Podcast appearances and mentions of Johnny Carson

Brian Noonan, Wally Podrazik, Justin Kulovsek and Chris Pokorny (the museum exhibit team) join WGN Radio's (and MBC chair, president and CEO) Dave Plier to talk about the new exhibits at the Museum of Broadcast Communications: “Johnny Carson: The Centennial,” “The Evolution of Late Night,” Antenna TV's “I Dream of Jeannie” 65th anniversary, “Bozo's Circus” […]

This episode was originally released on 9/1/2020. While new episodes of Breaking Walls are on hiatus I'll be going back and posting the older episodes. ____________ In Breaking Walls episode 107, we go back to school with the Nelson family and find out why David and Ricky joined the program, and how it affected the entertainment industry forever. —————————— Highlights: • Oswald George Nelson—Boy from New Jersey • The Ukulele Craze and the Boy scout Jamboree • Ozzie Starts a Band • Splitting Time Between Football and Music • Cleaning Up Around Town • On the Banks of the Old Raritan • Law School and WMCA • Ozzie Nelson and His Orchestra Gets on Radio • Ozzie Meet Harriet • Harriet Hilliard—One Heck of a Talent • Harriet Joins the Band • Joe Penner and Robert Ripley • Getting Married—Harriet Becomes a Film Star • Touring—David and Eric Are Born • Red Skelton • The Adventures of Ozzie and Harriet is Born • Changing Networks in 1948 • Jack Benny Jumps to CBS—David and Ricky Join the Show • Finding Their Groove as a Family • ABC and a Ten-Year Contract • Here Come The Nelsons to Television • Looking Ahead to Halloween —————————— The WallBreakers: http://thewallbreakers.com Subscribe to Breaking Walls everywhere you get your podcasts. To support the show: http://patreon.com/TheWallBreakers —————————— The reading material used in today's episode was: • On the Air — By John Dunning • Ozzie — By Ozzie Nelson • Network Radio Ratings, 1932-53 — By Jim Ramsburg • Before Television — By Glenhall Taylor • As well as articles from the archives of Broadcasting Magazine, Sponsor Magazine, Radio Daily, and Radio Mirror. —————————— On the interview front: • Ozzie Nelson spoke with: Johnny Carson, Chuck Cecil, and James Day • Ricky Nelson spoke with Johnny Carson and David Hartman • David Nelson spoke with David Hartman, and KRLA • Jack Wagner and Johnny Hayes were also with KRLA • While Harriet Nelson spoke with David Hartman and Chuck Schaden • Chuck Schaden also interviewed Jack Benny, Lurene Tuttle and Janet Waldo Hear these chats and others from Chuck's forty-year career at SpeakingOfRadio.com —————————— Selected music featured in today's episode was: • Theme from A Summer Place — By The Ventures • Colorado Trail — From Stephen Ives' The West • On The Banks of the Old Raritan — By The Rutgers Alma Mater Choir • Auld Lang Syne — By the Manhattan Strings • Dream a Little Dream of Me and Jersey Bounce — By Ozzie Nelson and His Orchestra • Get Thee Behind Me Satan — By Harriet Hilliard Nelson • I Will Follow You — By Ricky Nelson • The Haunted House Boogie — By Jack Rivers and Happy Wilson

Can I buy a vowel?! Welcome to an all new episode of pcmc. Your one-stop-shop for pop culture musings, celebrations, and ephemera! On today's show, host Mike Bongiorno is joined by Vin Forte, and they dive into the dark and desperate world of failed late-night talk shows. Today's subject: The Pat Sajak Show (1989). This show ran for one season before being put to sleep like an old sick dog. Pat Sajak is mostly known to the world as the long-time host of the game show Wheel of Fortune, but in the late 80s CBS (trying to compete with Johnny Carson) decided to make him the face of their late-night offering. It did not go well. Mike and Vin go through the first episode of the show with a fine-tooth comb, looking at what works (not a lot) and what doesn't (most of it) and figure out why this show failed so spectacularly. Come back next week for more talk show talk. If you like this show, please share it with everyone you know! find us everywhere @PCMCpod 

In this impactful and inspiring episode of Unstoppable Mindset, host Michael Hingson sits down with Ronald Cocking—performer, educator, and co-founder of the Looking Glass Studio of Performing Arts—to reflect on a remarkable life shaped by rhythm, resilience, and love. Ron's journey into the performing arts began at just five years old, when his passion for tap dance ignited a lifelong commitment to dance and musical theater. From his first professional role at age 15 in My Fair Lady to founding one of Southern California's most impactful arts schools, Ron's story is one of dedication, creativity, and community.   But perhaps the most moving part of Ron's story is his 49-year partnership—both personal and professional—with the late Gloria McMillan, best known as Harriet Conklin from Our Miss Brooks. Together, they created a legacy of mentorship through the Looking Glass Studio, where they taught thousands of students across generations—not just how to act, sing, or dance, but how to live with confidence and integrity.   Ron also reflects on the legacy Gloria left behind, his continued involvement in the arts, and the words of wisdom that guide his life:   “Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.” “To find happiness, take the gifts God has given you and give them away.”   This is more than a story of a career in the arts—it's a touching tribute to passion, partnership, and purpose that will leave you inspired.   Highlights:   00:48 – Hear how early radio at home shaped a lifetime love for performance. 03:00 – Discover why drumming and tap both trained his ear for rhythm. 06:12 – Learn how a tough studio change led to ballet, jazz, and tumbling basics. 08:21 – See the “sing with your feet” method that makes tap click for students. 10:44 – Find out how a teen chorus role in My Fair Lady opened pro doors. 13:19 – Explore the drum-and-tap crossover he performed with Leslie Uggams. 15:39 – Learn how meeting Gloria led to a studio launched for $800. 18:58 – Get the long view on running a school for 44 years with family involved. 23:46 – Understand how Our Miss Brooks moved from radio to TV with its cast intact. 32:36 – See how 42nd Street proves the chorus can be the star. 41:51 – Hear why impact matters more than fame when students build careers. 43:16 – Learn what it takes to blend art and business without losing heart. 45:47 – Compare notes on marriage, teamwork, and communication that lasts. 48:20 – Enjoy a rare soft-shoe moment Ron and Gloria performed together. 56:38 – Take away the “teach to fish” approach that builds lifelong confidence.   About the Guest:   My father was a trumpet player, thus I heard music at home often in the early 50's and was always impressed and entertained by the rhythms and beats of Big Band music… especially the drummers.  Each time I would see Tap dancers on TV, I was glued to the screen.  It fascinated me the way Tap dancers could create such music with their feet!   In 1954, at age 5, after begging my Mom and Dad to enroll me in a Tap class, my Dad walked in from work and said “Well, you're all signed up, and your first Tap class is next Tuesday.  I was thrilled and continued studying tap and many other dance forms and performing and teaching dance for all of my life.     In my mid teens, I became serious about dancing as a possible career.  After seeing my first musical, “The Pajama Game” starring Ruth Lee, I new I wanted to do musical theatre.  I got my first professional opportunity at age 15 in “My Fair Lady” for the San Bernardino Civic Light Opera Association and loved every minute of it… and would continue performing for this organization well into my 30's   I met Gloria McMillan in the late 60's while choreographing a summer musical for children.  Gloria's daughter was doing the role of Dorothy in “The Wizard of Oz”.  Then, about 3 or 4 years later I would meet Gloria again and the sparks flew.  And, yes, she was Gloria McMillan of “Our Miss Brooks” fame on both radio and television.  Wow, was I blessed to have crossed paths with her.  We shared our lives together for 49 years.   On November 4, 1974, Gloria and I opened a performing arts school together named “The Looking Glass Studio of Performing Arts”.  We would teach and manage the school together for 44 years until we retired on June 30, 2018.  We moved to Huntington Beach, California and spent 3 beautiful years together until she left to meet our Lord in heaven on January 19, 2022.   Ways to connect with Ron:   Lgsparon@aol.com     About the Host:   Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening!   Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast   If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset .   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review   Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.       Transcription Notes:   Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:20 Well, hi there, wherever you are and wherever you happen to be today. Welcome to unstoppable mindset. I'm your host, Mike hingson, and today we get to chat with Ron Cocking, who is Ron. Well, we're going to find out over the next hour. And Ron was married for many years to another person who is very famous, and we'll get to that, probably not as well known to what I would probably describe as the younger generation, but you're going to get to learn a lot about Ron and his late wife before we're done, and I am sure we're going to have a lot of fun doing it. So let's get to it. Ron, welcome to unstoppable mindset. We're glad you're here.   Ron Cocking ** 01:59 Thank you. I'm so glad to be here. Michael, this. I've been looking forward to this.   Michael Hingson ** 02:04 I have been as well, and we're going to have a lot of fun doing it.   Ron Cocking ** 02:08 Do you one note on that last name? It is cocking. Cocking, he comes right? Comes from a little townlet in the coal mining country of England called Cockington.   Michael Hingson ** 02:20 I don't know why I keep saying that, but yeah, cocky, no   02:23 problem.   Michael Hingson ** 02:24 Well, do you go up to the reps recreations at all?   Ron Cocking ** 02:28 Oh my gosh, Gloria. And I know you and Gloria, did do you still do it? I've it's on my schedule for September.   Michael Hingson ** 02:35 I'm gonna miss it this year. I've got a speech to give. So I was going to be playing Richard diamond at recreation. Well, I'll have to be Dick Powell another time, but I thought that you you were still doing   02:50 it. I'm planning on it cool.   Michael Hingson ** 02:53 Well, tell us about the early Ron cocking and kind of growing up in some of that stuff. Let's start with that.   Ron Cocking ** 02:59 Well, the early part of my story was when I was born just a little before television came in, before everyone had a TV in their home. How old are you now? If I maybe, you know, I am now 76   Michael Hingson ** 03:12 Okay, that's what I thought. Yeah, you're one year ahead of me. I'm 75   Ron Cocking ** 03:16 I was born in 49 and so my earliest remembrances my mom and dad and my brother and I lived with our grandfather, and we had no television, but we had this big it must have been about three to four foot tall, this big box on the floor in a very prominent spot in the living room. And that was the Sunday afternoon entertainment. I remember my family sitting around, and I listened and I laughed when they did, but I had no idea what was going on, but that was the family gathering. And just, I know we'll talk about it later, but I I just have this notion that at that time I was laughing, not knowing what I was laughing at, but I bet I was laughing at my future   Michael Hingson ** 04:02 wife, yes, yes, but other things as well. I mean, you probably laughed at Jack Benny and Amos and Andy and   Ron Cocking ** 04:09 yeah, I remember listening to all those folks, and it was just amazing. Then when television came about and my father was a trumpet player, and I loved his trumpet playing, and he practiced often at home. He would sit in his easy chair and play some tunes and scales and that sort of thing. But what captured my ear and my eyes when I went to on rare occasions when I could go to his engagements, it was always the drummer that just stuck out to me. I was mesmerized by the rhythms that they could produce. And when TV came about, I remember the old variety shows, and they often would have tap dancers like. Had a stair gene, Kelly, Peg Leg Bates and the Nicholas brothers, and I just, I was just taken back by the rhythms. It sounded like music to me. The rhythms just made me want to do it. And so I started putting that bug in my parents ears. And I waited and waited. I wanted to take tap dance lessons. And one day, my dad walks in the back door, and I said, Dad, have you signed me up yet? And he said, Yep, you start next Tuesday at 330 in the afternoon. So I was overjoyed, and I went in for my first lesson. And mind you, this was a private tap class. Total Cost of $1.25 and we had a pianist for music, no record player, live piano, wow. And so I, I rapidly fell in love with tap dance.   Michael Hingson ** 05:56 And so you did that when you weren't in school. Presumably, you did go to school.   Ron Cocking ** 06:00 Oh, yeah, I did go to school. Yeah, I did well in school, and I enjoyed school. I did all the athletics. I played little league, and eventually would be a tennis player and water polo and all that stuff. But all through the years, after school was on the way to the dance classes.   Michael Hingson ** 06:16 So you graduated, or I suppose I don't want to insult drumming, but you graduated from drumming to tap dancing, huh?   Ron Cocking ** 06:24 Well, I kept doing them both together. I would dance, and then when my dad would practice, I would beg him to just play a tune like the St Louis Blues, yeah, and so that I could keep time, so I pulled a little stool up in front of an easy chair, and one of the arms of the chair was the ride cymbal, and the other one was the crash cymbal, and the seat of the chair was my snare drum. I would play along with him. And eventually he got tired of that and bought a Hi Fi for my brother and I, and in the bedroom I had a Hi Fi, and I started to put together a set of drums, and I spent hours next to that, Hi Fi, banging on the drums, and I remember it made me feel good. One day, my mom finally said to me, you know, you're starting to sound pretty good, and that that was a landmark for me. I thought, wow, somebody is enjoying my drumming,   Michael Hingson ** 07:18 but you couldn't do drumming and tap dancing at the same time. That would have been a little bit of a challenge. A challenge.   Ron Cocking ** 07:23 No, I would practice that the drums in the afternoon and then head for the dance studio later. And in this case, I was a local boy. I grew up in Riverside California, and my first tap teacher was literally maybe two miles from our house. But that didn't last long. She got married and became pregnant and closed her studio, and then I she recommended that I go see this teacher in San Bernardino by the name of Vera Lynn. And which I did, I remember walking into this gigantic classroom with a bunch of really tall kids, and I was maybe seven or eight years old, and I guess it was kind of an audition class, but after that evening, I she put me in the most appropriate classes, one of which was ballet, which I wasn't too excited about, but they all told me, If you're going to be a serious dancer, even a tap dancer, you need to get the basic body placement from ballet classes. And I said, Well, I am not going to put any tights and a T shirt on. But they finally got me to do that because they told me that the Rams football team took ballet class twice a week at that time. Ah. Said, no kidding. So they got me, they they got you. They got me into ballet class, and then it was jazz, and then it was tumbling, and so I did it all.   Michael Hingson ** 08:43 I remember when we moved to California when I was five, and probably when I was about eight or nine, my brother and I were enrolled by my mother. I guess my parents enrolled us in a dance class. So I took dance class for a few years. I learned something about dancing. I did have a pair of tap shoes, although I didn't do a lot of it, but I, but I did dance and never, never really pursued it enough to become a Gene Kelly or Fred Astaire. Well, few of us do. I didn't dislike it. It just didn't happen. But that was okay, but it was fun to, you know, to do it and to learn something about that. And so I even today, I I remember it, and I appreciate it. So that's pretty cool.   Ron Cocking ** 09:32 Well, you would understand what I always told my students, that tap dancing is like singing a song with your feet. Yeah. And I would sing, I would say, you all know, happy birthday, right? So I would sing it, and they would sing it along, and then I'd said, then I would sing it again, and I would sing it totally out of rhythm. And they would wrinkle their nose and look at me and say, okay, so what are you doing? And I'd say, Well, you don't recognize it because the rhythm is not correct. So then I would. Would tap dance Happy birthday, and I'd say, you sing along in your mind and I'm going to tap dance it. And that would always ring a bell in their mind, like, Oh, I get it. The rhythm has to be right on the button, or the people aren't going to recognize   Michael Hingson ** 10:16 that was very clever to do.   Ron Cocking ** 10:18 Yeah, thank you. And they got it, yeah, they got it, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 10:22 which is even, even more important. That's pretty clever. Well, so you did that, and did you do it all the way through high school,   Ron Cocking ** 10:30 all the way through high school? And I think when I was 15, I was, I think I was in the eighth grade, maybe ninth, but I was 15 and got my first chance to I was cast in a professional show for San Bernardino civic light opera Association. And the show was My Fair Lady, and it was my English and journalism teacher at the junior high who had been cast. He was a performer also, but something came up and he couldn't follow through, so he had given the association my name, and I was out in the backyard. My mom came out. Said, Hey, San Bernardino clo just called and they want, they want to see it tonight at seven o'clock. So I put on my dance clothes and went over, and the director, by the name of Gosh, Gene Bayless, came out, and he showed me a couple of steps. And he said, Yeah, let's do it together. And he said, Boy, you unscramble your feet pretty well there kid. And he he looked over into the costumers and said, measure this guy. Let's put him in the show. So I was beside myself. And long story short, I Gosh, I'm over the over the years, I my first show was at age 15 with them, and I participated, did shows with them, until I think my last show, I was about 38 years old, and that last show was anything goes with Leslie uggums, wow.   Michael Hingson ** 11:52 So what part did you play on my fair lady?   Ron Cocking ** 11:55 I was just a chorus kid. I remember in the opening when Eliza sings, that wouldn't it be lovely? Wouldn't it be lovely? I was a street sweeper. I remember I had a broom, and there were three of us, and we were sweeping up that street and working in and around. Eliza Doolittle, of   Michael Hingson ** 12:11 course, being really spiteful. You just said a little while ago, you were beside yourself. And the thing that I got to say to that, quoting the Muppets, is, how do the two of you stand each other? But anyway, that's okay, good in the original Muppet Movie, that line is in there. And I it just came out so fast, but I heard it. I was going, Oh my gosh. I couldn't believe they did that. But anyway, it was so cute, very funny. That's great. So and then you were, you eventually were opposite Leslie UB,   Ron Cocking ** 12:39 yes, that was one of the high points talking about dancing and drumming at the same time. In fact, I used to give a drum a basic drum summer camp where I would teach tappers the basics of music notation, quarter notes, eighth notes, 16th notes. And then we would put a tap orchestra together. Everybody had their own music stand and their own drum pad. I would conduct, and we would play little pieces, and they would they would drum a rhythm, tap, a rhythm, drum, a rhythm, tap, a rhythm. And so anyway, it came full circle. One of the highlights of my dance slash drumming career was this show I did with Leslie uggums, the director had done this prior, and he knew it would work, and so so did the conductor in the entre Act. The top of the second act, the pit orchestra starts and plays like eight measures. And then there were six of us on stage, behind the main curtain, and we would play the next 16 bars, and then we would toss it back to the pit, and then toss it back to us, and the curtain would begin to rise, and we were right into the first song that Leslie uggums sang to get into the second act. Then she wanted to add a couple of songs that she liked, and she was very popular in with the audiences in San Bernardino, so she added a couple of songs, and I got to play those songs with her and and that was just so thrilling. And I with the scene finished, I had to have my tap shoes on, on the drum set. I had to hop down from the riser, and came out, brought one of my Toms with me, and played along with another featured tap dancer that kind of took over the scene at that point. So it was, it was really cool.   Michael Hingson ** 14:31 So with all this drumming, did you ever meet anyone like buddy rip?   Ron Cocking ** 14:35 No, I never met any famous drummers except a man by the name of Jack Sperling, which was one of my drumming idols,   Michael Hingson ** 14:44 Donnie Carson was quite the drummer, as I recall,   Ron Cocking ** 14:48 yeah, he did play yeah and boy, his his drummer, Ed Shaughnessy on his on The Tonight Show was phenomenal. Yeah, he's another of my favorites, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 14:57 well, and I remember. I guess Johnny Carson and Buddy Rich played together, which was kind of fun. They   Ron Cocking ** 15:07 played together, and so did Ed Shaughnessy and Buddy Rich did a little competition on the show one time I realized, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 15:15 right, yeah. Well, and it's interesting to see some of the performers do that. I remember once trying to remember whether what show it was on, maybe it was also a Tonight Show where Steve Martin substituted for Johnny, but he and the steel Canyon, the Steve Canyon band, came out. Of course, he was great on the band, and then flat and Scruggs or flat came out. Or which one? Yeah, which one did the banjo flat, I think, but they, but they banjo together, which was fun?   Ron Cocking ** 15:51 Oh, wow, yeah, yeah. Steve Martin is a tremendous band. He is, Whoa, yeah. I,   Michael Hingson ** 15:56 I have a hard time imagining fingers moving that fast, but that's okay, me too. I saved my fingers for Braille, so it's okay. So where did you go to college?   Ron Cocking ** 16:07 I went to for two years to Riverside City College, Riverside Community College, and then I went for two years to San Bernardino Cal State, San Bernardino, and I was majoring in English because I thought I may want to do some writing. But in the meantime, I became married, I became a father, and so I was trying to work and study and maintain a family life, and I just couldn't do it all. So I didn't quite finish a major at Cal State San Bernardino. I continued actually a nightclub drumming career. And now, now we're getting up to where this our performing arts studio began between Gloria and I.   Michael Hingson ** 16:50 So was it? GLORIA? You married first?   Ron Cocking ** 16:53 No, okay, no, Gloria was married. Gloria was a prior, prior marriage for 20 some years, or 20 years, I guess. And I had been married only two years, I think. And when we first, well, we actually met while we were both. I'll tell you the story in a minute, if you want to hear it. Sure, the first time I ever met Gloria Macmillan, I had no idea who she was, because she her name was Gloria Allen at the time that was, that was her married name that she took after the arm is Brooks TV show. Well, she took that the new name before the TV show even ended. But I was choreographing a children's summer musical, and the director came up said, hey, I want you to meet this young lady's mom. So the young lady was Gloria's daughter, her oldest daughter, Janet. And I said, Sure. So he said, This is Gloria. Allen, Gloria, this is Ron. And we shook hands, and I said, Nice to meet you. And that was it. And so the show happened. It ran for a couple of weeks, and Gloria was a wonderful stage mom. She she never bothered anyone. She watched the show. She was very supportive of her daughter. Didn't, didn't stage manage   Michael Hingson ** 18:09 whatsoever, which wasn't a helicopter mom, which is good,   Ron Cocking ** 18:12 definitely that, which was just really cool. So and so I was maybe three, four years later, so Gloria obviously knew that I could dance, because she had seen me choreographed. So I got a phone call from Gloria Allen, and I said, Okay, I remember her. She wanted to meet because she was thinking about starting an acting school and wanted someone to teach actors some dance movement. So I went over for a interview and took my little at that time, about two and a half year old, daughter, three year old, and we chatted, and oh my gosh, I just this, this beautiful woman swept me off my feet. And of course, I by the end of the conversation, I said, Gosh, you know, we talked about how we would integrate the acting and the dance, and I said, Can I have your phone number? Nope, I got the old well, we'll call you. Don't call us. And so I had to wait for a few days before I got a call back, but I got a call back, and I don't remember a lot of details, but the sparks flew really, really quickly, and we started planning our school. And if you can believe that this was 1973 when we started planning, maybe it was early 74 and we invested a whole total of $800 to get ourselves into business. We bought a record player, some mirrors, some paint, and a business license and a little shingle to hang out front. We had a little one room studio, and we. Opened on November 4, 1974 and we would close the studio on June 30, 2018 Wow.   Michael Hingson ** 20:08 Yeah. So you, you had it going for quite a while, almost, well, actually, more than 40 years. 44 years. 44 years, yes. And you got married along the way.   Ron Cocking ** 20:20 Well along the way, my my wife always said she fell in love with my daughter, and then she had to take me along with her. Yeah. Well, there you go. So we were together constantly, just running the school together. And then eventually I moved over to San Bernardino, and it was, gosh, some 1213, years later, we got married in on June 28 1987 and but nothing really changed, because we had already been living together and raising five children. GLORIA had four from a private prior marriage, and I had my little girl. So we we got all these five kids through elementary and junior high in high school, and they all went to college. And they're all beautiful kids and productive citizens, two of them still in show biz. Her son, my stepson, Christopher Allen, is a successful producer now and of Broadway shows. And our daughter, Barbara Bermudez, the baby that Gloria fell in love with. She's now a producer slash stage manager director. She does really well at big events with keynote speakers. And she'll, if they want her to, she will hire in everything from lighting and sound to extra performers and that sort of thing. And she's, she's just busy constantly all over the world, wow.   Michael Hingson ** 21:43 Well, that's pretty cool. And what are the other three doing?   Ron Cocking ** 21:47 One is a VP of Sales for it's a tub and shower company, jacuzzi, and the other one is a married housewife, but now she is a grandmother and has two little grandkids, and they that's Janet, the one that I originally had worked with in that children's show. And she and her husband live in Chino Hills, California, which is about 40 minutes from here. I live in Huntington Beach, California now,   Michael Hingson ** 22:14 well, and I'm not all that far away from you. We're in Victorville. Oh, Victorville, okay, yeah, the high desert. So the next time you go to Vegas, stop by on your way, I'll do that, since that's mainly what Victorville is probably most known for. I remember when I was growing I grew up in Palmdale, and Palmdale wasn't very large. It only had like about 20 703,000 people. But as I described it to people, Victorville wasn't even a speck on a radar scope compared to Palmdale at that time. Yeah, my gosh, are over 120,000 people in this town?   Ron Cocking ** 22:51 Oh, I remember the drive in the early days from here to Vegas in that you really felt like you could get out on the road all alone and relax and take it all in, and now it can be trafficking all all the   Speaker 1 ** 23:04 way. Yeah, it's crazy. I don't know. I still think they need to do something to put some sort of additional infrastructure, and there's got to be another way to get people to Vegas and back without going on i 15, because it is so crowded, especially around holidays, that one of these days, somebody will get creative. Maybe they'll get one of Tesla's tunnel boring tools, and they'll make a tunnel, and you can go underground the whole way, I don't know,   Ron Cocking ** 23:32 but that would be, that would be great. Something like that would happen.   Michael Hingson ** 23:38 Well, so you you started the school and and that did, pretty cool. Did, did Gloria do any more acting after our Miss Brooks? And then we should explain our Miss Brooks is a show that started on radio. Yes, it went on to television, and it was an arm is Brooks. Miss Brooks played by e vardin. Was a teacher at Madison High, and the principal was Osgood Conklin, played by Gail Gordon, who was absolutely perfect for the part. He was a crotchety old curmudgeon by any standards. And Gloria played his daughter, Harriet correct. And so when it went from radio to television, one of the things that strikes me about armas Brooks and a couple of those shows, burns and Allen, I think, is sort of the same. Jack Benny was a little different. But especially armas Brooks, it just seems to me like they they took the radio shows and all they did was, did the same shows. They weren't always the same plots, but it was, it was radio on television. So you, you had the same dialog. It was really easy for me to follow, and it was, was fascinating, because it was just like the radio shows, except they were on television.   Ron Cocking ** 24:56 Yeah, pretty much. In fact, there were a lot, there's lots of episodes. Episodes that are even named the same name as they had on the radio, and they're just have to be reworked for for the television screen,   Michael Hingson ** 25:08 yeah, but the the dialog was the same, which was so great,   Ron Cocking ** 25:13 yeah, yeah. And to see what was I going to add, it was our Miss Brooks was one of the very few radio shows that made the transition to television with the cast with the same intact. Yeah, everybody looked like they sounded. So it worked when they were in front of the camera. Yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 25:33 it sort of worked with Jack Benny, because most of the well, all the characters were in it, Don Wilson, Mary, Livingston, Dennis day, Rochester, world, yeah. And of course, Mel Blanc, yeah, oh.   Ron Cocking ** 25:49 GLORIA tells a story. She she and her mom, Hazel, were walking down the street on the way to do a radio show in the old days in Hollywood, and here comes Mel blank, he says, he pulls over. Says, Hey, where are you girls headed because I know that he probably recognized them from being at at CBS all the time, and they said, We're headed to CBS. He said, hop in. Oh, that's where I'm going. So Mel Brooks gave her a ride to the Mel Blanc, yeah, would have been   Michael Hingson ** 26:15 fun if Mel Brooks had but that's okay, Young Frankenstein, but that's another story. It is. But that's that's cool. So did they ever? Did she ever see him any other times? Or was that it?   Ron Cocking ** 26:30 No, I think that was it. That's the one story that she has where Mel Blanc is involved.   Michael Hingson ** 26:36 What a character, though. And of course, he was the man of a million voices, and it was just incredible doing I actually saw a couple Jack Benny shows this morning and yesterday. One yesterday, he was Professor LeBlanc teaching Jack Benny how to play the violin, which was a lost cause.   Ron Cocking ** 26:59 Actually, Jack Benny was not a bad view. No,   Michael Hingson ** 27:01 he wasn't violent. No, he wasn't. He had a lot of fun with it, and that stick went straight in from radio to television, and worked really well, and people loved it, and you knew what was going to happen, but it didn't matter. But it was still   Ron Cocking ** 27:16 funny, and I'm sure during the transition they there was a little bit of panic in the writers department, like, okay, what are we going to do? We got to come up with a few shows. We got to get ahead a little bit. So the writing being just a little different, I'm sure that's part of the reason why they went back and kind of leaned on the old, old script somewhat, until they kind of cut their teeth on the new this new thing called television   Michael Hingson ** 27:39 well, but they still kept a lot of the same routines in one way or another.   Ron Cocking ** 27:45 Yeah, when they work, they work, whether you're just listening or whether you're watching,   Michael Hingson ** 27:48 right, exactly what other shows made it from radio to television with the cast   Ron Cocking ** 27:53 intact? You know, I am not up on that number. I   Michael Hingson ** 27:57 know there were a couple that did. RMS, Brooks was, well, oh no, I was gonna say Abbott and Costello, but that was different, but our Miss Brooks certainly did. If   Ron Cocking ** 28:09 the Bickersons did, I forget the two actors that did that show, but that was a really, Francis   Michael Hingson ** 28:13 Langford and Donna Michi could be, but I think burns and Allen, I think, kept the same people as much as there were. Harry bonzell was still with them, and so on. But it was interesting to see those. And I'm awake early enough in the morning, just because it's a good time to get up, and I get and be real lazy and go slowly to breakfast and all that. But I watched the Benny show, and occasionally before it, I'll watch the burns and Allen show. And I think that the plots weren't as similar from radio to television on the burns and Allen show as they weren't necessarily in the Benny show, but, but it all worked.   Ron Cocking ** 28:58 Yeah, yeah. That's why they were on the air for so long?   Michael Hingson ** 29:02 Yeah, so what other kind of acting did Gloria do once? So you guys started the school   Ron Cocking ** 29:10 well after she well, when we started the school, we found ourselves, you know, raising five children. And so I continued playing nightclub gigs. I had one, one nightclub job for like, five years in a row with two wonderful, wonderful musicians that were like fathers to me. And Gloria actually went to work for her brother in law, and she became a salesperson, and eventually the VP of Sales for a fiberglass tub and shower business down here in Santa Ana. So she drove that 91 freeway from San Bernardino, Santa Ana, all the time. But in,   Michael Hingson ** 29:47 yeah, you could do it back then, much more than now. It was a little better   Ron Cocking ** 29:51 and but in, but twist in between, she managed. Her mom still did a little bit of agency. And she would call Gloria and say. Want you to go see so and so. She did an episode of perfect strangers. She did an episode with Elliot of the guy that played Elliot Ness, stack the show Robert Stack the show was called Help Wanted no see. I guess that was an in but wanted, anyway, she did that. She did a movie with Bruce Dern and Melanie Griffith called Smile. And so she kept, she kept her foot in the door, but, but not, not all that much she she really enjoyed when John Wilder, one of her childhood acting buddies, who she called her brother, and he still calls her sis, or he would call her sis, still. His name was Johnny McGovern when he was a child actor, and when he decided to try some movie work, he there was another Johnny McGovern in Screen Actors Guild, so he had to change his name to John Wyler, but he did that mini series called centennial, and he wanted Gloria for a specific role, to play a German lady opposite the football player Alex Karras. And they had a couple of really nice scenes together. I think she was in three, maybe four of the segments. And there were many segments, it was like a who's who in Hollywood, the cast of that show   Michael Hingson ** 31:28 does that was pretty cool.   Ron Cocking ** 31:32 But anyway, yeah, after Gloria finished armas Brooks, she became married to Gilbert Allen, who, who then became a Presbyterian minister. So Gloria, when you said, Did she continue acting? There's a lot of acting that goes on being a minister and being a minister's wife, and she would put together weddings for people, and that sort of thing. And she did that for 20 years. Wow. So she Gloria was a phenomenon. She did so many things. And she did them all so very well, in my   Speaker 1 ** 32:04 opinion. And so did you? Yeah, which is, which is really cool. So you, but you, you both started the school, and that really became your life's passion for 44 years. Yes,   Ron Cocking ** 32:16 we would get up in the mornings, go do a little business, come home, have a little lunch, go back about 132 o'clock, and we would normally crank up about four after the kids get out of school, and we would teach from four to nine, sometimes to 10. Go out, have some dinner. So yeah, we pretty much 24/7 and we had had such similar backgrounds. Hers on a national radio and television scale, and mine on a much more local, civic light opera scale. But we both had similar relations with our our moms after after the radio tapings and the TV things. GLORIA And her mom. They lived in Beverly Hills, right at Wilshire and Doheny, and they had their favorite chocolate and ice cream stops. And same thing for me, my mom would take me there, two doors down from the little studio where I was taking my tap classes. There was an ice cream parlor, haywoods ice cream. And that was, that was the the lure, if you go in and if you do your practicing, Ronnie, you can, I'll take it for an ice cream so that I did my practicing, had plenty of little treats on the way, so we had that in common, and we both just had very supportive moms that stayed out of the way, not, not what I would call a pushy parent, or, I think you mentioned the helicopter, helicopter, but it   Michael Hingson ** 33:37 but it sounds like you didn't necessarily need the bribes to convince you to tap dance, as you know, anyway, but they didn't hurt.   Ron Cocking ** 33:46 No, it didn't hurt at all, and it was something to look forward to, but I I just enjoyed it all along. Anyway, I finally got to to really showcase what I could do when I was cast as the dance director in the show 42nd street. Oh, wow. And I was lucky. We were lucky. San Bernardino clo was able to hire John Engstrom, who had done the show on Broadway. The earlier version that came, I think it was on Broadway in the mid or to late 70s. He had worked side by side with Gower Champion putting the show together. He told us all sorts of stories about how long it took Gower to put together that opening dance. Because everything in the opening number you you see those steps later in the show done by the chorus, because the opening number is an audition for dancers who want to be in this new Julian Marsh show. So the music starts, the audience hears, I know there must have been 20 of us tapping our feet off. And then a few seconds later, the curtain rises about two and a half feet. And then they see all these tapping feet. And then the main curtain goes out, and there we all are. And. I my part. I was facing upstage with my back to the audience, and then at some point, turned around and we did it was the most athletic, difficult, two and a half minute tap number I had ever done, I'll bet. But it was cool. There were five or six kids that had done it on Broadway and the national tour. And then during that audition, one more high point, if we have the time, we I was auditioning just like everybody else. The director had called and asked if I would audition, but he wasn't going to be choreographing. John Engstrom was so with there was probably 50 or 60 kids of all ages, some adults auditioning, and at one point, John pulled out one of the auditioners, and he happened to be one of my male tap dance students. And he said, Now I want everybody to watch Paul do this step. Paul did the step. He said, Now he said, Paul, someone is really teaching you well. He said, everybody that's the way to do a traveling timestamp so and that, you know, I'll remember that forever. And it ended up he hired. There were seven myself and seven other of my students were cast in that show. And some of them, some of them later, did the show in Las Vegas, different directors. But yeah, that, that was a high point for me.   Speaker 1 ** 36:19 I'm trying to remember the first time I saw 42nd street. I think I've seen it twice on Broadway. I know once, but we also saw it once at the Lawrence Welk Resorts condo there, and they did 42nd street. And that was a lot of that show was just a lot of fun. Anyway,   Ron Cocking ** 36:39 it's a fun show. And as John said in that show, The chorus is the star of the show.   Speaker 1 ** 36:45 Yeah, it's all about dancing by any by any definition, any standard. It's a wonderful show. And anybody who is listening or watching, if you ever get a chance to go see 42nd street do it, it is, it is. Well, absolutely, well worth it.   Ron Cocking ** 37:00 Yeah, good. Good show. Fantastic music, too. Well.   Michael Hingson ** 37:03 How did you and Gloria get along so well for so long, basically, 24 hours a day, doing everything together that that I would think you would even be a little bit amazed, not that you guys couldn't do it, but that you did it so well, and so many people don't do it well,   Ron Cocking ** 37:21 yeah, I don't know I from, from the the first time we met, we just seemed to be on the same wavelength. And by the way, I found out as time went by, Gloria was like Mrs. Humble. She wasn't a bragger, very humble. And it took me a while to find out what an excellent tap dancer she was. But when we went to the studio in the early days, we had, we just had one room. So she would teach actors for an hour, take a break. I would go in teach a tap class or a movement class or a ballet class. I in the early days, I taught, I taught it all. I taught ballet and jazz and and and and   Michael Hingson ** 38:01 tap. Well, let's let's be honest, she had to be able to tap dance around to keep ahead of Osgoode Conklin, but that's another story.   Ron Cocking ** 38:09 Yeah. So yeah, that. And as our studio grew, we would walk every day from our first studio down to the corner to a little wind chills donut shop wind chills donuts to get some coffee and come back. And about a year and a half later, after walking by this, this retail vacant spot that was two doors from our studio, we said, I wonder if that might be, you know, something for us, it had a four lease sign. So, long story short, we released it. The owner of the property loved knowing that Gloria Macmillan was that space. And so luckily, you know when things are supposed to happen. They happen as people would move out next to us, we would move in. So we ended up at that particular studio with five different studio rooms. Wow. And so then we can accommodate all of the above, acting, singing classes, all the dance disciplines, all at the same time, and we can, like, quadruple our student body. So then we made another move, because the neighborhood was kind of collapsing around us, we made another room and purchased a building that had been built as a racquetball club. It had six racquetball courts, all 20 by 40, beautiful hardwood. We made four of them, five of them into studios, and then there was a double racquetball racquetball court in the front of the building which they had tournaments in it was 40 by 40 we moved. We made that into a black box theater for Gloria. And the back wall of the theater was one inch glass outside of which the audiences for the racquetball tournaments used to sit. But outside the glass for us, we had to put curtains there, and out front for us was our. Gigantic lobby. The building was 32,000 square feet. Wow, we could it just made our heart, hearts sing when we could walk down that hallway and see a ballet class over here, a tap class over there, singers, singing actors in the acting room. It was beautiful. And again, it was just meant for us because it was our beautiful daughter, Kelly, who passed away just nine months after Gloria did. She's the one that said, you guys ought to look into that. And I said, Well, it's a racquetball court. But again, the first moment we walked in the front door, you start. We started thinking like, whoa. I think we could make this work. And it worked for another 20 years for us and broke our hearts to basically rip it apart, tear the theater down, and everything when we were moving out, because we we couldn't find another studio that was interested in in coming in, because they would have had to purchase the building. We wanted to sell the building. Yeah. So anyway, of all things, they now sell car mufflers out of there.   Michael Hingson ** 41:02 That's a little different way, way. Yeah, social shock, did any of your students become pretty well known in the in the entertainment world?   Ron Cocking ** 41:11 I wouldn't say well known, but a lot of them have worked a lot and made careers. Some of our former students are now in their 50s, middle 50s, pushing 60, and have done everything from cruise ship to Las Vegas to regional some national tours, even our son, Christopher, he did the national tour of meet me in St Louis with Debbie Boone, okay, and he's the one that is Now a successful producer. He's his latest hit. Well, his first, what can be considered legitimately a Broadway hit show was the show called shucked, and it opened about two years ago, I think, and I finally got to go back to New York and see it just a month before it closed. Very hilarious. Takes place in Iowa. The whole show is built around a county in which everybody that lives there makes their living off of corn, making whiskey. And it is a laugh, way more than a laugh a minute. But anyway, we had one of Gloria's acting students who was hired on with a Jonathan Winters TV sitcom called Davis rules. It ran for two seasons, and here he was like 16 or 17 years old, making, I think it was. He was making $8,000 a week, and he was in heaven. He looked like the Son he played, the grandson of Jonathan Winters and the son of Randy Quaid and so he, yeah, he was in heaven. And then after that, he did a very popular commercial, the 711 brain freeze commercial for Slurpee. The Slurpee, yeah, and he made the so much money from that, but then he kind of disappeared from showbiz. I don't know what he's doing nowadays,   Speaker 1 ** 43:00 but it's, it's, it's interesting to, you know, to hear the stories. And, yeah, I can understand that, that not everybody gets to be so famous. Everybody knows them, but it's neat that you had so many people who decided to make entertainment a career. So clearly, you had a pretty good influence on a lot of, a lot of kids.   Ron Cocking ** 43:20 Yes, I over the years, Gloria and I felt like we had 1000s of children of our own, that they that we had raised together. It's really a good feeling. And I still get phone calls. We got a phone call once a few years back from from one of our students who had been trying to crack the nut in New York, and she called us like 530 in the morning, because, of course, it was Yeah, but she had just signed her first national tour contract and was going to go out with the show cabaret. So fortunately, we were able to drive up to Santa not let's see, it's just below San San Jose. The show came through San Jose, and we got to see her up there. But those kinds of things are what made us keep teaching, year after year, all these success stories. Of course, we have former students that are now lawyers. Those are actors. Well, we   Michael Hingson ** 44:17 won't hold it and we understand, yeah and they are actors, by all means. How many teachers did you have in the studio when you had the big building?   Ron Cocking ** 44:26 Gosh, at one time, we had 10 or 12 teachers, teaching vocal teachers, two or three ballet teachers, jazz teachers, and you both taught as well. And we both continued teaching all through that time. We never just became managers, although that's that was part of it, and mixing business with art is a challenge, and it takes kind of a different mindset, and then what an unstoppable mindset you have to have in order to mix business with performing, because it's too. Different sides of your brain and a lot of patience and a lot of patience. And guess who taught me patience? Uh huh, Gloria Macmillan.   Michael Hingson ** 45:09 I would Conklin's daughter, yes, and I'll bet that's where she learned patience. No, I'm just teasing, but yeah, I hear you, yeah. Well, I know Karen and I were married for 40 years, until she passed in November of 2022 and there's so many similarities in what you're talking about, because we we could do everything together. We had challenges. Probably the biggest challenge that we ever had was we were living in Vista California, and I was working in Carlsbad, and the president of our company decided that we should open an office, because I was being very successful at selling to the government, we should open an office in the DC area. And so we both got excited about that. But then one day he came in and he had this epiphany. He said, No, not Virginia. I want you to open an office in New York. And Karen absolutely hated that she was ready to go to Virginia and all that.   Speaker 1 ** 46:15 But the problem for me was it was either move to New York or take a sales territory that didn't sell very much anymore. The owner wasn't really willing to discuss it, so we had some challenges over that, but the marriage was strong enough that it that it worked out, and we moved to New Jersey, and Karen made a lot of friends back there, but, you know, we always did most everything together. And then when the pandemic occurred, being locked down, it just proved all the more we just did everything together. We were together. We talked a lot, which is, I think one of the keys to any good marriages, and you talk and communicate.   Ron Cocking ** 46:56 Yes, in fact, when after we closed the studio in 2018 it took us a few more months to sell our home, and then when we moved down here, it was only about, I don't know, I don't know if it was a full year or not, but the pandemic hit and but it really didn't bother us, because we had, we had been working the teaching scene for so many years that we basically Were done. We basically walked out of the studio. We did. Neither of us have the desire to, well, let's continue in at some level, no, we cherished our time together. We have a little porch out in front of our home here, and it gets the ocean breeze, and we would sit for hours and chat. And oddly enough, not oddly, one of our favorite things to do, we have a website that we went to that had, I think, every radio show of armas Brooks ever made. And we would sit listen to those and just laugh. And, in fact, Gloria, there are some. She said, You know what? I don't even remember that episode at all. So yeah, that that was an interesting part. But yeah, Gloria and I, like your wife and you really enjoyed time together. We never talked about needing separate vacations or anything if we wanted to do something. We did it   Speaker 1 ** 48:16 together, yeah, and we did too. And you know, for us it was, it was out of desire, but also was easier for us, because she was in a wheelchair her whole life. I was I'm blind. I've been blind my whole life. And as I tell people, the marriage worked out well. She read, I pushed, and in reality, that really is the way it worked, yeah, yeah. Until she started using a power chair. Then I didn't push. I kept my toes out of the way. But still, it was, it was really did meld and mesh together very well and did everything   Ron Cocking ** 48:49 together. That's fantastic. I'm proud of you, Michael, and it really   Michael Hingson ** 48:53 it's the only way to go. So I miss her, but like, I keep telling people she's somewhere monitoring me, and if I misbehave, I'm going to hear about it. So I got to be a good kid,   Ron Cocking ** 49:04 and I'll hear I'll get some notes tonight from the spirit of Gloria McMillan too. I prayed to her before I went on. I said, please let the words flow and please not let me say anything that's inappropriate. And I think she's guided me through okay so far.   Michael Hingson ** 49:20 Well, if, if you do something you're not supposed to, she's gonna probably hit you upside the head. You know, did you two ever actually get to perform together?   Ron Cocking ** 49:30 Oh, I'm glad you asked that, because, well, it had been years since I knew that she was a darn good tap dancer. In fact, I had a tap dancing ensemble of of my more advanced kids, and if they wanted to dedicate the extra time that it took, we rehearsed them and let them perform at free of charge once they made it to that group, they they did not pay to come in and rehearse with me, because I would spend a lot of time standing there creating so. So we were doing a performance, and we wanted to spotlight, I forget the exact reason why we wanted to spotlight some of Gloria's career. Talk about radio a little bit. And I said, Gloria, would you do a little soft shoe routine? And because we had invited a mutual friend of ours, Walden Hughes, from the reps organization, and he was going to be the guest of honor, so I talked her into it. At first she wasn't going to go for it, but we had so much fun rehearsing it together. And it wasn't a long routine, it was relatively short, beautiful music, little soft shoe, and it was so much fun to say that we actually tap danced together. But the other times that we actually got to work together was at the old time radio conventions, mostly with reps, and that's really when I got to sit on stage. I was kind of typecast as an announcer, and I got to do some commercials. I got to sing once with Lucy arnazza. Oh, life, a life boy soap commercial. But when Gloria, Well, Gloria did the lead parts, and oh my gosh, that's when I realized what a superb actress she was. And if I don't know if you've heard of Greg Oppenheimer, his father, Jess Oppenheimer created the I Love Lucy shows, and so Gloria loved Jess Oppenheimer. And so Greg Oppenheimer, Jess Son, did a lot of directing, and oh my gosh, I would see he came in very well prepared and knew how the lines should be delivered. And if Gloria was not right on it, he would say, No, wait a minute, Gloria, I want you to emphasize the word decided, and that's going to get the laugh. And when he gave her a reading like that man, the next time she went through that dialog, just what he had asked for. And I thought, Oh my gosh. And her timing, after watching so many armist Brooks TV and listening to radio shows. GLORIA learned her comedic timing from one of the princesses of comedy timing is Eve Arden, right? They were so well for obvious reasons. They were so very similar. And if you have time to story for another story, do you know have you heard of Bob Hastings? He was the lieutenant on McHale's navy. McHale's Navy, right? Yeah. Well, he also did a lot of old time radio. So we went up to Seattle,   Michael Hingson ** 52:32 our two grandkids, Troy Amber, he played, not Archie. Was it Henry Aldridge? He was on,   Ron Cocking ** 52:40 I think you're right. I'm not too up on the cast of the old time radio show. Yeah, I think you're right. But anyway, he was there, and there was an actress that had to bow out. I don't know who that was, but our grandsons and Gloria and I, we walked in, and as usual, we say hi to everybody. We're given a big packet of six or eight scripts each, and we go to our room and say, Oh my gosh. Get out the pencils, and we start marking our scripts. So we get a phone call from Walden, and he said, hey, Ron Bob. Bob Hastings wants to see Gloria in his room. He wants to read through he's not sure if he wants to do the Bickersons script, because he you know, the gal bowed out and right, you know, so Gloria went down   Michael Hingson ** 53:23 couple of doors, coming   Ron Cocking ** 53:26 Yes, and she so she came back out of half an hour, 40 minutes later, and she said, well, that little stinker, he was auditioning me. He went in and she went in and he said, Well, you know, I don't know if I want to do this. It doesn't seem that funny to me. Let's read a few lines. Well, long story short, they read the whole thing through, and they were both, they were both rolling around the floor. I'll bet they laughing and so and then jump to the following afternoon, they did it live, and I was able to watch. I had some pre time, and I watched, and they were just fantastic together. I left after the show, I went to the green room, had a little snack, and I was coming back to our room, walking down the hall, and here comes Bob Hastings, and he says, oh, Ron. He said, Your wife was just fantastic. So much better than the other girl would have been. So when I told GLORIA That story that made her her day, her week. She felt so good about that. So that's my Bob Hastings story. Bob Hastings and Gloria Macmillan were great as the Bickersons.   Speaker 1 ** 54:29 Yeah, that was a very clever show. It started on the Danny Thomas show, and then they they ended up going off and having their own show, Francis Langford and Donna Michi, but they were very clever.   Ron Cocking ** 54:42 Now, did you realize when now that you mentioned Danny Thomas? Did you realize that Gloria's mom, Hazel McMillan, was the first female agent, talent agent in Hollywood? No, and that's how you know when the. They moved from from Portland, Oregon, a little city outside of Portland. They moved because Gloria's mom thought she had talent enough to do radio, and it wasn't a year after they got here to LA that she did her first national show for Lux radio at the age of five. That was in 1937 with with Edward G Robinson. I've got a recording of that show. What's what show was it? It was a Christmas show. And I don't remember the name of the of it, but it was a Christmas show. It was Walden that sent us. Sent   Michael Hingson ** 55:33 it to us. I'll find it. I've got it, I'm sure.   Ron Cocking ** 55:35 And so, yeah, so, so Gloria was a member of what they called the 500 club. There was a group of, I don't know, nine or 10 kids that by the time the photograph that I have of this club, it looks like Gloria is around 12 to 14 years old, and they had all done 500 or more radio shows. Wow, that's a lot of radio show. There's a lot of radio So Gloria did, I mean, I got a short my point was, her mom was an agent, and when Gloria was working so consistently at armas Brooks, she said, Well, I'm kind of out of a job. I don't need to take you. GLORIA could drive then. And so she came back from the grocery store, Ralph's market near Wilshire and Doheny, and she came back said, Well, I know what I'm going to do. I ran into this cute little boy at the grocery store. I'm going to represent him for television. And she that's, she started the Hazel McMillan agency, and she ran that agency until she just couldn't anymore. I think she ran it until early 1980s but she, my god, she represented people like Angela Cartwright on the Danny Thomas show and Kathy Garver on, all in the family a family affair. Family Affair. Yeah. Jane north. Jane North went in for Dennis the Menace. He didn't get the role. He came back said, Hazel, I don't think they liked me, and they didn't. They didn't call me back or anything. Hazel got on that phone, said, Look, I know this kid can do what you're asking for. I want you to see him again. He went back and they read him again. He got the part, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 57:21 and he was perfect for it.   Ron Cocking ** 57:22 He was perfect for that part was, I'm sorry.   Michael Hingson ** 57:27 It's sad that he passed earlier this year.   Ron Cocking ** 57:29 Yeah, he passed and he had, he had a tough life, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 57:36 well, you know, tell me you, you have what you you have some favorite words of wisdom. Tell me about those.   Ron Cocking ** 57:45 Oh, this goes back to the reason why I came across this when I was looking for something significant to say on the opening of one of our big concert programs. We used to do all of our shows at the California theater of Performing Arts in San Bernardino, it's a really, a real gem of a theater. It's where Will Rogers gave his last performance. And so I came across this, and it's, I don't know if this is biblical, you might, you might know, but it's, if you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. If you teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime. And that's what I felt like Gloria and I were trying to do. We wanted to teach these kids as as professionally. We treated our students as they were, as if they were little professionals. We we expected quality, we expected them to work hard, but again, Gloria taught me patience, unending patience. But we knew that we wanted them to feel confident when the time came, that they would go out and audition. We didn't want them to be embarrassed. We want we wanted them to be able to come back to us and say, Boy, I felt so good at that audition. I knew all the steps I was and I and I read so well it was. And thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And so that aspect of it, we felt that we were feeding them for a lifetime, but we also were creating all of these arts patrons, all these lovers of the arts, 1000s of kids now love to go to musicals and movies and plays because they've kind of been there and done that at our studio. And so anyway, that's and whether, whether or not it was their confidence in show business or whether it was their confidence we've had so many calls from and visits from parents and former students saying, Boy, I just was awarded a job. And they said my my communication skills were excellent, and I owe that to Gloria. I was on the beach the other day, and I looked over and there was this young man and his wife. I assumed it was his wife. It was they were setting. Up their beach chairs, and I looked and I say, Excuse me, is your name Brandon? And he said, No, but he said, Is your name Ron? And I said, Yes. He said, No, my name is Eric. And I said, Eric puentes. And so we reminisced for a while. He took tap from me. He took acting from Gloria, and he said, you know, he was sad to hear of Gloria's passing. And he said, You know, I owe so much to Gloria. I learned so much about speaking in front of groups. And he is now a minister. He has his own church in Redlands, California, and he's a minister. And of all the billion people on the beach, he sits next to me. So that's one of those things when it's supposed to   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:41 happen. It happens. It does. Yeah, well, and as we talked about earlier, you and Gloria did lots of stuff with reps, and I'm going to miss it this time, but I've done a few, and I'm going to do some more. What I really enjoy about people who come from the radio era, and who have paid attention to the radio era is that the acting and the way they project is so much different and so much better than people who have no experience with radio. And I know Walden and I have talked about the fact that we are looking to get a grant at some point so that we can train actors or people who want to be involved in these shows, to be real actors, and who will actually go back and listen to the shows, listen to what people did, and really try to bring that forward into the recreations, because so many people who haven't really had the experience, or who haven't really listened to radio programs sound so forced, as opposed to natural.   Ron Cocking ** 1:01:46 I agree, and I know exactly what you're saying. In fact, Walden on a couple of at least two or three occasions, he allowed us to take some of Gloria's acting students all the way to Seattle, and we did some in for the spurred vac organization Los Angeles, we did a beautiful rendition of a script that we adapted of the Velveteen Rabbit. And of all people, Janet Waldo agreed to do the fairy at the end, and she was exquisite. And it's only like, I don't know, four or five lines, and, oh my gosh, it just wrapped it up with a satin bow. And, but, but in some of our kids, yeah, they, they, they were very impressed by the radio, uh, recreations that they were exposed to at that convention.   Speaker 1 ** 1:02:37 Yeah, yeah. Well, and it's, it is so wonderful to hear some of these actors who do it so well, and to really see how they they are able to pull some of these things together and make the shows a lot better. And I hope that we'll see more of that. I hope that we can actually work to teach more people how to really deal with acting from a standpoint of radio,   Ron Cocking ** 1:03:04 that's a great idea. And I know Walden is really sensitive to that. He Yeah, he would really be a proponent of that.   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:10 Oh, he and I have talked about it. We're working on it. We're hoping we can get some things. Well, I want to thank you for being here. We've been doing this an hour already.  

*cue the Johnny Carson theme* WGN Radio’s David Plier isn’t just a host at our station but also the President and CEO of the Museum of Broadcast Communications in Chicago. David joined Steve Dale on the Booth 46 Podcast, from the heart of Chicago at Petterino’s, to talk about the re-opening of the museum, which […]

This week Lynn & Carl are joined by female powerhouses of Saint Louis Theatre. First, De Kaplan and Stellie Siteman discuss their Max and Louie Productions collaboration with The Cabaret Project of St. Louis to bring super-singer Marilyn Maye in a one-night-only tribute to Johnny Carson. Music and musings. Nov. 19th at the Sheldon Concert Hall. Next Michelle Hand talks about her one-woman show, "The Search for Signs of Intelligent Life in the Universe" at St. Louis Actors' Studio through Nov. 23rd. Finally, Lynn saw the new releases: Nuremberg, Christy & Frankenstein.

Nick spotlights five of the greatest impressionists in Saturday Night Live history — Dana Carvey, Chloe Fineman, Darrell Hammond, Bill Hader, and Melissa Villaseñor. Each performer brought a unique brilliance to the art of mimicry, shaping decades of the show's comedy legacy. From Carvey's classic takes on George Bush and Johnny Carson to Hammond's uncanny Bill Clinton and Hader's pitch-perfect Al Pacino, Nick revisits some of the most unforgettable impressions ever seen on the SNL stage. He also includes revealing interview clips of Fineman, Hammond, and Hader discussing their process and performing live examples of their uncanny vocal transformations. Finally, Villaseñor brings the episode home with two standout sketches showcasing her incredible range — nailing everyone from Kristen Wiig to Jennifer Lopez to a shockingly accurate Owen Wilson. A fun, fascinating look at the masters who turned imitation into high art on SNL. [Ep 148]

This episode was originally released on 8/1/2020. While new episodes of Breaking Walls are on hiatus I'll be going back and posting the older episodes. ____________ In Breaking Walls episode 106, we join Eve Arden at Madison High School and find out why we all love Our Miss Brooks. —————————— Highlights: • Who is Eunice Quedens? • Eve the heroine with Elizabeth Arden cosmetics. • Starting out in Hollywood • Getting on the Radio • Teaming with Danny Kaye, Jack Haley, and Jack Carson • William Paley and his Packaged Program Initiative • My Friend Irma and Two New Proposed Female-driven Situation Comedies • Our Miss Booth—Not Happening • Eve Arden, meet Connie Brooks • Our Miss Brooks—The New Summer Hit • Colgate Signs on in the Fall of 1948 • Cast Camaraderie • Eve Arden—Radio's Top Comedienne • Miss Brooks Gains Traction • Taking the Show into TV without Jeff Chandler • Winding down the Radio Show • Looking Ahead to September —————————— The WallBreakers: http://thewallbreakers.com Subscribe to Breaking Walls everywhere you get your podcasts. To support the show: http://patreon.com/TheWallBreakers —————————— The reading material used in today's episode was: On the Air — By John Dunning Network Radio Ratings, 1932-53 — By Jim Ramsburg As well as articles from the archives of Broadcasting Magazine, Radio Daily, and Radio Mirror. —————————— On the interview front: Eve Arden, Gale Gordon, Jack Haley and Gloria McMillan were with Chuck Schaden. Hear their full chats at SpeakingofRadio.com. Eve Arden was also with John Dunning on July 25th, 1982 for 71KNUS Mary Jane Croft was with SPERDVAC on March 14th, 1992. For more information, please go to SPERDVAC.com. Shirley Booth was with Dick Cavett in 1971. And Ozzie and Harriet Nelson were on Johnny Carson's Tonight Show on November 18th, 1969. —————————— Selected music featured in today's episode was: • It's Been a Long Long Time — By The Harry James Band • Easy Street — By June Christy • Living Without You — By George Winston • Hello Mary Lou — By Ricky Nelson

Send us a textDarin almost had a scare in the air! Find out what went wrong that caused him to spend 10 hours at the airport.Mike wants to stop people from doing stupid shit. Hear his detailed planPlus the Johnny Carson centennial exhibit, unusual elevator encounters, rude waiters and the mystery of the missing microphone.We told our families that we're beloved and very popular, so if they ask you about it please play along.#JOHNNYCARSON #CHICAGO #FLYING #YODA #ANDREWDICECLAY #COMEDY #PODCASTS #IRRITABLEDADSYNDROMESupport the showThank you so much for listening to this episode! If you like what we do, please check out our other content! Follow our socials for announcements when we go LIVE and to become part of the show!All episode, videos, and more can be found on our website at: https://www.irritabledadsyndrome.com/Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/IrritableDadSyndromeYouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@irritabledadsyndromeTikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@irritabledadsyndromeInstagram: https://www.instagram.com/irritabledadsyndrome/Threads: https://www.threads.net/@irritabledadsyndromeTwitter / X: https://x.com/DadIrritableTons of bonus and premium content (including archived, uncensored videos of episode recordings, unique merch, and more!) is all on our Patreon page! Join our Patrons today and support our show!Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/irritabledadsyndrome

Welcome back to another fun-filled episode of the Rick's Rambles Podcast, your weekly dose of positivity, pop culture, and good news! We kick things off with our always-popular Fun Facts segment, and this week we're diving into the life and times of Johnny Carson. Ever wondered what the legendary Tonight Show host did before he took over late-night television? You might be surprised by his fascinating early years! Next, we head into our Good News & Mental Health segment. We're talking about simple, practical ways to make your yard winter-friendly for wildlife. From birds to pollinators, seeing wildlife thrive in our certified habitat has given my wife and me such a boost—something we hope inspires you too! In our Story Behind the Song feature, we're celebrating a Halloween classic: “The Monster Mash”! Learn how Bobby “Boris” Pickett created a hit that still gets every spooky season rocking. And of course, we wrap things up with the Quirky and Fun Holidays of the Week — because who doesn't love a reason to celebrate something silly?

WGN Radio's own David Plier, president of the Museum of Broadcast Communications, joins Steve Dale to chat about their exhibit celebrating Johnny Carson's 100th birthday. Plus, what the king of late night was really like, and how his approach differs from today's hosts. The new Museum location is 440 W. Randolph St.

In this hilarious and heartfelt episode of We Think It's Funny, hosts Daniel Lobell and Mark Schiff welcome comedian, filmmaker, and author Mark Malkoff, whose new book Love, Johnny Carson dives deep into the wit, mystery, and magic of the legendary late-night host. The conversation is full of laughs, fascinating behind-the-scenes Carson stories, and reflections on what made him such a singular figure in comedy. Daniel and Mark also reminisce about how Daniel first met Mark Malkoff years ago while interning at The Colbert Report, and how their friendship grew from those early days in comedy. It's a lively, nostalgic, and laughter-filled episode celebrating friendship, showbiz history, and the enduring influence of Johnny Carson.

Episode 183 – Mark Malkoff (Part Two): “Love Johnny Carson”This week brings Part Two of our encompassing conversation with Mark Malkoff, host of The Carson Podcast and author of the brilliant new book Love Johnny Carson.Picking up right where Part One left off, Mark and Mike continue their deep dive into Johnny's incredible career and legacy — and how it all connects to the world of David Letterman. The episode opens with the story of the unexpected intruder who interrupted Johnny Carson's very first Tonight Show, and traces his journey all the way through his final broadcast.Mark also sheds light on Johnny's post-retirement years — a period often mislabeled as “quiet,” yet filled with creativity, generosity, and private moments that reveal the man behind the legend. Along the way, the conversation explores the parallels and contrasts between Carson and Letterman, two giants whose influence continues to shape late-night television to this day.Before you head off into late-night nostalgia, stop by Hello-Deli.com — the only place to grab officially licensed Late Show with David Letterman merch, personally delivered (almost) by the legendary Rupert Jee.And hey, if this episode made you smile, please like, share, subscribe, and drop a comment — even if it's just to tell us your favorite Carson moment. We'll take it.

We're pulling back The Tonight Show curtain, not only to reveal Johnny Carson, but to explore the lore and the legend that were Johnny's Tonight Show reign.Joining us are Love Johnny Carson author and The Carson Podcast host, Mark Malkoff, along with Carson Tonight Show guest and Leno Tonight Show writer, Jimmy Brogan.Mark's new Carson book offers a decade-by-decade deep look at the King of Late Night. Through his multitude of podcast interviews with Carson insiders, Mark peels away the stony myth to reveal that the real Johnny was more like the brilliantly charming, funny man you saw on TV and less like the icy, ramrod figure,  of legend, stealing himself from social intimacy. In actual fact, in order to get from points A to B, Johnny had to hold his gaze on the horizon and keep moving or he would attract a crowd. Mark and Jimmy share what made Johnny so important to them and to comedy itself. Jimmy recalls turning down his initial invitation to guest on the show because although his crowd work was extraordinary, you can't do that with a studio audience and he knew he wasn't ready.Fritz, a standup comedian who became an NBC weatherman worked upstairs from The Tonight Show. He was groomed by talent coordinator Jim McCawley to appear on Carson and then easily fill in when a guest fell out.Mark's deep research reveals a Johnny few have seen: the private man behind the poise. We learn about his secret yearning to be a singer. (he took three weeks of lessons to duet with Julio Iglesias as Willie Nelson ), his need for strong boundaries with fans, and his quiet interest in humanism and social justice. Mark also debunks myths about famous feuds with Wayne Newton and Joan Rivers, while Jimmy shares his own Joan Rivers talk show audition story and memories of the bumpy Carson into Leno transition.From Kermit the Frog guest-hosting The Tonight Show to Johnny's competitive streak, sensitivity and complex charm, this episode dives into the brilliance, insecurity, and humanity of a television legend. Plus, Mark tells us about his own outrageous social experiments, including overcoming his fear of flying by living on an airplane for 30 days, visiting every Starbucks in Manhattan in one day and collecting keys to cities from Mayors across America!In current media --Weezy:  Netflix Documentary, The Perfect NeighborFritz: Apple TV+ documentary, Stiller and Meara: Nothing Is Lost Path Points of InterestLove Johnny Carson: One Obsessive Fan's Journey To Find The Genius Behind The Legend by Mark MalkoffMark MalkoffMark Malkoff on WikipediaThe Carson PodcastMark Malkoff on InstagramJimmy BroganJimmy Brogan on WikipediaJimmy Brogan on InstagramJimmy Brogan on Mark's PodcastThe Perfect NeighborStiller and Meara: Nothing Is Lost

Mark Malkoff is a comedian, writer, and podcaster, and he is the author of the new book Love Johnny Carson: One Obsessive Fan's Journey to Find the Genius Behind the Legend. He joined Tony Mazur on the Check Your Brain podcast to talk about who Johnny was, how the Tonight Show gained its footing, the move from New York to Burbank, and all of Carson's admirers and imitators. They also touched on the state of late night TV in 2025, the failures of Chevy Chase and Magic Johnson, and the wars between Team Letterman and Team Leno, as well as Team Leno vs. Team Conan.   Mark's book is available to purchase right now, which can be found here. Love Johnny Carson by Mark Malkoff: 9780593472552 | PenguinRandomHouse.com: Books   He also hosts the Inside Late Night podcast. Podcasts - LateNighter   Be sure to subscribe to Tony's Patreon. $3 gets you just audio, $5 gets video AND audio, and $10 has all of the above, as well as bonus podcasts per week. Visit Patreon.com/TonyMazur. Tony is also on Rumble! Go find his video podcasts over there for free.   Cover art for the Check Your Brain podcast is by Eric C. Fischer. If you need terrific graphic design work done, contact Eric at illstr8r@gmail.com.

What does it take to keep your voice—and your purpose—strong through every season of life? In this episode of Unstoppable Mindset, I sit down with my friend Bill Ratner, one of Hollywood's most recognized voice actors, best known as Flint from GI Joe. Bill's voice has carried him through radio, animation, and narration, but what stands out most is how he's used that same voice to serve others through storytelling, teaching, and grief counseling. Together, we explore the heart behind his work—from bringing animated heroes to life to standing on The Moth stage and helping people find healing through poetry. Bill shares lessons from his own journey, including losing both parents early, finding family in unexpected places, and discovering how creative expression can rebuild what life breaks down. We also reflect on 9/11, preparedness, and the quiet confidence that comes from trusting your training—whether you're a first responder, a performer, or just navigating the unknown. This conversation isn't just about performance; it's about presence. It's about using your story, your craft, and your compassion to keep moving forward—unstoppable, one voice at a time. Highlights: 00:31 – Hear the Flint voice and what it takes to bring animated characters to life. 06:57 – Learn why an uneven college path still led to a lifelong acting career. 11:50 – Understand how GI Joe became a team and a toy phenomenon that shaped culture. 15:58 – See how comics and cartoons boosted classroom literacy when used well. 17:06 – Pick up simple ways parents can spark reading through shared stories. 19:29 – Discover how early, honest conversations about death can model resilience. 24:09 – Learn to critique ads and media like a pro to sharpen your own performance. 36:19 – Follow the pivot from radio to voiceover and why specialization pays. 47:48 – Hear practical editing approaches and accessible tools that keep shows tight. 49:38 – Learn how The Moth builds storytelling chops through timed, judged practice. 55:21 – See how poetry—and poetry therapy—support grief work with students. 59:39 – Take notes on memoir writing, emotional management, and one-person shows. About the Guest: Bill Ratner is one of America's best known voice actors and author of poetry collections Lamenting While Doing Laps in the Lake (Slow Lightning Lit 2024,) Fear of Fish (Alien Buddha Press 2021,) To Decorate a Casket (Finishing Line Press 2021,) and the non-fiction book Parenting For The Digital Age: The Truth Behind Media's Effect On Children and What To Do About It (Familius Books 2014.) He is a 9-time winner of the Moth StorySLAM, 2-time winner of Best of The Hollywood Fringe Extension Award for Solo Performance, Best of the Net Poetry Nominee 2023 (Lascaux Review,) and New Millennium "America One Year From Now" Writing Award Finalist. His writing appears in Best Small Fictions 2021 (Sonder Press,) Missouri Review (audio,) Baltimore Review, Chiron Review, Feminine Collective, and other journals. He is the voice of "Flint" in the TV cartoon G.I. Joe, "Donnell Udina" in the computer game Mass Effect, the voice of Air Disasters on Smithsonian Channel, NewsNation, and network TV affiliates across the country. He is a committee chair for his union, SAG-AFTRA, teaches Voiceovers for SAG-AFTRA Foundation, Media Awareness for Los Angeles Unified School District, and is a trained grief counsellor. Member: Actors Equity Association, Screen Actors Guild-AFTRA, National Storytelling Network • https://billratner.com • @billratner Ways to connect with Bill: https://soundcloud.com/bill-ratner https://www.instagram.com/billratner/ https://twitter.com/billratner https://www.threads.net/@billratner https://billratner.tumblr.com https://www.youtube.com/@billratner/videos https://www.facebook.com/billratner.voiceover.author https://bsky.app/profile/bilorat.bsky.social About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset . Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes: Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:21 Well on a gracious hello to you, wherever you may be, I am your host. Mike hingson, and you are listening to unstoppable mindset. Today, we get to have a voice actor, person, Bill Ratner, who you want to know who Bill Radnor is, go back and watch the old GI Joe cartoons and listen to the voice of Flint.   Bill Ratner ** 01:42 All right. Lady Jay, you better get your battle gear on, because Cobra is on their way. And I can't bring up the Lacher threat weapon system. We got to get out of here. Yo, Joe,   Michael Hingson ** 01:52 there you go. I rest my case Well, Bill, welcome to unstoppable mindset.   Bill Ratner ** 02:00 We can't rest now. Michael, we've just begun. No, we've just begun.   Michael Hingson ** 02:04 We got to keep going here. Well, I'm really glad that you're here. Bill is another person who we inveigled to get on unstoppable mindset with the help of Walden Hughes. And so that means we can talk about Walden all we want today. Bill just saying, oh goodness. And I got a lot to say. Let me tell you perfect, perfect. Bring it on. So we are really grateful to Walden, although I hope he's not listening. We don't want to give him a big head. But no, seriously, we're really grateful. Ah, good point.   Bill Ratner ** 02:38 But his posture, oddly enough, is perfect.   Michael Hingson ** 02:40 Well, there you go. What do you do? He practiced. Well, anyway, we're glad you're here. Tell us about the early bill, growing up and all that stuff. It's always fun to start a good beginning.   Bill Ratner ** 02:54 Well, I was a very lucky little boy. I was born in Des Moines, Iowa in 1947 to two lovely people, professionals, both with master's degree out at University of Chicago. My mother was a social worker. My father had an MBA in business. He was managing editor of Better Homes and Gardens magazine. So I had the joy of living in a better home and living in a garden.   Michael Hingson ** 03:21 My mother. How long were you in Des Moines?   Bill Ratner ** 03:24 Five and a half years left before my sixth birthday. My dad got a fancy job at an ad agency in Minneapolis, and had a big brother named Pete and big handsome, curly haired boy with green eyes. And moved to Minneapolis, Minnesota, and was was brought up there.   Michael Hingson ** 03:45 Wow. So you went to school there and and chased the girls and all that stuff.   Bill Ratner ** 03:54 I went to school there at Blake School for Boys in Hopkins, Minnesota. Couldn't chase the girls day school, but the girls we are allowed to dance with certainly not chase. Michael was at woodhue dancing school, the Northrop girls from Northrop girls school and the Blake boys were put together in eighth grade and taught the Cha Cha Cha, the waltz, the Charleston, and we danced together, and the girls wore white gloves, and we sniffed their perfume, and we all learned how to be lovers when we were 45   Michael Hingson ** 04:37 There you are. Well, as long as you learned at some point, that's a good start.   Bill Ratner ** 04:44 It's a weird generation. Michael,   Michael Hingson ** 04:46 I've been to Des Moines before. I was born in Chicago, but moved out to California when I was five, but I did some work with the National Federation of the Blind in the mid 19. 1970s 1976 into 1978 so spent time at the Iowa Commission for the Blind in Des Moines, which became a top agency for the Blind in well, the late 50s into the to the 60s and so on. So   Bill Ratner ** 05:15 both my parents are from Chicago. My father from the south side of Chicago, 44th and Kenzie, which was a Irish, Polish, Italian, Jewish, Ukrainian neighborhood. And my mother from Glencoe, which was a middle class suburb above Northwestern University in Evanston.   Michael Hingson ** 05:34 I Where were you born? 57th and union, north, south side, no, South   Bill Ratner ** 05:42 57th union is that? Is that west of Kenzie?   Michael Hingson ** 05:46 You know, I don't remember the geography well enough to know, but I know that it was, I think, Mount Sinai Hospital where I was born. But it was, it's, it's, it's a pretty tough neighborhood today. So I understand,   Bill Ratner ** 06:00 yeah, yeah, my it was tough, then it's tough now,   Michael Hingson ** 06:03 yeah, I think it's tougher, supposedly, than it was. But we lived there for five years, and then we we moved to California, and I remember some things about Chicago. I remember walking down to the local candy store most days, and had no problem doing that. My parents were told they should shut me away at a home somewhere, because no blind child could ever grow up to amount to anything. And my parents said, You guys are you're totally wrong. And they brought me up with that attitude. So, you   Bill Ratner ** 06:32 know who said that the school says school so that   Michael Hingson ** 06:35 doctors doctors when they discovered I was blind with the   Bill Ratner ** 06:38 kid, goodness gracious, horrified.   Michael Hingson ** 06:44 Well, my parents said absolutely not, and they brought me up, and they actually worked with other parents of premature kids who became blind, and when kindergarten started in for us in in the age of four, they actually had a special kindergarten class for blind kids at the Perry School, which is where I went. And so I did that for a year, learn braille and some other things. Then we moved to California, but yeah, and I go back to Chicago every so often. And when I do nowadays, they I one of my favorite places to migrate in Chicago is Garrett Popcorn.   Bill Ratner ** 07:21 Ah, yes, with caramel corn, regular corn, the   Michael Hingson ** 07:25 Chicago blend, which is a mixture, yeah, the Chicago blend is cheese corn, well, as it is with caramel corn, and they put much other mozzarella on it as well. It's really good.   Bill Ratner ** 07:39 Yeah, so we're on the air. Michael, what do you call your what do you call your program? Here I am your new friend, and I can't even announce your program because I don't know   Michael Hingson ** 07:48 the name, unstoppable mindset. This   Bill Ratner ** 07:51 is unstoppable mindset.   Michael Hingson ** 07:56 We're back. Well, we're back already. We're fast. So you, you, you moved off elsewhere, out of Des Moines and all that. And where did you go to college?   Bill Ratner ** 08:09 Well, this is like, why did you this is, this is a bit like talking about the Vietnam War. Looking back on my college career is like looking back on the Vietnam War series, a series of delusions and defeats. By the time I the time i for college, by the time I was applying for college, I was an orphan, orphan, having been born to fabulous parents who died too young of natural causes. So my grades in high school were my mediocre. I couldn't get into the Ivy Leagues. I got into the big 10 schools. My stepmother said, you're going to Michigan State in East Lansing because your cousin Eddie became a successful realtor. And Michigan State was known as mu u it was the most successful, largest agriculture college and university in the country. Kids from South Asia, China, Northern Europe, Southern Europe, South America all over the world came to Michigan State to study agricultural sciences, children of rich farmers all over the world and middle class farmers all over the world, and a huge police science department. Part of the campus was fenced off, and the young cadets, 1819, 20 years old, would practice on the rest of the student body, uniformed with hats and all right, excuse me, young man, we're just going to get some pizza at eight o'clock on Friday night. Stand against your car. Hands in your car. I said, Are you guys practicing again? Shut up and spread your legs. So that was that was Michigan State, and even though both my parents had master's degrees, I just found all the diversions available in the 1960s to be too interesting, and was not invited. Return after my sophomore year, and in order to flunk out of a big 10 University, and they're fine universities, all of them, you have to be either really determined or not so smart, not really capable of doing that level of study in undergraduate school. And I'd like to think that I was determined. I used to show up for my exams with a little blue book, and the only thing I would write is due to lack of knowledge, I am unable to complete this exam, sign Bill ranter and get up early and hand it in and go off. And so what was, what was left for a young man like that was the theater I'd seen the great Zero Mostel when I was 14 years old and on stage live, he looked just like my father, and he was funny, and if I Were a rich man, and that's the grade zero must tell. Yeah, and it took about five, no, it took about six, seven years to percolate inside my bread and my brain. In high school, I didn't want to do theater. The cheerleaders and guys who I had didn't happen to be friends with or doing theater. I took my girlfriends to see plays, but when I was 21 I started acting, and I've been an actor ever since. I'm a committee chair on the screen actors guild in Hollywood and Screen Actors Guild AFTRA, and work as a voice actor and collect my pensions and God bless the union.   Michael Hingson ** 11:44 Well, hey, as long as it works and you're making progress, you know you're still with it, right?   Bill Ratner ** 11:53 That's the that's the point. There's no accounting for taste in my business. Michael, you work for a few different broadcast entities at my age. And it's, you know, it's younger people. It's 18 to 3418 years to 34 years old is the ideal demographic for advertisers, Ford, Motor Company, Dove soap, Betty, Crocker, cake mixes and cereals, every conceivable product that sold online or sold on television and radio. This is my this is my meat, and I don't work for religion. However, if a religious organization calls, I call and say, I I'm not, not qualified or not have my divinity degree in order to sell your church to the public?   Michael Hingson ** 12:46 Yeah, yeah. Well, I, I can understand that. But you, you obviously do a lot, and as we talked about, you were Flint and GI Joe, which is kind of cool.   Bill Ratner ** 13:01 Flynn GI Joe was very cool. Hasbro Corporation, which was based in Providence, Rhode Island, had a huge success with GI Joe, the figure. The figure was about 11 and a half inches tall, like a Barbie, and was at first, was introduced to the public after the Korean War. There is a comic book that was that was also published about GI Joe. He was an individual figure. He was a figure, a sort of mythic cartoon figure during World War Two, GI Joe, generic American soldier, fighting man and but the Vietnam war dragged on for a long time, and the American buying public or buying kids toys got tired of GI Joe, got tired of a military figure in their household and stopped buying. And when Nixon ended the Vietnam War, or allotted to finish in 1974 Hasbro was in the tank. It's got its stock was cheap, and executives are getting nervous. And then came the Great George Lucas in Star Wars, who shrank all these action figures down from 11 and a half inches to three and a half inches, and went to China and had Chinese game and toy makers make Star Wars toys, and began to earn billions and billions dollars. And so Hasbro said, let's turn GI Joe into into a team. And the team began with flint and Lady J and Scarlett and Duke and Destro and cover commander, and grew to 85 different characters, because Hasbro and the toy maker partners could create 85 different sets of toys and action figures. So I was actor in this show and had a good time, and also a purveyor of a billion dollar industry of American toys. And the good news about these toys is I was at a conference where we signed autographs the voice actors, and we have supper with fans and so on. And I was sitting next to a 30 year old kid and his parents. And this kid was so knowledgeable about pop culture and every conceivable children's show and animated show that had ever been on the screen or on television. I turned to his mother and sort of being a wise acre, said, So ma'am, how do you feel about your 30 year old still playing with GI Joe action figures? And she said, Well, he and I both teach English in the Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania school system, and last year, the literacy level of my ninth graders was 50% 50% of those kids could not read in ninth grade. So I asked the principal if I could borrow my son's GI Joe, action figures, comic books and VHS tapes, recordings of the shows from TV. And he said, Sure, whatever you want to try. And so she did, and she played the video tapes, and these kids were thrilled. They'd never seen a GI Joe cartoon in class before. Passed out the comic books, let him read comics. And then she said, Okay, you guys. And passed out notebooks and pens and pencils, and said, I want you guys to make up some some shows, some GI Joe shows. And so they said, Yeah, we're ready. All right, Cobra, you better get into the barber shop, because the barber bill is no longer there and the fire engines are in the way. And wait a minute, there's a dog in the street. And so they're making this up, using their imagination, doing their schoolwork, by coming up with scenarios, imaginary fam fan fiction for GI Joe and she raised the literacy level in her classroom by 50% that year, by the end of that year, so, so that was the only story that I've ever heard about the sort of the efficacy of GI Joe, other than, you know, kids play with them. Do they? Are they shooting each other all the time? I certainly hope not. I hope not. Are they using the action figures? Do they strip their guns off and put them in a little, you know, stub over by the side and and have them do physical battle with each other, or have them hump the woods, or have them climb the stairs, or have them search the trees. Who knows what kids do? Same with same with girls and and Barbies. Barbie has been a source of fun and creativity for lots of girls, and the source of of worry and bother to a lot of parents as   Michael Hingson ** 17:54 well. Well, at the same time, though, when kids start to react and relate to some of these things. It's, it's pretty cool. I mean, look what's happened with the whole Harry Potter movement and craze. Harry Potter has probably done more in the last 20 or 25 years to promote reading for kids than most anything else, and   Bill Ratner ** 18:17 that's because it's such a good series of books. I read them to my daughters, yeah. And the quality of writing. She was a brilliant writer, not only just the stories and the storytelling, which is fun to watch in the movies, and you know, it's great for a parent to read. If there are any parents listening, I don't care how old your kids are. I don't care if they're 15. Offer to read to them. The 15 year old might, of course, say mom, but anybody younger than that might say either, all right, fine, which is, which means you better do it or read, read a book. To me, sure, it's fun for the parent, fun for the kid, and it makes the child a completely different kind of thinker and worker and earner.   Michael Hingson ** 19:05 Well, also the people who they got to read the books for the recordings Stephen Fry and in the US here, Jim Dale did such an incredible job as well. I've, I've read the whole Harry Potter series more than once, because I just enjoy them, and I enjoy listening to the the voices. They do such a good job. Yeah. And of course, for me, one of the interesting stories that I know about Jim Dale reading Harry Potter was since it was published by Scholastic he was actually scheduled to do a reading from one of the Harry from the new Harry Potter book that was coming out in 2001 on September 11, he was going to be at Scholastic reading. And of course, that didn't happen because of of everything that did occur. So I don't know whether I'm. I'm assuming at some point a little bit later, he did, but still he was scheduled to be there and read. But it they are there. They've done so much to help promote reading, and a lot of those kinds of cartoons and so on. Have done some of that, which is, which is pretty good. So it's good to, you know, to see that continue to happen. Well, so you've written several books on poetry and so on, and I know that you you've mentioned more than once grief and loss. How come those words keep coming up?   Bill Ratner ** 20:40 Well, I had an unusual childhood. Again. I mentioned earlier how, what a lucky kid I was. My parents were happy, educated, good people, not abusers. You know, I don't have a I don't have horror stories to tell about my mother or my father, until my mother grew sick with breast cancer and and it took about a year and a half or two years to die when I was seven years old. The good news is, because she was a sensitive, educated social worker, as she was actually dying, she arranged a death counseling session with me and my older brother and the Unitarian minister who was also a death counselor, and whom she was seeing to talk about, you know, what it was like to be dying of breast cancer with two young kids. And at this session, which was sort of surprised me, I was second grade, came home from school. In the living room was my mother and my brother looking a little nervous, and Dr Carl storm from the Unitarian Church, and she said, you know, Dr storm from church, but he's also my therapist. And we talk about my illness and how I feel, and we talk about how much I love you boys, and talk about how I worry about Daddy. And this is what one does when one is in crisis. That was a moment that was not traumatic for me. It's a moment I recalled hundreds of times, and one that has been a guiding light through my life. My mother's death was very difficult for my older brother, who was 13 who grew up in World War Two without without my father, it was just him and my mother when he was off in the Pacific fighting in World War Two. And then I was born after the war. And the loss of a mother in a family is like the bottom dropping out of a family. But luckily, my dad met a woman he worked with a highly placed advertising executive, which was unusual for a female in the 1950s and she became our stepmother a year later, and we had some very lovely, warm family years with her extended family and our extended family and all of us together until my brother got sick, came down with kidney disease a couple of years before kidney dialysis was invented, and a couple of years before kidney transplants were done, died at 19. Had been the captain of the swimming team at our high school, but did a year in college out in California and died on Halloween of 1960 my father was 51 years old. His eldest son had died. He had lost his wife six years earlier. He was working too hard in the advertising industry, successful man and dropped out of a heart attack 14th birthday. Gosh, I found him unconscious on the floor of our master bathroom in our house. So my life changed. I My life has taught me many, many things. It's taught me how the defense system works in trauma. It's taught me the resilience of a child. It's taught me the kindness of strangers. It's taught me the sadness of loss.   Michael Hingson ** 24:09 Well, you, you seem to come through all of it pretty well. Well, thank you. A question behind that, just an observation, but, but you do seem to, you know, obviously, cope with all of it and do pretty well. So you, you've always liked to be involved in acting and so on. How did you actually end up deciding to be a voice actor?   Bill Ratner ** 24:39 Well, my dad, after he was managing editor of Better Homes and Gardens magazine in Des Moines for Meredith publishing, got offered a fancy job as executive vice president of the flower and mix division for Campbell within advertising and later at General Mills Corporation. From Betty Crocker brand, and would bring me to work all the time, and would sit with me, and we'd watch the wonderful old westerns that were on prime time television, rawhide and Gunsmoke and the Virginian and sure   Michael Hingson ** 25:15 and all those. Yeah, during   Bill Ratner ** 25:17 the commercials, my father would make fun of the commercials. Oh, look at that guy. And number one, son, that's lousy acting. Number two, listen to that copy. It's the dumbest ad copy I've ever seen. The jingles and and then he would say, No, that's a good commercial, right there. And he wasn't always negative. He would he was just a good critic of advertising. So at a very young age, starting, you know, when we watch television, I think the first television ever, he bought us when I was five years old, I was around one of the most educated, active, funny, animated television critics I could hope to have in my life as a 56789, 1011, 12 year old. And so when I was 12, I became one of the founding members of the Brotherhood of radio stations with my friends John Waterhouse and John Barstow and Steve gray and Bill Connors in South Minneapolis. I named my five watt night kit am transmitter after my sixth grade teacher, Bob close this is wclo stereo radio. And when I was in sixth grade, I built myself a switch box, and I had a turntable and I had an intercom, and I wired my house for sound, as did all the other boys in the in the B, O, R, S, and that's brotherhood of radio stations. And we were guests on each other's shows, and we were obsessed, and we would go to the shopping malls whenever a local DJ was making an appearance and torture him and ask him dumb questions and listen obsessively to American am radio. And at the time for am radio, not FM like today, or internet on your little radio tuner, all the big old grandma and grandpa radios, the wooden ones, were AM, for amplitude modulated. You could get stations at night, once the sun went down and the later it got, the ionosphere would lift and the am radio signals would bounce higher and farther. And in Minneapolis, at age six and seven, I was able to to listen to stations out of Mexico and Texas and Chicago, and was absolutely fascinated with with what was being put out. And I would, I would switch my brother when I was about eight years old, gave me a transistor radio, which I hid under my bed covers. And at night, would turn on and listen for, who knows, hours at a time, and just tuning the dial and tuning the dial from country to rock and roll to hit parade to news to commercials to to agric agriculture reports to cow crossings in Kansas and grain harvesting and cheese making in Wisconsin, and on and on and on that made up the great medium of radio that was handing its power and its business over to television, just as I was growing As a child. Fast, fascinating transition   Michael Hingson ** 28:18 and well, but as it was transitioning, how did that affect you?   Bill Ratner ** 28:26 It made television the romantic, exciting, dynamic medium. It made radio seem a little limited and antiquated, and although I listened for environment and wasn't able to drag a television set under my covers. Yeah, and television became memorable with with everything from actual world war two battle footage being shown because there wasn't enough programming to 1930s Warner Brothers gangster movies with James Cagney, Edward G   Michael Hingson ** 29:01 Robinson and yeah   Bill Ratner ** 29:02 to all the sitcoms, Leave It to Beaver and television cartoons and on and on and on. And the most memorable elements to me were the personalities, and some of whom were invisible. Five years old, I was watching a Kids program after school, after kindergarten. We'll be back with more funny puppets, marionettes after this message and the first words that came on from an invisible voice of this D baritone voice, this commercial message will be 60 seconds long, Chrysler Dodge for 1954 blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I watched hypnotized, hypnotized as a 1953 dodge drove across the screen with a happy family of four waving out the window. And at the end of the commercial, I ran into the kitchen said, Mom, mom, I know what a minute. Is, and it was said, it had suddenly come into my brain in one of those very rare and memorable moments in a person's life where your brain actually speaks to you in its own private language and says, Here is something very new and very true, that 60 seconds is in fact a minute. When someone says, See you in five minutes, they mean five times that, five times as long as that. Chrysler commercial, five times 60. That's 300 seconds. And she said, Did you learn it that that on T in kindergarten? And I said, No, I learned it from kangaroo Bob on TV, his announcer, oh, kangaroo Bob, no, but this guy was invisible. And so at five years of age, I was aware of the existence of the practice of the sound, of the magic of the seemingly unlimited access to facts, figures, products, brand names that these voices had and would say on the air in This sort of majestic, patriarchal way,   Michael Hingson ** 31:21 and just think 20 years later, then you had James Earl Jones,   Bill Ratner ** 31:26 the great dame. James Earl Jones, father was a star on stage at that time the 1950s James Earl Jones came of age in the 60s and became Broadway and off Broadway star.   Michael Hingson ** 31:38 I got to see him in Othello. He was playing Othello. What a powerful performance. It was   Bill Ratner ** 31:43 wonderful performer. Yeah, yeah. I got to see him as Big Daddy in Canada, Hot Tin Roof, ah, live and in person, he got front row seats for me and my family.   Michael Hingson ** 31:53 Yeah, we weren't in the front row, but we saw it. We saw it on on Broadway,   Bill Ratner ** 31:58 the closest I ever got to James Earl Jones. He and I had the same voice over agent, woman named Rita vinari of southern Barth and benare company. And I came into the agency to audition for Doritos, and I hear this magnificent voice coming from behind a closed voiceover booth, saying, with a with a Spanish accent, Doritos. I thought that's James Earl Jones. Why is he saying burritos? And he came out, and he bowed to me, nodded and smiled, and I said, hello and and the agent probably in the booth and shut the door. And she said, I said, that was James Earl Jones. What a voice. What she said, Oh, he's such a nice man. And she said, but I couldn't. I was too embarrassed. I was too afraid to stop him from saying, Doritos. And it turns out he didn't get the gig. So it is some other voice actor got it because he didn't say, had he said Doritos with the agent froze it froze up. That was as close as I ever got to did you get the gig? Oh goodness no,   Michael Hingson ** 33:01 no, you didn't, huh? Oh, well, well, yeah. I mean, it was a very, it was, it was wonderful. It was James Earl Jones and Christopher Plummer played Iago. Oh, goodness, oh, I know. What a what a combination. Well, so you, you did a lot of voiceover stuff. What did you do regarding radio moving forward? Or did you just go completely out of that and you were in TV? Or did you have any opportunity   Bill Ratner ** 33:33 for me to go back at age 15, my brother and father, who were big supporters of my radio. My dad would read my W, C, l, o, newsletter and need an initial, an excellent journalism son and my brother would bring his teenage friends up. He'd play the elderly brothers, man, you got an Elvis record, and I did. And you know, they were, they were big supporters for me as a 13 year old, but when I turned 14, and had lost my brother and my father, I lost my enthusiasm and put all of my radio equipment in a box intended to play with it later. Never, ever, ever did again. And when I was about 30 years old and I'd done years of acting in the theater, having a great time doing fun plays and small theaters in Minneapolis and South Dakota and and Oakland, California and San Francisco. I needed money, so I looked in the want ads and saw a job for telephone sales, and I thought, Well, I used to love the telephone. I used to make phony phone calls to people all the time. Used to call funeral homes. Hi Carson, funeral I help you. Yes, I'm calling to tell you that you have a you have a dark green slate tile. Roof, isn't that correct? Yes. Well, there's, there's a corpse on your roof. Lady for goodness sake, bring it down and we laugh and we record it and and so I thought, Well, gee, I used to have a lot of fun with the phone. And so I called the number of telephone sales and got hired to sell magazine subscriptions and dinner tickets to Union dinners and all kinds of things. And then I saw a new job at a radio station, suburban radio station out in Walnut Creek, California, a lovely Metro BART train ride. And so I got on the BART train, rode out there and walked in for the interview, and was told I was going to be selling small advertising packages on radio for the station on the phone. And so I called barber shops and beauty shops and gas stations in the area, and one guy picked up the phone and said, Wait a minute, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Are you on the radio right now? And I said, No, I'm just I'm in the sales room. Well, maybe you should be. And he slams the phone on me. He didn't want to talk to me anymore. It wasn't interested in buying advertising. I thought, gee. And I told somebody at the station, and they said, Well, you want to be in the radio? And he went, Yeah, I was on the radio when I was 13. And it just so happened that an older fellow was retiring from the 10am to 2pm slot. K I S King, kiss 99 and KD FM, Pittsburgh, California. And it was a beautiful music station. It was a music station. Remember, old enough will remember music that used to play in elevators that was like violin music, the Percy faith orchestra playing a Rolling Stone song here in the elevator. Yes, well, that's exactly what we played. And it would have been harder to get a job at the local rock stations because, you know, they were popular places. And so I applied for the job, and   Michael Hingson ** 37:06 could have lost your voice a lot sooner, and it would have been a lot harder if you had had to do Wolfman Jack. But that's another story.   Bill Ratner ** 37:13 Yeah, I used to listen to Wolf Man Jack. I worked in a studio in Hollywood. He became a studio. Yeah, big time.   Michael Hingson ** 37:22 Anyway, so you you got to work at the muzack station, got   Bill Ratner ** 37:27 to work at the muzack station, and I was moving to Los Angeles to go to a bigger market, to attempt to penetrate a bigger broadcast market. And one of the sales guys, a very nice guy named Ralph pizzella said, Well, when you get to La you should study with a friend of mine down to pie Troy, he teaches voiceovers. I said, What are voice overs? He said, You know that CVS Pharmacy commercial just carted up and did 75 tags, available in San Fernando, available in San Clemente, available in Los Angeles, available in Pasadena. And I said, Yeah. He said, Well, you didn't get paid any extra. You got paid your $165 a week. The guy who did that commercial for the ad agency got paid probably 300 bucks, plus extra for the tags, that's voiceovers. And I thought, why? There's an idea, what a concept. So he gave me the name and number of old friend acquaintance of his who he'd known in radio, named Don DiPietro, alias Johnny rabbit, who worked for the Dick Clark organization, had a big rock and roll station there. He'd come to LA was doing voiceovers and teaching voiceover classes in a little second story storefront out of the San Fernando Valley in Los Angeles. So I signed up for his class, and he was an experienced guy, and he liked me, and we all had fun, and I realized I was beginning to study like an actor at 1818, who goes to New York or goes to Los Angeles or Chicago or Atlanta or St Louis to act in the big theaters, and starts acting classes and realizes, oh my goodness, these people are truly professionals. I don't know how to do what they do. And so for six years, I took voice over classes, probably 4050, nights a year, and from disc jockeys, from ex show hosts, from actors, from animated cartoon voices, and put enough time in to get a degree in neurology in medical school. And worked my way up in radio in Los Angeles and had a morning show, a lovely show with a wonderful news man named Phil Reed, and we talked about things and reviewed movies and and played a lot of music. And then I realized, wait a minute, I'm earning three times the money in voiceovers as I am on the radio, and I have to get up at 430 in the morning to be on the radio. Uh, and a wonderful guy who was Johnny Carson's staff announcer named Jack angel said, You're not still on radio, are you? And I said, Well, yeah, I'm working in the morning. And Ka big, get out of there. Man, quit. Quit. And I thought, well, how can I quit? I've always wanted to be a radio announcer. And then there was another wonderful guy on the old am station, kmpc, sweet Dick Whittington. Whittington, right? And he said at a seminar that I went to at a union voice over training class, when you wake up at four in the morning and you swing your legs over the bed and your shoes hit the floor, and you put your head in your hands, and you say to yourself, I don't want to do this anymore. That's when you quit radio. Well, that hadn't happened to me. I was just getting up early to write some comedy segments and on and on and on, and then I was driving around town all day doing auditions and rented an ex girlfriend's second bedroom so that I could nap by myself during the day, when I had an hour in and I would as I would fall asleep, I'd picture myself every single day I'm in a dark voiceover studio, a microphone Is before me, a music stand is before the microphone, and on it is a piece of paper with advertising copy on it. On the other side of the large piece of glass of the recording booth are three individuals, my employers, I begin to read, and somehow the text leaps off the page, streams into my eyes, letter for letter, word for word, into a part of my back brain that I don't understand and can't describe. It is processed in my semi conscious mind with the help of voice over training and hope and faith, and comes out my mouth, goes into the microphone, is recorded in the digital recorder, and those three men, like little monkeys, lean forward and say, Wow, how do you do that? That was my daily creative visualization. Michael, that was my daily fantasy. And I had learned that from from Dale Carnegie, and I had learned that from Olympic athletes on NBC TV in the 60s and 70s, when the announcer would say, this young man you're seeing practicing his high jump is actually standing there. He's standing stationary, and the bouncing of the head is he's actually rehearsing in his mind running and running and leaping over the seven feet two inch bar and falling into the sawdust. And now he's doing it again, and you could just barely see the man nodding his head on camera at the exact rhythm that he would be running the 25 yards toward the high bar and leaping, and he raised his head up during the imaginary lead that he was visualizing, and then he actually jumped the seven foot two inches. That's how I learned about creative visualization from NBC sports on TV.   Michael Hingson ** 43:23 Channel Four in Los Angeles. There you go. Well, so you you broke into voice over, and that's what you did.   Bill Ratner ** 43:38 That's what I did, darn it, I ain't stopping now, there's a wonderful old actor named Bill Irwin. There two Bill Irwin's one is a younger actor in his 50s or 60s, a brilliant actor from Broadway to film and TV. There's an older William Irwin. They also named Bill Irwin, who's probably in his 90s now. And I went to a premiere of a film, and he was always showing up in these films as The senile stock broker who answers the phone upside down, or the senile board member who always asks inappropriate questions. And I went up to him and I said, you know, I see you in everything, man. I'm 85 years old. Some friends and associates of mine tell me I should slow down. I only got cast in movies and TV when I was 65 I ain't slowing down. If I tried to slow down at 85 I'd have to stop That's my philosophy. My hero is the great Don Pardo, the late great   Michael Hingson ** 44:42 for Saturday Night Live and Jeopardy   Bill Ratner ** 44:45 lives starring Bill Murray, Gilder Radner, and   Michael Hingson ** 44:49 he died for Jeopardy before that,   Bill Ratner ** 44:52 yeah, died at 92 with I picture him, whether it probably not, with a microphone and. His hand in his in his soundproof booth, in his in his garage, and I believe he lived in Arizona, although the show was aired and taped in New York, New York, right where he worked for for decades as a successful announcer. So that's the story.   Michael Hingson ** 45:16 Michael. Well, you know, I miss, very frankly, some of the the the days of radio back in the 60s and 70s and so on. We had, in LA what you mentioned, Dick Whittington, Dick whittinghill on kmpc, Gary Owens, you know, so many people who were such wonderful announcers and doing some wonderful things, and radio just isn't the same anymore. It's gone. It's   Bill Ratner ** 45:47 gone to Tiktok and YouTube. And the truth is, I'm not gonna whine about Tiktok or YouTube, because some of the most creative moments on camera are being done on Tiktok and YouTube by young quote influencers who hire themselves out to advertisers, everything from lipstick. You know,   Speaker 1 ** 46:09 when I went to a party last night was just wild and but this makeup look, watch me apply this lip remover and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, no, I have no lip.   Bill Ratner ** 46:20 You know, these are the people with the voices. These are the new voices. And then, of course, the faces. And so I would really advise before, before people who, in fact, use the internet. If you use the internet, you can't complain if you use the internet, if you go to Facebook or Instagram, or you get collect your email or Google, this or that, which most of us do, it's handy. You can't complain about tick tock, tick tock, tick tock. You can't complain about tick tock or YouTube, because it's what the younger generation is using, and it's what the younger generation advertisers and advertising executives and creators and musicians and actors are using to parade before us, as Gary Owens did, as Marlon Brando did, as Sarah Bernhardt did in the 19 so as all as you do, Michael, you're a parader. You're the head of the parade. You've been in on your own float for years. I read your your bio. I don't even know why you want to waste a minute talking to me for goodness sakes.   Michael Hingson ** 47:26 You know, the one thing about podcasts that I like over radio, and I did radio at kuci for seven years when I was in school, what I really like about podcasts is they're not and this is also would be true for Tiktok and YouTube. Primarily Tiktok, I would would say it isn't as structured. So if we don't finish in 60 minutes, and we finish in 61 minutes, no one's gonna shoot us.   Bill Ratner ** 47:53 Well, I beg to differ with you. Now. I'm gonna start a fight with you. Michael, yeah, we need conflict in this script. Is that it The Tick Tock is very structured. Six. No,   Michael Hingson ** 48:03 no, I understand that. I'm talking about podcasts,   Bill Ratner ** 48:07 though, but there's a problem. We gotta Tone It Up. We gotta pick it up. We gotta there's a lot of and I listen to what are otherwise really bright, wonderful personalities on screen, celebrities who have podcasts and the car sucks, and then I had meatballs for dinner, haha. And you know what my wife said? Why? You know? And there's just too much of that. And,   Michael Hingson ** 48:32 oh, I understand, yeah. I mean, it's like, like anything, but I'm just saying that's one of the reasons I love podcasting. So it's my way of continuing what I used to do in radio and having a lot of fun doing it   Bill Ratner ** 48:43 all right, let me ask you. Let me ask you a technical and editorial question. Let me ask you an artistic question. An artist, can you edit this podcast? Yeah. Are you? Do you plan to Nope.   Michael Hingson ** 48:56 I think conversations are conversations, but there is a but, I mean,   Bill Ratner ** 49:01 there have been starts and stops and I answer a question, and there's a long pause, and then, yeah, we can do you edit that stuff   Michael Hingson ** 49:08 out. We do, we do, edit some of that out. And I have somebody that that that does a lot of it, because I'm doing more podcasts, and also I travel and speak, but I can edit. There's a program called Reaper, which is really a very sophisticated   Bill Ratner ** 49:26 close up spaces. You   Michael Hingson ** 49:28 can close up spaces with it, yes, but the neat thing about Reaper is that somebody has written scripts to make it incredibly accessible for blind people using screen readers.   Bill Ratner ** 49:40 What does it do? What does it do? Give me the elevator pitch.   Michael Hingson ** 49:46 You've seen some of the the programs that people use, like computer vision and other things to do editing of videos and so on. Yeah.   Bill Ratner ** 49:55 Yeah. Even Apple. Apple edit. What is it called? Apple? Garage Band. No, that's audio. What's that   Michael Hingson ** 50:03 audio? Oh,   Bill Ratner ** 50:06 quick time is quick   Michael Hingson ** 50:07 time. But whether it's video or audio, the point is that Reaper allows me to do all of that. I can edit audio. I can insert, I can remove pauses. I can do anything with Reaper that anyone else can do editing audio, because it's been made completely accessible.   Bill Ratner ** 50:27 That's great. That's good. That's nice. Oh, it is. It's cool.   Michael Hingson ** 50:31 So so if I want, I can edit this and just have my questions and then silence when you're talking.   Bill Ratner ** 50:38 That might be best. Ladies and gentlemen, here's Bill Ratner,   Michael Hingson ** 50:46 yep, exactly, exactly. Now you have won the moth stories. Slam, what? Tell me about my story. Slam, you've won it nine times.   Bill Ratner ** 51:00 The Moth was started by a writer, a novelist who had lived in the South and moved to New York City, successful novelist named George Dawes green. And the inception of the moth, which many people listening are familiar with from the Moth Radio Hour. It was, I believe, either late 90s or early 2000s when he'd been in New York for a while and was was publishing as a fiction writer, and threw a party, and decided, instead of going to one of these dumb, boring parties or the same drinks being served and same cigarettes being smoked out in the veranda and the same orders. I'm going to ask people to bring a five minute story, a personal story, nature, a true story. You don't have to have one to get into the party, but I encourage you to. And so you know, the 3040, 50 people showed up, many of whom had stories, and they had a few drinks, and they had hors d'oeuvres. And then he said, Okay, ladies and gentlemen, take your seats. It's time for and then I picked names out of a hat, and person after person after person stood up in a very unusual setting, which was almost never done at parties. You How often do you see that happen? Suddenly, the room falls silent, and someone with permission being having been asked by the host to tell a personal story, some funny, some tragic, some complex, some embarrassing, some racy, some wild, some action filled. And afterward, the feedback he got from his friends was, this is the most amazing experience I've ever had in my life. And someone said, you need to do this. And he said, Well, you people left a lot of cigarette butts and beer cans around my apartment. And they said, well, let's do it at a coffee shop. Let's do it at a church basement. So slowly but surely, the moth storytelling, story slams, which were designed after the old poetry slams in the 50s and 60s, where they were judged contests like, like a dance contest. Everybody's familiar with dance contests? Well, there were, then came poetry contests with people singing and, you know, and singing and really energetically, really reading. There then came storytelling contests with people standing on a stage before a silent audience, telling a hopefully interesting, riveting story, beginning middle, end in five minutes. And so a coffee house was found. A monthly calendar was set up. Then came the internet. Then it was so popular standing room only that they had to open yet another and another, and today, some 20 years later, 20 some years later, from Austin, Texas to San Francisco, California to Minneapolis, Minnesota to New York City to Los Angeles. There are moth story slams available on online for you to schedule yourself to go live and in person at the moth.org as in the moth with wings. Friend of mine, I was in New York. He said, You can't believe it. This writer guy, a writer friend of mine who I had read, kind of an avant garde, strange, funny writer was was hosting something called the moth in New York, and we were texting each other. He said, Well, I want to go. The theme was show business. I was going to talk to my Uncle Bobby, who was the bell boy. And I Love Lucy. I'll tell a story. And I texted him that day. He said, Oh man, I'm so sorry. I had the day wrong. It's next week. Next week, I'm going to be back home. And so he said, Well, I think there's a moth in Los Angeles. So about 15 years ago, I searched it down and what? Went to a small Korean barbecue that had a tiny little stage that originally was for Korean musicians, and it was now being used for everything from stand up comedy to evenings of rock and roll to now moth storytelling once a month. And I think the theme was first time. And so I got up and told a silly story and didn't win first prize. They have judges that volunteer judges a table of three judges scoring, you like, at a swim meet or a track beat or, you know, and our gymnastics meet. So this is all sort of familiar territory for everybody, except it's storytelling and not high jumping or pull ups. And I kept going back. I was addicted to it. I would write a story and I'd memorize it, and I'd show up and try to make it four minutes and 50 seconds and try to make it sound like I was really telling a story and not reading from a script. And wish I wasn't, because I would throw the script away, and I knew the stories well enough. And then they created a radio show. And then I began to win slams and compete in the grand slams. And then I started submitting these 750 word, you know, two and a half page stories. Literary magazines got a few published and found a whole new way to spend my time and not make much   Michael Hingson ** 56:25 money. Then you went into poetry.   Bill Ratner ** 56:29 Then I got so bored with my prose writing that I took a poetry course from a wonderful guy in LA called Jack grapes, who had been an actor and a football player and come to Hollywood and did some TV, episodics and and some some episodic TV, and taught poetry. It was a poet in the schools, and I took his class of adults and got a poem published. And thought, wait a minute, these aren't even 750 words. They're like 75 words. I mean, you could write a 10,000 word poem if you want, but some people have, yeah, and it was complex, and there was so much to read and so much to learn and so much that was interesting and odd. And a daughter of a friend of mine is a poet, said, Mommy, are you going to read me one of those little word movies before I go to sleep?   Michael Hingson ** 57:23 A little word movie, word movie out of the   Bill Ratner ** 57:27 mouths of babes. Yeah, and so, so and I perform. You know, last night, I was in Orange County at a organization called ugly mug Cafe, and a bunch of us poets read from an anthology that was published, and we sold our books, and heard other young poets who were absolutely marvelous and and it's, you know, it's not for everybody, but it's one of the things I do.   Michael Hingson ** 57:54 Well, you sent me pictures of book covers, so they're going to be in the show notes. And I hope people will will go out and get them   Bill Ratner ** 58:01 cool. One of the one of the things that I did with poetry, in addition to wanting to get published and wanting to read before people, is wanting to see if there is a way. Because poetry was, was very satisfying, emotionally to me, intellectually very challenging and satisfying at times. And emotionally challenging and very satisfying at times, writing about things personal, writing about nature, writing about friends, writing about stories that I received some training from the National Association for poetry therapy. Poetry therapy is being used like art therapy, right? And have conducted some sessions and and participated in many and ended up working with eighth graders of kids who had lost someone to death in the past year of their lives. This is before covid in the public schools in Los Angeles. And so there's a lot of that kind of work that is being done by constable people, by writers, by poets, by playwrights,   Michael Hingson ** 59:09 and you became a grief counselor,   Bill Ratner ** 59:13 yes, and don't do that full time, because I do voiceovers full time, right? Write poetry and a grand. Am an active grandparent, but I do the occasional poetry session around around grief poetry.   Michael Hingson ** 59:31 So you're a grandparent, so you've had kids and all that. Yes, sir, well, that's is your wife still with us? Yes?   Bill Ratner ** 59:40 Oh, great, yeah, she's an artist and an art educator. Well, that   Michael Hingson ** 59:46 so the two of you can criticize each other's works, then, just   Bill Ratner ** 59:52 saying, we're actually pretty kind to each other. I Yeah, we have a lot of we have a lot of outside criticism. Them. So, yeah, you don't need to do it internally. We don't rely on it. What do you think of this although, although, more than occasionally, each of us will say, What do you think of this poem, honey? Or what do you think of this painting, honey? And my the favorite, favorite thing that my wife says that always thrills me and makes me very happy to be with her is, I'll come down and she's beginning a new work of a new piece of art for an exhibition somewhere. I'll say, what? Tell me about what's, what's going on with that, and she'll go, you know, I have no idea, but it'll tell me what to do.   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:33 Yeah, it's, it's like a lot of authors talk about the fact that their characters write the stories right, which, which makes a lot of sense. So with all that you've done, are you writing a memoir? By any chance, I   Bill Ratner ** 1:00:46 am writing a memoir, and writing has been interesting. I've been doing it for many years. I got it was my graduate thesis from University of California Riverside Palm Desert.   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:57 My wife was a UC Riverside graduate. Oh, hi. Well, they   Bill Ratner ** 1:01:01 have a low residency program where you go for 10 days in January, 10 days in June. The rest of it's online, which a lot of universities are doing, low residency programs for people who work and I got an MFA in creative writing nonfiction, had a book called parenting for the digital age, the truth about media's effect on children. And was halfway through it, the publisher liked it, but they said you got to double the length. So I went back to school to try to figure out how to double the length. And was was able to do it, and decided to move on to personal memoir and personal storytelling, such as goes on at the moth but a little more personal than that. Some of the material that I was reading in the memoir section of a bookstore was very, very personal and was very helpful to read about people who've gone through particular issues in their childhood. Mine not being physical abuse or sexual abuse, mine being death and loss, which is different. And so that became a focus of my graduate thesis, and many people were urging me to write a memoir. Someone said, you need to do a one man show. So I entered the Hollywood fringe and did a one man show and got good reviews and had a good time and did another one man show the next year and and so on. So But writing memoir as anybody knows, and they're probably listeners who are either taking memoir courses online or who may be actively writing memoirs or short memoir pieces, as everybody knows it, can put you through moods from absolutely ecstatic, oh my gosh, I got this done. I got this story told, and someone liked it, to oh my gosh, I'm so depressed I don't understand why. Oh, wait a minute, I was writing about such and such today. Yeah. So that's the challenge for the memoir is for the personal storyteller, it's also, you know, and it's more of a challenge than it is for the reader, unless it's bad writing and the reader can't stand that. For me as a reader, I'm fascinated by people's difficult stories, if they're well   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:24 told well, I know that when in 2002 I was advised to write a book about the World Trade Center experiences and all, and it took eight years to kind of pull it all together. And then I met a woman who actually I collaborated with, Susie Florey, and we wrote thunder dog. And her agent became my agent, who loved the proposal that we sent and actually got a contract within a week. So thunder dog came out in 2011 was a New York Times bestseller, and very blessed by that, and we're working toward the day that it will become a movie still, but it'll happen. And then I wrote a children's version of it, well, not a children's version of the book, but a children's book about me growing up in Roselle, growing up the guide dog who was with me in the World Trade Center, and that's been on Amazon. We self published it. Then last year, we published a new book called Live like a guide dog, which is all about controlling fear and teaching people lessons that I learned prior to September 11. That helped me focus and remain calm.   Bill Ratner ** 1:04:23 What happened to you on September 11,   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:27 I was in the World Trade Center. I worked on the 78th floor of Tower One.   Bill Ratner ** 1:04:32 And what happened? I mean, what happened to you?   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:36 Um, nothing that day. I mean, well, I got out. How did you get out? Down the stairs? That was the only way to go. So, so the real story is not doing it, but why it worked. And the real issue is that I spent a lot of time when I first went into the World Trade Center, learning all I could about what to do in an emergency, talking to police, port authorities. Security people, emergency preparedness people, and also just walking around the world trade center and learning the whole place, because I ran an office for a company, and I wasn't going to rely on someone else to, like, lead me around if we're going to go to lunch somewhere and take people out before we negotiated contracts. So I needed to know all of that, and I learned all I could, also realizing that if there ever was an emergency, I might be the only one in the office, or we might be in an area where people couldn't read the signs to know what to do anyway. And so I had to take the responsibility of learning all that, which I did. And then when the planes hit 18 floors above us on the other side of the building, we get we had some guests in the office. Got them out, and then another colleague, who was in from our corporate office, and I and my guide dog, Roselle, went to the stairs, and we started down. And   Bill Ratner ** 1:05:54 so, so what floor did the plane strike?   Michael Hingson ** 1:05:58 It struck and the NOR and the North Tower, between floors 93 and 99 so I just say 96 okay, and you were 20 floors down, 78 floors 78 so we were 18 floors below, and   Bill Ratner ** 1:06:09 at the moment of impact, what did you think?   Michael Hingson ** 1:06:13 Had no idea we heard a muffled kind of explosion, because the plane hit on the other side of the building, 18 floors above us. There was no way to know what was going on. Did you feel? Did you feel? Oh, the building literally tipped, probably about 20 feet. It kept tipping. And then we actually said goodbye to each other, and then the building came back upright. And then we went,   Bill Ratner ** 1:06:34 really you so you thought you were going to die?   Michael Hingson ** 1:06:38 David, my colleague who was with me, as I said, he was from our California office, and he was there to help with some seminars we were going to be doing. We actually were saying goodbye to each other because we thought we were about to take a 78 floor plunge to the street, when the building stopped tipping and it came back. Designed to do that by the architect. It was designed to do that, which is the point, the point.   Bill Ratner ** 1:07:02 Goodness, gracious. And then did you know how to get to the stairway?   Michael Hingson ** 1:07:04 Oh, absolutely. And did you do it with your friend? Yeah, the first thing we did, the first thing we did is I got him to get we had some guests, and I said, get him to the stairs. Don't let him take the elevators, because I knew he had seen fire above us, but that's all we knew. And but I said, don't take the elevators. Don't let them take elevators. Get them to the stairs and then come back and we'll leave. So he did all that, and then he came back, and we went to the stairs and started down.   Bill Ratner ** 1:07:33 Wow. Could you smell anything?   Michael Hingson ** 1:07:36 We smelled burning jet fuel fumes on the way down. And that's how we figured out an airplane must have hit the building, but we had no idea what happened. We didn't know what happened until the until both towers had collapsed, and I actually talked to my wife, and she's the one who told us how to aircraft have been crashed into the towers, one into the Pentagon, and a fourth, at that time, was still missing over Pennsylvania. Wow. So you'll have to go pick up a copy of thunder dog. Goodness. Good. Thunder dog. The name of the book is Thunder dog, and the book I wrote last year is called Live like a guide dog. It's le

The guys mark the 20th anniversary of Johnny Carson's passing — and the death of late-night entertainment as we knew it. Then they dive into the NBA gambling scandal, the NYC mayoral race, and Maine's Democrat Senate candidate who somehow missed the Nazi tattoo on his arm. They wrap with a hard-hitting “offensive political battle plan” for the Trump Administration to end the government shutdown.

Over 30 people, including NBA players, have been arrested on federal gambling-related investigations. Mark interviews comedian and writer Mark Malkoff. Mark has a new book out called " Love Johnny Carson". The book highlights moments from Johnny's life on The Tonight Show and off-air action. Andrew Cuomo's polling numbers have been climbing since Mayor Eric Adams endorsed him. Mark interviews pollster John McLaughlin. John breaks down the real polls you should look at regarding President Trump's job performance. So far, Republicans are maintaining seats through the midterms, according to McLauglin's knowledge.

Over 30 people, including NBA players, have been arrested on federal gambling-related investigations. Mark interviews comedian and writer Mark Malkoff. Mark has a new book out called " Love Johnny Carson". The book highlights moments from Johnny's life on The Tonight Show and off-air action. Andrew Cuomo's polling numbers have been climbing since Mayor Eric Adams endorsed him. Mark interviews pollster John McLaughlin. John breaks down the real polls you should look at regarding President Trump's job performance. So far, Republicans are maintaining seats through the midterms, according to McLauglin's knowledge. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Mark Malkoff is a comedian, podcaster, and author who wrote Love, Jonny Carson; he's also one of Gavin's high school friends. His new book is a complete look at the amazing career of one of the most important voices in entertainment history. If you love late night and comedy, you gotta check out this in-depth chat they have.

Brian T. Kennedy, Chairman of the Committee on the Present Danger China, starts the show off with Seth on President Trump’s upcoming trip to Asia. Late night television on what would’ve been Johnny Carson’s 100th Birthday. Red Chinese crackdowns on religion. Stephen A. Smith’s commentary on the organized gambling racket scandal rocking the sports world.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

In connection with this week's "Fun For All Ages" episode about Johnny Carson's 100th birthday, GGACP revisits this 2019 interview with comedian-historian and host of "The Carson Podcast," Mark Malkoff and Emmy-winning writer and producer (and lifelong Carson fan) Phil Rosenthal. Also in this episode: The flamboyance of Monti Rock, the “magic” of Uri Geller and Johnny locks horns with “Saturday Night Live." PLUS: Mark (finally) lands Doc Severinsen! And Phil discovers the infamous “Jack Frost” sketch! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Reminiscing with former Tonight Show producer and President of The Carson Entertainment Group and magical variety acts about The King of Late Night, Johnny Carson, on his 100th birthday.

Today marks what would have been the 100th birthday of The King of Late Night – Johnny Carson. To celebrate, we're joined by our old friend Mark Malkoff, whose new book Love Johnny Carson offers a captivating look back at the 30 years Johnny Carson spent behind the desk of The Tonight Show.Mark has an extensive history with Johnny Carson beginning with The Carson Podcast, which ran for over 8 years and featured conversations with more than 300 guests – including writers, crew members, musicians, comedians, and so many of Carson's famous guests. Now, he's compiled those interviews along with four additional years of research (and more interviews) into this heartfelt love letter to one of television's greatest icons.Over the course of our discussion, Mark shares his process in writing the book, explores what made Johnny Carson so special and unique, and reminds us of just how important Carson was during his three decades in late night. He shares stories about Chevy Chase, Jay Leno, David Letterman, and Joan Rivers, as well as reveals his favorite Johnny Carson guest and his pick for Johnny's "Best Bit."Love Johnny Carson is out now. Click here to grab your copy.---------------------------------Subscribe today! Follow us on social media: Twitter: @NR4PTProject Instagram: @nr4ptproject Bluesky: @nr4ptproject.bsky.social Facebook: The Not Ready for Prime Time Project Contact Us: Website: https://www.nr4project.comEmail: nr4ptproject@gmail.com

Darin Cox, our resident Johnny Carson producer and Todd Muench, with Antenna TV, joins Lisa Dent to discuss Johnny Carson’s 100th birthday and the opening of the Johnny Carson exhibit at Chicago’s Museum of Broadcast Communications. Cox shares some of the most memorable Johnny Carson segments and guest appearances. Along side The Johnny Carson Centennial […]

Andrew Cuomo has shifted his personal attacks from Zohran Mamdani to Republican Curtis Sliwa, focusing on winning the NYC mayoral race. Late-night TV has changed over the years. The late, great Johnny Carson was at the top of his game, hosting late-night TV. Are ICE raids throughout the country causing fear among people who are not targeted? Mark interviews author Ann Coulter. Would removing the Democratic Party in NYC solve all the affordability issues in the city? The "No Kings" protests were mostly led by senior citizens.

Andrew Cuomo has shifted his personal attacks from Zohran Mamdani to Republican Curtis Sliwa, focusing on winning the NYC mayoral race. Mark takes your calls! Late-night TV has changed over the years. The late, great Johnny Carson was at the top of his game, hosting late-night TV.

Andrew Cuomo has shifted his personal attacks from Zohran Mamdani to Republican Curtis Sliwa, focusing on winning the NYC mayoral race. Mark takes your calls! Late-night TV has changed over the years. The late, great Johnny Carson was at the top of his game, hosting late-night TV. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Andrew Cuomo has shifted his personal attacks from Zohran Mamdani to Republican Curtis Sliwa, focusing on winning the NYC mayoral race. Late-night TV has changed over the years. The late, great Johnny Carson was at the top of his game, hosting late-night TV. Are ICE raids throughout the country causing fear among people who are not targeted? Mark interviews author Ann Coulter. Would removing the Democratic Party in NYC solve all the affordability issues in the city? The "No Kings" protests were mostly led by senior citizens. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Mark Malkoff joins us today to determine who's more obsessed with Carson - him or Tom. Considering he's written a book and hosted a podcast specifically on the topic, it's safe to say it's him. But we've done almost 3000 episodes of this show and Carson comes up in approximately half of them, so maybe it's closer than you think.On the show:TomAndyKristyn BurttMark MalkoffTopics covered:Halloween moviesTorture porn vs. movies that are actually goodJohnny CarsonLove Johnny CarsonSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

CEO of the Museum of Broadcast Communications and WGN Radio host Dave Plier joins Wendy Snyder (in for Bob Sirott) to talk about the grand opening of the new Museum of Broadcast Communications site. Some of the new exhibits highlight Johnny Carson’s career, five decades of The Loop, and “I Dream of Jeannie.”

An icon of 20th Century American humor, Jack Benny started as a violinist who would use comedy to save himself from bombing. He ended up as a legendary comedian who used the violin as one part of an indelible comic character. Vain, stingy, and eternally 39, Jack became a hit in the 1930s on the then-new medium of radio. He turned that into a stellar movie and television career -- earning himself three stars on Hollywood's Walk of Fame -- one each for movies, radio, and television. Benny was also part of Hollywood's comedy old guard with friends ranging from Bob Hope and Johnny Carson to Benny's long-time best bud George Burns. Benny is often cited as the Jedi master of comic timing -- he could bring down the house with just a glance, a shrug, or a perfectly timed "Well!" As always find extra clips below and thanks for sharing our shows! Want more Jack Benny This is short but worth seeing the visuals as Jack is called out on his age in a delightfully backhanded way. https://youtu.be/qCCzO-9pWls?si=RIi6-QPXUqS4J074 Jack's radio show was fun for some of the byplay between Jack and Announcer Don Wilson. This "marathon" of Benny radio shows has a nice example at the start -- then stick around for more!https://youtu.be/qCCzO-9pWls?si=RIi6-QPXUqS4J074 Jack and Johnny Carson were good friends, dating back to when Johnny was the new kid in town. This bit from Jack's tv show is great fun. https://youtu.be/mUd1-_91YTk?si=3Ob1JIItYTInlxjO Jack received a rare honor when he was cast in his very own Looney Tunes cartoon. Here's a taste, featuring some of Jack's regular co-stars. https://youtu.be/xB6TSameuYQ?si=XUz2xQuUgOuXrQVS

Mut in-studio. Mut provides an update on his leg (00:01:30). Feits went after Pat Bev (00:11:00). Dan Lebetard says goodbye to a producer (00:38:00). Kirk opens Mut's present (00:51:00). Johnny Carson calls in (01:07:00). Gus met up with the Barstool guys in Vegas (01:40:00).You can find every episode of this show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or YouTube. Prime Members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. For more, visit barstool.link/kminshow

Mark's new book Love Johnny Carson comes out today! His co-writer David Ritz joins Mark to discuss writing the book being published by Dutton Books. 

There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”. Mark takes your calls! Mark interviews Boston radio host Howie Carr. Major changes are on the horizon for CBS News. Howie gives us an update on the city of Boston's culture.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Tomorrow night is the last NYC mayoral debate before the election. Mark interviews streaming host Bill O'Reilly. Most people who protested over the weekend in the 'No Kings' rallies are concerned about ICE. Bill's book, "Confronting Evil", explains how Vladimir Putin operates. There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”. Mark interviews Boston radio host Howie Carr. Major changes are on the horizon for CBS News. Howie gives us an update on the city of Boston's culture. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”.

There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”. Mark takes your calls! Mark interviews Boston radio host Howie Carr. Major changes are on the horizon for CBS News. Howie gives us an update on the city of Boston's culture.

Tomorrow night is the last NYC mayoral debate before the election. Mark interviews streaming host Bill O'Reilly. Most people who protested over the weekend in the 'No Kings' rallies are concerned about ICE. Bill's book, "Confronting Evil", explains how Vladimir Putin operates. There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”. Mark interviews Boston radio host Howie Carr. Major changes are on the horizon for CBS News. Howie gives us an update on the city of Boston's culture.

There's a new book out about the late, great Johnny Carson called "Love Johnny Carson”.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

We discuss the Midwest origins of the "King of Late Night," plus the time a whole Iowa town came on Letterman's show. Then, we speak to a current producer for Seth Meyers.

In this episode of Unstoppable Mindset, Michael Hingson welcomes Karolyn Grimes, best known for her unforgettable role as Zuzu Bailey in Frank Capra's timeless classic It's a Wonderful Life. At 85, Karolyn brings not just cherished memories from Hollywood's Golden Age but profound lessons in faith, resilience, and gratitude that still inspire today. She shares vivid behind-the-scenes stories of working with Jimmy Stewart, Cary Grant, John Wayne, and Maureen O'Hara—moments that shaped her life long after the cameras stopped rolling. From learning her lines at six years old to celebrating a surprise birthday on the set of Rio Grande, Karolyn offers a heartfelt glimpse into the wonder and warmth of old Hollywood. But her story reaches far beyond fame. After losing both parents by age fifteen and later enduring the heartbreak of losing her husband and son, Karolyn rediscovered purpose through the enduring message of It's a Wonderful Life. Today, she travels to Seneca Falls, New York—the real-life Bedford Falls—attends festivals, supports the Zuzu House foundation, and co-hosts the Zuzu All Grown Up podcast, continuing to spread the film's message of hope. Michael and Karolyn also share exciting plans for a Richard Diamond, Private Detective radio drama at next year's REPS showcase. Filled with nostalgia, laughter, and heart, this episode reminds us that no matter the season—or the challenges— “It truly is a wonderful life.”   Highlights: 01:24 – Hear how Karolyn's early music and elocution lessons opened doors to a Hollywood career at just six years old. 07:50 – Discover how losing both parents by age fifteen changed her path and led her to a quieter life in Missouri. 14:51 – Learn what it was like to work under Frank Capra's direction and how he brought out the best in young actors. 19:12 – Feel the kindness of Jimmy Stewart as Karolyn recalls a moment when he turned a mistake into encouragement. 27:20 – Relive her birthday surprise on the set of Rio Grande with John Wayne and a cake she'll never forget. 31:29 – Get a candid glimpse of Maureen O'Hara's fiery personality and how it lit up the screen. 47:23 – Walk with Karolyn through Seneca Falls, New York—the real-life inspiration for Bedford Falls—and its annual It's a Wonderful Life festival. 58:27 – See how she keeps the film's spirit alive today through public appearances, the Zuzu House foundation, and her Zuzu All Grown Up podcast.   About the Guest:   Karolyn Grimes is an American actress best remembered for her role as Zuzu Bailey in Frank Capra's timeless film It's a Wonderful Life (1946), where she delivered one of cinema's most cherished lines: “Every time a bell rings, an angel gets his wings.” Born in Hollywood, California, in 1940, Grimes began acting as an infant and appeared in 16 films during her childhood, including The Bishop's Wife (1947). Her early career placed her alongside Hollywood legends like James Stewart, Donna Reed, Loretta Young, and David Niven. She later earned honors such as a star on the Missouri Walk of Fame and the Edwin P. Hubble Medal of Initiative for her contributions to film and culture. Grimes' personal story is one of remarkable endurance. Orphaned by age 15, she was sent from Hollywood to rural Missouri to live with strict relatives, yet she persevered and eventually became a medical technologist. Life brought both love and heartbreak—two marriages, seven children, and the tragic loss of her youngest son and husband. In the 1980s, renewed popularity of It's a Wonderful Life reconnected her with fans and co-stars, inspiring her to embrace the film's message of hope. Today, she travels widely to share her memories of the movie, appears annually at the Seneca Falls celebration that inspired Bedford Falls, and continues to spread its enduring message that every life truly matters.   Ways to connect with Karolyn:   podcast site, www.zuzunetwork.com Facebook page Karolyn Grimes, www.zuzu.net     About the Host:   Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog.   Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children's Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association's 2012 Hero Dog Awards.   https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/   accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/       Thanks for listening!   Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below!   Subscribe to the podcast   If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset .   Leave us an Apple Podcasts review   Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts.       Transcription Notes:   Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us.   Michael Hingson ** 01:20 Well, a gracious hello to you, wherever you happen to be today, I am your host, Mike or Michael. I don't really care which hingson and you are listening to or watching unstoppable mindset. Today, we get a chance to chat with someone who, well, you may or may not know who she is, you will probably by the time we're done, because I'm going to give you a clue. Probably one of the most famous lines that she ever spoke was, whenever a bell rings, an angel gets its wings. And you are right, if you guessed it, you get to meet Zuzu or Karolyn Grimes. Today, I met Karolyn a few years ago when we were both involved in doing recreations of old radio shows with the radio enthusiasts of Puget Sound, and we have had the opportunity to chat and do things together like other recreations ever since. I'm going to miss, unfortunately, the one in September, because I'm going to be off elsewhere in Texas doing a speech. But what do you do anyway? Karolyn or Zuzu, whichever you prefer, welcome to unstoppable mindset. We're really glad you're here.   Karolyn Grimes ** 02:35 I'm so disappointed I don't get to see your dog.   Michael Hingson ** 02:40 Oh, next time. Okay, see we and you know that's the thing Carolyn is, just like everyone else, it's always all about the dog. Forget me. That's okay. It's okay. He loves it.   Karolyn Grimes ** 02:58 Well, I'm sorry you're not coming. Because you know what, I really am going to do a fantastic part that I love, and that's playing Loretta Young's part in the bishop's wife, the bishop's wife, right? Yes, and you're going to miss it. Well, I   Michael Hingson ** 03:14 will probably try to at least listen on the internet and and hear it. I think that'll be fun. It's a it's a great part. Well, you were in the bishop's wife originally, weren't you?   Karolyn Grimes ** 03:25 Yes, I was, who did? Who did you play? I played Little Debbie, who was David Nevin and Loretta Young's little girl, and Cary Grant was an angel who came down to straighten my dad out,   Michael Hingson ** 03:43 and at the end he straightened him out, but there was never any memory of him being there. Was there.   Karolyn Grimes ** 03:50 That's right, he was erased, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 03:56 oh, you know, it's all about doing it, and not about him. So it's okay. I think I thought Cary Grant did a great job. I really always was wonderful, wonderful. What was he like to work with? And what was David Nevin like to work with, much less Loretta Young?   Karolyn Grimes ** 04:13 Well, at the beginning of the movie, they told me not to go near David Nevin. Don't bother him. So I never did. I just had the feeling he didn't like kids or something, I don't know. But Loretta Young was cordial and nice, but she pretty much sat in her chair and studied the script most of the time, so I didn't really get to visit with her all that much, but boy, Cary Grant was hands on. Oh, he was great. He there was a lot of snow in the movie, and there was an ice skating scene, and there was actually an ice rink on our stage. So every day at lunch, he would come and get me and. And he pulled me around on a sled while he practiced ice skating. And that was so much fun,   Michael Hingson ** 05:08 cool. And that was all in Hollywood, right?   05:11 Oh, yes,   Michael Hingson ** 05:15 I, I always found it interesting. We went to see the Rockettes a couple of times at Radio City Music Hall in New York. And it was interesting to see their, quote, ice skating rink, which was, was a very smooth floor and and they could raise it and lower it and all sorts of things. It was. It was kind of fascinating to actually know about that. And I actually got a chance to go look at it was kind of pretty interesting.   Karolyn Grimes ** 05:45 Can you imagine, they actually made a skating rink on stage. I mean, you know, yeah, before miracles.   Michael Hingson ** 05:55 Well, tell us a little bit about, kind of, maybe the early Karolyn growing up, and, you know, how things got started and and what you did a little bit? Well, my   Karolyn Grimes ** 06:04 mother gave me all kinds of lessons. I was an only child, and so when I was about, I guess, three, she started me on the piano, the violin, dancing, which never took singing, and even elocution, diction, everything I had lessons coming out my eyeballs and I played the violin and piano.   Michael Hingson ** 06:30 So did you ever? Did you ever compete with Jack Benny playing the violin? Not hardly just checking.   Karolyn Grimes ** 06:37 I did win a scholarship, though, to go to college on my violin when I was in high school. So, you know, I I played it for a long time, but I didn't play the piano, just I stuck with the violin and I did singing. I did a lot of vocal stuff when I got older, but when I was little, she gave me all these lessons and and I can remember saying, Well, I really don't want to go to school today if I stay at home and I practice my elocution, or I practice this, or practice my piano or whatever, well, then could I stay home and she let me stay home from school so I would practice.   Michael Hingson ** 07:21 Yeah. Did you ever   Karolyn Grimes ** 07:23 go ahead? That's fine, that's all.   Michael Hingson ** 07:26 Did you ever ask her or ever learn why she was so adamant that you took all these kinds of lessons when you were young and so on, as opposed to just going to school and so on. Well,   Karolyn Grimes ** 07:38 unfortunately, she started getting sick when I was eight years old. And, you know, I was too young to think about asking questions like that, you know. And then she died when I was 14. So that was kind of the end of my career, for sure.   Michael Hingson ** 07:55 Well, yeah, and sort of it was but, but you never really did learn why she was so so steadfast in her beliefs that you had to take all of those lessons.   Karolyn Grimes ** 08:07 I had no idea, because when she started getting sick, she had early onset Alzheimer's, and so, you know she wasn't, you couldn't communicate.   Michael Hingson ** 08:18 Really, yeah, yeah. And it was only when you were old enough that that started. So, yeah, you really couldn't get a lot of information and do a lot of communicating. I understand that. No, and you didn't have much time after that to really talk to your father about it either. No, I didn't.   Karolyn Grimes ** 08:41 He died a year after she did. And I was 15, and the court in Hollywood shipped me to a little town in Missouri. I think there were 700 people in the town, or something like that. Yeah. So it's quite a culture shock, but it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Get me out of Hollywood was great.   Michael Hingson ** 09:01 So what did you do then? So you were now 15, and they sent you off to Missouri. Why Missouri?   Karolyn Grimes ** 09:09 Well, those were the only people who volunteered to take me. I had a lot of people in LA, where I lived, who would have taken me, but my father didn't leave a will. So when I asked the judge, I said, Do I have any say at all about who I go to live with? And he said, whatever you want is like a drop in the bucket. So needless to say, my mean aunt and uncle took me back to Missouri, in a little town, but it was like, I say the best thing ever happened to me, because they're real people. They weren't phony. They were they were serious and and they were loving and kind, and they realized I was in a. Horrible home situation. So they really my teachers and merchants, everybody knew, and they really made up for that. They made my life livable and that I will never forget it, and I will always love that town, because   Michael Hingson ** 10:19 what town was it? Osceola,   Karolyn Grimes ** 10:21 Missouri. Oh, Osceola. Okay, I've heard of it. 800 people in there or something.   Michael Hingson ** 10:27 You said they were your mean aunt and uncle. Why did you Why do you call them mean?   Karolyn Grimes ** 10:34 My uncle wasn't mean, but he was beaten down by his wife. She would her. Her best ploy would be to if I did something wrong, she would punish other people. And that was worse than punishing you. Yeah. So it was very, very hard to not do something wrong, because I kind of seemed like I did all the time.   Michael Hingson ** 11:05 Yeah, you didn't know what the rules were. No, yeah, that that made it, made it very tough. So what did you do once you went back there? I assume you went to, you finished school.   Karolyn Grimes ** 11:21 Yes, I finished school, and then I went to college. Where did you go? Well, it was called Central Missouri State at that time, and it was the home of the mules. And of course, my major was music, so that was what I did, mostly with my life, but I ended up going into science and I became medical technologist.   Michael Hingson ** 11:46 Uh huh, well, the mules, so you majored in music. Did you get any advanced degree or just get a bachelor's?   Karolyn Grimes ** 11:57 No, okay, I changed everything and decided that I need to make money instead, to survive,   Michael Hingson ** 12:05 yeah, you got to do some of that kind of stuff. Yeah, you do. It's one of those, those things that happens. So what did you do after college?   Karolyn Grimes ** 12:13 I got a job working for medical office in was kind of a clinic in Kansas City, Missouri, okay? And I spent probably 15 years there, maybe, maybe more I remember for sure, and that's, that's what I did. Then after that, I retired and raised a bunch of kids.   Michael Hingson ** 12:42 Well, that's a worthwhile endeavor.   12:46 It's stressful.   Michael Hingson ** 12:50 Well, you know, but as long as they don't call you mean, then that probably counts for something.   Karolyn Grimes ** 12:56 Yeah, they didn't call me mean. Well,   Michael Hingson ** 13:00 there you are. So you you did all of your your acting and movies and so on, kind of at a younger age, you didn't go back into doing any of that. No, I   Karolyn Grimes ** 13:11 didn't, but I did get active in the theater scene in the Kansas City area. So I did quite a few plays, and I had a really good time doing that. Okay, only problem with that is you have to memorize so much.   Michael Hingson ** 13:27 Yeah, you can't use cue cards and you can't use a script,   Karolyn Grimes ** 13:30 yeah? So I tried to work and do that, yeah, it's kind of tough, but I did. I the last one I did. I think I was 40 something, but it was fun. I loved it.   Michael Hingson ** 13:44 So what, what kind of maybe famous plays were you in?   Karolyn Grimes ** 13:49 Not famous? They were small ones. And honestly, I can't even remember what they were. I it's in my mind, one, the last one was musical, and it was kind of a Western. I can't remember what it was to save my soul, but that's, that's privilege of getting old.   Michael Hingson ** 14:09 Yeah, you never know. You might remember one of these days,   Karolyn Grimes ** 14:14 yeah, oh, I will, I'm sure, probably about an hour from now.   Michael Hingson ** 14:18 Yeah. Well, so going back earlier, what was the first movie you were in   Karolyn Grimes ** 14:27 that night with you, and that starred, Oh, see, there goes. My mind again. It was an opera singer. Can't think of Suzanne, York, oh, okay, and it had Irene Ryan, who was in the hillbillies. She was a maid. And it was, it was a Christmas scene, or it was section of the movie where I was one of. Five orphans that were sent. This opera singer wanted us to give us a Christmas night. We were from an orphanage, and so she had us come. We were going to spend the night, and she had presents for us and all that sort of thing. And the first thing I did was break an ornament on the Christmas tree. Oh, dear. Ah, so the kids got mad at me, because they knew we were going to be sent back to the orphanage. But anyway, in the end, she held me on her lap and sang a lullaby to me, and I will always remember that.   Michael Hingson ** 15:39 Yeah, you mentioned Irene, Ryan, granny, which was, yeah, she was in. She played a maid. What a character she   15:46 was. She was a maid.   Michael Hingson ** 15:50 Then what did you do after that movie? How old were you for that movie? I was four. You're four. So you do remember it sort of, yeah.   Karolyn Grimes ** 16:01 Just don't remember names particularly. I mean, yeah, but you were really funny about it that the there was one agent, pretty much, that had all the kids in her stable that worked in the movies back then. It was an easy thing, and she had Jimmy Hawkins, who was Tommy, and it's a wonderful life. And she also had his older brother, and his older brother was in that particular movie with me, so it was kind of a family affair all every time you went to an audition or an interview you saw the same kids over and over.   Michael Hingson ** 16:49 Well, how did you end up then being in It's a Wonderful Life. What? What did they what does it think and decide that you were the person for   Karolyn Grimes ** 17:01 it. Well, nothing really special. You know, I went on the interview back in the day. They didn't have what they do today. They had interviews where you went, and you had a one on one situation. Maybe five or six us girls would go to the interview, and then they'd bring another batch in, and that's kind of how it went. And most of us, as I say, had the same agent, so we, my mother took me to the interview, to the and it's like, it's not like an audition, it's an interview, and you actually go in and talk to casting director. And you know, you know, do what they tell you to do. So in this particular interview, there was a little girl who accidentally spilled some coffee on my dress. Her mother's coffee on my dress, because so back then, we all wore dresses, and I just didn't think a thing about it didn't bother me to have a dirty dress. I just I went in and did my interview. When I went in there, I meant Frank Capra was in, ah, and he interviewed and and cast every single person in that film, even the extras. That's how precise he was. But I went in there, and I remember he asked me how I would look, how I would act if I lost my dog and he died. I gave him my spiel, all with a dirty dress, but didn't bother me a bit. Came out, and then when we were leaving, I heard my mother mentioned to one of the other mothers that she felt like that, that girl's mother had had her spilling on purpose so they would intimidate me. But I didn't know it. I didn't realize it, and didn't bother me a bit.   Michael Hingson ** 19:11 What did you say when Frank Capra asked me that question? Do you remember?   Karolyn Grimes ** 19:16 Well, I I didn't say anything.   Michael Hingson ** 19:20 I just looked, no, I mean, about the dog?   Karolyn Grimes ** 19:22 Well, I just looked, oh, you know, yeah, squeezed up kind of teared, and was unhand picked. That was, you know, there was no line involved. It was just that, well, she must ask the other lines, but I don't remember, I just remember that.   Michael Hingson ** 19:46 So what was he like to work with?   Karolyn Grimes ** 19:49 He was wonderful, absolutely wonderful. He would get down on his knees so that he could communicate with those kids. And I. I thought that was really great, and I'm sure you got a lot more out of us by doing that. Rather than looking down on us and telling us what he wanted   Michael Hingson ** 20:09 us to do, he made you feel like a part of it all.   Karolyn Grimes ** 20:13 Yes, he did. He gave us a lot of power that way.   Michael Hingson ** 20:17 Yeah, and what was it like working with Jimmy Stewart and Donna Reed.   Karolyn Grimes ** 20:22 Well, you know, I didn't have any scenes with Donna Reed, except that being the movie, that's true. I didn't have any interaction with her. I had no lines. I don't even remember Donna Reed, but he was my focal point. Jimmy Stewart was fabulous. He was kind, considerate, and I fluffed a line in the pedal scene, and he said that, that's all right, Carolyn, you'll get it right next time. And it was things like that, you know, that made a difference between, if you messed up online, where they would get aggravated with you, and then you probably mess it up again. But he did the right thing. He made me not feel bad about it, and encouraged me to do it again.   Michael Hingson ** 21:17 It's, it's interesting, and it, it's a great lesson to you know, to point out that when when people help empower and they aren't negative and are encouraging no matter what you're doing, that counts for a lot. And I I find that when I encounter people who just decide they're going to be mean because they got to boss you around and do all sorts of obnoxious things to try to intimidate you and so on. In the long run, that is just so unproductive, it seems to me.   Karolyn Grimes ** 21:49 Yes, I agree. I don't see what it accomplishes.   Michael Hingson ** 21:53 Yeah, so I can appreciate what you're saying, and it makes a lot of sense. Well, I'm glad, and I always thought that Jimmy Stewart was that kind of a person, both he and Cary Grant both seemed sensitive, really concerned about people succeeding. They weren't jerks.   Karolyn Grimes ** 22:13 No, they weren't. And caught up with him later in life, he was getting calls from a lot of people about whatever happened to that little girl. And so he had one of his secretaries Call Me and find Me and and he called me and we had chat. And here I am in Missouri. He's in Hollywood. That was pretty cool when you're 40 years old. When that was the first year I ever saw the movie after I talked to him. So that was kind of how it went. But then after that, I met him in New York at a function, and we spent some time together, and he was delightful, so kind, so   Michael Hingson ** 23:01 generous. I remember when I first saw part of It's a Wonderful Life. It was back in the day when there was regular television. Then there was UHF, which was everything above, basically channel 13. And you had to have special at that time receivers to receive it. And one day I was, I just come home from high school, from classes, and I turned on the television, and it was a UHF channel, and I started scrolling across, and all of a sudden I heard Jimmy Stewart's voice, and I went, What's that? And it took me a couple of minutes of listening to it to figure out what the movie was, because I had heard about it enough that I I figured it out, but I listened to about half the movie, and then later I found the whole movie and watched it. And of course, also since then, I have had the opportunity to listen to radio broadcasts of it, like Lux radio theater and so on, where, where they did it. But I remember it well, yes, so did you do much of anything in in radio?   Karolyn Grimes ** 24:13 Then? Not really, not really. I can remember being on the radio for the opening night of the bishop's club. That was really exciting.   Michael Hingson ** 24:28 It's a lot of interesting movies back then. You know, It's a Wonderful Life The Bishop's wife in 1947 also, there was Miracle on 34th Street that people thought was never going to go anywhere. And it and also,   Karolyn Grimes ** 24:43 I'm sorry, still alive today, it   Michael Hingson ** 24:46 is and, and it's a classic. All three of them are classics and, and should be, right? So what did you do after the bishop's wife, from movie standpoint?   Karolyn Grimes ** 24:59 Oh. Um, I think I really don't remember exactly, but I did some movies that were westerns, and I really liked those. They were really fun. I did Rio Grande John Wayne and off Scott and I did honey child with Judy Canova.   Michael Hingson ** 25:28 I'll bet that was a   25:29 was a hoot. It was a hoot. What   Michael Hingson ** 25:33 was Judy Canova like?   Karolyn Grimes ** 25:36 Well, she was really nice. I played her niece, and I lived with her, and she was very nice. It's like that this particular movie, her mother had just died, so she was kind of not all happy, herself, still mourning, but she was very nice and considerate. And you know, she's the one that's saying, I'll be coming around when I come. Yeah, she'll be coming around the corner when she comes. That was what I always remembered her for, yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 26:15 Oh, she was always quite the character.   Karolyn Grimes ** 26:18 Oh, she was and she though she had that voice that was unusual.   Michael Hingson ** 26:27 So what? What did you do? What was your role in Rio Grande with John Wayne and marine O'Hara?   Karolyn Grimes ** 26:39 I was the school teacher's daughter, and we lived on a fort. We were in Moab, you daughter? Film it. Yeah, we lived on a fort. And I, my uncle was Victor McLachlan. And so the Indians came and raided us, and he they saved us and put us in a wagon to send us off to be safe. But the Indians got us and killed my mom and put us in the top of a Chapel Church, and that's where we were. And so they the three of the the people, I can't think of their names again. That's problem for me names, but I'll think of them eventually. They rescued us kids, and Victor McLachlan came to get me when the Calvary had gotten there, and I'm on a plat, kind of a platform, ringing the bell. I was ringing a bell throughout this movie, and I hit a bell. I hit Harry Carey Junior over the head with a bell. I always had a bell, so I'm ringing this giant bell to say it's okay for the Calgary to come in. And Vic McLachlan had to pull me off the platform and get me out the door and into a wagon to be rescued, because all his kids were being rescued. And so when he pulled me off that platform, I had this little dress on, and I got a big bad splinter in my bottom. Oh, gosh, it was horrible. It hurt so bad I was going to say, I bet it did. You can never show anything like that. So I did not show it. I just jumped off into his arms, and that was it.   Michael Hingson ** 28:44 Well, I would presume they eventually got the splitter out. Well, my   Karolyn Grimes ** 28:48 mom did, yeah, those things happen.   Michael Hingson ** 28:53 So what was it like working with John Wayne and Marie? No Hara, what both, what characters they are? Oh,   Karolyn Grimes ** 29:02 yeah. Well, John Wayne was just a booming voice. Yeah, he was a huge figure. He I didn't really have any relationship with him, but I had a birthday in the Fourth of July while I was there, ah, and the Korean flicked. Had just broken out. It was 1950 and the government had commandeered airplanes, so John Wayne managed to have airplane bring in a bunch of supplies, and it was one of them was a big, giant birthday cake for me, and bunch of fireworks. He had $300 worth of fireworks, and so we he threw me a party out on Colorado River bluffs, and we had glass. Do is really so funny. Said Happy birthday Little Miss Carolyn and Pat way and his son, who's my age, was out there too. He was he and Michael on school break for summer, and so they were part of the film. He was my age, so we hung around a lot. We were kind of upset because all we got to do with all those fireworks, two little sparklers, what   Michael Hingson ** 30:32 was marine O'Hara like?   Karolyn Grimes ** 30:38 I guess maybe she and Mr. Ford didn't get along very well, and she had a temper. He had a   Michael Hingson ** 30:47 temper, an Irish temper, yes, yes.   Karolyn Grimes ** 30:50 And I saw a lot of that. And one particular time we were in, they had a limo that would take us from the motel to the set which was on the Colorado River, and it was on this person's ranch. So we go down this terribly dangerous road to go to his ranch. At least it was dangerous to me. I was scared, definitely going to Fall River, yeah, because it was right on the edge. But she was angry, and we were in this limo, and she was with her hairdresser. They were in the front row, and my mother and I were in the back of the limo. She was cursing and carrying on about mister Ford, and I didn't pay any attention to it. And so her hairdresser said, Miss O'Hara, there's, there's a little girl in the back. She just kept right on going. But when she said that, I started paying attention what she was in and she was just a string of curses. It was so bad, she was so angry, and it was so funny. So she didn't, it didn't bother her to swear in front of the little child.   Michael Hingson ** 32:14 Just think how much language and how much elocution you learned, huh? Oh no, I did because, oh   Karolyn Grimes ** 32:19 yeah, potential, until she said that, then I listened.   Michael Hingson ** 32:25 Just rounded out your vocabulary. Oh,   Karolyn Grimes ** 32:28 yes, I've never heard words like that, and   Michael Hingson ** 32:32 probably never did again, no, than the ones you used, but, you know, but still. Oh, that's, that's pretty cool, though. So, did you ever have any kind of an opportunity to reunite and be with all of the Bailey family again from the movie?   Karolyn Grimes ** 32:53 Yes, in 1993 or four? Wow. It was quite a while, 60 years later, yeah, um, I had already been in contact with little Tommy. We've been conversing on a phone for about five years, but the target tour had, It's a Wonderful Life is a sort of a theme in their stores that year, and so they thought it would be a good ploy to have a reunion with the Bailey kids. So they brought us all together and put us on a tour. And that was when we all met up again, and I was so excited to do it, and that's the first time I actually saw people's response to this movie. We were in an autographed line at some of the targets that we went to, and people would come through the line and they share their stories about how the movie had affected their lives, and I was so impressed. I well, I just couldn't forget it. And so from that time forward, I became very enamored of sharing messages with other people, and I started doing various appearances and things like that.   Michael Hingson ** 34:23 Yeah. So what other kinds of appearances have you done?   Karolyn Grimes ** 34:28 Oh my gosh, I couldn't even begin to tell you lots. Well, that's good. All different kinds. I mean, you know, all different kinds.   34:38 Have you had   34:40 Go ahead. Thanks.   Michael Hingson ** 34:43 Have you had any or any significant number of appearances and interviews on television over the years?   Karolyn Grimes ** 34:50 No, just interviews, lots of interviews, live interviews. Yeah, yes, that's all never involved with anything again. And, but, yeah, I think I might do something kind of fun in September   Michael Hingson ** 35:08 March or in in Washington.   Karolyn Grimes ** 35:11 No, no, what in Ireland?   Michael Hingson ** 35:15 In Ireland, be gosh and be Garda. Yes, what are you going to   Karolyn Grimes ** 35:19 do? They're going, they're filming movie about Jimmy Stewart. Oh, and they want me to do a cameo. Well, cool. Isn't that fun?   Michael Hingson ** 35:31 That'll be exciting. Yes, I'm really excited. Wow. So long later. I, yeah, you know, I, I, I've seen, of course, movies with Jimmy Stewart, and I remember seeing him once on The Tonight Show, Later in the period of The Tonight Show and so on. And I'm not sure how long after that, he he passed, but I remember his his appearance, which was kind of fun.   Karolyn Grimes ** 35:59 Did you happen to hear him when he did the poem about his dog bull.   Michael Hingson ** 36:04 Yeah, that's what I'm thinking of. That's the one I saw   Karolyn Grimes ** 36:07 that was so tender and true. It was just really something.   Michael Hingson ** 36:13 And the Tonight Show with Johnny Carson was such a wonderful show. I watched reruns of it regularly on some of the channels, and I just think that it's so much more fun than a lot of what we see in late night TV. Today, I do miss Johnny Carson. Yes, did you ever, did you ever meet him?   Karolyn Grimes ** 36:32 No, I didn't.   Michael Hingson ** 36:38 Well still, I remember old Bo   Karolyn Grimes ** 36:43 Yes, he was a wonderful man. Yeah, they did a special thing in 19 a, 1990 it was they had a special event that was honoring him and all the people that he worked with, Allison, you know, all the stars that he'd work with. And so he invited me to come. So I went to New York, and I just had a really wonderful time about to meet his wife, and it was just good old fun just to see him again, because he was just such a down to earth man, yeah, and he just was so kind and so generous that it was a real, real exciting moment For me, that's for sure.   Michael Hingson ** 37:40 I watch him occasionally now, because he is regular, not regularly, but he's often on the Jack Benny show. And the Jack Benny show is being run on a couple on some of the TV stations, and so it's kind of fun to see the by play between he and his wife and Jack Benny. And, of course, Jack Benny, it's the traditional Jack Benny image. But the shows are so much fun, yes? And clearly, Jimmy Stewart, well, all of them have a lot of fun doing those shows.   Karolyn Grimes ** 38:17 Yeah, I think they did. Yeah. Those old radio shows were so great. I really enjoyed them back in the day well.   Michael Hingson ** 38:29 And I find that when people really enjoy what they do, and you see that come out in even on some of the earlier television shows, with the radio shows, it makes such a difference, because you can feel the energy that's coming from people.   Karolyn Grimes ** 38:48 You do. You really do.   Michael Hingson ** 38:52 If people don't enjoy what they're doing, that comes through. And you you can tell so it's it's fun, when people really enjoy it. Well, how did you get involved with the Marshfield Cherry Blossom Festival? You've been doing that for a while,   Karolyn Grimes ** 39:14 a long years, more than I true. Well, Nicholas called me. He runs the festival. I can't tell you what year it was, but it probably was early 80s. Maybe, wow, no, wouldn't have been early 80s. Sorry, no. Probably in early 2000 okay? And he called me and asked me if I would come down and be in the festival. So I said, Okay, and so. We flew back and went to the festival, and it was Dean Martin's daughter was there, and one of the Munchkins was there. Can't think of his name. One lived in St Louis, character. He was there. Couple of other people that were there, you know, old stars, and it rained, it snowed, and it was just, it was awful. It sweeted. It was just really bad. So there wasn't much of a turnout, and it was kind of a disappointment to Nicholas, I think because it since then they've changed the date, so it's a little later in the year. And yeah, you know, kind of count on the weather being a little better. But then I didn't come back for about two years, and then he called me King, and from that time forward, I went back every year, and one of the special things that happened by being there was that the lady who played violet bit, young, Violet bit, she can't think of her name, but I'm really bad At names today. Yeah, way she she was a psychologist, and for the last, oh, I guess long, maybe eight years before I met her, Jimmy Hawkins, the littlest boy in the movie, and myself, had tried to get her involved with the film, and what the things that we did for the film, and she wouldn't have anything to do with it, because she thought it was Hollywood, and she didn't believe in that, and this was the only movie she did. So someone by the name of Nicholas convinced her to come that year. So she came, and she her son brought her, and when she saw how much that movie is loved and how it had affected so many people and their story, she got the first hand view of that that was then for her. She decided she wanted to be a part of It's a Wonderful Life from then on, did they   Michael Hingson ** 42:27 show the movie that you're at the festival? No, oh, okay,   Karolyn Grimes ** 42:32 no, she just came,   Michael Hingson ** 42:34 and so many people just talked about it.   Karolyn Grimes ** 42:37 Yeah, yeah. She she finally realized that people really loved the movie. Of course, she saw it after that, because after that little appearance, I say you're coming to Seneca Falls. I won't take no for an answer. So her son brought her every year after that, and of course, we saw the movie dead, and she had experienced the real love that the people had for the film and for the characters in the film.   Michael Hingson ** 43:12 What was it like being around and working with Lionel Barrymore,   Karolyn Grimes ** 43:20 well, I really wasn't around him very much. We had cast fish shoes sometimes, and he he was in his he was really in a wheelchair. He had crippling arthritis. It's terrible. His hands are all gnarled. And I really didn't talk to him or having any interaction with him. I might have been in scene with him, or we've done publicity photos with him, but I don't, I don't remember ever   Michael Hingson ** 43:50 interacting with him, with him that much, yeah,   Karolyn Grimes ** 43:53 but he wasn't scary, yeah?   Michael Hingson ** 43:57 Well, that's a start. Not, not like marine O'Hara huh?   Karolyn Grimes ** 44:01 No, no. And they had a cast party at the end of movie. Most movies after they're finished, had a cast party, uh huh? This one was celebrating the end of its wonderful life. And so he, he came and I got to talk to him without, you know, he had a skull cap on, and it raised his forehead about two inches, so he had real elongated, big forehead, and took more hair off his head, so he looked meaner. That was the idea. So he didn't have that on you just look like a normal man and everything, and he didn't look mean. And so I chatted with him. He was fine. He wasn't really a nice guy.   Michael Hingson ** 44:51 Again, it's one of those things where he was perfect for that part, though.   Karolyn Grimes ** 44:55 Oh yes, he was perfect. Yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 45:00 It was, it was fun. And I, I think, at the time, when I first saw the movie, I didn't even know that he was the person who played Mr. Potter, but I didn't, I didn't realize that because I was young enough, but I hadn't really learned about different characters and and different actors, but I figured it out soon enough. Yeah, so tell me about Zuzu house back there.   Karolyn Grimes ** 45:30 Well, one night I was writing in a limo, and it was during the Christmas season. I was somewhere in New York, and I can't remember where I was doing a gig, and Nicholas called me, and I'll always remember it, because I was sitting in this room all and he said, Carolyn, I just discovered there are people in this community. This is very small town. Well, it's a small town, and there are people who young people who don't have a place to sleep. They're sleeping on park benches. There's this couch surfing, all this chippy said I had no idea this was going on. I want us to start a house and make it possible for them to have shelter. And so he said, The reason I'm calling you is because I want to know if it's alright if I name it the Zuzu house. So I said, Well, of course, go right ahead. So from then on, I became active with the Zuzu house and their foundation and their situation, all that they do. Unfortunately, covid happened right after that, and it made it really hard to get, you know, materials, building materials, and things like that that we needed to finish it. So it took a long time to finish the house, but it's finished now, and it houses now. It houses is us refuse for women from mean men, I guess, and that's what it is. So I'm proud to be part of it, and they did such a fabulous job. It's a great, wonderful, beautiful facility, and it's way out in the country, and it's really a place where they can get their marbles all on sack again.   Michael Hingson ** 47:33 How far is it from Marshfield? Um, I didn't get to go there when I was there last year.   Karolyn Grimes ** 47:40 My guess is about 30 minutes. Oh, okay.   Michael Hingson ** 47:47 Well, now the the the other question I would ask is, as you pointed out, the reason that the women are there, so do you go and teach them elocution, like how Marino Hara talk so that they can, yeah, I just just say, help them out, you know,   Karolyn Grimes ** 48:08 yeah, I learned a lot there.   Michael Hingson ** 48:12 But yeah, that that's really cool, that that you, you do that. Well, tell me about Seneca Falls, or, should we say, Bedford Falls, and what goes on there, and, yes, what you do and so on. I'll always think of it just Bedford Falls, but   Karolyn Grimes ** 48:27 most people do,   Michael Hingson ** 48:29 as opposed to potters field, you know. But yeah,   Karolyn Grimes ** 48:34 about seeing my this is my 23rd year. So 23 years ago, God, I can't believe it's that long. I knew cameraman on the Oprah show. It's very good friend of mine. And so it was September, and he called me and he said, Oh my god, Carolyn, this is it. This is the town you've got to come here. You've got to come He says, I'm going to go talk to somebody. And that was the last I heard. But he talked to somebody, the right person who knew what it was about and saw the possibilities. And so her name was mo cock at the time. Her name is Young. Now mo young, but she went to the Historical Society and got funding and turned it around real fast so that they could create an event for me to come and appear. So I did, and I landed in Rochester, I believe what drove to Seneca Falls, and it was snowing, and I there was no one on the streets. There was no one around. And she drive, drove up to the Main Street and open. The car door. When we just walked on Main Street, the bridge was there. It was all lit up, yeah, lit up on each post, lamp post. And it was the most wonderful experience, because I really felt like this was the place, if Frank Kaplan wanted to see a place that would inspire him to build bamboo falls, this would be the place to come. And I was so impressed. And I just loved it. So I came back every year after that, yeah, and, and then I started inviting other people like Jimmy Hawkins and Jamie, who Carol Coombs, who played Jamie, and, you know, other people. And so it was very neat event. And I even invited the babies who played Larry, the oldest boy in the movie. You know, they have a they have to have twins to play babies, because they can't be under the lights so long. So they rotate them. And so that was, that was really kind of incredible, too. Now, it's a huge affair and it   Michael Hingson ** 51:21 never had anything to do with the movie originally, right?   Karolyn Grimes ** 51:25 We're not sure. I actually think that Frank Capra had an aunt in Aurora, which is south of that town, and there's a barber there that he swears that he cut Capra's hair, and when I first started going there, what, 20 years ago, he was still alive. So I talked to him, and I said, Do you really think that was Frank Capra? And he said, Yes, I do. I really do. And he said, You know, I cut his hair, and I will always remember we chatted, and he said he was from Sicily, and I was from Sicily too, so we had a lot of calm. And he said his last name was Capra, and it means goat in Italian. And Tommy's name, the barber's name is bellissimo, which means beautiful. So he said, I always remember cutting the goat's hair. Wow, I saw three weeks later in a newspaper, there was an article about him going to make the movie. It's a wonderful love. So he said I knew that was who he was, yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 52:54 so he had clearly been there, and imagery made such an impression on him,   Karolyn Grimes ** 53:03 and also on the bridge, there's a plaque, and he would have seen this, and it was for a young Italian immigrant. And of course, you know, capper was strong Italian. And this young Italian immigrant didn't know how to swim, but he jumped in the canal to save the life of a wasp woman who was committing suicide, and he made her her get out of our she got out of the water safely, and he died, he didn't know how to swim. So it was a huge thing back then, and it brought the community together. You know, there was the Italian side and and the the other side. And this brought everybody together. And it, it turned out that the they brought the whole family, his whole family, over, because they were, you know, what, wanted to do something, because they appreciated what he'd done so much to say that woman's life. And so I think camper would have seen that and that plaque, and he would have learned a story, and maybe that gave him some ideas about It's A Wonderful Life.   Michael Hingson ** 54:28 I don't know a lot about Frank Capra, but it's fascinating to hear the stories that you're telling, because it it certainly portrays him as a not only a caring person, but a person who pays attention to a lot of detail. The very fact that that he was in that town, and all the imagery and all the things that he brought to it had to, had to be very relevant. Well, all   Karolyn Grimes ** 54:56 the names of the streets in the town are. The movie, or, you know, quite a few of them, yeah, and the main street had a part of it at that time that had trees down the middle of it. And there's just so many things in in the town that are applicable to the film. And I used to know tons more when I was trying to convince everybody that this was the place. But now I don't have to remember those anymore, because people already know there are 1000s and 1000s of people that go through the town and feel the magic that now then we, we the gift shop is making it possible for people to remember their loved ones by putting bells on the bridge. And it's really, you know, become something. And then the museum, which I helped start, is really a cool museum, but they are getting a new museum, which is going to be much larger because they can't even begin to display all the things they have.   Michael Hingson ** 56:14 Well, it's, it's, it's interesting how all of this has has come up, but none of the filming of the movie was was done there. It was all in Hollywood, right? Oh, yes, but, but still, the the imagery and the vision that that people have, that brought you and everyone together to create that celebration is certainly great for the town. I love that one is it? I'm just going to have to show up. It's a Christmas event every year, right?   Karolyn Grimes ** 56:47 Yes, yeah. There's a 5k run, and they start on the bridge. And there's a few serious people in the beginning, some fellas and gals that want to win. But after that, let me tell you, it's fun. There are people dressed like Christmas trees. They got lights all over themselves. They they light up their dogs, their babies, their strollers, and they're all in this run, and it's five miles. And at some of the they go through the residential district, and some of the houses they have the booths give them a little bit of hot toddy and so forth to get them on   Michael Hingson ** 57:29 the way. Yeah, in Christmas time, I would think so it's just   Karolyn Grimes ** 57:33 a lot of fun. And people love it. And I always started every time they have it. I've always started it, so that's kind of a tradition.   Michael Hingson ** 57:46 So you have done some cameos, like Gremlins and Christmas vacation, right? Well, yeah, cameo appearances,   Karolyn Grimes ** 57:55 yeah, I guess you say that, yeah. What was that like? Well, it's, it was just, you know, the movie they showed the movie, yeah, so that was, that was all. It was just, they showed the movie just like they showed it in Christmas vacation. And somehow, when they show the movie, it's always when Zuzu is saying that line. Oh,   Michael Hingson ** 58:21 okay, so it's not so much you as it is the the original movie, yeah, it's little Zuzu well, but it's a great line. I mean, you know, well, it is. I remember last year, wasn't it? I think at the reps event. We'll get to that in a sec. But I remember getting some bells from you, and I actually, I think I told you I was going to send one to my cousin, and I let you say hello to her, and she got that bell and was completely blown away. She loves it. Oh, good. And I have the bell. I have my bell sitting out in open plain sight for the world to see, and I go by and ring it every so often. Oh, great. Oh, well, we gotta have those angels out. So what kind of events and things do you do typically, or do you like to to enjoy doing it Christmas?   Karolyn Grimes ** 59:20 Um, I kind of work during Christmas. Well, that's my season, and so I do gift shows. I do appearances, I introduce the movie. I do I'm on the road the whole time, and I love it, because I interact with these wonderful people who love the movie. And if they love the movie, believe me, they are wonderful people.   Michael Hingson ** 59:45 Yeah, undoubtedly, so well, so you you also have been involved with some of the radio recreations from from reps. And what do you think about that? How do you like that? Do.   Karolyn Grimes ** 59:59 Oh, my goodness, so much fun. And I'm old enough to remember a   Michael Hingson ** 1:00:04 lot of the shows.   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:00:07 No, I remember very well. And, you know, I it was just a whole bunch of fun to do that and recreate these scenes from older raining days. And I remember my mother and father bought a brand new Frazier. It's a car, and I'm sure nobody's ever heard of Kaiser Fraser cars, because that was the ugliest name car in my life. But they had to have that car. And I remember when we got the car, my dad was offered he could either have a heater and he could afford to pay for either a heater or a radio. And he chose the radio. So I heard inner sanctum. I heard all these wonderful, wonderful plays. Back in the day, all these shows from the radio.   Michael Hingson ** 1:01:07 I came in near the the so called traditional end of radio, probably actually 1957 so I had five years, but almost from the beginning, I always wanted to collect more of the shows and did, and then also did a radio program for six and a half, almost seven years at the campus radio station where I worked, kuci. We did radio every Sunday night, so I had three hours of radio. And I love to tell people I heard about this show on television called 60 minutes. But my show was opposite Mike Wallace, and mine went for three hours, and his was only an hour, but it was like seven years before I got to watch 60 minutes and and learn about it, because we had shows every year or every every Sunday night, and we had a deputy sheriff who called from the Orange County jail once to tell me. He said, You know, you guys have created a real challenge for us, because he said, so many people have heard about what you do, some of a lot of our inmates, that on Sunday nights, we have to split the jail and send half people up, half the people upstairs, where there's enough radio reception, they can listen to your show, and the other half listens to and watches 60 minutes, which I always thought was kind of cute. So you do a podcast now too, don't you?   1:02:34 I do tell us   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:36 about that. I know we were focused on it. Yeah,   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:02:39 Chris and I do it. He's He's a psychologist, and we interview all kinds of people, all walks of life, yeah.   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:51 How long has it been running now,   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:02:54 this is second year, okay,   Michael Hingson ** 1:02:57 well, I don't know. Chris hasn't said a single word during this whole thing.   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:03:01 Oh, he's not here. What good is he, you know, right?   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:09 Well, so you know, we've been, can you believe what we've been doing? This an hour?   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:03:14 Oh, really, I did not know. I'm   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:18 telling you, time flies when you're having fun. Is there kind of anything that you want to talk about that maybe we haven't yet, any any last questions or thoughts that you have that you want to bring up?   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:03:31 No, I don't think so. I think we've covered it pretty good. We've, we've,   Michael Hingson ** 1:03:37 we've done a lot. But you know, it's really wonderful to to have you on if people want to reach out to you, how do they do that?   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:03:45 They can reach me at Carolyn, K, A R, o l, y n, dot Wilkerson, W, I, L, k, e r, s o n@gmail.com,   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:01 okay. Well, hopefully people will reach out, and if they want to also have a website, I was going to ask   1:04:10 you that zoo, zoo.net,   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:12 well, you can't do better than that. And what's the podcast called   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:04:22 seeing this is the thing with names. There it goes again. You think, I know? Oh, my goodness, I can't remember. Oh, tell you, I'm getting old. It's getting worse and worse.   Michael Hingson ** 1:04:36 All grown up is the puppy. All grown up, all grown ups. Oh, Carolyn, Carol, well, there you go. Well, yeah, and I, I enjoyed being on it. Well, I'm sorry we're going to miss seeing you at reps, because I won't be able to be there. I had told Walden, and walden's actually been on unstoppable mindset now a couple of. On, but I had told him he and I had talked about me doing Richard diamond private detective and actually playing Richard diamond. And I said, I want Carolyn to play Helen Asher. So we'll now have to postpone, postpone that till next year,   1:05:14 but we're going to do it. Yeah,   Michael Hingson ** 1:05:17 yeah. It'll be fun. I Richard diamond has always been kind of really my favorite radio show, and I think I can carry off that voice pretty well.   Karolyn Grimes ** 1:05:27 So it'll be fun. Yeah, it will well.   Michael Hingson ** 1:05:30 I want to thank you for being here, and I want to thank all of you for listening to us today, reminisce and talk about all sorts of stuff. Love to hear your thoughts. Please feel free to email me at Michael H, I m, I C, H, A, E, L, H, I at accessibe, A, C, C, E, S, S, i, b, e.com, and, of course, wherever you're observing the podcast today, I hope that you'll give us a five star rating. Karolyn deserves a five star rating, even if you don't think I do do it for Karolyn. We love to have great reviews. We appreciate it. And Karolyn for you and everyone out there who is listening and watching. If you know anyone else who ought to be a guest on unstoppable mindset, we'd love it if you'd reach out and let us know, give us an introduction. I think everyone has a story to tell, and I enjoy getting the opportunity to to visit with people and hear stories. So please, if you have any thoughts, introduce us. We'd love to to meet other people. But again, Karolyn, I really appreciate you being here, and I want to thank you for being with us today.   1:06:38 My pleasure being here.   Michael Hingson ** 1:06:42 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com . AccessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for Listening. Please come back and visit us again next week.

Joe Rogan's frustration over political issues, Gianmarco Soresi's views on edgy comedy, and Marc Maron's documentary 'Anxiety Club'. It includes Chris Rock's admiration for Ben Stiller, Sebastian Maniscalco's experiences at the Riyadh Comedy Festival, and Kathy Griffin's recent struggles and party incident. The show also covers Conan O'Brien's 1500-episode run on TBS, Johnny Carson's iconic curtain auction, and a tribute week for Carson's 100th birthday. Lastly, Jimmy Fallon shares a humorous incident from his Olympics commentary experience.Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/daily-comedy-news-with-johnny-mac--4522158/support.Become a premium subscriber! (no ads). For Apple users, hit the banner on your Apple podcasts app which says UNINTERRUPTED LISTENING and the bonus “DCN8” show.You also get 25+ other series  (it's only $4.99 a month with a free-trial month)Contact John at john@thesharkdeck dot com  Media Thoughts is mcdpod.substack.com dailycomedynews.substack.com DCN on Threads: https://www.threads.net/@dailycomedynews https://linktr.ee/dailycomedynews www.buymeacoffee.com/dailycomedynews  

A little gritty political drama, a little technicolor musical, a little revolutionary politics, a little ahead-of-its-time queer representation…Kiss of the Spider Woman has been a novel, a play, an Oscar-winning movie, a Tony-winning Broadway musical, and now a Bill Condon movie musical starring Jennifer Lopez, Diego Luna, and relative newcomer Tonatiuh. LA-based film critic Carlos Aguilar joins us to get into the enduring allure of Spider Woman, and to name some bleak movies that could be jazzed up with a little old-timey movie-musical interlude.What's GoodAlonso - Bulgarian State Woman Choir on Johnny Carson in 1990Drea - Bed Bands (wholesome)Carlos - New episode of Storage WarsKevin - The Craft at CinespiaITIDICApple TV Streaming Drops “+” From its NameThe TiVo Era Has Ended, Officially NowAnnie Hall Returning to Cinemas in Honor of Diane KeatonStaff PicksAlonso - Orwell: 2+2=5Drea - Blue MoonCarlos - It Was Just an AccidentKevin - Battle Royale Follow us on BlueSky, Facebook, Instagram, or LetterboxdWithKevin AveryDrea ClarkAlonso DuraldeProduced by Marissa FlaxbartSr. Producer Laura Swisher

This episode was originally released on 6/1/2020. While new episodes of Breaking Walls are on hiatus I'll be going back and posting the older episodes. ____________ In Breaking Walls Episode 104 we focus on Orson Welles' radio career from Pearl Harbor through the end of radio's peak, and pick up where we left off in Breaking Walls episode 79. —————————— Highlights: • Orson Returns to Radio In the Fall of 1941 • The Magnificent Ambersons Enters Productions • December 7th, 1941 • Orson and Norman Corwin Collaborate • Orson is Named Pan-American Goodwill Ambassador • It's All True and Brazil • Problems with RKO • Endings Changed, Others Destroyed • Orson gets fired—Returns to the United States in the fall of 1942 • Ceiling Unlimited And Hello Americans • Jane Eyre • Jack Benny Gets Sick, Orson filles in as host • The Mercury Wonder Show • Rita • Marriage, again • Busy Radio Days in 1944 • The Orson Welles Almanac • Campaigning for FDR • Donovan's Brain • D Day • Election Day—1944 • Rita and Orson meet Rebecca • Christmas 1944 • This is My Best • Our President is Dead • More Collaborations with Corwin • The War Ends • The Stranger • Around the World in Eighty Days • The Mercury Summer Theater • The Lady From Shanghai • Divorce • Macbeth • Europe and the end for Welles on American radio —————————— The WallBreakers: http://thewallbreakers.com Subscribe to Breaking Walls everywhere you get your podcasts. To support the show: http://patreon.com/TheWallBreakers —————————— The reading material used in today's episode was: • Citizen Welles by Frank Brady • This is Orson Welles by Welles and Peter Bogdanovich • On the Air — By John Dunning • Discovering Orson Welles by Jonathan Rosenbaum • Orson Welles on the Air, at OrsonWelles.Indiana.edu • Wellesnet.com. —————————— On the interview front: • Orson Welles was with Peter Bogdonavich, Dick Cavett, Johnny Carson, Merv Griffin, Leslie MeGahey, Dinah Shore, and Huw Wheldon. • Byron Kane and Jeanette Nolan were with SPERDVAC, the Society to Preserve and Encourage Radio Drama, Variety, and Comedy. For more information, please go to SPERDVAC.com • Norman Corwin was with Chuck Schaden. Hear the full chat at SpeakingofRadio.com. • Howard Duff was with Dick Bertel and Ed Corcoran for WTIC's The Golden Age of Radio. Hear their full chat at Goldenage-WTIC.org. • Robert Wise was with Leslie MeGahey. • Jack Benny spoke with Jack Carney. • Lurene Tuttle spoke with Same Time, Same Station in 1972. • Agnes Moorehead was with Dick Cavett in 1973. —————————— Selected music featured in today's episode was: • Perfida — By Jimmy Dorsey and his Orchestra • The Klezmer's Wedding — By Andre Moisan • The Third Man — By Anton Karas • Hooray for Hollywood — By Don Swan • The Battle Cry of Freedom — By Jacqueline Schwab • Star of Bethlehem — Conducted by John Williams

TVC 709.3: Part 2 of the conversation that began last week with Howard Smith, author of My Friend Johnny, a memoir of Howard's twenty-year friendship with Johnny Carson, which began in 1985 when Howard found himself living four doors down the street from Carson in Malibu, and which continued until the end of Carson's life. Topics this segment include a look at some of the other celebrities from business, sports, politics, and entertainment that Howard came to know during his career as a tech mogul, including NFL Hall of Fame quarterback Fran Tarkenton and President Gerald Ford. My Friend Johnny is available at MyFriendJohnny.com. Calendar year 2025 marks not only the twentieth anniversary of Carson's passing, but the 100th anniversary of his birth.

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Seth takes a closer look at Trump thinking "habeas corpus" is the name of a person and Trump's threat to arrest Illinois Governor JB Pritzker.Then, Ryan Reynolds talks about the time he crossed paths with Johnny Carson and Johnny Cash in the same week, struggling with the heat while receiving the Order of Canada Honor and his work on the John Candy: I Like Me documentary.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

A Legendary Life of Faith, Family, and Laughter with Jeff Foxworthy (Part 2) What if the very things the world tells you will make you happy—fame, wealth, recognition—turn out to be the biggest illusions of all? In this powerful continuation of my conversation with Jeff Foxworthy, one of the most successful comedians of all time, we go beyond the laughs to uncover the faith, humility, and life lessons that have shaped the man behind the jokes. In Part 1, Jeff opened up about his childhood, the pain of an absent father, and how comedy became both a calling and a gift from God. In Part 2, we go even deeper. Jeff reveals what it felt like to stand terrified behind the curtain of The Tonight Show moments before Johnny Carson called him to the stage—and how that leap of faith launched his career. He shares stories of living as the “underdog,” being mentored by Chick-fil-A founder Truett Cathy, and why he believes encouragement is one of the most powerful forces in the world. But what struck me most is Jeff's unwavering commitment to living out his faith. From ministering to the homeless community, to teaching his children and grandchildren that kindness and effort matter more than status, Jeff shows us what it means to use your platform for purpose. This conversation is full of wisdom about letting go of control, trusting God's plan, and remembering that our true identity is not in what we do, but in who we are as children of God. This is one of those rare interviews that's both deeply moving and practical. Jeff talks about how to discover and honor the gifts you've been given, why you don't need to be 100% ready to take a leap, and how suffering can become the soil where your greatest impact is born. I promise you—this episode will stay with you long after it ends. Key Takeaways: Why you'll never feel 100% “ready”—and why you need to jump anyway How childhood wounds can become seeds of compassion and service The secret to storytelling and connection that made Jeff a comedy legend Why encouragement is one of the most underrated superpowers you can give away How to let go, surrender control, and live with unshakable faith This conversation isn't just about comedy—it's about courage, calling, and living a life of eternal impact. Don't miss it. Also don't miss out on MAXOUT2026: Once a year, I open my home for an intimate one-day experience unlike anything else I do. This year, I'm making it even smaller—just 12 to 15 people. Together, we'll dive deep into the exact strategies I use to plan, visualize, and design the best year of my life—and yours. If you're ready to Max Out your future, join me at Maxout2026.com for a life-changing day you'll never forget. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

RUNDOWN   (352) is Gainesville, Florida — home of the University of Florida. They reflect on Petty's legendary catalog, from “American Girl” to “Free Fallin',” his Beatles-inspired path to music, and his legacy in Gators football culture. Mitch and Hotshot recap the Seahawks' nail-biting win in Glendale, where a late Jason Meyers field goal sealed the victory to move Seattle to 3–1. They turn to the Huskies' tough loss against Ohio State, noting costly penalties and red-zone failures that made the final score more lopsided than the game felt. The Mariners closed the regular season with a sweep at the hands of the Dodgers but secured the No. 2 seed at 90–72. Joe Doyle and Brady Farkas join Mitch to debate whether the late skid matters, the state of the bullpen (Bazardo vs. Brash in high-leverage spots, Munoz's control issues), and the playoff rotation order. They also spar over Cal Raleigh's MVP case against Aaron Judge and whether Seattle should prefer Cleveland or Detroit in the ALDS. The Seahawks dominated for three quarters in Arizona before letting the Cardinals storm back with 17 unanswered points, needing Jason Myers' last-second field goal to escape with a win. The No-Table crew weighs Sam Darnold's poise, Mike Macdonald's conservative late-game decisions, the defense's lapses, and the ongoing questions with the run game and offensive line. Mitch welcomes CBS Sports' Rick Neuheisel, presented by Taco Time Northwest, for his weekly whip-around of the college football world. They break down Washington's missed opportunities against Ohio State, Alabama's statement win at Georgia, and why depth in the trenches separates contenders from pretenders. Rick also weighs in on Penn State's playoff chances, Miami–Florida State as a marquee matchup, and hands out his Chicken Caesar Taco awards before making his Week 6 pick.   GUESTS   Brady Farkas | Host, Refuse to Lose Podcast (Mariners on SI) Joe Doyle | MLB Draft & Mariners Analyst, Over-Slot Substack Brady Henderson | Seahawks Insider, ESPN Jacson Bevens | Writer, Cigar Thoughts Rick Neuheisel | CBS College Football Analyst, Former Head Coach & Rose Bowl Champion   TABLE OF CONTENTS   0:00 | Gators, Guitar Lessons, and the Great Tom Petty 9:05 | BEAT THE BOYS - Register at MitchUnfiltered.com 13:20 | Seahawks Hold On, Huskies Fall Short, Mariners Await Their Opponent 35:47 | GUEST: Mariners No-Table; Mariners Finish 90–72, Set for ALDS with Questions Looming 1:00:26 | GUEST: Seahawks No-Table; Seahawks Survive Scare in Glendale 1:27:02 | GUEST: Rick Neuheisel; on Huskies, Bama's Revival, and the Week Ahead in College Football 1:56:57 | Other Stuff Segment: Hotshot raves about the film One Battle After Another with Leonardo DiCaprio, Sean Penn, Benicio Del Toro, and Regina Hall, directed by Paul Thomas Anderson, calling it the best movie he's seen in a decade, while Mitch celebrates that the Astros have been eliminated from the playoffs and notes the Mariners' upcoming intrasquad scrimmages at T-Mobile. Other stories include Shaun Alexander announcing his 14th child, Richard Sherman's deferred prosecution and Hall of Fame comments about Russell Wilson, Matthew Stafford's painful low blow and his wife's vasectomy joke, the Ryder Cup devolving into pro wrestling–style chaos, Logan Paul buying a $32.5 million mansion, Johnny Carson's Malibu estate hitting the market at $110 million, Brandon Roy suspiciously being removed as Garfield High's coach, and MLB introducing its new ABS challenge system for balls and strikes. RIPs include former Bengals and Auburn running back Rudy Johnson, who died by suicide at 45 amid CTE concerns, and Elaine Merck Binder, one of the last surviving Munchkins from The Wizard of Oz, at 94. HEADLINES: Stephen King's obsession with “Mambo No. 5” nearly cost him his marriage, Alyssa Milano removing her breast implants at 52, a man without thumbs going viral for showing he can do anything except hitchhike, Bachelor star Madison Prewett claiming 10 years without masturbation, and MLB preparing blind dipshit robot umpires for 2026.