The Beached White Male Podcast with Ken Kemp

Send us a textToday, we welcome a conversation with Dr. Christian Smith, one of America's leading sociologists of religion. He studied at Wheaton and Gordon College, earned an M.A. and PhD at Harvard, and serves currently as the William R. Kenan Jr. Professor of Sociology at the University of Notre Dame. You may know him from his groundbreaking research on adolescent spirituality, but in this episode, we dive into the sweeping themes of his current book, Why Religion Went Obsolete: The Demise of Traditional Faith in America, released in April 2025 from Oxford University Press.We examine the profound cultural and generational shifts that have contributed to the decline of religion in America—what Dr. Smith refers to as a slow but steady obsolescence. From the rise of the “nones” and the “spiritual but not religious,” to the scandals, the loss of clergy credibility, and the overwhelming politicization of faith, especially within evangelical circles, we unpack it all. Dr. Smith is data-driven, deeply thoughtful, and committed to honesty—he doesn't just describe the trends; he interprets them with nuance and care.We also talk about the fears that drive some religious communities to build protective bubbles—Christian schools, worldview camps, media silos—and how those moves may be accelerating the very decline they fear. This is a conversation about cultural change, generational transitions, science, sexuality, and what it means to seek moral grounding in a rapidly shifting world.This episode invites us to ask: When has religion truly been good? And can it be good again? As James Baldwin once said, “Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced.” SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textOn this Juneteenth, Ken invites John Williams back to the podcast, this time to talk about the summer series, TRUTH QUEST. John and Ken review the origins of the Civil Rights (C.R.) Tour of the South, and John's journey from his law practice to his first C.R. Tour. His experience became a catalyst for leaving his law practice behind. A vision was born to introduce others to the history of race in America - to educate, inspire and transform. The Center has grown exponentially, influencing not only Fellowship Monrovia but churches, non-profits, and individuals across the nation by means of the tours, workshops, Table Talks, and curriculum development. In this conversation, John reflects on his personal meeting with the late Civil Rights icon and Congressman, John Lewis. John Williams has been in "Good Trouble" ever since, along with Ken. SHOW NOTESMeet our contributors.Listen to the entire series - TRUTH QUEST: Exploring the History of Race in America - in their own words.Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textToday, we've got another edition of The Two Kens with my good friend and fellow podcaster, Ken Fong. This time, we dive into the bizarre breakup between Donald Trump and Elon Musk — a political feud that feels like your parents fighting in public. No one's enjoying it, but everyone's watching. Trump, the undisputed Master of Distraction, still knows how to hijack the media cycle like nobody else. But Musk? He's backing down, but MAGA world is squirming.We'll also take a hard look at an aging Democratic Party, struggling to reach a younger generation. Legends like Bernie Sanders and the young and compelling AOC, efforts are underway to counter-balance the callous, authoritarian strategies of this administration. And then there's David Hogg, now a DNC vice chair, who came out of the Parkland tragedy and has become a bold voice for Gen Z.We'll unpack L.A.'s recent ICE and National Guard deployment, Mayor Karen Bass's leadership, and how Gavin Newsom is responding to Trump's provocations — including that military birthday bash set for June 14.I give a shoutout to my nephew Otto Kemp, who just jumped from the Triple A Iron Pigs to the big show - on the starting roster with the Philadelphia Phillies.Darcy and Dane McKenzie: A Minnesota military family speaks out: No troops to quell protestsSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a text(REPRISE) Ken welcomes professor, fellow podcaster, and author Dr. Brad Onishi back to the podcast to talk about his new book - Preparing for War - The Extremist History of White Christian Nationalism and What Comes Next (release date: January 3, 2023). A long-time friend of the podcast, Brad has been busy after a major event in Denver focussed on Christian Nationalism last month with a large audience both live and virtual. It featured major influencers and thinkers including Robert P. Jones,  Sam Perry, Katherine Steward, Larycia Hawkins, and his podcast partner, Dan Miller. In addition to his regular podcast, Straight White American Jesus,. Brad is releasing a series on The New Apostolic Reformation with Professor Matthew Taylor, Ph.D. It's an expose on a growing movement advancing an extreme dominion version of Christianity. Brad introduces his book which traces what we now know as Christian Trumpism from the 1960s to the present in the context of his own personal journey - beginning with his conversion in high school in Orange County (CA); the great mid-west and Southern migration to California, the John Birch Society, The Crystal Cathedral and Robert Schuller, his own Friends Church (predominantly white) and Friendship Baptist Church (predominantly black), to Dr. James Dobson and his secular eugenicist mentor, Dr. Paul Pompenoe. Onishi fills in the background on two Jericho Marches, featuring Eric Metaxas, Michael Flynn and Alex Jones,  which were a prelude to the January 6 Insurrection. Finally, the two discuss the ways in which American Evangelicalism finds its roots in The Lost Case Narrative of the South. SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textPhilip Yancey's courageous and penetrating new book, his memoir - Where the Light Fell - will be released on October 5. There's a big audience for Philip's story. There are over 100 million claim to have experienced Christian fundamentalism and 25 million more identify as "exvangelicals." Brother Marshall, a musical prodigy, had perfect pitch. Philip's  father contracted polio and died when Philip was only 18 months old. Ken notes that Philip's experience in segregationalist fundamentalism is extreme. Paul Van Gorder, Bob Jones, Jr., Lester Maddox all would come to Philip's church. The Prophecy Conferences were an annual event, providing much to fear. Tony Evans came to the church, and was turned away.  Philip's mother, a well known Bible teacher, struggled to make ends meet but never quite recovered from her husbands passing. The three Yancey's lived in a mobile home, located in an Atlanta area "trailer park." The Lost Cause narrative permeated church life, but high school opened new perspectives for Philip.  He shares bitter-sweet memories of church life. Philip appeared as the Southern preacher Elijah in a high school performance of Inherit the Wind. In Bible College, Philip had a reputation as an intellectual rebel, reading Bertrand Russell and Harvey Cox. Then he met his match, Janet. The parable of the Good Samaritan changed everything. He would later write. What's So Amazing about Grace. George Beverly Shea's song touches Philip.SHOW NOTES Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a text(REPRISE) For a second time, Ken welcomes Rev. Ben Cremer to the podcast for Season 5. Ken starts by thanking Ben for that first interview, "Myths We Believe," which is far and away the most downloaded podcast of Ken's more than 300 episodes (exceeding the former first-place interview with Kristin Kobes Du Mez). Ben is a prolific author, just finishing up the manuscript of his first book. He has a big audience for his newsletter, which is delivered weekly on Sunday mornings. He calls it "Into The Gray." It's a resource of books, podcasts, and then a thoughtful essay of his own around important issues of the day. Ken chose three to discuss on this podcast - first, "A Troubling Conversation" highlighting the commonly held doctrine of Total Depravity. The second contemplates the common default answer when Christians encounter those who hold opposite views. They'll say, "Well, they aren't REAL Christians." The third addresses a spiritual discipline that is widely ignored in the traditions both Ben and Ken grew up in - lament. Ben brings fresh, sometimes provocative thinking to all three issues. Ken predicts that this conversation will be another that breaks records. SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textPLEASE NOTE: EDITING ERRORS HAVE BEEN REPAIRED. This week on Beach Talk with Betsey Newenhuyse, we're reflecting on Memorial Day from Betsey's visit to Ft. Sheridan Cemetery—where memory and meaning converge. We'll share personal thoughts about our dads and how sensational politics and shallow discourse often diminish this solemn day.Betsey brings us a notable message from Pete Buttigieg that cuts through the noise. We dive into the bizarre age obsession—“Biden's old!”—while so many political leaders are aging out. We'll also head down a rabbit trail: Young Earth creationism, QAnon, and my latest Substack post on the Scopes Trial. Anti-science. Anti-expertise. Anti-intellect. The Ark Encounter. The clergy survey. The 1960 film, Inherit the Wind. When faith becomes a box-checking exercise—what's left?I'll touch on Diarmaid MacCulloch's brilliant insights in his history of Christianity and sex. I'll talk about my professor's lecture on the difference between astrology and astronomy—it tells us a lot about Christian Nationalism's current dogma.Finally, we'll confront the attack on universities (hello, Harvard), Jemar Tisby's Roadmap to Ruin, Project 2025, and what it all means for the Church—and for our democracy. Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textI'm pleased to welcome Tracey Gee to the podcast — author, coach, keynote speaker, and the thoughtful spirit behind The Magic of Knowing What You Want. Tracey brings clarity, warmth, and wisdom. You'll love this conversation - it'll help you, too, as it did me.Tracey holds degrees from UCLA in Anthropology and Business, a Master's in Leadership from Fuller Theological Seminary, and certifications in StrengthsFinder, Cultural Intelligence, the Enneagram, and Working Genius. She serves on the coaching faculty for LEAP and works with incredible organizations like Coca-Cola, Amazon, UC Berkeley, and the Miami Heat.We first connected at a leadership conference at the JB Duke Hotel, where Tracey was in her element — speaking, coaching, and gifting her book to every participant.In this episode, we talk about the “desire fog” so many of us feel, and why it can be hard to name what we really want. Tracey shares her own journey — from piano to dance, ministry to coaching — and her four-part framework for rediscovering purpose: Calibration, Expansion, Experimentation, Integration.I open up about my own season of loss and rediscovery — and how desire and purpose are deeply connected.Tune in for a rich, encouraging conversation. SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textToday's episode connects ancient Viking history to today's global headlines. This is my seventh conversation with historian and political commentator Martyn Whittock—this time we dive into his brand-new book, “Vikings in the East: From Vladimir the Great to Vladimir Putin.”Martyn joins us from Bath, UK, where he's been tracking the strange but powerful ways history is being used—and misused—in modern politics. We explore how Viking warriors, Norse myths, and the baptism of Vladimir the Great in 988 C.E. are showing up in Putin's speeches and statues… and even in his justification for war. We'll ask: Is Russia the “true” heir of Western values? What's the story behind that giant Vladimir statue in Moscow? And why does ancient Kyiv play such a central role in today's geopolitical storm?We also turn our lens on the U.S.—trade wars, tariffs, Bitcoin, Christian nationalism, and wild predictions about our political future.Anyone who is thoughtful and just a little bit skeptical about the stories we hear will want to join us for this insightful, instructive exploration of history.    SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textToday, my guest is journalist and author Katherine Stewart. I had a compelling conversation with this highly sought-after writer, and we went deep. Known for The Power Worshippers, she's back with Money, Lies, and God, exposing the dangerous alliance of Christian Nationalism and political power.We dive into her journey from the Child Evangelism Fellowship to attending rallies and conferences of the religious right. Katherine reveals how dark money, misinformation, and groups like Project 2025, the Federalist Society, and the Claremont Institute are reshaping America.We discuss Trump's 2024 win, his first 100 days, and how Christian Nationalism impacts public education, gender issues, race, and democracy itself.Most importantly, Katherine shares how we can resist and respond.This is a conversation that matters — for faith, democracy, and our future.Stewart began her journalism career working for investigative reporter Wayne Barrett at The Village Voice. Since 2011, she has contributed op-eds to The New York Times and written for various publications, including The Guardian, The American Prospect, The Nation, and The Atlantic. Her book was the basis of the documentary film by Rob Reiner, God and Country.SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textJoin me for the latest episode of Beach Talk with Betsey Newenhuyse—we've got a packed show you won't want to miss!Betsey shares a moving story about her brother joining a protest last weekend. He's not usually out there with a sign, but his action got us talking about showing up in different ways—and how that still matters.We dive into big headlines, like 60 Minutes teaming up with lawyers to defend the “spheres” of influence under threat. Harvard and other universities are stepping up too, pushing back in powerful ways.The administration's first 100 days? A mess. We talk about the chaos—from lost Navy jets and Newark's airport debacle to the attack on PBS and the “Anti-Abundance Agenda” of new tariffs.I also hosted my first Table Talk with Jemar Tisby—Roadmap to Ruin—and it sparked some rich discussion.We touch on Pete Buttigieg's MSNBC appearance, the President's meeting with Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney, the shady crypto scandal, and even Garrison Keillor's take on Trump as “Pope.”Plus, we review the film Conclave and dive into the emerging Democratic “shadow primary.”So grab your coffee and listen in—this episode is full of insight, laughs, and some surprises, too.Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textKen welcomes Washington political commentator, speechwriter, and author Peter Wehner. Pete is a contributing writer at The Atlantic and a senior fellow at the Trinity Forum. He is well known for his prolific contribution to the intersection of politics, public policy, and faith. Early on, he identified as a conservative, a Republican, and an Evangelical. From 2011, when Donald Trump campaigned to challenge the legitimacy of the Obama Presidency, suggesting that he was born in Kenya and not the U.S.A., Wehner has called out the danger of a Trump presidency. Pete has been a stalwart in opposing Donald Trump and in the process, he no longer identifies as a Republican or an Evangelical. He remains a traditional conservative. However, he has offered a powerful and sustained critique of evangelical support for Donald Trump and a Republican Party that has become subservient to the newly elected President. Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson played a key role in that transition. Ken and Pete have a lively discussion over his early years as a new Christian, his college career, the influence of his scientist father, his move to Washington, Reagan's speech after the Challenger disaster, George Bush's 9/11 speech (Pete was in the White House that fateful day), and finally Donald Trump's complete take-over of the Republican Party and his return to the White House for a second term. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textSPOILER ALERT: If you have not seen the movie or read the book CONCLAVE, you may not want to listen (until you've seen the film or read the book). The Two Kens take a deep dive into the symbolism and message of this highly acclaimed motion picture starring Ralph Fiennes, Stanley Tucci, Isabella Rossellini, John Lithgow, and more. There's much to discuss, unpack, and explore in this groundbreaking film. It's a film set in the Vatican when a fictional Pope dies, leaving the College of Cardinals to isolate themselves in the Sistine Chapel where they will elect a new Holy Father from among their ranks. BE FOREWARNED: Kemp and Fong reveal the stunning surprise ending and examine its meaning for today.Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textThis week, I sit down with Dr. Phil Allen—a former All-American basketball player turned theologian, poet, and prophetic voice. From the basketball courts of North Carolina A&T to the halls of Fuller Seminary, Phil shares his remarkable journey from hoop dreams to a life dedicated to ministry, ethics, and racial healing.We explore his moving documentary “Open Wounds”, inspired by the tragic story of his grandfather—an untold chapter of racial violence that Phil discovered later in life. The film made its way to Sundance and now serves as a centerpiece for our discussion on generational trauma and redemption.We also dive into his powerful book, "The Prophetic Lens: The Camera and Black Moral Agency From MLK to Darnella Frazier", examining how the lens—literal and metaphorical—shapes our understanding of justice, especially in the wake of George Floyd, Ahmaud Arbery, and others.Topics include:Phil's transformation from athlete to scholar and poetLife at North Carolina A&TThe making of Open WoundsFaith, ethics, race, and cultureThe power of video and voice in modern civil rightsRunning as a spiritual and physical disciplineThis conversation is thoughtful, raw, and full of hope. Tune in to hear how one man's story speaks to a much bigger truth, and calls us to learn, engage, resist, and at the same time, stay healthy.SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textAfter attending a recent event featuring Dr. Jemar Tisby, I had the chance to connect with the host of that gathering, Professor Jessica Wai-Fong Wong, Associate Professor of Systematic Theology at Azusa Pacific University and author of the groundbreaking book Disordered: Holy Icons and Racial Myths.In this episode, we reflect on that event, where Dr. Tisby shared moving stories about his relationship with the late Dr. Bill Pennell of Fuller Theological Seminary—a pioneering voice in racial awareness whose bold challenges to white evangelicalism began in the late '60s and continued for decades.Dr. Wong, herself deeply influenced by Dr. Pennell's legacy, joins me for a conversation that dives into the concept of whiteness as an archetype and its enduring impact on Christian theology and the history of race. Drawing from her own journey as a Chinese American woman raised in predominantly white spaces in Texas, Dr. Wong shares insights from her book, including what it means to "aspire to whiteness" and the painful experience of being cast as an "anti-icon" in a white-dominated religious context.We also explore my own experience within a Korean megachurch in Southern California, examining how whiteness becomes synonymous with order, while everyone else—Black, brown, Asian, Jewish, or female—is often seen as a threat to it.This is more than a theological discussion—it's a deep dive into history, identity, and the present-day political and spiritual moment we're all navigating. SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textJoin us for another Beach Talk!  In the midst of a week of global market turmoil, Betsy and I sit down for a heartfelt and thought-provoking conversation. We kick things off with Betsy's anticipation of a beautiful experience of an Interfaith weekend—celebrating both a Saturday evening Seder and a Palm Sunday procession, complete with palm branches and a donkey.From there, we dive into the dramatic impact of the President's newly implemented global tariff plan and the resulting stock market plunge. We explore what I call a “foolish fiction” behind the crisis and share my experience at the Inland Empire's “Hands Off” protest here in Southern California. My sign read, “Stop the Chainsaw Massacre.” Both DOGE and tariffs are out of control.We also cover Senator Cory Booker's record-breaking 25-hour speech, discuss two revealing new books about President Biden's health, and get an update from Betsy on what Former Secretary of Transportation Pete Buttigieg has been up to.Pull up a chair, grab your coffee, and join us for a conversation that will remind you - you are not alone.Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textJoin me for a compelling conversation with my guest, Dameon Wroe. His story is one of struggle, survival, and ultimately, redemption. Growing up in Southern California, Dameon faced challenges early on. After his parents' divorce, he lived with his sister and, by his teenage years, had already experienced run-ins with the police. He learned his lesson and set out to become a police officer, studying law enforcement in college.Music became his avocation. He performed at the Roxy, and was discovered by The Whispers—an iconic R&B group known for hits like "And the Beat Goes On" and "Rock Steady." He landed a record deal with Capitol Records. It seemed like he was on his way to stardom.But life took a drastic turn. While working as a security officer and preparing to enter law enforcement, Dameon found himself on the wrong side of the justice system. He endured the trauma of wrongful accusations, jury trials, and a million-dollar bail that kept him locked up. Books like Just Mercy by Bryan Stevenson and The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander give us a powerful background for Dameon's journey.Dameon just published his fifth book - a captivating account of his painful journey - The Road to Redemption (July 2024). It's the “non-fictional story of an author's relentless pursuit of justice, and full vindication. After being wrongfully arrested and maliciously prosecuted for murder, Dameon tells the truthful version about what happened on the night of January 1, 2004.”Now, as an author, motivational speaker, mentor, and life coach, Dameon draws on his experience to inspire change. Join us on this episode as we unpack the realities of the justice system, share this story of resilience, and spark conversations that matter. SHOW NOTES Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textIf you had difficulty listening to S6E15: Echoes of Internment: Filmmaker Claudia Katayanagi on History, Justice, and Resistance - the sound has been repaired. Try it again. Don't miss it!Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textJoin me as I sit down with Claudia Katayanagi, an award-winning documentary filmmaker whose work brings hidden histories to light. As a fourth-generation Japanese American, Claudia's personal and professional journey led her to uncover the dark realities of World War II's "Citizen Isolation Centers," a topic explored in her powerful documentary A Bitter Legacy.In our conversation, we dive deep into the intersection of past and present injustices, examining how the forced internment of Japanese Americans echoes in today's mass deportation threats, immigrant detentions, and violations of civil rights. We discuss the Enemy Aliens Act of 1798, used as a justification during WWII and again today by the current administration. Claudia's work, including her latest film, Exile - Community in Conflict, confronts these historical parallels head-on. She shares her firsthand experiences documenting protests at detention centers across the country, from Texas to California, and the urgent need for truth-telling in the face of rising xenophobia.We also discuss the power of art and storytelling as acts of resistance—how the men and women imprisoned during WWII used paintings, poetry, and prayer to sustain their spirits, and how those lessons resonate in today's fights for justice. With history repeating itself in disturbing ways, Claudia's activism through Tsuru for Solidarity reminds us that silence is not an option.This episode will challenge you. It will inform you. And it will push you to take action. Tune in, learn the truth, and—most importantly—use your voice. Protest. Organize. Vote. Because the fight for justice never ends. SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textOn today's Beach Talk, Betsey Newehuyse and I break down the headlines as the President floods the zone with controversy, wielding Executive Orders like a wrecking ball to smash the federal government to pieces. In these gloomy, fear-filled times, we need a break—so we turn to baseball and college hoops. March Madness is here, and my LA Dodgers take on Betsey's Chicago Cubs in Tokyo, where fans are out in full force for their favorite Japanese superstars.  Meanwhile, I've been writing open letters to Senator John Thune, urging him to step up and put the brakes on the President's anti-democratic agenda. And now, Michael Kruse of Politico has taken notice, quoting my letters in his latest profile: "Does John Thune Have a Red Line When It Comes to Trump?"But the headlines only get darker—the administration is rounding up immigrants, with ICE Director Tom Homan invoking the 1798 Alien Enemies Act to detain so-called “Venezuelan Terrorists” without due process. They've been shipped off to El Salvadorian prisons—unnamed, unidentified, uncharged. And then there's what I'm calling "The Chainsaw Massacre", a brutal purge of funding and jobs, engineered by Elon Musk himself. We dive into the real, personal stories behind these losses.Join us for all this and more on Beach Talk—because the news never stops, and neither do we.SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textEver heard the word patrimonialism? Neither had we—until we read Jonathan Rauch's eye-opening article in The Atlantic: "One Word Describes Trump." In this episode of The Two Kens, Ken Fong and I dive into what this term really means and why it's the key to understanding the new administration. Patrimonialism, a concept from sociologist Max Weber, describes rulers who claim to be the symbolic “father” of the people—personifying and controlling the state. Sound familiar? We break down the administration's first 60 days including mass firings, legal overreach, and dismantling of key government services; renaming the Gulf of Mexico and Mount Denali (yes, really); trade wars, territorial ambitions including Canada, Greenland, the Panama Canal, and the chaos strategy at play. We also talk about my letters to Senate Majority Leader John Thune—picked up by Politico and The New Yorker—urging him to take a stand. Plus, we tackle the Democratic Party's challenge in fighting back against this Republican power grab. Join us for this timely and critical conversation.  SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textI'm excited to welcome back my friend and political activist, Darcy McKenzie. Over the years, as our friendship has grown, we've witnessed and reflected on some major milestone moments in history. Darcy lives near the very street corner where George Floyd lost his life, and her advocacy began on local school boards before expanding into key roles supporting both local and national Democratic candidates. She's a key player in the DFL (Democratic Farmer-Labor) Party, working to advance affirmative action, outreach, and inclusion at every level of government.In this episode, we dive into the political landscape, discussing Vice Presidential candidate Tim Walz and the Kamala Harris campaign. Darcy has campaigned for an impressive range of candidates, including Muslim Attorney General Keith Ellison, Representative Ilhan Omar, Jewish Secretary of State Steve Simon, and LGBTQ Representative Angie Craig. She's also been a strong advocate for women leaders, supporting Senators Amy Klobuchar and Tina Smith, as well as Representatives Betty McCollum and Kelly Morrison. And while she champions diversity, she's also backed candidates like Governor Tim Walz, a "straight white guy," and now she's fully supporting Lt. Governor Peggy Flanagan, a Native American leader, in her run for the U.S. Senate.Together, Darcy and I unpack the weaponization of DEI and CRT, and we share where we find hope and encouragement even in today's political climate. Let's get into it.SHOW NOTESSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textIn this timely and special episode of The Beached White Male Podcast, host Ken Kemp welcomes back his trusted friend and guest, Betsey Newenhuyse, for a deep dive into the emotional and spiritual challenges of our current political climate. As the nation grapples with division and uncertainty, Ken and Betsey explore how faith, friendship, and personal reflection can serve as vital coping mechanisms.Their conversation is framed by two compelling pieces of writing: an essay by the celebrated storyteller Garrison Keillor and Katherine Stewart's powerful new book, Money, Lies, and God: Inside the Movement to Destroy American Democracy. Keillor's reflections on friendship, place, worship, and prayer provide a sense of comfort and nostalgia—reminding us of the grounding forces in our lives that help us weather difficult times. Meanwhile, Stewart's investigative work exposes the dangerous political forces seeking to manipulate faith for power, offering a sobering counterpoint to the more personal and spiritual aspects of the discussion.Ken and Betsey reflect on the tension between these two perspectives—the solace found in spiritual traditions versus the urgent need to confront political realities that threaten democratic values. Through honest conversation, they explore how people of conscience can stay engaged without losing hope, how faith communities can be both a refuge and a call to action, and how, even in the midst of turmoil, we can still proclaim, “It is well with my soul.”The Three Tenors perform “It Is Well With My Soul” in Bath, EnglandBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textKen welcomes pastor, historian, and special advisor to the President at Baylor University, Dr. Malcolm Foley. Just this month, his new book - The Anti-Greed Gospel: Why the Love of Money Is the Root of Racism and How the Church Can Create a New Way Forward - has just been released. Dr. Foley shares something of his faith and spiritual journey. As an undergraduate at Washington University in St. Louis, he majored in Finance and the Classics. After earning an M. Div. at Yale Divinity School, he completed his Ph.D. at Baylor. His dissertation focussed on the history of lynching in America, and the responses of African American Protestants to the horror of it all. Ken and Malcolm unpack the thesis of his new book: that racism is rooted in greed. They talk about his concept of racialized capitalism, the dominance of white supremacy, the witness of the “Church Fathers” and the biblical passages that deal with greed and wealth. In the 1987 movie Wall Street, Gordon Gekko (played by Michael Douglas) declares, “Greed is good!” Dr. Foley disagrees. He takes a deep dive into the reality of lynching and the use of violence and terror to subjugate black folks. It's a hard look at history. They talk about Malcolm's heroes in the movement: Martin Luther King, Malcolm X (for whom he was named), and Ida B. Wells among many others. Toward the end of their lively conversation, Ken asks Dr. Foley about the current weaponization of phrases like DEI, Woke, and CRT which do not appear in the book. Don't miss Malcolm's response. SHOW NOTES (see links to the book and more about Dr. Foley)Support the showBecome a Patron - Click on the link to learn how you can become a Patron of the show. Thank you! Ken's Substack Page The Podcast Official Site: TheBeachedWhiteMale.com

Send us a textIn this episode, we get a close-up look at immigration - from the immigrant's perspective. Ken welcomes veteran actor, Stelio Savante who plays a key role in the new independent film, “Between Borders.” In his nearly forty years as an actor, Stelio is a SAG award nominee with over 140 credits in television, and theatrical releases. In the popular series, The Chosen, Stelio plays the role of Moses. Ken and Stelio talk about his career in film. They follow his journey of faith, starting in his country of birth - South Africa. From Capetown, Stelio goes to college in the United States where he excels in sports - and in theater.Then they get into the powerful drama of the film, Between Borders. Stelio plays the role of an American Missionary who meets Armenian refugee Ivan and Petrosyan family in Russia. Here's a summary from the official web site - “In a crumbling Soviet Union, the Petrosyan family finds themselves as outcasts—wherever they go. Their Armenian heritage marks them for discrimination, first in their home country of Azerbaijan and then in Russia. After finding their eternal hope through a church planted by American missionaries, the hostility of everyday life pushes them to seek refuge in the United States. In the shadow of exile, hope became their home. Based on a riveting true story of faith and hope set amidst great oppression.”The role of Violeta Petrosyan is played by Elizabeth Tish (who plays Mary in The Chosen). Ken and Stelio unpack the power of the story and Stelio's identification, himself an immigrant and now a citizen. Stelio also tells the story of his role as Moses in The Chosen, and Demas (one of the thieves crucified with Jesus) in The Two Thieves.SHOW NOTES - See links to Stelio's work.Between Borders Official Site - How to see the filmBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken welcomes Osahon for another Cabana Talk and a review of the Super Bowl Half-Time Show. They invite their good friend Grant Young, a Play Station engineer they met in a Table Talk hosted by Ken and Osahon in 2021. As the Philadelphia Eagles met the Kansas City Chiefs for Super Bowl VIX, the epic half-time performance featured rapper Kendrick Lamar, Pulitzer Prize winner with 17 Grammys (47 nominations), twice named among TIME MAGAZINE's Most Influential Person of the Year, Rock and Roll Hall of Famer and many other awards. Osahon and Grant have been long-time fans - and with enthusiasm watched the show together with great interest. From personal experience, both Osahon and Grant (a graduate of California Baptist University with both Bachelor's and Master's degrees) know white evangelical spaces well and lament much of the misplaced controversy around the famed Hip-Hop artist. They explain the very public, long-time tension between Lamar and Drake; the appearance of Samuel L. Jackson and Serena Williams; and the elegant symbolism on full display throughout the show. Ken, Osahon, and Grant agree with the USA TODAY Opinion that “The Super Bowl was a rejection of Trump's Vision for America.” It was the first time in history that a sitting President appeared in person at the Super Bowl. He sat through the tepid reception (as many boos as cheers), the conspicuous absence of camera focus on him, the black national anthem, the many black artists who performed, the powerful half-time show, and the sound defeat of his favored Kansas City Chiefs. His later Truth Social posts confirmed that he was not pleased. This podcast is a lively, informative discussion of an event viewed by 128 million people around the globe. See SHOW NOTES for referenced articles. Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Kemp and Fong agree. We need each other now more than ever. Steve Bannon predicted the strategy of this new administration. He declared, “We're gunna flood the zone with sh*t.” He was prophetic. The Zone has experienced a flash flood. The two Kens thought the new President's intent would be to drain the swamp - but the flash flood of Executive Orders, the defunding, the closures, the pardons have all had the intended effect. None of us, not the politicians, not the media, not the pundits - none of us can keep up. The two podcasters review several articles that have been illuminating. One tells the story of Hungary: Viktor Orbán's takeover of their vibrant democracy, turning it into an authoritarian state. The Atlantic published a thorough review of the history of Hitler's first 53 days - in which he dismantled Germany's democracy by using the Constitution to accomplish that goal. And then, V.P. J.D. Vance emerges as an amateur theologian, justifying the neglect of the marginalized by coming up with a “God-ordained hierarchy” that in essence, gets us off the hook for caring for our neighbors. It's a collaboration of the Two Kens to stay on the alert, speak the truth, and maintain our vigilance. SHOW NOTESSOURCES:VOX - Their democracy died.They have lessons for America about Trump's power grab. Hungarians who lived through Viktor Orbán's 2010 power grab warn Americans: Act now, before it's too late by Zach Beachamp February 5, 2025ATLANTIC - HOW HITLER DISMANTLED A DEMOCRACY IN 53 DAYS He used the Constitution to shatter the Constitution. By Timothy W. Ryback, JANUARY 08, 2025JD Vance accidentally directed us to a crucial moral question: Just ignore the godawful reading of Christianity he used to get there. VOX by Sigal Samuel, February 6, 2025Become a Patron | Ken's Substack Page | Affirmative Action - Lessons from the SuperBowlNUMBER 401Support the show

Ken and Betsey review over five years of Beach Talks as Ken posts the podcast's 400th episode. Three friends check in to celebrate -  Darcy McKenzie, Osahon Obazuaye, and Ken Fong. Betsey, a Chicago resident, shares some of her experience this month spending three delightful weeks in Tuscon - the Arizona Desert. Ken and Betsey then compare notes on the new administration's first two weeks in power. It's been a firehose of headlines, including those controversial cabinet appointments, an avalanche of executive orders, bizarre explanations (for Southern California fires and then those terrible plane crashes), targeted attacks on D.E.I., inflationary tariffs, trade wars, and plans to absorb Canada, Mexico, Panama, Greenland, and now Gaza under America's domain. Elon Musk takes the axe to congressionally mandated programs. Oh - don't forget - it's now “The Gulf of America” and “Mt. McKinley.” Predictions of the imposition of the feared Project 2025 (which the then-candidate for President claimed he knew nothing about) turn out to be way understated. Turns out, it was a detailed script for these first two weeks. The President and his supporters said they would “drain the swamp,” but it looks more like Steve Bannon's colorful prediction - that on Day One, Trump would “flood the zone with sh*t.” Ken and Betsey commit to keep this podcast and their Beach Talks going - we need each other now more than ever.Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

When Ken researched his Bible School classmate, Melvin Warren, he stumbled across Dr. Curtis' book. It referenced a familiar, legendary press conference. In 1970, at the famed Arch entrance at the Moody Bible Institute in Chicago, Melvin made a speech as the cameras rolled and journalists scribbled notes. He claimed that the school's racism so marred his experience as a student that he tore up his diploma and tossed it into the trash. He made national news. That incident not only drove Ken into a years-long quest to understand the dynamic of racism in his white evangelical church but it also played significantly into the doctoral dissertation of another Moody grad, Dr. Jesse Curtis. Dr. Curtis is now an assistant professor at Valparaiso University. Ken and Jesse compare notes on that momentous event. It prompted Ken's Beached White Male journey. It also contributed to Dr. Curtis' doctoral focus - now a book considered a “must-read” by both Jemar Tisby and Kristin Kobes du Mez. Ken and Jese discuss The Myth of Colorblind Christians: Evangelicals and White Supremacy in the Civil Rights Era. Dr. Curtis covers the history of racism in the white evangelical church going back to the Billy Graham era when Howard Jones became the first African American evangelist on “The Team.” Jesse believes that the Church Growth Movement founded by Donald McGavran contributed to the segregation that was a feature in the explosive growth the church at the turn of the century - including “ethnic” congregations and mega-churches. McGavran's protege, C. Peter Wagner, added fuel that dynamic. In their wide-ranging discussion, they talk about evangelical super-stars like Rick Warren and Bill Hybels as well as champions like Bill Pannel, Tom Skinner and John Perkins. Curtis argues that the notion of “colorblind Christians” is a myth. While he wrote some five years ago, the case is as relevant as ever. Just this week, in his inaugural address, the 47th President stated, “We will forge a society that is colorblind…” His supporters stood in enthusiastic applause. Ken and Jesse agree: this is not progress. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageEpisode Number 399    Support the show

Ken welcomes Washington political commentator, speechwriter, and author Peter Wehner. Pete is a contributing writer at The Atlantic and a senior fellow at the Trinity Forum. He is well known for his prolific contribution to the intersection of politics, public policy, and faith. Early on, he identified as a conservative, a Republican, and an Evangelical. From 2011, when Donald Trump campaigned to challenge the legitimacy of the Obama Presidency, suggesting that he was born in Kenya and not the U.S.A., Wehner has called out the danger of a Trump presidency. Pete has been a stalwart in opposing Donald Trump and in the process, he no longer identifies as a Republican or an Evangelical. He remains a traditional conservative. However, he has offered a powerful and sustained critique of evangelical support for Donald Trump and a Republican Party that has become subservient to the newly elected President. Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson played a key role in that transition. Ken and Pete have a lively discussion over his early years as a new Christian, his college career, the influence of his scientist father, his move to Washington, Reagan's speech after the Challenger disaster, George Bush's 9/11 speech (Pete was in the White House that fateful day), and finally Donald Trump's complete take-over of the Republican Party and his return to the White House for a second term. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageEpisode #398Support the show

When Ken Fong saw the flames coming over the ridge from his front yard, he voluntarily evacuated along with his adult daughter. His home church, First Baptist of Pasadena, opened its doors to evacuees. Fong joined them for two nights. Ken Kemp, dealing with power outs, high winds, and menacing fire danger, called on Ken for a conversation around this catastrophic fire season - especially for Pacific Palisades and Altadena. Fong's wedding, scheduled for this weekend, meant that a late-night departure from his home included a tuxedo and patent leather shoes. At the church, Ken shares the dramatic collection of painful stories he encountered the two nights he slept in the church. In addition, the two Kens talk about the passing of President Jimmy Carter and his powerful legacy.Ken's Substack | Become a PatronSupport the show

In memory of President Jimmie Carter, Ken has invited three quests to share their personal reflections on a 100 year long life well lived: historian, professor and prolific author, Dr. Randall Balmer; retired Biola University political science professor, Dr. Dave Peters; and his Beach Talk friend, Betsey Newenhuyse (See Part I). Here In Part Two, Dr. Balmer continues to share his thoughts from his recent article (Published in the L.A. Times, Religious News Service (RNS) and others) entitled, Jimmy Carter rid the presidency of lies. His fellow evangelicals? Not so much. Then, Dr. Dave Peters, a retired professor of Political Science at Biola University, shares his personal meeting with his inspiration, Jimmy Carter first at the Carter Center and also in Plaines, Georgia. Carter was a political model for Peters, a Democrat, who served on the City Council of LaMirada and was elected Mayor of that city for six terms.SHOW NOTESSpecial Guests in Part I: Randall Balmer, Ph.D. and Betsey NewenhuyseRedeemer: The Life of Jimmy Carter (Second Edition) by Randall Balmer, Ph.D.Ken's Substack: Jimmy Carter R.I.P. | Become a PatronSupport the show

Special Guests in Part I: Randall Balmer, Ph.D. and Betsey NewenhuyseIn memory of President Jimmie Carter, Ken invites three quests to share their personal reflections on a 100 year long life well lived: historian, professor and prolific author, Dr. Randall Balmer; retired Biola University political science professor, Dr. Dave Peters; and his Beach Talk friend, Betsey Newenhuyse. In Part One, Dr. Balmer shares his thoughts from his recent article (Published in the L.A. Times, Religious News Service (RNS) and others) entitled, Jimmy Carter rid the presidency of lies. His fellow evangelicals? Not so much. He explains how evangelical enthusiasm for the peanut farmer's victory soured over this four year - and then the powerful legacy he leaves, especially for his exemplary service in his post-presidency years. Betsey shares her life in the 70s as Nixon resigned and Carter beat Gerald Ford in 1976. SHOW NOTESPart II: With Dr. Balmer and Dr. Peters to be released January 9, 2025 Redeemer: The Life of Jimmy Carter (Second Edition) by Randall Balmer, Ph.D.Ken's Substack: Jimmy Carter R.I.P. | Become a PatronSupport the show

Ken welcomes Nate Manderson back as we close out our year and Season 5. Nate's rich experience as a pastor, an educator, and an advocate for the working class has made him a popular writer for The Boston Globe and Salon.com. His most recent piece is entitled, How the left can get its mojo back: Listen to working-class people of faith. It's a rich analysis of where the Democrats got it wrong in the Presidential election. Ken and Nate review the election and fill it in with Nate's considerable experience in Boston schools from elementary to high school to community college. He connects with the labor force and the Latino community and helps us understand how Donald Trump managed to win a high degree of unlikely support. Ken and Nate get ready for the challenges of a new year. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken and Betsey usually discuss politics. Today, they set aside the political turmoil in the headlines and discuss Christmas. Ken's most recent Substack reflects on the central scene that is the focus of the celebration of Christmas by Christians all around the world - the Nativity. Joseph. Mary. The baby Jesus. It's a wide-ranging conversation around literalism, fundamentalism, and a contemplation of what is real and true. From Charles Dickens to Karen Armstrong, they share their childhood experiences, Ken's performance of White Christmas in a posh restaurant with a couple of carolers in Victorian dress, and neighborhood displays of inflatable Santas, Snowmen, Grinches, Mickey and Minnie, and of course, Nativity scenes. Ken's Substack: The Nativity | Become a Patron Support the show

Ken shares his reflections on the opening of the restored Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris after the devastating fire of April 2019.You can follow along on his Substack Page here.Become a PatronSupport the show

Ken and Betsey reflect on the Late Great Planet Earth, the monster 197o best-seller by Hal Lindsey, who passed away on November 25th. The cottage industry of apocalyptic books and movies spawned by Lindsey's book live with us to this day. While they acknowledge the need to move on from the distress and anxiety of election day, they invite their listeners into a continued conversation of some of the main headlines. President Biden issued a complete pardon for his son, Biden. The week's political conversation focussed on the president-elect's Cabinet pick for Department of Defense, the controversial Pete Hegseth. Hegseth's extreme political views are rooted in his church's doctrine. Pilgrim Hill Reformed Fellowship is a member of the Communion of Reformed Evangelical Churches founded by the self-described “theologian,” Douglas Wilson of Moscow, Idaho. Health insurance companies are under scrutiny in the aftermath of the horrific, cold-blooded murder of United Health Care's CEO, Brian Thompson. The two agree it's time to gaze at the lights all around and be reminded of the delights and wonder of the Season.Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken welcomes back professor, author, and activist Dr. David Dark to discuss his new book, We Become What We Normalize. David shares the recent tragedy on Belmont University's campus in the shooting of the popular freshman, accomplished musician Jillian Ludwig . He tells us about the impact of this horrible incident on his students. The entire nation took note - raising the issue of gun control. David asks a provocative question: "Am I responsible for the lies that other people voice in my presence unchallenged?" When we are silent, we normalize. The conversation picks up Part I - discussing David's assertion that all of us -because we are human - are "religious." There exists good and bad/toxic and healthy religion. We must apply critical thinking to discern. Dr. Dark agrees with Christopher Hitchens that there is a form of religion that "poisons everything." To illustrate, they consider a diverse collection of individuals including Colin Kaepernick, Howard Thurman, Rush Limbaugh, and Donald Trump. In conclusion, David shares his long-time work in the Tennessee prison system - regrettably, a for-profit enterprise.David Dark Part ISHOW NOTES | Become a PatronSupport the showSupport the show

SPOILER ALERT: If you have not seen the movie or read the book CONCLAVE, you may not want to listen (until you've seen the film or read the book). The Two Kens take a deep dive into the symbolism and message of this highly acclaimed motion picture starring Ralph Fiennes, Stanley Tucci, Isabella Rossellini, John Lithgow, and more. There's much to discuss, unpack, and explore in this groundbreaking film. It's a film set in the Vatican when a fictional Pope dies, leaving the College of Cardinals to isolate themselves in the Sistine Chapel where they will elect a new Holy Father from among their ranks. BE FOREWARNED: Kemp and Fong reveal the stunning surprise ending and examine its meaning for today.Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken shares his latest Substack entry: Factions - Tribal Warfare Has A Long History. It's inspired by the Apostle Paul and Robert Harris' novel, Conclave (now a highly acclaimed feature film). As we gather, let's embrace the gifts that surround us, even in troubled times.Ken's SubstackSupport the show

As we somehow adjust to the presidential election results, we bid farewell to an evangelical leader who stood for integrity over conformity. As Ken and Betsey connect again and share their disappointment over the election results, they begin with a lengthy reflection on the life of a powerful communicator, an inspirational influencer, a compelling professor/theologian, and an entertaining orator - Tony Campolo. We don't know if he was alert enough in those final days to have grasped the MAGA victory on November 5th, but he would certainly have shared our despondency. In this post-election Beach Talk, Ken asks Betsey to share her reactions as the election results became clear. They go on to react to some of the nominations in the headlines: Matt Gaetz, RFK Jr., Steven Miller, Elon Musk, Pete Hegseth, Mehmet Oz, and others. The fears of a Trump victory we all noted are being realized. Ken and Betsey lament the now-documented reality that a majority of those who voted chose this path. They conclude by sharing the need to find a place for gratitude as Thanksgiving Day approaches.   Become a Patron | Ken's Substack Page | Ken's Recent Post: Writer's Block Support the show

Ken welcomes back to the podcast the originator of the hashtag that launched a movement: #exvangelical, Blake Chastain. They discuss his new book, Exvangelical and Beyond: How American Christianity Went Radical and the Movement Fighting Back. An undergraduate at an evangelical university in Central Indiana, Blake had questions - about the Bible, the exclusive truth claims, the identification with conservative politics, the indifference to Earth care, to race, to social justice, and finally, the full-on embrace of MAGA Trumpism. It was a crisis of faith. When his hashtag went viral, CBS called him for a life-changing interview. Blake started The Exvangelical Podcast. In a wide-ranging conversation, Ken and Blake explore the history of evangelicalism and the contributing factors that have led to the evangelicalism we know today. SHOW NOTESPurchase Blake's Book on AmazonBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack Page | Writer's BlockSupport the show

Ken joins Ken Fong for a morning after the election review. It's not so much an autopsy on what went wrong as it is a reflection of their visceral response to the news that the 45th President won a decisive victory. He will become the 47th President of the United States. More than half the nation is celebrating this week - but celebrating what? The other less than half is deeply disappointed, fearful, depressed, and stunned. Once again, pollsters missed it. As a former senator put it, “Fear sells. Anger sells. Retribution and revenge sell. Us versus Them sells.” But an appeal to “the better angels of our nature”? Not so much. The two Kens call on several sources for insight and perspective, including Frank Schaeffer, Nadia Bolz Weber, and Robert Reich. Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken welcomes back essayist, teacher, guidance counselor, and ordained minister Nathaniel Manderson from his home in Boston. Last Summer, Nate took thirty days to walk the 500 mile Camino do Santiago pilgrimage tradition says was taken by St. James, the Apostle. It's the same journey memorialized by the Emilio Estevez film starring his father, Martin Sheen called The Way. Nate shares his remarkable journey - the prompting to go, the people he met, lessons along the way, and the intensely emotional climax that final day as he entered the Cathedral de Santiago de Compostela (consecrated in 1211 C.E.) Just a few days before their conversation, Nate's most recent opinion piece was published in the Boston Globe entitled Democrats: Let Me (Re)Introduce You to the Working Class. Even with his advanced academic degrees, he considers himself a member of that working class. Nate is a contributor to the popular news site SALON. His author page makes the introduction: Nathaniel Manderson was educated at a conservative seminary, trained as a minister, ordained through the American Baptist Churches USA and guided by liberal ideals. Throughout his career he has been a pastor, a career counselor, an academic adviser, a high school English teacher and an advocate for first-generation and low-income students, along with a paper delivery man, a construction worker, a FedEx package handler and whatever else he could do to take care of his family.SHOW NOTES | Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the showSupport the show

Ken welcomes writer, teacher, preacher and justice advocate, Jim Wallis. Rev. Wallis' new book, The False White Gospel: Rejecting Christian Nationalism, Reclaiming True Faith, and Refounding Democracy is getting high marks and a wide reading. It's a timely and prophetic challenge in an era of polarization and worse, the advancement in America of what Jim calls an heretical version of The Gospel. Wallis calls this a “Bonhoeffer moment.” Silence is not an option. Ken and Jim reminisce over their days together at Trinity Evangelical Divinity School where they both earned a Master of Divinity degree. The famed Carl F. H. Henry influenced them both. In 1973, Henry and Wallis framed The Chicago Declaration along with other prominent evangelical signatories, a document that rings true to this very day. Jim has authored more than a dozen books. He is founder and served as chief editor of Sojourner's Magazine. Today, he holds the prestigious Chair in Faith and Justice at Georgetown University in Washington DC named for his friend Bishop Desmund Tutu. In a wide-ranging conversation, they talk about Wallis' journey since those seminary days, putting him in the center of the Civil Rights movement, appearing over the years as a regular on CNN, MSNBC, The Today Show, and many other major outlets as a Social Action alternative to the infamous Religious Right. Ken asks Jim why he still considers himself an “evangelical.” Jim shares inside stories about his many friends - Ron Sider, Ron Dellums, Howard Thurman, John Lewis, Barack Obama, Jamie Raskin and many more. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Ken welcomes historian, author, and media commentator Martyn Whittock from his home across the Pond just outside London. Martyn read Ken's Substack series on Biblical Authority and reached out with some comments. It prompted this lively conversation - and led to another focus: Martyn's article recently published in the UK - How US Evangelicals Could Affect the Entire World. Whittock, a licensed minister in the Church of England, is a self-described “Evangelical.” For years, he has been a student of American Evangelicalism. He gives us a fascinating insight into the differences between our two countries: in America - the preponderance of MAGA Evangelicals, and in Britain - a very different sort of evangelical. Martyn expresses his deep concern over the prospect of a second term for the 45th President not only for the USA. He believes a second Trump Presidency will have an egregious adverse effect on Europe and the entire world. He explains this in considerable detail. Then, Ken asks Martyn about two recent appearances on British television as a history specialist. In the first, Martyn comments on the recent terror attack in Moscow that killed over one hundred in a large theater. In the second, he is asked about the Princess of Wales and the conspiracy theories that surrounded her hospital stay and absence from public life. You can see those clips by clicking on the links. SHOW NOTESMartyn Whittock on British TV: CBN LIVE on The Princess of Wales | Talk TV with Trisha Goddard on the Moscow Terror Attack (11-22 minutes into the program)Become a Patron of the BWM Podcast | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

For a second time, Ken welcomes Rev. Ben Cremer to the podcast for Season 5. Ken starts by thanking Ben for that first interview, "Myths We Believe," which is far and away the most downloaded podcast of Ken's more than 300 episodes (exceeding the former first-place interview with Kristin Kobes Du Mez). Ben is a prolific author, just finishing up the manuscript of his first book. He has a big audience for his newsletter, which is delivered weekly on Sunday mornings. He calls it "Into The Gray." It's a resource of books, podcasts, and then a thoughtful essay of his own around important issues of the day. Ken chose three to discuss on this podcast - first, "A Troubling Conversation" highlighting the commonly held doctrine of Total Depravity. The second contemplates the common default answer when Christians encounter those who hold opposite views. They'll say, "Well, they aren't REAL Christians." The third addresses a spiritual discipline that is widely ignored in the traditions both Ben and Ken grew up in - lament. Ben brings fresh, sometimes provocative thinking to all three issues. Ken predicts that this conversation will be another that breaks records. SHOW NOTESSign up for Ben's Newsletter INTO THE GRAY | Become a PatronKen's Substact Page | Philip Yancey's Blog Site - Hole in the WallSupport the show

In this election year, immigration has become a major political issue. Some would like you to believe immigration is tantamount to a veritable “invasion” of undesirables or worse. However, since the 1980s, a little-known faith-based movement has taken a very different view. Humanitarian organizations, legal advocates, and religious groups have collaborated to provide advocacy, shelter, and assimilation. Thanks to generous grants and support from the Henry Luce Foundation, the Institute for Religion, Media, and Civic Engagement and the American Academy of Religion, Executive Producer Brad Onshi presents a seven-episode podcast that tells the story of “The Sanctuary Movement.” Scholars Lloyd Barba, Ph.D. (Professor, Amherst College) and Sergio Gonzales, Ph.D. (Professor, Marquette University) bring their research to the program with a focus on asylum seekers from Central America. The Sanctuary Movement has been active for hundreds of years - around the world. But it began in earnest in this country in 1982 with a wave of immigrants from war-torn El Salvador and Guatemala. It's a story of faith as radical hospitality and the tension over “the borders between church and state.” Ken and Dr. Barba talk about the podcast series and how the current political climate distorts and harms both immigrants and Americans. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

The two Ken's reconvene at about 23 days out. The predictions seem to be coming true. The conspiracies, the threats, the misinformation, the falsehoods, and name-calling all proliferate. Kemp and Fong remain stymied that the race could possibly be this close. From the outset, the Two Kens make movie recommendations: Kemp - Bad Faith and Fong - Conclave. It opens up a conversation about Catholicism, J.D. Vance's conversion and the legacy of Vatican II. As the election closes in, there are hopeful signs. Malcolm Gladwell and Michael Moore weigh in. Kamala Harris's energy and focus remain strong - she seems undeterred by the vicious, fabricated attacks. She appears fearlessly in a wide range of interviews across the media spectrum. With the former president's and his running mate's fallacious charges of theft, mismanagement, and “incompetence,” they frustrate recovery efforts prompted by the twin hurricane tragedies - Helene and Milton. The former president's claim of superior genes and the suggestion that undocumented immigrants carry “bad genes” comes right out of the blatantly racist pseudoscience of eugenics.  They finish with some suggestions on how to survive until election day - and better, to do all we can to secure this critical victory.    SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Just this year, Neelam Warren-Pal graduated from DePauw University with a Bachelor of Arts degree in Communications. Her late grandfather, Melvin Warren, was Ken's classmate in the late 1960s.When Ken left Southern California after graduating high school in 1966, he traveled to Chicago where he became a student at the Moody Bible Institute. Among his freshman dorm mates was Melvin Warren. They had long talks into the night. In retrospect, it was a clash of cultures. Four years later, Melvin called a press conference and announced that the Bible school was a white, hopelessly racist institution. Rather than receive an education, it caused him much harm. See JET MAGAZINE article from 1970.All these years, Ken lived with the suspicion that his response to Melvin's life story on the South Side of Chicago had contributed to his profound disappointment. Several years ago, Ken attempted to locate him - only to find that Melvin had died - too soon. Ken wrote a letter to Melvin and read it on a Beached White Male podcast episode - posted April 17, 2020. Several months later from her college dorm, Neelam, Melvin's granddaughter, decided on her own to search Google for the grandfather she had never met. Ken's podcast came up. Neelam listened as this stranger from California read a letter to her grandfather. He reflected on their days in Bible school more than fifty years before. Neelam shared her discovery with her Mom, Karen, Melvin's daughter. Since then Ken, Karen and Neelam have become friends. In this episode, you will hear Neelam's version of this heartwarming story. A graduate of DePauw University, Neelam hopes to be a podcaster. Her plan is to interview popular hip-hop artists. Ken and Neelam talk about her favorites: Doechii, Noname, and Megan Thee Stallion. SHOW NOTESBecome a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

The Republican Vice-President candidate had two objectives: 1) to appear the “nice guy” (as opposed to the extreme MAGA champion) and 2) to make the former President's campaign sound reasonable (which it isn't). It seemed to work until the second half. New to the national stage, Tim Walz had a rough start. Prepped by Pete Buttigieg, he appeared nervous and over-prepared. Ken compares the governor's opener to showing up for a tough exam after an all-night cramming session. But as Walz got comfortable, he scored big points, pushing Vance to display his authentic MAGA self. Ken and Betsey review the high and low moments of the debate. They reflect on the journeys of the two candidates that brought them to the national spotlight. Then they turn to other subjects: the passing of the incomparable actor Maggie Smith and  a major Chicago Tribune article exposing Wheaton College's connection to both Project 2025 and Evangelicals for Harris.Become a Patron | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show