Podcasts about american evangelicalism

Charisma is a word we hear all the time, but what does it really mean? Why are some leaders able to draw people in, while others push us away? I've been fascinated by this for years, wondering why we're drawn to certain people, what makes us follow, and how charisma shapes our lives in ways we don't always notice. In a culture where stories and leaders are constantly competing for our attention, understanding charisma feels more urgent than ever. That's why I'm excited to talk with Molly Worthen. Molly is a historian and journalist whose new book, Spellbound, digs deep into the history of charisma in America. She traces how charisma has played out from the era of the Puritans and prophets, through conquerors, agitators, and experts, all the way to today's age of gurus and influencers. Each era reveals something about what we long for—and what we risk—when we put our trust in charismatic leaders. In this episode, we explore what charisma actually is, how it both unites and divides, and how these waves of charismatic movements have shaped our culture and our faith. We'll talk about the stories that draw us in, the identities we build, and how to stay grounded as followers of Jesus when everything around us feels like it's shifting. If you're trying to figure out who to trust, how to stay rooted, or just want to make sense of all the noise, this conversation is for you.Molly Worthen is a professor of history at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and a freelance journalist. She teaches courses on North American religion and politics, global Christianity, and the history of ideas. She writes on these themes for The New York Times and has contributed to The New Yorker, Slate, The American Prospect, Foreign Policy, and other publications. She has also created video and audio courses on the history of Christianity and the history of charismatic leadership for the Great Courses and Audible. Her previous books are Apostles of Reason: The Crisis of Authority in American Evangelicalism and The Man on Whom Nothing Was Lost: The Grand Strategy of Charles Hill.Molly's Book:SpellboundMolly's Recommendations:The SparrowChildren of GodSubscribe to Our Substack: Shifting CultureConnect with Joshua: jjohnson@allnations.usGo to www.shiftingculturepodcast.com to interact and donate. Every donation helps to produce more podcasts for you to enjoy.Follow on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Threads, Bluesky or YouTubeConsider Giving to the podcast and to the ministry that my wife and I do around the world. Just click on the support the show link below Support the show

Josh Daws, host of  @GreatAwokening , joins me to speak about the intellectual and ideological decline of American Evangelicalism, and how he's trying to wake it up to first principles.https://x.com/JoshDawshttps://www.youtube.com/@GreatAwokeningSupport this channel:https://www.paypal.me/benjaminboycehttps://cash.app/$benjaminaboycehttps://www.buymeacoffee.com/benjaminaboyce

Title: Church Leaders: Priority #1 Text: Acts 20:7-12 FCF: We often struggle listening and obeying church leadership. Prop: Because obedient church leaders give their highest priority to the spiritual growth of the church, we must consider it our highest priority by listening to and obeying our leaders' spiritual instruction. Scripture Intro: [Slide 1] Turn in your bible to Acts chapter 20. In a moment we'll read from the Legacy Standard Bible starting in verse 7. You can follow along in the pew bible or in whatever version you prefer. Some have noted that last week's message was somewhat surprising. In reading what amounts to essentially an itinerary, perhaps you too did not think that there would be much to learn from such a text. Nevertheless, we see Paul's consistent desire to exhort, encourage, and teach the scriptures to believers all around the Aegean Sea. In what is quickly becoming Luke's emphasis, we will notice yet again the character of Paul in this text this morning. I dare say that as many were surprised by last week's message hidden in a seemingly empty 6 verses, many will be equally surprised by this week's message. Because many a believer has no doubt entered this text and been led to believe that Luke's primary point is the miracle of raising a young boy back to life. However… would it shock you to hear that the death and resurrection of this young boy is actually just an interruption in what is the main point of this passage? Don't believe me? Let's look. Please stand with me to give honor to and to focus on the reading of the Word of God. Invocation: Most loving and gracious Father. You have sent Your Son to purchase us from the domain of darkness. You have sent Your Spirit to dwell in us and make us new. And to guide us in Your ways you have raised up for us godly church leaders whose primary objective is to do all that is in their power to ensure our spiritual success. Father, I pray that you might send your Spirit among us today to reveal to us the blessing of Your Dear Son's Undershepherds and their purpose which has been ordained by Christ Himself. May Your people grow in their attentiveness, submission, and love for spiritual instruction. We pray this in Jesus' name, Amen. Transition: Let us get right to the text this morning… there is much to cover. I.) Obedient church leaders give their highest priority to the spiritual growth of the church, so we must be attentive and submissive to spiritual instruction. (7-9) a. [Slide 2] 7 - And on the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, i. From some of the earliest writings we have of church fathers that are not the writings of the apostles, we understand that the early church met together on the first day of the week to worship God together. ii. They called it the Lord's Day. iii. On the first day of the week in creation God created the heavens and the earth. His Spirit moved upon the formless waters and brought order out of chaos. He created light and separated the light from the darkness. On the first day of the week our Savior rose from the dead and brought spiritual light to His people separating them from spiritual darkness forever, bringing them the dawn of new creation. iv. While there are many Christians who believe that the Lord's Day is the equivalent of the Christian Sabbath, there is actually very good reasons to conclude that this is, in fact, not the case. v. At some point in the near future, I plan to do a deeper dive into this matter. The title of that study will be, “Should we celebrate a Christian Sabbath on Sunday?” We'll discuss the arguments posited by both sides and see if we can't find an answer together. vi. Until then, it is important to understand that the church at this time both obyed the Sabbath on Saturday, if they were Jewish, and also gathered together on Sunday as the church, Jew or Gentile. vii. Luke points out here that gathering together to celebrate the Lord's Supper, sharing a fuller meal together, worshipping God and hearing preaching of the Word on Sunday – was all normal and common practice in the church since its beginning. b. [Slide 3] Paul began speaking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight. i. Luke and Paul spent a week in Philippi celebrating the feast of unleavened bread, they traveled for 5 days to Troas and then stayed in Troas 7 days. ii. This is the seventh day of their stay in the city of Troas and Paul and Luke intend to leave the next day. iii. Paul is trying to make it to Jerusalem for Pentecost. Pentecost is on the 50th day after Passover. So, if we are tracking, we are about 14 days into that 50. iv. Given what could happen during travel, Paul and his companions are eager to press on – but not so much so that they abandon believers seeking discipleship. v. We see Paul staying up to midnight preaching a message of exhortation from the word of God to the brothers and sisters there in Troas. vi. Although church services would no doubt be held after sunset to accommodate lower class workers, it is certainly not a normal thing for services to have gone on this long. We can infer that from Luke telling us that Paul prolonged his message until midnight. vii. Paul wishes to leave them with as much teaching as possible. viii. The word for speaking here is often used of dialectic teaching where there are questions and answers. It would have been structured and ordered – but there would have been opportunities for discussion as well. ix. Because of this we can reasonably assume that the vast majority of the believers here at Troas were interacting with Paul and Paul was not droning on and on to a group of people who were bord out of their skulls. x. Inferring these details from what Luke has told us, helps us to see this narrative episode for what it is because so often people see it for what it isn't. xi. More on that as we go forward. c. [Slide 4] 8 - Now there were many lamps in the upper room where we were gathered together. i. I literally laughed out loud after the fourth or fifth time reading this passage through. ii. It suddenly occurred to me the potential comedy associated with this little verse. iii. Luke seems to imply that everything upstairs was well lit with many lamps. It wasn't dark. Paul was preaching, so it wasn't quiet. iv. In other words, Eutychus didn't have a lot of great excuses to fall asleep. v. Now as I turned to commentators and scholars to confirm that this is what Luke is saying, I was shocked to see how many different opinions there are on the significance of this little verse. 1. Some, but very few, saw it the way I did where these lights were meant to exonerate Paul and the church in Eutychus' falling asleep. a. There were actually punishments associated with young people falling asleep in the synagogue at that time. b. You could actually be expelled from the Synagogue for 30 days if you were a youth that fell asleep during the teaching of the Word of God. c. Therefore, Luke may be hinting that Eutychus has some of this blame as Paul and the church did not make it easy to fall asleep since it was loud and well-lit. 2. Some conclude that Luke is implying that the upper room was very warm with so many lit lamps. a. Thus, it was very conducive for sleep… in other words the opposite reading of what I saw. b. But, if it were too warm, wouldn't Eutychus have stood a better chance at staying awake at the window? 3. Other commentators, knowing that they were no doubt oil lamps, suggest that the oxygen in the room would have been in low supply. a. Again, indicating that it was conducive to sleep. b. But Eutychus being at the window has the best chance of breathing easy. 4. Still others suggest that this comment of many lamps is intended to suggest that the room was quite full of people, who have brought their torches with them. a. The strength of this interpretation seems to be in keeping with Luke's emphasis. b. Luke is emphasizing Paul and his conduct as a good church leader and with many people there and only 1 falling asleep, again Eutychus is to blame for falling asleep. 5. And even others suggest that the many lights indicate that the Christians were not hiding or meeting in secret. a. Again, a valid interpretation. b. However, if this is Luke's point, it seems to be well hidden since there is no indication of persecution by the authorities in the city of Troas. vi. When we come down to it, we must understand verse 8 in the context of the whole. The miracle, as we will see, and Eutychus' part in all this, is very… VERY small. vii. Luke is telling this story to further authenticate Paul as a servant of God like previous servants you may have seen in the scriptures including both Peter and even Jesus Himself. viii. Therefore, I conclude that this comment about the lights has to be related to exonerating Paul from any blame associated with this accident. d. [Slide 5] 9 - And there was a young man named Eutychus sitting on the windowsill, sinking into a deep sleep. i. Nevertheless, despite there being many lamps and despite Paul speaking with power and authority, and despite all these folks gathered and discussing the scriptures together, this young man named Eutychus, was sinking into a deep sleep. ii. Now to be fair, it is midnight. Assuming he woke that day at sunrise, and assuming that he spent all day working as a slave boy, which the word “boy” in verse 12 could also be interpreted to mean, and assuming the evening had been full of celebration with the church, feasting, many songs, and long sermons… we can see why Eutychus might have been a little sleepy. iii. And perhaps he sought the window because it WAS getting stuffy in the house and Eutychus sought the cool breeze off the Aegean to keep himself awake? We can assume noble intentions. iv. In any case, Eutychus fights a losing battle with his weak humanity. v. He does not take enough necessary steps to stay awake. e. [Slide 6] And as Paul kept on talking, he sunk into that sleep and fell down from the third floor and was picked up dead. i. Paul continues to preach because the message is not finished. ii. We even get the impression that most of the church gathered there in the upper room were attentively listening and even participating in discussion. iii. Indeed, Paul seems to be the one making a great sacrifice here. Despite having to leave in the morning, he continues to preach. iv. Nevertheless, Eutychus succumbed to his human need for sleep and fell out of the third story window. v. The expression, picked up dead, is an idiom suggesting that he was dead when he hit the ground. Most likely a broken neck. vi. There is absolutely no reason to believe anything different in this text other than that Eutychus was dead. Not unconscious or appearing dead. Luke is a physician remember. He would certainly be able, with relative precision, to determine if the boy was merely unconscious or dead. vii. Luke says he is dead. f. [Slide 7] Summary of the Point: Since, as we've said, Luke's emphasis seems to be less on Eutychus and the miracle and more on Paul and his excellence as a spokesperson of God in a long line of prophets all the way back to the Old Testament, it is important to see that the message of this text is primarily rooted in a truth about obedient and godly church leadership. Paul is not an Elder of a church, although he is certainly qualified to be one. He is a missionary and an apostle. A Preacher, an Evangelist. His role encompasses various roles we still have even now in the church. Meaning Paul is able to provide an example for us for all church leaders. And we see very clearly in this text, the priority that Paul puts on the spiritual growth of the church. Even though he must leave the very next day, he meets, into the late hours of the night, with these believers in Troas, ministering to them and growing them in spiritual instruction. He lingers with them, at the expense of himself. We see prophets, priests, kings, other apostles, and even Jesus Himself doing similar things. Paul then is a model for us of what Godly and obedient church leaders value most. What they prioritize most in their ministries. And it is, quite simply, the spiritual growth of the church. So, what ought to be the response of the church to such a church leader? We ought to listen attentively and submissively to our spiritual leadership. Yes, Eutychus provides for us a negative example. Even though we can excuse him for being tired – the bottom line is that to a certain degree, he allowed himself to fall asleep. Much like Jesus rebuked his disciples for sleeping while he prayed in Gethsemane, so also, we must see Eutychus' example as a rebuke to us, and recognize that we cannot passively grow in spiritual maturity. We cannot grow closer to Christ by osmosis. Instead, we must actively listen and obey instruction from the Word of God. Transition: [Slide 8(blank)] Well, we already know what happens to Eutychus. In fact, the story is so well known that there isn't a lot of suspense here on what will happen next. But after Eutychus is raised… it might be a shock to you what happens then. Let's get into it. II.) Obedient church leaders give their highest priority to the spiritual growth of the church, so we must also greatly appreciate spiritual instruction. a. [Slide 9] 10 - But Paul went down and fell upon him, and after embracing him, he said, “Do not be troubled, for his life is in him.” i. Paul, pauses his sermon for the immediate physical need of the young boy Eutychus. ii. He goes down to the street and falls upon the boy. iii. In a scene which is reminiscent of Elijah and Elisha laying upon someone in order to raise them from the dead, Paul embraces the young man and pulls him close. iv. Luke does not tell us that Paul prayed for him. He does not tell us that Paul commanded him to live again. v. Given the fact that he was dead when he hit the ground, one thing we can be sure – it was the power of God, not Paul, that raised Eutychus from the dead. vi. When Paul recognizes that life has returned to him, he assures everyone that there is no reason to be worried or troubled. The boy is alive. vii. So, what now? The boy is raised? Probably time to dismiss everyone and go home right? b. [Slide 10] 11 - And when he had gone back up and had broken the bread and eaten, he talked with them a long while until daybreak, and then left. i. In what could certainly be seen as rather unkind or lacking compassion, Paul returns inside and fellowships and speaks with the church until daybreak. ii. Some may suggest that after such a terrible tragedy being averted only by a miracle from God, perhaps that was a good time to call it a night and return home. iii. Instead, Paul continues to fellowship with the church and even speak further with them concerning the things of the Lord. iv. Probably Luke intends The Lord's Supper here when he mentions breaking bread. v. He stays until the sun rises. vi. This is a true expression of Paul's priorities. vii. Certainly, he did not ignore the physical world, as if it did not matter or was evil – like the Gnostics would later conclude. viii. Instead, he had compassion on the boy who had died, but when he was alive again, he returned to spiritual matters and matters of fellowship with the body of Christ – for these were of utmost priority to Paul before he left them for Jerusalem. ix. Perhaps because he assumed he would never return. c. [Slide 11] 12 - And they took away the boy alive, and were not a little comforted. i. And just in case there was any doubt as to the boy's condition as the night went on – he went away alive with his family. ii. He did not swoon back as if he hung on the balance between life and death. iii. Instead, he was dead, and was now alive. iv. His family left the church assembly after daybreak greatly comforted because he was as he came. Alive and well. d. [Slide 12] Summary of the Point: Luke again emphasizes the priority that church leadership must give to spiritual growth. Just because something is the highest priority doesn't mean other things aren't important. Paul was obviously not done instructing the congregation in Troas. But he interrupted all that he was saying to go and minister to the young man. However, once he was raised back to life, Paul went right back to breaking bread and teaching the believers again. No doubt even using the vivid death to life illustration to teach on Christ through the Lord's Supper and further explain the nature of Christianity to them. It is very clear that Paul's top priority, even in the midst of someone dying during one of his sermons, was to ensure the spiritual growth of God's children. What do we see as the response? Paul's continued ministry of the Word is met by people who have reordered their life to appreciate the instruction. Even the newly raised Eutychus stays until Paul is finished. If the church leadership is prioritizing spiritual growth, that should also be the priority of the church as well. Conclusion: So, CBC, what have we learned today and how then shall we live? Doctrinal Takeaway: [Slide 13] Every episode in the book of Acts exposes the work of God to spread the gospel and the kingdom of Christ to the uttermost parts of the earth through His apostles. And in this particular context, we see the priority of those God is using to do this. The priority of church leaders, even missionaries like Paul, is to focus on the spiritual growth of the church. Paul needs to leave on Monday, but the Christians of Troas need his instruction. So, Paul stays up with them until daybreak to instruct them in the Word. Even when he is interrupted by a young man falling from a window and dying, Paul, by the power of the Holy Spirit, raises the young man back to life and then continues ministering to the spiritual growth of the believers in Troas… including the young man who had just been raised. This is a pattern for us describing what every obedient and godly church leader ought to prioritize above everything else. Namely, the spiritual growth of the children of God to be mature and Christlike people. In this little story we see two responses to the priority Paul places on spiritual growth. The first is a negative example of Eutychus. He did not remain attentive or submissive to the spiritual instruction of Paul. Second, we see that after he was raised, Eutychus stayed, proving that his priorities had reoriented around the importance of spiritual instruction. So we too much put spiritual instruction as our primary objective by attentively listening and obeying it. But let me apply this more directly to us today. Let me give you some rather toe crunching applications this morning. 1.) [Slide 14] Mind Transformation: “What truth must we believe from this text?” or “What might we not naturally believe that we must believe because of what this text has said?” We must affirm that church leaders are required by God to focus on the spiritual growth of those in their charge. a. Though a miracle occurs in this text, it is very obviously an interruption in what is the priority for Paul. b. Paul sacrificially gives of himself to teach and preach to hungry believers in Troas. He has to depart the very next day, but stays up with them until midnight discussing the things of the Lord. c. They are interrupted by this tragedy, but the moment it is resolved, Paul goes right back to preaching and fellowshipping with the church there. d. The heart of Paul shows a clear priority on the spiritual instruction and growth of God's people. e. If we go back, we see this same heart found in the prophets and godly kings of Israel. We see this same heart in Jesus as he corrects Martha for working while spiritual instruction was occurring. f. No matter what your preconceived ideas of what a Pastor or Elder should be… you must come to grips with the reality that our primary role… the one for which we will stand before God to be judged… is whether or not we focused on the spiritual instruction and growth of God's people. g. Knowing this, it may require you to discard some expectations you may have of your Elders. h. Our culture expects pastors to be all kinds of things that would cause us to sacrifice spiritual instruction as our primary objective. i. Many were raised expecting their pastor to make house visits, hospital visits, go do to door evangelizing, conduct weddings, perform funerals, call on everyone in the church just to check in with them, come to people's houses and mow their lawns, fix their plumbing, and a whole host of other expectations that could require an Elder to sacrifice the one priority that the Lord has placed on his shoulders. j. Now, can an Elder do these things? Should an Elder do these things? Certainly. k. But not at the expense of our primary objective. l. It has been almost a decade, so I feel as though I can speak of it plainly without seeming like I am airing dirty laundry. m. But before I became the pastor here, I was an associate pastor of another church for about 6 years. n. About a year before I was fired, the lead pastor met with me and told me that he did not think that I was called to be a pastor. He explained that I did not seem to have a heart of compassion for others as a pastor should and suggested I become a professor at a seminary since I spent most of my time preparing to teach the scriptures. o. My friends, this pastor was deceived. He was duped to believe that compassion for others, specifically in acts of kindness, should be the primary focus of a pastor. p. And he believed it so much that he was convinced that something was wrong with me for prioritizing teaching God's people His Word. q. I bear no ill will toward him, because the Lord's hand of providence clearly led me to this church, and in June I'll have been your pastor for 9 years. r. But one of the things I have appreciated the most about you as a church family, is that you have allowed me to put your spiritual instruction as my highest priority. s. I must confess that I often feel a longing in my heart to call each of you to check in. I feel a longing in my heart to visit you when you are ill. And when the Lord allows, I do enjoy visiting or calling you and by the end of our conversations I always feel a desire to make it a more frequent occurrence. t. But among the other Elders or the congregation, I have never felt an expectation to do anything other than devoting most of my time to deep study and diligent instruction of the Word of God. u. And for this – I say, thank you. v. And also, let's keep it that way for all the Elders. w. God's primary objective for every spiritual leader, is to see to the spiritual instruction and growth of those to whom He has entrusted to us. x. But, of course, we can pendulum swing too far, can't we? 2.) [Slide 15] Refutation: “What lies must we cast down” or “What do we naturally believe, or have been taught to believe, that this passage shows is false?” We must deny that church leaders should only focus on the spiritual growth of the church. a. We notice in this text that in the middle of a long discussion about spiritual things, Paul is interrupted by such a petty little thing as the death of one of the church members.

April Ajoy is a content creator and podcast host who uses humor to shine a light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. After growing up an evangelist's kid entrenched in Christian Nationalism and working in conservative Christian media, she saw the harm caused firsthand. Still a Christian, she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive faith. April has been featured on Buzzfeed, CNN, Newsweek and more. She's been married to Beecher for 10 years and they have two daughters together.Enjoy this illuminating and hope-giving conversation with April Ajoy! Recorded in November 2024.Want some extra energetic support during this season of life? Head over to joyplay.org/booking to work with Jena.

For this week's episode, we're joined by April Ajoy, the author of Star-Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism and Finding a True Faith. She is also a content creator and podcast host who uses humor to shine light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. After growing up an evangelist's kid entrenched in Christian Nationalism and working in conservative Christian media, she saw the harm caused firsthand. Still a Christian, she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive faith. April has been featured on Buzzfeed, CNN, Newsweek and more. She's been married to Beecher for 10 years and they have two daughters together.Connect with April:* Instagram* TikTok*Purchase her book: Star-Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism and Finding A True FaithConnect with USS: United SHE Stands InstagramThis episode was edited by Kevin Tanner. Learn more about him and his services here:* Website: https://www.kevwyxin.com/* Instagram: @kevwyxin Get full access to United SHE Stands at www.unitedshestands.com/subscribe

Text us your questions!This is a re-release of an episode from our first season: our first conversation with Kristin Kobes Du Mez, which happened to fall just after January 6, 2021. It seems fitting to revisit it now.=====In this episode, we chat with Kristin Kobes Du Mez about her book that's been making waves and is brilliantly titled Jesus and John Wayne: How White Evangelicals Corrupted a Faith and Fractured a Nation.  This book is probably our favorite of 2020 and is a must-read. During the course of this interview, we chat about everything from toxic masculinity and power hungry religious leaders to Amy Grant and Tiffany. Seriously.Content note: this episode contains some mild profanity.=====Want to support us?The best way is to subscribe to our Patreon. Annual memberships are available for a 10% discount.If you'd rather make a one-time donation, you can contribute through our PayPal. Other important info: Rate & review us on Apple & Spotify Follow us on social media at @PPWBPodcast Watch & comment on YouTube Email us at pastorandphilosopher@gmail.com Cheers!

For years, the Perspectives Course has been a go-to training option for Christians eager to learn about cross-cultural missions. Thousands have been blessed by the insight delivered through the course and its training text, Perspectives on the World Christian Movement. Pastors, missions committees, future missionaries and even regular Christians hoping to learn more about God's heart for the peoples have benefitted. And while much of Perspectives is wonderful, you should be cautious about certain teachings embedded in the course. So warns Josh Manley, a pastor serving in the United Arab Emirates. Josh joins the Christian Emergency Podcast to highlight his concerns, particularly with Perspective's favorable treatment of Church Planting Movements. Church Planting Movements, or CPM, sound amazing. But as Josh points out, CPM is a specific methodology that, when looked at closely, may have problems. Is CPM more biblical or pragmatic? What do Christians taking the Perspectives Course need to consider? Listen in and learn as Josh unpacks this important issue, which has already made a profound impact on missions and the Church. If you find this material helpful, please share it with your friends and leave us a five-star rating wherever you listen to your podcasts. Also, don't forget to subscribe to the show, so you'll never miss out when new episodes drop. To learn more about resources mentioned in this episode, see the following. Josh Manley (Twitter): @JoshPManley Revival and Revivalism: The Making and Marring of American Evangelicalism, by Iain H. Murray (Book): https://banneroftruth.org/us/store/history-biography/revival-and-revivalism/ Radius International: https://www.radiusinternational.org/ Capital Hill Baptist Church – Misions Training Course: https://www.capitolhillbaptist.org/resources/core-seminars/series/missions/ International Mission Board (IMB) – Missions Training Courses: https://imb.pathwright.com/library/ Christian Emergency Alliance: https://www.christianemergency.com/ Follow the Christian Emergency Alliance on Twitter: @ChristianEmerg1 Follow the Christian Emergency Alliance on Facebook: @ChristianEmergency The Christian Emergency Podcast is a production of the Christian Emergency Alliance. Soli Deo Gloria

We're excited to welcome April Ajoy back to our show. April is an influencer, content-creator, podcaster, and all-around troublemaker for the Christian right. She grew up in the heart of American Evangelicalism as an Evangelist's kid and she is insightful and astute at illuminating the ways Christian Nationalism has infiltrated churches and political arenas, shaping not only modern Evangelical culture but also American public policy and international relations. Her new book is called “Star Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism & Finding a True Faith.”LinksApril's first appearance on our showApril on InstagramApril's book Want more? Check out our exclusive Patreon episodes here.Join the conversation and connect with other listeners here.All our links are here. Transcript of this episode is here.Doubting your beliefs? Have questions about changing or leaving your faith? You are not alone and Recovering from Religion is here to help.

When is controversy justified? When is it not? How ought it to be conducted? When ought it to be refused? These are questions of particular importance for Christians in an argumentative and distracted age, such as ours. The three selections we read this week go some way towards helping us answer them.   Featured Content: – Excerpt from 'The Benefits and Dangers of Controversy' in Evangelical Holiness and Other Addresses, by Iain H. Murray (Edinburgh: Banner of Truth, 2013), pages 119–130. – Selection from a sermon by Dan Peters given at the 2024 Banner Borders Conference, 'Blessed are the Peacemakers, Part II'. – 'William Cunningham–Humble Controversialist', David Campbell, Banner of Truth Magazine, Issue 690, March 2021.   About the Contributors: Iain H. Murray is one of the founders of the Banner of Truth Trust. His books published with Banner include Jonathan Edwards: A New Biography (1987), Revival and Revivalism: The Making and Marring of American Evangelicalism 1750–1858 (1994), and Amy Carmichael: Beauty for Ashes (2015). Dan Peters is minister at Newcastle Reformed Evangelical Church and is the author of Distinct Communion: The Believer's Relations with Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (Christian Focus Publications, 2024). David Campbell is minister at North Preston Evangelical Church, a trustee of the Banner of Truth Trust, and author of Sanctification: Transformed Life (Banner Mini-Guides).   Buy Iain H. Murray, Evangelical Holiness and Other Addresses (Paperback, 2011): https://banneroftruth.org/store/christian-living/evangelical-holiness/   Explore the work of the Banner of Truth: www.banneroftruth.org Subscribe to the Magazine (print/digital/both): www.banneroftruth.org/magazine Leave us a voice message: www.speakpipe.com/magazinepodcast

I presume many of you, like me, are feeling a deep swirl of emotions coming out of a week where we have witnessed the re-election of Trump. Honestly it feels so baffling to me that someone can so blatantly be a convicted felon, a misogynist, an authoritarian, completely void of compassion and empathy for vulnerable people…and with all this and so much more on full display and public record… still be worshipped and adored and actively chosen by a majority of voters. And one of the most disturbing realities is how many white Evangelical Christians unashamedly throw their support and indeed their votes behind this man. There's a strong argument to be made that Evangelical support for Trump in 2016 has been one of the major catalysts for people deconstructing faith and leaving the institutional church. The #exvangelical movement can largely be traced back to that election.White Evangelicals aren't solely responsible for Trump — and why he had such a clear majority of support in this election is beyond my ability or this podcast's ability to answer. And yet, this disturbing confluence of politics and religion and the questions it raises has obviously been very real and personal for many of us. And so this week I actually wanted to replay an earlier podcast conversation from a couple years back now, with David Gushee (that I think remains very relevant).   David has been one of the voices that has helped me understand the history that led to what American Evangelicalism is today. He has also been a strong advocate for defending democracy — and my second of two interviews with him was discussing his book ‘Defending Democracy from its Christian Enemies'. You may want to go back and listen to that though I understand if the wound feels too fresh right now (though of course the need to defend democracy only increases after this election result). But I actually wanted to revisit my first conversation with David, in which we mainly spoke about his book ‘After Evangelicalism' which asks where do you go when you've seen the ugliest manifestations of Evangelical Christianity and want none of that…but you still want a faith that makes sense and approaches the world in ethical, compassionate, just ways? David speaks so well about this.I'm reminded this week — as I often am — that the most important choice is not between theism or atheism. Between religious or non-religious. Christian or not Christian. The choice is what kind of Christian will I be? What kind of human will I be? What kind of neighbour will I be? Evil arrives under the guise of many labels. So too does love. And when we fail to see love through the most powerful leaders in this world — we might want to throw our hands up in despair. Yet, I think it only becomes more essential that we choose the alternate reality — the truer reality — of self-giving love lived out in our lives and neighbourhoods Want to reach out and let us know your thoughts or suggestions for the show? Send us a message here; we'd love to hear from you.The Spiritual Misfits Survival Guide (FREE): https://www.spiritualmisfits.com.au/survivalguideSign up to our mailing list:https://spiritualmisfits.com.au/Join our online Facebook community: https://www.facebook.com/groups/spiritualmisfitspodcastSupport the pod:https://spiritualmisfits.com.au/support-us/View all episodes at: https://spiritualmisfits.buzzsprout.com

Ken welcomes historian, author, and media commentator Martyn Whittock from his home across the Pond just outside London. Martyn read Ken's Substack series on Biblical Authority and reached out with some comments. It prompted this lively conversation - and led to another focus: Martyn's article recently published in the UK - How US Evangelicals Could Affect the Entire World. Whittock, a licensed minister in the Church of England, is a self-described “Evangelical.” For years, he has been a student of American Evangelicalism. He gives us a fascinating insight into the differences between our two countries: in America - the preponderance of MAGA Evangelicals, and in Britain - a very different sort of evangelical. Martyn expresses his deep concern over the prospect of a second term for the 45th President not only for the USA. He believes a second Trump Presidency will have an egregious adverse effect on Europe and the entire world. He explains this in considerable detail. Then, Ken asks Martyn about two recent appearances on British television as a history specialist. In the first, Martyn comments on the recent terror attack in Moscow that killed over one hundred in a large theater. In the second, he is asked about the Princess of Wales and the conspiracy theories that surrounded her hospital stay and absence from public life. You can see those clips by clicking on the links. SHOW NOTESMartyn Whittock on British TV: CBN LIVE on The Princess of Wales | Talk TV with Trisha Goddard on the Moscow Terror Attack (11-22 minutes into the program)Become a Patron of the BWM Podcast | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Send me a text! I'd love to know what you're thinking!Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss the immense pressures faced by pastors today, as articulated by Tim Alberta. Tim highlighted how congregants increasingly expect pastors to function beyond their traditional roles, turning them into part-time pundits and cultural commentators on a myriad of contentious issues ranging from masking and vaccines to abortion and trans rights. Markus and Tod examine the challenges this poses, especially during heightened political seasons, and explore strategies for pastors to manage these pressures healthily, emphasizing the importance of honesty, mission focus, and relational support.Tod Bolsinger and Markus Watson discuss this quote from Tim Alberta in Ep 234, Political Power and American Evangelicalism:"What I kept coming back to was this immense pressure on pastors to be more than a pastor. In other words, their congregants in so many cases are looking to them in this moment saying, 'Okay. So, what about masking? What about the vaccine?  What about the trans issue?  What about abortion? What about, I mean, about everything.'...  They start to view their pastor as sort of a part-time pastor, but also a kind of part-time pundit, a part-time cultural commentator, part-time prognosticator of world events."THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Pastors face immense pressure to address a wide range of social and political issues.Congregants often expect pastors to act as experts beyond their theological training.Effective leadership includes honestly admitting when answers are unclear.Addressing political tensions in congregations requires a commitment to the mission of following Jesus.Building strong relationships and seeking support helps pastors navigate crises and maintain integrity.Did you know Spiritual Life and Leadership has been named the #1 Spiritual Leadership Podcast by the Feedspot Podcasters Database? Check it out HERE!

Patreon supporters who give $5 a month will get an ad-free version of the show! Join our private Facebook group and Discord server! April Ajoy is a hilarious content creator and podcast host who shines a light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. She grew up as an evangelist's kid steeped in Christian Nationalism, and she worked in conservative Christian media. That's where she saw the harm of those ideologies firsthand. She's still a Christian today, but she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive vision of the faith. Her new book is called "Star-Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism and Finding A True Faith." Affiliate link here: https://amzn.to/4dxNEYI April on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@aprilajoy April on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprilajoy SPONSOR: Sign up at butcherbox.com/friendly and use code friendly to choose your Free for a Year offer, plus get $20 off your first order! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Patreon supporters who give $5 a month will get an ad-free version of the show!Join our private Facebook group and Discord server!April Ajoy is a hilarious content creator and podcast host who shines a light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. She grew up as an evangelist's kid steeped in Christian Nationalism, and she worked in conservative Christian media. That's where she saw the harm of those ideologies firsthand. She's still a Christian today, but she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive vision of the faith.Her new book is called "Star-Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism and Finding A True Faith."Affiliate link here: https://amzn.to/4dxNEYIApril on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@aprilajoyApril on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprilajoySPONSOR: Sign up at butcherbox.com/friendly and use code friendly to choose your Free for a Year offer, plus get $20 off your first order! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Darren Dochuk's book Anointed With Oil: How Christianity and Crude Made Modern America has been out a couple of years. But I must confess that I discovered it only recently, and it has changed my perspective about a lot things I thought I knew about modern American Evangelicalism. As you will hear, he outlines how modern Protestantism split in the early 20th century into liberal and conservative factions. The liberal stream was made up mostly of the mainline protestant churches, and the conservative stream became what we know today is evangelicalism. However, what Dockuk adds to this conversation is an analysis of how both streams got funded -- by oil millionaires such as John D. Rockefeller on the left and J. Howard Pew and the Hunt Brothers on the right. He has caused me to believe that without these men and a very few others who funded their religious impulses, modern American religious life would look very different than it does today. Darren Dochuk is a professor of history at the University of Notre Dame, and his previous works include From Bible Belt to Sunbelt, a history of the rise of evangelical conservatism. That book won the John H. Dunning Prize from the American Historical Association. Darren Dochuk spoke to me from his office in South Bend, Indiana. I hope you'll join me again on Friday when I'm joined by Natasha Cowden for our discussion of the week's news. The producer for today's program is Jeff McIntosh. Until next time, may God bless you!  

Brandon Washington, Pastor at Embassy Christian Bible Church and author of A Burning House, joins Autumn and Hunter on the podcast to discuss his recent book. In A Burning House, Washington contends that American Evangelicalism is a house ablaze: burning by its own hand due to an “in-house schism.” The stain of segregation has long tarnished the witness of Christianity and hampered our progress toward a Christ-like vision of Shalom—peace, justice, and wholeness—in the world. Common doctrine may unite black and white evangelicals. However, rifts such as social ethics and cultural influences still separate us, and we are in danger of embracing a truncated or partial gospel.Resources mentioned in this episode:

TW: homophobia, transphobia, suicidal thoughtsToday, April Ajoy tells her story of leaving Christian Nationalism. We also dig into what it's like being part of a queer family in the Southeastern US. April is a content creator and podcast host who uses humor to shine light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. After growing up an evangelist's kid entrenched in Christian Nationalism and working in conservative Christian media, she saw the harm caused firsthand. Still a Christian, she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive faith. April has been featured on Buzzfeed, CNN, Newsweek and more. She's been married to Beecher for 10 years and they have two daughters together.Please take care while listening, as there is discussion of homophobia, transphobia, and suicidal thoughts. If you're experiencing feelings of hopelessness or depression, please reach out to a trusted counselor or a hotline such as Trans Lifeline, which is 877-565-8860. You can get your copy of Star Spangled Jesus wherever books are sold. Follow April on all social media platforms @aprilajoy. You can hear April on The New Evangelicals podcast every Friday wherever you are listening. Support the show

Send us a textThe conversation explores the rise of Christian nationalism and the New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) in American politics. The guest, Matthew Taylor, discusses the theological and social shifts within the religious right, the influence of charismatic Christianity, and the role of violence in their beliefs. The conversation also delves into the four quadrant model of American Christianity and the impact of charismatic leaders like Paula White. The chapter titles could include 'The Rise of Christian Nationalism', 'Understanding the New Apostolic Reformation', 'The Theology of Violence', and 'The Paradox of Empowering Women'. The New Apostolic Reformation (NAR) movement, led by figures like C. Peter Wagner, has had a significant impact on American Christianity and politics. The NAR combines charismatic worship music with political activism, using worship as a way to insert religion into public debates. This worship music industrial complex has enculturated the far right of America to see themselves as the true worshipers of God, standing against the idolatry and demonic realm that surrounds them. The NAR movement is on the upswing, with its ideas becoming more mainstream among American evangelicals. It has also infiltrated the militia movement and white nationalist scripts.Buy the book: https://a.co/d/5yUwxSeGuest Bio:Matthew D. Taylor, Ph.D., is a Senior Scholar and the Protestant Scholar at the Institute for Islamic, Christian, and Jewish Studies (ICJS), where he specializes in Muslim-Christian dialogue, Evangelical and Pentecostal movements, religious politics in the U.S., and American Islam. His book, Scripture People: Salafi Muslims in Evangelical Christians' America (Cambridge University Press), offers an introduction to the oft-misunderstood Salafi movement in the U.S. by way of comparison with American Evangelicalism. He is also the creator of the acclaimed audio-documentary series Charismatic Revival Fury: The New Apostolic Reformation, which details how networks of extremist Christian leaders helped instigate the January 6th Insurrection.  "The Faith Roundtable" is a captivating spinoff from the Faithful Politics podcast, dedicated to exploring the crucial issues facing the church in America today. Hosted by Josh Burtram, this podcast brings together faith leaders, theologians, and scholars for deep, respectful discussions on topics at the heart of American Christianity. From the intersection of faith and public life to urgent matters such as social justice and community engagement, each episode offers insightful conversations Support the showTo learn more about the show, contact our hosts, or recommend future guests, click on the links below: Website: https://www.faithfulpoliticspodcast.com/ Faithful Host: Josh@faithfulpoliticspodcast.com Political Host: Will@faithfulpoliticspodcast.com Twitter: @FaithfulPolitik Instagram: faithful_politics Facebook: FaithfulPoliticsPodcast LinkedIn: faithfulpolitics Subscribe to our Substack: https://faithfulpolitics.substack.com/

With both the election and polls getting closer, new research from Lifeway says a record number of pastors are refusing to say who they're voting for—even on an anonymous survey. Mike Erre says he wouldn't answer the survey either. His reason may surprise you. Phil explores how Pat Buchanan's 1992 presidential campaign was a harbinger of today's politics. And diversity experts featured in Matt Walsh's new documentary claim he lied to get them to participate in the film. Walsh says it's okay to lie for the greater good of winning the culture war. Is he right? Then, Kaitlyn interviews America's Government Teacher and social media sensation, Sharon McMahon, about her new book “The Small and the Mighty.” McMahon says history can give us hope and resilience to live faithfully in our divided times. Also this week—Be careful, that's not an Oreo on the ground.   0:00 - BioLogos - Go to https://biologos.org/podcast/language-of-god/ and check out the Language of God podcast!   1:05 - Intro   2:24 -  Preview of The Esau McCaulley Podcast   5:36 - Show Starts   6:58 - Theme Song   7:19 - Sponsor - The National Association of Evangelicals - Listen to the Difficult to explore how Christians can become peacemakers. Go to https://www.nae.org/introduction-difficult-conversations-podcast-series/ to check it out!   8:26 - Skye's New Hat   13:24 - News of the Oreo Butt   18:27 - LifeWay's Research on Pastors' Voting Polls   27:42 - Mike's Church Navigating the Political Divide   30:58 - The GOP's Slow Turn from Evangelicalism   42:41 - Has Anti-Immigration Sentiment Become Mainstream in Christianity?   51:00 - Matt Walsh's “Am I a Racist?”   57:38 - Sponsor- Brooklyn Bedding - Brooklyn Bedding is offering up to 25% off sitewide for our listeners! Go to https://www.brooklynbedding.com/holypost to get yours now!   58:40 - Sponsor - World Relief - Visit https://worldrelief.org/holypost/ to learn more about refugee resettlement!   59:48 - Interview   1:01:34 - How Did McMahon Get Into Teaching History on the Internet?   1:06:55 - How Do You Engage Online Without Falling Into Outrage?   1:10:30 - What Is Your Most Important Work?   1:16:09 - What Is Your Capacity?   1:27:17 - Septima Clark   1:33:27 - Loving Your Enemies   1:39:16 - End Credits     Links Mentioned in the News Segment: Oreo Spider Butts https://boingboing.net/2024/09/14/trapdoor-ravine-spiders-butt-easily-mistaken-for-oreo-cookie.html   The GOP's Slow Turn from American Evangelicalism https://religionnews.com/2024/09/18/the-declining-significance-of-religion-in-the-gop/?utm_medium=social   Half of Pastors Plan to Vote for Trump, Nearly a Quarter Wouldn't Say https://www.christianitytoday.com/2024/09/trump-vote-pastors-evangelical-election-lifeway-survey/   How Far is Too Far? https://wng.org/opinions/how-far-is-too-far-1726567683 Other resources: Holy Post website: https://www.holypost.com/   Holy Post Plus: www.holypost.com/plus   Holy Post Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/holypost   Holy Post Merch Store: https://www.holypost.com/shop   The Holy Post is supported by our listeners. We may earn affiliate commissions through links listed here. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.  

Send me a text! I'd love to know what you're thinking!Here in the U.S. the impact of the election and the campaigns of Donald Trump and Kamala Harris are inescapable.In this episode, Tim Alberta, author of The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory: American Evangelicals in an Age of Extremism, discusses the unsettling trend of political polarization in the church, the role of pastors in responding to the pressure to reclaim a "Christian America," and the importance of having diverse relationships as we navigate this season of polarization.THIS EPISODE'S HIGHLIGHTS INCLUDE:Tim Alberta shares his story of being criticized for his political views while at his father's funeral.Tim Alberta expresses concern over the perceived decline of "Christian America."Alberta warns about the losses incurred when churches self-select into narrow ideological spaces.Diverse relationships are necessary for spiritual growth and addressing complex issues.Markus Watson mentions Allen Hilton and Andrew Hanauer's organizations working to address political polarization. These organizations bring different churches together to facilitate conversations and humanize each other.Alberta discusses how American Christians often view the U.S. as a nation set apart or a new Israel in covenant with God. This belief leads to a conflation of defending America with defending God.Some Christians view political opponents as cultural and spiritual adversaries, treating political warfare as spiritual warfare.There seems to be a fear among evangelicals of losing status, indoctrination of children, and being targeted by the government.Alberta discusses the shift from a culture sympathetic to Christian ideals to one perceived as hostile, creating a siege mentality.There seems to be a sense of entitlement within the evangelical community, akin to the belief of the ancient people of Israel..Tim Alberta highlights the difficulty for Christians to relate to scriptural suffering due to comfort and wealth in America.Some Christians compromise their virtues to reclaim a "Christian America," engaging in unethical behavior for a perceived greater good.RELEVANT RESOURCES AND LINKS:Tim Alberta:www.bytimalberta.comThe AtlanticTwitter/X - @TimAlbertaBooks mentioned:The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory, by Tim AlbertaAmerican Carnage, by Tim AlbertaRelated episodes:Tackling Toxic Polarization in Your Church, with Allen Hilton and Andrew HanauerLeading Your Church Through Political Division, with Allen HiltonGrace-Filled Politics, with Aaron SchaferDid you know Spiritual Life and Leadership has been named the #1 Spiritual Leadership Podcast by the Feedspot Podcasters Database? Check it out HERE!

April Ajoy (she/her) is a content creator and podcast host who uses humor to shine light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. After growing up an evangelist's kid entrenched in Christian Nationalism and working in conservative Christian media, she saw the harm caused firsthand. Still a Christian, she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive faith. She's been married to Beecher for 10 years and they have two daughters together. In this episode we talk about: April's book Star-Spangled Jesus: Leaving Christian Nationalism and Finding a True Faith (which you can pre-order here!) America Say Jesus Tour Her father's death and her brother coming out as gay sparked her shifting beliefs and deconstruction  Being Christian and voting Democrat (and how voting Republican doesn't actually save babies…) If you're coming out of Christian Nationalism, look back at the words of Jesus Connect with April: Instagram TikTok Listen to her America Say Jesus clip here Pre-order April's book: Star-Spangled Jesus Learn more about Content Warning Event and register here! And check out the list of amazing collaborators here. Connect with Maggie: Instagram Email: ⁠hello.decons@gmail.com⁠ Join the conversation on discord Visit ⁠dauntless.fm⁠ for more content Learn more about Amy's music: Website Foray Music Instagram This is a Dauntless Media Collective Podcast. Visit dauntless.fm for more content.

Today we delve into the contentious topic of class division within American Evangelicalism, sparked by an article from Christianity Today. We discuss the intellectual vs. non-intellectual Christian divide, how education influences political and religious beliefs, and the impact of Donald Trump's leadership on evangelical communities. The conversation touches on the complexities of faith, cultural shifts within the church, and the broader implications for Christian unity.   00:00 Behind the Scenes at Smarticle Headquarters 00:28 Seeking Unity on God Talk Friday 01:10 The Evangelical Diploma Divide 02:22 Class Division in American Evangelicalism 03:32 The Intellectual vs. Non-Intellectual Christian Debate 04:35 The Role of Education in Faith and Politics 05:25 The Complexity of Modern Evangelicalism 10:33 The Influence of Social Media and Internet 12:24 The Future of Conservative Christianity 13:01 Concluding Thoughts on Faith and Unity   The Evangelical Diploma Divide smarticlepodcast@gmail.com #educatedchristians #evangelicalshateschool #evangelicals #christianintelligencia #christianintellectuals  #Christianitytoday #spiritual #faith #godtok #faithtalk #realfaith #smarticlepodcast #podcast #smarticle @dailymeditations @Smarticleshow @BDDoble @larryolson threads.net/@smarticleshow @brand.dobes The Center for Action and Contemplation  The Smarticle Podcast 

Joel is joined by Brad Gray, CEO of Walking the Text, a non-profit organization that specalizes in helping pastors and Christians understand the cultural, linguistic, and literary context of the Bible. What are the "lenses of context" for reading scripture? How does understanding this context correctly enable Christians to live out the vision of scripture and be conformed to Christ?SPONSOR: The Living Church, The Human Pilgrimage Conferencelivingchurch.org/eventsUse code "CPT" for 10% registration.

In this episode, Zen speaks with Leslie Garrote about American Evangelicalism: its history, the challenges of studying a living religious movement, and best practices. Leslie is currently a PhD student in Baylor's Religion Department. She is a Hispanic Theology Initiative scholar and a recipient of the Louisville Institute's doctoral fellowship. Leslie's Recommended Readings: Mark Noll's A History of Christianity in the United States and Canada Darren Dochuck's From Bible Belt to Sunbelt: Plain-Folk Religion, Grassroots Politics, and the Rise of Evangelical Conservatism Daniel Vaca's Evangelicals Incorporated: Books and the Business of Religion in America Kristen Kobes Du Mez's Jesus and John Wayne: How White Evangelicals Corrupted a Faith and Fractured a Nation Anthea Butler's White Evangelical Racism: The Politics of Morality in America Read Leslie's Anxious Bench essay here: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/anxiousbench/2024/07/what-black-women-bloggers-can-teach-american-evangelicals/ Other Episodes You Might Like: Mandy McMichael on hearing Baptist women's history: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/hearing-history-mandy-mcmichael-on-interviewing-baptist/id1648052085?i=1000619951034 Adam Bond on Black Baptist Leaders, Race Literature, and the Salvation of America: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/black-baptist-leaders-race-literature-and-the/id1648052085?i=1000653202533

Kaitlyn Schiess joins the podcast to talk about her recent book The Ballot and the Bible: How Scripture Has Been Used and Abused in American Politics and Where We Go from Here (Brazos, 2023). She shares her background of education and how she began interacting with the question of the relationship between church and state, Christians and the politics of the world. What makes America a "Bible haunted nation"? Should Christians think of their nation as a "city on a hill"? What gifts can careful readers of Scripture offer to the contemporary political realm? All this on more on this new episode!This episode sponsored by The After Party.

Russell Moore, Editor-in-Chief of Christianity Today, joins the podcast to talk about his journey of faith, major influences on his faith, and current reflections on the state of American Evangelicalism. Why is fiction so profoundly impactful on his thinking? Why is the American church prone to cultural nominalism and pragmatism? What does the American church need to repent of and convert to? What is the biblical meaning of hope? All this and more on this new episode!

Pre-order: https://www.amazon.com/Star-Spangled-Jesus-Leaving-Christian-Nationalism/dp/1546006680 "April Ajoy is a content creator and podcast host who uses humor to shine light on harmful, toxic, and sometimes just weird traits of American Evangelicalism. After growing up an evangelist's kid entrenched in Christian Nationalism and later working in conservative Christian media, she saw the harm caused firsthand. Still a Christian, she uses her platform to expose the dangers of Christian Nationalism while promoting a more inclusive faith." Help sustain the work of RLC: www.redletterchristians.org/donate/ To check out what RLC is up to, please visit us www.redletterchristians.org  Follow us on Twitter: @RedLetterXians Instagram: @RedLetterXians Follow Shane on Instagram: @shane.claiborne Twitter: @ShaneClaiborne Intro song by Common Hymnal: https://commonhymnal.com/ 

June 18, 2024 HOUR #1: WILLIAM WOLFE, Founder & Executive Director of the Center For Baptist Leadership, & widely respected & authoritative commentator on the role of the Southern Baptist Convemtion in broader American Evangelicalism & the intersection of faith & politics in our nation; PLUS HOUR #2: Jared Moore, Senior Pastor of Homesteads Baptist Church of Crossville, TN, author, & recent candidate for President of the Southern Baptist Convention, who will both address: “WHAT REALLY HAPPENED @ the 2024 SOUTHERN BAPTIST CON- VENTION MEETING?”   Subscribe: iTunes  TuneIn Android RSS Feed Listen:

We're back for season two, and we're kicking it off by talking to Dr. Matthew D. Taylor about that weird An Appeal to Heaven flag that got Justice Samuel Alito in so much trouble! Taylor holds a Ph.D. in Religious Studies and Muslim-Christian Relations from Georgetown University and an M.A. in Theology from Fuller Theological Seminary. His book, Scripture People: Salafi Muslims in Evangelical Christians' America (Cambridge University Press), offers an introduction to the oft-misunderstood Salafi movement in the U.S. by way of comparison with American Evangelicalism. He is also the creator of the acclaimed audio-documentary series  “Charismatic Revival Fury: The New Apostolic Reformation,” which details how networks of extremist Christian leaders helped instigate the January 6th Insurrection. His next book, The Violent Take It By Force: The Christian movement that is threatening our democracy (Broadleaf Books), will be published in Fall 2024. He joined Kelly and John to talk about the threat to democracy the flag represents, and offered his thoughts about what we can still do to break the spell of Christian Nationalism in America.

American Evangelicalism goes in for a check-up as Dr. Albert Mohler, President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary. and Dr. Andrew Davis, Pastor of First Baptist Church in Durham, NC, explore the effects of modernity on the Evangelical mind.For more articles, books, and podcasts, please visit 9marks.org

Today on the Christian History Almanac, we remember a major figure and publisher in 20th-century American Evangelicalism on his 76th birthday: Jim Wallis. Show Notes: Support 1517 1517 Podcasts 1517 on Youtube 1517 Podcast Network on Apple Podcasts 1517 Academy - Free Theological Education What's New from 1517: Available Now: Encouragement for Motherhood Edited by Katie Koplin Pre-order: Hitchhiking with Prophets: A Ride Through the Salvation Story of the Old Testament by Chad Bird 30 Minutes in the NT on Youtube Remembering Rod Rosenbladt Available Now: Be Thou My Song by Kerri Tom More from the hosts: Dan van Voorhis SHOW TRANSCRIPTS are available: https://www.1517.org/podcasts/the-christian-history-almanac CONTACT: CHA@1517.org SUBSCRIBE: Apple Podcasts Spotify Stitcher Overcast Google Play FOLLOW US: Facebook Twitter Audio production by Christopher Gillespie (gillespie.media).

Is the history of Evangelicalism a little blurry for you? Or are you a history buff who loves to talk about names, dates and changes on the historical scene? Either way, you'll benefit from listening to Mark Dever chat it up with Mark Noll, McManis Professor of Christian Thought at Wheaton College.For more articles, books, and podcasts, please visit 9marks.org

This week, we share the second installment of Coracle's 2024 "Justice, Mercy & Humility" Soundings Seminar Series.  This series explores the continuing relevance of Micah 6:8's exhortation to “act justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with God.”  In this week's conversation, Bill Haley is joined by the co-chairs of the Coracle Board, Rev. Dr. Kendrick Curry and Rich Dean, to explore the deep biblical foundations of the pursuit of Justice and mercy in humility. They also unpack some of the areas where the church has fallen short of holding these three pursuits together, and they candidly discuss what steps are needed to bring healing and reconciliation.View Our Full Archive of Soundings Seminarsinthecoracle.org  |  @inthecoracleSupport the show

Ken welcomes historian, author, and media commentator Martyn Whittock from his home across the Pond just outside London. Martyn read Ken's Substack series on Biblical Authority and reached out with some comments. It prompted this lively conversation - and led to another focus: Martyn's article recently published in the UK - How US Evangelicals Could Affect the Entire World. Whittock, a licensed minister in the Church of England, is a self-described “Evangelical.” For years, he has been a student of American Evangelicalism. He gives us a fascinating insight into the differences between our two countries: in America - the preponderance of MAGA Evangelicals, and in Britain - a very different sort of evangelical. Martyn expresses his deep concern over the prospect of a second term for the 45th President not only for the USA. He believes a second Trump Presidency will have an egregious adverse effect on Europe and the entire world. He explains this in considerable detail. Then, Ken asks Martyn about two recent appearances on British television as a history specialist. In the first, Martyn comments on the recent terror attack in Moscow that killed over one hundred in a large theater. In the second, he is asked about the Princess of Wales and the conspiracy theories that surrounded her hospital stay and absence from public life. You can see those clips by clicking on the links. SHOW NOTESMartyn Whittock on British TV: CBN LIVE on The Princess of Wales | Talk TV with Trisha Goddard on the Moscow Terror Attack (11-22 minutes into the program)Become a Patron of the BWM Podcast | Ken's Substack PageSupport the show

Today we're talking about a key voting bloc in this year’s elections: white evangelical Christian voters. In 2016 and 2020, they helped Donald Trump rise to power. NPR’s Sarah McCammon, author of “Exvangelicals,” discusses why evangelicals continue to back Trump, her personal journey leaving evangelicalism and the economic systems built around the evangelical movement. We’ll also talk about the Maryland bridge collapse and the state of U.S. infrastructure. Plus, Neil King Jr., author of the memoir “American Ramble,” answers the Make Me Smart question. Here’s everything we talked about today: “‘You gotta be tough’: White evangelicals remain enthusiastic about Donald Trump” from NPR “How younger voters will impact elections: What is happening to the white evangelical vote?” from Brookings “Why White Evangelicals Stuck with Trump” from the University of Chicago Divinity School “Latinos Will Determine the Future of American Evangelicalism” from The Atlantic “Bridge Collapse in Baltimore Puts an Election Year Spotlight on Infrastructure” from The New York Times “Elon Musk's Starlink Terminals Are Falling Into the Wrong Hands” from Bloomberg We want to hear your answer to the Make Me Smart question. You can reach us at makemesmart@marketplace.org or leave us a voicemail at 508-U-B-SMART.

Today we're talking about a key voting bloc in this year’s elections: white evangelical Christian voters. In 2016 and 2020, they helped Donald Trump rise to power. NPR’s Sarah McCammon, author of “Exvangelicals,” discusses why evangelicals continue to back Trump, her personal journey leaving evangelicalism and the economic systems built around the evangelical movement. We’ll also talk about the Maryland bridge collapse and the state of U.S. infrastructure. Plus, Neil King Jr., author of the memoir “American Ramble,” answers the Make Me Smart question. Here’s everything we talked about today: “‘You gotta be tough’: White evangelicals remain enthusiastic about Donald Trump” from NPR “How younger voters will impact elections: What is happening to the white evangelical vote?” from Brookings “Why White Evangelicals Stuck with Trump” from the University of Chicago Divinity School “Latinos Will Determine the Future of American Evangelicalism” from The Atlantic “Bridge Collapse in Baltimore Puts an Election Year Spotlight on Infrastructure” from The New York Times “Elon Musk's Starlink Terminals Are Falling Into the Wrong Hands” from Bloomberg We want to hear your answer to the Make Me Smart question. You can reach us at makemesmart@marketplace.org or leave us a voicemail at 508-U-B-SMART.

Today we're talking about a key voting bloc in this year’s elections: white evangelical Christian voters. In 2016 and 2020, they helped Donald Trump rise to power. NPR’s Sarah McCammon, author of “Exvangelicals,” discusses why evangelicals continue to back Trump, her personal journey leaving evangelicalism and the economic systems built around the evangelical movement. We’ll also talk about the Maryland bridge collapse and the state of U.S. infrastructure. Plus, Neil King Jr., author of the memoir “American Ramble,” answers the Make Me Smart question. Here’s everything we talked about today: “‘You gotta be tough’: White evangelicals remain enthusiastic about Donald Trump” from NPR “How younger voters will impact elections: What is happening to the white evangelical vote?” from Brookings “Why White Evangelicals Stuck with Trump” from the University of Chicago Divinity School “Latinos Will Determine the Future of American Evangelicalism” from The Atlantic “Bridge Collapse in Baltimore Puts an Election Year Spotlight on Infrastructure” from The New York Times “Elon Musk's Starlink Terminals Are Falling Into the Wrong Hands” from Bloomberg We want to hear your answer to the Make Me Smart question. You can reach us at makemesmart@marketplace.org or leave us a voicemail at 508-U-B-SMART.

We recently had the pleasure of sitting down with Mark Dever, pastor at Capitol Hill Baptist Church (Washington, D. C.), to discuss books, ministry, and reading in the local church.   Mark's book recommendations: Samuel Prime, The Power of Prayer: The New York Revival of 1858 (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/power-of-prayer/) Andrew Bonar and Bennet Tyler, Asahel Nettleton: Life and Labours (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/asahel-nettleton/) C. H. Spurgeon, The Greatest Fight in the World (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/church-ministry/the-greatest-fight-in-the-world/) John Bunyan, All Loves Excelling (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/all-loves-excelling/) Richard Sibbes, The Bruised Reed (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/the-bruised-reed/) Thomas Boston, The Crook in the Lot (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/the-crook-in-the-lot/) William Gurnall, The Christian in Complete Armour (3 vols: https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/christian-in-complete-armour-5/ 1 vol: https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/sermons-and-expositions/christian-in-complete-armour/) J. C. Ryle, Thoughts for Young Men (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/thoughts-young-men/) Iain Murray, The Forgotten Spurgeon (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/forgotten-spurgeon/) Jonathan Edwards on Revival, especially The Distinguishing Marks of a Work of the Spirit of God (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/jonathan-edwards-on-revival/) Iain Murray, Evangelicalism Divided: A Record of Crucial Change in the Years 1950 to 2000 (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/church-ministry/evangelicalism-divided/) J. C. Ryle, Expository Thoughts on Mark (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/commentaries/expository-thoughts-on-the-gospels-10/) The Works of Richard Sibbes (7 vols: https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/collected-workssets/the-works-of-richard-sibbes/) J. C. Ryle, Light from Old Times (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/christian-living/light-from-old-times/) Iain Murray, The Life of Martyn Lloyd-Jones (1 vol: https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/the-life-of-martyn-lloyd-jones/) C. H. Spurgeon, The Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit (Vol 38, 1892), (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/sermons-and-expositions/metropolitan-tabernacle/) Charles Bridges, The Christian Ministry (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/church-ministry/the-christian-ministry/) Iain Murray, Revival and Revivalism: The Making and Marring of American Evangelicalism 1750–1858 (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/theology/revival-and-revivalism/) Iain Murray, ed., The Reformation of the Church (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/reformation-of-the-church/) J. H. Merle d'Aubigné, The Reformation in England (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/the-reformation-in-england-3/) John Calvin, Sermons on Ephesians (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/sermons-and-expositions/sermons-on-ephesians/) The Works of Jonathan Edwards (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/collected-workssets/the-works-of-jonathan-edwards/) The Works of John Bunyan (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/collected-workssets/the-works-of-john-bunyan-4/) C. H. Spurgeon's Autobiography (https://banneroftruth.org/uk/store/history-biography/c-h-spurgeon-autobiography/)   Links from this week's episode Capitol Hill Baptist Church: https://www.capitolhillbaptist.org/ 9Marks: www.9marks.org Connie Dever's Children's Ministry: https://praisefactory.org/ Explore the work of the Banner of Truth: www.banneroftruth.org Subscribe to the Magazine (Print/Digital/Both): www.banneroftruth.org/magazine Tell us your thoughts on this episode: https://www.speakpipe.com/magazinepodcast

Michael Todd and Steven Furtick are two of th biggest names in American Evangelicalism. Their teachings and philosophies are often scrutinized as heretical. is that true though? Are these guys really heretics or are they sinfully judged as so because of their platform? 

Leslie and Karen are two new friends who are getting to know each other as they record thier podcast together. Today's episode is an awesome conversation about the things they used to journal about and the way they felt about themselves when they were steeped in American Evangelicalism. Both ladies are deconstructing their faith and beliefs, but are still trying to cling to Jesus in the process. While preparing for today's episode, they both realized that they needed to extend grace to someone very, very important in their lives...Find out more about Leslie's Coaching at https://www.leslieneasecoaching.comFind out more about Karen at https://www.karenruthshock.com Honoring the Journey is co-hosted by Leslie Nease and Karen Shock, produced and edited by Leslie Nease and the artwork for the show is also created by Leslie Nease. If you are looking for community as you deconstruct or just a place to go and enjoy the company of people who are seekers, learners and who are looking to connect with the Divine without religious baggage, please join our Private Facebook Community! We will also do live shows and events through this page. Both Leslie and Karen are very passionate about connection and community, so look for some retreats in the future, as well!

Tim Alberta takes a deep dive into the contemporary state of American Evangelicalism in a time of extremism. Tim Alberta is a journalist, author, and staff writer for The Atlantic.

In this week's episode, Jeremi and Zachary are joined by Dr. Daniel Hummel about the history of American Evangelicalism and its connection to both policy and theology. Zachary sets the scene with his poem entitled, "If Your God is a God of Truth" Dr. Daniel Hummel is the Director for University Engagement at Upper House, a Christian study center serving the University of Wisconsin-Madison. Daniel is the author of The Rise and Fall of Dispensationalism: How the Evangelical Battle Over the End Times Shaped a Nation and Covenant Brothers: Evangelicals, Jews, and U.S.-Israeli Relations. Daniel has written about religion, politics, and foreign policy for the Washington Post, Christianity Today, and Religion News Service. His academic research has been published in Religion & American Culture and Church History.

American Christianity enjoys a great deal of power and influence at home and abroad. Is the church better for it? Is the world better for it? Or is Christian Nationalism just another idolatry—a temptation to take up the sword instead of taking up the cross? Journalist Tim Alberta (The Atlantic, POLITICO) joins Evan Rosa for a discussion of his new book, The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory: American Evangelicals in an Age of Extremism. Tim explains his reporting on American Evangelicalism from 2019 through 2023 as well as his own Christian faith and spiritual background. He also reflects on a variety of challenging issues that influence life far upstream from political theatre, including:how faith matures or erodesthe impact of Constantinian Christianity and the Christian embrace of power, influence, and glory in American public lifethe difference between Christ and Christendom, and our allegiance to one or the otherand the meaning and unique threat of idolatry—which takes on a unique form in contemporary American life.Show ArtGrégoire Guérard, “The Arrest of Christ”, circa 1520-1522, Musée des Beaux-Arts, Dijon, FranceAbout Tim AlbertaVisit Tim's personal website for more of his writing, or follow him on X/Twitter.Tim Alberta is an award-winning journalist, best-selling author, and staff writer for The Atlantic magazine. He formerly served as chief political correspondent for POLITICO. In 2019, he published the critically acclaimed book, "American Carnage: On the Front Lines of the Republican Civil War and the Rise of President Trump" and co-moderated the year's final Democratic presidential debate aired by PBS Newshour.Hailing from Brighton, Michigan, Tim attended Schoolcraft College and later Michigan State University, where his plans to become a baseball writer were changed by a stint covering the legislature in Lansing. He went on to spend more than a decade in Washington, reporting for publications including the Wall Street Journal, The Hotline, National Journal and National Review. Having covered the biggest stories in national politics—the battles over health care and immigration on Capitol Hill; the election and presidency of Donald Trump; the ideological warfare between and within the two parties—Tim was eager for a new challenge.In 2019, he moved home to Michigan. Rather than cover the 2020 campaign through the eyes of the candidates, Tim roved the country and reported from gun shows and farmers markets, black cookouts and white suburbs, crowded wholesale stores and shuttered small businesses. He wrote a regular "Letter to Washington" that kept upstream from politics, focusing less on manifest partisan divisions and more on elusive root causes: the hollowing out of communities, the diminished faith in vital institutions, the self-perpetuating cycle of cultural antagonism, the diverging economic realities for wealthy and working-class citizens, the rapid demographic makeover of America—and the corollary spikes in racism and xenophobia.Tim joined The Atlantic in March 2021 with a mandate to keep roaming and writing and telling stories that strike at the heart of America's discontent. His work has been featured in dozens of other publications nationwide, including Sports Illustrated and Vanity Fair, and he frequently appears as a commentator on television programs in the United States and around the world. Tim's first book, "American Carnage," debuted at No. 1 and No. 2 on the Washington Post and New York Times best-seller lists, respectively. He lives in southeast Michigan with his wife, three sons, and German Shepherd.Show NotesTim Alberta, The Kingdom, the Power, and the GloryIntellectually re-examining the faith of childhoodA generational disillusionment in today's exit from ChristianityGenerational break in attitude & behaviorDistance from the moral majority generation to evaluate criticallyInverse relationship where the more one learns about Christ, the less they like ChristianityThe creation of the secular, evil “other”“They created this other, this outsider, this enemy that had to be defeated.”Current American Christianity is often looking to find our identities on the good side of zero-sum equation.Shrinking our theology into something pathetic and miniscule.St. Augustine, St. Paul, and C.S. Lewis“One way to find meaning is to locate an enemy.”From Cal Thomas's Blinded by Might” —”Unless you have the power to right every wrong and cure every ill and what better way to do that than with An all powerful God on your side.”The church most often seems to thrive when it is at the margins.“We can understand the relationship between this lust for dominance in our, in a society, the inverse relationship between that lust for dominance and the health of the church.”Satan's temptation of Christ in the Gospel of Luke—the temptation to bow down.St. Peter, “Blessed are you Simon bar Jonah…” and then… “Get behind me Satan.”Reaching for the sword versus reaching for the crossThe impact of Constantinian ChristianityJohn Dixon's Bullies and SaintsConstantine wielding Christianity to dominate—the imposition of Christian faith“Is Christianity an end or is it a means to an end?”“It's easy to forget about the teachings of Christ if you are preoccupied with the, crusades of Christianity”“An idol is something that starts as a good and healthy thing, but then becomes the ultimate thing.”America as a kingdomAmerican Christendom as a source of idolatryBaptizing the American experience and pastE.g., Thomas Jefferson, Donald Trump, and Paula White“The other part of it that I find to be uniquely problematic and sometimes just downright gross, is this willful merging of scripture with the American mythos.”Mike Pence, and “Let us set our eyes on Old Glory.”“Thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, forever.”An age of gnawing unknownsTim Alberta's reflections on his father“Keep your eyes fixed on Jesus.”The influence of Jesus's life and teaching“We are in sales, not management.”Production NotesThis podcast featured Tim AlbertaEdited and Produced by Evan RosaHosted by Evan RosaProduction Assistance by Macie Bridge, Alexa Rollow, and Tim BergelandA Production of the Yale Center for Faith & Culture at Yale Divinity School https://faith.yale.edu/aboutSupport For the Life of the World podcast by giving to the Yale Center for Faith & Culture: https://faith.yale.edu/give

One of the highlights of 2023 was having this conversation with David Brooks.   You might recognize David Brooks from his columns in The New York Times or his essays in The Atlantic. Perhaps you've seen him on PBS NewsHour or Meet the Press. He's also a prolific author. In fact, his 2019 book The Second Mountain was a major inspiration for this program. We discuss that as well as David's new book, How to Know a Person: The Art of Seeing Others Deeply and Being Deeply Seen (Penguin Random House).   Our conversation with "Brooksie" went in a number of surprising directions: Sociological observations (and confessions) of New York Mets fans; The way lifelong friends enrich our lives; Depression - fair warning that this section gets pretty gritty and candid; How, as observant Jews, we both discovered Christianity later in life; As Jews who are Christian, whether we have any ambivalence; American Evangelicalism - talk about ambivalence! David's writing process and the motivation of deadlines; and much, much more!   Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what's broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it.   Please support our wonderful sponsor Meza Wealth Management: www.mezawealth.com   And you can find Corey on all the socials @coreysnathan such as www.threads.net/@coreysnathan.   David's new book HOW TO KNOW A PERSON:  www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/652822/how-to-know-a-person-by-david-brooks

What does it mean to be an EXvangelical? For Mattie Jo Cowsert, how did that deconstruction of her faith, the tradition that she grew up in, all come about? How have family and friends back home reacted to Mattie Jo's journey, specifically with her being an outspoken exvangelical? What's it been like to go back and examine the truth of certain pillars of today's American Evangelicalism such as the Kanakuk Kamps, now known to have employed and protected serial sexual predators? We get into so much more, too - including plenty of politics!   Mattie Jo Cowsert is an #exvangelical whose blog God, Sex & Rich People traces her journey from the Bible Belt to New York City as she deconstructs Christian fundamentalism to embrace personal and sexual freedom. Her book of the same name will be out this coming winter and her pilot based on her series premiered this year at the Omaha Film Festival.   Talkin' Politics & Religion Without Killin' Each Other is part of The Democracy Group, a network of podcasts that examines what's broken in our democracy and how we can work together to fix it.   Please support our wonderful sponsor Meza Wealth Management:  https://www.mezawealth.com/   And you can find Corey on all the socials @coreysnathan such as www.threads.net/@coreysnathan.   www.mattiejocowsert.com/   On Instagram: @mattiejocowsert   www.mattiejocowsert.com/godsexandrichpeople

Guest Bios Show Transcript How did loving your enemies—a command of Jesus—suddenly become a sign that you're “woke”? And why is “owning the libs” now the answer to “What would Jesus do?”  On this edition of The Roys Report, bestselling author and journalist Tim Alberta joins host Julie Roys to explore a disturbing phenomenon in American evangelicalism. Though once evangelicals understood that the Kingdom of God and the kingdom of man were separate, now the two are being combined into an unholy mix. And sadly, for millions of conservative Christians, America is their kingdom—and proper adherence to their political ideology is their litmus test for Christian orthodoxy! On this podcast, you'll hear Julie's compelling conversation with Tim, exploring how evangelicals got into this mess—and if, and how, we can get ourselves out. Yet Tim doesn't speak as an outside critic passing judgment, but as a practicing Christian and the son of an evangelical pastor.  Tim spent years sifting through the wreckage of American evangelicalism, interviewing pastors, evangelical/political activists, congregants, and scholars. The result is his new book, The Kingdom, The Power, and The Glory, which tells story after illuminating story of major players and institutions within the evangelical movement that have succumbed to political idolatry.  One example is Liberty University, founded in 1971 by Jerry Falwell Sr. Recent headlines have exposed how Senior's now-disgraced son, Jerry Falwell, Jr., made Liberty into a far-right, culture warring, money-making powerhouse. But is this mixing of the kingdom of God and the kingdom of man a corruption of Senior's vision—or, is it the culmination of it? And what does it say that everyone—the administration, board, and Liberty supporters—were all fine with it, as long as the money was coming in?  Tim also shares stunning admissions he got during one-on-one interviews with major evangelical/political figures, like Robert Jeffress and Ralph Reed. In private, these men confessed that they know mixing political advocacy with the gospel is misleading and wrong. Yet, as Tim documents, these men keep doing it! Yet Tim also offers stories of hope—like his chapter on Rev. Dr. John Dickson, who teaches at the flagship evangelical school, Wheaton College in Wheaton, Ill. In it, Tim explains why Dickson has become a missionary to America—and how Christians can lose the culture wars yet live joyfully and winsomely among unbelievers. Tim's book also includes a chapter on exposing abuse and corruption, featuring Rachel Denhollander's work and our work at The Roys Report. On the podcast, we discuss why our reporting is so important and why this chapter is Tim's mother's favorite! This is such an important podcast for Christians wanting to remain true to their calling to worship God first and foremost, rather than succumb to political idolatry.  Guests Tim Alberta Tim Alberta is a staff writer for The Atlantic and has written for dozens of other publications, including the Wall Street Journal and National Review. He is the author of The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory: American Evangelicals in an Age of Extremism and the New York Times bestseller American Carnage: On the Front Lines of the Republican Civil War and the Rise of President Trump. He lives in southeast Michigan with his wife and three sons. Show Transcript SPEAKERS TIM ALBERTA, Julie Roys Julie Roys  00:04 How did loving your enemies, a command of Jesus, suddenly become a sign that you're woke? And why is owning the libs now the answer to what would Jesus do? Welcome to The Roys Report, a podcast dedicated to reporting the truth and restoring the church. I'm Julie Roys and joining me on this podcast is New York Times bestselling author Tim Alberta, whose latest book explores what happened to American evangelicalism. Decades ago, Americans viewed evangelicalism favorably. In 1976, author and historian Gary Wills called evangelicalism, the major religious force in America, both in numbers and an impact. And leading evangelical thinkers claimed that evangelicalism could no longer be regarded as reactionary but was vigorously and sometimes creatively speaking to the needs of the contemporary world. Fast forward to today and evangelicalism has become synonymous with Donald Trump, a thrice married vulgar opportunist who said he doesn't need to repent or ask for forgiveness. A recent poll by Pew Research found that the only religious group that views evangelicals favorably are evangelicals. And as Tim Alberta notes in his book in 1991 90% of Americans identified as Christians, but today, only 63% do. What happened to this once vibrant movement? And can it be saved, or has it passed beyond the point of no return? Un his new book, The Kingdom, The Power, and The Glory. Tim Alberta does a masterful job of exploring these questions, but he doesn't do it as an outside critic passing judgment. But as a practicing Christian and the son of an evangelical pastor. I found Tim's book eye opening on many levels, and I'm so excited to share this interview with you. Julie Roys  01:47 But before I do, I want to thank the sponsors of this podcast, Judson University, and Marquardt of Barrington. If you're looking for a top ranked Christian University, providing a caring community and an excellent college experience, Judson University is for you. Judson is located on 90 acres just 40 miles west of Chicago in Elgin, Illinois. The school offers more than 60 majors, great leadership opportunities, and strong financial aid. Plus, you can take classes online as well as in person. Judson University is shaping lives that shaped the world. For more information, just go to JUDSONU.EDU. Also, if you're looking for a quality new or used car, I highly recommend my friends at Marquardt of Barrington. Marquardt is a Buick GMC dealership where you can expect honesty, integrity, and transparency. That's because the owners there Dan and Kurt Marquardt, are men of integrity, to check them out, just go to BUYACAR123.COM. Julie Roys  02:51 Well, again, joining me is Tim Alberta, a staff writer for The Atlantic and the former chief political correspondent for Politico. Tim also is the author of The New York Times best seller American Carnage on the Frontlines of the Republican Civil War, and the Rise of President Trump. And his latest book, The Kingdom, The Power, and The Glory, explores American evangelicals in an age of extremism. So, Tim, welcome. It is just such a pleasure to be with you again. TIM ALBERTA  03:16 Yes, Julie, it is. It's great to catch up with you and come sort of full circle from where we were a couple of years ago talking about all of this. Julie Roys  03:24 That's right. We spent a couple of well, more than a couple of hours. I think it was supposed to be like maybe an hour and a half, and we got so into our discussion. I think we closed down one coffee shop and went to another. TIM ALBERTA  03:35 We did. I hijacked your whole day. Julie Roys  03:38 Oh, it was fantastic. And so, encouraging to me, but always fun to talk to a fellow journalist with similar convictions. And I was excited about this book when we had our discussion. I'm so honored, I have to say, you know, to get the galley of the book, and I figured because we spent so much time that I'd be in it, but you know, just what you wrote, and the way that you captured some things just so honored to be featured in a chapter with Rachel den Hollander. So, thank you so much for that. I just really appreciate it. TIM ALBERTA  04:07 I should tell you that is my mother's favorite chapter of the book. Oh, for what it's worth, because she's big into strong feminine Christian leadership. And so, she was particularly smitten with you and with Rachel. So, I thought you should know that. Julie Roys  04:21 Oh, wow. Well, I'm honored. I really am. And I should mention that we are offering your book as a premium to anybody who gives $50 or more to The Roys Report in this month. Again, this is just a way that you're able to support the work that we do, but also get this fantastic book. Just go to JULIEROYS.COM/DONATE if you're able to help us out and continue the work that we do, and also get what could be a great Christmas present for somebody or for yourself. So anyway, encourage you to do that. Well, Tim, as I mentioned in the open, you're not writing this book as sort of an outsider critiquing evangelicalism. You grew up evangelical, your dad was an evangelical pastor. And oddly enough, it was at your dad's funeral in 2019, that something sort of awakened you to the severity of what's happening right now within evangelicalism. Tell us a bit about that story. TIM ALBERTA  05:17 Yeah, so my dad, Reverend Richard Alberta, was an amazing, amazing guy. We were very close. And he had a pretty crazy come to Jesus story himself where he was actually kind of a hotshot New York finance guy. And my mom was kind of a hotshot, young journalist with ABC Radio. They lived in New York and my dad, despite having all of this worldly material success, just felt this emptiness. And he was an atheist. He grew up in an unbelieving home. And he, one day stumbled into this church in the Hudson Valley, and heard the gospel and he gave his life to Christ. And it was already a pretty dramatic conversion because he became completely unrecognizable to people around him, including my mom, who was not yet a Christian. Everybody who knew him just thought he was sort of losing it. Suddenly, he's waking up at four in the morning to read his Bible and meditate in prayer for hours. And they're all like, what is this guy doing? And then pretty soon after that, he feels the Lord calling him to ministry. And now they all think he's like certifiable, right? You know, but he follows the Lord's calling. And, you know, he and my mom who became a Christian, they sell all the possessions so he can go to seminary, and they basically they give up this pretty lavish lifestyle they'd had. And for the next like, 20 years, they just work in small churches and live on food stamps and serve the Lord that way. And then when I come along, some years later, we eventually settle in Brighton, which is a suburb of Detroit. And my dad builds this kind of small startup church there into kind of a mega church. And that was my home. It was my community. It was my whole life, really. My mom was on the staff there at the church as well. It was called Cornerstone Evangelical Presbyterian Church. I was raised physically, literally, inside of that church. TIM ALBERTA  07:11 And so, my dad dies a few years back. And when I came back to the church for the funeral, because of the work I've done in politics, and because I had just recently written this book about Trumpism and his takeover of the Republican Party, I was kind of in the crosshairs of right-wing media at that time, because of the book. And so, at the funeral or at the wake during the visitation, I had a bunch of people at the church kind of confronting me and wanting to argue about politics and about Trump and asking me if I was still a Christian and how I could be criticizing him this way. And it was pretty ugly. And as you said, sort of a wakeup call. Julie Roys  07:52 Yeah. And it is something isn't it when you don't support these people that certain evangelicalism believe you have to your, you know, I've got people praying for my salvation, because I've taken on John MacArthur, you know, It's craziness. But there is this tribalism now, within evangelicalism, and it's probably at its very worst when it comes to former President Trump and what he typified. It's interesting to me, you know, as I look at the evangelical movement, you know, I was a card-carrying conservative right? Before Trump came along, and then something really happened. And I feel like I was going back and reading a little bit of Chuck Colson's, Kingdoms in Conflict. Do you remember that book? TIM ALBERTA  08:34 I do. Yeah. Julie Roys  08:35 I mean, he was pretty even handed. I mean, he's very clear in there that being in the kingdom of heaven means it's not about ruling others, it's about being under God's rule. And yet something has tripped, where we're not saying that anymore. We're really become about this whole Dominionism. And he talks about the cultural mandate and things like that, but it's from a very, very different perspective. So here we are dealing with all of this Christian nationalism, and according to your book, a lot of this began, and it's funny because now, Lynchburg Virginia has become synonymous with the Falwell's and with Liberty University. But I've got to say, growing up in the 80s, you know, I knew about the Moral Majority, and some of that, but it just wasn't that big to me. And yet it has grown and grown, and I guess I wasn't even aware of the influence it had. But talk about how a lot of this has its roots really there, in Lynchburg, Virginia, and with what Jerry Falwell Senior. started in, like the late 70s, early 80s. TIM ALBERTA  09:42 Sure, in the context of the American church experience, it is Lynchburg, Virginia. It is the mid-1970s. And it is Jerry Falwell Senior who was a brilliant businessman who, you know, this guy could sell anyone on anything, and he was kind of a master entrepreneur, also a master manipulator. And what Falwell Senior. effectively did, he had already built out Thomas Road Baptist Church into a massive congregation. And then he had tapped into the relatively new medium of television to broadcast his sermons around the country. At one point, he became the single most telecasted program in the entire country. And so, he's reaching millions of people and he's raising a lot of money. This is pretty cutting-edge stuff at the time, but he's building out a mailing list with like more than 10 million names on it, and they are raking in money. So, then he already has his church. But Falwell, Senior is really almost the early archetype of the Christian nationalist. He believes that sort of fighting for God and fighting for America is one in the same and that if America falls, then almost God's kingdom on earth will fall. And so he recognizes that he needs something more than a church; that he needs kind of a cultural stronghold. So, he does two things. First, he takes this little Baptist College Lynchburg Baptist College, and at the time of the bicentennial in 1976, he rebrands it to Liberty University, and he changes the colors from green and gold to red, white, and blue. And basically, they do this whole patriotic rebranding exercise, which is aimed at tapping into not only patriotism in the church, but also tapping into the percolating low simmering at the time, fear in the church and grievance in the church. This sense that, you know, abortion is now legal. Pornography is prevalent, the drug culture is out of control. Prayer is banned in public schools. Secularism is on the march and they're coming for us like they are coming for Christianity in America. And so, Jerry Falwell turns Liberty University into this cause, and then piggybacks onto that with this new organization, The Moral Majority. So suddenly, he's got these three cogs. And he builds out this machine, Falwell Senior does, and it is incredibly effective. They mobilize 10s of millions of voters and sort of bring them under this banner of not just, you know, Christianity, not just following Jesus, but a very particular type of Christianity, a sort of subculture of a subculture. And in many ways, those seeds planted by Falwell 50 years ago, we are harvesting them now. And what we are dealing with, you know, the fracturing of the modern evangelical movement, I think you can trace it directly back to that period. Julie Roys  12:36 It's so interesting, because I think when you talk about Jerry Falwell Senior, and I've talked to a lot of people from Liberty, I've done a lot of reporting about Liberty. And a lot of folks look very wistfully back to the early days, and these are good people, you know, I've talked extensively to them. They're really good people, sincere believers. They look at what's happened to Liberty, and they're like, this isn't Senior. Like Senior loved the Lord and he really was sincere in his walk with the Lord and Junior just was like, we don't know how Junior happened, right? I mean, that's how they often talk about it. I'm going to have you come back to that, because I think what you present is a very, very different picture and honestly, one that I've begun to suspect myself. But let's talk about what happens with you know, Senior dies pretty abruptly right of a heart attack. And then Jerry Falwell, Junior, who is the lawyer, right? He takes over not Jonathan Falwell, who's the pastor, much more of the spiritual leader, but Jerry Falwell, Junior takes over. Very clearly, I'm not a spiritual leader. I mean, he really assued that whole entire title. But when he takes over, despite all the success that his dad had, the school was on the brink of bankruptcy at this point, right? And he kind of turns it around. 13:57 So, Falwell, Junior. is the yes, the UVA trained lawyer, businessman, real estate developer, who is a smart guy. He knows business. And he had really kept the church and organized religion at arm's length. His younger brother Jonathan was the preacher in the family. But Jerry Junior, he'd gone to Liberty for his undergraduate studies. And he says that, you know, he believes in the teachings of Jesus but rejects a lot of the other stuff that comes with it, including Liberty itself. Jerry Junior never wanted to really be a part of Liberty. And suddenly as he's working in the private sector, the school is about to go under. Jerry Senior has really badly mismanaged the finances and he tells his son that basically the school is on the brink of insolvency. And so, Jerry Junior kind of reluctantly comes aboard and he helps to stabilize everything, and he makes a lot of drastic cuts to the different programs and kind of rejiggers the whole balance sheet operation. And he saves Liberty in a lot of ways that, you know, his father gave him credit for that. And it's interesting though, Julie, that when Jerry Falwell senior dies, it's not an accident that Jerry Junior. takes over. That was the plan of succession. It's notable that here is Jerry Falwell senior, who is both businessman and culture warrior, but also a preacher. And he's got these two sons that exemplify one of each, right? He's got the son who's a preacher. And he's got the other son who's the kind of culture warrior businessman. And he appoints the latter to take over Liberty after he's gone. And that in and of itself, I think, speaks volumes. And then more to the point, Jerry Junior, as you said, he comes in and he tells anybody who will listen, look, I'm not a religious leader, I'm not here charged with the spiritual well-being of this school. I'm here to turn us into a powerhouse, I'm here to turn us into a highly profitable, highly influential organization that can sort of, you know, push back against the forces of secularism in the left in this country. But he doesn't, to his credit, I suppose. Falwell Junior, he doesn't pretend that he's something that he's not. And the irony of it all, Julie is that everybody was fine with it. They were fine with it. Right? They were, as you know, when the money was coming in, and the buildings were going up at a rapid clip, and the endowment was bulging, everybody was fine with it. Because he's Jerry Senior's namesake, and he's a Falwell, and the school is doing great. Clearly God is blessing this project. So, what's not to like? Julie Roys  16:47 Well, and you say everyone was fine with it. And it's true on a public face, everyone was fine with it. I will say I started hearing from a lot of people who weren't fine with it from I mean, obviously the Jane DOE's and now we know about who were victims of sexual assault, and their cases got just horribly mismanaged. In fact, not even reported. And you know, now we have the Department of Education looking into how badly Liberty bungled these cases and violated Title Nine mandates, and they could face like a 30 some million dollar fine, which could be one of the largest ever. So, this was percolating under the surface, but nobody knew about it at the time. And I also talked to a lot of professors who were like, the way this place is being run is abysmal. There's nothing Christian about it. The way the administration handles things, there's nothing Christian about it. And we know too, from some of the people you interviewed, it was less like a religious institution and more like a mafia like a mob boss. Like Jerry turned into I think Jerry is very, he's very likable when you meet him. I mean, obviously very socially gifted, even though he's an introvert. He seems like this kind of your good old boy that, you know, everybody likes. But he began to become very controlling, and lock that place down where Jerry ruled with really an iron fist. And by the time some of the stuff started coming out about him, that place I mean, am I right, that it was a lot less like a Christian institution a lot more like the organized crime syndicate? TIM ALBERTA  18:24 Yeah, well, and listen like this is so Julie. It's funny, because obviously, you and I are in the same line of work. We're coming at this from pretty similar worldviews, and we're having similar conversations, with some of the same people. And you're exactly right when they're using the term family business. You know, Liberty is a family business. They're not just talking about like the Falwell family. There's, you know, the implication there is like very clearly that there is almost a mafioso-esque quality to, you don't cross the Falwell's, the power is concentrated in a few hands here. If you get a seat at the table, you are just lucky to be there and you nod and you know, at one point, I think I make sort of an offhand smart aleck comparison to like the North Korean military where, you know, you stand and salute the dear leader and don't dare step out of line. And of course, that's tragic on a number of levels, one of them being that Liberty has been filled over the years with really good and godly students and good and godly professors who are there for the right reasons. Some of these professors who started to really see the rot from the inside., they chose to stick around because on the one hand, they could see the success around them. The kind of observable material success that you know that the campus is absolutely stunning. Maybe God is doing something really marvelous here and I just have to kind of see my way through this part of it. But I also think that there's a level of devotion, and a feeling for some of these people that they wanted to help right the ship, that they wanted to be a part of the solution. And obviously, those are some of the characters I talk to in the book who now have finally gotten to a breaking point where they say, you know what? I just can't do it anymore. And not only can I not do it anymore, but the world needs to know, the whistle needs to be blown here that like this is not okay. Julie Roys  20:21 What does it say about evangelicalism, Tim, that when the money was coming in, and the money still is coming in, that everybody was okay with how godless this place was? And anybody that was in administration knew and saw it. The Board, who it's astounding to me that when Jerry Falwell Junior, got embroiled in this big sex scandal, and he gets fired, that Jerry Prevo takes over. And we think that that is a change of the guard. This was the man who was the chairman of the board the whole time that Jerry was doing all of this stuff. It's shocking to me, but yet I see it so much in so many different Christian organizations. And so, what is it about us that we're okay with these things, with really what is just absolute rampant hypocrisy? TIM ALBERTA  21:15 I'm afraid that in many ways, we're actually worse than some of those secular institutions. Because of this idea of the prosperity gospel, it's almost become like this proper noun. And so, people feel like well, those are those people are crazy. I'm not one of them, I'm not a part of that, right? But the idea inherent to the prosperity gospel, right is that, well, if you give to the Lord, and if you serve the Lord, if you follow the Lord, then you will be blessed. But that is so conveniently and so easily reverse engineered by a lot of Christians, either at a conscious or at a subconscious level, where when you see any sort of material success around you, you then say, well, clearly, I'm blessed. Clearly, the Lord is blessing this project. And that creates a kind of a permission structure, I think, for a lot of us to then turn a blind eye to things that are very obviously wrong, or kind of downplay things that you otherwise would never downplay. And whether that's an individual church congregation, whether that's a big college campus, whether it's the President of the United States, this can manifest in a lot of different ways. It's so much based on that kind of material thinking that I think we are particularly vulnerable, particularly susceptible to it here in the American church. I think the saddest part about it is that many of us just don't see it, or maybe don't want to see it. I don't know. Julie Roys  22:44 Your book has a stunning quote, stunning quote by a former professor, Dr. Aaron Warner. And he says, and I quote, Jerry, Senior, was always a bit of a scoundrel, and Jerry Junior, perfected the art of using fear and hatred as a growth strategy. Christianity happens to be the thing that they used to build a multibillion-dollar institution. It could have been anything else. It could have been moonshine, but they chose Christianity. And it's gained them a lot of power and a lot of money; the two things these people truly worship. You talked to a lot of people, interviewed a lot of people at Liberty. Is that characterization fair? Or do you think it's a little too harsh? TIM ALBERTA  23:23 It's harsh, that's for sure. It might contain some traces of hyperbole. But I will say this, Aaron Werner is another guy who knows that institution very well. Went there as an undergraduate, has deep longstanding ties to Liberty And the stories he tells from the inside are stunning. One of the other quotes, actually, I thought it might be the one that you're going to read because it kind of runs right along in parallel to that one is from a current professor. Now, at the time of this recording, he's a current professor. My sense is that when the book releases and when this gets back to the administration that he could be dismissed and he's expecting that that will happen. But his name is Nick Olsen, and he's an English professor, very popular English professor there. Brilliant, godly young guy. And he's a legacy at Liberty. His dad was one of the first students at Liberty and a contemporary of Falwell Senior. And Nick has sort of agonized in recent years with this inheritance at Liberty and everything that he's seen and struggled with there. And he says to me, this is not quite verbatim, but he says this to me in the final chapter of the book, he says, Jerry Junior, thought that he was fulfilling his father's vision by assuing spiritual stuff and by building out this massive multibillion dollar like culture warring Republican institution. And he says, and it is heartbreaking, because that's exactly what he's done, and he did fulfill Jerry Senior's vision. And I think that piece of it, Julie is not hyperbole. I think that when you spend enough time digging through the archives and talking to people who were there in the room where it happened, so to speak, it becomes pretty self-evident. And by the way, you know, you mentioned earlier that there are people who will say, Yeah, but you know, Jerry Senior, he really loved the Lord. Yeah, well, these things aren't mutually exclusive. I mean, I'm not suggesting that he didn't love the Lord. But I'm suggesting that like many people who love the Lord, he got his priorities out of whack. And by the way, we are all susceptible to this. But it's very hard to evaluate the history of Liberty University, the decisions made there, the structure of the place and the personnel and how they've treated people and what the benchmarks have been. It's very hard to assess all of that and reach any other conclusion than the one that Nick Olsen reaches at the end of the book. Julie Roys  25:41 And yet Liberty continues to be the largest Christian university in the country. It still has this dominance, there's still a lot of people that I know sending their kids there. And it's heartbreaking to me. I mean, I just wonder at what point do we say enough, and we stand up to this? And I'm glad that people are starting to speak out. But sometimes I wonder if it's too little too late, when we have just these juggernaut organizations and it really has been a marrying of two kingdoms that should be in conflict, and we're trying to say that they can be married together the kingdom of this world, the kingdom, the political realm, and the kingdom of Christ. And Jesus never became a political leader. It's stunning to me some of these quotes that are in your book, that are just like you expect a lightning to fall out of the sky, the way that scripture and Jesus are being misrepresented. It's just so awful. Julie Roys  26:37 In your first section, though, I have to say there's always some redeeming thing in each section, which I'm like, Thank You, Lord. It's like a palate cleanser in a lot of just awful stuff. But you have this beautiful chapter. And it's on a guy, John Dixon, who I actually got to know in my reporting on Ravi Zacharias, because John used to be a speaker for Ravi Zacharias International Ministries. And he was one of those who, you know, pretty early in the game as things were starting to come out, recognized that there were some lies being told by the institution he had been a part of, and he quickly made a break, and he boldly took a stand. I mean, I really respected him for that, that he didn't seem to have this Oh, fear of, if I say something, what's going to happen to me? I mean, he just said what was right, and what was what was true. And now he's at Wheaton College, which is right in my backyard. And what I love is that he's so joyfully on the losing team. You know, we've got all of these people, all these Christians out there telling us we have to be on the winning team, we got to take America back. And here's John Dixon saying, No, we're on the losing team right now. I mean, eventually, when Christ comes back, we'll be you know, he will set things right, and we'll be on the winning team. But for now, we're kind of on the losing team. And it's okay, people. So, talk about John and what we can learn from him and his example, because again, he's from Australia, which is probably about 10 or 15 years ahead of us in sort of this post Christian era that, you know, is beginning to happen here as well. Julie Roys  28:16 And that is so tough for us. I mean, it's not tough for Chinese Christians to get this, right? I mean they get it right away. Because to be a believer means you have to get rid of everything, you can't hold on to anything, you're gonna lose all your power, all your position. But I think we've been, actually it's the curse of being prosperous. And being in a country where Christians have had the majority and where it actually was a plus, probably for my parents to be believers. I think it won't be for my children. But maybe that'll be a good thing. And maybe that's precisely what the church needs. We already think we're being persecuted, which is funny. We really aren't. But we may see it. And right now, I think most of the persecution we're getting is because of what you said that we're not because we're so holy, but because we're actually worse than the world in so many different ways. And we deserve it. TIM ALBERTA  28:16 John is really one of my favorite people I've met in all of the journeys that I was on, and one of my favorite characters in the book for exactly the reasons that you mentioned there. And the fact that he is not an American is, I think, a big part of his perspective, right? But I think also, there's something deeper embedded in the American psyche, about winning, about the need to dominate. I have a funny quote somewhere else in the book from somebody who had spent years living and studying and teaching in Canada, who talks about how Canadians just want fourth place, and then when they get the bronze, they're thrilled. And in America, if you don't get the gold, you're a total loser, right? And so, there's something, you know, about the American Christian experience that's so different. And so, John, one of my favorite scenes in all of this reporting that I did was, we're sitting in the cafeteria there at Wheaton College, surrounded by the flags of the world all around us in the cafeteria. And I say, Why did you come here? Like, really? Why did you come here? And he says, like, this is my mission field now, like the US is my mission field because of this, this stuff. Everything you and I are discussing right now. He said this stuff is like so toxic and so unhealthy. And the church is caught in this terrible pattern. That, by the way, is not new. Right? You go back to Constantine, there has been this obsession with worldly power this inclination to merge two kingdoms into one. So, what we're living through here is not new, in a lot of ways. And I think John is so brilliant in kind of illuminating the appropriate Christian perspective here, which is to say that if you care so much about winning and losing, then the good news is you've already won, right? The tomb is empty, Jesus conquered death, and you believe in him. So therefore, you're already a part of the kingdom. But this place, which is meant to be ephemeral, and unimportant ultimately, and just, you know, a step among the stairs, that if your identity here is wrapped up in winning and losing, then you can't really have your identity there. And he says, ultimately, you know, we're the death and resurrection people. Like losing, and losing well, is a part of the Christian experience. TIM ALBERTA  31:24 John Dixon talks about how there's sort of this inverse relationship historically, between the amount of cultural and social and political power held by Christians in a society and the health of Christianity in that society, right? In other words, when you hold the commanding heights, the Christian influence it actually tends to be pretty weak and pretty corrupted and pretty compromised. When you are at the margins and when you are truly countercultural, the witness thrives. And we've seen that throughout history. Another favorite character of mine in the book, Brian Zahnd, who's the pastor of a church out in Missouri, he talks about how difficult it is for American Christians to really appreciate how the Bible is written from the perspective of the underdog, right? The Hebrew slaves fleeing Egypt, and the first century Christians living under a brutal Roman occupation. Like they had no power, they had no influence. And yet they were so joyful, and they were so content because they had their kingdom, right? And it does give me unease even in my own personal life, just the things I enjoy the materials, the prosperity, the comforts; can I fully appreciate the baby born in a manger? can I fully identify with the vagrant preacher from the ghettos of Nazareth? You know, it's a hard thing. Julie Roys  32:42 And here's the reality; that message, which is Christ's message really doesn't sell well in America. Having your best life now sells in America. And what we're seeing right now, and this, you know, brings me to the second section in your book dealing with power, which again, we've got to take back, America, has become sort of the mantra that we're hearing from so many of these, you know, political rights. And it has just morphed into something where, and again, I said at the outset, I used to be very much politically engaged with the conservative movement. I am not anymore because I can't stomach it and what it's become. I felt like we were being salt. But now it's about dominating and doing it by any means possible, where we just get rid of our morality. And I was always brought up to believe and I think this is what Scripture teaches, that the means is as important as the end. And so, if we achieve a righteous end through an unrighteous means, then we've lost. We've completely lost because we have given up what makes us unique, and what makes us God honoring for something that we're saying is a God honoring, you know end. But again, this is what has happened in our country. And, and what's interesting in this section that just captured my imagination. I mean, I've wondered this, like, you take a Robert Jeffress, right? This guy's not dumb. He's a smart Southern Baptist preacher, clearly a savvy guy. He has built this mega church, but the things that came out of his mouth, especially when Trump was in power, but it's still there. The things that come out of his mouth, and I think, he's got to know that this is not in line with the Gospels. He's got to see this. And yet, publicly, you wouldn't hear that. But when you met with him privately, you began to hear some doubt in there and allowing you to see a little bit of vulnerability, although it didn't seem to last all that long. But talk about that, because I'm not sensing much doubt in the masses that follow these men. But when you get them one on one, tell me what you see. TIM ALBERTA  34:50 And it's not just Robert Jeffress, Greg Locke, Greg Locke, Ralph Reed. Yeah, yeah, a lot of these guys. It's the pastor who in my hometown, grew his church tenfold by basically turning Sunday morning worship services into Fox news segments. And giving a Nazi salute to Gretchen Whitmer from his pulpit. I mean, but then you get them one on one. And you press them a little bit. I mean, you know, politely, respectfully, but you press them. Suddenly, they not only back off a little bit, but they do a little bit of like winking and nodding at you to basically say, like, you're right, I'm definitely putting on a bit of a song and dance here for the masses. But I think that they will ultimately justify it by saying, Well, yeah, but look at all these people who are coming in and look at the opportunity, we have to reach them now with the gospel? So, you know, those ends really do justify the means. I think the problem with that, as you hinted it, is but look, I mean, there's a lot of problems with it. You know, Mark 8:36 is not a rhetorical question, right? Like, what does it profit a man to gain the whole world yet forfeit his soul? But I think for some of these people, some of these leaders, the thing that really grates at me and I know it grates at you, Julie, is like, they're the shepherds, they're the ones who are supposed to know better, because a lot of their flock, you know, and I'm not being condescending or patronizing when I say this, they don't necessarily know better, they are the sheep, right? They need to be shepherded. And instead of shepherding, a lot of these people have just themselves become wolves. And they become wolves for what? So that you can have a seat at the table? So that you can get on Fox News? So that you can raise some money? So that for what ultimately? You're so right, when you press them on it almost to a person, they will acknowledge at some level that what they're doing is kind of gross, and kind of anti-biblical, and then they just keep on doing it. Julie Roys  36:46 So, speak to the person who is listening. And we probably don't have a ton of these. But there may be some who are listening, who have bought this hook, line, and sinker that we do need to take America back. And Franklin Graham told us it's all for the Supreme Court justices, and we got the Supreme Court justices and Roe v. Wade was just overturned and, you know, look at what was accomplished. So, you know, politics is a dirty business, Tim. I mean, come on, if we're gonna win in politics, which, you know, we're talking about babies here, babies are being slaughtered left and right. And then, you know, some of these people would allow a baby to be born alive and kill it. You know, that's who these people are. So, I mean, come on. This is the world we live in, and we've got to fight the way that the world fights. What do you say? TIM ALBERTA  37:35 I'd say a couple of things. I think you can go round and round about Roe v. Wade, and about Trump and about Supreme Court justices. But be careful what you wish for in this space. Because the fact of the matter is that Roe v Wade fell, and the total number of abortions in this country went up. I live in Michigan, where prior to Roe v Wade falling, there were pretty tight abortion restrictions in Michigan. Now, it is the wild west. It is some of the most liberalized abortion laws in the country. And that is true in seven or eight other states that have had ballot initiatives passed since Roe v. Wade, dramatically liberalizing abortion laws, and it's going to happen in a number of other states next year. So, let's be really clear eyed and fact based when we talk about what our political involvement does and what it doesn't do. At the end of the day, if you want to win hearts and minds to stop the scourge of abortion, if you are a Christian, and you view this as your great crusade, then is voting for a candidate or putting a bumper sticker on your car, is that the way to win those hearts and minds? Because the fact is, if American evangelicals had put a fraction of the energy into the social side of abortion, of doing the hard work in the clinics, and helping the single mothers and doing the foster care that is needed to address this at its root, if they had been willing to do that over the last 50 years, my guess is that public opinion would be dramatically different as it pertains to abortion. And we wouldn't even be talking about Roe v. Wade, because the number of abortions would be so low in this country that it wouldn't even register. But we've sort of self-selected into this alternate universe where politicians are our savior, and that politics is the mechanism by which we right the wrongs in this country. And I'm sorry, but if you are citizens of another kingdom?, then you can't possibly believe that. You can't possibly believe that Donald Trump or that any other politician is the person who's going to ultimately right these great moral wrongs. But unfortunately, I think that's the trap we've fallen into. Julie Roys  39:51 You know, I used to be very involved in the prolife movement. I will say, almost all of the people that I knew when I was involved in the pro-life movement, were actually involved in reaching out to single moms and caring for them and caring for their unborn children. But I think what we've forgotten so much is that politics is downstream of culture. So, if you're losing the culture, which we clearly are to change the politics, if you've got a kid that's rebellious, a teenager who's rebellious in your home, locking down all the windows and the doors in your house, that's not going to keep your kid from sinning. What's going to keep your kid from sinning, is if you can winsomely love your child into relationship with Jesus Christ and to want to be like you and to want to adopt your values. But we've forgotten about that, we've become this, you know, Midas right. And I remember in 2016, writing a commentary, The Rise of Trump, The Fall of Evangelicalism, and I said, we may win this one, but we will lose in the long run, if we throw our convictions out the window, and we alienate everyone around us, by our you know, the way that we talk and the way that we relate to people. This is not how you win people to the Lord. That fell on, you know, really deaf ears. It actually lost me some key supporters too. But I just was stunned because I did not know who these people were that I thought believed the same way that I did and had the same values. And then I went, Wow, we are just on different planets, we really don't have that. Julie Roys  41:29 I want to look at one person, again, you have these palate cleansers within all of these sections. And one of them to me is Cal Thomas, who was very much a part of the right and so I can relate to that, because that was I mean, I used to be emceeing the banquet to raise money for you know, the political cause, or whatever it was. I don't do that anymore. Cal Thomas doesn't do that anymore. What changed Cal? TIM ALBERTA  41:58 It's so funny, Julie, because just a minute ago, when you were talking about what are the weapons of our warfare? I was thinking about Cal., because Cal for those who don't know his story, you know, he was Jerry Falwell Senior's lieutenant in the Moral Majority. And he was their spokesman for the Moral Majority. And the vice president of that organization, and, you know, was really heavily involved in the kind of crusading era of the Religious Right, he was a central figure. And then Cal really started to feel uneasy with what he was seeing around him. And he doesn't even sugarcoat it. We have this very raw conversation in the book where he talks about, you know, the corruption and the greed and the grift. And how he just couldn't justify it. He justified it for a while by saying, Well, look how many people we're reaching, and look at all this money coming in. So clearly, you know, God must be doing something here. And then he eventually just gets to a point where he says, No, this is a scam. It's just immoral. And he finally walks away. And then years later, he writes this book called Blinded by Might, where he kind of tries to atone. And he just says, Listen, I was a total believer in winning the culture war to protect Christian America, as you know, part of our duty, you know, to God's kingdom. And in fact, not only has it failed, but it has backfired spectacularly, that we have driven away so many people who need Jesus, but who won't have anything to do with us anymore, They won't even let us in the door to have a conversation because of the way we've treated them because of the way we've treated the culture. So, to your point about locking down the teenager in the house, right? Cal really eloquently and powerfully was giving voice to this when he wrote that book. And then, you know, in our interviews for this book, he's an older guy now he's 80. And he's looking back with such regret on those years and thinking about how did he in some way contribute to laying the groundwork for Trump ism as this kind of sub cult in the evangelical world. And what's most interesting to me from that whole conversation, and I said this to him, is that the more things have changed, the more they've stayed the exact same. I mean, this break that he's describing in the 1980s. And this kind of crisis of conscience that he's feeling is exactly what we're trying to address today. What I'm trying to address in the book now, which is that, listen, it doesn't have to be this way. You have a choice, right? We all have a choice. It was so incredibly unpleasant for me to write this book in a lot of ways, Julie. If I'm being totally honest, I probably couldn't have written it while my dad was still alive. It would have been too hard. Like I've had some people writing me emails this past week saying, oh, like thank you for your courage. Thank you for your brave, I don't feel courageous. I don't feel brave. I feel like a coward in a lot of ways that it took me so long and that a lot of ways took my dad dying and having those experiences at his funeral to finally be willing to acknowledge and use my platform, my relatively high profile journalistically speaking to address this thing that has been so clearly wrong for such a long time. And so, for anybody listening, whether it's in your individual congregation, your faith community, your family, whatever it is like, it doesn't have to be this way. And it takes people like Cal Thomas, kind of blowing up his own life, blowing up his tribal affiliations and walking away. It takes Pastor Brian Zahnd, who I write about in Chapter 15, who had a mega church of 5000 people, and they were making money hand over fist. And then he just woke up one day and had this like epiphany from the Lord that it was all wrong, and that it was so shallow, and it was doing such a disservice to the Gospel. And he blew up his mega church. He's got like 150 people who come every Sunday now and the sanctuary seats like 2000. And he made a choice, right? Cal Thomas made a choice. You've made a choice, Julie. And I just think like, at the end of the day, the people who make that choice and who decide to reckon with what this has become? I don't think they're going to regret it. I really don't. Julie Roys  46:05 I have not regretted it once being free of the whole evangelical industrial complex as it's called, and just being free to follow your conscience without thinking, what are the consequences if I speak the truth publicly? Like what's going to happen to me? Like I see so many Christians just living in fear that if they speak out, or they tell the truth that they know that something, you know, there will be bad consequences for me, and it just makes me wonder, do we believe the gospel, like do we believe the gospel? What gospel are we living on day-to-day basis? And I love Pastor Zahnd's story that was like one of my favorite stories. And it reminded me of the book because I just interviewed Scott McKnight and Laura Behringer and their book pivot, which talks about similar things, other churches that realized church is toxic. It's huge, it's successful, but I feel empty inside, you know, and I feel thin, and they made that pivot. And it may be to smaller church, it may be and it's interesting, though, you were saying how Zahnd's church is now starting to maybe even start to grow and become a little bit healthier. And so, when I hear that I say, it's going to take a while. But in this, you know, these ashes, do you see something growing that's beautiful there that can replace this ugliness that quite frankly, I think I just think it's doomed. I think it's coming down. I don't know that it will come down quickly. This complex that we've built, but I think it will come down eventually. It may take decades. But I think there will be a Christianity I hope this was my prayer that replaces it. And it's more organic and more Grassroots less big leadership and more the Body of Christ. TIM ALBERTA  47:48 Yes,  I do see something rising from the ashes. I can sense it, particularly among the younger generation. One of the things that consistently surprised me in all of my reporting, and it was a pleasant surprise, to be clear, was spending time with younger believers. They ideologically, culturally, politically, like they're really no different from their parents, like they check those boxes on paper. But then you kind of get into some of this with them. And they want nothing to do with Trumpism. They want nothing to do with Charlie Kirk, and I'm talking about like the serious believers. I'm not talking about like the very casual kids who identify as Christian, but then go to a Turning Point USA event. I mean, like, you spend time around Liberty, and like, yes, there are some MAGA kids at Liberty. But most of the kids you spend time with  at Liberty, including those who would self-identify as like, sure I guess on paper, I would be a Republican, because of abortion because of other issues, they will really eloquently and gracefully speak to these schisms. And they're so perceptive. I think that's the big thing, Julie, is that they can see it. Right? My generation, I kind of think of us as like the children of the Moral Majority. And we can now very clearly diagnose this in a way that my dad's generation probably couldn't, they were too close to it. They were too wrapped up in it. And I think, you know, in some ways, they almost I kind of tend to maybe just give them a little bit of a pass for that because they didn't have the appropriate distance to really assess it and analyze it in the way that I think I'm able to, and certainly in the way that the generations behind me are able to. They see what this is doing to the church, and they are saying no, thank you. Even at my home church, the guy who took over for my dad, almost run out of the place. He came very close to just quitting because it got so bad for him because he hears this young guy taking over this, this mega church congregation in a very conservative Republican community. And he's not particularly a conservative Republican. He's not like some big Democrat either. He's just a guy who like loves Jesus and who processes news events through the eyes of like the gospel, right? What's so interesting is that he lost a ton of his congregation. And then this past summer, I went back for the first time since my dad's funeral, and the place was packed, and I didn't recognize anybody there. And he comes out and gives this sort of fire and brimstone sermon, challenging them on the culture wars, challenging them on like, where are your priorities, really? What kingdom do you really belong to? And so that actually, I didn't aim to end the book on that optimistic note, but I was so encouraged by it, because it makes me think that in this market of supply and demand that you and I have talked about, and mostly we focused on the perverted nature of the supply and demand, that there is also maybe more demand out there than we realize for that true, pure form of the gospel. And so that is my hope, moving forward, and particularly with these younger Christians, who will demand something better than what we've seen so far. Julie Roys  50:53 I loved that I don't often read the epilogue, but in your book I did. And that was beautiful to read about Pastor Winans and the way that, you know, you kind of left them in the early chapters really disillusioned and discouraged. And then he comes back invigorated for the gospel, and preaching it so boldly and that really, pastors like that give me hope. And I know that there's probably a lot more of them than I encounter in you know, the line of work that I do, which usually means I hear about the worst of the worst all the time. Julie Roys  51:28 Let me just ask you about this most of your chapters are about political power and about the way that these kingdoms  and the power has sort of become an idolatrous thing. And then you turn your eye to corruption going on in the church and the abuse, the abuse in the Southern Baptist Convention, how that's been addressed recently, how Rachel den Hollander stood up to it and she went, you know, most people I'm sure listening know Rachel's story. But you know, one of the first gymnasts who came forward and told her story about Larry Nasser, and how he had abused so much of the, you know, US Olympic gymnasts team. And she went from being just Joan of Arc, I think you call it to being Jezebel, right? Or from Esther to Jezebel, because she spoke out about the evil in the church. And that's what I found. When I was at Moody Radio I was allowed to speak about Joel Osteen, right? Or I was allowed to speak about the liberals in politics. But when I turned my critique on our own tribe, man, I would get shut down, you know. That's one of the reasons I left Moody besides the others that I talked about. I couldn't speak out about the evil in our own house. And I feel that at this point, we have no moral platform as Christians to be speaking about the evil out in the world anymore, until we deal with the evil in our own house and the way that it's crept in. You know, judgment begins with the house of God. He doesn't expect, you know, the people who don't know him, to act any differently than they're acting, but He expects us to, and we're not. So, I appreciated that you put this chapter in the book, dealing with some of the abuse and the corruption within the church. But you could have easily left it out and just talked about the way that politics has, you know, really usurped the gospel. Why did you put this chapter in? TIM ALBERTA  53:28 One of the things that really bugs me, is how the New Testament model here and you were just alluding to this a moment ago. The New Testament model is not ambiguous. We are to treat outsiders with unlimited grace and kindness and compassion and forgiveness, because they don't know God, and they don't know any better. That is clear. And what is also clear is that we are to treat the insiders with the utmost accountability, and they are to be held to the highest standard because they do know God, and they do know better. That is the New Testament model. And we in the American church have completely flipped it. We have nothing but hostility, and animus and enmity towards the outside world. And we practice nothing but grace and forgiveness and cheap grace and cheap forgiveness inside the church. Right? And it drives me a little bit nuts. Because if you are the person out there in the world, who is sort of curious about Jesus, and you feel something missing in your life, what are the odds today that you're going to go to a local church and try to learn a little bit more? I mean, you know, you might say, Well, some people will, some people do Sure. But the statistics here don't lie, Julie. Like when you look back 30 or 40 years, the perception of the church among unbelievers in this country was incredibly positive. People who did not know Jesus looked at the church as a beacon of moral rectitude, of compassion, of social good. Even if they were never going to sit in the pews with us, even if they didn't believe any of the doctrine, they respected the church and they admire the church. And that has completely changed. It's just completely fallen apart. There are some people who will tell you like Robert Jeffers and I go back and forth on this in the book, he said, Well, that it doesn't matter, right? Those people aren't looking for the Lord. I completely disagree. I think the credibility of the church matters enormously. TIM ALBERTA  55:37 To your question of why did I feel compelled to include that chapter? Well, who's going to hold the church accountable? Is the church going to hold itself accountable? No, I mean, typically, institutions are not very good at self-policing. We know that from working in journalism, right? By the way, the media is not very good at self-policing. Actually, I could argue the media is terrible at self-policing. I mean, any big institution, it can't be expected to hold itself accountable. Okay, so what are the mechanisms for accountability here? If we care about the Bride of Christ, if we care about the credibility of the church, if we care about how the outside world perceives the church, which I think matters enormously, then what do we do to ensure that the church is on the up and up and is doing its duty before God and it's carrying out its purpose and its mission? You know, journalism has to play a role in that. I think, you know, the law has to play a role in that. I think that there are external forces, even, you know, gasp secular forces that have to play a role in that, because otherwise, we just leave these churches, these pastors to their own devices. And I'm sorry, but you don't need to read any other source then the Bible itself. You pick up the Bible itself, read from Old Testament to new and see how well that works out. We see it time and again. I there are not accountability structures in place, then things go very badly, very quickly. And so that's a long answer to your question. Julie Roys  57:06 Hmm. Well, I appreciate that. And I appreciate your book. And I know you're getting interviews all over the country. I saw you on CBS, Good Morning America; that was so exciting to see but really wonderful that you've gotten this platform to winsomely speak to the rest of society who I remember a couple of times, I got to be on NPR. They would ask me about evangelicalism, and they are always amazed, I think that I could even string two sentences together. And I was actually an evangelical right? But I am so thrilled that you are representing evangelicals because you're a face that and I don't know, do you still identify as Evangelical? TIM ALBERTA  57:49 not really, I don't fight the label, but I would not volunteer it for myself just because of exactly what we just described, you know. Somebody outside the church hears it, and they quickly shut down the conversation, because they don't really want anything to do with you. Julie Roys  58:01 I don't know if I would take that term, either. I'm kind of where you are, as well. But you're a Christian, and you love Jesus. And even when I heard you in that one interview recently said, How's your faith? and you're like, it's as strong as it's ever been. I thank you for that and for your witness, and for this book, and for giving me so much of your time. I really appreciate it. So, thank you, TIM ALBERTA  58:21 Thank you for all that you're doing. And thank you for saying that. It's very kind of you. We're ultimately playing some small part here in trying to get this thing back on track and doing it as humbly as possible. I hope that we can make a difference. Thank you for having me on. And I know that we'll continue to talk. Julie Roys  58:39 Absolutely. And thanks so much for listening to The Roys Report, a podcast dedicated to reporting the truth and restoring the church. I'm Julie Roys. And just a quick reminder, if you'd like a copy of Tim Alberta's book, The Kingdome, The Power, and The Glory, we'd be happy to send you one for a gift of $50 or more to The Roys Report this month. Again, we don't have any large donors or advertising, we simply have you, the people who care about exposing evil and restoring the church. So, if you'd like to support our work and get Tim's book, just go to JULIEROYS.COM/DONATE. Also, I want to let you know that next week, I'll be releasing another talk from the RESTORE conference. This one is by veteran church planter Lance Ford, who gave an amazing talk on the Christian addiction to leadership and why it's so toxic. I love this talk and I think you will too. So be watching for that. We'll release the talk as both an audio podcast and as a video at my YouTube channel. Also, just a quick reminder to subscribe to The Roys Report on Apple podcast, Google podcasts or Spotify. That way you'll never miss an episode. And while you're at it, I'd really appreciate it if you'd help us spread the word about the podcast by leaving a review. And then please share the podcast on social media. So, more people can hear about this great content. Again, thanks so much for joining me today hope you are blessed and encouraged. Read more

Conspiracy theories, political idolatry, church divisions, and pastoral burnout. How do we explain what's happened to the evangelical movement in America? Tim Alberta is a political journalist and staff writer for The Atlantic. His new book, “The Power, the Glory, and the Kingdom,” looks at how evangelicalism lost its way. As an evangelical himself, Alberta says fear and greed created the conditions for extremism to take over the movement. Also this week, surprising data after the Dobbs decision shows birthrates are up in states that banned abortion, but overall abortion rates nationwide are also higher. And should we use ChatGPT to interpret the Bible? Kaitlyn's new article says probably not.   Holy Post Plus Extended Tim Alberta Interview https://www.patreon.com/posts/94152371 0:00 - Intro   1:25 - Show starts   2:13 - Theme Song   2:35 - Sponsor - Faithful Counseling - Get 10% off your first month at www.FaithfulCounseling.com/HOLYPOST   3:45 - Are abortion rates increasing or decreasing    26:25 - Should AI interpret Scripture   48:13 - Sponsor - Sundays Dog Food - Get 35% off your first order of Sundays. Go to www.SundaysForDogs.com/HOLYPOST or use code HOLYPOST at checkout.    49:25 - Sponsor - Blueland - Get 30% off your first order by going to www.blueland.com/HOLYPOST   50:38 - Interview Intro   55:20 - What made evangelicals feel under siege   1:06:00 - Pervasive greed   1:13:00 - How Trumpism is impacting the local church   1:30:06 - End Credits Links mentioned in news segment:   Our abortion video from 2020 - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvWD7ykNjCc   ‎The Daily: Ending Roe Was Supposed to Reduce Abortions. It Didn't. on Apple Podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-daily/id1200361736?i=1000636899810   Why Do We Want AI to Interpret Scripture? https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2023/december/ai-artificial-intelligence-interpret-scripture-bible.html ‎ Other resources:   The Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory: American Evangelicals in an Age of Extremism by Tim Alberta - https://amzn.to/418LPNb   Holy Post website: https://www.holypost.com/   Holy Post Plus: www.holypost.com/plus   Holy Post Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/holypost   Holy Post Merch Store: https://www.holypost.com/shop The Holy Post is supported by our listeners. We may earn affiliate commissions through links listed here. As an Amazon Associate, we earn from qualifying purchases.  

What did we learn about the culture wars? What's providing us with hope? And, what's coming next on The Cartographers? We'd love it if you rated and reviewed the show. Share an episode with a friend! Other episodes in this series: Episode 1: Stuck in the Middle Episode 2: How'd we Get Stuck in the Middle? Episode 3: A Culture War Alternative with Mark Labberton Episode 4: Agent of Grace or Culture War Victim with Dan Darling Episode 5: What if Culture Wars are your Work? with Pete Wehner Episode 6: Beauty as an Antidote to the Culture Wars with Susannah Black Roberts Episode 7: The Burning House of American Evangelicalism with Brandon Washington Episode 8: Humor Deflates the Culture Wars with Harrison Scott Key The Cartographers is a production of Willowbrae Institute. Find out more at willowbrae.org. Be sure to signup for Willowbrae's newsletter. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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By now, we're all familiar with the tragic events happening in the Middle East. We are shocked and deeply grieved by the events of October 7, 2023. And like many others, we've recently found ourselves perplexed by some of the reactions of supporters on both sides. In this episode, Keith and Patrick aren't seeking to weigh in on this political, international situation, nor are they offering a detailed history of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Today, they address one specific question: Does the Bible require Christians to support the nation-state of Israel? Listen as they walk through American Evangelicalism's historical support of the Israeli state. They provide biblical context for this way of thinking, then dive into its roots in dispensationalism and End Times Theology. They examine what the Bible really means when it comes to Abraham's modern-day descendants and offer a truly biblical way for Christians to think about this international war. Listen now! Have you benefitted personally from Truth Over Tribe or seen it have a positive effect on someone you know? have you used the podcast, book, or blog as a catalyst for conversation on polarizing topics? We want to hear about it! Share your story at choosetruthovertribe.com/story. Ok, truth time... Did you like this episode? Tell us by leaving a rating or review!