, and then everybody has to fit into that system underneath that pyramid. Mary DeMuth: Whereas the kingdom of God is the opposite of that. It’s an inverted pyramid. The kingdom is of people that are last to are not acknowledged. And I think we’re going to be super surprised at where they are standing in line and the new heavens and the new earth, the people with all the acclaim are going to be way at the back. The people that nobody knew about that were silently and quietly serving the Lord are going to be at the front of the line. And we’re going to say, tell me your story, I want to learn from you. Mary DeMuth: But these structures cause the downfall of many men who do not have the character to hold up that structure. They’ve been given leadership responsibility without having maturity, and therefore they are stealing sermons. They are harming people with their words. They are demonizing others. They are all sorts of things you talked about last week. They’re doing those things because they have to keep their empire because their ego needs it so badly. Julie Roys: And the other thing is, and we can’t really even go into this, although I know you see this too, because you run your own literary agency, is that the evangelical industrial complex needs these celebrity pastors to function. So they need the publishing companies need the celebrities so that they can publish them, so that the megachurches need the celebrity to fuel their model of that great attractional speaker that can be everything. Which again, does just feed into the narcissism and it attracts the narcissism. Julie Roys: We like the narcissist. And the whole entire moneymaking empire runs on these narcissists and these celebrity pastors. And so it’s not just even the pastor himself who needs to be a celebrity, but it’s this system that needs celebrities. And at some point, Mary we’ve got to deal with this and evangelicalism, or we’re just going to keep doing this over and over and over again. Mary DeMuth: And I believe the Lord is bringing judgment on those systems. And we’re seeing that in publishing as well. I think it’s a broken system. We make these requirements of how popular you are to be able to be an author. In the nineties and before, it was really about can you write a good book? Is it theologically sound? Do you have a good mind? Do you have a heart to minister to others? And now it’s how many social media followers do you have? Which is you can buy those. Mary DeMuth: So what does that even mean? I hate being a cog in the Christian industrial complex, both as an author and as a literary agent, but as an agent, I feel like I’m championing projects that would otherwise not get sold. That are more global voices people that are marginalized and not often given a voice. So that’s why I have a literary agency. Cause I’m trying to have those voices platformed. Julie Roys: Before you go, I want to ask you also about, we’ve talked a little bit about a safe church, but what makes somebody a safe person as you’re trying to process this? Mary DeMuth: A safe person is someone who doesn’t speak initially, who is an active listener. Who doesn’t jump to conclusions, who doesn’t feel the need to defend the church that you are leaving, who doesn’t say things like Hebrew says don’t forsake your assembling together. Those kinds of like cliche, like super cliche oh, you better do this instead of just meeting you in your grief. Mary DeMuth: A safe person doesn’t try to change your state. They come alongside you into your state and they weep alongside. And that to me is so powerful. People won’t remember what you said, but they will remember that you were there with them in the pain. And we’re just willing to say, yeah, that hurts. And, oh, that must’ve been very painful. Just that empathy piece. Julie Roys: And they won’t shame you for deconstructing. They’ll walk with you; they’ll allow you to process. And I hate that when I see that. I see it on social media all the time, people denigrating people who are deconstructing and I’m like, maybe if you didn’t do that, maybe they wouldn’t be walking away from their faith. But again, deconstructing, I think takes a lot of different forms. I think for a lot of people that have gone through it; they’ve come back to a richer faith that stripped of maybe some of the baggage that they had previously. Julie Roys: Before I let you go, because I know a lot of people listening are in this place of just really, really  struggling and in a lot of hurt. And I know you have names and faces for those people too. Would you be willing to just pray for them and what they’re going through right now? Mary DeMuth: I will. And I’m just going to mention, I have a free resource, MARYDEMUTH.COM/CHURCHHURT. And it’s a hundred statements about things that people feel when they’re going through church hurt so that you can share it with a friend and check off the ones that are you, and then have a good conversation about it. Julie Roys: Wonderful. What a great resource. Thank you. Mary DeMuth: Yeah. Okay. Let me pray. Lord, thank you for loving the least of these. Thank you for leaving the 99 and chasing the one. Thank you for being counterintuitive. Thank you for the Sermon on the Mount. Thank you for your grace being sufficient for us and your power is made perfect in our weakness. Mary DeMuth: Lord, forgive us for these systems where we are worshiping strength, power, and numbers when that’s nothing to do with your kingdom. Reorient our lives and our hearts to what is your kingdom. Help us to hear your voice in the midst of the madness and the muddledness of what this has become. I pray that you would send friends to my friends who are suffering in the aftermath of spiritual abuse and church hurt. Mary DeMuth: I pray for hope Lord in these kinds of situations, it can feel like a death, and it feels very hopeless and sad. I pray for comfort and pray all of this in your beautiful name, Jesus. Amen. Julie Roys: Amen. Mary. Thank you so much. And how beautiful that even in this you are ministering to others through it. So I am just so grateful for you and for Patrick and for what you bring to the kingdom. And thank you so much for being willing to talk so vulnerably and bravely. So thank you. Mary DeMuth: Thank you. Julie Roys: And thanks so much for listening to The Roys Report, a podcast dedicated to reporting the truth and restoring the church. I’m Julie Roys, and I want to invite all of you to our next Restore Conference in Phoenix in February 2025. Julie Roys: This is one of the most healing gatherings I know of, where you won’t just hear from amazing folks like Mary DeMuth and Scott McKnight, author of A Church Called Tove, and Dr. David Pooler, an expert in adult clergy sexual abuse. But you’ll also meet lots of other people who have gone through similar experiences, and I’ve found that just being in that kind of community is so healing. Julie Roys: And so powerful. So please come. I would love to meet you there. To find out more information, just go to RESTORE2025.COM. Also just a quick reminder to subscribe to The Roys Report on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube. That way you won’t miss any of these episodes. And while you’re at it, I’d really appreciate it if you’d help us spread the word about the podcast by leaving a review. Julie Roys: And then please share the podcast on social media so more people can hear about this great content. Again, thanks so much for joining me today. Hope you were blessed and encouraged. 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If you're paying attention even in the slightest, you know there is a clear and deliberate agenda to undermine and de-value men and the role they play in society. It's crucial that we, as men, remain vigilant in the knowledge of that and, more importantly, continue to show up powerfully for those we wish to lead and serve. My guest today, Mark Driscoll, has been doing this for decades specifically through his ministry of Christ. We talk about whether or not men are the problem in society, the balance between fearless courage and loving kindness, why submitting to proper authority does not make us weaker men, the key archetypes of masculinity, Christian weakness, and why curiosity will you put you on a path to becoming a better man. SHOW HIGHLIGHTS (00:00) - Episode Intro (00:42) - Men, Masculinity, and Convictions (07:23) - The Nature of God and Humanity (19:16) - Navigating Faith, Authority, and Hope (25:52) - Discussion on Faith and Humanity (34:50) - Exploring Fatherhood and Authority in Society (49:07) - Erosion of Masculinity in Society (01:00:26) - Encouraging Courage in Men (01:07:00) - Masculinity, Motives, and Mentorship   Battle Planners: Pick yours up today! Order Ryan's new book, The Masculinity Manifesto. For more information on the Iron Council brotherhood. Want maximum health, wealth, relationships, and abundance in your life? Sign up for our free course, 30 Days to Battle Ready  

In this podcast… Pastor Loran Livingston famously trashed the trump bible recently. But I turned up some other interesting clips about the guy, courtesy of hemant Mehta and others. As a televangelist, he might not be as respectable as he looks. There's a pastor named Mark Driscoll. You might have heard of him, you might not. He recently became the focus of a massive schism in the evangelical church, and nobody seems to be talking about it. I love everything about it. Let's talk about how he just tore evangelical church in two. Pastor John MacArthur has been a televangelist longer than i've been alive. He's a mainstay in the movement. He even started a kind of college. Apparently, he thinks PTSD and OCD are fake. Among other acronyms. He didn't just toss it out there, either. He really leaned into it. We also take voicemails. If you want to leave a voicemail, the number is 1-800-701-8573. Get my book (Understanding Jehovahs Witnesses): https://owenmorgan.com/ Become a youtube member: https://owenmorgan.com/fireside-membership Patreon: https://owenmorgan.com/patreon Twitch: https://owenmorgan.com/twitch Telltale: https://www.youtube.com/@owenmorgantelltale Telltale Fireside Chat: https://www.youtube.com/@telltalefiresidechat Telltale Unfiltered: https://www.youtube.com/@telltaleunfiltered TikTok: https://owenmorgan.com/tiktok Discord: https://owenmorgan.com/discord PayPal: https://owenmorgan.com/paypal Teespring: https://owenmorgan.com/teespring Podcast on iTunes: https://owenmorgan.com/itunes-podcast Podcast on SoundCloud: https://owenmorgan.com/soundcloud-podcast Voicemail: 1-800-701-8573

In light of recent evangelical “viral moments” (e.g. Mark Driscoll calling out a sword-swallower at a men's conference), Scott and Chris tackle gimmicks in Evangelicalism. Listen to learn the motives behind gimmicky Christianity, its consequences, and how to combat it with our Bibles.

The Church That Hired a Former Male Stripper to Perform at a Men's ConferenceThe Stream, By Michael Brown, on April 16, 2024https://stream.org/the-church-that-hired-a-former-male-stripper-to-perform-at-a-mens-conference/The discussion delves into a rather bizarre incident that occurred at a men's conference involving a former male stripper who performed shirtless acrobatics. This seemingly innocuous act sparked a clash between pastors Mark Driscoll and Michael Brown, leading to a humorous yet insightful analysis of the underlying issues.The conversation begins by highlighting the absurdity of the situation, with participants poking fun at the over-the-top reactions of Driscoll and Brown. They suggest that the pastors' discomfort likely stems from deep-seated homophobia and insecurity rather than any legitimate concern.As the discussion unfolds, the participants explore the broader themes of masculinity, repression, and hypocrisy within religious circles. They point out the irony of a supposedly Godly event descending into a spectacle of judgment and immaturity.Through witty banter and astute observations, the participants critique the double standards and irrationality inherent in the situation. They emphasize the importance of open dialogue and self-reflection in dismantling harmful attitudes and fostering a more inclusive and understanding community.The Non-Prophets, Episode 23.18.4 featuring Phoebe Rose, Emma Thorne, Infidel64 and Helen GreeneBecome a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/the-non-prophets--3254964/support.

Evangelical conservatives too often portray masculinity as if men are supposed to be the “Alpha male”—aloof, emotionless, vying for control, and bullying. Today we look at how, even in nature, this concept of the Alpha Male has been overblown. And we present a better picture.To Support Us:Join our Patreon for as little as $5 a month to support our workFor tax deductible donations in the U.S., support Good Fruit Faith Initiative through the Bosko FoundationAnd check out our Merch, or any of our courses!Things mentioned in the podcast:Let Men Be Men podcasts, and Let Men Be DadsJosh Howerton about Evangelical HoneymoonsThe Desiring God article where Greg Morse bemoans all the safe menThe TED Talk from Frans de Waal about Alpha MalesRick Pidcock analyses the Stronger Men's Conference with Mark Driscoll's “Jezebel” outburst This week's article on turning the other cheek All about New River Fellowship ChurchNew River Fellowship FacebookInstagramPastor Joey Willis, Lead Pastor at New River Fellowship in Hudson Oaks, Texas.Join Sheila at Bare Marriage.com!Check out her books: The Great Sex Rescue She Deserves Better The Good Girl's Guide to Great Sex and The Good Guy's Guide to Great Sex And she has an Orgasm Course and a Libido course too!Check out all her courses, FREE resources, books, and so much more at Sheila's LinkTree.

Are our smartphones killing our faith? Do we need to take drastic steps to protect ourselves from their misuse? Were Mark Driscoll's actions out of line at the Stronger Men's conference? In this episode the regulars cover these questions, amid the broader topic of our current smartphone addiction and epidemic, in light of author Jonathan Haidt's new book, The Anxious Generation.David also shares about his disdain for a phone's Airplane Mode function, and an ominous occurrence of phantom vibration syndrome.-------------------------------Questions, comments, or feedback? We'd love to hear what you think! Send them to provokeandinspire@steiger.org, or send us a message on Instagram.Join the Provoke & Inspire Discord Community!Click below to follow the regulars on Instagram!Ben PierceDavid PierceChad JohnsonLuke Greenwood

Today's Topics: 1) Mexican Church criticizes Santa Muerte T-shirt supporting President López Obrador https://cruxnow.com/church-in-the-americas/2024/04/mexican-church-criticizes-santa-muerte-t-shirt-supporting-president-lopez-obrador 2) The new 50 euro note enshrines Baphomet as the god of the EU https://www.fromrome.info/2023/05/21/the-new-50-euro-note-enshrines-baphomet-as-the-god-of-the-eu/ 3, 4) Mark Driscoll kicked off stage at John Lindell's (protestant) Men's Conference https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4W_qOLb7xE

Summary In this conversation, Tim and April discuss Taylor Swift's new album and the criticism it has received from some conservative Christians. They address the accusations of blasphemy and witchcraft, as well as the critique of explicit lyrics. They also highlight the hypocrisy of supporting Donald Trump while condemning Swift's music. The conversation reveals the subjective nature of art interpretation and the need for self-reflection within religious communities. In this conversation, Tim and April discuss the misconceptions and misunderstandings surrounding the concepts of witchcraft, demons, and Christian nationalism. They critique the views of Sean Feucht, a Christian musician and activist, who uses buzzwords like witches and demons without fully understanding their historical and cultural contexts. They also highlight the financial motivations behind Feucht's activism and his association with other controversial figures like Mark Driscoll and Eric Metaxas. The conversation touches on the ongoing Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the role of Christian Zionism, as well as the harmful effects of fear-based ideologies and the importance of respecting individual beliefs. Takeaways The criticism of Taylor Swift's album by conservative Christians reveals the subjective nature of art interpretation. Accusations of blasphemy and witchcraft are based on selective reading and misinterpretation of lyrics. The hypocrisy of supporting Donald Trump while condemning Swift's music exposes the double standards within some religious communities. Misunderstandings and misconceptions about witchcraft and demons are prevalent, often fueled by a lack of historical and cultural context. Some Christian activists, like Sean Feucht, use buzzwords without fully understanding their meanings, leading to misrepresentations and fear-based ideologies. Christian nationalism often promotes a narrow and exclusionary view of Christianity, disregarding the diversity of beliefs within the faith. Respecting individual beliefs and avoiding the imposition of one's own beliefs on others is crucial for fostering understanding and dialogue. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Mispronunciations 07:06 Engaging with Different Perspectives on LGBTQ+ Affirmation 27:27 Sean Feucht's Urgent Message and Misguided Critiques 35:26 The Subjectivity of Art Interpretation and the Need for Self-Reflection 45:52 Navigating the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict with Nuance 52:56 Respecting Individual Beliefs and Avoiding Imposition Check out our website for merch, educational materials, and how to join our community! If you'd like to support our work, you can DONATE here! Follow Us On Instagram @thenewevangelicals  Subscribe On YouTube The New Evangelicals exists to support those who are tired of how evangelical church has been done before and want to see an authentic faith lived out with Jesus at the center. We are committed to building a caring community that emulates the ways of Jesus by reclaiming the evangelical tradition and embracing values that build a better way forward. If you've been marginalized by your faith, you are welcome here. We've built an empathetic and inclusive space that encourages authentic conversations, connections and faith. Whether you consider yourself a Christian, an exvangelical, someone who's questioning your faith, or someone who's left the faith entirely, you are welcome here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In this episode, Kyle breaks down the most recent controversy surrounding Mark Driscoll; this time, his public rebuke of a male stripper's pole dance routine that opened a Christian men's conference. Also, in the Quick Hitters segment, we discuss Max Holloway delivering the greatest knockout in MMA history, Joe Biden trying to turn Easter into tranny Christmas, Caitlyn Clark somehow saving and ruining women's basketball simultaneously, a gay man in Chicago being arrested for allegedly distributing child pornography and planning to rape his newborn son, the National Association of Intercollegiate Athletics (NAIA) adopting a new policy banning males from competing in women's sports. Let's get into it… Episode notes and links HERE. Donate to support our mission of equipping men to push back darkness. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Previously puritanical evangelicals are increasingly embracing profanity and lewd content. A recent New York Times article explores possible explanations ranging from politics and the culture wars, to the internet and the decline of churches. Also, fewer people are reading books, and that's a challenge for Christian traditions rooted in literacy, education, and the Bible. How do we make disciples in a post-literate culture? Then, more people are comparing our divisive culture to America just before the Civil War. Are we heading toward a national divorce—or worse? Historian Tracy McKenzie is back to share lessons and warnings from 19th century America. Plus, new developments as the turducken turns. 0:00 - Sponsor - Richmont Graduate University - Join a Christian mental health counseling program! Use referral code HOLYPOST at checkout to skip the application fee. Go to https://www.richmont.edu/ 0:37 - Intro 1:56 - Show Starts 3:10 - Theme Song 3:31- Sponsor - Hiya Health - Go to www.hiyahealth.com/HOLYPOST to receive 50% off your first order 4:36 - Stronger Men's Conference Story Continued 14:46 - Raunchy Christians 23:23 - Children and Public Spaces 33:00 - Literacy and Discipleship 35:38 - Hearing vs. Reading the Bible 42:23 - Can Churches be the Antidote for a Lonely, Digital World? 51:13 - Integrating Technology and Scripture 55:17 - Sponsor - World Relief - Visit https://worldrelief.org/holypost/ to download your family refugee guide and learn more about the Path Community 56:03 - Sponsor - Faithful Counseling - Get 10% off your first month at www.betterhelp.com/HOLYPOST 57:03 - Interview 59:03 - Can We Compare Today and 1850? 1:03:21 - How Has Media Affected Current Politics? 1:15:16 - The Role of Conspiracy Theories 1:24:42 - Why Were We More Unified in the Past? 1:35:00 - End Credits Links Mentioned in the News Segment: John Lindell and Mark Driscoll https://julieroys.com/john-lindell-apologizes-for-inviting-driscoll-and-sword-swallower-to-stronger-mens-conference/   Biblical Literacy in a Postliterate Age https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2024/april-web-only/biblical-literacy-in-postliterate-age-reading-video.html   The Raunchy Christians Are Here https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/17/us/evangelicals-christians-conservative-trump.html   Other resources: Holy Post website: https://www.holypost.com/ Holy Post Plus: www.holypost.com/plus Holy Post Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/holypost Holy Post Merch Store: https://www.holypost.com/shop   The Holy Post is supported by our listeners. We may earn affiliate commissions through links listed here. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.  

Steve begins the show by sharing some of his thoughts on North Carolina elections. Next, John Zmirak, a writer for the Stream, provides powerful insight about the war in Ukraine and passive Christians in America. Then, for Idolatry or Not, we discuss a Bill Maher clip about child grooming that has been circling the internet. Finally, Steve shares his thoughts on the Mark Driscoll situation.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

In todays episode we discuss this stupid drama between Mark and John. We are here not to light a fire of discord, but to observe everything from a Biblical perspective and learn from the situation.____________________________Support The Ministry by giving a one-time gift or becoming a partner:CLICK HERE____________________________Download my Free 5 Day DevotionalCLICK HERE____________________________Sign up for your free trial at Theos UniversityCLICK HERE____________________________

If you wondered where all the male strippers went from your local gay bars, they are now shaking their hips at church.At the Christian fundamentalist Stronger Men's Conference in Springfield, MO, controversy broke out when pastor Mark Driscoll called out pastor John Lindell for allowing a male circus acrobat to perform shirtless on a stripper pole feats of Christian strength.The audience was divided over the pastor's comments, with some booing the concerned pastor, while others saying he was out of line and should have discussed the matter with organizers privately.Get off the cross and get up on that pole!Today we take a look at all the hot news and trends that are working the pole for your attention.Designing Women star Delta Burke says she got addicted to meth while on the show.• AI does the impossible: transform a photo of Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg to look sexy.• Japan is now using the sound of crows to scare off crows.• Lesbian Visibility Week Kicks off with airing of classic podcasts featuring lesbian and non binary queer icons.FOLLOW US ON INSTAGRAM: ★ instagram.com/faustofernos★ instagram.com/marcfelion

In a recent episode of Didaché, host Justin Peters delves into the controversial figures and practices within the charismatic movement, focusing on Mark Driscoll's contentious actions at the Stronger Men's Conference. Peters and guest Phil Johnson discuss the implications of Driscoll's behavior, including public rebukes and affirmations that blurred lines of accountability and biblical leadership. The podcast critically examines the charismatic movement's endorsement of questionable leaders and the potential harm this poses to the integrity of Christian witness. Pertinent Links Phil Johnson's review of Driscoll's book on marriage My full review of Driscoll's pornographic visions Christian Leaders article on the controversy by Jesse T. Jackson Ashamed of the Gospel Mars Hill former elders' statement on Driscoll's disqualification for ministry ➡️ Find all of Justin's essential links here: https://linktr.ee/justinpetersmin

Today we're joined by author Jon Acuff to talk about ways we can take hold of negative thoughts, which studies show is a huge issue in this generation. Plus, if you're in the mood for some hot Christians and hot takes, this show HAS them. You'll hear some outspoken faith talk from the distractingly good-looking star of 'Reacher,' plus we get into the very strange Mark Driscoll men's conference dust-up from last weekend. Plus, Jesse gives an extremely in-depth update on the lady with the sign outside of his office, at the end we have your feedback and a lot more. Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Brant and Sherri discuss the latest Mark Driscoll controversy and what it says about masculinity. They also talk about Psalm 73.   Quotes: “Somebody robbed a store with a snake.”   “If you're not given a vision there's complete confusion.”   “Stay humble, my friend.”   “When I entered your sanctuary THEN I understood.”   “I marvel at the human DNA sequence.”

Summary In this conversation, Tim and April discuss the recent events involving Josh Howerton and Mark Driscoll. They talk about Josh's apology and the similarities between his apology and another pastor's apology. They also discuss Mark's controversial remarks at the Stronger Men's Conference and his use of the Jezebel spirit trope. The conversation delves into the problematic nature of these actions and the reactions from the audience and online community. In this conversation, Tim and April discuss the recent controversy surrounding Mark Driscoll and his involvement in the Stronger Men's Conference. They explore the dynamics of the charismatic world and its tendency to look for demons everywhere, as well as the intersection of Christian nationalism and charismatic beliefs. They also highlight the lack of accountability and the documented legacy of abuse associated with Mark Driscoll. The conversation touches on the internalized misogyny within evangelical circles and the problematic views on women's modesty. They conclude by discussing the recent developments involving John Lindell and his call for Mark Driscoll to repent. Takeaways Apologies should be genuine and not copied from others Using the Jezebel spirit trope is sexist and misogynistic Mark Driscoll's actions and remarks are calculated and attention-seeking The reactions from the audience and online community reveal the problematic nature of these actions. The charismatic world is often primed to look for demons everywhere, and this tendency is amplified when combined with Christian nationalist beliefs. Mark Driscoll has a history of abuse and a lack of accountability, yet he continues to gain a following and promote his new book. There is a prevalent issue of internalized misogyny within evangelical circles, with many women defending Mark Driscoll despite his problematic views and treatment of women. John Lindell has called out Mark Driscoll for his actions and has received death threats as a result. The concept of 'modesty' in evangelical circles is often misused and places the burden on women to manage men's thoughts and actions. Chapters 00:00 Introduction and Setting 07:07 Josh Howerton's Apology and Plagiarism 31:26 Mark's Calculated Actions and Reactions 43:04 John Lindell's Call for Mark Driscoll to Repent Check out our website for merch, educational materials, and how to join our community! If you'd like to support our work, you can DONATE here! Follow Us On Instagram @thenewevangelicals  Subscribe On YouTube The New Evangelicals exists to support those who are tired of how evangelical church has been done before and want to see an authentic faith lived out with Jesus at the center. We are committed to building a caring community that emulates the ways of Jesus by reclaiming the evangelical tradition and embracing values that build a better way forward. If you've been marginalized by your faith, you are welcome here. We've built an empathetic and inclusive space that encourages authentic conversations, connections and faith. Whether you consider yourself a Christian, an exvangelical, someone who's questioning your faith, or someone who's left the faith entirely, you are welcome here! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Jon talks about stories of interest for evangelical Christians including reactions to Trump's abortion position from Russell Moore and J.D. Greear, the Acts 29 Network is losing churches, purging the remaining conservatives from the Episcopal Church, compromise at Christian universities, Mark Driscoll's controversy at the Stronger Men's Conference, Phil Johnson's concern over kinists, Bruce Frank running for SBC President, The ERLC's recent lobbying efforts, Ligon Duncan's justification for endorsing Woke Church, and Richard Dawkins calls himself a cultural Christian. #RichardDawkins #RussellMoore #JDGreear #PhilJohnson #LigonDuncan #MarkDriscollTo Support the Podcast: https://www.worldviewconversation.com/support/Become a Patronhttps://www.patreon.com/worldviewconversationFollow Jon on X: https://twitter.com/jonharris1989Follow Jon on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/worldviewconversation/00:00:00 Introduction00:06:18 Richard Dawkins00:16:19 Cultural Changes00:24:25 Greear, Moore, Trueman vs Trump00:31:05 Christian colleges, Acts 29, the Episcopal Church00:42:27 Southern Baptists00:49:41 ERLC00:51:56 Mark Driscoll01:14:18 Phil Johnson01:37:13 Ligon Duncan01:53:12 EndSupport this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/conversations-that-matter8971/donationsAdvertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brandsPrivacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Today we discuss the recent controversy over Mark Driscoll's public rebuke of a stripper's performance during the opening of the Stronger Men's Conference. Magala took off his shirt, ascended a pole, and swallowed a sword at the event, which was organized by James River Church in Missouri. Was Driscoll out of line? Plus, Ben Affleck and Jennifer Garner's daughter recently came out as transgender - we go through some other children of celebrities who have also become LGBTQ+. And recent maulings by Pitbulls beg the question: should the breed be banned? --- Timecodes: (00:30) Mark Driscoll & sword swallowing debacle (23:55) Golden Bachelor breakup (36:45) Ben Affleck and Jennifer Garner's daughter is “trans” (47:15) Pitbulls --- Today's Sponsors: EveryLife — the only premium baby brand that is unapologetically pro-life. EveryLife offers high-performing, supremely soft diapers and wipes that protect and celebrate every precious life. Head to EveryLife.com and use promo code ALLIE10 to get 10% of your first order today! Focus on the Family — the new podcast, "Practice Makes Parent" brings you real, practical, and biblical advice. Tune in every Wednesday on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcasting platform. Find the podcast here: https://podcasts.focusonthefamily.com/show/practice-makes-parent/?refcd=1674101&utm_source=blaze&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=relatable American Christian Credit Union — America's Christian Credit Union is Federally Insured by the National Credit Union Administration. Find America's Christian Credit Union online at AmericasChristianCU.com/SWITCH NetSuite — gain visibility and control of your financials, planning, budgeting, and inventory so you can manage risk, get reliable forecasts, and improve margins. Go to NetSuite.com/ALLIE to get your one-of-a-kind flexible financing program. --- Relevant Episodes: Ep 806 | Justice For Maple: A Story of Pit Bulls & Political Corruption | Guest: Holly Simon https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/relatable-with-allie-beth-stuckey/id1359249098?i=1000613279662 Ep 986 | Steven Furtick Gives a Master Class in Narci-gesis https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-986-my-problem-with-steven-furticks-easter-sermon/id1359249098?i=1000652653436 --- Buy Allie's book, You're Not Enough (& That's Okay): Escaping the Toxic Culture of Self-Love: https://alliebethstuckey.com/book Relatable merchandise – use promo code 'ALLIE10' for a discount: https://shop.blazemedia.com/collections/allie-stuckey Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Atheist Richard Dawkins has said he doesn't believe one word of the Christian faith, but he now considers himself a “cultural Christian” and wants to defend the Christian values of his country against the influence of Islam and immigrants. Does this represent an alignment between the New Atheists and Christian Nationalists? Curtis Chang shares about “The After Party”—the new curriculum he's developed with David French and Russel Moore to help Christians focus on hope and humility rather than partisanship. Also this week, Mark Driscoll gets booted from a men's conference. And another infraction by a Florida man with a Bible.   Holy Post Plus Getting Schooled - Mariah W. Stewart https://www.patreon.com/posts/100430727/   0:00 - Intro   1:02 - Show Starts   3:02 - Theme Song   3:23 - Sponsor - Sundays Dog Food - Get 35% off your first order of Sundays. Go to www.SundaysForDogs.com/HOLYPOST or use code HOLYPOST at checkout.   4:35 - Florida Man Scales Tower with Bible   12:00 - Mark Driscoll Kicked Off Stage After Calling Sword-Swallower a “Jezebel Spirit”   22:35 - Richard Dawkins, the “Cultural Christian”   36:40 - Dusty Deavers, the Country Singin' Senator   46:06 - Pray for the Middle East   50:46 - Sponsor - Blueland - Get 15% off your first order by going to https://www.blueland.com/HOLYPOST   51:54  - Sponsor - Hatch - Form better bedtime habits today with Hatch—$20 off and free shipping when you order the Restore at www.hatch.co/holypost   52:55 - Interview   1:04:34 - The “What” vs the “How”   1:16:26 - Four Quadrant of Political Engagement   1:27:19 - End Credits Links Mentioned in the News Segment: Florida Man Climbs Cell Phone Tower https://www.newsweek.com/florida-miami-man-climbs-cell-phone-tower-disconnects-power-live-video-1886494   Sword-Swallower on a Pole and Mark Driscoll https://www.newsweek.com/pastor-kicked-stage-strip-show-1890247   Richard Dawkins and Cultural Christianity https://christianitytoday.com/ct/2024/april-web-only/new-atheism-destroy-christianity-richard-dawkins.html   Other resources:   The After Party: https://redeemingbabel.org/the-after-party/   Holy Post website: https://www.holypost.com/   Holy Post Plus: www.holypost.com/plus   Holy Post Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/holypost   Holy Post Merch Store: https://www.holypost.com/shop The Holy Post is supported by our listeners. We may earn affiliate commissions through links listed here. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.  

Confusion and anxiety. Narcissistic tendencies. Spiritual abuses. As the host of The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill, CT's director of media Mike Cosper explored how these themes can wreak havoc in a church. Now, he's sharing his own experiences with harm and healing in church life through his latest book, Land of My Sojourn: The Landscape of a Faith Lost and Found. On this episode of The Russell Moore Show, Moore hosts Cosper for a discussion of hurt and hope. They talk about Cosper's work in church ministry, in his book, and while hosting the podcast The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill. Their conversation covers church polity, planting, and pastoring. Moore and Cosper talk about the importance of humility in an era of narcissistic spiritual leaders and discuss the importance of wisdom and suffering in tempering idealism. Cosper and Moore talk about reconciling stories of hospitality and kindness about figures like Mark Driscoll with the damage and trauma they've inflicted on others. They respond to the critique that The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill has made pastoring more difficult and encourage listeners to consider the importance of telling the truth even—perhaps especially—when the truth is hard to accept. Tune in for a discussion that is honest about the harm some churches have caused and hopeful about the church as a place of healing. Resources mentioned in this episode include: The Bulletin Land of My Sojourn: The Landscape of a Faith Lost and Found by Mike Cosper The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill William Carey “Jon Hamm on the Evolution of Don Draper on 'Mad Men'” Acts 29 “Land of My Sojourn” by Rich Mullins Do you have a question for Russell Moore? Send it to questions@russellmoore.com. Special offer for listeners:  Russell Moore will join friends David French and Curtis Chang in Washington, DC, for The After Party LIVE! on April 19. As a faithful listener to the podcast, we'd love for you to join us and use this $20 off offer just for listeners! The After Party is a free six-part video curriculum designed for people and pastors alike, and offers “a better way” for Christians to engage in politics. Learn more and buy tickets here—we've saved a seat for you! Click here for a trial membership at Christianity Today. “The Russell Moore Show” is a production of Christianity Today Executive Producers: Erik Petrik, Russell Moore, and Mike Cosper Host: Russell Moore Producer: Ashley Hales Associate Producers: Abby Perry and McKenzie Hill Director of Operations for CT Media: Matt Stevens Audio engineering by Dan Phelps Video producer: Abby Egan Theme Song: “Dusty Delta Day” by Lennon Hutton Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Chuck Swindoll steps down as senior pastor and announces his new successor, Jonathan Murphy. Wretched Radio | Air Date: April 16, 2024 https://media-wretched.org/Radio/Podcast/WR2024-0416.mp3 Segment 1 Let’s talk about Pastors. Chuck Swindoll is stepping down soon. Segment 2 Mark Driscoll recently preached a men’s conference and called out the conference for having a male pole dancer. […] The post CHUCK SWINDOLL IS 89 AND STILL PREACHING! appeared first on Wretched.

In this episode of Didaché, host Justin Peters delves into the controversy surrounding Mark Driscoll's removal from the Stronger Men's Conference. The discussion begins with an analysis of Driscoll's contentious actions, including his provocative comments during the event, which are claimed to be a publicity stunt. Peters interviews Travis Allen, a pastor who has had direct past interactions with Driscoll, along with Gabe Hughes, to explore further Driscoll's history and the potential motivations behind his behavior. The episode offers a critical look at the implications of such actions on Christian ministry and leadership integrity. Gabe Hughes Church and Youtube channel | Church  Travis Allen's church ➡️ Find all of Justin's essential links here: https://linktr.ee/justinpetersmin

Steve talks about how every crisis America faces in 2023 has its roots in 2020 and poor leadership through COVID. Then, Pastor Mark Driscoll joins the show to discuss the decline of masculinity in America and what to do about it. In Hour Two, actor and conservative activist Siaka Massaquoi retells his harrowing account of being in the crosshairs of the DOJ over his presence in D.C. on January 6, 2021. Finally, Pop Culture Tuesday is a review of the new movie, "The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds & Snakes." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices