Podcasts about Bokashi

It has been a busy half term, and finally some rain. Vicky has robins nesting in her ivy, scuppering her neighbour's plan of a new fence. Karin is excited about her new Bokashi bin arriving.

The weekend has been busy with stalls at the local school fair and St Albans Spring Festival, having lots of meaningful conversations all about Bokashi and Soil Squad. Karin is particularly shattered after so much social interaction and is planning a little snooze is the hammock. As always, thanks to Alex Kizenkov for intro music.

Ces 17 et 18 avril, les Compost Days battront leur plein à Bruxelles avec des portes ouvertes dans des composts de quartier, des balades éducatives et des ateliers pour apprendre à valoriser vos déchets autrement.Parmi les méthodes présentées : le Bokashi compost, une technique japonaise de compostage d'intérieur, à mi-chemin entre le compost classique et le vermicompostage. Elle fonctionne par fermentation, ne sent presque rien, se place facilement dans une cuisine, et se présente comme une petite poubelle… avec robinet intégré.Vous pourrez découvrir cette méthode (et bien d'autres) dans l'espace Fais-le toi-même, 11 rue Américaine à Saint-Gilles, avec notamment un atelier animé par l'association Worms, qui accompagne citoyens, écoles et entreprises dans la mise en place de composts urbains.Envie d'aller plus loin ? La Wallonie propose une cartographie pour repérer les composts collectifs proches de chez vous. Et si le cœur vous en dit, pourquoi ne pas devenir maître composteur pour faire bouger les choses dans votre quartier ?Parce que composter, c'est réduire ses déchets, produire du terreau, et faire un geste simple pour la planète.Vous aimez ce contenu ? Alors n'hésitez pas à vous abonner, à lui donner des étoiles et à partager ce podcast autour de vous. Ça nous aide à nous faire connaître et à essaimer les idées constructives qui rendent le monde plus joli !Une chronique signée Leslie Rijmenams à retrouver (aussi) sur Nostalgie et www.nostalgie.be.

We hosted a Bokashi composting workshop last weekend and we loved the challenge of how you bokashi on a balcony and use all of your food waste!Karin has never sowed as many seeds in her life and has come up with a genius solution for supporting her tomato plants...

Spring is in the air, and it's time to get your hands dirty! This week, we're diving into the juicy world of tomatoes with Liz Mooney from the RHS Garden Wisley edibles team. She shares some of her best tried and tested cultivars and expert advice on how to grow a bumper crop. Plus, if hydrangeas are on your planting list, renowned woody plant collector and hybridizer Maurice Foster will be picking out some of his favourites. And finally, we're tackling food waste head-on – Jenny Laville and composting guru Heather Gorringe break down worm farms, compost heaps, and bokashi bins to help you turn scraps into garden gold! Host: Gareth Richards Contributors: Liz Mooney, Maurice Foster, Jenny Laville, Heather Gorringe Links: How to Grow Tomatoes Wiggly Wigglers How to stop throwing away food waste – with or without a garden Bokashi composting  The Hydrangea - A Reappraisal  White House Farm Garden and Arboretum White House Farm Hydrangea open days: June 28th and August 23rd

Today we're diving into a topic that's at the heart of productive farming: making the most of muck. From slurry to compost, we'll explore how to get more from less and maximise the value of organic manures.Are there topics you'd like us to cover or guests you'd love to hear from? Get in touch by emailing us at podcast@cornishmutual.co.uk or by connecting with us on our socials @cornishmutual. Your feedback helps us shape the podcast to meet your needs.Joining Peter today is Andrew Sincock, Managing Director of Agriton UK and Agro-Vital UK, and a 2023 Nuffield Scholar researching organic manures.Farming Focus is the podcast for farmers in the South West of England, but is relevant for farmers outside of the region or indeed anyone in the wider industry or who has an interest in food and farming. For more information on Cornish Mutual visit cornishmutual.co.ukFor our podcast disclaimer click here. If you'd like to send us an email you can contact us at podcast@cornishmutual.co.ukTimestamps00:15 Peter introduces the episode.01:30 Andrew introduces himself. 3:48 Bokashi6:30 Rothamsted research study.8:34 What does soil organic matter do?11:15 How do farmers value the nutrients on their farm?13:37 How to analyse a muck heap?15:24 Get away from calling muck a waste product. 15:58 What are the common mistakes when it comes to applying muck?18:00 Costs. 19:05 Announcements about capital items.19:30 Grants that people should be looking at?21:50 incremental changes. 24:38 Applying ammonium nitrate. 30:20 C:N ration of muck 33:50 Showstoppers. 35:44 Peter rounds up. 

Send us a textThis week is all about getting ahead with your next round of crops! Preparing for the next round of succession sowing and planting. Yes, it's time to start thinking about those Winter crops—eek!

Welcome to our short and sharp summer series where we revisit some of your very favourite episodes. We've added an additional little intro, reflecting on our chat with Kate and composty things we've been working on since then. Compostable Kate's was a cracker of an episode.  While not a sponsor of this episode, Bokashi is offering an ongoing 5% off everything on the www.bokashi.com.au website for all your Bokashi and EnsoPet needs. We're addicts. Simply enter the code AG15 at check out to receive your 5% discount.  Here's the original episode spiel: We've been dedicated students of the Compostable Kate's School of Compost since wayyyyy back, so it's an absolute dream to interview her for this week's episode. Kate Flood (aka Compostable Kate) is a sustainability educator, compost queen and author of The Compost Coach (2023). She is prolific on Instagram, sharing all things Bokashi, worm farms and hot compost. She lives, gardens and composts in the Bega Valley, in southern New South Wales on the Yuin-Monaro Nations. We chat about what Kate and Beyonce have in common, her amazing jumper collection and, of course, all things compost including sheet composting, what kind of composting she'd do on a desert island, and a whole lot more.  We also talk about how composting is fabulous for the garden, and vital part of climate activism.  Find her on Instagram here But before we get there...we're chatting about possums, snails and wheelbarrows. We're drinking the Compostable Kate Cocktail (a fresh little number we whipped up with sparkling rose, ginger syrup, strawberries and borage). We're recommending The Overstory by Richard Powers Kate recommends: the Share Waste app - a way to connect people who wish to recycle their food scraps and other organics with their neighbours who are already composting, worm-farming or keeping farm animals.

The Soil Matters Brandon Rust @bokashi earthworks   Today's Guest: Brandon Rust @bokashi earthworks https://www.bokashiearthworks.net/ https://www.instagram.com/bokashiearthworks/ https://www.instagram.com/rustbrandon/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0Kq1qkd2nRlMBXxdJ7gN5g   Your Host:   Leighton Morrison https://www.instagram.com/kingdomaqua... https://www.kingdomaquaponicsllc.com/   Executive Producer Ken Somerville https://www.instagram.com/kensomerville/ https://www.itsallaboutthebiology.ca Contact email itsallaboutthebiology@gmail.com Reach out to Ken for a quick 15 min call: https://calendly.com/kensomerville/connections   Help to support the mission: patreon.com/user?u=104510089   Discount codes available at: https://www.itsallaboutthebiology.ca/discountcodes   #flowers,#plants,#nature,#gardening,#garden,#growing,#koreannaturalfarming,#naturalfarming,#jadam,#naturalfertilizer,#naturalfarminginputs,#permaculture,#regenerative,#foodforest,#biodynamic,#bioactive,#organic,#notill,#knf,#organicgardening,#urbangardening,#containergardening,#homegardening,   Music by The Invisible Gardener (Andy Lopez) https://soundcloud.com/invisiblegardener For Full: Disclaimer

--This episode is proudly sponsored by Bokashi One. Reduce landfill and boost the efforts in your garden in a fuss-free, no-smell way. Enjoy 15% off the entire Bokashi One range by using the promo code AG15 when purchasing from www.bokashi.com.au between now and 1 Jan, 2025-- When Petrina Burrill was in grade six, she wrote, ‘When I grow up I want to be a florist,' such was her conviction and obsession with blooms. Since then, Petrina Blooms - as she's known on Instagram. has had a diverse career, but has landed back in the garden where she belongs. She's now known for her secret garden-esque backyard in Melbourne and her epic annual ranunculus, aka ranunk, schedule.  For over a decade, Petrina has lovingly transformed her family's backyard into a year-round spectacle of beauty, from where she hosts workshops and events and picks bunches of flowers for lucky recipients.  Petrina lives, works and gardens in Ivanhoe Victoria, on Wurundjeri Woi Wurrung Country. The days are longer and we're drinking a Willie Smith's Organic Cider. It's yummy and not too sweet. Perfection! We're talking about rooster dramas, kiwi fruit, espaliering stuff, wormwood for chickens, what the heck is a corm, Bokashi, and dreaming of a Hannah Maloney-esque pumpkin arch. We've also been mismanaging our potatoes. face palms. Check out Petrina's magical garden escapades here Follow us on Instagram here. Thanks for being here.  Feel free to leave us a review. We would LOVE that. 

Send Me A Message!! Could your garden flourish with only a sprinkle of fallen leaves? Unlock the secrets of creating nutrient-rich leaf mold to naturally boost soil health and transform your garden into a thriving ecosystem. In this episode of Master My Garden podcast, we unravel the art of turning autumn's abundance into a gardener's goldmine, inspired by a curious listener's question. You'll discover not just the simplicity of making leaf mold but also the patience it demands, akin to nature's slow dance in the forest. As we embrace the seasonal shift, learn how to prepare your garden for the chill of frost, and explore the timely practice of bare root and root ball planting to ensure your garden thrives through the cold months.Venture beyond leaf mold and step into the world of composting mastery. From the basics of balancing green and brown materials in your compost bin to exploring innovative techniques like the Bokashi bin method and worm bins, we offer valuable insights for every garden space. Whether you're dealing with a towering compost heap or trying to manage food waste in a small apartment, there's a method for you. With personal tips and tried-and-tested advice, get ready to revamp your composting routine and gear up your garden for the upcoming bare root planting season. Plus, don't miss a sneak peek into our upcoming episode, where we'll explore perfect Christmas gifts for the garden enthusiasts in your life.Support the showIf there is any topic you would like covered in future episodes, please let me know. Email: info@mastermygarden.com Master My Garden Courses: https://mastermygarden.com/courses/Check out Master My Garden on the following channels Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mastermygarden/ Instagram @Mastermygarden https://www.instagram.com/mastermygarden/ Until next week Happy gardening John

Scotland Grows writer Karen Stewart-Russell chats in this episode about so many things: her love of roses, the many things she does with the herbs she grows, and her love of gardening gadgets like an automated greenhouse system, her Bokashi bin, and her hydroponics growing experiment. Karen's passion for community also shines through as she discusses her local initiatives: a seed library and plant exchange that fosters community interaction and brightens spirits, and her secret guerrilla gardening efforts to plant bulbs around her neighbourhood. What is apparent is Karen's quiet joy for gardening, for her own personal satisfaction rather than for comparison to others, and you can explore Karen's insightful columns in Scotland Grows magazine.  Be inspired in this episode with Karen, to find joy in every corner of your green space. -------------------------------------------- Be sure to sign up to our mailing list so we can let you know when new episodes are published. Scotland Grows magazine is our digital title which celebrates Scottish gardening, and drops into your inbox 6 times a year. If you would like to receive a copy, just follow this LINK. You can follow Scotland Grows on Facebook, Instagram, and LinkedIn, we'd love to have your company there! And of course, you can always find your share of gardening goodness on our website at scotlandgrowsmagazine.com. -------------------------------------------- This series is sponsored by ROOTS, a subscription from the National Trust for Scotland which helps both your garden and Trust gardens thrive. For £7 a month you will be sent a ROOTS pack every six weeks, with gardening gifts, including Scottish seeds six times a year, stories about Scotland's plant life, and tips from  expert Trust gardeners, as well as an invitation to two exclusive ROOTS events a year with the Trust gardens team. Whether you buy ROOTS for yourself or as a gift for a loved one, your £7 a month will go towards supporting Trust gardens and designed landscapes in Scotland. Sign up today at nts.org.uk/roots and use the code Grows24 to receive an extra packet of seeds in your first pack. Find out more here: www.nts.org.uk/roots

Cuauhtemoc Villa is an educator and pioneer in the regenerative community who not only teaches, but SHOWS people how to unlock the power of healthy, clean soils using Effective Microorganisms (EM), Bokashi and Bio-Char. Cuauhtemoc has nearly 20 years of experience preparing EM with an ability to help YOU UNDERSTAND why it is a miracle in regenerative agriculture.Topics Discussed:What is Effective Microorganisms (EM) and How Do You Make It?How can EM be used in bio-remediaton of soils and waterways?What is Bio-Char and Why Is It Important?How Do You Make Bio-Char?What Kind of Information does the Carbon in Bio-Char Hold and Transfer?Questions Asked:What rate of Sea Water is used to re-mineralize RO?How Do I Make EM at Home?Is RO Water considered "Clean Water" or lifeless water in your opinion?Do You Like to add anything additional to your bokashi after ferment?When worms get that purple sheen, is that the abundance of Purple Non-Sulphur Bacteria (PNSB)?Can you explain Super Ceramics powder?When you use molasses, should you put it in hot water before using it?How can I remove viroids in my soil?Is any wood OK for making biochar?What are the best woods to use for biochar?Could there be any benefits to making bio-char with driftwood as opposed to other woods?What is a DIY Terra Preta compost pit?How much bio-char would you suggest using in worm and insect bins like isopods?Support this FREE show by supporting these amazing small-businesses:http://www.okcalyxxshop.comhttp://www.rubberduckyisopods.comhttp://www.MIBeneficials.com

Well, the summer's over, but for the last week in the southwest of England the sun's been shining while autumn's been gently easing itself into the air - and Newsweek is back with a full, ripe crop of six conversations. ffinlo Costain speaks to: Emma Toovey from the Environment Bank - 1'10'' Leona McDonald, the director of Golden Hooves - 9'12'' Andrew Barbour from Mains of Fincastle - 15'58'' Bishop Takalani Mufamadi from the Southern African Faith Communities' Environment Institute - 25'46'' Emma Bell from The Open University - 40'22'' Alice Groom from the RSPB - 53'24''

We connect with Southern Oregon Bokashi to learn all about how Bokashi works in your Soil, what it adds to your soil life (microbes and enzymes) and nutrients, and more! Plus we break down how you can make your own Bokashi at home! Connect with Southern Oregon Bokashi: https://sobokashi.com/ - Please Like & Subscribe to our channel! - https://youtube.com/cannabuzz Join the CannaBuzz community and use code "buzz" for a free month of access. https://www.cannabuzz.app/invite/1117872 Need help with pest management? Check out Lost Coast Plant Therapy: https://www.lostcoastplanttherapy.com/ Thank you to our Sponsors: TikiMadMan - TikiSeeds and TikiCuts Neptune Seedbank - NeptuneSeedbank Sacred Three Mushrooms - SacredThreeMushrooms Lost Coast Plant Therapy - https://www.lostcoastplanttherapy.com/ Sign up for our Email List: https://view.flodesk.com/pages/621c1f4f755600eb5898aa42 Please subscribe to our show on Spotify or your favorite podcast app.

We're talking slugs, again. The allotment's slugs seem to have now all commuted to Karin's plot for a holiday, after finding a deluge of slugs on her plot this morning. Having been despondent about the fox digging up the lettuce seedlings in the bed of Bokashi compost, it's finally come up trumps, providing so many nutrients for Vicky's random pumpkin plant which is absolutely booming.  We've both been really disappointed with our corn on the cobs and feels like our sweetcorn may have suffered from a lack of pollinators this year.  Vicky finally makes her first ratatouille this century and Karin has some lovely pears. Q: Is a big courgette called a marrow? Do share your thought on our poll!

It's time for the second Big River Watch of the year. It's a chance to spend time observing the health of your local river between the 6th and 12th of September. The River Dee trust are taking part in the forthcoming survey and Keilidh Ewan, education and outreach officer for the trust gave Mark some more information.A new trial is underway in Scotland which could cut the harmful emissions associated with manure on farms. Two farmers are trying out a system called Bokashi which the Soil Association hopes may lead to improvements in the soil while also being a little kinder to the environment. Rachel spoke to farmer Andrew Barbour at Glen Fincastle and Field Lab Co-ordinator Audrey Litterick who explained what this process actually involves.Producer Phil met up with Ada Campbell, chair of Langass Community Woodland Trust to have a walk round one of the few forested areas on north Uist and hear the story of Hercules the bear.Rachel recently bumped into an artist in Aberdeenshire who was on her way to a farm to collect a fleece for one of her new collections. Lucy MacDonald who is also a weaver likes to use local materials including wool and plants to make her work sustainable, traceable and authentic. Rachel joined her as she visited Diana Milligan and Cobweb – one of Diana's rather interesting looking Ryeland Sheep.The Isle of Rum has been designated as Scotland's first International Dark Sky Sanctuary by DarkSky International. The designation recognises the efforts of the community to protect and promote the island's starry skies and nocturnal environment. Isle of Rum Community Trust Director Fliss Fraser joins Mark and Rachel live to tell them more about Rum's dark skies and the benefits the nocturnal environment brings to us and to the natural world.The forest trails near Aberfoyle in the Trossachs have become increasingly popular in recent years for mountain bikers and gravel riders keen to get away from busy roads. The waymarked trails, in the shadow of Ben Lomond, have been named Gravelfoyle. Now, in a bid to attract more people to them a pilot called Parkride has been taking place; a bit like Parkrun but replacing running with biking. Alongside it parents can drop off their kids at ‘Bairns On Bikes' where professional coaches teach youngsters basic and more advanced bike skills. Linda Sinclair went along to find out more.Claudia Zeiske is a long distance walker and she has been walking from mountain to sea across Aberdeenshire. Mark met up with Claudia at the end of her journey at a place called Gadle Braes in Peterhead in what was a very blustery day to find out why exactly she had undertaken the walk Lucy MacDonald's an artist who uses local fleeces and plants in her work. After she's sorted through the fleece and given it a wash, she will put it through a carding machine before spinning it and weaving it. Rachel watched her in action at her studio in Aberdeen.

Welcome to this special mini-episode of Hort Culture, where your hosts Alexis and Ray dive into the world of bokashi composting. Today, Alexis shares her fascination with this Japanese method that ferments organic waste, including items typically not compostable. She's intrigued by its efficiency and how it enriches soil without the foul odors associated with traditional composting. Comparatively, bokashi is quicker and can handle a wider variety of waste, making it a superb option for urban gardeners. Join us as we explore this sustainable practice that's revolutionizing composting in small spaces!Bokashi methodQuestions/Comments/Feedback/Suggestions for Topics: hortculturepodcast@l.uky.eduCheck us out on Instagram!

Weder Alex noch Lena haben einen Bokashi oder eine Wurmkiste daheim. Das liegt vor allem daran, das beide mit einem Kompost im Garten arbeiten und damit gut fahren. Wer aber weniger Platz hat, seine organischen Abfälle in der Küche direkt wieder in den Kreislauf zurückführen möchte und den Aufwand nicht scheut, für den ist eine der beiden hier vorgestellten Alternativen mit Sicherheit was. In der aktuellen Folge erfahrt ihr, wie die beiden Kompostalternativen funktionierenl, was ihr dafür benötigt und womit ihr euch im Vorfeld beschäftigen solltet.Außerdem kurz & knackig, was gerade im Garten zu tun ist:denkt daran, weiterhin Salat vorzuziehen und zu pflanzen, vor allem Radicchio, Eissalat, Endivie und Bataviadas letzte Mal gehen Buschbohnen, Spinat und KarottenErdbeeren düngenKräuter ernten und trocknenHimbeeren mulchen Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

There is a simple solution to conserve, and reuse, more of the nutrients from food waste. In today's episode, I'm talking to Julia Brenner, a soil scientist and co-founder of Melta, a company dedicated to transforming waste management and soil health. Julia and her business partner founded Melta in 2020, to solve two interconnected challenges faced by rural municipalities: the lack of accessible and cost-effective food waste solutions, and the difficulty of transporting organic fertilizers to remote areas. This is a brilliant example of something that is needs little investment, saves money, time and space, and can be adopted easily, all around the world. It is easy to scale out, and a great example of a local, regenerative solution to the typical ineffective, expensive and resource-intensive solutions that we see in western society. The Melta system uses the Bokashi process which is thought to originate from East Asia, centuries ago. The Bokashi process converts food waste and similar organic matter into a nutrient-rich soil additive which also improves soil texture. Melta's innovative system for organic waste collection, processing, and utilization can reduce municipal waste transport by 70%, and producing a nutrient-rich fertilizer that is cheaper and easier for farmers to access. Julia studied soil restoration at the University of Iceland and then delved further into nutrient cycling and climate models at Oak Ridge National Laboratory. She continues to engage in collaborative field experiments with the Soil Conservation Service of Iceland and Icelandic Agricultural University. Julia is passionate about making “sustainability” a realistic and attainable goal, and is committed to bridging the gap between practical waste management and soil health. We discover why dealing with household food waste is such a big headache for rural municipalities; and how the bokashi process can easily become part of a system that's better for households, farmers and the local council. Julia explains how the Bokashi process works in practice, and why households prefer it over other methods like putting food waste in with other refuse, or have separate food waste collection bins. As we'll hear, the results are amazing – and the system is very simple, so it could be easily used in rural areas around the world.

Send us a Text Message.Ever wondered if it's possible to manage a full-fledged compost system in a bustling city like Tampa? Join me, Sheila, as I share my personal journey through the trials and tribulations of urban composting with a busy family life. This episode of Zero Waste Imperfectly explores the ins and outs of traditional compost bins, the surprises of vermicomposting, and the simplicity of Bokashi composting. My experiences are filled with successes and failures, offering you an honest look at what works and what doesn't in an urban environment.Learn how to integrate composting into your hectic schedule without turning your life upside down. I'll discuss the benefits and challenges of various composting techniques and provide practical tips to make it a sustainable habit. Whether you're a composting novice or an experienced green thumb, this episode is brimming with insights to help you reduce waste and contribute to a healthier planet. Join the conversation, and let's make sustainable living a reality, one small step at a time.

We enjoy a cup of Dried Yarrow and Mint tea today - it's a winner, Jen loves it.Dr Compost joins us for a chat about… composting! He's a mine of information and has a few ideas to help Jen get started with composing.Take a look at Ben's Socials @dr_compost & Dr Compost on fb, Ben talks about Bokashi composting in his latest video.We learn about two lesser-known Vitamins G & G. That's right, Gratitude and Green, we take stock of just how beneficial being grateful and spending time outside is for our health.Vegetable of the Week is Micro-greens.Our new segment is ‘Snapshot'.  This is the spot where we connect with gardeners across the nation to uncover their latest endeavours and gardening adventures. This week kicks off with us talking to Dr Compost, Ben Elms.We announce our winner of the weekly $20 Gift Voucher from Kings Seeds.Shelley Franks @mumofarainbow And the Winner of the Gubba Moon Calendar Clock is….. Kate Grantley-Hogg, Congratulations to our winners, and huge thanks to our sponsors.Sowing and Planting time - what should we be planting now?Book of the Week - Your Well-being Garden and RHS publication.Support the showYou can contact us at coach@yourgardencoach.nz Please follow our Instagram page @yourgardencoach_nz where we regularly upload interesting gardening tips Our website is under construction, as you know good things take time.Keep a lookout for http://yourgardencoach.nz We hope you enjoy our podcast, designed for gardeners in the Central Otago region of the South Island of New Zealand - but not exclusively. Join us from wherever you happen to be and simply check the title of the podcast. e.g. Spring Ep1. to fit in with the season in your location.

Episode Summary This week on Live Like the World is Dying, Colin talks to Brooke about how to asses damage to structures after disasters, what you can do when you're stuck in a building after a disaster, and ways to make your situation easier and safer. Guest Info Colin (he/him) is a carpenter, industrial electrician, and backpacker. Host Info Brooke can be found on Twitter or Mastodon @ogemakweBrooke. Publisher Info This show is published by Strangers in A Tangled Wilderness. We can be found at www.tangledwilderness.org, or on Twitter @TangledWild and Instagram @Tangled_Wilderness. You can support the show on Patreon at www.patreon.com/strangersinatangledwilderness. Transcript Live Like the World is Dying: Colin on Structural Triage After a Disaster **Brooke ** 00:15 Hello and welcome to Live Like the World is Dying, your podcast for it feels like the end times. I'm Brooke Jackson, your host for this episode. Today I'll be talking with Colin, an experienced construction and trade worker, about how to prepare for and perform structural triage after disasters. But first we'd like to celebrate being a member of the Channel Zero Network of anarchist podcasts by playing a little jingle from one of the other podcasts on the network. Doo doo doo, doo doo. **Brooke ** 00:48 And we're back. Colin, thank you for joining us today to talk about structural triage after disasters. Would you introduce yourself? Let us know your pronouns, where you're from if you want, maybe some of your background in the construction industry. **Colin ** 01:19 Yeah, I'm Colin, he/him. Lived in around Western Pennsylvania pretty much my entire life—mostly in the Pittsburgh area. I picked up carpentry right after college just as a way to earn some money. Been in and out that for a while. I worked as an industrial electrician in the power industry for about seven years, and then decided I'd had enough of that and went back to doing carpentry. **Brooke ** 02:10 Okay, so is your—is your background in those trades the reason that you're interested in this topic, or was there something else that sparked you or made you kind of get into learning about it? **Colin ** 02:23 Actually, the impetus for this was a little over—actually, seems like ages ago, but actually less than a year ago, a friend had an apartment fire right after Christmas last year. And it's still that big cold snap. And fortunately, we managed to get them recovered from that, but it was only due to the fairly heroic efforts of a lot of friends. And after that I started thinking about, you know, like, what are the ways that, you know, if you don't have people looking out for you and willing to come bail you out, what can you do if you're stuck in a damaged building for a few days while you're waiting for utilities to come back online, first responders to work through a backlog? Just, how can you make things easier in the immediate few days after disaster? **Brooke ** 03:14 Nice. So is this something that you then have you had to put into practice, or other people around you have put into practice? Or are we mostly theoretical at this point and haven't tested all these things—not that we don't trust your experience here. **Colin ** 03:31 Yeah, no, I have done some of these things more in the context of camping and backpacking, just like, there are things you can do that will make the situation easier and safer. Also, a lot of my background in working in power plants involved constant safety trainings about how do you do things safely? What do you have to look out for? What are, you know, things that you just need to be aware of when you're in dangerous situations? And I'm continually surprised at how many of those applied to everyday life, and how much of that stuff we just don't have to think about when we're living in a house that has already been designed to be safe. But when you have a disaster, obviously things break. And suddenly, things that are—things that normally have the engineering and safety built into them no longer work the way they're supposed to, and suddenly, you have to take care of all of that on your own. It's not that hard to do, or even that expensive. You just have to do the planning and preparation before it happens. Because once you find yourself in that situation, it's too late. **Brooke ** 04:46 Yeah, that makes sense. And we're gonna get into those details in a second. But for the listener, I just wanted to share that Colin had reached out to us with this really great list of different things we could explore on this topic. And as I said to him, the the part that stood out most to me was he was talking about how to shelter in place in a compromised building and how to do structural triage and first aid that can make the eventual recovery easier. So we may get into a lot more than that today, we may have a second episode at some point to talk about other things because Colin has a lot of great info to share. But that was the part that really struck me and the areas that I wanted to focus on. And so right before we get into the details, another question I wanted to ask you was, how broadly is this applicable? Like, you know, there's all kinds of different disaster situations, right? We've got floods, fires, earthquakes, tornadoes, unnatural disasters. Do you have different tips for different scenarios that we're going to talk about, or is a lot of this like works across multiple possibilities? **Colin ** 05:50 It's some of both. A lot of the things you need to be concerned with sheltering in place, or just being aware of what are the things that change when systems go offline. So when you don't have power anymore and you're relying on batteries or a generator, or you lose your gas, now, suddenly, you're relying on kerosene heaters or lamps. All of these things change how you have to think about your safety in a house. Obviously, people have been living with fireplaces and wood stoves and oil lamps for a very, very long time. It's not that hard to do. But if you're used to being able to flip a switch and have the lights come on, you're going to have to make some changes. And if you don't do those things, you can cause yourself serious problems. **Brooke ** 06:38 Okay, so let's talk about the first part of that where work. Let's say we're in a situation where we've just had a disaster, we're in a compromised building—whether it be like—I guess mostly we're talking about homes, or maybe your apartment complex too, not necessarily, like, work structures. So let's say we're in that in that situation, we're in this compromised building right after a disaster, what's one of the first things that we need to do? **Colin ** 07:01 So the very first thing is always keep yourself safe, because there's no disaster that you can't make worse by getting injured. And this is especially true— **Brooke ** 07:12 [Laughing] That's a good line, yeah! **Colin ** 07:12 That's especially true when you have, you know, something like the ERCOT disaster down in Texas and 2021, and you have an entire city that is struggling, and your first responders are overwhelmed. **Brooke ** 07:28 Was that when they lost power? **Colin ** 07:30 Yeah, they lost power for I want to say a week or two? I don't think it was continuous. I think it went off, and then it came back on, and then it went off again. The estimated death toll from that was like somewhere between 250 and 700 people, which is—that's like 10 times the number of people that die from an average hurricane season. And most of it was due to things like hyperthermia and carbon monoxide poisoning. Just because people were trying to stay warm and making bad decisions either because they didn't know any better, or they didn't have the tools they needed. Most of it could have been avoided. But obviously that was a terrible situation, and Texas is still recovering from that. So yeah, you've got to keep yourself safe. Couple parts of that. The easiest thing is the personal protective equipment side. Because that's just a matter of throwing a little bit of money at the problem, and it doesn't even take very much money. This is stuff like have worked gloves around so that you can protect your hands. Keep safety glasses around, because getting an eye injury will make life real bad and real tough right now. Earplugs. Disasters are often loud, and even if they're not, things are going to sound different. So having earplugs can help you sleep better. These are, like, not—things that do not cost a whole lot of money. But the most important thing is just to look at the situation and take a beat and figure out what has changed and what you need to do to stop the problem from getting worse. So the first part of this is anything that is broken or not working the way it is supposed to needs to be shut down. So like, do you need to get the power turned off? Do you need to get the gas turned off? Do you need to get the water turned off so your pipes don't freeze and burst? These are things that the average homeowner can do: turning off the power, as long as you have access to the circuit breaker, it's a matter of flipping a switch. Water should just be a matter of closing a valve. The problem is a lot of times the shutoff valves for water don't work the way they're supposed to because they haven't been maintained. I have run into that a few times. And— **Brooke ** 09:42 I know I know at my own house, shutting off the water is a much bigger deal than it should be. **Colin ** 09:48 Right and most of the time that's fine, until you have pipes that are actively spraying water, and suddenly it's not fine. Getting the gas shut off. Usually, again, just matter of going outside with a wrench and turning the valve at the meter. But you have to have the right size wrench and you have to know where that valve is. **Brooke ** 10:09 Okay, so here's a neat—sorry to interrupt you. But I've had—for a long time I've had—I don't know if this is good, so you tell me. I got a wrench that's like specifically for shutting off your gas, it's this bright red one, and you zip tie it next to your gas main. And then if there's a disaster, you should have to go cut the zip tie and use that wrench. **Colin ** 10:32 Yeah, that is a fantastic idea. **Brooke ** 10:34 Okay. **Colin ** 10:35 I would suggest maybe string or something that you can just yank to break it loose, because having zip tie on there that you have to cut, that's one more tool you have to find before you can get to the wrench. Zipties are fantastic because they are very secure. Sometimes so secure that you can't get them off. **Brooke ** 10:50 So I might have to replace the string once in a while, but string would be better. **Colin ** 10:53 Or, the meters normally magnetic, you can put it on a magnet, you can just have it— **Brooke ** 10:58 Oh, yeah! **Colin ** 10:59 —duct taped to the side of it. Something you can get off without tools. And it's always there. And then periodically, every six months, just check and make sure it's there. And, you know, a raccoon hasn't stolen it. But no, that's a fantastic idea. **Brooke ** 11:13 Okay, so that's a good planning ahead. But if you haven't planned ahead, then, you know trying to find a wrench is generally the tool you're going to need, right, to shut that off if you have gas? **Colin ** 11:22 Yeah yeah. Then if you live in an apartment building, usually you will have access to your electrical panel, but not always. You may not have access to the main water shut offs for your apartment. You can probably find out where in the building those are. You're not going to be able to tell if they're working the way they're supposed to before something happens. But have a plan for how to get into whatever room the shut offs are in. If you have to go through a door, this may mean keeping a sledge hammer or pry bar around so that you can get through to the shut offs in the case of an emergency. And yeah, your landlord is probably going to be unhappy and you may lose your security deposit, but it's better than having your apartment burn down. **Brooke ** 12:12 Yeah, seems like it. **Colin ** 12:13 Yeah. **Brooke ** 12:14 Okay, so step one is, like right after the disaster, donning some protective gear and then going around to shut off compromised utilities. **Colin ** 12:24 Right, anything's not working, get it turned off so that the situation stops getting worse. Once everything's shut down, then you can take your time and figure out how to make things livable until systems start to come back online. The other thing to do with preparation is make sure all your smoke alarms are working, and make sure you have fire extinguishers. Because, again, fire when you don't have first responders available is very, very bad. So hopefully everyone has these things to begin with. But if you don't, I highly recommend going out and getting some as soon as possible. **Brooke ** 13:01 Okay. **Colin ** 13:02 So you now have everything turned off, you have your fire extinguishers, you've dealt with the immediate problem. Now you're faced with, how do I make the structure minimally safe for the next few days? If you have broken windows, damaged roof from storms, things like that. **Brooke ** 13:25 Okay, so it's assuming your residence is still some amount of livable and/or you just don't have anywhere else to go and you kind of have to stay. **Colin ** 13:35 Yeah, as long as you have a roof and three walls, you're gonna be fine most of the time. **Brooke ** 13:44 What about—what about the fourth wall? Why don't we get a fourth wall here, Collin? **Colin ** 13:48 I mean, four walls is great. Three walls is enough to keep the roof up. **Brooke ** 13:55 That's a really good point though, no, genuinely. **Colin ** 13:58 If a tree comes through the front of your house, you can still deal with that. It's gonna suck, but it's not the end of the world. And the things that you need to make the situation better than it would be? Not that complicated. It basically boils down a lot of times to having some plastic sheeting or tarps and a staple gun. If you can get something over your openings to keep the wind and the water from entering the house, that's going to buy you a lot of time. If you've ever been driving through, you know, the back roads and rural counties and you see the houses that have the plastic tarps over their roofs that have obviously been there for many years, those houses are still functional. They're still standing. A lot of times people are still living quite comfortably inside those houses. Doesn't look very good, but it's gonna work for a while. And oftentimes, that's all you need. **Brooke ** 14:50 Yeah, that's one of the reasons you see tarps up there for so long is that they're doing what they need to do and they don't need to do more than that. For folks that don't have that kind of stuff sitting around, I imagined that maybe grabbing some sheets or blankets or something and throwing those over the opening would still be better than just leaving it open? **Colin ** 15:10 Yeah, even the bed sheet over the window is going to stop rain from blowing in and my dogs barking in the background. I apologize. **Brooke ** 15:19 That's okay. We are a puppy-friendly podcast. **Colin ** 15:25 A staple gun is something that you should definitely own if you don't, because that's the easiest and fastest way of getting any kind of sheet, whether it's cloth, or a tarp, or trash bags with plastic sheeting attached to walls really fast. A staple gun will set you back maybe $20 tops, and makes life a whole lot easier when it comes to covering openings. If you don't, if you don't have that, duct tape will also work. However, it doesn't work as well as you would expect, especially when the weather is cold or if surfaces are wet. **Brooke ** 16:01 Sure. Yeah. Thumb tacks if you have those sitting around. **Colin ** 16:06 Thumb tacks. Hammer and nails. **Brooke ** 16:08 Yeah. **Colin ** 16:09 Anything to do to secure a sheet. At that point, you're not really worried about damaging the house because the damage has already been done, and fixing a few nail holes is peanuts compared to trying to fix, you know, several hundred gallons of water that have been blown in by high winds. **Brooke ** 16:25 Okay, so we close our openings to protect from water, from cold temperatures, probably from other elements too, right, if—blocking the sun? **Colin ** 16:36 Yeah, sun. If you're in a hot area—this is a totally different topic on its own. But trying to keep the sun out of your house, if you're in a hot situation is just as important as trying to keep the heat inside the house if you're in a cold situation. If you lose power and you're relying on air conditioning to keep your house livable, the best thing you can do is get all of your windows covered as soon as you possibly can. Because solar gain through glass will drive up the interior temperature really quickly. Doesn't matter what you have. Again, plastic bags will work. Anything, just block the amount of light that's coming through the glass. Cardboard, sheets, blinds, you name it? **Brooke ** 17:24 All right. So we've covered up our holes. What do we need to do next? **Colin ** 17:30 Covered up the holes. Things are shut down, turned off. Now you have to start worrying about how am I going to actually get back to living inside this damaged structure for as long as I need to until help can arrive and start doing major repairs that need to happen? And a couple of things you want to look at, the—obviously we're coming up on winter. So the first thing to talk about is how do you stay warm? Hopefully you have blankets and sleeping bags and things that will keep you warm overnight. But you can also look at how you can take a single room and the house and make that one room more pleasant for the duration. So like, if you are struggling to keep your house warm because either you've totally lost power or your furnace can't keep up with the temperatures, shut everything down except for one room—preferably a room that has water and power in it. So you have all of your basic necessities in one spot. If you have a bathroom basement—or a bathroom in the basement is ideal because it's usually going to be interior walls, you've got water, you've got power, and if you throw, you know, a pad down the floor you can even sleep in there. You've got all your necessities in one spot. **Brooke ** 18:56 Now are basements fairly safe places in the face of most natural disasters? Are there times when you wouldn't want to hang out in the basement? **Colin ** 19:03 It depends on the disaster. **Brooke ** 19:04 Okay. **Colin ** 19:06 Obviously if you're dealing with a flood, the basements not where you want to be. **Brooke ** 19:10 [Laughs] Sure. What about if there's been fire damage to like the upstairs of your house? **Colin ** 19:20 That depends on how stable the structure is. If there's fire damage, usually you don't want to be directly over or directly under the damaged section. **Brooke ** 19:31 Hm. Okay. **Colin ** 19:32 So that if it collapses, it doesn't land on you and you don't go through the floor. **Brooke ** 19:37 Okay. Makes sense. **Colin ** 19:38 So fire—like talking about a fire damaged structure is probably beyond the scope of what I'm qualified to do, and beyond the scope of most of the people listening to the podcast because it requires you to be able to look at the damaged structural members and evaluate, you know, how compromised are these? Is this floor burned but otherwise stable, or is this going to collapse in the next five minutes? And that's a skill set entirely on its own. **Brooke ** 20:11 That's a good point. **Colin ** 20:12 If something looks burned and unsafe, just don't go near it. **Brooke ** 20:18 Yeah, and of course, you know, burned structures and objects can be very carcinogenic too. **Colin ** 20:26 That's also true. **Brooke ** 20:27 They can really impact your health. So that's a really good point that a lot of this maybe is really not applicable to the situation of having been in a fire. **Colin ** 20:35 Now, that said, if you've lost half of your house to fire, and you have a few rooms that are still relatively untouched on one side of the house, and you can seal off the burned section of the house, again, using plastic, just so you don't have the smell of the burned material getting into the living area as much as possible, you're still better off inside the house in that situation overall, if you don't have anywhere else to go, then you are trying to, say, camp out in the backyard. Because solid walls and a solid roof offer you more protection and better insulation, even when they're damaged. **Brooke ** 21:16 Okay, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. If you have a really bad kitchen fire and lose your kitchen, that doesn't mean you have to move out of the whole house necessarily. Okay. **Colin ** 21:24 Correct. Yeah. And obviously, the best thing to do is leave and go someplace else if you can. But this is: your stocking place because the roads are impassable, or you literally have nowhere else to go. **Brooke ** 21:37 Yeah. Okay. All right. So moving into the basement, a good idea if you can, but in general is secluding yourself in part of the house. And to throw in a personal anecdote, we had this ice storm here in Kalapuya territory in Oregon—it was almost three years ago now. And most of the town lost power. And it was one, two, three days, a week, seven days, ten days for some folks—long time. And, I kind of without knowing any of this, just sort of instinctively moved us into the living room where a fireplace was because we had lost power and we lost it for a week. And we all just camped out, you know, slept, ate, played in the living room, because the only source of heat was the fireplace. So that's what we gravitated to. Anyway. **Colin ** 22:27 Yeah. And if you have a fireplace, if you have a room that's already set up for that kind of thing, like a living room, that's fantastic. I mean, there's no reason to hide out in the bathroom, if you have a place with a working fireplace. Yeah, good, go for the fireplace room. **Brooke ** 22:42 Yeah. On the downside, we had to pass into the, you know, 40 degree, 30 degree weather in the rest of the house to get to the bathroom. One in the back of the house. But, you know, for everything else, we were cozied up and warm in our one little room. Which, you know, we drove each other crazy. I will say that too being trapped in the one room together. But it was the only place that we be worn for that week. **Colin ** 23:06 Yeah, like having just a contained place that you can keep as warm and comfortable or as cool and comfortable as possible is your best option. Don't worry about trying to keep your entire house up to temperature, whether that be warm or cold. Because that takes a lot of energy to do and it's just probably not gonna be possible in most situations. **Brooke ** 23:28 Okay, here's a scenario question for you: Let's say same set of circumstances, like, that I went through, but something crashed through my big living room window, and we have to tarp over it. Is it? Is it? Is it better? Like, if I have to stay in my house at that point, is it better to still be in the living room with the fire in the tarped up window, or should I try and move to a different room and figure out some other heating source? **Colin ** 23:54 I would probably still stay in the living room. If your concern is keeping yourself warm and you have a fireplace, that's going to be your best option. **Brooke ** 24:06 Okay. **Colin ** 24:06 The issue of the window being broken and the tarp—the one problem with tarps is in high winds, they tend to flap a lot and they're just kind of annoying. The easy solution to that is back it up with cardboard. Cardboard does not like to get wet, but as long as it stays dry, it's a fairly good insulator and it's solid. And it's cheap. You can—everybody has a pile of cardboard boxes and their front hall from Amazon waiting to go out in the recycling. So take some of those boxes— **Brooke ** 24:37 I'm just gonna close this door behind me... **Colin ** 24:41 Take some of these boxes, break them down, put a few layers of cardboard on the inside just as a backup to the tarp so that your plastic is keeping the water out, but your cardboard is blocking more of the wind and keeping the plastic from flapping quite so much. **Brooke ** 24:57 Okay got it. So staying close to that the best heat source is still the way to go. **Colin ** 25:03 Yeah, it's always gonna be a judgment call as to what that is. But if you have a fire, and you are comfortable using it, and you have a good wood supply, that's almost always going to be your best bet. **Brooke ** 25:16 Okay? Makes sense. All right, so let's see, where are we even at not in our to do list here? **Colin ** 25:24 Okay, so we have a warm place to stay. And, assuming you have a fireplace, we've got that taken care of. The trickier situation is when you lose power and suddenly you'd have no heat at all. And even if you're relying—if you use natural gas for your heat, pretty much every furnace these days has an electric blower unless you have one of the, like, direct vent wall mounted furnace units that are basically just a gas flame that's passively heating. But if you're using forced air, it's using gas for the heat source, but you need electricity to move that warm air through the house. So if you lose your electricity, you lose your heat, even though you still have a fuel source. And that's something that a lot of people don't think about, especially in winter, they're like, oh, it's not a problem. If you lose electricity, big deal, I have gas. Well, that's not going to help you. **Brooke ** 26:25 That was my circumstance. Gas furnace, but needed the electricity and we didn't have that. **Colin ** 26:30 Yeah. So if you can get yourself down to a fairly small room, a bathroom, a small bedroom, even a large walk-,in closet, it doesn't take a whole lot of energy to keep one of those spaces warm. You can get the small, portable, like, propane heaters, little buddy heaters. They don't cost a whole lot, but then you have the issue of combustion in a confined space, which is a good way to end up with carbon monoxide poisoning or asphyxiation or, yeah. It can be a very bad scene. So if you're going to do that, be sure you have a portable carbon dioxide alarm. Just go to Home Depot or wherever, pick up another one of the nine volt battery powered smoke and carbon monoxide alarms, and keep that in whatever space you're running that portable heater. It doesn't matter if you have smoke alarms and carbon monoxide heaters or detectors throughout the house. Those aren't going to help you if you have sealed yourself off from those alarms so that you can try to keep the space warm. **Brooke ** 26:41 Makes sense. **Colin ** 27:22 And actually, my recommendation, even more than one of the small portable heaters, is a kerosene lamp or propane lamp of some kind. A lot of the old ice fishers for heating their ice fishing huts in the winter just used Coleman lanterns. One of the propane Coleman lanterns will put out almost the same amount of heat as a 1500 watt electric space heater. **Brooke ** 28:11 Oh wow! **Colin ** 28:12 They are very, very warm. Now also, it's still combustion. So you have to be aware of that. And they do get very hot. So you need to have a place to hang it to keep it away from fabric and other things that can catch on fire. But they will make a room surprisingly warm on their own. And then that also gives you light source, which is another thing that you're going to need if your power is off. **Brooke ** 28:39 Now, what if—what if it's a reverse circumstance. You've lost power and it's very warm climate. You're in, you know, hot temperatures. Are you still trying to stay in one room? What tools do you have to get cold? **Colin ** 28:55 That is a much more difficult situation. There are some things you can do, but it's going to require more tools and more planning. If you've ever seen the giant black tubes coming out of pit toilets, usually like a national parks, what those are doing is pulling a draft on the underground part of the toilet by using a thermal chimney. That black tube gets hot in the sun and hot air rises, you're pulling the hot stinky air up from out of your bathroom, and pulling fresh air in. So you can do the exact same thing with a house by having some kind of large black chimney. You can do this out of pipe or even black cardboard if you live in a very dry area. But this is something you're going to have to know how to build and plan for in advance. It can be done, but it's probably going to be on—be beyond the scope of what most people can do in an emergency. So really, in the situation where hat is issue, the best thing you can do is stay out of the sun and try to move as little as possible. Outside if you can, like wherever you can get fresh air, any kind of breeze, air movement, is going to keep you cooler than sitting inside. **Brooke ** 30:24 Yeah. If you know how to make like a swamp cooler kind of thing—let's say your water, you can still get coolish water coming out and you've got—well I guess you need electricity for the fan. Damn. **Colin ** 30:36 You can use the swamp cooler, you can build a passive swamp cooler. Again, it relies on that thermal chimney to create the draft. But those do work, assuming that you're in an area that is dry enough that you have evaporation. I live in western Pennsylvania, and usually in the summer if it's hot enough to need air conditioning, it's also about 95% humidity and swamp coolers do not work. **Brooke ** 31:02 And I think they can even be dangerous, right? Making it—because they can make it too humid—unsafely humid? **Colin ** 31:09 Yes. **Brooke ** 31:12 Sorry, you're getting outside your realm. **Colin ** 31:17 No, no. So the swamp cooler, you know, for listeners who are not aware of what this is, it's a—basically the same thing as a wet rag that the moisture on the—in the cooler evaporates and evaporation requires energy. So you're pulling heat out of the air and using that to evaporate water. And what you end up with is air that is cooler than it was before, but also more humid. So obviously, before that can work, you need to have air that is dry enough that it can absorb some amount of moisture. If you already have close to as much moisture in the air as it can possibly handle, you're not going to change the temperature significantly by evaporation. **Brooke ** 32:03 Okay. Make sense. All right, so we we've gotten ourselves down to one room, we figured out a way to heat ourselves, and we're hunkered in and it's gonna be a few days that we're in this situation. So what now and what next? **Colin ** 32:22 So now you have to think about, you know, the basics of survival. You need food and water. Food, hopefully you have some stores around. If not, you know, at least in the United States, getting food is not that difficult most of the time, it may not be good. But you're probably not going to starve if you're in your house. **Brooke ** 32:52 Even if you're iced in and can't—can't literally get out of your house, you probably have something in your pantry, it might not be what you want to eat, but there is calories available. **Colin ** 33:02 Yeah. You have calories. They're maybe not the best calories, but their calories. Water is trickier. Hopefully, you have at least a little bit of a stockpile, but not always. And if you have lost your water supply, or if there is damage to the mains—like again, using Texas as an example. Once your water mains freeze and the pressure in those pipes drop, you start having issues with groundwater making its way into the water mains, and that results in a boil order. So it's entirely possible to be in a situation where your taps still work, water comes out, but you can't drink it. And now you're faced with a problem of, like, how do you make this water supply drinkable again? And if you have a small water filter like the Sawyer Mini, it's popular with a lot of backpackers, a LifeStraw, anything like that, those are great. If you don't have one of those, the reason it's called a boil order is because you can always boil the water. Again, assuming that you have a heat source with which you can get the water hot. If you have a gas stove, most of the time natural gas is not disrupted by natural disasters with the exception of earthquakes. But if you're relying on electricity, if you're cooking like a lot of people do and you lose electricity, now you're kind of out of luck. So you need to have some kind of way of boiling water. If you have that Coleman lantern or a kerosene lantern, a lot of those get hot enough that you actually can boil water in a small container over one of those lanterns. It's not ideal. My recommendation is actually just one of the old school Coleman propane two burner backpacking stoves. They are absolute workhorses, indestructible. My brother just inherited the one of my parents, which I think is pushing 50 years old and still works just fine. You cannot kill those things, and you can pick one up off eBay for somewhere between $20 and $50, depending on what kind of condition it's in. And the other great thing about propane is that it has an indefinite shelf life. So if you have one of those stoves sitting around and you have one of the green one pound cylinders of propane, that you inherited from your grandparents, plug that in. It doesn't matter if it is twice as old as you are, it's still going to work just fine. Same is not true of gasoline and a lot of the other fuels. They're hard to store, they smell, they have other issues. But propane is fantastic. So you can buy it, you can stash in your basement, you can forget about it, and it'll be there when you need it. **Brooke ** 36:01 Now a complicating factor to be aware of ahead of time, of course, is that you can have a big propane tank like you might use for your barbecue, and then you can have those little green ones. And they're not—they don't necessarily all hook up into the same canisters, you know, the camp stoves versus barbecues, right, so you might not have the right size of—like if you're—if you have a camp stove and you're like, I can hook my barbecue propane tank up to it, that's not going to work with what you normally have, right? **Colin ** 36:31 With what you normally have. There are adaptor hoses that are designed to do exactly that. And a lot of times if you have outdoor events, they will use those two burner stoves but they will hook them up to the barbecue tanks because the little one pound cylinders get expensive if you're relying on those for a large amount of propane. You also can't refill them like you can with a barbecue tanks. **Brooke ** 36:54 Right. So it's so frustrating. **Colin ** 36:55 Yeah. So if you have a bar—if you have a barbecue grill already, then, you know, there's your heat source. You have to go outside to use it, but you can put a pot of water on your barbeque grill and bring it to a boil, it'll work just fine. Or if you have one of the little two burner backpacking/camping stoves, they make the hoses to go from the barbecue tank to that kind of stove. And now you can bring your propane tank inside as you need. Again, under normal circumstances don't do this. But in a disaster you can. And run the propane inside. **Brooke ** 37:35 Check your venting, check your C02 levels... **Colin ** 37:38 Again, there's a very good reason that they tell you not to do this. And if you're cooking inside with a stove that has not been designed to do this, you need to have your fire extinguisher, you need to have your carbon monoxide alarm, and as soon as you're done with it, get that fuel back out of the house, because obviously propane is flammable. **Brooke ** 38:00 Alright, so we've got a way to get some water, hopefully, and to warm up some food or cook some food if we need to. So we've got those basic elements that we can survive and subsist for however long we're gonna be stuck in this compromised building in this disaster. **Colin ** 38:18 Yeah, so the next part is, don't get sick. This means how to have a way to keep yourself clean. [Everyone dissolves into a fit of giggles] Hot tip! Don't get sick. Life is better when you're not sick. **Brooke ** 38:21 [Laughing] Yes. **Colin ** 38:40 Keeping up with sanitation when you don't have running water, especially when you don't have hot running water, is hard. If you don't have water, you also probably don't have a functioning toilet anymore. And that's going to be a problem sooner than—real quick. Takes about 24 hours, possibly less, and suddenly it's unpleasant. So have a way of dealing with all that when you don't have running water. The easiest solution is a five gallon bucket and something for urine. You want to try to keep those things separate because you're in, you know, you can take it outside, you can dump it in the grass, it'll be fine. The same is not true of feces. You need to at the very least compost that. You can get fancy composting toilets that will set you back several thousand dollars. **Brooke ** 39:41 Yeah **Colin ** 39:42 They worked really well. They have fans and tumblers and everything else. But for the van that I use for camping, my solution is a five gallon bucket with a gasketed lid and plastic bag full of chopped straw, and it works just fine. It doesn't smell that great when you open it. But honestly, it's not terrible. As long as you keep the feces covered with a layer of either chopped straw or peat moss or something else that will absorb all the excess nitrogen is really what you're after. You're fine. **Brooke ** 40:21 A brief segue as we talk to Colin's husband/wife/romantic partner. How do they feel about the shit bucket? **Colin ** 40:30 Not a fan. On the other hand, given a choice between the shit bucket, and going outside, when it's pouring down rain in the middle of the winter, and we're camping? [Laughing] The bucket is better. It's not ideal, but when you need it, you're really glad that you have it. And it's something that you can keep around, it'll set—it'll cost you maybe $10, and throw it in the basement. Hopefully you never need it. But if you do, it's there, and it will get you out of a bad situation. And it doesn't require you to put a whole lot of thought or effort into dealing with it. And then once everything is back online, and you have trash collection, again, if nothing else, seal the bucket up, put it in the trash can, and let the whole thing go to the landfill. Composting it is great, that's what I do. But if you just don't want to deal with it, put the entire bucket in the trash. **Brooke ** 41:28 Or an even poor man's version of this, you can put a plastic bag in a trash can and put your business in there and then tie up your plastic bag, set it outside. And repeat, if you forgot to get a bucket ahead of time. **Colin ** 41:43 Yes, that also works just fine. The nice thing about the bucket is then you have a sealed lid so it keeps the odor inside, and you can keep it in the house where it's warm and dry. Because there's nothing worse than having to poop in the middle of the night when it is sleeping and five degrees outside. **Brooke ** 42:03 Yeah, that's pretty awful. **Colin ** 42:05 Food waste and trash are two other big things. Trash collection, we take for granted. But if you've ever had a couple bags of trash sitting in your garage for a week because you forgot to put them out on trash day, they get real unpleasant real fast. So again, if you're in a situation where you know you're going to have to be living with this stuff for an extended period of time, try to keep your food waste separate from your trash that doesn't stink. So plastic bags, solid stuff that will be dry and relatively odorless in one bag. Food waste, again, can go in a sealed bucket, or in a smaller bag, you can keep further away from the house. If you're familiar with Bokashi, I think that came up on one of the episodes about composting. It's not, it's not composting in and of itself, it's a bit more like fermenting—kind of like making sauerkraut, but with food scraps—and basically does the same thing. You just get a bucket with a sealed lid, put your food in there, let it sit and it will slowly ferment on its own. And it can take pretty much anything. Even things that normal compost can't. So it can handle small amounts of meat and protein, cooked food, things like that. We have a bucket of that just under our sink that all the food scraps go into. And it probably gets emptied maybe once every two weeks, so that we don't have to have any food going into the trash. And yeah, it's—it's funny, like I will occasionally go to people's houses now that are just using trash cans the way people do where everything goes in the trash can. And I walk into the kitchen. I'm like, why am I smelling, like, food waste? Like I smell rotten food. What's wrong? It's like oh, right, it's because you're putting in the trash can where it sits and rots. So if you can just keep those two things separate. It will make the situation a lot more pleasant. That's a great tip. And yeah, just, you know, as much as you can, wash your hands and do all the things you are supposed to do. Brush your teeth, floss, things like that nature. Just take care of yourself and try to keep yourself together for as long as you possibly can. The situation will improve if you can just avoid making it worse. Human body is amazingly tough. All you have to do is sit and wait and most situations disaster-wise will improve on their own because the pressure on first response yours and utilities will ease up and things will start to come back online, as long as you can make it through that first critical period. **Brooke ** 45:08 Okay, do you mind now if we shift to talking about structural triage and things that we do to our actual residences, dwellings, things to look out for and know in disasters, and sort of that aspect of it? **Colin ** 45:28 Yeah, definitely. Did you have anything in mind in particular, where you wanted to start, or? **Brooke ** 45:32 Well, we talked about, you know, turning things off, of course. And then closing up holes. There's lots of other things in the house that can get damaged, in, you know, different scenarios, earthquakes and tornadoes and floods. So I'm curious, like, if there are other structural indicators or things to look for, you know, that, you know, from sort of your construction perspective that, like, oh, that's a sign of this thing is unstable, that you might not know just as a normal person. **Colin ** 46:09 Yes, generally when you get into questions of structural stability, like is this house going to fall down? If you have any doubt, the best thing to do is vacate the structure. Because actually looking at structures from an engineering standpoint, and determining when something is safe and when it's not, is beyond the scope of most people, myself included. I know what structures are supposed to look like and I can tell you when something is damaged, but I can't necessarily tell you how close it is to falling down. But the big things to look for are just like, do you see cracks in the foundation that weren't there yesterday? **Brooke ** 46:54 Okay, **Colin ** 46:55 You're probably familiar with, with how your house looks. If you see something that looks unfamiliar. investigate further, as much as you possibly can. This is kind of the best advice that I can give. **Brooke ** 47:08 Okay, what about things like crack new cracks in the wall? Like, is that is the wall crack itself a sign? Or was that—would that be like, okay, now and go look at the foundation and see. **Colin ** 47:18 If you're talking about cracks in interior plaster walls, those are not necessarily an issue by themselves. Because buildings can have a fair amount of flex to them before they fall down. Like you look at the number of houses that have an alarming lean to them and have been standing for two hundred years. Like, structures are remarkably resilient until they're not. **Brooke ** 47:45 Okay. **Colin ** 47:45 But if you have any doubt, the best thing is, get yourself out of the structure. **Brooke ** 47:50 Okay. I guess I'm also thinking about it from, like, the opposite perspective of something you might see and worry about and think you need to leave, but then actually it's okay and you could stay. So that's, you know, like the wall cracks, that might not actually be a big issue if you've suddenly had a crack on the wall. **Colin ** 48:10 Yeah, so the best thing you can do is try to get yourself into part of the house where you have as little as possible above you and as little as possible below you. So if you have a three story house, you don't necessarily want to be on that second floor for any reason. Because that's kind of the worst of both worlds, because you could go through the floor or the roof could come down on you. The best thing you can do, again, is get yourself into a small space where the only thing above you is the roof and maybe some insulation, and the only thing below you is concrete slab. Still not a guarantee that you're safe. **Brooke ** 48:54 Sure, yeah. **Colin ** 48:55 But you're gonna be better off there than in a multistory structure. **Brooke ** 48:59 Right. Yeah. We talked about how, you know, things might come through the windows or the walls, but as long as you've got your three walls in your roof, you're okay. What if you have four walls and a hole in the roof? Like things come through the roof. **Colin ** 49:13 Yeah, if you have a damaged roof, the best thing to do is get up on the roof and patch it from the outside. But that's not always possible. Especially if you have a multistory house and you don't have an extension ladder that can get you up to the roof, which is true for a lot of people. So then you're stuck with, how do I deal with this hole in my roof from the inside? Sometimes, assuming you have access to the attic, you can get into the attic and if you have, you know, a gaping hole where say a meteor came through your roof and punched a big hole in it. [Laughing] You can feed things in from the outside and then pull them back down against the roof. So you can build your patch and feed it through and pieces. Reach up from the inside, lay it down on the outside. And it's not gonna be a perfect seal, but it will keep at least some of the water and weather from getting into the house. Usually when you have that big of a hole, if you can't patch it from the outside, things are going to end up leaking and you're gonna be faced with situation where you have to try to catch the water once it comes into the house and get it back outside the house where it belongs. Again, the key for this is a staple gun, and some plastic sheet. So just, if you can hang plastic underneath the area that is leaking, or tarp to catch the drips, and then divert that water to a collection point, whether that is a bucket if it's a very slow leak, or a improvised funnel if it's a faster leak. It's not hard to make a funnel, if you have a garden hose and a two liter bottle, the garden hose thread is close enough to the spread on two liter bottles, that you can literally just screw the bottle onto the garden hose. And if you cut at an angle, cut the bottle at an angle, you can make something that is big enough that you can make a channel in your tarp, they will direct that into your two liter bottle funnel into your garden hose which you can then, you know, run down out of your attic and out of window. **Brooke ** 51:35 That's really cool, I might need to do something like that—not for disaster reasons, but just for gardening stuff this summer. **Colin ** 51:44 The two liter bottle to the hose connection will probably leak a little bit. **Brooke ** 51:49 Shhhhhh, kill my dreams. **Colin ** 51:51 Duct tape will fix that. Or if you have any of that self-fusing silicone tape they sell for emergency plumbing repairs, that works too. But honestly, as long as the water that's flowing through the bottle and into the hose is not under any pressure, the leak is probably going to be slow enough that it's not gonna be an issue. **Brooke ** 52:14 So roof damage is not necessarily something to run away from. **Colin ** 52:19 Roof damage is not the end of the world. It's bad, especially if you can't get up on the roof to fix it. But there are things you can do to keep it from totally destroying the house, the first thing to do is just figure out how you're going to keep the water from getting in. And if you can't do that, figure out how you're gonna get the water that's inside the house, back outside the house. **Brooke ** 52:44 And is that one of the biggest risks in the in any kind of natural disasters is water damage? **Colin ** 52:49 Water Damage is the hardest and the most insidious, because once water gets into the house and things get wet, now you have issues of mold to deal with. Once you have mold that can render a structure uninhabitable in a matter of days. As long as things are dry, they can last a very, very long time. But once they get wet, you're in trouble. **Brooke ** 53:15 Okay, what about the opposite side? Fire damage. We talked about that a little bit. But you know, let's say you had a kitchen fire destroyed the kitchen. Is there anything you can do in the aftermath of a fire that's going to do anything to help you save structures or objects and make the recovery easier? **Colin ** 53:36 Assuming that the fire was put out with water, you've got the same issue. **Brooke ** 53:41 That's a really good point! [Laughing] No, I didn't think about that. That's a really good point. **Colin ** 53:45 Dried back out. If you put the fire out yourself, you probably use a dry chemical fire extinguisher. So you have a giant mess to clean up, but it's not soaking wet. If the Fire Company had to come and put it out with hoses, not only do you have the fire damage, everything you own in that immediate area is now soaking wet and covered with soot and just generally filthy. That was the situation that we had with the friend that I talked about earlier with having the apartment fire, that it was kind of a blessing that it happened in the middle of winter because we were able to just go over there and get everything out of the apartment and throw it in our backyard and it just stayed frozen for a week until we were ready to deal with it. **Brooke ** 54:32 Ah, right. Because your winters are snowy and icy, not rainy, like here. **Colin ** 54:35 Yeah, it is generally rainy her. But it just happened to be in the middle of cold snap. So it was in the 20s for the most part, dropping down to single digits for about that entire week. So we just had bags and bags of wet clothing, wet furniture, sitting in the backyard under plastic so they stayed frozen and didn't grow mold. Because once things are wet, you're in trouble. So if it's not frozen, the best thing you can do is get fans on it, keep that air moving, and try to get it dried back out as soon as you can. **Brooke ** 55:11 That makes sense. I guess I've never thought about this, but it makes sense. The fire department, if they come in and they take a host of things, they don't come back and dry it out for you. Right, you're left to handle that part on your own. **Colin ** 55:24 You'll have to handle that part. And usually, they have broken windows in the process, because that's how they get the hoses in and that's how they control the flow of the smoke and the fire through the structure, is making holes in walls. Generally, once you have a fire, you also have other structural damage to deal with. **Brooke ** 55:43 Yeah. Okay. We're kind of get down to our last few minutes. I know there's a lot more that we could talk about and go over with all of this. But I want to make some space here for any other sort of critical things that you really want to talk about, teach and share with this episode. **Colin ** 56:01 I think we've covered most of the critical things. Again, the biggest one is just keep yourself safe and don't make the situation worse. No matter how bad it seems, take a minute, breathe, look at it, and think. I know, again, other episodes of the podcast, they've talked about the, like the threat onion from the military, which is the same basic idea as the layers of safety that they talk about in industrial design. And all these things say step one is your design and your engineering controls that make it safe. So the good analogy for that is things like antilock brakes in the car. You don't have to do anything for those to work. They're just there. They don't require any thought. Seatbelts and airbags are also great. Seatbelts, you have to remember to use them, and they only help—they only help after the accident has already occurred. **Brooke ** 57:06 Right. **Colin ** 57:07 A seatbelt does not prevent an accident. So when you're in a bad situation, look at what you're about to do, think about the situation, figure out which of those engineering safety controls have gone out the window as a result of the disaster. So you had a fire in the kitchen, you've lost your stove, you're gonna have to rely on your little tiny Coleman backpacking stove. That's great, it'll work. But you no longer have that automatic ignition, you're going to have to use lighter to light the stove. You don't have the combustion controls to make sure that the flame has a pilot light, that the pilot light turns off when the gas goes out. So you can have the gas from one of their stoves leaking if you fail to turn the valve off all the way when you're done with it. All these things that are part of normal everyday life that you just don't think about, no longer work the way they're supposed to in a disaster. So just look at what you're doing, and see what you've lost, and figure out how you can get that safety back on your own. **Brooke ** 58:22 Okay, that is really great. And I am wishing we had more time because I just feel like there's so much more that we could say and get into. But I think this has been a really, really great, you know, just kind of primer and information that would help people get through, you know, the first two or three days after a disaster for sure. So, I really appreciate that you joined us today on the podcast and share this info with us. Is there anything else that you want to plug or promote or share? **Colin ** 58:56 No, I think that was pretty much it. **Brooke ** 58:58 Okay, well, thanks again for being here. **Colin ** 59:00 Thank you very much. **Brooke ** 59:05 To our listeners. Thanks so much for listening. If you enjoy our podcast, please give it a like, drop a comment, or review. Subscribe to us if you haven't already. These things make the algorithms that rule our world offer our show to more people. This podcast is produced by the anarchist publishing collective, Strangers in a Tangled Wilderness. You can connect with us on Twitter @tangledwild and also on Instagram. Or check out our website at tangledwilderness.org where you can find our extensive lists of projects and publications. This podcast and much of the work of Strangers is made possible by our Patreon supporters. If you want to become a supporter, check out our Patreon at patreon.com/strangersinatangledwilderness. They are cool benefits various support tiers on Patreon. For instance, if you support the collective at just $5 a month, then we will mail you a monthly zine. Those contain essays, stories, poems, art, all kinds of great stuff. We'd like to give a specific shout out to some of our most supportive Patreon supporters. Thanks to Aly, Paige, Jenipher, Eric, David, Staro, Patoli, Chris, theo, Kirk, Princess Miranda, Milica, Marm, Catgut, Janice & O'Dell, Dana, Carson, Buck, Lord Harken, Nicole, paparouna, Funder, Perceval, BenBen, Mic Aiah, anonymous, S.J., Trixter, Hunter, Chelsea, Julia, Boise Mutual Aid, and as always, Hoss the dog. Find out more at https://live-like-the-world-is-dying.pinecast.co

Żyjemy w epoce plastiku i płacimy za to coraz wyższą cenę. Posłuchajcie czym uwiódł nas ten syntetyczny wynalazek, jaka jest skala produkcji i recyklingu plastiku oraz konsekwencje dla ludzi, środowiska i klimatu. Razem z Pauliną Pepperą i Michałem Kruszyńskim, których aktywizm popchnął do założenia startupu ZNIKA, omawiamy różne typy opakowań, obnażamy greenwashing i obalamy kilka mitów. Przyglądamy się też ekologicznym rozwiązaniom, które naprawdę robią różnicę. Posłuchajcie! Odcinek powstał w partnerstwie ze startupem ZNIKA, który zajmuje się ekologicznymi opakowaniami i etykietami dla sklepów online, w ramach kampanii prośrodowiskowej #wysylkabezplastiku, w której mogą wziąć udział wszystkie chętne marki modowe. Sprawdźcie, jak rozwiązania ZNIKA wdrożyła marka Bokashi https://www.instagram.com/bokashi_store/) i klub Warta Poznań https://www.instagram.com/warta.poznan/#wysylkabezplastiku #odpowiedzialnamoda #katarzynazajaczkowska #znika

Today we go back to one of Keith's favourite topics! Where everything in a good garden starts - the soil.Finally an easy guide to why we should we be composting, getting started and maintaining a perfect, odour-free compost. We learn about the Carbon:Nitrogen ratio (ideally 1 part carbon to 3 parts nitrogen)the role of microbes in breaking down compost. What can and can't go into the compost bin - No animal products (besides manure & egg shells)! Dog hair and even vacuum lint are ok to go in - who knew!Whether you have room for an open-air compost, a compost bin in the corner of your garden or an apartment with a small worm farm or Bokashi bin, we can all play a part in reducing green waste going into landfill. Applying mulch and organic fertilisers to our garden allows composting to naturally occur in our garden.Where you can find all things Muddy Boots!Website: https://www.muddyboots.net.au/Instagram: www.instagram.com/muddybootspodcast/ Facebook: Muddy Boots Podcast | Facebook

Unlock the secrets to turning your kitchen scraps into garden gold as we welcome Kate Flood, Australia's composting maestro, to the show. Get ready to be equipped with the know-how for crafting the perfect compost blend, as Kate lifts the lid on the essential ingredients and processes that lead to lush, thriving gardens. Whether you're wrestling with a tiny balcony space or looking after a large garden, we've got composting tips and tricks tailored just for you.This episode is a one-stop-shop for gardeners of all stripes seeking to boost their soil health and plant vitality. Listen to Kate as she breaks down hot composting and why your patience during the curing phase rewards you with truly rich compost. We also take a peek at the fascinating world of fungi and how a handful of wood chips can supercharge your compost pile's ecosystem. Plus, for apartment dwellers, there's a deep dive into the wonders of Bokashi bins – your solution to indoor composting without the mess.But we don't stop there; our conversation ventures into the transformative power of fermented waste in your garden. We also delve into  biochar, the dark diamond of soil amendments and what it can do for your garden as well as the planet. By the time you're done with this episode, you'll be itching to grab your shovel and start fermenting, composting, and reaping the rewards of a vibrant, healthy garden alongside Kate's expert guidance.You can buy Kate's book here https://www.amazon.co.uk/Compost-Coach-compost-regenerative-wherever/dp/1922616451/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1E250JSG189YW&keywords=the+compost+coach+by+kate+flood&qid=1705674578&sprefix=the+compos%2Caps%2C74&sr=8-1If there is any topic you would like covered in future episodes, please let me know. Email:  info@mastermygarden.com   Check out Master My Garden on the following channels   Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mastermygarden/  Instagram @Mastermygarden https://www.instagram.com/mastermygarden/  Twitter:https://twitter.com/tweetsbyMMG   Until next week  Happy gardening  John Support the show

This week we have an educational and inspirational conversation with Brandon Rust @rust.brandon / @bokashiearthworks . We discuss nutrient efficiency, the importance of chelated carbon and minerals, and the interconnections between every aspect of our reality! We end this one with the Wizard's Rules; you will want to stick around for those! ALSO! THE NUTRIGROW POTS ARE NOW AVAILABLE! THIS PRODUCT WILL HELP TO REDUCE WASTE AND ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT FROM ANY SIZE GARDEN! MY DAD AND I WOULD HAVE USED THESE IF THEY WERE AVAILABLE BACK THEN! https://www.bokashiearthworks.net/nutrigrow-pot/AND GO CHECK OUT THEIR FULL LINE OF PRODUCTS! https://www.bokashiearthworks.net/Thank you for listening and please make sure you check out all of our social medias and subscribe to our YouTube and Patreon!https://www.instagram.com/terpenetherapypodcast/https://www.patreon.com/terpenetherapypodcasthttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIuE6pg63WB2dwZ--1SgTig/featuredDISCLAIMER: All cannabis on this podcast was purchased legally and all individuals pictured consuming cannabis are over the age of 21. Terpene Therapy does not condone any use of illicit cannabis, especially by any persons under the age of 21.Support the show

20+yr Cannabis Microbiologist, Global Food Control by Russia, Organic Vs. Non-OrganicThis episode you might want to hold off smoking for! We dive deep into the Soil Web and science behind soil, hydroponics, and coco with benefits to each and downfalls. Today we welcome a 20+ year microbiologist and Agronomist to First Smoke, Brandon Rust. This episode is for all plant lovers and cultivators no matter the fruit your chasing, species you like growing or kind of plant you find interesting. Lighting up we get into why we only have 60 years worth of nutrients to mine from Russia and then we are going to face real issues with our global food pricing and supply chain. Brandon speaks about the microbiology and chemistry behind cannabis plants and understanding how the plant actually grows and the sciences behind it. Why grow Organic Vs. Non-organic? We get deep into the ramifications we face as a planet as well as health benefits and waste benefits. It was inspiring to hear about Brandon's very rough childhood and seeing how he blossomed, became one of the leading plant agronomists and microbiologists in the entire cannabis space today. Listen in and take notes as we welcome Brandon Rust of Bokashi earthworks to first smoke of the day podcast.Connect with Brandon Rust!https://www.instagram.com/rust.brandonhttps://www.bokashiearthworks.net/FSOTD SponsorsDr. Dabber | IGGrow Generation | IGDrip Hydro | IGFSOTD LinksWebsite | YouTubeMake sure to tell all your friends and family to subscribe! Go register on the website for all the exclusive ad-free content, BTS, tutorials, and more! Please leave a 5-Star review! We appreciate your support, First Smoke Family! Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Growing With Fishes Podcast. A podcast dedicated to growing aquaponics & cannabis and spreading information to the masses about sustainable plant production! Brandon Rust @rust.brandon https://www.bokashiearthworks.net/ Growing With Fishes Podcast Discord https://discord.gg/nqBf3bj Aquaponic Cannabis Master Class www.APMJClass.com or www.AP420.com Pest Control Class ThePestClass.com Marty's Channel APMeds https://www.youtube.com/user/mwaddell6901 IG: APMeds Steve Channel Potent Ponics https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCRkqYlFzKpbCXreVKPYFlGg Facebook group Aquaponic Cannabis Growers https://www.facebook.com/groups/1510902559180077/ Potentponics.com Aquaponic Cannabis Nutrients https://www.APMJNutes.com True Aquaponic Nutrients https://trueaquaponics.com/?ref=zQK0Q Bokashi Earthworks https://www.bokashiearthworks.net/ Coupon Code Potent

The Sun And The Moon With Brandon Rust @bokashi earthworks   Today's Guest: Brandon Rust @bokashi earthworks https://www.bokashiearthworks.com/ https://www.instagram.com/bokashiearthworks/ https://www.instagram.com/rustbrandon/ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0Kq1qkd2nRlMBXxdJ7gN5g   Your Hosts Luna Whitcomb https://www.instagram.com/lunallday/   Alexandria Irons Queen of the Sun Grown Queen of the Sun Grown | creating Classes, Recipes, Videos, Articles, and Podcast! | Patreon https://youtube.com/@queenofthesungrown8609 Queen of the Sun Grown (@queenofthesungrown) | Instagram https://www.bokashiearthworks.com/?wpam_id=37 Links: Articles, and Podcast! | Patreon https://youtube.com/@queenofthesungrown8609 LIVE Holistic Horticulture Class Series: Code SoilMatters10 for 10% off. SUNGROWN10 active for all blumat watering systems at Blumat Info   Executive Producer: Ken Somerville “It's All About The Biology” https://www.instagram.com/kensomerville/ https://www.itsallaboutthebiology.ca Contact email itsallaboutthebiologytour@gmail.com Reach out to Ken for a quick 15 min call: https://calendly.com/kensomerville/connections   Discount Codes: https://quadag.com/kensomerville Use KENSOMERVILLE at check out. 15% off selected products: F1 FUEL, F2 FOLIAR OIM, FULONIC OIM, HUMONIC OIM Limited to one use per customer   https://ionicaid.com/kensomerville 15% off entire order Applies to subscription and one-time orders Applies to first subscription order only Limited to one use per customer   https://empirerolling.com/kensomerville Get 10% off all purchases by using KENSOMERVILLE at check out.   https://threeeyedtiger.samcart.com/products/the-regenerative-soil-reset Get 20% off purchase by using Ken regen at check out.    #flowers,#plants,#nature,#gardening,#garden,#growing,#koreannaturalfarming,#naturalfarming,#jadam,#naturalfertilizer,#naturalfarminginputs,#permaculture,#regenerative,#foodforest,#biodynamic,#bioactive,#organic,#notill,#knf,#organicgardening,#urbangardening,#containergardening,#homegardening,#cannabis,#cannabisgrowing, Disclaimer It's All About The Biology Channel podcasts and coverage of live events are for general educational/informational and/or entertainment purposes only; the use of any information on these podcasts or materials linked from these podcasts is at the user's own risk, this channel does not necessarily agree with any of the content or opinions shared by our hosts or guests, and as these podcasts are streamed live, we cannot be held responsible for what our hosts or guests say or recommend, neither should our hosts be held responsible for what any of the guests say or do, it is the listener's/viewers' responsibility to decipher whether the content is useful in their own circumstance(s). This channel does not constitute the practice of medicine, nursing, or other professional health care services, including the giving of medical advice, and no doctor/patient relationship is formed between the channel's hosts/guests and our listeners/viewers, the content of this channel is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment, users should not disregard or delay in obtaining medical advice for any medical condition they may have and should seek the assistance of their healthcare professionals for any such conditions.

- Bokashi: fermenting system, takes meat and high concentrations of citrus, cheap to make and transport easily.  - Cold Compost: microorganisms break things down (worms, bugs etc too).  - Hot Compost: more deliberate balance of materials that isn't added to over time (made and then left for 3-6 months), takes garden clippings, branches, hard things, gets up to 65/70 degrees.  - Worm Farm: worms do the work, can't put in strongly acidic foods, meat, dairy etc.  LISTEN ABOVESee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Compostable Kate is social media icon with her passionate and unique ability to spread the word on how to produce the most wonderful compost and biochar at home. https://www.hoselink.com.au/?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=all+the+dirt&utm_campaign=5+percent+off  

Martyn Richards from Agriton UK talks to Oliver Rogers about using a process called bokashi composting to make use of your kitchen food waste. To buy bokashi products from Agriton UK visit their website: https://bit.ly/3qx6pIY For international customers visit worldwide distributor, EMRO Japan, scroll down to 'choose county' and find a retailer for your territory: https://bit.ly/3Cl6QIW

Join our conversation with The Compost Fairry, Crystal, as we learn how to make fast, easy compost. Go follow her on Instagram, Tik Tok, and You Tube for some real entertaining education!

April 13, 2023--Host Jenn Procacci speaks with Cuauhtemoc Villa and Rae Heart of Ground Culture, and Katie Newman of Golden Fig Gardens, about the Bokashi Ball Workshop happening on 4/20.

 Amanda Kovattana is a 6-year veteran of tiny house living who lives completely off-grid in the drought-ridden landscape of Northern California. In this conversation, we get a sense of all of the ingenious systems that Amanda has developed to live tiny comfortably while also working within the bounds of the resources she has - including an interesting way of collecting rainwater. During the course of the conversation, I also learned about the alternative to a composting toilet that Amanda uses called Bokashi, which is a fermentation method she's very knowledgeable about. Full show notes and images at thetinyhouse.net/257In This Episode: Simple and effective water catchment systemComposting toilets and BokashiFun furniture and storageWater conservation in dry areasInnovating and iterating systems that workThis Week's Sponsor: PODX Go Are you looking for a compact and affordable way to streamline your lifestyle? PODX Go's meticulously designed tiny home expands from a trailer to a 364-square-foot home with just the push of a button. Certified by NOAH and build to ANSI119.5 standards, the Grande S1 is towable with an F250 or equivalent. The PODX GO home is 99% factory built with healthy and eco-friendly materials, so you can rest easy knowing your home is taking care of you and the environment. It features a fully fitted kitchen, bedroom, bath, and living room with ingenious storage spaces throughout. PODX Go has even partnered with Renogy solar systems, so you can live off-grid or reduce your energy bills. POD X Go has launched its crowdfunding campaign with special pricing starting from just $49,000 dollars. Visit PodXGo.com to watch a video of the S1 unfold, and to get the crowdfunding launch discount. Thank you so much to Pod X Go for sponsoring our show. The 2023 Tiny House Bundle: https://www.thetinyhouse.net/bundleGet $1600+ of tiny house plans, ebooks, courses and software through Saturday at noon. Don't miss it! Support the showListen. Subscribe. Rate. Review. Apple Podcasts Spotify Stitcher Google Podcasts More... Follow Ethan. Mastodon (my favorite!) Instagram Pinterest Facebook Want to say 'thank you' for the show? Buy me a coffee!

ajayasir.com Patreon.com/ajayasir. In this episode I talk about how to make Lactic Acid Bacteria in hopes that I can use it to prevent our chicken and duck coops from being stinky. Here is the link to the Bokashi episode I mention -https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/abundant-living-and-gardening/id1543253943?i=1000504619146

In this episode we speak with Gail and Cab Baber who are long-time ag producers in Hawaii and early adopters of growing Hawaiian hemp. We talk about the many issues they have faced related to growing hemp and its many uses and promise as a crop, but also talk about a number of important issues and possible solutions related to Hawaii Ag production in general too.Brought to you by University of Hawaii College of Tropical Ag. and Human Resources, and the Seeds of Well-being (SOW) Project. This podcast is supported by the Farm and Ranch Stress Assistance Network (FRSAN) grant from the U.S. Department of Agriculture, National Institute of Food and Agriculture and Hawaii Department of Agriculture.Associated Links:Hawaii Royal HempIsland Herbs HawaiiClarence Baber Sustainable Agricultural and Environmental ManagementHawaii Hemp Farmers AssociationHemp Farmers Are Fed Up With Government Regulations Hampering The Industry's Potential2023 State of Hawaii Legislative Bills:SB516 Hemp Producers; Commercial Hemp Production; LabelingSB655 Hemp Producers; Commercial Hemp Production; CultivationSB637 Commercial Hemp Processing; Structures and BuildingsHB1359 Hemp Producers; Cannabis; Licensing; Labeling ($)Find out more about us: Seeds Of Wellbeing website Seeds of Wellbeing Resource Hub All the SOW links

It's seed starting time!  I'd venture to say this is what we growers are live for!  Watching seedlings grow in the depths of winter is the best mood lifter.  Those of you in the Southern Hemisphere are likely gearing up for your late summer sowings for cool annuals too.  So it seemed like a great time to do a deeper dive into seed sowing with my old friend and seed starting pro, Lisa Mason Zeigler from the Gardener's Workshop.  Lisa literally wrote the book, called Cool Flowers, on starting seeds for early spring crops. She's been flower farming for 25 years and runs a seed supply house.  She's also the host of the Field & Garden podcast, which you should check out if you haven't already.  In this episode,  Lisa and I talk all about seeds.  Everything from seed storage tips to creating a living soil with natural inputs to even a bit about sowing by the biodynamic calendar.   If you'd like to get my written out Regenerative Seed Starting Mix Recipe, join the Regenerative Flower Farmers Network (RFFN) to download that today.    Lots of links to share with this episode: The New Organic Grower by Eliot Coleman Seed Germination Theory and Practice by Dr. Norman Deno (free download) Biodynamic Calendar (make sure to set your specific location for accurate days) A study about the importance of the first few days of a seedling's life and how they develop Maxicrop (kelp product) WCA (calcium input) LAB (video on how to make it) A study on worm castings enhancing germination A study on worm castings improving disease resistance TED talk on how bacteria “talk” with autoinducers   Past episodes mentioned in this conversation for further listening include: Episode 21: BRIX with Dr. Tom Dykstra Episode 15: Korean Natural Farming and JADAM in Flower Farming with Tony Gaetz of Bare Mountain Farm Episode 16: Biodynamics with Erika and Ken from Teton Full Circle Farm Episode 23: Bokashi and Worm Farming with Matt Arthur   HAVE IDEAS AND FEEDBACK ABOUT THE PODCAST?  Share your opinions in this brief survey.   As always, if you appreciate this podcast and all the education it provides, please take a moment out of your day to rate and write a review for it on Apple Podcasts or wherever you are listening to it. 

Jay blaze sits down with Brandon Rust from Bokashi Earthworks to talk about Bokashi and its benefits for growing cannabis

This week's guest is Martyn Richards who is the Home & Garden Manager for Agriton UK, part of a large European group of companies who manufacture products to help commercial and domestic users deal with the ‘soil, crop, animal waste cycle'. Martyn contacted me to see if I would be interested in speaking to him about their bokashi composting system and I thought, yes, I would, because I didn't really understand the process. So my first question to Martyn was, just what is bokashi? Listen now and all will be revealed… What We Talk About What is bokashi compost?  How bokashi systems are different to traditional composting methods What can you compost? Is there anything you can't? Do you need to add anything for the process to work? What are Bokashi organisms? Where do they originate from? Is it expensive to set up? Does it work at any scale? Does what you put in affect what comes out in terms of nutrient value? What is Bokashi bran? Links Agriton's Bokashi Brochure  www.agriton.co.uk Other episodes if you liked this one: The Composting Process Feeding Your Soil with Humanure Patreon Membership

In this episode, we're joined by Brandon Rust, founder of Bokashi Earthworks and known for his extensive expertise in cannabis growing. Brandon's work walks the tight rope between understanding conventional agricultural practices and how to maximize yield and data tracking while also embracing many natural farming methods. Why is this balance important, and what does it look like?   Check out Brandon's incredible work on Instagram @Rust.Brandon and if you're looking to buy products from Bokashi Earthworks, visit: https://www.bokashiearthworks.com/?wpam_id=21 As of this episode drop, there is a 25% sale using the code BLACKFRIDAY   To support this podcast, join our patreon for early episode access at www.patreon.com/poorprolesalmanac

In this episode, we explore the traditional practice of bokashi. Fermenting waste instead of composting offers a number of benefits and comes with its own set of rules on what this practice needs. Bokashi is particularly beneficial for indoor growers, folks in urban spaces, and people who enjoy a good ferment. How does bokashi change the material profile, and what are the benefits, and ultimately, how does a bokashi end-product compare to compost? We explore these questions and what Hillary Clinton has to do with it in this episode.   Sources: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/360069726_Growth_and_Yield_Performance_of_Radish_as_Affected_by_Different_Amount_of_EM-bokashi_in_Lahar_Soil    "Bokashi Composting scraps to soil in weeks," Adam Footer   https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/217032797.pdf  https://www.researchgate.net/publication/242539803_Carbon_nutrient_and_mass_loss_during_composting 

I think the whole world should be doing this! - AlisonIt just makes everything more pleasant with your food waste - there is no rotting, no flies. - TjasaYou know that Alison is always fermenting weird and strange things but when she told me she was fermenting her trash - it was a new level. I had to know more.A little over a year ago, Alison off-hand mentioned something she called bokashi, and I had to ask her, "What IS that?" It turns out bokashi is the Japanese word for compost, and Alison had purchased a tool that she used to ferment her food waste - even bones & fat, anything she didn't use or that went bad - into compost tea and compost, which she was using in her porch garden. As you have seen on her instagram, she produced some incredible vegetables with the help of that nutrient dense lacto fermented suplementation for her plants. I know that any purchase Alison makes is extremely well thought-out and researched and, yes, she did her research on the bokashi process. She read books, watched videos, explored DIY options, and she did her due diligence to study this two-bucket system that we are going to talk today, as well as the inoculant that she adds to the food waste to compost it.This fermentation process can be done in the house, it has no smell, it doesn't attract fruit flies, and you can use the compost and the compost tea in your big garden, small garden and more. In this episode, Alison and I will explain the process of fermenting waste, the bacterial inoculant that is used to ferment the food waste so efficiently and completely, and then we will actually interview the US and Canada supplier that makes the two-bucket system that Alison is using. Alison will ask her some more technical questions and we will come back to wrap up, and you can get about your day fermenting your trash!Check out the Bokashi system here, and use the code AKP for 10% off!Want more? Come be part of our community and help support the continued work of the podcast! Our podcast is sponsored by our patrons and listeners who are also supported by the extra content that we share (think exclusive podcasts, live chats, cook ups and recipes) over at our Patreon community!From $5 a month (or equivalent in your currency) you'll be helping us with the costs of recording, editing and putting this work out into the world. And you'll get to be part of our community on a deeper level. What We Talk About:2:29 What we had to eat!08:24 A review from Ester @wolfdaughterdarling12:24 Let's talk about bokashi! Alison's experience and why she was inspired to talk about this on the podcast35:00 The US Giveaway (open until Nov 29 2022)"A non-stop ferment of your kitchen waste."37:32 Alison's interview with Tjasa38:33 What is Bokashi?39:09 What is "EM", and how does it work in bokashi?40:25 How are the microorganisms used in the bokashi bucket?41:15 Is there a smell to bokashi fermenting in our kitchens? Fermentation vs Rotting42:34 Using bokashi in a small apartment vs on a farm or larger household45:23 What do the Effective Microorganisms do to compost?48:08 The rules of bokashi composting and how it differs from conventional waste composting54:40 How do you see bokashi making a difference in a larger scale?01:01:14 Teraganix discount code & the giveaway

In this episode, host Jennie Love is joined by farmer Matt Arthur of BLH Farm to dive into bokashi and worm farming at a scale that can actually provide a large volume of high-quality compost and castings for a small farm.  If you've struggled with making compost on your farm or finding well-aged, herbicide-free compost locally, bokashi could be the solution you've been searching for!   An anerobic fermentation process, bokashi does not require a carbon source and takes a fraction of the time to produce finished compost that the more widely-known and used areobic compost pile does.  Listen as Matt explains why and how.  Originally farming flowers, Matt has diversified his business in recent years to include a paid food waste collection service for his local community to support his larger-scale bokashi operation. And that bokashi operation produces high-quality feedstock for his worm operation!  He sells castings and worms locally and nationwide.  Matt's inspirational system is very do-able for just about any farm and requires no large equipment.  Find Matt on Instagram @blh_farm and at his website: https://blhfarm.com/ In this show, Matt mentions 96 gallon "rollers".  Here's a link to a video showing how to convert one for bokashi as well as where to buy the components.  Matt also mentioned EM-1.  Here's a link to where to purchase it: https://tinyurl.com/musry4hh Coming up on October 28th, 2022, there will be an in-person No-Till Flowers Field Day at Jennie's regenerative flower farm in Philadelphia.  Click here to register.  If you enjoy the content you hear on this podcast, consider joining the Regenerative Flower Farmers Network (RFFN), a community of like-mind growers who put the ecosystem at the forefront of their farms.  It's just the price of a fancy latte to join for the whole year! Members get special access to podcast guests and other exclusive content.  Matt will be answering questions about bokashi and worms live on RFFN in November.  PLEASE RATE AND REVIEW THIS PODCAST WHEREVER YOU ARE LISTENING: this helps us grow our aduience!   Follow @notillflowers on Instagram for lots of content about regenerative flower farming.    

Episode Notes Episode summary Margaret talks with Paige, who works in composting and humanure systems, about how to set up systems for disposing of food and human waste, different kind of systems that can be used including worm composting, and the importance of thinking about the scale and purpose of your system. Guest Info Paige can be found on Twitter @bad.compost Host Info Margaret Killjoy can be found on twitter @magpiekilljoy or instagram at @margaretkilljoy. Publisher Info This show is published by Strangers in A Tangled Wilderness. We can be found at www.tangledwilderness.org, or on Twitter @TangledWild and Instagram @Tangled_Wilderness. You can support the show on Patreon at www.patreon.com/strangersinatangledwilderness. Penumbra City Spot If you would like to play test our Penumbra City TTRPG with your friends, contact us at Penumbra.City.Playtest@gmail.com Transcript Paige on Composting Margaret 00:15 Hello, and welcome to Live Like The World Is Dying, your podcast for what feels like the end times. I'm your host, Margaret Killjoy. Well, I'm one of the hosts, but I'm your host today. But, now there's new hosts for the show, which is very exciting to me. As much as I love listening to the sound of my own voice all the time, sometimes I like listening to other people talk. And, today we are going to be talking to Paige about composting, we're going to be talking about what to do with stuff that rots and why it's so important. And I don't know, lots of stuff around shit and things like that. I'm really excited about this kind of selfishly, because I have a lot of questions that are for my own personal use as someone who composts, and you know, has lived off grid a lot and stuff like that. So I think, I hope that you will get a lot out of it, and this podcast is a proud member of the Channel Zero network of anarchists podcasts. And here's a jingle from another show on the network. JINGLE Margaret 01:49 Okay, if you could introduce yourself with your name, your pronouns, and then I guess kind of why people should listen to you about compost. Paige 01:58 Thank you so much for having me. My name is Paige. I use she/her pronouns. I guess I started composting at a pretty young age. We had a pile at my parents house growing up and then more recently, actually worked for Tucson's city composting program when it was run through their university, so was on like an industrial scale operation for a couple of months. I currently work at the food bank in their farm and garden program. And I have helped them redesign their worm composting system as well as their just general composting system as well as installed composting toilets on site. I've also worked with friends of a land project and help them set up a composting system for humanure as well as just like food waste. Margaret 02:51 Cool. For anyone who's listening, if you can hear a squeaking in the background is because I gave my dog a toy that I thought didn't have a squeaker in it. And I was proven mistaken. So, I apologize for that. But okay, so composting, what is composting, that's where things where you just like throw an apple into the woods, and hope for the best. Paige 03:12 So composting isn't just kind of throwing stuff and hoping for the best. It's usually just taking, like organic material. And there's different types of composting, there's different systems, but it's kind of creating in a controlled environment to process what would be waste products into something that you can use more as a soil amendment, maybe for your garden, and maybe for fruit trees. But it's just yeah, processing waste into something really valuable and useful. Margaret 03:40 I get really excited about it. I have this kind of like scavenger mindset leftover from when I was more of like a squatter and traveler. But, I feel like food waste is like the main way I can still really feel that, like scratch that itch, you know? I mean, I guess I do it sometimes with other stuff where I try and scavenge. But like, I get really excited by the idea that you can like not have food waste be waste. And so I don't know, I'm very excited about this. Okay, so what are some of the basics of you know, okay, so, I mean, I guess the 'why' someone would compost is probably sort of implied, like not letting things go to waste. And then also like, not needing to, you know, go and purchase fertilizer and things like that for your garden. But, what are some of the basic 'Hows' like, I guess starting at a smaller scale, you know, if someone wants to set up compost at their apartment or at their house or wherever they are. Paige 04:35 Yeah, so I think it's really going to depend on like what you have available to you. So, like a backyard system. You could do an outdoor, like hot or thermophilic pile, which I've seen systems built out of pallets where you just kind of set up like a three or four sided bin, and then you just throw your food scraps in there along with some sort of cover material which will generally be like a dry carbon based thing, maybe leaves, maybe sawdust. In my house, I use manure I like go pick it up every couple of months if you're an apartment and don't.... Margaret 05:09 Manure is the cover? Paige 05:10 Yeah, I use like, well, so the manure that I find it's like it's manure mixed with straw. So it's like pretty dry. Margaret 05:18 Oh, okay. Paige 05:18 And bulky. And I think the thing that I see people doing wrong is just not having enough material to do like a hot compost pile. So, they're just kind of throwing stuff in a pile, and I live in the desert, so it just kind of dries out. I think it's probably different and more humid wet places. But yeah, to get like, kind of your traditional hot compost pile, I feel like would be kind of more on the scale of like, a pallet bin at the smallest, like three feet by three feet. Ish. Margaret 05:48 Okay. Paige 05:49 But, there's also you know, there's other options for like apartments and indoor use, such as like a worm bin, or there's, there's also a style of composting called Bokashi. That's actually more of like a fermentation that people do in buckets that you can also use to process your waste. I'm not as familiar with that. But, you know, not everybody has outdoor space to have a big pile that might be kind of gnarly sometimes. Margaret 06:14 Yeah. So, you keep talking about hot composting. Is that like, in contrast to cold composting. Is there cold composting that we could be doing? Or? No? Paige 06:22 There is. Yeah, I mean, if you if you're just adding material really slowly over time, or you don't have a lot of material, you'll probably have like kind of a colder compost and stuff won't break down as quickly. Generally, like a big hot compost pile is also going to result in like an end product like your compost will be more like bacterially dominant versus like, a long to cold compost where you're like not trying to get the temperature up, is going to be more conducive to like a fungally based compost. So, there are like there are kind of different end, end goals based on maybe what they use is going to be. A veggie garden that's going to prefer like a bacterial heavy...a bacteria heavy compost, and like trees are going to prefer like a fungally based, but if you kind of mix and match, like, it kind of doesn't matter. There's like, yeah, I feel like you can go really deep into all the science behind it, or you can just kind of like not and still make good compost and like, deal with your food waste accordingly. But, there are like different methods you can do, depending on on what your end goal is if you wanna goo deep into it. Margaret 07:35 Yeah, I guess that's something that's always sort of intimidated me about it is that, you know, before I started composting, I had always been sort of, I'd read all this stuff about it. And it was very, like, "This is the perfect ratio of nitrogen versus carbon material to add," or I guess, greens versus browns, I think is the way it's like often phrased or something. "And if you get it wrong, like all hell will break loose and demons will come forth from the seventh seal," and all of that and, and so it like kind of like, I think it scares a lot of people off, but you're sort of implying and my understanding is that you can kind of just do it and then like fuck with it to fix it as you go? Is that is that fairly accurate? Paige 08:13 Yeah, I would definitely say that's accurate. Yeah, I think like...yeah, definitely people kind of stick to like the greens and browns, but I don't know, I think it's kind of tricky. Sometimes if you have material that's like, drying out or really not drying out, depending on your climate. So, like here out in Tucson, where I live, it's like you have to water your compost. Otherwise, it just, it's just a pile of like dried old vegetables or whatever you're throwing into it so. And yeah. So I mean, it's like the greens and browns, which are your carbon to nitrogen, but then it's also you're looking at like moisture and porosity. So, if you think of like a pile of sticks, like that's like too porous, there's too much airflow that's not going to break down. But if you have like a mucky swamp that's also not going to have airflow. it's gonna it's gonna be really anaerobic and smelly. So yeah, I mean, I think like you kind of just have to see what works for your climate, and I think trial and errors the best way to go and err on the side of maybe a little more of like the browns, the carbon, stuff and add water if need be. And if it's not breaking down, then you'd want to add more of like the green nitrogen rich stuff, but I don't know. Yeah, I feel like in the current moments, I've tried to like come up with the perfect recipe and it's just not...it's just not necessary for like a backyard system. Margaret 09:41 Yeah. So it's more cooking than baking? Paige 09:44 Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like throwing in the spices.... Margaret 09:48 It gets presented as baking. Paige 09:49 Yeah, Nah. It's I mean, yeah, If you're doing it on like an industrial scale where there's like regulations and all of these different things that could really go wrong and you're dealing with like, tons and tons of material I think it's a bit more of an issue, but for like your average backyard person, I think like, just try to start and see what happens and adjust from there. Margaret 10:10 Yeah. What about those like roller...I feel like when you look for like compost, backyard composting like products, you have these...And I actually have one in my side yard, but it has yet to produce useful compost, but I think that's not not the fault of the product. But like, yeah, what do you what do you make of these, you know, it's like, I have this thing that looks a little bit like a five gallon of sorry, a 50 gallon drum but on a spindle where it can spin and there's like a...mine has like two compartments. And, I don't know, I've got it a Tractor Supply. Paige 10:46 Yeah, I've never had luck with those. But, I think it's just being in the desert. I think here inthe desert they just dry out. So, I've I've never tried those. I kind of tend to think that a lot of I mean, there's there's so many like compost products out there that are like try to make it easier. And I...to me, they all feel a little gimmicky. It's like, okay, you need like, you need to put stuff somewhere. It needs water, air, carbon, nitrogen. And that's it. And so having all of these like, additional, like tools, I yeah, I haven't had luck with them. I think the idea is that it gives you more airflow and allows you to like turn and mix the material, which probably helps it break down faster. But, it's also they're so small, like 50 gallons...I just, I usually try to start a pile that's bigger than that if I'm trying to get it hot. Margaret 11:35 Okay. Paige 11:35 And then. Yeah, I mean, I try to like I just put stuff in a pile, have enough material, and then I kind of like turn it sometimes. But, I try to kind of more just like let it sit and let like all the microbes and like fungus like do their job because it's just less work for me to deal with. But, I think they probably worked for some people. I don't know. Margaret 11:57 So we shouldn't do the Live Like The World Is Dying branded backyard compost tumblers? We should find a different gimmick product to sell? Paige 12:04 Probably. But you know, also if you're trying to do a brand deal, I think I'm open to discussing it. Margaret 12:10 I know I was gonna say like what did you get a cut? Does it suddenly...is it a better product at that point? Paige 12:14 Yeah, well at that point. Margaret 12:15 Okay. Yeah. Okay, I mean, I, the times I've seen them I think that the the primary appeal is almost like the...well it's like the like, my dogs not gonna get into it because it's in this thing, you know? It's like it's like pre contained, right. But, but yeah, I also have had it for nine months and it is still just sort of full of old leaves rather than full of like good useful dirt, so I can't really like speak to its efficacy. Paige 12:47 Yeah. Margaret 12:49 And I'm, I'm trying to build a system now that is like three bins that are four foot by four foot each each bin with the idea that one bin per year, and then by the time I fill up the third bin the first bend has been sitting for two years is my like, maybe overkill. I have all these like plans to make it rat proof and stuff too. I guess Okay, so I want to talk about some of the like downsides of composting or these sorts of compost like the things that I've heard about and worry about, 1) is you know, my dog has gotten into compost before and gotten really sick, right? So, keeping specifically Rintrah, my dog, out of compost is the first most important thing, and then also rats, and then smell, and then okay, what's the other one? Murdering yourself by putting it on plants, and having the plants that you grow murder you instead of feed you. Those are the four things that I've heard as potential downsides. Paige 13:47 Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think all of those can be concerns. I definitely have like my friends dogs come over, and they hop in the compost. We kind of joke that like our house is the fun house for all the dogs, because they get to come and like play in like rotting stuff. But, you know sometimes that's maybe not ideal for them just because of, yeah, I put chicken bones and stuff in there, which you definitely don't want dogs getting into. But yeah, I think for to kind of control for for small animals and pets. I think doing pallet bins and then lining that with hardware cloth, kind of like what you were saying or honestly even lining it with cardboard would probably be effective at keeping them out. And not the rats, but at least like dogs. If there's like wood and then a couple other layers of stuff. As far as the smell, that's often an indicator of too much nitrogen and too much humidity and liquid. So, to kind of mitigate that you'd want to add more like dry carbon based stuff. And yeah, it's interesting because it sounds like your pile on the ground might be kind of smelly, but then you're like tumbler pile might just be dry leaves, so maybe if you just like threw the dry leaves in with the pile thatmight kind of address that. Working with what we got. Margaret 15:03 Oh, the tumbler pile. The tumbler pile is gross as Hell. That's why it's full of dry leaves now. Paige 15:07 Oh, Okay. Margaret 15:09 It used to be. There is no ground pile yet. The ground pile is a dream. It's a 2x4 frame that is currently sitting in the space that used to be a garden from the last person who lived here. Paige 15:21 Oh okay. Margaret 15:22 Tut I haven't...I haven't done the lining it with hardware cloth and all that stuff yet. Paige 15:26 Cool. Yeah, yeah. But, I...you know, composting in the desert we're trying to keep out pets and javalinas, and also squirrels. And yeah, I feel like doing it out of pallets, and then hardware cloth has...I've seen be pretty effective in keeping that stuff out. And then yeah, smell is usually it's too wet. As far as like creating like a dangerous end product, I think for that you can really just think about the time that...how long it takes as well as like the heat of the pile. So if you're able to get enough material and get it to heat up, it's gonna kill almost anything that is harmful to humans. The kind of industry standard is getting piles up to 130 degrees for about 15 days. And that's considered like sufficient to, like, kill pretty much anything like even like human waste. So, you know, and I think letting it sit for longer periods of time is the way to kind of guarantee that, that it's going to be alright for for food production. Margaret 16:24 That was kind of my thinking behind the the setup that I'm going to do with the two years instead of like one year is just out of like, well, what if I'm really lazy and do it badly then I'll just have it have set for two years instead of one year. Paige 16:33 Totally. Margaret 16:33 I don't know. What shouldn't people compost? I have a feeling that the answer to this is, 'It depends.' It depends on like the scale of the compost and things like that. But, to maybe like, I feel like kind of at this beginning, we're sort of talking about like backyard level compost, like vegetable garden level compost, and then I'd love to from there move into humanure and also like doing it at scale. But, in terms of like a backyard compost. What are things that are like good or bad for compost? Paige 17:10 Yeah, generally, most like vegetable and like fruit scraps are super great. Some people have trouble with like citrus peels, like they'll just kind of dry out. People tend to recommend against dairy, meat, and bones as well as really fatty things. If you have something it's really oily, as well as like often cooked food. But, a lot of that is mostly because of the salt content in the cooked food. Like adding a bunch of salt to your compost isn't ideal, because you don't want to be putting like salty, just salty compost on your vegetable garden. That's going to kind of suck the water away from from the roots of the plants. But, honestly, if you're doing like even like a four by four backyard, like I put meat, I put cooked food, I put pretty much anything in there, and just kind of...as long as it's getting hot enough and it's big enough, it's probably going to be okay. But, if you're doing smaller scale, you might want to be a little more choosy. And then if you're doing like an indoor worm bin, if you don't have an outdoor space, then you have to be a lot more choosy because you're not, you're not just putting stuff together and hoping it works out. You're kind of like feeding worms and they're they're a little pickier than some of the microbes that will be in your big outdoor pile. Margaret 18:25 Yeah, that makes sense to me. How long does it take to like, if you're throwing like chicken bones and stuff in that, like, how long is that taking to break down? Paige 18:33 Um, I feel like it takes like three to six months generally, but that's if it's..if you keep the pile hot and big, and there's like a lot of like, if it's moist enough, then like stuff will break down pretty quickly. Margaret 18:45 Okay. Paige 18:46 The bokashi method I was mentioning earlier, too, that can be used to kind of like ferment and like break stuff down. And, that's like a couple of weeks, but I haven't I haven't actually tried that method. But, I've heard that it can be really good for like animal bones. Margaret 19:00 Yeah, I watched one video. I probably a lot of people listen to this also do the thing where they're suddenly interested in something to watch all the YouTube videos and listen to all the podcasts about it. That might be why you're listening to this very podcast right now. Maybe you don't listen to the show. Maybe you just googled or searched 'compost.' One of the things that I watched was just like, "And then you kill the rats, and then you throw the rats in the compost pile." It was just sort of the the compost pile is like the 'all devour,' and it was like clearly he was doing it in this very like, "See. Look. The compost pile is not so fragile as people claim." I don't know that kind of impressed me, the idea that you can just throw the rats into...the dead ones into the compost pile. I don't know. Paige 19:43 Yeah, totally. No, it's it's kind of wild like what a pile will just like totally consume. Yeah, I think also like speaking about rats, like rats aren't gonna go into a pile if it's 140 degrees. Like that's too warm for them. They're like not gonna fuck with it. Margaret 19:58 Oh Huh, okay. Paige 19:59 Yeah. I just like it's just not...Yeah, if you if you're keeping it hot, it's like not a very like, comfortable environment for a lot of like the rodents and things like that. They'll kind of keep away from from at least the hot parts of it. Yeah, it's also cool. Like the the heating aspect of it, I've seen systems where, you know, it's like, you're using the heat to kind of generate all these microbes and break down all the material, but I've also seen systems where people are using it to heat water. If you like coil like pipes through it, you can even kind of get a couple of different uses out of that heat, which is pretty cool. Margaret 20:35 And compost piles generate this heat on their own from like, it's like a byproduct of the process of breaking down? Paige 20:42 Yeah, basically, it creates like, it'll just kind of breed all these microbes. And as these micro populations multiply, they yeah, and they consume food, they just create an like an immense amount of heat. I've seen piles that got up to like 160 degrees Fahrenheit. When I was working at the city's composting site, there was one winter where it snowed in Tucson, which was kind of scary, but there were two inches of snow on the ground everywhere, except for on top of...a lot of industrial scale areas, we'll use what's called wind row, which is like a pile, it's maybe five to six feet tall, and then it's just elongated it across whatever area they have. And so everywhere there was snow, except for on top of these wind rows that were just steaming and just melting everything that fell on them, which was really cool. Margaret 21:29 Yeah. Okay, so can you heat a house? By setting up a compost bin in your basement? Paige 21:36 Oh, I wonder. I mean, I think you could, if you put a compost pile in your basement, and then ran pipes through the pile, and then through your floor, I feel like you could gett some good like, floor warming action. Yeah, or like, some people will pile.. they'll put their pile against a greenhouse to kind of like, passively have a little like heat source near their greenhouse. But, if you're trying to... Margaret 22:01 Oh, that's interesting. Paige 22:02 Yeah, if you're trying to maintain like a pretty consistent amount of heat, though, you kind of need to constantly be adding a good amount of material and turning it because it'll, it'll kind of like it'll get really hot initially, when there's all this like new new material, microbes, air, water, and then it'll cool off. And then if you add more, or turn it and add more air, it'll heat up again, and it kind of will go through these cycles. But, eventually, what you want is an end product that's not going to reheat. And that's kind of a sign that the compost is like aged well and is a stable thing that you can put into your garden. Margaret 22:36 Oh, okay. Paige 22:36 Yeah, I've put in compost to my garden, like mixed it in when it wasn't fully done. And then like my garden bed, like, reheated and like was up at like 120 degrees, which is like not, yeah, not ideal and not good for growing plants. But if you have like unfinished compost, you can like, put a couple inches on top of your plants. And that's often going to be all right. But if you're like really doing like a first amendment of your...of a new garden plot, you want to make sure that you're working with something that's not going to reheat. Margaret 23:10 Okay. So, you know, you kind of know compost is done when it looks like dirt and isn't hot anymore? Do you like? Do you build up a pile and then just move on to the next pile? Are you kind of always adding to the original pile? Like, what what is to be done? How do you? How do? Paige 23:27 So there's a lot of different systems you can do. So there's, if you start a pile and then move on to the next one, that's kind of what's considered a batch system. So, you're building something up and adding to it and then you're letting it sit for an amount of time to make sure that stuffs broken down. There's other systems that are more designed as like a flow through system. So you're maybe adding to the top of the pile but you're able to pull stuff off the bottom, a lot of worm composting systems are flow through because you kind of have to, when you're putting new material and then harvesting old material, you're also trying to not like remove all the worms from the system. So you're trying to kind of add often, add material to the top and harvest from the bottom. So there's, there's different like commercial or DIY systems that that can be made to accommodate that. So, you can do either. And I think it really depends on like, what your timeline is and what your end goal is. Like, are you just trying to get rid of the waste that you have? And not have it be in your trash? Are you trying to make a soil amendment that's as good as possible as fast as possible? And so there's kind of different systems that that make the most sense based on just like what you have on site, what kind of energy you want to put in, and what your goal is. Yeah, but either are options. Margaret 24:44 Okay. So this kind of brings me...Well, I don't know if it logically brings me to but the thing that it makes me think of is that okay, so if you're in an apartment, right, and like I guess you could kind of tiny scale compost and on your porch or something, but it seems like it It makes more sense to have sometimes composting be a sort of shared thing between houses or within a community. Right? Like, you know, I know a lot of cities, and it sounds like this is something that you have been involved with at a municipal level, have like composting where people were able to set aside their food and the city goes and composts it because it's not trash, right? It should never have been trash, so the idea that we live in a society that's all organic matters is trash is very bizarre. But, it seems like you could also set that up kind of like smaller scale, right? Like, you know, within any given community, if you don't live somewhere with municipal composting, or, or is it better to just let it be at municipal level? Like what are the advantages of doing compost at scale, whether it's a community wide scale or municipal wide scale? Paige 25:45 Yeah, so I think doing it at a community or at a municipal scale and having it be really official, I think it makes it easier to divert stuff from the landfill. So, when food waste goes into the landfill, it creates methane, which is, you know, more potent than than co2. And, so it's actually interesting here, and here in southern Arizona, a lot of food comes through the port, that's like two...an hour south of Tucson through Nogales, and they have...the landfill there is like one of the most methane rich ones in the country, because they don't have a composting program down there, or like a way to divert food waste besides through like their food bank. And so when trucks come across the border, and food doesn't pass inspection, it just goes and the semi trucks are just dumping food waste into the landfill. And then it's creating like methane. Margaret 25:45 Oh, god. Paige 25:47 And so, you know, that's like a huge problem. It probably like deserves like a pretty big solution as far as like, what a system to address that would be. But, I think when I was working at the at Tucson's program, we had a lot of problems of people putting just garbage and trash into like the food waste bins at different restaurants. And, so it creates this really big problem of contamination, like when you're doing it on a large scale, like we...I remember seeing like freon tanks and just like constant plastic bags. Yeah. And so we were, it'd be like a huge part of what we did is we would just like kind of like tromp around in these massive piles of rotting food like pulling out plastic and even like the quote unquote, like compostable bags don't actually break down in some systems, and they would, they would clog up some of our machinery. And so yeah, I think I think large scale, you just have issues of contamination. And you also need a bunch of heavy machinery. Like we were operating, like a water truck and front loaders, we had like this machine that was specifically like a compost turner. It was, it was just like a lot of...it was pretty energy intensive process. It was fun. It was cool. I like you know, got to drive a tractor around. That was fun. But yeah, I think I think having it more be like the community scale where it's like, either backyard based or neighborhood based, or like community garden based, I think is is a better way to do it and just kind of cutting out like the transportation time and just having it at that scale. But, but again, that's not going to it's not going to address, you know, the semi trucks full of rotting food. But right, yeah, so. So there's, yeah, there's benefits and drawbacks, but I think I think, you know, with almost anything usually, like a lot of small, decentralized solutions are usually better than the large centralized ones. Margaret 28:27 I've I've based most of my political beliefs on this concept. But yeah, but I also believe that sometimes certain things need to be structured at larger levels in order to be effective, you know, or like, I don't know, accomplish what they need, like what you're talking about with like the, you know, the trucks or whatever. Well, okay, so then if you do it at the community level, it seems like another advantage right is you probably get less contamination literally because people could be like, "Joe, you can't keep throwing your Freon tanks in with your compost." You know, like Joe keeps doing that and, and probably gets shamed enough about it, right. Paige 29:07 Yeah, definitely. Margaret 29:09 I literally can't even imagine what a Freon tank is. I mean, I'm aware that there's a liquid called Freon... Paige 29:13 It kind of looked like a propane tank, but it was like blue and like, I was just like, In what world do we think this is gonna break down? Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was just, it was a bit of a mess. But yeah, so I mean, you know, when you're doing large scale, yeah, it's like you need to also figure out like how to like educate people versus Yeah, like, the just like community shaming of Joe for his Freon tank is is maybe a little more effective than like a massive scale like, program. Yeah. But yeah, and also, I mean, I think when you're doing smaller scale it also...people end up talking to each other and, you know, building community Yeah, that they do if they just aren't interacting. Yeah, Margaret 29:55 That makes sense. Okay, so But then, in terms of the stuff that...one of the things I got kind of excited about when I started doing...looking more into compost, because I've lived in situations that have required relied upon compost at various points in my life, a fair amount, but I've never been personally like, directing it the way that I am currently. And one of the things that kind of surprised me to learn about is that, like cardboard and paper and stuff can be composted, but maybe not easily, or it needs to be shredded or like, like it, there were a couple things that in my mind were marked trash, or fake recycling, because one of the biggest problems I think we have in this world is that recycling is a scam, or at least the version of--not the concept of recycling, right--but yeah, you know, the current industrial infrastructure of recycling seems to be largely smoke and mirrors. So, I'm excited by the idea of like, the more DIY recycling type stuff we can do, the more repurposing we can do. So, paper, cardboard: Yes? No? Maybe? Paige 31:03 Paper, cardboard, yes, under certain circumstances. So yeah, you're totally right about the shredding. So a lot of what that has to do with is like the surface area to like mass of the item. And so if you think about, like your compost pile is all these little particles, and then the microbes that are breaking stuff down, kind of live on like, the slime level surrounding each little particle. And so all these little microbes are going to have a lot easier time breaking down a bunch of shredded tiny bits of paper than like a full sheet or like a full chunk of cardboard that you're just creating more areas for them... Margaret 31:37 Or like an entire Ayn Rand book. Paige 31:39 Yeah, I mean, that's a good yeah. Yeah, you might need to rip that up first, which I think people would not be opposed to. Margaret 31:46 Okay. Paige 31:47 Might have fun with. Margaret 31:48 Okay, cool. Yeah. Paige 31:50 Yeah, I think that would be the ideal. I think also, cardboard and paper, worms really love it. So, you know, you could also set up multiple systems where you put something somewhere in some in another. The system that I have at the food bank demo garden here in Tucson, we have like a hot compost area, but then we also have a big worm area. And what we feed them is we feed them shredded paper, and then unfinished compost. And so we we put like a layer of paper and then we on top of it, we put a bunch of hot compost essentially but because we're only putting like an inch or two, it's not gonna stay hot. But we that's what we feed our worms. And they they love it. And so yeah, cardboard and paper, I would think more of as worm food than then putting it in my in my pile, although you can. But as the more you're able to break it down, the better. Margaret 32:44 Are there like--speaking of products and gimmicks--I can imagine a paper shredder, and I can imagine a wood chipper. But, can you just put cardboard into a wood chipper? Or like, like, is there a way to, you know, because I think that a lot of people during the pandemic probably receive more and more things in cardboard boxes at their front porch. And, like, you know, having ways to dispose of that as like bonus besides of course just using it as like sheet mulch or I don't know if that's what you call it, but like the gardening purpose of laying out cardboard, you know, any any tips on on breaking down cardboard? Paige 33:24 Umm, getting it wet and ripping it? But it's Yeah, I don't I don't think you could put it into a shredder. I think it would maybe gum it up. You also have to kind of take off like the plastic tape of that stuff. Because that won't break down. Some people get really specific and focused on like, "Oh, this is with a like plastic based ink. Like we're gonna be putting microplastics in like the soil." And like, there might be some truth to that. And I'm just like, we just live in like an industrial world where there's microplastics everywhere. And like, you can not put the like plastic based ink into your compost, because of the micro plastics or you can just be like, shrug and throw it in. Margaret 34:07 We're all gonna die one day. And yeah, we did this to ourselves. Yeah. Paige 34:10 I live in a city and I breathed the air here. Like, I think some microplastics in my garden is...we're already full of microplastics. I think it's fine. We're just like, you know, we're all connected. Margaret 34:21 I mean, it's either fine or it's not right. But it's like, I don't think I'm going to dramatically improve my quality of life by avoiding that additional little bit in my cherry tomatoes or whatever. Paige 34:30 Yeah, totally. Yeah, I guess it's actually deeply deeply not fine. And we don't have control over it may be my actual belief but... Margaret 34:38 Yeah, totally. Okay, well, speaking of the ruins of industrial society, can you can you put ash in compost? Is it depend on what the ash is of Paige 34:46 No ash and compost. No, don't do that. Margaret 34:50 Fuck. Paige 34:50 Yeah. Well, I mean, like... Margaret 34:51 What am I supposed to do with ash then? Paige 34:53 I don't know. People ask me that sometimes. And people were putting it into like a composting system and like using it in the humanure system, and I was Like, I mean, it's kind of just like, it's almost like really fine sand like it's just not alive. It's, it's maybe gonna bulk it and not harm it. It's not you're not adding anything that the pile needs. It's just kind of like fluff and like very dense fluff. Margaret 35:14 You're just putting it there to get rid of it. Paige 35:15 Yeah. And just like based on how dense ash is, especially when it's wet, you're probably limiting some of the airflow which is not good. So I yeah, I don't have a good use for ash besides, I've mixed it into like concrete before like when I needed to buy like sand and mix up like Portland cement. I've just like thrown ash in and that was fine. But I don't know how many how many concrete projects you have in your life right now, that might not be a reasonable solution. Margaret 35:43 I actually have more experience building than growing food so...I'm growing food as the unexplored terrain. Although I kind of hate working with concrete and I'm not very good at it. And I'm terrified of breathing it in. But well, yeah. Okay. Cement, I guess is what I'm terrified of breathing in concrete itself. I'm not particularly worried about chunks of gravel or whatever. Yeah. Okay. Okay. So no ash. Okay. But you mentioned these compostable plastics, aren't they gonna save us all? And isn't everything fine and plastic is great now because it's all compostable? Basically. Okay. So like, I've heard this before, right? That you need that, like your plastic spoon that you get at the hippie diner doesn't actually break down in a home compost. It would only break down on like, municipal level compost. Is that true? Is it like does it just take a lot longer? Or is it about a heat difference? Or is it all scam? Paige 36:37 Um, it's yeah, it's a heat and time thing, but it's really just a scam. I mean, I just don't...In what world is a single use item good for the environment at all. Like it's just greenwashing bullshit scam. Yeah, it's also there's interesting things about like what's biodegradable versus compostable? Like biodegradable just means it's gonna break down into way smaller pieces and compostable means it's like made out of a carbon or like quote unquote, natural thing that will eventually become dirt. But,we yeah, even at like an industrial scale, like we would constantly just be pulling plastic out. And so you know, it's kind of a thing that, you know, people do where it's like, 'wish cycling,' where you like, you're like, Oh, I'm gonna put this in the recycling bin because I like hope it's recyclable, but it's really not. Margaret 37:27 I did as a kid. Yeah. Paige 37:29 Yeah. And it's like, ultimately, proud. Totally. It's like a weird Yeah, you're like, you're like hoping something will break down. But, you're ultimately like, making it so like, some like worker or machine is gonna have to, like deal with it later down the line. And, you know, it's like, maybe you feel a little better about yourself, but it's, it's ultimately not not making a difference. Margaret 37:48 It's like calling the cops instead of handling the problem directly. You're just putting it on someone else. Paige 37:53 Yeah, it's like, yeah, It's kind of some weird like, Nimmy Nimmy thing. Maybe it would be a way to think about it. But yeah, yeah. Margaret 38:01 Yeah. Okay, fine. Paige 38:06 Sorry. Margaret 38:07 Okay, so I can't put ash in. All the plastic stuff is a scam. Yeah. I mean, neither of these thing surprise me. The ash thing I'm sad about. It makes a lot of sense. The way you described it makes perfect sense. Basically, because burning cardboard when when recycling is fake is something that people sometimes do. Paige 38:26 Yeah, totally. Margaret 38:27 Okay, so let's talk about...you've been bringing up worms a couple of times. My conception of worm composting is fairly simple. It's like, instead of the food is digested by random bacteria from the air/becomes sort of soil in the classic rot way. Instead, like worms, eat it and then poop it out. And then the worm poop, which we call castings to not sound gross is the like, some of like, the best, most nutrient dense compost in the world or something? Paige 39:02 Yeah, that's right. Yeah, worms are a little pickier eaters than the microbes. But yeah, they'll break stuff down really well. It's not all types of worms. There's like some specific worms that are better for composting. They have different names. Often people call them Red Wigglers but they're like scientific name is Eisenia Fetida and that those are yeah they're good worms for composting. Margaret 39:23 It's a prettier word. Paige 39:23 Yeah, it's a little prettier. Or fetid, you know, working with rotten stuff, but they, yeah, they're not good for fishing. They like kind of create like a weird smell that fish don't like so they're, they're very specific for for compost and they kind of only live in like the top three inches of soil, usually like rotting leaves and stuff. Yeah, and so you can you have to, you have to have a little more control over a worm pile because you're not you're not it's not just kind of like set it and leave it. You need to make sure that they have water, that they have fresh food, that they don't get too hot or too cold. Like there's a little more care that goes into that. Margaret 39:58 That they don't get bored. Paige 39:59 Yeah. You got it? Yeah. Totally gotta... Margaret 40:01 Like little worm toys or yeah? Paige 40:03 Yeah, exactly. Definitely add adding a few toys I haven't I feel it's a good idea to see how that affects our our system at the food bank, do some trials see if they're more productive if we give them some, you know, we give them bread, but not circuses. So we'll see if they're a little more productive if we meet their needs. Margaret 40:24 Flea circuses are the worms. Paige 40:26 Yeah, we'll figure it out. Margaret 40:28 Okay. Paige 40:30 But yeah, what else can I say about worms? Oh, it's interesting, because a lot of worms like for compost, as well as worms that like live in our soil are mostly invasive in North America. So kind of similar to honey bees or a lot of honeybees in North America. And they've Yeah, they've really, you have to actually be kind of careful with what types of worms you're working with, and where you're putting the material in certain parts of the country, because there's been really big problems of invasive earthworms. And they're, they're really impacting forest ecology, actually, you know, a lot of forests, maybe had a certain type of worm there, or maybe it didn't have worms. And so part of the forest ecology is that all of these, like leaves fall on the ground and take a long time to rot. But if you add a bunch of worms to that system, they end up eating all the all the leaves, which it just changes the soil makeup. And and it's, it's kind of a big problem. Yeah, Margaret 41:23 It gets rid of the mulch or whatever, right? Paige 41:26 Yeah. Margaret 41:26 Hmm. Okay. And so when you when you do worm composting, and you have a worm bin, you're basically breeding worms at the same time, right? Like, do you end up with more worms than you started? And you therefore can like, go and start your new worm bin? Because you have like, twice as many worms, or... Paige 41:46 Yeah. Margaret 41:46 Like, do...You don't have to like keep going by and buying worms at the worm store? The wormery? Paige 41:54 Yeah, ideally, you would not have to make too many trips to the wormery kind of like a one and done scenario would be ideal. But yeah, they'll double in population every three to six months under ideal conditions. They...eah, it was interesting. Like, you can get worms as like bait worms, where you buy them like 12, in a little cup, but those often aren't actually composting rooms. And the way that you generally buy composting worms is by the pound. And so when we started our system at the food bank, I bought 25 pounds of worms, which was about 25,000 worms. And the way you kind of calculate how many worms you need is actually based on the surface area of how big your system is. So every square foot, you can do a pound of worms, but.... Margaret 42:38 Cause they only hang out the top three inches? Paige 42:40 Yeah, yeah, totally. So if you have like, a super deep system, like they're just not going to go that deep. But yeah, there's a lot of...Yeah, worms are fun. And again, they they're creating like, super high quality material. Part of that is because when they, you know, part of what's good about compost and worm castings is like they will they add a lot of like microbes and bacteria to your soil and kind of help build up your like soil food web. And there's a lot of like microbes and bacteria that actually breed and reproduce like within the digestive tract of a worm. And so they'll like they're basically eating microbes and bacteria, and then shitting out like, way more microbes and bacteria. And that's like, kind of the thing that you want in your garden. So yeah, worms are fun. They're cool. And they Yeah, they'll any worm can like mate with any other worm. And then they they lay like an egg that has like, two to four baby worms in it, and then they hatch. Margaret 43:34 Okay, because they're not individually sexed or something like... Paige 43:37 Yeah, they don't. Everybody's got all the junk. Yeah. Margaret 43:41 Okay, cool. So The Left Hand of Darkness is the worms existence. Can you use other creepy crawlies? Like if you want to have your like goth garden where you only grow black eggplant, and black tomatoes, and black roses, and stuff, can you get like nightcrawlers or like, centipede or something? Paige 44:01 You can do you can do like nightcrawlers. Yeah, I mean, same as worms, but you can also do people will do black soldier fly larva to break down food and it's like, they just look like little weird grubs. And you can use those not to I guess that's not really composting at all. I mean, it's it's getting rid of like a waste material and like feeding it to like, little little bugs. But then you would just use those to like feed your chickens or something. So...not really compost, but a way to.... Margaret 44:28 So there's more steps involved? Paige 44:29 Yeah, probably. Yeah, yeah. Margaret 44:32 Okay, so speaking of worm casings, and poop, the--not the final question, but the final like category--we'll be talking about human casings as part of composting, like, I know that this, you know, one of the reason want to save it for last is almost like the escalating level of like perceived grossness, right? Like I, I think people are like, "Oh, food rots. I understand that. Vegetables and rot. That's cool." And then you're like, "Yeah, but what if there's a bunch of worms," and then people get a little bit weird. And then you're like, "Okay, but what if you do with human shit?" Paige 45:04 Yeah. Margaret 45:05 And then that's where people say that they don't want to come over anymore. And that they don't want to eat your vegetables. Paige 45:11 Yep. Margaret 45:12 But it's actually completely fine. Well, it just takes additional safety precautions? I'm asking this is like, it's funny because I'm like, I try to self insert as the person who doesn't know anything about this, but I've like also lived on in places with humanure systems for a number of years. But,I'm curious your experience or like, how you sell people on humanure, or? I don't know, can you give an introduction to human casings? Yeah, Paige 45:38 Totally. Um, yeah, so you a lot of like, what to compost on what not to compost will be like, definitely not human, like poop or pee. And yeah, that's just totally not true. You can, you know, we're an animal like any other creating manure, and you can definitely use it. The yeah, there's a lot of different systems. I mean, there's commercial composting toilets that you can buy for your home that are like in the 1000s of dollars, but you can also make like DIY systems for like, under $50. Yeah, I've, I've seen a couple of different systems, I've helped set some up. At the garden that I work at, we have like a fully permitted humanure system that I built. And yeah, I've helped set up some different ones on like a land project. But yeah, you can definitely do it, the, the differences are, you just want to be really certain that you're hitting high temperatures, because that's what's really going to address like kind of the pathogen problem. But if you're if you're getting like a big hot pile of compost, and you're putting like human waste in it, like it's, it's gonna break it down, and it's going to be safe to use. Yeah, I'm trying to think of the I think the big questions are like, at what scale are you trying to do it? And do you care if it's like permitted or not? In some states, you can legally compost human waste at your home and some places you can't. It's also interesting, the like, a lot of sewage treatment plants end up composting, like their final product, and they refer to it as bio solids. And so actually, a lot of cities are composting human waste, they're just doing it after it's gone through like... Margaret 47:13 That's good. Paige 47:14 Yeah, it's like it's after it's gone through like a really like chemical heavy process to like, really ensure that there's nothing like bad in it. But yeah, 'bio solids,' is kind of like the, like industry term that, that they've adopted to not say like 'human shit,' which, you know is a little more off putting. But ultimately, yeah, yeah. Margaret 47:34 I mean, it's interesting to me, right? Because like, I think that this, to me is an example of where sometimes people...I read a book by a purported environmentalist once that was like, "We're animals, we should just poop on the ground." It was this big name, author that...whatever it was Derek Jensen, I fucking hate him. I don't care about name droping him. Fucking transphobe piece of shit. But anyway, you know, he wrote this book called "What We Leave Behind," that I just like, even back, this is like, back when I like before I learned...I'm not a particular fan of this particular author, but I was when I was younger. And one of the first things that talks about is basically being like, "I just go poop on the ground, because that's we're animals and it's fine." And I'm like, I also believe that the idea of like, taking our nutrients or whatever, and flushing them into the ocean is a bad idea, right? But, I also believe that we develop that system for a reason, which was that before we used to just poop in the streets, and everyone would get sick and die. Paige 48:31 Yes. Margaret 48:32 And so, so something like this is actually really interesting to me, because it seems to be this...you know, both sides are just full of shit...I didn't even mean to make that pun. Yeah. We'll be here all day. Okay, and I don't know. So it's just like, it's particular interesting. It's particularly interesting to me that it's like, "Okay, well, we actually can just do it right." We can actually...and it's not incredibly hard. You just actually have to do it. You just actually have to make sure that your compost pile sits for a really long time and or gets up to the right temperature if you're not going to be you know, I don't know. I don't know where I'm going with that rant. But... Paige 49:18 Derek Jensen sucks. Conclusion. Margaret 49:20 Yeah, yeah, totally. Don't just go poop on the ground next to your dog's shit. Paige 49:26 Yeah. I yeah, I think it feels really absurd to poop in drinking water, especially in the desert. A lot of like municipal sewage systems were not built to the scale that they're now operating at. A lot of them were like built to just totally overflow into like, whatever local water source there is. So yeah, I think like not shitting in drinking water and like having smaller scale ways to address like human waste I think is like a way better option and, you know, kind of similar to your other compost pile where you add like your greens and browns. In this case, the poop is actually a green, it's more of a nitrogen rich thing. It's not a brown, ironically. But yeah, you can I mean, I think the simplest system is like, it's called like a 'bucket to barrel' system or a 'bucket to bin.' And you would just have like a five gallon bucket with a toilet seat and like kind of a bin built around it so it's comfortable to sit on, and then you just like, go to the bathroom in it, and then cover whatever you leave behind with your dump, I guess, with wood shavings or some kind of carbon source. And then basically like, when that's filled, you just transfer it out to your bin system or wherever you're, you're kind of doing the the secondary processing. And yeah, just like make sure that pile gets hot. The systems that I've helped install, and we're actually trying to get one installed in my house in Tucson right now are either like barrel systems or like larger, I guess, bin or like a tote system. But you. Yeah, so there's the barrel, the bucket system, or you can also build toilets out of like 55 gallon barrels where you just like put build a toilet seat for the top of it. And then just like use, use that for your waste, and you're adding sawdust and things. And you just want to make sure that that system has like some ventilation as well as like an insect trap. And... Margaret 51:28 I was just going to ask, yeah, if you're doing it. Is that where you like? I've seen people do it where they like, take a...I completely cut you off. I'm sorry. Paige 51:36 Oh, you're good, go ahead. Margaret 51:38 People take a tube and like drill holes in it, and then stick it in the middle of the whole thing. So that way, like, even as the compost builds up, there's always like, a way for air to get in and throughout it all. Paige 51:48 Yeah, totally. Yeah, that's, that's.... Margaret 51:50 I think sometimes people over design these things, too. Paige 51:53 Yeah, totally. I think that's, that's definitely true, I think. I mean, I think it's helpful to have like more airflow, especially in like a composting toilet scenario. You also like, if you have like that 55 gallon barrel, like you do need to like turn it, which you do with a compost crank, which is kind of like a long, stick with like a coil at the end. And you just kind of like you put that stick in and kind of like crank it down and pull up and just try to get like some some like mixing in there. And that'll help the material breakdown better. Margaret 52:22 Oh, I see. Paige 52:24 Yeah, and then usually those are, those are kind of more of a batch system. So you would have a certain number of barrels, depending on how many people you had using it. And you would essentially use one and once it's filled, you would cap it, and then like wait four to six months and then empty it eventually. In that four to six month time period, you do want to make sure that you are turning it, and making sure that it's getting up to temperature to kind of guarantee that any any pathogens are dying in there. Yeah, and the other system that I've built is like more of like a larger tote system. So it was built out of cinder blocks. And it was like a two two section toilet. And so it's a bigger space is going to take longer to fill. But it's by having kind of like multiple of the same thing, then you have one that's like aging and resting and one that's actively being used. The other factor to consider is urine diversion. Different people have different take on it. I think if you're doing a bigger system, like with barrels or like the bigger bins, it's helpful to try to divert urine. So having like... Margaret 53:27 Oh, interesting. Paige 53:28 Yeah, it kind of depends on where you are and how heavy of use it is. But a system that I helped work on was one that like often would have like a lot of people using it really quickly. And so kind of keeping urine diverted was helpful because otherwise it would just get too moist and bulky. And like in that sense, and in those moments like it actually does get smelly and gross often. If you're maintaining it well it's actually not smelly or gross at all. But yeah, if it's heavier use it's helpful to like have a urinal or like there's like urine diverters or funnels that like you can have like in the toilet seat that kind of helps like if people are like sitting and peeing it all kind of separate from the solids. Yeah, so there's there's there's different ways to do it. But I mean, urine also can be composted. So. Margaret 54:16 Right, yeah. Well, and a lot of people will put it--please don't listen to me as the expert gardener anyone who's listening to this--I'm under the impression is about 10 to 1 water to urine and then like apply as fertilizer directly once it's like watered down that heavily. That's something that you've heard ever? Paige 54:37 I've heard people do that. I feel like I I've kind of tended to more just do like, compost everything first and then use it. Yeah, just because yeah, I mean, I think for me, too. It's just like not It's not easy for me to like, harvest my own urine. It's not a thing. I feel super....Like. Yeah, I but I have heard of people doing that. Margaret 55:00 Yeah, yeah, it just seems like the process of combining the two. 10 to 1 or whatever it just involves, like lots of...I don't know, stagnant urine is one of the worst punk house smells that's ever been smelled. Paige 55:16 Yeah. Margaret 55:17 And that's not something that I would try to sell someone on. But, then that is the reason...As I've been researching hypothetical humanure systems....I have been interested to see the different ways that people take the different takes that people have on it. It seems like if you're not diverting it, you're just you're ending up with a lot watery buckets, right. And so you just have a lot more. You're saying it's bulkier, because you're just adding so much more sawdust or hay or whatever your carbon is, in order to start absorbing all that? Paige 55:49 Yeah, you can, you can run through your carbon source a lot faster if you're trying to add that. I think also like, especially with bucket systems, like if you're peeing in the buckets, and just like, I've carried some buckets that were just like, I was like, This is disgusting. Like, this is just like, piss and shit and like a little bit of sawdust. And I'm not happy about this. I've also like, yeah, you know, trained people to use a bucket system and like, don't ever pee in the bucket. And then the next morning, I'm like, sitting there, and I'm like, Oh, God, I'm peeing. I'm letting everyone down. I'm such a hypocrite. Oh, no. It happens. It's a shameful thing to do I guess but. But yeah, if you're, if you're, especially with a bucket system, if you have to, like move it, I feel like if there's a lot of people using it, it's nice to maybe divert the urine just for like it weighs less, it just is less smelly. But you can also just add a lot more carbon. So like, when I've done systems that weren't going to have urine diversion, I've actually started whatever like receptacle or container with like, a third full of whatever carbon material I'm going to be using, just to really make sure that there's like, kind of like just a bunch of dry material that can soak up that excess liquid. And yeah, and I think it's, you know, a, I've worked with systems that are I've gotten systems permitted. And I've also been around systems that were not permitted. And a lot of like, the permit stuff, like will require urine diversion, just for, like, pathogens and smells and things like that. Yeah. So I think it's just a thing to consider of how you're, how you're gonna manage that, that added, like, moisture and, like, just like dense material. Margaret 57:33 So what do you...so in terms of carbon to add, I think that this is also another thing that holds people up, right is because, you know, there's like, oh, just add a lot of sawdust. And most people, I think, think to themselves, I don't have a lot of sawdust. I don't produce much sawdust in my life. Even I as someone who like makes her own furniture, sometimes and shit. I don't produce that much sawdust compared to like what is necessary, right. And, you know, some of the places I've lived before will make deals with sawmills where they just basically show up with a truck and are like, "Hey, can I have your sawdust?" And the place is like, "Yeah, whatever, just get rid of the sawdust for me, I don't care." But it seems like everyone has different tactics on getting carbon material. And it's like, it seems like it's the it's the one that a lot of people aren't producing themselves enough and therefore go and get. And that was actually why I was so excited about like cardboard and paper as possible carbon sources. I know that for myself, I fortunately, live somewhere where there's a lot of land and I can just like, run a push mower with a bag on the back and fill out the bag. And then this is literally my hypothesis. It's green when it first gets cut, but later it's brown, and it seems like it when it's dried out. It's more of a carbon for compost. Paige 58:49 Yep. Margaret 58:51 Okay, so how would you recommend 1) Am I doing it right? And 2) that other people go and find a carbon source? Paige 58:56 Yeah, I mean, I think the sawmill thing is a great thing to do. That's what we're doing. Like with the garden and other projects, like we just have agreements with sawmills, and like, cabinetry places and the only thing we have to keep an eye out for is if they're working with walnut. That's a word that has a lot of like antibiotic, antibacterial properties and will like kind of halt the process. And so you don't want to be adding walnut and I think there's maybe a few other types of wood that that you wouldn't want to use. Margaret 59:24 Like Cedar, maybe? Paige 59:25 Potentially I'm not, yeah, I'm not totally sure. But yeah, I think dried grass clippings would work great as a cover material. The other thing that we will sometimes do out here in the desert is like sweep under like mesquite trees because there's just these really fine little leaves that when they're dried out work really well. But yeah, the other thing is just getting...if it's like just a system for yourself, and you're not having to source that much you can also just buy like wood shavings at like a pet store, which is annoying. It's like annoying to have to buy, buy something that you have to put into your system, but I think it's better than shiting in water, personally. But... Margaret 1:00:01 Yeah, well especially in Tucson or something. Paige 1:00:04 Yeah, totally. Yeah. But it's, you know, I think it's up to what you have on site. I don't know that shredded paper would be...because part of what you want to do is you want to kind of cover your poop so that it's like not smelly and not like easily accessible to flies and different insects--and so like I'm thinking if you just did like shredded paper, I think it would just be kind of like some fluff on top but still like a lot of access for like smells to pop up and for like insects to get in. That might not work super well, unless it's like that really finely shredded paper, but I'm not sure. Margaret 1:00:43 But it'd be really fun for whoever's job it is to, to steal your shredded paper in order to like, re put together your files and try and prove that you did this or that, you know, yeah, if they had to, like literally go into the compost bin. Paige 1:00:58 Yeah, that's a good way. Yeah. Some good security culture, maybe to compost your, your paper and I support that. Margaret 1:01:10 Okay, well, that's, that's the majority of my questions. I was wondering if you had any final words about why this is like, great? And matters? And it's so interesting? You know, you've, you've talked about, like, for example, like, like shitting in drinking water is like, not the coolest thing that's ever happened. But, but yeah, do you have like, or any other final thoughts are things that I should have asked you that I didn't, or? Paige 1:01:35 I can't think of anything right now. But yeah, I mean, I think composting is just like, it's a way to just like address waste problems on site. It's like small scale, it's a way to build up soil and not use fertilizers and inputs. So, I think it's just a really good thing to do if you're able, and it's fun. I think it's fun. Margaret 1:01:55 Yeah, I think it'd be a cool way to like, you know, one of the questions I get asked a lot is, like how people can can meet their neighbors? And I mean, obviously, sometimes it's a very complicated question, you know, if you're, like, I'm not in a, I'm not in a blue state, let's say. And, you know, like, like, there's a lot of like, compl

Thrifty gardeners, take note. This is all about doing it yourself.  You can collect your own seeds, (but be very careful of one thing),  make your own seed pots, fertilizer, compost, pesticides, soil test and potting soil.  All organic, mostly made with stuff you have in your shed or pantry. Plus a quick reprise of the ever popular Bokashi and the many maggots story. And why kids eating mud pies could be a very good thing. Learn How to Winter Sow! Don't Know Your Zone? Find it HERE Support UDT by joining our Garden Party and get fun rewards! Get a UDT Coffee Mug or other cool Merch! Visit our website for pix, good info and Upside Down Dictionary Click here to write to us! 

Welcome to Season 3, Episode 3, If You're not a Partner of the Solution, You're a Partner of the Problem; Partnerships and Programs with the Sustainability in Prisons Project (aka SPP). This season is all about the Sustainability in Prisons Project, what they do, why they do it and how you might be able bring your skills and knowledge to incarcerated individuals. For this episode, we interviewed Kelli Bush, the Sustainability in Prisons Project Director; Mary Linders, WDFW Wildlife Biologist; and Carolina Landa, a former butterfly technician. In this episode we dive into the complex web of partnerships that SPP maintains for their various, changing and growing programs. At the heart of this whole organization is a web of partnerships that keep everything moving forward and also ensure that projects are safe and appropriate for the prison environment.Interviewees' Background and ExperienceKelli Bush is the co-director of the Sustainability in Prisons Project. She helps bring nature, science and environmental education into prisons in Washington. She also leads staff from The Evergreen State College that coordinate programs in the prisons. She has a Bachelor's degree in Agriculture Ecology from The Evergreen State College. Mary Linders has worked as an endangered species recovery biologist for the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) since 1994. For the past 18 years she has worked to protect and recover populations of five at-risk prairie and oak-associated species in the South Puget Sound region. As the lead biologist overseeing captive rearing and population re-establishment of the federally endangered Taylor's checkerspot butterfly, Mary has grown the project from a captive rearing test trial to a program with two captive rearing facilities, 14 field sites, and nine conservation partners. All told, this effort is transforming thousands of acres of degraded grassland to high quality native prairie benefitting a multitude of other species. Mary holds a Bachelor's degree in Anthropology from the University of Wisconsin-Madison and a Master's degree in Wildlife Science from the University of Washington-Seattle. This background has served her well in a field where conservation values mesh with competing human values. Outside of work she enjoys gardening, hiking, camping, paddling and playing music with her husband and son. Carolina Landa MPA, identifies as a Mexican-American woman. She currently works at the Office of the Corrections Ombuds as the Assistant Ombuds focused on Gender Equity and Reentry. She is a graduate of The Evergreen State College where she received her Bachelor's degree with a focus on Law and Policy followed by her Master's degree in Public Administration. Her three areas of specialized work are in Social Justice, Disabilities and Immigration. She currently serves as a member of the Washington State Developmental Disabilities Council. She strongly believes that people with lived experiences have the power through voice to impact the most effective change in our society. Partnerships and Programs, oh my!This episode is all about partnerships and programs in the Sustainability in Prisons Project (SPP). When we first started researching this topic, Amy the Poop Detective was amazed at the breadth of different organizations and project types that fall under the SPP umbrella.SPP was initially formed as a partnership between The Evergreen State College (Evergreen) and the Department of Corrections (DOC) to bring science, nature and education into prisons in Washington State. It has since grown to almost 200 partnerships. The breadth and depth of the programs that they help facilitate is impressive, to say the very least. While we are most interested in conservation, nature and education programs, we learn that there are so many other types of programs/projects.SPP Perspective on Partnerships and ProgramsIn this episode, Kelli Bush shares more about how partnerships form and function. One of the main points that she makes is that these programs can be started at any level, whether it be an idea from an incarcerated individual, DOC staff, Evergreen graduates or partners in the community (that could mean you!). She also describes how each project is evaluated to make sure that there is benefit to all involved parties. They especially do not want projects that are just looking for free or cheap labor. The primary types of benefits to incarcerated individuals are educational, therapeutic and/or job skill related. She also shares more about how new projects also must be vetted by the DOC to ensure that they meet their safety and risk reduction considerations associated with the prison environment. We chat about how some projects are relatively easy to implement, for example education programs, where other programs are more difficult to implement such as the Taylor's checkerspot butterfly program, which required a greenhouse to be built and potential risks to be considered. She uses the composting program at the Monroe Correctional Facility as an example of how programs can start and grow. In this example, incarcerated individuals worked with DOC staff to develop an internal composting program. Over time, this program has grown into an award winning composting program and they have expanded their composting methods to include Bokashi composting (basically fermenting compost) and Black Soldier Fly Larvae composting, similar to vermicomposting, where the larvae eat through and break down food waste quickly. Here are some additional links to learn more about the SPP Bokashi and Black Soldier Fly Larvae composting programs.She shares more about several programs that are not so science based, including:A dog training program, where dogs live with and are trained by incarcerated individuals. They train dogs for children and adults for a variety of conditions. They also host foster animals, sometimes difficult to adopt animals, from many different agencies including the Kitsap Humane Society and Purrfect Pals.A bike refurbishing program, which reduces waste by salvaging and restoring bikes that otherwise might be headed to the landfill. Then those newly tuned up bikes get awesome paint jobs and they are donated back to someone in need in the community.There are lots of other cool partnerships that we did not get into. If you want to learn more, head over to SPP's website and you can look through the many partners and projects.Kelli shares a little about potential project gaps. One of the projects she hopes that the Magical Mapper might pursue is bringing more technology, like GIS, into the prisons. The other one that she feels is important is a program that supports successful reentry, and that includes housing and employment opportunities. She discusses how she initially thought this work might be done outside of the prison by another organization, but now she thinks it might be something that SPP should help develop. She wants partners to consider if organizations are willing to invest in previously incarcerated individuals once they are outside of the prison as well; helping them grow their environmental careers once they are released.We talk about some of the barriers to new program development such as:A general lack of space; prisons were not set up as educational facilitiesTechnology, computer and internet accessGeneral capacity at SPP to take on and facilitate additional projectsKelli also discusses how a big part of SPP's work is to try and identify the roles and responsibilities for the involved partners. She talks about how communication, clarity of roles, community time investment and who gets recognition for the work are all important aspects to making the partnerships function and ensuring that all partners feel valued and needed.She also shares a little bit about a new program on the horizon, the Evergreen Coalition for Justice, which just received funding for a year that starts this July. It will provide an opportunity to expand support for incarcerated individuals post release. They will partner with community colleges and other organizations to help fill the gaps where needs have been identified and to complement existing programs. They are pitching the idea to develop a program with current community organizations that are involved with SPP to work with previously incarcerated individuals post release.Outside Organization Perspective on Partnerships and ProgramsNext we get Mary in the hot seat to learn more about her experiences with partnerships and programs and in her work with WDFW. Mary shares more about how she partners with SPP to help recover the Taylor's checkerspot butterfly. We're going to focus more on the Taylor's Checkerspot Butterfly Program next episode, but this interview with Mary is more about the partnership and program with SPP. Mary shares some of the ins and outs of how the partnership started and how difficult it was to get support from WDFW for the project. She talks about some of the other partners in the Taylor's checkerspot butterfly recovery program and what their roles are. Partners in this program include Joint Base Lewis-McChord, the Department of Defense, the US Fish and Wildlife, the Oregon Zoo, and SPP (which includes Evergreen and the Department of Corrections), and the butterfly technicians. We also dive into some more details of the program.Next Mary talks about some of the things that potential new partners may need to consider if they want to develop a new SPP project or program. Some of the things that she mentions include that you have to really know what goals or products that you need, you also need to have critical and detailed planning, and in the end you need to be creative and flexible. She also shares a little about the impact this work has had on her and how it has been one of the most rewarding things she has ever done.SPP Butterfly Technician Perspective on Partnerships and ProgramsFinally, we bring in Carolina Landa to share her lived experience as a Taylor's Checkerspot Butterfly technician. She discusses her experience with partnerships and how the SPP program helped her find her voice, move forward, and be successful after her release. Since she was a butterfly technician, she went on to earn her Bachelor's and Master's degrees in Public Administration from The Evergreen State College and she is currently an Ombuds(wo)man for the Department of Corrections. She shares how she became involved in the butterfly program and what some of the requirements were for her to become a butterfly technician. She also talks about how she was perceived by other inmates and how the program has grown in popularity. She shares some of the ins and outs, like how they spent 7 hours a day in the greenhouse during the active rearing season.One of the areas that she thinks could use a new program or project developed under SPP would be a re-entry program or a work entry program, which of course is similar to what Kelli was saying! And it sounds like on some level the Evergreen Coalition for Justice will be able to help move this idea forward. Carolina shares her perspective on whether she felt her experience participating in SPP was exploitative. She talks about what she gained from the program. One of the major benefits was she was the first person to receive 16 college credits for her participation in the program from The Evergreen State College. She also talked about the therapeutic aspect of working with the butterflies, being outside of the prison walls, able to spend her days in the sunshine of the greenhouse, and about the lifelong friendships that she made with the people that she worked with. She shares that near the end of her time she had to move on to another program that took up more of her time. She wasn't able to work at the butterfly enclosure anymore, but she still volunteered her time there on the weekends!!!As far as what she would change about the program, she says that she hopes that programs like this expand and are available to more participants and at different prisons. She shares a little about what she is up to now, including being an advisor to SPP and her work as an Omsbud(wo)man for DOC.As far as her experience with incarceration and reentry, she says that prisons are bad (m'kay) and most first timers never think that they will end up in prison. She shares that there are staff that want to do better, but the structure makes change very difficult. She says for those experiencing incarceration it is important to build your network, find your people and community and then you have people to ask if you need help. She also talks about how technology can be difficult to adjust to post release. She shares a little about the barriers that exist when you have a criminal background, namely around housing and employment. In Washington you can have your record vacated depending on the type of felony and Carolina helped fight for this change in Washington!She also talks about how the view of the prison system is changing and how Washington State is making some changes. One of the programs that Washington has participated in is the AMEND program, which brings the principles of incarceration from Norway, where the goal is more restorative than punitive.Finally, she helps us end with a little bit of humor when she shares a funny story about a corrections officer that took her job seriously.Until Next Time…Thank you so much for joining us this episode! We hope you learned more about how the Sustainability in Prisons Project uses partnerships to effectively leverage multiple partners to bring education, nature and science into the prisons and how their programs impact our communities and our environment. We think the biggest takeaways from this episode include:Partnerships must provide value to all involvedPartnerships and programs can start from any level, whether that's an incarcerated individual, DOC or SPP staff, an outside organization, or an Evergreen graduate student and One of SPPs main roles is as a facilitator, ensuring that projects and programs run effectivelyWe also learned that some projects are easy to implement, such as bringing a guest lecturer or developing some educational materials, while other programs are more difficult to implement, such as the butterfly program, which requires learning how to successfully rear butterflies in a prison and building the necessary infrastructure to do so. Please don't forget to rate, review and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever you get your podcasts (like Tune In, Castbox Himalaya, iheartradio, etc). Please let us know what you think in the comments below or on our Facebook page. Until next time, Will We Make It Out Alive?

In this interview we talk with Brandon Rust. Brandon is the founder of a company called Bokashi Earthworks who specialises in growing cannabis organically from reusing food waste. Brandon has also spent time in prison for cannabis crimes when it was illegal in his state. He tells us about his experiences in prison and how the US prison system works. Brandon is also a panel member of the Cheap Home Grow Podcast, you can find out more about him there, or on his website, and instagram account.  Thanks as always for downloading the show! I hope you enjoy this interview. Please share the link to this episode on social media, or with friends IRL. Help us make the show grow more by sharing it as much as possible. 

Huge shoutout to new Patreon members Ralph, SV, Tylor, Dillon, Vlad the Inhaler, MaineGirlGrows & Joe Soil! Our guest this episode is Brian Maisenbacher (@earth_grower). We chat about various methods of composting at home and about the importance of microbial diversity. Brian has dedicated his life to becoming the best farmer he possibly can be. He is mission-driven to help others have success in growing food and medicinal crops for their communities and their families. He is passionate about finding solutions to help farmers become more regenerative and profitable. Brian has wholeheartedly spent over a decade working on farms, heritage orchards, cattle ranches, doing landscaping, and designing home gardens and farms around Arizona, California, and the Midwest. He has also spent time working in Kenya to help build farms and provide fresh water for children's homes and churches with Love Mercy Organization. Periodically he teaches agricultural classes with Earth Citizens Organization Farm in Cottonwood Arizona. He studied Permaculture Design at Oregon State University, Korean Natural Farming with Chris Trump, Microbial Density and Diversity Analysis with Dr. Mary Lucero, as well as Microscopy and the Soil Food Web with Dr. Elaine Ingham. He embodies the philosophy of working with the rhythms of Nature and allowing it to be a conduit to become a better human being. He created Earth Grower LLC to help him achieve these goals in himself, and to help others become stronger more resilient farmers. Follow Brian on Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/earth_grower/ Earth Grower website: https://www.earthgrowerllc.com/ DISCOUNT CODES: AutoPot USA - use code AFpodcast to save 10% at https://www.autopot-usa.com/ AC Infinity - use code AFpodcast to save 15% at https://www.acinfinity.com/ Nature's Living Soil - use code AutoflowerPodcast15 to save 15% at https://www.natureslivingsoil.com/ SD Microbes - use code AFpodcast to save 10% at https://sdmicrobeworks.com/ DYNOMYCO - use code AFpodcast to save 10% at https://www.dynomyco.com/   MERCH IS AVAILABLE! Visit the link below to shop! http://autoflowerpodcast.com/shop-merch/ Support the Podcast on Patreon Get early access to episodes, FREE TESTER SEEDS & other perks! https://www.patreon.com/autoflowerpodcast Questions/Comments? Email me at AutoflowerPodcast@gmail.com Connect on Social Media YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/AutoflowerPodcast Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/autoflowerpodcast/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/autoflowerpod Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Autoflower-Podcast My personal grow account: https://www.instagram.com/tourettegrower/ My personal YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/TouretteGrower Website: www.AutoflowerPodcast.com Credits: Intro/outro music: “Win City” from https://www.zapsplat.com. Soundbytes: Donald Trump, Jeff Sessions, Reefer Madness, Bill Hicks, Jim Morrison. Remixed by Chad Dulaney.